Technical vs Creative Email Strategy for B2B Lead Gen | Write Emails That Demand Replies | Hunter.io

just to give you a quick overview of of just to give you a quick overview of of what's coming up today. Like I said, what's coming up today. Like I said, what's coming up today. Like I said, I'll be moderating in in the background. I'll be moderating in in the background. I'll be moderating in in the background. Uh we're going to kick off uh with Matt Uh we're going to kick off uh with Matt Uh we're going to kick off uh with Matt going through a little bit around uh the going through a little bit around uh the going through a little bit around uh the the findings of of analyzing 31 million the findings of of analyzing 31 million the findings of of analyzing 31 million emails. That's a lot of emails to emails. That's a lot of emails to emails. That's a lot of emails to analyze and I'm sure he's got some great analyze and I'm sure he's got some great analyze and I'm sure he's got some great takeaways for you. Then we're going to takeaways for you. Then we're going to takeaways for you. Then we're going to get into really the meat of today, which get into really the meat of today, which get into really the meat of today, which is the technical versus creative writing is the technical versus creative writing is the technical versus creative writing aspect. Oliver is is definitely the aspect. Oliver is is definitely the aspect. Oliver is is definitely the person to listen to on that. I'm sure person to listen to on that. I'm sure person to listen to on that. I'm sure Matt will add quite a lot of flavor to Matt will add quite a lot of flavor to Matt will add quite a lot of flavor to that as well where we're going to talk that as well where we're going to talk that as well where we're going to talk about getting the basics right of about getting the basics right of about getting the basics right of writing your outreach. Uh then we're writing your outreach. Uh then we're writing your outreach. Uh then we're going to share a little bit more via going to share a little bit more via going to share a little bit more via Matt through how you can actually put Matt through how you can actually put Matt through how you can actually put this to the test. I'm sure some of you this to the test. I'm sure some of you this to the test. I'm sure some of you have seen me reach out to you about our have seen me reach out to you about our have seen me reach out to you about our messaging madness uh email writing messaging madness uh email writing messaging madness uh email writing tournament. Love for you to hear more tournament. Love for you to hear more tournament. Love for you to hear more about that and get involved. And then about that and get involved. And then about that and get involved. And then there'll be a Q&A section dedicated uh there'll be a Q&A section dedicated uh there'll be a Q&A section dedicated uh to the last 25 or so minutes of today's to the last 25 or so minutes of today's to the last 25 or so minutes of today's session. Just some housekeeping before I session. Just some housekeeping before I session. Just some housekeeping before I fade away into the background. If you fade away into the background. If you fade away into the background. If you have any questions, uh please use the have any questions, uh please use the have any questions, uh please use the questions tab that you'll see in the questions tab that you'll see in the questions tab that you'll see in the toolbar at the bottom right of your toolbar at the bottom right of your toolbar at the bottom right of your screen. Uh if you want to have a chat screen. Uh if you want to have a chat screen. Uh if you want to have a chat with us in terms of conversating, there with us in terms of conversating, there with us in terms of conversating, there is a uh there's a chat section as well.

is a uh there's a chat section as well. is a uh there's a chat section as well. We'll have plenty of time dedicated to We'll have plenty of time dedicated to We'll have plenty of time dedicated to questions at the end. So, please make questions at the end. So, please make questions at the end. So, please make sure you make a note and add them as we sure you make a note and add them as we sure you make a note and add them as we go along. And yeah, thank you guys. Take go along. And yeah, thank you guys. Take go along. And yeah, thank you guys. Take it away and can't wait to hear what you it away and can't wait to hear what you it away and can't wait to hear what you can share. can share. can share. >> Thanks, James. >> Thanks, James. >> Thanks, James. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> All right, the truth. I love it. I get >> All right, the truth. I love it. I get >> All right, the truth. I love it. I get to be the truth bringer. Um, so what is to be the truth bringer. Um, so what is to be the truth bringer. Um, so what is the truth about email outreach in 2026? the truth about email outreach in 2026? the truth about email outreach in 2026? Um, and it has changed. So let's let's Um, and it has changed. So let's let's Um, and it has changed. So let's let's take a look. Let's get into the details. take a look. Let's get into the details. take a look. Let's get into the details. First, so that you understand where this First, so that you understand where this First, so that you understand where this data is coming from and how we would data is coming from and how we would data is coming from and how we would call it the truth. Um, we do a lot of call it the truth. Um, we do a lot of call it the truth. Um, we do a lot of primary research here at Hunter to drive primary research here at Hunter to drive primary research here at Hunter to drive not only product ideas, product not only product ideas, product not only product ideas, product direction, but also to make sure that we direction, but also to make sure that we direction, but also to make sure that we can feed that out to our customers and can feed that out to our customers and can feed that out to our customers and our audience so that you're not just our audience so that you're not just our audience so that you're not just reading about, you know, the next cool reading about, you know, the next cool reading about, you know, the next cool thing that you found on Reddit, but you thing that you found on Reddit, but you thing that you found on Reddit, but you actually have some data and some actually have some data and some actually have some data and some evidence to kind of back this up. And so evidence to kind of back this up. And so evidence to kind of back this up. And so what we did was analyzed 31 million what we did was analyzed 31 million what we did was analyzed 31 million outreach emails um to help provide outreach emails um to help provide outreach emails um to help provide essentially a benchmark of what leads to essentially a benchmark of what leads to essentially a benchmark of what leads to success in cold outreach. I did not hand success in cold outreach. I did not hand success in cold outreach. I did not hand read all 31 million. So I do have other read all 31 million. So I do have other read all 31 million. So I do have other things, but I can confidently tell you things, but I can confidently tell you things, but I can confidently tell you that the analysis um has lifted some that the analysis um has lifted some that the analysis um has lifted some really solid insights. Um so here's some really solid insights. Um so here's some really solid insights. Um so here's some highle stats that I think is really good highle stats that I think is really good highle stats that I think is really good to kind of frame this. The first is to kind of frame this. The first is to kind of frame this. The first is about 30% of cold emails are opened. So about 30% of cold emails are opened. So about 30% of cold emails are opened. So open rates are still pretty healthy. If open rates are still pretty healthy. If open rates are still pretty healthy. If you compare that to normal marketing you compare that to normal marketing you compare that to normal marketing outreach, 30% is a is a pretty good outreach, 30% is a is a pretty good outreach, 30% is a is a pretty good number. Um the average email sequence number. Um the average email sequence number. Um the average email sequence that you run now the whole sequence has that you run now the whole sequence has that you run now the whole sequence has about a 4.5% reply rate. Now this is up

about a 4.5% reply rate. Now this is up about a 4.5% reply rate. Now this is up from last year. Um so people are getting from last year. Um so people are getting from last year. Um so people are getting better and that's a good sign. It is better and that's a good sign. It is better and that's a good sign. It is proof that uh some of the things that proof that uh some of the things that proof that uh some of the things that we've been sharing are working and we've been sharing are working and we've been sharing are working and that's fantastic. that's fantastic. that's fantastic. The the downsides though, decision The the downsides though, decision The the downsides though, decision makers are not getting a lot of great makers are not getting a lot of great makers are not getting a lot of great content from people. And this is I think content from people. And this is I think content from people. And this is I think surprising for some, not surprising for surprising for some, not surprising for surprising for some, not surprising for others depending on what side of the others depending on what side of the others depending on what side of the inbox you're on, but 69% of those that inbox you're on, but 69% of those that inbox you're on, but 69% of those that we spoke with see a lot of AI slop and we spoke with see a lot of AI slop and we spoke with see a lot of AI slop and they can just tell like when they read they can just tell like when they read they can just tell like when they read the email, it just looks like AI slop the email, it just looks like AI slop the email, it just looks like AI slop from the beginning. Unfortunately, that from the beginning. Unfortunately, that from the beginning. Unfortunately, that feels kind of like everything right now, feels kind of like everything right now, feels kind of like everything right now, but it's definitely true of cold but it's definitely true of cold but it's definitely true of cold outreach as well. 65% say that emails outreach as well. 65% say that emails outreach as well. 65% say that emails feel too pushy. I think that's really feel too pushy. I think that's really feel too pushy. I think that's really important feedback from the audience. important feedback from the audience. important feedback from the audience. Um, AI slop, you know, the best thing Um, AI slop, you know, the best thing Um, AI slop, you know, the best thing you can do there is try not to use AI you can do there is try not to use AI you can do there is try not to use AI slop as part of your outreach efforts. slop as part of your outreach efforts. slop as part of your outreach efforts. But in terms of making them feel too But in terms of making them feel too But in terms of making them feel too pushy or not feel too pushy, that's pushy or not feel too pushy, that's pushy or not feel too pushy, that's something you can really control. 61% something you can really control. 61% something you can really control. 61% say that they find the outreach emails say that they find the outreach emails say that they find the outreach emails irrelevant.

irrelevant. irrelevant. So, this is I I think there's clearly a So, this is I I think there's clearly a So, this is I I think there's clearly a theme. It's either it's slap or it's theme. It's either it's slap or it's theme. It's either it's slap or it's irrelevant or it's too pushy. The point irrelevant or it's too pushy. The point irrelevant or it's too pushy. The point is the messages aren't landing with the is the messages aren't landing with the is the messages aren't landing with the audience the majority of the time. In audience the majority of the time. In audience the majority of the time. In fact, 3.6% of emails bounce despite the fact, 3.6% of emails bounce despite the fact, 3.6% of emails bounce despite the fact that we have tons of tools around fact that we have tons of tools around fact that we have tons of tools around deliverability. But if you notice the deliverability. But if you notice the deliverability. But if you notice the percentages, 3.6% that's not your percentages, 3.6% that's not your percentages, 3.6% that's not your biggest problem, right? The bigger biggest problem, right? The bigger biggest problem, right? The bigger problem is in that 60 to 70% of feedback problem is in that 60 to 70% of feedback problem is in that 60 to 70% of feedback we get from users or from decision we get from users or from decision we get from users or from decision makers that say they're just not getting makers that say they're just not getting makers that say they're just not getting relevant emails. relevant emails. relevant emails. Now, the good news is that cold outreach Now, the good news is that cold outreach Now, the good news is that cold outreach is not dead. These metrics do not is not dead. These metrics do not is not dead. These metrics do not indicate that this is doom and gloom. indicate that this is doom and gloom. indicate that this is doom and gloom. We're not here to scare everybody off. We're not here to scare everybody off. We're not here to scare everybody off. The next slide actually, I think, is a The next slide actually, I think, is a The next slide actually, I think, is a really good indicator of progress and really good indicator of progress and really good indicator of progress and the direction we all need to head. and the direction we all need to head. and the direction we all need to head. and that is that almost 60% of decision that is that almost 60% of decision that is that almost 60% of decision makers are getting at least one valuable makers are getting at least one valuable makers are getting at least one valuable email a month. That's a cold outreach.

email a month. That's a cold outreach. email a month. That's a cold outreach. So the the good news is yes, lots of So the the good news is yes, lots of So the the good news is yes, lots of them are complaining. That means your them are complaining. That means your them are complaining. That means your competitors are bad at this. By and competitors are bad at this. By and competitors are bad at this. By and large, the majority of people doing this large, the majority of people doing this large, the majority of people doing this are bad at it. What that means is are bad at it. What that means is are bad at it. What that means is there's a lot of opportunity for you to there's a lot of opportunity for you to there's a lot of opportunity for you to improve. It means there's a lot of improve. It means there's a lot of improve. It means there's a lot of opportunity for us to continue to bring opportunity for us to continue to bring opportunity for us to continue to bring good ideas to help to make the product good ideas to help to make the product good ideas to help to make the product easier to use. But more importantly, easier to use. But more importantly, easier to use. But more importantly, decision makers are still saying they're decision makers are still saying they're decision makers are still saying they're open to this because they are still open to this because they are still open to this because they are still getting value from the channel. That's getting value from the channel. That's getting value from the channel. That's the most important piece because that is the most important piece because that is the most important piece because that is the center of whether or not this is a the center of whether or not this is a the center of whether or not this is a channel that you should invest in the channel that you should invest in the channel that you should invest in the evidence, the data, the improvement. It evidence, the data, the improvement. It evidence, the data, the improvement. It is getting harder, but it's not getting is getting harder, but it's not getting is getting harder, but it's not getting harder to differentiate. And that's I harder to differentiate. And that's I harder to differentiate. And that's I think the really good point. If you're think the really good point. If you're think the really good point. If you're trying to just use a bunch of things trying to just use a bunch of things trying to just use a bunch of things that you've seen other people use, that you've seen other people use, that you've seen other people use, that's probably not going to get you that's probably not going to get you that's probably not going to get you there. But if you're really building a there. But if you're really building a there. But if you're really building a relevant case for why they should have a relevant case for why they should have a relevant case for why they should have a conversation with you and not being too conversation with you and not being too conversation with you and not being too pushy, you're already off to a good pushy, you're already off to a good pushy, you're already off to a good start. And I think luckily we've got a start. And I think luckily we've got a start. And I think luckily we've got a lot of content today to try to help lot of content today to try to help lot of content today to try to help steer you in that direction of where steer you in that direction of where steer you in that direction of where should you be thinking about a technical should you be thinking about a technical should you be thinking about a technical point of view and where you should be point of view and where you should be point of view and where you should be optimizing that versus on the creative optimizing that versus on the creative optimizing that versus on the creative side. If you've been in webinars with us side. If you've been in webinars with us side. If you've been in webinars with us before, you know I like to harp on the before, you know I like to harp on the before, you know I like to harp on the creative side a lot. So luckily you're creative side a lot. So luckily you're creative side a lot. So luckily you're not going to have to hear about that not going to have to hear about that not going to have to hear about that from me again. We've got Oliver here to from me again. We've got Oliver here to from me again. We've got Oliver here to talk about that. And I think that's the talk about that. And I think that's the talk about that. And I think that's the best best way to transition to what's best best way to transition to what's best best way to transition to what's coming next is how do we help you coming next is how do we help you coming next is how do we help you between the technical and the creative between the technical and the creative between the technical and the creative about email outreach. So Oliver, take it about email outreach. So Oliver, take it about email outreach. So Oliver, take it away.

away. away. >> Awesome. I appreciate it. So looking at >> Awesome. I appreciate it. So looking at >> Awesome. I appreciate it. So looking at technical versus creative, these are the technical versus creative, these are the technical versus creative, these are the two most important pillars when it comes two most important pillars when it comes two most important pillars when it comes to creating an an efficient outbound to creating an an efficient outbound to creating an an efficient outbound system. So you kind of want to look at system. So you kind of want to look at system. So you kind of want to look at it like ying and yang almost. So in it like ying and yang almost. So in it like ying and yang almost. So in order to have an effective campaign, you order to have an effective campaign, you order to have an effective campaign, you need to kind of create that balance and need to kind of create that balance and need to kind of create that balance and harmony in the universe or in this case harmony in the universe or in this case harmony in the universe or in this case your your email setup. So we've got our your your email setup. So we've got our your your email setup. So we've got our technical and our creative. So we'll go technical and our creative. So we'll go technical and our creative. So we'll go through each of these sections a little through each of these sections a little through each of these sections a little bit more in depth as we progress through bit more in depth as we progress through bit more in depth as we progress through the deck. But the big things we want to the deck. But the big things we want to the deck. But the big things we want to focus on on the technical side, it's focus on on the technical side, it's focus on on the technical side, it's going to be our domains and email going to be our domains and email going to be our domains and email accounts. So what we actually set up, accounts. So what we actually set up, accounts. So what we actually set up, what we're sending with. Then we'll what we're sending with. Then we'll what we're sending with. Then we'll progress into the warm-up phase where we progress into the warm-up phase where we progress into the warm-up phase where we talk about how important it is to give talk about how important it is to give talk about how important it is to give the domains and email accounts we set up the domains and email accounts we set up the domains and email accounts we set up ample time to essentially integrate into ample time to essentially integrate into ample time to essentially integrate into the rest of the email world. Then we'll the rest of the email world. Then we'll the rest of the email world. Then we'll go through HTML versus plain text, which go through HTML versus plain text, which go through HTML versus plain text, which sounds a little bit more scary than it sounds a little bit more scary than it sounds a little bit more scary than it actually is. We'll really simplify that actually is. We'll really simplify that actually is. We'll really simplify that and actually explain what it is. Then and actually explain what it is. Then and actually explain what it is. Then we'll go through the value in tracking we'll go through the value in tracking we'll go through the value in tracking things. Then on the creative side, which things. Then on the creative side, which things. Then on the creative side, which is my favorite part, that's the fun is my favorite part, that's the fun is my favorite part, that's the fun side. We'll just kind of talk about the side. We'll just kind of talk about the side. We'll just kind of talk about the different strategies we can roll out different strategies we can roll out different strategies we can roll out with in 2026 and what they actually come with in 2026 and what they actually come with in 2026 and what they actually come down to. So, we'll we'll actually get down to. So, we'll we'll actually get down to. So, we'll we'll actually get into the nitty-gritty of what research into the nitty-gritty of what research into the nitty-gritty of what research and relevance can look like for you and and relevance can look like for you and and relevance can look like for you and your offer, linking those challenges to your offer, linking those challenges to your offer, linking those challenges to the value of your business, then some the value of your business, then some the value of your business, then some writing frameworks to convey those writing frameworks to convey those writing frameworks to convey those values, and then just the psychological values, and then just the psychological values, and then just the psychological side of the the campaigns as well. We

side of the the campaigns as well. We side of the the campaigns as well. We obviously want people to read our emails obviously want people to read our emails obviously want people to read our emails regardless of how good or bad they are. regardless of how good or bad they are. regardless of how good or bad they are. If we're not kind of interrupting If we're not kind of interrupting If we're not kind of interrupting patterns, then people aren't going to patterns, then people aren't going to patterns, then people aren't going to read it. People aren't going to pay read it. People aren't going to pay read it. People aren't going to pay attention. So, we'll we'll get through the So, we'll we'll get through the technical part. Now, this is it's nice technical part. Now, this is it's nice technical part. Now, this is it's nice because if you do this right the first because if you do this right the first because if you do this right the first time and you do it well, then you're set time and you do it well, then you're set time and you do it well, then you're set up for success in the long term. So, up for success in the long term. So, up for success in the long term. So, it's kind of like going to the the it's kind of like going to the the it's kind of like going to the the dentist. If you floss and you brush your dentist. If you floss and you brush your dentist. If you floss and you brush your teeth every day, it's good to still teeth every day, it's good to still teeth every day, it's good to still check up on it, but you don't check up on it, but you don't check up on it, but you don't necessarily need to make it a go-to necessarily need to make it a go-to necessarily need to make it a go-to every single day. So, we'll we'll give every single day. So, we'll we'll give every single day. So, we'll we'll give you those frameworks. We'll show you how you those frameworks. We'll show you how you those frameworks. We'll show you how to floss. We'll show you how to brush to floss. We'll show you how to brush to floss. We'll show you how to brush your teeth. So, you don't have to worry your teeth. So, you don't have to worry your teeth. So, you don't have to worry about this maybe. So the the technical basics what maybe. So the the technical basics what we really want to dive into here is as I we really want to dive into here is as I we really want to dive into here is as I shared on the previous slide we want to shared on the previous slide we want to shared on the previous slide we want to understand domains and email accounts.

understand domains and email accounts. understand domains and email accounts. So what is a domain? So for example So what is a domain? So for example So what is a domain? So for example hunter.io is going to be Matt's primary hunter.io is going to be Matt's primary hunter.io is going to be Matt's primary domain. That's their main website. domain. That's their main website. domain. That's their main website. That's what all of their internal That's what all of their internal That's what all of their internal communications run through. So a communications run through. So a communications run through. So a subdomain might be rather than hunter.io subdomain might be rather than hunter.io subdomain might be rather than hunter.io is the main domain. The subdomain is is the main domain. The subdomain is is the main domain. The subdomain is going to be huntergrowth.io IO for going to be huntergrowth.io IO for going to be huntergrowth.io IO for example, you add in that extra word that example, you add in that extra word that example, you add in that extra word that still ties to the value proposition. And still ties to the value proposition. And still ties to the value proposition. And the reason we do that is because the reason we do that is because the reason we do that is because as efficient as outbound email can be as efficient as outbound email can be as efficient as outbound email can be with all of these things around with all of these things around with all of these things around compliance and all these different tools compliance and all these different tools compliance and all these different tools like Google and Microsoft, they have like Google and Microsoft, they have like Google and Microsoft, they have their own kind of filters that they like their own kind of filters that they like their own kind of filters that they like to operate from. So if you overstep, you to operate from. So if you overstep, you to operate from. So if you overstep, you step on their toes, then they might flag step on their toes, then they might flag step on their toes, then they might flag your main domain, which we do not want your main domain, which we do not want your main domain, which we do not want because we don't want to impact the because we don't want to impact the because we don't want to impact the health of our ability to send emails. If health of our ability to send emails. If health of our ability to send emails. If we send important things out, if we we send important things out, if we we send important things out, if we receive important things, we're trying receive important things, we're trying receive important things, we're trying to grow business. That's not something to grow business. That's not something to grow business. That's not something we want to worry about. So we create we want to worry about. So we create we want to worry about. So we create subdomains so we don't have to worry subdomains so we don't have to worry subdomains so we don't have to worry about that. Gives us a little bit more about that. Gives us a little bit more about that. Gives us a little bit more leeway to make mistakes and also scale leeway to make mistakes and also scale leeway to make mistakes and also scale scale the campaigns. So, a subdomain, scale the campaigns. So, a subdomain, scale the campaigns. So, a subdomain, like I said, can be huntergrowth.io like I said, can be huntergrowth.io like I said, can be huntergrowth.io as opposed to your main domain. And then as opposed to your main domain. And then as opposed to your main domain. And then underneath that is the email accounts.

underneath that is the email accounts. underneath that is the email accounts. So, we'll set up new infrastructure. So, So, we'll set up new infrastructure. So, So, we'll set up new infrastructure. So, we've got our subdomain, we've got our subdomain, we've got our subdomain, huntergrowth.io. huntergrowth.io. huntergrowth.io. Then, we've got the email accounts Then, we've got the email accounts Then, we've got the email accounts underneath that. So, Matt's email might underneath that. So, Matt's email might underneath that. So, Matt's email might be matt.io. be matt.io. be matt.io. That's his main one. It's linked to the That's his main one. It's linked to the That's his main one. It's linked to the main domain. For the subdomain, for the main domain. For the subdomain, for the main domain. For the subdomain, for the new email accounts, we might make Matt new email accounts, we might make Matt new email accounts, we might make Matt Huntergrowth.io. io. So it's a new email Huntergrowth.io. io. So it's a new email Huntergrowth.io. io. So it's a new email on the new subdomain. And the benefit of on the new subdomain. And the benefit of on the new subdomain. And the benefit of sending outbound email is we can create sending outbound email is we can create sending outbound email is we can create multiple email accounts under this same multiple email accounts under this same multiple email accounts under this same subdomain. So it could be subdomain. So it could be subdomain. So it could be [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], matt [email protected], matt [email protected], matt [email protected], matt.tharpunergrowth.io. matt.tharpunergrowth.io. matt.tharpunergrowth.io. Because now we've got the infrastructure Because now we've got the infrastructure Because now we've got the infrastructure to send more emails per account. We've to send more emails per account. We've to send more emails per account. We've got more accounts able to send. And got more accounts able to send. And got more accounts able to send. And we're doing all of this without risking we're doing all of this without risking we're doing all of this without risking the health of our primary domain. And the health of our primary domain. And the health of our primary domain. And this is super important especially as this is super important especially as this is super important especially as you scale up because we want to the the you scale up because we want to the the you scale up because we want to the the ideal setup that I like to run is we buy ideal setup that I like to run is we buy ideal setup that I like to run is we buy 10 subdomains. So that could be 10 subdomains. So that could be 10 subdomains. So that could be huntergrowth.io, hunter team.io, all huntergrowth.io, hunter team.io, all huntergrowth.io, hunter team.io, all these different subdomains and then we these different subdomains and then we these different subdomains and then we put three email accounts under each one.

put three email accounts under each one. put three email accounts under each one. So a solid setup gives you more than So a solid setup gives you more than So a solid setup gives you more than enough data to work with all the way enough data to work with all the way enough data to work with all the way from top of funnel to bottom of funnel. from top of funnel to bottom of funnel. from top of funnel to bottom of funnel. is going to be 10 subdomains, then three is going to be 10 subdomains, then three is going to be 10 subdomains, then three email accounts under each domain. So, email accounts under each domain. So, email accounts under each domain. So, we've got 30 total accounts. And the we've got 30 total accounts. And the we've got 30 total accounts. And the recommended there, four email accounts. recommended there, four email accounts. recommended there, four email accounts. You can either do two to three on the You can either do two to three on the You can either do two to three on the safe side or three to five if you're safe side or three to five if you're safe side or three to five if you're really trying to scale up, but I've really trying to scale up, but I've really trying to scale up, but I've always found that three email accounts always found that three email accounts always found that three email accounts per subdomain is the sweet spot. per subdomain is the sweet spot. per subdomain is the sweet spot. Then, we want to understand what warm-up Then, we want to understand what warm-up Then, we want to understand what warm-up is once we've got our infrastructure set is once we've got our infrastructure set is once we've got our infrastructure set up. So, what warm-up is, it's up. So, what warm-up is, it's up. So, what warm-up is, it's essentially you want to set it as a essentially you want to set it as a essentially you want to set it as a minimum of two weeks. And there's lots minimum of two weeks. And there's lots minimum of two weeks. And there's lots of softwares you can do this through. of softwares you can do this through. of softwares you can do this through. So, you set up a new domain, you set up So, you set up a new domain, you set up So, you set up a new domain, you set up a new account, you want it to be sending a new account, you want it to be sending a new account, you want it to be sending and receiving emails for a minimum of and receiving emails for a minimum of and receiving emails for a minimum of two weeks before you start to actually two weeks before you start to actually two weeks before you start to actually send outbound. Because if you buy a new send outbound. Because if you buy a new send outbound. Because if you buy a new account, you start blasting out outbound account, you start blasting out outbound account, you start blasting out outbound emails, Google, Microsoft, they're going emails, Google, Microsoft, they're going emails, Google, Microsoft, they're going to flag you because they're not to flag you because they're not to flag you because they're not necessarily a fan of cold email systems.

necessarily a fan of cold email systems. necessarily a fan of cold email systems. they allow it doesn't necessarily mean they allow it doesn't necessarily mean they allow it doesn't necessarily mean they're they're favoring it. So, you they're they're favoring it. So, you they're they're favoring it. So, you want to give it at least two weeks to want to give it at least two weeks to want to give it at least two weeks to warm up, then you eventually continue to warm up, then you eventually continue to warm up, then you eventually continue to scale it up. And we'll go through kind scale it up. And we'll go through kind scale it up. And we'll go through kind of more about warm-up in the next slide, of more about warm-up in the next slide, of more about warm-up in the next slide, but we want to jump into what HTML but we want to jump into what HTML but we want to jump into what HTML versus plain text is. I said on versus plain text is. I said on versus plain text is. I said on previously this is it might sound a previously this is it might sound a previously this is it might sound a little scary. What does HTML stand for? little scary. What does HTML stand for? little scary. What does HTML stand for? I'll be honest, I don't know. But plain I'll be honest, I don't know. But plain I'll be honest, I don't know. But plain text, the the difference is so HTML text, the the difference is so HTML text, the the difference is so HTML emails, it's going to be graphic design. emails, it's going to be graphic design. emails, it's going to be graphic design. And it's going to be those marketing And it's going to be those marketing And it's going to be those marketing emails. You're going to have links in emails. You're going to have links in emails. You're going to have links in it, bold text, GIFs. For outbound cold it, bold text, GIFs. For outbound cold it, bold text, GIFs. For outbound cold email, you want to avoid those. The more email, you want to avoid those. The more email, you want to avoid those. The more simple you can make the email, the simple you can make the email, the simple you can make the email, the better because, as I'm sure most of you better because, as I'm sure most of you better because, as I'm sure most of you guys know, depending on the size of your guys know, depending on the size of your guys know, depending on the size of your company, you might have gone through company, you might have gone through company, you might have gone through compliance training, some cyber security compliance training, some cyber security compliance training, some cyber security checks. They do not want you clicking on checks. They do not want you clicking on checks. They do not want you clicking on links. It's kind of 101. Don't click on links. It's kind of 101. Don't click on links. It's kind of 101. Don't click on links from people you don't know. And links from people you don't know. And links from people you don't know. And nowadays, there's so many spam filters nowadays, there's so many spam filters nowadays, there's so many spam filters to not even give people the opportunity to not even give people the opportunity to not even give people the opportunity to click links from people they don't to click links from people they don't to click links from people they don't know. So, if you're sending links, if know. So, if you're sending links, if know. So, if you're sending links, if you're sending pictures, it might not you're sending pictures, it might not you're sending pictures, it might not even reach their inbox to begin with.

even reach their inbox to begin with. even reach their inbox to begin with. So, if you can just send a simple plain So, if you can just send a simple plain So, if you can just send a simple plain text email as you're doing cold text email as you're doing cold text email as you're doing cold outreach, that's going to be your go-to. outreach, that's going to be your go-to. outreach, that's going to be your go-to. And then for tracking, the next big And then for tracking, the next big And then for tracking, the next big bullet point when you're tracking open bullet point when you're tracking open bullet point when you're tracking open rates, that also comes with a cookie rates, that also comes with a cookie rates, that also comes with a cookie essentially. So when people open the essentially. So when people open the essentially. So when people open the email, it'll mark it as opened. That's email, it'll mark it as opened. That's email, it'll mark it as opened. That's another thing that providers don't another thing that providers don't another thing that providers don't necessarily like coming through because necessarily like coming through because necessarily like coming through because it can not always be the the healthiest it can not always be the the healthiest it can not always be the the healthiest for the inbox or the recipient. So as for the inbox or the recipient. So as for the inbox or the recipient. So as you're tracking open rates, we actually you're tracking open rates, we actually you're tracking open rates, we actually recommend to not track open rates recommend to not track open rates recommend to not track open rates initially. You can until you find a initially. You can until you find a initially. You can until you find a subject line that you know is getting subject line that you know is getting subject line that you know is getting opened. Matt shared that. Was it average opened. Matt shared that. Was it average opened. Matt shared that. Was it average open rates are 30% right now, Matt? open rates are 30% right now, Matt? open rates are 30% right now, Matt? >> That's right. Yeah. So, if you find >> That's right. Yeah. So, if you find >> That's right. Yeah. So, if you find something 30% or above, then rock and something 30% or above, then rock and something 30% or above, then rock and roll with that. But if you're below roll with that. But if you're below roll with that. But if you're below that, you can keep testing, keep that, you can keep testing, keep that, you can keep testing, keep tracking open rates. But once you get tracking open rates. But once you get tracking open rates. But once you get above that point, just turn open above that point, just turn open above that point, just turn open tracking off because one, it can impact tracking off because one, it can impact tracking off because one, it can impact deliverability in a negative way and deliverability in a negative way and deliverability in a negative way and it's not always accurate. So, it can it's not always accurate. So, it can it's not always accurate. So, it can kind of skew your numbers and the way kind of skew your numbers and the way kind of skew your numbers and the way you look at your campaign.

you look at your campaign. you look at your campaign. >> That's a really important point. It it >> That's a really important point. It it >> That's a really important point. It it could be too easy to think, well, I need could be too easy to think, well, I need could be too easy to think, well, I need that open tracking because that's so so that open tracking because that's so so that open tracking because that's so so valuable. or go the other direction, valuable. or go the other direction, valuable. or go the other direction, which is, oh, then get it out of there. which is, oh, then get it out of there. which is, oh, then get it out of there. I don't want anything to trigger. But I don't want anything to trigger. But I don't want anything to trigger. But it's absolutely practical, especially if it's absolutely practical, especially if it's absolutely practical, especially if you're warming up a new idea or a new you're warming up a new idea or a new you're warming up a new idea or a new campaign or you're testing new messaging campaign or you're testing new messaging campaign or you're testing new messaging or it's a new audience. You you need or it's a new audience. You you need or it's a new audience. You you need that signal early on. Um, and so you that signal early on. Um, and so you that signal early on. Um, and so you want the open tracking for a little want the open tracking for a little want the open tracking for a little window of time, but just know it's going window of time, but just know it's going window of time, but just know it's going to skew your data probably in the to skew your data probably in the to skew your data probably in the negative a bit, but as soon as you get negative a bit, but as soon as you get negative a bit, but as soon as you get enough signal, definitely take that out. enough signal, definitely take that out. enough signal, definitely take that out. That's in going to increase your your That's in going to increase your your That's in going to increase your your open rate. it's going to increase your open rate. it's going to increase your open rate. it's going to increase your throughput. We've seen reply rates go throughput. We've seen reply rates go throughput. We've seen reply rates go up. So, yeah, definitely that's a really up. So, yeah, definitely that's a really up. So, yeah, definitely that's a really important point to make sure that uh important point to make sure that uh important point to make sure that uh that lands clearly. And I also want to that lands clearly. And I also want to that lands clearly. And I also want to before we move off of this real quick, before we move off of this real quick, before we move off of this real quick, Oliver, I just want to add Oliver, I just want to add Oliver, I just want to add the the closer your email looks to a the the closer your email looks to a the the closer your email looks to a sales email, like a true like I wrote sales email, like a true like I wrote sales email, like a true like I wrote this to Oliver to try to get him to this to Oliver to try to get him to this to Oliver to try to get him to consider having a conversation with me consider having a conversation with me consider having a conversation with me about my service. like ISPs can't email about my service. like ISPs can't email about my service. like ISPs can't email service providers, email um uh ESPs service providers, email um uh ESPs service providers, email um uh ESPs can't block those, right? Like they know can't block those, right? Like they know can't block those, right? Like they know that selling selling is a part of just that selling selling is a part of just that selling selling is a part of just running a business and they can't create running a business and they can't create running a business and they can't create rules that block that entirely or else, rules that block that entirely or else, rules that block that entirely or else, you know, all of our businesses are you know, all of our businesses are you know, all of our businesses are injured. So they know they have to injured. So they know they have to injured. So they know they have to thread this needle, right? Like they thread this needle, right? Like they thread this needle, right? Like they they have to be careful about it.

they have to be careful about it. they have to be careful about it. Knowing what they're trying to protect Knowing what they're trying to protect Knowing what they're trying to protect and what they're not trying to protect and what they're not trying to protect and what they're not trying to protect is a really good thing to inform your is a really good thing to inform your is a really good thing to inform your creative. Um Oliver is going to talk creative. Um Oliver is going to talk creative. Um Oliver is going to talk about that a bunch now, but I just I about that a bunch now, but I just I about that a bunch now, but I just I wanted to really double down on that wanted to really double down on that wanted to really double down on that point that they're not trying to block point that they're not trying to block point that they're not trying to block all cold outreach. They're just trying all cold outreach. They're just trying all cold outreach. They're just trying to limit the bad cold outreach, which is to limit the bad cold outreach, which is to limit the bad cold outreach, which is actually in all of our favor anyway. >> Yeah, 100%. If we can follow the best >> Yeah, 100%. If we can follow the best practices, then then we're good. Now, practices, then then we're good. Now, practices, then then we're good. Now, one thing we like to look at when one thing we like to look at when one thing we like to look at when determining email infrastructure, determining email infrastructure, determining email infrastructure, there's two primary companies and setups there's two primary companies and setups there's two primary companies and setups that that kind of everybody leans that that kind of everybody leans that that kind of everybody leans towards. There's Google and there's towards. There's Google and there's towards. There's Google and there's Microsoft. So, based on Hunter's data, Microsoft. So, based on Hunter's data, Microsoft. So, based on Hunter's data, Google has a much higher reply rate. So, Google has a much higher reply rate. So, Google has a much higher reply rate. So, 5.9% compared to Microsoft accounts, 4%. 5.9% compared to Microsoft accounts, 4%. 5.9% compared to Microsoft accounts, 4%. From my perspective on this, I lean From my perspective on this, I lean From my perspective on this, I lean towards Google 90% of the time. I think towards Google 90% of the time. I think towards Google 90% of the time. I think most people in here, I also recommend most people in here, I also recommend most people in here, I also recommend you to lean towards Google email you to lean towards Google email you to lean towards Google email accounts. The only and that's because a accounts. The only and that's because a accounts. The only and that's because a majority of businesses are on Google.

majority of businesses are on Google. majority of businesses are on Google. Now, if we're moving up market, we're Now, if we're moving up market, we're Now, if we're moving up market, we're going after maybe like larger, going after maybe like larger, going after maybe like larger, medium-sized businesses, enterprise medium-sized businesses, enterprise medium-sized businesses, enterprise clients. A lot of those businesses clients. A lot of those businesses clients. A lot of those businesses typically operate with Microsoft Teams typically operate with Microsoft Teams typically operate with Microsoft Teams internally. So, the way you kind of want internally. So, the way you kind of want internally. So, the way you kind of want to look at it is look at your ICP. 90% to look at it is look at your ICP. 90% to look at it is look at your ICP. 90% of you, like I said, are going to lean of you, like I said, are going to lean of you, like I said, are going to lean towards Google. If you're going after towards Google. If you're going after towards Google. If you're going after enterprise-sized clients, maybe lean enterprise-sized clients, maybe lean enterprise-sized clients, maybe lean towards Microsoft because Google towards Microsoft because Google towards Microsoft because Google accounts like to send and receive emails accounts like to send and receive emails accounts like to send and receive emails from other Google accounts. Microsoft from other Google accounts. Microsoft from other Google accounts. Microsoft likes to send and receive emails from likes to send and receive emails from likes to send and receive emails from other Microsoft accounts. So, majority other Microsoft accounts. So, majority other Microsoft accounts. So, majority of you, Google Workspace is the way to of you, Google Workspace is the way to of you, Google Workspace is the way to go when setting up these subdomains, go when setting up these subdomains, go when setting up these subdomains, these email accounts. If you are these email accounts. If you are these email accounts. If you are targeting larger clients, then you might targeting larger clients, then you might targeting larger clients, then you might want to maybe go half and half. Half want to maybe go half and half. Half want to maybe go half and half. Half Google, half Microsoft. And then there's Google, half Microsoft. And then there's Google, half Microsoft. And then there's settings on certain providers that you settings on certain providers that you settings on certain providers that you can do deliverability matching as well. can do deliverability matching as well. can do deliverability matching as well. But for the most part, I think if you've But for the most part, I think if you've But for the most part, I think if you've got a Google setup, you're you're ready got a Google setup, you're you're ready got a Google setup, you're you're ready to rock and roll. You'll get good reply to rock and roll. You'll get good reply to rock and roll. You'll get good reply rates. So checklist, we're almost through the So checklist, we're almost through the technical setup and then we can get into technical setup and then we can get into technical setup and then we can get into the fun stuff. But this is very the fun stuff. But this is very the fun stuff. But this is very important. So we want to set up important. So we want to set up important. So we want to set up subdomains. Like I said, we a good setup subdomains. Like I said, we a good setup subdomains. Like I said, we a good setup depending on what scale you're looking depending on what scale you're looking depending on what scale you're looking at. I typically recommend 10 subdomains at. I typically recommend 10 subdomains at. I typically recommend 10 subdomains with three email accounts linked to with three email accounts linked to with three email accounts linked to each. Now, you can do three to five each. Now, you can do three to five each. Now, you can do three to five emails per subdomain. If you really want emails per subdomain. If you really want emails per subdomain. If you really want to scale, you can do two to three if you to scale, you can do two to three if you to scale, you can do two to three if you want to be a bit more conservative. So, want to be a bit more conservative. So, want to be a bit more conservative. So, three is going to be that sweet spot.

three is going to be that sweet spot. three is going to be that sweet spot. And we want to warm up these email And we want to warm up these email And we want to warm up these email accounts. So, we kind of touched on the accounts. So, we kind of touched on the accounts. So, we kind of touched on the last slide, but I want to get into it last slide, but I want to get into it last slide, but I want to get into it here. So, as we're scaling these things here. So, as we're scaling these things here. So, as we're scaling these things up, we don't just buy email accounts and up, we don't just buy email accounts and up, we don't just buy email accounts and then we can instantly start sending then we can instantly start sending then we can instantly start sending dozens of emails per day from each dozens of emails per day from each dozens of emails per day from each account. That's just going to get us account. That's just going to get us account. That's just going to get us flagged. So, we give them two weeks to flagged. So, we give them two weeks to flagged. So, we give them two weeks to warm up. And this is typically done by warm up. And this is typically done by warm up. And this is typically done by softwares of them sending and receiving softwares of them sending and receiving softwares of them sending and receiving emails in and out. So, it just looks emails in and out. So, it just looks emails in and out. So, it just looks like a natural email account. You want like a natural email account. You want like a natural email account. You want to do this for a minimum of two weeks. to do this for a minimum of two weeks. to do this for a minimum of two weeks. The longer you can do it, the better. If The longer you can do it, the better. If The longer you can do it, the better. If you can do it for six months, by all you can do it for six months, by all you can do it for six months, by all means, do it. But the minimum you want means, do it. But the minimum you want means, do it. But the minimum you want to do it is at least two weeks. And then to do it is at least two weeks. And then to do it is at least two weeks. And then from there, you can continuously scale from there, you can continuously scale from there, you can continuously scale it up. So we've got on the screen, it it up. So we've got on the screen, it it up. So we've got on the screen, it says sends from 15 to 45 per day. When says sends from 15 to 45 per day. When says sends from 15 to 45 per day. When you first get started, I even like to you first get started, I even like to you first get started, I even like to start it lower than that. So on day one, start it lower than that. So on day one, start it lower than that. So on day one, we'll send two emails per account. On we'll send two emails per account. On we'll send two emails per account. On day two, we'll send four emails per day two, we'll send four emails per day two, we'll send four emails per account. On day three, we'll send six. account. On day three, we'll send six. account. On day three, we'll send six. And continuously scale up. And then And continuously scale up. And then And continuously scale up. And then maybe we leave it at 15 for a week or maybe we leave it at 15 for a week or maybe we leave it at 15 for a week or two. And then as we continue to grow, two. And then as we continue to grow, two. And then as we continue to grow, then we can scale up to 30 40 emails per then we can scale up to 30 40 emails per then we can scale up to 30 40 emails per day. But I like to treat each of my day. But I like to treat each of my day. But I like to treat each of my email accounts like they're they're kind email accounts like they're they're kind email accounts like they're they're kind of their their own little athlete, of their their own little athlete, of their their own little athlete, right? So if I'm training somebody to right? So if I'm training somebody to right? So if I'm training somebody to run a marathon, I'm not going to tell run a marathon, I'm not going to tell run a marathon, I'm not going to tell them to run a marathon every day. Some them to run a marathon every day. Some them to run a marathon every day. Some days I'm going to say run a 5K, run days I'm going to say run a 5K, run days I'm going to say run a 5K, run three miles today, run 10 miles today, three miles today, run 10 miles today, three miles today, run 10 miles today, run 15 miles today. Then we'll we'll run 15 miles today. Then we'll we'll run 15 miles today. Then we'll we'll pull it back. We'll go back to 10 miles.

pull it back. We'll go back to 10 miles. pull it back. We'll go back to 10 miles. Then as we're getting closer to the Then as we're getting closer to the Then as we're getting closer to the race, all right, now we can start to do race, all right, now we can start to do race, all right, now we can start to do 25 26 miles. Kind of get get the the 25 26 miles. Kind of get get the the 25 26 miles. Kind of get get the the full experience. So don't max out your full experience. So don't max out your full experience. So don't max out your emails because if you continuously max emails because if you continuously max emails because if you continuously max it out every day, just like an athlete, it out every day, just like an athlete, it out every day, just like an athlete, they're eventually going to burn out. So they're eventually going to burn out. So they're eventually going to burn out. So you really kind of want to be cautious you really kind of want to be cautious you really kind of want to be cautious here. So you're sending limits is going here. So you're sending limits is going here. So you're sending limits is going to be important. Start small, to be important. Start small, to be important. Start small, continuously scale it up. As you get continuously scale it up. As you get continuously scale it up. As you get more responses, even if they're good or more responses, even if they're good or more responses, even if they're good or bad responses, the more things coming in bad responses, the more things coming in bad responses, the more things coming in that prove that you're landing in that prove that you're landing in that prove that you're landing in inboxes, inboxes, inboxes, the more you can scale it up, the more the more you can scale it up, the more the more you can scale it up, the more you can kind of keep it at a certain you can kind of keep it at a certain you can kind of keep it at a certain level. Then next is going to be creating level. Then next is going to be creating level. Then next is going to be creating our lead list. So, same thing as you are our lead list. So, same thing as you are our lead list. So, same thing as you are warming up your emails. Just because you warming up your emails. Just because you warming up your emails. Just because you have an email account does not have an email account does not have an email account does not automatically grant you access to be automatically grant you access to be automatically grant you access to be able to send hundreds of thousands of able to send hundreds of thousands of able to send hundreds of thousands of emails from it. So, as you scale up the emails from it. So, as you scale up the emails from it. So, as you scale up the number of sends, you also want to scale number of sends, you also want to scale number of sends, you also want to scale up the number of people you're actually up the number of people you're actually up the number of people you're actually contacting. So, start off with a 100 contacting. So, start off with a 100 contacting. So, start off with a 100 people, then maybe next campaign add 200 people, then maybe next campaign add 200 people, then maybe next campaign add 200 people, then next campaign 300 people, people, then next campaign 300 people, people, then next campaign 300 people, then 400 people. Obviously, tie this all then 400 people. Obviously, tie this all then 400 people. Obviously, tie this all into how many accounts you've purchased, into how many accounts you've purchased, into how many accounts you've purchased, but don't just try to go for the whole but don't just try to go for the whole but don't just try to go for the whole pie right out the gate. Take a piece, pie right out the gate. Take a piece, pie right out the gate. Take a piece, take some crumbs, and then continue to take some crumbs, and then continue to take some crumbs, and then continue to scale it up. And then next bullet point scale it up. And then next bullet point scale it up. And then next bullet point is test plain text versus design emails.

is test plain text versus design emails. is test plain text versus design emails. Remember we really will just want to Remember we really will just want to Remember we really will just want to focus on plain text especially if it's focus on plain text especially if it's focus on plain text especially if it's our first time contacting people. So our first time contacting people. So our first time contacting people. So don't send links you look suspicious. don't send links you look suspicious. don't send links you look suspicious. Don't send pictures attachments. Don't send pictures attachments. Don't send pictures attachments. Keep the text just simple as the Keep the text just simple as the Keep the text just simple as the occasional occasional occasional bold or italic won't kill a campaign but bold or italic won't kill a campaign but bold or italic won't kill a campaign but we do recommend just steering away from we do recommend just steering away from we do recommend just steering away from it unless it's absolutely necessary. it unless it's absolutely necessary. it unless it's absolutely necessary. Then even unsubscribe links at the Then even unsubscribe links at the Then even unsubscribe links at the bottom. It's still a link. It still bottom. It's still a link. It still bottom. It's still a link. It still might look suspicious. Even if it is might look suspicious. Even if it is might look suspicious. Even if it is very just common to see in these sort of very just common to see in these sort of very just common to see in these sort of emails, we still recommend steering away emails, we still recommend steering away emails, we still recommend steering away from it at the bottom. Worst case from it at the bottom. Worst case from it at the bottom. Worst case scenario, if you'd like to include it, scenario, if you'd like to include it, scenario, if you'd like to include it, just put a reply no and I'll take you just put a reply no and I'll take you just put a reply no and I'll take you out of the sequence. Or a little cheat out of the sequence. Or a little cheat out of the sequence. Or a little cheat code, put something positive for them to code, put something positive for them to code, put something positive for them to respond with. So even the the email respond with. So even the the email respond with. So even the the email providers don't flag it. If you see a providers don't flag it. If you see a providers don't flag it. If you see a bunch of if they see a bunch of people bunch of if they see a bunch of people bunch of if they see a bunch of people responding saying no no no no then responding saying no no no no then responding saying no no no no then they're going to be like okay what is they're going to be like okay what is they're going to be like okay what is this guy saying in these emails say this guy saying in these emails say this guy saying in these emails say respond rainbow and I'll take you out of respond rainbow and I'll take you out of respond rainbow and I'll take you out of the the sequence. Something that won't the the sequence. Something that won't the the sequence. Something that won't get necessarily flagged by the email get necessarily flagged by the email get necessarily flagged by the email provider but still gets the point across provider but still gets the point across provider but still gets the point across to you that they want to be removed. And to you that they want to be removed. And to you that they want to be removed. And then same thing for testing subject then same thing for testing subject then same thing for testing subject lines. We'll get more into this into the lines. We'll get more into this into the lines. We'll get more into this into the creative portion of the deck, but use creative portion of the deck, but use creative portion of the deck, but use open tracking until you're at about that open tracking until you're at about that open tracking until you're at about that 30% plus open rate. So, get it to where 30% plus open rate. So, get it to where 30% plus open rate. So, get it to where you're you're average or above and then you're you're average or above and then you're you're average or above and then you can turn it off because most of the you can turn it off because most of the you can turn it off because most of the time they're not going to be super time they're not going to be super time they're not going to be super accurate. It's going to skew the way you accurate. It's going to skew the way you accurate. It's going to skew the way you look at campaigns. It's going to impact look at campaigns. It's going to impact look at campaigns. It's going to impact deliverability and ultimately none of us

deliverability and ultimately none of us deliverability and ultimately none of us are sending email so they get open. are sending email so they get open. are sending email so they get open. We're sending emails so they get We're sending emails so they get We're sending emails so they get responded to and that's going to be the responded to and that's going to be the responded to and that's going to be the metric that matters. metric that matters. metric that matters. Hey Oliver, before we move on on this Hey Oliver, before we move on on this Hey Oliver, before we move on on this particular bit, we've probably got some particular bit, we've probably got some particular bit, we've probably got some folks that are attending the webinar folks that are attending the webinar folks that are attending the webinar today who are new to cold outreach today who are new to cold outreach today who are new to cold outreach there. This is a new area and they may there. This is a new area and they may there. This is a new area and they may look at that technical checklist and be look at that technical checklist and be look at that technical checklist and be a little overwhelmed. Um, can you talk a a little overwhelmed. Um, can you talk a a little overwhelmed. Um, can you talk a little bit about like how much of this little bit about like how much of this little bit about like how much of this is like a early like you kind of is like a early like you kind of is like a early like you kind of frontload this, you got to do a little frontload this, you got to do a little frontload this, you got to do a little bit at the beginning and then you don't bit at the beginning and then you don't bit at the beginning and then you don't have to think about it or versus like have to think about it or versus like have to think about it or versus like how much of this should they be how much of this should they be how much of this should they be spending, you know, a couple of hours a spending, you know, a couple of hours a spending, you know, a couple of hours a month on like give them some idea of how month on like give them some idea of how month on like give them some idea of how frequent and how much time they should frequent and how much time they should frequent and how much time they should be investing in this portion. be investing in this portion. be investing in this portion. >> Yeah, great question. And I think most >> Yeah, great question. And I think most >> Yeah, great question. And I think most of this is going to be frontloaded. So, of this is going to be frontloaded. So, of this is going to be frontloaded. So, if you can set this up right one time, if you can set this up right one time, if you can set this up right one time, then you'll be good to go. It's kind of then you'll be good to go. It's kind of then you'll be good to go. It's kind of like what I had mentioned earlier. It's like what I had mentioned earlier. It's like what I had mentioned earlier. It's kind of like going to the dentist. If kind of like going to the dentist. If kind of like going to the dentist. If you floss, you brush your teeth, the you floss, you brush your teeth, the you floss, you brush your teeth, the dentist isn't going to be a concern for dentist isn't going to be a concern for dentist isn't going to be a concern for you. Obviously, you still want to go you. Obviously, you still want to go you. Obviously, you still want to go check up every few months. You might check up every few months. You might check up every few months. You might want to run a deliverability check. You want to run a deliverability check. You want to run a deliverability check. You want to check make sure you're not want to check make sure you're not want to check make sure you're not landing in spam. But for the most part, landing in spam. But for the most part, landing in spam. But for the most part, if you can follow these guidelines, if you can follow these guidelines, if you can follow these guidelines, you're staying within the sending you're staying within the sending you're staying within the sending limits, you've created your subdomains, limits, you've created your subdomains, limits, you've created your subdomains, then your teeth are going to be healthy, then your teeth are going to be healthy, then your teeth are going to be healthy, your campaigns are going to be healthy, your campaigns are going to be healthy, your campaigns are going to be healthy, you're not necessarily going to have to you're not necessarily going to have to you're not necessarily going to have to worry about it. But it is good every worry about it. But it is good every worry about it. But it is good every couple of months, maybe once a quarter couple of months, maybe once a quarter couple of months, maybe once a quarter or even just once a month. You want to or even just once a month. You want to or even just once a month. You want to air on the side of caution is to just air on the side of caution is to just air on the side of caution is to just run a simple deliverability check. Make run a simple deliverability check. Make run a simple deliverability check. Make sure you're not landing in spam. But for sure you're not landing in spam. But for sure you're not landing in spam. But for the most part, if you can do this, you the most part, if you can do this, you the most part, if you can do this, you can follow the guidelines, then can follow the guidelines, then can follow the guidelines, then infrastructure and the technical side of

infrastructure and the technical side of infrastructure and the technical side of outbound email won't be an issue for outbound email won't be an issue for outbound email won't be an issue for you. you. you. >> So it's safe to say you should never >> So it's safe to say you should never >> So it's safe to say you should never become an a me you should never memorize become an a me you should never memorize become an a me you should never memorize this. Like you shouldn't do it this. Like you shouldn't do it this. Like you shouldn't do it frequently enough that this becomes like frequently enough that this becomes like frequently enough that this becomes like a routine for you. Like every time you a routine for you. Like every time you a routine for you. Like every time you have to go do this, you should be have to go do this, you should be have to go do this, you should be thinking, "Oh crud, where's my thinking, "Oh crud, where's my thinking, "Oh crud, where's my checklist? I need to go back and checklist? I need to go back and checklist? I need to go back and remember how to do this." Is that is remember how to do this." Is that is remember how to do this." Is that is that fair, Oliver? that fair, Oliver? that fair, Oliver? >> Yeah. Bingo. You want to be spending 90% >> Yeah. Bingo. You want to be spending 90% >> Yeah. Bingo. You want to be spending 90% of your time on the next section, which of your time on the next section, which of your time on the next section, which is going to be creatives. Obviously, is going to be creatives. Obviously, is going to be creatives. Obviously, there is a a few things on this list, there is a a few things on this list, there is a a few things on this list, but once you check them off once, if you but once you check them off once, if you but once you check them off once, if you do it right, and then you continuously do it right, and then you continuously do it right, and then you continuously stay within the guidelines, it's not stay within the guidelines, it's not stay within the guidelines, it's not something you should be concerned about. which does bring us to the creative part which does bring us to the creative part which is the the fun part right I do which is the the fun part right I do which is the the fun part right I do want to emphasize that the the technical want to emphasize that the the technical want to emphasize that the the technical side of the business or the campaigns it side of the business or the campaigns it side of the business or the campaigns it is going to be our foundation but like I is going to be our foundation but like I is going to be our foundation but like I said if you do it right once you're in a said if you do it right once you're in a said if you do it right once you're in a very strong spot very strong spot very strong spot now with the creatives an interesting now with the creatives an interesting now with the creatives an interesting stat is that 61% of decision makers say stat is that 61% of decision makers say stat is that 61% of decision makers say emails are irrelevant to their marketing emails are irrelevant to their marketing emails are irrelevant to their marketing efforts now what exactly efforts now what exactly efforts now what exactly Does that mean that the other 39% are Does that mean that the other 39% are Does that mean that the other 39% are doing? It means they understand buyer doing? It means they understand buyer doing? It means they understand buyer psychology. So, everybody in here is psychology. So, everybody in here is psychology. So, everybody in here is interested in learning about how to send interested in learning about how to send interested in learning about how to send cold email. 61% of people probably cold email. 61% of people probably cold email. 61% of people probably haven't joined this because they're not haven't joined this because they're not haven't joined this because they're not interested. They've tried it. It didn't interested. They've tried it. It didn't interested. They've tried it. It didn't work for them. But the 39% that do find work for them. But the 39% that do find work for them. But the 39% that do find success with it, it's because they found success with it, it's because they found success with it, it's because they found out there's something called the buyer out there's something called the buyer out there's something called the buyer pyramid. You can look it up after, but

pyramid. You can look it up after, but pyramid. You can look it up after, but it represents that 3% of prospects are it represents that 3% of prospects are it represents that 3% of prospects are in a buying solution for their product in a buying solution for their product in a buying solution for their product right now. 6 to 7% are open to it. 30% right now. 6 to 7% are open to it. 30% right now. 6 to 7% are open to it. 30% are not thinking about it. 30% don't are not thinking about it. 30% don't are not thinking about it. 30% don't think they're interested. And 30% know think they're interested. And 30% know think they're interested. And 30% know they're not interested. So, as we're they're not interested. So, as we're they're not interested. So, as we're sending cold emails, a lot of people sending cold emails, a lot of people sending cold emails, a lot of people will try to target that really small 3% will try to target that really small 3% will try to target that really small 3% of the market that are looking for a of the market that are looking for a of the market that are looking for a solution right now. And for that to solution right now. And for that to solution right now. And for that to happen, a lot of stars need to align. happen, a lot of stars need to align. happen, a lot of stars need to align. You one need to land in their emails You one need to land in their emails You one need to land in their emails when they're when they're when they're thinking about the solution. They thinking about the solution. They thinking about the solution. They already need to be actively searching already need to be actively searching already need to be actively searching for a solution. Then we've got to have for a solution. Then we've got to have for a solution. Then we've got to have good deliverability and we've got to good deliverability and we've got to good deliverability and we've got to have a good message. That's a lot of have a good message. That's a lot of have a good message. That's a lot of variables to control. variables to control. variables to control. Now, as you're going through the Now, as you're going through the Now, as you're going through the creative basics of emails, we might want creative basics of emails, we might want creative basics of emails, we might want to expand beyond just that 3% that are to expand beyond just that 3% that are to expand beyond just that 3% that are looking for a solution right now. So, we looking for a solution right now. So, we looking for a solution right now. So, we want to have relationshipdriven want to have relationshipdriven want to have relationshipdriven approaches to emails. So at that top approaches to emails. So at that top approaches to emails. So at that top bullet point it says traditional sales bullet point it says traditional sales bullet point it says traditional sales emails so asking for a meeting directly emails so asking for a meeting directly emails so asking for a meeting directly so you can sell earn only a 3% reply so you can sell earn only a 3% reply so you can sell earn only a 3% reply rate. Whereas if you look at the sub rate. Whereas if you look at the sub rate. Whereas if you look at the sub bullet points so marketing campaigns um bullet points so marketing campaigns um bullet points so marketing campaigns um focused on MQLs get a 6.2% reply rate focused on MQLs get a 6.2% reply rate focused on MQLs get a 6.2% reply rate digital PRs will get a 13% reply rate digital PRs will get a 13% reply rate digital PRs will get a 13% reply rate and even headhunting campaigns from and even headhunting campaigns from and even headhunting campaigns from recruiters get a 7.5% reply rate. So recruiters get a 7.5% reply rate. So recruiters get a 7.5% reply rate. So there is ways to do it where you can get there is ways to do it where you can get there is ways to do it where you can get in front of these conversations. But in front of these conversations. But in front of these conversations. But below that, this is kind of my personal below that, this is kind of my personal below that, this is kind of my personal bread and butter in writing outbound bread and butter in writing outbound bread and butter in writing outbound emails. Like I said, we really want to emails. Like I said, we really want to emails. Like I said, we really want to lean into relationship building because

lean into relationship building because lean into relationship building because it's very difficult to find that 3% at it's very difficult to find that 3% at it's very difficult to find that 3% at the right time when there's six to 7% of the right time when there's six to 7% of the right time when there's six to 7% of people that are open to it, 30% are not people that are open to it, 30% are not people that are open to it, 30% are not thinking about it, 30% aren't sure if thinking about it, 30% aren't sure if thinking about it, 30% aren't sure if they're interested or not, and then 30% they're interested or not, and then 30% they're interested or not, and then 30% know they're not interested. So that know they're not interested. So that know they're not interested. So that leaves us with that 30% out, that leaves leaves us with that 30% out, that leaves leaves us with that 30% out, that leaves us 67% of the market that we're able to us 67% of the market that we're able to us 67% of the market that we're able to contact with cold email. Now, if we go contact with cold email. Now, if we go contact with cold email. Now, if we go for a direct pitch, we really can only for a direct pitch, we really can only for a direct pitch, we really can only hit that 3%. But if we take a very hit that 3%. But if we take a very hit that 3%. But if we take a very relationship driven approach, that relationship driven approach, that relationship driven approach, that significantly expands our markets, we significantly expands our markets, we significantly expands our markets, we can go for 67% of the market now. And if can go for 67% of the market now. And if can go for 67% of the market now. And if we add in that 3% included, we've got we add in that 3% included, we've got we add in that 3% included, we've got 70% of the market we can tap into. 70% of the market we can tap into. 70% of the market we can tap into. Whereas all of these people that are Whereas all of these people that are Whereas all of these people that are screaming from the rooftops that cold screaming from the rooftops that cold screaming from the rooftops that cold email is dead, they're just focused on email is dead, they're just focused on email is dead, they're just focused on that 3%. And that makes it significantly that 3%. And that makes it significantly that 3%. And that makes it significantly harder for them to break into because harder for them to break into because harder for them to break into because they're competing with everybody else they're competing with everybody else they're competing with everybody else that's focused on that 3%. that's focused on that 3%. that's focused on that 3%. So how do we get encapsulate the full So how do we get encapsulate the full So how do we get encapsulate the full 70% of the market? We take strategies 70% of the market? We take strategies 70% of the market? We take strategies like research calls. So you create like research calls. So you create like research calls. So you create roundts. We invite people to contribute roundts. We invite people to contribute roundts. We invite people to contribute to white papers, blog posts, LinkedIn to white papers, blog posts, LinkedIn to white papers, blog posts, LinkedIn posts just like thought leadership posts just like thought leadership posts just like thought leadership content. what are you seeing in the content. what are you seeing in the content. what are you seeing in the space? Oh, you're seeing this. Maybe I space? Oh, you're seeing this. Maybe I space? Oh, you're seeing this. Maybe I can share some insights about what we're can share some insights about what we're can share some insights about what we're doing for outbound email, for example.

doing for outbound email, for example. doing for outbound email, for example. And then we learn from each other. We And then we learn from each other. We And then we learn from each other. We build that relationship. If there's a build that relationship. If there's a build that relationship. If there's a business conversation to be had, then we business conversation to be had, then we business conversation to be had, then we have that as well. And then you can tie have that as well. And then you can tie have that as well. And then you can tie this into even more modern content. I'm this into even more modern content. I'm this into even more modern content. I'm big believer video content is king right big believer video content is king right big believer video content is king right now. So you can invite prospects to now. So you can invite prospects to now. So you can invite prospects to podcasts, webinars, or even just podcasts, webinars, or even just podcasts, webinars, or even just commenting on a research piece you've commenting on a research piece you've commenting on a research piece you've already created. And with that, you already created. And with that, you already created. And with that, you might think, Oliver, that's sounds like might think, Oliver, that's sounds like might think, Oliver, that's sounds like it takes up a lot of bandwidth. I have a it takes up a lot of bandwidth. I have a it takes up a lot of bandwidth. I have a sales team that does all of my outbound. sales team that does all of my outbound. sales team that does all of my outbound. Can can they do it? One example of Can can they do it? One example of Can can they do it? One example of somebody that's done this really well is somebody that's done this really well is somebody that's done this really well is Lovable. So all of their employees have Lovable. So all of their employees have Lovable. So all of their employees have pretty much leaned into creating pretty much leaned into creating pretty much leaned into creating personal brand content on LinkedIn. So personal brand content on LinkedIn. So personal brand content on LinkedIn. So yes, you can have your SDR saying, "Hey, yes, you can have your SDR saying, "Hey, yes, you can have your SDR saying, "Hey, want to jump on for a 10-minute want to jump on for a 10-minute want to jump on for a 10-minute recording? Just share your thoughts on recording? Just share your thoughts on recording? Just share your thoughts on the industry? I'll post on my LinkedIn, the industry? I'll post on my LinkedIn, the industry? I'll post on my LinkedIn, you post on your LinkedIn." Now your SDR you post on your LinkedIn." Now your SDR you post on your LinkedIn." Now your SDR has that relationship. So it is great if has that relationship. So it is great if has that relationship. So it is great if we've got founder things like webinars we've got founder things like webinars we've got founder things like webinars coming from Matt, but it's also good if coming from Matt, but it's also good if coming from Matt, but it's also good if we have a SDR or sales rep or an AE that we have a SDR or sales rep or an AE that we have a SDR or sales rep or an AE that can do these things as well because it's can do these things as well because it's can do these things as well because it's not too much more time consuming.

not too much more time consuming. not too much more time consuming. They're already putting the effort into They're already putting the effort into They're already putting the effort into scaling outbound, getting these scaling outbound, getting these scaling outbound, getting these conversations. you might as well go that conversations. you might as well go that conversations. you might as well go that extra mile and secure the conversation, extra mile and secure the conversation, extra mile and secure the conversation, secure that business relationship. So secure that business relationship. So secure that business relationship. So you can do things like that. So thought you can do things like that. So thought you can do things like that. So thought leadership very relationship based. leadership very relationship based. leadership very relationship based. Ultimately, you just want to be Ultimately, you just want to be Ultimately, you just want to be providing a ton of value upfront. So you providing a ton of value upfront. So you providing a ton of value upfront. So you can share calculators and tools that can share calculators and tools that can share calculators and tools that you've built specifically for your lead. you've built specifically for your lead. you've built specifically for your lead. Let's say you're running an accounting Let's say you're running an accounting Let's say you're running an accounting firm. Maybe you send them a Excel sheet firm. Maybe you send them a Excel sheet firm. Maybe you send them a Excel sheet that if they input their numbers, it'll that if they input their numbers, it'll that if they input their numbers, it'll automate the rest of it. Things like automate the rest of it. Things like automate the rest of it. Things like that. or pilots where you offer some that. or pilots where you offer some that. or pilots where you offer some kind of handholding service at a kind of handholding service at a kind of handholding service at a discounted rate to the lead or even discounted rate to the lead or even discounted rate to the lead or even free. Hey, if I do this for you, would free. Hey, if I do this for you, would free. Hey, if I do this for you, would you be open to helping us with a case you be open to helping us with a case you be open to helping us with a case study? Things like that where once study? Things like that where once study? Things like that where once again, you're just positioning them as I again, you're just positioning them as I again, you're just positioning them as I wouldn't say the authority, but you're wouldn't say the authority, but you're wouldn't say the authority, but you're positioning them as somebody you want to positioning them as somebody you want to positioning them as somebody you want to gain insights from. And then on the flip gain insights from. And then on the flip gain insights from. And then on the flip side of that, you can provide insights side of that, you can provide insights side of that, you can provide insights back to them. Like I said, very back to them. Like I said, very back to them. Like I said, very relationshipbased over transactional relationshipbased over transactional relationshipbased over transactional because that opens up to 70% of the because that opens up to 70% of the because that opens up to 70% of the market rather than just a mere 3% we're market rather than just a mere 3% we're market rather than just a mere 3% we're sending, hey, buy my solution.

And that ties into how do we actually And that ties into how do we actually write the messages that land with these? write the messages that land with these? write the messages that land with these? So, we've got our strategy on the back So, we've got our strategy on the back So, we've got our strategy on the back end. Now, how do we get people to want end. Now, how do we get people to want end. Now, how do we get people to want to respond to us? So based on Hunter's to respond to us? So based on Hunter's to respond to us? So based on Hunter's data that they've pulled from was it 31 data that they've pulled from was it 31 data that they've pulled from was it 31 million emails using publicly available million emails using publicly available million emails using publicly available information makes 67% of decision makers information makes 67% of decision makers information makes 67% of decision makers more likely to reply which is a a more likely to reply which is a a more likely to reply which is a a massive jump which ties into the the massive jump which ties into the the massive jump which ties into the the next slide where we dive into next slide where we dive into next slide where we dive into personalization. personalization. personalization. So what we really want to look at is So what we really want to look at is So what we really want to look at is there's a few different ways we can look there's a few different ways we can look there's a few different ways we can look at it. I think one thing that I've seen at it. I think one thing that I've seen at it. I think one thing that I've seen become a really common theme is if you become a really common theme is if you become a really common theme is if you look at that third bullet point down look at that third bullet point down look at that third bullet point down their social media presence. So as an their social media presence. So as an their social media presence. So as an individual and company profiles, individual and company profiles, individual and company profiles, people take this and run with this and I people take this and run with this and I people take this and run with this and I think there's a lot of workflows through think there's a lot of workflows through think there's a lot of workflows through Clay and different email softwares that Clay and different email softwares that Clay and different email softwares that really pull from LinkedIn just comment really pull from LinkedIn just comment really pull from LinkedIn just comment on their most recent post. So, an on their most recent post. So, an on their most recent post. So, an example of this might be maybe Matt puts example of this might be maybe Matt puts example of this might be maybe Matt puts out a post on LinkedIn that just joking out a post on LinkedIn that just joking out a post on LinkedIn that just joking around that his dog interrupts his Zoom around that his dog interrupts his Zoom around that his dog interrupts his Zoom meetings every once in a while and just meetings every once in a while and just meetings every once in a while and just the struggles of working from home. I've the struggles of working from home. I've the struggles of working from home. I've seen emails where somebody will email seen emails where somebody will email seen emails where somebody will email Matt and it'll be automated. Matt, your Matt and it'll be automated. Matt, your Matt and it'll be automated. Matt, your post about your dog interrupting your post about your dog interrupting your post about your dog interrupting your your Zoom meetings really resonated with your Zoom meetings really resonated with your Zoom meetings really resonated with me. Do you want to buy my accounting me. Do you want to buy my accounting me. Do you want to buy my accounting software? Like that. That is not how you software? Like that. That is not how you software? Like that. That is not how you you kind of personalize emails. But you kind of personalize emails. But you kind of personalize emails. But there is ways where you take those and there is ways where you take those and there is ways where you take those and say, "Hey, Matt, saw your post about say, "Hey, Matt, saw your post about say, "Hey, Matt, saw your post about your your dog interrupting your Zoom

your your dog interrupting your Zoom your your dog interrupting your Zoom meetings. I've spoken with other 40 meetings. I've spoken with other 40 meetings. I've spoken with other 40 other SAS founders." And one thing that other SAS founders." And one thing that other SAS founders." And one thing that distracts them is that they spend 10 distracts them is that they spend 10 distracts them is that they spend 10 hours per week on admin work around hours per week on admin work around hours per week on admin work around accounting. I have a software. Would you accounting. I have a software. Would you accounting. I have a software. Would you be open to a quick conversation around be open to a quick conversation around be open to a quick conversation around it to kind of save that from me? So, it to kind of save that from me? So, it to kind of save that from me? So, that was kind of a a brainstorm went off that was kind of a a brainstorm went off that was kind of a a brainstorm went off the cuff there. But the the the point is the cuff there. But the the the point is the cuff there. But the the the point is there's personalization and then there's there's personalization and then there's there's personalization and then there's fake personalization. I think there's so fake personalization. I think there's so fake personalization. I think there's so much noise or the AI slop that we much noise or the AI slop that we much noise or the AI slop that we mentioned earlier around that where mentioned earlier around that where mentioned earlier around that where people are just personalizing for the people are just personalizing for the people are just personalizing for the sake of personalizing and they're not sake of personalizing and they're not sake of personalizing and they're not doing it right and it's just killing doing it right and it's just killing doing it right and it's just killing their email campaigns making people less their email campaigns making people less their email campaigns making people less receptive to emails because it's receptive to emails because it's receptive to emails because it's majority of the time you can see right majority of the time you can see right majority of the time you can see right through it and it really just kind of through it and it really just kind of through it and it really just kind of makes it a little difficult. Then the next thing is once again if Then the next thing is once again if we're leaning towards podcasts or we're leaning towards podcasts or we're leaning towards podcasts or research reports, we really just want to research reports, we really just want to research reports, we really just want to make it personalized, show value, make make it personalized, show value, make make it personalized, show value, make it very outcome oriented. So don't just it very outcome oriented. So don't just it very outcome oriented. So don't just try to pitch Matt your accounting try to pitch Matt your accounting try to pitch Matt your accounting software. Pitch him that it can save him software. Pitch him that it can save him software. Pitch him that it can save him 10 hours per week if he uses the 10 hours per week if he uses the 10 hours per week if he uses the software. Just get him on that software. Just get him on that software. Just get him on that conversation. If you're doing a podcast conversation. If you're doing a podcast conversation. If you're doing a podcast style, don't say, "Hey, can I have 30 style, don't say, "Hey, can I have 30 style, don't say, "Hey, can I have 30 minutes of your time?" In exchange for minutes of your time?" In exchange for minutes of your time?" In exchange for 30 minutes of your time, I'll give you 30 minutes of your time, I'll give you 30 minutes of your time, I'll give you edited clips, an edited interview that edited clips, an edited interview that edited clips, an edited interview that you can distribute to your own audience you can distribute to your own audience you can distribute to your own audience because now it's a win-win for both of because now it's a win-win for both of because now it's a win-win for both of you. You get the conversation, you get you. You get the conversation, you get you. You get the conversation, you get the relationship, they get content the relationship, they get content the relationship, they get content without having to do anything.

without having to do anything. without having to do anything. And some good ways to kind of ask this And some good ways to kind of ask this And some good ways to kind of ask this is there's three really good examples is there's three really good examples is there's three really good examples here, but take this mindset and apply it here, but take this mindset and apply it here, but take this mindset and apply it to the rest of your email. So, it's can to the rest of your email. So, it's can to the rest of your email. So, it's can I send more information? Are you open to I send more information? Are you open to I send more information? Are you open to learning more? Can I share my calendar? learning more? Can I share my calendar? learning more? Can I share my calendar? So, it's not let me know what works best So, it's not let me know what works best So, it's not let me know what works best next week because then they've got to do next week because then they've got to do next week because then they've got to do stuff. It's can I send more information? stuff. It's can I send more information? stuff. It's can I send more information? They can just reply yes. Open the They can just reply yes. Open the They can just reply yes. Open the learning more? Yes. Can I share my learning more? Yes. Can I share my learning more? Yes. Can I share my calendar? Yes. Make it as frictionless calendar? Yes. Make it as frictionless calendar? Yes. Make it as frictionless for them as possible. If you kind of for them as possible. If you kind of for them as possible. If you kind of make it more of a statement or big ask, make it more of a statement or big ask, make it more of a statement or big ask, they don't know who you are. Do they they don't know who you are. Do they they don't know who you are. Do they really want to give you the time of day? really want to give you the time of day? really want to give you the time of day? They don't know yet. So, if you make it They don't know yet. So, if you make it They don't know yet. So, if you make it as frictionless as possible, make them as frictionless as possible, make them as frictionless as possible, make them give you a one-word answer, then puts give you a one-word answer, then puts give you a one-word answer, then puts you in a really strong spot because, you in a really strong spot because, you in a really strong spot because, like I said, there's a lot of variables like I said, there's a lot of variables like I said, there's a lot of variables that go into this, you could have a that go into this, you could have a that go into this, you could have a great email. If you have too big of an great email. If you have too big of an great email. If you have too big of an ask at the CTA, it might not respond and ask at the CTA, it might not respond and ask at the CTA, it might not respond and now you're starting to change things now you're starting to change things now you're starting to change things that don't need to be changed if it all that don't need to be changed if it all that don't need to be changed if it all started at your CTA. So, make it started at your CTA. So, make it started at your CTA. So, make it baseline as frictionless as possible.

So the creative basics here I think um So the creative basics here I think um what we really just want to emphasize what we really just want to emphasize what we really just want to emphasize lead with value at this point pulling it lead with value at this point pulling it lead with value at this point pulling it back to the the buyer pyramid only 3% of back to the the buyer pyramid only 3% of back to the the buyer pyramid only 3% of prospects are looking for a solution prospects are looking for a solution prospects are looking for a solution right now and very rarely to access that right now and very rarely to access that right now and very rarely to access that 3% is it just going to fall into their 3% is it just going to fall into their 3% is it just going to fall into their lap in their inbox. You want to create lap in their inbox. You want to create lap in their inbox. You want to create these relevant but personalized emails these relevant but personalized emails these relevant but personalized emails that can be just that can be just that can be just utilized through through different utilized through through different utilized through through different metrics like not necessarily I need this metrics like not necessarily I need this metrics like not necessarily I need this right now. I'm open to a conversation. right now. I'm open to a conversation. right now. I'm open to a conversation. Maybe it's a fit, maybe it's not. At Maybe it's a fit, maybe it's not. At Maybe it's a fit, maybe it's not. At least I know who I'm speaking with and least I know who I'm speaking with and least I know who I'm speaking with and know who to come to later down the line know who to come to later down the line know who to come to later down the line if I do need this. if I do need this. if I do need this. And then what that looks like for B2B, And then what that looks like for B2B, And then what that looks like for B2B, there's always great ways to tie in there's always great ways to tie in there's always great ways to tie in secondary touches. So, LinkedIn is secondary touches. So, LinkedIn is secondary touches. So, LinkedIn is great. Phone calls still great. Sending great. Phone calls still great. Sending great. Phone calls still great. Sending an email, having sort of a social an email, having sort of a social an email, having sort of a social presence is always going to be more presence is always going to be more presence is always going to be more beneficial with any sort of cold beneficial with any sort of cold beneficial with any sort of cold outbound. They don't know who you are, outbound. They don't know who you are, outbound. They don't know who you are, they're less likely to respond. If they they're less likely to respond. If they they're less likely to respond. If they know who you are, they're more likely to know who you are, they're more likely to know who you are, they're more likely to respond. Very straightforward. So, we respond. Very straightforward. So, we respond. Very straightforward. So, we kind of really want to bridge that gap, kind of really want to bridge that gap, kind of really want to bridge that gap, build that familiarity, and use our build that familiarity, and use our build that familiarity, and use our email to make it relevant and then build email to make it relevant and then build email to make it relevant and then build a little bit of urgency. So, at the a little bit of urgency. So, at the a little bit of urgency. So, at the bottom, the psychological things behind bottom, the psychological things behind bottom, the psychological things behind it is just giving first. So whether that it is just giving first. So whether that it is just giving first. So whether that be podcast or white paper or a be podcast or white paper or a be podcast or white paper or a calculator tool, whatever it may be, calculator tool, whatever it may be, calculator tool, whatever it may be, just give value before asking for just give value before asking for just give value before asking for anything.

anything. anything. Break patterns. I think this is really Break patterns. I think this is really Break patterns. I think this is really good and this showed up in the Hunter good and this showed up in the Hunter good and this showed up in the Hunter stats a lot. If everybody's writing a stats a lot. If everybody's writing a stats a lot. If everybody's writing a super long email, write a short one. If super long email, write a short one. If super long email, write a short one. If everyone's pitching, start to educate. everyone's pitching, start to educate. everyone's pitching, start to educate. Kind of if everybody goes left, you go Kind of if everybody goes left, you go Kind of if everybody goes left, you go right. It comes back to just grown up, right. It comes back to just grown up, right. It comes back to just grown up, right? Don't follow the the crowd just right? Don't follow the the crowd just right? Don't follow the the crowd just because everybody else is doing it. And because everybody else is doing it. And because everybody else is doing it. And then creating curiosity. So open a loop then creating curiosity. So open a loop then creating curiosity. So open a loop that the lead needs to close by that the lead needs to close by that the lead needs to close by replying. So don't just send them the replying. So don't just send them the replying. So don't just send them the accounting calculator right out the accounting calculator right out the accounting calculator right out the gate. Say, "Are you interested in how I gate. Say, "Are you interested in how I gate. Say, "Are you interested in how I can save you 10 hours per week with this can save you 10 hours per week with this can save you 10 hours per week with this accounting calculator?" Respond yes and accounting calculator?" Respond yes and accounting calculator?" Respond yes and I'll send it over. Just get them to at I'll send it over. Just get them to at I'll send it over. Just get them to at least put some skin in the game. Like I least put some skin in the game. Like I least put some skin in the game. Like I said, keep it as frictionless as said, keep it as frictionless as said, keep it as frictionless as possible, but you do want to know that possible, but you do want to know that possible, but you do want to know that there's some intent there before you there's some intent there before you there's some intent there before you just start spamming things out because just start spamming things out because just start spamming things out because we do want that relationship long term. we do want that relationship long term. we do want that relationship long term. Then follow-up. So, a lot of that was Then follow-up. So, a lot of that was Then follow-up. So, a lot of that was about the first sequence. So, now we about the first sequence. So, now we about the first sequence. So, now we want to look at what the follow-up want to look at what the follow-up want to look at what the follow-up sequences look like because it's a sequences look like because it's a sequences look like because it's a saying that's been in business for as saying that's been in business for as saying that's been in business for as long as I can remember. The money's in long as I can remember. The money's in long as I can remember. The money's in the follow-up, right? So, there's two the follow-up, right? So, there's two the follow-up, right? So, there's two ways to do this. And I much prefer the ways to do this. And I much prefer the ways to do this. And I much prefer the first way, which is my way. So there's first way, which is my way. So there's first way, which is my way. So there's there's people that I see, I'll get hit there's people that I see, I'll get hit there's people that I see, I'll get hit from the same person with eight emails from the same person with eight emails from the same person with eight emails over two weeks span. Like every other over two weeks span. Like every other over two weeks span. Like every other day, they're sending me a bump up email.

day, they're sending me a bump up email. day, they're sending me a bump up email. Hey Oliver, did you see this? Hey Hey Oliver, did you see this? Hey Hey Oliver, did you see this? Hey Oliver, check this. Hey Oliver, check Oliver, check this. Hey Oliver, check Oliver, check this. Hey Oliver, check out our website. Hey Oliver, do you want out our website. Hey Oliver, do you want out our website. Hey Oliver, do you want a meeting? I usually get pretty teed off a meeting? I usually get pretty teed off a meeting? I usually get pretty teed off with that. I just delete it, delete it, with that. I just delete it, delete it, with that. I just delete it, delete it, delete it every single time. I don't delete it every single time. I don't delete it every single time. I don't even bother responding because I know even bother responding because I know even bother responding because I know there's going to be another one coming. there's going to be another one coming. there's going to be another one coming. So, I usually like to stick it to at max So, I usually like to stick it to at max So, I usually like to stick it to at max three follow-ups. Usually, I just do two three follow-ups. Usually, I just do two three follow-ups. Usually, I just do two follow-ups along with the first email. follow-ups along with the first email. follow-ups along with the first email. So, three total emails. So, if you use So, three total emails. So, if you use So, three total emails. So, if you use kind of that range, you are going to kind of that range, you are going to kind of that range, you are going to increase your reply rates. But after a increase your reply rates. But after a increase your reply rates. But after a certain point, rather than spamming certain point, rather than spamming certain point, rather than spamming essentially, keep your follow-ups essentially, keep your follow-ups essentially, keep your follow-ups limited. Continuously provide value. limited. Continuously provide value. limited. Continuously provide value. Like I said, if we're going after the Like I said, if we're going after the Like I said, if we're going after the conversation, the relationship, then we conversation, the relationship, then we conversation, the relationship, then we don't need as many follow-ups. If we don't need as many follow-ups. If we don't need as many follow-ups. If we want to start with three and then every want to start with three and then every want to start with three and then every other month we add another one in just other month we add another one in just other month we add another one in just check in. That's more than okay. But one check in. That's more than okay. But one check in. That's more than okay. But one for infrastructure, two for just common for infrastructure, two for just common for infrastructure, two for just common courtesy. courtesy. courtesy. Limit your follow-ups to maybe three or Limit your follow-ups to maybe three or Limit your follow-ups to maybe three or four spread out over two or three weeks.

four spread out over two or three weeks. four spread out over two or three weeks. So checklist here. I know we we went So checklist here. I know we we went So checklist here. I know we we went through a lot so far. So we'll we'll through a lot so far. So we'll we'll through a lot so far. So we'll we'll kind of summarize this and I'm looking kind of summarize this and I'm looking kind of summarize this and I'm looking forward to the Q&A because I'm sure a forward to the Q&A because I'm sure a forward to the Q&A because I'm sure a lot of that is going to be around what lot of that is going to be around what lot of that is going to be around what we just went through. So, we want to we just went through. So, we want to we just went through. So, we want to create multiple email sequences that create multiple email sequences that create multiple email sequences that apply different approaches. So, maybe apply different approaches. So, maybe apply different approaches. So, maybe you try a podcast style campaign. Maybe you try a podcast style campaign. Maybe you try a podcast style campaign. Maybe try a white paper style campaign. Then try a white paper style campaign. Then try a white paper style campaign. Then maybe you try a direct where you talk maybe you try a direct where you talk maybe you try a direct where you talk about Matt's LinkedIn post about his about Matt's LinkedIn post about his about Matt's LinkedIn post about his dog. But we really want it to be dog. But we really want it to be dog. But we really want it to be personalized. We don't want it to be AI personalized. We don't want it to be AI personalized. We don't want it to be AI slop regardless of which one we go slop regardless of which one we go slop regardless of which one we go through. One thing that's really good is through. One thing that's really good is through. One thing that's really good is running just five minute research running just five minute research running just five minute research sprints on your list. So, as we said, we sprints on your list. So, as we said, we sprints on your list. So, as we said, we want to scale up our our ICPR list. So, want to scale up our our ICPR list. So, want to scale up our our ICPR list. So, when we buy new accounts, maybe we start when we buy new accounts, maybe we start when we buy new accounts, maybe we start off with a 100 people in the lead list off with a 100 people in the lead list off with a 100 people in the lead list and then scale it to 200 people, then and then scale it to 200 people, then and then scale it to 200 people, then 300 people. As we do this, it gets 300 people. As we do this, it gets 300 people. As we do this, it gets easier at scale if you lay a good easier at scale if you lay a good easier at scale if you lay a good foundation. So, those first 100 people foundation. So, those first 100 people foundation. So, those first 100 people we want to target, what do they all have we want to target, what do they all have we want to target, what do they all have in common? What do they struggle with in in common? What do they struggle with in in common? What do they struggle with in their day-to-day? their day-to-day? their day-to-day? Matt doesn't wake up and say, I'm the Matt doesn't wake up and say, I'm the Matt doesn't wake up and say, I'm the CEO of a of a large software company. He CEO of a of a large software company. He CEO of a of a large software company. He wakes up and says, "Oh, I've got wakes up and says, "Oh, I've got wakes up and says, "Oh, I've got to spend three hours today on admin to spend three hours today on admin to spend three hours today on admin work." That's what he's thinking about.

work." That's what he's thinking about. work." That's what he's thinking about. He's not thinking about kind of the He's not thinking about kind of the He's not thinking about kind of the demographic side of things that a lot of demographic side of things that a lot of demographic side of things that a lot of people when they're doing outbound people when they're doing outbound people when they're doing outbound email, they'll scrape CEO decision email, they'll scrape CEO decision email, they'll scrape CEO decision makers at hunter.io. makers at hunter.io. makers at hunter.io. Speak to Matt's problems, not speaking Speak to Matt's problems, not speaking Speak to Matt's problems, not speaking to Matt. Because, like I said, he to Matt. Because, like I said, he to Matt. Because, like I said, he doesn't get out of bed and says, "I'm a doesn't get out of bed and says, "I'm a doesn't get out of bed and says, "I'm a CEO of a software company." He thinks CEO of a software company." He thinks CEO of a software company." He thinks about his problems and that's what he's about his problems and that's what he's about his problems and that's what he's going to resonate in an in an email going to resonate in an in an email going to resonate in an in an email with. with. with. And then on this front, aim for one to And then on this front, aim for one to And then on this front, aim for one to two people to send outreach emails at two people to send outreach emails at two people to send outreach emails at any time. So you might start off with any time. So you might start off with any time. So you might start off with Matt, but it's also good to add James Matt, but it's also good to add James Matt, but it's also good to add James into the sequence of Matt isn't into the sequence of Matt isn't into the sequence of Matt isn't responding because Matt might have a responding because Matt might have a responding because Matt might have a week where he's literally just too busy week where he's literally just too busy week where he's literally just too busy to respond to emails. Or on the flip to respond to emails. Or on the flip to respond to emails. Or on the flip side, maybe Matt never responds to side, maybe Matt never responds to side, maybe Matt never responds to outbound emails. You never know what the outbound emails. You never know what the outbound emails. You never know what the situation is until you get that situation is until you get that situation is until you get that conversation. Sometimes it's good to conversation. Sometimes it's good to conversation. Sometimes it's good to loop in a second decision maker that can loop in a second decision maker that can loop in a second decision maker that can either point you to Matt or you can also either point you to Matt or you can also either point you to Matt or you can also just bridge that conversation with. just bridge that conversation with. just bridge that conversation with. And the long term, if you do want a if And the long term, if you do want a if And the long term, if you do want a if you truly want a conversation with you truly want a conversation with you truly want a conversation with somebody, which I think everybody does, somebody, which I think everybody does, somebody, which I think everybody does, then maybe add LinkedIn FOB to your then maybe add LinkedIn FOB to your then maybe add LinkedIn FOB to your sequence. So now you're doing a sequence. So now you're doing a sequence. So now you're doing a multi-channel approach. You can maybe multi-channel approach. You can maybe multi-channel approach. You can maybe add a cold call if you can find their add a cold call if you can find their add a cold call if you can find their number. So you just really want to make number. So you just really want to make number. So you just really want to make everything as valuable as possible. Like everything as valuable as possible. Like everything as valuable as possible. Like I said, you don't want to spam. Make I said, you don't want to spam. Make I said, you don't want to spam. Make every follow-up either every follow-up either every follow-up either share a new piece of content, ask a new share a new piece of content, ask a new share a new piece of content, ask a new question, provide a new low pressure CTA question, provide a new low pressure CTA question, provide a new low pressure CTA like, "Can I share more information?"

like, "Can I share more information?" like, "Can I share more information?" The goal here is just try to not be The goal here is just try to not be The goal here is just try to not be overly salesy, try to not be overly overly salesy, try to not be overly overly salesy, try to not be overly spammy. At the end of the day, you've spammy. At the end of the day, you've spammy. At the end of the day, you've always got to understand that the person always got to understand that the person always got to understand that the person receiving this email is still a person. receiving this email is still a person. receiving this email is still a person. Just like you don't like to be spammed, Just like you don't like to be spammed, Just like you don't like to be spammed, they don't like to be spammed either. they don't like to be spammed either. they don't like to be spammed either. So, market the way you want to be So, market the way you want to be So, market the way you want to be marketed to. And then break patterns. marketed to. And then break patterns. marketed to. And then break patterns. So, for the subject line, I know we said So, for the subject line, I know we said So, for the subject line, I know we said find one that kind of meets industry find one that kind of meets industry find one that kind of meets industry average or above. A lot of people average or above. A lot of people average or above. A lot of people overthink this. Aim for two to five overthink this. Aim for two to five overthink this. Aim for two to five words in your subject line with a little words in your subject line with a little words in your subject line with a little bit of an element of personalization. bit of an element of personalization. bit of an element of personalization. I'll share a little cheat code for mine. I'll share a little cheat code for mine. I'll share a little cheat code for mine. When I run the podcast campaign, I just When I run the podcast campaign, I just When I run the podcast campaign, I just put podcast question mark. Simple, one put podcast question mark. Simple, one put podcast question mark. Simple, one word. It sparks curiosity in one way or word. It sparks curiosity in one way or word. It sparks curiosity in one way or another. Is this person inviting me on a another. Is this person inviting me on a another. Is this person inviting me on a podcast? Have they seen me on a podcast? podcast? Have they seen me on a podcast? podcast? Have they seen me on a podcast? it it's just enough to get the open and it it's just enough to get the open and it it's just enough to get the open and then they read it, they see they're then they read it, they see they're then they read it, they see they're getting invited on a podcast. Whereas if getting invited on a podcast. Whereas if getting invited on a podcast. Whereas if I put in the subject line, hey Matt, I put in the subject line, hey Matt, I put in the subject line, hey Matt, want to join me for a podcast, half of want to join me for a podcast, half of want to join me for a podcast, half of that's going to get cut off. Now he just that's going to get cut off. Now he just that's going to get cut off. Now he just sees, hey Matt, want to like uh oh, sees, hey Matt, want to like uh oh, sees, hey Matt, want to like uh oh, sales email ignore. So if you see long sales email ignore. So if you see long sales email ignore. So if you see long emails in your inbox, write shorter.

emails in your inbox, write shorter. emails in your inbox, write shorter. Like I said, if the whole crowd is going Like I said, if the whole crowd is going Like I said, if the whole crowd is going left, you go right. We really want to left, you go right. We really want to left, you go right. We really want to get our point across in the first get our point across in the first get our point across in the first sentence. So, what that can come down to sentence. So, what that can come down to sentence. So, what that can come down to is is is there's no like right there's no holy there's no like right there's no holy there's no like right there's no holy grail. I wish I could sit here and say grail. I wish I could sit here and say grail. I wish I could sit here and say this is the perfect sentence to open this is the perfect sentence to open this is the perfect sentence to open your email with. And I think we'll get your email with. And I think we'll get your email with. And I think we'll get into the Q&A a little bit and we can into the Q&A a little bit and we can into the Q&A a little bit and we can kind of dive into this a little bit kind of dive into this a little bit kind of dive into this a little bit deeper, but at the end of it, if you deeper, but at the end of it, if you deeper, but at the end of it, if you write a three paragraph email, don't write a three paragraph email, don't write a three paragraph email, don't wait until the third paragraph to wait until the third paragraph to wait until the third paragraph to actually tell them what you're talking actually tell them what you're talking actually tell them what you're talking about. If you write a post or if you tie about. If you write a post or if you tie about. If you write a post or if you tie it back to Matt post about his his dog, it back to Matt post about his his dog, it back to Matt post about his his dog, don't make Matt read for two minutes don't make Matt read for two minutes don't make Matt read for two minutes about his LinkedIn post. He already about his LinkedIn post. He already about his LinkedIn post. He already knows he wrote it. He posted it. Use knows he wrote it. He posted it. Use knows he wrote it. He posted it. Use that as a one sentence. Then right after that as a one sentence. Then right after that as a one sentence. Then right after that, follow up with as to why that's that, follow up with as to why that's that, follow up with as to why that's relevant, why you're talking about it. relevant, why you're talking about it. relevant, why you're talking about it. And then, as always, I think it goes And then, as always, I think it goes And then, as always, I think it goes without saying, whether it be outbound without saying, whether it be outbound without saying, whether it be outbound email or anything else in your business email or anything else in your business email or anything else in your business at this point, avoid using templates and at this point, avoid using templates and at this point, avoid using templates and AI just as is. really add in that kind AI just as is. really add in that kind AI just as is. really add in that kind of touch of human personalization in of touch of human personalization in of touch of human personalization in there because it's getting to the point there because it's getting to the point there because it's getting to the point now where we're overrelying on AI. It's now where we're overrelying on AI. It's now where we're overrelying on AI. It's pretty obvious.

>> This was great. I have so many >> This was great. I have so many follow-ups. I can't wait to dive into follow-ups. I can't wait to dive into follow-ups. I can't wait to dive into the questions. Um, I want to say before the questions. Um, I want to say before the questions. Um, I want to say before we get into the questions though, we get into the questions though, we get into the questions though, there's a fun opportunity that we do now there's a fun opportunity that we do now there's a fun opportunity that we do now annually at Hunter called uh, if you'll annually at Hunter called uh, if you'll annually at Hunter called uh, if you'll click to the next slide, Messaging click to the next slide, Messaging click to the next slide, Messaging Madness 2026. It is a global competition Madness 2026. It is a global competition Madness 2026. It is a global competition and it's literally designed to put your and it's literally designed to put your and it's literally designed to put your email writing skills to the test and email writing skills to the test and email writing skills to the test and essentially compete. Um, there is a essentially compete. Um, there is a essentially compete. Um, there is a prize. Uh, there might even be a prize. Uh, there might even be a prize. Uh, there might even be a surprise prize this year. We're going to surprise prize this year. We're going to surprise prize this year. We're going to get creative and have some fun with it. get creative and have some fun with it. get creative and have some fun with it. But it's essentially like a March But it's essentially like a March But it's essentially like a March Madness bracket but for cold outreach. Madness bracket but for cold outreach. Madness bracket but for cold outreach. So it's an annual competition. Um it's So it's an annual competition. Um it's So it's an annual competition. Um it's really, you know, there's it's thematic really, you know, there's it's thematic really, you know, there's it's thematic and it also gives you enough context to and it also gives you enough context to and it also gives you enough context to know what kind of email to write. Um you know what kind of email to write. Um you know what kind of email to write. Um you can write one for each scenario or you can write one for each scenario or you can write one for each scenario or you can focus on a single scenario. There is can focus on a single scenario. There is can focus on a single scenario. There is a $1,000 grand prize. Um, you also get a a $1,000 grand prize. Um, you also get a a $1,000 grand prize. Um, you also get a year subscription to Hunter Starter and year subscription to Hunter Starter and year subscription to Hunter Starter and the winner uh gets a special guest spot the winner uh gets a special guest spot the winner uh gets a special guest spot on our podcast Outfox, which if you're on our podcast Outfox, which if you're on our podcast Outfox, which if you're not tun tuning into Outfox, you should not tun tuning into Outfox, you should not tun tuning into Outfox, you should subscribe on your favorite podcast subscribe on your favorite podcast subscribe on your favorite podcast platform. Uh, it's definitely we're platform. Uh, it's definitely we're platform. Uh, it's definitely we're having a lot of fun with it and I think having a lot of fun with it and I think having a lot of fun with it and I think there have been some really valuable there have been some really valuable there have been some really valuable conversations that I think touch on conversations that I think touch on conversations that I think touch on actually a number of questions that have actually a number of questions that have actually a number of questions that have come up in today's conversation. So, 64 come up in today's conversation. So, 64 come up in today's conversation. So, 64 spots, classic March Madness bracket spots, classic March Madness bracket spots, classic March Madness bracket style activity. Um, and we are going to style activity. Um, and we are going to style activity. Um, and we are going to have the community vote as well as uh

have the community vote as well as uh have the community vote as well as uh some of the leadership vote. And so, some of the leadership vote. And so, some of the leadership vote. And so, you're getting uh you know, you're you're getting uh you know, you're you're getting uh you know, you're you're getting exposure for these you're getting exposure for these you're getting exposure for these concepts across a really broad base of concepts across a really broad base of concepts across a really broad base of users. And it's just it's a great way to users. And it's just it's a great way to users. And it's just it's a great way to get your skills out there, test yourself get your skills out there, test yourself get your skills out there, test yourself against a bunch of other people. And I against a bunch of other people. And I against a bunch of other people. And I don't know, maybe you're like me and don't know, maybe you're like me and don't know, maybe you're like me and you're just competitive. whether you you're just competitive. whether you you're just competitive. whether you like it or not, it's a great opportunity like it or not, it's a great opportunity like it or not, it's a great opportunity to get in there and compete and have to get in there and compete and have to get in there and compete and have some fun. So, highly recommend it. It's some fun. So, highly recommend it. It's some fun. So, highly recommend it. It's a great way to test your skills. Um, a great way to test your skills. Um, a great way to test your skills. Um, we'll switch over to the Q&A. While we'll switch over to the Q&A. While we'll switch over to the Q&A. While we're switching over to Q&A, I wanted to we're switching over to Q&A, I wanted to we're switching over to Q&A, I wanted to add something to the end almost as a add something to the end almost as a add something to the end almost as a bookend on um on Oliver's creative bookend on um on Oliver's creative bookend on um on Oliver's creative content piece. Um, content piece. Um, content piece. Um, so I get 50 to 150 cold outreach emails so I get 50 to 150 cold outreach emails so I get 50 to 150 cold outreach emails a day pretty much every day, including a day pretty much every day, including a day pretty much every day, including the weekends. And so honestly it has the weekends. And so honestly it has the weekends. And so honestly it has become at times a bit of a challenge for become at times a bit of a challenge for become at times a bit of a challenge for me. Um it's important because I have to me. Um it's important because I have to me. Um it's important because I have to see what people are saying and I have to see what people are saying and I have to see what people are saying and I have to see what people are trying to do. So I see what people are trying to do. So I see what people are trying to do. So I don't want to shut it out completely. Um don't want to shut it out completely. Um don't want to shut it out completely. Um but it also has created like a really but it also has created like a really but it also has created like a really good opportunity for me to just you know good opportunity for me to just you know good opportunity for me to just you know see interesting ideas. Recently though see interesting ideas. Recently though see interesting ideas. Recently though because of the volume I've decided I'm because of the volume I've decided I'm because of the volume I've decided I'm also going to start trying email also going to start trying email also going to start trying email assistance. So AI that sits in my email assistance. So AI that sits in my email assistance. So AI that sits in my email and acts as an additional filter. I've and acts as an additional filter. I've and acts as an additional filter. I've tried about three of them so far because tried about three of them so far because tried about three of them so far because based on all of our content, the next based on all of our content, the next based on all of our content, the next problem we're all going to have to solve problem we're all going to have to solve problem we're all going to have to solve together is how do we get past these AI together is how do we get past these AI together is how do we get past these AI readers in our inboxes. The good news, readers in our inboxes. The good news, readers in our inboxes. The good news, having now spent uh most of this year having now spent uh most of this year having now spent uh most of this year testing various platforms, I can tell testing various platforms, I can tell testing various platforms, I can tell you most of them are bad. Um they either

you most of them are bad. Um they either you most of them are bad. Um they either don't weed any out or they weed don't weed any out or they weed don't weed any out or they weed everything out. I've tried a couple of everything out. I've tried a couple of everything out. I've tried a couple of good ones and the good ones echo good ones and the good ones echo good ones and the good ones echo everything we've talked about today and everything we've talked about today and everything we've talked about today and that is if you're talking about value um that is if you're talking about value um that is if you're talking about value um that bubbles up. I get a message that that bubbles up. I get a message that that bubbles up. I get a message that says I think this is a pitch but there's says I think this is a pitch but there's says I think this is a pitch but there's some real value in here. I think you some real value in here. I think you some real value in here. I think you should take a look at it. And so like should take a look at it. And so like should take a look at it. And so like when you focus on a lot of the advice when you focus on a lot of the advice when you focus on a lot of the advice that Oliver has shared today, I'm seeing that Oliver has shared today, I'm seeing that Oliver has shared today, I'm seeing that that's even potentially f futurep that that's even potentially f futurep that that's even potentially f futurep proofing you against some of the key proofing you against some of the key proofing you against some of the key issues that are going to come up as AI issues that are going to come up as AI issues that are going to come up as AI gets more integrated into our inboxes. gets more integrated into our inboxes. gets more integrated into our inboxes. So the good news I'm seeing a lot of So the good news I'm seeing a lot of So the good news I'm seeing a lot of evidence, it's anecdotal, so it's not evidence, it's anecdotal, so it's not evidence, it's anecdotal, so it's not part of our research yet, but part of our research yet, but part of our research yet, but anecdotally I'm seeing that a lot of anecdotally I'm seeing that a lot of anecdotally I'm seeing that a lot of this advice is only making it more this advice is only making it more this advice is only making it more important to do the kinds of things that important to do the kinds of things that important to do the kinds of things that are going to help you get through these are going to help you get through these are going to help you get through these AI filters. So, you know, previously it AI filters. So, you know, previously it AI filters. So, you know, previously it was spam filters, now it's going to be was spam filters, now it's going to be was spam filters, now it's going to be AI filters. The problem is the same. And AI filters. The problem is the same. And AI filters. The problem is the same. And if you lead with value, it generally if you lead with value, it generally if you lead with value, it generally gets through all of them. And so, I gets through all of them. And so, I gets through all of them. And so, I can't double down on that point enough.

can't double down on that point enough. can't double down on that point enough. All right, that was great stuff, Oliver. All right, that was great stuff, Oliver. All right, that was great stuff, Oliver. Thank you. Uh, let's jump into the Thank you. Uh, let's jump into the Thank you. Uh, let's jump into the questions. So, uh, James has shared one. questions. So, uh, James has shared one. questions. So, uh, James has shared one. Hey guys, what's your feedback best Hey guys, what's your feedback best Hey guys, what's your feedback best practice on including sender signature practice on including sender signature practice on including sender signature contact info in your email? Oliver, what contact info in your email? Oliver, what contact info in your email? Oliver, what are your thoughts? are your thoughts? are your thoughts? Yeah, I think um for outbound email, I Yeah, I think um for outbound email, I Yeah, I think um for outbound email, I try to keep it as simple as possible. try to keep it as simple as possible. try to keep it as simple as possible. So, I put the my name, so Oliver, CEO, So, I put the my name, so Oliver, CEO, So, I put the my name, so Oliver, CEO, Ascension, Cleveland, Ohio, and my phone Ascension, Cleveland, Ohio, and my phone Ascension, Cleveland, Ohio, and my phone number underneath. Like I said, we want number underneath. Like I said, we want number underneath. Like I said, we want to avoid links. We want to avoid to avoid links. We want to avoid to avoid links. We want to avoid graphics. So, as we're sending outbound graphics. So, as we're sending outbound graphics. So, as we're sending outbound email specifically, it's best to leave email specifically, it's best to leave email specifically, it's best to leave that until at least the follow-up or that until at least the follow-up or that until at least the follow-up or once we get a positive response, we get once we get a positive response, we get once we get a positive response, we get that meeting booked, then we can that meeting booked, then we can that meeting booked, then we can transfer over to our main email. That's great. Yeah, you can also just That's great. Yeah, you can also just type it, right? And by the way, one type it, right? And by the way, one type it, right? And by the way, one thing I will note, make sure whatever is thing I will note, make sure whatever is thing I will note, make sure whatever is in your signature is at least fairly in your signature is at least fairly in your signature is at least fairly close to your domain. Like one of the close to your domain. Like one of the close to your domain. Like one of the things that are I see a lot over like things that are I see a lot over like things that are I see a lot over like over the last couple years as scaling over the last couple years as scaling over the last couple years as scaling has been the focus for everybody. I has been the focus for everybody. I has been the focus for everybody. I notice a lot in my email that the domain notice a lot in my email that the domain notice a lot in my email that the domain name associated with the email account name associated with the email account name associated with the email account and the domain and the brand name of the and the domain and the brand name of the and the domain and the brand name of the company sending the email are often company sending the email are often company sending the email are often really far apart and what it ends up really far apart and what it ends up really far apart and what it ends up looking like is even more spammy than looking like is even more spammy than looking like is even more spammy than before and even more AI generated. So I before and even more AI generated. So I before and even more AI generated. So I also want to just really emphasize the also want to just really emphasize the also want to just really emphasize the point that it is a brand touch point.

point that it is a brand touch point. point that it is a brand touch point. Whether they respond to the first email Whether they respond to the first email Whether they respond to the first email or not, you should be thinking about it or not, you should be thinking about it or not, you should be thinking about it almost like an ad impression. Make sure almost like an ad impression. Make sure almost like an ad impression. Make sure that your key point, your key pain point that your key point, your key pain point that your key point, your key pain point that you address comes across and your that you address comes across and your that you address comes across and your brand, your brand name, so when they see brand, your brand name, so when they see brand, your brand name, so when they see that again, whether that's retargeting that again, whether that's retargeting that again, whether that's retargeting ads or whatever, they feel familiar. If ads or whatever, they feel familiar. If ads or whatever, they feel familiar. If these things are wildly far apart these things are wildly far apart these things are wildly far apart because of all the fishing and all of because of all the fishing and all of because of all the fishing and all of the other scams that are out there, the other scams that are out there, the other scams that are out there, that's just another reason why somebody that's just another reason why somebody that's just another reason why somebody might ignore your email. And so, the might ignore your email. And so, the might ignore your email. And so, the closer those things are, if it says like closer those things are, if it says like closer those things are, if it says like like like your examples I thought were like like your examples I thought were like like your examples I thought were great, you know, huntergrowth.io, great, you know, huntergrowth.io, great, you know, huntergrowth.io, I think that's easily close enough where I think that's easily close enough where I think that's easily close enough where most people receiving an email would go, most people receiving an email would go, most people receiving an email would go, "Okay, these make sense." Right? That's "Okay, these make sense." Right? That's "Okay, these make sense." Right? That's what you need to accomplish. It doesn't what you need to accomplish. It doesn't what you need to accomplish. It doesn't have to be perfect, but you need to be have to be perfect, but you need to be have to be perfect, but you need to be close enough that you get the mental close enough that you get the mental close enough that you get the mental brand association out of that. This is a brand association out of that. This is a brand association out of that. This is a good follow-up for you, Oliver. Google good follow-up for you, Oliver. Google good follow-up for you, Oliver. Google versus Microsoft. Would you recommend versus Microsoft. Would you recommend versus Microsoft. Would you recommend filtering companies by small companies filtering companies by small companies filtering companies by small companies for Google, larger companies for for Google, larger companies for for Google, larger companies for Microsoft? It's a pretty reasonable Microsoft? It's a pretty reasonable Microsoft? It's a pretty reasonable expectation. What do you think? Yeah, I expectation. What do you think? Yeah, I expectation. What do you think? Yeah, I think that's a it's a good way to look think that's a it's a good way to look think that's a it's a good way to look at it and your mindset is definitely in at it and your mindset is definitely in at it and your mindset is definitely in the right place. I think for the right place. I think for the right place. I think for most of the time most of the time most of the time I I think yeah, if if you've got the I I think yeah, if if you've got the I I think yeah, if if you've got the ability to do it, if you can get the ability to do it, if you can get the ability to do it, if you can get the logistics down for it, then you're good.

logistics down for it, then you're good. logistics down for it, then you're good. But for the most part, I don't want But for the most part, I don't want But for the most part, I don't want people to to stress about this. If you people to to stress about this. If you people to to stress about this. If you rock and roll with Google inboxes, rock and roll with Google inboxes, rock and roll with Google inboxes, you're likely going to be fine. If you you're likely going to be fine. If you you're likely going to be fine. If you rock and roll with Microsoft inboxes, rock and roll with Microsoft inboxes, rock and roll with Microsoft inboxes, you're likely going to be fine. Just you're likely going to be fine. Just you're likely going to be fine. Just think about who your ICP is mostly going think about who your ICP is mostly going think about who your ICP is mostly going to be using. to be using. to be using. Yeah, it's a great point. Nothing to add Yeah, it's a great point. Nothing to add Yeah, it's a great point. Nothing to add there. Does leading with value mean leading Does leading with value mean leading with outcomes like improve your ROI, with outcomes like improve your ROI, with outcomes like improve your ROI, decrease costs, improve health outcomes, decrease costs, improve health outcomes, decrease costs, improve health outcomes, and how should these outcomes, value and how should these outcomes, value and how should these outcomes, value statements be? Um, why don't you go statements be? Um, why don't you go statements be? Um, why don't you go first, Oliver, because I definitely want first, Oliver, because I definitely want first, Oliver, because I definitely want to comment on this one as well. to comment on this one as well. to comment on this one as well. >> Yeah, sounds good. So, this is a great >> Yeah, sounds good. So, this is a great >> Yeah, sounds good. So, this is a great point and a great question. So point and a great question. So point and a great question. So there's two ways to look at leading with there's two ways to look at leading with there's two ways to look at leading with value. So leading with value the most of value. So leading with value the most of value. So leading with value the most of what I was speaking with is make it so what I was speaking with is make it so what I was speaking with is make it so they feel like they're receiving they feel like they're receiving they feel like they're receiving something. So just I'll continue to use something. So just I'll continue to use something. So just I'll continue to use it the because it's what I use in my it the because it's what I use in my it the because it's what I use in my business the example of the podcast business the example of the podcast business the example of the podcast invite. So they get to provide they get invite. So they get to provide they get invite. So they get to provide they get positioned as a thought leader. They get positioned as a thought leader. They get positioned as a thought leader. They get content. They get clips. They get content. They get clips. They get content. They get clips. They get exposed to my audience when I post it.

exposed to my audience when I post it. exposed to my audience when I post it. So that's the value they get. The value So that's the value they get. The value So that's the value they get. The value I get is I get a 30-minute conversation I get is I get a 30-minute conversation I get is I get a 30-minute conversation sit down where they can air out their sit down where they can air out their sit down where they can air out their business. If there's any way I can help business. If there's any way I can help business. If there's any way I can help them, then we progress into a them, then we progress into a them, then we progress into a conversation naturally. But if you're conversation naturally. But if you're conversation naturally. But if you're sending a direct email, then 100% lead sending a direct email, then 100% lead sending a direct email, then 100% lead with the outcomes. So, we'll save you 10 with the outcomes. So, we'll save you 10 with the outcomes. So, we'll save you 10 hours per week. We'll sign you five new hours per week. We'll sign you five new hours per week. We'll sign you five new clients in the next 30 days. We'll clients in the next 30 days. We'll clients in the next 30 days. We'll decrease costs here. We'll increase your decrease costs here. We'll increase your decrease costs here. We'll increase your health outcomes. whatever examples you'd health outcomes. whatever examples you'd health outcomes. whatever examples you'd like to to rock and roll with. I think like to to rock and roll with. I think like to to rock and roll with. I think the there's two different ways to look the there's two different ways to look the there's two different ways to look at it. So leading with value is you're at it. So leading with value is you're at it. So leading with value is you're really truly giving them something of really truly giving them something of really truly giving them something of value. And then two, if you're leaning value. And then two, if you're leaning value. And then two, if you're leaning more towards direct, then yes, 100% you more towards direct, then yes, 100% you more towards direct, then yes, 100% you need to be outcome focused. need to be outcome focused. need to be outcome focused. >> I want to also emphasize the specificity >> I want to also emphasize the specificity >> I want to also emphasize the specificity of your examples, Oliver, because you of your examples, Oliver, because you of your examples, Oliver, because you weren't just talking about outcomes more weren't just talking about outcomes more weren't just talking about outcomes more broadly. Um, you were talking about broadly. Um, you were talking about broadly. Um, you were talking about specific things. And I would add to this specific things. And I would add to this specific things. And I would add to this that the best versions of this that I've that the best versions of this that I've that the best versions of this that I've seen also lead with pain and then attach seen also lead with pain and then attach seen also lead with pain and then attach the outcome. And the reason for that is the outcome. And the reason for that is the outcome. And the reason for that is that a lot of time the outcome is what that a lot of time the outcome is what that a lot of time the outcome is what everybody says, right? Like how many everybody says, right? Like how many everybody says, right? Like how many different Look, if you're selling go to different Look, if you're selling go to different Look, if you're selling go to market software, which probably most of market software, which probably most of market software, which probably most of you are not, but if you were, you'd you are not, but if you were, you'd you are not, but if you were, you'd imagine we'd all be talking about imagine we'd all be talking about imagine we'd all be talking about pipeline and sales revenue and all of pipeline and sales revenue and all of pipeline and sales revenue and all of that. So like if you go to the very very that. So like if you go to the very very that. So like if you go to the very very end of all the outcomes, they kind of end of all the outcomes, they kind of end of all the outcomes, they kind of all sound the same. What's really true all sound the same. What's really true all sound the same. What's really true though is that the pain point that you though is that the pain point that you though is that the pain point that you address that makes your product unique address that makes your product unique address that makes your product unique or your service unique or the reason why or your service unique or the reason why or your service unique or the reason why your consulting firm is a better option

your consulting firm is a better option your consulting firm is a better option for them is usually very clear. There's for them is usually very clear. There's for them is usually very clear. There's a pain point that you solve better or a pain point that you solve better or a pain point that you solve better or that you focus on better. And I think that you focus on better. And I think that you focus on better. And I think like Oliver, what was it? You said like Oliver, what was it? You said like Oliver, what was it? You said something like 3% are actively looking. something like 3% are actively looking. something like 3% are actively looking. So that means 97% of the people that So that means 97% of the people that So that means 97% of the people that you're going to email, the timing isn't you're going to email, the timing isn't you're going to email, the timing isn't right. So what should you be trying to right. So what should you be trying to right. So what should you be trying to accomplish? Give them something that accomplish? Give them something that accomplish? Give them something that they can hang on to, that they can they can hang on to, that they can they can hang on to, that they can remember, that makes that brand remember, that makes that brand remember, that makes that brand impression more interesting, not because impression more interesting, not because impression more interesting, not because it gets you a meeting, but simply it gets you a meeting, but simply it gets you a meeting, but simply because they now associate you with with because they now associate you with with because they now associate you with with you with that value. That's going to get you with that value. That's going to get you with that value. That's going to get through the filters. And the other thing through the filters. And the other thing through the filters. And the other thing that's going to happen is you're far that's going to happen is you're far that's going to happen is you're far more likely to catch the 3% that way, by more likely to catch the 3% that way, by more likely to catch the 3% that way, by the way, because then they will be the way, because then they will be the way, because then they will be feeling the pain acutely. And we all feeling the pain acutely. And we all feeling the pain acutely. And we all know like I feel lots of pains that I know like I feel lots of pains that I know like I feel lots of pains that I haven't yet gotten a chance to address. haven't yet gotten a chance to address. haven't yet gotten a chance to address. And so the other thing is leading with And so the other thing is leading with And so the other thing is leading with the pain is a really great way to the pain is a really great way to the pain is a really great way to connect with somebody emotionally and connect with somebody emotionally and connect with somebody emotionally and honestly outcomes are sometimes they can honestly outcomes are sometimes they can honestly outcomes are sometimes they can be a little bit too broad. And so I be a little bit too broad. And so I be a little bit too broad. And so I think your example Oliver of really think your example Oliver of really think your example Oliver of really specific outcomes is great. Um and I specific outcomes is great. Um and I specific outcomes is great. Um and I think you know anytime you can lean into think you know anytime you can lean into think you know anytime you can lean into the pain I think those two things are the pain I think those two things are the pain I think those two things are generally going to catch their attention generally going to catch their attention generally going to catch their attention really quickly. Mhm.

>> Let's say you receive a reply from a >> Let's say you receive a reply from a first outreach. Yes, please send more first outreach. Yes, please send more first outreach. Yes, please send more info. You send and they don't get back info. You send and they don't get back info. You send and they don't get back to you. What's the best way to react to to you. What's the best way to react to to you. What's the best way to react to that? How would you react to that, that? How would you react to that, that? How would you react to that, Oliver? >> So, if it's a one-off, maybe don't be >> So, if it's a one-off, maybe don't be too concerned. It's still a numbers too concerned. It's still a numbers too concerned. It's still a numbers game. At the end of the day, marketing, game. At the end of the day, marketing, game. At the end of the day, marketing, sales, it's all numbers. If it's sales, it's all numbers. If it's sales, it's all numbers. If it's repeatedly happening, repeatedly happening, repeatedly happening, send send better info, send more values. send send better info, send more values. send send better info, send more values. You know, like the um you don't have to You know, like the um you don't have to You know, like the um you don't have to over complicate it. It's not rocket over complicate it. It's not rocket over complicate it. It's not rocket science. If you're if you're getting a science. If you're if you're getting a science. If you're if you're getting a ton of responses, people saying yes, ton of responses, people saying yes, ton of responses, people saying yes, please send more info, means you're in a please send more info, means you're in a please send more info, means you're in a really good spot because you're getting really good spot because you're getting really good spot because you're getting the attention, you're getting in a the attention, you're getting in a the attention, you're getting in a position to nurture that relationship. position to nurture that relationship. position to nurture that relationship. If it's struggling on the back end, then If it's struggling on the back end, then If it's struggling on the back end, then evaluate what you're sending or how evaluate what you're sending or how evaluate what you're sending or how you're sending it. Maybe rather than you're sending it. Maybe rather than you're sending it. Maybe rather than send more info, maybe you try to push send more info, maybe you try to push send more info, maybe you try to push for a call so you can custom the info for a call so you can custom the info for a call so you can custom the info you're going to send them. There there's you're going to send them. There there's you're going to send them. There there's so many different ways to look at it. so many different ways to look at it. so many different ways to look at it. >> And it never hurts to reply back in a >> And it never hurts to reply back in a >> And it never hurts to reply back in a really genuine way. Like, hey, I really really genuine way. Like, hey, I really really genuine way. Like, hey, I really hope that was useful. Can you give me hope that was useful. Can you give me hope that was useful. Can you give me some feedback? Or, did that hit the some feedback? Or, did that hit the some feedback? Or, did that hit the mark? Did that seem like something that mark? Did that seem like something that mark? Did that seem like something that provides you value? If not, I'd love to provides you value? If not, I'd love to provides you value? If not, I'd love to recalibrate. like don't hesitate if recalibrate. like don't hesitate if recalibrate. like don't hesitate if something doesn't seem like it's working something doesn't seem like it's working something doesn't seem like it's working to have the follow-up be something like to have the follow-up be something like to have the follow-up be something like that because then again not everybody's that because then again not everybody's that because then again not everybody's going to respond. They don't need to.

going to respond. They don't need to. going to respond. They don't need to. It's not their responsibility to give It's not their responsibility to give It's not their responsibility to give you that feedback, but you might get you that feedback, but you might get you that feedback, but you might get some. You'll get more than if you don't. some. You'll get more than if you don't. some. You'll get more than if you don't. >> Yeah, I like that. And to to add on it, >> Yeah, I like that. And to to add on it, >> Yeah, I like that. And to to add on it, I think um at the end of the day, these I think um at the end of the day, these I think um at the end of the day, these are still people. They don't want to be are still people. They don't want to be are still people. They don't want to be rude to you intentionally. It's very rude to you intentionally. It's very rude to you intentionally. It's very easy to not respond to an email. So, easy to not respond to an email. So, easy to not respond to an email. So, don't just instantly jump to worst case don't just instantly jump to worst case don't just instantly jump to worst case scenario like it's bad. Don't be afraid scenario like it's bad. Don't be afraid scenario like it's bad. Don't be afraid to ask. Like Matt said, most people are to ask. Like Matt said, most people are to ask. Like Matt said, most people are going to be willing to give you feedback going to be willing to give you feedback going to be willing to give you feedback if they liked it, they didn't like it. if they liked it, they didn't like it. if they liked it, they didn't like it. If you ask politely and genuinely, most If you ask politely and genuinely, most If you ask politely and genuinely, most people are going to be willing to to people are going to be willing to to people are going to be willing to to give you a bit of feedback. give you a bit of feedback. give you a bit of feedback. >> And they're very unlikely to respond >> And they're very unlikely to respond >> And they're very unlikely to respond back and go, "Yeah, this isn't even back and go, "Yeah, this isn't even back and go, "Yeah, this isn't even remotely interesting to me or this remotely interesting to me or this remotely interesting to me or this content sucks." Like, nobody's going to content sucks." Like, nobody's going to content sucks." Like, nobody's going to tell you your baby is ugly. So it's very tell you your baby is ugly. So it's very tell you your baby is ugly. So it's very good indicator like like like Oliver good indicator like like like Oliver good indicator like like like Oliver said if it's a volume issue then there's said if it's a volume issue then there's said if it's a volume issue then there's something there you should probably something there you should probably something there you should probably probe but otherwise I wouldn't sweat probe but otherwise I wouldn't sweat probe but otherwise I wouldn't sweat about it too much. about it too much. about it too much. Uh good question. How do you put up or Uh good question. How do you put up or Uh good question. How do you put up or how do you offer free value resources how do you offer free value resources how do you offer free value resources without putting your link in the without putting your link in the without putting your link in the message? Good question.

message? Good question. message? Good question. >> Good question. So the way I like to look >> Good question. So the way I like to look >> Good question. So the way I like to look at it is we don't want to put links in at it is we don't want to put links in at it is we don't want to put links in the initial outreach because that's the initial outreach because that's the initial outreach because that's what's being sent at scale. But if we're what's being sent at scale. But if we're what's being sent at scale. But if we're sending sending sending the way the filters are going to look at the way the filters are going to look at the way the filters are going to look at it, this person responded to them. it, this person responded to them. it, this person responded to them. There's some interest. There's a There's some interest. There's a There's some interest. There's a relationship being built. Now they can relationship being built. Now they can relationship being built. Now they can be a little bit more free on what gets be a little bit more free on what gets be a little bit more free on what gets sent between them. Whereas if we send sent between them. Whereas if we send sent between them. Whereas if we send 100 links and get no responses, 100 links and get no responses, 100 links and get no responses, they might associate that link with they might associate that link with they might associate that link with something that's suspicious. Whereas we something that's suspicious. Whereas we something that's suspicious. Whereas we get a response, we send a link, and then get a response, we send a link, and then get a response, we send a link, and then it progresses. That's always a good it progresses. That's always a good it progresses. That's always a good sign. So, it's going to be sent at a sign. So, it's going to be sent at a sign. So, it's going to be sent at a much lower volume, and there's already much lower volume, and there's already much lower volume, and there's already discourse going on, so it's less likely discourse going on, so it's less likely discourse going on, so it's less likely to get flagged. to get flagged. to get flagged. >> Yeah, it's a great comment. >> Do you find oneline qualifying intro is >> Do you find oneline qualifying intro is helpful upfront in an email? example, I helpful upfront in an email? example, I helpful upfront in an email? example, I work with your industry peers like X and work with your industry peers like X and work with your industry peers like X and X or better to dive into what's valuable X or better to dive into what's valuable X or better to dive into what's valuable to your target prospect.

to your target prospect. to your target prospect. Now, are you saying as a first line? Because are you saying as a first line? Because obviously you could potentially do both. obviously you could potentially do both. obviously you could potentially do both. Um, so maybe if you can clarify the Um, so maybe if you can clarify the Um, so maybe if you can clarify the question, are you asking as like an question, are you asking as like an question, are you asking as like an intro line? Um, Oliver, assume it's an intro line? Um, Oliver, assume it's an intro line? Um, Oliver, assume it's an intro line question. What would you say intro line question. What would you say intro line question. What would you say to that? to that? to that? >> Thanks, Jason. Yeah, I think leading out >> Thanks, Jason. Yeah, I think leading out >> Thanks, Jason. Yeah, I think leading out with or leading with the value to the with or leading with the value to the with or leading with the value to the prospect is going to be more important. prospect is going to be more important. prospect is going to be more important. So like a good mental framework you So like a good mental framework you So like a good mental framework you have, and I'll say this slowly if people have, and I'll say this slowly if people have, and I'll say this slowly if people want to write it down, is you want a want to write it down, is you want a want to write it down, is you want a call out. So that can be the the outcome call out. So that can be the the outcome call out. So that can be the the outcome you help them achieve, the actual offer, you help them achieve, the actual offer, you help them achieve, the actual offer, how you do it, and then a testimonial, how you do it, and then a testimonial, how you do it, and then a testimonial, and then dig into the pain point again and then dig into the pain point again and then dig into the pain point again if you'd like. So there's obviously, if you'd like. So there's obviously, if you'd like. So there's obviously, like I said earlier, there's no holy like I said earlier, there's no holy like I said earlier, there's no holy grail. I wish I could sit here and say grail. I wish I could sit here and say grail. I wish I could sit here and say if you write this exact email then your if you write this exact email then your if you write this exact email then your business will 3x the end of the year. I business will 3x the end of the year. I business will 3x the end of the year. I I wish that was the case. I wish I I had I wish that was the case. I wish I I had I wish that was the case. I wish I I had something like that for my own business. something like that for my own business. something like that for my own business. But it is a lot of testing. There's no But it is a lot of testing. There's no But it is a lot of testing. There's no right or wrong answers. You've kind of right or wrong answers. You've kind of right or wrong answers. You've kind of just got to try some stuff, see what just got to try some stuff, see what just got to try some stuff, see what works, what doesn't, then continuously works, what doesn't, then continuously works, what doesn't, then continuously change it, optimize it, and make change it, optimize it, and make change it, optimize it, and make adjustments as needed.

adjustments as needed. adjustments as needed. >> I'll I'll add to that. Uh Jason, one of >> I'll I'll add to that. Uh Jason, one of >> I'll I'll add to that. Uh Jason, one of the things that drives me crazy is like the things that drives me crazy is like the things that drives me crazy is like to Oliver's point, I'd love to be able to Oliver's point, I'd love to be able to Oliver's point, I'd love to be able to give more black and white answers to to give more black and white answers to to give more black and white answers to a lot of these questions, but one thing a lot of these questions, but one thing a lot of these questions, but one thing that we see that is even true of the that we see that is even true of the that we see that is even true of the data, not just the responses, but even data, not just the responses, but even data, not just the responses, but even the data is that one industry is often the data is that one industry is often the data is that one industry is often wildly different than another. The wildly different than another. The wildly different than another. The amount of data available for one amount of data available for one amount of data available for one industry is often very different from industry is often very different from industry is often very different from another. And so the problem is is like another. And so the problem is is like another. And so the problem is is like even telling you how do you find the how even telling you how do you find the how even telling you how do you find the how do you find the leads? Like all of these do you find the leads? Like all of these do you find the leads? Like all of these things are a bit subjective because they things are a bit subjective because they things are a bit subjective because they skew differently in each industry. And skew differently in each industry. And skew differently in each industry. And so honestly Oliver and I might 100% so honestly Oliver and I might 100% so honestly Oliver and I might 100% agree on this. It still might be worth agree on this. It still might be worth agree on this. It still might be worth you experimenting with your audience, you experimenting with your audience, you experimenting with your audience, Jason, to try to see does putting social Jason, to try to see does putting social Jason, to try to see does putting social proof a little higher in the email work proof a little higher in the email work proof a little higher in the email work better or not. Um those are things that better or not. Um those are things that better or not. Um those are things that I do find experimentation I do find experimentation I do find experimentation are really really valuable to sus out. are really really valuable to sus out. are really really valuable to sus out. um you know, do do one that's goes to 50 um you know, do do one that's goes to 50 um you know, do do one that's goes to 50 people and another one that goes to 50 people and another one that goes to 50 people and another one that goes to 50 people with a slightly different twist people with a slightly different twist people with a slightly different twist and just see if there's like a a really and just see if there's like a a really and just see if there's like a a really disproportionate response rate to one. disproportionate response rate to one. disproportionate response rate to one. Um it doesn't have to be a big long Um it doesn't have to be a big long Um it doesn't have to be a big long scientific experiment to still give you scientific experiment to still give you scientific experiment to still give you some directional information.

some directional information. some directional information. Great question. Does any of this advice change based on Does any of this advice change based on the size of the organization for your the size of the organization for your the size of the organization for your for example solar entrepreneur doing for example solar entrepreneur doing for example solar entrepreneur doing everything themselves? everything themselves? everything themselves? No, sadly. Um, I don't think so. Oliver, No, sadly. Um, I don't think so. Oliver, No, sadly. Um, I don't think so. Oliver, do you? do you? do you? >> No, I think it if you can build the >> No, I think it if you can build the >> No, I think it if you can build the system out a one person business, you system out a one person business, you system out a one person business, you can build it at a 100 person business as can build it at a 100 person business as can build it at a 100 person business as well. well. well. >> Yeah. I mean, look, one of the things we >> Yeah. I mean, look, one of the things we >> Yeah. I mean, look, one of the things we do, not a plug for Hunter, but like one do, not a plug for Hunter, but like one do, not a plug for Hunter, but like one of the things we focus on a lot in our of the things we focus on a lot in our of the things we focus on a lot in our product is trying to make all of this as product is trying to make all of this as product is trying to make all of this as easy as possible. So, if you are an easy as possible. So, if you are an easy as possible. So, if you are an individual that you can still do all of individual that you can still do all of individual that you can still do all of these things. Um, everybody like these things. Um, everybody like these things. Um, everybody like especially if you're a solarreneur or especially if you're a solarreneur or especially if you're a solarreneur or you're a consultant or something like you're a consultant or something like you're a consultant or something like this is a lever you should be pulling this is a lever you should be pulling this is a lever you should be pulling and you just have to find the right way. and you just have to find the right way. and you just have to find the right way. For you, it might not be about quantity, For you, it might not be about quantity, For you, it might not be about quantity, right? The scalability aspect of this right? The scalability aspect of this right? The scalability aspect of this might not be as big of an issue. It's might not be as big of an issue. It's might not be as big of an issue. It's more about automating good messages and more about automating good messages and more about automating good messages and um yeah like our tool other tools are um yeah like our tool other tools are um yeah like our tool other tools are going to be able to help you do that.

I love the awkward pause while we wait I love the awkward pause while we wait for the next question. [laughter] for the next question. [laughter] for the next question. [laughter] >> Matt, any questions for me? No, I'm >> Matt, any questions for me? No, I'm >> Matt, any questions for me? No, I'm kidding. kidding. kidding. >> Question from Peter. Does it make sense >> Question from Peter. Does it make sense >> Question from Peter. Does it make sense to post on as many social media to post on as many social media to post on as many social media platforms as possible to get your brand platforms as possible to get your brand platforms as possible to get your brand out there? Whoa. Depends on who you ask. out there? Whoa. Depends on who you ask. out there? Whoa. Depends on who you ask. I mean, yes, but like Oliver, give a I mean, yes, but like Oliver, give a I mean, yes, but like Oliver, give a more [laughter] well-reasoned answer to more [laughter] well-reasoned answer to more [laughter] well-reasoned answer to that question. that question. that question. >> Yeah, I think it comes back to a point I >> Yeah, I think it comes back to a point I >> Yeah, I think it comes back to a point I touched on earlier. If people know who touched on earlier. If people know who touched on earlier. If people know who you are, they're going to be more likely you are, they're going to be more likely you are, they're going to be more likely to respond. If I see a name pop up in my to respond. If I see a name pop up in my to respond. If I see a name pop up in my email inbox that I've also seen on on email inbox that I've also seen on on email inbox that I've also seen on on LinkedIn and YouTube, then I'll at least LinkedIn and YouTube, then I'll at least LinkedIn and YouTube, then I'll at least open the email, see what they've got to open the email, see what they've got to open the email, see what they've got to say. Whereas, if it's somebody I've say. Whereas, if it's somebody I've say. Whereas, if it's somebody I've never seen before, never seen before, never seen before, I'm not going to say I wouldn't open I'm not going to say I wouldn't open I'm not going to say I wouldn't open their email, but I'm definitely more their email, but I'm definitely more their email, but I'm definitely more likely to open an email from somebody I likely to open an email from somebody I likely to open an email from somebody I know that for the same thing. If know that for the same thing. If know that for the same thing. If somebody's knocking on Yeah. somebody's knocking on Yeah. somebody's knocking on Yeah. >> the front door of my house, if I don't >> the front door of my house, if I don't >> the front door of my house, if I don't know who they are, I'm be pretty know who they are, I'm be pretty know who they are, I'm be pretty skeptical opening the door. But if I've skeptical opening the door. But if I've skeptical opening the door. But if I've seen them around the neighborhood, if I seen them around the neighborhood, if I seen them around the neighborhood, if I know who they are, then yeah, I'll open know who they are, then yeah, I'll open know who they are, then yeah, I'll open the door, see what they got to say. the door, see what they got to say. the door, see what they got to say. >> It doesn't have to be social media, >> It doesn't have to be social media, >> It doesn't have to be social media, though, Peter. Um, something that I, so though, Peter. Um, something that I, so though, Peter. Um, something that I, so first off, I'm not prolific on social first off, I'm not prolific on social first off, I'm not prolific on social media, much to James' chagrin. Um, and media, much to James' chagrin. Um, and media, much to James' chagrin. Um, and one of the things that I tested one of the things that I tested one of the things that I tested previously, it was like, oh, do we previously, it was like, oh, do we previously, it was like, oh, do we follow up on LinkedIn after a cold follow up on LinkedIn after a cold follow up on LinkedIn after a cold outreach, and does that help? I actually outreach, and does that help? I actually outreach, and does that help? I actually found one of the most effective things found one of the most effective things found one of the most effective things for me personally was uh using um for me personally was uh using um for me personally was uh using um retargeting ads as a second touch. And retargeting ads as a second touch. And retargeting ads as a second touch. And what would what that would often do is what would what that would often do is what would what that would often do is like maybe the first email like maybe the first email like maybe the first email doesn't quite land, but it captures doesn't quite land, but it captures doesn't quite land, but it captures their attention a little bit. And then their attention a little bit. And then their attention a little bit. And then they go to the website, they see it,

they go to the website, they see it, they go to the website, they see it, they get a stronger brand impression. they get a stronger brand impression. they get a stronger brand impression. Now they're out trafficing the web, they Now they're out trafficing the web, they Now they're out trafficing the web, they get the retargeting ads. The next time I get the retargeting ads. The next time I get the retargeting ads. The next time I send a follow-up email, they've seen send a follow-up email, they've seen send a follow-up email, they've seen Hunter seven times, eight times. Now Hunter seven times, eight times. Now Hunter seven times, eight times. Now they're like, "Oh yeah, that Hunter." they're like, "Oh yeah, that Hunter." they're like, "Oh yeah, that Hunter." Yeah. And like I've seen this at Yeah. And like I've seen this at Yeah. And like I've seen this at multiple companies. When I was doing multiple companies. When I was doing multiple companies. When I was doing outreach directly for myself, I saw outreach directly for myself, I saw outreach directly for myself, I saw this. And so multiple touches are good. this. And so multiple touches are good. this. And so multiple touches are good. It doesn't have to be social media, but It doesn't have to be social media, but It doesn't have to be social media, but social media visibility can help make social media visibility can help make social media visibility can help make sure that people feel like you're sure that people feel like you're sure that people feel like you're credible if they do investigate like who credible if they do investigate like who credible if they do investigate like who is this person? Who's this Peter guy is this person? Who's this Peter guy is this person? Who's this Peter guy that's emailing me? It's not a bad idea, that's emailing me? It's not a bad idea, that's emailing me? It's not a bad idea, but it's not a requirement either. And but it's not a requirement either. And but it's not a requirement either. And also depends on the industry. Um, if also depends on the industry. Um, if also depends on the industry. Um, if you're marketing to a bunch of social you're marketing to a bunch of social you're marketing to a bunch of social marketers, yeah, you should probably be marketers, yeah, you should probably be marketers, yeah, you should probably be there. Um, but if you're marketing to a there. Um, but if you're marketing to a there. Um, but if you're marketing to a bunch of accountants, I don't know that bunch of accountants, I don't know that bunch of accountants, I don't know that they're going to set check your social they're going to set check your social they're going to set check your social media. So, like I I think it's industry media. So, like I I think it's industry media. So, like I I think it's industry specific a bit too. specific a bit too. specific a bit too. >> Yeah. Just to just to add on that, I >> Yeah. Just to just to add on that, I >> Yeah. Just to just to add on that, I don't think if you have a really good don't think if you have a really good don't think if you have a really good email, your social presence isn't going email, your social presence isn't going email, your social presence isn't going to make or break your campaign. If you to make or break your campaign. If you to make or break your campaign. If you write a good email, you write a good write a good email, you write a good write a good email, you write a good email, you're going to get good email, you're going to get good email, you're going to get good responses.

Question from Rebecca. I'm curious how Question from Rebecca. I'm curious how subdomains don't create a sense of chaos subdomains don't create a sense of chaos subdomains don't create a sense of chaos and insecurity for the person we are and insecurity for the person we are and insecurity for the person we are sending from. Aren't we building the sending from. Aren't we building the sending from. Aren't we building the brand of the person in the company? I brand of the person in the company? I brand of the person in the company? I mean, this is a bit I touched on this a mean, this is a bit I touched on this a mean, this is a bit I touched on this a little bit earlier. Rebecca, if you're little bit earlier. Rebecca, if you're little bit earlier. Rebecca, if you're still here, I do think of these as brand still here, I do think of these as brand still here, I do think of these as brand touch points. I think it's really touch points. I think it's really touch points. I think it's really important. I think it's something that's important. I think it's something that's important. I think it's something that's under emphasized in the industry. If you under emphasized in the industry. If you under emphasized in the industry. If you go and you read a bunch of, you know, go and you read a bunch of, you know, go and you read a bunch of, you know, outreach blog posts and Reddit posts and outreach blog posts and Reddit posts and outreach blog posts and Reddit posts and things, I think that this is under things, I think that this is under things, I think that this is under discussed and I think it's really discussed and I think it's really discussed and I think it's really important. You should think of this as a important. You should think of this as a important. You should think of this as a brand touch point. um worst case brand touch point. um worst case brand touch point. um worst case scenario, it's an opportunity to put scenario, it's an opportunity to put scenario, it's an opportunity to put your brand in front of somebody in a way your brand in front of somebody in a way your brand in front of somebody in a way that's very that's that you get to that's very that's that you get to that's very that's that you get to control the impression, right? You get control the impression, right? You get control the impression, right? You get to control what you say and how you say to control what you say and how you say to control what you say and how you say it. And so, um the subdomains it. And so, um the subdomains it. And so, um the subdomains themselves, as long as they're really themselves, as long as they're really themselves, as long as they're really really close to the brand that you're really close to the brand that you're really close to the brand that you're actually sending from, you should be actually sending from, you should be actually sending from, you should be okay. Um the ones that I've seen that okay. Um the ones that I've seen that okay. Um the ones that I've seen that are problematic, if I showed them to are problematic, if I showed them to are problematic, if I showed them to you, you would say, "Well, yeah, that's you, you would say, "Well, yeah, that's you, you would say, "Well, yeah, that's obviously problematic." Um, but there's obviously problematic." Um, but there's obviously problematic." Um, but there's a lot of ways that you can adjust like, a lot of ways that you can adjust like, a lot of ways that you can adjust like, you know, get hunter.io or get you know, get hunter.io or get you know, get hunter.io or get hunter.co. Like there's a lot of hunter.co. Like there's a lot of hunter.co. Like there's a lot of flexibility there, but you want to make flexibility there, but you want to make flexibility there, but you want to make sure the core brand is present so that sure the core brand is present so that sure the core brand is present so that that impression is of value. Otherwise, that impression is of value. Otherwise, that impression is of value. Otherwise, by the way, LinkedIn follow-up, social by the way, LinkedIn follow-up, social by the way, LinkedIn follow-up, social follow-up, retargeting, it doesn't follow-up, retargeting, it doesn't follow-up, retargeting, it doesn't matter. The rest of it won't matter matter. The rest of it won't matter matter. The rest of it won't matter because the brand impression is lost.

because the brand impression is lost. because the brand impression is lost. >> Yeah. And I think this was in the deck, >> Yeah. And I think this was in the deck, >> Yeah. And I think this was in the deck, but I didn't really emphasize it too but I didn't really emphasize it too but I didn't really emphasize it too much. One thing you can do as you're much. One thing you can do as you're much. One thing you can do as you're setting these up is these will forward setting these up is these will forward setting these up is these will forward to your main domain. So using the to your main domain. So using the to your main domain. So using the example from earlier, if somebody, and example from earlier, if somebody, and example from earlier, if somebody, and don't actually try this because I don't don't actually try this because I don't don't actually try this because I don't think it's a real domain, if somebody think it's a real domain, if somebody think it's a real domain, if somebody typed in huntergrowth.io, typed in huntergrowth.io, typed in huntergrowth.io, had we set that up, hunter.io's main had we set that up, hunter.io's main had we set that up, hunter.io's main website would still pop up. It would website would still pop up. It would website would still pop up. It would just forward everything to there. So you just forward everything to there. So you just forward everything to there. So you do want your brand name in there. You do want your brand name in there. You do want your brand name in there. You want it very similar. You want to convey want it very similar. You want to convey want it very similar. You want to convey your value proposition because like Matt your value proposition because like Matt your value proposition because like Matt said, it is a brand touch point. But if said, it is a brand touch point. But if said, it is a brand touch point. But if you set it up correctly, which is no you set it up correctly, which is no you set it up correctly, which is no issues, it will forward to your main issues, it will forward to your main issues, it will forward to your main domain. So if they type in that website, domain. So if they type in that website, domain. So if they type in that website, your main website pops up. your main website pops up. your main website pops up. Thanks, Oliver. Thanks, Oliver. Thanks, Oliver. We need like Jeopardy music in the pods. >> Oh, there are in fact. Um, curious, >> Oh, there are in fact. Um, curious, Oliver, what tools do you use to check Oliver, what tools do you use to check Oliver, what tools do you use to check your credibility score for an email your credibility score for an email your credibility score for an email domain before you start sending email? I domain before you start sending email? I domain before you start sending email? I think uh a super easy one is, let me think uh a super easy one is, let me think uh a super easy one is, let me just make sure I say this right. It's just make sure I say this right. It's just make sure I say this right. It's called Mail Tester.

called Mail Tester. called Mail Tester. Um you can use this for Yeah. Yeah. So, if you type in Yeah. Yeah. So, if you type in www.mmail-tester.com, you can um send an email to the email you can um send an email to the email they provide you from your main account they provide you from your main account they provide you from your main account and it'll tell you what your and it'll tell you what your and it'll tell you what your deliverability deliverability deliverability score is and tell you if you're score is and tell you if you're score is and tell you if you're blacklisted on any sites. So, that blacklisted on any sites. So, that blacklisted on any sites. So, that that's a super simple way to do it. that's a super simple way to do it. that's a super simple way to do it. There's a few others you can just have There's a few others you can just have There's a few others you can just have it automated. There's softwares that it automated. There's softwares that it automated. There's softwares that will do it for you. But if you just want will do it for you. But if you just want will do it for you. But if you just want to test a oneoff, like I said, if you to test a oneoff, like I said, if you to test a oneoff, like I said, if you set it up once, you really don't need to set it up once, you really don't need to set it up once, you really don't need to do this more than once a month. If you do this more than once a month. If you do this more than once a month. If you just want to send a just want to send a just want to send a email from Mail Tester, then you'll be email from Mail Tester, then you'll be email from Mail Tester, then you'll be all good. Also, look, we've got two all good. Also, look, we've got two all good. Also, look, we've got two things coming out in the next 30 days things coming out in the next 30 days things coming out in the next 30 days for our customers that are going to help for our customers that are going to help for our customers that are going to help with this. Um, one, we're actually going with this. Um, one, we're actually going with this. Um, one, we're actually going to release it as soon as it's ready on a to release it as soon as it's ready on a to release it as soon as it's ready on a landing page, so it could literally be landing page, so it could literally be landing page, so it could literally be available to anybody. Um, I I'd love to available to anybody. Um, I I'd love to available to anybody. Um, I I'd love to say it's next week or tomorrow. it's say it's next week or tomorrow. it's say it's next week or tomorrow. it's sometime in the next couple of weeks.

sometime in the next couple of weeks. sometime in the next couple of weeks. Um, and then that's going to get Um, and then that's going to get Um, and then that's going to get integrated into the product with a big integrated into the product with a big integrated into the product with a big release we have coming out in March. So, release we have coming out in March. So, release we have coming out in March. So, u, we're also going to make that even u, we're also going to make that even u, we're also going to make that even easier. But yes, in the interim, uh, easier. But yes, in the interim, uh, easier. But yes, in the interim, uh, mail tester and there's, you know, mail tester and there's, you know, mail tester and there's, you know, others like that that you could others like that that you could others like that that you could leverage. Should these emails from the new Should these emails from the new subdomain come out of our CRM? I So, no. um if it comes so what's the I So, no. um if it comes so what's the best way to frame this? I Oliver talk a best way to frame this? I Oliver talk a best way to frame this? I Oliver talk a little bit about if you will the goal of little bit about if you will the goal of little bit about if you will the goal of the sending like it's supposed to look the sending like it's supposed to look the sending like it's supposed to look like it's coming from Oliver and I think like it's coming from Oliver and I think like it's coming from Oliver and I think that's what's really important to get that's what's really important to get that's what's really important to get here is um your CRM actually is going to here is um your CRM actually is going to here is um your CRM actually is going to be sending a broadcast email. They're be sending a broadcast email. They're be sending a broadcast email. They're not even sending it onetoone. It's not even sending it onetoone. It's not even sending it onetoone. It's usually going to use a shared uh email usually going to use a shared uh email usually going to use a shared uh email address. So, it's not even going to look address. So, it's not even going to look address. So, it's not even going to look like it comes, it's going to look like a like it comes, it's going to look like a like it comes, it's going to look like a marketing email, which isn't what you're marketing email, which isn't what you're marketing email, which isn't what you're trying to achieve with with outreach.

trying to achieve with with outreach. trying to achieve with with outreach. Um, yeah, talk about that more, Oliver. Um, yeah, talk about that more, Oliver. Um, yeah, talk about that more, Oliver. >> Yeah, I think um we there's >> Yeah, I think um we there's >> Yeah, I think um we there's so I'll use an example and this isn't so I'll use an example and this isn't so I'll use an example and this isn't obviously like a dig. I think uh a lot obviously like a dig. I think uh a lot obviously like a dig. I think uh a lot of people when they run outbound, they of people when they run outbound, they of people when they run outbound, they might run it out of HubSpot, for might run it out of HubSpot, for might run it out of HubSpot, for example, and that is a purely kind of example, and that is a purely kind of example, and that is a purely kind of marketing automation. for for their marketing automation. for for their marketing automation. for for their newsletters or it should be used for newsletters or it should be used for newsletters or it should be used for their newsletters, but they've got it their newsletters, but they've got it their newsletters, but they've got it set up so it's running as their outbound set up so it's running as their outbound set up so it's running as their outbound system as well. So, they're running system as well. So, they're running system as well. So, they're running newsletters out of it. They're running newsletters out of it. They're running newsletters out of it. They're running outbound out of it. So, now we're outbound out of it. So, now we're outbound out of it. So, now we're targeting warm audiences, cold audiences targeting warm audiences, cold audiences targeting warm audiences, cold audiences with the same infrastructure, and those with the same infrastructure, and those with the same infrastructure, and those two should be kept separate. I think two should be kept separate. I think two should be kept separate. I think that that's one thing Hunter does really that that's one thing Hunter does really that that's one thing Hunter does really well. There's other softwares out there well. There's other softwares out there well. There's other softwares out there you can run it through. Um, just setting you can run it through. Um, just setting you can run it through. Um, just setting up an outbound specific infrastructure up an outbound specific infrastructure up an outbound specific infrastructure that's kind of separate from your CRM is that's kind of separate from your CRM is that's kind of separate from your CRM is really beneficial just so you know you really beneficial just so you know you really beneficial just so you know you have that piece of mind that it's not have that piece of mind that it's not have that piece of mind that it's not overlapping with anything you're already overlapping with anything you're already overlapping with anything you're already doing. We haven't thought of a great way doing. We haven't thought of a great way doing. We haven't thought of a great way to communicate this. So, let me be to communicate this. So, let me be to communicate this. So, let me be clear. This is sort of sample messaging.

clear. This is sort of sample messaging. clear. This is sort of sample messaging. But the way I like to think about where But the way I like to think about where But the way I like to think about where Hunter lives versus where your CRM lives Hunter lives versus where your CRM lives Hunter lives versus where your CRM lives is that you want your CRM to be the is that you want your CRM to be the is that you want your CRM to be the accounts you're talking to, the customer accounts you're talking to, the customer accounts you're talking to, the customer relationships you have, sales relationships you have, sales relationships you have, sales opportunities that are active in the opportunities that are active in the opportunities that are active in the pipeline that your sales reps are pipeline that your sales reps are pipeline that your sales reps are talking to. You want that data to be talking to. You want that data to be talking to. You want that data to be focused, clean. You don't want to have focused, clean. You don't want to have focused, clean. You don't want to have to deal with a bunch of noisy overhead. to deal with a bunch of noisy overhead. to deal with a bunch of noisy overhead. Hunter is like top offunnel like it's Hunter is like top offunnel like it's Hunter is like top offunnel like it's early early very very top offunnel the early early very very top offunnel the early early very very top offunnel the data is going to be messier a lot of data is going to be messier a lot of data is going to be messier a lot of these aren't going to generate these aren't going to generate these aren't going to generate conversations right and so you've got a conversations right and so you've got a conversations right and so you've got a lot of activity that you're trying to lot of activity that you're trying to lot of activity that you're trying to generate and when something positive generate and when something positive generate and when something positive happens that should be going into your happens that should be going into your happens that should be going into your CRM this helps you kind of keep both CRM this helps you kind of keep both CRM this helps you kind of keep both separate both systems clean and focused separate both systems clean and focused separate both systems clean and focused make sure your CRM data is is is solid make sure your CRM data is is is solid make sure your CRM data is is is solid and you don't run into the CRM bloat and you don't run into the CRM bloat and you don't run into the CRM bloat problem and it allows us to do things problem and it allows us to do things problem and it allows us to do things like continue to verify all all the like continue to verify all all the like continue to verify all all the leads and continue to try to keep the leads and continue to try to keep the leads and continue to try to keep the noisy data at least as organized and noisy data at least as organized and noisy data at least as organized and clean as possible so you can then mine clean as possible so you can then mine clean as possible so you can then mine for opportunities from it. By keeping for opportunities from it. By keeping for opportunities from it. By keeping those two systems separate, it actually those two systems separate, it actually those two systems separate, it actually really helps you down the road keeping really helps you down the road keeping really helps you down the road keeping your CRM useful and not bloated and not your CRM useful and not bloated and not your CRM useful and not bloated and not fragile. Um it seems like ah that's what fragile. Um it seems like ah that's what fragile. Um it seems like ah that's what CRM are for, right? but they actually CRM are for, right? but they actually CRM are for, right? but they actually kind of start to break and fold if you kind of start to break and fold if you kind of start to break and fold if you put way too much lead data in there put way too much lead data in there put way too much lead data in there because it ends up becoming just noisy because it ends up becoming just noisy because it ends up becoming just noisy and the data ages and then it's bad data and the data ages and then it's bad data and the data ages and then it's bad data and then that starts to affect your and then that starts to affect your and then that starts to affect your marketing efficiency. So, it's really marketing efficiency. So, it's really marketing efficiency. So, it's really good to try to figure out how to keep good to try to figure out how to keep good to try to figure out how to keep these two things separate. I wish I had these two things separate. I wish I had these two things separate. I wish I had like a really good visualization for like a really good visualization for like a really good visualization for this. I still don't. But like the like

this. I still don't. But like the like this. I still don't. But like the like that's the concept conceptually that's that's the concept conceptually that's that's the concept conceptually that's what you're trying to do is keep these what you're trying to do is keep these what you're trying to do is keep these two systems clean, focused, and as two systems clean, focused, and as two systems clean, focused, and as separate as you can. I think I mean did I ruin the last I think I mean did I ruin the last question time frame, James? question time frame, James? question time frame, James? >> Yes. Yeah. Time for one more question. >> Yes. Yeah. Time for one more question. >> Yes. Yeah. Time for one more question. There's been so many great questions and There's been so many great questions and There's been so many great questions and uh for anyone who hasn't had a chance to uh for anyone who hasn't had a chance to uh for anyone who hasn't had a chance to have their their question answered. Um have their their question answered. Um have their their question answered. Um we'll make sure that we we follow up uh we'll make sure that we we follow up uh we'll make sure that we we follow up uh with a piece of content that kind of with a piece of content that kind of with a piece of content that kind of goes through, you know, a summary of goes through, you know, a summary of goes through, you know, a summary of everything that's been asked today. Um, everything that's been asked today. Um, everything that's been asked today. Um, so I'm just going to pop up the last so I'm just going to pop up the last so I'm just going to pop up the last question for everyone and then Matt and question for everyone and then Matt and question for everyone and then Matt and Oliver, if you can just uh, yeah, let us Oliver, if you can just uh, yeah, let us Oliver, if you can just uh, yeah, let us know your thoughts on on David's know your thoughts on on David's know your thoughts on on David's question coming up now. question coming up now. question coming up now. >> Thanks, James. >> Thanks, James. >> Thanks, James. Automation has exploded over the last Automation has exploded over the last Automation has exploded over the last couple years and my reply rates have couple years and my reply rates have couple years and my reply rates have dropped. Yeah. Hiring managers say dropped. Yeah. Hiring managers say dropped. Yeah. Hiring managers say they're getting 40 to 50 emails a day. they're getting 40 to 50 emails a day. they're getting 40 to 50 emails a day. Not surprised. They ignore most. Yes. Not surprised. They ignore most. Yes. Not surprised. They ignore most. Yes. And in 2025, cold calling has generated And in 2025, cold calling has generated And in 2025, cold calling has generated more clients for me than email. Oh, more clients for me than email. Oh, more clients for me than email. Oh, fantastic. Is genuine outreach being fantastic. Is genuine outreach being fantastic. Is genuine outreach being drowned by automation? Um, I think what drowned by automation? Um, I think what drowned by automation? Um, I think what automation has done is make bad outreach automation has done is make bad outreach automation has done is make bad outreach easier. It's And so what you're seeing easier. It's And so what you're seeing easier. It's And so what you're seeing is that yes, all of those things that is that yes, all of those things that is that yes, all of those things that you said are true. I mean, minus the you said are true. I mean, minus the you said are true. I mean, minus the cold calling thing, although good for cold calling thing, although good for cold calling thing, although good for you. I don't hear that very often. Um, you. I don't hear that very often. Um, you. I don't hear that very often. Um, but it's just that it's made it easier but it's just that it's made it easier but it's just that it's made it easier for people to send more outreach that for people to send more outreach that for people to send more outreach that isn't genuine. It isn't personalized.

isn't genuine. It isn't personalized. isn't genuine. It isn't personalized. It's not relevant. And so I think that It's not relevant. And so I think that It's not relevant. And so I think that what that does is that that sort of what that does is that that sort of what that does is that that sort of masks the real value. It's easy to masks the real value. It's easy to masks the real value. It's easy to distract you and say like cold outreach distract you and say like cold outreach distract you and say like cold outreach isn't working for you when what's really isn't working for you when what's really isn't working for you when what's really happening is it's just become really happening is it's just become really happening is it's just become really really easy and really cheap to do it really easy and really cheap to do it really easy and really cheap to do it really badly and um and to do it at really badly and um and to do it at really badly and um and to do it at scale badly. I think that's the real key scale badly. I think that's the real key scale badly. I think that's the real key difference. Um difference. Um difference. Um also the things that we did two years also the things that we did two years also the things that we did two years ago have now been done for two years and ago have now been done for two years and ago have now been done for two years and so it's really easy to spot them. I so it's really easy to spot them. I so it's really easy to spot them. I think that's the other thing is like it think that's the other thing is like it think that's the other thing is like it there's a little bit of a fashion there's a little bit of a fashion there's a little bit of a fashion element to this over time. You have to element to this over time. You have to element to this over time. You have to change your tactics. you have to change change your tactics. you have to change change your tactics. you have to change your language a bit um because otherwise your language a bit um because otherwise your language a bit um because otherwise it becomes just a little bit too it becomes just a little bit too it becomes just a little bit too routine. What would you add to that routine. What would you add to that routine. What would you add to that Oliver? Oliver? Oliver? >> Yeah, I think it's a it is a great >> Yeah, I think it's a it is a great >> Yeah, I think it's a it is a great question and your mind's 100% in the question and your mind's 100% in the question and your mind's 100% in the right place. It has caused some issues right place. It has caused some issues right place. It has caused some issues but only if you are putting yourself in but only if you are putting yourself in but only if you are putting yourself in that same bucket, right? So if you were that same bucket, right? So if you were that same bucket, right? So if you were spending sending AI emails this time spending sending AI emails this time spending sending AI emails this time last year, now everybody's saying the last year, now everybody's saying the last year, now everybody's saying the same AI emails, they they're not going same AI emails, they they're not going same AI emails, they they're not going to get opened. It's the we'll pull it to get opened. It's the we'll pull it to get opened. It's the we'll pull it out from the context of just outbound out from the context of just outbound out from the context of just outbound email in general on YouTube, Instagram, email in general on YouTube, Instagram, email in general on YouTube, Instagram, Facebook, Tik Tok. There's millions, if Facebook, Tik Tok. There's millions, if Facebook, Tik Tok. There's millions, if not like hundreds of millions videos not like hundreds of millions videos not like hundreds of millions videos going up every second. But steeple going up every second. But steeple going up every second. But steeple people are still breaking through the people are still breaking through the people are still breaking through the noise with content. If you have a good noise with content. If you have a good noise with content. If you have a good piece of content, the algorithm is going piece of content, the algorithm is going piece of content, the algorithm is going to pick it up. It's going to get to pick it up. It's going to get to pick it up. It's going to get responses, comments, likes, all that. If responses, comments, likes, all that. If responses, comments, likes, all that. If you have a good email, it's also going you have a good email, it's also going you have a good email, it's also going to break through that same amount of to break through that same amount of to break through that same amount of noise. If you have a good cold call,

noise. If you have a good cold call, noise. If you have a good cold call, it's going to break through that same it's going to break through that same it's going to break through that same amount of noise. amount of noise. amount of noise. >> If cold calling 2025 generated more >> If cold calling 2025 generated more >> If cold calling 2025 generated more clients for you, there's probably clients for you, there's probably clients for you, there's probably someone right now thinking cold calling someone right now thinking cold calling someone right now thinking cold calling is terrible. I'm never doing it again. is terrible. I'm never doing it again. is terrible. I'm never doing it again. Like, it didn't get me one client even Like, it didn't get me one client even Like, it didn't get me one client even though I spent XYZ dollars on it all of though I spent XYZ dollars on it all of though I spent XYZ dollars on it all of last year. So every channel if you have last year. So every channel if you have last year. So every channel if you have the mindset that it's saturated will be the mindset that it's saturated will be the mindset that it's saturated will be saturated. But you've got to kind of saturated. But you've got to kind of saturated. But you've got to kind of find your edge. And you could say that find your edge. And you could say that find your edge. And you could say that about almost every channel out there. about almost every channel out there. about almost every channel out there. There's good competition, there's bad There's good competition, there's bad There's good competition, there's bad competition. There's slop and there's competition. There's slop and there's competition. There's slop and there's not slop. How do we break through that not slop. How do we break through that not slop. How do we break through that noise? noise? noise? Exactly right. This was great. Oliver, Exactly right. This was great. Oliver, Exactly right. This was great. Oliver, thanks so much for joining us for this. thanks so much for joining us for this. thanks so much for joining us for this. Um this was phenomenal. I hope the Um this was phenomenal. I hope the Um this was phenomenal. I hope the audience for the for those that are audience for the for those that are audience for the for those that are still here, thank you so much. Um I know still here, thank you so much. Um I know still here, thank you so much. Um I know a lot of you are still on. So, a lot of you are still on. So, a lot of you are still on. So, appreciate it. Hope this was valuable. appreciate it. Hope this was valuable. appreciate it. Hope this was valuable. We'll definitely get to uh the rest of We'll definitely get to uh the rest of We'll definitely get to uh the rest of the questions and make sure those get the questions and make sure those get the questions and make sure those get addressed. Uh we are going to share the addressed. Uh we are going to share the addressed. Uh we are going to share the recording. Um the slides will be recording. Um the slides will be recording. Um the slides will be available and so if you guys have any available and so if you guys have any available and so if you guys have any additional questions or followup, you additional questions or followup, you additional questions or followup, you know how to reach us. Um and please let know how to reach us. Um and please let know how to reach us. Um and please let us know if you have anything else and us know if you have anything else and us know if you have anything else and otherwise we'll be in touch.

otherwise we'll be in touch. otherwise we'll be in touch. Thanks Oliver. It's great to have you Thanks Oliver. It's great to have you Thanks Oliver. It's great to have you here. here. here. >> Thank you for having me on and for >> Thank you for having me on and for >> Thank you for having me on and for everybody tuning in. Thank you for your everybody tuning in. Thank you for your everybody tuning in. Thank you for your time and attention. time and attention. time and attention. >> Thanks James.