7 Key Insights to Shape Your Church in 2025 | 2024 Executive Pastors Survey Results

hey friends my name is Rich Burch hey friends my name is Rich Burch welcome to this summary presentation welcome to this summary presentation welcome to this summary presentation about the 2024 national executive about the 2024 national executive about the 2024 national executive pastors survey we're going to go through pastors survey we're going to go through pastors survey we're going to go through some key insights that we hope might some key insights that we hope might some key insights that we hope might help uh shape your church for this year help uh shape your church for this year help uh shape your church for this year this is the fifth year that we've done this is the fifth year that we've done this is the fifth year that we've done this survey uh we do it every year in this survey uh we do it every year in this survey uh we do it every year in December deliberately uh because we're December deliberately uh because we're December deliberately uh because we're trying to catch a pulse really as we trying to catch a pulse really as we trying to catch a pulse really as we turn from one year to the uh the next we turn from one year to the uh the next we turn from one year to the uh the next we have hundreds of executive pastors every have hundreds of executive pastors every have hundreds of executive pastors every year who help us with this and it really year who help us with this and it really year who help us with this and it really gives us a sense of what's happening in gives us a sense of what's happening in gives us a sense of what's happening in the church we've been able to track some the church we've been able to track some the church we've been able to track some Trends uh over this year and so what we Trends uh over this year and so what we Trends uh over this year and so what we want to do is give you some insights want to do is give you some insights want to do is give you some insights that you can apply to your church not that you can apply to your church not that you can apply to your church not just kind of what's happening in the just kind of what's happening in the just kind of what's happening in the church in general but hopefully some church in general but hopefully some church in general but hopefully some things that might help you as you think things that might help you as you think things that might help you as you think and wrestle through these issues at un and wrestle through these issues at un and wrestle through these issues at un Seminary we love executive pastors Seminary we love executive pastors Seminary we love executive pastors that's where my background is in that that's where my background is in that that's where my background is in that second chair Pro really leading at the second chair Pro really leading at the second chair Pro really leading at the intersection of vision and execution intersection of vision and execution intersection of vision and execution that's where we lead and we're just so that's where we lead and we're just so that's where we lead and we're just so honored that you uh would take some time honored that you uh would take some time honored that you uh would take some time to listen to this presentation and to to listen to this presentation and to to listen to this presentation and to think about and reflect on uh where think about and reflect on uh where think about and reflect on uh where things are at in your church so let's things are at in your church so let's things are at in your church so let's dive in with some insights for this year dive in with some insights for this year dive in with some insights for this year so the first one I would say this is a so the first one I would say this is a so the first one I would say this is a big Insight hybrid worship is here to big Insight hybrid worship is here to big Insight hybrid worship is here to stay stay stay 86.8% of churches offer both in person 86.8% of churches offer both in person 86.8% of churches offer both in person and online this is up from 79% last year and online this is up from 79% last year and online this is up from 79% last year and those churches that are offering and those churches that are offering and those churches that are offering just online only are less than 1% and

just online only are less than 1% and just online only are less than 1% and shrinking this is this is an interesting shrinking this is this is an interesting shrinking this is this is an interesting Insight listen last year 2024 there were Insight listen last year 2024 there were Insight listen last year 2024 there were many kind of high-profile churches many many kind of high-profile churches many many kind of high-profile churches many is too strong of a word there were a few is too strong of a word there were a few is too strong of a word there were a few high-profile churches that made a big high-profile churches that made a big high-profile churches that made a big deal about the fact that they were deal about the fact that they were deal about the fact that they were getting out of church online were not getting out of church online were not getting out of church online were not doing online anymore and I was saying at doing online anymore and I was saying at doing online anymore and I was saying at the time don't do it friends that is bad the time don't do it friends that is bad the time don't do it friends that is bad thinking uh you know was interesting thinking uh you know was interesting thinking uh you know was interesting over the course of this thing as we've over the course of this thing as we've over the course of this thing as we've been doing this survey I remember early been doing this survey I remember early been doing this survey I remember early in 2020 there were a whole group of in 2020 there were a whole group of in 2020 there were a whole group of churches that were and leaders that were churches that were and leaders that were churches that were and leaders that were kind of on the opposite end of the kind of on the opposite end of the kind of on the opposite end of the spectrum they were saying we're all spectrum they were saying we're all spectrum they were saying we're all we're going all in we're never going we're going all in we're never going we're going all in we're never going back to inperson worship it's going to back to inperson worship it's going to back to inperson worship it's going to be online all the time and I was like uh be online all the time and I was like uh be online all the time and I was like uh raised my hand I was like uh I don't raised my hand I was like uh I don't raised my hand I was like uh I don't think that's true we've had 2,000 years think that's true we've had 2,000 years think that's true we've had 2,000 years of in-person services I think there is of in-person services I think there is of in-person services I think there is something about the gathered Body of something about the gathered Body of something about the gathered Body of Christ please we are going to get back Christ please we are going to get back Christ please we are going to get back into into into inperson but then now it's like the inperson but then now it's like the inperson but then now it's like the pendulum swung the other way and people pendulum swung the other way and people pendulum swung the other way and people are like we're getting rid of the online are like we're getting rid of the online are like we're getting rid of the online stuff friends what we're seeing is that stuff friends what we're seeing is that stuff friends what we're seeing is that that is just not the case with the that is just not the case with the that is just not the case with the majority of churches out there uh Church majority of churches out there uh Church majority of churches out there uh Church going forward is hybrid is both online going forward is hybrid is both online going forward is hybrid is both online and in person we know that a high and in person we know that a high and in person we know that a high percentage 90 some odd percent of the percentage 90 some odd percent of the percentage 90 some odd percent of the guests that arrive at your church are guests that arrive at your church are guests that arrive at your church are going to check you out online on your going to check you out online on your going to check you out online on your Church online experience on YouTube on Church online experience on YouTube on Church online experience on YouTube on social media this is important so you social media this is important so you social media this is important so you need to build a screen to seat need to build a screen to seat need to build a screen to seat assimilation process your website is the assimilation process your website is the assimilation process your website is the beginning of the assimilation process beginning of the assimilation process beginning of the assimilation process what you're doing on your app to engage

what you're doing on your app to engage what you're doing on your app to engage people during the week is a critical people during the week is a critical people during the week is a critical piece of this puzzle so you're going to piece of this puzzle so you're going to piece of this puzzle so you're going to want to uh be thinking about this as we want to uh be thinking about this as we want to uh be thinking about this as we go forward we really want you uh also to go forward we really want you uh also to go forward we really want you uh also to be thinking about the fact that you can be thinking about the fact that you can be thinking about the fact that you can use your online tools not just to invite use your online tools not just to invite use your online tools not just to invite your people to um you know come to your people to um you know come to your people to um you know come to in-person service but actually call out in-person service but actually call out in-person service but actually call out the fact that hey you know what a great the fact that hey you know what a great the fact that hey you know what a great thing you could do out of today if thing you could do out of today if thing you could do out of today if you've been impacted by today's mess you've been impacted by today's mess you've been impacted by today's mess message why not invite that your people message why not invite that your people message why not invite that your people to share that message or the clips or to share that message or the clips or to share that message or the clips or YouTube stuff or Tik Tok you know to YouTube stuff or Tik Tok you know to YouTube stuff or Tik Tok you know to share that with their friends um we want share that with their friends um we want share that with their friends um we want to really invest in both online and to really invest in both online and to really invest in both online and in-person experiences that really um in-person experiences that really um in-person experiences that really um maintain consistency and Excellence it maintain consistency and Excellence it maintain consistency and Excellence it should feel like your Church's should feel like your Church's should feel like your Church's experience when you're coming online and experience when you're coming online and experience when you're coming online and I it doesn't bother me um and this is a I it doesn't bother me um and this is a I it doesn't bother me um and this is a strategy question really but it doesn't strategy question really but it doesn't strategy question really but it doesn't bother me if um there are things that bother me if um there are things that bother me if um there are things that we're doing in our in-person experiences we're doing in our in-person experiences we're doing in our in-person experiences that we can't replicate um online that we can't replicate um online that we can't replicate um online because our pathway is about screen because our pathway is about screen because our pathway is about screen deceit we are hoping to drive people deceit we are hoping to drive people deceit we are hoping to drive people from online and ultimately getting them from online and ultimately getting them from online and ultimately getting them to come in person uh that's a part of to come in person uh that's a part of to come in person uh that's a part of what we're doing so if you're thinking what we're doing so if you're thinking what we're doing so if you're thinking about getting rid of online please about getting rid of online please about getting rid of online please please do not do that uh I know a few please do not do that uh I know a few please do not do that uh I know a few churches did that last year and you know churches did that last year and you know churches did that last year and you know I've commented about that in other I've commented about that in other I've commented about that in other context but this what this clearly shows context but this what this clearly shows context but this what this clearly shows is that people are doing both and we're is that people are doing both and we're is that people are doing both and we're not going back hybrid church is here to

not going back hybrid church is here to not going back hybrid church is here to stay number two financial and spiritual stay number two financial and spiritual stay number two financial and spiritual health are improving so 54% of churches health are improving so 54% of churches health are improving so 54% of churches report stronger Financial heal Health report stronger Financial heal Health report stronger Financial heal Health than in 2023 this is great to say this than in 2023 this is great to say this than in 2023 this is great to say this is great to see and 57% of churches said is great to see and 57% of churches said is great to see and 57% of churches said they had higher spiritual Vitality this they had higher spiritual Vitality this they had higher spiritual Vitality this is fantastic churches across the country is fantastic churches across the country is fantastic churches across the country are showing both resilience and Recovery are showing both resilience and Recovery are showing both resilience and Recovery after the pandemic and you'll see me say after the pandemic and you'll see me say after the pandemic and you'll see me say this a few times I think about this this a few times I think about this this a few times I think about this every year we do this survey because we every year we do this survey because we every year we do this survey because we we started this kind of in the teeth of we started this kind of in the teeth of we started this kind of in the teeth of the pandemic and really what we're the pandemic and really what we're the pandemic and really what we're showing is that both financial and showing is that both financial and showing is that both financial and spiritual Vitality are continued to spiritual Vitality are continued to spiritual Vitality are continued to improve you know just today I was improve you know just today I was improve you know just today I was talking to a church one of the churches talking to a church one of the churches talking to a church one of the churches that I coach and they saw huge growth that I coach and they saw huge growth that I coach and they saw huge growth here this last year you know it'll put here this last year you know it'll put here this last year you know it'll put them in uh probably one of the fastest them in uh probably one of the fastest them in uh probably one of the fastest growing churches in the country and growing churches in the country and growing churches in the country and their Financial Health is tracking with their Financial Health is tracking with their Financial Health is tracking with their attendance there is this notion their attendance there is this notion their attendance there is this notion that you cannot do both that you cannot that you cannot do both that you cannot that you cannot do both that you cannot grow and grow your finances at the same grow and grow your finances at the same grow and grow your finances at the same time you can't reach people unchurch time you can't reach people unchurch time you can't reach people unchurch people and see finances grow that's just people and see finances grow that's just people and see finances grow that's just not true um really what we want to do is not true um really what we want to do is not true um really what we want to do is is help you focus on impact stories week is help you focus on impact stories week is help you focus on impact stories week in week out every weekend in your in week out every weekend in your in week out every weekend in your offering um please don't do like offering um please don't do like offering um please don't do like offering talks that you can download offering talks that you can download offering talks that you can download online or use chat GPT to generate you online or use chat GPT to generate you online or use chat GPT to generate you should be sharing genuine stories should be sharing genuine stories should be sharing genuine stories pictures of things happening at your pictures of things happening at your pictures of things happening at your events and drawing the connection events and drawing the connection events and drawing the connection between life change and the finances of

between life change and the finances of between life change and the finances of your church when people give to your your church when people give to your your church when people give to your church good things happen share that church good things happen share that church good things happen share that week in week out there's momentum that's week in week out there's momentum that's week in week out there's momentum that's happening at your church and this is happening at your church and this is happening at your church and this is great to see if you're one of these great to see if you're one of these great to see if you're one of these churches that reported both improved churches that reported both improved churches that reported both improved improved finances and improved spiritual improved finances and improved spiritual improved finances and improved spiritual Vitality I would say 2025 is the year Vitality I would say 2025 is the year Vitality I would say 2025 is the year for you to double down and take some for you to double down and take some for you to double down and take some risk let's do some stuff that we haven't risk let's do some stuff that we haven't risk let's do some stuff that we haven't done before let put some of that Capital done before let put some of that Capital done before let put some of that Capital um in Risk let's invest it uh put it out um in Risk let's invest it uh put it out um in Risk let's invest it uh put it out into uh back into the Harvest to see into uh back into the Harvest to see into uh back into the Harvest to see what we can do to see more people get what we can do to see more people get what we can do to see more people get connected with the message of Jesus all connected with the message of Jesus all connected with the message of Jesus all right so that's Insight number two right so that's Insight number two right so that's Insight number two Insight number three leadership Insight number three leadership Insight number three leadership development uh tops Staff Care development uh tops Staff Care development uh tops Staff Care priorities let me move this so you can priorities let me move this so you can priorities let me move this so you can see uh this here so this is interesting see uh this here so this is interesting see uh this here so this is interesting uh leadership development was the number uh leadership development was the number uh leadership development was the number one priority by 36 almost 37% of one priority by 36 almost 37% of one priority by 36 almost 37% of responded and it was in the top two responded and it was in the top two responded and it was in the top two priorities of 59% of all the churches priorities of 59% of all the churches priorities of 59% of all the churches that uh were were studied uh mental that uh were were studied uh mental that uh were were studied uh mental health uh consistently ranked the lowest health uh consistently ranked the lowest health uh consistently ranked the lowest in these and in these and in these and 56% uh of churches L ranked in the 56% uh of churches L ranked in the 56% uh of churches L ranked in the lowest uh of all of these categories so lowest uh of all of these categories so lowest uh of all of these categories so so what does this mean prioritizing so what does this mean prioritizing so what does this mean prioritizing leadership development um is really a leadership development um is really a leadership development um is really a need for all of our churches uh and you need for all of our churches uh and you need for all of our churches uh and you know this Ephesians 4 we've got to be know this Ephesians 4 we've got to be know this Ephesians 4 we've got to be equipping obviously the people in our equipping obviously the people in our equipping obviously the people in our church but that means that we've got to church but that means that we've got to church but that means that we've got to equip leaders in our um you know that equip leaders in our um you know that equip leaders in our um you know that are on our staff uh we need our staff to are on our staff uh we need our staff to are on our staff uh we need our staff to be not just pastors but also to be be not just pastors but also to be be not just pastors but also to be excellent leaders in fact uh we run a a

excellent leaders in fact uh we run a a excellent leaders in fact uh we run a a private coaching group uh for a group a private coaching group uh for a group a private coaching group uh for a group a group of churches called The Church goth group of churches called The Church goth group of churches called The Church goth incubator and actually this month in incubator and actually this month in incubator and actually this month in church growth incubator we're doing some church growth incubator we're doing some church growth incubator we're doing some research on exactly this specifically research on exactly this specifically research on exactly this specifically asking the question of fast growing asking the question of fast growing asking the question of fast growing churches what are they doing at the churches what are they doing at the churches what are they doing at the pivot of moving volunteers from being pivot of moving volunteers from being pivot of moving volunteers from being just a volunteer obviously say that with just a volunteer obviously say that with just a volunteer obviously say that with air quotes from just a volunteer to air quotes from just a volunteer to air quotes from just a volunteer to being a volunteer leader and what are being a volunteer leader and what are being a volunteer leader and what are they doing and what we're seeing what's they doing and what we're seeing what's they doing and what we're seeing what's interesting in that research is um as interesting in that research is um as interesting in that research is um as we're seeing them do this kind of we're seeing them do this kind of we're seeing them do this kind of research um or as we're doing this research um or as we're doing this research um or as we're doing this research we're we're seeing that there's research we're we're seeing that there's research we're we're seeing that there's a strong correlation between churches a strong correlation between churches a strong correlation between churches that have a robust way of moving that have a robust way of moving that have a robust way of moving volunteers into leadership positions volunteers into leadership positions volunteers into leadership positions that they also have a robust way of that they also have a robust way of that they also have a robust way of moving uh volunteer staff or volunteer moving uh volunteer staff or volunteer moving uh volunteer staff or volunteer leaders into the in interpid staff leaders into the in interpid staff leaders into the in interpid staff applications you know and into their you applications you know and into their you applications you know and into their you know roles as a as on their team these know roles as a as on their team these know roles as a as on their team these are connected if you want to grow your are connected if you want to grow your are connected if you want to grow your staff you're going to need to grow staff you're going to need to grow staff you're going to need to grow volunteers you know really looking for volunteers you know really looking for volunteers you know really looking for providing structured growth providing structured growth providing structured growth opportunities for your staff this year opportunities for your staff this year opportunities for your staff this year something as easy as uh you know getting something as easy as uh you know getting something as easy as uh you know getting your staff team together and saying your staff team together and saying your staff team together and saying we're going to read a book together in we're going to read a book together in we're going to read a book together in the next three months even something as the next three months even something as the next three months even something as simple as that and saying hey let's read simple as that and saying hey let's read simple as that and saying hey let's read this book and in 3 months we're going to this book and in 3 months we're going to this book and in 3 months we're going to have a discussion about it I'm going to have a discussion about it I'm going to have a discussion about it I'm going to take you out for lunch we're going to take you out for lunch we're going to take you out for lunch we're going to talk about it even that uh even that talk about it even that uh even that talk about it even that uh even that alone now I do want to flag the mental alone now I do want to flag the mental alone now I do want to flag the mental health issue um this is an issue I I health issue um this is an issue I I health issue um this is an issue I I know that lots of our churches are not know that lots of our churches are not know that lots of our churches are not looking for this or not saying hey this

looking for this or not saying hey this looking for this or not saying hey this is a priority but I would continue to uh is a priority but I would continue to uh is a priority but I would continue to uh to be thinking about these issues you to be thinking about these issues you to be thinking about these issues you know even if it's in the back of our know even if it's in the back of our know even if it's in the back of our mind particularly as it relates to our mind particularly as it relates to our mind particularly as it relates to our next Insight Insight number four staff next Insight Insight number four staff next Insight Insight number four staff morale is rising but burnout persists morale is rising but burnout persists morale is rising but burnout persists staff morale is rising but burnout staff morale is rising but burnout staff morale is rising but burnout persists so here's what the results were persists so here's what the results were persists so here's what the results were 76.64 per of Staff when we asked what 76.64 per of Staff when we asked what 76.64 per of Staff when we asked what their kind of orientation of the future their kind of orientation of the future their kind of orientation of the future what we thought their orientation about what we thought their orientation about what we thought their orientation about the future was hey they were feeling the future was hey they were feeling the future was hey they were feeling hopeful uh about the future but 29% said hopeful uh about the future but 29% said hopeful uh about the future but 29% said that they reported that they thought that they reported that they thought that they reported that they thought their staff were were burnt out or that their staff were were burnt out or that their staff were were burnt out or that exhaustion was like a real issue so this exhaustion was like a real issue so this exhaustion was like a real issue so this is a good thing I would say this is like is a good thing I would say this is like is a good thing I would say this is like a good news bad news situation hope is a good news bad news situation hope is a good news bad news situation hope is rising among among our church staff rising among among our church staff rising among among our church staff which is positive it's good to see which is positive it's good to see which is positive it's good to see particularly when we pull back you'll particularly when we pull back you'll particularly when we pull back you'll see this later when we pull back over see this later when we pull back over see this later when we pull back over the years this is one of those areas the years this is one of those areas the years this is one of those areas that we've seen grow which is positive that we've seen grow which is positive that we've seen grow which is positive but burnout is real friends and that 29% but burnout is real friends and that 29% but burnout is real friends and that 29% of um leaders who said when they uh kind of um leaders who said when they uh kind of um leaders who said when they uh kind of talked about what how they described of talked about what how they described of talked about what how they described their staff they would describe them as their staff they would describe them as their staff they would describe them as exhausted these are two Dynamics then exhausted these are two Dynamics then exhausted these are two Dynamics then can be that both can be true at one time can be that both can be true at one time can be that both can be true at one time in your team they can both feel hopeful in your team they can both feel hopeful in your team they can both feel hopeful for the future and frankly burnt out for the future and frankly burnt out for the future and frankly burnt out they can feel excited about where the they can feel excited about where the they can feel excited about where the mission is for your church while at the mission is for your church while at the mission is for your church while at the same time exhausted personally my same time exhausted personally my same time exhausted personally my recommendation for you is to read carry recommendation for you is to read carry recommendation for you is to read carry newoff stuff man he does so much he his newoff stuff man he does so much he his newoff stuff man he does so much he his book at your best if you're looking for

book at your best if you're looking for book at your best if you're looking for a resource for your team do the staff re a resource for your team do the staff re a resource for your team do the staff re do the staff training thing we just do the staff training thing we just do the staff training thing we just talked about read a book we're going to talked about read a book we're going to talked about read a book we're going to read about it in three over three months read about it in three over three months read about it in three over three months and then we're going to get together and and then we're going to get together and and then we're going to get together and talk about it read his at your best book talk about it read his at your best book talk about it read his at your best book uh and then have a conversation about uh and then have a conversation about uh and then have a conversation about green zones yellow zones red zones none green zones yellow zones red zones none green zones yellow zones red zones none of that will make sense if you have not of that will make sense if you have not of that will make sense if you have not read his book to help your team read his book to help your team read his book to help your team understand how can they avoid exhaustion understand how can they avoid exhaustion understand how can they avoid exhaustion what do they need to do to manage their what do they need to do to manage their what do they need to do to manage their energy another thing is to provide energy another thing is to provide energy another thing is to provide practical tools we don't want your team practical tools we don't want your team practical tools we don't want your team to overwork we want them to work to overwork we want them to work to overwork we want them to work appropriately and I know for me in my appropriately and I know for me in my appropriately and I know for me in my context when I was an executive Pastor context when I was an executive Pastor context when I was an executive Pastor or leading teams and we were would talk or leading teams and we were would talk or leading teams and we were would talk about like cuz the problem is like staff about like cuz the problem is like staff about like cuz the problem is like staff time it it can be it's like bottomless time it it can be it's like bottomless time it it can be it's like bottomless how the mission is endless by definition how the mission is endless by definition how the mission is endless by definition we've cast our mission in giant ways and we've cast our mission in giant ways and we've cast our mission in giant ways and so our team will just keep working and so our team will just keep working and so our team will just keep working and so what I would do is explain to our so what I would do is explain to our so what I would do is explain to our staff um if you think about the week if staff um if you think about the week if staff um if you think about the week if you think about it any given day you've you think about it any given day you've you think about it any given day you've got the kind of lunch or you got the got the kind of lunch or you got the got the kind of lunch or you got the breakfast to lunch I would call that a breakfast to lunch I would call that a breakfast to lunch I would call that a block and then you've got the lunch to block and then you've got the lunch to block and then you've got the lunch to dinner that's a block and then I've got dinner that's a block and then I've got dinner that's a block and then I've got dinner to whenever you know bedtime dinner to whenever you know bedtime dinner to whenever you know bedtime that's another block and what I would that's another block and what I would that's another block and what I would encourage my staff rather than thinking encourage my staff rather than thinking encourage my staff rather than thinking about hours of time I would ask them to about hours of time I would ask them to about hours of time I would ask them to apply 10 blocks of effort every single apply 10 blocks of effort every single apply 10 blocks of effort every single week week in week out I'm not at so if week week in week out I'm not at so if week week in week out I'm not at so if you work you know the first two days of you work you know the first two days of you work you know the first two days of the week you work you know morning till the week you work you know morning till the week you work you know morning till night that's six blocks so that you need night that's six blocks so that you need night that's six blocks so that you need to be taking other time off now you

to be taking other time off now you to be taking other time off now you don't need to necessarily do that for don't need to necessarily do that for don't need to necessarily do that for your team but you need to have some sort your team but you need to have some sort your team but you need to have some sort of easy way to communicate something of easy way to communicate something of easy way to communicate something like that to your team to push back like that to your team to push back like that to your team to push back against burnout burnout is real friends against burnout burnout is real friends against burnout burnout is real friends your people can be both committed to the your people can be both committed to the your people can be both committed to the mission and exhausted at the same time mission and exhausted at the same time mission and exhausted at the same time uh if they're exhausted that doesn't uh if they're exhausted that doesn't uh if they're exhausted that doesn't mean that they don't love the mission it mean that they don't love the mission it mean that they don't love the mission it doesn't mean that they're not hopeful doesn't mean that they're not hopeful doesn't mean that they're not hopeful for the future it just means they're for the future it just means they're for the future it just means they're tired how can you help them build in tired how can you help them build in tired how can you help them build in rhythms of rest and celebration to rhythms of rest and celebration to rhythms of rest and celebration to sustain your team's morale something for sustain your team's morale something for sustain your team's morale something for you uh to think about all right Insight you uh to think about all right Insight you uh to think about all right Insight number five uh volunteer engagement is a number five uh volunteer engagement is a number five uh volunteer engagement is a growth area so in 2020 only 21% of growth area so in 2020 only 21% of growth area so in 2020 only 21% of churches reported that they were seeing churches reported that they were seeing churches reported that they were seeing volunteer growth in their communities volunteer growth in their communities volunteer growth in their communities where across the board we're seeing uh where across the board we're seeing uh where across the board we're seeing uh churches saying that volunteer growth is churches saying that volunteer growth is churches saying that volunteer growth is happening in our churches which is happening in our churches which is happening in our churches which is wonderful there's lots of different wonderful there's lots of different wonderful there's lots of different places actually throughout the survey places actually throughout the survey places actually throughout the survey that pointed towards that V uh volunteer that pointed towards that V uh volunteer that pointed towards that V uh volunteer pipelines are being built people are pipelines are being built people are pipelines are being built people are figuring out how uh to get volunteers figuring out how uh to get volunteers figuring out how uh to get volunteers plugged in at their Church which is plugged in at their Church which is plugged in at their Church which is fantastic in fact one of the things fantastic in fact one of the things fantastic in fact one of the things we've talked about in our coaching I we've talked about in our coaching I we've talked about in our coaching I call it the 1:3 ratio of volunteer call it the 1:3 ratio of volunteer call it the 1:3 ratio of volunteer engagement that for every one volunteer engagement that for every one volunteer engagement that for every one volunteer it's a great party trick if you were at it's a great party trick if you were at it's a great party trick if you were at a party of pastors instead of asking how a party of pastors instead of asking how a party of pastors instead of asking how big is your church ask them um how many big is your church ask them um how many big is your church ask them um how many volunteers do you have and invariably if volunteers do you have and invariably if volunteers do you have and invariably if you tell me the number of volunteers you you tell me the number of volunteers you you tell me the number of volunteers you have I can tell you what your attendance have I can tell you what your attendance have I can tell you what your attendance is if you're if you say I've got a 100 is if you're if you say I've got a 100 is if you're if you say I've got a 100 volunteers at my church chances are your volunteers at my church chances are your volunteers at my church chances are your church is about 300 if you say I've got

church is about 300 if you say I've got church is about 300 if you say I've got a thousand volunteers chances are you're a thousand volunteers chances are you're a thousand volunteers chances are you're Church of somewhere around 3,000 people Church of somewhere around 3,000 people Church of somewhere around 3,000 people the 1:3 ratio is important because the 1:3 ratio is important because the 1:3 ratio is important because volunteer growth precedes attendance volunteer growth precedes attendance volunteer growth precedes attendance growth not the other way around so when growth not the other way around so when growth not the other way around so when we grow our volunteer our teams that is we grow our volunteer our teams that is we grow our volunteer our teams that is um a way for us to uh really predict or um a way for us to uh really predict or um a way for us to uh really predict or to grow our overall um attendance as a to grow our overall um attendance as a to grow our overall um attendance as a church so volunteer growth precedes church so volunteer growth precedes church so volunteer growth precedes growth so you know what's the growth so you know what's the growth so you know what's the application here um this something if application here um this something if application here um this something if this isn't happening in your church if this isn't happening in your church if this isn't happening in your church if you're not increasing volunteer you're not increasing volunteer you're not increasing volunteer engagement providing a clear meaningful engagement providing a clear meaningful engagement providing a clear meaningful volunteer roles to people that's volunteer roles to people that's volunteer roles to people that's important to help them understand their important to help them understand their important to help them understand their gifts and their passions uh you know gifts and their passions uh you know gifts and their passions uh you know that's a critical piece of the way that's a critical piece of the way that's a critical piece of the way provide clear ways for people to get provide clear ways for people to get provide clear ways for people to get plugged in in a way that connects with plugged in in a way that connects with plugged in in a way that connects with who they are don't say no for them don't who they are don't say no for them don't who they are don't say no for them don't uh you know this happens all the time uh you know this happens all the time uh you know this happens all the time too often church leaders say no for too often church leaders say no for too often church leaders say no for their people uh they go in and um you their people uh they go in and um you their people uh they go in and um you know they they're like I can't ask know they they're like I can't ask know they they're like I can't ask somebody to do that I can't I can't ask somebody to do that I can't I can't ask somebody to do that I can't I can't ask somebody to do that but what you somebody to do that but what you somebody to do that but what you understand though is actually people understand though is actually people understand though is actually people with growing churches they have big asks with growing churches they have big asks with growing churches they have big asks of volunteers put out put a big ask out of volunteers put out put a big ask out of volunteers put out put a big ask out there I remember a friend early on um there I remember a friend early on um there I remember a friend early on um Who I Really respect on building teams Who I Really respect on building teams Who I Really respect on building teams they would just be super blatant to they would just be super blatant to they would just be super blatant to people they would say you know what people they would say you know what people they would say you know what really what we're asking you to do is a really what we're asking you to do is a really what we're asking you to do is a volunteer job we're asking you to put in volunteer job we're asking you to put in volunteer job we're asking you to put in huge time uh through this volunteer role

huge time uh through this volunteer role huge time uh through this volunteer role and in fact it's kind of like working and in fact it's kind of like working and in fact it's kind of like working part-time for the church but we're just part-time for the church but we're just part-time for the church but we're just not going to pay you this we're this not going to pay you this we're this not going to pay you this we're this role is going to require 10 hours a week role is going to require 10 hours a week role is going to require 10 hours a week of you don't say no for your people and of you don't say no for your people and of you don't say no for your people and then regular celebrate volunteers if then regular celebrate volunteers if then regular celebrate volunteers if you're trying to build engagement you you're trying to build engagement you you're trying to build engagement you need to increase the volunteer need to increase the volunteer need to increase the volunteer celebration what gets celebrated gets celebration what gets celebrated gets celebration what gets celebrated gets repeated what can you do to celebrate repeated what can you do to celebrate repeated what can you do to celebrate your volunteers this year uh at your your volunteers this year uh at your your volunteers this year uh at your church all right number six staff uh church all right number six staff uh church all right number six staff uh staffing needs continue to shift so let staffing needs continue to shift so let staffing needs continue to shift so let me get a drink me get a drink me get a drink here as we're going through these here as we're going through these here as we're going through these insights I'm getting parched um so insights I'm getting parched um so insights I'm getting parched um so staffing needs are shifting so we asked staffing needs are shifting so we asked staffing needs are shifting so we asked what H what roles were you hiring and we what H what roles were you hiring and we what H what roles were you hiring and we saw a huge jump this year in support saw a huge jump this year in support saw a huge jump this year in support roles so 45.4 2% of churches said roles so 45.4 2% of churches said roles so 45.4 2% of churches said they're hiring in support roles so this they're hiring in support roles so this they're hiring in support roles so this would be like would be like would be like Administration um you know non-f Administration um you know non-f Administration um you know non-f Frontline pastoral care roles uh and 32% Frontline pastoral care roles uh and 32% Frontline pastoral care roles uh and 32% said they've got NextGen in there so said they've got NextGen in there so said they've got NextGen in there so interesting these are kind of the two interesting these are kind of the two interesting these are kind of the two leading areas so this is positive in one leading areas so this is positive in one leading areas so this is positive in one sense I think this actually relates in a sense I think this actually relates in a sense I think this actually relates in a positive way to what was happening there positive way to what was happening there positive way to what was happening there before hiring support staff to support before hiring support staff to support before hiring support staff to support your pastors and directors can be a your pastors and directors can be a your pastors and directors can be a really good thing positive that's really really good thing positive that's really really good thing positive that's really good um but the my caution for you is good um but the my caution for you is good um but the my caution for you is this listen very carefully to me friends this listen very carefully to me friends this listen very carefully to me friends if you are hiring support roles in 2024 if you are hiring support roles in 2024 if you are hiring support roles in 2024 please make sure that you're not taking please make sure that you're not taking please make sure that you're not taking stuff away from volunteers but your stuff away from volunteers but your stuff away from volunteers but your Ephesians 4 you're still equipping the

Ephesians 4 you're still equipping the Ephesians 4 you're still equipping the Saints even if it's a support role they Saints even if it's a support role they Saints even if it's a support role they should be volun they should be engaging should be volun they should be engaging should be volun they should be engaging more volunteers not taking jobs away more volunteers not taking jobs away more volunteers not taking jobs away from volunteers they needs to be a flow from volunteers they needs to be a flow from volunteers they needs to be a flow of work from um from your staff to of work from um from your staff to of work from um from your staff to volunteers not the other way around if volunteers not the other way around if volunteers not the other way around if you're hiring a support role that to do you're hiring a support role that to do you're hiring a support role that to do if you're hiring support um you know if you're hiring support um you know if you're hiring support um you know support role to do things that used to support role to do things that used to support role to do things that used to be done by volunteers I would be highly be done by volunteers I would be highly be done by volunteers I would be highly concerned about that that that's concerned about that that that's concerned about that that that's actually the start of decline of your actually the start of decline of your actually the start of decline of your church this is one of the ways that church this is one of the ways that church this is one of the ways that churches become overstaffed so I would churches become overstaffed so I would churches become overstaffed so I would audit your staff structure and ask the audit your staff structure and ask the audit your staff structure and ask the question hey what are some areas that we question hey what are some areas that we question hey what are some areas that we could give to volunteers and could we could give to volunteers and could we could give to volunteers and could we lump a bunch of that together what if we lump a bunch of that together what if we lump a bunch of that together what if we lumped a bunch of that work together and lumped a bunch of that work together and lumped a bunch of that work together and hired a staff to ultimately uh Empower hired a staff to ultimately uh Empower hired a staff to ultimately uh Empower volunteers to pick up that um you know volunteers to pick up that um you know volunteers to pick up that um you know that work so we we again move from staff that work so we we again move from staff that work so we we again move from staff to volunteers that's really what we're to volunteers that's really what we're to volunteers that's really what we're trying uh to do so we you know it's okay trying uh to do so we you know it's okay trying uh to do so we you know it's okay if we're hiring support staff I think if we're hiring support staff I think if we're hiring support staff I think that's a good thing it relates to the that's a good thing it relates to the that's a good thing it relates to the thing before it nextg man perfect area thing before it nextg man perfect area thing before it nextg man perfect area to invest uh kids ministry grows to invest uh kids ministry grows to invest uh kids ministry grows churches and having a thriving kids churches and having a thriving kids churches and having a thriving kids ministry sometimes requires more staff ministry sometimes requires more staff ministry sometimes requires more staff to support the volunteers that are there to support the volunteers that are there to support the volunteers that are there and so it makes sense that people are and so it makes sense that people are and so it makes sense that people are hiring in that area number seven um so hiring in that area number seven um so hiring in that area number seven um so top areas of concern so these is when we top areas of concern so these is when we top areas of concern so these is when we asked people things that they're asked people things that they're asked people things that they're worrying about financial stability 35% worrying about financial stability 35% worrying about financial stability 35% of people said Financial stability uh of people said Financial stability uh of people said Financial stability uh Staffing uh 25% of people when we asked

Staffing uh 25% of people when we asked Staffing uh 25% of people when we asked them this is an open Forum question 25% them this is an open Forum question 25% them this is an open Forum question 25% said something around Staffing uh 20% said something around Staffing uh 20% said something around Staffing uh 20% said something around facilities so we said something around facilities so we said something around facilities so we have heard you clearly at un Seminary have heard you clearly at un Seminary have heard you clearly at un Seminary we're going to be doing more on um on on we're going to be doing more on um on on we're going to be doing more on um on on financial stability this year um we know financial stability this year um we know financial stability this year um we know that inflation is a real is issue we that inflation is a real is issue we that inflation is a real is issue we know that dealing with growth is a real know that dealing with growth is a real know that dealing with growth is a real issue and donor fatigue is an issue um issue and donor fatigue is an issue um issue and donor fatigue is an issue um you know I'll give you an example I you know I'll give you an example I you know I'll give you an example I don't know if you know this but actually don't know if you know this but actually don't know if you know this but actually I do coaching with churches around I've I do coaching with churches around I've I do coaching with churches around I've never this is literally the first time never this is literally the first time never this is literally the first time I've ever talked publicly about this I I've ever talked publicly about this I I've ever talked publicly about this I do coaching with churches around giving do coaching with churches around giving do coaching with churches around giving stuff and fact um just recently I'm stuff and fact um just recently I'm stuff and fact um just recently I'm working through a public campaign phase working through a public campaign phase working through a public campaign phase where we're raising some resources for a where we're raising some resources for a where we're raising some resources for a church and they had the largest on the church and they had the largest on the church and they had the largest on the second weekend of their public phase of second weekend of their public phase of second weekend of their public phase of their campaign they had the largest their campaign they had the largest their campaign they had the largest attendance ever in uh the history of attendance ever in uh the history of attendance ever in uh the history of their Church during a capital campaign their Church during a capital campaign their Church during a capital campaign or during a fundraising campaign a or during a fundraising campaign a or during a fundraising campaign a generosity initiative and that's the generosity initiative and that's the generosity initiative and that's the trend we see time and again when done trend we see time and again when done trend we see time and again when done well you these are not you know contrary well you these are not you know contrary well you these are not you know contrary ideas you can both raise resources and ideas you can both raise resources and ideas you can both raise resources and continue to reach people I would say the continue to reach people I would say the continue to reach people I would say the big Takeaway on financial stability is big Takeaway on financial stability is big Takeaway on financial stability is you know the best time to grow uh the you know the best time to grow uh the you know the best time to grow uh the best time to plant an oak tree was 30 best time to plant an oak tree was 30 best time to plant an oak tree was 30 years ago the best time to put systems years ago the best time to put systems years ago the best time to put systems in place on this was 5 years ago uh but in place on this was 5 years ago uh but in place on this was 5 years ago uh but the the next best time to plant an oak the the next best time to plant an oak the the next best time to plant an oak tree is today the next PL next best time tree is today the next PL next best time tree is today the next PL next best time to start the systems required to build to start the systems required to build to start the systems required to build Financial stability is today so I would Financial stability is today so I would Financial stability is today so I would be thinking what can you do today to

be thinking what can you do today to be thinking what can you do today to build a system to not solve this build a system to not solve this build a system to not solve this quarter's financial problem but to quarter's financial problem but to quarter's financial problem but to really change the traj of this over 2025 really change the traj of this over 2025 really change the traj of this over 2025 into 2026 and Beyond so that's it seven into 2026 and Beyond so that's it seven into 2026 and Beyond so that's it seven insights you know looking back to uh insights you know looking back to uh insights you know looking back to uh this survey over the last 20 years or 20 this survey over the last 20 years or 20 this survey over the last 20 years or 20 years it doesn't feels like 20 years uh years it doesn't feels like 20 years uh years it doesn't feels like 20 years uh since 2020 couple things that are since 2020 couple things that are since 2020 couple things that are interesting to see some health so you interesting to see some health so you interesting to see some health so you know hybrid worship adoption grew you know hybrid worship adoption grew you know hybrid worship adoption grew you can see the number the number there it can see the number the number there it can see the number the number there it actually was high in 2020 and then took actually was high in 2020 and then took actually was high in 2020 and then took a bit of a dip but has we've seen us go a bit of a dip but has we've seen us go a bit of a dip but has we've seen us go back in there Financial Health we're back in there Financial Health we're back in there Financial Health we're seeing great um you know Financial seeing great um you know Financial seeing great um you know Financial Health is just expanding which is Health is just expanding which is Health is just expanding which is wonderful many churches are saying hey wonderful many churches are saying hey wonderful many churches are saying hey their Financial Health is better now their Financial Health is better now their Financial Health is better now than it was at the beginning of the year than it was at the beginning of the year than it was at the beginning of the year and our staff's hope grew why do I say and our staff's hope grew why do I say and our staff's hope grew why do I say this I I really want to say for you and this I I really want to say for you and this I I really want to say for you and for me the pandemic's behind us I know for me the pandemic's behind us I know for me the pandemic's behind us I know why are we still talking about the why are we still talking about the why are we still talking about the pandemic but I I really think many of us pandemic but I I really think many of us pandemic but I I really think many of us we would say that's a defining turn in we would say that's a defining turn in we would say that's a defining turn in our history but it's been 5 years since our history but it's been 5 years since our history but it's been 5 years since that and it's time for us to move on so that and it's time for us to move on so that and it's time for us to move on so friends uh that there it is there are friends uh that there it is there are friends uh that there it is there are some insights from the 2024 national some insights from the 2024 national some insights from the 2024 national executive Pastor survey I'd love for you executive Pastor survey I'd love for you executive Pastor survey I'd love for you to listen to the unseminary to listen to the unseminary to listen to the unseminary podcast uh drop by we'll put links in podcast uh drop by we'll put links in podcast uh drop by we'll put links in the show notes here about that drop by the show notes here about that drop by the show notes here about that drop by and subscribe to that you can also drop and subscribe to that you can also drop and subscribe to that you can also drop by unseminary dcom and uh sign up to our by unseminary dcom and uh sign up to our by unseminary dcom and uh sign up to our email list we've got lots of ways to email list we've got lots of ways to email list we've got lots of ways to help uh executive pastors over there uh help uh executive pastors over there uh help uh executive pastors over there uh thanks so much for being a part of the thanks so much for being a part of the thanks so much for being a part of the survey if you were uh I'd love to

survey if you were uh I'd love to survey if you were uh I'd love to comment below which of those insights comment below which of those insights comment below which of those insights reson with you uh how uh could they help reson with you uh how uh could they help reson with you uh how uh could they help or you know what does that tweak you to or you know what does that tweak you to or you know what does that tweak you to think about for this coming year at your think about for this coming year at your think about for this coming year at your church thanks friends