An Honest Conversation With Elevation Church’s Copywriter

today on the show we're joined by Nikki today on the show we're joined by Nikki Sherer who oversees all copyrighting and Sherer who oversees all copyrighting and Sherer who oversees all copyrighting and language for churchwide initiatives at language for churchwide initiatives at language for churchwide initiatives at Elevation Church this means Nikki is Elevation Church this means Nikki is Elevation Church this means Nikki is responsible for what elevation says and responsible for what elevation says and responsible for what elevation says and how they say it now you might be how they say it now you might be how they say it now you might be familiar with a church style guide for familiar with a church style guide for familiar with a church style guide for things like this is our logo and this is things like this is our logo and this is things like this is our logo and this is the color we use and this is the font the color we use and this is the font the color we use and this is the font that we use essentially what Nikki that we use essentially what Nikki that we use essentially what Nikki oversees is a language style guide which oversees is a language style guide which oversees is a language style guide which is probably not something your church is probably not something your church is probably not something your church has but might be what you need has but might be what you need has but might be what you need especially because the words that we use especially because the words that we use especially because the words that we use in person and online do matter a lot in person and online do matter a lot in person and online do matter a lot more than our local so let's dive more than our local so let's dive more than our local so let's dive in well hey there and welcome to the pro in well hey there and welcome to the pro in well hey there and welcome to the pro Church tool show we're here to help you Church tool show we're here to help you Church tool show we're here to help you in your church navigate the biggest in your church navigate the biggest in your church navigate the biggest communication shift in 500 years I'm communication shift in 500 years I'm communication shift in 500 years I'm Brady Shir your host I'm joined as Brady Shir your host I'm joined as Brady Shir your host I'm joined as always by my co-host it's Alexander always by my co-host it's Alexander always by my co-host it's Alexander Mills hello hello and today we're also Mills hello hello and today we're also Mills hello hello and today we're also joined by Nikki sheerer of Elevation joined by Nikki sheerer of Elevation joined by Nikki sheerer of Elevation Church Nikki oversees copyrighting and Church Nikki oversees copyrighting and Church Nikki oversees copyrighting and language for all of elevation churchwide language for all of elevation churchwide language for all of elevation churchwide initiatives prior to that Nikki was initiatives prior to that Nikki was initiatives prior to that Nikki was involved in elevation social media for involved in elevation social media for involved in elevation social media for about 3 years in children's ministry for about 3 years in children's ministry for about 3 years in children's ministry for a few years before that and her husband a few years before that and her husband a few years before that and her husband is also is also is also a campus pastor at one of elevation a campus pastor at one of elevation a campus pastor at one of elevation locations Nikki welcome to the show locations Nikki welcome to the show locations Nikki welcome to the show thanks I'm glad to be here I feel like thanks I'm glad to be here I feel like thanks I'm glad to be here I feel like one of the first things that we should one of the first things that we should one of the first things that we should tackle is our shared last name no we are tackle is our shared last name no we are tackle is our shared last name no we are not related but surely Nikki you know not related but surely Nikki you know not related but surely Nikki you know the pain uniquely that I feel when the pain uniquely that I feel when the pain uniquely that I feel when people try to pronounce our last name people try to pronounce our last name people try to pronounce our last name it's not easy to add the eer to Shear it it's not easy to add the eer to Shear it it's not easy to add the eer to Shear it just gets shortened Brady Shear it's very challenging Nikki I know Shear it's very challenging Nikki I know one of the things that you oversee at one of the things that you oversee at one of the things that you oversee at elevation elevation elevation is what you described as Elevation

is what you described as Elevation is what you described as Elevation Church voice and I think that's where Church voice and I think that's where Church voice and I think that's where I'd like to start our conversation what I'd like to start our conversation what I'd like to start our conversation what exactly is Elevation Church exactly is Elevation Church exactly is Elevation Church voice well um it's the way that we speak voice well um it's the way that we speak voice well um it's the way that we speak um and and as a as a church grows uh the um and and as a as a church grows uh the um and and as a as a church grows uh the number of people communicating on behalf number of people communicating on behalf number of people communicating on behalf of that church grows as well and and of that church grows as well and and of that church grows as well and and then there can become a lot of variety then there can become a lot of variety then there can become a lot of variety in the way that we see things and all of in the way that we see things and all of in the way that we see things and all of that and and so when I speak of that and and so when I speak of that and and so when I speak of Elevation Church voice um it's a Elevation Church voice um it's a Elevation Church voice um it's a distinction because we also have uh distinction because we also have uh distinction because we also have uh Pastor Steven fct's voice and we have Pastor Steven fct's voice and we have Pastor Steven fct's voice and we have the voice of of our pastor Holly feric the voice of of our pastor Holly feric the voice of of our pastor Holly feric and the voice of our children's ministry and the voice of our children's ministry and the voice of our children's ministry right all these different things and so right all these different things and so right all these different things and so when we talk about a collective voice when we talk about a collective voice when we talk about a collective voice like Elevation Church voice as opposed like Elevation Church voice as opposed like Elevation Church voice as opposed to an individual voice like Pastor to an individual voice like Pastor to an individual voice like Pastor Steven fct's voice it's really different Steven fct's voice it's really different Steven fct's voice it's really different right because a collective voice right because a collective voice right because a collective voice shouldn't sound like one person it shouldn't sound like one person it shouldn't sound like one person it should sound like a group of people in should sound like a group of people in should sound like a group of people in in essence and so I describe when I in essence and so I describe when I in essence and so I describe when I teach it um Elevation Church voice is uh teach it um Elevation Church voice is uh teach it um Elevation Church voice is uh casual concise and casual concise and casual concise and conversational and and and we developed conversational and and and we developed conversational and and and we developed that because um our church is a global that because um our church is a global that because um our church is a global Church uh we have a lot of locations but Church uh we have a lot of locations but Church uh we have a lot of locations but our ministry is worldwide and and when our ministry is worldwide and and when our ministry is worldwide and and when you can and when you can give it you can and when you can give it you can and when you can give it parameters like that um that means that parameters like that um that means that parameters like that um that means that we can have Elevation Church voice in we can have Elevation Church voice in we can have Elevation Church voice in English or Spanish um we can have it English or Spanish um we can have it English or Spanish um we can have it Elevation Church voice in the United Elevation Church voice in the United Elevation Church voice in the United States or somewhere in Europe and um States or somewhere in Europe and um States or somewhere in Europe and um because casual is casual in whatever because casual is casual in whatever because casual is casual in whatever language or place that you're speaking language or place that you're speaking language or place that you're speaking it for instance uh you answer one of the

it for instance uh you answer one of the it for instance uh you answer one of the first questions that I wanted to ask first questions that I wanted to ask first questions that I wanted to ask which was how do you differentiate which was how do you differentiate which was how do you differentiate between Pastor step's voice and between Pastor step's voice and between Pastor step's voice and elevation voice are would you say that elevation voice are would you say that elevation voice are would you say that obviously the difference exists is the obviously the difference exists is the obviously the difference exists is the elevation kind of brand voice inspired elevation kind of brand voice inspired elevation kind of brand voice inspired by Pastor stepen and the reason I ask is by Pastor stepen and the reason I ask is by Pastor stepen and the reason I ask is because like my exposure to elevation is because like my exposure to elevation is because like my exposure to elevation is so much influenced by like what I see on so much influenced by like what I see on so much influenced by like what I see on my social feed which is mostly going to my social feed which is mostly going to my social feed which is mostly going to be you know sermon clips and things like be you know sermon clips and things like be you know sermon clips and things like that from Pastor Steven so are there that from Pastor Steven so are there that from Pastor Steven so are there carryovers or are they completely carryovers or are they completely carryovers or are they completely distinct um there are some carryovers distinct um there are some carryovers distinct um there are some carryovers but they're actually pretty distinct but they're actually pretty distinct but they're actually pretty distinct Pastor Steven's voice is really direct Pastor Steven's voice is really direct Pastor Steven's voice is really direct um a lot of a lot of the quotes the um a lot of a lot of the quotes the um a lot of a lot of the quotes the things that people love that he says um things that people love that he says um things that people love that he says um they're very unique to him and and he they're very unique to him and and he they're very unique to him and and he gets straight to the point um he doesn't gets straight to the point um he doesn't gets straight to the point um he doesn't he's not very um like soft in his he's not very um like soft in his he's not very um like soft in his approach where as as a church sometimes approach where as as a church sometimes approach where as as a church sometimes we want to be um and so uh when the we want to be um and so uh when the we want to be um and so uh when the difference between if you look at Pastor difference between if you look at Pastor difference between if you look at Pastor Steven's social media and the church's Steven's social media and the church's Steven's social media and the church's social media they might show you the social media they might show you the social media they might show you the same sermon moment for instance but same sermon moment for instance but same sermon moment for instance but Pastor Steven social media is going to Pastor Steven social media is going to Pastor Steven social media is going to show you that sermon moment and and the show you that sermon moment and and the show you that sermon moment and and the caption is going to be direct it's going caption is going to be direct it's going caption is going to be direct it's going to be clear it's probably going to be to be clear it's probably going to be to be clear it's probably going to be really short but the church's uh the really short but the church's uh the really short but the church's uh the lens that we give it is going to there's lens that we give it is going to there's lens that we give it is going to there's going to be more of a lens to it so going to be more of a lens to it so going to be more of a lens to it so we're going to talk more about like what we're going to talk more about like what we're going to talk more about like what does this mean for your life and and how does this mean for your life and and how does this mean for your life and and how you can you apply that and and so it's you can you apply that and and so it's you can you apply that and and so it's just taking more of that like active just taking more of that like active just taking more of that like active approach to to really like help people approach to to really like help people approach to to really like help people take it to another take it to another take it to another level okay so I guess my big question level okay so I guess my big question level okay so I guess my big question then would be what's the value in

then would be what's the value in then would be what's the value in keeping them them different I I would keeping them them different I I would keeping them them different I I would expect I think oh it would be good if expect I think oh it would be good if expect I think oh it would be good if the voices were closer to the same the voices were closer to the same the voices were closer to the same what's the value for keeping them what's the value for keeping them what's the value for keeping them separate uh oh gosh there's several um separate uh oh gosh there's several um separate uh oh gosh there's several um they have different audiences first they have different audiences first they have different audiences first thing um Pastor Stephen there are a lot thing um Pastor Stephen there are a lot thing um Pastor Stephen there are a lot of people who follow him who don't of people who follow him who don't of people who follow him who don't follow Elevation Church um so think of follow Elevation Church um so think of follow Elevation Church um so think of people who are happily connected to people who are happily connected to people who are happily connected to their own church somewhere else um but their own church somewhere else um but their own church somewhere else um but they enjoy watching Pastor Steven's they enjoy watching Pastor Steven's they enjoy watching Pastor Steven's sermons or they like to follow his sermons or they like to follow his sermons or they like to follow his social media because it's encouraging social media because it's encouraging social media because it's encouraging something like that um so they're going something like that um so they're going something like that um so they're going to engage more specifically with his to engage more specifically with his to engage more specifically with his sermon content or he just released a sermon content or he just released a sermon content or he just released a book and be really interested in his book and be really interested in his book and be really interested in his book content and all of that whereas the book content and all of that whereas the book content and all of that whereas the church and he's going to occasionally church and he's going to occasionally church and he's going to occasionally mention Church things that are connected mention Church things that are connected mention Church things that are connected to that as well but he recognizes that to that as well but he recognizes that to that as well but he recognizes that his audience is larger than that uh his his audience is larger than that uh his his audience is larger than that uh his audience he's not always trying to get audience he's not always trying to get audience he's not always trying to get people to come to our church because people to come to our church because people to come to our church because he's also ministering to people who are he's also ministering to people who are he's also ministering to people who are already connected in other places uh but already connected in other places uh but already connected in other places uh but for Church we're trying to show people for Church we're trying to show people for Church we're trying to show people how hey we want to talk about this how hey we want to talk about this how hey we want to talk about this sermon you can join a small group during sermon you can join a small group during sermon you can join a small group during the week and that's not necessarily the week and that's not necessarily the week and that's not necessarily something that that's better coming from something that that's better coming from something that that's better coming from the church voice than from Pastor the church voice than from Pastor the church voice than from Pastor Steven's Steven's Steven's voice I I think one thing I'd like to voice I I think one thing I'd like to voice I I think one thing I'd like to demystify for everyone listening is I demystify for everyone listening is I demystify for everyone listening is I think it's probably easy to listen to think it's probably easy to listen to think it's probably easy to listen to what Nikki's describing say hey big what Nikki's describing say hey big what Nikki's describing say hey big words our church is international we are words our church is international we are words our church is international we are reaching this many people we have you reaching this many people we have you reaching this many people we have you know millions in our audience and know millions in our audience and know millions in our audience and perhaps mistakenly think that having a a perhaps mistakenly think that having a a perhaps mistakenly think that having a a brand Voice or brand guide or a voice brand Voice or brand guide or a voice brand Voice or brand guide or a voice guide that you can share with people on guide that you can share with people on guide that you can share with people on staff isn't maybe necessary for for your staff isn't maybe necessary for for your staff isn't maybe necessary for for your church you one of the things that we church you one of the things that we church you one of the things that we hear all the time Nikki is like hey man

hear all the time Nikki is like hey man hear all the time Nikki is like hey man I was doing an announcement and then the I was doing an announcement and then the I was doing an announcement and then the children's Pastor got up and like they children's Pastor got up and like they children's Pastor got up and like they did not stick to like the idea that we did not stick to like the idea that we did not stick to like the idea that we talked about in staff meeting and so I talked about in staff meeting and so I talked about in staff meeting and so I would love to hear from you how do you would love to hear from you how do you would love to hear from you how do you cast vision from like a language side cast vision from like a language side cast vision from like a language side those three C's are excellent how do you those three C's are excellent how do you those three C's are excellent how do you get a church of your size to stay on get a church of your size to stay on get a church of your size to stay on message because I'm sure if you can message because I'm sure if you can message because I'm sure if you can describe how you do it we can apply that describe how you do it we can apply that describe how you do it we can apply that in a church of any size yeah um I think in a church of any size yeah um I think in a church of any size yeah um I think maybe we're going to talk about this maybe we're going to talk about this maybe we're going to talk about this later but and there are a lot of later but and there are a lot of later but and there are a lot of different ways there's some things that different ways there's some things that different ways there's some things that we have so we have a style guide like we have so we have a style guide like we have so we have a style guide like this is the way we do dates and times this is the way we do dates and times this is the way we do dates and times right like that kind of a thing and I right like that kind of a thing and I right like that kind of a thing and I think every church should do that um think every church should do that um think every church should do that um this is the way that we say our church this is the way that we say our church this is the way that we say our church name this is this is the way we name this is this is the way we name this is this is the way we capitalize these things um this is the capitalize these things um this is the capitalize these things um this is the way that we say um someone's um title on way that we say um someone's um title on way that we say um someone's um title on staff uh because it should be the same staff uh because it should be the same staff uh because it should be the same everywhere whoever says it right um so everywhere whoever says it right um so everywhere whoever says it right um so wherever we put 9:30 a.m. it should look wherever we put 9:30 a.m. it should look wherever we put 9:30 a.m. it should look the same way every time are we uppercase the same way every time are we uppercase the same way every time are we uppercase lowercase we use the periods do we not lowercase we use the periods do we not lowercase we use the periods do we not use the periods right um it should use the periods right um it should use the periods right um it should always be the same and so so on one hand always be the same and so so on one hand always be the same and so so on one hand we have the style guide that's everyone we have the style guide that's everyone we have the style guide that's everyone across the church this is how we across the church this is how we across the church this is how we communicate like this whether it's in an communicate like this whether it's in an communicate like this whether it's in an email or social media this is the way we email or social media this is the way we email or social media this is the way we say these things separate from that um say these things separate from that um say these things separate from that um when we talk about specific things like when we talk about specific things like when we talk about specific things like we're about to I just got out of a we're about to I just got out of a we're about to I just got out of a meeting for Easter right and so when we meeting for Easter right and so when we meeting for Easter right and so when we talk about Easter how are we going to talk about Easter how are we going to talk about Easter how are we going to talk about that um how are we going to talk about that um how are we going to talk about that um how are we going to see that churchwide what are what are see that churchwide what are what are see that churchwide what are what are the what are the things we're going to the what are the things we're going to the what are the things we're going to put around that and so so we create a put around that and so so we create a put around that and so so we create a guide for everyone to use um in uh we guide for everyone to use um in uh we guide for everyone to use um in uh we call those language guides and and

call those language guides and and call those language guides and and they're so helpful because um you you they're so helpful because um you you they're so helpful because um you you create this resource and you get it in create this resource and you get it in create this resource and you get it in the hands of everyone who will be the hands of everyone who will be the hands of everyone who will be communicating and then they have communicating and then they have communicating and then they have parameters to stay in for that Nikki parameters to stay in for that Nikki parameters to stay in for that Nikki this is this conversation is already so this is this conversation is already so this is this conversation is already so fascinating because uh to a lot of the fascinating because uh to a lot of the fascinating because uh to a lot of the folks listening I'm sure the idea of a folks listening I'm sure the idea of a folks listening I'm sure the idea of a style guide is really familiar and style guide is really familiar and style guide is really familiar and that's most often a visual element how that's most often a visual element how that's most often a visual element how do we want these things look how do we do we want these things look how do we do we want these things look how do we how do we type 9:30 a.m. right with the how do we type 9:30 a.m. right with the how do we type 9:30 a.m. right with the periods or without uh but talking about periods or without uh but talking about periods or without uh but talking about a language guide it's it's really a language guide it's it's really a language guide it's it's really fascinating and and really appropriate fascinating and and really appropriate fascinating and and really appropriate I'm I'm I'm confident that a lot of us I'm I'm I'm confident that a lot of us I'm I'm I'm confident that a lot of us who work in church are thinking like oh who work in church are thinking like oh who work in church are thinking like oh yeah I wish that everyone on staff or yeah I wish that everyone on staff or yeah I wish that everyone on staff or all the volunteers would talk about this all the volunteers would talk about this all the volunteers would talk about this thing that we really want to talk about thing that we really want to talk about thing that we really want to talk about the way that we want to talk about it the way that we want to talk about it the way that we want to talk about it and so I I want to talk a little bit and so I I want to talk a little bit and so I I want to talk a little bit more about your language guys in a few more about your language guys in a few more about your language guys in a few in a few moments but I want to just take in a few moments but I want to just take in a few moments but I want to just take one step back and just hear a littleit a one step back and just hear a littleit a one step back and just hear a littleit a little bit from you like you're talking little bit from you like you're talking little bit from you like you're talking about how you instill this language once about how you instill this language once about how you instill this language once you have it but I'm C ious how do you you have it but I'm C ious how do you you have it but I'm C ious how do you mind this language out in the first mind this language out in the first mind this language out in the first place like how do you discern what place like how do you discern what place like how do you discern what Elevation Church voice is at all well I Elevation Church voice is at all well I Elevation Church voice is at all well I mean I didn't decide that that was mean I didn't decide that that was mean I didn't decide that that was decided before I um uh but I I think um I think that I um uh but I I think um I think that we're careful to so our church just we're careful to so our church just we're careful to so our church just celebrated our 18th anniversary right celebrated our 18th anniversary right celebrated our 18th anniversary right and and so the the way that we say and and so the the way that we say and and so the the way that we say things that we said things 18 years ago things that we said things 18 years ago things that we said things 18 years ago and the way we say them now like what we and the way we say them now like what we and the way we say them now like what we might call casual 18 years ago and what might call casual 18 years ago and what might call casual 18 years ago and what we call Casual now I just think you have we call Casual now I just think you have we call Casual now I just think you have to always be kind of like uh self- to always be kind of like uh self- to always be kind of like uh self- policing that um like hey this is policing that um like hey this is policing that um like hey this is getting this language is getting tired I

getting this language is getting tired I getting this language is getting tired I know this is like this sounds like us know this is like this sounds like us know this is like this sounds like us but and so I think there has to be but and so I think there has to be but and so I think there has to be someone who owns it and again this works someone who owns it and again this works someone who owns it and again this works for a small church right who on your for a small church right who on your for a small church right who on your staff is good at staff is good at staff is good at writing that's really all it is uh writing that's really all it is uh writing that's really all it is uh there's probably someone who is better there's probably someone who is better there's probably someone who is better at it than everyone else um and and so at it than everyone else um and and so at it than everyone else um and and so so give them the re on it and then and so give them the re on it and then and so give them the re on it and then and then get the and then get the important then get the and then get the important then get the and then get the important voices in the room right so then you've voices in the room right so then you've voices in the room right so then you've got you've got your pastor you know uh got you've got your pastor you know uh got you've got your pastor you know uh your your area directors whatever it is your your area directors whatever it is your your area directors whatever it is um and say like hey what do you guys um and say like hey what do you guys um and say like hey what do you guys think about this how does this resonate think about this how does this resonate think about this how does this resonate with you and and and and then if you can with you and and and and then if you can with you and and and and then if you can have a person who's leading it and you have a person who's leading it and you have a person who's leading it and you choose of the person who's deciding on choose of the person who's deciding on choose of the person who's deciding on it who's making the decision and then it who's making the decision and then it who's making the decision and then you get the key influencers in the room you get the key influencers in the room you get the key influencers in the room you can hash it out and land on some you can hash it out and land on some you can hash it out and land on some things that you all feel good about and things that you all feel good about and things that you all feel good about and then if everyone agrees on the direction then if everyone agrees on the direction then if everyone agrees on the direction um then you really got something um then you really got something um then you really got something unifying there a couple weeks ago we unifying there a couple weeks ago we unifying there a couple weeks ago we were talking with uh Transformation were talking with uh Transformation were talking with uh Transformation Church and they used similar language Church and they used similar language Church and they used similar language they said uh the guy we were talking to they said uh the guy we were talking to they said uh the guy we were talking to said look there always has to be a hater said look there always has to be a hater said look there always has to be a hater in the room someone that can say you in the room someone that can say you in the room someone that can say you know and and you're you you use the word know and and you're you you use the word know and and you're you you use the word policing so I'd really like for you if policing so I'd really like for you if policing so I'd really like for you if you would to put on your kind of you would to put on your kind of you would to put on your kind of Sergeant sheerer uh cap cap for us can Sergeant sheerer uh cap cap for us can Sergeant sheerer uh cap cap for us can you tell us about like an actual time you tell us about like an actual time you tell us about like an actual time the more granular the better where the more granular the better where the more granular the better where you're like hey this is the language we you're like hey this is the language we you're like hey this is the language we used here's why it doesn't align with used here's why it doesn't align with used here's why it doesn't align with what weed and here's what we to it to what weed and here's what we to it to what weed and here's what we to it to inad because I think this can get AIT inad because I think this can get AIT inad because I think this can get AIT esoteric for people that maybe unlike esoteric for people that maybe unlike esoteric for people that maybe unlike you and who like in copyrighting day in you and who like in copyrighting day in you and who like in copyrighting day in day out so the more like practical I

day out so the more like practical I day out so the more like practical I think it helped land the plane a bit for think it helped land the plane a bit for think it helped land the plane a bit for folks yes so this is my job I I do it folks yes so this is my job I I do it folks yes so this is my job I I do it every single day so uh a lot of a lot of every single day so uh a lot of a lot of every single day so uh a lot of a lot of what I do is I give feedback on copy what I do is I give feedback on copy what I do is I give feedback on copy that I see come through right so someone that I see come through right so someone that I see come through right so someone might might might feedback and so but this is that leasing feedback and so but this is that leasing feedback and so but this is that leasing right is that I get to be the person who right is that I get to be the person who right is that I get to be the person who um who watches out for our voice in the um who watches out for our voice in the um who watches out for our voice in the sense we've got an email going out to sense we've got an email going out to sense we've got an email going out to thousands of people right and and and thousands of people right and and and thousands of people right and and and when I see the copy for it uh there when I see the copy for it uh there when I see the copy for it uh there might be something in there that's it's might be something in there that's it's might be something in there that's it's not clear um you know like this the not clear um you know like this the not clear um you know like this the communication feels a little bit muddy communication feels a little bit muddy communication feels a little bit muddy or something like that or or it's uh or something like that or or it's uh or something like that or or it's uh it's coming across too formal which is it's coming across too formal which is it's coming across too formal which is not Elevation Church voice is not formal not Elevation Church voice is not formal not Elevation Church voice is not formal we're casual um that's really important we're casual um that's really important we're casual um that's really important to us and so uh so whatever it is the to us and so uh so whatever it is the to us and so uh so whatever it is the specific thing then I will I will specific thing then I will I will specific thing then I will I will comment with the um I try really hard comment with the um I try really hard comment with the um I try really hard not to ever say like hey this doesn't not to ever say like hey this doesn't not to ever say like hey this doesn't sound like us without saying why it sound like us without saying why it sound like us without saying why it doesn't sound like us so that's like the doesn't sound like us so that's like the doesn't sound like us so that's like the really important thing and when you've really important thing and when you've really important thing and when you've got like those those um those kind of got like those those um those kind of got like those those um those kind of guides those values lining you lining guides those values lining you lining guides those values lining you lining you up for like hey we all agreed on you up for like hey we all agreed on you up for like hey we all agreed on this is what we sound like and so when I this is what we sound like and so when I this is what we sound like and so when I read this my perspective is that it's read this my perspective is that it's read this my perspective is that it's not clear uh this feels confusing to me not clear uh this feels confusing to me not clear uh this feels confusing to me can we make this clearer and so I I can we make this clearer and so I I can we make this clearer and so I I think like just being able to Point think like just being able to Point think like just being able to Point again right back to those this is what again right back to those this is what again right back to those this is what we said our voice is and so to me and we said our voice is and so to me and we said our voice is and so to me and maybe to you this is clear but it's not maybe to you this is clear but it's not maybe to you this is clear but it's not to me and so it should be clear to all to me and so it should be clear to all to me and so it should be clear to all of us to anyone who looks at this so

of us to anyone who looks at this so of us to anyone who looks at this so let's let's rework it again to make it let's let's rework it again to make it let's let's rework it again to make it clear is that is that how does that clear is that is that how does that clear is that is that how does that answer the question yeah and you really answer the question yeah and you really answer the question yeah and you really answered the question when you shared answered the question when you shared answered the question when you shared those three you know concise casual and those three you know concise casual and those three you know concise casual and conversational because you know it's conversational because you know it's conversational because you know it's it's so funny usually the larger it's so funny usually the larger it's so funny usually the larger churches have a really good grasp on churches have a really good grasp on churches have a really good grasp on this because by necessity if you don't this because by necessity if you don't this because by necessity if you don't have a grasp on values that are clearly have a grasp on values that are clearly have a grasp on values that are clearly cast in the form of vision chaos Reigns cast in the form of vision chaos Reigns cast in the form of vision chaos Reigns Supreme right and and in smaller Supreme right and and in smaller Supreme right and and in smaller churches we can sometimes get away with churches we can sometimes get away with churches we can sometimes get away with that because like hey it's a small that because like hey it's a small that because like hey it's a small church family of course it's chaos you church family of course it's chaos you church family of course it's chaos you know it's like a regular family it's know it's like a regular family it's know it's like a regular family it's just wild but like the larger you get just wild but like the larger you get just wild but like the larger you get you have multiple departments multiple you have multiple departments multiple you have multiple departments multiple heads you got these people reporting to heads you got these people reporting to heads you got these people reporting to these people reporting to these people these people reporting to these people these people reporting to these people you have to have these values lined up you have to have these values lined up you have to have these values lined up that being said I think for every size that being said I think for every size that being said I think for every size church this is so important what do we church this is so important what do we church this is so important what do we talk about all the time the challenge talk about all the time the challenge talk about all the time the challenge when you're working with creatives and when you're working with creatives and when you're working with creatives and this is creative writing but sharing a this is creative writing but sharing a this is creative writing but sharing a sermon is creative Worship Is Creative sermon is creative Worship Is Creative sermon is creative Worship Is Creative so much of what we do in church is so much of what we do in church is so much of what we do in church is storytelling and creative how do you storytelling and creative how do you storytelling and creative how do you give feedback how are you critical how give feedback how are you critical how give feedback how are you critical how do you tell someone okay this needs to do you tell someone okay this needs to do you tell someone okay this needs to be changed and it sounds like maybe a be changed and it sounds like maybe a be changed and it sounds like maybe a big big part of your job is finding ways big big part of your job is finding ways big big part of your job is finding ways to give that critical feedback but it to give that critical feedback but it to give that critical feedback but it not being hurtful or offensive and it's not being hurtful or offensive and it's not being hurtful or offensive and it's still achieving the end objective that still achieving the end objective that still achieving the end objective that you want could you talk maybe about like you want could you talk maybe about like you want could you talk maybe about like what are some of the biggest challenges what are some of the biggest challenges what are some of the biggest challenges that you encounter and have to that you encounter and have to that you encounter and have to continually overcome when you're talking continually overcome when you're talking continually overcome when you're talking about giving that feedback yeah um and I about giving that feedback yeah um and I about giving that feedback yeah um and I know like people don't really love the know like people don't really love the know like people don't really love the word feedback I don't have a better word word feedback I don't have a better word word feedback I don't have a better word for it though um but I um uh so the

for it though um but I um uh so the for it though um but I um uh so the first thing I would say is that first thing I would say is that first thing I would say is that especially for my copyrighting team uh especially for my copyrighting team uh especially for my copyrighting team uh we have values uh for our team and um we have values uh for our team and um we have values uh for our team and um and one of them is that we're flexible and one of them is that we're flexible and one of them is that we're flexible um and I kind of having in the um and I kind of having in the um and I kind of having in the description underneath that like don't description underneath that like don't description underneath that like don't like our first draft want us to take like our first draft want us to take like our first draft want us to take another shot we'd love to uh we can't another shot we'd love to uh we can't another shot we'd love to uh we can't wait to make this better and and I think wait to make this better and and I think wait to make this better and and I think when you come in like when I interview when you come in like when I interview when you come in like when I interview someone I I start right at the gate like someone I I start right at the gate like someone I I start right at the gate like how would it feel for you to um have to how would it feel for you to um have to how would it feel for you to um have to rework every single thing that you have rework every single thing that you have rework every single thing that you have that you write for us forever right like that you write for us forever right like that you write for us forever right like there's never going to be a point when there's never going to be a point when there's never going to be a point when someone's not saying like hey can we try someone's not saying like hey can we try someone's not saying like hey can we try it this way hey can we do that instead it this way hey can we do that instead it this way hey can we do that instead there's you're never going to like there's you're never going to like there's you're never going to like outgrow the season because we always outgrow the season because we always outgrow the season because we always want to get better uh we always want to want to get better uh we always want to want to get better uh we always want to we're we're eager to hear what someone we're we're eager to hear what someone we're we're eager to hear what someone else's Viewpoint is on what we wrote and else's Viewpoint is on what we wrote and else's Viewpoint is on what we wrote and so so there's never I think when you can so so there's never I think when you can so so there's never I think when you can kind of demystify the like I think we kind of demystify the like I think we kind of demystify the like I think we like to think well I just need feedback like to think well I just need feedback like to think well I just need feedback for a little while and then it'll get for a little while and then it'll get for a little while and then it'll get good enough and I won't need it anymore good enough and I won't need it anymore good enough and I won't need it anymore right um well then if if no one's right um well then if if no one's right um well then if if no one's dialoguing with you about your art your dialoguing with you about your art your dialoguing with you about your art your creativity your your talent whatever it creativity your your talent whatever it creativity your your talent whatever it is if you don't have someone dialoguing is if you don't have someone dialoguing is if you don't have someone dialoguing with you about it it's probably not with you about it it's probably not with you about it it's probably not getting better um because you're not getting better um because you're not getting better um because you're not getting an outside voice on it and so I getting an outside voice on it and so I getting an outside voice on it and so I so just I would say we set the so just I would say we set the so just I would say we set the expectation for from the beginning like expectation for from the beginning like expectation for from the beginning like that's how we do it uh we we always have that's how we do it uh we we always have that's how we do it uh we we always have someone else look at things at least one someone else look at things at least one someone else look at things at least one other person many things have more than other person many things have more than other person many things have more than that um so we've got someone looking that um so we've got someone looking that um so we've got someone looking like purely from like oh that grammar is like purely from like oh that grammar is like purely from like oh that grammar is not correct and then someone else not correct and then someone else not correct and then someone else looking from the like oh that's not uh

looking from the like oh that's not uh looking from the like oh that's not uh we need to add this information that we need to add this information that we need to add this information that information is missing and and and so information is missing and and and so information is missing and and and so when you've got like these different when you've got like these different when you've got like these different voices in there um uh and you set that voices in there um uh and you set that voices in there um uh and you set that expectation when people are expecting expectation when people are expecting expectation when people are expecting that then it's not it's not hurtful that then it's not it's not hurtful that then it's not it's not hurtful right it's not like you don't take it as right it's not like you don't take it as right it's not like you don't take it as personal like this is just part of the personal like this is just part of the personal like this is just part of the job this is we do this like if I worked job this is we do this like if I worked job this is we do this like if I worked for a newspaper every single thing I for a newspaper every single thing I for a newspaper every single thing I wrote would be wrote would be wrote would be copyedited yeah you know Nikki we sat copyedited yeah you know Nikki we sat copyedited yeah you know Nikki we sat down to to chat with you about you know down to to chat with you about you know down to to chat with you about you know language guides and and our conversation language guides and and our conversation language guides and and our conversation has quickly just kind of evolved into has quickly just kind of evolved into has quickly just kind of evolved into just general leadership in church which just general leadership in church which just general leadership in church which I mean for so many people listening to I mean for so many people listening to I mean for so many people listening to the show like these are the things we're the show like these are the things we're the show like these are the things we're working through how to lead teams and working through how to lead teams and working through how to lead teams and and right now we're talking about um and right now we're talking about um and right now we're talking about um policies for language which I mean policies for language which I mean policies for language which I mean you've done such a good job of you've done such a good job of you've done such a good job of articulating how to give feedback in articulating how to give feedback in articulating how to give feedback in that space and it's what we talk about that space and it's what we talk about that space and it's what we talk about in the show too about having policies in the show too about having policies in the show too about having policies for social media for example and how to for social media for example and how to for social media for example and how to make decisions about what to post and make decisions about what to post and make decisions about what to post and what not to post well we hold it up what not to post well we hold it up what not to post well we hold it up against the policy we've agreed on these against the policy we've agreed on these against the policy we've agreed on these things and so we get to hold it up things and so we get to hold it up things and so we get to hold it up against that for for your case in the in against that for for your case in the in against that for for your case in the in the language Department you have this the language Department you have this the language Department you have this policy we are we're casual we're concise policy we are we're casual we're concise policy we are we're casual we're concise we're conversational and so when you're we're conversational and so when you're we're conversational and so when you're giving feedback you get to hold it up giving feedback you get to hold it up giving feedback you get to hold it up against that and say you know what this against that and say you know what this against that and say you know what this is not clear enough this is not concise is not clear enough this is not concise is not clear enough this is not concise enough um I do want to talk about I want enough um I do want to talk about I want enough um I do want to talk about I want to transition now a little bit into your to transition now a little bit into your to transition now a little bit into your social media policies um and some of the social media policies um and some of the social media policies um and some of the decisions that you make in and amongst decisions that you make in and amongst decisions that you make in and amongst your team um you know we we have ations your team um you know we we have ations your team um you know we we have ations with people on the show all this uh all with people on the show all this uh all with people on the show all this uh all the time social media managers folks who the time social media managers folks who the time social media managers folks who are posting for their churches and and are posting for their churches and and are posting for their churches and and we we usually get to the point of the we we usually get to the point of the we we usually get to the point of the conversation talking about like how do conversation talking about like how do conversation talking about like how do you decide what to post and what not to you decide what to post and what not to you decide what to post and what not to post and in America and a a church of post and in America and a a church of post and in America and a a church of your influence and your affluence like

your influence and your affluence like your influence and your affluence like something you surely run into a lot is something you surely run into a lot is something you surely run into a lot is like when there is a national tragedy like when there is a national tragedy like when there is a national tragedy for example like how do we decide what for example like how do we decide what for example like how do we decide what to post what not to post folks are to post what not to post folks are to post what not to post folks are looking to elevation for Spiritual looking to elevation for Spiritual looking to elevation for Spiritual Direction what does what does God say Direction what does what does God say Direction what does what does God say about this what does our what does the about this what does our what does the about this what does our what does the what do the Christians say about this what do the Christians say about this what do the Christians say about this and you're one of the churches that and you're one of the churches that and you're one of the churches that folks are looking to and so I I guess folks are looking to and so I I guess folks are looking to and so I I guess that's my question is like how are you that's my question is like how are you that's my question is like how are you making decisions about what to post and making decisions about what to post and making decisions about what to post and what not to post um when a situation what not to post um when a situation what not to post um when a situation like that whether National or otherwise like that whether National or otherwise like that whether National or otherwise is kind of is kind of is kind of unfolding um I I'm going to answer this unfolding um I I'm going to answer this unfolding um I I'm going to answer this really practically and specifically for really practically and specifically for really practically and specifically for you but the first thing I'm going to say you but the first thing I'm going to say you but the first thing I'm going to say is like you're not going to get it right is like you're not going to get it right is like you're not going to get it right every time it's every time it's every time it's okay um you seek wise counsel and you okay um you seek wise counsel and you okay um you seek wise counsel and you pray about it and you make the best call pray about it and you make the best call pray about it and you make the best call that's that's what you do um but but that's that's what you do um but but that's that's what you do um but but here's how we decide here's how we decide here's how we decide um and I will say like we haven't always um and I will say like we haven't always um and I will say like we haven't always gotten it right um there have been times gotten it right um there have been times gotten it right um there have been times where we're like ah we should have where we're like ah we should have where we're like ah we should have posted about that sooner or now we posted about that sooner or now we posted about that sooner or now we shouldn't have posted about that one we' shouldn't have posted about that one we' shouldn't have posted about that one we' we've self-reflected a couple times like we've self-reflected a couple times like we've self-reflected a couple times like that um but in general that um but in general that um but in general um we are going to make uh comments that um we are going to make uh comments that um we are going to make uh comments that are connected to our values what matters are connected to our values what matters are connected to our values what matters to us things um or here's here's I'll be to us things um or here's here's I'll be to us things um or here's here's I'll be really practical we have um like really practical we have um like really practical we have um like physical locations as well as an online physical locations as well as an online physical locations as well as an online Ministry and so say um there's a tragedy Ministry and so say um there's a tragedy Ministry and so say um there's a tragedy um I personally live uh near our Ron Oak um I personally live uh near our Ron Oak um I personally live uh near our Ron Oak Virginia campus so say uh something Virginia campus so say uh something Virginia campus so say uh something terrible happens in the Rono Virginia terrible happens in the Rono Virginia terrible happens in the Rono Virginia area our church is going to make a

area our church is going to make a area our church is going to make a statement about that uh we're going to statement about that uh we're going to statement about that uh we're going to we're going to say something that's we're going to say something that's we're going to say something that's going to comfort specifically the people going to comfort specifically the people going to comfort specifically the people who are connected to our ministry from who are connected to our ministry from who are connected to our ministry from that area that matters to us we've got that area that matters to us we've got that area that matters to us we've got people there we minister to people there people there we minister to people there people there we minister to people there that's specific to us um as opposed to that's specific to us um as opposed to that's specific to us um as opposed to if the same exact thing happened in if the same exact thing happened in if the same exact thing happened in another area where we don't have like an another area where we don't have like an another area where we don't have like an established Ministry maybe we haven't established Ministry maybe we haven't established Ministry maybe we haven't met people in that City before in person met people in that City before in person met people in that City before in person or something like that then we're less or something like that then we're less or something like that then we're less likely to say a comment about that for likely to say a comment about that for likely to say a comment about that for instance we also have like core core instance we also have like core core instance we also have like core core values um related like to our Outreach values um related like to our Outreach values um related like to our Outreach specifically and so like for some church specifically and so like for some church specifically and so like for some church that would look like missions right that would look like missions right that would look like missions right maybe you've got like a mission presence maybe you've got like a mission presence maybe you've got like a mission presence in like a certain area that your church in like a certain area that your church in like a certain area that your church is just like really connected to and for is just like really connected to and for is just like really connected to and for us we've got like certain certain us we've got like certain certain us we've got like certain certain Ministry partners that we partner with Ministry partners that we partner with Ministry partners that we partner with and and so uh what that that Partners and and so uh what that that Partners and and so uh what that that Partners sorry that partnership also um comes out sorry that partnership also um comes out sorry that partnership also um comes out in like how we speak about things and so in like how we speak about things and so in like how we speak about things and so um so it really is it's personal right um so it really is it's personal right um so it really is it's personal right so personal is powerful um we're the one so personal is powerful um we're the one so personal is powerful um we're the one thing that we are pretty committed to is thing that we are pretty committed to is thing that we are pretty committed to is we're not going to say something just to we're not going to say something just to we're not going to say something just to say something so uh I'm not going to do say something so uh I'm not going to do say something so uh I'm not going to do pray hash pray for whatever um we kind pray hash pray for whatever um we kind pray hash pray for whatever um we kind of committed like we're not going to do of committed like we're not going to do of committed like we're not going to do that kind of post anymore if we're going that kind of post anymore if we're going that kind of post anymore if we're going to do that we're actually going to write to do that we're actually going to write to do that we're actually going to write The Prayer um I mean I'm not just going The Prayer um I mean I'm not just going The Prayer um I mean I'm not just going to like try to do like the cool trendy to like try to do like the cool trendy to like try to do like the cool trendy thing I want to do something that gives thing I want to do something that gives thing I want to do something that gives people value or uh or helps them people value or uh or helps them people value or uh or helps them Comforts them gives them something like Comforts them gives them something like Comforts them gives them something like that a church needs to give them right that a church needs to give them right that a church needs to give them right so that's I mean you mentioned so that's I mean you mentioned so that's I mean you mentioned reflecting on ways that you've missed reflecting on ways that you've missed reflecting on ways that you've missed before in the past my sense is maybe

before in the past my sense is maybe before in the past my sense is maybe you've reflected and be like hey you you've reflected and be like hey you you've reflected and be like hey you know we kind of just did like the token know we kind of just did like the token know we kind of just did like the token post there and next time let's do post there and next time let's do post there and next time let's do something that's a bit more substantive something that's a bit more substantive something that's a bit more substantive because we don't want to Simply do because we don't want to Simply do because we don't want to Simply do something because oh everyone else is something because oh everyone else is something because oh everyone else is and by us not doing it there's almost and by us not doing it there's almost and by us not doing it there's almost like the sin of mission of us like like the sin of mission of us like like the sin of mission of us like opting out of it so if we are we're opting out of it so if we are we're opting out of it so if we are we're going to make it substantive is is that going to make it substantive is is that going to make it substantive is is that accurate oh yeah absolutely excellent accurate oh yeah absolutely excellent accurate oh yeah absolutely excellent okay it's funny because uh we've never okay it's funny because uh we've never okay it's funny because uh we've never spoken and I don't know about you know spoken and I don't know about you know spoken and I don't know about you know elevation specific policy on this but uh elevation specific policy on this but uh elevation specific policy on this but uh this is identically what we have shared this is identically what we have shared this is identically what we have shared for years um in response to people for years um in response to people for years um in response to people asking us this happened should we say it asking us this happened should we say it asking us this happened should we say it we've always had two simple principles we've always had two simple principles we've always had two simple principles one does it align with your Church's one does it align with your Church's one does it align with your Church's existing Ministries specifically so like existing Ministries specifically so like existing Ministries specifically so like if there's something to do with like you if there's something to do with like you if there's something to do with like you know um young mothers uh oh it's it's know um young mothers uh oh it's it's know um young mothers uh oh it's it's abortion it's something like that and abortion it's something like that and abortion it's something like that and you have like a huge emphasis at your you have like a huge emphasis at your you have like a huge emphasis at your church in your Ministries already great church in your Ministries already great church in your Ministries already great or is it local if it's local then great or is it local if it's local then great or is it local if it's local then great if it's neither of those two things you if it's neither of those two things you if it's neither of those two things you have like the freedom to just opt out have like the freedom to just opt out have like the freedom to just opt out because it doesn't actually align with because it doesn't actually align with because it doesn't actually align with your existing Ministry and so if your existing Ministry and so if your existing Ministry and so if anything it could kind of look like anything it could kind of look like anything it could kind of look like you're you know a front runner and you're you know a front runner and you're you know a front runner and wanting to jump on the trend just to you wanting to jump on the trend just to you wanting to jump on the trend just to you know virtue signal let's uh talk know virtue signal let's uh talk know virtue signal let's uh talk about special initiatives um you are in about special initiatives um you are in about special initiatives um you are in the middle of the middle of the middle of book season with Pastor Steven yes it is book season with Pastor Steven yes it is book season with Pastor Steven yes it is the middle six months okay there you go the middle six months okay there you go the middle six months okay there you go do you feel like you're coming out of it do you feel like you're coming out of it do you feel like you're coming out of it are we're getting close to that is the a are we're getting close to that is the a are we're getting close to that is the a little bit yeah uh it's also Easter little bit yeah uh it's also Easter little bit yeah uh it's also Easter season you know you mentioned just season you know you mentioned just season you know you mentioned just coming out of an Easter meeting uh coming out of an Easter meeting uh coming out of an Easter meeting uh Easter's a bit earlier this year but by Easter's a bit earlier this year but by Easter's a bit earlier this year but by the time this goes out it is still pre-

the time this goes out it is still pre- the time this goes out it is still pre- Easter I'd love to hear about like what Easter I'd love to hear about like what Easter I'd love to hear about like what are you specifically tackling for Easter are you specifically tackling for Easter are you specifically tackling for Easter right now like okay this is going to be right now like okay this is going to be right now like okay this is going to be a bigger service for most churches what a bigger service for most churches what a bigger service for most churches what are some of the things that you have to are some of the things that you have to are some of the things that you have to get your you know ducks in a row as it get your you know ducks in a row as it get your you know ducks in a row as it were in respect to were in respect to were in respect to Easter um for us the most important Easter um for us the most important Easter um for us the most important thing on Easter is inviting people to thing on Easter is inviting people to thing on Easter is inviting people to church um it is uh it's the Sunday for church um it is uh it's the Sunday for church um it is uh it's the Sunday for us that we have one of the highest us that we have one of the highest us that we have one of the highest attendance people tend to come to Easter attendance people tend to come to Easter attendance people tend to come to Easter more than Christmas um and so it's the more than Christmas um and so it's the more than Christmas um and so it's the it's and I think a lot of that is uh it's and I think a lot of that is uh it's and I think a lot of that is uh location specific uh so for instance uh location specific uh so for instance uh location specific uh so for instance uh how people are going to come in the how people are going to come in the how people are going to come in the Southern United States as opposed to Southern United States as opposed to Southern United States as opposed to Canada that will probably be different Canada that will probably be different Canada that will probably be different right and so so you have to apply this right and so so you have to apply this right and so so you have to apply this to your to your own scenario but um but to your to your own scenario but um but to your to your own scenario but um but for us we know that we tend to see for us we know that we tend to see for us we know that we tend to see people um more easily come to church on people um more easily come to church on people um more easily come to church on Easter and so knowing that uh we try to Easter and so knowing that uh we try to Easter and so knowing that uh we try to capitalize on the opportunity um the capitalize on the opportunity um the capitalize on the opportunity um the mission of Elevation Church We Exist so mission of Elevation Church We Exist so mission of Elevation Church We Exist so that people far from God will be raised that people far from God will be raised that people far from God will be raised to life in Christ that's our mission and to life in Christ that's our mission and to life in Christ that's our mission and and so when I think about Easter and I and so when I think about Easter and I and so when I think about Easter and I think about the mission of reaching think about the mission of reaching think about the mission of reaching people far from God I people far from God I people far from God I and and and what Jesus like Easter and and and and what Jesus like Easter and and and and what Jesus like Easter and Christmas are the only two Sundays of Christmas are the only two Sundays of Christmas are the only two Sundays of the year that are actually wrapped the year that are actually wrapped the year that are actually wrapped around a particular passage in the Bible around a particular passage in the Bible around a particular passage in the Bible right a lot of most of our other Sundays right a lot of most of our other Sundays right a lot of most of our other Sundays are whatever the pastor wants to preach are whatever the pastor wants to preach are whatever the pastor wants to preach on you know any particular thing or on you know any particular thing or on you know any particular thing or whatever but but Easter and Christmas whatever but but Easter and Christmas whatever but but Easter and Christmas are both around particular biblical are both around particular biblical are both around particular biblical events and so this particular biblical

events and so this particular biblical events and so this particular biblical event of Easter is tied directly to our event of Easter is tied directly to our event of Easter is tied directly to our mission um and so that's so important to mission um and so that's so important to mission um and so that's so important to us and so when I think about how I'm us and so when I think about how I'm us and so when I think about how I'm going to talk about Easter I'm thinking going to talk about Easter I'm thinking going to talk about Easter I'm thinking about talking to people far from God um about talking to people far from God um about talking to people far from God um so because that's the thing that matters so because that's the thing that matters so because that's the thing that matters most to us and so uh so just to like most to us and so uh so just to like most to us and so uh so just to like give you just like a teeny bit of a give you just like a teeny bit of a give you just like a teeny bit of a glimpse I'm talking all the way from glimpse I'm talking all the way from glimpse I'm talking all the way from people who have been in our church for people who have been in our church for people who have been in our church for years and I want them to invite people years and I want them to invite people years and I want them to invite people to church all the way to people who've to church all the way to people who've to church all the way to people who've never heard of our church before and never heard of our church before and never heard of our church before and trying to get them to come to church trying to get them to come to church trying to get them to come to church right people who are unchurched you right people who are unchurched you right people who are unchurched you might say and so how do I talk to those might say and so how do I talk to those might say and so how do I talk to those two people are really different um but two people are really different um but two people are really different um but I'm putting a lot of my focus energy I'm putting a lot of my focus energy I'm putting a lot of my focus energy time resources toward what I would call time resources toward what I would call time resources toward what I would call the cold audience as people far from God the cold audience as people far from God the cold audience as people far from God and so I'm not going to say the word and so I'm not going to say the word and so I'm not going to say the word Calvary not going to say the word Calvary not going to say the word Calvary not going to say the word Resurrection I'm not going to say the Resurrection I'm not going to say the Resurrection I'm not going to say the blood of Jesus right um I'm not going to blood of Jesus right um I'm not going to blood of Jesus right um I'm not going to say any of these words that make someone say any of these words that make someone say any of these words that make someone feel like an outsider this is really feel like an outsider this is really feel like an outsider this is really important um an important guiding important um an important guiding important um an important guiding principle for how we develop language is principle for how we develop language is principle for how we develop language is um anyone can be a part of our church it um anyone can be a part of our church it um anyone can be a part of our church it might not be for everyone everyone might might not be for everyone everyone might might not be for everyone everyone might not like it but anyone can come um you not like it but anyone can come um you not like it but anyone can come um you don't have to understand what we're you don't have to understand what we're you don't have to understand what we're you know any fancy language there's not any know any fancy language there's not any know any fancy language there's not any prerequisite to be able to come here and prerequisite to be able to come here and prerequisite to be able to come here and so so when we're thinking about such a so so when we're thinking about such a so so when we're thinking about such a like steeped in Tradition holiday like like steeped in Tradition holiday like like steeped in Tradition holiday like Easter and how we talk to someone who's

Easter and how we talk to someone who's Easter and how we talk to someone who's not steeped in that tradition and how we not steeped in that tradition and how we not steeped in that tradition and how we get them to connect to it and come to it get them to connect to it and come to it get them to connect to it and come to it that's really important to us that's that's really important to us that's that's really important to us that's such good Insight because I think a lot such good Insight because I think a lot such good Insight because I think a lot of us know this anecdotally that when of us know this anecdotally that when of us know this anecdotally that when we're trying to communicate about we're trying to communicate about we're trying to communicate about whether it's Easter or anything else whether it's Easter or anything else whether it's Easter or anything else we're doing at church that's where we we're doing at church that's where we we're doing at church that's where we get bogged down a little bit is in the get bogged down a little bit is in the get bogged down a little bit is in the messy middle because we all know messy middle because we all know messy middle because we all know regardless of the size of our church regardless of the size of our church regardless of the size of our church that we're talking to two distinct that we're talking to two distinct that we're talking to two distinct groups of people folks who are either groups of people folks who are either groups of people folks who are either plugged in at church know the language plugged in at church know the language plugged in at church know the language know the lingo attend every Sunday and know the lingo attend every Sunday and know the lingo attend every Sunday and folks who don't come to church maybe folks who don't come to church maybe folks who don't come to church maybe who've never heard the language or the who've never heard the language or the who've never heard the language or the lingo but we want them to come to church lingo but we want them to come to church lingo but we want them to come to church on Sunday and so it sounds like maybe on Sunday and so it sounds like maybe on Sunday and so it sounds like maybe what you're describing is that you are what you're describing is that you are what you're describing is that you are creating different content pieces for creating different content pieces for creating different content pieces for these two different groups of people is these two different groups of people is these two different groups of people is that is that true and if it is can you that is that true and if it is can you that is that true and if it is can you give me an example of um you know one of give me an example of um you know one of give me an example of um you know one of each pieces of of content but for the each pieces of of content but for the each pieces of of content but for the same same same event you boy you're you're you're event you boy you're you're you're event you boy you're you're you're playing with my memory here because I playing with my memory here because I playing with my memory here because I don't have it up in front of me but I don't have it up in front of me but I don't have it up in front of me but I can give you um that's okay I can give can give you um that's okay I can give can give you um that's okay I can give you I can give you a little bit here um you I can give you a little bit here um you I can give you a little bit here um so here's here's a good example um we so here's here's a good example um we so here's here's a good example um we were using um the verse and boy you're were using um the verse and boy you're were using um the verse and boy you're really testing my memory here I think really testing my memory here I think really testing my memory here I think it's John 16 33 but it doesn't matter it's John 16 33 but it doesn't matter it's John 16 33 but it doesn't matter the one that says um in this world uh the one that says um in this world uh the one that says um in this world uh you will have trouble but take heart you will have trouble but take heart you will have trouble but take heart I've overcome the world right that verse I've overcome the world right that verse I've overcome the world right that verse um and and we really love that for um and and we really love that for um and and we really love that for Easter because um it has this tension in Easter because um it has this tension in Easter because um it has this tension in it of like there's going to be trouble it of like there's going to be trouble it of like there's going to be trouble but everything's going to be okay and but everything's going to be okay and but everything's going to be okay and the reason everything's going to be okay

the reason everything's going to be okay the reason everything's going to be okay is because of Jesus and and so we can we is because of Jesus and and so we can we is because of Jesus and and so we can we can take that that tension that we're can take that that tension that we're can take that that tension that we're talking about and we can talk to our talking about and we can talk to our talking about and we can talk to our warm audience um and so I'm going to warm audience um and so I'm going to warm audience um and so I'm going to talk to them uh from stage on Sunday talk to them uh from stage on Sunday talk to them uh from stage on Sunday right if they're in the room then right if they're in the room then right if they're in the room then they're a warm audience um I'm going to they're a warm audience um I'm going to they're a warm audience um I'm going to talk to them in people whose emails I've talk to them in people whose emails I've talk to them in people whose emails I've already gathered um they've already already gathered um they've already already gathered um they've already engaged with us in some manner I'm going engaged with us in some manner I'm going engaged with us in some manner I'm going to talk to them from that that warmer um to talk to them from that that warmer um to talk to them from that that warmer um angle where I'm going to talk to them angle where I'm going to talk to them angle where I'm going to talk to them about hey there's someone in your life about hey there's someone in your life about hey there's someone in your life who's going through a hard time right who's going through a hard time right who's going through a hard time right now uh there's someone in your life who now uh there's someone in your life who now uh there's someone in your life who needs the hope of Christ um and they needs the hope of Christ um and they needs the hope of Christ um and they need to know that even though they're need to know that even though they're need to know that even though they're going through a hard time everything's going through a hard time everything's going through a hard time everything's going to be okay who are you inviting to going to be okay who are you inviting to going to be okay who are you inviting to Easter that's how I'm going to say that Easter that's how I'm going to say that Easter that's how I'm going to say that to my warm audience but to my cold to my warm audience but to my cold to my warm audience but to my cold audience which is like uh uh ads is a audience which is like uh uh ads is a audience which is like uh uh ads is a great spot for this but also like again great spot for this but also like again great spot for this but also like again I Love Thinking of small Church contact I Love Thinking of small Church contact I Love Thinking of small Church contact because I've been in a small Church because I've been in a small Church because I've been in a small Church before too um I had Church experience before too um I had Church experience before too um I had Church experience before elevation and and so maybe to you before elevation and and so maybe to you before elevation and and so maybe to you this is like a social media post that this is like a social media post that this is like a social media post that you boost a little bit right it's just you boost a little bit right it's just you boost a little bit right it's just like a small thing but if you do that like a small thing but if you do that like a small thing but if you do that it's going to hit some people who aren't it's going to hit some people who aren't it's going to hit some people who aren't familiar with your church and that's familiar with your church and that's familiar with your church and that's going to be a cold audience and so for going to be a cold audience and so for going to be a cold audience and so for them that's going to be more them that's going to be more them that's going to be more like uh life is hard right now but like uh life is hard right now but like uh life is hard right now but there's hope um come find out why join there's hope um come find out why join there's hope um come find out why join us for Easter at elevation um and that's us for Easter at elevation um and that's us for Easter at elevation um and that's like maybe a little cheesier than I'd like maybe a little cheesier than I'd like maybe a little cheesier than I'd actually write it but but off the cuff actually write it but but off the cuff actually write it but but off the cuff that's on the spot on the spot that's that's on the spot on the spot that's that's on the spot on the spot that's good enough that gives you but that good enough that gives you but that good enough that gives you but that gives you kind of like the difference gives you kind of like the difference gives you kind of like the difference right where I'm I'm uh I'm I'm basing it

right where I'm I'm uh I'm I'm basing it right where I'm I'm uh I'm I'm basing it in scripture I'm pulling out like what in scripture I'm pulling out like what in scripture I'm pulling out like what we call like a felt need or attention we call like a felt need or attention we call like a felt need or attention and then I'm thinking about how does and then I'm thinking about how does and then I'm thinking about how does that matter the person who's already that matter the person who's already that matter the person who's already coming to church and what action step do coming to church and what action step do coming to church and what action step do I want them to take I want them to come I want them to take I want them to come I want them to take I want them to come and invite somebody how does that matter and invite somebody how does that matter and invite somebody how does that matter to somebody who doesn't come to church to somebody who doesn't come to church to somebody who doesn't come to church why would they even want to come um and why would they even want to come um and why would they even want to come um and and so kind of thinking about that both and so kind of thinking about that both and so kind of thinking about that both ways so you talked about the importance ways so you talked about the importance ways so you talked about the importance of making this big push for invitation of making this big push for invitation of making this big push for invitation at Easter bigger than Christmas there's at Easter bigger than Christmas there's at Easter bigger than Christmas there's the existing willingness for folks to the existing willingness for folks to the existing willingness for folks to come maybe region specific I'm confident come maybe region specific I'm confident come maybe region specific I'm confident that a big part of making those invites that a big part of making those invites that a big part of making those invites is empowering people in the existing is empowering people in the existing is empowering people in the existing Church to make those invites themselves Church to make those invites themselves Church to make those invites themselves personally so are you personally so are you personally so are you like resourcing folks with like hey when like resourcing folks with like hey when like resourcing folks with like hey when you invite them talk about it like this you invite them talk about it like this you invite them talk about it like this all over the all over the all over the place what does that actually look like place what does that actually look like place what does that actually look like are you handing out pamphlets are you handing out pamphlets are you handing out pamphlets like yes I mean we've done this so many like yes I mean we've done this so many like yes I mean we've done this so many ways so one thing that we do at all of ways so one thing that we do at all of ways so one thing that we do at all of our campuses is a Elevation Church is our campuses is a Elevation Church is our campuses is a Elevation Church is heavily volunteer Le um our our staff at heavily volunteer Le um our our staff at heavily volunteer Le um our our staff at campuses is low uh there there'll be campuses is low uh there there'll be campuses is low uh there there'll be like maybe four to 10 Camp staff members like maybe four to 10 Camp staff members like maybe four to 10 Camp staff members on a campus and so the rest of it is all on a campus and so the rest of it is all on a campus and so the rest of it is all volunteers and leaders and um and so we volunteers and leaders and um and so we volunteers and leaders and um and so we have a volunteer rally every Sunday and have a volunteer rally every Sunday and have a volunteer rally every Sunday and that's a really um important moment of that's a really um important moment of that's a really um important moment of investment on our campus um it will be investment on our campus um it will be investment on our campus um it will be right before we're expecting guests to right before we're expecting guests to right before we're expecting guests to arrive uh most campuses it's 45 minutes arrive uh most campuses it's 45 minutes arrive uh most campuses it's 45 minutes before church and we have this little before church and we have this little before church and we have this little this touch base of about 15 minutes and this touch base of about 15 minutes and this touch base of about 15 minutes and that right there is a really important

that right there is a really important that right there is a really important spot where we mobilize people with spot where we mobilize people with spot where we mobilize people with information with assets with uh how-tos information with assets with uh how-tos information with assets with uh how-tos with uh we'll have fun with it uh you with uh we'll have fun with it uh you with uh we'll have fun with it uh you know can our children's ministry or our know can our children's ministry or our know can our children's ministry or our guest experience team invite the most guest experience team invite the most guest experience team invite the most people to church let's see how you know people to church let's see how you know people to church let's see how you know we'll track it we have we have a great we'll track it we have we have a great we'll track it we have we have a great time with it or so we have fun with it time with it or so we have fun with it time with it or so we have fun with it we'll make it really spiritual uh we'll make it really spiritual uh we'll make it really spiritual uh everyone write down the first name of everyone write down the first name of everyone write down the first name of the person that you're inviting to the person that you're inviting to the person that you're inviting to church this Sunday we're going to pray church this Sunday we're going to pray church this Sunday we're going to pray over them together right now um uh over them together right now um uh over them together right now um uh partner up with the person next to you partner up with the person next to you partner up with the person next to you uh share the name first name of the uh share the name first name of the uh share the name first name of the person you're inviting this week pray person you're inviting this week pray person you're inviting this week pray over each other so so in our in a really over each other so so in our in a really over each other so so in our in a really intimate setting with among our intimate setting with among our intimate setting with among our volunteers that's more what it looks volunteers that's more what it looks volunteers that's more what it looks like like like but from stage uh when you're C when but from stage uh when you're C when but from stage uh when you're C when you're communicating to the whole you're communicating to the whole you're communicating to the whole congregation that looks like hey on your congregation that looks like hey on your congregation that looks like hey on your way out today we're going to give you way out today we're going to give you way out today we're going to give you five invites to Easter and we want you five invites to Easter and we want you five invites to Easter and we want you to hand these out to five people this to hand these out to five people this to hand these out to five people this week for sure you know five people that week for sure you know five people that week for sure you know five people that don't go to church anywhere that you don't go to church anywhere that you don't go to church anywhere that you think might come why not hand them an think might come why not hand them an think might come why not hand them an invite put it you know put it under invite put it you know put it under invite put it you know put it under their windshield wi whatever it is I their windshield wi whatever it is I their windshield wi whatever it is I we'll give them ideas but but just to we'll give them ideas but but just to we'll give them ideas but but just to kind of give you like the contrast there kind of give you like the contrast there kind of give you like the contrast there of how we would communicate that in of how we would communicate that in of how we would communicate that in different ways but we really try very different ways but we really try very different ways but we really try very hard um to put resources in people's hard um to put resources in people's hard um to put resources in people's hands so uh just like usually they're hands so uh just like usually they're hands so uh just like usually they're like little square invites or something like little square invites or something like little square invites or something like that um sometimes they're clever like that um sometimes they're clever like that um sometimes they're clever sometimes they're just really like clear sometimes they're just really like clear sometimes they're just really like clear but beautifully designed um we change but beautifully designed um we change but beautifully designed um we change them up but yeah it's that's a pretty them up but yeah it's that's a pretty them up but yeah it's that's a pretty big thing for us okay I got to ask it big thing for us okay I got to ask it big thing for us okay I got to ask it really stood out to me when you were really stood out to me when you were really stood out to me when you were describing language for invitation and I describing language for invitation and I describing language for invitation and I think it's really important here to

think it's really important here to think it's really important here to distinguish what Nikki's describing as distinguish what Nikki's describing as distinguish what Nikki's describing as the starting point for folks and then the starting point for folks and then the starting point for folks and then where you eventually get led to to when where you eventually get led to to when where you eventually get led to to when you actually attend church and how those you actually attend church and how those you actually attend church and how those are very very different the starting are very very different the starting are very very different the starting point is not the end point but you said point is not the end point but you said point is not the end point but you said one word we're not going to use in one word we're not going to use in one word we're not going to use in talking about Easter to folks that don't talking about Easter to folks that don't talking about Easter to folks that don't know anything about church is the word know anything about church is the word know anything about church is the word Resurrection I think saying we plead the Resurrection I think saying we plead the Resurrection I think saying we plead the blood of Christ over you I think it's blood of Christ over you I think it's blood of Christ over you I think it's understandable why we might not use that understandable why we might not use that understandable why we might not use that language but it's so common in church to language but it's so common in church to language but it's so common in church to be like you know what's next week be like you know what's next week be like you know what's next week Resurrection Sunday we often retitle Resurrection Sunday we often retitle Resurrection Sunday we often retitle Easter to put that directly into the Easter to put that directly into the Easter to put that directly into the name so can you talk about like the name so can you talk about like the name so can you talk about like the decision for why not to use something uh decision for why not to use something uh decision for why not to use something uh like that for someone that might be like like that for someone that might be like like that for someone that might be like wait a minute why can't we use wait a minute why can't we use wait a minute why can't we use that uh so just to like be clear we'll that uh so just to like be clear we'll that uh so just to like be clear we'll use that in church uh you'll hear Pastor use that in church uh you'll hear Pastor use that in church uh you'll hear Pastor Steven say that you'll hear our host say Steven say that you'll hear our host say Steven say that you'll hear our host say that from stage uh where we're not using that from stage uh where we're not using that from stage uh where we're not using that is outside um so uh and that's that is outside um so uh and that's that is outside um so uh and that's because uh Resurrection is not an because uh Resurrection is not an because uh Resurrection is not an everyday conversation if you talk to everyday conversation if you talk to everyday conversation if you talk to someone who doesn't know Christ they are someone who doesn't know Christ they are someone who doesn't know Christ they are never going to say the word resurrection never going to say the word resurrection never going to say the word resurrection that there just not like it's just not that there just not like it's just not that there just not like it's just not going to be it's not a word that's in going to be it's not a word that's in going to be it's not a word that's in normal language and so I instead of normal language and so I instead of normal language and so I instead of saying but they do know what Easter is saying but they do know what Easter is saying but they do know what Easter is they do know Easter Sunday and so so we they do know Easter Sunday and so so we they do know Easter Sunday and so so we don't christianize it in the in the don't christianize it in the in the don't christianize it in the in the language to people who are far from God language to people who are far from God language to people who are far from God um I'd rather say um Jesus was raised to um I'd rather say um Jesus was raised to um I'd rather say um Jesus was raised to life I'd rather say that Jesus came back life I'd rather say that Jesus came back life I'd rather say that Jesus came back to life again after dying for us I'd to life again after dying for us I'd to life again after dying for us I'd rather say that um it's clear you it's rather say that um it's clear you it's rather say that um it's clear you it's weird what how did that happen but still

weird what how did that happen but still weird what how did that happen but still like you get what I'm like you get what I'm like you get what I'm saying yeah and I love the the way that saying yeah and I love the the way that saying yeah and I love the the way that you've talked about hey here's how we're you've talked about hey here's how we're you've talked about hey here's how we're going to talk about with folks that are going to talk about with folks that are going to talk about with folks that are familiar with the language and here's familiar with the language and here's familiar with the language and here's how we're not going to talk about it so how we're not going to talk about it so how we're not going to talk about it so there's a source scripture and that there's a source scripture and that there's a source scripture and that Source scripture inspires two different Source scripture inspires two different Source scripture inspires two different expressions of the language so for expressions of the language so for expressions of the language so for instance you could say to someone that instance you could say to someone that instance you could say to someone that is not going to ever use the word is not going to ever use the word is not going to ever use the word Resurrection like Hey we're bringing Resurrection like Hey we're bringing Resurrection like Hey we're bringing hope out of hopelessness well what is hope out of hopelessness well what is hope out of hopelessness well what is that that's Resurrection you take that that's Resurrection you take that that's Resurrection you take something that's dead and you're something that's dead and you're something that's dead and you're bringing it back to life but it's an bringing it back to life but it's an bringing it back to life but it's an accessible language that someone that accessible language that someone that accessible language that someone that doesn't have any like experience with doesn't have any like experience with doesn't have any like experience with like wait wait what does resurrection like wait wait what does resurrection like wait wait what does resurrection mean it's the same meaning to them and mean it's the same meaning to them and mean it's the same meaning to them and you can meet them where they're at and you can meet them where they're at and you can meet them where they're at and then it sounds like hey once we're in then it sounds like hey once we're in then it sounds like hey once we're in church that's the whole point now we're church that's the whole point now we're church that's the whole point now we're going to lead them to where we want them going to lead them to where we want them going to lead them to where we want them to be yeah to be yeah to be yeah absolutely okay let's talk about ads you absolutely okay let's talk about ads you absolutely okay let's talk about ads you mentioned uh doing ads copy I'd love to mentioned uh doing ads copy I'd love to mentioned uh doing ads copy I'd love to know what are the advertising or know what are the advertising or know what are the advertising or Outreach platforms that elevation is Outreach platforms that elevation is Outreach platforms that elevation is seeing the most traction with right now seeing the most traction with right now seeing the most traction with right now I can't speak into that a lot um because I can't speak into that a lot um because I can't speak into that a lot um because I'm not behind the strategy of it um but I'm not behind the strategy of it um but I'm not behind the strategy of it um but we have we have all like the the basic we have we have all like the the basic we have we have all like the the basic spots that we certainly are very present spots that we certainly are very present spots that we certainly are very present on uh Facebook and Instagram uh we're on uh Facebook and Instagram uh we're on uh Facebook and Instagram uh we're having fun experimenting on Tik Tok having fun experimenting on Tik Tok having fun experimenting on Tik Tok still that's that's still like a growing still that's that's still like a growing still that's that's still like a growing space we experiment with it I don't space we experiment with it I don't space we experiment with it I don't think that's for everyone and I don't think that's for everyone and I don't think that's for everyone and I don't think it's for every Church um but I do think it's for every Church um but I do think it's for every Church um but I do think that Facebook and Instagram are think that Facebook and Instagram are think that Facebook and Instagram are for every church still um those uh you for every church still um those uh you for every church still um those uh you should be on there um but then uh should be on there um but then uh should be on there um but then uh outside of that it depends on what it is outside of that it depends on what it is outside of that it depends on what it is that we're advertising uh so we'll that we're advertising uh so we'll that we're advertising uh so we'll advertise on Spotify because we have

advertise on Spotify because we have advertise on Spotify because we have Elevation Worship of course um and we'll Elevation Worship of course um and we'll Elevation Worship of course um and we'll yeah and then it's really like um we yeah and then it's really like um we yeah and then it's really like um we advertise on Amazon Pastor just released advertise on Amazon Pastor just released advertise on Amazon Pastor just released his books so again advertising for that his books so again advertising for that his books so again advertising for that in different places it really just in different places it really just in different places it really just depends on like what we're talking about depends on like what we're talking about depends on like what we're talking about but I would say uh uh Google and Google but I would say uh uh Google and Google but I would say uh uh Google and Google Facebook Instagram are probably like our Facebook Instagram are probably like our Facebook Instagram are probably like our main spots easy okay let's talk about main spots easy okay let's talk about main spots easy okay let's talk about the copy then specifically uh what I'd the copy then specifically uh what I'd the copy then specifically uh what I'd love to hear like you've presumably been love to hear like you've presumably been love to hear like you've presumably been a big part of overseeing or directly a big part of overseeing or directly a big part of overseeing or directly writing a lot of different ad copy uh writing a lot of different ad copy uh writing a lot of different ad copy uh what what are some of you know your what what are some of you know your what what are some of you know your favorites that you've done over the favorites that you've done over the favorites that you've done over the years years years gosh any winners in your mind that gosh any winners in your mind that gosh any winners in your mind that you're like oh you know what I really you're like oh you know what I really you're like oh you know what I really crushed it I I I was in the lab I was in crushed it I I I was in the lab I was in crushed it I I I was in the lab I was in my bag and we just this one got so many my bag and we just this one got so many my bag and we just this one got so many people saved people saved people saved okay okay okay I I can't I can't recite for you I I can't I can't recite for you I I can't I can't recite for you something that I feel that way about but something that I feel that way about but something that I feel that way about but I will tell you the ones that I feel I will tell you the ones that I feel I will tell you the ones that I feel most proud of uh have been most proud of uh have been most proud of uh have been fun um yeah I think people fun um yeah I think people fun um yeah I think people um and not like so one of the ways we um and not like so one of the ways we um and not like so one of the ways we have even more specific ways to when I have even more specific ways to when I have even more specific ways to when I teach Elevation Church voice I teach teach Elevation Church voice I teach teach Elevation Church voice I teach there's a lot more to it and one of the there's a lot more to it and one of the there's a lot more to it and one of the things I say is that we are fun but not things I say is that we are fun but not things I say is that we are fun but not silly and I think that's like an silly and I think that's like an silly and I think that's like an important distinction as well um our important distinction as well um our important distinction as well um our culture is fun it's important to us that culture is fun it's important to us that culture is fun it's important to us that people can be light-hearted um uh life people can be light-hearted um uh life people can be light-hearted um uh life is heavy and so it doesn't always have is heavy and so it doesn't always have is heavy and so it doesn't always have to be heavy we can have fun um and uh

to be heavy we can have fun um and uh to be heavy we can have fun um and uh there I remember um um there there have there I remember um um there there have there I remember um um there there have been an Easter one and a Christmas one been an Easter one and a Christmas one been an Easter one and a Christmas one that we've done with kids in them and that we've done with kids in them and that we've done with kids in them and kids are easy people love kids and we kids are easy people love kids and we kids are easy people love kids and we use staff kids that keeps us safe um but use staff kids that keeps us safe um but use staff kids that keeps us safe um but yeah uh but um uh kids are endearing yeah uh but um uh kids are endearing yeah uh but um uh kids are endearing it's hard not to smile at kids not to be it's hard not to smile at kids not to be it's hard not to smile at kids not to be like oh look at that I'm going to lean like oh look at that I'm going to lean like oh look at that I'm going to lean in a little more uh that doesn't feel in a little more uh that doesn't feel in a little more uh that doesn't feel like so serious I don't feel like I'm like so serious I don't feel like I'm like so serious I don't feel like I'm going to feel judged by that right um going to feel judged by that right um going to feel judged by that right um it's very approachable and I think it's very approachable and I think it's very approachable and I think advertising advertising advertising needs to be approachable so that would needs to be approachable so that would needs to be approachable so that would be a good example I suppose of fun but be a good example I suppose of fun but be a good example I suppose of fun but not silly not silly not silly exactly yeah I feel like if it was me exactly yeah I feel like if it was me exactly yeah I feel like if it was me that's an important you would need to that's an important you would need to that's an important you would need to teach that to me be okay bra fun not teach that to me be okay bra fun not teach that to me be okay bra fun not silly because I feel like it would silly because I feel like it would silly because I feel like it would descend a little blurry there that's descend a little blurry there that's descend a little blurry there that's that's pretty juvenile there son I got that's pretty juvenile there son I got that's pretty juvenile there son I got there pretty quickly we we have this there pretty quickly we we have this there pretty quickly we we have this line that we use for because we have line that we use for because we have line that we use for because we have some particular staff members who cross some particular staff members who cross some particular staff members who cross that line and and uh and we say uh well that line and and uh and we say uh well that line and and uh and we say uh well you don't know the line until you cross you don't know the line until you cross you don't know the line until you cross it it it and there are some of them that cross it and there are some of them that cross it and there are some of them that cross it more than okay then this was not planned more than okay then this was not planned more than okay then this was not planned but I got to ask this you know one of but I got to ask this you know one of but I got to ask this you know one of the Elevation Church posts that came the Elevation Church posts that came the Elevation Church posts that came across my feed this year and frankly across my feed this year and frankly across my feed this year and frankly I've talked about it as a big fan of it I've talked about it as a big fan of it I've talked about it as a big fan of it supportive of it um feels like it might supportive of it um feels like it might supportive of it um feels like it might have crossed into the silly territory have crossed into the silly territory have crossed into the silly territory and that was the uh SpongeBob karaoke and that was the uh SpongeBob karaoke and that was the uh SpongeBob karaoke cover of one of the hill song worship cover of one of the hill song worship cover of one of the hill song worship songs I did that one slip through there songs I did that one slip through there songs I did that one slip through there Nikki or what Nikki or what Nikki or what happened I need to know who posted that

happened I need to know who posted that happened I need to know who posted that one it was it I feel like it was one it was it I feel like it was one it was it I feel like it was probably our youth account or it was yes probably our youth account or it was yes probably our youth account or it was yes on the on the on the youth account on the on the on the youth account on the on the on the youth account they're allowed to be silly they're they're allowed to be silly they're they're allowed to be silly they're allowed to be Sly the youth account is allowed to be Sly the youth account is allowed to be Sly the youth account is very they go Rogue a little bit so you very they go Rogue a little bit so you very they go Rogue a little bit so you can see it in her eyes she looked to the can see it in her eyes she looked to the can see it in her eyes she looked to the side she's like the youth every single side she's like the youth every single side she's like the youth every single senior leader listening knows that senior leader listening knows that senior leader listening knows that feeling what did the youth group do this feeling what did the youth group do this feeling what did the youth group do this time they did what you and so but just time they did what you and so but just time they did what you and so but just like very candidly you got to let them a like very candidly you got to let them a like very candidly you got to let them a little bit um uh their their demographic little bit um uh their their demographic little bit um uh their their demographic is different than the whole church it's is different than the whole church it's is different than the whole church it's very zero in certainly and um and so I very zero in certainly and um and so I very zero in certainly and um and so I don't want to post that and I don't want don't want to post that and I don't want don't want to post that and I don't want our church account to post that um and I our church account to post that um and I our church account to post that um and I will call them out if they spell will call them out if they spell will call them out if they spell something wrong but other than something wrong but other than something wrong but other than that other than that um uh they can have that other than that um uh they can have that other than that um uh they can have fun with it because um teenagers need to fun with it because um teenagers need to fun with it because um teenagers need to be able in my I have a teenager I'm a be able in my I have a teenager I'm a be able in my I have a teenager I'm a mom um and teenagers need to be able to mom um and teenagers need to be able to mom um and teenagers need to be able to find Church approachable too and so just find Church approachable too and so just find Church approachable too and so just like a little aside there go ahead and like a little aside there go ahead and like a little aside there go ahead and let your youth ministry set up their own let your youth ministry set up their own let your youth ministry set up their own account keep eyes on it keep them in the account keep eyes on it keep them in the account keep eyes on it keep them in the guard guard rails but like theirs can be guard guard rails but like theirs can be guard guard rails but like theirs can be wider than yours you know Nikki you just wider than yours you know Nikki you just wider than yours you know Nikki you just you just use the word demographic there you just use the word demographic there you just use the word demographic there to give to give your youth account a to give to give your youth account a to give to give your youth account a little bit more license to be maybe a little bit more license to be maybe a little bit more license to be maybe a little bit more silly and that seems to little bit more silly and that seems to little bit more silly and that seems to be the Common Thread that has been just be the Common Thread that has been just be the Common Thread that has been just like quietly weaved throughout this like quietly weaved throughout this like quietly weaved throughout this entire conversation is that in just entire conversation is that in just entire conversation is that in just about everything you've said you have about everything you've said you have about everything you've said you have revealed that the decisions that you're revealed that the decisions that you're revealed that the decisions that you're making whether it's on social or the making whether it's on social or the making whether it's on social or the Elevation Church voice whatever it is Elevation Church voice whatever it is Elevation Church voice whatever it is are in informed by the people you're

are in informed by the people you're are in informed by the people you're talking to and by having a a really talking to and by having a a really talking to and by having a a really acute awareness of who you're talking to acute awareness of who you're talking to acute awareness of who you're talking to and why you're talking to to them and to and why you're talking to to them and to and why you're talking to to them and to me as a pastor that's like that feels me as a pastor that's like that feels me as a pastor that's like that feels very pastoral in nature that like you very pastoral in nature that like you very pastoral in nature that like you know the people you are talking to or know the people you are talking to or know the people you are talking to or that you want to talk to they are known that you want to talk to they are known that you want to talk to they are known and you are addressing them in a way and you are addressing them in a way and you are addressing them in a way that's appropriate for them in a way that's appropriate for them in a way that's appropriate for them in a way that's attractive to them and so I just that's attractive to them and so I just that's attractive to them and so I just want to ask you like in your role um I I want to ask you like in your role um I I want to ask you like in your role um I I forget what your actual uh what your forget what your actual uh what your forget what your actual uh what your actual job title is but in your role actual job title is but in your role actual job title is but in your role like does it feel like the work that like does it feel like the work that like does it feel like the work that you're doing is pastoral in nature you're doing is pastoral in nature you're doing is pastoral in nature absolutely I absolutely I absolutely I um uh it's very I feel like I feel like um uh it's very I feel like I feel like um uh it's very I feel like I feel like I have a very pastoral role um because I I have a very pastoral role um because I I have a very pastoral role um because I get to have get to have get to have um I get to have this really zoomed out um I get to have this really zoomed out um I get to have this really zoomed out view um of people and to try to view um of people and to try to view um of people and to try to notice um what I'm seeing the different notice um what I'm seeing the different notice um what I'm seeing the different demographics leaning into and needing demographics leaning into and needing demographics leaning into and needing and that kind of a thing and and that kind of a thing and and that kind of a thing and um and I I think a lot of times in um and I I think a lot of times in um and I I think a lot of times in Ministry so I have been in the past uh Ministry so I have been in the past uh Ministry so I have been in the past uh we were we were at a previous small we were we were at a previous small we were we were at a previous small Church in Vermont a little closer to you Church in Vermont a little closer to you Church in Vermont a little closer to you guys and um and I was in U more pastoral guys and um and I was in U more pastoral guys and um and I was in U more pastoral what we would call classically pastoral what we would call classically pastoral what we would call classically pastoral Ministry there and um and I think uh a Ministry there and um and I think uh a Ministry there and um and I think uh a beautiful thing that's happened in beautiful thing that's happened in beautiful thing that's happened in churches is uh that we've really like churches is uh that we've really like churches is uh that we've really like expanded expanded expanded uh what Ministry can look like and in

uh what Ministry can look like and in uh what Ministry can look like and in the different ways that God can use the different ways that God can use the different ways that God can use different people's um gifts talents different people's um gifts talents different people's um gifts talents experience um perspective to to Really F experience um perspective to to Really F experience um perspective to to Really F A need that someone else maybe you have A need that someone else maybe you have A need that someone else maybe you have a senior pastor who's great at a senior pastor who's great at a senior pastor who's great at communicating from stage but he's not communicating from stage but he's not communicating from stage but he's not good at written good at written good at written communication right uh imagine someone communication right uh imagine someone communication right uh imagine someone partnering with him um to learn to write partnering with him um to learn to write partnering with him um to learn to write in the voice that he speaks in um um to in the voice that he speaks in um um to in the voice that he speaks in um um to help him translate that um in other help him translate that um in other help him translate that um in other spaces in written form like what a spaces in written form like what a spaces in written form like what a beautiful Ministry um I wrote down I beautiful Ministry um I wrote down I beautiful Ministry um I wrote down I actually wrote down some questions I had actually wrote down some questions I had actually wrote down some questions I had a feeling you were going to ask me this a feeling you were going to ask me this a feeling you were going to ask me this um because I feel like this would be um because I feel like this would be um because I feel like this would be helpful to your listeners I have some helpful to your listeners I have some helpful to your listeners I have some questions that help me decide um uh what questions that help me decide um uh what questions that help me decide um uh what I'm going to say and how I'm going to I'm going to say and how I'm going to I'm going to say and how I'm going to say it outstanding let's do it okay I say it outstanding let's do it okay I say it outstanding let's do it okay I have it's just four questions they're have it's just four questions they're have it's just four questions they're not they're not hard who am I speaking not they're not hard who am I speaking not they're not hard who am I speaking to um that's that's where I start and so to um that's that's where I start and so to um that's that's where I start and so is it a small group of people a large is it a small group of people a large is it a small group of people a large group of people um are is there a group of people um are is there a group of people um are is there a particular age demographic about them uh particular age demographic about them uh particular age demographic about them uh do they live in a certain place um is it do they live in a certain place um is it do they live in a certain place um is it very broad is it very narrow just really very broad is it very narrow just really very broad is it very narrow just really try to like think about that um and then try to like think about that um and then try to like think about that um and then what do I want them to hear um and this what do I want them to hear um and this what do I want them to hear um and this is very different from what do I want to is very different from what do I want to is very different from what do I want to say um because what I want to say and say um because what I want to say and say um because what I want to say and what they might hear might be two what they might hear might be two what they might hear might be two different things I might need to say it different things I might need to say it different things I might need to say it in a different way than I want to say it in a different way than I want to say it in a different way than I want to say it in order for them to hear it the the way in order for them to hear it the the way in order for them to hear it the the way that I want them to hear it and so what that I want them to hear it and so what that I want them to hear it and so what do I want them to hear excuse do I want them to hear excuse do I want them to hear excuse me and then um what do I want them to do

me and then um what do I want them to do me and then um what do I want them to do uh so there should be some kind of call uh so there should be some kind of call uh so there should be some kind of call to action right um do I want them to to action right um do I want them to to action right um do I want them to come to Easter do I want them to pray come to Easter do I want them to pray come to Easter do I want them to pray for something but I should be clear I for something but I should be clear I for something but I should be clear I should be clear in who I'm speaking to should be clear in who I'm speaking to should be clear in who I'm speaking to what I want them to hear and what I want what I want them to hear and what I want what I want them to hear and what I want them to do and then how do I want them them to do and then how do I want them them to do and then how do I want them to to to feel um because imagine if I'm super feel um because imagine if I'm super feel um because imagine if I'm super clear in all of that but it's like so clear in all of that but it's like so clear in all of that but it's like so direct that it's offputting M right yeah direct that it's offputting M right yeah direct that it's offputting M right yeah so how do I want them to feel when they so how do I want them to feel when they so how do I want them to feel when they when they engage with my content okay I when they engage with my content okay I when they engage with my content okay I have an extremely practical example of have an extremely practical example of have an extremely practical example of what she just said that I did today and what she just said that I did today and what she just said that I did today and the reason I'm bringing up my experience the reason I'm bringing up my experience the reason I'm bringing up my experience is because yes we share a last name but is because yes we share a last name but is because yes we share a last name but when Nikki said that she cared how AM when Nikki said that she cared how AM when Nikki said that she cared how AM and PM were stylized I knew that we were and PM were stylized I knew that we were and PM were stylized I knew that we were Kindred Kindred Kindred Spirits I like okay it's not just the Spirits I like okay it's not just the Spirits I like okay it's not just the last name so today we had a church last name so today we had a church last name so today we had a church upload a sermon file late to us so for upload a sermon file late to us so for upload a sermon file late to us so for context Nikki we prepare uh social media context Nikki we prepare uh social media context Nikki we prepare uh social media content for churches that's one of the content for churches that's one of the content for churches that's one of the services that we we we do so we need services that we we we do so we need services that we we we do so we need sermons to be uploaded by Tuesday at sermons to be uploaded by Tuesday at sermons to be uploaded by Tuesday at midnight and this sermon came in late midnight and this sermon came in late midnight and this sermon came in late and it's really tough for us to turn it and it's really tough for us to turn it and it's really tough for us to turn it around when it comes in late and so what around when it comes in late and so what around when it comes in late and so what we've done is we've implemented this we've done is we've implemented this we've done is we've implemented this hard deadline most churches get it to us hard deadline most churches get it to us hard deadline most churches get it to us on Sunday if it doesn't come in before on Sunday if it doesn't come in before on Sunday if it doesn't come in before uh Tuesday midnight Pacific we can't get uh Tuesday midnight Pacific we can't get uh Tuesday midnight Pacific we can't get get it done so we had this pre-written get it done so we had this pre-written get it done so we had this pre-written email to reply to this church and one of email to reply to this church and one of email to reply to this church and one of our editors sent it to them and the our editors sent it to them and the our editors sent it to them and the church uh did not care for this email church uh did not care for this email church uh did not care for this email and they replied like hey are you and they replied like hey are you and they replied like hey are you serious like this is the first time this serious like this is the first time this serious like this is the first time this has happened like are we going to get a

has happened like are we going to get a has happened like are we going to get a refund like come on and my editor was refund like come on and my editor was refund like come on and my editor was like I thought like we communicated like I thought like we communicated like I thought like we communicated clearly this deadline like why are they clearly this deadline like why are they clearly this deadline like why are they like getting emotional about this and I like getting emotional about this and I like getting emotional about this and I said well I think it might be the copy said well I think it might be the copy said well I think it might be the copy uh because what they said was and I uh because what they said was and I uh because what they said was and I quote it was it was we will not prepare quote it was it was we will not prepare quote it was it was we will not prepare this sermon for you because it is after this sermon for you because it is after this sermon for you because it is after our deadline and I said when you our deadline and I said when you our deadline and I said when you communicated as we will not communicated as we will not communicated as we will not there's agency in your decision you are there's agency in your decision you are there's agency in your decision you are the judge and jury and have said look I the judge and jury and have said look I the judge and jury and have said look I could do this but I'm not going to and I could do this but I'm not going to and I could do this but I'm not going to and I said we need to change this script to said we need to change this script to said we need to change this script to say we are unable to complete sermons I say we are unable to complete sermons I say we are unable to complete sermons I said because now we've removed the said because now we've removed the said because now we've removed the agency it's not that we don't want to agency it's not that we don't want to agency it's not that we don't want to we'd love to it's just that there are we'd love to it's just that there are we'd love to it's just that there are very real deadlines and there's simply very real deadlines and there's simply very real deadlines and there's simply not enough time in the day so we we we not enough time in the day so we we we not enough time in the day so we we we we physically literally cannot and I we physically literally cannot and I we physically literally cannot and I said if we don't change this every time said if we don't change this every time said if we don't change this every time we send this email out it's going to put we send this email out it's going to put we send this email out it's going to put the church on their back foot the church on their back foot the church on their back foot immediately immediately immediately because how we're making them feel is because how we're making them feel is because how we're making them feel is we're very corporate we're very direct we're very corporate we're very direct we're very corporate we're very direct and we're very like we will not do this and we're very like we will not do this and we're very like we will not do this so tough luck um so hopefully that so tough luck um so hopefully that so tough luck um so hopefully that serves as a practical example for maybe serves as a practical example for maybe serves as a practical example for maybe you know in terms of I I actually think you know in terms of I I actually think you know in terms of I I actually think this applies to feedback too um you can this applies to feedback too um you can this applies to feedback too um you can be clear and be clear and be clear and kind I think um a lot of times uh in an kind I think um a lot of times uh in an kind I think um a lot of times uh in an effort to be clear um we end up being effort to be clear um we end up being effort to be clear um we end up being harsh and I'm like well that's just how harsh and I'm like well that's just how harsh and I'm like well that's just how it is and you know uh sorry I speak the it is and you know uh sorry I speak the it is and you know uh sorry I speak the truth I truth I truth I yeah that's it um and you don't need to yeah that's it um and you don't need to yeah that's it um and you don't need to be that way especially because you have be that way especially because you have be that way especially because you have access to AI so if say you're a person access to AI so if say you're a person access to AI so if say you're a person who just is not a nice Communicator you

who just is not a nice Communicator you who just is not a nice Communicator you can put it into Ai and say make this can put it into Ai and say make this can put it into Ai and say make this nicer make this more so good there's no nicer make this more so good there's no nicer make this more so good there's no excuse AI discipling us to be more like excuse AI discipling us to be more like excuse AI discipling us to be more like Jesus in the way we talk well it is one Jesus in the way we talk well it is one Jesus in the way we talk well it is one of the benefits of working remotely you of the benefits of working remotely you of the benefits of working remotely you don't have to talk to someone face to don't have to talk to someone face to don't have to talk to someone face to face hear what they have to say before face hear what they have to say before face hear what they have to say before you slack them back seek the Lord then you slack them back seek the Lord then you slack them back seek the Lord then seek Ai and that way and and that can seek Ai and that way and and that can seek Ai and that way and and that can teach you like oh okay so that's how teach you like oh okay so that's how teach you like oh okay so that's how you'd say it you know and look those are you'd say it you know and look those are you'd say it you know and look those are those language models have been trained those language models have been trained those language models have been trained by you know hundreds of millions of by you know hundreds of millions of by you know hundreds of millions of input presumably the kind people have input presumably the kind people have input presumably the kind people have told the AI how to talk we're not yet told the AI how to talk we're not yet told the AI how to talk we're not yet kind we're learning I love it yes please kind we're learning I love it yes please kind we're learning I love it yes please deliver this feedback in the voice of deliver this feedback in the voice of deliver this feedback in the voice of Fred Rogers oh yeah yeah you you love Mr Fred Rogers oh yeah yeah you you love Mr Fred Rogers oh yeah yeah you you love Mr Rogers I love Mr Rogers yeah yeah in Rogers I love Mr Rogers yeah yeah in Rogers I love Mr Rogers yeah yeah in Canada we had Mr dress up oh that's Canada we had Mr dress up oh that's Canada we had Mr dress up oh that's interesting yeah yeah kind of like the interesting yeah yeah kind of like the interesting yeah yeah kind of like the knockoff we have a lot knockoff things knockoff we have a lot knockoff things knockoff we have a lot knockoff things where it's like you know this is what where it's like you know this is what where it's like you know this is what they do and then this is what you know they do and then this is what you know they do and then this is what you know you have the NFL we have the CFL the you have the NFL we have the CFL the you have the NFL we have the CFL the Canadian Football League uhhuh just Canadian Football League uhhuh just Canadian Football League uhhuh just lower budgets generally yeah lower lower budgets generally yeah lower lower budgets generally yeah lower viewership that's fair that's fair uh viewership that's fair that's fair uh viewership that's fair that's fair uh this has been an outstanding this has been an outstanding this has been an outstanding conversation Nikki very grateful for conversation Nikki very grateful for conversation Nikki very grateful for your time especially during a busy your time especially during a busy your time especially during a busy Easter season where you're surely Easter season where you're surely Easter season where you're surely overseeing many responsibilities is overseeing many responsibilities is overseeing many responsibilities is there anything uh you know parting words there anything uh you know parting words there anything uh you know parting words of wisdom that you'd like to leave for of wisdom that you'd like to leave for of wisdom that you'd like to leave for many of the churches listening uh that many of the churches listening uh that many of the churches listening uh that uh you know are in different situations uh you know are in different situations uh you know are in different situations smaller situations but I think so many smaller situations but I think so many smaller situations but I think so many of the things that we've talked about of the things that we've talked about of the things that we've talked about are truly are truly are truly Universal I just think that for every

Universal I just think that for every Universal I just think that for every Ministry regardless of the size if you Ministry regardless of the size if you Ministry regardless of the size if you know what you're trying to do and who know what you're trying to do and who know what you're trying to do and who you're trying to do it for and you can you're trying to do it for and you can you're trying to do it for and you can clearly Define the way that you want to clearly Define the way that you want to clearly Define the way that you want to do that you don't need a lot of people do that you don't need a lot of people do that you don't need a lot of people to do that um but you can have uh one of to do that um but you can have uh one of to do that um but you can have uh one of the phrases that we use is focus the phrases that we use is focus the phrases that we use is focus Excellence it's really important to us Excellence it's really important to us Excellence it's really important to us um and you can do that uh you don't need um and you can do that uh you don't need um and you can do that uh you don't need a lot of people to do that you don't a lot of people to do that you don't a lot of people to do that you don't need a lot of resources I recommend um need a lot of resources I recommend um need a lot of resources I recommend um getting grammarly uh I recommend uh getting grammarly uh I recommend uh getting grammarly uh I recommend uh using AI uh don't these things are not I using AI uh don't these things are not I using AI uh don't these things are not I use them I'm a professional I have a use them I'm a professional I have a use them I'm a professional I have a copyrighting team I use them um and so copyrighting team I use them um and so copyrighting team I use them um and so uh use the tools at your disposal don't uh use the tools at your disposal don't uh use the tools at your disposal don't make things hard on yourself um and uh make things hard on yourself um and uh make things hard on yourself um and uh and I don't know let's go like win more and I don't know let's go like win more and I don't know let's go like win more people for Christ there you go yeah people for Christ there you go yeah people for Christ there you go yeah praise God anything uh that you wish to praise God anything uh that you wish to praise God anything uh that you wish to plug either on your own behalf for plug either on your own behalf for plug either on your own behalf for behalf of the church I mean if you behalf of the church I mean if you behalf of the church I mean if you haven't gotten Pastor Steven's new book haven't gotten Pastor Steven's new book haven't gotten Pastor Steven's new book do the new you you're out of your do the new you you're out of your do the new you you're out of your mind I um I got to read it way ahead of mind I um I got to read it way ahead of mind I um I got to read it way ahead of time um it's excellent it's helpful it's time um it's excellent it's helpful it's time um it's excellent it's helpful it's practical um and I'm just excited for practical um and I'm just excited for practical um and I'm just excited for everybody to get their hands on it also everybody to get their hands on it also everybody to get their hands on it also the plug I'll give you is the audio book the plug I'll give you is the audio book the plug I'll give you is the audio book is is read by him and it has bonus is is read by him and it has bonus is is read by him and it has bonus content on it is this the first time content on it is this the first time content on it is this the first time that he's done the audio book I don't that he's done the audio book I don't that he's done the audio book I don't know it might be it's uh this is the know it might be it's uh this is the know it might be it's uh this is the first book He's released in eight years first book He's released in eight years first book He's released in eight years so all of his previous books uh were so all of his previous books uh were so all of his previous books uh were were eight years or were eight years or were eight years or older wow I am an audiobook listener older wow I am an audiobook listener older wow I am an audiobook listener almost exclusively and it is always a almost exclusively and it is always a almost exclusively and it is always a huge benefit when I know that I'm huge benefit when I know that I'm huge benefit when I know that I'm listening to the author you can just

listening to the author you can just listening to the author you can just like feel the you know hours and hours like feel the you know hours and hours like feel the you know hours and hours of work that they've poured into the of work that they've poured into the of work that they've poured into the material and it kind of just like comes material and it kind of just like comes material and it kind of just like comes out into the performance of the the out into the performance of the the out into the performance of the the reading of the audiobook so that's great reading of the audiobook so that's great reading of the audiobook so that's great to hear you can find that on Audible to hear you can find that on Audible to hear you can find that on Audible find the book anywhere where books are find the book anywhere where books are find the book anywhere where books are sold online or in person and thank you sold online or in person and thank you sold online or in person and thank you to Nikki thanks as always to everyone to Nikki thanks as always to everyone to Nikki thanks as always to everyone for their time attention and Trust we'll for their time attention and Trust we'll for their time attention and Trust we'll talk to you real talk to you real talk to you real soon we're watching soon we're watching soon we're watching Trust no I don't know what that is Trust no I don't know what that is Trust no I don't know what that is really did you just make something up really did you just make something up really did you just make something up nope it's another reality game show it's nope it's another reality game show it's nope it's another reality game show it's like does it involve trust yeah