IoT Coffee Talk: Episode 235 - The Entrepreneur's Paradox

a a [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Music] hey that's going to be really really bad hey that's going to be really really bad bad bad bad bad bad karaoke what was that I was bad bad karaoke what was that I was bad bad karaoke what was that I was trying to play White Snake and I choked trying to play White Snake and I choked trying to play White Snake and I choked so whatever when playing White Snake you whatever when playing White Snake you know it's close is as good as a win you know it's close is as good as a win you know it's close is as good as a win you know you're that's true I you know I'm know you're that's true I you know I'm know you're that's true I you know I'm so off these days for the first couple so off these days for the first couple so off these days for the first couple seconds I thought you were going to play seconds I thought you were going to play seconds I thought you were going to play uh like uh like uh like Unchained B Helen you know um next time next time that's a know um next time next time that's a great idea what was the deal David Lee great idea what was the deal David Lee great idea what was the deal David Lee Ross like one J coming up yeah give me a Ross like one J coming up yeah give me a Ross like one J coming up yeah give me a break Dave Come On Dave give me a break and you know the think that those break and you know the think that those those guys were kids they were like 20 those guys were kids they were like 20 those guys were kids they were like 20 something you know yeah young guys but something you know yeah young guys but something you know yeah young guys but you know I mean it goes to show you the you know I mean it goes to show you the you know I mean it goes to show you the that Brilliance of Youth sometimes you that Brilliance of Youth sometimes you that Brilliance of Youth sometimes you know what I'm saying the Brilliance of know what I'm saying the Brilliance of know what I'm saying the Brilliance of Youth you know I have long believed this

Youth you know I have long believed this Youth you know I have long believed this about maybe it crosses everything about maybe it crosses everything about maybe it crosses everything whether it's musical Talent your ability whether it's musical Talent your ability whether it's musical Talent your ability to write songs and anything else I don't to write songs and anything else I don't to write songs and anything else I don't know the magic happens in your know the magic happens in your know the magic happens in your 20s when you're young and this sounds 20s when you're young and this sounds 20s when you're young and this sounds really horrible for bands as they really horrible for bands as they really horrible for bands as they continue on and they're in their 30s and continue on and they're in their 30s and continue on and they're in their 30s and then they're in their 40s and the 50s then they're in their 40s and the 50s then they're in their 40s and the 50s and notice how their albums just don't and notice how their albums just don't and notice how their albums just don't sell at all yeah and so the best they do sell at all yeah and so the best they do sell at all yeah and so the best they do you're so mean no no wait wait for it you're so mean no no wait wait for it you're so mean no no wait wait for it wait for it okay there's a lot of wait for it okay there's a lot of wait for it okay there's a lot of evidence to back this up actually I've evidence to back this up actually I've evidence to back this up actually I've always believed it it it it it saddens always believed it it it it it saddens always believed it it it it it saddens me um but it's true and so the best they me um but it's true and so the best they me um but it's true and so the best they can do is just tour and play the hits can do is just tour and play the hits can do is just tour and play the hits from when they were in their 20s and so from when they were in their 20s and so from when they were in their 20s and so then I was validated by Rick Bato where then I was validated by Rick Bato where then I was validated by Rick Bato where he did a whole he did a video where he he did a whole he did a video where he he did a whole he did a video where he talked about the exact same thing and he talked about the exact same thing and he talked about the exact same thing and he met and he just went through every band met and he just went through every band met and he just went through every band you can think of even the Beatles the you can think of even the Beatles the you can think of even the Beatles the best of the best yeah it's like there's best of the best yeah it's like there's best of the best yeah it's like there's some kind of magic some kind of whatever some kind of magic some kind of whatever some kind of magic some kind of whatever your brain's I don't know working better your brain's I don't know working better your brain's I don't know working better uh more I it's like a I think it's like uh more I it's like a I think it's like uh more I it's like a I think it's like a success bias you know you get Su you a success bias you know you get Su you a success bias you know you get Su you get some success with some content and get some success with some content and get some success with some content and then you everything else is you create then you everything else is you create then you everything else is you create is against that measurement and you just is against that measurement and you just is against that measurement and you just keep biasing toward that I think yeah keep biasing toward that I think yeah keep biasing toward that I think yeah yeah Rick AO by the way if people yeah Rick AO by the way if people yeah Rick AO by the way if people haven't checked out the Rick a YouTube haven't checked out the Rick a YouTube haven't checked out the Rick a YouTube if you're a musician that's a great if you're a musician that's a great if you're a musician that's a great YouTube channel to hit so oh yeah I mean YouTube channel to hit so oh yeah I mean YouTube channel to hit so oh yeah I mean I'm surprised people even know about him

I'm surprised people even know about him I'm surprised people even know about him even though something like two million even though something like two million even though something like two million view um I love watching his stuff it's I view um I love watching his stuff it's I view um I love watching his stuff it's I mean he gets some of the best guitar mean he gets some of the best guitar mean he gets some of the best guitar players oh yeah I haven't seen the video players oh yeah I haven't seen the video players oh yeah I haven't seen the video yet I don't if he published it but he yet I don't if he published it but he yet I don't if he published it but he did come out and say he finally he got did come out and say he finally he got did come out and say he finally he got David Gilmore to come on which was yeah David Gilmore to come on which was yeah David Gilmore to come on which was yeah yeah because in the past he mentioned yeah because in the past he mentioned yeah because in the past he mentioned you know there'll be some people I just you know there'll be some people I just you know there'll be some people I just won't be able to get right and and he won't be able to get right and and he won't be able to get right and and he listed names and Gilbo was one of them listed names and Gilbo was one of them listed names and Gilbo was one of them but apparently he just got him in an but apparently he just got him in an but apparently he just got him in an interview so that's pretty cool you know interview so that's pretty cool you know interview so that's pretty cool you know yeah I heard David Gilmore was on the yeah I heard David Gilmore was on the yeah I heard David Gilmore was on the tonight or one of the late night shows tonight or one of the late night shows tonight or one of the late night shows recently or something I don't know recently or something I don't know recently or something I don't know what's going on that wow opening he had what's going on that wow opening he had what's going on that wow opening he had Brian May on there recently fairly Brian May on there recently fairly Brian May on there recently fairly recently I guess that was incredible recently I guess that was incredible recently I guess that was incredible absolutely too like to absolutely too like to absolutely too like to absolutely yeah and you know it's great absolutely yeah and you know it's great absolutely yeah and you know it's great because he knows music and history like because he knows music and history like because he knows music and history like Rob I love history it's fun yeah but Rob I love history it's fun yeah but Rob I love history it's fun yeah but he's up to he's up to date with all the he's up to he's up to date with all the he's up to he's up to date with all the new kids you know like uh um yeah New new kids you know like uh um yeah New new kids you know like uh um yeah New Kids on The Walk New Kids on The Walk Kids on The Walk New Kids on The Walk Kids on The Walk New Kids on The Walk yeah you know he's up to date with that yeah you know he's up to date with that yeah you know he's up to date with that stuff yeah stuff yeah stuff yeah um so but yeah you know I think it boils um so but yeah you know I think it boils um so but yeah you know I think it boils down to like freaking down to like freaking down to like freaking hormone they have the hor you know some hormone they have the hor you know some hormone they have the hor you know some you know if you think back um to your um you know if you think back um to your um you know if you think back um to your um your teens as well as your early 20s man your teens as well as your early 20s man your teens as well as your early 20s man it's it's you're aggressive you know

it's it's you're aggressive you know it's it's you're aggressive you know know and you have a lot of testosterone know and you have a lot of testosterone know and you have a lot of testosterone and a lot of other stuff going on and and a lot of other stuff going on and and a lot of other stuff going on and you're inspired you know you're hopeful you're inspired you know you're hopeful you're inspired you know you're hopeful yeah a lot of stuff so you just uh I yeah a lot of stuff so you just uh I yeah a lot of stuff so you just uh I think you go down vectors that you think you go down vectors that you think you go down vectors that you people that are old and grumpy and people that are old and grumpy and people that are old and grumpy and crusty like us um kind of go well you crusty like us um kind of go well you crusty like us um kind of go well you don't know what's not possible as a don't know what's not possible as a don't know what's not possible as a younger person and you don't go for it younger person and you don't go for it younger person and you don't go for it and you learn and then you know you and you learn and then you know you and you learn and then you know you realize oh that wasn't possible but that realize oh that wasn't possible but that realize oh that wasn't possible but that was fun it's just like intact like you was fun it's just like intact like you was fun it's just like intact like you know remember Steve Jobs would say we know remember Steve Jobs would say we know remember Steve Jobs would say we didn't know it was impossible and so we didn't know it was impossible and so we didn't know it was impossible and so we did it you know it's like yeah we found did it you know it's like yeah we found did it you know it's like yeah we found a way to do a put a pdp1 on a piece of a way to do a put a pdp1 on a piece of a way to do a put a pdp1 on a piece of plywood on a deal made to Apple one and plywood on a deal made to Apple one and plywood on a deal made to Apple one and we didn't know that we couldn't do it we didn't know that we couldn't do it we didn't know that we couldn't do it and that's how we did it and it's that and that's how we did it and it's that and that's how we did it and it's that youth I think it's that arrogance or we youth I think it's that arrogance or we youth I think it's that arrogance or we don't know we don't know and so we don't know we don't know and so we don't know we don't know and so we somehow magically did it you know yeah somehow magically did it you know yeah somehow magically did it you know yeah um just having like a um um just having like a um um just having like a um you know tons of guts I mean I'm running you know tons of guts I mean I'm running you know tons of guts I mean I'm running up on the seven I mean just had the up on the seven I mean just had the up on the seven I mean just had the seventh year anniversary of next curve seventh year anniversary of next curve seventh year anniversary of next curve and for me at my age man that was was and for me at my age man that was was and for me at my age man that was was some scary stuff and Rob you were there some scary stuff and Rob you were there some scary stuff and Rob you were there at the beginning that's the crazy thing at the beginning that's the crazy thing at the beginning that's the crazy thing you know you are you were part of next you know you are you were part of next you know you are you were part of next curve you know you were the you're part curve you know you were the you're part curve you know you were the you're part of the history but you know I quite of the history but you know I quite of the history but you know I quite honestly I didn't know where I was going honestly I didn't know where I was going honestly I didn't know where I was going to end up and I ended up in I would have to end up and I ended up in I would have to end up and I ended up in I would have to say a pretty freaking you know nice to say a pretty freaking you know nice to say a pretty freaking you know nice place and and uh you never know but I

place and and uh you never know but I place and and uh you never know but I mean it's no but then you know you mean it's no but then you know you mean it's no but then you know you listen to these kids doing the crazy listen to these kids doing the crazy listen to these kids doing the crazy stuff man they never say it was easy in stuff man they never say it was easy in stuff man they never say it was easy in fact they didn't even know if it was fact they didn't even know if it was fact they didn't even know if it was gonna work you know um I know I remember gonna work you know um I know I remember gonna work you know um I know I remember I've got all these pictures of us at iot I've got all these pictures of us at iot I've got all these pictures of us at iot World Congress Solutions World Congress World Congress Solutions World Congress World Congress Solutions World Congress yeah like back in 2018 or 17 or yeah like back in 2018 or 17 or yeah like back in 2018 or 17 or something I don't know and we're something I don't know and we're something I don't know and we're standing iot thing and stuff like that standing iot thing and stuff like that standing iot thing and stuff like that you know what you did you you know what you did you you know what you did you struggled you per you perseverance struggled you per you perseverance struggled you per you perseverance there's uh you know my wife a school there's uh you know my wife a school there's uh you know my wife a school teacher she talks about kids today not teacher she talks about kids today not teacher she talks about kids today not all of them but she says she talks tries all of them but she says she talks tries all of them but she says she talks tries to teach them about this notion of to teach them about this notion of to teach them about this notion of productive struggle yeah um like because productive struggle yeah um like because productive struggle yeah um like because a lot of kids will just throw up their a lot of kids will just throw up their a lot of kids will just throw up their hands and give up like oh this is too hands and give up like oh this is too hands and give up like oh this is too hard I quit I can't do it you know and hard I quit I can't do it you know and hard I quit I can't do it you know and trying to teach them you've got to push trying to teach them you've got to push trying to teach them you've got to push through you're going to your whole life through you're going to your whole life through you're going to your whole life you're going to get into these things you're going to get into these things you're going to get into these things that you think are too hard or the that you think are too hard or the that you think are too hard or the mountains too high to climb and you mountains too high to climb and you mountains too high to climb and you really got to find a way to be really got to find a way to be really got to find a way to be persistent and push through yeah yeah persistent and push through yeah yeah persistent and push through yeah yeah there's also this interesting uh there's also this interesting uh there's also this interesting uh discussion going on especially on discussion going on especially on discussion going on especially on LinkedIn around agism and age in Tech LinkedIn around agism and age in Tech LinkedIn around agism and age in Tech and even so there's you know on the and even so there's you know on the and even so there's you know on the younger side there is that you know we younger side there is that you know we younger side there is that you know we don't know it's impossible we go for it don't know it's impossible we go for it don't know it's impossible we go for it on the older side there is like the on the older side there is like the on the older side there is like the wisdom and the operational knowledge wisdom and the operational knowledge wisdom and the operational knowledge that you also need to be successful to that you also need to be successful to that you also need to be successful to so it's like part important to have like so it's like part important to have like so it's like part important to have like this kind of well-rounded team often you this kind of well-rounded team often you this kind of well-rounded team often you know you've seen this unfortunately you

know you've seen this unfortunately you know you've seen this unfortunately you see you know there was some VC the other see you know there was some VC the other see you know there was some VC the other day that say yeah never hire a CEO older day that say yeah never hire a CEO older day that say yeah never hire a CEO older than 35 or something like that like it's than 35 or something like that like it's than 35 or something like that like it's kind of this [ __ ] that's like you kind of this [ __ ] that's like you kind of this [ __ ] that's like you know this age bias that goes on that know this age bias that goes on that know this age bias that goes on that really harmful and it's actually it's really harmful and it's actually it's really harmful and it's actually it's not it's a bad business strategy too not it's a bad business strategy too not it's a bad business strategy too it's not immoral it's bad business it's not immoral it's bad business it's not immoral it's bad business strategy so yeah you know in that regard strategy so yeah you know in that regard strategy so yeah you know in that regard I think it's just even playing field you I think it's just even playing field you I think it's just even playing field you know what I'm saying um I think I I mean know what I'm saying um I think I I mean know what I'm saying um I think I I mean to be honest I have met some older folks to be honest I have met some older folks to be honest I have met some older folks folks who are a folks who are a folks who are a Generation Um older than me that are Generation Um older than me that are Generation Um older than me that are super entrepreneurial they have crazy super entrepreneurial they have crazy super entrepreneurial they have crazy Amazing Ideas some of a lot of bad ideas Amazing Ideas some of a lot of bad ideas Amazing Ideas some of a lot of bad ideas too so I don't think it really I don't too so I don't think it really I don't too so I don't think it really I don't think it's really all that that diff think it's really all that that diff think it's really all that that diff different in terms of a quote unquote different in terms of a quote unquote different in terms of a quote unquote dynamic or issue it's just it's dynamic or issue it's just it's dynamic or issue it's just it's different right you experience different right you experience different right you experience definitely matters but then experience definitely matters but then experience definitely matters but then experience can sometime pigeonhole your thinking can sometime pigeonhole your thinking can sometime pigeonhole your thinking right and then on the other end right and then on the other end right and then on the other end ignorance can uh enable you to um get ignorance can uh enable you to um get ignorance can uh enable you to um get excited about something that you excited about something that you excited about something that you shouldn't be getting excited about but shouldn't be getting excited about but shouldn't be getting excited about but then it gives you that that perseverance then it gives you that that perseverance then it gives you that that perseverance I I guess that in on a few I I guess that in on a few I I guess that in on a few occasions uh that effort and that energy occasions uh that effort and that energy occasions uh that effort and that energy can translate into something that's big can translate into something that's big can translate into something that's big right um whereas you know some of these right um whereas you know some of these right um whereas you know some of these more exper experienced people they more exper experienced people they more exper experienced people they actually hone in on a real fraking actually hone in on a real fraking actually hone in on a real fraking problem right that can ex exponentially

problem right that can ex exponentially problem right that can ex exponentially scale but they have no idea how to sell scale but they have no idea how to sell scale but they have no idea how to sell it and talk BS about it yeah you know it and talk BS about it yeah you know it and talk BS about it yeah you know what I'm saying and do all the FY crap what I'm saying and do all the FY crap what I'm saying and do all the FY crap that you know you know people who are that you know you know people who are that you know you know people who are let's say less experienced and maybe let's say less experienced and maybe let's say less experienced and maybe ignorant of things they have no problem ignorant of things they have no problem ignorant of things they have no problem doing it because they believe right doing it because they believe right doing it because they believe right right yeah yeah this is like that right yeah yeah this is like that right yeah yeah this is like that discussion Around The Beginner's mind discussion Around The Beginner's mind discussion Around The Beginner's mind and the experts mind you know where you and the experts mind you know where you and the experts mind you know where you hear about that yeah in The Beginner's hear about that yeah in The Beginner's hear about that yeah in The Beginner's mind anything is possible you know and mind anything is possible you know and mind anything is possible you know and and the problem with people with a lot and the problem with people with a lot and the problem with people with a lot of experience is sometimes they self of experience is sometimes they self of experience is sometimes they self sabotage and they'll say oh this has sabotage and they'll say oh this has sabotage and they'll say oh this has already been done self uh self edit already been done self uh self edit already been done self uh self edit maybe yeah yeah exactly and so it makes maybe yeah yeah exactly and so it makes maybe yeah yeah exactly and so it makes me think the ideal Tech founder is a me think the ideal Tech founder is a me think the ideal Tech founder is a little bit little bit little bit naive but persistent a little bit crazy persistent a little bit crazy but yeah you know what always helps so but yeah you know what always helps so but yeah you know what always helps so man in any regard is um better questions man in any regard is um better questions man in any regard is um better questions tough tough tough questions I don't think it's it's wrong questions I don't think it's it's wrong questions I don't think it's it's wrong for grumpy old old folks to ask tough for grumpy old old folks to ask tough for grumpy old old folks to ask tough questions and if let's say um you know a questions and if let's say um you know a questions and if let's say um you know a bright-eyed young person can't answer bright-eyed young person can't answer bright-eyed young person can't answer them well that's something they should them well that's something they should them well that's something they should take on and to answer you know what I'm take on and to answer you know what I'm take on and to answer you know what I'm yeah um because there's a lot of older yeah um because there's a lot of older yeah um because there's a lot of older generation folks who don't a ask great generation folks who don't a ask great generation folks who don't a ask great questions they get a lot of problems questions they get a lot of problems questions they get a lot of problems that's the business all the time a good that's the business all the time a good that's the business all the time a good board of directors will ask good

board of directors will ask good board of directors will ask good questions that's why you have good board questions that's why you have good board questions that's why you have good board of directors exactly they've been to a of directors exactly they've been to a of directors exactly they've been to a lot of rodeos ask those questions be lot of rodeos ask those questions be lot of rodeos ask those questions be like hm have you thought about this you like hm have you thought about this you like hm have you thought about this you know yeah do you guys I know we probably know yeah do you guys I know we probably know yeah do you guys I know we probably talk this before do you guys ever listen talk this before do you guys ever listen talk this before do you guys ever listen to the acquired podcast you know it's to the acquired podcast you know it's to the acquired podcast you know it's these guys at Madrona uh I think you these guys at Madrona uh I think you these guys at Madrona uh I think you mentioned it yeah madona yeah um they mentioned it yeah madona yeah um they mentioned it yeah madona yeah um they did a great thing they did the whole did a great thing they did the whole did a great thing they did the whole history of Microsoft which is great but history of Microsoft which is great but history of Microsoft which is great but they're doing one right now where they're doing one right now where they're doing one right now where they're talking about Mark Zuckerberg they're talking about Mark Zuckerberg they're talking about Mark Zuckerberg specifically and meta but really about specifically and meta but really about specifically and meta but really about him when you talk about a young person him when you talk about a young person him when you talk about a young person who doesn't know you can't do things and who doesn't know you can't do things and who doesn't know you can't do things and you just go for it you know some you you just go for it you know some you you just go for it you know some you obviously you know lots of the stories obviously you know lots of the stories obviously you know lots of the stories behind Zuck and Facebook and everything behind Zuck and Facebook and everything behind Zuck and Facebook and everything uh from the movie and other and lots of uh from the movie and other and lots of uh from the movie and other and lots of books have been written about it but books have been written about it but books have been written about it but some of the insights are just so cool um some of the insights are just so cool um some of the insights are just so cool um you know and people are like you know you know and people are like you know you know and people are like you know can he really be the CEO of this giant can he really be the CEO of this giant can he really be the CEO of this giant thing you know um and there the answer thing you know um and there the answer thing you know um and there the answer is yes he is yes he is yes he can the guy's really got it whatever can the guy's really got it whatever can the guy's really got it whatever people throw tomatoes at Zach all the people throw tomatoes at Zach all the people throw tomatoes at Zach all the time but you know what he's There's time but you know what he's There's time but you know what he's There's Something Magic that he's got they talk Something Magic that he's got they talk Something Magic that he's got they talk about all the other Tech stuff he had about all the other Tech stuff he had about all the other Tech stuff he had done in high school you know when he he done in high school you know when he he done in high school you know when he he went to like Philips exitor and then he went to like Philips exitor and then he went to like Philips exitor and then he was going to some real regular public was going to some real regular public was going to some real regular public school and he was just way too smart and school and he was just way too smart and school and he was just way too smart and he was just you know so he got in and he was just you know so he got in and he was just you know so he got in and then it was just like a no-brainer that then it was just like a no-brainer that then it was just like a no-brainer that he was going to get into Harvard you he was going to get into Harvard you he was going to get into Harvard you know like he's just he was just so much know like he's just he was just so much know like he's just he was just so much smarter and yet he was always building smarter and yet he was always building smarter and yet he was always building software and Building Things uh and then

software and Building Things uh and then software and Building Things uh and then you know Harvard was like I think you you know Harvard was like I think you you know Harvard was like I think you it's funny they they said class it's funny they they said class it's funny they they said class classroom study was like the least classroom study was like the least classroom study was like the least important thing on his mind he was important thing on his mind he was important thing on his mind he was building stuff the whole time and building stuff the whole time and building stuff the whole time and obviously we know about the face smash obviously we know about the face smash obviously we know about the face smash thing which is like the Hot or Not deal thing which is like the Hot or Not deal thing which is like the Hot or Not deal uh on Harvard campus but uh pretty uh on Harvard campus but uh pretty uh on Harvard campus but uh pretty brilliant actually it's super remarkable brilliant actually it's super remarkable brilliant actually it's super remarkable then they talk about the VCS but but the then they talk about the VCS but but the then they talk about the VCS but but the whole deal about you know once he moves whole deal about you know once he moves whole deal about you know once he moves to Pao to Pao to Pao Alto um and the kind of deal they wanted Alto um and the kind of deal they wanted Alto um and the kind of deal they wanted to do and they talked about this like to do and they talked about this like to do and they talked about this like we're just a few years out of the dotc we're just a few years out of the dotc we're just a few years out of the dotc crash and a lot of VCS felt really crash and a lot of VCS felt really crash and a lot of VCS felt really burned by the kind of crazy things they burned by the kind of crazy things they burned by the kind of crazy things they invested in during.com and then Here invested in during.com and then Here invested in during.com and then Here Comes this Facebook thing where it's Comes this Facebook thing where it's Comes this Facebook thing where it's like no zck needs to be completely in like no zck needs to be completely in like no zck needs to be completely in control of the whole thing you know and control of the whole thing you know and control of the whole thing you know and most VCS back then and even ever most VCS back then and even ever most VCS back then and even ever especially today there's like no way in especially today there's like no way in especially today there's like no way in hell you know it's like you know you're hell you know it's like you know you're hell you know it's like you know you're getting this much money we're going to getting this much money we're going to getting this much money we're going to own this huge chunk there's no way you'd own this huge chunk there's no way you'd own this huge chunk there's no way you'd have over 50% control of company and yet have over 50% control of company and yet have over 50% control of company and yet that's what happened and they kind of that's what happened and they kind of that's what happened and they kind of talked about the only way it really talked about the only way it really talked about the only way it really could happen was going after individual could happen was going after individual could happen was going after individual Angels at the beginning so you know Angels at the beginning so you know Angels at the beginning so you know apparently he talked to you know Reed apparently he talked to you know Reed apparently he talked to you know Reed Hoffman at the beginning you know who Hoffman at the beginning you know who Hoffman at the beginning you know who was just barely doing was just barely doing was just barely doing LinkedIn uh what's his name Pinkus who LinkedIn uh what's his name Pinkus who LinkedIn uh what's his name Pinkus who was also I think part of the eBay Mafia was also I think part of the eBay Mafia was also I think part of the eBay Mafia or the PayPal or the PayPal or the PayPal Mafia um and they could chip in a little Mafia um and they could chip in a little Mafia um and they could chip in a little bit of money but then they said we need

bit of money but then they said we need bit of money but then they said we need to introduce you to Peter teal um and I to introduce you to Peter teal um and I to introduce you to Peter teal um and I think it was only through that mechanism think it was only through that mechanism think it was only through that mechanism and Peter teal hadn't started Founders and Peter teal hadn't started Founders and Peter teal hadn't started Founders fund yet that they were you know at that fund yet that they were you know at that fund yet that they were you know at that individual onet toone level that they individual onet toone level that they individual onet toone level that they were able to do a deal where Zach would were able to do a deal where Zach would were able to do a deal where Zach would have so much control and still get the have so much control and still get the have so much control and still get the money he needed and then of course then money he needed and then of course then money he needed and then of course then later on all the you know Excel Partners later on all the you know Excel Partners later on all the you know Excel Partners all the other VCS kind of got in line all the other VCS kind of got in line all the other VCS kind of got in line and they did a deal they said they would and they did a deal they said they would and they did a deal they said they would never never never do and yet at the same time it's like do and yet at the same time it's like do and yet at the same time it's like yeah we invested Facebook you know it's yeah we invested Facebook you know it's yeah we invested Facebook you know it's the most successful company ever when the most successful company ever when the most successful company ever when you talk about Venture Venture Capital you talk about Venture Venture Capital you talk about Venture Venture Capital company like those guys what I think company like those guys what I think company like those guys what I think they said they made 250,000 X on their they said they made 250,000 X on their they said they made 250,000 X on their money as a I mean there's nothing that money as a I mean there's nothing that money as a I mean there's nothing that compares to Facebook just really isn't compares to Facebook just really isn't compares to Facebook just really isn't you know you thought Google was the you know you thought Google was the you know you thought Google was the biggest thing that those guy Facebook biggest thing that those guy Facebook biggest thing that those guy Facebook blows it out yeah interesting story blows it out yeah interesting story blows it out yeah interesting story about Facebook I was like uh you know about Facebook I was like uh you know about Facebook I was like uh you know for our community in the now what we for our community in the now what we for our community in the now what we call the Aji Foundation we used to call call the Aji Foundation we used to call call the Aji Foundation we used to call the tml foundation the tml foundation the tml foundation yeah um which we launched last week in yeah um which we launched last week in yeah um which we launched last week in Taiwan and I was like you know we've Taiwan and I was like you know we've Taiwan and I was like you know we've always never really engaged in the always never really engaged in the always never really engaged in the Facebook Community because you know Facebook Community because you know Facebook Community because you know there's people on LinkedIn and Discord there's people on LinkedIn and Discord there's people on LinkedIn and Discord orever but to be honest with you when we orever but to be honest with you when we orever but to be honest with you when we do events and we want to advertise for do events and we want to advertise for do events and we want to advertise for registration we get the most response registration we get the most response registration we get the most response out of Facebook ads and I thought that out of Facebook ads and I thought that out of Facebook ads and I thought that was really interesting and so I went to was really interesting and so I went to was really interesting and so I went to Taiwan I met this guy named uh Jack Taiwan I met this guy named uh Jack Taiwan I met this guy named uh Jack enishi and uh shout out to Jack and he enishi and uh shout out to Jack and he enishi and uh shout out to Jack and he was on a panel uh on our event there and

was on a panel uh on our event there and was on a panel uh on our event there and he runs an aedi and Taiwan Facebook he runs an aedi and Taiwan Facebook he runs an aedi and Taiwan Facebook group and I was like oh cool I was like group and I was like oh cool I was like group and I was like oh cool I was like you know how big's a group he's like you know how big's a group he's like you know how big's a group he's like about 10,000 people whoa like what you about 10,000 people whoa like what you about 10,000 people whoa like what you know so I Jo I joined the group and uh know so I Jo I joined the group and uh know so I Jo I joined the group and uh what was cool about it was that of what was cool about it was that of what was cool about it was that of course like 90% is in Chinese but the course like 90% is in Chinese but the course like 90% is in Chinese but the translation uh Tech on Facebook was translation uh Tech on Facebook was translation uh Tech on Facebook was really good so I'm able to like read all really good so I'm able to like read all really good so I'm able to like read all the posts and read the articles and the posts and read the articles and the posts and read the articles and engage with this this uh organization engage with this this uh organization engage with this this uh organization and this community which is really cool and this community which is really cool and this community which is really cool using you know my my English um but it using you know my my English um but it using you know my my English um but it was like this huge AI community of tech was like this huge AI community of tech was like this huge AI community of tech nerds you know in Taiwan um that was nerds you know in Taiwan um that was nerds you know in Taiwan um that was just out there that I didn't even heard just out there that I didn't even heard just out there that I didn't even heard of so I think I think Facebook's got a of so I think I think Facebook's got a of so I think I think Facebook's got a lot more kind a lot more Dimensions to lot more kind a lot more Dimensions to lot more kind a lot more Dimensions to it than most of us think about maybe in it than most of us think about maybe in it than most of us think about maybe in the west yeah I agree and you know the west yeah I agree and you know the west yeah I agree and you know people talk about their Tech or the people talk about their Tech or the people talk about their Tech or the scalability or whatever and you always scalability or whatever and you always scalability or whatever and you always talk about the big cloud players like talk about the big cloud players like talk about the big cloud players like AWS and AER and gcp and people always AWS and AER and gcp and people always AWS and AER and gcp and people always look at me funny I routinely tell people look at me funny I routinely tell people look at me funny I routinely tell people when you want to learn about giant when you want to learn about giant when you want to learn about giant scalable systems you should look at scalable systems you should look at scalable systems you should look at Facebook before you look at those other Facebook before you look at those other Facebook before you look at those other guys because nothing compares actually guys because nothing compares actually guys because nothing compares actually yeah there's no there's no company on yeah there's no there's no company on yeah there's no there's no company on the planet that has over four billion the planet that has over four billion the planet that has over four billion active daily users hitting your system active daily users hitting your system active daily users hitting your system nothing I think they're using their nothing I think they're using their nothing I think they're using their their AI for translation too because it their AI for translation too because it their AI for translation too because it was really good it was was really good it was was really good it was really impressive you know I used to really impressive you know I used to really impressive you know I used to when I was trying to improve myself as when I was trying to improve myself as when I was trying to improve myself as an architect I would read all these an architect I would read all these an architect I would read all these white papers that the Facebook white papers that the Facebook white papers that the Facebook Architects would publish on how to build Architects would publish on how to build Architects would publish on how to build scalable systems because they're better scalable systems because they're better scalable systems because they're better than anybody they just are it seems

than anybody they just are it seems than anybody they just are it seems cheesy to say Facebook is the best but cheesy to say Facebook is the best but cheesy to say Facebook is the best but just really is because the the numbers just really is because the the numbers just really is because the the numbers don't lie yeah it's not even close it don't lie yeah it's not even close it don't lie yeah it's not even close it would be all the cloud players and would be all the cloud players and would be all the cloud players and everyone combined to try to even get everyone combined to try to even get everyone combined to try to even get close to what Facebook does every day close to what Facebook does every day close to what Facebook does every day yeah and they're disrupting with llama yeah and they're disrupting with llama yeah and they're disrupting with llama and open source you know AI model kind and open source you know AI model kind and open source you know AI model kind of blowing up everyone's nice little uh of blowing up everyone's nice little uh of blowing up everyone's nice little uh money machines you know scal they're money machines you know scal they're money machines you know scal they're like ah throw it out there here's some like ah throw it out there here's some like ah throw it out there here's some search new search engine no big deal for search new search engine no big deal for search new search engine no big deal for free yeah and um yeah and H all these free yeah and um yeah and H all these free yeah and um yeah and H all these hyperscalers are different like you're hyperscalers are different like you're hyperscalers are different like you're saying rob they have more of a let's say saying rob they have more of a let's say saying rob they have more of a let's say homogeneous workload portfolio than homogeneous workload portfolio than homogeneous workload portfolio than others so if you're trying to compare others so if you're trying to compare others so if you're trying to compare with AWS or others you have to start or with AWS or others you have to start or with AWS or others you have to start or you know know Amazon more broadly you you know know Amazon more broadly you you know know Amazon more broadly you have to look at their Core Business have to look at their Core Business have to look at their Core Business right which in you know for Amazon it's right which in you know for Amazon it's right which in you know for Amazon it's retail um for uh Google it's search so retail um for uh Google it's search so retail um for uh Google it's search so you know but these are pretty big you know but these are pretty big you know but these are pretty big businesses themselves right and so uh businesses themselves right and so uh businesses themselves right and so uh they might not have the billions of they might not have the billions of they might not have the billions of active uh daily users but that's how you active uh daily users but that's how you active uh daily users but that's how you have to look at the scale but if you you have to look at the scale but if you you have to look at the scale but if you you start to look at hyperscalers in terms start to look at hyperscalers in terms start to look at hyperscalers in terms of their Cloud business because that's of their Cloud business because that's of their Cloud business because that's how a lot of people think of them for how a lot of people think of them for how a lot of people think of them for some reason these days then it's a some reason these days then it's a some reason these days then it's a totally different story it's not an totally different story it's not an totally different story it's not an Apples to Apples uh comparison right and Apples to Apples uh comparison right and Apples to Apples uh comparison right and in that regard um Facebook is lucky in that regard um Facebook is lucky in that regard um Facebook is lucky because they don't have to deal with

because they don't have to deal with because they don't have to deal with that diversity of workloads that let's that diversity of workloads that let's that diversity of workloads that let's say AWS or Azure has to deal with say AWS or Azure has to deal with say AWS or Azure has to deal with they're not running overall has to deal they're not running overall has to deal they're not running overall has to deal with yeah they're not running crap ton with yeah they're not running crap ton with yeah they're not running crap ton of complexity that goes beyond you know of complexity that goes beyond you know of complexity that goes beyond you know typ hypers skill thinking but Rob you typ hypers skill thinking but Rob you typ hypers skill thinking but Rob you know that scale that you're talking know that scale that you're talking know that scale that you're talking about that Facebook has and you I about that Facebook has and you I about that Facebook has and you I remember TK amen you know when I was uh remember TK amen you know when I was uh remember TK amen you know when I was uh when he was a CEO of Rocket 10 mobile he when he was a CEO of Rocket 10 mobile he when he was a CEO of Rocket 10 mobile he he used to bring that up all the time he used to bring that up all the time he used to bring that up all the time and but the one thing that you always uh and but the one thing that you always uh and but the one thing that you always uh arrived at is the fact that in a arrived at is the fact that in a arrived at is the fact that in a Facebook data center you have one Facebook data center you have one Facebook data center you have one basically a singular workload quote basically a singular workload quote basically a singular workload quote unquote I mean it's a massive complex unquote I mean it's a massive complex unquote I mean it's a massive complex one but you don't have all these one but you don't have all these one but you don't have all these different system systems um that you're different system systems um that you're different system systems um that you're trying to provide to your customers like trying to provide to your customers like trying to provide to your customers like um you know AWS or gcp or Azure you know um you know AWS or gcp or Azure you know um you know AWS or gcp or Azure you know so yeah in that regard man it it so yeah in that regard man it it so yeah in that regard man it it freaking massively scaled right in its freaking massively scaled right in its freaking massively scaled right in its simplicity so yeah it's incredible man simplicity so yeah it's incredible man simplicity so yeah it's incredible man yeah it was interesting to hear early yeah it was interesting to hear early yeah it was interesting to hear early on they didn't even have to worry about on they didn't even have to worry about on they didn't even have to worry about scale problems any early on they did scale problems any early on they did scale problems any early on they did things that seemed counterintuitive in things that seemed counterintuitive in things that seemed counterintuitive in the early days remember it's like all the early days remember it's like all the early days remember it's like all right we're g to get Harvard first and right we're g to get Harvard first and right we're g to get Harvard first and then the next come they went after uh then the next come they went after uh then the next come they went after uh Columbia in New York City and they Columbia in New York City and they Columbia in New York City and they actually had dedicated servers and there actually had dedicated servers and there actually had dedicated servers and there was no interconnect between so when was no interconnect between so when was no interconnect between so when Colombia came online they could not see Colombia came online they could not see Colombia came online they could not see Harvard people and so early on they

Harvard people and so early on they Harvard people and so early on they didn't even have to worry about scale didn't even have to worry about scale didn't even have to worry about scale issues because they just had a Columbia issues because they just had a Columbia issues because they just had a Columbia server and a Harvard server and they and server and a Harvard server and they and server and a Harvard server and they and they kind of went like that initially at they kind of went like that initially at they kind of went like that initially at least and so they could build the least and so they could build the least and so they could build the technology keep adding features on the technology keep adding features on the technology keep adding features on the Fly that kind of thing and not worry Fly that kind of thing and not worry Fly that kind of thing and not worry about scale until finally flipping the about scale until finally flipping the about scale until finally flipping the switch and saying okay now you can all switch and saying okay now you can all switch and saying okay now you can all see each other you know I'm surprised uh see each other you know I'm surprised uh see each other you know I'm surprised uh Facebook or meta hasn't gone bit harder Facebook or meta hasn't gone bit harder Facebook or meta hasn't gone bit harder into the kind of build your own server into the kind of build your own server into the kind of build your own server chip business um like the other chip business um like the other chip business um like the other hyperscalers have you know maybe it's hyperscalers have you know maybe it's hyperscalers have you know maybe it's under WRA we don't know about it but you under WRA we don't know about it but you under WRA we don't know about it but you it would seem like with that kind of it would seem like with that kind of it would seem like with that kind of scale and those kind of workloads like scale and those kind of workloads like scale and those kind of workloads like you were saying Leonard they could you were saying Leonard they could you were saying Leonard they could optimize a little bit um yeah you know optimize a little bit um yeah you know optimize a little bit um yeah you know well I mean maybe they're looking at uh well I mean maybe they're looking at uh well I mean maybe they're looking at uh because they they buy a crap ton of um because they they buy a crap ton of um because they they buy a crap ton of um Nvidia sure right and maybe the way that Nvidia sure right and maybe the way that Nvidia sure right and maybe the way that they're looking at things is hey this is they're looking at things is hey this is they're looking at things is hey this is pretty general purpose so it's pretty general purpose so it's pretty general purpose so it's extensible and you know given how extensible and you know given how extensible and you know given how quickly U these um you know geni quickly U these um you know geni quickly U these um you know geni supercomputing platforms are evolving um supercomputing platforms are evolving um supercomputing platforms are evolving um we should have as much flexibility built we should have as much flexibility built we should have as much flexibility built into the into the into the overall um you know system overall um you know system overall um you know system so that we can depreciate it longer over so that we can depreciate it longer over so that we can depreciate it longer over time you know yeah no that's true I do time you know yeah no that's true I do time you know yeah no that's true I do know though problem right know though problem right know though problem right now the other fast yeah but the training now the other fast yeah but the training now the other fast yeah but the training the issue is the training costs now out the issue is the training costs now out the issue is the training costs now out of control and it's like anything you to of control and it's like anything you to of control and it's like anything you to optimize your training is going to have

optimize your training is going to have optimize your training is going to have a huge impact on your bottom line a huge impact on your bottom line a huge impact on your bottom line because it's just billions of dollars at because it's just billions of dollars at because it's just billions of dollars at this point to train but think about all this point to train but think about all this point to train but think about all the inference they have sure I because the inference they have sure I because the inference they have sure I because we have to remember they're not selling we have to remember they're not selling we have to remember they're not selling this stuff to Enterprise is internally this stuff to Enterprise is internally this stuff to Enterprise is internally they're going to be developing these new they're going to be developing these new they're going to be developing these new capabilities for their ad systems their capabilities for their ad systems their capabilities for their ad systems their you know um the targeting or you know um the targeting or you know um the targeting or personalization engine that they have uh personalization engine that they have uh personalization engine that they have uh the recommender engines right that the recommender engines right that the recommender engines right that systems that Jensen always talks about systems that Jensen always talks about systems that Jensen always talks about and that's a those are massive workloads and that's a those are massive workloads and that's a those are massive workloads right Leonard your audio setting might right Leonard your audio setting might right Leonard your audio setting might you're cutting out a little bit on your you're cutting out a little bit on your you're cutting out a little bit on your a have like an aggressive noise a have like an aggressive noise a have like an aggressive noise cancelling thing going on that fine yeah you're fine you know it's that fine yeah you're fine you know it's really interesting you know so a lot of really interesting you know so a lot of really interesting you know so a lot of people might remember in The Social people might remember in The Social people might remember in The Social Network movie there's a time when bunch Network movie there's a time when bunch Network movie there's a time when bunch of them went to see Bill Gates speak at of them went to see Bill Gates speak at of them went to see Bill Gates speak at Harvard and there's more to that than Harvard and there's more to that than Harvard and there's more to that than you think apparently and this was this you think apparently and this was this you think apparently and this was this is a major factor in Zuck feeling is a major factor in Zuck feeling is a major factor in Zuck feeling comfortable about leaving Harvard comfortable about leaving Harvard comfortable about leaving Harvard was during that speech that Bill Gates was during that speech that Bill Gates was during that speech that Bill Gates gave at Harvard he mentioned Harvard has gave at Harvard he mentioned Harvard has gave at Harvard he mentioned Harvard has this really liberal policy that if you this really liberal policy that if you this really liberal policy that if you want to take a long sabatical or leave want to take a long sabatical or leave want to take a long sabatical or leave of absence from Harvard you can take as of absence from Harvard you can take as of absence from Harvard you can take as long a sabatical as you want and then long a sabatical as you want and then long a sabatical as you want and then just come right back and Bill said

just come right back and Bill said just come right back and Bill said that's what gave him the Comfort to know that's what gave him the Comfort to know that's what gave him the Comfort to know that he could drop out of Harvard and go that he could drop out of Harvard and go that he could drop out of Harvard and go to Albuquerque to Albuquerque to Albuquerque Microsoft and that was what made suck Microsoft and that was what made suck Microsoft and that was what made suck ber feel relieved and goes oh okay I ber feel relieved and goes oh okay I ber feel relieved and goes oh okay I could leave for a while and then I can could leave for a while and then I can could leave for a while and then I can come back anytime I want and that and so come back anytime I want and that and so come back anytime I want and that and so it was that speech from Bill that kind it was that speech from Bill that kind it was that speech from Bill that kind of gave him the free pass to feel like of gave him the free pass to feel like of gave him the free pass to feel like okay it's not so bad if I leave and go okay it's not so bad if I leave and go okay it's not so bad if I leave and go to California you to California you to California you know you know the other platform I think know you know the other platform I think know you know the other platform I think is kind of getting hot too it's not the is kind of getting hot too it's not the is kind of getting hot too it's not the same infrastructure scale as Reddit I same infrastructure scale as Reddit I same infrastructure scale as Reddit I don't know if you've seen Reddit is now don't know if you've seen Reddit is now don't know if you've seen Reddit is now profitable for the first time wow great profitable for the first time wow great profitable for the first time wow great and uh it's getting I I I I definitely and uh it's getting I I I I definitely and uh it's getting I I I I definitely foresee Reddit becoming much more foresee Reddit becoming much more foresee Reddit becoming much more mainstream platform for communities and mainstream platform for communities and mainstream platform for communities and conversations I think it's just yeah conversations I think it's just yeah conversations I think it's just yeah it's get getting better and better and it's get getting better and better and it's get getting better and better and you know I think if they start infusing you know I think if they start infusing you know I think if they start infusing with more AI smarts like if I had a with more AI smarts like if I had a with more AI smarts like if I had a Reddit agent to help me sort of Reddit agent to help me sort of Reddit agent to help me sort of summarize what's happening in my my summarize what's happening in my my summarize what's happening in my my subreddits and threads I mean stuff like subreddits and threads I mean stuff like subreddits and threads I mean stuff like that I think is really cool because it's that I think is really cool because it's that I think is really cool because it's well why not that would be great no no well why not that would be great no no well why not that would be great no no no no no it sounds great it's just I I no no no it sounds great it's just I I no no no it sounds great it's just I I been man have you noticed Google has been man have you noticed Google has been man have you noticed Google has materially gotten worse with these materially gotten worse with these materially gotten worse with these gen overview oh my God I mean it's like gen overview oh my God I mean it's like gen overview oh my God I mean it's like now the rest of the search is becoming now the rest of the search is becoming now the rest of the search is becoming useless it's like the results are so low useless it's like the results are so low useless it's like the results are so low quality because I'm you know I usually quality because I'm you know I usually quality because I'm you know I usually use search but then you know you get

use search but then you know you get use search but then you know you get force-fed these overviews and yeah time force-fed these overviews and yeah time force-fed these overviews and yeah time again I'll I you occasionally I'll go again I'll I you occasionally I'll go again I'll I you occasionally I'll go and I'll review the the overviews and I'll review the the overviews and I'll review the the overviews there's all kind of crazy crap in it there's all kind of crazy crap in it there's all kind of crazy crap in it about 20% of it is wrong and then now I about 20% of it is wrong and then now I about 20% of it is wrong and then now I look at the search results and there's look at the search results and there's look at the search results and there's nothing useful there because I think a nothing useful there because I think a nothing useful there because I think a lot of it is being informed by the lot of it is being informed by the lot of it is being informed by the recommender engine yeah that's also recommender engine yeah that's also recommender engine yeah that's also running gen AI yeah so I'm running gen AI yeah so I'm running gen AI yeah so I'm like disappointing you know because I like disappointing you know because I like disappointing you know because I you know you kind of rely on Google to you know you kind of rely on Google to you know you kind of rely on Google to at least up some quality stuff and now at least up some quality stuff and now at least up some quality stuff and now it's all just a mish mash of just ad ad it's all just a mish mash of just ad ad it's all just a mish mash of just ad ad fronted content and then right really fronted content and then right really fronted content and then right really low quality links have you seen the low quality links have you seen the low quality links have you seen the Apple intelligence some of the screens Apple intelligence some of the screens Apple intelligence some of the screens of like your EMA it summarizes your of like your EMA it summarizes your of like your EMA it summarizes your notifications like ring doorbell you notifications like ring doorbell you notifications like ring doorbell you have people at your front door your back have people at your front door your back have people at your front door your back door and your garage it's like it door and your garage it's like it door and your garage it's like it summarizes is like and it's like oh I'm summarizes is like and it's like oh I'm summarizes is like and it's like oh I'm being invaded by by like a moob people being invaded by by like a moob people being invaded by by like a moob people it's like largely useless I'm actually it's like largely useless I'm actually it's like largely useless I'm actually turning off the I turned off the um turning off the I turned off the um turning off the I turned off the um summary or whatever they call it summary or whatever they call it summary or whatever they call it Priority thing because it kept Priority thing because it kept Priority thing because it kept prioritizing the my junk prioritizing the my junk prioritizing the my junk mail you got to be kidding me it's like mail you got to be kidding me it's like mail you got to be kidding me it's like I got to turn this [ __ ] off because I'm I got to turn this [ __ ] off because I'm I got to turn this [ __ ] off because I'm not really GNA get anything done not really GNA get anything done not really GNA get anything done priority you've won a million dollars priority you've won a million dollars priority you've won a million dollars click here oh wow yeah that's what you click here oh wow yeah that's what you click here oh wow yeah that's what you know we talked about before the learning know we talked about before the learning know we talked about before the learning curve is going to turn people off curve is going to turn people off curve is going to turn people off because nobody wants to suffer this crap because nobody wants to suffer this crap because nobody wants to suffer this crap I don't want my junk mail being

I don't want my junk mail being I don't want my junk mail being prioritized by a prioritized by a prioritized by a geni that basically lowers my qu the geni that basically lowers my qu the geni that basically lowers my qu the quality of the experience and the quality of the experience and the quality of the experience and the utility utility utility of something that actually worked pretty of something that actually worked pretty of something that actually worked pretty freaking okay before having that freaking okay before having that freaking okay before having that dominate the top of the screen that dominate the top of the screen that dominate the top of the screen that freaking pisses me off man anyways I freaking pisses me off man anyways I freaking pisses me off man anyways I gotta drop hey enjoy the rest of your gotta drop hey enjoy the rest of your gotta drop hey enjoy the rest of your discussion I look forward to you know discussion I look forward to you know discussion I look forward to you know listening to it all right see you guys bye welcome to part bye welcome to part two part two part two part two but part two are not uh really two but part two are not uh really two but part two are not uh really interesting right on on the movies interesting right on on the movies interesting right on on the movies history yeah good point like the sequel history yeah good point like the sequel history yeah good point like the sequel to The Big we should be the part three to The Big we should be the part three to The Big we should be the part three part three sometimes are good yeah of part three sometimes are good yeah of part three sometimes are good yeah of course I thought aliens was a good course I thought aliens was a good course I thought aliens was a good sequel to alen yeah or maybe good The sequel to alen yeah or maybe good The sequel to alen yeah or maybe good The Godfather right yeah yeah could happen Godfather right yeah yeah could happen Godfather right yeah yeah could happen so what's going on in so what's going on in so what's going on in Barca yeah I think it's going well Barca yeah I think it's going well Barca yeah I think it's going well already I was last week at the Smart already I was last week at the Smart already I was last week at the Smart City Expo oh cool City Expo oh cool City Expo oh cool yeah yeah it was it was fun to meet uh yeah yeah it was it was fun to meet uh yeah yeah it was it was fun to meet uh some people and yeah and I saw a lot of some people and yeah and I saw a lot of some people and yeah and I saw a lot of AI use cases for for smart cities that's AI use cases for for smart cities that's AI use cases for for smart cities that's interesting I don't know let's see let's interesting I don't know let's see let's interesting I don't know let's see let's see how it evolve or it's yeah or they see how it evolve or it's yeah or they see how it evolve or it's yeah or they kill it at some point but uh yeah and uh kill it at some point but uh yeah and uh kill it at some point but uh yeah and uh looking forward to see what happens at looking forward to see what happens at looking forward to see what happens at mobile War Congress yeah I saw yeah

mobile War Congress yeah I saw yeah mobile War Congress yeah I saw yeah different people we know who went to the different people we know who went to the different people we know who went to the Smart City thing um yeah you I never Smart City thing um yeah you I never Smart City thing um yeah you I never know how things are going with smart know how things are going with smart know how things are going with smart cities if that's still going strong or cities if that's still going strong or cities if that's still going strong or if it's dead or people hoping I don't if it's dead or people hoping I don't if it's dead or people hoping I don't know I don't know maybe here the know I don't know maybe here the know I don't know maybe here the specialist on oh on the on the specialist on oh on the on the specialist on oh on the on the temperature of a smart cities it's B temperature of a smart cities it's B temperature of a smart cities it's B right yeah yeah but uh I don't know I right yeah yeah but uh I don't know I right yeah yeah but uh I don't know I mean it was two halls from mobile mean it was two halls from mobile mean it was two halls from mobile Congress venue but yeah they were half Congress venue but yeah they were half Congress venue but yeah they were half half and not a lot of people I just went half and not a lot of people I just went half and not a lot of people I just went one day and then I organized a Meetup one day and then I organized a Meetup one day and then I organized a Meetup yeah and then yeah it was interesting yeah and then yeah it was interesting yeah and then yeah it was interesting like 30 people show up and Studio was like 30 people show up and Studio was like 30 people show up and Studio was doing a demo of their doing a demo of their doing a demo of their Nvidia system and then it was fun Nvidia system and then it was fun Nvidia system and then it was fun because they are releasing a new a new because they are releasing a new a new because they are releasing a new a new device called Rec camera which is just a device called Rec camera which is just a device called Rec camera which is just a really tiny device which which with a really tiny device which which with a really tiny device which which with a single board computer a single board single board computer a single board single board computer a single board computer based on risk 5 running Linux computer based on risk 5 running Linux computer based on risk 5 running Linux oh oh oh cool so yeah you you can run YOLO V8 on cool so yeah you you can run YOLO V8 on cool so yeah you you can run YOLO V8 on on that device yeah so actually yeah on that device yeah so actually yeah on that device yeah so actually yeah this is what weal like 100 episodes ago this is what weal like 100 episodes ago this is what weal like 100 episodes ago like camera is not a camera anymore like camera is not a camera anymore like camera is not a camera anymore right right right cameras our children right right right cameras our children right right right cameras our children no will not know what is a camera like no will not know what is a camera like no will not know what is a camera like uh they don't know what was a telephone uh they don't know what was a telephone uh they don't know what was a telephone from yeah ago right Everything's changed from yeah ago right Everything's changed from yeah ago right Everything's changed camera's got a lot smarter that's camera's got a lot smarter that's camera's got a lot smarter that's amazing that's cool amazing that's cool amazing that's cool stuff yeah you know what I really loved

stuff yeah you know what I really loved stuff yeah you know what I really loved being involved a little you know in the being involved a little you know in the being involved a little you know in the Smart City thing I thought there was a Smart City thing I thought there was a Smart City thing I thought there was a lot of good ideas a lot of cool things lot of good ideas a lot of cool things lot of good ideas a lot of cool things that could have happened and I don't that could have happened and I don't that could have happened and I don't know I guess a variety of reasons I know know I guess a variety of reasons I know know I guess a variety of reasons I know people talk generically about oh we had people talk generically about oh we had people talk generically about oh we had great ideas and then we had to go work great ideas and then we had to go work great ideas and then we had to go work with city hall or the leaders of the with city hall or the leaders of the with city hall or the leaders of the city and they didn't like IR ideas or it city and they didn't like IR ideas or it city and they didn't like IR ideas or it got caught up in a bureaucracy and got caught up in a bureaucracy and got caught up in a bureaucracy and slowed down um and Al I also would hear slowed down um and Al I also would hear slowed down um and Al I also would hear people like pointing who's got the money people like pointing who's got the money people like pointing who's got the money to build all this stuff you know because to build all this stuff you know because to build all this stuff you know because the city's like oh we don't have any the city's like oh we don't have any the city's like oh we don't have any money are you you know money are you you know money are you you know you it's like that you it's like that you it's like that Spiderman picture exactly look at each Spiderman picture exactly look at each Spiderman picture exactly look at each other who's playing for this it sounds other who's playing for this it sounds other who's playing for this it sounds really really really cool yeah that's a that's a good one no cool yeah that's a that's a good one no cool yeah that's a that's a good one no no absolutely yeah and then yeah now for no absolutely yeah and then yeah now for no absolutely yeah and then yeah now for example in the US you're going to change example in the US you're going to change example in the US you're going to change the government right so probably yeah the government right so probably yeah the government right so probably yeah some of the providers will uh will be some of the providers will uh will be some of the providers will uh will be killed right because uh the party just killed right because uh the party just killed right because uh the party just change change change so that's no that's a good question you so that's no that's a good question you so that's no that's a good question you know I know there a lot of people know I know there a lot of people know I know there a lot of people outside the US who maybe inside the US outside the US who maybe inside the US outside the US who maybe inside the US think that it's a when you have a new think that it's a when you have a new think that it's a when you have a new president that it's there giant change president that it's there giant change president that it's there giant change it might seem like a big change when it might seem like a big change when it might seem like a big change when you're watching it on TV on the news and you're watching it on TV on the news and you're watching it on TV on the news and hearing stuff I think what actually hearing stuff I think what actually hearing stuff I think what actually happens is far less change than people happens is far less change than people happens is far less change than people think people freak out people are like

think people freak out people are like think people freak out people are like oh my God you know it's all you know oh my God you know it's all you know oh my God you know it's all you know okay okay okay so you know day-to-day life doesn't so you know day-to-day life doesn't so you know day-to-day life doesn't change much day today life doesn't change much day today life doesn't change much day today life doesn't change as much and so if we think about change as much and so if we think about change as much and so if we think about smart cities I think the who the mayor smart cities I think the who the mayor smart cities I think the who the mayor of the city is and the city council of the city is and the city council of the city is and the city council probably plays a bigger role uh in probably plays a bigger role uh in probably plays a bigger role uh in making that happen than somebody in a making that happen than somebody in a making that happen than somebody in a distant Capital you know far away distant Capital you know far away distant Capital you know far away um but but I think Lots like lots of um but but I think Lots like lots of um but but I think Lots like lots of things it all still comes down to money things it all still comes down to money things it all still comes down to money um more than anything actually uh which um more than anything actually uh which um more than anything actually uh which is sad and what's the length of uh is sad and what's the length of uh is sad and what's the length of uh government for majors in the US it's government for majors in the US it's government for majors in the US it's like four years or I think it's I think like four years or I think it's I think like four years or I think it's I think it's four years but I think they can and it's four years but I think they can and it's four years but I think they can and you know that's the weird thing you know you know that's the weird thing you know you know that's the weird thing you know as far as term limits how how many times as far as term limits how how many times as far as term limits how how many times can they run um that's good it it depend can they run um that's good it it depend can they run um that's good it it depend you know like the president can only run you know like the president can only run you know like the president can only run twice um okay twice um okay twice um okay there's no limits on Congress or Senate there's no limits on Congress or Senate there's no limits on Congress or Senate I think there should I think there should I think there should be um and then but when you start going be um and then but when you start going be um and then but when you start going down to the state level they all make down to the state level they all make down to the state level they all make their own rules and so you could in some their own rules and so you could in some their own rules and so you could in some states maybe the mayor can run two times states maybe the mayor can run two times states maybe the mayor can run two times maybe eight years total or something in maybe eight years total or something in maybe eight years total or something in other states the mayor could probably be other states the mayor could probably be other states the mayor could probably be there forever whatever some old there forever whatever some old there forever whatever some old guy um so yeah I think it depends on the

guy um so yeah I think it depends on the guy um so yeah I think it depends on the state and the rules they have each yeah state and the rules they have each yeah state and the rules they have each yeah which I guess that's kind of a weird which I guess that's kind of a weird which I guess that's kind of a weird thing about the United States is that thing about the United States is that thing about the United States is that you would have all these different rules you would have all these different rules you would have all these different rules about different state you know um it's about different state you know um it's about different state you know um it's like a yeah the says whatever is not listed as yeah the says whatever is not listed as far as what the federal government is far as what the federal government is far as what the federal government is doing specifically then those powers are doing specifically then those powers are doing specifically then those powers are left to the states and so that has left to the states and so that has left to the states and so that has allowed each state to do all kinds of allowed each state to do all kinds of allowed each state to do all kinds of different things uh which is why some different things uh which is why some different things uh which is why some people might come from Europe Europe and people might come from Europe Europe and people might come from Europe Europe and go wow I drove around America and it go wow I drove around America and it go wow I drove around America and it seemed like a whole bunch of different seemed like a whole bunch of different seemed like a whole bunch of different countries yeah it's it's it's a huge countries yeah it's it's it's a huge countries yeah it's it's it's a huge country it's like you're no we have to country it's like you're no we have to country it's like you're no we have to think of like Europe right uh it's like think of like Europe right uh it's like think of like Europe right uh it's like going to Europe from country to Country going to Europe from country to Country going to Europe from country to Country yeah you're right but with the same yeah you're right but with the same yeah you're right but with the same language basically yeah and sometimes language basically yeah and sometimes language basically yeah and sometimes the states are just as different almost the states are just as different almost the states are just as different almost you know the way you know some states you know the way you know some states you know the way you know some states are very similar and yeah others are are very similar and yeah others are are very similar and yeah others are completely different yeah no doubt about completely different yeah no doubt about completely different yeah no doubt about it that's pretty interesting absolutely it that's pretty interesting absolutely it that's pretty interesting absolutely yeah but but yeah no no I think yeah yeah but but yeah no no I think yeah yeah but but yeah no no I think yeah similar I think yeah here I remember similar I think yeah here I remember similar I think yeah here I remember when when there was this a smart city when when there was this a smart city when when there was this a smart city fber and we change from it was the right fber and we change from it was the right fber and we change from it was the right party and then we changed to left party party and then we changed to left party party and then we changed to left party in Barcelona and then they killed in Barcelona and then they killed in Barcelona and then they killed everything related to Smart cities oh everything related to Smart cities oh everything related to Smart cities oh initiatives yeah and I remember yeah initiatives yeah and I remember yeah initiatives yeah and I remember yeah some companies or organizations that some companies or organizations that some companies or organizations that were more like left but working on these were more like left but working on these were more like left but working on these smart City projects then the left smart City projects then the left smart City projects then the left government was saying no no you were you

government was saying no no you were you government was saying no no you were you were a provider or a lier of the were a provider or a lier of the were a provider or a lier of the previous government so we don't want to previous government so we don't want to previous government so we don't want to have anyone right who collaborated with have anyone right who collaborated with have anyone right who collaborated with the previous government the previous government the previous government so and you know so these people don't so and you know so these people don't so and you know so these people don't think that they're collaborating with think that they're collaborating with think that they're collaborating with the government they're just trying to do the government they're just trying to do the government they're just trying to do good work you know exactly good good good work you know exactly good good good work you know exactly good good work or yeah or a useful project for for work or yeah or a useful project for for work or yeah or a useful project for for the society right yeah ab and maybe they the society right yeah ab and maybe they the society right yeah ab and maybe they they voted right for the left and and they voted right for the left and and they voted right for the left and and then then then they yeah but you're right it's like no they yeah but you're right it's like no they yeah but you're right it's like no matter who you are you have to de deal matter who you are you have to de deal matter who you are you have to de deal with or work with exactly is in power with or work with exactly is in power with or work with exactly is in power even if you don't like them you've got even if you don't like them you've got even if you don't like them you've got to find a way to collaborate and work to find a way to collaborate and work to find a way to collaborate and work together yeah it's interesting you know together yeah it's interesting you know together yeah it's interesting you know what I feel weird smart cities is that I what I feel weird smart cities is that I what I feel weird smart cities is that I spend a bunch of time you'll relate to spend a bunch of time you'll relate to spend a bunch of time you'll relate to this I've got a bunch of code sitting on this I've got a bunch of code sitting on this I've got a bunch of code sitting on a computer that's a digital a smart City a computer that's a digital a smart City a computer that's a digital a smart City digital twin thing that I built oh well digital twin thing that I built oh well digital twin thing that I built oh well you know and it's kind of like the the you know and it's kind of like the the you know and it's kind of like the the Russ doll I don't know it's like you Russ doll I don't know it's like you Russ doll I don't know it's like you know but it's creating digital twins know but it's creating digital twins know but it's creating digital twins it's you it's basically creating groups it's you it's basically creating groups it's you it's basically creating groups within groups but you could think of it within groups but you could think of it within groups but you could think of it was twins it's like create the city was twins it's like create the city was twins it's like create the city create a property a building floors in a create a property a building floors in a create a property a building floors in a building rooms in a floor all that kind building rooms in a floor all that kind building rooms in a floor all that kind of stuff and then you have iot devices of stuff and then you have iot devices of stuff and then you have iot devices inside all those things and you'd have inside all those things and you'd have inside all those things and you'd have all the information about going what's all the information about going what's all the information about going what's going on everywhere and so it's it going on everywhere and so it's it going on everywhere and so it's it wasn't totally finished but I built a wasn't totally finished but I built a wasn't totally finished but I built a bunch of it and so it was like this web

bunch of it and so it was like this web bunch of it and so it was like this web interface and you would drill you could interface and you would drill you could interface and you would drill you could drill drill drill into nice into different areas and so into nice into different areas and so into nice into different areas and so but it's just sitting on a computer now but it's just sitting on a computer now but it's just sitting on a computer now doing nothing so so you don't have this doing nothing so so you don't have this doing nothing so so you don't have this deployed right it's not deplo it's just deployed right it's not deplo it's just deployed right it's not deplo it's just so so talking about deployment in so so talking about deployment in so so talking about deployment in Barcelona actually and and then we go Barcelona actually and and then we go Barcelona actually and and then we go back to your digital marcity digital back to your digital marcity digital back to your digital marcity digital twin but um actually there was a street twin but um actually there was a street twin but um actually there was a street where there were many Pilots running in where there were many Pilots running in where there were many Pilots running in parallel in in one Street in Barcelona parallel in in one Street in Barcelona parallel in in one Street in Barcelona in poano and and in poano and and in poano and and some some month ago I met one one some some month ago I met one one some some month ago I met one one startup one entrepreneur who used to run startup one entrepreneur who used to run startup one entrepreneur who used to run a pilot there and what he told me is a pilot there and what he told me is a pilot there and what he told me is that uh at some point when the that uh at some point when the that uh at some point when the government changed so that so nobody was government changed so that so nobody was government changed so that so nobody was replying emails or anything so they went replying emails or anything so they went replying emails or anything so they went there with a l to collect the hardware there with a l to collect the hardware there with a l to collect the hardware because maybe that Hardware was because maybe that Hardware was because maybe that Hardware was thousands of dollars or yeah so it was thousands of dollars or yeah so it was thousands of dollars or yeah so it was expensive thing so they just collected expensive thing so they just collected expensive thing so they just collected the hardware and went and resell it to the hardware and went and resell it to the hardware and went and resell it to someone to someone else because yeah someone to someone else because yeah someone to someone else because yeah nobody was paying for the pilot was a nobody was paying for the pilot was a nobody was paying for the pilot was a bit uh like you had a lot of different bit uh like you had a lot of different bit uh like you had a lot of different cool pilot projects in Barcelona you cool pilot projects in Barcelona you cool pilot projects in Barcelona you remember that bus station managed by remember that bus station managed by remember that bus station managed by Cisco whatever I don't know that was Cisco whatever I don't know that was Cisco whatever I don't know that was really weird like what Cisco is doing in really weird like what Cisco is doing in really weird like what Cisco is doing in uh no uh no uh no what I know you know as a station yeah what I know you know as a station yeah what I know you know as a station yeah or but didn't you have things like or but didn't you have things like or but didn't you have things like monitoring uh like gases in the air or monitoring uh like gases in the air or monitoring uh like gases in the air or or pollution or yeah around the quality

or pollution or yeah around the quality or pollution or yeah around the quality sensors yeah that was done by fabl sensors yeah that was done by fabl sensors yeah that was done by fabl Barcelona for example they they were Barcelona for example they they were Barcelona for example they they were doing a the smart they call it the smart doing a the smart they call it the smart doing a the smart they call it the smart citizen it was okay so actually it's citizen it was okay so actually it's citizen it was okay so actually it's funny the just some a year before the funny the just some a year before the funny the just some a year before the fber of the Smart City Expo there was a fber of the Smart City Expo there was a fber of the Smart City Expo there was a fever of air quality sensors on fever of air quality sensors on fever of air quality sensors on Kickstarter just one Kickstarter Lune Kickstarter just one Kickstarter Lune Kickstarter just one Kickstarter Lune there were like three four five um air there were like three four five um air there were like three four five um air quality sensors and the funny story is quality sensors and the funny story is quality sensors and the funny story is that in this iot Meetup that I organized that in this iot Meetup that I organized that in this iot Meetup that I organized uh during the Smart City Expo there was uh during the Smart City Expo there was uh during the Smart City Expo there was a guy who was explaining that they were a guy who was explaining that they were a guy who was explaining that they were doing a smart uh air quality sensor for doing a smart uh air quality sensor for doing a smart uh air quality sensor for bikes wow for bikes so like again there bikes wow for bikes so like again there bikes wow for bikes so like again there is still uh typ of projects are still uh is still uh typ of projects are still uh is still uh typ of projects are still uh running there I wonder what the secret running there I wonder what the secret running there I wonder what the secret to having these projects survive to having these projects survive to having these projects survive different governments and Leadership is different governments and Leadership is different governments and Leadership is you know because there ideas that we've you know because there ideas that we've you know because there ideas that we've had for a long time they're not new had for a long time they're not new had for a long time they're not new ideas um and you just like how do how do ideas um and you just like how do how do ideas um and you just like how do how do they survive how do you make it happen they survive how do you make it happen they survive how do you make it happen um yeah and yeah and the problem is that um yeah and yeah and the problem is that um yeah and yeah and the problem is that probably they just reinvent the wheel probably they just reinvent the wheel probably they just reinvent the wheel because no the no the new governments because no the no the new governments because no the no the new governments don't want to don't want to learn about don't want to don't want to learn about don't want to don't want to learn about what happened before so they are just what happened before so they are just what happened before so they are just Reinventing the wheel and rein investing Reinventing the wheel and rein investing Reinventing the wheel and rein investing money that has been already spent right money that has been already spent right money that has been already spent right but it's easy to spend money when it's but it's easy to spend money when it's but it's easy to spend money when it's not yours right so that's true that's not yours right so that's true that's not yours right so that's true that's true you're right you're right oh my true you're right you're right oh my true you're right you're right oh my gosh one of the I hav about the digital gosh one of the I hav about the digital gosh one of the I hav about the digital SC I have been thinking a lot on on SC I have been thinking a lot on on SC I have been thinking a lot on on concept of unified name space that at

concept of unified name space that at concept of unified name space that at the end it's the same that you mentioned the end it's the same that you mentioned the end it's the same that you mentioned right so have like uh yeah all of these right so have like uh yeah all of these right so have like uh yeah all of these um no uh what what it's used on um no uh what what it's used on um no uh what what it's used on Industrial iot how to apply that into Industrial iot how to apply that into Industrial iot how to apply that into any yeah to any use case and still it's any yeah to any use case and still it's any yeah to any use case and still it's a great place maybe to have a unified a great place maybe to have a unified a great place maybe to have a unified namespace concept could be could be you namespace concept could be could be you namespace concept could be could be you know I remember when I first heard about know I remember when I first heard about know I remember when I first heard about unified names what's the guy's name I I unified names what's the guy's name I I unified names what's the guy's name I I had lunch with him in Dallas uh the had lunch with him in Dallas uh the had lunch with him in Dallas uh the guyed the whole thing um anyway it I guyed the whole thing um anyway it I guyed the whole thing um anyway it I don't don't don't remember you're right you're right um remember you're right you're right um remember you're right you're right um I'm I'm losing my mind this morning for I'm I'm losing my mind this morning for I'm I'm losing my mind this morning for some reason yeah me too huh what some reason yeah me too huh what some reason yeah me too huh what happened yeah um uh this is it it what happened yeah um uh this is it it what happened yeah um uh this is it it what is UniFi names I'm watching a video from is UniFi names I'm watching a video from is UniFi names I'm watching a video from W Walker Reynolds Walker Reynolds that's W Walker Reynolds Walker Reynolds that's W Walker Reynolds Walker Reynolds that's right yeah so I had lunch with him in right yeah so I had lunch with him in right yeah so I had lunch with him in Dallas um yeah he's smart guy and he's Dallas um yeah he's smart guy and he's Dallas um yeah he's smart guy and he's but a lot of hands-on experience and so but a lot of hands-on experience and so but a lot of hands-on experience and so he kind of put that together and I he kind of put that together and I he kind of put that together and I remember when he was first describing it remember when he was first describing it remember when he was first describing it it did remind me of similar things we it did remind me of similar things we it did remind me of similar things we were doing with digital twins you know were doing with digital twins you know were doing with digital twins you know yeah he kind of wanted this one place yeah he kind of wanted this one place yeah he kind of wanted this one place where all the data was going and I where all the data was going and I where all the data was going and I remember lots of people would ask him remember lots of people would ask him remember lots of people would ask him and I did too I was like are you talking and I did too I was like are you talking and I did too I was like are you talking about a database where everything comes about a database where everything comes about a database where everything comes and he's like no it's not a database it and he's like no it's not a database it and he's like no it's not a database it it seemed like it was very connected to it seemed like it was very connected to it seemed like it was very connected to mqtt Brokers yeah exactly and it's like mqtt Brokers yeah exactly and it's like mqtt Brokers yeah exactly and it's like topics or something and I'm like exactly topics or something and I'm like exactly topics or something and I'm like exactly it's a broker so you want to do a it's a broker so you want to do a it's a broker so you want to do a digital twin of not related all the

digital twin of not related all the digital twin of not related all the buildings or or whatever you just buildings or or whatever you just buildings or or whatever you just subscribe to the topics of the buildings subscribe to the topics of the buildings subscribe to the topics of the buildings and you just get that data into your and you just get that data into your and you just get that data into your system and create your digital twins for system and create your digital twins for system and create your digital twins for the buildings so this is the only thing the buildings so this is the only thing the buildings so this is the only thing you need to do so that's I think it's a you need to do so that's I think it's a you need to do so that's I think it's a super smart uh concept no it is it is so super smart uh concept no it is it is so super smart uh concept no it is it is so you subscribe to topics and then you you subscribe to topics and then you you subscribe to topics and then you pull that data um you know I it doesn't pull that data um you know I it doesn't pull that data um you know I it doesn't seem that radical of change from what seem that radical of change from what seem that radical of change from what other systems have done other systems other systems have done other systems other systems have done other systems have had a different way of pulling the have had a different way of pulling the have had a different way of pulling the same data from a different location like same data from a different location like same data from a different location like you know you could build the whole thing you know you could build the whole thing you know you could build the whole thing just using rest apis and a database and just using rest apis and a database and just using rest apis and a database and still find a way to do it um yeah but still find a way to do it um yeah but still find a way to do it um yeah but the problem is that that collecting uh the problem is that that collecting uh the problem is that that collecting uh multiple data sets on one unique multiple data sets on one unique multiple data sets on one unique database it's it's hard right so what database it's it's hard right so what database it's it's hard right so what it's so basically unified namespace you it's so basically unified namespace you it's so basically unified namespace you have to think it as a picture have to think it as a picture have to think it as a picture like a picture now now now no you have like a picture now now now no you have like a picture now now now no you have pictures of the moment that it's not pictures of the moment that it's not pictures of the moment that it's not stored so but you can do whatever you stored so but you can do whatever you stored so but you can do whatever you want with that data so you just need to want with that data so you just need to want with that data so you just need to subscribe to the set of data that you subscribe to the set of data that you subscribe to the set of data that you want right and then store it and then want right and then store it and then want right and then store it and then know uh build your uh business Logics on know uh build your uh business Logics on know uh build your uh business Logics on on the data that you want yeah um but on the data that you want yeah um but on the data that you want yeah um but just it's it's just something super just it's it's just something super just it's it's just something super generic um and then you have to think generic um and then you have to think generic um and then you have to think about this rest API so depending on the about this rest API so depending on the about this rest API so depending on the mqtt broker that you want to use yeah mqtt broker that you want to use yeah mqtt broker that you want to use yeah there are rest AP you can use rest apis

there are rest AP you can use rest apis there are rest AP you can use rest apis if you want but I think it's um yeah if if you want but I think it's um yeah if if you want but I think it's um yeah if you have a system on your business on you have a system on your business on you have a system on your business on your your your application with an mqtt endpoint that application with an mqtt endpoint that application with an mqtt endpoint that just subscribe and then you just put just subscribe and then you just put just subscribe and then you just put that data on a database or whatever yeah that data on a database or whatever yeah that data on a database or whatever yeah that's enough it's super simple it's that's enough it's super simple it's that's enough it's super simple it's it's super neat yeah no you're right it's super neat yeah no you're right it's super neat yeah no you're right you're right but it definitely seems you're right but it definitely seems you're right but it definitely seems very mqtt focused um just cuz it has very mqtt focused um just cuz it has very mqtt focused um just cuz it has that Pub sub architectural pattern built that Pub sub architectural pattern built that Pub sub architectural pattern built into it um whereas if you were building into it um whereas if you were building into it um whereas if you were building it using another wire protocol like rest it using another wire protocol like rest it using another wire protocol like rest or amqp or something else you would have or amqp or something else you would have or amqp or something else you would have to build that yourself differently to build that yourself differently to build that yourself differently exactly it's like I remember when we did exactly it's like I remember when we did exactly it's like I remember when we did lumata we ended up using to help get to lumata we ended up using to help get to lumata we ended up using to help get to Market faster we used rabid Market faster we used rabid Market faster we used rabid mq is that initial place to dump all the mq is that initial place to dump all the mq is that initial place to dump all the data to cue the data coming in also data to cue the data coming in also data to cue the data coming in also because rabbit had supported mqtt amqp because rabbit had supported mqtt amqp because rabbit had supported mqtt amqp HTP rest I had a bunch of stuff out of HTP rest I had a bunch of stuff out of HTP rest I had a bunch of stuff out of the box and so we're like okay let's use the box and so we're like okay let's use the box and so we're like okay let's use that we don't have to build it no rmq that we don't have to build it no rmq that we don't have to build it no rmq has been super useful yeah yeah and so has been super useful yeah yeah and so has been super useful yeah yeah and so it's like okay whatever protocol and it's like okay whatever protocol and it's like okay whatever protocol and then we'll dump it message CU and then then we'll dump it message CU and then then we'll dump it message CU and then we the thing is the difference I guess we the thing is the difference I guess we the thing is the difference I guess is if you're not doing the whole mqtt is if you're not doing the whole mqtt is if you're not doing the whole mqtt topic and topic and topic and subscription if you're not doing that subscription if you're not doing that subscription if you're not doing that then you've got data comes into some then you've got data comes into some then you've got data comes into some kind of message queue and you've got kind of message queue and you've got kind of message queue and you've got some kind of Damon's worker role pulling

some kind of Damon's worker role pulling some kind of Damon's worker role pulling data out of the queue and sending it to data out of the queue and sending it to data out of the queue and sending it to the right location in the the right location in the the right location in the database um so yeah you can do that but database um so yeah you can do that but database um so yeah you can do that but then yeah you are um cop it to to the then yeah you are um cop it to to the then yeah you are um cop it to to the yeah to the demons or to the workers of yeah to the demons or to the workers of yeah to the demons or to the workers of rabit mq yeah so yeah with the other rabit mq yeah so yeah with the other rabit mq yeah so yeah with the other yeah you are you're just cop yeah to yeah you are you're just cop yeah to yeah you are you're just cop yeah to have M an mqtt client and then from the have M an mqtt client and then from the have M an mqtt client and then from the subscription you do whatever you but subscription you do whatever you but subscription you do whatever you but probably you will H it if there there is probably you will H it if there there is probably you will H it if there there is a lot of data yeah the actually what a lot of data yeah the actually what a lot of data yeah the actually what it's surprising is that the mttd brokers it's surprising is that the mttd brokers it's surprising is that the mttd brokers who are really really scalable and work who are really really scalable and work who are really really scalable and work really well yeah so I I can imagine like really well yeah so I I can imagine like really well yeah so I I can imagine like an entity like a city hall just pushing an entity like a city hall just pushing an entity like a city hall just pushing all the data publishing all the data in all the data publishing all the data in all the data publishing all the data in an mqtt broker and like asking to or or an mqtt broker and like asking to or or an mqtt broker and like asking to or or telling to the citizens or or companies telling to the citizens or or companies telling to the citizens or or companies like data is here so [ __ ] all these open like data is here so [ __ ] all these open like data is here so [ __ ] all these open data concept and everything that sucks data concept and everything that sucks data concept and everything that sucks and not working or it's on PDFs and the and not working or it's on PDFs and the and not working or it's on PDFs and the data is here if you want it just data is here if you want it just data is here if you want it just subscribe yeah so you were deciding and subscribe yeah so you were deciding and subscribe yeah so you were deciding and building the things building the things building the things IO how did that work with your system as IO how did that work with your system as IO how did that work with your system as far as handling all that data coming in far as handling all that data coming in far as handling all that data coming in did you have some kind of power we yeah did you have some kind of power we yeah did you have some kind of power we yeah we were using redis as a q system um we were using redis as a q system um we were using redis as a q system um maybe it's not designed for that and and maybe it's not designed for that and and maybe it's not designed for that and and then uh from Red yeah we were push then uh from Red yeah we were push then uh from Red yeah we were push storing the data on on storing the data on on storing the data on on Cassandra okay basically and yeah we Cassandra okay basically and yeah we Cassandra okay basically and yeah we were using Cassandra for a Time serious were using Cassandra for a Time serious were using Cassandra for a Time serious database yeah but basically as a q

database yeah but basically as a q database yeah but basically as a q system we were using red yeah I it was a system we were using red yeah I it was a system we were using red yeah I it was a super simple system yeah it would be super simple system yeah it would be super simple system yeah it would be fast because it's in memory I guess fast because it's in memory I guess fast because it's in memory I guess exactly exactly so it was very fast this exactly exactly so it was very fast this exactly exactly so it was very fast this is what we wanted to have like a kind of is what we wanted to have like a kind of is what we wanted to have like a kind of cache or or a queue yeah that was really cache or or a queue yeah that was really cache or or a queue yeah that was really fast and then we could uh do other fast and then we could uh do other fast and then we could uh do other operations between leing Ries and being operations between leing Ries and being operations between leing Ries and being stored in database and Cassandra was stored in database and Cassandra was stored in database and Cassandra was good for fast rights if I remember right good for fast rights if I remember right good for fast rights if I remember right inserts yeah no it was good for for inserts yeah no it was good for for inserts yeah no it was good for for brights and reads the only problem is brights and reads the only problem is brights and reads the only problem is that you needed to take care a lot uh of that you needed to take care a lot uh of that you needed to take care a lot uh of of it so you had to run your uh cleanups of it so you had to run your uh cleanups of it so you had to run your uh cleanups and so you have to do some cleanups uh and so you have to do some cleanups uh and so you have to do some cleanups uh monthly it's kind of a McDonald's ice monthly it's kind of a McDonald's ice monthly it's kind of a McDonald's ice cream machine right so if it works it cream machine right so if it works it cream machine right so if it works it works really works really works really well and and you need to do your uh yeah well and and you need to do your uh yeah well and and you need to do your uh yeah all your work and and it works um but all your work and and it works um but all your work and and it works um but wow you had uh yeah you had to had like wow you had uh yeah you had to had like wow you had uh yeah you had to had like an expert on that to to do the an expert on that to to do the an expert on that to to do the maintenance and everything do you ever maintenance and everything do you ever maintenance and everything do you ever think back to those times and think what think back to those times and think what think back to those times and think what if if you would have made a different if if you would have made a different if if you would have made a different choice or do something differently a choice or do something differently a choice or do something differently a different database or different different database or different different database or different whatever maybe no maybe not uh not whatever maybe no maybe not uh not whatever maybe no maybe not uh not database we were very it was scaling database we were very it was scaling database we were very it was scaling well yeah maybe what what I was not well yeah maybe what what I was not well yeah maybe what what I was not super happy is that um and even at that

super happy is that um and even at that super happy is that um and even at that moment it's we didn't support the moment it's we didn't support the moment it's we didn't support the standard standard standard mqtt right um yeah uh protocol so that mqtt right um yeah uh protocol so that mqtt right um yeah uh protocol so that was a bit of me I would have changed was a bit of me I would have changed was a bit of me I would have changed that now yeah but um yeah true but yeah that now yeah but um yeah true but yeah that now yeah but um yeah true but yeah the other things were working well we the other things were working well we the other things were working well we were supporting yeah I don't know Co-op were supporting yeah I don't know Co-op were supporting yeah I don't know Co-op m ktt not the standard solution m ktt not the standard solution m ktt not the standard solution rest apis web sockets I mean the problem rest apis web sockets I mean the problem rest apis web sockets I mean the problem was not the technology right it was the was not the technology right it was the was not the technology right it was the the the market is still not then you the the market is still not then you the the market is still not then you have like your customers do you have have like your customers do you have have like your customers do you have like utilities or or I'm trying to remember who your or I'm trying to remember who your customers were in AR we had uh many customers were in AR we had uh many customers were in AR we had uh many different verticals actually yeah we had different verticals actually yeah we had different verticals actually yeah we had yeah we we did Pilots everywhere yeah we we did Pilots everywhere yeah we we did Pilots everywhere actually yeah but yeah we had few big actually yeah but yeah we had few big actually yeah but yeah we had few big customers from solar customers from solar customers from solar panels uh companies we were tracking panels uh companies we were tracking panels uh companies we were tracking hundreds of thousands of solar panels I hundreds of thousands of solar panels I hundreds of thousands of solar panels I remember that they were doing in remember that they were doing in remember that they were doing in 201 14 they were doing predictive 201 14 they were doing predictive 201 14 they were doing predictive maintenance on solar panels wow so 10 maintenance on solar panels wow so 10 maintenance on solar panels wow so 10 years ago that's cool yeah that that was years ago that's cool yeah that that was years ago that's cool yeah that that was like probably well maybe not was the like probably well maybe not was the like probably well maybe not was the first time but the first time I saw first time but the first time I saw first time but the first time I saw companies doing productive maintenance companies doing productive maintenance companies doing productive maintenance uh really uh really uh really they had they they were having problems they had they they were having problems they had they they were having problems so this company was deploying solar so this company was deploying solar so this company was deploying solar Parks solar panels all around the

Parks solar panels all around the Parks solar panels all around the worldall and they had problems when the worldall and they had problems when the worldall and they had problems when the park stopped working okay and and what park stopped working okay and and what park stopped working okay and and what they were explaining me is that they they were explaining me is that they they were explaining me is that they needed to travel so for example no in needed to travel so for example no in needed to travel so for example no in Chile no if you want to if you have a Chile no if you want to if you have a Chile no if you want to if you have a park in in a desert in Chile in the park in in a desert in Chile in the park in in a desert in Chile in the South South South America uh yeah maybe it's a three-day America uh yeah maybe it's a three-day America uh yeah maybe it's a three-day trip to get there yeah but the problem trip to get there yeah but the problem trip to get there yeah but the problem is not that is that if you want to go is not that is that if you want to go is not that is that if you want to go there for work to repair something you there for work to repair something you there for work to repair something you need a work permit and that last maybe need a work permit and that last maybe need a work permit and that last maybe one or two weeks more oh wow so it's not one or two weeks more oh wow so it's not one or two weeks more oh wow so it's not like okay this is not working I'm GNA like okay this is not working I'm GNA like okay this is not working I'm GNA take the next flight and go there and take the next flight and go there and take the next flight and go there and repair oh wait you do that that's repair oh wait you do that that's repair oh wait you do that that's interesting no it's yeah that's um yeah interesting no it's yeah that's um yeah interesting no it's yeah that's um yeah I didn't know that so they wanted to I didn't know that so they wanted to I didn't know that so they wanted to predict like okay how how many days do predict like okay how how many days do predict like okay how how many days do we need two weeks okay so we need to we need two weeks okay so we need to we need two weeks okay so we need to predict two weeks in advance that this predict two weeks in advance that this predict two weeks in advance that this is going to have a problem so we can is going to have a problem so we can is going to have a problem so we can send someone to repair it before that send someone to repair it before that send someone to repair it before that happen yeah so it's not just no but for happen yeah so it's not just no but for happen yeah so it's not just no but for technology it's for a human bureaucracy technology it's for a human bureaucracy technology it's for a human bureaucracy sometimes you need to that's right I sometimes you need to that's right I sometimes you need to that's right I think a lot of people didn't think about think a lot of people didn't think about think a lot of people didn't think about that part they were just thinking about that part they were just thinking about that part they were just thinking about and sensors and not exactly no it's like and sensors and not exactly no it's like and sensors and not exactly no it's like okay what machine do I need or no no okay what machine do I need or no no okay what machine do I need or no no well you need a work permit to go there well you need a work permit to go there well you need a work permit to go there to fix this right right oh my God that's to fix this right right oh my God that's to fix this right right oh my God that's pretty cool that's interesting yeah and pretty cool that's interesting yeah and pretty cool that's interesting yeah and in lumada would you change anything in in lumada would you change anything in in lumada would you change anything in the stack or the stack or the stack or um you know I thought it was more um you know I thought it was more um you know I thought it was more complicated than it needed to be in some complicated than it needed to be in some complicated than it needed to be in some ways ways ways um I we built it in Java I would change

um I we built it in Java I would change um I we built it in Java I would change that and the reason that and the reason that and the reason was so we were it was the early days of was so we were it was the early days of was so we were it was the early days of microservices were hot and Docker was microservices were hot and Docker was microservices were hot and Docker was new and we're going to use Docker and new and we're going to use Docker and new and we're going to use Docker and there was that whole remember they would there was that whole remember they would there was that whole remember they would say well hey if you're using all your say well hey if you're using all your say well hey if you're using all your services in Docker each one could be services in Docker each one could be services in Docker each one could be written in a different programming written in a different programming written in a different programming language it doesn't matter matter and so language it doesn't matter matter and so language it doesn't matter matter and so in the early days of building lamada all in the early days of building lamada all in the early days of building lamada all the developers I think we had five the developers I think we had five the developers I think we had five different programming languages were different programming languages were different programming languages were being used in building Lada and I being used in building Lada and I being used in building Lada and I remember having a meeting with everybody remember having a meeting with everybody remember having a meeting with everybody I was like stop stop stop I need you to I was like stop stop stop I need you to I was like stop stop stop I need you to pick one language I go I this is going pick one language I go I this is going pick one language I go I this is going to get so complicated to get so complicated to get so complicated already more complicated by using already more complicated by using already more complicated by using different languages and so I said I different languages and so I said I different languages and so I said I don't care which one you pick just pick don't care which one you pick just pick don't care which one you pick just pick one and so they all got together and one and so they all got together and one and so they all got together and decided to go with Java the problem of decided to go with Java the problem of decided to go with Java the problem of that at the time frame was Java wasn't that at the time frame was Java wasn't that at the time frame was Java wasn't optimized to run very well inside of optimized to run very well inside of optimized to run very well inside of Docker containers oh W orchestration Docker containers oh W orchestration Docker containers oh W orchestration because Java was using too much memory because Java was using too much memory because Java was using too much memory too many resources and as a result we too many resources and as a result we too many resources and as a result we had to use larger VMS in Amazon to run had to use larger VMS in Amazon to run had to use larger VMS in Amazon to run lumata than we should have and it was lumata than we should have and it was lumata than we should have and it was because the Java the jvm was not because the Java the jvm was not because the Java the jvm was not optimized for containers and so it it optimized for containers and so it it optimized for containers and so it it was bloated you know we should have used was bloated you know we should have used was bloated you know we should have used something like go or some other really something like go or some other really something like go or some other really lean fast small language you know in lean fast small language you know in lean fast small language you know in framework instead so definitely would

framework instead so definitely would framework instead so definitely would change that um yeah I think we were we change that um yeah I think we were we change that um yeah I think we were we were okay with no JS at that moment so were okay with no JS at that moment so were okay with no JS at that moment so we a good decision there yeah that's we a good decision there yeah that's we a good decision there yeah that's what losant used they Ed no. JS too um what losant used they Ed no. JS too um what losant used they Ed no. JS too um the uh I remember thinking also we used the uh I remember thinking also we used the uh I remember thinking also we used Cassandra and Cassandra and Cassandra and Maria Maria Maria DB so I and I thought that was weird I DB so I and I thought that was weird I DB so I and I thought that was weird I was like why are we using two was like why are we using two was like why are we using two databases and so the relational database databases and so the relational database databases and so the relational database had all that metadata and all the kind had all that metadata and all the kind had all that metadata and all the kind of users groups that stuff we use mongod of users groups that stuff we use mongod of users groups that stuff we use mongod for that yeah yeah candre was just for for that yeah yeah candre was just for for that yeah yeah candre was just for the actual data coming in there and the actual data coming in there and the actual data coming in there and so I'd wish that there was a simpler way so I'd wish that there was a simpler way so I'd wish that there was a simpler way to do that just find one database to try to do that just find one database to try to do that just find one database to try to make it lighter weight uh than having to make it lighter weight uh than having to make it lighter weight uh than having too running understand the thinking that too running understand the thinking that too running understand the thinking that was the initial date as well of nosql was the initial date as well of nosql was the initial date as well of nosql right so yeah so so there were too many right so yeah so so there were too many right so yeah so so there were too many databases um and each one was for a databases um and each one was for a databases um and each one was for a specific use case that's right so yeah specific use case that's right so yeah specific use case that's right so yeah yeah this is yeah we were using mongodb yeah this is yeah we were using mongodb yeah this is yeah we were using mongodb for users and events and so on and we for users and events and so on and we for users and events and so on and we were using then Cassandra for for data were using then Cassandra for for data were using then Cassandra for for data which you're right over time a lot of which you're right over time a lot of which you're right over time a lot of the other like postgress and some others the other like postgress and some others the other like postgress and some others started supporting Jason and all kinds started supporting Jason and all kinds started supporting Jason and all kinds of things it's like I was just always of things it's like I was just always of things it's like I was just always focused on trying to keep it as simple focused on trying to keep it as simple focused on trying to keep it as simple as possible um because it was just as possible um because it was just as possible um because it was just getting really big and heavy you know getting really big and heavy you know getting really big and heavy you know and so that's a problem it was a problem

and so that's a problem it was a problem and so that's a problem it was a problem absolutely um yeah yeah I was absolutely um yeah yeah I was absolutely um yeah yeah I was amazed the developers did a great job of amazed the developers did a great job of amazed the developers did a great job of getting a lot of good features out the getting a lot of good features out the getting a lot of good features out the door quickly though I was I was door quickly though I was I was door quickly though I was I was impressed with that but yeah those are impressed with that but yeah those are impressed with that but yeah those are probably the things I would you know probably the things I would you know probably the things I would you know doing today just use a simple one data doing today just use a simple one data doing today just use a simple one data base if I can you know I don't base if I can you know I don't base if I can you know I don't know also depending on the use case you know also depending on the use case you know also depending on the use case you don't need as much scalability as people don't need as much scalability as people don't need as much scalability as people think you do you know um exactly well it think you do you know um exactly well it think you do you know um exactly well it we we were non transversal platform so we we were non transversal platform so we we were non transversal platform so we had from pictures to to S Fox datas we had from pictures to to S Fox datas we had from pictures to to S Fox datas no we were from some megabytes per no we were from some megabytes per no we were from some megabytes per message to 12 bytes so it yeah so if you message to 12 bytes so it yeah so if you message to 12 bytes so it yeah so if you focus on LP WS no I think one big focus on LP WS no I think one big focus on LP WS no I think one big question I still wrestle with or worry question I still wrestle with or worry question I still wrestle with or worry about is what is the secret to success about is what is the secret to success about is what is the secret to success for these iot platforms you know some for these iot platforms you know some for these iot platforms you know some some most of them have all failed now some most of them have all failed now some most of them have all failed now and and I wonder why they most of them and and I wonder why they most of them and and I wonder why they most of them did the job they worked they did what did the job they worked they did what did the job they worked they did what they said they were going to do and so they said they were going to do and so they said they were going to do and so I'm always wondering why did why did why I'm always wondering why did why did why I'm always wondering why did why did why did some of them really great technology did some of them really great technology did some of them really great technology struggle getting customers or keeping struggle getting customers or keeping struggle getting customers or keeping customers uh were were companies worried customers uh were were companies worried customers uh were were companies worried about not owning that technology about not owning that technology about not owning that technology themselves and having it in house were themselves and having it in house were themselves and having it in house were they worried about having dependencies they worried about having dependencies they worried about having dependencies on other companies I don't know um I'd on other companies I don't know um I'd on other companies I don't know um I'd love to figure it out though so actually

love to figure it out though so actually love to figure it out though so actually if you want to to learn about this you if you want to to learn about this you if you want to to learn about this you need to come to iot Stars mobile need to come to iot Stars mobile need to come to iot Stars mobile Congress where we start having so I'm Congress where we start having so I'm Congress where we start having so I'm going to say something confidential but going to say something confidential but going to say something confidential but we have the first Speaker confirm he's a we have the first Speaker confirm he's a we have the first Speaker confirm he's a successful iot entrepreneur and will successful iot entrepreneur and will successful iot entrepreneur and will talk about what did he talk about what did he talk about what did he learn um during yeah well and still learn um during yeah well and still learn um during yeah well and still doing and and what how companies are doing and and what how companies are doing and and what how companies are failing and he's failing and he's failing and he's succeeding I'm trying to find the notes succeeding I'm trying to find the notes succeeding I'm trying to find the notes of what he of what he of what he said uh but yeah yeah basically he's said uh but yeah yeah basically he's said uh but yeah yeah basically he's like why iot startups fail and why iot like why iot startups fail and why iot like why iot startups fail and why iot startups succeed and he's going to startups succeed and he's going to startups succeed and he's going to explain the recipe that's hopefully I explain the recipe that's hopefully I explain the recipe that's hopefully I will see you on iot Star mobile Congress will see you on iot Star mobile Congress will see you on iot Star mobile Congress I feel like they know who this person is I feel like they know who this person is I feel like they know who this person is and I feel like he lives where you and I feel like he lives where you and I feel like he lives where you live no I think you don't know him I live no I think you don't know him I live no I think you don't know him I don't know him I I don't think so it's don't know him I I don't think so it's don't know him I I don't think so it's not some guy from espia no no no no okay not some guy from espia no no no no okay not some guy from espia no no no no okay I was thinking of somebody I was thinking of somebody I was thinking of somebody else friend of yours um who had an i else friend of yours um who had an i else friend of yours um who had an i company you mean yeah no no no no no no company you mean yeah no no no no no no company you mean yeah no no no no no no he's where he was saying they were fail he's where he was saying they were fail he's where he was saying they were fail and then they had to change their and then they had to change their and then they had to change their business model to kind of be like business model to kind of be like business model to kind of be like Consulting Services we're going to come Consulting Services we're going to come Consulting Services we're going to come help you do the work and he said that help you do the work and he said that help you do the work and he said that made a difference for him yeah no no no made a difference for him yeah no no no made a difference for him yeah no no no it's um no no this no the the company

it's um no no this no the the company it's um no no this no the the company who who confirm who's going to speak who who confirm who's going to speak who who confirm who's going to speak it's called it's called it's called sensus okay so they it's the best asset sensus okay so they it's the best asset sensus okay so they it's the best asset tracker in the market it's a profitable tracker in the market it's a profitable tracker in the market it's a profitable company okay cool and now they are company okay cool and now they are company okay cool and now they are expanding the market so he's he wants to expanding the market so he's he wants to expanding the market so he's he wants to explain why explain why explain why some asset tracker companies failed and some asset tracker companies failed and some asset tracker companies failed and why some others made it that's great and why some others made it that's great and why some others made it that's great and yeah what's what's a secret sauce to to yeah what's what's a secret sauce to to yeah what's what's a secret sauce to to have success so I think it's going to be have success so I think it's going to be have success so I think it's going to be a super interesting that's awesome a super interesting that's awesome a super interesting that's awesome conversation a lot of people want to conversation a lot of people want to conversation a lot of people want to know what the secret sauce is for sure know what the secret sauce is for sure know what the secret sauce is for sure yeah and this guy the CEO and the yeah and this guy the CEO and the yeah and this guy the CEO and the founder is a is a kind of a really cool founder is a is a kind of a really cool founder is a is a kind of a really cool guy a character and I think it's going guy a character and I think it's going guy a character and I think it's going to be super interesting yeah every time to be super interesting yeah every time to be super interesting yeah every time I met him yeah it's it's like I met him yeah it's it's like I met him yeah it's it's like it's his type of people that you learn it's his type of people that you learn it's his type of people that you learn things every time you talk with him so things every time you talk with him so things every time you talk with him so that's awesome do you know yet where that's awesome do you know yet where that's awesome do you know yet where you're going to have the event this year you're going to have the event this year you're going to have the event this year yeah 4th of March 2025 of yeah 4th of March 2025 of yeah 4th of March 2025 of March okay oh okay good cool cool yeah March okay oh okay good cool cool yeah March okay oh okay good cool cool yeah and yeah the only thing that we are and yeah the only thing that we are and yeah the only thing that we are changing is uh Tuesday instead of changing is uh Tuesday instead of changing is uh Tuesday instead of morning uh of Monday sorry said of morning uh of Monday sorry said of morning uh of Monday sorry said of Monday okay yeah Tuesday night okay yeah Monday okay yeah Tuesday night okay yeah Monday okay yeah Tuesday night okay yeah good beer so so actually it's going to good beer so so actually it's going to good beer so so actually it's going to be the 10th anniversary of iot stars you be the 10th anniversary of iot stars you be the 10th anniversary of iot stars you came to the first one yeah 10th came to the first one yeah 10th came to the first one yeah 10th anniversary yeah so actually one thing anniversary yeah so actually one thing anniversary yeah so actually one thing that we are thinking it's like okay so that we are thinking it's like okay so that we are thinking it's like okay so 10 years uh happen right well we missed

10 years uh happen right well we missed 10 years uh happen right well we missed a a a 2020 the c one but uh so what iot 2020 the c one but uh so what iot 2020 the c one but uh so what iot thought leaders and professional think thought leaders and professional think thought leaders and professional think that it's going to happen in the next 10 that it's going to happen in the next 10 that it's going to happen in the next 10 years yeah I like that you should call years yeah I like that you should call years yeah I like that you should call Rudy Rudy yeah we Rudy Rudy yeah we Rudy Rudy yeah we that's a good one yeah actually I had a that's a good one yeah actually I had a that's a good one yeah actually I had a call with him last year yeah call with him last year yeah call with him last year yeah maybe is he yeah I think he's between I maybe is he yeah I think he's between I maybe is he yeah I think he's between I and Belgium okay all right so yeah I and Belgium okay all right so yeah I and Belgium okay all right so yeah I think he's doing a lot of think he's doing a lot of think he's doing a lot of um he was trying to yeah he's creating um he was trying to yeah he's creating um he was trying to yeah he's creating this this this new I don't know how circular it's not new I don't know how circular it's not new I don't know how circular it's not circular economy it's like it's like Ed circular economy it's like it's like Ed circular economy it's like it's like Ed ational he's doing educational courses ational he's doing educational courses ational he's doing educational courses for leaders and entrepreneurs and and for leaders and entrepreneurs and and for leaders and entrepreneurs and and people who people who people who yeah some of the stuff that they were yeah some of the stuff that they were yeah some of the stuff that they were doing the training have you come to the doing the training have you come to the doing the training have you come to the island and spend some time and I don't island and spend some time and I don't island and spend some time and I don't know yeah let me find it's like yeah I know yeah let me find it's like yeah I know yeah let me find it's like yeah I have a yeah that's that's a good point have a yeah that's that's a good point have a yeah that's that's a good point yeah that' be one of the things that I yeah that' be one of the things that I yeah that' be one of the things that I like more from the first St is that we like more from the first St is that we like more from the first St is that we brought a probably I already said this brought a probably I already said this brought a probably I already said this many times here we brought a philosopher many times here we brought a philosopher many times here we brought a philosopher I don't know if you were there I was I don't know if you were there I was I don't know if you were there I was there I'm trying to remember what he there I'm trying to remember what he there I'm trying to remember what he talked about though so he was like talked about though so he was like talked about though so he was like explaining so so we were doing five explaining so so we were doing five explaining so so we were doing five startup pites yeah and then philosopher startup pites yeah and then philosopher startup pites yeah and then philosopher was like explaining how all of the ideas

was like explaining how all of the ideas was like explaining how all of the ideas of the entrepreneurs uh peach were of the entrepreneurs uh peach were of the entrepreneurs uh peach were connected with the classical connected with the classical connected with the classical philosophy I love and how like in the philosophy I love and how like in the philosophy I love and how like in the ancient Greece we no philosophers were ancient Greece we no philosophers were ancient Greece we no philosophers were already thinking on how to solve that already thinking on how to solve that already thinking on how to solve that love it my love it my love it my God the format I mean it feels like God the format I mean it feels like God the format I mean it feels like we've gotten away from doing the startup we've gotten away from doing the startup we've gotten away from doing the startup pitches um and just doing you know those pitches um and just doing you know those pitches um and just doing you know those panel discussions or whatever yeah it's panel discussions or whatever yeah it's panel discussions or whatever yeah it's hard to find iot startups right I it's hard to find iot startups right I it's hard to find iot startups right I it's not like a Hot Topic anymore yeah true not like a Hot Topic anymore yeah true not like a Hot Topic anymore yeah true yeah I don't know do you see in Seattle yeah I don't know do you see in Seattle yeah I don't know do you see in Seattle or in Washington a lot of you're right I or in Washington a lot of you're right I or in Washington a lot of you're right I startups anymore or that was that's what startups anymore or that was that's what startups anymore or that was that's what it was mainly about back then was it was mainly about back then was it was mainly about back then was startups doing pitches and judges and startups doing pitches and judges and startups doing pitches and judges and having a winner and helping them yeah it having a winner and helping them yeah it having a winner and helping them yeah it was connecting like the entrepreneurs uh was connecting like the entrepreneurs uh was connecting like the entrepreneurs uh coming into the iot field with like coming into the iot field with like coming into the iot field with like professionals and thought leaders yeah professionals and thought leaders yeah professionals and thought leaders yeah and I think that was an and I think that was an and I think that was an interesting interesting interesting absolutely yeah it'd be great to find a absolutely yeah it'd be great to find a absolutely yeah it'd be great to find a way to have maybe we call it I don't way to have maybe we call it I don't way to have maybe we call it I don't know some other I don't know you're know some other I don't know you're know some other I don't know you're right I don't want to change it but yet right I don't want to change it but yet right I don't want to change it but yet I but yes it' be great to find way to I but yes it' be great to find way to I but yes it' be great to find way to have entrepreneurs and and at least do have entrepreneurs and and at least do have entrepreneurs and and at least do one you know yeah but it's Yeah It's one you know yeah but it's Yeah It's one you know yeah but it's Yeah It's tricky to find entrepreneurs and tricky to find entrepreneurs and tricky to find entrepreneurs and sometimes now the LA in the last times sometimes now the LA in the last times sometimes now the LA in the last times entrepreneurs that were coming or or entrepreneurs that were coming or or entrepreneurs that were coming or or applying to talk they were like serious

applying to talk they were like serious applying to talk they were like serious a or serious B I remember that in 2021 I a or serious B I remember that in 2021 I a or serious B I remember that in 2021 I think you were there now we had Natalia think you were there now we had Natalia think you were there now we had Natalia right who was like like like the real right who was like like like the real right who was like like like the real startup entrepreneur but then we have startup entrepreneur but then we have startup entrepreneur but then we have like a serious a swis company yeah like a serious a swis company yeah like a serious a swis company yeah Health in the he that was not really an Health in the he that was not really an Health in the he that was not really an iot thing but I don't know yeah right iot thing but I don't know yeah right iot thing but I don't know yeah right you know you know you know yeah people are using data yeah people are using data yeah people are using data though and you know even though people though and you know even though people though and you know even though people are all excited about AI are all excited about AI are all excited about AI now you know this notion of trying to now you know this notion of trying to now you know this notion of trying to find a reason to live for iot you know find a reason to live for iot you know find a reason to live for iot you know AI needs that data to train the models AI needs that data to train the models AI needs that data to train the models you know there might be you know I don't you know there might be you know I don't you know there might be you know I don't know some kind of d you know CU we you know some kind of d you know CU we you know some kind of d you know CU we you could step back you could imagine the could step back you could imagine the could step back you could imagine the technology that we've built and just say technology that we've built and just say technology that we've built and just say well it's not it's not always about well it's not it's not always about well it's not it's not always about about devices it's just a a data stream about devices it's just a a data stream about devices it's just a a data stream pipe that goes somewhere that could be pipe that goes somewhere that could be pipe that goes somewhere that could be used for any kind of analytics or it used for any kind of analytics or it used for any kind of analytics or it could be used to train models I remember could be used to train models I remember could be used to train models I remember when I started having a light bulb come when I started having a light bulb come when I started having a light bulb come on for me that saying digital twins on for me that saying digital twins on for me that saying digital twins could also be an AI an ml model at the could also be an AI an ml model at the could also be an AI an ml model at the same time and the reason I thought that same time and the reason I thought that same time and the reason I thought that was when I started doing you know it was when I started doing you know it was when I started doing you know it took me a long time to understand and took me a long time to understand and took me a long time to understand and figure out how to figure out how to figure out how to do machine learning models but I was do machine learning models but I was do machine learning models but I was like oh wait a second you know when I like oh wait a second you know when I like oh wait a second you know when I would talk about a digital twin of a a would talk about a digital twin of a a would talk about a digital twin of a a pickup truck you know and four tires and pickup truck you know and four tires and pickup truck you know and four tires and an engine and lights and transmission an engine and lights and transmission an engine and lights and transmission and all that stuff and those are and all that stuff and those are and all that stuff and those are properties of the truck of the digital

properties of the truck of the digital properties of the truck of the digital twin and then and then their current twin and then and then their current twin and then and then their current state kind of like we do with iot and state kind of like we do with iot and state kind of like we do with iot and then you send all that data and you then you send all that data and you then you send all that data and you build the digital twin of the truck and build the digital twin of the truck and build the digital twin of the truck and the data comes in and it tells you the the data comes in and it tells you the the data comes in and it tells you the current latest state of the tire current latest state of the tire current latest state of the tire pressure and the engine speed and all pressure and the engine speed and all pressure and the engine speed and all that [ __ ] and then you have the that [ __ ] and then you have the that [ __ ] and then you have the historical state of all that as well and historical state of all that as well and historical state of all that as well and I was like when you're training a I was like when you're training a I was like when you're training a machine learning model to for like machine learning model to for like machine learning model to for like predictive maintenance or to see you predictive maintenance or to see you predictive maintenance or to see you know there's features of the model which know there's features of the model which know there's features of the model which are the same thing as maybe all those are the same thing as maybe all those are the same thing as maybe all those different properties or attributes of different properties or attributes of different properties or attributes of the twin and then there's the label as the twin and then there's the label as the twin and then there's the label as they call it that's the answer you're they call it that's the answer you're they call it that's the answer you're looking for and so if I was saying is looking for and so if I was saying is looking for and so if I was saying is this machine working or not is it this machine working or not is it this machine working or not is it failing or is it working is the label failing or is it working is the label failing or is it working is the label and the features are all the properties and the features are all the properties and the features are all the properties which are and so at some point I was which are and so at some point I was which are and so at some point I was like okay the digital twin is also doing like okay the digital twin is also doing like okay the digital twin is also doing two jobs at once it's also the machine two jobs at once it's also the machine two jobs at once it's also the machine learning model um but it could be data learning model um but it could be data learning model um but it could be data from anywhere you know I'm just trying from anywhere you know I'm just trying from anywhere you know I'm just trying to think out loud where where we could to think out loud where where we could to think out loud where where we could get entrepreneurs who are still get entrepreneurs who are still get entrepreneurs who are still thinking that connected intelligence thinking that connected intelligence thinking that connected intelligence that connected even if they're all that connected even if they're all that connected even if they're all focused on AI some of them have got to focused on AI some of them have got to focused on AI some of them have got to be focused on the data transmission or be focused on the data transmission or be focused on the data transmission or how you do that where it's coming from how you do that where it's coming from how you do that where it's coming from let's make a call right yeah know yeah let's make a call right yeah know yeah let's make a call right yeah know yeah if anyone is watching this yes yes send if anyone is watching this yes yes send if anyone is watching this yes yes send us an email at hello iot stars.com us an email at hello iot stars.com us an email at hello iot stars.com exactly exactly because that would be exactly exactly because that would be exactly exactly because that would be that'd be fun to at least have one group

that'd be fun to at least have one group that'd be fun to at least have one group still doing a still doing a still doing a pitch I would also think I would like pitch I would also think I would like pitch I would also think I would like iot stars to last iot stars to last iot stars to last longer than it the past I don't know I longer than it the past I don't know I longer than it the past I don't know I didn't go to Austin I don't know how didn't go to Austin I don't know how didn't go to Austin I don't know how long it was um that was the classical long it was um that was the classical long it was um that was the classical iot stars that like the last one that iot stars that like the last one that iot stars that like the last one that you attended yeah yeah um I just you attended yeah yeah um I just you attended yeah yeah um I just remember when we did the one at that new remember when we did the one at that new remember when we did the one at that new place near F Grandvilla where we could place near F Grandvilla where we could place near F Grandvilla where we could walk to it yeah it seemed like it was walk to it yeah it seemed like it was walk to it yeah it seemed like it was really short to me even though I know we really short to me even though I know we really short to me even though I know we were there drinking for a while and we were there drinking for a while and we were there drinking for a while and we went upstairs and we did some live went upstairs and we did some live went upstairs and we did some live recordings and stuff like that but as recordings and stuff like that but as recordings and stuff like that but as far as the actual event where you had far as the actual event where you had far as the actual event where you had speakers it just seemed like it was over speakers it just seemed like it was over speakers it just seemed like it was over and people were leaving really soon and and people were leaving really soon and and people were leaving really soon and I was like I wish it was yeah me I don't I was like I wish it was yeah me I don't I was like I wish it was yeah me I don't want it to be so long that people Lo want it to be so long that people Lo want it to be so long that people Lo where you lose the audience or they're where you lose the audience or they're where you lose the audience or they're not they're bored or whatever yeah yeah not they're bored or whatever yeah yeah not they're bored or whatever yeah yeah yeah yeah I know what you mean but a yeah yeah I know what you mean but a yeah yeah I know what you mean but a little bit longer you know if it was one little bit longer you know if it was one little bit longer you know if it was one hour do you mean the talks or or the hour do you mean the talks or or the hour do you mean the talks or or the eban itself M well the overall event eban itself M well the overall event eban itself M well the overall event would get longer but yeah the talks I would get longer but yeah the talks I would get longer but yeah the talks I think I would have more talks you know think I would have more talks you know think I would have more talks you know it see you know maybe have individual it see you know maybe have individual it see you know maybe have individual speakers you know like you you're you're speakers you know like you you're you're speakers you know like you you're you're going to have a good guy who's going to going to have a good guy who's going to going to have a good guy who's going to talk about how to succeed that's great talk about how to succeed that's great talk about how to succeed that's great and then some more panel discussions um and then some more panel discussions um and then some more panel discussions um yeah but also maybe talking about things yeah but also maybe talking about things yeah but also maybe talking about things that people have never heard of before I that people have never heard of before I that people have never heard of before I don't know groundbreaking cool things don't know groundbreaking cool things don't know groundbreaking cool things yeah I write this down things that yeah I write this down things that yeah I write this down things that people never heard before yeah like we

people never heard before yeah like we people never heard before yeah like we could get there live on stage and we could get there live on stage and we could get there live on stage and we could turn make our digital twins from could turn make our digital twins from could turn make our digital twins from iot into machine learning models and iot into machine learning models and iot into machine learning models and show us training them and then doing show us training them and then doing show us training them and then doing predictions I used to not have any idea how to do I used to not have any idea how to do that stuff but the tools the technology that stuff but the tools the technology that stuff but the tools the technology tool tooling has gotten easier to do tool tooling has gotten easier to do tool tooling has gotten easier to do that today in the past it's like I was that today in the past it's like I was that today in the past it's like I was just happy that I could move data just happy that I could move data just happy that I could move data somewhere and get it into a database and somewhere and get it into a database and somewhere and get it into a database and do some basic analytics but the machine do some basic analytics but the machine do some basic analytics but the machine learning stuff it used to be you had learning stuff it used to be you had learning stuff it used to be you had these PhD data scientists to do that these PhD data scientists to do that these PhD data scientists to do that work and it was it was work and it was it was work and it was it was inconsistent in whether it actually inconsistent in whether it actually inconsistent in whether it actually worked or not worked or not worked or not um and so uh but today you know lots of um and so uh but today you know lots of um and so uh but today you know lots of tooling I know me personally I used the tooling I know me personally I used the tooling I know me personally I used the uh ml.net and I saw how easy it was to uh ml.net and I saw how easy it was to uh ml.net and I saw how easy it was to in Visual Studio to point to a data set in Visual Studio to point to a data set in Visual Studio to point to a data set or point to a table in a database and or point to a table in a database and or point to a table in a database and this new thing called this new thing called this new thing called automl where it tries a whole bunch of automl where it tries a whole bunch of automl where it tries a whole bunch of different algorithms and finds the best different algorithms and finds the best different algorithms and finds the best One One One automatically that's that's huge because automatically that's that's huge because automatically that's that's huge because now all of a sudden it makes makes it now all of a sudden it makes makes it now all of a sudden it makes makes it easier for lots of people to do machine easier for lots of people to do machine easier for lots of people to do machine learning on a machine yeah absolutely I learning on a machine yeah absolutely I learning on a machine yeah absolutely I I was uh yeah the media Booth I saw I was uh yeah the media Booth I saw I was uh yeah the media Booth I saw there they have these there they have these there they have these agent agent noes I don't know how they agent agent noes I don't know how they agent agent noes I don't know how they call it or and and basically it's kind call it or and and basically it's kind call it or and and basically it's kind of a not red thing no it's like a like of a not red thing no it's like a like of a not red thing no it's like a like boess and you connect and you say and

boess and you connect and you say and boess and you connect and you say and and it's automatically works that's cool and it's automatically works that's cool and it's automatically works that's cool I think we are going to a no code um no I think we are going to a no code um no I think we are going to a no code um no solution yeah where there are black solution yeah where there are black solution yeah where there are black boxes that do black magic and work yeah boxes that do black magic and work yeah boxes that do black magic and work yeah I think you're right I think you're I think you're right I think you're I think you're right I think you're right absolutely um yeah I think there's right absolutely um yeah I think there's right absolutely um yeah I think there's a lot of cool stuff we could talk a lot of cool stuff we could talk a lot of cool stuff we could talk about AI is a service machine learning about AI is a service machine learning about AI is a service machine learning is a service you know um I mean I was is a service you know um I mean I was is a service you know um I mean I was always blown away this ml.net as soon as always blown away this ml.net as soon as always blown away this ml.net as soon as it figured out then it say here's some it figured out then it say here's some it figured out then it say here's some test stated to make sure it's prediction test stated to make sure it's prediction test stated to make sure it's prediction works the way and you're like oh and works the way and you're like oh and works the way and you're like oh and then the next thing in the Wizard is then the next thing in the Wizard is then the next thing in the Wizard is like create the code to build a rest like create the code to build a rest like create the code to build a rest service and then you just send service and then you just send service and then you just send does inference against the model I'm does inference against the model I'm does inference against the model I'm like that's so like that's so like that's so cool does anybody else know how easy cool does anybody else know how easy cool does anybody else know how easy this has gotten um and yet and and yet this has gotten um and yet and and yet this has gotten um and yet and and yet obviously everybody's excited about obviously everybody's excited about obviously everybody's excited about generative AI these days and that's all generative AI these days and that's all generative AI these days and that's all they're talking about um but that other they're talking about um but that other they're talking about um but that other still yeah or maybe we need to go to the still yeah or maybe we need to go to the still yeah or maybe we need to go to the older things no like we can we can uh older things no like we can we can uh older things no like we can we can uh bring again uino Unos and show cool bring again uino Unos and show cool bring again uino Unos and show cool stuff with them right yeah like no this stuff with them right yeah like no this stuff with them right yeah like no this is not connected so there are only is not connected so there are only is not connected so there are only serial ports and yeah digital serial ports and yeah digital serial ports and yeah digital analog you know sometimes I wonder if if analog you know sometimes I wonder if if analog you know sometimes I wonder if if the secret and maybe your friend knows the secret and maybe your friend knows the secret and maybe your friend knows the secret to success but I always the secret to success but I always the secret to success but I always wonder maybe is it just having is it wonder maybe is it just having is it wonder maybe is it just having is it creating all open source creating all open source creating all open source technology and saying here it technology and saying here it technology and saying here it is and I know lots of people say oh do

is and I know lots of people say oh do is and I know lots of people say oh do the red hat model or whatever but it's the red hat model or whatever but it's the red hat model or whatever but it's like well open source platforms all this like well open source platforms all this like well open source platforms all this stuff if you want us to make some manage stuff if you want us to make some manage stuff if you want us to make some manage it for you and host it for you you can it for you and host it for you you can it for you and host it for you you can pay me to do that but it's really you pay me to do that but it's really you pay me to do that but it's really you get to own a company X YZ whoever you get to own a company X YZ whoever you get to own a company X YZ whoever you are it's your platform if you want to are it's your platform if you want to are it's your platform if you want to run it you can but we make money off of run it you can but we make money off of run it you can but we make money off of Maintenance or hosting it in a cloud for Maintenance or hosting it in a cloud for Maintenance or hosting it in a cloud for you I don't know it's sometimes it's you I don't know it's sometimes it's you I don't know it's sometimes it's just semantics whether it's different or just semantics whether it's different or just semantics whether it's different or not not not but because like like your smart City but because like like your smart City but because like like your smart City conference that you just had smart conference that you just had smart conference that you just had smart cities so many of these things cities so many of these things cities so many of these things the underpinnings of that is still the underpinnings of that is still the underpinnings of that is still iot it just isely yeah a lot of these iot it just isely yeah a lot of these iot it just isely yeah a lot of these cool industry cool industry cool industry 4.0 absolutely requires iot an an 4.0 absolutely requires iot an an 4.0 absolutely requires iot an an ethernet cable or Fiber and yeah yeah ethernet cable or Fiber and yeah yeah ethernet cable or Fiber and yeah yeah absolutely yeah I was seeing some demos absolutely yeah I was seeing some demos absolutely yeah I was seeing some demos and I was like oh look this is what the and I was like oh look this is what the and I was like oh look this is what the Rob was saying ethernet cables and fivr Rob was saying ethernet cables and fivr Rob was saying ethernet cables and fivr all right totally yeah it all needs iot all right totally yeah it all needs iot all right totally yeah it all needs iot and then when we talk about doing all and then when we talk about doing all and then when we talk about doing all the sustainability stuff um you know the sustainability stuff um you know the sustainability stuff um you know climate and tracking and things like climate and tracking and things like climate and tracking and things like that you need iot to do that too you that you need iot to do that too you that you need iot to do that too you know I'm still spending time and doing know I'm still spending time and doing know I'm still spending time and doing conferences with these oil and gas conferences with these oil and gas conferences with these oil and gas people in people in people in Texas saying you need to use iot so you Texas saying you need to use iot so you Texas saying you need to use iot so you know what's going on you know so you can know what's going on you know so you can know what's going on you know so you can manage things methane absolutely methane manage things methane absolutely methane manage things methane absolutely methane CO2 emissions you know how else are you

CO2 emissions you know how else are you CO2 emissions you know how else are you going to know unless some guy drives his going to know unless some guy drives his going to know unless some guy drives his truck and goes there and takes a reading truck and goes there and takes a reading truck and goes there and takes a reading directly and then writes it sit down on directly and then writes it sit down on directly and then writes it sit down on his clipboard yeah clipboard yeah it's absolutely it's um yeah yeah iot it's absolutely it's um yeah yeah iot it's absolutely it's um yeah yeah iot needs to be there and it it will be needs to be there and it it will be needs to be there and it it will be embedded in in the no in the solution embedded in in the no in the solution embedded in in the no in the solution yeah for customers and yeah yeah yeah yeah for customers and yeah yeah yeah yeah for customers and yeah yeah yeah and it's going to be a camera or it's and it's going to be a camera or it's and it's going to be a camera or it's going to be a a tiny sensor or a going to be a a tiny sensor or a going to be a a tiny sensor or a certified sensor but yeah it's G to certified sensor but yeah it's G to certified sensor but yeah it's G to absolutely it's a mast now we're going absolutely it's a mast now we're going absolutely it's a mast now we're going to bring and it's not going to be iot to bring and it's not going to be iot to bring and it's not going to be iot probably but it won't be and you're probably but it won't be and you're probably but it won't be and you're right it like we talk about a lot of right it like we talk about a lot of right it like we talk about a lot of times when technology becomes mature it times when technology becomes mature it times when technology becomes mature it disappears and it just goes into the disappears and it just goes into the disappears and it just goes into the background and it's just something else background and it's just something else background and it's just something else you use and you don't think about it you you use and you don't think about it you you use and you don't think about it you know you know we don't talk about are know you know we don't talk about are know you know we don't talk about are you using Ethernet or token ring or are you using Ethernet or token ring or are you using Ethernet or token ring or are you using you know there's so many you using you know there's so many you using you know there's so many techologies in the early days it's techologies in the early days it's techologies in the early days it's exciting it's interesting and new and exciting it's interesting and new and exciting it's interesting and new and you talk about it and then over time you talk about it and then over time you talk about it and then over time it's just what we use and we don't even it's just what we use and we don't even it's just what we use and we don't even talk about about it anymore um you talk about about it anymore um you talk about about it anymore um you know anyway we're going to find a way know anyway we're going to find a way know anyway we're going to find a way I'm excited about I Stars we got to make I'm excited about I Stars we got to make I'm excited about I Stars we got to make this the best ever I love having year this the best ever I love having year this the best ever I love having year anniversary make it bigger I think if we anniversary make it bigger I think if we anniversary make it bigger I think if we can make it longer but make sure we keep can make it longer but make sure we keep can make it longer but make sure we keep the audience excited not bored falling the audience excited not bored falling the audience excited not bored falling asleep yeah that's tricky because people asleep yeah that's tricky because people asleep yeah that's tricky because people is tired so it's always a fight uh if we

is tired so it's always a fight uh if we is tired so it's always a fight uh if we want to have more talks or less but uh want to have more talks or less but uh want to have more talks or less but uh yeah I don't know it It's tricky because yeah I don't know it It's tricky because yeah I don't know it It's tricky because yeah people sometimes uh like us I yeah people sometimes uh like us I yeah people sometimes uh like us I starts to meet with other people so if starts to meet with other people so if starts to meet with other people so if they get bored or someone needs to go to they get bored or someone needs to go to they get bored or someone needs to go to dinner and I want to talk with you let's dinner and I want to talk with you let's dinner and I want to talk with you let's go outside but then yeah outside there go outside but then yeah outside there go outside but then yeah outside there is the food and then you start eating is the food and then you start eating is the food and then you start eating before anyone else and right yeah that's before anyone else and right yeah that's before anyone else and right yeah that's yet happened like half of the food was yet happened like half of the food was yet happened like half of the food was over because there were like 10 people over because there were like 10 people over because there were like 10 people outside outside outside speak yeah I ocean speak yeah I ocean speak yeah I ocean DJ yeah indeed indeed yeah but he's DJ yeah indeed indeed yeah but he's DJ yeah indeed indeed yeah but he's doing other bands so yeah L is not uh doing other bands so yeah L is not uh doing other bands so yeah L is not uh yeah but you never know not part of iot yeah but you never know not part of iot yeah but you never know not part of iot Stars anymore Stars anymore Stars anymore sadly we might get him we we I think sadly we might get him we we I think sadly we might get him we we I think because I imagine how cool that was you because I imagine how cool that was you because I imagine how cool that was you go into strella dam for what 30 minutes go into strella dam for what 30 minutes go into strella dam for what 30 minutes an hour something people are drinking an hour something people are drinking an hour something people are drinking beer talking DJ that's cool go in do the beer talking DJ that's cool go in do the beer talking DJ that's cool go in do the event maybe make that event an hour and event maybe make that event an hour and event maybe make that event an hour and a half or something I don't know a half or something I don't know a half or something I don't know individual speakers panels see if we can individual speakers panels see if we can individual speakers panels see if we can find find find one group of entrepreneurs maybe um and one group of entrepreneurs maybe um and one group of entrepreneurs maybe um and then maybe after come back up and have then maybe after come back up and have then maybe after come back up and have beer again I don't know or maybe have beer again I don't know or maybe have beer again I don't know or maybe have light food or something you know tap us light food or something you know tap us light food or something you know tap us something like that so that we have a something like that so that we have a something like that so that we have a reason to stay there after instead of reason to stay there after instead of reason to stay there after instead of people just leaving um yeah indeed this

people just leaving um yeah indeed this people just leaving um yeah indeed this is what what we are doing so beers talks is what what we are doing so beers talks is what what we are doing so beers talks and more beers and food yeah and and more beers and food yeah and and more beers and food yeah and actually something that we tested yeah actually something that we tested yeah actually something that we tested yeah you missed that in Austin so we had you missed that in Austin so we had you missed that in Austin so we had Olivia Block doing his iot Show podcast Olivia Block doing his iot Show podcast Olivia Block doing his iot Show podcast cool from iot Star so we are try we are cool from iot Star so we are try we are cool from iot Star so we are try we are gonna try to repeat that and have in uh gonna try to repeat that and have in uh gonna try to repeat that and have in uh in in in Barcelona doing an iot coffee talk Barcelona doing an iot coffee talk Barcelona doing an iot coffee talk yeah between people and that live stream yeah between people and that live stream yeah between people and that live stream from there I remember when we did the from there I remember when we did the from there I remember when we did the coffee talk but it was upstairs at that coffee talk but it was upstairs at that coffee talk but it was upstairs at that other near Fe Grand I remember really W other near Fe Grand I remember really W other near Fe Grand I remember really W it be I really wanted it to I had this it be I really wanted it to I had this it be I really wanted it to I had this in my mind up on in my mind up on in my mind up on stage doing the coffee talk live and stage doing the coffee talk live and stage doing the coffee talk live and broadcasting it live from there in front broadcasting it live from there in front broadcasting it live from there in front of everybody and then maybe that's what of everybody and then maybe that's what of everybody and then maybe that's what Olivier did um but something yeah Olivier did um but something yeah Olivier did um but something yeah exactly he was live streaming and then exactly he was live streaming and then exactly he was live streaming and then he now later he cut the videos and he now later he cut the videos and he now later he cut the videos and everything and he published The Cut uh everything and he published The Cut uh everything and he published The Cut uh videos and but I think it was very good videos and but I think it was very good videos and but I think it was very good he couldn't there be like five six he couldn't there be like five six he couldn't there be like five six people in oh that's cool in one hour people in oh that's cool in one hour people in oh that's cool in one hour yeah and uh and this is what we want to yeah and uh and this is what we want to yeah and uh and this is what we want to do because I think there is a lot of do because I think there is a lot of do because I think there is a lot of value as well on those interviews you value as well on those interviews you value as well on those interviews you can know ol it's it's really good doing can know ol it's it's really good doing can know ol it's it's really good doing the right questions yeah I like that do the right questions yeah I like that do the right questions yeah I like that do the good old Reddit ask me anything AMA I know see yeah yeah absolutely so AMA I know see yeah yeah absolutely so is going to be cool all right I'm

is going to be cool all right I'm is going to be cool all right I'm getting excited it's going to be good getting excited it's going to be good getting excited it's going to be good Che your flights I better get a flight I Che your flights I better get a flight I Che your flights I better get a flight I know I focus on cloud and my new job you know I focus on cloud and my new job you know I focus on cloud and my new job you know and private Cloud but we'll still know and private Cloud but we'll still know and private Cloud but we'll still find probably there is a lot of private find probably there is a lot of private find probably there is a lot of private Cloud at M Congress right all the Cloud at M Congress right all the Cloud at M Congress right all the private Cloud um players are there you private Cloud um players are there you private Cloud um players are there you know what's interesting speaking of know what's interesting speaking of know what's interesting speaking of private cloud and open private cloud and open private cloud and open source it feels do you remember remember source it feels do you remember remember source it feels do you remember remember open stack do you remember that open stack do you remember that open stack do you remember that technology yeah it was open source technology yeah it was open source technology yeah it was open source technology technology technology yeah Linux Foundation or not I don't yeah Linux Foundation or not I don't yeah Linux Foundation or not I don't think so there's this open think so there's this open think so there's this open infra it's like apparently though the infra it's like apparently though the infra it's like apparently though the second or third most active open source second or third most active open source second or third most active open source project in the world though even though project in the world though even though project in the world though even though it's not part of the Linux foundation it's not part of the Linux foundation it's not part of the Linux foundation and I just remember it and I heard about and I just remember it and I heard about and I just remember it and I heard about it again there there was a data center it again there there was a data center it again there there was a data center company called Rackspace and yeah of company called Rackspace and yeah of company called Rackspace and yeah of course they used open stack and open course they used open stack and open course they used open stack and open stack was originally created by and stack was originally created by and stack was originally created by and NASA and in 2010 and then it was being NASA and in 2010 and then it was being NASA and in 2010 and then it was being used initially as an alternative to a used initially as an alternative to a used initially as an alternative to a public cloud like instead of azure or public cloud like instead of azure or public cloud like instead of azure or AWS I'm going to use open stack to build AWS I'm going to use open stack to build AWS I'm going to use open stack to build this cloud in fact HP even tried to go this cloud in fact HP even tried to go this cloud in fact HP even tried to go in the cloud business and use open stack in the cloud business and use open stack in the cloud business and use open stack to do that and it didn't work out some to do that and it didn't work out some to do that and it didn't work out some of the Telecom Telco companies use open of the Telecom Telco companies use open of the Telecom Telco companies use open stack to run their Telecom clouds but stack to run their Telecom clouds but stack to run their Telecom clouds but then you're right it kind of died and

then you're right it kind of died and then you're right it kind of died and you didn't hear anything about anyway it you didn't hear anything about anyway it you didn't hear anything about anyway it feels like like it's making a comeback feels like like it's making a comeback feels like like it's making a comeback I'm hearing a lot more now and people I'm hearing a lot more now and people I'm hearing a lot more now and people because this because of the need for because this because of the need for because this because of the need for private cloud or hybrid Cloud um private cloud or hybrid Cloud um private cloud or hybrid Cloud um industry 40 it's happening in factories industry 40 it's happening in factories industry 40 it's happening in factories and it's got to be local you know um and and it's got to be local you know um and and it's got to be local you know um and so uh and so now all of a sudden I think so uh and so now all of a sudden I think so uh and so now all of a sudden I think it's given open stack got more mature it's given open stack got more mature it's given open stack got more mature over the years it can do VMS it can do over the years it can do VMS it can do over the years it can do VMS it can do kubernetes and manage all that stuff has kubernetes and manage all that stuff has kubernetes and manage all that stuff has a dashboard point and click so uh anyway a dashboard point and click so uh anyway a dashboard point and click so uh anyway I think stuff like that that that I think stuff like that that that I think stuff like that that that there's a tie in the people are wanting there's a tie in the people are wanting there's a tie in the people are wanting to do these IND industry 40 to do these IND industry 40 to do these IND industry 40 things they talk about the edge but things they talk about the edge but things they talk about the edge but maybe they need an easy point and click maybe they need an easy point and click maybe they need an easy point and click private yeah they need something like private yeah they need something like private yeah they need something like that yeah they need uh something that that yeah they need uh something that that yeah they need uh something that can yeah that can help them in private can yeah that can help them in private can yeah that can help them in private cloud in the factories yeah but as well cloud in the factories yeah but as well cloud in the factories yeah but as well um yeah no absolutely yeah and and yeah um yeah no absolutely yeah and and yeah um yeah no absolutely yeah and and yeah keep it simple interesting I didn't I keep it simple interesting I didn't I keep it simple interesting I didn't I didn't follow them but uh looks and and didn't follow them but uh looks and and didn't follow them but uh looks and and are they going to Mobile Congress or or are they going to Mobile Congress or or are they going to Mobile Congress or or you know it's a good question I'll I'll you know it's a good question I'll I'll you know it's a good question I'll I'll reach out and find out I'm gonna I'm GNA reach out and find out I'm gonna I'm GNA reach out and find out I'm gonna I'm GNA write a article an IDC paper on open and write a article an IDC paper on open and write a article an IDC paper on open and POS and position it as hey here's your POS and position it as hey here's your POS and position it as hey here's your open source alternative to build a open source alternative to build a open source alternative to build a private hybrid Cloud you know in private hybrid Cloud you know in private hybrid Cloud you know in addition to you know VMware has their addition to you know VMware has their addition to you know VMware has their Cloud HP has something called Green Lake Cloud HP has something called Green Lake Cloud HP has something called Green Lake all the hyperscalers have on Prim

all the hyperscalers have on Prim all the hyperscalers have on Prim there's azure stacked there's AWS there's azure stacked there's AWS there's azure stacked there's AWS outposts yeah um Oracle has something outposts yeah um Oracle has something outposts yeah um Oracle has something called dedicated region and Linux called dedicated region and Linux called dedicated region and Linux Foundation doesn't have Foundation doesn't have Foundation doesn't have anything I have to check you I'll have anything I have to check you I'll have anything I have to check you I'll have to go look around and see what they got to go look around and see what they got to go look around and see what they got they may have something I don't know but they may have something I don't know but they may have something I don't know but maybe not I don't know either yeah but maybe not I don't know either yeah but maybe not I don't know either yeah but because yeah all this is built on Linux because yeah all this is built on Linux because yeah all this is built on Linux anyway yeah yeah something to look at anyway yeah yeah something to look at anyway yeah yeah something to look at fun fun fun stuff should we say adios to everyone stuff should we say adios to everyone stuff should we say adios to everyone and definitely come to iot stars in and definitely come to iot stars in and definitely come to iot stars in Barcelona I don't have my shirt get some Barcelona I don't have my shirt get some Barcelona I don't have my shirt get some iot coffee talk merch like Mark has come iot coffee talk merch like Mark has come iot coffee talk merch like Mark has come to Mobile World Congress in Barca go to to Mobile World Congress in Barca go to to Mobile World Congress in Barca go to iot Stars support Elevate our kids um iot Stars support Elevate our kids um iot Stars support Elevate our kids um help these kids get the laptops and help these kids get the laptops and help these kids get the laptops and connectivity so that they can go to connectivity so that they can go to connectivity so that they can go to school online in case something weird school online in case something weird school online in case something weird happens like another happens like another happens like another pandemic you never go you just never pandemic you never go you just never pandemic you never go you just never know all right thanks for joining us know all right thanks for joining us know all right thanks for joining us everybody good day everyone bye everybody good day everyone bye everybody good day everyone bye [Music]