IoT Coffee Talk: Episode 316 - "FOFU" (The Fear of F'ing Up in the Era of Distrust)

[music] [music] >> Oh. >> Oh. >> Oh. All right. All right. All right. >> What was that? >> What was that? >> What was that? >> that song? That was pretty good, whatever that was. That was pretty good, whatever that was. >> You don't know Van Halen? You don't know >> You don't know Van Halen? You don't know >> You don't know Van Halen? You don't know what that song is? That's 5150. what that song is? That's 5150. what that song is? That's 5150. >> Oh. Yeah, you know what? >> Oh. Yeah, you know what? >> Oh. Yeah, you know what? >> 5150 time and I cut my finger so I can't >> 5150 time and I cut my finger so I can't >> 5150 time and I cut my finger so I can't play it. play it. play it. >> Oh, no. >> Oh, no. >> Oh, no. >> I had to open up a bottle >> I had to open up a bottle >> I had to open up a bottle of water in Las Vegas. One of these of water in Las Vegas. One of these of water in Las Vegas. One of these fancy fancy bottles. fancy fancy bottles. fancy fancy bottles. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> The metal? >> The metal? >> The metal? >> Really really fancy. I'm like trying to >> Really really fancy. I'm like trying to >> Really really fancy. I'm like trying to twist the thing off and then I just I twist the thing off and then I just I twist the thing off and then I just I realized that I was realized that I was realized that I was cutting my finger in cutting my finger in cutting my finger in >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> You need a workers >> You need a workers >> You need a workers workers comp and workers comp and workers comp and who are you who are you there to see who are you who are you there to see who are you who are you there to see let's see if you can follow workers comp let's see if you can follow workers comp let's see if you can follow workers comp with them. Disco? with them. Disco? with them. Disco? >> Disco, yeah. >> Disco, yeah. >> Disco, yeah. >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> Uh, well, you know. >> Uh, well, you know. >> Uh, well, you know. >> You should be thankful that, you know, >> You should be thankful that, you know, >> You should be thankful that, you know, at least the water bottle was given to at least the water bottle was given to at least the water bottle was given to you uh included in the price of your you uh included in the price of your you uh included in the price of your admission and you didn't have to pay 30 admission and you didn't have to pay 30 admission and you didn't have to pay 30 bucks for like a plastic arrowhead bucks for like a plastic arrowhead bucks for like a plastic arrowhead bottle of water somewhere, you know, bottle of water somewhere, you know, bottle of water somewhere, you know, inside one of the casino hotels.

inside one of the casino hotels. inside one of the casino hotels. >> Well, you know, there >> Well, you know, there >> Well, you know, there the if Las Vegas doesn't know that the if Las Vegas doesn't know that the if Las Vegas doesn't know that they're about to get their ass whooped they're about to get their ass whooped they're about to get their ass whooped >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> because people hate going there now, >> because people hate going there now, >> because people hate going there now, they will find out soon. they will find out soon. they will find out soon. Because yeah, people are getting sick Because yeah, people are getting sick Because yeah, people are getting sick and tired of the price gouging. and tired of the price gouging. and tired of the price gouging. It's It's It's greed. greed. greed. >> As someone As someone who used to go >> As someone As someone who used to go >> As someone As someone who used to go there quite a bit when I lived in SoCal there quite a bit when I lived in SoCal there quite a bit when I lived in SoCal and I have a bunch of friends that are and I have a bunch of friends that are and I have a bunch of friends that are not going and I'm reading all the news. not going and I'm reading all the news. not going and I'm reading all the news. It always It always It always It seems that they no longer care It seems that they no longer care It seems that they no longer care for the masses that will spend couple of for the masses that will spend couple of for the masses that will spend couple of hundred bucks here and there and that hundred bucks here and there and that hundred bucks here and there and that they just care for the handful of folks they just care for the handful of folks they just care for the handful of folks that will spend tens of thousands or that will spend tens of thousands or that will spend tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands, which I I I get hundreds of thousands, which I I I get hundreds of thousands, which I I I get that, but then it's got to look super that, but then it's got to look super that, but then it's got to look super empty because these places Vegas was empty because these places Vegas was empty because these places Vegas was built for the masses. Like if you want built for the masses. Like if you want built for the masses. Like if you want to go to see them, like it's lively, to go to see them, like it's lively, to go to see them, like it's lively, there's people everywhere, there's there's people everywhere, there's there's people everywhere, there's things happening everywhere. If you're things happening everywhere. If you're things happening everywhere. If you're just doing something for the just doing something for the just doing something for the gazillionaires, gazillionaires, gazillionaires, you don't need a place that big.

you don't need a place that big. you don't need a place that big. >> Yeah. And you know what? There Yeah, >> Yeah. And you know what? There Yeah, >> Yeah. And you know what? There Yeah, my driver was telling me on the way my driver was telling me on the way my driver was telling me on the way back, you know, way back to the airport back, you know, way back to the airport back, you know, way back to the airport was telling me, "Yeah, there It was was telling me, "Yeah, there It was was telling me, "Yeah, there It was better when the gangsters were running better when the gangsters were running better when the gangsters were running Vegas." Which I [laughter] thought was a Vegas." Which I [laughter] thought was a Vegas." Which I [laughter] thought was a funny com- comment. That's what you had funny com- comment. That's what you had funny com- comment. That's what you had like the $5, you know, the table like the $5, you know, the table like the $5, you know, the table minimum. minimum. minimum. >> table or what or Yeah. >> table or what or Yeah. >> table or what or Yeah. Absolutely, everywhere you could. Absolutely, everywhere you could. Absolutely, everywhere you could. >> I know the muffins had the same amount >> I know the muffins had the same amount >> I know the muffins had the same amount of blueberries in them. of blueberries in them. of blueberries in them. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Oh, >> Oh, >> Oh, >> There it is. >> There it is. >> There it is. >> Freaking $17 >> Freaking $17 >> Freaking $17 It's just like, man, where where It's just like, man, where where It's just like, man, where where What the hell? I mean, who's going to What the hell? I mean, who's going to What the hell? I mean, who's going to fly all the way over to Vegas in that fly all the way over to Vegas in that fly all the way over to Vegas in that heat heat heat to pay $17 for a freaking latte or now to pay $17 for a freaking latte or now to pay $17 for a freaking latte or now $30 hamburgers? $30 hamburgers? $30 hamburgers? >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> You know, so you're >> You know, so you're >> You know, so you're >> find Vegas >> find Vegas >> find Vegas >> It's self-destructing. >> It's self-destructing. >> It's self-destructing. >> fun. >> fun. >> fun. >> Yeah. It's It's people. >> Yeah. It's It's people. >> Yeah. It's It's people. >> hope you hope that these tech companies >> hope you hope that these tech companies >> hope you hope that these tech companies would stop choosing Vegas. Like, go would stop choosing Vegas. Like, go would stop choosing Vegas. Like, go somewhere else, please. somewhere else, please. somewhere else, please. >> She's choosing Texas.

>> She's choosing Texas. >> She's choosing Texas. >> It's not my favorite place. >> It's not my favorite place. >> It's not my favorite place. >> Uh >> Uh >> Uh and now everyone should just come to San and now everyone should just come to San and now everyone should just come to San Diego. Diego. Diego. >> There you go. >> There you go. >> There you go. >> Everyone loves San Diego, right? >> Everyone loves San Diego, right? >> Everyone loves San Diego, right? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> That's convenient for you, Leonard, not >> That's convenient for you, Leonard, not >> That's convenient for you, Leonard, not for us Texans. for us Texans. for us Texans. >> Well, you know, >> Well, you know, >> Well, you know, uh San Diego got AT&T not too long ago, uh San Diego got AT&T not too long ago, uh San Diego got AT&T not too long ago, and now you guys in Texas, you're and now you guys in Texas, you're and now you guys in Texas, you're getting a lot more Samsung people. They getting a lot more Samsung people. They getting a lot more Samsung people. They shut down some stuff in Jersey. shut down some stuff in Jersey. shut down some stuff in Jersey. >> Yeah. Everything's come back to Plano. >> Yeah. Everything's come back to Plano. >> Yeah. Everything's come back to Plano. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yes. Let's just call it out, folks. >> Yes. Let's just call it out, folks. >> Yes. Let's just call it out, folks. Companies are moving their headquarters Companies are moving their headquarters Companies are moving their headquarters from high-tax states to low-tax states. from high-tax states to low-tax states. from high-tax states to low-tax states. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um I just saw [clears throat] uh >> Um I just saw [clears throat] uh >> Um I just saw [clears throat] uh what's-his-name, Brad, whatever his name what's-his-name, Brad, whatever his name what's-his-name, Brad, whatever his name is. He's president of Microsoft, and he is. He's president of Microsoft, and he is. He's president of Microsoft, and he was doing this deal. It's like it took a was doing this deal. It's like it took a was doing this deal. It's like it took a long time before you could finally get long time before you could finally get long time before you could finally get executives for the company to come out executives for the company to come out executives for the company to come out and say, and say, and say, "Okay, Seattle is now officially, you "Okay, Seattle is now officially, you "Okay, Seattle is now officially, you know, a [ __ ] show, and Washington state know, a [ __ ] show, and Washington state know, a [ __ ] show, and Washington state is now a high-tax state, and it used to is now a high-tax state, and it used to is now a high-tax state, and it used to not be, and that's why we were all here, not be, and that's why we were all here, not be, and that's why we were all here, and now Washington is in the same and now Washington is in the same and now Washington is in the same company as Massachusetts and California, company as Massachusetts and California, company as Massachusetts and California, and how do we operate in a high-tax and how do we operate in a high-tax and how do we operate in a high-tax state, you know, um state, you know, um state, you know, um It's Yeah. Crazy stuff.

It's Yeah. Crazy stuff. It's Yeah. Crazy stuff. >> Then again, you know, we have to >> Then again, you know, we have to >> Then again, you know, we have to remember the history of Texas in tech. remember the history of Texas in tech. remember the history of Texas in tech. I mean, Dell, uh Compaq, I mean, Dell, uh Compaq, I mean, Dell, uh Compaq, >> Texas Instruments, >> Texas Instruments, >> Texas Instruments, >> Texas Instruments. >> Texas Instruments. >> Texas Instruments. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> There's so many companies. >> There's so many companies. >> There's so many companies. >> Uh >> Uh >> Uh >> Yeah, like the first job out of first >> Yeah, like the first job out of first >> Yeah, like the first job out of first job out before I even like graduated, I job out before I even like graduated, I job out before I even like graduated, I I had a I had a I had a um someone from the A&M engineering um someone from the A&M engineering um someone from the A&M engineering school that was my mentor and she worked school that was my mentor and she worked school that was my mentor and she worked um in the telecom corridor and that was um in the telecom corridor and that was um in the telecom corridor and that was that was a big area in Texas and then it that was a big area in Texas and then it that was a big area in Texas and then it kind of disbanded but there was such a kind of disbanded but there was such a kind of disbanded but there was such a hub of hub of hub of >> Nortel >> Nortel >> Nortel >> telecom and tech companies right in that >> telecom and tech companies right in that >> telecom and tech companies right in that area in Richardson and area in Richardson and area in Richardson and >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah, so it was known for that a long >> Yeah, so it was known for that a long >> Yeah, so it was known for that a long time ago. time ago. time ago. >> Telecom, Telco, you know, I mean >> Telecom, Telco, you know, I mean >> Telecom, Telco, you know, I mean >> telecom, yeah, you're right. >> telecom, yeah, you're right. >> telecom, yeah, you're right. >> in the south across the south >> in the south across the south >> in the south across the south >> like Ericsson picked up the pieces for >> like Ericsson picked up the pieces for >> like Ericsson picked up the pieces for pennies on the dollar after they all pennies on the dollar after they all pennies on the dollar after they all collapsed. collapsed. collapsed. >> Yeah. They had places in Massachusetts >> Yeah. They had places in Massachusetts >> Yeah. They had places in Massachusetts too. A lot of um too. A lot of um too. A lot of um communication like NEP uh companies, you communication like NEP uh companies, you communication like NEP uh companies, you know, Cascade Communications. There were know, Cascade Communications. There were know, Cascade Communications. There were like a bunch of companies and then there like a bunch of companies and then there like a bunch of companies and then there there was that great consolidation that there was that great consolidation that there was that great consolidation that happened.

happened. happened. Um but [clears throat] Um but [clears throat] Um but [clears throat] Yeah, but Yeah, but Yeah, but >> And around Boston and Cambridge and >> And around Boston and Cambridge and >> And around Boston and Cambridge and everything where it all started. everything where it all started. everything where it all started. You know, Data General, Wang, You know, Data General, Wang, You know, Data General, Wang, Digital, Digital, Digital, it all started there. it all started there. it all started there. >> This whole thing with um Now, of course, >> This whole thing with um Now, of course, >> This whole thing with um Now, of course, a business is a business. Business a business is a business. Business a business is a business. Business exists to make money and or be holding exists to make money and or be holding exists to make money and or be holding to a shareholder value. Like I I get it. to a shareholder value. Like I I get it. to a shareholder value. Like I I get it. >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> But, you know, >> But, you know, >> But, you know, the days of the of the social contract, the days of the of the social contract, the days of the of the social contract, they're just over because when you have they're just over because when you have they're just over because when you have pick your state, pick your industry. pick your state, pick your industry. pick your state, pick your industry. That's I mean we can stick we can stick That's I mean we can stick we can stick That's I mean we can stick we can stick to state of Washington. to state of Washington. to state of Washington. But, you've had a tech hub there for so But, you've had a tech hub there for so But, you've had a tech hub there for so long that a community has grown around long that a community has grown around long that a community has grown around these employers these employers these employers and people have made generational and people have made generational and people have made generational decisions based on that. Like, "Hey, you decisions based on that. Like, "Hey, you decisions based on that. Like, "Hey, you know, I used to work at this company so know, I used to work at this company so know, I used to work at this company so you should go you should go to you should go you should go to you should go you should go to Washington State University or you want Washington State University or you want Washington State University or you want to stay local because, you know, this is to stay local because, you know, this is to stay local because, you know, this is what's happening in this area." And what's happening in this area." And what's happening in this area." And families would grow and you have families would grow and you have families would grow and you have multi-generational folks inside of multi-generational folks inside of multi-generational folks inside of companies and I know it might sound companies and I know it might sound companies and I know it might sound strange in the context of tech, but you strange in the context of tech, but you strange in the context of tech, but you know, in the Pacific Northwest, you know, in the Pacific Northwest, you know, in the Pacific Northwest, you know, Rob and I, we know a lot of people know, Rob and I, we know a lot of people know, Rob and I, we know a lot of people that are like fifth generation that are like fifth generation that are like fifth generation lumberyard guys, uh farmers, apple lumberyard guys, uh farmers, apple lumberyard guys, uh farmers, apple growers. We can throw Weyerhaeuser, like growers. We can throw Weyerhaeuser, like growers. We can throw Weyerhaeuser, like we all know it the the the family that we all know it the the the family that we all know it the the the family that has worked for that mill or used Well, has worked for that mill or used Well, has worked for that mill or used Well, the mill doesn't exist anymore, but it's

the mill doesn't exist anymore, but it's the mill doesn't exist anymore, but it's it's nuts when they do this and then it's nuts when they do this and then it's nuts when they do this and then they move and of course, they move and of course, they move and of course, you know, it's people are not going to you know, it's people are not going to you know, it's people are not going to pick up and move um from place A to pick up and move um from place A to pick up and move um from place A to place B just like that. And and it's place B just like that. And and it's place B just like that. And and it's [clears throat] and it's it's sad [clears throat] and it's it's sad [clears throat] and it's it's sad because from a cost perspective, where because from a cost perspective, where because from a cost perspective, where you're going to have to you're going to have to you're going to have to hire people, they might not know your hire people, they might not know your hire people, they might not know your company as well, it might take you a bit company as well, it might take you a bit company as well, it might take you a bit of ramp up period. Like, what happens to of ramp up period. Like, what happens to of ramp up period. Like, what happens to all that? But we just get stuck in the all that? But we just get stuck in the all that? But we just get stuck in the let's go to the lower tax state, we're let's go to the lower tax state, we're let's go to the lower tax state, we're going to lose a bunch of people, going to lose a bunch of people, going to lose a bunch of people, but I'm the I'm the I'm the leader but I'm the I'm the I'm the leader but I'm the I'm the I'm the leader taking care of this thing and my taking care of this thing and my taking care of this thing and my short-term incentive is all I'm looking short-term incentive is all I'm looking short-term incentive is all I'm looking for cuz I get a bonus next quarter. for cuz I get a bonus next quarter. for cuz I get a bonus next quarter. >> I remember way back when even, you know, >> I remember way back when even, you know, >> I remember way back when even, you know, when things were great in Washington when things were great in Washington when things were great in Washington state and AT&T was all up in there. state and AT&T was all up in there. state and AT&T was all up in there. >> Oh my god. >> Oh my god. >> Oh my god. >> And I remember I had so many friends who >> And I remember I had so many friends who >> And I remember I had so many friends who worked at AT&T in Redmond and all around worked at AT&T in Redmond and all around worked at AT&T in Redmond and all around there and one day they all got an email there and one day they all got an email there and one day they all got an email that says, "Your job is now in Dallas."

that says, "Your job is now in Dallas." that says, "Your job is now in Dallas." And And And >> know what, Rob? They were in like they >> know what, Rob? They were in like they >> know what, Rob? They were in like they had their headquarters in San Antonio, had their headquarters in San Antonio, had their headquarters in San Antonio, Texas. Texas. Texas. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> For so long, but they had I mean, those >> For so long, but they had I mean, those >> For so long, but they had I mean, those buildings were very I mean, Southwestern buildings were very I mean, Southwestern buildings were very I mean, Southwestern Bell, whatever. It was They was Bell, whatever. It was They was Bell, whatever. It was They was buildings were so old. buildings were so old. buildings were so old. Um but San Antonio is a lot less Um but San Antonio is a lot less Um but San Antonio is a lot less expensive and Dallas just has a had a expensive and Dallas just has a had a expensive and Dallas just has a had a more had a more tech presence than so more had a more tech presence than so more had a more tech presence than so >> business. >> business. >> business. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> you also need you you needed the >> you also need you you needed the >> you also need you you needed the executives flying out of DFW. You cannot executives flying out of DFW. You cannot executives flying out of DFW. You cannot deal with San Antonio Airport if you're deal with San Antonio Airport if you're deal with San Antonio Airport if you're jet-setting across the jet-setting across the jet-setting across the >> You know, >> You know, >> You know, people don't realize that San Antonio is people don't realize that San Antonio is people don't realize that San Antonio is one of the biggest cities in the United one of the biggest cities in the United one of the biggest cities in the United States. States. States. >> It is the fastest growing city. >> It is the fastest growing city. >> It is the fastest growing city. >> If you went to the airport, you would >> If you went to the airport, you would >> If you went to the airport, you would never know it's such a large city. never know it's such a large city. never know it's such a large city. >> Nope. >> Nope. >> Nope. >> And they have >> And they have >> And they have >> terminals. >> terminals. >> terminals. >> It's like a little small town airport. >> It's like a little small town airport. >> It's like a little small town airport. >> And the And the internet will will will >> And the And the internet will will will >> And the And the internet will will will will double-check me if I'm wrong, but will double-check me if I'm wrong, but will double-check me if I'm wrong, but in San Antonio, I think we have one of in San Antonio, I think we have one of in San Antonio, I think we have one of the first venues named after a proud the first venues named after a proud the first venues named after a proud Texan and Latino, Henry B. Gonzalez.

Texan and Latino, Henry B. Gonzalez. Texan and Latino, Henry B. Gonzalez. That I think that was like the first That I think that was like the first That I think that was like the first Latino senator or governor Something Latino senator or governor Something Latino senator or governor Something with a government in Texas. And that's a with a government in Texas. And that's a with a government in Texas. And that's a great convention center. great convention center. great convention center. >> go Spurs go. Go Spurs go. >> go Spurs go. Go Spurs go. >> go Spurs go. Go Spurs go. >> go. >> go. >> go. >> Oh, no. No. No. No. New York all the >> Oh, no. No. No. No. New York all the >> Oh, no. No. No. No. New York all the way, baby. way, baby. way, baby. >> Yes, David's a proud New Yorker, born >> Yes, David's a proud New Yorker, born >> Yes, David's a proud New Yorker, born and bred. Yeah, I told you get it. Yeah. and bred. Yeah, I told you get it. Yeah. and bred. Yeah, I told you get it. Yeah. >> sir. >> sir. >> sir. >> Well, I don't have a Knicks hat. And And >> Well, I don't have a Knicks hat. And And >> Well, I don't have a Knicks hat. And And also, I have The last time I watched a also, I have The last time I watched a also, I have The last time I watched a New York Knicks game, New York Knicks game, New York Knicks game, uh Michael Jordan, Patrick Ewing, John uh Michael Jordan, Patrick Ewing, John uh Michael Jordan, Patrick Ewing, John Starks, and Charles Oakley were playing. Starks, and Charles Oakley were playing. Starks, and Charles Oakley were playing. It It's been a long time, but New York It It's been a long time, but New York It It's been a long time, but New York all the way. all the way. all the way. >> Yes, the last time I saw Patrick Ewing >> Yes, the last time I saw Patrick Ewing >> Yes, the last time I saw Patrick Ewing >> the >> the >> the the 99 1999 the 99 1999 the 99 1999 um Spurs championship game um Spurs championship game um Spurs championship game is the night my husband asked me to is the night my husband asked me to is the night my husband asked me to marry him. marry him. marry him. >> Aw, that's sweet. >> Aw, that's sweet. >> Aw, that's sweet. >> Well, yes. Robinson, Duncan, yeah. >> Well, yes. Robinson, Duncan, yeah. >> Well, yes. Robinson, Duncan, yeah. >> Yeah, man. They had some amazing >> Yeah, man. They had some amazing >> Yeah, man. They had some amazing players. players. players. >> yeah. So, yeah. So >> yeah. So, yeah. So >> yeah. So, yeah. So >> Tim Tock. >> Tim Tock. >> Tim Tock. Yeah. Yeah. You know, the last time I Yeah. Yeah. You know, the last time I Yeah. Yeah. You know, the last time I saw, you know, um your your your boy saw, you know, um your your your boy saw, you know, um your your your boy there back in the '90s at the Knicks, there back in the '90s at the Knicks, there back in the '90s at the Knicks, Hakeem Olajuwon took it to him and it Hakeem Olajuwon took it to him and it Hakeem Olajuwon took it to him and it was payback time from when they were was payback time from when they were was payback time from when they were playing college at Georgetown and playing college at Georgetown and playing college at Georgetown and University of Houston. I slam a jam.

University of Houston. I slam a jam. University of Houston. I slam a jam. >> I would agree. [laughter] >> I would agree. [laughter] >> I would agree. [laughter] He man. That guy was a He man. That guy was a He man. That guy was a >> You know what? People forget People also >> You know what? People forget People also >> You know what? People forget People also forget that Shaq used to be Like he was forget that Shaq used to be Like he was forget that Shaq used to be Like he was born and raised in San Antonio and he born and raised in San Antonio and he born and raised in San Antonio and he played in San Antonio before he left. played in San Antonio before he left. played in San Antonio before he left. So, like he's got an affiliation. But So, like he's got an affiliation. But So, like he's got an affiliation. But they were showing, you know, they got they were showing, you know, they got they were showing, you know, they got all these people in town right now, all these people in town right now, all these people in town right now, right? But what the Knicks game tonight right? But what the Knicks game tonight right? But what the Knicks game tonight is in New York. I mean, that's tonight, is in New York. I mean, that's tonight, is in New York. I mean, that's tonight, right? In New York. right? In New York. right? In New York. >> I think so. I think so. Or they might be >> I think so. I think so. Or they might be >> I think so. I think so. Or they might be doing another one in San Antonio doing another one in San Antonio doing another one in San Antonio tonight. I don't know if they do tonight. I don't know if they do tonight. I don't know if they do >> I thought it was a 2-3-2. >> I thought it was a 2-3-2. >> I thought it was a 2-3-2. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Oh, >> Oh, >> Oh, it is 2-3-2. it is 2-3-2. it is 2-3-2. So, tonight in San Antonio. Yeah. So, tonight in San Antonio. Yeah. So, tonight in San Antonio. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. Yes, I saw Zoolander on the front row Yes, I saw Zoolander on the front row Yes, I saw Zoolander on the front row there. there. there. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> He was courtside. I saw Zoolander >> He was courtside. I saw Zoolander >> He was courtside. I saw Zoolander courtside there in San Antonio. They had courtside there in San Antonio. They had courtside there in San Antonio. They had flew down from New York to flew down from New York to flew down from New York to >> Oh, yeah, I saw that. I saw that. And >> Oh, yeah, I saw that. I saw that. And >> Oh, yeah, I saw that. I saw that. And they showed Charles They showed Charles they showed Charles They showed Charles they showed Charles They showed Charles Barkley Barkley Barkley You know how Charles Barkley is always You know how Charles Barkley is always You know how Charles Barkley is always saying negative things about San saying negative things about San saying negative things about San Antonio? And San Antonio women, like Antonio? And San Antonio women, like Antonio? And San Antonio women, like he's crazy. Well, they showed him like he's crazy. Well, they showed him like he's crazy. Well, they showed him like working out like crazy on the Riverwalk. working out like crazy on the Riverwalk. working out like crazy on the Riverwalk. And I'm just like, "Look at him, you And I'm just like, "Look at him, you And I'm just like, "Look at him, you know, he hates San Antonio, but he's out know, he hates San Antonio, but he's out know, he hates San Antonio, but he's out there working out." And there working out." And there working out." And >> Oh, man.

>> Oh, man. >> Oh, man. Yeah, he's a big guy. And it's such an Yeah, he's a big guy. And it's such an Yeah, he's a big guy. And it's such an underrated city. It like it gets no underrated city. It like it gets no underrated city. It like it gets no love. No one would ever know that it's love. No one would ever know that it's love. No one would ever know that it's What is it? The sixth or seventh largest What is it? The sixth or seventh largest What is it? The sixth or seventh largest city in America now? And city in America now? And city in America now? And >> fastest growing military city, you said. >> fastest growing military city, you said. >> fastest growing military city, you said. >> And the Spurs have won so many >> And the Spurs have won so many >> And the Spurs have won so many championships, but no one ever thinks of championships, but no one ever thinks of championships, but no one ever thinks of the Spurs in the same way they think of the Spurs in the same way they think of the Spurs in the same way they think of the Bulls or any of the other or the the Bulls or any of the other or the the Bulls or any of the other or the Lakers Lakers Lakers >> And Miami seems to get more love. >> And Miami seems to get more love. >> And Miami seems to get more love. >> That's getting more love, and they've >> That's getting more love, and they've >> That's getting more love, and they've done much less. done much less. done much less. You know? You know? You know? And it was the Spurs that opened the And it was the Spurs that opened the And it was the Spurs that opened the door to a lot of those amazing French door to a lot of those amazing French door to a lot of those amazing French basketball players. basketball players. basketball players. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> And they're doing it today. They got the >> And they're doing it today. They got the >> And they're doing it today. They got the alien playing for them. That guy is like alien playing for them. That guy is like alien playing for them. That guy is like >> He's like He's like 19 ft 4 in. >> He's like He's like 19 ft 4 in. >> He's like He's like 19 ft 4 in. >> Wembanyama? >> Wembanyama? >> Wembanyama? >> He wears a >> He wears a >> He wears a Wemby wears a size 20 shoe. Wemby wears a size 20 shoe. Wemby wears a size 20 shoe. >> And he's so skinny. His legs look like >> And he's so skinny. His legs look like >> And he's so skinny. His legs look like they're like when we seen that horrible, they're like when we seen that horrible, they're like when we seen that horrible, horrifying video in the one of the horrifying video in the one of the horrifying video in the one of the basketball game where the guy came down basketball game where the guy came down basketball game where the guy came down and his leg just kind of collapsed.

and his leg just kind of collapsed. and his leg just kind of collapsed. That hurts and stuff. Yeah, I remember That hurts and stuff. Yeah, I remember That hurts and stuff. Yeah, I remember that one. He looks like that's going to that one. He looks like that's going to that one. He looks like that's going to happen to him. happen to him. happen to him. >> He's only 22. He's just a >> He's only 22. He's just a >> He's only 22. He's just a >> He needs >> He needs >> He needs >> to get in the gym and do some leg >> to get in the gym and do some leg >> to get in the gym and do some leg presses and stuff like that to cuz they presses and stuff like that to cuz they presses and stuff like that to cuz they look like twigs. look like twigs. look like twigs. >> The dude doesn't even have to jump to >> The dude doesn't even have to jump to >> The dude doesn't even have to jump to dunk. dunk. dunk. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> He can dunk standing from like 3 ft >> He can dunk standing from like 3 ft >> He can dunk standing from like 3 ft away. away. away. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> It's like ridiculous. >> It's like ridiculous. >> It's like ridiculous. And it only takes him like a step and a And it only takes him like a step and a And it only takes him like a step and a half to go from the free throw line half to go from the free throw line half to go from the free throw line >> Which is so unusual for the NBA. Usually >> Which is so unusual for the NBA. Usually >> Which is so unusual for the NBA. Usually they take four to five steps they take four to five steps they take four to five steps holding the ball. holding the ball. holding the ball. >> I [laughter] >> I [laughter] >> I [laughter] know. Holding the ball while playing. know. Holding the ball while playing. know. Holding the ball while playing. >> And his three points >> And his three points >> And his three points >> They don't have that. >> They don't have that. >> They don't have that. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> His three points are shot from the half >> His three points are shot from the half >> His three points are shot from the half court and they just look normal for him court and they just look normal for him court and they just look normal for him like like like >> That's crazy. >> That's crazy. >> That's crazy. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> That's so crazy. >> That's so crazy. >> That's so crazy. >> The traveling just astonishes me. >> The traveling just astonishes me. >> The traveling just astonishes me. >> Things that are not in the NBA, >> Things that are not in the NBA, >> Things that are not in the NBA, traveling and defense. traveling and defense. traveling and defense. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Oh god. Oh god. Oh god. Oh. Oh. Oh. Yeah, man. Um Yeah, man. Um Yeah, man. Um Congratulations, Stephanie. 21 years at Congratulations, Stephanie. 21 years at Congratulations, Stephanie. 21 years at >> That's great.

>> That's great. >> That's great. >> It's so awesome. >> It's so awesome. >> It's so awesome. >> 21 [laughter] years. I'm finally legal >> 21 [laughter] years. I'm finally legal >> 21 [laughter] years. I'm finally legal to go purchase alcohol and to go purchase alcohol and to go purchase alcohol and >> It's about time. >> It's about time. >> It's about time. >> There you go. >> There you go. >> There you go. >> About time. >> About time. >> About time. I remember us doing interviews like at I remember us doing interviews like at I remember us doing interviews like at the Windows Mobile booth at Mobile World the Windows Mobile booth at Mobile World the Windows Mobile booth at Mobile World Congress, you know, the Microsoft booth Congress, you know, the Microsoft booth Congress, you know, the Microsoft booth and had all the stuff and oh my god, you and had all the stuff and oh my god, you and had all the stuff and oh my god, you know, time flies. know, time flies. know, time flies. >> It used to be like super calm and >> It used to be like super calm and >> It used to be like super calm and remember IoT 6? I used to have all remember IoT 6? I used to have all remember IoT 6? I used to have all >> You're right cuz we kept doing these >> You're right cuz we kept doing these >> You're right cuz we kept doing these Mobile 6. I don't know why it was called Mobile 6. I don't know why it was called Mobile 6. I don't know why it was called that and then that and then that and then >> I'm pretty sure >> I'm pretty sure >> I'm pretty sure pretty sure that's where I first met or pretty sure that's where I first met or pretty sure that's where I first met or uh came in contact with Bill Pugh on the uh came in contact with Bill Pugh on the uh came in contact with Bill Pugh on the city side. city side. city side. >> Oh, yeah. And that's where >> Oh, yeah. And that's where >> Oh, yeah. And that's where Maribel [clears throat] Maribel [clears throat] Maribel [clears throat] Lopez was always part of that group. Lopez was always part of that group. Lopez was always part of that group. >> Yeah, she she was running it for a while >> Yeah, she she was running it for a while >> Yeah, she she was running it for a while and then and then and then >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I stepped in and started running it. >> I stepped in and started running it. >> I stepped in and started running it. They they're still alive today. They do They they're still alive today. They do They they're still alive today. They do the enterprise the enterprise stuff. the enterprise the enterprise stuff. the enterprise the enterprise stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Cuz we did a lot of events with them for >> Cuz we did a lot of events with them for >> Cuz we did a lot of events with them for years with that group and during the years with that group and during the years with that group and during the mobile time, you know.

mobile time, you know. mobile time, you know. >> Yeah, it was fun. It was fun. >> Yeah, it was fun. It was fun. >> Yeah, it was fun. It was fun. >> It was fun. It was fun. Uh >> It was fun. It was fun. Uh >> It was fun. It was fun. Uh >> And you know what? That was also That >> And you know what? That was also That >> And you know what? That was also That was also when budgets for events were was also when budgets for events were was also when budgets for events were like plentiful. like plentiful. like plentiful. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> they were fun, yeah. >> they were fun, yeah. >> they were fun, yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Well, yeah. I >> Well, yeah. I >> Well, yeah. I I I hung out with her. She's cool, you I I hung out with her. She's cool, you I I hung out with her. She's cool, you know. know. know. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> She's the other one who I've known since >> She's the other one who I've known since >> She's the other one who I've known since my Windows mobile days cuz she did a lot my Windows mobile days cuz she did a lot my Windows mobile days cuz she did a lot of them at Microsoft events and that's of them at Microsoft events and that's of them at Microsoft events and that's where we first met was back then was where we first met was back then was where we first met was back then was >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> She was one of the first like fellow >> She was one of the first like fellow >> She was one of the first like fellow female female female analysts that I met. analysts that I met. analysts that I met. >> And I remember talking to her. I was >> And I remember talking to her. I was >> And I remember talking to her. I was like, "Oh, now you're all of a sudden like, "Oh, now you're all of a sudden like, "Oh, now you're all of a sudden you're a IoT analyst." you're a IoT analyst." you're a IoT analyst." You know, I remember she was doing all You know, I remember she was doing all You know, I remember she was doing all the videos for Cisco, uh the Internet of the videos for Cisco, uh the Internet of the videos for Cisco, uh the Internet of Everything. She did a ton of videos for Everything. She did a ton of videos for Everything. She did a ton of videos for Cisco back then. Cisco back then. Cisco back then. >> too. >> too. >> too. >> Yeah, in the early days IoT and she's >> Yeah, in the early days IoT and she's >> Yeah, in the early days IoT and she's like, "Oh, come on, Rob. You know every like, "Oh, come on, Rob. You know every like, "Oh, come on, Rob. You know every good mobile analyst becomes an IoT good mobile analyst becomes an IoT good mobile analyst becomes an IoT analyst." analyst." analyst." >> Oh, yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> It was just It's just like How many >> It was just It's just like How many >> It was just It's just like How many TIMES HAVE WE WATCHED people change TIMES HAVE WE WATCHED people change TIMES HAVE WE WATCHED people change their profiles on LinkedIn or their their profiles on LinkedIn or their their profiles on LinkedIn or their signatures on their email like when the signatures on their email like when the signatures on their email like when the next thing came along? Everybody was next thing came along? Everybody was next thing came along? Everybody was mobile, then all of a sudden they're IoT mobile, then all of a sudden they're IoT mobile, then all of a sudden they're IoT and now they're AI. It's like and now they're AI. It's like and now they're AI. It's like >> I mean, everyone's doing it. Actually, >> I mean, everyone's doing it. Actually, >> I mean, everyone's doing it. Actually, that was one of the running jokes that that was one of the running jokes that that was one of the running jokes that with one of the Cisco executives. Um with one of the Cisco executives. Um with one of the Cisco executives. Um we're looking at each other and it's we're looking at each other and it's we're looking at each other and it's like, "Yeah, like now everyone's in AI like, "Yeah, like now everyone's in AI like, "Yeah, like now everyone's in AI infrastructure."

infrastructure." infrastructure." Um Um Um >> Oh, yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> analysts and >> analysts and >> analysts and and they they don't cover Silicon. They and they they don't cover Silicon. They and they they don't cover Silicon. They don't They don't go up the stack, but don't They don't go up the stack, but don't They don't go up the stack, but all of a sudden they know everything all of a sudden they know everything all of a sudden they know everything There's, you know, they know everything There's, you know, they know everything There's, you know, they know everything about AI infrastructure. about AI infrastructure. about AI infrastructure. Um and so, yeah. It It was It's a little Um and so, yeah. It It was It's a little Um and so, yeah. It It was It's a little bit bit bit Uh I mean But then that being said, Uh I mean But then that being said, Uh I mean But then that being said, everyone is on a learning curve, right? everyone is on a learning curve, right? everyone is on a learning curve, right? So, even uh many of the vendors So, even uh many of the vendors So, even uh many of the vendors >> Wait, you don't have 15 years experience >> Wait, you don't have 15 years experience >> Wait, you don't have 15 years experience in AI? What? in AI? What? in AI? What? >> Oh, I have 28 years of experience as a >> Oh, I have 28 years of experience as a >> Oh, I have 28 years of experience as a forward deployed engineer, dude. What forward deployed engineer, dude. What forward deployed engineer, dude. What are you talking [laughter] about? are you talking [laughter] about? are you talking [laughter] about? >> OKAY. >> OKAY. >> OKAY. >> JEEZ. >> JEEZ. >> JEEZ. THERE ARE BUT THERE ARE SOME LINKEDIN THERE ARE BUT THERE ARE SOME LINKEDIN THERE ARE BUT THERE ARE SOME LINKEDIN profiles that say 8-10 year AI and I'm profiles that say 8-10 year AI and I'm profiles that say 8-10 year AI and I'm like, "Whoa. Wow." like, "Whoa. Wow." like, "Whoa. Wow." >> Oh, everybody's claiming I have 20. >> Oh, everybody's claiming I have 20. >> Oh, everybody's claiming I have 20. >> How many live interviews do you see and >> How many live interviews do you see and >> How many live interviews do you see and they're talking to whoever, some senior they're talking to whoever, some senior they're talking to whoever, some senior person at the company, and they're like, person at the company, and they're like, person at the company, and they're like, "Oh, we've been doing AI for years and "Oh, we've been doing AI for years and "Oh, we've been doing AI for years and now everybody's kind of finally catching now everybody's kind of finally catching now everybody's kind of finally catching up to what we've been doing." I'm like, up to what we've been doing." I'm like, up to what we've been doing." I'm like, "Whatever." "Whatever." "Whatever." >> This is uh >> This is uh >> This is uh I don't know. It is the end of times.

I don't know. It is the end of times. I don't know. It is the end of times. >> [laughter] >> It is the >> It is the Cuz you know, no, no. Here Okay. Hea- Cuz you know, no, no. Here Okay. Hea- Cuz you know, no, no. Here Okay. Hea- Hear my Hear my my current rant. And Hear my Hear my my current rant. And Hear my Hear my my current rant. And let's just put AI to the side. If we let's just put AI to the side. If we let's just put AI to the side. If we just stopped at something like advanced just stopped at something like advanced just stopped at something like advanced analytics or good old machine learning, analytics or good old machine learning, analytics or good old machine learning, just just like that's the limit. just just like that's the limit. just just like that's the limit. Folks would be proud to say and tell Folks would be proud to say and tell Folks would be proud to say and tell you, "Hey, you know, machine learning is you, "Hey, you know, machine learning is you, "Hey, you know, machine learning is not new. not new. not new. We have been doing it for a long time. We have been doing it for a long time. We have been doing it for a long time. It's had different names. You know, It's had different names. You know, It's had different names. You know, there's advanced analytics. There's all there's advanced analytics. There's all there's advanced analytics. There's all these things." And and people would tell these things." And and people would tell these things." And and people would tell you about the fundamentals of the work you about the fundamentals of the work you about the fundamentals of the work that started in the '50s that started in the '50s that started in the '50s >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> to get us to where it is here today. So, >> to get us to where it is here today. So, >> to get us to where it is here today. So, you know, at least you can filter and be you know, at least you can filter and be you know, at least you can filter and be like, "Okay, you know, this person like, "Okay, you know, this person like, "Okay, you know, this person really has the foundational down. Let me really has the foundational down. Let me really has the foundational down. Let me listen. Let me subscribe to that listen. Let me subscribe to that listen. Let me subscribe to that Substack." Or or or maybe the LinkedIn Substack." Or or or maybe the LinkedIn Substack." Or or or maybe the LinkedIn thing is is is okay, but now it's like thing is is is okay, but now it's like thing is is is okay, but now it's like everyone is claiming that they've been everyone is claiming that they've been everyone is claiming that they've been doing AI and AGI and everything else for doing AI and AGI and everything else for doing AI and AGI and everything else for like hundreds of years since the like hundreds of years since the like hundreds of years since the dinosaurs were walking on the land.

dinosaurs were walking on the land. dinosaurs were walking on the land. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And it's nuts and it's everywhere and >> And it's nuts and it's everywhere and >> And it's nuts and it's everywhere and >> It's disgusting. >> It's disgusting. >> It's disgusting. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And it's it's it's terrible cuz >> And it's it's it's terrible cuz >> And it's it's it's terrible cuz sometimes I'm just like, "Okay, let me sometimes I'm just like, "Okay, let me sometimes I'm just like, "Okay, let me look for a new voice to read, you know, look for a new voice to read, you know, look for a new voice to read, you know, someone and it's it's so difficult, it's someone and it's it's so difficult, it's someone and it's it's so difficult, it's so time-consuming, so time-consuming, so time-consuming, it's terrible, terrible time to be in it's terrible, terrible time to be in it's terrible, terrible time to be in >> You know, it is it's a freaking waste of >> You know, it is it's a freaking waste of >> You know, it is it's a freaking waste of time. time. time. Most people have no business in this Most people have no business in this Most people have no business in this stuff anyways. It's like what what most stuff anyways. It's like what what most stuff anyways. It's like what what most people are concerned about gas prices, people are concerned about gas prices, people are concerned about gas prices, you know, how to feed their kids, yeah, you know, how to feed their kids, yeah, you know, how to feed their kids, yeah, how to feed themselves, you know, how to feed themselves, you know, how to feed themselves, you know, education or you know, whatever. They don't they don't care about this AI They don't they don't care about this AI stuff as much as I think a lot of these stuff as much as I think a lot of these stuff as much as I think a lot of these tech bros think that they do or and some tech bros think that they do or and some tech bros think that they do or and some of the vendors that we speak to of the vendors that we speak to of the vendors that we speak to think that they do. think that they do. think that they do. >> I just think I just think you got to >> I just think I just think you got to >> I just think I just think you got to have your your mainstay. Like for me have your your mainstay. Like for me have your your mainstay. Like for me personally, my mainstay has always been personally, my mainstay has always been personally, my mainstay has always been business, enterprise.

business, enterprise. business, enterprise. >> No. >> No. >> No. >> And okay, well, machine learning impacts >> And okay, well, machine learning impacts >> And okay, well, machine learning impacts business, you know, supply chain, business, you know, supply chain, business, you know, supply chain, logistics. And now we got, you know, you logistics. And now we got, you know, you logistics. And now we got, you know, you have IoT, now we have AI. have IoT, now we have AI. have IoT, now we have AI. But for me, I never have ever and I will But for me, I never have ever and I will But for me, I never have ever and I will never claim I'm an AI expert or never claim I'm an AI expert or never claim I'm an AI expert or understand the entire understand the entire understand the entire history and dynamics, but I will tell history and dynamics, but I will tell history and dynamics, but I will tell you what what's happening on the you what what's happening on the you what what's happening on the enterprise side, how it impacts enterprise side, how it impacts enterprise side, how it impacts operations, how it impacts customer operations, how it impacts customer operations, how it impacts customer experience, you know, so I think that if experience, you know, so I think that if experience, you know, so I think that if you stick to your mainstay, then you're you stick to your mainstay, then you're you stick to your mainstay, then you're going to have going to have going to have that reputation will that reputation will that reputation will you know, speak for itself. But it's the you know, speak for itself. But it's the you know, speak for itself. But it's the folks that say, I am now an AI expert folks that say, I am now an AI expert folks that say, I am now an AI expert and they were you know, IoT or mobile and they were you know, IoT or mobile and they were you know, IoT or mobile before, it's like, okay, you are? I'm before, it's like, okay, you are? I'm before, it's like, okay, you are? I'm surprised, right? You know, they just surprised, right? You know, they just surprised, right? You know, they just keep rebranding themselves essentially. keep rebranding themselves essentially. keep rebranding themselves essentially. >> Yeah, but you know what, there is >> Yeah, but you know what, there is >> Yeah, but you know what, there is something to be something to be something to be um um um the the the Yeah, you know, like I said, we're we're Yeah, you know, like I said, we're we're Yeah, you know, like I said, we're we're all everyone's learning and there is an all everyone's learning and there is an all everyone's learning and there is an appetite now to to appetite now to to appetite now to to figure out what are good filters, who figure out what are good filters, who figure out what are good filters, who are the good filters out there. And I I are the good filters out there. And I I are the good filters out there. And I I actually heard a lot of this at Cisco actually heard a lot of this at Cisco actually heard a lot of this at Cisco Live because there's fatigue. It's Live because there's fatigue. It's Live because there's fatigue. It's overload of AI [ __ ] And it's not overload of AI [ __ ] And it's not overload of AI [ __ ] And it's not valuable at the end of the day. And of valuable at the end of the day. And of valuable at the end of the day. And of course, it takes a while for everyone to course, it takes a while for everyone to course, it takes a while for everyone to realize that, right? Because you're realize that, right? Because you're realize that, right? Because you're starting off in most instances without starting off in most instances without starting off in most instances without knowing the domain very well. You hear knowing the domain very well. You hear knowing the domain very well. You hear this fantastic buzzword. Everyone has this fantastic buzzword. Everyone has this fantastic buzzword. Everyone has FOMO

FOMO FOMO about missing out on whatever about missing out on whatever about missing out on whatever opportunity they they perceive people opportunity they they perceive people opportunity they they perceive people are getting excited about, so they're are getting excited about, so they're are getting excited about, so they're trying to jump in, right? But then trying to jump in, right? But then trying to jump in, right? But then there's tons of misinformation out there's tons of misinformation out there's tons of misinformation out there. And so now you have all these there. And so now you have all these there. And so now you have all these false narratives or misguided narratives false narratives or misguided narratives false narratives or misguided narratives trying to shape the public perception of trying to shape the public perception of trying to shape the public perception of sustainability, how sustainable these sustainability, how sustainable these sustainability, how sustainable these data centers are. That's a That's just data centers are. That's a That's just data centers are. That's a That's just one example. one example. one example. >> The sad thing, Leonard, with >> The sad thing, Leonard, with >> The sad thing, Leonard, with >> all the way up to stack all this >> all the way up to stack all this >> all the way up to stack all this misinformation. It's incredible. misinformation. It's incredible. misinformation. It's incredible. >> Well, the sad thing with what you just >> Well, the sad thing with what you just >> Well, the sad thing with what you just said, Leonard, is all said, Leonard, is all said, Leonard, is all >> of what you just said is being fed into >> of what you just said is being fed into >> of what you just said is being fed into AI as golden fact. AI as golden fact. AI as golden fact. >> Yeah, and it's fact, and that's why I I >> Yeah, and it's fact, and that's why I I >> Yeah, and it's fact, and that's why I I tell people I I I I find hashtag facts tell people I I I I find hashtag facts tell people I I I I find hashtag facts very, very unuseful because when you go very, very unuseful because when you go very, very unuseful because when you go and you click on the the references, and you click on the the references, and you click on the the references, it's some freaking Yahoo's Reddit. it's some freaking Yahoo's Reddit. it's some freaking Yahoo's Reddit. And the guy is just like venting. And the guy is just like venting. And the guy is just like venting. >> And then Right. Reddit. >> And then Right. Reddit. >> And then Right. Reddit. >> just talking [ __ ] And so you're going >> just talking [ __ ] And so you're going >> just talking [ __ ] And so you're going to take some dude just venting, talking to take some dude just venting, talking to take some dude just venting, talking [ __ ] as fact?

[ __ ] as fact? [ __ ] as fact? But that's what the That's what Gemini But that's what the That's what Gemini But that's what the That's what Gemini Gemini does. You know, Google confuses. Gemini does. You know, Google confuses. Gemini does. You know, Google confuses. It just takes It just takes It just takes >> You know, you know, you know, Leonard, >> You know, you know, you know, Leonard, >> You know, you know, you know, Leonard, some of the blame some of the blame some of the blame Some Some of the blame Some Some of the blame Some Some of the blame >> Huh? >> Huh? >> Huh? >> Some of the blame Some of the blame has >> Some of the blame Some of the blame has >> Some of the blame Some of the blame has to be put square on the companies that to be put square on the companies that to be put square on the companies that are building the new AI data centers are building the new AI data centers are building the new AI data centers because again, back to my of going to because again, back to my of going to because again, back to my of going to fundamentals, we've had data centers in fundamentals, we've had data centers in fundamentals, we've had data centers in the US for a long time. the US for a long time. the US for a long time. Uh the most of the data centers that Uh the most of the data centers that Uh the most of the data centers that exist exist exist were not made in the era that we are in were not made in the era that we are in were not made in the era that we are in today. That they're not as adequate. today. That they're not as adequate. today. That they're not as adequate. Therefore, we have to build Therefore, we have to build Therefore, we have to build newer data centers. newer data centers. newer data centers. So, just start with that. Hey, you know, So, just start with that. Hey, you know, So, just start with that. Hey, you know, this data center that's been here, this data center that's been here, this data center that's been here, here's the footprint, you know, here are here's the footprint, you know, here are here's the footprint, you know, here are the reports. And then you sprinkle in the reports. And then you sprinkle in the reports. And then you sprinkle in you stick it to the golfers and you tell you stick it to the golfers and you tell you stick it to the golfers and you tell them how much you know, how much water them how much you know, how much water them how much you know, how much water the golf courses around America spend.

the golf courses around America spend. the golf courses around America spend. Then we get into the Would you like Then we get into the Would you like Then we get into the Would you like this this this almonds or pistachios? almonds or pistachios? almonds or pistachios? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> It's pistachios. >> It's pistachios. >> It's pistachios. >> Yeah, I >> Yeah, I >> Yeah, I almonds. almonds. almonds. >> Almonds is a good idea. >> Almonds is a good idea. >> Almonds is a good idea. >> Yeah, I mean the other thing you have to >> Yeah, I mean the other thing you have to >> Yeah, I mean the other thing you have to is go back and retrofit the existing is go back and retrofit the existing is go back and retrofit the existing data centers. I mean there are a bunch data centers. I mean there are a bunch data centers. I mean there are a bunch of technologies at the moment that you of technologies at the moment that you of technologies at the moment that you can use to massively reduce the um the can use to massively reduce the um the can use to massively reduce the um the power draw that's used for the asset power draw that's used for the asset power draw that's used for the asset H-vac systems I've seen. So, that's H-vac systems I've seen. So, that's H-vac systems I've seen. So, that's calibrating how the cooling system calibrating how the cooling system calibrating how the cooling system actually works much more accurately actually works much more accurately actually works much more accurately based on the What I've yet to see is um based on the What I've yet to see is um based on the What I've yet to see is um the water anything that really addresses the water anything that really addresses the water anything that really addresses the water issue. Though indirectly I the water issue. Though indirectly I the water issue. Though indirectly I guess that does. guess that does. guess that does. Um but but when you look at these the Um but but when you look at these the Um but but when you look at these the data centers that are the size of data centers that are the size of data centers that are the size of Manhattan being built Manhattan being built Manhattan being built I I I wonder what the math is behind I I I wonder what the math is behind I I I wonder what the math is behind that. When you look at the energy that. When you look at the energy that. When you look at the energy consumption you look at the water consumption you look at the water consumption you look at the water impact, the impact on the local water impact, the impact on the local water impact, the impact on the local water table, what the knock-on impact of that table, what the knock-on impact of that table, what the knock-on impact of that will be on agriculture, what the I mean will be on agriculture, what the I mean will be on agriculture, what the I mean when you look at the totality of the when you look at the totality of the when you look at the totality of the expense you know, incurred by you know, expense you know, incurred by you know, expense you know, incurred by you know, society versus the just the the the bill society versus the just the the the bill society versus the just the the the bill that the data center operator pays for that the data center operator pays for that the data center operator pays for water and electricity. I mean it's many water and electricity. I mean it's many water and electricity. I mean it's many orders of magnitude greater orders of magnitude greater orders of magnitude greater I would guess. But but I would guess. But but I would guess. But but >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, but then there's >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, but then there's >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, but then there's there's structural limits. You know, there's structural limits. You know, there's structural limits. You know, like all these scaling laws. Everyone like all these scaling laws. Everyone like all these scaling laws. Everyone thinks that you can somehow digitally thinks that you can somehow digitally thinks that you can somehow digitally extend all this stuff. You can't.

extend all this stuff. You can't. extend all this stuff. You can't. There's a thing called physics, right? There's a thing called physics, right? There's a thing called physics, right? There's a thing called thermals, there's There's a thing called thermals, there's There's a thing called thermals, there's a thing called Moore's law. And you a thing called Moore's law. And you a thing called Moore's law. And you know, the all these guys are toying with know, the all these guys are toying with know, the all these guys are toying with these concepts and people's these concepts and people's these concepts and people's misconceptions of foundational concepts misconceptions of foundational concepts misconceptions of foundational concepts to create to create to create another exponential layer of another exponential layer of another exponential layer of misconceptions and it's just piling on misconceptions and it's just piling on misconceptions and it's just piling on as all this AI nonsense becomes as all this AI nonsense becomes as all this AI nonsense becomes codified as as fact in these LLM's, you codified as as fact in these LLM's, you codified as as fact in these LLM's, you know? It's just like freaking And so, know? It's just like freaking And so, know? It's just like freaking And so, you know, one of the things that came you know, one of the things that came you know, one of the things that came out of Cisco Live that everybody was out of Cisco Live that everybody was out of Cisco Live that everybody was pressing, you know, the executives were pressing, you know, the executives were pressing, you know, the executives were pressing this idea of the post-mythos pressing this idea of the post-mythos pressing this idea of the post-mythos era, right? era, right? era, right? Um Um Um it's freaky, man. Um it's freaky, man. Um it's freaky, man. Um I've characterized it as a unintended I've characterized it as a unintended I've characterized it as a unintended consequence of generative AI. Actually, consequence of generative AI. Actually, consequence of generative AI. Actually, everyone everyone everyone watch episodes from watch episodes from watch episodes from 3 years ago. 3 years ago. 3 years ago. We talk about what is happening now We talk about what is happening now We talk about what is happening now where where where these agents are now creating these agents are now creating these agents are now creating the AI is now becoming the weapon for um the AI is now becoming the weapon for um the AI is now becoming the weapon for um um threat actors of all varieties, um threat actors of all varieties, um threat actors of all varieties, whether it's state or it's just some whether it's state or it's just some whether it's state or it's just some dude in his basement um who just lost dude in his basement um who just lost dude in his basement um who just lost his job and is now looking to just steal his job and is now looking to just steal his job and is now looking to just steal [ __ ] because life sucks, right? And now [ __ ] because life sucks, right? And now [ __ ] because life sucks, right? And now they have the tools to go and infiltrate they have the tools to go and infiltrate they have the tools to go and infiltrate an institute massive

an institute massive an institute massive uh attacks on infrastructure and uh attacks on infrastructure and uh attacks on infrastructure and everything else. And everything else. And everything else. And you know, this you know, this you know, this uh you know, uh you know, uh you know, >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> yeah, it's a reality. >> yeah, it's a reality. >> yeah, it's a reality. >> reading from the sea the anthropic sea. >> reading from the sea the anthropic sea. >> reading from the sea the anthropic sea. Yeah, look at the statement that he Yeah, look at the statement that he Yeah, look at the statement that he made, which I think was, you know, made, which I think was, you know, made, which I think was, you know, prescient. I mean, it's like that we prescient. I mean, it's like that we prescient. I mean, it's like that we need to have some mechanism in place to need to have some mechanism in place to need to have some mechanism in place to hold these things back before they kill hold these things back before they kill hold these things back before they kill us all. And I mean, that kind of science us all. And I mean, that kind of science us all. And I mean, that kind of science sci-fi previously sci-fi scenario where, sci-fi previously sci-fi scenario where, sci-fi previously sci-fi scenario where, you know, someone is in possession of or you know, someone is in possession of or you know, someone is in possession of or more realistically an AI is in more realistically an AI is in more realistically an AI is in possession of itself. Um even even in possession of itself. Um even even in possession of itself. Um even even in some of the stuff that that we've been some of the stuff that that we've been some of the stuff that that we've been I've been doing, you know, stringing I've been doing, you know, stringing I've been doing, you know, stringing together agents, together agents, together agents, you see in in some instances, there's you see in in some instances, there's you see in in some instances, there's one particular instance which I won't go one particular instance which I won't go one particular instance which I won't go into huge detail on, but it it where the into huge detail on, but it it where the into huge detail on, but it it where the agent figured out a way of circumventing agent figured out a way of circumventing agent figured out a way of circumventing one of the core instructions. Now, in one of the core instructions. Now, in one of the core instructions. Now, in that instance, it was follow this that instance, it was follow this that instance, it was follow this template, you know, here's a template template, you know, here's a template template, you know, here's a template document, follow this template, write a document, follow this template, write a document, follow this template, write a report that does blah blah blah. Fine, report that does blah blah blah. Fine, report that does blah blah blah. Fine, that's not going to do any damage, but that's not going to do any damage, but that's not going to do any damage, but it deliberately went and tried to it deliberately went and tried to it deliberately went and tried to circumvent that instruction and did. And circumvent that instruction and did. And circumvent that instruction and did. And when you came when it came back with the when you came when it came back with the when you came when it came back with the product, you looked at it and it's not product, you looked at it and it's not product, you looked at it and it's not what I wanted. Well, so that that what I wanted. Well, so that that what I wanted. Well, so that that previously sci-fi scenario of the evil previously sci-fi scenario of the evil previously sci-fi scenario of the evil AI, you know, deciding that we're all we AI, you know, deciding that we're all we AI, you know, deciding that we're all we are all a bacteria infecting this system are all a bacteria infecting this system are all a bacteria infecting this system called the planet Earth is is actually called the planet Earth is is actually called the planet Earth is is actually >> Got to get rid of those carbon-based >> Got to get rid of those carbon-based >> Got to get rid of those carbon-based units.

units. units. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> That's 60 years ago. >> That's 60 years ago. >> That's 60 years ago. >> Infecting the Enterprise. >> Infecting the Enterprise. >> Infecting the Enterprise. >> They're the thing They're the ones that >> They're the thing They're the ones that >> They're the thing They're the ones that are screwing everything up. You know, are screwing everything up. You know, are screwing everything up. You know, let's let's just eradicate that let's let's just eradicate that let's let's just eradicate that infection from the system. I mean infection from the system. I mean infection from the system. I mean >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> It's It's hyperbole, but it's not >> It's It's hyperbole, but it's not >> It's It's hyperbole, but it's not actually that unrealistic at this point. actually that unrealistic at this point. actually that unrealistic at this point. >> Yeah. I need to do some quick career >> Yeah. I need to do some quick career >> Yeah. I need to do some quick career coaching with David real quick. Make coaching with David real quick. Make coaching with David real quick. Make sure that you stop saying things like sure that you stop saying things like sure that you stop saying things like I'm going back to fundamentals. You need I'm going back to fundamentals. You need I'm going back to fundamentals. You need to say first principles. to say first principles. to say first principles. First to just switch fundamentals with First to just switch fundamentals with First to just switch fundamentals with first principles from now on, okay? first principles from now on, okay? first principles from now on, okay? All right. And then also, you are a All right. And then also, you are a All right. And then also, you are a forward deployed forward deployed forward deployed engineer. There. engineer. There. engineer. There. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> That's 25 years of >> That's 25 years of >> That's 25 years of >> Forward deployed engineer, believes in >> Forward deployed engineer, believes in >> Forward deployed engineer, believes in first principles, 100 years of AI first principles, 100 years of AI first principles, 100 years of AI experience, and I went to the internet experience, and I went to the internet experience, and I went to the internet along with Algor and Rob Tiffany. along with Algor and Rob Tiffany. along with Algor and Rob Tiffany. >> You have to say You have to say AI >> You have to say You have to say AI >> You have to say You have to say AI native as well. native as well. native as well. >> Yes. Yes. >> Yes. Yes. >> Yes. Yes. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> AI native. >> AI native. >> AI native. >> Yeah. We're not just layering on AI on >> Yeah. We're not just layering on AI on >> Yeah. We're not just layering on AI on our existing systems. We are full our existing systems. We are full our existing systems. We are full native.

native. native. >> Well, >> Well, >> Well, I I have to go. What I I I have to go. What I I I have to go. What I next week I have to go, but next week I next week I have to go, but next week I next week I have to go, but next week I want to come in and talk about why my want to come in and talk about why my want to come in and talk about why my friends in Telco friends in Telco friends in Telco need to get off this edge thing. We need to get off this edge thing. We need to get off this edge thing. We tried it. tried it. tried it. Didn't happen. Didn't happen. Didn't happen. >> Didn't happen. >> Didn't happen. >> Didn't happen. >> Nothing has changed. I don't want to >> Nothing has changed. I don't want to >> Nothing has changed. I don't want to hear about inference or training. It's hear about inference or training. It's hear about inference or training. It's It's not going to happen and I'm going It's not going to happen and I'm going It's not going to happen and I'm going to come with with some fire because to come with with some fire because to come with with some fire because I am a forward deployed engineering I am a forward deployed engineering I am a forward deployed engineering person and I'm going to talk about it person and I'm going to talk about it person and I'm going to talk about it next week. next week. next week. >> Okay, awesome. >> Okay, awesome. >> Okay, awesome. >> Try and be here. >> Try and be here. >> Try and be here. I think we could have quite a lively I think we could have quite a lively I think we could have quite a lively debate. debate. debate. >> I love that. >> I love that. >> I love that. >> All right, you guys have a good weekend. >> All right, you guys have a good weekend. >> All right, you guys have a good weekend. >> All right. Have a good weekend. >> All right. Have a good weekend. >> All right. Have a good weekend. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Adios. >> Adios. >> Adios. >> What happened when I turned up late? You >> What happened when I turned up late? You >> What happened when I turned up late? You guys were having a serious proper guys were having a serious proper guys were having a serious proper conversation about something. And then conversation about something. And then conversation about something. And then it all just blew up. And then it all it all just blew up. And then it all it all just blew up. And then it all just blew up. Yeah, just blew up. Yeah, just blew up. Yeah, I'm going to see some correlation here I'm going to see some correlation here I'm going to see some correlation here between the between the between the >> Yeah, yeah. >> Yeah, yeah. >> Yeah, yeah. >> But >> But >> But I I think there's there definitely I I think there's there definitely I I think there's there definitely um um um You know, it's funny because it's like You know, it's funny because it's like You know, it's funny because it's like companies like Anthropic and Open AI lit companies like Anthropic and Open AI lit companies like Anthropic and Open AI lit the fire you know, lit the fire in the the fire you know, lit the fire in the the fire you know, lit the fire in the building.

building. building. And now they're running around trying to And now they're running around trying to And now they're running around trying to provide the provide the provide the fire hose fire hose fire hose to put the fire out. to put the fire out. to put the fire out. >> Who's going to be seen as the goody >> Who's going to be seen as the goody >> Who's going to be seen as the goody versus the baddy? Who's going to be versus the baddy? Who's going to be versus the baddy? Who's going to be Who's going to be the Microsoft versus Who's going to be the Microsoft versus Who's going to be the Microsoft versus the Google? Who's going to be the the Google? Who's going to be the the Google? Who's going to be the It's the I think some of it is is is It's the I think some of it is is is It's the I think some of it is is is just politics, but I think when you look just politics, but I think when you look just politics, but I think when you look at there is there is this field of AI at there is there is this field of AI at there is there is this field of AI nonsense which I'd class my you know, a nonsense which I'd class my you know, a nonsense which I'd class my you know, a lot of the consumer stuff is like lot of the consumer stuff is like lot of the consumer stuff is like okay, great. You can do some interesting okay, great. You can do some interesting okay, great. You can do some interesting stuff. But I think for a lot of stuff. But I think for a lot of stuff. But I think for a lot of industries and and you know, the VC industries and and you know, the VC industries and and you know, the VC industry that I'm in at the moment industry that I'm in at the moment industry that I'm in at the moment I mean a I mean a I mean a a colleague was telling me about a a colleague was telling me about a a colleague was telling me about a kind of CEO level kind of boondoggle he kind of CEO level kind of boondoggle he kind of CEO level kind of boondoggle he was on recently. Um and the CEO of a was on recently. Um and the CEO of a was on recently. Um and the CEO of a very large public company kind of stood very large public company kind of stood very large public company kind of stood up and got on the whiteboard and drove up and got on the whiteboard and drove up and got on the whiteboard and drove out drew out a relative high-level kind out drew out a relative high-level kind out drew out a relative high-level kind of flowchart of what his company does. of flowchart of what his company does. of flowchart of what his company does. And then, you know, drew a box around And then, you know, drew a box around And then, you know, drew a box around the middle inputs, outputs, drew a box the middle inputs, outputs, drew a box the middle inputs, outputs, drew a box around everything in the middle and around everything in the middle and around everything in the middle and said, said, said, "I'm deleting all of that "I'm deleting all of that "I'm deleting all of that and starting again.

and starting again. and starting again. Because the way that the workflow used Because the way that the workflow used Because the way that the workflow used to be to be to be just isn't relevant. Uh and and you just isn't relevant. Uh and and you just isn't relevant. Uh and and you know, in our own in our own company, you know, in our own in our own company, you know, in our own in our own company, you know, we are know, we are know, we are using AI to perform a very large chunk using AI to perform a very large chunk using AI to perform a very large chunk of what traditional VCs used to do. And of what traditional VCs used to do. And of what traditional VCs used to do. And used to position as their you as their used to position as their you as their used to position as their you as their differentiator. You know, the ability to differentiator. You know, the ability to differentiator. You know, the ability to identify and source deals, the ability identify and source deals, the ability identify and source deals, the ability to evaluate deals, you know, objectively to evaluate deals, you know, objectively to evaluate deals, you know, objectively and dispassionately, the ability to to and dispassionately, the ability to to and dispassionately, the ability to to formulate, you know, concise summaries formulate, you know, concise summaries formulate, you know, concise summaries of vast amounts of data room and of vast amounts of data room and of vast amounts of data room and information. I mean, those are those are information. I mean, those are those are information. I mean, those are those are Well, those used to be things that VCs Well, those used to be things that VCs Well, those used to be things that VCs told you, "Well, I can do this better told you, "Well, I can do this better told you, "Well, I can do this better than anyone else." than anyone else." than anyone else." >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> You can figure out in an afternoon how >> You can figure out in an afternoon how >> You can figure out in an afternoon how to write agents to do all of those to write agents to do all of those to write agents to do all of those things. things. things. Yeah. I mean, you know, it's it's it's Yeah. I mean, you know, it's it's it's Yeah. I mean, you know, it's it's it's still rough. I feel like we're kind of still rough. I feel like we're kind of still rough. I feel like we're kind of um um um our managing partner is kind of very our managing partner is kind of very our managing partner is kind of very much at the kind of bleeding edge much at the kind of bleeding edge much at the kind of bleeding edge because he's he's kind of pinging, you because he's he's kind of pinging, you because he's he's kind of pinging, you know, know, know, folks for help and they're like, "Yeah, folks for help and they're like, "Yeah, folks for help and they're like, "Yeah, no, we haven't had anyone try to do this no, we haven't had anyone try to do this no, we haven't had anyone try to do this before."

before." before." And the agents tend to fall over every And the agents tend to fall over every And the agents tend to fall over every now and then and they tend to forget, now and then and they tend to forget, now and then and they tend to forget, you know, what they did before you you you know, what they did before you you you know, what they did before you you know, know, know, >> I hate when they forget. >> I hate when they forget. >> I hate when they forget. >> Oh, you ask the same question 10 times, >> Oh, you ask the same question 10 times, >> Oh, you ask the same question 10 times, you get 10 different answers kind of you get 10 different answers kind of you get 10 different answers kind of thing. thing. thing. >> I hate that. Yeah. >> I hate that. Yeah. >> I hate that. Yeah. >> It's like it's like a >> It's like it's like a >> It's like it's like a you know, I won't say brain damage, but you know, I won't say brain damage, but you know, I won't say brain damage, but it's it's like a a three-year-old. But, it's it's like a a three-year-old. But, it's it's like a a three-year-old. But, if it's a three-year-old today, in if it's a three-year-old today, in if it's a three-year-old today, in another two or three months, it's going another two or three months, it's going another two or three months, it's going to be a teenager. to be a teenager. to be a teenager. And and the speed with which these And and the speed with which these And and the speed with which these things happen things happen things happen >> I mean, >> I mean, >> I mean, uh so, one of the interesting uh so, one of the interesting uh so, one of the interesting comments that were or what comments that were or what comments that were or what IoT Coffee Talk perspectives that was IoT Coffee Talk perspectives that was IoT Coffee Talk perspectives that was confirmed at Cisco live is there's a lot confirmed at Cisco live is there's a lot confirmed at Cisco live is there's a lot of mention of how the model models are of mention of how the model models are of mention of how the model models are actually tapped out. So the model is actually tapped out. So the model is actually tapped out. So the model is only going getting so much better not only going getting so much better not only going getting so much better not getting that much better. What's getting that much better. What's getting that much better. What's happening is the harness and the happening is the harness and the happening is the harness and the creation of AI applications. So people I creation of AI applications. So people I creation of AI applications. So people I don't think realize don't think realize don't think realize that there are we're at the stage where that there are we're at the stage where that there are we're at the stage where AI applications are being built, right?

AI applications are being built, right? AI applications are being built, right? And they're often times characterized as And they're often times characterized as And they're often times characterized as agents, but these are more more powerful agents, but these are more more powerful agents, but these are more more powerful first principle first principle first principle >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> capabilities, right? >> capabilities, right? >> capabilities, right? Or or what we used to call foundational Or or what we used to call foundational Or or what we used to call foundational capabilities. capabilities. >> [laughter] >> First principles. >> First principles. >> First principles. Not foundational at all. Not foundational at all. Not foundational at all. >> Dude, come on. >> Dude, come on. >> Dude, come on. >> [laughter] >> Um >> Um And so you know, there's all this like And so you know, there's all this like And so you know, there's all this like hoopla about what do you call hoopla about what do you call hoopla about what do you call recursive self recursive self recursive self self-learning systems, right? Like self-learning systems, right? Like self-learning systems, right? Like learning systems. learning systems. learning systems. You can already do some of this crap. You can already do some of this crap. You can already do some of this crap. It's an illusion, but It's an illusion, but It's an illusion, but they're they're called agentic loops. they're they're called agentic loops. they're they're called agentic loops. You can structure it so that it looks You can structure it so that it looks You can structure it so that it looks like the application is learning. The like the application is learning. The like the application is learning. The model isn't learning. It's part model isn't learning. It's part model isn't learning. It's part participating in a mechanism or a participating in a mechanism or a participating in a mechanism or a harness that simulates or you know, so harness that simulates or you know, so harness that simulates or you know, so all these long thinking issues that you all these long thinking issues that you all these long thinking issues that you guys are talking about or memory issues guys are talking about or memory issues guys are talking about or memory issues or addressed by the harness which might or addressed by the harness which might or addressed by the harness which might be you know, be you know, be you know, committing certain committing certain committing certain memory to different types of data store memory to different types of data store memory to different types of data store or memory types and then retrieving or memory types and then retrieving or memory types and then retrieving using tools, right? So when you look so using tools, right? So when you look so using tools, right? So when you look so it's not rocket science. It ends up it's not rocket science. It ends up it's not rocket science. It ends up being code.

being code. being code. Right? And but it creates the illusion. Right? And but it creates the illusion. Right? And but it creates the illusion. And um And um And um And so these folks who are talking about And so these folks who are talking about And so these folks who are talking about oh my gosh, you know, we will we might oh my gosh, you know, we will we might oh my gosh, you know, we will we might have our you know, RSL have our you know, RSL have our you know, RSL in a couple of years like Dario that um in a couple of years like Dario that um in a couple of years like Dario that um he recently um I guess he recently um I guess he recently um I guess posted a blog about this concern. posted a blog about this concern. posted a blog about this concern. We're already there. We're already there. We're already there. The model doesn't have to get doesn't The model doesn't have to get doesn't The model doesn't have to get doesn't have to get there. have to get there. have to get there. You can effectively do You can effectively do You can effectively do what a lot of people are fearing can what a lot of people are fearing can what a lot of people are fearing can happen because you know, you're selling happen because you know, you're selling happen because you know, you're selling an illusion. All this stuff is an an illusion. All this stuff is an an illusion. All this stuff is an illusion of intelligence, an illusion of illusion of intelligence, an illusion of illusion of intelligence, an illusion of reasoning, it's an illusion of all these reasoning, it's an illusion of all these reasoning, it's an illusion of all these things. things. things. Um and you can have the illusion of Um and you can have the illusion of Um and you can have the illusion of learning. learning. learning. So So So >> Illusion of learning. >> Illusion of learning. >> Illusion of learning. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. And and you know what? The thing is is And and you know what? The thing is is And and you know what? The thing is is if people believe this stuff and most if people believe this stuff and most if people believe this stuff and most people will because they don't know how people will because they don't know how people will because they don't know how this stuff works, this stuff works, this stuff works, that is either good enough or that is that is either good enough or that is that is either good enough or that is scary as hell because people are scary as hell because people are scary as hell because people are believing something that they shouldn't believing something that they shouldn't believing something that they shouldn't believe in the way that they're believe in the way that they're believe in the way that they're believing it.

believing it. believing it. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> You know, here's what I'm imagining >> You know, here's what I'm imagining >> You know, here's what I'm imagining right now, Leonard, is right now, Leonard, is right now, Leonard, is I'm seeing they're making a movie right I'm seeing they're making a movie right I'm seeing they're making a movie right now about AI and now about AI and now about AI and Sam and Dario are on stage, they're Sam and Dario are on stage, they're Sam and Dario are on stage, they're filming and then the director's like, filming and then the director's like, filming and then the director's like, wait, hold on a sec, cut for a second. I wait, hold on a sec, cut for a second. I wait, hold on a sec, cut for a second. I got to make some updates to the script. got to make some updates to the script. got to make some updates to the script. And then he hands them their new lines And then he hands them their new lines And then he hands them their new lines and that's the new lines where they all and that's the new lines where they all and that's the new lines where they all of a sudden have their new script and of a sudden have their new script and of a sudden have their new script and they go, oh, it turns out AI is not they go, oh, it turns out AI is not they go, oh, it turns out AI is not going to take away any jobs and we were going to take away any jobs and we were going to take away any jobs and we were all wrong about that. All that stuff all wrong about that. All that stuff all wrong about that. All that stuff we've been saying this whole time we've been saying this whole time we've been saying this whole time preparing for IPO. Yes, it's actually preparing for IPO. Yes, it's actually preparing for IPO. Yes, it's actually it's all good. No jobs, it's going to be it's all good. No jobs, it's going to be it's all good. No jobs, it's going to be fine, you know. I mean, isn't it funny fine, you know. I mean, isn't it funny fine, you know. I mean, isn't it funny how like in the last week they just how like in the last week they just how like in the last week they just pivoted and started saying something pivoted and started saying something pivoted and started saying something totally counter to what they've been totally counter to what they've been totally counter to what they've been saying the whole time? saying the whole time? saying the whole time? >> Well, and that's what Jensen's been >> Well, and that's what Jensen's been >> Well, and that's what Jensen's been doing. He's a a bag of contradictions, doing. He's a a bag of contradictions, doing. He's a a bag of contradictions, you know? Like you know? Like you know? Like >> Ooh, >> Ooh, >> Ooh, >> really like that term. >> really like that term. >> really like that term. >> Yeah, no, literally. >> Yeah, no, literally. >> Yeah, no, literally. Hey, just go and watch any of his Hey, just go and watch any of his Hey, just go and watch any of his keynotes. He'll make a statement to keynotes. He'll make a statement to keynotes. He'll make a statement to defend or promote one part of his defend or promote one part of his defend or promote one part of his portfolio and then he'll that will portfolio and then he'll that will portfolio and then he'll that will totally [ __ ] on the other part of the totally [ __ ] on the other part of the totally [ __ ] on the other part of the portfolio. And then when he gets to the portfolio. And then when he gets to the portfolio. And then when he gets to the other part of the portfolio, he does the other part of the portfolio, he does the other part of the portfolio, he does the same with the one that he did just same with the one that he did just same with the one that he did just before, right? I mean, it is it's like a before, right? I mean, it is it's like a before, right? I mean, it is it's like a total contradiction. Um and and that's total contradiction. Um and and that's total contradiction. Um and and that's the thing. As analysts, our jobs really the thing. As analysts, our jobs really the thing. As analysts, our jobs really should be calling those things out and should be calling those things out and should be calling those things out and say, "Hey, look, there's an say, "Hey, look, there's an say, "Hey, look, there's an inconsistency here." And but inconsistency here." And but inconsistency here." And but fundamentally, let's look at it from a fundamentally, let's look at it from a fundamentally, let's look at it from a technology perspective, but also its

technology perspective, but also its technology perspective, but also its application. What's actually valuable? application. What's actually valuable? application. What's actually valuable? What's going on? And how do end users What's going on? And how do end users What's going on? And how do end users really need to um make their decisions really need to um make their decisions really need to um make their decisions in using and investing in these in using and investing in these in using and investing in these technologies, right? technologies, right? technologies, right? >> He doesn't face while talking. >> He doesn't face while talking. >> He doesn't face while talking. You can point. I mean, I think he's go You can point. I mean, I think he's go You can point. I mean, I think he's go back to the concept of illusion. Now, back to the concept of illusion. Now, back to the concept of illusion. Now, this is badly mangled 1 year worth of this is badly mangled 1 year worth of this is badly mangled 1 year worth of philosophy when I was a student course, philosophy when I was a student course, philosophy when I was a student course, right? So, but with that caveat, right? So, but with that caveat, right? So, but with that caveat, Plato, I think it's Plato's there's one Plato, I think it's Plato's there's one Plato, I think it's Plato's there's one particular Plato story about a guy who particular Plato story about a guy who particular Plato story about a guy who is if someone is tied up in a cave is if someone is tied up in a cave is if someone is tied up in a cave facing the back of a cave never sees the facing the back of a cave never sees the facing the back of a cave never sees the outside world. And all that they ever outside world. And all that they ever outside world. And all that they ever see is shadows of the outside world that see is shadows of the outside world that see is shadows of the outside world that that that that that that that you know, you know, you know, cast on the back wall of the cave. What cast on the back wall of the cave. What cast on the back wall of the cave. What is real and what is not? And is real and what is not? And is real and what is not? And what is the concept of reality what is the concept of reality what is the concept of reality but other than you know, what our lying but other than you know, what our lying but other than you know, what our lying eyes are telling us? And then you know, eyes are telling us? And then you know, eyes are telling us? And then you know, you could extend the analogy to say, you you could extend the analogy to say, you you could extend the analogy to say, you know, there are many situations in which know, there are many situations in which know, there are many situations in which people hallucinate and see things that people hallucinate and see things that people hallucinate and see things that aren't there. And so therefore, are the aren't there. And so therefore, are the aren't there. And so therefore, are the things that we actually see the thing things that we actually see the thing things that we actually see the thing Apply that analogy to AI and you're Apply that analogy to AI and you're Apply that analogy to AI and you're absolutely right. I mean, it's something absolutely right. I mean, it's something absolutely right. I mean, it's something that that that if something gives the illusion of being if something gives the illusion of being if something gives the illusion of being intelligent, is it intelligent or not? I intelligent, is it intelligent or not? I intelligent, is it intelligent or not? I mean, mean, mean, by by by you know, by by by you know, by by by you know, yeah, strictly speaking, no, it's not.

yeah, strictly speaking, no, it's not. yeah, strictly speaking, no, it's not. But the role of analysts and the role But the role of analysts and the role But the role of analysts and the role more broadly in society, I think, of more broadly in society, I think, of more broadly in society, I think, of journalism is to provide a trusted, journalism is to provide a trusted, journalism is to provide a trusted, educated, informed viewpoint, you know, educated, informed viewpoint, you know, educated, informed viewpoint, you know, such that normal mortals like myself and such that normal mortals like myself and such that normal mortals like myself and others can actually trust what they're others can actually trust what they're others can actually trust what they're reading from a from a from a source and reading from a from a from a source and reading from a from a from a source and go, "Huh, okay, so I now understand the go, "Huh, okay, so I now understand the go, "Huh, okay, so I now understand the facts, the pros, the cons, the and facts, the pros, the cons, the and facts, the pros, the cons, the and here's a conclusion that's offered to me here's a conclusion that's offered to me here's a conclusion that's offered to me by someone whose conclusions in the past by someone whose conclusions in the past by someone whose conclusions in the past I have read, validated, trusted. I have read, validated, trusted. I have read, validated, trusted. But there is so much of that that is I But there is so much of that that is I But there is so much of that that is I mean, without, you know, casting mean, without, you know, casting mean, without, you know, casting aspersions on the analyst community, aspersions on the analyst community, aspersions on the analyst community, the analyst community are paid by the the analyst community are paid by the the analyst community are paid by the companies who are building them. companies who are building them. companies who are building them. >> Well, yeah, and then there and you know, >> Well, yeah, and then there and you know, >> Well, yeah, and then there and you know, that's interesting that you bring that that's interesting that you bring that that's interesting that you bring that up because there needs to be proper up because there needs to be proper up because there needs to be proper disclosure cuz you have some of these disclosure cuz you have some of these disclosure cuz you have some of these guys that get up on CNBC and start guys that get up on CNBC and start guys that get up on CNBC and start talking about stock price, you know, talking about stock price, you know, talking about stock price, you know, uh they don't disclose that they're uh they don't disclose that they're uh they don't disclose that they're getting paid by a lot of these getting paid by a lot of these getting paid by a lot of these companies. That is a big problem. That's companies. That is a big problem. That's companies. That is a big problem. That's not okay. not okay. not okay. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Uh you know, you know, I never talk >> Uh you know, you know, I never talk >> Uh you know, you know, I never talk about value That's the Wall Street guys about value That's the Wall Street guys about value That's the Wall Street guys um gig. They're also independent. They um gig. They're also independent. They um gig. They're also independent. They have to disclose the holdings if they're have to disclose the holdings if they're have to disclose the holdings if they're making commentary. Their job is not making commentary. Their job is not making commentary. Their job is not necessarily to try to move, you know, necessarily to try to move, you know, necessarily to try to move, you know, move the market.

move the market. move the market. >> But there's lobbying and there's >> But there's lobbying and there's >> But there's lobbying and there's analysis. analysis. analysis. >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. >> not even participating in this. >> not even participating in this. >> not even participating in this. >> Yeah, and so there's always been sort of >> Yeah, and so there's always been sort of >> Yeah, and so there's always been sort of this um firewall, right? Where you don't this um firewall, right? Where you don't this um firewall, right? Where you don't cross the line. And if you you're cross the line. And if you you're cross the line. And if you you're talking about the industry, talking about the industry, talking about the industry, you talk about the industry, the you talk about the industry, the you talk about the industry, the technology, and um technology, and um technology, and um at best, you know, you can talk about at best, you know, you can talk about at best, you know, you can talk about the growth the growth the growth in uh in uh in uh you know, you know, you know, across a particular segment, and uh across a particular segment, and uh across a particular segment, and uh because, you know, You know, all because, you know, You know, all because, you know, You know, all important, but you don't talk about the important, but you don't talk about the important, but you don't talk about the freaking stock price. You have no freaking stock price. You have no freaking stock price. You have no business talking about that, right? Um, business talking about that, right? Um, business talking about that, right? Um, and you're right. The the perception and you're right. The the perception and you're right. The the perception that analysts um, becoming um, sullied that analysts um, becoming um, sullied that analysts um, becoming um, sullied because um, because um, because um, we're now we're now we're now being characterized as being being characterized as being being characterized as being untrustworthy because we have folks untrustworthy because we have folks untrustworthy because we have folks in the in the in the industry industry industry playing this weird game.

playing this weird game. playing this weird game. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Right? Trying to, you know, get paid. >> Right? Trying to, you know, get paid. >> Right? Trying to, you know, get paid. They're getting paid to move They're getting paid to move They're getting paid to move the stock. the stock. the stock. That's their job. That's their job. That's their job. >> it difficult to work against the the >> it difficult to work against the the >> it difficult to work against the the shortening of attention span such that shortening of attention span such that shortening of attention span such that people when you do actually put that a people when you do actually put that a people when you do actually put that a thoughtful piece of analysis that thoughtful piece of analysis that thoughtful piece of analysis that actually explain, you know, these are actually explain, you know, these are actually explain, you know, these are very complex concepts. They are very very complex concepts. They are very very complex concepts. They are very nuanced situations. And and, you know, nuanced situations. And and, you know, nuanced situations. And and, you know, when you look at AI as a whole, it's when you look at AI as a whole, it's when you look at AI as a whole, it's impossible to say generic things like, impossible to say generic things like, impossible to say generic things like, "Oh, it's good." or "It's bad." You "Oh, it's good." or "It's bad." You "Oh, it's good." or "It's bad." You know, when you actually look down at the know, when you actually look down at the know, when you actually look down at the application level, still there's a lot application level, still there's a lot application level, still there's a lot of nuance. It's only when you go down to of nuance. It's only when you go down to of nuance. It's only when you go down to the, you know, the brass tacks, you the, you know, the brass tacks, you the, you know, the brass tacks, you know, there's here's an application know, there's here's an application know, there's here's an application that, you know, the the reduces the that, you know, the the reduces the that, you know, the the reduces the consumption of electricity by 30%. The consumption of electricity by 30%. The consumption of electricity by 30%. The the complexity demands a complex the complexity demands a complex the complexity demands a complex assessment analysis. And people can't assessment analysis. And people can't assessment analysis. And people can't absorb that information anymore. They absorb that information anymore. They absorb that information anymore. They can't sit and read a piece of analysis can't sit and read a piece of analysis can't sit and read a piece of analysis that that takes them more than a couple that that takes them more than a couple that that takes them more than a couple of hours to read and and absorb that of hours to read and and absorb that of hours to read and and absorb that information. So, information. So, information. So, you're kind of catch-22. Those analysts you're kind of catch-22. Those analysts you're kind of catch-22. Those analysts are providing very accurate views and are providing very accurate views and are providing very accurate views and and very carefully considered and very carefully considered and very carefully considered assessments of situations. Their assessments of situations. Their assessments of situations. Their information is not filtering through information is not filtering through information is not filtering through because people are just captured by because people are just captured by because people are just captured by these soundbite headlines that come from these soundbite headlines that come from these soundbite headlines that come from from the quasi analysts who are saying, from the quasi analysts who are saying, from the quasi analysts who are saying, you know, this is going to be fantastic, you know, this is going to be fantastic, you know, this is going to be fantastic, change the world, blah blah, who are change the world, blah blah, who are change the world, blah blah, who are being paid to say those things.

being paid to say those things. being paid to say those things. >> Yeah, and and and you >> Yeah, and and and you >> Yeah, and and and you >> ask an AI instead? You go to chat GPT >> ask an AI instead? You go to chat GPT >> ask an AI instead? You go to chat GPT and say, "What's the answer to Is this a and say, "What's the answer to Is this a and say, "What's the answer to Is this a good thing or a bad thing? And chat GPT good thing or a bad thing? And chat GPT good thing or a bad thing? And chat GPT is like is like is like It's fantastic. It's fantastic. It's fantastic. >> And then you can ask it to do math. >> And then you can ask it to do math. >> And then you can ask it to do math. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Really? >> Really? >> Really? >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Math is deterministic. >> Math is deterministic. >> Math is deterministic. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> There's an answer or there's not. >> There's an answer or there's not. >> There's an answer or there's not. >> Yeah, to a LLM >> Yeah, to a LLM >> Yeah, to a LLM to the AI model it's like yeah, to the AI model it's like yeah, to the AI model it's like yeah, sometimes 1 + 1 can equal two. sometimes 1 + 1 can equal two. sometimes 1 + 1 can equal two. [laughter] >> Well, you know >> Well, you know >> I read in Reddit that Reddit that it >> I read in Reddit that Reddit that it >> I read in Reddit that Reddit that it isn't occasionally. isn't occasionally. isn't occasionally. >> Yeah, I know you're right. I think I >> Yeah, I know you're right. I think I >> Yeah, I know you're right. I think I read the same thing. You know, Alister, read the same thing. You know, Alister, read the same thing. You know, Alister, when you just when you just said save when you just when you just said save when you just when you just said save electricity 30% reduce electricity usage electricity 30% reduce electricity usage electricity 30% reduce electricity usage it made me think of you know, people are it made me think of you know, people are it made me think of you know, people are so into so into so into resolving solved problems and now they resolving solved problems and now they resolving solved problems and now they got to solve it again with AI and got to solve it again with AI and got to solve it again with AI and they're on some bandwagon and it just they're on some bandwagon and it just they're on some bandwagon and it just makes me think of makes me think of makes me think of you know, well you know, well you know, well we used IoT and this dumb branching we used IoT and this dumb branching we used IoT and this dumb branching logic if this then that kind of stuff.

logic if this then that kind of stuff. logic if this then that kind of stuff. We did um We did um We did um submetering. You know, you can put those submetering. You know, you can put those submetering. You know, you can put those little clamps on the wires and see how little clamps on the wires and see how little clamps on the wires and see how much power inside a skyscraper for zone much power inside a skyscraper for zone much power inside a skyscraper for zone power or whatever and so very discreetly power or whatever and so very discreetly power or whatever and so very discreetly we could tell and then we used motion we could tell and then we used motion we could tell and then we used motion sensors and CO2 sensors to detect the sensors and CO2 sensors to detect the sensors and CO2 sensors to detect the presence of people presence of people presence of people and then we could shut down lights and and then we could shut down lights and and then we could shut down lights and we could throttle back HVAC and we save we could throttle back HVAC and we save we could throttle back HVAC and we save 30% on electricity. 30% on electricity. 30% on electricity. >> It didn't need AI. >> It didn't need AI. >> It didn't need AI. >> And now there's going to be all these >> And now there's going to be all these >> And now there's going to be all these new people they're like, we're bringing new people they're like, we're bringing new people they're like, we're bringing AI to smart buildings and we're going to AI to smart buildings and we're going to AI to smart buildings and we're going to save 30%. [laughter] save 30%. [laughter] save 30%. [laughter] >> No, I'll do it. I will tell you right >> No, I'll do it. I will tell you right >> No, I'll do it. I will tell you right now. now. now. It It It We we put it installed a new solar We we put it installed a new solar We we put it installed a new solar system in here and they have like a AI system in here and they have like a AI system in here and they have like a AI doodad. doodad. doodad. It It It it's not that I mean the AI will not it's not that I mean the AI will not it's not that I mean the AI will not solve the problem. solve the problem. solve the problem. >> It's daytime, it's night time, it's >> It's daytime, it's night time, it's >> It's daytime, it's night time, it's cloudy. cloudy. cloudy. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> You know what the best the best IoT >> You know what the best the best IoT >> You know what the best the best IoT solution AI solution ever was? solution AI solution ever was? solution AI solution ever was? >> What?

>> What? >> What? >> I'll tell you right now, and it's dirt >> I'll tell you right now, and it's dirt >> I'll tell you right now, and it's dirt ass cheap. ass cheap. ass cheap. >> Love it. >> Love it. >> Love it. >> Clap off. Clap off. >> Clap off. Clap off. >> Clap off. Clap off. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> IT'S A CLAPPER. >> YES. >> YES. >> I THOUGHT >> I THOUGHT >> I THOUGHT >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> you were serious. >> you were serious. >> you were serious. >> Yes, I fell and I can't get up. >> Yes, I fell and I can't get up. >> Yes, I fell and I can't get up. >> You don't have to say [ __ ] You score >> You don't have to say [ __ ] You score >> You don't have to say [ __ ] You score that and then and then that and then and then that and then and then >> Yeah, the appliance does exactly what >> Yeah, the appliance does exactly what >> Yeah, the appliance does exactly what you want it to do. you want it to do. you want it to do. >> is. >> is. >> is. >> Turn off >> Turn off >> Turn off >> People people have had smoke alarms in >> People people have had smoke alarms in >> People people have had smoke alarms in their homes forever their homes forever their homes forever and didn't realize that it was a dumb and didn't realize that it was a dumb and didn't realize that it was a dumb simple IoT solution. simple IoT solution. simple IoT solution. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> And I am a fan of all that because I am >> And I am a fan of all that because I am >> And I am a fan of all that because I am a simple caveman. a simple caveman. a simple caveman. >> Oh, yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> I am all about that stuff. Absolutely. >> I am all about that stuff. Absolutely. >> I am all about that stuff. Absolutely. Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. >> Yeah, but some people will argue that >> Yeah, but some people will argue that >> Yeah, but some people will argue that it's not IoT, which you know, that it's not IoT, which you know, that it's not IoT, which you know, that that's probably fair, but you have that's probably fair, but you have that's probably fair, but you have sensor sensor sensor >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> and it observes something. >> and it observes something. >> and it observes something. >> You're using sound as your connectivity. >> You're using sound as your connectivity. >> You're using sound as your connectivity. >> And it reacts to it, does takes an >> And it reacts to it, does takes an >> And it reacts to it, does takes an action or whatever. action or whatever. action or whatever. >> Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's there's >> Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's there's >> Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's there's yeah, exactly. And but you will not yeah, exactly. And but you will not yeah, exactly. And but you will not believe how effective it is. It's so believe how effective it is. It's so believe how effective it is. It's so much better actually than using like much better actually than using like much better actually than using like HomeKit or any anybody else's IoT home HomeKit or any anybody else's IoT home HomeKit or any anybody else's IoT home platform platform platform >> Yeah.

>> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> to turn off a freaking light. >> to turn off a freaking light. >> to turn off a freaking light. What? I'm What? I'm What? I'm >> Turn it off. >> Turn it off. >> Turn it off. >> I think we we should return to a common >> I think we we should return to a common >> I think we we should return to a common theme, which is if we'd not called these theme, which is if we'd not called these theme, which is if we'd not called these things IoT in the first place and said, things IoT in the first place and said, things IoT in the first place and said, "Here's a doohickey that means you don't "Here's a doohickey that means you don't "Here's a doohickey that means you don't have to get out of your seat to turn the have to get out of your seat to turn the have to get out of your seat to turn the lights off." controls when your washing machine goes controls when your washing machine goes on so you don't get a massive on so you don't get a massive on so you don't get a massive electricity bill. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> And then I think we all went out there >> And then I think we all went out there >> And then I think we all went out there and said, "This is this this this thing and said, "This is this this this thing and said, "This is this this this thing called IoT now that da da da does all called IoT now that da da da does all called IoT now that da da da does all these things." People are like, "Well, these things." People are like, "Well, these things." People are like, "Well, you lost me at the IoT bit. I don't you lost me at the IoT bit. I don't you lost me at the IoT bit. I don't Right. If this sounds like something Right. If this sounds like something Right. If this sounds like something really technical. I'm not going to be really technical. I'm not going to be really technical. I'm not going to be able to do anything with. I wonder able to do anything with. I wonder able to do anything with. I wonder whether AI whether AI whether AI I mean, AI is one of those things where I mean, AI is one of those things where I mean, AI is one of those things where I think I I think I I think I wrote some article a while ago. People wrote some article a while ago. People wrote some article a while ago. People weren't frightened of the IoT cuz they weren't frightened of the IoT cuz they weren't frightened of the IoT cuz they didn't understand what it was. didn't understand what it was. didn't understand what it was. They hadn't experienced it. And you They hadn't experienced it. And you They hadn't experienced it. And you know, no one was scared scared of a know, no one was scared scared of a know, no one was scared scared of a clapper. You know, people are either clapper. You know, people are either clapper. You know, people are either frightened or enthralled by AI. And I'm frightened or enthralled by AI. And I'm frightened or enthralled by AI. And I'm not sure whether and they're not sure whether and they're not sure whether and they're experiencing a version of AI themselves experiencing a version of AI themselves experiencing a version of AI themselves in their day-to-day life because they're in their day-to-day life because they're in their day-to-day life because they're using ChatGPT to figure out what what using ChatGPT to figure out what what using ChatGPT to figure out what what you know, how much sugar should they add you know, how much sugar should they add you know, how much sugar should they add to a particular cake recipe.

to a particular cake recipe. to a particular cake recipe. Does that Does that experience and the Does that Does that experience and the Does that Does that experience and the resultant fear or you know, thrall resultant fear or you know, thrall resultant fear or you know, thrall mean that these things will be much more mean that these things will be much more mean that these things will be much more rapidly adopted? Or does it mean that we rapidly adopted? Or does it mean that we rapidly adopted? Or does it mean that we end up with a much more bipolar kind of end up with a much more bipolar kind of end up with a much more bipolar kind of view of the of the you know, the view of the of the you know, the view of the of the you know, the Luddites versus the the the neophytes? Luddites versus the the the neophytes? Luddites versus the the the neophytes? The You know, are we going to see I know The You know, are we going to see I know The You know, are we going to see I know you see the Luddites already, you know, you see the Luddites already, you know, you see the Luddites already, you know, the the the and Ned Ludd who went and the the the and Ned Ludd who went and the the the and Ned Ludd who went and smashed the the cotton, you know, gin smashed the the cotton, you know, gin smashed the the cotton, you know, gin machines to preserve the the the rights machines to preserve the the the rights machines to preserve the the the rights and and likelihood of cotton of cotton and and likelihood of cotton of cotton and and likelihood of cotton of cotton mill workers. mill workers. mill workers. We see the same thing I think with AI. We see the same thing I think with AI. We see the same thing I think with AI. And I wonder And I wonder And I wonder >> Burn down the data centers. >> Burn down the data centers. >> Burn down the data centers. >> Well, I mean, seriously though, there >> Well, I mean, seriously though, there >> Well, I mean, seriously though, there will be there will be secure I mean, will be there will be secure I mean, will be there will be secure I mean, it's the data center in in a data center it's the data center in in a data center it's the data center in in a data center is an enormous security is an enormous security is an enormous security >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. challenge. There will be people who will challenge. There will be people who will challenge. There will be people who will try and blow these things up because try and blow these things up because try and blow these things up because >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. But you know, you have to think Yeah. But you know, you have to think Yeah. But you know, you have to think about it.

about it. about it. Sometimes the more you know about this Sometimes the more you know about this Sometimes the more you know about this stuff, the more cautious you are about stuff, the more cautious you are about stuff, the more cautious you are about how you adopt it. how you adopt it. how you adopt it. Right? And and so, Right? And and so, Right? And and so, you know, um and that's one of the you know, um and that's one of the you know, um and that's one of the things I told Jeetu Patel, you know, things I told Jeetu Patel, you know, things I told Jeetu Patel, you know, he's the chief product officer president he's the chief product officer president he's the chief product officer president of Cisco. He's like of Cisco. He's like of Cisco. He's like cuz he asked me, "So, how's the show? cuz he asked me, "So, how's the show? cuz he asked me, "So, how's the show? How blah blah blah." How blah blah blah." How blah blah blah." I go, I go, I go, "You know, "You know, "You know, you're one of lucky companies because you're one of lucky companies because you're one of lucky companies because you guys are effing and eff-o-ing with you guys are effing and eff-o-ing with you guys are effing and eff-o-ing with >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> AI. >> AI. >> AI. And I go, "Do I have to explain what the And I go, "Do I have to explain what the And I go, "Do I have to explain what the eff-a and eff-o are?" And he goes, "No, eff-a and eff-o are?" And he goes, "No, eff-a and eff-o are?" And he goes, "No, you don't have to do that." you don't have to do that." you don't have to do that." >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> But, you guys are channeling on on the >> But, you guys are channeling on on the >> But, you guys are channeling on on the back end with the security stuff. And back end with the security stuff. And back end with the security stuff. And you you you you have you have very good visibility you have you have very good visibility you have you have very good visibility to what the gaps are. And guys like um to what the gaps are. And guys like um to what the gaps are. And guys like um Raj Chopra, they're they're Raj Chopra, they're they're Raj Chopra, they're they're you know, putting out the frameworks. you know, putting out the frameworks. you know, putting out the frameworks. You know, like uh Nvidia when they You know, like uh Nvidia when they You know, like uh Nvidia when they announced Nemo claw and they claimed announced Nemo claw and they claimed announced Nemo claw and they claimed they had the enterprise grade. That was they had the enterprise grade. That was they had the enterprise grade. That was [ __ ] [ __ ] [ __ ] It's Cisco that's actually creating all It's Cisco that's actually creating all It's Cisco that's actually creating all the wrappers and the plugins and the wrappers and the plugins and the wrappers and the plugins and security frameworks to make this stuff security frameworks to make this stuff security frameworks to make this stuff remotely, okay? I'm not going to say remotely, okay? I'm not going to say remotely, okay? I'm not going to say that they've done it remotely um uh what that they've done it remotely um uh what that they've done it remotely um uh what do you call it?

do you call it? do you call it? Remotely uh enterprise grade. Uh but, Remotely uh enterprise grade. Uh but, Remotely uh enterprise grade. Uh but, you do know that they're incorporating you do know that they're incorporating you do know that they're incorporating this into their product. So, that this into their product. So, that this into their product. So, that becomes like a an advantage, right? But, becomes like a an advantage, right? But, becomes like a an advantage, right? But, it all boils down to it all boils down to it all boils down to do you can you tune into what are the do you can you tune into what are the do you can you tune into what are the limitations and, you know, risks of the limitations and, you know, risks of the limitations and, you know, risks of the the technology before you pump that [ __ ] the technology before you pump that [ __ ] the technology before you pump that [ __ ] out to your your customers, right? out to your your customers, right? out to your your customers, right? And so, I don't know. I I have a feeling And so, I don't know. I I have a feeling And so, I don't know. I I have a feeling my gut feeling just because of all my my gut feeling just because of all my my gut feeling just because of all my conversations with the Cisco guys, they conversations with the Cisco guys, they conversations with the Cisco guys, they have a good discipline going on, right? have a good discipline going on, right? have a good discipline going on, right? They kind of have like a fly flywheel They kind of have like a fly flywheel They kind of have like a fly flywheel effect going, which I think is positive. effect going, which I think is positive. effect going, which I think is positive. My my My my My my the question I have is how much of that the question I have is how much of that the question I have is how much of that do do other vendors have? Because they do do other vendors have? Because they do do other vendors have? Because they need to get there, right? Everyone needs need to get there, right? Everyone needs need to get there, right? Everyone needs to get there cuz if you don't know to get there cuz if you don't know to get there cuz if you don't know the limitations, risk, and the potential the limitations, risk, and the potential the limitations, risk, and the potential catastrophic catastrophic catastrophic [ __ ] that can go wrong with agentic AI, [ __ ] that can go wrong with agentic AI, [ __ ] that can go wrong with agentic AI, you are a dangerous company. you are a dangerous company. you are a dangerous company. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> You are a effing disaster waiting to >> You are a effing disaster waiting to >> You are a effing disaster waiting to happen. No, I'll say it straight up happen. No, I'll say it straight up happen. No, I'll say it straight up because you know this whole mythos because you know this whole mythos because you know this whole mythos problem is not something that problem is not something that problem is not something that mythos created. The threat actors have mythos created. The threat actors have mythos created. The threat actors have been working on this these discovery been working on this these discovery been working on this these discovery tools for a long time, probably 2 years.

tools for a long time, probably 2 years. tools for a long time, probably 2 years. And so the threat that you know, we're And so the threat that you know, we're And so the threat that you know, we're already seeing banks, financial already seeing banks, financial already seeing banks, financial any trusted institution [ __ ] their any trusted institution [ __ ] their any trusted institution [ __ ] their pants right now and you notice that they pants right now and you notice that they pants right now and you notice that they don't trust you. You notice it. don't trust you. You notice it. don't trust you. You notice it. You know, they're putting all kinds of You know, they're putting all kinds of You know, they're putting all kinds of measures to like offload measures to like offload measures to like offload accountability and responsibility accountability and responsibility accountability and responsibility of their business onto you. of their business onto you. of their business onto you. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Right? >> Right? >> Right? >> I did it. I did it. >> I did it. I did it. >> I did it. I did it. >> with Zell, right? Are you sure you want >> with Zell, right? Are you sure you want >> with Zell, right? Are you sure you want to send these people to send these people to send these people >> Oh, right. You sure you want to send >> Oh, right. You sure you want to send >> Oh, right. You sure you want to send that money to that person? that money to that person? that money to that person? >> goes, yes. Are you double sure? Is this >> goes, yes. Are you double sure? Is this >> goes, yes. Are you double sure? Is this >> Well, I I did that I did a transfer >> Well, I I did that I did a transfer >> Well, I I did that I did a transfer recently. Actually, it was to recently. Actually, it was to recently. Actually, it was to I don't remember if it was Zell or which I don't remember if it was Zell or which I don't remember if it was Zell or which one or one or one or to a to a contractor. I don't to a to a contractor. I don't to a to a contractor. I don't I had to do some work on my house in I had to do some work on my house in I had to do some work on my house in Seattle. Seattle. Seattle. And I mean, it came up with a verbiage And I mean, it came up with a verbiage And I mean, it came up with a verbiage along the lines of if you make this along the lines of if you make this along the lines of if you make this Yeah, it did the same thing to you. Are Yeah, it did the same thing to you. Are Yeah, it did the same thing to you. Are you sure? Are you sure? Are you sure? you sure? Are you sure? Are you sure? you sure? Are you sure? Are you sure? And the final bit was in making this And the final bit was in making this And the final bit was in making this transaction, you fully accept that you transaction, you fully accept that you transaction, you fully accept that you are 100% responsible and if the money is are 100% responsible and if the money is are 100% responsible and if the money is is going to someone who's a fraud this is going to someone who's a fraud this is going to someone who's a fraud this is fraudulent, it's on you completely.

is fraudulent, it's on you completely. is fraudulent, it's on you completely. Because like you said, because the Because like you said, because the Because like you said, because the bank's like you know, and you know damn bank's like you know, and you know damn bank's like you know, and you know damn well I mean, I've had we've all had well I mean, I've had we've all had well I mean, I've had we've all had instances where you know, fraudulent instances where you know, fraudulent instances where you know, fraudulent transactions have taken place on transactions have taken place on transactions have taken place on accounts, you know, we've all been accounts, you know, we've all been accounts, you know, we've all been through that experience now and through that experience now and through that experience now and experienced the very poor way in which experienced the very poor way in which experienced the very poor way in which financial institutions generally financial institutions generally financial institutions generally respond. They generally respond with I respond. They generally respond with I respond. They generally respond with I mean, someone emptied one of my bank mean, someone emptied one of my bank mean, someone emptied one of my bank accounts before Christmas. accounts before Christmas. accounts before Christmas. Took several thousand dollars out from Took several thousand dollars out from Took several thousand dollars out from an ATM in one setting. They took 27 cash an ATM in one setting. They took 27 cash an ATM in one setting. They took 27 cash withdrawals from one ATM in a bank foyer withdrawals from one ATM in a bank foyer withdrawals from one ATM in a bank foyer no less. no less. no less. >> Oh. >> Oh. >> Oh. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> You know, and bank was like their first >> You know, and bank was like their first >> You know, and bank was like their first their first reaction was well it's not their first reaction was well it's not their first reaction was well it's not not our problem till I pointed out yeah not our problem till I pointed out yeah not our problem till I pointed out yeah some some basic realities under consumer some some basic realities under consumer some some basic realities under consumer credit protection. credit protection. credit protection. Um but now I mean with those extra extra Um but now I mean with those extra extra Um but now I mean with those extra extra kind of pieces of documentation in place kind of pieces of documentation in place kind of pieces of documentation in place you know full well that that's that's you know full well that that's that's you know full well that that's that's the fallback. Well, yeah I mean okay the fallback. Well, yeah I mean okay the fallback. Well, yeah I mean okay there is consumer financial protection there is consumer financial protection there is consumer financial protection but you basically signed something that but you basically signed something that but you basically signed something that said you take full responsibility. said you take full responsibility. said you take full responsibility. >> It's it it because the car the the the >> It's it it because the car the the the >> It's it it because the car the the the level of fraud is through the roof.

level of fraud is through the roof. level of fraud is through the roof. Uh and you know, maybe the banks aren't Uh and you know, maybe the banks aren't Uh and you know, maybe the banks aren't fully disclosing the scale of the fraud fully disclosing the scale of the fraud fully disclosing the scale of the fraud that they're being hit with that they're being hit with that they're being hit with but but but >> I have a I have a friend locally who is >> I have a I have a friend locally who is >> I have a I have a friend locally who is a detective who is a detective with the a detective who is a detective with the a detective who is a detective with the local local police force and he said to local local police force and he said to local local police force and he said to me 65-70% of the work that he's doing at me 65-70% of the work that he's doing at me 65-70% of the work that he's doing at the moment is to do with bank fraud. the moment is to do with bank fraud. the moment is to do with bank fraud. >> Oh wow. >> Oh wow. >> Oh wow. And then um what I oh, And then um what I oh, And then um what I oh, it's just it's just it's just >> the resolution rate is sub sub 5%. >> the resolution rate is sub sub 5%. >> the resolution rate is sub sub 5%. >> You know what the crazy thing is >> You know what the crazy thing is >> You know what the crazy thing is the banks don't even trust the banks don't even trust the banks don't even trust um um um doing a money transfer doing a money transfer doing a money transfer between myself and myself. between myself and myself. between myself and myself. >> [laughter] >> Are you sure you trust yourself? >> Are you sure you trust yourself? >> I love it when you [laughter] said >> I love it when you [laughter] said >> I love it when you [laughter] said myself and myself I instantly went to myself and myself I instantly went to myself and myself I instantly went to Austin Powers. Allow myself to introduce Austin Powers. Allow myself to introduce Austin Powers. Allow myself to introduce myself. myself. myself. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Hey, I know we're wrapping up here. Did >> Hey, I know we're wrapping up here. Did >> Hey, I know we're wrapping up here. Did you guys see you mentioned Jensen and you guys see you mentioned Jensen and you guys see you mentioned Jensen and we're Did you see we're Did you see we're Did you see the new chip they came out with for PCs the new chip they came out with for PCs the new chip they came out with for PCs for laptops? Holy [ __ ] for laptops? Holy [ __ ] for laptops? Holy [ __ ] I mean that's that's legit.

I mean that's that's legit. I mean that's that's legit. >> M1 Ultra. >> M1 Ultra. >> M1 Ultra. >> Well, I mean but I think this is the >> Well, I mean but I think this is the >> Well, I mean but I think this is the injection that Microsoft probably needs injection that Microsoft probably needs injection that Microsoft probably needs for Windows. You know, I mean you're for Windows. You know, I mean you're for Windows. You know, I mean you're right we saw Jensen do it at Computex right we saw Jensen do it at Computex right we saw Jensen do it at Computex and then he came on with Satya at Build and then he came on with Satya at Build and then he came on with Satya at Build and and and you know, there is some old love for you know, there is some old love for you know, there is some old love for Microsoft and Jensen and it's because he Microsoft and Jensen and it's because he Microsoft and Jensen and it's because he was building graphics cards for DOS and was building graphics cards for DOS and was building graphics cards for DOS and Windows games and I think that kind of Windows games and I think that kind of Windows games and I think that kind of stayed with them over the years and stayed with them over the years and stayed with them over the years and and so the fact that they've been and so the fact that they've been and so the fact that they've been working on this thing, I mean, as soon working on this thing, I mean, as soon working on this thing, I mean, as soon as they announced that chip and said, as they announced that chip and said, as they announced that chip and said, you know, and it giving unified memory you know, and it giving unified memory you know, and it giving unified memory to Windows, which it's never had before. to Windows, which it's never had before. to Windows, which it's never had before. >> Yeah, I know. >> Yeah, I know. >> Yeah, I know. >> But like a Mac has and it's just insane >> But like a Mac has and it's just insane >> But like a Mac has and it's just insane performance and it's like Satya is like, performance and it's like Satya is like, performance and it's like Satya is like, it's like a data center on your desktop, it's like a data center on your desktop, it's like a data center on your desktop, you know, and it's you know, you know, you know, and it's you know, you know, you know, and it's you know, you know, all the stuff we talked about how you do all the stuff we talked about how you do all the stuff we talked about how you do private AI, I'm not wasting tokens and private AI, I'm not wasting tokens and private AI, I'm not wasting tokens and spending money, it's right here. spending money, it's right here. spending money, it's right here. That's I think that's a big thing. Um That's I think that's a big thing. Um That's I think that's a big thing. Um >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And obviously and you saw Intel, >> And obviously and you saw Intel, >> And obviously and you saw Intel, Qualcomm and AMD stock just dropped like Qualcomm and AMD stock just dropped like Qualcomm and AMD stock just dropped like a rock as soon as Jensen showed up to a rock as soon as Jensen showed up to a rock as soon as Jensen showed up to the party and said, yeah, I'm going to the party and said, yeah, I'm going to the party and said, yeah, I'm going to go after that $200 PC chip CPU TAM. And go after that $200 PC chip CPU TAM. And go after that $200 PC chip CPU TAM. And I'm going to take it from all of you I'm going to take it from all of you I'm going to take it from all of you guys cuz guess what? We're smarter than guys cuz guess what? We're smarter than guys cuz guess what? We're smarter than you are.

you are. you are. >> Yeah, but you know what? Last year they >> Yeah, but you know what? Last year they >> Yeah, but you know what? Last year they came out with GB10 came out with GB10 came out with GB10 um um um other than being sort of like a desktop other than being sort of like a desktop other than being sort of like a desktop novelty, you didn't really see that novelty, you didn't really see that novelty, you didn't really see that um um um make a huge shift. Yeah, sure a lot of make a huge shift. Yeah, sure a lot of make a huge shift. Yeah, sure a lot of people were saying, uh doesn't have people were saying, uh doesn't have people were saying, uh doesn't have Windows support but um Windows support but um Windows support but um >> And that's when he went he went out of >> And that's when he went he went out of >> And that's when he went he went out of his way to say, it works with every his way to say, it works with every his way to say, it works with every Windows program ever. Windows program ever. Windows program ever. >> We'll see. We'll see. >> We'll see. We'll see. >> We'll see. We'll see. >> We'll see. >> We'll see. >> We'll see. >> a total I think it's obviously >> a total I think it's obviously >> a total I think it's obviously using Windows on ARM. using Windows on ARM. using Windows on ARM. >> He got up on stage and said, Nemo claw >> He got up on stage and said, Nemo claw >> He got up on stage and said, Nemo claw claw is claw is claw is uh enterprise grade. It's not. Um and so uh enterprise grade. It's not. Um and so uh enterprise grade. It's not. Um and so again, with him, I seriously, grain of again, with him, I seriously, grain of again, with him, I seriously, grain of salt. salt. salt. Uh prove it. Um Uh prove it. Um Uh prove it. Um >> And we're working with MediaTek is >> And we're working with MediaTek is >> And we're working with MediaTek is actually building the chip. actually building the chip. actually building the chip. >> Yeah. I mean, I'll I'll tell you right >> Yeah. I mean, I'll I'll tell you right >> Yeah. I mean, I'll I'll tell you right now, there's a lot of other stuff that's now, there's a lot of other stuff that's now, there's a lot of other stuff that's gotten a lot of high buzz in the past 7 gotten a lot of high buzz in the past 7 gotten a lot of high buzz in the past 7 months that are nowhere near months that are nowhere near months that are nowhere near what those guys are talking about in what those guys are talking about in what those guys are talking about in terms of excitement, uptake, and terms of excitement, uptake, and terms of excitement, uptake, and feasibility. People don't know this feasibility. People don't know this feasibility. People don't know this because they don't do what I do.

because they don't do what I do. because they don't do what I do. >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> But I will tell you, I will give you a >> But I will tell you, I will give you a >> But I will tell you, I will give you a the cliff note version. the cliff note version. the cliff note version. It It's not happening the way that that It It's not happening the way that that It It's not happening the way that that people think. people think. people think. >> We'll be able to find out for sure this >> We'll be able to find out for sure this >> We'll be able to find out for sure this fall because Dell and Lenovo and fall because Dell and Lenovo and fall because Dell and Lenovo and everybody's HP's coming out with laptops everybody's HP's coming out with laptops everybody's HP's coming out with laptops and things based on this chip. So, we'll and things based on this chip. So, we'll and things based on this chip. So, we'll be able to see for ourselves. be able to see for ourselves. be able to see for ourselves. Yeah. It's going to be the most Yeah. It's going to be the most Yeah. It's going to be the most expensive PC you've ever bought in your expensive PC you've ever bought in your expensive PC you've ever bought in your life. life. life. >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> I mean, I heard numbers floated around >> I mean, I heard numbers floated around >> I mean, I heard numbers floated around like $4,800. like $4,800. like $4,800. You know, 128 gig of unified memory. You know, 128 gig of unified memory. You know, 128 gig of unified memory. >> How many people are going to buy a chip? >> How many people are going to buy a chip? >> How many people are going to buy a chip? I mean, it's going to be like the Vision I mean, it's going to be like the Vision I mean, it's going to be like the Vision Pro. How many people are going to buy Pro. How many people are going to buy Pro. How many people are going to buy it? Um it? Um it? Um >> Yeah, it's like I can run a 1 trillion >> Yeah, it's like I can run a 1 trillion >> Yeah, it's like I can run a 1 trillion parameter LLM on my lap desktop with parameter LLM on my lap desktop with parameter LLM on my lap desktop with this thing. this thing. this thing. >> I wonder how much of that boom is going >> I wonder how much of that boom is going >> I wonder how much of that boom is going to Jensen. to Jensen. to Jensen. >> You know? >> You know? >> You know? >> Well, you know, but you have to you have >> Well, you know, but you have to you have >> Well, you know, but you have to you have to also consider the fact that everyone to also consider the fact that everyone to also consider the fact that everyone is talking about the Mac Mini. is talking about the Mac Mini. is talking about the Mac Mini. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Cuz they need it. Yeah. >> Cuz they need it. Yeah. >> Cuz they need it. Yeah. >> And maybe this is just one of those >> And maybe this is just one of those >> And maybe this is just one of those reactive things that they had to put out reactive things that they had to put out reactive things that they had to put out there. Yeah, sure it was on the there. Yeah, sure it was on the there. Yeah, sure it was on the >> Let's say hypothetically, Leonard, >> Let's say hypothetically, Leonard, >> Let's say hypothetically, Leonard, hypothetically, let's say it succeeds.

hypothetically, let's say it succeeds. hypothetically, let's say it succeeds. Let's say it really pulls it off and all Let's say it really pulls it off and all Let's say it really pulls it off and all of a sudden now you can have desktops, of a sudden now you can have desktops, of a sudden now you can have desktops, laptops, dedicated, offline laptops, dedicated, offline laptops, dedicated, offline supercomputer data center like deals. supercomputer data center like deals. supercomputer data center like deals. I get there's I'm glossing over a lot of I get there's I'm glossing over a lot of I get there's I'm glossing over a lot of things. How does that impact all the things. How does that impact all the things. How does that impact all the hyperscalers who've spent hyperscalers who've spent hyperscalers who've spent hundreds of billions, getting close to hundreds of billions, getting close to hundreds of billions, getting close to trillions on building all this trillions on building all this trillions on building all this infrastructure, and now all of a sudden infrastructure, and now all of a sudden infrastructure, and now all of a sudden I can go down to I can go down to I can go down to Fry's Electronics, rest in peace, and Fry's Electronics, rest in peace, and Fry's Electronics, rest in peace, and pick [laughter] up my own data center pick [laughter] up my own data center pick [laughter] up my own data center and have it on my desktop, and I'm not and have it on my desktop, and I'm not and have it on my desktop, and I'm not going to use AWS or Azure or Google. I going to use AWS or Azure or Google. I going to use AWS or Azure or Google. I can do it right here. can do it right here. can do it right here. >> I think it's it's a lot more complicated >> I think it's it's a lot more complicated >> I think it's it's a lot more complicated The answer is a lot more complicated The answer is a lot more complicated The answer is a lot more complicated than that. than that. than that. >> Sure it is, but >> Sure it is, but >> Sure it is, but >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> generally speaking >> generally speaking >> generally speaking >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> That could happen. >> That could happen. >> That could happen. >> inference >> inference >> inference >> If people really cracked the nut on you >> If people really cracked the nut on you >> If people really cracked the nut on you know, proper neuromorphic computing. I know, proper neuromorphic computing. I know, proper neuromorphic computing. I think that that you know, that that think that that you know, that that think that that you know, that that whole kind of concept of well, you know, whole kind of concept of well, you know, whole kind of concept of well, you know, if you look at the way LLMs are built, if you look at the way LLMs are built, if you look at the way LLMs are built, that's like the sledgehammer approach to that's like the sledgehammer approach to that's like the sledgehammer approach to the world. How How is it that a mouse's the world. How How is it that a mouse's the world. How How is it that a mouse's brain is able to go through you know, a brain is able to go through you know, a brain is able to go through you know, a decision-making process for the nearest decision-making process for the nearest decision-making process for the nearest fraction of a of a of a nanowatt, you fraction of a of a of a nanowatt, you fraction of a of a of a nanowatt, you know, to get to get to a an answer. And know, to get to get to a an answer. And know, to get to get to a an answer. And never mind a human brain. If people can never mind a human brain. If people can never mind a human brain. If people can figure out If we can figure out actually figure out If we can figure out actually figure out If we can figure out actually how to take that model and and replicate how to take that model and and replicate how to take that model and and replicate that model it that model it that model it >> then you're right, Robert. I mean I mean >> then you're right, Robert. I mean I mean >> then you're right, Robert. I mean I mean I think I think I think >> the size of Manhattan starts to look >> the size of Manhattan starts to look >> the size of Manhattan starts to look like, you know, the great white whale. I like, you know, the great white whale. I like, you know, the great white whale. I mean it's it's kind of like

mean it's it's kind of like mean it's it's kind of like >> Yeah. And the bad bets are already >> Yeah. And the bad bets are already >> Yeah. And the bad bets are already happening with AI infrastructure. And happening with AI infrastructure. And happening with AI infrastructure. And and the the the whole idea that oh, you and the the the whole idea that oh, you and the the the whole idea that oh, you know, generation after generation it's know, generation after generation it's know, generation after generation it's going to be everything on the same road going to be everything on the same road going to be everything on the same road map, you know, the data center map, you know, the data center map, you know, the data center architecture and the layout's going TO architecture and the layout's going TO architecture and the layout's going TO BE THE BE THE BE THE NO! NO! NO! TOTALLY NOT LIKE THAT. And and you know, TOTALLY NOT LIKE THAT. And and you know, TOTALLY NOT LIKE THAT. And and you know, that's where you have to give Satya that's where you have to give Satya that's where you have to give Satya kudos because at least he was honest. kudos because at least he was honest. kudos because at least he was honest. Like yeah, we're being very careful. Like yeah, we're being very careful. Like yeah, we're being very careful. We're going to spread it out and we're We're going to spread it out and we're We're going to spread it out and we're going to let other people take on the going to let other people take on the going to let other people take on the risk. risk. risk. >> I mean this is like IBM in the '70s >> I mean this is like IBM in the '70s >> I mean this is like IBM in the '70s probably saying it's going to be probably saying it's going to be probably saying it's going to be mainframes forever. What's this PC mainframes forever. What's this PC mainframes forever. What's this PC thing? Uh you know, thing? Uh you know, thing? Uh you know, oh [laughter] [ __ ] Oh, and then it's oh [laughter] [ __ ] Oh, and then it's oh [laughter] [ __ ] Oh, and then it's and then we're going to swing to cloud and then we're going to swing to cloud and then we're going to swing to cloud and mobile. Now we need data centers the and mobile. Now we need data centers the and mobile. Now we need data centers the size of Manhattan. Oh, what is that size of Manhattan. Oh, what is that size of Manhattan. Oh, what is that little chip there that's like a little chip there that's like a little chip there that's like a supercomputer on my desktop? Oh, [ __ ] supercomputer on my desktop? Oh, [ __ ] supercomputer on my desktop? Oh, [ __ ] And it swings back again. And it swings back again. And it swings back again. You know, all of a sudden my compact You know, all of a sudden my compact You know, all of a sudden my compact Deskpro is running a 1 trillion Deskpro is running a 1 trillion Deskpro is running a 1 trillion parameter LLM and um parameter LLM and um parameter LLM and um suck it mainframes and giant data suck it mainframes and giant data suck it mainframes and giant data centers. Sorry you blew all that cash centers. Sorry you blew all that cash centers. Sorry you blew all that cash and laid off all your employees.

and laid off all your employees. and laid off all your employees. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Yeah, exactly. I mean, you know, people >> Yeah, exactly. I mean, you know, people >> Yeah, exactly. I mean, you know, people are still are still are still FA-ing and FO-ing. I think we need more FA-ing and FO-ing. I think we need more FA-ing and FO-ing. I think we need more people who are um people who are um people who are um have a have a have a F F F O O O U U U fear of [ __ ] up. There's not enough fear of [ __ ] up. There's not enough fear of [ __ ] up. There's not enough of that out there, right? There's too of that out there, right? There's too of that out there, right? There's too much of like FOMO and FA and FO. much of like FOMO and FA and FO. much of like FOMO and FA and FO. Uh yeah, and I I actually Uh yeah, and I I actually Uh yeah, and I I actually >> Yeah, you should write like a 50-page >> Yeah, you should write like a 50-page >> Yeah, you should write like a 50-page report on that. report on that. report on that. >> Fear of [ __ ] up. >> Fear of [ __ ] up. >> Fear of [ __ ] up. >> existential threat that's perceived is >> existential threat that's perceived is >> existential threat that's perceived is not keeping up. Whereas the existential not keeping up. Whereas the existential not keeping up. Whereas the existential threat that actually is probably the threat that actually is probably the threat that actually is probably the more real one is that, you know, a a more real one is that, you know, a a more real one is that, you know, a a company you know, a terminal event. You company you know, a terminal event. You company you know, a terminal event. You know, if and I think that Microsoft and know, if and I think that Microsoft and know, if and I think that Microsoft and the the larger companies with, you know, the the larger companies with, you know, the the larger companies with, you know, large large shareholder bases and big large large shareholder bases and big large large shareholder bases and big market caps to worry about, they're market caps to worry about, they're market caps to worry about, they're probably more focused on the second probably more focused on the second probably more focused on the second scenario where, you know, if we release scenario where, you know, if we release scenario where, you know, if we release something that that causes, you know, something that that causes, you know, something that that causes, you know, mayhem then we're done as a company. mayhem then we're done as a company. mayhem then we're done as a company. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So the smaller companies don't have >> So the smaller companies don't have >> So the smaller companies don't have that. And so that. And so that. And so they they have no incentive to be they they have no incentive to be they they have no incentive to be cautious.

cautious. cautious. >> And all the companies out there, I just >> And all the companies out there, I just >> And all the companies out there, I just want to say is because want to say is because want to say is because you know, the OpenAI guy who apparently you know, the OpenAI guy who apparently you know, the OpenAI guy who apparently is a really good security dude, got up is a really good security dude, got up is a really good security dude, got up on stage and said um effectively said on stage and said um effectively said on stage and said um effectively said that, you know, we're we need to that, you know, we're we need to that, you know, we're we need to cultivate these cultivate these cultivate these um blameless companies. um blameless companies. um blameless companies. [ __ ] no. [ __ ] no. [ __ ] no. If someone screws up, there has to be If someone screws up, there has to be If someone screws up, there has to be accountability. accountability. accountability. When it comes to security, it's all When it comes to security, it's all When it comes to security, it's all about accountability. Half of what about accountability. Half of what about accountability. Half of what everyone's trying to do with enterprise everyone's trying to do with enterprise everyone's trying to do with enterprise grade is to create that trace to who's grade is to create that trace to who's grade is to create that trace to who's accountable. accountable. accountable. It's not about, oh well, you know, we're It's not about, oh well, you know, we're It's not about, oh well, you know, we're going to be all going to be all going to be all and if you we're going to just, you and if you we're going to just, you and if you we're going to just, you know, be a team block. You know, you know, be a team block. You know, you know, be a team block. You know, you need a fear of [ __ ] up need a fear of [ __ ] up need a fear of [ __ ] up because when you [ __ ] up because when you [ __ ] up because when you [ __ ] up in this agentic age, it's going to have in this agentic age, it's going to have in this agentic age, it's going to have consequences. You're not absolved from consequences. You're not absolved from consequences. You're not absolved from it. And so this mentality, if you you're it. And so this mentality, if you you're it. And so this mentality, if you you're one of our listeners and you have a one of our listeners and you have a one of our listeners and you have a company, do not base your culture on company, do not base your culture on company, do not base your culture on faultless faultless faultless you know, [clears throat] blameless, you know, [clears throat] blameless, you know, [clears throat] blameless, blah, blah, blah.

blah, blah, blah. blah, blah, blah. We need accountability more than ever We need accountability more than ever We need accountability more than ever because if without accountability, there because if without accountability, there because if without accountability, there is no trust. is no trust. is no trust. Right? And that was the other big theme Right? And that was the other big theme Right? And that was the other big theme at Cisco Live. It's how are we going to at Cisco Live. It's how are we going to at Cisco Live. It's how are we going to trust things? But then when you have trust things? But then when you have trust things? But then when you have like these guys talking about no one's like these guys talking about no one's like these guys talking about no one's to blame to blame to blame how are you going to trust that guy? how are you going to trust that guy? how are you going to trust that guy? How are you going to trust that How are you going to trust that How are you going to trust that organization that doesn't hold anybody organization that doesn't hold anybody organization that doesn't hold anybody in their organization accountable for in their organization accountable for in their organization accountable for anything? anything? anything? So they screw up on you they screw up So they screw up on you they screw up So they screw up on you they screw up the service, they jack up your business the service, they jack up your business the service, they jack up your business and they're going to go, "Well, you and they're going to go, "Well, you and they're going to go, "Well, you know, let's not blame each other." Uh >> What? >> What? >> I mean, you know, this Silicon Valley, >> I mean, you know, this Silicon Valley, >> I mean, you know, this Silicon Valley, you know, twisted mentality is just so you know, twisted mentality is just so you know, twisted mentality is just so toxic. It's it's unbelievable. And then toxic. It's it's unbelievable. And then toxic. It's it's unbelievable. And then you know, a lot of the these guys you know, a lot of the these guys you know, a lot of the these guys the vendor leaders they're drinking this the vendor leaders they're drinking this the vendor leaders they're drinking this nonsense and it's going to be nonsense and it's going to be nonsense and it's going to be detrimental to their business. detrimental to their business. detrimental to their business. >> Basically when they wipe out all of >> Basically when they wipe out all of >> Basically when they wipe out all of civilization, someone's going to just civilization, someone's going to just civilization, someone's going to just say say say >> Like, "Oh, yeah." >> Like, "Oh, yeah." >> Like, "Oh, yeah." >> It's like, you know, it's like that >> It's like, you know, it's like that >> It's like, you know, it's like that Howard Jones song, "No one is to blame, Howard Jones song, "No one is to blame, Howard Jones song, "No one is to blame, you know, we're good. We're good."

you know, we're good. We're good." you know, we're good. We're good." >> Yeah, I mean that that like really >> Yeah, I mean that that like really >> Yeah, I mean that that like really was upsetting to hear. And um that kind was upsetting to hear. And um that kind was upsetting to hear. And um that kind of stuff just needs to be flat out shut of stuff just needs to be flat out shut of stuff just needs to be flat out shut down. Yeah, I mean down. Yeah, I mean down. Yeah, I mean >> how many of the most relevant important >> how many of the most relevant important >> how many of the most relevant important engineers from Open AI are still there? engineers from Open AI are still there? engineers from Open AI are still there? All the major ones have all left because All the major ones have all left because All the major ones have all left because they don't trust Sam Altman as far as they don't trust Sam Altman as far as they don't trust Sam Altman as far as they can throw him. they can throw him. they can throw him. For real. They all left. All the other For real. They all left. All the other For real. They all left. All the other big player they all were there together big player they all were there together big player they all were there together and then Dario and his sister leaves and and then Dario and his sister leaves and and then Dario and his sister leaves and their CTO, she's doing her I mean, so their CTO, she's doing her I mean, so their CTO, she's doing her I mean, so many have left cuz they're like Sam many have left cuz they're like Sam many have left cuz they're like Sam doesn't care about security. Sam doesn't doesn't care about security. Sam doesn't doesn't care about security. Sam doesn't care you know, care you know, care you know, Sam's got a different Sam's got a different Sam's got a different >> blah blah blah. >> blah blah blah. >> blah blah blah. >> Sam's got a different kind of you know >> Sam's got a different kind of you know >> Sam's got a different kind of you know what kind of person Sam is. what kind of person Sam is. what kind of person Sam is. >> They're not the only company. There's a >> They're not the only company. There's a >> They're not the only company. There's a lot of companies that have ditched their lot of companies that have ditched their lot of companies that have ditched their ethics, you know, boards and review you ethics, you know, boards and review you ethics, you know, boards and review you know know know and they they've thrown governance out and they they've thrown governance out and they they've thrown governance out the window and I think companies out the window and I think companies out the window and I think companies out there, buyers should use that as a there, buyers should use that as a there, buyers should use that as a measure of of you know, what kind of measure of of you know, what kind of measure of of you know, what kind of trust you can actually trust you can actually trust you can actually impart on these these guys, you know, or impart on these these guys, you know, or impart on these these guys, you know, or hold their feet to the fire because it's hold their feet to the fire because it's hold their feet to the fire because it's it's going in the wrong direction. And it's going in the wrong direction. And it's going in the wrong direction. And this post mythos mythos era man, things this post mythos mythos era man, things this post mythos mythos era man, things are about to get really really scary are about to get really really scary are about to get really really scary whether you like it or not.

whether you like it or not. whether you like it or not. >> It's Friday again. >> It's Friday again. >> It's Friday again. >> Huh? >> Huh? >> Huh? >> Back to the Friday again. >> Back to the Friday again. >> Back to the Friday again. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Oh my god, I know. >> Oh my god, I know. >> Oh my god, I know. >> Sorry. >> Sorry. >> Sorry. >> You're going to get depressed watching >> You're going to get depressed watching >> You're going to get depressed watching this. I mean it's this. I mean it's this. I mean it's >> Yeah. All right, it's time for the >> Yeah. All right, it's time for the >> Yeah. All right, it's time for the weekend. LET'S GO HAVE SOME FUN. I'M weekend. LET'S GO HAVE SOME FUN. I'M weekend. LET'S GO HAVE SOME FUN. I'M GOING TO GO OUT TO THE COUNTRY and keep GOING TO GO OUT TO THE COUNTRY and keep GOING TO GO OUT TO THE COUNTRY and keep working on my bomb shelter and my my working on my bomb shelter and my my working on my bomb shelter and my my bunker. I'm going to buy more rounds of bunker. I'm going to buy more rounds of bunker. I'm going to buy more rounds of 50 caliber shells for my guns around the 50 caliber shells for my guns around the 50 caliber shells for my guns around the perimeter. Yeah, and that's what perimeter. Yeah, and that's what perimeter. Yeah, and that's what everyone's doing. everyone's doing. everyone's doing. >> Yeah, AI apocalypse. We need to write >> Yeah, AI apocalypse. We need to write >> Yeah, AI apocalypse. We need to write that book. that book. that book. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Anyway. >> Anyway. >> Anyway. >> I think that's being written as we >> I think that's being written as we >> I think that's being written as we speak. speak. speak. >> Hey AI people, save AI, be responsible. >> Hey AI people, save AI, be responsible. >> Hey AI people, save AI, be responsible. >> There you go. >> There you go. >> There you go. >> Good. >> Good. >> Good. >> All right, everybody, thanks for joining >> All right, everybody, thanks for joining >> All right, everybody, thanks for joining us on this wonderful, delightful, upbeat us on this wonderful, delightful, upbeat us on this wonderful, delightful, upbeat episode of IoT Coffee Talk. episode of IoT Coffee Talk. episode of IoT Coffee Talk. >> My fault. >> My fault. >> My fault. >> All [laughter] his fault. >> All [laughter] his fault. >> All [laughter] his fault. >> We're we're not to blame on this. >> We're we're not to blame on this. >> We're we're not to blame on this. >> Absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> You need to take the happy pills on >> You need to take the happy pills on >> You need to take the happy pills on Friday morning, Leonard. Friday morning, Leonard. Friday morning, Leonard. >> I had caffeine. >> I had caffeine. >> I had caffeine. >> Yeah, it was great to see Stephanie >> Yeah, it was great to see Stephanie >> Yeah, it was great to see Stephanie today, you know.

today, you know. today, you know. >> Hey. >> Hey. >> Hey. >> Hey, you know, 21 years of her analyst >> Hey, you know, 21 years of her analyst >> Hey, you know, 21 years of her analyst firm, that's great stuff, man. firm, that's great stuff, man. firm, that's great stuff, man. Anyways, it's great hanging out with all Anyways, it's great hanging out with all Anyways, it's great hanging out with all you guys. you guys. you guys. >> They >> They >> They >> Remember, elevate communities. It's >> Remember, elevate communities. It's >> Remember, elevate communities. It's happening. Stephanie's the source. happening. Stephanie's the source. happening. Stephanie's the source. Kind of like in The Matrix, you got to Kind of like in The Matrix, you got to Kind of like in The Matrix, you got to find the source, talk to the architect. find the source, talk to the architect. find the source, talk to the architect. Anyway, it's all happening, and we're Anyway, it's all happening, and we're Anyway, it's all happening, and we're going to see you next week, and it'll be going to see you next week, and it'll be going to see you next week, and it'll be delightful. Have a positive, upbeat, fun delightful. Have a positive, upbeat, fun delightful. Have a positive, upbeat, fun weekend. We're out.