Celebrating Juneteenth - What Churches Need to Know

at the scene for us. at the scene for us. Absolutely. And and thank you, Kate, for Absolutely. And and thank you, Kate, for Absolutely. And and thank you, Kate, for your your heart toward this and even your your heart toward this and even your your heart toward this and even have the conversation. I've I've been have the conversation. I've I've been have the conversation. I've I've been involved in many conversations about involved in many conversations about involved in many conversations about this and I love it every time because I this and I love it every time because I this and I love it every time because I think the more we keep talking about it think the more we keep talking about it think the more we keep talking about it Yes. Yes. Yes. we're going to find out the the great we're going to find out the the great we're going to find out the the great value and learn some pretty important value and learn some pretty important value and learn some pretty important lessons along the way. I agree. Yeah, lessons along the way. I agree. Yeah, lessons along the way. I agree. Yeah, there there was the trickle of there there was the trickle of there there was the trickle of information being given. I think when we information being given. I think when we information being given. I think when we go back to the Emancipation go back to the Emancipation go back to the Emancipation Proclamation, I think a lot of people Proclamation, I think a lot of people Proclamation, I think a lot of people see that as this grand document that see that as this grand document that see that as this grand document that freed all slaves and it didn't free all freed all slaves and it didn't free all freed all slaves and it didn't free all slaves. Matter of fact, it was actually slaves. Matter of fact, it was actually slaves. Matter of fact, it was actually more of a kind of what I call an more of a kind of what I call an more of a kind of what I call an inciting of bringing people together inciting of bringing people together inciting of bringing people together around an ideal around an ideal around an ideal Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. that there could be freedom of slavery that there could be freedom of slavery that there could be freedom of slavery and the greatest aspect politically, and the greatest aspect politically, and the greatest aspect politically, which to this day we still see race which to this day we still see race which to this day we still see race being politicized, was that those that being politicized, was that those that being politicized, was that those that embraced that well now black men could embraced that well now black men could embraced that well now black men could be a part of the Union Army and the and be a part of the Union Army and the and be a part of the Union Army and the and the Union Navy. And so that was a huge the Union Navy. And so that was a huge the Union Navy. And so that was a huge proponent of the Emancipation proponent of the Emancipation proponent of the Emancipation Proclamation because now black men who Proclamation because now black men who Proclamation because now black men who were feeling oppressed had an were feeling oppressed had an were feeling oppressed had an opportunity now to fight, quote unquote, opportunity now to fight, quote unquote, opportunity now to fight, quote unquote, for their freedom. So that was a large for their freedom. So that was a large for their freedom. So that was a large part of the Emancipation Proclamation part of the Emancipation Proclamation part of the Emancipation Proclamation and so you're right, it didn't set all and so you're right, it didn't set all and so you're right, it didn't set all slaves free and then we had the slaves free and then we had the slaves free and then we had the information being disseminated very information being disseminated very information being disseminated very slowly and when General Granger shows up slowly and when General Granger shows up slowly and when General Granger shows up in in Texas to now give this declaration in in Texas to now give this declaration in in Texas to now give this declaration that that that that slaves are free, even then there that slaves are free, even then there that slaves are free, even then there were slaves that up to 6 years later, we were slaves that up to 6 years later, we were slaves that up to 6 years later, we have accounts from from slaves who were have accounts from from slaves who were have accounts from from slaves who were interviewed 6 years later, they were interviewed 6 years later, they were interviewed 6 years later, they were still being beaten, they were still still being beaten, they were still still being beaten, they were still being treated as if slavery was alive

being treated as if slavery was alive being treated as if slavery was alive and well. So even with the proclamation, and well. So even with the proclamation, and well. So even with the proclamation, slavery still didn't end, but at least slavery still didn't end, but at least slavery still didn't end, but at least it gave it a stamp in history and yes, it gave it a stamp in history and yes, it gave it a stamp in history and yes, on June 19th when that was declared, on June 19th when that was declared, on June 19th when that was declared, there were slaves that went into great there were slaves that went into great there were slaves that went into great joy, great celebration, and and wanted joy, great celebration, and and wanted joy, great celebration, and and wanted to celebrate coming together to to celebrate coming together to to celebrate coming together to celebrate the holiday. I think what's celebrate the holiday. I think what's celebrate the holiday. I think what's interesting is because of segregation interesting is because of segregation interesting is because of segregation they didn't have a place to gather they didn't have a place to gather they didn't have a place to gather because they could not gather at the because they could not gather at the because they could not gather at the park. They could not gather at the at park. They could not gather at the at park. They could not gather at the at the at the formal social gathering the at the formal social gathering the at the formal social gathering spots. And so it was actually in around spots. And so it was actually in around spots. And so it was actually in around 1870 1870 1870 that a group of them got together and that a group of them got together and that a group of them got together and they were called freed people. That's they were called freed people. That's they were called freed people. That's that was the moniker county given to to that was the moniker county given to to that was the moniker county given to to the slaves that that were operating in the slaves that that were operating in the slaves that that were operating in their freedom so to speak. They were their freedom so to speak. They were their freedom so to speak. They were called freed people and they came called freed people and they came called freed people and they came together and came up with $800 and together and came up with $800 and together and came up with $800 and bought 10 acres of land right there in bought 10 acres of land right there in bought 10 acres of land right there in the in Houston area and that 10 acres of the in Houston area and that 10 acres of the in Houston area and that 10 acres of land became Emancipation Park and that's land became Emancipation Park and that's land became Emancipation Park and that's when technically Juneteenth was really when technically Juneteenth was really when technically Juneteenth was really celebrated 1866. That following year is celebrated 1866. That following year is celebrated 1866. That following year is when they they had the park now and they when they they had the park now and they when they they had the park now and they opened it up and actually that park was opened it up and actually that park was opened it up and actually that park was the only public place that many of them the only public place that many of them the only public place that many of them could even gather up until 1950.

could even gather up until 1950. could even gather up until 1950. To be that staggering that up to 1950 To be that staggering that up to 1950 To be that staggering that up to 1950 they could not gather anywhere other they could not gather anywhere other they could not gather anywhere other than that segregated space that they than that segregated space that they than that segregated space that they created for themselves. And so that's created for themselves. And so that's created for themselves. And so that's what's fascinating to me is it's not what's fascinating to me is it's not what's fascinating to me is it's not just Juneteenth. It's everything around just Juneteenth. It's everything around just Juneteenth. It's everything around it that that brought that to be. it that that brought that to be. it that that brought that to be. And so when you kind of pause and think And so when you kind of pause and think And so when you kind of pause and think about that was almost a hundred years, about that was almost a hundred years, about that was almost a hundred years, right? That right? That right? That this not only the celebration but also this not only the celebration but also this not only the celebration but also that landmark exists and it still exists that landmark exists and it still exists that landmark exists and it still exists today. today. today. And it was really this milestone um And it was really this milestone um And it was really this milestone um for African-American people. for African-American people. for African-American people. And there's a lot of meaning to the the And there's a lot of meaning to the the And there's a lot of meaning to the the way that it's celebrated. And I know way that it's celebrated. And I know way that it's celebrated. And I know that it's considered to be the longest that it's considered to be the longest that it's considered to be the longest running African-American holiday. running African-American holiday. running African-American holiday. And it holds three significant ideals. And it holds three significant ideals. And it holds three significant ideals. To celebrate obviously that's a very To celebrate obviously that's a very To celebrate obviously that's a very important but then to educate and that's important but then to educate and that's important but then to educate and that's what we're hoping to do a little bit what we're hoping to do a little bit what we're hoping to do a little bit today. And then to agitate or to move today. And then to agitate or to move today. And then to agitate or to move the cause forward, right? And so when the cause forward, right? And so when the cause forward, right? And so when you think about those ideals, what you think about those ideals, what you think about those ideals, what what does that bring to your mind and to what does that bring to your mind and to what does that bring to your mind and to your heart?

your heart? your heart? It really it brings to my heart and mind It really it brings to my heart and mind It really it brings to my heart and mind what should be uh the catalyst for all what should be uh the catalyst for all what should be uh the catalyst for all humans as it relates to moving forward humans as it relates to moving forward humans as it relates to moving forward uh in humanity period. I I I don't think uh in humanity period. I I I don't think uh in humanity period. I I I don't think those ideals are specific to those ideals are specific to those ideals are specific to African-Americans. I don't think they're African-Americans. I don't think they're African-Americans. I don't think they're they're specific to minorities. I think they're specific to minorities. I think they're specific to minorities. I think all of us should be looking at each one all of us should be looking at each one all of us should be looking at each one of us and saying, "How can I celebrate of us and saying, "How can I celebrate of us and saying, "How can I celebrate you? you? you? How can I become more educated about How can I become more educated about How can I become more educated about you? And then how can we all agitate the you? And then how can we all agitate the you? And then how can we all agitate the system or the powers that be or our own system or the powers that be or our own system or the powers that be or our own ignorance or our own pride? How can we ignorance or our own pride? How can we ignorance or our own pride? How can we agitate those things in us? I think when agitate those things in us? I think when agitate those things in us? I think when people hear the word agitation, they people hear the word agitation, they people hear the word agitation, they they think instantly of something they think instantly of something they think instantly of something negative. Uh but agitation has always negative. Uh but agitation has always negative. Uh but agitation has always been critical for anything to move been critical for anything to move been critical for anything to move forward. I mean, Jesus Jesus was one of forward. I mean, Jesus Jesus was one of forward. I mean, Jesus Jesus was one of the greatest agitators with everything the greatest agitators with everything the greatest agitators with everything that he did. And and that's what's that he did. And and that's what's that he did. And and that's what's interesting to me is that Juneteenth interesting to me is that Juneteenth interesting to me is that Juneteenth keeps losing its significance until keeps losing its significance until keeps losing its significance until something is agitated that brings the something is agitated that brings the something is agitated that brings the awareness back. Uh we we go from 1865 awareness back. Uh we we go from 1865 awareness back. Uh we we go from 1865 and a lot of people didn't hear anything and a lot of people didn't hear anything and a lot of people didn't hear anything about Juneteenth when Jim Crow and that about Juneteenth when Jim Crow and that about Juneteenth when Jim Crow and that whole era took place in our country, it whole era took place in our country, it whole era took place in our country, it died down. And we don't see the died down. And we don't see the died down. And we don't see the resurgence of Juneteenth until we see resurgence of Juneteenth until we see resurgence of Juneteenth until we see the poor people's campaign and march in the poor people's campaign and march in the poor people's campaign and march in Washington in 1968. And so that campaign Washington in 1968. And so that campaign Washington in 1968. And so that campaign from May to June that Martin Luther King from May to June that Martin Luther King from May to June that Martin Luther King authored, but of course he was killed in authored, but of course he was killed in authored, but of course he was killed in April, but they decided to still do it.

April, but they decided to still do it. April, but they decided to still do it. Well, that campaign which lasted 6 Well, that campaign which lasted 6 Well, that campaign which lasted 6 weeks, 3,000 people, they built a whole weeks, 3,000 people, they built a whole weeks, 3,000 people, they built a whole town, a whole city called Resurrection town, a whole city called Resurrection town, a whole city called Resurrection City right there on the mall in City right there on the mall in City right there on the mall in Washington uh and had their own zip code Washington uh and had their own zip code Washington uh and had their own zip code for crying out loud. 2013 was the zip for crying out loud. 2013 was the zip for crying out loud. 2013 was the zip code. And so we see that whole movement, code. And so we see that whole movement, code. And so we see that whole movement, but actually what brought Juneteenth but actually what brought Juneteenth but actually what brought Juneteenth back to prominence was the agitation of back to prominence was the agitation of back to prominence was the agitation of what's called the Solidarity Day March what's called the Solidarity Day March what's called the Solidarity Day March uh that happened right on June 19th of uh that happened right on June 19th of uh that happened right on June 19th of of that year of 1968 and 50 to 100,000 of that year of 1968 and 50 to 100,000 of that year of 1968 and 50 to 100,000 people were gathered there. And so that people were gathered there. And so that people were gathered there. And so that brought a resurgence of Juneteenth. So brought a resurgence of Juneteenth. So brought a resurgence of Juneteenth. So now Juneteenth is back and we're now Juneteenth is back and we're now Juneteenth is back and we're celebrating it. But then it loses again, celebrating it. But then it loses again, celebrating it. But then it loses again, it loses its luster and it's not really it loses its luster and it's not really it loses its luster and it's not really heard about. Now, what the beautiful heard about. Now, what the beautiful heard about. Now, what the beautiful part was with that many thousands of part was with that many thousands of part was with that many thousands of people, they went back to their people, they went back to their people, they went back to their prospective locations and said, "Oh my prospective locations and said, "Oh my prospective locations and said, "Oh my goodness, there's actually a holiday and goodness, there's actually a holiday and goodness, there's actually a holiday and there's a whole thing around this." And there's a whole thing around this." And there's a whole thing around this." And it begin to spread. But again, it begin it begin to spread. But again, it begin it begin to spread. But again, it begin to go down and actually it wasn't till to go down and actually it wasn't till to go down and actually it wasn't till kind of some modern things that kind of some modern things that kind of some modern things that happened. When we go back to 2012, happened. When we go back to 2012, happened. When we go back to 2012, Trayvon Martin when he was killed, 2013 Trayvon Martin when he was killed, 2013 Trayvon Martin when he was killed, 2013 was pivotal because George Zimmerman was was pivotal because George Zimmerman was was pivotal because George Zimmerman was found not guilty.

found not guilty. found not guilty. Well, that happened around the same time Well, that happened around the same time Well, that happened around the same time as Juneteenth. Juneteenth comes with as Juneteenth. Juneteenth comes with as Juneteenth. Juneteenth comes with another surge, another agitation. Now another surge, another agitation. Now another surge, another agitation. Now we're celebrating Juneteenth. It dies we're celebrating Juneteenth. It dies we're celebrating Juneteenth. It dies down again. And then we have George down again. And then we have George down again. And then we have George Floyd. He's killed in May, right before Floyd. He's killed in May, right before Floyd. He's killed in May, right before Juneteenth. Now all of a sudden Juneteenth. Now all of a sudden Juneteenth. Now all of a sudden Juneteenth has been celebrated by Juneteenth has been celebrated by Juneteenth has been celebrated by thousands and millions of people and it thousands and millions of people and it thousands and millions of people and it really has never been celebrated at the really has never been celebrated at the really has never been celebrated at the at the level that it has been after that at the level that it has been after that at the level that it has been after that happened with George Floyd. So, the this happened with George Floyd. So, the this happened with George Floyd. So, the this whole concept that they came up with whole concept that they came up with whole concept that they came up with that agitation would be part of the that agitation would be part of the that agitation would be part of the awareness has literally played out awareness has literally played out awareness has literally played out through history, that even the through history, that even the through history, that even the acknowledgement of this holiday took an acknowledgement of this holiday took an acknowledgement of this holiday took an agitation of some sort to even bring it agitation of some sort to even bring it agitation of some sort to even bring it back to prominence. I think I think it's back to prominence. I think I think it's back to prominence. I think I think it's somewhat prophetic and I think that it somewhat prophetic and I think that it somewhat prophetic and I think that it also speaks to us that something can also speaks to us that something can also speaks to us that something can live and no matter what happens in live and no matter what happens in live and no matter what happens in history, if that thing is actually built history, if that thing is actually built history, if that thing is actually built on a solid foundation, it will continue on a solid foundation, it will continue on a solid foundation, it will continue to manifest over time. to manifest over time. to manifest over time. That's what I That's what I feel with That's what I That's what I feel with That's what I That's what I feel with with when I think of it. with when I think of it. with when I think of it. Yeah, I think that's really beautiful. Yeah, I think that's really beautiful. Yeah, I think that's really beautiful. Um Um Um and as we continue to be educated, and as we continue to be educated, and as we continue to be educated, right, then those two components of right, then those two components of right, then those two components of education and agitation then become this education and agitation then become this education and agitation then become this really beautiful moving forward.

really beautiful moving forward. really beautiful moving forward. Um Um Um I know there's some very traditional um I know there's some very traditional um I know there's some very traditional um components of the celebration of components of the celebration of components of the celebration of Juneteenth and obviously as um Juneteenth and obviously as um Juneteenth and obviously as um things ebb and flow over time, those things ebb and flow over time, those things ebb and flow over time, those change. But I know some of them include change. But I know some of them include change. But I know some of them include public readings of the Emancipation public readings of the Emancipation public readings of the Emancipation Proclamation, Proclamation, Proclamation, Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. um singing traditional songs like Swing um singing traditional songs like Swing um singing traditional songs like Swing Low, Sweet Chariot. Uh I think that was Low, Sweet Chariot. Uh I think that was Low, Sweet Chariot. Uh I think that was a song that I I sang when I was a little a song that I I sang when I was a little a song that I I sang when I was a little girl at summer camp, right? Um and then girl at summer camp, right? Um and then girl at summer camp, right? Um and then reading public works by renowned reading public works by renowned reading public works by renowned African-American poets like Maya African-American poets like Maya African-American poets like Maya Angelou. Angelou. Angelou. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um do you have a specific memory of a Um do you have a specific memory of a Um do you have a specific memory of a celebration that you have been to? celebration that you have been to? celebration that you have been to? Um and actually, I probably share in Um and actually, I probably share in Um and actually, I probably share in what many African-Americans share in. I what many African-Americans share in. I what many African-Americans share in. I didn't celebrate Juneteenth growing up. didn't celebrate Juneteenth growing up. didn't celebrate Juneteenth growing up. Didn't know anything about Juneteenth. Didn't know anything about Juneteenth. Didn't know anything about Juneteenth. It was never talked about in school. I It was never talked about in school. I It was never talked about in school. I never heard of it in any history classes never heard of it in any history classes never heard of it in any history classes or books I my entire my entire life. I or books I my entire my entire life. I or books I my entire my entire life. I grew up in Danville, Kentucky. And so, grew up in Danville, Kentucky. And so, grew up in Danville, Kentucky. And so, Juneteenth for me has been a far later Juneteenth for me has been a far later Juneteenth for me has been a far later occurrence in my life uh of doing my own occurrence in my life uh of doing my own occurrence in my life uh of doing my own personal research and came upon it. Uh personal research and came upon it. Uh personal research and came upon it. Uh and so, for me, I spend most of my time and so, for me, I spend most of my time and so, for me, I spend most of my time with awareness of it not necessarily with awareness of it not necessarily with awareness of it not necessarily celebrating it with things that I eat or celebrating it with things that I eat or celebrating it with things that I eat or do. I do it through education, being a do. I do it through education, being a do. I do it through education, being a part of panels, forums. And then I also part of panels, forums. And then I also part of panels, forums. And then I also try to do it through my graphic design.

try to do it through my graphic design. try to do it through my graphic design. Always like to try to design something Always like to try to design something Always like to try to design something every year that really shows my passion every year that really shows my passion every year that really shows my passion for it. But then I share that with for it. But then I share that with for it. But then I share that with people and say, "Hey, you can have it people and say, "Hey, you can have it people and say, "Hey, you can have it for free. Just post it and share it." for free. Just post it and share it." for free. Just post it and share it." And uh and I I plan to do that again And uh and I I plan to do that again And uh and I I plan to do that again this year. Did it last year and it was a this year. Did it last year and it was a this year. Did it last year and it was a great success. A lot of people like the great success. A lot of people like the great success. A lot of people like the design that I did and shared it. And design that I did and shared it. And design that I did and shared it. And that to me is how I celebrate it. that to me is how I celebrate it. that to me is how I celebrate it. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. I love that. I love that. I love that. Um so, I think as Juneteenth I think Um so, I think as Juneteenth I think Um so, I think as Juneteenth I think this is a really important um as this is a really important um as this is a really important um as Juneteenth begins to receive awareness, Juneteenth begins to receive awareness, Juneteenth begins to receive awareness, increased awareness, very much like what increased awareness, very much like what increased awareness, very much like what you were talking about in 2020 um you were talking about in 2020 um you were talking about in 2020 um outside of the African-American outside of the African-American outside of the African-American community um with people who look like community um with people who look like community um with people who look like me, um I think it's really important me, um I think it's really important me, um I think it's really important that we do that in a very mindful way. that we do that in a very mindful way. that we do that in a very mindful way. That's so much more than sharing a That's so much more than sharing a That's so much more than sharing a social media post on Juneteenth. And so social media post on Juneteenth. And so social media post on Juneteenth. And so some of the ways that I have done that some of the ways that I have done that some of the ways that I have done that which is not enough are supporting my my which is not enough are supporting my my which is not enough are supporting my my area black-owned businesses. I think area black-owned businesses. I think area black-owned businesses. I think that's a great way to do that.

that's a great way to do that. that's a great way to do that. Speaking up when I hear or see racism in Speaking up when I hear or see racism in Speaking up when I hear or see racism in my community in my areas of influence my community in my areas of influence my community in my areas of influence and with the people that I know. I have and with the people that I know. I have and with the people that I know. I have the ability and the right to do that. What else? What are some other ideas What else? What are some other ideas that you have that that would be a good that you have that that would be a good that you have that that would be a good idea? idea? idea? Absolutely. Well, I think those two are Absolutely. Well, I think those two are Absolutely. Well, I think those two are are outstanding. are outstanding. are outstanding. And the only thing that I would add to And the only thing that I would add to And the only thing that I would add to that is that is that is I'm I'm more I'm more concerned with I'm I'm more I'm more concerned with I'm I'm more I'm more concerned with what happens June 18th and June 20th what happens June 18th and June 20th what happens June 18th and June 20th that I am June 19th. June 19th is going that I am June 19th. June 19th is going that I am June 19th. June 19th is going nowhere. But it's what happens the day nowhere. But it's what happens the day nowhere. But it's what happens the day before and the day after. And I say that before and the day after. And I say that before and the day after. And I say that kind of in a metaphorical way, but I kind of in a metaphorical way, but I kind of in a metaphorical way, but I think that we all have to take up on think that we all have to take up on think that we all have to take up on ourselves to say if I'm truly going to ourselves to say if I'm truly going to ourselves to say if I'm truly going to celebrate celebrate celebrate the the essence of a holiday and what it the the essence of a holiday and what it the the essence of a holiday and what it means. Well, then it has to become a means. Well, then it has to become a means. Well, then it has to become a part of my lifestyle in some way. part of my lifestyle in some way. part of my lifestyle in some way. Otherwise, it's just a day that I that I Otherwise, it's just a day that I that I Otherwise, it's just a day that I that I did something out of feeling obligated did something out of feeling obligated did something out of feeling obligated or not to appear that I'm insensitive or not to appear that I'm insensitive or not to appear that I'm insensitive which to me is disingenuous and it which to me is disingenuous and it which to me is disingenuous and it really doesn't accomplish anything. If really doesn't accomplish anything. If really doesn't accomplish anything. If anything, I would hope that people if anything, I would hope that people if anything, I would hope that people if you take the time to study, you take the you take the time to study, you take the you take the time to study, you take the time to really look at what happened time to really look at what happened time to really look at what happened with with June 19th and understand here with with June 19th and understand here with with June 19th and understand here are slaves who didn't even know they are slaves who didn't even know they are slaves who didn't even know they were free.

were free. were free. Who were still working at plantations, Who were still working at plantations, Who were still working at plantations, still thinking about how can I escape still thinking about how can I escape still thinking about how can I escape this reality and didn't know they were this reality and didn't know they were this reality and didn't know they were free. free. free. I think it it makes all of us have to I think it it makes all of us have to I think it it makes all of us have to stop and think about how powerful stop and think about how powerful stop and think about how powerful education is. education is. education is. The difference was education. It wasn't The difference was education. It wasn't The difference was education. It wasn't money. money. money. The difference wasn't social standing The difference wasn't social standing The difference wasn't social standing per se. It was I haven't been educated. per se. It was I haven't been educated. per se. It was I haven't been educated. And I think to this day, to me that's And I think to this day, to me that's And I think to this day, to me that's the greatest pandemic we have is lack of the greatest pandemic we have is lack of the greatest pandemic we have is lack of education. And I think that's the beauty education. And I think that's the beauty education. And I think that's the beauty of this. So, if anything, get educated. of this. So, if anything, get educated. of this. So, if anything, get educated. Find forums, find seminars, find Find forums, find seminars, find Find forums, find seminars, find conferences online that you can attend. conferences online that you can attend. conferences online that you can attend. What you just said I think is beautiful. What you just said I think is beautiful. What you just said I think is beautiful. Yes, do business with black-owned Yes, do business with black-owned Yes, do business with black-owned businesses. And I know that gets businesses. And I know that gets businesses. And I know that gets it gets tricky to say that because I it gets tricky to say that because I it gets tricky to say that because I think sometimes people just want to say, think sometimes people just want to say, think sometimes people just want to say, "Hey, business is business. I'll do "Hey, business is business. I'll do "Hey, business is business. I'll do business with whoever. Why do we have to business with whoever. Why do we have to business with whoever. Why do we have to call it black-owned?" And why do we have call it black-owned?" And why do we have call it black-owned?" And why do we have to say minority-owned? And the And the to say minority-owned? And the And the to say minority-owned? And the And the issue for the the issue that I I realize issue for the the issue that I I realize issue for the the issue that I I realize people have with it, I do understand it.

people have with it, I do understand it. people have with it, I do understand it. Trust me, I do understand it to some Trust me, I do understand it to some Trust me, I do understand it to some degree. But you have to understand for degree. But you have to understand for degree. But you have to understand for so long so long so long having a business as an African-American having a business as an African-American having a business as an African-American was something, first of all, that you was something, first of all, that you was something, first of all, that you couldn't even dream of. When actually couldn't even dream of. When actually couldn't even dream of. When actually you could do it, you were limited to you could do it, you were limited to you could do it, you were limited to what it could be. You were limited to what it could be. You were limited to what it could be. You were limited to the industries that it could be in. And the industries that it could be in. And the industries that it could be in. And so, now this revival and resurgence that so, now this revival and resurgence that so, now this revival and resurgence that own any business we want, and we can do own any business we want, and we can do own any business we want, and we can do whatever we want. Well, it's a It's more whatever we want. Well, it's a It's more whatever we want. Well, it's a It's more of a celebration. It's not black people of a celebration. It's not black people of a celebration. It's not black people trying to be special, or I need you to trying to be special, or I need you to trying to be special, or I need you to acknowledge my business over someone acknowledge my business over someone acknowledge my business over someone else's. That is not the aspect. It's else's. That is not the aspect. It's else's. That is not the aspect. It's that it's a celebration that I can have that it's a celebration that I can have that it's a celebration that I can have any business that I want. And I think any business that I want. And I think any business that I want. And I think when you when you when you become patrons of that business, you now become patrons of that business, you now become patrons of that business, you now are joining in celebration, not are joining in celebration, not are joining in celebration, not separation. separation. separation. You're joining in a celebration of this You're joining in a celebration of this You're joining in a celebration of this ideal that we are all equal. ideal that we are all equal. ideal that we are all equal. So, I as a white person can walk into a So, I as a white person can walk into a So, I as a white person can walk into a black establishment and patronize that black establishment and patronize that black establishment and patronize that business and spend my dollar there as business and spend my dollar there as business and spend my dollar there as celebration that you actually can have a celebration that you actually can have a celebration that you actually can have a business just like me, and it doesn't business just like me, and it doesn't business just like me, and it doesn't matter the color of your skin. That's matter the color of your skin. That's matter the color of your skin. That's how I wish America could see this. And I how I wish America could see this. And I how I wish America could see this. And I think if we saw it, again, we're going think if we saw it, again, we're going think if we saw it, again, we're going back to Juneteenth. If we could see it back to Juneteenth. If we could see it back to Juneteenth. If we could see it as celebration as celebration as celebration the celebration I think would make the celebration I think would make the celebration I think would make people want to get educated, and then we people want to get educated, and then we people want to get educated, and then we could all come together to educate. I could all come together to educate. I could all come together to educate. I don't want just black people coming don't want just black people coming don't want just black people coming together to agitate because that's not together to agitate because that's not together to agitate because that's not going to work well for us. We we need a going to work well for us. We we need a going to work well for us. We we need a concerted effort of everybody working concerted effort of everybody working concerted effort of everybody working together to agitate and then we just together to agitate and then we just together to agitate and then we just create harmony and unity out of that.

create harmony and unity out of that. create harmony and unity out of that. So, yes, patronize businesses. I think So, yes, patronize businesses. I think So, yes, patronize businesses. I think also educate yourself and then talk to also educate yourself and then talk to also educate yourself and then talk to people who have knowledge about our people who have knowledge about our people who have knowledge about our history. history. history. Every black person doesn't have Every black person doesn't have Every black person doesn't have knowledge about knowledge about knowledge about black history. black history. black history. That's just a reality. So, you may have That's just a reality. So, you may have That's just a reality. So, you may have a lot of black friends. You know, I get a lot of black friends. You know, I get a lot of black friends. You know, I get that all the time. Well, pastor, I have that all the time. Well, pastor, I have that all the time. Well, pastor, I have a lot of black friends. That's a lot of black friends. That's a lot of black friends. That's incredible. You should. You should have incredible. You should. You should have incredible. You should. You should have friends of every race as far as I'm friends of every race as far as I'm friends of every race as far as I'm concerned. But when it comes to concerned. But when it comes to concerned. But when it comes to education, every black person can't education, every black person can't education, every black person can't educate you on our history because many educate you on our history because many educate you on our history because many of them don't know the history. So, it's of them don't know the history. So, it's of them don't know the history. So, it's being intentional and that's the word being intentional and that's the word being intentional and that's the word I'd really like to use is be intentional I'd really like to use is be intentional I'd really like to use is be intentional in your educational pursuits to find the in your educational pursuits to find the in your educational pursuits to find the answers that you want to have and then, answers that you want to have and then, answers that you want to have and then, no matter what history shows you, no matter what history shows you, no matter what history shows you, don't minimize or dismiss that it don't minimize or dismiss that it don't minimize or dismiss that it happened because it's ugly. happened because it's ugly. happened because it's ugly. And I think sometimes that's what gets And I think sometimes that's what gets And I think sometimes that's what gets lost when we start having conversations. lost when we start having conversations. lost when we start having conversations. It gets very uncomfortable to read It gets very uncomfortable to read It gets very uncomfortable to read certain reports of things that happened certain reports of things that happened certain reports of things that happened by white people doing things toward by white people doing things toward by white people doing things toward black people and my response to that it black people and my response to that it black people and my response to that it is, is, is, I understand it's uncomfortable, but I understand it's uncomfortable, but I understand it's uncomfortable, but what about the people that were enduring what about the people that were enduring what about the people that were enduring it? What were they experiencing? It's it? What were they experiencing? It's it? What were they experiencing? It's uncomfortable for me to read even though uncomfortable for me to read even though uncomfortable for me to read even though it didn't happen to me and nobody in my it didn't happen to me and nobody in my it didn't happen to me and nobody in my generation inflicted that upon my generation inflicted that upon my generation inflicted that upon my ancestors, but even when I read those ancestors, but even when I read those ancestors, but even when I read those accounts, it's as if I can feel what accounts, it's as if I can feel what accounts, it's as if I can feel what they were feeling had happened. So, I they were feeling had happened. So, I they were feeling had happened. So, I understand that it's hard to read understand that it's hard to read understand that it's hard to read certain accounts. It's very difficult to certain accounts. It's very difficult to certain accounts. It's very difficult to hear. You know, we just dealt with the hear. You know, we just dealt with the hear. You know, we just dealt with the whole massacre at Tulsa and and Black whole massacre at Tulsa and and Black whole massacre at Tulsa and and Black Wall Street. You know, we just came Wall Street. You know, we just came Wall Street. You know, we just came through that. It's very difficult and I through that. It's very difficult and I through that. It's very difficult and I get that and I understand, hey, I just

get that and I understand, hey, I just get that and I understand, hey, I just want to move forward want to move forward want to move forward because that's ugly. It's it's a dark because that's ugly. It's it's a dark because that's ugly. It's it's a dark stain on our history and I get all of stain on our history and I get all of stain on our history and I get all of that, but we're doomed as has been said that, but we're doomed as has been said that, but we're doomed as has been said so many times by many more popular and so many times by many more popular and so many times by many more popular and famous people than me, we're doomed to famous people than me, we're doomed to famous people than me, we're doomed to repeat the past if we don't learn those repeat the past if we don't learn those repeat the past if we don't learn those lessons from it. So, I just say be lessons from it. So, I just say be lessons from it. So, I just say be intentional. I don't really have a list intentional. I don't really have a list intentional. I don't really have a list of what you do. I just say be of what you do. I just say be of what you do. I just say be intentional in in understanding the intentional in in understanding the intentional in in understanding the plight of individuals who look plight of individuals who look plight of individuals who look differently than you. Whether that's differently than you. Whether that's differently than you. Whether that's history, and then unfortunately, you history, and then unfortunately, you history, and then unfortunately, you don't have to go to history. don't have to go to history. don't have to go to history. We can talk about some things presently We can talk about some things presently We can talk about some things presently that are very alarming for black people. that are very alarming for black people. that are very alarming for black people. That might be where you start. If you That might be where you start. If you That might be where you start. If you don't want to go to history, well, then don't want to go to history, well, then don't want to go to history, well, then let's just start with present day. Many let's just start with present day. Many let's just start with present day. Many of the ills and social ills and of the ills and social ills and of the ills and social ills and struggles we're having, let's see what struggles we're having, let's see what struggles we're having, let's see what we can do to come up with solutions. we can do to come up with solutions. we can do to come up with solutions. That to me would be a greater That to me would be a greater That to me would be a greater appreciation of Juneteenth than a appreciation of Juneteenth than a appreciation of Juneteenth than a barbecue and and festivities, which I barbecue and and festivities, which I barbecue and and festivities, which I love all of that, but I'm always trying love all of that, but I'm always trying love all of that, but I'm always trying to look at, "Okay, that's great, to look at, "Okay, that's great, to look at, "Okay, that's great, but what is the solution that we can but what is the solution that we can but what is the solution that we can come away with?" come away with?" come away with?" So, I think those are some really So, I think those are some really So, I think those are some really important and key takeaways. Whether you important and key takeaways. Whether you important and key takeaways. Whether you are an attender of a church, um just are an attender of a church, um just are an attender of a church, um just uh uh uh someone who's in a middle leadership someone who's in a middle leadership someone who's in a middle leadership position in a church, or if you are position in a church, or if you are position in a church, or if you are leading a church. I think those are No leading a church. I think those are No leading a church. I think those are No matter where you are in that structure matter where you are in that structure matter where you are in that structure in a church, I think those are That's a in a church, I think those are That's a in a church, I think those are That's a key takeaway.

key takeaway. key takeaway. My next question is, if you are someone My next question is, if you are someone My next question is, if you are someone in a church, any you know, at any level, in a church, any you know, at any level, in a church, any you know, at any level, who your church has not addressed who your church has not addressed who your church has not addressed anything close to Juneteenth to this anything close to Juneteenth to this anything close to Juneteenth to this point. So, you are feeling a little point. So, you are feeling a little point. So, you are feeling a little hesitant hesitant hesitant to kind of put your toe in. to kind of put your toe in. to kind of put your toe in. Um which I understand, right? I Um which I understand, right? I Um which I understand, right? I understand, and I know you do, too. Um understand, and I know you do, too. Um understand, and I know you do, too. Um how What would you say, Pastor Larry, is how What would you say, Pastor Larry, is how What would you say, Pastor Larry, is kind of that good kind of that good kind of that good first way to kind of put your toe in? first way to kind of put your toe in? first way to kind of put your toe in? Um not I'm not saying in a safe way, but Um not I'm not saying in a safe way, but Um not I'm not saying in a safe way, but in a thought very thoughtful way. in a thought very thoughtful way. in a thought very thoughtful way. That's a That's a great question, Kate, That's a That's a great question, Kate, That's a That's a great question, Kate, and I think I think a lot of people fall and I think I think a lot of people fall and I think I think a lot of people fall in that category. Um I choose to believe in that category. Um I choose to believe in that category. Um I choose to believe that that that so many people desire to see celebration so many people desire to see celebration so many people desire to see celebration of all races. They have a heart for of all races. They have a heart for of all races. They have a heart for minorities. They understand that yes, minorities. They understand that yes, minorities. They understand that yes, there's been some serious issues with there's been some serious issues with there's been some serious issues with that in our country. So, I choose to that in our country. So, I choose to that in our country. So, I choose to believe on the God side of people that believe on the God side of people that believe on the God side of people that yes, I I believe in equality. I think yes, I I believe in equality. I think yes, I I believe in equality. I think it's a it's something we need to talk it's a it's something we need to talk it's a it's something we need to talk about. I think where a lot of people about. I think where a lot of people about. I think where a lot of people differ is the approach differ is the approach differ is the approach in which it's brought about. And and in which it's brought about. And and in which it's brought about. And and that's been many of the conversations that's been many of the conversations that's been many of the conversations I've had when you when you talk about I've had when you when you talk about I've had when you when you talk about Black Lives Matter or you talk about Black Lives Matter or you talk about Black Lives Matter or you talk about these movements and people not these movements and people not these movements and people not understanding the difference between the understanding the difference between the understanding the difference between the Black Lives Matter organization, which Black Lives Matter organization, which Black Lives Matter organization, which is a political organization, versus is a political organization, versus is a political organization, versus Black Lives Matter started as a thought,

Black Lives Matter started as a thought, Black Lives Matter started as a thought, a concept. It it wasn't connected to the a concept. It it wasn't connected to the a concept. It it wasn't connected to the organization. When I say Black Lives organization. When I say Black Lives organization. When I say Black Lives Matter, it has nothing to do with Matter, it has nothing to do with Matter, it has nothing to do with organization. I pay no dues to that organization. I pay no dues to that organization. I pay no dues to that organization. I have no allegiance or organization. I have no allegiance or organization. I have no allegiance or alliance to that organization. But, when alliance to that organization. But, when alliance to that organization. But, when I say that, it's an ideal. Uh and of I say that, it's an ideal. Uh and of I say that, it's an ideal. Uh and of course, we know that all lives matter. course, we know that all lives matter. course, we know that all lives matter. That that has never been a question, That that has never been a question, That that has never been a question, even among black people. It's just that even among black people. It's just that even among black people. It's just that when we see a certain race having to when we see a certain race having to when we see a certain race having to deal with certain things perpetually and deal with certain things perpetually and deal with certain things perpetually and consistently that other races don't have consistently that other races don't have consistently that other races don't have to deal with, we have to stop and think to deal with, we have to stop and think to deal with, we have to stop and think about it. And again, it goes back to not about it. And again, it goes back to not about it. And again, it goes back to not that we're trying to separate, we're that we're trying to separate, we're that we're trying to separate, we're trying to educate. And so, I think for trying to educate. And so, I think for trying to educate. And so, I think for churches, churches, churches, don't feel the pressure don't feel the pressure don't feel the pressure to become these institutions of social to become these institutions of social to become these institutions of social justice if you've never done that. Uh justice if you've never done that. Uh justice if you've never done that. Uh matter of fact, there's a fine line that matter of fact, there's a fine line that matter of fact, there's a fine line that you you have to walk even when you're you you have to walk even when you're you you have to walk even when you're considering social justice as a part of considering social justice as a part of considering social justice as a part of your ministry, uh that that that has to your ministry, uh that that that has to your ministry, uh that that that has to be done very sagaciously because be done very sagaciously because be done very sagaciously because sometimes we can mix the two and it sometimes we can mix the two and it sometimes we can mix the two and it doesn't do well for the cause of Jesus doesn't do well for the cause of Jesus doesn't do well for the cause of Jesus Christ. So, I'm I'm also aware of that. Christ. So, I'm I'm also aware of that. Christ. So, I'm I'm also aware of that. I would say to a church, if you want to I would say to a church, if you want to I would say to a church, if you want to let's say this is the first opportunity let's say this is the first opportunity let's say this is the first opportunity that your church is going to take to that your church is going to take to that your church is going to take to celebrate a holiday that is geared celebrate a holiday that is geared celebrate a holiday that is geared toward a particular race. Here's what I toward a particular race. Here's what I toward a particular race. Here's what I would say to you. I would say to would say to you. I would say to would say to you. I would say to talk to your church about the talk to your church about the talk to your church about the Emancipation Proclamation.

Emancipation Proclamation. Emancipation Proclamation. Talk to your church about what that Talk to your church about what that Talk to your church about what that ideal was. ideal was. ideal was. What that goal was. What that goal was. What that goal was. Connect that to Connect that to Connect that to the goal of Jesus Christ. the goal of Jesus Christ. the goal of Jesus Christ. Is that we're all Is that we're all Is that we're all one with him. We're all the same with one with him. We're all the same with one with him. We're all the same with him. him. him. From there, talk about the beauty of From there, talk about the beauty of From there, talk about the beauty of what this brought about. Was it perfect? what this brought about. Was it perfect? what this brought about. Was it perfect? No. No. No. Did it accomplish everything it was sent Did it accomplish everything it was sent Did it accomplish everything it was sent out to do? No. Were all the motives out to do? No. Were all the motives out to do? No. Were all the motives behind it pure? Not at all. But, that's behind it pure? Not at all. But, that's behind it pure? Not at all. But, that's the sovereignty of God. He has the the sovereignty of God. He has the the sovereignty of God. He has the ability to take things that may not have ability to take things that may not have ability to take things that may not have the best motives, but if God can use it, the best motives, but if God can use it, the best motives, but if God can use it, all things work together for good. He all things work together for good. He all things work together for good. He has the ability to make it good. So, I has the ability to make it good. So, I has the ability to make it good. So, I think you can start there. I would think you can start there. I would think you can start there. I would connect the two. You don't have to leave connect the two. You don't have to leave connect the two. You don't have to leave it separate in history and not connect it separate in history and not connect it separate in history and not connect it to what we do with Christ. And I it to what we do with Christ. And I it to what we do with Christ. And I think this whole ideal of all men are think this whole ideal of all men are think this whole ideal of all men are created equal, we all have equal created equal, we all have equal created equal, we all have equal standing before Jesus Christ. Here's an standing before Jesus Christ. Here's an standing before Jesus Christ. Here's an opportunity first time in in our opportunity first time in in our opportunity first time in in our nation's history that there's a nation's history that there's a nation's history that there's a proclamation from the government to that proclamation from the government to that proclamation from the government to that to that regard. And so, out of that came to that regard. And so, out of that came to that regard. And so, out of that came this celebration for a group of people this celebration for a group of people this celebration for a group of people who didn't know they were free.

who didn't know they were free. who didn't know they were free. And just talk about that aspect. Talk And just talk about that aspect. Talk And just talk about that aspect. Talk about the aspect of freedom to people about the aspect of freedom to people about the aspect of freedom to people that don't know they're free. That's the that don't know they're free. That's the that don't know they're free. That's the whole message of the gospel. whole message of the gospel. whole message of the gospel. If you just receive that, I think we can If you just receive that, I think we can If you just receive that, I think we can weave things together and that's what weave things together and that's what weave things together and that's what I've seen to be very powerful when it I've seen to be very powerful when it I've seen to be very powerful when it comes to church. Weave the message of comes to church. Weave the message of comes to church. Weave the message of the gospel with history and it makes it the gospel with history and it makes it the gospel with history and it makes it palpable for people who may be nervous palpable for people who may be nervous palpable for people who may be nervous about the implications of just about the implications of just about the implications of just celebrating the holiday. I would not celebrating the holiday. I would not celebrating the holiday. I would not recommend a church to do that that's recommend a church to do that that's recommend a church to do that that's never done that. I do think though with never done that. I do think though with never done that. I do think though with creativity, we can weave those messages creativity, we can weave those messages creativity, we can weave those messages together and guess what you're doing? together and guess what you're doing? together and guess what you're doing? You're celebrating and you're educating You're celebrating and you're educating You're celebrating and you're educating simultaneously. You know what that's simultaneously. You know what that's simultaneously. You know what that's going to happen? Agitation is going to going to happen? Agitation is going to going to happen? Agitation is going to happen for people personally. happen for people personally. happen for people personally. Now, not necessarily they came from the Now, not necessarily they came from the Now, not necessarily they came from the pulpit, now people in their personal pulpit, now people in their personal pulpit, now people in their personal time are going to go study Juneteenth time are going to go study Juneteenth time are going to go study Juneteenth because they heard about it first at because they heard about it first at because they heard about it first at their church, but it wasn't in an overt their church, but it wasn't in an overt their church, but it wasn't in an overt way. It wasn't in a way that would shock way. It wasn't in a way that would shock way. It wasn't in a way that would shock them. It wasn't a way that would take them. It wasn't a way that would take them. It wasn't a way that would take them, you know, kind of catch them off them, you know, kind of catch them off them, you know, kind of catch them off guard. You're you're doing it with guard. You're you're doing it with guard. You're you're doing it with wisdom.

wisdom. wisdom. And that's what I would say. And if any And that's what I would say. And if any And that's what I would say. And if any church is struggling with that, please church is struggling with that, please church is struggling with that, please reach out to me. I promise you I will reach out to me. I promise you I will reach out to me. I promise you I will help you. I won't charge you for help you. I won't charge you for help you. I won't charge you for consultation fees. Just consultation fees. Just consultation fees. Just reach out to me. I'll be more than happy reach out to me. I'll be more than happy reach out to me. I'll be more than happy to help you kind of paint that narrative to help you kind of paint that narrative to help you kind of paint that narrative and even give script into help whatever and even give script into help whatever and even give script into help whatever creative team that has to talk about creative team that has to talk about creative team that has to talk about this. It's that important to me. And but this. It's that important to me. And but this. It's that important to me. And but I choose to believe that so many I choose to believe that so many I choose to believe that so many churches want to do it. They just don't churches want to do it. They just don't churches want to do it. They just don't quite know how to go about it. I think that is absolutely beautiful I think that is absolutely beautiful tying freedom, the freedom we have in tying freedom, the freedom we have in tying freedom, the freedom we have in Christ. I think that's just absolutely Christ. I think that's just absolutely Christ. I think that's just absolutely beautiful. So thank you for sharing beautiful. So thank you for sharing beautiful. So thank you for sharing about that. about that. about that. Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. Um I have just one final um thought that Um I have just one final um thought that Um I have just one final um thought that I thought we could flesh out a little I thought we could flesh out a little I thought we could flesh out a little bit and that is So if you're all in bit and that is So if you're all in bit and that is So if you're all in on everything we've talked about. So if on everything we've talked about. So if on everything we've talked about. So if you're like nodding and saying, "Yes, you're like nodding and saying, "Yes, you're like nodding and saying, "Yes, I'm so good. I love this. I love this I'm so good. I love this. I love this I'm so good. I love this. I love this conversation." Um and you're looking for conversation." Um and you're looking for conversation." Um and you're looking for some resources. You're thinking, "Okay, some resources. You're thinking, "Okay, some resources. You're thinking, "Okay, but tell me what I can do next." but tell me what I can do next." but tell me what I can do next." Let's talk about that. Let's talk about Let's talk about that. Let's talk about Let's talk about that. Let's talk about um some people you can follow on Insta um some people you can follow on Insta um some people you can follow on Insta or Facebook, some stuff you can watch on or Facebook, some stuff you can watch on or Facebook, some stuff you can watch on YouTube, um maybe a book you can read, YouTube, um maybe a book you can read, YouTube, um maybe a book you can read, all the good stuff to kind of take it to all the good stuff to kind of take it to all the good stuff to kind of take it to the next level. So what would you the next level. So what would you the next level. So what would you recommend uh if you're in that camp, recommend uh if you're in that camp, recommend uh if you're in that camp, Pastor Larry?

Pastor Larry? Pastor Larry? Absolutely. Um I I honestly more than Absolutely. Um I I honestly more than Absolutely. Um I I honestly more than following people or really YouTube. And following people or really YouTube. And following people or really YouTube. And And the only reason I say that is And the only reason I say that is And the only reason I say that is because I'm I'm very cautious with my because I'm I'm very cautious with my because I'm I'm very cautious with my endorsements of of of people as it endorsements of of of people as it endorsements of of of people as it relates to to social media. Uh I relates to to social media. Uh I relates to to social media. Uh I encourage people to read. I encourage encourage people to read. I encourage encourage people to read. I encourage people to read because what I do know is people to read because what I do know is people to read because what I do know is is that books that are written and is that books that are written and is that books that are written and well-written uh they're done so from a well-written uh they're done so from a well-written uh they're done so from a point of they have included their point of they have included their point of they have included their references and there's more of a sense references and there's more of a sense references and there's more of a sense of that the information you're getting of that the information you're getting of that the information you're getting is accurate and it's not just based on is accurate and it's not just based on is accurate and it's not just based on conjecture or maybe an emotional tirade conjecture or maybe an emotional tirade conjecture or maybe an emotional tirade at a moment by someone. So, a few books at a moment by someone. So, a few books at a moment by someone. So, a few books that I would recommend that I would recommend that I would recommend the birth of a white nation by the birth of a white nation by the birth of a white nation by Jacqueline Battalora, great book. Jacqueline Battalora, great book. Jacqueline Battalora, great book. And and maybe at some point I can I can And and maybe at some point I can I can And and maybe at some point I can I can send these to you Katie and you can put send these to you Katie and you can put send these to you Katie and you can put it under under this video or so forth. it under under this video or so forth. it under under this video or so forth. But but I and then But but I and then But but I and then the new Jim Crow mass incarceration in the new Jim Crow mass incarceration in the new Jim Crow mass incarceration in the age of color blindness by Michelle the age of color blindness by Michelle the age of color blindness by Michelle Alexander, great book. Uh the reason Alexander, great book. Uh the reason Alexander, great book. Uh the reason that book is so important is seeing how that book is so important is seeing how that book is so important is seeing how there is still a structured and there is still a structured and there is still a structured and systematic plan in place specifically as systematic plan in place specifically as systematic plan in place specifically as it relates to black men for oppression.

it relates to black men for oppression. it relates to black men for oppression. And that book will open your eyes to how And that book will open your eyes to how And that book will open your eyes to how this plays out with mass incarceration. this plays out with mass incarceration. this plays out with mass incarceration. I promise you don't be thrown off by the I promise you don't be thrown off by the I promise you don't be thrown off by the title and think oh here we go again. title and think oh here we go again. title and think oh here we go again. Read that book. Read that book because Read that book. Read that book because Read that book. Read that book because it will open your eyes. A slavery by it will open your eyes. A slavery by it will open your eyes. A slavery by another name by Douglas Blackman, great another name by Douglas Blackman, great another name by Douglas Blackman, great text to read as well. And so I've got text to read as well. And so I've got text to read as well. And so I've got about six or seven others and I'll I'll about six or seven others and I'll I'll about six or seven others and I'll I'll I'll shoot them to you and then you can I'll shoot them to you and then you can I'll shoot them to you and then you can you can assemble information yet too. you can assemble information yet too. you can assemble information yet too. But I would just say to anything that But I would just say to anything that But I would just say to anything that you see online to anyone that you follow you see online to anyone that you follow you see online to anyone that you follow online, here's what I this this is my online, here's what I this this is my online, here's what I this this is my charge to you. Be diligent in your charge to you. Be diligent in your charge to you. Be diligent in your research of them. research of them. research of them. Everyone's motives are not pure. Everyone's motives are not pure. Everyone's motives are not pure. Some individuals motive is to incite Some individuals motive is to incite Some individuals motive is to incite violence. violence. violence. It's to incite hatred, separatism. That It's to incite hatred, separatism. That It's to incite hatred, separatism. That is not what the majority of black people is not what the majority of black people is not what the majority of black people in this country are about. We are about in this country are about. We are about in this country are about. We are about unity. We are about education. We do unity. We are about education. We do unity. We are about education. We do want to see celebration of who we are, want to see celebration of who we are, want to see celebration of who we are, but we never want to see that over but we never want to see that over but we never want to see that over celebration of anybody else. We just celebration of anybody else. We just celebration of anybody else. We just want it to be equal. That's all. want it to be equal. That's all. want it to be equal. That's all. We just want it to be equal. Not that We just want it to be equal. Not that We just want it to be equal. Not that we're better than or greater than. We we're better than or greater than. We we're better than or greater than. We just want it to be equal and be given just want it to be equal and be given just want it to be equal and be given credit for what we do, achieve, and uh credit for what we do, achieve, and uh credit for what we do, achieve, and uh make happen in this country. So, that make happen in this country. So, that make happen in this country. So, that would be my recommend. I hope I haven't would be my recommend. I hope I haven't would be my recommend. I hope I haven't let you down by not giving let you down by not giving let you down by not giving more more sources, but I choose when it more more sources, but I choose when it more more sources, but I choose when it comes to matters of this I choose to go comes to matters of this I choose to go comes to matters of this I choose to go toward resources that I can actually toward resources that I can actually toward resources that I can actually prove. Where did you get the prove. Where did you get the prove. Where did you get the information? Where is this coming from?

information? Where is this coming from? information? Where is this coming from? And and literary pieces that are well And and literary pieces that are well And and literary pieces that are well written and well documented seem to written and well documented seem to written and well documented seem to serve best. serve best. serve best. Mhm.