Kevin Peck on the Conviction, Culture & Constructs of Leadership Development

today's on Seminary podcast episode is today's on Seminary podcast episode is brought to you by Church community brought to you by Church community brought to you by Church community Builder I love how these guys help Builder I love how these guys help Builder I love how these guys help church leaders make and grow disciples church leaders make and grow disciples church leaders make and grow disciples by providing software and coaching focus by providing software and coaching focus by providing software and coaching focus on improving operational effectiveness on improving operational effectiveness on improving operational effectiveness Church community Builder provides Church community Builder provides Church community Builder provides leaders like me with insights into leaders like me with insights into leaders like me with insights into engagement of our church Community engagement of our church Community engagement of our church Community Helping Us close the gaps that allow Helping Us close the gaps that allow Helping Us close the gaps that allow people to slip away unnoticed visit people to slip away unnoticed visit people to slip away unnoticed visit Church community builder.com to learn Church community builder.com to learn Church community builder.com to learn more ladies and gentlemen welcome to the more ladies and gentlemen welcome to the more ladies and gentlemen welcome to the unseminary podcast are you looking for unseminary podcast are you looking for unseminary podcast are you looking for practical Ministry help to drive your practical Ministry help to drive your practical Ministry help to drive your ministry further faster have a sinking ministry further faster have a sinking ministry further faster have a sinking feeling that your ministry training feeling that your ministry training feeling that your ministry training didn't prepare you for the real world didn't prepare you for the real world didn't prepare you for the real world hey you're not alone join thousands of hey you're not alone join thousands of hey you're not alone join thousands of others in pursuit of stuff that we wish others in pursuit of stuff that we wish others in pursuit of stuff that we wish they had taught in seminary buckle up they had taught in seminary buckle up they had taught in seminary buckle up and let's get started with this week's and let's get started with this week's and let's get started with this week's unseminary unseminary unseminary podcast well hey everybody Welcome to podcast well hey everybody Welcome to podcast well hey everybody Welcome to the unseminary podcast so glad that you the unseminary podcast so glad that you the unseminary podcast so glad that you decided to join us uh you know we try to decided to join us uh you know we try to decided to join us uh you know we try to every week have people on the show who every week have people on the show who every week have people on the show who we think are going to help you um lead we think are going to help you um lead we think are going to help you um lead in a new way and kind of take your in a new way and kind of take your in a new way and kind of take your church to a Next Level and I'm just just church to a Next Level and I'm just just church to a Next Level and I'm just just so honored today uh we really are so honored today uh we really are so honored today uh we really are privileged to have Kevin pek from Austin privileged to have Kevin pek from Austin privileged to have Kevin pek from Austin Stone a great leader um leading really a Stone a great leader um leading really a Stone a great leader um leading really a fantastic Church Uh Kevin welcome to the fantastic Church Uh Kevin welcome to the fantastic Church Uh Kevin welcome to the show hey thanks for having me Rich folks show hey thanks for having me Rich folks show hey thanks for having me Rich folks that don't know Austin Stone is a that don't know Austin Stone is a that don't know Austin Stone is a fantastic Church in of all places Austin fantastic Church in of all places Austin fantastic Church in of all places Austin um I think you have five campuses now um I think you have five campuses now um I think you have five campuses now around around in and around Austin is around around in and around Austin is around around in and around Austin is that true yeah we have uh actually we that true yeah we have uh actually we that true yeah we have uh actually we have seven campuses at five locations we have seven campuses at five locations we have seven campuses at five locations we uh double tap a couple of locations so uh double tap a couple of locations so uh double tap a couple of locations so that we get bang for our buck on that we get bang for our buck on that we get bang for our buck on facilities fantastic well why you tell facilities fantastic well why you tell facilities fantastic well why you tell us a little bit about Austin Stone for

us a little bit about Austin Stone for us a little bit about Austin Stone for folks that don't know uh and about your folks that don't know uh and about your folks that don't know uh and about your role there yeah you bet we we started role there yeah you bet we we started role there yeah you bet we we started about 15 years ago it's a church plant a about 15 years ago it's a church plant a about 15 years ago it's a church plant a guy named Matt Carter actually uh took a guy named Matt Carter actually uh took a guy named Matt Carter actually uh took a church planting class at Seminary he was church planting class at Seminary he was church planting class at Seminary he was down in Houston and and felt the call to down in Houston and and felt the call to down in Houston and and felt the call to plant churches and at the time Austin plant churches and at the time Austin plant churches and at the time Austin was one of those kind of random Southern was one of those kind of random Southern was one of those kind of random Southern cities that still showed up on the list cities that still showed up on the list cities that still showed up on the list of most unreached cities in North of most unreached cities in North of most unreached cities in North America and so him being kind of an America and so him being kind of an America and so him being kind of an entrepreneurial guy he said hey if we're entrepreneurial guy he said hey if we're entrepreneurial guy he said hey if we're going to tackle this let's go to the going to tackle this let's go to the going to tackle this let's go to the hard places and so he's he he headed hard places and so he's he he headed hard places and so he's he he headed down here with his family about 15 years down here with his family about 15 years down here with his family about 15 years ago and about a year in I came back to ago and about a year in I came back to ago and about a year in I came back to Austin because I'm from Austin I'm Austin because I'm from Austin I'm Austin because I'm from Austin I'm actually a local austinite was coming actually a local austinite was coming actually a local austinite was coming back to take care of my dad after my mom back to take care of my dad after my mom back to take care of my dad after my mom died um I was in management consulting died um I was in management consulting died um I was in management consulting at the time and thought hey I'll help at the time and thought hey I'll help at the time and thought hey I'll help out with this young Church Plant since out with this young Church Plant since out with this young Church Plant since uh I was a lost guy when I lived here in uh I was a lost guy when I lived here in uh I was a lost guy when I lived here in Austin and thought man I'd love to see Austin and thought man I'd love to see Austin and thought man I'd love to see the church flourish here in the city the church flourish here in the city the church flourish here in the city that I'm from so uh just asked him to that I'm from so uh just asked him to that I'm from so uh just asked him to help out for a couple of years the price help out for a couple of years the price help out for a couple of years the price was right I was free so was right I was free so was right I was free so he said yes and um uh 14 years later I'm he said yes and um uh 14 years later I'm he said yes and um uh 14 years later I'm still here so enjoying enjoying leading still here so enjoying enjoying leading still here so enjoying enjoying leading uh and serving the City of Austin by um uh and serving the City of Austin by um uh and serving the City of Austin by um by not only planting the Austin Stone by not only planting the Austin Stone by not only planting the Austin Stone but also hopefully um generating more but also hopefully um generating more but also hopefully um generating more leaders and more gospel workers for our leaders and more gospel workers for our leaders and more gospel workers for our city and around the globe uh my city and around the globe uh my city and around the globe uh my particular role kind of developed over particular role kind of developed over particular role kind of developed over time uh as Matt and I continue to work time uh as Matt and I continue to work time uh as Matt and I continue to work together for the last 14 years we just together for the last 14 years we just together for the last 14 years we just saw that we had a good complimentary set saw that we had a good complimentary set saw that we had a good complimentary set of gifts and uh Matt loves to preach and of gifts and uh Matt loves to preach and of gifts and uh Matt loves to preach and therefore leads and I love to lead and

therefore leads and I love to lead and therefore leads and I love to lead and therefore preach and we thought hey we therefore preach and we thought hey we therefore preach and we thought hey we trust each other like each other let's trust each other like each other let's trust each other like each other let's do this together and so just about seven do this together and so just about seven do this together and so just about seven years ago I um I kind of took on the years ago I um I kind of took on the years ago I um I kind of took on the role of of lead pastor and he became role of of lead pastor and he became role of of lead pastor and he became pastor of preaching and we kind of split pastor of preaching and we kind of split pastor of preaching and we kind of split that traditional role of senior pastor that traditional role of senior pastor that traditional role of senior pastor uh so that we uh more form our campus uh so that we uh more form our campus uh so that we uh more form our campus because one of the things we love to do because one of the things we love to do because one of the things we love to do here at our church is just demonstrate here at our church is just demonstrate here at our church is just demonstrate the plurality of leadership that we see the plurality of leadership that we see the plurality of leadership that we see really explicitly in scripture and so um really explicitly in scripture and so um really explicitly in scripture and so um that started with us too and now is that started with us too and now is that started with us too and now is grown to a much larger team where we grown to a much larger team where we grown to a much larger team where we love to share leadership so that um love to share leadership so that um love to share leadership so that um God's church can keep going forward God's church can keep going forward God's church can keep going forward regardless of the human instruments that regardless of the human instruments that regardless of the human instruments that he uses fantastic well you know for he uses fantastic well you know for he uses fantastic well you know for folks that don't know Austin Stone is folks that don't know Austin Stone is folks that don't know Austin Stone is one of those you know fastest growing one of those you know fastest growing one of those you know fastest growing churches in the country it's a fantastic churches in the country it's a fantastic churches in the country it's a fantastic you guys are doing a great ministry in a you guys are doing a great ministry in a you guys are doing a great ministry in a lot of different ways God's using you um lot of different ways God's using you um lot of different ways God's using you um you know in some pretty amazing ways but you know in some pretty amazing ways but you know in some pretty amazing ways but it's got to be hard to keep up with all it's got to be hard to keep up with all it's got to be hard to keep up with all that you know you've uh I love what you that you know you've uh I love what you that you know you've uh I love what you touched on there the plurality of touched on there the plurality of touched on there the plurality of leaders um you're modeling that at the leaders um you're modeling that at the leaders um you're modeling that at the very core of kind of the leadership very core of kind of the leadership very core of kind of the leadership structure but that's really kind of structure but that's really kind of structure but that's really kind of dominoed down from what I see um really dominoed down from what I see um really dominoed down from what I see um really throughout your entire you know throughout your entire you know throughout your entire you know organization what is what is kind of organization what is what is kind of organization what is what is kind of leadership development looking like for leadership development looking like for leadership development looking like for you at Austin Stone these days right you at Austin Stone these days right you at Austin Stone these days right yeah you know for us leadership yeah you know for us leadership yeah you know for us leadership development became at at our heart kind development became at at our heart kind development became at at our heart kind of a core conviction not one of those of a core conviction not one of those of a core conviction not one of those add-ons not an extra program not one of add-ons not an extra program not one of add-ons not an extra program not one of those things that we thought hey this those things that we thought hey this those things that we thought hey this would be a good idea but as long as we would be a good idea but as long as we would be a good idea but as long as we pull off worship Services we're still pull off worship Services we're still pull off worship Services we're still winning it actually for us became a core winning it actually for us became a core winning it actually for us became a core theological concept for us a core theological concept for us a core theological concept for us a core theological motivation for us because we theological motivation for us because we theological motivation for us because we just realized really really early on uh

just realized really really early on uh just realized really really early on uh that we are going to die at 100% chance that we are going to die at 100% chance that we are going to die at 100% chance rate um we're gonna go away uh death uh rate um we're gonna go away uh death uh rate um we're gonna go away uh death uh is coming uh for us and therefore is coming uh for us and therefore is coming uh for us and therefore multiplication replication is going to multiplication replication is going to multiplication replication is going to be uh not just an add-on but a necessary be uh not just an add-on but a necessary be uh not just an add-on but a necessary part of us um actually caring for our part of us um actually caring for our part of us um actually caring for our city um in a way that actually sees us city um in a way that actually sees us city um in a way that actually sees us rightly as just creatures and so that's rightly as just creatures and so that's rightly as just creatures and so that's become a must do uh part of our our of become a must do uh part of our our of become a must do uh part of our our of our ministry structure and so because of our ministry structure and so because of our ministry structure and so because of that we kind of see leadership that we kind of see leadership that we kind of see leadership development at at you know in three development at at you know in three development at at you know in three parts we don't first aim at a program we parts we don't first aim at a program we parts we don't first aim at a program we we really aim at saying it started with we really aim at saying it started with we really aim at saying it started with a conviction and then for us it a conviction and then for us it a conviction and then for us it developed in a culture and then we start developed in a culture and then we start developed in a culture and then we start talking about the constructs um that can talking about the constructs um that can talking about the constructs um that can help us develop leaders and so for us help us develop leaders and so for us help us develop leaders and so for us that that really has been a good that that really has been a good that that really has been a good framework and so we continue to enhance framework and so we continue to enhance framework and so we continue to enhance in our in our congregation as new people in our in our congregation as new people in our in our congregation as new people come in this conviction for leadership come in this conviction for leadership come in this conviction for leadership development because convictions are development because convictions are development because convictions are going to come lost you something uh and going to come lost you something uh and going to come lost you something uh and those convictions as we talk about them those convictions as we talk about them those convictions as we talk about them and as we as we build models for them uh and as we as we build models for them uh and as we as we build models for them uh it develops as part of the culture where it develops as part of the culture where it develops as part of the culture where it becomes abnormal not to do it it it becomes abnormal not to do it it it becomes abnormal not to do it it would feel wrong not to do it um and would feel wrong not to do it um and would feel wrong not to do it um and then we keep tweaking the constructs then we keep tweaking the constructs then we keep tweaking the constructs because things are going to change because things are going to change because things are going to change people are going to change we're going people are going to change we're going people are going to change we're going to learn new stuff about how leaders are to learn new stuff about how leaders are to learn new stuff about how leaders are made and then we can kind of change the made and then we can kind of change the made and then we can kind of change the constructs and so for us it starts at constructs and so for us it starts at constructs and so for us it starts at the very beginning with convictions and the very beginning with convictions and the very beginning with convictions and so we're teaching on it all the time um so we're teaching on it all the time um so we're teaching on it all the time um not only on on multiplication itself but not only on on multiplication itself but not only on on multiplication itself but we're teaching on plurality of we're teaching on plurality of we're teaching on plurality of leadership um on a regular basis and leadership um on a regular basis and leadership um on a regular basis and we're teaching on God's global vision we're teaching on God's global vision we're teaching on God's global vision that God wants more than Austin which

that God wants more than Austin which that God wants more than Austin which just leads to a natural Theology of just leads to a natural Theology of just leads to a natural Theology of we're gonna have to multiply and not we're gonna have to multiply and not we're gonna have to multiply and not just add here in Austin yeah I love that just add here in Austin yeah I love that just add here in Austin yeah I love that why don't you leaning a little bit on why don't you leaning a little bit on why don't you leaning a little bit on the plurality of leadership I think we the plurality of leadership I think we the plurality of leadership I think we live in a in a I don't know whether You' live in a in a I don't know whether You' live in a in a I don't know whether You' call it a superhero time frame of of call it a superhero time frame of of call it a superhero time frame of of church leaders or a you know a kind of church leaders or a you know a kind of church leaders or a you know a kind of star obsessed like there's always the star obsessed like there's always the star obsessed like there's always the one guy or the one leader at the top one guy or the one leader at the top one guy or the one leader at the top that's making You Know It All Happened that's making You Know It All Happened that's making You Know It All Happened which just isn't biblical or true um which just isn't biblical or true um which just isn't biblical or true um kind of unpack that a little bit how do kind of unpack that a little bit how do kind of unpack that a little bit how do you explain the plurality of leadership you explain the plurality of leadership you explain the plurality of leadership to your people at Austin Stone yeah so to your people at Austin Stone yeah so to your people at Austin Stone yeah so for us I mean it really starts um at the for us I mean it really starts um at the for us I mean it really starts um at the very core with a couple of different very core with a couple of different very core with a couple of different things number one that God's desire and things number one that God's desire and things number one that God's desire and design for mankind is to um demonstrate design for mankind is to um demonstrate design for mankind is to um demonstrate the image of God to the world but he the image of God to the world but he the image of God to the world but he decided from the very beginning to do decided from the very beginning to do decided from the very beginning to do that through a plurality of people and that through a plurality of people and that through a plurality of people and so when God makes man kind in his own so when God makes man kind in his own so when God makes man kind in his own image he makes male and female so from image he makes male and female so from image he makes male and female so from the very beginning in order to the very beginning in order to the very beginning in order to demonstrate the image of God God is demonstrate the image of God God is demonstrate the image of God God is adding more than one guy uh if anyone adding more than one guy uh if anyone adding more than one guy uh if anyone could have pulled it off it should have could have pulled it off it should have could have pulled it off it should have been Adam but he doesn't do that and so been Adam but he doesn't do that and so been Adam but he doesn't do that and so he does Adam and Eve and then from that he does Adam and Eve and then from that he does Adam and Eve and then from that you see throughout scripture even early you see throughout scripture even early you see throughout scripture even early as early as uh as early as Moses you see as early as uh as early as Moses you see as early as uh as early as Moses you see the Jethro principle of him trying to uh the Jethro principle of him trying to uh the Jethro principle of him trying to uh forget that first message and do all the forget that first message and do all the forget that first message and do all the ministry on his own and his ministry on his own and his ministry on his own and his father-in-law comes in with great advice father-in-law comes in with great advice father-in-law comes in with great advice and says what you're doing is not good and says what you're doing is not good and says what you're doing is not good and there's a multip of leaders and so and there's a multip of leaders and so and there's a multip of leaders and so for us we're just kind of seeing that for us we're just kind of seeing that for us we're just kind of seeing that thread throughout the scripture and for thread throughout the scripture and for thread throughout the scripture and for us we're saying this has to happen from

us we're saying this has to happen from us we're saying this has to happen from a very theological concept and then a very theological concept and then a very theological concept and then secondly um and always secondly we see secondly um and always secondly we see secondly um and always secondly we see it as just a real practical Theology of it as just a real practical Theology of it as just a real practical Theology of humanity humanity is going to ever since humanity humanity is going to ever since humanity humanity is going to ever since the fall we're going to die and if we the fall we're going to die and if we the fall we're going to die and if we care about the glory of God as the care about the glory of God as the care about the glory of God as the Supreme thing for the church um then our Supreme thing for the church um then our Supreme thing for the church um then our Glory um our Fame our um our our being Glory um our Fame our um our our being Glory um our Fame our um our our being lifted up all always become secondary um lifted up all always become secondary um lifted up all always become secondary um at minimum secondary and so therefore at minimum secondary and so therefore at minimum secondary and so therefore for us we say listen what's best for the for us we say listen what's best for the for us we say listen what's best for the church is for people not to be um hinged church is for people not to be um hinged church is for people not to be um hinged on our abilities our talents and all all on our abilities our talents and all all on our abilities our talents and all all sorts of the things that God's put sorts of the things that God's put sorts of the things that God's put really good stuff in us but it should be really good stuff in us but it should be really good stuff in us but it should be hinged on um this plural leadership so hinged on um this plural leadership so hinged on um this plural leadership so that if one leader either dies or gets that if one leader either dies or gets that if one leader either dies or gets sent across the seas or Falls in sent across the seas or Falls in sent across the seas or Falls in Ministry all those things God has Ministry all those things God has Ministry all those things God has already taken care of taken care of by already taken care of taken care of by already taken care of taken care of by offering to us the wisdom and Grace of offering to us the wisdom and Grace of offering to us the wisdom and Grace of plural leadership and so we're plural leadership and so we're plural leadership and so we're constantly teaching our people listen uh constantly teaching our people listen uh constantly teaching our people listen uh because of humanity uh we need plural because of humanity uh we need plural because of humanity uh we need plural leaderships and because of God we need leaderships and because of God we need leaderships and because of God we need plural leadership and uh our our our plural leadership and uh our our our plural leadership and uh our our our folks are embracing it because I think folks are embracing it because I think folks are embracing it because I think everyone um at least in our day and age everyone um at least in our day and age everyone um at least in our day and age while we like these gigantic Heroes while we like these gigantic Heroes while we like these gigantic Heroes we're also becoming more and more we're also becoming more and more we're also becoming more and more distrusting of them because humans keep distrusting of them because humans keep distrusting of them because humans keep being human at an alarm alarming being human at an alarm alarming being human at an alarm alarming regularity so very true wow that's regularity so very true wow that's regularity so very true wow that's that's very good now the amazing thing that's very good now the amazing thing that's very good now the amazing thing is I think there's a lot of church is I think there's a lot of church is I think there's a lot of church leaders um who they would believe that leaders um who they would believe that leaders um who they would believe that but have been unable to kind of but have been unable to kind of but have been unable to kind of operationalize that have been able to operationalize that have been able to operationalize that have been able to have been unable to build a culture what

have been unable to build a culture what have been unable to build a culture what have you done at Austin Stone to kind of have you done at Austin Stone to kind of have you done at Austin Stone to kind of take that and then transform that into a take that and then transform that into a take that and then transform that into a culture that actually values and is culture that actually values and is culture that actually values and is developing leaders man that's great developing leaders man that's great developing leaders man that's great thanks for asking that uh well a couple thanks for asking that uh well a couple thanks for asking that uh well a couple of things is uh first and foremost we're of things is uh first and foremost we're of things is uh first and foremost we're going to model it in our leadership going to model it in our leadership going to model it in our leadership structures uh and so we we will always structures uh and so we we will always structures uh and so we we will always talk about listen we're not going to talk about listen we're not going to talk about listen we're not going to make we're not going to make me major make we're not going to make me major make we're not going to make me major decisions without a team now it doesn't decisions without a team now it doesn't decisions without a team now it doesn't always have to be the same team and always have to be the same team and always have to be the same team and that's the real magic sauce is there are that's the real magic sauce is there are that's the real magic sauce is there are lots of conversations happening every lots of conversations happening every lots of conversations happening every day um that we want to happen in team day um that we want to happen in team day um that we want to happen in team but if you if you narrow it down to a but if you if you narrow it down to a but if you if you narrow it down to a team makes all the decisions uh then team makes all the decisions uh then team makes all the decisions uh then really what you're doing is not creating really what you're doing is not creating really what you're doing is not creating multiplication you're just creating a multiplication you're just creating a multiplication you're just creating a bottleneck and so even at our Elder team bottleneck and so even at our Elder team bottleneck and so even at our Elder team we have one Elder team in one sense but we have one Elder team in one sense but we have one Elder team in one sense but at another sense we have teams of teams at another sense we have teams of teams at another sense we have teams of teams and so there's one set of Elder teams and so there's one set of Elder teams and so there's one set of Elder teams who's who's going to focus on legal and who's who's going to focus on legal and who's who's going to focus on legal and financial decisions and crazy enough I'm financial decisions and crazy enough I'm financial decisions and crazy enough I'm not on that nor is Matt Carter on that not on that nor is Matt Carter on that not on that nor is Matt Carter on that but rather we have to listen to those but rather we have to listen to those but rather we have to listen to those guys make decisions um as a different guys make decisions um as a different guys make decisions um as a different team may make strategic decisions team may make strategic decisions team may make strategic decisions they're going to be forced to have they're going to be forced to have they're going to be forced to have plural leadership as they make a plural leadership as they make a plural leadership as they make a decision together about okay if I need decision together about okay if I need decision together about okay if I need resources and you have a vision we're resources and you have a vision we're resources and you have a vision we're going to have to get together and talk going to have to get together and talk going to have to get together and talk and so there's a modeling of it in the and so there's a modeling of it in the and so there's a modeling of it in the way that we make decisions which really way that we make decisions which really way that we make decisions which really does trickle down to the whole does trickle down to the whole does trickle down to the whole organization but secondly in developing organization but secondly in developing organization but secondly in developing leaders um one of the biggest issues for leaders um one of the biggest issues for leaders um one of the biggest issues for us is not only to teach the culture um us is not only to teach the culture um us is not only to teach the culture um and teach the convictions but to and teach the convictions but to and teach the convictions but to actually have constructs if you don't actually have constructs if you don't actually have constructs if you don't have the constructs the ideas never have the constructs the ideas never have the constructs the ideas never actually move forward and so to get real actually move forward and so to get real actually move forward and so to get real practical and tactical we do a couple of

practical and tactical we do a couple of practical and tactical we do a couple of things number one we have a very clear things number one we have a very clear things number one we have a very clear articulated leadership development articulated leadership development articulated leadership development pipeline at our church uh there's not a pipeline at our church uh there's not a pipeline at our church uh there's not a secret pen that shows up on your pillow secret pen that shows up on your pillow secret pen that shows up on your pillow if you to enter into leadership it's not if you to enter into leadership it's not if you to enter into leadership it's not like getting into skull and bones at like getting into skull and bones at like getting into skull and bones at Yale or something like that so if people Yale or something like that so if people Yale or something like that so if people want to become an elder if they want to want to become an elder if they want to want to become an elder if they want to become a deacon we're not saying you're become a deacon we're not saying you're become a deacon we're not saying you're going to become one but we're saying you going to become one but we're saying you going to become one but we're saying you can raise your hand and here's the can raise your hand and here's the can raise your hand and here's the course to get into it one of our course to get into it one of our course to get into it one of our constant lines to them is if you'll have constant lines to them is if you'll have constant lines to them is if you'll have the courage to raise your hand we'll the courage to raise your hand we'll the courage to raise your hand we'll have the courage to tell you no if we have the courage to tell you no if we have the courage to tell you no if we don't see the calling but we're not GNA don't see the calling but we're not GNA don't see the calling but we're not GNA just uh leave it as an unspoken we'll just uh leave it as an unspoken we'll just uh leave it as an unspoken we'll let you know if we think you're great let you know if we think you're great let you know if we think you're great right and so here's what we do is is we right and so here's what we do is is we right and so here's what we do is is we have an articulated pipeline that says have an articulated pipeline that says have an articulated pipeline that says if you want to become a leader sign up if you want to become a leader sign up if you want to become a leader sign up for this there's an application process for this there's an application process for this there's an application process that you go through there's an interview that you go through there's an interview that you go through there's an interview process that you go through to get into process that you go through to get into process that you go through to get into our leadership development Pipeline and our leadership development Pipeline and our leadership development Pipeline and then from them we have really carefully then from them we have really carefully then from them we have really carefully articulated uh competencies whether and articulated uh competencies whether and articulated uh competencies whether and these competencies kind of fall in three these competencies kind of fall in three these competencies kind of fall in three categories um we have theological categories um we have theological categories um we have theological competencies because this is at the core competencies because this is at the core competencies because this is at the core a church that is going to disseminate a church that is going to disseminate a church that is going to disseminate God's word and so it's not just God's word and so it's not just God's word and so it's not just skill-based compet there's some skill-based compet there's some skill-based compet there's some theological based competencies second theological based competencies second theological based competencies second there are skill-based competencies there are skill-based competencies there are skill-based competencies there's some skills that you have to do there's some skills that you have to do there's some skills that you have to do to progress through different leadership to progress through different leadership to progress through different leadership layers and then finally um there's some layers and then finally um there's some layers and then finally um there's some character competencies because again character competencies because again character competencies because again this is the primary qualifier at least this is the primary qualifier at least this is the primary qualifier at least in scripture for what it takes to be a in scripture for what it takes to be a in scripture for what it takes to be a Biblical leader and so we're going to Biblical leader and so we're going to Biblical leader and so we're going to we're basically going to just level out we're basically going to just level out we're basically going to just level out the competency map and say you're going the competency map and say you're going the competency map and say you're going to have to achieve these different to have to achieve these different to have to achieve these different benchmarks as you go forward and so

benchmarks as you go forward and so benchmarks as you go forward and so there's no secret how to get in there's there's no secret how to get in there's there's no secret how to get in there's no secret how to progress and then no secret how to progress and then no secret how to progress and then finally we're always going to have what finally we're always going to have what finally we're always going to have what we call sending platforms there's going we call sending platforms there's going we call sending platforms there's going to be an opportunity for people not only to be an opportunity for people not only to be an opportunity for people not only to get trained but once they get trained to get trained but once they get trained to get trained but once they get trained to find leadership positions whether to find leadership positions whether to find leadership positions whether they're in the church in the world or at they're in the church in the world or at they're in the church in the world or at other churches we're those are all wins other churches we're those are all wins other churches we're those are all wins for us um but we have real specific ways for us um but we have real specific ways for us um but we have real specific ways that we're helping place our leaders in that we're helping place our leaders in that we're helping place our leaders in leadership positions and sometimes leadership positions and sometimes leadership positions and sometimes leadership pipelines are just education leadership pipelines are just education leadership pipelines are just education pipelines because they don't have that pipelines because they don't have that pipelines because they don't have that final piece U that helps you find a final piece U that helps you find a final piece U that helps you find a place to lead um and we're working place to lead um and we're working place to lead um and we're working really really hard to make that happen really really hard to make that happen really really hard to make that happen now let's that that's fascinating now let's that that's fascinating now let's that that's fascinating there's a lot there thank you so much uh there's a lot there thank you so much uh there's a lot there thank you so much uh you know for that on the very front end you know for that on the very front end you know for that on the very front end people self-identifying I first of all I people self-identifying I first of all I people self-identifying I first of all I want I don't want anyone to miss that I want I don't want anyone to miss that I want I don't want anyone to miss that I love what you're saying there it's got love what you're saying there it's got love what you're saying there it's got to be super clear super obvious there's to be super clear super obvious there's to be super clear super obvious there's not like the secret you know handshake I not like the secret you know handshake I not like the secret you know handshake I love that because I think a lot of times love that because I think a lot of times love that because I think a lot of times in churches we put we add friction in in churches we put we add friction in in churches we put we add friction in areas we shouldn't we make things more areas we shouldn't we make things more areas we shouldn't we make things more complex than we should and I just love complex than we should and I just love complex than we should and I just love that I think that's great what about the that I think that's great what about the that I think that's great what about the converse problem of that the people who converse problem of that the people who converse problem of that the people who rais their hand aren't necessarily the rais their hand aren't necessarily the rais their hand aren't necessarily the people you know aren't you people you know aren't you people you know aren't you disproportionately asking people the disproportionately asking people the disproportionately asking people the guys who necessarily are saying they guys who necessarily are saying they guys who necessarily are saying they want to be leaders aren't maybe the want to be leaders aren't maybe the want to be leaders aren't maybe the people you want uh to to be leaders how people you want uh to to be leaders how people you want uh to to be leaders how do you deal with that yeah and you know do you deal with that yeah and you know do you deal with that yeah and you know that just starts with I think some some that just starts with I think some some that just starts with I think some some good biblical discipleship conversations good biblical discipleship conversations good biblical discipleship conversations what I love about leadership development what I love about leadership development what I love about leadership development is it at its court is a subset of is it at its court is a subset of is it at its court is a subset of spiritual formation right so leadership spiritual formation right so leadership spiritual formation right so leadership development is not something different development is not something different development is not something different it's a subset of it and so even in the it's a subset of it and so even in the it's a subset of it and so even in the conversation of someone saying I don't

conversation of someone saying I don't conversation of someone saying I don't think you're called the lead at a higher think you're called the lead at a higher think you're called the lead at a higher level or a bigger group of people we're level or a bigger group of people we're level or a bigger group of people we're still getting our job done and still getting our job done and still getting our job done and spiritually forming them and so what spiritually forming them and so what spiritually forming them and so what we'll talk about with leadership is um we'll talk about with leadership is um we'll talk about with leadership is um we feel like most people are going to be we feel like most people are going to be we feel like most people are going to be called to lead in some capacity and it called to lead in some capacity and it called to lead in some capacity and it may or may not be in the capacity that may or may not be in the capacity that may or may not be in the capacity that you want but in some and so we get you want but in some and so we get you want but in some and so we get everyone to raise their hands I'd like everyone to raise their hands I'd like everyone to raise their hands I'd like to start because at at the bare minimum to start because at at the bare minimum to start because at at the bare minimum God has called every believer to make God has called every believer to make God has called every believer to make disciples who make disciples who make disciples who make disciples who make disciples who make disciples who make disciples so at some level you're called disciples so at some level you're called disciples so at some level you're called to lead at least a few other people yes to lead at least a few other people yes to lead at least a few other people yes uh just biblically speaking and so when uh just biblically speaking and so when uh just biblically speaking and so when you raise your hand we're aiming in the you raise your hand we're aiming in the you raise your hand we're aiming in the first course for that in that first first course for that in that first first course for that in that first section of your leadership development section of your leadership development section of your leadership development we're saying can you make disciples That we're saying can you make disciples That we're saying can you make disciples That Make Disciples now after raising your Make Disciples now after raising your Make Disciples now after raising your hand for there it's going to be a hand for there it's going to be a hand for there it's going to be a collaborative conversation whether we're collaborative conversation whether we're collaborative conversation whether we're going to learn the skills that are going to learn the skills that are going to learn the skills that are necessary to lead a group of 10 and then necessary to lead a group of 10 and then necessary to lead a group of 10 and then we're going to we're going to have we're going to we're going to have we're going to we're going to have another collaborative conversation to another collaborative conversation to another collaborative conversation to say do we think do we cooperatively say do we think do we cooperatively say do we think do we cooperatively think that you should learn what it think that you should learn what it think that you should learn what it means to lead leaders of groups of 10 means to lead leaders of groups of 10 means to lead leaders of groups of 10 and then again there's going to be this and then again there's going to be this and then again there's going to be this other Benchmark time period assessment other Benchmark time period assessment other Benchmark time period assessment period that say do you need to move on period that say do you need to move on period that say do you need to move on to the next set of competencies that to the next set of competencies that to the next set of competencies that help you lead leaders of leaders of help you lead leaders of leaders of help you lead leaders of leaders of groups of 10 which is now Resource groups of 10 which is now Resource groups of 10 which is now Resource Management resource allocation whole Management resource allocation whole Management resource allocation whole different set of competencies and in different set of competencies and in different set of competencies and in each way there's a great discipleship each way there's a great discipleship each way there's a great discipleship conversation so it's not even a loss conversation so it's not even a loss conversation so it's not even a loss when they're raising their hand for the when they're raising their hand for the when they're raising their hand for the next level but the answer is no it's next level but the answer is no it's next level but the answer is no it's still doing what the church is called to still doing what the church is called to still doing what the church is called to do which is to make disciples of Jesus do which is to make disciples of Jesus do which is to make disciples of Jesus Christ fa fascinating this has been a Christ fa fascinating this has been a Christ fa fascinating this has been a great conversation uh what would you say

great conversation uh what would you say great conversation uh what would you say the connection between Austin Stone's the connection between Austin Stone's the connection between Austin Stone's growth your impact in the culture your growth your impact in the culture your growth your impact in the culture your ability to impact and then connect get ability to impact and then connect get ability to impact and then connect get people plugged in discipled um what is people plugged in discipled um what is people plugged in discipled um what is the connection between that that's the connection between that that's the connection between that that's happening and this leadership happening and this leadership happening and this leadership development kind of culture you know development kind of culture you know development kind of culture you know that obviously has been driven deep in that obviously has been driven deep in that obviously has been driven deep in what in what you're doing how are those what in what you're doing how are those what in what you're doing how are those two linked together two linked together two linked together yeah I you know I think you know in our yeah I you know I think you know in our yeah I you know I think you know in our big failure reports uh throughout big failure reports uh throughout big failure reports uh throughout throughout Austin Stone history if you throughout Austin Stone history if you throughout Austin Stone history if you ask us where our big failure points were ask us where our big failure points were ask us where our big failure points were we would be able to point back to a we would be able to point back to a we would be able to point back to a place where we ran out of leaders okay place where we ran out of leaders okay place where we ran out of leaders okay right uh where there was a place where right uh where there was a place where right uh where there was a place where there were still people who wanted to there were still people who wanted to there were still people who wanted to come to Christ because while we love come to Christ because while we love come to Christ because while we love plurality and we love uh leadership plurality and we love uh leadership plurality and we love uh leadership development we still have some development we still have some development we still have some incredibly gifted leaders at the helm incredibly gifted leaders at the helm incredibly gifted leaders at the helm and what we're not saying is that really and what we're not saying is that really and what we're not saying is that really gifted men don't have an ormous impact gifted men don't have an ormous impact gifted men don't have an ormous impact they do the problem is what do you do they do the problem is what do you do they do the problem is what do you do with that impact and what do you do with with that impact and what do you do with with that impact and what do you do with that fruit and and in so many places you that fruit and and in so many places you that fruit and and in so many places you have these incredibly gifted leaders have these incredibly gifted leaders have these incredibly gifted leaders that can attract the crowds but they that can attract the crowds but they that can attract the crowds but they can't mobilize the crowds they can't can't mobilize the crowds they can't can't mobilize the crowds they can't move the crowds because the crowds move the crowds because the crowds move the crowds because the crowds eventually won't have the skill they eventually won't have the skill they eventually won't have the skill they won't have the experience and they won't won't have the experience and they won't won't have the experience and they won't have the character shaping or the have the character shaping or the have the character shaping or the theological robust development in order theological robust development in order theological robust development in order to kind of lead past the just okay I'm to kind of lead past the just okay I'm to kind of lead past the just okay I'm in I'm in for Jesus now what and so so in I'm in for Jesus now what and so so in I'm in for Jesus now what and so so we would get to these places where we would get to these places where we would get to these places where crowds would gather but then we couldn't crowds would gather but then we couldn't crowds would gather but then we couldn't mobilize those crowds into being able to mobilize those crowds into being able to mobilize those crowds into being able to be good discipl makers good leaders and be good discipl makers good leaders and be good discipl makers good leaders and so we couldn't multiply we could just so we couldn't multiply we could just so we couldn't multiply we could just add and that was the growth barriers add and that was the growth barriers add and that was the growth barriers growth barriers happen for us when you

growth barriers happen for us when you growth barriers happen for us when you don't have enough leaders to multiply don't have enough leaders to multiply don't have enough leaders to multiply you only have enough leaders to keep you only have enough leaders to keep you only have enough leaders to keep adding and so for us that that that has adding and so for us that that that has adding and so for us that that that has been for us when we feel a growth been for us when we feel a growth been for us when we feel a growth barrier there is a possibility it's barrier there is a possibility it's barrier there is a possibility it's parking don't get me wrong there's a parking don't get me wrong there's a parking don't get me wrong there's a possibility um it's it's seats but what possibility um it's it's seats but what possibility um it's it's seats but what we're finding is if you have enough we're finding is if you have enough we're finding is if you have enough leaders they'll go solve the parking leaders they'll go solve the parking leaders they'll go solve the parking problem yes so one of constant constant problem yes so one of constant constant problem yes so one of constant constant uh what we call is those those those uh uh what we call is those those those uh uh what we call is those those those uh those kind of Plum lines for us is every those kind of Plum lines for us is every those kind of Plum lines for us is every problem is a leadership problem at the problem is a leadership problem at the problem is a leadership problem at the end of the day because problem it could end of the day because problem it could end of the day because problem it could have got solved if you had a leader to have got solved if you had a leader to have got solved if you had a leader to solve it absolutely that's that's solve it absolutely that's that's solve it absolutely that's that's fantastic well this has been a great fantastic well this has been a great fantastic well this has been a great conversation there's a lot here you know conversation there's a lot here you know conversation there's a lot here you know you feel like when you're just taking a you feel like when you're just taking a you feel like when you're just taking a step in you're like gosh there's so much step in you're like gosh there's so much step in you're like gosh there's so much there I wish I could could dive in now there I wish I could could dive in now there I wish I could could dive in now what I understand is um you've teamed up what I understand is um you've teamed up what I understand is um you've teamed up with Eric guer LifeWay resources you're with Eric guer LifeWay resources you're with Eric guer LifeWay resources you're releasing a great uh book called design releasing a great uh book called design releasing a great uh book called design to lead it comes out September 1st um to lead it comes out September 1st um to lead it comes out September 1st um can you tell us a little bit about that can you tell us a little bit about that can you tell us a little bit about that because I'm hoping people are leaning in because I'm hoping people are leaning in because I'm hoping people are leaning in they're madly trying to take notes but they're madly trying to take notes but they're madly trying to take notes but they probably want to dig a little bit they probably want to dig a little bit they probably want to dig a little bit deeper tell us why did you write the deeper tell us why did you write the deeper tell us why did you write the book and what are you hoping um you know book and what are you hoping um you know book and what are you hoping um you know church leaders will benefit from reading church leaders will benefit from reading church leaders will benefit from reading it yeah no we wrote the book I think it yeah no we wrote the book I think it yeah no we wrote the book I think primarily because we saw this problem as primarily because we saw this problem as primarily because we saw this problem as a problem that everybody kind of gets a problem that everybody kind of gets a problem that everybody kind of gets the sense is an issue but there's not a the sense is an issue but there's not a the sense is an issue but there's not a a real robust or clear pathway to solve a real robust or clear pathway to solve a real robust or clear pathway to solve it uh at least uh at least in our it uh at least uh at least in our it uh at least uh at least in our experience there's good resources out experience there's good resources out experience there's good resources out there for each kind of different aspect there for each kind of different aspect there for each kind of different aspect of it but no one really puts it together of it but no one really puts it together of it but no one really puts it together in a easily to follow form and so that's

in a easily to follow form and so that's in a easily to follow form and so that's what we did so the book kind of follows what we did so the book kind of follows what we did so the book kind of follows the the three things that I just the the three things that I just the the three things that I just outlined we spend the first third of the outlined we spend the first third of the outlined we spend the first third of the book talking about here's the book talking about here's the book talking about here's the convictions that are necessary for you'd convictions that are necessary for you'd convictions that are necessary for you'd have a leadership development uh have a leadership development uh have a leadership development uh happening in your church now second happening in your church now second happening in your church now second third of the book is here's to build a third of the book is here's to build a third of the book is here's to build a culture of leadership development and culture of leadership development and culture of leadership development and then that third part of the book talks then that third part of the book talks then that third part of the book talks about here's how to build formal about here's how to build formal about here's how to build formal constructs for leadership development constructs for leadership development constructs for leadership development within the church because it all for us within the church because it all for us within the church because it all for us builds off of the conviction that God builds off of the conviction that God builds off of the conviction that God actually designed the church to develop actually designed the church to develop actually designed the church to develop leaders and secondly in a really leaders and secondly in a really leaders and secondly in a really intentional double onanda there he he intentional double onanda there he he intentional double onanda there he he designed men and women to lead that's designed men and women to lead that's designed men and women to lead that's part of the IMO day um is if God is part of the IMO day um is if God is part of the IMO day um is if God is ultimately building a kingdom and is a ultimately building a kingdom and is a ultimately building a kingdom and is a kingdom and he made us in His image to kingdom and he made us in His image to kingdom and he made us in His image to be these these servant leaders these be these these servant leaders these be these these servant leaders these servant Kings across the world that servant Kings across the world that servant Kings across the world that we're designed to lead in some sense and we're designed to lead in some sense and we're designed to lead in some sense and so how can the church take a front row so how can the church take a front row so how can the church take a front row uh seat in the uh in the in the goal to uh seat in the uh in the in the goal to uh seat in the uh in the in the goal to make leaders of mankind so we think the make leaders of mankind so we think the make leaders of mankind so we think the church really ought to be at the church really ought to be at the church really ought to be at the Forefront of developing leaders uh for Forefront of developing leaders uh for Forefront of developing leaders uh for the benefit of God's church and the the benefit of God's church and the the benefit of God's church and the benefit of God's kingdom across the benefit of God's kingdom across the benefit of God's kingdom across the globe so hopefully this resource will be globe so hopefully this resource will be globe so hopefully this resource will be um helpful to people and so that was our um helpful to people and so that was our um helpful to people and so that was our intention and write it with the book intention and write it with the book intention and write it with the book you'll always have to wait and see this you'll always have to wait and see this you'll always have to wait and see this is the Seminary podcast stuff you wish is the Seminary podcast stuff you wish is the Seminary podcast stuff you wish they taught in seminary well we're going they taught in seminary well we're going they taught in seminary well we're going to jump into the light lightning round to jump into the light lightning round to jump into the light lightning round that part of the episode where we ask that part of the episode where we ask that part of the episode where we ask similar questions of everybody that's on similar questions of everybody that's on similar questions of everybody that's on the show today super excited to have the show today super excited to have the show today super excited to have Kevin pek with us from Austin Stone Kevin pek with us from Austin Stone Kevin pek with us from Austin Stone Church just a great leader um fantastic Church just a great leader um fantastic Church just a great leader um fantastic Church you should be following him and

Church you should be following him and Church you should be following him and uh the church for sure um what are some uh the church for sure um what are some uh the church for sure um what are some online resources that you're using these online resources that you're using these online resources that you're using these days that are helping you in your days that are helping you in your days that are helping you in your ministry well a couple just from the ministry well a couple just from the ministry well a couple just from the real practical side I'm a Evernote freak real practical side I'm a Evernote freak real practical side I'm a Evernote freak and and a wonderless junkie I use and and a wonderless junkie I use and and a wonderless junkie I use wonderless really primarily to to keep wonderless really primarily to to keep wonderless really primarily to to keep keep track of the things I need to get keep track of the things I need to get keep track of the things I need to get done so email that is an action item done so email that is an action item done so email that is an action item goes straight there and then Evernote is goes straight there and then Evernote is goes straight there and then Evernote is the place where I store things that I the place where I store things that I the place where I store things that I want to read and um things that I want want to read and um things that I want want to read and um things that I want to curates for for later resources to curates for for later resources to curates for for later resources caused me a lot of not having to start caused me a lot of not having to start caused me a lot of not having to start over from scratch whenever I'm over from scratch whenever I'm over from scratch whenever I'm developing content is just having good developing content is just having good developing content is just having good tags in my Evernote love that from a tags in my Evernote love that from a tags in my Evernote love that from a Content perspective some of my favorite Content perspective some of my favorite Content perspective some of my favorite stuff out there in the world is uh is stuff out there in the world is uh is stuff out there in the world is uh is unseminary podcast one of my favorite unseminary podcast one of my favorite unseminary podcast one of my favorite out there in the whole wide world oh now out there in the whole wide world oh now out there in the whole wide world oh now I got to send you 20 bucks I got to send you 20 bucks I got to send you 20 bucks yeah uh and an angel got his wings uh yeah uh and an angel got his wings uh yeah uh and an angel got his wings uh and secondly uh aan uh I really love the and secondly uh aan uh I really love the and secondly uh aan uh I really love the Gospel Coalition website erlc website Gospel Coalition website erlc website Gospel Coalition website erlc website right now has been really helpful for right now has been really helpful for right now has been really helpful for intersecting cultural issues in the intersecting cultural issues in the intersecting cultural issues in the world I love Desiring God obviously world I love Desiring God obviously world I love Desiring God obviously because you know it's it's Dr Piper nice because you know it's it's Dr Piper nice because you know it's it's Dr Piper nice very cool um what's a book you've read very cool um what's a book you've read very cool um what's a book you've read in the last six months that's had an in the last six months that's had an in the last six months that's had an impact on your thinking or Ministry yeah impact on your thinking or Ministry yeah impact on your thinking or Ministry yeah a really great book for me has been in a really great book for me has been in a really great book for me has been in Christ Gathering him for the World by Christ Gathering him for the World by Christ Gathering him for the World by Steve timus and de la Hoy uh both these Steve timus and de la Hoy uh both these Steve timus and de la Hoy uh both these guys have done tremendous work in guys have done tremendous work in guys have done tremendous work in basically just creating what I think is basically just creating what I think is basically just creating what I think is a uh good biblical the Theology of the a uh good biblical the Theology of the a uh good biblical the Theology of the term in Christ and really really term in Christ and really really term in Christ and really really practical implications what it means for practical implications what it means for practical implications what it means for us as Christians being Christ on the us as Christians being Christ on the us as Christians being Christ on the church on our mission uh on the way we church on our mission uh on the way we church on our mission uh on the way we interact with each other how how we

interact with each other how how we interact with each other how how we interact with each other within the interact with each other within the interact with each other within the church really really helpful um stuff uh church really really helpful um stuff uh church really really helpful um stuff uh for me and just understanding the power for me and just understanding the power for me and just understanding the power that God has um put in the church and that God has um put in the church and that God has um put in the church and how it practically plays out in this how it practically plays out in this how it practically plays out in this wonderful and glorious Doctrine called wonderful and glorious Doctrine called wonderful and glorious Doctrine called being in Christ very cool um what's being in Christ very cool um what's being in Christ very cool um what's another Ministry you're looking at another Ministry you're looking at another Ministry you're looking at that's inspiring you these days people that's inspiring you these days people that's inspiring you these days people look at Austin Stone often are inspired look at Austin Stone often are inspired look at Austin Stone often are inspired by your ministry who who are you looking by your ministry who who are you looking by your ministry who who are you looking at being inspired by yeah without a at being inspired by yeah without a at being inspired by yeah without a doubt Redeemer Dubai uh Dave Ferman and doubt Redeemer Dubai uh Dave Ferman and doubt Redeemer Dubai uh Dave Ferman and also uh another great leader Scott also uh another great leader Scott also uh another great leader Scott Zeller there leading their their Church Zeller there leading their their Church Zeller there leading their their Church multiplication efforts there a church multiplication efforts there a church multiplication efforts there a church that is just um greatly impacting the that is just um greatly impacting the that is just um greatly impacting the world because they sit the crossroads of world because they sit the crossroads of world because they sit the crossroads of the East uh in Dubai right now and just the East uh in Dubai right now and just the East uh in Dubai right now and just watching god grow that church and not watching god grow that church and not watching god grow that church and not only grow that church but multiply that only grow that church but multiply that only grow that church but multiply that church seeing Church Church planners church seeing Church Church planners church seeing Church Church planners grow all over the world in places where grow all over the world in places where grow all over the world in places where churches just are not yet really churches just are not yet really churches just are not yet really incredible Church amazing well if you incredible Church amazing well if you incredible Church amazing well if you could get 15 minutes with any leader could get 15 minutes with any leader could get 15 minutes with any leader alive who would that be and why yeah so alive who would that be and why yeah so alive who would that be and why yeah so right now uh answer would be Russell right now uh answer would be Russell right now uh answer would be Russell Moore uh good friend but can't seem to Moore uh good friend but can't seem to Moore uh good friend but can't seem to get enough time with him right now uh get enough time with him right now uh get enough time with him right now uh and uh planned that answer before uh and uh planned that answer before uh and uh planned that answer before uh Twitter and Donald Trump the other day Twitter and Donald Trump the other day Twitter and Donald Trump the other day yes which just makes me want to talk to yes which just makes me want to talk to yes which just makes me want to talk to him Morey going on exactly what's that him Morey going on exactly what's that him Morey going on exactly what's that like when you get blown up by a like when you get blown up by a like when you get blown up by a presidential candidate yeah uh I think presidential candidate yeah uh I think presidential candidate yeah uh I think he is tackling some of I think the most he is tackling some of I think the most he is tackling some of I think the most difficult issues in the whole wide world difficult issues in the whole wide world difficult issues in the whole wide world right now from an evangelic perspective right now from an evangelic perspective right now from an evangelic perspective and he does it with grace and truth in a and he does it with grace and truth in a and he does it with grace and truth in a way that very very few men can uh so uh

way that very very few men can uh so uh way that very very few men can uh so uh would love to get more and more time would love to get more and more time would love to get more and more time with him because I think uh the reason with him because I think uh the reason with him because I think uh the reason there's such a spotlight on him is there's such a spotlight on him is there's such a spotlight on him is because he is tackling issues right now because he is tackling issues right now because he is tackling issues right now in a way that I think is as thoughtful in a way that I think is as thoughtful in a way that I think is as thoughtful as anybody else out there very cool well as anybody else out there very cool well as anybody else out there very cool well I appreciate you being on the show I I appreciate you being on the show I I appreciate you being on the show I know you've got a lot going on um when know you've got a lot going on um when know you've got a lot going on um when you just want to kick back relax uh you you just want to kick back relax uh you you just want to kick back relax uh you know kind of have a little bit of fun know kind of have a little bit of fun know kind of have a little bit of fun what do you do for fun these days I what do you do for fun these days I what do you do for fun these days I coach kids sport teams uh I got three coach kids sport teams uh I got three coach kids sport teams uh I got three daughters though so it's a little daughters though so it's a little daughters though so it's a little bananas in my bananas in my bananas in my household right now we're playing household right now we're playing household right now we're playing competitive kickball which I bet you competitive kickball which I bet you competitive kickball which I bet you didn't know was a thing I didn't know didn't know was a thing I didn't know didn't know was a thing I didn't know that's a thing it's totally a thing and that's a thing it's totally a thing and that's a thing it's totally a thing and trust me it's a big deal uh my daughters trust me it's a big deal uh my daughters trust me it's a big deal uh my daughters love it and I love coaching it it's a love it and I love coaching it it's a love it and I love coaching it it's a lot of lot of lot of fun and uh yeah very cool well if people fun and uh yeah very cool well if people fun and uh yeah very cool well if people want to get in touch with you um learn want to get in touch with you um learn want to get in touch with you um learn more about the book um you know learn more about the book um you know learn more about the book um you know learn more about Austin Stone how can they do more about Austin Stone how can they do more about Austin Stone how can they do that yeah a great way is just following that yeah a great way is just following that yeah a great way is just following on Twitter uh I picked the the most uh on Twitter uh I picked the the most uh on Twitter uh I picked the the most uh insanely dumb Twitter handle in the insanely dumb Twitter handle in the insanely dumb Twitter handle in the world because I didn't know Twitter was world because I didn't know Twitter was world because I didn't know Twitter was going to be a thing uh it's uncore going to be a thing uh it's uncore going to be a thing uh it's uncore kcore nice I love to I I keep that kcore nice I love to I I keep that kcore nice I love to I I keep that updated pretty pretty frequently updated pretty pretty frequently updated pretty pretty frequently throughout the week uh also feel free to throughout the week uh also feel free to throughout the week uh also feel free to hit us up at Austin stone.org love hit us up at Austin stone.org love hit us up at Austin stone.org love connect with you there great thanks so connect with you there great thanks so connect with you there great thanks so much I really appreciate being on the much I really appreciate being on the much I really appreciate being on the show today you rich thank you thank you show today you rich thank you thank you show today you rich thank you thank you for tuning in to this week's unseminary for tuning in to this week's unseminary for tuning in to this week's unseminary podcast don't be shy we'd love to podcast don't be shy we'd love to podcast don't be shy we'd love to connect check out unseminary inbox you connect check out unseminary inbox you connect check out unseminary inbox you can sign up at unseminary dcom and we'll can sign up at unseminary dcom and we'll can sign up at unseminary dcom and we'll send you helpful training resources send you helpful training resources send you helpful training resources every week plus you'll gain immediate

every week plus you'll gain immediate every week plus you'll gain immediate access to our exclusive members area access to our exclusive members area access to our exclusive members area with tons of resources you can use with tons of resources you can use with tons of resources you can use connect with Rich on Twitter at Rich connect with Rich on Twitter at Rich connect with Rich on Twitter at Rich Birch or through email rich unseminary Birch or through email rich unseminary Birch or through email rich unseminary tocom don't forget to check out the show tocom don't forget to check out the show tocom don't forget to check out the show notes for this episode at unseminary notes for this episode at unseminary notes for this episode at unseminary tocom it includes links to what we tocom it includes links to what we tocom it includes links to what we talked about today and more leave a talked about today and more leave a talked about today and more leave a comment we'd love to hear from you did comment we'd love to hear from you did comment we'd love to hear from you did you enjoy today's episode drop by iTunes you enjoy today's episode drop by iTunes you enjoy today's episode drop by iTunes and leave a review Thanks again for and leave a review Thanks again for and leave a review Thanks again for tuning in to this week's un Seminary tuning in to this week's un Seminary tuning in to this week's un Seminary podcast join us next week when we'll podcast join us next week when we'll podcast join us next week when we'll learn more stuff we wish they taught in learn more stuff we wish they taught in learn more stuff we wish they taught in seminary