AI in the Next 10 Years: Best & Worst Case Scenarios With James JP Poulter

we've already seen the impact that covid we've already seen the impact that covid and the smartphone has had on young and the smartphone has had on young and the smartphone has had on young people's ability to form lasting social people's ability to form lasting social people's ability to form lasting social bonds with one another to you know have bonds with one another to you know have bonds with one another to you know have deep conversations and deep deep conversations and deep deep conversations and deep relationships and who knows already what relationships and who knows already what relationships and who knows already what knock on impact that's going to have 10 knock on impact that's going to have 10 knock on impact that's going to have 10 years down the road to the population years down the road to the population years down the road to the population let alone anything else if young men let alone anything else if young men let alone anything else if young men can't find young women to you know build can't find young women to you know build can't find young women to you know build the population with without some other the population with without some other the population with without some other artificial intervention we're going to artificial intervention we're going to artificial intervention we're going to have problems guys like that's the way have problems guys like that's the way have problems guys like that's the way it's going add to the ability for you to it's going add to the ability for you to it's going add to the ability for you to have a virtual girlfriend or virtual have a virtual girlfriend or virtual have a virtual girlfriend or virtual boyfriend and fall in love with the boyfriend and fall in love with the boyfriend and fall in love with the chatbot and be totally happy with that I chatbot and be totally happy with that I chatbot and be totally happy with that I think is a relational category that we think is a relational category that we think is a relational category that we don't want to see emerge and that's don't want to see emerge and that's don't want to see emerge and that's actually probably the more likely worst actually probably the more likely worst actually probably the more likely worst case scenario that we are already seeing case scenario that we are already seeing case scenario that we are already seeing companies building tools building companies building tools building companies building tools building experiences where you can essentially experiences where you can essentially experiences where you can essentially take a step back from society and have take a step back from society and have take a step back from society and have pretty much everything done for you both pretty much everything done for you both pretty much everything done for you both your work product your relational your work product your relational your work product your relational products your you call it whatever products your you call it whatever products your you call it whatever aspect of of your life you want manag aspect of of your life you want manag aspect of of your life you want manag and we end up in a kind of you you and we end up in a kind of you you and we end up in a kind of you you remember that Disney Movie Wally right remember that Disney Movie Wally right remember that Disney Movie Wally right we kind of end up in that kind of all we kind of end up in that kind of all we kind of end up in that kind of all sat slightly and a half vegetative state sat slightly and a half vegetative state sat slightly and a half vegetative state looking like a potato leaning back looking like a potato leaning back looking like a potato leaning back watching a recycling truck clean up the watching a recycling truck clean up the watching a recycling truck clean up the world like that's not a great outcome world like that's not a great outcome world like that's not a great outcome generally speaking welcome to the K generally speaking welcome to the K generally speaking welcome to the K newoff leadership podcast on YouTube I'm newoff leadership podcast on YouTube I'm newoff leadership podcast on YouTube I'm so glad that you joined us hey today so glad that you joined us hey today so glad that you joined us hey today we're talking about all things AI what we're talking about all things AI what we're talking about all things AI what are the best and worst case scenarios are the best and worst case scenarios are the best and worst case scenarios for AI in the next 10 years and then for AI in the next 10 years and then for AI in the next 10 years and then what are some practical apps that you're what are some practical apps that you're what are some practical apps that you're missing that could really save you hours

missing that could really save you hours missing that could really save you hours if not staff members so we're going to if not staff members so we're going to if not staff members so we're going to talk about all of that hey if you're new talk about all of that hey if you're new talk about all of that hey if you're new here which is most of you subscribe make here which is most of you subscribe make here which is most of you subscribe make sure you do that because then you'll sure you do that because then you'll sure you do that because then you'll never miss like worldclass interviews I never miss like worldclass interviews I never miss like worldclass interviews I am talking to Charles doig in the future am talking to Charles doig in the future am talking to Charles doig in the future about super communicators sitting down about super communicators sitting down about super communicators sitting down with Ken Blanchard having conversations with Ken Blanchard having conversations with Ken Blanchard having conversations with Andy Stanley and Ed ster hey none with Andy Stanley and Ed ster hey none with Andy Stanley and Ed ster hey none of those are up yet but if you subscribe of those are up yet but if you subscribe of those are up yet but if you subscribe you won't miss a thing well today's you won't miss a thing well today's you won't miss a thing well today's episode is brought to you by my live episode is brought to you by my live episode is brought to you by my live event called The Art of leadership live event called The Art of leadership live event called The Art of leadership live and if you're looking to level up your and if you're looking to level up your and if you're looking to level up your leadership level up your church I'm leadership level up your church I'm leadership level up your church I'm hosting my very first conference the art hosting my very first conference the art hosting my very first conference the art of leadership live in Dallas Texas of leadership live in Dallas Texas of leadership live in Dallas Texas September 16th to 18th it's a very small September 16th to 18th it's a very small September 16th to 18th it's a very small bespoke curated event and if you're bespoke curated event and if you're bespoke curated event and if you're ready to break free from what's been ready to break free from what's been ready to break free from what's been holding you back secure your spot by holding you back secure your spot by holding you back secure your spot by visiting the artof leadership live.com visiting the artof leadership live.com visiting the artof leadership live.com I'd love to see in Dallas hurry because I'd love to see in Dallas hurry because I'd love to see in Dallas hurry because things are filling up really really things are filling up really really things are filling up really really quickly and also today's episode is quickly and also today's episode is quickly and also today's episode is brought to you by 10x10 so if you're a brought to you by 10x10 so if you're a brought to you by 10x10 so if you're a youth pastor you're probably trying to youth pastor you're probably trying to youth pastor you're probably trying to connect with the Next Generation Well connect with the Next Generation Well connect with the Next Generation Well you got to figure out exactly how to do you got to figure out exactly how to do you got to figure out exactly how to do it they have a free assessment for you it they have a free assessment for you it they have a free assessment for you that you can learn by going to that you can learn by going to that you can learn by going to 10x10 RDI and you can get your free 10x10 RDI and you can get your free 10x10 RDI and you can get your free assessment right away absolutely no assessment right away absolutely no assessment right away absolutely no charge to you and it's your relational charge to you and it's your relational charge to you and it's your relational discipleship inventory and now my discipleship inventory and now my discipleship inventory and now my conversation with one and only JP bter conversation with one and only JP bter conversation with one and only JP bter about AI JP Welcome to the about AI JP Welcome to the about AI JP Welcome to the podcast Car thanks so much for having me podcast Car thanks so much for having me podcast Car thanks so much for having me it's a pleasure to be here yeah so I

it's a pleasure to be here yeah so I it's a pleasure to be here yeah so I want to start in the deep want to start in the deep want to start in the deep end what are the threats of AI there's end what are the threats of AI there's end what are the threats of AI there's like two different views right there's like two different views right there's like two different views right there's the benevolent view of AI and then the benevolent view of AI and then the benevolent view of AI and then there's the malevolent view of AI so there's the malevolent view of AI so there's the malevolent view of AI so from where you sit uh what are what are from where you sit uh what are what are from where you sit uh what are what are the threats the existential threats that the threats the existential threats that the threats the existential threats that AI poses right now well I think the AI poses right now well I think the AI poses right now well I think the biggest distinction is that I'm not sure biggest distinction is that I'm not sure biggest distinction is that I'm not sure that AI is the existential threat but that AI is the existential threat but that AI is the existential threat but it's AI in the hands of humans that it's AI in the hands of humans that it's AI in the hands of humans that might be the existential threat which is might be the existential threat which is might be the existential threat which is probably an important distinction you probably an important distinction you probably an important distinction you know in the church we have a habit know in the church we have a habit know in the church we have a habit sometimes a nasty one when it comes to sometimes a nasty one when it comes to sometimes a nasty one when it comes to technology of looking for 666 in the technology of looking for 666 in the technology of looking for 666 in the code of everything that we use uh code of everything that we use uh code of everything that we use uh assuming that there's something evil assuming that there's something evil assuming that there's something evil lying behind it and I don't think that lying behind it and I don't think that lying behind it and I don't think that that's what's happening here but we that's what's happening here but we that's what's happening here but we obviously know from all the work that's obviously know from all the work that's obviously know from all the work that's being done across the industry that AI being done across the industry that AI being done across the industry that AI does have the potential to radically does have the potential to radically does have the potential to radically transform society and particularly when transform society and particularly when transform society and particularly when put in the hands of those that may not put in the hands of those that may not put in the hands of those that may not want to use it for good can really have want to use it for good can really have want to use it for good can really have some pretty devastating impacts on some pretty devastating impacts on some pretty devastating impacts on things like the economy on politics and things like the economy on politics and things like the economy on politics and you know on the geopolitical space you know on the geopolitical space you know on the geopolitical space There's real opportunity that things There's real opportunity that things There's real opportunity that things could go arai with AI being used by Bad could go arai with AI being used by Bad could go arai with AI being used by Bad actors but AI itself doesn't seem to at actors but AI itself doesn't seem to at actors but AI itself doesn't seem to at the moment want to come and kill us all the moment want to come and kill us all the moment want to come and kill us all even though it might have the potential even though it might have the potential even though it might have the potential to do so so I don't think that we are to do so so I don't think that we are to do so so I don't think that we are starting the conversation from a starting the conversation from a starting the conversation from a position that we should be fearful of AI position that we should be fearful of AI position that we should be fearful of AI but we are in a position where we need but we are in a position where we need but we are in a position where we need to be faithful with it and particularly to be faithful with it and particularly to be faithful with it and particularly take a considered approach to how we use take a considered approach to how we use take a considered approach to how we use it as Christians and how we bring it it as Christians and how we bring it it as Christians and how we bring it into the church and everything else that

into the church and everything else that into the church and everything else that we do one of the things that I think we do one of the things that I think we do one of the things that I think about a lot is unintended consequences about a lot is unintended consequences about a lot is unintended consequences so you know if you if you look at social so you know if you if you look at social so you know if you if you look at social media a decade ago most people well media a decade ago most people well media a decade ago most people well maybe not a decade ago but 15 years ago maybe not a decade ago but 15 years ago maybe not a decade ago but 15 years ago as it was developing most people would as it was developing most people would as it was developing most people would say oh this is good we had no idea it say oh this is good we had no idea it say oh this is good we had no idea it would produce the unintended would produce the unintended would produce the unintended consequences particularly among teenage consequences particularly among teenage consequences particularly among teenage girls um you know gen Z with the anxiety girls um you know gen Z with the anxiety girls um you know gen Z with the anxiety Jonathan heid has done some incredible Jonathan heid has done some incredible Jonathan heid has done some incredible work in that area this year just work in that area this year just work in that area this year just highlighting I just got finished reading highlighting I just got finished reading highlighting I just got finished reading the anxious generation and I think it we the anxious generation and I think it we the anxious generation and I think it we we see that those like second and third we see that those like second and third we see that those like second and third order consequences just couldn't have order consequences just couldn't have order consequences just couldn't have been anticipated when that technology been anticipated when that technology been anticipated when that technology emerged well exactly and I mean you know emerged well exactly and I mean you know emerged well exactly and I mean you know I I didn't see it either and I was an I I didn't see it either and I was an I I didn't see it either and I was an avid adapter and you know now I realize avid adapter and you know now I realize avid adapter and you know now I realize oh yeah this is messing with my brain oh yeah this is messing with my brain oh yeah this is messing with my brain too so you know when you think about AI too so you know when you think about AI too so you know when you think about AI in the future um in the future um in the future um one of the sub arguments under how one of the sub arguments under how one of the sub arguments under how social media is used but also AI is it's social media is used but also AI is it's social media is used but also AI is it's all monetized like there's government all monetized like there's government all monetized like there's government policy can hardly keep up the EU has policy can hardly keep up the EU has policy can hardly keep up the EU has done probably the best job globally or done probably the best job globally or done probably the best job globally or worst job depending on how you look at worst job depending on how you look at worst job depending on how you look at it of of regulating technology but like it of of regulating technology but like it of of regulating technology but like the government doesn't even understand the government doesn't even understand the government doesn't even understand it and I was reading some backstory on it and I was reading some backstory on it and I was reading some backstory on Sam Altman being kicked out of the board Sam Altman being kicked out of the board Sam Altman being kicked out of the board for um for open AI earlier this year and for um for open AI earlier this year and for um for open AI earlier this year and then being brought back in after he was then being brought back in after he was then being brought back in after he was offered by Microsoft and it seemed to be offered by Microsoft and it seemed to be offered by Microsoft and it seemed to be the the the backstory there from what I the the the backstory there from what I the the the backstory there from what I can determine and again I don't know Sam

can determine and again I don't know Sam can determine and again I don't know Sam Alman and I'm I don't live in Silicon Alman and I'm I don't live in Silicon Alman and I'm I don't live in Silicon Valley is that it was his seeming lack Valley is that it was his seeming lack Valley is that it was his seeming lack of regard for the human consequences of of regard for the human consequences of of regard for the human consequences of AI and really the race to be first to AI and really the race to be first to AI and really the race to be first to Market dominant in Market profit profit Market dominant in Market profit profit Market dominant in Market profit profit profit um any thoughts on that when profit um any thoughts on that when profit um any thoughts on that when really you you can make an argument with really you you can make an argument with really you you can make an argument with the Magnificent 7 that it's just a race the Magnificent 7 that it's just a race the Magnificent 7 that it's just a race to shareholders greatest profitability to shareholders greatest profitability to shareholders greatest profitability to be first Etc is that what you mean by to be first Etc is that what you mean by to be first Etc is that what you mean by the existential threat being in the the existential threat being in the the existential threat being in the hands of humans or what's your take on hands of humans or what's your take on hands of humans or what's your take on monetization and all of this well so the monetization and all of this well so the monetization and all of this well so the existential threat problem mostly comes existential threat problem mostly comes existential threat problem mostly comes from these models getting out of hand from these models getting out of hand from these models getting out of hand and into the hands of those that might and into the hands of those that might and into the hands of those that might use them for nefarious purposes we think use them for nefarious purposes we think use them for nefarious purposes we think about things like fake news Mass about things like fake news Mass about things like fake news Mass generation of you know content that may generation of you know content that may generation of you know content that may affect elections obviously we're in the affect elections obviously we're in the affect elections obviously we're in the year as we record of the election year as we record of the election year as we record of the election depending this we'll see many of those depending this we'll see many of those depending this we'll see many of those been affected by a but I would guess a been affected by a but I would guess a been affected by a but I would guess a lot not there's a real effect or at lot not there's a real effect or at lot not there's a real effect or at least a correlator effect that we point least a correlator effect that we point least a correlator effect that we point at and say hey there was fake news in at and say hey there was fake news in at and say hey there was fake news in the ecosystem it'll be hard to make an the ecosystem it'll be hard to make an the ecosystem it'll be hard to make an argument with anybody that that's not argument with anybody that that's not argument with anybody that that's not really been the case whether or not it's really been the case whether or not it's really been the case whether or not it's had any real causal effects on outcome had any real causal effects on outcome had any real causal effects on outcome of Elections that that's yet to be seen of Elections that that's yet to be seen of Elections that that's yet to be seen but certainly that it'll be out there but certainly that it'll be out there but certainly that it'll be out there and it'll be something that people point and it'll be something that people point and it'll be something that people point at and that in itself is disruptive at and that in itself is disruptive at and that in itself is disruptive right when something like this this new right when something like this this new right when something like this this new technology comes into the space long technology comes into the space long technology comes into the space long before think back to Cambridge analytica before think back to Cambridge analytica before think back to Cambridge analytica think back to what happened with think back to what happened with think back to what happened with Facebook long before anyone found out

Facebook long before anyone found out Facebook long before anyone found out there was something going on under the there was something going on under the there was something going on under the hood there people were still pointing at hood there people were still pointing at hood there people were still pointing at Facebook and pointing at many other Facebook and pointing at many other Facebook and pointing at many other social platforms and saying this is social platforms and saying this is social platforms and saying this is going to have a negative effect on our going to have a negative effect on our going to have a negative effect on our elections or on the outcome of other elections or on the outcome of other elections or on the outcome of other social issues and I think we can already social issues and I think we can already social issues and I think we can already do that with AI in an unchecked do that with AI in an unchecked do that with AI in an unchecked unregulated way now the good thing is I unregulated way now the good thing is I unregulated way now the good thing is I do think Global Regulators are learning do think Global Regulators are learning do think Global Regulators are learning from what's happened in the social media from what's happened in the social media from what's happened in the social media space and as you in the EU and in the US space and as you in the EU and in the US space and as you in the EU and in the US and around the world people will move and around the world people will move and around the world people will move fast to try and bring some kind of fast to try and bring some kind of fast to try and bring some kind of regulation in but the the big difference regulation in but the the big difference regulation in but the the big difference here is that this isn't a a channel that here is that this isn't a a channel that here is that this isn't a a channel that we're talking about AI isn't something we're talking about AI isn't something we're talking about AI isn't something that just becomes one person's job in that just becomes one person's job in that just becomes one person's job in the company or one person's job in the the company or one person's job in the the company or one person's job in the church this affects everything it's church this affects everything it's church this affects everything it's affecting all the tools that we use now affecting all the tools that we use now affecting all the tools that we use now even the things we're using to record even the things we're using to record even the things we're using to record this podcast or the computer that you're this podcast or the computer that you're this podcast or the computer that you're using today certainly the phone that using today certainly the phone that using today certainly the phone that you're going to use in the next 24 you're going to use in the next 24 you're going to use in the next 24 months is going to have some kind of AI months is going to have some kind of AI months is going to have some kind of AI living inside of it and until we all living inside of it and until we all living inside of it and until we all have a better understanding of what that have a better understanding of what that have a better understanding of what that means for us we're not going to be means for us we're not going to be means for us we're not going to be turning it off by default we're most of turning it off by default we're most of turning it off by default we're most of the time going to be opted into it and the time going to be opted into it and the time going to be opted into it and so we could accidentally if we're not so we could accidentally if we're not so we could accidentally if we're not careful sleep walk into another type of careful sleep walk into another type of careful sleep walk into another type of experience that we've had with social experience that we've had with social experience that we've had with social media where we are falling foul to media where we are falling foul to media where we are falling foul to giving our data over to platforms that giving our data over to platforms that giving our data over to platforms that may want to use it for different may want to use it for different may want to use it for different purposes even if that's just to monetize purposes even if that's just to monetize purposes even if that's just to monetize it with us not knowing about it even if it with us not knowing about it even if it with us not knowing about it even if that's just the worst thing that happens that's just the worst thing that happens that's just the worst thing that happens that's still something that could be that's still something that could be that's still something that could be happening to us that we might not want happening to us that we might not want happening to us that we might not want to be participating in I think that's to be participating in I think that's to be participating in I think that's why we've got to be cautious you know why we've got to be cautious you know why we've got to be cautious you know strange analogy here but I just strange analogy here but I just strange analogy here but I just interviewed William Yuri who will be on

interviewed William Yuri who will be on interviewed William Yuri who will be on the podcast so he wrote the infamous the podcast so he wrote the infamous the podcast so he wrote the infamous getting TOS Fisher and Yuri and has been getting TOS Fisher and Yuri and has been getting TOS Fisher and Yuri and has been involved in really the biggest involved in really the biggest involved in really the biggest negotiations of the last 50 years and negotiations of the last 50 years and negotiations of the last 50 years and although we didn't spend a lot of time although we didn't spend a lot of time although we didn't spend a lot of time on it in the conversation remember on it in the conversation remember on it in the conversation remember talking to him off Mike about the arms talking to him off Mike about the arms talking to him off Mike about the arms race like the start talks the salt talks race like the start talks the salt talks race like the start talks the salt talks you're probably too young to remember you're probably too young to remember you're probably too young to remember those in real time I was in college I those in real time I was in college I those in real time I was in college I remember them read about them and there remember them read about them and there remember them read about them and there was the arms race right like in the ' was the arms race right like in the ' was the arms race right like in the ' 80s that was a very real thing and it 80s that was a very real thing and it 80s that was a very real thing and it looked like you know there was the Mad looked like you know there was the Mad looked like you know there was the Mad pack the mutually assured destruction pack the mutually assured destruction pack the mutually assured destruction that if the United States or the Soviet that if the United States or the Soviet that if the United States or the Soviet Union now Russia press a nuclear button Union now Russia press a nuclear button Union now Russia press a nuclear button the planet was blown to Smither in in in the planet was blown to Smither in in in the planet was blown to Smither in in in minutes and we came close a few times minutes and we came close a few times minutes and we came close a few times and then that and then that and then that decelerated so do you see right now we decelerated so do you see right now we decelerated so do you see right now we kind of have another race in technology kind of have another race in technology kind of have another race in technology to the top it'sit driven it's not driven to the top it'sit driven it's not driven to the top it'sit driven it's not driven by States and governments it's driven by by States and governments it's driven by by States and governments it's driven by Private Industry do you see any kind of Private Industry do you see any kind of Private Industry do you see any kind of and and I know you work in this area and and I know you work in this area and and I know you work in this area hence the question any kind of um not hence the question any kind of um not hence the question any kind of um not external ethical Council but internal external ethical Council but internal external ethical Council but internal where open AI sits down with anthropic where open AI sits down with anthropic where open AI sits down with anthropic sits down with the thousands of startups sits down with the thousands of startups sits down with the thousands of startups with meta and says hey what are we doing with meta and says hey what are we doing with meta and says hey what are we doing here that will benefit Humanity do you here that will benefit Humanity do you here that will benefit Humanity do you see any of that happening or is that see any of that happening or is that see any of that happening or is that really left to outside really left to outside really left to outside actors well I think that it's definitely actors well I think that it's definitely actors well I think that it's definitely coming because the pressure is there for coming because the pressure is there for coming because the pressure is there for them to all be on the same page the them to all be on the same page the them to all be on the same page the challenge obviously with the commercial

challenge obviously with the commercial challenge obviously with the commercial side of it is that none of them want to side of it is that none of them want to side of it is that none of them want to share their toys right they all want to share their toys right they all want to share their toys right they all want to keep their own little special source and keep their own little special source and keep their own little special source and that's understandable too I mean the AI that's understandable too I mean the AI that's understandable too I mean the AI Wars they're basically becoming a proxy Wars they're basically becoming a proxy Wars they're basically becoming a proxy for the cloud Wars that we've seen over for the cloud Wars that we've seen over for the cloud Wars that we've seen over the past decade of you know the Amazons the past decade of you know the Amazons the past decade of you know the Amazons the Googles they're competing but the the Googles they're competing but the the Googles they're competing but the difference is that they've all been difference is that they've all been difference is that they've all been leapfrogged by some of these startups leapfrogged by some of these startups leapfrogged by some of these startups that they couldn't have anticipated at that they couldn't have anticipated at that they couldn't have anticipated at the time and hence the Investments that the time and hence the Investments that the time and hence the Investments that are coming in left right and Center what are coming in left right and Center what are coming in left right and Center what what's really interesting if you look at what's really interesting if you look at what's really interesting if you look at the board makeup of many of these the board makeup of many of these the board makeup of many of these companies they've got people sitting companies they've got people sitting companies they've got people sitting across them from all these different across them from all these different across them from all these different companies on each other's boards they're companies on each other's boards they're companies on each other's boards they're building up different teams you've got building up different teams you've got building up different teams you've got you know people like from Google that you know people like from Google that you know people like from Google that are now on the anthropic board you've are now on the anthropic board you've are now on the anthropic board you've got Amazon investing in them as well as got Amazon investing in them as well as got Amazon investing in them as well as Google investing in them um and so it Google investing in them um and so it Google investing in them um and so it does make the landscape quite muddled does make the landscape quite muddled does make the landscape quite muddled but they all are essentially moving but they all are essentially moving but they all are essentially moving towards the same thing of for-profit as towards the same thing of for-profit as towards the same thing of for-profit as the means of growing these things and the means of growing these things and the means of growing these things and there's nothing necess neily there's nothing necess neily there's nothing necess neily intrinsically wrong with that but the intrinsically wrong with that but the intrinsically wrong with that but the accountability is the thing that we want accountability is the thing that we want accountability is the thing that we want to see and obviously that's the work to see and obviously that's the work to see and obviously that's the work that's being done by the EU with the AI that's being done by the EU with the AI that's being done by the EU with the AI act that's just been passed uh is what's act that's just been passed uh is what's act that's just been passed uh is what's going through Congress at the moment I'm going through Congress at the moment I'm going through Congress at the moment I'm sure what will be uh coming out in both sure what will be uh coming out in both sure what will be uh coming out in both the Canadian and the UK governments as the Canadian and the UK governments as the Canadian and the UK governments as they try and bring something that's of they try and bring something that's of they try and bring something that's of parac to those um you know registrations parac to those um you know registrations parac to those um you know registrations and leg legislations but the challenge and leg legislations but the challenge and leg legislations but the challenge is how will we as a society respond to is how will we as a society respond to is how will we as a society respond to this I think that's the bigger problem this I think that's the bigger problem this I think that's the bigger problem because governments great at regulating because governments great at regulating because governments great at regulating big companies it's much easier for them big companies it's much easier for them big companies it's much easier for them to do because there's less people they to do because there's less people they to do because there's less people they have to talk to but I kind of look at it have to talk to but I kind of look at it have to talk to but I kind of look at it as the analogy of like when we wanted to as the analogy of like when we wanted to as the analogy of like when we wanted to make cars safer we had to do two things

make cars safer we had to do two things make cars safer we had to do two things at the same time you had to go to Ford at the same time you had to go to Ford at the same time you had to go to Ford and GM and Volvo and everyone and say and GM and Volvo and everyone and say and GM and Volvo and everyone and say hey put seat belts in the car and that hey put seat belts in the car and that hey put seat belts in the car and that was one part of the problem and then the was one part of the problem and then the was one part of the problem and then the other part of the problem was telling other part of the problem was telling other part of the problem was telling all of us to put the seat bels on when all of us to put the seat bels on when all of us to put the seat bels on when we got in the car yeah and that's the we got in the car yeah and that's the we got in the car yeah and that's the bit that seems to me is missing we're bit that seems to me is missing we're bit that seems to me is missing we're not seeing an awful lot of work by not seeing an awful lot of work by not seeing an awful lot of work by governments Regulators but other public governments Regulators but other public governments Regulators but other public bodies to make sure that you know Carrie bodies to make sure that you know Carrie bodies to make sure that you know Carrie knows what he's doing with his data and knows what he's doing with his data and knows what he's doing with his data and JP knows what he's doing with his data JP knows what he's doing with his data JP knows what he's doing with his data and just put that on a higher pedestal and just put that on a higher pedestal and just put that on a higher pedestal than we do right now and we see this you than we do right now and we see this you than we do right now and we see this you all across the place and you know you all across the place and you know you all across the place and you know you mentioned Jonathan Height's work um mentioned Jonathan Height's work um mentioned Jonathan Height's work um around the anxious generation we're just around the anxious generation we're just around the anxious generation we're just handing over so much of our data in the handing over so much of our data in the handing over so much of our data in the form of our smartphones and particularly form of our smartphones and particularly form of our smartphones and particularly we're handing over those smartphones to we're handing over those smartphones to we're handing over those smartphones to our kids uh without training them on hey our kids uh without training them on hey our kids uh without training them on hey this is what's going on with the data this is what's going on with the data this is what's going on with the data that you're giving away when you sign that you're giving away when you sign that you're giving away when you sign that little tick box without reading the that little tick box without reading the that little tick box without reading the terms and conditions terms and conditions terms and conditions that's where we need to be paying more that's where we need to be paying more that's where we need to be paying more attention so Does anybody read the terms attention so Does anybody read the terms attention so Does anybody read the terms and conditions like seriously I know I and conditions like seriously I know I and conditions like seriously I know I know and then it's uh accept all cookies know and then it's uh accept all cookies know and then it's uh accept all cookies decline all cookies or Worse manage your decline all cookies or Worse manage your decline all cookies or Worse manage your preferences and I've hit the manage your preferences and I've hit the manage your preferences and I've hit the manage your preferences and I'm led into this preferences and I'm led into this preferences and I'm led into this confusing landscape that I'm just like confusing landscape that I'm just like confusing landscape that I'm just like all right I'll just accept them what's all right I'll just accept them what's all right I'll just accept them what's at stake in in moments like that where at stake in in moments like that where at stake in in moments like that where we're accepting terms and conditions and we're accepting terms and conditions and we're accepting terms and conditions and cookies and I know that Google's going cookies and I know that Google's going cookies and I know that Google's going to change that massively this year as to change that massively this year as to change that massively this year as well with the death of third party well with the death of third party well with the death of third party cookies but well I mean the the history cookies but well I mean the the history cookies but well I mean the the history of the internet is us giving up privacy of the internet is us giving up privacy of the internet is us giving up privacy for utility right yeah if we find enough

for utility right yeah if we find enough for utility right yeah if we find enough utility in anything we'll give up some utility in anything we'll give up some utility in anything we'll give up some privacy for it every time that you want privacy for it every time that you want privacy for it every time that you want an Uber to arrive and find you on the an Uber to arrive and find you on the an Uber to arrive and find you on the street you're giving up a little bit of street you're giving up a little bit of street you're giving up a little bit of privacy for that utility the same if you privacy for that utility the same if you privacy for that utility the same if you want your Shopify account to remember want your Shopify account to remember want your Shopify account to remember your login details or if you want to use your login details or if you want to use your login details or if you want to use meta products to browse what your meta products to browse what your meta products to browse what your college roommates are up to every time college roommates are up to every time college roommates are up to every time we do that we're giving up some level of we do that we're giving up some level of we do that we're giving up some level of privacy for that social utility back and privacy for that social utility back and privacy for that social utility back and the history of as I say the internet the history of as I say the internet the history of as I say the internet says that we will continue to do that says that we will continue to do that says that we will continue to do that because as humans just by our very because as humans just by our very because as humans just by our very nature we're quite lazy animals we like nature we're quite lazy animals we like nature we're quite lazy animals we like to find straight paths between point a to find straight paths between point a to find straight paths between point a and point B and as long as we're those and point B and as long as we're those and point B and as long as we're those lazy animals will continue to find ways lazy animals will continue to find ways lazy animals will continue to find ways even self-inflicted of exploiting that even self-inflicted of exploiting that even self-inflicted of exploiting that laziness uh to get what we want and laziness uh to get what we want and laziness uh to get what we want and that's where the biggest problem is is that's where the biggest problem is is that's where the biggest problem is is that most often these products are not that most often these products are not that most often these products are not particularly clear about what they're particularly clear about what they're particularly clear about what they're doing with the data and even if they are doing with the data and even if they are doing with the data and even if they are clear with what they're doing with the clear with what they're doing with the clear with what they're doing with the data they're moving at such a speed that data they're moving at such a speed that data they're moving at such a speed that we can't really know five 10 years from we can't really know five 10 years from we can't really know five 10 years from now what this is going to look like you now what this is going to look like you now what this is going to look like you know the AI that we have today as our know the AI that we have today as our know the AI that we have today as our mutual friend keny Jang says is the mutual friend keny Jang says is the mutual friend keny Jang says is the dumbest it will ever be yes right yeah dumbest it will ever be yes right yeah dumbest it will ever be yes right yeah and that's the thing that we can't and that's the thing that we can't and that's the thing that we can't anticipate if you even think about the anticipate if you even think about the anticipate if you even think about the advancements we've seen in the past 48 advancements we've seen in the past 48 advancements we've seen in the past 48 months um from these quite simple months um from these quite simple months um from these quite simple language models things like Alexa things language models things like Alexa things language models things like Alexa things like Google Assistant then we get the like Google Assistant then we get the like Google Assistant then we get the first versions of chat GPT that can just first versions of chat GPT that can just first versions of chat GPT that can just just about write something interesting just about write something interesting just about write something interesting but then these Leaps and Bounds to the but then these Leaps and Bounds to the but then these Leaps and Bounds to the video and the imagery that they're able video and the imagery that they're able video and the imagery that they're able to create if that curve continues to to create if that curve continues to to create if that curve continues to grow exponentially five years from now grow exponentially five years from now grow exponentially five years from now 10 years from now we can't even imagine

10 years from now we can't even imagine 10 years from now we can't even imagine what these things are going to be able what these things are going to be able what these things are going to be able to do and they're all learning from the to do and they're all learning from the to do and they're all learning from the data that we're giving them right now data that we're giving them right now data that we're giving them right now and they'll learn from the data that we and they'll learn from the data that we and they'll learn from the data that we create using these tools in the years to create using these tools in the years to create using these tools in the years to come and so that's why we need to take come and so that's why we need to take come and so that's why we need to take more accountability for what we're using more accountability for what we're using more accountability for what we're using them for well this is on an individual them for well this is on an individual them for well this is on an individual user basis but also for all the leaders user basis but also for all the leaders user basis but also for all the leaders who run organizations whose who run organizations whose who run organizations whose organizations are collecting this kind organizations are collecting this kind organizations are collecting this kind of information too right so qu two of information too right so qu two of information too right so qu two questions for you number one what do you questions for you number one what do you questions for you number one what do you do do you accept all cookies do you do do you accept all cookies do you do do you accept all cookies do you decline some do you manage your decline some do you manage your decline some do you manage your preferences what what do you do preferences what what do you do preferences what what do you do personally with that knowing what you personally with that knowing what you personally with that knowing what you know which is you know probably more know which is you know probably more know which is you know probably more than most of us listening to this than most of us listening to this than most of us listening to this podcast and certainly more than the podcast and certainly more than the podcast and certainly more than the person conducting this person conducting this person conducting this interview I think you're more educated interview I think you're more educated interview I think you're more educated than you let on I would say little than you let on I would say little than you let on I would say little knowledge is dangerous it's very knowledge is dangerous it's very knowledge is dangerous it's very dangerous I try I I think I try but I'm dangerous I try I I think I try but I'm dangerous I try I I think I try but I'm I'm not gonna say that I'm not guilty of I'm not gonna say that I'm not guilty of I'm not gonna say that I'm not guilty of this myself because I too want all of this myself because I too want all of this myself because I too want all of those things but I would be particularly those things but I would be particularly those things but I would be particularly when it comes to these AI tools that are when it comes to these AI tools that are when it comes to these AI tools that are now being built on top of the language now being built on top of the language now being built on top of the language models let's move like the social models let's move like the social models let's move like the social networks and other things like you know networks and other things like you know networks and other things like you know the iTunes privacy agreement to one side the iTunes privacy agreement to one side the iTunes privacy agreement to one side and think about particularly these AI and think about particularly these AI and think about particularly these AI tools one of the things I'm always doing tools one of the things I'm always doing tools one of the things I'm always doing is looking at what models are they built is looking at what models are they built is looking at what models are they built on top of you've obviously got things on top of you've obviously got things on top of you've obviously got things like chat gbt which we all know many like chat gbt which we all know many like chat gbt which we all know many people might have tried out something people might have tried out something people might have tried out something like Claude or perplexity and then like Claude or perplexity and then like Claude or perplexity and then there's the new AIS that tend to be feel there's the new AIS that tend to be feel there's the new AIS that tend to be feel more friendly like the um pie from more friendly like the um pie from more friendly like the um pie from inflection uh some of these tools you inflection uh some of these tools you inflection uh some of these tools you you guys may find or you'll find in the you guys may find or you'll find in the you guys may find or you'll find in the show notes I'm sure but these new types

show notes I'm sure but these new types show notes I'm sure but these new types of tools they're not always the of tools they're not always the of tools they're not always the experience that you're having with them experience that you're having with them experience that you're having with them at least is not always built by that at least is not always built by that at least is not always built by that same company we're seeing lots of same company we're seeing lots of same company we're seeing lots of startups lots of people building new startups lots of people building new startups lots of people building new experiences that you can use on your experiences that you can use on your experiences that you can use on your phone or on the desktop that are rappers phone or on the desktop that are rappers phone or on the desktop that are rappers on top of other language like a skin on top of other language like a skin on top of other language like a skin right skin with some prompt engineering right skin with some prompt engineering right skin with some prompt engineering and and and specialized if you don't and and and specialized if you don't and and and specialized if you don't know what model is underneath that you know what model is underneath that you know what model is underneath that you don't know where your data is ultimately don't know where your data is ultimately don't know where your data is ultimately going to and what it's being used for in going to and what it's being used for in going to and what it's being used for in the future now I personally I don't the future now I personally I don't the future now I personally I don't think there's anything particularly think there's anything particularly think there's anything particularly nefarious going on at any of these nefarious going on at any of these nefarious going on at any of these companies right now there's no evidence companies right now there's no evidence companies right now there's no evidence to suggest that from what I'm seeing to suggest that from what I'm seeing to suggest that from what I'm seeing they all ultimately as you've alluded to they all ultimately as you've alluded to they all ultimately as you've alluded to before are commercial Enterprises and before are commercial Enterprises and before are commercial Enterprises and they want to make money and the minute they want to make money and the minute they want to make money and the minute that they lose our trust is the minute that they lose our trust is the minute that they lose our trust is the minute they stop making money so we you know they stop making money so we you know they stop making money so we you know there is that kind of interesting there is that kind of interesting there is that kind of interesting tension that the commercial aspect of tension that the commercial aspect of tension that the commercial aspect of all this holds but doesn't mean that the all this holds but doesn't mean that the all this holds but doesn't mean that the companies building on top of these companies building on top of these companies building on top of these things don't want to do things that things don't want to do things that things don't want to do things that either are not like I say bad in either are not like I say bad in either are not like I say bad in themselves but they may not be things themselves but they may not be things themselves but they may not be things that we necessarily want to support as a that we necessarily want to support as a that we necessarily want to support as a society and particularly within society and particularly within society and particularly within leadership or within Church context the leadership or within Church context the leadership or within Church context the these are the issues that I think we these are the issues that I think we these are the issues that I think we want to pay more attention to because want to pay more attention to because want to pay more attention to because just because something can be done just because something can be done just because something can be done doesn't necessarily mean that it should doesn't necessarily mean that it should doesn't necessarily mean that it should be done um or certainly that we would be done um or certainly that we would be done um or certainly that we would want it to be done so when you think want it to be done so when you think want it to be done so when you think about the future I I like to think in about the future I I like to think in about the future I I like to think in terms of trajectory or trend lines JP so terms of trajectory or trend lines JP so terms of trajectory or trend lines JP so you know if you look at the decline of you know if you look at the decline of you know if you look at the decline of the church over time there's a trend

the church over time there's a trend the church over time there's a trend line and even after covid I was reading line and even after covid I was reading line and even after covid I was reading a few graphs recently basically there's a few graphs recently basically there's a few graphs recently basically there's an interruption pattern Interruption and an interruption pattern Interruption and an interruption pattern Interruption and then it continues on the historic trend then it continues on the historic trend then it continues on the historic trend line down which is really too bad other line down which is really too bad other line down which is really too bad other companies like the rise of tech market companies like the rise of tech market companies like the rise of tech market capitalization or user share the trend capitalization or user share the trend capitalization or user share the trend line is here's 2010 here's 2015 here's line is here's 2010 here's 2015 here's line is here's 2010 here's 2015 here's 2020 here's 2024 it's up right so with 2020 here's 2024 it's up right so with 2020 here's 2024 it's up right so with with no current no future intervention with no current no future intervention with no current no future intervention beyond what we see beyond what we see beyond what we see now I'd like to go into the worst case now I'd like to go into the worst case now I'd like to go into the worst case for AI and the best case for AI so and I for AI and the best case for AI so and I for AI and the best case for AI so and I know ask 10 people get 10 opinions I get know ask 10 people get 10 opinions I get know ask 10 people get 10 opinions I get it but I would love your take as it but I would love your take as it but I would love your take as somebody who's literally built and sold somebody who's literally built and sold somebody who's literally built and sold companies in Ai and who sits on a board companies in Ai and who sits on a board companies in Ai and who sits on a board and you know has your res and you know has your res and you know has your res what is the worst what is the worst what is the worst case um that we could imagine a world 5 case um that we could imagine a world 5 case um that we could imagine a world 5 10 years down the road in terms of AI 10 years down the road in terms of AI 10 years down the road in terms of AI and where it's and where it's and where it's going well if anyone has watched the going well if anyone has watched the going well if anyone has watched the recent Mission Impossible movies they'll recent Mission Impossible movies they'll recent Mission Impossible movies they'll have seen what looks like potentially have seen what looks like potentially have seen what looks like potentially the worst case scenario which is some the worst case scenario which is some the worst case scenario which is some kind of large scale AI emerges as being kind of large scale AI emerges as being kind of large scale AI emerges as being um I would not say sentian because I'm um I would not say sentian because I'm um I would not say sentian because I'm not sure that that's actually possible not sure that that's actually possible not sure that that's actually possible within our theology but with something within our theology but with something within our theology but with something that emerges with the super intelligence that emerges with the super intelligence that emerges with the super intelligence that is beyond our that is beyond our that is beyond our control and starts deciding that either control and starts deciding that either control and starts deciding that either it's going to align itself with those it's going to align itself with those it's going to align itself with those that would seek to see the downfall of that would seek to see the downfall of that would seek to see the downfall of society or the end of the western world society or the end of the western world society or the end of the western world or however you want to put it or that it or however you want to put it or that it or however you want to put it or that it just makes that decision in and of

just makes that decision in and of just makes that decision in and of itself and says you know what humans itself and says you know what humans itself and says you know what humans you're not doing a great job looking you're not doing a great job looking you're not doing a great job looking after this planet maybe we would be after this planet maybe we would be after this planet maybe we would be better off without you and that argument better off without you and that argument better off without you and that argument has been made by many the likelihood of has been made by many the likelihood of has been made by many the likelihood of that happening I think is far off that happening I think is far off that happening I think is far off because I think there are many steps because I think there are many steps because I think there are many steps between here and there before we get between here and there before we get between here and there before we get anywhere near that being a challenge but anywhere near that being a challenge but anywhere near that being a challenge but it's not entirely impossible and because it's not entirely impossible and because it's not entirely impossible and because it's not entirely impossible we should it's not entirely impossible we should it's not entirely impossible we should at least give it some level of you at least give it some level of you at least give it some level of you attention if nothing else to make sure attention if nothing else to make sure attention if nothing else to make sure it shapes the way that we follow policy it shapes the way that we follow policy it shapes the way that we follow policy and that we keep away from those things and that we keep away from those things and that we keep away from those things in the same way that we did with nuclear in the same way that we did with nuclear in the same way that we did with nuclear weapons which is often the you weapons which is often the you weapons which is often the you comparison and probably more importantly comparison and probably more importantly comparison and probably more importantly the way that we didn't really do it with the way that we didn't really do it with the way that we didn't really do it with social media which is probably a more social media which is probably a more social media which is probably a more accurate comparison in terms of the accurate comparison in terms of the accurate comparison in terms of the actual net impact that it's had on actual net impact that it's had on actual net impact that it's had on people around the world so I think in people around the world so I think in people around the world so I think in terms of worst case scenarios that's terms of worst case scenarios that's terms of worst case scenarios that's kind of out there in the existential kind of out there in the existential kind of out there in the existential threat category but what I think is more threat category but what I think is more threat category but what I think is more the likely worst case scenario is that the likely worst case scenario is that the likely worst case scenario is that these models continue to grow unchecked these models continue to grow unchecked these models continue to grow unchecked and that we just begin to adopt them and that we just begin to adopt them and that we just begin to adopt them into society in a way that we just into society in a way that we just into society in a way that we just wouldn't want to see happen I think the wouldn't want to see happen I think the wouldn't want to see happen I think the the one area that I'm particularly the one area that I'm particularly the one area that I'm particularly passionate about is in relationships passionate about is in relationships passionate about is in relationships we've already seen the impact that covid we've already seen the impact that covid we've already seen the impact that covid and the smartphone has had on young and the smartphone has had on young and the smartphone has had on young people's ability to form lasting social people's ability to form lasting social people's ability to form lasting social bonds with one another to you know have bonds with one another to you know have bonds with one another to you know have deep conversations and deep deep conversations and deep deep conversations and deep relationships and who knows already what relationships and who knows already what relationships and who knows already what knock on impact that's going to have 10 knock on impact that's going to have 10 knock on impact that's going to have 10 years down the road to the population years down the road to the population years down the road to the population let alone anything else if young men let alone anything else if young men let alone anything else if young men can't find young women to you know build can't find young women to you know build can't find young women to you know build the population with without some other the population with without some other the population with without some other artificial intervention we're GNA have artificial intervention we're GNA have artificial intervention we're GNA have problems guys like that's the way it's

problems guys like that's the way it's problems guys like that's the way it's going add to the ability for you to have going add to the ability for you to have going add to the ability for you to have a virtual girlfriend or a virtual a virtual girlfriend or a virtual a virtual girlfriend or a virtual boyfriend and fall in love with the boyfriend and fall in love with the boyfriend and fall in love with the chatbot and be totally happy with that I chatbot and be totally happy with that I chatbot and be totally happy with that I think is a relational category that think is a relational category that think is a relational category that don't want to see emerge and that's don't want to see emerge and that's don't want to see emerge and that's actually probably the more likely worst actually probably the more likely worst actually probably the more likely worst case scenario that we are already seeing case scenario that we are already seeing case scenario that we are already seeing companies building tools building companies building tools building companies building tools building experiences where you can essentially experiences where you can essentially experiences where you can essentially take a step back from society and have take a step back from society and have take a step back from society and have pretty much everything done for you both pretty much everything done for you both pretty much everything done for you both your work product your relational your work product your relational your work product your relational product your you call it whatever aspect product your you call it whatever aspect product your you call it whatever aspect of of your life you want managed and we of of your life you want managed and we of of your life you want managed and we end up in a kind of you know you end up in a kind of you know you end up in a kind of you know you remember that Disney Movie Wally right remember that Disney Movie Wally right remember that Disney Movie Wally right we kind of end up in that kind of all we kind of end up in that kind of all we kind of end up in that kind of all sat in a half vegetative state looking sat in a half vegetative state looking sat in a half vegetative state looking like a potato leaning back watching a like a potato leaning back watching a like a potato leaning back watching a recycling truck clean up the world like recycling truck clean up the world like recycling truck clean up the world like that's not a great outcome generally that's not a great outcome generally that's not a great outcome generally speaking um and that's before they all speaking um and that's before they all speaking um and that's before they all had like AI friends they at least were had like AI friends they at least were had like AI friends they at least were talking to one another so I think that's talking to one another so I think that's talking to one another so I think that's where we could end up in some form and where we could end up in some form and where we could end up in some form and that is to me a more likely worst case that is to me a more likely worst case that is to me a more likely worst case scenario than necessarily you know scenario than necessarily you know scenario than necessarily you know something releases all the nukes or something releases all the nukes or something releases all the nukes or turns off all of the energy grid yeah turns off all of the energy grid yeah turns off all of the energy grid yeah and so sort of a a general eneral social and so sort of a a general eneral social and so sort of a a general eneral social degradation over what we have now and uh degradation over what we have now and uh degradation over what we have now and uh for regular listeners Scott Galloway is for regular listeners Scott Galloway is for regular listeners Scott Galloway is on this here again I don't know exactly on this here again I don't know exactly on this here again I don't know exactly when compared when all the episodes will when compared when all the episodes will when compared when all the episodes will be released but he sees that as a be released but he sees that as a be released but he sees that as a massive threat to our culture is massive threat to our culture is massive threat to our culture is disengaged young men you know he says

disengaged young men you know he says disengaged young men you know he says that's that's where things go bad all that's that's where things go bad all that's that's where things go bad all right now be The Optimist I'm sure right now be The Optimist I'm sure right now be The Optimist I'm sure you've got an optimistic framework again you've got an optimistic framework again you've got an optimistic framework again all things being equal nothing in the all things being equal nothing in the all things being equal nothing in the future radically changing from the future radically changing from the future radically changing from the current trajectory current trajectory current trajectory what is the possible best case what is the possible best case what is the possible best case scenario well I think this is scenario well I think this is scenario well I think this is interesting you recently have Morgan on interesting you recently have Morgan on interesting you recently have Morgan on your show I think talking about kind of your show I think talking about kind of your show I think talking about kind of the things that don't change yes I'm the things that don't change yes I'm the things that don't change yes I'm going to have him yeah or you're GNA going to have him yeah or you're GNA going to have him yeah or you're GNA have and yeah and you know he is um his have and yeah and you know he is um his have and yeah and you know he is um his his recent book I think is really his recent book I think is really his recent book I think is really fascinating because he talks about the fascinating because he talks about the fascinating because he talks about the things that that don't change over time things that that don't change over time things that that don't change over time and I think that's actually more likely and I think that's actually more likely and I think that's actually more likely there's a bunch of human characteristics there's a bunch of human characteristics there's a bunch of human characteristics that don't change I as much as we're that don't change I as much as we're that don't change I as much as we're worried about things like AI girlfriends worried about things like AI girlfriends worried about things like AI girlfriends and stuff I actually think that the over and stuff I actually think that the over and stuff I actually think that the over majority of us still find the pull to be majority of us still find the pull to be majority of us still find the pull to be with one another in the physical space with one another in the physical space with one another in the physical space the real like optimistic view of AI is the real like optimistic view of AI is the real like optimistic view of AI is that it can just take away so many of that it can just take away so many of that it can just take away so many of the drudgery tasks that we all have to the drudgery tasks that we all have to the drudgery tasks that we all have to deal with you know particularly in deal with you know particularly in deal with you know particularly in Ministry context or work contexts you Ministry context or work contexts you Ministry context or work contexts you know we spend so much time administering know we spend so much time administering know we spend so much time administering the work we do rather than doing the work we do rather than doing the work we do rather than doing Ministry or we spend so much time you Ministry or we spend so much time you Ministry or we spend so much time you know on the the busy work that is often know on the the busy work that is often know on the the busy work that is often called rather than actually being busy called rather than actually being busy called rather than actually being busy working on the thing that we want to working on the thing that we want to working on the thing that we want to focus on and AI does hold the promise to focus on and AI does hold the promise to focus on and AI does hold the promise to be able to eliminate vast amounts of be able to eliminate vast amounts of be able to eliminate vast amounts of that work days if not weeks a year of that work days if not weeks a year of that work days if not weeks a year of that you know filling in a spreadsheet that you know filling in a spreadsheet that you know filling in a spreadsheet or entering a form for the 17th time or entering a form for the 17th time or entering a form for the 17th time that was built on you know Windows 97 or that was built on you know Windows 97 or that was built on you know Windows 97 or whatever it might be like these things whatever it might be like these things whatever it might be like these things are out there still and as much as you are out there still and as much as you are out there still and as much as you know the technical world has been

know the technical world has been know the technical world has been revolutionized you walk into any public revolutionized you walk into any public revolutionized you walk into any public Municipal Building or hospital or school Municipal Building or hospital or school Municipal Building or hospital or school and you'll find technologies that have and you'll find technologies that have and you'll find technologies that have been leapfrogged time and time again been leapfrogged time and time again been leapfrogged time and time again still running in you know many of these still running in you know many of these still running in you know many of these places and AI potentially could come places and AI potentially could come places and AI potentially could come along and if not replace those along and if not replace those along and if not replace those Technologies just fill those things in Technologies just fill those things in Technologies just fill those things in for us which would make things a lot for us which would make things a lot for us which would make things a lot easier for most of our lives so easier for most of our lives so easier for most of our lives so Administration I think is going to be Administration I think is going to be Administration I think is going to be one of the big things that maybe we do one of the big things that maybe we do one of the big things that maybe we do end up in the world of being able to do end up in the world of being able to do end up in the world of being able to do the four- day work week and you know the four- day work week and you know the four- day work week and you know living that kind of dream that Tim living that kind of dream that Tim living that kind of dream that Tim Ferris has been selling to us for a Ferris has been selling to us for a Ferris has been selling to us for a number of years yeah that we actually number of years yeah that we actually number of years yeah that we actually might have some lifestyle you know might have some lifestyle you know might have some lifestyle you know benefit over time I think that's one of benefit over time I think that's one of benefit over time I think that's one of the big things but it's also imperative the big things but it's also imperative the big things but it's also imperative right like if we want to solve some of right like if we want to solve some of right like if we want to solve some of the biggest issues in the world climate the biggest issues in the world climate the biggest issues in the world climate change you know cancer uh you other kind change you know cancer uh you other kind change you know cancer uh you other kind of you know um diseases and also make of you know um diseases and also make of you know um diseases and also make sure that our politics is actually sure that our politics is actually sure that our politics is actually something that can sustain itself over something that can sustain itself over something that can sustain itself over time we haven't done a great job of that time we haven't done a great job of that time we haven't done a great job of that as of late as the human race since the as of late as the human race since the as of late as the human race since the Industrial Revolution and those problems Industrial Revolution and those problems Industrial Revolution and those problems are now so big that the speed required are now so big that the speed required are now so big that the speed required to fix them doesn't seem to be possible to fix them doesn't seem to be possible to fix them doesn't seem to be possible in and of ourselves and so my optimistic in and of ourselves and so my optimistic in and of ourselves and so my optimistic view would be that we will see massive view would be that we will see massive view would be that we will see massive breakthroughs whether it's the work breakthroughs whether it's the work breakthroughs whether it's the work that's being done on things like protein that's being done on things like protein that's being done on things like protein folding or the you know discovery of new folding or the you know discovery of new folding or the you know discovery of new drugs the identification of new cancers drugs the identification of new cancers drugs the identification of new cancers the solding of the climate race or you the solding of the climate race or you the solding of the climate race or you know emergence of things like nuclear know emergence of things like nuclear know emergence of things like nuclear you know small nuclear fusion and you know small nuclear fusion and you know small nuclear fusion and nuclear fision reactors which you know nuclear fision reactors which you know nuclear fision reactors which you know will give us Boundless Energy sources will give us Boundless Energy sources will give us Boundless Energy sources we're not going to get to those things we're not going to get to those things we're not going to get to those things without artificial intelligence we don't without artificial intelligence we don't without artificial intelligence we don't have the collective brain power on our have the collective brain power on our have the collective brain power on our own and so I think that we could begin own and so I think that we could begin own and so I think that we could begin to see the New Renaissance begin to

to see the New Renaissance begin to to see the New Renaissance begin to emerge over the next decade as these emerge over the next decade as these emerge over the next decade as these Technologies get smarter so long as the Technologies get smarter so long as the Technologies get smarter so long as the negative opportunities don't outweigh negative opportunities don't outweigh negative opportunities don't outweigh the positive ones um and that people the positive ones um and that people the positive ones um and that people continue to to seek for human continue to to seek for human continue to to seek for human flourishing rather than uh you know the flourishing rather than uh you know the flourishing rather than uh you know the the rather commercial you know sad story the rather commercial you know sad story the rather commercial you know sad story that is being told at the moment of just that is being told at the moment of just that is being told at the moment of just flooding the internet with garbage flooding the internet with garbage flooding the internet with garbage content like that's what seems to be content like that's what seems to be content like that's what seems to be more likely right now but I'm hopeful more likely right now but I'm hopeful more likely right now but I'm hopeful that we might see a new generation of that we might see a new generation of that we might see a new generation of technologists arrive that say wow we can technologists arrive that say wow we can technologists arrive that say wow we can use this stuff to do immense good we'll use this stuff to do immense good we'll use this stuff to do immense good we'll probably toggle between the macro and probably toggle between the macro and probably toggle between the macro and the micro but to dip down into the micro the micro but to dip down into the micro the micro but to dip down into the micro for moment what are some of the most for moment what are some of the most for moment what are some of the most interesting uses of AI that you're interesting uses of AI that you're interesting uses of AI that you're seeing right now and I'd love you to seeing right now and I'd love you to seeing right now and I'd love you to take that in two phases number one just take that in two phases number one just take that in two phases number one just what's on your phone what's on your what's on your phone what's on your what's on your phone what's on your laptop that you're finding absolutely laptop that you're finding absolutely laptop that you're finding absolutely fascinating on a micro level and then fascinating on a micro level and then fascinating on a micro level and then other technologies that perhaps you other technologies that perhaps you other technologies that perhaps you haven't discovered personally yet but haven't discovered personally yet but haven't discovered personally yet but you know are out there what's uh what's you know are out there what's uh what's you know are out there what's uh what's what's got your attention well I mean what's got your attention well I mean what's got your attention well I mean the app that probably gets more the app that probably gets more the app that probably gets more attention on my phone if I think about attention on my phone if I think about attention on my phone if I think about it here than any other it here than any other it here than any other is um perplexity at the moment um as a is um perplexity at the moment um as a is um perplexity at the moment um as a search engine it has almost entirely search engine it has almost entirely search engine it has almost entirely replaced my use of Google this is not a replaced my use of Google this is not a replaced my use of Google this is not a endorsement for them I don't I don't endorsement for them I don't I don't endorsement for them I don't I don't have any particular have any particular have any particular affiliation no nothing nothing of that affiliation no nothing nothing of that affiliation no nothing nothing of that nature but I would just say from nature but I would just say from nature but I would just say from straight out usage um it's amazing how straight out usage um it's amazing how straight out usage um it's amazing how quickly that has replaced things a story quickly that has replaced things a story quickly that has replaced things a story from this week a client rang us out of

from this week a client rang us out of from this week a client rang us out of the blue at Vixen Labs the agency that I the blue at Vixen Labs the agency that I the blue at Vixen Labs the agency that I run uh saying hey I got in touch with run uh saying hey I got in touch with run uh saying hey I got in touch with you because I found an article about the you because I found an article about the you because I found an article about the very specific thing I was looking to do very specific thing I was looking to do very specific thing I was looking to do with AI this week and you were the top with AI this week and you were the top with AI this week and you were the top answer ranked on perplexity because it answer ranked on perplexity because it answer ranked on perplexity because it was found very specifically the the was found very specifically the the was found very specifically the the article he was looking for in a way that article he was looking for in a way that article he was looking for in a way that Google had no ranking for us whatsoever Google had no ranking for us whatsoever Google had no ranking for us whatsoever and even if you take that in microcosm and even if you take that in microcosm and even if you take that in microcosm it's a really good example of how these it's a really good example of how these it's a really good example of how these new tools are helping find much more new tools are helping find much more new tools are helping find much more contextual information so perplexity I contextual information so perplexity I contextual information so perplexity I think is amazing um if nothing else think is amazing um if nothing else think is amazing um if nothing else because I can ask it questions and ask because I can ask it questions and ask because I can ask it questions and ask it follow-up questions and it seems to it follow-up questions and it seems to it follow-up questions and it seems to do a better job of looking at the stuff do a better job of looking at the stuff do a better job of looking at the stuff than I can do on my own just Google than I can do on my own just Google than I can do on my own just Google Google search has so degraded over the Google search has so degraded over the Google search has so degraded over the last couple of years I know they keep last couple of years I know they keep last couple of years I know they keep making changes but it's it's not making changes but it's it's not making changes but it's it's not functionally useless but it's functionally useless but it's functionally useless but it's approaching that and and well once these approaching that and and well once these approaching that and and well once these Gemini models begin to roll out into Gemini models begin to roll out into Gemini models begin to roll out into mainstream Google search which we can mainstream Google search which we can mainstream Google search which we can only anticipate they will then I think only anticipate they will then I think only anticipate they will then I think there's a real chance Google catches up there's a real chance Google catches up there's a real chance Google catches up but for now for me I spend an awful lot but for now for me I spend an awful lot but for now for me I spend an awful lot of time in perplexity uh for anyone that of time in perplexity uh for anyone that of time in perplexity uh for anyone that makes uh slideware or content for the makes uh slideware or content for the makes uh slideware or content for the internet which is sure is all of us that internet which is sure is all of us that internet which is sure is all of us that get stuck in PowerPoint from time to get stuck in PowerPoint from time to get stuck in PowerPoint from time to time I've been using tools like time I've been using tools like time I've been using tools like beautiful a which has an amazing ability beautiful a which has an amazing ability beautiful a which has an amazing ability for you know if you're a pastor or an for you know if you're a pastor or an for you know if you're a pastor or an executive leader of some description executive leader of some description executive leader of some description right now having to put together this right now having to put together this right now having to put together this year's annual reports or quartly year's annual reports or quartly year's annual reports or quartly earnings uh being able to design a slide earnings uh being able to design a slide earnings uh being able to design a slide deck which has the clawed model from deck which has the clawed model from deck which has the clawed model from anthropic running inside of it you can anthropic running inside of it you can anthropic running inside of it you can create an entire 20 slide presentation create an entire 20 slide presentation create an entire 20 slide presentation with one line text prompt oh uh it does with one line text prompt oh uh it does with one line text prompt oh uh it does the layouts for you it goes to Dary and

the layouts for you it goes to Dary and the layouts for you it goes to Dary and creates images for you it chooses the creates images for you it chooses the creates images for you it chooses the most appropriate slide layout like it's most appropriate slide layout like it's most appropriate slide layout like it's an amazing tool again not align with an amazing tool again not align with an amazing tool again not align with them but just that's the one that I them but just that's the one that I them but just that's the one that I spend literally hours in every single spend literally hours in every single spend literally hours in every single day and day and day and beautiful. yeah for sure those are two beautiful. yeah for sure those are two beautiful. yeah for sure those are two checking those out those are new to me checking those out those are new to me checking those out those are new to me I've heard of them but I haven't done I've heard of them but I haven't done I've heard of them but I haven't done anything with them yeah they're anything with them yeah they're anything with them yeah they're definitely great places to start and you definitely great places to start and you definitely great places to start and you if you are already using something like if you are already using something like if you are already using something like chat GPT you can access the gp4 models chat GPT you can access the gp4 models chat GPT you can access the gp4 models you can access the clawed models inside you can access the clawed models inside you can access the clawed models inside of perplexity as well so you can switch of perplexity as well so you can switch of perplexity as well so you can switch around and you pay one subscription around and you pay one subscription around and you pay one subscription price is it is it just me or is Cloe price is it is it just me or is Cloe price is it is it just me or is Cloe significantly more intelligent than chat significantly more intelligent than chat significantly more intelligent than chat GPT 4 right now it's certainly more GPT 4 right now it's certainly more GPT 4 right now it's certainly more eloquent not necessarily more eloquent not necessarily more eloquent not necessarily more intelligent which is really interesting intelligent which is really interesting intelligent which is really interesting um the what we're beginning to see with um the what we're beginning to see with um the what we're beginning to see with some of these models they're they're some of these models they're they're some of these models they're they're bringing personality in in some ways the bringing personality in in some ways the bringing personality in in some ways the Claude model is particularly good at Claude model is particularly good at Claude model is particularly good at long form written content oh that's long form written content oh that's long form written content oh that's probably why I like it yeah well for you probably why I like it yeah well for you probably why I like it yeah well for you exactly and for myself as well like you exactly and for myself as well like you exactly and for myself as well like you it's much better at emulating my voice it's much better at emulating my voice it's much better at emulating my voice when I give it examples than chat GPT is when I give it examples than chat GPT is when I give it examples than chat GPT is and it sticks to the task for longer and it sticks to the task for longer and it sticks to the task for longer than kind of wandering off and doing than kind of wandering off and doing than kind of wandering off and doing something strange which GPT can kind of something strange which GPT can kind of something strange which GPT can kind of be um prone to do so yeah I would be um prone to do so yeah I would be um prone to do so yeah I would definitely say um Claude is also a definitely say um Claude is also a definitely say um Claude is also a really good place to play around with really good place to play around with really good place to play around with particularly if you're a content creator particularly if you're a content creator particularly if you're a content creator if you're a writer if you're someone the if you're a writer if you're someone the if you're a writer if you're someone the right press releases or social media right press releases or social media right press releases or social media content or you know biographies or content or you know biographies or content or you know biographies or whatever it might be anything that's whatever it might be anything that's whatever it might be anything that's longer form Claude is probably your goto longer form Claude is probably your goto longer form Claude is probably your goto uh model right now for doing that well uh model right now for doing that well uh model right now for doing that well and what's really promising is those and what's really promising is those and what's really promising is those models are getting small enough to be models are getting small enough to be models are getting small enough to be able to run on a phone offline which

able to run on a phone offline which able to run on a phone offline which opens up some really interesting opens up some really interesting opens up some really interesting opportunities in places where opportunities in places where opportunities in places where connectivity is bad um or parts of the connectivity is bad um or parts of the connectivity is bad um or parts of the world where AI tools would be pretty world where AI tools would be pretty world where AI tools would be pretty hard to um to justify just because the hard to um to justify just because the hard to um to justify just because the amount of data that they use so um I'm amount of data that they use so um I'm amount of data that they use so um I'm I'm particularly excit about where they I'm particularly excit about where they I'm particularly excit about where they might go yeah that's interesting so might go yeah that's interesting so might go yeah that's interesting so again a one1 question and by the way for again a one1 question and by the way for again a one1 question and by the way for Canadian listeners most are American uh Canadian listeners most are American uh Canadian listeners most are American uh you can't get Cloe at least at the time you can't get Cloe at least at the time you can't get Cloe at least at the time of recording this but a VPN will work of recording this but a VPN will work of recording this but a VPN will work you around that pretty easily yeah a and you around that pretty easily yeah a and you around that pretty easily yeah a and you can also access it via some of these you can also access it via some of these you can also access it via some of these other tools as well which is again the other tools as well which is again the other tools as well which is again the the thing we were saying before about the thing we were saying before about the thing we were saying before about some of these tools they have other some of these tools they have other some of these tools they have other models inside of them so you know your models inside of them so you know your models inside of them so you know your mileage vary but play around and a vpn's mileage vary but play around and a vpn's mileage vary but play around and a vpn's a great idea anyway on public internet a great idea anyway on public internet a great idea anyway on public internet but beyond that that's a virtual private but beyond that that's a virtual private but beyond that that's a virtual private Network Cloe by the way is C Network Cloe by the way is C Network Cloe by the way is C audde uh and what okay so help me audde uh and what okay so help me audde uh and what okay so help me understand as somebody who does not code understand as somebody who does not code understand as somebody who does not code and someone who is not into AI deeply and someone who is not into AI deeply and someone who is not into AI deeply chat GPT is an llm clo is an llm as well chat GPT is an llm clo is an llm as well chat GPT is an llm clo is an llm as well large language model is that right but large language model is that right but large language model is that right but but they're trained on different things but they're trained on different things but they're trained on different things like I don't I don't understand cuz they like I don't I don't understand cuz they like I don't I don't understand cuz they are very different like user interface are very different like user interface are very different like user interface is like oh that was really helpful chat is like oh that was really helpful chat is like oh that was really helpful chat GPT is one more time please with feeling GPT is one more time please with feeling GPT is one more time please with feeling you know so it was helpful to understand you know so it was helpful to understand you know so it was helpful to understand the difference between a large language the difference between a large language the difference between a large language model and the app that you might use model and the app that you might use model and the app that you might use that thing in yeah so Claude has there that thing in yeah so Claude has there that thing in yeah so Claude has there are a number of different clawed models are a number of different clawed models are a number of different clawed models it doesn't help that they're called it doesn't help that they're called it doesn't help that they're called Claude as well but there are a number of Claude as well but there are a number of Claude as well but there are a number of different clawed models if you go to different clawed models if you go to different clawed models if you go to claw. you can interact with the clawed claw. you can interact with the clawed claw. you can interact with the clawed model or at the time of recording it may

model or at the time of recording it may model or at the time of recording it may be a different one from when you're be a different one from when you're be a different one from when you're listening to this but the Claude 3 model listening to this but the Claude 3 model listening to this but the Claude 3 model or CLA four claw five whatever comes or CLA four claw five whatever comes or CLA four claw five whatever comes down the line so the the language model down the line so the the language model down the line so the the language model itself is trained on a massive amount of itself is trained on a massive amount of itself is trained on a massive amount of human created data some synthetic human created data some synthetic human created data some synthetic created data living on the internet and created data living on the internet and created data living on the internet and depending on who you're getting that depending on who you're getting that depending on who you're getting that model from they've sourced it from model from they've sourced it from model from they've sourced it from different places some have more different places some have more different places some have more commercial agreements in place others commercial agreements in place others commercial agreements in place others are just scraping stuff that's in the are just scraping stuff that's in the are just scraping stuff that's in the public domain but the big difference is public domain but the big difference is public domain but the big difference is the way that they're trained and tuned the way that they're trained and tuned the way that they're trained and tuned to behave in different ways and then to behave in different ways and then to behave in different ways and then when you come and use them inside of a when you come and use them inside of a when you come and use them inside of a tool for example inside of chat G PT tool for example inside of chat G PT tool for example inside of chat G PT you're using what is probably the GPT you're using what is probably the GPT you're using what is probably the GPT 3.5 or GPT 4 model those different 3.5 or GPT 4 model those different 3.5 or GPT 4 model those different models have different amounts of data in models have different amounts of data in models have different amounts of data in them different knowledge and they behave them different knowledge and they behave them different knowledge and they behave in slightly different ways but you can in slightly different ways but you can in slightly different ways but you can access both of them inside of the chat access both of them inside of the chat access both of them inside of the chat GPT app and it's the same models that if GPT app and it's the same models that if GPT app and it's the same models that if you use Bing chat for example or you're you use Bing chat for example or you're you use Bing chat for example or you're using Microsoft co-pilot you're using using Microsoft co-pilot you're using using Microsoft co-pilot you're using the GPT for model inside of those tools the GPT for model inside of those tools the GPT for model inside of those tools and they have different abilities too so and they have different abilities too so and they have different abilities too so of idea right yeah but so Bing search of idea right yeah but so Bing search of idea right yeah but so Bing search uses the same model that chat gbt has uses the same model that chat gbt has uses the same model that chat gbt has but it has the ability to go to the but it has the ability to go to the but it has the ability to go to the internet and pull in real time results internet and pull in real time results internet and pull in real time results and blend it with the content that the and blend it with the content that the and blend it with the content that the model can produce the same thing that model can produce the same thing that model can produce the same thing that perplexity is able to do when they're perplexity is able to do when they're perplexity is able to do when they're using their own perplexity search model using their own perplexity search model using their own perplexity search model and Claude isn't able to do in and of and Claude isn't able to do in and of and Claude isn't able to do in and of itself because it doesn't have live itself because it doesn't have live itself because it doesn't have live internet access so they all have internet access so they all have internet access so they all have slightly different abilities it's kind slightly different abilities it's kind slightly different abilities it's kind of like having a range of different of like having a range of different of like having a range of different assistants you know that you might assistants you know that you might assistants you know that you might employ to different jobs some of them

employ to different jobs some of them employ to different jobs some of them are going to be better at different are going to be better at different are going to be better at different things um and so chat GPT is things um and so chat GPT is things um and so chat GPT is particularly good at like tasks and particularly good at like tasks and particularly good at like tasks and handling data it's particularly good at handling data it's particularly good at handling data it's particularly good at writing code Claude is much better at writing code Claude is much better at writing code Claude is much better at linguistic tasks long form textual tasks linguistic tasks long form textual tasks linguistic tasks long form textual tasks um and neither of those produce images um and neither of those produce images um and neither of those produce images but that's why you have things like Dary but that's why you have things like Dary but that's why you have things like Dary uh from open AI or mistol and there are uh from open AI or mistol and there are uh from open AI or mistol and there are many others that can produce uh visuals many others that can produce uh visuals many others that can produce uh visuals as well okay so just from a basic thing as well okay so just from a basic thing as well okay so just from a basic thing anthropic which is the company behind anthropic which is the company behind anthropic which is the company behind Cloe they is are they working totally Cloe they is are they working totally Cloe they is are they working totally independently from chat BT like there's independently from chat BT like there's independently from chat BT like there's no master data source these are two no master data source these are two no master data source these are two separate companies that have developed separate companies that have developed separate companies that have developed things scratch as far as we're aware things scratch as far as we're aware things scratch as far as we're aware there's no as far as we're aware let's there's no as far as we're aware let's there's no as far as we're aware let's not get into conspiracy theories well no not get into conspiracy theories well no not get into conspiracy theories well no but is an important thing to highlight but is an important thing to highlight but is an important thing to highlight that none of these companies publish that none of these companies publish that none of these companies publish exactly what data has been trained to exactly what data has been trained to exactly what data has been trained to make them work um not in full anyway make them work um not in full anyway make them work um not in full anyway even the open source ones now you can even the open source ones now you can even the open source ones now you can begin to get an understanding of what begin to get an understanding of what begin to get an understanding of what might be in there because we've seen might be in there because we've seen might be in there because we've seen examples and this is the the basis of examples and this is the the basis of examples and this is the the basis of the court case being uh held by uh the the court case being uh held by uh the the court case being uh held by uh the New York Times against open AI at the New York Times against open AI at the New York Times against open AI at the moment is that clearly chat gbt is able moment is that clearly chat gbt is able moment is that clearly chat gbt is able to produce L well at least was able to to produce L well at least was able to to produce L well at least was able to produce long form examples of what seem produce long form examples of what seem produce long form examples of what seem to be exactly copies of New York Times to be exactly copies of New York Times to be exactly copies of New York Times articles therefore you can assume it was articles therefore you can assume it was articles therefore you can assume it was in the training data it may no longer be in the training data it may no longer be in the training data it may no longer be um and so each of these different models um and so each of these different models um and so each of these different models they have slightly different training they have slightly different training they have slightly different training data that goes inside of them and that's data that goes inside of them and that's data that goes inside of them and that's what makes them better or worse at what makes them better or worse at what makes them better or worse at certain tasks there are some models that certain tasks there are some models that certain tasks there are some models that are trained for example just on

are trained for example just on are trained for example just on scientific papers and so scientific scientific papers and so scientific scientific papers and so scientific papers if you write them they have a papers if you write them they have a papers if you write them they have a very specific linguistic style a way of very specific linguistic style a way of very specific linguistic style a way of referencing Etc um and so you would want referencing Etc um and so you would want referencing Etc um and so you would want a model that was trained on that and a model that was trained on that and a model that was trained on that and this is where we see a lot of companies this is where we see a lot of companies this is where we see a lot of companies going right now is building on top of going right now is building on top of going right now is building on top of these language models with their own these language models with their own these language models with their own data sets so you've seen examples from data sets so you've seen examples from data sets so you've seen examples from Bloomberg doing it with financial data Bloomberg doing it with financial data Bloomberg doing it with financial data or McKenzie the consulting firm doing it or McKenzie the consulting firm doing it or McKenzie the consulting firm doing it with all of their Consulting content and with all of their Consulting content and with all of their Consulting content and we're now seeing in the Christian World we're now seeing in the Christian World we're now seeing in the Christian World Bibles being built on top I've just seen Bibles being built on top I've just seen Bibles being built on top I've just seen the release this past couple of weeks of the release this past couple of weeks of the release this past couple of weeks of bible. which is a project that's trying bible. which is a project that's trying bible. which is a project that's trying to build a large Corpus of a of to build a large Corpus of a of to build a large Corpus of a of Christian content to train a Christian content to train a Christian content to train a foundational language model so it's foundational language model so it's foundational language model so it's better at producing biblical related better at producing biblical related better at producing biblical related content so we're going to see examples content so we're going to see examples content so we're going to see examples of that type of thing emerge as well be of that type of thing emerge as well be of that type of thing emerge as well be fun to see him merge so many different fun to see him merge so many different fun to see him merge so many different theologies into one that'll be theologies into one that'll be theologies into one that'll be absolutely fascinating to watch well and absolutely fascinating to watch well and absolutely fascinating to watch well and that's the problem right because first that's the problem right because first that's the problem right because first of all if you want to put something in of all if you want to put something in of all if you want to put something in them you've got to agree what we agree them you've got to agree what we agree them you've got to agree what we agree on which is not always the easiest of on which is not always the easiest of on which is not always the easiest of things okay I'm gonna have to track that things okay I'm gonna have to track that things okay I'm gonna have to track that one no that's a good survey of the one no that's a good survey of the one no that's a good survey of the landscape it really is JP um you landscape it really is JP um you landscape it really is JP um you specialize in conversational AI what is specialize in conversational AI what is specialize in conversational AI what is that so yeah so we we started Vixen Labs that so yeah so we we started Vixen Labs that so yeah so we we started Vixen Labs which is the agency I've run for the which is the agency I've run for the which is the agency I've run for the past five or six years really with the past five or six years really with the past five or six years really with the intent around making experiences of intent around making experiences of intent around making experiences of talking with the companies and the talking with the companies and the talking with the companies and the organizations that you have to do organizations that you have to do organizations that you have to do business with every day a little bit business with every day a little bit business with every day a little bit better through talking to them rather better through talking to them rather better through talking to them rather than having to click and scroll and than having to click and scroll and than having to click and scroll and swipe down is this like instead of press swipe down is this like instead of press swipe down is this like instead of press five precisely and and so that we've

five precisely and and so that we've five precisely and and so that we've been really focused on things like voice been really focused on things like voice been really focused on things like voice Technologies we spend a lot of time Technologies we spend a lot of time Technologies we spend a lot of time building uh applications for Alexa for building uh applications for Alexa for building uh applications for Alexa for Google Assistant over the past couple of Google Assistant over the past couple of Google Assistant over the past couple of years and now that's emerged into these years and now that's emerged into these years and now that's emerged into these large language models that can help us large language models that can help us large language models that can help us build things like chat Bots and voice build things like chat Bots and voice build things like chat Bots and voice assistants that are just much more assistants that are just much more assistants that are just much more pleasurable to use and actually helpful pleasurable to use and actually helpful pleasurable to use and actually helpful than they have been historically more than they have been historically more than they have been historically more than just doing timers and reminders uh than just doing timers and reminders uh than just doing timers and reminders uh which is what they've been good for for which is what they've been good for for which is what they've been good for for a little while so yeah we focus on that a little while so yeah we focus on that a little while so yeah we focus on that because I think you know we want the because I think you know we want the because I think you know we want the future of using the internet to be one future of using the internet to be one future of using the internet to be one that's just a little bit more personal that's just a little bit more personal that's just a little bit more personal and you more human ironically um which and you more human ironically um which and you more human ironically um which you know we are conversational animals you know we are conversational animals you know we are conversational animals right that's how we get things done right that's how we get things done right that's how we get things done whether you you don't roll up at whether you you don't roll up at whether you you don't roll up at McDonald's drive-thru and Order U you McDonald's drive-thru and Order U you McDonald's drive-thru and Order U you know to have a chat with someone um but know to have a chat with someone um but know to have a chat with someone um but the means that you do so you know the the means that you do so you know the the means that you do so you know the means you get that burger delivered into means you get that burger delivered into means you get that burger delivered into the car or whatever your order is is the car or whatever your order is is the car or whatever your order is is through the art of conversation and and through the art of conversation and and through the art of conversation and and that's the way we've always done things that's the way we've always done things that's the way we've always done things as humans you we believe you know as humans you we believe you know as humans you we believe you know certainly from a Christian perspective certainly from a Christian perspective certainly from a Christian perspective that you know we began with the word that you know we began with the word that you know we began with the word right and so we know that conver ation right and so we know that conver ation right and so we know that conver ation and and the art of talking to one and and the art of talking to one and and the art of talking to one another is an important thing so I I another is an important thing so I I another is an important thing so I I would love to see more of our technology would love to see more of our technology would love to see more of our technology head in that direction rather than it head in that direction rather than it head in that direction rather than it being this kind of screens in front of being this kind of screens in front of being this kind of screens in front of us at all times head down in a phone um us at all times head down in a phone um us at all times head down in a phone um we think that by bringing the ability to we think that by bringing the ability to we think that by bringing the ability to talk to and type to if necessary uh Tech talk to and type to if necessary uh Tech talk to and type to if necessary uh Tech it it lifts us out of that trap um and it it lifts us out of that trap um and it it lifts us out of that trap um and lifts us out of that Doom scrolling lifts us out of that Doom scrolling lifts us out of that Doom scrolling mentality oh that's that's a great thing mentality oh that's that's a great thing mentality oh that's that's a great thing so for those who have called Apple in so for those who have called Apple in so for those who have called Apple in the last six seven years um you would be

the last six seven years um you would be the last six seven years um you would be familiar with that kind of familiar with that kind of familiar with that kind of conversational AI where it's like I'm a conversational AI where it's like I'm a conversational AI where it's like I'm a fully trained voice specialist that can fully trained voice specialist that can fully trained voice specialist that can help you what's wrong you know and then help you what's wrong you know and then help you what's wrong you know and then you tell it my computer won't boot up you tell it my computer won't boot up you tell it my computer won't boot up and it's like oh it sounds like you need and it's like oh it sounds like you need and it's like oh it sounds like you need technical support hang on I'll put you technical support hang on I'll put you technical support hang on I'll put you right through that kind of thing well so right through that kind of thing well so right through that kind of thing well so that's the I think what we would see as that's the I think what we would see as that's the I think what we would see as conversational Tech like 1.0 it's conversational Tech like 1.0 it's conversational Tech like 1.0 it's emerged from natural language processing emerged from natural language processing emerged from natural language processing and you know being able to un natural and you know being able to un natural and you know being able to un natural language understanding so that is the language understanding so that is the language understanding so that is the you know press one for this and it knows you know press one for this and it knows you know press one for this and it knows at least what you said yes but the at least what you said yes but the at least what you said yes but the difference now we see is with these difference now we see is with these difference now we see is with these language models is that you could say language models is that you could say language models is that you could say the entire thing of what's wrong with the entire thing of what's wrong with the entire thing of what's wrong with your MacBook and if Apple chose or other your MacBook and if Apple chose or other your MacBook and if Apple chose or other manufacturers chose to put these systems manufacturers chose to put these systems manufacturers chose to put these systems in place it could do what chat gbt could in place it could do what chat gbt could in place it could do what chat gbt could do which is take all of that information do which is take all of that information do which is take all of that information from you directly and actually give you from you directly and actually give you from you directly and actually give you the answer it would probably work out the answer it would probably work out the answer it would probably work out pretty well that's fantastic because pretty well that's fantastic because pretty well that's fantastic because it's the same technology it's the same it's the same technology it's the same it's the same technology it's the same technology it's just being spoken to you technology it's just being spoken to you technology it's just being spoken to you rather than showing you as a line of rather than showing you as a line of rather than showing you as a line of text on screen and we're seeing this now text on screen and we're seeing this now text on screen and we're seeing this now if you use the chat GPT app on your if you use the chat GPT app on your if you use the chat GPT app on your phone you can talk to it and it talks phone you can talk to it and it talks phone you can talk to it and it talks back to you in a variety of different back to you in a variety of different back to you in a variety of different voices and you can always flick away and voices and you can always flick away and voices and you can always flick away and look at the screen but actually that look at the screen but actually that look at the screen but actually that experience of talking to these things experience of talking to these things experience of talking to these things with your voice is actually quite with your voice is actually quite with your voice is actually quite delightful uh and certainly feels far delightful uh and certainly feels far delightful uh and certainly feels far more human even though it's not than um more human even though it's not than um more human even though it's not than um you know typing into a a screen or into you know typing into a a screen or into you know typing into a a screen or into a text box yeah all right I want to talk a text box yeah all right I want to talk a text box yeah all right I want to talk about because you work with um about because you work with um about because you work with um Ecclesia uh Eccles how do you pronounce Ecclesia uh Eccles how do you pronounce Ecclesia uh Eccles how do you pronounce it ey I think is the pronunciation we're it ey I think is the pronunciation we're it ey I think is the pronunciation we're going with but you know seeing it going with but you know seeing it going with but you know seeing it written down is different it's it's a

written down is different it's it's a written down is different it's it's a think tank that is starting to process think tank that is starting to process think tank that is starting to process or that is processing the theological or that is processing the theological or that is processing the theological issues associated with AI what is uh if issues associated with AI what is uh if issues associated with AI what is uh if you were to look at an agenda of what you were to look at an agenda of what you were to look at an agenda of what consumes your time and eccles's time consumes your time and eccles's time consumes your time and eccles's time what what are the top two or three what what are the top two or three what what are the top two or three things on your agenda right now what are things on your agenda right now what are things on your agenda right now what are you working on so I think eesi we you working on so I think eesi we you working on so I think eesi we founded the the thing tank at the end of founded the the thing tank at the end of founded the the thing tank at the end of 20203 as we began to see the emergence 20203 as we began to see the emergence 20203 as we began to see the emergence of the church really responding to the of the church really responding to the of the church really responding to the AI Revolution AI Revolution AI Revolution and particularly for church leaders in and particularly for church leaders in and particularly for church leaders in in all contexts whether that's you know in all contexts whether that's you know in all contexts whether that's you know in Ministry um in parachurch in Ministry um in parachurch in Ministry um in parachurch organizations in nonprofits but organizations in nonprofits but organizations in nonprofits but Christian leaders looking for guidance Christian leaders looking for guidance Christian leaders looking for guidance on how do I wrestle with some of these on how do I wrestle with some of these on how do I wrestle with some of these big topics that are arising and broadly big topics that are arising and broadly big topics that are arising and broadly speaking we've rallied around three big speaking we've rallied around three big speaking we've rallied around three big areas one is to have a better Theology areas one is to have a better Theology areas one is to have a better Theology of AI because it does raise some of AI because it does raise some of AI because it does raise some existential questions and maybe we can existential questions and maybe we can existential questions and maybe we can get into those I know you've done a lot get into those I know you've done a lot get into those I know you've done a lot on that in the past um but then the on that in the past um but then the on that in the past um but then the Practical and the Pastoral implications Practical and the Pastoral implications Practical and the Pastoral implications of the other two real are areas so of the other two real are areas so of the other two real are areas so practically what does it mean to have an practically what does it mean to have an practically what does it mean to have an AI policy for your church or for your AI policy for your church or for your AI policy for your church or for your charity what does it mean to have a code charity what does it mean to have a code charity what does it mean to have a code of ethics what how will you physically of ethics what how will you physically of ethics what how will you physically go around choosing which tools to use go around choosing which tools to use go around choosing which tools to use and which ones that sit outside of and which ones that sit outside of and which ones that sit outside of things and then pastorally using that as things and then pastorally using that as things and then pastorally using that as a kind of broad Catal is how do you deal a kind of broad Catal is how do you deal a kind of broad Catal is how do you deal with the issues that arise from AI in with the issues that arise from AI in with the issues that arise from AI in Ministry or in society and I always use Ministry or in society and I always use Ministry or in society and I always use this example which I know is maybe a bit this example which I know is maybe a bit this example which I know is maybe a bit Tri but you know when a young person Tri but you know when a young person Tri but you know when a young person comes to a youth worker and says hey comes to a youth worker and says hey comes to a youth worker and says hey I've fallen in love with this chat but

I've fallen in love with this chat but I've fallen in love with this chat but what do I do how does a youth worker or what do I do how does a youth worker or what do I do how does a youth worker or a minister in that context respond to a minister in that context respond to a minister in that context respond to that question like what do they actually that question like what do they actually that question like what do they actually say do they acknowledge the feelings say do they acknowledge the feelings say do they acknowledge the feelings which may be very real for that young which may be very real for that young which may be very real for that young person who feels like they truly have a person who feels like they truly have a person who feels like they truly have a relationship with these things we've relationship with these things we've relationship with these things we've seen examples in in recent months of seen examples in in recent months of seen examples in in recent months of people sadly committing suicide when you people sadly committing suicide when you people sadly committing suicide when you know these Bots break up with them or know these Bots break up with them or know these Bots break up with them or that they have tried to marry them you that they have tried to marry them you that they have tried to marry them you know that we've seen you know both the know that we've seen you know both the know that we've seen you know both the good and the bad of these things and good and the bad of these things and good and the bad of these things and that's already now let alone 24 months that's already now let alone 24 months that's already now let alone 24 months from now when this stuff gets really from now when this stuff gets really from now when this stuff gets really smart so how do we contend with these smart so how do we contend with these smart so how do we contend with these issues that this is the stuff we're issues that this is the stuff we're issues that this is the stuff we're trying to wrestle with because even if trying to wrestle with because even if trying to wrestle with because even if you choose not to quite and quite use AI you choose not to quite and quite use AI you choose not to quite and quite use AI in your ministry your congregations in your ministry your congregations in your ministry your congregations those that you're trying to seek to those that you're trying to seek to those that you're trying to seek to reach and be impacted and certainly on reach and be impacted and certainly on reach and be impacted and certainly on the mission field they will be using it the mission field they will be using it the mission field they will be using it there's no way that we're putting this there's no way that we're putting this there's no way that we're putting this back in the box and so what we really back in the box and so what we really back in the box and so what we really want to see at Ecclesia is the church be want to see at Ecclesia is the church be want to see at Ecclesia is the church be prepared and equipped to respond to that prepared and equipped to respond to that prepared and equipped to respond to that situation and to be able to roll with situation and to be able to roll with situation and to be able to roll with these things as they emerge not be these things as they emerge not be these things as they emerge not be caught on the back foot as we've so caught on the back foot as we've so caught on the back foot as we've so often seen it be the way in the past often seen it be the way in the past often seen it be the way in the past when it comes to technology and the when it comes to technology and the when it comes to technology and the church where we're often bad at it or church where we're often bad at it or church where we're often bad at it or often late or often both and I think we often late or often both and I think we often late or often both and I think we could do a better job of it this time could do a better job of it this time could do a better job of it this time around I I really appreciate it you know around I I really appreciate it you know around I I really appreciate it you know and that example of somebody falling in and that example of somebody falling in and that example of somebody falling in love with an AI or a chatbot has been love with an AI or a chatbot has been love with an AI or a chatbot has been used before on this podcast and it used before on this podcast and it used before on this podcast and it sounds like science fiction but it's not sounds like science fiction but it's not sounds like science fiction but it's not science fiction yeah so I mean one of science fiction yeah so I mean one of science fiction yeah so I mean one of the things that we see and saw this at a the things that we see and saw this at a the things that we see and saw this at a hackathon that I was at recently where hackathon that I was at recently where hackathon that I was at recently where there was an example of a Church there was an example of a Church there was an example of a Church organization that was trying to create a

organization that was trying to create a organization that was trying to create a technology using CCTV and Ai and it technology using CCTV and Ai and it technology using CCTV and Ai and it could do face tracking to monitor could do face tracking to monitor could do face tracking to monitor attendance now there's probably a bunch attendance now there's probably a bunch attendance now there's probably a bunch of good reasons why you might want to do of good reasons why you might want to do of good reasons why you might want to do that but there's also a lot of that but there's also a lot of that but there's also a lot of challenges with it as well right totally challenges with it as well right totally challenges with it as well right totally doable with existing technology like doable with existing technology like doable with existing technology like plug together a few different tools plug together a few different tools plug together a few different tools totally doable right now should it be totally doable right now should it be totally doable right now should it be done I think real problematic use case done I think real problematic use case done I think real problematic use case because the minute you start tracking because the minute you start tracking because the minute you start tracking who's there who's not who's to stop who's there who's not who's to stop who's there who's not who's to stop someone calling them up and saying hey someone calling them up and saying hey someone calling them up and saying hey your giving looks like it's dropped this your giving looks like it's dropped this your giving looks like it's dropped this past month and you've not been at church past month and you've not been at church past month and you've not been at church three times or Worse hey I saw you sit three times or Worse hey I saw you sit three times or Worse hey I saw you sit next to the same woman three times in next to the same woman three times in next to the same woman three times in the past month in church and she's not the past month in church and she's not the past month in church and she's not your wife and your wife wasn't there is your wife and your wife wasn't there is your wife and your wife wasn't there is there something going on there like there something going on there like there something going on there like these are scenarios that you know again these are scenarios that you know again these are scenarios that you know again it's not about the AI being you know it's not about the AI being you know it's not about the AI being you know nefarious it's AI in the hands of nefarious it's AI in the hands of nefarious it's AI in the hands of someone that might use it in the wrong someone that might use it in the wrong someone that might use it in the wrong way that is the problem and and these way that is the problem and and these way that is the problem and and these are real time things and we need the are real time things and we need the are real time things and we need the church to be not just going oh isn't church to be not just going oh isn't church to be not just going oh isn't this exciting I can do things that I this exciting I can do things that I this exciting I can do things that I don't have to have someone at the back don't have to have someone at the back don't have to have someone at the back with a clicker you know registering how with a clicker you know registering how with a clicker you know registering how many people showed up this Sunday I can many people showed up this Sunday I can many people showed up this Sunday I can just have an AI do it well where is that just have an AI do it well where is that just have an AI do it well where is that data going what are you going to do with data going what are you going to do with data going what are you going to do with that data what are the ways you're going that data what are the ways you're going that data what are the ways you're going to keep that person safe let alone the to keep that person safe let alone the to keep that person safe let alone the safeguarding implications and many other safeguarding implications and many other safeguarding implications and many other issues besides but these types of things issues besides but these types of things issues besides but these types of things are already happening the technology is are already happening the technology is are already happening the technology is already there to use it and I want us to already there to use it and I want us to already there to use it and I want us to use this technology I don't want to use this technology I don't want to use this technology I don't want to sound like I'm saying put the brakes on sound like I'm saying put the brakes on sound like I'm saying put the brakes on but you wouldn't get in a car with a but you wouldn't get in a car with a but you wouldn't get in a car with a great accelerator with no brake pedals great accelerator with no brake pedals great accelerator with no brake pedals and we need to have both and that's what and we need to have both and that's what and we need to have both and that's what we're advocating for is we need to you

we're advocating for is we need to you we're advocating for is we need to you know go forward and try and find use know go forward and try and find use know go forward and try and find use cases for this stuff but also know when cases for this stuff but also know when cases for this stuff but also know when we need to apply the brakes and make we need to apply the brakes and make we need to apply the brakes and make sure that we're driving on the right sure that we're driving on the right sure that we're driving on the right Road well and I think that's a good Road well and I think that's a good Road well and I think that's a good point I mean that product probably isn't point I mean that product probably isn't point I mean that product probably isn't at market right now and hopefully not at market right now and hopefully not at market right now and hopefully not being developed uh but it probably will being developed uh but it probably will being developed uh but it probably will be and it probably will be released by be and it probably will be released by be and it probably will be released by somebody down the road whether it's out somebody down the road whether it's out somebody down the road whether it's out of that Source or a different source and of that Source or a different source and of that Source or a different source and then you need the wisdom to figure it then you need the wisdom to figure it then you need the wisdom to figure it out you know I was thinking when you out you know I was thinking when you out you know I was thinking when you were saying the unintended and the the were saying the unintended and the the were saying the unintended and the the intended consequences of AI are in your intended consequences of AI are in your intended consequences of AI are in your church imagine a church in 20 2008 you church imagine a church in 20 2008 you church imagine a church in 20 2008 you know just as Twitter was emerging know just as Twitter was emerging know just as Twitter was emerging Facebook was starting to escape out of Facebook was starting to escape out of Facebook was starting to escape out of campuses saying we're not doing social campuses saying we're not doing social campuses saying we're not doing social media we're not doing as we called it media we're not doing as we called it media we're not doing as we called it then Web 2.0 it's banned in our church then Web 2.0 it's banned in our church then Web 2.0 it's banned in our church we won't have an account if that we won't have an account if that we won't have an account if that happened and let's say you're still happened and let's say you're still happened and let's say you're still reaching people in 2024 which is a whole reaching people in 2024 which is a whole reaching people in 2024 which is a whole other other other question everybody in your church you're question everybody in your church you're question everybody in your church you're dealing with increased teen anxiety dealing with increased teen anxiety dealing with increased teen anxiety depression um polarization extremism all depression um polarization extremism all depression um polarization extremism all of those things have happened to your of those things have happened to your of those things have happened to your church even though you're off social church even though you're off social church even though you're off social media and your argument is you and and a media and your argument is you and and a media and your argument is you and and a surprising number I mean glue has done surprising number I mean glue has done surprising number I mean glue has done the studies on that glue and Bara the studies on that glue and Bara the studies on that glue and Bara surprising number of people in the surprising number of people in the surprising number of people in the church are opposed to Ai and saying church are opposed to Ai and saying church are opposed to Ai and saying we're not going to use it well first of we're not going to use it well first of we're not going to use it well first of all you're probably already using it and all you're probably already using it and all you're probably already using it and don't realize it secondly even if you don't realize it secondly even if you don't realize it secondly even if you did that that doesn't mean your church did that that doesn't mean your church did that that doesn't mean your church isn't going to have a whole bunch of isn't going to have a whole bunch of isn't going to have a whole bunch of people like meaningful percentages in people like meaningful percentages in people like meaningful percentages in love with chatbots uh using technology love with chatbots uh using technology love with chatbots uh using technology for malevolent purposes not knowing for malevolent purposes not knowing for malevolent purposes not knowing ethically what to do as a Christian ethically what to do as a Christian ethically what to do as a Christian about how to integrate it in their

about how to integrate it in their about how to integrate it in their businesses and in their home what to do businesses and in their home what to do businesses and in their home what to do with their teenagers their marriage with their teenagers their marriage with their teenagers their marriage broke up um over AI like all that stuff broke up um over AI like all that stuff broke up um over AI like all that stuff is coming in here it's all coming and is coming in here it's all coming and is coming in here it's all coming and it's all coming and it's also coming you it's all coming and it's also coming you it's all coming and it's also coming you for the church leader that might be for the church leader that might be for the church leader that might be listening it's also coming into the listening it's also coming into the listening it's also coming into the actual delivery of ministry as well actual delivery of ministry as well actual delivery of ministry as well right you we we get this question all right you we we get this question all right you we we get this question all the time about can I use chat gbt to the time about can I use chat gbt to the time about can I use chat gbt to help me write a sermon and I know that help me write a sermon and I know that help me write a sermon and I know that we can because you you and many others we can because you you and many others we can because you you and many others have work on building helpful tools to have work on building helpful tools to have work on building helpful tools to help you do exactly that because it it help you do exactly that because it it help you do exactly that because it it can be done um but you know should we be can be done um but you know should we be can be done um but you know should we be asking it to write all of our prayers asking it to write all of our prayers asking it to write all of our prayers for a Sunday and just reading them for a Sunday and just reading them for a Sunday and just reading them verbum you know should we be asking it verbum you know should we be asking it verbum you know should we be asking it to compose worship music and using that to compose worship music and using that to compose worship music and using that without the spirit being part of that without the spirit being part of that without the spirit being part of that process like these are really thorny process like these are really thorny process like these are really thorny theological issues that we have to try theological issues that we have to try theological issues that we have to try and unpick and I don't think most and unpick and I don't think most and unpick and I don't think most churches let alone have time to think churches let alone have time to think churches let alone have time to think about this stuff or the or the knowledge about this stuff or the or the knowledge about this stuff or the or the knowledge or education to do so and nor should or education to do so and nor should or education to do so and nor should they they're not you know AI theologians they they're not you know AI theologians they they're not you know AI theologians sitting around thinking about this stuff sitting around thinking about this stuff sitting around thinking about this stuff we need to equip them with the with this we need to equip them with the with this we need to equip them with the with this knowledge um but yeah it's very much knowledge um but yeah it's very much knowledge um but yeah it's very much starting at the Baseline of do people starting at the Baseline of do people starting at the Baseline of do people know what the tools are do they know how know what the tools are do they know how know what the tools are do they know how they're being used and crucially are we they're being used and crucially are we they're being used and crucially are we thinking critically about them before we thinking critically about them before we thinking critically about them before we actually pick up and log in before you actually pick up and log in before you actually pick up and log in before you click yes to the terms and conditions click yes to the terms and conditions click yes to the terms and conditions again without reading them um just again without reading them um just again without reading them um just because the thing looks like it's going because the thing looks like it's going because the thing looks like it's going to save you two hours of an afternoon to save you two hours of an afternoon to save you two hours of an afternoon like these are the the steps we need like these are the the steps we need like these are the the steps we need people to to take and to you know be people to to take and to you know be people to to take and to you know be aware that um when we add technology to aware that um when we add technology to aware that um when we add technology to anything we give it the opportunity for

anything we give it the opportunity for anything we give it the opportunity for it to take over some of our decision- it to take over some of our decision- it to take over some of our decision- making which we might want but we also making which we might want but we also making which we might want but we also give it the opportunity to take over give it the opportunity to take over give it the opportunity to take over some of our mistakes which we don't want some of our mistakes which we don't want some of our mistakes which we don't want and that's the thing that we want to be and that's the thing that we want to be and that's the thing that we want to be conscious of is that if you wouldn't be conscious of is that if you wouldn't be conscious of is that if you wouldn't be willing to give this task to uh an willing to give this task to uh an willing to give this task to uh an assistant without checking what they assistant without checking what they assistant without checking what they were doing don't give it to an AI to do were doing don't give it to an AI to do were doing don't give it to an AI to do it either you know we need to stay in it either you know we need to stay in it either you know we need to stay in the loop and help um use these tools the loop and help um use these tools the loop and help um use these tools responsibly particularly in Ministry responsibly particularly in Ministry responsibly particularly in Ministry context if we want in the church to context if we want in the church to context if we want in the church to increase to use your analogy of that increase to use your analogy of that increase to use your analogy of that trend line rather than uh you know trend line rather than uh you know trend line rather than uh you know decrease as it so often has done so what decrease as it so often has done so what decrease as it so often has done so what should the average Church leader and the should the average Church leader and the should the average Church leader and the average business leader because we have average business leader because we have average business leader because we have a lot of Business Leaders listening to a lot of Business Leaders listening to a lot of Business Leaders listening to what should what question should they be what should what question should they be what should what question should they be asking what should they be paying asking what should they be paying asking what should they be paying attention to what should they be doing attention to what should they be doing attention to what should they be doing right right right now well the first thing goes for either now well the first thing goes for either now well the first thing goes for either if you're in a an Enterprise context or if you're in a an Enterprise context or if you're in a an Enterprise context or you're in a small business or or if you're in a small business or or if you're in a small business or or if you're a church leader or in a charity you're a church leader or in a charity you're a church leader or in a charity is do you even know what AI is being is do you even know what AI is being is do you even know what AI is being used in your organization if you can't used in your organization if you can't used in your organization if you can't answer that question answer that question answer that question confidently um then that's the first confidently um then that's the first confidently um then that's the first place to start and that might mean yes place to start and that might mean yes place to start and that might mean yes you need to do a survey and find out how you need to do a survey and find out how you need to do a survey and find out how many people have signed up to chat gbt many people have signed up to chat gbt many people have signed up to chat gbt plus with their private credit card and plus with their private credit card and plus with their private credit card and they're charging it back or how many of they're charging it back or how many of they're charging it back or how many of you have like turned on an AI module you have like turned on an AI module you have like turned on an AI module inside of your conferencing software inside of your conferencing software inside of your conferencing software without looking at how that data is without looking at how that data is without looking at how that data is being collected or stored do you know being collected or stored do you know being collected or stored do you know how the tools that you're using are how the tools that you're using are how the tools that you're using are using and what models are they using using and what models are they using using and what models are they using because we've seen as we've said AI has because we've seen as we've said AI has because we've seen as we've said AI has shown up now not just in a hey I've shown up now not just in a hey I've shown up now not just in a hey I've bought an AI product it's showing up in

bought an AI product it's showing up in bought an AI product it's showing up in all of the technology we use from the all of the technology we use from the all of the technology we use from the mailbox provider that you choose to mailbox provider that you choose to mailbox provider that you choose to things like canva and notion and assana things like canva and notion and assana things like canva and notion and assana and all of the things that we use to and all of the things that we use to and all of the things that we use to kind of keep our day-to-day projects kind of keep our day-to-day projects kind of keep our day-to-day projects going in the digital ecosystem and many going in the digital ecosystem and many going in the digital ecosystem and many of those being used obviously in the of those being used obviously in the of those being used obviously in the church as well these all are beginning church as well these all are beginning church as well these all are beginning to have ai tools added to them it may to have ai tools added to them it may to have ai tools added to them it may not be the headline it may be just a not be the headline it may be just a not be the headline it may be just a part of the the stack um and so the part of the the stack um and so the part of the the stack um and so the first thing to do is pay attention to first thing to do is pay attention to first thing to do is pay attention to that what's going on do you know what's that what's going on do you know what's that what's going on do you know what's being used the second is actually to use being used the second is actually to use being used the second is actually to use some of it and crucially to pay for some some of it and crucially to pay for some some of it and crucially to pay for some of it which I know might seem of it which I know might seem of it which I know might seem counterintuitive but what I mean by that counterintuitive but what I mean by that counterintuitive but what I mean by that is use some of these tools to get is use some of these tools to get is use some of these tools to get familiar with them as I say I don't familiar with them as I say I don't familiar with them as I say I don't think open AI what they're trying to do think open AI what they're trying to do think open AI what they're trying to do is evil I would endorse you go play is evil I would endorse you go play is evil I would endorse you go play around with perplexity and chat GPT but around with perplexity and chat GPT but around with perplexity and chat GPT but do it in a responsible way where you're do it in a responsible way where you're do it in a responsible way where you're keeping things private that should stay keeping things private that should stay keeping things private that should stay private don't put anything on the private don't put anything on the private don't put anything on the internet that you won't want on the internet that you won't want on the internet that you won't want on the internet applies to AI tools as well and internet applies to AI tools as well and internet applies to AI tools as well and you know comply with all of the usual you know comply with all of the usual you know comply with all of the usual things like gdpr and you know uh copper things like gdpr and you know uh copper things like gdpr and you know uh copper compliance if you're in the US or what compliance if you're in the US or what compliance if you're in the US or what whatever else um regulations apply at whatever else um regulations apply at whatever else um regulations apply at the time of uh of listening to this take the time of uh of listening to this take the time of uh of listening to this take those regular precautions but go and those regular precautions but go and those regular precautions but go and play around and why I say pay for it is play around and why I say pay for it is play around and why I say pay for it is because when you begin to pay for these because when you begin to pay for these because when you begin to pay for these tools they are not using your time and tools they are not using your time and tools they are not using your time and attention as the currency they're using attention as the currency they're using attention as the currency they're using your money as the currency uh in the your money as the currency uh in the your money as the currency uh in the interaction with these models and that interaction with these models and that interaction with these models and that means that more often than not you're means that more often than not you're means that more often than not you're not having any of your data go to train not having any of your data go to train not having any of your data go to train future versions of the model you've got future versions of the model you've got future versions of the model you've got the ability usually to delete what the ability usually to delete what the ability usually to delete what you've put in and that you can remove it you've put in and that you can remove it you've put in and that you can remove it if you want to and that you will be if you want to and that you will be if you want to and that you will be getting Enterprise level Safety and getting Enterprise level Safety and getting Enterprise level Safety and Security you know at both ends when

Security you know at both ends when Security you know at both ends when you're sending data up and receiving it you're sending data up and receiving it you're sending data up and receiving it when you pay for these get those when you pay for these get those when you pay for these get those benefits yeah so when you pay you're benefits yeah so when you pay you're benefits yeah so when you pay you're under a a a stricter level of privacy under a a a stricter level of privacy under a a a stricter level of privacy security Etc than when you're using the security Etc than when you're using the security Etc than when you're using the free stuff did not know that the free stuff did not know that the free stuff did not know that the difference between YouTube and YouTube difference between YouTube and YouTube difference between YouTube and YouTube premium what do you get when you pay for premium what do you get when you pay for premium what do you get when you pay for YouTube premium you don't get any ads YouTube premium you don't get any ads YouTube premium you don't get any ads because you're no longer the product I because you're no longer the product I because you're no longer the product I happily pay for YouTube premium and for happily pay for YouTube premium and for happily pay for YouTube premium and for years that's $99 I pay every month stand years that's $99 I pay every month stand years that's $99 I pay every month stand it $1299 a month sign me up but it goes it $1299 a month sign me up but it goes it $1299 a month sign me up but it goes the same way so when you pay for the same way so when you pay for the same way so when you pay for perplexity Plus or Pro or whatever they perplexity Plus or Pro or whatever they perplexity Plus or Pro or whatever they call it they're all called pro pro plus call it they're all called pro pro plus call it they're all called pro pro plus Max or Ultra I think is usually the way Max or Ultra I think is usually the way Max or Ultra I think is usually the way um but what whatever one you're paying um but what whatever one you're paying um but what whatever one you're paying for the likelihood is that the terms of for the likelihood is that the terms of for the likelihood is that the terms of service have changed and you're no service have changed and you're no service have changed and you're no longer paying to train the model your longer paying to train the model your longer paying to train the model your data is yours ah there you go so again data is yours ah there you go so again data is yours ah there you go so again you might not want to pay money to the you might not want to pay money to the you might not want to pay money to the these people and that's absolutely fine these people and that's absolutely fine these people and that's absolutely fine but if you're going to use them you're but if you're going to use them you're but if you're going to use them you're actually better off paying for it most actually better off paying for it most actually better off paying for it most of the time so I would say first thing of the time so I would say first thing of the time so I would say first thing is know what's going on second is try is know what's going on second is try is know what's going on second is try test it out and then the third thing is test it out and then the third thing is test it out and then the third thing is be transparent which is if you're going be transparent which is if you're going be transparent which is if you're going to use these tools whether it's in the to use these tools whether it's in the to use these tools whether it's in the creation of ministry resources whether creation of ministry resources whether creation of ministry resources whether it's in the administration of your it's in the administration of your it's in the administration of your business whether it's managing the data business whether it's managing the data business whether it's managing the data of your people in whatever context just of your people in whatever context just of your people in whatever context just be upfront and transparent with the be upfront and transparent with the be upfront and transparent with the people that are going to be affected by people that are going to be affected by people that are going to be affected by that the best thing you can do is public that the best thing you can do is public that the best thing you can do is public publish ethics policy or transparency publish ethics policy or transparency publish ethics policy or transparency policy around AI put it up on your policy around AI put it up on your policy around AI put it up on your website in the same way you would do website in the same way you would do website in the same way you would do with your privacy policy or other things with your privacy policy or other things with your privacy policy or other things and just state how you're using tools and just state how you're using tools and just state how you're using tools what you're using them for crucially

what you're using them for crucially what you're using them for crucially what you're not using them for and be up what you're not using them for and be up what you're not using them for and be up front with your congregation or your front with your congregation or your front with your congregation or your business about it because the last thing business about it because the last thing business about it because the last thing that anyone wants is for there to be that anyone wants is for there to be that anyone wants is for there to be some kind of sneaking suspicion that hey some kind of sneaking suspicion that hey some kind of sneaking suspicion that hey I think the Vicor or the pastor or the I think the Vicor or the pastor or the I think the Vicor or the pastor or the minister is writing all of his sermons minister is writing all of his sermons minister is writing all of his sermons with chat gbt and it turns out to be with chat gbt and it turns out to be with chat gbt and it turns out to be true um you know at least if he's true um you know at least if he's true um you know at least if he's upfront about it then maybe that's okay upfront about it then maybe that's okay upfront about it then maybe that's okay but um you know we don't want to be but um you know we don't want to be but um you know we don't want to be found out and that's what we want to found out and that's what we want to found out and that's what we want to make sure that people are are taking make sure that people are are taking make sure that people are are taking seriously I think there's a lot of fear seriously I think there's a lot of fear seriously I think there's a lot of fear around around around transparency and I wonder if it's tied I transparency and I wonder if it's tied I transparency and I wonder if it's tied I mean you're working with the church of mean you're working with the church of mean you're working with the church of England on ethics on this uh I just read England on ethics on this uh I just read England on ethics on this uh I just read a case to it might have been in the New a case to it might have been in the New a case to it might have been in the New York Times uh they have an ethicist York Times uh they have an ethicist York Times uh they have an ethicist column and uh this pastor served for 50 column and uh this pastor served for 50 column and uh this pastor served for 50 years retired and someone in the church years retired and someone in the church years retired and someone in the church just happen stance discovered another just happen stance discovered another just happen stance discovered another sermon that sounded an awful lot like sermon that sounded an awful lot like sermon that sounded an awful lot like one of his and then went back through one of his and then went back through one of his and then went back through his work and discovered that they were his work and discovered that they were his work and discovered that they were all ripped off right down to the stories all ripped off right down to the stories all ripped off right down to the stories that never happened to him like told that never happened to him like told that never happened to him like told someone else's story as though he had someone else's story as though he had someone else's story as though he had had that vacation or been to that coffee had that vacation or been to that coffee had that vacation or been to that coffee shop which to me is is shop which to me is is shop which to me is is unconscionable the ethicist was actually unconscionable the ethicist was actually unconscionable the ethicist was actually quite gentle saying I'll let this guy go quite gentle saying I'll let this guy go quite gentle saying I'll let this guy go into retirement I'm like no he lied like into retirement I'm like no he lied like into retirement I'm like no he lied like and yet we've all used Google search for and yet we've all used Google search for and yet we've all used Google search for years right like years right like years right like I mean we use and and uh I mean an I mean we use and and uh I mean an I mean we use and and uh I mean an thesauruses and concordances and thesauruses and concordances and thesauruses and concordances and assistant guides and all these other assistant guides and all these other assistant guides and all these other things as well biblical commentaries things as well biblical commentaries things as well biblical commentaries it's all digitized now I still I still

it's all digitized now I still I still it's all digitized now I still I still you know I use chat GPT for first drafts you know I use chat GPT for first drafts you know I use chat GPT for first drafts research I've never found a good sermon research I've never found a good sermon research I've never found a good sermon to come out of AI yet that's just me um to come out of AI yet that's just me um to come out of AI yet that's just me um but sometimes if I need something but sometimes if I need something but sometimes if I need something summarized or I want ideas rebuilt or summarized or I want ideas rebuilt or summarized or I want ideas rebuilt or tested I will use it so when it comes to tested I will use it so when it comes to tested I will use it so when it comes to disclosure like it's one thing to get up disclosure like it's one thing to get up disclosure like it's one thing to get up there and say every Sunday I used Google there and say every Sunday I used Google there and say every Sunday I used Google I read five commentaries I went back to I read five commentaries I went back to I read five commentaries I went back to the inner linear Greek nobody nobody the inner linear Greek nobody nobody the inner linear Greek nobody nobody does that but I have preached messages does that but I have preached messages does that but I have preached messages where I said hey a lot of these ideas in where I said hey a lot of these ideas in where I said hey a lot of these ideas in the message and I'll give credit where the message and I'll give credit where the message and I'll give credit where they're due came from a sermon I heard they're due came from a sermon I heard they're due came from a sermon I heard from Tim Keller or Andy Stanley preached from Tim Keller or Andy Stanley preached from Tim Keller or Andy Stanley preached the series I'm reteaching it right now the series I'm reteaching it right now the series I'm reteaching it right now and it's got my own spin on it but you and it's got my own spin on it but you and it's got my own spin on it but you need to know these ideas came first from need to know these ideas came first from need to know these ideas came first from Andy SC I think that's a great example I Andy SC I think that's a great example I Andy SC I think that's a great example I think that's a great example it's you we think that's a great example it's you we think that's a great example it's you we what level of transparency would you what level of transparency would you what level of transparency would you give if you weren't on the internet give if you weren't on the internet give if you weren't on the internet that should be the same level of that should be the same level of that should be the same level of transparency you give with the internet transparency you give with the internet transparency you give with the internet whether it's AI or just Google like whether it's AI or just Google like whether it's AI or just Google like that's fine that's what we're asking for that's fine that's what we're asking for that's fine that's what we're asking for because you know we want to be you it's because you know we want to be you it's because you know we want to be you it's a good principle in general I think it's a good principle in general I think it's a good principle in general I think it's a Christian principle in general to be a Christian principle in general to be a Christian principle in general to be transparent about these things not transparent about these things not transparent about these things not necessarily you know to the nth degree necessarily you know to the nth degree necessarily you know to the nth degree like you say here's like my entire web like you say here's like my entire web like you say here's like my entire web search history that went into this search history that went into this search history that went into this that's not necessary but at least in the that's not necessary but at least in the that's not necessary but at least in the spirit of it is saying hey I used or spirit of it is saying hey I used or spirit of it is saying hey I used or maybe it's you know once a year or it's maybe it's you know once a year or it's maybe it's you know once a year or it's part of your statement that's just up on part of your statement that's just up on part of your statement that's just up on the website somewhere or on social media the website somewhere or on social media the website somewhere or on social media that says just so you know these are the that says just so you know these are the that says just so you know these are the tools that I regular use to help with my tools that I regular use to help with my tools that I regular use to help with my research and planning of this thing it research and planning of this thing it research and planning of this thing it hasn't happened to me yet where anything hasn't happened to me yet where anything hasn't happened to me yet where anything has come out of clo or chat GPT or other

has come out of clo or chat GPT or other has come out of clo or chat GPT or other models where I'm like oh this is like models where I'm like oh this is like models where I'm like oh this is like final draft 101 it's like okay I have a final draft 101 it's like okay I have a final draft 101 it's like okay I have a few ideas let's get moving but I suppose few ideas let's get moving but I suppose few ideas let's get moving but I suppose the day is coming where chat gbt will the day is coming where chat gbt will the day is coming where chat gbt will create a better sermon than I could create a better sermon than I could create a better sermon than I could write or clo would I wonder sorry you're write or clo would I wonder sorry you're write or clo would I wonder sorry you're you're a good pre there's a lot of like you're a good pre there's a lot of like you're a good pre there's a lot of like sermons that chat GPT can write now sermons that chat GPT can write now sermons that chat GPT can write now that's better than a lot of sermons that's better than a lot of sermons that's better than a lot of sermons being written by humans let's be honest being written by humans let's be honest being written by humans let's be honest perhaps and and then I guess I guess perhaps and and then I guess I guess perhaps and and then I guess I guess you're at the point where if I borrowed you're at the point where if I borrowed you're at the point where if I borrowed a John orberg sermon I'm just going to a John orberg sermon I'm just going to a John orberg sermon I'm just going to be like hey this started with John be like hey this started with John be like hey this started with John orberg or um and you know I put my spin orberg or um and you know I put my spin orberg or um and you know I put my spin on it or maybe you stand up one day and on it or maybe you stand up one day and on it or maybe you stand up one day and go you know what chat GPT spit out this go you know what chat GPT spit out this go you know what chat GPT spit out this amazing Treatise on Grace and today I'm amazing Treatise on Grace and today I'm amazing Treatise on Grace and today I'm going to share and a lot of it was done going to share and a lot of it was done going to share and a lot of it was done via chat GPT if it's like 90% that and via chat GPT if it's like 90% that and via chat GPT if it's like 90% that and 10% you I'm trying like for example AI 10% you I'm trying like for example AI 10% you I'm trying like for example AI helped write me these questions for you helped write me these questions for you helped write me these questions for you and I almost always for the last year and I almost always for the last year and I almost always for the last year and a half run questions and guests and a half run questions and guests and a half run questions and guests through chat GPT or Cloe and then I sit through chat GPT or Cloe and then I sit through chat GPT or Cloe and then I sit down and I go oh I never would have down and I go oh I never would have down and I go oh I never would have thought to ask that so it's always a mix thought to ask that so it's always a mix thought to ask that so it's always a mix it's somewhere between sometimes half it's somewhere between sometimes half it's somewhere between sometimes half and sometimes it's like I kept one and sometimes it's like I kept one and sometimes it's like I kept one question or whatever so it's just the question or whatever so it's just the question or whatever so it's just the idea of trans Arcy and I think you're idea of trans Arcy and I think you're idea of trans Arcy and I think you're right having a policy is really good do right having a policy is really good do right having a policy is really good do you have a downloadable one I know Kenny you have a downloadable one I know Kenny you have a downloadable one I know Kenny Jang and and church. Tech and people Jang and and church. Tech and people Jang and and church. Tech and people like that are working on that right now like that are working on that right now like that are working on that right now I I have not replicated one because I I I have not replicated one because I I I have not replicated one because I would endorse the one that Kenny has so would endorse the one that Kenny has so would endorse the one that Kenny has so yeah definitely go to church. Tech and yeah definitely go to church. Tech and yeah definitely go to church. Tech and download his um it was with him last

download his um it was with him last download his um it was with him last week because we were discussing exactly week because we were discussing exactly week because we were discussing exactly this and it's this is the thing that I this and it's this is the thing that I this and it's this is the thing that I would recommend so definitely going if would recommend so definitely going if would recommend so definitely going if you if you don't follow Kenny his AI for you if you don't follow Kenny his AI for you if you don't follow Kenny his AI for church leaders Facebook group is amazing church leaders Facebook group is amazing church leaders Facebook group is amazing church. Tech is great um so definitely church. Tech is great um so definitely church. Tech is great um so definitely go and uh use that in the podcast go and uh use that in the podcast go and uh use that in the podcast recommend all his stuff recommend all his stuff recommend all his stuff but um I would say that you know that's but um I would say that you know that's but um I would say that you know that's where we do need to kind of you know where we do need to kind of you know where we do need to kind of you know we're getting more of these practical we're getting more of these practical we're getting more of these practical guidelines right we're getting practical guidelines right we're getting practical guidelines right we're getting practical guidelines that is beginning to emerge I guidelines that is beginning to emerge I guidelines that is beginning to emerge I think the Theology of this stuff is think the Theology of this stuff is think the Theology of this stuff is still something we're going to wrestle still something we're going to wrestle still something we're going to wrestle with for some time um because you know with for some time um because you know with for some time um because you know as these models emerge what happens when as these models emerge what happens when as these models emerge what happens when a great Christian theology based you a great Christian theology based you a great Christian theology based you know model arrives that can write know model arrives that can write know model arrives that can write sermons that was based on hopefully sermons that was based on hopefully sermons that was based on hopefully people that opted into giving all of people that opted into giving all of people that opted into giving all of their uh you know sermon content their uh you know sermon content their uh you know sermon content over it can create stuff and then the over it can create stuff and then the over it can create stuff and then the question is well where is what is that question is well where is what is that question is well where is what is that you know is that is that um spoken into you know is that is that um spoken into you know is that is that um spoken into by God can he use that stuff and my by God can he use that stuff and my by God can he use that stuff and my answer would be yes I think you God can answer would be yes I think you God can answer would be yes I think you God can use all things can't he like that's what use all things can't he like that's what use all things can't he like that's what we believe so it's um but we we we believe so it's um but we we we believe so it's um but we we particularly when it comes to teaching particularly when it comes to teaching particularly when it comes to teaching and preaching we have this very specific and preaching we have this very specific and preaching we have this very specific call of ministry onto that um that thing call of ministry onto that um that thing call of ministry onto that um that thing and we lump that in with the job of a and we lump that in with the job of a and we lump that in with the job of a church leader and I think that's where church leader and I think that's where church leader and I think that's where we probably have going a little bit we probably have going a little bit we probably have going a little bit wrong along the ways we say the church wrong along the ways we say the church wrong along the ways we say the church you know for most church leaders you know for most church leaders you know for most church leaders listening to this um if if that's your listening to this um if if that's your listening to this um if if that's your job you probably are a staff member of job you probably are a staff member of job you probably are a staff member of One um we often think of the mega One um we often think of the mega One um we often think of the mega churches and the big places and that's churches and the big places and that's churches and the big places and that's what a lot of the technology that's out

what a lot of the technology that's out what a lot of the technology that's out there is cater to but for most people there is cater to but for most people there is cater to but for most people certainly here in the UK the 17,000 certainly here in the UK the 17,000 certainly here in the UK the 17,000 churches across the Church of England churches across the Church of England churches across the Church of England that I get to work with from time to that I get to work with from time to that I get to work with from time to time they're being led by one person who time they're being led by one person who time they're being led by one person who doesn't have time to do this stuff and doesn't have time to do this stuff and doesn't have time to do this stuff and probably is trying to do all aspects of probably is trying to do all aspects of probably is trying to do all aspects of in a church and Carri I know you know in a church and Carri I know you know in a church and Carri I know you know this firsthand and not all of them are this firsthand and not all of them are this firsthand and not all of them are great preachers in fact some of them are great preachers in fact some of them are great preachers in fact some of them are really not great preachers at all and really not great preachers at all and really not great preachers at all and they would be the first to admit it they would be the first to admit it they would be the first to admit it because they didn't get into leading uh because they didn't get into leading uh because they didn't get into leading uh Ministry to be a great preacher they got Ministry to be a great preacher they got Ministry to be a great preacher they got into it to reach the poor or to be into it to reach the poor or to be into it to reach the poor or to be evangelists or to be missioned there evangelists or to be missioned there evangelists or to be missioned there lots of different reasons and we I think lots of different reasons and we I think lots of different reasons and we I think when we think about these tools there when we think about these tools there when we think about these tools there maybe is a possibility that they could maybe is a possibility that they could maybe is a possibility that they could come along and really help many people come along and really help many people come along and really help many people encounter the gospel in a way that they encounter the gospel in a way that they encounter the gospel in a way that they weren't able to before through the voice weren't able to before through the voice weren't able to before through the voice of the person in the local church who of the person in the local church who of the person in the local church who was speaking to them but we need to work was speaking to them but we need to work was speaking to them but we need to work through some of these things in terms of through some of these things in terms of through some of these things in terms of like what is our Theology of that and like what is our Theology of that and like what is our Theology of that and will we accept that that can be part of will we accept that that can be part of will we accept that that can be part of the future of what Ministry looks like the future of what Ministry looks like the future of what Ministry looks like without necessarily going to the nth without necessarily going to the nth without necessarily going to the nth degree of saying we'll just stick chat degree of saying we'll just stick chat degree of saying we'll just stick chat GPT with a voice assistant at the front GPT with a voice assistant at the front GPT with a voice assistant at the front of church every Sunday and lead them to of church every Sunday and lead them to of church every Sunday and lead them to it well you bring your heart to it you it well you bring your heart to it you it well you bring your heart to it you know there's a Canadian Doctrine I was know there's a Canadian Doctrine I was know there's a Canadian Doctrine I was just doing a quick uh legal search from just doing a quick uh legal search from just doing a quick uh legal search from back in law school it's a I don't think back in law school it's a I don't think back in law school it's a I don't think it's common law so it could be in it's common law so it could be in it's common law so it could be in England too it's called passing off and England too it's called passing off and England too it's called passing off and it doesn't mean this but in my head I it doesn't mean this but in my head I it doesn't mean this but in my head I always take that term uh and apply it to always take that term uh and apply it to always take that term uh and apply it to church world if I take you know someone church world if I take you know someone church world if I take you know someone else's sermon or someone else's book else's sermon or someone else's book else's sermon or someone else's book like I've got William Yuri's here on my like I've got William Yuri's here on my like I've got William Yuri's here on my desk and I'm like reading you chapter desk and I'm like reading you chapter desk and I'm like reading you chapter one and I pretend it's my work I'm I'm one and I pretend it's my work I'm I'm one and I pretend it's my work I'm I'm passing it off as though I did all the

passing it off as though I did all the passing it off as though I did all the work I did all the stuff and I think work I did all the stuff and I think work I did all the stuff and I think that's out of bounds like I don't care that's out of bounds like I don't care that's out of bounds like I don't care whether it's analog or digital if you're whether it's analog or digital if you're whether it's analog or digital if you're pretending to do something that you pretending to do something that you pretending to do something that you didn't do on the other hand great books didn't do on the other hand great books didn't do on the other hand great books have great footnotes and you know a Tim have great footnotes and you know a Tim have great footnotes and you know a Tim Keller joke that's been told on this Keller joke that's been told on this Keller joke that's been told on this podcast once or twice he was famous for podcast once or twice he was famous for podcast once or twice he was famous for saying well first of all almost any saying well first of all almost any saying well first of all almost any random sermon you listen to by Tim random sermon you listen to by Tim random sermon you listen to by Tim Keller probably has 25 to 50 references Keller probably has 25 to 50 references Keller probably has 25 to 50 references in it as CS Lewis says as mirav Wulf in it as CS Lewis says as mirav Wulf in it as CS Lewis says as mirav Wulf says as this person says as this person says as this person says as this person says as this person says as this person says he and you don't think anything of says he and you don't think anything of says he and you don't think anything of it you just think wow that guy reads it you just think wow that guy reads it you just think wow that guy reads widely which he does and he says you widely which he does and he says you widely which he does and he says you know when I have time to write an know when I have time to write an know when I have time to write an original sermon that's how it goes when original sermon that's how it goes when original sermon that's how it goes when I'm out of time I just quote CS Lewis I'm out of time I just quote CS Lewis I'm out of time I just quote CS Lewis you know but he always quoted CS Lewis you know but he always quoted CS Lewis you know but he always quoted CS Lewis he never passed he would say C Le said C he never passed he would say C Le said C he never passed he would say C Le said C Lewis said you know sort of a joke but Lewis said you know sort of a joke but Lewis said you know sort of a joke but um one of the most profound thinkers of um one of the most profound thinkers of um one of the most profound thinkers of this generation you know Tim Keller and this generation you know Tim Keller and this generation you know Tim Keller and he was quoting people left right and he was quoting people left right and he was quoting people left right and Center so if you're using chat GPT throw Center so if you're using chat GPT throw Center so if you're using chat GPT throw your heart into it but just say hey I your heart into it but just say hey I your heart into it but just say hey I had some help from this or I had some had some help from this or I had some had some help from this or I had some help here but I think as a pastor you help here but I think as a pastor you help here but I think as a pastor you have and as a leader I was reading an have and as a leader I was reading an have and as a leader I was reading an article a friend sent me from the Wall article a friend sent me from the Wall article a friend sent me from the Wall Street Journal and it was saying you Street Journal and it was saying you Street Journal and it was saying you know what's happening to Tech axios is a know what's happening to Tech axios is a know what's happening to Tech axios is a media organization media organization media organization and they're saying we're humanizing the and they're saying we're humanizing the and they're saying we're humanizing the news at a very deep level they were news at a very deep level they were news at a very deep level they were founded in 2017 from people I think who founded in 2017 from people I think who founded in 2017 from people I think who started Politico and they're going we're started Politico and they're going we're started Politico and they're going we're humanizing this at a very deep level I humanizing this at a very deep level I humanizing this at a very deep level I think when you bring your Humanity to think when you bring your Humanity to think when you bring your Humanity to the task when you when I bring my the task when you when I bring my the task when you when I bring my Humanity to this show when it's actually

Humanity to this show when it's actually Humanity to this show when it's actually me asking you the questions and as you me asking you the questions and as you me asking you the questions and as you note like most guests do how many actual note like most guests do how many actual note like most guests do how many actual questions I sent you did I actually use questions I sent you did I actually use questions I sent you did I actually use very few because we're having a great very few because we're having a great very few because we're having a great conversation and you know but any agree conversation and you know but any agree conversation and you know but any agree disagree I'd love your thoughts on that disagree I'd love your thoughts on that disagree I'd love your thoughts on that well no so I agree I think that we all well no so I agree I think that we all well no so I agree I think that we all have to you know weigh it ourselves as have to you know weigh it ourselves as have to you know weigh it ourselves as to how much of my own Humanity do I want to how much of my own Humanity do I want to how much of my own Humanity do I want to bring to any of these things that we to bring to any of these things that we to bring to any of these things that we do with with AI whether that's preaching do with with AI whether that's preaching do with with AI whether that's preaching a sermon whether that's writing the a sermon whether that's writing the a sermon whether that's writing the annual address whether it's writing a annual address whether it's writing a annual address whether it's writing a birthday poem for a friend you know birthday poem for a friend you know birthday poem for a friend you know whatever it might be or writing your whatever it might be or writing your whatever it might be or writing your hopefully you're not writing your wife's hopefully you're not writing your wife's hopefully you're not writing your wife's Christmas card yeah kind of like missive Christmas card yeah kind of like missive Christmas card yeah kind of like missive um using AI but you might um you can do um using AI but you might um you can do um using AI but you might um you can do all these things we have to bring our all these things we have to bring our all these things we have to bring our Humanity to and weigh each other these Humanity to and weigh each other these Humanity to and weigh each other these things up individually I mean car I'll things up individually I mean car I'll things up individually I mean car I'll turn it on you like how would you feel turn it on you like how would you feel turn it on you like how would you feel about the idea of a a carry bot in the about the idea of a a carry bot in the about the idea of a a carry bot in the future long after you've you know kind future long after you've you know kind future long after you've you know kind of gone to be with the Lord you know and of gone to be with the Lord you know and of gone to be with the Lord you know and all of your sermon content you know all of your sermon content you know all of your sermon content you know Falls over into the public domain like Falls over into the public domain like Falls over into the public domain like do you want people interacting with do you want people interacting with do you want people interacting with Kerry 3.0 in the future and you know Kerry 3.0 in the future and you know Kerry 3.0 in the future and you know downloading future versions of sermons downloading future versions of sermons downloading future versions of sermons that you never wrote like write me a that you never wrote like write me a that you never wrote like write me a sermon on you know kind of one sermon on you know kind of one sermon on you know kind of one Corinthians 133 with the Theology of CS Corinthians 133 with the Theology of CS Corinthians 133 with the Theology of CS Lewis and The Star car newal like what Lewis and The Star car newal like what Lewis and The Star car newal like what what would that look like yeah I I find what would that look like yeah I I find what would that look like yeah I I find that very problematic first of all you that very problematic first of all you that very problematic first of all you know we were talking about this as a know we were talking about this as a know we were talking about this as a team very recently I think most of the team very recently I think most of the team very recently I think most of the work I've done in this life is going to work I've done in this life is going to work I've done in this life is going to disappear in a generation you just disappear in a generation you just disappear in a generation you just there's very few people who get read uh there's very few people who get read uh there's very few people who get read uh beyond their demise but I think it

beyond their demise but I think it beyond their demise but I think it honestly it's a great question honestly it's a great question honestly it's a great question JP unless things get upended very very JP unless things get upended very very JP unless things get upended very very quickly I think the one thing that has quickly I think the one thing that has quickly I think the one thing that has the potential to outlive you is a book the potential to outlive you is a book the potential to outlive you is a book you write you write you write um podcast come and go blog P post come um podcast come and go blog P post come um podcast come and go blog P post come and go social media posts Vapor eyes and go social media posts Vapor eyes and go social media posts Vapor eyes with the dawn um I think I think it's a with the dawn um I think I think it's a with the dawn um I think I think it's a book and what I like about a book when book and what I like about a book when book and what I like about a book when they're well done is you know a book's they're well done is you know a book's they're well done is you know a book's taken you anywhere from a lifetime to taken you anywhere from a lifetime to taken you anywhere from a lifetime to multiple years to produce it's your best multiple years to produce it's your best multiple years to produce it's your best thinking on an issue it's 340 50 70,000 thinking on an issue it's 340 50 70,000 thinking on an issue it's 340 50 70,000 words on a dedicated subject and it words on a dedicated subject and it words on a dedicated subject and it makes a long form argument that you just makes a long form argument that you just makes a long form argument that you just can't make on on digital means you just can't make on on digital means you just can't make on on digital means you just you can't do it and so you know you can't do it and so you know you can't do it and so you know alternatively you know if you have a alternatively you know if you have a alternatively you know if you have a lecture series you're a professor it lecture series you're a professor it lecture series you're a professor it probably has that level of of thought to probably has that level of of thought to probably has that level of of thought to it and lecture notes but often lectures it and lecture notes but often lectures it and lecture notes but often lectures endure when they get published so I endure when they get published so I endure when they get published so I think if you have a Tome of work that think if you have a Tome of work that think if you have a Tome of work that might be you know by the time I'm gone might be you know by the time I'm gone might be you know by the time I'm gone hopefully I've written eight or nine hopefully I've written eight or nine hopefully I've written eight or nine books and and that's plenty for a books and and that's plenty for a books and and that's plenty for a lifetime maybe one of them has a chance lifetime maybe one of them has a chance lifetime maybe one of them has a chance to be helpful beyond my death but you to be helpful beyond my death but you to be helpful beyond my death but you know the sermon chatbot for Charles know the sermon chatbot for Charles know the sermon chatbot for Charles Spurgeon I'm sure is coming if it hasn't Spurgeon I'm sure is coming if it hasn't Spurgeon I'm sure is coming if it hasn't been invented yet but I think if you been invented yet but I think if you been invented yet but I think if you have Legacy thinkers or people who have Legacy thinkers or people who have Legacy thinkers or people who really helped shape the thought of a really helped shape the thought of a really helped shape the thought of a generation that perhaps a chatbot would generation that perhaps a chatbot would generation that perhaps a chatbot would be helpful I think for most of us myself

be helpful I think for most of us myself be helpful I think for most of us myself included it's like you made a included it's like you made a included it's like you made a contribution in your lifetime you did a contribution in your lifetime you did a contribution in your lifetime you did a good job and most people tend you know good job and most people tend you know good job and most people tend you know Gordon McDonald told me years ago and Gordon McDonald told me years ago and Gordon McDonald told me years ago and he's written some amazing books I was he's written some amazing books I was he's written some amazing books I was asking advice as I steep back from the asking advice as I steep back from the asking advice as I steep back from the teaching team and like retired retired teaching team and like retired retired teaching team and like retired retired at Conexus and just became a congregant at Conexus and just became a congregant at Conexus and just became a congregant he said Carrie they forget you quickly he said Carrie they forget you quickly he said Carrie they forget you quickly and he was so accurate and and you know and he was so accurate and and you know and he was so accurate and and you know that's humbling but you just have to that's humbling but you just have to that's humbling but you just have to realize your place in the culture and uh realize your place in the culture and uh realize your place in the culture and uh so yeah I I wouldn't have any now I so yeah I I wouldn't have any now I so yeah I I wouldn't have any now I think while I'm alive we're working on a think while I'm alive we're working on a think while I'm alive we're working on a carry bot so that people can ask me carry bot so that people can ask me carry bot so that people can ask me questions and spit out I have thousands questions and spit out I have thousands questions and spit out I have thousands of Articles and you know ideas and of Articles and you know ideas and of Articles and you know ideas and published sources out there we'll feed published sources out there we'll feed published sources out there we'll feed all that into the G BT and it'll pump all that into the G BT and it'll pump all that into the G BT and it'll pump out or L llm it'll pump out hopefully out or L llm it'll pump out hopefully out or L llm it'll pump out hopefully accurate answers we haven't been able to accurate answers we haven't been able to accurate answers we haven't been able to get it accurate enough yet but uh when get it accurate enough yet but uh when get it accurate enough yet but uh when we do get it I don't want to be we do get it I don't want to be we do get it I don't want to be responsible for saying things I didn't responsible for saying things I didn't responsible for saying things I didn't mean and never intended to say I look mean and never intended to say I look mean and never intended to say I look forward to playing around with it I forward to playing around with it I forward to playing around with it I might even write my own sermon or to might even write my own sermon or to might even write my own sermon or to using oh that' be great that'd be great using oh that' be great that'd be great using oh that' be great that'd be great so um I'm gonna ask you one or two more so um I'm gonna ask you one or two more so um I'm gonna ask you one or two more questions and then open the floor to you questions and then open the floor to you questions and then open the floor to you what what do you wish churches were what what do you wish churches were what what do you wish churches were doing with AI that they're not doing doing with AI that they're not doing doing with AI that they're not doing right now wow I mean there is a lot just right now wow I mean there is a lot just right now wow I mean there is a lot just to kind of get off the starting blocks to kind of get off the starting blocks to kind of get off the starting blocks with which is you know again we have with which is you know again we have with which is you know again we have this wonderful opportunity don't we like this wonderful opportunity don't we like this wonderful opportunity don't we like in church ministry to you know bring in church ministry to you know bring in church ministry to you know bring people into relationship with Jesus and people into relationship with Jesus and people into relationship with Jesus and have them grow and be nurtured and be have them grow and be nurtured and be have them grow and be nurtured and be discipled but the thing that often gets discipled but the thing that often gets discipled but the thing that often gets in the way of that is just the

in the way of that is just the in the way of that is just the day-to-day drudgery of managing our you day-to-day drudgery of managing our you day-to-day drudgery of managing our you know money managing our teams putting know money managing our teams putting know money managing our teams putting people on rotors you all of this stuff people on rotors you all of this stuff people on rotors you all of this stuff so one of the big things I just wish so one of the big things I just wish so one of the big things I just wish churches would be doing is seeing this churches would be doing is seeing this churches would be doing is seeing this massive opportunity that's in front of massive opportunity that's in front of massive opportunity that's in front of them to pick up a bunch of things that them to pick up a bunch of things that them to pick up a bunch of things that might just make that task a little bit might just make that task a little bit might just make that task a little bit easier this week this month um you know easier this week this month um you know easier this week this month um you know whether think about you know whether think about you know whether think about you know particularly in the post digital Age and particularly in the post digital Age and particularly in the post digital Age and and postco we're all wrestling with and postco we're all wrestling with and postco we're all wrestling with having to basically compete for having to basically compete for having to basically compete for attention on social media to create attention on social media to create attention on social media to create content to bring people through the content to bring people through the content to bring people through the doors uh it's the primary place that doors uh it's the primary place that doors uh it's the primary place that people are spending time and money in people are spending time and money in people are spending time and money in terms of evangelism and Outreach but terms of evangelism and Outreach but terms of evangelism and Outreach but that you know not most churches don't that you know not most churches don't that you know not most churches don't have a church staff as I said before have a church staff as I said before have a church staff as I said before most churches are one person with army most churches are one person with army most churches are one person with army of well-meaning volunteers um and so of well-meaning volunteers um and so of well-meaning volunteers um and so they don't have teams that can help do they don't have teams that can help do they don't have teams that can help do the social media posting or manage a the social media posting or manage a the social media posting or manage a schedule or put together a rotor um with schedule or put together a rotor um with schedule or put together a rotor um with and if they are doing it they're often and if they are doing it they're often and if they are doing it they're often having to do it in their spare time so I having to do it in their spare time so I having to do it in their spare time so I think one of the big things is that think one of the big things is that think one of the big things is that churches would adopt some of these churches would adopt some of these churches would adopt some of these things just to get the basics done uh things just to get the basics done uh things just to get the basics done uh and you know spend more of their and you know spend more of their and you know spend more of their well-earned uh time and and their well-earned uh time and and their well-earned uh time and and their congregation's resources on that rather congregation's resources on that rather congregation's resources on that rather than you know having to relearn how to than you know having to relearn how to than you know having to relearn how to do another you know three social media do another you know three social media do another you know three social media posts in canva next Sunday so you know posts in canva next Sunday so you know posts in canva next Sunday so you know what's fast ating I've got a personal what's fast ating I've got a personal what's fast ating I've got a personal story on that we had some family over a story on that we had some family over a story on that we had some family over a couple weeks ago and I have a niece who couple weeks ago and I have a niece who couple weeks ago and I have a niece who started her own business and she wasn't started her own business and she wasn't started her own business and she wasn't at the table but her mom was and she was at the table but her mom was and she was at the table but her mom was and she was just saying how overwhelming it was for just saying how overwhelming it was for just saying how overwhelming it was for my niece to try to come up with social my niece to try to come up with social my niece to try to come up with social media but she wants to get the word out media but she wants to get the word out media but she wants to get the word out and I'm like well have you used AI so he and I'm like well have you used AI so he and I'm like well have you used AI so he literally just brought my laptop to the

literally just brought my laptop to the literally just brought my laptop to the kitchen counter and I I used a couple of kitchen counter and I I used a couple of kitchen counter and I I used a couple of AIS and just entered a prompt that said AIS and just entered a prompt that said AIS and just entered a prompt that said develop here's the name of the salon develop here's the name of the salon develop here's the name of the salon here's the name of the person this here's the name of the person this here's the name of the person this location this is specialization location this is specialization location this is specialization create a social media plan that for the create a social media plan that for the create a social media plan that for the next 30 days on her Instagram account next 30 days on her Instagram account next 30 days on her Instagram account literally strategy exact text everything literally strategy exact text everything literally strategy exact text everything image suggestions in about 25 seconds image suggestions in about 25 seconds image suggestions in about 25 seconds and my sister-in-law started to cry and my sister-in-law started to cry and my sister-in-law started to cry she's like this this exists I'm like she's like this this exists I'm like she's like this this exists I'm like absolutely and and you know that was the absolutely and and you know that was the absolutely and and you know that was the well I think I was paid I've done the well I think I was paid I've done the well I think I was paid I've done the same thing with with a teacher that I same thing with with a teacher that I same thing with with a teacher that I know a friend of mine who's a you know a friend of mine who's a you know a friend of mine who's a you teacher she fourth grade here in the UK teacher she fourth grade here in the UK teacher she fourth grade here in the UK and I showed her to how to transcribe a and I showed her to how to transcribe a and I showed her to how to transcribe a YouTube video turn it into a quick you YouTube video turn it into a quick you YouTube video turn it into a quick you know short story analogy for her class know short story analogy for her class know short story analogy for her class and then write a bunch of follow-up and then write a bunch of follow-up and then write a bunch of follow-up questions and you know to that same questions and you know to that same questions and you know to that same reaction just you know people's eyes reaction just you know people's eyes reaction just you know people's eyes light up and like this stuff is actually light up and like this stuff is actually light up and like this stuff is actually here the the thing that I really want here the the thing that I really want here the the thing that I really want people do is not just use it but know people do is not just use it but know people do is not just use it but know how to use it really well like that's how to use it really well like that's how to use it really well like that's where the real game Cher is so you know where the real game Cher is so you know where the real game Cher is so you know I don't know if you did this with with I don't know if you did this with with I don't know if you did this with with your example with your friend but you your example with your friend but you your example with your friend but you know telling it to not just write a know telling it to not just write a know telling it to not just write a social media policy but tell it hey social media policy but tell it hey social media policy but tell it hey you're going to behave like an absolute you're going to behave like an absolute you're going to behave like an absolute social media expert you know everything social media expert you know everything social media expert you know everything that you need to know about how to post that you need to know about how to post that you need to know about how to post on this platform you've learned from all on this platform you've learned from all on this platform you've learned from all of the big influencers and now this is of the big influencers and now this is of the big influencers and now this is all the information I want you to go and all the information I want you to go and all the information I want you to go and produce for me those little tweaks in produce for me those little tweaks in produce for me those little tweaks in the prompt do amazing things they still the prompt do amazing things they still the prompt do amazing things they still work okay that's good to know they still work okay that's good to know they still work okay that's good to know they still work and and these models they produce work and and these models they produce work and and these models they produce some fascinating results when you give

some fascinating results when you give some fascinating results when you give them a bit of personality to respond in them a bit of personality to respond in them a bit of personality to respond in before you get started so I think that's before you get started so I think that's before you get started so I think that's the other thing I want people to do is the other thing I want people to do is the other thing I want people to do is use them well well uh there's a lot of use them well well uh there's a lot of use them well well uh there's a lot of stuff we could get to but uh we've been stuff we could get to but uh we've been stuff we could get to but uh we've been an hour on this already uh anything we an hour on this already uh anything we an hour on this already uh anything we haven't touched on that you'd like to haven't touched on that you'd like to haven't touched on that you'd like to touch touch touch on I think the main thing I would say is on I think the main thing I would say is on I think the main thing I would say is that I think that those speaking to that I think that those speaking to that I think that those speaking to anyone that's kind of working in anyone that's kind of working in anyone that's kind of working in technology or working in leadership technology or working in leadership technology or working in leadership right now has a responsibility when it right now has a responsibility when it right now has a responsibility when it comes to AI that they may not think comes to AI that they may not think comes to AI that they may not think about which is that we are the last about which is that we are the last about which is that we are the last generation maybe the most anxious generation maybe the most anxious generation maybe the most anxious according to Jonathan height but we're according to Jonathan height but we're according to Jonathan height but we're the last generation of people of Le the last generation of people of Le the last generation of people of Le leaders that will remember what life was leaders that will remember what life was leaders that will remember what life was like before and after this technology like before and after this technology like before and after this technology has existed like my kids I've got you at has existed like my kids I've got you at has existed like my kids I've got you at the time of recording a nine-year-old the time of recording a nine-year-old the time of recording a nine-year-old and a six-year-old they will not know and a six-year-old they will not know and a six-year-old they will not know what life is like to go through school what life is like to go through school what life is like to go through school to go into University to work in a a to go into University to work in a a to go into University to work in a a workplace to you know talk to a social workplace to you know talk to a social workplace to you know talk to a social media thing and not question whether or media thing and not question whether or media thing and not question whether or not is this a real person or is this an not is this a real person or is this an not is this a real person or is this an AI like that's the we're the last AI like that's the we're the last AI like that's the we're the last generation to remember what that's like generation to remember what that's like generation to remember what that's like like and so I think as Leaders as like and so I think as Leaders as like and so I think as Leaders as technologists as particularly people technologists as particularly people technologists as particularly people working in Ministry we're the last working in Ministry we're the last working in Ministry we're the last people to remember what that truly people to remember what that truly people to remember what that truly disconnected experience was like and we disconnected experience was like and we disconnected experience was like and we want to try and look for what was the want to try and look for what was the want to try and look for what was the gold in that that we want to bring into gold in that that we want to bring into gold in that that we want to bring into the Next Generation and hold on to and the Next Generation and hold on to and the Next Generation and hold on to and what are the things that we want our AIS what are the things that we want our AIS what are the things that we want our AIS we want our technology to look like in

we want our technology to look like in we want our technology to look like in the future so that we end up in that the future so that we end up in that the future so that we end up in that more um positive view of where that more um positive view of where that more um positive view of where that future curve might go rather than the future curve might go rather than the future curve might go rather than the more negative because I think we only more negative because I think we only more negative because I think we only get one shot at it we've seen so many get one shot at it we've seen so many get one shot at it we've seen so many times before that when this technology times before that when this technology times before that when this technology or any technology gets out of the box or any technology gets out of the box or any technology gets out of the box there is no real putting it back in there is no real putting it back in there is no real putting it back in there and we're seeing obviously efforts there and we're seeing obviously efforts there and we're seeing obviously efforts at the moment to do that with social at the moment to do that with social at the moment to do that with social media we don't want to have to go media we don't want to have to go media we don't want to have to go through the same thing with AI and I through the same thing with AI and I through the same thing with AI and I think that's our responsibility it's all think that's our responsibility it's all think that's our responsibility it's all of our responsibility and it comes back of our responsibility and it comes back of our responsibility and it comes back to the point I made at the start which to the point I made at the start which to the point I made at the start which is you can wait for the government to is you can wait for the government to is you can wait for the government to regulate a model or you can hope that a regulate a model or you can hope that a regulate a model or you can hope that a benevolent AI benevolent AI benevolent AI Council arises out of the big seven Council arises out of the big seven Council arises out of the big seven companies running the show or you and companies running the show or you and companies running the show or you and your neighbors and your children and the your neighbors and your children and the your neighbors and your children and the people that you work with take people that you work with take people that you work with take Collective responsibility to say this is Collective responsibility to say this is Collective responsibility to say this is what we want this to look like in the what we want this to look like in the what we want this to look like in the future and behave accordingly and not future and behave accordingly and not future and behave accordingly and not just give into the easy thing not to just give into the easy thing not to just give into the easy thing not to give into the lazy thing and not just give into the lazy thing and not just give into the lazy thing and not just give up more utility for our privacy and give up more utility for our privacy and give up more utility for our privacy and end up with unintended consequences end up with unintended consequences end up with unintended consequences that's what I really want people to try that's what I really want people to try that's what I really want people to try and do I think that is a fantastic call and do I think that is a fantastic call and do I think that is a fantastic call to action for older listeners so I got to action for older listeners so I got to action for older listeners so I got the internet when I was 31 I got my the internet when I was 31 I got my the internet when I was 31 I got my first smartphone when I was 40 and it first smartphone when I was 40 and it first smartphone when I was 40 and it was a Blackberry and I was so excited was a Blackberry and I was so excited was a Blackberry and I was so excited that I could get emails on it it was you that I could get emails on it it was you that I could get emails on it it was you know primitive know primitive know primitive Philistine I know again you're too young Philistine I know again you're too young Philistine I know again you're too young you're too young but you know you know

you're too young but you know you know you're too young but you know you know what is interesting and I've often what is interesting and I've often what is interesting and I've often thought about pre-digital memory but I thought about pre-digital memory but I thought about pre-digital memory but I was really thinking about it you know was really thinking about it you know was really thinking about it you know I'm not young as a leader anymore and I'm not young as a leader anymore and I'm not young as a leader anymore and it's like but I do know what life was it's like but I do know what life was it's like but I do know what life was like before we all got the internet the like before we all got the internet the like before we all got the internet the Prototype of the internet the dialup Prototype of the internet the dialup Prototype of the internet the dialup internet and I think you know if you internet and I think you know if you internet and I think you know if you think about what it means to be human I think about what it means to be human I think about what it means to be human I have an interest in philosophy it's have an interest in philosophy it's have an interest in philosophy it's people like Vol it's people like SRA people like Vol it's people like SRA people like Vol it's people like SRA it's people uh like kard and you know it's people uh like kard and you know it's people uh like kard and you know nii to some extent although he was nii to some extent although he was nii to some extent although he was pretty dystopian uh who who who really pretty dystopian uh who who who really pretty dystopian uh who who who really helped us positive outlook not the most helped us positive outlook not the most helped us positive outlook not the most positive outlook and theologians who positive outlook and theologians who positive outlook and theologians who make us think about what life is really make us think about what life is really make us think about what life is really about it would be wonderful in these about it would be wonderful in these about it would be wonderful in these next few decades while those of us who next few decades while those of us who next few decades while those of us who remember that are still alive because we remember that are still alive because we remember that are still alive because we won't be in 30 40 years to note what it won't be in 30 40 years to note what it won't be in 30 40 years to note what it means to be human and to really think means to be human and to really think means to be human and to really think about that because I think you're right about that because I think you're right about that because I think you're right like Civilization is about to change like Civilization is about to change like Civilization is about to change fundamentally and fundamentally and fundamentally and inalienably forever and maybe one of our inalienably forever and maybe one of our inalienably forever and maybe one of our contributions because a lot of older contributions because a lot of older contributions because a lot of older leaders feel useless they feel like oh leaders feel useless they feel like oh leaders feel useless they feel like oh my time is gone I'm not a young leader my time is gone I'm not a young leader my time is gone I'm not a young leader anymore I think to be able to reflect anymore I think to be able to reflect anymore I think to be able to reflect and and prayerfully think through the and and prayerfully think through the and and prayerfully think through the theological philosophical dimensions of theological philosophical dimensions of theological philosophical dimensions of what was it like to be the last what was it like to be the last what was it like to be the last generation to grow up with a pre digital generation to grow up with a pre digital generation to grow up with a pre digital memory and to interact as human beings memory and to interact as human beings memory and to interact as human beings and to have meaning in your life what and to have meaning in your life what and to have meaning in your life what does that look like and then you know does that look like and then you know does that look like and then you know the next generation will separate the the next generation will separate the the next generation will separate the wheat from the chaff and figure out what

wheat from the chaff and figure out what wheat from the chaff and figure out what it keeps and what it discards but that it keeps and what it discards but that it keeps and what it discards but that is a that is a tremendous help I think is a that is a tremendous help I think is a that is a tremendous help I think to people who are older and don't think to people who are older and don't think to people who are older and don't think you have to write a book just get you have to write a book just get you have to write a book just get together with some 25y olds and have together with some 25y olds and have together with some 25y olds and have conversations that's a beautiful call to conversations that's a beautiful call to conversations that's a beautiful call to action you know K I think the thing that action you know K I think the thing that action you know K I think the thing that I hold on to is that God could have I hold on to is that God could have I hold on to is that God could have chose to create anything yeah he could chose to create anything yeah he could chose to create anything yeah he could have control could have chosen to cre us have control could have chosen to cre us have control could have chosen to cre us as silicon based as silicon based as silicon based intelligences but he chose to build us intelligences but he chose to build us intelligences but he chose to build us as carbon ones and I often have this as carbon ones and I often have this as carbon ones and I often have this phrase that I say a lot is that matter phrase that I say a lot is that matter phrase that I say a lot is that matter matters you know we are physical 3D matters you know we are physical 3D matters you know we are physical 3D living our life out in the dimension of living our life out in the dimension of living our life out in the dimension of time for a reason because that's the way time for a reason because that's the way time for a reason because that's the way that God intended it and we don't want that God intended it and we don't want that God intended it and we don't want to lose sight of that that we get a lot to lose sight of that that we get a lot to lose sight of that that we get a lot of these kind of digital fantasists that of these kind of digital fantasists that of these kind of digital fantasists that live inside of the Silicon Valley bubble live inside of the Silicon Valley bubble live inside of the Silicon Valley bubble thinking that the future is us all being thinking that the future is us all being thinking that the future is us all being downloaded onto a chip and having you downloaded onto a chip and having you downloaded onto a chip and having you know endless life in that way and that's know endless life in that way and that's know endless life in that way and that's just not the model that we've been given just not the model that we've been given just not the model that we've been given and I think we want to hang on to that and I think we want to hang on to that and I think we want to hang on to that as best as we can and be the story that as best as we can and be the story that as best as we can and be the story that you know speaks into society that you you know speaks into society that you you know speaks into society that you know matter matters and that we are know matter matters and that we are know matter matters and that we are built to be with one another um in an built to be with one another um in an built to be with one another um in an embodied way because that's you know he embodied way because that's you know he embodied way because that's you know he come he came to earth right in in bodily come he came to earth right in in bodily come he came to earth right in in bodily form for a reason um he didn't he didn't form for a reason um he didn't he didn't form for a reason um he didn't he didn't speak to us through a chat speak to us through a chat speak to us through a chat bot fascinating JP people are going to bot fascinating JP people are going to bot fascinating JP people are going to want to track with you where will they want to track with you where will they want to track with you where will they find you online these days and any find you online these days and any find you online these days and any resources you want to direct people to resources you want to direct people to resources you want to direct people to in particular yeah well I'm sure you'll in particular yeah well I'm sure you'll in particular yeah well I'm sure you'll find the links to the shet but you'll find the links to the shet but you'll find the links to the shet but you'll find me James poter at pretty much every

find me James poter at pretty much every find me James poter at pretty much every social media platform you need to I social media platform you need to I social media platform you need to I write mostly over LinkedIn if that's write mostly over LinkedIn if that's write mostly over LinkedIn if that's your place or you like to hang out uh your place or you like to hang out uh your place or you like to hang out uh and if you are interested I suppose in and if you are interested I suppose in and if you are interested I suppose in getting more information about how to getting more information about how to getting more information about how to follow along with what we're doing at follow along with what we're doing at follow along with what we're doing at ecclesi go to Eccles i.org that's a eou ecclesi go to Eccles i.org that's a eou ecclesi go to Eccles i.org that's a eou CLE s i that's the Ecclesia AI b.org um CLE s i that's the Ecclesia AI b.org um CLE s i that's the Ecclesia AI b.org um ec.org and yeah you'll get the resources ec.org and yeah you'll get the resources ec.org and yeah you'll get the resources follow the research and engage in the follow the research and engage in the follow the research and engage in the conversation fantastic thank you so much conversation fantastic thank you so much conversation fantastic thank you so much thank you Carrie