IoT Coffee Talk: Episode 334 - "Who is Your Industry Death Star?" (Disruption in Hype's Clothing)

Not even... Not even... Yes. Yes. I like the fact that you have a I like the fact that you have a delay in the middle, so if you... I do delay in the middle, so if you... I do n't know what's wrong with you, but with all of n't know what's wrong with you, but with all of n't know what's wrong with you, but with all of you, I think you were still for you, I think you were still for you, I think you were still for a while and then... It's very a while and then... It's very a while and then... It's very impressive. impressive. Yes, that's why you need it to be symmetrical. What was that? Down. What was that? Down. What was that? What was that? What was that? 50 times because things are 50 times because things are 50 times because things are getting crazy. It getting crazy. It getting crazy. It was 5150, huh? was 5150, huh? was 5150, huh? Yes, I thought you needed... Yes, I thought you needed... Yes, I thought you needed... You know, IBM had a machine called the You know, IBM had a machine called the You know, IBM had a machine called the 5150. Probably the first PC 5150. Probably the first PC 5150. Probably the first PC ever. The IBM PC was a 5150. And it ever. The IBM PC was a 5150. And it ever. The IBM PC was a 5150. And it 's great to see Andrea back on the 's great to see Andrea back on the 's great to see Andrea back on the show. It's been great seeing you. show. It's been great seeing you. show. It's been great seeing you. Hello. Hello. How's it going? I'm How's it going? I'm How's it going? I'm glad to see you too. glad to see you too. Have you returned to Dallas? Have you returned to the Have you returned to Dallas? Have you returned to the Have you returned to Dallas? Have you returned to the field? field? field? Back in Dallas, to my office. Back in Dallas, to my office. Back in Dallas, to my office. Okay. Okay. Okay. Um, you know, back to IoT Coffee Um, you know, back to IoT Coffee Um, you know, back to IoT Coffee Talk. Talk. Yes. Yes. For a good reason. For one reason. It For a good reason. For one reason. It For a good reason. For one reason. It 's not a coincidence. Yes. I have to...

's not a coincidence. Yes. I have to... 's not a coincidence. Yes. I have to... Yes. It's not a coincidence. It's Yes. It's not a coincidence. It's Yes. It's not a coincidence. It's been on my agenda all this time been on my agenda all this time . I don't think I've been here for . I don't think I've been here for . I don't think I've been here for the last year or two. Maybe the last year or two. Maybe the last year or two. Maybe two years. two years. two years. Yes. It's been a while. Yes. It's been a while. Yes. It's been a while. But it stayed on my agenda. But it stayed on my agenda. But it stayed on my agenda. Yes. Yes. Yes. And I had this mental tic every And I had this mental tic every And I had this mental tic every Friday. Yes. They're meeting now. Yes. They're Friday. Yes. They're meeting now. Yes. They're Friday. Yes. They're meeting now. Yes. They're meeting now. Whatever is happening in meeting now. Whatever is happening in meeting now. Whatever is happening in the world, I'm not kidding you. the world, I'm not kidding you. the world, I'm not kidding you. Because you've been all over the world. I Because you've been all over the world. I Because you've been all over the world. I follow you on Facebook. You've been follow you on Facebook. You've been follow you on Facebook. You've been everywhere, you know? And it's quite everywhere, you know? And it's quite everywhere, you know? And it's quite surprising. But you've probably surprising. But you've probably surprising. But you've probably heard this other little voice in the back of heard this other little voice in the back of heard this other little voice in the back of your head saying: I think IoT your head saying: I think IoT your head saying: I think IoT is in fashion again. I think we're going is in fashion again. I think we're going is in fashion again. I think we're going to... I think I heard that the head of to... I think I heard that the head of to... I think I heard that the head of IoT marketing for the IoT Universal IoT marketing for the IoT Universal IoT marketing for the IoT Universal Club now calls it physical AI and it's all the Club now calls it physical AI and it's all the Club now calls it physical AI and it's all the rage. And AI needs that data, and rage. And AI needs that data, and rage. And AI needs that data, and the old becomes new again, and we are a the old becomes new again, and we are a the old becomes new again, and we are a generation of technology that is leaving, and we are back generation of technology that is leaving, and we are back generation of technology that is leaving, and we are back in the black, and in the black, and in the black, and we have the 5150 running with the IBM we have the 5150 running with the IBM we have the 5150 running with the IBM PC. Everything is coming together. Yes. PC. Everything is coming together. Yes. PC. Everything is coming together. Yes. Absolutely. Old school and new Absolutely. Old school and new Absolutely. Old school and new school. What's old is new again.

school. What's old is new again. school. What's old is new again. Yes. Before we started recording, I was Yes. Before we started recording, I was Yes. Before we started recording, I was having a serious conversation with having a serious conversation with having a serious conversation with our fellow panelists about the our fellow panelists about the our fellow panelists about the IBM ThinkPad. I was about to join IBM ThinkPad. I was about to join IBM ThinkPad. I was about to join and I turned it on. It had about 1% and I turned it on. It had about 1% and I turned it on. It had about 1% battery left. So I had to go and find battery left. So I had to go and find battery left. So I had to go and find a small MacBook. But I thought, "Oh, do a small MacBook. But I thought, "Oh, do a small MacBook. But I thought, "Oh, do you use a ThinkPad with that little you use a ThinkPad with that little you use a ThinkPad with that little red bump or something?" This is red bump or something?" This is red bump or something?" This is somewhat unusual, even though the somewhat unusual, even though the somewhat unusual, even though the IBM ThinkPad is the IBM ThinkPad is the IBM ThinkPad is the most successful laptop computer on the most successful laptop computer on the most successful laptop computer on the planet. You just have to look at the planet. You just have to look at the planet. You just have to look at the sales figures. Lenovo is sales figures. Lenovo is sales figures. Lenovo is killing it. killing it. killing it. I'm using it. I'm using it. I'm using it. Yes. And I... And then I just Yes. And I... And then I just Yes. And I... And then I just said, "Well, you know, I don't look said, "Well, you know, I don't look said, "Well, you know, I don't look 25, but I'm not 25 anymore. But anyway, I 25, but I'm not 25 anymore. But anyway, I 25, but I'm not 25 anymore. But anyway, I 've been using the ThinkPad since it 've been using the ThinkPad since it 've been using the ThinkPad since it was the IBM ThinkPad back in the '90s. And back then was the IBM ThinkPad back in the '90s. And back then was the IBM ThinkPad back in the '90s. And back then , there was no consensus , there was no consensus , there was no consensus on how on how on how a mouse was supposed to be used on a laptop. The a mouse was supposed to be used on a laptop. The a mouse was supposed to be used on a laptop. The trackpad wasn't locked yet. trackpad wasn't locked yet. trackpad wasn't locked yet. There were things that clipped onto the There were things that clipped onto the There were things that clipped onto the side of the laptop with side of the laptop with side of the laptop with thumb trackballs. There were thumb trackballs. There were thumb trackballs. There were trackballs in the same trackballs in the same trackballs in the same package. And this little package. And this little package. And this little red bump that the ThinkPad had was a red bump that the ThinkPad had was a red bump that the ThinkPad had was a clever way to keep your clever way to keep your clever way to keep your hand on the keyboard, and then, using your hand on the keyboard, and then, using your hand on the keyboard, and then, using your index finger, you could move the mouse index finger, you could move the mouse index finger, you could move the mouse without having to take your hands off the without having to take your hands off the without having to take your hands off the keyboard. Because all the other keyboard. Because all the other keyboard. Because all the other mechanisms required that... You either use the mechanisms required that... You either use the mechanisms required that... You either use the mouse or you use the keyboard, but you mouse or you use the keyboard, but you mouse or you use the keyboard, but you can never do it at the same time. And can never do it at the same time. And can never do it at the same time. And then I thought it was then I thought it was then I thought it was brilliant engineering on IBM's part. And now there was brilliant engineering on IBM's part. And now there was brilliant engineering on IBM's part. And now there was always that weirdness. Have you ever always that weirdness. Have you ever always that weirdness. Have you ever noticed that sometimes... I don't noticed that sometimes... I don't noticed that sometimes... I don't see it anymore. Sometimes the mouse would get see it anymore. Sometimes the mouse would get see it anymore. Sometimes the mouse would get out of calibration, and all of a sudden, it would start

out of calibration, and all of a sudden, it would start out of calibration, and all of a sudden, it would start flying around." Uncontrolled movement all over the flying around." Uncontrolled movement all over the flying around." Uncontrolled movement all over the screen. You're bringing back PTSD memories. I screen. You're bringing back PTSD memories. I screen. You're bringing back PTSD memories. I had to mentally rehearse had to mentally rehearse had to mentally rehearse putting my hand on the keyboard. Did I use my putting my hand on the keyboard. Did I use my putting my hand on the keyboard. Did I use my thumb or my index finger for that? This is thumb or my index finger for that? This is thumb or my index finger for that? This is the second conversation I've had this the second conversation I've had this the second conversation I've had this week about the IBM ThinkPad Nub. And I just week about the IBM ThinkPad Nub. And I just week about the IBM ThinkPad Nub. And I just want everyone to know there's want everyone to know there's want everyone to know there's a community, a support group, a community, a support group, a community, a support group, because I suffer from PTSD, so because I suffer from PTSD, so because I suffer from PTSD, so we have the Red Nub Club, which is like the we have the Red Nub Club, which is like the we have the Red Nub Club, which is like the Pink Pony Club, but better. And it's for Pink Pony Club, but better. And it's for Pink Pony Club, but better. And it's for people who are recovering from their people who are recovering from their people who are recovering from their ThinkPad. Anyway, I still like it. ThinkPad. Anyway, I still like it. ThinkPad. Anyway, I still like it. I think it's a great laptop I think it's a great laptop I think it's a great laptop . It's not as cool at Starbucks or . It's not as cool at Starbucks or . It's not as cool at Starbucks or Peet's Coffee as having a MacBook. I get it Peet's Coffee as having a MacBook. I get it Peet's Coffee as having a MacBook. I get it . But MacBooks aren't . But MacBooks aren't . But MacBooks aren't as cool as they used to be. Remember as cool as they used to be. Remember as cool as they used to be. Remember when they had the shiny apple on when they had the shiny apple on when they had the shiny apple on the back of the lid and the back of the lid and the back of the lid and people were like, "Oh, you're cool." people were like, "Oh, you're cool." people were like, "Oh, you're cool." You are in San Francisco. Yes. Is You are in San Francisco. Yes. Is there a better name for a laptop there a better name for a laptop there a better name for a laptop than ThinkPad?

than ThinkPad? than ThinkPad? Yes. Yes. Yes. IdeaPad. IdeaPad. Good. Good. Knowledge Pad. Knowledge Pad. Yes. Knowledge Pad. Knowledge Pad. Yes. Knowledge Pad. Knowledge Pad. Yes. Physical AI. Physics AI. Oh, God. Super Physical AI. Physics AI. Oh, God. Super Physical AI. Physics AI. Oh, God. Super physical intelligence. Super physical intelligence. Super physical intelligence. Super physical intelligence. physical intelligence. physical intelligence. Artificial intelligence. Say it out loud. What does Artificial intelligence. Say it out loud. What does Artificial intelligence. Say it out loud. What does that really mean? Oh, Devin that really mean? Oh, Devin that really mean? Oh, Devin will be the worst marketing specialist will be the worst marketing specialist will be the worst marketing specialist in the world. You know, marketing is a in the world. You know, marketing is a in the world. You know, marketing is a No, no, I hired this guy to No, no, I hired this guy to No, no, I hired this guy to create your Well, you know. Obviously, create your Well, you know. Obviously, create your Well, you know. Obviously, we've been hearing a lot about the we've been hearing a lot about the we've been hearing a lot about the different brands. May I ask if different brands. May I ask if different brands. May I ask if you had a large meeting of all the you had a large meeting of all the you had a large meeting of all the top AI technology experts top AI technology experts top AI technology experts in the Oval Office of the in the Oval Office of the in the Oval Office of the White House? The last time. And there was a White House? The last time. And there was a White House? The last time. And there was a lot of talk about that, you know, I know some lot of talk about that, you know, I know some lot of talk about that, you know, I know some of you listen to the of you listen to the of you listen to the All-in podcast and many of those guys were All-in podcast and many of those guys were All-in podcast and many of those guys were there, so it's interesting to hear there, so it's interesting to hear there, so it's interesting to hear background stories. And it's moderated background stories. And it's moderated background stories. And it's moderated by Donald, and it's interesting because by Donald, and it's interesting because by Donald, and it's interesting because you're right, some people are saying, are we you're right, some people are saying, are we you're right, some people are saying, are we going to call it Trump intelligence?

going to call it Trump intelligence? Or are we going to call it Or are we going to call it artificial intelligence or superintelligence, you know artificial intelligence or superintelligence, you know ? Still up in the air. You know, yes. ? Still up in the air. You know, yes. ? Still up in the air. You know, yes. Yes. Because there was Yes. Because there was Yes. Because there was artificial intelligence, there is artificial intelligence, there is artificial intelligence, there is artificial general intelligence which we are artificial general intelligence which we are artificial general intelligence which we are trying to reach, which is also trying to reach, which is also trying to reach, which is also known as the singularity, and then there is known as the singularity, and then there is known as the singularity, and then there is artificial superintelligence ( artificial superintelligence ( ASI), which may be in the future. ASI), which may be in the future. But then, but then Peter Diamandis But then, but then Peter Diamandis says, "No, we're at AGI now," and says, "No, we're at AGI now," and says, "No, we're at AGI now," and you know, Jensen agreed with Sam you know, Jensen agreed with Sam you know, Jensen agreed with Sam because Sam said so. Because remember, if because Sam said so. Because remember, if because Sam said so. Because remember, if you remember, because we're all you remember, because we're all you remember, because we're all computing historians here, computing historians here, computing historians here, technology historians, if technology historians, if technology historians, if you remember the original deal that Sam you remember the original deal that Sam you remember the original deal that Sam made with Satya, uh, which was the first made with Satya, uh, which was the first made with Satya, uh, which was the first real deal around all this real deal around all this real deal around all this AI madness, it was, you know, they got the AI madness, it was, you know, they got the AI madness, it was, you know, they got the first big investment and they got first big investment and they got first big investment and they got all this use of the Azure cloud to all this use of the Azure cloud to all this use of the Azure cloud to train their models, and that's how it train their models, and that's how it train their models, and that's how it all started. And their only way out all started. And their only way out all started. And their only way out was: once they achieved was: once they achieved was: once they achieved artificial general intelligence, once they artificial general intelligence, once they artificial general intelligence, once they achieved AGI, then achieved AGI, then achieved AGI, then OpenAI could somehow break OpenAI could somehow break OpenAI could somehow break any deal they had with any deal they had with any deal they had with Microsoft. That being said, they said they've already Microsoft. That being said, they said they've already Microsoft. That being said, they said they've already found a way out of that found a way out of that found a way out of that deal and now they're everywhere, deal and now they're everywhere, deal and now they're everywhere, right? There you have it. But right? There you have it. But right? There you have it. But artificial general intelligence can artificial general intelligence can artificial general intelligence can be as smart as one of us or be as smart as one of us or be as smart as one of us or as all of us together, or perhaps do as all of us together, or perhaps do as all of us together, or perhaps do anything a person can do. Don't know anything a person can do. Don't know anything a person can do. Don't know . And then there's superintelligence, . And then there's superintelligence, . And then there's superintelligence, smarter than all of us smarter than all of us smarter than all of us combined with maybe some combined with maybe some combined with maybe some alien intelligence, I don't know.

alien intelligence, I don't know. alien intelligence, I don't know. Well, I set the bar low, so it's Well, I set the bar low, so it's Well, I set the bar low, so it's not going to be too difficult to do not going to be too difficult to do not going to be too difficult to do that. that. Hey, by the way, Devon, do you know Hey, by the way, Devon, do you know Andrea? Do you know her? Andrea? Do you know her? Andrea? Do you know her? No, I don't know her. I haven't had the No, I don't know her. I haven't had the No, I don't know her. I haven't had the pleasure. pleasure. pleasure. Yes, I mean... why don't you know Yes, I mean... why don't you know Yes, I mean... why don't you know Alister? In other words, she doesn't Alister? In other words, she doesn't Alister? In other words, she doesn't know him either. Alister, did I say your name right? know him either. Alister, did I say your name right? know him either. Alister, did I say your name right? Oh my God, wow, it's been so Oh my God, wow, it's been so Oh my God, wow, it's been so long. long. long. Yes, I'm dating my absence from my Yes, I'm dating my absence from my Yes, I'm dating my absence from my IoT coffee. IoT coffee. IoT coffee. Yes, Andrea and I worked together at Yes, Andrea and I worked together at Yes, Andrea and I worked together at Ericsson. Yes, that's how we Ericsson. Yes, that's how we Ericsson. Yes, that's how we met. met. Yes, it was a while ago, but not really , maybe 2000 years ago? Maybe 10 , maybe 2000 years ago? Maybe 10 , maybe 2000 years ago? Maybe 10 years ago that we met? years ago that we met? years ago that we met? Something like that. A Something like that. A Something like that. A long time ago. long time ago. long time ago. Yes. In Yes. In Yes. In fact, we met in Barcelona. fact, we met in Barcelona. fact, we met in Barcelona. We met Robin at the Mobile World We met Robin at the Mobile World We met Robin at the Mobile World Congress. Congress. Exact. Exact. There with my client at that moment. I There with my client at that moment. I There with my client at that moment. I was the general manager of the was the general manager of the was the general manager of the Bell Canada account. And Bell Canada had Bell Canada account. And Bell Canada had Bell Canada account. And Bell Canada had Ericsson IoT connectivity, right?

Ericsson IoT connectivity, right? Ericsson IoT connectivity, right? That infrastructure. That infrastructure. That infrastructure. Ah, of course. They had the accelerator. Yes. Ah, of course. They had the accelerator. Yes. Ah, of course. They had the accelerator. Yes. Yes, the accelerator. We were looking for Yes, the accelerator. We were looking for , you know, ways to use it. And the , you know, ways to use it. And the , you know, ways to use it. And the client was looking and so were we client was looking and so were we client was looking and so were we , so that's how we , so that's how we , so that's how we met. We met in the context met. We met in the context met. We met in the context of IoT. We of IoT. We of IoT. We did it. Remember, 10 years ago, that did it. Remember, 10 years ago, that did it. Remember, 10 years ago, that would be in 2016 at MWC, IoT was the would be in 2016 at MWC, IoT was the would be in 2016 at MWC, IoT was the most important thing happening at most important thing happening at most important thing happening at that time. that time. that time. It was. It's because it It was. It's because it It was. It's because it was the final stage of the was the final stage of the was the final stage of the smartphone revolution before the smartphone revolution before the smartphone revolution before the 5G craze. And then it was the IoT segment. 5G craze. And then it was the IoT segment. 5G craze. And then it was the IoT segment. Yes. And it was actually 2017 because in 2016 I Yes. And it was actually 2017 because in 2016 I Yes. And it was actually 2017 because in 2016 I was still in the US. I moved at the was still in the US. I moved at the was still in the US. I moved at the end of the year. But as I was end of the year. But as I was end of the year. But as I was preparing to meet with you preparing to meet with you preparing to meet with you again this week, what's happening today? again this week, what's happening today? again this week, what's happening today? I met Leonard in person a I met Leonard in person a I met Leonard in person a couple of days ago. couple of days ago. couple of days ago. Yes. Uh-huh. We can talk about that. Yes. Uh-huh. We can talk about that. Yes. Uh-huh. We can talk about that. Well, maybe not. But I Well, maybe not. But I Well, maybe not. But I started thinking about IoT more started thinking about IoT more intensely, and I remember it was 10 intensely, and I remember it was 10 years ago. I was at Ericsson in Dallas.

years ago. I was at Ericsson in Dallas. years ago. I was at Ericsson in Dallas. He led a group of radio access networks He led a group of radio access networks He led a group of radio access networks , the local group. , the local group. , the local group. Okay. Okay. Okay. Call it sales engineering at Call it sales engineering at Call it sales engineering at Ericsson, we never called it that. Ericsson, we never called it that. Ericsson, we never called it that. We called it solutions management, We called it solutions management, We called it solutions management, solutions architecture, solutions architecture, solutions architecture, sales support, that kind of thing. Yes, so I sales support, that kind of thing. Yes, so I sales support, that kind of thing. Yes, so I had that for North America. had that for North America. had that for North America. IoT was something very important. So I IoT was something very important. So I IoT was something very important. So I had a colleague, if you remember, Bob had a colleague, if you remember, Bob had a colleague, if you remember, Bob Gessel. Gessel. Gessel. Yes, I remember Bob. Yes, I remember Bob. Bob was studying end-to- Bob was studying end-to- end IoT, and I was bringing in the end IoT, and I was bringing in the end IoT, and I was bringing in the radio access network part that could make or radio access network part that could make or radio access network part that could make or break IoT in terms of a break IoT in terms of a break IoT in terms of a variety of aspects. variety of aspects. variety of aspects. Clear. Clear. Clear. Performance and cost and all that, Performance and cost and all that, Performance and cost and all that, then I remember presenting IoT then I remember presenting IoT then I remember presenting IoT from a bottom-up perspective. Yes. from a bottom-up perspective. Yes. from a bottom-up perspective. Yes. Here in Dallas, educating people, and Here in Dallas, educating people, and Here in Dallas, educating people, and I was thinking, "Oh, 10 years later, I don't I was thinking, "Oh, 10 years later, I don't I was thinking, "Oh, 10 years later, I don't know. How do we talk about IoT now know. How do we talk about IoT now know. How do we talk about IoT now because it was so trendy 10 years ago because it was so trendy 10 years ago ?"

?" ?" It was fashionable. It was fashionable. It was fashionable. They loved it, and I loved it too. They loved it, and I loved it too. They loved it, and I loved it too. It was trendy, It was trendy, It was trendy, but they've renamed it something else, but they've renamed it something else, but they've renamed it something else, whether it's telemetry, machine-to- whether it's telemetry, machine-to- whether it's telemetry, machine-to- machine IoT, the machine IoT, the machine IoT, the physical Metaverse, don't forget the physical Metaverse, don't forget the physical Metaverse, don't forget the Metaverse. Metaverse. Metaverse. Metaverse, you Metaverse, you Metaverse, you know, you have people. know, you have people. know, you have people. You had no presence in the Metaverse, You had no presence in the Metaverse, You had no presence in the Metaverse, if I remember correctly. if I remember correctly. if I remember correctly. That's not a person, it's the Internet That's not a person, it's the Internet That's not a person, it's the Internet of Things. The key question in of Things. The key question in of Things. The key question in this whole matter of this whole matter of this whole matter of artificial intelligence is: is it a thing, a person, artificial intelligence is: is it a thing, a person, artificial intelligence is: is it a thing, a person, or a category in itself? But I or a category in itself? But I or a category in itself? But I would say that IoT is still very much in would say that IoT is still very much in would say that IoT is still very much in vogue, it's just that, you know, the name vogue, it's just that, you know, the name vogue, it's just that, you know, the name IoT isn't as catchy as the new IoT isn't as catchy as the new IoT isn't as catchy as the new names we're giving it. I'm names we're giving it. I'm names we're giving it. I'm very glad to very glad to very glad to hear that, Don. Regarding getting to know each other, I think hear that, Don. Regarding getting to know each other, I think hear that, Don. Regarding getting to know each other, I think we need a we need a we need a separate one-on-one meeting just to understand the separate one-on-one meeting just to understand the separate one-on-one meeting just to understand the basics. basics. Devin, you were also in Dallas with Devin, you were also in Dallas with Leonard at this event recently. Leonard at this event recently. Leonard at this event recently. Yeah? Yeah? Yeah? I was in another one, in fact, I was in a I was in another one, in fact, I was in a I was in another one, in fact, I was in a different one, and then I was in different one, and then I was in different one, and then I was in Dallas and Austin. I had the whole Dallas and Austin. I had the whole Dallas and Austin. I had the whole Texas experience, and before you Texas experience, and before you Texas experience, and before you came, I told Leonard, "The only came, I told Leonard, "The only came, I told Leonard, "The only problem right now is that I can't problem right now is that I can't problem right now is that I can't get the song Choosing Texas out of my get the song Choosing Texas out of my get the song Choosing Texas out of my head." Is head." Is n't that crazy?

n't that crazy? n't that crazy? For the last two days because, you For the last two days because, you For the last two days because, you know, we were in the car know, we were in the car and they kept playing it over and over again. I haven't heard anything else but that song since I've been heard anything else but that song since I've been here, and it's here, and it's here, and it's stuck in my head. It's been on my stuck in my head. It's been on my stuck in my head. It's been on my mind, mind, mind, believe me, I can't believe it. I mean, believe me, I can't believe it. I mean, believe me, I can't believe it. I mean, that song has been number one on that song has been number one on that song has been number one on the country music chart the country music chart the country music chart all year. Uh, what's her name, all year. Uh, what's her name, all year. Uh, what's her name, Ella? Uh, Ella? Uh, Langley? Langley? Langley? Yes it is. Yes it is. Yes it is. For a good reason. I don't want to For a good reason. I don't want to For a good reason. I don't want to call her unknown, but call her unknown, but call her unknown, but overnight she has the most overnight she has the most overnight she has the most popular song in the country for the entire year. Yes, popular song in the country for the entire year. Yes, popular song in the country for the entire year. Yes, you're right, I listen to it all the you're right, I listen to it all the you're right, I listen to it all the time, it's crazy. time, it's crazy. It's an advertisement for the It's an advertisement for the state of Texas. I bet they pay off state of Texas. I bet they pay off state of Texas. I bet they pay off , you know, the state government , you know, the state government , you know, the state government pays or incentivizes local radio. pays or incentivizes local radio. pays or incentivizes local radio. Exactly. Probably every Exactly. Probably every Exactly. Probably every business in Texas has t-shirts, you business in Texas has t-shirts, you business in Texas has t-shirts, you know, we chose Texas, yeah, I get it know, we chose Texas, yeah, I get it . What's going on, Alister? . What's going on, Alister? Uh, we're about to Uh, we're about to launch your product today. So yes launch your product today. So yes launch your product today. So yes .

. . Yes. Yes. Yes. We're launching the We're launching the We're launching the Mesa Amaysim 20 national package, which will allow Mesa Amaysim 20 national package, which will allow Mesa Amaysim 20 national package, which will allow people to take a flat CSV file of people to take a flat CSV file of people to take a flat CSV file of historical data, create simulations, historical data, create simulations, historical data, create simulations, train agents, test those agents train agents, test those agents train agents, test those agents in the simulation, deploy those in the simulation, deploy those in the simulation, deploy those agents in the real world, manage agents in the real world, manage agents in the real world, manage industrial processes, choose, know, industrial processes, choose, know, so if I suddenly disappear, which will so if I suddenly disappear, which will probably happen in a few probably happen in a few probably happen in a few minutes, I'll just see again what's going on minutes, I'll just see again what's going on minutes, I'll just see again what's going on , but yeah, wow. , but yeah, wow. , but yeah, wow. The The The good life is good. Last week good life is good. Last week good life is good. Last week I was in Memphis, at a I was in Memphis, at a I was in Memphis, at a yeast-producing client. yeast-producing client. yeast-producing client. Okay. Okay. Okay. Implementing an integrated control system Implementing an integrated control system Implementing an integrated control system for the for the for the yeast fermentation process, which... yeast fermentation process, which... yeast fermentation process, which... Wow. It Wow. It Wow. It smells like yeast, you'd be surprised. I mean smells like yeast, you'd be surprised. I mean smells like yeast, you'd be surprised. I mean , I think they're the , I think they're the , I think they're the world's largest yeast manufacturer, and world's largest yeast manufacturer, and world's largest yeast manufacturer, and they make yeast for bread, yeast they make yeast for bread, yeast they make yeast for bread, yeast for wine, yeast for bioreactors, for wine, yeast for bioreactors, for wine, yeast for bioreactors, yeast for biology, yeast for yeast for biology, yeast for ... Yeah, yeah, all kinds of... ... Yeah, yeah, all kinds of... ... Yeah, yeah, all kinds of... Wow. Wow. Wow. Yes, it's fascinating. Fascinating. Yes, it's fascinating. Fascinating. Yes, it's fascinating. Fascinating. Wow, it's not just for bread anymore, huh? Wow, it's not just for bread anymore, huh? Wow, it's not just for bread anymore, huh? No, no, yes, yes. No, no, yes, yes. No, no, yes, yes. It's all biochemistry, yes.

It's all biochemistry, yes. It's all biochemistry, yes. Yes Yes Yes of course. of course. of course. That's great. That's great. That's great. Yes, but they're Yes, but they're Yes, but they're microbial things that people microbial things that people microbial things that people are working on to, you know, are working on to, you know, are working on to, you know, digest plastics and all that kind of digest plastics and all that kind of digest plastics and all that kind of stuff. I think it's great... stuff. I think it's great... stuff. I think it's great... Oh, yes. Yes, you know what? Yes, I've Oh, yes. Yes, you know what? Yes, I've Oh, yes. Yes, you know what? Yes, I've heard about things like that in the past heard about things like that in the past . It could have been some other . It could have been some other . It could have been some other chemical, like, you know, there are chemical, like, you know, there are chemical, like, you know, there are people who say, "Oh, we had an people who say, "Oh, we had an people who say, "Oh, we had an oil spill and we're going to put this oil spill and we're going to put this oil spill and we're going to put this biological stuff there to eat it or biological stuff there to eat it or biological stuff there to eat it or something." "I don't know. something." "I don't know. something." "I don't know. Magically. But I also got a Magically. But I also got a Magically. But I also got a reminder of why I... I reminder of why I... I reminder of why I... I might fail us over the course of might fail us over the course of might fail us over the course of the last few days. I don't know what's going on the last few days. I don't know what's going on the last few days. I don't know what's going on with the others, but I use with the others, but I use with the others, but I use weird Microsoft. You know, we use the weird Microsoft. You know, we use the weird Microsoft. You know, we use the Microsoft back-end, so I use Microsoft back-end, so I use Microsoft back-end, so I use Copilot, and I've created a bunch of agents Copilot, and I've created a bunch of agents Copilot, and I've created a bunch of agents in Copilot, and it's... and everything... and on a in Copilot, and it's... and everything... and on a in Copilot, and it's... and everything... and on a good day, it all works together good day, it all works together good day, it all works together brilliantly, and I can say, 'Well brilliantly, and I can say, 'Well , what you know, what should... , what you know, what should... What's going on with XYZ?'" "And he What's going on with XYZ?'" "And he What's going on with XYZ?'" "And he tells me. And every now and then he shits the tells me. And every now and then he shits the tells me. And every now and then he shits the bed. And in the last few days, he's bed. And in the last few days, he's bed. And in the last few days, he's gone from being, I would say, a gone from being, I would say, a gone from being, I would say, a reasoning teenager to being a reasoning teenager to being a reasoning teenager to being a little kid, running around screaming, little kid, running around screaming, little kid, running around screaming, throwing things, breaking things, you throwing things, breaking things, you throwing things, breaking things, you know, it's like... know, it's like... know, it's like... Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But anyway, very fast, Andrea, Devin But anyway, very fast, Andrea, Devin But anyway, very fast, Andrea, Devin is senior vice president of IoT at NTT is senior vice president of IoT at NTT is senior vice president of IoT at NTT Data. And he's a former Data. And he's a former Data. And he's a former deployed engineer like me.

deployed engineer like me. Yeah. Nice to meet you. Nice Yeah. Nice to meet you. Nice to meet you, and I'm going to say wow. Yeah. to meet you, and I'm going to say wow. Yeah. At Hitachi Vantara and Azure IoT and At Hitachi Vantara and Azure IoT and Microsoft. Microsoft. Microsoft. Yeah. I know. It's like we're all Yeah. I know. It's like we're all Yeah. I know. It's like we're all one big family here. Yeah. And I one big family here. Yeah. And I one big family here. Yeah. And I was deployed, too. In the was deployed, too. In the was deployed, too. In the damn military, where the damn military, where the damn military, where the term deployed comes from, okay? See you term deployed comes from, okay? See you term deployed comes from, okay? See you in the desert somewhere, okay? in the desert somewhere, okay? in the desert somewhere, okay? Yeah. Well, we're the appropriate version Yeah. Well, we're the appropriate version . . . If you're on submarines, if you're in the If you're on submarines, if you're in the If you're on submarines, if you're in the middle of the desert, you're in serious middle of the desert, you're in serious middle of the desert, you're in serious trouble. trouble. trouble. Yeah, serious trouble. You're right Yeah, serious trouble. You're right . Yeah, land maybe. Yeah. Oh, . Yeah, land maybe. Yeah. Oh, . Yeah, land maybe. Yeah. Oh, my God. my God. Yeah, I mean that That's pretty much it Yeah, I mean that That's pretty much it . I mean, well, you . I mean, well, you . I mean, well, you know, you're the OG, and then we're kind of a know, you're the OG, and then we're kind of a know, you're the OG, and then we're kind of a proper version when the proper version when the proper version when the consulting industry, you know, kind of consulting industry, you know, kind of consulting industry, you know, kind of ... Well, it's the same ... Well, it's the same ... Well, it's the same model because you have to be model because you have to be model because you have to be forward-deployed.

forward-deployed. So, the first person who So, the first person who started saying that a lot was Alex Karp started saying that a lot was Alex Karp started saying that a lot was Alex Karp at Palantir, and then Rackspace at Palantir, and then Rackspace at Palantir, and then Rackspace recently, just because we know that recently, just because we know that recently, just because we know that the people at Rackspace, recently, the people at Rackspace, recently, the people at Rackspace, recently, in their latest group of people in their latest group of people in their latest group of people running that company, have a running that company, have a running that company, have a deep association with Palantir, and deep association with Palantir, and deep association with Palantir, and they're like, "Oh, we should also they're like, "Oh, we should also they're like, "Oh, we should also have forward-deployed engineers have forward-deployed engineers have forward-deployed engineers ." And then they publicized it and ." And then they publicized it and ." And then they publicized it and overnight, within overnight, within overnight, within a week or two, every a week or two, every a week or two, every company on the planet had company on the planet had company on the planet had engineers deployed. It's incredible. Are they going to engineers deployed. It's incredible. Are they going to give us berets or something? give us berets or something? Yes. Yes, yes. They put a beret on you. Yes. Yes. Yes, yes. They put a beret on you. Yes. Last week I met a guy who Last week I met a guy who manages all of OpenAI's deployed engineers manages all of OpenAI's deployed engineers manages all of OpenAI's deployed engineers . He said he had a team . He said he had a team . He said he had a team of about 2000 people. of about 2000 people. 2000? Where would they get 2000? Where would they get 2000? Where would they get enough money? Oh, never mind. enough money? Oh, never mind. enough money? Oh, never mind. Yes, yes, yes. Basically, they're Yes, yes, yes. Basically, they're Yes, yes, yes. Basically, they're coming in and it's interesting. I think there's coming in and it's interesting. I think there's coming in and it's interesting. I think there's a platform approach, and then a platform approach, and then a platform approach, and then a bunch of people come along and a bunch of people come along and a bunch of people come along and build it for you. And then a build it for you. And then a build it for you. And then a bunch of people show up and build it for you bunch of people show up and build it for you . So they're getting into, you know, . So they're getting into, you know, . So they're getting into, you know, publishing houses, media companies, publishing houses, media companies, publishing houses, media companies, everywhere. And basically, I think you everywhere. And basically, I think you everywhere. And basically, I think you told me a while ago, I've seen other told me a while ago, I've seen other told me a while ago, I've seen other people talking about this in this people talking about this in this people talking about this in this too. Companies say, "Well, too. Companies say, "Well, too. Companies say, "Well, there are inputs and outputs, plus there are inputs and outputs, plus there are inputs and outputs, plus everything in between, so everything in between, so everything in between, so I'm discarding all of that to I'm discarding all of that to I'm discarding all of that to build it again using build it again using build it again using artificial intelligence." That's just how it is artificial intelligence." That's just how it is artificial intelligence." That's just how it is . That's just how it is. They appear.

. That's just how it is. They appear. . That's just how it is. They appear. His analogy was: "Well, we move into His analogy was: "Well, we move into His analogy was: "Well, we move into the house next door and the house next door and the house next door and rebuild the company with AI in the rebuild the company with AI in the rebuild the company with AI in the house next door, and then we ask house next door, and then we ask people to move into the house—you know, people to move into the house—you know, the house... the house... I'm kind of the only one doing this. I'm kind of the only one doing this. So, welcome, and remember to So, welcome, and remember to So, welcome, and remember to take this seriously at your own take this seriously at your own take this seriously at your own risk. Get insurance if you do risk. Get insurance if you do . If you follow any of Rob's advice . If you follow any of Rob's advice . If you follow any of Rob's advice about stock picking and about stock picking and about stock picking and nonsense like that, then you'll be nonsense like that, then you'll be nonsense like that, then you'll be completely on your own and completely on your own and completely on your own and 1000% responsible for your own 1000% responsible for your own 1000% responsible for your own decisions. But remember, we're decisions. But remember, we're decisions. But remember, we're doing this for the community. Check out doing this for the community. Check out doing this for the community. Check out Elevate Communities and make a Elevate Communities and make a Elevate Communities and make a donation. Okay, we're going to try to donation. Okay, we're going to try to donation. Okay, we're going to try to wrap this up probably next year wrap this up probably next year wrap this up probably next year , now that we've done the , now that we've done the , now that we've done the rebranding and all the legal paperwork for rebranding and all the legal paperwork for rebranding and all the legal paperwork for this nonprofit.

this nonprofit. this nonprofit. And our mission And our mission And our mission is in place, too. is in place, too. is in place, too. Yes, yes. So we want to help Yes, yes. So we want to help Yes, yes. So we want to help incubate a new generation of incubate a new generation of incubate a new generation of Ford engineers around this thing Ford engineers around this thing Ford engineers around this thing called IoT, which is constantly called IoT, which is constantly called IoT, which is constantly being rebranded as something else. But being rebranded as something else. But being rebranded as something else. But our mission here at IoT Coffee our mission here at IoT Coffee our mission here at IoT Coffee Talk is to ground everything." So Talk is to ground everything." So Talk is to ground everything." So things don't get ridiculous. And things don't get ridiculous. And things don't get ridiculous. And also, remember, if you're not interested in also, remember, if you're not interested in also, remember, if you're not interested in charity and you don't care about charity and you don't care about charity and you don't care about communities, you can buy one of communities, you can buy one of communities, you can buy one of these. these. these. Buy the merchandise. Buy the merchandise. Buy the merchandise. Especially if you're into fashion, because Especially if you're into fashion, because Especially if you're into fashion, because this is the hottest thing. I mean, look at that this is the hottest thing. I mean, look at that . It's . It's . It's so popular. It's so popular. so popular. It's so popular. so popular. It's so popular. No, it's so popular. No, it's so popular. No, it's so popular. And you know, whether you know it or not, we're And you know, whether you know it or not, we're And you know, whether you know it or not, we're trendsetters, trendsetters, trendsetters, trendsetters, trendsetters, trendsetters, because after we started IoT because after we started IoT because after we started IoT Coffee Talk, everyone started Coffee Talk, everyone started Coffee Talk, everyone started giving coffee talks. So, you giving coffee talks. So, you giving coffee talks. So, you know, know, know, talk to each other. talk to each other. talk to each other. Yes, exactly. Talk to each other, Yes, exactly. Talk to each other, right? And right? And right? And we'll have Barbara we'll have Barbara we'll have Barbara Walters on, Barbra Streisand will also be Walters on, Barbra Streisand will also be Walters on, Barbra Streisand will also be on the show, and on the show, and on the show, and Madonna too; it's going to be really Madonna too; it's going to be really Madonna too; it's going to be really amazing. I'm thrilled. Yes, let amazing. I'm thrilled. Yes, let amazing. I'm thrilled. Yes, let Mark come, Mark Myers. That's him. Yes Mark come, Mark Myers. That's him. Yes Mark come, Mark Myers. That's him. Yes , , , I have... Yes, of course. It's going to I have... Yes, of course. It's going to I have... Yes, of course. It's going to be sweater season. Right?

be sweater season. Right? be sweater season. Right? I'm so glad it's I'm so glad it's sweater season. sweater season. Sweater season. I Sweater season. I Sweater season. I love it. Oh my God. love it. Oh my God. love it. Oh my God. You know, You know, you've made a good point. There are you've made a good point. There are those who have no interest in those who have no interest in those who have no interest in charity, in helping others or the charity, in helping others or the charity, in helping others or the planet. I understand that. I'm not here planet. I understand that. I'm not here planet. I understand that. I'm not here to judge. But it's interesting that to judge. But it's interesting that to judge. But it's interesting that you said that. I mean, you said that. I mean, you said that. I mean, I mentioned earlier when I wrote this I mentioned earlier when I wrote this I mentioned earlier when I wrote this book with a hundred of these use cases book with a hundred of these use cases book with a hundred of these use cases to help with different to help with different to help with different sustainability issues, my wife reminded me sustainability issues, my wife reminded me sustainability issues, my wife reminded me that not everyone has a that not everyone has a that not everyone has a charitable heart or wants to do things for the charitable heart or wants to do things for the charitable heart or wants to do things for the good of humanity. They want to get good of humanity. They want to get good of humanity. They want to get paid. They think, "What's in it for me paid. They think, "What's in it for me paid. They think, "What's in it for me ?" " ?" " ?" " Yes. Yes. And that was the last thing I did before And that was the last thing I did before publishing the book because I went through all publishing the book because I went through all publishing the book because I went through all 100 use cases, and the last part of 100 use cases, and the last part of 100 use cases, and the last part of each one is the financial benefit. each one is the financial benefit. Yes. Yes. How you're going to make money, how you're going to How you're going to make money, how you're going to How you're going to make money, how you're going to save money, how you're going to reduce save money, how you're going to reduce save money, how you're going to reduce risk, you know, kind of like the risk, you know, kind of like the risk, you know, kind of like the big three. Yes. big three. Yes. big three. Yes. For each of the use cases For each of the use cases For each of the use cases because, yes, not everyone is because, yes, not everyone is because, yes, not everyone is interested in those things. So buy interested in those things. So buy interested in those things. So buy some merchandise. some merchandise. some merchandise. Yes. Yes. Yes. Whatever. There you go. You do Whatever. There you go. You do Whatever. There you go. You do n't have to be an individual.

n't have to be an individual. n't have to be an individual. You could be a corporation if You could be a corporation if You could be a corporation if you want. you want. you want. Yes. Yes. Yes. Donate. Donate. Donate. Donate. You're like... Because I was thinking, you Donate. You're like... Because I was thinking, you Donate. You're like... Because I was thinking, you know, maybe in the same way that, you know, maybe in the same way that, you know, maybe in the same way that, you know, Jensen writes you a check and know, Jensen writes you a check and know, Jensen writes you a check and transfers $2 billion into transfers $2 billion into transfers $2 billion into your bank account, like you're your bank account, like you're your bank account, like you're Neo Cloud or something. Neo Cloud or something. Neo Cloud or something. Yes. Yes. Yes. We could have that for ourselves, We could have that for ourselves, We could have that for ourselves, too. If they want to, you know, too. If they want to, you know, too. If they want to, you know, if Jensen wants to do that, you know, if Jensen wants to do that, you know, if Jensen wants to do that, you know, we're good. We'll take it we're good. We'll take it we're good. We'll take it responsibly. responsibly. responsibly. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. It's all good. You know, Devon, You just Yes. It's all good. You know, Devon, You just Yes. It's all good. You know, Devon, You just had an event. Something about had an event. Something about had an event. Something about physical AI, right? I saw a post physical AI, right? I saw a post physical AI, right? I saw a post about it? about it? about it? Right. We had our inaugural Right. We had our inaugural Right. We had our inaugural physical AI summit. physical AI summit. physical AI summit. That's huge. That's amazing. That's huge. That's amazing. That's huge. That's amazing. So, all the physical AI experts So, all the physical AI experts So, all the physical AI experts were there. were there. were there. Not all of them. Well, not all of them. You know, Not all of them. Well, not all of them. You know, Not all of them. Well, not all of them. You know, but we had some but we had some but we had some great discussions. great discussions. Yeah? Yeah, we'll Yeah? Yeah, we'll Yeah? Yeah, we'll give you an invitation. give you an invitation. Yeah. Oh, did it go well? I mean, did it go Yeah. Oh, did it go well? I mean, did it go well? Did you learn a lot? I don't well? Did you learn a lot? I don't well? Did you learn a lot? I don't know anything know anything know anything about learning, but, well, we had some about learning, but, well, we had some about learning, but, well, we had some good conversations and a lot, well, good conversations and a lot, well, good conversations and a lot, well, the thing is, I think we the thing is, I think we the thing is, I think we 're all tired of all the summits 're all tired of all the summits 're all tired of all the summits about... I think this was the third one I about... I think this was the third one I about... I think this was the third one I 've heard about in the last 've heard about in the last 've heard about in the last two months about AI summits, two months about AI summits, two months about AI summits, physical AI summits from many physical AI summits from many physical AI summits from many different organizations. But it was different organizations. But it was different organizations. But it was great that we did it in the great that we did it in the great that we did it in the birthplace of AI, or really, birthplace of AI, or really, birthplace of AI, or really, the AI ​​hotbed in the AI ​​hotbed in the AI ​​hotbed in the Bay Area. And it was also co-sponsored

the Bay Area. And it was also co-sponsored the Bay Area. And it was also co-sponsored by Ericsson, Docomo, Solona, ​​uh, I by Ericsson, Docomo, Solona, ​​uh, I by Ericsson, Docomo, Solona, ​​uh, I know, and some of our other friends. know, and some of our other friends. know, and some of our other friends. But, well, the first day was But, well, the first day was But, well, the first day was basically already You know, show and basically already You know, show and basically already You know, show and tell. Everyone brought their tell. Everyone brought their tell. Everyone brought their demos, the summit, and things to demos, the summit, and things to demos, the summit, and things to show. And then, during the second show. And then, during the second show. And then, during the second day, we had several day, we had several day, we had several talk sessions. First, you know, the talk sessions. First, you know, the talk sessions. First, you know, the two key things in all of this are: two key things in all of this are: what's the return on investment? what's the return on investment? what's the return on investment? Well, business models—how do you Well, business models—how do you Well, business models—how do you make money with this? But, most make money with this? But, most make money with this? But, most importantly, I did one on governance and importantly, I did one on governance and importantly, I did one on governance and security. Yes. Good. security. Yes. Good. security. Yes. Good. Good. Good. Good. Especially around the balance of, you Especially around the balance of, you Especially around the balance of, you know, how do you keep encouraging things know, how do you keep encouraging things while everyone thinks you while everyone thinks you 're building Skynet, but 're building Skynet, but how do you put security barriers in place, and how do you put security barriers in place, and how do you put security barriers in place, and what do you actually allow these what do you actually allow these what do you actually allow these things to do? And again, I think the CEO of things to do? And again, I think the CEO of things to do? And again, I think the CEO of Palo Alto Networks said it best: AI Palo Alto Networks said it best: AI Palo Alto Networks said it best: AI is not deterministic. I use the is not deterministic. I use the is not deterministic. I use the analogy of, you know, I have a analogy of, you know, I have a analogy of, you know, I have a 17-year-old, and the inputs you 17-year-old, and the inputs you 17-year-old, and the inputs you give it don't always result in give it don't always result in give it don't always result in predictable outcomes, as predictable outcomes, as predictable outcomes, as anyone who has a anyone who has a anyone who has a teenager or a young child can tell you.

teenager or a young child can tell you. teenager or a young child can tell you. So, when you have all these agents, you So, when you have all these agents, you So, when you have all these agents, you know, if you model the agent after know, if you model the agent after know, if you model the agent after the brain of a young child or a the brain of a young child or a the brain of a young child or a teenager, who You know what you're going to get out teenager, who You know what you're going to get out teenager, who You know what you're going to get out of it. So how do you of it. So how do you of it. So how do you establish safety barriers establish safety barriers without being overly restrictive? Because without being overly restrictive? Because we can over-regulate ourselves to we can over-regulate ourselves to we can over-regulate ourselves to death, and I'm not going to mention certain death, and I'm not going to mention certain death, and I'm not going to mention certain regions of the world that are regions of the world that are regions of the world that are doing that. Then, other regions doing that. Then, other regions doing that. Then, other regions are really bringing their are really bringing their are really bringing their technocrats together and embracing this and technocrats together and embracing this and technocrats together and embracing this and building a future. So building a future. So how do we not stifle how do we not stifle how do we not stifle innovation, but make sure we innovation, but make sure we innovation, but make sure we 're not building Skynet? Because 're not building Skynet? Because 're not building Skynet? Because I think José from Gartner—is it José I think José from Gartner—is it José I think José from Gartner—is it José or Jorge? Gartner, I can't remember his or Jorge? Gartner, I can't remember his or Jorge? Gartner, I can't remember his last name—he started it all by saying, " last name—he started it all by saying, " last name—he started it all by saying, " Well, Well, Well, agentic AI is great, but agentic AI is great, but agentic AI is great, but physical AI has physical AI has physical AI has a propensity to kill you or harm you." a propensity to kill you or harm you." a propensity to kill you or harm you." And that's the difference. I'll And that's the difference. I'll And that's the difference. I'll leave you with this thought. Sitting in leave you with this thought. Sitting in leave you with this thought. Sitting in a yeast plant last week a yeast plant last week a yeast plant last week made me understand this much better than made me understand this much better than made me understand this much better than anything else. You know, I think a anything else. You know, I think a anything else. You know, I think a lot of the current hype around lot of the current hype around lot of the current hype around AI is being driven by companies AI is being driven by companies AI is being driven by companies that, if they hadn't been born on the internet, would that, if they hadn't been born on the internet, would that, if they hadn't been born on the internet, would certainly have grown and grown on the certainly have grown and grown on the certainly have grown and grown on the internet. So, applying AI to internet. So, applying AI to internet. So, applying AI to those businesses doesn't entail There's no those businesses doesn't entail There's no those businesses doesn't entail There's no physical risk if you mistype the physical risk if you mistype the physical risk if you mistype the content. But when you get into content. But when you get into content. But when you get into manufacturing environments, these guys manufacturing environments, these guys manufacturing environments, these guys are 10 years behind. And their are 10 years behind. And their are 10 years behind. And their main focus is main focus is main focus is governance. They're still working in governance. They're still working in governance. They're still working in environments where environments where environments where cybersecurity prevents cybersecurity prevents cybersecurity prevents IT and OT systems from communicating with each IT and OT systems from communicating with each IT and OT systems from communicating with each other. The OT system is inside other. The OT system is inside other. The OT system is inside the factory walls, and nothing gets in

the factory walls, and nothing gets in the factory walls, and nothing gets in . That's where . That's where . That's where manufacturing is. And until we manufacturing is. And until we manufacturing is. And until we make some significant progress make some significant progress make some significant progress in governance and in governance and in governance and predictability and the ability to predictability and the ability to predictability and the ability to establish security barriers, like I establish security barriers, like I establish security barriers, like I said, they're not going to be interested. You said, they're not going to be interested. You said, they're not going to be interested. You know, it's called code. You're going to use know, it's called code. You're going to use know, it's called code. You're going to use AI, AI, AI, basically, to prototype basically, to prototype basically, to prototype what a point optimization looks like, and what a point optimization looks like, and what a point optimization looks like, and then you're going to generate the code then you're going to generate the code then you're going to generate the code needed to execute it in a needed to execute it in a needed to execute it in a much cheaper and much cheaper and much cheaper and more deterministic way. People are more deterministic way. People are more deterministic way. People are kind of idiots. It's like at some kind of idiots. It's like at some kind of idiots. It's like at some point you realize, "I have to point you realize, "I have to point you realize, "I have to code things." Okay, code things." Okay, code things." Okay, code it, and then you build and code it, and then you build and code it, and then you build and fine-tune the whole DevOps SDLC process fine-tune the whole DevOps SDLC process fine-tune the whole DevOps SDLC process to make it work. a more to make it work. a more to make it work. a more iterative prototype. See you later, and you know, this iterative prototype. See you later, and you know, this iterative prototype. See you later, and you know, this is a conversation I had at TM is a conversation I had at TM is a conversation I had at TM Forum because I suggested, you know, that Forum because I suggested, you know, that Forum because I suggested, you know, that this autonomous network framework may this autonomous network framework may this autonomous network framework may never reach level five. Level one never reach level five. Level one , two, three, four. Because, you know, , two, three, four. Because, you know, , two, three, four. Because, you know, this is the thing. And I love the this is the thing. And I love the this is the thing. And I love the guys at TM Forum. They're very tough.

guys at TM Forum. They're very tough. You're all still stuck at You're all still stuck at level three. And you know what? When the level three. And you know what? When the level three. And you know what? When the telecom industry telecom industry telecom industry is stuck at level three, and they've is stuck at level three, and they've is stuck at level three, and they've been investing in this been investing in this been investing in this forever—and Andrea, you probably have a forever—and Andrea, you probably have a forever—and Andrea, you probably have a lot to say about that—if they can't lot to say about that—if they can't lot to say about that—if they can't work these things out, it doesn't bode work these things out, it doesn't bode work these things out, it doesn't bode well for any other well for any other well for any other industry. And he was talking about industry. And he was talking about industry. And he was talking about manufacturing and how, yeah, we have to manufacturing and how, yeah, we have to manufacturing and how, yeah, we have to work out the barriers to work out the barriers to work out the barriers to entry, blah, blah, blah for entry, blah, blah, blah for entry, blah, blah, blah for manufacturing. What about the manufacturing. What about the manufacturing. What about the consumer? There was a report in the consumer? There was a report in the consumer? There was a report in the Wall Street Journal. What's the Wall Street Journal. What's the Wall Street Journal. What's the ultimate goal? Some goal. Yeah, yeah. Now there are ultimate goal? Some goal. Yeah, yeah. Now there are ultimate goal? Some goal. Yeah, yeah. Now there are reports that say consumers are reports that say consumers are reports that say consumers are saying, "Well, it works perfectly, saying, "Well, it works perfectly, saying, "Well, it works perfectly, perfectly, 90% of the time." And perfectly, 90% of the time." And perfectly, 90% of the time." And then the other 10% of the time, it then the other 10% of the time, it then the other 10% of the time, it empties my bank account. empties my bank account. empties my bank account. Yes, it's buying junk you didn't want to Yes, it's buying junk you didn't want to Yes, it's buying junk you didn't want to buy. So, you receive this buy. So, you receive this buy. So, you receive this confirmation or they send you this thing. And confirmation or they send you this thing. And confirmation or they send you this thing. And then you have to return it. So then you have to return it. So then you have to return it. So think about it from the other side. Invest think about it from the other side. Invest think about it from the other side. Invest only the cost of reverse logistics only the cost of reverse logistics only the cost of reverse logistics due to agent hallucinations and due to agent hallucinations and due to agent hallucinations and unwanted purchases that now unwanted purchases that now unwanted purchases that now have to be reversed. I saw how big have to be reversed. I saw how big have to be reversed. I saw how big this is going to get. So, you this is going to get. So, you this is going to get. So, you lovely little muse, whatever you are, I lovely little muse, whatever you are, I lovely little muse, whatever you are, I encourage you to go to YouTube and watch encourage you to go to YouTube and watch encourage you to go to YouTube and watch the latest Daily Show with Jon Stewart.

the latest Daily Show with Jon Stewart. the latest Daily Show with Jon Stewart. He did a whole program about it. And it He did a whole program about it. And it He did a whole program about it. And it 's hilarious. It's like you could 's hilarious. It's like you could ...it's like 20 or 30, whatever, 20 ...it's like 20 or 30, whatever, 20 ...it's like 20 or 30, whatever, 20 minutes and you have the little creature. minutes and you have the little creature. minutes and you have the little creature. It's really funny and, you know, it's kind of It's really funny and, you know, it's kind of It's really funny and, you know, it's kind of scary and all that. Just so you know scary and all that. Just so you know scary and all that. Just so you know , friends, I only want to give , friends, I only want to give , friends, I only want to give credit where credit is due. Where did credit where credit is due. Where did credit where credit is due. Where did AI originate? Does AI originate? Does anyone know its anyone know its anyone know its actual birthplace? Because I don't want to give too much actual birthplace? Because I don't want to give too much actual birthplace? Because I don't want to give too much credit to those people from Silicon Valley. credit to those people from Silicon Valley. credit to those people from Silicon Valley. Oh, it can't be done. They're Oh, it can't be done. They're Oh, it can't be done. They're like salsa instructors who arrive like salsa instructors who arrive like salsa instructors who arrive late to the party. late to the party. Oxford or Oxford or Dartmouth College? Dartmouth College? Yes. Yes. Yes. In Hanover, New Hampshire. Yes. Anyway, In Hanover, New Hampshire. Yes. Anyway, In Hanover, New Hampshire. Yes. Anyway, there was kind of a summer research agreement there was kind of a summer research agreement there was kind of a summer research agreement . What was it like? Was it in the . What was it like? Was it in the . What was it like? Was it in the 40s or 50s? In 1956. A group of 40s or 50s? In 1956. A group of 40s or 50s? In 1956. A group of people got together and coined the people got together and coined the people got together and coined the term then and have been term then and have been term then and have been working on it ever since, working on it ever since, working on it ever since, languishing and struggling and it's languishing and struggling and it's languishing and struggling and it's not really working and you've heard things not really working and you've heard things not really working and you've heard things about AI winters that have about AI winters that have about AI winters that have happened, where they just happened, where they just happened, where they just gave up for a decade or two, and gave up for a decade or two, and gave up for a decade or two, and then came back. But then, in 2017, then came back. But then, in 2017, then came back. But then, in 2017, we had the transformer white paper we had the transformer white paper we had the transformer white paper that changed everything.

that changed everything. that changed everything. How appropriate. And now How appropriate. And now How appropriate. And now all this magic is happening. So all this magic is happening. So all this magic is happening. So there you have it. Also, when I think there you have it. Also, when I think there you have it. Also, when I think about the next time you do about the next time you do about the next time you do physical magic. Next time, Devin, that physical magic. Next time, Devin, that physical magic. Next time, Devin, that you hold a physical AI summit, I think you hold a physical AI summit, I think you hold a physical AI summit, I think you should have a you should have a you should have a theme song about physical AI, and it should theme song about physical AI, and it should theme song about physical AI, and it should be sung by Olivia Newton-John. be sung by Olivia Newton-John. Because I think she has the Because I think she has the perfect song for it. perfect song for it. Will you and Leonard come to play it and Will you and Leonard come to play it and Will you and Leonard come to play it and dance to it? Will you dance to it? dance to it? Will you dance to it? Of course we'll dance it. You have a Of course we'll dance it. You have a partner, yes. Gods. That's what partner, yes. Gods. That's what partner, yes. Gods. That's what everyone wants to see, you know? Of everyone wants to see, you know? Of everyone wants to see, you know? Of course. It's like we're putting on course. It's like we're putting on shorts too. Yes, Leonard will. shorts too. Yes, Leonard will. Yes. Yes. Yes. Or the dolphin shorts. Or the dolphin shorts. Dolphin shorts. Now you're Dolphin shorts. Now you're talking. Wow, it's been a long time since I talking. Wow, it's been a long time since I talking. Wow, it's been a long time since I heard that term. My God. Oh. heard that term. My God. Oh. heard that term. My God. Oh. How crazy. Well, last night I went to the movies.

How crazy. Well, last night I went to the movies. Last night I watched the premiere of Last night I watched the premiere of Facebook's new movie, The Social Facebook's new movie, The Social Facebook's new movie, The Social Reckoning. Reckoning. Oh, yes. And that was done by Aaron Sorkin, who And that was done by Aaron Sorkin, who also wrote The also wrote The also wrote The Social Network movie. Uh, and it was about the woman Social Network movie. Uh, and it was about the woman Social Network movie. Uh, and it was about the woman who is the whistleblower inside who is the whistleblower inside who is the whistleblower inside Facebook, who somehow revealed Facebook, who somehow revealed Facebook, who somehow revealed how they changed all the algorithms and how they changed all the algorithms and how they changed all the algorithms and how they were the ones how they were the ones how they were the ones radicalizing people, so, you radicalizing people, so, you radicalizing people, so, you know, they made a kind of know, they made a kind of know, they made a kind of movie about it. You know, if movie about it. You know, if movie about it. You know, if you remember the first you remember the first you remember the first Facebook movie, it was based a lot on Facebook movie, it was based a lot on Facebook movie, it was based a lot on statements made in statements made in statements made in court and things like that. And you can court and things like that. And you can court and things like that. And you can see that a little bit here too. I didn't see that a little bit here too. I didn't see that a little bit here too. I didn't think it was as good as the first one. I don't think he was think it was as good as the first one. I don't think he was think it was as good as the first one. I don't think he was trying to be. I would say it trying to be. I would say it trying to be. I would say it reminded me more of going to see All the reminded me more of going to see All the reminded me more of going to see All the President's Men or Spotlight, President's Men or Spotlight, President's Men or Spotlight, where investigative journalists where investigative journalists where investigative journalists peel back the layers, uncovering peel back the layers, uncovering peel back the layers, uncovering things, and having an internal whistleblower things, and having an internal whistleblower . The complainant is terrified for . The complainant is terrified for . The complainant is terrified for her life. You know, and I need to be her life. You know, and I need to be her life. You know, and I need to be anonymous and they can't, you know, and anonymous and they can't, you know, and anonymous and they can't, you know, and then, finally, you know, she then, finally, you know, she then, finally, you know, she finds all the documents and finds all the documents and finds all the documents and exposes everything and exposes everything and exposes everything and oh, yeah.

oh, yeah. I think it's worth watching if you don't know I think it's worth watching if you don't know all the things that, you know, and I all the things that, you know, and I all the things that, you know, and I 'm not here to put Meta down, 'm not here to put Meta down, 'm not here to put Meta down, but they've done a lot of things to but they've done a lot of things to but they've done a lot of things to themselves, you know? And it's quite themselves, you know? And it's quite themselves, you know? And it's quite interesting. Pretty interesting, you interesting. Pretty interesting, you interesting. Pretty interesting, you know, it makes you feel like at some know, it makes you feel like at some know, it makes you feel like at some point they realized that point they realized that point they realized that Facebook's audience was Facebook's audience was Facebook's audience was aging and the things that aging and the things that aging and the things that worked to keep attention worked to keep attention worked to keep attention on the platform weren't working as well on the platform weren't working as well on the platform weren't working as well . And so, they needed something . And so, they needed something . And so, they needed something new. And then you see the scene where new. And then you see the scene where new. And then you see the scene where Zuckerberg says, "Well, you know, it Zuckerberg says, "Well, you know, it Zuckerberg says, "Well, you know, it used to be totally based on used to be totally based on used to be totally based on likes. Remember it was like, likes. Remember it was like, likes. Remember it was like, okay, if you liked something, we'd okay, if you liked something, we'd okay, if you liked something, we'd send you more of those things, send you more of those things, right? Uh, and then he said, right? Uh, and then he said, right? Uh, and then he said, okay, we'll give—I'm probably okay, we'll give—I'm probably okay, we'll give—I'm probably saying this wrong—five points for a saying this wrong—five points for a saying this wrong—five points for a like, we'll give you 10 points for an like, we'll give you 10 points for an like, we'll give you 10 points for an emoji, 15 points if you comment, emoji, 15 points if you comment, emoji, 15 points if you comment, and 30 points if you share it." And and 30 points if you share it." And and 30 points if you share it." And they talked about the effect of they talked about the effect of they talked about the effect of resharing, and then they started to resharing, and then they started to resharing, and then they started to realize that, literally, the realize that, literally, the realize that, literally, the algorithm was funneling people algorithm was funneling people algorithm was funneling people into these groups of all kinds of into these groups of all kinds of into these groups of all kinds of horrible things that you've seen, you know, horrible things that you've seen, you know, no.

no. on social media, where on social media, where on social media, where misinformation and all sorts of things came together. And misinformation and all sorts of things came together. And misinformation and all sorts of things came together. And so you can see the background of what's so you can see the background of what's so you can see the background of what's happening. And they do so in a non- happening. And they do so in a non- happening. And they do so in a non- linear way. They go to the future, they will return. Yes, it linear way. They go to the future, they will return. Yes, it linear way. They go to the future, they will return. Yes, it was interesting. It's educational, at was interesting. It's educational, at was interesting. It's educational, at least, you know? least, you know? least, you know? Yes. Yes. Yes. And it takes a brave person to And it takes a brave person to And it takes a brave person to be a whistleblower like this be a whistleblower like this be a whistleblower like this woman was. And obviously, Meta has been woman was. And obviously, Meta has been woman was. And obviously, Meta has been sued to oblivion, but sued to oblivion, but sued to oblivion, but they're not forgotten because they make so much they're not forgotten because they make so much they're not forgotten because they make so much money that they're still in business, money that they're still in business, you know? I don't know if these were you know? I don't know if these were you know? I don't know if these were real words that were ever spoken, but they real words that were ever spoken, but they real words that were ever spoken, but they were something really powerful in the were something really powerful in the were something really powerful in the movie. He was one of movie. He was one of movie. He was one of Zuckerberg's right-hand men, a kind of Zuckerberg's right-hand men, a kind of Zuckerberg's right-hand men, a kind of person like... Talking to the person like... Talking to the person like... Talking to the Wall Street Journal reporter. There was a lot of Wall Street Journal reporter. There was a lot of Wall Street Journal reporter. There was a lot of arrogance, like, you don't know who you arrogance, like, you don't know who you arrogance, like, you don't know who you 're dealing with. We are twice as 're dealing with. We are twice as 're dealing with. We are twice as big as the largest country on the big as the largest country on the big as the largest country on the planet. They made a comment like, " planet. They made a comment like, " We are in a post-government era." " We are in a post-government era." " We are in a post-government era." " Yes. Yes. Yes. We're much bigger and more important We're much bigger and more important We're much bigger and more important than any small government. Never than any small government. Never than any small government. Never mind. Quite interesting, indeed mind. Quite interesting, indeed mind. Quite interesting, indeed . Yes, that's why they're . Yes, that's why they're . Yes, that's why they're trying to get into small trying to get into small trying to get into small businesses and become a fabric of businesses and become a fabric of businesses and become a fabric of small businesses. They did that with the small businesses. They did that with the small businesses. They did that with the latest Muse update. And now it latest Muse update. And now it latest Muse update. And now it 's available. You don't need to buy 's available. You don't need to buy 's available. You don't need to buy that little Tom-Tamagotchi device that little Tom-Tamagotchi device , do you?

, do you? , do you? Wait, what? My Tamagotchi? Wait, what? My Tamagotchi? Wait, what? My Tamagotchi? Yes, you can. You'll have it on the iPad, the Yes, you can. You'll have it on the iPad, the Yes, you can. You'll have it on the iPad, the iPhone, and the Android phone, so it'll be iPhone, and the Android phone, so it'll be iPhone, and the Android phone, so it'll be everywhere. everywhere. everywhere. Yes. Yes. Yes. But, going back to Devin's comment, I do But, going back to Devin's comment, I do But, going back to Devin's comment, I do n't think what are perceived as n't think what are perceived as n't think what are perceived as regulations are actually regulations are actually regulations are actually guardrails for social protection guardrails for social protection guardrails for social protection from the adverse impacts of AI. But from the adverse impacts of AI. But , obviously, there's a sovereign element , obviously, there's a sovereign element , obviously, there's a sovereign element to it, which is to it, which is to it, which is becoming increasingly anti- becoming increasingly anti- becoming increasingly anti- American technology, anti-US. And that's American technology, anti-US. And that's American technology, anti-US. And that's an area of ​​innovation that, in some an area of ​​innovation that, in some an area of ​​innovation that, in some of these markets, is true. It's a of these markets, is true. It's a of these markets, is true. It's a shame... Well, you know what? It's a shame... Well, you know what? It's a shame... Well, you know what? It's a reaction to what's going on. And yes reaction to what's going on. And yes , all of this is educational for a lot of , all of this is educational for a lot of , all of this is educational for a lot of people. I remember almost 9 years ago I people. I remember almost 9 years ago I people. I remember almost 9 years ago I gave a couple of..." Talks about how gave a couple of..." Talks about how gave a couple of..." Talks about how these companies operate and how these companies operate and how these companies operate and how the entire digital marketing sector is like the entire digital marketing sector is like the entire digital marketing sector is like digital surveillance, right? And this digital surveillance, right? And this digital surveillance, right? And this was before the book on was before the book on was before the book on the surveillance economy came out. And because I the surveillance economy came out. And because I the surveillance economy came out. And because I work with these companies, I know how they've work with these companies, I know how they've work with these companies, I know how they've evolved over evolved over evolved over the decades. And people didn't the decades. And people didn't the decades. And people didn't know that. People in digital marketing know that. People in digital marketing know that. People in digital marketing had no idea what they were had no idea what they were had no idea what they were getting into. And now, if you look at the

getting into. And now, if you look at the getting into. And now, if you look at the whole system, it's all rigged. whole system, it's all rigged. And it's also a lot of crap. And it's also a lot of crap. Well, many of you know this; we Well, many of you know this; we Well, many of you know this; we 've mentioned it before. The 've mentioned it before. The 've mentioned it before. The impressions that people are paying for, that impressions that people are paying for, that marketing teams are paying for, they know are garbage. They marketing teams are paying for, they know are garbage. They just don't tell their just don't tell their just don't tell their executives because they don't want their executives because they don't want their executives because they don't want their budgets to disappear. budgets to disappear. budgets to disappear. Yes. Yes. Yes. But they're throwing money But they're throwing money But they're throwing money away. But they're enriching away. But they're enriching away. But they're enriching these companies, like, you know, the these companies, like, you know, the these companies, like, you know, the company that hosts this platform. You company that hosts this platform. You company that hosts this platform. You know, it's a fact. And a lot of people know, it's a fact. And a lot of people know, it's a fact. And a lot of people know that. And the whole pay-to- know that. And the whole pay-to- know that. And the whole pay-to- play dynamic is exactly that. You know, there are play dynamic is exactly that. You know, there are play dynamic is exactly that. You know, there are only so many eyes only so many eyes only so many eyes in the world. Right? And now what are they in the world. Right? And now what are they in the world. Right? And now what are they trying to do? Oh, we have these trying to do? Oh, we have these trying to do? Oh, we have these agents going around doing all agents going around doing all agents going around doing all these things for you, like buying things you did these things for you, like buying things you did these things for you, like buying things you did n't want 10% of the time so n't want 10% of the time so n't want 10% of the time so we can impose expensive we can impose expensive we can impose expensive reverse logistics on small reverse logistics on small reverse logistics on small businesses, right? Unintended consequences businesses, right? Unintended consequences businesses, right? Unintended consequences , but yeah, you know, people , but yeah, you know, people , but yeah, you know, people just don't know, you know?

just don't know, you know? just don't know, you know? People don't know. And I think movies People don't know. And I think movies People don't know. And I think movies like that are good. At least like that are good. At least like that are good. At least they raise some degree of they raise some degree of they raise some degree of fundamental concern, and then fundamental concern, and then fundamental concern, and then maybe they get educated, but yeah, this whole thing maybe they get educated, but yeah, this whole thing maybe they get educated, but yeah, this whole thing has been kind of like a has been kind of like a has been kind of like a circus act. I mean, these companies circus act. I mean, these companies circus act. I mean, these companies literally represent our literally represent our literally represent our messed-up economy. You know, this whole thing messed-up economy. You know, this whole thing messed-up economy. You know, this whole thing is fleeting. Let's say the EU and is fleeting. Let's say the EU and is fleeting. Let's say the EU and other markets decide to ban all other markets decide to ban all other markets decide to ban all US social media platforms. US social media platforms. What will happen to these companies? What will happen to these companies? What will happen to these companies? They'll disappear. And they can. They'll disappear. And they can. They'll disappear. And they can. I mean, or if the situation gets I mean, or if the situation gets I mean, or if the situation gets worse to the point where these worse to the point where these worse to the point where these AI platforms are collecting all AI platforms are collecting all AI platforms are collecting all our information, infringing on our information, infringing on our information, infringing on rights, and creating high- rights, and creating high- rights, and creating high- fidelity profiles of every single individual, right? fidelity profiles of every single individual, right? fidelity profiles of every single individual, right? Those digital duplicates of everyone. That Those digital duplicates of everyone. That Those digital duplicates of everyone. That 's extremely... Dangerous, it's 's extremely... Dangerous, it's 's extremely... Dangerous, it's really dangerous. really dangerous. Representatives from all over the world. That's Representatives from all over the world. That's very dangerous. You know, it's very dangerous. You know, it's very dangerous. You know, it's super dangerous. You've heard super dangerous. You've heard super dangerous. You've heard about American companies, and this will about American companies, and this will about American companies, and this will also sound arrogant when they say also sound arrogant when they say also sound arrogant when they say whatever it is—it could be something about whatever it is—it could be something about whatever it is—it could be something about social media—"We're going to ban this social media—"We're going to ban this social media—"We're going to ban this in England or Europe or whatever."

in England or Europe or whatever." in England or Europe or whatever." Or, you know, like you're Or, you know, like you're Or, you know, like you're seeing more and more seeing more and more seeing more and more security regulations, or some security regulations, or some security regulations, or some new ones, CRA or something, in Europe, new ones, CRA or something, in Europe, you know? And if you are found guilty, you know? And if you are found guilty, you know? And if you are found guilty, we will take 10% of your we will take 10% of your we will take 10% of your annual income. annual income. annual income. Yes. Yes. Yes. And sometimes it seems that they are attacking And sometimes it seems that they are attacking And sometimes it seems that they are attacking American companies because they are American companies because they are American companies because they are the dominant ones used in the dominant ones used in the dominant ones used in Europe in this scenario. Sometimes Europe in this scenario. Sometimes Europe in this scenario. Sometimes you hear that fear that says we have to you hear that fear that says we have to you hear that fear that says we have to do a much better job than we are do a much better job than we are do a much better job than we are now. But sometimes I hear that now. But sometimes I hear that now. But sometimes I hear that we're all going to withdraw from we're all going to withdraw from we're all going to withdraw from Europe together. And everyone is going to Europe together. And everyone is going to Europe together. And everyone is going to withdraw from Europe because the withdraw from Europe because the withdraw from Europe because the regulations are so strict that I can't regulations are so strict that I can't regulations are so strict that I can't do business here and I can't do business here and I can't do business here and I can't risk this for my company. And I hear risk this for my company. And I hear risk this for my company. And I hear arrogant terms like: "If Europe arrogant terms like: "If Europe arrogant terms like: "If Europe continues doing this, the continues doing this, the continues doing this, the European Commission will end up being a haven of European Commission will end up being a haven of European Commission will end up being a haven of peace and will not be relevant to the rest peace and will not be relevant to the rest peace and will not be relevant to the rest of the planet because it will regulate of the planet because it will regulate of the planet because it will regulate itself until it ceases to be relevant." itself until it ceases to be relevant." itself until it ceases to be relevant." So you definitely see both So you definitely see both So you definitely see both sides.

sides. sides. Yes, but I think it will be a great Yes, but I think it will be a great Yes, but I think it will be a great incentive for Europeans to incentive for Europeans to incentive for Europeans to start investing in their own start investing in their own start investing in their own technology. You know, there's a technology. You know, there's a technology. You know, there's a growing concern about growing concern about growing concern about our capacity to, you know, have our capacity to, you know, have our capacity to, you know, have our own intelligence, so to our own intelligence, so to our own intelligence, so to speak. And I gave a presentation that was speak. And I gave a presentation that was speak. And I gave a presentation that was in C-Pass AAA. And you know, I thought I was going to in C-Pass AAA. And you know, I thought I was going to in C-Pass AAA. And you know, I thought I was going to talk about network APIs and talk about network APIs and talk about network APIs and these guys kind of bringing in this AI these guys kind of bringing in this AI these guys kind of bringing in this AI infrastructure-related stuff infrastructure-related stuff infrastructure-related stuff . And I found out at the last minute, . And I found out at the last minute, . And I found out at the last minute, so I had to come up with the platform so I had to come up with the platform so I had to come up with the platform the night before on the flight. I was freaking out the night before on the flight. I was freaking out the night before on the flight. I was freaking out . I thought, dude, what the . I thought, dude, what the . I thought, dude, what the hell, dude? But then I went on hell, dude? But then I went on hell, dude? But then I went on stage and it was, honestly, a great stage and it was, honestly, a great exercise in doing things halfway, exercise in doing things halfway, it was a great exploration which, and I'll it was a great exploration which, and I'll it was a great exploration which, and I'll share some of that on LinkedIn. share some of that on LinkedIn. But the agenda is to find out, okay, to what extent are we really to what extent are we really to what extent are we really behind? And what, what and how do behind? And what, what and how do behind? And what, what and how do we get to our own sovereign move now we get to our own sovereign move now we get to our own sovereign move now ? Where do we need to invest?

? Where do we need to invest? ? Where do we need to invest? So these questions are So these questions are So these questions are arising. And I think the more arising. And I think the more arising. And I think the more we do, the more we do, the more we do, the more American companies will resist, even the American companies will resist, even the American companies will resist, even the defense industry, you know, these defense industry, you know, these defense industry, you know, these companies, these countries, especially companies, these countries, especially companies, these countries, especially Europe, are going to invest in their own Europe, are going to invest in their own Europe, are going to invest in their own things. And it's not that... I mean, the things. And it's not that... I mean, the things. And it's not that... I mean, the Swedes and the Finns are, you Swedes and the Finns are, you Swedes and the Finns are, you know, wonderfully positioned for know, wonderfully positioned for know, wonderfully positioned for some of the new some of the new some of the new defense technologies. And everything else. I mean defense technologies. And everything else. I mean , it's incredible. Think about those two , it's incredible. Think about those two , it's incredible. Think about those two countries in particular, how innovative and countries in particular, how innovative and countries in particular, how innovative and pioneering they have historically been, pioneering they have historically been, pioneering they have historically been, right? And if they can find right? And if they can find right? And if they can find local markets in Europe, you know, local markets in Europe, you know, local markets in Europe, you know, I agree with you. It's arrogant I agree with you. It's arrogant I agree with you. It's arrogant for people in the US to think that for people in the US to think that for people in the US to think that Europe is somehow like, you know, Europe is somehow like, you know, Europe is somehow like, you know, the sick person of the Western world or the the sick person of the Western world or the the sick person of the Western world or the sick person of the Western world. You sick person of the Western world. You sick person of the Western world. You know, know, know, think Sweden, I think Saab.

think Sweden, I think Saab. think Sweden, I think Saab. Yes. Yes. Yes. Not just for cars anymore. In fact, I used to Not just for cars anymore. In fact, I used to Not just for cars anymore. In fact, I used to think Saabs were really think Saabs were really think Saabs were really cool cars. Yes. cool cars. Yes. cool cars. Yes. I love Saabs. I love Saabs. I love Saabs. They manufacture fantastic They manufacture fantastic They manufacture fantastic fighter jets. They manufacture fighter jets. They manufacture fighter jets. They manufacture air-independent propulsion systems for submarines air-independent propulsion systems for submarines air-independent propulsion systems for submarines that are quieter than that are quieter than that are quieter than anything we've ever built in the U.S. anything we've ever built in the U.S. anything we've ever built in the U.S. Yes, a lot of innovation. Of course. Yes, a lot of innovation. Of course. Yes, a lot of innovation. Of course. On the communications side On the communications side On the communications side too, obviously, right? What? too, obviously, right? What? too, obviously, right? What? Oh, yes. Only a submariner would Oh, yes. Only a submariner would Oh, yes. Only a submariner would know. know. know. Yes, I mean, is it Submariner or Yes, I mean, is it Submariner or Yes, I mean, is it Submariner or Submariner? Or is it Submariner? And you Submariner? Or is it Submariner? And you Submariner? Or is it Submariner? And you told me it wasn't a told me it wasn't a told me it wasn't a Submariner. You could buy a Rolex Submariner. You could buy a Rolex Submariner. You could buy a Rolex Submariner. But yes, and that's how Submariner. But yes, and that's how Submariner. But yes, and that's how someone will know if you're not legitimate. If someone will know if you're not legitimate. If someone will know if you're not legitimate. If you say, you know, like people say, " you say, you know, like people say, " Oh yeah, I was in the Navy. I was a Oh yeah, I was in the Navy. I was a Oh yeah, I was in the Navy. I was a submariner." And they say, "I caught you." " submariner." And they say, "I caught you." " Isn't Isn't Isn't Sub-Mariner also a DC Comics hero? Sub-Mariner also a DC Comics hero? Probably. Probably. Yeah. You Probably. Probably. Yeah. You know, it's like when someone says, ' know, it's like when someone says, ' know, it's like when someone says, ' Yeah, I used to work in Silicon Yeah, I used to work in Silicon Yeah, I used to work in Silicon Valley.'" Like...

Valley.'" Like... Valley.'" Like... Oh, yeah, sure. Oh, yeah, sure. Silicone. Silicone. Very good. Now I know it's not...It's not Very good. Now I know it's not...It's not Very good. Now I know it's not...It's not the Bay Area. Yes, but you the Bay Area. Yes, but you the Bay Area. Yes, but you know, there are times when it's good to know, there are times when it's good to know, there are times when it's good to know the wrong way to say something know the wrong way to say something know the wrong way to say something or just a different way in or just a different way in or just a different way in a difficult situation. I know I've already a difficult situation. I know I've already a difficult situation. I know I've already used this example in the series before, used this example in the series before, used this example in the series before, but I think it was like in the second but I think it was like in the second but I think it was like in the second Die Hard movie, you know, Die Hard movie, you know, Die Hard movie, you know, Bruce Willis is getting into an Bruce Willis is getting into an Bruce Willis is getting into an elevator and there are a bunch of thugs elevator and there are a bunch of thugs elevator and there are a bunch of thugs there, but they're all dressed up there, but they're all dressed up there, but they're all dressed up and all that. And then they want him to and all that. And then they want him to and all that. And then they want him to think they're good and he goes in there think they're good and he goes in there , but one of them makes the mistake of , but one of them makes the mistake of , but one of them makes the mistake of referring to the elevator as a lift. referring to the elevator as a lift. referring to the elevator as a lift. And that's what made him think, and And that's what made him think, and And that's what made him think, and then of course, he had to kill them then of course, he had to kill them then of course, he had to kill them all in the all in the all in the elevator like one does, right? You already elevator like one does, right? You already elevator like one does, right? You already know. Well, anyway, a little know. Well, anyway, a little know. Well, anyway, a little advice for you. Yes, it's great. Hey, advice for you. Yes, it's great. Hey, advice for you. Yes, it's great. Hey, I wanted to tell you... Well, one of the I wanted to tell you... Well, one of the I wanted to tell you... Well, one of the big news stories this week was the big news stories this week was the big news stories this week was the announcement that SpaceX is acquiring announcement that SpaceX is acquiring announcement that SpaceX is acquiring Spectrum, and now you have all these Spectrum, and now you have all these Spectrum, and now you have all these people freaking out, people freaking out, people freaking out, media analysts and influencers saying, "Wow, it media analysts and influencers saying, "Wow, it media analysts and influencers saying, "Wow, it 's doomsday for 's doomsday for 's doomsday for telecoms." "I want you to know, I want to telecoms." "I want you to know, I want to telecoms." "I want you to know, I want to know what Andrea thinks about this.

know what Andrea thinks about this. What's your reaction to all this What's your reaction to all this fuss? Do you think the carriers fuss? Do you think the carriers fuss? Do you think the carriers are dead? are dead? are dead? Minimal. Minimal reaction from me Minimal. Minimal reaction from me Minimal. Minimal reaction from me so far. I would say I think I so far. I would say I think I so far. I would say I think I need to look into this more, need to look into this more, need to look into this more, but my reaction is minimal. Of but my reaction is minimal. Of but my reaction is minimal. Of course, the excitement comes from the type course, the excitement comes from the type course, the excitement comes from the type of spectrum they're getting into of spectrum they're getting into of spectrum they're getting into , right? It's 800 MHz, so , right? It's 800 MHz, so , right? It's 800 MHz, so I love it. I love it. Yes, I I love it. I love it. Yes, I I love it. I love it. Yes, I love it. Yes. Well, I started my career love it. Yes. Well, I started my career , you don't know how many years ago, but , you don't know how many years ago, but , you don't know how many years ago, but you can do the math with 800 MHz. With 800 you can do the math with 800 MHz. With 800 you can do the math with 800 MHz. With 800 MHz, we knew it was good, but we didn't MHz, we knew it was good, but we didn't MHz, we knew it was good, but we didn't know how good it was until know how good it was until know how good it was until the other spectrum came along, and of course the other spectrum came along, and of course , , yes? Yes, PCS, you know, yes? Yes, PCS, you know, yes? Yes, PCS, you know, PCS. PCS. PCS. Yes. Yes. Yes. Right. Right. Right. But I've seen some reactions today, But I've seen some reactions today, But I've seen some reactions today, but I have to form my own. Of but I have to form my own. Of but I have to form my own. Of course, you have to look at the economics course, you have to look at the economics . What does that mean for . What does that mean for . What does that mean for telecom companies in telecom companies in telecom companies in terms of customers? Retention? And is terms of customers? Retention? And is terms of customers? Retention? And is retention supposed to lie solely in, or retention supposed to lie solely in, or retention supposed to lie solely in, or depend solely on, the ability to depend solely on, the ability to depend solely on, the ability to guarantee Connectivity? Or is it about guarantee Connectivity? Or is it about guarantee Connectivity? Or is it about added value, right? So I get added value, right? So I get added value, right? So I get the feeling I left the feeling I left the feeling I left telecoms a few years ago telecoms a few years ago telecoms a few years ago because I had other things going on in my life, you

because I had other things going on in my life, you because I had other things going on in my life, you know? I took a break and I'm coming know? I took a break and I'm coming know? I took a break and I'm coming back, and the truth is, nothing has back, and the truth is, nothing has back, and the truth is, nothing has changed in terms of value. If changed in terms of value. If changed in terms of value. If people are reacting so strongly to people are reacting so strongly to people are reacting so strongly to this announcement... this announcement... this announcement... Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, where's the value in It's like, where's the value in It's like, where's the value in telecoms? And telecoms? And telecoms? And well, as you know, sometimes it's just well, as you know, sometimes it's just well, as you know, sometimes it's just these analysts who are living in a these analysts who are living in a these analysts who are living in a bubble and need to create something bubble and need to create something bubble and need to create something relevant for themselves, or like relevant for themselves, or like relevant for themselves, or like this is trendy. And this is trendy. And this is trendy. And average people are walking down the street and saying, "I don't average people are walking down the street and saying, "I don't average people are walking down the street and saying, "I don't even know what you're talking about." "I even know what you're talking about." "I even know what you're talking about." "I really don't care." But you really don't care." But you really don't care." But you know, since we're all know, since we're all know, since we're all technology and technology and technology and telecom historians on this show, and you telecom historians on this show, and you telecom historians on this show, and you may have seen the synopsis of may have seen the synopsis of may have seen the synopsis of this, you know, where did this this, you know, where did this this, you know, where did this 800-megahertz band come from? These megahertz bands came from 800-megahertz band come from? These megahertz bands came from 800-megahertz band come from? These megahertz bands came from ... T-Mobile, when T-Mobile did ... T-Mobile, when T-Mobile did ... T-Mobile, when T-Mobile did the acquisition, the merger with Sprint, the acquisition, the merger with Sprint, the acquisition, the merger with Sprint, they were told they had to get rid they were told they had to get rid they were told they had to get rid of that 800-megahertz band of that 800-megahertz band of that 800-megahertz band from Sprint, from Sprint, from Sprint, which they had, well, and they couldn't do it which they had, well, and they couldn't do it . They had a hard time. Nobody . They had a hard time. Nobody . They had a hard time. Nobody wanted to buy it, and they even put it up wanted to buy it, and they even put it up wanted to buy it, and they even put it up with another group to try to sell it, with another group to try to sell it, with another group to try to sell it, but they couldn't do it or whatever.

but they couldn't do it or whatever. but they couldn't do it or whatever. So it's been sitting on a So it's been sitting on a So it's been sitting on a shelf since the acquisition, shelf since the acquisition, shelf since the acquisition, since the merger happened. And since the merger happened. And since the merger happened. And let's go back even further, where did let's go back even further, where did let's go back even further, where did Sprint get it from? They got it from Sprint get it from? They got it from Sprint get it from? They got it from Nextel. Nextel walkie-talkies Nextel. Nextel walkie-talkies Nextel. Nextel walkie-talkies . . Motorola phones. Yeah. Motorola phones. Yeah. Yeah. Did Yeah. Did anybody know anybody who had anybody know anybody who had anybody know anybody who had a Nextel phone? I remember having a Nextel phone? I remember having a Nextel phone? I remember having one at one point. one at one point. one at one point. Cool. Cool. Cool. And you could start talking. Yeah. I did And you could start talking. Yeah. I did And you could start talking. Yeah. I did n't have one, but yeah. It n't have one, but yeah. It n't have one, but yeah. It was a company in the that I worked on. They was a company in the that I worked on. They was a company in the that I worked on. They gave it to everyone, but I gave it to everyone, but I gave it to everyone, but I saw them as saw them as saw them as construction workers. It construction workers. It construction workers. It was a great app. It was was a great app. It was was a great app. It was great, it great, it great, it died, but it was great. It died, but it was great. It died, but it was great. It died. Push-to- died. Push-to- died. Push-to- talk technology was a big deal. Yes. talk technology was a big deal. Yes. talk technology was a big deal. Yes. That was great. That was great. That was great. Yes. And I remember at some point Yes. And I remember at some point Yes. And I remember at some point working with Nextel International. I don't working with Nextel International. I don't working with Nextel International. I don't know if you remember them. It's been many know if you remember them. It's been many know if you remember them. It's been many years since they tried to implement years since they tried to implement years since they tried to implement push-to-talk technology push-to-talk technology over 3G or over HSPA in South America. over 3G or over HSPA in South America.

Right. HSPA. Yes, and then it just did Right. HSPA. Yes, and then it just did n't take off. Yes. n't take off. Yes. n't take off. Yes. But here, at the Nextel level, it was But here, at the Nextel level, it was But here, at the Nextel level, it was incredible. incredible. incredible. Yes. Yes. Yes. And then Elon acquired And then Elon acquired And then Elon acquired 800 MHz satellites, and the talking point 800 MHz satellites, and the talking point 800 MHz satellites, and the talking point is, yes, I can do things with Starlink is, yes, I can do things with Starlink is, yes, I can do things with Starlink as long as I'm outside, just like as long as I'm outside, just like as long as I'm outside, just like we talk about GPS. Indoors, it doesn't we talk about GPS. Indoors, it doesn't we talk about GPS. Indoors, it doesn't work as well, but guess what? You work as well, but guess what? You work as well, but guess what? You have an 800 MHz frequency band have an 800 MHz frequency band have an 800 MHz frequency band through walls and roofs. through walls and roofs. through walls and roofs. Yes. Yes. Yes. And then, And then, And then, courage. courage. courage. And this takes me back to my And this takes me back to my And this takes me back to my early days at Ericsson talking to early days at Ericsson talking to early days at Ericsson talking to engineers In Kista they always engineers In Kista they always engineers In Kista they always told me with certainty that if I said, told me with certainty that if I said, "What are you going to do?" "In 10 years?" " "What are you going to do?" "In 10 years?" " "What are you going to do?" "In 10 years?" " I'll be working on 6G." "And in 20 I'll be working on 6G." "And in 20 I'll be working on 6G." "And in 20 years?" "I'll be working on 7G." And I say, " years?" "I'll be working on 7G." And I say, " years?" "I'll be working on 7G." And I say, " Yes." Has it ever Yes." Has it ever occurred to you that something occurred to you that something occurred to you that something could come out of nowhere and change could come out of nowhere and change could come out of nowhere and change your whole world?" No, of course not your whole world?" No, of course not . We decide what happens, you . We decide what happens, you . We decide what happens, you know, as if they believe that Ericsson and know, as if they believe that Ericsson and know, as if they believe that Ericsson and Nokia or whatever create the path. Nokia or whatever create the path. Nokia or whatever create the path. This is the whole future. And I say, This is the whole future. And I say, This is the whole future. And I say, well, I come from this other well, I come from this other well, I come from this other technological world where someone you've technological world where someone you've technological world where someone you've never heard of and never heard of and never heard of and might even make fun of when you might even make fun of when you might even make fun of when you first see them will end up first see them will end up first see them will end up eating your lunch and disrupting eating your lunch and disrupting eating your lunch and disrupting your whole world. And they say, that your whole world. And they say, that your whole world. And they say, that could never happen. And I say, well, there's a could never happen. And I say, well, there's a could never happen. And I say, well, there's a guy doing something with a bunch of guy doing something with a bunch of guy doing something with a bunch of satellites that could ruin your whole satellites that could ruin your whole satellites that could ruin your whole plan.

plan. plan. Yes, but two things. One is the Yes, but two things. One is the Yes, but two things. One is the creativity of Sweden, not Finland, which creativity of Sweden, not Finland, which creativity of Sweden, not Finland, which you mentioned earlier. And you know, you mentioned earlier. And you know, you mentioned earlier. And you know, I lived in that ecosystem for many, I lived in that ecosystem for many, I lived in that ecosystem for many, many years and creativity was pure many years and creativity was pure many years and creativity was pure engineering, intelligence. I mean engineering, intelligence. I mean , incredible intelligence in , incredible intelligence in , incredible intelligence in engineering. Incredible. The algorithms engineering. Incredible. The algorithms , the antennas. Well, I'm more of a , the antennas. Well, I'm more of a , the antennas. Well, I'm more of a hardware person at the beginning of my hardware person at the beginning of my hardware person at the beginning of my career. So I keep coming back to that. career. So I keep coming back to that. career. So I keep coming back to that. The antennas and the algorithms, the The antennas and the algorithms, the The antennas and the algorithms, the software that communicated with the software that communicated with the software that communicated with the antennas, right? And that's what they've seen, they've had antennas, right? And that's what they've seen, they've had antennas, right? And that's what they've seen, they've had proof over the proof over the proof over the years, right? That the technology that years, right? That the technology that years, right? That the technology that emerged from their R&D was outperforming emerged from their R&D was outperforming emerged from their R&D was outperforming everything else or just surviving... everything else or just surviving... everything else or just surviving... Yes. Yes. Yes. And more. Surviving and more. Another And more. Surviving and more. Another And more. Surviving and more. Another cycle, another cycle, right? And many cycle, another cycle, right? And many cycle, another cycle, right? And many times it was political, and somehow times it was political, and somehow times it was political, and somehow that technology still won. And that that technology still won. And that that technology still won. And that 's the first thing. The second point I was going to 's the first thing. The second point I was going to 's the first thing. The second point I was going to raise. Do you think we would have the raise. Do you think we would have the raise. Do you think we would have the same reaction now if it wasn't Elon same reaction now if it wasn't Elon same reaction now if it wasn't Elon involved? If it were involved? If it were involved? If it were someone else?

someone else? Okay, that's fine, politician. And we also have to remember that it's And we also have to remember that it's just the US, you know? It's not...you just the US, you know? It's not...you just the US, you know? It's not...you 're not...you're not upsetting, you know, 're not...you're not upsetting, you know, 're not...you're not upsetting, you know, people who are casual observers of people who are casual observers of people who are casual observers of the telecommunications industry the telecommunications industry the telecommunications industry are going to freak out and say, "Oh, this are going to freak out and say, "Oh, this are going to freak out and say, "Oh, this is world domination and it's a is world domination and it's a is world domination and it's a global network." No, no, not really. I think global network." No, no, not really. I think global network." No, no, not really. I think one of the aspects that makes the one of the aspects that makes the one of the aspects that makes the acquisition of 800 MHz important acquisition of 800 MHz important acquisition of 800 MHz important is that there are people in the mobile industry is that there are people in the mobile industry is that there are people in the mobile industry who are trying to position who are trying to position who are trying to position mobile telephony as a kind of mobile telephony as a kind of mobile telephony as a kind of primary indoor connectivity, primary indoor connectivity, right? And the challenge here, the dilemma right? And the challenge here, the dilemma right? And the challenge here, the dilemma here is that most of the 800 here is that most of the 800 here is that most of the 800 MHz band is probably for voice, MHz band is probably for voice, right? Some, you know, aren't things right? Some, you know, aren't things right? Some, you know, aren't things that consume a lot of data and require that consume a lot of data and require that consume a lot of data and require an uplink and high an uplink and high an uplink and high uplink throughput because uplink throughput because uplink throughput because if you're indoors, you if you're indoors, you if you're indoors, you 're probably using Wi-Fi or something else for... you 're probably using Wi-Fi or something else for... you know, the inside...

know, the inside... But what we heard a couple of But what we heard a couple of But what we heard a couple of weeks ago or here on... you know, weeks ago or here on... you know, weeks ago or here on... you know, we used to think of Laura WAN we used to think of Laura WAN we used to think of Laura WAN as this outdoor farm, whatever as this outdoor farm, whatever as this outdoor farm, whatever and all that, everyone was and all that, everyone was and all that, everyone was talking about using Laura inside talking about using Laura inside talking about using Laura inside buildings. Because? Oh, because it's buildings. Because? Oh, because it's buildings. Because? Oh, because it's a frequency band below 1 a frequency band below 1 a frequency band below 1 GHz that can penetrate walls. GHz that can penetrate walls. GHz that can penetrate walls. As an IoT expert, I am a big As an IoT expert, I am a big As an IoT expert, I am a big believer in narrowband. I mean believer in narrowband. I mean believer in narrowband. I mean , who even remembers Sigfox? , who even remembers Sigfox? , who even remembers Sigfox? Completely. Completely. Completely. For a temperature sensor, don't For a temperature sensor, don't For a temperature sensor, don't you need...? Yes. you need...? Yes. you need...? Yes. Cellular connectivity. They are kilobytes of Cellular connectivity. They are kilobytes of Cellular connectivity. They are kilobytes of data. data. data. Yes. It's Yes. It's Yes. It's better, you know, and as you know, when better, you know, and as you know, when better, you know, and as you know, when you deploy, especially you deploy, especially you deploy, especially battery-powered IoT devices, you try to battery-powered IoT devices, you try to battery-powered IoT devices, you try to maximize maximize maximize battery life because the battery life because the battery life because the operational cost of changing that operational cost of changing that operational cost of changing that battery will wipe out the return on battery will wipe out the return on battery will wipe out the return on investment. And that's why they sometimes investment. And that's why they sometimes investment. And that's why they sometimes say, "Oh, we're going to use 5G for everything." say, "Oh, we're going to use 5G for everything." say, "Oh, we're going to use 5G for everything." No, you won't. No, you won't. No, you won't. Correct. Correct. Correct. And that's why I love the And that's why I love the And that's why I love the subgigahertz narrowband, you know, it subgigahertz narrowband, you know, it subgigahertz narrowband, you know, it should be, you know, if... should be, you know, if... should be, you know, if... Anyway. Anyway. We love it. We love it. I love what you say because I I love what you say because I I love what you say because I love what you say, Devin. It love what you say, Devin. It love what you say, Devin. It reminds me of 10 years ago, when IoT reminds me of 10 years ago, when IoT reminds me of 10 years ago, when IoT was all the rage and we were talking about was all the rage and we were talking about was all the rage and we were talking about Ericsson IoT on the 700. And about the Ericsson IoT on the 700. And about the Ericsson IoT on the 700. And about the software features that would make it software features that would make it software features that would make it super efficient. And I remember talking about it super efficient. And I remember talking about it super efficient. And I remember talking about it at home with my husband. which at home with my husband. which at home with my husband. which is also high-tech. And is also high-tech. And is also high-tech. And he disagreed. I was he disagreed. I was he disagreed. I was proposing the arguments that you proposing the arguments that you proposing the arguments that you are presenting now. And I was are presenting now. And I was are presenting now. And I was like, "Oh, you know what? Just like, "Oh, you know what? Just like, "Oh, you know what? Just support me." I say: 'No'. But it doesn't make

support me." I say: 'No'. But it doesn't make support me." I say: 'No'. But it doesn't make sense. sense. sense. Yeah, but you know, Yeah, but you know, Yeah, but you know, sometimes you have a Kool-Aid, right? Or sometimes you have a Kool-Aid, right? Or sometimes you have a Kool-Aid, right? Or do you want to have the Kool-Aid? And my do you want to have the Kool-Aid? And my do you want to have the Kool-Aid? And my husband always said, 'No'. You husband always said, 'No'. You husband always said, 'No'. You know, and that's important, right? know, and that's important, right? What? What do we have here? I mean What? What do we have here? I mean What? What do we have here? I mean , you know, there's a , you know, there's a , you know, there's a LoRa gateway here. LoRa gateway here. LoRa gateway here. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. You Yes. You Yes. You know, there's a problem here. If I put know, there's a problem here. If I put know, there's a problem here. If I put everything on Wi-Fi, sometimes I have a everything on Wi-Fi, sometimes I have a everything on Wi-Fi, sometimes I have a guest network and it times out guest network and it times out guest network and it times out . If someone upgrades their . If someone upgrades their . If someone upgrades their Wi-Fi network, then I have to go, you know, Wi-Fi network, then I have to go, you know, Wi-Fi network, then I have to go, you know, many of these implementations last many of these implementations last many of these implementations last 5 or 10 years. And you know, how 5 or 10 years. And you know, how 5 or 10 years. And you know, how often do you change an SSID or something like that? often do you change an SSID or something like that? often do you change an SSID or something like that? Clear. You Clear. You Clear. You know, Wi-Fi is great, but if know, Wi-Fi is great, but if know, Wi-Fi is great, but if I have something dedicated, I keep it off I have something dedicated, I keep it off I have something dedicated, I keep it off the main network for security, you the main network for security, you the main network for security, you know. know. Anyway, we could have, you Anyway, we could have, you know, this is all Winky is know, this is all Winky is know, this is all Winky is pushing for. This, right? And as they pushing for. This, right? And as they pushing for. This, right? And as they always say for massive IoT, always say for massive IoT, always say for massive IoT, you basically need you basically need you basically need free connectivity and a $5 sensor. We have free connectivity and a $5 sensor. We have free connectivity and a $5 sensor. We have n't reached that point yet, but n't reached that point yet, but n't reached that point yet, but if you had it, everything would be connected if you had it, everything would be connected . So, do . So, do you think we could do...?

you think we could do...? you think we could do...? I would track everything my I would track everything my I would track everything my son has because he loses everything. Do son has because he loses everything. Do you think we could do...? Do you think we you think we could do...? Do you think we you think we could do...? Do you think we could make could make could make smart buildings, smart cities with smart buildings, smart cities with smart buildings, smart cities with LoRa? LoRa? Of course. Okay. Of course. Of course. Okay. Of course. You think about the core and You think about the core and You think about the core and Laura's ecosystem has caught up. You look at Laura's ecosystem has caught up. You look at Laura's ecosystem has caught up. You look at my devices and all that and you know there are my devices and all that and you know there are my devices and all that and you know there are thousands of sensors you can thousands of sensors you can thousands of sensors you can easily deploy. And easily deploy. And easily deploy. And our friend Steve Cannon, with his our friend Steve Cannon, with his our friend Steve Cannon, with his business, has been using my business, has been using my business, has been using my devices for his business for a long time. But devices for his business for a long time. But devices for his business for a long time. But I was so excited to be able to come to the I was so excited to be able to come to the I was so excited to be able to come to the Things event and see this whole Things event and see this whole Things event and see this whole different world, right? No, I'm a fan. different world, right? No, I'm a fan. different world, right? No, I'm a fan. We need to see you next year, We need to see you next year, We need to see you next year, Devin. Devin. Devin. Of course. I really regretted missing out on Of course. I really regretted missing out on Of course. I really regretted missing out on all the fun. all the fun. Oh, yes. We had an explosion. That Oh, yes. We had an explosion. That was really...Yes, you should have been was really...Yes, you should have been was really...Yes, you should have been with us at the with us at the with us at the Masters of IoT dinners we were Masters of IoT dinners we were Masters of IoT dinners we were holding. And you too, Andrea.

holding. And you too, Andrea. holding. And you too, Andrea. We need our boy. We need our boy. So, depending on what I do So, depending on what I do professionally next year, I professionally next year, I professionally next year, I might be there. Who knows? might be there. Who knows? I think Andrea will return to IoT, and that I think Andrea will return to IoT, and that many things will happen in Texas, and that a many things will happen in Texas, and that a many things will happen in Texas, and that a lot of new IoT technology will be created lot of new IoT technology will be created lot of new IoT technology will be created using AI to make it better than what we using AI to make it better than what we using AI to make it better than what we created before. It's going to happen created before. It's going to happen created before. It's going to happen any moment. any moment. You said Texas, but one last You said Texas, but one last thought about 800 MHz and Starlink. My thought about 800 MHz and Starlink. My thought about 800 MHz and Starlink. My mind takes me to Australia. Not to Texas, mind takes me to Australia. Not to Texas, mind takes me to Australia. Not to Texas, but to Australia, right? Because it's but to Australia, right? Because it's but to Australia, right? Because it's enormous. They have 800 MHz, right? I enormous. They have 800 MHz, right? I enormous. They have 800 MHz, right? I mean, she's busy, right? mean, she's busy, right? mean, she's busy, right? But they have it. We have always worked But they have it. We have always worked But they have it. We have always worked together with Australia in terms together with Australia in terms together with Australia in terms of product availability and of product availability and of product availability and technology. So, what can technology. So, what can technology. So, what can Starlink do for Australia? I Starlink do for Australia? I Starlink do for Australia? I mean, it's not populated, right? But mean, it's not populated, right? But mean, it's not populated, right? But what could be done there what could be done there what could be done there differently? It's just a question and it differently? It's just a question and it differently? It's just a question and it might be a silly idea, but might be a silly idea, but might be a silly idea, but I wanted to finish what I was saying I wanted to finish what I was saying .

. . Yes, you're Yes, you're Yes, you're absolutely right. This frequency matters, absolutely right. This frequency matters, absolutely right. This frequency matters, you know? Why did T-Mobile, don't give me that you know? Why did T-Mobile, don't give me that you know? Why did T-Mobile, don't give me that crap, go from worst to crap, go from worst to crap, go from worst to first? How did T-Mobile go first? How did T-Mobile go first? How did T-Mobile go from last to first place? Because of from last to first place? Because of from last to first place? Because of the agreement with Sprint, right? Because the agreement with Sprint, right? Because the agreement with Sprint, right? Because they got other good things from Sprint they got other good things from Sprint , and where did Sprint get them from? , and where did Sprint get them from? , and where did Sprint get them from? Wait. Clearwire. Wait. Clearwire. Wait. Clearwire. Clearwire, 2.6. Yes. You Clearwire, 2.6. Yes. You Clearwire, 2.6. Yes. You know, Clearwire. Do you remember what know, Clearwire. Do you remember what know, Clearwire. Do you remember what 4G was supposed to be? WiMAX. 4G was supposed to be? WiMAX. 4G was supposed to be? WiMAX. WiMAX. WiMAX. WiMAX. Yes. And it didn't happen. But Craig McCaw, Yes. And it didn't happen. But Craig McCaw, Yes. And it didn't happen. But Craig McCaw, who is the ultimate wireless pioneer who is the ultimate wireless pioneer who is the ultimate wireless pioneer in the United States, built the entire in the United States, built the entire in the United States, built the entire network with WiMAX to basically provide network with WiMAX to basically provide network with WiMAX to basically provide fixed wireless access to the home with fixed wireless access to the home with fixed wireless access to the home with WiMAX, and then LTE appeared out of nowhere WiMAX, and then LTE appeared out of nowhere WiMAX, and then LTE appeared out of nowhere at the last second and swooped in and at the last second and swooped in and at the last second and swooped in and became 4G. became 4G. became 4G. Yes. That's another example of, you know, Yes. That's another example of, you know, Yes. That's another example of, you know, the creativity and innovation of Northern the creativity and innovation of Northern the creativity and innovation of Northern Europe simply disappearing. Europe simply disappearing. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. But I think T-Mobile, I think T-Mobile, But I think T-Mobile, I think T-Mobile, But I think T-Mobile, I think T-Mobile, in my opinion, is very well in my opinion, is very well in my opinion, is very well managed. It's not just about the managed. It's not just about the managed. It's not just about the assets they have, but I think they assets they have, but I think they assets they have, but I think they manage them well.

manage them well. manage them well. Yes. Yes, and they have been modernized. They've Yes. Yes, and they have been modernized. They've Yes. Yes, and they have been modernized. They've been aggressive with their modernization, been aggressive with their modernization, been aggressive with their modernization, so they're kind of a so they're kind of a so they're kind of a top-tier company. top-tier company. top-tier company. Yes. It's very well managed. Yes. Yes. It's very well managed. Yes. Yes. It's very well managed. Yes. I think they're great, I think they're I think they're great, I think they're I think they're great, I think they're great marketers. great marketers. great marketers. Yes. Well, yes, there's that too. And I was Yes. Well, yes, there's that too. And I was Yes. Well, yes, there's that too. And I was also going to mention that AT&T and also going to mention that AT&T and also going to mention that AT&T and Verizon tend to be a bit more Verizon tend to be a bit more Verizon tend to be a bit more pragmatic in this respect. I pragmatic in this respect. I pragmatic in this respect. I mean, if you talk to people in the network mean, if you talk to people in the network mean, if you talk to people in the network who aren't so involved with all who aren't so involved with all who aren't so involved with all the superficial stuff above, you the superficial stuff above, you the superficial stuff above, you know, all the over-the-top stuff, they're know, all the over-the-top stuff, they're know, all the over-the-top stuff, they're very, very practical. They have their very, very practical. They have their very, very practical. They have their roadmap. They know that change takes a long roadmap. They know that change takes a long roadmap. They know that change takes a long time. Modernization. I mean, time. Modernization. I mean, time. Modernization. I mean, they have a lot of inherited things that they have to they have a lot of inherited things that they have to they have a lot of inherited things that they have to move. And then, you move. And then, you move. And then, you know, it's easy to vilify them and say that know, it's easy to vilify them and say that know, it's easy to vilify them and say that you guys are behind the times, but you're you guys are behind the times, but you're you guys are behind the times, but you're evolving what you have, evolving what you have, evolving what you have, and I think my opinion is that you're a and I think my opinion is that you're a and I think my opinion is that you're a lot more thoughtful about where lot more thoughtful about where lot more thoughtful about where you invest to modernize you invest to modernize you invest to modernize compared to what compared to what compared to what T-Mobile has done. T-Mobile takes T-Mobile has done. T-Mobile takes T-Mobile has done. T-Mobile takes more risks, right?

more risks, right? more risks, right? Yes a lot. Yes a lot. Yes a lot. Yes, who wasn't pragmatic? Yes, who wasn't pragmatic? Who took risks? Who broke Who took risks? Who broke Who took risks? Who broke all the rules? The best thing that ever all the rules? The best thing that ever all the rules? The best thing that ever happened to the entire industry was John happened to the entire industry was John happened to the entire industry was John Legere getting there. Legere getting there. Legere getting there. Yes, exactly. I was thinking about him. Yes, exactly. I was thinking about him. Yes, exactly. I was thinking about him. Because of him and because of marketing. In fact, Because of him and because of marketing. In fact, Because of him and because of marketing. In fact, everyone I worked with everyone I worked with everyone I worked with at Ericsson always had at Ericsson always had at Ericsson always had good things to say about Ericsson good things to say about Ericsson good things to say about Ericsson managing T-Mobile's network for them managing T-Mobile's network for them managing T-Mobile's network for them because they didn't have the because they didn't have the because they didn't have the engineering knowledge to do it themselves. They did engineering knowledge to do it themselves. They did n't know what they were doing. That sounds n't know what they were doing. That sounds awful. There were some people who awful. There were some people who awful. There were some people who knew what they were doing. But the knew what they were doing. But the knew what they were doing. But the reality was that you had to have reality was that you had to have reality was that you had to have someone. However, it didn't happen by someone. However, it didn't happen by someone. However, it didn't happen by magic. AT&T tried to acquire magic. AT&T tried to acquire magic. AT&T tried to acquire T-Mobile many, many years ago and the T-Mobile many, many years ago and the T-Mobile many, many years ago and the government shut it down, but there was a government shut it down, but there was a government shut it down, but there was a breakup fee of, I forget how many breakup fee of, I forget how many breakup fee of, I forget how many billions of dollars. billions of dollars. billions of dollars. Yes, yes, yes. Yes, yes, yes. Yes, yes, yes. And then the last T-Mobile location And then the last T-Mobile location , they're going to die, but they got this , they're going to die, but they got this incredible billion-dollar cash deposit and this new incredible billion-dollar cash deposit and this new gunslinger John Legere comes in and says gunslinger John Legere comes in and says gunslinger John Legere comes in and says let's smash everything. We broke the let's smash everything. We broke the let's smash everything. We broke the rule book and started over, and it rule book and started over, and it rule book and started over, and it worked. And then the power of one's worked. And then the power of one's worked. And then the power of one's willpower, of willpower, of willpower, of creativity, of a person in creativity, of a person in creativity, of a person in marketing in reality and how we marketing in reality and how we marketing in reality and how we delve deeper into GTM. Sometimes that delve deeper into GTM. Sometimes that delve deeper into GTM. Sometimes that became more important than became more important than became more important than technology or anything else.

technology or anything else. technology or anything else. Yes, yes, yes. Yes, yes, yes. Yes, yes, yes. And that's exactly why I called them And that's exactly why I called them And that's exactly why I called them a well-managed company. I was a well-managed company. I was a well-managed company. I was saying that it's saying that it's saying that it's brilliant. brilliant. brilliant. Yes. Yes. Yes. It's brilliant. And then they got It's brilliant. And then they got It's brilliant. And then they got great and got excellent great and got excellent great and got excellent Sprint bands, obviously. You know, Sprint bands, obviously. You know, Sprint bands, obviously. You know, long-range 5G, you know, with the long-range 5G, you know, with the long-range 5G, you know, with the Goldilocks mid-band that nobody else had. Goldilocks mid-band that nobody else had. Goldilocks mid-band that nobody else had. That made all the difference. That made all the difference. That made all the difference. And they were the first to cut the And they were the first to cut the And they were the first to cut the third layer, which was the millimeter third layer, which was the millimeter third layer, which was the millimeter of the three-layer cake that we were supposed to of the three-layer cake that we were supposed to of the three-layer cake that we were supposed to have with the have with the have with the millimeter wave that never...Where's millimeter wave that never...Where's millimeter wave that never...Where's the military...I can't see it. Well, you the military...I can't see it. Well, you the military...I can't see it. Well, you know, it bounced off this know, it bounced off this know, it bounced off this glass window here. glass window here. glass window here. They are millimeters. They are millimeters. They are millimeters. Yes, I was at the Qualcomm Yes, I was at the Qualcomm Yes, I was at the Qualcomm Snapdragon Summit when T-Mobile was there Snapdragon Summit when T-Mobile was there Snapdragon Summit when T-Mobile was there at one of the analyst meetings, at one of the analyst meetings, at one of the analyst meetings, uh, uh, you know, and they had the uh, uh, you know, and they had the uh, uh, you know, and they had the T-Mobile cake there, and the year before there were T-Mobile cake there, and the year before there were T-Mobile cake there, and the year before there were three, and then they cut off the three, and then they cut off the three, and then they cut off the top, and, uh, uh, who was it, uh, top, and, uh, uh, who was it, uh, top, and, uh, uh, who was it, uh, Kory, uh, I...I...I always have Kory, uh, I...I...I always have Kory, uh, I...I...I always have trouble with his last name. He, he's trouble with his last name. He, he's trouble with his last name. He, he's the the the one.

one. one. Kopenhaver, you know. Kopenhaver, you know. Kopenhaver, you know. Copenhagen, yes. Copenhagen, yes. Copenhagen, yes. Yes, yes. I said, "What happened to the Yes, yes. I said, "What happened to the Yes, yes. I said, "What happened to the third one?" He gave me a strange look and said, "No third one?" He gave me a strange look and said, "No third one?" He gave me a strange look and said, "No comment." comment." That third layer was really cool That third layer was really cool when we were doing the when we were doing the when we were doing the initial 5G demonstrations, where they would initial 5G demonstrations, where they would initial 5G demonstrations, where they would basically stand right in front of basically stand right in front of basically stand right in front of the cell tower the cell tower the cell tower and say, "I'm going to get 10 gigabits. and say, "I'm going to get 10 gigabits. and say, "I'm going to get 10 gigabits. I'm going to run a data center on my I'm going to run a data center on my I'm going to run a data center on my phone." But as soon as I get phone." But as soon as I get phone." But as soon as I get behind the glass window, behind the glass window, behind the glass window, goodbye. Yes. goodbye. Yes. goodbye. Yes. Yes, it won't work. Yes, it won't work. Yes, it won't work. Yes, the whole thing about physical AI. Yes, the whole thing about physical AI. Yes, the whole thing about physical AI. I think we need to rethink it. I I think we need to rethink it. I I think we need to rethink it. I really don't trust the way really don't trust the way really don't trust the way the telecom industry, the telecom industry, the telecom industry, including T-Mobile, talks about including T-Mobile, talks about including T-Mobile, talks about physical AI. They have to be very careful physical AI. They have to be very careful physical AI. They have to be very careful with kinetic tokens because with kinetic tokens because with kinetic tokens because nowadays kinetic means military. nowadays kinetic means military. nowadays kinetic means military. Kinetic action, XYZ kinetic. Kinetic action, XYZ kinetic. Kinetic action, XYZ kinetic. Okay, so does Captain Kirk fire Okay, so does Captain Kirk fire Okay, so does Captain Kirk fire tokens? Is it like a photon torpedo? tokens? Is it like a photon torpedo? tokens? Is it like a photon torpedo? Shoot tokens at the Klingons.

Shoot tokens at the Klingons. Shoot tokens at the Klingons. Perhaps it came from Battlestar Galactica. Perhaps it came from Battlestar Galactica. Perhaps it came from Battlestar Galactica. Yes. Yes. There you have it. There you have it. Yes. There you have it. There you have it. Yes. No, you know, what a trip down. No, you know, what a trip down. No, you know, what a trip down. This call has been an This call has been an This call has been an unforgettable memory. I mean, we talk about unforgettable memory. I mean, we talk about unforgettable memory. I mean, we talk about everything from ThinkPad to iDen, from everything from ThinkPad to iDen, from everything from ThinkPad to iDen, from Nextel to WiMAX, from John Legere to Saab. Nextel to WiMAX, from John Legere to Saab. You know, this has to be a You know, this has to be a historic call where we didn't apologize historic call where we didn't apologize historic call where we didn't apologize even once for being too even once for being too even once for being too serious on this call. serious on this call. TRUE. TRUE. Yes, we should all be, Yes, we should all be, we could be teachers, we could be teachers, we could be teachers, university professors who teach the history university professors who teach the history university professors who teach the history of telecommunications and all these of telecommunications and all these of telecommunications and all these young minds. He's young minds. He's young minds. He's seriously so good at it. It's crazy. seriously so good at it. It's crazy. seriously so good at it. It's crazy. I was kind of listening to it in the I was kind of listening to it in the I was kind of listening to it in the car and thinking, "Damn, dude." It's like you're car and thinking, "Damn, dude." It's like you're car and thinking, "Damn, dude." It's like you're serious. Did I serious. Did I apologize in the car, Leonard? apologize in the car, Leonard? apologize in the car, Leonard? No, you didn't. You can do it now in No, you didn't. You can do it now in No, you didn't. You can do it now in front of our entire audience. front of our entire audience. front of our entire audience. Good. Good. Good. Good.

Good. Good. Sometimes we put on our Sometimes we put on our Sometimes we put on our big-boy pants and pretend to be professionals from big-boy pants and pretend to be professionals from big-boy pants and pretend to be professionals from time to time. time to time. time to time. From time to time. From time to time. It From time to time. From time to time. It From time to time. From time to time. It was, I mean, you know, it was, yes, it was, I mean, you know, it was, yes, it was, I mean, you know, it was, yes, it was a double whammy. I was able to see Andre in was a double whammy. I was able to see Andre in was a double whammy. I was able to see Andre in person for the first time. You know, we miss person for the first time. You know, we miss person for the first time. You know, we miss each other and, of course, Devin. each other and, of course, Devin. each other and, of course, Devin. Although I have seen him several times, I Although I have seen him several times, I Although I have seen him several times, I intended to greet him during the intended to greet him during the intended to greet him during the course of several conferences. I course of several conferences. I course of several conferences. I was busy. I didn't want to bother him. was busy. I didn't want to bother him. was busy. I didn't want to bother him. Then he disappeared. Now you have him in Then he disappeared. Now you have him in Then he disappeared. Now you have him in your sights and you leave, and then he disappears. He's your sights and you leave, and then he disappears. He's your sights and you leave, and then he disappears. He's like the magic man. Do you see me now like the magic man. Do you see me now like the magic man. Do you see me now ? Not now. ? Not now. ? Not now. Yes, there you are. Exactly. Okay, Yes, there you are. Exactly. Okay, Yes, there you are. Exactly. Okay, guys. Okay, let's wrap guys. Okay, let's wrap guys. Okay, let's wrap this up. Rob, would you like to this up. Rob, would you like to this up. Rob, would you like to invite us? invite us? invite us? Clear. Thank you so much for joining us Clear. Thank you so much for joining us Clear. Thank you so much for joining us for this historic episode of IoT for this historic episode of IoT for this historic episode of IoT Coffee Talk. You know, if you need Coffee Talk. You know, if you need Coffee Talk. You know, if you need someone to teach you something about the someone to teach you something about the someone to teach you something about the history of technology and history of technology and history of technology and telecommunications, this is the place telecommunications, this is the place telecommunications, this is the place to do it, right? We are your to do it, right? We are your to do it, right? We are your teachers of IoT and physical AI. We're teachers of IoT and physical AI. We're teachers of IoT and physical AI. We're on board with physical AI. Let's on board with physical AI. Let's on board with physical AI. Let's dive right in. We're going to guide you and dive right in. We're going to guide you and dive right in. We're going to guide you and show you the way, right? And we're show you the way, right? And we're show you the way, right? And we're also going to help the people also going to help the people also going to help the people who use this technology. We spent who use this technology. We spent who use this technology. We spent many years using this technology many years using this technology many years using this technology for commercial purposes in business, for commercial purposes in business, for commercial purposes in business, which is great. But at some which is great. But at some which is great. But at some point along the way we discovered point along the way we discovered point along the way we discovered we could use it to help we could use it to help we could use it to help people, humanity, and the planet.

people, humanity, and the planet. people, humanity, and the planet. So we'll do that too. It's about So we'll do that too. It's about So we'll do that too. It's about uplifting communities. Yes. You'll see uplifting communities. Yes. You'll see uplifting communities. Yes. You'll see a new level of advancement that you've never a new level of advancement that you've never a new level of advancement that you've never seen before with the things we'll seen before with the things we'll seen before with the things we'll do with our technology to do with our technology to do with our technology to help people around the world help people around the world help people around the world in difficult situations. It's in difficult situations. It's in difficult situations. It's exciting. So stay exciting. So stay exciting. So stay tuned. Have a great weekend everyone tuned. Have a great weekend everyone tuned. Have a great weekend everyone . See you . See you . See you next week. next week. next week. And let's get physical, people. And let's get physical, people. And let's get physical, people. Let's Let's Let's get physical. Let's get get physical. Let's get get physical. Let's get physical. physical. physical. Let me listen to your body language. Let me listen to your body language. Let me listen to your body language. Let me listen to your network. I Let me listen to your network. I Let me listen to your network. I love it. I love it. I will behave. I will behave love it. I love it. I will behave. I will behave love it. I love it. I will behave. I will behave . . Alright, see you guys. Bye bye Alright, see you guys. Bye bye . . . See you. Have a good weekend See you. Have a good weekend .