Maximizing Social Media for Church Engagement | Interview with Seth Muse

[Music] [Music] today on the podcast today on the podcast today on the podcast i am excited to have seth muse i am excited to have seth muse i am excited to have seth muse uh seth is a former communication uh seth is a former communication uh seth is a former communication director at director at director at mega church uh he's been in ministry for mega church uh he's been in ministry for mega church uh he's been in ministry for 20 years 20 years 20 years he's done all kinds of things he has a he's done all kinds of things he has a he's done all kinds of things he has a current podcast current podcast current podcast where he he's a host and it's called where he he's a host and it's called where he he's a host and it's called seminary of hard knocks it's got a lot seminary of hard knocks it's got a lot seminary of hard knocks it's got a lot of great content of great content of great content he also uh is a church communications he also uh is a church communications he also uh is a church communications coach coach coach and uh if you want to learn more about and uh if you want to learn more about and uh if you want to learn more about him go to sethmuse.com him go to sethmuse.com him go to sethmuse.com but today we're talking about just what but today we're talking about just what but today we're talking about just what church communication church communication church communication directors are dealing with and how they directors are dealing with and how they directors are dealing with and how they can can can navigate this pandemic we're in right navigate this pandemic we're in right navigate this pandemic we're in right now and just the now and just the now and just the the cultural change that's happening the cultural change that's happening the cultural change that's happening inside the church so i hope you enjoy it inside the church so i hope you enjoy it inside the church so i hope you enjoy it well hey seth thanks for uh joining us well hey seth thanks for uh joining us well hey seth thanks for uh joining us today glad to have you on the podcast today glad to have you on the podcast today glad to have you on the podcast yeah my pleasure jason thanks for having yeah my pleasure jason thanks for having yeah my pleasure jason thanks for having me yeah yeah so we were just chatting a me yeah yeah so we were just chatting a me yeah yeah so we were just chatting a little bit there uh we could go little bit there uh we could go little bit there uh we could go on and on about where churches are when on and on about where churches are when on and on about where churches are when it comes to the it comes to the it comes to the digital ministry or discipleship and digital ministry or discipleship and digital ministry or discipleship and it's it's funny how church is all over it's it's funny how church is all over it's it's funny how church is all over the board the board the board now you um you invest a lot of time now you um you invest a lot of time now you um you invest a lot of time coaching churches right especially well coaching churches right especially well coaching churches right especially well in all kinds of things but especially in all kinds of things but especially in all kinds of things but especially the digital like the digital like the digital like social media space so uh what are social media space so uh what are social media space so uh what are through this pandemic what are some of through this pandemic what are some of through this pandemic what are some of the things that you've been coaching the things that you've been coaching the things that you've been coaching churches on that churches on that churches on that you've said hey you've been doing it you've said hey you've been doing it you've said hey you've been doing it this way and you've been doing a good this way and you've been doing a good this way and you've been doing a good job job job but you got to do it this way to do a but you got to do it this way to do a but you got to do it this way to do a great job or to get great job or to get great job or to get better what are some of those things better what are some of those things better what are some of those things that you're talking to churches about

that you're talking to churches about that you're talking to churches about yeah i think the biggest thing yeah i think the biggest thing yeah i think the biggest thing most churches right now are it's it's a most churches right now are it's it's a most churches right now are it's it's a difference between what they're focused difference between what they're focused difference between what they're focused on on on in the panic mode and what they need to in the panic mode and what they need to in the panic mode and what they need to really really really you know grow and expand and you know you know grow and expand and you know you know grow and expand and you know continue continue continue and i think what what most churches are and i think what what most churches are and i think what what most churches are focused on are oh no we don't have tools focused on are oh no we don't have tools focused on are oh no we don't have tools we don't have equipment we don't have we don't have equipment we don't have we don't have equipment we don't have know-how know-how know-how in these certain areas that we now have in these certain areas that we now have in these certain areas that we now have to have to have to have absolute know-how and the best equipment absolute know-how and the best equipment absolute know-how and the best equipment and all these and all these and all these all these things and and that's not all these things and and that's not all these things and and that's not necessarily true necessarily true necessarily true the biggest issue for churches right now the biggest issue for churches right now the biggest issue for churches right now during the pandemic is getting around during the pandemic is getting around during the pandemic is getting around the mental block of their priorities and the mental block of their priorities and the mental block of their priorities and in the procedures and things that we in the procedures and things that we in the procedures and things that we have defined ministry as have defined ministry as have defined ministry as in the in the past it's like we're in the in the past it's like we're in the in the past it's like we're revealing what the pandemic is revealing revealing what the pandemic is revealing revealing what the pandemic is revealing about churches about churches about churches is that we we may have had a little bit is that we we may have had a little bit is that we we may have had a little bit almost to an idolatry view of in-person almost to an idolatry view of in-person almost to an idolatry view of in-person buildings meetings um buildings meetings um buildings meetings um you know from as as ministry and i think you know from as as ministry and i think you know from as as ministry and i think getting around the the paradigm shift of getting around the the paradigm shift of getting around the the paradigm shift of the world doesn't necessarily work that the world doesn't necessarily work that the world doesn't necessarily work that way way way only anymore it's seeing ministry as only anymore it's seeing ministry as only anymore it's seeing ministry as something bigger than just something bigger than just something bigger than just face to face and seeing how digital face to face and seeing how digital face to face and seeing how digital spaces contribute to ministry and can spaces contribute to ministry and can spaces contribute to ministry and can actually actually actually contain ministry in some ways is is contain ministry in some ways is is contain ministry in some ways is is something that i don't think we something that i don't think we something that i don't think we i mean i had a client say that i mean i had a client say that i mean i had a client say that we're freaking out we were

we're freaking out we were we're freaking out we were we saw the future we were trying to do we saw the future we were trying to do we saw the future we were trying to do you know you know you know something and that was going to take 15 something and that was going to take 15 something and that was going to take 15 years and suddenly we had to do it in 15 years and suddenly we had to do it in 15 years and suddenly we had to do it in 15 days days days and didn't know what to do didn't have and didn't know what to do didn't have and didn't know what to do didn't have resources didn't have manpower resources didn't have manpower resources didn't have manpower didn't have any of that and i think didn't have any of that and i think didn't have any of that and i think that's a lot of churches you know so i that's a lot of churches you know so i that's a lot of churches you know so i think that's think that's think that's been the biggest issue is just getting been the biggest issue is just getting been the biggest issue is just getting church church church not only church communicators because we not only church communicators because we not only church communicators because we kind of already saw some of this kind of already saw some of this kind of already saw some of this but getting pastors and leaders to you but getting pastors and leaders to you but getting pastors and leaders to you know know know catch up to this idea that ministry catch up to this idea that ministry catch up to this idea that ministry could be online could be online could be online in in some ways and not completely but in in some ways and not completely but in in some ways and not completely but um and how that can be ministry you know um and how that can be ministry you know um and how that can be ministry you know partnership with you know your in-person partnership with you know your in-person partnership with you know your in-person ministry and how it fuses together ministry and how it fuses together ministry and how it fuses together and becomes your ministry in general so and becomes your ministry in general so and becomes your ministry in general so i think that's been a difficult thing i think that's been a difficult thing i think that's been a difficult thing for churches to for churches to for churches to figure out is what does that look like figure out is what does that look like figure out is what does that look like and i think the biggest block to that is and i think the biggest block to that is and i think the biggest block to that is just getting their head around that just getting their head around that just getting their head around that digital's okay to call ministry digital's okay to call ministry digital's okay to call ministry and if we could do that it unlocks you and if we could do that it unlocks you and if we could do that it unlocks you know this whole know this whole know this whole like oh well what could that look like like oh well what could that look like like oh well what could that look like because as we were talking earlier you because as we were talking earlier you because as we were talking earlier you know know know that it seems like the church has this that it seems like the church has this that it seems like the church has this understanding of it should just be understanding of it should just be understanding of it should just be natural like okay i gotta do ministry natural like okay i gotta do ministry natural like okay i gotta do ministry here in this space now so what am i here in this space now so what am i here in this space now so what am i gonna do gonna do gonna do but we have just not seen digital as but we have just not seen digital as but we have just not seen digital as ministry ministry ministry for so long that it's almost like we for so long that it's almost like we for so long that it's almost like we don't we have don't we have don't we have we have no idea what to do with it and we have no idea what to do with it and we have no idea what to do with it and it's it's it's it's just a new it's just a new context it's just a new it's just a new context it's just a new it's just a new context you know a ministry is still you know a ministry is still you know a ministry is still ministry it's just a new context it's ministry it's just a new context it's ministry it's just a new context it's almost like a missionary going to a new

almost like a missionary going to a new almost like a missionary going to a new country country country it's like what would you do you know you it's like what would you do you know you it's like what would you do you know you just do that for digital just do that for digital just do that for digital and it's it's it should be natural it and it's it's it should be natural it and it's it's it should be natural it doesn't seem natural doesn't seem natural doesn't seem natural so when i coach it's like that is a big so when i coach it's like that is a big so when i coach it's like that is a big issue and the second issue and the second issue and the second issue that i always try to deal with is issue that i always try to deal with is issue that i always try to deal with is just internal communications among staff just internal communications among staff just internal communications among staff especially right now because especially right now because especially right now because we're also spread out and remote and we're also spread out and remote and we're also spread out and remote and this is totally new for so many people this is totally new for so many people this is totally new for so many people and it's difficult so helping staff and it's difficult so helping staff and it's difficult so helping staff communicate better communicate better communicate better be on board with each other better be on board with each other better be on board with each other better understand what's happening in the understand what's happening in the understand what's happening in the church better church better church better and just finding that ways to build that and just finding that ways to build that and just finding that ways to build that internal infrastructure has been a internal infrastructure has been a internal infrastructure has been a challenge as well challenge as well challenge as well yeah you and i were speaking earlier yeah you and i were speaking earlier yeah you and i were speaking earlier about the uh about the uh about the uh some of the the models when you think some of the the models when you think some of the the models when you think about like blockbuster about like blockbuster about like blockbuster right and how they collapse because right and how they collapse because right and how they collapse because they're almost arrogant enough to think they're almost arrogant enough to think they're almost arrogant enough to think that we'll just build more brick and that we'll just build more brick and that we'll just build more brick and mortar stores and people keep coming and mortar stores and people keep coming and mortar stores and people keep coming and they they took their eyes off where they they took their eyes off where they they took their eyes off where people are wanting to go to right and so people are wanting to go to right and so people are wanting to go to right and so netflix that's why netflix that's why netflix that's why netflix exploded and blockbuster netflix exploded and blockbuster netflix exploded and blockbuster failed you know and so you think about failed you know and so you think about failed you know and so you think about where we are as in the the big c church where we are as in the the big c church where we are as in the the big c church and and and kind of where the big church is going kind of where the big church is going kind of where the big church is going and and the concept and the idea that we and and the concept and the idea that we and and the concept and the idea that we can't be so arrogant enough to think can't be so arrogant enough to think can't be so arrogant enough to think that that that uh they're just gonna come in person uh they're just gonna come in person uh they're just gonna come in person like it just like it just like it just isn't gonna happen you have to put f isn't gonna happen you have to put f isn't gonna happen you have to put f effort into that and i effort into that and i effort into that and i i see that happening like you probably i see that happening like you probably i see that happening like you probably see that happening it's it's like see that happening it's it's like see that happening it's it's like churches are starting to churches are starting to churches are starting to you know the leadership is starting to you know the leadership is starting to you know the leadership is starting to go hey maybe we need to go hey maybe we need to go hey maybe we need to vote reallocate funds reallocate staff

vote reallocate funds reallocate staff vote reallocate funds reallocate staff or reallocate ministry focus to or reallocate ministry focus to or reallocate ministry focus to figuring out where does discipleship figuring out where does discipleship figuring out where does discipleship begin and can you do that online and begin and can you do that online and begin and can you do that online and and kind of all that and and kind of all that and and kind of all that and so i'm starting to see you know at least so i'm starting to see you know at least so i'm starting to see you know at least at mission marketing what we do is we at mission marketing what we do is we at mission marketing what we do is we try to take try to take try to take content that's being created and content that's being created and content that's being created and repurpose it to be repurpose it to be repurpose it to be put on online so that google can crawl put on online so that google can crawl put on online so that google can crawl it it it how are you seeing that being done when how are you seeing that being done when how are you seeing that being done when it when it comes to it when it comes to it when it comes to other platforms like social media like other platforms like social media like other platforms like social media like if are you are you if are you are you if are you are you seeing that churches are doing a good seeing that churches are doing a good seeing that churches are doing a good job or they're figuring out how to take job or they're figuring out how to take job or they're figuring out how to take their content their content their content and repurpose it yeah it's i mean some and repurpose it yeah it's i mean some and repurpose it yeah it's i mean some are it's are it's are it's the the new challenge to that i mean the the new challenge to that i mean the the new challenge to that i mean before we used to say like before we used to say like before we used to say like your weekend service is a content your weekend service is a content your weekend service is a content production machine production machine production machine you've got video you've got messages you've got video you've got messages you've got video you've got messages music you've got music you've got music you've got i don't know what everything else you do i don't know what everything else you do i don't know what everything else you do in a service so find ways to slice that in a service so find ways to slice that in a service so find ways to slice that up up up take that through the week do that take that through the week do that take that through the week do that that's kind of easy but a lot of that's kind of easy but a lot of that's kind of easy but a lot of churches weren't doing that churches weren't doing that churches weren't doing that but now you don't have that really i but now you don't have that really i but now you don't have that really i mean you you may have well mean you you may have well mean you you may have well you don't have it like you did you have you don't have it like you did you have you don't have it like you did you have your message but it comes in your message but it comes in your message but it comes in parts and it's online or you know it's parts and it's online or you know it's parts and it's online or you know it's just different now just different now just different now and i think that churches are realizing and i think that churches are realizing and i think that churches are realizing just how much space there is to fill just how much space there is to fill just how much space there is to fill online and that they online and that they online and that they they don't have the content so now what they don't have the content so now what they don't have the content so now what is the struggle is the struggle is the struggle is trying to figure out okay well what is trying to figure out okay well what is trying to figure out okay well what kind of videos should we shoot that have kind of videos should we shoot that have kind of videos should we shoot that have nothing to do with our service

nothing to do with our service nothing to do with our service you know because we need that kind of you know because we need that kind of you know because we need that kind of content too you know blog material content too you know blog material content too you know blog material or vlog material for youtube you know or vlog material for youtube you know or vlog material for youtube you know that type of stuff that google that type of stuff that google that type of stuff that google loves to crawl that when your website loves to crawl that when your website loves to crawl that when your website continually updates and changes continually updates and changes continually updates and changes it it loves to find new new things to it it loves to find new new things to it it loves to find new new things to show you show you show you all those things that are now all those things that are now all those things that are now contributing to whether or not people contributing to whether or not people contributing to whether or not people are showing up at your service are showing up at your service are showing up at your service in ways that they haven't before they in ways that they haven't before they in ways that they haven't before they were always important but now it's like were always important but now it's like were always important but now it's like that's what you got you know it's like that's what you got you know it's like that's what you got you know it's like you're taking them from you're taking them from you're taking them from a search to a live stream it's it's a search to a live stream it's it's a search to a live stream it's it's one click you know it's right there um one click you know it's right there um one click you know it's right there um and that's what you're trying to do and that's what you're trying to do and that's what you're trying to do mostly mostly mostly so when you feel like you're trying to so when you feel like you're trying to so when you feel like you're trying to get back to some kind of normal and get get back to some kind of normal and get get back to some kind of normal and get away from all that it's just away from all that it's just away from all that it's just i don't think we're ever gonna get there i don't think we're ever gonna get there i don't think we're ever gonna get there again in the way that we were but again in the way that we were but again in the way that we were but we have to look at our budgets we have we have to look at our budgets we have we have to look at our budgets we have to look at it in real time as to look at it in real time as to look at it in real time as you know this is a this is something we you know this is a this is something we you know this is a this is something we need to really put effort into need to really put effort into need to really put effort into and that videos like how to study the and that videos like how to study the and that videos like how to study the bible bible bible and what is you know what's my daily and what is you know what's my daily and what is you know what's my daily devotional video for my pastor devotional video for my pastor devotional video for my pastor shot with my iphone posted to facebook shot with my iphone posted to facebook shot with my iphone posted to facebook you know and you know and you know and and that type of thing matters and that type of thing matters and that type of thing matters so much more than it did it mattered so much more than it did it mattered so much more than it did it mattered before but so much more now before but so much more now before but so much more now because it's a way of discipling your because it's a way of discipling your because it's a way of discipling your people through the digital space people through the digital space people through the digital space and what's hard to understand for and what's hard to understand for and what's hard to understand for pastors is that they're not physically pastors is that they're not physically pastors is that they're not physically present when the discipleship takes present when the discipleship takes present when the discipleship takes place place place because people may watch that video 10 because people may watch that video 10 because people may watch that video 10 days after you posted it days after you posted it days after you posted it yep and you have no idea you know so yep and you have no idea you know so yep and you have no idea you know so how's that ministry well it is

how's that ministry well it is how's that ministry well it is it's just you're not really present for it's just you're not really present for it's just you're not really present for it it it they have to connect with you so you they have to connect with you so you they have to connect with you so you have to kind of plan for that have to kind of plan for that have to kind of plan for that so i think there's a lot of factors so i think there's a lot of factors so i think there's a lot of factors there with you know there with you know there with you know repurposing your content that um repurposing your content that um repurposing your content that um you don't have as much content like you don't have as much content like you don't have as much content like right now like what are your church right now like what are your church right now like what are your church photographers doing photographers doing photographers doing what do they take photos of you know what do they take photos of you know what do they take photos of you know that's there's nothing they're not there that's there's nothing they're not there that's there's nothing they're not there you know it's like there's nothing to you know it's like there's nothing to you know it's like there's nothing to take photos up take photos up take photos up so your social media probably is so your social media probably is so your social media probably is suffering because you're if you suffering because you're if you suffering because you're if you typically rely on your photographers typically rely on your photographers typically rely on your photographers dumping you know eight million photos of dumping you know eight million photos of dumping you know eight million photos of your band or your band or your band or you know that classic silhouette hand in you know that classic silhouette hand in you know that classic silhouette hand in the air and the blurry band in the the air and the blurry band in the the air and the blurry band in the background photo that everybody needs background photo that everybody needs background photo that everybody needs that you know it's like if you don't that you know it's like if you don't that you know it's like if you don't have that what do you have you know well have that what do you have you know well have that what do you have you know well no oh no you know it's like we'll take no oh no you know it's like we'll take no oh no you know it's like we'll take pictures of real stuff man you know not pictures of real stuff man you know not pictures of real stuff man you know not that's not real but take pictures of that's not real but take pictures of that's not real but take pictures of stuff like what's going on at your house stuff like what's going on at your house stuff like what's going on at your house take photos get your people to take take photos get your people to take take photos get your people to take photos photos photos you have to dig a little deeper and mine you have to dig a little deeper and mine you have to dig a little deeper and mine it's almost like mining you have to mine it's almost like mining you have to mine it's almost like mining you have to mine your own audience for content your own audience for content your own audience for content and i mean user generated content is and i mean user generated content is and i mean user generated content is what we call that when what we call that when what we call that when you know others provide it for you you you know others provide it for you you you know others provide it for you you don't even make it don't even make it don't even make it and you just share it but that honestly and you just share it but that honestly and you just share it but that honestly performs better on performs better on performs better on social media than most of the stuff you social media than most of the stuff you social media than most of the stuff you make and that you shot with enough make and that you shot with enough make and that you shot with enough studio with you know thousands of studio with you know thousands of studio with you know thousands of dollars of lighting and camera dollars of lighting and camera dollars of lighting and camera you know it's just it's the way the you know it's just it's the way the you know it's just it's the way the world is world is world is so i think when we realize as a church so i think when we realize as a church so i think when we realize as a church that the quality quote quality of what that the quality quote quality of what that the quality quote quality of what you put out you put out you put out the definition of that word quality has

the definition of that word quality has the definition of that word quality has changed for the common audience changed for the common audience changed for the common audience that doesn't require all that stuff and that doesn't require all that stuff and that doesn't require all that stuff and setup and prep setup and prep setup and prep that the raw video still looks pretty that the raw video still looks pretty that the raw video still looks pretty good and they're good and they're good and they're very okay with it it opens up so many very okay with it it opens up so many very okay with it it opens up so many opportunities for you to create content opportunities for you to create content opportunities for you to create content that are that are that are it's going to connect with people for it's going to connect with people for it's going to connect with people for your social media channels for youtube your social media channels for youtube your social media channels for youtube channels channels channels um you know there's best practices um you know there's best practices um you know there's best practices lighting things like that you audio you lighting things like that you audio you lighting things like that you audio you can do but man can do but man can do but man it's it's so not as hard as it was it's it's so not as hard as it was it's it's so not as hard as it was and and i think we made it hard because and and i think we made it hard because and and i think we made it hard because we came out of that production era of we came out of that production era of we came out of that production era of the church the church the church that i believe is absolutely just over that i believe is absolutely just over that i believe is absolutely just over people are over it um people are over it um people are over it um so i mean we saw we saw attendance so i mean we saw we saw attendance so i mean we saw we saw attendance declining anyway declining anyway declining anyway right it was like you know church right it was like you know church right it was like you know church attendance was declining your church may attendance was declining your church may attendance was declining your church may have been growing or whatnot because have been growing or whatnot because have been growing or whatnot because you're doing something specific but i you're doing something specific but i you're doing something specific but i guarantee guarantee guarantee it was not because your band was awesome it was not because your band was awesome it was not because your band was awesome you know it was not because your video you know it was not because your video you know it was not because your video you know can't you get three cameras you know can't you get three cameras you know can't you get three cameras that cost a million dollars each you that cost a million dollars each you that cost a million dollars each you know or whatever know or whatever know or whatever it wasn't because of the production of it wasn't because of the production of it wasn't because of the production of what you do what you do what you do um you know it was because of something um you know it was because of something um you know it was because of something else going on your church but the else going on your church but the else going on your church but the majority of church the tennis declining majority of church the tennis declining majority of church the tennis declining in person so in person so in person so when this pandemic happened i feel like when this pandemic happened i feel like when this pandemic happened i feel like people people people might have even breathed the sigh of might have even breathed the sigh of might have even breathed the sigh of relief relief relief that okay well i can't go to church that okay well i can't go to church that okay well i can't go to church man it's i was such a chore anyway man it's i was such a chore anyway man it's i was such a chore anyway you know yeah not that not that it's a you know yeah not that not that it's a you know yeah not that not that it's a good thing that we can't do it because i good thing that we can't do it because i good thing that we can't do it because i i was kind of in that far swing

i was kind of in that far swing i was kind of in that far swing like we got to get more people to think like we got to get more people to think like we got to get more people to think digital and now it's like that's all we digital and now it's like that's all we digital and now it's like that's all we have and even i'm going have and even i'm going have and even i'm going man okay this is too far this is too man okay this is too far this is too man okay this is too far this is too much i miss my church much i miss my church much i miss my church you know i'm a super introvert and i'm you know i'm a super introvert and i'm you know i'm a super introvert and i'm just like oh i need to get back just like oh i need to get back just like oh i need to get back so i'm not saying i'm not advocating for so i'm not saying i'm not advocating for so i'm not saying i'm not advocating for not going to church in person but not going to church in person but not going to church in person but you know it's like you try to get people you know it's like you try to get people you know it's like you try to get people to come this way so hard you to come this way so hard you to come this way so hard you end up being like overcompensating in end up being like overcompensating in end up being like overcompensating in your own in your own life and now your own in your own life and now your own in your own life and now you got all of it you want and it's like you got all of it you want and it's like you got all of it you want and it's like what god always does like what god always does like what god always does like that's what you think you want well that's what you think you want well that's what you think you want well here's a bunch of it here's a bunch of it here's a bunch of it it's almost like asking for extra it's almost like asking for extra it's almost like asking for extra ketchup in a wendy's drive-through you ketchup in a wendy's drive-through you ketchup in a wendy's drive-through you know it's like here's three packets of know it's like here's three packets of know it's like here's three packets of ketchup like can i have some more here's ketchup like can i have some more here's ketchup like can i have some more here's 50 packages you know 50 packages you know 50 packages you know i don't want that much ketchup man put i don't want that much ketchup man put i don't want that much ketchup man put them in your glove compartment you them in your glove compartment you them in your glove compartment you forget about them forget about them forget about them for real it's like i'll use that that's for real it's like i'll use that that's for real it's like i'll use that that's right ketchup right ketchup right ketchup well so so i think catching the drift well so so i think catching the drift well so so i think catching the drift here it's like it really here it's like it really here it's like it really so it matters a little bit on the so it matters a little bit on the so it matters a little bit on the technology that you have technology that you have technology that you have it matters a whole lot more on the it matters a whole lot more on the it matters a whole lot more on the quality quality quality of the content and the in the of the content and the in the of the content and the in the creativeness which creativeness which creativeness which you know all that effort and focus that you know all that effort and focus that you know all that effort and focus that you know all kinds of churches big or you know all kinds of churches big or you know all kinds of churches big or small would put into trying to small would put into trying to small would put into trying to get people to come onto their campus get people to come onto their campus get people to come onto their campus right events and conferences and of right events and conferences and of right events and conferences and of course we can worship course we can worship course we can worship so if we can just take that same kind of so if we can just take that same kind of so if we can just take that same kind of head knowledge and head knowledge and head knowledge and focus it over here to how do you really focus it over here to how do you really focus it over here to how do you really create meaningful create meaningful create meaningful online content for engagement now we online content for engagement now we online content for engagement now we have have have almost an equal playing field it doesn't almost an equal playing field it doesn't almost an equal playing field it doesn't matter who you are what size of church matter who you are what size of church matter who you are what size of church you are you are you are it matters about how how much brain it matters about how how much brain it matters about how how much brain power you're going to put into this power you're going to put into this power you're going to put into this thing

thing thing yeah and learn just like you it's it's yeah and learn just like you it's it's yeah and learn just like you it's it's like reading the bible you've got to like reading the bible you've got to like reading the bible you've got to study and figure out how to study and figure out how to study and figure out how to do this yeah you know appropriately and do this yeah you know appropriately and do this yeah you know appropriately and effectively effectively effectively and man our biblical head biblical and man our biblical head biblical and man our biblical head biblical biblical illiteracy is a huge issue that biblical illiteracy is a huge issue that biblical illiteracy is a huge issue that you can address you can address you can address with digital content you should it's with digital content you should it's with digital content you should it's like like like you don't think you're doing the world a you don't think you're doing the world a you don't think you're doing the world a favor by teaching people how to study favor by teaching people how to study favor by teaching people how to study the bible better the bible better the bible better on a regular basis oh my gosh if people on a regular basis oh my gosh if people on a regular basis oh my gosh if people could study the bible better could study the bible better could study the bible better things would be much better you know things would be much better you know things would be much better you know just within the christian world just within the christian world just within the christian world and they want that kind of content they and they want that kind of content they and they want that kind of content they don't know how to study it they're don't know how to study it they're don't know how to study it they're listening to listening to listening to teenagers on tick-tock telling them oh i teenagers on tick-tock telling them oh i teenagers on tick-tock telling them oh i didn't know that about the bible you didn't know that about the bible you didn't know that about the bible you know know know what not maybe adults aren't but you what not maybe adults aren't but you what not maybe adults aren't but you know what i'm saying like that's what know what i'm saying like that's what know what i'm saying like that's what the youth are listening to the youth are listening to the youth are listening to um it's just be part of that um it's just be part of that um it's just be part of that conversation conversation conversation and for so long the leaders of our and for so long the leaders of our and for so long the leaders of our church have not church have not church have not been part of that conversation because been part of that conversation because been part of that conversation because they are not in that space they are not in that space they are not in that space they're not engaging they're not adding they're not engaging they're not adding they're not engaging they're not adding what they have to add what they have to add what they have to add to that space yeah content creators to that space yeah content creators to that space yeah content creators you know creatives like myself you know you know creatives like myself you know you know creatives like myself you know students kids you know people with a students kids you know people with a students kids you know people with a passion passion passion and i think you i can't remember where and i think you i can't remember where and i think you i can't remember where it's found but proverbs says that it's found but proverbs says that it's found but proverbs says that zeal without knowledge is folly and it's zeal without knowledge is folly and it's zeal without knowledge is folly and it's it's like you have a generation of it's like you have a generation of it's like you have a generation of people who are activists people who are activists people who are activists who want more but don't have the who want more but don't have the who want more but don't have the knowledge to actually knowledge to actually knowledge to actually teach the bible well and here we are as teach the bible well and here we are as teach the bible well and here we are as pastors with pastors with pastors with years of experience and and

years of experience and and years of experience and and understanding understanding understanding not doing it in the space where people not doing it in the space where people not doing it in the space where people want to hear that want to hear that want to hear that yeah because we might get a somebody yeah because we might get a somebody yeah because we might get a somebody might be mean to us like so what might be mean to us like so what might be mean to us like so what paul was imprisoned and killed you know paul was imprisoned and killed you know paul was imprisoned and killed you know it's like it's like it's like what can't we can't take somebody going what can't we can't take somebody going what can't we can't take somebody going you know you know you know oh this is stupid you're an idiot we oh this is stupid you're an idiot we oh this is stupid you're an idiot we believe that crap you know we can't believe that crap you know we can't believe that crap you know we can't we can't deal with that come on i think we can't deal with that come on i think we can't deal with that come on i think it's it's it's i think it's where we miss our i think it's where we miss our i think it's where we miss our opportunity on digital is to opportunity on digital is to opportunity on digital is to add what we can add to the conversation add what we can add to the conversation add what we can add to the conversation so so so what so what are chur like are there any what so what are chur like are there any what so what are chur like are there any churches that you know about or what are churches that you know about or what are churches that you know about or what are churches doing that are you feel like churches doing that are you feel like churches doing that are you feel like are kind of leading are kind of leading are kind of leading the charge or leading in the space of the charge or leading in the space of the charge or leading in the space of building up an online ministry and building up an online ministry and building up an online ministry and that are you have any ideas on well that are you have any ideas on well that are you have any ideas on well i i would look at for churches that have i i would look at for churches that have i i would look at for churches that have an online pastor they have a person that an online pastor they have a person that an online pastor they have a person that is is is literally labeled pastor who is literally labeled pastor who is literally labeled pastor who is responsible for what goes on responsible for what goes on responsible for what goes on online digital pastor online pastor i online digital pastor online pastor i online digital pastor online pastor i know that north point has know that north point has know that north point has this saddleback has the jay cranda is at this saddleback has the jay cranda is at this saddleback has the jay cranda is at saddleback saddleback saddleback um dave adamson does does some things um dave adamson does does some things um dave adamson does does some things with online with online with online at uh um at north point um at uh um at north point um at uh um at north point um you know it's gonna be a it's typically you know it's gonna be a it's typically you know it's gonna be a it's typically the bigger churches that have staff for the bigger churches that have staff for the bigger churches that have staff for this but this but this but most of the unsung heroes of this are most of the unsung heroes of this are most of the unsung heroes of this are these volunteers at these smaller these volunteers at these smaller these volunteers at these smaller churches that just handle social media churches that just handle social media churches that just handle social media that are doing ministry and their pastor that are doing ministry and their pastor that are doing ministry and their pastor may not even know about it may not even know about it may not even know about it it's that kind of thing just talk to the it's that kind of thing just talk to the it's that kind of thing just talk to the people that are in your church that are people that are in your church that are people that are in your church that are savvy when it comes to social media and

savvy when it comes to social media and savvy when it comes to social media and see what they're doing especially if see what they're doing especially if see what they're doing especially if they're already volunteering and helping they're already volunteering and helping they're already volunteering and helping you with it you with it you with it and start working with them to see how and start working with them to see how and start working with them to see how you can improve and be part of it you can improve and be part of it you can improve and be part of it because i know one thing is man when because i know one thing is man when because i know one thing is man when your pastor's face pops up on your your pastor's face pops up on your your pastor's face pops up on your church's social media church's social media church's social media comments likes and interactions and comments likes and interactions and comments likes and interactions and impressions go up impressions go up impressions go up yeah it's they want to see you they yeah it's they want to see you they yeah it's they want to see you they want to see you and if you don't know want to see you and if you don't know want to see you and if you don't know how to do that how to do that how to do that there's somebody in your church that there's somebody in your church that there's somebody in your church that does that you just have to go hey help does that you just have to go hey help does that you just have to go hey help me do this me do this me do this and they would love to help you do this and they would love to help you do this and they would love to help you do this so i think when you look around look so i think when you look around look so i think when you look around look around at other churches there may be around at other churches there may be around at other churches there may be bigger churches in the area that have bigger churches in the area that have bigger churches in the area that have some kind of some kind of some kind of best practices or staffing ideas for you best practices or staffing ideas for you best practices or staffing ideas for you or whatnot you may or whatnot you may or whatnot you may post that in the facebook group and find post that in the facebook group and find post that in the facebook group and find it but at the end of the day it but at the end of the day it but at the end of the day what works in your context is probably what works in your context is probably what works in your context is probably available to you right there available to you right there available to you right there you just have to start and stop worrying you just have to start and stop worrying you just have to start and stop worrying about it being clunky it's going to be about it being clunky it's going to be about it being clunky it's going to be clunky it's always it's social media clunky it's always it's social media clunky it's always it's social media it's a sandbox it's a sandbox it's a sandbox yeah so between like facebook yeah so between like facebook yeah so between like facebook instagram twitter what are uh how are instagram twitter what are uh how are instagram twitter what are uh how are those those those platforms really aiding the church and platforms really aiding the church and platforms really aiding the church and which ones do you which ones do you which ones do you see thriving or see thriving or see thriving or which one of those unique platforms what which one of those unique platforms what which one of those unique platforms what do they bring to churches do they bring to churches do they bring to churches yeah that's a great question because i yeah that's a great question because i yeah that's a great question because i think we think they all do the same think we think they all do the same think we think they all do the same thing and they don't thing and they don't thing and they don't um with facebook you get a lot of um with facebook you get a lot of um with facebook you get a lot of community community community especially with your older crowd like if especially with your older crowd like if especially with your older crowd like if you're in your you're looking at those you're in your you're looking at those you're in your you're looking at those 20 20 20 late maybe late 20s mostly 30s and 40s late maybe late 20s mostly 30s and 40s late maybe late 20s mostly 30s and 40s and 50s and 50s and 50s and 60s that those those demographic and 60s that those those demographic and 60s that those those demographic ranges ranges ranges tend to really connect on facebook now tend to really connect on facebook now tend to really connect on facebook now instagram is going to be your 30 to 40s

instagram is going to be your 30 to 40s instagram is going to be your 30 to 40s now now now uh and some 20s um tick tock is going to uh and some 20s um tick tock is going to uh and some 20s um tick tock is going to be your young crowd be your young crowd be your young crowd so when you're looking at them you got so when you're looking at them you got so when you're looking at them you got to understand like who's where to understand like who's where to understand like who's where mostly we used to say don't post the mostly we used to say don't post the mostly we used to say don't post the same thing on all those same thing on all those same thing on all those because it'll be the same people seeing because it'll be the same people seeing because it'll be the same people seeing the same thing twice like that's not the same thing twice like that's not the same thing twice like that's not really true people kind of have one really true people kind of have one really true people kind of have one platform they really go to a lot platform they really go to a lot platform they really go to a lot so you really don't have a lot of so you really don't have a lot of so you really don't have a lot of overlap anymore but you have to change overlap anymore but you have to change overlap anymore but you have to change things around things around things around to fit those platforms so for facebook to fit those platforms so for facebook to fit those platforms so for facebook everything for facebook i think everything for facebook i think everything for facebook i think if you're if you're focused on your page if you're if you're focused on your page if you're if you're focused on your page you're going to get one percent or so you're going to get one percent or so you're going to get one percent or so people seeing what you post but if you people seeing what you post but if you people seeing what you post but if you use groups it's going to be higher use groups it's going to be higher use groups it's going to be higher and they're going to be able to be part and they're going to be able to be part and they're going to be able to be part of the conversation so i think groups of the conversation so i think groups of the conversation so i think groups are incredibly important going forward are incredibly important going forward are incredibly important going forward for churches and online ministry for churches and online ministry for churches and online ministry even if you only have one campus which even if you only have one campus which even if you only have one campus which is most of us is most of us is most of us you know start a facebook page and you know start a facebook page and you know start a facebook page and connect a facebook group for your church connect a facebook group for your church connect a facebook group for your church to that page to that page to that page and let the group be the thing where you and let the group be the thing where you and let the group be the thing where you put like put like put like you have moderators you have people you have moderators you have people you have moderators you have people interacting and your page can be about interacting and your page can be about interacting and your page can be about you know whatever your page is about um you know whatever your page is about um you know whatever your page is about um but but but i think community is a big focus for i think community is a big focus for i think community is a big focus for facebook facebook facebook you have to talk you have to you have to you have to talk you have to you have to you have to talk you have to you have to focus on conversations and community and focus on conversations and community and focus on conversations and community and for facebook and i think you do that and for facebook and i think you do that and for facebook and i think you do that and that's first that's first that's first not how flashy and cool is this content not how flashy and cool is this content not how flashy and cool is this content that's going to help you win on facebook that's going to help you win on facebook that's going to help you win on facebook and that's what it brings with instagram and that's what it brings with instagram and that's what it brings with instagram which is also owned by facebook which is also owned by facebook which is also owned by facebook it's a different platform mobile only it's a different platform mobile only it's a different platform mobile only pretty much i mean there's desktop pretty much i mean there's desktop pretty much i mean there's desktop versions but who cares versions but who cares versions but who cares but it's a mobile thing about but it's a mobile thing about but it's a mobile thing about photography so

photography so photography so let your pictures speak on facebook we let your pictures speak on facebook we let your pictures speak on facebook we do a lot of do a lot of do a lot of like created graphics for for instagram like created graphics for for instagram like created graphics for for instagram i should say i should say i should say and uh let your photography shine and uh let your photography shine and uh let your photography shine on instagram even and i hate to say this on instagram even and i hate to say this on instagram even and i hate to say this because even if you do like stock because even if you do like stock because even if you do like stock photography photography photography in your captions and things like that in your captions and things like that in your captions and things like that there's a way you can tell a story with there's a way you can tell a story with there's a way you can tell a story with a photo a photo a photo i don't recommend doing stock i don't recommend doing stock i don't recommend doing stock photography but sometimes that's better photography but sometimes that's better photography but sometimes that's better than than than some of the graphics that people are some of the graphics that people are some of the graphics that people are making yeah it's like making yeah it's like making yeah it's like choose your battles right um get a choose your battles right um get a choose your battles right um get a photographer do you photographer do you photographer do you do your best but phone cameras are do your best but phone cameras are do your best but phone cameras are pretty great but instagram is really pretty great but instagram is really pretty great but instagram is really more about more about more about display it engages in so many ways in display it engages in so many ways in display it engages in so many ways in stories if you're using stories that's stories if you're using stories that's stories if you're using stories that's super like super like super like one-to-one conversational engagement one-to-one conversational engagement one-to-one conversational engagement with all those stickers and polls and with all those stickers and polls and with all those stickers and polls and uh you they can go to your dms really uh you they can go to your dms really uh you they can go to your dms really quick but if you're talking about just quick but if you're talking about just quick but if you're talking about just the instagram feed which most churches the instagram feed which most churches the instagram feed which most churches only do only do only do with instagram which i think is a shame with instagram which i think is a shame with instagram which i think is a shame but if but if but if they're only posting the feed you have they're only posting the feed you have they're only posting the feed you have to think about to think about to think about how you're displaying your vision your how you're displaying your vision your how you're displaying your vision your values you're showing what's going on values you're showing what's going on values you're showing what's going on don't just talk about the fact that you don't just talk about the fact that you don't just talk about the fact that you believe things believe things believe things show how that stuff is going on in your show how that stuff is going on in your show how that stuff is going on in your church so church so church so any kind of think of it like reporting any kind of think of it like reporting any kind of think of it like reporting almost like here's what's happening almost like here's what's happening almost like here's what's happening at our church that's an instagram at our church that's an instagram at our church that's an instagram strength is that you can strength is that you can strength is that you can put up a picture of what it is you're put up a picture of what it is you're put up a picture of what it is you're trying to do as a church trying to do as a church trying to do as a church so community conversations on facebook

so community conversations on facebook so community conversations on facebook display display display instagram feed and on instagram stories instagram feed and on instagram stories instagram feed and on instagram stories and now reels and and now reels and and now reels and igtv which is igtv is great for certain igtv which is igtv is great for certain igtv which is igtv is great for certain long sermon clips and things like that long sermon clips and things like that long sermon clips and things like that all these different things you can all these different things you can all these different things you can display what's going on at your church display what's going on at your church display what's going on at your church and get people to interact with you and get people to interact with you and get people to interact with you one-to-one be active in those comments one-to-one be active in those comments one-to-one be active in those comments and dms for and dms for and dms for instagram or is going to be your time instagram or is going to be your time instagram or is going to be your time yeah so it's like you you said something yeah so it's like you you said something yeah so it's like you you said something that caught my attention that caught my attention that caught my attention it's like uh uh news reporting or it's like uh uh news reporting or it's like uh uh news reporting or actually storytelling actually storytelling actually storytelling yeah what your church is about through yeah what your church is about through yeah what your church is about through that story and that helps to if you're that story and that helps to if you're that story and that helps to if you're about about about you know community and you want to make you know community and you want to make you know community and you want to make an impact in community then how are an impact in community then how are an impact in community then how are change lives happening in your church change lives happening in your church change lives happening in your church because of impact in community and because of impact in community and because of impact in community and telling that story telling that story telling that story yeah it's like what story do you want to yeah it's like what story do you want to yeah it's like what story do you want to tell tell tell should be the first question and then should be the first question and then should be the first question and then say what photo can i get say what photo can i get say what photo can i get that that would show that story and then that that would show that story and then that that would show that story and then use your caption use your caption use your caption i'm surprised how many churches don't i'm surprised how many churches don't i'm surprised how many churches don't even fill in the caption they even fill in the caption they even fill in the caption they don't even write anything but use the don't even write anything but use the don't even write anything but use the caption to give that picture context caption to give that picture context caption to give that picture context so that people understand what you're so that people understand what you're so that people understand what you're talking about i'm not saying write a talking about i'm not saying write a talking about i'm not saying write a book or micro blog which you could book or micro blog which you could book or micro blog which you could but tell micro stories and but tell micro stories and but tell micro stories and uh my company church com team is that's uh my company church com team is that's uh my company church com team is that's one of the things we're focusing on with one of the things we're focusing on with one of the things we're focusing on with churches right now that we work with churches right now that we work with churches right now that we work with we we give you communication support for we we give you communication support for we we give you communication support for for churches remotely but for churches remotely but for churches remotely but we're trying to help them see how to we're trying to help them see how to we're trying to help them see how to tell micro stories and whenever we do tell micro stories and whenever we do tell micro stories and whenever we do that that that their social media engagement goes way their social media engagement goes way their social media engagement goes way up and that's just for facebook and

up and that's just for facebook and up and that's just for facebook and instagram as well instagram as well instagram as well but on instagram it's like it's a it's but on instagram it's like it's a it's but on instagram it's like it's a it's an art form an art form an art form you know that requires some attention you know that requires some attention you know that requires some attention but it but it's always but it but it's always but it but it's always better for your audience even if you better for your audience even if you better for your audience even if you don't get like the comments that you don't get like the comments that you don't get like the comments that you want on instagram want on instagram want on instagram almost it's okay if you're not getting almost it's okay if you're not getting almost it's okay if you're not getting comments on facebook it's like okay what comments on facebook it's like okay what comments on facebook it's like okay what are we doing wrong are we doing wrong are we doing wrong but if you're not getting comments on but if you're not getting comments on but if you're not getting comments on instagram feed it's like all right instagram feed it's like all right instagram feed it's like all right are we getting dms because what happens are we getting dms because what happens are we getting dms because what happens is we put out this content we work hard is we put out this content we work hard is we put out this content we work hard and then we people respond we don't talk and then we people respond we don't talk and then we people respond we don't talk back to them back to them back to them and that's a huge part of both those and that's a huge part of both those and that's a huge part of both those platforms algorithm platforms algorithm platforms algorithm showing it to more people is if the showing it to more people is if the showing it to more people is if the church or the or the church or the or the church or the or the the creator responds conversationally the creator responds conversationally the creator responds conversationally so you know there's so many elements to so you know there's so many elements to so you know there's so many elements to this that you this that you this that you you need someone who's focused on it um you need someone who's focused on it um you need someone who's focused on it um as far as twitter goes i don't know how as far as twitter goes i don't know how as far as twitter goes i don't know how twitter serves the church to be honest twitter serves the church to be honest twitter serves the church to be honest yeah i don't ever use it i think that yeah i don't ever use it i think that yeah i don't ever use it i think that your staff your staff your staff can definitely use it and you as a can definitely use it and you as a can definitely use it and you as a pastor you can use it individually pastor you can use it individually pastor you can use it individually and we definitely see some pastors using and we definitely see some pastors using and we definitely see some pastors using twitter as their themselves not the twitter as their themselves not the twitter as their themselves not the church church church right i think that twitter needs you to right i think that twitter needs you to right i think that twitter needs you to be personal in a way that be personal in a way that be personal in a way that is unlike the other two yeah so you're is unlike the other two yeah so you're is unlike the other two yeah so you're as as a church i don't see a lot of use as as a church i don't see a lot of use as as a church i don't see a lot of use for twitter to be honest i'm sure there for twitter to be honest i'm sure there for twitter to be honest i'm sure there are uses i never focus on it or worry are uses i never focus on it or worry are uses i never focus on it or worry about it at all about it at all about it at all um when i ran communications from my um when i ran communications from my um when i ran communications from my last church i didn't even we just last church i didn't even we just last church i didn't even we just shut it down we didn't even do it yeah shut it down we didn't even do it yeah shut it down we didn't even do it yeah um so um so um so and that's the other thing it's like and that's the other thing it's like and that's the other thing it's like they don't all you don't have to do them they don't all you don't have to do them they don't all you don't have to do them all do the one that works all do the one that works all do the one that works you know facebook and instagram are the you know facebook and instagram are the you know facebook and instagram are the big two to me

big two to me big two to me uh people are gonna always start with uh people are gonna always start with uh people are gonna always start with facebook but i think that you should facebook but i think that you should facebook but i think that you should move to instagram first mentality move to instagram first mentality move to instagram first mentality because when you do that what you post because when you do that what you post because when you do that what you post to instagram can be translated to to instagram can be translated to to instagram can be translated to facebook facebook facebook easily which you post to facebook cannot easily which you post to facebook cannot easily which you post to facebook cannot always be translated to instagram easily always be translated to instagram easily always be translated to instagram easily so if you think instagram first you'll so if you think instagram first you'll so if you think instagram first you'll be okay on both be okay on both be okay on both so that's that and plus you've got your so that's that and plus you've got your so that's that and plus you've got your 30s and 40s of those young families 30s and 40s of those young families 30s and 40s of those young families you've been trying to reach for so long you've been trying to reach for so long you've been trying to reach for so long they're on instagram that's the parents they're on instagram that's the parents they're on instagram that's the parents you know and what you know and what you know and what what you do there is going to matter what you do there is going to matter what you do there is going to matter that's right anyway that's right anyway that's right anyway well let's let's change gears let's talk well let's let's change gears let's talk well let's let's change gears let's talk about church communication directors about church communication directors about church communication directors right so i know you guys do a lot of right so i know you guys do a lot of right so i know you guys do a lot of consulting and you talk and consulting and you talk and consulting and you talk and and help a lot of church comms you're a and help a lot of church comms you're a and help a lot of church comms you're a former church communication director so former church communication director so former church communication director so am i am i am i yeah and so what are what are yeah and so what are what are yeah and so what are what are from what you're seeing what are church from what you're seeing what are church from what you're seeing what are church communication directors struggling with communication directors struggling with communication directors struggling with where do they need assistance what kind where do they need assistance what kind where do they need assistance what kind of questions should they be asking of questions should they be asking of questions should they be asking leadership in this time sure leadership in this time sure leadership in this time sure um i think they're struggling for well um i think they're struggling for well um i think they're struggling for well firstly firstly firstly their middle management and it's always their middle management and it's always their middle management and it's always hard to be middle management hard to be middle management hard to be middle management you have leaders who are above you you have leaders who are above you you have leaders who are above you making decisions and sometimes you're making decisions and sometimes you're making decisions and sometimes you're not privy to what's going into those not privy to what's going into those not privy to what's going into those decisions so decisions so decisions so you get it it's just like anybody else you get it it's just like anybody else you get it it's just like anybody else you get a decision handed to you and you get a decision handed to you and you get a decision handed to you and you're like you're like you're like what you i don't know what to do and what you i don't know what to do and what you i don't know what to do and then you also have then you also have then you also have you know your team or volunteers or you you know your team or volunteers or you you know your team or volunteers or you know you're by yourself and you have to know you're by yourself and you have to know you're by yourself and you have to work with work with work with others that um you know others that um you know others that um you know maybe that are under you in the org maybe that are under you in the org maybe that are under you in the org charter peers with you in the org chart

charter peers with you in the org chart charter peers with you in the org chart whatever whatever whatever and you're trying to get some things and you're trying to get some things and you're trying to get some things done and right now done and right now done and right now people that do not want to hear about people that do not want to hear about people that do not want to hear about requests and requests and requests and systems when everything's shot you know systems when everything's shot you know systems when everything's shot you know right right right like are you telling me i have to turn like are you telling me i have to turn like are you telling me i have to turn in a request that's fully i don't know i in a request that's fully i don't know i in a request that's fully i don't know i don't know what's going on man and i'm don't know what's going on man and i'm don't know what's going on man and i'm like i don't know what's going on either like i don't know what's going on either like i don't know what's going on either but i know i can't get anything done if but i know i can't get anything done if but i know i can't get anything done if you don't give me the info you don't give me the info you don't give me the info so you got to get the info um so we're so you got to get the info um so we're so you got to get the info um so we're chasing down things probably more than chasing down things probably more than chasing down things probably more than we ever have as communication directors we ever have as communication directors we ever have as communication directors so i think that what like i said earlier so i think that what like i said earlier so i think that what like i said earlier with internal communications that with internal communications that with internal communications that is something i think communication is something i think communication is something i think communication directors should focus on directors should focus on directors should focus on uh because i think we are uniquely uh because i think we are uniquely uh because i think we are uniquely positioned to be the one that actually positioned to be the one that actually positioned to be the one that actually makes that better makes that better makes that better other other we have to touch every staff other other we have to touch every staff other other we have to touch every staff position position position at some point on the church staff if at some point on the church staff if at some point on the church staff if you're the communication director you you're the communication director you you're the communication director you have to deal with have to deal with have to deal with all the way from your senior pastor to all the way from your senior pastor to all the way from your senior pastor to your to your volunteers because your to your volunteers because your to your volunteers because i i'd get emails when i was at my last i i'd get emails when i was at my last i i'd get emails when i was at my last church from church from church from random people who are like hey i'm on random people who are like hey i'm on random people who are like hey i'm on one of our softball teams and i need to one of our softball teams and i need to one of our softball teams and i need to get the logo get the logo get the logo for our jerseys and i'm like for our jerseys and i'm like for our jerseys and i'm like who are you i don't even i'm not sending who are you i don't even i'm not sending who are you i don't even i'm not sending our logo out to everybody you know like our logo out to everybody you know like our logo out to everybody you know like i don't know what's going on so it was i don't know what's going on so it was i don't know what's going on so it was who knows it's like being a youth pastor who knows it's like being a youth pastor who knows it's like being a youth pastor only for everybody's department only for everybody's department only for everybody's department you never know what you're gonna be you never know what you're gonna be you never know what you're gonna be doing that day um you know it's just a doing that day um you know it's just a doing that day um you know it's just a crazy crazy crazy crazy situation so i think crazy situation so i think crazy situation so i think focusing on internal communications and focusing on internal communications and focusing on internal communications and being being being you know the champion of just knowing you know the champion of just knowing you know the champion of just knowing what the heck's going on and making sure

what the heck's going on and making sure what the heck's going on and making sure so what that looks like um you have a so what that looks like um you have a so what that looks like um you have a conversation with a staff member let's conversation with a staff member let's conversation with a staff member let's say your pastor says something in say your pastor says something in say your pastor says something in passing passing passing or you know your executive pastor says i or you know your executive pastor says i or you know your executive pastor says i think we need to do this so think we need to do this so think we need to do this so here's what i want you to do and it here's what i want you to do and it here's what i want you to do and it gives you tasks you know this is true gives you tasks you know this is true gives you tasks you know this is true all right so all right so all right so send an email to your staff you know to send an email to your staff you know to send an email to your staff you know to your team your team your team and say here's what the pastor told me and say here's what the pastor told me and say here's what the pastor told me executive said to do executive said to do executive said to do copy your pastor on that so he knows copy your pastor on that so he knows copy your pastor on that so he knows what's going on if you have that what's going on if you have that what's going on if you have that relationship relationship relationship just make sure the people who need to just make sure the people who need to just make sure the people who need to know know what you just talked about know know what you just talked about know know what you just talked about it's over communication it feels like it's over communication it feels like it's over communication it feels like overkill but right now especially overkill but right now especially overkill but right now especially it helps everyone stay on the same page it helps everyone stay on the same page it helps everyone stay on the same page you are this you are this you are this pivot position that can pivot position that can pivot position that can get information and then put it in the get information and then put it in the get information and then put it in the inbox of someone that needs to know it inbox of someone that needs to know it inbox of someone that needs to know it without saying why didn't you tell you without saying why didn't you tell you without saying why didn't you tell you what you told me you know why didn't you what you told me you know why didn't you what you told me you know why didn't you tell them what you told me tell them what you told me tell them what you told me i thought we are on the same page i thought we are on the same page i thought we are on the same page because then you show up at the service because then you show up at the service because then you show up at the service and go and go and go tada i did all this hard work and the tada i did all this hard work and the tada i did all this hard work and the person that should have known that person that should have known that person that should have known that didn't know goes what the heck is this didn't know goes what the heck is this didn't know goes what the heck is this why did we do that why didn't you ask me why did we do that why didn't you ask me why did we do that why didn't you ask me about it let's not do it let's change it about it let's not do it let's change it about it let's not do it let's change it at the last minute and we're all like oh at the last minute and we're all like oh at the last minute and we're all like oh what do we do what do we do what do we do yeah well we didn't communicate that's yeah well we didn't communicate that's yeah well we didn't communicate that's what we didn't do you know and so what we didn't do you know and so what we didn't do you know and so i think when you're in this position i think when you're in this position i think when you're in this position it's extra work it's extra work it's extra work and doesn't feel like communications but and doesn't feel like communications but and doesn't feel like communications but it is in fact it is in fact it is in fact communicating with each other so when we communicating with each other so when we communicating with each other so when we focus focus focus on that i think it makes all the other on that i think it makes all the other on that i think it makes all the other things that we're trying to do in things that we're trying to do in things that we're trying to do in communications easier communications easier communications easier uh especially if we have a team that uh especially if we have a team that uh especially if we have a team that we're trying to lead we're trying to lead we're trying to lead and if you're blessed to be able to have

and if you're blessed to be able to have and if you're blessed to be able to have people that work with you in the same people that work with you in the same people that work with you in the same department department department communications then the hardest thing is communications then the hardest thing is communications then the hardest thing is being middle management being middle management being middle management and just being the informational hub for and just being the informational hub for and just being the informational hub for the church and the church and the church and making sure that everybody knows what making sure that everybody knows what making sure that everybody knows what they need to know and has the info they they need to know and has the info they they need to know and has the info they need and need and need and you ha that that makes them want to give you ha that that makes them want to give you ha that that makes them want to give it the info to you it the info to you it the info to you as well like oh you know seth is our as well like oh you know seth is our as well like oh you know seth is our comms person and comms person and comms person and you know he always tells me a bunch of you know he always tells me a bunch of you know he always tells me a bunch of stuff so when i find things out i stuff so when i find things out i stuff so when i find things out i have the president now oh i need to set have the president now oh i need to set have the president now oh i need to set this i wonder if he knows this i wonder if he knows this i wonder if he knows you know it's like they help you out so you know it's like they help you out so you know it's like they help you out so it just develops this culture of it just develops this culture of it just develops this culture of communicating well within communicating well within communicating well within you know our staff and leadership much you know our staff and leadership much you know our staff and leadership much less how do we communicate with our less how do we communicate with our less how do we communicate with our people people people you know it's it's the infrastructure you know it's it's the infrastructure you know it's it's the infrastructure that makes the that makes the that makes the the external communications work the external communications work the external communications work so um i don't know that's that's what i so um i don't know that's that's what i so um i don't know that's that's what i think communication directors should think communication directors should think communication directors should really focus on right now really focus on right now really focus on right now is that not not the overproduction of is that not not the overproduction of is that not not the overproduction of content the uh as far as like content the uh as far as like content the uh as far as like the shine you're gonna over produce a the shine you're gonna over produce a the shine you're gonna over produce a lot of content you know lot of content you know lot of content you know you're you're in over production mode uh you're you're in over production mode uh you're you're in over production mode uh that's fine that's fine that's fine but over communication mode needs to but over communication mode needs to but over communication mode needs to happen as well happen as well happen as well yeah that's really good advice uh just yeah that's really good advice uh just yeah that's really good advice uh just uh uh uh you because i think probably for you and you because i think probably for you and you because i think probably for you and the same thing for me i felt like the same thing for me i felt like the same thing for me i felt like such a burden to make sure that your such a burden to make sure that your such a burden to make sure that your event was super successful you know and event was super successful you know and event was super successful you know and they would rely on they would rely on they would rely on me and my department my team to make me and my department my team to make me and my department my team to make sure that there is plenty of people at sure that there is plenty of people at sure that there is plenty of people at their event their event their event well that's not happening anymore right

well that's not happening anymore right well that's not happening anymore right and you may not even be under the same and you may not even be under the same and you may not even be under the same roof roof roof anymore because of the social distancing anymore because of the social distancing anymore because of the social distancing rules and so i think that that key of rules and so i think that that key of rules and so i think that that key of uh in my opinion yeah obviously over uh in my opinion yeah obviously over uh in my opinion yeah obviously over communicating with the staff communicating with the staff communicating with the staff incredibly important you don't get into incredibly important you don't get into incredibly important you don't get into a bubble that's a bubble that's a bubble that's such that that that just causes storms such that that that just causes storms such that that that just causes storms fires that you don't want the other fires that you don't want the other fires that you don't want the other thing i think is you you in this space thing i think is you you in this space thing i think is you you in this space and in this and in this and in this this new it's not a new digital age but this new it's not a new digital age but this new it's not a new digital age but in this new direction that we have to go in this new direction that we have to go in this new direction that we have to go in in in i think communication directors just i think communication directors just i think communication directors just kind of constantly be fed kind of constantly be fed kind of constantly be fed they need to listen to guys like seth they need to listen to guys like seth they need to listen to guys like seth here they here they here they you gotta absorb what's going on around you gotta absorb what's going on around you gotta absorb what's going on around you you you outside of your world so that you can outside of your world so that you can outside of your world so that you can bring it into your world bring it into your world bring it into your world and really i and i you know leadership and really i and i you know leadership and really i and i you know leadership up up up like go up to leadership and inform them like go up to leadership and inform them like go up to leadership and inform them about what we should be doing why we about what we should be doing why we about what we should be doing why we should be doing it should be doing it should be doing it and not just going hey i have a wild and not just going hey i have a wild and not just going hey i have a wild idea no i have an idea and here's why idea no i have an idea and here's why idea no i have an idea and here's why and here's what i've seen happen before and here's what i've seen happen before and here's what i've seen happen before and this is the result works and this is the result works and this is the result works could expect if we go into the space and could expect if we go into the space and could expect if we go into the space and i think that's what a good communication i think that's what a good communication i think that's what a good communication director should do director should do director should do is don't try to feel like you can do it is don't try to feel like you can do it is don't try to feel like you can do it all on your own you don't have to all on your own you don't have to all on your own you don't have to there's so many resources guys like seth there's so many resources guys like seth there's so many resources guys like seth and emissional marketing that you can go and emissional marketing that you can go and emissional marketing that you can go and learn a ton and learn a ton and learn a ton about how to do this effectively yeah about how to do this effectively yeah about how to do this effectively yeah and that comes out of a relationship you and that comes out of a relationship you and that comes out of a relationship you know it's that the value of that walk know it's that the value of that walk know it's that the value of that walk down and hang out for a second ask how down and hang out for a second ask how down and hang out for a second ask how the kids were the kids were the kids were um another quick story there was a um another quick story there was a um another quick story there was a there's a guy at my former church that there's a guy at my former church that there's a guy at my former church that i'm still friends with today i'm still friends with today i'm still friends with today just does the marriage ministry there

just does the marriage ministry there just does the marriage ministry there and um and um and um you know his name is brock and brock was you know his name is brock and brock was you know his name is brock and brock was talking about he has re-engaged three talking about he has re-engaged three talking about he has re-engaged three nights a week you know nights a week you know nights a week you know all these different campuses and he's all these different campuses and he's all these different campuses and he's you know it's crazy you know it's crazy you know it's crazy right huge ministry at the church and so right huge ministry at the church and so right huge ministry at the church and so you know he was he was talking to me you know he was he was talking to me you know he was he was talking to me about how hard it was about how hard it was about how hard it was to get people to get people to get people to stick with their appointments to stick with their appointments to stick with their appointments and he's like because what happened was and he's like because what happened was and he's like because what happened was he we were like let's go to lunch he we were like let's go to lunch he we were like let's go to lunch and he goes well i can't have an and he goes well i can't have an and he goes well i can't have an appointment and then he was like well appointment and then he was like well appointment and then he was like well they just didn't they just didn't they just didn't show up do you want to go ahead and go show up do you want to go ahead and go show up do you want to go ahead and go and i was like yeah let's go so um and i was like yeah let's go so um and i was like yeah let's go so um he was telling me about what happened he was telling me about what happened he was telling me about what happened and i was like well have you heard of and i was like well have you heard of and i was like well have you heard of calendly calendly calendly he goes what's calendly and i was like he goes what's calendly and i was like he goes what's calendly and i was like oh my gosh you serious you don't use oh my gosh you serious you don't use oh my gosh you serious you don't use calendly to book appointments calendly to book appointments calendly to book appointments and he goes no we just email back and and he goes no we just email back and and he goes no we just email back and forth and look at our calendars and forth and look at our calendars and forth and look at our calendars and trying to work it out and i'm like trying to work it out and i'm like trying to work it out and i'm like well i mean that works but well i mean that works but well i mean that works but have you ever had a talent so it's like have you ever had a talent so it's like have you ever had a talent so it's like i i i showed him what it what it can do this showed him what it what it can do this showed him what it what it can do this little free little free little free program that he can connect with his program that he can connect with his program that he can connect with his calendar calendar calendar and provide slots for people to sign up and provide slots for people to sign up and provide slots for people to sign up for for for put all the appointment scheduling on put all the appointment scheduling on put all the appointment scheduling on him on the the people him on the the people him on the the people and then automatically sends them links and then automatically sends them links and then automatically sends them links automatically sends the calendar to them automatically sends the calendar to them automatically sends the calendar to them and he was like this has changed my life and he was like this has changed my life and he was like this has changed my life this has absolutely changed my life this this has absolutely changed my life this this has absolutely changed my life this is so much better is so much better is so much better and i was like i can't believe you and i was like i can't believe you and i was like i can't believe you didn't know about that well didn't know about that well didn't know about that well that's basic for me but we were talking that's basic for me but we were talking that's basic for me but we were talking before like i'm kind of shocked at how

before like i'm kind of shocked at how before like i'm kind of shocked at how little you know some some church little you know some some church little you know some some church leadership are aware of these amazing leadership are aware of these amazing leadership are aware of these amazing digital tools that are available to them digital tools that are available to them digital tools that are available to them they don't even know they exist much they don't even know they exist much they don't even know they exist much less everybody uses less everybody uses less everybody uses except for them right we all use them except for them right we all use them except for them right we all use them we're like we're like we're like mailchimp what you know it's like yes mailchimp what you know it's like yes mailchimp what you know it's like yes these things are these things are these things are free you know these are google is free free you know these are google is free free you know these are google is free like you know what all the google suite like you know what all the google suite like you know what all the google suite can do can do can do oh my lord what's google yeah it's like oh my lord what's google yeah it's like oh my lord what's google yeah it's like i use it for email and like do you know i use it for email and like do you know i use it for email and like do you know do you drive you have do you drive you have do you drive you have you know calendar and like do you know you know calendar and like do you know you know calendar and like do you know how this works how this works how this works and it's like i'm not saying like and it's like i'm not saying like and it's like i'm not saying like pastors are dumb they they definitely pastors are dumb they they definitely pastors are dumb they they definitely know a lot about technology and know a lot about technology and know a lot about technology and especially in the apple world especially in the apple world especially in the apple world but there are so many little things like but there are so many little things like but there are so many little things like that that are just that that are just that that are just free little extras that make their life free little extras that make their life free little extras that make their life so much easier so much easier so much easier that as a communication director our old that as a communication director our old that as a communication director our old hat hat hat to us you know that we know all about so to us you know that we know all about so to us you know that we know all about so helping them connect those dots just helping them connect those dots just helping them connect those dots just through the conversation like well through the conversation like well through the conversation like well you know what you could do you know that you know what you could do you know that you know what you could do you know that relational relational relational conversation is where i think conversation is where i think conversation is where i think communication directors communication directors communication directors can really serve the pastors in a way can really serve the pastors in a way can really serve the pastors in a way that they didn't know they needed that they didn't know they needed that they didn't know they needed absolutely well if we go back into february and we asked if we go back into february and we asked 10 pastors hey you ever heard of zoom 10 pastors hey you ever heard of zoom 10 pastors hey you ever heard of zoom you're probably going to get eight of you're probably going to get eight of you're probably going to get eight of them or nine of them going what's them or nine of them going what's them or nine of them going what's what are you talking about yeah now it's what are you talking about yeah now it's what are you talking about yeah now it's like i'm sick of zoom like i'm sick of zoom like i'm sick of zoom but it's such a we're doing this right but it's such a we're doing this right but it's such a we're doing this right now on zoom it's such a powerful now on zoom it's such a powerful now on zoom it's such a powerful powerful tool that can be used for powerful tool that can be used for powerful tool that can be used for discipleship

discipleship discipleship and they weren't ready either i mean and they weren't ready either i mean and they weren't ready either i mean zoom was like zoom was like zoom was like when everybody started using it it was when everybody started using it it was when everybody started using it it was like wow we have security issues we need like wow we have security issues we need like wow we have security issues we need to address to address to address you know when they had to adjust you you know when they had to adjust you you know when they had to adjust you know they're not immune to it we're all know they're not immune to it we're all know they're not immune to it we're all trying to figure things out but trying to figure things out but trying to figure things out but um you know approaching this stuff with um you know approaching this stuff with um you know approaching this stuff with some humility and realizing there's some humility and realizing there's some humility and realizing there's things you don't know things you don't know things you don't know and that this 20-something kid you've and that this 20-something kid you've and that this 20-something kid you've got volunteering in your comms got volunteering in your comms got volunteering in your comms department department department might be able to make your ministry of might be able to make your ministry of might be able to make your ministry of 30 years 30 years 30 years really powerful right now because of really powerful right now because of really powerful right now because of things things things they know that you don't know yeah they know that you don't know yeah they know that you don't know yeah and i think it's it's just it's and i think it's it's just it's and i think it's it's just it's connecting the dots because you connecting the dots because you connecting the dots because you have pastor you have the most incredible have pastor you have the most incredible have pastor you have the most incredible message message message ever and we want to go where you bottle ever and we want to go where you bottle ever and we want to go where you bottle that up and get it out there has got to that up and get it out there has got to that up and get it out there has got to change change change yeah and we want that like communication yeah and we want that like communication yeah and we want that like communication directors are not with a wet blanket directors are not with a wet blanket directors are not with a wet blanket that you sometimes get that you sometimes get that you sometimes get get pegged as is the well we can't do get pegged as is the well we can't do get pegged as is the well we can't do that and here's why we can't do it and that and here's why we can't do it and that and here's why we can't do it and we need to not do that we need to not do that we need to not do that we need to not be that way but because we need to not be that way but because we need to not be that way but because we're typically more how people than wow we're typically more how people than wow we're typically more how people than wow people people people in general and so the wow people are in general and so the wow people are in general and so the wow people are typically the pastors who go typically the pastors who go typically the pastors who go wouldn't it be great if we did this and wouldn't it be great if we did this and wouldn't it be great if we did this and we're like well how would we do that we're like well how would we do that we're like well how would we do that and i was like oh sad trombone you know and i was like oh sad trombone you know and i was like oh sad trombone you know but we but we but we we definitely have the know-how to make we definitely have the know-how to make we definitely have the know-how to make those things happen and those things happen and those things happen and want those things to happen you know for want those things to happen you know for want those things to happen you know for you and your ministry we want to see you you and your ministry we want to see you you and your ministry we want to see you reach more people we want to see reach more people we want to see reach more people we want to see the message be seen by more people uh the message be seen by more people uh the message be seen by more people uh you know and more people come to christ you know and more people come to christ you know and more people come to christ i mean that's i mean that's i mean that's why we do this exactly it is so why we do this exactly it is so why we do this exactly it is so important to us important to us important to us that you do it a certain way because that you do it a certain way because that you do it a certain way because it's more successful

it's more successful it's more successful which means more people hear the gospel which means more people hear the gospel which means more people hear the gospel which means that what you're trying to which means that what you're trying to which means that what you're trying to do and what we're trying to do are the do and what we're trying to do are the do and what we're trying to do are the same same same thing so understanding that thing so understanding that thing so understanding that you know that's the mission behind you know that's the mission behind you know that's the mission behind why do we nerd out over google and how why do we nerd out over google and how why do we nerd out over google and how many people many people many people saw a video it's because saw a video it's because saw a video it's because that matters to their eternity yeah that matters to their eternity yeah that matters to their eternity yeah and and we want to be we're doing our and and we want to be we're doing our and and we want to be we're doing our part to to uh part to to uh part to to uh to help them with that and i think to help them with that and i think to help them with that and i think sometimes we don't see that as we're all sometimes we don't see that as we're all sometimes we don't see that as we're all in the in the in the trying to do the same thing yep yep trying to do the same thing yep yep trying to do the same thing yep yep well as we kind of close up here this well as we kind of close up here this well as we kind of close up here this has been amazing thank you has been amazing thank you has been amazing thank you so much for your input talk to me a so much for your input talk to me a so much for your input talk to me a little bit about what you're doing little bit about what you're doing little bit about what you're doing uh how can churches connect with you uh uh how can churches connect with you uh uh how can churches connect with you uh how are you helping and and where you how are you helping and and where you how are you helping and and where you know where do churches go to know where do churches go to know where do churches go to to learn more about seth and what he's to learn more about seth and what he's to learn more about seth and what he's doing right well doing right well doing right well personally you can go to sethmuse.com my personally you can go to sethmuse.com my personally you can go to sethmuse.com my blog podcast at the seminary of hard blog podcast at the seminary of hard blog podcast at the seminary of hard knocks is my podcast knocks is my podcast knocks is my podcast you can subscribe that would be great you can subscribe that would be great you can subscribe that would be great for the church where i could probably for the church where i could probably for the church where i could probably serve you the most is why i left the serve you the most is why i left the serve you the most is why i left the official position of my church official position of my church official position of my church is to start a company called church com is to start a company called church com is to start a company called church com team which you can find at team which you can find at team which you can find at churchcomteam.com churchcomteam.com churchcomteam.com and what it is is we are remote and what it is is we are remote and what it is is we are remote communication support for churches who communication support for churches who communication support for churches who desperately need it desperately need it desperately need it we can either lead your team or support we can either lead your team or support we can either lead your team or support staff you have there staff you have there staff you have there when it comes to social media or website when it comes to social media or website when it comes to social media or website development development development things like that um creating ads things like that um creating ads things like that um creating ads creating creating creating you know all the things that you have to you know all the things that you have to you know all the things that you have to do uh you get a team of professionals

do uh you get a team of professionals do uh you get a team of professionals for less than the price you pay of a for less than the price you pay of a for less than the price you pay of a full-time employee per year full-time employee per year full-time employee per year and uh it's it's a good deal we price it and uh it's it's a good deal we price it and uh it's it's a good deal we price it that way to be of value to churches that way to be of value to churches that way to be of value to churches because that's my heart because that's my heart because that's my heart i want to see them succeed in this area i want to see them succeed in this area i want to see them succeed in this area and i know that they often and i know that they often and i know that they often like we've been talking about are like we've been talking about are like we've been talking about are frustrated and don't have the manpower frustrated and don't have the manpower frustrated and don't have the manpower don't have the know-how don't have the know-how don't have the know-how i don't have the time to get everything i don't have the time to get everything i don't have the time to get everything done that require that square one of done that require that square one of done that require that square one of basic communications requires now basic communications requires now basic communications requires now square one of communications has grown square one of communications has grown square one of communications has grown from what you need to be a basic from what you need to be a basic from what you need to be a basic functioning communicate digital functioning communicate digital functioning communicate digital communications hub for communications hub for communications hub for your people is is so vast your people is is so vast your people is is so vast from website seo you know google search from website seo you know google search from website seo you know google search stuff which you guys do a great job with stuff which you guys do a great job with stuff which you guys do a great job with yeah um website development social media yeah um website development social media yeah um website development social media content content planning content content planning content content planning all of that project management we do all all of that project management we do all all of that project management we do all that so that so that so um it's it's a company that um it's it's a company that um it's it's a company that is really important to me i believe one is really important to me i believe one is really important to me i believe one of the reasons i left my one church so i of the reasons i left my one church so i of the reasons i left my one church so i could help could help could help multiple churches because we saw multiple churches because we saw multiple churches because we saw a need um and right now it's a need um and right now it's a need um and right now it's it's going well we're having a blast it's going well we're having a blast it's going well we're having a blast doing it uh doing it uh doing it uh working with churches from texas to working with churches from texas to working with churches from texas to florida and florida and florida and it's uh which i'm in texas but um you it's uh which i'm in texas but um you it's uh which i'm in texas but um you know taking on new clients for 2021 know taking on new clients for 2021 know taking on new clients for 2021 and you know in the fall and we we're and you know in the fall and we we're and you know in the fall and we we're having a great time doing so having a great time doing so having a great time doing so churchcom team.com is what i'm really churchcom team.com is what i'm really churchcom team.com is what i'm really focused on right now or you can focused on right now or you can focused on right now or you can subscribe to my podcast the seminary of subscribe to my podcast the seminary of subscribe to my podcast the seminary of hard knocks that's how you connect with hard knocks that's how you connect with hard knocks that's how you connect with me me me yeah and i'd encourage you to do that

yeah and i'd encourage you to do that yeah and i'd encourage you to do that because i you know looking at your because i you know looking at your because i you know looking at your podcast you guys put out a lot of great podcast you guys put out a lot of great podcast you guys put out a lot of great content a lot of stuff that content a lot of stuff that content a lot of stuff that you you know any any church staff member you you know any any church staff member you you know any any church staff member needs to listen to needs to listen to needs to listen to right and it's not like don't church right and it's not like don't church right and it's not like don't church don't don't don't be so uh arrogant enough to think that be so uh arrogant enough to think that be so uh arrogant enough to think that well our comms team they're the ones well our comms team they're the ones well our comms team they're the ones that that that handle all this stuff when it comes to handle all this stuff when it comes to handle all this stuff when it comes to digital no i think the whole digital no i think the whole digital no i think the whole staff needs to learn about where this is staff needs to learn about where this is staff needs to learn about where this is going going going and it's just in my opinion you know the and it's just in my opinion you know the and it's just in my opinion you know the church calm guy is the one who's going church calm guy is the one who's going church calm guy is the one who's going to go deeper into it to go deeper into it to go deeper into it but we all need to learn so right no but we all need to learn so right no but we all need to learn so right no matter what position you play matter what position you play matter what position you play if you're a volunteer or you the lead if you're a volunteer or you the lead if you're a volunteer or you the lead pastor pastor pastor be tuning into this stuff absorb it and be tuning into this stuff absorb it and be tuning into this stuff absorb it and have a conversation with seth have a conversation with seth have a conversation with seth about what that could look like and i'm about what that could look like and i'm about what that could look like and i'm just a big fan i did this at my church i just a big fan i did this at my church i just a big fan i did this at my church i i believe in surrounding myself with i believe in surrounding myself with i believe in surrounding myself with vendors vendors vendors or or volunteers but vendors that or or volunteers but vendors that or or volunteers but vendors that were experts at what they did and with were experts at what they did and with were experts at what they did and with good value right it's not like we're you good value right it's not like we're you good value right it's not like we're you know trying to take advantage but know trying to take advantage but know trying to take advantage but yeah i never liked i never liked it when yeah i never liked i never liked it when yeah i never liked i never liked it when somebody somebody somebody said i should pay you know x amount of said i should pay you know x amount of said i should pay you know x amount of dollars and dollars and dollars and this is all they do um i was more about this is all they do um i was more about this is all they do um i was more about like like like what kind of value do you bring in terms what kind of value do you bring in terms what kind of value do you bring in terms of helping me achieve what my mission's of helping me achieve what my mission's of helping me achieve what my mission's about about about and you know price isn't really the and you know price isn't really the and you know price isn't really the biggest thing at this point it's biggest thing at this point it's biggest thing at this point it's it's i want to put out really really it's i want to put out really really it's i want to put out really really good quality and i want to put out good quality and i want to put out good quality and i want to put out in good you know a good amount of time in good you know a good amount of time in good you know a good amount of time like a timely quality right like a timely quality right like a timely quality right price doesn't really always matter at price doesn't really always matter at price doesn't really always matter at that point but i'm just such a big that point but i'm just such a big that point but i'm just such a big believer in surrounding myself with

believer in surrounding myself with believer in surrounding myself with people that are talented who know what people that are talented who know what people that are talented who know what they're talking about yeah they're talking about yeah they're talking about yeah seth knows what he's talking about so seth knows what he's talking about so seth knows what he's talking about so i'd encourage you to reach out to him i'd encourage you to reach out to him i'd encourage you to reach out to him and and and and uh have a conversation and just if and uh have a conversation and just if and uh have a conversation and just if anything just absorb and learn it anything just absorb and learn it anything just absorb and learn it we i think you and i both have the same we i think you and i both have the same we i think you and i both have the same heart as i lead our company it's all heart as i lead our company it's all heart as i lead our company it's all about about about educating and equipping because i want educating and equipping because i want educating and equipping because i want you to win you to win you to win when the church wins we all win that's when the church wins we all win that's when the church wins we all win that's one of the benefits one of the benefits one of the benefits that we offer is like especially in our that we offer is like especially in our that we offer is like especially in our top tier we'll come and actually do a top tier we'll come and actually do a top tier we'll come and actually do a whole seminar for your whole staff whole seminar for your whole staff whole seminar for your whole staff yeah those tier to tell them how to be yeah those tier to tell them how to be yeah those tier to tell them how to be part of social media part of social media part of social media why is this important why is digital why is this important why is digital why is this important why is digital imported whether it's you know imported whether it's you know imported whether it's you know quarantine time or not you know it's quarantine time or not you know it's quarantine time or not you know it's it's going to be always important it's going to be always important it's going to be always important like you've got a kids pastor who could like you've got a kids pastor who could like you've got a kids pastor who could be killing it on instagram or social or be killing it on instagram or social or be killing it on instagram or social or tic toc or whatever and they aren't tic toc or whatever and they aren't tic toc or whatever and they aren't doing it at all it's like how do you doing it at all it's like how do you doing it at all it's like how do you show them what they can what they can do show them what they can what they can do show them what they can what they can do and why they should do it it's like and why they should do it it's like and why they should do it it's like that's part of what our company does is that's part of what our company does is that's part of what our company does is is uh we don't just focus on executing is uh we don't just focus on executing is uh we don't just focus on executing tasks tasks tasks it's about coaching and training for it's about coaching and training for it's about coaching and training for your staff for your leadership your staff for your leadership your staff for your leadership uh we do a lot of things that bridge uh we do a lot of things that bridge uh we do a lot of things that bridge that gap we've been talking today that gap we've been talking today that gap we've been talking today between between between leadership and communications teams and leadership and communications teams and leadership and communications teams and communications teams and volunteer teams communications teams and volunteer teams communications teams and volunteer teams and how to work with your other staff and how to work with your other staff and how to work with your other staff that are peers and that are peers and that are peers and who don't want to use the process or who don't want to use the process or who don't want to use the process or whatever you know like how do you get whatever you know like how do you get whatever you know like how do you get through that we do a lot of work in that through that we do a lot of work in that through that we do a lot of work in that area area area for our team that uh really does change for our team that uh really does change for our team that uh really does change the dynamic of whether or not you're the dynamic of whether or not you're the dynamic of whether or not you're successful in the execution successful in the execution successful in the execution at all because you can work on execution at all because you can work on execution at all because you can work on execution all day and only get to a point where all day and only get to a point where all day and only get to a point where if people don't get along or they don't if people don't get along or they don't if people don't get along or they don't work well together it's just never going work well together it's just never going work well together it's just never going to to to work so um you know you got to be on the

work so um you know you got to be on the work so um you know you got to be on the same page so we do a lot of that we call same page so we do a lot of that we call same page so we do a lot of that we call that internal communications we focus on that internal communications we focus on that internal communications we focus on internal communications and external internal communications and external internal communications and external communications for your church communications for your church communications for your church and uh you know because that's a big and uh you know because that's a big and uh you know because that's a big deal you know it's a huge deal deal you know it's a huge deal deal you know it's a huge deal you got to go train people how to they you got to go train people how to they you got to go train people how to they don't they don't know don't they don't know don't they don't know they don't know how to do it i used to they don't know how to do it i used to they don't know how to do it i used to run 30-something facebook groups for my run 30-something facebook groups for my run 30-something facebook groups for my last church last church last church uh the only way we did that is because i uh the only way we did that is because i uh the only way we did that is because i had people on staff that were had people on staff that were had people on staff that were responsible for each of these groups responsible for each of these groups responsible for each of these groups trained them how to do it gave them trained them how to do it gave them trained them how to do it gave them content ideas content ideas content ideas uh followed up with them we even did uh followed up with them we even did uh followed up with them we even did like a like a like a i don't know was it sunday social.tv and i don't know was it sunday social.tv and i don't know was it sunday social.tv and i'd grab some graphics i hear share some i'd grab some graphics i hear share some i'd grab some graphics i hear share some of this you know and of this you know and of this you know and um you know just easy low-hanging fruit um you know just easy low-hanging fruit um you know just easy low-hanging fruit is out there that your comments director is out there that your comments director is out there that your comments director can can can can help with but um you know your staff can help with but um you know your staff can help with but um you know your staff have to be on board with have to be on board with have to be on board with doing it the only reason they did it is doing it the only reason they did it is doing it the only reason they did it is because we started a group we were because we started a group we were because we started a group we were starting a campus starting a campus starting a campus uh and and we took a facebook group that uh and and we took a facebook group that uh and and we took a facebook group that grew up from 180 to a thousand launched grew up from 180 to a thousand launched grew up from 180 to a thousand launched with over a thousand people with over a thousand people with over a thousand people and i think that facebook group was a and i think that facebook group was a and i think that facebook group was a big part of it wasn't the only reason big part of it wasn't the only reason big part of it wasn't the only reason but that was a big part of it but that was a big part of it but that was a big part of it because everybody got involved they because everybody got involved they because everybody got involved they started doing um started doing um started doing um kind of people were so excited to have kind of people were so excited to have kind of people were so excited to have that campus in that in their area they that campus in that in their area they that campus in that in their area they started to started to started to organize high school small groups and organize high school small groups and organize high school small groups and meetups and get-togethers and meetups and get-togethers and meetups and get-togethers and our staff were like whoa what's going on our staff were like whoa what's going on our staff were like whoa what's going on what's happening we're not ready for what's happening we're not ready for what's happening we're not ready for that that that like people are ready man they're like people are ready man they're like people are ready man they're they're not waiting on you they're not waiting on you they're not waiting on you and it was the facebook group that and it was the facebook group that and it was the facebook group that started that it gave it so much momentum started that it gave it so much momentum started that it gave it so much momentum going forward i mean just so many things going forward i mean just so many things going forward i mean just so many things can happen can happen can happen so we modeled our other campus groups so we modeled our other campus groups so we modeled our other campus groups after that group after that it was like after that group after that it was like after that group after that it was like here's what you can do here's what you can do here's what you can do here's how you do it go do it and the here's how you do it go do it and the here's how you do it go do it and the whole thing hinged on the fact

whole thing hinged on the fact whole thing hinged on the fact that that campus pastor who was new who that that campus pastor who was new who that that campus pastor who was new who called it the facebook before this called it the facebook before this called it the facebook before this became such an incredible online became such an incredible online became such an incredible online minister minister minister in that group i'll never forget having in that group i'll never forget having in that group i'll never forget having that conversation he was in my office that conversation he was in my office that conversation he was in my office and it was such a cool moment too he he and it was such a cool moment too he he and it was such a cool moment too he he we had this whole conversation about we had this whole conversation about we had this whole conversation about ministry and online how he can use video ministry and online how he can use video ministry and online how he can use video to train his volunteers and to train his volunteers and to train his volunteers and tell people what to do and uh when they tell people what to do and uh when they tell people what to do and uh when they get to the to the church and get to the to the church and get to the to the church and you know share vision and how often he you know share vision and how often he you know share vision and how often he should do it and he was like really should do it and he was like really should do it and he was like really that's i don't have to that's i don't have to that's i don't have to get in the studio every time and he was get in the studio every time and he was get in the studio every time and he was blown away blown away blown away and uh dude's in his 50s and uh dude's in his 50s and uh dude's in his 50s and he walked out he was walking out of and he walked out he was walking out of and he walked out he was walking out of my office i remember he stopped in my my office i remember he stopped in my my office i remember he stopped in my doorway doorway doorway with his back to me this was such a with his back to me this was such a with his back to me this was such a comic book moment any any comic book moment any any comic book moment any any oh man uh he looks over his shoulders oh man uh he looks over his shoulders oh man uh he looks over his shoulders kind of kind of kind of as this typical you know anime glance as this typical you know anime glance as this typical you know anime glance back back back and goes this facebook group is my cam and goes this facebook group is my cam and goes this facebook group is my cam is my church until i have a campus right is my church until i have a campus right is my church until i have a campus right and i went yep he went got it and he and i went yep he went got it and he and i went yep he went got it and he walked out walked out walked out i was like it's gonna be good and he i was like it's gonna be good and he i was like it's gonna be good and he just then proceeded to kill it just then proceeded to kill it just then proceeded to kill it uh he's the reason that group grew and uh he's the reason that group grew and uh he's the reason that group grew and why they launched with that why they launched with that why they launched with that kind of momentum and it was just amazing kind of momentum and it was just amazing kind of momentum and it was just amazing to watch to watch to watch wow guy was named mike mike had called wow guy was named mike mike had called wow guy was named mike mike had called it the facebook until then it the facebook until then it the facebook until then and i somehow convinced him this was and i somehow convinced him this was and i somehow convinced him this was going to help him and he bought in full going to help him and he bought in full going to help him and he bought in full full steam and man it launched full steam and man it launched full steam and man it launched mind shift of how you can do ministry

mind shift of how you can do ministry mind shift of how you can do ministry yeah yeah yeah it was like i remember the moment when it was like i remember the moment when it was like i remember the moment when the light bulb went on he was like this the light bulb went on he was like this the light bulb went on he was like this is my is my is my this is my church this is my campus it's this is my church this is my campus it's this is my church this is my campus it's facebook facebook facebook isn't it i was like yeah yeah isn't it i was like yeah yeah isn't it i was like yeah yeah yeah powerful stuff it's like cue the yeah powerful stuff it's like cue the yeah powerful stuff it's like cue the music man music man music man it might drop you the slow-mo armageddon it might drop you the slow-mo armageddon it might drop you the slow-mo armageddon walk out of my office and some awesome walk out of my office and some awesome walk out of my office and some awesome music music music it was great it's like that's what i it was great it's like that's what i it was great it's like that's what i live for those moments when that light live for those moments when that light live for those moments when that light bulb goes off bulb goes off bulb goes off and it seemed just do so great with it and it seemed just do so great with it and it seemed just do so great with it it was awesome it was awesome it was awesome it was good to see yeah well cool well it was good to see yeah well cool well it was good to see yeah well cool well thank you thank you thank you again and uh uh we'll put some links on again and uh uh we'll put some links on again and uh uh we'll put some links on this podcast so you can check out uh this podcast so you can check out uh this podcast so you can check out uh seth and his uh his company and seth and his uh his company and seth and his uh his company and man just thank you for what you're doing man just thank you for what you're doing man just thank you for what you're doing for the kingdom brother you're uh you're for the kingdom brother you're uh you're for the kingdom brother you're uh you're making an impact so appreciate you making an impact so appreciate you making an impact so appreciate you my pleasure thanks for having me on this my pleasure thanks for having me on this my pleasure thanks for having me on this is awesome all right we'll talk to you soon soon well thanks seth boy that was great well thanks seth boy that was great well thanks seth boy that was great conversation uh a lot of takeaways from conversation uh a lot of takeaways from conversation uh a lot of takeaways from that as that as that as as leaders in the church space right one as leaders in the church space right one as leaders in the church space right one of the things i think that we need to of the things i think that we need to of the things i think that we need to really be focusing on is how do we really be focusing on is how do we really be focusing on is how do we lead during this time and if you're lead during this time and if you're lead during this time and if you're having questions about what does online having questions about what does online having questions about what does online ministry look like ministry look like ministry look like and and how can we be more creative with and and how can we be more creative with and and how can we be more creative with our content i recommend our content i recommend our content i recommend you either reach out to seth right so you either reach out to seth right so you either reach out to seth right so seth has seth has seth has his uh his website you can go there his uh his website you can go there his uh his website you can go there sethmuse.com or sethmuse.com or sethmuse.com or you can certainly go to you can certainly go to you can certainly go to church.comteam.com church.comteam.com church.comteam.com um or talk to us at missional marketing um or talk to us at missional marketing um or talk to us at missional marketing right we

right we right we we'd love to help you understand how to we'd love to help you understand how to we'd love to help you understand how to get better when it comes to creating an get better when it comes to creating an get better when it comes to creating an online church culture much deeper than online church culture much deeper than online church culture much deeper than just just just putting your sermons out on the weekends putting your sermons out on the weekends putting your sermons out on the weekends right it's a lot more right it's a lot more right it's a lot more involved than that so another thing seth involved than that so another thing seth involved than that so another thing seth said that was really intriguing was the said that was really intriguing was the said that was really intriguing was the fact that we have to fact that we have to fact that we have to be focused on not just necessarily be focused on not just necessarily be focused on not just necessarily having the best studios or having the having the best studios or having the having the best studios or having the best equipment best equipment best equipment but really being creative and thinking but really being creative and thinking but really being creative and thinking through and through and through and leaning on stories let stories tell the leaning on stories let stories tell the leaning on stories let stories tell the story story story and uh that doesn't take uh a lot of and uh that doesn't take uh a lot of and uh that doesn't take uh a lot of money and resources it takes your your money and resources it takes your your money and resources it takes your your mind and your mind and your mind and your creativity and energy and time and creativity and energy and time and creativity and energy and time and effort to focus on that effort to focus on that effort to focus on that and so i think it's really important for and so i think it's really important for and so i think it's really important for us as leaders in the church space to be us as leaders in the church space to be us as leaders in the church space to be mindful about what this gift we have mindful about what this gift we have mindful about what this gift we have that i think you know covid can be kind that i think you know covid can be kind that i think you know covid can be kind of of of silver lined as a gift to be able to silver lined as a gift to be able to silver lined as a gift to be able to reset reset reset and hit hit the reset button and move and hit hit the reset button and move and hit hit the reset button and move forward forward forward intentionally about not only connecting intentionally about not only connecting intentionally about not only connecting with people that are far from god with people that are far from god with people that are far from god un-church people but also people in your un-church people but also people in your un-church people but also people in your church right church right church right and and actually growing your church and and actually growing your church and and actually growing your church and so uh again go check out seth go and so uh again go check out seth go and so uh again go check out seth go check out missional marketing take a check out missional marketing take a check out missional marketing take a look at our blog we've got a ton of look at our blog we've got a ton of look at our blog we've got a ton of content on there content on there content on there hope you really enjoyed today's podcast hope you really enjoyed today's podcast hope you really enjoyed today's podcast until next time god bless

until next time god bless until next time god bless [Music]