5 Revival Secrets You Need To Know Before It's Too Late with Jon Tyson

For all the leaders listening who are For all the leaders listening who are longing but haven't seen it, where's a longing but haven't seen it, where's a longing but haven't seen it, where's a good place to begin posturing yourself, good place to begin posturing yourself, good place to begin posturing yourself, preparing? I say three, four things have preparing? I say three, four things have preparing? I say three, four things have been very effective for me. Number one, been very effective for me. Number one, been very effective for me. Number one, and the biggest, best personalitydriven and the biggest, best personalitydriven and the biggest, best personalitydriven mega ministries mega ministries mega ministries resulted in the largest decline resulted in the largest decline resulted in the largest decline in our generation. I'm not putting those in our generation. I'm not putting those in our generation. I'm not putting those things down. I'm saying we just relied things down. I'm saying we just relied things down. I'm saying we just relied on gifting or the flesh or systems or on gifting or the flesh or systems or on gifting or the flesh or systems or cultural momentum. And I think God is cultural momentum. And I think God is cultural momentum. And I think God is telling us, I'll take it from here. I I telling us, I'll take it from here. I I telling us, I'll take it from here. I I appreciate you guys. Thank you. But now, appreciate you guys. Thank you. But now, appreciate you guys. Thank you. But now, let me show you what I can do. It's that let me show you what I can do. It's that let me show you what I can do. It's that John Wimber moment. John, I've seen your John Wimber moment. John, I've seen your John Wimber moment. John, I've seen your ministry. Now, let me show you. What ministry. Now, let me show you. What ministry. Now, let me show you. What does it take to prepare and preach for does it take to prepare and preach for does it take to prepare and preach for revival? It's a great question. John revival? It's a great question. John revival? It's a great question. John Tyson answers that question today on my Tyson answers that question today on my Tyson answers that question today on my leadership podcast. I sit down with leadership podcast. I sit down with leadership podcast. I sit down with John. We talk about the history of John. We talk about the history of John. We talk about the history of revival. We talk about the dynamics of revival. We talk about the dynamics of revival. We talk about the dynamics of revival. What do you need to get your revival. What do you need to get your revival. What do you need to get your church prepared, your heart prepared, church prepared, your heart prepared, church prepared, your heart prepared, you prepared, your people prepared, and you prepared, your people prepared, and you prepared, your people prepared, and a whole lot more. John has studied a whole lot more. John has studied a whole lot more. John has studied revival like almost nobody else. I think revival like almost nobody else. I think revival like almost nobody else. I think you're going to love this episode. It's you're going to love this episode. It's you're going to love this episode. It's also part two of our revival series. So, also part two of our revival series. So, also part two of our revival series. So, if you haven't subscribed yet, please do if you haven't subscribed yet, please do if you haven't subscribed yet, please do so because uh well, we already talked so because uh well, we already talked so because uh well, we already talked about the Aspbury revival and talked to about the Aspbury revival and talked to about the Aspbury revival and talked to the guy who preached the sermon that the guy who preached the sermon that the guy who preached the sermon that happened to kick it off. And we've also happened to kick it off. And we've also happened to kick it off. And we've also got some stuff from the UK, from got some stuff from the UK, from got some stuff from the UK, from Saddleback, from uh Gen Z coming up in Saddleback, from uh Gen Z coming up in Saddleback, from uh Gen Z coming up in this revival series. I want to get you this revival series. I want to get you this revival series. I want to get you and your church ready for revival. I and your church ready for revival. I and your church ready for revival. I think it's happening like pre-revival think it's happening like pre-revival think it's happening like pre-revival and it would be great to have you in on and it would be great to have you in on and it would be great to have you in on it. So like, subscribe, follow. That it. So like, subscribe, follow. That it. So like, subscribe, follow. That would be great. And hey, if you want a would be great. And hey, if you want a would be great. And hey, if you want a deeper conversation, I mean, jump into

deeper conversation, I mean, jump into deeper conversation, I mean, jump into the comments here on YouTube, but click the comments here on YouTube, but click the comments here on YouTube, but click the link in the description because what the link in the description because what the link in the description because what you're going to see is you're going to you're going to see is you're going to you're going to see is you're going to see an opportunity to join my Art of see an opportunity to join my Art of see an opportunity to join my Art of Leadership Academy. And there it's other Leadership Academy. And there it's other Leadership Academy. And there it's other church leaders who just have a church leaders who just have a church leaders who just have a conversation about the stuff we're conversation about the stuff we're conversation about the stuff we're talking about on this podcast and talking about on this podcast and talking about on this podcast and beyond. would love to have you join us beyond. would love to have you join us beyond. would love to have you join us or go to carnuhoff.com/showotes. or go to carnuhoff.com/showotes. or go to carnuhoff.com/showotes. Now, we're going to get to a word from Now, we're going to get to a word from Now, we're going to get to a word from today's partners and then we'll dive today's partners and then we'll dive today's partners and then we'll dive into my conversation in New York City into my conversation in New York City into my conversation in New York City with John Tyson. Today's episode is with John Tyson. Today's episode is with John Tyson. Today's episode is brought to you by the art of leadership brought to you by the art of leadership brought to you by the art of leadership academy. Now, one of the things John academy. Now, one of the things John academy. Now, one of the things John highlights in this episode is that highlights in this episode is that highlights in this episode is that revival doesn't begin on stage. It revival doesn't begin on stage. It revival doesn't begin on stage. It begins in the unseen, in prep, in study, begins in the unseen, in prep, in study, begins in the unseen, in prep, in study, in prayer, in becoming the kind of in prayer, in becoming the kind of in prayer, in becoming the kind of person revival can flow through. Which person revival can flow through. Which person revival can flow through. Which raises a question I've been thinking raises a question I've been thinking raises a question I've been thinking about. If revival broke out in your about. If revival broke out in your about. If revival broke out in your church this Sunday, would you and your church this Sunday, would you and your church this Sunday, would you and your team be ready to shepherd it? Well, it's team be ready to shepherd it? Well, it's team be ready to shepherd it? Well, it's worth sitting on that and I'd love to worth sitting on that and I'd love to worth sitting on that and I'd love to hear your thoughts. So, inside of my Art hear your thoughts. So, inside of my Art hear your thoughts. So, inside of my Art of Leadership Academy, we're having of Leadership Academy, we're having of Leadership Academy, we're having those kinds of conversations, unpacking those kinds of conversations, unpacking those kinds of conversations, unpacking what readiness looks like personally, what readiness looks like personally, what readiness looks like personally, spiritually, organizationally, just like spiritually, organizationally, just like spiritually, organizationally, just like we do for every episode of this podcast.

we do for every episode of this podcast. we do for every episode of this podcast. So right now you're listening to this So right now you're listening to this So right now you're listening to this podcast, whatever you're doing, maybe podcast, whatever you're doing, maybe podcast, whatever you're doing, maybe you're out biking or riding or mowing you're out biking or riding or mowing you're out biking or riding or mowing the lawn or washing dishes or whatever the lawn or washing dishes or whatever the lawn or washing dishes or whatever it happens to be. But if you process it it happens to be. But if you process it it happens to be. But if you process it alone, it's different than processing it alone, it's different than processing it alone, it's different than processing it in community. So we've set up a in community. So we've set up a in community. So we've set up a trollfree community inside my art of trollfree community inside my art of trollfree community inside my art of leadership academy where we can discuss leadership academy where we can discuss leadership academy where we can discuss stuff like we're talking about in this stuff like we're talking about in this stuff like we're talking about in this episode. You can download the show episode. You can download the show episode. You can download the show notes, access practical resources, and notes, access practical resources, and notes, access practical resources, and get together with thousands of other get together with thousands of other get together with thousands of other pastors who are on the same journey as pastors who are on the same journey as pastors who are on the same journey as you are. So you can click the link in you are. So you can click the link in you are. So you can click the link in the episode description or maybe head to the episode description or maybe head to the episode description or maybe head to the arttoofleershipacademy.com. the arttoofleershipacademy.com. the arttoofleershipacademy.com. I'd love for you to be part of this I'd love for you to be part of this I'd love for you to be part of this really important conversation starting really important conversation starting really important conversation starting today. Today's episode is brought to you today. Today's episode is brought to you today. Today's episode is brought to you by one accord. As pastors and church by one accord. As pastors and church by one accord. As pastors and church leaders, your heart's desire is to see leaders, your heart's desire is to see leaders, your heart's desire is to see every member of your church grow in every member of your church grow in every member of your church grow in their relationship with Jesus through their relationship with Jesus through their relationship with Jesus through the teaching of God's word. Yet for some the teaching of God's word. Yet for some the teaching of God's word. Yet for some members, the language barrier can be a members, the language barrier can be a members, the language barrier can be a real hindrance. It can affect both their real hindrance. It can affect both their real hindrance. It can affect both their understanding of the message and a sense understanding of the message and a sense understanding of the message and a sense of belonging to your church community. of belonging to your church community. of belonging to your church community. And that's where One Accord comes in.

And that's where One Accord comes in. And that's where One Accord comes in. One Accord is an AI based translation One Accord is an AI based translation One Accord is an AI based translation platform designed exclusively for the platform designed exclusively for the platform designed exclusively for the local church by believers actively local church by believers actively local church by believers actively serving in the local church. With over serving in the local church. With over serving in the local church. With over 40 languages available in live 40 languages available in live 40 languages available in live simultaneous translation, One Accord simultaneous translation, One Accord simultaneous translation, One Accord would love to partner with your church would love to partner with your church would love to partner with your church to bridge the language gap. Their to bridge the language gap. Their to bridge the language gap. Their subscription plans start from $150 a subscription plans start from $150 a subscription plans start from $150 a month. And when you visit month. And when you visit month. And when you visit oneacord.ai/carry, oneacord.ai/carry, oneacord.ai/carry, you can get a free trial with three you can get a free trial with three you can get a free trial with three hours of translation credit. So head on hours of translation credit. So head on hours of translation credit. So head on over to oneacord.ai/cy to get started today. to get started today. >> Well, John, it's good to be together in >> Well, John, it's good to be together in >> Well, John, it's good to be together in New York. Thanks so much for hosting us New York. Thanks so much for hosting us New York. Thanks so much for hosting us for this episode of the podcast today. for this episode of the podcast today. for this episode of the podcast today. >> It is a joy to be with you in person. >> It is a joy to be with you in person. >> It is a joy to be with you in person. We've done this a few times on the We've done this a few times on the We've done this a few times on the internet. Great to see. internet. Great to see. internet. Great to see. >> We always meet in person, but never for >> We always meet in person, but never for >> We always meet in person, but never for the pod. So here at Church of the City the pod. So here at Church of the City the pod. So here at Church of the City headquarters. headquarters. headquarters. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Downtown Manhattan. Yeah. And you have >> Downtown Manhattan. Yeah. And you have >> Downtown Manhattan. Yeah. And you have studied revival for decades. This has studied revival for decades. This has studied revival for decades. This has been something you've really really been something you've really really been something you've really really studied. What is uh well let do you studied. What is uh well let do you studied. What is uh well let do you think we're in the middle of something?

think we're in the middle of something? think we're in the middle of something? Is something shifting? Like what's going Is something shifting? Like what's going Is something shifting? Like what's going on? Even start here in New York City and on? Even start here in New York City and on? Even start here in New York City and then we can go beyond that. What are you then we can go beyond that. What are you then we can go beyond that. What are you seeing? What are you sensing? seeing? What are you sensing? seeing? What are you sensing? >> We are I do not think we are in revival, >> We are I do not think we are in revival, >> We are I do not think we are in revival, full-blown revival. full-blown revival. full-blown revival. I do think we are in the early stages of I do think we are in the early stages of I do think we are in the early stages of revival. So I something has shifted. The revival. So I something has shifted. The revival. So I something has shifted. The tide has turned. The bleeding has tide has turned. The bleeding has tide has turned. The bleeding has stopped and we are seeing some very very stopped and we are seeing some very very stopped and we are seeing some very very encouraging stories. So starting here in encouraging stories. So starting here in encouraging stories. So starting here in New York, I chose some stories from a New York, I chose some stories from a New York, I chose some stories from a pastor's gathering. One of the the pastor's gathering. One of the the pastor's gathering. One of the the trends we're seeing is people coming to trends we're seeing is people coming to trends we're seeing is people coming to Jesus in dreams. I know this is Jesus in dreams. I know this is Jesus in dreams. I know this is happening in the UK. This is happening happening in the UK. This is happening happening in the UK. This is happening here in New York. here in New York. here in New York. >> I just heard a story from a pastor's >> I just heard a story from a pastor's >> I just heard a story from a pastor's gathering this past week. Little church gathering this past week. Little church gathering this past week. Little church in East Harlem. Um, there's two people in East Harlem. Um, there's two people in East Harlem. Um, there's two people in the neighborhood, in the neighborhood, in the neighborhood, uh, a a husband and a wife. The woman uh, a a husband and a wife. The woman uh, a a husband and a wife. The woman has a nightmare. In the nightmare, she's has a nightmare. In the nightmare, she's has a nightmare. In the nightmare, she's being attacked by two dark figures come being attacked by two dark figures come being attacked by two dark figures come in. Demonic forces. A person of light in. Demonic forces. A person of light in. Demonic forces. A person of light walks into the room. walks into the room. walks into the room. >> So, this is a believer or not.

>> So, this is a believer or not. >> So, this is a believer or not. >> Not a believer at all. >> Not a believer at all. >> Not a believer at all. >> Not a believer. >> Not a believer. >> Not a believer. >> Banishes banishes the darkness with his >> Banishes banishes the darkness with his >> Banishes banishes the darkness with his presence. She follows the figure out. presence. She follows the figure out. presence. She follows the figure out. The figure sort of pushes her away. She The figure sort of pushes her away. She The figure sort of pushes her away. She says, "No, no. I just wanted to say says, "No, no. I just wanted to say says, "No, no. I just wanted to say thank you the figure of light and she thank you the figure of light and she thank you the figure of light and she says I knew at that moment it was Jesus says I knew at that moment it was Jesus says I knew at that moment it was Jesus Jesus said to me don't worry about it Jesus said to me don't worry about it Jesus said to me don't worry about it when you wake up repent when you wake up repent when you wake up repent so she wakes up and doesn't know what so she wakes up and doesn't know what so she wakes up and doesn't know what repent means but know that it's repent means but know that it's repent means but know that it's connected to Jesus so goes to a local connected to Jesus so goes to a local connected to Jesus so goes to a local church the closest church he can find church the closest church he can find church the closest church he can find and says how do I repent I met Jesus in and says how do I repent I met Jesus in and says how do I repent I met Jesus in a dream dream gave her life to Christ a dream dream gave her life to Christ a dream dream gave her life to Christ led her husband to Christ they've been led her husband to Christ they've been led her husband to Christ they've been the church for 6 months following Jesus. the church for 6 months following Jesus. the church for 6 months following Jesus. People are walking in off the street People are walking in off the street People are walking in off the street um saying, "I had a dream about faith in um saying, "I had a dream about faith in um saying, "I had a dream about faith in church and I felt like I meant to come church and I felt like I meant to come church and I felt like I meant to come back to the church. Do you have a back to the church. Do you have a back to the church. Do you have a Bible?" One of our pastors owns a Bible?" One of our pastors owns a Bible?" One of our pastors owns a bookshop. Uh sorry, a little craft shop, bookshop. Uh sorry, a little craft shop, bookshop. Uh sorry, a little craft shop, >> gifts, trinkets, that sort of thing. Um >> gifts, trinkets, that sort of thing. Um >> gifts, trinkets, that sort of thing. Um she was in a shop. A man came in. She she was in a shop. A man came in. She she was in a shop. A man came in. She had just lit a candle cuz she sells had just lit a candle cuz she sells had just lit a candle cuz she sells candles to show the man the scent. And candles to show the man the scent. And candles to show the man the scent. And the man said, "Oh, this smells like my the man said, "Oh, this smells like my the man said, "Oh, this smells like my church." There was a random woman from church." There was a random woman from church." There was a random woman from Australia in her shop who said, "What is Australia in her shop who said, "What is Australia in her shop who said, "What is happening in New York?" Not a Christian.

happening in New York?" Not a Christian. happening in New York?" Not a Christian. >> Everywhere I go, people are talking >> Everywhere I go, people are talking >> Everywhere I go, people are talking about church or they're talking about about church or they're talking about about church or they're talking about Jesus. Jesus. Jesus. >> In our staff meeting we just had, um >> In our staff meeting we just had, um >> In our staff meeting we just had, um there was a a couple who went to a local there was a a couple who went to a local there was a a couple who went to a local bar. They were hanging out at the bar. bar. They were hanging out at the bar. bar. They were hanging out at the bar. They were talking about prayer and They were talking about prayer and They were talking about prayer and revival at the bar. a guy who's playing revival at the bar. a guy who's playing revival at the bar. a guy who's playing live there starts playing a worship live there starts playing a worship live there starts playing a worship song. Afterwards, they come up to him song. Afterwards, they come up to him song. Afterwards, they come up to him and say, "Are you a believer?" And he and say, "Are you a believer?" And he and say, "Are you a believer?" And he said, "I don't know how to answer that." said, "I don't know how to answer that." said, "I don't know how to answer that." Several weeks ago, someone started Several weeks ago, someone started Several weeks ago, someone started talking to me about Jesus. I've been talking to me about Jesus. I've been talking to me about Jesus. I've been reading the Bible. I'm really interested reading the Bible. I'm really interested reading the Bible. I'm really interested in faith. Mark Matlock who you know has in faith. Mark Matlock who you know has in faith. Mark Matlock who you know has been in and out of the city quite a bit been in and out of the city quite a bit been in and out of the city quite a bit and he said anecdotally and he said anecdotally and he said anecdotally >> about 85% of the conversations he has >> about 85% of the conversations he has >> about 85% of the conversations he has with people if left to their natural with people if left to their natural with people if left to their natural course will turn towards spirituality or course will turn towards spirituality or course will turn towards spirituality or the things of faith. This is happening the things of faith. This is happening the things of faith. This is happening in the Bronx, Staten Island, Queens, in the Bronx, Staten Island, Queens, in the Bronx, Staten Island, Queens, Brooklyn, and here in Manhattan. That Brooklyn, and here in Manhattan. That Brooklyn, and here in Manhattan. That has not happened. I've been here 20 has not happened. I've been here 20 has not happened. I've been here 20 years now. years now. years now. >> Yeah. Yeah. You've been here forever. >> Yeah. Yeah. You've been here forever. >> Yeah. Yeah. You've been here forever. >> That has not happened since I have been >> That has not happened since I have been >> That has not happened since I have been here. here. here. >> Wow. So, I had breakfast this morning, >> Wow. So, I had breakfast this morning, >> Wow. So, I had breakfast this morning, as you know, with some of Tim Keller's as you know, with some of Tim Keller's as you know, with some of Tim Keller's team, the Gospel and Life team, and team, the Gospel and Life team, and team, the Gospel and Life team, and we've gotten together over the years, we've gotten together over the years, we've gotten together over the years, and one of the things that's and one of the things that's and one of the things that's interesting, I remember I had the interesting, I remember I had the interesting, I remember I had the privilege of interviewing Tim a few privilege of interviewing Tim a few privilege of interviewing Tim a few times for this podcast.

times for this podcast. times for this podcast. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> Oh my goodness. I'll tell you, uh, so >> Oh my goodness. I'll tell you, uh, so >> Oh my goodness. I'll tell you, uh, so grateful for that. grateful for that. grateful for that. >> But Tim and I talked about the tipping >> But Tim and I talked about the tipping >> But Tim and I talked about the tipping point when he got to Manhattan in 1989. point when he got to Manhattan in 1989. point when he got to Manhattan in 1989. Something like 1% of the population of Something like 1% of the population of Something like 1% of the population of Manhattan attended a evangelical church, Manhattan attended a evangelical church, Manhattan attended a evangelical church, right? Protestant church. And that means right? Protestant church. And that means right? Protestant church. And that means if you're in an office building of a if you're in an office building of a if you're in an office building of a hundred people, you're the only one. hundred people, you're the only one. hundred people, you're the only one. It's John all alone in the corner, It's John all alone in the corner, It's John all alone in the corner, right? By the time he was wrapping up as right? By the time he was wrapping up as right? By the time he was wrapping up as senior pastor of Redeemer Church, forget senior pastor of Redeemer Church, forget senior pastor of Redeemer Church, forget the exact stat and the team couldn't the exact stat and the team couldn't the exact stat and the team couldn't remember exactly either. it was remember exactly either. it was remember exactly either. it was something like 4 or 9% something like 4 or 9% something like 4 or 9% um were now attending an evangelical um were now attending an evangelical um were now attending an evangelical church in Manhattan Protestant church church in Manhattan Protestant church church in Manhattan Protestant church which which is very different because in which which is very different because in which which is very different because in that same office of a hundred there's a that same office of a hundred there's a that same office of a hundred there's a lunch table or a small group there lunch table or a small group there lunch table or a small group there you're reaching a tipping point but that you're reaching a tipping point but that you're reaching a tipping point but that was even a decade ago and this feels was even a decade ago and this feels was even a decade ago and this feels different than that it does feel different than that it does feel different than that it does feel different cuz you were here a decade ago different cuz you were here a decade ago different cuz you were here a decade ago >> yeah Malcolm Glad so I I was here I >> yeah Malcolm Glad so I I was here I >> yeah Malcolm Glad so I I was here I moved in '05 that's when there was a moved in '05 that's when there was a moved in '05 that's when there was a massive Southern Baptist push. I think massive Southern Baptist push. I think massive Southern Baptist push. I think New York was what they called a focus New York was what they called a focus New York was what they called a focus city.

city. city. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> I think they planted over 40 churches >> I think they planted over 40 churches >> I think they planted over 40 churches that year. Um Redeemer have planted, you that year. Um Redeemer have planted, you that year. Um Redeemer have planted, you know, a lot more churches since then. know, a lot more churches since then. know, a lot more churches since then. This the dynamics. It's very hard to This the dynamics. It's very hard to This the dynamics. It's very hard to explain. Uh this is not only was that explain. Uh this is not only was that explain. Uh this is not only was that pre-COVID, which is another issue. It pre-COVID, which is another issue. It pre-COVID, which is another issue. It was pre-ocial media. It was was pre-ocial media. It was was pre-ocial media. It was pre-smartphones. You had trios and pre-smartphones. You had trios and pre-smartphones. You had trios and Blackberries, but it was just a Blackberries, but it was just a Blackberries, but it was just a >> that didn't really work. >> that didn't really work. >> that didn't really work. >> Yes. A different world. and how you >> Yes. A different world. and how you >> Yes. A different world. and how you navigated the city was very local, very navigated the city was very local, very navigated the city was very local, very provincial, uh, parochial. That's why we provincial, uh, parochial. That's why we provincial, uh, parochial. That's why we built a model on it back in the day. built a model on it back in the day. built a model on it back in the day. Now, uh, everybody navigates through Now, uh, everybody navigates through Now, uh, everybody navigates through social media, through apps. It's a social media, through apps. It's a social media, through apps. It's a totally different city. So, totally different city. So, totally different city. So, >> so upper west side, upper east side, two >> so upper west side, upper east side, two >> so upper west side, upper east side, two worlds that didn't meet even though worlds that didn't meet even though worlds that didn't meet even though they're 15 minutes apart. they're 15 minutes apart. they're 15 minutes apart. >> There's still a a small amount of that, >> There's still a a small amount of that, >> There's still a a small amount of that, but not for Gen Z. You just go wherever but not for Gen Z. You just go wherever but not for Gen Z. You just go wherever your phone is, wherever the action is. your phone is, wherever the action is. your phone is, wherever the action is. Um, so that that really changed the city Um, so that that really changed the city Um, so that that really changed the city and that changed how faith spreads in and that changed how faith spreads in and that changed how faith spreads in the city. that changed how stories about the city. that changed how stories about the city. that changed how stories about what what God is doing. what what God is doing. what what God is doing. >> So, there's a level of awareness of what >> So, there's a level of awareness of what >> So, there's a level of awareness of what God's doing that uh we haven't God's doing that uh we haven't God's doing that uh we haven't experienced. Uh that's really important, experienced. Uh that's really important, experienced. Uh that's really important, too. You know, Malcolm Gladwell in the too. You know, Malcolm Gladwell in the too. You know, Malcolm Gladwell in the Tipping Point Revisited says it's Tipping Point Revisited says it's Tipping Point Revisited says it's between 25 and 30% to really see change.

between 25 and 30% to really see change. between 25 and 30% to really see change. >> So, I think we're a little optimistic on >> So, I think we're a little optimistic on >> So, I think we're a little optimistic on 5% is going to get us there. 5% is going to get us there. 5% is going to get us there. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I think I think Tim's original vision >> I think I think Tim's original vision >> I think I think Tim's original vision they were sharing with me was to get to they were sharing with me was to get to they were sharing with me was to get to 20% of the city 20% of the city 20% of the city >> and we weren't there yet. We're not >> and we weren't there yet. We're not >> and we weren't there yet. We're not there yet. there yet. there yet. >> Listen, I have nothing but a standing >> Listen, I have nothing but a standing >> Listen, I have nothing but a standing ovation for Tim Keller. If you've ever ovation for Tim Keller. If you've ever ovation for Tim Keller. If you've ever been to Nashville, been to Nashville, been to Nashville, >> yeah, >> yeah, >> yeah, >> Nashville's filled with Christians and >> Nashville's filled with Christians and >> Nashville's filled with Christians and it doesn't feel like it's in the middle it doesn't feel like it's in the middle it doesn't feel like it's in the middle of a move of God. I love the heart of of a move of God. I love the heart of of a move of God. I love the heart of wanting to see the gospel take New York wanting to see the gospel take New York wanting to see the gospel take New York and I love that. My only um note on that and I love that. My only um note on that and I love that. My only um note on that would be it's got to be the right kinds would be it's got to be the right kinds would be it's got to be the right kinds of Christians. 20% of the wrong kind of of Christians. 20% of the wrong kind of of Christians. 20% of the wrong kind of Christian does nothing, Christian does nothing, Christian does nothing, >> right? >> right? >> right? >> 20% of potent disciples that does >> 20% of potent disciples that does >> 20% of potent disciples that does everything. You may not need 20%. Uh everything. You may not need 20%. Uh everything. You may not need 20%. Uh Paul didn't need 20% uh to reach uh all Paul didn't need 20% uh to reach uh all Paul didn't need 20% uh to reach uh all of Asia when he ran the school at of Asia when he ran the school at of Asia when he ran the school at Tyrannis. So again, my I'm advocating I Tyrannis. So again, my I'm advocating I Tyrannis. So again, my I'm advocating I love that. I love everything about more love that. I love everything about more love that. I love everything about more churches, gospel. I love all of those churches, gospel. I love all of those churches, gospel. I love all of those things. And as long as we're building things. And as long as we're building things. And as long as we're building potent disciples, I think we're we're potent disciples, I think we're we're potent disciples, I think we're we're God Jesus is building his church and God Jesus is building his church and God Jesus is building his church and he's doing something beautiful now. But he's doing something beautiful now. But he's doing something beautiful now. But the supernatural revelation like Paul the supernatural revelation like Paul the supernatural revelation like Paul getting knocked off his horse stories getting knocked off his horse stories getting knocked off his horse stories about this woman who has this dream and about this woman who has this dream and about this woman who has this dream and Jesus tells her, "No, when you wake up, Jesus tells her, "No, when you wake up, Jesus tells her, "No, when you wake up, repent." And she goes to a church. That repent." And she goes to a church. That repent." And she goes to a church. That seems new to New York. hearing stories seems new to New York. hearing stories seems new to New York. hearing stories like that or that's always been in like that or that's always been in like that or that's always been in pockets.

pockets. pockets. >> It's so >> It's so >> It's so I can't New York is so vast. Yeah. I can't New York is so vast. Yeah. I can't New York is so vast. Yeah. >> In in the outer burrows and in minority >> In in the outer burrows and in minority >> In in the outer burrows and in minority communities that have a communities that have a communities that have a >> immigrant communities coming from places >> immigrant communities coming from places >> immigrant communities coming from places where they have a way more integrated where they have a way more integrated where they have a way more integrated view of the supernatural view of the supernatural view of the supernatural >> that way be that may be more normative. >> that way be that may be more normative. >> that way be that may be more normative. I can tell you for for Manhattan and I can tell you for for Manhattan and I can tell you for for Manhattan and sort of sort of sort of >> for those folks that is that is >> for those folks that is that is >> for those folks that is that is completely new. That is completely new. completely new. That is completely new. completely new. That is completely new. That is a shift of the spirit reaching That is a shift of the spirit reaching That is a shift of the spirit reaching people. It it doesn't surprise me. I people. It it doesn't surprise me. I people. It it doesn't surprise me. I mean, it's happened in places the the mean, it's happened in places the the mean, it's happened in places the the the dreams uh in Muslim communities, the dreams uh in Muslim communities, the dreams uh in Muslim communities, that sort of thing. that sort of thing. that sort of thing. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> It's happened before in places where >> It's happened before in places where >> It's happened before in places where they needed the gospel radically. It they needed the gospel radically. It they needed the gospel radically. It just may be that Western culture is one just may be that Western culture is one just may be that Western culture is one of those places that needs the gospel of those places that needs the gospel of those places that needs the gospel radically. radically. radically. >> Now we're on the list. >> Now we're on the list. >> Now we're on the list. >> Yeah. Jesus is like, "Hey, listen. You >> Yeah. Jesus is like, "Hey, listen. You >> Yeah. Jesus is like, "Hey, listen. You guys have been doing this for a couple guys have been doing this for a couple guys have been doing this for a couple hundred years. I appreciate the effort. hundred years. I appreciate the effort. hundred years. I appreciate the effort. Let me accelerate that and help you Let me accelerate that and help you Let me accelerate that and help you directly." We're definitely seeing that. directly." We're definitely seeing that. directly." We're definitely seeing that. So, is that a characteristic of revival? So, is that a characteristic of revival? So, is that a characteristic of revival? You've studied revival. What are some of You've studied revival. What are some of You've studied revival. What are some of the characteristics of revival?

the characteristics of revival? the characteristics of revival? Well, revival is um one of Edward to a Well, revival is um one of Edward to a Well, revival is um one of Edward to a paraphrase of one of Edward's phrases, paraphrase of one of Edward's phrases, paraphrase of one of Edward's phrases, an acceleration of the normal work of an acceleration of the normal work of an acceleration of the normal work of the spirit. the spirit. the spirit. >> So, what would happen in a decade >> So, what would happen in a decade >> So, what would happen in a decade happens in days. So, you will see a happens in days. So, you will see a happens in days. So, you will see a radical acceleration. radical acceleration. radical acceleration. We we to try and train our team to think We we to try and train our team to think We we to try and train our team to think about this. We think, okay, how many about this. We think, okay, how many about this. We think, okay, how many people came to Christ last year? How people came to Christ last year? How people came to Christ last year? How many people have come to Christ in the many people have come to Christ in the many people have come to Christ in the last 10 years? What if that happened in last 10 years? What if that happened in last 10 years? What if that happened in 2 days? Do we have new Christian 2 days? Do we have new Christian 2 days? Do we have new Christian follow-up ready to serve them? Do we follow-up ready to serve them? Do we follow-up ready to serve them? Do we have a way to integrate them integrate have a way to integrate them integrate have a way to integrate them integrate them into community and groups? Do we them into community and groups? Do we them into community and groups? Do we have a freedom pathway for them to have a freedom pathway for them to have a freedom pathway for them to process their trauma, their pain or process their trauma, their pain or process their trauma, their pain or idols? Some of that's demonic, the idols? Some of that's demonic, the idols? Some of that's demonic, the strongholds. Do we have processes to strongholds. Do we have processes to strongholds. Do we have processes to actually get people free so they can actually get people free so they can actually get people free so they can walk in authority? So, um, I think we're walk in authority? So, um, I think we're walk in authority? So, um, I think we're getting more of an awareness of what getting more of an awareness of what getting more of an awareness of what revival is and the cost of revival. And revival is and the cost of revival. And revival is and the cost of revival. And so, I think we're starting to see those so, I think we're starting to see those so, I think we're starting to see those early signs, the acceleration of the early signs, the acceleration of the early signs, the acceleration of the things of God. Maybe God in his mercy things of God. Maybe God in his mercy things of God. Maybe God in his mercy hasn't poured out yet because we're not hasn't poured out yet because we're not hasn't poured out yet because we're not quite ready. So, radical salvations, quite ready. So, radical salvations, quite ready. So, radical salvations, acceleration of the work of the spirit, acceleration of the work of the spirit, acceleration of the work of the spirit, uh, profound repentance. These are uh, profound repentance. These are uh, profound repentance. These are classic signs we all know about. Uh, I classic signs we all know about. Uh, I classic signs we all know about. Uh, I was reading about a revival in I think was reading about a revival in I think was reading about a revival in I think it's Sa, you would know Saskatoon.

it's Sa, you would know Saskatoon. it's Sa, you would know Saskatoon. >> Oh, Saskatoon, Saskatchewan. Yeah. >> Oh, Saskatoon, Saskatchewan. Yeah. >> Oh, Saskatoon, Saskatchewan. Yeah. Saskatoon revival. Saskatoon revival. Saskatoon revival. >> Shout out Canada. >> Shout out Canada. >> Shout out Canada. >> Yes. Uh that happened. Um and that >> Yes. Uh that happened. Um and that >> Yes. Uh that happened. Um and that totally totally impacted the whole totally totally impacted the whole totally totally impacted the whole community. They had to I don't know that community. They had to I don't know that community. They had to I don't know that story. story. story. >> Oh, really? Was that like 50 years ago? >> Oh, really? Was that like 50 years ago? >> Oh, really? Was that like 50 years ago? >> Yeah. This is 19772. >> Duncan Campbell came from the Hebdes. >> Duncan Campbell came from the Hebdes. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Preached there and said there is a move >> Preached there and said there is a move >> Preached there and said there is a move of God coming to Canada. of God coming to Canada. of God coming to Canada. >> And that's where Henry Blackabe, he was >> And that's where Henry Blackabe, he was >> And that's where Henry Blackabe, he was a part of that Canadian God. Yeah. All a part of that Canadian God. Yeah. All a part of that Canadian God. Yeah. All of that came out of that revival. of that came out of that revival. of that came out of that revival. >> Really? >> Really? >> Really? >> Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. And then >> Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. And then >> Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. And then there was two evangelist twin brothers. there was two evangelist twin brothers. there was two evangelist twin brothers. They went over. It happened on the west They went over. It happened on the west They went over. It happened on the west coast of Canada. Really? Probably coast of Canada. Really? Probably coast of Canada. Really? Probably >> I was a kid >> I was a kid >> I was a kid >> outside of the Toronto blessing. >> outside of the Toronto blessing. >> outside of the Toronto blessing. >> Yes. 1989. >> Yes. 1989. >> Yes. 1989. >> Pro probably Canada's last move. There >> Pro probably Canada's last move. There >> Pro probably Canada's last move. There could be some more I'm unaware of, but could be some more I'm unaware of, but could be some more I'm unaware of, but these are the ones that in my revival these are the ones that in my revival these are the ones that in my revival books I read about. They had to u they books I read about. They had to u they books I read about. They had to u they they had to open accounts because people they had to open accounts because people they had to open accounts because people were giving money back. They were were giving money back. They were were giving money back. They were stolen. They were returning things to stolen. They were returning things to stolen. They were returning things to stores. There was mass repentance. one stores. There was mass repentance. one stores. There was mass repentance. one one of the pastors there said, "We are one of the pastors there said, "We are one of the pastors there said, "We are kneedeep in a pool of love." And it's kneedeep in a pool of love." And it's kneedeep in a pool of love." And it's like a beautiful statement about what like a beautiful statement about what like a beautiful statement about what happened.

happened. happened. >> We're not seeing that in New York yet. >> We're not seeing that in New York yet. >> We're not seeing that in New York yet. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> We're not seeing >> We're not seeing >> We're not seeing >> That's why sort of early stages >> That's why sort of early stages >> That's why sort of early stages pre-revival. pre-revival. pre-revival. >> Yeah. We're not seeing um the returning >> Yeah. We're not seeing um the returning >> Yeah. We're not seeing um the returning of stolen goods. We're not seeing uh a of stolen goods. We're not seeing uh a of stolen goods. We're not seeing uh a radical noticeable decrease in crime radical noticeable decrease in crime radical noticeable decrease in crime because of spiritual related things. And because of spiritual related things. And because of spiritual related things. And again, New York is so big, mate. how again, New York is so big, mate. how again, New York is so big, mate. how they would track that and incorporate they would track that and incorporate they would track that and incorporate faith in it. Um I don't know at this faith in it. Um I don't know at this faith in it. Um I don't know at this stage of it but we are seeing um some of stage of it but we are seeing um some of stage of it but we are seeing um some of those early fruits massive amounts of those early fruits massive amounts of those early fruits massive amounts of people turning to the Lord interest in people turning to the Lord interest in people turning to the Lord interest in revival. Um Gen Z has not had a revival revival. Um Gen Z has not had a revival revival. Um Gen Z has not had a revival culture. I'm Gen X man. I grew up with culture. I'm Gen X man. I grew up with culture. I'm Gen X man. I grew up with revivals coming, you know, revivals coming, you know, revivals coming, you know, >> and that was on the edge, that was on >> and that was on the edge, that was on >> and that was on the edge, that was on the end of the Toronto blessing in the end of the Toronto blessing in the end of the Toronto blessing in Brownsville. And then I think a bunch of Brownsville. And then I think a bunch of Brownsville. And then I think a bunch of people got burned out, sort of went into people got burned out, sort of went into people got burned out, sort of went into the Willow Creek model, which is what I the Willow Creek model, which is what I the Willow Creek model, which is what I did. That vision of a prevailing church, did. That vision of a prevailing church, did. That vision of a prevailing church, >> yeah, >> yeah, >> yeah, >> a biblically functioning Acts two >> a biblically functioning Acts two >> a biblically functioning Acts two community, felt you were moving forward, community, felt you were moving forward, community, felt you were moving forward, but in a healthy, sustainable way. but in a healthy, sustainable way. but in a healthy, sustainable way. >> I don't think Jenz grew up with a vision >> I don't think Jenz grew up with a vision >> I don't think Jenz grew up with a vision of a move of God. Now, I think they've of a move of God. Now, I think they've of a move of God. Now, I think they've heard about it. They're getting a taste heard about it. They're getting a taste heard about it. They're getting a taste for it. God's doing it and we are in the for it. God's doing it and we are in the for it. God's doing it and we are in the early stages of these beautiful signs.

early stages of these beautiful signs. early stages of these beautiful signs. Repentance, new kind of preaching, Repentance, new kind of preaching, Repentance, new kind of preaching, passion for worship, uh care for the passion for worship, uh care for the passion for worship, uh care for the lost, desire to see people find freedom. lost, desire to see people find freedom. lost, desire to see people find freedom. It's really amazing. It's really amazing. It's really amazing. >> So last year you went to the Hebdes to >> So last year you went to the Hebdes to >> So last year you went to the Hebdes to study revival. You're heading back there study revival. You're heading back there study revival. You're heading back there right after we record this. right after we record this. right after we record this. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Talk to us about what you're learning >> Talk to us about what you're learning >> Talk to us about what you're learning there. there. there. >> I've been to the he >> I've been to the he >> I've been to the he >> and why the hees >> and why the hees >> and why the hees four times. Wow. Last year I was four times. Wow. Last year I was four times. Wow. Last year I was preaching at the Heritage Revival preaching at the Heritage Revival preaching at the Heritage Revival Conference uh for uh a wonderful the Conference uh for uh a wonderful the Conference uh for uh a wonderful the best of Scotland uh pastor Tommy and best of Scotland uh pastor Tommy and best of Scotland uh pastor Tommy and Donna. They pastor a man's memorial Donna. They pastor a man's memorial Donna. They pastor a man's memorial church in downtown Stornway. I went to church in downtown Stornway. I went to church in downtown Stornway. I went to the Hebdes because of all of the the Hebdes because of all of the the Hebdes because of all of the revivals I had studied. This is in 2018. revivals I had studied. This is in 2018. revivals I had studied. This is in 2018. I took my family on a revival tour to 17 I took my family on a revival tour to 17 I took my family on a revival tour to 17 locations of historic moves of God locations of historic moves of God locations of historic moves of God around the world. And I went when I read around the world. And I went when I read around the world. And I went when I read about what happened in the Hebdes, it about what happened in the Hebdes, it about what happened in the Hebdes, it resonated the most deeply of what I resonated the most deeply of what I resonated the most deeply of what I hoped to see God do in New York City. hoped to see God do in New York City. hoped to see God do in New York City. >> What resonated? >> What resonated? >> What resonated? >> There was there was tangible zones of >> There was there was tangible zones of >> There was there was tangible zones of the manifest presence of God. They would the manifest presence of God. They would the manifest presence of God. They would cover a region. You would step into it cover a region. You would step into it cover a region. You would step into it and you would feel a spiritual shift.

and you would feel a spiritual shift. and you would feel a spiritual shift. There would be people out in the fields There would be people out in the fields There would be people out in the fields encountering God. People getting right encountering God. People getting right encountering God. People getting right with God on the side of the road. There with God on the side of the road. There with God on the side of the road. There was an atmosphere of the manifest was an atmosphere of the manifest was an atmosphere of the manifest presence of God that would come in and presence of God that would come in and presence of God that would come in and I'm like that happened to New in the I'm like that happened to New in the I'm like that happened to New in the business room's revival there was a business room's revival there was a business room's revival there was a tangible zone of the presence of God tangible zone of the presence of God tangible zone of the presence of God particularly in lower Manhattan where particularly in lower Manhattan where particularly in lower Manhattan where most of the city was located but ships most of the city was located but ships most of the city was located but ships coming into New York Harbor would coming into New York Harbor would coming into New York Harbor would experience people coming under the experience people coming under the experience people coming under the conviction of sin before they got to the conviction of sin before they got to the conviction of sin before they got to the soil. soil. soil. >> And when was this in New York? >> And when was this in New York? >> And when was this in New York? >> This is the 1850s uh when the >> This is the 1850s uh when the >> This is the 1850s uh when the businessman's revival happened. businessman's revival happened. businessman's revival happened. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> So pre-ivil war. And um so you just have >> So pre-ivil war. And um so you just have >> So pre-ivil war. And um so you just have this this profound sense of God is in this this profound sense of God is in this this profound sense of God is in this place. That was during the great uh this place. That was during the great uh this place. That was during the great uh prayer revival from Jeremiah Lania which prayer revival from Jeremiah Lania which prayer revival from Jeremiah Lania which started in 1857. started in 1857. started in 1857. There was a continuous unbroken There was a continuous unbroken There was a continuous unbroken chain of prayer that one man experienced chain of prayer that one man experienced chain of prayer that one man experienced from Omaha, Nebraska all the way into from Omaha, Nebraska all the way into from Omaha, Nebraska all the way into Manhattan following the flies and and Manhattan following the flies and and Manhattan following the flies and and sounds of the prayer revival. So that's sounds of the prayer revival. So that's sounds of the prayer revival. So that's happened in New York. It's happened in happened in New York. It's happened in happened in New York. It's happened in the Hebdes and when I went there the Hebdes and when I went there the Hebdes and when I went there you would read these accounts and Duncan you would read these accounts and Duncan you would read these accounts and Duncan Campbell preached a gospel of Campbell preached a gospel of Campbell preached a gospel of repentance. It wasn't just a time of repentance. It wasn't just a time of repentance. It wasn't just a time of refreshing.

refreshing. refreshing. >> It wasn't just the father's love that >> It wasn't just the father's love that >> It wasn't just the father's love that came on the back end of it came on the back end of it came on the back end of it >> but it was people under the conviction >> but it was people under the conviction >> but it was people under the conviction of sin really you know just moved by the of sin really you know just moved by the of sin really you know just moved by the gospel with a nuclear bomb attached to gospel with a nuclear bomb attached to gospel with a nuclear bomb attached to it. So I went there and um you know it. So I went there and um you know it. So I went there and um you know stood in front of the church in Barvis stood in front of the church in Barvis stood in front of the church in Barvis out in the middle of nowhere and just out in the middle of nowhere and just out in the middle of nowhere and just held hands with my family and said, held hands with my family and said, held hands with my family and said, "God, this is 2018. Lord, we will give "God, this is 2018. Lord, we will give "God, this is 2018. Lord, we will give our lives to see you do this in New our lives to see you do this in New our lives to see you do this in New York." And I didn't know it at the time. York." And I didn't know it at the time. York." And I didn't know it at the time. That was a little seed of faith. We said That was a little seed of faith. We said That was a little seed of faith. We said we we sort of joke some families go to we we sort of joke some families go to we we sort of joke some families go to Disney World for for vacation. We did a Disney World for for vacation. We did a Disney World for for vacation. We did a revival tour around the world. revival tour around the world. revival tour around the world. In the providence of God, I ended up In the providence of God, I ended up In the providence of God, I ended up meeting the pastor who pastored that meeting the pastor who pastored that meeting the pastor who pastored that church where the revival happened. And I church where the revival happened. And I church where the revival happened. And I went to a prayer meeting which was one went to a prayer meeting which was one went to a prayer meeting which was one of the most sacred experiences of my of the most sacred experiences of my of the most sacred experiences of my life. My my whole vision was Lord, let life. My my whole vision was Lord, let life. My my whole vision was Lord, let me if there's anybody still alive from me if there's anybody still alive from me if there's anybody still alive from that movement of God. This is 49 to 52. that movement of God. This is 49 to 52. that movement of God. This is 49 to 52. Let me warm my heart by the coals that Let me warm my heart by the coals that Let me warm my heart by the coals that are still burning in them. And uh so we are still burning in them. And uh so we are still burning in them. And uh so we go to this church and on the the door go to this church and on the the door go to this church and on the the door there's a sign that says Sabbath prayer there's a sign that says Sabbath prayer there's a sign that says Sabbath prayer meeting. And my wife said to me, "I bet meeting. And my wife said to me, "I bet meeting. And my wife said to me, "I bet if there's any of them still alive, I if there's any of them still alive, I if there's any of them still alive, I bet they still pray." And I was so bet they still pray." And I was so bet they still pray." And I was so tired. Like, I got so much jet lag. My tired. Like, I got so much jet lag. My tired. Like, I got so much jet lag. My wife was like, "Stir yourself up like a wife was like, "Stir yourself up like a wife was like, "Stir yourself up like a man. Go." So, I end up going to this man. Go." So, I end up going to this man. Go." So, I end up going to this prayer meeting and I pray with about prayer meeting and I pray with about prayer meeting and I pray with about seven of the last remaining members who seven of the last remaining members who seven of the last remaining members who encountered that move of God.

encountered that move of God. encountered that move of God. >> And they were there in 49 to 52. >> And they were there in 49 to 52. >> And they were there in 49 to 52. >> Yep. And they teenagers. And um a lot of >> Yep. And they teenagers. And um a lot of >> Yep. And they teenagers. And um a lot of Pentecostals come to the Hebdes with you Pentecostals come to the Hebdes with you Pentecostals come to the Hebdes with you I'm from a Assemblies of God background I'm from a Assemblies of God background I'm from a Assemblies of God background with a very aggressive we're going to with a very aggressive we're going to with a very aggressive we're going to touch the fire. These are very very touch the fire. These are very very touch the fire. These are very very conservative culturally very very conservative culturally very very conservative culturally very very reformed Calvinist sort of culture. A reformed Calvinist sort of culture. A reformed Calvinist sort of culture. A lot of respect for God still. You go to lot of respect for God still. You go to lot of respect for God still. You go to the heist today most things would be the heist today most things would be the heist today most things would be closed on a Sunday. But I went and sat closed on a Sunday. But I went and sat closed on a Sunday. But I went and sat at the back of the room. They're all at the back of the room. They're all at the back of the room. They're all praying down the front. And they said to praying down the front. And they said to praying down the front. And they said to me, "Young man, me, "Young man, me, "Young man, >> would you like to come and pray with >> would you like to come and pray with >> would you like to come and pray with us?" Young man, I was in mid-40s. I come us?" Young man, I was in mid-40s. I come us?" Young man, I was in mid-40s. I come down the front and pray with them and down the front and pray with them and down the front and pray with them and they said, "What do you want to know they said, "What do you want to know they said, "What do you want to know about the revival? We know we can trust about the revival? We know we can trust about the revival? We know we can trust you cuz you came to pray. Everybody you cuz you came to pray. Everybody you cuz you came to pray. Everybody wants the stories, but nobody wants God wants the stories, but nobody wants God wants the stories, but nobody wants God and we know we can trust you cuz you and we know we can trust you cuz you and we know we can trust you cuz you pray with us." And they just sat there pray with us." And they just sat there pray with us." And they just sat there >> and open up their heart. So the stories >> and open up their heart. So the stories >> and open up their heart. So the stories they were telling me, I was like, they were telling me, I was like, they were telling me, I was like, "That's what I want to see." So I ended "That's what I want to see." So I ended "That's what I want to see." So I ended up becoming friends with Pastor uh Tommy up becoming friends with Pastor uh Tommy up becoming friends with Pastor uh Tommy McNeel, the Reverend Tommy McNeel, and McNeel, the Reverend Tommy McNeel, and McNeel, the Reverend Tommy McNeel, and um he said, "Hey, we're hosting this um he said, "Hey, we're hosting this um he said, "Hey, we're hosting this hees revival conference. We know that he hees revival conference. We know that he hees revival conference. We know that he are in your heart. Would you come and are in your heart. Would you come and are in your heart. Would you come and speak? So I went last summer. It was speak? So I went last summer. It was speak? So I went last summer. It was extraordinary in Storway and um had the extraordinary in Storway and um had the extraordinary in Storway and um had the strongest encounter of the presence of strongest encounter of the presence of strongest encounter of the presence of God I've ever had in my life.

God I've ever had in my life. God I've ever had in my life. >> So the glorious break that down. What >> So the glorious break that down. What >> So the glorious break that down. What does that mean? does that mean? does that mean? >> Just it's very hard to explain. Except >> Just it's very hard to explain. Except >> Just it's very hard to explain. Except I've encountered the love of God, liquid I've encountered the love of God, liquid I've encountered the love of God, liquid waves of liquid love, the power of the waves of liquid love, the power of the waves of liquid love, the power of the gospel, an awareness of sin, the beauty gospel, an awareness of sin, the beauty gospel, an awareness of sin, the beauty of the Savior, a filling of the spirit of the Savior, a filling of the spirit of the Savior, a filling of the spirit where you just haven't, you know, where you just haven't, you know, where you just haven't, you know, physical manifestations, physical manifestations, physical manifestations, speaking in tongues, all the charismatic speaking in tongues, all the charismatic speaking in tongues, all the charismatic stuff. This, I was say, this was the awe stuff. This, I was say, this was the awe stuff. This, I was say, this was the awe awe awe awe of God. And I'd never encountered it of God. And I'd never encountered it of God. And I'd never encountered it like that. So that is interesting. And like that. So that is interesting. And like that. So that is interesting. And you're speaking into a what a lot of you're speaking into a what a lot of you're speaking into a what a lot of people probably would say. I've studied people probably would say. I've studied people probably would say. I've studied this, read my Bible every day. I pray. I this, read my Bible every day. I pray. I this, read my Bible every day. I pray. I preached it. And there's probably some preached it. And there's probably some preached it. And there's probably some students of revival watching this students of revival watching this students of revival watching this podcast, listening in. podcast, listening in. podcast, listening in. What was What was What was different? Two questions. What was different? Two questions. What was different? Two questions. What was different? different? different? And any idea what might have triggered And any idea what might have triggered And any idea what might have triggered it? it? it? I mean, what was different?

I mean, what was different? I mean, what was different? I mean it's it I mean it's it I mean it's it the best way I can describe is the aura the best way I can describe is the aura the best way I can describe is the aura of God. You know the Lord in his temple of God. You know the Lord in his temple of God. You know the Lord in his temple let all the earth be silent. There was let all the earth be silent. There was let all the earth be silent. There was silence in heaven for half an hour. silence in heaven for half an hour. silence in heaven for half an hour. Sometimes the presence of God is so Sometimes the presence of God is so Sometimes the presence of God is so weighty. weighty. weighty. You don't even want to sing in response. You don't even want to sing in response. You don't even want to sing in response. You're just getting crushed by the You're just getting crushed by the You're just getting crushed by the kabode glory. It's just like shut up and kabode glory. It's just like shut up and kabode glory. It's just like shut up and let God be God. It's it's be still and let God be God. It's it's be still and let God be God. It's it's be still and know that I'm God. It's that it's that know that I'm God. It's that it's that know that I'm God. It's that it's that that's not from a contemplative. I'm that's not from a contemplative. I'm that's not from a contemplative. I'm aware of divine union. I mean like God aware of divine union. I mean like God aware of divine union. I mean like God is in the room. Shut your mouth. The is in the room. Shut your mouth. The is in the room. Shut your mouth. The king is here. king is here. king is here. >> Not fear, >> Not fear, >> Not fear, >> right? >> right? >> right? >> But not love or I am not in charge of >> But not love or I am not in charge of >> But not love or I am not in charge of this encounter. God is here. And um it this encounter. God is here. And um it this encounter. God is here. And um it was in the middle of a worship set and I was in the middle of a worship set and I was in the middle of a worship set and I think we wrecked it by going into think we wrecked it by going into think we wrecked it by going into worship because we didn't know what else worship because we didn't know what else worship because we didn't know what else to do. No one wanted to speak and no one to do. No one wanted to speak and no one to do. No one wanted to speak and no one wanted to preach. So we wanted to preach. So we wanted to preach. So we >> So you weren't the only one feeling >> So you weren't the only one feeling >> So you weren't the only one feeling this? No, this? No, this? No, >> this is the whole room and this during >> this is the whole room and this during >> this is the whole room and this during the conference. the conference. the conference. >> Yeah, this is this is on the Saturday >> Yeah, this is this is on the Saturday >> Yeah, this is this is on the Saturday night. I mean, this is wild. And so, you night. I mean, this is wild. And so, you night. I mean, this is wild. And so, you felt it. And this is so interesting to felt it. And this is so interesting to felt it. And this is so interesting to me, you know, because being a former me, you know, because being a former me, you know, because being a former Presbyterian, I'm very heady, very Presbyterian, I'm very heady, very Presbyterian, I'm very heady, very intellectual, and I've had profound intellectual, and I've had profound intellectual, and I've had profound experiences of God. One of those few experiences of God. One of those few experiences of God. One of those few people with a reformed background that people with a reformed background that people with a reformed background that actually does believe in the gift of actually does believe in the gift of actually does believe in the gift of tongues. I have the gift of tongues. It tongues. I have the gift of tongues. It tongues. I have the gift of tongues. It comes in seasons and waves and small comes in seasons and waves and small comes in seasons and waves and small doses and then it goes away. And I've doses and then it goes away. And I've doses and then it goes away. And I've had some profound experiences had some profound experiences had some profound experiences of God, but it's it's not like an on of God, but it's it's not like an on of God, but it's it's not like an on demand thing. It's not like in your demand thing. It's not like in your demand thing. It's not like in your devotions today, you could just

devotions today, you could just devotions today, you could just transport yourself there. Which brings transport yourself there. Which brings transport yourself there. Which brings on the second part of the question. What on the second part of the question. What on the second part of the question. What triggers an experience like that? triggers an experience like that? triggers an experience like that? Because I'm sure there are people Because I'm sure there are people Because I'm sure there are people watching and listening who's like, watching and listening who's like, watching and listening who's like, "Yeah, it's never even happened. Am I "Yeah, it's never even happened. Am I "Yeah, it's never even happened. Am I even a Christian?" I know I am. But even a Christian?" I know I am. But even a Christian?" I know I am. But like, you know what I mean? Like there's like, you know what I mean? Like there's like, you know what I mean? Like there's that missing out. This was there's a that missing out. This was there's a that missing out. This was there's a difference between a personal encounter difference between a personal encounter difference between a personal encounter with God, which I would say you have with God, which I would say you have with God, which I would say you have more agency over than a corporate more agency over than a corporate more agency over than a corporate meaning in your private. meaning in your private. meaning in your private. >> That's true. Mine have mostly been I've >> That's true. Mine have mostly been I've >> That's true. Mine have mostly been I've had a few worship experiences, but mine had a few worship experiences, but mine had a few worship experiences, but mine are mostly private. are mostly private. are mostly private. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> This was in a worship and pastor Pastor >> This was in a worship and pastor Pastor >> This was in a worship and pastor Pastor Tommy's wife uh Donna Tommy's wife uh Donna Tommy's wife uh Donna is a lioness in prayer, mate. Co is a lioness in prayer, mate. Co is a lioness in prayer, mate. Co Scottish covenant prayer. Scottish covenant prayer. Scottish covenant prayer. >> Now, uh Tommy is one of the leaders of >> Now, uh Tommy is one of the leaders of >> Now, uh Tommy is one of the leaders of the Church of Scotland. These guys are the Church of Scotland. These guys are the Church of Scotland. These guys are Presbyterians. I mean, Presbyterians. I mean, Presbyterians. I mean, >> right. We're not like free. >> right. We're not like free. >> right. We're not like free. >> A lot of good stuff. >> A lot of good stuff. >> A lot of good stuff. >> Um, but she's just got a gift of >> Um, but she's just got a gift of >> Um, but she's just got a gift of covenant prayer. I I had gone, covenant prayer. I I had gone, covenant prayer. I I had gone, >> that's a long story. I was in Iceland >> that's a long story. I was in Iceland >> that's a long story. I was in Iceland and had this prompting. I've got to go and had this prompting. I've got to go and had this prompting. I've got to go to the Hebdes and went to the Hebdes to the Hebdes and went to the Hebdes to the Hebdes and went to the Hebdes with a friend of mine named Phil from with a friend of mine named Phil from with a friend of mine named Phil from Atlanta and we went to a prayer meeting Atlanta and we went to a prayer meeting Atlanta and we went to a prayer meeting there and the presence of God came with there and the presence of God came with there and the presence of God came with came that came down with violent force came that came down with violent force came that came down with violent force and I was pinned to the ground. Could and I was pinned to the ground. Could and I was pinned to the ground. Could not get up for about two hours with a not get up for about two hours with a not get up for about two hours with a spirit of travail.

spirit of travail. spirit of travail. And it's And it's And it's >> a spirit of which >> a spirit of which >> a spirit of which >> travail. Just agonizing prayer. >> travail. Just agonizing prayer. >> travail. Just agonizing prayer. Agonizing prayer. Agonizing prayer. Agonizing prayer. >> Does that mean like work? >> Does that mean like work? >> Does that mean like work? >> Travail. Trav is French for work. >> Travail. Trav is French for work. >> Travail. Trav is French for work. >> I mean, yeah, working it out. Okay. >> I mean, yeah, working it out. Okay. >> I mean, yeah, working it out. Okay. >> Working it out. All right. >> Working it out. All right. >> Working it out. All right. >> Just a burden for God to move. Lord, >> Just a burden for God to move. Lord, >> Just a burden for God to move. Lord, you've got to move. Desperation. you've got to move. Desperation. you've got to move. Desperation. >> Just want to make sure I understood. >> Just want to make sure I understood. >> Just want to make sure I understood. >> And um >> And um >> And um >> and I just remember thinking, whoa, >> and I just remember thinking, whoa, >> and I just remember thinking, whoa, whoa. And that got kicked off because whoa. And that got kicked off because whoa. And that got kicked off because there was a lay man who prayed with a there was a lay man who prayed with a there was a lay man who prayed with a kind of intimacy where the fear of God kind of intimacy where the fear of God kind of intimacy where the fear of God fell in the room. And I had this sense. fell in the room. And I had this sense. fell in the room. And I had this sense. I am a seminary graduate very well read I am a seminary graduate very well read I am a seminary graduate very well read in an urban center with a high level of in an urban center with a high level of in an urban center with a high level of ideiation fluency ideiation fluency ideiation fluency walking with God for 30 years walking with God for 30 years walking with God for 30 years professional pastor. And I don't think I professional pastor. And I don't think I professional pastor. And I don't think I know God like that bloke who I believe know God like that bloke who I believe know God like that bloke who I believe is a plumber. is a plumber. is a plumber. And it was just that it was a sense of And it was just that it was a sense of And it was just that it was a sense of that I know God, but I don't know God that I know God, but I don't know God that I know God, but I don't know God like that that guy. And they've got a like that that guy. And they've got a like that that guy. And they've got a concept of just covenant prayer of being concept of just covenant prayer of being concept of just covenant prayer of being in covenant with God. Well, at the he in covenant with God. Well, at the he in covenant with God. Well, at the he revival conference, it was Pastor revival conference, it was Pastor revival conference, it was Pastor Tommy's wife, Donna, and she has a gift Tommy's wife, Donna, and she has a gift Tommy's wife, Donna, and she has a gift of covenant prayer. It's just like of covenant prayer. It's just like of covenant prayer. It's just like claiming praying in faith, claiming the claiming praying in faith, claiming the claiming praying in faith, claiming the promises of God. I'll play you a clip promises of God. I'll play you a clip promises of God. I'll play you a clip after so you can get a sense of um the after so you can get a sense of um the after so you can get a sense of um the kind of kind of kind of >> Actually, maybe we can insert that into >> Actually, maybe we can insert that into >> Actually, maybe we can insert that into >> I'll have to ask if it's okay. If we >> I'll have to ask if it's okay. If we >> I'll have to ask if it's okay. If we can, we'll we'll we'll either put it at can, we'll we'll we'll either put it at can, we'll we'll we'll either put it at the end or the end or the end or >> it just triggered God coming down.

>> it just triggered God coming down. >> it just triggered God coming down. >> That's what triggered it. It was a woman >> That's what triggered it. It was a woman >> That's what triggered it. It was a woman with authority calling God on his word. with authority calling God on his word. with authority calling God on his word. Lord, you have said we did not make this Lord, you have said we did not make this Lord, you have said we did not make this up. You have promised. We are hungry. up. You have promised. We are hungry. up. You have promised. We are hungry. You said you would. It's about time for You said you would. It's about time for You said you would. It's about time for you to show up. you to show up. you to show up. >> Is that sort of a thumbnail definition >> Is that sort of a thumbnail definition >> Is that sort of a thumbnail definition of covenant prayer as opposed to prayer? of covenant prayer as opposed to prayer? of covenant prayer as opposed to prayer? Like God, we're tapping into your Like God, we're tapping into your Like God, we're tapping into your covenant. What is covenant prayer? covenant. What is covenant prayer? covenant. What is covenant prayer? >> Covenant prayer is like, so an example >> Covenant prayer is like, so an example >> Covenant prayer is like, so an example would be my wife called. Um would be my wife called. Um would be my wife called. Um >> I stopped this podcast to my wife. She >> I stopped this podcast to my wife. She >> I stopped this podcast to my wife. She has interruption rights in my life. has interruption rights in my life. has interruption rights in my life. >> My wife can ask yeah I'm in a marriage >> My wife can ask yeah I'm in a marriage >> My wife can ask yeah I'm in a marriage covenant. She has access to everything I covenant. She has access to everything I covenant. She has access to everything I have and everything I am. have and everything I am. have and everything I am. >> I may have a kind heart and help other >> I may have a kind heart and help other >> I may have a kind heart and help other people as I am able. But she can draw on people as I am able. But she can draw on people as I am able. But she can draw on a kind of intimacy. It's it's basically a kind of intimacy. It's it's basically a kind of intimacy. It's it's basically three levels. This is how Andrew Murray three levels. This is how Andrew Murray three levels. This is how Andrew Murray explained it. You have a life explained it. You have a life explained it. You have a life connection. You have a love connection. connection. You have a love connection. connection. You have a love connection. And you have a legal connection. I'm And you have a legal connection. I'm And you have a legal connection. I'm doing my whole life with her. I entered doing my whole life with her. I entered doing my whole life with her. I entered into this entered into this because of into this entered into this because of into this entered into this because of love and it's legally bound. love and it's legally bound. love and it's legally bound. >> And when you pray out of that posture, >> And when you pray out of that posture, >> And when you pray out of that posture, it's not wish. Lord, I wish. it's not wish. Lord, I wish. it's not wish. Lord, I wish. >> It's not um contemplative, aba God, >> It's not um contemplative, aba God, >> It's not um contemplative, aba God, father. It is king of the universe. You father. It is king of the universe. You father. It is king of the universe. You are the one who has. It's Nehemiah.

are the one who has. It's Nehemiah. are the one who has. It's Nehemiah. Nehemiah says uh you read Nehemiah's Nehemiah says uh you read Nehemiah's Nehemiah says uh you read Nehemiah's prayers. All of the Old Testament prayers. All of the Old Testament prayers. All of the Old Testament prayers were covenant prayers. Lord, you prayers were covenant prayers. Lord, you prayers were covenant prayers. Lord, you have said even if they distribute it to have said even if they distribute it to have said even if they distribute it to the ends of the earth, if we return to the ends of the earth, if we return to the ends of the earth, if we return to you, Josiah's prayers, their covenant you, Josiah's prayers, their covenant you, Josiah's prayers, their covenant prayers, she got into that mode of prayers, she got into that mode of prayers, she got into that mode of covenant prayer, covenant prayer, covenant prayer, >> which makes you think God will come down >> which makes you think God will come down >> which makes you think God will come down or she will be struck by lightning. And or she will be struck by lightning. And or she will be struck by lightning. And it turns out God came down. That's what it turns out God came down. That's what it turns out God came down. That's what triggered it. It was a it was an triggered it. It was a it was an triggered it. It was a it was an intervention in the meeting. There's intervention in the meeting. There's intervention in the meeting. There's people down the front getting ministry people down the front getting ministry people down the front getting ministry time and she said, "Stop it. Everyone time and she said, "Stop it. Everyone time and she said, "Stop it. Everyone stop praying." She stopped the meeting. stop praying." She stopped the meeting. stop praying." She stopped the meeting. Stop praying. stop your ministry time. Stop praying. stop your ministry time. Stop praying. stop your ministry time. Boom. She goes into a glory. Boom. She goes into a glory. Boom. She goes into a glory. Amazing. Amazing. Amazing. Those moments, sometimes they last an Those moments, sometimes they last an Those moments, sometimes they last an hour. Sometimes they last days. At hour. Sometimes they last days. At hour. Sometimes they last days. At Aspbury, they lasted I forget what it Aspbury, they lasted I forget what it Aspbury, they lasted I forget what it was. was. was. >> 16 days. Yeah. >> 16 days. Yeah. >> 16 days. Yeah. >> 16 days. >> 16 days. >> 16 days. >> How do you know it's happening? How do >> How do you know it's happening? How do >> How do you know it's happening? How do you know it's ending? there would be an internal dynamic, an there would be an internal dynamic, an internal awareness. I was at Aspbury and internal awareness. I was at Aspbury and internal awareness. I was at Aspbury and this this was more potent than Aspbury.

this this was more potent than Aspbury. this this was more potent than Aspbury. Asbury was very very different. Asbury Asbury was very very different. Asbury Asbury was very very different. Asbury to me to me to me was like you could feel was like you could feel was like you could feel the resting presence of God. Not raw the resting presence of God. Not raw the resting presence of God. Not raw power drawing love. power drawing love. power drawing love. >> Um you know in the book of Hosea it says >> Um you know in the book of Hosea it says >> Um you know in the book of Hosea it says I will heal you of your waywardness. I will heal you of your waywardness. I will heal you of your waywardness. >> And part of that I think was God was >> And part of that I think was God was >> And part of that I think was God was healing Jenzie of of pain and healing Jenzie of of pain and healing Jenzie of of pain and waywardness. And it was just that waywardness. And it was just that waywardness. And it was just that drawing love, the father's love, drawing love, the father's love, drawing love, the father's love, restoring love. Um, but you know it restoring love. Um, but you know it restoring love. Um, but you know it because it's there. And then you know it because it's there. And then you know it because it's there. And then you know it cuz it's not there. I mean, how do you cuz it's not there. I mean, how do you cuz it's not there. I mean, how do you know when your wife's in the room and know when your wife's in the room and know when your wife's in the room and your wife's not in the room? She's like, your wife's not in the room? She's like, your wife's not in the room? She's like, she's there and she's not there. It's she's there and she's not there. It's she's there and she's not there. It's the difference between omni presence and the difference between omni presence and the difference between omni presence and manifest presence or tangible presence. manifest presence or tangible presence. manifest presence or tangible presence. And God is everywhere present. That's And God is everywhere present. That's And God is everywhere present. That's one of his attributes. But when he one of his attributes. But when he one of his attributes. But when he specially manifests himself, you you specially manifests himself, you you specially manifests himself, you you just know because he's there. Um, you just know because he's there. Um, you just know because he's there. Um, you feel it physically, you feel it feel it physically, you feel it feel it physically, you feel it certainly spiritually. You have this certainly spiritually. You have this certainly spiritually. You have this inner sense uh your spirit crying out to inner sense uh your spirit crying out to inner sense uh your spirit crying out to the to the father and that reciprocal the to the father and that reciprocal the to the father and that reciprocal I'm here. I love you. I'm with you.

I'm here. I love you. I'm with you. I'm here. I love you. I'm with you. >> At Asbury, it just felt like waves of >> At Asbury, it just felt like waves of >> At Asbury, it just felt like waves of love passing through the air. You just love passing through the air. You just love passing through the air. You just weep and then the waves would increase weep and then the waves would increase weep and then the waves would increase and you would you feel the intensity of and you would you feel the intensity of and you would you feel the intensity of it and then it would ease off a bit and it and then it would ease off a bit and it and then it would ease off a bit and then another wave would come, another then another wave would come, another then another wave would come, another moment would come. In the Hedes it moment would come. In the Hedes it moment would come. In the Hedes it wasn't like that. In the Hebedes, it was wasn't like that. In the Hebedes, it was wasn't like that. In the Hebedes, it was a general sense of hunger, but then a general sense of hunger, but then a general sense of hunger, but then there was boom, power, intervention, there was boom, power, intervention, there was boom, power, intervention, shut up. God is here. shut up. God is here. shut up. God is here. >> You are not. So, I say you're not in >> You are not. So, I say you're not in >> You are not. So, I say you're not in charge of it. charge of it. charge of it. >> It's an involuntary response to the >> It's an involuntary response to the >> It's an involuntary response to the reality of God being in the room. You reality of God being in the room. You reality of God being in the room. You can't control it. So, it lasted. I think can't control it. So, it lasted. I think can't control it. So, it lasted. I think you can steward it or you can you can steward it or you can you can steward it or you can >> you can learn to >> you can learn to >> you can learn to >> facilitate what God's doing, but at the >> facilitate what God's doing, but at the >> facilitate what God's doing, but at the end of the day, God's sovereignty does end of the day, God's sovereignty does end of the day, God's sovereignty does what he wants. And in that moment, I what he wants. And in that moment, I what he wants. And in that moment, I think he responded to the prayer that think he responded to the prayer that think he responded to the prayer that was prayed. And this they they literally was prayed. And this they they literally was prayed. And this they they literally said, "We touched something. You got to said, "We touched something. You got to said, "We touched something. You got to come back next year. Let's press in. come back next year. Let's press in. come back next year. Let's press in. Let's go all the way." So that's why I'm Let's go all the way." So that's why I'm Let's go all the way." So that's why I'm going back. Let's see what going back. Let's see what going back. Let's see what >> So you're heading back. >> So you're heading back. >> So you're heading back. >> See what God would do. >> See what God would do. >> See what God would do. >> So when you come back from the Hees, >> So when you come back from the Hees, >> So when you come back from the Hees, you're back at Church of the City in New you're back at Church of the City in New you're back at Church of the City in New York.

York. York. >> There must be a longing that it's like >> There must be a longing that it's like >> There must be a longing that it's like and I want to bring this back. And then and I want to bring this back. And then and I want to bring this back. And then you've just got a church service. How do you've just got a church service. How do you've just got a church service. How do you navigate that tension of having had you navigate that tension of having had you navigate that tension of having had those profound spiritual experiences those profound spiritual experiences those profound spiritual experiences that are beyond your control? that are beyond your control? that are beyond your control? You can't conjure them up. You can't you You can't conjure them up. You can't you You can't conjure them up. You can't you can't make them happen. can't make them happen. can't make them happen. And then you go into your 2, three, And then you go into your 2, three, And then you go into your 2, three, four, five Sunday services on Sunday four, five Sunday services on Sunday four, five Sunday services on Sunday morning at your locations. Cuz I think, morning at your locations. Cuz I think, morning at your locations. Cuz I think, you know, most of us watching, listening you know, most of us watching, listening you know, most of us watching, listening to this podcast, that's a reality. we've to this podcast, that's a reality. we've to this podcast, that's a reality. we've tasted and we've seen and then here we tasted and we've seen and then here we tasted and we've seen and then here we are in a normal Sunday. are in a normal Sunday. are in a normal Sunday. >> Does it change for you? Do you approach >> Does it change for you? Do you approach >> Does it change for you? Do you approach it differently? Like tell us tell us it differently? Like tell us tell us it differently? Like tell us tell us about that dynamic. about that dynamic. about that dynamic. >> Yeah. Well, you can't control it, but >> Yeah. Well, you can't control it, but >> Yeah. Well, you can't control it, but you can position your heart for it. you can position your heart for it. you can position your heart for it. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I mean, you can you can >> I mean, you can you can >> I mean, you can you can >> angle the culture of your church towards >> angle the culture of your church towards >> angle the culture of your church towards it. I mean, we would do today we would it. I mean, we would do today we would it. I mean, we would do today we would do four 1-hour prayer meetings for do four 1-hour prayer meetings for do four 1-hour prayer meetings for revival in New York City. So we did 6:00 revival in New York City. So we did 6:00 revival in New York City. So we did 6:00 this morning, 7:00 this morning, 12:00 this morning, 7:00 this morning, 12:00 this morning, 7:00 this morning, 12:00 lunchtime, 7:00 p.m. tonight. We're lunchtime, 7:00 p.m. tonight. We're lunchtime, 7:00 p.m. tonight. We're literally saying, "Lord, you have said literally saying, "Lord, you have said literally saying, "Lord, you have said so." Number one, I want to say this. God so." Number one, I want to say this. God so." Number one, I want to say this. God is worthy to be sought whether he is worthy to be sought whether he is worthy to be sought whether he answers another prayer or not.

answers another prayer or not. answers another prayer or not. >> So you love God. It's it's uh that I may >> So you love God. It's it's uh that I may >> So you love God. It's it's uh that I may know him and the power of his know him and the power of his know him and the power of his resurrection, the fellowship of his resurrection, the fellowship of his resurrection, the fellowship of his suffering. This one thing I do, suffering. This one thing I do, suffering. This one thing I do, everything else is rubbish. So part of everything else is rubbish. So part of everything else is rubbish. So part of it is the joyful pursuit of the God who it is the joyful pursuit of the God who it is the joyful pursuit of the God who has saved you. whether you get anything has saved you. whether you get anything has saved you. whether you get anything from it, whether he does anything. When from it, whether he does anything. When from it, whether he does anything. When you're in love, you're not thinking, you're in love, you're not thinking, you're in love, you're not thinking, "Wow, I wonder how wealthy you are and I "Wow, I wonder how wealthy you are and I "Wow, I wonder how wealthy you are and I wonder how rich we'll be in our 50s." wonder how rich we'll be in our 50s." wonder how rich we'll be in our 50s." All you're thinking is, "I want to be All you're thinking is, "I want to be All you're thinking is, "I want to be with you." I think there's that that with you." I think there's that that with you." I think there's that that purity of desire to just love God. But purity of desire to just love God. But purity of desire to just love God. But you can position your you can position your you can position your self and you can respond to the his self and you can respond to the his self and you can respond to the his invitations which are all through the invitations which are all through the invitations which are all through the Bible called him. Jesus teaching in Luke Bible called him. Jesus teaching in Luke Bible called him. Jesus teaching in Luke 11 extraordinary, 11 extraordinary, 11 extraordinary, >> you know, on that persistent aggressive >> you know, on that persistent aggressive >> you know, on that persistent aggressive prayer because a shameless audacity, prayer because a shameless audacity, prayer because a shameless audacity, trusting your father's heart, whoever trusting your father's heart, whoever trusting your father's heart, whoever asks for the Holy Spirit, the father asks for the Holy Spirit, the father asks for the Holy Spirit, the father will give generously. will give generously. will give generously. >> Um the the biblical uh injunctions, the >> Um the the biblical uh injunctions, the >> Um the the biblical uh injunctions, the the if then promises, you know, if my the if then promises, you know, if my the if then promises, you know, if my people who are called by my name in the people who are called by my name in the people who are called by my name in the New Testament, Jesus telling us to ask New Testament, Jesus telling us to ask New Testament, Jesus telling us to ask that we may receive um the coming of the that we may receive um the coming of the that we may receive um the coming of the spirit, creating space for the spirit, spirit, creating space for the spirit, spirit, creating space for the spirit, you know, all of those sorts of things.

you know, all of those sorts of things. you know, all of those sorts of things. So you can uh you can't control it but So you can uh you can't control it but So you can uh you can't control it but you can position for it. You can you can you can position for it. You can you can you can position for it. You can you can pray for it. You can hunger for it and pray for it. You can hunger for it and pray for it. You can hunger for it and you can create space for it which is you can create space for it which is you can create space for it which is very important. One of the ways we do very important. One of the ways we do very important. One of the ways we do that apart from a culture of um daily that apart from a culture of um daily that apart from a culture of um daily prayer and seeking God and then um prayer and seeking God and then um prayer and seeking God and then um getting with other people to see God getting with other people to see God getting with other people to see God together is we have a little time we've together is we have a little time we've together is we have a little time we've done this for seven years now. It's done this for seven years now. It's done this for seven years now. It's called lingering. And basically we called lingering. And basically we called lingering. And basically we realize in the gospels Jesus loves two realize in the gospels Jesus loves two realize in the gospels Jesus loves two things need and faith. things need and faith. things need and faith. >> One calls on his heart, one calls on his >> One calls on his heart, one calls on his >> One calls on his heart, one calls on his power. And we know that if you have a power. And we know that if you have a power. And we know that if you have a crowd full of people, those who are who crowd full of people, those who are who crowd full of people, those who are who have something they need from God, Lord, have something they need from God, Lord, have something they need from God, Lord, if you're willing, I am willing. if you're willing, I am willing. if you're willing, I am willing. >> And then faith. I've not even found >> And then faith. I've not even found >> And then faith. I've not even found faith faith faith >> in Israel like this. So we want to >> in Israel like this. So we want to >> in Israel like this. So we want to create a bonus time. We call it create a bonus time. We call it create a bonus time. We call it lingering. It's built into our service lingering. It's built into our service lingering. It's built into our service time. Typical service is two hours. time. Typical service is two hours. time. Typical service is two hours. We've carved 30 minutes for this where We've carved 30 minutes for this where We've carved 30 minutes for this where after the sermon is done, instead of after the sermon is done, instead of after the sermon is done, instead of saying amen, let's send sing the saying amen, let's send sing the saying amen, let's send sing the benediction, we say, "Amen. Let's ask benediction, we say, "Amen. Let's ask benediction, we say, "Amen. Let's ask the Holy Spirit to come and make the the Holy Spirit to come and make the the Holy Spirit to come and make the word of God real in the room." We have a word of God real in the room." We have a word of God real in the room." We have a vineyardy sort of approach, ministry vineyardy sort of approach, ministry vineyardy sort of approach, ministry time space. We have prayer leaders down time space. We have prayer leaders down time space. We have prayer leaders down the front and we will give starting the front and we will give starting the front and we will give starting prayer prompts. If you're here today, um prayer prompts. If you're here today, um prayer prompts. If you're here today, um you have a sense right now that this is you have a sense right now that this is you have a sense right now that this is happening in your heart, respond, happening in your heart, respond, happening in your heart, respond, respond, respond. any prophetic things.

respond, respond. any prophetic things. respond, respond. any prophetic things. We've got a team that prays before the We've got a team that prays before the We've got a team that prays before the service and during the service. We'll service and during the service. We'll service and during the service. We'll share those. Hey, if your name's Tim and share those. Hey, if your name's Tim and share those. Hey, if your name's Tim and you hurt your right shoulder in the you hurt your right shoulder in the you hurt your right shoulder in the sixth grade, we feel like God wants to sixth grade, we feel like God wants to sixth grade, we feel like God wants to heal you. So, sort of like those live heal you. So, sort of like those live heal you. So, sort of like those live prophetic things. prophetic things. prophetic things. >> And then the main thing is creating >> And then the main thing is creating >> And then the main thing is creating space for it. We live in a Martha world, space for it. We live in a Martha world, space for it. We live in a Martha world, >> missing Jesus because we're busy with >> missing Jesus because we're busy with >> missing Jesus because we're busy with the preparations for Jesus to come the preparations for Jesus to come the preparations for Jesus to come rather than just like having space to rather than just like having space to rather than just like having space to sit at his feet and learn whatever he's sit at his feet and learn whatever he's sit at his feet and learn whatever he's saying. So that's baked into our saying. So that's baked into our saying. So that's baked into our gatherings. That's baked into our gatherings. That's baked into our gatherings. That's baked into our groups. That's like trying to build a groups. That's like trying to build a groups. That's like trying to build a culture that if God did want to move, we culture that if God did want to move, we culture that if God did want to move, we wouldn't miss it. wouldn't miss it. wouldn't miss it. >> Openness. >> Openness. >> Openness. >> Yeah. So beyond openness, there's >> Yeah. So beyond openness, there's >> Yeah. So beyond openness, there's there's closed, open, and desperate. We there's closed, open, and desperate. We there's closed, open, and desperate. We would be on the desperate side beyond would be on the desperate side beyond would be on the desperate side beyond open, which is like, God, you got to do open, which is like, God, you got to do open, which is like, God, you got to do this. this. this. >> One of my big learnings is that if >> One of my big learnings is that if >> One of my big learnings is that if someone can talk you into it, someone someone can talk you into it, someone someone can talk you into it, someone else can talk you out of it. If I can else can talk you out of it. If I can else can talk you out of it. If I can talk you into it talk you into it talk you into it >> with my arguments on a Sunday, someone >> with my arguments on a Sunday, someone >> with my arguments on a Sunday, someone on YouTube smarter than me can talk you on YouTube smarter than me can talk you on YouTube smarter than me can talk you out of it on Monday. out of it on Monday. out of it on Monday. >> But if you have an encounter with God, >> But if you have an encounter with God, >> But if you have an encounter with God, I've met the risen Christ. Is very, very I've met the risen Christ. Is very, very I've met the risen Christ. Is very, very hard for YouTube to talk you out of it hard for YouTube to talk you out of it hard for YouTube to talk you out of it if it's God who brought you into if it's God who brought you into if it's God who brought you into >> if you know.

>> if you know. >> if you know. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So, I want to move on to other things, >> So, I want to move on to other things, >> So, I want to move on to other things, but I want to come back to you because but I want to come back to you because but I want to come back to you because we've all done services. We're we've all done services. We're we've all done services. We're positioned. We're prayed. We go in and positioned. We're prayed. We go in and positioned. We're prayed. We go in and nothing quote happens. It's like what nothing quote happens. It's like what nothing quote happens. It's like what was on the page happened in real life. was on the page happened in real life. was on the page happened in real life. We had a ministry time lingering time. We had a ministry time lingering time. We had a ministry time lingering time. Few people came forward. No visions, no Few people came forward. No visions, no Few people came forward. No visions, no profound, no salvations that week. When profound, no salvations that week. When profound, no salvations that week. When that happens, that happens, that happens, how do you respond? how do you respond? how do you respond? >> Part of it I would say is, hey, call us >> Part of it I would say is, hey, call us >> Part of it I would say is, hey, call us to be faithful. to be faithful. to be faithful. >> Yeah. and to to facilitate our role with >> Yeah. and to to facilitate our role with >> Yeah. and to to facilitate our role with the the normative means of grace. the the normative means of grace. the the normative means of grace. >> There's something beautiful and edifying >> There's something beautiful and edifying >> There's something beautiful and edifying when you preach God's word, when you when you preach God's word, when you when you preach God's word, when you gather to have your heart reordered gather to have your heart reordered gather to have your heart reordered through worship, when you receive through worship, when you receive through worship, when you receive communion and you remember Christ in the communion and you remember Christ in the communion and you remember Christ in the middle of a world that's forgotten him. middle of a world that's forgotten him. middle of a world that's forgotten him. When uh you're in a room with people you When uh you're in a room with people you When uh you're in a room with people you wouldn't choose to be apart from Jesus. wouldn't choose to be apart from Jesus. wouldn't choose to be apart from Jesus. That's beautiful. That is enough. That's beautiful. That is enough. That's beautiful. That is enough. >> That is enough. and your mind yourself. >> That is enough. and your mind yourself. >> That is enough. and your mind yourself. >> However, I would say to everybody, when >> However, I would say to everybody, when >> However, I would say to everybody, when the wind is blowing, set your sails.

the wind is blowing, set your sails. the wind is blowing, set your sails. That may have been your experience your That may have been your experience your That may have been your experience your entire life. But when God begins to entire life. But when God begins to entire life. But when God begins to move, it is time to lean in. move, it is time to lean in. move, it is time to lean in. >> And um you know, I was I was reading uh >> And um you know, I was I was reading uh >> And um you know, I was I was reading uh last night about uh the revival in last night about uh the revival in last night about uh the revival in Northern Ireland. Had this beautiful be Northern Ireland. Had this beautiful be Northern Ireland. Had this beautiful be uh beautiful move of God. They call in uh beautiful move of God. They call in uh beautiful move of God. They call in Olter, they called it the year of grace. Olter, they called it the year of grace. Olter, they called it the year of grace. And it was just a year where the mass And it was just a year where the mass And it was just a year where the mass conversions, the presence of God coming conversions, the presence of God coming conversions, the presence of God coming in radical power in these communities. in radical power in these communities. in radical power in these communities. And it was one of those things where if And it was one of those things where if And it was one of those things where if you were hungry, God came. The only ones you were hungry, God came. The only ones you were hungry, God came. The only ones who missed him were the critics and the who missed him were the critics and the who missed him were the critics and the cynics. cynics. cynics. >> And so my my point is it may not be >> And so my my point is it may not be >> And so my my point is it may not be happening now. happening now. happening now. >> But if you're hungry, when a genuine >> But if you're hungry, when a genuine >> But if you're hungry, when a genuine wave of the spirit of God comes, it will wave of the spirit of God comes, it will wave of the spirit of God comes, it will happen where you are. So I would just happen where you are. So I would just happen where you are. So I would just say don't again faithfulness is our say don't again faithfulness is our say don't again faithfulness is our primary call upward call to God. primary call upward call to God. primary call upward call to God. >> But in seasons where God is drawing >> But in seasons where God is drawing >> But in seasons where God is drawing near, you should adjust to the season. near, you should adjust to the season. near, you should adjust to the season. And the Bible does talk about Jesus wept And the Bible does talk about Jesus wept And the Bible does talk about Jesus wept over Jerusalem. Oh Jerusalem, you've over Jerusalem. Oh Jerusalem, you've over Jerusalem. Oh Jerusalem, you've missed your hour of visitation. And missed your hour of visitation. And missed your hour of visitation. And Jesus does promise there's all these Jesus does promise there's all these Jesus does promise there's all these that they're alluding to different that they're alluding to different that they're alluding to different things. Some of them are prophetic things. Some of them are prophetic things. Some of them are prophetic fulfillment. Some are about the end fulfillment. Some are about the end fulfillment. Some are about the end times. But the principle behind the times. But the principle behind the times. But the principle behind the general principle behind the specific general principle behind the specific general principle behind the specific verses is you can miss when God is verses is you can miss when God is verses is you can miss when God is moving. And so I would just say just set moving. And so I would just say just set moving. And so I would just say just set your heart Lord I can't control this.

your heart Lord I can't control this. your heart Lord I can't control this. You are sovereign. You are Lord. But if You are sovereign. You are Lord. But if You are sovereign. You are Lord. But if you are doing something I want in and I you are doing something I want in and I you are doing something I want in and I promise that I will adjust everything. I promise that I will adjust everything. I promise that I will adjust everything. I think God may know this about our church think God may know this about our church think God may know this about our church and again you've got to build this into and again you've got to build this into and again you've got to build this into your board. You've got to build this your board. You've got to build this your board. You've got to build this into your elders. You got to build this into your elders. You got to build this into your elders. You got to build this into your leadership structure. If we into your leadership structure. If we into your leadership structure. If we had a visitation of God like Asbury, our had a visitation of God like Asbury, our had a visitation of God like Asbury, our church would stop everything and go church would stop everything and go church would stop everything and go after it as long as it lasted. And so I after it as long as it lasted. And so I after it as long as it lasted. And so I think there is an underlying willingness think there is an underlying willingness think there is an underlying willingness to suspend the normative means of grace to suspend the normative means of grace to suspend the normative means of grace if God moves in a special way. I I think if God moves in a special way. I I think if God moves in a special way. I I think that does require that does require that does require practical preparation and definitely practical preparation and definitely practical preparation and definitely heart preparation. And it seems to me heart preparation. And it seems to me heart preparation. And it seems to me that the churches where these things are that the churches where these things are that the churches where these things are kicking off a little bit, these kicking off a little bit, these kicking off a little bit, these forerunners of what maybe everybody's forerunners of what maybe everybody's forerunners of what maybe everybody's experienced are churches that are both experienced are churches that are both experienced are churches that are both hungry and open and willing to disrupt hungry and open and willing to disrupt hungry and open and willing to disrupt uh for whatever God's doing in the uh for whatever God's doing in the uh for whatever God's doing in the season. How has your study the history season. How has your study the history season. How has your study the history of revival, your experience of revival of revival, your experience of revival of revival, your experience of revival and profound moves of God shaped how you and profound moves of God shaped how you and profound moves of God shaped how you preach and shape how you teach? How are preach and shape how you teach? How are preach and shape how you teach? How are you different today in terms of your you different today in terms of your you different today in terms of your teaching and preaching than you were 15 teaching and preaching than you were 15 teaching and preaching than you were 15 years ago?

years ago? years ago? I've I've never experienced revival. I've I've never experienced revival. I've I've never experienced revival. I've never experienced it. I don't think I've never experienced it. I don't think I've never experienced it. I don't think I mean the Jesus movement, they called I mean the Jesus movement, they called I mean the Jesus movement, they called that a movement, not a revival. It was that a movement, not a revival. It was that a movement, not a revival. It was probably a revival. Asbury was an probably a revival. Asbury was an probably a revival. Asbury was an outpouring, not a revival. I don't uh outpouring, not a revival. I don't uh outpouring, not a revival. I don't uh Toronto blessing. That was a time of Toronto blessing. That was a time of Toronto blessing. That was a time of refreshing. Refreshing. I'm not sure any refreshing. Refreshing. I'm not sure any refreshing. Refreshing. I'm not sure any of us here in the west. of us here in the west. of us here in the west. I mean, there was there was the I mean, there was there was the I mean, there was there was the Pensacola outpouring Pensacola outpouring Pensacola outpouring >> um at Brownsville AOG. Maybe some folks >> um at Brownsville AOG. Maybe some folks >> um at Brownsville AOG. Maybe some folks saw that. I'm not sure we've ever seen saw that. I'm not sure we've ever seen saw that. I'm not sure we've ever seen one in our life. So, I'm sort of Noah one in our life. So, I'm sort of Noah one in our life. So, I'm sort of Noah building a boat and I've never building a boat and I've never building a boat and I've never encountered rain. Like, I know it's encountered rain. Like, I know it's encountered rain. Like, I know it's coming. I very believe this. coming. I very believe this. coming. I very believe this. >> Um how it's impacted my preaching, >> Um how it's impacted my preaching, >> Um how it's impacted my preaching, it it probably hasn't impacted my it it probably hasn't impacted my it it probably hasn't impacted my preaching that much. It's impacted my preaching that much. It's impacted my preaching that much. It's impacted my preparation for preaching and my prayer preparation for preaching and my prayer preparation for preaching and my prayer around preaching. It would be around preaching. It would be around preaching. It would be intangibles, not specifics. intangibles, not specifics. intangibles, not specifics. So, it's more So, it's more So, it's more you're building like preparation. You're you're building like preparation. You're you're building like preparation. You're praying differently. You're asking God praying differently. You're asking God praying differently. You're asking God rather than Ooh, that's really clever.

rather than Ooh, that's really clever. rather than Ooh, that's really clever. >> Yeah. Yeah. It's sort of an approach. I >> Yeah. Yeah. It's sort of an approach. I >> Yeah. Yeah. It's sort of an approach. I think when I first came to New York, um think when I first came to New York, um think when I first came to New York, um I was pretty intimidated by the city. I was pretty intimidated by the city. I was pretty intimidated by the city. You know, I'm a high school dropout, You know, I'm a high school dropout, You know, I'm a high school dropout, very working-class background. I'm a very working-class background. I'm a very working-class background. I'm a butcher by training, as you know. butcher by training, as you know. butcher by training, as you know. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> I start hanging out with these finance >> I start hanging out with these finance >> I start hanging out with these finance bros and these people that went to Ivy bros and these people that went to Ivy bros and these people that went to Ivy League schools. League schools. League schools. >> I probably had a season where >> I probably had a season where >> I probably had a season where I probably overadjusted out of a desire I probably overadjusted out of a desire I probably overadjusted out of a desire not to seem like an idiot. M not to seem like an idiot. M not to seem like an idiot. M >> now it turned out I had a definitely had >> now it turned out I had a definitely had >> now it turned out I had a definitely had a mind and I had a kind of aptitude for a mind and I had a kind of aptitude for a mind and I had a kind of aptitude for the world of thought and ideas the world of thought and ideas the world of thought and ideas >> but like kind of went hyper inellectual >> but like kind of went hyper inellectual >> but like kind of went hyper inellectual or or or or or or >> yeah I'm not hyper but I probably put >> yeah I'm not hyper but I probably put >> yeah I'm not hyper but I probably put too much time into my sermons and not too much time into my sermons and not too much time into my sermons and not enough time in prayer. I have definitely enough time in prayer. I have definitely enough time in prayer. I have definitely corrected that corrected that corrected that >> which means you this uh the Saskatoon >> which means you this uh the Saskatoon >> which means you this uh the Saskatoon revival one of the one of the features revival one of the one of the features revival one of the one of the features they said the pastor spoke for 15 they said the pastor spoke for 15 they said the pastor spoke for 15 minutes minutes minutes >> didn't even give a proper older call 100 >> didn't even give a proper older call 100 >> didn't even give a proper older call 100 people came forward and you couldn't the people came forward and you couldn't the people came forward and you couldn't the damn broke and there was nothing you damn broke and there was nothing you damn broke and there was nothing you could do in seasons of moves of God like could do in seasons of moves of God like could do in seasons of moves of God like that no one's looking for an hour that no one's looking for an hour that no one's looking for an hour exposition on you know Ephesians 3 God's exposition on you know Ephesians 3 God's exposition on you know Ephesians 3 God's there there there um so yeah I think it's a lot of it is um so yeah I think it's a lot of it is um so yeah I think it's a lot of it is about prayer and um you know every time about prayer and um you know every time about prayer and um you know every time we preach we someone praying during the we preach we someone praying during the we preach we someone praying during the service. There's people under the floor service. There's people under the floor service. There's people under the floor like Spoon's old boiler room in the like Spoon's old boiler room in the like Spoon's old boiler room in the chapel next door. There is a team chapel next door. There is a team chapel next door. There is a team praying while I'm preaching. Holy praying while I'm preaching. Holy praying while I'm preaching. Holy Spirit, come in. You know, uh, one Spirit, come in. You know, uh, one Spirit, come in. You know, uh, one Thessalonians, we know, brothers and Thessalonians, we know, brothers and Thessalonians, we know, brothers and sisters, loved by God that he's chosen sisters, loved by God that he's chosen sisters, loved by God that he's chosen you because our gospel came to you. Not

you because our gospel came to you. Not you because our gospel came to you. Not simply with word, but power the Holy simply with word, but power the Holy simply with word, but power the Holy Spirit and deep conviction. We're Spirit and deep conviction. We're Spirit and deep conviction. We're praying that that would happen. Power of praying that that would happen. Power of praying that that would happen. Power of the Holy Spirit, deep conviction. So, I the Holy Spirit, deep conviction. So, I the Holy Spirit, deep conviction. So, I think it's really about think it's really about think it's really about uh intercession connected to the to the uh intercession connected to the to the uh intercession connected to the to the word rather than just how we're redoing word rather than just how we're redoing word rather than just how we're redoing it. I have a you we both teach preaching it. I have a you we both teach preaching it. I have a you we both teach preaching and communication. and communication. and communication. >> We both have courses. >> We both have courses. >> We both have courses. >> Yeah. I um I have a 10-step process I >> Yeah. I um I have a 10-step process I >> Yeah. I um I have a 10-step process I run every sermon through. That hasn't run every sermon through. That hasn't run every sermon through. That hasn't really changed, really changed, really changed, >> but my level of prayer for that has >> but my level of prayer for that has >> but my level of prayer for that has really changed. really changed. really changed. >> How do you pray differently? >> How do you pray differently? >> How do you pray differently? >> I'm I'm praying with expectation. Wow. >> I'm I'm praying with expectation. Wow. >> I'm I'm praying with expectation. Wow. You know, so he's a classic. Yeah. You know, so he's a classic. Yeah. You know, so he's a classic. Yeah. Classic story. Frederick Bner, one of Classic story. Frederick Bner, one of Classic story. Frederick Bner, one of the great authors, the great authors, the great authors, >> great preacher, Presbyterian. >> great preacher, Presbyterian. >> great preacher, Presbyterian. >> Yep. Um, he became a Christian in the >> Yep. Um, he became a Christian in the >> Yep. Um, he became a Christian in the upper east side in a Presbyterian church upper east side in a Presbyterian church upper east side in a Presbyterian church here. here. here. >> Really? >> Really? >> Really? >> Yeah. In his early 20s, he was a >> Yeah. In his early 20s, he was a >> Yeah. In his early 20s, he was a breakout author, had a book, did well, breakout author, had a book, did well, breakout author, had a book, did well, made it into New York's made it into New York's made it into New York's >> uh, illiterati. He's he's a cultural >> uh, illiterati. He's he's a cultural >> uh, illiterati. He's he's a cultural elite. Then he struggled. Um, he hears elite. Then he struggled. Um, he hears elite. Then he struggled. Um, he hears about a preacher who is not a good about a preacher who is not a good about a preacher who is not a good communicator, but is a magician with communicator, but is a magician with communicator, but is a magician with words. And in one of the sermons, he words. And in one of the sermons, he words. And in one of the sermons, he talked about what it was like to talked about what it was like to talked about what it was like to encounter God. And he and he used three encounter God. And he and he used three encounter God. And he and he used three words. The preacher used three words words. The preacher used three words words. The preacher used three words talking about wrestling with God. And talking about wrestling with God. And talking about wrestling with God. And the the words with great laughter. And the the words with great laughter. And the the words with great laughter. And Beerness said they came like a bolt of Beerness said they came like a bolt of Beerness said they came like a bolt of thunder from from the pulpit to his thunder from from the pulpit to his thunder from from the pulpit to his heart where he had never thought before heart where he had never thought before heart where he had never thought before that life with God could include that life with God could include that life with God could include laughter. And he gave his life to Jesus laughter. And he gave his life to Jesus laughter. And he gave his life to Jesus because of words in a sermon. It wasn't because of words in a sermon. It wasn't because of words in a sermon. It wasn't just those words. It was power. M just those words. It was power. M just those words. It was power. M >> there was power coming from the pulpit

>> there was power coming from the pulpit >> there was power coming from the pulpit piercing the heart. So I'm I am I am piercing the heart. So I'm I am I am piercing the heart. So I'm I am I am praying for power to be released. You praying for power to be released. You praying for power to be released. You read the accounts of Jonathan Edwards read the accounts of Jonathan Edwards read the accounts of Jonathan Edwards and he's he's giving these monotone and he's he's giving these monotone and he's he's giving these monotone sermons sermons sermons >> where I I got in a car and drove up and >> where I I got in a car and drove up and >> where I I got in a car and drove up and stood I think it's in Enfield stood I think it's in Enfield stood I think it's in Enfield >> u Massachusetts where he preached >> u Massachusetts where he preached >> u Massachusetts where he preached sinners in the hands of an angry god. sinners in the hands of an angry god. sinners in the hands of an angry god. It's outside like an apartment complex. It's outside like an apartment complex. It's outside like an apartment complex. There's a rock on a piece of grass. And There's a rock on a piece of grass. And There's a rock on a piece of grass. And I stood there just, you know, he I stood there just, you know, he I stood there just, you know, he preached a lot on the love of God, but preached a lot on the love of God, but preached a lot on the love of God, but people were holding on to the rails like people were holding on to the rails like people were holding on to the rails like they were falling into hell. they were falling into hell. they were falling into hell. You don't see that too often, but you do You don't see that too often, but you do You don't see that too often, but you do see that in times of revival. I'm asking see that in times of revival. I'm asking see that in times of revival. I'm asking that, Lord, mark people. I pray your that, Lord, mark people. I pray your that, Lord, mark people. I pray your word would be like a hammer that breaks word would be like a hammer that breaks word would be like a hammer that breaks the rock. I pray it will be living and the rock. I pray it will be living and the rock. I pray it will be living and active like a double-edged sword. You active like a double-edged sword. You active like a double-edged sword. You know, in in Hebrews 4 when it talks know, in in Hebrews 4 when it talks know, in in Hebrews 4 when it talks about the Bible being living and active, about the Bible being living and active, about the Bible being living and active, it says that uh we may be exposed it says that uh we may be exposed it says that uh we may be exposed and everyone will give an account to and everyone will give an account to and everyone will give an account to God. So, it's like the word opens you God. So, it's like the word opens you God. So, it's like the word opens you up. In Greek, that has the idea of a man up. In Greek, that has the idea of a man up. In Greek, that has the idea of a man in court who's been sentenced. This in court who's been sentenced. This in court who's been sentenced. This isn't a shame culture isn't a shame culture isn't a shame culture >> where people would bow their heads, but >> where people would bow their heads, but >> where people would bow their heads, but in a shame culture, they wanted you to in a shame culture, they wanted you to in a shame culture, they wanted you to look at it. So, they would put a dagger look at it. So, they would put a dagger look at it. So, they would put a dagger on your throat, making you have to look on your throat, making you have to look on your throat, making you have to look and receive your verdict. And that idea and receive your verdict. And that idea and receive your verdict. And that idea of being exposed is that in the Greek of being exposed is that in the Greek of being exposed is that in the Greek which literally means the word of God which literally means the word of God which literally means the word of God it's cutting you open. You have to hear it's cutting you open. You have to hear it's cutting you open. You have to hear this. You cannot ignore this. I mean this. You cannot ignore this. I mean this. You cannot ignore this. I mean that is a different kind of preaching that is a different kind of preaching that is a different kind of preaching than your typical homaly. The other than your typical homaly. The other than your typical homaly. The other thing I would say that's connected to

thing I would say that's connected to thing I would say that's connected to this is a little bit of an at your best this is a little bit of an at your best this is a little bit of an at your best riff. Okay. But athletes riff. Okay. But athletes riff. Okay. But athletes peak. They will organize their week to peak. They will organize their week to peak. They will organize their week to peak for three hours on a Saturday or peak for three hours on a Saturday or peak for three hours on a Saturday or Sunday. Sunday. Sunday. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> When they're playing. >> When they're playing. >> When they're playing. >> And most pastors are exhausted from a >> And most pastors are exhausted from a >> And most pastors are exhausted from a week of ministry. And they are week of ministry. And they are week of ministry. And they are >> never thought of that. >> never thought of that. >> never thought of that. >> They are limping into the pullpit. I am >> They are limping into the pullpit. I am >> They are limping into the pullpit. I am trying to des I'm not saying that trying to des I'm not saying that trying to des I'm not saying that preaching is more important than preaching is more important than preaching is more important than everything else, but I'm saying everything else, but I'm saying everything else, but I'm saying >> the apostles might have thought it is. >> the apostles might have thought it is. >> the apostles might have thought it is. >> It matters. >> It matters. >> It matters. >> Yes. Well, act six, you devote yourself >> Yes. Well, act six, you devote yourself >> Yes. Well, act six, you devote yourself >> 100%. I'm trying to structure my week >> 100%. I'm trying to structure my week >> 100%. I'm trying to structure my week where I'm peing with spiritual power on where I'm peing with spiritual power on where I'm peing with spiritual power on Sunday, not limping in out of Sunday, not limping in out of Sunday, not limping in out of exhaustion. That is a different thing exhaustion. That is a different thing exhaustion. That is a different thing about structuring your heart, your about structuring your heart, your about structuring your heart, your energy, and your week. Well, not to energy, and your week. Well, not to energy, and your week. Well, not to overquote Keller, but in preaching, he overquote Keller, but in preaching, he overquote Keller, but in preaching, he talks about the difference between a talks about the difference between a talks about the difference between a good sermon and a good uh preaching. I'm good sermon and a good uh preaching. I'm good sermon and a good uh preaching. I'm trying to remember the exact phrasing, trying to remember the exact phrasing, trying to remember the exact phrasing, right? right? right? >> And he said, I think he was talking >> And he said, I think he was talking >> And he said, I think he was talking about Whitfield. He was saying, you about Whitfield. He was saying, you about Whitfield. He was saying, you know, there was another preacher and he know, there was another preacher and he know, there was another preacher and he always had a good sermon, but he didn't always had a good sermon, but he didn't always had a good sermon, but he didn't always have good preaching. Um, always have good preaching. Um, always have good preaching. Um, Whitfield didn't always have a good Whitfield didn't always have a good Whitfield didn't always have a good sermon, but he always had good sermon, but he always had good sermon, but he always had good preaching. And it's a difference between preaching. And it's a difference between preaching. And it's a difference between probably prep, uncction, what happens in probably prep, uncction, what happens in probably prep, uncction, what happens in the room, because you and I can take the the room, because you and I can take the the room, because you and I can take the same manuscript.

same manuscript. same manuscript. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Word for word, internalize it. You can >> Word for word, internalize it. You can >> Word for word, internalize it. You can give it with great power. I can give it give it with great power. I can give it give it with great power. I can give it at false plat. And there's something at false plat. And there's something at false plat. And there's something that happens. And you know, we've all that happens. And you know, we've all that happens. And you know, we've all you've had this experience where you you've had this experience where you you've had this experience where you thought, I bombed, people come to faith. thought, I bombed, people come to faith. thought, I bombed, people come to faith. Other times, you think you're crushing Other times, you think you're crushing Other times, you think you're crushing it, nothing happens. There is that that it, nothing happens. There is that that it, nothing happens. There is that that thing that only the Holy Spirit can thing that only the Holy Spirit can thing that only the Holy Spirit can bring. bring. bring. >> Now, we're getting a little charismatic >> Now, we're getting a little charismatic >> Now, we're getting a little charismatic here. Now, we're talking about the here. Now, we're talking about the here. Now, we're talking about the anointing. anointing. anointing. >> That's right. There is the word >> That's right. There is the word >> That's right. There is the word anointing. anointing. anointing. >> I think sometimes >> I think sometimes >> I think sometimes I I think there will be a sense I I think there will be a sense I I think there will be a sense >> sometimes you feel like it falls flat, >> sometimes you feel like it falls flat, >> sometimes you feel like it falls flat, but there's a person in the room who God but there's a person in the room who God but there's a person in the room who God loves. So because of God's love for the loves. So because of God's love for the loves. So because of God's love for the person receiving the word, he just person receiving the word, he just person receiving the word, he just ministers them that word in power. ministers them that word in power. ministers them that word in power. >> That's about the receiver. I think >> That's about the receiver. I think >> That's about the receiver. I think there's other times where you're walking there's other times where you're walking there's other times where you're walking with God with such intimacy that there with God with such intimacy that there with God with such intimacy that there is an anointing on whatever you preach is an anointing on whatever you preach is an anointing on whatever you preach because it's connected to your life and because it's connected to your life and because it's connected to your life and that's an overflow from the secret that's an overflow from the secret that's an overflow from the secret place. One of my uh resolves of 2025 place. One of my uh resolves of 2025 place. One of my uh resolves of 2025 was pleading for anointing and then was pleading for anointing and then was pleading for anointing and then in every sermon I preached giving space in every sermon I preached giving space in every sermon I preached giving space for a response to the power of God. So for a response to the power of God. So for a response to the power of God. So that's like I've I don't think I've that's like I've I don't think I've that's like I've I don't think I've preached certainly on a Sunday where preached certainly on a Sunday where preached certainly on a Sunday where we've not had some kind of space to we've not had some kind of space to we've not had some kind of space to encounter the power of God based on the encounter the power of God based on the encounter the power of God based on the word. And it's a little bit like Lord word. And it's a little bit like Lord word. And it's a little bit like Lord you know I am prayed up prepared walking you know I am prayed up prepared walking you know I am prayed up prepared walking with you consecrated studied and showed

with you consecrated studied and showed with you consecrated studied and showed myself approved. myself approved. myself approved. Now it is your job to authenticate this Now it is your job to authenticate this Now it is your job to authenticate this message. And I say things I try and warn message. And I say things I try and warn message. And I say things I try and warn the congregation. The words you have the congregation. The words you have the congregation. The words you have just heard have started revolutions and just heard have started revolutions and just heard have started revolutions and reformations. The words you have just reformations. The words you have just reformations. The words you have just heard have changed the hearts of the heard have changed the hearts of the heard have changed the hearts of the most hardened atheists. The words you've most hardened atheists. The words you've most hardened atheists. The words you've heard our life now spirit of God come heard our life now spirit of God come heard our life now spirit of God come and do that in the room. You know you're and do that in the room. You know you're and do that in the room. You know you're calling God to you know change things. calling God to you know change things. calling God to you know change things. It is my vision. Beatnner who you know It is my vision. Beatnner who you know It is my vision. Beatnner who you know is a was a wonderful author had a is a was a wonderful author had a is a was a wonderful author had a breathtaking way of reaching the heart. breathtaking way of reaching the heart. breathtaking way of reaching the heart. I'm like, Lord, raise up a hundred I'm like, Lord, raise up a hundred I'm like, Lord, raise up a hundred beaters in my church because they've beaters in my church because they've beaters in my church because they've heard your word in the same way. You heard your word in the same way. You heard your word in the same way. You know, you're you're wanting God to do know, you're you're wanting God to do know, you're you're wanting God to do that. What I'm hoping for, um, God will that. What I'm hoping for, um, God will that. What I'm hoping for, um, God will always use leaders in revival because he always use leaders in revival because he always use leaders in revival because he uses people. That's his method. But I am uses people. That's his method. But I am uses people. That's his method. But I am asking for a kind of power that is not asking for a kind of power that is not asking for a kind of power that is not centralized in one location or church centralized in one location or church centralized in one location or church where you can't quite tell what it's where you can't quite tell what it's where you can't quite tell what it's where it's coming from. It's in a whole where it's coming from. It's in a whole where it's coming from. It's in a whole region. And so God gets all the glory. region. And so God gets all the glory. region. And so God gets all the glory. And there may be some like little hot And there may be some like little hot And there may be some like little hot spots, but it's not like that guy is so spots, but it's not like that guy is so spots, but it's not like that guy is so anointed.

anointed. anointed. >> That guy that preaching. Yeah. >> That guy that preaching. Yeah. >> That guy that preaching. Yeah. >> Mhm. Okay. I want to come back to that. >> Mhm. Okay. I want to come back to that. >> Mhm. Okay. I want to come back to that. This episode is brought to you by Glue. This episode is brought to you by Glue. This episode is brought to you by Glue. So you probably use chat GPT. But have So you probably use chat GPT. But have So you probably use chat GPT. But have you ever wondered where those answers you ever wondered where those answers you ever wondered where those answers are coming from or if you can trust them are coming from or if you can trust them are coming from or if you can trust them even beyond like hallucinations? That's even beyond like hallucinations? That's even beyond like hallucinations? That's why I'm excited about what Glue has why I'm excited about what Glue has why I'm excited about what Glue has built. It's called Glue AI Chat. So built. It's called Glue AI Chat. So built. It's called Glue AI Chat. So Devin Klein from the Glue team is here. Devin Klein from the Glue team is here. Devin Klein from the Glue team is here. Devon, what makes Glue AI Chat Devon, what makes Glue AI Chat Devon, what makes Glue AI Chat different? different? different? >> Hey, Carrie. Uh, Glue AI Chat gives you >> Hey, Carrie. Uh, Glue AI Chat gives you >> Hey, Carrie. Uh, Glue AI Chat gives you the power of AI, but from a trusted the power of AI, but from a trusted the power of AI, but from a trusted faith-based source. It's actually built faith-based source. It's actually built faith-based source. It's actually built for Christians. So, you're not getting for Christians. So, you're not getting for Christians. So, you're not getting random internet answers. You're getting random internet answers. You're getting random internet answers. You're getting responses that are thoughtful, aligned responses that are thoughtful, aligned responses that are thoughtful, aligned with biblical values, and actually with biblical values, and actually with biblical values, and actually helpful on real life stuff like helpful on real life stuff like helpful on real life stuff like parenting, relationships, leadership, parenting, relationships, leadership, parenting, relationships, leadership, and faith questions. and faith questions. and faith questions. >> So, basically, it's a trained model. >> So, basically, it's a trained model. >> So, basically, it's a trained model. It's trained specifically on on basic It's trained specifically on on basic It's trained specifically on on basic theology, which is awesome. So, if theology, which is awesome. So, if theology, which is awesome. So, if you're looking for AI that aligns with you're looking for AI that aligns with you're looking for AI that aligns with what you believe, you might want to what you believe, you might want to what you believe, you might want to check out Glue AI chat. It's really check out Glue AI chat. It's really check out Glue AI chat. It's really different than what you're going to find different than what you're going to find different than what you're going to find in the mainline. And best of all, it's in the mainline. And best of all, it's in the mainline. And best of all, it's totally free. So, how do you get it?

totally free. So, how do you get it? totally free. So, how do you get it? Well, head on over to Well, head on over to Well, head on over to chat.glue.com/carry. chat.glue.com/carry. chat.glue.com/carry. That's chat.g.com/cy. And try it today. So, anything else on And try it today. So, anything else on teaching in a revival? Because there's teaching in a revival? Because there's teaching in a revival? Because there's so many preachers listening, watching so many preachers listening, watching so many preachers listening, watching right now. Any other notes for those of right now. Any other notes for those of right now. Any other notes for those of us? Because I'm preaching this weekend, us? Because I'm preaching this weekend, us? Because I'm preaching this weekend, so I'm like taking notes. You don't know so I'm like taking notes. You don't know so I'm like taking notes. You don't know what what what >> Martin Luther Jones says. Uh, every >> Martin Luther Jones says. Uh, every >> Martin Luther Jones says. Uh, every revival comes with a new kind of revival comes with a new kind of revival comes with a new kind of preaching. preaching. preaching. >> And it is a again it's a it's a spirit. >> And it is a again it's a it's a spirit. >> And it is a again it's a it's a spirit. It's the same same word It's the same same word It's the same same word spirit empowered. D Moody uh you know he spirit empowered. D Moody uh you know he spirit empowered. D Moody uh you know he came to New York believe he was going to came to New York believe he was going to came to New York believe he was going to see AB Simpson because there was a move see AB Simpson because there was a move see AB Simpson because there was a move of God happening with the Christian of God happening with the Christian of God happening with the Christian Missionary Alliance. He came to hear Missionary Alliance. He came to hear Missionary Alliance. He came to hear Simpson speak and he was filled with the Simpson speak and he was filled with the Simpson speak and he was filled with the Holy Spirit in lower Manhattan. He said Holy Spirit in lower Manhattan. He said Holy Spirit in lower Manhattan. He said he was so overwhelmed with the presence he was so overwhelmed with the presence he was so overwhelmed with the presence of God. It's sacred moment. He didn't of God. It's sacred moment. He didn't of God. It's sacred moment. He didn't want to talk about it but he had to ask want to talk about it but he had to ask want to talk about it but he had to ask God to stop it. And I've tried God to stop it. And I've tried God to stop it. And I've tried everywhere to find that location. If you everywhere to find that location. If you everywhere to find that location. If you know where that is hit me up. Um, but know where that is hit me up. Um, but know where that is hit me up. Um, but anyway, it says afterward he preached anyway, it says afterward he preached anyway, it says afterward he preached the same sermons and before dozens came the same sermons and before dozens came the same sermons and before dozens came to Christ, afterward thousands came to to Christ, afterward thousands came to to Christ, afterward thousands came to Christ. There was just an anointing that Christ. There was just an anointing that Christ. There was just an anointing that came on him. There was a pivot in Billy came on him. There was a pivot in Billy came on him. There was a pivot in Billy Graham's time, too, where it went from a Graham's time, too, where it went from a Graham's time, too, where it went from a few people responding to everybody few people responding to everybody few people responding to everybody responding. Same message. I I think his responding. Same message. I I think his responding. Same message. I I think his was I I I could be wrong here, but his was I I I could be wrong here, but his was I I I could be wrong here, but his was around he had another friend of his was around he had another friend of his was around he had another friend of his who was an evangelist, more gifted than who was an evangelist, more gifted than who was an evangelist, more gifted than him who started.

him who started. him who started. >> It was a Canadian uh friend Charles >> It was a Canadian uh friend Charles >> It was a Canadian uh friend Charles Templeton. Templeton. Templeton. >> Yeah, Templeton. And he he became >> Yeah, Templeton. And he he became >> Yeah, Templeton. And he he became basically basically basically uh a critic of the Bible. uh a critic of the Bible. uh a critic of the Bible. >> He did. And Graham said, "I'm going to >> He did. And Graham said, "I'm going to >> He did. And Graham said, "I'm going to trust God's word." And apparently it was trust God's word." And apparently it was trust God's word." And apparently it was that trust in the confidence of the word that trust in the confidence of the word that trust in the confidence of the word >> that facilitated that. But Martin Lloyd >> that facilitated that. But Martin Lloyd >> that facilitated that. But Martin Lloyd Jones was controversial. I'm reading Jones was controversial. I'm reading Jones was controversial. I'm reading right now Joy Unspeakable is his book on right now Joy Unspeakable is his book on right now Joy Unspeakable is his book on uh the baptism of the spirit. uh the baptism of the spirit. uh the baptism of the spirit. Um Um Um again this is the same thing with Duncan again this is the same thing with Duncan again this is the same thing with Duncan Campbell. They seem to indicate I mean Campbell. They seem to indicate I mean Campbell. They seem to indicate I mean my theology is one baptism many my theology is one baptism many my theology is one baptism many fillings. They were filled on Pentecost fillings. They were filled on Pentecost fillings. They were filled on Pentecost and then Acts chapter 4 they're all and then Acts chapter 4 they're all and then Acts chapter 4 they're all filled again. The building is seems like filled again. The building is seems like filled again. The building is seems like you you will face things you need fresh you you will face things you need fresh you you will face things you need fresh power for. But it does seem in moves of power for. But it does seem in moves of power for. But it does seem in moves of God there's this anointing that comes on God there's this anointing that comes on God there's this anointing that comes on people to declare the word. Uh, I was people to declare the word. Uh, I was people to declare the word. Uh, I was reading last night um about in Barton reading last night um about in Barton reading last night um about in Barton Stones revival down in Kentucky, Kain Stones revival down in Kentucky, Kain Stones revival down in Kentucky, Kain Ridge, the story about a 7-year-old girl Ridge, the story about a 7-year-old girl Ridge, the story about a 7-year-old girl sitting on a man's shoulders preaching sitting on a man's shoulders preaching sitting on a man's shoulders preaching till she was exhausted till she was exhausted till she was exhausted and almost collapsed. And they had these and almost collapsed. And they had these and almost collapsed. And they had these preaching stations with this people preaching stations with this people preaching stations with this people standing up and preaching, 20,000 standing up and preaching, 20,000 standing up and preaching, 20,000 people. the power of God. They called uh people. the power of God. They called uh people. the power of God. They called uh they called it America's Pentecost. Cain they called it America's Pentecost. Cain they called it America's Pentecost. Cain Ridge that seemed to come with some sort Ridge that seemed to come with some sort Ridge that seemed to come with some sort of uncction and anointing with of uncction and anointing with of uncction and anointing with preaching. So yeah, all I would say is preaching. So yeah, all I would say is preaching. So yeah, all I would say is be holy, be holy, be holy, prayerful, expectant, create space for prayerful, expectant, create space for prayerful, expectant, create space for God to move. But that that you know, God to move. But that that you know, God to move. But that that you know, Spurgeon, I heard this

Spurgeon, I heard this Spurgeon, I heard this >> 16 steps uh in the London tabernacle >> 16 steps uh in the London tabernacle >> 16 steps uh in the London tabernacle leading up to the pulpit and each one he leading up to the pulpit and each one he leading up to the pulpit and each one he would say, "I believe in the Holy would say, "I believe in the Holy would say, "I believe in the Holy Spirit. I believe in the Holy Spirit. I Spirit. I believe in the Holy Spirit. I Spirit. I believe in the Holy Spirit. I believe in the Holy Spirit." and he believe in the Holy Spirit." and he believe in the Holy Spirit." and he would mount the pulpit with prayer would mount the pulpit with prayer would mount the pulpit with prayer underneath him with the boiler room and underneath him with the boiler room and underneath him with the boiler room and then belief in the spirit when he then belief in the spirit when he then belief in the spirit when he proclaimed God's word. You've heard this proclaimed God's word. You've heard this proclaimed God's word. You've heard this story. Spurgeon had an anointing when story. Spurgeon had an anointing when story. Spurgeon had an anointing when they were building when they were doing they were building when they were doing they were building when they were doing renovations on his building to test the renovations on his building to test the renovations on his building to test the mic where he's going to preach. He mic where he's going to preach. He mic where he's going to preach. He yelled out, "Behold the lamb of God who yelled out, "Behold the lamb of God who yelled out, "Behold the lamb of God who takes away from the sins of the takes takes away from the sins of the takes takes away from the sins of the takes away the sins of the world." And two away the sins of the world." And two away the sins of the world." And two guys working up in the rafters. One of guys working up in the rafters. One of guys working up in the rafters. One of them got converted by him simply saying them got converted by him simply saying them got converted by him simply saying that verse. You know what that is, mate? that verse. You know what that is, mate? that verse. You know what that is, mate? Anointing. Anointing. Anointing. >> That is anointing. One of the things >> That is anointing. One of the things >> That is anointing. One of the things that um tell me whether I'm mistaken on that um tell me whether I'm mistaken on that um tell me whether I'm mistaken on this, but you know, we've mentioned a this, but you know, we've mentioned a this, but you know, we've mentioned a lot of well-known people, but they're lot of well-known people, but they're lot of well-known people, but they're not necessarily celebrities. We live in not necessarily celebrities. We live in not necessarily celebrities. We live in a celebrity pastor age. I am, you know, a celebrity pastor age. I am, you know, a celebrity pastor age. I am, you know, selfish and egoomaniacal enough to know selfish and egoomaniacal enough to know selfish and egoomaniacal enough to know that a younger version of me and that a younger version of me and that a younger version of me and hopefully not a current version of me, hopefully not a current version of me, hopefully not a current version of me, well, maybe it's going to come through well, maybe it's going to come through well, maybe it's going to come through me, right? We've had those thoughts as me, right? We've had those thoughts as me, right? We've had those thoughts as pastors. Um, doesn't seem like that's pastors. Um, doesn't seem like that's pastors. Um, doesn't seem like that's what Gen Z is looking for. They're not what Gen Z is looking for. They're not what Gen Z is looking for. They're not looking for a celebrity to follow.

looking for a celebrity to follow. looking for a celebrity to follow. They're not looking for that kind of They're not looking for that kind of They're not looking for that kind of thing. What can you tell us about thing. What can you tell us about thing. What can you tell us about um leadership um leadership um leadership and a move of God slashrevival? and a move of God slashrevival? and a move of God slashrevival? What are the healthy characteristics? What are the healthy characteristics? What are the healthy characteristics? The um fake versions, you know, where I The um fake versions, you know, where I The um fake versions, you know, where I got a revival going on over here, got a revival going on over here, got a revival going on over here, everybody. Um, I' I'd love to because we everybody. Um, I' I'd love to because we everybody. Um, I' I'd love to because we live in a cultural moment where it'd be live in a cultural moment where it'd be live in a cultural moment where it'd be very easy and you see this on social very easy and you see this on social very easy and you see this on social media sometimes where people are media sometimes where people are media sometimes where people are claiming revival. Um, I'm just curious claiming revival. Um, I'm just curious claiming revival. Um, I'm just curious about celebrity culture and revival. about celebrity culture and revival. about celebrity culture and revival. George Whitfield was the most famous man George Whitfield was the most famous man George Whitfield was the most famous man of his generation. I mean, he was famous of his generation. I mean, he was famous of his generation. I mean, he was famous um, in the world. Evan Roberts had, if um, in the world. Evan Roberts had, if um, in the world. Evan Roberts had, if you go to Mariah Chapel, you go to Mariah Chapel, you go to Mariah Chapel, I mean, there's cups with Evan Roberts I mean, there's cups with Evan Roberts I mean, there's cups with Evan Roberts on the cups, man. I mean, you can you on the cups, man. I mean, you can you on the cups, man. I mean, you can you can never fully separate leadership. God can never fully separate leadership. God can never fully separate leadership. God uses people. Um, so you know, you hear uses people. Um, so you know, you hear uses people. Um, so you know, you hear about things like nameless, faceless. I about things like nameless, faceless. I about things like nameless, faceless. I that's not even biblical. It's a it's a that's not even biblical. It's a it's a that's not even biblical. It's a it's a genu it's a sincere attempt.

genu it's a sincere attempt. genu it's a sincere attempt. >> Yeah. I've heard that with Gen Z saying >> Yeah. I've heard that with Gen Z saying >> Yeah. I've heard that with Gen Z saying we want no names, we want no faces, we we want no names, we want no faces, we we want no names, we want no faces, we want no credit. want no credit. want no credit. >> Yeah. I mean, I love that. Um that's >> Yeah. I mean, I love that. Um that's >> Yeah. I mean, I love that. Um that's just God uses people now just God uses people now just God uses people now >> because leadership is a spiritual gift. >> because leadership is a spiritual gift. >> because leadership is a spiritual gift. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Like most people don't have it. Some >> Like most people don't have it. Some >> Like most people don't have it. Some people people people >> Wesley and Methodism, Calvin and >> Wesley and Methodism, Calvin and >> Wesley and Methodism, Calvin and Presbyterianism. Presbyterianism. Presbyterianism. >> There's something to it. >> There's something to it. >> There's something to it. >> Yeah. Or no. >> Yeah. Or no. >> Yeah. Or no. >> Um the problem is modern society's >> Um the problem is modern society's >> Um the problem is modern society's desire to make people into celebrities. desire to make people into celebrities. desire to make people into celebrities. Um Um Um >> so you've got to again how do you >> so you've got to again how do you >> so you've got to again how do you leverage the leadership gift and not leverage the leadership gift and not leverage the leadership gift and not bury it out of fear? And then how do you bury it out of fear? And then how do you bury it out of fear? And then how do you not turn that into a celebrity? that not turn that into a celebrity? that not turn that into a celebrity? that that's uh it's it's a little bit like that's uh it's it's a little bit like that's uh it's it's a little bit like asking it's like um trying to direct a asking it's like um trying to direct a asking it's like um trying to direct a hurricane, mate. No one's in charge of hurricane, mate. No one's in charge of hurricane, mate. No one's in charge of the hurricane. God will have certain the hurricane. God will have certain the hurricane. God will have certain people who may give weather reports who people who may give weather reports who people who may give weather reports who get some attention. Um but it is very get some attention. Um but it is very get some attention. Um but it is very very hard to direct a hurricane. So I very hard to direct a hurricane. So I very hard to direct a hurricane. So I would just say, yeah, you you did would just say, yeah, you you did would just say, yeah, you you did mention a good point. You know, you'll mention a good point. You know, you'll mention a good point. You know, you'll go through a series of tests before God go through a series of tests before God go through a series of tests before God can use you as a leader. And um so I can use you as a leader. And um so I can use you as a leader. And um so I don't think um you can violate those don't think um you can violate those don't think um you can violate those tests. And and part of the challenge of tests. And and part of the challenge of tests. And and part of the challenge of of of media is there can be a sense that of of media is there can be a sense that of of media is there can be a sense that more is happening than you think. It can more is happening than you think. It can more is happening than you think. It can create ungodly FOMO that we're missing create ungodly FOMO that we're missing create ungodly FOMO that we're missing out which can make you scramble in the out which can make you scramble in the out which can make you scramble in the fresh the flesh to make something fresh the flesh to make something fresh the flesh to make something happening and that will just be a happening and that will just be a happening and that will just be a dumpster fire of of works. So you've got dumpster fire of of works. So you've got dumpster fire of of works. So you've got to guard against that. I mean, I'm to guard against that. I mean, I'm to guard against that. I mean, I'm you've got to guard your heart. And

you've got to guard your heart. And you've got to guard your heart. And >> you know, the classic I think I can >> you know, the classic I think I can >> you know, the classic I think I can genuinely say, genuinely say, genuinely say, >> so I I'm here's my current level of >> so I I'm here's my current level of >> so I I'm here's my current level of sanctification. Okay. If a move of God sanctification. Okay. If a move of God sanctification. Okay. If a move of God happened at Redeemer Lincoln Square and happened at Redeemer Lincoln Square and happened at Redeemer Lincoln Square and our church was not the center of it, I our church was not the center of it, I our church was not the center of it, I would genuinely rejoice in that. But if would genuinely rejoice in that. But if would genuinely rejoice in that. But if they did not let me in the room to they did not let me in the room to they did not let me in the room to experience it, I'd never forgive them. experience it, I'd never forgive them. experience it, I'd never forgive them. So, but I think I'm at that point. Yeah. So, but I think I'm at that point. Yeah. So, but I think I'm at that point. Yeah. In your early years, like you want it to In your early years, like you want it to In your early years, like you want it to be you. That's just a part of young be you. That's just a part of young be you. That's just a part of young person's psychology. person's psychology. person's psychology. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're 30. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're 30. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're 30. >> But you get filtered out of that and >> But you get filtered out of that and >> But you get filtered out of that and you're like, God, I just want to see you you're like, God, I just want to see you you're like, God, I just want to see you do it. And what I'm praying for, do it. And what I'm praying for, do it. And what I'm praying for, >> I'm praying for a move of God, not a >> I'm praying for a move of God, not a >> I'm praying for a move of God, not a move of John. You know what I mean? move of John. You know what I mean? move of John. You know what I mean? Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, >> I'm praying for something so big that >> I'm praying for something so big that >> I'm praying for something so big that I'm I'm praying for a regional, I'm I'm praying for a regional, I'm I'm praying for a regional, national, global visitation, national, global visitation, national, global visitation, but you can't no one gets the credit in but you can't no one gets the credit in but you can't no one gets the credit in the same. You know, I will say this, the the same. You know, I will say this, the the same. You know, I will say this, the other thing to to keep in mind is the other thing to to keep in mind is the other thing to to keep in mind is the standards you determine success by are standards you determine success by are standards you determine success by are massive. And I've shared this with our massive. And I've shared this with our massive. And I've shared this with our folks a lot. Uh I just was reading about folks a lot. Uh I just was reading about folks a lot. Uh I just was reading about revival in China. I mean, there's revival in China. I mean, there's revival in China. I mean, there's there's there's people in China that there's there's people in China that there's there's people in China that have churches with a population of the have churches with a population of the have churches with a population of the size of Manhattan.

size of Manhattan. size of Manhattan. >> So, you're going to feel good about >> So, you're going to feel good about >> So, you're going to feel good about >> 10, 12, 15 million people. >> 10, 12, 15 million people. >> 10, 12, 15 million people. >> Yeah. You're going to feel good about >> Yeah. You're going to feel good about >> Yeah. You're going to feel good about yourselves because um you know, you got yourselves because um you know, you got yourselves because um you know, you got a little bit of growth in moment in the a little bit of growth in moment in the a little bit of growth in moment in the last few years. It's like a wake up. last few years. It's like a wake up. last few years. It's like a wake up. You're going to get to heaven and You're going to get to heaven and You're going to get to heaven and they'll be like, "Oh, great, man. Praise they'll be like, "Oh, great, man. Praise they'll be like, "Oh, great, man. Praise the Lord." But they're probably so the Lord." But they're probably so the Lord." But they're probably so humbled they'll celebrate you. My simple humbled they'll celebrate you. My simple humbled they'll celebrate you. My simple point is by what standard? And uh again, point is by what standard? And uh again, point is by what standard? And uh again, you've got to know your call, the upward you've got to know your call, the upward you've got to know your call, the upward call of God on your life. You got to get call of God on your life. You got to get call of God on your life. You got to get the flesh out of it, the desire for the flesh out of it, the desire for the flesh out of it, the desire for attention and recognition. And then you attention and recognition. And then you attention and recognition. And then you got to get so desperate that you just got to get so desperate that you just got to get so desperate that you just cease caring. And then you just got to cease caring. And then you just got to cease caring. And then you just got to say, Lord, whatever it takes, whoever it say, Lord, whatever it takes, whoever it say, Lord, whatever it takes, whoever it is, here I am. Use me. Send me to is, here I am. Use me. Send me to is, here I am. Use me. Send me to whatever degree you want. And there's whatever degree you want. And there's whatever degree you want. And there's going to take thousands of us to steward going to take thousands of us to steward going to take thousands of us to steward what it is you want to do. So the older what it is you want to do. So the older what it is you want to do. So the older I get, John, the more I'm testing my I get, John, the more I'm testing my I get, John, the more I'm testing my motives daily, and they're mixed still. motives daily, and they're mixed still. motives daily, and they're mixed still. How do you test your motives? How is How do you test your motives? How is How do you test your motives? How is that moving through your life over the that moving through your life over the that moving through your life over the decades to where you are now? decades to where you are now? decades to where you are now? >> Well, there's things you can proactively >> Well, there's things you can proactively >> Well, there's things you can proactively do. I mean, so there's a whole series of do. I mean, so there's a whole series of do. I mean, so there's a whole series of spiritual practices. spiritual practices. spiritual practices. >> Um, you know, the prayer of examine. I >> Um, you know, the prayer of examine. I >> Um, you know, the prayer of examine. I I've done that basically.

I've done that basically. I've done that basically. >> I mean, I don't know how a practice like >> I mean, I don't know how a practice like >> I mean, I don't know how a practice like that got into my Pentecostal world, but that got into my Pentecostal world, but that got into my Pentecostal world, but it did, it did, it did, >> which is how you open your day and how >> which is how you open your day and how >> which is how you open your day and how you close your day. and asking those you close your day. and asking those you close your day. and asking those questions, Lord, where did I feel far questions, Lord, where did I feel far questions, Lord, where did I feel far from you today? Is there any error I from you today? Is there any error I from you today? Is there any error I displeased you? I I came up in a in a displeased you? I I came up in a in a displeased you? I I came up in a in a church that did that and that really church that did that and that really church that did that and that really impacted me. So, there's proactive impacted me. So, there's proactive impacted me. So, there's proactive things you can do. things you can do. things you can do. >> Lord, why did that bother me? Why did I >> Lord, why did that bother me? Why did I >> Lord, why did that bother me? Why did I say that? Lord, search me. Know me. But say that? Lord, search me. Know me. But say that? Lord, search me. Know me. But then there's this other things that God then there's this other things that God then there's this other things that God does to test you. And um you know, I was does to test you. And um you know, I was does to test you. And um you know, I was reading uh my Bible reading last night reading uh my Bible reading last night reading uh my Bible reading last night where uh Jesus has got a crowd of people where uh Jesus has got a crowd of people where uh Jesus has got a crowd of people and he's going to feed him. And he says and he's going to feed him. And he says and he's going to feed him. And he says he asked him, "What should we do?" only he asked him, "What should we do?" only he asked him, "What should we do?" only tested him to see his response. And I tested him to see his response. And I tested him to see his response. And I was like, "Oh, that's interesting. This was like, "Oh, that's interesting. This was like, "Oh, that's interesting. This is a provision test. Can Jesus provide is a provision test. Can Jesus provide is a provision test. Can Jesus provide out of loaves and fishes for a out of loaves and fishes for a out of loaves and fishes for a multitude? He wants to see his disciples multitude? He wants to see his disciples multitude? He wants to see his disciples response." Jesus will test you. And you response." Jesus will test you. And you response." Jesus will test you. And you can fail those tests. And um so I think can fail those tests. And um so I think can fail those tests. And um so I think God is so kind when you're in one, you God is so kind when you're in one, you God is so kind when you're in one, you know it. So you you'll just be like, "Oh know it. So you you'll just be like, "Oh know it. So you you'll just be like, "Oh gosh, my motives are getting hammered gosh, my motives are getting hammered gosh, my motives are getting hammered here." And my response would be, "Lord, here." And my response would be, "Lord, here." And my response would be, "Lord, I yield to you. This is painful, but I I yield to you. This is painful, but I I yield to you. This is painful, but I choose the crucifform life. I've I I run choose the crucifform life. I've I I run choose the crucifform life. I've I I run towards the altar, no matter how painful towards the altar, no matter how painful towards the altar, no matter how painful it is. I think at this point in my life it is. I think at this point in my life it is. I think at this point in my life as well, late 40s, I see all the as well, late 40s, I see all the as well, late 40s, I see all the casualties of not submitting to the casualties of not submitting to the casualties of not submitting to the discipline and testing. And I'm like, I discipline and testing. And I'm like, I discipline and testing. And I'm like, I choose the pain of discipline rather choose the pain of discipline rather choose the pain of discipline rather than the pain of disgrace. You know, than the pain of disgrace. You know, than the pain of disgrace. You know, it's it's an awkward segment, but I I it's it's an awkward segment, but I I it's it's an awkward segment, but I I listened to this last week and it really listened to this last week and it really listened to this last week and it really shook me. It was Brian Houston doing a

shook me. It was Brian Houston doing a shook me. It was Brian Houston doing a podcast called The Humpty Pastor. I've podcast called The Humpty Pastor. I've podcast called The Humpty Pastor. I've seen it but I haven't listened. seen it but I haven't listened. seen it but I haven't listened. >> Oh man, >> Oh man, >> Oh man, >> that thing is potent. He's got a thing >> that thing is potent. He's got a thing >> that thing is potent. He's got a thing on Proverbs 5 where it talks about uh on Proverbs 5 where it talks about uh on Proverbs 5 where it talks about uh giving into and it says your glory will giving into and it says your glory will giving into and it says your glory will go to another and your years will be go to another and your years will be go to another and your years will be given to the merciless given to the merciless given to the merciless and he talked about the and he talked about the and he talked about the >> it's like self-reflection. >> it's like self-reflection. >> it's like self-reflection. >> Yeah. Yeah. It's him talking about his >> Yeah. Yeah. It's him talking about his >> Yeah. Yeah. It's him talking about his own leadership fail uh failures. It's own leadership fail uh failures. It's own leadership fail uh failures. It's really potent and that whole concept of really potent and that whole concept of really potent and that whole concept of your glory in a godly way. Everything your glory in a godly way. Everything your glory in a godly way. Everything that you've worked on being given to that you've worked on being given to that you've worked on being given to another who will steward it without another who will steward it without another who will steward it without disgracing God and then you being given disgracing God and then you being given disgracing God and then you being given to the merciless. And that internet mob to the merciless. And that internet mob to the merciless. And that internet mob is merciless. is merciless. is merciless. >> They whatever pain you've got, whatever >> They whatever pain you've got, whatever >> They whatever pain you've got, whatever scandal you, they will rub soul into the scandal you, they will rub soul into the scandal you, they will rub soul into the wound. wound. wound. >> And I hear something like that and it it >> And I hear something like that and it it >> And I hear something like that and it it produces zero judgment. produces zero judgment. produces zero judgment. It produces resolve in me. Lord, have It produces resolve in me. Lord, have It produces resolve in me. Lord, have mercy in me. Do not give my years to the mercy in me. Do not give my years to the mercy in me. Do not give my years to the merciless. And he's he's basically merciless. And he's he's basically merciless. And he's he's basically pleading like don't learn the hard way pleading like don't learn the hard way pleading like don't learn the hard way by having to fail yourself. Listen to by having to fail yourself. Listen to by having to fail yourself. Listen to what I'm saying. Being disgraced on a what I'm saying. Being disgraced on a what I'm saying. Being disgraced on a global scale is painful. And he had this global scale is painful. And he had this global scale is painful. And he had this other line which he called um uh you other line which he called um uh you other line which he called um uh you know the the torture of what could have know the the torture of what could have know the the torture of what could have been.

been. been. >> He's like that is a haunting thing. So >> He's like that is a haunting thing. So >> He's like that is a haunting thing. So again you God will test you and we again you God will test you and we again you God will test you and we should look around and say Lord I am should look around and say Lord I am should look around and say Lord I am capable of that. Give me grace in those capable of that. Give me grace in those capable of that. Give me grace in those moments of testing. So when someone who moments of testing. So when someone who moments of testing. So when someone who was one of the most successful leaders was one of the most successful leaders was one of the most successful leaders of this generation is exhorting you, I I of this generation is exhorting you, I I of this generation is exhorting you, I I receive that word humbly. receive that word humbly. receive that word humbly. >> Zero judgment. I'm like, "Okay, Lord, I >> Zero judgment. I'm like, "Okay, Lord, I >> Zero judgment. I'm like, "Okay, Lord, I that could be me. How do I pass these that could be me. How do I pass these that could be me. How do I pass these tests? How do I submit myself?" So I tests? How do I submit myself?" So I tests? How do I submit myself?" So I think um as Gen Z leaders, you know, think um as Gen Z leaders, you know, think um as Gen Z leaders, you know, some of the oldest Gen Z leaders, 27, some of the oldest Gen Z leaders, 27, some of the oldest Gen Z leaders, 27, 28, they're going to start getting 28, they're going to start getting 28, they're going to start getting tested in fresh ways. And uh the more we tested in fresh ways. And uh the more we tested in fresh ways. And uh the more we can do to prepare them for those tests can do to prepare them for those tests can do to prepare them for those tests and let them know they're coming, I and let them know they're coming, I and let them know they're coming, I think the better we'll be in terms of think the better we'll be in terms of think the better we'll be in terms of the legacy we leave. Some of the data the legacy we leave. Some of the data the legacy we leave. Some of the data we're looking at in this series is young we're looking at in this series is young we're looking at in this series is young men seem to be particularly responding. men seem to be particularly responding. men seem to be particularly responding. You see that in the UK, you spend a lot You see that in the UK, you spend a lot You see that in the UK, you spend a lot of time in the UK. We've got a whole UK of time in the UK. We've got a whole UK of time in the UK. We've got a whole UK panel talking about that. But you also panel talking about that. But you also panel talking about that. But you also work with the spiritual formation of work with the spiritual formation of work with the spiritual formation of young men, dads, sons, teenagers.

young men, dads, sons, teenagers. young men, dads, sons, teenagers. What are you seeing in this next What are you seeing in this next What are you seeing in this next generation of young men in terms of generation of young men in terms of generation of young men in terms of their spiritual hunger and how they their spiritual hunger and how they their spiritual hunger and how they respond? respond? respond? >> So we this is gearing up to be the most >> So we this is gearing up to be the most >> So we this is gearing up to be the most religious generation in decades right religious generation in decades right religious generation in decades right now. now. now. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> So um I have friends all over the world. >> So um I have friends all over the world. >> So um I have friends all over the world. I got to say one of one of the countries I got to say one of one of the countries I got to say one of one of the countries I love is Iceland. I love is Iceland. I love is Iceland. >> Okay. Never been. >> Okay. Never been. >> Okay. Never been. >> Oh mate. You want to be you want to be >> Oh mate. You want to be you want to be >> Oh mate. You want to be you want to be in the Lord of the Rings? in the Lord of the Rings? in the Lord of the Rings? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Go to Iceland. It's my extraordinary >> Go to Iceland. It's my extraordinary >> Go to Iceland. It's my extraordinary place. I love it so much. Um I have a place. I love it so much. Um I have a place. I love it so much. Um I have a pastor who pastors uh the largest church pastor who pastors uh the largest church pastor who pastors uh the largest church in Rekavik and um you know traditionally in Rekavik and um you know traditionally in Rekavik and um you know traditionally the typical Icelandic man is not sort of the typical Icelandic man is not sort of the typical Icelandic man is not sort of open to the gospel. It's one of the most open to the gospel. It's one of the most open to the gospel. It's one of the most secular countries on earth secular countries on earth secular countries on earth >> and they've just seen this resurgence of >> and they've just seen this resurgence of >> and they've just seen this resurgence of young men coming to the church young men coming to the church young men coming to the church unprompted. I just had this sense I unprompted. I just had this sense I unprompted. I just had this sense I should read a Bible. I just had a sense should read a Bible. I just had a sense should read a Bible. I just had a sense I I need spirituality in my life. And um I I need spirituality in my life. And um I I need spirituality in my life. And um Helgi uh who's the pastor there is Helgi uh who's the pastor there is Helgi uh who's the pastor there is saying one of the marks is young men who saying one of the marks is young men who saying one of the marks is young men who they've been unable to reach through they've been unable to reach through they've been unable to reach through traditional means being reached directly traditional means being reached directly traditional means being reached directly by God and coming back to the church.

by God and coming back to the church. by God and coming back to the church. That is happening everywhere. That is happening everywhere. That is happening everywhere. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um >> Um >> Um >> and if that that quiet revival report >> and if that that quiet revival report >> and if that that quiet revival report out of the UK, it's quantifiable. out of the UK, it's quantifiable. out of the UK, it's quantifiable. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Quadrupling quintupling of young men >> Quadrupling quintupling of young men >> Quadrupling quintupling of young men attending church in their teens and 20s. attending church in their teens and 20s. attending church in their teens and 20s. Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, >> you're starting to see data, Barna data >> you're starting to see data, Barna data >> you're starting to see data, Barna data is showing that men, Gen Z men are more is showing that men, Gen Z men are more is showing that men, Gen Z men are more spiritually curious, open, and engaged spiritually curious, open, and engaged spiritually curious, open, and engaged than Gen Z women. than Gen Z women. than Gen Z women. >> Yeah, I I got um some data sent to me, >> Yeah, I I got um some data sent to me, >> Yeah, I I got um some data sent to me, sort of secret data from a high-end sort of secret data from a high-end sort of secret data from a high-end research firm. So, not Christian data, research firm. So, not Christian data, research firm. So, not Christian data, non-Christian data. non-Christian data. non-Christian data. >> Uh I run a program called the Primal >> Uh I run a program called the Primal >> Uh I run a program called the Primal Path, which is a 5-year right of passage Path, which is a 5-year right of passage Path, which is a 5-year right of passage for fathers and sons. There's a lot of for fathers and sons. There's a lot of for fathers and sons. There's a lot of energy around doing one-off events. I energy around doing one-off events. I energy around doing one-off events. I love a good event. love a good event. love a good event. >> Yeah. But you're going to need more than >> Yeah. But you're going to need more than >> Yeah. But you're going to need more than an event to form your son into a godly an event to form your son into a godly an event to form your son into a godly man. So I've got this 5-year curriculum. man. So I've got this 5-year curriculum. man. So I've got this 5-year curriculum. It's it's really solid. But anyway, it's It's it's really solid. But anyway, it's It's it's really solid. But anyway, it's called the primal path. I was reading called the primal path. I was reading called the primal path. I was reading this data on Gen Z and one of the this data on Gen Z and one of the this data on Gen Z and one of the biggest trends they go uh 25 26 27 is biggest trends they go uh 25 26 27 is biggest trends they go uh 25 26 27 is what they're calling primal masculinity. what they're calling primal masculinity. what they're calling primal masculinity. And the whole thing and then they talk And the whole thing and then they talk And the whole thing and then they talk about trad fantasies which is you know about trad fantasies which is you know about trad fantasies which is you know when you've been told you can be when you've been told you can be when you've been told you can be anything and do anything. Young people anything and do anything. Young people anything and do anything. Young people want to rebel. They have a reformative want to rebel. They have a reformative want to rebel. They have a reformative edge edge edge >> and you're told you can be anything.

>> and you're told you can be anything. >> and you're told you can be anything. Well, the true rebel is going to say, Well, the true rebel is going to say, Well, the true rebel is going to say, "Stuff you. I'm gonna go get married and "Stuff you. I'm gonna go get married and "Stuff you. I'm gonna go get married and have kids young." Do you know what I have kids young." Do you know what I have kids young." Do you know what I mean? When when you're in when you're in mean? When when you're in when you're in mean? When when you're in when you're in chaos, you're going to rebel towards chaos, you're going to rebel towards chaos, you're going to rebel towards order. And when you're in anarchy and order. And when you're in anarchy and order. And when you're in anarchy and rebellion, you're going to rebel towards rebellion, you're going to rebel towards rebellion, you're going to rebel towards tradition. And one of those trends for tradition. And one of those trends for tradition. And one of those trends for young men is primal masculinity. So, young men is primal masculinity. So, young men is primal masculinity. So, it's the influences who are helping them it's the influences who are helping them it's the influences who are helping them get their lives back. So, I'm I'm get their lives back. So, I'm I'm get their lives back. So, I'm I'm genuinely really grateful. I started 5 genuinely really grateful. I started 5 genuinely really grateful. I started 5 years ago in CO aggressively years ago in CO aggressively years ago in CO aggressively aggressively trying to disciple men. And aggressively trying to disciple men. And aggressively trying to disciple men. And our whole vision um is on fix the our whole vision um is on fix the our whole vision um is on fix the foundations. Like most men have cracks foundations. Like most men have cracks foundations. Like most men have cracks from the from a what co did, from the from a what co did, from the from a what co did, >> what porn has done to them, how job >> what porn has done to them, how job >> what porn has done to them, how job industries are changing and all the rest industries are changing and all the rest industries are changing and all the rest of it. They don't have a foundation to of it. They don't have a foundation to of it. They don't have a foundation to build the rest of their lives on. So build the rest of their lives on. So build the rest of their lives on. So we've again I don't have to go into it we've again I don't have to go into it we've again I don't have to go into it here, but I've got a ton of resources to here, but I've got a ton of resources to here, but I've got a ton of resources to help men fix the foundation of their help men fix the foundation of their help men fix the foundation of their lives as they come back to church to lives as they come back to church to lives as they come back to church to disciple them into becoming the kinds of disciple them into becoming the kinds of disciple them into becoming the kinds of men that God wants them to be. So um I men that God wants them to be. So um I men that God wants them to be. So um I think that it's really interesting too think that it's really interesting too think that it's really interesting too because during co I I had this burning because during co I I had this burning because during co I I had this burning passion I run a thing called forming men passion I run a thing called forming men passion I run a thing called forming men I had this burning passion to like mass I had this burning passion to like mass I had this burning passion to like mass disciple men to lead a movement of men disciple men to lead a movement of men disciple men to lead a movement of men and then one of my pastor friends came and then one of my pastor friends came and then one of my pastor friends came to New York to New York to New York >> this is Darren Rousen uh in Long Beach >> this is Darren Rousen uh in Long Beach >> this is Darren Rousen uh in Long Beach took me down to where the businessman's took me down to where the businessman's took me down to where the businessman's revival happened and he says I don't revival happened and he says I don't revival happened and he says I don't know if you ever connected these dots know if you ever connected these dots know if you ever connected these dots but the last great move of God in your but the last great move of God in your but the last great move of God in your city was the businessman's revival and city was the businessman's revival and city was the businessman's revival and God has given you a half a cuz he wants God has given you a half a cuz he wants God has given you a half a cuz he wants to do a revival with men again. And that

to do a revival with men again. And that to do a revival with men again. And that I really leaned I I received that. I I really leaned I I received that. I I really leaned I I received that. I believed there was something in that for believed there was something in that for believed there was something in that for me. So we've worked hard to create me. So we've worked hard to create me. So we've worked hard to create resource. Our best one's one called man resource. Our best one's one called man resource. Our best one's one called man year which is basically a year long year which is basically a year long year which is basically a year long thing to fix a foundation how to love thing to fix a foundation how to love thing to fix a foundation how to love God physically, spiritually, mentally God physically, spiritually, mentally God physically, spiritually, mentally and emotionally. And that is seeing and emotionally. And that is seeing and emotionally. And that is seeing tremendous fruit where you basically tremendous fruit where you basically tremendous fruit where you basically form a covenant with a few guys to just form a covenant with a few guys to just form a covenant with a few guys to just run this thing through to get that run this thing through to get that run this thing through to get that foundation right to rebuild your life in foundation right to rebuild your life in foundation right to rebuild your life in God on top of it. God on top of it. God on top of it. >> I have a hunger for that. Oh, might >> I have a hunger for that. Oh, might >> I have a hunger for that. Oh, might >> might. >> might. >> might. >> And these are 20somes or 40some guys. >> And these are 20somes or 40some guys. >> And these are 20somes or 40some guys. >> Predominantly 20somes. >> Predominantly 20somes. >> Predominantly 20somes. >> 20ome young men >> 20ome young men >> 20ome young men of their life. of their life. of their life. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> So, I mean, think about that. Who do you >> So, I mean, think about that. Who do you >> So, I mean, think about that. Who do you look to? What they've had is optimizers. look to? What they've had is optimizers. look to? What they've had is optimizers. So, you've had Jordan Peterson, who for So, you've had Jordan Peterson, who for So, you've had Jordan Peterson, who for many folks played some archetypal role many folks played some archetypal role many folks played some archetypal role of a father figure. He's sort of pivoted of a father figure. He's sort of pivoted of a father figure. He's sort of pivoted into politics. into politics. into politics. >> Yeah. Um, and so he's no longer like >> Yeah. Um, and so he's no longer like >> Yeah. Um, and so he's no longer like calling for the hearts of young men like calling for the hearts of young men like calling for the hearts of young men like he was. That resonance seems to have um he was. That resonance seems to have um he was. That resonance seems to have um shifted. You get Huberman who's like shifted. You get Huberman who's like shifted. You get Huberman who's like optimizing with all the protocols which optimizing with all the protocols which optimizing with all the protocols which is sort of like a secular John Mark is sort of like a secular John Mark is sort of like a secular John Mark coma. He's got a protocol for everything coma. He's got a protocol for everything coma. He's got a protocol for everything to form you into your optimized self.

to form you into your optimized self. to form you into your optimized self. >> But optimizing for what? >> But optimizing for what? >> But optimizing for what? >> You look at influence and you know even >> You look at influence and you know even >> You look at influence and you know even someone like Andrew Tate who basically someone like Andrew Tate who basically someone like Andrew Tate who basically is living the life of an empowered is living the life of an empowered is living the life of an empowered middle school boy. middle school boy. middle school boy. sex with a bunch of women and toys. sex with a bunch of women and toys. sex with a bunch of women and toys. That's not a that's not a mature version That's not a that's not a mature version That's not a that's not a mature version of a man. So people are just asking like of a man. So people are just asking like of a man. So people are just asking like what is there? And then you know there's what is there? And then you know there's what is there? And then you know there's this one man who is the best man who's this one man who is the best man who's this one man who is the best man who's ever lived who was Jesus Christ. The way ever lived who was Jesus Christ. The way ever lived who was Jesus Christ. The way Jesus treated women, the way Jesus used Jesus treated women, the way Jesus used Jesus treated women, the way Jesus used power, the way Jesus had courage, the power, the way Jesus had courage, the power, the way Jesus had courage, the way Jesus had a mission, the way Jesus way Jesus had a mission, the way Jesus way Jesus had a mission, the way Jesus would flip tables and weep, this is the would flip tables and weep, this is the would flip tables and weep, this is the best man that's ever lived. and they best man that's ever lived. and they best man that's ever lived. and they start looking and realizing, wow, start looking and realizing, wow, start looking and realizing, wow, disciplehip and Christianity is not just disciplehip and Christianity is not just disciplehip and Christianity is not just believing a bunch of ideas in my head or believing a bunch of ideas in my head or believing a bunch of ideas in my head or doing a bunch of things for God. It's doing a bunch of things for God. It's doing a bunch of things for God. It's about becoming being shaped into the about becoming being shaped into the about becoming being shaped into the greatest man who's ever lived. Wow, what greatest man who's ever lived. Wow, what greatest man who's ever lived. Wow, what a refreshing vision. And so I think men a refreshing vision. And so I think men a refreshing vision. And so I think men are seeing Jesus aresh and realizing are seeing Jesus aresh and realizing are seeing Jesus aresh and realizing spiritual formation is becoming like spiritual formation is becoming like spiritual formation is becoming like Christ. That is very good news for this Christ. That is very good news for this Christ. That is very good news for this generation. covered an awful lot. And generation. covered an awful lot. And generation. covered an awful lot. And I'm thinking about the leaders listening I'm thinking about the leaders listening I'm thinking about the leaders listening who are interested, who are interested, who are interested, but they're going to go out there. It's but they're going to go out there. It's but they're going to go out there. It's the same 50 or the same 500 or sometimes the same 50 or the same 500 or sometimes the same 50 or the same 500 or sometimes the same 5,000 people that are there the same 5,000 people that are there the same 5,000 people that are there every week. And there just doesn't seem every week. And there just doesn't seem every week. And there just doesn't seem to be the stirrings of the move of God to be the stirrings of the move of God to be the stirrings of the move of God yet. And they're hopeful. They're yet. And they're hopeful. They're yet. And they're hopeful. They're they're not cynical.

they're not cynical. they're not cynical. What are some You've talked about What are some You've talked about What are some You've talked about posturing, positioning yourself. So for posturing, positioning yourself. So for posturing, positioning yourself. So for all the leaders listening who are all the leaders listening who are all the leaders listening who are longing but haven't seen it, where's a longing but haven't seen it, where's a longing but haven't seen it, where's a good place to begin posturing yourself, good place to begin posturing yourself, good place to begin posturing yourself, preparing I say three four things have preparing I say three four things have preparing I say three four things have been very effective for me. Number one, been very effective for me. Number one, been very effective for me. Number one, fasting. fasting. fasting. >> I hate fasting. >> I hate fasting. >> I hate fasting. >> Yeah, me too. >> Yeah, me too. >> Yeah, me too. >> I like to eat. I'm in a food city. >> I like to eat. I'm in a food city. >> I like to eat. I'm in a food city. You're in Hell's Kitchen right now. This You're in Hell's Kitchen right now. This You're in Hell's Kitchen right now. This whole thing I know this whole thing is a whole thing I know this whole thing is a whole thing I know this whole thing is a restaurant. restaurant. restaurant. >> We've eaten our way through Manhattan. >> We've eaten our way through Manhattan. >> We've eaten our way through Manhattan. My goodness. I'll tell you food tour. My goodness. I'll tell you food tour. My goodness. I'll tell you food tour. But nothing But nothing But nothing draws me out of the normal into the draws me out of the normal into the draws me out of the normal into the spiritual like fasting. So, so just spiritual like fasting. So, so just spiritual like fasting. So, so just integrating fasting. integrating fasting. integrating fasting. >> So when you when you fast is it a week? >> So when you when you fast is it a week? >> So when you when you fast is it a week? One day one day you fasted yesterday. One day one day you fasted yesterday. One day one day you fasted yesterday. One day a week. One day a week. One day a week. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Yep. So wait yesterday. >> Yep. So wait yesterday. >> Yep. So wait yesterday. >> Oh, you didn't preach. I was going to >> Oh, you didn't preach. I was going to >> Oh, you didn't preach. I was going to say you fasted and preached. say you fasted and preached. say you fasted and preached. >> Um just we try and do that every week. >> Um just we try and do that every week. >> Um just we try and do that every week. Uh number two, read accounts of revival. Uh number two, read accounts of revival. Uh number two, read accounts of revival. Yeah. Can I back up on fasting? water Yeah. Can I back up on fasting? water Yeah. Can I back up on fasting? water fasting, liquid fasting, like like do fasting, liquid fasting, like like do fasting, liquid fasting, like like do >> don't be liquid fasting sometimes. Water >> don't be liquid fasting sometimes. Water >> don't be liquid fasting sometimes. Water fasting, mainly liquid fasting.

fasting, mainly liquid fasting. fasting, mainly liquid fasting. >> Liquid fasting solids, >> Liquid fasting solids, >> Liquid fasting solids, >> whatever. God, but not shakes, >> whatever. God, but not shakes, >> whatever. God, but not shakes, >> right? You're not shake chocolate malt. >> right? You're not shake chocolate malt. >> right? You're not shake chocolate malt. Exactly. Exactly. 1,200 calories in this Exactly. Exactly. 1,200 calories in this Exactly. Exactly. 1,200 calories in this 32 oz gulp. Yeah. No. No. But whatever 32 oz gulp. Yeah. No. No. But whatever 32 oz gulp. Yeah. No. No. But whatever gets your heart off the flesh and makes gets your heart off the flesh and makes gets your heart off the flesh and makes you hunger for the spirit. you hunger for the spirit. you hunger for the spirit. >> Whatever that is, do that. >> Whatever that is, do that. >> Whatever that is, do that. >> Read accounts of revival. I read an >> Read accounts of revival. I read an >> Read accounts of revival. I read an account of revival every day. account of revival every day. account of revival every day. >> Oh wow. >> Oh wow. >> Oh wow. >> And it just stirs my faith. The one I >> And it just stirs my faith. The one I >> And it just stirs my faith. The one I was reading this morning was the a was reading this morning was the a was reading this morning was the a Saskatoon revival Saskatoon revival Saskatoon revival >> and I was like, God, do that in New >> and I was like, God, do that in New >> and I was like, God, do that in New York. York. York. >> You have a a book like a history >> You have a a book like a history >> You have a a book like a history revival. You probably got a library of revival. You probably got a library of revival. You probably got a library of room. room. room. >> Yeah, I think um I could leave a couple >> Yeah, I think um I could leave a couple >> Yeah, I think um I could leave a couple of links to websites that have accounts. of links to websites that have accounts. of links to websites that have accounts. >> We'll link to those in the show notes if >> We'll link to those in the show notes if >> We'll link to those in the show notes if people want to get started. people want to get started. people want to get started. >> Um >> Um >> Um >> very very strong. Um, get around people >> very very strong. Um, get around people >> very very strong. Um, get around people who care about revival in if if you have who care about revival in if if you have who care about revival in if if you have a town a town a town of 500. I promise you, God has an of 500. I promise you, God has an of 500. I promise you, God has an intercessor who cares about this in your intercessor who cares about this in your intercessor who cares about this in your town. May not be your favorite person. town. May not be your favorite person. town. May not be your favorite person. Maybe an maybe an older folk who is Maybe an maybe an older folk who is Maybe an maybe an older folk who is disengaged. Someone in your town has disengaged. Someone in your town has disengaged. Someone in your town has this bird because God always this bird because God always this bird because God always >> there's someone with a prayer, someone >> there's someone with a prayer, someone >> there's someone with a prayer, someone with a history, somebody who interceds.

with a history, somebody who interceds. with a history, somebody who interceds. >> Go find them, honor them, and activate >> Go find them, honor them, and activate >> Go find them, honor them, and activate them. And then I would say um just get them. And then I would say um just get them. And then I would say um just get on your own with God and ask yourself on your own with God and ask yourself on your own with God and ask yourself this question. Uh Duncan Campbell says, this question. Uh Duncan Campbell says, this question. Uh Duncan Campbell says, "Lack of corporate revival is no excuse "Lack of corporate revival is no excuse "Lack of corporate revival is no excuse for not living in personal revival and for not living in personal revival and for not living in personal revival and just say to the Lord, Lord, revive me. just say to the Lord, Lord, revive me. just say to the Lord, Lord, revive me. Lord, please give me the promises of God Lord, please give me the promises of God Lord, please give me the promises of God for my life." Jesus, you said rivers, if for my life." Jesus, you said rivers, if for my life." Jesus, you said rivers, if anyone is thirsty, rivers, plural of anyone is thirsty, rivers, plural of anyone is thirsty, rivers, plural of living water. I want the living water. living water. I want the living water. living water. I want the living water. just like go have it out with God. And just like go have it out with God. And just like go have it out with God. And um you know some of my best encounters um you know some of my best encounters um you know some of my best encounters are just like come on God. I didn't are just like come on God. I didn't are just like come on God. I didn't write this book. You wrote this book. write this book. You wrote this book. write this book. You wrote this book. >> You said I'm asking you to show up in my >> You said I'm asking you to show up in my >> You said I'm asking you to show up in my life. And the Bible says we will seek life. And the Bible says we will seek life. And the Bible says we will seek him and find him if we search with all him and find him if we search with all him and find him if we search with all of our heart. And in Luke 11 I would of our heart. And in Luke 11 I would of our heart. And in Luke 11 I would meditate on that. The content of what to meditate on that. The content of what to meditate on that. The content of what to pray the Lord's prayer. The attitude pray the Lord's prayer. The attitude pray the Lord's prayer. The attitude that we pray with the friend at midnight that we pray with the friend at midnight that we pray with the friend at midnight shameless audacity. the expectation of shameless audacity. the expectation of shameless audacity. the expectation of prayer. Ask and you shall receive. Seek prayer. Ask and you shall receive. Seek prayer. Ask and you shall receive. Seek and you shall find. Knock. The heart of and you shall find. Knock. The heart of and you shall find. Knock. The heart of the father. Even though we're evil, know the father. Even though we're evil, know the father. Even though we're evil, know how to good gifts. I would just go say, how to good gifts. I would just go say, how to good gifts. I would just go say, Jesus, you taught all of these things on Jesus, you taught all of these things on Jesus, you taught all of these things on prayer. I'm praying you're up. And I prayer. I'm praying you're up. And I prayer. I'm praying you're up. And I would trust God at his word.

would trust God at his word. would trust God at his word. >> What's a misconception about revival >> What's a misconception about revival >> What's a misconception about revival that needs to die? That we can control that needs to die? That we can control that needs to die? That we can control it. it. it. >> We can't control it, man. God is >> We can't control it, man. God is >> We can't control it, man. God is sovereign. God does what he wants. Um, sovereign. God does what he wants. Um, sovereign. God does what he wants. Um, we can hunger for it. We can long for we can hunger for it. We can long for we can hunger for it. We can long for it. we can call on his promises, but it. we can call on his promises, but it. we can call on his promises, but part of the the deal of being God is you part of the the deal of being God is you part of the the deal of being God is you get to do what you want. So, um yeah, get to do what you want. So, um yeah, get to do what you want. So, um yeah, any Yeah. The other thing I would the other Yeah. The other thing I would the other thing I would say um is that one mistake thing I would say um is that one mistake thing I would say um is that one mistake I think that's happening right now is as I think that's happening right now is as I think that's happening right now is as non-carismatics are becoming non-carismatics are becoming non-carismatics are becoming charismatic, they're thinking that's charismatic, they're thinking that's charismatic, they're thinking that's revival. It's not. You're just revival. It's not. You're just revival. It's not. You're just encountering the gifts of the spirit. It encountering the gifts of the spirit. It encountering the gifts of the spirit. It will feel like revival. will feel like revival. will feel like revival. This is not revival. This is just an This is not revival. This is just an This is not revival. This is just an encounter with the gifts of the spirit. encounter with the gifts of the spirit. encounter with the gifts of the spirit. >> So I think I I think I mean certainly >> So I think I I think I mean certainly >> So I think I I think I mean certainly the global church is is charismatic and the global church is is charismatic and the global church is is charismatic and Pentecostal. The future of the church is Pentecostal. The future of the church is Pentecostal. The future of the church is a charismatic church. We need the power a charismatic church. We need the power a charismatic church. We need the power of God or you know of God or you know of God or you know >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Let's be genuinely honest. The biggest >> Let's be genuinely honest. The biggest >> Let's be genuinely honest. The biggest and best churches in every tradition and best churches in every tradition and best churches in every tradition doesn't matter if you're Pentecostal or doesn't matter if you're Pentecostal or doesn't matter if you're Pentecostal or Presbyterian. America built those.

Presbyterian. America built those. Presbyterian. America built those. >> And we've had leadership scandals in >> And we've had leadership scandals in >> And we've had leadership scandals in both of those. the Pentecostal and the both of those. the Pentecostal and the both of those. the Pentecostal and the Presbyterian and everything in between. Presbyterian and everything in between. Presbyterian and everything in between. And the biggest best personalitydriven And the biggest best personalitydriven And the biggest best personalitydriven mega ministries mega ministries mega ministries resulted in the largest decline resulted in the largest decline resulted in the largest decline in our generation. And I think at some in our generation. And I think at some in our generation. And I think at some point there is a condensed realization. point there is a condensed realization. point there is a condensed realization. We're saying, "God, you're up. We've We're saying, "God, you're up. We've We're saying, "God, you're up. We've seen the best churches we can build. Now seen the best churches we can build. Now seen the best churches we can build. Now come and show us how you promised to come and show us how you promised to come and show us how you promised to build the church." I'm not putting those build the church." I'm not putting those build the church." I'm not putting those things down. I'm saying we just relied things down. I'm saying we just relied things down. I'm saying we just relied on gifting or the flesh or systems or on gifting or the flesh or systems or on gifting or the flesh or systems or cultural momentum. And I think God is cultural momentum. And I think God is cultural momentum. And I think God is telling us, I'll take it from here. I I telling us, I'll take it from here. I I telling us, I'll take it from here. I I appreciate you guys. Thank you. But now, appreciate you guys. Thank you. But now, appreciate you guys. Thank you. But now, let me show you what I can do. It's that let me show you what I can do. It's that let me show you what I can do. It's that John Wimble moment. John, I've seen your John Wimble moment. John, I've seen your John Wimble moment. John, I've seen your ministry. Now, let me show you mine. Maybe we need to leave it there. Maybe we need to leave it there. >> Yeah, maybe we need to leave it there. >> Yeah, maybe we need to leave it there. >> Yeah, maybe we need to leave it there. >> We have talked about a lot of things. >> We have talked about a lot of things. >> We have talked about a lot of things. We're going to link to everything we We're going to link to everything we We're going to link to everything we covered in the show notes. If there was covered in the show notes. If there was covered in the show notes. If there was one particular website, your social one particular website, your social one particular website, your social media account, anything that you would media account, anything that you would media account, anything that you would say, hey, you want to learn more about say, hey, you want to learn more about say, hey, you want to learn more about revival, follow here. Quick call to revival, follow here. Quick call to revival, follow here. Quick call to action. Do you have I mean, if you want action. Do you have I mean, if you want action. Do you have I mean, if you want to learn about revival, I would put you to learn about revival, I would put you to learn about revival, I would put you to the website. So, I'm going to link in to the website. So, I'm going to link in to the website. So, I'm going to link in the show notes, which are revival the show notes, which are revival the show notes, which are revival libraries.

libraries. libraries. >> If you want to follow the stuff we're >> If you want to follow the stuff we're >> If you want to follow the stuff we're doing here in New York, you can go to doing here in New York, you can go to doing here in New York, you can go to johntyson.org. johntyson.org. johntyson.org. And everything in my life, men, And everything in my life, men, And everything in my life, men, fatherhood, revival, preaching, it is fatherhood, revival, preaching, it is fatherhood, revival, preaching, it is all in one easy to find place. all in one easy to find place. all in one easy to find place. >> Amazing. I can't thank you enough. This >> Amazing. I can't thank you enough. This >> Amazing. I can't thank you enough. This is uh had a lot of surprises for me in is uh had a lot of surprises for me in is uh had a lot of surprises for me in it. Delightful it. Delightful it. Delightful >> surprises. And uh until next time, John. >> surprises. And uh until next time, John. >> surprises. And uh until next time, John. Always great chatting with you, Mike. Always great chatting with you, Mike. Always great chatting with you, Mike. >> Always. Yeah.