IoT Coffee Talk Webcast: Episode 197 - Microsoft IoT Central (To be or not to be?)

you got you got [Music] [Music] [Music] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] oh oh oh [Music] a a [Music] wow wow I didn't realize we had David wow wow I didn't realize we had David Gilmore in our show today that's Gilmore in our show today that's Gilmore in our show today that's impressive it is outstanding oh now I

impressive it is outstanding oh now I impressive it is outstanding oh now I can switch my camera see I was using my can switch my camera see I was using my can switch my camera see I was using my iPhone camera now I can switch to my iPhone camera now I can switch to my iPhone camera now I can switch to my regular camera there you go and then you regular camera there you go and then you regular camera there you go and then you know we got some other Loser on the show know we got some other Loser on the show know we got some other Loser on the show here's got sakur in the background you here's got sakur in the background you here's got sakur in the background you know just making us all jealous oh my know just making us all jealous oh my know just making us all jealous oh my gosh that's incredible we're pro level gosh that's incredible we're pro level gosh that's incredible we're pro level today yeah I'm actually I'm actually in today yeah I'm actually I'm actually in today yeah I'm actually I'm actually in vacation but uh so I three times so why vacation but uh so I three times so why vacation but uh so I three times so why not go to I coffee talk and because I'm not go to I coffee talk and because I'm not go to I coffee talk and because I'm in the right because I'm in the right in the right because I'm in the right in the right because I'm in the right time zone this is not coffee I'm time zone this is not coffee I'm time zone this is not coffee I'm drinking drinking drinking yes I love it I love it oh my God are yes I love it I love it oh my God are yes I love it I love it oh my God are you having a great time in Paris yeah you having a great time in Paris yeah you having a great time in Paris yeah it's it's it's yeah it's pretty cool I was uh I was in yeah it's pretty cool I was uh I was in yeah it's pretty cool I was uh I was in Finland last week yeah because I went I Finland last week yeah because I went I Finland last week yeah because I went I think I men you guys but I went to a think I men you guys but I went to a think I men you guys but I went to a hacker conference for for a talk is my hacker conference for for a talk is my hacker conference for for a talk is my definition of vacation and definition of vacation and definition of vacation and uh yeah and uh yeah I'm spending a week uh yeah and uh yeah I'm spending a week uh yeah and uh yeah I'm spending a week in Paris to meet with old friend I met in Paris to meet with old friend I met in Paris to meet with old friend I met with with a friend who is dut C at the with with a friend who is dut C at the with with a friend who is dut C at the system now so we were at engineer school system now so we were at engineer school system now so we were at engineer school together so yeah and we are comparing together so yeah and we are comparing together so yeah and we are comparing our gray hair now ah our gray hair now ah our gray hair now ah yeah well you know yeah I saw you I was yeah well you know yeah I saw you I was yeah well you know yeah I saw you I was following you on Instagram and you had following you on Instagram and you had following you on Instagram and you had some good pictures were you up in Lil oh yeah the restaurant you know you Lil oh yeah the restaurant you know you know that restaurant Oh I thought you know that restaurant Oh I thought you know that restaurant Oh I thought you were in no I don't know the restaurant I were in no I don't know the restaurant I were in no I don't know the restaurant I know the town I've been to Lil um oh no know the town I've been to Lil um oh no know the town I've been to Lil um oh no no no actually it's a different

no no actually it's a different no no actually it's a different spending it's it's a little rest no I'm spending it's it's a little rest no I'm spending it's it's a little rest no I'm just seeing in Paris this time so I B just seeing in Paris this time so I B just seeing in Paris this time so I B and Paris that's a excellent excellent and Paris that's a excellent excellent and Paris that's a excellent excellent well it's raining here in Belleview so well it's raining here in Belleview so well it's raining here in Belleview so nothing very exciting going on yeah it's nothing very exciting going on yeah it's nothing very exciting going on yeah it's it's it's raining in Paris as well so it's it's raining in Paris as well so it's it's raining in Paris as well so and by the way hey talking about global and by the way hey talking about global and by the way hey talking about global warming and cl change climate change uh warming and cl change climate change uh warming and cl change climate change uh I had rain in elsi in February can you I had rain in elsi in February can you I had rain in elsi in February can you imagine that it should be snow not imagine that it should be snow not imagine that it should be snow not rain kind of weird it's been kind of rain kind of weird it's been kind of rain kind of weird it's been kind of warm hasn't it Pete up here in the yeah warm hasn't it Pete up here in the yeah warm hasn't it Pete up here in the yeah I don't think we're going to get much I don't think we're going to get much I don't think we're going to get much winter going on here I mean yeah 40s winter going on here I mean yeah 40s winter going on here I mean yeah 40s next week and that's about it I think it next week and that's about it I think it next week and that's about it I think it hit below freezing like one week out of hit below freezing like one week out of hit below freezing like one week out of this yeah I mean when you look over at this yeah I mean when you look over at this yeah I mean when you look over at the mountains it's kind of scary because the mountains it's kind of scary because the mountains it's kind of scary because they're not there's not a lot of snow up they're not there's not a lot of snow up they're not there's not a lot of snow up there um a lot of snow and for all you there um a lot of snow and for all you there um a lot of snow and for all you people who care about water and people who care about water and people who care about water and agriculture snow pack is how we save up agriculture snow pack is how we save up agriculture snow pack is how we save up water during the winter that then flows water during the winter that then flows water during the winter that then flows in the spring and summer to make every in the spring and summer to make every in the spring and summer to make every all the magic happen um Hydro power all the magic happen um Hydro power all the magic happen um Hydro power exactly hydr power many rivers that you exactly hydr power many rivers that you exactly hydr power many rivers that you think just come from magical places think just come from magical places think just come from magical places actually come from snow pack melting and actually come from snow pack melting and actually come from snow pack melting and if it rains all winter while it's green if it rains all winter while it's green if it rains all winter while it's green and everything here there won't be any and everything here there won't be any and everything here there won't be any store of water saved up water for the store of water saved up water for the store of water saved up water for the rest of the year which will then rest of the year which will then rest of the year which will then inadvertently lead to Drought um which inadvertently lead to Drought um which inadvertently lead to Drought um which which seems strange in the moment but

which seems strange in the moment but which seems strange in the moment but yeah um not good you know um good I yeah um not good you know um good I yeah um not good you know um good I remember few years ago like when you remember few years ago like when you remember few years ago like when you know obviously California is getting know obviously California is getting know obviously California is getting slammed Now by atmospheric rivers and La slammed Now by atmospheric rivers and La slammed Now by atmospheric rivers and La is is is underwater um but you know the in past underwater um but you know the in past underwater um but you know the in past years you know they talk about the years you know they talk about the years you know they talk about the winter time like there's very very low winter time like there's very very low winter time like there's very very low snow pack in the Sierra and Nevada snow pack in the Sierra and Nevada snow pack in the Sierra and Nevada mountains uh which you know has a mountains uh which you know has a mountains uh which you know has a devastating impact in by the way this is devastating impact in by the way this is devastating impact in by the way this is a cool book termination shock if you've a cool book termination shock if you've a cool book termination shock if you've ever read Neil Stevenson no crash he's ever read Neil Stevenson no crash he's ever read Neil Stevenson no crash he's kind of F that he wrote this a few years kind of F that he wrote this a few years kind of F that he wrote this a few years ago it's a pretty thick thick one but ago it's a pretty thick thick one but ago it's a pretty thick thick one but it's a cool novel about climate it takes it's a cool novel about climate it takes it's a cool novel about climate it takes place about 30 or 40 years in the future place about 30 or 40 years in the future place about 30 or 40 years in the future it's kind of near future yeah and they it's kind of near future yeah and they it's kind of near future yeah and they they do some I won't spoil it but they they do some I won't spoil it but they they do some I won't spoil it but they do some sort of G kind of climate do some sort of G kind of climate do some sort of G kind of climate engineering you know kind of try to fix engineering you know kind of try to fix engineering you know kind of try to fix things and there's lots of interesting things and there's lots of interesting things and there's lots of interesting political yes things going on so pretty political yes things going on so pretty political yes things going on so pretty cool book if you're into like climate cool book if you're into like climate cool book if you're into like climate sci-fi is that a thing I don't sci-fi is that a thing I don't sci-fi is that a thing I don't know you know I think we've had climate know you know I think we've had climate know you know I think we've had climate sci-fi inadvertently in all kinds of sci-fi inadvertently in all kinds of sci-fi inadvertently in all kinds of books movies in the past and sometimes books movies in the past and sometimes books movies in the past and sometimes we didn't realize that that's what it we didn't realize that that's what it we didn't realize that that's what it was or we didn't think about it it was or we didn't think about it it was or we didn't think about it it wasn't political at the time um I wasn't political at the time um I wasn't political at the time um I remember not long ago rewatching on TV remember not long ago rewatching on TV remember not long ago rewatching on TV um not inous strain soilent um not inous strain soilent um not inous strain soilent green um oh yeah soilent Green yeah and green um oh yeah soilent Green yeah and green um oh yeah soilent Green yeah and while the theme of the movie is while the theme of the movie is while the theme of the movie is obviously about people and little green obviously about people and little green obviously about people and little green Wafers if if you you'll recognize it's Wafers if if you you'll recognize it's Wafers if if you you'll recognize it's very hot that movie was made in like the very hot that movie was made in like the very hot that movie was made in like the early 70s and yet it was burning hot and

early 70s and yet it was burning hot and early 70s and yet it was burning hot and there was no food and it was and I don't there was no food and it was and I don't there was no food and it was and I don't know if overtly were trying to predict know if overtly were trying to predict know if overtly were trying to predict some kind of heated climate or not maybe some kind of heated climate or not maybe some kind of heated climate or not maybe so in the 70s there's a lot of so in the 70s there's a lot of so in the 70s there's a lot of environmentalism I remember one of the environmentalism I remember one of the environmentalism I remember one of the Planet of the Apes movies had a lot of Planet of the Apes movies had a lot of Planet of the Apes movies had a lot of environmental overtones to it yeah not environmental overtones to it yeah not environmental overtones to it yeah not to get too far off topic but um I don't to get too far off topic but um I don't to get too far off topic but um I don't even know what the topic is so it's not even know what the topic is so it's not even know what the topic is so it's not possible to get off topic we haven't possible to get off topic we haven't possible to get off topic we haven't really gotten one really gotten one really gotten one yet welcome David thank you look the yet welcome David thank you look the yet welcome David thank you look the blue we got blue black that's awesome blue we got blue black that's awesome blue we got blue black that's awesome yeah I'm sorry I didn't travel with my yeah I'm sorry I didn't travel with my yeah I'm sorry I didn't travel with my my t-shirt I'm just a white T-shirt yeah my t-shirt I'm just a white T-shirt yeah my t-shirt I'm just a white T-shirt yeah that's so how are things in that's so how are things in that's so how are things in Portlandia um you know typical weather Portlandia um you know typical weather Portlandia um you know typical weather you know it'll be uh overcast till April you know it'll be uh overcast till April you know it'll be uh overcast till April and uh and the sun comes up yes pretty and uh and the sun comes up yes pretty and uh and the sun comes up yes pretty much but you know Portland is good man much but you know Portland is good man much but you know Portland is good man Portland is good beautiful as always the Portland is good beautiful as always the Portland is good beautiful as always the PMW the PMW the PMW the PMW yeah I played I played that uh kind PMW yeah I played I played that uh kind PMW yeah I played I played that uh kind of slow durge song uh wish you were here of slow durge song uh wish you were here of slow durge song uh wish you were here this morning CU I was kind of mourning this morning CU I was kind of mourning this morning CU I was kind of mourning the whole Azure iot Central uh the whole Azure iot Central uh the whole Azure iot Central uh yeah how I wish live a your iot central yeah how I wish live a your iot central yeah how I wish live a your iot central apparently I'm not sure what's going on apparently I'm not sure what's going on apparently I'm not sure what's going on there but yeah it's not like it's not there but yeah it's not like it's not there but yeah it's not like it's not like uh you know these iot platforms like uh you know these iot platforms like uh you know these iot platforms ever leave their users hanging I mean ever leave their users hanging I mean ever leave their users hanging I mean this never ever happens right right so this never ever happens right right so this never ever happens right right so there was so the so for the readers that

there was so the so for the readers that there was so the so for the readers that are not familiar and I encourage you to are not familiar and I encourage you to are not familiar and I encourage you to do your own do your own research SE Arch do your own do your own research SE Arch do your own do your own research SE Arch but the uh there was a kind of a system but the uh there was a kind of a system but the uh there was a kind of a system message that came out saying like Azure message that came out saying like Azure message that came out saying like Azure Central was going to get retired and Central was going to get retired and Central was going to get retired and this is the last day you could create this is the last day you could create this is the last day you could create some resources blah blah blah some some resources blah blah blah some some resources blah blah blah some system message came out that created a system message came out that created a system message came out that created a firestorm out there in the internet firestorm out there in the internet firestorm out there in the internet tubes and then uh there was a blog post tubes and then uh there was a blog post tubes and then uh there was a blog post by Microsoft I think from cam V Brad who by Microsoft I think from cam V Brad who by Microsoft I think from cam V Brad who said the uh message was not accurate and said the uh message was not accurate and said the uh message was not accurate and we're you know we're not you know we're we're you know we're not you know we're we're you know we're not you know we're supporting our customers and blah blah supporting our customers and blah blah supporting our customers and blah blah that came out a couple days AO go but that came out a couple days AO go but that came out a couple days AO go but there was this whole meta you know there was this whole meta you know there was this whole meta you know discussion around like David you were discussion around like David you were discussion around like David you were saying platforms taking dependencies on saying platforms taking dependencies on saying platforms taking dependencies on platforms from companies and you know platforms from companies and you know platforms from companies and you know hyperscalers have a habit of um putting hyperscalers have a habit of um putting hyperscalers have a habit of um putting out all kinds of cool stacks and getting out all kinds of cool stacks and getting out all kinds of cool stacks and getting people very excited about them and then people very excited about them and then people very excited about them and then realizing actually we're kind of in the realizing actually we're kind of in the realizing actually we're kind of in the cloud business and then maybe we don't cloud business and then maybe we don't cloud business and then maybe we don't want to put any more effort into it so want to put any more effort into it so want to put any more effort into it so it's unclear it sounds like it's still it's unclear it sounds like it's still it's unclear it sounds like it's still keep being kept alive from Microsoft keep being kept alive from Microsoft keep being kept alive from Microsoft although it's interesting if you read although it's interesting if you read although it's interesting if you read the blog post they didn't say they the blog post they didn't say they the blog post they didn't say they didn't say Azure iot Central basically didn't say Azure iot Central basically didn't say Azure iot Central basically they just said the message was they just said the message was they just said the message was inaccurate didn't say how it was inaccurate didn't say how it was inaccurate didn't say how it was inaccurate they just said it was inaccurate they just said it was inaccurate they just said it was inaccurate so the date could be slightly inaccurate so the date could be slightly inaccurate so the date could be slightly off could be off by two days or could be off could be off by two days or could be off could be off by two days or could be completely wrong we don't know but they completely wrong we don't know but they completely wrong we don't know but they just said the message was inaccurate so just said the message was inaccurate so just said the message was inaccurate so but you know what is that if you've but you know what is that if you've but you know what is that if you've worked in any company that has PR or or worked in any company that has PR or or worked in any company that has PR or or you know internal Communications you you know internal Communications you you know internal Communications you know it is very typical let's just say

know it is very typical let's just say know it is very typical let's just say before earnings right now they might not before earnings right now they might not before earnings right now they might not they might not know whether earnings are they might not know whether earnings are they might not know whether earnings are good or bad but there's going to be a good or bad but there's going to be a good or bad but there's going to be a draft earnings were amazing and you know draft earnings were amazing and you know draft earnings were amazing and you know bullet point bullet point or well you bullet point bullet point or well you bullet point bullet point or well you know inflation is killing so I there has know inflation is killing so I there has know inflation is killing so I there has to be some validity to what was in the to be some validity to what was in the to be some validity to what was in the original leaked message sure because original leaked message sure because original leaked message sure because someone was drafting it you know that someone was drafting it you know that someone was drafting it you know that person someone wrote it and someone sent person someone wrote it and someone sent person someone wrote it and someone sent it so there must something behind it so it so there must something behind it so it so there must something behind it so you know it's like let just just come you know it's like let just just come you know it's like let just just come clean for the Youth users uh you know clean for the Youth users uh you know clean for the Youth users uh you know because at the end of the I mean luckily because at the end of the I mean luckily because at the end of the I mean luckily you know we forget quickly but you know you know we forget quickly but you know you know we forget quickly but you know you have all these deployments let's you have all these deployments let's you have all these deployments let's just you know just let the community just you know just let the community just you know just let the community know what the real deal is and in the know what the real deal is and in the know what the real deal is and in the meantime folks diversify diversify meantime folks diversify diversify meantime folks diversify diversify diversify you know like I I think I I diversify you know like I I think I I diversify you know like I I think I I think for once you experience something think for once you experience something think for once you experience something like this you just stop putting the like this you just stop putting the like this you just stop putting the majority of your load on one piece of majority of your load on one piece of majority of your load on one piece of infrastructure like it's I know it infrastructure like it's I know it infrastructure like it's I know it sounds easy you know one throw to choke sounds easy you know one throw to choke sounds easy you know one throw to choke you know one you know one you know one infrastructure then this happens yeah infrastructure then this happens yeah infrastructure then this happens yeah well and this is why things are going to well and this is why things are going to well and this is why things are going to multicloud multi-edge because people multicloud multi-edge because people multicloud multi-edge because people need to hedge their bets and yeah you need to hedge their bets and yeah you need to hedge their bets and yeah you know and then there's all this thing know and then there's all this thing know and then there's all this thing where platform companies always try to where platform companies always try to where platform companies always try to go up the stack you know to get more go up the stack you know to get more go up the stack you know to get more functionality and margin and kind of functionality and margin and kind of functionality and margin and kind of squeeze out their Partners I'm thinking squeeze out their Partners I'm thinking squeeze out their Partners I'm thinking of connect from AET and humity and these of connect from AET and humity and these of connect from AET and humity and these other folks that have perfectly valid other folks that have perfectly valid other folks that have perfectly valid you know SAS platforms uh for iot and uh

you know SAS platforms uh for iot and uh you know SAS platforms uh for iot and uh yeah and then then after they go in yeah and then then after they go in yeah and then then after they go in there and sort of you know chew up their there and sort of you know chew up their there and sort of you know chew up their Partners markets then they decide to Partners markets then they decide to Partners markets then they decide to retire it and um Everybody Dies everyone retire it and um Everybody Dies everyone retire it and um Everybody Dies everyone dies at the end dies at the end dies at the end yes I I haven't I haven't looked for the yes I I haven't I haven't looked for the yes I I haven't I haven't looked for the actually into the Microsoft stack for a actually into the Microsoft stack for a actually into the Microsoft stack for a while Sobe because I saw the news while while Sobe because I saw the news while while Sobe because I saw the news while I was traveling and not necessarily pay I was traveling and not necessarily pay I was traveling and not necessarily pay attention too much attention but does attention too much attention but does attention too much attention but does that mean they're also retiring their that mean they're also retiring their that mean they're also retiring their digital twin modeling language or is digital twin modeling language or is digital twin modeling language or is moving somewhere else no no it's just moving somewhere else no no it's just moving somewhere else no no it's just the basic infrastructure they're the basic infrastructure they're the basic infrastructure they're changing changing changing right well with the iot central offering right well with the iot central offering right well with the iot central offering that was being that was the system that was being that was the system that was being that was the system message that it was being deprecated message that it was being deprecated message that it was being deprecated which is now accurate give you guys some which is now accurate give you guys some which is now accurate give you guys some other kids out there all the history in other kids out there all the history in other kids out there all the history in there you know way back when we had when there you know way back when we had when there you know way back when we had when we first started building what we called we first started building what we called we first started building what we called Azure iot um we first had a SAS program Azure iot um we first had a SAS program Azure iot um we first had a SAS program product called intelligence system product called intelligence system product called intelligence system service that was built by the embedded service that was built by the embedded service that was built by the embedded team actually actually at Microsoft U team actually actually at Microsoft U team actually actually at Microsoft U they were kind of going down a track and they were kind of going down a track and they were kind of going down a track and then Azure kind of came to life and then then Azure kind of came to life and then then Azure kind of came to life and then we started stringing we had event hubs we started stringing we had event hubs we started stringing we had event hubs and then we had some new streaming and then we had some new streaming and then we had some new streaming analytics and then we had some Azure ML analytics and then we had some Azure ML analytics and then we had some Azure ML and they were all brand new and then and they were all brand new and then and they were all brand new and then there was a tug-of-war between the there was a tug-of-war between the there was a tug-of-war between the intelligence system service guys which intelligence system service guys which intelligence system service guys which was in beta and they were actively was in beta and they were actively was in beta and they were actively announcing it and everything and had announcing it and everything and had announcing it and everything and had customers using it and then the Azure customers using it and then the Azure customers using it and then the Azure guys were like yeah but you guys don't guys were like yeah but you guys don't guys were like yeah but you guys don't really you you're really good at the really you you're really good at the really you you're really good at the embedded stuff on the device but you embedded stuff on the device but you embedded stuff on the device but you don't know as much about Cloud as we do don't know as much about Cloud as we do don't know as much about Cloud as we do and so uh tug of war ensued and the

and so uh tug of war ensued and the and so uh tug of war ensued and the Azure people won and so for a while we Azure people won and so for a while we Azure people won and so for a while we cobbled together something just we just cobbled together something just we just cobbled together something just we just generically called it asot but it was generically called it asot but it was generically called it asot but it was like cobbling together event hubs and a like cobbling together event hubs and a like cobbling together event hubs and a databased r tracking databased r tracking databased r tracking devices it was it was it was just a devices it was it was it was just a devices it was it was it was just a bunch of junk and customers knew it and bunch of junk and customers knew it and bunch of junk and customers knew it and so we worked on this new thing called so we worked on this new thing called so we worked on this new thing called iot Hub which is basically a whole bunch iot Hub which is basically a whole bunch iot Hub which is basically a whole bunch of event hubs hiding underneath the of event hubs hiding underneath the of event hubs hiding underneath the thing and then a deal to track devices thing and then a deal to track devices thing and then a deal to track devices and authentication and all that that you and authentication and all that that you and authentication and all that that you having to roll your own before so we did having to roll your own before so we did having to roll your own before so we did that uh customers still said hey you're that uh customers still said hey you're that uh customers still said hey you're still just kind of stringing stuff still just kind of stringing stuff still just kind of stringing stuff together to build a solution this is together to build a solution this is together to build a solution this is crap and so we built these pre-built crap and so we built these pre-built crap and so we built these pre-built solutions for a while um one for solutions for a while um one for solutions for a while um one for remaining useful life one for stream you remaining useful life one for stream you remaining useful life one for stream you know there's a few that we put together know there's a few that we put together know there's a few that we put together they were cobbling together dynamically they were cobbling together dynamically they were cobbling together dynamically on the fly a bunch of services and so on the fly a bunch of services and so on the fly a bunch of services and so that happened and then we at Microsoft that happened and then we at Microsoft that happened and then we at Microsoft we acquired an Italian company called we acquired an Italian company called we acquired an Italian company called salair which was an ass sass iot salair which was an ass sass iot salair which was an ass sass iot application and brought those folks on application and brought those folks on application and brought those folks on and um and the descendant of Solair is and um and the descendant of Solair is and um and the descendant of Solair is iot iot iot Central and so that and and uh you know Central and so that and and uh you know Central and so that and and uh you know I know Sam George was a big fan of iot I know Sam George was a big fan of iot I know Sam George was a big fan of iot Central and I get it I I'm kind of with Central and I get it I I'm kind of with Central and I get it I I'm kind of with him not everybody him not everybody him not everybody was but I'm a big fan of the easy button was but I'm a big fan of the easy button was but I'm a big fan of the easy button and keeping it simple and I thought and keeping it simple and I thought and keeping it simple and I thought people were have still and I see I see people were have still and I see I see people were have still and I see I see this with AWS as well iot people were this with AWS as well iot people were this with AWS as well iot people were having to write too much code and built

having to write too much code and built having to write too much code and built too much stuff to build their solution too much stuff to build their solution too much stuff to build their solution and I'd hear people say well crap if I'm and I'd hear people say well crap if I'm and I'd hear people say well crap if I'm having to write so much code why am I having to write so much code why am I having to write so much code why am I using your stuff I might as well just bu using your stuff I might as well just bu using your stuff I might as well just bu roll my own and you know there's always roll my own and you know there's always roll my own and you know there's always the sales people like you don't want to the sales people like you don't want to the sales people like you don't want to roll your own you want to use our roll your own you want to use our roll your own you want to use our platform and um so iot Central was kind platform and um so iot Central was kind platform and um so iot Central was kind of the SAS thing it came descended from of the SAS thing it came descended from of the SAS thing it came descended from the salair stuff and we may have some the salair stuff and we may have some the salair stuff and we may have some salair people on our show at some point salair people on our show at some point salair people on our show at some point here who are now at here who are now at here who are now at Arduino um and um so that'll be Arduino um and um so that'll be Arduino um and um so that'll be interesting but the idea was make it interesting but the idea was make it interesting but the idea was make it simple make it stupid easy Point click simple make it stupid easy Point click simple make it stupid easy Point click make it happen you know instead of make it happen you know instead of make it happen you know instead of having to and so I thought the thinking having to and so I thought the thinking having to and so I thought the thinking was good on that and that's the kind of was good on that and that's the kind of was good on that and that's the kind of the thinking I see with platforms like the thinking I see with platforms like the thinking I see with platforms like clear blade and low sand and some others clear blade and low sand and some others clear blade and low sand and some others that are real easy kind of point and that are real easy kind of point and that are real easy kind of point and click um but uh you know what I it just click um but uh you know what I it just click um but uh you know what I it just a lack I don't know if it's just lack of a lack I don't know if it's just lack of a lack I don't know if it's just lack of adoption but what really Burns me up adoption but what really Burns me up adoption but what really Burns me up is that you know Microsoft has arguably is that you know Microsoft has arguably is that you know Microsoft has arguably one of the best sales forces on the one of the best sales forces on the one of the best sales forces on the planet they can get a meeting with planet they can get a meeting with planet they can get a meeting with anybody anytime and I know when this anybody anytime and I know when this anybody anytime and I know when this stuff came out all the sales guys were stuff came out all the sales guys were stuff came out all the sales guys were in there just doing the hard press on in there just doing the hard press on in there just doing the hard press on customers on the Enterprise customers customers on the Enterprise customers customers on the Enterprise customers this is the future we are betting we're this is the future we are betting we're this is the future we are betting we're investing we're in it for the long haul investing we're in it for the long haul investing we're in it for the long haul we want you to adopt this okay we trust we want you to adopt this okay we trust we want you to adopt this okay we trust you y and it's like then you put the you y and it's like then you put the you y and it's like then you put the pull the football away you know like pull the football away you know like pull the football away you know like Lucy you know um peanuts pulling the Lucy you know um peanuts pulling the Lucy you know um peanuts pulling the football just at the last

football just at the last football just at the last second and a lot of people have to just second and a lot of people have to just second and a lot of people have to just be disillusioned because every time a be disillusioned because every time a be disillusioned because every time a new thing comes out the customers get new thing comes out the customers get new thing comes out the customers get pressed really hard by the Salesforce pressed really hard by the Salesforce pressed really hard by the Salesforce and the Salesforce says everything and and the Salesforce says everything and and the Salesforce says everything and you and then so it's a trust you and then so it's a trust you and then so it's a trust problem um I don't know man what do you problem um I don't know man what do you problem um I don't know man what do you think well this is part of the strategy think well this is part of the strategy think well this is part of the strategy so cuz you know so now you you you lose so cuz you know so now you you you lose so cuz you know so now you you you lose the trust then next week you do a reorg the trust then next week you do a reorg the trust then next week you do a reorg you f a lot of these sales people and you f a lot of these sales people and you f a lot of these sales people and then when and then let the new sales then when and then let the new sales then when and then let the new sales people introduce themselves and hey it's people introduce themselves and hey it's people introduce themselves and hey it's a whole new world here I'm going to a whole new world here I'm going to a whole new world here I'm going to clean this up I'm gonna clean this up clean this up I'm gonna clean this up clean this up I'm gonna clean this up yeah yeah yeah not that other person yeah yeah yeah not that other person yeah yeah yeah not that other person yeah yeah but you can't you can't just yeah yeah but you can't you can't just yeah yeah but you can't you can't just trade outfits and expect a different trade outfits and expect a different trade outfits and expect a different result I mean that's literally what it result I mean that's literally what it result I mean that's literally what it is right I mean look look I I I I is right I mean look look I I I I is right I mean look look I I I I responded to that post um and and it's I responded to that post um and and it's I responded to that post um and and it's I don't know for me it call me an old head don't know for me it call me an old head don't know for me it call me an old head call me what it is I don't I it really call me what it is I don't I it really call me what it is I don't I it really doesn't matter the bottom damn line is doesn't matter the bottom damn line is doesn't matter the bottom damn line is any of these csps are going to have any of these csps are going to have any of these csps are going to have their own proprietary you know hook their own proprietary you know hook their own proprietary you know hook that's going to get you in there and if that's going to get you in there and if that's going to get you in there and if you're an if you're an emerging startup you're an if you're an emerging startup you're an if you're an emerging startup or you're a company that's looking to or you're a company that's looking to or you're a company that's looking to scale or any of those types of things scale or any of those types of things scale or any of those types of things and you're building your stuff and you and you're building your stuff and you and you're building your stuff and you build it based on those proprietary build it based on those proprietary build it based on those proprietary Services I mean you're knowingly walking Services I mean you're knowingly walking Services I mean you're knowingly walking in locked in because the amount of work in locked in because the amount of work in locked in because the amount of work that it's going to take to to unplug that it's going to take to to unplug that it's going to take to to unplug from that and go over to the next from that and go over to the next from that and go over to the next CSP is painful right it's painful it's

CSP is painful right it's painful it's CSP is painful right it's painful it's expensive and there's no guarantee I expensive and there's no guarantee I expensive and there's no guarantee I mean now you're you're in an mean now you're you're in an mean now you're you're in an operational uh conundrum in terms of how operational uh conundrum in terms of how operational uh conundrum in terms of how do you operate these multiple do you operate these multiple do you operate these multiple environments right and you're I mean so environments right and you're I mean so environments right and you're I mean so now what happens to your your now what happens to your your now what happens to your your operational model your cost model all of operational model your cost model all of operational model your cost model all of these other things are out the window these other things are out the window these other things are out the window and then when they decide you know what and then when they decide you know what and then when they decide you know what we haven't had the adoption that we we haven't had the adoption that we we haven't had the adoption that we thought we were going to have sorry guys thought we were going to have sorry guys thought we were going to have sorry guys we were wrong we're unplugging and we were wrong we're unplugging and we were wrong we're unplugging and you're you're screwed with a capital you're you're screwed with a capital you're you're screwed with a capital left right yeah although I would I would left right yeah although I would I would left right yeah although I would I would want to give Microsoft a little Pro they want to give Microsoft a little Pro they want to give Microsoft a little Pro they do have a pretty good sunsetting policy do have a pretty good sunsetting policy do have a pretty good sunsetting policy like they have a pretty strict policy of like they have a pretty strict policy of like they have a pretty strict policy of when products get de featured and put in when products get de featured and put in when products get de featured and put in bug fix mode and like it's a multi-year bug fix mode and like it's a multi-year bug fix mode and like it's a multi-year thing so I I'll give them some props on thing so I I'll give them some props on thing so I I'll give them some props on that they don't just go out there and that they don't just go out there and that they don't just go out there and pull a plug that being said as Rob said pull a plug that being said as Rob said pull a plug that being said as Rob said they do you know have the sales team they do you know have the sales team they do you know have the sales team gold on selling it pretty hard they get gold on selling it pretty hard they get gold on selling it pretty hard they get a lot of adoption and then you're stuck a lot of adoption and then you're stuck a lot of adoption and then you're stuck with a platform that's not getting new with a platform that's not getting new with a platform that's not getting new features and it may still be alive but features and it may still be alive but features and it may still be alive but now it's becoming less and less now it's becoming less and less now it's becoming less and less competitive relative to other other competitive relative to other other competitive relative to other other platforms out there I think that's a platforms out there I think that's a platforms out there I think that's a challenge like you know as Rob said at challenge like you know as Rob said at challenge like you know as Rob said at for a long time Microsoft was selling for a long time Microsoft was selling for a long time Microsoft was selling chemistry sets and people didn't want chemistry sets and people didn't want chemistry sets and people didn't want chemistry sets they wanted the milkshake chemistry sets they wanted the milkshake chemistry sets they wanted the milkshake or whatever that's bad metaphor but uh or whatever that's bad metaphor but uh or whatever that's bad metaphor but uh you know so it's like as as a smaller you know so it's like as as a smaller you know so it's like as as a smaller especially company you you know you're especially company you you know you're especially company you you know you're making these bets and some of the bets making these bets and some of the bets making these bets and some of the bets are bets on big companies some of them are bets on big companies some of them are bets on big companies some of them are on smaller companies too right uh are on smaller companies too right uh are on smaller companies too right uh for their platform forms and you take for their platform forms and you take for their platform forms and you take these dependencies and like how do you these dependencies and like how do you these dependencies and like how do you sort of mitigate that risk uh over time sort of mitigate that risk uh over time sort of mitigate that risk uh over time it's really challenging when people are

it's really challenging when people are it's really challenging when people are changing their plans well I mean changing their plans well I mean changing their plans well I mean hindsight is 2020 I'm going to take you hindsight is 2020 I'm going to take you hindsight is 2020 I'm going to take you know since bill just called himself an know since bill just called himself an know since bill just called himself an old head I'm going to build on that you old head I'm going to build on that you old head I'm going to build on that you know he's been here before electricity know he's been here before electricity know he's been here before electricity so he know absolutely steam powered iot so he know absolutely steam powered iot so he know absolutely steam powered iot yeah but you know because we never yeah but you know because we never yeah but you know because we never disagree we never disagree here uh I'll disagree we never disagree here uh I'll disagree we never disagree here uh I'll throw it it's it is super easy to say throw it it's it is super easy to say throw it it's it is super easy to say I'm going to build this on not I'm going to build this on not I'm going to build this on not proprietary x uh but the reality is proprietary x uh but the reality is proprietary x uh but the reality is especially for a startup that's a risk especially for a startup that's a risk especially for a startup that's a risk I'm going to take because I cannot hire I'm going to take because I cannot hire I'm going to take because I cannot hire an amount of people today so I am going an amount of people today so I am going an amount of people today so I am going to jump on this platform on this to jump on this platform on this to jump on this platform on this infrastructure on this whatever that's infrastructure on this whatever that's infrastructure on this whatever that's multiuse so I can build something and multiuse so I can build something and multiuse so I can build something and then worry about it later now back to then worry about it later now back to then worry about it later now back to Bill's Point yes when someone tells you Bill's Point yes when someone tells you Bill's Point yes when someone tells you hey this is straight up forklift like you've got basically we're forklift like you've got basically we're going to the dump uh we're going to take going to the dump uh we're going to take going to the dump uh we're going to take it we're just going to dump and we're it we're just going to dump and we're it we're just going to dump and we're going to start from scratch that's when going to start from scratch that's when going to start from scratch that's when you have an issue it's you know it's you have an issue it's you know it's you have an issue it's you know it's like the economy like if I'm retiring like the economy like if I'm retiring like the economy like if I'm retiring today and the SMP is good it's like hey today and the SMP is good it's like hey today and the SMP is good it's like hey okay but if someone if tomorrow is a bad okay but if someone if tomorrow is a bad okay but if someone if tomorrow is a bad day it's like you know what the hell's day it's like you know what the hell's day it's like you know what the hell's happening um I'm 68 and I'm going to go happening um I'm 68 and I'm going to go happening um I'm 68 and I'm going to go to the grocery store to bag um so it's to the grocery store to bag um so it's to the grocery store to bag um so it's it's it's really it's it's honestly um it's it's really it's it's honestly um it's it's really it's it's honestly um it's it's an afterthought when you're it's it's an afterthought when you're it's it's an afterthought when you're starting something uh nowadays uh

starting something uh nowadays uh starting something uh nowadays uh because of the tools that are out there because of the tools that are out there because of the tools that are out there and you know maybe the idea is that we and you know maybe the idea is that we and you know maybe the idea is that we we've always think of scaling as in um we've always think of scaling as in um we've always think of scaling as in um you know how do I multiply this this you know how do I multiply this this you know how do I multiply this this widget how do I you know get it into the widget how do I you know get it into the widget how do I you know get it into the hands of as many customers as possible I hands of as many customers as possible I hands of as many customers as possible I think part of the scaling conversation think part of the scaling conversation think part of the scaling conversation is how do I diversify whatever my widget is how do I diversify whatever my widget is how do I diversify whatever my widget is and if we're going to stick to Cloud is and if we're going to stick to Cloud is and if we're going to stick to Cloud you know how do I when I'm building even you know how do I when I'm building even you know how do I when I'm building even though I'm going to select This Cloud though I'm going to select This Cloud though I'm going to select This Cloud how do I think of this architecture that how do I think of this architecture that how do I think of this architecture that if and when I've done some pre-work to if and when I've done some pre-work to if and when I've done some pre-work to easily go to that cloud or on premises easily go to that cloud or on premises easily go to that cloud or on premises or whatever that's we're going to have or whatever that's we're going to have or whatever that's we're going to have to think that way now yeah I think to think that way now yeah I think to think that way now yeah I think that's part of best practice right these that's part of best practice right these that's part of best practice right these days is having a multicloud plan Plan B days is having a multicloud plan Plan B days is having a multicloud plan Plan B I mean I know a lot of Fortune 50s I mean I know a lot of Fortune 50s I mean I know a lot of Fortune 50s Fortune 500s that are actively on three Fortune 500s that are actively on three Fortune 500s that are actively on three clouds you you know they have an on-prem clouds you you know they have an on-prem clouds you you know they have an on-prem they have a AWS they have an Azure they have a AWS they have an Azure they have a AWS they have an Azure whatever they they they put some whatever they they they put some whatever they they they put some workloads on one and some on the other workloads on one and some on the other workloads on one and some on the other or they do redundancies I think any or they do redundancies I think any or they do redundancies I think any anyone in the any big company has got to anyone in the any big company has got to anyone in the any big company has got to have that kind of strategy these days have that kind of strategy these days have that kind of strategy these days especially things things like this that especially things things like this that especially things things like this that happen and then they do happen and happen and then they do happen and happen and then they do happen and there's rational business reasons it there's rational business reasons it there's rational business reasons it just reinforces the need to architect just reinforces the need to architect just reinforces the need to architect for some some diversity and you know now for some some diversity and you know now for some some diversity and you know now that uh it's um I I have to laugh cuz that uh it's um I I have to laugh cuz that uh it's um I I have to laugh cuz I'm going to use the word Telco and I'm going to use the word Telco and I'm going to use the word Telco and Visionary in a single sentence but the Visionary in a single sentence but the Visionary in a single sentence but the Telos Telos Telos wait you canot do that hold on hold on wait you canot do that hold on hold on wait you canot do that hold on hold on Rob hold on because it's something that Rob hold on because it's something that Rob hold on because it's something that P just said so here's the thing uh most

P just said so here's the thing uh most P just said so here's the thing uh most most of the big Global Telos uh and this most of the big Global Telos uh and this most of the big Global Telos uh and this is like you know product that are 10 is like you know product that are 10 is like you know product that are 10 years old they have done a great job years old they have done a great job years old they have done a great job with their multicloud strategy if if you with their multicloud strategy if if you with their multicloud strategy if if you from a connectivity perspective to tell from a connectivity perspective to tell from a connectivity perspective to tell an Enterprise customer that the uh an Enterprise customer that the uh an Enterprise customer that the uh multicloud multi-data Center multicloud multi-data Center multicloud multi-data Center infrastructure that's really there now infrastructure that's really there now infrastructure that's really there now they're not going to see the they're not going to see the they're not going to see the money that's monetization is another money that's monetization is another money that's monetization is another issue but the pipes the pipes are there issue but the pipes the pipes are there issue but the pipes the pipes are there and and I think this is going to come and and I think this is going to come and and I think this is going to come back and so this Microsoft news is good back and so this Microsoft news is good back and so this Microsoft news is good for Telo and it's good for the the for Telo and it's good for the the for Telo and it's good for the the sellers that are having this discussion sellers that are having this discussion sellers that are having this discussion because you go as neutral you're going because you go as neutral you're going because you go as neutral you're going as like hey I'm not pitching your I'm as like hey I'm not pitching your I'm as like hey I'm not pitching your I'm not pitching your Cloud but here's this not pitching your Cloud but here's this not pitching your Cloud but here's this infrastructure that it's in the ground infrastructure that it's in the ground infrastructure that it's in the ground literally and it could help you literally and it could help you literally and it could help you diversify now so uh Telco folks go you diversify now so uh Telco folks go you diversify now so uh Telco folks go you know go tell your know go tell your know go tell your friends t t prior to any Telos using one friends t t prior to any Telos using one friends t t prior to any Telos using one of the hyperscale clouds all of them of the hyperscale clouds all of them of the hyperscale clouds all of them rolled their own and they used open rolled their own and they used open rolled their own and they used open shift open stack to build their own shift open stack to build their own shift open stack to build their own clouds because they didn't want to take clouds because they didn't want to take clouds because they didn't want to take a dependency on these new young whipper a dependency on these new young whipper a dependency on these new young whipper snapper hyperscalers that were coming up snapper hyperscalers that were coming up snapper hyperscalers that were coming up because Telos have been here since the because Telos have been here since the because Telos have been here since the dawn of time and these cloud guys are dawn of time and these cloud guys are dawn of time and these cloud guys are new to the I wonder how that's playing new to the I wonder how that's playing new to the I wonder how that's playing out because I remember all the Telos and out because I remember all the Telos and out because I remember all the Telos and and Ericson they all use you know these and Ericson they all use you know these and Ericson they all use you know these open- Source Cloud Solutions you know open- Source Cloud Solutions you know open- Source Cloud Solutions you know backed by red hat or canonical and folks backed by red hat or canonical and folks backed by red hat or canonical and folks like that I don't know how that's played

like that I don't know how that's played like that I don't know how that's played out there's so much news and hype about out there's so much news and hype about out there's so much news and hype about Telco partnering with AWS or whoever you Telco partnering with AWS or whoever you Telco partnering with AWS or whoever you know is know is know is there it's a simple flavor it's so you there it's a simple flavor it's so you there it's a simple flavor it's so you have a lot of uh you know uh software have a lot of uh you know uh software have a lot of uh you know uh software defined networking and a lot of um defined networking and a lot of um defined networking and a lot of um Network functions that have been Network functions that have been Network functions that have been virtualized just to enable the virtualized just to enable the virtualized just to enable the connectivity again not now I'm going to connectivity again not now I'm going to connectivity again not now I'm going to it's the the the value is in the it's the the the value is in the it's the the the value is in the diversity of the connectivity not the diversity of the connectivity not the diversity of the connectivity not the not the destination itself at Le at not the destination itself at Le at not the destination itself at Le at least for the at least for the Telo but least for the at least for the Telo but least for the at least for the Telo but yeah I know like the open Rand yeah I know like the open Rand yeah I know like the open Rand deployments these days are typically deployments these days are typically deployments these days are typically like a Dell Zeon box running Linux and like a Dell Zeon box running Linux and like a Dell Zeon box running Linux and running packet core someone's packet running packet core someone's packet running packet core someone's packet core there in a box it's not in a core there in a box it's not in a core there in a box it's not in a hyperscaler data center right it's on hyperscaler data center right it's on hyperscaler data center right it's on the tower it's nearby so it actually I the tower it's nearby so it actually I the tower it's nearby so it actually I think this actually reinforces the need think this actually reinforces the need think this actually reinforces the need for more of these kind of distribut data for more of these kind of distribut data for more of these kind of distribut data centers and providers that are you know centers and providers that are you know centers and providers that are you know not you know putting workloads sure in not you know putting workloads sure in not you know putting workloads sure in Azure AWS and all that stuff is great Azure AWS and all that stuff is great Azure AWS and all that stuff is great but also what about equinex and vulture but also what about equinex and vulture but also what about equinex and vulture and vapor and you know all these other and vapor and you know all these other and vapor and you know all these other folks that have clouds you know they're folks that have clouds you know they're folks that have clouds you know they're selling Cloud capabilities but they're selling Cloud capabilities but they're selling Cloud capabilities but they're not in the hyperscaler and I think not in the hyperscaler and I think not in the hyperscaler and I think you'll see workloads distributed to them you'll see workloads distributed to them you'll see workloads distributed to them like packet core and things like that like packet core and things like that like packet core and things like that not necessarily all running up doesn't not necessarily all running up doesn't not necessarily all running up doesn't all have to be in the cloud of clouds it all have to be in the cloud of clouds it all have to be in the cloud of clouds it can be in the little well we live long can be in the little well we live long can be in the little well we live long enough enough enough to see a tel in the US buy vapor hey Verizon bought AOL so anything vapor hey Verizon bought AOL so anything can happen What AT&T Direct TV I mean that's

happen What AT&T Direct TV I mean that's that's that's that's FR you know guys the interesting thing FR you know guys the interesting thing FR you know guys the interesting thing to me is that because it depends on what to me is that because it depends on what to me is that because it depends on what level the stack you put your dependency level the stack you put your dependency level the stack you put your dependency because I'm kind of feeling we're having because I'm kind of feeling we're having because I'm kind of feeling we're having the same conversation I had when I was a the same conversation I had when I was a the same conversation I had when I was a a young engineer working on on Unix a young engineer working on on Unix a young engineer working on on Unix boxes you had the unisis Unix you the N boxes you had the unisis Unix you the N boxes you had the unisis Unix you the N Unix you the BSD Unix and people was Unix you the BSD Unix and people was Unix you the BSD Unix and people was figuring out how you port from that to figuring out how you port from that to figuring out how you port from that to ever ever ever so are we haven't we realized that you so are we haven't we realized that you so are we haven't we realized that you know cloud is basically an know cloud is basically an know cloud is basically an industrialization that into a data industrialization that into a data industrialization that into a data center is not yours but the problem is center is not yours but the problem is center is not yours but the problem is exactly the same so what is interesting exactly the same so what is interesting exactly the same so what is interesting in the in the business world is that you in the in the business world is that you in the in the business world is that you know we be our data dependency at the know we be our data dependency at the know we be our data dependency at the level of SQL and then there were level of SQL and then there were level of SQL and then there were different SQL implementation everywhere different SQL implementation everywhere different SQL implementation everywhere and you could to some extent move from and you could to some extent move from and you could to some extent move from one to the other now if you create your one to the other now if you create your one to the other now if you create your dependency so at a level which is not dependency so at a level which is not dependency so at a level which is not right so not at the level but at the right so not at the level but at the right so not at the level but at the level of a service that never becomes a level of a service that never becomes a level of a service that never becomes a standard this is where you get a problem standard this is where you get a problem standard this is where you get a problem right so it's it's the same problem is right so it's it's the same problem is right so it's it's the same problem is facility so and and by the way maybe facility so and and by the way maybe facility so and and by the way maybe that's G to kill me to say that but that's G to kill me to say that but that's G to kill me to say that but maybe that means that the G approach to maybe that means that the G approach to maybe that means that the G approach to take Cloud Foundry as there you know take Cloud Foundry as there you know take Cloud Foundry as there you know foundational element in the end was not foundational element in the end was not foundational element in the end was not too bad because it's an open source too bad because it's an open source too bad because it's an open source project and you know if somebody decided project and you know if somebody decided project and you know if somebody decided to kill it you can even you know to kill it you can even you know to kill it you can even you know maintain your own implementation so well maintain your own implementation so well maintain your own implementation so well wasn't it like base camp or somebody had wasn't it like base camp or somebody had wasn't it like base camp or somebody had a big posting around moving off the a big posting around moving off the a big posting around moving off the cloud and moving back on Prem and yeah cloud and moving back on Prem and yeah cloud and moving back on Prem and yeah you know I don't know if it's one or the you know I don't know if it's one or the you know I don't know if it's one or the other but it's you know there's

other but it's you know there's other but it's you know there's certainly a lot more on Prem I would certainly a lot more on Prem I would certainly a lot more on Prem I would call it near Prem multi-tenant near Prem call it near Prem multi-tenant near Prem call it near Prem multi-tenant near Prem you know happening these days it's very you know happening these days it's very you know happening these days it's very hot area did you just invent a new word hot area did you just invent a new word hot area did you just invent a new word today near Prem near Prem oh my God today near Prem near Prem oh my God today near Prem near Prem oh my God trademark oh my God we need to create a trademark oh my God we need to create a trademark oh my God we need to create a magic quadrant for near Prim right now magic quadrant for near Prim right now magic quadrant for near Prim right now that's right that's right now that's that's right that's right now that's that's right that's right now that's that's what's happening and I think base that's what's happening and I think base that's what's happening and I think base camp folks were like hey we're just GNA camp folks were like hey we're just GNA camp folks were like hey we're just GNA pull off the cloud and own our own pull off the cloud and own our own pull off the cloud and own our own destiny and you know that's right it's destiny and you know that's right it's destiny and you know that's right it's but that will the problem with that is but that will the problem with that is but that will the problem with that is that will force you to go lower in the that will force you to go lower in the that will force you to go lower in the stack right and you have to take all the stack right and you have to take all the stack right and you have to take all the engine yeah because if you build your engine yeah because if you build your engine yeah because if you build your stuff on on Lambda functions because you stuff on on Lambda functions because you stuff on on Lambda functions because you want to do serverless I mean good luck want to do serverless I mean good luck want to do serverless I mean good luck finding that on Prem so that's the finding that on Prem so that's the finding that on Prem so that's the problem we keep on going back to low in problem we keep on going back to low in problem we keep on going back to low in the stack or higher in the stack well the stack or higher in the stack well the stack or higher in the stack well then there's also the capex and the then there's also the capex and the then there's also the capex and the hardware too you have to and you know hardware too you have to and you know hardware too you have to and you know you're going to find some extra h20s you're going to find some extra h20s you're going to find some extra h20s lying around to put in your lunch room lying around to put in your lunch room lying around to put in your lunch room you know no way I mean you know forget you know no way I mean you know forget you know no way I mean you know forget it you want that stuff you need to go to it you want that stuff you need to go to it you want that stuff you need to go to a cloud Demetri kind of what you're a cloud Demetri kind of what you're a cloud Demetri kind of what you're saying is kind of like like alpacino saying is kind of like like alpacino saying is kind of like like alpacino would say they keep pulling me back you would say they keep pulling me back you would say they keep pulling me back you know it's it's just that's crazy stuff know it's it's just that's crazy stuff know it's it's just that's crazy stuff as as we said earlier when you're I when as as we said earlier when you're I when as as we said earlier when you're I when you're a starter or you're developing a you're a starter or you're developing a you're a starter or you're developing a product you have to be very careful the product you have to be very careful the product you have to be very careful the where what dependency level you have if where what dependency level you have if where what dependency level you have if you're only dependent on UB 2 that's you're only dependent on UB 2 that's you're only dependent on UB 2 that's great you can put that onto whatever AI great you can put that onto whatever AI great you can put that onto whatever AI you PC runs and disconnect yourself from

you PC runs and disconnect yourself from you PC runs and disconnect yourself from the cloud if you're depending on the cloud if you're depending on the cloud if you're depending on Services which are proprietary and deep Services which are proprietary and deep Services which are proprietary and deep down into the stack provider then you down into the stack provider then you down into the stack provider then you you have much more you betting that they you have much more you betting that they you have much more you betting that they will be successful and they become will be successful and they become will be successful and they become standards that's the problem you know standards that's the problem you know standards that's the problem you know the IA reading um I I read the whole uh the IA reading um I I read the whole uh the IA reading um I I read the whole uh the base camp return on investment of the base camp return on investment of the base camp return on investment of moving off the cloud um and something moving off the cloud um and something moving off the cloud um and something that I thinking reading between the that I thinking reading between the that I thinking reading between the lines um so Tech aside economics aside I lines um so Tech aside economics aside I lines um so Tech aside economics aside I think the their team was invested in think the their team was invested in think the their team was invested in doing this and I think part of the doing this and I think part of the doing this and I think part of the vision is that because we're going to do vision is that because we're going to do vision is that because we're going to do this ourselves and we need more people this ourselves and we need more people this ourselves and we need more people sounds like their Engineers are vested sounds like their Engineers are vested sounds like their Engineers are vested in this journey you know it's not a it in this journey you know it's not a it in this journey you know it's not a it didn't really like a scheme to get off didn't really like a scheme to get off didn't really like a scheme to get off the cloud and then get rid of the the cloud and then get rid of the the cloud and then get rid of the engineers cuz you know then it's just engineers cuz you know then it's just engineers cuz you know then it's just going to it's just going to fall apart going to it's just going to fall apart going to it's just going to fall apart um so I don't know how many more of um so I don't know how many more of um so I don't know how many more of those we'll see or or how many of folks those we'll see or or how many of folks those we'll see or or how many of folks like that I forget the guy's name I like that I forget the guy's name I like that I forget the guy's name I don't know um you know we'll take the don't know um you know we'll take the don't know um you know we'll take the time to publish cuz I thought it was time to publish cuz I thought it was time to publish cuz I thought it was very detailed it was you know seriously very detailed it was you know seriously very detailed it was you know seriously this journey of how we got off the cloud this journey of how we got off the cloud this journey of how we got off the cloud um you um you um you know savings yeah it was good marketing know savings yeah it was good marketing know savings yeah it was good marketing yeah what's that you what's that you got yeah what's that you what's that you got yeah what's that you what's that you got there Rob got a new toy is is that a there Rob got a new toy is is that a there Rob got a new toy is is that a Mini Pro in a square Mini Pro in a square Mini Pro in a square form you know ever since uh you know form you know ever since uh you know form you know ever since uh you know obviously last summer Intel said no more obviously last summer Intel said no more obviously last summer Intel said no more Nooks from us um but there are a lot of Nooks from us um but there are a lot of Nooks from us um but there are a lot of other players out there making little

other players out there making little other players out there making little mini PCS this is link but there's a mini PCS this is link but there's a mini PCS this is link but there's a bunch of them out there Mr Edge celsia bunch of them out there Mr Edge celsia bunch of them out there Mr Edge celsia you know would be interested in this you know would be interested in this you know would be interested in this because um because um because um so anyway that kind of looks kind of so anyway that kind of looks kind of so anyway that kind of looks kind of that familiar looking feeli like you that familiar looking feeli like you that familiar looking feeli like you saying with the inel Nook and again saying with the inel Nook and again saying with the inel Nook and again there's a lot of players in here most of there's a lot of players in here most of there's a lot of players in here most of them are from China and it is what it is them are from China and it is what it is them are from China and it is what it is you know if you don't have rs232 build you know if you don't have rs232 build you know if you don't have rs232 build do and want do and want do and want it right it right it right so iot is not predicated on anything so iot is not predicated on anything so iot is not predicated on anything other than what used to be that is still other than what used to be that is still other than what used to be that is still out there ooh that's like out there ooh that's like out there ooh that's like poetry Legacy baby well you know as I've poetry Legacy baby well you know as I've poetry Legacy baby well you know as I've told some of you guys you know I'm I'm told some of you guys you know I'm I'm told some of you guys you know I'm I'm building a distributed Edge Cloud thingy building a distributed Edge Cloud thingy building a distributed Edge Cloud thingy um and we kind of were you know you were um and we kind of were you know you were um and we kind of were you know you were talking about how the different Telos talking about how the different Telos talking about how the different Telos were using open stack shift you know were using open stack shift you know were using open stack shift you know there's a smaller version of that from there's a smaller version of that from there's a smaller version of that from conle called conle called conle called microcloud and with microc cloud with as microcloud and with microc cloud with as microcloud and with microc cloud with as few as three nodes and I have three of few as three nodes and I have three of few as three nodes and I have three of these you install you know o to it these you install you know o to it these you install you know o to it doesn't matter which version desktop doesn't matter which version desktop doesn't matter which version desktop server even their iot version on on on server even their iot version on on on server even their iot version on on on your deal and you have three of them and your deal and you have three of them and your deal and you have three of them and as long as they're on the same network as long as they're on the same network as long as they're on the same network you do a Linux command and start pulling you do a Linux command and start pulling you do a Linux command and start pulling down their microc Cloud it'll down their microc Cloud it'll down their microc Cloud it'll automatically identify your three nodes automatically identify your three nodes automatically identify your three nodes that's the minimum and create a cluster

that's the minimum and create a cluster that's the minimum and create a cluster and then it has a whole web dashboard and then it has a whole web dashboard and then it has a whole web dashboard and everything and you can go go in and everything and you can go go in and everything and you can go go in there and it looks like you're in AWS or there and it looks like you're in AWS or there and it looks like you're in AWS or aure just spin up VMS allocate storage aure just spin up VMS allocate storage aure just spin up VMS allocate storage so um that's the crazy thing I'm working so um that's the crazy thing I'm working so um that's the crazy thing I'm working on at my current job since we're in that on at my current job since we're in that on at my current job since we're in that whole weird commercial real estate deal whole weird commercial real estate deal whole weird commercial real estate deal with networks and we're in all these with networks and we're in all these with networks and we're in all these skyscrapers and stuff right I'm building skyscrapers and stuff right I'm building skyscrapers and stuff right I'm building a distributed a distributed a distributed Edge and you see it I think equinix did Edge and you see it I think equinix did Edge and you see it I think equinix did an announcement the other day with an announcement the other day with an announcement the other day with Nvidia so semiconductor partners are Nvidia so semiconductor partners are Nvidia so semiconductor partners are working with hosting providers to create working with hosting providers to create working with hosting providers to create these clouds that are very almost these clouds that are very almost these clouds that are very almost semiconductor specific yes and there's semiconductor specific yes and there's semiconductor specific yes and there's nothing stopping Rob or anyone from nothing stopping Rob or anyone from nothing stopping Rob or anyone from buying some kit I mean there's a famous buying some kit I mean there's a famous buying some kit I mean there's a famous case study with chick-fil where they case study with chick-fil where they case study with chick-fil where they basically you know duct tape three Intel basically you know duct tape three Intel basically you know duct tape three Intel Nooks together and and they created the Nooks together and and they created the Nooks together and and they created the little server for each Chick-fil-A that little server for each Chick-fil-A that little server for each Chick-fil-A that they ran the whole operation on I think they ran the whole operation on I think they ran the whole operation on I think two of them were working and one was a two of them were working and one was a two of them were working and one was a failover but you know this stuff these failover but you know this stuff these failover but you know this stuff these days it's the silicon's powerful enough days it's the silicon's powerful enough days it's the silicon's powerful enough the networks are fast enough yeah where the networks are fast enough yeah where the networks are fast enough yeah where you can bring a lot of this Cloud you can bring a lot of this Cloud you can bring a lot of this Cloud functionality into back back into the functionality into back back into the functionality into back back into the closet uh or the whatever the lunchroom closet uh or the whatever the lunchroom closet uh or the whatever the lunchroom is and um you know seriously reduce your is and um you know seriously reduce your is and um you know seriously reduce your Cloud cost Cloud cost Cloud cost yeah yeah yeah the that other player out there that's the that other player out there that's the that other player out there that's gonna try twist catch play catchup with gonna try twist catch play catchup with gonna try twist catch play catchup with Nvidia um now you know the cool thing is Nvidia um now you know the cool thing is Nvidia um now you know the cool thing is is there's been so much news in the last is there's been so much news in the last is there's been so much news in the last I'd say seven days that's validating the I'd say seven days that's validating the I'd say seven days that's validating the thing that we're already building what thing that we're already building what thing that we're already building what that I've been working on you know

that I've been working on you know that I've been working on you know um what's the big CDN provider um aamai um what's the big CDN provider um aamai um what's the big CDN provider um aamai aamai they had a big announcement same aamai they had a big announcement same aamai they had a big announcement same yep where they're going to add you know yep where they're going to add you know yep where they're going to add you know instead of just being a CDN they're instead of just being a CDN they're instead of just being a CDN they're going to do compute and stuff like that going to do compute and stuff like that going to do compute and stuff like that and they've got points of thousands over and they've got points of thousands over and they've got points of thousands over 4,000 points of presence and stuff like 4,000 points of presence and stuff like 4,000 points of presence and stuff like that yeah um AI as a that yeah um AI as a that yeah um AI as a service um because it turns out the service um because it turns out the service um because it turns out the large language model thing that we all large language model thing that we all large language model thing that we all have fun with a normal company would have fun with a normal company would have fun with a normal company would never put their data in that they still never put their data in that they still never put their data in that they still need to train their own models about need to train their own models about need to train their own models about their own stuff Air Canada I think did their own stuff Air Canada I think did their own stuff Air Canada I think did that that worked out pretty well yeah that that worked out pretty well yeah that that worked out pretty well yeah and so uh since I figured out how to do and so uh since I figured out how to do and so uh since I figured out how to do AI since I can train models myself I since I can train models myself I could provide AI as a service on my could provide AI as a service on my could provide AI as a service on my distributed Edge for your buildings yeah distributed Edge for your buildings yeah distributed Edge for your buildings yeah in buildings or I could open it up to in buildings or I could open it up to in buildings or I could open it up to customers from the outside in fact I no customers from the outside in fact I no customers from the outside in fact I no doubt about it I was originally thinking doubt about it I was originally thinking doubt about it I was originally thinking this is for tenants in the buildings d this is for tenants in the buildings d this is for tenants in the buildings d da but I could also just think of the da but I could also just think of the da but I could also just think of the buildings is it's just a location it buildings is it's just a location it buildings is it's just a location it just happens to happen using the power just happens to happen using the power just happens to happen using the power and the connectivity so you could to the and the connectivity so you could to the and the connectivity so you could to the neighborhood as a multi-tenant cloud you neighborhood as a multi-tenant cloud you neighborhood as a multi-tenant cloud you know for everyone in the neighborhood at know for everyone in the neighborhood at know for everyone in the neighborhood at a discount right absolutely so I'm a discount right absolutely so I'm a discount right absolutely so I'm expecting Pete to come help me do all expecting Pete to come help me do all expecting Pete to come help me do all this stuff Ed guy we we we want to know this stuff Ed guy we we we want to know this stuff Ed guy we we we want to know what is the name of your AI bot going to what is the name of your AI bot going to what is the name of your AI bot going to be I'm hoping it's like kesso or be I'm hoping it's like kesso or be I'm hoping it's like kesso or something I was going to use something something I was going to use something something I was going to use something called there was this name from uh well

called there was this name from uh well called there was this name from uh well did you ever hear play a video game and did you ever hear play a video game and did you ever hear play a video game and there was this one character named there was this one character named there was this one character named Cortana um she was awesome but wait they Cortana um she was awesome but wait they Cortana um she was awesome but wait they s wait hold on sure might have expired you should cheat sure might have expired you should cheat check us PTO on that it might be check us PTO on that it might be check us PTO on that it might be available dri are you are you in available dri are you are you in available dri are you are you in Paris yes okay I think we're near Paris yes okay I think we're near Paris yes okay I think we're near the yeah it's not a fake background the yeah it's not a fake background the yeah it's not a fake background that's a real deal no no no that's a real deal no no no that's a real deal no no no he's it's the real thing I rented that he's it's the real thing I rented that he's it's the real thing I rented that in vacation for a weekend I rented that in vacation for a weekend I rented that in vacation for a weekend I rented that fabulous artist studio just in front of fabulous artist studio just in front of fabulous artist studio just in front of Sak now it's Paris so six floor Sak now it's Paris so six floor Sak now it's Paris so six floor blyer my legs up that's a good exercise blyer my legs up that's a good exercise blyer my legs up that's a good exercise and then it looks like Mark it looks and then it looks like Mark it looks and then it looks like Mark it looks like you're in a building that's under like you're in a building that's under like you're in a building that's under construction if I look behind you it's construction if I look behind you it's construction if I look behind you it's probably not it's trying to be cool but probably not it's trying to be cool but probably not it's trying to be cool but it looks like I'm seeing walls being it looks like I'm seeing walls being it looks like I'm seeing walls being built I'm in a shopping mall oh so built I'm in a shopping mall oh so built I'm in a shopping mall oh so yeah in a restaurant that it is still yeah in a restaurant that it is still yeah in a restaurant that it is still not open so I'm sitting here okay I not open so I'm sitting here okay I not open so I'm sitting here okay I wanted to challenge you to ask you how wanted to challenge you to ask you how wanted to challenge you to ask you how how are you going to manage uh host how are you going to manage uh host how are you going to manage uh host updates how are you update the operating updates how are you update the operating updates how are you update the operating system when there will be Linux uh system when there will be Linux uh system when there will be Linux uh kernel tches kernel tches kernel tches with I'm going to use this method the with I'm going to use this method the with I'm going to use this method the acronym is fio figure it acronym is fio figure it acronym is fio figure it out and so I know so there literally is out and so I know so there literally is out and so I know so there literally is it's called microcloud but think of it it's called microcloud but think of it it's called microcloud but think of it as a subset of open stack or whatever um as a subset of open stack or whatever um as a subset of open stack or whatever um from a minimum of three nodes up to 50

from a minimum of three nodes up to 50 from a minimum of three nodes up to 50 nodes um and then the same remote stuff nodes um and then the same remote stuff nodes um and then the same remote stuff I can use for auntu Linux they've got I can use for auntu Linux they've got I can use for auntu Linux they've got remote monitor remote monitor remote monitor I'm sure there's a lot of stuff I have I'm sure there's a lot of stuff I have I'm sure there's a lot of stuff I have to figure out that I don't know yet but to figure out that I don't know yet but to figure out that I don't know yet but I'll figure it out but you know Rob for I'll figure it out but you know Rob for I'll figure it out but you know Rob for a small fee I can handle all of your a small fee I can handle all of your a small fee I can handle all of your updates in real time with a cunning use updates in real time with a cunning use updates in real time with a cunning use of one of of one of of one of these and I'll figure it out genius and these and I'll figure it out genius and these and I'll figure it out genius and very very safe and very secure no worry very very safe and very secure no worry very very safe and very secure no worry about that actually I read an article about that actually I read an article about that actually I read an article that the the USB sticks are actually that the the USB sticks are actually that the the USB sticks are actually there's a lot of degradation in USB there's a lot of degradation in USB there's a lot of degradation in USB sticks because they use a lot of parts sticks because they use a lot of parts sticks because they use a lot of parts memory Parts in USB sticks that don't memory Parts in USB sticks that don't memory Parts in USB sticks that don't pass quality tests and stuff like that pass quality tests and stuff like that pass quality tests and stuff like that so they end up you get you get sort of so they end up you get you get sort of so they end up you get you get sort of the reject memory pieces in your USB the reject memory pieces in your USB the reject memory pieces in your USB sticks so be aware of how long you think sticks so be aware of how long you think sticks so be aware of how long you think that USB stick's Gonna Last because it that USB stick's Gonna Last because it that USB stick's Gonna Last because it probably is pretty dis yeah yeah oh my probably is pretty dis yeah yeah oh my probably is pretty dis yeah yeah oh my God I'm in Paris by the way too just God I'm in Paris by the way too just God I'm in Paris by the way too just you're in Paris too yeah sure why not you're in Paris too yeah sure why not you're in Paris too yeah sure why not why not exactly yeah you don't want to why not exactly yeah you don't want to why not exactly yeah you don't want to know the number of complaints that we know the number of complaints that we know the number of complaints that we have from people uh using eter Bina eter have from people uh using eter Bina eter have from people uh using eter Bina eter flashing uh operating systems on USB flashing uh operating systems on USB flashing uh operating systems on USB drives so yeah scks complaining like oh drives so yeah scks complaining like oh drives so yeah scks complaining like oh destroyed by USB destroyed by USB destroyed by USB stick I wonder if the answer is what you stick I wonder if the answer is what you stick I wonder if the answer is what you say it's like yeah maybe buy a a say it's like yeah maybe buy a a say it's like yeah maybe buy a a better spend an extra couple of bucks better spend an extra couple of bucks better spend an extra couple of bucks I'm wondering if there's a play for I'm wondering if there's a play for I'm wondering if there's a play for balena updating microc clouds I'm just balena updating microc clouds I'm just balena updating microc clouds I'm just making up here I don't even know um making up here I don't even know um making up here I don't even know um I don't know I never with microc clouds

I don't know I never with microc clouds I don't know I never with microc clouds but happy to happy to explore we're but happy to happy to explore we're but happy to happy to explore we're always happy to explore we could have an always happy to explore we could have an always happy to explore we could have an if I could if I could get you on a call if I could if I could get you on a call if I could if I could get you on a call for an exploratory call that would be for an exploratory call that would be for an exploratory call that would be great maybe how about next Thursday at great maybe how about next Thursday at great maybe how about next Thursday at 3m. of the calend calendly link right 3m. of the calend calendly link right 3m. of the calend calendly link right now yes that's right it it's already in now yes that's right it it's already in now yes that's right it it's already in your calendar even though I'm trying to your calendar even though I'm trying to your calendar even though I'm trying to get you to do this for me I actually get you to do this for me I actually get you to do this for me I actually need you to come to my calendly and do need you to come to my calendly and do need you to come to my calendly and do all the work to make that happen is that all the work to make that happen is that all the work to make that happen is that that's okay right yeah okay you know that's okay right yeah okay you know that's okay right yeah okay you know that it's always a pleasure to give you that it's always a pleasure to give you that it's always a pleasure to give you support even if you are in a parking lot support even if you are in a parking lot support even if you are in a parking lot or whatever you are yes yes that's right or whatever you are yes yes that's right or whatever you are yes yes that's right Mark helped me out in a Walmart parking Mark helped me out in a Walmart parking Mark helped me out in a Walmart parking lot one time getting some on once a year lot one time getting some on once a year lot one time getting some on once a year it doesn't harm anyone right that's it doesn't harm anyone right that's it doesn't harm anyone right that's right that's right I was using Blues right that's right I was using Blues right that's right I was using Blues Wireless trying to get it to upload some Wireless trying to get it to upload some Wireless trying to get it to upload some stuff to Blues from my car from in a stuff to Blues from my car from in a stuff to Blues from my car from in a Walmart parking lot because there was Walmart parking lot because there was Walmart parking lot because there was good signal there you know cellular good signal there you know cellular good signal there you know cellular so while you're in the mode of of uh fio so while you're in the mode of of uh fio so while you're in the mode of of uh fio um make sure that you account for trust um make sure that you account for trust um make sure that you account for trust transparency and transparency and transparency and Providence those are big words there I Providence those are big words there I Providence those are big words there I just picked them up right there okay just picked them up right there okay just picked them up right there okay okay they were laying on my desk they on okay they were laying on my desk they on okay they were laying on my desk they on your desk TR trust wait a your desk TR trust wait a your desk TR trust wait a second people are just gonna be happy to second people are just gonna be happy to second people are just gonna be happy to be here yeah but if if it's I mean be here yeah but if if it's I mean be here yeah but if if it's I mean actually I might P you to to look at actually I might P you to to look at actually I might P you to to look at what you you're working on because I'm what you you're working on because I'm what you you're working on because I'm interested it's micing as well but if interested it's micing as well but if interested it's micing as well but if you have multiple nodes depending on how

you have multiple nodes depending on how you have multiple nodes depending on how this is designed you can very well this is designed you can very well this is designed you can very well imagine that when there's an noise imagine that when there's an noise imagine that when there's an noise update one of the not say hey you know update one of the not say hey you know update one of the not say hey you know what I'm going to update one nodes check what I'm going to update one nodes check what I'm going to update one nodes check that the workload works well and then if that the workload works well and then if that the workload works well and then if it works well toate the others so there it works well toate the others so there it works well toate the others so there should be mechanism to or if we believe should be mechanism to or if we believe should be mechanism to or if we believe in those architecture that might be in those architecture that might be in those architecture that might be actually a very interesting thing to actually a very interesting thing to actually a very interesting thing to look into the dropping to make sure that look into the dropping to make sure that look into the dropping to make sure that you maintain your micro Cloud at at the you maintain your micro Cloud at at the you maintain your micro Cloud at at the right level of your security if you get right level of your security if you get right level of your security if you get in the neighborhood Cloud business in the neighborhood Cloud business in the neighborhood Cloud business you're going to have to like wear the you're going to have to like wear the you're going to have to like wear the pager and like get a call at two in the pager and like get a call at two in the pager and like get a call at two in the morning because somebody's webcam thing morning because somebody's webcam thing morning because somebody's webcam thing isn't working right so I don't know if isn't working right so I don't know if isn't working right so I don't know if you want to get in the cloud oh crap I you want to get in the cloud oh crap I you want to get in the cloud oh crap I just forgot about that part that just forgot about that part that just forgot about that part that means but but you know it would be it means but but you know it would be it means but but you know it would be it would be it would be pagro 2.0 so you would be it would be pagro 2.0 so you would be it would be pagro 2.0 so you will have a robot in your home that will have a robot in your home that will have a robot in your home that comes to while you sleep you know comes to while you sleep you know comes to while you sleep you know that's that's such a that's such an that's that's such a that's such an that's that's such a that's such an interesting point because if I go back interesting point because if I go back interesting point because if I go back in time and I think when you know Pete in time and I think when you know Pete in time and I think when you know Pete and I were at Microsoft and we launched and I were at Microsoft and we launched and I were at Microsoft and we launched Azure and there's a lot of people I want Azure and there's a lot of people I want Azure and there's a lot of people I want to work in Azure and they're working on to work in Azure and they're working on to work in Azure and they're working on Azure and they were thinking it's wrting Azure and they were thinking it's wrting Azure and they were thinking it's wrting and stuff like that and then all of a and stuff like that and then all of a and stuff like that and then all of a sudden it's like oh wait the cloud is sudden it's like oh wait the cloud is sudden it's like oh wait the cloud is actually a managed service and 147 all actually a managed service and 147 all actually a managed service and 147 all of a sudden it's not Windows Server of a sudden it's not Windows Server of a sudden it's not Windows Server running in your data center and it's all running in your data center and it's all running in your data center and it's all on you to figure it out it's it's now on on you to figure it out it's it's now on on you to figure it out it's it's now on me and all of a sudden I had guys me and all of a sudden I had guys me and all of a sudden I had guys basically had the equivalent of pagers basically had the equivalent of pagers basically had the equivalent of pagers yep 247 R shift yeah and so I yeah I was yep 247 R shift yeah and so I yeah I was yep 247 R shift yeah and so I yeah I was actually playing a tennis match at the actually playing a tennis match at the actually playing a tennis match at the pro club once and this this person he

pro club once and this this person he pro club once and this this person he had to leave in the middle of the match had to leave in the middle of the match had to leave in the middle of the match oh man like I gotta go I gotta go I was oh man like I gotta go I gotta go I was oh man like I gotta go I gotta go I was like I won which is good but uh there like I won which is good but uh there like I won which is good but uh there you go you you just you like send a you go you you just you like send a you go you you just you like send a secret message that's right I'm like secret message that's right I'm like secret message that's right I'm like email Jason Xander there's an outage email Jason Xander there's an outage email Jason Xander there's an outage there's an outage in Azure you're gonna there's an outage in Azure you're gonna there's an outage in Azure you're gonna have to go take care of have to go take care of have to go take care of that sure uh Rob that when you do your that sure uh Rob that when you do your that sure uh Rob that when you do your network failover and you go from you network failover and you go from you network failover and you go from you know from fiber to Cellular that at the know from fiber to Cellular that at the know from fiber to Cellular that at the same time you don't run like a 3 gig same time you don't run like a 3 gig same time you don't run like a 3 gig update to the Box on your on your on update to the Box on your on your on update to the Box on your on your on your 2 kilobyte plan yes on your iot your 2 kilobyte plan yes on your iot your 2 kilobyte plan yes on your iot aggregator platform because you're going aggregator platform because you're going aggregator platform because you're going to get a fat Bill well you guys are the to get a fat Bill well you guys are the to get a fat Bill well you guys are the smartest people I know does this sound smartest people I know does this sound smartest people I know does this sound crazy to you that I'm gonna try to do crazy to you that I'm gonna try to do crazy to you that I'm gonna try to do this or is it just like any other thing this or is it just like any other thing this or is it just like any other thing we do we figure it out you know and it's we do we figure it out you know and it's we do we figure it out you know and it's unrelated to iot I mean it's it's like unrelated to iot I mean it's it's like unrelated to iot I mean it's it's like basically micro I mean it's it's Edge basically micro I mean it's it's Edge basically micro I mean it's it's Edge it's Edge you know Edge compute yeah and it's Edge you know Edge compute yeah and it's Edge you know Edge compute yeah and you're GNA have cameras and other things you're GNA have cameras and other things you're GNA have cameras and other things hooked up to it right so you're GNA do hooked up to it right so you're GNA do hooked up to it right so you're GNA do it I would probably the only thing is it I would probably the only thing is it I would probably the only thing is like I think there is going to be a like I think there is going to be a like I think there is going to be a proliferation of these kind of microc proliferation of these kind of microc proliferation of these kind of microc clouds as off as offerings and I think clouds as off as offerings and I think clouds as off as offerings and I think people have to really be thoughtful people have to really be thoughtful people have to really be thoughtful about how they go to market with that about how they go to market with that about how they go to market with that because you know all kidding aside like because you know all kidding aside like because you know all kidding aside like we just talked about dependencies you we just talked about dependencies you we just talked about dependencies you know companies taking dependencies on know companies taking dependencies on know companies taking dependencies on your your am ryzen box that you just your your am ryzen box that you just your your am ryzen box that you just bought from somewhere T somewhere Amazon bought from somewhere T somewhere Amazon bought from somewhere T somewhere Amazon where all things come from I thought you where all things come from I thought you where all things come from I thought you were gonna say teu or something no I were gonna say teu or something no I were gonna say teu or something no I didn't I might as well maybe I get a

didn't I might as well maybe I get a didn't I might as well maybe I get a better deal on te better deal on te better deal on te prob shop like a billionaire at Teemu prob shop like a billionaire at Teemu prob shop like a billionaire at Teemu shop like a billionaire oh my gosh you shop like a billionaire oh my gosh you shop like a billionaire oh my gosh you know if I take this all the way back to know if I take this all the way back to know if I take this all the way back to earlier in the conversation and Mr earlier in the conversation and Mr earlier in the conversation and Mr Vasquez remember this so we were talking Vasquez remember this so we were talking Vasquez remember this so we were talking about the whole cloud dependencies and about the whole cloud dependencies and about the whole cloud dependencies and it's it scary and Pete was saying it's it scary and Pete was saying it's it scary and Pete was saying everybody's going multicloud and it's everybody's going multicloud and it's everybody's going multicloud and it's dangerous and everything David you might dangerous and everything David you might dangerous and everything David you might remember we did a a one of our episodes remember we did a a one of our episodes remember we did a a one of our episodes I don't know a million years ago where I I don't know a million years ago where I I don't know a million years ago where I talked about how I'm going to rescue all talked about how I'm going to rescue all talked about how I'm going to rescue all of of of iot and I built this the original thing iot and I built this the original thing iot and I built this the original thing the original thunder struck platform the original thunder struck platform the original thunder struck platform prior to it pivoting to becoming an prior to it pivoting to becoming an prior to it pivoting to becoming an agriculture thing it was actually any agriculture thing it was actually any agriculture thing it was actually any device to any device to any device to any platform and it was crazy and it had all platform and it was crazy and it had all platform and it was crazy and it had all this Security checks but it also part of this Security checks but it also part of this Security checks but it also part of the thinking was it was multic Cloud I the thinking was it was multic Cloud I the thinking was it was multic Cloud I spent a lot of time to build spent a lot of time to build spent a lot of time to build it I in addition to I'm like calling up it I in addition to I'm like calling up it I in addition to I'm like calling up you know Eric simoney at Clear blade and you know Eric simoney at Clear blade and you know Eric simoney at Clear blade and calling up my buddies at low sand I'm calling up my buddies at low sand I'm calling up my buddies at low sand I'm calling up everybody and I'm like hey I calling up everybody and I'm like hey I calling up everybody and I'm like hey I can route things and dynamically click a can route things and dynamically click a can route things and dynamically click a button and have iot device feeds switch button and have iot device feeds switch button and have iot device feeds switch from this place to that place so I also from this place to that place so I also from this place to that place so I also did it for S3 buckets I did it for Azure did it for S3 buckets I did it for Azure did it for S3 buckets I did it for Azure blob storage I did it for all these blob storage I did it for all these blob storage I did it for all these platforms and so I built all this stuff platforms and so I built all this stuff platforms and so I built all this stuff because the thinking was we've all seen because the thinking was we've all seen because the thinking was we've all seen in the past on Twitter the internet of in the past on Twitter the internet of in the past on Twitter the internet of and it talks about when consumer and it talks about when consumer and it talks about when consumer iots become bricked because the platform

iots become bricked because the platform iots become bricked because the platform the cloud the whatever that that compy the cloud the whatever that that compy the cloud the whatever that that compy was depending on went out of business was depending on went out of business was depending on went out of business and all of a sudden this $400 thing you and all of a sudden this $400 thing you and all of a sudden this $400 thing you bought doesn't work anymore or your bought doesn't work anymore or your bought doesn't work anymore or your thermostat bricks or whatever exactly so thermostat bricks or whatever exactly so thermostat bricks or whatever exactly so some of my value prop was no problem if some of my value prop was no problem if some of my value prop was no problem if this guy's going to shut down I can this guy's going to shut down I can this guy's going to shut down I can redirect you to a new host and you can redirect you to a new host and you can redirect you to a new host and you can start using that instead um yeah that start using that instead um yeah that start using that instead um yeah that was a lot of fun back then I think you was a lot of fun back then I think you was a lot of fun back then I think you need a software update for that and and need a software update for that and and need a software update for that and and some of the breaks became because of the some of the breaks became because of the some of the breaks became because of the software update I remember yeah true software update I remember yeah true software update I remember yeah true that's true you're right you're right that's true you're right you're right that's true you're right you're right well some and and some became a briak well some and and some became a briak well some and and some became a briak because of the software update yeah because of the software update yeah because of the software update yeah that's right we've seen lots of phones that's right we've seen lots of phones that's right we've seen lots of phones laying on the ground over the laying on the ground over the laying on the ground over the years actually so the other thing about years actually so the other thing about years actually so the other thing about multic Cloud this is why I think like multic Cloud this is why I think like multic Cloud this is why I think like orchestration which we don't have a lot orchestration which we don't have a lot orchestration which we don't have a lot of time to talk about the idea of of time to talk about the idea of of time to talk about the idea of orchestration is hey Mark is like that's orchestration is hey Mark is like that's orchestration is hey Mark is like that's kind of the center of the universe right kind of the center of the universe right kind of the center of the universe right I think I think it's like it's like how I think I think it's like it's like how I think I think it's like it's like how how how I stop worrying and learn to how how I stop worrying and learn to how how I stop worrying and learn to love love love orchestration uh because uh orchestration uh because uh orchestration uh because uh orchestrating workloads across multiple orchestrating workloads across multiple orchestrating workloads across multiple clouds and clouds to edges is going to clouds and clouds to edges is going to clouds and clouds to edges is going to be fundamental to you know mitigating be fundamental to you know mitigating be fundamental to you know mitigating dependencies and uh so I I love these dependencies and uh so I I love these dependencies and uh so I I love these company I mean there's all the the Azure company I mean there's all the the Azure company I mean there's all the the Azure Arc and the kind of hyperscaler ones but Arc and the kind of hyperscaler ones but Arc and the kind of hyperscaler ones but there's also a lot of independent there's also a lot of independent there's also a lot of independent orchestration platforms and folks like orchestration platforms and folks like orchestration platforms and folks like zida doing things on the edge and um I zida doing things on the edge and um I zida doing things on the edge and um I think there's a lot of action there and think there's a lot of action there and think there's a lot of action there and I think a lot of opportun for for folks I think a lot of opportun for for folks I think a lot of opportun for for folks to come in and help companies mitigate

to come in and help companies mitigate to come in and help companies mitigate Risk by betting on one Cloud didn't say Risk by betting on one Cloud didn't say Risk by betting on one Cloud didn't say didn't they just do it good was it didn't they just do it good was it didn't they just do it good was it series B he just raised like 72 million series B he just raised like 72 million series B he just raised like 72 million so and it and all on Edge orchestration so and it and all on Edge orchestration so and it and all on Edge orchestration Edge orchestration only yeah that's that Edge orchestration only yeah that's that Edge orchestration only yeah that's that kind of money on edge orchestration wow kind of money on edge orchestration wow kind of money on edge orchestration wow wow so it's happening on some of you wow so it's happening on some of you wow so it's happening on some of you your point Robin because I think there's your point Robin because I think there's your point Robin because I think there's a there's also a very interesting dim a there's also a very interesting dim a there's also a very interesting dim mention is the fact that you can mention is the fact that you can mention is the fact that you can actually at very low cost kind of scale actually at very low cost kind of scale actually at very low cost kind of scale your compute power under your control so your compute power under your control so your compute power under your control so you not rely on the C service provider you not rely on the C service provider you not rely on the C service provider so if you think about it this way you so if you think about it this way you so if you think about it this way you can actually achieve the idea that there can actually achieve the idea that there can actually achieve the idea that there might be some data that you actually might be some data that you actually might be some data that you actually never want to be have on the cloud you never want to be have on the cloud you never want to be have on the cloud you want to have the complete control and want to have the complete control and want to have the complete control and you might allow some services to run on you might allow some services to run on you might allow some services to run on this data if the service is sent to you this data if the service is sent to you this data if the service is sent to you and you compute and you inspect the and you compute and you inspect the and you compute and you inspect the result and then you send the result back result and then you send the result back result and then you send the result back so and from data privacy element I can so and from data privacy element I can so and from data privacy element I can very well imagine that we we have more very well imagine that we we have more very well imagine that we we have more and more of those boxes in our homes and more of those boxes in our homes and more of those boxes in our homes that are mini cloud in which the very that are mini cloud in which the very that are mini cloud in which the very very personal data stays and when very personal data stays and when very personal data stays and when someone wants to access this data someone wants to access this data someone wants to access this data instead of saying hey give me the data instead of saying hey give me the data instead of saying hey give me the data give me an API I want to suck it out no give me an API I want to suck it out no give me an API I want to suck it out no send me the payload I run the payload to send me the payload I run the payload to send me the payload I run the payload to check the data and you get the answer check the data and you get the answer check the data and you get the answer you see so I think it's a it's a very you see so I think it's a it's a very you see so I think it's a it's a very interesting uh it's very interesting interesting uh it's very interesting interesting uh it's very interesting actually the evolution here absolutely actually the evolution here absolutely actually the evolution here absolutely we have problem my my talk in Finland we have problem my my talk in Finland we have problem my my talk in Finland last week was about you all the the last week was about you all the the last week was about you all the the danger of personal data and potentially

danger of personal data and potentially danger of personal data and potentially AI on societies and and the fact that we AI on societies and and the fact that we AI on societies and and the fact that we have those digital twins of ourself have those digital twins of ourself have those digital twins of ourself distributed everywhere we have distributed everywhere we have distributed everywhere we have absolutely no clue and we are giving the absolutely no clue and we are giving the absolutely no clue and we are giving the illusion of security with those illusion of security with those illusion of security with those regulation that talk about content but regulation that talk about content but regulation that talk about content but once you've consented to once you've once you've consented to once you've once you've consented to once you've consented to give data do we have a map consented to give data do we have a map consented to give data do we have a map of all these data all around us that is of all these data all around us that is of all these data all around us that is owned by anybody I mean they app on the owned by anybody I mean they app on the owned by anybody I mean they app on the app store where they can tell you if app store where they can tell you if app store where they can tell you if you're paying twice for Netflix you're paying twice for Netflix you're paying twice for Netflix subscription so which mean that we don't subscription so which mean that we don't subscription so which mean that we don't even know if we have one or two and we even know if we have one or two and we even know if we have one or two and we expect people to remember what they expect people to remember what they expect people to remember what they conent to do so so you can very well conent to do so so you can very well conent to do so so you can very well imagine models where you actually as I imagine models where you actually as I imagine models where you actually as I said control this data and the workload said control this data and the workload said control this data and the workload comes to you then you are really in comes to you then you are really in comes to you then you are really in control yeah yeah yeah that's a good control yeah yeah yeah that's a good control yeah yeah yeah that's a good point that's a good point and to your point that's a good point and to your point that's a good point and to your point and to your point on gen no compan point and to your point on gen no compan point and to your point on gen no compan is going to let their data go outside so is going to let their data go outside so is going to let their data go outside so now you can run that on your s little now you can run that on your s little now you can run that on your s little box and specialize your your your box and specialize your your your box and specialize your your your business and and run those kind of business and and run those kind of business and and run those kind of solutions so that's solution ever since solutions so that's solution ever since solutions so that's solution ever since I figured out ml.net I am I figured out ml.net I am I figured out ml.net I am golden I golden I golden I you you know you don't need that at all you you know you don't need that at all you you know you don't need that at all you go on chat GPT and you can create you go on chat GPT and you can create you go on chat GPT and you can create your GPT by just talking to it you don't your GPT by just talking to it you don't your GPT by just talking to it you don't you don't have to code you don't have to you don't have to code you don't have to you don't have to code you don't have to code anymore that's actually one of the code anymore that's actually one of the code anymore that's actually one of the scary thing as you don't have to code scary thing as you don't have to code scary thing as you don't have to code anymore anybody can write those anymore anybody can write those anymore anybody can write those conversational tools without writing any conversational tools without writing any conversational tools without writing any code you just upload some crappy data code you just upload some crappy data code you just upload some crappy data that you made yourself or that you get that you made yourself or that you get that you made yourself or that you get somewhere it's scary I will admit I mean somewhere it's scary I will admit I mean somewhere it's scary I will admit I mean I I I've been more and more using either I I I've been more and more using either I I I've been more and more using either chat gbt or I've been you know since chat gbt or I've been you know since chat gbt or I've been you know since Microsoft slammed the little co-pilot

Microsoft slammed the little co-pilot Microsoft slammed the little co-pilot onto the taskbar of Windows 11 I've been onto the taskbar of Windows 11 I've been onto the taskbar of Windows 11 I've been using using using co-pilot to solve programming problems co-pilot to solve programming problems co-pilot to solve programming problems like when when it's something real like when when it's something real like when when it's something real difficult you can't figure it out I difficult you can't figure it out I difficult you can't figure it out I start asking it it doesn't always have start asking it it doesn't always have start asking it it doesn't always have the right answer and I might have to go the right answer and I might have to go the right answer and I might have to go three or four times Drilling in the cool three or four times Drilling in the cool three or four times Drilling in the cool thing though is I love how it thing though is I love how it thing though is I love how it understands the context of the understands the context of the understands the context of the conversation or remembers the context of conversation or remembers the context of conversation or remembers the context of it which is really key you know I'll say it which is really key you know I'll say it which is really key you know I'll say I want this and do this and it's not I want this and do this and it's not I want this and do this and it's not right it's like well actually I need right it's like well actually I need right it's like well actually I need this to I want this if frame to be able this to I want this if frame to be able this to I want this if frame to be able to to to call by the same page and it and it and call by the same page and it and it and call by the same page and it and it and it figures it out not right way but it it figures it out not right way but it it figures it out not right way but it figures it out and it's actually helped figures it out and it's actually helped figures it out and it's actually helped me solve a lot of problems so yeah it me solve a lot of problems so yeah it me solve a lot of problems so yeah it remember like I'll have a and I'll say remember like I'll have a and I'll say remember like I'll have a and I'll say well can I get that in 6 by 16 by9 and well can I get that in 6 by 16 by9 and well can I get that in 6 by 16 by9 and then it'll redo it in a different thing then it'll redo it in a different thing then it'll redo it in a different thing but the question is when does co-pilot but the question is when does co-pilot but the question is when does co-pilot start writing its own Co p i mean that's start writing its own Co p i mean that's start writing its own Co p i mean that's the issu the issu the issu is well that but that that's that's not is well that but that that's that's not is well that but that that's that's not going to happen and tell you why going to happen and tell you why going to happen and tell you why actually if you I don't know if you if actually if you I don't know if you if actually if you I don't know if you if you have if you have studied a little you have if you have studied a little you have if you have studied a little bit on other those large language model bit on other those large language model bit on other those large language model work there's a great article from Stefan work there's a great article from Stefan work there's a great article from Stefan W from V from alpha you can read that W from V from alpha you can read that W from V from alpha you can read that the thing is fundamentally it is the thing is fundamentally it is the thing is fundamentally it is extremely effective for problem that you extremely effective for problem that you extremely effective for problem that you might not have solved yourself but have might not have solved yourself but have might not have solved yourself but have been sold by other people and are been sold by other people and are been sold by other people and are documented and been digitized and documented and been digitized and documented and been digitized and actually I have a personal example I I a actually I have a personal example I I a actually I have a personal example I I a big having a big birthday this year so big having a big birthday this year so big having a big birthday this year so I've started to be the little website I've started to be the little website I've started to be the little website with some clu for my friends and I have with some clu for my friends and I have with some clu for my friends and I have a Discord server and I wanted that every a Discord server and I wanted that every a Discord server and I wanted that every every time somebody visit the website

every time somebody visit the website every time somebody visit the website there's a message sent to Discord and there's a message sent to Discord and there's a message sent to Discord and and if you want to do that you need to and if you want to do that you need to and if you want to do that you need to use as sync programming in Python which use as sync programming in Python which use as sync programming in Python which is not very well known I mean I spent a is not very well known I mean I spent a is not very well known I mean I spent a day in a half with CHP trying to find a day in a half with CHP trying to find a day in a half with CHP trying to find a way to make it work never worked I way to make it work never worked I way to make it work never worked I called a friend 20 minutes send me a called a friend 20 minutes send me a called a friend 20 minutes send me a piece of code that works so if if you piece of code that works so if if you piece of code that works so if if you are in the Universe of things that have are in the Universe of things that have are in the Universe of things that have been so for example for Arduino it's been so for example for Arduino it's been so for example for Arduino it's fantastic you want to do some stuff on fantastic you want to do some stuff on fantastic you want to do some stuff on Arduino you ask GPT copy paste the code Arduino you ask GPT copy paste the code Arduino you ask GPT copy paste the code it runs it's beautiful right but as soon it runs it's beautiful right but as soon it runs it's beautiful right but as soon as you get into anything Innovative or as you get into anything Innovative or as you get into anything Innovative or novel it's uh exactly as soon as you get novel it's uh exactly as soon as you get novel it's uh exactly as soon as you get to creativity I mean it gives you the to creativity I mean it gives you the to creativity I mean it gives you the illusion of creativity because it illusion of creativity because it illusion of creativity because it generate codes but the other funny thing generate codes but the other funny thing generate codes but the other funny thing I figure out in code I don't know if you I figure out in code I don't know if you I figure out in code I don't know if you see the same thing Rob is it has a see the same thing Rob is it has a see the same thing Rob is it has a serious problem with a date format in serious problem with a date format in serious problem with a date format in API codes because there's so many you API codes because there's so many you API codes because there's so many you know you never know if the month is know you never know if the month is know you never know if the month is first or if it's the if it's the GMT first or if it's the if it's the GMT first or if it's the if it's the GMT format or it's the local format it meses format or it's the local format it meses format or it's the local format it meses up the formatting of the of the of the up the formatting of the of the of the up the formatting of the of the of the date datetime things in every that's date datetime things in every that's date datetime things in every that's three funny that's a good point wow well three funny that's a good point wow well three funny that's a good point wow well it's only as good as the data that it's it's only as good as the data that it's it's only as good as the data that it's trained on and now there's a lot of trained on and now there's a lot of trained on and now there's a lot of controversy about you know we talked controversy about you know we talked controversy about you know we talked about privacy of data who's giving about privacy of data who's giving about privacy of data who's giving permission for that data to be used for permission for that data to be used for permission for that data to be used for llms other things like that I think it's llms other things like that I think it's llms other things like that I think it's that's the big copyright issues going on that's the big copyright issues going on that's the big copyright issues going on so yeah so yeah so yeah yeah so as a non coder uh as I tell Rob yeah so as a non coder uh as I tell Rob yeah so as a non coder uh as I tell Rob I know python in PowerPoint okay like I

I know python in PowerPoint okay like I I know python in PowerPoint okay like I will just read it and sound like will just read it and sound like will just read it and sound like excellent now jokes I don't code I don't excellent now jokes I don't code I don't excellent now jokes I don't code I don't have the skill not my thing but I do have the skill not my thing but I do have the skill not my thing but I do understand that I can do something understand that I can do something understand that I can do something simple you know I can go buy you know a simple you know I can go buy you know a simple you know I can go buy you know a def kit you know connect to my local def kit you know connect to my local def kit you know connect to my local network and use you know Chad GPT like network and use you know Chad GPT like network and use you know Chad GPT like hey you know I want to I want to make a hey you know I want to I want to make a hey you know I want to I want to make a video camera you know just something video camera you know just something video camera you know just something super simple and I get a whole copy super simple and I get a whole copy super simple and I get a whole copy paste of code but you know I would love paste of code but you know I would love paste of code but you know I would love to hear from you guys from my benefit to hear from you guys from my benefit to hear from you guys from my benefit and the benefit of our let me see the and the benefit of our let me see the and the benefit of our let me see the number 1.93 billion people that subscrib number 1.93 billion people that subscrib number 1.93 billion people that subscrib to this program that's amazing how would to this program that's amazing how would to this program that's amazing how would a non- coder know that the code that I'm a non- coder know that the code that I'm a non- coder know that the code that I'm copy and pasting is just what I wanted copy and pasting is just what I wanted copy and pasting is just what I wanted to do I have a little box I want to do a to do I have a little box I want to do a to do I have a little box I want to do a little iot project versus something that little iot project versus something that little iot project versus something that might bite me in the butt later um like might bite me in the butt later um like might bite me in the butt later um like how no seriously how would I know I how no seriously how would I know I how no seriously how would I know I wouldn't know he wouldn't know you're wouldn't know he wouldn't know you're wouldn't know he wouldn't know you're right yeah you know one minute you think right yeah you know one minute you think right yeah you know one minute you think you're writing the right code next thing you're writing the right code next thing you're writing the right code next thing you're playing a game of thermonuclear you're playing a game of thermonuclear you're playing a game of thermonuclear war that could happen but I do I do war that could happen but I do I do war that could happen but I do I do believe that over time actually the the believe that over time actually the the believe that over time actually the the large language model will probably large language model will probably large language model will probably actually not require you to put any code actually not require you to put any code actually not require you to put any code you will just explain with plain you will just explain with plain you will just explain with plain language as soon as we can start language as soon as we can start language as soon as we can start connecting to the physical world you connecting to the physical world you connecting to the physical world you just Express what you want to do and you just Express what you want to do and you just Express what you want to do and you will do it for you so you you and that's will do it for you so you you and that's will do it for you so you you and that's to me that's the danger of of of llms is to me that's the danger of of of llms is to me that's the danger of of of llms is that it allow it allows you to do a that it allow it allows you to do a that it allow it allows you to do a number of kind of deductible things

number of kind of deductible things number of kind of deductible things without having to be a data scientist or without having to be a data scientist or without having to be a data scientist or think coding it's so prompt engineering think coding it's so prompt engineering think coding it's so prompt engineering prompt engineering that's the new prompt engineering that's the new prompt engineering that's the new engineering engineering engineering discipline yeah discipline yeah discipline yeah but I'll send you the I send you the but I'll send you the I send you the but I'll send you the I send you the link and you put it into the the notes link and you put it into the the notes link and you put it into the the notes as well because you what is also as well because you what is also as well because you what is also important to understand those language important to understand those language important to understand those language model do not actually itate on things model do not actually itate on things model do not actually itate on things it's a neural network and it propagates it's a neural network and it propagates it's a neural network and it propagates in the network so if you type a prompt in the network so if you type a prompt in the network so if you type a prompt please go look on the internet check please go look on the internet check please go look on the internet check this check this article combin it with this check this article combin it with this check this article combin it with this comb with that it's going to give this comb with that it's going to give this comb with that it's going to give you an answer but it's not doing that it you an answer but it's not doing that it you an answer but it's not doing that it has no capacity to do computation or has no capacity to do computation or has no capacity to do computation or iteration so it's it's important to iteration so it's it's important to iteration so it's it's important to understand how it works absolutely understand how it works absolutely understand how it works absolutely absolutely wow so Rob Rob check this absolutely wow so Rob Rob check this absolutely wow so Rob Rob check this code tell me if I you know that's it I code tell me if I you know that's it I code tell me if I you know that's it I don't want to I don't want to launch a don't want to I don't want to launch a don't want to I don't want to launch a nuclear warhead anywhere right you need nuclear warhead anywhere right you need nuclear warhead anywhere right you need another llm to check the other llms work another llm to check the other llms work another llm to check the other llms work I think is yeah well Spider-Man meme we I think is yeah well Spider-Man meme we I think is yeah well Spider-Man meme we could create the Rob we could create the could create the Rob we could create the could create the Rob we could create the the Rob GPT where we take everything the Rob GPT where we take everything the Rob GPT where we take everything that Rob ever publish and actually that Rob ever publish and actually that Rob ever publish and actually publish quite a lot on on Twitter and publish quite a lot on on Twitter and publish quite a lot on on Twitter and add that to CH GPT and create a GPT of add that to CH GPT and create a GPT of add that to CH GPT and create a GPT of Rob and then we have Rob we can talk to Rob and then we have Rob we can talk to Rob and then we have Rob we can talk to wow wow wow I mean I mean it is possible I that I mean I mean it is possible I that I mean I mean it is possible I that would be an interesting experiment to would be an interesting experiment to would be an interesting experiment to your Rob take everything you published your Rob take everything you published your Rob take everything you published and and go on CH GPT say create a new and and go on CH GPT say create a new and and go on CH GPT say create a new GPT and said I want to create something GPT and said I want to create something GPT and said I want to create something that represent what I said in the past that represent what I said in the past that represent what I said in the past it is all the data I posted on link on

it is all the data I posted on link on it is all the data I posted on link on twit how we get to live forever internal twit how we get to live forever internal twit how we get to live forever internal like everything that was yeah you know like everything that was yeah you know like everything that was yeah you know would be crazy that after you do the would be crazy that after you do the would be crazy that after you do the mashup you create uh like a a pixel out mashup you create uh like a a pixel out mashup you create uh like a a pixel out of each uh out of each uh thing that you of each uh out of each uh thing that you of each uh out of each uh thing that you publish and when we zoom out above the publish and when we zoom out above the publish and when we zoom out above the atmospheric layer it looks like Eddie atmospheric layer it looks like Eddie atmospheric layer it looks like Eddie Van Halen yes yeah yeah I can see that I Van Halen yes yeah yeah I can see that I Van Halen yes yeah yeah I can see that I can see that wow all right that's can see that wow all right that's can see that wow all right that's interesting PC we work on that we have interesting PC we work on that we have interesting PC we work on that we have arrived at the end of our show folks arrived at the end of our show folks arrived at the end of our show folks thanks so much for joining us I know you thanks so much for joining us I know you thanks so much for joining us I know you got so much deep Knowledge from this you got so much deep Knowledge from this you got so much deep Knowledge from this you know especially from Dimitri there sacur know especially from Dimitri there sacur know especially from Dimitri there sacur drinking some champagne you know saw drinking some champagne you know saw drinking some champagne you know saw that you know and prco some people get that you know and prco some people get that you know and prco some people get to visit I France champagne champagne to visit I France champagne champagne to visit I France champagne champagne some people get to visit peris some some people get to visit peris some some people get to visit peris some people get to go to Sak ker other people people get to go to Sak ker other people people get to go to Sak ker other people like your typical American the last time like your typical American the last time like your typical American the last time they saw ker was in John Wick four when they saw ker was in John Wick four when they saw ker was in John Wick four when they're having the gun shootout going up they're having the gun shootout going up they're having the gun shootout going up those stairs that go on forever it's those stairs that go on forever it's those stairs that go on forever it's like dude take the fernic okay but no no like dude take the fernic okay but no no like dude take the fernic okay but no no we got to shoot shoot shoot and then we got to shoot shoot shoot and then we got to shoot shoot shoot and then roll all the way down and then start roll all the way down and then start roll all the way down and then start over again but I think that's a great over again but I think that's a great over again but I think that's a great scene to have a shootout a duel right scene to have a shootout a duel right scene to have a shootout a duel right there in front of the homor right there there in front of the homor right there there in front of the homor right there go see the was on strike of course it's go see the was on strike of course it's go see the was on strike of course it's France it's on strike yeah of course I'm France it's on strike yeah of course I'm France it's on strike yeah of course I'm you know the yellow jackets or whatever you know the yellow jackets or whatever you know the yellow jackets or whatever those guys they wearing their vests and those guys they wearing their vests and those guys they wearing their vests and everything like that everything like that everything like that okay okay I gotta so thank you for

okay okay I gotta so thank you for okay okay I gotta so thank you for joining us on iot Coffee Talk lots of joining us on iot Coffee Talk lots of joining us on iot Coffee Talk lots of fun stuff we talked about today check us fun stuff we talked about today check us fun stuff we talked about today check us out on the YouTubes if you want to see out on the YouTubes if you want to see out on the YouTubes if you want to see our beautiful faces check us out any our beautiful faces check us out any our beautiful faces check us out any also anywhere where you get your also anywhere where you get your also anywhere where you get your podcasts you know we are closing in on a podcasts you know we are closing in on a podcasts you know we are closing in on a big milestone podcast wise I think in big milestone podcast wise I think in big milestone podcast wise I think in the next week we'll have something to the next week we'll have something to the next week we'll have something to share there which is pretty exciting for share there which is pretty exciting for share there which is pretty exciting for us so people might like our vo better us so people might like our vo better us so people might like our vo better than our faces bunch of faces made for than our faces bunch of faces made for than our faces bunch of faces made for radio radio radio here oh my gosh and make sure to support here oh my gosh and make sure to support here oh my gosh and make sure to support elevat our kids go to elevator kids.org elevat our kids go to elevator kids.org elevat our kids go to elevator kids.org you know and support all these kids you know and support all these kids you know and support all these kids bridging digital divide getting bridging digital divide getting bridging digital divide getting computers and internet access to served computers and internet access to served computers and internet access to served under resource families and kids so that under resource families and kids so that under resource families and kids so that they learn too and we are out of here they learn too and we are out of here they learn too and we are out of here adios