Ryan Visconti on Being Inside a Church Succession While Seeing it Grow from 300 to 1300!

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further faster have a sinking feeling that your have a sinking feeling that your have a sinking feeling that your ministry training didn't prepare you for ministry training didn't prepare you for ministry training didn't prepare you for the real world hey you're not alone join the real world hey you're not alone join the real world hey you're not alone join thousands of others have pursuit of thousands of others have pursuit of thousands of others have pursuit of stuff that we wish they had taught in stuff that we wish they had taught in stuff that we wish they had taught in seminary buckle up and let's get started seminary buckle up and let's get started seminary buckle up and let's get started with this week's on seminary podcast hey with this week's on seminary podcast hey with this week's on seminary podcast hey everybody welcome to the on seminary everybody welcome to the on seminary everybody welcome to the on seminary podcast my name is rich and I am so glad podcast my name is rich and I am so glad podcast my name is rich and I am so glad that you've decided to take some time that you've decided to take some time that you've decided to take some time out before we get into this weekend of out before we get into this weekend of out before we get into this weekend of ministry at your church to to listen ministry at your church to to listen ministry at your church to to listen into today's podcast you're going to be into today's podcast you're going to be into today's podcast you're going to be rewarded for that we've got Ryan rewarded for that we've got Ryan rewarded for that we've got Ryan Visconti from generation church this is Visconti from generation church this is Visconti from generation church this is a fantastic Church in Arizona that a fantastic Church in Arizona that a fantastic Church in Arizona that you're going to want to learn more about you're going to want to learn more about you're going to want to learn more about it Ryan welcome to the show hey riffs it Ryan welcome to the show hey riffs it Ryan welcome to the show hey riffs thank you thanks for having me on your thank you thanks for having me on your thank you thanks for having me on your show man in public I've been looking on show man in public I've been looking on show man in public I've been looking on earth this is this is going to be great earth this is this is going to be great earth this is this is going to be great why don't you kind of give us a bit of why don't you kind of give us a bit of why don't you kind of give us a bit of the generation story give me a sense of the generation story give me a sense of the generation story give me a sense of you know kind of if people were to show you know kind of if people were to show you know kind of if people were to show up this weekend what would the up this weekend what would the up this weekend what would the experience experience experience tell us a business story well my dad tell us a business story well my dad tell us a business story well my dad became the pastor of our church back in

became the pastor of our church back in became the pastor of our church back in 1999 and it was about 70 to 80 people 1999 and it was about 70 to 80 people 1999 and it was about 70 to 80 people with you know little little tiny with you know little little tiny with you know little little tiny facility and a lot of elderly people in facility and a lot of elderly people in facility and a lot of elderly people in the East Valley of Phoenix or a lot of the East Valley of Phoenix or a lot of the East Valley of Phoenix or a lot of people come to retire and he started people come to retire and he started people come to retire and he started doing really good stuff and doing a doing really good stuff and doing a doing really good stuff and doing a great job leading the church and it great job leading the church and it great job leading the church and it started to grow and they you know they started to grow and they you know they started to grow and they you know they build some facilities and started to build some facilities and started to build some facilities and started to really get some momentum and after they really get some momentum and after they really get some momentum and after they kind of peaked out I would say at about kind of peaked out I would say at about kind of peaked out I would say at about the 400 to 500 person mark and regular the 400 to 500 person mark and regular the 400 to 500 person mark and regular attendants they kind of started a subtle attendants they kind of started a subtle attendants they kind of started a subtle slow decline and I had left on home to slow decline and I had left on home to slow decline and I had left on home to go to the army as an army officer and go to the army as an army officer and go to the army as an army officer and never was planning to be in history by never was planning to be in history by never was planning to be in history by any stretch any stretch any stretch and unbeknownst to me I was actually in and unbeknownst to me I was actually in and unbeknownst to me I was actually in Iraq and I felt called in ministry and I Iraq and I felt called in ministry and I Iraq and I felt called in ministry and I was not super pumped about it at first was not super pumped about it at first was not super pumped about it at first let me tell you but over time you know let me tell you but over time you know let me tell you but over time you know God worked on my heart and I knew that's God worked on my heart and I knew that's God worked on my heart and I knew that's what I was supposed to do so I started I what I was supposed to do so I started I what I was supposed to do so I started I started you know just asking for advice started you know just asking for advice started you know just asking for advice for my dad and I I don't know why I for my dad and I I don't know why I for my dad and I I don't know why I didn't think about it but it was kind of didn't think about it but it was kind of didn't think about it but it was kind of a no-brainer in hindsight but he wanted a no-brainer in hindsight but he wanted a no-brainer in hindsight but he wanted me to come work with him and see if you me to come work with him and see if you me to come work with him and see if you know we could really do some things to know we could really do some things to know we could really do some things to turn the church around and he was turn the church around and he was turn the church around and he was totally ready for that a head started to totally ready for that a head started to totally ready for that a head started to decline I would say slowly for the last decline I would say slowly for the last decline I would say slowly for the last four or five years and he was just four or five years and he was just four or five years and he was just willing and ready to make any changes willing and ready to make any changes willing and ready to make any changes necessary so I came and started serving necessary so I came and started serving necessary so I came and started serving him kinda like a right-hand man and the him kinda like a right-hand man and the him kinda like a right-hand man and the churches maybe running about 300 people churches maybe running about 300 people churches maybe running about 300 people on Sunday at the time and with his on Sunday at the time and with his on Sunday at the time and with his blessing we just started you know blessing we just started you know blessing we just started you know chopping things apart in stopping chopping things apart in stopping chopping things apart in stopping certain ministries and kind of took a

certain ministries and kind of took a certain ministries and kind of took a simple Church approach to ministry where simple Church approach to ministry where simple Church approach to ministry where it was like we just focused primarily on it was like we just focused primarily on it was like we just focused primarily on the Sunday service experience and that the Sunday service experience and that the Sunday service experience and that was our main focus and so I think out of was our main focus and so I think out of was our main focus and so I think out of that we started to see some turnaround that we started to see some turnaround that we started to see some turnaround and some growth then I was thinking and some growth then I was thinking and some growth then I was thinking about leaving the plan the church with about leaving the plan the church with about leaving the plan the church with my wife but kind of unbeknownst to us my wife but kind of unbeknownst to us my wife but kind of unbeknownst to us God just kind of set this whole thing in God just kind of set this whole thing in God just kind of set this whole thing in motion we ended up relaunching the motion we ended up relaunching the motion we ended up relaunching the church that we were at there as church that we were at there as church that we were at there as generation church January 2014 and me generation church January 2014 and me generation church January 2014 and me and my dad kind of Co pastored for about and my dad kind of Co pastored for about and my dad kind of Co pastored for about a year to have a season of transition a year to have a season of transition a year to have a season of transition and we did something really unique where and we did something really unique where and we did something really unique where for that first season we were like let's for that first season we were like let's for that first season we were like let's start out and have him teach in the start out and have him teach in the start out and have him teach in the service on Sunday and I'll teach in the service on Sunday and I'll teach in the service on Sunday and I'll teach in the service on Sunday it's very unusual but service on Sunday it's very unusual but service on Sunday it's very unusual but it allowed us to keep everyone that was it allowed us to keep everyone that was it allowed us to keep everyone that was already there in the church they've already there in the church they've already there in the church they've happened to lose anything necessarily if happened to lose anything necessarily if happened to lose anything necessarily if they already love the pastor that was they already love the pastor that was they already love the pastor that was there and I was able to teach in a there and I was able to teach in a there and I was able to teach in a service the same worship style basically service the same worship style basically service the same worship style basically and in our church started to grow out of and in our church started to grow out of and in our church started to grow out of that and as it grew we added services that and as it grew we added services that and as it grew we added services first you know we added another service first you know we added another service first you know we added another service for me to teach in and then the for me to teach in and then the for me to teach in and then the following year we added two other following year we added two other following year we added two other services another traditional service and services another traditional service and services another traditional service and another PM service community gym so then another PM service community gym so then another PM service community gym so then we we had five services going and in we we had five services going and in we we had five services going and in just a couple years there the church just a couple years there the church just a couple years there the church basically tripled in size and it's been basically tripled in size and it's been basically tripled in size and it's been going really well since then too going really well since then too going really well since then too amazing and yeah still I was checking amazing and yeah still I was checking amazing and yeah still I was checking out your site which is amazing by the out your site which is amazing by the out your site which is amazing by the way people should check it out you guys way people should check it out you guys way people should check it out you guys have done a great job online you still have done a great job online you still have done a great job online you still do you still have like a traditional

do you still have like a traditional do you still have like a traditional service and then a and then whatever service and then a and then whatever service and then a and then whatever you'd call a normal service or whatever you'd call a normal service or whatever you'd call a normal service or whatever that yeah yeah part of your deal yeah it that yeah yeah part of your deal yeah it that yeah yeah part of your deal yeah it is and we actually really like it and I is and we actually really like it and I is and we actually really like it and I feel even more committed to it as a feel even more committed to it as a feel even more committed to it as a strategy the the traditional service you strategy the the traditional service you strategy the the traditional service you know started as a way to maintain what know started as a way to maintain what know started as a way to maintain what we had and it's actually grown in this we had and it's actually grown in this we had and it's actually grown in this time over the last couple years it's time over the last couple years it's time over the last couple years it's probably grown twenty-five to thirty probably grown twenty-five to thirty probably grown twenty-five to thirty percent in just the last year Wow percent in just the last year Wow percent in just the last year Wow and so you know we're reaching people in and so you know we're reaching people in and so you know we're reaching people in that service we've been able to move that service we've been able to move that service we've been able to move them to another facility on our campus them to another facility on our campus them to another facility on our campus so we have services going concurrently so we have services going concurrently so we have services going concurrently right now it allows us to reach right now it allows us to reach right now it allows us to reach different generations of people like different generations of people like different generations of people like families will show up and split and families will show up and split and families will show up and split and people will go over to our traditional people will go over to our traditional people will go over to our traditional service some people will come in to our service some people will come in to our service some people will come in to our our main service and they'll take kids our main service and they'll take kids our main service and they'll take kids and laabh you'll have three four and laabh you'll have three four and laabh you'll have three four generations of people at church it's generations of people at church it's generations of people at church it's pretty cool hmm interesting interesting pretty cool hmm interesting interesting pretty cool hmm interesting interesting well there's a lot there you know well there's a lot there you know well there's a lot there you know there's a lot of there's so much packed there's a lot of there's so much packed there's a lot of there's so much packed into your story I'm like gosh where do into your story I'm like gosh where do into your story I'm like gosh where do we start but why don't we talk a little we start but why don't we talk a little we start but why don't we talk a little bit about you know some of the changes bit about you know some of the changes bit about you know some of the changes you know even just a named generation you know even just a named generation you know even just a named generation Church you went through a rebranding Church you went through a rebranding Church you went through a rebranding process you came to the name what was process you came to the name what was process you came to the name what was that process look like why did you end that process look like why did you end that process look like why did you end up with generation you know what were up with generation you know what were up with generation you know what were some of your learnings do that yeah it's some of your learnings do that yeah it's some of your learnings do that yeah it's funny because that was that was my dad's funny because that was that was my dad's funny because that was that was my dad's idea and I was like you know I think of idea and I was like you know I think of idea and I was like you know I think of the cool name you know and I don't think the cool name you know and I don't think the cool name you know and I don't think church names are the most important church names are the most important church names are the most important thing in the world but the church that thing in the world but the church that thing in the world but the church that existed previously had a reputation existed previously had a reputation existed previously had a reputation somewhat in the community not really bad somewhat in the community not really bad somewhat in the community not really bad necessarily but I felt like rebranding necessarily but I felt like rebranding necessarily but I felt like rebranding was going to not only give us a chance was going to not only give us a chance was going to not only give us a chance to start new but also just kind of get

to start new but also just kind of get to start new but also just kind of get some buzz going and kind of just quickly some buzz going and kind of just quickly some buzz going and kind of just quickly get back on track and I you know that get back on track and I you know that get back on track and I you know that was a huge part of our strategy was was a huge part of our strategy was was a huge part of our strategy was social media branding and we're not the social media branding and we're not the social media branding and we're not the best at it by any means we did it with a best at it by any means we did it with a best at it by any means we did it with a very little resources to start out it very little resources to start out it very little resources to start out it just kind of taps into like the natural just kind of taps into like the natural just kind of taps into like the natural abilities of the younger generation to abilities of the younger generation to abilities of the younger generation to try to make some things look more try to make some things look more try to make some things look more up-to-date but I feel like that is one up-to-date but I feel like that is one up-to-date but I feel like that is one of the the least talked about aspects of of the the least talked about aspects of of the the least talked about aspects of church growth strategy for like the church growth strategy for like the church growth strategy for like the human-sized Church it was we started human-sized Church it was we started human-sized Church it was we started creating the perception creating the perception creating the perception that we were a excite and exciting that we were a excite and exciting that we were a excite and exciting growing Church and that was dynamic growing Church and that was dynamic growing Church and that was dynamic honestly even before it was happening I honestly even before it was happening I honestly even before it was happening I think it's just social media and think it's just social media and think it's just social media and pictures and I would feel like we were pictures and I would feel like we were pictures and I would feel like we were still in the middle of just struggles still in the middle of just struggles still in the middle of just struggles and stuff but I'd have friends coming up and stuff but I'd have friends coming up and stuff but I'd have friends coming up to me from around the valley here and to me from around the valley here and to me from around the valley here and just now looks like amazing things are just now looks like amazing things are just now looks like amazing things are happening at your church and it would happening at your church and it would happening at your church and it would just give me a little bit of a sense of just give me a little bit of a sense of just give me a little bit of a sense of how powerful that's interesting that is how powerful that's interesting that is how powerful that's interesting that is know what you share and what you talk know what you share and what you talk know what you share and what you talk about online no absolutely I'm a good about online no absolutely I'm a good about online no absolutely I'm a good friend of mine is church planning right friend of mine is church planning right friend of mine is church planning right now and so that's been a fun process to now and so that's been a fun process to now and so that's been a fun process to kind of be back you know listening to kind of be back you know listening to kind of be back you know listening to him and and and he says the same thing him and and and he says the same thing him and and and he says the same thing it's interesting the way he speaks about it's interesting the way he speaks about it's interesting the way he speaks about social media it's like when if you were social media it's like when if you were social media it's like when if you were planning a church 20 years ago you say planning a church 20 years ago you say planning a church 20 years ago you say well we got to have a kid's ministry we well we got to have a kid's ministry we well we got to have a kid's ministry we got to do that yeah you can't not have a got to do that yeah you can't not have a got to do that yeah you can't not have a well-defined you know kind of social well-defined you know kind of social well-defined you know kind of social media presence what were some of the media presence what were some of the media presence what were some of the things you learned in that you know that things you learned in that you know that things you learned in that you know that it's kind of worked well in reading out it's kind of worked well in reading out it's kind of worked well in reading out using that to kind of impact your using that to kind of impact your using that to kind of impact your community well we learned first just by

community well we learned first just by community well we learned first just by trial and error and I've since then trial and error and I've since then trial and error and I've since then learned a lot of the things that we did learned a lot of the things that we did learned a lot of the things that we did wrong well you know I or the wealth wrong well you know I or the wealth wrong well you know I or the wealth manager yeah yeah I mean the first thing manager yeah yeah I mean the first thing manager yeah yeah I mean the first thing we do is just you know creating a new we do is just you know creating a new we do is just you know creating a new website and a lot of people this is like website and a lot of people this is like website and a lot of people this is like no duh but there's a lot of great free no duh but there's a lot of great free no duh but there's a lot of great free website platforms or very cheap website platforms or very cheap website platforms or very cheap platforms out there today yet you'll platforms out there today yet you'll platforms out there today yet you'll still see some people that just have still see some people that just have still see some people that just have honestly embarrassing websites and that honestly embarrassing websites and that honestly embarrassing websites and that is the front door to your church that to is the front door to your church that to is the front door to your church that to me your website is like your first line me your website is like your first line me your website is like your first line of your welcome team and you know then of your welcome team and you know then of your welcome team and you know then online on social media just trying to online on social media just trying to online on social media just trying to share wins and stories that revolve share wins and stories that revolve share wins and stories that revolve around people and life change and every around people and life change and every around people and life change and every little thing does matter is something little thing does matter is something little thing does matter is something which I would say to our staff a lot which I would say to our staff a lot which I would say to our staff a lot along the way it's like every little along the way it's like every little along the way it's like every little perception the color of the building perception the color of the building perception the color of the building you're decorating in the building what you're decorating in the building what you're decorating in the building what you post on social media how you talk you post on social media how you talk you post on social media how you talk how you communicate it all creates an how you communicate it all creates an how you communicate it all creates an image and I just like to say that it's image and I just like to say that it's image and I just like to say that it's kind of like little pixels of a greater kind of like little pixels of a greater kind of like little pixels of a greater image in there's thousands of little image in there's thousands of little image in there's thousands of little perception points which all add up and perception points which all add up and perception points which all add up and so when people are looking for a new so when people are looking for a new so when people are looking for a new church or they wake up one day and they church or they wake up one day and they church or they wake up one day and they feel like something's missing in their feel like something's missing in their feel like something's missing in their life and they start looking around and life and they start looking around and life and they start looking around and googling churches googling churches googling churches you know you just want them to land on you know you just want them to land on you know you just want them to land on your stuff and you know feel welcomed your stuff and you know feel welcomed your stuff and you know feel welcomed and like it's a good something worth and like it's a good something worth and like it's a good something worth checking out very cool very cool well in checking out very cool very cool well in checking out very cool very cool well in the you know the handover in the the you know the handover in the the you know the handover in the relationship with your dad there must relationship with your dad there must relationship with your dad there must there must be a few relate there must be there must be a few relate there must be there must be a few relate there must be a few tips in there that you could talk a few tips in there that you could talk a few tips in there that you could talk yeah you know because that that you know

yeah you know because that that you know yeah you know because that that you know I know a lot of churches are facing you I know a lot of churches are facing you I know a lot of churches are facing you know a succession the fact that you end know a succession the fact that you end know a succession the fact that you end up doing that transition with your dad up doing that transition with your dad up doing that transition with your dad is an interesting piece of the equation is an interesting piece of the equation is an interesting piece of the equation but what did you learn even just in that but what did you learn even just in that but what did you learn even just in that succession that worked well sounded like succession that worked well sounded like succession that worked well sounded like the the dual service thing that was good the the dual service thing that was good the the dual service thing that was good other pieces yeah I mean the succession other pieces yeah I mean the succession other pieces yeah I mean the succession is a hot topic I think with pastors is a hot topic I think with pastors is a hot topic I think with pastors right now and with my dad I learned some right now and with my dad I learned some right now and with my dad I learned some really valuable lessons and then now I'm really valuable lessons and then now I'm really valuable lessons and then now I'm going through it again with my going through it again with my going through it again with my father-in-law as his church and Phoenix father-in-law as his church and Phoenix father-in-law as his church and Phoenix is merging with us we're actually voting is merging with us we're actually voting is merging with us we're actually voting on that this Sunday for them to become on that this Sunday for them to become on that this Sunday for them to become our second campus and it's really our second campus and it's really our second campus and it's really exciting but it's another element of the exciting but it's another element of the exciting but it's another element of the same succession dynamic so you know one same succession dynamic so you know one same succession dynamic so you know one of the things I found is that these of the things I found is that these of the things I found is that these older you know pastors who are in place older you know pastors who are in place older you know pastors who are in place maybe in their late fifties or sixties maybe in their late fifties or sixties maybe in their late fifties or sixties who are starting to think about moving who are starting to think about moving who are starting to think about moving on you know they're hitting that point on you know they're hitting that point on you know they're hitting that point where they're thinking about moving on where they're thinking about moving on where they're thinking about moving on but they don't feel ready to let go and but they don't feel ready to let go and but they don't feel ready to let go and they've got a lot of energy and and they've got a lot of energy and and they've got a lot of energy and and passion a lot of times left another passion a lot of times left another passion a lot of times left another common issue that can't afford to stop common issue that can't afford to stop common issue that can't afford to stop working so many were underpaid for such working so many were underpaid for such working so many were underpaid for such a high large part of their career but a high large part of their career but a high large part of their career but what we kind of did I think is something what we kind of did I think is something what we kind of did I think is something that a lot searchers could tap into that a lot searchers could tap into that a lot searchers could tap into where you know you can keep somebody on where you know you can keep somebody on where you know you can keep somebody on staff and keep them involved with staff and keep them involved with staff and keep them involved with ministry and yet passed the baton to the ministry and yet passed the baton to the ministry and yet passed the baton to the next generation and allowed them to next generation and allowed them to next generation and allowed them to really start driving the vision and really start driving the vision and really start driving the vision and along the way you know I would push along the way you know I would push along the way you know I would push really hard and my dad would really hard and my dad would really hard and my dad would occasionally pull on the reins and just occasionally pull on the reins and just occasionally pull on the reins and just say like let's slow down a little on say like let's slow down a little on say like let's slow down a little on that and and it looking back you know that and and it looking back you know that and and it looking back you know that was really good I was valuable I that was really good I was valuable I that was really good I was valuable I think to have a person driving the

think to have a person driving the think to have a person driving the vision and another person with some vision and another person with some vision and another person with some wisdom and experience you know just wisdom and experience you know just wisdom and experience you know just maybe cautioning along the way that maybe cautioning along the way that maybe cautioning along the way that created a really potent dynamic there so created a really potent dynamic there so created a really potent dynamic there so he was willing to push and let things he was willing to push and let things he was willing to push and let things change which is something that not a lot change which is something that not a lot change which is something that not a lot of churches are willing to do not a lot of churches are willing to do not a lot of churches are willing to do not a lot of pastors are willing to step back from of pastors are willing to step back from of pastors are willing to step back from the lead role and let somebody else lead the lead role and let somebody else lead the lead role and let somebody else lead when you know when you know when you know you could say they're kind of in the you could say they're kind of in the you could say they're kind of in the prime of their their career still but prime of their their career still but prime of their their career still but that's one of the things that my dad did that's one of the things that my dad did that's one of the things that my dad did that I think just was such a win was he that I think just was such a win was he that I think just was such a win was he stepped back he said it's not about me I stepped back he said it's not about me I stepped back he said it's not about me I mean I'm saying you know I don't want to mean I'm saying you know I don't want to mean I'm saying you know I don't want to go to my grave and have it said that I go to my grave and have it said that I go to my grave and have it said that I was afraid to take a risk and he just was afraid to take a risk and he just was afraid to take a risk and he just wanted to see more people coming to the wanted to see more people coming to the wanted to see more people coming to the kingdom and he felt like you know he kingdom and he felt like you know he kingdom and he felt like you know he could see some of his dreams fulfilled could see some of his dreams fulfilled could see some of his dreams fulfilled through you know the next person who through you know the next person who through you know the next person who happened to be his son but it applies to happened to be his son but it applies to happened to be his son but it applies to anyone and he was just he was willing to anyone and he was just he was willing to anyone and he was just he was willing to go so we had a lot of unanimity on our go so we had a lot of unanimity on our go so we had a lot of unanimity on our philosophy and our strategy and I would philosophy and our strategy and I would philosophy and our strategy and I would say that if it was not like sinful he say that if it was not like sinful he say that if it was not like sinful he was willing to give it a shot so you was willing to give it a shot so you was willing to give it a shot so you know he was willing to really let let me know he was willing to really let let me know he was willing to really let let me do stuff and push and right we know how do stuff and push and right we know how do stuff and push and right we know how sensitive it can be in churches when sensitive it can be in churches when sensitive it can be in churches when people start making changes and stuff people start making changes and stuff people start making changes and stuff but it was really cool hmm interesting but it was really cool hmm interesting but it was really cool hmm interesting now I know in a high-growth situation now I know in a high-growth situation now I know in a high-growth situation like that there is always a stretch on like that there is always a stretch on like that there is always a stretch on resources or are you the exception of resources or are you the exception of resources or are you the exception of the church where you just had like so the church where you just had like so the church where you just had like so much money you didn't know what to do much money you didn't know what to do much money you didn't know what to do with so many people you know you're just

with so many people you know you're just with so many people you know you're just or like we got volunteers coming out the or like we got volunteers coming out the or like we got volunteers coming out the wazoo we don't know what to do otherwise wazoo we don't know what to do otherwise wazoo we don't know what to do otherwise you felt with those pressures the kind you felt with those pressures the kind you felt with those pressures the kind of pressures of growth dealing with you of pressures of growth dealing with you of pressures of growth dealing with you know we need more people we need more know we need more people we need more know we need more people we need more resources what are some of the lessons resources what are some of the lessons resources what are some of the lessons you've learned in that process and we you've learned in that process and we you've learned in that process and we definitely did not have a lot of definitely did not have a lot of definitely did not have a lot of resources and I think that you know resources and I think that you know resources and I think that you know because we were we were kind of on the because we were we were kind of on the because we were we were kind of on the decline and then when we started growing decline and then when we started growing decline and then when we started growing quickly some some of those years we were quickly some some of those years we were quickly some some of those years we were growing at 45 50 percent per year and I growing at 45 50 percent per year and I growing at 45 50 percent per year and I learned that it was pretty common with learned that it was pretty common with learned that it was pretty common with growth like that to have your income growth like that to have your income growth like that to have your income from giving be about a year behind and from giving be about a year behind and from giving be about a year behind and that's what I found consistently that that's what I found consistently that that's what I found consistently that our giving has been reflecting last our giving has been reflecting last our giving has been reflecting last year's average attendance so on the at year's average attendance so on the at year's average attendance so on the at the beginning of the process it was the beginning of the process it was the beginning of the process it was really tough and we were kind of on the really tough and we were kind of on the really tough and we were kind of on the front end of that that curve where you front end of that that curve where you front end of that that curve where you know everything we do was a stretch and know everything we do was a stretch and know everything we do was a stretch and there were many months where we were there were many months where we were there were many months where we were coming out in the red you know and it coming out in the red you know and it coming out in the red you know and it was kind of scary but there's a lot that was kind of scary but there's a lot that was kind of scary but there's a lot that you can do for affordably I think you can do for affordably I think you can do for affordably I think there's a lot of free resources there's a lot of free resources there's a lot of free resources and one of the things I would tell and one of the things I would tell and one of the things I would tell pastors in that situation who are trying pastors in that situation who are trying pastors in that situation who are trying to turn something around but they'll to turn something around but they'll to turn something around but they'll have a lot of resources is simple is have a lot of resources is simple is have a lot of resources is simple is better than complex when you don't have better than complex when you don't have better than complex when you don't have a lot of resources so you know go for a lot of resources so you know go for a lot of resources so you know go for the the more simple stage design go for the the more simple stage design go for the the more simple stage design go for the more simple branding package keep it the more simple branding package keep it the more simple branding package keep it clean which allows you don't usually clean which allows you don't usually clean which allows you don't usually keep it cheap and then uh-huh keep it cheap and then uh-huh keep it cheap and then uh-huh and we we try to capitalize on what we

and we we try to capitalize on what we and we we try to capitalize on what we were strong at and we didn't really were strong at and we didn't really were strong at and we didn't really apologize for the fact that we didn't apologize for the fact that we didn't apologize for the fact that we didn't offer every you know eight auxilary offer every you know eight auxilary offer every you know eight auxilary ministry we just kind of started with ministry we just kind of started with ministry we just kind of started with the beginning with the basics and then the beginning with the basics and then the beginning with the basics and then as we grew we kind of hit this Tempe as we grew we kind of hit this Tempe as we grew we kind of hit this Tempe tipping point recently where we started tipping point recently where we started tipping point recently where we started to have some more resources but there to have some more resources but there to have some more resources but there were those points where we had to hire were those points where we had to hire were those points where we had to hire yeah as a kind of a step of faith yeah yeah as a kind of a step of faith yeah yeah as a kind of a step of faith yeah and just kind of a trust that we were and just kind of a trust that we were and just kind of a trust that we were making the right choice and trust the making the right choice and trust the making the right choice and trust the guys bringing the resources yeah why guys bringing the resources yeah why guys bringing the resources yeah why don't we talk a little bit about that I don't we talk a little bit about that I don't we talk a little bit about that I know because I've been there where it's know because I've been there where it's know because I've been there where it's like that the phrase I've used before is like that the phrase I've used before is like that the phrase I've used before is the like we're buying clothes that a the like we're buying clothes that a the like we're buying clothes that a little too big we got to going out of little too big we got to going out of little too big we got to going out of debt and we're going to fit into these debt and we're going to fit into these debt and we're going to fit into these clothes looks a little silly at the clothes looks a little silly at the clothes looks a little silly at the beginning but we kind of grow to make it beginning but we kind of grow to make it beginning but we kind of grow to make it happen how did that balance out the kind happen how did that balance out the kind happen how did that balance out the kind of faith and then the pragmatic side of of faith and then the pragmatic side of of faith and then the pragmatic side of all of that to take some of those all of that to take some of those all of that to take some of those financial risks hiring staff which is a financial risks hiring staff which is a financial risks hiring staff which is a different kind of risk because if it different kind of risk because if it different kind of risk because if it doesn't work you're going to end up doesn't work you're going to end up doesn't work you're going to end up letting somebody go and that's not great letting somebody go and that's not great letting somebody go and that's not great yeah what's going through your mind in yeah what's going through your mind in yeah what's going through your mind in that I think the key is if you're taking that I think the key is if you're taking that I think the key is if you're taking the step of faith like that you want to the step of faith like that you want to the step of faith like that you want to make sure that you're already on the make sure that you're already on the make sure that you're already on the upswing and if you're already you've upswing and if you're already you've upswing and if you're already you've already got some signs of life and already got some signs of life and already got some signs of life and momentum going there or else it could be momentum going there or else it could be momentum going there or else it could be a little too risky yeah I mean we we a little too risky yeah I mean we we a little too risky yeah I mean we we definitely had a few months where it was definitely had a few months where it was definitely had a few months where it was tight and honestly the first person was tight and honestly the first person was tight and honestly the first person was my dad who said you know I'll take a pay my dad who said you know I'll take a pay my dad who said you know I'll take a pay cut if we can't make ends meet and he cut if we can't make ends meet and he cut if we can't make ends meet and he did some months you know he was willing did some months you know he was willing did some months you know he was willing to do that and I've seen that with to do that and I've seen that with to do that and I've seen that with several leaders in ministry but I think

several leaders in ministry but I think several leaders in ministry but I think there's a few key areas of course with there's a few key areas of course with there's a few key areas of course with you know preaching worship you know preaching worship you know preaching worship kids ministry where you just have to be kids ministry where you just have to be kids ministry where you just have to be solid and you know you just if you have solid and you know you just if you have solid and you know you just if you have to hire someone to strengthen up one of to hire someone to strengthen up one of to hire someone to strengthen up one of those areas it's worth it I think it's those areas it's worth it I think it's those areas it's worth it I think it's worth the step of say worth the step of say worth the step of say and you can't do everything at once of and you can't do everything at once of and you can't do everything at once of course but I would prioritize that it course but I would prioritize that it course but I would prioritize that it just seems like worth investing in those just seems like worth investing in those just seems like worth investing in those areas very cool very cool well is there areas very cool very cool well is there areas very cool very cool well is there anything else you want to share before anything else you want to share before anything else you want to share before we move on with the rest of the episode we move on with the rest of the episode we move on with the rest of the episode yeah I think you know growing in this yeah I think you know growing in this yeah I think you know growing in this role as a young lead pastor I was 30 role as a young lead pastor I was 30 role as a young lead pastor I was 30 when I took over as the lead pastor and when I took over as the lead pastor and when I took over as the lead pastor and I'm 32 now you know and one of the I'm 32 now you know and one of the I'm 32 now you know and one of the principles I learned I think going back principles I learned I think going back principles I learned I think going back to when I was a second lieutenant in the to when I was a second lieutenant in the to when I was a second lieutenant in the Army was you know if you're in charge be Army was you know if you're in charge be Army was you know if you're in charge be in charge and I need a lot of leaders I in charge and I need a lot of leaders I in charge and I need a lot of leaders I think who are waiting for permission to think who are waiting for permission to think who are waiting for permission to do what they know they need to do and I do what they know they need to do and I do what they know they need to do and I just have learned this and I share it just have learned this and I share it just have learned this and I share it with with my friends just do what do with with my friends just do what do with with my friends just do what do what you know you need to do God's what you know you need to do God's what you know you need to do God's already given you permission to make the already given you permission to make the already given you permission to make the changes that you need to make it's not changes that you need to make it's not changes that you need to make it's not easy but that's why you're in that role easy but that's why you're in that role easy but that's why you're in that role is to make hard decision whether it's is to make hard decision whether it's is to make hard decision whether it's letting someone go or making a big letting someone go or making a big letting someone go or making a big change don't be afraid to make changes change don't be afraid to make changes change don't be afraid to make changes and people are more willing to make and people are more willing to make and people are more willing to make changes than we think they are if you'll changes than we think they are if you'll changes than we think they are if you'll just give them a little bit of vision just give them a little bit of vision just give them a little bit of vision and why behind the change this is the on and why behind the change this is the on and why behind the change this is the on seminary podcast stuff you wish they seminary podcast stuff you wish they seminary podcast stuff you wish they taught in seminary well we're going to

taught in seminary well we're going to taught in seminary well we're going to jump in as lightning around that part of jump in as lightning around that part of jump in as lightning around that part of the episode where we ask similar the episode where we ask similar the episode where we ask similar questions of everybody that's on the questions of everybody that's on the questions of everybody that's on the episode super excited to have pastor episode super excited to have pastor episode super excited to have pastor Ryan Visconti today from generation Ryan Visconti today from generation Ryan Visconti today from generation Church in Arizona great church that you Church in Arizona great church that you Church in Arizona great church that you really should be following and checking really should be following and checking really should be following and checking out Ryan what's an online resource that out Ryan what's an online resource that out Ryan what's an online resource that you're using these days that's that's you're using these days that's that's you're using these days that's that's helping you out helping you out helping you out sometimes just started using with our sometimes just started using with our sometimes just started using with our staff is a program called grammarly yes staff is a program called grammarly yes staff is a program called grammarly yes you installed on your computer and it you installed on your computer and it you installed on your computer and it helps people with not just spell check helps people with not just spell check helps people with not just spell check but also like grammar and if you start but also like grammar and if you start but also like grammar and if you start overusing one word too often your overusing one word too often your overusing one word too often your written communication so we've all I'm written communication so we've all I'm written communication so we've all I'm having people install that and use it having people install that and use it having people install that and use it because we've had different degrees of because we've had different degrees of because we've had different degrees of ability when it comes to written ability when it comes to written ability when it comes to written communication there so that's fun that's communication there so that's fun that's communication there so that's fun that's fun yeah what's a book you've read in fun yeah what's a book you've read in fun yeah what's a book you've read in the last I don't know maybe six months the last I don't know maybe six months the last I don't know maybe six months to a year that's impacted your shape to a year that's impacted your shape to a year that's impacted your shape impact your thinking or ministry right impact your thinking or ministry right impact your thinking or ministry right now I'm reading money matters by Steve now I'm reading money matters by Steve now I'm reading money matters by Steve Stroupe for churches and he has Stroupe for churches and he has Stroupe for churches and he has some just great stuff on capital some just great stuff on capital some just great stuff on capital campaigns and money management for lead campaigns and money management for lead campaigns and money management for lead pastors he talks about the fact that you pastors he talks about the fact that you pastors he talks about the fact that you know you go through seminary but you know you go through seminary but you know you go through seminary but you don't usually get taught how to manage don't usually get taught how to manage don't usually get taught how to manage money especially in the larger culture money especially in the larger culture money especially in the larger culture so he I just learned that he Steve's so he I just learned that he Steve's so he I just learned that he Steve's group out of Texas he is a Yoda by doing group out of Texas he is a Yoda by doing group out of Texas he is a Yoda by doing you know it's amazing so that's been a you know it's amazing so that's been a you know it's amazing so that's been a huge win for me yeah we did some huge win for me yeah we did some huge win for me yeah we did some coaching with Steve for a while and so coaching with Steve for a while and so coaching with Steve for a while and so he's totally a Yoda he told ya he's a he's totally a Yoda he told ya he's a he's totally a Yoda he told ya he's a great a great guy for sure what's

great a great guy for sure what's great a great guy for sure what's another ministry that you're looking at another ministry that you're looking at another ministry that you're looking at that inspires you I look at elevation a that inspires you I look at elevation a that inspires you I look at elevation a lot in of course I love you know pastor lot in of course I love you know pastor lot in of course I love you know pastor Stephens preaching and everything but I Stephens preaching and everything but I Stephens preaching and everything but I really was blown away when I saw how really was blown away when I saw how really was blown away when I saw how they flow with their service and just they flow with their service and just they flow with their service and just it's like maximum impact in the amount it's like maximum impact in the amount it's like maximum impact in the amount of times they have you there and it's a of times they have you there and it's a of times they have you there and it's a different type of model I think then different type of model I think then different type of model I think then kind of like how let's say Andy's family kind of like how let's say Andy's family kind of like how let's say Andy's family does church so you know to each his own does church so you know to each his own does church so you know to each his own but there really resonated with me that but there really resonated with me that but there really resonated with me that kind of the maximum impact that they kind of the maximum impact that they kind of the maximum impact that they make and I come from like a make and I come from like a make and I come from like a spirit-filled background of church so spirit-filled background of church so spirit-filled background of church so they do that it looks a little different they do that it looks a little different they do that it looks a little different in our context but I just kind of love in our context but I just kind of love in our context but I just kind of love that they capture that dynamic but in that they capture that dynamic but in that they capture that dynamic but in its a way that's accessible to everybody its a way that's accessible to everybody its a way that's accessible to everybody so I love those guys yeah absolutely so I love those guys yeah absolutely so I love those guys yeah absolutely yeah the pastor Stephen esteem isn't yeah the pastor Stephen esteem isn't yeah the pastor Stephen esteem isn't that incredible if you could get 15 that incredible if you could get 15 that incredible if you could get 15 minutes with any leader alive hard minutes with any leader alive hard minutes with any leader alive hard question would you want to get that with question would you want to get that with question would you want to get that with and why you know I think I'd like to sit and why you know I think I'd like to sit and why you know I think I'd like to sit down with Craig shuffle yeah you know down with Craig shuffle yeah you know down with Craig shuffle yeah you know yeah he is just like the most humble guy yeah he is just like the most humble guy yeah he is just like the most humble guy it seems and he has cracked so many it seems and he has cracked so many it seems and he has cracked so many issues that I'm facing right now so I've issues that I'm facing right now so I've issues that I'm facing right now so I've been kind of drinking in his leadership been kind of drinking in his leadership been kind of drinking in his leadership podcast I was a little late to the game podcast I was a little late to the game podcast I was a little late to the game I'm a late adapter I've realized I might I'm a late adapter I've realized I might I'm a late adapter I've realized I might be discovering things about a year after be discovering things about a year after be discovering things about a year after everybody else everybody else everybody else so you know him we're trying to figure so you know him we're trying to figure so you know him we're trying to figure out this multi-site thing right now and out this multi-site thing right now and out this multi-site thing right now and I know a lot of people are doing great I know a lot of people are doing great I know a lot of people are doing great at it so he just seems that have learned at it so he just seems that have learned at it so he just seems that have learned a lot of great lessons about managing

a lot of great lessons about managing a lot of great lessons about managing time and taking care of your family and time and taking care of your family and time and taking care of your family and taking care of yourself or your own walk taking care of yourself or your own walk taking care of yourself or your own walk with God that I'm trying to apply to my with God that I'm trying to apply to my with God that I'm trying to apply to my life very cool well I know leading a life very cool well I know leading a life very cool well I know leading a church like yours is is a lot of work church like yours is is a lot of work church like yours is is a lot of work it's it's it's you know it's a lot of effort and it can you know it's a lot of effort and it can you know it's a lot of effort and it can take a lot out of you what do you do for take a lot out of you what do you do for take a lot out of you what do you do for fun when you just want to kind of kick fun when you just want to kind of kick fun when you just want to kind of kick back relax enjoy enjoy life a little bit back relax enjoy enjoy life a little bit back relax enjoy enjoy life a little bit you know Netflix and chill man we you know me my wife we'll spend time we you know me my wife we'll spend time together I go and golf some just try to together I go and golf some just try to together I go and golf some just try to read and take my mind off of ministry I read and take my mind off of ministry I read and take my mind off of ministry I think anything they taught you zone out think anything they taught you zone out think anything they taught you zone out and not think about the church for a and not think about the church for a and not think about the church for a little while is is healthy great huh so little while is is healthy great huh so little while is is healthy great huh so good well right I really appreciate you good well right I really appreciate you good well right I really appreciate you being on the show today if people want being on the show today if people want being on the show today if people want to get in touch with you or with the to get in touch with you or with the to get in touch with you or with the church what's the best way for them to church what's the best way for them to church what's the best way for them to do that do that do that I'm on social media at Ryan Visconti and I'm on social media at Ryan Visconti and I'm on social media at Ryan Visconti and online you know generation dot church online you know generation dot church online you know generation dot church they can find our website but if it'll they can find our website but if it'll they can find our website but if it'll be it you can see that website go find be it you can see that website go find be it you can see that website go find meaning my email my social media contact meaning my email my social media contact meaning my email my social media contact information great thanks so much pastor information great thanks so much pastor information great thanks so much pastor Ryan I appreciate you on the show thanks Ryan I appreciate you on the show thanks Ryan I appreciate you on the show thanks have a great week thanks rich I have a great week thanks rich I have a great week thanks rich I appreciate it appreciate it appreciate it thank you for tuning in to this week's thank you for tuning in to this week's thank you for tuning in to this week's unsung re podcast don't be shy unsung re podcast don't be shy unsung re podcast don't be shy we'd love to connect check out on we'd love to connect check out on we'd love to connect check out on seminary inbox you can sign up at seminary inbox you can sign up at seminary inbox you can sign up at unsummon Ericom and we'll send you unsummon Ericom and we'll send you unsummon Ericom and we'll send you helpful training resources every week helpful training resources every week helpful training resources every week plus you'll gain immediate access to our plus you'll gain immediate access to our plus you'll gain immediate access to our exclusive members area with tons of

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