Jon Morrison on Being a Millennial Reaching Millennials

welcome to the uncie Maneri podcast are welcome to the uncie Maneri podcast are you looking for practical ministry help you looking for practical ministry help you looking for practical ministry help to drive your ministry further faster to drive your ministry further faster to drive your ministry further faster have a sinking feeling that your have a sinking feeling that your have a sinking feeling that your ministry training didn't prepare you for ministry training didn't prepare you for ministry training didn't prepare you for the real world hey you're not alone join the real world hey you're not alone join the real world hey you're not alone join thousands of others in pursuit of stuff thousands of others in pursuit of stuff thousands of others in pursuit of stuff that we wish they had taught in seminary that we wish they had taught in seminary that we wish they had taught in seminary buckle up and let's get started with buckle up and let's get started with buckle up and let's get started with this week's on seminary podcast this week's on seminary podcast this week's on seminary podcast okay everybody welcome to the on okay everybody welcome to the on okay everybody welcome to the on seminary podcast my name is rich the HOS seminary podcast my name is rich the HOS seminary podcast my name is rich the HOS around these parts so glad that you've around these parts so glad that you've around these parts so glad that you've decided to tune in I know there's a lot decided to tune in I know there's a lot decided to tune in I know there's a lot going on in your church this week today going on in your church this week today going on in your church this week today we've got John Morrison with us now now we've got John Morrison with us now now we've got John Morrison with us now now John's a little bit of a different guest John's a little bit of a different guest John's a little bit of a different guest as you listen in you're going to be as you listen in you're going to be as you listen in you're going to be rewarded for for tuning in today John's rewarded for for tuning in today John's rewarded for for tuning in today John's a friend he's a fellow Canadian welcome a friend he's a fellow Canadian welcome a friend he's a fellow Canadian welcome to the show John thanks so much rich to the show John thanks so much rich to the show John thanks so much rich it's great to be on this side of the it's great to be on this side of the it's great to be on this side of the podcast I've been listening for a long podcast I've been listening for a long podcast I've been listening for a long time now and it's great to be a guest time now and it's great to be a guest time now and it's great to be a guest now so hopefully I can add value to your now so hopefully I can add value to your now so hopefully I can add value to your list or some way with telling my story list or some way with telling my story list or some way with telling my story but no it's great so for folks that but no it's great so for folks that but no it's great so for folks that don't know I was born and raised in kind don't know I was born and raised in kind don't know I was born and raised in kind of central Canada around Toronto John is of central Canada around Toronto John is of central Canada around Toronto John is from the west coast everybody at this from the west coast everybody at this from the west coast everybody at this part of the world just you know feels part of the world just you know feels part of the world just you know feels jealous of them so happy to have you jealous of them so happy to have you jealous of them so happy to have you here but now John a lot of people that here but now John a lot of people that here but now John a lot of people that come on the show they tell these amazing come on the show they tell these amazing come on the show they tell these amazing stories about their own personal stories about their own personal stories about their own personal transformation about you know like I'm I transformation about you know like I'm I transformation about you know like I'm I was leading a church of four people and was leading a church of four people and was leading a church of four people and before I knew it it was a church of before I knew it it was a church of before I knew it it was a church of 4,000 like or he raised a bunch of money 4,000 like or he raised a bunch of money 4,000 like or he raised a bunch of money and did this amazing thing John actually and did this amazing thing John actually and did this amazing thing John actually has an interesting story that I'm hoping has an interesting story that I'm hoping has an interesting story that I'm hoping he'll tell it's kind of a little bit of he'll tell it's kind of a little bit of he'll tell it's kind of a little bit of a personal story around his own ministry a personal story around his own ministry a personal story around his own ministry journey I'd love to hear a little bit journey I'd love to hear a little bit journey I'd love to hear a little bit about that John if you could tell us about that John if you could tell us about that John if you could tell us kind of what has brought you to the

kind of what has brought you to the kind of what has brought you to the season that you're in now well hey season that you're in now well hey season that you're in now well hey that's a great question and when I'd that's a great question and when I'd that's a great question and when I'd happily tell but I also want to say that happily tell but I also want to say that happily tell but I also want to say that I love those rags to riches stories I love those rags to riches stories I love those rags to riches stories because they encouraged me so much it's because they encouraged me so much it's because they encouraged me so much it's great to know that those things happen great to know that those things happen great to know that those things happen and many of my friends have had the and many of my friends have had the and many of my friends have had the opportunity to do that I thought we were opportunity to do that I thought we were opportunity to do that I thought we were doing that at this one church that I was doing that at this one church that I was doing that at this one church that I was at the last assignment we saw a good at the last assignment we saw a good at the last assignment we saw a good growth in a church that was over 100 growth in a church that was over 100 growth in a church that was over 100 years old and I thought you know we were years old and I thought you know we were years old and I thought you know we were putting chapters together to write a putting chapters together to write a putting chapters together to write a book about how to take over an book about how to take over an book about how to take over an established church and lead it into the established church and lead it into the established church and lead it into the 21st century and I was very encouraged 21st century and I was very encouraged 21st century and I was very encouraged by some of the growth that we saw new by some of the growth that we saw new by some of the growth that we saw new people coming baptisms people coming baptisms people coming baptisms regularly we saw debt being paid off and regularly we saw debt being paid off and regularly we saw debt being paid off and then there was a bit of a vacuum in our then there was a bit of a vacuum in our then there was a bit of a vacuum in our leadership my executive pastor got a leadership my executive pastor got a leadership my executive pastor got a promotion to a different place oh the promotion to a different place oh the promotion to a different place oh the district office I guess you could call district office I guess you could call district office I guess you could call it and I created a bit of a power vacuum it and I created a bit of a power vacuum it and I created a bit of a power vacuum in the sense that I was in a teaching in the sense that I was in a teaching in the sense that I was in a teaching pastor executive pastor model so a co pastor executive pastor model so a co pastor executive pastor model so a co leadership and then we decided and I leadership and then we decided and I leadership and then we decided and I recommended my own basically layoffs and recommended my own basically layoffs and recommended my own basically layoffs and that I said hey I think we should go to that I said hey I think we should go to that I said hey I think we should go to lead pastor model because I think it's lead pastor model because I think it's lead pastor model because I think it's more efficient I had lots of reasons why more efficient I had lots of reasons why more efficient I had lots of reasons why and I think the traditional model does and I think the traditional model does and I think the traditional model does work a little better and the board said work a little better and the board said work a little better and the board said yet we totally agree with you in fact we yet we totally agree with you in fact we yet we totally agree with you in fact we were thinking the same thing and I was were thinking the same thing and I was were thinking the same thing and I was thinking because we had all this success thinking because we had all this success thinking because we had all this success and you know we're building up lots of and you know we're building up lots of and you know we're building up lots of momentum and excitement and there was a momentum and excitement and there was a momentum and excitement and there was a buzz in the church I thought for sure buzz in the church I thought for sure buzz in the church I thought for sure that I would be the guy to be honest that I would be the guy to be honest that I would be the guy to be honest with you and then my life literally fell

with you and then my life literally fell with you and then my life literally fell apart in one meeting when I heard the apart in one meeting when I heard the apart in one meeting when I heard the words search committee and I knew that words search committee and I knew that words search committee and I knew that at that point my my season was over and at that point my my season was over and at that point my my season was over and I mean I was thinking did I overreact to I mean I was thinking did I overreact to I mean I was thinking did I overreact to this is this really happening this is this really happening this is this really happening you know we had a my wife was pregnant you know we had a my wife was pregnant you know we had a my wife was pregnant it was Christmas was coming I thought it was Christmas was coming I thought it was Christmas was coming I thought for sure it wasn't but yeah I realized for sure it wasn't but yeah I realized for sure it wasn't but yeah I realized that they thought I was too young to be that they thought I was too young to be that they thought I was too young to be the leader while they liked who I was the leader while they liked who I was the leader while they liked who I was they said it wasn't about character or they said it wasn't about character or they said it wasn't about character or sin it was about basically me being too sin it was about basically me being too sin it was about basically me being too young to lead a church of that's been young to lead a church of that's been young to lead a church of that's been over 100 years old so that was very over 100 years old so that was very over 100 years old so that was very disheartening and yet I see that out of disheartening and yet I see that out of disheartening and yet I see that out of it God has used that time that I had I it God has used that time that I had I it God has used that time that I had I had I got a generous severance package had I got a generous severance package had I got a generous severance package which was great we had another baby our which was great we had another baby our which was great we had another baby our second second baby there so with a second second baby there so with a second second baby there so with a toddler around the newborn it was great toddler around the newborn it was great toddler around the newborn it was great to have some time away and I also had to have some time away and I also had to have some time away and I also had lots of time to think Who am I as a as a lots of time to think Who am I as a as a lots of time to think Who am I as a as a young leader in the church how can I young leader in the church how can I young leader in the church how can I still contribute so it's never a matter still contribute so it's never a matter still contribute so it's never a matter of you know all bitter about the church of you know all bitter about the church of you know all bitter about the church it was actually about you know what can it was actually about you know what can it was actually about you know what can I contribute going forward from here how I contribute going forward from here how I contribute going forward from here how can I um how could I reengage myself as can I um how could I reengage myself as can I um how could I reengage myself as a 30-something leader in the church so a 30-something leader in the church so a 30-something leader in the church so there's a long answer to a short there's a long answer to a short there's a long answer to a short question no no that's good question no no that's good question no no that's good you know was it was the sense not that I you know was it was the sense not that I you know was it was the sense not that I want to lean in on your pain too much want to lean in on your pain too much want to lean in on your pain too much but what was the idea but what was the idea but what was the idea like that there was there seemed to be like that there was there seemed to be like that there was there seemed to be consensus like hey we're happy with John consensus like hey we're happy with John consensus like hey we're happy with John doing what he's doing when there was doing what he's doing when there was doing what he's doing when there was someone in that executive pastor role someone in that executive pastor role someone in that executive pastor role but once that escaped then it was like

but once that escaped then it was like but once that escaped then it was like we'll wait a second this we're just not we'll wait a second this we're just not we'll wait a second this we're just not sure that that's really a winning sure that that's really a winning sure that that's really a winning solution yeah and in fairness to the solution yeah and in fairness to the solution yeah and in fairness to the board they had to make a very tough board they had to make a very tough board they had to make a very tough decision and so I understand that maybe decision and so I understand that maybe decision and so I understand that maybe they were looking for a different skill they were looking for a different skill they were looking for a different skill set to to lead a church that was set to to lead a church that was set to to lead a church that was multi-generational but at the end of the multi-generational but at the end of the multi-generational but at the end of the day their decision resulted in me you day their decision resulted in me you day their decision resulted in me you know I'm not having a job anymore so we know I'm not having a job anymore so we know I'm not having a job anymore so we had we had to make a tough decision in had we had to make a tough decision in had we had to make a tough decision in response to that to say you know what it response to that to say you know what it response to that to say you know what it seems like the writing's on the wall for seems like the writing's on the wall for seems like the writing's on the wall for us here and so we had to make the tough us here and so we had to make the tough us here and so we had to make the tough decision to say maybe God has something decision to say maybe God has something decision to say maybe God has something else and so we had to leave you know else and so we had to leave you know else and so we had to leave you know really close friends that we had and and really close friends that we had and and really close friends that we had and and now just seeking God to see what next now just seeking God to see what next now just seeking God to see what next but I still always want to tell the but I still always want to tell the but I still always want to tell the story with the positive angle and that story with the positive angle and that story with the positive angle and that out of this God has really allowed me to out of this God has really allowed me to out of this God has really allowed me to spend time with my family which I value spend time with my family which I value spend time with my family which I value a great deal he's allowed me to rethink a great deal he's allowed me to rethink a great deal he's allowed me to rethink some of the stuff that we'll probably some of the stuff that we'll probably some of the stuff that we'll probably talk about here and so that I can add talk about here and so that I can add talk about here and so that I can add something with a fresh voice to a something with a fresh voice to a something with a fresh voice to a conversation that I think needs to conversation that I think needs to conversation that I think needs to happen in the church about how to engage happen in the church about how to engage happen in the church about how to engage with my generation the millennial with my generation the millennial with my generation the millennial generation yeah that's cool why don't we generation yeah that's cool why don't we generation yeah that's cool why don't we jump into that you know I think the jump into that you know I think the jump into that you know I think the obviously outside of this pastoring role obviously outside of this pastoring role obviously outside of this pastoring role you're you've also you know you've been you're you've also you know you've been you're you've also you know you've been a blogger and author you've written at a blogger and author you've written at a blogger and author you've written at least one book I think maybe two yeah least one book I think maybe two yeah least one book I think maybe two yeah yeah yeah and so you know you sit an yeah yeah and so you know you sit an yeah yeah and so you know you sit an interesting position to kind of sit back interesting position to kind of sit back interesting position to kind of sit back and say what are the kind of trends that and say what are the kind of trends that and say what are the kind of trends that you're noticing in you know the broader you're noticing in you know the broader you're noticing in you know the broader church context what are the things church context what are the things church context what are the things you're thinking about or you're thinking you're thinking about or you're thinking you're thinking about or you're thinking we should be thinking about from your we should be thinking about from your we should be thinking about from your seat right

seat right seat right well I mean I think a lot of your well I mean I think a lot of your well I mean I think a lot of your listeners will be familiar with George listeners will be familiar with George listeners will be familiar with George barniz recent book the state of pastors barniz recent book the state of pastors barniz recent book the state of pastors where they release the Barna research where they release the Barna research where they release the Barna research group which has been really eye-opening group which has been really eye-opening group which has been really eye-opening and humbling for us who grew up in the and humbling for us who grew up in the and humbling for us who grew up in the church and who are leaders in the church church and who are leaders in the church church and who are leaders in the church to see that across North America pastors to see that across North America pastors to see that across North America pastors are getting older and so that kind of are getting older and so that kind of are getting older and so that kind of conflicts with the current population conflicts with the current population conflicts with the current population trends in North America which say that trends in North America which say that trends in North America which say that the millennial generation is now the the millennial generation is now the the millennial generation is now the largest generation out there and yet we largest generation out there and yet we largest generation out there and yet we are grossly underrepresented in church are grossly underrepresented in church are grossly underrepresented in church leadership so I think in the workforce leadership so I think in the workforce leadership so I think in the workforce a one-in-three workers is a millennial a one-in-three workers is a millennial a one-in-three workers is a millennial and that's of course someone born and that's of course someone born and that's of course someone born between 1980 and 2000 depending on where between 1980 and 2000 depending on where between 1980 and 2000 depending on where you draw the line but I think that's a you draw the line but I think that's a you draw the line but I think that's a kind of a consensus age there so one in kind of a consensus age there so one in kind of a consensus age there so one in three in the workforce is the Millennial three in the workforce is the Millennial three in the workforce is the Millennial which is probably scary to a lot of which is probably scary to a lot of which is probably scary to a lot of employers okay employers okay employers okay I still think Millennials bring a lot to I still think Millennials bring a lot to I still think Millennials bring a lot to the table and what we can get into that the table and what we can get into that the table and what we can get into that if you won but only one in seven pastors if you won but only one in seven pastors if you won but only one in seven pastors are under 40 in the church and so I mean are under 40 in the church and so I mean are under 40 in the church and so I mean whatever you want to interpret with that whatever you want to interpret with that whatever you want to interpret with that stat I'm sure many opinions will be out stat I'm sure many opinions will be out stat I'm sure many opinions will be out there but it's just interesting to see there but it's just interesting to see there but it's just interesting to see that you know if we are serious about that you know if we are serious about that you know if we are serious about passing the baton on to the next passing the baton on to the next passing the baton on to the next generation then we have to be willing to generation then we have to be willing to generation then we have to be willing to take a risk saan I mean I'll just make take a risk saan I mean I'll just make take a risk saan I mean I'll just make it personal leaders like me who yes have it personal leaders like me who yes have it personal leaders like me who yes have many faults and and don't see the whole many faults and and don't see the whole many faults and and don't see the whole picture but need to learn to be able to picture but need to learn to be able to picture but need to learn to be able to grow and and take the leadership so I grow and and take the leadership so I grow and and take the leadership so I hope that out of my pain in saying hope that out of my pain in saying hope that out of my pain in saying having people look at me and say no having people look at me and say no having people look at me and say no you're too young I can say well actually you're too young I can say well actually you're too young I can say well actually you know maybe I can raise up an army of

you know maybe I can raise up an army of you know maybe I can raise up an army of young people who can help lead the young people who can help lead the young people who can help lead the church into the next wave and then maybe church into the next wave and then maybe church into the next wave and then maybe even instill confidence in some Gen Xers even instill confidence in some Gen Xers even instill confidence in some Gen Xers or baby boomers that know Millennials or baby boomers that know Millennials or baby boomers that know Millennials can can do a good job we're not like the can can do a good job we're not like the can can do a good job we're not like the media portrays us to be like lazy media portrays us to be like lazy media portrays us to be like lazy narcissistic I mean we are those things narcissistic I mean we are those things narcissistic I mean we are those things but we're also sort of us good things but we're also sort of us good things but we're also sort of us good things too right I just think it's funny that too right I just think it's funny that too right I just think it's funny that every time you see something in the news every time you see something in the news every time you see something in the news about Millennials it's always negative about Millennials it's always negative about Millennials it's always negative right like I saw this I saw this one right like I saw this I saw this one right like I saw this I saw this one question on it it was a headline it said question on it it was a headline it said question on it it was a headline it said why are Millennials so obsessed with why are Millennials so obsessed with why are Millennials so obsessed with food like well I think probably because food like well I think probably because food like well I think probably because we need to eat yeah you want to get some we need to eat yeah you want to get some we need to eat yeah you want to get some but alive so we like to we like surged I but alive so we like to we like surged I but alive so we like to we like surged I enjoyed food myself no but anyways I'm enjoyed food myself no but anyways I'm enjoyed food myself no but anyways I'm just thinking trying to rethink how we just thinking trying to rethink how we just thinking trying to rethink how we can build up trust and so one person can build up trust and so one person can build up trust and so one person told me a mentor kind of took me under told me a mentor kind of took me under told me a mentor kind of took me under his wing for a bit you know when we were his wing for a bit you know when we were his wing for a bit you know when we were in a real hurtin section and of life and in a real hurtin section and of life and in a real hurtin section and of life and said you know it'll be very easy for you said you know it'll be very easy for you said you know it'll be very easy for you to take revenge out on this on these to take revenge out on this on these to take revenge out on this on these people you know maybe a couple of board people you know maybe a couple of board people you know maybe a couple of board members that you didn't get along with members that you didn't get along with members that you didn't get along with that had it out for you or whatever but that had it out for you or whatever but that had it out for you or whatever but he said the best revenge is a life he said the best revenge is a life he said the best revenge is a life well-lived mmm you know that's that is well-lived mmm you know that's that is well-lived mmm you know that's that is so what Paul said to Timothy too right so what Paul said to Timothy too right so what Paul said to Timothy too right do not let anyone look down on you do not let anyone look down on you do not let anyone look down on you because you're a young but that an because you're a young but that an because you're a young but that an example example example in the way you live your life and how in the way you live your life and how in the way you live your life and how you talk to how you have your face with you talk to how you have your face with you talk to how you have your face with God I mean that I don't know how that God I mean that I don't know how that God I mean that I don't know how that was advice because I've been reading was advice because I've been reading was advice because I've been reading first Timothy for my whole life right I first Timothy for my whole life right I first Timothy for my whole life right I love that first of all do not let anyone love that first of all do not let anyone love that first of all do not let anyone look down on you because you were young look down on you because you were young look down on you because you were young and so it's right there and so I think

and so it's right there and so I think and so it's right there and so I think if I can set and it helped set an if I can set and it helped set an if I can set and it helped set an example in some ways you know even example in some ways you know even example in some ways you know even someone that's been say quote burned by someone that's been say quote burned by someone that's been say quote burned by the church I mean I learned that in the church I mean I learned that in the church I mean I learned that in seminary what you have a tough seminary what you have a tough seminary what you have a tough experience at some point things are experience at some point things are experience at some point things are going to go awry for you at one point going to go awry for you at one point going to go awry for you at one point everyone's going to have a scar to bear everyone's going to have a scar to bear everyone's going to have a scar to bear every pastor will carry that at one every pastor will carry that at one every pastor will carry that at one point I had mine early I learned that point I had mine early I learned that point I had mine early I learned that but then to actually have to go through but then to actually have to go through but then to actually have to go through it and to say I still love the church I it and to say I still love the church I it and to say I still love the church I still believe it's the hope of the world still believe it's the hope of the world still believe it's the hope of the world I still lost people matter to God and I still lost people matter to God and I still lost people matter to God and that church is his greatest vehicle to that church is his greatest vehicle to that church is his greatest vehicle to reach them very cool camp to write we're reach them very cool camp to write we're reach them very cool camp to write we're both camp guys yeah yeah exactly yeah both camp guys yeah yeah exactly yeah both camp guys yeah yeah exactly yeah Hampshire helps but Church is working Hampshire helps but Church is working Hampshire helps but Church is working with campsite oh I'd know absolutely with campsite oh I'd know absolutely with campsite oh I'd know absolutely yeah they look there's nothing like a yeah they look there's nothing like a yeah they look there's nothing like a local church for sure by any means when local church for sure by any means when local church for sure by any means when it's done well that most definitely why it's done well that most definitely why it's done well that most definitely why don't you give you know so funny don't you give you know so funny don't you give you know so funny personal anecdote and all this I was personal anecdote and all this I was personal anecdote and all this I was born in 1974 I'm a gen Xer 1974 has the born in 1974 I'm a gen Xer 1974 has the born in 1974 I'm a gen Xer 1974 has the dubious distinction of being the lowest dubious distinction of being the lowest dubious distinction of being the lowest birth rate year of the 20th century so I birth rate year of the 20th century so I birth rate year of the 20th century so I interesting I did not know that smallest interesting I did not know that smallest interesting I did not know that smallest yep the smallest so I was never in a yep the smallest so I was never in a yep the smallest so I was never in a portable as you know throw school had portable as you know throw school had portable as you know throw school had small class sizes and and a lot of times small class sizes and and a lot of times small class sizes and and a lot of times I just don't run into other leaders who I just don't run into other leaders who I just don't run into other leaders who are my age so as a gen Xer are my age so as a gen Xer are my age so as a gen Xer a year a minority rich literature a year a minority rich literature a year a minority rich literature minority sure like yeah exactly so you minority sure like yeah exactly so you minority sure like yeah exactly so you know what I would you say why would you know what I would you say why would you know what I would you say why would you say that there is hesitancy from or why say that there is hesitancy from or why say that there is hesitancy from or why is that trend that you know so few is that trend that you know so few is that trend that you know so few pastors or preachers are led by folks

pastors or preachers are led by folks pastors or preachers are led by folks that are Millennials what why is that oh that are Millennials what why is that oh that are Millennials what why is that oh I mean that's that's a long conversation I mean that's that's a long conversation I mean that's that's a long conversation but I think a few things is you know if but I think a few things is you know if but I think a few things is you know if we if we do believe what the media says we if we do believe what the media says we if we do believe what the media says about Millennials then you know they about Millennials then you know they about Millennials then you know they can't get off their phones they show up can't get off their phones they show up can't get off their phones they show up late to work they are addicted to porn late to work they are addicted to porn late to work they are addicted to porn and their social media net and and their social media net and and their social media net and themselves and everything right but I themselves and everything right but I themselves and everything right but I think probably one of the biggest things think probably one of the biggest things think probably one of the biggest things that that that that that that they represent a threat sometimes I mean they represent a threat sometimes I mean they represent a threat sometimes I mean I listen to some of my pastor friends I listen to some of my pastor friends I listen to some of my pastor friends who are a bit older longer in the tooth who are a bit older longer in the tooth who are a bit older longer in the tooth and they don't even know how to what to and they don't even know how to what to and they don't even know how to what to do with social media right it seems like do with social media right it seems like do with social media right it seems like everything has changed and I would think everything has changed and I would think everything has changed and I would think that you know that's kind of what like that you know that's kind of what like that you know that's kind of what like the taxi drivers feel about uber and the taxi drivers feel about uber and the taxi drivers feel about uber and that's what Christian bookstore owners that's what Christian bookstore owners that's what Christian bookstore owners feel about Amazon and all these things feel about Amazon and all these things feel about Amazon and all these things have been disrupted by this huge have been disrupted by this huge have been disrupted by this huge revolution in communication and how revolution in communication and how revolution in communication and how people engage and how they what they people engage and how they what they people engage and how they what they expect and the church to think that expect and the church to think that expect and the church to think that we're immune from it it would be totally we're immune from it it would be totally we're immune from it it would be totally naive but while some churches I think naive but while some churches I think naive but while some churches I think can get along just fine can get along just fine can get along just fine saying you know what we're not going to saying you know what we're not going to saying you know what we're not going to work we're going to kind of hunker down work we're going to kind of hunker down work we're going to kind of hunker down and we're not going to do social media and we're not going to do social media and we're not going to do social media we're not going to get engaged in all we're not going to get engaged in all we're not going to get engaged in all that I think they see it as a threat and that I think they see it as a threat and that I think they see it as a threat and so anybody who represents that that's so anybody who represents that that's so anybody who represents that that's comfortable with it you know they kind comfortable with it you know they kind comfortable with it you know they kind of represent social media because of represent social media because of represent social media because they're young and they're they are they're young and they're they are they're young and they're they are always on their phones or - you know and always on their phones or - you know and always on their phones or - you know and so I think you know maybe maybe I so I think you know maybe maybe I so I think you know maybe maybe I probably don't do it justice either - probably don't do it justice either - probably don't do it justice either - because I embrace these new technologies because I embrace these new technologies because I embrace these new technologies so quickly and I'm comfortable with them so quickly and I'm comfortable with them so quickly and I'm comfortable with them it's kind of the air that I've read it's kind of the air that I've read it's kind of the air that I've read through those formative years of my 20s

through those formative years of my 20s through those formative years of my 20s right like that's when the rise of right like that's when the rise of right like that's when the rise of social media happens so because I'm so social media happens so because I'm so social media happens so because I'm so comfortable with it maybe I represent a comfortable with it maybe I represent a comfortable with it maybe I represent a threat to some older leaders or whatever threat to some older leaders or whatever threat to some older leaders or whatever and and people like me but I do you and and people like me but I do you and and people like me but I do you think it's funny racial that you know think it's funny racial that you know think it's funny racial that you know like all these new technologies were like all these new technologies were like all these new technologies were always made fun of right if you want it always made fun of right if you want it always made fun of right if you want it Downton Abbey and you see the phone come Downton Abbey and you see the phone come Downton Abbey and you see the phone come out and the butler just cannot figure out and the butler just cannot figure out and the butler just cannot figure out yes well I he just hates the phone out yes well I he just hates the phone out yes well I he just hates the phone he's like this thing you'll never catch he's like this thing you'll never catch he's like this thing you'll never catch on staying with electricity and you look on staying with electricity and you look on staying with electricity and you look at when like Twitter came out and at when like Twitter came out and at when like Twitter came out and YouTube came out and Facebook came out YouTube came out and Facebook came out YouTube came out and Facebook came out they all got made fun of until they were they all got made fun of until they were they all got made fun of until they were completely normal right so I think completely normal right so I think completely normal right so I think Millennials you know we get made fun of Millennials you know we get made fun of Millennials you know we get made fun of and I like I said rightly so for many and I like I said rightly so for many and I like I said rightly so for many things but soon we're going to be the things but soon we're going to be the things but soon we're going to be the ones that have to take over totally well ones that have to take over totally well ones that have to take over totally well and even just just this week I was and even just just this week I was and even just just this week I was reading actually don't think it was reading actually don't think it was reading actually don't think it was launched this week I think I was a week launched this week I think I was a week launched this week I think I was a week behind on it but the New York Times behind on it but the New York Times behind on it but the New York Times started doing snapchat stories and I and started doing snapchat stories and I and started doing snapchat stories and I and I I commented online I was like that is I I commented online I was like that is I I commented online I was like that is that that is a tipping point somewhere that that is a tipping point somewhere that that is a tipping point somewhere in for that particular platform you know in for that particular platform you know in for that particular platform you know when when it when a when when it when a when when it when a a literally kind of old school it a literally kind of old school it a literally kind of old school it doesn't really get much more staid than doesn't really get much more staid than doesn't really get much more staid than the New York Times and the New York the New York Times and the New York the New York Times and the New York Times says hmm I think we need to and I Times says hmm I think we need to and I Times says hmm I think we need to and I saw I was digging into it a little bit saw I was digging into it a little bit saw I was digging into it a little bit and they actually have six full-time and they actually have six full-time and they actually have six full-time people employed on that one application people employed on that one application people employed on that one application just on repurposing for and it's just on repurposing for and it's just on repurposing for and it's interesting you should actually it's interesting you should actually it's interesting you should actually it's well worth checking out well worth checking out well worth checking out they clearly are trying to I think what they clearly are trying to I think what they clearly are trying to I think what they're trying to do is to draw people they're trying to do is to draw people they're trying to do is to draw people from snapchat into their current you

from snapchat into their current you from snapchat into their current you know into their other brands and they're know into their other brands and they're know into their other brands and they're trying to repackage their content to trying to repackage their content to trying to repackage their content to appeal to a younger generation which is appeal to a younger generation which is appeal to a younger generation which is even you know I it's probably not even even you know I it's probably not even even you know I it's probably not even Millennials they're thinking about but Millennials they're thinking about but Millennials they're thinking about but it's probably been younger than that but it's probably been younger than that but it's probably been younger than that but you know we I think we have to stay on you know we I think we have to stay on you know we I think we have to stay on the cutting edge we have to keep asking the cutting edge we have to keep asking the cutting edge we have to keep asking that question how do we continue to that question how do we continue to that question how do we continue to reach that next generation let's say reach that next generation let's say reach that next generation let's say you're you know listening and and you you're you know listening and and you you're you know listening and and you know there's leaders from maybe you know know there's leaders from maybe you know know there's leaders from maybe you know one of those 40-something fifty one of those 40-something fifty one of those 40-something fifty something leaders who's kind of caught something leaders who's kind of caught something leaders who's kind of caught in the middle ironically I run into a in the middle ironically I run into a in the middle ironically I run into a lot of leaders in their 60s and even 70s lot of leaders in their 60s and even 70s lot of leaders in their 60s and even 70s who are like I'm willing to try whatever who are like I'm willing to try whatever who are like I'm willing to try whatever because they've seen so much change but because they've seen so much change but because they've seen so much change but there's something about I've got a there's something about I've got a there's something about I've got a friend of mine that's a couple years old friend of mine that's a couple years old friend of mine that's a couple years old to me who will remain nameless who is so to me who will remain nameless who is so to me who will remain nameless who is so stodgy he's like mid-40s and he like stodgy he's like mid-40s and he like stodgy he's like mid-40s and he like acts like he's you know 75 years old and acts like he's you know 75 years old and acts like he's you know 75 years old and he's like resistant to all this why what he's like resistant to all this why what he's like resistant to all this why what would your advice be to him let's say he would your advice be to him let's say he would your advice be to him let's say he actually comes around since I you know actually comes around since I you know actually comes around since I you know and maybe we need we do need to do a few and maybe we need we do need to do a few and maybe we need we do need to do a few things to try to a you know kind of be a things to try to a you know kind of be a things to try to a you know kind of be a bit more open to reaching you know bit more open to reaching you know bit more open to reaching you know Millennials what would you suggest yeah Millennials what would you suggest yeah Millennials what would you suggest yeah I think that's a great first you know I think that's a great first you know I think that's a great first you know caveat to say look this isn't just the caveat to say look this isn't just the caveat to say look this isn't just the not all people are the same age just not all people are the same age just not all people are the same age just because we label somebody a millennial because we label somebody a millennial because we label somebody a millennial because they're eight 1980 to 2000 I because they're eight 1980 to 2000 I because they're eight 1980 to 2000 I think that people are people right we think that people are people right we think that people are people right we know that they're loved made by God know that they're loved made by God know that they're loved made by God valued by him that they are fallen and valued by him that they are fallen and valued by him that they are fallen and so they're going to be distracted by so they're going to be distracted by so they're going to be distracted by things that are secondary loves like you things that are secondary loves like you things that are secondary loves like you know the love technology or the love know the love technology or the love know the love technology or the love people more than God and will love other people more than God and will love other people more than God and will love other things with all of our heart rather than things with all of our heart rather than things with all of our heart rather than God so I get that and what maybe just

God so I get that and what maybe just God so I get that and what maybe just one example before we get into that one example before we get into that one example before we get into that isn't I was at I was at a family isn't I was at I was at a family isn't I was at I was at a family gathering just a few weeks ago and I gathering just a few weeks ago and I gathering just a few weeks ago and I looked around the room there was about looked around the room there was about looked around the room there was about 20 people there 20 people there 20 people there and it was the the boomers in the room and it was the the boomers in the room and it was the the boomers in the room that were on their phones and the that were on their phones and the that were on their phones and the Millennials were correcting them saying Millennials were correcting them saying Millennials were correcting them saying hey will hey will hey will no phones during family time this is no phones during family time this is no phones during family time this is yeah right here so it's so funny to yeah right here so it's so funny to yeah right here so it's so funny to think you know what some of these issues think you know what some of these issues think you know what some of these issues are actually universal across not just are actually universal across not just are actually universal across not just not just one thing so when I say like not just one thing so when I say like not just one thing so when I say like you know here's how we can reach you know here's how we can reach you know here's how we can reach Millennials I don't even know if Millennials I don't even know if Millennials I don't even know if Millennials know how to reach Millennials know how to reach Millennials know how to reach Millennials exactly because we're so Millennials exactly because we're so Millennials exactly because we're so different I mean I heard our friend Cary different I mean I heard our friend Cary different I mean I heard our friend Cary newhoff once say you know if you bring a newhoff once say you know if you bring a newhoff once say you know if you bring a bunch of Millennials around the dinner bunch of Millennials around the dinner bunch of Millennials around the dinner table and you start talking to them table and you start talking to them table and you start talking to them about what did they what are they about what did they what are they about what did they what are they looking for in church if you have 10 looking for in church if you have 10 looking for in church if you have 10 Millennials around the table you'll get Millennials around the table you'll get Millennials around the table you'll get 12 different answers right I can only 12 different answers right I can only 12 different answers right I can only give my perspective of what has helped give my perspective of what has helped give my perspective of what has helped me totally and so I would just say a few me totally and so I would just say a few me totally and so I would just say a few things like hey you know what address things like hey you know what address things like hey you know what address and I'm an apologetics guy I only became and I'm an apologetics guy I only became and I'm an apologetics guy I only became that because I mean I was being asked that because I mean I was being asked that because I mean I was being asked lots of questions as a youth pastor and lots of questions as a youth pastor and lots of questions as a youth pastor and young adults pastor and I was being young adults pastor and I was being young adults pastor and I was being asked these philosophical questions that asked these philosophical questions that asked these philosophical questions that I had never dealt with in Bible School I had never dealt with in Bible School I had never dealt with in Bible School right I learned how to preach from right I learned how to preach from right I learned how to preach from Romans and I learn different theories on Romans and I learn different theories on Romans and I learn different theories on who wrote the book of Hebrews and those who wrote the book of Hebrews and those who wrote the book of Hebrews and those are all great learn but I never learned are all great learn but I never learned are all great learn but I never learned anything about how does Christianity anything about how does Christianity anything about how does Christianity work with science right and working with work with science right and working with work with science right and working with a philosophical angle to the problem of a philosophical angle to the problem of a philosophical angle to the problem of suffering and evil things like you know suffering and evil things like you know suffering and evil things like you know how do you deal with the book of Genesis how do you deal with the book of Genesis how do you deal with the book of Genesis 1 or star each chapter of Genesis 1 so 1 or star each chapter of Genesis 1 so 1 or star each chapter of Genesis 1 so it's just really important things that

it's just really important things that it's just really important things that are deal-breakers for a lot of people are deal-breakers for a lot of people are deal-breakers for a lot of people whether they be inside or outside the whether they be inside or outside the whether they be inside or outside the church but knowing that there's an church but knowing that there's an church but knowing that there's an opportunity to just give a little opportunity to just give a little opportunity to just give a little apologetics angle now I mean may the 4th apologetics angle now I mean may the 4th apologetics angle now I mean may the 4th was just yesterday for so you know we was just yesterday for so you know we was just yesterday for so you know we don't all have to be a Jedi in don't all have to be a Jedi in don't all have to be a Jedi in apologetics or what we go ahead I yes apologetics or what we go ahead I yes apologetics or what we go ahead I yes but we just have to know something about but we just have to know something about but we just have to know something about what could the skeptic be thinking about what could the skeptic be thinking about what could the skeptic be thinking about this message that I'm giving right here this message that I'm giving right here this message that I'm giving right here and what is the person who's struggling and what is the person who's struggling and what is the person who's struggling with doubt right maybe they're they grew with doubt right maybe they're they grew with doubt right maybe they're they grew up in the church they're card-carrying up in the church they're card-carrying up in the church they're card-carrying believers you know helping out in your believers you know helping out in your believers you know helping out in your youth ministry but you don't know what youth ministry but you don't know what youth ministry but you don't know what they were just that video that they just they were just that video that they just they were just that video that they just saw on youtube or something that totally saw on youtube or something that totally saw on youtube or something that totally throwing their faith in the question throwing their faith in the question throwing their faith in the question just the night before mm-hmm you don't just the night before mm-hmm you don't just the night before mm-hmm you don't know some of the stuff that they've been know some of the stuff that they've been know some of the stuff that they've been working through in their classroom at working through in their classroom at working through in their classroom at university years so just say like hey university years so just say like hey university years so just say like hey you know maybe you're wondering if this you know maybe you're wondering if this you know maybe you're wondering if this event ever happened or if this is event ever happened or if this is event ever happened or if this is credible what I'm saying here let's credible what I'm saying here let's credible what I'm saying here let's consider different perspectives and then consider different perspectives and then consider different perspectives and then just I mean Tim Keller pastor in New just I mean Tim Keller pastor in New just I mean Tim Keller pastor in New York does that so well where he just had York does that so well where he just had York does that so well where he just had addresses the skeptic addresses the skeptic addresses the skeptic addresses the doubter and I just think addresses the doubter and I just think addresses the doubter and I just think to think that everybody's just going to to think that everybody's just going to to think that everybody's just going to blindly believe everything that we say blindly believe everything that we say blindly believe everything that we say because we have the authority in the because we have the authority in the because we have the authority in the pulpit is just too naive when especially pulpit is just too naive when especially pulpit is just too naive when especially reaching Millennials because yeah I just reaching Millennials because yeah I just reaching Millennials because yeah I just think worse there's a lot of skeptics think worse there's a lot of skeptics think worse there's a lot of skeptics and doubters that were engaging with and and doubters that were engaging with and and doubters that were engaging with and that we have in our own hearts that's that we have in our own hearts that's that we have in our own hearts that's just poor thing before my long diatribe just poor thing before my long diatribe just poor thing before my long diatribe wraps up here I think when I was a youth wraps up here I think when I was a youth wraps up here I think when I was a youth pastor and I was getting asked these pastor and I was getting asked these pastor and I was getting asked these questions from sincere skeptics and questions from sincere skeptics and questions from sincere skeptics and doubters when I didn't have an answer

doubters when I didn't have an answer doubters when I didn't have an answer for those things they became like it for those things they became like it for those things they became like it would like be like a cancer in my soul would like be like a cancer in my soul would like be like a cancer in my soul that wouldn't eat up my vibrancy my that wouldn't eat up my vibrancy my that wouldn't eat up my vibrancy my boldness life my trust in God but when boldness life my trust in God but when boldness life my trust in God but when we get asked a question I mean that's we get asked a question I mean that's we get asked a question I mean that's one thing to be talking to somebody that one thing to be talking to somebody that one thing to be talking to somebody that Jesus died for and that God loves that Jesus died for and that God loves that Jesus died for and that God loves that he wants to to reach but to actually he wants to to reach but to actually he wants to to reach but to actually realize that not having an answer realize that not having an answer realize that not having an answer affects us so much right and so and affects us so much right and so and affects us so much right and so and erodes our confidence in our faith so as erodes our confidence in our faith so as erodes our confidence in our faith so as an apologetics guy that's just one thing an apologetics guy that's just one thing an apologetics guy that's just one thing that I would take it again talk forever that I would take it again talk forever that I would take it again talk forever about having an online community and its about having an online community and its about having an online community and its importance a real-life community taking importance a real-life community taking importance a real-life community taking advantage of new opportunities and advantage of new opportunities and advantage of new opportunities and technologies not being afraid of it but technologies not being afraid of it but technologies not being afraid of it but I'll just rest there in the apologetics I'll just rest there in the apologetics I'll just rest there in the apologetics answer and say that would be one of the answer and say that would be one of the answer and say that would be one of the my my hope for pastors is that they my my hope for pastors is that they my my hope for pastors is that they would realize that you know people are would realize that you know people are would realize that you know people are asking really tough questions inside and asking really tough questions inside and asking really tough questions inside and outside the church and we have to love outside the church and we have to love outside the church and we have to love them enough to always be ready to give them enough to always be ready to give them enough to always be ready to give up using for the hope we have in Jesus up using for the hope we have in Jesus up using for the hope we have in Jesus are their people are their pastors that are their people are their pastors that are their people are their pastors that you look to or communicators you look to you look to or communicators you look to you look to or communicators you look to that you think are doing a because that you think are doing a because that you think are doing a because they're there are we had Jay Warner they're there are we had Jay Warner they're there are we had Jay Warner Wallace friend of mine on you know he's Wallace friend of mine on you know he's Wallace friend of mine on you know he's an apologetics guy great guy for sure an apologetics guy great guy for sure an apologetics guy great guy for sure dozen is he has an amazing apologetics dozen is he has an amazing apologetics dozen is he has an amazing apologetics ministry does a lot of does a lot of ministry does a lot of does a lot of ministry does a lot of does a lot of great things he ends up becoming like a great things he ends up becoming like a great things he ends up becoming like a special like a guest speaker on a lot of special like a guest speaker on a lot of special like a guest speaker on a lot of churches are there are there church churches are there are there church churches are there are there church leaders out there who you think Tim leaders out there who you think Tim leaders out there who you think Tim Keller you mentioned does a good job Keller you mentioned does a good job Keller you mentioned does a good job kind of integrating that into the normal kind of integrating that into the normal kind of integrating that into the normal fabric of what he does other other folks fabric of what he does other other folks fabric of what he does other other folks that you would suggest that do a good that you would suggest that do a good that you would suggest that do a good job to kind of kind of weaving that into job to kind of kind of weaving that into job to kind of kind of weaving that into their ministry well you know I like I

their ministry well you know I like I their ministry well you know I like I mean if I mention names I think so many mean if I mention names I think so many mean if I mention names I think so many people know names better than better people know names better than better people know names better than better than I do you know who the true heroes than I do you know who the true heroes than I do you know who the true heroes are it would be more like the youth are it would be more like the youth are it would be more like the youth pastors out there because the youth pastors out there because the youth pastors out there because the youth pastors are do pastors are do pastors are do with high school students right and I with high school students right and I with high school students right and I mean high schools have totally a lot of mean high schools have totally a lot of mean high schools have totally a lot of maybe I shouldn't say totally I mean maybe I shouldn't say totally I mean maybe I shouldn't say totally I mean Canada is an interesting thing we've Canada is an interesting thing we've Canada is an interesting thing we've been secular for a while now but high been secular for a while now but high been secular for a while now but high schools can be a very hostile schools can be a very hostile schools can be a very hostile environment for the Christian and a environment for the Christian and a environment for the Christian and a place where skepticism just grows place where skepticism just grows place where skepticism just grows vibrant you know so youth pastors are vibrant you know so youth pastors are vibrant you know so youth pastors are the ones who are calling me often who the ones who are calling me often who the ones who are calling me often who are maybe even buying my book so are maybe even buying my book so are maybe even buying my book so ordering saying hey I'm going to do a ordering saying hey I'm going to do a ordering saying hey I'm going to do a topic say I'm talking about suffering or topic say I'm talking about suffering or topic say I'm talking about suffering or something and I need to talk to or maybe something and I need to talk to or maybe something and I need to talk to or maybe even I'm talking through Joe but I'm even I'm talking through Joe but I'm even I'm talking through Joe but I'm talking through James chapter one we're talking through James chapter one we're talking through James chapter one we're talking to encounter all joy when you talking to encounter all joy when you talking to encounter all joy when you experience trials of many kinds and I experience trials of many kinds and I experience trials of many kinds and I want to do something on suffering want to do something on suffering want to do something on suffering because this is the number one question because this is the number one question because this is the number one question my kids are asking how could God be good my kids are asking how could God be good my kids are asking how could God be good in light of all this so the heroes to me in light of all this so the heroes to me in light of all this so the heroes to me are the youth pastors in the young adult are the youth pastors in the young adult are the youth pastors in the young adult guys out there who are integrating this guys out there who are integrating this guys out there who are integrating this stuff because they they have to keep stuff because they they have to keep stuff because they they have to keep their kids interested and keep them their kids interested and keep them their kids interested and keep them listening and if they don't address you listening and if they don't address you listening and if they don't address you know what the questions that they're know what the questions that they're know what the questions that they're asking those kids will pick up their asking those kids will pick up their asking those kids will pick up their phones or tuned out or not come or go to phones or tuned out or not come or go to phones or tuned out or not come or go to sports or do anything else either then sports or do anything else either then sports or do anything else either then come to the youth group that night so come to the youth group that night so come to the youth group that night so it's really the youth pastors rich that it's really the youth pastors rich that it's really the youth pastors rich that are really impressing me because they're are really impressing me because they're are really impressing me because they're realizing they need to do this if realizing they need to do this if realizing they need to do this if they're going to actually be relevant to they're going to actually be relevant to they're going to actually be relevant to the stuff that their kids are working the stuff that their kids are working the stuff that their kids are working through and and I mean university through and and I mean university through and and I mean university students would be the same as well so students would be the same as well so students would be the same as well so any young adults group out there if you any young adults group out there if you any young adults group out there if you want names I could give you a few but I

want names I could give you a few but I want names I could give you a few but I mean it's really the those who are kind mean it's really the those who are kind mean it's really the those who are kind of connect with younger generations that of connect with younger generations that of connect with younger generations that are really getting this and yeah that's are really getting this and yeah that's are really getting this and yeah that's like me see the need for it so bad right like me see the need for it so bad right like me see the need for it so bad right yeah absolutely for a long time I served yeah absolutely for a long time I served yeah absolutely for a long time I served with a still a good friend my brother with a still a good friend my brother with a still a good friend my brother Cavey at the meeting house in in Toronto Cavey at the meeting house in in Toronto Cavey at the meeting house in in Toronto who every Sunday they do open forum Q&A who every Sunday they do open forum Q&A who every Sunday they do open forum Q&A at the end of his messages and I know at the end of his messages and I know at the end of his messages and I know that what's that that's so important to that what's that that's so important to that what's that that's so important to you right yeah I realized that people you right yeah I realized that people you right yeah I realized that people are going to have questions yeah are going to have questions yeah are going to have questions yeah absolutely and having pinch-hit a couple absolutely and having pinch-hit a couple absolutely and having pinch-hit a couple times there and they do Q&A even their times there and they do Q&A even their times there and they do Q&A even their guest communicators do Q&A I know what guest communicators do Q&A I know what guest communicators do Q&A I know what it does for me when I like if we're it does for me when I like if we're it does for me when I like if we're honest what sometimes when we preach honest what sometimes when we preach honest what sometimes when we preach it's like we've got this all into a nice it's like we've got this all into a nice it's like we've got this all into a nice little neat package but like if we're little neat package but like if we're little neat package but like if we're honest there's this one part of it honest there's this one part of it honest there's this one part of it that we just kind of gloss over that we just kind of gloss over that we just kind of gloss over rhetorically affray and we're kind of rhetorically affray and we're kind of rhetorically affray and we're kind of hoping no one asked us a question about hoping no one asked us a question about hoping no one asked us a question about it but it but it but saying that that just and I've heard him saying that that just and I've heard him saying that that just and I've heard him say this that just Oh to the fact that say this that just Oh to the fact that say this that just Oh to the fact that he knows that people can ask questions he knows that people can ask questions he knows that people can ask questions for days is teaching into a spot where for days is teaching into a spot where for days is teaching into a spot where it's like I'm gonna have to address that it's like I'm gonna have to address that it's like I'm gonna have to address that or if I'm not if I don't address it I've or if I'm not if I don't address it I've or if I'm not if I don't address it I've at least got to make sure I've got an at least got to make sure I've got an at least got to make sure I've got an answer so when someone asked a question answer so when someone asked a question answer so when someone asked a question you know I'm ready to you know to answer you know I'm ready to you know to answer you know I'm ready to you know to answer that yeah how many times have I closed that yeah how many times have I closed that yeah how many times have I closed in prayer at the end of a sermon and in prayer at the end of a sermon and in prayer at the end of a sermon and said well that's all that I know about said well that's all that I know about said well that's all that I know about that particular topic presently right that particular topic presently right that particular topic presently right right right right right right right very well I just hope nobody asked me very well I just hope nobody asked me very well I just hope nobody asked me about it but again I mean even even just about it but again I mean even even just about it but again I mean even even just acknowledging that you don't know acknowledging that you don't know acknowledging that you don't know everything as a leader like to be everything as a leader like to be everything as a leader like to be authentic and to say look that's a great authentic and to say look that's a great authentic and to say look that's a great question you know why don't we look into

question you know why don't we look into question you know why don't we look into this or why don't you look into it this or why don't you look into it this or why don't you look into it encouraging them to pointing them in the encouraging them to pointing them in the encouraging them to pointing them in the right direction I think that's another right direction I think that's another right direction I think that's another thing about reaching Millennials it's thing about reaching Millennials it's thing about reaching Millennials it's okay to be human right right and it's okay to be human right right and it's okay to be human right right and it's okay to admit that you make mistakes too okay to admit that you make mistakes too okay to admit that you make mistakes too and to lay that out there before them I and to lay that out there before them I and to lay that out there before them I mean not to hang out your dirty laundry mean not to hang out your dirty laundry mean not to hang out your dirty laundry all the time but what I think people all the time but what I think people all the time but what I think people appreciate authenticity and that's appreciate authenticity and that's appreciate authenticity and that's probably no surprise to many of us cool probably no surprise to many of us cool probably no surprise to many of us cool now now now you're an author as well you've written you're an author as well you've written you're an author as well you've written on some of these these topics I wonder on some of these these topics I wonder on some of these these topics I wonder if you could kind of talk us through if you could kind of talk us through if you could kind of talk us through some of that tell me about you know if some of that tell me about you know if some of that tell me about you know if you have a book clear minds and dirty you have a book clear minds and dirty you have a book clear minds and dirty feet it's a great title tell us about feet it's a great title tell us about feet it's a great title tell us about that yeah so that book came out of an that yeah so that book came out of an that yeah so that book came out of an experience that I had again it would experience that I had again it would experience that I had again it would probably build off my story is I was probably build off my story is I was probably build off my story is I was getting asked all these questions and getting asked all these questions and getting asked all these questions and didn't know the answers to them and that didn't know the answers to them and that didn't know the answers to them and that actually sent me to have to resign from actually sent me to have to resign from actually sent me to have to resign from my job I was in a growing young adult my job I was in a growing young adult my job I was in a growing young adult ministry called ethos in Coquitlam on ministry called ethos in Coquitlam on ministry called ethos in Coquitlam on the west coast of Canada there and it the west coast of Canada there and it the west coast of Canada there and it was going really well and I lot again was going really well and I lot again was going really well and I lot again lots of momentum we're having a lot of lots of momentum we're having a lot of lots of momentum we're having a lot of fun but I found that I was woefully fun but I found that I was woefully fun but I found that I was woefully equipped for doing ministry so my buddy equipped for doing ministry so my buddy equipped for doing ministry so my buddy Andy Steiger was starting a ministry Andy Steiger was starting a ministry Andy Steiger was starting a ministry called apologetics Canada and he needed called apologetics Canada and he needed called apologetics Canada and he needed to do a conference that and we held the to do a conference that and we held the to do a conference that and we held the conference there and in the first year conference there and in the first year conference there and in the first year we were expecting like 100 200 people or we were expecting like 100 200 people or we were expecting like 100 200 people or whatever we got 700 Canadians to in the whatever we got 700 Canadians to in the whatever we got 700 Canadians to in the you know the great pagan north an you know the great pagan north an you know the great pagan north an apologetics conference right right and I apologetics conference right right and I apologetics conference right right and I thought oh my goodness there's a huge thought oh my goodness there's a huge thought oh my goodness there's a huge market for this in Canada Wow and then I market for this in Canada Wow and then I market for this in Canada Wow and then I looked at the speakers and they were all looked at the speakers and they were all looked at the speakers and they were all Americans and I thought wow like our

Americans and I thought wow like our Americans and I thought wow like our Canadian apologetics defense is a lot Canadian apologetics defense is a lot Canadian apologetics defense is a lot like a like a like a a Canadian military defense and that we a Canadian military defense and that we a Canadian military defense and that we justify on the American right of trouble justify on the American right of trouble justify on the American right of trouble yes right I was asking the question no yes right I was asking the question no yes right I was asking the question no who's who's training up leaders for for who's who's training up leaders for for who's who's training up leaders for for this important issue of giving helping this important issue of giving helping this important issue of giving helping people have an answer to these really people have an answer to these really people have an answer to these really tough questions that they're asking tough questions that they're asking tough questions that they're asking inside and outside the church so I had inside and outside the church so I had inside and outside the church so I had to resign to resign to resign I had to sell everything my car I had a I had to sell everything my car I had a I had to sell everything my car I had a motorcycle even at that point I had to motorcycle even at that point I had to motorcycle even at that point I had to sell that everything to get tuition to sell that everything to get tuition to sell that everything to get tuition to go to this really cool program at Oxford go to this really cool program at Oxford go to this really cool program at Oxford University where I got the chance to University where I got the chance to University where I got the chance to study for a year under really amazing study for a year under really amazing study for a year under really amazing names like mouston McGrath John Lennox names like mouston McGrath John Lennox names like mouston McGrath John Lennox Ravi Zacharias came and visited us and Ravi Zacharias came and visited us and Ravi Zacharias came and visited us and it was just a fantastic year I left that it was just a fantastic year I left that it was just a fantastic year I left that and went to Biola University to finish and went to Biola University to finish and went to Biola University to finish off a master's in apologetics and all off a master's in apologetics and all off a master's in apologetics and all that to say that was important for me to that to say that was important for me to that to say that was important for me to is really establish myself like okay I'm is really establish myself like okay I'm is really establish myself like okay I'm confident in these questions I know it confident in these questions I know it confident in these questions I know it and now I can give to others and so I and now I can give to others and so I and now I can give to others and so I you know people giving me scholarship you know people giving me scholarship you know people giving me scholarship money my local church had given me money money my local church had given me money money my local church had given me money and this was just a way to say you know and this was just a way to say you know and this was just a way to say you know here's thank you and I so I wrote the here's thank you and I so I wrote the here's thank you and I so I wrote the book clear - dirty feet with just book clear - dirty feet with just book clear - dirty feet with just answers to questions like hey how do we answers to questions like hey how do we answers to questions like hey how do we make sense of Christianity and science make sense of Christianity and science make sense of Christianity and science how did that conversation go evidence how did that conversation go evidence how did that conversation go evidence for God's existence how did why did God for God's existence how did why did God for God's existence how did why did God allow suffering and evil one cop one allow suffering and evil one cop one allow suffering and evil one cop one chapter on the philosophical answer but chapter on the philosophical answer but chapter on the philosophical answer but another question another topic on or another question another topic on or another question another topic on or chapter on when someone actually is

chapter on when someone actually is chapter on when someone actually is suffering right Sonia writes the problem suffering right Sonia writes the problem suffering right Sonia writes the problem of pain and it's absolutely a focal of pain and it's absolutely a focal of pain and it's absolutely a focal treatise on why God allows suffering and treatise on why God allows suffering and treatise on why God allows suffering and evil and he loses his wife joy to cancer evil and he loses his wife joy to cancer evil and he loses his wife joy to cancer the love of his life he's a complete the love of his life he's a complete the love of his life he's a complete wreck and though the answer that you wreck and though the answer that you wreck and though the answer that you give to somebody going through both give to somebody going through both give to somebody going through both Fiona in a philosophy classroom it's a Fiona in a philosophy classroom it's a Fiona in a philosophy classroom it's a lot different than you go with someone lot different than you go with someone lot different than you go with someone who just loved in a totally I mean who just loved in a totally I mean who just loved in a totally I mean looking at those kinds of things and looking at those kinds of things and looking at those kinds of things and then I was able to present that to the then I was able to present that to the then I was able to present that to the world or to my mom my grandma and it world or to my mom my grandma and it world or to my mom my grandma and it hasn't thank you too for all that it's hasn't thank you too for all that it's hasn't thank you too for all that it's been invested in my life so clear minds been invested in my life so clear minds been invested in my life so clear minds and dirty fees kinda like my apologetics and dirty fees kinda like my apologetics and dirty fees kinda like my apologetics treatise yep which I'm happy - yeah - treatise yep which I'm happy - yeah - treatise yep which I'm happy - yeah - Hawke because I think it's just full of Hawke because I think it's just full of Hawke because I think it's just full of stuff but other people have taught me stuff but other people have taught me stuff but other people have taught me that I know that I know that I know pathan cool and then you're just pathan cool and then you're just pathan cool and then you're just releasing a new book here called life releasing a new book here called life releasing a new book here called life hacks why don't you give us a quick hacks why don't you give us a quick hacks why don't you give us a quick quick kind of overview of that and then quick kind of overview of that and then quick kind of overview of that and then we'll move on with the rest the episode we'll move on with the rest the episode we'll move on with the rest the episode sure yeah I'm happy to talk about that sure yeah I'm happy to talk about that sure yeah I'm happy to talk about that when I was a youth pastor I wrote a book when I was a youth pastor I wrote a book when I was a youth pastor I wrote a book to give as a gift to my grads I was to give as a gift to my grads I was to give as a gift to my grads I was single and had lots of time and was single and had lots of time and was single and had lots of time and was ambitious but also I was more just like ambitious but also I was more just like ambitious but also I was more just like unhappy what to say the least about the unhappy what to say the least about the unhappy what to say the least about the caliber of books that you can give to caliber of books that you can give to caliber of books that you can give to grad student I mean like 101 Bible grad student I mean like 101 Bible grad student I mean like 101 Bible promises for grads none of my grads I promises for grads none of my grads I promises for grads none of my grads I knew we're going to read that and just knew we're going to read that and just knew we're going to read that and just some even the stuff that I would give some even the stuff that I would give some even the stuff that I would give them wasn't written for young adults you them wasn't written for young adults you them wasn't written for young adults you know it just this is a great book but know it just this is a great book but know it just this is a great book but they're not gonna write it's not dressed they're not gonna write it's not dressed they're not gonna write it's not dressed up so I wrote life hacks with them in up so I wrote life hacks with them in up so I wrote life hacks with them in mind but then as I was kind of letting

mind but then as I was kind of letting mind but then as I was kind of letting other people read it you know adults other people read it you know adults other people read it you know adults would say hey this was really helpful would say hey this was really helpful would say hey this was really helpful for me this one chap there or you know for me this one chap there or you know for me this one chap there or you know and then I talked about the church or and then I talked about the church or and then I talked about the church or whatever and how you need to love the whatever and how you need to love the whatever and how you need to love the church and they said oh I really church and they said oh I really church and they said oh I really appreciated that and this guy was like appreciated that and this guy was like appreciated that and this guy was like retired so it happened to a bigger eye retired so it happened to a bigger eye retired so it happened to a bigger eye so I didn't call it like the gift for so I didn't call it like the gift for so I didn't call it like the gift for grads I called it like pack this because grads I called it like pack this because grads I called it like pack this because all of us need to know as a great big all of us need to know as a great big all of us need to know as a great big discipleship in the 21st century so I discipleship in the 21st century so I discipleship in the 21st century so I rewrote it and now seven years after the rewrote it and now seven years after the rewrote it and now seven years after the fact I'm rebranding it releasing it and fact I'm rebranding it releasing it and fact I'm rebranding it releasing it and I think it's it should be helpful for a I think it's it should be helpful for a I think it's it should be helpful for a lot of people is a fun little project lot of people is a fun little project lot of people is a fun little project that I've enjoyed working on in this that I've enjoyed working on in this that I've enjoyed working on in this season when I've had to kind of you know season when I've had to kind of you know season when I've had to kind of you know reimagine what ministry in my country reimagine what ministry in my country reimagine what ministry in my country look like yes is the on seminary podcast look like yes is the on seminary podcast look like yes is the on seminary podcast stuff you wish they taught in seminary stuff you wish they taught in seminary stuff you wish they taught in seminary well we're going to jump into the well we're going to jump into the well we're going to jump into the lightening around that part of the lightening around that part of the lightening around that part of the episode where we have similar questions episode where we have similar questions episode where we have similar questions of everybody that's been on the show of everybody that's been on the show of everybody that's been on the show today we want to ask John Morrison or today we want to ask John Morrison or today we want to ask John Morrison or just so glad to have you on the show just so glad to have you on the show just so glad to have you on the show today John what is an online resource today John what is an online resource today John what is an online resource that you're using these days that's that you're using these days that's that you're using these days that's helping you out well one thing that's helping you out well one thing that's helping you out well one thing that's really helped me is I've had to read really helped me is I've had to read really helped me is I've had to read redo my blog so I've been blogging since redo my blog so I've been blogging since redo my blog so I've been blogging since 2006 got in it early and you know made 2006 got in it early and you know made 2006 got in it early and you know made all the mistakes of writing too much too all the mistakes of writing too much too all the mistakes of writing too much too long and I mean everything and so I had long and I mean everything and so I had long and I mean everything and so I had to learn but I've rereleased it with a to learn but I've rereleased it with a to learn but I've rereleased it with a new platform that it's been really new platform that it's been really new platform that it's been really helpful for me it was I use it as a helpful for me it was I use it as a helpful for me it was I use it as a pastor it's called Church OS it's a web pastor it's called Church OS it's a web pastor it's called Church OS it's a web platform but I've used it as my own platform but I've used it as my own platform but I've used it as my own personal blog and the reason why I was personal blog and the reason why I was personal blog and the reason why I was able to do that because my bro able to do that because my bro able to do that because my bro there's actually the owner of the there's actually the owner of the there's actually the owner of the company I was able to redo it for me and

company I was able to redo it for me and company I was able to redo it for me and so I really love that um my wife got me so I really love that um my wife got me so I really love that um my wife got me some podcasting gears for my birthday I some podcasting gears for my birthday I some podcasting gears for my birthday I asked for it my birthday's not for four asked for it my birthday's not for four asked for it my birthday's not for four months from now but I asked an early months from now but I asked an early months from now but I asked an early birthday present because I wanted to birthday present because I wanted to birthday present because I wanted to start that so I've been learning a noble start that so I've been learning a noble start that so I've been learning a noble GarageBand so a preacher using GarageBand so a preacher using GarageBand so a preacher using GarageBand is kind of interesting that's GarageBand is kind of interesting that's GarageBand is kind of interesting that's been helpful for me and then all my been helpful for me and then all my been helpful for me and then all my books I released through a great bit of books I released through a great bit of books I released through a great bit of software that you know rich called software that you know rich called software that you know rich called create space and create space is just create space and create space is just create space and create space is just amazon's way to self-publish so I've amazon's way to self-publish so I've amazon's way to self-publish so I've created a publishing company through my created a publishing company through my created a publishing company through my friends ministry apologetics Canada and friends ministry apologetics Canada and friends ministry apologetics Canada and so we just create Canadian resources for so we just create Canadian resources for so we just create Canadian resources for Canadians that otherwise couldn't you Canadians that otherwise couldn't you Canadians that otherwise couldn't you know I mean it's not like the zonder know I mean it's not like the zonder know I mean it's not like the zonder event of the world are going to event of the world are going to event of the world are going to necessarily look at little minnows like necessarily look at little minnows like necessarily look at little minnows like me in case Vancouver so anyway that's me in case Vancouver so anyway that's me in case Vancouver so anyway that's that's what I've been using it's been that's what I've been using it's been that's what I've been using it's been very helpful for me those online very helpful for me those online very helpful for me those online resources on top of all the other ones resources on top of all the other ones resources on top of all the other ones that you know all your guests mention that you know all your guests mention that you know all your guests mention ever notes and write write write write ever notes and write write write write ever notes and write write write write that's like that you know well that's that's like that you know well that's that's like that you know well that's what I thought it would help me was yeah what I thought it would help me was yeah what I thought it would help me was yeah those tools that's cool what's a book those tools that's cool what's a book those tools that's cool what's a book you've read in the last six months you've read in the last six months you've read in the last six months that's shaping your thinking or ministry that's shaping your thinking or ministry that's shaping your thinking or ministry yeah I had a necessary endings by Henry yeah I had a necessary endings by Henry yeah I had a necessary endings by Henry cloud handed to me obviously given what cloud handed to me obviously given what cloud handed to me obviously given what I talked about in the beginning of of my I talked about in the beginning of of my I talked about in the beginning of of my ministry at the last Church kind of ministry at the last Church kind of ministry at the last Church kind of falling apart so quickly I had to falling apart so quickly I had to falling apart so quickly I had to realize like some things are good so we realize like some things are good so we realize like some things are good so we start up a lot of things but when you start up a lot of things but when you start up a lot of things but when you start up something you need to put start up something you need to put start up something you need to put something to an end and so this rning is something to an end and so this rning is something to an end and so this rning is very helpful for me also I've just been very helpful for me also I've just been very helpful for me also I've just been loving these two non-christian guys Gary

loving these two non-christian guys Gary loving these two non-christian guys Gary Vaynerchuk you were called askgaryvee Vaynerchuk you were called askgaryvee Vaynerchuk you were called askgaryvee and I was listening to a lot of and I was listening to a lot of and I was listening to a lot of Christian podcast leaders that I respect Christian podcast leaders that I respect Christian podcast leaders that I respect a great deal and they kept talking about a great deal and they kept talking about a great deal and they kept talking about this Gary Vee guy Gary Vee and I was this Gary Vee guy Gary Vee and I was this Gary Vee guy Gary Vee and I was like why don't I just listen to him and like why don't I just listen to him and like why don't I just listen to him and then yes whatever so I he's got a bit of then yes whatever so I he's got a bit of then yes whatever so I he's got a bit of a potty mouth I call him the potty mouth a potty mouth I call him the potty mouth a potty mouth I call him the potty mouth prophet yes but I've just been so I've prophet yes but I've just been so I've prophet yes but I've just been so I've learned a ton from him he's just an learned a ton from him he's just an learned a ton from him he's just an entrepreneur a lot and and a guy named entrepreneur a lot and and a guy named entrepreneur a lot and and a guy named Pat Flynn who many people who started a Pat Flynn who many people who started a Pat Flynn who many people who started a podcast kind of used him as the way to podcast kind of used him as the way to podcast kind of used him as the way to learn what not to do and what to do and learn what not to do and what to do and learn what not to do and what to do and he recommends all kinds of stuff for he recommends all kinds of stuff for he recommends all kinds of stuff for setting up a business but I used him a setting up a business but I used him a setting up a business but I used him a lot for creating my podcast lot for creating my podcast lot for creating my podcast Morrison podcast so nice now that's Morrison podcast so nice now that's Morrison podcast so nice now that's great what's another minister you great what's another minister you great what's another minister you looking to that's inspiring you these looking to that's inspiring you these looking to that's inspiring you these days you know you should really say days you know you should really say days you know you should really say other than on seminary oh great I got other than on seminary oh great I got other than on seminary oh great I got out into twenty bucks well it's been so out into twenty bucks well it's been so out into twenty bucks well it's been so important right like I mean you are the important right like I mean you are the important right like I mean you are the guide to help leaders like me and you guide to help leaders like me and you guide to help leaders like me and you know Canadians about Americans as well I know Canadians about Americans as well I know Canadians about Americans as well I know a lot of your listeners are know a lot of your listeners are know a lot of your listeners are American well you're the guy that helps American well you're the guy that helps American well you're the guy that helps us with stuff that we didn't learn in us with stuff that we didn't learn in us with stuff that we didn't learn in Bible School right so what a great Bible School right so what a great Bible School right so what a great supplementary ministry to the stuff that supplementary ministry to the stuff that supplementary ministry to the stuff that were you know that we had learned about were you know that we had learned about were you know that we had learned about theology and you know how to not get theology and you know how to not get theology and you know how to not get your your way around Church life or your your way around Church life or your your way around Church life or whatever but anyway son seminaries huge whatever but anyway son seminaries huge whatever but anyway son seminaries huge been huge for me obviously carry new been huge for me obviously carry new been huge for me obviously carry new hops podcast he's a great Canadian hops podcast he's a great Canadian hops podcast he's a great Canadian leader I'm sure appreciated him and then leader I'm sure appreciated him and then leader I'm sure appreciated him and then the stuff the doors that she panned for the stuff the doors that she panned for the stuff the doors that she panned for me like like your podcast as well and me like like your podcast as well and me like like your podcast as well and there's another Canadian guy named Brady there's another Canadian guy named Brady there's another Canadian guy named Brady Shearer he has a ministry called pro Shearer he has a ministry called pro Shearer he has a ministry called pro church tools it's more of a bit I guess

church tools it's more of a bit I guess church tools it's more of a bit I guess but man what a huge resource he is for but man what a huge resource he is for but man what a huge resource he is for church leader a great new technology church leader a great new technology church leader a great new technology that he's got coming out or new software that he's got coming out or new software that he's got coming out or new software I should say this nucleus thing that I should say this nucleus thing that I should say this nucleus thing that I've been following along so there's I've been following along so there's I've been following along so there's just so much great stuff out there and just so much great stuff out there and just so much great stuff out there and I'm happy to contribute in some way in I'm happy to contribute in some way in I'm happy to contribute in some way in my own life but it inspires me when guys my own life but it inspires me when guys my own life but it inspires me when guys like you and guys like Carrington Hoff like you and guys like Carrington Hoff like you and guys like Carrington Hoff Brady shear Canadian guys that I respect Brady shear Canadian guys that I respect Brady shear Canadian guys that I respect a lot Andy Steiger out of apologetics a lot Andy Steiger out of apologetics a lot Andy Steiger out of apologetics Canada when they're doing this stuff I Canada when they're doing this stuff I Canada when they're doing this stuff I think man I could do this too you know think man I could do this too you know think man I could do this too you know like chillin wide open and the like chillin wide open and the like chillin wide open and the opportunities are all there for anybody opportunities are all there for anybody opportunities are all there for anybody that has some kind of ambition to do that has some kind of ambition to do that has some kind of ambition to do something so I love the resources that something so I love the resources that something so I love the resources that are coming out and ministries that God are coming out and ministries that God are coming out and ministries that God is using cool well we're going to have is using cool well we're going to have is using cool well we're going to have to jump to the last question which is in to jump to the last question which is in to jump to the last question which is in your personal life when you're just your personal life when you're just your personal life when you're just looking to have fun you want to kick looking to have fun you want to kick looking to have fun you want to kick back relax what what do you do for fun back relax what what do you do for fun back relax what what do you do for fun well I don't know I mean I told you I well I don't know I mean I told you I well I don't know I mean I told you I just had a newborn huh I sleep I tried just had a newborn huh I sleep I tried just had a newborn huh I sleep I tried to nap as much as I can agree with to nap as much as I can agree with to nap as much as I can agree with Warren a couple months ago and we're Warren a couple months ago and we're Warren a couple months ago and we're just finally getting to that stage where just finally getting to that stage where just finally getting to that stage where she's sleeping a little more I have a she's sleeping a little more I have a she's sleeping a little more I have a really gracious wife was happy to take really gracious wife was happy to take really gracious wife was happy to take her little bit more but I also have a her little bit more but I also have a her little bit more but I also have a toddler so you know when you have a toddler so you know when you have a toddler so you know when you have a second kid and the toddler comes along second kid and the toddler comes along second kid and the toddler comes along dad has to step up a little more can't dad has to step up a little more can't dad has to step up a little more can't just hand it hand the newborn to the mom just hand it hand the newborn to the mom just hand it hand the newborn to the mom anymore you have a toddler running anymore you have a toddler running anymore you have a toddler running around right I thought yeah I mean I around right I thought yeah I mean I around right I thought yeah I mean I play hockey too I love to play hockey I play hockey too I love to play hockey I play hockey too I love to play hockey I was a goalie for many years until I was was a goalie for many years until I was was a goalie for many years until I was about 20 and then God called me to about 20 and then God called me to about 20 and then God called me to ministry but I yeah I love to play ministry but I yeah I love to play ministry but I yeah I love to play pick-up hockey and then I work in the pick-up hockey and then I work in the pick-up hockey and then I work in the yard I just love yard work I think as a yard I just love yard work I think as a yard I just love yard work I think as a pastor yard work is like therapy for me pastor yard work is like therapy for me pastor yard work is like therapy for me because the grass does what you want

because the grass does what you want because the grass does what you want right yeah that's true put the seeds in right yeah that's true put the seeds in right yeah that's true put the seeds in you water it and it grows you know and you water it and it grows you know and you water it and it grows you know and though it's hard to do yard work as a as though it's hard to do yard work as a as though it's hard to do yard work as a as a Vancouver I don't know you maybe some a Vancouver I don't know you maybe some a Vancouver I don't know you maybe some people don't know what the weather's people don't know what the weather's people don't know what the weather's like in the yes in Vancouver I always like in the yes in Vancouver I always like in the yes in Vancouver I always say that it rained twice this year 28 say that it rained twice this year 28 say that it rained twice this year 28 days the first time in 34 days second days the first time in 34 days second days the first time in 34 days second time you had an honor rain so I was out time you had an honor rain so I was out time you had an honor rain so I was out in the yard yesterday thinking about you in the yard yesterday thinking about you in the yard yesterday thinking about you asking me this question I was like I asking me this question I was like I asking me this question I was like I love yard work this is like play for me love yard work this is like play for me love yard work this is like play for me so anyway that's good I'll boring it so anyway that's good I'll boring it so anyway that's good I'll boring it that for an answer but that's no no that for an answer but that's no no that for an answer but that's no no that's great that I wonderful no I'm that's great that I wonderful no I'm that's great that I wonderful no I'm it's funny because I my wife really it's funny because I my wife really it's funny because I my wife really loves yard work and so over the years loves yard work and so over the years loves yard work and so over the years I've been a reluctant helper to her but I've been a reluctant helper to her but I've been a reluctant helper to her but actually I was just saying with her to actually I was just saying with her to actually I was just saying with her to the spring that actually I think that's the spring that actually I think that's the spring that actually I think that's change actually I think I do enjoy it change actually I think I do enjoy it change actually I think I do enjoy it it's fun it is fun to see and it's I it's fun it is fun to see and it's I it's fun it is fun to see and it's I love painting and like wall painting love painting and like wall painting love painting and like wall painting like you know here's a wall called one like you know here's a wall called one like you know here's a wall called one cholera warning right and it's that same cholera warning right and it's that same cholera warning right and it's that same thing it's like I've always said to thing it's like I've always said to thing it's like I've always said to people I'm like I love it because it's people I'm like I love it because it's people I'm like I love it because it's like you start at the beginning of the like you start at the beginning of the like you start at the beginning of the day and then at the end of day you're day and then at the end of day you're day and then at the end of day you're done which not a lot of stuff in done which not a lot of stuff in done which not a lot of stuff in ministry has that feel to it so exactly ministry has that feel to it so exactly ministry has that feel to it so exactly and everything looks different right and everything looks different right and everything looks different right exactly so John if people want to get in exactly so John if people want to get in exactly so John if people want to get in touch with you how can they do that or touch with you how can they do that or touch with you how can they do that or you know check up with your books and you know check up with your books and you know check up with your books and all that what's the best way for them to all that what's the best way for them to all that what's the best way for them to plug in yeah I'm happy to contact plug in yeah I'm happy to contact plug in yeah I'm happy to contact anybody or connect with anybody I have a anybody or connect with anybody I have a anybody or connect with anybody I have a my own website that I talked to what's my own website that I talked to what's my own website that I talked to what's John Morrison CA it was a gift from my John Morrison CA it was a gift from my John Morrison CA it was a gift from my brother back in 2006 and it's continued brother back in 2006 and it's continued brother back in 2006 and it's continued on and then there's a contact area there on and then there's a contact area there on and then there's a contact area there you can just reach out to me that way you can just reach out to me that way you can just reach out to me that way and I'd be happy to answer any questions and I'd be happy to answer any questions and I'd be happy to answer any questions or you know take any advice or or you know take any advice or or you know take any advice or encouragement or anything so that's encouragement or anything so that's encouragement or anything so that's probably the best way to do it the probably the best way to do it the probably the best way to do it the easiest way and otherwise you know easiest way and otherwise you know easiest way and otherwise you know that's on Twitter I'm John Morrison

that's on Twitter I'm John Morrison that's on Twitter I'm John Morrison underscore and always looking to make a underscore and always looking to make a underscore and always looking to make a new Facebook friend so you can reach out new Facebook friend so you can reach out new Facebook friend so you can reach out to me that way too so very cool well to me that way too so very cool well to me that way too so very cool well thanks so much you appreciate you be on thanks so much you appreciate you be on thanks so much you appreciate you be on the show today the show today the show today thanks Rach it's a real pleasures and I thanks Rach it's a real pleasures and I thanks Rach it's a real pleasures and I like I said great to be on this side of like I said great to be on this side of like I said great to be on this side of the podcast how much to help in any way the podcast how much to help in any way the podcast how much to help in any way appreciate that Joe and have a great day appreciate that Joe and have a great day appreciate that Joe and have a great day thank you for tuning in to this week's thank you for tuning in to this week's thank you for tuning in to this week's unsung nari podcast don't be shy we'd unsung nari podcast don't be shy we'd unsung nari podcast don't be shy we'd love to connect check out on seminary love to connect check out on seminary love to connect check out on seminary inbox you can sign up at unsummon Ericom inbox you can sign up at unsummon Ericom inbox you can sign up at unsummon Ericom and we'll send you helpful training and we'll send you helpful training and we'll send you helpful training resources every week plus you'll gain resources every week plus you'll gain resources every week plus you'll gain immediate access to our exclusive immediate access to our exclusive immediate access to our exclusive members area with tons of resources you members area with tons of resources you members area with tons of resources you can use connect with rich on twitter at can use connect with rich on twitter at can use connect with rich on twitter at rich birch or through email rich at rich birch or through email rich at rich birch or through email rich at unsummon Ericom don't forget to check unsummon Ericom don't forget to check unsummon Ericom don't forget to check out the show notes for this episode a out the show notes for this episode a out the show notes for this episode a ton seminary comm it includes links to ton seminary comm it includes links to ton seminary comm it includes links to what we talked about today and more what we talked about today and more what we talked about today and more leave a comment we'd love to hear from leave a comment we'd love to hear from leave a comment we'd love to hear from you did you enjoy today's episode drop you did you enjoy today's episode drop you did you enjoy today's episode drop by iTunes and leave a review thanks by iTunes and leave a review thanks by iTunes and leave a review thanks again for tuning in to this week's again for tuning in to this week's again for tuning in to this week's unsung nary podcast join us next week unsung nary podcast join us next week unsung nary podcast join us next week when we'll learn more stuff we wish they when we'll learn more stuff we wish they when we'll learn more stuff we wish they taught in seminary