Intentional Cultivation of a Multicultural Church | Interview with Chip Freed

[Music] [Music] today i'm talking with chip freed today i'm talking with chip freed today i'm talking with chip freed chip is the lead pastor at garfield chip is the lead pastor at garfield chip is the lead pastor at garfield memorial church in cleveland ohio memorial church in cleveland ohio memorial church in cleveland ohio now this is truly a multi-ethnic church now this is truly a multi-ethnic church now this is truly a multi-ethnic church with many people with many people with many people that have all kinds of different that have all kinds of different that have all kinds of different backgrounds and beliefs however backgrounds and beliefs however backgrounds and beliefs however the one thing they have in common is the one thing they have in common is the one thing they have in common is they love jesus they love each other and they love jesus they love each other and they love jesus they love each other and they set aside their differences they set aside their differences they set aside their differences now chip leads this church he's doing an now chip leads this church he's doing an now chip leads this church he's doing an amazing job and and i'm really excited amazing job and and i'm really excited amazing job and and i'm really excited for you to hear for you to hear for you to hear how chip is leading in this how chip is leading in this how chip is leading in this very difficult season of multi-athletic very difficult season of multi-athletic very difficult season of multi-athletic church church church well hey chip thanks for joining us well hey chip thanks for joining us well hey chip thanks for joining us today glad today glad today glad to have you on the podcast hey it's to have you on the podcast hey it's to have you on the podcast hey it's great to meet you for the first time in great to meet you for the first time in great to meet you for the first time in person and uh person and uh person and uh and really love what mission marketing and really love what mission marketing and really love what mission marketing is doing man yeah well we love what is doing man yeah well we love what is doing man yeah well we love what you're doing we have heard some great you're doing we have heard some great you're doing we have heard some great things and uh you know today i'd like to things and uh you know today i'd like to things and uh you know today i'd like to talk talk talk about some topics that are kind of hard about some topics that are kind of hard about some topics that are kind of hard they're they're they're certainly they're they're they're certainly they're they're they're certainly difficult difficult difficult but a lot of churches are you know but a lot of churches are you know but a lot of churches are you know getting into this space and finally getting into this space and finally getting into this space and finally maybe but getting into space so maybe but getting into space so maybe but getting into space so we got this uh election coming up here we got this uh election coming up here we got this uh election coming up here in november in november in november um and it's probably as polarizing as um and it's probably as polarizing as um and it's probably as polarizing as it's maybe ever been but it's maybe ever been but it's maybe ever been but maybe not but certainly it feels that maybe not but certainly it feels that maybe not but certainly it feels that way especially when you think about all way especially when you think about all way especially when you think about all the racial issues we have the racial issues we have the racial issues we have in our country so how have you how have in our country so how have you how have in our country so how have you how have you managed that how have you talked to you managed that how have you talked to you managed that how have you talked to your congregation about that because you your congregation about that because you your congregation about that because you are a are a are a truly a multi-diverse church truly a multi-diverse church truly a multi-diverse church yeah i mean just a little about us in yeah i mean just a little about us in yeah i mean just a little about us in cleveland ohio too it's kind of unique

cleveland ohio too it's kind of unique cleveland ohio too it's kind of unique in the sense that cleveland always makes in the sense that cleveland always makes in the sense that cleveland always makes the top 10 list of most segregated the top 10 list of most segregated the top 10 list of most segregated cities in america cities in america cities in america so we were seven this year we've been as so we were seven this year we've been as so we were seven this year we've been as high as three i think three years ago high as three i think three years ago high as three i think three years ago so for us it's very important for us to so for us it's very important for us to so for us it's very important for us to to model to model to model uh as a church to not just reflect the uh as a church to not just reflect the uh as a church to not just reflect the community but more importantly reflect community but more importantly reflect community but more importantly reflect the kingdom the kingdom the kingdom you know we believe jesus was really you know we believe jesus was really you know we believe jesus was really serious when he said that kingdom come serious when he said that kingdom come serious when he said that kingdom come on earth right um and so we on earth right um and so we on earth right um and so we you know we and we talk about this uh you know we and we talk about this uh you know we and we talk about this uh we're partners with the mosaics global we're partners with the mosaics global we're partners with the mosaics global network we're teaching the church in network we're teaching the church in network we're teaching the church in that that that and a working definition of the and a working definition of the and a working definition of the multi-ethnic churches multi-ethnic churches multi-ethnic churches we say we will ourselves to walk work we say we will ourselves to walk work we say we will ourselves to walk work and worship together as one and worship together as one and worship together as one for the sake of a credible witness of for the sake of a credible witness of for the sake of a credible witness of god's love for all people not just some god's love for all people not just some god's love for all people not just some people people people yeah so that word will you know what i yeah so that word will you know what i yeah so that word will you know what i mean dude that's an active word mean dude that's an active word mean dude that's an active word and so i think uh willing ourselves to and so i think uh willing ourselves to and so i think uh willing ourselves to try to be try to be try to be this kind of witness in a polarized time this kind of witness in a polarized time this kind of witness in a polarized time you know it's kind of for such a time as you know it's kind of for such a time as you know it's kind of for such a time as this but what folks don't realize they this but what folks don't realize they this but what folks don't realize they say oh well you know look at garfield say oh well you know look at garfield say oh well you know look at garfield and and and they don't realize how hard it is i mean they don't realize how hard it is i mean they don't realize how hard it is i mean within our body within our body within our body just to even stay together you know when just to even stay together you know when just to even stay together you know when the world is literally trying to pull us the world is literally trying to pull us the world is literally trying to pull us apart apart apart and and the you know diversity of and and the you know diversity of and and the you know diversity of political opinion is there political opinion is there political opinion is there um we don't uh we don't go after um we don't uh we don't go after um we don't uh we don't go after people or parties i don't endorse that people or parties i don't endorse that people or parties i don't endorse that and we don't talk about it and we don't talk about it and we don't talk about it but you know we'll go after racism we'll but you know we'll go after racism we'll but you know we'll go after racism we'll go after sexism we'll go after go after sexism we'll go after go after sexism we'll go after things that that uh hurt and injure things that that uh hurt and injure things that that uh hurt and injure people and discriminate against people

people and discriminate against people people and discriminate against people um and we try and stay in that lane and um and we try and stay in that lane and um and we try and stay in that lane and but we we really have to continually but we we really have to continually but we we really have to continually call ourselves call ourselves call ourselves to the mission of you know uh to the mission of you know uh to the mission of you know uh of being this kind of witness in other of being this kind of witness in other of being this kind of witness in other words i always say words i always say words i always say there's no chance of garfield become the there's no chance of garfield become the there's no chance of garfield become the garfield memorial becoming a preference garfield memorial becoming a preference garfield memorial becoming a preference driven church driven church driven church because people got to leave their because people got to leave their because people got to leave their preferences to be in the church where preferences to be in the church where preferences to be in the church where we have two rules in our church jason we have two rules in our church jason we have two rules in our church jason that this may tell you that this may tell you that this may tell you we can talk more specifically about the we can talk more specifically about the we can talk more specifically about the election that gives you kind of election that gives you kind of election that gives you kind of the fiber of who we are we say to be the fiber of who we are we say to be the fiber of who we are we say to be part of our church one you have to be part of our church one you have to be part of our church one you have to be comfortable being uncomfortable comfortable being uncomfortable comfortable being uncomfortable that's woman um although when i read my that's woman um although when i read my that's woman um although when i read my scriptures i don't find anything where scriptures i don't find anything where scriptures i don't find anything where jesus called us through like you just jesus called us through like you just jesus called us through like you just put on full comfortable life right i'm put on full comfortable life right i'm put on full comfortable life right i'm just gonna say that just gonna say that just gonna say that yeah but but we just say you have to be yeah but but we just say you have to be yeah but but we just say you have to be comfortable being uncomfortable and comfortable being uncomfortable and comfortable being uncomfortable and number two we say number two we say number two we say you're gonna like 70 of what happens you're gonna like 70 of what happens you're gonna like 70 of what happens here here here and if you can if you can live in that and if you can if you can live in that and if you can if you can live in that you're you're cool you're you're cool you're you're cool your game because when you're in here your game because when you're in here your game because when you're in here thirty percent thirty percent thirty percent understand somebody else is in there understand somebody else is in there understand somebody else is in there seventy percent so seventy percent so seventy percent so that those you know there's something that those you know there's something that those you know there's something about this church that i i about this church that i i about this church that i i i really admire and i don't just say i really admire and i don't just say i really admire and i don't just say that from the lead pastor chair that from the lead pastor chair that from the lead pastor chair but i see folks of every tribe you know but i see folks of every tribe you know but i see folks of every tribe you know culture nation the revelation 7 9 church culture nation the revelation 7 9 church culture nation the revelation 7 9 church and i see folks and i see folks and i see folks really working at their their walk with really working at their their walk with really working at their their walk with christ i mean christ i mean christ i mean you know a lot of places you go we do you know a lot of places you go we do you know a lot of places you go we do some fun stuff don't get me wrong people some fun stuff don't get me wrong people some fun stuff don't get me wrong people love it enjoy it love it enjoy it love it enjoy it a lot of places people go because they a lot of places people go because they a lot of places people go because they won't feel totally comfortable and i get won't feel totally comfortable and i get won't feel totally comfortable and i get this this this and i love this preach i love this music and i love this preach i love this music and i love this preach i love this music love the kids in their streets

love the kids in their streets love the kids in their streets i think we we put a lot of time in to i think we we put a lot of time in to i think we we put a lot of time in to this i see folks really stretching this i see folks really stretching this i see folks really stretching you know just stretching like we can't you know just stretching like we can't you know just stretching like we can't be everything nobody can do that but be everything nobody can do that but be everything nobody can do that but people are really trying people are really trying people are really trying and i really really admire that i think and i really really admire that i think and i really really admire that i think that's um i think that's a depth in that's um i think that's a depth in that's um i think that's a depth in their spiritual their spiritual their spiritual life yeah well you know to your point life yeah well you know to your point life yeah well you know to your point jesus never said this is going to be jesus never said this is going to be jesus never said this is going to be easy easy easy and why would you want it to be easy and why would you want it to be easy and why would you want it to be easy it's it's it's it's it's hard and for you to to have a it's it's hard and for you to to have a it's it's hard and for you to to have a a truly growing diversity diverse church a truly growing diversity diverse church a truly growing diversity diverse church well it speaks volumes to your well it speaks volumes to your well it speaks volumes to your leadership in leadership in leadership in and and painting that picture that i and and painting that picture that i and and painting that picture that i love that concept hey if you you know love that concept hey if you you know love that concept hey if you you know there's no perfect church ever right there's no perfect church ever right there's no perfect church ever right jesus is perfect we're not so therefore jesus is perfect we're not so therefore jesus is perfect we're not so therefore we're not gonna have a perfect church at we're not gonna have a perfect church at we're not gonna have a perfect church at all all all but but if but you're leading people to but but if but you're leading people to but but if but you're leading people to recognize that it's okay recognize that it's okay recognize that it's okay um you you have to be accepting and um you you have to be accepting and um you you have to be accepting and focus focus focus first on jesus and focus on love and the first on jesus and focus on love and the first on jesus and focus on love and the rest of it kind of takes care of itself rest of it kind of takes care of itself rest of it kind of takes care of itself and and and i'm sure how you know is there a time i'm sure how you know is there a time i'm sure how you know is there a time where you where you where you this kind of like it clicked going we this kind of like it clicked going we this kind of like it clicked going we really need to be focused on that like really need to be focused on that like really need to be focused on that like is that something that well i have to do is that something that well i have to do is that something that well i have to do some i gotta do a little personal some i gotta do a little personal some i gotta do a little personal confession okay confession okay confession okay um it's it's it's i guess in my dna i um it's it's it's i guess in my dna i um it's it's it's i guess in my dna i think every think every think every pastor needs to dig down deep what are pastor needs to dig down deep what are pastor needs to dig down deep what are their core calling their core calling their core calling right like i was never called to go right like i was never called to go right like i was never called to go visit people at the hospital or lead a visit people at the hospital or lead a visit people at the hospital or lead a trustee meeting but you learn to do trustee meeting but you learn to do trustee meeting but you learn to do those things those things those things yeah my core calling was first to

yeah my core calling was first to yeah my core calling was first to foremost to preach the gospel that was foremost to preach the gospel that was foremost to preach the gospel that was clear very young clear very young clear very young and secondly there was dealing with the and secondly there was dealing with the and secondly there was dealing with the fragmentation of community fragmentation of community fragmentation of community like i was raised in a house with a like i was raised in a house with a like i was raised in a house with a mother that was amazing like i mother that was amazing like i mother that was amazing like i she had to have the talk with me about she had to have the talk with me about she had to have the talk with me about racism what racism was racism what racism was racism what racism was because in the seven i played division because in the seven i played division because in the seven i played division one college basketball so i was a one college basketball so i was a one college basketball so i was a basketball holic basketball holic basketball holic and uh the first african-american moved and uh the first african-american moved and uh the first african-american moved into our school system in the seventh into our school system in the seventh into our school system in the seventh grade grade grade um so i would have been i'm going to um so i would have been i'm going to um so i would have been i'm going to date myself uh 1976 date myself uh 1976 date myself uh 1976 and uh you know we became buds because and uh you know we became buds because and uh you know we became buds because we were teammates and we were teammates and we were teammates and i went to this one club took him as a i went to this one club took him as a i went to this one club took him as a guest and they came out and bleached the guest and they came out and bleached the guest and they came out and bleached the pool pool pool you know and you know i rode our bikes you know and you know i rode our bikes you know and you know i rode our bikes back home and i had back home and i had back home and i had my mom had to have to talk with me and my mom had to have to talk with me and my mom had to have to talk with me and you know there's a passage where it says you know there's a passage where it says you know there's a passage where it says jesus looked at the crowd and he grew up jesus looked at the crowd and he grew up jesus looked at the crowd and he grew up great compassion on them and you great compassion on them and you great compassion on them and you probably know this probably know this probably know this as a biblical scholar that had as a biblical scholar that had as a biblical scholar that had compassion is that that compassion is that that compassion is that that word in the greek that comes from like word in the greek that comes from like word in the greek that comes from like splogna splogna splogna which is like his intestines twisted which is like his intestines twisted which is like his intestines twisted and when my my mom had that talk of me and when my my mom had that talk of me and when my my mom had that talk of me something inside me twisted and i almost something inside me twisted and i almost something inside me twisted and i almost feel sick in my stomach feel sick in my stomach feel sick in my stomach and i just felt this calling um you know and i just felt this calling um you know and i just felt this calling um you know so i so i so i went down the path of of learning beyond went down the path of of learning beyond went down the path of of learning beyond my own culture my own culture my own culture um i had a degree in um african-american um i had a degree in um african-american um i had a degree in um african-american studies a minor at colgate with manning studies a minor at colgate with manning studies a minor at colgate with manning maribel maribel maribel who was cornell west professor so i went who was cornell west professor so i went who was cornell west professor so i went to princeton i was a graduate system for to princeton i was a graduate system for to princeton i was a graduate system for cornell so cornell so cornell so kind of immersed in this whole race kind of immersed in this whole race kind of immersed in this whole race crisis uh met my wife we've been married crisis uh met my wife we've been married crisis uh met my wife we've been married over three decades she happens to be over three decades she happens to be over three decades she happens to be african-american so

african-american so african-american so we got together when only 10 of america we got together when only 10 of america we got together when only 10 of america was in favor of was in favor of was in favor of interracial marriage and we heard a lot interracial marriage and we heard a lot interracial marriage and we heard a lot of preachers preaching against that and of preachers preaching against that and of preachers preaching against that and we looked through that whole needle we looked through that whole needle we looked through that whole needle so we've tried to be you know just so we've tried to be you know just so we've tried to be you know just bridge builders we don't go in with this bridge builders we don't go in with this bridge builders we don't go in with this as a cause as a cause as a cause um but i've had the privilege to only um but i've had the privilege to only um but i've had the privilege to only serve two churches in my life serve two churches in my life serve two churches in my life one was a one was the oldest historical one was a one was the oldest historical one was a one was the oldest historical african american church african american church african american church in lorain county that dwindled down to in lorain county that dwindled down to in lorain county that dwindled down to 32 people 32 people 32 people and by the time we left there they were and by the time we left there they were and by the time we left there they were running 400 in worship and probably running 400 in worship and probably running 400 in worship and probably 65-35 65-35 65-35 and then here at garfield was more of a and then here at garfield was more of a and then here at garfield was more of a upper middle-class all-white church upper middle-class all-white church upper middle-class all-white church that um transitioned now to about you that um transitioned now to about you that um transitioned now to about you know 1300 know 1300 know 1300 active folks 647 active folks 647 active folks 647 adult baptisms the last 10 years i love adult baptisms the last 10 years i love adult baptisms the last 10 years i love that number that number that number but no no one ethnic group more than 52 but no no one ethnic group more than 52 but no no one ethnic group more than 52 and and i i don't know i think my wife and and i i don't know i think my wife and and i i don't know i think my wife and i probably we were carriers of that and i probably we were carriers of that and i probably we were carriers of that just as who we are in our dna but i just as who we are in our dna but i just as who we are in our dna but i always share with the book this really always share with the book this really always share with the book this really grows grows grows out of healthy evangelistic dna out of healthy evangelistic dna out of healthy evangelistic dna you know when jesus said go and make you know when jesus said go and make you know when jesus said go and make disciples of all disciples of all disciples of all ethnic that's the word for people groups ethnic that's the word for people groups ethnic that's the word for people groups fna and the greek fna and the greek fna and the greek you know i think we translate that in to you know i think we translate that in to you know i think we translate that in to go and make some go and make some go and make some you know and fish in certain waters and you know and fish in certain waters and you know and fish in certain waters and and what's your target audience and what's your target audience and what's your target audience right like in mosaics we we challenge right like in mosaics we we challenge right like in mosaics we we challenge mark damas and i and we say mark damas and i and we say mark damas and i and we say who's your target audience was never a who's your target audience was never a who's your target audience was never a biblical question biblical question biblical question you know i mean we made it this question

you know i mean we made it this question you know i mean we made it this question is is is it's go out and reach um you know every it's go out and reach um you know every it's go out and reach um you know every people people people nation tribe and language and and uh the nation tribe and language and and uh the nation tribe and language and and uh the revelation revelation revelation 9 church i talk about garfield like we 9 church i talk about garfield like we 9 church i talk about garfield like we know where we're going know where we're going know where we're going you know if you ever build something you know if you ever build something you know if you ever build something like i'm a terrible builder my like i'm a terrible builder my like i'm a terrible builder my oldest daughter she's an architect so oldest daughter she's an architect so oldest daughter she's an architect so she's the builder she's the builder she's the builder but even when we're putting something but even when we're putting something but even when we're putting something together what do you do you have to look together what do you do you have to look together what do you do you have to look at the box top right like how does this at the box top right like how does this at the box top right like how does this thing go together thing go together thing go together forget the instructions and i feel like forget the instructions and i feel like forget the instructions and i feel like in revelation 7 in revelation 7 in revelation 7 9 god gave us the box style like we know 9 god gave us the box style like we know 9 god gave us the box style like we know the trajectory of the church the trajectory of the church the trajectory of the church so are we just sitting back now saying so are we just sitting back now saying so are we just sitting back now saying well god will figure that out someday well god will figure that out someday well god will figure that out someday when he says no my kingdom come on earth when he says no my kingdom come on earth when he says no my kingdom come on earth as it is in heaven which you mind on as it is in heaven which you mind on as it is in heaven which you mind on earth will be earth will be earth will be founded you know i mean there's just founded you know i mean there's just founded you know i mean there's just we're to be the now and not yet we're to be the now and not yet we're to be the now and not yet so yeah getting a group of folk they're so yeah getting a group of folk they're so yeah getting a group of folk they're committed to that committed to that committed to that um in their walk with christ it's really um in their walk with christ it's really um in their walk with christ it's really really exciting really exciting really exciting um but you're right in an election year um but you're right in an election year um but you're right in an election year it's also it's also it's also really really challenging yeah well so really really challenging yeah well so really really challenging yeah well so yeah yeah yeah to your point you're not going to wander to your point you're not going to wander to your point you're not going to wander into becoming a multi-ethnic church into becoming a multi-ethnic church into becoming a multi-ethnic church that's just that's not going to happen that's just that's not going to happen that's just that's not going to happen right it right it right it it just won't happen so you guys have it just won't happen so you guys have it just won't happen so you guys have addressed that and you addressed that and you addressed that and you are that like you just i think you said are that like you just i think you said are that like you just i think you said 52 52 52 you know you're just a mixed background you know you're just a mixed background you know you're just a mixed background mixed race mixed race mixed race what what advice do you give to churches what what advice do you give to churches what what advice do you give to churches that are that they don't have that that are that they don't have that that are that they don't have that statistic statistic statistic that are going huh probably need to that are going huh probably need to that are going huh probably need to think about this and we need to

think about this and we need to think about this and we need to you know we need to pray about this and you know we need to pray about this and you know we need to pray about this and be led by god but what would you say be led by god but what would you say be led by god but what would you say practically practically practically this is what you have to do yeah so this is what you have to do yeah so this is what you have to do yeah so first off uh generate a holy discontent first off uh generate a holy discontent first off uh generate a holy discontent i i don't think there's enough of that i i don't think there's enough of that i i don't think there's enough of that in our churches we look around and we in our churches we look around and we in our churches we look around and we see like see like see like we're all this culture we're all we're all this culture we're all we're all this culture we're all republican we're all democrat we're all republican we're all democrat we're all republican we're all democrat we're all college educated college educated college educated um you know we're birds of a feather um you know we're birds of a feather um you know we're birds of a feather flock together flock together flock together and i what we try to do with mosaics is and i what we try to do with mosaics is and i what we try to do with mosaics is go in and just kind of go in and just kind of go in and just kind of generate a little holy discontent about generate a little holy discontent about generate a little holy discontent about that you know the truth that you know the truth that you know the truth and to not say just and to not say just and to not say just this isn't simply because of the this isn't simply because of the this isn't simply because of the changing demographic of america which changing demographic of america which changing demographic of america which that's not going anywhere that's not going anywhere that's not going anywhere right um the the number one contributor right um the the number one contributor right um the the number one contributor to the fact that to the fact that to the fact that we'll be a non-anglo-majority nation by we'll be a non-anglo-majority nation by we'll be a non-anglo-majority nation by about 2043 about 2043 about 2043 everybody thinks it's immigration it's everybody thinks it's immigration it's everybody thinks it's immigration it's birth rate right that's what's doing it birth rate right that's what's doing it birth rate right that's what's doing it i contributed to that it's not going i contributed to that it's not going i contributed to that it's not going anywhere anywhere anywhere um and so obviously to to be relevant in um and so obviously to to be relevant in um and so obviously to to be relevant in our culture we talk about this our culture we talk about this our culture we talk about this but we don't do it for that reason we do but we don't do it for that reason we do but we don't do it for that reason we do it because really this is biblically it because really this is biblically it because really this is biblically mandated mandated mandated people don't think about this but every people don't think about this but every people don't think about this but every single church in the book of acts is a single church in the book of acts is a single church in the book of acts is a mole ethnic card mole ethnic card mole ethnic card um and and so you know we feel this um and and so you know we feel this um and and so you know we feel this envisioned by envisioned by envisioned by christ in john 17 is described by luke christ in john 17 is described by luke christ in john 17 is described by luke in the book of acts and it's prescribed in the book of acts and it's prescribed in the book of acts and it's prescribed by paul by paul by paul here's here's a little truth bomb for here's here's a little truth bomb for here's here's a little truth bomb for folks that are out there folks that are out there folks that are out there um it's dawned on me you know paul had a um it's dawned on me you know paul had a um it's dawned on me you know paul had a specific specific specific calling and it was gentile inclusion

calling and it was gentile inclusion calling and it was gentile inclusion right right right which was a was an ethnic difference which was a was an ethnic difference which was a was an ethnic difference from jew and gentile from jew and gentile from jew and gentile and he a former pharisee was called to and he a former pharisee was called to and he a former pharisee was called to gentile inclusion in fact in romans 16 gentile inclusion in fact in romans 16 gentile inclusion in fact in romans 16 25 25 25 he talks about i came to share with you he talks about i came to share with you he talks about i came to share with you my gospel my gospel my gospel and the goodness of jesus christ now can and the goodness of jesus christ now can and the goodness of jesus christ now can you imagine jason i stand up in your you imagine jason i stand up in your you imagine jason i stand up in your church and i said church and i said church and i said hey jason brought me today and chips hey jason brought me today and chips hey jason brought me today and chips here i'm here to preach my gospel here i'm here to preach my gospel here i'm here to preach my gospel like you better throw me out but paul like you better throw me out but paul like you better throw me out but paul had like the big g gospel martha mars had like the big g gospel martha mars had like the big g gospel martha mars likes to say and then the little g likes to say and then the little g likes to say and then the little g gospel and his little g gospel with gospel and his little g gospel with gospel and his little g gospel with gentile inclusion gentile inclusion gentile inclusion and if you read the book of acts that's and if you read the book of acts that's and if you read the book of acts that's what got paul killed he was not killed what got paul killed he was not killed what got paul killed he was not killed for preaching jesus for preaching jesus for preaching jesus he was killed for gentile inclusion read he was killed for gentile inclusion read he was killed for gentile inclusion read acts 22 22 acts 22 22 acts 22 22 easy one to remember two two two two easy one to remember two two two two easy one to remember two two two two he's giving his defense before the jews he's giving his defense before the jews he's giving his defense before the jews and he's sharing everything about the and he's sharing everything about the and he's sharing everything about the good news of christ good news of christ good news of christ and what's happened but then in 2221 he and what's happened but then in 2221 he and what's happened but then in 2221 he says says says and god has called me to reach the and god has called me to reach the and god has called me to reach the gentile gentile gentile and that acts 22.2 said up to this point and that acts 22.2 said up to this point and that acts 22.2 said up to this point they listened to him but when he said they listened to him but when he said they listened to him but when he said that they said this fellow that they said this fellow that they said this fellow is is does not should not be on the is is does not should not be on the is is does not should not be on the earth and he must die earth and he must die earth and he must die so this is i guess creating that holy so this is i guess creating that holy so this is i guess creating that holy discontent discontent discontent understand that's biblically mandated understand that's biblically mandated understand that's biblically mandated and then actually take some intentional and then actually take some intentional and then actually take some intentional steps like there's a whole laundry list steps like there's a whole laundry list steps like there's a whole laundry list of what some of those can be of what some of those can be of what some of those can be yeah but taking some intentionality um i yeah but taking some intentionality um i yeah but taking some intentionality um i got into a twitter fight which i should got into a twitter fight which i should got into a twitter fight which i should know better know better know better um and it happened to be a pastor of my um and it happened to be a pastor of my um and it happened to be a pastor of my own tribe i didn't know it was a leader

own tribe i didn't know it was a leader own tribe i didn't know it was a leader that i spoke with at exponential so i that i spoke with at exponential so i that i spoke with at exponential so i felt pretty ashamed of myself felt pretty ashamed of myself felt pretty ashamed of myself but uh he put something out there in but uh he put something out there in but uh he put something out there in this podcast that said this podcast that said this podcast that said hey if your aim is diversity all you'll hey if your aim is diversity all you'll hey if your aim is diversity all you'll get is political correctness get is political correctness get is political correctness but if your aim is jesus you'll get but if your aim is jesus you'll get but if your aim is jesus you'll get diversity diversity diversity so i hit him up and i said hey bro how's so i hit him up and i said hey bro how's so i hit him up and i said hey bro how's that been working out for us for 200 that been working out for us for 200 that been working out for us for 200 years years years so you know 87 churches in america are so you know 87 churches in america are so you know 87 churches in america are by definition segregated along by definition segregated along by definition segregated along ethnic lines so i guess we never made it ethnic lines so i guess we never made it ethnic lines so i guess we never made it about jesus about jesus about jesus so didn't give me a christmas card but i so didn't give me a christmas card but i so didn't give me a christmas card but i think that's ridiculous think that's ridiculous think that's ridiculous we're intentional about worship we're we're intentional about worship we're we're intentional about worship we're intentional about discipleship intentional about discipleship intentional about discipleship we're intentional about offering we're intentional about offering we're intentional about offering excellence and you know paul is excellence and you know paul is excellence and you know paul is intentional in this intentional in this intentional in this so to be intentional about this is so to be intentional about this is so to be intentional about this is is important not just the wealth it was is important not just the wealth it was is important not just the wealth it was if god wanted it to happen it would if god wanted it to happen it would if god wanted it to happen it would happen happen happen why why only when we come to this issue why why only when we come to this issue why why only when we come to this issue do i start hearing things like that do i start hearing things like that do i start hearing things like that you know and i you know it's not like you know and i you know it's not like you know and i you know it's not like well if god wants worship to happen it well if god wants worship to happen it well if god wants worship to happen it just happens just happens just happens so let's hope a worship leader shows up so let's hope a worship leader shows up so let's hope a worship leader shows up or somebody has a prepared message or somebody has a prepared message or somebody has a prepared message we don't do anything like that so taking we don't do anything like that so taking we don't do anything like that so taking taking some intentionality and i can dig taking some intentionality and i can dig taking some intentionality and i can dig down deeper what that is but um down deeper what that is but um down deeper what that is but um but that those would be the opening but that those would be the opening but that those would be the opening statements i'd say statements i'd say statements i'd say yeah i had a a podcast with a yeah i had a a podcast with a yeah i had a a podcast with a african-american leader african-american leader african-american leader uh in a church in kansas city and he uh in a church in kansas city and he uh in a church in kansas city and he he had some really great advice he said he had some really great advice he said he had some really great advice he said if you really want to work on if you really want to work on if you really want to work on on building a diverse church on building a diverse church on building a diverse church he goes you got to go meet people that

he goes you got to go meet people that he goes you got to go meet people that are not like you are not like you are not like you and you got to develop relationships and and you got to develop relationships and and you got to develop relationships and he started by he started by he started by going to another church and this going to another church and this going to another church and this you know this is a white church another you know this is a white church another you know this is a white church another church and his is a black church and church and his is a black church and church and his is a black church and they've they they've they they've they they've swapped pulpits they've they've they've swapped pulpits they've they've they've swapped pulpits they've they've followed you're talking about followed you're talking about followed you're talking about yeah we don't know each other in this yeah we don't know each other in this yeah we don't know each other in this movement but it's absolutely right like movement but it's absolutely right like movement but it's absolutely right like we say we say we say it's hard to lead a model at the church it's hard to lead a model at the church it's hard to lead a model at the church if you don't leave them all ethnic life if you don't leave them all ethnic life if you don't leave them all ethnic life yeah you know if you just want your yeah you know if you just want your yeah you know if you just want your sunday morning to be that way but your sunday morning to be that way but your sunday morning to be that way but your fridays and saturdays never are fridays and saturdays never are fridays and saturdays never are and that's that gets into who are you and that's that gets into who are you and that's that gets into who are you reading reading reading who you who are you who you're mentoring who you who are you who you're mentoring who you who are you who you're mentoring who's mentoring you who's mentoring you who's mentoring you um and and luckily in our society that's um and and luckily in our society that's um and and luckily in our society that's becoming becoming becoming less and less difficult to do although less and less difficult to do although less and less difficult to do although as you said this election year as you said this election year as you said this election year there's a lot of play on racial anxiety there's a lot of play on racial anxiety there's a lot of play on racial anxiety and it's and it's and it's forcing people back into pockets that to forcing people back into pockets that to forcing people back into pockets that to me me me um is satanic we battle not against um is satanic we battle not against um is satanic we battle not against flesh and blood flesh and blood flesh and blood pretty obviously these are acts of the pretty obviously these are acts of the pretty obviously these are acts of the enemy divide and conquer enemy divide and conquer enemy divide and conquer is pretty clear and uh is pretty clear and uh is pretty clear and uh you know but i think matthew 16 jesus you know but i think matthew 16 jesus you know but i think matthew 16 jesus said we're to be said we're to be said we're to be god's wrecking crew against the gates of god's wrecking crew against the gates of god's wrecking crew against the gates of hell so we gotta fight back against that hell so we gotta fight back against that hell so we gotta fight back against that offensively that's what we're that's offensively that's what we're that's offensively that's what we're that's what we're trying to do we don't feel what we're trying to do we don't feel what we're trying to do we don't feel perfect at all but that's what we're perfect at all but that's what we're perfect at all but that's what we're trying to do trying to do trying to do but but you guys it seems like you guys but but you guys it seems like you guys but but you guys it seems like you guys are are you're speaking up about it are are you're speaking up about it are are you're speaking up about it you're actually going there where a lot you're actually going there where a lot you're actually going there where a lot of pastors when they're in the pulpit of pastors when they're in the pulpit of pastors when they're in the pulpit they just try to avoid that they just try to avoid that they just try to avoid that and i hope it does hope it goes away or and i hope it does hope it goes away or and i hope it does hope it goes away or hope it doesn't become an issue hope it doesn't become an issue hope it doesn't become an issue yeah we own it you know we really do um

yeah we own it you know we really do um yeah we own it you know we really do um and right now in fact right through the and right now in fact right through the and right now in fact right through the election we've been in a teaching series election we've been in a teaching series election we've been in a teaching series i've told our folk we're not going to i've told our folk we're not going to i've told our folk we're not going to let this go let this go let this go until after the election we got until after the election we got until after the election we got something planned for the hall event something planned for the hall event something planned for the hall event but it's all on reconciliation the whole but it's all on reconciliation the whole but it's all on reconciliation the whole theme of reconciliation theme of reconciliation theme of reconciliation you know god was in christ reconciling you know god was in christ reconciling you know god was in christ reconciling the world the world the world unto himself and what paul said god has unto himself and what paul said god has unto himself and what paul said god has given us given us given us this ministry of reconciliation now this ministry of reconciliation now this ministry of reconciliation now there's a really there's a really there's a really sappy reconciliation that's preached out sappy reconciliation that's preached out sappy reconciliation that's preached out there in the church there in the church there in the church and i don't like it and it was like well and i don't like it and it was like well and i don't like it and it was like well let's just go stand in a big arena hold let's just go stand in a big arena hold let's just go stand in a big arena hold hands and send somebody off hands and send somebody off hands and send somebody off that's not the work of reconciliation that's not the work of reconciliation that's not the work of reconciliation reconciliation is hard reconciliation is hard reconciliation is hard hard difficult work and we've been hard difficult work and we've been hard difficult work and we've been talking about that talking about that talking about that um leading up to this and saying this is um leading up to this and saying this is um leading up to this and saying this is what we're called to what we're called to what we're called to i was just praying today jason and talk i was just praying today jason and talk i was just praying today jason and talk about the election i knew i would have about the election i knew i would have about the election i knew i would have the privilege to talk to you the privilege to talk to you the privilege to talk to you and i was i was stuck in first john 3 1 and i was i was stuck in first john 3 1 and i was i was stuck in first john 3 1 you know where it says you know where it says you know where it says this love that the father is lavish this love that the father is lavish this love that the father is lavish thomas thomas thomas i started digging back because i'm i'm i started digging back because i'm i'm i started digging back because i'm i'm old enough to remember the king james old enough to remember the king james old enough to remember the king james right like that was my devotional bible right like that was my devotional bible right like that was my devotional bible and the king james said what manner of and the king james said what manner of and the king james said what manner of love is love is love is right that god has lathered on when i right that god has lathered on when i right that god has lathered on when i dug into the greek dug into the greek dug into the greek text i just did this today something i text i just did this today something i text i just did this today something i had never realized had never realized had never realized actually what john was quoting was a actually what john was quoting was a actually what john was quoting was a very well-known idiom in that dna very well-known idiom in that dna very well-known idiom in that dna and the literal translation says what and the literal translation says what and the literal translation says what country country country is love like this come from like that is love like this come from like that is love like this come from like that wasn't it and i thought my gosh wasn't it and i thought my gosh wasn't it and i thought my gosh in the midst of an election like there

in the midst of an election like there in the midst of an election like there is a love that comes out is a love that comes out is a love that comes out that it is not a political party it is that it is not a political party it is that it is not a political party it is not not not a conservative liberal but if it a conservative liberal but if it a conservative liberal but if it shatters shatters shatters the borders the parties the boundaries the borders the parties the boundaries the borders the parties the boundaries of this world as we know of this world as we know of this world as we know and if we can dig our nose back in that and if we can dig our nose back in that and if we can dig our nose back in that what kind what country what kind what country what kind what country did a love like this come from and does did a love like this come from and does did a love like this come from and does that that that compel me right that paul says in second compel me right that paul says in second compel me right that paul says in second corinthians you only talked about the corinthians you only talked about the corinthians you only talked about the ministry of ministry of ministry of reconciliation he said this love of reconciliation he said this love of reconciliation he said this love of christ compels me christ compels me christ compels me you know it compels me um my wife and i you know it compels me um my wife and i you know it compels me um my wife and i just were talking yesterday and having just were talking yesterday and having just were talking yesterday and having our own personal event our own personal event our own personal event and you know it's an african-american and you know it's an african-american and you know it's an african-american woman there's not some really really woman there's not some really really woman there's not some really really painful painful painful things for her we almost lost our middle things for her we almost lost our middle things for her we almost lost our middle son to a profiling incident son to a profiling incident son to a profiling incident in 2010 with two of his african-american in 2010 with two of his african-american in 2010 with two of his african-american college teammates so this stuff gets so college teammates so this stuff gets so college teammates so this stuff gets so close to home close to home close to home and we were talking there were things and we were talking there were things and we were talking there were things that got her angry got me angry that got her angry got me angry that got her angry got me angry but then we held hands and said this but then we held hands and said this but then we held hands and said this jesus thing man we gotta stay in this jesus thing man we gotta stay in this jesus thing man we gotta stay in this work of reconciliation right like we work of reconciliation right like we work of reconciliation right like we can't leave it can't leave it can't leave it and that's that love that other country and that's that love that other country and that's that love that other country love love love that he's lavished on the man that that he's lavished on the man that that he's lavished on the man that compels us into this work compels us into this work compels us into this work and it's it's a good thing it does and it's it's a good thing it does and it's it's a good thing it does because otherwise we'd all quit because otherwise we'd all quit because otherwise we'd all quit and give up because it's hard yeah this and give up because it's hard yeah this and give up because it's hard yeah this is not this is not in the handbook they is not this is not in the handbook they is not this is not in the handbook they give you how to plant a new church give you how to plant a new church give you how to plant a new church it's not one of the 69 steps trust me oh my yeah it uh yeah oh my yeah it uh yeah that's it's got to be it's it's one of that's it's got to be it's it's one of that's it's got to be it's it's one of those battles it's just

those battles it's just those battles it's just it's going to be ongoing for a long it's going to be ongoing for a long it's going to be ongoing for a long long time and it has been you know it long time and it has been you know it long time and it has been you know it has been has been has been it's not new this is you know it has it's not new this is you know it has it's not new this is you know it has been this this happened to be been this this happened to be been this this happened to be you know jim wallace talks about this as you know jim wallace talks about this as you know jim wallace talks about this as america's original sin i don't think america's original sin i don't think america's original sin i don't think he's wrong he's wrong he's wrong um dr king said racism is as indigenous um dr king said racism is as indigenous um dr king said racism is as indigenous to america's pine trees to america's pine trees to america's pine trees so but that was you and gentile if you so but that was you and gentile if you so but that was you and gentile if you read the you know gentiles become so read the you know gentiles become so read the you know gentiles become so tame to us but when paul says that jesus tame to us but when paul says that jesus tame to us but when paul says that jesus has torn down the wall of hostility has torn down the wall of hostility has torn down the wall of hostility between us between us between us that word hostility was active hatred it that word hostility was active hatred it that word hostility was active hatred it was historical enmity was historical enmity was historical enmity and of course uh you know dating back to and of course uh you know dating back to and of course uh you know dating back to cain and abel our needs to tribalize and cain and abel our needs to tribalize and cain and abel our needs to tribalize and you know from our own um sinfulness uh you know from our own um sinfulness uh you know from our own um sinfulness uh satan has exploited that through the satan has exploited that through the satan has exploited that through the years years years but but this is to me so i got something but but this is to me so i got something but but this is to me so i got something i'm actually putting in a book i i'm actually putting in a book i i'm actually putting in a book i shouldn't put out there somebody will shouldn't put out there somebody will shouldn't put out there somebody will steal it from me steal it from me steal it from me but you know we always talk about the but you know we always talk about the but you know we always talk about the adam and eve story and you know the adam and eve story and you know the adam and eve story and you know the foundational story foundational story foundational story of um you know original sin which i of um you know original sin which i of um you know original sin which i guess guess guess and cain and abel illustrated there and and cain and abel illustrated there and and cain and abel illustrated there and christ on the cross christ on the cross christ on the cross um redeeming us from that right that um redeeming us from that right that um redeeming us from that right that that's brokenness from god get it that's that's brokenness from god get it that's that's brokenness from god get it that's the foundational atonement anthem a man the foundational atonement anthem a man the foundational atonement anthem a man sold sold sold i gave my life to christ um i think i gave my life to christ um i think i gave my life to christ um i think there was a second there was a second there was a second fall and it was a corporate fall and it fall and it was a corporate fall and it fall and it was a corporate fall and it happened at the tower of battle happened at the tower of battle happened at the tower of battle that led us now now it's not me that led us now now it's not me that led us now now it's not me you know adam blaine he blamed the

you know adam blaine he blamed the you know adam blaine he blamed the serpent serpent serpent i heard desmond two foot two who said i heard desmond two foot two who said i heard desmond two foot two who said the serpents had nobody else to blame the serpents had nobody else to blame the serpents had nobody else to blame like we're always like we're always like we're always blame shifting but at the corporate fall blame shifting but at the corporate fall blame shifting but at the corporate fall let us build for ourselves let us make a let us build for ourselves let us make a let us build for ourselves let us make a name for ourselves name for ourselves name for ourselves and and god broke that right like broke and and god broke that right like broke and and god broke that right like broke that idea apart that idea apart that idea apart but i never thought about that just as but i never thought about that just as but i never thought about that just as the cross was the solution to the the cross was the solution to the the cross was the solution to the individual sound individual sound individual sound the church was supposed to be the the church was supposed to be the the church was supposed to be the solution to the corporate senate solution to the corporate senate solution to the corporate senate and and pentecost itself was and and pentecost itself was and and pentecost itself was a healing event from the tower of battle a healing event from the tower of battle a healing event from the tower of battle now everybody spoke in their own now everybody spoke in their own now everybody spoke in their own language language language but all heard the message of the but all heard the message of the but all heard the message of the goodness of christ goodness of christ goodness of christ so i really i think we've undersold the so i really i think we've undersold the so i really i think we've undersold the church in some ways i mean church in some ways i mean church in some ways i mean we're a mess we know that it's what we're a mess we know that it's what we're a mess we know that it's what proves god how could you run an proves god how could you run an proves god how could you run an organization like this for 2 000 years organization like this for 2 000 years organization like this for 2 000 years and still be here and still be here and still be here but but i think that jesus's idea for but but i think that jesus's idea for but but i think that jesus's idea for this thing he called his bride his this thing he called his bride his this thing he called his bride his church church church was to deal with this very issue the was to deal with this very issue the was to deal with this very issue the brokenness brokenness brokenness the fragmentation and brokenness of what the fragmentation and brokenness of what the fragmentation and brokenness of what is ultimately restored in revelation 7 is ultimately restored in revelation 7 is ultimately restored in revelation 7 9.

9. 9. so it's like paul said i feel like i'm so it's like paul said i feel like i'm so it's like paul said i feel like i'm stuck with it like stuck with it like stuck with it like you know he's lavished his love of this you know he's lavished his love of this you know he's lavished his love of this other country love on me other country love on me other country love on me he's reconciled me to the cross and you he's reconciled me to the cross and you he's reconciled me to the cross and you know i have to be in this work of know i have to be in this work of know i have to be in this work of reconciliation reconciliation reconciliation with my brothers and sisters you know with my brothers and sisters you know with my brothers and sisters you know because love compels me well there's another yeah thanks for well there's another yeah thanks for sharing that there's another uh sharing that there's another uh sharing that there's another uh area you guys are uh you you're unique area you guys are uh you you're unique area you guys are uh you you're unique and that is you guys have i hear you and that is you guys have i hear you and that is you guys have i hear you have a traditional have a traditional have a traditional and a modern worship service right yeah and a modern worship service right yeah and a modern worship service right yeah oh how did that happen oh how did that happen oh how did that happen i mean how wow well you know we are in i mean how wow well you know we are in i mean how wow well you know we are in the mainline church a lot of people call the mainline church a lot of people call the mainline church a lot of people call us an anomaly but we're we're us an anomaly but we're we're us an anomaly but we're we're part of the united methodist church i part of the united methodist church i part of the united methodist church i love the method of heritage i love um love the method of heritage i love um love the method of heritage i love um the missional aspect that the method is the missional aspect that the method is the missional aspect that the method is moving out i love that the memphis moving out i love that the memphis moving out i love that the memphis movement was multi-ethnic at its movement was multi-ethnic at its movement was multi-ethnic at its inception in america now sin broke that inception in america now sin broke that inception in america now sin broke that um but it was there's a lot of other um but it was there's a lot of other um but it was there's a lot of other junk that comes junk that comes junk that comes with denominational life that none of us with denominational life that none of us with denominational life that none of us love they turn into clubs love they turn into clubs love they turn into clubs instead of movement but in the in the instead of movement but in the in the instead of movement but in the in the mainline church mainline church mainline church there's usually a traditional service if there's usually a traditional service if there's usually a traditional service if you will you will you will but again that's a culturally loaded but again that's a culturally loaded but again that's a culturally loaded term because traditional term because traditional term because traditional worship is white eurocentric worship worship is white eurocentric worship worship is white eurocentric worship right but there's that and we have that right but there's that and we have that right but there's that and we have that and then we have our mosaic services and then we have our mosaic services and then we have our mosaic services which are which are which are more modern um but the beauty is the more modern um but the beauty is the more modern um but the beauty is the same message the same same message the same same message the same um teaching it's what it uh what did um teaching it's what it uh what did um teaching it's what it uh what did andy stanley say the message never

andy stanley say the message never andy stanley say the message never changes but the methods always do changes but the methods always do changes but the methods always do so you know we honor folks worship in so you know we honor folks worship in so you know we honor folks worship in different ways folks learn in different different ways folks learn in different different ways folks learn in different ways ways ways folks experience god in different ways folks experience god in different ways folks experience god in different ways um and we honor that in our space um and we honor that in our space um and we honor that in our space that it's not just we want your color that it's not just we want your color that it's not just we want your color not your culture not your culture not your culture right it's like you know if we have right it's like you know if we have right it's like you know if we have folks who are charismatic with folks who are charismatic with folks who are charismatic with folks who are more uh cerebral um folks who are more uh cerebral um folks who are more uh cerebral um you get me going on my preaching our you get me going on my preaching our you get me going on my preaching our foundational sermon for foundational sermon for foundational sermon for for garfield is act 16 where you know for garfield is act 16 where you know for garfield is act 16 where you know luke gives us these case studies olivia luke gives us these case studies olivia luke gives us these case studies olivia the little slave girl the roman the little slave girl the roman the little slave girl the roman jailer those were the first three jailer those were the first three jailer those were the first three conversions and we knew there were more conversions and we knew there were more conversions and we knew there were more so why does luke tell us those three so why does luke tell us those three so why does luke tell us those three they're so different they're so different they're so different they're ethnically different they're they're ethnically different they're they're ethnically different they're sociologically different their learner sociologically different their learner sociologically different their learner style different style different style different right the lydia went to a little small right the lydia went to a little small right the lydia went to a little small group they sat down group they sat down group they sat down and she's thinking right she's having and she's thinking right she's having and she's thinking right she's having tea little slave girl man she's got a tea little slave girl man she's got a tea little slave girl man she's got a pentecostal revival she needs a power pentecostal revival she needs a power pentecostal revival she needs a power encounter on her heart encounter on her heart encounter on her heart and a roman jailer man he's drinking and a roman jailer man he's drinking and a roman jailer man he's drinking beer at the vfw he doesn't care what you beer at the vfw he doesn't care what you beer at the vfw he doesn't care what you and i talk about but and i talk about but and i talk about but somehow the gospel broke through in each somehow the gospel broke through in each somehow the gospel broke through in each and and and so we try to be that community where so we try to be that community where so we try to be that community where lydia the little slave girl the roman lydia the little slave girl the roman lydia the little slave girl the roman jail all of them can come in jail all of them can come in jail all of them can come in they can connect with god in their own they can connect with god in their own they can connect with god in their own unique way unique way unique way but journey to the same water of but journey to the same water of but journey to the same water of reconciliation can you imagine being in reconciliation can you imagine being in reconciliation can you imagine being in olivia's house and those three were olivia's house and those three were olivia's house and those three were sitting around the table sitting around the table sitting around the table i mean like where did those that's why i i mean like where did those that's why i i mean like where did those that's why i preached where do those people ever get preached where do those people ever get preached where do those people ever get together in the world together in the world together in the world right and you know here's lydia she's a

right and you know here's lydia she's a right and you know here's lydia she's a fashion ceo fashion ceo fashion ceo she's eating that ruth chris every night she's eating that ruth chris every night she's eating that ruth chris every night you know she's wealthy here's a little you know she's wealthy here's a little you know she's wealthy here's a little slave girl she's slave girl she's slave girl she's sex trafficked under east knight bridge sex trafficked under east knight bridge sex trafficked under east knight bridge in cleveland open her pant brings her in cleveland open her pant brings her in cleveland open her pant brings her cheeseburger cheeseburger cheeseburger and here's this xgi guy over with his and here's this xgi guy over with his and here's this xgi guy over with his buds like i said the vfw buds like i said the vfw buds like i said the vfw where in the world does three people get where in the world does three people get where in the world does three people get together in the real together in the real together in the real world never than the church world never than the church world never than the church christ reconciling movement there's a christ reconciling movement there's a christ reconciling movement there's a table for table for table for each of them and i'm going to tell you each of them and i'm going to tell you each of them and i'm going to tell you when you actually think that that table when you actually think that that table when you actually think that that table is hard work but boy is it rich is hard work but boy is it rich is hard work but boy is it rich so so that's i don't know if i answered so so that's i don't know if i answered so so that's i don't know if i answered that but that's something that's so i that but that's something that's so i that but that's something that's so i think that's think that's think that's even the uniqueness of our worship even the uniqueness of our worship even the uniqueness of our worship offering i laugh when i'm out preaching offering i laugh when i'm out preaching offering i laugh when i'm out preaching an exponential or the an exponential or the an exponential or the mosaics be around the table and they're mosaics be around the table and they're mosaics be around the table and they're like i'm the only dude that has one of like i'm the only dude that has one of like i'm the only dude that has one of those words of experiences but those words of experiences but those words of experiences but i think it's part of our diversity i i think it's part of our diversity i i think it's part of our diversity i think it's a beautiful thing think it's a beautiful thing think it's a beautiful thing well it sounds like i mean you you know well it sounds like i mean you you know well it sounds like i mean you you know because you you have different because you you have different because you you have different styles of worship but yet you've still styles of worship but yet you've still styles of worship but yet you've still been able to gather one church been able to gather one church been able to gather one church yes right one body uh that yes right one body uh that yes right one body uh that looks completely different than most looks completely different than most looks completely different than most churches out there churches out there churches out there and um you're you're you're doing that and um you're you're you're doing that and um you're you're you're doing that and you're serving and you're growing and you're serving and you're growing and you're serving and you're growing and you're discipling and you're discipling and you're discipling um in different spaces and that's uh um in different spaces and that's uh um in different spaces and that's uh yeah yeah yeah that's hard to do isn't it it's very that's hard to do isn't it it's very that's hard to do isn't it it's very hard to do but hard to do but hard to do but it it it's hard to do but sacred and it it it's hard to do but sacred and it it it's hard to do but sacred and here's another thing i say to pastor you here's another thing i say to pastor you here's another thing i say to pastor you know when my wife and i got together know when my wife and i got together know when my wife and i got together as i said 10 of america was in favor of as i said 10 of america was in favor of as i said 10 of america was in favor of interracial marriage

interracial marriage interracial marriage we had so many people in our ears we had so many people in our ears we had so many people in our ears telling us why it wouldn't work telling us why it wouldn't work telling us why it wouldn't work what did they know you know here we are what did they know you know here we are what did they know you know here we are 32 years later i have my best friend my 32 years later i have my best friend my 32 years later i have my best friend my ministry partner ministry partner ministry partner um god ordained this couple to just um god ordained this couple to just um god ordained this couple to just be who we were i'd say the same thing be who we were i'd say the same thing be who we were i'd say the same thing about this hard church work about this hard church work about this hard church work what do they know when they say it can't what do they know when they say it can't what do they know when they say it can't be done be done be done so so work at it here's my here's last so so work at it here's my here's last so so work at it here's my here's last sermon i promise you get me fired up on sermon i promise you get me fired up on sermon i promise you get me fired up on this station this station this station but john 17 it's jesus said you know he but john 17 it's jesus said you know he but john 17 it's jesus said you know he prayed for us prayed for us prayed for us you know those who are yet to come you know those who are yet to come you know those who are yet to come because of this witness so because of this witness so because of this witness so you know when preachers say on the last you know when preachers say on the last you know when preachers say on the last night of jesus's life he had you on his night of jesus's life he had you on his night of jesus's life he had you on his mind that's real mind that's real mind that's real like he prayed okay pray for himself he like he prayed okay pray for himself he like he prayed okay pray for himself he prayed for his disciples they prayed for prayed for his disciples they prayed for prayed for his disciples they prayed for us us us and he said one prayer you know this and he said one prayer you know this and he said one prayer you know this they might be completely one they might be completely one they might be completely one and then he said this so that the world and then he said this so that the world and then he said this so that the world will know that you sent me will know that you sent me will know that you sent me like i can't i can't guarantee they'll like i can't i can't guarantee they'll like i can't i can't guarantee they'll do it it's a hana clause do it it's a hana clause do it it's a hana clause but if they do it the world will know but if they do it the world will know but if they do it the world will know and that's why i tell garfield boys i and that's why i tell garfield boys i and that's why i tell garfield boys i said folks you got to be a so that said folks you got to be a so that said folks you got to be a so that church church church yeah you got to be you know that you yeah you got to be you know that you yeah you got to be you know that you know people do know people do know people do they were known in cleveland i mean you they were known in cleveland i mean you they were known in cleveland i mean you know when when uh tamira rice was shot i know when when uh tamira rice was shot i know when when uh tamira rice was shot i was one of the first pastors at the was one of the first pastors at the was one of the first pastors at the city leaders called and i was like i city leaders called and i was like i city leaders called and i was like i don't even know somebody like yeah but don't even know somebody like yeah but don't even know somebody like yeah but when we speak to you we speak to when we speak to you we speak to when we speak to you we speak to everybody everybody everybody right like we know there's all the right like we know there's all the right like we know there's all the pieces of a fire there pieces of a fire there pieces of a fire there and and i think when that rumor gets out and and i think when that rumor gets out and and i think when that rumor gets out even people go like i don't know if i

even people go like i don't know if i even people go like i don't know if i know what they believe know what they believe know what they believe but wow there's something different but wow there's something different but wow there's something different and what manner of love is this right and what manner of love is this right and what manner of love is this right i'm back to that verse i'm back to that verse i'm back to that verse what country or love is this thing from what country or love is this thing from what country or love is this thing from that conservatives liberals republicans that conservatives liberals republicans that conservatives liberals republicans democrats black white democrats black white democrats black white people of different orientations people people of different orientations people people of different orientations people trying to figure out how can they be trying to figure out how can they be trying to figure out how can they be in this place there's got to be in this place there's got to be in this place there's got to be something something something beyond you know this world i mean that beyond you know this world i mean that beyond you know this world i mean that that's me preaching it but we sense that that's me preaching it but we sense that that's me preaching it but we sense that we get people come to our church and we get people come to our church and we get people come to our church and said they never become dead in church you know wow it's fun to give up it's you know wow it's fun to give up it's fun to get up on sunday and i sit there fun to get up on sunday and i sit there fun to get up on sunday and i sit there and say look i know and say look i know and say look i know again this is free pandemic but even again this is free pandemic but even again this is free pandemic but even still now online but when we were all in still now online but when we were all in still now online but when we were all in physical space or something in addition physical space or something in addition physical space or something in addition online i say things like hey i know some online i say things like hey i know some online i say things like hey i know some of you are here because you're lost to of you are here because you're lost to of you are here because you're lost to bed bed bed or because you're trying to get that or because you're trying to get that or because you're trying to get that second date but that's okay second date but that's okay second date but that's okay you know and i had a brother come up to you know and i had a brother come up to you know and i had a brother come up to me white brother all cut me white brother all cut me white brother all cut built he's like i don't don't like built he's like i don't don't like built he's like i don't don't like church don't like christians didn't like church don't like christians didn't like church don't like christians didn't like pastors don't like you pastors don't like you pastors don't like you but i'm trying to get that second date but i'm trying to get that second date but i'm trying to get that second date and then i'm looking like who you dating and then i'm looking like who you dating and then i'm looking like who you dating me like her i said well you better get me like her i said well you better get me like her i said well you better get to know jesus bro to know jesus bro to know jesus bro you know so but again i you know so but again i you know so but again i that folk feel like that folk feel like that folk feel like because there's that kind of diversity because there's that kind of diversity because there's that kind of diversity and there's all diversity but i don't and there's all diversity but i don't and there's all diversity but i don't know if you're a conservative liberal know if you're a conservative liberal know if you're a conservative liberal but i know if you're maybe but i know if you're maybe but i know if you're maybe you know puerto rican or chinese or you know puerto rican or chinese or you know puerto rican or chinese or anglo anglo anglo and like if they see that and they go and like if they see that and they go and like if they see that and they go wow maybe there's a space for me wow maybe there's a space for me wow maybe there's a space for me and it just like they they feel like

and it just like they they feel like and it just like they they feel like there's an opportunity to get into a there's an opportunity to get into a there's an opportunity to get into a place like that place like that place like that where it won't be so conspicuous you where it won't be so conspicuous you where it won't be so conspicuous you know know know um i just remember the interracial um i just remember the interracial um i just remember the interracial couple my wife and i was i was away from couple my wife and i was i was away from couple my wife and i was i was away from the lord i was running my own business the lord i was running my own business the lord i was running my own business my wife was my wife was my wife was the one who brought me back to christ the one who brought me back to christ the one who brought me back to christ and we knew we had to get into a church and we knew we had to get into a church and we knew we had to get into a church but where were we going to go as an but where were we going to go as an but where were we going to go as an interracial couple in like mid interracial couple in like mid interracial couple in like mid in 1985 right like where we're going to in 1985 right like where we're going to in 1985 right like where we're going to go so go so go so i'm from she was from canton i was from i'm from she was from canton i was from i'm from she was from canton i was from youngstown and we started visiting youngstown and we started visiting youngstown and we started visiting churches and churches and churches and you know we go to a white church they you know we go to a white church they you know we go to a white church they talk about us we go to a black church talk about us we go to a black church talk about us we go to a black church they talk about they talk about they talk about i told my wife i said why don't we go to i told my wife i said why don't we go to i told my wife i said why don't we go to korean church korean church korean church and she said to me she said chip that's and she said to me she said chip that's and she said to me she said chip that's a korean speaking church a korean speaking church a korean speaking church i said yeah honey but when we go there i said yeah honey but when we go there i said yeah honey but when we go there and they talk about us we won't know and they talk about us we won't know and they talk about us we won't know what they're saying what they're saying what they're saying and it's so funny it's like we were in and it's so funny it's like we were in and it's so funny it's like we were in that position that position that position of being the outsiders and finding of being the outsiders and finding of being the outsiders and finding we had a tough time getting into church we had a tough time getting into church we had a tough time getting into church because they were their own folks and because they were their own folks and because they were their own folks and they were they were they were on clubs and i really i guess it's in on clubs and i really i guess it's in on clubs and i really i guess it's in both of our hearts and we want to make both of our hearts and we want to make both of our hearts and we want to make sure we're not stumbling anybody that sure we're not stumbling anybody that sure we're not stumbling anybody that they can wander into garfield they can wander into garfield they can wander into garfield and uh i got a i got an email from and uh i got a i got an email from and uh i got a i got an email from somebody worshipping with us online somebody worshipping with us online somebody worshipping with us online and said they were hindu family and and said they were hindu family and and said they were hindu family and they're like you know we really they're like you know we really they're like you know we really love what you're doing and we love the love what you're doing and we love the love what you're doing and we love the things that we're doing to engage the things that we're doing to engage the things that we're doing to engage the community are like community are like community are like can we be involved you know and i told can we be involved you know and i told can we be involved you know and i told them hey you know we're unashamedly of them hey you know we're unashamedly of them hey you know we're unashamedly of christian church i hope you're listening christian church i hope you're listening christian church i hope you're listening to this gospel of jesus to this gospel of jesus to this gospel of jesus i want you to do no we built this church i want you to do no we built this church i want you to do no we built this church for you you for you you for you you can you can belong before you believe

can you can belong before you believe can you can belong before you believe you can come on in you can come on in you can come on in i just want folks to feel it's a safe i just want folks to feel it's a safe i just want folks to feel it's a safe place to church yeah place to church yeah place to church yeah i feel at home right yeah yeah and and i feel at home right yeah yeah and and i feel at home right yeah yeah and and feel safe i mean feel safe i mean feel safe i mean i always laugh in some ways the i always laugh in some ways the i always laugh in some ways the pharisees that pharisees that pharisees that you know there was so much wrong with you know there was so much wrong with you know there was so much wrong with that story as you know when they ripped that story as you know when they ripped that story as you know when they ripped the woman caught me at active adultery the woman caught me at active adultery the woman caught me at active adultery of course where's the man and of course where's the man and of course where's the man and was it a setup and blah blah blah but was it a setup and blah blah blah but was it a setup and blah blah blah but these pharisees dragged that poor woman these pharisees dragged that poor woman these pharisees dragged that poor woman in the moment of humiliation through her in the moment of humiliation through her in the moment of humiliation through her at the feet of jesus at the feet of jesus at the feet of jesus which was the safest place she could which was the safest place she could which was the safest place she could ever see ever see ever see yeah yeah and they didn't know it and yeah yeah and they didn't know it and yeah yeah and they didn't know it and that's kind of to me is that's kind of to me is that's kind of to me is what if the church were that just the what if the church were that just the what if the church were that just the feet of jesus where folks could come in feet of jesus where folks could come in feet of jesus where folks could come in and it's literally the safest place they and it's literally the safest place they and it's literally the safest place they could ever be could ever be could ever be yeah that's that's that's what we try to yeah that's that's that's what we try to yeah that's that's that's what we try to do well and that's why do well and that's why do well and that's why that's what we would hope every local that's what we would hope every local that's what we would hope every local church church church is like truly and not be judgmental the is like truly and not be judgmental the is like truly and not be judgmental the problem is people in the church are the problem is people in the church are the problem is people in the church are the ones that ones that ones that give that weird look or say something give that weird look or say something give that weird look or say something and it's like come on and it's like come on and it's like come on yeah so because they're kidding yeah so because they're kidding yeah so because they're kidding go ahead let's see what does it look go ahead let's see what does it look go ahead let's see what does it look like for you for for your church you like for you for for your church you like for you for for your church you know know know as you look to you know pass this as you look to you know pass this as you look to you know pass this election so get past november we're election so get past november we're election so get past november we're still in this pandemic and you think still in this pandemic and you think still in this pandemic and you think about about about 2020 has been quite the year and you 2020 has been quite the year and you 2020 has been quite the year and you look at 2021 look at 2021 look at 2021 where are you what are you praying for where are you what are you praying for where are you what are you praying for where are you hoping you go what does where are you hoping you go what does where are you hoping you go what does that look like that look like that look like yeah man i tell you i was just in a yeah man i tell you i was just in a yeah man i tell you i was just in a explaining i was in a explaining i was in a explaining i was in a interview with somebody from our interview with somebody from our interview with somebody from our denomination earlier today

denomination earlier today denomination earlier today and i anybody that answers that question and i anybody that answers that question and i anybody that answers that question like they know don't trust them like they know don't trust them like they know don't trust them yeah because i really i really feel like yeah because i really i really feel like yeah because i really i really feel like and this and this and this this is this excites me and it scares me this is this excites me and it scares me this is this excites me and it scares me to my core this is lewis and clark time to my core this is lewis and clark time to my core this is lewis and clark time and there's no maps we're making the and there's no maps we're making the and there's no maps we're making the math math math and um i feel like it bugs me because i and um i feel like it bugs me because i and um i feel like it bugs me because i feel like with 30 years feel like with 30 years feel like with 30 years experience i feel like wow you know like experience i feel like wow you know like experience i feel like wow you know like with mosaic with mosaic with mosaic we talked about our friend martha moz we talked about our friend martha moz we talked about our friend martha moz and i was like we gained all this and i was like we gained all this and i was like we gained all this knowledge knowledge knowledge and like none of that's gonna help me a and like none of that's gonna help me a and like none of that's gonna help me a bit in the next decade like i gotta bit in the next decade like i gotta bit in the next decade like i gotta relearn everything relearn everything relearn everything yeah and i think to be in that spirit of yeah and i think to be in that spirit of yeah and i think to be in that spirit of um um um of really discovery but knowing that god of really discovery but knowing that god of really discovery but knowing that god is is is ahead of us and we're just joining with ahead of us and we're just joining with ahead of us and we're just joining with him in this kind of new reality him in this kind of new reality him in this kind of new reality because the churches are gonna fail or because the churches are gonna fail or because the churches are gonna fail or the people who think well this is gonna the people who think well this is gonna the people who think well this is gonna be over at some point and everything's be over at some point and everything's be over at some point and everything's back to normal back to normal back to normal i i that's that's a prescription for i i that's that's a prescription for i i that's that's a prescription for failure yeah failure yeah failure yeah now yeah some things will be normal and now yeah some things will be normal and now yeah some things will be normal and they'll be live where there'll be other they'll be live where there'll be other they'll be live where there'll be other things things things but it's it's never going to be the same but it's it's never going to be the same but it's it's never going to be the same these are transitional moments these are transitional moments these are transitional moments and so if we can if we can live in that and so if we can if we can live in that and so if we can if we can live in that is great is great is great and and again garfield has felt we have and and again garfield has felt we have and and again garfield has felt we have a we have a vision point pointing this a we have a vision point pointing this a we have a vision point pointing this was planned way before was planned way before was planned way before the pandemic and they're looking out the pandemic and they're looking out the pandemic and they're looking out beyond me beyond me beyond me you know i mean the next 10 years is you know i mean the next 10 years is you know i mean the next 10 years is probably going to be the transition of probably going to be the transition of probably going to be the transition of senior leadership in garfield and they senior leadership in garfield and they senior leadership in garfield and they have felt and that's why we're preaching have felt and that's why we're preaching have felt and that's why we're preaching this they have felt that for whatever this they have felt that for whatever this they have felt that for whatever reason reason reason this ministry of reconciliation is what

this ministry of reconciliation is what this ministry of reconciliation is what god wants us to have god wants us to have god wants us to have so i have been trying to up the end even so i have been trying to up the end even so i have been trying to up the end even more more more with our membership you know you know with our membership you know you know with our membership you know you know from fam to followers that wasn't my from fam to followers that wasn't my from fam to followers that wasn't my words words words um the brother that wrote that book um the brother that wrote that book um the brother that wrote that book but you know that we got to go deeper so but you know that we got to go deeper so but you know that we got to go deeper so i've told them if if we have a gideon i've told them if if we have a gideon i've told them if if we have a gideon revival that we went from 200 revival that we went from 200 revival that we went from 200 to you know 1300 and god takes us back to you know 1300 and god takes us back to you know 1300 and god takes us back to 200 to 200 to 200 i'm like okay with that right now but i i'm like okay with that right now but i i'm like okay with that right now but i want to be the 200 want to be the 200 want to be the 200 with their hair on fire yeah about this with their hair on fire yeah about this with their hair on fire yeah about this kind of mission kind of mission kind of mission in this brave new world um and so in this brave new world um and so in this brave new world um and so yeah it's a real adventure for me yeah it's a real adventure for me yeah it's a real adventure for me right now but with this this ministry of right now but with this this ministry of right now but with this this ministry of reconciliation second corinthians 5 reconciliation second corinthians 5 reconciliation second corinthians 5 um we're going to stay in that lane and um we're going to stay in that lane and um we're going to stay in that lane and we're we're just going to try to be we're we're just going to try to be we're we're just going to try to be that kind of light and challenge and that kind of light and challenge and that kind of light and challenge and love love love in action you know scattered in action you know scattered in action you know scattered right i've told our staff in our church right i've told our staff in our church right i've told our staff in our church i used to preach acts 2. i used to preach acts 2. i used to preach acts 2. i used to love acts 2. i used to go to i used to love acts 2. i used to go to i used to love acts 2. i used to go to active conferences active conferences active conferences i don't i can't stand acts 2 anymore i i don't i can't stand acts 2 anymore i i don't i can't stand acts 2 anymore i used to love it i wanted to be those used to love it i wanted to be those used to love it i wanted to be those folk and then folk and then folk and then one day that god hit me upside the head one day that god hit me upside the head one day that god hit me upside the head and like jesus told them folks to go and like jesus told them folks to go and like jesus told them folks to go and they saved and yeah they were doing and they saved and yeah they were doing and they saved and yeah they were doing these wonderful things these wonderful things these wonderful things but they were doing it for each other but they were doing it for each other but they were doing it for each other and it wasn't until acts eight and it wasn't until acts eight and it wasn't until acts eight when the persecutions came and they were when the persecutions came and they were when the persecutions came and they were scattered scattered scattered that they went from being ministry that they went from being ministry that they went from being ministry consumers to ministry providers consumers to ministry providers consumers to ministry providers so garfield church north point church

so garfield church north point church so garfield church north point church willow creek church saddleback name them willow creek church saddleback name them willow creek church saddleback name them all we've been all we've been all we've been scattered which may put us right where scattered which may put us right where scattered which may put us right where god wanted us in the first place god wanted us in the first place god wanted us in the first place that not just coming to a place to be that not just coming to a place to be that not just coming to a place to be ministry consumers ministry consumers ministry consumers but as i say acts 8 ministry providers but as i say acts 8 ministry providers but as i say acts 8 ministry providers proclaiming the word wherever we go proclaiming the word wherever we go proclaiming the word wherever we go so we're emphasizing church at home so we're emphasizing church at home so we're emphasizing church at home right now i've been telling our members right now i've been telling our members right now i've been telling our members like we're home depot right now you can like we're home depot right now you can like we're home depot right now you can do it we can help do it we can help do it we can help you know used to come for us to do it no you know used to come for us to do it no you know used to come for us to do it no now you do it now you do it now you do it you disciple your kids you witness on you disciple your kids you witness on you disciple your kids you witness on your your your job uh you uh serve the poor job uh you uh serve the poor job uh you uh serve the poor and and we'll help you we'll be your and and we'll help you we'll be your and and we'll help you we'll be your consultant right we'll be like our consultant right we'll be like our consultant right we'll be like our podcast time podcast time podcast time you know and i that's that's i can't you know and i that's that's i can't you know and i that's that's i can't wait to see what god does this next wait to see what god does this next wait to see what god does this next decade i really can't i think it's gonna decade i really can't i think it's gonna decade i really can't i think it's gonna be be be i think you know a thousand years from i think you know a thousand years from i think you know a thousand years from now folks will be writing about this now folks will be writing about this now folks will be writing about this decade decade decade probably yeah yeah because i think that probably yeah yeah because i think that probably yeah yeah because i think that uh churches uh churches uh churches are i talked to a lot of churches and are i talked to a lot of churches and are i talked to a lot of churches and and all of them are kind of and all of them are kind of and all of them are kind of trying to figure out scratching their trying to figure out scratching their trying to figure out scratching their head redefining what does church head redefining what does church head redefining what does church look like we know what the mission of look like we know what the mission of look like we know what the mission of the church is we're not saying that's the church is we're not saying that's the church is we're not saying that's going away but how you do that certainly going away but how you do that certainly going away but how you do that certainly is is is and what are the metrics right and what and what are the metrics right and what and what are the metrics right and what in one of the metrics how do you measure in one of the metrics how do you measure in one of the metrics how do you measure that that that you know what's can you truly disciple you know what's can you truly disciple you know what's can you truly disciple somebody online somebody online somebody online you know is it a is it is it now i was you know is it a is it is it now i was you know is it a is it is it now i was using myself as an example because i got using myself as an example because i got using myself as an example because i got two teenage boys and so two teenage boys and so two teenage boys and so we've been taking the opportunity to sit we've been taking the opportunity to sit we've been taking the opportunity to sit in our family room after we watch the in our family room after we watch the in our family room after we watch the message and actually have a conversation

message and actually have a conversation message and actually have a conversation right and i got two teenage boys i want right and i got two teenage boys i want right and i got two teenage boys i want to pour into them i to pour into them i to pour into them i i want them to learn to own their faith i want them to learn to own their faith i want them to learn to own their faith yep i just borrow their faith because we yep i just borrow their faith because we yep i just borrow their faith because we said here's you know you're gonna be you said here's you know you're gonna be you said here's you know you're gonna be you know that's not that's not know that's not that's not know that's not that's not that's not what i want for my boys but i that's not what i want for my boys but i that's not what i want for my boys but i will not have that conversation will not have that conversation will not have that conversation if you know we're driving to church and if you know we're driving to church and if you know we're driving to church and then we're talking with people then we're talking with people then we're talking with people afterwards and then we get in the car afterwards and then we get in the car afterwards and then we get in the car and probably go our separate ways and probably go our separate ways and probably go our separate ways because we're all doing different things because we're all doing different things because we're all doing different things we would never have that intimate time we would never have that intimate time we would never have that intimate time together yeah together yeah together yeah this has afforded us that opportunity this has afforded us that opportunity this has afforded us that opportunity i'm illustrating exactly what we're i'm illustrating exactly what we're i'm illustrating exactly what we're trying to preach you know trying to preach you know trying to preach you know and teach with our folks right now and and teach with our folks right now and and teach with our folks right now and and and that's claiming something and and that's claiming something and and that's claiming something you know i i this is probably off topic you know i i this is probably off topic you know i i this is probably off topic i was in a different podcast and i was in a different podcast and i was in a different podcast and and somebody was bemoaning and i hated and somebody was bemoaning and i hated and somebody was bemoaning and i hated to be we're all to be we're all to be we're all we're all thin right now so we pop off we're all thin right now so we pop off we're all thin right now so we pop off too easy too easy too easy but it was we was bemoaning well you but it was we was bemoaning well you but it was we was bemoaning well you know the government they're trying to know the government they're trying to know the government they're trying to shut us down and shut us down and shut us down and they won't let us gather in our building they won't let us gather in our building they won't let us gather in our building and just hit the lawn i said and just hit the lawn i said and just hit the lawn i said would you stop whining i said you would you stop whining i said you would you stop whining i said you realize in the last six months realize in the last six months realize in the last six months the gospel has been preached to more the gospel has been preached to more the gospel has been preached to more people in america people in america people in america than it had in the past six years there than it had in the past six years there than it had in the past six years there are more people right now looking online are more people right now looking online are more people right now looking online and engaging and hearing this message and engaging and hearing this message and engaging and hearing this message than ever than ever than ever i i heard craig graduate life church say i i heard craig graduate life church say i i heard craig graduate life church say something about i something about i something about i i think they you know i mean it's huge i think they you know i mean it's huge i think they you know i mean it's huge as they are they as they are they as they are they don't quote me on this but something don't quote me on this but something don't quote me on this but something around like the average like 20 000 around like the average like 20 000 around like the average like 20 000 salvations a weekend across the whole

salvations a weekend across the whole salvations a weekend across the whole span of the country span of the country span of the country the first weekend after the pandemic the first weekend after the pandemic the first weekend after the pandemic they had 150 000 conversions they had 150 000 conversions they had 150 000 conversions yeah you know people are this is an yeah you know people are this is an yeah you know people are this is an opportune time it's scary it's opportune time it's scary it's opportune time it's scary it's uncomfortable uncomfortable uncomfortable i didn't wish it like esther didn't wish i didn't wish it like esther didn't wish i didn't wish it like esther didn't wish that she was that she was that she was born for such a time as this right but born for such a time as this right but born for such a time as this right but you know jason you and i is for such a you know jason you and i is for such a you know jason you and i is for such a time as this and time as this and time as this and and um we're trying to figure out and as and um we're trying to figure out and as and um we're trying to figure out and as you say the mission you say the mission you say the mission doesn't change um but you know doesn't change um but you know doesn't change um but you know we've got to have some new wine skins we've got to have some new wine skins we've got to have some new wine skins and that's right and look for these and that's right and look for these and that's right and look for these opportunities like we started something opportunities like we started something opportunities like we started something like garfield we just started last month like garfield we just started last month like garfield we just started last month we have after parties now we have after parties now we have after parties now so we do our services uh you know we do so we do our services uh you know we do so we do our services uh you know we do on the parking lot live on the parking lot live on the parking lot live we've got a few people coming in live in we've got a few people coming in live in we've got a few people coming in live in service with social distance and all service with social distance and all service with social distance and all that that that we have our broadcast we rebroadcast at we have our broadcast we rebroadcast at we have our broadcast we rebroadcast at various times various times various times um so throughout the morning there's um so throughout the morning there's um so throughout the morning there's maybe five six opportunities to beat maybe five six opportunities to beat maybe five six opportunities to beat part worship part worship part worship at one o'clock we say hey dvr the browns at one o'clock we say hey dvr the browns at one o'clock we say hey dvr the browns and come on in and come on in and come on in and we steam them we tailgate we come in and we steam them we tailgate we come in and we steam them we tailgate we come in and after party and let's and after party and let's and after party and let's let's jump into the message and our let's jump into the message and our let's jump into the message and our pastors go on breakout rooms and who pastors go on breakout rooms and who pastors go on breakout rooms and who would have thought such a thing would have thought such a thing would have thought such a thing yeah but but it's great and we're like yeah but but it's great and we're like yeah but but it's great and we're like saying now saying now saying now you know do this with your family and so you know do this with your family and so you know do this with your family and so i don't know i'm like i say i'm i don't know i'm like i say i'm i don't know i'm like i say i'm energized and i'm energized and i'm energized and i'm in trepidation but i think that's what in trepidation but i think that's what in trepidation but i think that's what paul said we work out our salvation and paul said we work out our salvation and paul said we work out our salvation and fear and trembling trembling can be a fear and trembling trembling can be a fear and trembling trembling can be a good thing good thing good thing yes it can you know it's exciting but so yes it can you know it's exciting but so yes it can you know it's exciting but so that's kind of where we're at that's kind of where we're at that's kind of where we're at and um yeah i anybody tells you an and um yeah i anybody tells you an and um yeah i anybody tells you an expert don't believe them but

expert don't believe them but expert don't believe them but people that are realizing you know people that are realizing you know people that are realizing you know they're hopping in the canoe with they're hopping in the canoe with they're hopping in the canoe with sacagawea and let's go let's go figure sacagawea and let's go let's go figure sacagawea and let's go let's go figure it out it out it out that's the spirit that's the spirit i'm that's the spirit that's the spirit i'm that's the spirit that's the spirit i'm calling on right now yeah knowing that calling on right now yeah knowing that calling on right now yeah knowing that god's got a plan for it god's got a plan for it god's got a plan for it so keeping your mind open your eyes open so keeping your mind open your eyes open so keeping your mind open your eyes open and acting well and acting well and acting well and you know recognizing what a gift and you know recognizing what a gift and you know recognizing what a gift what an opportunity instead of going man what an opportunity instead of going man what an opportunity instead of going man we're getting the short into the stick we're getting the short into the stick we're getting the short into the stick here no you're not here no you're not here no you're not because well you know it was weird i was because well you know it was weird i was because well you know it was weird i was with some pastors this week and we were with some pastors this week and we were with some pastors this week and we were realizing too realizing too realizing too um you know maybe god you know the um you know maybe god you know the um you know maybe god you know the weakness shaft thing i mean maybe guys weakness shaft thing i mean maybe guys weakness shaft thing i mean maybe guys just doing some weaning out just doing some weaning out just doing some weaning out like we had settled for so little and like we had settled for so little and like we had settled for so little and called a church called a church called a church um i had a pastor tell me that somebody um i had a pastor tell me that somebody um i had a pastor tell me that somebody called him called him called him and uh in the church and said okay i and uh in the church and said okay i and uh in the church and said okay i want one answer one answer only want one answer one answer only want one answer one answer only and how you how you say it you can only and how you how you say it you can only and how you how you say it you can only say one word is going to determine where say one word is going to determine where say one word is going to determine where kind of the top families there leave the kind of the top families there leave the kind of the top families there leave the church church church and she said uh do black lives matter and she said uh do black lives matter and she said uh do black lives matter all lives matter all lives matter all lives matter like he had answered one word and like he had answered one word and like he had answered one word and however he answered they were gone however he answered they were gone however he answered they were gone and i said i hope they're gone you know and i said i hope they're gone you know and i said i hope they're gone you know and they are and they are and they are and i just said i i i i and i just said i i i i and i just said i i i i it hurt one people but it's like maybe it hurt one people but it's like maybe it hurt one people but it's like maybe god's just saying god's just saying god's just saying i gotta shake that out you know i gotta i gotta shake that out you know i gotta i gotta shake that out you know i gotta get back to the folks get back to the folks get back to the folks really with their hair on fire for what really with their hair on fire for what really with their hair on fire for what this gospel really is this gospel really is this gospel really is to go out and preach the love of christ to go out and preach the love of christ to go out and preach the love of christ and uh and uh and uh and and maybe this is the scattering of

and and maybe this is the scattering of and and maybe this is the scattering of acts eight and i i don't know acts eight and i i don't know acts eight and i i don't know but i that's why i say i'm when you say but i that's why i say i'm when you say but i that's why i say i'm when you say what's next what's next what's next i felt like i'd asked our folks at our i felt like i'd asked our folks at our i felt like i'd asked our folks at our church an awful lot church an awful lot church an awful lot to let them lay aside personal to let them lay aside personal to let them lay aside personal preferences past experiences preferences past experiences preferences past experiences politics and focus but there's even a politics and focus but there's even a politics and focus but there's even a next level next level next level of this being ministry providers that um of this being ministry providers that um of this being ministry providers that um that i'm gonna i'm gonna work real hard that i'm gonna i'm gonna work real hard that i'm gonna i'm gonna work real hard with them on and understand saying look with them on and understand saying look with them on and understand saying look hey hey hey here i'm your lead pastor i'm not sure i here i'm your lead pastor i'm not sure i here i'm your lead pastor i'm not sure i must do it i get it must do it i get it must do it i get it but nonetheless this is the ministry but nonetheless this is the ministry but nonetheless this is the ministry that his love other country loves that his love other country loves that his love other country loves compels us compels us compels us i laugh every time i say that i think if i laugh every time i say that i think if i laugh every time i say that i think if remember the exorcist movie i'm so old remember the exorcist movie i'm so old remember the exorcist movie i'm so old and then the episode you know the lord and then the episode you know the lord and then the episode you know the lord of jesus christ compels you it was like of jesus christ compels you it was like of jesus christ compels you it was like a negative thing a negative thing a negative thing the opposite of that is man the love of the opposite of that is man the love of the opposite of that is man the love of jesus christ jesus christ jesus christ compels us it just projects us out of compels us it just projects us out of compels us it just projects us out of the world the world the world and i'm hoping that's what's happening and i'm hoping that's what's happening and i'm hoping that's what's happening yeah well your your message of yeah well your your message of yeah well your your message of reconciliation and reconciliation and reconciliation and and just staying on that theme and just staying on that theme and just staying on that theme so timely uh with with anything that's so timely uh with with anything that's so timely uh with with anything that's going on right going on right going on right it's and we have some big issues in our it's and we have some big issues in our it's and we have some big issues in our country right now country right now country right now um and and it doesn't seem like it's um and and it doesn't seem like it's um and and it doesn't seem like it's going to go away any time soon so that's going to go away any time soon so that's going to go away any time soon so that's a a a if enter if the churches can take if enter if the churches can take if enter if the churches can take anything away be like anything away be like anything away be like yeah focus on that make that a core yeah focus on that make that a core yeah focus on that make that a core yeah and let's let's do that together yeah and let's let's do that together yeah and let's let's do that together you know i always say i'm not running

you know i always say i'm not running you know i always say i'm not running for anything and my allegiance is to the for anything and my allegiance is to the for anything and my allegiance is to the mother king mother king mother king that doesn't mean that i don't care that doesn't mean that i don't care that doesn't mean that i don't care about what happens here doesn't mean we about what happens here doesn't mean we about what happens here doesn't mean we don't confront injustice doesn't mean don't confront injustice doesn't mean don't confront injustice doesn't mean we don't be good citizens all those we don't be good citizens all those we don't be good citizens all those things not at all things not at all things not at all but you know um ultimately am i living but you know um ultimately am i living but you know um ultimately am i living in the ethics in the ethics in the ethics of the true kingdom for jesus christ i of the true kingdom for jesus christ i of the true kingdom for jesus christ i tell my folks here's the good news tell my folks here's the good news tell my folks here's the good news three billion years from now in eternity three billion years from now in eternity three billion years from now in eternity we won't even remember what a president we won't even remember what a president we won't even remember what a president was was was so let's be that colony from heaven that so let's be that colony from heaven that so let's be that colony from heaven that paul talks about paul talks about paul talks about and and be in the world not of the world and and be in the world not of the world and and be in the world not of the world i mean you know fight injustice i i'm i mean you know fight injustice i i'm i mean you know fight injustice i i'm not preaching the not preaching the not preaching the opiate of the people but let's let's opiate of the people but let's let's opiate of the people but let's let's remember remember remember you know where our ultimate home is yeah you know where our ultimate home is yeah you know where our ultimate home is yeah and and work toward that and work toward and and work toward that and work toward and and work toward that and work toward that that that but it's it's hard work it but it should but it's it's hard work it but it should but it's it's hard work it but it should be you just didn't you know be you just didn't you know be you just didn't you know i remember martin luther king jr once i remember martin luther king jr once i remember martin luther king jr once said you know in one of his great said you know in one of his great said you know in one of his great sermons sermons sermons he said we turned he said when did the he said we turned he said when did the he said we turned he said when did the great commission become great commission become great commission become lo i send you into the world to keep lo i send you into the world to keep lo i send you into the world to keep your blood pressure down and have a your blood pressure down and have a your blood pressure down and have a well-adjusted personality well-adjusted personality well-adjusted personality you know no no we're called to this hard you know no no we're called to this hard you know no no we're called to this hard work work work that's a credible witness for the hard that's a credible witness for the hard that's a credible witness for the hard work work work um yeah um yeah um yeah well chip well thank you for your well chip well thank you for your well chip well thank you for your insight insight insight hey bro it's really good meeting you in hey bro it's really good meeting you in hey bro it's really good meeting you in person yeah likewise so i person yeah likewise so i person yeah likewise so i appreciate you appreciate what you're appreciate you appreciate what you're appreciate you appreciate what you're doing uh for his kingdom and uh keep up doing uh for his kingdom and uh keep up doing uh for his kingdom and uh keep up the good work the good work the good work and do no other all right hold on silver and do no other all right hold on silver and do no other all right hold on silver have i known what i have i gave to you

have i known what i have i gave to you have i known what i have i gave to you my brother my brother my brother all right we'll talk to you soon my all right we'll talk to you soon my all right we'll talk to you soon my friend thank you sir friend thank you sir friend thank you sir well chip we should all be inspired to well chip we should all be inspired to well chip we should all be inspired to lead like this lead like this lead like this generating a holy discontent that has us generating a holy discontent that has us generating a holy discontent that has us focused on being a multi-ethnic church focused on being a multi-ethnic church focused on being a multi-ethnic church it's mandated in the bible you spoke it's mandated in the bible you spoke it's mandated in the bible you spoke into this into this into this and this work of reconciliation is not and this work of reconciliation is not and this work of reconciliation is not easy a takeaway for you church easy a takeaway for you church easy a takeaway for you church might be to think about your church and might be to think about your church and might be to think about your church and where you're headed are you focused on where you're headed are you focused on where you're headed are you focused on a biblical mandate that all people a biblical mandate that all people a biblical mandate that all people all people should learn and get to know all people should learn and get to know all people should learn and get to know jesus jesus jesus is that what you're doing now if you is that what you're doing now if you is that what you're doing now if you want to learn more want to learn more want to learn more uh check out chip at garfield memorial uh check out chip at garfield memorial uh check out chip at garfield memorial church church church right or go the mosaic network that's an right or go the mosaic network that's an right or go the mosaic network that's an organization that works with churches organization that works with churches organization that works with churches and helps them and helps them and helps them become multi-ethnic and so i encourage become multi-ethnic and so i encourage become multi-ethnic and so i encourage you to do that you to do that you to do that until next time god bless and take care until next time god bless and take care until next time god bless and take care [Music]