The Brain Rot Problem Nobody's Talking About

If you sound like every other If you sound like every other person on your feed, I think you're person on your feed, I think you're person on your feed, I think you're going to get dismissed. Maybe maybe not going to get dismissed. Maybe maybe not going to get dismissed. Maybe maybe not today, but soon you will be. And then today, but soon you will be. And then today, but soon you will be. And then suddenly you're going to lose your suddenly you're going to lose your suddenly you're going to lose your ability to generate meaningful content. ability to generate meaningful content. ability to generate meaningful content. And if you outsource your thinking to And if you outsource your thinking to And if you outsource your thinking to the same engine everyone else is using, the same engine everyone else is using, the same engine everyone else is using, which is basically ChatGPT or Claude, which is basically ChatGPT or Claude, which is basically ChatGPT or Claude, you're not only losing your voice, you're not only losing your voice, you're not only losing your voice, you're losing your mind. Welcome to the you're losing your mind. Welcome to the you're losing your mind. Welcome to the Carey Nieuwhof Leadership Podcast. I'm Carey Nieuwhof Leadership Podcast. I'm Carey Nieuwhof Leadership Podcast. I'm so glad you joined us. Hey, shout-out so glad you joined us. Hey, shout-out so glad you joined us. Hey, shout-out before we get into today's show for before we get into today's show for before we get into today's show for those who are commenting on Spotify and those who are commenting on Spotify and those who are commenting on Spotify and YouTube, Tamber Delin, Rhea Thomas, YouTube, Tamber Delin, Rhea Thomas, YouTube, Tamber Delin, Rhea Thomas, Matthew Todd, and Scott Rank. We see Matthew Todd, and Scott Rank. We see Matthew Todd, and Scott Rank. We see you. Thank you so much for your you. Thank you so much for your you. Thank you so much for your feedback. Welcome to all the new feedback. Welcome to all the new feedback. Welcome to all the new listeners and welcome to those of you listeners and welcome to those of you listeners and welcome to those of you who've been around for a long, long who've been around for a long, long who've been around for a long, long time. Really glad you're here. Today time. Really glad you're here. Today time. Really glad you're here. Today we're talking about brain rot, cognitive we're talking about brain rot, cognitive we're talking about brain rot, cognitive [music] surrender, and why your voice is [music] surrender, and why your voice is [music] surrender, and why your voice is worth fighting for. I'm really concerned worth fighting for. I'm really concerned worth fighting for. I'm really concerned about what's happening in culture right about what's happening in culture right about what's happening in culture right now now now and [music] want to talk to you about and [music] want to talk to you about and [music] want to talk to you about how to properly use AI. how to properly use AI. how to properly use AI. I think we can overuse it. I think we I think we can overuse it. I think we I think we can overuse it. I think we can underuse it. And I use AI, but I'm can underuse it. And I use AI, but I'm can underuse it. And I use AI, but I'm using it in a way that I think using it in a way that I think using it in a way that I think >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> is going to be really important. And I >> is going to be really important. And I >> is going to be really important. And I talked to a lot of friends, big and talked to a lot of friends, big and talked to a lot of friends, big and small churches, who are using artificial small churches, who are using artificial small churches, who are using artificial intelligence. And sometimes we get it intelligence. And sometimes we get it intelligence. And sometimes we get it right and sometimes we get it wrong. And right and sometimes we get it wrong. And right and sometimes we get it wrong. And what can happen is we end up losing the what can happen is we end up losing the what can happen is we end up losing the ability to think. So, if you're ability to think. So, if you're ability to think. So, if you're interested in that, interested in that, interested in that, yeah, I'm wrestling with that myself and yeah, I'm wrestling with that myself and yeah, I'm wrestling with that myself and I want to take us on this journey to I want to take us on this journey to I want to take us on this journey to talk about it and why your voice is talk about it and why your voice is talk about it and why your voice is worth fighting for. And I want to talk worth fighting for. And I want to talk worth fighting for. And I want to talk specifically to young leaders, too. I specifically to young leaders, too. I specifically to young leaders, too. I think this is really critical. I've got

think this is really critical. I've got think this is really critical. I've got decades of like non-AI content decades of like non-AI content decades of like non-AI content development. You, if you just graduated development. You, if you just graduated development. You, if you just graduated from college, and a lot of you are young from college, and a lot of you are young from college, and a lot of you are young leaders, leaders, leaders, uh you're like, well, I I could do the uh you're like, well, I I could do the uh you're like, well, I I could do the whole thing through AI. What's at stake whole thing through AI. What's at stake whole thing through AI. What's at stake if you take that if you take that if you take that tack? What do you do? tack? What do you do? tack? What do you do? What's smart? What's not smart about it? What's smart? What's not smart about it? What's smart? What's not smart about it? So, if you want more, you can get more So, if you want more, you can get more So, if you want more, you can get more in the show notes. We have them at in the show notes. We have them at in the show notes. We have them at careynieuwhof.com/shownotes careynieuwhof.com/shownotes careynieuwhof.com/shownotes or you can go to The Art of Leadership or you can go to The Art of Leadership or you can go to The Art of Leadership Academy and join over 22,000 other Academy and join over 22,000 other Academy and join over 22,000 other leaders who are there and we'll have leaders who are there and we'll have leaders who are there and we'll have some great conversations with you. So, some great conversations with you. So, some great conversations with you. So, 3 and 1/2 years after chat GPT launched, 3 and 1/2 years after chat GPT launched, 3 and 1/2 years after chat GPT launched, uh we just don't sound the same anymore. uh we just don't sound the same anymore. uh we just don't sound the same anymore. We're starting to think the same or more We're starting to think the same or more We're starting to think the same or more accurately accurately accurately not think much at all. If you've noticed not think much at all. If you've noticed not think much at all. If you've noticed your feed, particularly over the last your feed, particularly over the last your feed, particularly over the last few months, I just see it filled with AI few months, I just see it filled with AI few months, I just see it filled with AI slop. It all sounds the same. It's all slop. It all sounds the same. It's all slop. It all sounds the same. It's all like it's written the same. And as soon like it's written the same. And as soon like it's written the same. And as soon as I detect that, I'm like, "Yeah, I'm as I detect that, I'm like, "Yeah, I'm as I detect that, I'm like, "Yeah, I'm not reading it." And uh maybe you've not reading it." And uh maybe you've not reading it." And uh maybe you've used AI to automate your social media. I used AI to automate your social media. I used AI to automate your social media. I want you to rethink that. Maybe you're want you to rethink that. Maybe you're want you to rethink that. Maybe you're using AI to write your message. I want using AI to write your message. I want using AI to write your message. I want you to rethink that, and here's why. A you to rethink that, and here's why. A you to rethink that, and here's why. A Wharton study just put a name on it, and Wharton study just put a name on it, and Wharton study just put a name on it, and I think it's appropriate. What they're I think it's appropriate. What they're I think it's appropriate. What they're calling it is cognitive surrender. And calling it is cognitive surrender. And calling it is cognitive surrender. And cognitive surrender happens when you let cognitive surrender happens when you let cognitive surrender happens when you let artificial intelligence do your thinking artificial intelligence do your thinking artificial intelligence do your thinking for you, which in many ways as a church for you, which in many ways as a church for you, which in many ways as a church leader is kind of like a spiritual leader is kind of like a spiritual leader is kind of like a spiritual surrender. So, this is something you surrender. So, this is something you surrender. So, this is something you have to fight for. Not just for church have to fight for. Not just for church have to fight for. Not just for church leaders, but if you're any kind of a leaders, but if you're any kind of a leaders, but if you're any kind of a content creator, I know we got a lot of content creator, I know we got a lot of content creator, I know we got a lot of business leaders listening, or a leader

business leaders listening, or a leader business leaders listening, or a leader of any kind, this is a fight you have to of any kind, this is a fight you have to of any kind, this is a fight you have to engage. So, let's talk about the content engage. So, let's talk about the content engage. So, let's talk about the content online that you probably spotted and online that you probably spotted and online that you probably spotted and I've spotted. I'm even seeing it now in I've spotted. I'm even seeing it now in I've spotted. I'm even seeing it now in books that were released in 2025 and books that were released in 2025 and books that were released in 2025 and 2026. And I I just kind of look at it. 2026. And I I just kind of look at it. 2026. And I I just kind of look at it. I'm like, "Yeah, it's generated by I'm like, "Yeah, it's generated by I'm like, "Yeah, it's generated by artificial intelligence." And I thought, artificial intelligence." And I thought, artificial intelligence." And I thought, "Man, you know, the guy didn't even "Man, you know, the guy didn't even "Man, you know, the guy didn't even write this. AI did." write this. AI did." write this. AI did." Why is that a problem? Cuz I use Why is that a problem? Cuz I use Why is that a problem? Cuz I use artificial intelligence as well. So, I'm artificial intelligence as well. So, I'm artificial intelligence as well. So, I'm going to give you my point of view. going to give you my point of view. going to give you my point of view. Content creation should still belong to Content creation should still belong to Content creation should still belong to the creators. So, your job, particularly the creators. So, your job, particularly the creators. So, your job, particularly I'm going to talk to pastors for a I'm going to talk to pastors for a I'm going to talk to pastors for a minute. You know what your job is? minute. You know what your job is? minute. You know what your job is? Your job is to wrestle God down when Your job is to wrestle God down when Your job is to wrestle God down when you're preaching a sermon, to do the you're preaching a sermon, to do the you're preaching a sermon, to do the hard work of staring at a blank page and hard work of staring at a blank page and hard work of staring at a blank page and to struggle on behalf of your to struggle on behalf of your to struggle on behalf of your congregation. I think that's your most congregation. I think that's your most congregation. I think that's your most valuable function or at least one of valuable function or at least one of valuable function or at least one of them. them. them. And a lot of pastors do that and then And a lot of pastors do that and then And a lot of pastors do that and then they turn to AI to help them make their they turn to AI to help them make their they turn to AI to help them make their message better. I think that's fine, but message better. I think that's fine, but message better. I think that's fine, but you know what? The initial struggle is you know what? The initial struggle is you know what? The initial struggle is yours. The problem emerges when you use yours. The problem emerges when you use yours. The problem emerges when you use artificial intelligence as a replacement artificial intelligence as a replacement artificial intelligence as a replacement for writing the message and as a for writing the message and as a for writing the message and as a replacement for the struggle on behalf replacement for the struggle on behalf replacement for the struggle on behalf of your people. You've got to get into of your people. You've got to get into of your people. You've got to get into the text. You got to say, "What does the text. You got to say, "What does the text. You got to say, "What does this mean? Like what does this actually this mean? Like what does this actually this mean? Like what does this actually mean?" Don't ask ChatGPT or Claude what mean?" Don't ask ChatGPT or Claude what mean?" Don't ask ChatGPT or Claude what it means.

it means. it means. You go do the hard work. Grab your You go do the hard work. Grab your You go do the hard work. Grab your commentaries and they can be online or commentaries and they can be online or commentaries and they can be online or analog. It doesn't matter. analog. It doesn't matter. analog. It doesn't matter. But I think that's your job and I think But I think that's your job and I think But I think that's your job and I think people can tell. I think people can tell people can tell. I think people can tell people can tell. I think people can tell like have you really wrestled this down? like have you really wrestled this down? like have you really wrestled this down? Do you own the message? Have you Do you own the message? Have you Do you own the message? Have you internalized this? Or did you just give internalized this? Or did you just give internalized this? Or did you just give a clever prompt and all of a sudden you a clever prompt and all of a sudden you a clever prompt and all of a sudden you got 30 minutes of AI-generated stuff got 30 minutes of AI-generated stuff got 30 minutes of AI-generated stuff that you don't even know what's coming that you don't even know what's coming that you don't even know what's coming next because you didn't write the next because you didn't write the next because you didn't write the message. So, my suggestion is you write message. So, my suggestion is you write message. So, my suggestion is you write it and then let AI refine it. And it and then let AI refine it. And it and then let AI refine it. And yeah, that's something I'm really yeah, that's something I'm really yeah, that's something I'm really passionate about. I got a new book passionate about. I got a new book passionate about. I got a new book coming out on AI in the future church coming out on AI in the future church coming out on AI in the future church and even though it's about artificial and even though it's about artificial and even though it's about artificial intelligence, intelligence, intelligence, I wrote the first two drafts the I wrote the first two drafts the I wrote the first two drafts the old-fashioned way, staring at a blinking old-fashioned way, staring at a blinking old-fashioned way, staring at a blinking cursor cursor cursor because I wanted that material to live because I wanted that material to live because I wanted that material to live in me. I wanted that material to be like in me. I wanted that material to be like in me. I wanted that material to be like you could stop me on the street and say, you could stop me on the street and say, you could stop me on the street and say, "So, what about deepfakes?" or "What "So, what about deepfakes?" or "What "So, what about deepfakes?" or "What about Silicon Valley? What about the about Silicon Valley? What about the about Silicon Valley? What about the motivations and the incentives of the AI motivations and the incentives of the AI motivations and the incentives of the AI companies?" or "Hey, what about making companies?" or "Hey, what about making companies?" or "Hey, what about making Sundays undownloadable?" And I know cuz Sundays undownloadable?" And I know cuz Sundays undownloadable?" And I know cuz what I've got, I mean the book is like what I've got, I mean the book is like what I've got, I mean the book is like 60,000 words, 60,000 words, 60,000 words, but inside me are about half a million but inside me are about half a million but inside me are about half a million words, a million words that I've words, a million words that I've words, a million words that I've digested, no more than that, that I've digested, no more than that, that I've digested, no more than that, that I've digested, that I've wrestled with, that digested, that I've wrestled with, that digested, that I've wrestled with, that didn't make the page. And so now, I didn't make the page. And so now, I didn't make the page. And so now, I wouldn't call myself an expert, but like wouldn't call myself an expert, but like wouldn't call myself an expert, but like I have thought about this topic I have thought about this topic I have thought about this topic deeply.

deeply. deeply. And And And if you haven't, I think there are tells. if you haven't, I think there are tells. if you haven't, I think there are tells. So, I want to walk you through seven So, I want to walk you through seven So, I want to walk you through seven giveaways that what you wrote was giveaways that what you wrote was giveaways that what you wrote was generated by AI. Seven tells or signs generated by AI. Seven tells or signs generated by AI. Seven tells or signs that probably your people are already that probably your people are already that probably your people are already picking up on. I'm picking up on it. picking up on. I'm picking up on it. picking up on. I'm picking up on it. Friends of mine are texting me, this was Friends of mine are texting me, this was Friends of mine are texting me, this was definitely AI, right? Uh definitely AI, right? Uh definitely AI, right? Uh and even if they can't name it, I think and even if they can't name it, I think and even if they can't name it, I think they kind of know. So, then I'm going to they kind of know. So, then I'm going to they kind of know. So, then I'm going to tell you what my voice actually is, what tell you what my voice actually is, what tell you what my voice actually is, what I'm doing to preserve it, so you have a I'm doing to preserve it, so you have a I'm doing to preserve it, so you have a positive marker to write toward, not positive marker to write toward, not positive marker to write toward, not only a list of things to avoid. only a list of things to avoid. only a list of things to avoid. And then in the second part, I want to And then in the second part, I want to And then in the second part, I want to talk about something even bigger than talk about something even bigger than talk about something even bigger than how we sound. I want to talk about how how we sound. I want to talk about how how we sound. I want to talk about how we're starting to think. A Wharton study we're starting to think. A Wharton study we're starting to think. A Wharton study published this past February called it, published this past February called it, published this past February called it, as I said, cognitive surrender. The as I said, cognitive surrender. The as I said, cognitive surrender. The Globe and Mail, big newspaper in Canada, Globe and Mail, big newspaper in Canada, Globe and Mail, big newspaper in Canada, which I read, just ran a piece on it. which I read, just ran a piece on it. which I read, just ran a piece on it. And for pastors and church And for pastors and church And for pastors and church communicators, I think this might be the communicators, I think this might be the communicators, I think this might be the most important conversation of the most important conversation of the most important conversation of the decade. So, here's the simple version. decade. So, here's the simple version. decade. So, here's the simple version. If you sound like every other person on If you sound like every other person on If you sound like every other person on your feed, I think you're going to get your feed, I think you're going to get your feed, I think you're going to get dismissed. Maybe maybe not today, but dismissed. Maybe maybe not today, but dismissed. Maybe maybe not today, but soon you will be. And then suddenly soon you will be. And then suddenly soon you will be. And then suddenly you're going to lose your ability to you're going to lose your ability to you're going to lose your ability to generate meaningful content. And if you generate meaningful content. And if you generate meaningful content. And if you outsource your thinking to the same outsource your thinking to the same outsource your thinking to the same engine everyone else is using, which is engine everyone else is using, which is engine everyone else is using, which is basically ChatGPT or Claude, you're not basically ChatGPT or Claude, you're not basically ChatGPT or Claude, you're not only losing your voice, you're losing only losing your voice, you're losing only losing your voice, you're losing your mind and everything your mind and everything your mind and everything that makes you you and the person that that makes you you and the person that that makes you you and the person that God wants you to be to minister. So, God wants you to be to minister. So, God wants you to be to minister. So, let's get into the signs. I've done a let's get into the signs. I've done a let's get into the signs. I've done a lot of research on this lately because I

lot of research on this lately because I lot of research on this lately because I was so frustrated seeing AI slop on my was so frustrated seeing AI slop on my was so frustrated seeing AI slop on my feed again and again. So, feed again and again. So, feed again and again. So, this is how I can tell and I think a lot this is how I can tell and I think a lot this is how I can tell and I think a lot of experts and probably the people you of experts and probably the people you of experts and probably the people you serve can tell that you didn't put in serve can tell that you didn't put in serve can tell that you didn't put in the work that you need to do. So, see if the work that you need to do. So, see if the work that you need to do. So, see if you recognize some of these in other you recognize some of these in other you recognize some of these in other people's content, too. So, sign number people's content, too. So, sign number people's content, too. So, sign number one that you're using AI to generate one that you're using AI to generate one that you're using AI to generate your content is there's too much your content is there's too much your content is there's too much contrast in it. This is the one I see contrast in it. This is the one I see contrast in it. This is the one I see more than any other right now. It's sort more than any other right now. It's sort more than any other right now. It's sort of AI's current go-to move. This isn't of AI's current go-to move. This isn't of AI's current go-to move. This isn't just X, it's Y. Or it says something just X, it's Y. Or it says something just X, it's Y. Or it says something like this, "This isn't just about like this, "This isn't just about like this, "This isn't just about revenue, it's about survival." Or revenue, it's about survival." Or revenue, it's about survival." Or "Amazon isn't just buying content, "Amazon isn't just buying content, "Amazon isn't just buying content, they're building credibility. This isn't they're building credibility. This isn't they're building credibility. This isn't a sermon series, it's a movement." I a sermon series, it's a movement." I a sermon series, it's a movement." I mean, do you recognize that? It's all mean, do you recognize that? It's all mean, do you recognize that? It's all over the place, right? Feels punchy the over the place, right? Feels punchy the over the place, right? Feels punchy the first time you read it, but by the fifth first time you read it, but by the fifth first time you read it, but by the fifth time you see it on the same feed, it time you see it on the same feed, it time you see it on the same feed, it starts to seem like a parody of itself. starts to seem like a parody of itself. starts to seem like a parody of itself. And right now on LinkedIn, on church And right now on LinkedIn, on church And right now on LinkedIn, on church Instagram, pastor newsletters, it's Instagram, pastor newsletters, it's Instagram, pastor newsletters, it's everywhere cuz we're all using the same everywhere cuz we're all using the same everywhere cuz we're all using the same AI to write this stuff. So, AI to write this stuff. So, AI to write this stuff. So, if you're going to have a bold claim if you're going to have a bold claim if you're going to have a bold claim like that, like maybe maybe use it once like that, like maybe maybe use it once like that, like maybe maybe use it once and then let it go. Twice, your reader and then let it go. Twice, your reader and then let it go. Twice, your reader starts to feel manipulated and beyond starts to feel manipulated and beyond starts to feel manipulated and beyond that, the reader knows, "Hey, some bot that, the reader knows, "Hey, some bot that, the reader knows, "Hey, some bot wrote this. You didn't write it." So, wrote this. You didn't write it." So, wrote this. You didn't write it." So, contrast, think of it as spice, contrast, think of it as spice, contrast, think of it as spice, not the meal.

not the meal. not the meal. But if you built your whole post around But if you built your whole post around But if you built your whole post around the "This isn't this, this is changing the "This isn't this, this is changing the "This isn't this, this is changing everything." you've outsourced your everything." you've outsourced your everything." you've outsourced your voice. So, you want to rebuild the post voice. So, you want to rebuild the post voice. So, you want to rebuild the post as a person, and then let the contrast as a person, and then let the contrast as a person, and then let the contrast be the kicker. Or, if you're using it be the kicker. Or, if you're using it be the kicker. Or, if you're using it sparingly and maybe it really is the sparingly and maybe it really is the sparingly and maybe it really is the biggest thing ever, well, that's great. biggest thing ever, well, that's great. biggest thing ever, well, that's great. All right, sign number two. Another tell All right, sign number two. Another tell All right, sign number two. Another tell that AI wrote it and you didn't is the that AI wrote it and you didn't is the that AI wrote it and you didn't is the staccato sentence, no paragraphs. staccato sentence, no paragraphs. staccato sentence, no paragraphs. Staccato sentences, no paragraphs. You Staccato sentences, no paragraphs. You Staccato sentences, no paragraphs. You know the rhythm. Short, sharp jabs. know the rhythm. Short, sharp jabs. know the rhythm. Short, sharp jabs. Three-word sentences stacked one after Three-word sentences stacked one after Three-word sentences stacked one after another. Not preaching, not teaching, another. Not preaching, not teaching, another. Not preaching, not teaching, just majestic. just majestic. just majestic. I mean, first of all, what does that I mean, first of all, what does that I mean, first of all, what does that even mean? Second, it sounds clever for even mean? Second, it sounds clever for even mean? Second, it sounds clever for a few lines, but super staccato a few lines, but super staccato a few lines, but super staccato sentences with no structural variation sentences with no structural variation sentences with no structural variation in their length or in their length or in their length or or or the idiom or or the idiom or or the idiom or the the What's the word I'm looking or the the What's the word I'm looking or the the What's the word I'm looking for? The timbre. No paragraphs. for? The timbre. No paragraphs. for? The timbre. No paragraphs. Yeah, that's bad. I mean, somebody's got Yeah, that's bad. I mean, somebody's got Yeah, that's bad. I mean, somebody's got to make that stop. I'll admit, to make that stop. I'll admit, to make that stop. I'll admit, like if you look back on my blog from like if you look back on my blog from like if you look back on my blog from posts 10 years ago, I used to write in posts 10 years ago, I used to write in posts 10 years ago, I used to write in short sentences because nobody else was short sentences because nobody else was short sentences because nobody else was doing it. And then AI started writing doing it. And then AI started writing doing it. And then AI started writing everything shorter and staccato. So now, everything shorter and staccato. So now, everything shorter and staccato. So now, guess what I do?

guess what I do? guess what I do? I write longer. I write longer. I write longer. Longer sentences can carry more meaning Longer sentences can carry more meaning Longer sentences can carry more meaning and they kind of breathe, right? and they kind of breathe, right? and they kind of breathe, right? And then, And then, And then, you know, a longer sentence can really you know, a longer sentence can really you know, a longer sentence can really make your your your reader think, the make your your your reader think, the make your your your reader think, the the congregation think, and you can the congregation think, and you can the congregation think, and you can include more nuance than these short include more nuance than these short include more nuance than these short staccato sentences. If you want to put staccato sentences. If you want to put staccato sentences. If you want to put in a short sentence or a single in a short sentence or a single in a short sentence or a single paragraph, great. Do it. I've I've got paragraph, great. Do it. I've I've got paragraph, great. Do it. I've I've got some in my new book, too. some in my new book, too. some in my new book, too. But let them live inside flowing But let them live inside flowing But let them live inside flowing conversational paragraphs. Let them be conversational paragraphs. Let them be conversational paragraphs. Let them be the period at the end of a paragraph, the period at the end of a paragraph, the period at the end of a paragraph, not the rhythm of every line, right? If not the rhythm of every line, right? If not the rhythm of every line, right? If your post reads like a stack of bumper your post reads like a stack of bumper your post reads like a stack of bumper stickers at a youth retreat, stickers at a youth retreat, stickers at a youth retreat, your rhythm is wrong. All right, third your rhythm is wrong. All right, third your rhythm is wrong. All right, third tell. Bold declarative headlines. This tell. Bold declarative headlines. This tell. Bold declarative headlines. This is hyperbole, overstatement. So, anytime is hyperbole, overstatement. So, anytime is hyperbole, overstatement. So, anytime you see something like, "Apple just you see something like, "Apple just you see something like, "Apple just changed the world with its latest changed the world with its latest changed the world with its latest release." Or, "Anthropic is about to release." Or, "Anthropic is about to release." Or, "Anthropic is about to overtake humanity." Or something like overtake humanity." Or something like overtake humanity." Or something like crazy like that. It's probably AI. Also, crazy like that. It's probably AI. Also, crazy like that. It's probably AI. Also, check the source because a lot of those check the source because a lot of those check the source because a lot of those accounts are bought accounts or they're accounts are bought accounts or they're accounts are bought accounts or they're people who used to write their own stuff people who used to write their own stuff people who used to write their own stuff and now they're using bots to do it. Or and now they're using bots to do it. Or and now they're using bots to do it. Or sometimes it's a it's I call them fake sometimes it's a it's I call them fake sometimes it's a it's I call them fake expertise people, people who are trying expertise people, people who are trying expertise people, people who are trying to sound authoritative because now AI to sound authoritative because now AI to sound authoritative because now AI has given them, you know, {quote} has given them, you know, {quote} has given them, you know, {quote} expertise expertise expertise in an area. I'm a mental health expert.

in an area. I'm a mental health expert. in an area. I'm a mental health expert. Yes, I You didn't go to school for that. Yes, I You didn't go to school for that. Yes, I You didn't go to school for that. You didn't really study that. You've You didn't really study that. You've You didn't really study that. You've just got a prompt going. That's what just got a prompt going. That's what just got a prompt going. That's what you've got. So, bold declarative you've got. So, bold declarative you've got. So, bold declarative headlines, um yeah, you got to watch headlines, um yeah, you got to watch headlines, um yeah, you got to watch that. So, sign number four, hype words that. So, sign number four, hype words that. So, sign number four, hype words and stock metaphors. So, if you see like and stock metaphors. So, if you see like and stock metaphors. So, if you see like transformational, game-changing, transformational, game-changing, transformational, game-changing, disruptive, revolutionary, paradigm disruptive, revolutionary, paradigm disruptive, revolutionary, paradigm shift, or even the word delve, or like shift, or even the word delve, or like shift, or even the word delve, or like the new normal, those are just stock the new normal, those are just stock the new normal, those are just stock phrases that everyone's using right now phrases that everyone's using right now phrases that everyone's using right now because the bots are spitting them out because the bots are spitting them out because the bots are spitting them out like a virus, okay? They've been like a virus, okay? They've been like a virus, okay? They've been laundered through a billion AI outputs laundered through a billion AI outputs laundered through a billion AI outputs until they mean almost nothing. So, what until they mean almost nothing. So, what until they mean almost nothing. So, what I would do if I see telltale signs like I would do if I see telltale signs like I would do if I see telltale signs like that, I just cut them. that, I just cut them. that, I just cut them. All right, even if they came from you All right, even if they came from you All right, even if they came from you and you're like, wait, I sound like a and you're like, wait, I sound like a and you're like, wait, I sound like a bot, I would probably cut that stuff. bot, I would probably cut that stuff. bot, I would probably cut that stuff. So, don't write this is a So, don't write this is a So, don't write this is a transformational moment for the church. transformational moment for the church. transformational moment for the church. What you might want to do is What you might want to do is What you might want to do is this could be the largest disruption the this could be the largest disruption the this could be the largest disruption the church has faced in your lifetime and church has faced in your lifetime and church has faced in your lifetime and you've got a couple years to position you've got a couple years to position you've got a couple years to position your team, but we really need to take your team, but we really need to take your team, but we really need to take this seriously. So, that starts to mean this seriously. So, that starts to mean this seriously. So, that starts to mean something. The other one is just like something. The other one is just like something. The other one is just like big hype and big hype is usually a sign big hype and big hype is usually a sign big hype and big hype is usually a sign that AI generated it. All right, fifth that AI generated it. All right, fifth that AI generated it. All right, fifth sign. Remember we got seven. Fake sign. Remember we got seven. Fake sign. Remember we got seven. Fake statistics. Okay, so this one's really statistics. Okay, so this one's really statistics. Okay, so this one's really important for church leaders, important for church leaders, important for church leaders, particularly pastors, fake statistics.

particularly pastors, fake statistics. particularly pastors, fake statistics. AI invents authority. It's gotten so AI invents authority. It's gotten so AI invents authority. It's gotten so much better, but it's still very much better, but it's still very much better, but it's still very um hallucinatory and it writes lines um hallucinatory and it writes lines um hallucinatory and it writes lines like study show storytelling is 22 times like study show storytelling is 22 times like study show storytelling is 22 times more memorable than facts. more memorable than facts. more memorable than facts. Well, it sounds smart, but like where's Well, it sounds smart, but like where's Well, it sounds smart, but like where's the study? Did you click on the link? Uh the study? Did you click on the link? Uh the study? Did you click on the link? Uh I often ask AI if it's doing research I often ask AI if it's doing research I often ask AI if it's doing research for me, please verify this. So, I I for me, please verify this. So, I I for me, please verify this. So, I I write this thing called church trends write this thing called church trends write this thing called church trends every January and it's about a two-month every January and it's about a two-month every January and it's about a two-month research project and I had done all my research project and I had done all my research project and I had done all my research and you know, I collect stuff research and you know, I collect stuff research and you know, I collect stuff over the year. Then I thought, I better over the year. Then I thought, I better over the year. Then I thought, I better run this through AI just to see if I'm run this through AI just to see if I'm run this through AI just to see if I'm missing a trend. Like, am I missing missing a trend. Like, am I missing missing a trend. Like, am I missing something? So, I said, if you were doing something? So, I said, if you were doing something? So, I said, if you were doing this, you know, what trends am I this, you know, what trends am I this, you know, what trends am I missing? Show me that. And it came back missing? Show me that. And it came back missing? Show me that. And it came back with a pretty convincing article with with a pretty convincing article with with a pretty convincing article with these headlines on Barna research and these headlines on Barna research and these headlines on Barna research and Lifeway research. Lifeway research. Lifeway research. And my first thought was, how could I And my first thought was, how could I And my first thought was, how could I have missed have missed have missed all of these sources? I mean, I'm pretty all of these sources? I mean, I'm pretty all of these sources? I mean, I'm pretty well subscribed and read. I guess I I'm well subscribed and read. I guess I I'm well subscribed and read. I guess I I'm not paying enough attention. And so, I not paying enough attention. And so, I not paying enough attention. And so, I started reading through these Barna started reading through these Barna started reading through these Barna stats and Lifeway stats and I thought, stats and Lifeway stats and I thought, stats and Lifeway stats and I thought, that's interesting. And then I clicked that's interesting. And then I clicked that's interesting. And then I clicked on the link. Went to nowhere. 404 error.

on the link. Went to nowhere. 404 error. on the link. Went to nowhere. 404 error. Like, okay. Like, okay. Like, okay. And then I thought, well, I'll just like And then I thought, well, I'll just like And then I thought, well, I'll just like Google the phrase. So, it was, you know, Google the phrase. So, it was, you know, Google the phrase. So, it was, you know, Barna says Gen Z is XYZ. I would just Barna says Gen Z is XYZ. I would just Barna says Gen Z is XYZ. I would just Google that. Google that. Google that. No Barna research. And I know I know No Barna research. And I know I know No Barna research. And I know I know these guys. I text David, "Did you do a these guys. I text David, "Did you do a these guys. I text David, "Did you do a study?" David Kinnaman, "Did you do a study?" David Kinnaman, "Did you do a study?" David Kinnaman, "Did you do a study on Nope. study on Nope. study on Nope. Same with Lifeway. Same with all of Same with Lifeway. Same with all of Same with Lifeway. Same with all of them. I I Googled it. I clicked on all them. I I Googled it. I clicked on all them. I I Googled it. I clicked on all the links. You know what that was? It the links. You know what that was? It the links. You know what that was? It was all fake. was all fake. was all fake. And that's 2026. If I had published that And that's 2026. If I had published that And that's 2026. If I had published that unthinkingly, I was going to sound smart unthinkingly, I was going to sound smart unthinkingly, I was going to sound smart until somebody just clicked the link and until somebody just clicked the link and until somebody just clicked the link and went, went, went, "This isn't true?" It was all fake. And "This isn't true?" It was all fake. And "This isn't true?" It was all fake. And then I challenged it, "Oh, you're right. then I challenged it, "Oh, you're right. then I challenged it, "Oh, you're right. I'm sorry. I made that up." I was like, I'm sorry. I made that up." I was like, I'm sorry. I made that up." I was like, "Well, "Well, "Well, glad I caught that." You know, this is a glad I caught that." You know, this is a glad I caught that." You know, this is a particular danger, pastors. You get up particular danger, pastors. You get up particular danger, pastors. You get up there every 7 days. You're a person of there every 7 days. You're a person of there every 7 days. You're a person of the book. the book. the book. And you don't want to be the one quoting And you don't want to be the one quoting And you don't want to be the one quoting fake research from the stage. The The fake research from the stage. The The fake research from the stage. The The trust cost is just too high. You've got trust cost is just too high. You've got trust cost is just too high. You've got to verify, verify, verify. And read the to verify, verify, verify. And read the to verify, verify, verify. And read the exact source. Go by the book or go to exact source. Go by the book or go to exact source. Go by the book or go to the original website. Make sure that the original website. Make sure that the original website. Make sure that they've got it right. Sometimes it's the they've got it right. Sometimes it's the they've got it right. Sometimes it's the right source and they get it wrong a right source and they get it wrong a right source and they get it wrong a little bit.

little bit. little bit. You know, it's like, "Well, it didn't You know, it's like, "Well, it didn't You know, it's like, "Well, it didn't really say this. It said that." You need really say this. It said that." You need really say this. It said that." You need to be the verifier. If you got a team to be the verifier. If you got a team to be the verifier. If you got a team building this, have your human team building this, have your human team building this, have your human team verify it. Um verify it. Um verify it. Um So So, you got to say it in your own So So, you got to say it in your own So So, you got to say it in your own voice and you got to verify. So, please voice and you got to verify. So, please voice and you got to verify. So, please use AI to do your research, but then use AI to do your research, but then use AI to do your research, but then verify it every time. And the same's verify it every time. And the same's verify it every time. And the same's true of Bible study. It sounds very true of Bible study. It sounds very true of Bible study. It sounds very convincing and you can prompt your way convincing and you can prompt your way convincing and you can prompt your way through it, but it can make big through it, but it can make big through it, but it can make big mistakes. And you don't want to mistakes. And you don't want to mistakes. And you don't want to misrepresent the Greek or the Hebrew, misrepresent the Greek or the Hebrew, misrepresent the Greek or the Hebrew, especially if you didn't take a class in especially if you didn't take a class in especially if you didn't take a class in Greek or Hebrew. You really want to do Greek or Hebrew. You really want to do Greek or Hebrew. You really want to do your research. So, uh fake statistic, your research. So, uh fake statistic, your research. So, uh fake statistic, fakes, fake everything. You You don't fakes, fake everything. You You don't fakes, fake everything. You You don't want to be caught with that. This want to be caught with that. This want to be caught with that. This episode is brought to you by my new episode is brought to you by my new episode is brought to you by my new book, AI and the Future Church. So, as book, AI and the Future Church. So, as book, AI and the Future Church. So, as you're listening to this episode, I want you're listening to this episode, I want you're listening to this episode, I want you to think about this. you to think about this. you to think about this. The same forces that can hollow out a The same forces that can hollow out a The same forces that can hollow out a person can hollow out a culture person can hollow out a culture person can hollow out a culture and a church. So, if you don't pay and a church. So, if you don't pay and a church. So, if you don't pay attention to what's happening around you attention to what's happening around you attention to what's happening around you and within you, things can go sideways and within you, things can go sideways and within you, things can go sideways quickly, right? Your church becomes quickly, right? Your church becomes quickly, right? Your church becomes irrelevant or irrelevant or irrelevant or what used to work just doesn't work what used to work just doesn't work what used to work just doesn't work anymore. Well, we are in an era of anymore. Well, we are in an era of anymore. Well, we are in an era of unprecedented change and the AI unprecedented change and the AI unprecedented change and the AI revolution is expected to be 10 times revolution is expected to be 10 times revolution is expected to be 10 times bigger and worse 10 times faster than bigger and worse 10 times faster than bigger and worse 10 times faster than the Industrial Revolution. That took the Industrial Revolution. That took the Industrial Revolution. That took centuries for people to adjust to, but centuries for people to adjust to, but centuries for people to adjust to, but the question is in the AI era, are you the question is in the AI era, are you the question is in the AI era, are you ready? Well, that's what I wrote my new ready? Well, that's what I wrote my new ready? Well, that's what I wrote my new book about. It's called AI and the book about. It's called AI and the book about. It's called AI and the Future Church and it's built on three Future Church and it's built on three Future Church and it's built on three shifts that can anchor you and your shifts that can anchor you and your shifts that can anchor you and your church through all the change that's church through all the change that's church through all the change that's ahead, however it unfolds. Shift number

ahead, however it unfolds. Shift number ahead, however it unfolds. Shift number one, make your Sundays non-downloadable. one, make your Sundays non-downloadable. one, make your Sundays non-downloadable. You want to build the kind of community You want to build the kind of community You want to build the kind of community that AI is never able to copy. Shift that AI is never able to copy. Shift that AI is never able to copy. Shift number two, build the shock absorbers number two, build the shock absorbers number two, build the shock absorbers now. You want to create capacity for the now. You want to create capacity for the now. You want to create capacity for the financial and mental health crises that financial and mental health crises that financial and mental health crises that are probably heading our way before are probably heading our way before are probably heading our way before people arrive, not after. And third, people arrive, not after. And third, people arrive, not after. And third, you want to fortify your integrity. you want to fortify your integrity. you want to fortify your integrity. Decide what you stand for because AI is Decide what you stand for because AI is Decide what you stand for because AI is going to raise the incentives and going to raise the incentives and going to raise the incentives and probably expose what a lot of leaders probably expose what a lot of leaders probably expose what a lot of leaders will fall for. We are moving into a wild will fall for. We are moving into a wild will fall for. We are moving into a wild world. You want to get these three right world. You want to get these three right world. You want to get these three right and I think this could become one of the and I think this could become one of the and I think this could become one of the greatest growth eras the church has ever greatest growth eras the church has ever greatest growth eras the church has ever seen. I think people are going to flock seen. I think people are going to flock seen. I think people are going to flock to church if we get this right. So don't to church if we get this right. So don't to church if we get this right. So don't blow this moment. My new book releases blow this moment. My new book releases blow this moment. My new book releases September 15th and you can pre-order it September 15th and you can pre-order it September 15th and you can pre-order it now at aifuture.church, now at aifuture.church, now at aifuture.church, on Amazon or anywhere you buy books. on Amazon or anywhere you buy books. on Amazon or anywhere you buy books. This episode is brought to you by Belay. This episode is brought to you by Belay. This episode is brought to you by Belay. So you know your church's finances So you know your church's finances So you know your church's finances matter, your ministry depends on healthy matter, your ministry depends on healthy matter, your ministry depends on healthy stewardship, but bookkeeping, invoices, stewardship, but bookkeeping, invoices, stewardship, but bookkeeping, invoices, reconciliations, reports, reconciliations, reports, reconciliations, reports, that's not why you stepped into that's not why you stepped into that's not why you stepped into ministry. Maybe working with numbers is ministry. Maybe working with numbers is ministry. Maybe working with numbers is not your strength or maybe it is, but it not your strength or maybe it is, but it not your strength or maybe it is, but it still can drain your focus from still can drain your focus from still can drain your focus from ministry. So every hour spent managing ministry. So every hour spent managing ministry. So every hour spent managing finances is an hour you're pulled away finances is an hour you're pulled away finances is an hour you're pulled away from leading and serving your church.

from leading and serving your church. from leading and serving your church. Yet the reality is Yet the reality is Yet the reality is you got to get the financial work done. you got to get the financial work done. you got to get the financial work done. So, our friends at Belay have US-based, So, our friends at Belay have US-based, So, our friends at Belay have US-based, highly vetted support that can help. highly vetted support that can help. >> [snorts] >> And their financial experts are here to >> And their financial experts are here to >> And their financial experts are here to handle the numbers. So, whether you need handle the numbers. So, whether you need handle the numbers. So, whether you need a single bookkeeper or a full-fledged a single bookkeeper or a full-fledged a single bookkeeper or a full-fledged accounting team, Belay has the match to accounting team, Belay has the match to accounting team, Belay has the match to fit your church's unique needs and fit your church's unique needs and fit your church's unique needs and budgets. And with the right support, you budgets. And with the right support, you budgets. And with the right support, you can stay present, move your mission can stay present, move your mission can stay present, move your mission forward, and still get the important forward, and still get the important forward, and still get the important foundational work done. Belay is also foundational work done. Belay is also foundational work done. Belay is also giving away a free download of their giving away a free download of their giving away a free download of their resource, Belay's Blueprint for Growth. resource, Belay's Blueprint for Growth. resource, Belay's Blueprint for Growth. This guide gives valuable insights into This guide gives valuable insights into This guide gives valuable insights into how to build a strong financial future how to build a strong financial future how to build a strong financial future for your church that will sustain your for your church that will sustain your for your church that will sustain your mission long-term. So, how do you get mission long-term. So, how do you get mission long-term. So, how do you get it? Text the word Carey, c a r e y, to it? Text the word Carey, c a r e y, to it? Text the word Carey, c a r e y, to 55123 for your free download. That's 55123 for your free download. That's 55123 for your free download. That's Carey to 55123. Carey to 55123. Carey to 55123. Find the freedom to live out your Find the freedom to live out your Find the freedom to live out your calling with Belay. Sign number six, calling with Belay. Sign number six, calling with Belay. Sign number six, quotes. Nobody ever said, This is the quotes. Nobody ever said, This is the quotes. Nobody ever said, This is the same problem of sorts on steroids. AI same problem of sorts on steroids. AI same problem of sorts on steroids. AI will produce a quote, attach a famous will produce a quote, attach a famous will produce a quote, attach a famous name, and offer no source.

name, and offer no source. name, and offer no source. AI is the new electricity, said Elon AI is the new electricity, said Elon AI is the new electricity, said Elon Musk. Actually, that wasn't Elon Musk, Musk. Actually, that wasn't Elon Musk, Musk. Actually, that wasn't Elon Musk, right? Didn't say that. Or, right? Didn't say that. Or, right? Didn't say that. Or, I've watched pastors deliver fake C.S. I've watched pastors deliver fake C.S. I've watched pastors deliver fake C.S. Lewis quotes from the stage, false Tim Lewis quotes from the stage, false Tim Lewis quotes from the stage, false Tim Keller quotes. Keller quotes. Keller quotes. Maybe it's a Bonhoeffer quote, all Maybe it's a Bonhoeffer quote, all Maybe it's a Bonhoeffer quote, all confidently delivered, none of them confidently delivered, none of them confidently delivered, none of them real. real. real. Your people are going to fact-check you, Your people are going to fact-check you, Your people are going to fact-check you, or the thoughtful ones will. And you or the thoughtful ones will. And you or the thoughtful ones will. And you really have to be careful. So, if you're really have to be careful. So, if you're really have to be careful. So, if you're looking for inspirational quotes or looking for inspirational quotes or looking for inspirational quotes or whatever, just check, check, check, whatever, just check, check, check, whatever, just check, check, check, verify, verify, verify. And then the verify, verify, verify. And then the verify, verify, verify. And then the seventh sign, you probably know this one seventh sign, you probably know this one seventh sign, you probably know this one already. It's small, but it's already. It's small, but it's already. It's small, but it's significant. If you're writing significant. If you're writing significant. If you're writing m dashes everywhere. That's the long m dashes everywhere. That's the long m dashes everywhere. That's the long dash between something. The m dash is dash between something. The m dash is dash between something. The m dash is AI's current signature tick. It's the AI's current signature tick. It's the AI's current signature tick. It's the fastest tell that a computer wrote it. I fastest tell that a computer wrote it. I fastest tell that a computer wrote it. I used to use a lot of m dashes, now I used to use a lot of m dashes, now I used to use a lot of m dashes, now I don't, or I rarely do. But what I do is don't, or I rarely do. But what I do is don't, or I rarely do. But what I do is use commas, periods, parentheses. use commas, periods, parentheses. use commas, periods, parentheses. Um but I've kind of cut them out because Um but I've kind of cut them out because Um but I've kind of cut them out because they're such an AI fingerprint problem they're such an AI fingerprint problem they're such an AI fingerprint problem right now. Okay, that's the to don't right now. Okay, that's the to don't right now. Okay, that's the to don't list. Those are the seven signs, but list. Those are the seven signs, but list. Those are the seven signs, but knowing what to avoid doesn't tell you knowing what to avoid doesn't tell you knowing what to avoid doesn't tell you what to write toward. And I think this what to write toward. And I think this what to write toward. And I think this is really important, particularly for is really important, particularly for is really important, particularly for younger leaders. If you've been using AI younger leaders. If you've been using AI younger leaders. If you've been using AI since it came out and you're like, I'm since it came out and you're like, I'm since it came out and you're like, I'm 23, what is my voice? This is a really 23, what is my voice? This is a really 23, what is my voice? This is a really big question. I spent quite a bit of big question. I spent quite a bit of big question. I spent quite a bit of time going over my writing and trying to time going over my writing and trying to time going over my writing and trying to make sure that I understand my voice.

make sure that I understand my voice. make sure that I understand my voice. Now, I have the advantage of having Now, I have the advantage of having Now, I have the advantage of having written for four decades. And I have written for four decades. And I have written for four decades. And I have tried a lot to train AI on my voice, and tried a lot to train AI on my voice, and tried a lot to train AI on my voice, and I'm going to be honest with you, I'm going to be honest with you, I'm going to be honest with you, AI is getting worse, not better at it. I AI is getting worse, not better at it. I AI is getting worse, not better at it. I don't know why cuz the models keep don't know why cuz the models keep don't know why cuz the models keep improving, but every time I'm like, hey, improving, but every time I'm like, hey, improving, but every time I'm like, hey, I want to turn this idea in a book into I want to turn this idea in a book into I want to turn this idea in a book into an Instagram post to write in my voice, an Instagram post to write in my voice, an Instagram post to write in my voice, it doesn't do a good job. It just it doesn't do a good job. It just it doesn't do a good job. It just reverts to its voice. And I've tried all reverts to its voice. And I've tried all reverts to its voice. And I've tried all these hacks. So, maybe you've got like a these hacks. So, maybe you've got like a these hacks. So, maybe you've got like a magic way to do this, drop in the magic way to do this, drop in the magic way to do this, drop in the comments. I'd love to hear from you. But comments. I'd love to hear from you. But comments. I'd love to hear from you. But again, the only way I would do that is again, the only way I would do that is again, the only way I would do that is if I had written on a subject and then I if I had written on a subject and then I if I had written on a subject and then I want to produce a shorter form of it. want to produce a shorter form of it. want to produce a shorter form of it. Um, that can save you some time. I Um, that can save you some time. I Um, that can save you some time. I already know what I think on an issue. I already know what I think on an issue. I already know what I think on an issue. I want to use AI want to use AI want to use AI to generate something in a shorter form, to generate something in a shorter form, to generate something in a shorter form, but it still screws up my voice. So, but it still screws up my voice. So, but it still screws up my voice. So, what I've had to do is I've had to what I've had to do is I've had to what I've had to do is I've had to figure out what is my voice. And figure out what is my voice. And figure out what is my voice. And ironically, uh, AI can help you figure ironically, uh, AI can help you figure ironically, uh, AI can help you figure out what your voice is if you feed in, out what your voice is if you feed in, out what your voice is if you feed in, you know, some manuscripts that you you know, some manuscripts that you you know, some manuscripts that you worked on or some articles that you worked on or some articles that you worked on or some articles that you wrote, etc. So, first thing I've learned wrote, etc. So, first thing I've learned wrote, etc. So, first thing I've learned about my voice, and you want to find about my voice, and you want to find about my voice, and you want to find similar markers for you. First, my voice similar markers for you. First, my voice similar markers for you. First, my voice is conversational.

is conversational. is conversational. If I'm doing it right, it sounds like If I'm doing it right, it sounds like If I'm doing it right, it sounds like I'm sitting across the table from you at I'm sitting across the table from you at I'm sitting across the table from you at a coffee shop and just talking to you as a coffee shop and just talking to you as a coffee shop and just talking to you as my friend, not lecturing from a stage, my friend, not lecturing from a stage, my friend, not lecturing from a stage, not like in a board meeting. I want it not like in a board meeting. I want it not like in a board meeting. I want it to be conversational. I remember when I to be conversational. I remember when I to be conversational. I remember when I started writing books, friend of mine started writing books, friend of mine started writing books, friend of mine texted me, he says, man, texted me, he says, man, texted me, he says, man, you you for 50,000 words, it was like I you you for 50,000 words, it was like I you you for 50,000 words, it was like I was just sitting down having a was just sitting down having a was just sitting down having a conversation with you. Yes, that's what conversation with you. Yes, that's what conversation with you. Yes, that's what I want this podcast to feel like, that's I want this podcast to feel like, that's I want this podcast to feel like, that's what I want my books to feel like, what I want my books to feel like, what I want my books to feel like, that's what I want my content to feel that's what I want my content to feel that's what I want my content to feel like. So, I'm conversational. You may like. So, I'm conversational. You may like. So, I'm conversational. You may not be, but I am. Second thing I know not be, but I am. Second thing I know not be, but I am. Second thing I know about myself is my voice is usually in about myself is my voice is usually in about myself is my voice is usually in the second person. I almost never say the second person. I almost never say the second person. I almost never say we. Now, if I'm dealing with a topic we. Now, if I'm dealing with a topic we. Now, if I'm dealing with a topic that's really sensitive, like we all that's really sensitive, like we all that's really sensitive, like we all sin, I'm not going to say you sin, I'm sin, I'm not going to say you sin, I'm sin, I'm not going to say you sin, I'm going to say, you know what, we all sin. going to say, you know what, we all sin. going to say, you know what, we all sin. But if I'm talking about leaders, notice But if I'm talking about leaders, notice But if I'm talking about leaders, notice how often in this podcast I've said you. how often in this podcast I've said you. how often in this podcast I've said you. Um talk about me, but I really don't use Um talk about me, but I really don't use Um talk about me, but I really don't use the third person a lot as in every the third person a lot as in every the third person a lot as in every leader. leader. leader. I'll say, "Hey, I'm talking to you. You I'll say, "Hey, I'm talking to you. You I'll say, "Hey, I'm talking to you. You know, this is something you need to know, this is something you need to know, this is something you need to consider. You need to find your voice."

consider. You need to find your voice." consider. You need to find your voice." Why do I do that? Well, that's a Why do I do that? Well, that's a Why do I do that? Well, that's a signature that I've been using for years signature that I've been using for years signature that I've been using for years because I figure you're reading it, we because I figure you're reading it, we because I figure you're reading it, we can connect, and we can try to figure can connect, and we can try to figure can connect, and we can try to figure that out. I'm not talking to anybody that out. I'm not talking to anybody that out. I'm not talking to anybody disembodied somewhere. I often use you. disembodied somewhere. I often use you. disembodied somewhere. I often use you. So, that's a that's a second So, that's a that's a second So, that's a that's a second characteristic. Third thing, characteristic. Third thing, characteristic. Third thing, I want to make sure that my voice is I want to make sure that my voice is I want to make sure that my voice is helpful, more than interesting or bold helpful, more than interesting or bold helpful, more than interesting or bold or declarative or revolutionary, as we or declarative or revolutionary, as we or declarative or revolutionary, as we talked about earlier. AI is going to talked about earlier. AI is going to talked about earlier. AI is going to make some crazy statements about why make some crazy statements about why make some crazy statements about why this church went bankrupt or why this this church went bankrupt or why this this church went bankrupt or why this moment in history is the most moment in history is the most moment in history is the most significant. It's a lot of hyperbole. significant. It's a lot of hyperbole. significant. It's a lot of hyperbole. When I write or speak, I just want it to When I write or speak, I just want it to When I write or speak, I just want it to be helpful. I want you, because you be helpful. I want you, because you be helpful. I want you, because you invested your time like you did in this invested your time like you did in this invested your time like you did in this podcast, to walk away going, podcast, to walk away going, podcast, to walk away going, "Boy, I really got to watch for AI tells "Boy, I really got to watch for AI tells "Boy, I really got to watch for AI tells in my writing, and maybe I have to in my writing, and maybe I have to in my writing, and maybe I have to rethink that." Like that's what you want rethink that." Like that's what you want rethink that." Like that's what you want to do. So, AI might say, "Here's the to do. So, AI might say, "Here's the to do. So, AI might say, "Here's the biggest change ever coming to every biggest change ever coming to every biggest change ever coming to every church in 2026." church in 2026." church in 2026." Helpful sounds like, "Here's one move to Helpful sounds like, "Here's one move to Helpful sounds like, "Here's one move to make in your staff meeting on Monday make in your staff meeting on Monday make in your staff meeting on Monday uh because of AI." So, in every email I uh because of AI." So, in every email I uh because of AI." So, in every email I write, every video, every caption in write, every video, every caption in write, every video, every caption in social media, the question that me and social media, the question that me and social media, the question that me and my team work on is, my team work on is, my team work on is, "If somebody accesses this, how is it "If somebody accesses this, how is it "If somebody accesses this, how is it going to help them?"

going to help them?" going to help them?" If the piece doesn't help you, I'm not If the piece doesn't help you, I'm not If the piece doesn't help you, I'm not going to publish it. going to publish it. going to publish it. Next thing is, huh, Next thing is, huh, Next thing is, huh, I try to admit what I don't know. I'm I try to admit what I don't know. I'm I try to admit what I don't know. I'm not an expert in a lot of things and AI not an expert in a lot of things and AI not an expert in a lot of things and AI thinks it's an expert in anything and to thinks it's an expert in anything and to thinks it's an expert in anything and to be fair, it trained on all the be fair, it trained on all the be fair, it trained on all the information information information known to humanity at any time. known to humanity at any time. known to humanity at any time. So, I'm very free to admit, "Look, I So, I'm very free to admit, "Look, I So, I'm very free to admit, "Look, I don't understand the math behind that don't understand the math behind that don't understand the math behind that either or I don't even know why this either or I don't even know why this either or I don't even know why this works." And in an AI era, I think that's works." And in an AI era, I think that's works." And in an AI era, I think that's superpower, right? A leader who can superpower, right? A leader who can superpower, right? A leader who can stand there vulnerably and say, "Yeah, stand there vulnerably and say, "Yeah, stand there vulnerably and say, "Yeah, I'm not an expert in this area." I'm not an expert in this area." I'm not an expert in this area." Um Um Um I think that could become winsome and I think that could become winsome and I think that could become winsome and trustworthy attribute because if you're trustworthy attribute because if you're trustworthy attribute because if you're faking expertise, faking expertise, faking expertise, um people aren't really going to trust um people aren't really going to trust um people aren't really going to trust you because they're going to know you you because they're going to know you you because they're going to know you don't you don't really understand brain don't you don't really understand brain don't you don't really understand brain science, do you, Carey? Correct. I have science, do you, Carey? Correct. I have science, do you, Carey? Correct. I have a degree in theology and history and a degree in theology and history and a degree in theology and history and law, not neuroscience. Fair. So, here's law, not neuroscience. Fair. So, here's law, not neuroscience. Fair. So, here's your homework. You got to figure out your homework. You got to figure out your homework. You got to figure out what your voice is. what your voice is. what your voice is. And what does that mean? Well, if you're And what does that mean? Well, if you're And what does that mean? Well, if you're experienced, read your old sermons, your experienced, read your old sermons, your experienced, read your old sermons, your emails, remember who you are. If you're emails, remember who you are. If you're emails, remember who you are. If you're 20, 20, 20, this is a tough assignment, but I did it this is a tough assignment, but I did it this is a tough assignment, but I did it and everybody who came before you did it and everybody who came before you did it and everybody who came before you did it in human history, write your next 100 in human history, write your next 100 in human history, write your next 100 drafts without artificial intelligence.

drafts without artificial intelligence. drafts without artificial intelligence. And if you do that and it's going to be And if you do that and it's going to be And if you do that and it's going to be frustrating and you're going to bang the frustrating and you're going to bang the frustrating and you're going to bang the table and you're going to put down your table and you're going to put down your table and you're going to put down your pen or you're going to want to punch pen or you're going to want to punch pen or you're going to want to punch your computer, your computer, your computer, that's actually your job, okay? You're that's actually your job, okay? You're that's actually your job, okay? You're going to discover your voice. It's going going to discover your voice. It's going going to discover your voice. It's going to take years, but that's what all the to take years, but that's what all the to take years, but that's what all the great thinkers, all the great writers, great thinkers, all the great writers, great thinkers, all the great writers, all the great preachers, all the great all the great preachers, all the great all the great preachers, all the great philosophers, that's what they've all philosophers, that's what they've all philosophers, that's what they've all done. Do you think done. Do you think done. Do you think Spurgeon and C.S. Lewis found their Spurgeon and C.S. Lewis found their Spurgeon and C.S. Lewis found their voice at 19? Nope. It was decades in the voice at 19? Nope. It was decades in the voice at 19? Nope. It was decades in the forging. So, you got to find your voice forging. So, you got to find your voice forging. So, you got to find your voice and that means and that means and that means in the age of AI, you probably want to in the age of AI, you probably want to in the age of AI, you probably want to do those first drafts without AI and do those first drafts without AI and do those first drafts without AI and then use it to critique it to make you then use it to critique it to make you then use it to critique it to make you better, but that could become your better, but that could become your better, but that could become your superpower in the age of AI. So, Kevin superpower in the age of AI. So, Kevin superpower in the age of AI. So, Kevin Kelly, somebody older than me, but who's Kelly, somebody older than me, but who's Kelly, somebody older than me, but who's been writing for decades, writes a lot been writing for decades, writes a lot been writing for decades, writes a lot about technology. He's the founder of about technology. He's the founder of about technology. He's the founder of Wired. And I really resonate with what Wired. And I really resonate with what Wired. And I really resonate with what he's saying. I read a piece of his that he's saying. I read a piece of his that he's saying. I read a piece of his that he wrote, not AI, that says, um he wrote, not AI, that says, um he wrote, not AI, that says, um basically it's your uniqueness, your basically it's your uniqueness, your basically it's your uniqueness, your distinct offerings, and creativity that distinct offerings, and creativity that distinct offerings, and creativity that are going to make you stand out in this are going to make you stand out in this are going to make you stand out in this artificial intelligence. I want to quote artificial intelligence. I want to quote artificial intelligence. I want to quote from Kevin. He says, "The less from Kevin. He says, "The less from Kevin. He says, "The less predictable you are, predictable you are, predictable you are, the less likely you are to be replaced the less likely you are to be replaced the less likely you are to be replaced by AIs. Machines are efficient and they by AIs. Machines are efficient and they by AIs. Machines are efficient and they are powered by the predictable. Current are powered by the predictable. Current are powered by the predictable. Current LLMs, large language models, are trained LLMs, large language models, are trained LLMs, large language models, are trained to generate the most predictable to generate the most predictable to generate the most predictable solutions. So far, they are not very solutions. So far, they are not very solutions. So far, they are not very good at duplicating what a creative, good at duplicating what a creative, good at duplicating what a creative, one-of-a-kind, improbable human can one-of-a-kind, improbable human can one-of-a-kind, improbable human can produce. To distance yourself from

produce. To distance yourself from produce. To distance yourself from machines, be as improbable as you can machines, be as improbable as you can machines, be as improbable as you can be." be." be." I love that, right? Like Salvador Dalí, I love that, right? Like Salvador Dalí, I love that, right? Like Salvador Dalí, Picasso, Van Gogh, they're painting like Picasso, Van Gogh, they're painting like Picasso, Van Gogh, they're painting like nobody else did. And I learn from other nobody else did. And I learn from other nobody else did. And I learn from other people. Craig Rochelle's a good friend. people. Craig Rochelle's a good friend. people. Craig Rochelle's a good friend. I never miss an episode of his podcast. I never miss an episode of his podcast. I never miss an episode of his podcast. And parts of me wish, "Boy, I wish I And parts of me wish, "Boy, I wish I And parts of me wish, "Boy, I wish I could be as clear and succinct as could be as clear and succinct as could be as clear and succinct as Craig." Craig." Craig." But I'm not. I'm different. And that's But I'm not. I'm different. And that's But I'm not. I'm different. And that's okay. And he's different from me. And okay. And he's different from me. And okay. And he's different from me. And there's a difference in you. The image there's a difference in you. The image there's a difference in you. The image of God in you is going to produce of God in you is going to produce of God in you is going to produce produce a unique fingerprint that you produce a unique fingerprint that you produce a unique fingerprint that you need to discover as a young leader. So need to discover as a young leader. So need to discover as a young leader. So that's what you need to be doing. This that's what you need to be doing. This that's what you need to be doing. This episode is brought to you by Church episode is brought to you by Church episode is brought to you by Church Growth Engine. So if you're like most Growth Engine. So if you're like most Growth Engine. So if you're like most pastors listening right now, you want pastors listening right now, you want pastors listening right now, you want your church to thrive, but you're your church to thrive, but you're your church to thrive, but you're drowning in strategies that don't fit drowning in strategies that don't fit drowning in strategies that don't fit your context. Maybe you've tried the your context. Maybe you've tried the your context. Maybe you've tried the latest programs, and you've read the latest programs, and you've read the latest programs, and you've read the books, and you've attended the books, and you've attended the books, and you've attended the conferences. But here's what's missing. conferences. But here's what's missing. conferences. But here's what's missing. A weekly pulse on what's actually A weekly pulse on what's actually A weekly pulse on what's actually working in churches like yours right working in churches like yours right working in churches like yours right now. Church Growth Engine delivers now. Church Growth Engine delivers now. Church Growth Engine delivers research-backed strategies straight into research-backed strategies straight into research-backed strategies straight into your inbox every Tuesday morning. No your inbox every Tuesday morning. No your inbox every Tuesday morning. No fluff, no theory, just practical fluff, no theory, just practical fluff, no theory, just practical insights you can scan in 5 minutes and insights you can scan in 5 minutes and insights you can scan in 5 minutes and implement this week. Whether you lead 50 implement this week. Whether you lead 50 implement this week. Whether you lead 50 people or 500. They cover why churches people or 500. They cover why churches people or 500. They cover why churches growing 5% annually measure engagement growing 5% annually measure engagement growing 5% annually measure engagement over attendance, how one pastor doubled over attendance, how one pastor doubled over attendance, how one pastor doubled visitor retention with immediate visitor retention with immediate visitor retention with immediate texting, and the surprising Jesus texting, and the surprising Jesus texting, and the surprising Jesus resurgence happening outside of church

resurgence happening outside of church resurgence happening outside of church walls. So, you can join over a thousand walls. So, you can join over a thousand walls. So, you can join over a thousand pastors who are building thriving pastors who are building thriving pastors who are building thriving churches without the overwhelm. churches without the overwhelm. churches without the overwhelm. Subscribe for free at Subscribe for free at Subscribe for free at churchgrowthengine.com. churchgrowthengine.com. churchgrowthengine.com. That's churchgrowthengine.com. That's churchgrowthengine.com. That's churchgrowthengine.com. Okay. Okay. Okay. Now, before we go, I want to talk about Now, before we go, I want to talk about Now, before we go, I want to talk about brain rot and cognitive surrender. Voice brain rot and cognitive surrender. Voice brain rot and cognitive surrender. Voice is half the conversation, the other half is half the conversation, the other half is half the conversation, the other half is brain rot. I want to jump back to is brain rot. I want to jump back to is brain rot. I want to jump back to that Globe and Mail piece that recently that Globe and Mail piece that recently that Globe and Mail piece that recently described the Wharton study. So, here's described the Wharton study. So, here's described the Wharton study. So, here's what researchers at Wharton School of what researchers at Wharton School of what researchers at Wharton School of Business did. They gave participants Business did. They gave participants Business did. They gave participants questions that required logic and questions that required logic and questions that required logic and reasoning. So, on their own, working reasoning. So, on their own, working reasoning. So, on their own, working from their own brain, from their own brain, from their own brain, people got the questions right about people got the questions right about people got the questions right about half the time. Then the researchers half the time. Then the researchers half the time. Then the researchers said, "Okay, you can do the same study, said, "Okay, you can do the same study, said, "Okay, you can do the same study, but use Chat GPT to help." People but use Chat GPT to help." People but use Chat GPT to help." People reached for it constantly, but the reached for it constantly, but the reached for it constantly, but the researchers rigged the back end. The researchers rigged the back end. The researchers rigged the back end. The chatbot was deliberately giving wrong chatbot was deliberately giving wrong chatbot was deliberately giving wrong answers. answers. answers. The participants went along with it The participants went along with it The participants went along with it unthinkingly, mistakes and all with unthinkingly, mistakes and all with unthinkingly, mistakes and all with almost no skepticism, and they thought, almost no skepticism, and they thought, almost no skepticism, and they thought, "Hey, AI must be right. I don't need to "Hey, AI must be right. I don't need to "Hey, AI must be right. I don't need to think." And of course, they scored way think." And of course, they scored way think." And of course, they scored way lower. You know what that is?

lower. You know what that is? lower. You know what that is? It's cognitive surrender. You knew the It's cognitive surrender. You knew the It's cognitive surrender. You knew the answer, answer, answer, but you let someone else do the work. but you let someone else do the work. but you let someone else do the work. So, you're not just outsourcing the So, you're not just outsourcing the So, you're not just outsourcing the work, you're outsourcing your judgment work, you're outsourcing your judgment work, you're outsourcing your judgment and maybe your brain and perhaps your and maybe your brain and perhaps your and maybe your brain and perhaps your soul. Ali Etimad, an engineering soul. Ali Etimad, an engineering soul. Ali Etimad, an engineering professor at Queen's University, calls professor at Queen's University, calls professor at Queen's University, calls this our calculator moment. When the this our calculator moment. When the this our calculator moment. When the calculator went mainstream, people calculator went mainstream, people calculator went mainstream, people worried that students would lose the worried that students would lose the worried that students would lose the ability to do math. And you know what? ability to do math. And you know what? ability to do math. And you know what? We kind of did. Most adults today can't We kind of did. Most adults today can't We kind of did. Most adults today can't do a square root in their head, and that do a square root in their head, and that do a square root in their head, and that opens the question now about what AI is opens the question now about what AI is opens the question now about what AI is going going do. So, apply that to going going do. So, apply that to going going do. So, apply that to ministry. Like the pastor who uses ministry. Like the pastor who uses ministry. Like the pastor who uses Claude to draft last week's sermon, then Claude to draft last week's sermon, then Claude to draft last week's sermon, then this week's, then next week's, then 18 this week's, then next week's, then 18 this week's, then next week's, then 18 months in, you don't know how to write a months in, you don't know how to write a months in, you don't know how to write a sermon anymore. Your brain has atrophied sermon anymore. Your brain has atrophied sermon anymore. Your brain has atrophied because like a muscle, like if you don't because like a muscle, like if you don't because like a muscle, like if you don't walk for a week, walk for a week, walk for a week, it's going to be really hard to walk. Uh it's going to be really hard to walk. Uh it's going to be really hard to walk. Uh I I stopped cycling last year and I got I I stopped cycling last year and I got I I stopped cycling last year and I got back on my bike and I'm like, "Ooh, I'm back on my bike and I'm like, "Ooh, I'm back on my bike and I'm like, "Ooh, I'm back." Two years. Anyway, almost back to back." Two years. Anyway, almost back to back." Two years. Anyway, almost back to where I was with a lot of cycling. where I was with a lot of cycling. where I was with a lot of cycling. But my goodness, your brain is like a But my goodness, your brain is like a But my goodness, your brain is like a muscle, you got to use it. So, why does muscle, you got to use it. So, why does muscle, you got to use it. So, why does this matter for you, the pastor?

this matter for you, the pastor? this matter for you, the pastor? Well, the same congregation that just Well, the same congregation that just Well, the same congregation that just outsourced its thinking to a chatbot all outsourced its thinking to a chatbot all outsourced its thinking to a chatbot all week is now sitting in a pew looking for week is now sitting in a pew looking for week is now sitting in a pew looking for something the chatbot cannot give them. something the chatbot cannot give them. something the chatbot cannot give them. And they might not know that that's what And they might not know that that's what And they might not know that that's what they're looking for, they're looking for, they're looking for, but you do. but you do. but you do. They're looking for an authentic They're looking for an authentic They're looking for an authentic connection with God and for a leader connection with God and for a leader connection with God and for a leader they trust that has done the hard work. they trust that has done the hard work. they trust that has done the hard work. And you're one of the few people left in And you're one of the few people left in And you're one of the few people left in their lives who can still call them to their lives who can still call them to their lives who can still call them to wrestle with something hard. You can wrestle with something hard. You can wrestle with something hard. You can call them to sit with a passage, to sit call them to sit with a passage, to sit call them to sit with a passage, to sit with grief, with grief, with grief, to contemplate their sin, to think about to contemplate their sin, to think about to contemplate their sin, to think about hope, to think about resurrection, what hope, to think about resurrection, what hope, to think about resurrection, what does it mean to be called by Christ, does it mean to be called by Christ, does it mean to be called by Christ, something that a chatbot can't resolve something that a chatbot can't resolve something that a chatbot can't resolve in 12 seconds. AI doesn't do that. It in 12 seconds. AI doesn't do that. It in 12 seconds. AI doesn't do that. It doesn't make you sit with anything. So, doesn't make you sit with anything. So, doesn't make you sit with anything. So, here's my heart. I started a couple here's my heart. I started a couple here's my heart. I started a couple years ago really drilling into AI years ago really drilling into AI years ago really drilling into AI because I wanted to get better at because I wanted to get better at because I wanted to get better at prompting and then as I got further into prompting and then as I got further into prompting and then as I got further into the topic, I kind of realized nobody's the topic, I kind of realized nobody's the topic, I kind of realized nobody's thinking about the impact of AI. thinking about the impact of AI. thinking about the impact of AI. What's going to happen to jobs, to What's going to happen to jobs, to What's going to happen to jobs, to mental health, to truth in an age of mental health, to truth in an age of mental health, to truth in an age of deep fakes, all that stuff. And so, the deep fakes, all that stuff. And so, the deep fakes, all that stuff. And so, the result was I ended up writing this book, result was I ended up writing this book, result was I ended up writing this book, AI in the Future Church, Make Your AI in the Future Church, Make Your AI in the Future Church, Make Your Ministry Irreplaceable in a world of Ministry Irreplaceable in a world of Ministry Irreplaceable in a world of artificial everything. It releases artificial everything. It releases artificial everything. It releases September 15th. And what it's about is September 15th. And what it's about is September 15th. And what it's about is not about the best prompts, it's about not about the best prompts, it's about not about the best prompts, it's about the impact of AI. It's cognitive, I got the impact of AI. It's cognitive, I got the impact of AI. It's cognitive, I got a whole chapter on brain rot.

a whole chapter on brain rot. a whole chapter on brain rot. But there's a whole lot more like, how But there's a whole lot more like, how But there's a whole lot more like, how do you, as a pastor, do you, as a pastor, do you, as a pastor, help people stay help people stay help people stay I think the church's future direction in I think the church's future direction in I think the church's future direction in an age of artificial everything is human an age of artificial everything is human an age of artificial everything is human connection. That as the world becomes connection. That as the world becomes connection. That as the world becomes more synthetic, we need to become more more synthetic, we need to become more more synthetic, we need to become more human. And the good news is this is what human. And the good news is this is what human. And the good news is this is what seminary prepared you for. seminary prepared you for. seminary prepared you for. And so this is a ministry model that And so this is a ministry model that And so this is a ministry model that I'll walk you through step by step, I'll walk you through step by step, I'll walk you through step by step, three major shifts about making Sundays three major shifts about making Sundays three major shifts about making Sundays non-downloadable, non-downloadable, non-downloadable, building the shock absorbers now, and building the shock absorbers now, and building the shock absorbers now, and fortifying your integrity because they I fortifying your integrity because they I fortifying your integrity because they I think all of that is at stake. In the think all of that is at stake. In the think all of that is at stake. In the age of AI, you can pre-order AI in the age of AI, you can pre-order AI in the age of AI, you can pre-order AI in the future church right now wherever books future church right now wherever books future church right now wherever books are sold. Links are in the show notes. are sold. Links are in the show notes. are sold. Links are in the show notes. Pre-orders matter more than I can Pre-orders matter more than I can Pre-orders matter more than I can explain. They tell the publisher this explain. They tell the publisher this explain. They tell the publisher this matters. They get the book in front of matters. They get the book in front of matters. They get the book in front of pastors and I think we need to get this pastors and I think we need to get this pastors and I think we need to get this message out. I got a lot of uh free message out. I got a lot of uh free message out. I got a lot of uh free bonuses if you pre-order now. And before bonuses if you pre-order now. And before bonuses if you pre-order now. And before you fire up Claude or ChatGPT to review you fire up Claude or ChatGPT to review you fire up Claude or ChatGPT to review your next email, um your next email, um your next email, um you might want to pre-order the book. you might want to pre-order the book. you might want to pre-order the book. And then you want to review your tells.

And then you want to review your tells. And then you want to review your tells. So, So, So, I want to leave you with this. I want to leave you with this. I want to leave you with this. Whose thinking is in your next sermon? Whose thinking is in your next sermon? Whose thinking is in your next sermon? Are you wrestling with God? Are you Are you wrestling with God? Are you Are you wrestling with God? Are you wrestling with Claude? Or with chat to wrestling with Claude? Or with chat to wrestling with Claude? Or with chat to get it done as quickly and easily as get it done as quickly and easily as get it done as quickly and easily as possible? possible? possible? The first, the wrestling is ministry. The first, the wrestling is ministry. The first, the wrestling is ministry. The other one I think could be an The other one I think could be an The other one I think could be an abdication of our calling. So, abdication of our calling. So, abdication of our calling. So, hope this episode helped you. We got a hope this episode helped you. We got a hope this episode helped you. We got a lot coming up on the podcast. Uh thanks lot coming up on the podcast. Uh thanks lot coming up on the podcast. Uh thanks for listening to my heart on this one. for listening to my heart on this one. for listening to my heart on this one. Will Gadara, oh my goodness, what a Will Gadara, oh my goodness, what a Will Gadara, oh my goodness, what a lovely, wonderful conversation with lovely, wonderful conversation with lovely, wonderful conversation with Will. Really personal. Charlie Dates. Will. Really personal. Charlie Dates. Will. Really personal. Charlie Dates. Then I got a whole series on AI cuz I Then I got a whole series on AI cuz I Then I got a whole series on AI cuz I think this is going to be the issue that think this is going to be the issue that think this is going to be the issue that defines us as a generation. JP Poulter, defines us as a generation. JP Poulter, defines us as a generation. JP Poulter, Pat Gelsinger, Will Jones, and a whole Pat Gelsinger, Will Jones, and a whole Pat Gelsinger, Will Jones, and a whole lot more coming up. If this conversation lot more coming up. If this conversation lot more coming up. If this conversation was helpful, leave a review or comment was helpful, leave a review or comment was helpful, leave a review or comment wherever you're listening. Don't forget wherever you're listening. Don't forget wherever you're listening. Don't forget to share it with a friend and hit to share it with a friend and hit to share it with a friend and hit subscribe or follow wherever you're subscribe or follow wherever you're subscribe or follow wherever you're watching or listening. We'll catch you watching or listening. We'll catch you watching or listening. We'll catch you next time and I hope our conversation next time and I hope our conversation next time and I hope our conversation today today today helped you get a little bit sharper helped you get a little bit sharper helped you get a little bit sharper and break a growth barrier you're and break a growth barrier you're and break a growth barrier you're facing.