Moving a Church From the Yellow Pages to Online Marketing | Kristi Jacobsen

[Music] [Music] well welcome to the missional marketing well welcome to the missional marketing well welcome to the missional marketing church growth interviews podcast i'm church growth interviews podcast i'm church growth interviews podcast i'm bart blair and bart blair and bart blair and as always i'm joined by my friend my as always i'm joined by my friend my as always i'm joined by my friend my colleague and my boss colleague and my boss colleague and my boss jason hamrock the ceo and chief coach jason hamrock the ceo and chief coach jason hamrock the ceo and chief coach at missional marketing jason how are you at missional marketing jason how are you at missional marketing jason how are you doing today hey bart i'm doing doing today hey bart i'm doing doing today hey bart i'm doing fantastic thank you how are you doing fantastic thank you how are you doing fantastic thank you how are you doing uh you know i'm all things considered uh you know i'm all things considered uh you know i'm all things considered i'm actually doing pretty well i'm actually doing pretty well i'm actually doing pretty well you and i were just talking before we you and i were just talking before we you and i were just talking before we started recording a few minutes ago started recording a few minutes ago started recording a few minutes ago about about about some of the great opportunities that some of the great opportunities that some of the great opportunities that we've had to work with some new churches we've had to work with some new churches we've had to work with some new churches trying some new things with churches as trying some new things with churches as trying some new things with churches as we're helping them we're helping them we're helping them in you know increase their their digital in you know increase their their digital in you know increase their their digital footprint footprint footprint in the communities and i'm just really in the communities and i'm just really in the communities and i'm just really excited about the opportunities that excited about the opportunities that excited about the opportunities that we've had we've had we've had and i'm excited to introduce the guests and i'm excited to introduce the guests and i'm excited to introduce the guests that we're going to be introducing today that we're going to be introducing today that we're going to be introducing today hey before i get to that i actually have hey before i get to that i actually have hey before i get to that i actually have i i have something i wanted i i have something i wanted i i have something i wanted to to point out uh as our listeners are to to point out uh as our listeners are to to point out uh as our listeners are listening to this podcast listening to this podcast listening to this podcast if they're subscribers they might have if they're subscribers they might have if they're subscribers they might have noticed that we missed a week or maybe noticed that we missed a week or maybe noticed that we missed a week or maybe they didn't notice that we missed a week they didn't notice that we missed a week they didn't notice that we missed a week um but we missed a weekly notice and um but we missed a weekly notice and um but we missed a weekly notice and their concern yeah yeah and i hope you their concern yeah yeah and i hope you their concern yeah yeah and i hope you noticed that we missed a week and i hope noticed that we missed a week and i hope noticed that we missed a week and i hope that you're concerned that you're concerned that you're concerned the reason we missed a week is because the reason we missed a week is because the reason we missed a week is because jason and i jason and i jason and i have been too busy and the reason that have been too busy and the reason that have been too busy and the reason that we're too busy we're too busy we're too busy is because admissional marketing we're is because admissional marketing we're is because admissional marketing we're slightly understaffed slightly understaffed slightly understaffed and that is my lead in to pass things and that is my lead in to pass things and that is my lead in to pass things over to you over to you over to you jason hamrock because we're hiring we're jason hamrock because we're hiring we're jason hamrock because we're hiring we're looking at adding some new team members looking at adding some new team members looking at adding some new team members to our team why don't you talk about

to our team why don't you talk about to our team why don't you talk about that for does this act that for does this act that for does this act oh i'd love to thanks bart yeah we are oh i'd love to thanks bart yeah we are oh i'd love to thanks bart yeah we are expanding expanding expanding and growing and god is good he's and growing and god is good he's and growing and god is good he's blessing us and what's really cool blessing us and what's really cool blessing us and what's really cool is the the churches we get to serve i'm is the the churches we get to serve i'm is the the churches we get to serve i'm just seeing them just seeing them just seeing them uh really excited about 2021 because uh really excited about 2021 because uh really excited about 2021 because they're back in person they're back in person they're back in person and more and more people are coming back and more and more people are coming back and more and more people are coming back and yet their online numbers are staying and yet their online numbers are staying and yet their online numbers are staying there and so there and so there and so churches inevitably then want to do more churches inevitably then want to do more churches inevitably then want to do more stuff right they stuff right they stuff right they they're like hey we're ready to go they're like hey we're ready to go they're like hey we're ready to go deeper into facebook or we're ready to deeper into facebook or we're ready to deeper into facebook or we're ready to start to do sermon snippets or whatever start to do sermon snippets or whatever start to do sermon snippets or whatever it is they may want to do that we work it is they may want to do that we work it is they may want to do that we work with them on with them on with them on it's caused our team to have to grow and it's caused our team to have to grow and it's caused our team to have to grow and we're bringing on we're bringing on we're bringing on lots of new churches around the country lots of new churches around the country lots of new churches around the country these days and so these days and so these days and so bart and myself and a bunch of us are bart and myself and a bunch of us are bart and myself and a bunch of us are like a digital like a digital like a digital coach to churches we meet with uh our coach to churches we meet with uh our coach to churches we meet with uh our church partners church partners church partners regularly and we serve them and we go regularly and we serve them and we go regularly and we serve them and we go through through through uh all the different products that we've uh all the different products that we've uh all the different products that we've uh you know that we're working on uh you know that we're working on uh you know that we're working on with them and we talk about their their with them and we talk about their their with them and we talk about their their analytics on their website we talk about analytics on their website we talk about analytics on their website we talk about what's happening on their facebook or what's happening on their facebook or what's happening on their facebook or instagram or instagram or instagram or if we're running google display ads or if we're running google display ads or if we're running google display ads or using the google grant we look at all of using the google grant we look at all of using the google grant we look at all of that that that and then we start to look at their and then we start to look at their and then we start to look at their website and so as a website and so as a website and so as a coach it's really a lot of fun i like to coach it's really a lot of fun i like to coach it's really a lot of fun i like to say that we get to work say that we get to work say that we get to work for the church not necessarily in the for the church not necessarily in the for the church not necessarily in the church church church if you know what i mean and so uh we're if you know what i mean and so uh we're if you know what i mean and so uh we're expanding we need more expanding we need more expanding we need more digital coaches um so if that's somebody digital coaches um so if that's somebody digital coaches um so if that's somebody that's you if that's uh if you think that's you if that's uh if you think that's you if that's uh if you think about oh i'd really love to work

about oh i'd really love to work about oh i'd really love to work for the church and not necessarily in for the church and not necessarily in for the church and not necessarily in the church anymore the church anymore the church anymore go to our website go to the missionary go to our website go to the missionary go to our website go to the missionary any more comments yeah wait wait wait any more comments yeah wait wait wait any more comments yeah wait wait wait he's not trying to get you to quit your he's not trying to get you to quit your he's not trying to get you to quit your job i don't want job i don't want job i don't want okay no and we we also have a number of okay no and we we also have a number of okay no and we we also have a number of of technical of technical of technical there's also a number of technical there's also a number of technical there's also a number of technical positions that we're looking to hire as positions that we're looking to hire as positions that we're looking to hire as well well well web developers graphic designer seo web developers graphic designer seo web developers graphic designer seo specialists uh specialists uh specialists uh you name it so our website do you you name it so our website do you you name it so our website do you remember the the url for it yes remember the the url for it yes remember the the url for it yes missionalmarketing.com forward missionalmarketing.com forward missionalmarketing.com forward slash careers okay in there you're gonna slash careers okay in there you're gonna slash careers okay in there you're gonna find find find uh yeah you're gonna find we're looking uh yeah you're gonna find we're looking uh yeah you're gonna find we're looking to hire uh graphic designers to hire uh graphic designers to hire uh graphic designers videographer guys we're videographer guys we're videographer guys we're full stack developers wordpress full stack developers wordpress full stack developers wordpress developers certainly as i talked about developers certainly as i talked about developers certainly as i talked about the digital coach the digital coach the digital coach got a lot of positions to fill around got a lot of positions to fill around got a lot of positions to fill around mission marketing okay cool i will put mission marketing okay cool i will put mission marketing okay cool i will put that link that link that link to that page in the show notes for this to that page in the show notes for this to that page in the show notes for this podcast so if you're watching or you're podcast so if you're watching or you're podcast so if you're watching or you're listening listening listening and you're interested in that check it and you're interested in that check it and you're interested in that check it out there's a way to contact us there out there's a way to contact us there out there's a way to contact us there and we can start a conversation to see and we can start a conversation to see and we can start a conversation to see if it might be a good if it might be a good if it might be a good fit for you all right jason um fit for you all right jason um fit for you all right jason um because i mentioned this because we because i mentioned this because we because i mentioned this because we recorded recorded recorded this interview with christy jacobson this interview with christy jacobson this interview with christy jacobson uh several weeks ago and part of the uh several weeks ago and part of the uh several weeks ago and part of the reason that we weren't ready to reason that we weren't ready to reason that we weren't ready to publish it on the week that it needed to publish it on the week that it needed to publish it on the week that it needed to be published is because we hadn't be published is because we hadn't be published is because we hadn't recorded this intro and we tried and recorded this intro and we tried and recorded this intro and we tried and then then then rescheduled because we were busy meeting rescheduled because we were busy meeting rescheduled because we were busy meeting with churches and doing other things with churches and doing other things with churches and doing other things so that's kind of why we've fallen so that's kind of why we've fallen so that's kind of why we've fallen behind this podcast thing although behind this podcast thing although behind this podcast thing although i wish this was what we did for a living i wish this was what we did for a living i wish this was what we did for a living and this was the main part of our job and this was the main part of our job and this was the main part of our job this is just kind of the fun stuff that this is just kind of the fun stuff that this is just kind of the fun stuff that we get to do when we're in between we get to do when we're in between we get to do when we're in between church meetings so um like

church meetings so um like church meetings so um like recess yeah it's kind of like recess so recess yeah it's kind of like recess so recess yeah it's kind of like recess so why don't you share a little bit about why don't you share a little bit about why don't you share a little bit about uh christy jacobson she's at vineyard uh christy jacobson she's at vineyard uh christy jacobson she's at vineyard cincinnati cincinnati cincinnati and uh why don't you just kind of do a and uh why don't you just kind of do a and uh why don't you just kind of do a little brief intro intro and then we'll little brief intro intro and then we'll little brief intro intro and then we'll roll the interview you bet so a little roll the interview you bet so a little roll the interview you bet so a little bit about christy she bit about christy she bit about christy she is a the director of communications and is a the director of communications and is a the director of communications and she's been in that role for she's been in that role for she's been in that role for almost 20 years she'll actually get into almost 20 years she'll actually get into almost 20 years she'll actually get into those details those details those details now the thing about christie she's super now the thing about christie she's super now the thing about christie she's super smart they smart they smart they they do a lot of advertising and they they do a lot of advertising and they they do a lot of advertising and they use rock use rock use rock as their church management system as their church management system as their church management system christie has literally gone over the christie has literally gone over the christie has literally gone over the last last last i don't know five or six years she's i don't know five or six years she's i don't know five or six years she's transitioned to several different senior transitioned to several different senior transitioned to several different senior pastors pastors pastors and and she has learned a ton from those and and she has learned a ton from those and and she has learned a ton from those experiences experiences experiences and so i uh we're going to talk about and so i uh we're going to talk about and so i uh we're going to talk about that today i hope you learned something that today i hope you learned something that today i hope you learned something from christy about that if that's you from christy about that if that's you from christy about that if that's you going through some going through some going through some leadership transitions yeah you might leadership transitions yeah you might leadership transitions yeah you might want to reach out and talk to chrissy want to reach out and talk to chrissy want to reach out and talk to chrissy because she has because she has because she has navigated those waters and she's done it navigated those waters and she's done it navigated those waters and she's done it very very well very very well very very well and so uh we talked about that we're and so uh we talked about that we're and so uh we talked about that we're going to talk about uh what's been going going to talk about uh what's been going going to talk about uh what's been going on at vineyard and you are going to on at vineyard and you are going to on at vineyard and you are going to be blessed by this podcast awesome be blessed by this podcast awesome be blessed by this podcast awesome here's our interview with christy here's our interview with christy here's our interview with christy jacobson jacobson jacobson christy jacobson welcome to the church christy jacobson welcome to the church christy jacobson welcome to the church growth interviews podcast jason and i growth interviews podcast jason and i growth interviews podcast jason and i are really excited to have you with us are really excited to have you with us are really excited to have you with us today today today yeah thanks for having me i'm glad to be yeah thanks for having me i'm glad to be yeah thanks for having me i'm glad to be here here here yeah well christy we've been friends for yeah well christy we've been friends for yeah well christy we've been friends for a long time and uh we've a long time and uh we've a long time and uh we've uh it's been great to be able to serve uh it's been great to be able to serve uh it's been great to be able to serve you guys and i'm really excited because you guys and i'm really excited because you guys and i'm really excited because i think a lot of our our listeners i think a lot of our our listeners i think a lot of our our listeners uh might be new to the communications

uh might be new to the communications uh might be new to the communications world um world um world um and and certainly there are a lot of and and certainly there are a lot of and and certainly there are a lot of churches these days churches these days churches these days where they're moving staff so staff where they're moving staff so staff where they're moving staff so staff person who is a person who is a person who is a youth pastor for all these years has now youth pastor for all these years has now youth pastor for all these years has now got the call to be got the call to be got the call to be in the communications department maybe in the communications department maybe in the communications department maybe even being their online even being their online even being their online pastor or writing communications or some pastor or writing communications or some pastor or writing communications or some kind of a digital digital strategy kind of a digital digital strategy kind of a digital digital strategy every time i talk to churches seems like every time i talk to churches seems like every time i talk to churches seems like somebody's new to the role they're not somebody's new to the role they're not somebody's new to the role they're not maybe new to the church but they're new maybe new to the church but they're new maybe new to the church but they're new to the role to the role to the role so share a little bit about your so share a little bit about your so share a little bit about your background and background and background and what you've been there for 20 some years what you've been there for 20 some years what you've been there for 20 some years so give our our listeners a little bit so give our our listeners a little bit so give our our listeners a little bit of uh of uh of uh your story sure so your story sure so your story sure so um i was a volunteer which is where um i was a volunteer which is where um i was a volunteer which is where everybody everybody everybody starts and i was volunteering in the starts and i was volunteering in the starts and i was volunteering in the hospitality team hospitality team hospitality team and passing out programs when people and passing out programs when people and passing out programs when people would come in and i got would come in and i got would come in and i got um recruited by the director of um recruited by the director of um recruited by the director of hospitality to hospitality to hospitality to create a newsletter for the hospitality create a newsletter for the hospitality create a newsletter for the hospitality team just on a volunteer basis and i was team just on a volunteer basis and i was team just on a volunteer basis and i was like like like i shouldn't say yes and i said yes and i i shouldn't say yes and i said yes and i i shouldn't say yes and i said yes and i was like i'm gonna have no was like i'm gonna have no was like i'm gonna have no time ever for anything so i started time ever for anything so i started time ever for anything so i started doing this newsletter doing this newsletter doing this newsletter and i also got connected to the and i also got connected to the and i also got connected to the communications director at the time communications director at the time communications director at the time and she brought me in for some like and she brought me in for some like and she brought me in for some like volunteer meetings they would have volunteer meetings they would have volunteer meetings they would have so i was just happily working somewhere so i was just happily working somewhere so i was just happily working somewhere else and volunteering here and i thought else and volunteering here and i thought else and volunteering here and i thought that's great i can volunteer that's great i can volunteer that's great i can volunteer that's a good role for me and then she that's a good role for me and then she that's a good role for me and then she was moving was moving was moving internally into an alpha director role internally into an alpha director role internally into an alpha director role and she's like christy we need somebody and she's like christy we need somebody and she's like christy we need somebody temporary part-time temporary part-time temporary part-time to work at the vineyard my role and i

to work at the vineyard my role and i to work at the vineyard my role and i was like uh was like uh was like uh i don't want to work at a church let me i don't want to work at a church let me i don't want to work at a church let me think about it so think about it so think about it so my other job just like ended and my other job just like ended and my other job just like ended and then i said okay i'm available so i then i said okay i'm available so i then i said okay i'm available so i started working started working started working temporary part-time and after six months temporary part-time and after six months temporary part-time and after six months my director was like you're still my director was like you're still my director was like you're still temporary let's make people let's make temporary let's make people let's make temporary let's make people let's make you you you like permanent so that's how i became like permanent so that's how i became like permanent so that's how i became that's how i joined staff that's how i joined staff that's how i joined staff um like i have a degree in public um like i have a degree in public um like i have a degree in public relations so that's my background relations so that's my background relations so that's my background so um you know i had a little bit of the so um you know i had a little bit of the so um you know i had a little bit of the skills and knowledge but skills and knowledge but skills and knowledge but i had no idea what i was doing for the i had no idea what i was doing for the i had no idea what i was doing for the first two weeks first two weeks first two weeks and then uh reflecting on that i still and then uh reflecting on that i still and then uh reflecting on that i still feel like i have no idea what i'm doing feel like i have no idea what i'm doing feel like i have no idea what i'm doing sometimes sometimes sometimes so you know imposter syndrome is real so you know imposter syndrome is real so you know imposter syndrome is real and i've been working here for 20 years and i've been working here for 20 years and i've been working here for 20 years and you'd think i would and you'd think i would and you'd think i would have a little more like oh i know what have a little more like oh i know what have a little more like oh i know what i'm doing but things are thank you thank i'm doing but things are thank you thank i'm doing but things are thank you thank you for the opportunity you for the opportunity you for the opportunity so much things are changing all the time so much things are changing all the time so much things are changing all the time you're constantly learning so you have you're constantly learning so you have you're constantly learning so you have to be really to be really to be really a learner to be in this role yeah yeah a learner to be in this role yeah yeah a learner to be in this role yeah yeah thanks for the honesty there that that's thanks for the honesty there that that's thanks for the honesty there that that's that that takes a that takes a lot of that that takes a that takes a lot of that that takes a that takes a lot of guts to say publicly guts to say publicly guts to say publicly yeah and and on a call that's being yeah and and on a call that's being yeah and and on a call that's being recorded that you feel like you don't recorded that you feel like you don't recorded that you feel like you don't know what you're doing know what you're doing know what you're doing everybody feels it though everybody i everybody feels it though everybody i everybody feels it though everybody i talk to they're like oh yeah talk to they're like oh yeah talk to they're like oh yeah i know they i have the exact same i know they i have the exact same i know they i have the exact same feeling so i'm just i'm just saying feeling so i'm just i'm just saying feeling so i'm just i'm just saying if you feel that way um trust me what if you feel that way um trust me what if you feel that way um trust me what everybody else does everybody else does everybody else does well what i find in the church well what i find in the church well what i find in the church communications space communications space communications space is that you don't to be an is that you don't to be an is that you don't to be an expert in church communications you expert in church communications you expert in church communications you don't need to know everything don't need to know everything don't need to know everything you're probably just the person that you're probably just the person that you're probably just the person that knows slightly more than everybody else

knows slightly more than everybody else knows slightly more than everybody else and you're just continuing to stay one and you're just continuing to stay one and you're just continuing to stay one step ahead of everybody else because you step ahead of everybody else because you step ahead of everybody else because you have to be have to be have to be you have to be a perpetual learner right you have to be a perpetual learner right you have to be a perpetual learner right communications digital media all the communications digital media all the communications digital media all the things that we work in in the church things that we work in in the church things that we work in in the church in communications it's changed so much in communications it's changed so much in communications it's changed so much in fact i'd like for you to talk a in fact i'd like for you to talk a in fact i'd like for you to talk a little bit about how much has changed in little bit about how much has changed in little bit about how much has changed in the 20 years the 20 years the 20 years since you joined the staff of the church since you joined the staff of the church since you joined the staff of the church what was the stuff that you were doing what was the stuff that you were doing what was the stuff that you were doing when you first started when you first started when you first started and what are the things that make up and what are the things that make up and what are the things that make up obviously your role has changed a lot obviously your role has changed a lot obviously your role has changed a lot but just in terms of the communications but just in terms of the communications but just in terms of the communications process and what you're doing as a process and what you're doing as a process and what you're doing as a church what are some of the big changes church what are some of the big changes church what are some of the big changes that you've seen in the last 20 years that you've seen in the last 20 years that you've seen in the last 20 years well when i first started we were faxing well when i first started we were faxing well when i first started we were faxing press releases press releases press releases i don't know if we even have a facts i don't know if we even have a facts i don't know if we even have a facts anymore um anymore um anymore um about like 10 around 2010 we really about like 10 around 2010 we really about like 10 around 2010 we really started a shift toward started a shift toward started a shift toward social media so we had to become experts social media so we had to become experts social media so we had to become experts in social media because we were all in social media because we were all in social media because we were all publishers publishers publishers um we used to put out like multi-page um we used to put out like multi-page um we used to put out like multi-page newsletters like it was all in print and newsletters like it was all in print and newsletters like it was all in print and then then then slowly everything has shifted online so slowly everything has shifted online so slowly everything has shifted online so we do a whole lot less we do a whole lot less we do a whole lot less fewer brochures and a lot more online fewer brochures and a lot more online fewer brochures and a lot more online and i learned how to program and i learned how to program and i learned how to program i i'm decent in html i i'm decent in html i i'm decent in html this is stuff that i didn't really learn this is stuff that i didn't really learn this is stuff that i didn't really learn in college so social media and then just i had a year social media and then just i had a year where i was like this is going to be my where i was like this is going to be my where i was like this is going to be my year of the e-newsletter and i really year of the e-newsletter and i really year of the e-newsletter and i really learned how to do e-newsletters learned how to do e-newsletters learned how to do e-newsletters um i kind of have a thing a year um i kind of have a thing a year um i kind of have a thing a year that i learn and i'm like i'm gonna get that i learn and i'm like i'm gonna get that i learn and i'm like i'm gonna get good at this i'm gonna really focus on

good at this i'm gonna really focus on good at this i'm gonna really focus on this this this and then i go into the next thing how do and then i go into the next thing how do and then i go into the next thing how do you balance that you balance that you balance that because as bart just said you have to be because as bart just said you have to be because as bart just said you have to be a perpetual learner you're constantly a perpetual learner you're constantly a perpetual learner you're constantly you you you have to learn because technology have to learn because technology have to learn because technology everything's changing constantly yet you everything's changing constantly yet you everything's changing constantly yet you also have also have also have uh a lot of um repeat like sunday's uh a lot of um repeat like sunday's uh a lot of um repeat like sunday's always coming always coming always coming there's there's those things in the there's there's those things in the there's there's those things in the church world it just happens church world it just happens church world it just happens over and over and over and so you have over and over and over and so you have over and over and over and so you have to be able to balance the two to be able to balance the two to be able to balance the two how have you been able to learn this how have you been able to learn this how have you been able to learn this stuff while stuff while stuff while uh keeping yourself grounded knowing uh keeping yourself grounded knowing uh keeping yourself grounded knowing that every week you've got that every week you've got that every week you've got services and you've got events and year services and you've got events and year services and you've got events and year after year it becomes the same after year it becomes the same after year it becomes the same yeah um i think it's you know just yeah um i think it's you know just yeah um i think it's you know just making making making time for that i love learning so that's time for that i love learning so that's time for that i love learning so that's not like a big issue for me but finding not like a big issue for me but finding not like a big issue for me but finding the voices i'm going to listen to is the voices i'm going to listen to is the voices i'm going to listen to is important important important i get like um i stay in touch with pr i get like um i stay in touch with pr i get like um i stay in touch with pr industry things like pr weekly industry things like pr weekly industry things like pr weekly so i'll read their newsletter and i just so i'll read their newsletter and i just so i'll read their newsletter and i just you just pick up things just by you just pick up things just by you just pick up things just by making a daily habit of scanning this making a daily habit of scanning this making a daily habit of scanning this and being like oh okay so that's a thing and being like oh okay so that's a thing and being like oh okay so that's a thing now i should probably look into what now i should probably look into what now i should probably look into what um oh what's the new audio only thing um oh what's the new audio only thing um oh what's the new audio only thing that people are doing it's uh how that people are doing it's uh how that people are doing it's uh how oh i'll think of it lately clubhouse is oh i'll think of it lately clubhouse is oh i'll think of it lately clubhouse is cleveland clubhouse and i was like oh we cleveland clubhouse and i was like oh we cleveland clubhouse and i was like oh we should be on clubhouse so should be on clubhouse so should be on clubhouse so that's a new thing that i've heard about that's a new thing that i've heard about that's a new thing that i've heard about um um um you know just you know facebook was the you know just you know facebook was the you know just you know facebook was the thing for a while and it's instagram and thing for a while and it's instagram and thing for a while and it's instagram and then we tried our then we tried our then we tried our hand at uh snapchat we're like you know hand at uh snapchat we're like you know hand at uh snapchat we're like you know what we just need to focus on like

what we just need to focus on like what we just need to focus on like two platforms so i guess just being a two platforms so i guess just being a two platforms so i guess just being a constant learner constant learner constant learner constantly talking to people um having constantly talking to people um having constantly talking to people um having kids kids kids helped me a lot um my son he was 11. he helped me a lot um my son he was 11. he helped me a lot um my son he was 11. he wanted to set up a youtube channel wanted to set up a youtube channel wanted to set up a youtube channel so i'm setting up a youtube channel for so i'm setting up a youtube channel for so i'm setting up a youtube channel for him and i learned so much about what the him and i learned so much about what the him and i learned so much about what the vineyard should be doing vineyard should be doing vineyard should be doing that i started doing a lot of that stuff that i started doing a lot of that stuff that i started doing a lot of that stuff for us just from that process for us just from that process for us just from that process wow that's yeah yeah so if there's wow that's yeah yeah so if there's wow that's yeah yeah so if there's so uh some advice for those who are kind so uh some advice for those who are kind so uh some advice for those who are kind of new to this role of new to this role of new to this role um there is a way i think you have to um there is a way i think you have to um there is a way i think you have to you have to be able to find rhythm you have to be able to find rhythm you have to be able to find rhythm it's really important to have rhythm but it's really important to have rhythm but it's really important to have rhythm but you also got to be able to you also got to be able to you also got to be able to keep your your mind and ears open for keep your your mind and ears open for keep your your mind and ears open for what's new what's new what's new and be able to absorb that and how you and be able to absorb that and how you and be able to absorb that and how you can put implement that in your can put implement that in your can put implement that in your in your career well i started putting in your career well i started putting in your career well i started putting things in my calendar so things in my calendar so things in my calendar so like the things that are the weekly like the things that are the weekly like the things that are the weekly rhythms so like every friday at 11 i rhythms so like every friday at 11 i rhythms so like every friday at 11 i have a time slot in my calendar to do have a time slot in my calendar to do have a time slot in my calendar to do uh like the update our events web page uh like the update our events web page uh like the update our events web page and and and update our program content so like update our program content so like update our program content so like scheduling those into my life scheduling those into my life scheduling those into my life that's important for the weekly rhythm um talk a little bit about the staff um talk a little bit about the staff that's under that's under that's under under you how have you been under you how have you been under you how have you been in leading them sure so we have in leading them sure so we have in leading them sure so we have um on my team we have graphic design and um on my team we have graphic design and um on my team we have graphic design and a digital content manager so a digital content manager so a digital content manager so our area oversees all the web and all

our area oversees all the web and all our area oversees all the web and all the the the graphic design and all the signage and graphic design and all the signage and graphic design and all the signage and all the all the video that we put online all the all the video that we put online all the all the video that we put online all the social media all the social media all the social media so i lead the graphic design team um i so i lead the graphic design team um i so i lead the graphic design team um i i know enough about graphic design i did i know enough about graphic design i did i know enough about graphic design i did it for a couple of years it for a couple of years it for a couple of years i think kind of poorly so i can lead i think kind of poorly so i can lead i think kind of poorly so i can lead that that that um but i i think what i understand is um but i i think what i understand is um but i i think what i understand is how to lead a creative person how to lead a creative person how to lead a creative person because i'm i'm a creative person and i because i'm i'm a creative person and i because i'm i'm a creative person and i know what really annoys them know what really annoys them know what really annoys them and that's like being micromanaged told and that's like being micromanaged told and that's like being micromanaged told how to do things a certain way how to do things a certain way how to do things a certain way so um i just lead people how i would so um i just lead people how i would so um i just lead people how i would want to be led want to be led want to be led so i've had really good consistency in so i've had really good consistency in so i've had really good consistency in our team our team our team um and i they're really great they're um and i they're really great they're um and i they're really great they're they know so much and i really rely on they know so much and i really rely on they know so much and i really rely on them a lot but sometimes i'm like them a lot but sometimes i'm like them a lot but sometimes i'm like can we start doing this and i'll have to can we start doing this and i'll have to can we start doing this and i'll have to do a lot of training on a certain thing do a lot of training on a certain thing do a lot of training on a certain thing and then they get it and they just run and then they get it and they just run and then they get it and they just run with it with it with it wow so you guys have had uh let's shift wow so you guys have had uh let's shift wow so you guys have had uh let's shift gears cause you guys you've had some gears cause you guys you've had some gears cause you guys you've had some leadership transitions leadership transitions leadership transitions and you've been been through it so kind and you've been been through it so kind and you've been been through it so kind of walk us through of walk us through of walk us through what was that like and what did you what was that like and what did you what was that like and what did you learn learn learn if this ever happens again or what if this ever happens again or what if this ever happens again or what advice would you give somebody who's advice would you give somebody who's advice would you give somebody who's going through a leadership going through a leadership going through a leadership transition sure so transition sure so transition sure so um when i first started we were on our um when i first started we were on our um when i first started we were on our church's second pastor church's second pastor church's second pastor and so we had him for a while and he and so we had him for a while and he and so we had him for a while and he retired and we hired another pastor retired and we hired another pastor retired and we hired another pastor and at that point it was sort of like and at that point it was sort of like and at that point it was sort of like our church our church our church i was like oh it's kind of like i work

i was like oh it's kind of like i work i was like oh it's kind of like i work for a second church for a second church for a second church so it's like my office stayed in the so it's like my office stayed in the so it's like my office stayed in the same building but over time our church same building but over time our church same building but over time our church kind of became different and i was like kind of became different and i was like kind of became different and i was like well well well if i think of this as more of like my if i think of this as more of like my if i think of this as more of like my second church that i've worked for it's second church that i've worked for it's second church that i've worked for it's a lot easier than trying to be like well a lot easier than trying to be like well a lot easier than trying to be like well it's not exactly like it used to be it's not exactly like it used to be it's not exactly like it used to be and you have to let go of what you used and you have to let go of what you used and you have to let go of what you used to be and just look to the future um to be and just look to the future um to be and just look to the future um so then last year right so then last year right so then last year right right around april 1st we had another right around april 1st we had another right around april 1st we had another pastor transition and so now i'm working pastor transition and so now i'm working pastor transition and so now i'm working for the third for the third for the third lead pastor oh oh oh oh all summer long lead pastor oh oh oh oh all summer long lead pastor oh oh oh oh all summer long we had a we had a we had a interim pastor and she is somebody who's interim pastor and she is somebody who's interim pastor and she is somebody who's she uh heads back-to-back ministries she uh heads back-to-back ministries she uh heads back-to-back ministries which is an orphan care ministry which is an orphan care ministry which is an orphan care ministry and so she was a guest speaker a lot and and so she was a guest speaker a lot and and so she was a guest speaker a lot and so she was our interim pastor so she was our interim pastor so she was our interim pastor and then we hired a full-time pastor in and then we hired a full-time pastor in and then we hired a full-time pastor in october and so that's been going really october and so that's been going really october and so that's been going really well well well um we are looking toward revamping um we are looking toward revamping um we are looking toward revamping kind of our mission and vision kind of our mission and vision kind of our mission and vision statements a little bit just looking to the future i think not just looking to the future i think not looking to the past at what you used to looking to the past at what you used to looking to the past at what you used to do is really important and just being do is really important and just being do is really important and just being flexible flexible flexible when you said something that you can't when you said something that you can't when you said something that you can't take this take this take this personally because when you have anytime personally because when you have anytime personally because when you have anytime you have a leadership change you have a leadership change you have a leadership change you're gonna have churn right some you're gonna have churn right some you're gonna have churn right some people are gonna leave they're gonna be people are gonna leave they're gonna be people are gonna leave they're gonna be maybe even angry uh maybe even angry uh maybe even angry uh you know and you just have to take all

you know and you just have to take all you know and you just have to take all that in and just let it that in and just let it that in and just let it come in one ear not the other because come in one ear not the other because come in one ear not the other because don't take it personally is that what don't take it personally is that what don't take it personally is that what you learned you learned you learned yes it it's important like yes it it's important like yes it it's important like i'm a feeler so i often tell myself you i'm a feeler so i often tell myself you i'm a feeler so i often tell myself you know it's just business know it's just business know it's just business and that really helps me a lot just to and that really helps me a lot just to and that really helps me a lot just to say you know what it's not really about say you know what it's not really about say you know what it's not really about me it's really about where the church is me it's really about where the church is me it's really about where the church is going going going so just taking myself out of it and so just taking myself out of it and so just taking myself out of it and really working together at the staff really working together at the staff really working together at the staff as a team you know we're on this mission as a team you know we're on this mission as a team you know we're on this mission together so that's together so that's together so that's just keeping the main thing the main just keeping the main thing the main just keeping the main thing the main thing also i always think like i have my thing also i always think like i have my thing also i always think like i have my own personal mission like own personal mission like own personal mission like my i remember going here at this church my i remember going here at this church my i remember going here at this church and really getting connected at one and really getting connected at one and really getting connected at one point point point you know there was a young adult you know there was a young adult you know there was a young adult ministry i was a big part of that i was ministry i was a big part of that i was ministry i was a big part of that i was leading groups leading groups leading groups and i think about a lot like how did i and i think about a lot like how did i and i think about a lot like how did i get connected in that group get connected in that group get connected in that group and my goal is to help other people get and my goal is to help other people get and my goal is to help other people get connected in the same way that i did connected in the same way that i did connected in the same way that i did so that's like my personal mission and so that's like my personal mission and so that's like my personal mission and if you keep if you keep if you keep that then it's not you're not going to that then it's not you're not going to that then it's not you're not going to be affected by other things around you be affected by other things around you be affected by other things around you changing so much changing so much changing so much interesting yeah yeah that's that's a interesting yeah yeah that's that's a interesting yeah yeah that's that's a real i mean real i mean real i mean something that i think we maybe lose something that i think we maybe lose something that i think we maybe lose sight of um is having your own personal sight of um is having your own personal sight of um is having your own personal goals for what you want to achieve and goals for what you want to achieve and goals for what you want to achieve and they have to be in balance to what they have to be in balance to what they have to be in balance to what leadership wants to do it's not like you leadership wants to do it's not like you leadership wants to do it's not like you are going to go in opposition to them are going to go in opposition to them are going to go in opposition to them but i i think uh to your point you but i i think uh to your point you but i i think uh to your point you you've uh you've uh you've uh and you've done it a couple times now and you've done it a couple times now and you've done it a couple times now you've had to kind of

you've had to kind of you've had to kind of have a mindset shift of okay now this is have a mindset shift of okay now this is have a mindset shift of okay now this is the direction that leadership wants to the direction that leadership wants to the direction that leadership wants to go go go all right we're gonna fine-tune all right we're gonna fine-tune all right we're gonna fine-tune everything to follow in those everything to follow in those everything to follow in those footsteps and i think when you're in footsteps and i think when you're in footsteps and i think when you're in that if you're in that harmony that if you're in that harmony that if you're in that harmony you find a good rhythm yeah exactly yeah you find a good rhythm yeah exactly yeah you find a good rhythm yeah exactly yeah christy so you're you're talking about christy so you're you're talking about christy so you're you're talking about you know really leading your team you know really leading your team you know really leading your team leading your department to really help leading your department to really help leading your department to really help the church fulfill its overarching the church fulfill its overarching the church fulfill its overarching mission mission mission you're obviously serving a lot of you're obviously serving a lot of you're obviously serving a lot of different people in a lot of different different people in a lot of different different people in a lot of different ministries within the context of the ministries within the context of the ministries within the context of the church church church as a leader of your department and of as a leader of your department and of as a leader of your department and of your team how do you define wins what your team how do you define wins what your team how do you define wins what are the things that you would celebrate are the things that you would celebrate are the things that you would celebrate with your team as your with your team as your with your team as your weekend week out quarter in quarter out weekend week out quarter in quarter out weekend week out quarter in quarter out season in season out what are the things season in season out what are the things season in season out what are the things that you would look to and go you know that you would look to and go you know that you would look to and go you know we we we we win here when we accomplish these we win here when we accomplish these we win here when we accomplish these things what are what are some of the things what are what are some of the things what are what are some of the ways that you would define that for your ways that you would define that for your ways that you would define that for your team team team sure so um you know there are certain sure so um you know there are certain sure so um you know there are certain things that we have control over things that we have control over things that we have control over so we have control over like how so we have control over like how so we have control over like how how much we can get the word out about how much we can get the word out about how much we can get the word out about certain things we don't have control certain things we don't have control certain things we don't have control always over if the event is perfect always over if the event is perfect always over if the event is perfect um so like we celebrate things for example we have we celebrate things for example we have a a a big fundraiser here every year it's big fundraiser here every year it's big fundraiser here every year it's called the hunger walk and it supports called the hunger walk and it supports called the hunger walk and it supports our food pantry we have the second our food pantry we have the second our food pantry we have the second largest food pantry in the area it's largest food pantry in the area it's largest food pantry in the area it's it's it's huge it's got its own building it's it's huge it's got its own building it's it's huge it's got its own building so so so we promote that among our staff and or we promote that among our staff and or we promote that among our staff and or among our congregation among our congregation among our congregation and um we raise like sixty thousand and um we raise like sixty thousand and um we raise like sixty thousand dollars a year with that

dollars a year with that dollars a year with that and i last year was a virtual walk and i last year was a virtual walk and i last year was a virtual walk and so people couldn't actually go in and so people couldn't actually go in and so people couldn't actually go in person and walk downtown person and walk downtown person and walk downtown and we still raised we almost reached and we still raised we almost reached and we still raised we almost reached our goal and that's like a win for us our goal and that's like a win for us our goal and that's like a win for us we're like ah we're like ah we're like ah yes you know what we did was worthwhile yes you know what we did was worthwhile yes you know what we did was worthwhile and it made this important and it made this important and it made this important um i think you know i look at numbers um i think you know i look at numbers um i think you know i look at numbers too just seeing like how many people too just seeing like how many people too just seeing like how many people have uh watched our youtube video i love have uh watched our youtube video i love have uh watched our youtube video i love looking looking looking at that i know it shouldn't define us at that i know it shouldn't define us at that i know it shouldn't define us but you know but you know but you know sharing that with my team like hey this sharing that with my team like hey this sharing that with my team like hey this was you know this is a good thing and was you know this is a good thing and was you know this is a good thing and if we have a social media post it did if we have a social media post it did if we have a social media post it did really well we celebrate that really well we celebrate that really well we celebrate that um those feel like wins um those feel like wins um those feel like wins yeah that's important dude i remember yeah that's important dude i remember yeah that's important dude i remember doing that it's important to celebrate doing that it's important to celebrate doing that it's important to celebrate that stuff and take a that stuff and take a that stuff and take a take a moment because it just becomes take a moment because it just becomes take a moment because it just becomes it comes becomes a blur you know when it comes becomes a blur you know when it comes becomes a blur you know when you go through these seasons and you go through these seasons and you go through these seasons and it's like it never stops i'm sure like it's like it never stops i'm sure like it's like it never stops i'm sure like when you you started out when you you started out when you you started out it wasn't as intense at least that was it wasn't as intense at least that was it wasn't as intense at least that was it wasn't as intended as time gone went it wasn't as intended as time gone went it wasn't as intended as time gone went on and on and on and we had bigger ideas and bigger dreams it we had bigger ideas and bigger dreams it we had bigger ideas and bigger dreams it just became more and more intense i just became more and more intense i just became more and more intense i think it's important to take think it's important to take think it's important to take time out and and celebrate those wins time out and and celebrate those wins time out and and celebrate those wins with your team and with your team and with your team and yeah and i'm not always the best at that yeah and i'm not always the best at that yeah and i'm not always the best at that but you know we've had some projects but you know we've had some projects but you know we've had some projects that we finish up that we finish up that we finish up like um annual report or a year in like um annual report or a year in like um annual report or a year in giving giving giving and we just all go out afterwards and and we just all go out afterwards and and we just all go out afterwards and just say you know this was great we got just say you know this was great we got just say you know this was great we got we we we accomplished our goal we did our part accomplished our goal we did our part accomplished our goal we did our part and now it's in somebody else's hands to and now it's in somebody else's hands to and now it's in somebody else's hands to finish it off finish it off finish it off yeah now when it comes to yeah now when it comes to yeah now when it comes to uh how your guys are are growing

uh how your guys are are growing uh how your guys are are growing reaching new people reaching new people reaching new people and engaging new people you know you and engaging new people you know you and engaging new people you know you mentioned this earlier in your mentioned this earlier in your mentioned this earlier in your 20-year career um you've had to make 20-year career um you've had to make 20-year career um you've had to make some shifts right it was all the some shifts right it was all the some shifts right it was all the traditional ways of you know that we traditional ways of you know that we traditional ways of you know that we used to advertise i remember running used to advertise i remember running used to advertise i remember running print ads and print ads and print ads and you know billboards and all the you know billboards and all the you know billboards and all the newsletters and then newsletters and then newsletters and then mailers all that kind of stuff so that's mailers all that kind of stuff so that's mailers all that kind of stuff so that's all that's all shifted all that's all shifted all that's all shifted what are some of the things that you're what are some of the things that you're what are some of the things that you're doing these days that are doing these days that are doing these days that are helping the vineyard grow and win and helping the vineyard grow and win and helping the vineyard grow and win and what's that look like because what's that look like because what's that look like because i know you guys are using uh rock as i know you guys are using uh rock as i know you guys are using uh rock as well as your church management system well as your church management system well as your church management system sure well when i first started we were i sure well when i first started we were i sure well when i first started we were i was the yellow pages ad coordinator as was the yellow pages ad coordinator as was the yellow pages ad coordinator as well well well so um all the money we used to spend on so um all the money we used to spend on so um all the money we used to spend on yellow pages it's like yellow pages it's like yellow pages it's like shifted over to viewers to online and shifted over to viewers to online and shifted over to viewers to online and there's just a really nice thing about there's just a really nice thing about there's just a really nice thing about online advertising you can just see like online advertising you can just see like online advertising you can just see like um you can see numbers behind what um you can see numbers behind what um you can see numbers behind what you've done so if somebody read the you've done so if somebody read the you've done so if somebody read the yellow pages you would never know if yellow pages you would never know if yellow pages you would never know if they actually called you there was no they actually called you there was no they actually called you there was no instant results sorry sorry i have to instant results sorry sorry i have to instant results sorry sorry i have to pause i have to pause for just a second pause i have to pause for just a second pause i have to pause for just a second because because because there are a lot of people that are there are a lot of people that are there are a lot of people that are listening to this podcast listening to this podcast listening to this podcast who don't even know what yellow pages who don't even know what yellow pages who don't even know what yellow pages are are are i'm sorry i'm sorry and i and i can i'm sorry i'm sorry and i and i can i'm sorry i'm sorry and i and i can remember remember remember the first church that i was on staff of the first church that i was on staff of the first church that i was on staff of managing the yellow pages managing the yellow pages managing the yellow pages ads was one of the first things that i ads was one of the first things that i ads was one of the first things that i had to do and i was had to do and i was had to do and i was blown away by how stinking expensive blown away by how stinking expensive blown away by how stinking expensive they were they were they were so uh just to clarify for those who so uh just to clarify for those who so uh just to clarify for those who don't know what yellow pages are there don't know what yellow pages are there don't know what yellow pages are there used to be used to be used to be way back in the old days these great big

way back in the old days these great big way back in the old days these great big fat fat fat books catalogs made of yellow paper books catalogs made of yellow paper books catalogs made of yellow paper that had yeah it's like a giant phone that had yeah it's like a giant phone that had yeah it's like a giant phone book book book with business listings in them and as a with business listings in them and as a with business listings in them and as a church church church i'm sure you did the same thing i'm sure i'm sure you did the same thing i'm sure i'm sure you did the same thing i'm sure both of you had to do this both of you had to do this both of you had to do this we would create ads and uh pay we would create ads and uh pay we would create ads and uh pay the yellow pages people to print our ads the yellow pages people to print our ads the yellow pages people to print our ads in these giant books and and it wasn't in these giant books and and it wasn't in these giant books and and it wasn't how stressful it was to put together an how stressful it was to put together an how stressful it was to put together an ad that you know is going to run for 12 ad that you know is going to run for 12 ad that you know is going to run for 12 months months months so you couldn't put service times in so you couldn't put service times in so you couldn't put service times in because what happens if they change in a because what happens if they change in a because what happens if they change in a month month month oh my goodness or service times oh my goodness or service times oh my goodness or service times yeah and it and it's and it's black yeah and it and it's and it's black yeah and it and it's and it's black gray ink on yellow paper that's the gray ink on yellow paper that's the gray ink on yellow paper that's the worst part too because if you've got any worst part too because if you've got any worst part too because if you've got any visual visual visual uh design background and you want the ad uh design background and you want the ad uh design background and you want the ad to look good to look good to look good you always have to imagine that this ad you always have to imagine that this ad you always have to imagine that this ad is going to be printed is going to be printed is going to be printed on yellow paper so anyway sorry sorry on yellow paper so anyway sorry sorry on yellow paper so anyway sorry sorry sorry i interrupted you there i just sorry i interrupted you there i just sorry i interrupted you there i just wanted to make sure that wanted to make sure that wanted to make sure that you know we mentioned yellow pages that you know we mentioned yellow pages that you know we mentioned yellow pages that people all know and understand what people all know and understand what people all know and understand what yellow pages are so yellow pages are so yellow pages are so you can continue on sorry designer who's you can continue on sorry designer who's you can continue on sorry designer who's like 15 years younger than me and so like 15 years younger than me and so like 15 years younger than me and so we're always asking him hey do you know we're always asking him hey do you know we're always asking him hey do you know what this what this what this is and he's like no no then we have to is and he's like no no then we have to is and he's like no no then we have to explain it explain it explain it we're like okay we can't we can't use we're like okay we can't we can't use we're like okay we can't we can't use that references tools so we were doing that references tools so we were doing that references tools so we were doing yellow pages and we were doing yellow pages and we were doing yellow pages and we were doing cincinnati enquirer ads things in the cincinnati enquirer ads things in the cincinnati enquirer ads things in the newspaper newspaper newspaper things in the local local newspaper

things in the local local newspaper things in the local local newspaper um and then you know when online came um and then you know when online came um and then you know when online came around around around we've always had a web presence okay we we've always had a web presence okay we we've always had a web presence okay we were pretty early in having a web were pretty early in having a web were pretty early in having a web presence presence presence um so people just you know googling what um so people just you know googling what um so people just you know googling what where are you and i find that i do this where are you and i find that i do this where are you and i find that i do this too like i don't go anywhere unless i too like i don't go anywhere unless i too like i don't go anywhere unless i look them up online look them up online look them up online yeah so just making sure your web yeah so just making sure your web yeah so just making sure your web presence is something that you'd want to presence is something that you'd want to presence is something that you'd want to run across if you're going to purchase run across if you're going to purchase run across if you're going to purchase your product or visit your church or your product or visit your church or your product or visit your church or whatever whatever whatever that's uh highly important um that's uh highly important um that's uh highly important um so that's a little bit of what's changed so that's a little bit of what's changed so that's a little bit of what's changed is is is obviously it's all gone from print to obviously it's all gone from print to obviously it's all gone from print to all online and all online and all online and the results are more instant so what i the results are more instant so what i the results are more instant so what i love about like when we love about like when we love about like when we run christmas and easter facebook ads run christmas and easter facebook ads run christmas and easter facebook ads with missional marketing we can see with missional marketing we can see with missional marketing we can see exactly what photo exactly what photo exactly what photo did the best and we're like nobody's did the best and we're like nobody's did the best and we're like nobody's really caring about our easter brand really caring about our easter brand really caring about our easter brand but they really care about this uh image but they really care about this uh image but they really care about this uh image of the stage with the lights because of the stage with the lights because of the stage with the lights because that's what people want to know they that's what people want to know they that's what people want to know they want to know want to know want to know what they're going to experience and if what they're going to experience and if what they're going to experience and if they can picture themselves they can picture themselves they can picture themselves in your service and those are the ads in your service and those are the ads in your service and those are the ads that do the best for us that do the best for us that do the best for us hey bart blair here i'm the producer of hey bart blair here i'm the producer of hey bart blair here i'm the producer of missional marketing's church growth missional marketing's church growth missional marketing's church growth interviews podcast thanks so much for interviews podcast thanks so much for interviews podcast thanks so much for tuning in tuning in tuning in admissional marketing we're passionate admissional marketing we're passionate admissional marketing we're passionate about helping churches reach more people about helping churches reach more people about helping churches reach more people for jesus online for jesus online for jesus online and one of the ways that we do that is and one of the ways that we do that is and one of the ways that we do that is by helping churches acquire more new by helping churches acquire more new by helping churches acquire more new visitors to their website visitors to their website visitors to their website utilizing the google ad grant google

utilizing the google ad grant google utilizing the google ad grant google offers qualifying non-profits including offers qualifying non-profits including offers qualifying non-profits including churches churches churches up to ten thousand dollars a month in up to ten thousand dollars a month in up to ten thousand dollars a month in advertising that means that you advertising that means that you advertising that means that you as a church could be using google as one as a church could be using google as one as a church could be using google as one of your primary digital outreach of your primary digital outreach of your primary digital outreach strategies strategies strategies to communicate the gospel and reach more to communicate the gospel and reach more to communicate the gospel and reach more people in your community people in your community people in your community if you'd like to learn more visit our if you'd like to learn more visit our if you'd like to learn more visit our website admissionalmarketing.com website admissionalmarketing.com website admissionalmarketing.com and click the link at the top of the and click the link at the top of the and click the link at the top of the page that says google grants we'd love page that says google grants we'd love page that says google grants we'd love an opportunity to partner with you an opportunity to partner with you an opportunity to partner with you in your mission to build god's kingdom in your mission to build god's kingdom in your mission to build god's kingdom here on earth well thanks again for here on earth well thanks again for here on earth well thanks again for listening to our podcast listening to our podcast listening to our podcast and now back to the show yeah you've and now back to the show yeah you've and now back to the show yeah you've learned a lot over the years and it's learned a lot over the years and it's learned a lot over the years and it's been been been it's been fun to kind of work with you it's been fun to kind of work with you it's been fun to kind of work with you guys because guys because guys because you're the you get it and you are a you're the you get it and you are a you're the you get it and you are a creative church creative church creative church and it's been it's been neat to see that and it's been it's been neat to see that and it's been it's been neat to see that that happen that happen that happen you know um as you so you get because you know um as you so you get because you know um as you so you get because you guys you got a good handle on you guys you got a good handle on you guys you got a good handle on on seo we often talk about that you got on seo we often talk about that you got on seo we often talk about that you got a good handle on using social platforms a good handle on using social platforms a good handle on using social platforms you know uh is that something that like you know uh is that something that like you know uh is that something that like what kind of advice would you give to a what kind of advice would you give to a what kind of advice would you give to a church that's been church that's been church that's been tinkering in fact i was just on a call tinkering in fact i was just on a call tinkering in fact i was just on a call with the church that said no we don't with the church that said no we don't with the church that said no we don't really do youtube really do youtube really do youtube i'm going why you know different i'm going why you know different i'm going why you know different conversation but conversation but conversation but explain some of the you know you you explain some of the you know you you explain some of the you know you you kind of explain a little bit of reasons kind of explain a little bit of reasons kind of explain a little bit of reasons like it's fun to see that stuff but like it's fun to see that stuff but like it's fun to see that stuff but how have you seen that grow the church how have you seen that grow the church how have you seen that grow the church yeah so we could have send out like 50 yeah so we could have send out like 50 yeah so we could have send out like 50 000 postcards in the past and not know 000 postcards in the past and not know 000 postcards in the past and not know like what what do you have to offer that like what what do you have to offer that like what what do you have to offer that somebody can bring their postcard somebody can bring their postcard somebody can bring their postcard in and turn it in what for a free cookie in and turn it in what for a free cookie in and turn it in what for a free cookie or something you know like or something you know like or something you know like that's always hard to track and we've

that's always hard to track and we've that's always hard to track and we've gone over that i've talked about that gone over that i've talked about that gone over that i've talked about that with you like how do you track a with you like how do you track a with you like how do you track a postcard postcard postcard um so well let me talk about youtube for um so well let me talk about youtube for um so well let me talk about youtube for a second a second a second so for like two years youtube was on my so for like two years youtube was on my so for like two years youtube was on my list like list like list like make our youtube channel better so when make our youtube channel better so when make our youtube channel better so when everything shut down last year we had a everything shut down last year we had a everything shut down last year we had a month month month where all of our um videos were watched where all of our um videos were watched where all of our um videos were watched so much we had like a huge overage bill so much we had like a huge overage bill so much we had like a huge overage bill with our streaming provider with our streaming provider with our streaming provider and i was like man we really need to be and i was like man we really need to be and i was like man we really need to be on youtube more we always have we've had on youtube more we always have we've had on youtube more we always have we've had our videos on youtube but just like we our videos on youtube but just like we our videos on youtube but just like we just just just uploaded them and let it go we didn't uploaded them and let it go we didn't uploaded them and let it go we didn't really concentrate on the channel really concentrate on the channel really concentrate on the channel so i would go on to life church so i would go on to life church so i would go on to life church on their youtube channel i would go into on their youtube channel i would go into on their youtube channel i would go into north point church on their youtube north point church on their youtube north point church on their youtube channel and see how they like channel and see how they like channel and see how they like organized it and it was just like oh i organized it and it was just like oh i organized it and it was just like oh i can rearrange stuff on my youtube can rearrange stuff on my youtube can rearrange stuff on my youtube channel channel channel i can have playlists and when i set up i can have playlists and when i set up i can have playlists and when i set up for my for my for my 11 year old i was like oh i can 11 year old i was like oh i can 11 year old i was like oh i can set up different logins so i um set up different logins so i um set up different logins so i um i changed on the back end how we can log i changed on the back end how we can log i changed on the back end how we can log in as a church so now we have like in as a church so now we have like in as a church so now we have like different staff who can go in and different staff who can go in and different staff who can go in and see different things that's huge for us see different things that's huge for us see different things that's huge for us um i was i was watching your video that um i was i was watching your video that um i was i was watching your video that you put out you put out you put out um it was like six tips on um it was like six tips on um it was like six tips on i can't remember how to improve your i can't remember how to improve your i can't remember how to improve your youtube presence youtube presence youtube presence art did that yep yeah yeah it was really art did that yep yeah yeah it was really art did that yep yeah yeah it was really good and there's some stuff on there good and there's some stuff on there good and there's some stuff on there that i have that i have that i have started because i watch aussie days you started because i watch aussie days you started because i watch aussie days you ever heard of him

ever heard of him ever heard of him and i think he used to work for north and i think he used to work for north and i think he used to work for north point and point and point and just talking about re-titling your just talking about re-titling your just talking about re-titling your pastor's sermons i was like pastor's sermons i was like pastor's sermons i was like i can do that yes of course i can do i can do that yes of course i can do i can do that yes of course i can do that so in the last that so in the last that so in the last you know six months i've started you know six months i've started you know six months i've started re-titling my pastor's sermons um re-titling my pastor's sermons um re-titling my pastor's sermons um we were actually the word rich we were we were actually the word rich we were we were actually the word rich we were just talking we were just talking about just talking we were just talking about just talking we were just talking about aussie dave in a in a team meeting a aussie dave in a in a team meeting a aussie dave in a in a team meeting a couple of days ago couple of days ago couple of days ago i've been trying to get him to come on i've been trying to get him to come on i've been trying to get him to come on our podcast but he's not responding to our podcast but he's not responding to our podcast but he's not responding to my request so aussie day he's another my request so aussie day he's another my request so aussie day he's another person person person yeah if you happen to be listening to yeah if you happen to be listening to yeah if you happen to be listening to this we'd love to have you on this we'd love to have you on this we'd love to have you on if anybody's listening to this and they if anybody's listening to this and they if anybody's listening to this and they know ozzy dave pass my know ozzy dave pass my know ozzy dave pass my email address along we'd love to have email address along we'd love to have email address along we'd love to have one yeah he's fantastic uh one yeah he's fantastic uh one yeah he's fantastic uh i will i will link to aussie dave's i will i will link to aussie dave's i will i will link to aussie dave's channel channel channel in the in the show notes for this in the in the show notes for this in the in the show notes for this podcast because he does have some really podcast because he does have some really podcast because he does have some really great stuff great stuff great stuff and he's been focusing a lot on youtube and he's been focusing a lot on youtube and he's been focusing a lot on youtube with some of the content he's creating with some of the content he's creating with some of the content he's creating lately lately lately i think he's just copying mine but you i think he's just copying mine but you i think he's just copying mine but you know i'll know i'll know i'll i'm just kidding i don't think he's i'm just kidding i don't think he's i'm just kidding i don't think he's doing that he's a pretty smart guy doing that he's a pretty smart guy doing that he's a pretty smart guy yeah he is he makes me anxious when i yeah he is he makes me anxious when i yeah he is he makes me anxious when i listen to him too of all the things that listen to him too of all the things that listen to him too of all the things that he does i'm like he does i'm like he does i'm like i'm not doing that i'm not doing that i i'm not doing that i'm not doing that i i'm not doing that i'm not doing that i should be doing that so should be doing that so should be doing that so um anyway that your video that you put um anyway that your video that you put um anyway that your video that you put out was just fantastic on that so out was just fantastic on that so out was just fantastic on that so growing your youtube channel growing your youtube channel growing your youtube channel uh just put some effort to it like don't uh just put some effort to it like don't uh just put some effort to it like don't put it on the shelf like i did for two put it on the shelf like i did for two put it on the shelf like i did for two years like years like years like you can learn from other people who are you can learn from other people who are you can learn from other people who are doing youtube doing youtube doing youtube um but once i got it i was like creating um but once i got it i was like creating um but once i got it i was like creating thumbnails and i was like oh this is so thumbnails and i was like oh this is so thumbnails and i was like oh this is so much much much fun i just had fun with it and we fun i just had fun with it and we fun i just had fun with it and we started a children's youtube channel started a children's youtube channel started a children's youtube channel i started a whole other channel for a i started a whole other channel for a i started a whole other channel for a children's ministry made fun thumbnails children's ministry made fun thumbnails children's ministry made fun thumbnails um you know you don't want to have the

um you know you don't want to have the um you know you don't want to have the default thumbnail of somebody default thumbnail of somebody default thumbnail of somebody um looking weird so really putting some um looking weird so really putting some um looking weird so really putting some effort toward effort toward effort toward what your thumbnails look like uh what what your thumbnails look like uh what what your thumbnails look like uh what was your other question on there was was your other question on there was was your other question on there was another side of your question jason another side of your question jason another side of your question jason well so uh you've had to convince well so uh you've had to convince well so uh you've had to convince leadership leadership leadership hey we need to go into space i don't hey we need to go into space i don't hey we need to go into space i don't know if that was hard or not so i'd love know if that was hard or not so i'd love know if that was hard or not so i'd love to hear your thoughts on how hard or how to hear your thoughts on how hard or how to hear your thoughts on how hard or how difficult was it to difficult was it to difficult was it to convince leadership that you should put convince leadership that you should put convince leadership that you should put resources resources resources not only your time but also money behind not only your time but also money behind not only your time but also money behind moving in moving in moving in into a digital space what was that like into a digital space what was that like into a digital space what was that like for you for you for you um yeah so we used to do postcards and um yeah so we used to do postcards and um yeah so we used to do postcards and then we would like not do them and then then we would like not do them and then then we would like not do them and then they would cycle back up like the they would cycle back up like the they would cycle back up like the conversation would happen again like conversation would happen again like conversation would happen again like should we do postcards again i'll be should we do postcards again i'll be should we do postcards again i'll be like like like uh i'll do postcards but i don't think uh i'll do postcards but i don't think uh i'll do postcards but i don't think we should do them we should do them we should do them and so there was this transition phase and so there was this transition phase and so there was this transition phase of like of like of like four or five years of us like doing one four or five years of us like doing one four or five years of us like doing one and then the next easter we wouldn't do and then the next easter we wouldn't do and then the next easter we wouldn't do one and then we would do one one and then we would do one one and then we would do one uh postcards are not the worst thing uh postcards are not the worst thing uh postcards are not the worst thing it's just that you need to focus it's just that you need to focus it's just that you need to focus somewhere somewhere somewhere so um so um so um i think just being able to show results i think just being able to show results i think just being able to show results and saying and saying and saying these are the people who are finding us these are the people who are finding us these are the people who are finding us through search and through search and through search and that's really key so i've put together a that's really key so i've put together a that's really key so i've put together a couple of presentations and explained it couple of presentations and explained it couple of presentations and explained it and once they see the why behind it it's and once they see the why behind it it's and once they see the why behind it it's a pretty easy sell um so always use numbers so if you're a um so always use numbers so if you're a person working at a church and you're person working at a church and you're person working at a church and you're like i think we should do this like i think we should do this like i think we should do this try to get some numbers behind what try to get some numbers behind what try to get some numbers behind what you're saying um

you're saying um you're saying um you can you can go into your google you can you can go into your google you can you can go into your google analytics account and just see like analytics account and just see like analytics account and just see like uh how many people are new visitors who uh how many people are new visitors who uh how many people are new visitors who are hitting your church i've are hitting your church i've are hitting your church i've talked to chuck you know on your team a talked to chuck you know on your team a talked to chuck you know on your team a lot about new visitors and returning lot about new visitors and returning lot about new visitors and returning visitors visitors visitors and we just have a lot i think it's like and we just have a lot i think it's like and we just have a lot i think it's like sixty percent of people are new visitors sixty percent of people are new visitors sixty percent of people are new visitors and forty percent are returning so it and forty percent are returning so it and forty percent are returning so it helps us helps us helps us um focus our website strategy toward um focus our website strategy toward um focus our website strategy toward just new people just new people just new people that's our main audience yeah that's our main audience yeah that's our main audience yeah wow so you've kind of mentioned some wow so you've kind of mentioned some wow so you've kind of mentioned some people that you're people that you're people that you're you're uh you're tuning into i think you're uh you're tuning into i think you're uh you're tuning into i think this is really important because i think this is really important because i think this is really important because i think if you're if you're kind of new to this if you're if you're kind of new to this if you're if you're kind of new to this role and you're new to role and you're new to role and you're new to the the church communications it's a the the church communications it's a the the church communications it's a it's a different animal like you know it's a different animal like you know it's a different animal like you know you're it's a different animal from like you're it's a different animal from like you're it's a different animal from like retail and corporate retail and corporate retail and corporate uh communications so you've mentioned uh communications so you've mentioned uh communications so you've mentioned aussie dave aussie dave aussie dave you also go to our art you think you you also go to our art you think you you also go to our art you think you kind of tuned in our podcasts and stuff kind of tuned in our podcasts and stuff kind of tuned in our podcasts and stuff that we that we that we do where else do you find inspiration do where else do you find inspiration do where else do you find inspiration and and who you know you mentioned a and and who you know you mentioned a and and who you know you mentioned a couple of churches uh couple of churches uh couple of churches uh because i think this is a copycat world because i think this is a copycat world because i think this is a copycat world it's like nothing nothing new other side it's like nothing nothing new other side it's like nothing nothing new other side um you know plagiarism isn't a big deal um you know plagiarism isn't a big deal um you know plagiarism isn't a big deal when you're coming to the church world when you're coming to the church world when you're coming to the church world because because because you want to learn and then just kind of you want to learn and then just kind of you want to learn and then just kind of reproduce what's what people are doing reproduce what's what people are doing reproduce what's what people are doing that's that's that's successful so what are some areas that successful so what are some areas that successful so what are some areas that are who are you following and are who are you following and are who are you following and what are you reading and yeah i i love what are you reading and yeah i i love what are you reading and yeah i i love podcasts i listen to them all the time podcasts i listen to them all the time podcasts i listen to them all the time i'll take my dog out for an hour long i'll take my dog out for an hour long i'll take my dog out for an hour long walk and just listen to podcasts while walk and just listen to podcasts while walk and just listen to podcasts while i'm walking i'm walking i'm walking so that's my time to listen um so that's my time to listen um so that's my time to listen um [Music] [Music] [Music] i listen to church pulse weekly that's

i listen to church pulse weekly that's i listen to church pulse weekly that's the carrie new hoff and the barna the carrie new hoff and the barna the carrie new hoff and the barna collaboration i love that one collaboration i love that one collaboration i love that one just kind of keeps me like weekly just kind of keeps me like weekly just kind of keeps me like weekly updated um updated um updated um at the table with patrick lencioni and at the table with patrick lencioni and at the table with patrick lencioni and he also did something recently with he also did something recently with he also did something recently with working genius that i think is fantastic working genius that i think is fantastic working genius that i think is fantastic um let's see i wrote down a couple more um let's see i wrote down a couple more um let's see i wrote down a couple more um um um there's one called fomo sapiens the guy there's one called fomo sapiens the guy there's one called fomo sapiens the guy who invented the word who invented the word who invented the word fomo i'll sometimes listen to him uh fomo i'll sometimes listen to him uh fomo i'll sometimes listen to him uh accidental creative accidental creative accidental creative he's a cincinnati-based guy and uh lead he's a cincinnati-based guy and uh lead he's a cincinnati-based guy and uh lead you know just kind of a you know just kind of a you know just kind of a expert on how to lead a creative team so expert on how to lead a creative team so expert on how to lead a creative team so i like him a lot i like him a lot i like him a lot i listen to annie downs she's got a good i listen to annie downs she's got a good i listen to annie downs she's got a good podcast i like listening to danielle podcast i like listening to danielle podcast i like listening to danielle strickland strickland strickland just you know i listen to some other just you know i listen to some other just you know i listen to some other women out there because women out there because women out there because you can find a lot of guys so i try to you can find a lot of guys so i try to you can find a lot of guys so i try to make an effort to listen to some women make an effort to listen to some women make an effort to listen to some women um there's there's one it's from um there's there's one it's from um there's there's one it's from the uk it's called unbelievable it's a the uk it's called unbelievable it's a the uk it's called unbelievable it's a apologetics podcast apologetics podcast apologetics podcast and they'll do like a debate between an and they'll do like a debate between an and they'll do like a debate between an atheist and a christian atheist and a christian atheist and a christian and i'll listen to select ones of those and i'll listen to select ones of those and i'll listen to select ones of those because i'm just really interested on because i'm just really interested on because i'm just really interested on why would somebody not believe why would somebody not believe why would somebody not believe the christian message like what is the christian message like what is the christian message like what is holding them back and i just want to holding them back and i just want to holding them back and i just want to know this know this know this and that got me into another one there's and that got me into another one there's and that got me into another one there's a podcast called the side b a podcast called the side b a podcast called the side b podcast and that's from the cs lewis podcast and that's from the cs lewis podcast and that's from the cs lewis institute institute institute and she does an in-depth interview with and she does an in-depth interview with and she does an in-depth interview with somebody who used to be an atheist somebody who used to be an atheist somebody who used to be an atheist and how they became a christian and and how they became a christian and and how they became a christian and that's just putting me in somebody that's just putting me in somebody that's just putting me in somebody else's shoes else's shoes else's shoes you know like i've been a christian a you know like i've been a christian a you know like i've been a christian a long time and i just want to know like long time and i just want to know like long time and i just want to know like how did somebody come to find god and

how did somebody come to find god and how did somebody come to find god and that's that's important for my role i that's that's important for my role i that's that's important for my role i think think think so those are that's i mean i'm i listen so those are that's i mean i'm i listen so those are that's i mean i'm i listen to a lot i don't listen to them all to a lot i don't listen to them all to a lot i don't listen to them all weekly weekly weekly um well i think it's super important i um well i think it's super important i um well i think it's super important i mean when because you're you're mean when because you're you're mean when because you're you're you're building content and you're you're building content and you're you're building content and you're creating creating creating messages and to be able to put yourself messages and to be able to put yourself messages and to be able to put yourself into somebody else's shoes i think into somebody else's shoes i think into somebody else's shoes i think as much as you can is really important as much as you can is really important as much as you can is really important because that's because that's because that's you you can't just christianize you you can't just christianize you you can't just christianize everything it that's not going to work everything it that's not going to work everything it that's not going to work you got to think like what they're you got to think like what they're you got to think like what they're thinking thinking thinking if you want to be effective at reaching if you want to be effective at reaching if you want to be effective at reaching them and engaging them so them and engaging them so them and engaging them so yeah yeah we're moving you know it's yeah yeah we're moving you know it's yeah yeah we're moving you know it's more of a post-christian culture than it more of a post-christian culture than it more of a post-christian culture than it was 10 years ago or 20 years ago was 10 years ago or 20 years ago was 10 years ago or 20 years ago and we're still in the bible belt like and we're still in the bible belt like and we're still in the bible belt like ohio still is but ohio still is but ohio still is but uh you know there's a lot of people who uh you know there's a lot of people who uh you know there's a lot of people who just aren't just aren't just aren't aren't there and the culture is shifting aren't there and the culture is shifting aren't there and the culture is shifting i have i have conversations with i have i have conversations with i have i have conversations with churches daily churches daily churches daily and one of one of the things that i and one of one of the things that i and one of one of the things that i i bring to their attention all the time i bring to their attention all the time i bring to their attention all the time and just taking a look at the website and just taking a look at the website and just taking a look at the website taking a look at their social media taking a look at their social media taking a look at their social media channels channels channels is to just challenge them to ask the is to just challenge them to ask the is to just challenge them to ask the question that if a person question that if a person question that if a person who is far from god who doesn't know who is far from god who doesn't know who is far from god who doesn't know what you know and doesn't believe what what you know and doesn't believe what what you know and doesn't believe what you believe they you believe they you believe they land on your website they land on your land on your website they land on your land on your website they land on your social media channels social media channels social media channels what do they see and how does it make what do they see and how does it make what do they see and how does it make them feel and them feel and them feel and you know ultimately we we tend to argue you know ultimately we we tend to argue you know ultimately we we tend to argue sometimes that sometimes that sometimes that people will make decisions based on fact people will make decisions based on fact people will make decisions based on fact but more often than not people make but more often than not people make but more often than not people make decisions based on the way that they decisions based on the way that they decisions based on the way that they feel feel feel um you know i think you know if you um you know i think you know if you um you know i think you know if you watch the political

watch the political watch the political landscape there's a lot of storytelling landscape there's a lot of storytelling landscape there's a lot of storytelling that goes on in politics that goes on in politics that goes on in politics there are some people that like to fight there are some people that like to fight there are some people that like to fight with facts and then there are some with facts and then there are some with facts and then there are some people that like to fight with story people that like to fight with story people that like to fight with story and more people resonate with story than and more people resonate with story than and more people resonate with story than they ever do with facts they ever do with facts they ever do with facts and so as a church it is important for and so as a church it is important for and so as a church it is important for us us us to hear people's stories to know to hear people's stories to know to hear people's stories to know people's stories to tell people's people's stories to tell people's people's stories to tell people's stories because stories are going to stories because stories are going to stories because stories are going to stories are going to move people forward stories are going to move people forward stories are going to move people forward draw them in draw them in draw them in better than facts ever will and your better than facts ever will and your better than facts ever will and your website tells a story website tells a story website tells a story your social media accounts tell a story your social media accounts tell a story your social media accounts tell a story the pastor's the pastor's the pastor's you know messages and all the additional you know messages and all the additional you know messages and all the additional content that you're creating it it tells content that you're creating it it tells content that you're creating it it tells story and it communicates something and story and it communicates something and story and it communicates something and so so so having that filter of of understanding having that filter of of understanding having that filter of of understanding where people who i i asked the same where people who i i asked the same where people who i i asked the same question christy question christy question christy how can people how can people not how can people how can people not how can people how can people not believe this you know how can people believe this you know how can people believe this you know how can people look at look at look at at people like you know tim keller and at people like you know tim keller and at people like you know tim keller and dr dr dr tim mackey and you know and and some of tim mackey and you know and and some of tim mackey and you know and and some of the most the most the most brilliant people i look around the brilliant people i look around the brilliant people i look around the christian world in the landscape and see christian world in the landscape and see christian world in the landscape and see all these amazingly brilliant smart all these amazingly brilliant smart all these amazingly brilliant smart people people people who've staked their lives on who've staked their lives on who've staked their lives on what the bible teaches us about god and what the bible teaches us about god and what the bible teaches us about god and who jesus is who jesus is who jesus is and then there are a lot of really smart and then there are a lot of really smart and then there are a lot of really smart people that that push against it people that that push against it people that that push against it and don't believe it and i ask myself and don't believe it and i ask myself and don't believe it and i ask myself the same question the same question the same question but the best way to get to the heart of but the best way to get to the heart of but the best way to get to the heart of that is obviously to listen to their that is obviously to listen to their that is obviously to listen to their stories and hear what they have to say stories and hear what they have to say stories and hear what they have to say so i so i so i i applaud you for that i think it i applaud you for that i think it i applaud you for that i think it probably really makes you more effective probably really makes you more effective probably really makes you more effective in what you're doing in what you're doing in what you're doing and uh i i think that it's encouraging

and uh i i think that it's encouraging and uh i i think that it's encouraging to hear that you're doing that and i to hear that you're doing that and i to hear that you're doing that and i hope more people will do it hope more people will do it hope more people will do it yeah yeah really just look at your yeah yeah really just look at your yeah yeah really just look at your website and just kind of go through and website and just kind of go through and website and just kind of go through and look at what kind of christian words look at what kind of christian words look at what kind of christian words you're using you're using you're using like you know we call our auditorium like you know we call our auditorium like you know we call our auditorium auditorium you know i don't we don't auditorium you know i don't we don't auditorium you know i don't we don't have words like narthex and things like have words like narthex and things like have words like narthex and things like that that that so just you know just just reading it so just you know just just reading it so just you know just just reading it critically like what i would critically like what i would critically like what i would if i had no idea what this church was if i had no idea what this church was if i had no idea what this church was what i know what this meant what i know what this meant what i know what this meant well and we're not perfect we still get well and we're not perfect we still get well and we're not perfect we still get it wrong it wrong it wrong yeah well i i we've shared this you know yeah well i i we've shared this you know yeah well i i we've shared this you know what what what i try to also encourage churches is they i try to also encourage churches is they i try to also encourage churches is they optimize their website optimize their website optimize their website the reason you do that is you want to be the reason you do that is you want to be the reason you do that is you want to be found you want that page found you want that page found you want that page to be found we were just talking to be found we were just talking to be found we were just talking yesterday as a team in our analytics and yesterday as a team in our analytics and yesterday as a team in our analytics and we have a blog post that is our we have a blog post that is our we have a blog post that is our i think it's the third most visited blog i think it's the third most visited blog i think it's the third most visited blog post post post on our website we have a lot of traffic on our website we have a lot of traffic on our website we have a lot of traffic to missional marketing to missional marketing to missional marketing and we went and looked at that blog post and we went and looked at that blog post and we went and looked at that blog post it's a good blog post but it didn't have it's a good blog post but it didn't have it's a good blog post but it didn't have really any good call to actions really any good call to actions really any good call to actions and i was i was sharing with our with and i was i was sharing with our with and i was i was sharing with our with our internal team our internal team our internal team i go you know whenever i talk to a i go you know whenever i talk to a i go you know whenever i talk to a church i go hey that marriage page church i go hey that marriage page church i go hey that marriage page that you put together maybe even the that you put together maybe even the that you put together maybe even the children's page children's page children's page you got to sometimes consider that if you got to sometimes consider that if you got to sometimes consider that if somebody lands on somebody lands on somebody lands on that page that could be their very first that page that could be their very first that page that could be their very first impression of your church impression of your church impression of your church so from that lens that's kind of their so from that lens that's kind of their so from that lens that's kind of their homepage homepage homepage in a sense are you proud of what you put in a sense are you proud of what you put in a sense are you proud of what you put out there

out there out there and usually it's like no yeah you could and usually it's like no yeah you could and usually it's like no yeah you could you could have you could have you could have a lot of great engaging information a lot of great engaging information a lot of great engaging information information but also stories information but also stories information but also stories because you want people to feel that because you want people to feel that because you want people to feel that they're valued and they're valued and they're valued and they're welcome and they are invited and they're welcome and they are invited and they're welcome and they are invited and a lot of our pages don't do that a lot of our pages don't do that a lot of our pages don't do that you know and so through that lens you you know and so through that lens you you know and so through that lens you gotta you gotta take that approach gotta you gotta take that approach gotta you gotta take that approach in our advertising too like we'll do the in our advertising too like we'll do the in our advertising too like we'll do the facebook advertising and instagram facebook advertising and instagram facebook advertising and instagram and the ones that do well just show and the ones that do well just show and the ones that do well just show somebody somebody somebody uh walking into the building and uh walking into the building and uh walking into the building and somebody greeting them somebody greeting them somebody greeting them and i think a lot of people just want to and i think a lot of people just want to and i think a lot of people just want to see that smiling face and they're also see that smiling face and they're also see that smiling face and they're also looking at what they're wearing looking at what they're wearing looking at what they're wearing is that person wearing a suit are they is that person wearing a suit are they is that person wearing a suit are they wearing shorts are they wearing shorts are they wearing shorts are they how are they dressed because if you're how are they dressed because if you're how are they dressed because if you're somebody who's never been to church somebody who's never been to church somebody who's never been to church before these are going to be questions before these are going to be questions before these are going to be questions that you're going to have that you're going to have that you're going to have so pick images that just show so pick images that just show so pick images that just show everyday people that are smiling smiling everyday people that are smiling smiling everyday people that are smiling smiling happy people sell things that's a donald happy people sell things that's a donald happy people sell things that's a donald miller phrase and i love it miller phrase and i love it miller phrase and i love it um so just pick people that um so just pick people that um so just pick people that uh they can picture themselves in their uh they can picture themselves in their uh they can picture themselves in their shoes and also you know pictures of shoes and also you know pictures of shoes and also you know pictures of diversity too diversity too diversity too don't just you know you gotta don't just you know you gotta don't just you know you gotta put people out there who you want to be put people out there who you want to be put people out there who you want to be um so that's important for us as well um um so that's important for us as well um um so that's important for us as well um so when i do advertising with you that's so when i do advertising with you that's so when i do advertising with you that's kind of where i'm thinking kind of where i'm thinking kind of where i'm thinking is like what kind of images can we pick is like what kind of images can we pick is like what kind of images can we pick that that that um would get people endorsed and um would get people endorsed and um would get people endorsed and something that you do for us something that you do for us something that you do for us is that you bring like the you put the is that you bring like the you put the is that you bring like the you put the words to the ads words to the ads words to the ads and i know that you're looking at all and i know that you're looking at all and i know that you're looking at all the other churches that you're

the other churches that you're the other churches that you're advertising with and you're picking advertising with and you're picking advertising with and you're picking the wording that has been a best the wording that has been a best the wording that has been a best practice for you practice for you practice for you so like this easter we didn't add and it so like this easter we didn't add and it so like this easter we didn't add and it was find hope this easter was find hope this easter was find hope this easter i don't think i would have chosen that i don't think i would have chosen that i don't think i would have chosen that myself find hope this easter but myself find hope this easter but myself find hope this easter but that was something that your team was that was something that your team was that was something that your team was like yeah this is doing really well and like yeah this is doing really well and like yeah this is doing really well and we're gonna we're gonna we're gonna use this wording and it did well because use this wording and it did well because use this wording and it did well because that's what people are looking for that's what people are looking for that's what people are looking for so just you you all bringing that whole so just you you all bringing that whole so just you you all bringing that whole big picture church knowledge to our big picture church knowledge to our big picture church knowledge to our church is really important for us church is really important for us church is really important for us yeah yeah thanks yeah and and i'll tell yeah yeah thanks yeah and and i'll tell yeah yeah thanks yeah and and i'll tell you where you where you where you just mentioned social media um and you just mentioned social media um and you just mentioned social media um and as we kind of white as we kind of white as we kind of white wine this down here another another wine this down here another another wine this down here another another platform platform platform listeners that you should go to and into listeners that you should go to and into listeners that you should go to and into is your google my business is your google my business is your google my business so make sure you have access to that and so make sure you have access to that and so make sure you have access to that and then you you just google your church then you you just google your church then you you just google your church you're going to see your google my you're going to see your google my you're going to see your google my business profile click on photos business profile click on photos business profile click on photos because if you think about that if because if you think about that if because if you think about that if people are people are people are looking for a church and they they find looking for a church and they they find looking for a church and they they find your church and they click on those your church and they click on those your church and they click on those photos photos photos that's their first impression of your that's their first impression of your that's their first impression of your church are those photos church are those photos church are those photos um often when i look at that with a um often when i look at that with a um often when i look at that with a church they're kind of shaking their church they're kind of shaking their church they're kind of shaking their head going head going head going how do we get rid of these photos how do we get rid of these photos how do we get rid of these photos because it's not what it's not who we because it's not what it's not who we because it's not what it's not who we are are are so start right there yeah we have a i so start right there yeah we have a i so start right there yeah we have a i have a weekly reminder on my calendar have a weekly reminder on my calendar have a weekly reminder on my calendar called called called update google my business and you can update google my business and you can update google my business and you can put a new you can put a new like post put a new you can put a new like post put a new you can put a new like post out there every week out there every week out there every week yep so otherwise we'll never do it yep so otherwise we'll never do it yep so otherwise we'll never do it christy you win the prize because christy you win the prize because christy you win the prize because i can't tell you how many times i have a i can't tell you how many times i have a i can't tell you how many times i have a conversation with a communications conversation with a communications conversation with a communications director and i say you really director and i say you really director and i say you really at least once a month need to be getting

at least once a month need to be getting at least once a month need to be getting in there and they're like well it's just in there and they're like well it's just in there and they're like well it's just kind of that one thing that just kind of kind of that one thing that just kind of kind of that one thing that just kind of falls falls falls off the you know all falls off the radar off the you know all falls off the radar off the you know all falls off the radar it's on the back burner it's on the back burner it's on the back burner and there you go christy that was the and there you go christy that was the and there you go christy that was the best advice put it best advice put it best advice put it on your calendar put it on your calendar on your calendar put it on your calendar on your calendar put it on your calendar to go and check your google my business to go and check your google my business to go and check your google my business page update your google my business page page update your google my business page page update your google my business page post something it fell off of our post something it fell off of our post something it fell off of our calendar and we didn't calendar and we didn't calendar and we didn't update it for like six months and i was update it for like six months and i was update it for like six months and i was like oh my gosh so it's back on the like oh my gosh so it's back on the like oh my gosh so it's back on the calendar calendar calendar yeah i would like to see christy's yeah i would like to see christy's yeah i would like to see christy's calendar wouldn't you because i i just calendar wouldn't you because i i just calendar wouldn't you because i i just just you'd have like it's just organized just you'd have like it's just organized just you'd have like it's just organized incredibly well incredibly well incredibly well uh sometimes i ignore some stuff i get uh sometimes i ignore some stuff i get uh sometimes i ignore some stuff i get too many notifications so i'm starting too many notifications so i'm starting too many notifications so i'm starting to ignore things so i to ignore things so i to ignore things so i have to i have to curate my own calendar have to i have to curate my own calendar have to i have to curate my own calendar sometimes yeah sometimes yeah sometimes yeah i get that hey we do need to wrap this i get that hey we do need to wrap this i get that hey we do need to wrap this up up up um we really really appreciate your time um we really really appreciate your time um we really really appreciate your time we know that you've got a lot going on we know that you've got a lot going on we know that you've got a lot going on and uh you're really you're really busy and uh you're really you're really busy and uh you're really you're really busy but at least you're really well but at least you're really well but at least you're really well organized and we're able to get us on organized and we're able to get us on organized and we're able to get us on your calendar your calendar your calendar so that we could actually spend this so that we could actually spend this so that we could actually spend this time together today thank you for not time together today thank you for not time together today thank you for not ignoring this notification ignoring this notification ignoring this notification um if uh if you know if we have any um if uh if you know if we have any um if uh if you know if we have any listeners that listeners that listeners that would like to reach out to you and would like to reach out to you and would like to reach out to you and connect with you pick your brain ask connect with you pick your brain ask connect with you pick your brain ask questions about some of the things that questions about some of the things that questions about some of the things that you're doing uh how you're doing uh how you're doing uh how what's the best way easiest way to uh to what's the best way easiest way to uh to what's the best way easiest way to uh to connect with you connect with you connect with you um well you can email me my email is um well you can email me my email is um well you can email me my email is jacobsen at vineyardcincinnati.com or jacobsen at vineyardcincinnati.com or jacobsen at vineyardcincinnati.com or you can you can you can you know if you want to send me a text you know if you want to send me a text you know if you want to send me a text text me my number is 513-259-7000 513-259-7000

513-259-7000 and just send me a text and i'll try to and just send me a text and i'll try to and just send me a text and i'll try to get back with you um get back with you um get back with you um you know my my favorite thing to talk you know my my favorite thing to talk you know my my favorite thing to talk about is how to just if you're about is how to just if you're about is how to just if you're working at a church and you're just kind working at a church and you're just kind working at a church and you're just kind of overwhelmed of overwhelmed of overwhelmed like how can you get a handle on project like how can you get a handle on project like how can you get a handle on project management so that you can think management so that you can think management so that you can think more creatively that this stuff can kind more creatively that this stuff can kind more creatively that this stuff can kind of run itself of run itself of run itself awesome thank you again for your time awesome thank you again for your time awesome thank you again for your time with us really appreciate it with us really appreciate it with us really appreciate it good stuff chris thank you it's an honor good stuff chris thank you it's an honor good stuff chris thank you it's an honor to be on your podcast thank you to be on your podcast thank you to be on your podcast thank you [Music] [Music] [Music] you