An Unfiltered Conversation With Mike Todd's Social Media Advisor

today on the show we're joined by Ron today on the show we're joined by Ron Starling who for 3 years held the role Starling who for 3 years held the role Starling who for 3 years held the role of content creator to the lead pastor at of content creator to the lead pastor at of content creator to the lead pastor at Transformation Church in Tulsa Oklahoma Transformation Church in Tulsa Oklahoma Transformation Church in Tulsa Oklahoma This Means Ron was working one-on-one This Means Ron was working one-on-one This Means Ron was working one-on-one with Pastor Mike Todd and helping to with Pastor Mike Todd and helping to with Pastor Mike Todd and helping to direct strategy on social we ask Ron all direct strategy on social we ask Ron all direct strategy on social we ask Ron all the big questions how do you decide what the big questions how do you decide what the big questions how do you decide what goes on the pastor's account versus the goes on the pastor's account versus the goes on the pastor's account versus the church's account how do you manage church's account how do you manage church's account how do you manage posting five times per day on Instagram posting five times per day on Instagram posting five times per day on Instagram and how do you get your pastor to trust and how do you get your pastor to trust and how do you get your pastor to trust your ideas even when they sound crazy your ideas even when they sound crazy your ideas even when they sound crazy Ron is a wealth of wisdom and he's Ron is a wealth of wisdom and he's Ron is a wealth of wisdom and he's incredibly transparent this interview incredibly transparent this interview incredibly transparent this interview which is also why we had to ask what which is also why we had to ask what which is also why we had to ask what provoked him to leave Transformation provoked him to leave Transformation provoked him to leave Transformation Church near the end of last year let's Church near the end of last year let's Church near the end of last year let's dive dive dive in well hey there and welcome to the pro in well hey there and welcome to the pro in well hey there and welcome to the pro Church tools show we're here to help you Church tools show we're here to help you Church tools show we're here to help you and your church navigate the biggest and your church navigate the biggest and your church navigate the biggest communication shift in 500 years I'm communication shift in 500 years I'm communication shift in 500 years I'm Brady she your host I'm joined as always Brady she your host I'm joined as always Brady she your host I'm joined as always by my co-host it's Alexander Mills hello by my co-host it's Alexander Mills hello by my co-host it's Alexander Mills hello hello and today we are also joined by hello and today we are also joined by hello and today we are also joined by Ron Starling creative genius Ron and I Ron Starling creative genius Ron and I Ron Starling creative genius Ron and I first met in person in uh Vegas in 2018 first met in person in uh Vegas in 2018 first met in person in uh Vegas in 2018 and then shortly after uh he was working and then shortly after uh he was working and then shortly after uh he was working at Transformation Church Tulsa Oklahoma at Transformation Church Tulsa Oklahoma at Transformation Church Tulsa Oklahoma most of our listeners might know them most of our listeners might know them most of our listeners might know them because of Pastor Mike Todd Ron welcome because of Pastor Mike Todd Ron welcome because of Pastor Mike Todd Ron welcome to the show oh it is an honor to be here to the show oh it is an honor to be here to the show oh it is an honor to be here Brady Alex I've been following you Brady Alex I've been following you Brady Alex I've been following you forever so to be on this with you to forever so to be on this with you to forever so to be on this with you to have this conversation is is the coolest have this conversation is is the coolest have this conversation is is the coolest thing to see you again is the coolest thing to see you again is the coolest thing to see you again is the coolest thing so I'm excited yeah it's been a thing so I'm excited yeah it's been a thing so I'm excited yeah it's been a been a while just a light pandemic in been a while just a light pandemic in been a while just a light pandemic in between our last meeting no sweat no between our last meeting no sweat no between our last meeting no sweat no sweat no sweat just a little panoramic sweat no sweat just a little panoramic sweat no sweat just a little panoramic and speaking of that you got in involved and speaking of that you got in involved and speaking of that you got in involved with transformation like right like on

with transformation like right like on with transformation like right like on the cusp of that before that then you the cusp of that before that then you the cusp of that before that then you kind of Hit the P pandemic there can you kind of Hit the P pandemic there can you kind of Hit the P pandemic there can you tell us a bit about how you first got tell us a bit about how you first got tell us a bit about how you first got connected to transformation and and your connected to transformation and and your connected to transformation and and your role there that you stepped into yeah of role there that you stepped into yeah of role there that you stepped into yeah of course this is one of my favorite course this is one of my favorite course this is one of my favorite stories so I remember working in a stories so I remember working in a stories so I remember working in a church in Las Vegas uh I think I was 22 church in Las Vegas uh I think I was 22 church in Las Vegas uh I think I was 22 or 23 at the time I left I started this or 23 at the time I left I started this or 23 at the time I left I started this creative Journey this is probably the creative Journey this is probably the creative Journey this is probably the day that I met you this is the day that day that I met you this is the day that day that I met you this is the day that I met you I kid you not the day I met I met you I kid you not the day I met I met you I kid you not the day I met you was my last day at my my church job you was my last day at my my church job you was my last day at my my church job in Vegas um I I packed up my bags and if in Vegas um I I packed up my bags and if in Vegas um I I packed up my bags and if you can imagine the scene in first you can imagine the scene in first you can imagine the scene in first prince of Bel where the room is empty prince of Bel where the room is empty prince of Bel where the room is empty you have he had his little box in his you have he had his little box in his you have he had his little box in his hand and I said to myself or honestly I hand and I said to myself or honestly I hand and I said to myself or honestly I said to God I said the only other church said to God I said the only other church said to God I said the only other church I would ever work at is Transformation I would ever work at is Transformation I would ever work at is Transformation Church and I met you like three hours Church and I met you like three hours Church and I met you like three hours later and then and I later and then and I later and then and I said no no I wish I could remember um said no no I wish I could remember um said no no I wish I could remember um and then 6 months later I get a call on and then 6 months later I get a call on and then 6 months later I get a call on my phone from uh the social media uh my phone from uh the social media uh my phone from uh the social media uh director at Transformation Church and director at Transformation Church and director at Transformation Church and I've known him we've known each other I've known him we've known each other I've known him we've known each other since 2017 since before he started since 2017 since before he started since 2017 since before he started working there and then also when they working there and then also when they working there and then also when they blew up because we were talking ideas blew up because we were talking ideas blew up because we were talking ideas content things like that and he goes hey content things like that and he goes hey content things like that and he goes hey man I heard that you're not working um man I heard that you're not working um man I heard that you're not working um and uh you want to move to Tulsa and I and uh you want to move to Tulsa and I and uh you want to move to Tulsa and I was like where's Tulsa again like I was like where's Tulsa again like I was like where's Tulsa again like I don't know if I want to do this and then don't know if I want to do this and then don't know if I want to do this and then I got another call I was in London at I got another call I was in London at I got another call I was in London at the time got another call from one of the time got another call from one of the time got another call from one of the executive pastors and they were like the executive pastors and they were like the executive pastors and they were like yeah man think about moving moving to yeah man think about moving moving to yeah man think about moving moving to Tulsa and I'm like o okay so I'm praying

Tulsa and I'm like o okay so I'm praying Tulsa and I'm like o okay so I'm praying earnestly uh fervently uh decide to earnestly uh fervently uh decide to earnestly uh fervently uh decide to apply and this is all 2019 and they apply and this is all 2019 and they apply and this is all 2019 and they offer me the job in May of 2019 and I offer me the job in May of 2019 and I offer me the job in May of 2019 and I declined the job 6 months later declined the job 6 months later declined the job 6 months later transformation conference happens and transformation conference happens and transformation conference happens and then I'm like yeah I should probably be then I'm like yeah I should probably be then I'm like yeah I should probably be here and then I move to Tulsa February here and then I move to Tulsa February here and then I move to Tulsa February 2020 right oh I'm there for four weeks 2020 right oh I'm there for four weeks 2020 right oh I'm there for four weeks four I have three weeks in the building four I have three weeks in the building four I have three weeks in the building right right right and uh I remember like it was yesterday and uh I remember like it was yesterday and uh I remember like it was yesterday March 15th um I'm recording a video with March 15th um I'm recording a video with March 15th um I'm recording a video with Pastor Michael he's like we're gonna Pastor Michael he's like we're gonna Pastor Michael he's like we're gonna have church this weekend I'm so excited have church this weekend I'm so excited have church this weekend I'm so excited to see you and I stop recording I go hey to see you and I stop recording I go hey to see you and I stop recording I go hey I don't think we G to have church this I don't think we G to have church this I don't think we G to have church this weekend he goes wrong that's so stupid weekend he goes wrong that's so stupid weekend he goes wrong that's so stupid like it's Church we're going to have like it's Church we're going to have like it's Church we're going to have church I go this church my friends at church I go this church my friends at church I go this church my friends at this church and they said and this this church and they said and this this church and they said and this church all around the country about our church all around the country about our church all around the country about our size they not having Church baby and he size they not having Church baby and he size they not having Church baby and he goes we're going to have church so we goes we're going to have church so we goes we're going to have church so we Pro proed to record the video I record Pro proed to record the video I record Pro proed to record the video I record the video I edit it somebody not me puts the video I edit it somebody not me puts the video I edit it somebody not me puts it on the internet and then he texts me it on the internet and then he texts me it on the internet and then he texts me he goes who put that who put that video he goes who put that who put that video he goes who put that who put that video up and I go we're not having church this up and I go we're not having church this up and I go we're not having church this weekend huh and that was the beginning weekend huh and that was the beginning weekend huh and that was the beginning of the panoramic for me and all my of the panoramic for me and all my of the panoramic for me and all my friends at friends at friends at TC and how long was transformation not TC and how long was transformation not TC and how long was transformation not doing inperson Services because I feel doing inperson Services because I feel doing inperson Services because I feel like I remember it being longer than a like I remember it being longer than a like I remember it being longer than a lot of other churches yeah it was super lot of other churches yeah it was super lot of other churches yeah it was super long so that one weekend in March we long so that one weekend in March we long so that one weekend in March we didn't open up until October didn't open up until October didn't open up until October 2022 I believe so we were closed down

2022 I believe so we were closed down 2022 I believe so we were closed down for like 2 years and there was way more for like 2 years and there was way more for like 2 years and there was way more to it like um it wasn't because we to it like um it wasn't because we to it like um it wasn't because we didn't we didn't want people in the didn't we didn't want people in the didn't we didn't want people in the building it wasn't because like we building it wasn't because like we building it wasn't because like we couldn't have like we didn't want to couldn't have like we didn't want to couldn't have like we didn't want to have church or online was great online have church or online was great online have church or online was great online was popping but um there was some like was popping but um there was some like was popping but um there was some like construction stuff that just was taking construction stuff that just was taking construction stuff that just was taking way too long and it was like yo we can't way too long and it was like yo we can't way too long and it was like yo we can't we can't have people in the building we can't have people in the building we can't have people in the building while there's still construction like while there's still construction like while there's still construction like the roof was overc capacity I was like the roof was overc capacity I was like the roof was overc capacity I was like uh I don't want to be in that building uh I don't want to be in that building uh I don't want to be in that building like I could die like uh y'all got too like I could die like uh y'all got too like I could die like uh y'all got too much stuff hanging up there too many much stuff hanging up there too many much stuff hanging up there too many lights um so they they prioritized lights um so they they prioritized lights um so they they prioritized people's safety and it was also people's safety and it was also people's safety and it was also something that like we're like let's not something that like we're like let's not something that like we're like let's not we don't need to tell everybody that we don't need to tell everybody that we don't need to tell everybody that right now let's just fix it and by the right now let's just fix it and by the right now let's just fix it and by the time we opened we were still doing time we opened we were still doing time we opened we were still doing construction just in places that people construction just in places that people construction just in places that people didn't need to be so it was it was a didn't need to be so it was it was a didn't need to be so it was it was a long process we're fighting the city but long process we're fighting the city but long process we're fighting the city but they got it done and it worked out so they got it done and it worked out so they got it done and it worked out so Ron for our listeners who might not know Ron for our listeners who might not know Ron for our listeners who might not know you can you tell us a little bit about you can you tell us a little bit about you can you tell us a little bit about yourself and and maybe your skill set yourself and and maybe your skill set yourself and and maybe your skill set why you had people from transformation why you had people from transformation why you had people from transformation texting you in the first place saying texting you in the first place saying texting you in the first place saying hey you want to come move to Tulsa and hey you want to come move to Tulsa and hey you want to come move to Tulsa and work this guy's getting head hunted dude work this guy's getting head hunted dude work this guy's getting head hunted dude it was crazy so um let's it all starts it was crazy so um let's it all starts it was crazy so um let's it all starts back then at that church in Las Vegas so back then at that church in Las Vegas so back then at that church in Las Vegas so um I have since I could remember thought um I have since I could remember thought um I have since I could remember thought I wasn't a creative person I would look I wasn't a creative person I would look I wasn't a creative person I would look myself in the mirror and say to myself myself in the mirror and say to myself myself in the mirror and say to myself Ron you're not creative and um it stole Ron you're not creative and um it stole Ron you're not creative and um it stole the the idea that I could do anything the the idea that I could do anything the the idea that I could do anything like this but I made a YouTube video like this but I made a YouTube video like this but I made a YouTube video when I was 16 and it got like 150,000 when I was 16 and it got like 150,000 when I was 16 and it got like 150,000 views and I was like maybe I do know

views and I was like maybe I do know views and I was like maybe I do know what I'm doing like this is back in 2012 what I'm doing like this is back in 2012 what I'm doing like this is back in 2012 um so I met this guy named Sean kennel um so I met this guy named Sean kennel um so I met this guy named Sean kennel he looked at me and he said Ron you are he looked at me and he said Ron you are he looked at me and he said Ron you are creative so that changed everything for creative so that changed everything for creative so that changed everything for me um and very shortly after that uh I me um and very shortly after that uh I me um and very shortly after that uh I was I was a kids Pastor very shortly was I was a kids Pastor very shortly was I was a kids Pastor very shortly after that I ended up uh taking the after that I ended up uh taking the after that I ended up uh taking the reign of social media at that church in reign of social media at that church in reign of social media at that church in Las Vegas and I I just wanted to Las Vegas and I I just wanted to Las Vegas and I I just wanted to approach it differently um I thought approach it differently um I thought approach it differently um I thought vertical video was really cool and this vertical video was really cool and this vertical video was really cool and this is when stories were just introduced um is when stories were just introduced um is when stories were just introduced um no one was really taking it seriously no one was really taking it seriously no one was really taking it seriously and I was like yo what if we made like and I was like yo what if we made like and I was like yo what if we made like actual videos on cameras and then edited actual videos on cameras and then edited actual videos on cameras and then edited them cut them down to 15-second them cut them down to 15-second them cut them down to 15-second increments and then posted that on increments and then posted that on increments and then posted that on Instagram instead of doing it on your Instagram instead of doing it on your Instagram instead of doing it on your phone so I did that I did it with phone so I did that I did it with phone so I did that I did it with transitions I did whip pan Transitions transitions I did whip pan Transitions transitions I did whip pan Transitions and Camera transitions uh masking I did and Camera transitions uh masking I did and Camera transitions uh masking I did I did the works the things that we would I did the works the things that we would I did the works the things that we would normally do in a video I did it on a normally do in a video I did it on a normally do in a video I did it on a store story um and stories were big store story um and stories were big store story um and stories were big everyone was watching stories so by that everyone was watching stories so by that everyone was watching stories so by that time I was making those videos and then time I was making those videos and then time I was making those videos and then people started talking about it it just people started talking about it it just people started talking about it it just became a thing that people started became a thing that people started became a thing that people started talking about and I just kept being talking about and I just kept being talking about and I just kept being consistent I was the guy in our church consistent I was the guy in our church consistent I was the guy in our church in our city that was known that would to in our city that was known that would to in our city that was known that would to make vertical videos and people were make vertical videos and people were make vertical videos and people were like uh I want that from my church so like uh I want that from my church so like uh I want that from my church so once that kind of got around um uh I was once that kind of got around um uh I was once that kind of got around um uh I was like hey can I like have a Sunday off to like hey can I like have a Sunday off to like hey can I like have a Sunday off to do this at another church and my pastor do this at another church and my pastor do this at another church and my pastor was like that doesn't even make sense was like that doesn't even make sense was like that doesn't even make sense like you can't not be here on Sunday for like you can't not be here on Sunday for like you can't not be here on Sunday for another church when you work at this another church when you work at this another church when you work at this church and I was like yo that's kind of

church and I was like yo that's kind of church and I was like yo that's kind of valid I have to think about this I have valid I have to think about this I have valid I have to think about this I have to figure out what I want to do so I I to figure out what I want to do so I I to figure out what I want to do so I I just took it upon myself and I was like just took it upon myself and I was like just took it upon myself and I was like yeah I'll hit you in two weeks and that yeah I'll hit you in two weeks and that yeah I'll hit you in two weeks and that was like my two we not like notice like was like my two we not like notice like was like my two we not like notice like it's probably my time to go um and that it's probably my time to go um and that it's probably my time to go um and that after that two weeks is when um that after that two weeks is when um that after that two weeks is when um that first story happened and then I started first story happened and then I started first story happened and then I started doing things for other people other doing things for other people other doing things for other people other churches and then then because I was on churches and then then because I was on churches and then then because I was on my own I kind of had to figure this out my own I kind of had to figure this out my own I kind of had to figure this out I had to figure out um what worked what I had to figure out um what worked what I had to figure out um what worked what didn't work um and over time social didn't work um and over time social didn't work um and over time social media became my Niche um and not as in media became my Niche um and not as in media became my Niche um and not as in like a specific Niche within social like a specific Niche within social like a specific Niche within social media but social media became my thing media but social media became my thing media but social media became my thing like um and I started to figure out what like um and I started to figure out what like um and I started to figure out what worked I started to figure out what what worked I started to figure out what what worked I started to figure out what what trends are how to utilize them um and trends are how to utilize them um and trends are how to utilize them um and that came over time especially with my that came over time especially with my that came over time especially with my time at TC but um yeah social media time at TC but um yeah social media time at TC but um yeah social media became my thing and I just started to became my thing and I just started to became my thing and I just started to understand it and I started helping understand it and I started helping understand it and I started helping build other people's platforms and it it build other people's platforms and it it build other people's platforms and it it just went up since there it's just went up since there it's just went up since there it's fascinating to draw parallels between fascinating to draw parallels between fascinating to draw parallels between your story Ron and my own story because your story Ron and my own story because your story Ron and my own story because when I first got started I was in the when I first got started I was in the when I first got started I was in the city of Edmonton in Canada and I was city of Edmonton in Canada and I was city of Edmonton in Canada and I was just like someone put a camera in my just like someone put a camera in my just like someone put a camera in my hand and I made a video for our church hand and I made a video for our church hand and I made a video for our church and then other churches were like yo can and then other churches were like yo can and then other churches were like yo can you make a video like that for us you make a video like that for us you make a video like that for us remember and I never thought of myself remember and I never thought of myself remember and I never thought of myself as a creative person but suddenly people as a creative person but suddenly people as a creative person but suddenly people are asking me to do things and then once are asking me to do things and then once are asking me to do things and then once you kind of have that that reputation you kind of have that that reputation you kind of have that that reputation amongst people you know then you're like amongst people you know then you're like amongst people you know then you're like oh maybe I could just like teach people oh maybe I could just like teach people oh maybe I could just like teach people online so it's just fascinating to think online so it's just fascinating to think online so it's just fascinating to think about how we think certain things about

about how we think certain things about about how we think certain things about ourselves oh I'm not X I'm not Y and ourselves oh I'm not X I'm not Y and ourselves oh I'm not X I'm not Y and then one person sees something in us and then one person sees something in us and then one person sees something in us and because of that one person you know it because of that one person you know it because of that one person you know it was Sean for you maybe it was my pastor was Sean for you maybe it was my pastor was Sean for you maybe it was my pastor Brett back then and then another person Brett back then and then another person Brett back then and then another person sees it because that person first sees it because that person first sees it because that person first believed in you and it shapes the believed in you and it shapes the believed in you and it shapes the trajectory of your entire life based on trajectory of your entire life based on trajectory of your entire life based on what one person said and just you what one person said and just you what one person said and just you putting in the work in the right place putting in the work in the right place putting in the work in the right place and then you're known for one thing then and then you're known for one thing then and then you're known for one thing then you expand to be known for other things you expand to be known for other things you expand to be known for other things so if anyone's listening to this you're so if anyone's listening to this you're so if anyone's listening to this you're like you know how to focusing on one like you know how to focusing on one like you know how to focusing on one thing becoming known for a single thing thing becoming known for a single thing thing becoming known for a single thing can play such a pivotal role and and can play such a pivotal role and and can play such a pivotal role and and pivoting from here Ron I want to talk pivoting from here Ron I want to talk pivoting from here Ron I want to talk specifically about social that you did specifically about social that you did specifically about social that you did for for for for for for transformation one of the things that I transformation one of the things that I transformation one of the things that I remember Pastor Mike saying in a remember Pastor Mike saying in a remember Pastor Mike saying in a conversation that I heard from him was I conversation that I heard from him was I conversation that I heard from him was I do most of the social media myself he do most of the social media myself he do most of the social media myself he said this that's distinct amongst said this that's distinct amongst said this that's distinct amongst pastors it's it's especially distinct pastors it's it's especially distinct pastors it's it's especially distinct amongst pastors of larger churches and amongst pastors of larger churches and amongst pastors of larger churches and so I'm curious about like so you know so I'm curious about like so you know so I'm curious about like so you know you're you're on the team at you're you're on the team at you're you're on the team at transformation you're creating content transformation you're creating content transformation you're creating content but then but then Pastor Mike's also but then but then Pastor Mike's also but then but then Pastor Mike's also creating content on his own what did creating content on his own what did creating content on his own what did what does that Dynamic look like it's what does that Dynamic look like it's what does that Dynamic look like it's actually really beautiful um because actually really beautiful um because actually really beautiful um because he's thinking differently he's thinking he's thinking differently he's thinking he's thinking differently he's thinking in the context of like I'm I'm pushing in the context of like I'm I'm pushing in the context of like I'm I'm pushing uh my myself the church uh how God is uh my myself the church uh how God is uh my myself the church uh how God is working in my life um uh him as a father working in my life um uh him as a father working in my life um uh him as a father there's different fact faets to who he there's different fact faets to who he there's different fact faets to who he is there's different facets to who is there's different facets to who is there's different facets to who really everyone is and a lot of people really everyone is and a lot of people really everyone is and a lot of people think that they're just onedimensional think that they're just onedimensional think that they're just onedimensional um and they only make content in that

um and they only make content in that um and they only make content in that one pillar is what I call it and it's one pillar is what I call it and it's one pillar is what I call it and it's like wait no like there's many different like wait no like there's many different like wait no like there's many different facets to you we need to explain to the facets to you we need to explain to the facets to you we need to explain to the world how God is impacting all those world how God is impacting all those world how God is impacting all those things so if you look at even in social things so if you look at even in social things so if you look at even in social media now it's not just the church it's media now it's not just the church it's media now it's not just the church it's Fitness it's family it's fatherhood and Fitness it's family it's fatherhood and Fitness it's family it's fatherhood and um and then also it's the church and um and then also it's the church and um and then also it's the church and there's so so many different things that there's so so many different things that there's so so many different things that you can create within that so it kind of you can create within that so it kind of you can create within that so it kind of gave him freedom to make content within gave him freedom to make content within gave him freedom to make content within those lanes and all I had to do was say those lanes and all I had to do was say those lanes and all I had to do was say hey if you do it like this you'll never hey if you do it like this you'll never hey if you do it like this you'll never lose and he was like bet so he already lose and he was like bet so he already lose and he was like bet so he already had the the the wherewithal he knew how had the the the wherewithal he knew how had the the the wherewithal he knew how to use a camera an actual camera uh even to use a camera an actual camera uh even to use a camera an actual camera uh even though we tried we opted not to use though we tried we opted not to use though we tried we opted not to use cameras as much as possible um unless cameras as much as possible um unless cameras as much as possible um unless we're making something high quality cuz we're making something high quality cuz we're making something high quality cuz it's weird when you're like hanging out it's weird when you're like hanging out it's weird when you're like hanging out with your wife and you're like hold on with your wife and you're like hold on with your wife and you're like hold on let me set up the 5D markv really quick let me set up the 5D markv really quick let me set up the 5D markv really quick over there like that's weird so uh I over there like that's weird so uh I over there like that's weird so uh I kind of just was like Hey look man these kind of just was like Hey look man these kind of just was like Hey look man these are the things that I think you should are the things that I think you should are the things that I think you should be trying this is a trend if you could be trying this is a trend if you could be trying this is a trend if you could just do this with your wife on a date just do this with your wife on a date just do this with your wife on a date night or if you can do this with your night or if you can do this with your night or if you can do this with your family or if you can fit this in family or if you can fit this in family or if you can fit this in whatever and one day it click and he was whatever and one day it click and he was whatever and one day it click and he was like Ron I got it and I was like bro you like Ron I got it and I was like bro you like Ron I got it and I was like bro you been had it um so that plus what we're been had it um so that plus what we're been had it um so that plus what we're what the content I would make for him what the content I would make for him what the content I would make for him from church uh that plus the content I from church uh that plus the content I from church uh that plus the content I would make with him when we're on trips would make with him when we're on trips would make with him when we're on trips it just it was a perfect Perfect Storm it just it was a perfect Perfect Storm it just it was a perfect Perfect Storm and that's what I think actually um and that's what I think actually um and that's what I think actually um attributes to uh to virality it's attributes to uh to virality it's attributes to uh to virality it's momentum it's not just one video it's momentum it's not just one video it's momentum it's not just one video it's multiple um a lot of people are like I

multiple um a lot of people are like I multiple um a lot of people are like I just made this one video and they kind just made this one video and they kind just made this one video and they kind of just like they're one hit wonder in of just like they're one hit wonder in of just like they're one hit wonder in all reality you want to have five or six all reality you want to have five or six all reality you want to have five or six videos always going you want to have videos always going you want to have videos always going you want to have multiple videos in your week that adds multiple videos in your week that adds multiple videos in your week that adds to the the the the pot it's a crock poot to the the the the pot it's a crock poot to the the the the pot it's a crock poot and you want to cook this thing we're and you want to cook this thing we're and you want to cook this thing we're cooking we're cooking so yeah somebody cooking we're cooking so yeah somebody cooking we're cooking so yeah somebody somebody cooked any here and that's somebody cooked any here and that's somebody cooked any here and that's that's youon so it sounds to me like that's youon so it sounds to me like that's youon so it sounds to me like Pastor Mike he's got he's got a bit of Pastor Mike he's got he's got a bit of Pastor Mike he's got he's got a bit of an aptitude for this already but if I'm an aptitude for this already but if I'm an aptitude for this already but if I'm hearing you correctly you would go to hearing you correctly you would go to hearing you correctly you would go to him and You' say okay how about you try him and You' say okay how about you try him and You' say okay how about you try this idea and then he is the one that this idea and then he is the one that this idea and then he is the one that actually executes on that idea that you actually executes on that idea that you actually executes on that idea that you gave him and then in the process of him gave him and then in the process of him gave him and then in the process of him doing that he's kind of learning on the doing that he's kind of learning on the doing that he's kind of learning on the job in the trenches and so he's kind of job in the trenches and so he's kind of job in the trenches and so he's kind of like raising and upping his own skill in like raising and upping his own skill in like raising and upping his own skill in that process is that kind of like the that process is that kind of like the that process is that kind of like the sequence that we're we're talking about sequence that we're we're talking about sequence that we're we're talking about here essentially yeah and he was already here essentially yeah and he was already here essentially yeah and he was already really good so like it there would be really good so like it there would be really good so like it there would be some ideas that I would send to him some ideas that I would send to him some ideas that I would send to him there would be some ideas that I would there would be some ideas that I would there would be some ideas that I would do or some ideas that I would have and do or some ideas that I would have and do or some ideas that I would have and then when I see him we would execute then when I see him we would execute then when I see him we would execute them together um and it just worked and them together um and it just worked and them together um and it just worked and especially if if it was done on a phone especially if if it was done on a phone especially if if it was done on a phone and he has his phone he could do it too and he has his phone he could do it too and he has his phone he could do it too so it's like hey look I know this kind so it's like hey look I know this kind so it's like hey look I know this kind of makes my job obsolete but if you of makes my job obsolete but if you of makes my job obsolete but if you could just do that like we win and I I'm could just do that like we win and I I'm could just do that like we win and I I'm all about that I'm all about giving all about that I'm all about giving all about that I'm all about giving people my brain because my brain is people my brain because my brain is people my brain because my brain is worth way more than what I could do with worth way more than what I could do with worth way more than what I could do with a camera so it just it just and it never a camera so it just it just and it never a camera so it just it just and it never stops so even while I'm not there stops so even while I'm not there stops so even while I'm not there because I just stepped away a couple because I just stepped away a couple because I just stepped away a couple months ago um he's still making content months ago um he's still making content months ago um he's still making content and the you can't NE unless you're a and the you can't NE unless you're a and the you can't NE unless you're a real content creator you can't tell the

real content creator you can't tell the real content creator you can't tell the difference between content that I would difference between content that I would difference between content that I would make and content that he would thought make and content that he would thought make and content that he would thought he would have thought of or uh the other he would have thought of or uh the other he would have thought of or uh the other person that's working with him is her person that's working with him is her person that's working with him is her name is Mima she's incredible incredible name is Mima she's incredible incredible name is Mima she's incredible incredible I will sing her Praises until I die I will sing her Praises until I die I will sing her Praises until I die um uh like it's just like we would all um uh like it's just like we would all um uh like it's just like we would all work in Tandem and we became one mind work in Tandem and we became one mind work in Tandem and we became one mind one sound it it actually was incredible one sound it it actually was incredible one sound it it actually was incredible but that's what happens when you have but that's what happens when you have but that's what happens when you have incredible team chemistry it's what incredible team chemistry it's what incredible team chemistry it's what happens when you work together on many happens when you work together on many happens when you work together on many different projects um and you actually different projects um and you actually different projects um and you actually communicate and I think we we really communicate and I think we we really communicate and I think we we really learned the power of unity together and learned the power of unity together and learned the power of unity together and creativity in creativity in creativity in structure so can you tell me about like structure so can you tell me about like structure so can you tell me about like I want like an actual example what's one I want like an actual example what's one I want like an actual example what's one of these actual ideas that you came to of these actual ideas that you came to of these actual ideas that you came to him with so that we all understand kind him with so that we all understand kind him with so that we all understand kind of what you're talking about and then of what you're talking about and then of what you're talking about and then second to that how are you coming up second to that how are you coming up second to that how are you coming up with these ideas oh great this is this with these ideas oh great this is this with these ideas oh great this is this is amazing I got your back so if you're is amazing I got your back so if you're is amazing I got your back so if you're listening this is how you win on social listening this is how you win on social listening this is how you win on social media okay so first you find a trend media okay so first you find a trend media okay so first you find a trend okay like a lot of people are against okay like a lot of people are against okay like a lot of people are against trends at the end of the day you're trends at the end of the day you're trends at the end of the day you're doing exactly what the trend is doing doing exactly what the trend is doing doing exactly what the trend is doing you're just uh you're just doing you're just uh you're just doing you're just uh you're just doing something that no one's looking at so a something that no one's looking at so a something that no one's looking at so a trend is not exactly something that's trend is not exactly something that's trend is not exactly something that's trendy it's just what people are paying trendy it's just what people are paying trendy it's just what people are paying attention to and if you can get in front attention to and if you can get in front attention to and if you can get in front of people's eyes you'll always win so of people's eyes you'll always win so of people's eyes you'll always win so here's how I did it uh for example have here's how I did it uh for example have here's how I did it uh for example have if you've ever seen if you've ever seen if you've ever seen uh Avengers and there's a moment with uh Avengers and there's a moment with uh Avengers and there's a moment with Thanos and he's like ah I finally rest Thanos and he's like ah I finally rest Thanos and he's like ah I finally rest and I forget what he says at the end of and I forget what he says at the end of and I forget what he says at the end of it but like it's a moment it's a huge it but like it's a moment it's a huge it but like it's a moment it's a huge moment in the movie it became a trend

moment in the movie it became a trend moment in the movie it became a trend right so I sent him the sound and I'm right so I sent him the sound and I'm right so I sent him the sound and I'm like hey man we've got to figure out like hey man we've got to figure out like hey man we've got to figure out something with this trend oh I finally something with this trend oh I finally something with this trend oh I finally rest you're about to go on sabatical you rest you're about to go on sabatical you rest you're about to go on sabatical you like rest rest is something that we like rest rest is something that we like rest rest is something that we prioritize here at our church he was prioritize here at our church he was prioritize here at our church he was like okay he hits me back in a couple like okay he hits me back in a couple like okay he hits me back in a couple days I see him we're in Atlanta and he days I see him we're in Atlanta and he days I see him we're in Atlanta and he goes yo goes yo goes yo I did it I was like what' you do he's I did it I was like what' you do he's I did it I was like what' you do he's like I did it he shows me his phone and like I did it he shows me his phone and like I did it he shows me his phone and he's like he shows me the video he puts he's like he shows me the video he puts he's like he shows me the video he puts the video like in the back of a balcony the video like in the back of a balcony the video like in the back of a balcony and it's just him with a coffee mug and it's just him with a coffee mug and it's just him with a coffee mug right with a little coffee mug and he's right with a little coffee mug and he's right with a little coffee mug and he's like I finally rest he's not even saying like I finally rest he's not even saying like I finally rest he's not even saying anything it's just him you can't even anything it's just him you can't even anything it's just him you can't even see him I finally rest and so he makes see him I finally rest and so he makes see him I finally rest and so he makes his video and it and he actually puts his video and it and he actually puts his video and it and he actually puts the caption and he's like he says the caption and he's like he says the caption and he's like he says something about like sleeping with his something about like sleeping with his something about like sleeping with his wife and I'm like yo like it's it's a wife and I'm like yo like it's it's a wife and I'm like yo like it's it's a little controversial yeah but he's little controversial yeah but he's little controversial yeah but he's married you should be doing that with married you should be doing that with married you should be doing that with your wife if you're not doing that with your wife if you're not doing that with your wife if you're not doing that with your wife there's something wrong okay your wife there's something wrong okay your wife there's something wrong okay we need to talk about that let's pray we need to talk about that let's pray we need to talk about that let's pray about that so um it was the moment for about that so um it was the moment for about that so um it was the moment for me where I was like oh he has it figured me where I was like oh he has it figured me where I was like oh he has it figured out like this is perfect we posted the out like this is perfect we posted the out like this is perfect we posted the video within 15 minutes I kid you not it video within 15 minutes I kid you not it video within 15 minutes I kid you not it was at like 200k we were we were on a was at like 200k we were we were on a was at like 200k we were we were on a shoe by the time we finished the shoot shoe by the time we finished the shoot shoe by the time we finished the shoot it was at 600 by the time we were done it was at 600 by the time we were done it was at 600 by the time we were done with the day it was at 1.5 million and I with the day it was at 1.5 million and I with the day it was at 1.5 million and I was like yo I think you got it like it's was like yo I think you got it like it's was like yo I think you got it like it's it's the trend filtered through what it it's the trend filtered through what it it's the trend filtered through what it is that you what you already do filtered is that you what you already do filtered is that you what you already do filtered through your Niche and if you do that through your Niche and if you do that through your Niche and if you do that and you make it relatable you will and you make it relatable you will and you make it relatable you will always always win so um that's that was always always win so um that's that was always always win so um that's that was like my favorite example um and uh let's

like my favorite example um and uh let's like my favorite example um and uh let's see how I figured that out was I tested see how I figured that out was I tested see how I figured that out was I tested it on myself so for years beforehand it on myself so for years beforehand it on myself so for years beforehand instead of just saying hey can you do instead of just saying hey can you do instead of just saying hey can you do this video I did the video and it worked this video I did the video and it worked this video I did the video and it worked like so uh I remember early 2020 I like so uh I remember early 2020 I like so uh I remember early 2020 I started making videos based on things started making videos based on things started making videos based on things that I've seen and just using them as an that I've seen and just using them as an that I've seen and just using them as an invite to church without saying hey come invite to church without saying hey come invite to church without saying hey come to church cuz that's super whack like to church cuz that's super whack like to church cuz that's super whack like it's 2024 if you're just saying come to it's 2024 if you're just saying come to it's 2024 if you're just saying come to church let's think of something church let's think of something church let's think of something different like everyone's so creative different like everyone's so creative different like everyone's so creative and it's your time to be creative so um and it's your time to be creative so um and it's your time to be creative so um I started making these funny videos I started making these funny videos I started making these funny videos about the Bible about Jesus and inviting about the Bible about Jesus and inviting about the Bible about Jesus and inviting people to church based on Trends and people to church based on Trends and people to church based on Trends and they were getting 20 30 40 50,000 views they were getting 20 30 40 50,000 views they were getting 20 30 40 50,000 views and I'm I'm just I just started on Tik and I'm I'm just I just started on Tik and I'm I'm just I just started on Tik Tok I just started on Instagram so I'm Tok I just started on Instagram so I'm Tok I just started on Instagram so I'm like oh this is this is magical so one like oh this is this is magical so one like oh this is this is magical so one day um I was like if I just utilize this day um I was like if I just utilize this day um I was like if I just utilize this trend I trend I trend I follow the format follow the template I follow the format follow the template I follow the format follow the template I uh and I change the words to what it is uh and I change the words to what it is uh and I change the words to what it is that I'm doing I can utilize this that I'm doing I can utilize this that I'm doing I can utilize this attention to my advantage and I can show attention to my advantage and I can show attention to my advantage and I can show people Jesus in in the process so uh I people Jesus in in the process so uh I people Jesus in in the process so uh I figured that out I sent it to him and figured that out I sent it to him and figured that out I sent it to him and then it and and it worked and we have then it and and it worked and we have then it and and it worked and we have just never stopped so and and there's just never stopped so and and there's just never stopped so and and there's other little things that we found that's other little things that we found that's other little things that we found that's just for the context of doing fun just for the context of doing fun just for the context of doing fun Instagram reals uh not to mention things Instagram reals uh not to mention things Instagram reals uh not to mention things that like sermon Recaps or Clips sermon that like sermon Recaps or Clips sermon that like sermon Recaps or Clips sermon Clips or uh Graphics anything like that Clips or uh Graphics anything like that Clips or uh Graphics anything like that there's a there's a strategy for there's a there's a strategy for there's a there's a strategy for everything um that one just happens to

everything um that one just happens to everything um that one just happens to be my favorite and the one that I could be my favorite and the one that I could be my favorite and the one that I could do the most because I can just do it on do the most because I can just do it on do the most because I can just do it on the go well Ron it sounds to me like the go well Ron it sounds to me like the go well Ron it sounds to me like you're describing um your function in you're describing um your function in you're describing um your function in this team your function at your bring this team your function at your bring this team your function at your bring your time at at transformation less as your time at at transformation less as your time at at transformation less as like a social social media content like a social social media content like a social social media content creator and more as a social media creator and more as a social media creator and more as a social media content curator it sounds like you were content curator it sounds like you were content curator it sounds like you were really giving vision and guidance in a really giving vision and guidance in a really giving vision and guidance in a way you were in your relationship with way you were in your relationship with way you were in your relationship with with Pastor Mike like you were with Pastor Mike like you were with Pastor Mike like you were discipling him in a way in how to learn discipling him in a way in how to learn discipling him in a way in how to learn and grow and then eventually like own and grow and then eventually like own and grow and then eventually like own his own content creation on social and his own content creation on social and his own content creation on social and that's really unique to um how we think that's really unique to um how we think that's really unique to um how we think about this this position this office if about this this position this office if about this this position this office if you will of social media content creator you will of social media content creator you will of social media content creator in the church space um but you're you're in the church space um but you're you're in the church space um but you're you're talking about like a a curation role and talking about like a a curation role and talking about like a a curation role and a role not just from the top down from a role not just from the top down from a role not just from the top down from the church account down to the folks who the church account down to the folks who the church account down to the folks who follow but like inter team dimension of follow but like inter team dimension of follow but like inter team dimension of like discipleship of of pushing each like discipleship of of pushing each like discipleship of of pushing each other and empowering each other to own other and empowering each other to own other and empowering each other to own your own role and grow in it so can you your own role and grow in it so can you your own role and grow in it so can you just talk to us a little bit more for a just talk to us a little bit more for a just talk to us a little bit more for a moment about like how you uncovered that moment about like how you uncovered that moment about like how you uncovered that office in yourself to to kind of office in yourself to to kind of office in yourself to to kind of transcend from just being a Creator like transcend from just being a Creator like transcend from just being a Creator like just doing the work and posting to being just doing the work and posting to being just doing the work and posting to being more of like a Visionary or like working more of like a Visionary or like working more of like a Visionary or like working in a team as a curator and pushing each in a team as a curator and pushing each in a team as a curator and pushing each other you know that phrase a rising tide other you know that phrase a rising tide other you know that phrase a rising tide races All Ships right it sounds like you races All Ships right it sounds like you races All Ships right it sounds like you really functioned in that role in really functioned in that role in really functioned in that role in transformation can you touch on that transformation can you touch on that transformation can you touch on that just for a moment dude one the way that

just for a moment dude one the way that just for a moment dude one the way that you picked it up is so great I just love you picked it up is so great I just love you picked it up is so great I just love the way that your brain works um aside the way that your brain works um aside the way that your brain works um aside from that being a good question I'm not from that being a good question I'm not from that being a good question I'm not even trying to like distract you be like even trying to like distract you be like even trying to like distract you be like oh think think about the answer I know oh think think about the answer I know oh think think about the answer I know what the answer is but um that's just a what the answer is but um that's just a what the answer is but um that's just a big part of who I am um I come from a big part of who I am um I come from a big part of who I am um I come from a church that church in Las Vegas taught church that church in Las Vegas taught church that church in Las Vegas taught me about discipleship that church in Las me about discipleship that church in Las me about discipleship that church in Las Vegas I spent five six almost seven Vegas I spent five six almost seven Vegas I spent five six almost seven years as a kids Pastor I spent that time years as a kids Pastor I spent that time years as a kids Pastor I spent that time and I didn't want to do it so like in and I didn't want to do it so like in and I didn't want to do it so like in order to like Empower people to do order to like Empower people to do order to like Empower people to do something especially if I didn't want to something especially if I didn't want to something especially if I didn't want to do it I had to teach people how to how do it I had to teach people how to how do it I had to teach people how to how to fish I had to teach I had to disciple to fish I had to teach I had to disciple to fish I had to teach I had to disciple people I had to give everything I had people I had to give everything I had people I had to give everything I had away and had to do it in a strategic way away and had to do it in a strategic way away and had to do it in a strategic way that it wasn't draining for me um but that it wasn't draining for me um but that it wasn't draining for me um but it's training for them so I I've always it's training for them so I I've always it's training for them so I I've always functioned in that way I'm I'm always functioned in that way I'm I'm always functioned in that way I'm I'm always discipling people that third person on discipling people that third person on discipling people that third person on the team was my disciple like I the team was my disciple like I the team was my disciple like I literally she was a part of my small literally she was a part of my small literally she was a part of my small group she lived in North Carolina she group she lived in North Carolina she group she lived in North Carolina she moved to Tulsa literally into my moved to Tulsa literally into my moved to Tulsa literally into my apartment building she didn't even know apartment building she didn't even know apartment building she didn't even know she just was like yo I'm moving to Tulsa she just was like yo I'm moving to Tulsa she just was like yo I'm moving to Tulsa and I was like where are you moving she and I was like where are you moving she and I was like where are you moving she was like uh this one and I was like dude was like uh this one and I was like dude was like uh this one and I was like dude I live four floors above where you're I live four floors above where you're I live four floors above where you're moving um so discipleship is a really moving um so discipleship is a really moving um so discipleship is a really big part of my life I've always always big part of my life I've always always big part of my life I've always always always had another person with me while always had another person with me while always had another person with me while I'm doing this thing called life while I'm doing this thing called life while I'm doing this thing called life while I'm doing this thing called I'm doing this thing called I'm doing this thing called Ministry um so I've always focused Ministry um so I've always focused Ministry um so I've always focused heavily on if you aren't pouring into heavily on if you aren't pouring into heavily on if you aren't pouring into someone if you aren't discipling people someone if you aren't discipling people someone if you aren't discipling people because that's what the Bible says it because that's what the Bible says it because that's what the Bible says it literally says go into the world and literally says go into the world and literally says go into the world and make disciples it didn't it didn't say

make disciples it didn't it didn't say make disciples it didn't it didn't say like you got to do it like a certain like you got to do it like a certain like you got to do it like a certain type of way like I'm doing it with Jesus type of way like I'm doing it with Jesus type of way like I'm doing it with Jesus Through social media um so that's always Through social media um so that's always Through social media um so that's always been a thing and honestly if you're been a thing and honestly if you're been a thing and honestly if you're watching I've hopefully I've been able watching I've hopefully I've been able watching I've hopefully I've been able to invest in your life in some type of to invest in your life in some type of to invest in your life in some type of way hopefully if if you if you're way hopefully if if you if you're way hopefully if if you if you're watching this video we've already had a watching this video we've already had a watching this video we've already had a moment or we've had a personal moment or we've had a personal moment or we've had a personal conversation where I've been able to conversation where I've been able to conversation where I've been able to pour into you I've been able to show you pour into you I've been able to show you pour into you I've been able to show you some things because that's a really big some things because that's a really big some things because that's a really big part of who I am um and I I I actually part of who I am um and I I I actually part of who I am um and I I I actually think it's a gift on my life I'm think it's a gift on my life I'm think it's a gift on my life I'm realizing that it's not something that realizing that it's not something that realizing that it's not something that everyone can do um so to answer your everyone can do um so to answer your everyone can do um so to answer your question in short uh it's really a part question in short uh it's really a part question in short uh it's really a part of who I am and it was instilled in me of who I am and it was instilled in me of who I am and it was instilled in me through my time when I first got saved through my time when I first got saved through my time when I first got saved when I first got saved when I was 16 the when I first got saved when I was 16 the when I first got saved when I was 16 the the biggest priority in our youth the biggest priority in our youth the biggest priority in our youth ministry was discipleship and uh I've ministry was discipleship and uh I've ministry was discipleship and uh I've always always always tried to do that I always always always tried to do that I always always always tried to do that I didn't even realize that that's what I didn't even realize that that's what I didn't even realize that that's what I was doing even at TC with my pastor uh was doing even at TC with my pastor uh was doing even at TC with my pastor uh but I definitely tried to do that with but I definitely tried to do that with but I definitely tried to do that with our team to make sure that we we weren't our team to make sure that we we weren't our team to make sure that we we weren't falling through the cracks and um the falling through the cracks and um the falling through the cracks and um the because it can create burnout when because it can create burnout when because it can create burnout when you're just like hey man like I know you you're just like hey man like I know you you're just like hey man like I know you can't do this but like we're going to can't do this but like we're going to can't do this but like we're going to I'm going to make you do this like no no I'm going to make you do this like no no I'm going to make you do this like no no no like let's let's maximize what your no like let's let's maximize what your no like let's let's maximize what your gift already is let's maximize who you gift already is let's maximize who you gift already is let's maximize who you already are and pull something out of already are and pull something out of already are and pull something out of you that you just didn't know that you you that you just didn't know that you you that you just didn't know that you could do yet rather than forcing you to could do yet rather than forcing you to could do yet rather than forcing you to do something that you really don't care do something that you really don't care do something that you really don't care for um so even for the context of for um so even for the context of for um so even for the context of churches with pastors who are more churches with pastors who are more churches with pastors who are more introverted and don't care about things

introverted and don't care about things introverted and don't care about things like that it's actually still possible like that it's actually still possible like that it's actually still possible to do hey you don't have to be loud and to do hey you don't have to be loud and to do hey you don't have to be loud and proud on Instagram you can be quiet proud on Instagram you can be quiet proud on Instagram you can be quiet quiet and sharp you can be intentional quiet and sharp you can be intentional quiet and sharp you can be intentional and and and start small you know what and and and start small you know what and and and start small you know what I'm I'm realizing I'm realizing that I'm I'm realizing I'm realizing that I'm I'm realizing I'm realizing that sometimes just setting up my phone while sometimes just setting up my phone while sometimes just setting up my phone while I'm reading my Bible is almost more I'm reading my Bible is almost more I'm reading my Bible is almost more powerful than trying to do a trend um or powerful than trying to do a trend um or powerful than trying to do a trend um or like doing a voiceover um or just just like doing a voiceover um or just just like doing a voiceover um or just just getting the small things or even just getting the small things or even just getting the small things or even just capturing small moments in my life capturing small moments in my life capturing small moments in my life that's a really big way to show people that's a really big way to show people that's a really big way to show people how God is working how God is doing what how God is working how God is doing what how God is working how God is doing what God is doing in your church through your God is doing in your church through your God is doing in your church through your pastor through your leader and so on and pastor through your leader and so on and pastor through your leader and so on and so forth so um yeah uh it's it actually so forth so um yeah uh it's it actually so forth so um yeah uh it's it actually is a big part of who I am and it it's I is a big part of who I am and it it's I is a big part of who I am and it it's I think it's a hack to creativity on any think it's a hack to creativity on any think it's a hack to creativity on any team if you can allow people to be who team if you can allow people to be who team if you can allow people to be who they are through their creativity they they are through their creativity they they are through their creativity they will always flourish rather than trying will always flourish rather than trying will always flourish rather than trying to fit someone into certain guidelines to fit someone into certain guidelines to fit someone into certain guidelines that's actually here's oh my gosh it's a that's actually here's oh my gosh it's a that's actually here's oh my gosh it's a whole another conversation but um I whole another conversation but um I whole another conversation but um I think creatives work really well within think creatives work really well within think creatives work really well within structure and a lot of people think that structure and a lot of people think that structure and a lot of people think that the structure are the boundaries that the structure are the boundaries that the structure are the boundaries that keep them from being who they are when keep them from being who they are when keep them from being who they are when it's not about personality structure it's not about personality structure it's not about personality structure it's about um it's about thinking it's about um it's about thinking it's about um it's about thinking structure because uh thinking is structure because uh thinking is structure because uh thinking is actually half the battle within actually half the battle within actually half the battle within creativity and if I don't have to think creativity and if I don't have to think creativity and if I don't have to think then I can just create because your then I can just create because your then I can just create because your brain works in two different ways if brain works in two different ways if brain works in two different ways if you're left brain left brain people you're left brain left brain people you're left brain left brain people usually I believe it's your left brain usually I believe it's your left brain usually I believe it's your left brain left brain people usually are really left brain people usually are really left brain people usually are really type A they're really organized they're type A they're really organized they're type A they're really organized they're super structured and right brain people

super structured and right brain people super structured and right brain people are super creative but you like the are super creative but you like the are super creative but you like the thing is we are all left and right brain thing is we are all left and right brain thing is we are all left and right brain people we we have both sides of our people we we have both sides of our people we we have both sides of our brain but the thing is doing both at the brain but the thing is doing both at the brain but the thing is doing both at the same time is incredibly difficult so if same time is incredibly difficult so if same time is incredibly difficult so if you can have someone in your team do you can have someone in your team do you can have someone in your team do that and structure it for you you're that and structure it for you you're that and structure it for you you're allowing the creatives to actually allowing the creatives to actually allowing the creatives to actually function creatively but we still need function creatively but we still need function creatively but we still need boundaries we still need structure just boundaries we still need structure just boundaries we still need structure just not in our actual personality be who you not in our actual personality be who you not in our actual personality be who you are and create what you can so that was are and create what you can so that was are and create what you can so that was long-winded but it had a little bit of long-winded but it had a little bit of long-winded but it had a little bit of wind behind it oh it's so good uh one wind behind it oh it's so good uh one wind behind it oh it's so good uh one thing that is really standing out to me thing that is really standing out to me thing that is really standing out to me is thinking about how Pastor Mike really is thinking about how Pastor Mike really is thinking about how Pastor Mike really was in a position of humility to accept was in a position of humility to accept was in a position of humility to accept advice and recommendations from a young advice and recommendations from a young advice and recommendations from a young person who was relatively new on staff person who was relatively new on staff person who was relatively new on staff when there are like there's high stakes when there are like there's high stakes when there are like there's high stakes here for a church of this size with this here for a church of this size with this here for a church of this size with this level of affluence like when I was on my level of affluence like when I was on my level of affluence like when I was on my social media you know director Journey social media you know director Journey social media you know director Journey at my church plant and I was like let's at my church plant and I was like let's at my church plant and I was like let's post this thing and they were like no if post this thing and they were like no if post this thing and they were like no if we had I mean what's the Fallout oh 12 we had I mean what's the Fallout oh 12 we had I mean what's the Fallout oh 12 people thought it was stupid you know people thought it was stupid you know people thought it was stupid you know like there wouldn't have been that much like there wouldn't have been that much like there wouldn't have been that much negative attention that was drawn to it negative attention that was drawn to it negative attention that was drawn to it back in 2010 at this new church plant in back in 2010 at this new church plant in back in 2010 at this new church plant in Canada whereas you know transformation Canada whereas you know transformation Canada whereas you know transformation Pastor Mike are on are on the come up Pastor Mike are on are on the come up Pastor Mike are on are on the come up here and now they're like going to post here and now they're like going to post here and now they're like going to post things about sleeping with their wife things about sleeping with their wife things about sleeping with their wife and and like what that might what and and like what that might what and and like what that might what attention that might draw and so like attention that might draw and so like attention that might draw and so like that just speaks to his character and that just speaks to his character and that just speaks to his character and his willingness to just put himself in a his willingness to just put himself in a his willingness to just put himself in a position of humility when I think most

position of humility when I think most position of humility when I think most people in that position would be people in that position would be people in that position would be resistant to that yeah that's super true resistant to that yeah that's super true resistant to that yeah that's super true here's the thing there are that and this here's the thing there are that and this here's the thing there are that and this is what that boundary is like hey that's is what that boundary is like hey that's is what that boundary is like hey that's a little too far um so there's a couple a little too far um so there's a couple a little too far um so there's a couple things that we have in place the first things that we have in place the first things that we have in place the first thing is this it's represent I wear it thing is this it's represent I wear it thing is this it's represent I wear it on my chest I probably lowkey get a on my chest I probably lowkey get a on my chest I probably lowkey get a tattoo but that's too much of a tattoo but that's too much of a tattoo but that's too much of a commitment but represent it's rep commitment but represent it's rep commitment but represent it's rep representing God to the lost and found representing God to the lost and found representing God to the lost and found right for transformation in Christ if I right for transformation in Christ if I right for transformation in Christ if I can fit it within that I'm winning yo if can fit it within that I'm winning yo if can fit it within that I'm winning yo if I'm taking culture representing it and I'm taking culture representing it and I'm taking culture representing it and saying hey look I know that this was saying hey look I know that this was saying hey look I know that this was misrepresented I want to show you what misrepresented I want to show you what misrepresented I want to show you what God is actually doing within this and God is actually doing within this and God is actually doing within this and I'm the conduit for it it'll always work I'm the conduit for it it'll always work I'm the conduit for it it'll always work right so that's one filter it's it does right so that's one filter it's it does right so that's one filter it's it does it fit within our mission right another it fit within our mission right another it fit within our mission right another thing is is like we're a high trust and thing is is like we're a high trust and thing is is like we're a high trust and high feedback uh culture uh at TC like high feedback uh culture uh at TC like high feedback uh culture uh at TC like literally it's like hey man we trust you literally it's like hey man we trust you literally it's like hey man we trust you but just let you know we're going to but just let you know we're going to but just let you know we're going to talk about it and we going to figure it talk about it and we going to figure it talk about it and we going to figure it out we're going to get these details and out we're going to get these details and out we're going to get these details and on top of that it's really good for on top of that it's really good for on top of that it's really good for everybody I don't care who you are are everybody I don't care who you are are everybody I don't care who you are are you need an internal hater like you need you need an internal hater like you need you need an internal hater like you need someone in your house that says that's someone in your house that says that's someone in your house that says that's stupid and um like sometimes I was that stupid and um like sometimes I was that stupid and um like sometimes I was that person sometimes P Mike was that person person sometimes P Mike was that person person sometimes P Mike was that person sometimes mimo was that person sometimes sometimes mimo was that person sometimes sometimes mimo was that person sometimes Pastor Charles was that like literally Pastor Charles was that like literally Pastor Charles was that like literally it there's got to be someone on the it there's got to be someone on the it there's got to be someone on the inside that's inside that's inside that's like no no like but also at the same

like no no like but also at the same like no no like but also at the same time like not every idea can get chot time like not every idea can get chot time like not every idea can get chot down like let's just go for it and the down like let's just go for it and the down like let's just go for it and the one about his wife like that was him one about his wife like that was him one about his wife like that was him like I wasn't that was not my caption like I wasn't that was not my caption like I wasn't that was not my caption that was his idea we bless God but um that was his idea we bless God but um that was his idea we bless God but um there's many of things I remember the there's many of things I remember the there's many of things I remember the first time that uh I like that happened first time that uh I like that happened first time that uh I like that happened I remember the first time I said I remember the first time I said I remember the first time I said something crazy and he trusted me and I something crazy and he trusted me and I something crazy and he trusted me and I was like oh that's that's kind of wild was like oh that's that's kind of wild was like oh that's that's kind of wild like you you really going you really like you you really going you really like you you really going you really going to listen to me he was like dude going to listen to me he was like dude going to listen to me he was like dude yeah like this is your job I was like yeah like this is your job I was like yeah like this is your job I was like that's kind of Valley he's like I hired that's kind of Valley he's like I hired that's kind of Valley he's like I hired you for this I was like dude all right you for this I was like dude all right you for this I was like dude all right cool um we're in a meeting we're cool um we're in a meeting we're cool um we're in a meeting we're planning for his his his book crazy planning for his his his book crazy planning for his his his book crazy faith and we're talking through a couple faith and we're talking through a couple faith and we're talking through a couple different things so it was crazy Faith different things so it was crazy Faith different things so it was crazy Faith book marketing meeting plus like what book marketing meeting plus like what book marketing meeting plus like what we're going to do for this year when it we're going to do for this year when it we're going to do for this year when it comes to social media I had two big comes to social media I had two big comes to social media I had two big Ideas the first one was uh we need a Ideas the first one was uh we need a Ideas the first one was uh we need a slogan for crazy Faith like it's only slogan for crazy Faith like it's only slogan for crazy Faith like it's only crazy till it happens everyone already crazy till it happens everyone already crazy till it happens everyone already knows that so we're sitting in the table knows that so we're sitting in the table knows that so we're sitting in the table and I'm like prayed up I'm like God like and I'm like prayed up I'm like God like and I'm like prayed up I'm like God like I I pray that this idea works and um I I pray that this idea works and um I I pray that this idea works and um we're like we need a second sing and I we're like we need a second sing and I we're like we need a second sing and I go yeah like you got to see it before go yeah like you got to see it before go yeah like you got to see it before see it and he was like I like that I was see it and he was like I like that I was see it and he was like I like that I was like I like it too like like what you like I like it too like like what you like I like it too like like what you want to do and he goes no no no like want to do and he goes no no no like want to do and he goes no no no like that's that's it you got to see it that's that's it you got to see it that's that's it you got to see it before you see it that's what faith is before you see it that's what faith is before you see it that's what faith is so um and like he took it and ran with so um and like he took it and ran with so um and like he took it and ran with it I I when I hear him say that it's so it I I when I hear him say that it's so it I I when I hear him say that it's so edifying because he took my idea I edifying because he took my idea I edifying because he took my idea I submitted it to him and he's running submitted it to him and he's running submitted it to him and he's running with it and it worked he he trusted me with it and it worked he he trusted me with it and it worked he he trusted me and was like yo like that's great and in

and was like yo like that's great and in and was like yo like that's great and in that same meeting I said this yo that same meeting I said this yo that same meeting I said this yo social media is changing um this is social media is changing um this is social media is changing um this is right as reals were introduced to right as reals were introduced to right as reals were introduced to Instagram and you're getting rewarded Instagram and you're getting rewarded Instagram and you're getting rewarded basically for doing reals first I was basically for doing reals first I was basically for doing reals first I was like yo if we make every video real we like yo if we make every video real we like yo if we make every video real we will not lose like no no more no more will not lose like no no more no more will not lose like no no more no more Recaps over a minute they've got to be Recaps over a minute they've got to be Recaps over a minute they've got to be 60 seconds or less because that is what 60 seconds or less because that is what 60 seconds or less because that is what the platform is asking of us if we do the platform is asking of us if we do the platform is asking of us if we do that and we go hard we won't lose I that and we go hard we won't lose I that and we go hard we won't lose I remember saying that and we went from remember saying that and we went from remember saying that and we went from maybe 900k to 1.5 million in just a maybe 900k to 1.5 million in just a maybe 900k to 1.5 million in just a couple of months um and he was like all couple of months um and he was like all couple of months um and he was like all right Ron said it like but let's do it right Ron said it like but let's do it right Ron said it like but let's do it and that was kind of hard on me because and that was kind of hard on me because and that was kind of hard on me because that just made all my content that I had that just made all my content that I had that just made all my content that I had to actually make had to be less than a to actually make had to be less than a to actually make had to be less than a minute but uh I just remember so vividly minute but uh I just remember so vividly minute but uh I just remember so vividly I was like dang kind of made my job I was like dang kind of made my job I was like dang kind of made my job hard every creative's challenge we hard every creative's challenge we hard every creative's challenge we should do this okay great go do it wait should do this okay great go do it wait should do this okay great go do it wait a second wait a minute oh no what have I a second wait a minute oh no what have I a second wait a minute oh no what have I done what have I done so I I I kind of done what have I done so I I I kind of done what have I done so I I I kind of dug myself into a hole but uh I was dug myself into a hole but uh I was dug myself into a hole but uh I was already making tons of things and I had already making tons of things and I had already making tons of things and I had a system to create seven to 10 10 a system to create seven to 10 10 a system to create seven to 10 10 actually 20 different pieces of content actually 20 different pieces of content actually 20 different pieces of content from one sermon every time that he from one sermon every time that he from one sermon every time that he preached so I I was like let me just preached so I I was like let me just preached so I I was like let me just work my system and figure out the flow work my system and figure out the flow work my system and figure out the flow and go from there so um I I just and go from there so um I I just and go from there so um I I just remember so vividly that was the first remember so vividly that was the first remember so vividly that was the first time that I walked away from a meeting time that I walked away from a meeting time that I walked away from a meeting and I felt like oh he took what I said and I felt like oh he took what I said and I felt like oh he took what I said super serious and he trusted me and then super serious and he trusted me and then super serious and he trusted me and then he probably walked away from that he probably walked away from that he probably walked away from that meeting and said I'm trusting Ron Mo and meeting and said I'm trusting Ron Mo and meeting and said I'm trusting Ron Mo and if he keeps doing this we'll it'll if he keeps doing this we'll it'll if he keeps doing this we'll it'll perpetuate but um one thing that I perpetuate but um one thing that I perpetuate but um one thing that I learned from this book called The Speed learned from this book called The Speed learned from this book called The Speed Of Trust if you trust first you can move

Of Trust if you trust first you can move Of Trust if you trust first you can move faster and don't don't make people earn faster and don't don't make people earn faster and don't don't make people earn your trust make people earn your your trust make people earn your your trust make people earn your distrust it it it's a completely distrust it it it's a completely distrust it it it's a completely different way of functioning but I also different way of functioning but I also different way of functioning but I also believe it's a it's a it's the Jesus way believe it's a it's a it's the Jesus way believe it's a it's a it's the Jesus way of functioning trust people and and of functioning trust people and and of functioning trust people and and allow people to give them space to uh to allow people to give them space to uh to allow people to give them space to uh to earn mistrust from you you'll move way earn mistrust from you you'll move way earn mistrust from you you'll move way faster so you mentioned that rapid faster so you mentioned that rapid faster so you mentioned that rapid growth once you pivoted to reals as soon growth once you pivoted to reals as soon growth once you pivoted to reals as soon as it dropped we're not waiting we're as it dropped we're not waiting we're as it dropped we're not waiting we're embracing it we're going and I think to embracing it we're going and I think to embracing it we're going and I think to me it's fascinating to to hear a church me it's fascinating to to hear a church me it's fascinating to to hear a church of your size affluence you know big of your size affluence you know big of your size affluence you know big Pastor well-known that book crazy Faith Pastor well-known that book crazy Faith Pastor well-known that book crazy Faith a New York Times bestselling book so not a New York Times bestselling book so not a New York Times bestselling book so not simply a a person that people know in simply a a person that people know in simply a a person that people know in the Christian world but like the Christian world but like the Christian world but like transcending beyond that and yet you're transcending beyond that and yet you're transcending beyond that and yet you're still saying we need to ride the trends still saying we need to ride the trends still saying we need to ride the trends of these platforms I think if there's of these platforms I think if there's of these platforms I think if there's any church any Pastor that could say hey any church any Pastor that could say hey any church any Pastor that could say hey hey hey we set the trends we do our own hey hey we set the trends we do our own hey hey we set the trends we do our own thing and you certainly do and yet thing and you certainly do and yet thing and you certainly do and yet you're still adhering to what the you're still adhering to what the you're still adhering to what the platforms are doing and not just platforms are doing and not just platforms are doing and not just adhering to it but doing it with urgency adhering to it but doing it with urgency adhering to it but doing it with urgency yeah yeah um and here's the thing cuz yeah yeah um and here's the thing cuz yeah yeah um and here's the thing cuz we're not copying anyone where we're not copying anyone where we're not copying anyone where like here's this is essentially I have a like here's this is essentially I have a like here's this is essentially I have a word for I can't remember at the current word for I can't remember at the current word for I can't remember at the current moment I want to say that word is moment I want to say that word is moment I want to say that word is pioneering pioneering is hard pioneering pioneering pioneering is hard pioneering pioneering pioneering is hard pioneering is scary doing it first is it's cont is scary doing it first is it's cont is scary doing it first is it's cont it's countercultural doing something it's countercultural doing something it's countercultural doing something before everyone else is but that's what before everyone else is but that's what before everyone else is but that's what we're call called to do we're set apart

we're call called to do we're set apart we're call called to do we're set apart like everything that I do is actually like everything that I do is actually like everything that I do is actually based on the Bible there is not one based on the Bible there is not one based on the Bible there is not one tactic there is not one strategy there tactic there is not one strategy there tactic there is not one strategy there is not one mindset that is not already is not one mindset that is not already is not one mindset that is not already rooted or based in a scripture or a rooted or based in a scripture or a rooted or based in a scripture or a verse or something that has to do with verse or something that has to do with verse or something that has to do with my theology so like what you're talking my theology so like what you're talking my theology so like what you're talking about is really just us being set apart about is really just us being set apart about is really just us being set apart we were made to do this let's go do it we were made to do this let's go do it we were made to do this let's go do it uh and what does that do fits within um uh and what does that do fits within um uh and what does that do fits within um the mission statement let's go represent the mission statement let's go represent the mission statement let's go represent in order to represent we've got to do in order to represent we've got to do in order to represent we've got to do things before everyone else in order to things before everyone else in order to things before everyone else in order to represent we've got to do it we got to represent we've got to do it we got to represent we've got to do it we got to do it well and we got to do it first so do it well and we got to do it first so do it well and we got to do it first so um like it's not like me nitpicking and um like it's not like me nitpicking and um like it's not like me nitpicking and saying like this church is doing that saying like this church is doing that saying like this church is doing that and that church is doing this no no no and that church is doing this no no no and that church is doing this no no no no no we're actually having no no we're actually having no no we're actually having conversations with Instagram and saying conversations with Instagram and saying conversations with Instagram and saying hey look we want to be the best like hey look we want to be the best like hey look we want to be the best like what does that look like well we're what does that look like well we're what does that look like well we're we're making this thing we're we're making this thing we're we're making this thing we're introducing this thing called reals we introducing this thing called reals we introducing this thing called reals we think you should do it okay great like think you should do it okay great like think you should do it okay great like there's no actual reason to not like there's no actual reason to not like there's no actual reason to not like there's certain things that I don't there's certain things that I don't there's certain things that I don't think that adds value like is it a is it think that adds value like is it a is it think that adds value like is it a is it a net negative like or is it a net a net negative like or is it a net a net negative like or is it a net positive or or is it like is it net positive or or is it like is it net positive or or is it like is it net nothing uh net neutral um we you kind of nothing uh net neutral um we you kind of nothing uh net neutral um we you kind of have to weigh what those things are and have to weigh what those things are and have to weigh what those things are and I believed that making Instagram reals I believed that making Instagram reals I believed that making Instagram reals when video was already a thing and just when video was already a thing and just when video was already a thing and just making them shorter that's a net making them shorter that's a net making them shorter that's a net positive the only net negative is that I positive the only net negative is that I positive the only net negative is that I have to work harder dude I can figure have to work harder dude I can figure have to work harder dude I can figure that out um it it's a net positive but that out um it it's a net positive but that out um it it's a net positive but some things are a net negative I don't some things are a net negative I don't some things are a net negative I don't really believe in like broadcast really believe in like broadcast really believe in like broadcast channels right now like I think that it channels right now like I think that it channels right now like I think that it needs a little bit more polishing so needs a little bit more polishing so needs a little bit more polishing so right now it's it's a Neal for me I I'm right now it's it's a Neal for me I I'm right now it's it's a Neal for me I I'm I'm not going to invest energy until I

I'm not going to invest energy until I I'm not going to invest energy until I figure out that like this is probably figure out that like this is probably figure out that like this is probably the best strategy that I can run with it the best strategy that I can run with it the best strategy that I can run with it but once it switches for me it's over but once it switches for me it's over but once it switches for me it's over I'm just going to go for it so okay I'm I'm just going to go for it so okay I'm I'm just going to go for it so okay I'm so glad you went there because I wanted so glad you went there because I wanted so glad you went there because I wanted to get I wanted to get strategic I to get I wanted to get strategic I to get I wanted to get strategic I wanted to get practical wanted to get wanted to get practical wanted to get wanted to get practical wanted to get granular you talked earlier about how granular you talked earlier about how granular you talked earlier about how when Instagram stories were new they when Instagram stories were new they when Instagram stories were new they came over from inspiration from Snapchat came over from inspiration from Snapchat came over from inspiration from Snapchat um you were doing these like these like um you were doing these like these like um you were doing these like these like polished stories with whip Transitions polished stories with whip Transitions polished stories with whip Transitions and cameras we have a friend here in and cameras we have a friend here in and cameras we have a friend here in Canada uh Jesse Driftwood who is like Canada uh Jesse Driftwood who is like Canada uh Jesse Driftwood who is like one of the pioneers of that tactic well one of the pioneers of that tactic well one of the pioneers of that tactic well I watched all his videos I studied I watched all his videos I studied I watched all his videos I studied everything Jesse Driftwood did I even everything Jesse Driftwood did I even everything Jesse Driftwood did I even dm' him like Jesse if you're watching dm' him like Jesse if you're watching dm' him like Jesse if you're watching this video bro I kid you not I'm I'm this video bro I kid you not I'm I'm this video bro I kid you not I'm I'm literally me because of you bro thank literally me because of you bro thank literally me because of you bro thank you so much um I'm just I'm so sorry you so much um I'm just I'm so sorry you so much um I'm just I'm so sorry that I just had to do that Jesse that I just had to do that Jesse that I just had to do that Jesse Driftwood is that guy no it's perfect Driftwood is that guy no it's perfect Driftwood is that guy no it's perfect yeah yes and so Jesse is a good friend yeah yes and so Jesse is a good friend yeah yes and so Jesse is a good friend of ours but like we we knew that then of ours but like we we knew that then of ours but like we we knew that then like watching Jesse do what he was doing like watching Jesse do what he was doing like watching Jesse do what he was doing then it was something he was a p he was then it was something he was a p he was then it was something he was a p he was the first person to do that or at least the first person to do that or at least the first person to do that or at least do it as good or as at scale as he was do it as good or as at scale as he was do it as good or as at scale as he was doing and we saw how he influenced like doing and we saw how he influenced like doing and we saw how he influenced like like Global a global trend on this like Global a global trend on this like Global a global trend on this platform and and you're a perfect um platform and and you're a perfect um platform and and you're a perfect um Testament to that and then you just Testament to that and then you just Testament to that and then you just talked about Jesse dri it's so good but talked about Jesse dri it's so good but talked about Jesse dri it's so good but then you just talked about at then you just talked about at then you just talked about at transformation when when Instagram transformation when when Instagram transformation when when Instagram dropped another new feature so same dropped another new feature so same dropped another new feature so same platform different feature reals um you platform different feature reals um you platform different feature reals um you guys just heavily invested in that so so guys just heavily invested in that so so guys just heavily invested in that so so right now you've moved on from right now you've moved on from right now you've moved on from transformation this is February

transformation this is February transformation this is February 2024 what social media platform and 2024 what social media platform and 2024 what social media platform and specifically what uh feature of that specifically what uh feature of that specifically what uh feature of that platform are you looking at and running platform are you looking at and running platform are you looking at and running running you know full steam ahead at running you know full steam ahead at running you know full steam ahead at investing into that platform and that investing into that platform and that investing into that platform and that feature what is it right now for you um feature what is it right now for you um feature what is it right now for you um so here's the thing um every platform so here's the thing um every platform so here's the thing um every platform has their own thing um and I I would say has their own thing um and I I would say has their own thing um and I I would say don't pick a platform because I'm saying don't pick a platform because I'm saying don't pick a platform because I'm saying it or we're saying it pick a platform it or we're saying it pick a platform it or we're saying it pick a platform that actually works for you because that actually works for you because that actually works for you because you're not going to you're not going to you're not going to you're not going to you're not going to you're not going to work hard at something that you kind of work hard at something that you kind of work hard at something that you kind of don't care about if you're if you're on don't care about if you're if you're on don't care about if you're if you're on Facebook trust me there is a way to win Facebook trust me there is a way to win Facebook trust me there is a way to win on Facebook for you not for me but for on Facebook for you not for me but for on Facebook for you not for me but for you um but my preferred platform right you um but my preferred platform right you um but my preferred platform right now is Instagram I think it's it's still now is Instagram I think it's it's still now is Instagram I think it's it's still that platform that I believe most people that platform that I believe most people that platform that I believe most people are gaining influence like real are gaining influence like real are gaining influence like real influence from um but I'm not that does influence from um but I'm not that does influence from um but I'm not that does not negate any other platform um I just not negate any other platform um I just not negate any other platform um I just saw saw a poll that saying Instagram has saw saw a poll that saying Instagram has saw saw a poll that saying Instagram has probably the most influence even though probably the most influence even though probably the most influence even though there's less people using the platform there's less people using the platform there's less people using the platform uh polish videos uh making things in uh polish videos uh making things in uh polish videos uh making things in yourself look good is something that yourself look good is something that yourself look good is something that people should be doing so um Instagram people should be doing so um Instagram people should be doing so um Instagram Instagram reals it is actually the thing Instagram reals it is actually the thing Instagram reals it is actually the thing that I'm still on right now uh with a that I'm still on right now uh with a that I'm still on right now uh with a supplement of carousels and photo dumps supplement of carousels and photo dumps supplement of carousels and photo dumps um and also I think graphics will be um and also I think graphics will be um and also I think graphics will be making a comeback very soon um in profit making a comeback very soon um in profit making a comeback very soon um in profit amongst us amongst us amongst us it it's I cuz it's a lost art most it it's I cuz it's a lost art most it it's I cuz it's a lost art most people don't know how to actually do it

people don't know how to actually do it people don't know how to actually do it so people that make graphics it's like so people that make graphics it's like so people that make graphics it's like yo but here's the thing if you're a yo but here's the thing if you're a yo but here's the thing if you're a graphic designer it's not about flexing graphic designer it's not about flexing graphic designer it's not about flexing like the it's not the flex it's the like the it's not the flex it's the like the it's not the flex it's the information it's the education it's the information it's the education it's the information it's the education it's the value so it's the same principles from a value so it's the same principles from a value so it's the same principles from a real but just on a on on a Carell or on real but just on a on on a Carell or on real but just on a on on a Carell or on a graphic So like um in a real I can a graphic So like um in a real I can a graphic So like um in a real I can tell you what the next three best tell you what the next three best tell you what the next three best cameras are and and I I can tell you cameras are and and I I can tell you cameras are and and I I can tell you that information some people just like that information some people just like that information some people just like to read okay great I'm going to make to read okay great I'm going to make to read okay great I'm going to make this for those people that like to read this for those people that like to read this for those people that like to read and do the exact same thing but make it and do the exact same thing but make it and do the exact same thing but make it pretty make it simple and effective and pretty make it simple and effective and pretty make it simple and effective and say hey look if you want to if you want say hey look if you want to if you want say hey look if you want to if you want to continue this journey follow me save to continue this journey follow me save to continue this journey follow me save this send this to someone that's looking this send this to someone that's looking this send this to someone that's looking for a camera and those are the same for a camera and those are the same for a camera and those are the same things that you would say in a video but things that you would say in a video but things that you would say in a video but do on a graphic um and then on Tik Tok do on a graphic um and then on Tik Tok do on a graphic um and then on Tik Tok it's a completely different ball game on it's a completely different ball game on it's a completely different ball game on Tik Tok I want to see the raw real fun Tik Tok I want to see the raw real fun Tik Tok I want to see the raw real fun like easygoing Part of Yourself um which like easygoing Part of Yourself um which like easygoing Part of Yourself um which is so easy if you're in a car you want is so easy if you're in a car you want is so easy if you're in a car you want to talk about your day just put it on I to talk about your day just put it on I to talk about your day just put it on I know you got a magnet standing on your know you got a magnet standing on your know you got a magnet standing on your car just go ahead and put your phone car just go ahead and put your phone car just go ahead and put your phone there and let's just have fun let's have there and let's just have fun let's have there and let's just have fun let's have a conversation give me the tea um and uh a conversation give me the tea um and uh a conversation give me the tea um and uh even for Facebook Facebook if you can if even for Facebook Facebook if you can if even for Facebook Facebook if you can if you can Crush 3 minute videos on you can Crush 3 minute videos on you can Crush 3 minute videos on Facebook you'll win Facebook is Facebook you'll win Facebook is Facebook you'll win Facebook is rewarding people for making videos over rewarding people for making videos over rewarding people for making videos over 3 minutes getting people on their 3 minutes getting people on their 3 minutes getting people on their platform and they will pay you of the platform and they will pay you of the platform and they will pay you of the only three of of those three platforms only three of of those three platforms only three of of those three platforms Facebook Facebook is the only platform Facebook Facebook is the only platform Facebook Facebook is the only platform that will pay you money and usage rights that will pay you money and usage rights that will pay you money and usage rights for what it is that you're doing so um for what it is that you're doing so um for what it is that you're doing so um there's a there's a way to win on every there's a there's a way to win on every there's a there's a way to win on every single platform and you've got to find single platform and you've got to find single platform and you've got to find your fit and go for it so along the

your fit and go for it so along the your fit and go for it so along the lines of the Practical question one that lines of the Practical question one that lines of the Practical question one that we get a lot from churches is how do I we get a lot from churches is how do I we get a lot from churches is how do I decide what goes on my church account decide what goes on my church account decide what goes on my church account versus my pastor account and versus my pastor account and versus my pastor account and transformation might be the first transformation might be the first transformation might be the first example that comes to mind when it when example that comes to mind when it when example that comes to mind when it when I think of a thriving Church account and I think of a thriving Church account and I think of a thriving Church account and the thriving Pastor account what were the thriving Pastor account what were the thriving Pastor account what were those conversations like how did you those conversations like how did you those conversations like how did you make those calls that's so funny because make those calls that's so funny because make those calls that's so funny because I'm going to give you an intad scoop I'm going to give you an intad scoop I'm going to give you an intad scoop internally we felt like the church's internally we felt like the church's internally we felt like the church's account was not winning in comparison to account was not winning in comparison to account was not winning in comparison to Pastor Michael's account because one Pastor Michael's account because one Pastor Michael's account because one that brother is at 2 million and the that brother is at 2 million and the that brother is at 2 million and the church is at 600,000 and they've been church is at 600,000 and they've been church is at 600,000 and they've been we've been kind of sitting in the 4 five we've been kind of sitting in the 4 five we've been kind of sitting in the 4 five 600,000 for a while but I think here it 600,000 for a while but I think here it 600,000 for a while but I think here it is every account needs a is every account needs a is every account needs a personality um so that's a whole other personality um so that's a whole other personality um so that's a whole other thing that I'm going to get to after I thing that I'm going to get to after I thing that I'm going to get to after I answer this question the difference answer this question the difference answer this question the difference between the two is Pastor Michael is a between the two is Pastor Michael is a between the two is Pastor Michael is a personality your pastor is a personality personality your pastor is a personality personality your pastor is a personality give them a personality and let them give them a personality and let them give them a personality and let them post um and your church is an post um and your church is an post um and your church is an organization is a community um so it's a organization is a community um so it's a organization is a community um so it's a little bit harder to win because there's little bit harder to win because there's little bit harder to win because there's no face that's just saying like hey no face that's just saying like hey no face that's just saying like hey follow me as I follow as we do this um follow me as I follow as we do this um follow me as I follow as we do this um but the the mix is whenever Pastor but the the mix is whenever Pastor but the the mix is whenever Pastor Michael is doing anything that involves Michael is doing anything that involves Michael is doing anything that involves the church um that that isn't the church um that that isn't the church um that that isn't necessarily like a talking head necessarily like a talking head necessarily like a talking head invitation unless it's a big video then invitation unless it's a big video then invitation unless it's a big video then it probably doesn't belong in the church it probably doesn't belong in the church it probably doesn't belong in the church platform so um but if if pastor's making

platform so um but if if pastor's making platform so um but if if pastor's making memes that had to do with a memes that had to do with a memes that had to do with a sermon bro bro like that's a sermon bro bro like that's a sermon bro bro like that's a collaboration post if if there's if he's collaboration post if if there's if he's collaboration post if if there's if he's if he's actually making a video in the if he's actually making a video in the if he's actually making a video in the morning and it's like the that Sunday morning and it's like the that Sunday morning and it's like the that Sunday walk-in video that now everyone's doing walk-in video that now everyone's doing walk-in video that now everyone's doing that's easily collaboration post to that's easily collaboration post to that's easily collaboration post to invite people to church my favorite invite people to church my favorite invite people to church my favorite thing about the about social media is thing about the about social media is thing about the about social media is you can take post down it doesn't have you can take post down it doesn't have you can take post down it doesn't have to stay there forever you're not married to stay there forever you're not married to stay there forever you're not married to the post you can take it down archive to the post you can take it down archive to the post you can take it down archive it maybe don't delete it just archive it it maybe don't delete it just archive it it maybe don't delete it just archive it so if you don't like it or if it doesn't so if you don't like it or if it doesn't so if you don't like it or if it doesn't fit just take utilize the influence and fit just take utilize the influence and fit just take utilize the influence and then take it down so um that's a whole then take it down so um that's a whole then take it down so um that's a whole another thing collaborations are like another thing collaborations are like another thing collaborations are like are the answer to that problem because are the answer to that problem because are the answer to that problem because you can now collaborate and UNC you can now collaborate and UNC you can now collaborate and UNC collaborate and you can also collaborate collaborate and you can also collaborate collaborate and you can also collaborate with four to five other people if you with four to five other people if you with four to five other people if you are confused on what you should be are confused on what you should be are confused on what you should be posting on your church and on your posting on your church and on your posting on your church and on your pastor's platform just just have the pastor's platform just just have the pastor's platform just just have the collaboration and decide does it does it collaboration and decide does it does it collaboration and decide does it does it apply to this crowd does it apply to the apply to this crowd does it apply to the apply to this crowd does it apply to the congregation that's your first thing congregation that's your first thing congregation that's your first thing does it apply to the congregation does does it apply to the congregation does does it apply to the congregation does it help people at your church or does it it help people at your church or does it it help people at your church or does it inform people at your church or does it inform people at your church or does it inform people at your church or does it provide value to people at your church provide value to people at your church provide value to people at your church then yes it should probably fit in the then yes it should probably fit in the then yes it should probably fit in the church's platform if it doesn't okay church's platform if it doesn't okay church's platform if it doesn't okay great that's specifically for pastor great that's specifically for pastor great that's specifically for pastor Pastor talking about his kids we don't Pastor talking about his kids we don't Pastor talking about his kids we don't need to talk about the babies on inst need to talk about the babies on inst need to talk about the babies on inst stagram unless it's a family post unless stagram unless it's a family post unless stagram unless it's a family post unless it's a hey Church families this is what it's a hey Church families this is what it's a hey Church families this is what our kids are doing then that's a our kids are doing then that's a our kids are doing then that's a completely different conversation so completely different conversation so completely different conversation so delineate what's for people and what's delineate what's for people and what's delineate what's for people and what's for your for the person people include

for your for the person people include for your for the person people include groups people include different groups people include different groups people include different Ministries people include the Ministries people include the Ministries people include the congregation people include teaching congregation people include teaching congregation people include teaching them teaching your church how to be the them teaching your church how to be the them teaching your church how to be the church how to be a Christian how to love church how to be a Christian how to love church how to be a Christian how to love God and um on your pastor's page you God and um on your pastor's page you God and um on your pastor's page you should be teaching fathers how to father should be teaching fathers how to father should be teaching fathers how to father in his everyday life your pastor should in his everyday life your pastor should in his everyday life your pastor should be teaching people how to love uh how be teaching people how to love uh how be teaching people how to love uh how teaching other people other men how to teaching other people other men how to teaching other people other men how to love his wife uh how to um and how to love his wife uh how to um and how to love his wife uh how to um and how to how to lead a team all those things are how to lead a team all those things are how to lead a team all those things are specific to him and some of those like specific to him and some of those like specific to him and some of those like team things could easily go in the team things could easily go in the team things could easily go in the church but you just got to use church but you just got to use church but you just got to use discretion in that way I've noticed that discretion in that way I've noticed that discretion in that way I've noticed that Pastor Mike has been doing a lot more uh Pastor Mike has been doing a lot more uh Pastor Mike has been doing a lot more uh Fitness content in the last year plus Fitness content in the last year plus Fitness content in the last year plus he's been quite transparent about that he's been quite transparent about that he's been quite transparent about that Journey that he's been on and it seems Journey that he's been on and it seems Journey that he's been on and it seems like people are really resonating with like people are really resonating with like people are really resonating with that type of content and so he's that type of content and so he's that type of content and so he's continued to double down on sharing that continued to double down on sharing that continued to double down on sharing that part of his life uh was that intentional part of his life uh was that intentional part of his life uh was that intentional from the beginning or was that kind of from the beginning or was that kind of from the beginning or was that kind of based on the feedback and traction that based on the feedback and traction that based on the feedback and traction that that content is getting oh people seem that content is getting oh people seem that content is getting oh people seem to like this this aligns with our vision to like this this aligns with our vision to like this this aligns with our vision and values let's keep doing it so it's and values let's keep doing it so it's and values let's keep doing it so it's actually a completely different Niche um actually a completely different Niche um actually a completely different Niche um there's Vision there that I can't uh I there's Vision there that I can't uh I there's Vision there that I can't uh I can't give up yet but I really think can't give up yet but I really think can't give up yet but I really think he's going to do it I think he's going he's going to do it I think he's going he's going to do it I think he's going to do it well so when he started his to do it well so when he started his to do it well so when he started his fitness journey he everything he's fitness journey he everything he's fitness journey he everything he's talking about even just this weekend um talking about even just this weekend um talking about even just this weekend um fit to finish is uh is a sermon that he fit to finish is uh is a sermon that he fit to finish is uh is a sermon that he preached recently at TC because he's in preached recently at TC because he's in preached recently at TC because he's in a Ser he was in summmer series called a Ser he was in summmer series called a Ser he was in summmer series called start sharp um he knew he was supposed start sharp um he knew he was supposed start sharp um he knew he was supposed to preach that maybe two years ago but

to preach that maybe two years ago but to preach that maybe two years ago but because he wasn't fit because he hasn't because he wasn't fit because he hasn't because he wasn't fit because he hasn't been sharp it didn't have authority so been sharp it didn't have authority so been sharp it didn't have authority so he spent two years working out losing he spent two years working out losing he spent two years working out losing weight in order to be able to preach weight in order to be able to preach weight in order to be able to preach that sermon series with authority God that sermon series with authority God that sermon series with authority God told him he said he told me in a told him he said he told me in a told him he said he told me in a conversation that God told him conversation that God told him conversation that God told him that um the ministry will go as far as that um the ministry will go as far as that um the ministry will go as far as you are fit basically like it it'll go you are fit basically like it it'll go you are fit basically like it it'll go as far as your body can take it is what as far as your body can take it is what as far as your body can take it is what he told me and he was like bro like I'm he told me and he was like bro like I'm he told me and he was like bro like I'm just eating donuts and Popeyes all the just eating donuts and Popeyes all the just eating donuts and Popeyes all the time you're not going to last long doing time you're not going to last long doing time you're not going to last long doing that so he had to change everything that so he had to change everything that so he had to change everything about how he functioned and he had to about how he functioned and he had to about how he functioned and he had to discipline his body um to now have discipline his body um to now have discipline his body um to now have authority to preach things like your authority to preach things like your authority to preach things like your your body's a temple and you need to your body's a temple and you need to your body's a temple and you need to take care of it you need to care uh you take care of it you need to care uh you take care of it you need to care uh you need to actually be fit because God need to actually be fit because God need to actually be fit because God calls us to be fit it's not about how we calls us to be fit it's not about how we calls us to be fit it's not about how we look to other people but it's about this look to other people but it's about this look to other people but it's about this Temple that we're taking care of for God Temple that we're taking care of for God Temple that we're taking care of for God cuz this body is borrowed and so on and cuz this body is borrowed and so on and cuz this body is borrowed and so on and so forth um so it actually was a thought so forth um so it actually was a thought so forth um so it actually was a thought two and a half maybe even three years two and a half maybe even three years two and a half maybe even three years ago and he's been taking action he put a ago and he's been taking action he put a ago and he's been taking action he put a gym inside of his his garage hired a gym inside of his his garage hired a gym inside of his his garage hired a trainer his whole family works out now trainer his whole family works out now trainer his whole family works out now all of his friends work out and it's a all of his friends work out and it's a all of his friends work out and it's a part of his life so um and there there part of his life so um and there there part of his life so um and there there are plans there and if you can predict are plans there and if you can predict are plans there and if you can predict it then you can predict it but like it then you can predict it but like it then you can predict it but like that's to talk to a specific group of that's to talk to a specific group of that's to talk to a specific group of people there's certain there's certain people there's certain there's certain people there's certain there's certain people that won't listen to you because people that won't listen to you because people that won't listen to you because you just don't do certain things like I you just don't do certain things like I you just don't do certain things like I have like football friends dude like I have like football friends dude like I have like football friends dude like I have no Authority there look I am me and have no Authority there look I am me and have no Authority there look I am me and this water bottle are the same size if this water bottle are the same size if this water bottle are the same size if you could like it's my football friends you could like it's my football friends you could like it's my football friends are not saying like bro you're you're

are not saying like bro you're you're are not saying like bro you're you're not disin you don't work out like you not disin you don't work out like you not disin you don't work out like you you like you don't even know what it's you like you don't even know what it's you like you don't even know what it's like to eat when you don't want to eat like to eat when you don't want to eat like to eat when you don't want to eat because you know what it does for your because you know what it does for your because you know what it does for your body like that's a very real thing but body like that's a very real thing but body like that's a very real thing but like all the other stuff like I could like all the other stuff like I could like all the other stuff like I could talk to you about it social media we talk to you about it social media we talk to you about it social media we could talk about it all day but football could talk about it all day but football could talk about it all day but football got no no Authority there working out got no no Authority there working out got no no Authority there working out you you ain't hearing from me like I go you you ain't hearing from me like I go you you ain't hearing from me like I go to the gym but I'm not really so there's to the gym but I'm not really so there's to the gym but I'm not really so there's there's Authority that comes when you uh there's Authority that comes when you uh there's Authority that comes when you uh you submit your body to what it is that you submit your body to what it is that you submit your body to what it is that you the the vision and the plans that you the the vision and the plans that you the the vision and the plans that you have for it so um I'm excited for you have for it so um I'm excited for you have for it so um I'm excited for what to come from it truly how many what to come from it truly how many what to come from it truly how many accounts were you managing at accounts were you managing at accounts were you managing at transformation like how many different transformation like how many different transformation like how many different channels are you looking at being like channels are you looking at being like channels are you looking at being like Oh we got to get content for this this Oh we got to get content for this this Oh we got to get content for this this this like like I'm guessing it's a large this like like I'm guessing it's a large this like like I'm guessing it's a large large number no it's not there's only large number no it's not there's only large number no it's not there's only there's only just his account and then there's only just his account and then there's only just his account and then the churches and then the Facebook and the churches and then the Facebook and the churches and then the Facebook and then Twitter but like that's pretty you then Twitter but like that's pretty you then Twitter but like that's pretty you can schedule out you can listen to a can schedule out you can listen to a can schedule out you can listen to a sermon get the the notes for the sermon sermon get the the notes for the sermon sermon get the the notes for the sermon uh take the notes put those um in tweet uh take the notes put those um in tweet uh take the notes put those um in tweet versions and then schedule your tweets versions and then schedule your tweets versions and then schedule your tweets for the entire week until next week so for the entire week until next week so for the entire week until next week so you just do that on Monday morning and you just do that on Monday morning and you just do that on Monday morning and then you'll never worry about Twitter then you'll never worry about Twitter then you'll never worry about Twitter ever again um Instagram and Facebook ever again um Instagram and Facebook ever again um Instagram and Facebook they're tied they're tethered so they're tied they're tethered so they're tied they're tethered so whatever you post on Instagram goes on whatever you post on Instagram goes on whatever you post on Instagram goes on Facebook that the only thing about Facebook that the only thing about Facebook that the only thing about working at transformation that was hard working at transformation that was hard working at transformation that was hard was the sheer amount of content that I was the sheer amount of content that I was the sheer amount of content that I had to make for those platforms within had to make for those platforms within had to make for those platforms within itself because we at some point was itself because we at some point was itself because we at some point was posting five times a day that is posting five times a day that is posting five times a day that is overwhelming like 5 time 7 is what 35 overwhelming like 5 time 7 is what 35 overwhelming like 5 time 7 is what 35 that's a lot to make in one week um or

that's a lot to make in one week um or that's a lot to make in one week um or every week so I would say it was pretty every week so I would say it was pretty every week so I would say it was pretty easy so easy that I was actually working easy so easy that I was actually working easy so easy that I was actually working within four other people uh while I was within four other people uh while I was within four other people uh while I was working at TC I was helping uh my friend working at TC I was helping uh my friend working at TC I was helping uh my friend Jain Chavez Pastor Jin Chavez at Jain Chavez Pastor Jin Chavez at Jain Chavez Pastor Jin Chavez at citylight I was making content for uh Dr citylight I was making content for uh Dr citylight I was making content for uh Dr Darius Daniels at some point I was Darius Daniels at some point I was Darius Daniels at some point I was helping another church in Florida um helping another church in Florida um helping another church in Florida um with my friend Pastor Donnie um all at with my friend Pastor Donnie um all at with my friend Pastor Donnie um all at the same exact time that I was working the same exact time that I was working the same exact time that I was working at TC were there limitations yes but at TC were there limitations yes but at TC were there limitations yes but again if you create a system it's not again if you create a system it's not again if you create a system it's not that hard to create content for multiple that hard to create content for multiple that hard to create content for multiple people um so I wasn't I'm I feel like people um so I wasn't I'm I feel like people um so I wasn't I'm I feel like I'm almost at a point now where I'm I'm almost at a point now where I'm I'm almost at a point now where I'm making more content um or about the same making more content um or about the same making more content um or about the same amount of content that I was making at amount of content that I was making at amount of content that I was making at TC with all my clients now so um and TC with all my clients now so um and TC with all my clients now so um and that's a lot cuz I'm working with quite that's a lot cuz I'm working with quite that's a lot cuz I'm working with quite a few different people and to be just a few different people and to be just a few different people and to be just now hitting the threshold of oh this is now hitting the threshold of oh this is now hitting the threshold of oh this is about the same that I would make at TC about the same that I would make at TC about the same that I would make at TC is kind of insane to think about but um is kind of insane to think about but um is kind of insane to think about but um at some point five five different pieces at some point five five different pieces at some point five five different pieces of content a day um and then you kind of of content a day um and then you kind of of content a day um and then you kind of just you figure out a flow for it so just you figure out a flow for it so just you figure out a flow for it so that you're not crying at night and kind that you're not crying at night and kind that you're not crying at night and kind of go from there that's a high volume of of go from there that's a high volume of of go from there that's a high volume of content and we know you are posting it content and we know you are posting it content and we know you are posting it to an audience of of millions of to an audience of of millions of to an audience of of millions of followers never mind um never mind the followers never mind um never mind the followers never mind um never mind the the potential uh reach thanks to the potential uh reach thanks to the potential uh reach thanks to Discovery algorithm so with that much Discovery algorithm so with that much Discovery algorithm so with that much content and posting to an audience of content and posting to an audience of content and posting to an audience of that scope you're bound to receive that scope you're bound to receive that scope you're bound to receive surely uh lots of lots of distasteful in surely uh lots of lots of distasteful in surely uh lots of lots of distasteful in in the best case and lots of hate in the best case and lots of hate in the best case and lots of hate comments in the worst case and this is a comments in the worst case and this is a comments in the worst case and this is a question we get often from churches

question we get often from churches question we get often from churches especially now as churches start to take especially now as churches start to take especially now as churches start to take our advice start to post to Tik Tok our advice start to post to Tik Tok our advice start to post to Tik Tok andam for the first time they're like oh andam for the first time they're like oh andam for the first time they're like oh my gosh what's happening exactly they go my gosh what's happening exactly they go my gosh what's happening exactly they go viral which is like this is great and viral which is like this is great and viral which is like this is great and then they are receiving comments for the then they are receiving comments for the then they are receiving comments for the first time so the question is um because first time so the question is um because first time so the question is um because I'm I'm sure you receive you know more I'm I'm sure you receive you know more I'm I'm sure you receive you know more of those comments than than most people of those comments than than most people of those comments than than most people we've ever talked to like how do you we've ever talked to like how do you we've ever talked to like how do you guys approach tackling those types of guys approach tackling those types of guys approach tackling those types of conversations and and those comments and conversations and and those comments and conversations and and those comments and conversations you know in the comment conversations you know in the comment conversations you know in the comment section or or in the DMS how did you section or or in the DMS how did you section or or in the DMS how did you guys handle the hate man um I had a guys handle the hate man um I had a guys handle the hate man um I had a really hard time I'm from New York City really hard time I'm from New York City really hard time I'm from New York City where we fight first like words like where we fight first like words like where we fight first like words like that is that was that was really hard that is that was that was really hard that is that was that was really hard for me me I was like yo you see this and for me me I was like yo you see this and for me me I was like yo you see this and he's like Ron we don't do that that's he's like Ron we don't do that that's he's like Ron we don't do that that's not your position it's not your position not your position it's not your position not your position it's not your position to fight and I'm like but like but they to fight and I'm like but like but they to fight and I'm like but like but they talk about you but like I'll fight like talk about you but like I'll fight like talk about you but like I'll fight like on on me on it's on site and um and on on me on it's on site and um and on on me on it's on site and um and there were many of times where he had to there were many of times where he had to there were many of times where he had to sit me down and he was like stop looking sit me down and he was like stop looking sit me down and he was like stop looking at those that is not for you you're at those that is not for you you're at those that is not for you you're going to you're you're going to ruin going to you're you're going to ruin going to you're you're going to ruin your mind and your and like and and and your mind and your and like and and and your mind and your and like and and and hurt your soul by reading these comments hurt your soul by reading these comments hurt your soul by reading these comments and taking them to heart when they don't and taking them to heart when they don't and taking them to heart when they don't even really know us they don't know me even really know us they don't know me even really know us they don't know me they don't know the reality of who he is they don't know the reality of who he is they don't know the reality of who he is or the reality of who I am or who you or the reality of who I am or who you or the reality of who I am or who you are and um it took a lot it took a lot are and um it took a lot it took a lot are and um it took a lot it took a lot of prayer especially after the whole of prayer especially after the whole of prayer especially after the whole Easter situation I like I had a really Easter situation I like I had a really Easter situation I like I had a really hard time a lot of prayer a lot of hard time a lot of prayer a lot of hard time a lot of prayer a lot of counseling honestly like with with counseling honestly like with with counseling honestly like with with pastors and but essentially here's what

pastors and but essentially here's what pastors and but essentially here's what you should do don't read into it don't you should do don't read into it don't you should do don't read into it don't read into it some things you should be read into it some things you should be read into it some things you should be aware of but you should also trust that aware of but you should also trust that aware of but you should also trust that there's people that are close to you in there's people that are close to you in there's people that are close to you in your life that have the ability to say your life that have the ability to say your life that have the ability to say hey that probably was not okay and then hey that probably was not okay and then hey that probably was not okay and then you could take that and heed it and you could take that and heed it and you could take that and heed it and apologize and repent that's our very apologize and repent that's our very apologize and repent that's our very real thing do that in private do that real thing do that in private do that real thing do that in private do that with people that you trust do that with people that you trust do that with people that you trust do that people that trust you that are not will people that trust you that are not will people that trust you that are not will that are not going to turn on you that are not going to turn on you that are not going to turn on you because there's a lot of people that because there's a lot of people that because there's a lot of people that will turn on you it's going to happen will turn on you it's going to happen will turn on you it's going to happen Jesus had people that did not like him Jesus had people that did not like him Jesus had people that did not like him no one that should have loved Jesus no one that should have loved Jesus no one that should have loved Jesus actually liked Jesus everyone that loved actually liked Jesus everyone that loved actually liked Jesus everyone that loved Jesus were people that were just finding Jesus were people that were just finding Jesus were people that were just finding out about him that were just learning out about him that were just learning out about him that were just learning about him and he challenged them every about him and he challenged them every about him and he challenged them every single day day there are there's a word single day day there are there's a word single day day there are there's a word for people that um that are in the same for people that um that are in the same for people that um that are in the same house that that are supposed to be doing house that that are supposed to be doing house that that are supposed to be doing the same thing and really are concerned the same thing and really are concerned the same thing and really are concerned about the laws and concerned about the about the laws and concerned about the about the laws and concerned about the rules and regulations and not about the rules and regulations and not about the rules and regulations and not about the heart and not about reaching people or heart and not about reaching people or heart and not about reaching people or healing people on the Sabbath I'm not healing people on the Sabbath I'm not healing people on the Sabbath I'm not going to say what that word is but you going to say what that word is but you going to say what that word is but you should be able to read it in between the should be able to read it in between the should be able to read it in between the lines so um it's hard yes it's going to lines so um it's hard yes it's going to lines so um it's hard yes it's going to happen regardless people like it's it's happen regardless people like it's it's happen regardless people like it's it's a part of the nature like I comment a part of the nature like I comment a part of the nature like I comment things on Instagram all the time and I things on Instagram all the time and I things on Instagram all the time and I get hate comments I get love comments uh get hate comments I get love comments uh get hate comments I get love comments uh and it's just a part of the game you're and it's just a part of the game you're and it's just a part of the game you're there's going to be people that don't there's going to be people that don't there's going to be people that don't agree with you that's the beautiful part agree with you that's the beautiful part agree with you that's the beautiful part of Being Human we have different of Being Human we have different of Being Human we have different opinions and you know what it's up to me opinions and you know what it's up to me opinions and you know what it's up to me it's up to you as a thought leader as a it's up to you as a thought leader as a it's up to you as a thought leader as a as a leader on at any level actually to as a leader on at any level actually to as a leader on at any level actually to respect someone's opinion and say hey respect someone's opinion and say hey respect someone's opinion and say hey look I'm glad that you have your opinion

look I'm glad that you have your opinion look I'm glad that you have your opinion and I have mine actually this is and I have mine actually this is and I have mine actually this is something that I believe is truth and something that I believe is truth and something that I believe is truth and I'm actually willing to learn and grow I'm actually willing to learn and grow I'm actually willing to learn and grow but I'm not going to argue with anyone but I'm not going to argue with anyone but I'm not going to argue with anyone I'm not going to take this and uh and I'm not going to take this and uh and I'm not going to take this and uh and make it a something that is is hard on make it a something that is is hard on make it a something that is is hard on me actually uh I actually have a post on me actually uh I actually have a post on me actually uh I actually have a post on my Instagram it's one of my pin posts my Instagram it's one of my pin posts my Instagram it's one of my pin posts and I'm talking about and I'm talking about and I'm talking about meekness um and this guy was like that's meekness um and this guy was like that's meekness um and this guy was like that's not the definition of meekness at all not the definition of meekness at all not the definition of meekness at all I'm like okay that's what Webster used I'm like okay that's what Webster used I'm like okay that's what Webster used to Define meekness is but this is what to Define meekness is but this is what to Define meekness is but this is what I'm understanding this is what God is I'm understanding this is what God is I'm understanding this is what God is teaching me this is what it means to me teaching me this is what it means to me teaching me this is what it means to me and like somehow got laced into it and and like somehow got laced into it and and like somehow got laced into it and like actually like started commenting like actually like started commenting like actually like started commenting and I was like hey man like this is all and I was like hey man like this is all and I was like hey man like this is all you bro like it's okay uh all love that you bro like it's okay uh all love that you bro like it's okay uh all love that brother came came to my church like a brother came came to my church like a brother came came to my church like a month later and was like um hey man I month later and was like um hey man I month later and was like um hey man I know we had this conversation I want to know we had this conversation I want to know we had this conversation I want to apologize I apologize and now we're apologize I apologize and now we're apologize I apologize and now we're friends so like a lot of people they're friends so like a lot of people they're friends so like a lot of people they're just thumb thugs man they talk behind just thumb thugs man they talk behind just thumb thugs man they talk behind screens but like um if it was in person screens but like um if it was in person screens but like um if it was in person they probably would never say that um so they probably would never say that um so they probably would never say that um so just take keep that in mind too people just take keep that in mind too people just take keep that in mind too people are a lot more bold on the internet than are a lot more bold on the internet than are a lot more bold on the internet than they are in person I know men that won't they are in person I know men that won't they are in person I know men that won't even talk to girls that they're even talk to girls that they're even talk to girls that they're interested in so hey man like they're interested in so hey man like they're interested in so hey man like they're probably not going to say anything to probably not going to say anything to probably not going to say anything to you in real life so so don't take it to you in real life so so don't take it to you in real life so so don't take it to heart because they don't even got the heart because they don't even got the heart because they don't even got the heart to probably say that to you face heart to probably say that to you face heart to probably say that to you face to face so thumb thugs never heard that to face so thumb thugs never heard that to face so thumb thugs never heard that the new keyboard Warrior thumb thugs I the new keyboard Warrior thumb thugs I the new keyboard Warrior thumb thugs I really appreciate that transparency Ron really appreciate that transparency Ron really appreciate that transparency Ron uh I think you just being upfront and uh I think you just being upfront and uh I think you just being upfront and being like yeah like all this hate came being like yeah like all this hate came being like yeah like all this hate came in and it was challenging I think like in and it was challenging I think like in and it was challenging I think like we all go through that when you start we all go through that when you start we all go through that when you start seeing these things and pretending like

seeing these things and pretending like seeing these things and pretending like you are somehow immune to it I don't you are somehow immune to it I don't you are somehow immune to it I don't think is helpful but talking about the think is helpful but talking about the think is helpful but talking about the Journey of okay this is what it is I Journey of okay this is what it is I Journey of okay this is what it is I understand I am aware and then finding a understand I am aware and then finding a understand I am aware and then finding a way and a posture to manage that and way and a posture to manage that and way and a posture to manage that and navigate it without resorting to navigate it without resorting to navigate it without resorting to fighting without resorting to like fighting without resorting to like fighting without resorting to like pretending like it it doesn't exist and pretending like it it doesn't exist and pretending like it it doesn't exist and and and ignoring the fact that it's a and and ignoring the fact that it's a and and ignoring the fact that it's a reality of being part of social um what reality of being part of social um what reality of being part of social um what I also don't want to pretend that we're I also don't want to pretend that we're I also don't want to pretend that we're avoiding is the fact you mentioned that avoiding is the fact you mentioned that avoiding is the fact you mentioned that you're no longer at transformation and you're no longer at transformation and you're no longer at transformation and the word on the street is that you and the word on the street is that you and the word on the street is that you and Pastor Mike you pushed him too hard and Pastor Mike you pushed him too hard and Pastor Mike you pushed him too hard and the the Harlem came out the Brooklyn the the Harlem came out the Brooklyn the the Harlem came out the Brooklyn came out came out came out the Queens came out don't know what part the Queens came out don't know what part the Queens came out don't know what part of New York get you're from and you're of New York get you're from and you're of New York get you're from and you're like I've had enough and you threw down like I've had enough and you threw down like I've had enough and you threw down and he couldn't take it and that's but and he couldn't take it and that's but and he couldn't take it and that's but please tell us a bit about you please tell us a bit about you please tell us a bit about you transitioning out of transformation what transitioning out of transformation what transitioning out of transformation what happened there and you know what are you happened there and you know what are you happened there and you know what are you up to now yeah so if that was the case up to now yeah so if that was the case up to now yeah so if that was the case he'd probably beat me up because he's he'd probably beat me up because he's he'd probably beat me up because he's about twice my size and he actually be about twice my size and he actually be about twice my size and he actually be working out and I could see what he working out and I could see what he working out and I could see what he lifts in the gym and he could lift me lifts in the gym and he could lift me lifts in the gym and he could lift me and I don't want to ever do that but um and I don't want to ever do that but um and I don't want to ever do that but um yeah uh it actually started this is a yeah uh it actually started this is a yeah uh it actually started this is a long story I'm going to say it really long story I'm going to say it really long story I'm going to say it really short two years ago at Vu conference short two years ago at Vu conference short two years ago at Vu conference there was an alter call for people who there was an alter call for people who there was an alter call for people who felt the call to to PR preach and pastor felt the call to to PR preach and pastor felt the call to to PR preach and pastor and I was like I think I'm supposed to and I was like I think I'm supposed to and I was like I think I'm supposed to raise my hand and U so I Rose my hand raise my hand and U so I Rose my hand raise my hand and U so I Rose my hand and I just didn't know but all these and I just didn't know but all these and I just didn't know but all these pastors were around me like Pastor Rich pastors were around me like Pastor Rich pastors were around me like Pastor Rich Pastor uh Chad Pastor Mike Pastor Pastor uh Chad Pastor Mike Pastor Pastor uh Chad Pastor Mike Pastor Charles Pastor rich rich senior I Charles Pastor rich rich senior I Charles Pastor rich rich senior I believe is his name and a couple other believe is his name and a couple other believe is his name and a couple other people that'll pray for me and I felt

people that'll pray for me and I felt people that'll pray for me and I felt like the basketball in um in uh uh like the basketball in um in uh uh like the basketball in um in uh uh what's that one movie Space Jam felt what's that one movie Space Jam felt what's that one movie Space Jam felt like the basketball and I was like yo I like the basketball and I was like yo I like the basketball and I was like yo I think think think I think I just got the gift bro I don't I think I just got the gift bro I don't I think I just got the gift bro I don't know man like if all these people know man like if all these people know man like if all these people praying for me at the same time like praying for me at the same time like praying for me at the same time like even like literally Judas Smith was even like literally Judas Smith was even like literally Judas Smith was preaching he came to me in the middle of preaching he came to me in the middle of preaching he came to me in the middle of the sermon and prayed for I was like I the sermon and prayed for I was like I the sermon and prayed for I was like I just got the goats of preaching uh to just got the goats of preaching uh to just got the goats of preaching uh to pray for me about preaching so I think pray for me about preaching so I think pray for me about preaching so I think something is within me so something something is within me so something something is within me so something started to stir within me uh during that started to stir within me uh during that started to stir within me uh during that time and um I think the following year I time and um I think the following year I time and um I think the following year I was like Hey God I would love to see was like Hey God I would love to see was like Hey God I would love to see what that difference is um just let me what that difference is um just let me what that difference is um just let me know um and then to to be honest with know um and then to to be honest with know um and then to to be honest with you I was like yo if nothing changes by you I was like yo if nothing changes by you I was like yo if nothing changes by like spring of 2023 bro like I'm upset like spring of 2023 bro like I'm upset like spring of 2023 bro like I'm upset like this this no you can't do that to like this this no you can't do that to like this this no you can't do that to me and he was like first of all slowly me and he was like first of all slowly me and he was like first of all slowly roll so spring happens and I get humbled roll so spring happens and I get humbled roll so spring happens and I get humbled and then in the summertime uh I'm on my and then in the summertime uh I'm on my and then in the summertime uh I'm on my way to New York City to go see some way to New York City to go see some way to New York City to go see some family and on the flight like when I family and on the flight like when I family and on the flight like when I land god releases me he literally like land god releases me he literally like land god releases me he literally like tells me when I land uh the same way tells me when I land uh the same way tells me when I land uh the same way that happened to when I got to Vegas for that happened to when I got to Vegas for that happened to when I got to Vegas for the first time um he was like you're the first time um he was like you're the first time um he was like you're good to go and I was like what that mean good to go and I was like what that mean good to go and I was like what that mean like what do you mean good to go uh he like what do you mean good to go uh he like what do you mean good to go uh he was like you can start thinking about was like you can start thinking about was like you can start thinking about what it looks like to leave and I was what it looks like to leave and I was what it looks like to leave and I was like okay cool that same week I got I like okay cool that same week I got I like okay cool that same week I got I got like four job offers and I was like got like four job offers and I was like got like four job offers and I was like that's insane um and then I just kept that's insane um and then I just kept that's insane um and then I just kept praying I was like Hey God when should I praying I was like Hey God when should I praying I was like Hey God when should I leave what does this look like uh and

leave what does this look like uh and leave what does this look like uh and why should I be leaving and um so I just why should I be leaving and um so I just why should I be leaving and um so I just I walked in that Authority um and I I walked in that Authority um and I I walked in that Authority um and I started to pray about what that looks started to pray about what that looks started to pray about what that looks like and he was like this is June and me like and he was like this is June and me like and he was like this is June and me and God are having this conversation and God are having this conversation and God are having this conversation October is when you should leave and I October is when you should leave and I October is when you should leave and I was like hey um that don't really work was like hey um that don't really work was like hey um that don't really work for me financially uh my lease is up in for me financially uh my lease is up in for me financially uh my lease is up in September where am I live for a month he September where am I live for a month he September where am I live for a month he was like don't worry about that leave in was like don't worry about that leave in was like don't worry about that leave in October like I said I'm like all right October like I said I'm like all right October like I said I'm like all right big dog so um I extend my lease I'm big dog so um I extend my lease I'm big dog so um I extend my lease I'm paying double on my rent um all because paying double on my rent um all because paying double on my rent um all because God told me to and um and God has God told me to and um and God has God told me to and um and God has rewarded me so much with uh me being rewarded me so much with uh me being rewarded me so much with uh me being able to work with a lot of really cool able to work with a lot of really cool able to work with a lot of really cool people I'm still working with my pastor people I'm still working with my pastor people I'm still working with my pastor in Vegas Javin Chavez um I'll still help in Vegas Javin Chavez um I'll still help in Vegas Javin Chavez um I'll still help with uh the creative team at TC uh with uh the creative team at TC uh with uh the creative team at TC uh they're still my friends it's still my they're still my friends it's still my they're still my friends it's still my family um I'm now actually working with family um I'm now actually working with family um I'm now actually working with uh this pastor's name is Pastor man uh this pastor's name is Pastor man uh this pastor's name is Pastor man Rango um and he travels the legitimate Rango um and he travels the legitimate Rango um and he travels the legitimate world and preaches all over and um he world and preaches all over and um he world and preaches all over and um he calls me in the like towards the end of calls me in the like towards the end of calls me in the like towards the end of this process and he goes hey man I want this process and he goes hey man I want this process and he goes hey man I want you to move to Dallas and I'm like okay you to move to Dallas and I'm like okay you to move to Dallas and I'm like okay like Dallas is cool you know what I'm like Dallas is cool you know what I'm like Dallas is cool you know what I'm saying like I I got my dream apartment saying like I I got my dream apartment saying like I I got my dream apartment here in Tulsa he's like no no like I here in Tulsa he's like no no like I here in Tulsa he's like no no like I want you to move to Dallas I want you to want you to move to Dallas I want you to want you to move to Dallas I want you to live in this house that uh that you you live in this house that uh that you you live in this house that uh that you you you'll live in it'll be an entire Studio you'll live in it'll be an entire Studio you'll live in it'll be an entire Studio we can make it look however you want um we can make it look however you want um we can make it look however you want um and turn it into a place where you can and turn it into a place where you can and turn it into a place where you can just film so like you're going to pay me just film so like you're going to pay me just film so like you're going to pay me to film you and be like a Tik tocker to film you and be like a Tik tocker to film you and be like a Tik tocker basically like you going to give me a basically like you going to give me a basically like you going to give me a Tik tock house like that's crazy um so

Tik tock house like that's crazy um so Tik tock house like that's crazy um so uh I literally January 7th I moved all uh I literally January 7th I moved all uh I literally January 7th I moved all my things from Tulsa to to Dallas and my things from Tulsa to to Dallas and my things from Tulsa to to Dallas and I've been traveling with him I've been I've been traveling with him I've been I've been traveling with him I've been working with uh elevation Rhythm and a working with uh elevation Rhythm and a working with uh elevation Rhythm and a couple other people too and I just get couple other people too and I just get couple other people too and I just get to have fun I get to make content that I to have fun I get to make content that I to have fun I get to make content that I think resonates with me and other people think resonates with me and other people think resonates with me and other people um and um getting ready because this um and um getting ready because this um and um getting ready because this going to be the Tik Tok house so um going to be the Tik Tok house so um going to be the Tik Tok house so um that's what I'm doing now um I'm doing a that's what I'm doing now um I'm doing a that's what I'm doing now um I'm doing a lot more Consulting with other churches lot more Consulting with other churches lot more Consulting with other churches I get to have conversations like this um I get to have conversations like this um I get to have conversations like this um and uh uh literally this year I've got and uh uh literally this year I've got and uh uh literally this year I've got got booked for maybe like four or five got booked for maybe like four or five got booked for maybe like four or five different conferences and uh and I'm different conferences and uh and I'm different conferences and uh and I'm like this is what I wanted to do this is like this is what I wanted to do this is like this is what I wanted to do this is this is how I wanted to to to do this this is how I wanted to to to do this this is how I wanted to to to do this that's where I wanted to transition into that's where I wanted to transition into that's where I wanted to transition into um and I'm excited to see what comes to um and I'm excited to see what comes to um and I'm excited to see what comes to fruition and uh I'm praying that I get fruition and uh I'm praying that I get fruition and uh I'm praying that I get like 12 speaking engagements I'm like like 12 speaking engagements I'm like like 12 speaking engagements I'm like God that's that's a lot for me it's a God that's that's a lot for me it's a God that's that's a lot for me it's a little bit for you so let's let's see little bit for you so let's let's see little bit for you so let's let's see what happens but God's on the move and what happens but God's on the move and what happens but God's on the move and I'm having a lot of fun in the process I'm having a lot of fun in the process I'm having a lot of fun in the process and I'm learning a lot about submission and I'm learning a lot about submission and I'm learning a lot about submission in uh obedience and comfort so it's in uh obedience and comfort so it's in uh obedience and comfort so it's really it's been amazing Well Ron we really it's been amazing Well Ron we really it's been amazing Well Ron we can't thank you enough for spending so can't thank you enough for spending so can't thank you enough for spending so much time with us being so transparent much time with us being so transparent much time with us being so transparent and gracious with uh the stories that and gracious with uh the stories that and gracious with uh the stories that you told and your own emotional and you told and your own emotional and you told and your own emotional and creative Journey any parting thoughts creative Journey any parting thoughts creative Journey any parting thoughts that you want to leave uh Pro Church that you want to leave uh Pro Church that you want to leave uh Pro Church Nation with Here's my thought actually Nation with Here's my thought actually Nation with Here's my thought actually do what Brady says because it could do what Brady says because it could do what Brady says because it could change your church it could change your change your church it could change your change your church it could change your life uh like be a part of this community life uh like be a part of this community life uh like be a part of this community um something happens when you do things

um something happens when you do things um something happens when you do things in unity actually the Bible ible says in unity actually the Bible ible says in unity actually the Bible ible says this Unity Demands a blessing I want the this Unity Demands a blessing I want the this Unity Demands a blessing I want the blessing so I'm going to function in blessing so I'm going to function in blessing so I'm going to function in unity um and I'm actually going to try unity um and I'm actually going to try unity um and I'm actually going to try and be consistent if you take these and be consistent if you take these and be consistent if you take these things they will work we are both things they will work we are both things they will work we are both products of just going for it and it products of just going for it and it products of just going for it and it working um and we've learned a lot along working um and we've learned a lot along working um and we've learned a lot along the process so like if you're a part of the process so like if you're a part of the process so like if you're a part of this community be a part of this this community be a part of this this community be a part of this community and if you're not a part of community and if you're not a part of community and if you're not a part of this community I'm telling you not this community I'm telling you not this community I'm telling you not asking you be a part of it because asking you be a part of it because asking you be a part of it because together we're going to win and I'm together we're going to win and I'm together we're going to win and I'm excited to see you win beautiful excited to see you win beautiful excited to see you win beautiful Capstone on the conversation Ron thanks Capstone on the conversation Ron thanks Capstone on the conversation Ron thanks as always to everyone listening for your as always to everyone listening for your as always to everyone listening for your time attention and trust and we will time attention and trust and we will time attention and trust and we will talk to you next talk to you next talk to you next week well hey there and welcome to the week well hey there and welcome to the week well hey there and welcome to the pro show we're here you sh I'm always pro show we're here you sh I'm always pro show we're here you sh I'm always I'm Jo my coost it's Al Alexander Mills I'm Jo my coost it's Al Alexander Mills I'm Jo my coost it's Al Alexander Mills and we're also joined by Ron and we're also joined by Ron and we're also joined by Ron Starling Ron is that your real name and Starling Ron is that your real name and Starling Ron is that your real name and why did you change your name