IoT Coffee Talk: Episode 312 - "IoT is a Trade" (It's not an ivory tower gig!)

>> Wow. There you go. Wow, this is like >> Wow. There you go. Wow, this is like warm up before you goes on stage, right? warm up before you goes on stage, right? warm up before you goes on stage, right? >> This is it, man. For the show. >> This is it, man. For the show. >> This is it, man. For the show. >> We're on Jazz Odyssey. >> We're on Jazz Odyssey. >> We're on Jazz Odyssey. And I used to make fun of how easy And I used to make fun of how easy And I used to make fun of how easy grunge was. grunge was. grunge was. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Smells like Teen Spirit. Is that what >> Smells like Teen Spirit. Is that what >> Smells like Teen Spirit. Is that what you were trying to play there? Yeah, but you were trying to play there? Yeah, but you were trying to play there? Yeah, but that smelt like [ __ ] you know? That was that smelt like [ __ ] you know? That was that smelt like [ __ ] you know? That was like It felt like that was kind of the like It felt like that was kind of the like It felt like that was kind of the song for a while and then you were just song for a while and then you were just song for a while and then you were just going the Northwest, I appreciate that. going the Northwest, I appreciate that. going the Northwest, I appreciate that. Yes. You know, little little extra Yes. You know, little little extra Yes. You know, little little extra trivia about that song. trivia about that song. trivia about that song. That was my wife and I are wedding song, That was my wife and I are wedding song, That was my wife and I are wedding song, our first our first our first Yes. We got married in Seattle and the Yes. We got married in Seattle and the Yes. We got married in Seattle and the right in the middle of the grunge deal. right in the middle of the grunge deal. right in the middle of the grunge deal. I know it seems weird and like It is I know it seems weird and like It is I know it seems weird and like It is weird. You guys are freaks. It's weird. You guys are freaks. It's weird. You guys are freaks. It's supposed to be like Frank Sinatra or supposed to be like Frank Sinatra or supposed to be like Frank Sinatra or something like that. something like that. something like that. >> Yeah, exactly. And uh >> Yeah, exactly. And uh >> Yeah, exactly. And uh Yeah, you know, it was the times. We Yeah, you know, it was the times. We Yeah, you know, it was the times. We were I don't know, you know. You were were I don't know, you know. You were were I don't know, you know. You were young kids. We were young young kids. We were young young kids. We were young we were crazy kids and Smells Like Teen we were crazy kids and Smells Like Teen we were crazy kids and Smells Like Teen Spirit was our first song. We were in a Spirit was our first song. We were in a Spirit was our first song. We were in a club, we were at club, we were at club, we were at Uh Pete, you might remember Celebrities Uh Pete, you might remember Celebrities Uh Pete, you might remember Celebrities uh down in Pioneer Square. I mean, it uh down in Pioneer Square. I mean, it uh down in Pioneer Square. I mean, it doesn't exist obviously anymore, but it doesn't exist obviously anymore, but it doesn't exist obviously anymore, but it was around back then. And, um, you know, was around back then. And, um, you know, was around back then. And, um, you know, that was right when all that stuff was that was right when all that stuff was that was right when all that stuff was there and the DJ we Yeah, we it I don't there and the DJ we Yeah, we it I don't there and the DJ we Yeah, we it I don't know. It's a weird story, but it know. It's a weird story, but it know. It's a weird story, but it happened and that's who we were.

happened and that's who we were. happened and that's who we were. We're raw, young, crazy kids. We're raw, young, crazy kids. We're raw, young, crazy kids. >> Yeah. And, um, there you go. That's >> Yeah. And, um, there you go. That's >> Yeah. And, um, there you go. That's awesome. Yeah, a little bit of Tiffany awesome. Yeah, a little bit of Tiffany awesome. Yeah, a little bit of Tiffany Tiffany history. Tiffany history. Tiffany history. >> Little Tiffany trivia there. Yeah, you >> Little Tiffany trivia there. Yeah, you >> Little Tiffany trivia there. Yeah, you know. And you know, we were talking know. And you know, we were talking know. And you know, we were talking about Van Halen and and, um, David Lee about Van Halen and and, um, David Lee about Van Halen and and, um, David Lee Roth earlier about writing the songs Roth earlier about writing the songs Roth earlier about writing the songs everything. everything. everything. You know how there's like so much fake You know how there's like so much fake You know how there's like so much fake news on all kinds of media now, AI news on all kinds of media now, AI news on all kinds of media now, AI generated news. generated news. generated news. Stories. Stories. Stories. Like So, basically, everybody already Like So, basically, everybody already Like So, basically, everybody already knows this, but we'll just say it. So, knows this, but we'll just say it. So, knows this, but we'll just say it. So, on Facebook, the Facebook, on Facebook, the Facebook, on Facebook, the Facebook, it's no longer really mostly about it's no longer really mostly about it's no longer really mostly about seeing what your friends are doing seeing what your friends are doing seeing what your friends are doing everything. Oh, yeah. everything. Oh, yeah. everything. Oh, yeah. >> Not only is it Not only is it the whole >> Not only is it Not only is it the whole >> Not only is it Not only is it the whole self-reinforcing bubbles that got them self-reinforcing bubbles that got them self-reinforcing bubbles that got them in trouble, but there's just all kinds in trouble, but there's just all kinds in trouble, but there's just all kinds of just news stories about and they find of just news stories about and they find of just news stories about and they find out that you're into music or you're out that you're into music or you're out that you're into music or you're into movies or you whatever and you just into movies or you whatever and you just into movies or you whatever and you just start seeing these long-form things and start seeing these long-form things and start seeing these long-form things and they suck you in. they suck you in. they suck you in. So, related to Eddie Van Halen. And So, related to Eddie Van Halen. And So, related to Eddie Van Halen. And obviously, there's a lot talk in the obviously, there's a lot talk in the obviously, there's a lot talk in the last 2 weeks about Michael Jackson cuz last 2 weeks about Michael Jackson cuz last 2 weeks about Michael Jackson cuz his movie's out. And even though the his movie's out. And even though the his movie's out. And even though the critics are panning it, critics are panning it, critics are panning it, it's headed towards a billion dollars it's headed towards a billion dollars it's headed towards a billion dollars because [laughter] because [laughter] because [laughter] the critics are panning it cuz they the critics are panning it cuz they the critics are panning it cuz they don't include all the bad stuff about don't include all the bad stuff about don't include all the bad stuff about Michael Jackson, you know, that Michael Jackson, you know, that Michael Jackson, you know, that happened. It's just the concerts and all happened. It's just the concerts and all happened. It's just the concerts and all the love, which is fine. And so, and the love, which is fine. And so, and the love, which is fine. And so, and it's In fact, I think Thriller is now it's In fact, I think Thriller is now it's In fact, I think Thriller is now back, uh, in the top 10 in the Hot 100 back, uh, in the top 10 in the Hot 100 back, uh, in the top 10 in the Hot 100 Billboard list. Um, you know, it's cool Billboard list. Um, you know, it's cool Billboard list. Um, you know, it's cool to see young people Yeah, cuz I mean, to see young people Yeah, cuz I mean, to see young people Yeah, cuz I mean, that was a phenomenon. But, there was that was a phenomenon. But, there was that was a phenomenon. But, there was like this story it was talking about how like this story it was talking about how like this story it was talking about how Eddie Van Halen getting together with

Eddie Van Halen getting together with Eddie Van Halen getting together with Michael to do Beat It, the guitar solo. Michael to do Beat It, the guitar solo. Michael to do Beat It, the guitar solo. And so, the whole story you're reading And so, the whole story you're reading And so, the whole story you're reading it, you know, and Eddie Van Halen gets a it, you know, and Eddie Van Halen gets a it, you know, and Eddie Van Halen gets a call from Quincy Jones, yeah, you know, call from Quincy Jones, yeah, you know, call from Quincy Jones, yeah, you know, and he's like, "What?" He's like, "Yeah, and he's like, "What?" He's like, "Yeah, and he's like, "What?" He's like, "Yeah, you know, you know, you know, Michael to to show he's for all kinds of Michael to to show he's for all kinds of Michael to to show he's for all kinds of music, he's going to do a rock song, and music, he's going to do a rock song, and music, he's going to do a rock song, and it's called Beat It, and he needs some it's called Beat It, and he needs some it's called Beat It, and he needs some help from you and all that kind of help from you and all that kind of help from you and all that kind of stuff." stuff." stuff." And And And and you go and he's like, "Oh, yeah, I and you go and he's like, "Oh, yeah, I and you go and he's like, "Oh, yeah, I got time to come down to the studio next got time to come down to the studio next got time to come down to the studio next Tuesday." And he comes down there Tuesday." And he comes down there Tuesday." And he comes down there whatever. And he's like, "Yeah, you whatever. And he's like, "Yeah, you whatever. And he's like, "Yeah, you know, cuz know, cuz know, cuz you know, we need you to do this song, you know, we need you to do this song, you know, we need you to do this song, you know, you know, you know, Thriller's out, and it's a real success, Thriller's out, and it's a real success, Thriller's out, and it's a real success, and so we need your help, you know, and so we need your help, you know, and so we need your help, you know, doing a guitar solo for Beat It." And doing a guitar solo for Beat It." And doing a guitar solo for Beat It." And then I'm like, "Wait, if the album Thriller's already out, if the album Thriller's already out, then it's too late for you to write the then it's too late for you to write the then it's too late for you to write the guitar solo for a song that's on that guitar solo for a song that's on that guitar solo for a song that's on that album." A lot of people obviously didn't get A lot of people obviously didn't get that. that. that. Like the fatal flaw in the AI was he's Like the fatal flaw in the AI was he's Like the fatal flaw in the AI was he's You guys aren't getting it either, are You guys aren't getting it either, are You guys aren't getting it either, are you? No, no, we get it, yeah. It's an you? No, no, we get it, yeah. It's an you? No, no, we get it, yeah. It's an impossible story. It's impossible. It's impossible story. It's impossible. It's impossible story. It's impossible. It's an impossible story. It's impossible an impossible story. It's impossible an impossible story. It's impossible story. We're just waiting for you to get story. We're just waiting for you to get story. We're just waiting for you to get to the end of it, that's all. Yeah, I to the end of it, that's all. Yeah, I to the end of it, that's all. Yeah, I >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I totally >> I totally >> I totally It's only a 1-hour show, Rob.

It's only a 1-hour show, Rob. It's only a 1-hour show, Rob. We only have a TikTok attention span. We only have a TikTok attention span. We only have a TikTok attention span. Come on, Rob. Oh, sorry. Sorry about Come on, Rob. Oh, sorry. Sorry about Come on, Rob. Oh, sorry. Sorry about that. that. that. >> NO, KEEP IT >> NO, KEEP IT >> NO, KEEP IT >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> NO, NO, >> NO, NO, >> NO, NO, BUT THERE'S LIKE SO MUCH STUFF LIKE BUT THERE'S LIKE SO MUCH STUFF LIKE BUT THERE'S LIKE SO MUCH STUFF LIKE THAT. THAT. THAT. >> KNOW, but people don't, you know, it >> KNOW, but people don't, you know, it >> KNOW, but people don't, you know, it goes over like you said that the goes over like you said that the goes over like you said that the attention span is light, and so people attention span is light, and so people attention span is light, and so people are just scrolling through like, "Oh, are just scrolling through like, "Oh, are just scrolling through like, "Oh, yeah, must be true." And they're like, yeah, must be true." And they're like, yeah, must be true." And they're like, you know, because the real story is you know, because the real story is you know, because the real story is Eddie Van Halen was never with Michael. Eddie Van Halen was never with Michael. Eddie Van Halen was never with Michael. He was like on some island somewhere and He was like on some island somewhere and He was like on some island somewhere and recorded it separately. The whole thing. recorded it separately. The whole thing. recorded it separately. The whole thing. They were never together. With Steve They were never together. With Steve They were never together. With Steve Lukather. Yeah, they were never Lukather. Yeah, they were never Lukather. Yeah, they were never together. together. together. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Lukather >> Lukather >> Lukather did down most of the guitar parts, did down most of the guitar parts, did down most of the guitar parts, actually, and then Eddie Van Halen actually, and then Eddie Van Halen actually, and then Eddie Van Halen rearranged that bit, you know, Yeah, right. You know, Yeah, right. You know, he did that whole breakdown, and then so he did that whole breakdown, and then so he did that whole breakdown, and then so that he can Yeah, cuz he didn't like it that he can Yeah, cuz he didn't like it that he can Yeah, cuz he didn't like it just being like just being like just being like you know, you know, you know, a a single part or a riff. a a single part or a riff. a a single part or a riff. a motif, so he changed a motif, so he changed a motif, so he changed He does what Eddie Van Halen does. He He does what Eddie Van Halen does. He He does what Eddie Van Halen does. He does all kinds of crazy stuff that does all kinds of crazy stuff that does all kinds of crazy stuff that sounds incredibly cool. Then of course sounds incredibly cool. Then of course sounds incredibly cool. Then of course he didn't get paid for any of it. And it he didn't get paid for any of it. And it he didn't get paid for any of it. And it was like one of the greatest, most was like one of the greatest, most was like one of the greatest, most popular songs, and biggest money-making popular songs, and biggest money-making popular songs, and biggest money-making song song song for you know. Right.

for you know. Right. for you know. Right. Yeah, he didn't care. Yeah, he didn't care. Yeah, he didn't care. But you know what? That was That That's But you know what? That was That That's But you know what? That was That That's who he was back then. You know what? who he was back then. You know what? who he was back then. You know what? That's That's That's the thing, authenticity. But even a ton the thing, authenticity. But even a ton the thing, authenticity. But even a ton of credit to David Lee Roth, he was of credit to David Lee Roth, he was of credit to David Lee Roth, he was incredibly authentic himself, you know? incredibly authentic himself, you know? incredibly authentic himself, you know? Well, sort of. Well, sort of. Well, sort of. Kind of ripped off that one other dude. Kind of ripped off that one other dude. Kind of ripped off that one other dude. I forgot the name of this individual, I forgot the name of this individual, I forgot the name of this individual, but you know, he did all this like, you but you know, he did all this like, you but you know, he did all this like, you know, know, know, How many people could do the splits? How many people could do the splits? How many people could do the splits? How many people could jump and do the How many people could jump and do the How many people could jump and do the splits in midair on stage like Diamond splits in midair on stage like Diamond splits in midair on stage like Diamond Dave? That was impressive. Dave? That was impressive. Dave? That was impressive. It was very impressive. It was very impressive. It was very impressive. Yeah, and doing kung fu with the you Yeah, and doing kung fu with the you Yeah, and doing kung fu with the you know, the little staff and yeah. know, the little staff and yeah. know, the little staff and yeah. Yeah. Amazing entertainment. And you Yeah. Amazing entertainment. And you Yeah. Amazing entertainment. And you know, artists There aren't that many know, artists There aren't that many know, artists There aren't that many artists that do that. artists that do that. artists that do that. Who don't rehearse those parts. It's Who don't rehearse those parts. It's Who don't rehearse those parts. It's just energy, right? They're just using just energy, right? They're just using just energy, right? They're just using energy as they're energy as they're energy as they're forming. And even Eddie, like running forming. And even Eddie, like running forming. And even Eddie, like running around and jumping and doing all this around and jumping and doing all this around and jumping and doing all this stuff, stuff, stuff, uh you know, all these weird uh you know, all these weird uh you know, all these weird I remember when he was like I remember when he was like I remember when he was like like suspended like had the wires on him like suspended like had the wires on him like suspended like had the wires on him and he was flying through the That was good stuff, man. That was good That was good stuff, man. That was good stuff.

stuff. stuff. As Leonard Nimoy would say, it was pure As Leonard Nimoy would say, it was pure As Leonard Nimoy would say, it was pure energy. energy. energy. Pure Pure Pure >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> What What song was that uh they they >> What What song was that uh they they >> What What song was that uh they they sampled? sampled? sampled? I want to know what you're thinking. And I want to know what you're thinking. And I want to know what you're thinking. And the song was They kept playing the clip the song was They kept playing the clip the song was They kept playing the clip from Spock saying, "Pure energy." Uh this is a music show and sometimes we Uh this is a music show and sometimes we talk about IoT and tech and things like talk about IoT and tech and things like talk about IoT and tech and things like physical AI. Oh my god. Yeah, we got um, physical AI. Oh my god. Yeah, we got um, physical AI. Oh my god. Yeah, we got um, you know, you know, you know, uh, uh, uh, our fill of Well, not really a fill of our fill of Well, not really a fill of our fill of Well, not really a fill of it, but we brought the physical AI it, but we brought the physical AI it, but we brought the physical AI message and grounded it in sensors at message and grounded it in sensors at message and grounded it in sensors at Sensors Converge, right? And uh Oh. Sensors Converge, right? And uh Oh. Sensors Converge, right? And uh Oh. Yeah, we hung out. Yeah, we hung out. Yeah, we hung out. >> Tell me all about it. I want to know all >> Tell me all about it. I want to know all >> Tell me all about it. I want to know all about Sensors Converge, man. about Sensors Converge, man. about Sensors Converge, man. That was a good show. Um, It was. Good That was a good show. Um, It was. Good That was a good show. Um, It was. Good conference. conference. conference. >> I can't believe how much um >> I can't believe how much um >> I can't believe how much um positive feedback there was on the positive feedback there was on the positive feedback there was on the floor. I mean, the traffic seemed like floor. I mean, the traffic seemed like floor. I mean, the traffic seemed like li- lighter than last year, but they had li- lighter than last year, but they had li- lighter than last year, but they had moved the date of the event a month uh moved the date of the event a month uh moved the date of the event a month uh it's usually in June, but because of it's usually in June, but because of it's usually in June, but because of like um like um like um I don't know, the World Cup, I don't know, the World Cup, I don't know, the World Cup, Mhm. they moved it to May this year. And Mhm. they moved it to May this year. And Mhm. they moved it to May this year. And uh you know, I guess what they didn't uh you know, I guess what they didn't uh you know, I guess what they didn't want happening were was uh, you know, want happening were was uh, you know, want happening were was uh, you know, the international Well, you know, a lot the international Well, you know, a lot the international Well, you know, a lot of the attendees are from around the of the attendees are from around the of the attendees are from around the globe, right?

globe, right? globe, right? >> Yeah, right. And it's >> Yeah, right. And it's >> Yeah, right. And it's Maybe people don't know that, but people Maybe people don't know that, but people Maybe people don't know that, but people like to converge in Silicon Valley for like to converge in Silicon Valley for like to converge in Silicon Valley for the semiconductor stuff. All right, I the semiconductor stuff. All right, I the semiconductor stuff. All right, I mean, the sensor stuff uh because a lot mean, the sensor stuff uh because a lot mean, the sensor stuff uh because a lot of the customers are there like Apple, of the customers are there like Apple, of the customers are there like Apple, uh like Meta. And so, it's like it's an uh like Meta. And so, it's like it's an uh like Meta. And so, it's like it's an interesting conference because this is interesting conference because this is interesting conference because this is one of the few conferences where Apple one of the few conferences where Apple one of the few conferences where Apple is very visible. Apple never shows up to is very visible. Apple never shows up to is very visible. Apple never shows up to anything. anything. anything. >> Yeah, and and and Qualcomm really makes >> Yeah, and and and Qualcomm really makes >> Yeah, and and and Qualcomm really makes a huge presence there as well because uh a huge presence there as well because uh a huge presence there as well because uh you know, you know, you know, uh you know, they're all they're uh you know, they're all they're uh you know, they're all they're competing with uh competing with uh competing with uh Qualcomm I mean, uh Apple when it comes Qualcomm I mean, uh Apple when it comes Qualcomm I mean, uh Apple when it comes to technologies bringing a lot of that to technologies bringing a lot of that to technologies bringing a lot of that mobile stuff, uh you know, that to the mobile stuff, uh you know, that to the mobile stuff, uh you know, that to the mobile world. But, yeah, it it's it's mobile world. But, yeah, it it's it's mobile world. But, yeah, it it's it's >> Rivian's there. Yeah, Rivian and you >> Rivian's there. Yeah, Rivian and you >> Rivian's there. Yeah, Rivian and you know, the the lidar, you know, all the know, the the lidar, you know, all the know, the the lidar, you know, all the sensors for the autonomous vehicles, sensors for the autonomous vehicles, sensors for the autonomous vehicles, which basically crashed cuz I don't know which basically crashed cuz I don't know which basically crashed cuz I don't know if No. the Luminar company, Luminar, the if No. the Luminar company, Luminar, the if No. the Luminar company, Luminar, the lidar company that some people were lidar company that some people were lidar company that some people were touting was going to be the next big touting was going to be the next big touting was going to be the next big thing because autonomous vehicles were thing because autonomous vehicles were thing because autonomous vehicles were going to be everywhere. They are going to be everywhere. They are going to be everywhere. They are everywhere.

everywhere. everywhere. No, not really. Uh they are No, not really. Uh they are No, not really. Uh they are they are they are they are >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I was in Scottsdale and I did two >> I was in Scottsdale and I did two >> I was in Scottsdale and I did two different rides. different rides. different rides. >> I know, yeah, saw that. >> I know, yeah, saw that. >> I know, yeah, saw that. >> It was awesome. I didn't die. My wife >> It was awesome. I didn't die. My wife >> It was awesome. I didn't die. My wife didn't die. Oh, good for you. didn't die. Oh, good for you. didn't die. Oh, good for you. IT WAS GREAT. IT WAS GREAT. That's the IT WAS GREAT. IT WAS GREAT. That's the IT WAS GREAT. IT WAS GREAT. That's the future. And you know what? Lots of future. And you know what? Lots of future. And you know what? Lots of people when they think about physical people when they think about physical people when they think about physical AI, which is like a wrapper or whatever, AI, which is like a wrapper or whatever, AI, which is like a wrapper or whatever, it's a lot of a lot of reusing a lot of it's a lot of a lot of reusing a lot of it's a lot of a lot of reusing a lot of the same IoT stuff, I get it. And but uh the same IoT stuff, I get it. And but uh the same IoT stuff, I get it. And but uh gosh, everybody's talking about physical gosh, everybody's talking about physical gosh, everybody's talking about physical AI and robots all the time and embodied AI and robots all the time and embodied AI and robots all the time and embodied intelligence. And And I get that. But I intelligence. And And I get that. But I intelligence. And And I get that. But I really feel like what's going on with really feel like what's going on with really feel like what's going on with Waymo self-driving cars, Waymo self-driving cars, Waymo self-driving cars, nothing compares to that. That is the nothing compares to that. That is the nothing compares to that. That is the epitome of physical AI and edge AI on epitome of physical AI and edge AI on epitome of physical AI and edge AI on wheels. wheels. wheels. Because It's sort of a perfect storm of Because It's sort of a perfect storm of Because It's sort of a perfect storm of tech. tech. tech. It is. [clears throat] It is. Yeah. And It is. [clears throat] It is. Yeah. And It is. [clears throat] It is. Yeah. And we lost him. we lost him. we lost him. Where did he just die? Where did he just die? Where did he just die? Yeah, you know, I think I think Yeah, you know, I think I think Yeah, you know, I think I think I think the sensors heard him and said, I think the sensors heard him and said, I think the sensors heard him and said, "Well, we don't want to hear about this, "Well, we don't want to hear about this, "Well, we don't want to hear about this, you know." Oh, we got [laughter] to kick you know." Oh, we got [laughter] to kick you know." Oh, we got [laughter] to kick this guy out. We got to kick this guy this guy out. We got to kick this guy this guy out. We got to kick this guy out. Yeah, I know what I out. Yeah, I know what I out. Yeah, I know what I you know, the you know, the you know, the It wasn't that long ago and I think It wasn't that long ago and I think It wasn't that long ago and I think Tesla was the same way with their full Tesla was the same way with their full Tesla was the same way with their full self-driving. You know, it used to be self-driving. You know, it used to be self-driving. You know, it used to be rules-based rules-based rules-based stuff. And the problem with rules-based, stuff. And the problem with rules-based, stuff. And the problem with rules-based, it makes sense early on because that's it makes sense early on because that's it makes sense early on because that's kind of like humans and we've been doing kind of like humans and we've been doing kind of like humans and we've been doing rules forever.

rules forever. rules forever. But after a while, trying to figure do But after a while, trying to figure do But after a while, trying to figure do rules for every edge case and every rules for every edge case and every rules for every edge case and every everything, it it you're chasing new everything, it it you're chasing new everything, it it you're chasing new rules that you need to apply to how your rules that you need to apply to how your rules that you need to apply to how your car operates in space. And so, you know, car operates in space. And so, you know, car operates in space. And so, you know, it wasn't that long ago that Google had it wasn't that long ago that Google had it wasn't that long ago that Google had Waymo switch, you know, to really using Waymo switch, you know, to really using Waymo switch, you know, to really using AI and, you know, doing machine learning AI and, you know, doing machine learning AI and, you know, doing machine learning and really learning. And the fact that and really learning. And the fact that and really learning. And the fact that they trained Waymo cars they trained Waymo cars they trained Waymo cars on digital twins. Yeah. on digital twins. Yeah. on digital twins. Yeah. >> Using a a world model digital twins of >> Using a a world model digital twins of >> Using a a world model digital twins of the planet Earth and trained it because the planet Earth and trained it because the planet Earth and trained it because that's the best way to train something that's the best way to train something that's the best way to train something is with digital twins. is with digital twins. is with digital twins. >> Yeah, like in the Matrix. Yeah, like in >> Yeah, like in the Matrix. Yeah, like in >> Yeah, like in the Matrix. Yeah, like in the Yeah, yeah. And so, you know, the the Yeah, yeah. And so, you know, the the Yeah, yeah. And so, you know, the when when they when Google switched from when when they when Google switched from when when they when Google switched from a rules engine-based thing to digital a rules engine-based thing to digital a rules engine-based thing to digital twins and true AI twins and true AI twins and true AI for all the nuances of the real world. for all the nuances of the real world. for all the nuances of the real world. And it's like, yeah, these Waymo And it's like, yeah, these Waymo And it's like, yeah, these Waymo vehicles have been trained. They've done vehicles have been trained. They've done vehicles have been trained. They've done 1 billion trips already, you know, in in 1 billion trips already, you know, in in 1 billion trips already, you know, in in this digital world model.

this digital world model. this digital world model. Uh Uh Uh Uh which is way more than they'll ever Uh which is way more than they'll ever Uh which is way more than they'll ever do in the real world. do in the real world. do in the real world. Um and then the AI but it but, you know, Um and then the AI but it but, you know, Um and then the AI but it but, you know, how like I'll talk about how like I'll how like I'll talk about how like I'll how like I'll talk about how like I'll do some IoT stuff where it's always a do some IoT stuff where it's always a do some IoT stuff where it's always a combination of deterministic and combination of deterministic and combination of deterministic and probabilistic. Yeah. probabilistic. Yeah. probabilistic. Yeah. >> Because because there's things happen in >> Because because there's things happen in >> Because because there's things happen in the real world the real world the real world No. No, I need to check it out. Um but No. No, I need to check it out. Um but No. No, I need to check it out. Um but things happen in the real world that you things happen in the real world that you things happen in the real world that you can't account for, you know? And um can't account for, you know? And um can't account for, you know? And um and so it's like like for instance, when and so it's like like for instance, when and so it's like like for instance, when you think of the Waymo car and it's got you think of the Waymo car and it's got you think of the Waymo car and it's got a zillion sensors on it and I know Elon a zillion sensors on it and I know Elon a zillion sensors on it and I know Elon makes fun of it makes fun of it makes fun of it cuz the Tesla doesn't have anything cuz the Tesla doesn't have anything cuz the Tesla doesn't have anything hanging off of it and Elon believes that hanging off of it and Elon believes that hanging off of it and Elon believes that cameras alone will be fine. Um I feel cameras alone will be fine. Um I feel cameras alone will be fine. Um I feel like Waymo is like over-engineered like Waymo is like over-engineered like Waymo is like over-engineered for safety and overthink but it works for safety and overthink but it works for safety and overthink but it works and they're actually in the lead by a and they're actually in the lead by a and they're actually in the lead by a wide margin even if it looks silly with wide margin even if it looks silly with wide margin even if it looks silly with all the things spinning all over the all the things spinning all over the all the things spinning all over the place. place. place. But the part that can't just be total AI But the part that can't just be total AI But the part that can't just be total AI is weird [ __ ] happens. A pedestrian is weird [ __ ] happens. A pedestrian is weird [ __ ] happens. A pedestrian walks right out in front of your car.

walks right out in front of your car. walks right out in front of your car. You know, cars get into your lane. All You know, cars get into your lane. All You know, cars get into your lane. All kinds of crazy stuff happens. And um and kinds of crazy stuff happens. And um and kinds of crazy stuff happens. And um and you need to be able to react to that. you need to be able to react to that. you need to be able to react to that. And so, it's always got to be a And so, it's always got to be a And so, it's always got to be a combination of yeah, I've been trained a combination of yeah, I've been trained a combination of yeah, I've been trained a billion times on a digital twin world billion times on a digital twin world billion times on a digital twin world model, model, model, but I also need to but I also need to but I also need to take care of real life as well cuz it's take care of real life as well cuz it's take care of real life as well cuz it's messy and you got to deal with it. And messy and you got to deal with it. And messy and you got to deal with it. And so, uh so, uh so, uh The newer the way the newer Waymos look The newer the way the newer Waymos look The newer the way the newer Waymos look a lot cooler. I mean, the a lot cooler. I mean, the a lot cooler. I mean, the Yeah. the current Waymos are just Yeah. the current Waymos are just Yeah. the current Waymos are just Jaguars that are The Jaguars. gear, but Jaguars that are The Jaguars. gear, but Jaguars that are The Jaguars. gear, but the newer Waymos that are designed that the newer Waymos that are designed that the newer Waymos that are designed that I've seen a few of them, they're much I've seen a few of them, they're much I've seen a few of them, they're much sleeker. sleeker. sleeker. Cuz they had the they had the they had a Cuz they had the they had the they had a Cuz they had the they had the they had a big boost at CES. big boost at CES. big boost at CES. >> CES, they showed some new Waymos at CES, >> CES, they showed some new Waymos at CES, >> CES, they showed some new Waymos at CES, yeah. So, they'll they'll get them out yeah. So, they'll they'll get them out yeah. So, they'll they'll get them out there, but I agree. I think you know, there, but I agree. I think you know, there, but I agree. I think you know, Waymo's way ahead and uh Waymo's way ahead and uh Waymo's way ahead and uh um you know, accommodating kind of and um you know, accommodating kind of and um you know, accommodating kind of and doing kind of the ultra low latency doing kind of the ultra low latency doing kind of the ultra low latency intelligent intelligent intelligent uh AGI uh uh AGI uh uh AGI uh is really important to Waymo because is really important to Waymo because is really important to Waymo because that's they they seem to have nailed it that's they they seem to have nailed it that's they they seem to have nailed it and uh and uh and uh Yeah. Yeah, once you take the Waymos Yeah. Yeah, once you take the Waymos Yeah. Yeah, once you take the Waymos though, like the third or fourth time, though, like the third or fourth time, though, like the third or fourth time, it becomes sort of uh blasé, you know, it becomes sort of uh blasé, you know, it becomes sort of uh blasé, you know, and sort of just getting in and and sort of just getting in and and sort of just getting in and like okay, get me where I want to go, like okay, get me where I want to go, like okay, get me where I want to go, you know. So, my my wife Kathy's like you know. So, my my wife Kathy's like you know. So, my my wife Kathy's like and they're playing like that music I and they're playing like that music I and they're playing like that music I hear when I'm at a spa.

hear when I'm at a spa. hear when I'm at a spa. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Like it's playing background music. >> Like it's playing background music. >> Like it's playing background music. >> That's the the killer feature is you go >> That's the the killer feature is you go >> That's the the killer feature is you go in and you play your own music on uh in and you play your own music on uh in and you play your own music on uh Right. Right. Absolutely. Right. Right. Absolutely. Right. Right. Absolutely. >> Absolutely. Yeah. You can't really do >> Absolutely. Yeah. You can't really do >> Absolutely. Yeah. You can't really do that in an Uber, you know. That's a good that in an Uber, you know. That's a good that in an Uber, you know. That's a good point. Um point. Um point. Um it's it is it's way more expensive it's it is it's way more expensive it's it is it's way more expensive though than doing an Uber and maybe though than doing an Uber and maybe though than doing an Uber and maybe that's just because I saw in San that's just because I saw in San that's just because I saw in San Francisco, it was cheaper. It was Francisco, it was cheaper. It was Francisco, it was cheaper. It was cheaper than an Uber. Really? cheaper than an Uber. Really? cheaper than an Uber. Really? >> I'm going from I'm in Scottsdale, >> I'm going from I'm in Scottsdale, >> I'm going from I'm in Scottsdale, South Scottsdale Road going up to north South Scottsdale Road going up to north South Scottsdale Road going up to north part of Scottsdale Road. So, let's say part of Scottsdale Road. So, let's say part of Scottsdale Road. So, let's say maybe 7 or 8 miles on a straight road to maybe 7 or 8 miles on a straight road to maybe 7 or 8 miles on a straight road to go to dinner [clears throat] up in the go to dinner [clears throat] up in the go to dinner [clears throat] up in the Kierland thing in North Scottsdale. Just Kierland thing in North Scottsdale. Just Kierland thing in North Scottsdale. Just a straight road and it was like $43. a straight road and it was like $43. a straight road and it was like $43. Yikes. And I'm just and I was like and I Yikes. And I'm just and I was like and I Yikes. And I'm just and I was like and I was like Maybe that's prototype pricing was like Maybe that's prototype pricing was like Maybe that's prototype pricing or something, but I don't know if I've or something, but I don't know if I've or something, but I don't know if I've seen anything That was funny. You know seen anything That was funny. You know seen anything That was funny. You know how like every tech in the early days, how like every tech in the early days, how like every tech in the early days, it's the most expensive version that it's the most expensive version that it's the most expensive version that it'll ever be is the early versions of it'll ever be is the early versions of it'll ever be is the early versions of it, and they'll get cheaper over time. it, and they'll get cheaper over time. it, and they'll get cheaper over time. So I didn't know. But you're saying it So I didn't know. But you're saying it So I didn't know. But you're saying it was cheaper for you when you bought it. was cheaper for you when you bought it. was cheaper for you when you bought it. >> for if you use the Waymo app in San >> for if you use the Waymo app in San >> for if you use the Waymo app in San Francisco, Francisco, Francisco, I've looked at it and it was it was, you I've looked at it and it was it was, you I've looked at it and it was it was, you know, a few bucks cheaper than Uber, a know, a few bucks cheaper than Uber, a know, a few bucks cheaper than Uber, a few bucks cheaper.

few bucks cheaper. few bucks cheaper. >> That's great. That's great. But it was >> That's great. That's great. But it was >> That's great. That's great. But it was fun. The cost per mile, obviously, is a fun. The cost per mile, obviously, is a fun. The cost per mile, obviously, is a lot more cuz the cars cost $500,000, so lot more cuz the cars cost $500,000, so lot more cuz the cars cost $500,000, so Marvin's got so much gear all over it, Marvin's got so much gear all over it, Marvin's got so much gear all over it, man. So but that's a big the cost per man. So but that's a big the cost per man. So but that's a big the cost per cost from cost per mile. cost from cost per mile. cost from cost per mile. >> Yeah. I guess like at the show, there's >> Yeah. I guess like at the show, there's >> Yeah. I guess like at the show, there's been a shift because automotive is not been a shift because automotive is not been a shift because automotive is not as big of a deal as it was maybe 3 4 as big of a deal as it was maybe 3 4 as big of a deal as it was maybe 3 4 years ago. Um yeah, definitely a shift years ago. Um yeah, definitely a shift years ago. Um yeah, definitely a shift toward toward toward whatever humanoid stuff, but whatever humanoid stuff, but whatever humanoid stuff, but I think the star of the show in terms of I think the star of the show in terms of I think the star of the show in terms of like like like spotlight device was the smart glasses. spotlight device was the smart glasses. spotlight device was the smart glasses. Right. Yeah, the Right. Yeah, the Right. Yeah, the S Micro really leaned in on on that S Micro really leaned in on on that S Micro really leaned in on on that stuff. TDK TDK's stuff. TDK TDK's stuff. TDK TDK's um um um CTO Cassette tapes? CTO Cassette tapes? CTO Cassette tapes? Yeah, exa- Yeah, exa- Yeah, exa- >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> exac- I I used to love TDK >> exac- I I used to love TDK >> exac- I I used to love TDK cassette tapes. Those are the ones TDK cassette tapes. Those are the ones TDK cassette tapes. Those are the ones TDK versus Maxell? Exactly. Yeah. You know, versus Maxell? Exactly. Yeah. You know, versus Maxell? Exactly. Yeah. You know, we actually talked to them about that. we actually talked to them about that. we actually talked to them about that. They had that This is These are some of They had that This is These are some of They had that This is These are some of the smart glasses, by the way. It's the smart glasses, by the way. It's the smart glasses, by the way. It's Sentient Sentient glasses.

Sentient Sentient glasses. Sentient Sentient glasses. But But But um yeah, TDK's got I talked to their um yeah, TDK's got I talked to their um yeah, TDK's got I talked to their marketing director cuz they're one of marketing director cuz they're one of marketing director cuz they're one of our strategic partners for AGI. And I our strategic partners for AGI. And I our strategic partners for AGI. And I was like, you know, you guys are doing was like, you know, you guys are doing was like, you know, you guys are doing some really cool stuff in Vinsense and some really cool stuff in Vinsense and some really cool stuff in Vinsense and all that, but all that, but all that, but you still got the the the cassette tape you still got the the the cassette tape you still got the the the cassette tape thing going on. In fact, they did a deal thing going on. In fact, they did a deal thing going on. In fact, they did a deal with Stranger Things, she said, where with Stranger Things, she said, where with Stranger Things, she said, where there was a T-shirt a TDK T-shirt there was a T-shirt a TDK T-shirt there was a T-shirt a TDK T-shirt some sort of like brand deal with some sort of like brand deal with some sort of like brand deal with Stranger Things like the Stranger Things Stranger Things like the Stranger Things Stranger Things like the Stranger Things came to them and said, "Hey, can we, you came to them and said, "Hey, can we, you came to them and said, "Hey, can we, you know, show this T-shirt?" Where then know, show this T-shirt?" Where then know, show this T-shirt?" Where then they started reselling the t-shirt as they started reselling the t-shirt as they started reselling the t-shirt as like merch. I love it. I love it. That's like merch. I love it. I love it. That's like merch. I love it. I love it. That's awesome. It's a little bit of honesty in awesome. It's a little bit of honesty in awesome. It's a little bit of honesty in there. But they're doing some cool there. But they're doing some cool there. But they're doing some cool stuff. stuff. stuff. And they've also acquired a number of And they've also acquired a number of And they've also acquired a number of companies at Vinnie since they acquired companies at Vinnie since they acquired companies at Vinnie since they acquired a a wearables a a wearables a a wearables kind of glasses frame company and so kind of glasses frame company and so kind of glasses frame company and so they're really they're really they're really going into the sensor space heavily. But going into the sensor space heavily. But going into the sensor space heavily. But Sentient was there and TDK Sentient was there and TDK Sentient was there and TDK Like Leonard was saying, a lot of Like Leonard was saying, a lot of Like Leonard was saying, a lot of wearables. A lot of medtech, too. I saw wearables. A lot of medtech, too. I saw wearables. A lot of medtech, too. I saw a lot of medtech a lot of a lot of medtech a lot of a lot of medtech a lot of [clears throat] biosensing saying muscle [clears throat] biosensing saying muscle [clears throat] biosensing saying muscle sensing sensing sensing uh you know, things like that. So I only uh you know, things like that. So I only uh you know, things like that. So I only saw one saw one saw one one booth that had a couple of goofy one booth that had a couple of goofy one booth that had a couple of goofy like kind of dog robots and stuff. But like kind of dog robots and stuff. But like kind of dog robots and stuff. But yeah.

yeah. yeah. >> Yeah, they were just trying to sell dog >> Yeah, they were just trying to sell dog >> Yeah, they were just trying to sell dog robots. But robots. But robots. But but they're all they're all yeah, but they're all they're all yeah, but they're all they're all yeah, they're all remote control. And then they're all remote control. And then they're all remote control. And then they have programmed moves. So they have programmed moves. So they have programmed moves. So when you see these when you see these when you see these these robots, there there's these robots, there there's these robots, there there's very little a AI in right very little a AI in right very little a AI in right orchestrating orchestrating orchestrating or a Street Fighter or a Tekken or a Street Fighter or a Tekken or a Street Fighter or a Tekken behavior. Yeah, or even perception. It's behavior. Yeah, or even perception. It's behavior. Yeah, or even perception. It's basically like Tekken. basically like Tekken. basically like Tekken. Tekken. Yeah, that's it. Tekken. Yeah, that's it. Tekken. Yeah, that's it. Or Street Fighter or you mean Fighter? Or Street Fighter or you mean Fighter? Or Street Fighter or you mean Fighter? >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> You know, it's But you know, the the >> You know, it's But you know, the the >> You know, it's But you know, the the joke is people think it's autonomous or joke is people think it's autonomous or joke is people think it's autonomous or it's exhibiting some sort of human it's exhibiting some sort of human it's exhibiting some sort of human behavior. It's all programmed. behavior. It's all programmed. behavior. It's all programmed. It it's just smoke and mirrors. You It it's just smoke and mirrors. You It it's just smoke and mirrors. You know, even the stuff that uh industrial know, even the stuff that uh industrial know, even the stuff that uh industrial all the industrial stuff um all the industrial stuff um all the industrial stuff um and even a humanoid uh most of it is and even a humanoid uh most of it is and even a humanoid uh most of it is just remote control. What about it's just remote control. What about it's just remote control. What about it's kind of cool, you know? It is cool.

kind of cool, you know? It is cool. kind of cool, you know? It is cool. Does anybody remember Freakazoid robots? Does anybody remember Freakazoid robots? Does anybody remember Freakazoid robots? Hm. I Isn't that like a song? Hm. I Isn't that like a song? Hm. I Isn't that like a song? Freakazoid robots like enter the dance Freakazoid robots like enter the dance Freakazoid robots like enter the dance floor kind of you know? floor kind of you know? floor kind of you know? >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I mean, am I the only one that knows >> I mean, am I the only one that knows >> I mean, am I the only one that knows anything about music history? anything about music history? anything about music history? Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. We used to dance to It's Star. Yes. We used to dance to It's Star. Yes. We used to dance to It's Star. Midnight Star. Midnight Absolutely. Midnight Star. Midnight Absolutely. Midnight Star. Midnight Absolutely. That's good stuff, man. I love it. That's good stuff, man. I love it. That's good stuff, man. I love it. Yeah, I I would do the music beatbox Yeah, I I would do the music beatbox Yeah, I I would do the music beatbox style right now, but it would be style right now, but it would be style right now, but it would be embarrassing. I I I had to learn that embarrassing. I I I had to learn that embarrassing. I I I had to learn that song song song because I was in the band. because I was in the band. because I was in the band. I was in the band. And then you know I was in the band. And then you know I was in the band. And then you know what's funny because sometimes you don't what's funny because sometimes you don't what's funny because sometimes you don't have a keyboard or you have extra parts have a keyboard or you have extra parts have a keyboard or you have extra parts and I had to have to figure out the and I had to have to figure out the and I had to have to figure out the guitar parts and I'd make it make it guitar parts and I'd make it make it guitar parts and I'd make it make it kind of like heavy metal. kind of like heavy metal. kind of like heavy metal. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Yeah, yeah. And we had the program into >> Yeah, yeah. And we had the program into >> Yeah, yeah. And we had the program into the Waymo cars, no parking on the dance the Waymo cars, no parking on the dance the Waymo cars, no parking on the dance floor. Yeah. I'm going to give you a ticket. I'm going to give you a ticket. >> [laughter] >> Oh my god, we're so bad. Yes. Oh. So, in >> Oh my god, we're so bad. Yes. Oh. So, in other news, um other news, um other news, um you know how I've you know, I I I use you know how I've you know, I I I use you know how I've you know, I I I use our friend Claude a lot and I've written our friend Claude a lot and I've written our friend Claude a lot and I've written a lot of code and it's helping me with a lot of code and it's helping me with a lot of code and it's helping me with some use cases and what gear to get.

some use cases and what gear to get. some use cases and what gear to get. When I talk about that sustainable When I talk about that sustainable When I talk about that sustainable development goal book, you know, it's development goal book, you know, it's development goal book, you know, it's like handbook like like handbook like like handbook like piecing together the bomb or how to do piecing together the bomb or how to do piecing together the bomb or how to do every use case. Anyway, every use case. Anyway, every use case. Anyway, but I thought I would go see how good but I thought I would go see how good but I thought I would go see how good Gemini is with writing code. Gemini is with writing code. Gemini is with writing code. And so I've spent some time this week And so I've spent some time this week And so I've spent some time this week kind of creating IoT, you know, kind of creating IoT, you know, kind of creating IoT, you know, lightweight IoT digital twin thing with lightweight IoT digital twin thing with lightweight IoT digital twin thing with uh with Postgres and stuff. And uh yeah, uh with Postgres and stuff. And uh yeah, uh with Postgres and stuff. And uh yeah, it's pretty good. It's not the same and it's pretty good. It's not the same and it's pretty good. It's not the same and it thinks differently. it thinks differently. it thinks differently. You know? Interesting. It's It's You know? Interesting. It's It's You know? Interesting. It's It's interesting to see what it does interesting to see what it does interesting to see what it does differently differently differently from what I what Claude does, you know? from what I what Claude does, you know? from what I what Claude does, you know? You're still achieving goals, but yeah, You're still achieving goals, but yeah, You're still achieving goals, but yeah, differently. Yeah, it's been kind of differently. Yeah, it's been kind of differently. Yeah, it's been kind of it's kind of fun. It doesn't do things it's kind of fun. It doesn't do things it's kind of fun. It doesn't do things as completely and crank out here's the as completely and crank out here's the as completely and crank out here's the file and here's the whole project for file and here's the whole project for file and here's the whole project for Visual Studio or whatever. Um you're Visual Studio or whatever. Um you're Visual Studio or whatever. Um you're still it's still just showing you on the still it's still just showing you on the still it's still just showing you on the screen, you're copying, pasting and screen, you're copying, pasting and screen, you're copying, pasting and putting code into stuff like that. But putting code into stuff like that. But putting code into stuff like that. But uh but it's uh but it's uh but it's >> actually be better, right? >> actually be better, right? >> actually be better, right? >> It's pretty good. It's pretty good, >> It's pretty good. It's pretty good, >> It's pretty good. It's pretty good, actually. You can You can You can deal actually. You can You can You can deal actually. You can You can You can deal with each step of the code code Yeah.

with each step of the code code Yeah. with each step of the code code Yeah. You know, coding. You know, coding. You know, coding. versus having some something just like versus having some something just like versus having some something just like spit something out and then you have to spit something out and then you have to spit something out and then you have to Right. hack everything and Right. hack everything and Right. hack everything and validate. validate. validate. >> Yes. Right. Yeah. Yes. So, I was doing >> Yes. Right. Yeah. Yes. So, I was doing >> Yes. Right. Yeah. Yes. So, I was doing some complicated thing and I've done some complicated thing and I've done some complicated thing and I've done this in the past with a digital twin this in the past with a digital twin this in the past with a digital twin system I built where, you know, I system I built where, you know, I system I built where, you know, I telemetry data for particular device, I telemetry data for particular device, I telemetry data for particular device, I I pre-create what the digital twin's I pre-create what the digital twin's I pre-create what the digital twin's schema looks like, right? You know, the schema looks like, right? You know, the schema looks like, right? You know, the properties, data types, all that [ __ ] properties, data types, all that [ __ ] properties, data types, all that [ __ ] Um and then the device is sending in Um and then the device is sending in Um and then the device is sending in telemetry and then it goes into a telemetry and then it goes into a telemetry and then it goes into a message queue and then you're pulling message queue and then you're pulling message queue and then you're pulling stuff out and you have to do some kind stuff out and you have to do some kind stuff out and you have to do some kind of transformation that says, "Oh, device of transformation that says, "Oh, device of transformation that says, "Oh, device 1 2 3 maps to this type, you know, this 1 2 3 maps to this type, you know, this 1 2 3 maps to this type, you know, this uh digital twin model." And then I would uh digital twin model." And then I would uh digital twin model." And then I would loop through a background process and loop through a background process and loop through a background process and write a bunch of code to convert what write a bunch of code to convert what write a bunch of code to convert what this JSON that's coming from the device this JSON that's coming from the device this JSON that's coming from the device and put it into a strongly typed uh and put it into a strongly typed uh and put it into a strongly typed uh table in the database, you know, so it's table in the database, you know, so it's table in the database, you know, so it's easy to query and stuff like that cuz easy to query and stuff like that cuz easy to query and stuff like that cuz I'm a fan of easy. I'm a fan of easy. I'm a fan of easy. Um and so uh Um and so uh Um and so uh and so I've done that a lot and it's a and so I've done that a lot and it's a and so I've done that a lot and it's a lot harder to do that and everything and lot harder to do that and everything and lot harder to do that and everything and and sometimes mistakes can pop along and sometimes mistakes can pop along and sometimes mistakes can pop along when things aren't perfect when data's when things aren't perfect when data's when things aren't perfect when data's flowing in cuz right, data's not always flowing in cuz right, data's not always flowing in cuz right, data's not always perfect, right? Um Yeah. And so it and perfect, right? Um Yeah. And so it and perfect, right? Um Yeah. And so it and so and then so with you know, with so and then so with you know, with so and then so with you know, with Gemini, it's it's in love with the uh Gemini, it's it's in love with the uh Gemini, it's it's in love with the uh Um this is so technical. I'm sorry, Um this is so technical. I'm sorry, Um this is so technical. I'm sorry, audience.

audience. audience. There's like in Postgres, you know, There's like in Postgres, you know, There's like in Postgres, you know, different databases, like so you know, different databases, like so you know, different databases, like so you know, you had all the NoSQL databases that got you had all the NoSQL databases that got you had all the NoSQL databases that got really hot and then all the relational really hot and then all the relational really hot and then all the relational databases had to like go, "Oh, crap, we databases had to like go, "Oh, crap, we databases had to like go, "Oh, crap, we better have JSON support, too, and we better have JSON support, too, and we better have JSON support, too, and we better support all this other stuff." better support all this other stuff." better support all this other stuff." And so uh you know, you have JSON And so uh you know, you have JSON And so uh you know, you have JSON support in everybody's deal. But one of support in everybody's deal. But one of support in everybody's deal. But one of the things that the things that the things that that Postgres uses something called that Postgres uses something called that Postgres uses something called JSONB. And it's a binary representation JSONB. And it's a binary representation JSONB. And it's a binary representation of your JSON data. of your JSON data. of your JSON data. And yeah, yeah. So it's And yeah, yeah. So it's And yeah, yeah. So it's So it's So it's smaller and it's way So it's So it's smaller and it's way So it's So it's smaller and it's way faster and you and you query it. And so faster and you and you query it. And so faster and you and you query it. And so instead of me dynamically creating a new instead of me dynamically creating a new instead of me dynamically creating a new table with the columns and data types table with the columns and data types table with the columns and data types and everything for the to represent the and everything for the to represent the and everything for the to represent the digital twin from the data, digital twin from the data, digital twin from the data, um it's not even trying to do that. It's um it's not even trying to do that. It's um it's not even trying to do that. It's just like, yeah, here it is and it's just like, yeah, here it is and it's just like, yeah, here it is and it's just this JSON B column and it it's not just this JSON B column and it it's not just this JSON B column and it it's not like we've never done that where we put like we've never done that where we put like we've never done that where we put a whole world of something in one cell, a whole world of something in one cell, a whole world of something in one cell, one column, you know, one row. one column, you know, one row. one column, you know, one row. Um but it's Um but it's Um but it's Yeah, yeah, it's like a blob. Yeah, it Yeah, yeah, it's like a blob. Yeah, it Yeah, yeah, it's like a blob. Yeah, it is. It's a blob. And but it's is. It's a blob. And but it's is. It's a blob. And but it's interesting and it interesting and it interesting and it it actually works pretty well and I'm it actually works pretty well and I'm it actually works pretty well and I'm sitting there going, well, will this sitting there going, well, will this sitting there going, well, will this scale? Can we, you know, and you're scale? Can we, you know, and you're scale? Can we, you know, and you're having having having I don't I don't know about you guys. I I I don't I don't know about you guys. I I I don't I don't know about you guys. I I think I know about you guys. I mean, I think I know about you guys. I mean, I think I know about you guys. I mean, I think we're all different.

think we're all different. think we're all different. But I mean, I I I use AI [laughter] But I mean, I I I use AI [laughter] But I mean, I I I use AI [laughter] heavily every day. heavily every day. heavily every day. We're all We're all individuals. No, We're all We're all individuals. No, We're all We're all individuals. No, yeah. I just mean that we're I know that yeah. I just mean that we're I know that yeah. I just mean that we're I know that we live in a bubble that the average we live in a bubble that the average we live in a bubble that the average person doesn't live in. And so, you person doesn't live in. And so, you person doesn't live in. And so, you know, I find I've used AI heavily every know, I find I've used AI heavily every know, I find I've used AI heavily every day. And I know that maybe we we might day. And I know that maybe we we might day. And I know that maybe we we might be in the 1% of people who do that. I be in the 1% of people who do that. I be in the 1% of people who do that. I don't know. don't know. don't know. But it's interesting. Anyway, there you But it's interesting. Anyway, there you But it's interesting. Anyway, there you go. So try out Gemini for coding. It's go. So try out Gemini for coding. It's go. So try out Gemini for coding. It's might be interesting. might be interesting. might be interesting. There you go. Great endorsement. There you go. Great endorsement. There you go. Great endorsement. I mean, I can tell you I can tell you I mean, I can tell you I can tell you I mean, I can tell you I can tell you this. this. this. Um Um Um first and foremost, I think the whole first and foremost, I think the whole first and foremost, I think the whole prompt engineering thing and everything prompt engineering thing and everything prompt engineering thing and everything like that, like that, like that, I think it's cool if you really want to I think it's cool if you really want to I think it's cool if you really want to learn how these things work, but I think learn how these things work, but I think learn how these things work, but I think at least from our side, I mean, there's at least from our side, I mean, there's at least from our side, I mean, there's a distinct point of view. a distinct point of view. a distinct point of view. Right? I mean, so like when we're Right? I mean, so like when we're Right? I mean, so like when we're talking twins and everything like that, talking twins and everything like that, talking twins and everything like that, like we would this whole week we've been like we would this whole week we've been like we would this whole week we've been having this huge back and forth having this huge back and forth having this huge back and forth internally about the state of twins and internally about the state of twins and internally about the state of twins and 3D versus operational and all of these 3D versus operational and all of these 3D versus operational and all of these other things. And the code that other things. And the code that other things. And the code that represents it represents it represents it because of the stack, right?

because of the stack, right? because of the stack, right? Uh so you can take a look at those like, Uh so you can take a look at those like, Uh so you can take a look at those like, you know, I mean, I I won't say names, you know, I mean, I I won't say names, you know, I mean, I I won't say names, but there are the those that do the 3D but there are the those that do the 3D but there are the those that do the 3D rendering, okay? Sure. rendering, okay? Sure. rendering, okay? Sure. And and for that there, you know, a lot And and for that there, you know, a lot And and for that there, you know, a lot a lot of times they're using Web GL. And a lot of times they're using Web GL. And a lot of times they're using Web GL. And for those that don't know, just Google for those that don't know, just Google for those that don't know, just Google Web GL. I mean, really it's just a a way Web GL. I mean, really it's just a a way Web GL. I mean, really it's just a a way of of browser rendering your of of browser rendering your of of browser rendering your environment. Um but there's a lot of environment. Um but there's a lot of environment. Um but there's a lot of scaffolding that's that's underneath all scaffolding that's that's underneath all scaffolding that's that's underneath all of that. of that. of that. And and so when you're when you when you And and so when you're when you when you And and so when you're when you when you do a comparison of a person writing that do a comparison of a person writing that do a comparison of a person writing that code in in context to what they're code in in context to what they're code in in context to what they're looking for as an output versus having looking for as an output versus having looking for as an output versus having that conversation with Claude or any AI, that conversation with Claude or any AI, that conversation with Claude or any AI, um um um the way that I approach it is so we like the way that I approach it is so we like the way that I approach it is so we like I said, we had this conversation. The I said, we had this conversation. The I said, we had this conversation. The way I approach it is in in a project, way I approach it is in in a project, way I approach it is in in a project, right? Co-work in a project and I lay right? Co-work in a project and I lay right? Co-work in a project and I lay out the frame. out the frame. out the frame. Here's here's everything and here's but Here's here's everything and here's but Here's here's everything and here's but everything is governed by a markdown.

everything is governed by a markdown. everything is governed by a markdown. A what? A what? A what? Markdown? Markdown? Markdown? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. An MD file. Oh, okay. An MD file. Oh, okay. An MD file. Oh, okay. All right. All right. All right. Um Um Um because I can edit those, but it becomes because I can edit those, but it becomes because I can edit those, but it becomes the contextual the contextual the contextual single point of truth. Uh-huh. single point of truth. Uh-huh. single point of truth. Uh-huh. So now I have a referenceable point to So now I have a referenceable point to So now I have a referenceable point to go back to whenever any hallucinations go back to whenever any hallucinations go back to whenever any hallucinations take place or anything else starts to take place or anything else starts to take place or anything else starts to drift or anything like that, I can I can drift or anything like that, I can I can drift or anything like that, I can I can catch that. Yeah. Um so so it I've kind catch that. Yeah. Um so so it I've kind catch that. Yeah. Um so so it I've kind of left the the the point of prompt of left the the the point of prompt of left the the the point of prompt engineering and landed on a series of engineering and landed on a series of engineering and landed on a series of markdowns that create the foundation by markdowns that create the foundation by markdowns that create the foundation by which the output is driven. So they they which the output is driven. So they they which the output is driven. So they they call that yeah, there there's people call that yeah, there there's people call that yeah, there there's people that are calling that context that are calling that context that are calling that context engineering. engineering. engineering. I mean, they're going to they're going I mean, they're going to they're going I mean, they're going to they're going to give it a name, you know, Yeah, I to give it a name, you know, Yeah, I to give it a name, you know, Yeah, I know. know. know. It's just It's just It's just >> I mean, I'm like at a given point, give >> I mean, I'm like at a given point, give >> I mean, I'm like at a given point, give it a name. it a name. it a name. I don't care. I mean, I'm just saying I don't care. I mean, I'm just saying I don't care. I mean, I'm just saying No, I I'm just saying I'm I'm No, I I'm just saying I'm I'm No, I I'm just saying I'm I'm helping you helping you helping you >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> associate some of the new buzzwords and >> associate some of the new buzzwords and >> associate some of the new buzzwords and new new new job roles that job roles that job roles that the the the prompt engineering folks are assigning prompt engineering folks are assigning prompt engineering folks are assigning themselves, but uh you And see, that's themselves, but uh you And see, that's themselves, but uh you And see, that's that's the weird part. That's probably that's the weird part. That's probably that's the weird part. That's probably why I don't get called to do keynotes why I don't get called to do keynotes why I don't get called to do keynotes and everything like that, because I'm and everything like that, because I'm and everything like that, because I'm going to say I could give less than two going to say I could give less than two going to say I could give less than two [ __ ] about, you know, what name you're [ __ ] about, you know, what name you're [ __ ] about, you know, what name you're calling it. Yeah. Because it's a calling it. Yeah. Because it's a calling it. Yeah. Because it's a distinct point of view, and your distinct point of view, and your distinct point of view, and your markdown doesn't look like my markdown.

markdown doesn't look like my markdown. markdown doesn't look like my markdown. So, Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And then So, Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And then So, Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And then all all just be becomes like goofy. It's all all just be becomes like goofy. It's all all just be becomes like goofy. It's like these SEO guys trying to all of a like these SEO guys trying to all of a like these SEO guys trying to all of a sudden become like context specialists, sudden become like context specialists, sudden become like context specialists, you know? And the problem for them you know? And the problem for them you know? And the problem for them though is that you have to become a though is that you have to become a though is that you have to become a domain expert. You actually need to know domain expert. You actually need to know domain expert. You actually need to know what kind of context to feed, and where what kind of context to feed, and where what kind of context to feed, and where the gaps are. And you know, the funny the gaps are. And you know, the funny the gaps are. And you know, the funny thing is you see all these context thing is you see all these context thing is you see all these context engineer guys talking about, "Oh, you engineer guys talking about, "Oh, you engineer guys talking about, "Oh, you know, you're missing context. You need know, you're missing context. You need know, you're missing context. You need to have comprehensive context." The to have comprehensive context." The to have comprehensive context." The thing is is you never have the full thing is is you never have the full thing is is you never have the full context. context. context. No, it definitely isn't in the world, No, it definitely isn't in the world, No, it definitely isn't in the world, especially in the world of twins, especially in the world of twins, especially in the world of twins, because that stuff is changing. Yeah, because that stuff is changing. Yeah, because that stuff is changing. Yeah, and and you know, one of the things that and and you know, one of the things that and and you know, one of the things that really really really stood out to me this year at Sensors stood out to me this year at Sensors stood out to me this year at Sensors Converge was Converge was Converge was the reminder that sensors drift just the reminder that sensors drift just the reminder that sensors drift just like AI models, and that it drifts from like AI models, and that it drifts from like AI models, and that it drifts from reality over time. They can degrade, reality over time. They can degrade, reality over time. They can degrade, they can They have all actually very they can They have all actually very they can They have all actually very similar problems to AI. But then, similar problems to AI. But then, similar problems to AI. But then, you layer AI on top of it, right?

you layer AI on top of it, right? you layer AI on top of it, right? And then you compound the problem And then you compound the problem And then you compound the problem because your AI can drift because your AI can drift because your AI can drift and it can and it can and it can degrade over time and then become degrade over time and then become degrade over time and then become disconnected from whatever abstracted disconnected from whatever abstracted disconnected from whatever abstracted reality that it's been trained on. So reality that it's been trained on. So reality that it's been trained on. So you you you the the the you know, as I was talking to engineers you know, as I was talking to engineers you know, as I was talking to engineers and some of the guys from you know, Edge and some of the guys from you know, Edge and some of the guys from you know, Edge Found Edge AI Foundation was there. You Found Edge AI Foundation was there. You Found Edge AI Foundation was there. You start to realize how difficult this start to realize how difficult this start to realize how difficult this stuff is and the guys who are up on stuff is and the guys who are up on stuff is and the guys who are up on stage pontificating about physical AI, stage pontificating about physical AI, stage pontificating about physical AI, you start to realize how little they you start to realize how little they you start to realize how little they know about what it takes to make this know about what it takes to make this know about what it takes to make this stuff usable and then long-term stuff usable and then long-term stuff usable and then long-term what the cost is to actually maintain what the cost is to actually maintain what the cost is to actually maintain good because good because good because and and so and and so and and so just tremendous props to that the just tremendous props to that the just tremendous props to that the engineers and the technical folks who engineers and the technical folks who engineers and the technical folks who actually deal with this stuff actually deal with this stuff actually deal with this stuff that probably have to painfully watch that probably have to painfully watch that probably have to painfully watch these bozos get up on stage and talk these bozos get up on stage and talk these bozos get up on stage and talk about exponential [ __ ] about exponential [ __ ] about exponential [ __ ] And sit there And sit there And sit there and go wow, what the [ __ ] are you and go wow, what the [ __ ] are you and go wow, what the [ __ ] are you talking about, right? What 14 oh talking about, right? What 14 oh talking about, right? What 14 oh >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> That was >> That was >> That was yeah, yeah, yeah, so one of the keynote speakers and won't so one of the keynote speakers and won't so one of the keynote speakers and won't call his name but like 14 what is it call his name but like 14 what is it call his name but like 14 what is it 14.8 billion as a number to even ask the 14.8 billion as a number to even ask the 14.8 billion as a number to even ask the audience or trillion what is this number

audience or trillion what is this number audience or trillion what is this number and he's asking and he's asking and he's asking the audience to guess on what the audience to guess on what the audience to guess on what cybercriminal economy cybercriminal economy cybercriminal economy >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> The problem is >> The problem is >> The problem is it it it it it it >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> it was recorded, right? But guess what >> it was recorded, right? But guess what >> it was recorded, right? But guess what it was the 14.8 trillion dollars. it was the 14.8 trillion dollars. it was the 14.8 trillion dollars. That was the combined That was the combined That was the combined No, no. He actually apparently not worth No, no. He actually apparently not worth No, no. He actually apparently not worth as much as everyone thinks, but which is as much as everyone thinks, but which is as much as everyone thinks, but which is kind of cool because that's a you know, kind of cool because that's a you know, kind of cool because that's a you know, a humble statistic associated a humble statistic associated a humble statistic associated to somebody who's quite large and to somebody who's quite large and to somebody who's quite large and exaggerated, but exaggerated, but exaggerated, but um um um it was the combined What was it? What it was the combined What was it? What it was the combined What was it? What was it that was it that was it that >> It was evaluation of the of the top >> It was evaluation of the of the top >> It was evaluation of the of the top seven, the Magnificent Seven. seven, the Magnificent Seven. seven, the Magnificent Seven. >> and then, you know, associating that to >> and then, you know, associating that to >> and then, you know, associating that to potential economic value. No, you don't potential economic value. No, you don't potential economic value. No, you don't do that. Valuation, stock market do that. Valuation, stock market do that. Valuation, stock market valuation is not the economy. It's like valuation is not the economy. It's like valuation is not the economy. It's like the number one the number one the number one misconception.

misconception. misconception. Anyone does that up on stage in my book, Anyone does that up on stage in my book, Anyone does that up on stage in my book, you've lost you I'm not listening to you you've lost you I'm not listening to you you've lost you I'm not listening to you anymore. Uh but yeah, it it was pretty anymore. Uh but yeah, it it was pretty anymore. Uh but yeah, it it was pretty funny. That wasn't my keynote. That was funny. That wasn't my keynote. That was funny. That wasn't my keynote. That was someone else just someone else just someone else just >> Yeah, but but just to clarify, just to >> Yeah, but but just to clarify, just to >> Yeah, but but just to clarify, just to clarify. You know what? It's a poison. clarify. You know what? It's a poison. clarify. You know what? It's a poison. And And And and it's a fallacy that's being Talk and it's a fallacy that's being Talk and it's a fallacy that's being Talk dirty to me. by Silicon Valley. There's dirty to me. by Silicon Valley. There's dirty to me. by Silicon Valley. There's so It's a Silicon Valley talk track. so It's a Silicon Valley talk track. so It's a Silicon Valley talk track. That valuation somehow equals economic That valuation somehow equals economic That valuation somehow equals economic growth, but then you when you look at growth, but then you when you look at growth, but then you when you look at some of these GDP growing at what a CAGR some of these GDP growing at what a CAGR some of these GDP growing at what a CAGR of like of like of like We're talking about global GDP, like 4% We're talking about global GDP, like 4% We're talking about global GDP, like 4% and then, you know, technology is and then, you know, technology is and then, you know, technology is growing at what what the valuation is growing at what what the valuation is growing at what what the valuation is way past that. So, how are you going to way past that. So, how are you going to way past that. So, how are you going to get a return off of get a return off of get a return off of an optimistic 4% global growth? But a an optimistic 4% global growth? But a an optimistic 4% global growth? But a lot of that's going to be driven by the lot of that's going to be driven by the lot of that's going to be driven by the developing economies, not the mature developing economies, not the mature developing economies, not the mature economies, right? Mature economies are economies, right? Mature economies are economies, right? Mature economies are growing at like, you know, 1 2%.

growing at like, you know, 1 2%. growing at like, you know, 1 2%. And the developing economies don't need And the developing economies don't need And the developing economies don't need AI to to drive growth, right? Because AI to to drive growth, right? Because AI to to drive growth, right? Because they're going to take on all of the they're going to take on all of the they're going to take on all of the [ __ ] stuff that the developed countries [ __ ] stuff that the developed countries [ __ ] stuff that the developed countries or the advanced economies or the advanced economies or the advanced economies don't want to do, you know, the stuff don't want to do, you know, the stuff don't want to do, you know, the stuff that that that everyone complained about Mhm. about everyone complained about Mhm. about everyone complained about Mhm. about [clears throat] globalism. [clears throat] globalism. [clears throat] globalism. So, none of this stuff makes any sense, So, none of this stuff makes any sense, So, none of this stuff makes any sense, you know, and you know, when you do you know, and you know, when you do you know, and you know, when you do the forecasting, Rob, you probably know, the forecasting, Rob, you probably know, the forecasting, Rob, you probably know, you have to do you know, what's called you have to do you know, what's called you have to do you know, what's called boundary testing and if you're the boundary testing and if you're the boundary testing and if you're the boundaries that you're assuming are just boundaries that you're assuming are just boundaries that you're assuming are just way way way exaggerated and wacky or exaggerated and wacky or exaggerated and wacky or you know, you know, you know, you have Yeah. you have nothing. You're you have Yeah. you have nothing. You're you have Yeah. you have nothing. You're just just just dead at that point. You know? dead at that point. You know? dead at that point. You know? >> It's like iterating through an array or >> It's like iterating through an array or >> It's like iterating through an array or you know, whatever and you have to do you know, whatever and you have to do you know, whatever and you have to do balance checking otherwise you could balance checking otherwise you could balance checking otherwise you could have an overflow. Yeah. But I mean at have an overflow. Yeah. But I mean at have an overflow. Yeah. But I mean at the end of the day, there's no one the end of the day, there's no one the end of the day, there's no one that's able to predict anything. I mean, that's able to predict anything. I mean, that's able to predict anything. I mean, when you get to 3 years out, you're when you get to 3 years out, you're when you get to 3 years out, you're already off.

already off. already off. But going back to your point, Leonard, But going back to your point, Leonard, But going back to your point, Leonard, about let's just talk about sensor drift about let's just talk about sensor drift about let's just talk about sensor drift and hardware, you know, and hardware, you know, and hardware, you know, that's why when you look at tech specs that's why when you look at tech specs that's why when you look at tech specs today and in the past, they always said today and in the past, they always said today and in the past, they always said plus or minus plus or minus plus or minus equivalent to or less than. I mean, they equivalent to or less than. I mean, they equivalent to or less than. I mean, they always had a spec because the always had a spec because the always had a spec because the performance is going to fall off and if performance is going to fall off and if performance is going to fall off and if you start to monitor those things and you start to monitor those things and you start to monitor those things and show them over a period of time, you show them over a period of time, you show them over a period of time, you will see that degradation take place. will see that degradation take place. will see that degradation take place. But but all of this, how is any of this But but all of this, how is any of this But but all of this, how is any of this any different than technology any different than technology any different than technology advancements that we've had in the past? advancements that we've had in the past? advancements that we've had in the past? Sure, this is probably the most that Sure, this is probably the most that Sure, this is probably the most that we've seen where people without a tech we've seen where people without a tech we've seen where people without a tech background can actually jump in and do background can actually jump in and do background can actually jump in and do something technical or appearance that something technical or appearance that something technical or appearance that of something technical. Um of something technical. Um of something technical. Um >> Yeah, exactly. Um >> Yeah, exactly. Um >> Yeah, exactly. Um >> You know what I mean, but but but those >> You know what I mean, but but but those >> You know what I mean, but but but those that are operating so like I don't even that are operating so like I don't even that are operating so like I don't even like the term art of the possible like the term art of the possible like the term art of the possible because it's anything, I mean, hell, because it's anything, I mean, hell, because it's anything, I mean, hell, anything's possible. Yeah.

anything's possible. Yeah. anything's possible. Yeah. >> If you put the pieces together. So, >> If you put the pieces together. So, >> If you put the pieces together. So, let's let's talk about the art of the let's let's talk about the art of the let's let's talk about the art of the outcome deliverable. Yeah. All right, outcome deliverable. Yeah. All right, outcome deliverable. Yeah. All right, let's talk about that. Let's talk about let's talk about that. Let's talk about let's talk about that. Let's talk about that. That is an art cuz if you can that. That is an art cuz if you can that. That is an art cuz if you can actually build something that drives an actually build something that drives an actually build something that drives an outcome and deliver on that at scale, outcome and deliver on that at scale, outcome and deliver on that at scale, now we got something to talk about. And now we got something to talk about. And now we got something to talk about. And oh by the way, when you do that, that oh by the way, when you do that, that oh by the way, when you do that, that that valuation piece that you're talking that valuation piece that you're talking that valuation piece that you're talking about will expose itself. Yeah. about will expose itself. Yeah. about will expose itself. Yeah. That is kind of weird that you say that That is kind of weird that you say that That is kind of weird that you say that you you don't get you should be invited you you don't get you should be invited you you don't get you should be invited upon stage all the time. upon stage all the time. upon stage all the time. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> You know what I'm saying? It's like it's >> You know what I'm saying? It's like it's >> You know what I'm saying? It's like it's just people are scared to bring you up just people are scared to bring you up just people are scared to bring you up because you just talk like it is. It's because you just talk like it is. It's because you just talk like it is. It's like you know, it's like basically hey like you know, it's like basically hey like you know, it's like basically hey people, you see this guy? You see this people, you see this guy? You see this people, you see this guy? You see this guy? You see this company, this company? guy? You see this company, this company? guy? You see this company, this company? Well, they're wasting your time. Well, they're wasting your time. Well, they're wasting your time. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I mean for a bunch of marketing >> I mean for a bunch of marketing >> I mean for a bunch of marketing nonsense, you know? It's It's It's But nonsense, you know? It's It's It's But nonsense, you know? It's It's It's But but you know, I get it into some degree but you know, I get it into some degree but you know, I get it into some degree because people are like, you know, come because people are like, you know, come because people are like, you know, come on, you have to be somewhat on, you have to be somewhat on, you have to be somewhat professional. It's like I'm totally professional. It's like I'm totally professional. It's like I'm totally professional. Oh, yeah. And I the fact professional. Oh, yeah. And I the fact professional. Oh, yeah. And I the fact that you don't like the language that I that you don't like the language that I that you don't like the language that I use I I I can walk out anywhere on the use I I I can walk out anywhere on the use I I I can walk out anywhere on the streets right there and talk to somebody streets right there and talk to somebody streets right there and talk to somebody and we're we're exchanging ideas using and we're we're exchanging ideas using and we're we're exchanging ideas using that language. Yeah. And Yeah. I mean, that language. Yeah. And Yeah. I mean, that language. Yeah. And Yeah. I mean, if you don't like that end of it, I get if you don't like that end of it, I get if you don't like that end of it, I get it. I mean, you know, that part of that it. I mean, you know, that part of that it. I mean, you know, that part of that doesn't change the fact that everything doesn't change the fact that everything doesn't change the fact that everything that I've done, I'm not going to say that I've done, I'm not going to say that I've done, I'm not going to say something that is as suspect except for something that is as suspect except for something that is as suspect except for they didn't land on the moon. But I they didn't land on the moon. But I they didn't land on the moon. But I mean, I'm not going to say mean, I'm not going to say mean, I'm not going to say >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I'm not going >> I'm not going >> I'm not going Look at Robin.

Look at Robin. Look at Robin. I said an opinion. You're right. I I said an opinion. You're right. I I said an opinion. You're right. I should have been quiet. should have been quiet. should have been quiet. You know, the point of We're all We're You know, the point of We're all We're You know, the point of We're all We're all We're all with you, right up until all We're all with you, right up until all We're all with you, right up until that point, Bill. We were right I know. that point, Bill. We were right I know. that point, Bill. We were right I know. I know, but You had credit until I have I know, but You had credit until I have I know, but You had credit until I have to remind people that I Now we're all to remind people that I Now we're all to remind people that I Now we're all >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I have to remind people that I will do >> I have to remind people that I will do >> I have to remind people that I will do that. I love the debate myself. that. I love the debate myself. that. I love the debate myself. But when we're talking about literally, But when we're talking about literally, But when we're talking about literally, you know, the businesses and how I built you know, the businesses and how I built you know, the businesses and how I built the businesses that that I have now and the businesses that that I have now and the businesses that that I have now and what we're Exactly. Exactly. But what happened? But what happened? But what happened? You got a little me glitch. You got a little me glitch. You got a little me glitch. >> You had a glitch. You had a glitch in >> You had a glitch. You had a glitch in >> You had a glitch. You had a glitch in the matrix. You got killed now. You had the matrix. You got killed now. You had the matrix. You got killed now. You had a glitch in the matrix. a glitch in the matrix. a glitch in the matrix. >> Oh, it it was trying to shut me down. >> Oh, it it was trying to shut me down. >> Oh, it it was trying to shut me down. Yeah, it was trying to shut you down. It Yeah, it was trying to shut you down. It Yeah, it was trying to shut you down. It was trying to shut you up, man. was trying to shut you up, man. was trying to shut you up, man. It was trying to it was trying to it was It was trying to it was trying to it was It was trying to it was trying to it was trying to censor me. trying to censor me. trying to censor me. >> You were being censored. >> You were being censored. >> You were being censored. The the the things that the things that The the the things that the things that The the the things that the things that I've built and the companies and I've built and the companies and I've built and the companies and everything, I mean all the people that everything, I mean all the people that everything, I mean all the people that work with me. Um work with me. Um work with me. Um I mean it everything's on the table. I mean it everything's on the table. I mean it everything's on the table. It's not my way or any way. I learn from It's not my way or any way. I learn from It's not my way or any way. I learn from them on a daily basis. Yeah.

them on a daily basis. Yeah. them on a daily basis. Yeah. I'll tell them, here's what I think and I'll tell them, here's what I think and I'll tell them, here's what I think and this is why and they'll be like, no this is why and they'll be like, no this is why and they'll be like, no you're wrong. you're wrong. you're wrong. Here here's what it is and here's the Here here's what it is and here's the Here here's what it is and here's the data that supports it. Okay, cool. data that supports it. Okay, cool. data that supports it. Okay, cool. Change my perspective right then on the Change my perspective right then on the Change my perspective right then on the on the on the fly and we'll credit them on the on the fly and we'll credit them on the on the fly and we'll credit them for correcting me. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I for correcting me. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I for correcting me. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I mean I I mean I I mean I I Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Everything all of this is still a >> Everything all of this is still a >> Everything all of this is still a conversation, right? I mean all of the conversation, right? I mean all of the conversation, right? I mean all of the you know, when the thing that I don't you know, when the thing that I don't you know, when the thing that I don't like is the is the BS behind it when like is the is the BS behind it when like is the is the BS behind it when people are like, oh yeah, we're we're people are like, oh yeah, we're we're people are like, oh yeah, we're we're edge based and then we start talking edge based and then we start talking edge based and then we start talking about their architecture and it's like, about their architecture and it's like, about their architecture and it's like, okay, so how do your messages get from okay, so how do your messages get from okay, so how do your messages get from here to there? Oh, well back over here. here to there? Oh, well back over here. here to there? Oh, well back over here. Oh, wait a minute, you're sending them Oh, wait a minute, you're sending them Oh, wait a minute, you're sending them back to the center cloud from the center back to the center cloud from the center back to the center cloud from the center cloud back down. So, you're still doing cloud back down. So, you're still doing cloud back down. So, you're still doing a round trip. Yeah. a round trip. Yeah. a round trip. Yeah. Your edge to edge communication is not Your edge to edge communication is not Your edge to edge communication is not really edge to edge. It's edge cloud to really edge to edge. It's edge cloud to really edge to edge. It's edge cloud to edge. edge. edge. Yeah. Yeah. And you know, that was one Yeah. Yeah. And you know, that was one Yeah. Yeah. And you know, that was one of the of the of the discussions that discussions that discussions that was um was um was um at least um at least um at least um quite frequent at Sensors Converge where quite frequent at Sensors Converge where quite frequent at Sensors Converge where we're talking about how edge AI, you we're talking about how edge AI, you we're talking about how edge AI, you know, how there's a AI know, how there's a AI know, how there's a AI AI IoT camp, right? It's like IoT with AI IoT camp, right? It's like IoT with AI IoT camp, right? It's like IoT with AI sprinkled on top, right?

AI sprinkled on top, right? AI sprinkled on top, right? >> Sure. Then you have edge AI. Edge AI is >> Sure. Then you have edge AI. Edge AI is >> Sure. Then you have edge AI. Edge AI is actually a different beast. It's almost actually a different beast. It's almost actually a different beast. It's almost like, you know, what talked about Pete. like, you know, what talked about Pete. like, you know, what talked about Pete. It's a counterpoint to IoT. It makes you It's a counterpoint to IoT. It makes you It's a counterpoint to IoT. It makes you think different. Like so, everything think different. Like so, everything think different. Like so, everything that you were talking about earlier, that you were talking about earlier, that you were talking about earlier, Rob, how Rob, how Rob, how you're dealing with streaming data you're dealing with streaming data you're dealing with streaming data and then you're, you know, aggregating and then you're, you know, aggregating and then you're, you know, aggregating it somewhere and then using a digital it somewhere and then using a digital it somewhere and then using a digital twin or some kind of ontology to to twin or some kind of ontology to to twin or some kind of ontology to to normalize it and normalize it and normalize it and give it meaning. give it meaning. give it meaning. That flips. That whole model is, That flips. That whole model is, That flips. That whole model is, you know, put on its head because Edge you know, put on its head because Edge you know, put on its head because Edge AI actually is about is really about how AI actually is about is really about how AI actually is about is really about how do you force everything as close to the do you force everything as close to the do you force everything as close to the sensor as possible and then have that sensor as possible and then have that sensor as possible and then have that translation you're talking about, Rob, translation you're talking about, Rob, translation you're talking about, Rob, done very locally and the only thing done very locally and the only thing done very locally and the only thing that you're really trying to transmit is that you're really trying to transmit is that you're really trying to transmit is context and meaning, whether it's context and meaning, whether it's context and meaning, whether it's through metadata or some other kind of through metadata or some other kind of through metadata or some other kind of format. Right. format. Right. format. Right. You know, it's not to say that you're You know, it's not to say that you're You know, it's not to say that you're going to have things shipped one way or going to have things shipped one way or going to have things shipped one way or the other. It's a force. Do you know the other. It's a force. Do you know the other. It's a force. Do you know what I'm saying? The force has got a lot what I'm saying? The force has got a lot what I'm saying? The force has got a lot of power. Yeah, exactly. And and and it of power. Yeah, exactly. And and and it of power. Yeah, exactly. And and and it is with you. And the force is strong in is with you. And the force is strong in is with you. And the force is strong in this one.

this one. this one. >> Yeah, exactly. The force is strong in >> Yeah, exactly. The force is strong in >> Yeah, exactly. The force is strong in this freaking Yoda. this freaking Yoda. this freaking Yoda. You know what? You know what? I keep You know what? You know what? I keep You know what? You know what? I keep hearing things from folks here that hearing things from folks here that hearing things from folks here that reminds me and I know Leonard you do reminds me and I know Leonard you do reminds me and I know Leonard you do posts about this where you're like, posts about this where you're like, posts about this where you're like, "People still don't know what IoT is." "People still don't know what IoT is." "People still don't know what IoT is." or whatever. And and Bill's like, "You or whatever. And and Bill's like, "You or whatever. And and Bill's like, "You don't know what the edge is." don't know what the edge is." don't know what the edge is." You don't know what the edge is. digital You don't know what the edge is. digital You don't know what the edge is. digital twin is, BUT I WILL TELL YOU WHAT IT IS. twin is, BUT I WILL TELL YOU WHAT IT IS. twin is, BUT I WILL TELL YOU WHAT IT IS. TWIN IS. I MEAN, YOU WERE JUST IN A it TWIN IS. I MEAN, YOU WERE JUST IN A it TWIN IS. I MEAN, YOU WERE JUST IN A it was like the idea like, we're going to was like the idea like, we're going to was like the idea like, we're going to have to have a conference that says have to have a conference that says have to have a conference that says that's called like, "You don't know what that's called like, "You don't know what that's called like, "You don't know what you're talking about you're talking about you're talking about and we're going to learn you something and we're going to learn you something and we're going to learn you something because because because I'M SURROUNDED BY FREAKING IDIOTS. I'M SURROUNDED BY FREAKING IDIOTS. I'M SURROUNDED BY FREAKING IDIOTS. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> OH MY GOD. OH MY GOD. LET'S just talk >> OH MY GOD. OH MY GOD. LET'S just talk >> OH MY GOD. OH MY GOD. LET'S just talk about digital twins and people not about digital twins and people not about digital twins and people not knowing what they are because I see it knowing what they are because I see it knowing what they are because I see it on the daily. Okay, at least weekly. on the daily. Okay, at least weekly. on the daily. Okay, at least weekly. Now, again, right? They're writing about Now, again, right? They're writing about Now, again, right? They're writing about digital twins digital twins digital twins and I catch them and I catch them and I catch them I catch them in that the so systems I catch them in that the so systems I catch them in that the so systems digital modeling thing and not the real digital modeling thing and not the real digital modeling thing and not the real digital twin thing and they go yeah digital twin thing and they go yeah digital twin thing and they go yeah these are great man if only there was a these are great man if only there was a these are great man if only there was a way to if a digital twin if you could way to if a digital twin if you could way to if a digital twin if you could like kind of make it alive and have real like kind of make it alive and have real like kind of make it alive and have real data then you would actually have data then you would actually have data then you would actually have something. [laughter] I'm like I'm like I got the RECORD I'm like I'm like I got the RECORD PLAYER LIKE PLAYER LIKE PLAYER LIKE I'M LIKE I'M LIKE BRO A DIGITAL TWIN IS I'M LIKE I'M LIKE BRO A DIGITAL TWIN IS I'M LIKE I'M LIKE BRO A DIGITAL TWIN IS ALIVE. IT'S ALIVE ALIVE. IT'S ALIVE ALIVE. IT'S ALIVE and it's not a digital model that you and it's not a digital model that you and it's not a digital model that you created in Katia.

created in Katia. created in Katia. It's a live physical twin digital twin It's a live physical twin digital twin It's a live physical twin digital twin data's flowing data's going and it's data's flowing data's going and it's data's flowing data's going and it's alive and you can look at it and there's alive and you can look at it and there's alive and you can look at it and there's latest data there's historical data and latest data there's historical data and latest data there's historical data and there's AI models being created from there's AI models being created from there's AI models being created from that. It's freaking alive and edge and that. It's freaking alive and edge and that. It's freaking alive and edge and you said and I love the idea of pure you said and I love the idea of pure you said and I love the idea of pure edges. I remember writing [ __ ] about edges. I remember writing [ __ ] about edges. I remember writing [ __ ] about doing that too. You know people are like doing that too. You know people are like doing that too. You know people are like oh I'm just doing this whole round trip. oh I'm just doing this whole round trip. oh I'm just doing this whole round trip. I'm like you know it's it's bonkers. I'm like you know it's it's bonkers. I'm like you know it's it's bonkers. AIOT yes I remember when people started AIOT yes I remember when people started AIOT yes I remember when people started talking about that we know exactly who talking about that we know exactly who talking about that we know exactly who you people are. It was because AIT has you people are. It was because AIT has you people are. It was because AIT has failed IOT's failed so we're going to failed IOT's failed so we're going to failed IOT's failed so we're going to put an A in front of it put an A in front of it put an A in front of it >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> AND WE'RE WE'RE SAVED WE'RE SAVED >> AND WE'RE WE'RE SAVED WE'RE SAVED >> AND WE'RE WE'RE SAVED WE'RE SAVED HALLELUJAH. HALLELUJAH. HALLELUJAH. Uh you know it's like Uh you know it's like Uh you know it's like I may not get to the AIOT promised land I may not get to the AIOT promised land I may not get to the AIOT promised land with you but I know you're going to make with you but I know you're going to make with you but I know you're going to make IT IT IT >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> YOU KNOW. >> YOU KNOW. >> YOU KNOW. I MEAN BUT BUT HERE'S the thing you know I MEAN BUT BUT HERE'S the thing you know I MEAN BUT BUT HERE'S the thing you know it's like it again a lot of the stuff it's like it again a lot of the stuff it's like it again a lot of the stuff that we do that we do that we do under the hood is not pretty.

under the hood is not pretty. under the hood is not pretty. Yeah yeah running the [ __ ] Yeah yeah running the [ __ ] Yeah yeah running the [ __ ] >> really isn't. It's it's truly >> really isn't. It's it's truly >> really isn't. It's it's truly understanding understanding understanding the numbers and it's not it's not the numbers and it's not it's not the numbers and it's not it's not following any prescribed rules. If you following any prescribed rules. If you following any prescribed rules. If you don't develop your own point of view don't develop your own point of view don't develop your own point of view about the stuff and then move to that about the stuff and then move to that about the stuff and then move to that point of delivery and scale. Why are we point of delivery and scale. Why are we point of delivery and scale. Why are we even having this conversation about even having this conversation about even having this conversation about >> Yeah. valuation? >> Yeah. valuation? >> Yeah. valuation? Yeah, exactly. And you know what? Like Yeah, exactly. And you know what? Like Yeah, exactly. And you know what? Like even with all this edge AI stuff, all even with all this edge AI stuff, all even with all this edge AI stuff, all the you know, like the you know, like the you know, like Pete and I we we cut a little video and Pete and I we we cut a little video and Pete and I we we cut a little video and we mentioned this. This stuff is like we mentioned this. This stuff is like we mentioned this. This stuff is like difficult. difficult. difficult. It it's really [ __ ] hard. I and It it's really [ __ ] hard. I and It it's really [ __ ] hard. I and again, hats off to the guys who are deep again, hats off to the guys who are deep again, hats off to the guys who are deep in the tech, right? And so I'm not going in the tech, right? And so I'm not going in the tech, right? And so I'm not going to go around and pontificate how edge AI to go around and pontificate how edge AI to go around and pontificate how edge AI is the greatest thing in the world. It's is the greatest thing in the world. It's is the greatest thing in the world. It's going to going to going to it's going to be a force. it's going to be a force. it's going to be a force. But the engineering, the technology, all But the engineering, the technology, all But the engineering, the technology, all the stuff, it's the stuff, it's the stuff, it's going to be difficult to translate the going to be difficult to translate the going to be difficult to translate the stuff into actual reliable, you know, stuff into actual reliable, you know, stuff into actual reliable, you know, valuable applications. Just like IoT, valuable applications. Just like IoT, valuable applications. Just like IoT, you know, you And Rob, you're absolutely you know, you And Rob, you're absolutely you know, you And Rob, you're absolutely right, man. Um right, man. Um right, man. Um people still don't get digital twin.

people still don't get digital twin. people still don't get digital twin. It's It's It's amazing. Now they're calling it amazing. Now they're calling it amazing. Now they're calling it synthetic data and all this other [ __ ] synthetic data and all this other [ __ ] synthetic data and all this other [ __ ] and it's like and it's like and it's like >> What are the people the people who think >> What are the people the people who think >> What are the people the people who think that digital twins is only about that digital twins is only about that digital twins is only about simulation? simulation? simulation? Well, Well, Well, so here's the thing. so here's the thing. so here's the thing. >> Yeah. Here's the thing. >> Yeah. Here's the thing. >> Yeah. Here's the thing. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Let's let's >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Let's let's >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Let's let's let's look at let's look at let's look let's look at let's look at let's look let's look at let's look at let's look at you know, some of the movements in at you know, some of the movements in at you know, some of the movements in the market, just period, right? Bentley the market, just period, right? Bentley the market, just period, right? Bentley Systems acquires Cesium. Systems acquires Cesium. Systems acquires Cesium. Right? Right? Right? They acquire Cesium and then they come They acquire Cesium and then they come They acquire Cesium and then they come out with a new product because they're out with a new product because they're out with a new product because they're merging the two, right? So you got you merging the two, right? So you got you merging the two, right? So you got you got the BIM model stuff with the Cesium got the BIM model stuff with the Cesium got the BIM model stuff with the Cesium WebGL front end and we're going to you WebGL front end and we're going to you WebGL front end and we're going to you know, and now we're going to start know, and now we're going to start know, and now we're going to start grooming in operational data. And you grooming in operational data. And you grooming in operational data. And you know what? My word to any anyone that is know what? My word to any anyone that is know what? My word to any anyone that is doing those type of thing, good on you. doing those type of thing, good on you. doing those type of thing, good on you. Go for it. Go for it. Go for it. They're and they're like, well, aren't They're and they're like, well, aren't They're and they're like, well, aren't you afraid? You know, that a threat. I'm you afraid? You know, that a threat. I'm you afraid? You know, that a threat. I'm like, "Do you understand how big this like, "Do you understand how big this like, "Do you understand how big this space is? space is? space is? I mean, it's huge. And and you and I mean, it's huge. And and you and I mean, it's huge. And and you and you've got, you know, you got all of you've got, you know, you got all of you've got, you know, you got all of these other frameworks and omniverse and these other frameworks and omniverse and these other frameworks and omniverse and this and that. You got all these other this and that. You got all these other this and that. You got all these other things.

things. things. If that's if you want to go that route If that's if you want to go that route If that's if you want to go that route and go where we've selected, we've and go where we've selected, we've and go where we've selected, we've landed on this framework. This is what landed on this framework. This is what landed on this framework. This is what we're going to do. These are the things we're going to do. These are the things we're going to do. These are the things we're going to be doing. We're going to we're going to be doing. We're going to we're going to be doing. We're going to groom in operational data. You're going groom in operational data. You're going groom in operational data. You're going to see these things. Good. Go do that to see these things. Good. Go do that to see these things. Good. Go do that and scale. and scale. and scale. Because at the end of the day, the Because at the end of the day, the Because at the end of the day, the technology is the enabler. The business technology is the enabler. The business technology is the enabler. The business is the driver of the economics that is the driver of the economics that is the driver of the economics that you're going to use to try to get to you're going to use to try to get to you're going to use to try to get to some level of valuation where either you some level of valuation where either you some level of valuation where either you go public and the people buy in even go public and the people buy in even go public and the people buy in even more or you get acquired and try to more or you get acquired and try to more or you get acquired and try to iterate on that and grow even bigger. iterate on that and grow even bigger. iterate on that and grow even bigger. And so the conversation is more about And so the conversation is more about And so the conversation is more about the application of the tech, your point the application of the tech, your point the application of the tech, your point of view, of view, of view, and your delivery mechanism. and your delivery mechanism. and your delivery mechanism. Yeah, and you know what? Um Yeah, and you know what? Um Yeah, and you know what? Um you're right. And and the reason why I you're right. And and the reason why I you're right. And and the reason why I think the think the think the IoT hype collapsed the first time is IoT hype collapsed the first time is IoT hype collapsed the first time is everyone thought that that was like a everyone thought that that was like a everyone thought that that was like a hyper scale opportunity and you're going hyper scale opportunity and you're going hyper scale opportunity and you're going you know, they saw these massive TAMs you know, they saw these massive TAMs you know, they saw these massive TAMs and people who threw out these and people who threw out these and people who threw out these gigantic numbers had no freaking idea gigantic numbers had no freaking idea gigantic numbers had no freaking idea what they're talking about. And the what they're talking about. And the what they're talking about. And the bottom line is is this. I had a chat bottom line is is this. I had a chat bottom line is is this. I had a chat with Andy Do. He's with Embedded Works.

with Andy Do. He's with Embedded Works. with Andy Do. He's with Embedded Works. He's in the capital ugly just with you He's in the capital ugly just with you He's in the capital ugly just with you except more on the IoT front. except more on the IoT front. except more on the IoT front. You know, You know, You know, And he did some stuff for SoFi Stadium. And he did some stuff for SoFi Stadium. And he did some stuff for SoFi Stadium. They put some sensors on 400 manhole They put some sensors on 400 manhole They put some sensors on 400 manhole covers, right? Okay. And I'm like covers, right? Okay. And I'm like covers, right? Okay. And I'm like thinking, he's telling me the story, I'm thinking, he's telling me the story, I'm thinking, he's telling me the story, I'm going, man, it reminded me of our going, man, it reminded me of our going, man, it reminded me of our episode. Rob, when you and I talked episode. Rob, when you and I talked episode. Rob, when you and I talked about IoT plumbers. about IoT plumbers. about IoT plumbers. Right? Right? Right? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. This business of {quote} {unquote} IoT This business of {quote} {unquote} IoT This business of {quote} {unquote} IoT is it's a trade business. It's not is it's a trade business. It's not is it's a trade business. It's not >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> some guy sitting up in a You know, it's >> some guy sitting up in a You know, it's >> some guy sitting up in a You know, it's like what Ian? You hang out with Ian. like what Ian? You hang out with Ian. like what Ian? You hang out with Ian. You're a RT, right? You're a RT, right? You're a RT, right? >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Does he sound like he's like some coding >> Does he sound like he's like some coding >> Does he sound like he's like some coding dude that just writes software, dude that just writes software, dude that just writes software, maintains software, you know, in some maintains software, you know, in some maintains software, you know, in some ivory tower? We're out there with the ivory tower? We're out there with the ivory tower? We're out there with the welders, man. welders, man. welders, man. Yeah. It's a [ __ ] trade business, Yeah. It's a [ __ ] trade business, Yeah. It's a [ __ ] trade business, right? You got to buy a truck and you right? You got to buy a truck and you right? You got to buy a truck and you got to roll that truck out. got to roll that truck out. got to roll that truck out. >> Yeah. You can get on site, be in the >> Yeah. You can get on site, be in the >> Yeah. You can get on site, be in the freaking hops field like you were, freaking hops field like you were, freaking hops field like you were, right? Watch the videos or the pictures right? Watch the videos or the pictures right? Watch the videos or the pictures every week from our friends at Caliper every week from our friends at Caliper every week from our friends at Caliper in Australia and they'll show you what in Australia and they'll show you what in Australia and they'll show you what real IoT is. Every week they've got real IoT is. Every week they've got real IoT is. Every week they've got something. They're in some manhole or in something. They're in some manhole or in something. They're in some manhole or in some creek somewhere or next to a some creek somewhere or next to a some creek somewhere or next to a railroad and they make it real. And it railroad and they make it real. And it railroad and they make it real. And it And it it it is. You're out there and And it it it is. You're out there and And it it it is. You're out there and >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> It's a trade business. It's a trade >> It's a trade business. It's a trade >> It's a trade business. It's a trade >> There's another company called Caliper, >> There's another company called Caliper, >> There's another company called Caliper, by the way, if you want to talk about by the way, if you want to talk about by the way, if you want to talk about deploying things in the real world. They

deploying things in the real world. They deploying things in the real world. They do like sewer sensors and all kinds of do like sewer sensors and all kinds of do like sewer sensors and all kinds of stuff in Australia and they're on the stuff in Australia and they're on the stuff in Australia and they're on the you know, telemetry on rail rail you know, telemetry on rail rail you know, telemetry on rail rail temperature and stuff. It's amazing. temperature and stuff. It's amazing. temperature and stuff. It's amazing. Well, you know what they have to do? Well, you know what they have to do? Well, you know what they have to do? Is that the Is that the Is that the That's the company you were just talking That's the company you were just talking That's the company you were just talking about? That's the company I was just about? That's the company I was just about? That's the company I was just saying. You're right. saying. You're right. saying. You're right. >> Oh, did you say >> Oh, did you say >> Oh, did you say Caliper? I did say Caliper. Yeah. Yeah, Caliper? I did say Caliper. Yeah. Yeah, Caliper? I did say Caliper. Yeah. Yeah, I wasn't listening. That's what happens I wasn't listening. That's what happens I wasn't listening. That's what happens when you don't pay attention to when you don't pay attention to when you don't pay attention to >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Well, there was a glitch in the matrix. >> Well, there was a glitch in the matrix. >> Well, there was a glitch in the matrix. It's all right. By the way, there's It's all right. By the way, there's It's all right. By the way, there's another company called Caliper. I don't another company called Caliper. I don't another company called Caliper. I don't know if you've heard of it. know if you've heard of it. know if you've heard of it. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> This guy. >> This guy. >> This guy. Yeah. You know what? I do think you were Yeah. You know what? I do think you were Yeah. You know what? I do think you were right. You know, I mean all all all right. You know, I mean all all all right. You know, I mean all all all well, a few jokes aside. I do think you well, a few jokes aside. I do think you well, a few jokes aside. I do think you were right. We should do a conference. were right. We should do a conference. were right. We should do a conference. And and it should be I mean I not like And and it should be I mean I not like And and it should be I mean I not like these other ones. Like come in and these other ones. Like come in and these other ones. Like come in and listen to us. Yeah. Yeah. Come in and listen to us. Yeah. Yeah. Come in and listen to us. Yeah. Yeah. Come in and engage. Let's have those conversations. engage. Let's have those conversations. engage. Let's have those conversations. Yes. What would the conference be Yes. What would the conference be Yes. What would the conference be called? Like you don't know [ __ ] they called? Like you don't know [ __ ] they called? Like you don't know [ __ ] they not like us, not like us, not like us, >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> we're going to learn you something, I'm >> we're going to learn you something, I'm >> we're going to learn you something, I'm surrounded by freaking idiots.

surrounded by freaking idiots. surrounded by freaking idiots. I like we're going to learn you I like we're going to learn you I like we're going to learn you something. something. something. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Ah, just just call it bring your tool >> Ah, just just call it bring your tool >> Ah, just just call it bring your tool belt. Yeah. There you go. Yeah. Yeah. belt. Yeah. There you go. Yeah. Yeah. belt. Yeah. There you go. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know. Well, you know. Well, you know. Well, it's like, you know, like Walker Well, it's like, you know, like Walker Well, it's like, you know, like Walker Reynolds has done those Prove It Reynolds has done those Prove It Reynolds has done those Prove It conferences like last couple years in conferences like last couple years in conferences like last couple years in Dallas, you know, where the industrial Dallas, you know, where the industrial Dallas, you know, where the industrial IT guys have to show up and show it IT guys have to show up and show it IT guys have to show up and show it really working and solving a real really working and solving a real really working and solving a real problem at the conference. problem at the conference. problem at the conference. And everybody everybody gets put on the And everybody everybody gets put on the And everybody everybody gets put on the spot in a real big way cuz he was all he spot in a real big way cuz he was all he spot in a real big way cuz he was all he pissed off at the conferences cuz he got pissed off at the conferences cuz he got pissed off at the conferences cuz he got all these booths and all these booths and all these booths and it's all marketing and he's like, we it's all marketing and he's like, we it's all marketing and he's like, we need to have a conference where you need to have a conference where you need to have a conference where you prove it. Yeah. Prove me Prove to me prove it. Yeah. Prove me Prove to me prove it. Yeah. Prove me Prove to me that your product does and he assigns that your product does and he assigns that your product does and he assigns them a task and you have to show up or them a task and you have to show up or them a task and you have to show up or you can't be there. Yeah, it's crazy. you can't be there. Yeah, it's crazy. you can't be there. Yeah, it's crazy. Yeah, well, it'd be great if he came on. Yeah, well, it'd be great if he came on. Yeah, well, it'd be great if he came on. I mean, you know, we had a couple of I mean, you know, we had a couple of I mean, you know, we had a couple of conversations about um him showing up conversations about um him showing up conversations about um him showing up and he has and he has and he has you know, he has like a you know, he has like a you know, he has like a Yeah, but it'd be cool to have him on Yeah, but it'd be cool to have him on Yeah, but it'd be cool to have him on Yeah. I just I think it's it's a great Yeah. I just I think it's it's a great Yeah. I just I think it's it's a great idea for a conference and I think that's idea for a conference and I think that's idea for a conference and I think that's kind of what we need is we need to kind of what we need is we need to kind of what we need is we need to You're obviously wrong. Everyone's You're obviously wrong. Everyone's You're obviously wrong. Everyone's wrong, as it turns out, and we're the wrong, as it turns out, and we're the wrong, as it turns out, and we're the only ones that are right. Mhm.

only ones that are right. Mhm. only ones that are right. Mhm. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Yeah, you know, that's a great way to >> Yeah, you know, that's a great way to >> Yeah, you know, that's a great way to get people to come to your conference. get people to come to your conference. get people to come to your conference. >> people to sign up for that. >> people to sign up for that. >> people to sign up for that. Yeah. No, I mean, look, my whole thing Yeah. No, I mean, look, my whole thing Yeah. No, I mean, look, my whole thing is is having creating that community of is is having creating that community of is is having creating that community of conversations. I mean, realistically, conversations. I mean, realistically, conversations. I mean, realistically, you know, I really like talking to you know, I really like talking to you know, I really like talking to people if they Well, we're we're people if they Well, we're we're people if they Well, we're we're educating and then it's like, well, I educating and then it's like, well, I educating and then it's like, well, I can't divulge that to you right now can't divulge that to you right now can't divulge that to you right now because that's our secret sauce. You because that's our secret sauce. You because that's our secret sauce. You don't have no secret sauce. You have no don't have no secret sauce. You have no don't have no secret sauce. You have no secret sauce. secret sauce. secret sauce. You know, the only sauce you got is the You know, the only sauce you got is the You know, the only sauce you got is the sauce you got from Cane's at lunch today sauce you got from Cane's at lunch today sauce you got from Cane's at lunch today for your chicken. That's all the sauce for your chicken. That's all the sauce for your chicken. That's all the sauce you got. We don't have no secret sauce. you got. We don't have no secret sauce. you got. We don't have no secret sauce. I mean, we will I will open up the I I mean, we will I will open up the I I mean, we will I will open up the I will open up the code and show you how will open up the code and show you how will open up the code and show you how we do what we do. I have no problem with we do what we do. I have no problem with we do what we do. I have no problem with that. that. that. >> Well, yeah, the only sauce that you have >> Well, yeah, the only sauce that you have >> Well, yeah, the only sauce that you have it ends up being experiences you solve it ends up being experiences you solve it ends up being experiences you solve the problem and you have a pattern for the problem and you have a pattern for the problem and you have a pattern for accelerating it for any other scenario, accelerating it for any other scenario, accelerating it for any other scenario, right? Recognizing that every situation right? Recognizing that every situation right? Recognizing that every situation is different. That's like uh is different. That's like uh is different. That's like uh you know, that's systems integration you know, that's systems integration you know, that's systems integration 101. That's engineering in the field 101. That's engineering in the field 101. That's engineering in the field 101, right? And you know, that's the 101, right? And you know, that's the 101, right? And you know, that's the only secret sauce that you can have, but only secret sauce that you can have, but only secret sauce that you can have, but it's usually like I don't think it's it's usually like I don't think it's it's usually like I don't think it's it's technology.

it's technology. it's technology. No, our secret Our secret sauce is the No, our secret Our secret sauce is the No, our secret Our secret sauce is the people. We've been doing this for over people. We've been doing this for over people. We've been doing this for over 10 years, 15 years. 10 years, 15 years. 10 years, 15 years. >> people and the experience, you know, I >> people and the experience, you know, I >> people and the experience, you know, I mean mean mean It's It's It's the people. I mean, and It's It's It's the people. I mean, and It's It's It's the people. I mean, and And you And you got to be crazy. And you And you got to be crazy. And you And you got to be crazy. >> It's a freaking trade, man. And And >> It's a freaking trade, man. And And >> It's a freaking trade, man. And And there's nothing wrong with it cuz you there's nothing wrong with it cuz you there's nothing wrong with it cuz you know these ancient commercial HVAC guys know these ancient commercial HVAC guys know these ancient commercial HVAC guys [laughter] make a [ __ ] ton of money, [laughter] make a [ __ ] ton of money, [laughter] make a [ __ ] ton of money, man. They make so much money, it's like man. They make so much money, it's like man. They make so much money, it's like crazy. crazy. crazy. >> Especially in the summertime. >> Especially in the summertime. >> Especially in the summertime. Oh, yeah. It's Exactly. Summertime. Oh, yeah. It's Exactly. Summertime. Oh, yeah. It's Exactly. Summertime. It's exactly. Locksmiths. It's exactly. Locksmiths. It's exactly. Locksmiths. Locksmiths. Locksmiths. Locksmiths. >> Yeah, they make a [ __ ] ton of money, >> Yeah, they make a [ __ ] ton of money, >> Yeah, they make a [ __ ] ton of money, man, because you got And think about all man, because you got And think about all man, because you got And think about all the use cases you're talking about here the use cases you're talking about here the use cases you're talking about here when we talk about these things, they when we talk about these things, they when we talk about these things, they can all be IoT-ized. can all be IoT-ized. can all be IoT-ized. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> It doesn't That doesn't That don't >> It doesn't That doesn't That don't >> It doesn't That doesn't That don't change the fact that you going to call change the fact that you going to call change the fact that you going to call them when that IoT part of the kind of them when that IoT part of the kind of them when that IoT part of the kind of fails you. Yeah, like what's happening fails you. Yeah, like what's happening fails you. Yeah, like what's happening in my house right now. I have in my house right now. I have in my house right now. I have like IoT connected lights and they're like IoT connected lights and they're like IoT connected lights and they're all like freaking, you know, refusing to all like freaking, you know, refusing to all like freaking, you know, refusing to operate. Going back in time, like operate. Going back in time, like operate. Going back in time, like whenever someone says, "What is this IoT whenever someone says, "What is this IoT whenever someone says, "What is this IoT all about?" you know, and I'm like, "Do all about?" you know, and I'm like, "Do all about?" you know, and I'm like, "Do you ever watch the weather on the news you ever watch the weather on the news you ever watch the weather on the news at night?" And they go, "Our weather at night?" And they go, "Our weather at night?" And they go, "Our weather station at the SeaTac Airport says it station at the SeaTac Airport says it station at the SeaTac Airport says it was 75 today." I go, "Do you know what was 75 today." I go, "Do you know what was 75 today." I go, "Do you know what that was? It was a sensor for that was? It was a sensor for that was? It was a sensor for temperature at a location and it was temperature at a location and it was temperature at a location and it was wirelessly transmitted back to the place wirelessly transmitted back to the place wirelessly transmitted back to the place where the weatherman can put something where the weatherman can put something where the weatherman can put something on screen and say it was 75 today in on screen and say it was 75 today in on screen and say it was 75 today in Seattle at the SeaTac Airport. That's Seattle at the SeaTac Airport. That's Seattle at the SeaTac Airport. That's it.

it. it. Yeah. That's it. It's sensors and we're Yeah. That's it. It's sensors and we're Yeah. That's it. It's sensors and we're sending the data to somewhere else sending the data to somewhere else sending the data to somewhere else and maybe converging a whole bunch of and maybe converging a whole bunch of and maybe converging a whole bunch of stuff together and that's what it is. stuff together and that's what it is. stuff together and that's what it is. You know? You know? You know? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Leonard, you mentioned your your >> Yeah. Leonard, you mentioned your your >> Yeah. Leonard, you mentioned your your lights. lights. lights. You you know what? You might want to You you know what? You might want to You you know what? You might want to consider Home Assistant. consider Home Assistant. consider Home Assistant. Home Assistant? Home Assistant? Home Assistant? Yeah. You you like to you like to tinker Yeah. You you like to you like to tinker Yeah. You you like to you like to tinker around, use Home Assistant and build a around, use Home Assistant and build a around, use Home Assistant and build a system. system. system. >> source? >> source? >> source? Oh, it's open source. That is like Oh, it's open source. That is like Oh, it's open source. That is like you know, I mean you can get a Proxmox you know, I mean you can get a Proxmox you know, I mean you can get a Proxmox box and Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know what? box and Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know what? box and Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know what? I I I bumped into that. Yeah. Okay. I I I I bumped into that. Yeah. Okay. I I I I bumped into that. Yeah. Okay. I saw that. saw that. saw that. >> that on a Raspberry Pi? >> that on a Raspberry Pi? >> that on a Raspberry Pi? Home Assistant? Oh, I mean you could you Home Assistant? Oh, I mean you could you Home Assistant? Oh, I mean you could you could. You really could. could. You really could. >> [laughter] >> You could. I mean I I I run I run all my >> You could. I mean I I I run I run all my >> You could. I mean I I I run I run all my stuff through Proxmox. stuff through Proxmox. stuff through Proxmox. Proxmox? Well, you can run all kinds of Proxmox? Well, you can run all kinds of Proxmox? Well, you can run all kinds of crazy stuff on a on a Raspberry Pi these crazy stuff on a on a Raspberry Pi these crazy stuff on a on a Raspberry Pi these days, right? So Yeah, but you still got days, right? So Yeah, but you still got days, right? So Yeah, but you still got to harden it, man. That's the See, to harden it, man. That's the See, to harden it, man. That's the See, that's the real thing. Can you go up and that's the real thing. Can you go up and that's the real thing. Can you go up and down the stack? Yeah.

down the stack? Yeah. down the stack? Yeah. And then, you know, think about it. And then, you know, think about it. And then, you know, think about it. That's going to be a really viable thing That's going to be a really viable thing That's going to be a really viable thing if you can you can deliver hardened if you can you can deliver hardened if you can you can deliver hardened secured secured secured um stacks, right? From hardware to the um stacks, right? From hardware to the um stacks, right? From hardware to the platform to all the endpoints that platform to all the endpoints that platform to all the endpoints that connect to it. connect to it. connect to it. Um Um Um because you know, man, I I I I because you know, man, I I I I because you know, man, I I I I I just don't see I just don't see I just don't see how people are going to be able to how people are going to be able to how people are going to be able to manage securely all these agents, right? manage securely all these agents, right? manage securely all these agents, right? It's it's insane. Um It's it's insane. Um It's it's insane. Um >> When you say when you say all these >> When you say when you say all these >> When you say when you say all these agents, what are these agents doing? agents, what are these agents doing? agents, what are these agents doing? You know, doing all the hypothetical You know, doing all the hypothetical You know, doing all the hypothetical [ __ ] that all these AI companies are [ __ ] that all these AI companies are [ __ ] that all these AI companies are talking about. talking about. talking about. You know, going off and doing research You know, going off and doing research You know, going off and doing research or doing, or doing, or doing, you know, buying [ __ ] for you and doing you know, buying [ __ ] for you and doing you know, buying [ __ ] for you and doing all kinds of stuff, whatever. Do you all kinds of stuff, whatever. Do you all kinds of stuff, whatever. Do you know what I'm saying? know what I'm saying? know what I'm saying? It It's the the the the the bigger part It It's the the the the the bigger part It It's the the the the the bigger part about it is putting the rigor around it about it is putting the rigor around it about it is putting the rigor around it to actually understand that the to actually understand that the to actually understand that the workflows that you have in there, number workflows that you have in there, number workflows that you have in there, number one, aren't drifting. Number two, have one, aren't drifting. Number two, have one, aren't drifting. Number two, have guardrails around them inside of the of guardrails around them inside of the of guardrails around them inside of the of the of the containers that have the of the containers that have the of the containers that have guardrails around them. I mean, you guardrails around them. I mean, you guardrails around them. I mean, you you've got a super you've got a super you've got a super >> It's >> It's >> It's No, no. And you know, like I said, you No, no. And you know, like I said, you No, no. And you know, like I said, you know, Paul Cunningham, CTO of Cadence, know, Paul Cunningham, CTO of Cadence, know, Paul Cunningham, CTO of Cadence, he got up on stage when he's talking he got up on stage when he's talking he got up on stage when he's talking about Cadence, about Cadence, about Cadence, uh their um, you know, uh their um, you know, uh their um, you know, uh their whole super agent framework.

uh their whole super agent framework. uh their whole super agent framework. Right? He goes, "We'll Right? He goes, "We'll Right? He goes, "We'll um agentic AI will require millions of um agentic AI will require millions of um agentic AI will require millions of lines of code." lines of code." lines of code." I don't know if they It just he got he I don't know if they It just he got he I don't know if they It just he got he slipped that through. slipped that through. slipped that through. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> But, I took a picture of it and then >> But, I took a picture of it and then >> But, I took a picture of it and then later on I gave my high-fives, like, later on I gave my high-fives, like, later on I gave my high-fives, like, "Yeah, you get it, man." [laughter] "Yeah, you get it, man." [laughter] "Yeah, you get it, man." [laughter] Yeah, you're beautiful. licensing and Yeah, you're beautiful. licensing and Yeah, you're beautiful. licensing and guardrail crap you have to stick on top guardrail crap you have to stick on top guardrail crap you have to stick on top of agents in order to make them use like of agents in order to make them use like of agents in order to make them use like usable. usable. usable. Yes. The the I mean, and that's the Yes. The the I mean, and that's the Yes. The the I mean, and that's the that's why I struggle with um these that's why I struggle with um these that's why I struggle with um these TAMs, the investment that's going in is TAMs, the investment that's going in is TAMs, the investment that's going in is you see guy companies like Cadence with you see guy companies like Cadence with you see guy companies like Cadence with amazing engineers trying to use this amazing engineers trying to use this amazing engineers trying to use this for, you know, semiconductor design for, you know, semiconductor design for, you know, semiconductor design automation, blah blah blah, right? You automation, blah blah blah, right? You automation, blah blah blah, right? You know, auto verification and know, auto verification and know, auto verification and you talk to the the people who are you talk to the the people who are you talk to the the people who are actually doing the work, and they will actually doing the work, and they will actually doing the work, and they will tell you a very different story. They tell you a very different story. They tell you a very different story. They say that the stuff is not usable, or we say that the stuff is not usable, or we say that the stuff is not usable, or we have to use it in a very measured way, have to use it in a very measured way, have to use it in a very measured way, and then it just looks like scripting.

and then it just looks like scripting. and then it just looks like scripting. So, what we're getting excited about at So, what we're getting excited about at So, what we're getting excited about at at the end of the day is like freaking at the end of the day is like freaking at the end of the day is like freaking RPA. RPA. RPA. Yes. Millions of lines of code, what's Yes. Millions of lines of code, what's Yes. Millions of lines of code, what's that tell you? You you stripping, like that tell you? You you stripping, like that tell you? You you stripping, like we've said before, you are stripping we've said before, you are stripping we've said before, you are stripping agency away from the LLM and at that agency away from the LLM and at that agency away from the LLM and at that point what do you have? point what do you have? point what do you have? Because you want it to be Because you want it to be Because you want it to be Yeah, you just want it to be Yeah, you just want it to be Yeah, you just want it to be deterministic. You don't want it to go deterministic. You don't want it to go deterministic. You don't want it to go off and do whatever the off and do whatever the off and do whatever the hell. hell. hell. You know, it's hilarious. It's a joke. You know, it's hilarious. It's a joke. You know, it's hilarious. It's a joke. It it like I said, I think it's going to It it like I said, I think it's going to It it like I said, I think it's going to take years for this stuff to get to a take years for this stuff to get to a take years for this stuff to get to a maturity level where it should be maturity level where it should be maturity level where it should be trusted. trusted. trusted. Yeah. It's that's it. That's Yeah. It's that's it. That's Yeah. It's that's it. That's It's It's why what I mean again, our It's It's why what I mean again, our It's It's why what I mean again, our point of view and how we're employing point of view and how we're employing point of view and how we're employing this is very specific and and gated by this is very specific and and gated by this is very specific and and gated by existing or in works existing or in works existing or in works best practices and standards, which is best practices and standards, which is best practices and standards, which is going to limit the art of the possible. going to limit the art of the possible. going to limit the art of the possible. Um that is that I mean at that point Um that is that I mean at that point Um that is that I mean at that point we're like nope, we we're I mean we we we're like nope, we we're I mean we we we're like nope, we we're I mean we we could entertain that, but it's going to could entertain that, but it's going to could entertain that, but it's going to take us a while to even get there and take us a while to even get there and take us a while to even get there and why would we want to do that?

why would we want to do that? why would we want to do that? Yeah, and these things just pop up. It's Yeah, and these things just pop up. It's Yeah, and these things just pop up. It's like we're here to solve this problem like we're here to solve this problem like we're here to solve this problem and we know what it is and we've and we know what it is and we've and we know what it is and we've articulated it and we've documented it articulated it and we've documented it articulated it and we've documented it and we've said this is what the outcome and we've said this is what the outcome and we've said this is what the outcome wants to be. wants to be. wants to be. That's what we're working on. You know, That's what we're working on. You know, That's what we're working on. You know, and by the way, it's there's probably and by the way, it's there's probably and by the way, it's there's probably some people who are watching this going, some people who are watching this going, some people who are watching this going, man, these guys are horrible for man, these guys are horrible for man, these guys are horrible for go-to-market support and we're actually go-to-market support and we're actually go-to-market support and we're actually we're not. If you have a we're not full we're not. If you have a we're not full we're not. If you have a we're not full of [ __ ] marketing and go-to-market of [ __ ] marketing and go-to-market of [ __ ] marketing and go-to-market um you know, strategy. um you know, strategy. um you know, strategy. This content is perfect for that kind of This content is perfect for that kind of This content is perfect for that kind of stuff. stuff. stuff. If you're full of [ __ ] you're going to If you're full of [ __ ] you're going to If you're full of [ __ ] you're going to find everything that we've just said find everything that we've just said find everything that we've just said super uncomfortable. super uncomfortable. super uncomfortable. That's right, cuz we don't stop till you That's right, cuz we don't stop till you That's right, cuz we don't stop till you get enough. Yeah. get enough. Yeah. get enough. Yeah. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Yeah. That's who we are, okay? Cuz the >> Yeah. That's who we are, okay? Cuz the >> Yeah. That's who we are, okay? Cuz the force has got a lot of power. force has got a lot of power. force has got a lot of power. Yeah. You know, I just Yeah. You know, I just Yeah. You know, I just >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> just to just JUST TO GO OFF on a tangent >> just to just JUST TO GO OFF on a tangent >> just to just JUST TO GO OFF on a tangent here, Bill said something. He's talking here, Bill said something. He's talking here, Bill said something. He's talking about his Proxmox, you know? Mhm. I'm about his Proxmox, you know? Mhm. I'm about his Proxmox, you know? Mhm. I'm curious. I curious. I curious. I I don't want to call out any names. I do I don't want to call out any names. I do I don't want to call out any names. I do spend a lot of time with a lot of people spend a lot of time with a lot of people spend a lot of time with a lot of people who are in the virtualization game. And who are in the virtualization game. And who are in the virtualization game. And they've all think their virtualization they've all think their virtualization they've all think their virtualization is really special. And most of the is really special. And most of the is really special. And most of the virtualization technology is just a virtualization technology is just a virtualization technology is just a wrapper around the KVM that's baked into wrapper around the KVM that's baked into wrapper around the KVM that's baked into the Linux kernel. Yeah. And a lot of the Linux kernel. Yeah. And a lot of the Linux kernel. Yeah. And a lot of them they're all of them, I'm going to them they're all of them, I'm going to them they're all of them, I'm going to say almost all of them have the same say almost all of them have the same say almost all of them have the same go-to-market strategy. Oh, ever since go-to-market strategy. Oh, ever since go-to-market strategy. Oh, ever since Broadcom bought VMware and now they're Broadcom bought VMware and now they're Broadcom bought VMware and now they're charging more and all this kind of stuff charging more and all this kind of stuff charging more and all this kind of stuff and so we're going to capture all that and so we're going to capture all that and so we're going to capture all that value.

value. value. Why isn't something like a open-source Why isn't something like a open-source Why isn't something like a open-source thing like Proxmox thing like Proxmox thing like Proxmox just just just running away with that? Or if it can't running away with that? Or if it can't running away with that? Or if it can't run away with it, it needs a company or run away with it, it needs a company or run away with it, it needs a company or someone to wrap around it to offer a someone to wrap around it to offer a someone to wrap around it to offer a service. What do you think, Bill? service. What do you think, Bill? service. What do you think, Bill? >> the the I I I mean my assessment of that >> the the I I I mean my assessment of that >> the the I I I mean my assessment of that when I when I started digging into it is when I when I started digging into it is when I when I started digging into it is then, you know, hey, I I kind of like then, you know, hey, I I kind of like then, you know, hey, I I kind of like the way they structured everything. It's the way they structured everything. It's the way they structured everything. It's open-source, we can do this. Um it's open-source, we can do this. Um it's open-source, we can do this. Um it's it's it's a small group of like 12 it's it's a small group of like 12 it's it's a small group of like 12 people people people in Germany. in Germany. in Germany. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Okay. That >> Okay. That >> Okay. That that there is I mean, they would have to that there is I mean, they would have to that there is I mean, they would have to really form themselves in such a way really form themselves in such a way really form themselves in such a way that they were able to scale and execute that they were able to scale and execute that they were able to scale and execute in that space. And and literally in that space. And and literally in that space. And and literally [clears throat] [clears throat] [clears throat] at that point, I would say ignore at that point, I would say ignore at that point, I would say ignore VMware, pay no attention to them at all. VMware, pay no attention to them at all. VMware, pay no attention to them at all. And I mean, that would be my advice to And I mean, that would be my advice to And I mean, that would be my advice to them. It'd be ignore all these big them. It'd be ignore all these big them. It'd be ignore all these big players. players. players. Play a different game. Stop Don't play Play a different game. Stop Don't play Play a different game. Stop Don't play their game. Play a different game. their game. Play a different game. their game. Play a different game. Exactly. They don't have to become a Red Exactly. They don't have to become a Red Exactly. They don't have to become a Red Hat. I mean Hat. I mean Hat. I mean >> got to face that man in the mirror and >> got to face that man in the mirror and >> got to face that man in the mirror and you just got to play a different game, you just got to play a different game, you just got to play a different game, you know? [laughter] you know? [laughter] you know? [laughter] What is the fuss all this Michael What is the fuss all this Michael What is the fuss all this Michael Jackson all these Michael Jackson and um Jackson all these Michael Jackson and um Jackson all these Michael Jackson and um CUZ IT'S THE HOT MOVIE THAT'S OUT RIGHT CUZ IT'S THE HOT MOVIE THAT'S OUT RIGHT CUZ IT'S THE HOT MOVIE THAT'S OUT RIGHT now about him.

now about him. now about him. I'm just saying. I mean, I'm just saying. I mean, I'm just saying. I mean, I mean, if they did that, it could be a I mean, if they did that, it could be a I mean, if they did that, it could be a real thriller. real thriller. real thriller. But it's not even Exactly. I don't even But it's not even Exactly. I don't even But it's not even Exactly. I don't even think it needs to be them. It's open think it needs to be them. It's open think it needs to be them. It's open source. They put it out there. Remember source. They put it out there. Remember source. They put it out there. Remember the whole planet survived on OpenSSL the whole planet survived on OpenSSL the whole planet survived on OpenSSL with one guy maintaining that thing. with one guy maintaining that thing. with one guy maintaining that thing. Oops. Oops. Oops. >> Yeah, but but Proxmox is not OpenSSL. >> Yeah, but but Proxmox is not OpenSSL. >> Yeah, but but Proxmox is not OpenSSL. >> [laughter] >> I mean when you're talking about when >> I mean when you're talking about when you're talking about virtualization you're talking about virtualization you're talking about virtualization there's various planes that you have to there's various planes that you have to there's various planes that you have to consider which OpenSSL just kind of consider which OpenSSL just kind of consider which OpenSSL just kind of said, "Hey, said, "Hey, said, "Hey, this is a socket. this is a socket. this is a socket. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> We're going to secure it." >> We're going to secure it." >> We're going to secure it." Oh my god. But yeah, Proxmox and works Oh my god. But yeah, Proxmox and works Oh my god. But yeah, Proxmox and works with clusters. I mean, it's pretty with clusters. I mean, it's pretty with clusters. I mean, it's pretty impressive for what it does. It's not impressive for what it does. It's not impressive for what it does. It's not trying to be the virtualization. KVM is trying to be the virtualization. KVM is trying to be the virtualization. KVM is the virtualization. But it needs the virtualization. But it needs the virtualization. But it needs wrappers to do clusters and lots of VMs wrappers to do clusters and lots of VMs wrappers to do clusters and lots of VMs and stuff and it does the LXC containers and stuff and it does the LXC containers and stuff and it does the LXC containers like you see on a Ubuntu and stuff. like you see on a Ubuntu and stuff. like you see on a Ubuntu and stuff. >> and spin down real I mean, all of this >> and spin down real I mean, all of this >> and spin down real I mean, all of this STUFF IS STUFF IS STUFF IS >> THAT SOUNDS LIKE THAT SOUNDS LIKE A >> THAT SOUNDS LIKE THAT SOUNDS LIKE A >> THAT SOUNDS LIKE THAT SOUNDS LIKE A WHOLE NEW STARTUP right there WHOLE NEW STARTUP right there WHOLE NEW STARTUP right there that we're just going to deliver Proxmox that we're just going to deliver Proxmox that we're just going to deliver Proxmox open source virtualization and open source virtualization and open source virtualization and containers and take over the world and containers and take over the world and containers and take over the world and the new GTMS we're going to grab all the new GTMS we're going to grab all the new GTMS we're going to grab all that stuff and we're only going to that stuff and we're only going to that stuff and we're only going to charge you like 5 cents a day or charge you like 5 cents a day or charge you like 5 cents a day or something like that.

something like that. something like that. Yeah, that that that that that right Yeah, that that that that that right Yeah, that that that that that right there there there uh uh uh contact Rob if you if you want to be contact Rob if you if you want to be contact Rob if you if you want to be part of that company. part of that company. part of that company. >> Yeah, there you go. >> Yeah, there you go. >> Yeah, there you go. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> But we're GOING TO GET A TRILLION >> But we're GOING TO GET A TRILLION >> But we're GOING TO GET A TRILLION CUSTOMERS. So [snorts] trillion That CUSTOMERS. So [snorts] trillion That CUSTOMERS. So [snorts] trillion That counts going to be We're going to make counts going to be We're going to make counts going to be We're going to make up We're going to make up in volume like up We're going to make up in volume like up We're going to make up in volume like the car dealership. the car dealership. the car dealership. >> Charge by the charge by the >> Charge by the charge by the >> Charge by the charge by the function and container. function and container. function and container. There you go. There you go. I don't There you go. There you go. I don't There you go. There you go. I don't know. Could be something there. All big know. Could be something there. All big know. Could be something there. All big companies I know of, every one of them companies I know of, every one of them companies I know of, every one of them uses KVM. uses KVM. uses KVM. >> AI in it, so they'll they'll never get >> AI in it, so they'll they'll never get >> AI in it, so they'll they'll never get funding. funding. funding. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We could put some AI. We could put some AI. We could put some AI. >> if you want to do that bootstrapped and >> if you want to do that bootstrapped and >> if you want to do that bootstrapped and never take a dime from investors, give never take a dime from investors, give never take a dime from investors, give me a call. All right. All right. There me a call. All right. All right. There me a call. All right. All right. There you go. All right. I think we got This will officially be the longest This will officially be the longest episode episode episode >> minute. Before we go, can I say one >> minute. Before we go, can I say one >> minute. Before we go, can I say one thing that just irked the hell out of me thing that just irked the hell out of me thing that just irked the hell out of me this week? Okay. this week? Okay. this week? Okay. Uh-oh. Uh-oh. Uh-oh. Come here. Come here. Come here. Listen.

Listen. Listen. All you people out there that keep All you people out there that keep All you people out there that keep sending these messages talking about how sending these messages talking about how sending these messages talking about how you're going to help improve sales you're going to help improve sales you're going to help improve sales because of your AI-assisted because of your AI-assisted because of your AI-assisted elements, elements, elements, stop it. stop it. stop it. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Stop it. Stop sending me DMs in my >> Stop it. Stop sending me DMs in my >> Stop it. Stop sending me DMs in my LinkedIn telling me that you got LinkedIn telling me that you got LinkedIn telling me that you got something and stop cold calling me. something and stop cold calling me. something and stop cold calling me. Stop it. Stop it. STOP IT. JUST STOP. Stop it. Stop it. STOP IT. JUST STOP. Stop it. Stop it. STOP IT. JUST STOP. >> EVEN THE MINUTE that I ask you they Oh, >> EVEN THE MINUTE that I ask you they Oh, >> EVEN THE MINUTE that I ask you they Oh, I get these emails. Oh, we've looked at I get these emails. Oh, we've looked at I get these emails. Oh, we've looked at your company and True North blah blah your company and True North blah blah your company and True North blah blah blah blah blah and we could help you blah blah blah and we could help you blah blah blah and we could help you increase sales by and I'm like, "Really? increase sales by and I'm like, "Really? increase sales by and I'm like, "Really? What do we do?" What do we do?" What do we do?" Yeah. Uh well, uh you see goodbye, Yeah. Uh well, uh you see goodbye, Yeah. Uh well, uh you see goodbye, click. You know, I'M LIKE I STOP IT. click. You know, I'M LIKE I STOP IT. click. You know, I'M LIKE I STOP IT. JUST STOP. JUST STOP. JUST STOP. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I KNOW WE TOLD YOU TO DON'T STOP TILL >> I KNOW WE TOLD YOU TO DON'T STOP TILL >> I KNOW WE TOLD YOU TO DON'T STOP TILL YOU get enough, but in this case, we YOU get enough, but in this case, we YOU get enough, but in this case, we want you to stop. want you to stop. want you to stop. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. You need to beat it, right? You need to You need to beat it, right? You need to You need to beat it, right? You need to beat it. You need to beat it. beat it. You need to beat it. beat it. You need to beat it. >> You need to beat it. You need to beat >> You need to beat it. You need to beat >> You need to beat it. You need to beat it. You need to beat it, man. it. You need to beat it, man. it. You need to beat it, man. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. You need to beat it. You're Exactly. You need to beat it. You're Exactly. You need to beat it. You're right. That is my PSA for today. All right. That is my PSA for today. All right. That is my PSA for today. All right.

right. right. >> That's a good PSA. >> That's a good PSA. >> That's a good PSA. >> I'm in. >> I'm in. >> I'm in. All right. Woohoo. So, you going to take All right. Woohoo. So, you going to take All right. Woohoo. So, you going to take us out? us out? us out? Bill should take us out. Bill should take us out. Bill should take us out. >> Yeah, you Yeah, you're so angry and on >> Yeah, you Yeah, you're so angry and on >> Yeah, you Yeah, you're so angry and on fire. fire. fire. >> Look, >> Look, >> Look, I mean, first off, I was late, so you I mean, first off, I was late, so you I mean, first off, I was late, so you know, sorry about that, but there's been know, sorry about that, but there's been know, sorry about that, but there's been a whole host of things uh going on and a whole host of things uh going on and a whole host of things uh going on and we want to thank you for hanging out we want to thank you for hanging out we want to thank you for hanging out with us this long. Um I mean, ideally, with us this long. Um I mean, ideally, with us this long. Um I mean, ideally, we always have good stuff to talk about, we always have good stuff to talk about, we always have good stuff to talk about, but we're looking for that engagement. but we're looking for that engagement. but we're looking for that engagement. Why don't you guys hit us up? Let us Why don't you guys hit us up? Let us Why don't you guys hit us up? Let us know what you want to hear about. Let us know what you want to hear about. Let us know what you want to hear about. Let us know what you want to talk about and know what you want to talk about and know what you want to talk about and come on the show. That would be awesome. come on the show. That would be awesome. come on the show. That would be awesome. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We want to We want to thank everyone for We want to We want to thank everyone for We want to We want to thank everyone for hanging out with us. We want to bring hanging out with us. We want to bring hanging out with us. We want to bring light light light to to to uh uh uh to elevate What is the new one now? to elevate What is the new one now? to elevate What is the new one now? >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Elevate communities. >> Elevate communities. >> Elevate communities. >> Communities. Elevate communities, yes. I >> Communities. Elevate communities, yes. I >> Communities. Elevate communities, yes. I mean, it I haven't seen I haven't seen mean, it I haven't seen I haven't seen mean, it I haven't seen I haven't seen it in a minute. it in a minute. it in a minute. Uh because it those things are important Uh because it those things are important Uh because it those things are important that we we've migrated away from just that we we've migrated away from just that we we've migrated away from just uh just providing laptops and things uh just providing laptops and things uh just providing laptops and things like that and we're looking for more like that and we're looking for more like that and we're looking for more engagement there for 100 100%. Uh You're engagement there for 100 100%. Uh You're engagement there for 100 100%. Uh You're good.

good. good. >> The Edge. I mean, everyone knows who >> The Edge. I mean, everyone knows who >> The Edge. I mean, everyone knows who Pete is and I mean and and I mean, he's Pete is and I mean and and I mean, he's Pete is and I mean and and I mean, he's a giant when it comes to the Edge and a giant when it comes to the Edge and a giant when it comes to the Edge and Edge AI and everything like that. Edge AI and everything like that. Edge AI and everything like that. I I mean, look, we're we're going to get I I mean, look, we're we're going to get I I mean, look, we're we're going to get engaged. I'mma tell you that. And and uh engaged. I'mma tell you that. And and uh engaged. I'mma tell you that. And and uh we're going to see what happens there. we're going to see what happens there. we're going to see what happens there. But you guys have a wonderful weekend. But you guys have a wonderful weekend. But you guys have a wonderful weekend. Stay up with us. Smash that like button. Stay up with us. Smash that like button. Stay up with us. Smash that like button. Come on back and see us again next week. Come on back and see us again next week. Come on back and see us again next week. >> And take us seriously at your own risk. >> And take us seriously at your own risk. >> And take us seriously at your own risk. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. Yeah. That's for sure. AND RING THAT Yeah. That's for sure. AND RING THAT Yeah. That's for sure. AND RING THAT BELL. BELL. BELL. >> [laughter] >> AND KEEP YOUR EYE ON THE MAN IN THE >> AND KEEP YOUR EYE ON THE MAN IN THE MIRROR. MIRROR. MIRROR. EXACTLY. Exactly cuz that man in the EXACTLY. Exactly cuz that man in the EXACTLY. Exactly cuz that man in the mirror's going to say that IoT Coffee mirror's going to say that IoT Coffee mirror's going to say that IoT Coffee Talk bros and girls Talk bros and girls Talk bros and girls are the number one thing on YouTube. I are the number one thing on YouTube. I are the number one thing on YouTube. I mean, we're we're Aren't we? mean, we're we're Aren't we? mean, we're we're Aren't we? Oh, yeah. Well, we're probably like the Oh, yeah. Well, we're probably like the Oh, yeah. Well, we're probably like the last remaining IoT titled show in the last remaining IoT titled show in the last remaining IoT titled show in the YouTube. YouTube. YouTube. We're the holdout. There you go. You got We're the holdout. There you go. You got We're the holdout. There you go. You got it now, guys. We're the [music] market.

it now, guys. We're the [music] market. it now, guys. We're the [music] market. Exactly.