Clarity Over Creativity | Rachael Branson

[Music] [Music] we want to make sure that we're we want to make sure that we're we want to make sure that we're communicating about them in an effective communicating about them in an effective communicating about them in an effective and efficient way so that they know what and efficient way so that they know what and efficient way so that they know what their next steps are if it's confusing their next steps are if it's confusing their next steps are if it's confusing or anything we always say Clarity over or anything we always say Clarity over or anything we always say Clarity over creativity right we want a very clear creativity right we want a very clear creativity right we want a very clear message um so that they know what is my message um so that they know what is my message um so that they know what is my next step in my faith journey and so next step in my faith journey and so next step in my faith journey and so that's our role um I don't expect the that's our role um I don't expect the that's our role um I don't expect the Ministries to know that that's our role Ministries to know that that's our role Ministries to know that that's our role a a Communications Department to be able a a Communications Department to be able a a Communications Department to be able to guide them and give them the best to guide them and give them the best to guide them and give them the best resources to resources to resources to communicate well hey Rachel thank you communicate well hey Rachel thank you communicate well hey Rachel thank you for joining us how you doing today I am for joining us how you doing today I am for joining us how you doing today I am doing great thanks so much for having me doing great thanks so much for having me doing great thanks so much for having me I really appreciate it oh glad to have I really appreciate it oh glad to have I really appreciate it oh glad to have you on the show and I'm really excited you on the show and I'm really excited you on the show and I'm really excited about our conversation because you and I about our conversation because you and I about our conversation because you and I are uh have the same kind of a path and are uh have the same kind of a path and are uh have the same kind of a path and we we were in the marketplace came to we we were in the marketplace came to we we were in the marketplace came to the church and and we were both I'm a the church and and we were both I'm a the church and and we were both I'm a former com director and you're a current former com director and you're a current former com director and you're a current com director so I'm really really com director so I'm really really com director so I'm really really excited about our our our talk today and excited about our our our talk today and excited about our our our talk today and so uh for our audience why don't you so uh for our audience why don't you so uh for our audience why don't you just give us a little background as to just give us a little background as to just give us a little background as to who you are and and what you do what who you are and and what you do what who you are and and what you do what church you're serving at and bring us up church you're serving at and bring us up church you're serving at and bring us up to speed sure um so I am at Abundant to speed sure um so I am at Abundant to speed sure um so I am at Abundant Life um it's out of the Kansas City area Life um it's out of the Kansas City area Life um it's out of the Kansas City area really Le Summit Missouri um and we have really Le Summit Missouri um and we have really Le Summit Missouri um and we have four campuses currently um expanding four campuses currently um expanding four campuses currently um expanding into another Market here um within the into another Market here um within the into another Market here um within the next year and then a growing online next year and then a growing online next year and then a growing online presence a little background of our presence a little background of our presence a little background of our church is we've been around for about 21

church is we've been around for about 21 church is we've been around for about 21 years same lead Pastor um I have been years same lead Pastor um I have been years same lead Pastor um I have been attending um Abundant Life for 20 of attending um Abundant Life for 20 of attending um Abundant Life for 20 of those years so I've been experiencing a those years so I've been experiencing a those years so I've been experiencing a lot of the growth as not only on staff lot of the growth as not only on staff lot of the growth as not only on staff for 10 of those years but also attending for 10 of those years but also attending for 10 of those years but also attending and it's really the only church my and it's really the only church my and it's really the only church my children out have ever known um and so children out have ever known um and so children out have ever known um and so it's just been a really sweet sweet time it's just been a really sweet sweet time it's just been a really sweet sweet time to be a part of the group growth um a to be a part of the group growth um a to be a part of the group growth um a little background on me um started out little background on me um started out little background on me um started out in the corporate world in agency digital in the corporate world in agency digital in the corporate world in agency digital um direct and database marketing uh um direct and database marketing uh um direct and database marketing uh started out there loved my time there started out there loved my time there started out there loved my time there but also realized as that we decided to but also realized as that we decided to but also realized as that we decided to grow our family um it really wasn't grow our family um it really wasn't grow our family um it really wasn't conducive to work you know 60 70 plus conducive to work you know 60 70 plus conducive to work you know 60 70 plus hours um and be away from kids so um hours um and be away from kids so um hours um and be away from kids so um took a little bit of a break and then um took a little bit of a break and then um took a little bit of a break and then um just kind of got back into it um within just kind of got back into it um within just kind of got back into it um within the last 10 to 12 years and really um the last 10 to 12 years and really um the last 10 to 12 years and really um focusing on the marketing and focusing on the marketing and focusing on the marketing and communication side of things yeah how communication side of things yeah how communication side of things yeah how did you how did you I mean it just seems did you how did you I mean it just seems did you how did you I mean it just seems natural then if because you started the natural then if because you started the natural then if because you started the church in a different role but you you church in a different role but you you church in a different role but you you migrated over to the coms team I did I migrated over to the coms team I did I migrated over to the coms team I did I did um so when I first started on staff did um so when I first started on staff did um so when I first started on staff at Abundant Life 10 years ago it was a at Abundant Life 10 years ago it was a at Abundant Life 10 years ago it was a part-time position in kids ministry and part-time position in kids ministry and part-time position in kids ministry and um I did a lot with the scheduling of um I did a lot with the scheduling of um I did a lot with the scheduling of volunteers and really just coaching them volunteers and really just coaching them volunteers and really just coaching them up and then I switched kind of to the up and then I switched kind of to the up and then I switched kind of to the administrative and more communication

administrative and more communication administrative and more communication side within kids side within kids side within kids ministry within a couple of years in ministry within a couple of years in ministry within a couple of years in that position our creative arts director that position our creative arts director that position our creative arts director at the time had joined staff and wanted at the time had joined staff and wanted at the time had joined staff and wanted to pick my brain about processes and to pick my brain about processes and to pick my brain about processes and just how marketing and Communications just how marketing and Communications just how marketing and Communications worked and so him and I met a couple of worked and so him and I met a couple of worked and so him and I met a couple of times and just decided to talk through times and just decided to talk through times and just decided to talk through what would it look like to start some what would it look like to start some what would it look like to start some processes we were just growing so fast processes we were just growing so fast processes we were just growing so fast and so when we chatted um I kind of left and so when we chatted um I kind of left and so when we chatted um I kind of left the conversation and said hey if the conversation and said hey if the conversation and said hey if anything ever comes up just let me know anything ever comes up just let me know anything ever comes up just let me know i' I'd be happy to kind of join the team i' I'd be happy to kind of join the team i' I'd be happy to kind of join the team and what that looks like and well and what that looks like and well and what that looks like and well something did come up and so he something did come up and so he something did come up and so he approached me and just said hey we have approached me and just said hey we have approached me and just said hey we have this director position and we think you this director position and we think you this director position and we think you would be a great fit for it so that's would be a great fit for it so that's would be a great fit for it so that's really how that transition you know in really how that transition you know in really how that transition you know in church World um you kind of move about church World um you kind of move about church World um you kind of move about based off of the need and based off of based off of the need and based off of based off of the need and based off of your skill skill set and so I that was a your skill skill set and so I that was a your skill skill set and so I that was a great fit for me and I was able to um great fit for me and I was able to um great fit for me and I was able to um jump into the role and just start going jump into the role and just start going jump into the role and just start going at it well you know what I really at it well you know what I really at it well you know what I really appreciate about that though and I I appreciate about that though and I I appreciate about that though and I I don't know if people understand this but don't know if people understand this but don't know if people understand this but when you've served on the other side of when you've served on the other side of when you've served on the other side of the fence so to speak you're in the the fence so to speak you're in the the fence so to speak you're in the ministry position and then you hop into ministry position and then you hop into ministry position and then you hop into the comm's director position because the comm's director position because the comm's director position because that's how we right com director there that's how we right com director there that's how we right com director there are clients so to speak the Ministries are clients so to speak the Ministries are clients so to speak the Ministries we serve and when you're able to serve we serve and when you're able to serve we serve and when you're able to serve on that side of the fence you get a on that side of the fence you get a on that side of the fence you get a really good perspective and appreciation really good perspective and appreciation really good perspective and appreciation for what the Ministries are dealing with for what the Ministries are dealing with for what the Ministries are dealing with and so you can bring Solutions I bet you

and so you can bring Solutions I bet you and so you can bring Solutions I bet you probably did that benefit you absolutely probably did that benefit you absolutely probably did that benefit you absolutely um being on the corporate agency side we um being on the corporate agency side we um being on the corporate agency side we did have a lot of clients and so I did have a lot of clients and so I did have a lot of clients and so I approached it in that mindset of our approached it in that mindset of our approached it in that mindset of our Ministries are our clients now that Ministries are our clients now that Ministries are our clients now that relationship is a lot different relationship is a lot different relationship is a lot different obviously when you're in the church obviously when you're in the church obviously when you're in the church world but you have to approach it in we world but you have to approach it in we world but you have to approach it in we want to do whatever we can to service want to do whatever we can to service want to do whatever we can to service our clients bring value to our our clients bring value to our our clients bring value to our Ministries that we're serving and be Ministries that we're serving and be Ministries that we're serving and be partners with them so that they know partners with them so that they know partners with them so that they know that we're in their Corner a lot of that we're in their Corner a lot of that we're in their Corner a lot of times Ministries they are really tunnel times Ministries they are really tunnel times Ministries they are really tunnel vision and focused because they have vision and focused because they have vision and focused because they have such a passion for the ministry kids such a passion for the ministry kids such a passion for the ministry kids ministry women's ministry so they may ministry women's ministry so they may ministry women's ministry so they may not get all of the aspects that go into not get all of the aspects that go into not get all of the aspects that go into communicating um effectively for their communicating um effectively for their communicating um effectively for their ministry that's our job as communication ministry that's our job as communication ministry that's our job as communication directors is to be able to help them directors is to be able to help them directors is to be able to help them communicate effectively and efficiently communicate effectively and efficiently communicate effectively and efficiently so that they can focus on what they're so that they can focus on what they're so that they can focus on what they're really good at and that's with really good at and that's with really good at and that's with connecting people to their specific connecting people to their specific connecting people to their specific Ministry yeah i' I've often I've often Ministry yeah i' I've often I've often Ministry yeah i' I've often I've often said when we're talking to uh Church said when we're talking to uh Church said when we're talking to uh Church comms leaders that one one of their comms leaders that one one of their comms leaders that one one of their primary pain points is the fact that primary pain points is the fact that primary pain points is the fact that every Ministry leader in the church acts every Ministry leader in the church acts every Ministry leader in the church acts as if their Ministry is like the most as if their Ministry is like the most as if their Ministry is like the most important than the only Ministry in the important than the only Ministry in the important than the only Ministry in the church and that creates attention for church and that creates attention for church and that creates attention for them but I said if that's the case you them but I said if that's the case you them but I said if that's the case you have the right person in those roles you have the right person in those roles you have the right person in those roles you want your student Ministry director to want your student Ministry director to want your student Ministry director to really feel like their Ministry is the really feel like their Ministry is the really feel like their Ministry is the most important you want your marriage

most important you want your marriage most important you want your marriage Ministry leaders to feel like their Ministry leaders to feel like their Ministry leaders to feel like their Ministry is the most important now it Ministry is the most important now it Ministry is the most important now it takes a strong vision and a strong takes a strong vision and a strong takes a strong vision and a strong leadership team to really guide that to leadership team to really guide that to leadership team to really guide that to make sure that everything is working make sure that everything is working make sure that everything is working cohesively but that one thing that cohesively but that one thing that cohesively but that one thing that creates a pain point is actually a real creates a pain point is actually a real creates a pain point is actually a real benefit in the church because you want benefit in the church because you want benefit in the church because you want people to have such a significant people to have such a significant people to have such a significant passion for what they're doing uh that passion for what they're doing uh that passion for what they're doing uh that they forget that there's anything else they forget that there's anything else they forget that there's anything else going on but as a comm's director you're going on but as a comm's director you're going on but as a comm's director you're now the the air traffic controller in now the the air traffic controller in now the the air traffic controller in the middle trying to make sure that all the middle trying to make sure that all the middle trying to make sure that all the planes are taking off and Landing the planes are taking off and Landing the planes are taking off and Landing when when and where appropriate oh 100% when when and where appropriate oh 100% when when and where appropriate oh 100% I wouldn't want somebody that was not I wouldn't want somebody that was not I wouldn't want somebody that was not passionate about that Ministry so how passionate about that Ministry so how passionate about that Ministry so how can we direct that passion into a can we direct that passion into a can we direct that passion into a partnership so that we can communicate partnership so that we can communicate partnership so that we can communicate and sure a famous phrase that I use a and sure a famous phrase that I use a and sure a famous phrase that I use a lot with a lot of our team is if lot with a lot of our team is if lot with a lot of our team is if everything's important nothing's everything's important nothing's everything's important nothing's important right everything cannot be important right everything cannot be important right everything cannot be important so it's a matter of balancing important so it's a matter of balancing important so it's a matter of balancing and really um it's not um just balancing and really um it's not um just balancing and really um it's not um just balancing but getting into a good Rhythm and a but getting into a good Rhythm and a but getting into a good Rhythm and a good strategy to be able to communicate good strategy to be able to communicate good strategy to be able to communicate all the things without watering down um all the things without watering down um all the things without watering down um or confusing the audience or or confusing the audience or or confusing the audience or overwhelming the audience of what's overwhelming the audience of what's overwhelming the audience of what's going on we are an event heavy driven going on we are an event heavy driven going on we are an event heavy driven Church um we have a lot of events going Church um we have a lot of events going Church um we have a lot of events going on which is great it's a lot of on which is great it's a lot of on which is great it's a lot of opportunities for people to connect to opportunities for people to connect to opportunities for people to connect to others but also to connect to Christ and others but also to connect to Christ and others but also to connect to Christ and so with those events we want to make

so with those events we want to make so with those events we want to make sure that we're communicating about them sure that we're communicating about them sure that we're communicating about them in an effective and efficient way so in an effective and efficient way so in an effective and efficient way so that they know what their next steps are that they know what their next steps are that they know what their next steps are if it's confusing or anything we always if it's confusing or anything we always if it's confusing or anything we always say Clarity over creativity right we say Clarity over creativity right we say Clarity over creativity right we want a very clear message um so that want a very clear message um so that want a very clear message um so that they know what is my next step in my they know what is my next step in my they know what is my next step in my faith journey and so that's our role um faith journey and so that's our role um faith journey and so that's our role um I don't expect them Ministries to know I don't expect them Ministries to know I don't expect them Ministries to know that that's our role as a a that that's our role as a a that that's our role as a a Communications Department to be able to Communications Department to be able to Communications Department to be able to guide them and give them the best guide them and give them the best guide them and give them the best resources to communicate oh I I love resources to communicate oh I I love resources to communicate oh I I love that statement Clarity over creativity that statement Clarity over creativity that statement Clarity over creativity because we can just creative Le take because we can just creative Le take because we can just creative Le take stuff that doesn't communicate an ounce stuff that doesn't communicate an ounce stuff that doesn't communicate an ounce yeah well yeah well yeah well done can can I ask just just a real done can can I ask just just a real done can can I ask just just a real quick follow-up question to that Jason quick follow-up question to that Jason quick follow-up question to that Jason um Rachel in terms of your own gifting um Rachel in terms of your own gifting um Rachel in terms of your own gifting would you consider yourself a person who would you consider yourself a person who would you consider yourself a person who leans more on the creative side or are leans more on the creative side or are leans more on the creative side or are you more of a project coordinator you more of a project coordinator you more of a project coordinator project manager type of person like what project manager type of person like what project manager type of person like what where where do where does your primary where where do where does your primary where where do where does your primary gifting fall in all of that yeah great gifting fall in all of that yeah great gifting fall in all of that yeah great question because there are kind of two question because there are kind of two question because there are kind of two sides of the fences when it comes to sides of the fences when it comes to sides of the fences when it comes to comms and marketing I fall more on the comms and marketing I fall more on the comms and marketing I fall more on the process side on the creative side I have process side on the creative side I have process side on the creative side I have a great team that I trust significantly a great team that I trust significantly a great team that I trust significantly now can I look at something that they've now can I look at something that they've now can I look at something that they've designed and be like that's not going to designed and be like that's not going to designed and be like that's not going to work it's not communicating effectively

work it's not communicating effectively work it's not communicating effectively yes I can certainly do that but I yes I can certainly do that but I yes I can certainly do that but I certainly fall more on the processes certainly fall more on the processes certainly fall more on the processes what can be efficient what communicates what can be efficient what communicates what can be efficient what communicates words so forth if you were to sit me words so forth if you were to sit me words so forth if you were to sit me down in front of a computer and ask me down in front of a computer and ask me down in front of a computer and ask me to design something I would be fired to design something I would be fired to design something I would be fired within two minutes I I can promise you within two minutes I I can promise you within two minutes I I can promise you that but as far as the process and what that but as far as the process and what that but as far as the process and what can we communicate with what words and can we communicate with what words and can we communicate with what words and how do we communicate that's a more my how do we communicate that's a more my how do we communicate that's a more my sweet spot it reminds me of something sweet spot it reminds me of something sweet spot it reminds me of something Jason our friend Tyler Mount over at Jason our friend Tyler Mount over at Jason our friend Tyler Mount over at Providence Church in North Carolina said Providence Church in North Carolina said Providence Church in North Carolina said he said I don't need to be a graphic he said I don't need to be a graphic he said I don't need to be a graphic designer to do my job but I need to know designer to do my job but I need to know designer to do my job but I need to know good and bad graphic design when I see good and bad graphic design when I see good and bad graphic design when I see it and that's the way that's the filter it and that's the way that's the filter it and that's the way that's the filter that he runs that through absolutely that he runs that through absolutely that he runs that through absolutely yeah Jason I interrupted you there sorry yeah Jason I interrupted you there sorry yeah Jason I interrupted you there sorry I hope you hope you didn't lose your I hope you hope you didn't lose your I hope you hope you didn't lose your train of thought there no I didn't I train of thought there no I didn't I train of thought there no I didn't I well I wanted to go back because I think well I wanted to go back because I think well I wanted to go back because I think this is a really valuable uh component this is a really valuable uh component this is a really valuable uh component of your your story so Rachel you you're of your your story so Rachel you you're of your your story so Rachel you you're season better and been around for a season better and been around for a season better and been around for a while but you mentioned that your Mentor while but you mentioned that your Mentor while but you mentioned that your Mentor which is a key thing there everybody which is a key thing there everybody which is a key thing there everybody needs a mentor right don't don't do this needs a mentor right don't don't do this needs a mentor right don't don't do this alone but you you were talking about alone but you you were talking about alone but you you were talking about some challenges and some transitions in some challenges and some transitions in some challenges and some transitions in inside of the department and what you're inside of the department and what you're inside of the department and what you're what was going on there talk to us a what was going on there talk to us a what was going on there talk to us a little bit about what were those little bit about what were those little bit about what were those challenges because I think a lot of challenges because I think a lot of challenges because I think a lot of people can relate to that kind of thing people can relate to that kind of thing people can relate to that kind of thing that's going on inside the inside the that's going on inside the inside the that's going on inside the inside the church and how did you how did you church and how did you how did you church and how did you how did you navigate that sure so just talking navigate that sure so just talking navigate that sure so just talking quickly about mentors and coaches I quickly about mentors and coaches I quickly about mentors and coaches I think it is so important that you have think it is so important that you have think it is so important that you have mentors and coaches that are outside of mentors and coaches that are outside of mentors and coaches that are outside of the the the organization reason being is oftentimes

organization reason being is oftentimes organization reason being is oftentimes if they're on staff with you um they may if they're on staff with you um they may if they're on staff with you um they may um have the same thoughts or thought um have the same thoughts or thought um have the same thoughts or thought patterns and so forth so it's really patterns and so forth so it's really patterns and so forth so it's really important that you have people outside important that you have people outside important that you have people outside of your current organization that are of your current organization that are of your current organization that are mentoring you in a way they come to the mentoring you in a way they come to the mentoring you in a way they come to the table with fresh eyes um they come to table with fresh eyes um they come to table with fresh eyes um they come to the table with some great the table with some great the table with some great wisdom that is very neutral um and so I wisdom that is very neutral um and so I wisdom that is very neutral um and so I always tell my team when they first join always tell my team when they first join always tell my team when they first join staff you need to decide who some staff you need to decide who some staff you need to decide who some mentors can be I I encourage them to mentors can be I I encourage them to mentors can be I I encourage them to have mentors not only in Ministry but have mentors not only in Ministry but have mentors not only in Ministry but also outside of ministry it gives them also outside of ministry it gives them also outside of ministry it gives them just a different perspective and so I've just a different perspective and so I've just a different perspective and so I've been blessed with a lot of mentors um been blessed with a lot of mentors um been blessed with a lot of mentors um through different stages of my career through different stages of my career through different stages of my career and so when I went through a tough time and so when I went through a tough time and so when I went through a tough time um really it was um right after after um really it was um right after after um really it was um right after after covid every every organization went covid every every organization went covid every every organization went through some things right um if you through some things right um if you through some things right um if you would have told me right before Co that would have told me right before Co that would have told me right before Co that I would be working more than I had ever I would be working more than I had ever I would be working more than I had ever before during Co I would have been like before during Co I would have been like before during Co I would have been like you're crazy but it was just such an you're crazy but it was just such an you're crazy but it was just such an interesting time and how we approached interesting time and how we approached interesting time and how we approached it as an organization of communication it as an organization of communication it as an organization of communication um was super important and so coming off um was super important and so coming off um was super important and so coming off of that um I just found myself in a of that um I just found myself in a of that um I just found myself in a season and we as an organization had to season and we as an organization had to season and we as an organization had to kind of pivot on how we were approaching kind of pivot on how we were approaching kind of pivot on how we were approaching things and so there was a lot of changes things and so there was a lot of changes things and so there was a lot of changes within the organization the structure within the organization the structure within the organization the structure and so forth within a year and a half I and so forth within a year and a half I and so forth within a year and a half I had three different supervisors um our

had three different supervisors um our had three different supervisors um our team was divided as far as um how they team was divided as far as um how they team was divided as far as um how they were structuring it and it was at that were structuring it and it was at that were structuring it and it was at that time I said this isn't for me I I I was time I said this isn't for me I I I was time I said this isn't for me I I I was so I was going through such an angry and so I was going through such an angry and so I was going through such an angry and selfish time looking back I can say that selfish time looking back I can say that selfish time looking back I can say that and I was I was like this is not what I and I was I was like this is not what I and I was I was like this is not what I had what I noticed I had planned what I had what I noticed I had planned what I had what I noticed I had planned what I had thought it was going to play out and had thought it was going to play out and had thought it was going to play out and so I was angry I was angry with the so I was angry I was angry with the so I was angry I was angry with the people within the organization um I was people within the organization um I was people within the organization um I was angry at god um because I was like this angry at god um because I was like this angry at god um because I was like this isn't what this isn't what we talked isn't what this isn't what we talked isn't what this isn't what we talked about and um really that came out in about and um really that came out in about and um really that came out in such an ugly way um that after I got such an ugly way um that after I got such an ugly way um that after I got through that season and I um really had through that season and I um really had through that season and I um really had a different mindset and a different a different mindset and a different a different mindset and a different heart shift um I had several people say heart shift um I had several people say heart shift um I had several people say oh my goodness I I see the Rachel that oh my goodness I I see the Rachel that oh my goodness I I see the Rachel that is there as opposed to this ugliness is there as opposed to this ugliness is there as opposed to this ugliness because I it was pure ugliness um do iie because I it was pure ugliness um do iie because I it was pure ugliness um do iie do I look back and say I wish I I didn't do I look back and say I wish I I didn't do I look back and say I wish I I didn't go through that no and here's the reason go through that no and here's the reason go through that no and here's the reason why um I was able to chat with a lot of why um I was able to chat with a lot of why um I was able to chat with a lot of mentors um that really challenged me one mentors um that really challenged me one mentors um that really challenged me one of them said um do you want to be right of them said um do you want to be right of them said um do you want to be right or do you want to be right with people or do you want to be right with people or do you want to be right with people and at that time I was like I want to be and at that time I was like I want to be and at that time I was like I want to be right and again there's my selfishness right and again there's my selfishness right and again there's my selfishness coming through right um and she she she

coming through right um and she she she coming through right um and she she she challenged me and she said what does challenged me and she said what does challenged me and she said what does that mean for you and at what point will that mean for you and at what point will that mean for you and at what point will you think that you're right on you think that you're right on you think that you're right on everything at what point and so walking everything at what point and so walking everything at what point and so walking away from that conversation with her I away from that conversation with her I away from that conversation with her I was a little bit frustrated to be quite was a little bit frustrated to be quite was a little bit frustrated to be quite honest cuz I was like you know she's my honest cuz I was like you know she's my honest cuz I was like you know she's my my friend but really she was a mentor my friend but really she was a mentor my friend but really she was a mentor and that's different she's not going to and that's different she's not going to and that's different she's not going to speak just only words that I want to speak just only words that I want to speak just only words that I want to hear she's going to challenge me and hear she's going to challenge me and hear she's going to challenge me and she's like we as Believers and as she's like we as Believers and as she's like we as Believers and as followers followers of Christ are to be followers followers of Christ are to be followers followers of Christ are to be right with God's people yeah and right right with God's people yeah and right right with God's people yeah and right now you're not right with God's people now you're not right with God's people now you're not right with God's people because you're fighting and so my my my because you're fighting and so my my my because you're fighting and so my my my really rub and ttention that I was really rub and ttention that I was really rub and ttention that I was trying to deal with was I was pleading trying to deal with was I was pleading trying to deal with was I was pleading with God to take me out of my position I with God to take me out of my position I with God to take me out of my position I didn't want to be there anymore um didn't want to be there anymore um didn't want to be there anymore um simply because I was hurt and so I let simply because I was hurt and so I let simply because I was hurt and so I let the hurt Define me and Define my the hurt Define me and Define my the hurt Define me and Define my position within the position within the position within the organization and um I just remember organization and um I just remember organization and um I just remember spending some very tense moments with um spending some very tense moments with um spending some very tense moments with um with God and just just spilling it all with God and just just spilling it all with God and just just spilling it all and you know those moments when you are and you know those moments when you are and you know those moments when you are raw I mean it is raw raw I mean it is raw raw I mean it is raw conversations um but I was I was just conversations um but I was I was just conversations um but I was I was just reminded of where I had seen God in the reminded of where I had seen God in the reminded of where I had seen God in the past in tough moments and those moments past in tough moments and those moments past in tough moments and those moments I could go back to and say okay I saw I could go back to and say okay I saw I could go back to and say okay I saw him here I saw him here he didn't leave

him here I saw him here he didn't leave him here I saw him here he didn't leave me but you know what I did I walked and me but you know what I did I walked and me but you know what I did I walked and turned a different direction and I was W turned a different direction and I was W turned a different direction and I was W not walking in the same step with Christ not walking in the same step with Christ not walking in the same step with Christ I had turned God didn't go anywhere he I had turned God didn't go anywhere he I had turned God didn't go anywhere he was right there the whole time but I had was right there the whole time but I had was right there the whole time but I had moved um because I was being selfish and moved um because I was being selfish and moved um because I was being selfish and I was being self-c centered because I I was being self-c centered because I I was being self-c centered because I thought I knew best here's what I I like thought I knew best here's what I I like thought I knew best here's what I I like to remind a lot of leaders we tell all to remind a lot of leaders we tell all to remind a lot of leaders we tell all of our staff you are leaders in either of our staff you are leaders in either of our staff you are leaders in either home you're leaders in your position at home you're leaders in your position at home you're leaders in your position at work and so you have to remind yourself work and so you have to remind yourself work and so you have to remind yourself you're not in on all of the you're not in on all of the you're not in on all of the conversations that maybe the executive conversations that maybe the executive conversations that maybe the executive team has you're not in on those team has you're not in on those team has you're not in on those decisions that they have to make and so decisions that they have to make and so decisions that they have to make and so we don't know we don't know we don't know 100% of why those decisions are made but 100% of why those decisions are made but 100% of why those decisions are made but if you trust leadership if you trust who if you trust leadership if you trust who if you trust leadership if you trust who God has placed in those positions that God has placed in those positions that God has placed in those positions that is something that you have to remember is something that you have to remember is something that you have to remember moving forward and um make decisions moving forward and um make decisions moving forward and um make decisions based off of I trust leadership and I based off of I trust leadership and I based off of I trust leadership and I did trust did trust did trust leadership yeah well Rachel thank you leadership yeah well Rachel thank you leadership yeah well Rachel thank you for being open and honest and uh uh kind for being open and honest and uh uh kind for being open and honest and uh uh kind of exposing a little bit of that about of exposing a little bit of that about of exposing a little bit of that about yourself and and hopefully yourself and and hopefully yourself and and hopefully as our listeners have heard that maybe as our listeners have heard that maybe as our listeners have heard that maybe you're going through that season and um you're going through that season and um you're going through that season and um as I've always just people that I've LED as I've always just people that I've LED as I've always just people that I've LED I've said hey it's failure is a a I've said hey it's failure is a a I've said hey it's failure is a a wonderful thing because as long as wonderful thing because as long as wonderful thing because as long as you're failing forward and you're you're failing forward and you're you're failing forward and you're learning about that failure because it's learning about that failure because it's learning about that failure because it's going to help you help you grow because

going to help you help you grow because going to help you help you grow because it's inevitable we're we we're gonna it's inevitable we're we we're gonna it's inevitable we're we we're gonna fail now sometimes it's better to have fail now sometimes it's better to have fail now sometimes it's better to have other people fail so we can learn from other people fail so we can learn from other people fail so we can learn from from them and that's what what's from them and that's what what's from them and that's what what's happening right here is is hopefully happening right here is is hopefully happening right here is is hopefully that's for some for our younger younger that's for some for our younger younger that's for some for our younger younger leader that are in this they just got leader that are in this they just got leader that are in this they just got into Ministry it's it's inevitable it's into Ministry it's it's inevitable it's into Ministry it's it's inevitable it's gonna happen it will it will it is so gonna happen it will it will it is so gonna happen it will it will it is so just take it in stride and always stay just take it in stride and always stay just take it in stride and always stay connected to Jesus and you you'll never connected to Jesus and you you'll never connected to Jesus and you you'll never go wrong but but but sometimes we just go wrong but but but sometimes we just go wrong but but but sometimes we just get a little out of out of sink there get a little out of out of sink there get a little out of out of sink there and that's okay yes and when you get out and that's okay yes and when you get out and that's okay yes and when you get out of that sink of being in a right of that sink of being in a right of that sink of being in a right relationship with Christ it trickles relationship with Christ it trickles relationship with Christ it trickles down to all areas of your life and so um down to all areas of your life and so um down to all areas of your life and so um that Joy that Joy that Joy pure joy that you once had is then pure joy that you once had is then pure joy that you once had is then replaced with discontentment it's placed replaced with discontentment it's placed replaced with discontentment it's placed with um comparison it's replaced with with um comparison it's replaced with with um comparison it's replaced with all of these things that are not of all of these things that are not of all of these things that are not of Christ and so reentering yourself and Christ and so reentering yourself and Christ and so reentering yourself and being able to speak to those that can being able to speak to those that can being able to speak to those that can speak truth Godly truth into your life speak truth Godly truth into your life speak truth Godly truth into your life and challenge you of what are you doing and challenge you of what are you doing and challenge you of what are you doing this for is it for your own purpose is this for is it for your own purpose is this for is it for your own purpose is it for your own gain or did you lose it for your own gain or did you lose it for your own gain or did you lose sight of that and why did you lose sight sight of that and why did you lose sight sight of that and why did you lose sight of it it's important to understand the of it it's important to understand the of it it's important to understand the wise but also do something with it wise but also do something with it wise but also do something with it besides sitting in your self pity and besides sitting in your self pity and besides sitting in your self pity and self oh woe is me but to do something self oh woe is me but to do something self oh woe is me but to do something with it yeah the nature of employment in with it yeah the nature of employment in with it yeah the nature of employment in church is so much different than

church is so much different than church is so much different than employment in the marketplace because employment in the marketplace because employment in the marketplace because you're not just in an employee employer you're not just in an employee employer you're not just in an employee employer relationship with the church that has relationship with the church that has relationship with the church that has hired you but you're also in a hired you but you're also in a hired you but you're also in a covenantal relationship ship with other covenantal relationship ship with other covenantal relationship ship with other brothers and sisters in Christ it's a brothers and sisters in Christ it's a brothers and sisters in Christ it's a different it's a different Dynamic Al different it's a different Dynamic Al different it's a different Dynamic Al together and it's it's not uncommon we together and it's it's not uncommon we together and it's it's not uncommon we see this far too often that a church see this far too often that a church see this far too often that a church staff culture can be unhealthy but I staff culture can be unhealthy but I staff culture can be unhealthy but I think sometimes we jump the gun and say think sometimes we jump the gun and say think sometimes we jump the gun and say the staff culture is unhealthy without the staff culture is unhealthy without the staff culture is unhealthy without realizing that maybe it's us that are realizing that maybe it's us that are realizing that maybe it's us that are unhealthy maybe the problem is inside me unhealthy maybe the problem is inside me unhealthy maybe the problem is inside me and it's not as much external factors and it's not as much external factors and it's not as much external factors contributing to that as it is just my contributing to that as it is just my contributing to that as it is just my own personal relationship with Jesus my own personal relationship with Jesus my own personal relationship with Jesus my own Pride versus humility battle that own Pride versus humility battle that own Pride versus humility battle that I'm fighting inside and I appreciate I'm fighting inside and I appreciate I'm fighting inside and I appreciate Rachel I appreciate your your honesty Rachel I appreciate your your honesty Rachel I appreciate your your honesty and your transparency there and I and your transparency there and I and your transparency there and I appreciate the fact that the Holy Spirit appreciate the fact that the Holy Spirit appreciate the fact that the Holy Spirit Led you to a place where you realize Led you to a place where you realize Led you to a place where you realize that yes there were some external that yes there were some external that yes there were some external factors that were creating the tension factors that were creating the tension factors that were creating the tension and the stress and the discontentment and the stress and the discontentment and the stress and the discontentment for you but you started with that for you but you started with that for you but you started with that internal reflection of going okay let's internal reflection of going okay let's internal reflection of going okay let's start with me let's get myself healthy start with me let's get myself healthy start with me let's get myself healthy and get myself redirected get myself and get myself redirected get myself and get myself redirected get myself back on point and then let's see where back on point and then let's see where back on point and then let's see where things go from there and if it's still things go from there and if it's still things go from there and if it's still Prov proves to be an unhealthy situation Prov proves to be an unhealthy situation Prov proves to be an unhealthy situation those are the types of ones that you may those are the types of ones that you may those are the types of ones that you may need to move on from but you know more need to move on from but you know more need to move on from but you know more often than not I think that we find that often than not I think that we find that often than not I think that we find that if if we can really redirect ourselves if if we can really redirect ourselves if if we can really redirect ourselves get ourselves healthy healthy repent of get ourselves healthy healthy repent of get ourselves healthy healthy repent of the things that we need to repent of the things that we need to repent of the things that we need to repent of personally it gets us back on track and personally it gets us back on track and personally it gets us back on track and then we can get back into those then we can get back into those then we can get back into those constructive and productive

constructive and productive constructive and productive relationships that we have that that God relationships that we have that that God relationships that we have that that God has called us in those those people to has called us in those those people to has called us in those those people to serve along side yes and you know I tell serve along side yes and you know I tell serve along side yes and you know I tell staff members that are coming from the staff members that are coming from the staff members that are coming from the corporate side into Ministry um I just corporate side into Ministry um I just corporate side into Ministry um I just let them know there's a lot of Grace let them know there's a lot of Grace let them know there's a lot of Grace there's a lot of love there's a lot of there's a lot of love there's a lot of there's a lot of love there's a lot of forgiveness and so that expectation of forgiveness and so that expectation of forgiveness and so that expectation of the corporate world um it can be it can the corporate world um it can be it can the corporate world um it can be it can be a hard transition from corporate into be a hard transition from corporate into be a hard transition from corporate into Ministry and so I I I tell them have a Ministry and so I I I tell them have a Ministry and so I I I tell them have a lot of Grace with yourself but also have lot of Grace with yourself but also have lot of Grace with yourself but also have a lot of Grace with others it doesn't a lot of Grace with others it doesn't a lot of Grace with others it doesn't mean that we can't have boundaries and mean that we can't have boundaries and mean that we can't have boundaries and um be able to have expectations from um be able to have expectations from um be able to have expectations from others because after all we've been others because after all we've been others because after all we've been called to be good stewards of our called to be good stewards of our called to be good stewards of our resources which is ourselves as well as resources which is ourselves as well as resources which is ourselves as well as our time and we want to Steward that our time and we want to Steward that our time and we want to Steward that well but at the same time there's a lot well but at the same time there's a lot well but at the same time there's a lot of times where we lose sight and so we of times where we lose sight and so we of times where we lose sight and so we um may look at somebody that doesn't um may look at somebody that doesn't um may look at somebody that doesn't understand everything that we as a coms understand everything that we as a coms understand everything that we as a coms director is going through and so we may director is going through and so we may director is going through and so we may look at them in a a negative light look at them in a a negative light look at them in a a negative light whereas instead of just uh criticizing whereas instead of just uh criticizing whereas instead of just uh criticizing them we bring them alongside we explain them we bring them alongside we explain them we bring them alongside we explain to them why it's important or why we do to them why it's important or why we do to them why it's important or why we do it this way and having a lot of Grace in it this way and having a lot of Grace in it this way and having a lot of Grace in that area um I used to say um I I was that area um I used to say um I I was that area um I used to say um I I was not a very grac filled individual until not a very grac filled individual until not a very grac filled individual until a lot of Grace had been given to me and

a lot of Grace had been given to me and a lot of Grace had been given to me and when you experience Grace from when you experience Grace from when you experience Grace from individuals that I look back and I think individuals that I look back and I think individuals that I look back and I think why did they even extend any Grace to me why did they even extend any Grace to me why did they even extend any Grace to me why our heavenly father has done that to why our heavenly father has done that to why our heavenly father has done that to us and there's often times that I think us and there's often times that I think us and there's often times that I think I should not have received that Grace I should not have received that Grace I should not have received that Grace because I don't I didn't feel worthy of because I don't I didn't feel worthy of because I don't I didn't feel worthy of that and so it's just a reminder for us that and so it's just a reminder for us that and so it's just a reminder for us to to have that Grace towards others um to to have that Grace towards others um to to have that Grace towards others um and then in in that transition from and then in in that transition from and then in in that transition from corporate into Ministry is to look to corporate into Ministry is to look to corporate into Ministry is to look to see where they're coming from uh try to see where they're coming from uh try to see where they're coming from uh try to understand and then also I always always understand and then also I always always understand and then also I always always say and we as a a whole team have a very say and we as a a whole team have a very say and we as a a whole team have a very um open and honest um feedback culture um open and honest um feedback culture um open and honest um feedback culture and having that healthy healthy way um and having that healthy healthy way um and having that healthy healthy way um makes a world of difference a world of makes a world of difference a world of makes a world of difference a world of difference because I always say in those difference because I always say in those difference because I always say in those tough conversations that we have with tough conversations that we have with tough conversations that we have with people there's always nuggets of truth people there's always nuggets of truth people there's always nuggets of truth that we personally can take and learn that we personally can take and learn that we personally can take and learn from even if maybe that individual had from even if maybe that individual had from even if maybe that individual had wronged us in a certain way there's some wronged us in a certain way there's some wronged us in a certain way there's some ownership ship a little piece of ownership ship a little piece of ownership ship a little piece of ownership that truth that will come out ownership that truth that will come out ownership that truth that will come out in those in those in those conversations how have you built your conversations how have you built your conversations how have you built your department in getting to that point department in getting to that point department in getting to that point where you have that feedback loop you where you have that feedback loop you where you have that feedback loop you know because we're in the service side know because we're in the service side know because we're in the service side of things and and um you know there's of things and and um you know there's of things and and um you know there's that there's that uh structure you want that there's that uh structure you want that there's that uh structure you want to have so that you because it's a team to have so that you because it's a team to have so that you because it's a team effort it's not like it's our team and

effort it's not like it's our team and effort it's not like it's our team and their team and we're you know it's one their team and we're you know it's one their team and we're you know it's one team right but yet you got to have that team right but yet you got to have that team right but yet you got to have that honest transparent feed Fe back Loop so honest transparent feed Fe back Loop so honest transparent feed Fe back Loop so then it allows you as a leader to be then it allows you as a leader to be then it allows you as a leader to be able to get inside of your your able to get inside of your your able to get inside of your your strengths and your Joys and if you're strengths and your Joys and if you're strengths and your Joys and if you're working genius model you know mine's I working genius model you know mine's I working genius model you know mine's I love the working genius if you guys have love the working genius if you guys have love the working genius if you guys have not gone through that but mine's not gone through that but mine's not gone through that but mine's invention and wonder because I'm I'm I invention and wonder because I'm I'm I invention and wonder because I'm I'm I bring I get joy when I get to do that bring I get joy when I get to do that bring I get joy when I get to do that so talk to us about that how you've so talk to us about that how you've so talk to us about that how you've built that and that feedback loop and built that and that feedback loop and built that and that feedback loop and what how how you've taken that and then what how how you've taken that and then what how how you've taken that and then and then did something with it yeah I I and then did something with it yeah I I and then did something with it yeah I I really think of of healthy feed back really think of of healthy feed back really think of of healthy feed back culture begins with trust if if there's culture begins with trust if if there's culture begins with trust if if there's not trust within um your own department not trust within um your own department not trust within um your own department and other departments and Ministries and other departments and Ministries and other departments and Ministries it's going to be very hard to have a a it's going to be very hard to have a a it's going to be very hard to have a a successful and a positive feedback successful and a positive feedback successful and a positive feedback culture so trust is a very important culture so trust is a very important culture so trust is a very important thing the other thing is is when you are thing the other thing is is when you are thing the other thing is is when you are meeting with somebody ask them if you meeting with somebody ask them if you meeting with somebody ask them if you can give them feedback that's super can give them feedback that's super can give them feedback that's super important one it's asking hey can I can important one it's asking hey can I can important one it's asking hey can I can I give you some feedback and then I give you some feedback and then I give you some feedback and then provide what that feedback is but then provide what that feedback is but then provide what that feedback is but then also do some also do some also do some followup at the same time person followup at the same time person followup at the same time person receiving feedback it's super important receiving feedback it's super important receiving feedback it's super important that we identify are we being that we identify are we being that we identify are we being defensive in that feedback and if so defensive in that feedback and if so defensive in that feedback and if so where is that coming from is it becoming where is that coming from is it becoming where is that coming from is it becoming is it coming from a place of I don't is it coming from a place of I don't is it coming from a place of I don't trust that individual if so then that trust that individual if so then that trust that individual if so then that needs to be addressed before that

needs to be addressed before that needs to be addressed before that feedback can be given anymore or is it feedback can be given anymore or is it feedback can be given anymore or is it because um that is just my my way of because um that is just my my way of because um that is just my my way of responding to a lot of negative because responding to a lot of negative because responding to a lot of negative because it's it's something that's been growing it's it's something that's been growing it's it's something that's been growing inside of me and so being able to inside of me and so being able to inside of me and so being able to understand okay why am I being defensive understand okay why am I being defensive understand okay why am I being defensive where is that coming from and being able where is that coming from and being able where is that coming from and being able to have those conversations even if to have those conversations even if to have those conversations even if they're uncomfortable a lot is super they're uncomfortable a lot is super they're uncomfortable a lot is super important do I get it right all the time important do I get it right all the time important do I get it right all the time no am I still working on it yes but at no am I still working on it yes but at no am I still working on it yes but at the same time having that trust within the same time having that trust within the same time having that trust within the department your own Department is the department your own Department is the department your own Department is really important that I can go to a really important that I can go to a really important that I can go to a designer I can go to a videographer and designer I can go to a videographer and designer I can go to a videographer and I can say hey do you mind if I give you I can say hey do you mind if I give you I can say hey do you mind if I give you some feedback on that even in a meeting some feedback on that even in a meeting some feedback on that even in a meeting maybe after maybe they didn't present maybe after maybe they didn't present maybe after maybe they didn't present themselves or the department in the best themselves or the department in the best themselves or the department in the best way um I can go to them and say hey do way um I can go to them and say hey do way um I can go to them and say hey do you mind if I provide some feedback on you mind if I provide some feedback on you mind if I provide some feedback on how that meeting went I observed this how that meeting went I observed this how that meeting went I observed this and I noticed that the reaction was this and I noticed that the reaction was this and I noticed that the reaction was this um do is there another way that we could um do is there another way that we could um do is there another way that we could have approach that so then it gives them have approach that so then it gives them have approach that so then it gives them an opportunity to really think through an opportunity to really think through an opportunity to really think through it and if they say no I handled it and if they say no I handled it and if they say no I handled everything well that's a an opportunity everything well that's a an opportunity everything well that's a an opportunity for some coaching to say this is what I for some coaching to say this is what I for some coaching to say this is what I observed this is what I walked away with observed this is what I walked away with observed this is what I walked away with and my supervisor still does that with and my supervisor still does that with and my supervisor still does that with me as well which I me as well which I me as well which I appreciate sometimes also it's important appreciate sometimes also it's important appreciate sometimes also it's important that we ask for feedback hey how do you that we ask for feedback hey how do you that we ask for feedback hey how do you feel like that meeting went that I led

feel like that meeting went that I led feel like that meeting went that I led do you feel like I was clear in my do you feel like I was clear in my do you feel like I was clear in my expectations and do you feel like how I expectations and do you feel like how I expectations and do you feel like how I approached the situation was positive or approached the situation was positive or approached the situation was positive or was there some things that I could was there some things that I could was there some things that I could improve on as a leader we should be improve on as a leader we should be improve on as a leader we should be looking for feedback um and looking for looking for feedback um and looking for looking for feedback um and looking for it in in people that we know that we can it in in people that we know that we can it in in people that we know that we can trust as well um if we're just looking trust as well um if we're just looking trust as well um if we're just looking for feedback and we're only surrounding for feedback and we're only surrounding for feedback and we're only surrounding us ourselves with people that are only us ourselves with people that are only us ourselves with people that are only going to say oh yeah you are great going to say oh yeah you are great going to say oh yeah you are great that's not a problem yeah where how are that's not a problem yeah where how are that's not a problem yeah where how are we learning to be better leaders so it's we learning to be better leaders so it's we learning to be better leaders so it's really important to to know your inner really important to to know your inner really important to to know your inner circle that can provide that feedback circle that can provide that feedback circle that can provide that feedback that is true and honest and helpful and that is true and honest and helpful and that is true and honest and helpful and then what do you do with it yeah that then what do you do with it yeah that then what do you do with it yeah that that's you just said there a second ago that's you just said there a second ago that's you just said there a second ago was like oh yeah everything's great was like oh yeah everything's great was like oh yeah everything's great that's so not helpful because you're not that's so not helpful because you're not that's so not helpful because you're not perfect 100% of the time and you only perfect 100% of the time and you only perfect 100% of the time and you only really learn through your failure yes really learn through your failure yes really learn through your failure yes yes and I think people are afraid to yes and I think people are afraid to yes and I think people are afraid to fail um especially coming from corporate fail um especially coming from corporate fail um especially coming from corporate you there's not that Grace and so when you there's not that Grace and so when you there's not that Grace and so when you fail maybe on a project or how you you fail maybe on a project or how you you fail maybe on a project or how you handled a situation you sometimes then handled a situation you sometimes then handled a situation you sometimes then have this um this uh people start have this um this uh people start have this um this uh people start thinking of you in a a certain way and thinking of you in a a certain way and thinking of you in a a certain way and so now you have to I have to hurry up so now you have to I have to hurry up so now you have to I have to hurry up and change how they thinking of me and change how they thinking of me and change how they thinking of me whereas I feel like in Ministry um whereas I feel like in Ministry um whereas I feel like in Ministry um failure if if if it is taught in a failure if if if it is taught in a failure if if if it is taught in a healthy way of hey it's okay if we take

healthy way of hey it's okay if we take healthy way of hey it's okay if we take a risk and it doesn't hit it out of the a risk and it doesn't hit it out of the a risk and it doesn't hit it out of the park yeah it's okay we're just going to park yeah it's okay we're just going to park yeah it's okay we're just going to adjust and we're going to make some adjust and we're going to make some adjust and we're going to make some changes to make it better for next time changes to make it better for next time changes to make it better for next time now if we're intentionally not doing our now if we're intentionally not doing our now if we're intentionally not doing our best that's a different conversation but best that's a different conversation but best that's a different conversation but some things are are going to fail and some things are are going to fail and some things are are going to fail and that's okay because we can learn from it that's okay because we can learn from it that's okay because we can learn from it and then the next time will be a success and then the next time will be a success and then the next time will be a success it it just seems to me just in our brief it it just seems to me just in our brief it it just seems to me just in our brief conversation here that you've really conversation here that you've really conversation here that you've really spent a lot of time working on the spent a lot of time working on the spent a lot of time working on the culture of your department and having culture of your department and having culture of your department and having those vulnerable kind of conversations those vulnerable kind of conversations those vulnerable kind of conversations and that's really how you've one of the and that's really how you've one of the and that's really how you've one of the I think this is one of the tools that I think this is one of the tools that I think this is one of the tools that you've been using to build a really you've been using to build a really you've been using to build a really healthy comms department and it's buil healthy comms department and it's buil healthy comms department and it's buil it's bridged those relationships with it's bridged those relationships with it's bridged those relationships with those Ministries absolutely um about a those Ministries absolutely um about a those Ministries absolutely um about a year ago um I was overseeing the year ago um I was overseeing the year ago um I was overseeing the ministry side of things as well as what ministry side of things as well as what ministry side of things as well as what I call the corporate the organization of I call the corporate the organization of I call the corporate the organization of Abundant Life and so my supervisor came Abundant Life and so my supervisor came Abundant Life and so my supervisor came to me and said I really think we need to to me and said I really think we need to to me and said I really think we need to split those um have somebody that split those um have somebody that split those um have somebody that oversees the ministry of things and have oversees the ministry of things and have oversees the ministry of things and have somebody that oversees organizationally somebody that oversees organizationally somebody that oversees organizationally you know Abundant Life and I could have you know Abundant Life and I could have you know Abundant Life and I could have done one of two things I could have said done one of two things I could have said done one of two things I could have said mine mine mine I have built this mine mine mine I have built this mine mine mine I have built this department I've worked hard or I can say department I've worked hard or I can say department I've worked hard or I can say you know what God's entrusted me um to you know what God's entrusted me um to you know what God's entrusted me um to manage and have it with an open hand and manage and have it with an open hand and manage and have it with an open hand and so we brought another individual in that so we brought another individual in that so we brought another individual in that oversees the ministry side of things and oversees the ministry side of things and oversees the ministry side of things and it has been such a great partnership um

it has been such a great partnership um it has been such a great partnership um she has had really built a great bridge she has had really built a great bridge she has had really built a great bridge of trust with the Ministries and um I'm of trust with the Ministries and um I'm of trust with the Ministries and um I'm able just to see her flourish in that able just to see her flourish in that able just to see her flourish in that area we are um on the same level the area we are um on the same level the area we are um on the same level the same team and it's really has been so same team and it's really has been so same team and it's really has been so very helpful to have somebody that can very helpful to have somebody that can very helpful to have somebody that can share in that and uh the frustrations share in that and uh the frustrations share in that and uh the frustrations and the winds and so forth um but at and the winds and so forth um but at and the winds and so forth um but at when it first happened I was like hm when it first happened I was like hm when it first happened I was like hm this is kind of a different way for me this is kind of a different way for me this is kind of a different way for me to now AO to now AO to now AO now my focus is going to be different now my focus is going to be different now my focus is going to be different which has been great and that's kind of which has been great and that's kind of which has been great and that's kind of my sweet spot anyway organizationally my sweet spot anyway organizationally my sweet spot anyway organizationally overall and so it was really a great overall and so it was really a great overall and so it was really a great transition it could have gone one of two transition it could have gone one of two transition it could have gone one of two ways it could have been I'm G to fight ways it could have been I'm G to fight ways it could have been I'm G to fight it and I'm going to make her life it and I'm going to make her life it and I'm going to make her life miserable or I'm going to embrace this miserable or I'm going to embrace this miserable or I'm going to embrace this and we're going to have a great and we're going to have a great and we're going to have a great partnership and it's really been a great partnership and it's really been a great partnership and it's really been a great partner now I have somebody to bounce partner now I have somebody to bounce partner now I have somebody to bounce ideas off of and and she does the same ideas off of and and she does the same ideas off of and and she does the same and so it's really been just a sweet and so it's really been just a sweet and so it's really been just a sweet sweet sweet sweet partnership yeah we've Rachel I I don't partnership yeah we've Rachel I I don't partnership yeah we've Rachel I I don't want to devalue the conversation up to want to devalue the conversation up to want to devalue the conversation up to this point because it has been this point because it has been this point because it has been phenomenal uh we've talked a lot about phenomenal uh we've talked a lot about phenomenal uh we've talked a lot about sort of soft skills and and cultural sort of soft skills and and cultural sort of soft skills and and cultural development I I would like to for the development I I would like to for the development I I would like to for the last you know few minutes that we have last you know few minutes that we have last you know few minutes that we have in the conversation to talk a little bit in the conversation to talk a little bit in the conversation to talk a little bit more technical about your team about the more technical about your team about the more technical about your team about the structure of your team and about the structure of your team and about the structure of your team and about the things that you're doing technically things that you're doing technically things that you're doing technically really to help the church accomplish its really to help the church accomplish its really to help the church accomplish its Mission so you you just kind of shared Mission so you you just kind of shared Mission so you you just kind of shared with us that um this Communications and with us that um this Communications and with us that um this Communications and marketing uh role that you were holding marketing uh role that you were holding marketing uh role that you were holding kind of got divvied into two separate

kind of got divvied into two separate kind of got divvied into two separate Lanes can you break that down for us Lanes can you break that down for us Lanes can you break that down for us what does that look like for you what what does that look like for you what what does that look like for you what does that look like for the other person does that look like for the other person does that look like for the other person uh how much overlap do you have what uh how much overlap do you have what uh how much overlap do you have what what are your priorities in the team what are your priorities in the team what are your priorities in the team that you lead and and how does that that you lead and and how does that that you lead and and how does that really help the church so I help with really help the church so I help with really help the church so I help with campus expansion as well as um marketing campus expansion as well as um marketing campus expansion as well as um marketing Abundant Life externally um that's the Abundant Life externally um that's the Abundant Life externally um that's the best way I can describe it and so our best way I can describe it and so our best way I can describe it and so our you know mission is we want to see lives you know mission is we want to see lives you know mission is we want to see lives changed by Jesus we know with the with changed by Jesus we know with the with changed by Jesus we know with the with digital world and how that looks now is digital world and how that looks now is digital world and how that looks now is iners is not always the answer as far as iners is not always the answer as far as iners is not always the answer as far as how people are connecting to Christ some how people are connecting to Christ some how people are connecting to Christ some are going to watch you online for many are going to watch you online for many are going to watch you online for many many months without even raising a hand many months without even raising a hand many months without even raising a hand or even commenting and so how do we or even commenting and so how do we or even commenting and so how do we really take that individual on a journey really take that individual on a journey really take that individual on a journey from watching online to participating in from watching online to participating in from watching online to participating in some other online things that we have so some other online things that we have so some other online things that we have so we started doing a lot of different we started doing a lot of different we started doing a lot of different resources um based off of sermon series resources um based off of sermon series resources um based off of sermon series getting some downloadable um study getting some downloadable um study getting some downloadable um study guides so they can further it's not just guides so they can further it's not just guides so they can further it's not just a Sunday thing they're studying a Sunday thing they're studying a Sunday thing they're studying throughout the week um we did a a series throughout the week um we did a a series throughout the week um we did a a series on just the Pains of Life called scars on just the Pains of Life called scars on just the Pains of Life called scars and so a lot of people have pain um that and so a lot of people have pain um that and so a lot of people have pain um that they've experienced in life and so they've experienced in life and so they've experienced in life and so having them go through a study um just having them go through a study um just having them go through a study um just helps them connect not only to Abundant helps them connect not only to Abundant helps them connect not only to Abundant Life but connects them to Christ and the

Life but connects them to Christ and the Life but connects them to Christ and the hope that they have in Christ and so my hope that they have in Christ and so my hope that they have in Christ and so my role is for um us to expand our reach um role is for um us to expand our reach um role is for um us to expand our reach um not only in the Kansas City area is to not only in the Kansas City area is to not only in the Kansas City area is to get people involved with Abundant Life get people involved with Abundant Life get people involved with Abundant Life and to see their lives changed and take and to see their lives changed and take and to see their lives changed and take their next step in their faith Journey their next step in their faith Journey their next step in their faith Journey but it also is beyond that we have you but it also is beyond that we have you but it also is beyond that we have you know over 4,000 people that are know over 4,000 people that are know over 4,000 people that are streaming us every single Sunday um and streaming us every single Sunday um and streaming us every single Sunday um and so it's important to connect them and so it's important to connect them and so it's important to connect them and not m not make it where it's just not m not make it where it's just not m not make it where it's just they're watching us on a Sunday that they're watching us on a Sunday that they're watching us on a Sunday that they're having small group in their they're having small group in their they're having small group in their house we have 25 Church houses which house we have 25 Church houses which house we have 25 Church houses which means they gather they get a group of means they gather they get a group of means they gather they get a group of people that are coming together on a people that are coming together on a people that are coming together on a Sunday morning they're streaming our Sunday morning they're streaming our Sunday morning they're streaming our services they're having Community um and services they're having Community um and services they're having Community um and they're building those communities they're building those communities they're building those communities pockets of community all throughout the pockets of community all throughout the pockets of community all throughout the United States but with our events as United States but with our events as United States but with our events as well we want people to see that we are well we want people to see that we are well we want people to see that we are living proof of a loving God to a living proof of a loving God to a living proof of a loving God to a watching world and some of those events watching world and some of those events watching world and some of those events are a free Carnival that we have every are a free Carnival that we have every are a free Carnival that we have every single year we've been doing it for 20 single year we've been doing it for 20 single year we've been doing it for 20 years where we open up our largest years where we open up our largest years where we open up our largest campus and we have a carnival free food campus and we have a carnival free food campus and we have a carnival free food free um games free rides everything um free um games free rides everything um free um games free rides everything um and why do we do that well we want to and why do we do that well we want to and why do we do that well we want to the community to see that we love them the community to see that we love them the community to see that we love them and we want them to have a fun spot for and we want them to have a fun spot for and we want them to have a fun spot for their family and it's what we like to their family and it's what we like to their family and it's what we like to call is a yes day for parents sometimes call is a yes day for parents sometimes call is a yes day for parents sometimes you're not able to say yes but when they you're not able to say yes but when they you're not able to say yes but when they come to the carival and they say Mom can come to the carival and they say Mom can come to the carival and they say Mom can I have cotton candy and a hot dog and

I have cotton candy and a hot dog and I have cotton candy and a hot dog and nachos you're able to say yes because nachos you're able to say yes because nachos you're able to say yes because you don't have to pay for it and so it's you don't have to pay for it and so it's you don't have to pay for it and so it's a great opportunity for us just oh you a great opportunity for us just oh you a great opportunity for us just oh you will be paying for it if they eat all of will be paying for it if they eat all of will be paying for it if they eat all of that you're just gonna be paying for it that you're just gonna be paying for it that you're just gonna be paying for it in a very different way exactly exactly in a very different way exactly exactly in a very different way exactly exactly but we want to be able to bless the but we want to be able to bless the but we want to be able to bless the families um we really have taken an families um we really have taken an families um we really have taken an initiative um we have every two year we initiative um we have every two year we initiative um we have every two year we kind of have this two-year run of kind of have this two-year run of kind of have this two-year run of initiatives um and so we're in our initiatives um and so we're in our initiatives um and so we're in our second year of called irresistible where second year of called irresistible where second year of called irresistible where we want to be able to show um the love we want to be able to show um the love we want to be able to show um the love of Christ that it is irresistible and so of Christ that it is irresistible and so of Christ that it is irresistible and so we've started a family ministry we had a we've started a family ministry we had a we've started a family ministry we had a a family parenting conference um last a family parenting conference um last a family parenting conference um last fall we're getting ready to do a fall we're getting ready to do a fall we're getting ready to do a marriage conference this spring um marriage conference this spring um marriage conference this spring um because we know the importance of because we know the importance of because we know the importance of families what family doesn't want to be families what family doesn't want to be families what family doesn't want to be better right yeah whether or not your better right yeah whether or not your better right yeah whether or not your church going whether or not your Christ church going whether or not your Christ church going whether or not your Christ believing you want to be a good mom you believing you want to be a good mom you believing you want to be a good mom you want to be a good dad you want the best want to be a good dad you want the best want to be a good dad you want the best family and so if we can help provide family and so if we can help provide family and so if we can help provide resources for those families and get resources for those families and get resources for those families and get them connected um to other families and them connected um to other families and them connected um to other families and other communities that's super important other communities that's super important other communities that's super important and so my role is really the external and so my role is really the external and so my role is really the external marketing of that um we have a Content marketing of that um we have a Content marketing of that um we have a Content writer that helps write blogs because we writer that helps write blogs because we writer that helps write blogs because we all know how are people going to find all know how are people going to find all know how are people going to find you on the internet on Google we got to you on the internet on Google we got to you on the internet on Google we got to play the game and so playing the game is play the game and so playing the game is play the game and so playing the game is making sure you have cont content that making sure you have cont content that making sure you have cont content that is searchable that optimized and so is searchable that optimized and so is searchable that optimized and so we're cranking out two to three blogs a

we're cranking out two to three blogs a we're cranking out two to three blogs a week um just to refresh and make sure we week um just to refresh and make sure we week um just to refresh and make sure we got content Out There Our YouTube we are got content Out There Our YouTube we are got content Out There Our YouTube we are making sure we have shorts and we're making sure we have shorts and we're making sure we have shorts and we're getting ready to start some online getting ready to start some online getting ready to start some online series for our online um just our series for our online um just our series for our online um just our community so that they can find us if if community so that they can find us if if community so that they can find us if if we're not having the paths for people to we're not having the paths for people to we're not having the paths for people to be able to find us they're going to find be able to find us they're going to find be able to find us they're going to find something else to fill that void with we something else to fill that void with we something else to fill that void with we want them to fill that void and want them to fill that void and want them to fill that void and hopelessness with Christ and so that's hopelessness with Christ and so that's hopelessness with Christ and so that's part of my job um now my co my co uh in part of my job um now my co my co uh in part of my job um now my co my co uh in part she oversees Ministries so she part she oversees Ministries so she part she oversees Ministries so she really helps communicate um with the really helps communicate um with the really helps communicate um with the Ministries on how they can really Ministries on how they can really Ministries on how they can really effectively communicate internally um effectively communicate internally um effectively communicate internally um about events about their ministries of about events about their ministries of about events about their ministries of Bible studies what's going on there and Bible studies what's going on there and Bible studies what's going on there and so she really leads them down that path so she really leads them down that path so she really leads them down that path of what's the most efficient way to of what's the most efficient way to of what's the most efficient way to communicate about the different things communicate about the different things communicate about the different things that they're doing um and how she can that they're doing um and how she can that they're doing um and how she can really help them yeah well I I I I love really help them yeah well I I I I love really help them yeah well I I I I love your model there because I I would say your model there because I I would say your model there because I I would say she's she's in charge of the 99 you're she's she's in charge of the 99 you're she's she's in charge of the 99 you're in charge of the one yes yes so it's in charge of the one yes yes so it's in charge of the one yes yes so it's been a great partnership um and she been a great partnership um and she been a great partnership um and she brings a lot of knowledge she also comes brings a lot of knowledge she also comes brings a lot of knowledge she also comes from a corporate background as well so from a corporate background as well so from a corporate background as well so she brings that knowledge in there as she brings that knowledge in there as she brings that knowledge in there as well and she leads a great team of we well and she leads a great team of we well and she leads a great team of we share graphic designers and we share share graphic designers and we share share graphic designers and we share videographers which has been really just videographers which has been really just videographers which has been really just a sweet time for us to be able just to a sweet time for us to be able just to a sweet time for us to be able just to share resources and and bounce ideas off share resources and and bounce ideas off share resources and and bounce ideas off of each other yeah wow well thank you

of each other yeah wow well thank you of each other yeah wow well thank you for okay we got to land This Plane for okay we got to land This Plane for okay we got to land This Plane because we I could keep going on and on because we I could keep going on and on because we I could keep going on and on so good but just real quick tell us a so good but just real quick tell us a so good but just real quick tell us a little bit about who you're listening to little bit about who you're listening to little bit about who you're listening to who you're paying attention to to help who you're paying attention to to help who you're paying attention to to help you do your job better yeah that's a you do your job better yeah that's a you do your job better yeah that's a great question um I always think Carrie great question um I always think Carrie great question um I always think Carrie newoff has great nuggets of leadership newoff has great nuggets of leadership newoff has great nuggets of leadership um I have followed him for years and um I have followed him for years and um I have followed him for years and years and so anytime I can pull some of years and so anytime I can pull some of years and so anytime I can pull some of those nuggets and really apply them to those nuggets and really apply them to those nuggets and really apply them to my own leadership is super important um my own leadership is super important um my own leadership is super important um one of my mentors um was um part of John one of my mentors um was um part of John one of my mentors um was um part of John Maxwell and always such good good Maxwell and always such good good Maxwell and always such good good information there um being able to lead information there um being able to lead information there um being able to lead in a Godly way and being able to be in a Godly way and being able to be in a Godly way and being able to be humble um being able to be um have humble um being able to be um have humble um being able to be um have Synergy within your team um and just Synergy within your team um and just Synergy within your team um and just being able to um communicate to your being able to um communicate to your being able to um communicate to your team and be open and honest and team and be open and honest and team and be open and honest and transparent is really important so those transparent is really important so those transparent is really important so those are two major ones that I do we haven't are two major ones that I do we haven't are two major ones that I do we haven't gone to a conference in such a long time gone to a conference in such a long time gone to a conference in such a long time we kind of got out of the Rhythm with we kind of got out of the Rhythm with we kind of got out of the Rhythm with covid and um we would love to get back covid and um we would love to get back covid and um we would love to get back into maybe a church comms Conference of into maybe a church comms Conference of into maybe a church comms Conference of some sort but we haven't done it in so some sort but we haven't done it in so some sort but we haven't done it in so many years we kind of have gotten out of many years we kind of have gotten out of many years we kind of have gotten out of that Rhythm but I also um several years that Rhythm but I also um several years that Rhythm but I also um several years ago even before Co I put together just a ago even before Co I put together just a ago even before Co I put together just a local group of comms directors here in local group of comms directors here in local group of comms directors here in the Kansas City area all female um which the Kansas City area all female um which the Kansas City area all female um which has been just a sweet time for us to be has been just a sweet time for us to be has been just a sweet time for us to be able to get together we get together

able to get together we get together able to get together we get together quarterly we don't look at it as oh quarterly we don't look at it as oh quarterly we don't look at it as oh they're just right next door to us and they're just right next door to us and they're just right next door to us and it's competition we look at it as this it's competition we look at it as this it's competition we look at it as this is building the kingdom and so we're is building the kingdom and so we're is building the kingdom and so we're able to share ideas we're able to share able to share ideas we're able to share able to share ideas we're able to share frustrations of oh I've been through frustrations of oh I've been through frustrations of oh I've been through that here's how I handled that situation that here's how I handled that situation that here's how I handled that situation and really just build a Sisterhood of and really just build a Sisterhood of and really just build a Sisterhood of comm's director in the Kansas City area comm's director in the Kansas City area comm's director in the Kansas City area it has really just been a time of um us it has really just been a time of um us it has really just been a time of um us to build each other up and grow and so to build each other up and grow and so to build each other up and grow and so those are some things that I do just to those are some things that I do just to those are some things that I do just to keep myself fresh and that I can also keep myself fresh and that I can also keep myself fresh and that I can also call on those that Core Group my inner call on those that Core Group my inner call on those that Core Group my inner circle of when things are tough and I circle of when things are tough and I circle of when things are tough and I know I can say I'm having a a time I I know I can say I'm having a a time I I know I can say I'm having a a time I I need yall to pray for me and I know need yall to pray for me and I know need yall to pray for me and I know they're going to do it yeah oh so good they're going to do it yeah oh so good they're going to do it yeah oh so good yeah I encourage everybody who's in that yeah I encourage everybody who's in that yeah I encourage everybody who's in that role to to find your find your people role to to find your find your people role to to find your find your people your group to connect with so absolutely your group to connect with so absolutely your group to connect with so absolutely yeah Rachel as as we wrap things up here yeah Rachel as as we wrap things up here yeah Rachel as as we wrap things up here today um uh help our audience know how today um uh help our audience know how today um uh help our audience know how they can find you find Abundant Life they can find you find Abundant Life they can find you find Abundant Life online uh I I we we are constantly online uh I I we we are constantly online uh I I we we are constantly talking with churches about content talking with churches about content talking with churches about content creation SEO blogging I know a lot of creation SEO blogging I know a lot of creation SEO blogging I know a lot of our listeners are going to go oh let's our listeners are going to go oh let's our listeners are going to go oh let's go see what the blogging content looks go see what the blogging content looks go see what the blogging content looks like they're they're GNA want to know like they're they're GNA want to know like they're they're GNA want to know where can they find that how can they where can they find that how can they where can they find that how can they connect with you if they had any connect with you if they had any connect with you if they had any follow-up questions or wanted to pick follow-up questions or wanted to pick follow-up questions or wanted to pick your brain about something yeah your brain about something yeah your brain about something yeah absolutely um so you can go to absolutely um so you can go to absolutely um so you can go to livingproof doco livingproof doco livingproof doco not.com because if you go there you'll

not.com because if you go there you'll not.com because if you go there you'll get hair products okay so livingproof get hair products okay so livingproof get hair products okay so livingproof doco is our website um SL blogs is where doco is our website um SL blogs is where doco is our website um SL blogs is where all of our blogs live if you want to all of our blogs live if you want to all of our blogs live if you want to reach out to me anybody can email me and reach out to me anybody can email me and reach out to me anybody can email me and that's Rachel r a a l. Branson at Living that's Rachel r a a l. Branson at Living that's Rachel r a a l. Branson at Living proof. happy to answer any questions we proof. happy to answer any questions we proof. happy to answer any questions we feel like we've learned from so many feel like we've learned from so many feel like we've learned from so many other churches that we also want to pass other churches that we also want to pass other churches that we also want to pass on whatever we've learned um because on whatever we've learned um because on whatever we've learned um because we're all in it together we want we're all in it together we want we're all in it together we want everybody to be able to succeed and we everybody to be able to succeed and we everybody to be able to succeed and we want the king Kingdom to grow and so I'm want the king Kingdom to grow and so I'm want the king Kingdom to grow and so I'm happy to answer questions regarding that happy to answer questions regarding that happy to answer questions regarding that you can find us on YouTube as well you can find us on YouTube as well you can find us on YouTube as well living proof um it's actually underneath living proof um it's actually underneath living proof um it's actually underneath youtube. youtube. youtube. abundantlifels um the same for all of abundantlifels um the same for all of abundantlifels um the same for all of our social handles on Instagram and our social handles on Instagram and our social handles on Instagram and Facebook um Abundant Life LS and Lee Facebook um Abundant Life LS and Lee Facebook um Abundant Life LS and Lee Summit so excellent Rachel thank you so Summit so excellent Rachel thank you so Summit so excellent Rachel thank you so much uh for being generous with your much uh for being generous with your much uh for being generous with your time and sharing so much with our time and sharing so much with our time and sharing so much with our audience today I'm I'm confident that audience today I'm I'm confident that audience today I'm I'm confident that it's uh it's going to be something it's uh it's going to be something it's uh it's going to be something that's going to resonate with people for that's going to resonate with people for that's going to resonate with people for a while um and yeah we just appreciate a while um and yeah we just appreciate a while um and yeah we just appreciate you and what you and your team there at you and what you and your team there at you and what you and your team there at Abundant Life are doing to reach more Abundant Life are doing to reach more Abundant Life are doing to reach more people for Jesus uh for those of you who people for Jesus uh for those of you who people for Jesus uh for those of you who are listening just a quick reminder if are listening just a quick reminder if are listening just a quick reminder if you haven't subscribed wherever you you haven't subscribed wherever you you haven't subscribed wherever you listen to your favorite podcast make listen to your favorite podcast make listen to your favorite podcast make sure that you subscribe I do want to sure that you subscribe I do want to sure that you subscribe I do want to remind you that if you're listening to remind you that if you're listening to remind you that if you're listening to this in real time about the time that this in real time about the time that this in real time about the time that this podcast came out you've only got a this podcast came out you've only got a this podcast came out you've only got a matter of weeks until Google podcasts is matter of weeks until Google podcasts is matter of weeks until Google podcasts is going away way so if you're subscribed going away way so if you're subscribed going away way so if you're subscribed on Google podcasts you won't get the on Google podcasts you won't get the on Google podcasts you won't get the podcast anymore in just a few more weeks podcast anymore in just a few more weeks podcast anymore in just a few more weeks so make sure you find a different so make sure you find a different so make sure you find a different platform Spotify Stitcher Apple podcasts

platform Spotify Stitcher Apple podcasts platform Spotify Stitcher Apple podcasts or somewhere else otherwise you will or somewhere else otherwise you will or somewhere else otherwise you will never hear us again and Jason and I never hear us again and Jason and I never hear us again and Jason and I would really be sad about that if you would really be sad about that if you would really be sad about that if you don't hear us again um again if you're don't hear us again um again if you're don't hear us again um again if you're watching on our YouTube channel uh we watching on our YouTube channel uh we watching on our YouTube channel uh we were going to pose a question related to were going to pose a question related to were going to pose a question related to this discussion that we just had with this discussion that we just had with this discussion that we just had with Rachel U pinning that to the top of the Rachel U pinning that to the top of the Rachel U pinning that to the top of the comment section and we'd love to engage comment section and we'd love to engage comment section and we'd love to engage with you there on our YouTube channel so with you there on our YouTube channel so with you there on our YouTube channel so uh leave us some feedback let us know uh leave us some feedback let us know uh leave us some feedback let us know what your thoughts are answer that what your thoughts are answer that what your thoughts are answer that question uh Rachel again thanks so much question uh Rachel again thanks so much question uh Rachel again thanks so much for joining us today thank you guys have for joining us today thank you guys have for joining us today thank you guys have a great