Project Camelot interviews Ralph Ring

[Music] [Music] He says, "You're going to you're going He says, "You're going to you're going He says, "You're going to you're going to get on board and we're going to we're to get on board and we're going to we're to get on board and we're going to we're going to go someplace and then we're going to go someplace and then we're going to go someplace and then we're going to come back and that's all." And going to come back and that's all." And going to come back and that's all." And he said, "But uh I want to tell you he said, "But uh I want to tell you he said, "But uh I want to tell you ahead of time, your brain will ahead of time, your brain will ahead of time, your brain will no longer be the same. Well, no longer be the same. Well, no longer be the same. Well, you will lose it. You will you will lose it. You will you will lose it. You will because it won't understand and it won't because it won't understand and it won't because it won't understand and it won't comprehend what's happening. So use your comprehend what's happening. So use your comprehend what's happening. So use your mind, use your feelings, come from your mind, use your feelings, come from your mind, use your feelings, come from your heart, meditate, go into a focus point heart, meditate, go into a focus point heart, meditate, go into a focus point and go to your higher thoughts and and go to your higher thoughts and and go to your higher thoughts and feelings, you know, then rather than feelings, you know, then rather than feelings, you know, then rather than than uh worrying about what was going to than uh worrying about what was going to than uh worrying about what was going to happen, these shutters are opening and happen, these shutters are opening and happen, these shutters are opening and shutting and creating all this reality shutting and creating all this reality shutting and creating all this reality you see around you. It doesn't really you see around you. It doesn't really you see around you. It doesn't really exist. It's all spirit. It's all energy, exist. It's all spirit. It's all energy, exist. It's all spirit. It's all energy, but we're creating this. That would be but we're creating this. That would be but we're creating this. That would be if you want to give us an intro on how if you want to give us an intro on how if you want to give us an intro on how you and Otis Carr came together and what you and Otis Carr came together and what you and Otis Carr came together and what your background was at the time and and your background was at the time and and your background was at the time and and bring us and how you worked with uh bring us and how you worked with uh bring us and how you worked with uh Jacques Gustau which is really Yeah, Jacques Gustau which is really Yeah, Jacques Gustau which is really Yeah, that's a good place to start. Okay.

that's a good place to start. Okay. that's a good place to start. Okay. Well, I I got out of the service in 54 Well, I I got out of the service in 54 Well, I I got out of the service in 54 and I um at when I was in the service, I and I um at when I was in the service, I and I um at when I was in the service, I was stationed on Guam and they had the was stationed on Guam and they had the was stationed on Guam and they had the Korean outbreak and they uh shipped us Korean outbreak and they uh shipped us Korean outbreak and they uh shipped us out in the middle of the night to Korea. out in the middle of the night to Korea. out in the middle of the night to Korea. We made the WCHON landing and and uh We made the WCHON landing and and uh We made the WCHON landing and and uh went through that situation which was went through that situation which was went through that situation which was kind of unpleasant. I got wounded about kind of unpleasant. I got wounded about kind of unpleasant. I got wounded about four times and had frostbite and so four times and had frostbite and so four times and had frostbite and so forth. And I became very very forth. And I became very very forth. And I became very very discouraged with the military totally discouraged with the military totally discouraged with the military totally because of the you know everything. And because of the you know everything. And because of the you know everything. And I uh I was an objective from the start I uh I was an objective from the start I uh I was an objective from the start on killing people. So I'd shoot in the on killing people. So I'd shoot in the on killing people. So I'd shoot in the air or whatever. They didn't care much air or whatever. They didn't care much air or whatever. They didn't care much for me. But for me. But for me. But while I was on Guam, the the Marines while I was on Guam, the the Marines while I was on Guam, the the Marines would fight with the Army and the Army would fight with the Army and the Army would fight with the Army and the Army would fight with the Navy at bars. would fight with the Navy at bars. would fight with the Navy at bars. They'd go out and and have fist fights. They'd go out and and have fist fights. They'd go out and and have fist fights. And uh I preferred to go down to the And uh I preferred to go down to the And uh I preferred to go down to the beach and and look around. And I finally beach and and look around. And I finally beach and and look around. And I finally got into scuba diving or skin diving got into scuba diving or skin diving got into scuba diving or skin diving actually with the snorkel and found a actually with the snorkel and found a actually with the snorkel and found a whole new environment underwater. And I whole new environment underwater. And I whole new environment underwater. And I became fascinated with it. And so I kept became fascinated with it. And so I kept became fascinated with it. And so I kept developing that until uh the outbreak in developing that until uh the outbreak in developing that until uh the outbreak in Korea. When I got back to the States, uh Korea. When I got back to the States, uh Korea. When I got back to the States, uh I was in heavy weapons. I was in the uh I was in heavy weapons. I was in the uh I was in heavy weapons. I was in the uh third division, seventh regimenal combat third division, seventh regimenal combat third division, seventh regimenal combat team, which is nothing more than machine team, which is nothing more than machine team, which is nothing more than machine guns, guns, guns, heavy mortars, and and uh big artillery.

heavy mortars, and and uh big artillery. heavy mortars, and and uh big artillery. And uh that's even though I had put in And uh that's even though I had put in And uh that's even though I had put in for engineering school continuously in for engineering school continuously in for engineering school continuously in my time in the service, they kept my time in the service, they kept my time in the service, they kept putting me back in the infantry. So when putting me back in the infantry. So when putting me back in the infantry. So when I got out, I didn't have much to to go I got out, I didn't have much to to go I got out, I didn't have much to to go on except my interest in diving. So I on except my interest in diving. So I on except my interest in diving. So I started a diving business, a skin started a diving business, a skin started a diving business, a skin diving, scuba diving business in San diving, scuba diving business in San diving, scuba diving business in San Francisco Francisco Francisco and eventually graduated down to and eventually graduated down to and eventually graduated down to Southern California where my family, Southern California where my family, Southern California where my family, some of my relatives and stuff, Newport some of my relatives and stuff, Newport some of my relatives and stuff, Newport Beach and and Costa Mesa, California. Beach and and Costa Mesa, California. Beach and and Costa Mesa, California. and uh I uh and uh I uh and uh I uh met my first wife and we got married and met my first wife and we got married and met my first wife and we got married and and uh had a couple of children and I and uh had a couple of children and I and uh had a couple of children and I was was diving uh on my own then I was was was diving uh on my own then I was was was diving uh on my own then I was doing a lot of diving. Uh I I was doing doing a lot of diving. Uh I I was doing doing a lot of diving. Uh I I was doing abalone diving and research and abalone diving and research and abalone diving and research and development diving and uh recovery development diving and uh recovery development diving and uh recovery diving and it was going along well, but diving and it was going along well, but diving and it was going along well, but my wife uh didn't like the idea that I'd my wife uh didn't like the idea that I'd my wife uh didn't like the idea that I'd be away for a couple of days on the boat be away for a couple of days on the boat be away for a couple of days on the boat and stuff and because the kids were and stuff and because the kids were and stuff and because the kids were growing up and they needed their dad and growing up and they needed their dad and growing up and they needed their dad and so forth. So to make a long story short, uh I went to work for uh the uh uh I went to work for uh the uh manufacturing plant at that time for US manufacturing plant at that time for US manufacturing plant at that time for US Divers was located in Costa Mesa or Divers was located in Costa Mesa or Divers was located in Costa Mesa or Santa Ana. And so I uh went to work for Santa Ana. And so I uh went to work for Santa Ana. And so I uh went to work for US Divers, which had developed the US Divers, which had developed the US Divers, which had developed the scuba, you know, Chak Custoau's scuba

scuba, you know, Chak Custoau's scuba scuba, you know, Chak Custoau's scuba gear. and uh they right away we hit it gear. and uh they right away we hit it gear. and uh they right away we hit it off because I am constantly a researcher off because I am constantly a researcher off because I am constantly a researcher and developer myself. So I went into the and developer myself. So I went into the and developer myself. So I went into the research and development department and research and development department and research and development department and uh uh we'd take trips out to Catalina uh uh we'd take trips out to Catalina uh uh we'd take trips out to Catalina and test my job was to test the and test my job was to test the and test my job was to test the wraparound mask at the one one stage and wraparound mask at the one one stage and wraparound mask at the one one stage and uh uh anyway I got really involved with uh uh anyway I got really involved with uh uh anyway I got really involved with that but we'd stay out longer and longer that but we'd stay out longer and longer that but we'd stay out longer and longer on research uh trips and um my wife u on research uh trips and um my wife u on research uh trips and um my wife u was getting very insistent that I get was getting very insistent that I get was getting very insistent that I get something a little less less dangerous something a little less less dangerous something a little less less dangerous and a little more um domestic, you know, and a little more um domestic, you know, and a little more um domestic, you know, home. So, she found this ad in the home. So, she found this ad in the home. So, she found this ad in the paper. It said there's Advanced Kinetics paper. It said there's Advanced Kinetics paper. It said there's Advanced Kinetics is is advertising they need uh lab is is advertising they need uh lab is is advertising they need uh lab techs, laboratory technicians and and uh techs, laboratory technicians and and uh techs, laboratory technicians and and uh research technicians. research technicians. research technicians. Why don't you go check because your Why don't you go check because your Why don't you go check because your interest has always been in in science interest has always been in in science interest has always been in in science and you're always and you're always and you're always off when I get home, I'm always tearing off when I get home, I'm always tearing off when I get home, I'm always tearing things apart and and stuff. So, I went things apart and and stuff. So, I went things apart and and stuff. So, I went over there and it was lunchtime over there and it was lunchtime over there and it was lunchtime and uh there was they were everybody was and uh there was they were everybody was and uh there was they were everybody was out to lunch. I was walking down the out to lunch. I was walking down the out to lunch. I was walking down the hall and I passed the uh director's hall and I passed the uh director's hall and I passed the uh director's office, Dr. Weinhard, and uh he said, office, Dr. Weinhard, and uh he said, office, Dr. Weinhard, and uh he said, "What are you doing?" And I said, "Well, "What are you doing?" And I said, "Well, "What are you doing?" And I said, "Well, I'm looking for a job." And you had an I'm looking for a job." And you had an I'm looking for a job." And you had an ad in a paper. And he said, "Oh, uh ad in a paper. And he said, "Oh, uh ad in a paper. And he said, "Oh, uh they're all out to lunch now." He says, they're all out to lunch now." He says, they're all out to lunch now." He says, "Come in. Let's talk." What have you

"Come in. Let's talk." What have you "Come in. Let's talk." What have you done and where's your background? I done and where's your background? I done and where's your background? I don't have any uh credentials uh except don't have any uh credentials uh except don't have any uh credentials uh except bumblebees and lizards and things that bumblebees and lizards and things that bumblebees and lizards and things that I've studied and I found out that I've studied and I found out that I've studied and I found out that there's quite a bit of credibility to there's quite a bit of credibility to there's quite a bit of credibility to natural law that I apply to things and natural law that I apply to things and natural law that I apply to things and it always works. So he said uh magnetics it always works. So he said uh magnetics it always works. So he said uh magnetics you're I said yeah I've studied you're I said yeah I've studied you're I said yeah I've studied magnetics all my life. I love it. And uh magnetics all my life. I love it. And uh magnetics all my life. I love it. And uh well you know coincidentally the guy well you know coincidentally the guy well you know coincidentally the guy that was working on our magnetic project that was working on our magnetic project that was working on our magnetic project just couldn't he just left and uh come just couldn't he just left and uh come just couldn't he just left and uh come to work tomorrow morning. you're going to work tomorrow morning. you're going to work tomorrow morning. you're going on the magnetic project. I said, "Fine, on the magnetic project. I said, "Fine, on the magnetic project. I said, "Fine, great." So, what it was was I had a great." So, what it was was I had a great." So, what it was was I had a bench, workbench, and there was a bench, workbench, and there was a bench, workbench, and there was a cathode ray tubes, you know, shooting cathode ray tubes, you know, shooting cathode ray tubes, you know, shooting firing electrons, and I had a a uh an firing electrons, and I had a a uh an firing electrons, and I had a a uh an oscilloscope mounted with a camera, oscilloscope mounted with a camera, oscilloscope mounted with a camera, high-speed camera, high-speed high-speed camera, high-speed high-speed camera, high-speed everything. And and through a magnetic everything. And and through a magnetic everything. And and through a magnetic field, I was firing these electrons. And field, I was firing these electrons. And field, I was firing these electrons. And uh he said, "Take pictures of them. uh he said, "Take pictures of them. uh he said, "Take pictures of them. We've got the idea of your goal is to We've got the idea of your goal is to We've got the idea of your goal is to get one electron completely through the get one electron completely through the get one electron completely through the field without deflection, without it field without deflection, without it field without deflection, without it being pulled to the positive or being pulled to the positive or being pulled to the positive or negative.

negative. negative. I said fine, you know, no problem. I said fine, you know, no problem. I said fine, you know, no problem. That's an easy job. So, I just kept That's an easy job. So, I just kept That's an easy job. So, I just kept taking pictures quite extensive and and taking pictures quite extensive and and taking pictures quite extensive and and expensive every day. I, you know, it was expensive every day. I, you know, it was expensive every day. I, you know, it was about thousand dollars worth of work about thousand dollars worth of work about thousand dollars worth of work every day that was paid for by the every day that was paid for by the every day that was paid for by the taxpayers for the research. And I taxpayers for the research. And I taxpayers for the research. And I started questioning it. And my started questioning it. And my started questioning it. And my affiliation with with nature affiliation with with nature affiliation with with nature told me that they were using force, told me that they were using force, told me that they were using force, brute force, brute force, and it doesn't brute force, brute force, and it doesn't brute force, brute force, and it doesn't work with nature. It doesn't work with work with nature. It doesn't work with work with nature. It doesn't work with the laws of nature. So I said, you know, the laws of nature. So I said, you know, the laws of nature. So I said, you know, this is never going to work. I I can I this is never going to work. I I can I this is never going to work. I I can I can appreciate this guy leaving. He got can appreciate this guy leaving. He got can appreciate this guy leaving. He got fed up and I was getting there fast. So fed up and I was getting there fast. So fed up and I was getting there fast. So I I went home and I I'd gone to garage I I went home and I I'd gone to garage I I went home and I I'd gone to garage sales and collected, you know, I had an sales and collected, you know, I had an sales and collected, you know, I had an audio amplifier. I had a a frequency uh audio amplifier. I had a a frequency uh audio amplifier. I had a a frequency uh uh generator. I had different things at uh generator. I had different things at uh generator. I had different things at home that I tore apart TV and got a home that I tore apart TV and got a home that I tore apart TV and got a cathode ray. I started the experiment on cathode ray. I started the experiment on cathode ray. I started the experiment on a small scale in my living room floor a small scale in my living room floor a small scale in my living room floor and um and um and um uh I set it all up and got everything uh I set it all up and got everything uh I set it all up and got everything the way I felt it should work.

the way I felt it should work. the way I felt it should work. And uh I instead of forcing the And uh I instead of forcing the And uh I instead of forcing the electrons I pulsed them you know I just electrons I pulsed them you know I just electrons I pulsed them you know I just gave them a pulse and that's all I did gave them a pulse and that's all I did gave them a pulse and that's all I did and they on their own started a circular and they on their own started a circular and they on their own started a circular motion attracted in their own pattern motion attracted in their own pattern motion attracted in their own pattern and how much they wanted to at a at a and how much they wanted to at a at a and how much they wanted to at a at a precision and they went from negative to precision and they went from negative to precision and they went from negative to positive all the way through to the end positive all the way through to the end positive all the way through to the end of the you were just feeding it back to of the you were just feeding it back to of the you were just feeding it back to the source and it was I said my god that the source and it was I said my god that the source and it was I said my god that was simple cuz the first shot went was simple cuz the first shot went was simple cuz the first shot went through and then I did many many more through and then I did many many more through and then I did many many more and they all went through without and they all went through without and they all went through without deflection at all and I said, "Oh, the deflection at all and I said, "Oh, the deflection at all and I said, "Oh, the I'm happy. This is going to give me a I'm happy. This is going to give me a I'm happy. This is going to give me a give me a raise maybe." give me a raise maybe." give me a raise maybe." So then the next experiment on the bench So then the next experiment on the bench So then the next experiment on the bench next to me, they're working on next to me, they're working on next to me, they're working on levitation. They uh other technicians, levitation. They uh other technicians, levitation. They uh other technicians, other uh engineers were working. What other uh engineers were working. What other uh engineers were working. What department were they working? In department were they working? In department were they working? In advanced kinetics in the uh the advanced kinetics in the uh the advanced kinetics in the uh the laboratory was huge and we had different laboratory was huge and we had different laboratory was huge and we had different you know uh different workbenches and you know uh different workbenches and you know uh different workbenches and they were all working they were working they were all working they were working they were all working they were working on lasers to the moon and and on lasers to the moon and and on lasers to the moon and and levitating. So there was different levitating. So there was different levitating. So there was different interest of course in involved in some interest of course in involved in some interest of course in involved in some of the projects as well. The government of the projects as well. The government of the projects as well. The government was funding this. They were this is all was funding this. They were this is all was funding this. They were this is all government funded research department of government funded research department of government funded research department of the uh army. Uh I don't know. I don't the uh army. Uh I don't know. I don't the uh army. Uh I don't know. I don't know just to get back to your story know just to get back to your story know just to get back to your story though of uh so you had developed this though of uh so you had developed this though of uh so you had developed this pulsing right and in the next you're pulsing right and in the next you're pulsing right and in the next you're saying next door the next uh bench over saying next door the next uh bench over saying next door the next uh bench over they're working on levitation and they they're working on levitation and they they're working on levitation and they had these just coils you know iron with

had these just coils you know iron with had these just coils you know iron with a copper wiring and they had steel balls a copper wiring and they had steel balls a copper wiring and they had steel balls and they would put them on top and fire and they would put them on top and fire and they would put them on top and fire it up and they would levitate the ball it up and they would levitate the ball it up and they would levitate the ball for I think four to eight minutes and it for I think four to eight minutes and it for I think four to eight minutes and it would burn the coil out and these they would burn the coil out and these they would burn the coil out and these they were called iglotrons I believe is the were called iglotrons I believe is the were called iglotrons I believe is the correct term for them and they'd have to correct term for them and they'd have to correct term for them and they'd have to go to supply and get another one and get go to supply and get another one and get go to supply and get another one and get another one. They were burning up two or another one. They were burning up two or another one. They were burning up two or three or four of these and they were at three or four of these and they were at three or four of these and they were at that and those days that was the 50s that and those days that was the 50s that and those days that was the 50s they were like $400 a copy and they were they were like $400 a copy and they were they were like $400 a copy and they were just ah we don't care we got plenty of just ah we don't care we got plenty of just ah we don't care we got plenty of them and they were burning these things them and they were burning these things them and they were burning these things up. So the other experiment I did at up. So the other experiment I did at up. So the other experiment I did at home home home was I took a 15-inch woofer speaker that was I took a 15-inch woofer speaker that was I took a 15-inch woofer speaker that I got out of garage sale or I don't know I got out of garage sale or I don't know I got out of garage sale or I don't know sound system somewhere and I put it just sound system somewhere and I put it just sound system somewhere and I put it just flat on the carpet on my living room flat on the carpet on my living room flat on the carpet on my living room floor and uh attached uh my audio floor and uh attached uh my audio floor and uh attached uh my audio amplifier right to it and I kind of amplifier right to it and I kind of amplifier right to it and I kind of started experimenting with like started experimenting with like started experimenting with like acoustical levitation thinking well you acoustical levitation thinking well you acoustical levitation thinking well you know they're they're using this force to know they're they're using this force to know they're they're using this force to push up and they're using a lot of power push up and they're using a lot of power push up and they're using a lot of power I'll try sound waves I I'll try you know I'll try sound waves I I'll try you know I'll try sound waves I I'll try you know sympathetic vibrations or whatever sympathetic vibrations or whatever sympathetic vibrations or whatever So, I fooled around with different So, I fooled around with different So, I fooled around with different objects and I' I'd have tentative objects and I' I'd have tentative objects and I' I'd have tentative results that it' start pulsing and results that it' start pulsing and results that it' start pulsing and stuff, but and then I I put a ping-pong stuff, but and then I I put a ping-pong stuff, but and then I I put a ping-pong ball in the center and I kept fooling ball in the center and I kept fooling ball in the center and I kept fooling and I think it was 28 uh,000 cycles. I and I think it was 28 uh,000 cycles. I and I think it was 28 uh,000 cycles. I got the ping-pong ball to come up.

got the ping-pong ball to come up. got the ping-pong ball to come up. Interesting you mention that because I Interesting you mention that because I Interesting you mention that because I recall seeing a news clip back in 1989 recall seeing a news clip back in 1989 recall seeing a news clip back in 1989 showing the scientist discovered how to showing the scientist discovered how to showing the scientist discovered how to do exactly what you just decided. This do exactly what you just decided. This do exactly what you just decided. This was back in what the 60s was back in what the 60s was back in what the 60s 50s. Oh god. Pulsing was quite simple 50s. Oh god. Pulsing was quite simple 50s. Oh god. Pulsing was quite simple and you know it can be done today. It and you know it can be done today. It and you know it can be done today. It could be duplicated today I suppose. I I could be duplicated today I suppose. I I could be duplicated today I suppose. I I you know I never tried it. I I didn't you know I never tried it. I I didn't you know I never tried it. I I didn't think you know to go back to it but it think you know to go back to it but it think you know to go back to it but it was a very simple operation because you was a very simple operation because you was a very simple operation because you let nature do all the work and all I did let nature do all the work and all I did let nature do all the work and all I did was understand what was happening. So was understand what was happening. So was understand what was happening. So and the same with the ping pong ball. and the same with the ping pong ball. and the same with the ping pong ball. Once I got it to levitate I was excited Once I got it to levitate I was excited Once I got it to levitate I was excited as heck and my wife said come to bed. as heck and my wife said come to bed. as heck and my wife said come to bed. Come to bed. So I went to bed and the Come to bed. So I went to bed and the Come to bed. So I went to bed and the next morning when I woke up the ping next morning when I woke up the ping next morning when I woke up the ping pong ball was still sitting there just pong ball was still sitting there just pong ball was still sitting there just levitating levitating. And this was like levitating levitating. And this was like levitating levitating. And this was like I think it was 28,000 I think it was 28,000 I think it was 28,000 cycles. No heat. No heat. No heat. And cycles. No heat. No heat. No heat. And cycles. No heat. No heat. No heat. And sound. But sound acoustical sound is all sound. But sound acoustical sound is all sound. But sound acoustical sound is all it was. Now, was it audible to the human it was. Now, was it audible to the human it was. Now, was it audible to the human ear as far as the sound? It's just I ear as far as the sound? It's just I ear as far as the sound? It's just I couldn't hear a thing. So was you're couldn't hear a thing. So was you're couldn't hear a thing. So was you're you're talking perhaps high frequency you're talking perhaps high frequency you're talking perhaps high frequency level or level or level or ultra high. Yeah. I you know um I ultra high. Yeah. I you know um I ultra high. Yeah. I you know um I experimented with different you know experimented with different you know experimented with different you know down in the lower ranges and down in the lower ranges and down in the lower ranges and nothing seemed to happen. and it had nothing seemed to happen. and it had nothing seemed to happen. and it had balanced and stuff, but I when I got up balanced and stuff, but I when I got up balanced and stuff, but I when I got up in the UHF Yeah. then then it then it in the UHF Yeah. then then it then it in the UHF Yeah. then then it then it then it happened. So I I I I thank my

then it happened. So I I I I thank my then it happened. So I I I I thank my wife for the pushing into that direction wife for the pushing into that direction wife for the pushing into that direction because this is this is my field. This because this is this is my field. This because this is this is my field. This is what I always wanted to do. And uh I is what I always wanted to do. And uh I is what I always wanted to do. And uh I think we we're on to something here and think we we're on to something here and think we we're on to something here and I can put my two cents in to uh to the I can put my two cents in to uh to the I can put my two cents in to uh to the pot and help humanity do something. back pot and help humanity do something. back pot and help humanity do something. back way back then you knew all this. Oh, way back then you knew all this. Oh, way back then you knew all this. Oh, yeah. And and so but you took it to yeah. And and so but you took it to yeah. And and so but you took it to these guys, right? And and how did they these guys, right? And and how did they these guys, right? And and how did they react? I took it to Dr. Weinhardt react? I took it to Dr. Weinhardt react? I took it to Dr. Weinhardt himself. I took I took uh Polaroids and himself. I took I took uh Polaroids and himself. I took I took uh Polaroids and I wrote up papers on it just like I did I wrote up papers on it just like I did I wrote up papers on it just like I did with my at the at the uh lab with my at the at the uh lab with my at the at the uh lab and I took it into Dr. Weinhardt and I took it into Dr. Weinhardt and I took it into Dr. Weinhardt and he says, "Close the door. Come in. and he says, "Close the door. Come in. and he says, "Close the door. Come in. Sit down." Sit down." Sit down." He said, he looked it all over and and He said, he looked it all over and and He said, he looked it all over and and stuff and he said, "Yeah, I know it's stuff and he said, "Yeah, I know it's stuff and he said, "Yeah, I know it's that simple, Ralph. I know that. I know that simple, Ralph. I know that. I know that simple, Ralph. I know that. I know that. that. that. But this is a government-f funed But this is a government-f funed But this is a government-f funed research facility. research facility. research facility. We count on the funds to keep us going. We count on the funds to keep us going. We count on the funds to keep us going. We're not necessarily We're not necessarily We're not necessarily interested right now in finding the interested right now in finding the interested right now in finding the answers. We're interested in looking for answers. We're interested in looking for answers. We're interested in looking for them. And we get paid handsomely for them. And we get paid handsomely for them. And we get paid handsomely for looking for the answers." And I said, looking for the answers." And I said, looking for the answers." And I said, "Well, here, look, this works. I mean, "Well, here, look, this works. I mean, "Well, here, look, this works. I mean, maybe I don't know what I'm doing and maybe I don't know what I'm doing and maybe I don't know what I'm doing and maybe it's it's not right, but I thought maybe it's it's not right, but I thought maybe it's it's not right, but I thought if I turned it over to the boys here, we if I turned it over to the boys here, we if I turned it over to the boys here, we can get come together and and this is a can get come together and and this is a can get come together and and this is a lot simpler than $400 a copy for lot simpler than $400 a copy for lot simpler than $400 a copy for iglotrons and and wasting our time with iglotrons and and wasting our time with iglotrons and and wasting our time with a with the uh cathode, you know, that a with the uh cathode, you know, that a with the uh cathode, you know, that you got set up. And he said,

you got set up. And he said, you got set up. And he said, he says, "Well, I can appreciate what he says, "Well, I can appreciate what he says, "Well, I can appreciate what what you've come up with, and I I didn't what you've come up with, and I I didn't what you've come up with, and I I didn't think you'd get there this fast with think you'd get there this fast with think you'd get there this fast with this because of your interest in natural this because of your interest in natural this because of your interest in natural law, but I'm going to have to shred law, but I'm going to have to shred law, but I'm going to have to shred this." He had a shredder right there. this." He had a shredder right there. this." He had a shredder right there. I'm going to have to shred this and tell I'm going to have to shred this and tell I'm going to have to shred this and tell you to go back to work on what you were you to go back to work on what you were you to go back to work on what you were doing. doing. doing. Well, right there, my whole world Well, right there, my whole world Well, right there, my whole world collapsed. I mean, I I I thought, where collapsed. I mean, I I I thought, where collapsed. I mean, I I I thought, where am I? I mean what I I really I didn't my am I? I mean what I I really I didn't my am I? I mean what I I really I didn't my whole attitude my whole demeanor towards whole attitude my whole demeanor towards whole attitude my whole demeanor towards the world changed. Who are these people the world changed. Who are these people the world changed. Who are these people anymore and and who are they really anymore and and who are they really anymore and and who are they really working for? Right. That's exactly the working for? Right. That's exactly the working for? Right. That's exactly the way I felt. So I uh I uh So eventually way I felt. So I uh I uh So eventually way I felt. So I uh I uh So eventually you actually left the job, right? You you actually left the job, right? You you actually left the job, right? You just got to make a long story short, I just got to make a long story short, I just got to make a long story short, I went back. I worked another two weeks went back. I worked another two weeks went back. I worked another two weeks and I couldn't stand it. I just that's and I couldn't stand it. I just that's and I couldn't stand it. I just that's it. I'm done. it. I'm done. it. I'm done. So but during this period I started So but during this period I started So but during this period I started meeting people just coincidentally who meeting people just coincidentally who meeting people just coincidentally who were most people I talked to outside of were most people I talked to outside of were most people I talked to outside of the lab didn't want to talk science they the lab didn't want to talk science they the lab didn't want to talk science they wanted to talk other things. So I had wanted to talk other things. So I had wanted to talk other things. So I had very limited um uh very limited um uh very limited um uh contacts with other people that were contacts with other people that were contacts with other people that were interested in science except I started interested in science except I started interested in science except I started meeting uh I I met this one person meeting uh I I met this one person meeting uh I I met this one person that said well you know what you're that said well you know what you're that said well you know what you're talking about is exactly what they're talking about is exactly what they're talking about is exactly what they're talking about in these meetings that I talking about in these meetings that I talking about in these meetings that I go to and the name of the meetings are go to and the name of the meetings are go to and the name of the meetings are called understanding called understanding called understanding and they were developed by a person

and they were developed by a person and they were developed by a person called Daniel Fry who was in the uh UFO called Daniel Fry who was in the uh UFO called Daniel Fry who was in the uh UFO and stuff stuff and uh they want to and stuff stuff and uh they want to and stuff stuff and uh they want to understand more. Why don't you come to understand more. Why don't you come to understand more. Why don't you come to one of our meetings and and talk? one of our meetings and and talk? one of our meetings and and talk? Well, I went to the meetings and I kind Well, I went to the meetings and I kind Well, I went to the meetings and I kind of duplicated what I just said about of duplicated what I just said about of duplicated what I just said about where I was working, you know, and they where I was working, you know, and they where I was working, you know, and they said, "Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, you know, said, "Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, you know, said, "Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, you know, you've got to meet you got to meet you've got to meet you got to meet you've got to meet you got to meet somebody. You got to meet Mr. Carr." somebody. You got to meet Mr. Carr." somebody. You got to meet Mr. Carr." What year was this about? Well, I I What year was this about? Well, I I What year was this about? Well, I I think it was late 59 or early 60s. And think it was late 59 or early 60s. And think it was late 59 or early 60s. And they says, "You you guys are talking the they says, "You you guys are talking the they says, "You you guys are talking the same thing, the same exact thing." And I same thing, the same exact thing." And I same thing, the same exact thing." And I said, "Well, okay." He said, "Well, said, "Well, okay." He said, "Well, said, "Well, okay." He said, "Well, coincidentally, coincidentally, coincidentally, uh, we're in touch with he's in he's uh, we're in touch with he's in he's uh, we're in touch with he's in he's just had some bad luck in in OK in just had some bad luck in in OK in just had some bad luck in in OK in Norman, Oklahoma. That's where he was Norman, Oklahoma. That's where he was Norman, Oklahoma. That's where he was trying to demonstrate trying to demonstrate trying to demonstrate uh the crafts, some, you know, the uh the crafts, some, you know, the uh the crafts, some, you know, the flying discs. flying discs. flying discs. and um and um and um they they they started started started negatively negatively negatively defining his work and uh the newspapers defining his work and uh the newspapers defining his work and uh the newspapers got a hold of it and you know like well got a hold of it and you know like well got a hold of it and you know like well he's trying to get funds to do something he's trying to get funds to do something he's trying to get funds to do something that's impossible and and the science that's impossible and and the science that's impossible and and the science has just never heard of such a thing and has just never heard of such a thing and has just never heard of such a thing and so forth. So, we're going to bring him so forth. So, we're going to bring him so forth. So, we're going to bring him out here and we're going to we're going out here and we're going to we're going out here and we're going to we're going to get a lab out here and uh

to get a lab out here and uh to get a lab out here and uh let him with his entourage and and let's let him with his entourage and and let's let him with his entourage and and let's go let's try another place another time go let's try another place another time go let's try another place another time and see if we can get somewhere. and see if we can get somewhere. and see if we can get somewhere. So, they did and I met with Carr and his So, they did and I met with Carr and his So, they did and I met with Carr and his entourage. He had Dennis Rupoli, um entourage. He had Dennis Rupoli, um entourage. He had Dennis Rupoli, um Norman Coloulton, Wayne Al's about six Norman Coloulton, Wayne Al's about six Norman Coloulton, Wayne Al's about six of He had a little consortium going on of He had a little consortium going on of He had a little consortium going on here. And where was this based now? here. And where was this based now? here. And where was this based now? Where where was your group based? Okay, Where where was your group based? Okay, Where where was your group based? Okay, this was in Costa Mesa, California where this was in Costa Mesa, California where this was in Costa Mesa, California where these understanding meetings were. And these understanding meetings were. And these understanding meetings were. And that's where I met Carr. Okay. But they that's where I met Carr. Okay. But they that's where I met Carr. Okay. But they found out that they were after Carr. He was having all they were after Carr. He was having all kinds of misses. They were trying to to kinds of misses. They were trying to to kinds of misses. They were trying to to to quiet his efforts, you know. They to quiet his efforts, you know. They to quiet his efforts, you know. They were trying to When you say he was were trying to When you say he was were trying to When you say he was having misses, actually people were having misses, actually people were having misses, actually people were trying to to kill him. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. trying to to kill him. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. trying to to kill him. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. they were they were threatening and then they were they were threatening and then they were they were threatening and then he you know he'd have to be very careful he you know he'd have to be very careful he you know he'd have to be very careful where he went because he'd find people where he went because he'd find people where he went because he'd find people kind of you know kind of you know kind of you know very curiously observing him and you very curiously observing him and you very curiously observing him and you know things like this they already knew know things like this they already knew know things like this they already knew what you were up to and they probably what you were up to and they probably what you were up to and they probably were following you as well as following were following you as well as following were following you as well as following him. That's a good point. I didn't bring him. That's a good point. I didn't bring him. That's a good point. I didn't bring this up and I think it's important.

this up and I think it's important. this up and I think it's important. You've heard by now it's all over the You've heard by now it's all over the You've heard by now it's all over the place about three men in black, right? place about three men in black, right? place about three men in black, right? Okay. I'd never heard, this was back Okay. I'd never heard, this was back Okay. I'd never heard, this was back before I'd even heard of such a thing. before I'd even heard of such a thing. before I'd even heard of such a thing. These three guys showed up on my door These three guys showed up on my door These three guys showed up on my door after this experiment and after Weinhard after this experiment and after Weinhard after this experiment and after Weinhard had destroyed these things. Honest to had destroyed these things. Honest to had destroyed these things. Honest to God, they were in black suits and they God, they were in black suits and they God, they were in black suits and they said, "We're from the DeWalt School of said, "We're from the DeWalt School of said, "We're from the DeWalt School of Electronics and we want we've heard Electronics and we want we've heard Electronics and we want we've heard about you and we want to can we come in about you and we want to can we come in about you and we want to can we come in and we want to know about your and we want to know about your and we want to know about your experiments and what you're doing and experiments and what you're doing and experiments and what you're doing and everything." And uh I was a little everything." And uh I was a little everything." And uh I was a little hesitant, but I invited him in and I hesitant, but I invited him in and I hesitant, but I invited him in and I started talking and my wife said, "No, started talking and my wife said, "No, started talking and my wife said, "No, no, these guys aren't they don't feel no, these guys aren't they don't feel no, these guys aren't they don't feel right." right." right." She's very intuitive and she had a bad She's very intuitive and she had a bad She's very intuitive and she had a bad feeling about that. She sure did. And I feeling about that. She sure did. And I feeling about that. She sure did. And I said, "Well, God, you can't kick them said, "Well, God, you can't kick them said, "Well, God, you can't kick them out." But they would became a little out." But they would became a little out." But they would became a little more insistent on, "Well, give us give more insistent on, "Well, give us give more insistent on, "Well, give us give us how you wrote how you did this and us how you wrote how you did this and us how you wrote how you did this and and I want the details and stuff." And and I want the details and stuff." And and I want the details and stuff." And they're not giving me anything back.

they're not giving me anything back. they're not giving me anything back. They're just kind of taking. And she They're just kind of taking. And she They're just kind of taking. And she caught this and she says, "You know, I'm caught this and she says, "You know, I'm caught this and she says, "You know, I'm going to have to ask you guys to leave going to have to ask you guys to leave going to have to ask you guys to leave right now. You can come back later or right now. You can come back later or right now. You can come back later or whatever you want to do, but don't you whatever you want to do, but don't you whatever you want to do, but don't you got to leave right now." And she kicked got to leave right now." And she kicked got to leave right now." And she kicked them out of the house. Wow. So, okay. them out of the house. Wow. So, okay. them out of the house. Wow. So, okay. So, you started in Costa Mesa and and So, you started in Costa Mesa and and So, you started in Costa Mesa and and didn't you move out of there or didn't you move out of there or didn't you move out of there or something? Yeah. The the the something? Yeah. The the the something? Yeah. The the the understanding group had a cabin of some understanding group had a cabin of some understanding group had a cabin of some people. There was lots of people in the people. There was lots of people in the people. There was lots of people in the understanding group. There was, you understanding group. There was, you understanding group. There was, you know, I don't know, a couple of dozen know, I don't know, a couple of dozen know, I don't know, a couple of dozen people that we would meet had a cabin up people that we would meet had a cabin up people that we would meet had a cabin up at Lake Arrowhead, which is uh down by at Lake Arrowhead, which is uh down by at Lake Arrowhead, which is uh down by Riverside up in the mountains in Riverside up in the mountains in Riverside up in the mountains in California. And they said, "Well, we got California. And they said, "Well, we got California. And they said, "Well, we got to get car and you guys in a safe place, to get car and you guys in a safe place, to get car and you guys in a safe place, and there's a nice big cabin and room and there's a nice big cabin and room and there's a nice big cabin and room enough for everybody. Go on up there and enough for everybody. Go on up there and enough for everybody. Go on up there and then we'll we'll keep working on what then we'll we'll keep working on what then we'll we'll keep working on what we're going to do." we're going to do." we're going to do." So I got up there with talking with Carr So I got up there with talking with Carr So I got up there with talking with Carr and his proteges and his and his people and his proteges and his and his people and his proteges and his and his people that he had with him and man I just lit that he had with him and man I just lit that he had with him and man I just lit up like a Christmas tree. I mean I was up like a Christmas tree. I mean I was up like a Christmas tree. I mean I was on cloud9 because I just man, on cloud9 because I just man, on cloud9 because I just man, you know, he was answering questions you know, he was answering questions you know, he was answering questions that I had on things and I was answering that I had on things and I was answering that I had on things and I was answering questions he had on things and it was questions he had on things and it was questions he had on things and it was just man connected on all kinds of just man connected on all kinds of just man connected on all kinds of levels. God, it was it was just the most levels. God, it was it was just the most levels. God, it was it was just the most wonderful time of my life. We were wonderful time of my life. We were wonderful time of my life. We were feeding their raccoons to to to keep our feeding their raccoons to to to keep our feeding their raccoons to to to keep our minds off. We were so anxious to get minds off. We were so anxious to get minds off. We were so anxious to get going on a project and uh they we got a going on a project and uh they we got a going on a project and uh they we got a phone call and they said, "We've got you phone call and they said, "We've got you phone call and they said, "We've got you a place. It's just down the hill from a place. It's just down the hill from a place. It's just down the hill from where you're at on the other side in where you're at on the other side in where you're at on the other side in Apple Valley or Hisperia, California

Apple Valley or Hisperia, California Apple Valley or Hisperia, California near Victorville." near Victorville." near Victorville." It's coincidentally because all these It's coincidentally because all these It's coincidentally because all these people moved on feelings and spirit if people moved on feelings and spirit if people moved on feelings and spirit if you would. This is about the same era. I you would. This is about the same era. I you would. This is about the same era. I wanted to point out that George Vanasel wanted to point out that George Vanasel wanted to point out that George Vanasel was having a lot of uh UFO meetings out was having a lot of uh UFO meetings out was having a lot of uh UFO meetings out at the Integatron near Joshua Tree. at the Integatron near Joshua Tree. at the Integatron near Joshua Tree. I'm glad you mentioned Vanasel. I forgot I'm glad you mentioned Vanasel. I forgot I'm glad you mentioned Vanasel. I forgot I had ordered from from Europe uh I had ordered from from Europe uh I had ordered from from Europe uh Tesla's big book and it did get to me Tesla's big book and it did get to me Tesla's big book and it did get to me and I was going through all the uh and I was going through all the uh and I was going through all the uh patents and everything in the big book patents and everything in the big book patents and everything in the big book and and and when this thing happened with my wife when this thing happened with my wife when this thing happened with my wife kicking these guys out and everything I kicking these guys out and everything I kicking these guys out and everything I I got a little apprehensive and I I got a little apprehensive and I I got a little apprehensive and I decided I knew of Van Hassel and I knew decided I knew of Van Hassel and I knew decided I knew of Van Hassel and I knew a little bit about his background and I a little bit about his background and I a little bit about his background and I didn't this was before I met Carr and so didn't this was before I met Carr and so didn't this was before I met Carr and so I took a trip I got in my car and I took a trip I got in my car and I took a trip I got in my car and because I I was going to try and meet because I I was going to try and meet because I I was going to try and meet people that will be more receptive do people that will be more receptive do people that will be more receptive do yeah more receptive and I took this yeah more receptive and I took this yeah more receptive and I took this Bible Bible Bible down to Giant Rock Joshua Tree down to Giant Rock Joshua Tree down to Giant Rock Joshua Tree California California California and met with Van Tassel and we had a and met with Van Tassel and we had a and met with Van Tassel and we had a nice talk and I said you know I was nice talk and I said you know I was nice talk and I said you know I was supposed to give you this you know I I supposed to give you this you know I I supposed to give you this you know I I can't I'm I'm out of this phase of this.

can't I'm I'm out of this phase of this. can't I'm I'm out of this phase of this. I don't know where I'm going or what I'm I don't know where I'm going or what I'm I don't know where I'm going or what I'm going to do, but this is it. And I gave going to do, but this is it. And I gave going to do, but this is it. And I gave it to him and I remember it was getting it to him and I remember it was getting it to him and I remember it was getting late that afternoon or evening and I late that afternoon or evening and I late that afternoon or evening and I went out and laid on a on a hillside went out and laid on a on a hillside went out and laid on a on a hillside and uh I looked up in the sky and I saw and uh I looked up in the sky and I saw and uh I looked up in the sky and I saw hundreds if not thousands of whatever hundreds if not thousands of whatever hundreds if not thousands of whatever they were UFOs, spaceships, different they were UFOs, spaceships, different they were UFOs, spaceships, different various shapes. Really? Yeah. They like various shapes. Really? Yeah. They like various shapes. Really? Yeah. They like green lights or whatever. I don't know. green lights or whatever. I don't know. green lights or whatever. I don't know. There was hundreds and hundreds. They There was hundreds and hundreds. They There was hundreds and hundreds. They were coming over and they they'd stop were coming over and they they'd stop were coming over and they they'd stop and come down and go up and around. Oh and come down and go up and around. Oh and come down and go up and around. Oh my god. This is this is really, you my god. This is this is really, you my god. This is this is really, you know, this is really and what I I said, know, this is really and what I I said, know, this is really and what I I said, "What is this for?" And what I got was "What is this for?" And what I got was "What is this for?" And what I got was because you did what you did. because you did what you did. because you did what you did. And I wow this is I was really So it was And I wow this is I was really So it was And I wow this is I was really So it was like a thank you demonstration of a like a thank you demonstration of a like a thank you demonstration of a sort, right? Wow. And I just That's sort, right? Wow. And I just That's sort, right? Wow. And I just That's amazing. You know, I chilled all over amazing. You know, I chilled all over amazing. You know, I chilled all over like if you build it, we will come.

like if you build it, we will come. like if you build it, we will come. Oh man. So then I got back and then they Oh man. So then I got back and then they Oh man. So then I got back and then they had set up the meeting with car and then had set up the meeting with car and then had set up the meeting with car and then we got down into the laboratory down in we got down into the laboratory down in we got down into the laboratory down in uh in Hisperia in co in Apple Valley uh in Hisperia in co in Apple Valley uh in Hisperia in co in Apple Valley and uh and uh and uh we started setting up shop. We had a we started setting up shop. We had a we started setting up shop. We had a little machine shop set up and we had uh little machine shop set up and we had uh little machine shop set up and we had uh you know all kinds of stuff to to do you know all kinds of stuff to to do you know all kinds of stuff to to do things with. But we'd had a couple of things with. But we'd had a couple of things with. But we'd had a couple of models that that they brought with them models that that they brought with them models that that they brought with them that were uh uh semi-operational. that were uh uh semi-operational. that were uh uh semi-operational. So we the first experiment that I saw So we the first experiment that I saw So we the first experiment that I saw that that just knocked my socks off was that that just knocked my socks off was that that just knocked my socks off was we set it up on on one of the we set it up on on one of the we set it up on on one of the workbenches and attached uh uh not workbenches and attached uh uh not workbenches and attached uh uh not electricity but uh sound waves if you electricity but uh sound waves if you electricity but uh sound waves if you will. Or maybe it was I think we had a I'm not sure. Anyway, and this was a a I'm not sure. Anyway, and this was a a small uh model about uh what 2 feet in small uh model about uh what 2 feet in small uh model about uh what 2 feet in diameter, two or three feet in diameter.

diameter, two or three feet in diameter. diameter, two or three feet in diameter. And uh they said, "Well, take a look at And uh they said, "Well, take a look at And uh they said, "Well, take a look at this." So they fired it up. this." So they fired it up. this." So they fired it up. Hardly any noise, just a hum, you know, Hardly any noise, just a hum, you know, Hardly any noise, just a hum, you know, vibratory hum. And u it was made out of vibratory hum. And u it was made out of vibratory hum. And u it was made out of aluminum. aluminum. aluminum. And I touched the surface of it and it And I touched the surface of it and it And I touched the surface of it and it felt good, but I could feel the the felt good, but I could feel the the felt good, but I could feel the the vibrations. vibrations. vibrations. And so they kept increasing the the uh And so they kept increasing the the uh And so they kept increasing the the uh energy energy energy and uh then there was this feeling that and uh then there was this feeling that and uh then there was this feeling that it g it felt really like somebody opened it g it felt really like somebody opened it g it felt really like somebody opened a door and a cool breeze was coming a door and a cool breeze was coming a door and a cool breeze was coming through. It felt really good. And at through. It felt really good. And at through. It felt really good. And at that time I went to touch it again and that time I went to touch it again and that time I went to touch it again and it was like jell-o. It was getting soft. it was like jell-o. It was getting soft. it was like jell-o. It was getting soft. It was getting really, really soft. Like It was getting really, really soft. Like It was getting really, really soft. Like I could put my fingers through it. I could put my fingers through it. I could put my fingers through it. Better than Jell-O because I it didn't Better than Jell-O because I it didn't Better than Jell-O because I it didn't stick or anything. I put my hand in and stick or anything. I put my hand in and stick or anything. I put my hand in and pulled it out. Oh my goodness. And what pulled it out. Oh my goodness. And what pulled it out. Oh my goodness. And what did it feel like when your hand was did it feel like when your hand was did it feel like when your hand was inside of the gelatinous material? Did inside of the gelatinous material? Did inside of the gelatinous material? Did you feel any It was the same tingling you feel any It was the same tingling you feel any It was the same tingling that we were all feeling in the in this that we were all feeling in the in this that we were all feeling in the in this room that you know we had accelerated room that you know we had accelerated room that you know we had accelerated our our our efforts. It's like what it our our our efforts. It's like what it our our our efforts. It's like what it was doing we were doing. Oh, I see. So, was doing we were doing. Oh, I see. So, was doing we were doing. Oh, I see. So, you were you were sort of speeding up to you were you were sort of speeding up to you were you were sort of speeding up to to kind of like in sympathy to to those to kind of like in sympathy to to those to kind of like in sympathy to to those vibration. Exactly. That resonance that vibration. Exactly. That resonance that vibration. Exactly. That resonance that you talk about. Mhm.

you talk about. Mhm. you talk about. Mhm. And uh Carr after the experiment, And uh Carr after the experiment, And uh Carr after the experiment, Carr uh the way he he briefed us on Carr uh the way he he briefed us on Carr uh the way he he briefed us on things was just we'd sit down and have a things was just we'd sit down and have a things was just we'd sit down and have a cup of coffee, you know, and just but cup of coffee, you know, and just but cup of coffee, you know, and just but he'd come out with this wonderful stuff he'd come out with this wonderful stuff he'd come out with this wonderful stuff that, you know, just about the laws of that, you know, just about the laws of that, you know, just about the laws of nature and how they are that is our nature and how they are that is our nature and how they are that is our whole essence. And if we ignore it, whole essence. And if we ignore it, whole essence. And if we ignore it, we're in trouble. You've got to we're in trouble. You've got to we're in trouble. You've got to understand these laws and how they work understand these laws and how they work understand these laws and how they work for anything. If you want a comfortable for anything. If you want a comfortable for anything. If you want a comfortable life, a good life, a happy life and uh life, a good life, a happy life and uh life, a good life, a happy life and uh especially if you want to get anywhere especially if you want to get anywhere especially if you want to get anywhere in technology, you can't use brute in technology, you can't use brute in technology, you can't use brute force. And I had told him about advanced force. And I had told him about advanced force. And I had told him about advanced kinetics and everything. And he kind of kinetics and everything. And he kind of kinetics and everything. And he kind of laughed and he said, "No." He said that laughed and he said, "No." He said that laughed and he said, "No." He said that we uh we uh we uh he told me a lot. he'd worked with Tesla he told me a lot. he'd worked with Tesla he told me a lot. he'd worked with Tesla and he'd known, you know, uh, him for a and he'd known, you know, uh, him for a and he'd known, you know, uh, him for a while and worked with him and, uh, I while and worked with him and, uh, I while and worked with him and, uh, I guess by now you already know about the guess by now you already know about the guess by now you already know about the the story of Tesla going to JP Morgan the story of Tesla going to JP Morgan the story of Tesla going to JP Morgan and, uh, when he showed the wireless uh, and, uh, when he showed the wireless uh, and, uh, when he showed the wireless uh, tower, how to transmit power wirelessly, tower, how to transmit power wirelessly, tower, how to transmit power wirelessly, and he says, "That's a real good idea, and he says, "That's a real good idea, and he says, "That's a real good idea, but how are we going to stick a meter on but how are we going to stick a meter on but how are we going to stick a meter on it?" Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. the essence of it?" Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. the essence of it?" Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. the essence of we are in control is really astounding we are in control is really astounding we are in control is really astounding and and he definitely uh sent the and and he definitely uh sent the and and he definitely uh sent the message no more he said if we go your message no more he said if we go your message no more he said if we go your way Tesla we'll have no more copper way Tesla we'll have no more copper way Tesla we'll have no more copper mills no more lumber we you know these mills no more lumber we you know these mills no more lumber we you know these trees for telephone poles and and wire trees for telephone poles and and wire trees for telephone poles and and wire he said well that's the idea you can

he said well that's the idea you can he said well that's the idea you can stick a a pole in the ground 30 feet and stick a a pole in the ground 30 feet and stick a a pole in the ground 30 feet and 30 feet and we can I'll show you we can 30 feet and we can I'll show you we can 30 feet and we can I'll show you we can get electricity anywhere it's all around get electricity anywhere it's all around get electricity anywhere it's all around us we're living in it and uh Morgan said us we're living in it and uh Morgan said us we're living in it and uh Morgan said no no No way. Tesla, there's no money in no no No way. Tesla, there's no money in no no No way. Tesla, there's no money in that. JP Morgan, from what I understand, that. JP Morgan, from what I understand, that. JP Morgan, from what I understand, was also one of the first uh one of the was also one of the first uh one of the was also one of the first uh one of the pioneers in the military-industrial pioneers in the military-industrial pioneers in the military-industrial complex. He was the man and uh soon complex. He was the man and uh soon complex. He was the man and uh soon afterward, he pretty much picked up the afterward, he pretty much picked up the afterward, he pretty much picked up the bat phone to the Washington and and bat phone to the Washington and and bat phone to the Washington and and said, "Hey, we got this loose cannon on said, "Hey, we got this loose cannon on said, "Hey, we got this loose cannon on our hands." And uh the implications of our hands." And uh the implications of our hands." And uh the implications of the uh conversations uh pretty much uh the uh conversations uh pretty much uh the uh conversations uh pretty much uh took care of burying Tesla from then took care of burying Tesla from then took care of burying Tesla from then forth. And uh I guess from what I forth. And uh I guess from what I forth. And uh I guess from what I understand from reading some uh the understand from reading some uh the understand from reading some uh the journals uh they gathered up all his journals uh they gathered up all his journals uh they gathered up all his equipment and they shipped it off to equipment and they shipped it off to equipment and they shipped it off to Right Pat Right Patterson Air Force Right Pat Right Patterson Air Force Right Pat Right Patterson Air Force Base. And then uh he I guess uh they put Base. And then uh he I guess uh they put Base. And then uh he I guess uh they put him up in a hotel in the Waldorf Atoria him up in a hotel in the Waldorf Atoria him up in a hotel in the Waldorf Atoria and gave him government stipened and the and gave him government stipened and the and gave him government stipened and the and the uh agents were always on the and the uh agents were always on the and the uh agents were always on the crawl prawling everywhere interrupting crawl prawling everywhere interrupting crawl prawling everywhere interrupting his conversations and uh pretty much his conversations and uh pretty much his conversations and uh pretty much filtering out any any connection with filtering out any any connection with filtering out any any connection with the outside world to him. Did Carr the outside world to him. Did Carr the outside world to him. Did Carr mention what happened to Tesla? Did he mention what happened to Tesla? Did he mention what happened to Tesla? Did he talk to you guys about that? Tesla talk to you guys about that? Tesla talk to you guys about that? Tesla became became became discouraged because of the, you know, discouraged because of the, you know, discouraged because of the, you know, the lack of interest in what, you know, the lack of interest in what, you know, the lack of interest in what, you know, I mean, he'd take them a new idea or I mean, he'd take them a new idea or I mean, he'd take them a new idea or bring them bring out a new idea and and bring them bring out a new idea and and bring them bring out a new idea and and show them the simplicity. There's show them the simplicity. There's show them the simplicity. There's nothing to it. And they'd say, "Well, nothing to it. And they'd say, "Well, nothing to it. And they'd say, "Well, there's no money in it. Forget it." I

there's no money in it. Forget it." I there's no money in it. Forget it." I mean and everything he bring up you know mean and everything he bring up you know mean and everything he bring up you know uh so it was Carr's point of view that uh so it was Carr's point of view that uh so it was Carr's point of view that the Tesla was uh discouraged but did the Tesla was uh discouraged but did the Tesla was uh discouraged but did Carr sort of relate his beingounded by Carr sort of relate his beingounded by Carr sort of relate his beingounded by you know the military or being you know you know the military or being you know you know the military or being you know shadowed and so on as being this what shadowed and so on as being this what shadowed and so on as being this what happened to Carr as being the same thing happened to Carr as being the same thing happened to Carr as being the same thing that's was h happened to Tesla. In other that's was h happened to Tesla. In other that's was h happened to Tesla. In other words did he talk about that at all car words did he talk about that at all car words did he talk about that at all car before he died? Well, I guess I don't before he died? Well, I guess I don't before he died? Well, I guess I don't know. You know, Carr didn't talk too know. You know, Carr didn't talk too know. You know, Carr didn't talk too much about the the threats or anything much about the the threats or anything much about the the threats or anything that Tesla had, you know, but uh I was that Tesla had, you know, but uh I was that Tesla had, you know, but uh I was under the impression talking to Carr under the impression talking to Carr under the impression talking to Carr that there were many many u things that there were many many u things that there were many many u things happening that were trying to keep Tesla happening that were trying to keep Tesla happening that were trying to keep Tesla under wraps, trying to keep him quiet. under wraps, trying to keep him quiet. under wraps, trying to keep him quiet. Mhm. And uh Tesla had told him at one Mhm. And uh Tesla had told him at one Mhm. And uh Tesla had told him at one time, he says, you know, I may never time, he says, you know, I may never time, he says, you know, I may never make it in this generation to get these make it in this generation to get these make it in this generation to get these ideas out, but this is all just free ideas out, but this is all just free ideas out, but this is all just free energy. Free is you you got four energy. Free is you you got four energy. Free is you you got four elements, you know, the sun, the the the elements, you know, the sun, the the the elements, you know, the sun, the the the water, the the earth, and the air.

water, the the earth, and the air. water, the the earth, and the air. They're all free. They have been They're all free. They have been They're all free. They have been forever, and they always will be. And forever, and they always will be. And forever, and they always will be. And we're not using them. We're we're we're not using them. We're we're we're not using them. We're we're inventing ways to put meters on them and inventing ways to put meters on them and inventing ways to put meters on them and sell them. They even were selling air at sell them. They even were selling air at sell them. They even were selling air at one time and now they're selling water one time and now they're selling water one time and now they're selling water and you know who would have thought. and you know who would have thought. and you know who would have thought. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, So, So, so Tesla told him all this that I'm so Tesla told him all this that I'm so Tesla told him all this that I'm sharing with you and he he thought all sharing with you and he he thought all sharing with you and he he thought all car was brilliant. He thought that you car was brilliant. He thought that you car was brilliant. He thought that you know he was grasping everything that know he was grasping everything that know he was grasping everything that Tesla was telling him because car had Tesla was telling him because car had Tesla was telling him because car had been into to uh to nature for for years been into to uh to nature for for years been into to uh to nature for for years himself. He said it if I don't make it himself. He said it if I don't make it himself. He said it if I don't make it or when I don't make it, he said, 'I or when I don't make it, he said, 'I or when I don't make it, he said, 'I probably won't make it. You take it and probably won't make it. You take it and probably won't make it. You take it and pass it on. And if you don't make it, pass it on. And if you don't make it, pass it on. And if you don't make it, pass it on. But this is it's it's going pass it on. But this is it's it's going pass it on. But this is it's it's going to get worse because they've already to get worse because they've already to get worse because they've already challenged nature. Man way back there challenged nature. Man way back there challenged nature. Man way back there had challenged nature and what goes had challenged nature and what goes had challenged nature and what goes around comes around. Natural law, it around comes around. Natural law, it around comes around. Natural law, it will come back on them. Basically, Carr will come back on them. Basically, Carr will come back on them. Basically, Carr did exactly what Tesla asked him to do.

did exactly what Tesla asked him to do. did exactly what Tesla asked him to do. Yes. He took it he took it forward. Yes. He took it he took it forward. Yes. He took it he took it forward. Yeah. In a sense, you are taking forward Yeah. In a sense, you are taking forward Yeah. In a sense, you are taking forward what car. Oh, you bet. What car? I mean, what car. Oh, you bet. What car? I mean, what car. Oh, you bet. What car? I mean, you you seem to be the person, you know, you you seem to be the person, you know, you you seem to be the person, you know, that that's like a descendant of car in that that's like a descendant of car in that that's like a descendant of car in that line. Am I right? Yeah. Yeah, I that line. Am I right? Yeah. Yeah, I that line. Am I right? Yeah. Yeah, I would say so. I mean, and it's so would say so. I mean, and it's so would say so. I mean, and it's so amazing to me that you're so unknown. amazing to me that you're so unknown. amazing to me that you're so unknown. Well, I there was there's many reasons Well, I there was there's many reasons Well, I there was there's many reasons for that. Um because uh we would like to for that. Um because uh we would like to for that. Um because uh we would like to actually know why you're so unknown. You actually know why you're so unknown. You actually know why you're so unknown. You know what I mean? Okay. Okay. I will know what I mean? Okay. Okay. I will know what I mean? Okay. Okay. I will tell you they were all tell you they were all tell you they were all hit and miss. The car was always on and hit and miss. The car was always on and hit and miss. The car was always on and I I'd stay up all night. We we'd be I I'd stay up all night. We we'd be I I'd stay up all night. We we'd be looking at the stars and talk all night looking at the stars and talk all night looking at the stars and talk all night and never need any sleep. I mean, I'd go and never need any sleep. I mean, I'd go and never need any sleep. I mean, I'd go to work the next day and just feel to work the next day and just feel to work the next day and just feel pumped up all the time talking to this pumped up all the time talking to this pumped up all the time talking to this guy. I mean, he would just wow. And I guy. I mean, he would just wow. And I guy. I mean, he would just wow. And I said, you know, don't you know, don't said, you know, don't you know, don't said, you know, don't you know, don't worry. We're going to get this thing worry. We're going to get this thing worry. We're going to get this thing going here. And um he said, well, going here. And um he said, well, going here. And um he said, well, they're closing in. They know he's in they're closing in. They know he's in they're closing in. They know he's in California now. They they and we were on California now. They they and we were on California now. They they and we were on some of our experiments on some of the some of our experiments on some of the some of our experiments on some of the crafts and we operated different crafts and we operated different crafts and we operated different principles and some of them would create principles and some of them would create principles and some of them would create a a corona around the outside of the we a a corona around the outside of the we a a corona around the outside of the we we'd operate these little the dialectric we'd operate these little the dialectric we'd operate these little the dialectric uh principles of the ionization process.

uh principles of the ionization process. uh principles of the ionization process. And so And so And so even though it was daylight sometimes even though it was daylight sometimes even though it was daylight sometimes you you'd see these things and the you you'd see these things and the you you'd see these things and the people in the valley were were people in the valley were were people in the valley were were that was the era of flying saucers and that was the era of flying saucers and that was the era of flying saucers and stuff. So they oh my god this place got stuff. So they oh my god this place got stuff. So they oh my god this place got flying sauces around here and stuff. flying sauces around here and stuff. flying sauces around here and stuff. Well that and the fact that the Well that and the fact that the Well that and the fact that the powers that were trying to powers that were trying to powers that were trying to reduce reduce reduce cars activities was following him trying cars activities was following him trying cars activities was following him trying to find him. So he said, "Well, we we're to find him. So he said, "Well, we we're to find him. So he said, "Well, we we're just going to have to keep working on just going to have to keep working on just going to have to keep working on this." Carr had made arrangements this." Carr had made arrangements this." Carr had made arrangements and I went with him and I went with him and I went with him to meet with a representative of General to meet with a representative of General to meet with a representative of General Motors car company Motors car company Motors car company and that I think it was either Riverside and that I think it was either Riverside and that I think it was either Riverside or or or I think it was Riverside. I think it was Riverside. I think it was Riverside. The guy had comm committed to meet with The guy had comm committed to meet with The guy had comm committed to meet with Carr because Carr told him a few things Carr because Carr told him a few things Carr because Carr told him a few things that that interested him and uh so I that that interested him and uh so I that that interested him and uh so I went with him and Rapulti was there and went with him and Rapulti was there and went with him and Rapulti was there and I think Aaho was there and uh in a very I think Aaho was there and uh in a very I think Aaho was there and uh in a very uh precise way car said you know we can uh precise way car said you know we can uh precise way car said you know we can levitate these machines now you know levitate these machines now you know levitate these machines now you know there's no you know we're get off the there's no you know we're get off the there's no you know we're get off the earth we're killing a lot animals were earth we're killing a lot animals were earth we're killing a lot animals were destroying the the plant life. He says, destroying the the plant life. He says, destroying the the plant life. He says, you know, within a within within a year you know, within a within within a year you know, within a within within a year we'll have these things going, you know, we'll have these things going, you know, we'll have these things going, you know, and we can start with the automobile and we can start with the automobile and we can start with the automobile that's obsolete. We can get these things

that's obsolete. We can get these things that's obsolete. We can get these things going and then homes and which is my going and then homes and which is my going and then homes and which is my interest. I've always wanted, you know, interest. I've always wanted, you know, interest. I've always wanted, you know, why not like the Jetston for instance, why not like the Jetston for instance, why not like the Jetston for instance, you know, floating homes and then maybe you know, floating homes and then maybe you know, floating homes and then maybe cities and then maybe, you know, cities and then maybe, you know, cities and then maybe, you know, countries. Who who knows the end of it? countries. Who who knows the end of it? countries. Who who knows the end of it? But um this guy got real real uh But um this guy got real real uh But um this guy got real real uh aggressive and said, you know, you put aggressive and said, you know, you put aggressive and said, you know, you put them up there, car, and we'll shoot him them up there, car, and we'll shoot him them up there, car, and we'll shoot him down. That was his words. You put them down. That was his words. You put them down. That was his words. You put them up and we'll shoot him down. Wow. up and we'll shoot him down. Wow. up and we'll shoot him down. Wow. And I was flabbergasted like And I was flabbergasted like And I was flabbergasted like why? What? He says, "Well, you're you're why? What? He says, "Well, you're you're why? What? He says, "Well, you're you're you're you're advocating an energy field you're you're advocating an energy field you're you're advocating an energy field that that um that that um that that um that there's no money involved. We can't that there's no money involved. We can't that there's no money involved. We can't you know, we have no means of you know, we have no means of you know, we have no means of controlling it." It was his premise controlling it." It was his premise controlling it." It was his premise here, right? No doubt. Because you're here, right? No doubt. Because you're here, right? No doubt. Because you're pulling energy out of the air, which is pulling energy out of the air, which is pulling energy out of the air, which is all around us, and using that to to all around us, and using that to to all around us, and using that to to transport or teleport or whatever. So, transport or teleport or whatever. So, transport or teleport or whatever. So, so he basically I mean, you guys just so he basically I mean, you guys just so he basically I mean, you guys just walked out of there and said, "Okay." walked out of there and said, "Okay." walked out of there and said, "Okay." What did Car say? Did he say, "Okay, I What did Car say? Did he say, "Okay, I What did Car say? Did he say, "Okay, I won't do it anymore." Or do you say, you won't do it anymore." Or do you say, you won't do it anymore." Or do you say, you know, what did Car say? I'm just curious know, what did Car say? I'm just curious know, what did Car say? I'm just curious after that.

after that. after that. I don't remember his exact words, but it I don't remember his exact words, but it I don't remember his exact words, but it was very very It was very very u sort of was very very It was very very u sort of was very very It was very very u sort of a standoff. was very very good the way a standoff. was very very good the way a standoff. was very very good the way he said really yeah he said you know he he said really yeah he said you know he he said really yeah he said you know he says it's only a matter of time till it says it's only a matter of time till it says it's only a matter of time till it comes back and and and uh you can't stop comes back and and and uh you can't stop comes back and and and uh you can't stop us can't stop it yeah it's it's it's us can't stop it yeah it's it's it's us can't stop it yeah it's it's it's here whether it's here today or tomorrow here whether it's here today or tomorrow here whether it's here today or tomorrow it's it's here and it's it's rapidly it's it's here and it's it's rapidly it's it's here and it's it's rapidly approaching the point where it has to be approaching the point where it has to be approaching the point where it has to be not not want to be but has to be and uh not not want to be but has to be and uh not not want to be but has to be and uh he said I'm sorry you don't you know see he said I'm sorry you don't you know see he said I'm sorry you don't you know see our point because we were willing to our point because we were willing to our point because we were willing to work with you, you could fund us and we work with you, you could fund us and we work with you, you could fund us and we could show you what we could do. I mean, could show you what we could do. I mean, could show you what we could do. I mean, the guy wasn't interested. So, we just the guy wasn't interested. So, we just the guy wasn't interested. So, we just we just left. And that was a, you know, we just left. And that was a, you know, we just left. And that was a, you know, another another another acquaintance that I had with the system acquaintance that I had with the system acquaintance that I had with the system that we live in. I mean, I I can't I that we live in. I mean, I I can't I that we live in. I mean, I I can't I could never accept. We went back to could never accept. We went back to could never accept. We went back to Apple Valley and said, "Let's get the Apple Valley and said, "Let's get the Apple Valley and said, "Let's get the let's get the 45 foot craft going. Let's let's get the 45 foot craft going. Let's let's get the 45 foot craft going. Let's have people on board. Let's let's you have people on board. Let's let's you have people on board. Let's let's you know and we'll we'll document it and know and we'll we'll document it and know and we'll we'll document it and we'll have the proof and then we'll find we'll have the proof and then we'll find we'll have the proof and then we'll find ways and we had the understanding group ways and we had the understanding group ways and we had the understanding group finding ways to let people know what finding ways to let people know what finding ways to let people know what what we're going to do. We're going to what we're going to do. We're going to what we're going to do. We're going to have live demonstrations eventually.

have live demonstrations eventually. have live demonstrations eventually. Make a long story short, we went through Make a long story short, we went through Make a long story short, we went through stages and we finally got to uh the big stages and we finally got to uh the big stages and we finally got to uh the big craft. There was there was actually two craft. There was there was actually two craft. There was there was actually two of them, but the there was the one craft of them, but the there was the one craft of them, but the there was the one craft that we were ready to try and experiment that we were ready to try and experiment that we were ready to try and experiment with. And how how big was that again? 45 with. And how how big was that again? 45 with. And how how big was that again? 45 ft in diameter. ft in diameter. ft in diameter. And uh we were by that time, you know, And uh we were by that time, you know, And uh we were by that time, you know, we didn't have any fences or anything we didn't have any fences or anything we didn't have any fences or anything around us and you could see the thing around us and you could see the thing around us and you could see the thing from the roads and stuff and we we knew from the roads and stuff and we we knew from the roads and stuff and we we knew that, you know, only a matter of time that, you know, only a matter of time that, you know, only a matter of time till the liloo started getting there. till the liloo started getting there. till the liloo started getting there. But we didn't care. We knew we had to do But we didn't care. We knew we had to do But we didn't care. We knew we had to do something before because now General something before because now General something before because now General Motors is going to go tell whoever what Motors is going to go tell whoever what Motors is going to go tell whoever what we're, you know, what we're proposing we're, you know, what we're proposing we're, you know, what we're proposing and and it won't be long before they and and it won't be long before they and and it won't be long before they they find out what we're doing. Well, he they find out what we're doing. Well, he they find out what we're doing. Well, he says, "Come on, we're going to go." says, "Come on, we're going to go." says, "Come on, we're going to go." He got us into the briefing room and he He got us into the briefing room and he He got us into the briefing room and he told there was three of us and I don't told there was three of us and I don't told there was three of us and I don't remember who the who the other two guys remember who the who the other two guys remember who the who the other two guys were now. It wasn't Repi, it wasn't were now. It wasn't Repi, it wasn't were now. It wasn't Repi, it wasn't Colton, it wasn't uh Aaho, Colton, it wasn't uh Aaho, Colton, it wasn't uh Aaho, but there was three of us and he said, but there was three of us and he said, but there was three of us and he said, "What you're going to do, you're going "What you're going to do, you're going "What you're going to do, you're going to get on board. We're going to go down to get on board. We're going to go down to get on board. We're going to go down range." We had a 65 mile uh range in uh range." We had a 65 mile uh range in uh range." We had a 65 mile uh range in uh Apple Valley and Apple Valley and Apple Valley and the um where we eventually wound up is the um where we eventually wound up is the um where we eventually wound up is about 10 miles I think down range. Uh he about 10 miles I think down range. Uh he about 10 miles I think down range. Uh he says, "You're going to you're going to says, "You're going to you're going to says, "You're going to you're going to get on board and we're going to we're get on board and we're going to we're get on board and we're going to we're going to go someplace and then we're going to go someplace and then we're going to go someplace and then we're going to come back and that's all." And

going to come back and that's all." And going to come back and that's all." And he said, "But uh I want to tell you he said, "But uh I want to tell you he said, "But uh I want to tell you ahead of time, your brain will ahead of time, your brain will ahead of time, your brain will no longer be the same. Well, no longer be the same. Well, no longer be the same. Well, you will lose it. You will you will lose it. You will you will lose it. You will because it won't understand and it won't because it won't understand and it won't because it won't understand and it won't comprehend what's happening. So use your comprehend what's happening. So use your comprehend what's happening. So use your mind, use your feelings, come from your mind, use your feelings, come from your mind, use your feelings, come from your heart, meditate, go into a focus point heart, meditate, go into a focus point heart, meditate, go into a focus point and go to your higher thoughts and and go to your higher thoughts and and go to your higher thoughts and feelings, you know, then rather than feelings, you know, then rather than feelings, you know, then rather than than uh worrying about what was going to than uh worrying about what was going to than uh worrying about what was going to happen. happen. happen. So he said it's going to be a strange So he said it's going to be a strange So he said it's going to be a strange experience for you. Um but it will experience for you. Um but it will experience for you. Um but it will happen and we will document it. And so happen and we will document it. And so happen and we will document it. And so we got on board and uh what it was there we got on board and uh what it was there we got on board and uh what it was there uh on board it was just a small uh on board it was just a small uh on board it was just a small like a crystal ball in the center. It like a crystal ball in the center. It like a crystal ball in the center. It wasn't actually in the center. It was wasn't actually in the center. It was wasn't actually in the center. It was off center a little bit. And it had a I off center a little bit. And it had a I off center a little bit. And it had a I think it was a laser. I don't know, but think it was a laser. I don't know, but think it was a laser. I don't know, but there was a white light coming up from there was a white light coming up from there was a white light coming up from the bottom of it. You know, it's shining the bottom of it. You know, it's shining the bottom of it. You know, it's shining up through it. And it just beautifully up through it. And it just beautifully up through it. And it just beautifully broke the color spectrum into like from broke the color spectrum into like from broke the color spectrum into like from infrared, red, red, red, red, red, red, infrared, red, red, red, red, red, red, infrared, red, red, red, red, red, red, red, orange, orange, yellow, yellow all red, orange, orange, yellow, yellow all red, orange, orange, yellow, yellow all the way around 360 degrees.

the way around 360 degrees. the way around 360 degrees. and to anywhere you wanted to go, any and to anywhere you wanted to go, any and to anywhere you wanted to go, any degree you wanted to go in the color degree you wanted to go in the color degree you wanted to go in the color spectrum was there. I said, "Boy, that's spectrum was there. I said, "Boy, that's spectrum was there. I said, "Boy, that's beautiful." And uh we'd been briefed on beautiful." And uh we'd been briefed on beautiful." And uh we'd been briefed on it, but I didn't until I saw it. I it, but I didn't until I saw it. I it, but I didn't until I saw it. I didn't realize, you know, what uh what didn't realize, you know, what uh what didn't realize, you know, what uh what was going on. He said, "Okay, just was going on. He said, "Okay, just was going on. He said, "Okay, just relax. relax. relax. We're going to go to an area We're going to go to an area We're going to go to an area that symbolizes." He used to use symbols that symbolizes." He used to use symbols that symbolizes." He used to use symbols a lot. I mean he'd say you know talking a lot. I mean he'd say you know talking a lot. I mean he'd say you know talking is useless you have to use higher than is useless you have to use higher than is useless you have to use higher than talking is symbols is to to reach the talking is symbols is to to reach the talking is symbols is to to reach the mind thinking in pictures in pictures mind thinking in pictures in pictures mind thinking in pictures in pictures right he said talking is in fact off the right he said talking is in fact off the right he said talking is in fact off the subject for a minute I I used to one of subject for a minute I I used to one of subject for a minute I I used to one of my great my great my great when I used to read a lot one of my when I used to read a lot one of my when I used to read a lot one of my great greatest people was Khal Gabbron great greatest people was Khal Gabbron great greatest people was Khal Gabbron and he wrote the book the prophet and in and he wrote the book the prophet and in and he wrote the book the prophet and in there he said one of his sayings was there he said one of his sayings was there he said one of his sayings was half of what I say to to you is half of what I say to to you is half of what I say to to you is meaningless, but it's necessary so that meaningless, but it's necessary so that meaningless, but it's necessary so that the other half may reach you. And I the other half may reach you. And I the other half may reach you. And I thought, well, now I get it. You know thought, well, now I get it. You know thought, well, now I get it. You know that you you have to come from the soul that you you have to come from the soul that you you have to come from the soul or the heart or it's no good. It's just or the heart or it's no good. It's just or the heart or it's no good. It's just going around in circles.

going around in circles. going around in circles. There's something about choosing the There's something about choosing the There's something about choosing the blue spectrum in order to with your blue spectrum in order to with your blue spectrum in order to with your mind. Aquamarine. Aquamarine. mind. Aquamarine. Aquamarine. mind. Aquamarine. Aquamarine. Aquamarine. The car. We were in touch. I Aquamarine. The car. We were in touch. I Aquamarine. The car. We were in touch. I don't know if we had walkie talk. I don't know if we had walkie talk. I don't know if we had walkie talk. I don't know. But I remember we were in don't know. But I remember we were in don't know. But I remember we were in touch and uh he said, "Okay, we're going touch and uh he said, "Okay, we're going touch and uh he said, "Okay, we're going to Aquamarine. That's over there." And to Aquamarine. That's over there." And to Aquamarine. That's over there." And um um um hang on, boys. Let's go. So we sat there hang on, boys. Let's go. So we sat there hang on, boys. Let's go. So we sat there and I'm just doing this from memory. And and I'm just doing this from memory. And and I'm just doing this from memory. And I'm So you're all collectively focusing I'm So you're all collectively focusing I'm So you're all collectively focusing the same collective thought, right, feed the same collective thought, right, feed the same collective thought, right, feed this energy in a in a center of a focal this energy in a in a center of a focal this energy in a in a center of a focal point, which was this ball, right? And point, which was this ball, right? And point, which was this ball, right? And this ball then started just closing down this ball then started just closing down this ball then started just closing down and focusing on aquamarine. the whole and focusing on aquamarine. the whole and focusing on aquamarine. the whole thing became aquamarine and I said my thing became aquamarine and I said my thing became aquamarine and I said my god this is this is how did he do that god this is this is how did he do that god this is this is how did he do that you know and he told us later that we you know and he told us later that we you know and he told us later that we were a part of it doing it because we were a part of it doing it because we were a part of it doing it because we were focused on it and I oh this is were focused on it and I oh this is were focused on it and I oh this is great this bio feedback mechanism of great this bio feedback mechanism of great this bio feedback mechanism of synergistic yeah yeah so so we got we synergistic yeah yeah so so we got we synergistic yeah yeah so so we got we got focused on it and then I was waiting got focused on it and then I was waiting got focused on it and then I was waiting for the thing to move now and uh nothing for the thing to move now and uh nothing for the thing to move now and uh nothing seemed to happen nothing you you know, seemed to happen nothing you you know, seemed to happen nothing you you know, and then Carr said, "Okay, boys, get out and then Carr said, "Okay, boys, get out and then Carr said, "Okay, boys, get out of the craft and uh see what see what's of the craft and uh see what see what's of the craft and uh see what see what's going on."

going on." going on." Well, didn't it work or what happened? Well, didn't it work or what happened? Well, didn't it work or what happened? He said, "Come on, get out of the He said, "Come on, get out of the He said, "Come on, get out of the craft." We got out and we were downrange craft." We got out and we were downrange craft." We got out and we were downrange 10 miles where this aquamarine 10 miles where this aquamarine 10 miles where this aquamarine area was. And uh like in within this area was. And uh like in within this area was. And uh like in within this whole process, you're talking about whole process, you're talking about whole process, you're talking about probably a few minutes. Oh, yeah. Yeah. probably a few minutes. Oh, yeah. Yeah. probably a few minutes. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I'll get to the timing in a minute on I'll get to the timing in a minute on I'll get to the timing in a minute on it. But so he said, "All right, pick up it. But so he said, "All right, pick up it. But so he said, "All right, pick up rocks, put them in your pocket, take rocks, put them in your pocket, take rocks, put them in your pocket, take some grass or whatever you can find, some grass or whatever you can find, some grass or whatever you can find, some uh tumble weed or whatever you can some uh tumble weed or whatever you can some uh tumble weed or whatever you can find and and get acquainted with where find and and get acquainted with where find and and get acquainted with where you're at because when you when you get you're at because when you when you get you're at because when you when you get back, you're not going to you're not back, you're not going to you're not back, you're not going to you're not going to remember any of this. I mean, going to remember any of this. I mean, going to remember any of this. I mean, that was the the gist of the whole that was the the gist of the whole that was the the gist of the whole thing." So we did and we got back on thing." So we did and we got back on thing." So we did and we got back on board and then we were back board and then we were back board and then we were back and and and we got out of the craft, went into we got out of the craft, went into we got out of the craft, went into debriefing and said, "Well, what the debriefing and said, "Well, what the debriefing and said, "Well, what the what happened?" You know, we thought, what happened?" You know, we thought, what happened?" You know, we thought, you know, it didn't work, did it? You you know, it didn't work, did it? You you know, it didn't work, did it? You don't think it worked? Check your don't think it worked? Check your don't think it worked? Check your pockets. And so we checked our pockets pockets. And so we checked our pockets pockets. And so we checked our pockets and here's these dang rocks and I had and here's these dang rocks and I had and here's these dang rocks and I had grass stains. I had everything, you grass stains. I had everything, you grass stains. I had everything, you know. I said, "Oh my god." But you did know. I said, "Oh my god." But you did know. I said, "Oh my god." But you did you have me? You didn't have memory of you have me? You didn't have memory of you have me? You didn't have memory of those? No memory. Amazing. No memory.

those? No memory. Amazing. No memory. those? No memory. Amazing. No memory. The memory was right. No memory at all. The memory was right. No memory at all. The memory was right. No memory at all. I remember the I remembered later later I remember the I remembered later later I remember the I remembered later later being there and picking up the rocks, being there and picking up the rocks, being there and picking up the rocks, but then there was just like no like it but then there was just like no like it but then there was just like no like it was a dream or something. Yeah. Like it was a dream or something. Yeah. Like it was a dream or something. Yeah. Like it was a dream. Exactly. Like you advance was a dream. Exactly. Like you advance was a dream. Exactly. Like you advance your imagination to a point and then and your imagination to a point and then and your imagination to a point and then and then uh then uh then uh you'd forget about it. Wow. And so I I I you'd forget about it. Wow. And so I I I you'd forget about it. Wow. And so I I I thought this is the most incredible thought this is the most incredible thought this is the most incredible experience I've ever had. And he said, experience I've ever had. And he said, experience I've ever had. And he said, "No, no, it's simple. Your brain is "No, no, it's simple. Your brain is "No, no, it's simple. Your brain is there to operate your body. You you're there to operate your body. You you're there to operate your body. You you're in a vessel here. It's an illusionary in a vessel here. It's an illusionary in a vessel here. It's an illusionary vessel that that people don't realize vessel that that people don't realize vessel that that people don't realize because we're creating it in micros because we're creating it in micros because we're creating it in micros secondsonds from one second to the secondsonds from one second to the secondsonds from one second to the other. These shutters are opening and other. These shutters are opening and other. These shutters are opening and shutting and creating all this reality shutting and creating all this reality shutting and creating all this reality you see around you. It doesn't really you see around you. It doesn't really you see around you. It doesn't really exist. It's all spirit. It's all energy. exist. It's all spirit. It's all energy. exist. It's all spirit. It's all energy. But we're creating this But we're creating this But we're creating this And uh he was blown us away, you know. And uh he was blown us away, you know. And uh he was blown us away, you know. And he said, "But your brain can has a And he said, "But your brain can has a And he said, "But your brain can has a capacity limit. It goes to a certain capacity limit. It goes to a certain capacity limit. It goes to a certain point of its of its uh responsibility.

point of its of its uh responsibility. point of its of its uh responsibility. And unless And unless And unless it's in touch with the mind, unless it it's in touch with the mind, unless it it's in touch with the mind, unless it consents to be in touch with the mind, consents to be in touch with the mind, consents to be in touch with the mind, which the higher mind, right? Well, which the higher mind, right? Well, which the higher mind, right? Well, yeah. That's the mind of all of us yeah. That's the mind of all of us yeah. That's the mind of all of us because we're all one. And unless it because we're all one. And unless it because we're all one. And unless it gets in touch with that, it doesn't know gets in touch with that, it doesn't know gets in touch with that, it doesn't know what's going on. Am I uh am I to presume what's going on. Am I uh am I to presume what's going on. Am I uh am I to presume that at that that moment that you had that at that that moment that you had that at that that moment that you had that that flight of that 10mi distance, that that flight of that 10mi distance, that that flight of that 10mi distance, your brain was being stretched like a your brain was being stretched like a your brain was being stretched like a rubber band, but when you went back, you rubber band, but when you went back, you rubber band, but when you went back, you went back faster than the memories of went back faster than the memories of went back faster than the memories of the experience could come back and your the experience could come back and your the experience could come back and your your brain could realize it. Yeah. your brain could realize it. Yeah. your brain could realize it. Yeah. Something like that. I don't know, days Something like that. I don't know, days Something like that. I don't know, days later or months later, you you could later or months later, you you could later or months later, you you could remember, like you said, picking up the remember, like you said, picking up the remember, like you said, picking up the rocks then. Yeah. But I don't remember rocks then. Yeah. But I don't remember rocks then. Yeah. But I don't remember any any any movement whatsoever. I mean, any any any movement whatsoever. I mean, any any any movement whatsoever. I mean, I don't you don't remember the craft I don't you don't remember the craft I don't you don't remember the craft moving or you don't move your body moving or you don't move your body moving or you don't move your body moving and and and the ball turned to moving and and and the ball turned to moving and and and the ball turned to aquamarine and they said, "Get out of aquamarine and they said, "Get out of aquamarine and they said, "Get out of the craft." We got out and I there was the craft." We got out and I there was the craft." We got out and I there was motion there. I don't remember too much motion there. I don't remember too much motion there. I don't remember too much of that, but I remember it being of that, but I remember it being of that, but I remember it being outside. And then I guess we got back in outside. And then I guess we got back in outside. And then I guess we got back in and back to the to the base. But to us, and back to the to the base. But to us, and back to the to the base. But to us, it was at least 15 minutes. Normal time.

it was at least 15 minutes. Normal time. it was at least 15 minutes. Normal time. Normal time. Yeah. I figured, you know, Normal time. Yeah. I figured, you know, Normal time. Yeah. I figured, you know, oh, we'd be gone about 15 minutes. So oh, we'd be gone about 15 minutes. So oh, we'd be gone about 15 minutes. So there's a time variation going on here. there's a time variation going on here. there's a time variation going on here. So, and Carr explained it. He said like, So, and Carr explained it. He said like, So, and Carr explained it. He said like, well, it's it's simple. well, it's it's simple. well, it's it's simple. People don't realize it. Man in a sense People don't realize it. Man in a sense People don't realize it. Man in a sense created time. Time doesn't exist in a in created time. Time doesn't exist in a in created time. Time doesn't exist in a in a in in a in essence. It it does when we a in in a in essence. It it does when we a in in a in essence. It it does when we create it and we have a beginning and an create it and we have a beginning and an create it and we have a beginning and an end to something. We call that time. But end to something. We call that time. But end to something. We call that time. But he says in a greater reality there is no he says in a greater reality there is no he says in a greater reality there is no time there. And what time there. And what time there. And what that's like the eternal now. Yeah. And that's like the eternal now. Yeah. And that's like the eternal now. Yeah. And with that that we pegged it at 15 with that that we pegged it at 15 with that that we pegged it at 15 minutes and he just a few seconds he minutes and he just a few seconds he minutes and he just a few seconds he says it just went outside and back in says it just went outside and back in says it just went outside and back in time. I mean it's just uh what you call time. I mean it's just uh what you call time. I mean it's just uh what you call it. What you created is what it is. And it. What you created is what it is. And it. What you created is what it is. And since then I've had experiences that you since then I've had experiences that you since then I've had experiences that you know have told me know have told me know have told me that just don't talk about it to anybody that just don't talk about it to anybody that just don't talk about it to anybody because you know it doesn't uh because you know it doesn't uh because you know it doesn't uh most people are are not interested most people are are not interested most people are are not interested because they're tied up with the because they're tied up with the because they're tied up with the creature comforts and so forth. And uh a creature comforts and so forth. And uh a creature comforts and so forth. And uh a lot of people when I start getting close lot of people when I start getting close lot of people when I start getting close to it, they get a little fearful because to it, they get a little fearful because to it, they get a little fearful because they don't understand, you know, that they don't understand, you know, that they don't understand, you know, that and they of course think I'm What and they of course think I'm What and they of course think I'm What happened after I mean you you made that happened after I mean you you made that happened after I mean you you made that that test flight, right? Right. And so that test flight, right? Right. And so that test flight, right? Right. And so you didn't you didn't make that many you didn't you didn't make that many you didn't you didn't make that many test flights after that. Is that right?

test flights after that. Is that right? test flights after that. Is that right? It you guys got closed down somehow. I It you guys got closed down somehow. I It you guys got closed down somehow. I did the one test flight and then we did did the one test flight and then we did did the one test flight and then we did did some things that were there at the did some things that were there at the did some things that were there at the plant but we didn't we didn't uh go down plant but we didn't we didn't uh go down plant but we didn't we didn't uh go down range or anything because it was just range or anything because it was just range or anything because it was just about within two weeks after that about within two weeks after that about within two weeks after that that the uh FBI and uh whoever these that the uh FBI and uh whoever these that the uh FBI and uh whoever these other guys CIA or what no such agency other guys CIA or what no such agency other guys CIA or what no such agency weirdos they came in to the plant they weirdos they came in to the plant they weirdos they came in to the plant they came over with all their bells and came over with all their bells and came over with all their bells and whistles and said that uh you know uh whistles and said that uh you know uh whistles and said that uh you know uh you're you're shutting down right now. you're you're shutting down right now. you're you're shutting down right now. And uh we asked why and they said, And uh we asked why and they said, And uh we asked why and they said, "Well, because of your threat to "Well, because of your threat to "Well, because of your threat to overthrow the monetary system of the overthrow the monetary system of the overthrow the monetary system of the United States of America." That was United States of America." That was United States of America." That was their ploy. That was their and the their ploy. That was their and the their ploy. That was their and the issues of national security and what issues of national security and what issues of national security and what have you. Mhm. And were confiscating have you. Mhm. And were confiscating have you. Mhm. And were confiscating everything. And they went into the to everything. And they went into the to everything. And they went into the to the uh you know the offices and they the uh you know the offices and they the uh you know the offices and they went into the lab and you know they went into the lab and you know they went into the lab and you know they started just confiscating everything. started just confiscating everything. started just confiscating everything. And then they uh briefed us or debriefed debriefed. Yes.

briefed us or debriefed debriefed. Yes. And told us in essence, you know, this And told us in essence, you know, this And told us in essence, you know, this is this is you you guys are wrong. is this is you you guys are wrong. is this is you you guys are wrong. You're you're you're going to you're You're you're you're going to you're You're you're you're going to you're you're attempting to overthrow the you're attempting to overthrow the you're attempting to overthrow the monetary system. And this is what this monetary system. And this is what this monetary system. And this is what this is what we're going to do to you if you is what we're going to do to you if you is what we're going to do to you if you don't cooperate. Sign here, here, and don't cooperate. Sign here, here, and don't cooperate. Sign here, here, and here. Well, did they have you sign here. Well, did they have you sign here. Well, did they have you sign something? No, I didn't. I don't something? No, I didn't. I don't something? No, I didn't. I don't remember signing anything. And what remember signing anything. And what remember signing anything. And what about Carr? Yeah, they might have had about Carr? Yeah, they might have had about Carr? Yeah, they might have had him. He was he got really really uh his him. He was he got really really uh his him. He was he got really really uh his health started going fast after that health started going fast after that health started going fast after that happened and I I don't know. So I don't happened and I I don't know. So I don't happened and I I don't know. So I don't know, you know, so this you were working know, you know, so this you were working know, you know, so this you were working on this night and day pretty much at on this night and day pretty much at on this night and day pretty much at that point. So you guys disbanded based that point. So you guys disbanded based that point. So you guys disbanded based on these people coming in. Yeah. And on these people coming in. Yeah. And on these people coming in. Yeah. And they said you're no longer allowed to on they said you're no longer allowed to on they said you're no longer allowed to on no uncertain terms. No uncertain terms no uncertain terms. No uncertain terms no uncertain terms. No uncertain terms and we're watching you, you know. So and we're watching you, you know. So and we're watching you, you know. So what what what did you do then? What I what what what did you do then? What I what what what did you do then? What I mean what did you do? Did you just go mean what did you do? Did you just go mean what did you do? Did you just go home and what you know did you try to home and what you know did you try to home and what you know did you try to work in secret at all at that point or work in secret at all at that point or work in secret at all at that point or anything like that? I tried to do it on anything like that? I tried to do it on anything like that? I tried to do it on my own which I found out is my own which I found out is my own which I found out is it's you can't do it. You got to have it's you can't do it. You got to have it's you can't do it. You got to have other people. So you and Carr did you other people. So you and Carr did you other people. So you and Carr did you stay in touch after that? Well they told stay in touch after that? Well they told stay in touch after that? Well they told us not to. So I uh through understanding us not to. So I uh through understanding us not to. So I uh through understanding I was in touch with Carr and and uh I I was in touch with Carr and and uh I I was in touch with Carr and and uh I said we'll get together again. But he he said we'll get together again. But he he said we'll get together again. But he he was really uh he said, "No, I don't I was really uh he said, "No, I don't I was really uh he said, "No, I don't I don't think we're going to make it this don't think we're going to make it this don't think we're going to make it this time.

time. time. [Music] Oh. Oh. [Music] Oh. Oh. [Music]