Shaun Nepstad on Plateaued to 10x Church Growth

as an Operations pastor I know how hard as an Operations pastor I know how hard it is to hire the right people I also it is to hire the right people I also it is to hire the right people I also know how hard it is to hire the right know how hard it is to hire the right know how hard it is to hire the right people in ministry that's why I'm people in ministry that's why I'm people in ministry that's why I'm thankful for my friends at the van der thankful for my friends at the van der thankful for my friends at the van der bloomin Search Group they are the bloomin Search Group they are the bloomin Search Group they are the leading search firm for churches and leading search firm for churches and leading search firm for churches and faith-based organizations van der faith-based organizations van der faith-based organizations van der bloomin prayerfully comes alongside your bloomin prayerfully comes alongside your bloomin prayerfully comes alongside your team to guide you through the search team to guide you through the search team to guide you through the search process and bring you great candidates process and bring you great candidates process and bring you great candidates that fit your church's unique needs that fit your church's unique needs that fit your church's unique needs visit Vander blue mancom for more visit Vander blue mancom for more visit Vander blue mancom for more information that's van der BL o e em e n information that's van der BL o e em e n information that's van der BL o e em e n com com com welcome to the uncie Maneri podcast are welcome to the uncie Maneri podcast are welcome to the uncie Maneri podcast are you looking for practical ministry help you looking for practical ministry help you looking for practical ministry help to drive their ministry further faster to drive their ministry further faster to drive their ministry further faster have a sinking feeling that your have a sinking feeling that your have a sinking feeling that your ministry training didn't prepare you for ministry training didn't prepare you for ministry training didn't prepare you for the real world the real world the real world hey you're not alone join thousands of hey you're not alone join thousands of hey you're not alone join thousands of others have pursued a stuff that we wish others have pursued a stuff that we wish others have pursued a stuff that we wish they had taught in seminary buckle up they had taught in seminary buckle up they had taught in seminary buckle up and let's get started with this week's and let's get started with this week's and let's get started with this week's on seminary podcast welcome to the on seminary podcast welcome to the on seminary podcast welcome to the podcast my name is rich birch so happy podcast my name is rich birch so happy podcast my name is rich birch so happy that you're with us today I'm honored that you're with us today I'm honored that you're with us today I'm honored that you would take some time out in that you would take some time out in that you would take some time out in your busy week we know you've got a lot your busy week we know you've got a lot your busy week we know you've got a lot going on as a church leader we're so going on as a church leader we're so going on as a church leader we're so happy that you would take some time happy that you would take some time happy that you would take some time today we got Sean Knepp stayed with us today we got Sean Knepp stayed with us today we got Sean Knepp stayed with us from fellowship church in Antioch from fellowship church in Antioch from fellowship church in Antioch California as Sean welcome to the show California as Sean welcome to the show California as Sean welcome to the show thanks so much for having me thanks so much for having me thanks so much for having me yeah thank you so much for being here yeah thank you so much for being here yeah thank you so much for being here you know I'm excited to hear more of the you know I'm excited to hear more of the you know I'm excited to hear more of the Fellowship Church story you know Church Fellowship Church story you know Church Fellowship Church story you know Church started in 2003 so what does that make started in 2003 so what does that make started in 2003 so what does that make you twelve thirteen years old and you you twelve thirteen years old and you you twelve thirteen years old and you know with 22 people and it's grown to know with 22 people and it's grown to know with 22 people and it's grown to you know to over 2100 which is you know to over 2100 which is you know to over 2100 which is incredible so I'd love to hear kind of incredible so I'd love to hear kind of incredible so I'd love to hear kind of give us the store that the the story give us the store that the the story give us the store that the the story well what got you into planting this well what got you into planting this well what got you into planting this church sure I'm truth generation pastor

church sure I'm truth generation pastor church sure I'm truth generation pastor on both sides of my family right I've on both sides of my family right I've on both sides of my family right I've always wanted to do this since I was a always wanted to do this since I was a always wanted to do this since I was a kid about 16 17 years old I really was kid about 16 17 years old I really was kid about 16 17 years old I really was asking God am I am i doing this because asking God am I am i doing this because asking God am I am i doing this because it's the family business God God really it's the family business God God really it's the family business God God really clarified some things that said no you clarified some things that said no you clarified some things that said no you have a legacy but there's also a unique have a legacy but there's also a unique have a legacy but there's also a unique calling on your lives so we served at calling on your lives so we served at calling on your lives so we served at some churches worship pastor and worship some churches worship pastor and worship some churches worship pastor and worship guy and youth and all that and finally guy and youth and all that and finally guy and youth and all that and finally my wife and I felt like we were supposed my wife and I felt like we were supposed my wife and I felt like we were supposed to come start a church in this region I to come start a church in this region I to come start a church in this region I was 24 years old we had been married for was 24 years old we had been married for was 24 years old we had been married for just a few years and we had four girls just a few years and we had four girls just a few years and we had four girls under the age of two Wow because they're under the age of two Wow because they're under the age of two Wow because they're such good planners that's what such good planners that's what such good planners that's what two year old a one-year-old and twins two year old a one-year-old and twins two year old a one-year-old and twins were zero and we started in an were zero and we started in an were zero and we started in an elementary cafetorium which nice it's elementary cafetorium which nice it's elementary cafetorium which nice it's not even really a word that's the not even really a word that's the not even really a word that's the category with the stage and rolled into category with the stage and rolled into category with the stage and rolled into that thing smell like tater tots and you that thing smell like tater tots and you that thing smell like tater tots and you know that box of yous lost-and-found know that box of yous lost-and-found know that box of yous lost-and-found clothes every capped ornaments we we clothes every capped ornaments we we clothes every capped ornaments we we started there with 22 people actually started there with 22 people actually started there with 22 people actually 2002 October 20th 2002 and and and guru 2002 October 20th 2002 and and and guru 2002 October 20th 2002 and and and guru - very quickly - about 300 people or so - very quickly - about 300 people or so - very quickly - about 300 people or so and about three months in we actually and about three months in we actually and about three months in we actually was in the hospital with ulcerative was in the hospital with ulcerative was in the hospital with ulcerative colitis it was a big scare losing blood colitis it was a big scare losing blood colitis it was a big scare losing blood yeah I was not ready man it was it was a yeah I was not ready man it was it was a yeah I was not ready man it was it was a big scare cuz I've been having pain big scare cuz I've been having pain big scare cuz I've been having pain since I was 13 years old cramps in the since I was 13 years old cramps in the since I was 13 years old cramps in the stomach it's nerves it's it's a stress

stomach it's nerves it's it's a stress stomach it's nerves it's it's a stress level did not manage all that long story level did not manage all that long story level did not manage all that long story short God healed me I haven't had a pain short God healed me I haven't had a pain short God healed me I haven't had a pain in 13 years thank God for that but we in 13 years thank God for that but we in 13 years thank God for that but we moved our our city had this this law moved our our city had this this law moved our our city had this this law that you had to move every year no that you had to move every year no that you had to move every year no useable churches man oh my goodness useable churches man oh my goodness useable churches man oh my goodness where we moved nine times in eight years where we moved nine times in eight years where we moved nine times in eight years Wow they basically they wouldn't let you Wow they basically they wouldn't let you Wow they basically they wouldn't let you use the property for longer than a year use the property for longer than a year use the property for longer than a year because they're trying to rotate people because they're trying to rotate people because they're trying to rotate people through right they want lots of through right they want lots of through right they want lots of different Christian anybody to dominate different Christian anybody to dominate different Christian anybody to dominate it it it yes when we got I understand that it was yes when we got I understand that it was yes when we got I understand that it was like man we thought about changing our like man we thought about changing our like man we thought about changing our name the church on the move name the church on the move name the church on the move yes yeah yes yeah yes yeah so we rotated around schools and we grew so we rotated around schools and we grew so we rotated around schools and we grew quickly to about 300 and then just Platt quickly to about 300 and then just Platt quickly to about 300 and then just Platt which you know for some people that's a which you know for some people that's a which you know for some people that's a lot of people for other people that's lot of people for other people that's lot of people for other people that's hardly any it was just where we were um hardly any it was just where we were um hardly any it was just where we were um but the problem was inside of me I felt but the problem was inside of me I felt but the problem was inside of me I felt like God had so much more for us to do like God had so much more for us to do like God had so much more for us to do in so many more people for us to reach in so many more people for us to reach in so many more people for us to reach like what do you do when the dream like what do you do when the dream like what do you do when the dream that's inside of you does not match the that's inside of you does not match the that's inside of you does not match the reality that's in front of you reality that's in front of you reality that's in front of you absolutely yeah what did you do at that absolutely yeah what did you do at that absolutely yeah what did you do at that moment moment moment where did you you know were you one where did you you know were you one where did you you know were you one service multiple serious what does that service multiple serious what does that service multiple serious what does that look like what was kind of the weekends look like what was kind of the weekends look like what was kind of the weekends like at that point of your church well like at that point of your church well like at that point of your church well at that point it was a one at that point it was a one at that point it was a one bangle to services I was I was leading bangle to services I was I was leading bangle to services I was I was leading worship I was taking in the offering I worship I was taking in the offering I worship I was taking in the offering I was doing the announcements I was was doing the announcements I was was doing the announcements I was preaching then we get it all over again preaching then we get it all over again preaching then we get it all over again yeah yeah yeah it was dumb like if you've ever seen a

it was dumb like if you've ever seen a it was dumb like if you've ever seen a one band in your local downtown area one band in your local downtown area one band in your local downtown area he's playing the guitar he's got the he's playing the guitar he's got the he's playing the guitar he's got the harmonic and the drums gone mm-hm it's harmonic and the drums gone mm-hm it's harmonic and the drums gone mm-hm it's impressive at first glance but the impressive at first glance but the impressive at first glance but the closer you look the more pitiful it is closer you look the more pitiful it is closer you look the more pitiful it is yes right you'd never have that guy lead yes right you'd never have that guy lead yes right you'd never have that guy lead worship on a Sunday right that's what I worship on a Sunday right that's what I worship on a Sunday right that's what I was doing okay nobody Archer my name my was doing okay nobody Archer my name my was doing okay nobody Archer my name my family and I'm fifth generation pastor family and I'm fifth generation pastor family and I'm fifth generation pastor like I said but nobody taught me how to like I said but nobody taught me how to like I said but nobody taught me how to build teams so I was trying to do it all build teams so I was trying to do it all build teams so I was trying to do it all myself and as a church I know you kind myself and as a church I know you kind myself and as a church I know you kind of do for a little bit but here's what I of do for a little bit but here's what I of do for a little bit but here's what I found you can't grow a church without found you can't grow a church without found you can't grow a church without releasing ministry right so we went on a releasing ministry right so we went on a releasing ministry right so we went on a mission man we started a prayer meeting mission man we started a prayer meeting mission man we started a prayer meeting you said how did the church change we you said how did the church change we you said how did the church change we started a weekly prayer gathering very started a weekly prayer gathering very started a weekly prayer gathering very cool and I wish I could say it was super cool and I wish I could say it was super cool and I wish I could say it was super organized and anointed and he was eight organized and anointed and he was eight organized and anointed and he was eight of us I was on the keyboard and we were of us I was on the keyboard and we were of us I was on the keyboard and we were fumbling through the presence of God but fumbling through the presence of God but fumbling through the presence of God but I just was banking on the fact that I just was banking on the fact that I just was banking on the fact that Jeremiah 33:3 says God says if you call Jeremiah 33:3 says God says if you call Jeremiah 33:3 says God says if you call me I'll answer you mmm I want to throw me I'll answer you mmm I want to throw me I'll answer you mmm I want to throw you out I'll ask you and I will show you you out I'll ask you and I will show you you out I'll ask you and I will show you great and marvelous things mmm great and marvelous things mmm great and marvelous things mmm so we just got together and started so we just got together and started so we just got together and started praying for the services um's found praying for the services um's found praying for the services um's found ourself praying for the community ourself praying for the community ourself praying for the community leaders and pretty soon God began to leaders and pretty soon God began to leaders and pretty soon God began to break our heart and and then he gave us break our heart and and then he gave us break our heart and and then he gave us strategy we came across the Ark and strategy we came across the Ark and strategy we came across the Ark and Association of related churches and then Association of related churches and then Association of related churches and then we came across some relationships that we came across some relationships that we came across some relationships that we started to build and the church began we started to build and the church began we started to build and the church began to grow and here's what I found I found to grow and here's what I found I found to grow and here's what I found I found in my personal pain pastors are in one in my personal pain pastors are in one in my personal pain pastors are in one of three categories number one bear in a of three categories number one bear in a of three categories number one bear in a survival mode mm-hmm survival mode is

survival mode mm-hmm survival mode is survival mode mm-hmm survival mode is like Psalm 69 Psalm 73 type stuff yes like Psalm 69 Psalm 73 type stuff yes like Psalm 69 Psalm 73 type stuff yes water's up to play what I'm about to water's up to play what I'm about to water's up to play what I'm about to drown yeah that's where we were nobody drown yeah that's where we were nobody drown yeah that's where we were nobody can nobody can focus on vision when can nobody can focus on vision when can nobody can focus on vision when you're in survival mode right you're you're in survival mode right you're you're in survival mode right you're just trying to survive right just get just trying to survive right just get just trying to survive right just get through next weekend yeah and then through next weekend yeah and then through next weekend yeah and then there's a sustaining mode which is not there's a sustaining mode which is not there's a sustaining mode which is not much better it's just like you're just much better it's just like you're just much better it's just like you're just trying to keep all the plates spinning trying to keep all the plates spinning trying to keep all the plates spinning and make sure everybody's happy but and make sure everybody's happy but and make sure everybody's happy but again you know you don't have much time again you know you don't have much time again you know you don't have much time to focus on vision to focus on vision to focus on vision and then number three is surge mode and and then number three is surge mode and and then number three is surge mode and that's where you are the growth mode that's where you are the growth mode that's where you are the growth mode where you began to see traction mmm what where you began to see traction mmm what where you began to see traction mmm what a lot of people don't realize is that a lot of people don't realize is that a lot of people don't realize is that we've been going for 13 years and when we've been going for 13 years and when we've been going for 13 years and when we it we year through 2006 mm-hm we it we year through 2006 mm-hm we it we year through 2006 mm-hm three years and we just plateaued at 300 three years and we just plateaued at 300 three years and we just plateaued at 300 people could not break that right we're people could not break that right we're people could not break that right we're bouncing around and it was so bouncing around and it was so bouncing around and it was so frustrating uh I began to pray this frustrating uh I began to pray this frustrating uh I began to pray this prayer that a lot of pastors pray Lord prayer that a lot of pastors pray Lord prayer that a lot of pastors pray Lord who should I bring in to take this who should I bring in to take this who should I bring in to take this church to where it needs to go church to where it needs to go church to where it needs to go cuz I'm here me I've hit my wow that's cuz I'm here me I've hit my wow that's cuz I'm here me I've hit my wow that's humbling as a tricia planner humbling as a tricia planner humbling as a tricia planner that's very humbling to be at that point that's very humbling to be at that point that's very humbling to be at that point yeah because you know a lot of church yeah because you know a lot of church yeah because you know a lot of church planners are chomping at the bit at the planners are chomping at the bit at the planners are chomping at the bit at the beginning right we're all like let me beginning right we're all like let me beginning right we're all like let me add a yeah yeah so we begin to to go on add a yeah yeah so we begin to to go on add a yeah yeah so we begin to to go on a mission tonight I was I was said like

a mission tonight I was I was said like a mission tonight I was I was said like I'm so tired of being the one-man band I'm so tired of being the one-man band I'm so tired of being the one-man band but Lord who do I need to bring in to but Lord who do I need to bring in to but Lord who do I need to bring in to take this church to where I needs to go take this church to where I needs to go take this church to where I needs to go because apparently I've hit my lid right because apparently I've hit my lid right because apparently I've hit my lid right and I actually begin to accept that and and I actually begin to accept that and and I actually begin to accept that and be okay with that like maybe my job is be okay with that like maybe my job is be okay with that like maybe my job is just to - maybe I'll just go ahead and just to - maybe I'll just go ahead and just to - maybe I'll just go ahead and and plant churches around go do nuts and plant churches around go do nuts and plant churches around go do nuts state or the world 300 yeah Rome - 300 - state or the world 300 yeah Rome - 300 - state or the world 300 yeah Rome - 300 - pass them over mm-hmm but it was that pass them over mm-hmm but it was that pass them over mm-hmm but it was that prayer meeting that saved our life man prayer meeting that saved our life man prayer meeting that saved our life man mm-hmm and then beginning to to see how mm-hmm and then beginning to to see how mm-hmm and then beginning to to see how to build cool and there's a phrase that to build cool and there's a phrase that to build cool and there's a phrase that we've we say a lot around here we've we say a lot around here we've we say a lot around here it's this it's not about getting a job it's this it's not about getting a job it's this it's not about getting a job done it's about getting the people done done it's about getting the people done done it's about getting the people done mmm is that first of all but it's not mmm is that first of all but it's not mmm is that first of all but it's not about getting a job about getting a job about getting a job it's like and the people done mmm so it's like and the people done mmm so it's like and the people done mmm so true and to say it's not my goal is not true and to say it's not my goal is not true and to say it's not my goal is not to just get the chairs set up straight I to just get the chairs set up straight I to just get the chairs set up straight I want to pass with the people that are want to pass with the people that are want to pass with the people that are here and and find their gifts and set here and and find their gifts and set here and and find their gifts and set them loose in that mm-hmm them loose in that mm-hmm them loose in that mm-hmm here's what the most connected people in here's what the most connected people in here's what the most connected people in church yep are those who are serving and church yep are those who are serving and church yep are those who are serving and on in small groups absolutely yeah into on in small groups absolutely yeah into on in small groups absolutely yeah into them yeah absolutely them yeah absolutely them yeah absolutely you'd all argue that's the truth but the you'd all argue that's the truth but the you'd all argue that's the truth but the question therein lies how do I get more question therein lies how do I get more question therein lies how do I get more people serving and its waters mm-hmm so people serving and its waters mm-hmm so people serving and its waters mm-hmm so we're on a mission with our growth we're on a mission with our growth we're on a mission with our growth I adopted from you know Church of the I adopted from you know Church of the I adopted from you know Church of the Highlands and which a lot are doing now Highlands and which a lot are doing now Highlands and which a lot are doing now which i think is great we started doing which i think is great we started doing which i think is great we started doing that and just figuring out okay we need that and just figuring out okay we need that and just figuring out okay we need a process by which people can come and a process by which people can come and a process by which people can come and get involved mm-hmm cuz I'm very early get involved mm-hmm cuz I'm very early get involved mm-hmm cuz I'm very early on like a couple years into the church on like a couple years into the church on like a couple years into the church mm-hmm there was a couple families that

mm-hmm there was a couple families that mm-hmm there was a couple families that would say Shawn I love the church love would say Shawn I love the church love would say Shawn I love the church love the preaching I love the worship but to the preaching I love the worship but to the preaching I love the worship but to me the church is a little cliquish I was me the church is a little cliquish I was me the church is a little cliquish I was like oh your mom's Church like that like oh your mom's Church like that like oh your mom's Church like that right yes Lord told me I felt the Lord right yes Lord told me I felt the Lord right yes Lord told me I felt the Lord say Shawn remember that time I said yes say Shawn remember that time I said yes say Shawn remember that time I said yes he said it's not so much that the church he said it's not so much that the church he said it's not so much that the church was cliquish but if I come to any church was cliquish but if I come to any church was cliquish but if I come to any church and there's not a clear pathway by which and there's not a clear pathway by which and there's not a clear pathway by which I know as a first-time guest how to get I know as a first-time guest how to get I know as a first-time guest how to get involved involved involved I can leave saying I love the preaching I can leave saying I love the preaching I can leave saying I love the preaching I love the worship but to me they were I love the worship but to me they were I love the worship but to me they were cliquish even though you're not we just cliquish even though you're not we just cliquish even though you're not we just have done a good job of letting them have done a good job of letting them have done a good job of letting them know what the next step is absolutely know what the next step is absolutely know what the next step is absolutely and you want to make it you know obvious and you want to make it you know obvious and you want to make it you know obvious and simple right what is this next step and simple right what is this next step and simple right what is this next step it needs to be super obvious it can't it it needs to be super obvious it can't it it needs to be super obvious it can't it can't be you know people I've got a lot can't be you know people I've got a lot can't be you know people I've got a lot going on in their heads it needs to be going on in their heads it needs to be going on in their heads it needs to be clear well what did you do how did you clear well what did you do how did you clear well what did you do how did you kind of make that simple and obvious kind of make that simple and obvious kind of make that simple and obvious make those next steps clear for people make those next steps clear for people make those next steps clear for people so they didn't they weren't wondering so they didn't they weren't wondering so they didn't they weren't wondering you know what is my next step after I'm you know what is my next step after I'm you know what is my next step after I'm here on a Sunday sure I don't know if here on a Sunday sure I don't know if here on a Sunday sure I don't know if you know this or not but when I was 21 you know this or not but when I was 21 you know this or not but when I was 21 years old I bought Krispy Kreme stock years old I bought Krispy Kreme stock years old I bought Krispy Kreme stock nice nobody told me to buy Krispy Kreme nice nobody told me to buy Krispy Kreme nice nobody told me to buy Krispy Kreme stock I just bought it I was like if stock I just bought it I was like if stock I just bought it I was like if they're if they ever go public on buying they're if they ever go public on buying they're if they ever go public on buying stock yes stock yes stock yes they're amazing gonna put my mouth on they're amazing gonna put my mouth on they're amazing gonna put my mouth on the glaze yes so I brought stock to you the glaze yes so I brought stock to you the glaze yes so I brought stock to you a few thousand out through a few a few thousand out through a few a few thousand out through a few thousand dollars at it it went up split thousand dollars at it it went up split thousand dollars at it it went up split one time split a second time split a one time split a second time split a one time split a second time split a third time I mean I made some money sold third time I mean I made some money sold third time I mean I made some money sold it but while I had the stock I was on my it but while I had the stock I was on my it but while I had the stock I was on my laptop every morning mmm is it growing laptop every morning mmm is it growing laptop every morning mmm is it growing is it growing is it growing a brain for

is it growing is it growing a brain for is it growing is it growing a brain for Krispy Kreme stock yeah yeah I want Krispy Kreme stock yeah yeah I want Krispy Kreme stock yeah yeah I want everybody Krispy Kreme yep I've been everybody Krispy Kreme yep I've been everybody Krispy Kreme yep I've been staff meetings pretending I'm paying staff meetings pretending I'm paying staff meetings pretending I'm paying attention to the staff meetings but attention to the staff meetings but attention to the staff meetings but really I'm checking this talking first really I'm checking this talking first really I'm checking this talking first because yes I don't have a large because yes I don't have a large because yes I don't have a large portfolio I had one port one stock in my portfolio I had one port one stock in my portfolio I had one port one stock in my belly belly belly and I'll tell you this once I sold it I and I'll tell you this once I sold it I and I'll tell you this once I sold it I never checked the stock mmm never checked the stock mmm never checked the stock mmm cuz I don't care if it grows or not cuz I don't care if it grows or not cuz I don't care if it grows or not right to be a bonus my wife and our right to be a bonus my wife and our right to be a bonus my wife and our daughters who are now teenagers will go daughters who are now teenagers will go daughters who are now teenagers will go to Krispy Kreme occasionally we'll enjoy to Krispy Kreme occasionally we'll enjoy to Krispy Kreme occasionally we'll enjoy it while we're there we'll get a dozen it while we're there we'll get a dozen it while we're there we'll get a dozen donuts we'll hang out while we eat but donuts we'll hang out while we eat but donuts we'll hang out while we eat but at the end of the day I can care less at the end of the day I can care less at the end of the day I can care less whether it grows or not right I feel whether it grows or not right I feel whether it grows or not right I feel like if there's a lot of people that like if there's a lot of people that like if there's a lot of people that attend churches that way they'll come attend churches that way they'll come attend churches that way they'll come and they'll enjoy the worship their kids and they'll enjoy the worship their kids and they'll enjoy the worship their kids will get a coloring page and it's not will get a coloring page and it's not will get a coloring page and it's not that they hate it while they're there that they hate it while they're there that they hate it while they're there they like it with while they're there they like it with while they're there they like it with while they're there right but they're just not vested right right but they're just not vested right right but they're just not vested right and if they're not invested in the and if they're not invested in the and if they're not invested in the church by serving somewhere they don't church by serving somewhere they don't church by serving somewhere they don't care if your church grows or not don't care if your church grows or not don't care if your church grows or not don't come once a month but they're not come once a month but they're not come once a month but they're not plugged in they're not serving so what plugged in they're not serving so what plugged in they're not serving so what we did is we we went on a mission to we did is we we went on a mission to we did is we we went on a mission to find people's passions because he find people's passions because he find people's passions because he fishin's 2:10 is very clear where God's fishin's 2:10 is very clear where God's fishin's 2:10 is very clear where God's workmanship created in Christ Jesus to workmanship created in Christ Jesus to workmanship created in Christ Jesus to do good works which God prepared in do good works which God prepared in do good works which God prepared in advance for you to do mm-hmm that means advance for you to do mm-hmm that means advance for you to do mm-hmm that means that there was never a time where God that there was never a time where God that there was never a time where God was like what are you gonna do with him was like what are you gonna do with him was like what are you gonna do with him right you gotta come quick we gotta find right you gotta come quick we gotta find right you gotta come quick we gotta find something for her to do yeah don't something for her to do yeah don't something for her to do yeah don't expect her she's a to see baby yeah yes expect her she's a to see baby yeah yes expect her she's a to see baby yeah yes so if if you want to find out what so if if you want to find out what so if if you want to find out what you're supposed to be doing just look at

you're supposed to be doing just look at you're supposed to be doing just look at you like your gifts your talents will you like your gifts your talents will you like your gifts your talents will reveal your calling and destiny so this reveal your calling and destiny so this reveal your calling and destiny so this growth track which by the way we do growth track which by the way we do growth track which by the way we do every month mm-hmm ever the first Sunday every month mm-hmm ever the first Sunday every month mm-hmm ever the first Sunday of the month is step 1 of the month is step 1 of the month is step 1 yep so I can study the month step 2 it yep so I can study the month step 2 it yep so I can study the month step 2 it doesn't matter if it's Easter Father's doesn't matter if it's Easter Father's doesn't matter if it's Easter Father's Day any of that stuff we and I don't Day any of that stuff we and I don't Day any of that stuff we and I don't care how many people are in it right yes care how many people are in it right yes care how many people are in it right yes we started at first and it was like you we started at first and it was like you we started at first and it was like you know 20 people than 15 and 25 and five know 20 people than 15 and 25 and five know 20 people than 15 and 25 and five and two one time a couple times one and two one time a couple times one and two one time a couple times one person show it up or nobody showed and person show it up or nobody showed and person show it up or nobody showed and right and our staff was like oh man what right and our staff was like oh man what right and our staff was like oh man what a waste of time and I said no don't you a waste of time and I said no don't you a waste of time and I said no don't you ever say all right exactly ever say all right exactly ever say all right exactly but on the calendar and when's the next but on the calendar and when's the next but on the calendar and when's the next time I can spend an hour with this time I can spend an hour with this time I can spend an hour with this person right if I could spend an hour person right if I could spend an hour person right if I could spend an hour with one person I could sell our church with one person I could sell our church with one person I could sell our church mm-hmm mm-hmm mm-hmm so we started doing that and every week so we started doing that and every week so we started doing that and every week man we started to build our dream thing man we started to build our dream thing man we started to build our dream thing what we call our dream team mmm we don't what we call our dream team mmm we don't what we call our dream team mmm we don't use volunteers we call them dream use volunteers we call them dream use volunteers we call them dream teamers mm-hmm will two months tied if teamers mm-hmm will two months tied if teamers mm-hmm will two months tied if you volunteer I'm sorry that's great just because I'm sorry that's great just because there's a need and I'll tell you what there's a need and I'll tell you what there's a need and I'll tell you what man from that moment of us discovering man from that moment of us discovering man from that moment of us discovering people's passions and setting them loose people's passions and setting them loose people's passions and setting them loose in their gifts 2010 our church was 300 in their gifts 2010 our church was 300 in their gifts 2010 our church was 300 people 2011 a grid of 500 people Wow people 2011 a grid of 500 people Wow people 2011 a grid of 500 people Wow 2012 it grew to 800 2013 1100 the next 2012 it grew to 800 2013 1100 the next 2012 it grew to 800 2013 1100 the next year 1600 last year 2100 now last Sunday

year 1600 last year 2100 now last Sunday year 1600 last year 2100 now last Sunday we had 3600 people that's amazing Church we had 3600 people that's amazing Church we had 3600 people that's amazing Church in our brand new building 43,000 square in our brand new building 43,000 square in our brand new building 43,000 square feet that's amazing Allisyn seats so we feet that's amazing Allisyn seats so we feet that's amazing Allisyn seats so we we we grew to 2,000 people we we grew to 2,000 people we we grew to 2,000 people mm-hmm with only three full-time staff mm-hmm with only three full-time staff mm-hmm with only three full-time staff wow that's amazing wow that's amazing wow that's amazing and it's because we had one in two and it's because we had one in two and it's because we had one in two people serving at our church right and people serving at our church right and people serving at our church right and you know a lot of people one guy was you know a lot of people one guy was you know a lot of people one guy was talking at a round table and one guy talking at a round table and one guy talking at a round table and one guy raised his hands like man I can't grow raised his hands like man I can't grow raised his hands like man I can't grow our church because we only have 200 our church because we only have 200 our church because we only have 200 people and I can't afford to hire staff people and I can't afford to hire staff people and I can't afford to hire staff and they're like Shawn yeah that's my and they're like Shawn yeah that's my and they're like Shawn yeah that's my thought I thought really what is this thought I thought really what is this thought I thought really what is this it's maybe it's not the best way to do it's maybe it's not the best way to do it's maybe it's not the best way to do it but don't let don't let that be an it but don't let don't let that be an it but don't let don't let that be an excuse not to grow mmm find people's excuse not to grow mmm find people's excuse not to grow mmm find people's passions sit down with them discover passions sit down with them discover passions sit down with them discover their gifts and then not just because their gifts and then not just because their gifts and then not just because they tell you you they have a gift they tell you you they have a gift they tell you you they have a gift mm-hmm it's kind of like you know the mm-hmm it's kind of like you know the mm-hmm it's kind of like you know the american idol singer who who can't sing american idol singer who who can't sing american idol singer who who can't sing work for anything and then gets mad at work for anything and then gets mad at work for anything and then gets mad at simon cowell for telling the truth simon cowell for telling the truth simon cowell for telling the truth that's like well friends say I could that's like well friends say I could that's like well friends say I could sing and all of us at home are like your sing and all of us at home are like your sing and all of us at home are like your friends don't love you yeah exactly friends don't love you yeah exactly friends don't love you yeah exactly they're not being clear yeah but your they're not being clear yeah but your they're not being clear yeah but your gifts make room for you and your gifts gifts make room for you and your gifts gifts make room for you and your gifts would be recognized and so you kind of would be recognized and so you kind of would be recognized and so you kind of that's where pastoring comes and I love that's where pastoring comes and I love that's where pastoring comes and I love you know the name of your your your you know the name of your your your you know the name of your your your movement on so many rights and movement on so many rights and movement on so many rights and everything that you wish they would have everything that you wish they would have everything that you wish they would have taught you but cuz nobody teaches you taught you but cuz nobody teaches you taught you but cuz nobody teaches you how to build teams no expert you know

how to build teams no expert you know how to build teams no expert you know tell us and that's our that's our tell us and that's our that's our tell us and that's our that's our primary role we fusions for it's not primary role we fusions for it's not primary role we fusions for it's not ministry right we're not I'm not even a ministry right we're not I'm not even a ministry right we're not I'm not even a minister really um I'm I'm just a minister really um I'm I'm just a minister really um I'm I'm just a facilitator right pastor eat your facilitator right pastor eat your facilitator right pastor eat your prophet evangelist you know we our role prophet evangelist you know we our role prophet evangelist you know we our role is is is prepare God's people for the works of prepare God's people for the works of prepare God's people for the works of ministry mmm so good if that's true we ministry mmm so good if that's true we ministry mmm so good if that's true we need a a very clear system mm-hmm by need a a very clear system mm-hmm by need a a very clear system mm-hmm by which we can let people know the very which we can let people know the very which we can let people know the very next step yeah I don't want people to next step yeah I don't want people to next step yeah I don't want people to miss that you know there are I know miss that you know there are I know miss that you know there are I know there's church planners and folks that there's church planners and folks that there's church planners and folks that are leading out in their church and they are leading out in their church and they are leading out in their church and they sense similar to where you were in 2009 sense similar to where you were in 2009 sense similar to where you were in 2009 2000 cents 2010 sense a you know I think 2000 cents 2010 sense a you know I think 2000 cents 2010 sense a you know I think the Lord is calling us to do something the Lord is calling us to do something the Lord is calling us to do something more I think get inside the head there more I think get inside the head there more I think get inside the head there of a leader because I think there are a of a leader because I think there are a of a leader because I think there are a lot of leaders who don't they there's lot of leaders who don't they there's lot of leaders who don't they there's somewhere between don't wanna relinquish somewhere between don't wanna relinquish somewhere between don't wanna relinquish ministry and then have a fear about ministry and then have a fear about ministry and then have a fear about doing that they they there's this doing that they they there's this doing that they they there's this internal like I just want to hold on to internal like I just want to hold on to internal like I just want to hold on to it all speak to that leader who's it all speak to that leader who's it all speak to that leader who's thinking that way today it's a great thinking that way today it's a great thinking that way today it's a great great statement because you are where great statement because you are where great statement because you are where you are because you're a great leader mm you are because you're a great leader mm you are because you're a great leader mm and the reason we don't want to release and the reason we don't want to release and the reason we don't want to release the reins is because we know we can the reins is because we know we can the reins is because we know we can probably do it better than most people probably do it better than most people probably do it better than most people in the church the only problem is that's in the church the only problem is that's in the church the only problem is that's not what you're called to do and we have not what you're called to do and we have not what you're called to do and we have another saying around here and that's another saying around here and that's another saying around here and that's it's this assume the best in people and it's this assume the best in people and it's this assume the best in people and let them prove you wrong mmm that's good let them prove you wrong mmm that's good let them prove you wrong mmm that's good we we walk around with like the gift of we we walk around with like the gift of we we walk around with like the gift of suspicion and nobody's gonna nobody's suspicion and nobody's gonna nobody's suspicion and nobody's gonna nobody's qualified now right listen there was qualified now right listen there was qualified now right listen there was this there was a time where you weren't this there was a time where you weren't this there was a time where you weren't good enough you know many of us are

good enough you know many of us are good enough you know many of us are still we're still not good enough or still we're still not good enough or still we're still not good enough or qualified enough but somebody took a qualified enough but somebody took a qualified enough but somebody took a risk on us and I would say there are risk on us and I would say there are risk on us and I would say there are gonna be some people that burn you but gonna be some people that burn you but gonna be some people that burn you but it's worth the risk right I mean we have it's worth the risk right I mean we have it's worth the risk right I mean we have over a thousand people on our dream team over a thousand people on our dream team over a thousand people on our dream team we just shot up by another thousand with we just shot up by another thousand with we just shot up by another thousand with this new building but before that you this new building but before that you this new building but before that you know two weeks ago we were one person in know two weeks ago we were one person in know two weeks ago we were one person in in to we're serving at the church you in to we're serving at the church you in to we're serving at the church you know what that does to the person they know what that does to the person they know what that does to the person they come alive yeah absolutely come alive yeah absolutely come alive yeah absolutely yeah I'm not trying to build the Church yeah I'm not trying to build the Church yeah I'm not trying to build the Church of attenders I'm trying to build a of attenders I'm trying to build a of attenders I'm trying to build a church that of people that are that are church that of people that are that are church that of people that are that are serving and their passions are there in serving and their passions are there in serving and their passions are there in small groups in relationship mmm that to small groups in relationship mmm that to small groups in relationship mmm that to me represents success not because we me represents success not because we me represents success not because we have a crowd on a Sunday so you've got have a crowd on a Sunday so you've got have a crowd on a Sunday so you've got to be willing to release ministry mm-hmm to be willing to release ministry mm-hmm to be willing to release ministry mm-hmm you cannot grow church without releasing you cannot grow church without releasing you cannot grow church without releasing it because they don't take ownership and it because they don't take ownership and it because they don't take ownership and the guy that's holding the front door the guy that's holding the front door the guy that's holding the front door he's going to invite all his friends to he's going to invite all his friends to he's going to invite all his friends to church church church cuz he wants this place to grow yes yes cuz he wants this place to grow yes yes cuz he wants this place to grow yes yes very true oh that's that's a good word very true oh that's that's a good word very true oh that's that's a good word Shawn I really appreciate that you know Shawn I really appreciate that you know Shawn I really appreciate that you know I there are a lot of leaders who are you I there are a lot of leaders who are you I there are a lot of leaders who are you know they may stumble with this the know they may stumble with this the know they may stumble with this the other piece I want to pull out in that I other piece I want to pull out in that I other piece I want to pull out in that I don't know people to miss is your don't know people to miss is your don't know people to miss is your commitment to staying on top of the commitment to staying on top of the commitment to staying on top of the growth track I think there are people growth track I think there are people growth track I think there are people that try similar things right they try that try similar things right they try that try similar things right they try but they say like we're gonna do it once but they say like we're gonna do it once but they say like we're gonna do it once um once every six months or they like we um once every six months or they like we um once every six months or they like we do that every fall do that every fall do that every fall how how much you know do you think kind how how much you know do you think kind how how much you know do you think kind of staying on top of it and not you know of staying on top of it and not you know of staying on top of it and not you know just keeping on top of that treadmill just keeping on top of that treadmill just keeping on top of that treadmill has helped you you know integrate people

has helped you you know integrate people has helped you you know integrate people you know see people take steps in their you know see people take steps in their you know see people take steps in their you know relationship with Jesus it's a you know relationship with Jesus it's a you know relationship with Jesus it's a great question again because we hate great question again because we hate great question again because we hate preaching to empty seats we start preaching to empty seats we start preaching to empty seats we start feeling like if a growth truck has ten feeling like if a growth truck has ten feeling like if a growth truck has ten people it's a failure ah people it's a failure ah people it's a failure ah when's the next time you you you're when's the next time you you you're when's the next time you you you're gonna be able to sit down with these 10 gonna be able to sit down with these 10 gonna be able to sit down with these 10 people and plug them in right like Jesus people and plug them in right like Jesus people and plug them in right like Jesus had 12 people was that a failure none of had 12 people was that a failure none of had 12 people was that a failure none of us would say that's a failure right I us would say that's a failure right I us would say that's a failure right I think personally it needs to be on the think personally it needs to be on the think personally it needs to be on the schedule and happen every month because schedule and happen every month because schedule and happen every month because some of the churches we talked to her some of the churches we talked to her some of the churches we talked to her like hey when's your membership plans like hey when's your membership plans like hey when's your membership plans how about every six months mm-hmm so how about every six months mm-hmm so how about every six months mm-hmm so that means that if I come to your church that means that if I come to your church that means that if I come to your church and I miss that it's a year before I and I miss that it's a year before I and I miss that it's a year before I could join the church so true yep no could join the church so true yep no could join the church so true yep no some people say well we just kind of some people say well we just kind of some people say well we just kind of look around and whenever we think that look around and whenever we think that look around and whenever we think that we have enough people were like every we we have enough people were like every we we have enough people were like every we should do a class not good good luck should do a class not good good luck should do a class not good good luck with me trying to you know stay for that with me trying to you know stay for that with me trying to you know stay for that right here's my phone you walk into any right here's my phone you walk into any right here's my phone you walk into any and think about the the last commercial and think about the the last commercial and think about the the last commercial building you walked into imagine if building you walked into imagine if building you walked into imagine if there was no front door here's what there was no front door here's what there was no front door here's what Windows everybody looking through like Windows everybody looking through like Windows everybody looking through like Han where how do we get in here there Han where how do we get in here there Han where how do we get in here there was a back door but they didn't tell you was a back door but they didn't tell you was a back door but they didn't tell you about it right about it right about it right good luck we're trying to have people good luck we're trying to have people good luck we're trying to have people stay there yes most people would leave a stay there yes most people would leave a stay there yes most people would leave a few might wander around and find the few might wander around and find the few might wander around and find the back door but very very few yes we all back door but very very few yes we all back door but very very few yes we all walk through the front door because it's walk through the front door because it's walk through the front door because it's clearly marked there's a sign clearly marked there's a sign clearly marked there's a sign there's people reading you and you walk there's people reading you and you walk there's people reading you and you walk in mm-hmm I feel like that's how a lot in mm-hmm I feel like that's how a lot in mm-hmm I feel like that's how a lot of churches are right Lana just don't

of churches are right Lana just don't of churches are right Lana just don't have a front door they can't wait it's have a front door they can't wait it's have a front door they can't wait it's like we got a back door somewhere around like we got a back door somewhere around like we got a back door somewhere around here yes yeah if you stick around for here yes yeah if you stick around for here yes yeah if you stick around for six months to a year we might let you in six months to a year we might let you in six months to a year we might let you in but the chances of that happening are so but the chances of that happening are so but the chances of that happening are so slim yeah absolutely you want the fish slim yeah absolutely you want the fish slim yeah absolutely you want the fish to be clean before we catch them and to be clean before we catch them and to be clean before we catch them and it's just not how it happens right it's just not how it happens right it's just not how it happens right absolutely kind of get mysteries messy absolutely kind of get mysteries messy absolutely kind of get mysteries messy man yep so you gotta have way that the man yep so you gotta have way that the man yep so you gotta have way that the the door is clearly marked and so we say the door is clearly marked and so we say the door is clearly marked and so we say at the end of every sermon and every at the end of every sermon and every at the end of every sermon and every service every week is hey let's clap our service every week is hey let's clap our service every week is hey let's clap our hands for those that made a decision to hands for those that made a decision to hands for those that made a decision to follow Christ today take an action card follow Christ today take an action card follow Christ today take an action card out check the box of corresponds with out check the box of corresponds with out check the box of corresponds with the decision you made give my life to the decision you made give my life to the decision you made give my life to Christ I'm renewing my life to Christ Christ I'm renewing my life to Christ Christ I'm renewing my life to Christ here are four steps you need to take here are four steps you need to take here are four steps you need to take number one right join a church your next number one right join a church your next number one right join a church your next opportunity is the first Sunday of next opportunity is the first Sunday of next opportunity is the first Sunday of next month right go for oath track discover month right go for oath track discover month right go for oath track discover your gifts and what makes you unique and your gifts and what makes you unique and your gifts and what makes you unique and then we're gonna put you on a team so then we're gonna put you on a team so then we're gonna put you on a team so that you can come alive because you that you can come alive because you that you can come alive because you can't fulfill purpose alone get on our can't fulfill purpose alone get on our can't fulfill purpose alone get on our dream team mm-hmm and then get in a dream team mm-hmm and then get in a dream team mm-hmm and then get in a small group because you know nobody small group because you know nobody small group because you know nobody should do life alone get water baptized should do life alone get water baptized should do life alone get water baptized mm-hmm we we tell them this every week mm-hmm we we tell them this every week mm-hmm we we tell them this every week right so they're not guessing no matter right so they're not guessing no matter right so they're not guessing no matter where they are where they are where they are everybody knows the next step absolutely everybody knows the next step absolutely everybody knows the next step absolutely very cool well Sean this has been a very cool well Sean this has been a very cool well Sean this has been a great great interview today I've really great great interview today I've really great great interview today I've really enjoyed jumping in you know chatting enjoyed jumping in you know chatting enjoyed jumping in you know chatting with you a little bit if people want to with you a little bit if people want to with you a little bit if people want to use anything else you want to say and use anything else you want to say and use anything else you want to say and then if people want to get in touch with then if people want to get in touch with then if people want to get in touch with you or Fellowship Church how can they do you or Fellowship Church how can they do you or Fellowship Church how can they do that yeah you could just email our that yeah you could just email our that yeah you could just email our website as the Fellowship Church calm website as the Fellowship Church calm website as the Fellowship Church calm and you can email us at info at the and you can email us at info at the and you can email us at info at the Fellowship Church calm and I'm just

Fellowship Church calm and I'm just Fellowship Church calm and I'm just gonna make a notation you know from this gonna make a notation you know from this gonna make a notation you know from this interview but anything we can do to help interview but anything we can do to help interview but anything we can do to help man my heart my heart just really is for man my heart my heart just really is for man my heart my heart just really is for churches that feels stuck because we churches that feels stuck because we churches that feels stuck because we were there and with all the temptation were there and with all the temptation were there and with all the temptation to want to quit it I just wanna let you to want to quit it I just wanna let you to want to quit it I just wanna let you know that your best days are still ahead know that your best days are still ahead know that your best days are still ahead of you it may not look like it but this of you it may not look like it but this of you it may not look like it but this is where faith comes in so man if is where faith comes in so man if is where faith comes in so man if there's anything we could do to help let there's anything we could do to help let there's anything we could do to help let us know very cool Sean thanks so much us know very cool Sean thanks so much us know very cool Sean thanks so much for being on the show today thanks so for being on the show today thanks so for being on the show today thanks so much thank you for tuning in to this much thank you for tuning in to this much thank you for tuning in to this week's unsung re podcast don't be shy week's unsung re podcast don't be shy week's unsung re podcast don't be shy we'd love to connect check out uncie we'd love to connect check out uncie we'd love to connect check out uncie Maneri inbox you can sign up at unsummon Maneri inbox you can sign up at unsummon Maneri inbox you can sign up at unsummon re comm and we'll send you helpful re comm and we'll send you helpful re comm and we'll send you helpful training resources every week plus training resources every week plus training resources every week plus you'll gain immediate access to our you'll gain immediate access to our you'll gain immediate access to our exclusive exclusive exclusive members area with tons of resources you members area with tons of resources you members area with tons of resources you can use connect with rich on Twitter can use connect with rich on Twitter can use connect with rich on Twitter and rich birch or through email rich at and rich birch or through email rich at and rich birch or through email rich at uncie Maneri calm don't forget to check uncie Maneri calm don't forget to check uncie Maneri calm don't forget to check out the show notes for this episode at out the show notes for this episode at out the show notes for this episode at unset Maneri calm it includes links to unset Maneri calm it includes links to unset Maneri calm it includes links to what we talked about today and more what we talked about today and more what we talked about today and more leave a comment we'd love to hear from leave a comment we'd love to hear from leave a comment we'd love to hear from you did you enjoy today's episode drop you did you enjoy today's episode drop you did you enjoy today's episode drop by iTunes and leave a review thanks by iTunes and leave a review thanks by iTunes and leave a review thanks again for tuning in to this week's on again for tuning in to this week's on again for tuning in to this week's on cemetery podcast join us next week when cemetery podcast join us next week when cemetery podcast join us next week when we'll learn more stuff we wish they we'll learn more stuff we wish they we'll learn more stuff we wish they taught in seminary