Jordan Jonas: Survival, Hunting, Siberia, God, and Winning Alone Season 6 | Lex Fridman Podcast #437

the following is a conversation with the following is a conversation with Jordan Jonas winner of alone season 6 a Jordan Jonas winner of alone season 6 a Jordan Jonas winner of alone season 6 a show where the task is to survive alone show where the task is to survive alone show where the task is to survive alone in the Arctic Wilderness longer than in the Arctic Wilderness longer than in the Arctic Wilderness longer than anyone else he is widely considered to anyone else he is widely considered to anyone else he is widely considered to be one of if not the greatest be one of if not the greatest be one of if not the greatest competitors on that show he has a competitors on that show he has a competitors on that show he has a fascinating life story that took him fascinating life story that took him fascinating life story that took him from a farm in Idaho and hoboing on from a farm in Idaho and hoboing on from a farm in Idaho and hoboing on trains Across America to traveling with trains Across America to traveling with trains Across America to traveling with NAD tribes in NAD tribes in NAD tribes in Siberia all that helped make him into a Siberia all that helped make him into a Siberia all that helped make him into a worldclass Explorer Survivor Hunter worldclass Explorer Survivor Hunter worldclass Explorer Survivor Hunter Wilderness guide and most importantly a Wilderness guide and most importantly a Wilderness guide and most importantly a great human being with a big heart and a great human being with a big heart and a great human being with a big heart and a big smile this was a truly fun and big smile this was a truly fun and big smile this was a truly fun and fascinating fascinating fascinating conversation let me also mention that at conversation let me also mention that at conversation let me also mention that at the end after the episode I'll start the end after the episode I'll start the end after the episode I'll start answering some questions and we'll tried answering some questions and we'll tried answering some questions and we'll tried to articulate my thinking on some top of to articulate my thinking on some top of to articulate my thinking on some top of Mind topics so if that's of interest to Mind topics so if that's of interest to Mind topics so if that's of interest to you keep listening after the episode is you keep listening after the episode is you keep listening after the episode is over this is Alex Ren podcast to support over this is Alex Ren podcast to support over this is Alex Ren podcast to support it please check out our sponsors in the it please check out our sponsors in the it please check out our sponsors in the description and now dear friends here's description and now dear friends here's description and now dear friends here's Jordan Jordan Jordan Jonas you won alone season 6 and I think Jonas you won alone season 6 and I think Jonas you won alone season 6 and I think are still considered to be one of if not are still considered to be one of if not are still considered to be one of if not the most successful Survivor on that the most successful Survivor on that the most successful Survivor on that show uh so let's go back let's look at show uh so let's go back let's look at show uh so let's go back let's look at the big picture can you uh tell me about

the big picture can you uh tell me about the big picture can you uh tell me about the show alone how does it work yeah the show alone how does it work yeah the show alone how does it work yeah it's a show where they take 10 it's a show where they take 10 it's a show where they take 10 individuals and each person gets 10 individuals and each person gets 10 individuals and each person gets 10 items off of a list you know basic items items off of a list you know basic items items off of a list you know basic items would be an axe a saw a frying pan you would be an axe a saw a frying pan you would be an axe a saw a frying pan you know some pretty basic stuff and then know some pretty basic stuff and then know some pretty basic stuff and then they send them all drop them off all in they send them all drop them off all in they send them all drop them off all in the woods with a few cameras and uh so the woods with a few cameras and uh so the woods with a few cameras and uh so the people are actually alone there's the people are actually alone there's the people are actually alone there's not a crew or anything and then you uh not a crew or anything and then you uh not a crew or anything and then you uh basically live there as long as you can basically live there as long as you can basically live there as long as you can you know and so the person that lasts you know and so the person that lasts you know and so the person that lasts the longest you know once the second the longest you know once the second the longest you know once the second place person Taps out they come and get place person Taps out they come and get place person Taps out they come and get you and that and that individual wins so you and that and that individual wins so you and that and that individual wins so it's a it's a pretty legit challenge you it's a it's a pretty legit challenge you it's a it's a pretty legit challenge you know they they drop you off helicopter know they they drop you off helicopter know they they drop you off helicopter flies out and you're not going to get flies out and you're not going to get flies out and you're not going to get your next meal until you make it happen your next meal until you make it happen your next meal until you make it happen so you have to figure out the shelter so you have to figure out the shelter so you have to figure out the shelter you have to figure out the source of you have to figure out the source of you have to figure out the source of food and then it gets colder and colder food and then it gets colder and colder food and then it gets colder and colder cuz I guess they drop you out in a cuz I guess they drop you out in a cuz I guess they drop you out in a moment where it's going into the winter moment where it's going into the winter moment where it's going into the winter yeah they typically do it in temperate yeah they typically do it in temperate yeah they typically do it in temperate colder climates things like that and colder climates things like that and colder climates things like that and they start in you know September October they start in you know September October they start in you know September October so time's ticking when they drop you off so time's ticking when they drop you off so time's ticking when they drop you off and uh yeah the pressure's on you got and uh yeah the pressure's on you got and uh yeah the pressure's on you got it's you know you get overwhelmed with it's you know you get overwhelmed with it's you know you get overwhelmed with all the things you have to do right away all the things you have to do right away all the things you have to do right away like oh man I'm not going to eat again like oh man I'm not going to eat again like oh man I'm not going to eat again until I actually shoot or catch until I actually shoot or catch until I actually shoot or catch something got to build a shelter it's something got to build a shelter it's something got to build a shelter it's pretty overwhelming figure your whole pretty overwhelming figure your whole pretty overwhelming figure your whole location out but it's interesting location out but it's interesting location out but it's interesting because once you're there a little while because once you're there a little while because once you're there a little while you kind of get into a well at least for you kind of get into a well at least for you kind of get into a well at least for me it did there was like a week or maybe

me it did there was like a week or maybe me it did there was like a week or maybe not a week but that I was kind of a not a week but that I was kind of a not a week but that I was kind of a little more annoyed with things you know little more annoyed with things you know little more annoyed with things you know it's like oh my sight sucks sucks and it's like oh my sight sucks sucks and it's like oh my sight sucks sucks and then and then you kind of accept it like then and then you kind of accept it like then and then you kind of accept it like you know what it is what it is no Co no you know what it is what it is no Co no you know what it is what it is no Co no amount of complaining is going to do amount of complaining is going to do amount of complaining is going to do anybody any good so I'm just going to anybody any good so I'm just going to anybody any good so I'm just going to make it happen and so then or you know make it happen and so then or you know make it happen and so then or you know do my best to and then I felt like I got do my best to and then I felt like I got do my best to and then I felt like I got in a Zone and I felt like I was right in a Zone and I felt like I was right in a Zone and I felt like I was right back in kind of Siberia or in that head back in kind of Siberia or in that head back in kind of Siberia or in that head space and I I found it actually really space and I I found it actually really space and I I found it actually really enjoyed it i' had been a little bit out enjoyed it i' had been a little bit out enjoyed it i' had been a little bit out of I guess you call it the game cuz I of I guess you call it the game cuz I of I guess you call it the game cuz I had had uh child and and so when we had had had uh child and and so when we had had had uh child and and so when we had our daughter we came back to the States our daughter we came back to the States our daughter we came back to the States and then a bunch of s things happened and then a bunch of s things happened and then a bunch of s things happened and I just ended up we didn't end up and I just ended up we didn't end up and I just ended up we didn't end up going back to Russia so there' been a going back to Russia so there' been a going back to Russia so there' been a couple years that I was just you know we couple years that I was just you know we couple years that I was just you know we raising the little girl and boy then and raising the little girl and boy then and raising the little girl and boy then and then so you've gotten a little soft so I then so you've gotten a little soft so I then so you've gotten a little soft so I was like did I got a little soft to was like did I got a little soft to was like did I got a little soft to F but then it was fun how like after F but then it was fun how like after F but then it was fun how like after just some days there I was like oh man I just some days there I was like oh man I just some days there I was like oh man I feel like I feel like I'm at home now feel like I feel like I'm at home now feel like I feel like I'm at home now and then it was like you're kind of in and then it was like you're kind of in and then it was like you're kind of in that flow State and it was actually that flow State and it was actually that flow State and it was actually there's a few moments like when you left there's a few moments like when you left there's a few moments like when you left the ladder up or with the moose that you the ladder up or with the moose that you the ladder up or with the moose that you kind of screwed up a little bit oh yeah kind of screwed up a little bit oh yeah kind of screwed up a little bit oh yeah how do you go from that moment of like how do you go from that moment of like how do you go from that moment of like frustration to the moment of acceptance frustration to the moment of acceptance frustration to the moment of acceptance I mean the more you put yourself in life I mean the more you put yourself in life I mean the more you put yourself in life in positions that are kind of outside in positions that are kind of outside in positions that are kind of outside your comfort zone or push your abilities your comfort zone or push your abilities your comfort zone or push your abilities the more often you're going to screw up the more often you're going to screw up the more often you're going to screw up and then yeah the more opportunity you and then yeah the more opportunity you and then yeah the more opportunity you have to learn from that and then to be have to learn from that and then to be have to learn from that and then to be honest it's kind of funny but you almost honest it's kind of funny but you almost honest it's kind of funny but you almost get to a position where

get to a position where get to a position where you you don't feel that uncomfort it's you you don't feel that uncomfort it's you you don't feel that uncomfort it's not unexpected you know you kind of not unexpected you know you kind of not unexpected you know you kind of expect you're going to mess up here and expect you're going to mess up here and expect you're going to mess up here and there you I remember particularly with there you I remember particularly with there you I remember particularly with the um the Moose the first moose I saw I the um the Moose the first moose I saw I the um the Moose the first moose I saw I had a great shot at it but I had a hard had a great shot at it but I had a hard had a great shot at it but I had a hard time judging distance because it was in time judging distance because it was in time judging distance because it was in a mud flat which means it's hard to it's a mud flat which means it's hard to it's a mud flat which means it's hard to it's hard to tell yardage you know some hard to tell yardage you know some hard to tell yardage you know some because you're usually typically going because you're usually typically going because you're usually typically going by trees or markers be like Oh I'm by trees or markers be like Oh I'm by trees or markers be like Oh I'm probably 30 yard away this was a giant probably 30 yard away this was a giant probably 30 yard away this was a giant moose and he was 40 something yards away moose and he was 40 something yards away moose and he was 40 something yards away and I estimated that he was 30 something and I estimated that he was 30 something and I estimated that he was 30 something yards away so I was way off and shot and yards away so I was way off and shot and yards away so I was way off and shot and Dro between his legs and then I realized Dro between his legs and then I realized Dro between his legs and then I realized I had not grabbed my quiver so I only I had not grabbed my quiver so I only I had not grabbed my quiver so I only had one shot and I just watched him turn had one shot and I just watched him turn had one shot and I just watched him turn around and walk off but I was struck around and walk off but I was struck around and walk off but I was struck initially with like I I actually noticed initially with like I I actually noticed initially with like I I actually noticed how unmad I was I was like oh this is how unmad I was I was like oh this is how unmad I was I was like oh this is actually I was like that was awesome actually I was like that was awesome actually I was like that was awesome that was like seeing a dinosaur that was that was like seeing a dinosaur that was that was like seeing a dinosaur that was really cool and then I was like oh what really cool and then I was like oh what really cool and then I was like oh what an idiot how to miss but then I was like an idiot how to miss but then I was like an idiot how to miss but then I was like but it made me that much more determined but it made me that much more determined but it made me that much more determined to make it happen again it was like to make it happen again it was like to make it happen again it was like okay nobody's going to make this happen okay nobody's going to make this happen okay nobody's going to make this happen except myself you can't can't complain except myself you can't can't complain except myself you can't can't complain it wouldn't have done me any good to go it wouldn't have done me any good to go it wouldn't have done me any good to go back and mope about it and so then I was back and mope about it and so then I was back and mope about it and so then I was like I had a thought I was like oh I like I had a thought I was like oh I like I had a thought I was like oh I remember these Nate the native guys remember these Nate the native guys remember these Nate the native guys telling me they used to like build these telling me they used to like build these telling me they used to like build these giant fences and funnel game into giant fences and funnel game into giant fences and funnel game into certain areas and stuff and I was like certain areas and stuff and I was like certain areas and stuff and I was like man that's a lot of calories but I have man that's a lot of calories but I have man that's a lot of calories but I have to make that happen again now so I like to make that happen again now so I like to make that happen again now so I like kind of kind of kind of went out there and tried that and that went out there and tried that and that went out there and tried that and that was kind of a attempt at something too was kind of a attempt at something too was kind of a attempt at something too it could have failed or not worked but

it could have failed or not worked but it could have failed or not worked but sure enough it worked and the sure enough it worked and the sure enough it worked and the opportunity came again the Moose came opportunity came again the Moose came opportunity came again the Moose came wanding along and I was able to get it wanding along and I was able to get it wanding along and I was able to get it but being able to take failure as soon but being able to take failure as soon but being able to take failure as soon as you can the better accept it and then as you can the better accept it and then as you can the better accept it and then learn from it is kind of a muscle you learn from it is kind of a muscle you learn from it is kind of a muscle you have to exercise a little bit well it's have to exercise a little bit well it's have to exercise a little bit well it's interesting cuz in this case the cost of interesting cuz in this case the cost of interesting cuz in this case the cost of failure is like you're not going to be failure is like you're not going to be failure is like you're not going to be able to eat yeah that that was really I able to eat yeah that that was really I able to eat yeah that that was really I mean the the most interesting thing mean the the most interesting thing mean the the most interesting thing about that show was how high the stakes about that show was how high the stakes about that show was how high the stakes felt because it didn't feel you know you felt because it didn't feel you know you felt because it didn't feel you know you didn't tell yourself you're on a show at didn't tell yourself you're on a show at didn't tell yourself you're on a show at least I didn't you just felt like it was least I didn't you just felt like it was least I didn't you just felt like it was you're going to starve to death if you you're going to starve to death if you you're going to starve to death if you don't make this happen and so the stakes don't make this happen and so the stakes don't make this happen and so the stakes felt so high and and um it was an felt so high and and um it was an felt so high and and um it was an interesting thing to tap into because I interesting thing to tap into because I interesting thing to tap into because I mean so many of our ancestors probably mean so many of our ancestors probably mean so many of our ancestors probably all just dealt with that on a regular all just dealt with that on a regular all just dealt with that on a regular basis but it's something that we all all basis but it's something that we all all basis but it's something that we all all the modern amenities and such and food the modern amenities and such and food the modern amenities and such and food security that we don't deal with and uh security that we don't deal with and uh security that we don't deal with and uh it was interesting to tap into what a it was interesting to tap into what a it was interesting to tap into what a kind of a peak mental experience that is kind of a peak mental experience that is kind of a peak mental experience that is when you really really need something to when you really really need something to when you really really need something to survive and then it happens it's you survive and then it happens it's you survive and then it happens it's you can't imagine I mean that's what our all can't imagine I mean that's what our all can't imagine I mean that's what our all our dopamine and receptors are tuned for our dopamine and receptors are tuned for our dopamine and receptors are tuned for that experience in particular so it was that experience in particular so it was that experience in particular so it was yeah it was pretty awesome but the yeah it was pretty awesome but the yeah it was pretty awesome but the pressure felt very on like I I always pressure felt very on like I I always pressure felt very on like I I always felt the pressure of of providing or felt the pressure of of providing or felt the pressure of of providing or starving and then there's a situation starving and then there's a situation starving and then there's a situation when you left the ladder up right and when you left the ladder up right and when you left the ladder up right and you needed fat and uh what is it the

you needed fat and uh what is it the you needed fat and uh what is it the Wolverine ate some of the fat right yeah Wolverine ate some of the fat right yeah Wolverine ate some of the fat right yeah well it was when I got the Moose I was well it was when I got the Moose I was well it was when I got the Moose I was so happy the most Joy I could almost so happy the most Joy I could almost so happy the most Joy I could almost experience Max maxed out but I didn't experience Max maxed out but I didn't experience Max maxed out but I didn't think I uh I didn't think I won at that think I uh I didn't think I won at that think I uh I didn't think I won at that point I never thought like oh that's my point I never thought like oh that's my point I never thought like oh that's my ticket to Victory I thought holy crap ticket to Victory I thought holy crap ticket to Victory I thought holy crap it's going to be me against somebody it's going to be me against somebody it's going to be me against somebody else that gets a moose now and we're else that gets a moose now and we're else that gets a moose now and we're going to be here 6 eight months who going to be here 6 eight months who going to be here 6 eight months who knows long and so I can't I can't be knows long and so I can't I can't be knows long and so I can't I can't be here 6 eight months and still lose so here 6 eight months and still lose so here 6 eight months and still lose so I've got to like I've got to outproduce I've got to like I've got to outproduce I've got to like I've got to outproduce somebody else with a moose so I had all somebody else with a moose so I had all somebody else with a moose so I had all that in my head and I already was of that in my head and I already was of that in my head and I already was of course pretty thin and and so I was just course pretty thin and and so I was just course pretty thin and and so I was just like man somebody else gets a moose I'm like man somebody else gets a moose I'm like man somebody else gets a moose I'm still going to be behind and so still going to be behind and so still going to be behind and so everything felt like precious to me and everything felt like precious to me and everything felt like precious to me and I had found a plastic jug and I put a I had found a plastic jug and I put a I had found a plastic jug and I put a whole bunch of the moose's fat in this whole bunch of the moose's fat in this whole bunch of the moose's fat in this plastic jug and set it up on a little plastic jug and set it up on a little plastic jug and set it up on a little shelf I thought you know what if a bear shelf I thought you know what if a bear shelf I thought you know what if a bear comes I'll probably hear it and I'll comes I'll probably hear it and I'll comes I'll probably hear it and I'll come out and be able to shoot it so I come out and be able to shoot it so I come out and be able to shoot it so I went to sleep and I woke up the next went to sleep and I woke up the next went to sleep and I woke up the next morning and I went out and I was like morning and I went out and I was like morning and I went out and I was like where's that jug started and then I was where's that jug started and then I was where's that jug started and then I was like wait a second what are all these like wait a second what are all these like wait a second what are all these prints and I started looking around and prints and I started looking around and prints and I started looking around and it took a second to dawn on me because I it took a second to dawn on me because I it took a second to dawn on me because I haven't interacted with wol Wolverines haven't interacted with wol Wolverines haven't interacted with wol Wolverines very often in life and uh I was like oh very often in life and uh I was like oh very often in life and uh I was like oh those are Wolverine tracks and he was those are Wolverine tracks and he was those are Wolverine tracks and he was just so much sneakier than bear would just so much sneakier than bear would just so much sneakier than bear would have been or something so it kind of have been or something so it kind of have been or something so it kind of surprised me and he took off with that surprised me and he took off with that surprised me and he took off with that jug of fat and so then I went from jug of fat and so then I went from jug of fat and so then I went from feeling pretty good about myself to like feeling pretty good about myself to like feeling pretty good about myself to like now I'm losing again against whoever you now I'm losing again against whoever you now I'm losing again against whoever you know this other person is with a moose know this other person is with a moose know this other person is with a moose so I I again kind of the pressure came so I I again kind of the pressure came so I I again kind of the pressure came back to Oh no I got to produce again you

back to Oh no I got to produce again you back to Oh no I got to produce again you know it wasn't the end of the world and know it wasn't the end of the world and know it wasn't the end of the world and I think they may have exaggerated a I think they may have exaggerated a I think they may have exaggerated a little bit how little fat I had left you little bit how little fat I had left you little bit how little fat I had left you know I still had there a moose has a lot know I still had there a moose has a lot know I still had there a moose has a lot of fat but it did make me feel like I of fat but it did make me feel like I of fat but it did make me feel like I was at a disadvantage again and so yeah was at a disadvantage again and so yeah was at a disadvantage again and so yeah that was pretty that was pretty intense that was pretty that was pretty intense that was pretty that was pretty intense cuz those Wolverines they're bold little cuz those Wolverines they're bold little cuz those Wolverines they're bold little animals and they and he was basically animals and they and he was basically animals and they and he was basically saying No this is is my saying No this is is my saying No this is is my moose and I had to counter his claims moose and I had to counter his claims moose and I had to counter his claims well they yeah they're really really well they yeah they're really really well they yeah they're really really smart they figure out a way to get to smart they figure out a way to get to smart they figure out a way to get to places really effectively Wolverines are places really effectively Wolverines are places really effectively Wolverines are like fascinating in that way uh so let's like fascinating in that way uh so let's like fascinating in that way uh so let's go to that happy moment the Moose yeah go to that happy moment the Moose yeah go to that happy moment the Moose yeah you are the first and one of the only you are the first and one of the only you are the first and one of the only contestants to have ever killed a moose contestants to have ever killed a moose contestants to have ever killed a moose on the show a big game animal with a bow on the show a big game animal with a bow on the show a big game animal with a bow and arrow so this is date 20 so can you and arrow so this is date 20 so can you and arrow so this is date 20 so can you take me through the kill yeah so I had take me through the kill yeah so I had take me through the kill yeah so I had missed one and I just decided I'm not missed one and I just decided I'm not missed one and I just decided I'm not here to starve I'm here to like try to here to starve I'm here to like try to here to starve I'm here to like try to become sustainable so I was like I don't become sustainable so I was like I don't become sustainable so I was like I don't care if it's a risk I'm going to build care if it's a risk I'm going to build care if it's a risk I'm going to build that fence I built it I would just pick that fence I built it I would just pick that fence I built it I would just pick berries and call Moose every you know berries and call Moose every you know berries and call Moose every you know every day and it was actually really every day and it was actually really every day and it was actually really Pleasant just sit in a berry patch and Pleasant just sit in a berry patch and Pleasant just sit in a berry patch and call call call Moose but then I also had this whole Moose but then I also had this whole Moose but then I also had this whole trap and snare lines set out everywhere trap and snare lines set out everywhere trap and snare lines set out everywhere so I had all these I was getting rabbits so I had all these I was getting rabbits so I had all these I was getting rabbits um but I and I was actually taking a um but I and I was actually taking a um but I and I was actually taking a rabbit out of a snare when I heard a rabbit out of a snare when I heard a rabbit out of a snare when I heard a Clank cuz I had set up kind of an alarm Clank cuz I had set up kind of an alarm Clank cuz I had set up kind of an alarm system with with string and cans so it's

system with with string and cans so it's system with with string and cans so it's a brilliant idea way yeah it's another a brilliant idea way yeah it's another a brilliant idea way yeah it's another thing that could have not worked but it thing that could have not worked but it thing that could have not worked but it worked and it came through and I was worked and it came through and I was worked and it came through and I was like oh I heard the cans clink and I was like oh I heard the cans clink and I was like oh I heard the cans clink and I was like no way and so I ran over I didn't like no way and so I ran over I didn't like no way and so I ran over I didn't know what it was exactly but something know what it was exactly but something know what it was exactly but something was coming along the fence and I ran was coming along the fence and I ran was coming along the fence and I ran over and jumped in the bush next to the over and jumped in the bush next to the over and jumped in the bush next to the funnel exit on the fence and sure enough funnel exit on the fence and sure enough funnel exit on the fence and sure enough the Big Moose came running up and you the Big Moose came running up and you the Big Moose came running up and you know your gets pounding like crazy know your gets pounding like crazy know your gets pounding like crazy you're like no way no way I probably you're like no way no way I probably you're like no way no way I probably could have waited a little longer and could have waited a little longer and could have waited a little longer and had a perfect broadside shot but I took had a perfect broadside shot but I took had a perfect broadside shot but I took the shot when he was uh he was he was the shot when he was uh he was he was the shot when he was uh he was he was pretty close like 24 yards but he was pretty close like 24 yards but he was pretty close like 24 yards but he was quartering towards me which makes it a quartering towards me which makes it a quartering towards me which makes it a little harder to make a a perfect Kill little harder to make a a perfect Kill little harder to make a a perfect Kill Shot you know and so I hit it and it Shot you know and so I hit it and it Shot you know and so I hit it and it took off running and I just thought you took off running and I just thought you took off running and I just thought you know I was super excited I couldn't know I was super excited I couldn't know I was super excited I couldn't believe I actually you know I was like believe I actually you know I was like believe I actually you know I was like oh my gosh I got the Boost I think that oh my gosh I got the Boost I think that oh my gosh I got the Boost I think that was a really good shot you get all was a really good shot you get all was a really good shot you get all excited but then it plays back in your excited but then it plays back in your excited but then it plays back in your head and particularly when you're first head and particularly when you're first head and particularly when you're first learning to hunt there's always an learning to hunt there's always an learning to hunt there's always an animal that gets away you know and you animal that gets away you know and you animal that gets away you know and you like make a bad decision or not a great like make a bad decision or not a great like make a bad decision or not a great shot or something and it's just it's shot or something and it's just it's shot or something and it's just it's just part of it and so of course you're just part of it and so of course you're just part of it and so of course you're like I'm not going to be satisfied until like I'm not going to be satisfied until like I'm not going to be satisfied until I see this thing so I followed the blood I see this thing so I followed the blood I see this thing so I followed the blood trail a little while and I saw some trail a little while and I saw some trail a little while and I saw some bubbly blood which meant it was hitting bubbly blood which meant it was hitting bubbly blood which meant it was hitting the lungs which meant it's not going to the lungs which meant it's not going to the lungs which meant it's not going to live you know you'll get it and so as live you know you'll get it and so as live you know you'll get it and so as long as you don't mess it up and so I long as you don't mess it up and so I long as you don't mess it up and so I went back to my shelter and waited an went back to my shelter and waited an went back to my shelter and waited an hour I skinned to that rabbit that had

hour I skinned to that rabbit that had hour I skinned to that rabbit that had caught and then super nervous the caught and then super nervous the caught and then super nervous the slowest hour I slowest hour I slowest hour I ever and then I followed it along ended ever and then I followed it along ended ever and then I followed it along ended up losing the blood trail I was like no up losing the blood trail I was like no up losing the blood trail I was like no no and then I was like well if there's no and then I was like well if there's no and then I was like well if there's no blood I'm just going to follow the no blood I'm just going to follow the no blood I'm just going to follow the path that I would go if I was a moose path that I would go if I was a moose path that I would go if I was a moose you know like the least resistance you know like the least resistance you know like the least resistance through the woods so I followed kind of through the woods so I followed kind of through the woods so I followed kind of along the shore there and enough I saw along the shore there and enough I saw along the shore there and enough I saw him up there I was like you know I was him up there I was like you know I was him up there I was like you know I was so excited lay down but uh but he hadn't so excited lay down but uh but he hadn't so excited lay down but uh but he hadn't died yet and so he just sat there and died yet and so he just sat there and died yet and so he just sat there and and he would stand up and I would just and he would stand up and I would just and he would stand up and I would just like no no no no and he would lay back like no no no no and he would lay back like no no no no and he would lay back down like yes and then he would stand up down like yes and then he would stand up down like yes and then he would stand up no and it was like that for you know a no and it was like that for you know a no and it was like that for you know a couple hours that took him and then couple hours that took him and then couple hours that took him and then finally at one point I you know and a finally at one point I you know and a finally at one point I you know and a lot of people have asked like why lot of people have asked like why lot of people have asked like why wouldn't you go finish it off um so when wouldn't you go finish it off um so when wouldn't you go finish it off um so when an animal like that gets hit it had no an animal like that gets hit it had no an animal like that gets hit it had no idea what hit it you know just all of a idea what hit it you know just all of a idea what hit it you know just all of a sudden it's like ah something got it and sudden it's like ah something got it and sudden it's like ah something got it and it ran off and it lays down and it's it ran off and it lays down and it's it ran off and it lays down and it's actually fairly calm and it doesn't actually fairly calm and it doesn't actually fairly calm and it doesn't really know what's going on and if you really know what's going on and if you really know what's going on and if you can leave it in that state it'll kind of can leave it in that state it'll kind of can leave it in that state it'll kind of just bleed out and as as peacefully as just bleed out and as as peacefully as just bleed out and as as peacefully as possible um if you go chase after it possible um if you go chase after it possible um if you go chase after it that's when you lose an animal because that's when you lose an animal because that's when you lose an animal because as soon as it knows it's being hunted as soon as it knows it's being hunted as soon as it knows it's being hunted you know it gets panicked adrenaline and you know it gets panicked adrenaline and you know it gets panicked adrenaline and it can just run and run and run and it can just run and run and run and it can just run and run and run and you'll never find it so I didn't want it you'll never find it so I didn't want it you'll never find it so I didn't want it to see me I knew if I tried to get it to see me I knew if I tried to get it to see me I knew if I tried to get it with another Arrow there's a chance I with another Arrow there's a chance I with another Arrow there's a chance I could have finished it off but there's could have finished it off but there's could have finished it off but there's also a not bad chance that it would see also a not bad chance that it would see also a not bad chance that it would see me take off or even attack cuz moose can me take off or even attack cuz moose can me take off or even attack cuz moose can be a little dangerous and so uh I just

be a little dangerous and so uh I just be a little dangerous and so uh I just chose to wait it out and at one point it chose to wait it out and at one point it chose to wait it out and at one point it stood up and fell over and I could tell stood up and fell over and I could tell stood up and fell over and I could tell it had died and walked over like you it had died and walked over like you it had died and walked over like you actually touch it and you're just like actually touch it and you're just like actually touch it and you're just like who no way like that whole burden of who no way like that whole burden of who no way like that whole burden of weeks of you're gonna starve you're weeks of you're gonna starve you're weeks of you're gonna starve you're gonna starve and it got rid of that gonna starve and it got rid of that gonna starve and it got rid of that demon to be honest it's one of the demon to be honest it's one of the demon to be honest it's one of the happiest moments of my life it's really happiest moments of my life it's really happiest moments of my life it's really hard to replicate that Joy because it it hard to replicate that Joy because it it hard to replicate that Joy because it it was just so so real you're so directly was just so so real you're so directly was just so so real you're so directly connected to your needs it's all so connected to your needs it's all so connected to your needs it's all so simple you know it was it was a peak simple you know it was it was a peak simple you know it was it was a peak experience for sure and will you worried experience for sure and will you worried experience for sure and will you worried that it would take many more hours and that it would take many more hours and that it would take many more hours and it would take it into the night yeah I it would take it into the night yeah I it would take it into the night yeah I was I mean until you actually have your was I mean until you actually have your was I mean until you actually have your hands on it I was worried the whole time hands on it I was worried the whole time hands on it I was worried the whole time it's a pretty nerve-wracking period it's a pretty nerve-wracking period it's a pretty nerve-wracking period there between when you get it and when there between when you get it and when there between when you get it and when you actually recover the animal get your you actually recover the animal get your you actually recover the animal get your hands on it so it took longer than I hands on it so it took longer than I hands on it so it took longer than I wanted but I finally got it can you wanted but I finally got it can you wanted but I finally got it can you actually speak to the the kill shot actually speak to the the kill shot actually speak to the the kill shot itself just for people who don't hunt itself just for people who don't hunt itself just for people who don't hunt yeah like what it takes to stay calm to yeah like what it takes to stay calm to yeah like what it takes to stay calm to to to not freak out too much to like to to not freak out too much to like to to not freak out too much to like wait but not wa too long yeah yeah I wait but not wa too long yeah yeah I wait but not wa too long yeah yeah I mean another thing about hunting is that mean another thing about hunting is that mean another thing about hunting is that for every animal you get you probably for every animal you get you probably for every animal you get you probably don't get you know nine or 10 that that don't get you know nine or 10 that that don't get you know nine or 10 that that just turned the wrong way when you were just turned the wrong way when you were just turned the wrong way when you were drawn back or went way behind a tree or drawn back or went way behind a tree or drawn back or went way behind a tree or you never had a clean shot or whatever you never had a clean shot or whatever you never had a clean shot or whatever it is and so um every time you can see a it is and so um every time you can see a it is and so um every time you can see a moment coming you know your heart really moment coming you know your heart really moment coming you know your heart really starts beating and you have to like starts beating and you have to like starts beating and you have to like breathe through it I can almost you know

breathe through it I can almost you know breathe through it I can almost you know you almost feel the nervousness of it you almost feel the nervousness of it you almost feel the nervousness of it and then uh and then you just try to and then uh and then you just try to and then uh and then you just try to stay calm you know like whatever you do stay calm you know like whatever you do stay calm you know like whatever you do just try to stay calm wait for it to just try to stay calm wait for it to just try to stay calm wait for it to come up drop back you you've practice come up drop back you you've practice come up drop back you you've practice shooting a lot so you have like kind of shooting a lot so you have like kind of shooting a lot so you have like kind of a technique like I'm going to go back a technique like I'm going to go back a technique like I'm going to go back touch my face draw my elbow tight and touch my face draw my elbow tight and touch my face draw my elbow tight and then the arrow is going to let loose a then the arrow is going to let loose a then the arrow is going to let loose a muscle memory most it's kind of muscle muscle memory most it's kind of muscle muscle memory most it's kind of muscle memory you have a little trigger like memory you have a little trigger like memory you have a little trigger like draw That Elbow tight and then and then draw That Elbow tight and then and then draw That Elbow tight and then and then uh then it happens and then you just uh then it happens and then you just uh then it happens and then you just watch the Arrow and see where it goes watch the Arrow and see where it goes watch the Arrow and see where it goes now with the animal you know you try to now with the animal you know you try to now with the animal you know you try to do it ethically that is like make as do it ethically that is like make as do it ethically that is like make as good of a shot as you can make sure it good of a shot as you can make sure it good of a shot as you can make sure it is either hit in the heart or both lungs is either hit in the heart or both lungs is either hit in the heart or both lungs and when that happens it's a pretty and when that happens it's a pretty and when that happens it's a pretty quick death which is death is a part of quick death which is death is a part of quick death which is death is a part of life and but honestly for a wild animal life and but honestly for a wild animal life and but honestly for a wild animal that's probably the best way to go they that's probably the best way to go they that's probably the best way to go they could they could have um now when a could they could have um now when a could they could have um now when a animal's kind of walking towards you if animal's kind of walking towards you if animal's kind of walking towards you if it's walking towards you but not it's walking towards you but not it's walking towards you but not directly towards you that's what you directly towards you that's what you directly towards you that's what you call quartering towards you you can call quartering towards you you can call quartering towards you you can picture it's actually pretty difficult picture it's actually pretty difficult picture it's actually pretty difficult to hit both lungs because the shoulder to hit both lungs because the shoulder to hit both lungs because the shoulder blade and all that bone is in the way so blade and all that bone is in the way so blade and all that bone is in the way so you want to so you have to make a you want to so you have to make a you want to so you have to make a perfect shot to get them both and to be perfect shot to get them both and to be perfect shot to get them both and to be honest when I took my shot I was a honest when I took my shot I was a honest when I took my shot I was a couple inches or a few inches right and couple inches or a few inches right and couple inches or a few inches right and so it went went through through the so it went went through through the so it went went through through the first lung and then it sunk the arrow first lung and then it sunk the arrow first lung and then it sunk the arrow all the way into the moose and but it all the way into the moose and but it all the way into the moose and but it didn't it allowed that second lung to didn't it allowed that second lung to didn't it allowed that second lung to stay breathing which which meant the stay breathing which which meant the stay breathing which which meant the Moose stayed alive longer what's your Moose stayed alive longer what's your Moose stayed alive longer what's your relationship with the animal in a

relationship with the animal in a relationship with the animal in a situation like that you said death is a situation like that you said death is a situation like that you said death is a part of yeah that's an interesting part of yeah that's an interesting part of yeah that's an interesting thought because no matter what your thought because no matter what your thought because no matter what your relationship relationship relationship to however you choose to go through life to however you choose to go through life to however you choose to go through life whether you know whatever you eat whether you know whatever you eat whether you know whatever you eat whatever you do whatever you do whatever you do um death is a part of life you know like um death is a part of life you know like um death is a part of life you know like every animal that's out there is living every animal that's out there is living every animal that's out there is living off of a dead even plants you know it's off of a dead even plants you know it's off of a dead even plants you know it's all it's all we're all part of this all it's all we're all part of this all it's all we're all part of this ecosystem I think it's really easy in a ecosystem I think it's really easy in a ecosystem I think it's really easy in a particularly in an urban environment but particularly in an urban environment but particularly in an urban environment but anywhere to think that we're separate anywhere to think that we're separate anywhere to think that we're separate from the ecosystem but we are very much from the ecosystem but we are very much from the ecosystem but we are very much a part of it um whether it be you know a part of it um whether it be you know a part of it um whether it be you know farming requires you know all this farming requires you know all this farming requires you know all this habitat to be turned into growing habitat to be turned into growing habitat to be turned into growing soybeans and and when you get the plows soybeans and and when you get the plows soybeans and and when you get the plows and the combines you know you're losing and the combines you know you're losing and the combines you know you're losing all kinds of different animals and all all kinds of different animals and all all kinds of different animals and all kind of potential kind of potential kind of potential habitat this so it's not costree and so habitat this so it's not costree and so habitat this so it's not costree and so when you realize that then you want to when you realize that then you want to when you realize that then you want to produce the food and the things you produce the food and the things you produce the food and the things you need uh in an ethical manner so I uh so need uh in an ethical manner so I uh so need uh in an ethical manner so I uh so for me for me for me hunting plays a really major role in hunting plays a really major role in hunting plays a really major role in that like I literally know how many that like I literally know how many that like I literally know how many animals a year it takes to feed my animals a year it takes to feed my animals a year it takes to feed my family and myself I actually know the family and myself I actually know the family and myself I actually know the exact number and it's like and I know exact number and it's like and I know exact number and it's like and I know what the cost of that is and I'm aware what the cost of that is and I'm aware what the cost of that is and I'm aware of it because I'm out in the woods and I of it because I'm out in the woods and I of it because I'm out in the woods and I see see these like beautiful elk and see see these like beautiful elk and see see these like beautiful elk and moose and I I really love the species moose and I I really love the species moose and I I really love the species love the animals but there is a fact love the animals but there is a fact love the animals but there is a fact that one of those individuals you know that one of those individuals you know that one of those individuals you know is going to have to feed me and and

is going to have to feed me and and is going to have to feed me and and particularly like on aan it was very particularly like on aan it was very particularly like on aan it was very heightened that experience so I shot heightened that experience so I shot heightened that experience so I shot that one animal and I was so so thankful that one animal and I was so so thankful that one animal and I was so so thankful you know that I wanted to give that big you know that I wanted to give that big you know that I wanted to give that big guy a hug and like hey sorry it was you guy a hug and like hey sorry it was you guy a hug and like hey sorry it was you but yeah had to be somebody yeah there's but yeah had to be somebody yeah there's but yeah had to be somebody yeah there's that there's that picture you just that there's that picture you just that there's that picture you just almost hugging it right totally and you almost hugging it right totally and you almost hugging it right totally and you you can also think about the the you can also think about the the you can also think about the the calories the the protein the fat all of calories the the protein the fat all of calories the the protein the fat all of that that that comes from that that will that that that comes from that that will that that that comes from that that will feed you right you're so grateful for it feed you right you're so grateful for it feed you right you're so grateful for it like the the Gratitude is is like you like the the Gratitude is is like you like the the Gratitude is is like you know definitely there what about the bow know definitely there what about the bow know definitely there what about the bow and arrow perspective well when you hunt and arrow perspective well when you hunt and arrow perspective well when you hunt with a bow you just get so much more up with a bow you just get so much more up with a bow you just get so much more up close to the animals you know you you close to the animals you know you you close to the animals you know you you can't just get it from 600 yards away can't just get it from 600 yards away can't just get it from 600 yards away you actually have to sneak in within 30 you actually have to sneak in within 30 you actually have to sneak in within 30 or so yards and uh when you do that the or so yards and uh when you do that the or so yards and uh when you do that the experiences you have are just they're experiences you have are just they're experiences you have are just they're way more dragged out so you know your way more dragged out so you know your way more dragged out so you know your heart's beating longer you have to heart's beating longer you have to heart's beating longer you have to control your nerves longer more often control your nerves longer more often control your nerves longer more often than not it doesn't go your way and the than not it doesn't go your way and the than not it doesn't go your way and the thing gets away and you know you've been thing gets away and you know you've been thing gets away and you know you've been hiking around in the woods for a week hiking around in the woods for a week hiking around in the woods for a week and then your opportunity arises and and then your opportunity arises and and then your opportunity arises and floats floats floats away like no and then but at the same away like no and then but at the same away like no and then but at the same time that's the only time uh when you time that's the only time uh when you time that's the only time uh when you like really have those interactions with like really have those interactions with like really have those interactions with the animals where you got this bugling the animals where you got this bugling the animals where you got this bugling bull you know like tearing at the trees bull you know like tearing at the trees bull you know like tearing at the trees right in front of you and other cow elk right in front of you and other cow elk right in front of you and other cow elk and animals running around you know you and animals running around you know you and animals running around you know you get you get you end up get you get you end up get you get you end up having really uh I don't know D say

having really uh I don't know D say having really uh I don't know D say intimate experiences with the animal intimate experiences with the animal intimate experiences with the animal just because because you're in it you're just because because you're in it you're just because because you're in it you're kind of in its world you're playing its kind of in its world you're playing its kind of in its world you're playing its game it has its senses to defend itself game it has its senses to defend itself game it has its senses to defend itself and you have your wit to try to to get and you have your wit to try to to get and you have your wit to try to to get over those and it really becomes over those and it really becomes over those and it really becomes you know it's not easy they're not it you know it's not easy they're not it you know it's not easy they're not it becomes kind of that chess game and becomes kind of that chess game and becomes kind of that chess game and those prey animals are always tuned in those prey animals are always tuned in those prey animals are always tuned in it's you know slightest stick they it's you know slightest stick they it's you know slightest stick they looking for wolves or for whatever it is looking for wolves or for whatever it is looking for wolves or for whatever it is so um there's something really pure and so um there's something really pure and so um there's something really pure and fun about it you know I will say there fun about it you know I will say there fun about it you know I will say there is a aspect that is fun there's no is a aspect that is fun there's no is a aspect that is fun there's no denying it it's like how denying it it's like how denying it it's like how we're you know people have been hunting we're you know people have been hunting we're you know people have been hunting forever and and uh I think it speaks to forever and and uh I think it speaks to forever and and uh I think it speaks to that part of us somehow but that part of us somehow but that part of us somehow but and I think bow hunting is probably the and I think bow hunting is probably the and I think bow hunting is probably the most pure form of it and that you get most pure form of it and that you get most pure form of it and that you get those experiences more often than with a those experiences more often than with a those experiences more often than with a rifle so I I don't know I I enjoy it a rifle so I I don't know I I enjoy it a rifle so I I don't know I I enjoy it a lot and and the way they do regulations lot and and the way they do regulations lot and and the way they do regulations and such um kind of the best times to and such um kind of the best times to and such um kind of the best times to hunt are usually allowed for bow because hunt are usually allowed for bow because hunt are usually allowed for bow because they're trying to you know keep it fair they're trying to you know keep it fair they're trying to you know keep it fair for the animal and such so so the for the animal and such so so the for the animal and such so so the distance the close distance makes you distance the close distance makes you distance the close distance makes you more in touch with sort of uh the the more in touch with sort of uh the the more in touch with sort of uh the the Natural Way of the predator and prey and Natural Way of the predator and prey and Natural Way of the predator and prey and you're just one you're one of the you're just one you're one of the you're just one you're one of the Predators mhm where you have to be Predators mhm where you have to be Predators mhm where you have to be clever you have to be quiet you have to clever you have to be quiet you have to clever you have to be quiet you have to be calm you have to all of that Y and be calm you have to all of that Y and be calm you have to all of that Y and the full Challenge and the luck involved

the full Challenge and the luck involved the full Challenge and the luck involved in catching the same thing as the in catching the same thing as the in catching the same thing as the Predators do exactly how many times do Predators do exactly how many times do Predators do exactly how many times do they snap a stick and watch them run off they snap a stick and watch them run off they snap a stick and watch them run off and like darn my stock was failed or you and like darn my stock was failed or you and like darn my stock was failed or you know so yeah you're just in that in that know so yeah you're just in that in that know so yeah you're just in that in that ecosystem how'd you learn to to shoot ecosystem how'd you learn to to shoot ecosystem how'd you learn to to shoot the bow yeah I was I didn't grow up the bow yeah I was I didn't grow up the bow yeah I was I didn't grow up hunting I grew up in a area that a lot hunting I grew up in a area that a lot hunting I grew up in a area that a lot of people hunted but my dad wasn't of people hunted but my dad wasn't of people hunted but my dad wasn't really into it and so I never got into really into it and so I never got into really into it and so I never got into it until until I lived in Russia with it until until I lived in Russia with it until until I lived in Russia with the natives it was just such a part of the natives it was just such a part of the natives it was just such a part of everything we did and a part of our life everything we did and a part of our life everything we did and a part of our life that when I came back I got a bow and I that when I came back I got a bow and I that when I came back I got a bow and I started doing archery in Virginia they started doing archery in Virginia they started doing archery in Virginia they had it was a pretty easy way to hunt cuz had it was a pretty easy way to hunt cuz had it was a pretty easy way to hunt cuz the deer were overpopulated and you the deer were overpopulated and you the deer were overpopulated and you could get these Urban Archer permits so could get these Urban Archer permits so could get these Urban Archer permits so You' go out and you know every couple You' go out and you know every couple You' go out and you know every couple days you'd have an opportunity to shoot days you'd have an opportunity to shoot days you'd have an opportunity to shoot a a deer that they needed population a a deer that they needed population a a deer that they needed population control and so there were a lot of them control and so there were a lot of them control and so there were a lot of them and it gave you a lot of opportunities and it gave you a lot of opportunities and it gave you a lot of opportunities to learn quickly so that's what got me to learn quickly so that's what got me to learn quickly so that's what got me into it and then I found I really into it and then I found I really into it and then I found I really enjoyed it do you practice with the with enjoyed it do you practice with the with enjoyed it do you practice with the with the Target also or just practice out oh the Target also or just practice out oh the Target also or just practice out oh no I would definitely practice with the no I would definitely practice with the no I would definitely practice with the target a lot you want to again you kind target a lot you want to again you kind target a lot you want to again you kind of have an obligation to do your best of have an obligation to do your best of have an obligation to do your best cuz you don't want to be flinging arrows cuz you don't want to be flinging arrows cuz you don't want to be flinging arrows into like the leg of an animal and it's into like the leg of an animal and it's into like the leg of an animal and it's a cool way h hly to provide quality meat a cool way h hly to provide quality meat a cool way h hly to provide quality meat for the family you know it's all raised for the family you know it's all raised for the family you know it's all raised naturally and wild and free until you naturally and wild and free until you naturally and wild and free until you bring it home into the freezer so so if bring it home into the freezer so so if bring it home into the freezer so so if we step back uh what are the 10 items we step back uh what are the 10 items we step back uh what are the 10 items you brought and what's actually the you brought and what's actually the you brought and what's actually the challenge of figuring out which items to challenge of figuring out which items to challenge of figuring out which items to bring yeah the challenge is that you bring yeah the challenge is that you bring yeah the challenge is that you don't exactly know what your sight

don't exactly know what your sight don't exactly know what your sight opportunities are going to be so you opportunities are going to be so you opportunities are going to be so you don't really know should I bring a don't really know should I bring a don't really know should I bring a fishing net am I going to even have a fishing net am I going to even have a fishing net am I going to even have a spot to net or not and things like that spot to net or not and things like that spot to net or not and things like that I brought a axe a saw um Leatherman Wave I brought a axe a saw um Leatherman Wave I brought a axe a saw um Leatherman Wave uh Pharaoh Rod is like a Mak Sparks to uh Pharaoh Rod is like a Mak Sparks to uh Pharaoh Rod is like a Mak Sparks to start a fire a frying pan a sleeping start a fire a frying pan a sleeping start a fire a frying pan a sleeping bag a fishing kit a bow and arrow bag a fishing kit a bow and arrow bag a fishing kit a bow and arrow trapping wire and trapping wire and trapping wire and paracord and so those are my 10 items is paracord and so those are my 10 items is paracord and so those are my 10 items is any uh any regrets any no major regrets any uh any regrets any no major regrets any uh any regrets any no major regrets I I took I took the saw kind of I I I took I took the saw kind of I I I took I took the saw kind of I thought it would be more of a Gallery thought it would be more of a Gallery thought it would be more of a Gallery saver then I I didn't really need it I saver then I I didn't really need it I saver then I I didn't really need it I in hindsight if I was doing you know in hindsight if I was doing you know in hindsight if I was doing you know season seven instead of six and got to season seven instead of six and got to season seven instead of six and got to watch I would have taken the the net cuz watch I would have taken the the net cuz watch I would have taken the the net cuz I I just planned to make a net but I I I just planned to make a net but I I I just planned to make a net but I would have rather just had two Nets would have rather just had two Nets would have rather just had two Nets brought one and left the saw because in brought one and left the saw because in brought one and left the saw because in the Northern woods in particular every the Northern woods in particular every the Northern woods in particular every tree is you know the size of your arm or tree is you know the size of your arm or tree is you know the size of your arm or leg you can chop it down with an ax and leg you can chop it down with an ax and leg you can chop it down with an ax and a couple swings yeah yeah you don't a couple swings yeah yeah you don't a couple swings yeah yeah you don't really need the saw um and so it was really need the saw um and so it was really need the saw um and so it was handy at times and useful but I think it handy at times and useful but I think it handy at times and useful but I think it was my was my was my if I had to do nine items I would have if I had to do nine items I would have if I had to do nine items I would have been just fine without the saw so two been just fine without the saw so two been just fine without the saw so two nests would just expand your uh food nests would just expand your uh food nests would just expand your uh food Gathering Gathering Gathering potential and then the in terms of potential and then the in terms of potential and then the in terms of trapping you were okay with just the trapping you were okay with just the trapping you were okay with just the little you brought the snare wire was little you brought the snare wire was little you brought the snare wire was good um I ran some you know I put out I

good um I ran some you know I put out I good um I ran some you know I put out I used all my snare wire I ran trap line used all my snare wire I ran trap line used all my snare wire I ran trap line which is just a series of traps through which is just a series of traps through which is just a series of traps through the woods and brush every place you see the woods and brush every place you see the woods and brush every place you see sign put a snare put a little Mark on sign put a snare put a little Mark on sign put a snare put a little Mark on the tree so I knew where that snare was the tree so I knew where that snare was the tree so I knew where that snare was and just make these paths through the and just make these paths through the and just make these paths through the woods and I put out you know I don't woods and I put out you know I don't woods and I put out you know I don't know how many 150 200 snares so every know how many 150 200 snares so every know how many 150 200 snares so every day I'd get a rabbit or two out of them day I'd get a rabbit or two out of them day I'd get a rabbit or two out of them and then so I had a lot of rabbits but and then so I had a lot of rabbits but and then so I had a lot of rabbits but uh once I got the Moose I actually took uh once I got the Moose I actually took uh once I got the Moose I actually took all those snares down because I didn't all those snares down because I didn't all those snares down because I didn't want to catch anything needlessly and oh want to catch anything needlessly and oh want to catch anything needlessly and oh you come to find out you can't live off you come to find out you can't live off you come to find out you can't live off of rabbits man cannot live off a rabbit of rabbits man cannot live off a rabbit of rabbits man cannot live off a rabbit alone it turns out so you set up a huge alone it turns out so you set up a huge alone it turns out so you set up a huge number of traps mhm you were also number of traps mhm you were also number of traps mhm you were also fishing and then always on the lookout fishing and then always on the lookout fishing and then always on the lookout for uh moose yeah so like what what's in for uh moose yeah so like what what's in for uh moose yeah so like what what's in terms of survival if you were to do it terms of survival if you were to do it terms of survival if you were to do it over again over and over and over and over again over and over and over and over again over and over and over and over like how do over like how do over like how do you um maximize your chance of having you um maximize your chance of having you um maximize your chance of having enough food to survive for a long time enough food to survive for a long time enough food to survive for a long time you have to be you have to be really you have to be you have to be really you have to be you have to be really adaptable because everything's going to adaptable because everything's going to adaptable because everything's going to it's always going to look different your it's always going to look different your it's always going to look different your situation your location I actually had a situation your location I actually had a situation your location I actually had a what I thought was a pretty good plan what I thought was a pretty good plan what I thought was a pretty good plan going into Al loan and it just the you going into Al loan and it just the you going into Al loan and it just the you know the location didn't allow for what know the location didn't allow for what know the location didn't allow for what I thought it would what was the plan I thought it would what was the plan I thought it would what was the plan well I thought I would just catch a well I thought I would just catch a well I thought I would just catch a bunch of fish cuz I'm on a really good bunch of fish cuz I'm on a really good bunch of fish cuz I'm on a really good fishing lake I catch a whole bunch of fishing lake I catch a whole bunch of fishing lake I catch a whole bunch of fish and let them rot for a little while fish and let them rot for a little while fish and let them rot for a little while and then just drag them all through the and then just drag them all through the and then just drag them all through the woods into a big pile and then hunt a

woods into a big pile and then hunt a woods into a big pile and then hunt a bear on that Big Fish bear on that Big Fish bear on that Big Fish pile that was the plan and I thought but pile that was the plan and I thought but pile that was the plan and I thought but when I got there uh for one I had a hard when I got there uh for one I had a hard when I got there uh for one I had a hard time catching fish off the bat you know time catching fish off the bat you know time catching fish off the bat you know it they didn't come like I was hoping it they didn't come like I was hoping it they didn't come like I was hoping and then for for two it had burned prior and then for for two it had burned prior and then for for two it had burned prior so there were no berries and so there so there were no berries and so there so there were no berries and so there were very few berries which meant there were very few berries which meant there were very few berries which meant there weren't grous there weren't be they weren't grous there weren't be they weren't grous there weren't be they weren you know they had all gone to weren you know they had all gone to weren you know they had all gone to other places where the berries were and other places where the berries were and other places where the berries were and so what I had grown accustomed to kind so what I had grown accustomed to kind so what I had grown accustomed to kind of relying on in Siberia wasn't there of relying on in Siberia wasn't there of relying on in Siberia wasn't there there you know so in in Russia which was there you know so in in Russia which was there you know so in in Russia which was a similar environment it was just Grouse a similar environment it was just Grouse a similar environment it was just Grouse and berries and fish and some berries and berries and fish and some berries and berries and fish and some berries and fish and then occasionally you know and fish and then occasionally you know and fish and then occasionally you know you get a moose or something but I had you get a moose or something but I had you get a moose or something but I had to reassess which was part of me being to reassess which was part of me being to reassess which was part of me being grumpy at the start like this place grumpy at the start like this place grumpy at the start like this place sex and then and then once I reassessed sex and then and then once I reassessed sex and then and then once I reassessed and and and you know right away I saw and and and you know right away I saw and and and you know right away I saw that there were moose tracks and such so that there were moose tracks and such so that there were moose tracks and such so I just started a plan for that I moved I just started a plan for that I moved I just started a plan for that I moved my uh camp in a into a area that was as my uh camp in a into a area that was as my uh camp in a into a area that was as removed as I could be from where all the removed as I could be from where all the removed as I could be from where all the action is where the tracks were so that action is where the tracks were so that action is where the tracks were so that I wasn't disturbing animal patterns I I wasn't disturbing animal patterns I I wasn't disturbing animal patterns I made sure the wind the predominant wind made sure the wind the predominant wind made sure the wind the predominant wind was blowing out my scent to Sea and or was blowing out my scent to Sea and or was blowing out my scent to Sea and or you know to the water and then really to you know to the water and then really to you know to the water and then really to be honest if you want to actually be honest if you want to actually be honest if you want to actually survive somewhere is different than survive somewhere is different than survive somewhere is different than alone but you do have to be active and alone but you do have to be active and alone but you do have to be active and it has to you're going to have to you're it has to you're going to have to you're it has to you're going to have to you're not going to live you're not going to be not going to live you're not going to be not going to live you're not going to be sustainable by you know starving it out sustainable by you know starving it out sustainable by you know starving it out youd have to Fig unlock the key that is

youd have to Fig unlock the key that is youd have to Fig unlock the key that is sustainability and I think there's a lot sustainability and I think there's a lot sustainability and I think there's a lot of areas that still have that potential of areas that still have that potential of areas that still have that potential but you have to figure out what it is but you have to figure out what it is but you have to figure out what it is it's usually going to be a combination it's usually going to be a combination it's usually going to be a combination of fishing you know trapping and then of fishing you know trapping and then of fishing you know trapping and then hunting and then once you have some the hunting and then once you have some the hunting and then once you have some the fishing and trapping will get you until fishing and trapping will get you until fishing and trapping will get you until you have some success hunting and then you have some success hunting and then you have some success hunting and then that'll buy you three or four months of that'll buy you three or four months of that'll buy you three or four months of time to continue another you know to time to continue another you know to time to continue another you know to keep hunting again and you just have to keep hunting again and you just have to keep hunting again and you just have to roll off of that but every you know roll off of that but every you know roll off of that but every you know depends on where you are what depends on where you are what depends on where you are what opportunities are there so okay so opportunities are there so okay so opportunities are there so okay so that's the process fishing and trapping that's the process fishing and trapping that's the process fishing and trapping until you're successful hunting and then until you're successful hunting and then until you're successful hunting and then the successful hunt uh buys you some the successful hunt uh buys you some the successful hunt uh buys you some more time mhm right right just go year more time mhm right right just go year more time mhm right right just go year and then you just go re like that and and then you just go re like that and and then you just go re like that and that's how people did it forever the that's how people did it forever the that's how people did it forever the pressure I noticed it you know with that pressure I noticed it you know with that pressure I noticed it you know with that you got that moose and then you're happy you got that moose and then you're happy you got that moose and then you're happy for a week or so and then you start to for a week or so and then you start to for a week or so and then you start to be like you know this is finite I'm GNA be like you know this is finite I'm GNA be like you know this is finite I'm GNA have to do this again and you imagine if have to do this again and you imagine if have to do this again and you imagine if you had a family that was going to you had a family that was going to you had a family that was going to starve if you weren't successful you starve if you weren't successful you starve if you weren't successful you know this next time and there just know this next time and there just know this next time and there just always that pressure you know made me always that pressure you know made me always that pressure you know made me really like appreciate the amount of really like appreciate the amount of really like appreciate the amount of what people had to deal with well in what people had to deal with well in what people had to deal with well in terms of being active like so you have terms of being active like so you have terms of being active like so you have to do stuff all all day so you get up so to do stuff all all day so you get up so to do stuff all all day so you get up so and planning MH like what am I going to and planning MH like what am I going to and planning MH like what am I going to in the in the midst of the frustration in the in the midst of the frustration in the in the midst of the frustration you have to figure out like what's you have to figure out like what's you have to figure out like what's what's the strategy like how do you put what's the strategy like how do you put what's the strategy like how do you put up all the traps what's is that a up all the traps what's is that a up all the traps what's is that a decision like you know most people like decision like you know most people like decision like you know most people like sit at their desk and have like a sit at their desk and have like a sit at their desk and have like a calendar what are you like figuring out calendar what are you like figuring out calendar what are you like figuring out like one thing about Wilderness life in like one thing about Wilderness life in like one thing about Wilderness life in general is it's remarkably less

general is it's remarkably less general is it's remarkably less scheduled than anything we deal with scheduled than anything we deal with scheduled than anything we deal with schedules are fairly unique to the schedules are fairly unique to the schedules are fairly unique to the modern context you'd wake up and you modern context you'd wake up and you modern context you'd wake up and you just sort of you have a you know just sort of you have a you know just sort of you have a you know Confluence of things you want to do Confluence of things you want to do Confluence of things you want to do things you need to do things you should things you need to do things you should things you need to do things you should do and you just kind of tackle them as do and you just kind of tackle them as do and you just kind of tackle them as you see fit as it flows in you know so you see fit as it flows in you know so you see fit as it flows in you know so and that's actually one of the things and that's actually one of the things and that's actually one of the things that you people really that I really that you people really that I really that you people really that I really appreciate about that lifestyle is it appreciate about that lifestyle is it appreciate about that lifestyle is it really is you're kind of in that flow really is you're kind of in that flow really is you're kind of in that flow and so I'd wake up and be like H maybe and so I'd wake up and be like H maybe and so I'd wake up and be like H maybe I'll go fishing and then I'll wander I'll go fishing and then I'll wander I'll go fishing and then I'll wander over and fish and then I'd be like I'm over and fish and then I'd be like I'm over and fish and then I'd be like I'm going to go check the Trap line add going to go check the Trap line add going to go check the Trap line add every day if I add five or 10 every day if I add five or 10 every day if I add five or 10 snares you know you're constantly adding snares you know you're constantly adding snares you know you're constantly adding to your productive potential and then uh to your productive potential and then uh to your productive potential and then uh but nothing's really scheduled you're but nothing's really scheduled you're but nothing's really scheduled you're just kind of flying by the seat of your just kind of flying by the seat of your just kind of flying by the seat of your pants but then there's a lot of instinct pants but then there's a lot of instinct pants but then there's a lot of instinct that's already loaded in so much like that's already loaded in so much like that's already loaded in so much like you already just like wisdom from all you already just like wisdom from all you already just like wisdom from all the times you've had to do it before the times you've had to do it before the times you've had to do it before you're just actually operating a lot on you're just actually operating a lot on you're just actually operating a lot on Instinct like you said where to find to Instinct like you said where to find to Instinct like you said where to find to place a shelter like how hard is that place a shelter like how hard is that place a shelter like how hard is that calculation where to place the shelter calculation where to place the shelter calculation where to place the shelter if you're like dropped off and this is if you're like dropped off and this is if you're like dropped off and this is all new to you of course all those all new to you of course all those all new to you of course all those things are going to be things you have things are going to be things you have things are going to be things you have to really think through and plan when to really think through and plan when to really think through and plan when you're thinking about a shelter you have you're thinking about a shelter you have you're thinking about a shelter you have to think of oh here's a nice flat spot to think of oh here's a nice flat spot to think of oh here's a nice flat spot you know that's a good place but also is you know that's a good place but also is you know that's a good place but also is there firewood nearby and if I'm going there firewood nearby and if I'm going there firewood nearby and if I'm going to be here for months is there enough to be here for months is there enough to be here for months is there enough firewood that I'm not going to be firewood that I'm not going to be firewood that I'm not going to be walking a half a mile to get a dry piece walking a half a mile to get a dry piece walking a half a mile to get a dry piece of wood is the water nearby is there is of wood is the water nearby is there is of wood is the water nearby is there is it is it somewhat open but also

it is it somewhat open but also it is it somewhat open but also protected from the elements cuz protected from the elements cuz protected from the elements cuz sometimes you get a beautiful spot it is sometimes you get a beautiful spot it is sometimes you get a beautiful spot it is great on a calm day and then wind comes great on a calm day and then wind comes great on a calm day and then wind comes like and so there's all these factors like and so there's all these factors like and so there's all these factors you know even down to taking in what you know even down to taking in what you know even down to taking in what game is doing in the area also and how game is doing in the area also and how game is doing in the area also and how that relates to where your shelter is that relates to where your shelter is that relates to where your shelter is you said you have to consider where the you said you have to consider where the you said you have to consider where the action will be and you want to be away action will be and you want to be away action will be and you want to be away from the action but close enough to it from the action but close enough to it from the action but close enough to it to see it yeah you want to be yeah right to see it yeah you want to be yeah right to see it yeah you want to be yeah right and so uh ideally you know it depends and so uh ideally you know it depends and so uh ideally you know it depends you're always going to make give and you're always going to make give and you're always going to make give and takes and one thing with shelters and takes and one thing with shelters and takes and one thing with shelters and location selection of stuff it's another location selection of stuff it's another location selection of stuff it's another thing you just have to trust your thing you just have to trust your thing you just have to trust your ability to adapt in the situation ability to adapt in the situation ability to adapt in the situation because you everybody has a particular because you everybody has a particular because you everybody has a particular you know you got an idea of a shelter you know you got an idea of a shelter you know you got an idea of a shelter you're going to build but then you get you're going to build but then you get you're going to build but then you get there and maybe there's a good Cliff there and maybe there's a good Cliff there and maybe there's a good Cliff that you can incorporate you know or May that you can incorporate you know or May that you can incorporate you know or May and then you just become creative and and then you just become creative and and then you just become creative and that's a really fun process too to just that's a really fun process too to just that's a really fun process too to just allow your creativity to try to flourish allow your creativity to try to flourish allow your creativity to try to flourish in that what kind of shelters are there in that what kind of shelters are there in that what kind of shelters are there there's all kinds of philosophies on there's all kinds of philosophies on there's all kinds of philosophies on shelters which is fun uh people it's fun shelters which is fun uh people it's fun shelters which is fun uh people it's fun to see people try different things mine to see people try different things mine to see people try different things mine was fairly basic for the simple reason was fairly basic for the simple reason was fairly basic for the simple reason that I had lived you know Winters that I had lived you know Winters that I had lived you know Winters through Winters in Siberia in a teepee through Winters in Siberia in a teepee through Winters in Siberia in a teepee so I knew I didn't need like anything so I knew I didn't need like anything so I knew I didn't need like anything too robust as long as I had calories I'd too robust as long as I had calories I'd too robust as long as I had calories I'd be warm and I wasn't particularly be warm and I wasn't particularly be warm and I wasn't particularly worried about the cold um but you'll see worried about the cold um but you'll see worried about the cold um but you'll see so I kept my shelter really pretty so I kept my shelter really pretty so I kept my shelter really pretty simple with idea that I built a simple simple with idea that I built a simple simple with idea that I built a simple A-frame type shelter and then most of my A-frame type shelter and then most of my A-frame type shelter and then most of my energy is going to be focused on getting energy is going to be focused on getting energy is going to be focused on getting calories and then of course there's calories and then of course there's calories and then of course there's always going to be downtime and in that

always going to be downtime and in that always going to be downtime and in that downtime I can tweak modify improve my downtime I can tweak modify improve my downtime I can tweak modify improve my shelter and that'll just be a con shelter and that'll just be a con shelter and that'll just be a con process that by the by the time you're process that by the by the time you're process that by the by the time you're there a few months you'll have all the there a few months you'll have all the there a few months you'll have all the Kinks worked out it'll be a really nice Kinks worked out it'll be a really nice Kinks worked out it'll be a really nice little setup but you don't have to start little setup but you don't have to start little setup but you don't have to start with that necessarily because you got with that necessarily because you got with that necessarily because you got other needs you got to focus on that other needs you got to focus on that other needs you got to focus on that said you'll see a lot of people on a said you'll see a lot of people on a said you'll see a lot of people on a loan that really focus on you know loan that really focus on you know loan that really focus on you know building the Log Cabin because they want building the Log Cabin because they want building the Log Cabin because they want to be secure or uh incorporating you to be secure or uh incorporating you to be secure or uh incorporating you know whatever the Earth has around know whatever the Earth has around know whatever the Earth has around whether it be rocks or whether it be whether it be rocks or whether it be whether it be rocks or whether it be digg in a hole you know and we've seen digg in a hole you know and we've seen digg in a hole you know and we've seen some really cool shelters and I I I'm some really cool shelters and I I I'm some really cool shelters and I I I'm not you knock it everybody's got there's not you knock it everybody's got there's not you knock it everybody's got there's all Different Strokes for different all Different Strokes for different all Different Strokes for different folks but I in my particular idea was to folks but I in my particular idea was to folks but I in my particular idea was to keep it fairly simple improve it with keep it fairly simple improve it with keep it fairly simple improve it with time but spend most of my energy you time but spend most of my energy you time but spend most of my energy you know the shelter you really need to know the shelter you really need to know the shelter you really need to think about it can't be Smoky because think about it can't be Smoky because think about it can't be Smoky because that'll be miserable but it is nice to that'll be miserable but it is nice to that'll be miserable but it is nice to have a fire inside so you need to have a have a fire inside so you need to have a have a fire inside so you need to have a fire inside that's not going to be fire inside that's not going to be fire inside that's not going to be dangerous and uh smoke free and then dangerous and uh smoke free and then dangerous and uh smoke free and then also airtight because you're never going also airtight because you're never going also airtight because you're never going to have a warm shelter out there because to have a warm shelter out there because to have a warm shelter out there because you don't have seals and things like you don't have seals and things like you don't have seals and things like that but as long as the air is not that but as long as the air is not that but as long as the air is not moving through it you can have a warm moving through it you can have a warm moving through it you can have a warm enough shelter with a fire with a fire enough shelter with a fire with a fire enough shelter with a fire with a fire and dryer socks and stuff how do you get and dryer socks and stuff how do you get and dryer socks and stuff how do you get the smoke out of the shelter if you have the smoke out of the shelter if you have the smoke out of the shelter if you have good clay and mud and rock you can build good clay and mud and rock you can build good clay and mud and rock you can build yourself a fireplace which is yourself a fireplace which is yourself a fireplace which is surprisingly not that hard you know you surprisingly not that hard you know you surprisingly not that hard you know you just oh really yeah it's fun thing to do just oh really yeah it's fun thing to do just oh really yeah it's fun thing to do it works well you know take a little it works well you know take a little it works well you know take a little hole start stacking rocks around it make hole start stacking rocks around it make hole start stacking rocks around it make it make sure it's opening and it it make sure it's opening and it it make sure it's opening and it actually works you know um so that's not

actually works you know um so that's not actually works you know um so that's not as hard as you might think as hard as you might think as hard as you might think um for me where I was I I kind of came um for me where I was I I kind of came um for me where I was I I kind of came up with it as I was there with my up with it as I was there with my up with it as I was there with my A-frame you know I I hadn't built an A-frame you know I I hadn't built an A-frame you know I I hadn't built an A-frame shelter like that before and so A-frame shelter like that before and so A-frame shelter like that before and so when I built it and then I had put a when I built it and then I had put a when I built it and then I had put a bunch of tin cans in the ground so that bunch of tin cans in the ground so that bunch of tin cans in the ground so that air would get the fire so it was fed by air would get the fire so it was fed by air would get the fire so it was fed by air which helps create a draft um but air which helps create a draft um but air which helps create a draft um but but I realized in an A-frame it really but I realized in an A-frame it really but I realized in an A-frame it really doesn't the smoke doesn't go out very doesn't the smoke doesn't go out very doesn't the smoke doesn't go out very well even if you leave a hole at the top well even if you leave a hole at the top well even if you leave a hole at the top it like collects and Billows back down it like collects and Billows back down it like collects and Billows back down so then I uh cut some of my tarp and so then I uh cut some of my tarp and so then I uh cut some of my tarp and made this and cut a hole in the in the made this and cut a hole in the in the made this and cut a hole in the in the A-frame and then I made like a hood vent A-frame and then I made like a hood vent A-frame and then I made like a hood vent that I could pull down and catch the that I could pull down and catch the that I could pull down and catch the smoke with and so while the fire was smoke with and so while the fire was smoke with and so while the fire was going it would just bow out the hood going it would just bow out the hood going it would just bow out the hood vent and then when it was done burning vent and then when it was done burning vent and then when it was done burning and it was just hot cold so I could and it was just hot cold so I could and it was just hot cold so I could close it seal it up and keep the heat in close it seal it up and keep the heat in close it seal it up and keep the heat in so it actually worked pretty well so so it actually worked pretty well so so it actually worked pretty well so start with something that kind of works start with something that kind of works start with something that kind of works and then keep improving yeah exactly I and then keep improving yeah exactly I and then keep improving yeah exactly I was wondering I mean the the the log cap was wondering I mean the the the log cap was wondering I mean the the the log cap mhm it feels like that's a thing that mhm it feels like that's a thing that mhm it feels like that's a thing that takes a huge amount of work before work takes a huge amount of work before work takes a huge amount of work before work the difference between a log cabin and a the difference between a log cabin and a the difference between a log cabin and a warm log cabin is like an immense amount warm log cabin is like an immense amount warm log cabin is like an immense amount of work and all the chinking and all the of work and all the chinking and all the of work and all the chinking and all the door ceiling and you know the chimney door ceiling and you know the chimney door ceiling and you know the chimney has to be anyway so otherwise it's just has to be anyway so otherwise it's just has to be anyway so otherwise it's just going to be the same ambient temperature going to be the same ambient temperature going to be the same ambient temperature as outside so uh I don't think alone's as outside so uh I don't think alone's as outside so uh I don't think alone's the proper context for a log cabin I the proper context for a log cabin I the proper context for a log cabin I think like a log cabin's great in as a think like a log cabin's great in as a think like a log cabin's great in as a hunting cabin as you know like you're

hunting cabin as you know like you're hunting cabin as you know like you're have something for years but in a 3 six have something for years but in a 3 six have something for years but in a 3 six month scenario I don't know that it's month scenario I don't know that it's month scenario I don't know that it's worth the calorie expenditure and it is worth the calorie expenditure and it is worth the calorie expenditure and it is a lot of calories but that's an a lot of calories but that's an a lot of calories but that's an interesting sort of metaphor of just interesting sort of metaphor of just interesting sort of metaphor of just like get something that works you see a like get something that works you see a like get something that works you see a lot a lot of this with companies like lot a lot of this with companies like lot a lot of this with companies like successful companies they you know get a successful companies they you know get a successful companies they you know get a prototype get a system that's working prototype get a system that's working prototype get a system that's working and improve fast in response to the and improve fast in response to the and improve fast in response to the conditions to the environment yeah conditions to the environment yeah conditions to the environment yeah because it's constantly changing yeah because it's constantly changing yeah because it's constantly changing yeah and you end up being a lot better if and you end up being a lot better if and you end up being a lot better if you're able to learn how to respond you're able to learn how to respond you're able to learn how to respond quickly uh versus like having a big plan quickly uh versus like having a big plan quickly uh versus like having a big plan that takes a huge amount of time to to that takes a huge amount of time to to that takes a huge amount of time to to accomplish that's right and forcing that accomplish that's right and forcing that accomplish that's right and forcing that through the pipeline whether or not it through the pipeline whether or not it through the pipeline whether or not it fits yeah can you just speak to like the fits yeah can you just speak to like the fits yeah can you just speak to like the place you were the the Canadian Arctic place you were the the Canadian Arctic place you were the the Canadian Arctic it looked cold yeah we were right near it looked cold yeah we were right near it looked cold yeah we were right near the Arctic Circle I don't know it was the Arctic Circle I don't know it was the Arctic Circle I don't know it was like 60 kilometers south of the Arctic like 60 kilometers south of the Arctic like 60 kilometers south of the Arctic Circle so uh it was it's a really cool Circle so uh it was it's a really cool Circle so uh it was it's a really cool area really remote thousands of little area really remote thousands of little area really remote thousands of little Lakes you know when you fly over you're Lakes you know when you fly over you're Lakes you know when you fly over you're just like man it's incredible there must just like man it's incredible there must just like man it's incredible there must be so many of those lakes that people be so many of those lakes that people be so many of those lakes that people haven't been to you know it really was a haven't been to you know it really was a haven't been to you know it really was a neat area really remote and for the neat area really remote and for the neat area really remote and for the show's purpose I think it was perfect show's purpose I think it was perfect show's purpose I think it was perfect because it did have enough game and because it did have enough game and because it did have enough game and enough different Avenues forward that I enough different Avenues forward that I enough different Avenues forward that I think it really did reward activity so I think it really did reward activity so I think it really did reward activity so I think uh but it's a special place it was think uh but it's a special place it was think uh but it's a special place it was uh Den there's the tribe that lived uh Den there's the tribe that lived uh Den there's the tribe that lived there the den people which interestingly there the den people which interestingly there the den people which interestingly enough here's a side note when I was in enough here's a side note when I was in enough here's a side note when I was in Siberia I floated down this river called Siberia I floated down this river called Siberia I floated down this river called the Pud Tusa and you get to this Village

the Pud Tusa and you get to this Village the Pud Tusa and you get to this Village called sulami and there's these KET called sulami and there's these KET called sulami and there's these KET people they're called and there's only people they're called and there's only people they're called and there's only 600 of them left but in this is in the 600 of them left but in this is in the 600 of them left but in this is in the middle of Siberia not in like the middle of Siberia not in like the middle of Siberia not in like the Pacific coast but their language is Pacific coast but their language is Pacific coast but their language is related to The Den people and so somehow related to The Den people and so somehow related to The Den people and so somehow you know that connection was there you know that connection was there you know that connection was there thousands of years ago super interesting thousands of years ago super interesting thousands of years ago super interesting but yeah so language travels somehow but yeah so language travels somehow but yeah so language travels somehow right and the remnant stayed back there right and the remnant stayed back there right and the remnant stayed back there it's very interesting that Think Through it's very interesting that Think Through it's very interesting that Think Through History yeah with within language it History yeah with within language it History yeah with within language it contains a history of a peoples and it's contains a history of a peoples and it's contains a history of a peoples and it's interesting how that evolves over time interesting how that evolves over time interesting how that evolves over time and how Wars tell the story like and how Wars tell the story like and how Wars tell the story like language tells the story of conflict and language tells the story of conflict and language tells the story of conflict and conflict shaped language and we get we conflict shaped language and we get we conflict shaped language and we get we get the result of that right so get the result of that right so get the result of that right so fascinating and the barriers that fascinating and the barriers that fascinating and the barriers that language creates is also the thing that language creates is also the thing that language creates is also the thing that leads to Wars and misunderstandings and leads to Wars and misunderstandings and leads to Wars and misunderstandings and all this kind of stuff it's a all this kind of stuff it's a all this kind of stuff it's a fascinating tension uh but it got cold fascinating tension uh but it got cold fascinating tension uh but it got cold there right it got real cold yeah I mean there right it got real cold yeah I mean there right it got real cold yeah I mean I think I don't know what that I didn't I think I don't know what that I didn't I think I don't know what that I didn't have a thermometer but I imagine it have a thermometer but I imagine it have a thermometer but I imagine it probably got probably got probably got to30 at the most you know like it might to30 at the most you know like it might to30 at the most you know like it might have gotten it would have definitely have gotten it would have definitely have gotten it would have definitely gotten colder had we stayed longer but gotten colder had we stayed longer but gotten colder had we stayed longer but uh yeah I to be honest I I was I never uh yeah I to be honest I I was I never uh yeah I to be honest I I was I never felt cold out there I was pretty I had felt cold out there I was pretty I had felt cold out there I was pretty I had that one pretty dialed in and once you that one pretty dialed in and once you that one pretty dialed in and once you have calories you can stay warm you can have calories you can stay warm you can have calories you can stay warm you can stay active you can you know you got to stay active you can you know you got to stay active you can you know you got to dress warm you know you don't never let dress warm you know you don't never let dress warm you know you don't never let there's a good one if you're in the cold there's a good one if you're in the cold there's a good one if you're in the cold never let yourself get too cold because never let yourself get too cold because never let yourself get too cold because what happens is you'll stop feeling

what happens is you'll stop feeling what happens is you'll stop feeling what's cold and then frostbite and then what's cold and then frostbite and then what's cold and then frostbite and then issues and then it's really hard to warm issues and then it's really hard to warm issues and then it's really hard to warm back up so every I it was so annoying back up so every I it was so annoying back up so every I it was so annoying I'd be out going to ice fish or I'd be out going to ice fish or I'd be out going to ice fish or something and then I would just notice something and then I would just notice something and then I would just notice that my feet are cold and you're just that my feet are cold and you're just that my feet are cold and you're just like ah dang it I just turn around go like ah dang it I just turn around go like ah dang it I just turn around go back start a fire dry my boots out make back start a fire dry my boots out make back start a fire dry my boots out make sure my feet are warm and then go again sure my feet are warm and then go again sure my feet are warm and then go again I wouldn't ignore that you know also you I wouldn't ignore that you know also you I wouldn't ignore that you know also you want to be able to feel the cold yeah want to be able to feel the cold yeah want to be able to feel the cold yeah you want to make sure you're still you want to make sure you're still you want to make sure you're still feeling things and that you're not feeling things and that you're not feeling things and that you're not toughen through it because you can't toughen through it because you can't toughen through it because you can't really tough through the cold it'll just really tough through the cold it'll just really tough through the cold it'll just get you so what's your relationship with get you so what's your relationship with get you so what's your relationship with the cold um psychologically the cold um psychologically the cold um psychologically physically uh it's interesting oh I physically uh it's interesting oh I physically uh it's interesting oh I actually there's a some part of it that actually there's a some part of it that actually there's a some part of it that really makes you feel alive you know I'm really makes you feel alive you know I'm really makes you feel alive you know I'm imagine you know sometime in Austin here imagine you know sometime in Austin here imagine you know sometime in Austin here you come go out and it's hot and sweaty you come go out and it's hot and sweaty you come go out and it's hot and sweaty and you're like you get that kind of and you're like you get that kind of and you're like you get that kind of kind of saps you there's something about kind of saps you there's something about kind of saps you there's something about that brisk cold that hits your face that that brisk cold that hits your face that that brisk cold that hits your face that you're like wakes you up makes you feel you're like wakes you up makes you feel you're like wakes you up makes you feel really alive engaged you know it feels really alive engaged you know it feels really alive engaged you know it feels like the margins of air are smaller so like the margins of air are smaller so like the margins of air are smaller so you're alert and engaged a little more you're alert and engaged a little more you're alert and engaged a little more there is something that's a little bit there is something that's a little bit there is something that's a little bit lifegiving just because you feel on an lifegiving just because you feel on an lifegiving just because you feel on an edge you're walk you're on this Edge but edge you're walk you're on this Edge but edge you're walk you're on this Edge but you have to be alert because even you you have to be alert because even you you have to be alert because even you know some of the natives I lived with know some of the natives I lived with know some of the natives I lived with the lady had face issues because she let the lady had face issues because she let the lady had face issues because she let her head get cold when they're on a her head get cold when they're on a her head get cold when they're on a snowmobile hat was up too high you know snowmobile hat was up too high you know snowmobile hat was up too high you know that little mistake and then it just that little mistake and then it just that little mistake and then it just freezes this part of your forehead and freezes this part of your forehead and freezes this part of your forehead and then the nerves go and then you got then the nerves go and then you got then the nerves go and then you got issues one just h wasn't high enough so issues one just h wasn't high enough so issues one just h wasn't high enough so you got kind of got to be dialed in on you got kind of got to be dialed in on you got kind of got to be dialed in on stuff well there's a psychological

stuff well there's a psychological stuff well there's a psychological element to just I mean it's element to just I mean it's element to just I mean it's unpleasant if I were to think of what unpleasant if I were to think of what unpleasant if I were to think of what kind of unpleasant would I kind of unpleasant would I kind of unpleasant would I Choose You Know fasting for a long Choose You Know fasting for a long Choose You Know fasting for a long periods of time going without food in a periods of time going without food in a periods of time going without food in a warm environment is way more pleasant warm environment is way more pleasant warm environment is way more pleasant than uh being fed in a c yeah exactly than uh being fed in a c yeah exactly than uh being fed in a c yeah exactly like if you were to choose I choose the like if you were to choose I choose the like if you were to choose I choose the opposite oh yeah okay well there you go opposite oh yeah okay well there you go opposite oh yeah okay well there you go I wonder if I wonder if I wonder if that's I if you're born with that or if that's I if you're born with that or if that's I if you're born with that or if that's developed maybe your time in that's developed maybe your time in that's developed maybe your time in Siberia like you or or do you gravitate Siberia like you or or do you gravitate Siberia like you or or do you gravitate towards I I wonder what that is cuz I towards I I wonder what that is cuz I towards I I wonder what that is cuz I really don't like survival in the cold I really don't like survival in the cold I really don't like survival in the cold I think a little bit of it is learned you think a little bit of it is learned you think a little bit of it is learned you like almost learned not you learn not to like almost learned not you learn not to like almost learned not you learn not to fear it you learn to kind of appreciate fear it you learn to kind of appreciate fear it you learn to kind of appreciate it and a big part of that is I mean to it and a big part of that is I mean to it and a big part of that is I mean to be honest it's like dressing warm being be honest it's like dressing warm being be honest it's like dressing warm being in good it's not that you know there's in good it's not that you know there's in good it's not that you know there's no secrets to that it's you just can't no secrets to that it's you just can't no secrets to that it's you just can't beat the cult so you just need to dress beat the cult so you just need to dress beat the cult so you just need to dress warm the na you know all that fur all warm the na you know all that fur all warm the na you know all that fur all that stuff and then all of a sudden you that stuff and then all of a sudden you that stuff and then all of a sudden you have your little Refuge have a nice warm have your little Refuge have a nice warm have your little Refuge have a nice warm fire gun and your teepee you know and fire gun and your teepee you know and fire gun and your teepee you know and then you I bet you you could learn to then you I bet you you could learn to then you I bet you you could learn to appreciate it yeah I think some of it is appreciate it yeah I think some of it is appreciate it yeah I think some of it is just opening yourself up to the just opening yourself up to the just opening yourself up to the possibility that there's something possibility that there's something possibility that there's something enjoyable about it like here I I run in enjoyable about it like here I I run in enjoyable about it like here I I run in Austin all the time and like 100 degree Austin all the time and like 100 degree Austin all the time and like 100 degree heat uhuh and I go out there with a heat uhuh and I go out there with a heat uhuh and I go out there with a smile on my face and like and learn to smile on my face and like and learn to smile on my face and like and learn to enjoy it oh yeah and so you're just like

enjoy it oh yeah and so you're just like enjoy it oh yeah and so you're just like I look kind of like you doing the cold I look kind of like you doing the cold I look kind of like you doing the cold just I don't think I enjoy the heat but just I don't think I enjoy the heat but just I don't think I enjoy the heat but you just allow yourself to enjoy yeah you just allow yourself to enjoy yeah you just allow yourself to enjoy yeah yeah yeah I I do feel that way I mean I yeah yeah I I do feel that way I mean I yeah yeah I I do feel that way I mean I I don't mind the heat that much but I I I don't mind the heat that much but I I I don't mind the heat that much but I I think you could get to the place where think you could get to the place where think you could get to the place where you appreciated the cold it's probably you appreciated the cold it's probably you appreciated the cold it's probably just a lack of it's kind of scary when just a lack of it's kind of scary when just a lack of it's kind of scary when you haven't done it and you don't know you haven't done it and you don't know you haven't done it and you don't know what you're doing and you go out and you what you're doing and you go out and you what you're doing and you go out and you feel cold it's like not fun but I bet feel cold it's like not fun but I bet feel cold it's like not fun but I bet you could you'd enjoy it you'll have to you could you'd enjoy it you'll have to you could you'd enjoy it you'll have to come out some sometimes come out some sometimes come out some sometimes 100% I mean you're right it does make 100% I mean you're right it does make 100% I mean you're right it does make you feel alive that it like maybe that's you feel alive that it like maybe that's you feel alive that it like maybe that's the thing that I struggle with is the the thing that I struggle with is the the thing that I struggle with is the time passes slower cuz it does make you time passes slower cuz it does make you time passes slower cuz it does make you feel alive you get to feel time but then feel alive you get to feel time but then feel alive you get to feel time but then the flip side of that is you get to feel the flip side of that is you get to feel the flip side of that is you get to feel every moment and you get to feel alive every moment and you get to feel alive every moment and you get to feel alive in every moment so that it's it's both in every moment so that it's it's both in every moment so that it's it's both scary when you're in experienced and and scary when you're in experienced and and scary when you're in experienced and and beautiful when you are experienced MH beautiful when you are experienced MH beautiful when you are experienced MH were there times when you got hungry I were there times when you got hungry I were there times when you got hungry I got got shot a rabbit on day one and I got got shot a rabbit on day one and I got got shot a rabbit on day one and I snared a couple rabbits on day two and snared a couple rabbits on day two and snared a couple rabbits on day two and then more and more as the time went so I then more and more as the time went so I then more and more as the time went so I actually did pretty well on the food actually did pretty well on the food actually did pretty well on the food front uh the other thing is when you front uh the other thing is when you front uh the other thing is when you have all those berries around and stuff have all those berries around and stuff have all those berries around and stuff you do have an ability to like fill your you do have an ability to like fill your you do have an ability to like fill your stomach and so you don't really notice stomach and so you don't really notice stomach and so you don't really notice if you're getting thinner or if you're if you're getting thinner or if you're if you're getting thinner or if you're losing weight um so I can say on alone I losing weight um so I can say on alone I losing weight um so I can say on alone I was not that hungry I've definitely been was not that hungry I've definitely been was not that hungry I've definitely been really hungry in Russia there were times really hungry in Russia there were times really hungry in Russia there were times when when I lost a lot of weight Ian I when when I lost a lot of weight Ian I when when I lost a lot of weight Ian I lost a lot more weight in Siberia than I

lost a lot more weight in Siberia than I lost a lot more weight in Siberia than I did on Al times so okay we'll have to did on Al times so okay we'll have to did on Al times so okay we'll have to talk about it so you uh caught a fish talk about it so you uh caught a fish talk about it so you uh caught a fish you caught a couple I think I caught you caught a couple I think I caught you caught a couple I think I caught like 13 or so they didn't show a lot of like 13 or so they didn't show a lot of like 13 or so they didn't show a lot of them you caught 13 fish 13 of those big them you caught 13 fish 13 of those big them you caught 13 fish 13 of those big fish to well I caught a couple that were fish to well I caught a couple that were fish to well I caught a couple that were small this is like a meme of this yeah small this is like a meme of this yeah small this is like a meme of this yeah it was a you're a perfect example of a it was a you're a perfect example of a it was a you're a perfect example of a person who was thriving surviving I was person who was thriving surviving I was person who was thriving surviving I was thought you know this this is in the in thought you know this this is in the in thought you know this this is in the in hindsight again when I was out there I hindsight again when I was out there I hindsight again when I was out there I never let myself think you might win and never let myself think you might win and never let myself think you might win and I just was going to be out there as long I just was going to be out there as long I just was going to be out there as long as I could and tried to remain as I could and tried to remain as I could and tried to remain pessimistic about no but then the uh but pessimistic about no but then the uh but pessimistic about no but then the uh but there I remember a thought that I was there I remember a thought that I was there I remember a thought that I was like I wonder if they're going to be like I wonder if they're going to be like I wonder if they're going to be able to make this look hard you know I able to make this look hard you know I able to make this look hard you know I did have that thought at one point and did have that thought at one point and did have that thought at one point and CU it went pretty well and I was CU it went pretty well and I was CU it went pretty well and I was definitely was it was hard definitely was it was hard definitely was it was hard psychologically because I didn't know psychologically because I didn't know psychologically because I didn't know when it was going to end like I thought when it was going to end like I thought when it was going to end like I thought this could go you know like I said 6 this could go you know like I said 6 this could go you know like I said 6 months could go go eight months a year months could go go eight months a year months could go go eight months a year and then you start to C you know a two and then you start to C you know a two and then you start to C you know a two and a three-year-old and you start to and a three-year-old and you start to and a three-year-old and you start to weigh in the is it worth it if it goes a weigh in the is it worth it if it goes a weigh in the is it worth it if it goes a year and it's not worth it if it goes year and it's not worth it if it goes year and it's not worth it if it goes eight months and I still lose so I feel eight months and I still lose so I feel eight months and I still lose so I feel like I had this pressure and it was like I had this pressure and it was like I had this pressure and it was psychologically difficult for that psychologically difficult for that psychologically difficult for that reason reason reason physically I wasn't too bad this is uh physically I wasn't too bad this is uh physically I wasn't too bad this is uh off mic we're talking about Gordon Ryan off mic we're talking about Gordon Ryan off mic we're talking about Gordon Ryan competing in in Jiu-Jitsu and maybe competing in in Jiu-Jitsu and maybe competing in in Jiu-Jitsu and maybe that's the challenge he also has to face that's the challenge he also has to face that's the challenge he also has to face is to make things look is to make things look is to make things look hard cuz there's he's so dominant in the

hard cuz there's he's so dominant in the hard cuz there's he's so dominant in the sport sport sport that in terms of the drama and the that in terms of the drama and the that in terms of the drama and the entertainment of the of the sport in entertainment of the of the sport in entertainment of the of the sport in this case of survival it has to be this case of survival it has to be this case of survival it has to be difficult you know and I'll add that for difficult you know and I'll add that for difficult you know and I'll add that for sure though that it's it's the woods sure though that it's it's the woods sure though that it's it's the woods it's nature you never know how it's it's nature you never know how it's it's nature you never know how it's going to go you know what I mean it's going to go you know what I mean it's going to go you know what I mean it's like every time you're out there it's a like every time you're out there it's a like every time you're out there it's a different scenario so yeah whatever different scenario so yeah whatever different scenario so yeah whatever Hallelujah it went well so you uh you Hallelujah it went well so you uh you Hallelujah it went well so you uh you won after 77 days won after 77 days won after 77 days how long do you think you could have how long do you think you could have how long do you think you could have lasted when I left I weighed what I do lasted when I left I weighed what I do lasted when I left I weighed what I do right now so I just weighed my normal right now so I just weighed my normal right now so I just weighed my normal weight I had you know a couple hundred weight I had you know a couple hundred weight I had you know a couple hundred pounds of moose I had at least you know pounds of moose I had at least you know pounds of moose I had at least you know 100 pounds of fish I had you know a pile 100 pounds of fish I had you know a pile 100 pounds of fish I had you know a pile of rabbits yeah a wolverine you know I of rabbits yeah a wolverine you know I of rabbits yeah a wolverine you know I had all this stuff and I know I hadn't had all this stuff and I know I hadn't had all this stuff and I know I hadn't gotten cold yet I I just thought but in gotten cold yet I I just thought but in gotten cold yet I I just thought but in my head I thought if I get today 130 or my head I thought if I get today 130 or my head I thought if I get today 130 or 40 40 40 even if someone else has big game I had even if someone else has big game I had even if someone else has big game I had a pretty good idea they might quit a pretty good idea they might quit a pretty good idea they might quit because it would be long cold dark days because it would be long cold dark days because it would be long cold dark days and how miserable is that just it's so and how miserable is that just it's so and how miserable is that just it's so boring it's freezing and and so I boring it's freezing and and so I boring it's freezing and and so I thought the only time I thought I could thought the only time I thought I could thought the only time I thought I could think about winning is one I got to day think about winning is one I got to day think about winning is one I got to day 130 or 40 and I definitely had that um 130 or 40 and I definitely had that um 130 or 40 and I definitely had that um with what I had uh now maybe I would with what I had uh now maybe I would with what I had uh now maybe I would have got you know I probably would have have got you know I probably would have have got you know I probably would have gotten more I had caught a that big 20 gotten more I had caught a that big 20 gotten more I had caught a that big 20 something pound Pike on the last day I something pound Pike on the last day I something pound Pike on the last day I was there maybe catch some more of those was there maybe catch some more of those was there maybe catch some more of those you know I don't you know and I don't

you know I don't you know and I don't you know I don't you know and I don't know like I don't know how many calories know like I don't know how many calories know like I don't know how many calories I had stored but I had a lot and so how I had stored but I had a lot and so how I had stored but I had a lot and so how long would that have lasted me assuming long would that have lasted me assuming long would that have lasted me assuming I didn't get anything else it definitely I didn't get anything else it definitely I didn't get anything else it definitely would have I definitely would have would have I definitely would have would have I definitely would have reached my goal of 130 or 40 days and reached my goal of 130 or 40 days and reached my goal of 130 or 40 days and then after that I thought we were just then after that I thought we were just then after that I thought we were just going to push into the who you know then going to push into the who you know then going to push into the who you know then it's just to see how much who has what it's just to see how much who has what it's just to see how much who has what reserves and we'll go as far as we can reserves and we'll go as far as we can reserves and we'll go as far as we can and that would get me through January and that would get me through January and that would get me through January into February and I just thought man into February and I just thought man into February and I just thought man that's going to be miserable for people that's going to be miserable for people that's going to be miserable for people and you were like I can last through and and you were like I can last through and and you were like I can last through and I knew do it yeah uh what what aspect of I knew do it yeah uh what what aspect of I knew do it yeah uh what what aspect of that is miserable the hardest thing for that is miserable the hardest thing for that is miserable the hardest thing for me would have been the boredom um me would have been the boredom um me would have been the boredom um because it's hard to it's hard to stay because it's hard to it's hard to stay because it's hard to it's hard to stay busy when it's all dark out when the ice busy when it's all dark out when the ice busy when it's all dark out when the ice is you know three four foot thick you is you know three four foot thick you is you know three four foot thick you can't fish and can't fish and can't fish and um I just think I think it would have um I just think I think it would have um I just think I think it would have just been really boring it would had to just been really boring it would had to just been really boring it would had to been a real zen master to push through been a real zen master to push through been a real zen master to push through it but because I had experienced it to it but because I had experienced it to it but because I had experienced it to some degree I knew I could and then I some degree I knew I could and then I some degree I knew I could and then I think things that might you know you think things that might you know you think things that might you know you start thinking about family and this and start thinking about family and this and start thinking about family and this and that and those situations and I just that and those situations and I just that and those situations and I just knew that those because I'd gone to all knew that those because I'd gone to all knew that those because I'd gone to all these trips to Russia for a year at a these trips to Russia for a year at a these trips to Russia for a year at a time the time context was a little time the time context was a little time the time context was a little broader for me than I think for some broader for me than I think for some broader for me than I think for some people because I I knew I could be gone people because I I knew I could be gone people because I I knew I could be gone for a year and come back catch up with for a year and come back catch up with for a year and come back catch up with my loved ones you know bring what I got my loved ones you know bring what I got my loved ones you know bring what I got back whether that be psychological back whether that be psychological back whether that be psychological whatever it is and we'd all enrich each whatever it is and we'd all enrich each whatever it is and we'd all enrich each other and and once it's in hindsight other and and once it's in hindsight other and and once it's in hindsight that year would have been like that that year would have been like that that year would have been like that talking about it so I had that

talking about it so I had that talking about it so I had that perspective and it so I knew I wasn't perspective and it so I knew I wasn't perspective and it so I knew I wasn't going to tap for any other reason other going to tap for any other reason other going to tap for any other reason other than running out of food someday so that than running out of food someday so that than running out of food someday so that was my stressor and then see you're able was my stressor and then see you're able was my stressor and then see you're able to given the boredom given the to given the boredom given the to given the boredom given the loneliness kind of zoom loneliness kind of zoom loneliness kind of zoom out and accept the passing of time just out and accept the passing of time just out and accept the passing of time just let it pass you know for me I'm an let it pass you know for me I'm an let it pass you know for me I'm an fairly act I like to be active and so I fairly act I like to be active and so I fairly act I like to be active and so I would try to think of creative ways to would try to think of creative ways to would try to think of creative ways to keep my brain busy you know we saw the keep my brain busy you know we saw the keep my brain busy you know we saw the like dumb rabbit for skit what but then like dumb rabbit for skit what but then like dumb rabbit for skit what but then I did a whole bunch of like elaborate I did a whole bunch of like elaborate I did a whole bunch of like elaborate Normandy reinvasion you knowas Normandy reinvasion you knowas Normandy reinvasion you knowas reenactments and stuff like there was reenactments and stuff like there was reenactments and stuff like there was like a there was a every day I would like a there was a every day I would like a there was a every day I would think of I got to think of something to think of I got to think of something to think of I got to think of something to make me laugh you know and then do some make me laugh you know and then do some make me laugh you know and then do some stupid skit and then that would be that stupid skit and then that would be that stupid skit and then that would be that would fill a couple hours of my time and would fill a couple hours of my time and would fill a couple hours of my time and then I'd spend an hour two couple few then I'd spend an hour two couple few then I'd spend an hour two couple few hours fishing and then you spend few hours fishing and then you spend few hours fishing and then you spend few hours you know whatever you're doing hours you know whatever you're doing hours you know whatever you're doing would you do that without a camera yeah would you do that without a camera yeah would you do that without a camera yeah oh no the the the skits funny question oh no the the the skits funny question oh no the the the skits funny question that's a good question I don't know I that's a good question I don't know I that's a good question I don't know I actually don't know that uh I will say actually don't know that uh I will say actually don't know that uh I will say that was the one of the advantages of that was the one of the advantages of that was the one of the advantages of being on the show versus uh in Siberia being on the show versus uh in Siberia being on the show versus uh in Siberia so no because I didn't in Siberia just so no because I didn't in Siberia just so no because I didn't in Siberia just do skits by myself but I didn't film it do skits by myself but I didn't film it do skits by myself but I didn't film it and so it was it was quite nice to have and so it was it was quite nice to have and so it was it was quite nice to have this camera that made you feel like you this camera that made you feel like you this camera that made you feel like you weren't quite as alone as if you were weren't quite as alone as if you were weren't quite as alone as if you were just in the Woods by yourself and I just in the Woods by yourself and I just in the Woods by yourself and I think it for me I was able to it's a it think it for me I was able to it's a it think it for me I was able to it's a it was a pain it was part of the cause of was a pain it was part of the cause of was a pain it was part of the cause of me missing that moose you know there's me missing that moose you know there's me missing that moose you know there's issues with it but I just chose to look issues with it but I just chose to look issues with it but I just chose to look at it as like this is an awesome at it as like this is an awesome at it as like this is an awesome opportunity to share with people a part

opportunity to share with people a part opportunity to share with people a part of me that most people don't get to see of me that most people don't get to see of me that most people don't get to see you know so that was I just chose to you know so that was I just chose to you know so that was I just chose to look at it that way and it was an look at it that way and it was an look at it that way and it was an advantage because you could do stuff advantage because you could do stuff advantage because you could do stuff like that I think there's actual power like that I think there's actual power like that I think there's actual power to doing this kind of documenting like to doing this kind of documenting like to doing this kind of documenting like talking to a camera or an audio recorder talking to a camera or an audio recorder talking to a camera or an audio recorder like that that's an actual tool in like that that's an actual tool in like that that's an actual tool in survival I I had a little bit of an survival I I had a little bit of an survival I I had a little bit of an experience being out alone in the jungle experience being out alone in the jungle experience being out alone in the jungle and just being able to talk to a thing and just being able to talk to a thing and just being able to talk to a thing mhm is much less lonely it is it really mhm is much less lonely it is it really mhm is much less lonely it is it really is it's a that's can be a powerful tool is it's a that's can be a powerful tool is it's a that's can be a powerful tool just sharing your experience I had the I just sharing your experience I had the I just sharing your experience I had the I definitely had the thought so going back definitely had the thought so going back definitely had the thought so going back to your earlier comment but I definitely to your earlier comment but I definitely to your earlier comment but I definitely had the thought if I knew I was the last had the thought if I knew I was the last had the thought if I knew I was the last person on Earth I wouldn't even bother person on Earth I wouldn't even bother person on Earth I wouldn't even bother like I wouldn't do that like I would like I wouldn't do that like I would like I wouldn't do that like I would just probably not I just give up I'm just probably not I just give up I'm just probably not I just give up I'm sure because even if I had a bunch of sure because even if I had a bunch of sure because even if I had a bunch of food and this and that but because I food and this and that but because I food and this and that but because I knew knew you're you know you're a part knew knew you're you know you're a part knew knew you're you know you're a part you're sharing it gives you a lot of you're sharing it gives you a lot of you're sharing it gives you a lot of strength to go through and and having strength to go through and and having strength to go through and and having that camera just as makes it that much that camera just as makes it that much that camera just as makes it that much more Vivid because you know you're not more Vivid because you know you're not more Vivid because you know you're not just going to be sharing a vague memory just going to be sharing a vague memory just going to be sharing a vague memory but an actual experience I think if but an actual experience I think if but an actual experience I think if you're the last person on Earth you you're the last person on Earth you you're the last person on Earth you would actually convince yourself first would actually convince yourself first would actually convince yourself first of all you don't know for sure last of all you don't know for sure last of all you don't know for sure last there's always going to be hope dies there's always going to be hope dies there's always going to be hope dies last yeah hope hope really do does die last yeah hope hope really do does die last yeah hope hope really do does die you really don't know you really you you really don't know you really you you really don't know you really you really hope to find I mean if you're really hope to find I mean if you're really hope to find I mean if you're like an apocal happens MH MH I think like an apocal happens MH MH I think like an apocal happens MH MH I think your whole life will become about your whole life will become about your whole life will become about finding the other person it would be and finding the other person it would be and finding the other person it would be and there's a CH I mean I I'm I guess I'm there's a CH I mean I I'm I guess I'm there's a CH I mean I I'm I guess I'm saying if you knew you were for some saying if you knew you were for some saying if you knew you were for some reason knew you were the last I wonder

reason knew you were the last I wonder reason knew you were the last I wonder if you would I wonder if you that that if you would I wonder if you that that if you would I wonder if you that that was a thought I had if I knew I was the was a thought I had if I knew I was the was a thought I had if I knew I was the last person like cuz I here I was having last person like cuz I here I was having last person like cuz I here I was having a good time having fun fishing plenty of a good time having fun fishing plenty of a good time having fun fishing plenty of food but like if I knew I was the last food but like if I knew I was the last food but like if I knew I was the last person on Earth I don't know that I person on Earth I don't know that I person on Earth I don't know that I would even bother but now if that was would even bother but now if that was would even bother but now if that was for real would I bother that's the for real would I bother that's the for real would I bother that's the question no no I think if you knew if question no no I think if you knew if question no no I think if you knew if somebody some some way you knew for sure somebody some some way you knew for sure somebody some some way you knew for sure I think your mind will start doubting it I think your mind will start doubting it I think your mind will start doubting it that whoever told you you're the last that whoever told you you're the last that whoever told you you're the last person person person whatever was lying right right the power whatever was lying right right the power whatever was lying right right the power of Hope might be of Hope might be of Hope might be more than I accounted for in that more than I accounted for in that more than I accounted for in that situation also uh you might if you are situation also uh you might if you are situation also uh you might if you are indeed the last person you might want to indeed the last person you might want to indeed the last person you might want to be documenting it for once you die you be documenting it for once you die you be documenting it for once you die you know an alien species come comes about know an alien species come comes about know an alien species come comes about CU whatever happened on Earth is a CU whatever happened on Earth is a CU whatever happened on Earth is a pretty special thing and if you're the pretty special thing and if you're the pretty special thing and if you're the last one you might be like the last last one you might be like the last last one you might be like the last person to tell the story of what person to tell the story of what person to tell the story of what happened and so that's going to be a way happened and so that's going to be a way happened and so that's going to be a way to convince yourself that this is to convince yourself that this is to convince yourself that this is important and so the days will go by important and so the days will go by important and so the days will go by like this but it would be like this but it would be like this but it would be lonely boy would that be lonely it would lonely boy would that be lonely it would lonely boy would that be lonely it would be wow maybe delving into the dredges be wow maybe delving into the dredges be wow maybe delving into the dredges the depths of yeah I mean something the depths of yeah I mean something the depths of yeah I mean something there is going to be existential dread there is going to be existential dread there is going to be existential dread mhm but also I don't know I think hope mhm but also I don't know I think hope mhm but also I don't know I think hope will burn bright you'll be looking for will burn bright you'll be looking for will burn bright you'll be looking for other humans that's you know one of the other humans that's you know one of the other humans that's you know one of the reasons I was look forward to talking to reasons I was look forward to talking to reasons I was look forward to talking to you things I appreciate about you is you you things I appreciate about you is you you things I appreciate about you is you you're always not out of naivity but you're always not out of naivity but you're always not out of naivity but you're always choose to look at the you're always choose to look at the you're always choose to look at the positive you know what I mean and I and

positive you know what I mean and I and positive you know what I mean and I and I think that's a a powerful mindset to I think that's a a powerful mindset to I think that's a a powerful mindset to have I appreciate it yeah that'd be a have I appreciate it yeah that'd be a have I appreciate it yeah that'd be a pretty cool survival situation though if pretty cool survival situation though if pretty cool survival situation though if you're the last person on you're the last person on you're the last person on Earth if you could share Earth if you could share Earth if you could share it you could share yeah um like I said it you could share yeah um like I said it you could share yeah um like I said many people consider you the most many people consider you the most many people consider you the most successful competitor on alone the other successful competitor on alone the other successful competitor on alone the other successful one is Roland Welker Rock successful one is Roland Welker Rock successful one is Roland Welker Rock House guy oh yeah this is just a fun House guy oh yeah this is just a fun House guy oh yeah this is just a fun ridiculous question but head-to head who ridiculous question but head-to head who ridiculous question but head-to head who do you think survives do you think survives do you think survives longer um if you want to get me the longer um if you want to get me the longer um if you want to get me the competitive side of it I would just say competitive side of it I would just say competitive side of it I would just say I I'm pretty dang sure I had more pounds I I'm pretty dang sure I had more pounds I I'm pretty dang sure I had more pounds of of of food but and I didn't have the advantage food but and I didn't have the advantage food but and I didn't have the advantage of knowing when it would end which I of knowing when it would end which I of knowing when it would end which I think would have been a greaty think would have been a greaty think would have been a greaty psychological oh yeah would have made it psychological oh yeah would have made it psychological oh yeah would have made it really easy once I got the Moose I could really easy once I got the Moose I could really easy once I got the Moose I could have shot the moose and just not have shot the moose and just not have shot the moose and just not stressed that would have been like a and stressed that would have been like a and stressed that would have been like a and so that was a big difference between the so that was a big difference between the so that was a big difference between the seasons that I felt seasons that I felt seasons that I felt like I mean I felt like the psychology like I mean I felt like the psychology like I mean I felt like the psychology of season 7 they kind of messed up by of season 7 they kind of messed up by of season 7 they kind of messed up by doing a 100 day cap because I for my own doing a 100 day cap because I for my own doing a 100 day cap because I for my own experience that was the hardest part but experience that was the hardest part but experience that was the hardest part but Roland's a he's a beast so for people Roland's a he's a beast so for people Roland's a he's a beast so for people who don't know they put a 100 day cap on who don't know they put a 100 day cap on who don't know they put a 100 day cap on so it's whoever can survive 100 days uh so it's whoever can survive 100 days uh so it's whoever can survive 100 days uh For That season it's interesting to hear For That season it's interesting to hear For That season it's interesting to hear that for you the uncertainty not knowing that for you the uncertainty not knowing that for you the uncertainty not knowing when it ends is that was for sure it when it ends is that was for sure it when it ends is that was for sure it it's the hardest that's true cuz like it's the hardest that's true cuz like it's the hardest that's true cuz like you wake up every day I didn't know how you wake up every day I didn't know how you wake up every day I didn't know how to ration my food I didn't know if if I

to ration my food I didn't know if if I to ration my food I didn't know if if I was going to lose after 6 months and was going to lose after 6 months and was going to lose after 6 months and then it was all going to be for not I then it was all going to be for not I then it was all going to be for not I didn't know if it you know I just didn't know if it you know I just didn't know if it you know I just there's so many unknowns you don't know there's so many unknowns you don't know there's so many unknowns you don't know like like I said if I shot a moose and like like I said if I shot a moose and like like I said if I shot a moose and it was 100 days done if I shot a moose it was 100 days done if I shot a moose it was 100 days done if I shot a moose and you don't know it's like crap I and you don't know it's like crap I and you don't know it's like crap I could still lose to somebody else but could still lose to somebody else but could still lose to somebody else but it's going to be way in the future it's going to be way in the future it's going to be way in the future so anyway that for me was definitely the so anyway that for me was definitely the so anyway that for me was definitely the the hard part and when you found out the hard part and when you found out the hard part and when you found out that you won and your wife was there it that you won and your wife was there it that you won and your wife was there it was funny because you're really happy was funny because you're really happy was funny because you're really happy there's great sort of moment of you uh there's great sort of moment of you uh there's great sort of moment of you uh reuniting but also there's a State of reuniting but also there's a State of reuniting but also there's a State of Shock of Shock of Shock of like you look you look like you were like you look you look like you were like you look you look like you were ready to go much longer that was the ready to go much longer that was the ready to go much longer that was the most genuine shock I could have I hadn't most genuine shock I could have I hadn't most genuine shock I could have I hadn't even like entertained a thought yet I even like entertained a thought yet I even like entertained a thought yet I didn't even think it was you'd hear the didn't even think it was you'd hear the didn't even think it was you'd hear the helicopters helicopters helicopters and I just assumed there was other and I just assumed there was other and I just assumed there was other people out there I just hadn't I thought people out there I just hadn't I thought people out there I just hadn't I thought like you know and for one the previous like you know and for one the previous like you know and for one the previous person that had gone the longest had person that had gone the longest had person that had gone the longest had gone 89 days so I just knew whoever else gone 89 days so I just knew whoever else gone 89 days so I just knew whoever else was out here with me somebody's got that was out here with me somebody's got that was out here with me somebody's got that in their crosshairs they're going to get in their crosshairs they're going to get in their crosshairs they're going to get to 90 and they're not going to quit at to 90 and they're not going to quit at to 90 and they're not going to quit at 90 they're going to go to 100 you know I 90 they're going to go to 100 you know I 90 they're going to go to 100 you know I just figured we can't start thinking just figured we can't start thinking just figured we can't start thinking about the end until a couple months from about the end until a couple months from about the end until a couple months from when it ended so I was just shocked I when it ended so I was just shocked I when it ended so I was just shocked I was and and they tricked me pretty good was and and they tricked me pretty good was and and they tricked me pretty good they know how to make you think you're they know how to make you think you're they know how to make you think you're not you know that they're you're not so not you know that they're you're not so not you know that they're you're not so they want you to do the surprise yeah they want you to do the surprise yeah they want you to do the surprise yeah they want it to be a surprise you really they want it to be a surprise you really they want it to be a surprise you really weren't I mean you have to do that I weren't I mean you have to do that I weren't I mean you have to do that I guess for survival don't be counting the guess for survival don't be counting the guess for survival don't be counting the days no I think that would be then you days no I think that would be then you days no I think that would be then you know you see that and some of the people

know you see that and some of the people know you see that and some of the people do that for myself that would be bad do that for myself that would be bad do that for myself that would be bad psychology because then you're just psychology because then you're just psychology because then you're just always disappointing yourself you have always disappointing yourself you have always disappointing yourself you have to be settled with the fact that this is to be settled with the fact that this is to be settled with the fact that this is going to go a long time and suck once going to go a long time and suck once going to go a long time and suck once you come to peace with that maybe you'll you come to peace with that maybe you'll you come to peace with that maybe you'll be pleasantly surprised but you're not be pleasantly surprised but you're not be pleasantly surprised but you're not going to be constantly disappointed so going to be constantly disappointed so going to be constantly disappointed so what was your diet like like what was what was your diet like like what was what was your diet like like what was your eating habits like during that time your eating habits like during that time your eating habits like during that time um like how many meals a day this is um like how many meals a day this is um like how many meals a day this is like what oh man I was trying to eat the what oh man I was trying to eat the thing I was like not trying to the more thing I was like not trying to the more thing I was like not trying to the more the Moose is hanging out there the more the Moose is hanging out there the more the Moose is hanging out there the more the critters every Critter in the forest the critters every Critter in the forest the critters every Critter in the forest is trying to Peck at it or mice trying is trying to Peck at it or mice trying is trying to Peck at it or mice trying to eat it and stuff so so one of the to eat it and stuff so so one of the to eat it and stuff so so one of the ways you can protect the food is by ways you can protect the food is by ways you can protect the food is by eating it so I was having three good eating it so I was having three good eating it so I was having three good meals a day and then I'd like cook up meals a day and then I'd like cook up meals a day and then I'd like cook up some meat and go to sleep and then uh some meat and go to sleep and then uh some meat and go to sleep and then uh wake up in the middle of night because wake up in the middle of night because wake up in the middle of night because they're long nights and like have some they're long nights and like have some they're long nights and like have some meat at night eat a bunch at night and meat at night eat a bunch at night and meat at night eat a bunch at night and then so I usually have a fish fish stew then so I usually have a fish fish stew then so I usually have a fish fish stew for lunch and then mousse for breakfast for lunch and then mousse for breakfast for lunch and then mousse for breakfast and dinner and then have some for a and dinner and then have some for a and dinner and then have some for a nighttime snack cuz the nights were long nighttime snack cuz the nights were long nighttime snack cuz the nights were long so you'd be in bed like 14 hours and so you'd be in bed like 14 hours and so you'd be in bed like 14 hours and wake up and eat and Dink around and go wake up and eat and Dink around and go wake up and eat and Dink around and go back to sleep is it okay that I was back to sleep is it okay that I was back to sleep is it okay that I was pretty low carb situation yeah I pretty low carb situation yeah I pretty low carb situation yeah I actually felt really good I tried to I actually felt really good I tried to I actually felt really good I tried to I tried to I think I would have felt tried to I think I would have felt tried to I think I would have felt better if I would have had a higher better if I would have had a higher better if I would have had a higher percentage of fat because you know it's percentage of fat because you know it's percentage of fat because you know it's still over more protein than if you're still over more protein than if you're still over more protein than if you're on a keto diet you want a lot of fat and on a keto diet you want a lot of fat and on a keto diet you want a lot of fat and so I did I did try to mix in like so I did I did try to mix in like so I did I did try to mix in like Nature's carbs different like reindeer Nature's carbs different like reindeer Nature's carbs different like reindeer Lykan and things like that

Lykan and things like that Lykan and things like that but honestly I felt pretty good on that but honestly I felt pretty good on that but honestly I felt pretty good on that diet we'll see how did you uh what's the diet we'll see how did you uh what's the diet we'll see how did you uh what's the secret to like protecting food what are secret to like protecting food what are secret to like protecting food what are the different ways to prot yeah a lot of the different ways to prot yeah a lot of the different ways to prot yeah a lot of times you know in a typical situation in times you know in a typical situation in times you know in a typical situation in the woods hunting you'll raise it up in the woods hunting you'll raise it up in the woods hunting you'll raise it up in a tree in a bag put it in like a game a tree in a bag put it in like a game a tree in a bag put it in like a game bag so the birds can't Peck at it and bag so the birds can't Peck at it and bag so the birds can't Peck at it and hang it in a tree so it cools you got to hang it in a tree so it cools you got to hang it in a tree so it cools you got to make sure first to cool it because it'll make sure first to cool it because it'll make sure first to cool it because it'll spoil so you cool it by whatever means spoil so you cool it by whatever means spoil so you cool it by whatever means necessary hanging it in a cool place necessary hanging it in a cool place necessary hanging it in a cool place letting the air blow around it um and letting the air blow around it um and letting the air blow around it um and then you'll notice that every Forest then you'll notice that every Forest then you'll notice that every Forest freeloader in the woods is going to come freeloader in the woods is going to come freeloader in the woods is going to come and try to steal your food and and it and try to steal your food and and it and try to steal your food and and it was just fun I mean it was it was crazy was just fun I mean it was it was crazy was just fun I mean it was it was crazy to watch you know like it's all the Jay to watch you know like it's all the Jay to watch you know like it's all the Jay all the camp Jays pecking at it or all the camp Jays pecking at it or all the camp Jays pecking at it or everything I did you know was was uh everything I did you know was was uh everything I did you know was was uh there was something that could get to it there was something that could get to it there was something that could get to it if put on the ground the mice get on it if put on the ground the mice get on it if put on the ground the mice get on it and they poop on it and they kind of and they poop on it and they kind of and they poop on it and they kind of mess it up so I uh ultimately it kind of mess it up so I uh ultimately it kind of mess it up so I uh ultimately it kind of just dawned on me shoot I'm going to just dawned on me shoot I'm going to just dawned on me shoot I'm going to have to build one of those aeni like have to build one of those aeni like have to build one of those aeni like food caches so I did and I put it up food caches so I did and I put it up food caches so I did and I put it up there and I thought I kind of solved my there and I thought I kind of solved my there and I thought I kind of solved my problem to to be honest the venki then problem to to be honest the venki then problem to to be honest the venki then so they would have taken a page out of so they would have taken a page out of so they would have taken a page out of like they would have mixed me and like they would have mixed me and like they would have mixed me and Rolland solution they build a tall stilt Rolland solution they build a tall stilt Rolland solution they build a tall stilt shelter and then put a box on the top shelter and then put a box on the top shelter and then put a box on the top that's enclosed and then the Bears can't that's enclosed and then the Bears can't that's enclosed and then the Bears can't get to it the mice can't poop on it the get to it the mice can't poop on it the get to it the mice can't poop on it the Birds The Wolverine you know it's safe Birds The Wolverine you know it's safe Birds The Wolverine you know it's safe and I never finished it I in in and I never finished it I in in and I never finished it I in in hindsight I don't actually know why I hindsight I don't actually know why I hindsight I don't actually know why I think I was just the way it timed like I think I was just the way it timed like I think I was just the way it timed like I didn't think something was going to get didn't think something was going to get didn't think something was going to get up there then it did and then I you know

up there then it did and then I you know up there then it did and then I you know you're like counting calories and stuff you're like counting calories and stuff you're like counting calories and stuff I should have in hindsight just boxed it I should have in hindsight just boxed it I should have in hindsight just boxed it in right away but to get ready for the in right away but to get ready for the in right away but to get ready for the long for the Long Haul yeah yeah yeah is long for the Long Haul yeah yeah yeah is long for the Long Haul yeah yeah yeah is a rabbit starvation a real thing yeah so a rabbit starvation a real thing yeah so a rabbit starvation a real thing yeah so you can't just live off protein and you can't just live off protein and you can't just live off protein and rabbits are almost protein I'd kill a rabbits are almost protein I'd kill a rabbits are almost protein I'd kill a rabbit eat the inerts and the brain and rabbit eat the inerts and the brain and rabbit eat the inerts and the brain and the eyes and then everything else is the eyes and then everything else is the eyes and then everything else is just protein and so uh it takes more just protein and so uh it takes more just protein and so uh it takes more calories to you know process that calories to you know process that calories to you know process that protein than you're getting from it protein than you're getting from it protein than you're getting from it without the fat so you actually lose I without the fat so you actually lose I without the fat so you actually lose I lost I had you know a lot of rabbits in lost I had you know a lot of rabbits in lost I had you know a lot of rabbits in the first 20 days I had 28 rabbits or the first 20 days I had 28 rabbits or the first 20 days I had 28 rabbits or something but I was losing weight at something but I was losing weight at something but I was losing weight at exactly the same speed as everybody else exactly the same speed as everybody else exactly the same speed as everybody else that didn't have anything so that's that didn't have anything so that's that didn't have anything so that's interesting yeah and i' never tried that interesting yeah and i' never tried that interesting yeah and i' never tried that before so I was wondering if I'm before so I was wondering if I'm before so I was wondering if I'm catching a ton of rabbits I wonder if I catching a ton of rabbits I wonder if I catching a ton of rabbits I wonder if I can last what 6 months on rabbits but no can last what 6 months on rabbits but no can last what 6 months on rabbits but no you just starve as fast as everybody you just starve as fast as everybody you just starve as fast as everybody else and decid to kind of learn that on else and decid to kind of learn that on else and decid to kind of learn that on the Fly and adjust I wonder what to make the Fly and adjust I wonder what to make the Fly and adjust I wonder what to make of that like so you need fat to survive of that like so you need fat to survive of that like so you need fat to survive like fundamental yeah that's the yeah like fundamental yeah that's the yeah like fundamental yeah that's the yeah and you'll notice when the Wolverine and you'll notice when the Wolverine and you'll notice when the Wolverine came or when animals came they would eat came or when animals came they would eat came or when animals came they would eat the skin off of the fish they would eat the skin off of the fish they would eat the skin off of the fish they would eat the eyes you know they' steal the Moose the eyes you know they' steal the Moose the eyes you know they' steal the Moose fat they leave all the meat yeah like fat they leave all the meat yeah like fat they leave all the meat yeah like behind the eyes is a bunch of fat so behind the eyes is a bunch of fat so behind the eyes is a bunch of fat so yeah you can kind of observe nature and yeah you can kind of observe nature and yeah you can kind of observe nature and see what they're eating and know where see what they're eating and know where see what they're eating and know where the gold is what do you like eating when the gold is what do you like eating when the gold is what do you like eating when you're like when you can eat whatever you're like when you can eat whatever you're like when you can eat whatever you want what do you feel best eating you want what do you feel best eating you want what do you feel best eating what do I feel best I just try to eat what do I feel best I just try to eat what do I feel best I just try to eat clean I clean I clean I think I'm not like super stricter on

think I'm not like super stricter on think I'm not like super stricter on anything but I think when I eat less anything but I think when I eat less anything but I think when I eat less carbs I feel better meat and vegetables carbs I feel better meat and vegetables carbs I feel better meat and vegetables I like we eat a lot of you know eat a I like we eat a lot of you know eat a I like we eat a lot of you know eat a lot of meat so basically everything you lot of meat so basically everything you lot of meat so basically everything you ate on a alone plus some veggies plus ate on a alone plus some veggies plus ate on a alone plus some veggies plus veggies throw in some buck I like veggies throw in some buck I like veggies throw in some buck I like Buck let's step to the uh the early days Buck let's step to the uh the early days Buck let's step to the uh the early days of of of Jordan so uh your uh Instagram handle is Jordan so uh your uh Instagram handle is Jordan so uh your uh Instagram handle is hobo jordo so early on in your life you hobo jordo so early on in your life you hobo jordo so early on in your life you uh hobo around the US on freight trains uh hobo around the US on freight trains uh hobo around the US on freight trains what's the story behind that my brother what's the story behind that my brother what's the story behind that my brother when he was 17 or so he just decided to when he was 17 or so he just decided to when he was 17 or so he just decided to go hitchhiking and he hitchhiked down to go hitchhiking and he hitchhiked down to go hitchhiking and he hitchhiked down to Reno from Idaho where we were and uh Reno from Idaho where we were and uh Reno from Idaho where we were and uh ended up loving traveling but hated ended up loving traveling but hated ended up loving traveling but hated being dependent on other people so he being dependent on other people so he being dependent on other people so he ended up jumping on a freight train and ended up jumping on a freight train and ended up jumping on a freight train and and just did it he honestly he pretty and just did it he honestly he pretty and just did it he honestly he pretty much got on a train and traveled the much got on a train and traveled the much got on a train and traveled the country for the next eight years on country for the next eight years on country for the next eight years on trains lived in the streets and trains lived in the streets and trains lived in the streets and everywhere but uh you know he was sober everywhere but uh you know he was sober everywhere but uh you know he was sober so it gives you a different experience so it gives you a different experience so it gives you a different experience than a lot but at one point when I was I than a lot but at one point when I was I than a lot but at one point when I was I guess yeah 18 he invited me to come guess yeah 18 he invited me to come guess yeah 18 he invited me to come along with him he'd probably been doing along with him he'd probably been doing along with him he'd probably been doing it five or so four or five years years it five or so four or five years years it five or so four or five years years and uh or more and uh I said sure So I and uh or more and uh I said sure So I and uh or more and uh I said sure So I quit my job and went out with them um quit my job and went out with them um quit my job and went out with them um hobo jordo's a bit of an over I feel hobo jordo's a bit of an over I feel hobo jordo's a bit of an over I feel self-conscious about that because I rode self-conscious about that because I rode self-conscious about that because I rode AC I rode trains across the country up AC I rode trains across the country up AC I rode trains across the country up and down the coast back you know spent and down the coast back you know spent and down the coast back you know spent the better part of the Year running

the better part of the Year running the better part of the Year running around riding trains and all the staying around riding trains and all the staying around riding trains and all the staying in places related to that but all the in places related to that but all the in places related to that but all the people you know the real hobos those people you know the real hobos those people you know the real hobos those guys are out there doing it for years on guys are out there doing it for years on guys are out there doing it for years on end but it was such a for me what it end but it was such a for me what it end but it was such a for me what it felt like was a it felt like a bit of a felt like was a it felt like a bit of a felt like was a it felt like a bit of a right of passage experience which is right of passage experience which is right of passage experience which is kind of missing I think in Modern Life kind of missing I think in Modern Life kind of missing I think in Modern Life so I did this thing that was a huge so I did this thing that was a huge so I did this thing that was a huge unknown Ben kind of was there with me my unknown Ben kind of was there with me my unknown Ben kind of was there with me my brother for most of it we traveled brother for most of it we traveled brother for most of it we traveled around got pushed my boundaries and around got pushed my boundaries and around got pushed my boundaries and every which way you know froze at night every which way you know froze at night every which way you know froze at night and did all the stuff and then and then and did all the stuff and then and then and did all the stuff and then and then at the end I actually wanted to go back at the end I actually wanted to go back at the end I actually wanted to go back and go back home and so I went on my own and go back home and so I went on my own and go back home and so I went on my own and went from Minneapolis back you know and went from Minneapolis back you know and went from Minneapolis back you know up to Spokan on my own which was a f my up to Spokan on my own which was a f my up to Spokan on my own which was a f my first stint of time by myself for like a first stint of time by myself for like a first stint of time by myself for like a week which was interesting alone with week which was interesting alone with week which was interesting alone with your own Thoughts with your own thoughts your own Thoughts with your own thoughts your own Thoughts with your own thoughts as my first time in my life had been as my first time in my life had been as my first time in my life had been like that you know and so it was it was like that you know and so it was it was like that you know and so it was it was powerful at the time you know what it powerful at the time you know what it powerful at the time you know what it did too is it gave me a whole different did too is it gave me a whole different did too is it gave me a whole different view of life cuz I had gotten a job when view of life cuz I had gotten a job when view of life cuz I had gotten a job when I was 13 and then 14 15 16 17 and then I I was 13 and then 14 15 16 17 and then I I was 13 and then 14 15 16 17 and then I was just in the normal run of things was just in the normal run of things was just in the normal run of things kind of and then that just threw a whole kind of and then that just threw a whole kind of and then that just threw a whole different path into my life and then I different path into my life and then I different path into my life and then I realized some of the things realized some of the things realized some of the things while I was traveling that I wouldn't while I was traveling that I wouldn't while I was traveling that I wouldn't experience again until I was living with experience again until I was living with experience again until I was living with Natives and such and that was you know Natives and such and that was you know Natives and such and that was you know you wake up you don't have a schedule you wake up you don't have a schedule you wake up you don't have a schedule you literally just have needs and you you literally just have needs and you you literally just have needs and you just somehow have to meet your needs and just somehow have to meet your needs and just somehow have to meet your needs and so uh it's it's a there's a really uh so uh it's it's a there's a really uh so uh it's it's a there's a really uh sense of Freedom you get that is hard to sense of Freedom you get that is hard to sense of Freedom you get that is hard to replicate elsewhere and so uh that was

replicate elsewhere and so uh that was replicate elsewhere and so uh that was eye opening to me and I think once I did eye opening to me and I think once I did eye opening to me and I think once I did that I went back so I went back to my that I went back so I went back to my that I went back so I went back to my old job at the salad dressing plant and old job at the salad dressing plant and old job at the salad dressing plant and there's this old crossed guy and he oh there's this old crossed guy and he oh there's this old crossed guy and he oh hobo jordo is back and that's kind of hobo jordo is back and that's kind of hobo jordo is back and that's kind of where I got it but but that freedom where I got it but but that freedom where I got it but but that freedom always was very important to me I think always was very important to me I think always was very important to me I think from that time on what did you learn from that time on what did you learn from that time on what did you learn about the United States about the people about the United States about the people about the United States about the people along the way cuz I took a road trip along the way cuz I took a road trip along the way cuz I took a road trip across the US also and there was a across the US also and there was a across the US also and there was a there's a romantic element there too of there's a romantic element there too of there's a romantic element there too of like of the like of the like of the freedom of freedom of freedom of the well maybe for me not knowing what the well maybe for me not knowing what the well maybe for me not knowing what the hell I'm going to do with my life the hell I'm going to do with my life the hell I'm going to do with my life but also excited by all the but also excited by all the but also excited by all the possibilities and and then you meet a possibilities and and then you meet a possibilities and and then you meet a lot of different people a lot of lot of different people a lot of lot of different people a lot of different kinds of stories and also like different kinds of stories and also like different kinds of stories and also like a lot of people that support you for a lot of people that support you for a lot of people that support you for traveling cuz I go there's a lot of traveling cuz I go there's a lot of traveling cuz I go there's a lot of people kind of dream of experiencing people kind of dream of experiencing people kind of dream of experiencing that freedom at least the people I've that freedom at least the people I've that freedom at least the people I've met and they usually don't they usually met and they usually don't they usually met and they usually don't they usually don't go out outside their little town don't go out outside their little town don't go out outside their little town they they have a thing and they they they they have a thing and they they they they have a thing and they they have a family usually and they they have a family usually and they they have a family usually and they they don't explore they don't take the leap don't explore they don't take the leap don't explore they don't take the leap and you can do that when you're young I and you can do that when you're young I and you can do that when you're young I guess you could do that any moment just guess you could do that any moment just guess you could do that any moment just say fuck it and leap into the the abyss say fuck it and leap into the the abyss say fuck it and leap into the the abyss of being on the road but anyway what did of being on the road but anyway what did of being on the road but anyway what did you learn about this country about the you learn about this country about the you learn about this country about the people in this country you're in an people in this country you're in an people in this country you're in an interesting context when you're on interesting context when you're on interesting context when you're on trains because the trains always end up

trains because the trains always end up trains because the trains always end up in the crappiest part of town you know in the crappiest part of town you know in the crappiest part of town you know and they and you're always outside and they and you're always outside and they and you're always outside interacting well the interesting things interacting well the interesting things interacting well the interesting things we know every once in a while the we know every once in a while the we know every once in a while the hitchhike to get from one place to hitchhike to get from one place to hitchhike to get from one place to another one interesting thing is you another one interesting thing is you another one interesting thing is you notice you always get picked up by the notice you always get picked up by the notice you always get picked up by the you know the poor people or you know you know the poor people or you know you know the poor people or you know they're the people that empathize with they're the people that empathize with they're the people that empathize with you stop pick you up you go to whatever you stop pick you up you go to whatever you stop pick you up you go to whatever ghetto I me you end up in and people are ghetto I me you end up in and people are ghetto I me you end up in and people are really oh what are you guys doing you really oh what are you guys doing you really oh what are you guys doing you real friendly and and and relatable it real friendly and and and relatable it real friendly and and and relatable it kind of you know broaden your my kind of you know broaden your my kind of you know broaden your my horizons for sure from being just Idaho horizons for sure from being just Idaho horizons for sure from being just Idaho kid and then meeting all these different kid and then meeting all these different kid and then meeting all these different people and and just seeing the goodness people and and just seeing the goodness people and and just seeing the goodness in people and this and that it's also in people and this and that it's also in people and this and that it's also very you know a lot of drugs and a lot very you know a lot of drugs and a lot very you know a lot of drugs and a lot of people with mental issues that of people with mental issues that of people with mental issues that you're friends with dealing with you you're friends with dealing with you you're friends with dealing with you know all that kind of stuff so any know all that kind of stuff so any know all that kind of stuff so any memorable characters well there's a few memorable characters well there's a few memorable characters well there's a few for sure I mean a lot of them I still for sure I mean a lot of them I still for sure I mean a lot of them I still know that are still around but the uh know that are still around but the uh know that are still around but the uh Rocco was one guy we traveled he's Rocco was one guy we traveled he's Rocco was one guy we traveled he's become like a brother but he's um he was become like a brother but he's um he was become like a brother but he's um he was he traveled with my my brother for years he traveled with my my brother for years he traveled with my my brother for years cuz they were the two sober guys kind of cuz they were the two sober guys kind of cuz they were the two sober guys kind of he rather than traveling cuz he was he rather than traveling cuz he was he rather than traveling cuz he was hooked on stuff did it to escape all hooked on stuff did it to escape all hooked on stuff did it to escape all that and so he was kind of sober and that and so he was kind of sober and that and so he was kind of sober and straight edge and he always he a 5 seven straight edge and he always he a 5 seven straight edge and he always he a 5 seven Italian guy that was always getting in Italian guy that was always getting in Italian guy that was always getting in fights and he has his own sense of uh fights and he has his own sense of uh fights and he has his own sense of uh ethics that I think is really ethics that I think is really ethics that I think is really interesting because he's super honest

interesting because he's super honest interesting because he's super honest but but he expects it of others and so but but he expects it of others and so but but he expects it of others and so it's funny in the modern context the it's funny in the modern context the it's funny in the modern context the thing that pops in my head is when he thing that pops in my head is when he thing that pops in my head is when he got a car for the first time which got a car for the first time which got a car for the first time which wasn't that long you know he in his 30s wasn't that long you know he in his 30s wasn't that long you know he in his 30s or something uh and he registered it or something uh and he registered it or something uh and he registered it which he was mad about that he had to which he was mad about that he had to which he was mad about that he had to register but then the next year they register but then the next year they register but then the next year they told him he had to register again and told him he had to register again and told him he had to register again and he's like what did you lose my he's like what did you lose my he's like what did you lose my registration went down there to the DMV registration went down there to the DMV registration went down there to the DMV chewed him out that he had to chewed him out that he had to chewed him out that he had to re-register because he already re-register because he already re-register because he already registered where's the paperwork and but registered where's the paperwork and but registered where's the paperwork and but just kind of views the world from a just kind of views the world from a just kind of views the world from a different lens I thought but on different lens I thought but on different lens I thought but on everything he's a character now he just everything he's a character now he just everything he's a character now he just lives by digging up bottles and finding lives by digging up bottles and finding lives by digging up bottles and finding Treasures in the but he uh notices the Treasures in the but he uh notices the Treasures in the but he uh notices the injustices in the world he notices in a injustices in the world he notices in a injustices in the world he notices in a very and speaks up and he's always like very and speaks up and he's always like very and speaks up and he's always like why doesn't everybody else speak up why doesn't everybody else speak up why doesn't everybody else speak up about their car about their car about their car registration and and then there was like registration and and then there was like registration and and then there was like you know dvo comes to mind because he you know dvo comes to mind because he you know dvo comes to mind because he was such a unique character as far as was such a unique character as far as was such a unique character as far as just for one he would have live to be just for one he would have live to be just for one he would have live to be 120 cuz the amount of chemicals and 120 cuz the amount of chemicals and 120 cuz the amount of chemicals and everything else he put into his body and everything else he put into his body and everything else he put into his body and still hey man you know one of those guys still hey man you know one of those guys still hey man you know one of those guys you could always get a dime you know you could always get a dime you know you could always get a dime you know always spare dime spare dime and you bum always spare dime spare dime and you bum always spare dime spare dime and you bum change and uh I change and uh I change and uh I see him sometimes and I'd be gone and see him sometimes and I'd be gone and see him sometimes and I'd be gone and then go to New York to visit my sister then go to New York to visit my sister then go to New York to visit my sister or something and i' sure enough there's or something and i' sure enough there's or something and i' sure enough there's dvo on the street what do you know and dvo on the street what do you know and dvo on the street what do you know and uh you go visit him in the hospital uh you go visit him in the hospital uh you go visit him in the hospital because he got bit by 20 you know 27 because he got bit by 20 you know 27 because he got bit by 20 you know 27 hobo spider bites you know he's just hobo spider bites you know he's just hobo spider bites you know he's just always rough but uh charismatic vital always rough but uh charismatic vital always rough but uh charismatic vital like the Vitality of life was in him but like the Vitality of life was in him but like the Vitality of life was in him but it was just so permeated with drugs and

it was just so permeated with drugs and it was just so permeated with drugs and alcohol too it's kind I wonder what cuz alcohol too it's kind I wonder what cuz alcohol too it's kind I wonder what cuz I've met people like that they're like I've met people like that they're like I've met people like that they're like they're just yeah Joy perme is the whole they're just yeah Joy perme is the whole they're just yeah Joy perme is the whole way of being and they're like they've way of being and they're like they've way of being and they're like they've been through some shit they have scars been through some shit they have scars been through some shit they have scars they' got they rough but they always got they' got they rough but they always got they' got they rough but they always got a big smile there's a guy I met in the a big smile there's a guy I met in the a big smile there's a guy I met in the jungle named Pico he lost the leg and he jungle named Pico he lost the leg and he jungle named Pico he lost the leg and he uh drives a boat and he just always has uh drives a boat and he just always has uh drives a boat and he just always has a big smile even given that like the a big smile even given that like the a big smile even given that like the hardship he has to get everything hardship he has to get everything hardship he has to get everything requires a huge amount of work but he's requires a huge amount of work but he's requires a huge amount of work but he's just big smile and there's stories in just big smile and there's stories in just big smile and there's stories in those eyes there something about yeah those eyes there something about yeah those eyes there something about yeah enduring difficulty that makes you able enduring difficulty that makes you able enduring difficulty that makes you able to appreciate life and look at it and to appreciate life and look at it and to appreciate life and look at it and smile any advice if I were to take a smile any advice if I were to take a smile any advice if I were to take a road trip again or if somebody else is road trip again or if somebody else is road trip again or if somebody else is thinking of hopping out a freight thinking of hopping out a freight thinking of hopping out a freight train way easier now cuz you have a map train way easier now cuz you have a map train way easier now cuz you have a map on your phone you feel you're going on your phone you feel you're going on your phone you feel you're going you're kind of cheating now it's not you're kind of cheating now it's not you're kind of cheating now it's not about the Destin cuz the map is about about the Destin cuz the map is about about the Destin cuz the map is about the destination right uh but here is the destination right uh but here is the destination right uh but here is like you don't give TR where are you like you don't give TR where are you like you don't give TR where are you going you're going anywhere going you're going anywhere going you're going anywhere exactly I say do it like go out and do exactly I say do it like go out and do exactly I say do it like go out and do things especially when you're things especially when you're things especially when you're young experiences and stuff help create young experiences and stuff help create young experiences and stuff help create the person you will be in the future the person you will be in the future the person you will be in the future putting doing things that you think like putting doing things that you think like putting doing things that you think like I don't want to do that I'm a little I don't want to do that I'm a little I don't want to do that I'm a little scared of that I mean that's what you scared of that I mean that's what you scared of that I mean that's what you got to do you just get out of your got to do you just get out of your got to do you just get out of your comfort zone and you will grow as a comfort zone and you will grow as a comfort zone and you will grow as a person and you'll go through a lot of person and you'll go through a lot of person and you'll go through a lot of wild experiences along the wild experiences along the wild experiences along the way say yes to life and that way CS of way say yes to life and that way CS of way say yes to life and that way CS of Life yeah I love the boredom of it Life yeah I love the boredom of it Life yeah I love the boredom of it freight train riding is very freight train riding is very freight train riding is very boring and like you'll wait for hours

boring and like you'll wait for hours boring and like you'll wait for hours for a train that never comes and then for a train that never comes and then for a train that never comes and then you'll go to the store and come back and you'll go to the store and come back and you'll go to the store and come back and it'll be gone you're like No And but I it'll be gone you're like No And but I it'll be gone you're like No And but I remember we went to jail we got out and remember we went to jail we got out and remember we went to jail we got out and then uh how'd you end up in jail oh you then uh how'd you end up in jail oh you then uh how'd you end up in jail oh you know it was thanks trespassing on a know it was thanks trespassing on a know it was thanks trespassing on a train but we were we were riding a train train but we were we were riding a train train but we were we were riding a train and my brother woke up and he had a dead and my brother woke up and he had a dead and my brother woke up and he had a dead H land on his head and hit the train and H land on his head and hit the train and H land on his head and hit the train and fell on him and we like woke up and we fell on him and we like woke up and we fell on him and we like woke up and we were laughing that's got to be some kind were laughing that's got to be some kind were laughing that's got to be some kind of bad of bad of bad Omen and then we were like looking out Omen and then we were like looking out Omen and then we were like looking out of the train and we saw a train worker of the train and we saw a train worker of the train and we saw a train worker look and saw us and he went like oh we look and saw us and he went like oh we look and saw us and he went like oh we know that's a bad omen anyway sure know that's a bad omen anyway sure know that's a bad omen anyway sure enough the Police Stopped the train enough the Police Stopped the train enough the Police Stopped the train somebody had seen us on it and they somebody had seen us on it and they somebody had seen us on it and they searched it got us and threw us in jail searched it got us and threw us in jail searched it got us and threw us in jail it was not a big deal we were in jail a it was not a big deal we were in jail a it was not a big deal we were in jail a couple days and then they uh uh but when couple days and then they uh uh but when couple days and then they uh uh but when we got out of course they put us we were we got out of course they put us we were we got out of course they put us we were in some Podunk town in Indiana and we in some Podunk town in Indiana and we in some Podunk town in Indiana and we didn't know where to catch out of there didn't know where to catch out of there didn't know where to catch out of there and so we were at some Factory and we and so we were at some Factory and we and so we were at some Factory and we just ban in Factory we waited there for just ban in Factory we waited there for just ban in Factory we waited there for like four days no train that was going like four days no train that was going like four days no train that was going slow enough that we could catch and then slow enough that we could catch and then slow enough that we could catch and then we found this big old roll of aluminum we found this big old roll of aluminum we found this big old roll of aluminum foil and out I got to apologize to this foil and out I got to apologize to this foil and out I got to apologize to this woman cuz we were so bored just sitting woman cuz we were so bored just sitting woman cuz we were so bored just sitting there we built these like hats you know there we built these like hats you know there we built these like hats you know like horns coming out every which way like horns coming out every which way like horns coming out every which way and loops and just sitting there and and loops and just sitting there and and loops and just sitting there and then it was at night and some minivan then it was at night and some minivan then it was at night and some minivan pulled up to this train that was going pulled up to this train that was going pulled up to this train that was going by too by too by too like Circle their car entertaining like Circle their car entertaining like Circle their car entertaining yourself with whatever you can poor lady yourself with whatever you can poor lady yourself with whatever you can poor lady was terrified see hitchhiking was tough was terrified see hitchhiking was tough was terrified see hitchhiking was tough I didn't like hitchhiking just cuz I didn't like hitchhiking just cuz I didn't like hitchhiking just cuz you're depending on the other people and

you're depending on the other people and you're depending on the other people and it is not I don't know why you just want it is not I don't know why you just want it is not I don't know why you just want to be independent but you do really cool to be independent but you do really cool to be independent but you do really cool people a lot of times there's really people a lot of times there's really people a lot of times there's really nice people that pick you up and and nice people that pick you up and and nice people that pick you up and and that's cool but I just personally that's cool but I just personally that's cool but I just personally actually didn't do it a lot um and I actually didn't do it a lot um and I actually didn't do it a lot um and I wasn't you know if you're on the streets wasn't you know if you're on the streets wasn't you know if you're on the streets for 10 years you'll end up doing it a for 10 years you'll end up doing it a for 10 years you'll end up doing it a lot more because you need to get from lot more because you need to get from lot more because you need to get from point A to point B but we just tried to point A to point B but we just tried to point A to point B but we just tried to avoid it as much as we could because avoid it as much as we could because avoid it as much as we could because didn't appeal to us as much well that didn't appeal to us as much well that didn't appeal to us as much well that one downside of hitchhiking is people one downside of hitchhiking is people one downside of hitchhiking is people talk a lot oh they do so it's it's both talk a lot oh they do so it's it's both talk a lot oh they do so it's it's both the pro and the con yeah yeah cuz the pro and the con yeah yeah cuz the pro and the con yeah yeah cuz they'll you know sometimes you just want they'll you know sometimes you just want they'll you know sometimes you just want to be sort of alone with your thoughts to be sort of alone with your thoughts to be sort of alone with your thoughts or it's there is a kind of lack of or it's there is a kind of lack of or it's there is a kind of lack of freedom and having to listen to a person freedom and having to listen to a person freedom and having to listen to a person that's giving you a right it's so true that's giving you a right it's so true that's giving you a right it's so true and then you don't know how to react to and then you don't know how to react to and then you don't know how to react to I mean I was young I remember I got I mean I was young I remember I got I mean I was young I remember I got picked up I was probably 19 or something picked up I was probably 19 or something picked up I was probably 19 or something and then I was just like hey how's it and then I was just like hey how's it and then I was just like hey how's it going she's like f my husband just died going she's like f my husband just died going she's like f my husband just died and then yeah then then there all and I and then yeah then then there all and I and then yeah then then there all and I got diagnosed with cancer and this and got diagnosed with cancer and this and got diagnosed with cancer and this and that but and pretty bitter and all that that but and pretty bitter and all that that but and pretty bitter and all that and understandably so but you're just and understandably so but you're just and understandably so but you're just like I have no idea to respond here so like I have no idea to respond here so like I have no idea to respond here so then you're young and you had to be nice then you're young and you had to be nice then you're young and you had to be nice and and I remember that ride being and and I remember that ride being and and I remember that ride being interesting cuz I didn't really know how interesting cuz I didn't really know how interesting cuz I didn't really know how to respond and she was angry and going to respond and she was angry and going to respond and she was angry and going through some stuff and and dumping it through some stuff and and dumping it through some stuff and and dumping it out she didn't have anyone else to dump out she didn't have anyone else to dump out she didn't have anyone else to dump it out on I was like wow I'm going to it out on I was like wow I'm going to it out on I was like wow I'm going to take the freight turn next time so how take the freight turn next time so how take the freight turn next time so how did you end up in did you end up in did you end up in Siberia um uh I'll try to keep it a Siberia um uh I'll try to keep it a Siberia um uh I'll try to keep it a little bit short on that

little bit short on that little bit short on that how but I but the long story short was I how but I but the long story short was I how but I but the long story short was I had a brother that's adopted and when he had a brother that's adopted and when he had a brother that's adopted and when he grew up he wanted to find his biological grew up he wanted to find his biological grew up he wanted to find his biological mom and just tell her thanks and and uh mom and just tell her thanks and and uh mom and just tell her thanks and and uh so he did and when he was he was so he did and when he was he was so he did and when he was he was probably 20 or something he found his probably 20 or something he found his probably 20 or something he found his biological mom told her things turns out biological mom told her things turns out biological mom told her things turns out he had a brother that was going to go he had a brother that was going to go he had a brother that was going to go over to Russia and uh help build this over to Russia and uh help build this over to Russia and uh help build this orphanage and that brother was about my orphanage and that brother was about my orphanage and that brother was about my age I and I remember at that time I I age I and I remember at that time I I age I and I remember at that time I I read this verse that said if you're in read this verse that said if you're in read this verse that said if you're in the darkness and see no light just the darkness and see no light just the darkness and see no light just continue following me basically I was continue following me basically I was continue following me basically I was like okay I'm I'm going to take that to like okay I'm I'm going to take that to like okay I'm I'm going to take that to the bank even though I don't know if the bank even though I don't know if the bank even though I don't know if it's true or not and then the only it's true or not and then the only it's true or not and then the only glimpse of like light I got in all that glimpse of like light I got in all that glimpse of like light I got in all that was when I heard about that orphanage to was when I heard about that orphanage to was when I heard about that orphanage to go build that go build that go build that orphanage and and I prayed about it and orphanage and and I prayed about it and orphanage and and I prayed about it and I felt and I and I can't explain like it I felt and I and I can't explain like it I felt and I and I can't explain like it brought me to tears I felt so strongly brought me to tears I felt so strongly brought me to tears I felt so strongly that I should go and so I was like well that I should go and so I was like well that I should go and so I was like well that's a clear call I'm just going to do that's a clear call I'm just going to do that's a clear call I'm just going to do it yes I just bought a ticket got a Visa it yes I just bought a ticket got a Visa it yes I just bought a ticket got a Visa for a year and then I went and helped for a year and then I went and helped for a year and then I went and helped build an orphanage and we got that built build an orphanage and we got that built build an orphanage and we got that built and I wanted but he was an American and and I wanted but he was an American and and I wanted but he was an American and I wanted to live with Russians to learn I wanted to live with Russians to learn I wanted to live with Russians to learn a language and so he sent me to a a language and so he sent me to a a language and so he sent me to a neighboring Village to live with a neighboring Village to live with a neighboring Village to live with a couple Russian families that needed a couple Russian families that needed a couple Russian families that needed a hand and somebody to watch their kids hand and somebody to watch their kids hand and somebody to watch their kids and cut their hay and milk the cow and and cut their hay and milk the cow and and cut their hay and milk the cow and all that so uh I found myself in that all that so uh I found myself in that all that so uh I found myself in that little Russian village little Russian village little Russian village just getting to know these two guys and just getting to know these two guys and just getting to know these two guys and their families it was a it was pretty

their families it was a it was pretty their families it was a it was pretty fascinating and I of course I didn't fascinating and I of course I didn't fascinating and I of course I didn't know the language yet and they were two know the language yet and they were two know the language yet and they were two awesome dudes both of them had been in awesome dudes both of them had been in awesome dudes both of them had been in prison and met each other in prison and prison and met each other in prison and prison and met each other in prison and like were really close cuz they had like like were really close cuz they had like like were really close cuz they had like found God in prison together and and found God in prison together and and found God in prison together and and stayed to get you got out and uh stayed stayed to get you got out and uh stayed stayed to get you got out and uh stayed connected and uh so I had bounce backs connected and uh so I had bounce backs connected and uh so I had bounce backs between those two families and they used between those two families and they used between those two families and they used to always tell me about their third to always tell me about their third to always tell me about their third buddy they had been in prison with who buddy they had been in prison with who buddy they had been in prison with who was a native fur trapper now in the was a native fur trapper now in the was a native fur trapper now in the north and so they you got to go meet our north and so they you got to go meet our north and so they you got to go meet our buddy up north and uh one day that guy buddy up north and uh one day that guy buddy up north and uh one day that guy came through to sell furs in the city came through to sell furs in the city came through to sell furs in the city and he like invited me to come live with and he like invited me to come live with and he like invited me to come live with him and my Visa was about to expire but him and my Visa was about to expire but him and my Visa was about to expire but I was like when I come back I'll come I was like when I come back I'll come I was like when I come back I'll come and so I uh went back home earned some and so I uh went back home earned some and so I uh went back home earned some more money did some construction or more money did some construction or more money did some construction or whatever then went back and uh headed whatever then went back and uh headed whatever then went back and uh headed north to hang out with Ura and F trap north to hang out with Ura and F trap north to hang out with Ura and F trap and and that started a whole new you and and that started a whole new you and and that started a whole new you know opened a whole new world that I know opened a whole new world that I know opened a whole new world that I didn't know about before we talk about didn't know about before we talk about didn't know about before we talk about your own fur trapping let's actually your own fur trapping let's actually your own fur trapping let's actually rewind and mhm would you describe that rewind and mhm would you describe that rewind and mhm would you describe that moment when you were in the darkness as moment when you were in the darkness as moment when you were in the darkness as a crisis of Faith yeah yeah for sure it a crisis of Faith yeah yeah for sure it a crisis of Faith yeah yeah for sure it was like was like was like a was darkness and that I I I didn't a was darkness and that I I I didn't a was darkness and that I I I didn't know how to know how to know how to parse you know what is this thing that's parse you know what is this thing that's parse you know what is this thing that's my faith and and what and what is what's my faith and and what and what is what's my faith and and what and what is what's the wheat and what's the chaff and how the wheat and what's the chaff and how the wheat and what's the chaff and how do I get through it and do I get through it and do I get through it and um I basically just clung to keeping it

um I basically just clung to keeping it um I basically just clung to keeping it really simple and and oddly enough in my really simple and and oddly enough in my really simple and and oddly enough in my Christian path it that God was actually Christian path it that God was actually Christian path it that God was actually defined in a certain God is love and I defined in a certain God is love and I defined in a certain God is love and I was just like that's the only thing I'm was just like that's the only thing I'm was just like that's the only thing I'm going to cling to you know and I'm going going to cling to you know and I'm going going to cling to you know and I'm going to try to express that in my life in to try to express that in my life in to try to express that in my life in whichever way I can and and just trust whichever way I can and and just trust whichever way I can and and just trust that if I do that if I act like I you that if I do that if I act like I you that if I do that if I act like I you know we've I've heard this lately but if know we've I've heard this lately but if know we've I've heard this lately but if you just act like you you just act like you you just act like you believe over time that world kind of believe over time that world kind of believe over time that world kind of opens to you when I said I would go to opens to you when I said I would go to opens to you when I said I would go to Russia I I pray and I was like Lord I Russia I I pray and I was like Lord I Russia I I pray and I was like Lord I don't see you I don't know but I got don't see you I don't know but I got don't see you I don't know but I got this what I felt like was a clear call I this what I felt like was a clear call I this what I felt like was a clear call I have only one request and that is that have only one request and that is that have only one request and that is that you would give me the faith to match my you would give me the faith to match my you would give me the faith to match my action you know I'm choosing to believe action you know I'm choosing to believe action you know I'm choosing to believe like I could choose not to because you like I could choose not to because you like I could choose not to because you know whatever but uh I'm going to choose know whatever but uh I'm going to choose know whatever but uh I'm going to choose to act and I just ask to have faith to act and I just ask to have faith to act and I just ask to have faith someday and then um and then and someday and then um and then and someday and then um and then and honestly the whole first year I went honestly the whole first year I went honestly the whole first year I went through that was a very crazy time for through that was a very crazy time for through that was a very crazy time for me learning the language being isolated me learning the language being isolated me learning the language being isolated being misunderstood and then but then being misunderstood and then but then being misunderstood and then but then trying to approach all that with a trying to approach all that with a trying to approach all that with a loving open heart and then I came back loving open heart and then I came back loving open heart and then I came back and I realized that that prayer had kind and I realized that that prayer had kind and I realized that that prayer had kind of been answered that wasn't the end of of been answered that wasn't the end of of been answered that wasn't the end of my journey but it was I was like whoa my journey but it was I was like whoa my journey but it was I was like whoa that was like my that was like my that was like my deepest request that I could come up deepest request that I could come up deepest request that I could come up with and somehow that had been answered with and somehow that had been answered with and somehow that had been answered so through that year you were just like so through that year you were just like so through that year you were just like first of all you couldn't speak the first of all you couldn't speak the first of all you couldn't speak the language that's really tough that's language that's really tough that's language that's really tough that's really tough because it's unlike on aone

really tough because it's unlike on aone really tough because it's unlike on aone where because not only can you not speak where because not only can you not speak where because not only can you not speak and you feel isolated but you're also and you feel isolated but you're also and you feel isolated but you're also misunderstood all the time so you seem misunderstood all the time so you seem misunderstood all the time so you seem like an idiot and and all that and so like an idiot and and all that and so like an idiot and and all that and so that was tough I felt very uh alone at that was tough I felt very uh alone at that was tough I felt very uh alone at that time at certain times in that that time at certain times in that that time at certain times in that Journey but you were sort of radiating Journey but you were sort of radiating Journey but you were sort of radiating like you said Leed would love so you like you said Leed would love so you like you said Leed would love so you radiating this kind of camaraderie radiating this kind of camaraderie radiating this kind of camaraderie compassion I was really intentional compassion I was really intentional compassion I was really intentional about trying to about that that was I about trying to about that that was I about trying to about that that was I don't know why I'm here I just know that don't know why I'm here I just know that don't know why I'm here I just know that I you know that that's my call is to I you know that that's my call is to I you know that that's my call is to love one another and so I just try to love one another and so I just try to love one another and so I just try to like and then it meant digging people's like and then it meant digging people's like and then it meant digging people's Wells it might meant just going and Wells it might meant just going and Wells it might meant just going and visiting that old laid babush scup at visiting that old laid babush scup at visiting that old laid babush scup at the house it's lonely or go and that was the house it's lonely or go and that was the house it's lonely or go and that was really cool I got to talk to some really cool I got to talk to some really cool I got to talk to some fascinating ladies and stuff and then fascinating ladies and stuff and then fascinating ladies and stuff and then what go to that Village help those what go to that Village help those what go to that Village help those families I'm going to be like cut the families I'm going to be like cut the families I'm going to be like cut the hay be the most the hardest worker I can hay be the most the hardest worker I can hay be the most the hardest worker I can be because that's my goal here I didn't be because that's my goal here I didn't be because that's my goal here I didn't have any other agenda or anything except have any other agenda or anything except have any other agenda or anything except to try to live a life of love and I to try to live a life of love and I to try to live a life of love and I couldn't Define it beyond that what was couldn't Define it beyond that what was couldn't Define it beyond that what was it like learning the Russian language uh it like learning the Russian language uh it like learning the Russian language uh it was super interesting I think uh I I it was super interesting I think uh I I it was super interesting I think uh I I had the thought while I was learning it had the thought while I was learning it had the thought while I was learning it one that it was way too hard like if I one that it was way too hard like if I one that it was way too hard like if I would have just learned Spanish or would have just learned Spanish or would have just learned Spanish or German I would be so much farther but German I would be so much farther but German I would be so much farther but here I am a year in and I'm like how do here I am a year in and I'm like how do here I am a year in and I'm like how do you say I want cheese you say I want cheese you say I want cheese properly and then but at the same time properly and then but at the same time properly and then but at the same time it was really cool to learn a language it was really cool to learn a language it was really cool to learn a language that uh that I thought in a lot of ways that uh that I thought in a lot of ways that uh that I thought in a lot of ways was richer than English it was it's a

was richer than English it was it's a was richer than English it was it's a very rich language I remember there was very rich language I remember there was very rich language I remember there was a uh comedy act in Russian but he was a uh comedy act in Russian but he was a uh comedy act in Russian but he was saying you know one word you can't have saying you know one word you can't have saying you know one word you can't have in English is Nila meaning like I didn't in English is Nila meaning like I didn't in English is Nila meaning like I didn't drink enough to get drunk to but you drink enough to get drunk to but you drink enough to get drunk to but you know that type thing and but it's just a know that type thing and but it's just a know that type thing and but it's just a you can make up these words using you can make up these words using you can make up these words using different pref you know prefixes and different pref you know prefixes and different pref you know prefixes and suffixes and like blend them in a way suffixes and like blend them in a way suffixes and like blend them in a way that is quite unique and interesting and that is quite unique and interesting and that is quite unique and interesting and honestly would be really good for poetry honestly would be really good for poetry honestly would be really good for poetry because it also doesn't have sentence because it also doesn't have sentence because it also doesn't have sentence structure in the same way English does structure in the same way English does structure in the same way English does the words can be jumbled in a way and the words can be jumbled in a way and the words can be jumbled in a way and somehow in the process of jumbling some somehow in the process of jumbling some somehow in the process of jumbling some humor some some uh musicality comes out humor some some uh musicality comes out humor some some uh musicality comes out it's interesting like you can be witty it's interesting like you can be witty it's interesting like you can be witty in Russian much easier than you can in in Russian much easier than you can in in Russian much easier than you can in English like witty and funny and and English like witty and funny and and English like witty and funny and and also with poetry you can say profound also with poetry you can say profound also with poetry you can say profound things by messing with words and the things by messing with words and the things by messing with words and the Order of Words which is hilarious Order of Words which is hilarious Order of Words which is hilarious because uh you had a great conversation because uh you had a great conversation because uh you had a great conversation with Joe Rogan and on that program you with Joe Rogan and on that program you with Joe Rogan and on that program you talked about you know how to say I I talked about you know how to say I I talked about you know how to say I I love you in russan is hilarious and it love you in russan is hilarious and it love you in russan is hilarious and it was for me the first time I don't know was for me the first time I don't know was for me the first time I don't know why you were a great person to why you were a great person to why you were a great person to articulate the flexibility and the power articulate the flexibility and the power articulate the flexibility and the power of the Russian language that's really of the Russian language that's really of the Russian language that's really cuz you were saying like yeah you could say every single order yeah you could say every single order every single com combination of ordering

every single com combination of ordering every single com combination of ordering of those words is of those words is of those words is has the same has the same has the same meaning but slightly different you could meaning but slightly different you could meaning but slightly different you could like it would change the meaning if you like it would change the meaning if you like it would change the meaning if you took yah out and just said Lu TI yeah took yah out and just said Lu TI yeah took yah out and just said Lu TI yeah there's like a different emphasis or there's like a different emphasis or there's like a different emphasis or maybe or yah TI or something you know maybe or yah TI or something you know maybe or yah TI or something you know like there all these different or just like there all these different or just like there all these different or just TI also right exactly so it is Rich and TI also right exactly so it is Rich and TI also right exactly so it is Rich and that and it was interesting coming from that and it was interesting coming from that and it was interesting coming from an English context and getting a glimpse an English context and getting a glimpse an English context and getting a glimpse of that and then wondering about all of that and then wondering about all of that and then wondering about all those you know Russian authors that we those you know Russian authors that we those you know Russian authors that we all appreciate that oh we actually all appreciate that oh we actually all appreciate that oh we actually aren't getting the full the full deal aren't getting the full the full deal aren't getting the full the full deal here oh yeah definitely I've recently here oh yeah definitely I've recently here oh yeah definitely I've recently become a fan actually of uh Lissa vonsky become a fan actually of uh Lissa vonsky become a fan actually of uh Lissa vonsky and Richard prier they're these world and Richard prier they're these world and Richard prier they're these world famous translators of Russian literature famous translators of Russian literature famous translators of Russian literature tolto DKI Czech of Pushkin bakov uh tolto DKI Czech of Pushkin bakov uh tolto DKI Czech of Pushkin bakov uh Pastak they've helped me understand just Pastak they've helped me understand just Pastak they've helped me understand just how much of an art form translation how much of an art form translation how much of an art form translation really is some authors do that art more really is some authors do that art more really is some authors do that art more translatable than others like theki is translatable than others like theki is translatable than others like theki is more translatable but then you can still more translatable but then you can still more translatable but then you can still spend a week on one sentence oh yeah spend a week on one sentence oh yeah spend a week on one sentence oh yeah like just how do I exactly capture this like just how do I exactly capture this like just how do I exactly capture this very important sentence uh but I think very important sentence uh but I think very important sentence uh but I think what's more powerful is not uh like what's more powerful is not uh like what's more powerful is not uh like literature but conversation which is one literature but conversation which is one literature but conversation which is one of the reasons I've been I've been of the reasons I've been I've been of the reasons I've been I've been carrying and feeling the responsibility carrying and feeling the responsibility carrying and feeling the responsibility of having conversations with Russian of having conversations with Russian of having conversations with Russian speakers um because I can still see the speakers um because I can still see the speakers um because I can still see the music of it I can still see the wit of music of it I can still see the wit of music of it I can still see the wit of it and in conversation comes out like

it and in conversation comes out like it and in conversation comes out like really interesting kinds of wisdom you really interesting kinds of wisdom you really interesting kinds of wisdom you you like you when I listen to like world you like you when I listen to like world you like you when I listen to like world leaders that speak Russian speak and I leaders that speak Russian speak and I leaders that speak Russian speak and I see the see the see the translation and it loses it loses the translation and it loses it loses the translation and it loses it loses the irony the like in between the words if irony the like in between the words if irony the like in between the words if you translate them literally you you you translate them literally you you you translate them literally you you lose the reference in there to the lose the reference in there to the lose the reference in there to the history of the peoples yeah for sure and history of the peoples yeah for sure and history of the peoples yeah for sure and I definitely seen that on like you know I definitely seen that on like you know I definitely seen that on like you know when if you listen to I think it when if you listen to I think it when if you listen to I think it probably was a Putin speech or something probably was a Putin speech or something probably was a Putin speech or something and you just see that oh wow something and you just see that oh wow something and you just see that oh wow something major is being Lost in Translation you major is being Lost in Translation you major is being Lost in Translation you can actually see it happen I wouldn't be can actually see it happen I wouldn't be can actually see it happen I wouldn't be surprised if that wasn't the case with surprised if that wasn't the case with surprised if that wasn't the case with the you know that whole greatest tragedy the you know that whole greatest tragedy the you know that whole greatest tragedy is the fall of the Soviet Union that I is the fall of the Soviet Union that I is the fall of the Soviet Union that I hear him being quoted as saying all the hear him being quoted as saying all the hear him being quoted as saying all the time I bet you there's something in time I bet you there's something in time I bet you there's something in there that's being Lost in Translation there that's being Lost in Translation there that's being Lost in Translation that is interesting I think the thing I that is interesting I think the thing I that is interesting I think the thing I see the most Lost in Translation is the see the most Lost in Translation is the see the most Lost in Translation is the humor mhm I'll just say that that was humor mhm I'll just say that that was humor mhm I'll just say that that was the hard that was the tangibly the the hard that was the tangibly the the hard that was the tangibly the hardest part about learning the language hardest part about learning the language hardest part about learning the language is that humor comes last and you have to is that humor comes last and you have to is that humor comes last and you have to like wait you have to wait that whole like wait you have to wait that whole like wait you have to wait that whole year you know or however long it takes year you know or however long it takes year you know or however long it takes you to learn the language to be able to you to learn the language to be able to you to learn the language to be able to start getting the humor you know some of start getting the humor you know some of start getting the humor you know some of it comes through but you miss so much it comes through but you miss so much it comes through but you miss so much nuance and it and and that was really nuance and it and and that was really nuance and it and and that was really difficult in interaction with people to difficult in interaction with people to difficult in interaction with people to like just be the guys you know when when like just be the guys you know when when like just be the guys you know when when there's humor going on and you're there's humor going on and you're there's humor going on and you're totally oblivious to it yeah everybody's totally oblivious to it yeah everybody's totally oblivious to it yeah everybody's laughing and you're like laughing and you're like laughing and you're like yeah trying to

yeah trying to yeah trying to laugh along what did they make of laugh along what did they make of laugh along what did they make of you to be honest this person that came you to be honest this person that came you to be honest this person that came from no descended upon from no descended upon from no descended upon us all full of love if I had a nickel us all full of love if I had a nickel us all full of love if I had a nickel for every time I heard like oh Americans for every time I heard like oh Americans for every time I heard like oh Americans suck but you're a good American you're suck but you're a good American you're suck but you're a good American you're like the only good American I've ever like the only good American I've ever like the only good American I've ever met but then of course they never met met but then of course they never met met but then of course they never met yeah exactly you're the only one but uh yeah exactly you're the only one but uh yeah exactly you're the only one but uh you know I think because I was just I you know I think because I was just I you know I think because I was just I tried to work hard tried to be more tried to work hard tried to be more tried to work hard tried to be more useful than I was a drain all that they useful than I was a drain all that they useful than I was a drain all that they all I think I think it was pretty all I think I think it was pretty all I think I think it was pretty appreciated me out there I've definitely appreciated me out there I've definitely appreciated me out there I've definitely heard that a lot and so that's nice can heard that a lot and so that's nice can heard that a lot and so that's nice can you talk about their way of you talk about their way of you talk about their way of life so like when when you're doing fur life so like when when you're doing fur life so like when when you're doing fur trapping so fur trapping was an trapping so fur trapping was an trapping so fur trapping was an interesting uh experience you you interesting uh experience you you interesting uh experience you you basically what you do in uh October or basically what you do in uh October or basically what you do in uh October or something you'll go out to your a something you'll go out to your a something you'll go out to your a hunting cabin and you there you'll have hunting cabin and you there you'll have hunting cabin and you there you'll have like three hunting cabins you go stock like three hunting cabins you go stock like three hunting cabins you go stock them with noodles or whatever it is and them with noodles or whatever it is and them with noodles or whatever it is and then for the next couple months or then for the next couple months or then for the next couple months or however long you'll go from one cabin however long you'll go from one cabin however long you'll go from one cabin usually the guys are just out there usually the guys are just out there usually the guys are just out there doing this on their own so they'll go doing this on their own so they'll go doing this on their own so they'll go out and they'll uh go from one cabin and out and they'll uh go from one cabin and out and they'll uh go from one cabin and each cabin will have five or six trap each cabin will have five or six trap each cabin will have five or six trap lines going out of it every day it'll lines going out of it every day it'll lines going out of it every day it'll take a half a day to walk to the end of take a half a day to walk to the end of take a half a day to walk to the end of your trap Line open all the traps and a your trap Line open all the traps and a your trap Line open all the traps and a half a day to get back and they'll do half a day to get back and they'll do half a day to get back and they'll do that they'll spend a week at a cabin that they'll spend a week at a cabin that they'll spend a week at a cabin open up all the traps and then it'll open up all the traps and then it'll open up all the traps and then it'll take a day to hike over to the other take a day to hike over to the other take a day to hike over to the other cabin go to that one open up all those cabin go to that one open up all those cabin go to that one open up all those traps and then there and then like 3 traps and then there and then like 3 traps and then there and then like 3 weeks later or so they'll end up back at weeks later or so they'll end up back at weeks later or so they'll end up back at the first cabin and then check all the

the first cabin and then check all the the first cabin and then check all the traps and so it's kind of that Rhythm traps and so it's kind of that Rhythm traps and so it's kind of that Rhythm and they'll do that for uh you know a and they'll do that for uh you know a and they'll do that for uh you know a couple few months during the winter and couple few months during the winter and couple few months during the winter and you're trapping Sable they're called you're trapping Sable they're called you're trapping Sable they're called Sable like Pine Martin is what we would Sable like Pine Martin is what we would Sable like Pine Martin is what we would have the equivalent of over here and uh have the equivalent of over here and uh have the equivalent of over here and uh what is it what it's like a weasel a what is it what it's like a weasel a what is it what it's like a weasel a furry little weasel and they make coats furry little weasel and they make coats furry little weasel and they make coats out of it and so when I went he showed out of it and so when I went he showed out of it and so when I went he showed me how to open a trap show me the ropes me how to open a trap show me the ropes me how to open a trap show me the ropes gave me a topographical map there's one gave me a topographical map there's one gave me a topographical map there's one cabin there's the other and we Ed ways cabin there's the other and we Ed ways cabin there's the other and we Ed ways for like five weeks we did run into each for like five weeks we did run into each for like five weeks we did run into each other once in the middle there uh at a other once in the middle there uh at a other once in the middle there uh at a cabin but other than that you you're cabin but other than that you you're cabin but other than that you you're just off by yourself hoping to shoot a just off by yourself hoping to shoot a just off by yourself hoping to shoot a grouse or something to add to your grouse or something to add to your grouse or something to add to your noodles and make your meal better catch noodles and make your meal better catch noodles and make your meal better catch a fish and then working really hard a fish and then working really hard a fish and then working really hard trying not to get lost and stuff how do trying not to get lost and stuff how do trying not to get lost and stuff how do you get from one trapping location to you get from one trapping location to you get from one trapping location to the next that's funny CU like it was the next that's funny CU like it was the next that's funny CU like it was both basically by landmarks and feel both basically by landmarks and feel both basically by landmarks and feel like I didn't have compass and things like I didn't have compass and things like I didn't have compass and things like that so by feel like that so by feel like that so by feel okay I got myself into trouble once and okay I got myself into trouble once and okay I got myself into trouble once and I the first time I went to one cabin I I the first time I went to one cabin I I the first time I went to one cabin I got myself into trouble first time I got myself into trouble first time I got myself into trouble first time I went to the other cabin I nailed it and went to the other cabin I nailed it and went to the other cabin I nailed it and so I had two different experiences on my so I had two different experiences on my so I had two different experiences on my first trip but the the one that I nailed first trip but the the one that I nailed first trip but the the one that I nailed it I remember I had to go and it's like it I remember I had to go and it's like it I remember I had to go and it's like a Day hike I was like well I know the a Day hike I was like well I know the a Day hike I was like well I know the cabin's South and so if I just walk cabin's South and so if I just walk cabin's South and so if I just walk south you know the left the sun should south you know the left the sun should south you know the left the sun should be on the left in the morning and right be on the left in the morning and right be on the left in the morning and right in front of me in the middle of the day in front of me in the middle of the day in front of me in the middle of the day and by evening it should like end up at and by evening it should like end up at and by evening it should like end up at my right and just kind of guess what my right and just kind of guess what my right and just kind of guess what time it is and and follow along and and

time it is and and follow along and and time it is and and follow along and and it you know it takes all day and kid you it you know it takes all day and kid you it you know it takes all day and kid you not ended up like 100 yards from the not ended up like 100 yards from the not ended up like 100 yards from the cabin I was like whoa this is the trail cabin I was like whoa this is the trail cabin I was like whoa this is the trail and that's the cabin like oh amazing and and that's the cabin like oh amazing and and that's the cabin like oh amazing and then the other time I went out and uh I then the other time I went out and uh I then the other time I went out and uh I heading over the mountains and I thought heading over the mountains and I thought heading over the mountains and I thought you know hours had passed I probably had you know hours had passed I probably had you know hours had passed I probably had gotten slightly lost and then uh I gotten slightly lost and then uh I gotten slightly lost and then uh I thought I was halfway there so I thought thought I was halfway there so I thought thought I was halfway there so I thought okay I'm going to sit down and cook some okay I'm going to sit down and cook some okay I'm going to sit down and cook some cook some food get a drink I'm I'm cook some food get a drink I'm I'm cook some food get a drink I'm I'm thirsty so I sat down and uh went to thirsty so I sat down and uh went to thirsty so I sat down and uh went to start a fire and my matches had gotten start a fire and my matches had gotten start a fire and my matches had gotten all wet because the snow had fallen on all wet because the snow had fallen on all wet because the snow had fallen on me and soaked me and I didn't have them me and soaked me and I didn't have them me and soaked me and I didn't have them wrapped in plastic I was like oh no I wrapped in plastic I was like oh no I wrapped in plastic I was like oh no I can't drink water you know so I was like can't drink water you know so I was like can't drink water you know so I was like well I'm just going to power through I'm well I'm just going to power through I'm well I'm just going to power through I'm halfway there well I kept hiking and halfway there well I kept hiking and halfway there well I kept hiking and then I realized it was getting night and then I realized it was getting night and then I realized it was getting night and uh and then I realized I was at the uh and then I realized I was at the uh and then I realized I was at the halfway point cuz I saw this rock that I halfway point cuz I saw this rock that I halfway point cuz I saw this rock that I was like oh no that's the halfway point was like oh no that's the halfway point was like oh no that's the halfway point I was like I can't do this and so I need I was like I can't do this and so I need I was like I can't do this and so I need to go get water I ended up having to to go get water I ended up having to to go get water I ended up having to divert down the mountain and head to the divert down the mountain and head to the divert down the mountain and head to the water I ended up you know it was a whole water I ended up you know it was a whole water I ended up you know it was a whole ordeal I had to take my skis off cuz I ordeal I had to take my skis off cuz I ordeal I had to take my skis off cuz I was going through an old forest fire was going through an old forest fire was going through an old forest fire burn so they were all really close trees burn so they were all really close trees burn so they were all really close trees but then the snow was like this deep so but then the snow was like this deep so but then the snow was like this deep so I was just trudging through and just I was just trudging through and just I was just trudging through and just wishing a bear would eat me get it over wishing a bear would eat me get it over wishing a bear would eat me get it over with but I finally made it down to the with but I finally made it down to the with but I finally made it down to the water chopped the hole through the ice water chopped the hole through the ice water chopped the hole through the ice was able to take a sip so you severely was able to take a sip so you severely was able to take a sip so you severely dehydrated severely dehydrated and dehydrated severely dehydrated and dehydrated severely dehydrated and exhausted exhausted cold like you know exhausted exhausted cold like you know exhausted exhausted cold like you know you feel sort of nervous you're in over you feel sort of nervous you're in over you feel sort of nervous you're in over your head and then and then I got down your head and then and then I got down your head and then and then I got down to the river chopped the whole nice to the river chopped the whole nice to the river chopped the whole nice drink it hiked up the river and drink it hiked up the river and drink it hiked up the river and eventually got to the other cabin it was

eventually got to the other cabin it was eventually got to the other cabin it was probably 3: in the morning or something probably 3: in the morning or something probably 3: in the morning or something he chopped a hole in the ice to drink to he chopped a hole in the ice to drink to he chopped a hole in the ice to drink to get some water yeah this got to be like get some water yeah this got to be like get some water yeah this got to be like the one of the worst days of your the one of the worst days of your the one of the worst days of your life you know it was a bad day for sure life you know it was a bad day for sure life you know it was a bad day for sure had had had of it was a bad day and it here's what of it was a bad day and it here's what of it was a bad day and it here's what was funny is I got to the cabin at like was funny is I got to the cabin at like was funny is I got to the cabin at like 3 in the morning and I should have 3 in the morning and I should have 3 in the morning and I should have brushed over a lot of like the misery brushed over a lot of like the misery brushed over a lot of like the misery that I felt and I that I felt and I that I felt and I laid down I was about to go to sleep and laid down I was about to go to sleep and laid down I was about to go to sleep and then Europe charges in from from the then Europe charges in from from the then Europe charges in from from the other way I was like whoa dude you're other way I was like whoa dude you're other way I was like whoa dude you're what are you doing and I was like how's what are you doing and I was like how's what are you doing and I was like how's it going he's oh it sucks and he laid it going he's oh it sucks and he laid it going he's oh it sucks and he laid down and just fell asleep I fell asleep down and just fell asleep I fell asleep down and just fell asleep I fell asleep and I was like oh that's funny the last and I was like oh that's funny the last and I was like oh that's funny the last few weeks that we've been apart who few weeks that we've been apart who few weeks that we've been apart who knows what he went through who knows why knows what he went through who knows why knows what he went through who knows why he was there at that time at night all he was there at that time at night all he was there at that time at night all just summarized and it sucked and we just summarized and it sucked and we just summarized and it sucked and we went to sleep and the next morning we went to sleep and the next morning we went to sleep and the next morning we parted waves and who knows what happened parted waves and who knows what happened parted waves and who knows what happened and you didn't really tell them never and you didn't really tell them never and you didn't really tell them never knew neither of us said what happened knew neither of us said what happened knew neither of us said what happened just like that's just like that's just like that's interesting yeah and he probably was interesting yeah and he probably was interesting yeah and he probably was through similar kinds of things who through similar kinds of things who through similar kinds of things who knows yeah like what what gave you knows yeah like what what gave you knows yeah like what what gave you strength in those in those hours when strength in those in those hours when strength in those in those hours when you're you know going to waste High snow you're you know going to waste High snow you're you know going to waste High snow all of that you're all of that you're all of that you're laughing but like that's hard yeah you laughing but like that's hard yeah you laughing but like that's hard yeah you know that Russian phrase know that Russian phrase know that Russian phrase GL eyes are afraid hands do I'm sure GL eyes are afraid hands do I'm sure GL eyes are afraid hands do I'm sure there a poetic way to try there a poetic way to try there a poetic way to try right it's kind of like you know just right it's kind of like you know just right it's kind of like you know just put one foot in front of the other you put one foot in front of the other you put one foot in front of the other you know when you think about what you have know when you think about what you have know when you think about what you have to do it's really intimidating and but

to do it's really intimidating and but to do it's really intimidating and but you just know if I just do it if I just you just know if I just do it if I just you just know if I just do it if I just do it if I just keep trudging eventually do it if I just keep trudging eventually do it if I just keep trudging eventually I'll get there and pretty soon you I'll get there and pretty soon you I'll get there and pretty soon you realize you I've covered a couple realize you I've covered a couple realize you I've covered a couple kilometers or right um and so when kilometers or right um and so when kilometers or right um and so when you're really in it in those moments I you're really in it in those moments I you're really in it in those moments I guess you're just you're just putting guess you're just you're just putting guess you're just you're just putting your head down and getting through I've your head down and getting through I've your head down and getting through I've had similar moments there's wisdom to had similar moments there's wisdom to had similar moments there's wisdom to that mhm like once just take it one step that mhm like once just take it one step that mhm like once just take it one step at a time one step at a time I think at a time one step at a time I think at a time one step at a time I think that a lot honestly I tell myself that a that a lot honestly I tell myself that a that a lot honestly I tell myself that a lot when when I'm about to do something lot when when I'm about to do something lot when when I'm about to do something really hard just you know glovi dealer really hard just you know glovi dealer really hard just you know glovi dealer one step at a time just going to get one step at a time just going to get one step at a time just going to get don't like sit there and think oh that's don't like sit there and think oh that's don't like sit there and think oh that's a long ways yeah just go and then you a long ways yeah just go and then you a long ways yeah just go and then you look back and you covered a bunch of look back and you covered a bunch of look back and you covered a bunch of ground one of the things I realized was ground one of the things I realized was ground one of the things I realized was helpful in the jungle that was one of helpful in the jungle that was one of helpful in the jungle that was one of the biggest realizations for the biggest realizations for the biggest realizations for me is like it really sucks right me is like it really sucks right me is like it really sucks right now but when I look back at the end of now but when I look back at the end of now but when I look back at the end of the the the day I won't really remember day I won't really remember day I won't really remember exactly how much it sucked I I have a exactly how much it sucked I I have a exactly how much it sucked I I have a vague notion of it sucking and I'll vague notion of it sucking and I'll vague notion of it sucking and I'll remember the good thing so being remember the good thing so being remember the good thing so being dehydrated I'll remember drinking water dehydrated I'll remember drinking water dehydrated I'll remember drinking water and I won't really remember the hours of and I won't really remember the hours of and I won't really remember the hours of feeling like shit that's absolutely true feeling like shit that's absolutely true feeling like shit that's absolutely true like tot it's so funny how like just like tot it's so funny how like just like tot it's so funny how like just awareness of that having been through it awareness of that having been through it awareness of that having been through it and then being aware of it means next and then being aware of it means next and then being aware of it means next time you face it you be like you know time you face it you be like you know time you face it you be like you know what once this is over I'm going to look what once this is over I'm going to look what once this is over I'm going to look back on it and it's going to be like back on it and it's going to be like back on it and it's going to be like that and nothing and I'll actually laugh that and nothing and I'll actually laugh that and nothing and I'll actually laugh about it and think it was it's thing about it and think it was it's thing about it and think it was it's thing I'll remember you know I remember that I'll remember you know I remember that I'll remember you know I remember that story of that miserable day going down story of that miserable day going down story of that miserable day going down to the ice and I can smile about it now to the ice and I can smile about it now to the ice and I can smile about it now and now that I know that I can be in a

and now that I know that I can be in a and now that I know that I can be in a miserable position and realize that miserable position and realize that miserable position and realize that that's what the outcome will be once I'm that's what the outcome will be once I'm that's what the outcome will be once I'm once it's over it's just going to be a once it's over it's just going to be a once it's over it's just going to be a story if you survive though if you story if you survive though if you story if you survive though if you survive and that can survive and that can survive and that can be uh so you mentioned you've learned be uh so you mentioned you've learned be uh so you mentioned you've learned about Hunger during these times like about Hunger during these times like about Hunger during these times like when was like the hungriest you've when was like the hungriest you've when was like the hungriest you've gotten to it was the first time so to gotten to it was the first time so to gotten to it was the first time so to continue the story slightly I Le went continue the story slightly I Le went continue the story slightly I Le went for trapping with that guy and then it for trapping with that guy and then it for trapping with that guy and then it turned out all his cousins were these turned out all his cousins were these turned out all his cousins were these native nomadic reindeer herders and native nomadic reindeer herders and native nomadic reindeer herders and after I like earned his trust and he after I like earned his trust and he after I like earned his trust and he liked me a lot he he took me out to his liked me a lot he he took me out to his liked me a lot he he took me out to his cousins who were all these you know cousins who were all these you know cousins who were all these you know Nomads living in tepes I was like this Nomads living in tepes I was like this Nomads living in tepes I was like this is awesome I didn't even know people is awesome I didn't even know people is awesome I didn't even know people still lived like this and they were still lived like this and they were still lived like this and they were really open and welcoming cuz their really open and welcoming cuz their really open and welcoming cuz their cousin just brought me out there you cousin just brought me out there you cousin just brought me out there you know and vouched for me but it was know and vouched for me but it was know and vouched for me but it was during fencing season and fencing in during fencing season and fencing in during fencing season and fencing in Siberia for those reindeers like an Siberia for those reindeers like an Siberia for those reindeers like an incredible thing you take an axe you go incredible thing you take an axe you go incredible thing you take an axe you go out and you just build these 30 out and you just build these 30 out and you just build these 30 kilometer Loop fences with just logs kilometer Loop fences with just logs kilometer Loop fences with just logs interlocking it's tons of work and all interlocking it's tons of work and all interlocking it's tons of work and all these guys are more efficient bodies these guys are more efficient bodies these guys are more efficient bodies they're better at it and I'm just like they're better at it and I'm just like they're better at it and I'm just like working less efficiently and also a lot working less efficiently and also a lot working less efficiently and also a lot bigger dude but we're all just on the bigger dude but we're all just on the bigger dude but we're all just on the same rations kind of and and and I got same rations kind of and and and I got same rations kind of and and and I got down that was like 155 pounds you know down that was like 155 pounds you know down that was like 155 pounds you know getting down pretty dang skinny for my getting down pretty dang skinny for my getting down pretty dang skinny for my 63 frame and just working really hard 63 frame and just working really hard 63 frame and just working really hard and it's in the spring in Siberia and it's in the spring in Siberia and it's in the spring in Siberia there's no like there's not much to there's no like there's not much to there's no like there's not much to forage you know in the fall you can have forage you know in the fall you can have forage you know in the fall you can have pine nuts and this and that but in the pine nuts and this and that but in the pine nuts and this and that but in the spring you're just stuck with whatever spring you're just stuck with whatever spring you're just stuck with whatever random food you've got and so that

random food you've got and so that random food you've got and so that that's where I lost the most weight and that's where I lost the most weight and that's where I lost the most weight and felt the most hungry and had a lot of felt the most hungry and had a lot of felt the most hungry and had a lot of other issues you know I was new to that other issues you know I was new to that other issues you know I was new to that type of work and so working as hard as I type of work and so working as hard as I type of work and so working as hard as I could but also making mistakes chopping could but also making mistakes chopping could but also making mistakes chopping myself with the ax and and getting myself with the ax and and getting myself with the ax and and getting injured all kinds of stuff you know so injured all kinds of stuff you know so injured all kinds of stuff you know so so injuries Plus very low calorie intake so injuries Plus very low calorie intake so injuries Plus very low calorie intake low Y and exhausted I remember if you low Y and exhausted I remember if you low Y and exhausted I remember if you got you were the poor son of a gun to got you were the poor son of a gun to got you were the poor son of a gun to get stuck slicing the bread you know get stuck slicing the bread you know get stuck slicing the bread you know like you're here cutting the bread and like you're here cutting the bread and like you're here cutting the bread and somebody throws all the spoons and drops somebody throws all the spoons and drops somebody throws all the spoons and drops the pot of soup there and it's like the pot of soup there and it's like the pot of soup there and it's like before you can even done slicing your before you can even done slicing your before you can even done slicing your slice all the meats like gone from the slice all the meats like gone from the slice all the meats like gone from the bowl everybody else has grabbed the bowl everybody else has grabbed the bowl everybody else has grabbed the spoon in midair and and you're like a spoon in midair and and you're like a spoon in midair and and you're like a hoping this one little noodle is going hoping this one little noodle is going hoping this one little noodle is going to give me a lot of nourishment wow so everybody gets I mean nourishment wow so everybody gets I mean yeah that first come for a serve I guess yeah that first come for a serve I guess yeah that first come for a serve I guess cuz it's like all the dudes out there cuz it's like all the dudes out there cuz it's like all the dudes out there working on the fence so you mentioned working on the fence so you mentioned working on the fence so you mentioned the axe and you gave me a present this the axe and you gave me a present this the axe and you gave me a present this is a probably the most badass present is a probably the most badass present is a probably the most badass present I've ever gotten uh so tell me the story I've ever gotten uh so tell me the story I've ever gotten uh so tell me the story of this of this ax so the natives when I of this of this ax so the natives when I of this of this ax so the natives when I got there I thought you know I grew up got there I thought you know I grew up got there I thought you know I grew up on a farm I thought I was pretty good on a farm I thought I was pretty good on a farm I thought I was pretty good with an axe but they do tons of work with an axe but they do tons of work with an axe but they do tons of work with those things and um and I really with those things and um and I really with those things and um and I really grew to love their type of Axe their grew to love their type of Axe their grew to love their type of Axe their style of Axe and just an ax General style of Axe and just an ax General style of Axe and just an ax General they'd always say it's the one tool you they'd always say it's the one tool you they'd always say it's the one tool you need to survive in the wilderness and need to survive in the wilderness and need to survive in the wilderness and and I agree and uh this one has certain and I agree and uh this one has certain and I agree and uh this one has certain yeah design features that the natives uh yeah design features that the natives uh yeah design features that the natives uh that was unique to the aeni to the

that was unique to the aeni to the that was unique to the aeni to the natives I was with one is with these natives I was with one is with these natives I was with one is with these Russian heads or the Soviet heads Russian heads or the Soviet heads Russian heads or the Soviet heads whatever they had they're a little wider whatever they had they're a little wider whatever they had they're a little wider on top here meaning you can put the on top here meaning you can put the on top here meaning you can put the handle through from the top like a handle through from the top like a handle through from the top like a tomahawk and it uh that means you're not tomahawk and it uh that means you're not tomahawk and it uh that means you're not dealing with a wedge and if it ever dealing with a wedge and if it ever dealing with a wedge and if it ever loosens and you're swinging it only gets loosens and you're swinging it only gets loosens and you're swinging it only gets tighter it doesn't fly off and so that's tighter it doesn't fly off and so that's tighter it doesn't fly off and so that's something that's kind of cool um then something that's kind of cool um then something that's kind of cool um then they have what's what they do that's they have what's what they do that's they have what's what they do that's unique is so you can see this is the unique is so you can see this is the unique is so you can see this is the Wolverine ax so it's got the little Wolverine ax so it's got the little Wolverine ax so it's got the little Wolverine head in honor of the Wolverine Wolverine head in honor of the Wolverine Wolverine head in honor of the Wolverine I fought on the show so you have I fought on the show so you have I fought on the show so you have actually two axes this is one of the actually two axes this is one of the actually two axes this is one of the small this is a little smaller I didn't small this is a little smaller I didn't small this is a little smaller I didn't want to make it too small because you want to make it too small because you want to make it too small because you need a something to actually work out need a something to actually work out need a something to actually work out there you need something kind of serious there you need something kind of serious there you need something kind of serious um but then they sharpen it from one um but then they sharpen it from one um but then they sharpen it from one side so if you're right-handed you side so if you're right-handed you side so if you're right-handed you sharpen it from the right side and that sharpen it from the right side and that sharpen it from the right side and that means when you're in the woods and means when you're in the woods and means when you're in the woods and living there's a lot of times where living there's a lot of times where living there's a lot of times where you're whether you're making a table or you're whether you're making a table or you're whether you're making a table or a sleigh or an ax handle or whatever a sleigh or an ax handle or whatever a sleigh or an ax handle or whatever you're doing that you're holding the you're doing that you're holding the you're doing that you're holding the wood and doing this work and it makes it wood and doing this work and it makes it wood and doing this work and it makes it really good for that planing the other really good for that planing the other really good for that planing the other thing it is especially in Northern woods thing it is especially in Northern woods thing it is especially in Northern woods all the trees are like this big you know all the trees are like this big you know all the trees are like this big you know you're never cutting down a big giant you're never cutting down a big giant you're never cutting down a big giant tree and so when you swing with a single tree and so when you swing with a single tree and so when you swing with a single sided axe like this sharpen from the one sided axe like this sharpen from the one sided axe like this sharpen from the one side it really with your right hand side it really with your right hand side it really with your right hand swing like this really bites into the swing like this really bites into the swing like this really bites into the wood and gives you a because with that wood and gives you a because with that wood and gives you a because with that if you can picture it that angle is if you can picture it that angle is if you can picture it that angle is going to cause deflection MH and without going to cause deflection MH and without going to cause deflection MH and without that angle on your right-handed swing it that angle on your right-handed swing it that angle on your right-handed swing it just like bites in there like crazy and

just like bites in there like crazy and just like bites in there like crazy and so uh that there's other little Divine so uh that there's other little Divine so uh that there's other little Divine you know the handle is made by some you know the handle is made by some you know the handle is made by some Amish guys in Canada this is all Hand Amish guys in Canada this is all Hand Amish guys in Canada this is all Hand Forged by uh oh it's Hand Forged yeah I Forged by uh oh it's Hand Forged yeah I Forged by uh oh it's Hand Forged yeah I mean yeah it looks and so it's a pretty mean yeah it looks and so it's a pretty mean yeah it looks and so it's a pretty sweet little yeah it's amazing there's sweet little yeah it's amazing there's sweet little yeah it's amazing there's other things you know like i s slly other things you know like i s slly other things you know like i s slly rounded this pole here it's just a rounded this pole here it's just a rounded this pole here it's just a little Nuance cuz when you pound a steak little Nuance cuz when you pound a steak little Nuance cuz when you pound a steak in if you picture it if it's if it's in if you picture it if it's if it's in if you picture it if it's if it's convex when you're pounding it it's convex when you're pounding it it's convex when you're pounding it it's going to blow the fibers apart if it has going to blow the fibers apart if it has going to blow the fibers apart if it has just a slight concave it helps hold the just a slight concave it helps hold the just a slight concave it helps hold the fibers together and so it's a little fibers together and so it's a little fibers together and so it's a little nuanced not too flat because you want to nuanced not too flat because you want to nuanced not too flat because you want to still be able to use the back as you still be able to use the back as you still be able to use the back as you would what kind of stuff are you using would what kind of stuff are you using would what kind of stuff are you using the axe for oh so the axe is super the axe for oh so the axe is super the axe for oh so the axe is super important to chop through ice in a important to chop through ice in a important to chop through ice in a winter situation which you probably winter situation which you probably winter situation which you probably hopefully won't hopefully won't hopefully won't need but what I use an axe all the time need but what I use an axe all the time need but what I use an axe all the time for is when I'm when it's wet and rainy for is when I'm when it's wet and rainy for is when I'm when it's wet and rainy and you need to start a fire like it's and you need to start a fire like it's and you need to start a fire like it's it's hard to get to the middle of it's hard to get to the middle of it's hard to get to the middle of drywood if just a knife or a saw and so drywood if just a knife or a saw and so drywood if just a knife or a saw and so you can I can go out there find a dead you can I can go out there find a dead you can I can go out there find a dead Tall Tree you know dead standing tree Tall Tree you know dead standing tree Tall Tree you know dead standing tree chop it down split it apart split it chop it down split it apart split it chop it down split it apart split it open get to the drywood on the inside open get to the drywood on the inside open get to the drywood on the inside shave it some little curls and have a shave it some little curls and have a shave it some little curls and have a fire going pretty fast and so if I have fire going pretty fast and so if I have fire going pretty fast and so if I have an axe I feel always confident that I an axe I feel always confident that I an axe I feel always confident that I can get a quick fire in whatever weather can get a quick fire in whatever weather can get a quick fire in whatever weather and I wouldn't feel the same without it and I wouldn't feel the same without it and I wouldn't feel the same without it in that regard so that's the main thing in that regard so that's the main thing in that regard so that's the main thing um of course you can use it I use it if um of course you can use it I use it if um of course you can use it I use it if you're taking an animal apart or if you're taking an animal apart or if you're taking an animal apart or if you're uh what you know all kinds of uh

you're uh what you know all kinds of uh you're uh what you know all kinds of uh what else building a shelter T skin and what else building a shelter T skin and what else building a shelter T skin and tee poles or whatever you're doing tee poles or whatever you're doing tee poles or whatever you're doing what's the use of a saw versus an X I what's the use of a saw versus an X I what's the use of a saw versus an X I greatly prefer an axxe a saw though has greatly prefer an axxe a saw though has greatly prefer an axxe a saw though has its value goes up quite a bit when its value goes up quite a bit when its value goes up quite a bit when you're in Hardwoods like when you're in you're in Hardwoods like when you're in you're in Hardwoods like when you're in a hardwood Oaks and Hickory and things a hardwood Oaks and Hickory and things a hardwood Oaks and Hickory and things like that it's they're a lot harder to like that it's they're a lot harder to like that it's they're a lot harder to chop so a saw is pretty nice in those chop so a saw is pretty nice in those chop so a saw is pretty nice in those situations I'd say um in those situations I'd say um in those situations I'd say um in those situations I'd like to have both uh in situations I'd like to have both uh in situations I'd like to have both uh in the Northwoods and in like more the Northwoods and in like more the Northwoods and in like more coniferous forests I don't think there's coniferous forests I don't think there's coniferous forests I don't think there's enough advantages that a saw incurs with enough advantages that a saw incurs with enough advantages that a saw incurs with a good axe now you'll see people with a good axe now you'll see people with a good axe now you'll see people with little like Camp axes and stuff and they little like Camp axes and stuff and they little like Camp axes and stuff and they just don't think they like axes it's just don't think they like axes it's just don't think they like axes it's like well you haven't actually tried to like well you haven't actually tried to like well you haven't actually tried to try a good one first and get good with try a good one first and get good with try a good one first and get good with it the one thing about an axe they're it the one thing about an axe they're it the one thing about an axe they're dangerous so you need to like practice dangerous so you need to like practice dangerous so you need to like practice always control it with two hands make always control it with two hands make always control it with two hands make sure you're not you know where it's sure you're not you know where it's sure you're not you know where it's going to go it doesn't hit you or when going to go it doesn't hit you or when going to go it doesn't hit you or when you're chopping like say you're creating you're chopping like say you're creating you're chopping like say you're creating something that you're not doing it on something that you're not doing it on something that you're not doing it on rocks and stuff so that it's you're rocks and stuff so that it's you're rocks and stuff so that it's you're doing it on top of wood so that when doing it on top of wood so that when doing it on top of wood so that when you're hitting the ground you're not you're hitting the ground you're not you're hitting the ground you're not dulling your axe you know there's you dulling your axe you know there's you dulling your axe you know there's you got to be a little bit thoughtful about got to be a little bit thoughtful about got to be a little bit thoughtful about it have you ever injured yourself in an it have you ever injured yourself in an it have you ever injured yourself in an axe in the early days oh yeah that first axe in the early days oh yeah that first axe in the early days oh yeah that first so i' had gotten a knee surgery uh and so i' had gotten a knee surgery uh and so i' had gotten a knee surgery uh and then about 3 months later had t my AC I then about 3 months later had t my AC I then about 3 months later had t my AC I went over to Russia and I was like well went over to Russia and I was like well went over to Russia and I was like well I got a good knee it's okay and then I got a good knee it's okay and then I got a good knee it's okay and then that's when I was building that fence that's when I was building that fence that's when I was building that fence that first time and uh at one point I that first time and uh at one point I that first time and uh at one point I chopped my rubber boot with my ax cuz it chopped my rubber boot with my ax cuz it chopped my rubber boot with my ax cuz it reflected off and I was new to them and reflected off and I was new to them and reflected off and I was new to them and uh and I was really frustrated because uh and I was really frustrated because uh and I was really frustrated because I'd done it before and uh and the native

I'd done it before and uh and the native I'd done it before and uh and the native guy was like oh you know we got I think guy was like oh you know we got I think guy was like oh you know we got I think there's a boot we left you know La you there's a boot we left you know La you there's a boot we left you know La you know a few years ago we left a boot like know a few years ago we left a boot like know a few years ago we left a boot like 4 kmet that way so we got the reindeer 4 kmet that way so we got the reindeer 4 kmet that way so we got the reindeer took him rode him over sure enough took him rode him over sure enough took him rode him over sure enough there's a stump with a Bo boot upside there's a stump with a Bo boot upside there's a stump with a Bo boot upside down pull it off put it on I was like down pull it off put it on I was like down pull it off put it on I was like sweet I'm back in business went back sweet I'm back in business went back sweet I'm back in business went back couple days later chopped it cut your couple days later chopped it cut your couple days later chopped it cut your foot cut my rubber boot and I was just foot cut my rubber boot and I was just foot cut my rubber boot and I was just like dang it and I was mad enough that I like dang it and I was mad enough that I like dang it and I was mad enough that I just grabbed the axe and swung it up the just grabbed the axe and swung it up the just grabbed the axe and swung it up the tree and it just one-handed and like tree and it just one-handed and like tree and it just one-handed and like deflected off and Bam right into my deflected off and Bam right into my deflected off and Bam right into my KNE and I was like oh I fell down I was KNE and I was like oh I fell down I was KNE and I was like oh I fell down I was like oh my gosh cuz you get your ax like oh my gosh cuz you get your ax like oh my gosh cuz you get your ax really like raiser sharp and then just really like raiser sharp and then just really like raiser sharp and then just swung it into my knee I didn't even want swung it into my knee I didn't even want swung it into my knee I didn't even want to look I was like oh no I looked and it to look I was like oh no I looked and it to look I was like oh no I looked and it wasn't huge wound because it had hit wasn't huge wound because it had hit wasn't huge wound because it had hit right on the bone of my knee but it right on the bone of my knee but it right on the bone of my knee but it split the bone cut a tend in there and I split the bone cut a tend in there and I split the bone cut a tend in there and I was out in the middle of wood so I was out in the middle of wood so I was out in the middle of wood so I literally like I knew I was in shock I literally like I knew I was in shock I literally like I knew I was in shock I I'm just going to go back to tep right I'm just going to go back to tep right I'm just going to go back to tep right now so I like ran back to Tepe laid down now so I like ran back to Tepe laid down now so I like ran back to Tepe laid down and honestly I was stuck there for a few and honestly I was stuck there for a few and honestly I was stuck there for a few days I was in so much pain and my other days I was in so much pain and my other days I was in so much pain and my other knee was bad it was like rough I had to knee was bad it was like rough I had to knee was bad it was like rough I had to I couldn't even I literally couldn't I couldn't even I literally couldn't I couldn't even I literally couldn't even walk at all or move I had to like even walk at all or move I had to like even walk at all or move I had to like there was a plastic bag I had to like there was a plastic bag I had to like there was a plastic bag I had to like poop in it and like roll to the edge of poop in it and like roll to the edge of poop in it and like roll to the edge of the teepee like shove under the M like I the teepee like shove under the M like I the teepee like shove under the M like I could just totally immobilized I guess could just totally immobilized I guess could just totally immobilized I guess that should teach you to not act when that should teach you to not act when that should teach you to not act when you're in a state of frustration or you're in a state of frustration or you're in a state of frustration or anger there you go I mean it's such a anger there you go I mean it's such a anger there you go I mean it's such a lesson too there were so many of those lesson too there were so many of those lesson too there were so many of those and it was always I was always in a and it was always I was always in a and it was always I was always in a little bit over my head but like I said little bit over my head but like I said little bit over my head but like I said you kind of do that enough and you make you kind of do that enough and you make you kind of do that enough and you make a lot of mistakes but every time you

a lot of mistakes but every time you a lot of mistakes but every time you learn I'm like now it's like an learn I'm like now it's like an learn I'm like now it's like an extension of my arm that's not going to extension of my arm that's not going to extension of my arm that's not going to happen because I just know how it works happen because I just know how it works happen because I just know how it works now uh you mentioned wet wood uh how you now uh you mentioned wet wood uh how you now uh you mentioned wet wood uh how you start a fire when everything's around start a fire when everything's around start a fire when everything's around you is wet I mean it depends on your you is wet I mean it depends on your you is wet I mean it depends on your environment but I will say in most of environment but I will say in most of environment but I will say in most of the forest I spend a lot of time in in the forest I spend a lot of time in in the forest I spend a lot of time in in all the Northwoods the best thing you all the Northwoods the best thing you all the Northwoods the best thing you can do is find a dead standing tree so can do is find a dead standing tree so can do is find a dead standing tree so it can be downpouring rain and you chop it can be downpouring rain and you chop it can be downpouring rain and you chop that tree down and then when you when that tree down and then when you when that tree down and then when you when you split it open no matter how much you split it open no matter how much you split it open no matter how much it's been raining it'll be dry on the it's been raining it'll be dry on the it's been raining it'll be dry on the inside so you chop that tree down chop a inside so you chop that tree down chop a inside so you chop that tree down chop a piece you know a foot long piece out and piece you know a foot long piece out and piece you know a foot long piece out and then split that thing open and then then split that thing open and then then split that thing open and then split it again and then you get to that split it again and then you get to that split it again and then you get to that in inner drywood and then you try to do in inner drywood and then you try to do in inner drywood and then you try to do this maybe under a spruce tree or under this maybe under a spruce tree or under this maybe under a spruce tree or under your own body so that it's not getting your own body so that it's not getting your own body so that it's not getting rained on while you're doing it make a rained on while you're doing it make a rained on while you're doing it make a bunch of little curls that'll light bunch of little curls that'll light bunch of little curls that'll light catch a flame or light and then you make catch a flame or light and then you make catch a flame or light and then you make a lot of a a lot more kindling and a lot of a a lot more kindling and a lot of a a lot more kindling and little pieces of drywood than you think little pieces of drywood than you think little pieces of drywood than you think because what'll happen you'll light it because what'll happen you'll light it because what'll happen you'll light it and it'll burn through and it like dang and it'll burn through and it like dang and it'll burn through and it like dang it so just be patient you're going to be it so just be patient you're going to be it so just be patient you're going to be fine you know like and make a nice pile fine you know like and make a nice pile fine you know like and make a nice pile of curls that you can light spark and of curls that you can light spark and of curls that you can light spark and then get a lot of good dry kindling and then get a lot of good dry kindling and then get a lot of good dry kindling and then don't be afraid to just boom boom then don't be afraid to just boom boom then don't be afraid to just boom boom boom pile a bunch of wood on and make a boom pile a bunch of wood on and make a boom pile a bunch of wood on and make a big old fire get warm as fast as you can big old fire get warm as fast as you can big old fire get warm as fast as you can it's amazing how much that of a recharge it's amazing how much that of a recharge it's amazing how much that of a recharge it is when you're cold and wet you can it is when you're cold and wet you can it is when you're cold and wet you can throw relatively wet wood on top of that throw relatively wet wood on top of that throw relatively wet wood on top of that once you get that going yeah then it'll once you get that going yeah then it'll once you get that going yeah then it'll dry as it goes but you need to be able dry as it goes but you need to be able dry as it goes but you need to be able to split open and get all that nice dry

to split open and get all that nice dry to split open and get all that nice dry wood on the inside I saw that you wood on the inside I saw that you wood on the inside I saw that you mentioned that you look for fat wood mentioned that you look for fat wood mentioned that you look for fat wood what's fat wood so on lot of pine trees what's fat wood so on lot of pine trees what's fat wood so on lot of pine trees a place where the tree was injured when a place where the tree was injured when a place where the tree was injured when it was alive it like pumped sap to it it was alive it like pumped sap to it it was alive it like pumped sap to it and then is a good point because I use and then is a good point because I use and then is a good point because I use this a lot um it pumps that tree full of this a lot um it pumps that tree full of this a lot um it pumps that tree full of sap and then years later the tree dies sap and then years later the tree dies sap and then years later the tree dies dries out rots away but that sap infused dries out rots away but that sap infused dries out rots away but that sap infused wood um it's it's like turpentine in wood um it's it's like turpentine in wood um it's it's like turpentine in there you know it's oily and so if it there you know it's oily and so if it there you know it's oily and so if it gets wet it does you can still light it gets wet it does you can still light it gets wet it does you can still light it it repulses water and so if you can find it repulses water and so if you can find it repulses water and so if you can find that in that in that in a rainstorm you can just make a little a rainstorm you can just make a little a rainstorm you can just make a little pile of those shavings get the crappiest pile of those shavings get the crappiest pile of those shavings get the crappiest spark or quickest light and it'll just spark or quickest light and it'll just spark or quickest light and it'll just sit there and and burn like a like a sit there and and burn like a like a sit there and and burn like a like a factory fire starter you know it's factory fire starter you know it's factory fire starter you know it's really really nice so it's good to spot really really nice so it's good to spot really really nice so it's good to spot it's a good thing to keep your eye out it's a good thing to keep your eye out it's a good thing to keep your eye out for yeah it's really fascinating and for yeah it's really fascinating and for yeah it's really fascinating and then you make this thing that's just to then you make this thing that's just to then you make this thing that's just to get the sauna going get the sauna going get the sauna going fast just that was what was that that fast just that was what was that that fast just that was what was that that was oil oh it this used motor oil I had was oil oh it this used motor oil I had was oil oh it this used motor oil I had if you mix it with some sawdust and then if you mix it with some sawdust and then if you mix it with some sawdust and then no's going just like getting like no's going just like getting like no's going just like getting like homemade fatwood I don't know how many homemade fatwood I don't know how many homemade fatwood I don't know how many times I've watched uh happy people uh a times I've watched uh happy people uh a times I've watched uh happy people uh a year in the taiga by w a Herzog you've year in the taiga by w a Herzog you've year in the taiga by w a Herzog you've you've talked about this movie uh where you've talked about this movie uh where you've talked about this movie uh where where is that located relative to where where is that located relative to where where is that located relative to where you were so there's this big river you were so there's this big river you were so there's this big river called the Yen that feeds through the called the Yen that feeds through the called the Yen that feeds through the middle of Russia and there's a bunch of

middle of Russia and there's a bunch of middle of Russia and there's a bunch of tributaries off of it and one of the tributaries off of it and one of the tributaries off of it and one of the tributaries is called the Pam Tusa and I tributaries is called the Pam Tusa and I tributaries is called the Pam Tusa and I was up that River and just a little ways was up that River and just a little ways was up that River and just a little ways North is another river called the Baka North is another river called the Baka North is another river called the Baka and that's where that Village is where and that's where that Village is where and that's where that Village is where they filmed happy people so in Siberian they filmed happy people so in Siberian they filmed happy people so in Siberian terms we're terms we're terms we're neighbors nice similar environment neighbors nice similar environment neighbors nice similar environment similar place the for Trapper that I was similar place the for Trapper that I was similar place the for Trapper that I was with knew the guy you know in the films with knew the guy you know in the films with knew the guy you know in the films what would you say about their way of what would you say about their way of what would you say about their way of life maybe in the way you've experienced life maybe in the way you've experienced life maybe in the way you've experienced it and the way you saw in happy people it and the way you saw in happy people it and the way you saw in happy people there's there's something really really there's there's something really really there's there's something really really powerful about uh spending that much powerful about uh spending that much powerful about uh spending that much time being independent you know time being independent you know time being independent you know depending depending depending on what we talked about a little ear on what we talked about a little ear on what we talked about a little ear about you're putting yourself in these about you're putting yourself in these about you're putting yourself in these situations all the time where you're situations all the time where you're situations all the time where you're uncomfortable where it's hard but then uncomfortable where it's hard but then uncomfortable where it's hard but then you're rising to the occasion you're you're rising to the occasion you're you're rising to the occasion you're making it happen there's nobody when making it happen there's nobody when making it happen there's nobody when you're fur tra in by yourself there's you're fur tra in by yourself there's you're fur tra in by yourself there's nobody else to look at to blame for nobody else to look at to blame for nobody else to look at to blame for anything that goes wrong it's just anything that goes wrong it's just anything that goes wrong it's just yourself that you're reliant on and yourself that you're reliant on and yourself that you're reliant on and and and there's something about the and and there's something about the and and there's something about the natural rhythms that you are in when natural rhythms that you are in when natural rhythms that you are in when you're you're you're when you're that connected to the when you're that connected to the when you're that connected to the natural world that really is does feel natural world that really is does feel natural world that really is does feel like that's what we're designed for and like that's what we're designed for and like that's what we're designed for and so there's a there's a psychological so there's a there's a psychological so there's a there's a psychological benefit you gain from spending that much benefit you gain from spending that much benefit you gain from spending that much time in that realm um and for that time in that realm um and for that time in that realm um and for that reason I think that you know people that reason I think that you know people that reason I think that you know people that are connected to those ways are able to are connected to those ways are able to are connected to those ways are able to tap into a tap into a tap into a particular I noticed it a lot with the particular I noticed it a lot with the particular I noticed it a lot with the natives so if I met the natives in the natives so if I met the natives in the natives so if I met the natives in the village I would think of them as like

village I would think of them as like village I would think of them as like unhappy people like like they drink a unhappy people like like they drink a unhappy people like like they drink a lot they lot they lot they uh always fighting the murder rate is uh always fighting the murder rate is uh always fighting the murder rate is through the roof the suicide ratees through the roof the suicide ratees through the roof the suicide ratees through the roof but if you meet those through the roof but if you meet those through the roof but if you meet those same people how in the woods living that same people how in the woods living that same people how in the woods living that way of life I thought these are happy way of life I thought these are happy way of life I thought these are happy people and it's kind of it's an people and it's kind of it's an people and it's kind of it's an interesting justos to be the same person interesting justos to be the same person interesting justos to be the same person but um but then you know I lived in a but um but then you know I lived in a but um but then you know I lived in a native Village that had the reindeer native Village that had the reindeer native Village that had the reindeer Hing going on around it and everybody Hing going on around it and everybody Hing going on around it and everybody kind of benefited because of that I also kind of benefited because of that I also kind of benefited because of that I also went to a native Village that they went to a native Village that they went to a native Village that they didn't hold those ways anymore and so didn't hold those ways anymore and so didn't hold those ways anymore and so everybody was just in the village life everybody was just in the village life everybody was just in the village life and just felt like a dark place whereas and just felt like a dark place whereas and just felt like a dark place whereas the other native Village it was rough in the other native Village it was rough in the other native Village it was rough in the village because everybody drank all the village because everybody drank all the village because everybody drank all the time but when it had that escape and the time but when it had that escape and the time but when it had that escape and it had that escape valve and then once it had that escape valve and then once it had that escape valve and then once you're out there it was just a whole you're out there it was just a whole you're out there it was just a whole different world and uh it was such an different world and uh it was such an different world and uh it was such an odd jux toos it's funny that the people odd jux toos it's funny that the people odd jux toos it's funny that the people that go that go that go trapping experience that happiness mhm trapping experience that happiness mhm trapping experience that happiness mhm and and and still don't have a self-awareness to still don't have a self-awareness to still don't have a self-awareness to like stop themselves from then drinking like stop themselves from then drinking like stop themselves from then drinking and doing all the dark stuff to go to and doing all the dark stuff to go to and doing all the dark stuff to go to the Village it's it's strange that that the Village it's it's strange that that the Village it's it's strange that that you're not able to you're in it you're you're not able to you're in it you're you're not able to you're in it you're happy but you're not able to sort of happy but you're not able to sort of happy but you're not able to sort of reflect on that the nature of that reflect on that the nature of that reflect on that the nature of that happiness that's it's really weird I've happiness that's it's really weird I've happiness that's it's really weird I've thought about that a lot and I don't I thought about that a lot and I don't I thought about that a lot and I don't I don't know the answer it's like there's don't know the answer it's like there's don't know the answer it's like there's a huge draw to comfort there's a huge a huge draw to comfort there's a huge a huge draw to comfort there's a huge and it's all multifaceted and somewhat and it's all multifaceted and somewhat and it's all multifaceted and somewhat complex because you know you can be out complex because you know you can be out complex because you know you can be out in the woods and have this really cool in the woods and have this really cool in the woods and have this really cool life I will say it's a little bit life I will say it's a little bit life I will say it's a little bit different for men than women because the different for men than women because the different for men than women because the men are living like the dream as far as

men are living like the dream as far as men are living like the dream as far as like what I would like so you're hunting like what I would like so you're hunting like what I would like so you're hunting and fishing and you know managing and fishing and you know managing and fishing and you know managing reindeer and you got these all these reindeer and you got these all these reindeer and you got these all these Adventures so what ends up happening is Adventures so what ends up happening is Adventures so what ends up happening is that a lot more guys than girl young men that a lot more guys than girl young men that a lot more guys than girl young men out there in the woods and so there's a out there in the woods and so there's a out there in the woods and so there's a draw also I think to go to the Village draw also I think to go to the Village draw also I think to go to the Village probably to find a woman and then probably to find a woman and then probably to find a woman and then there's a draw of like technology and there's a draw of like technology and there's a draw of like technology and the new things and I think it but then the new things and I think it but then the new things and I think it but then once they're there honestly alcohol once they're there honestly alcohol once they're there honestly alcohol becomes so overwhelming that everything becomes so overwhelming that everything becomes so overwhelming that everything else kind of just fiddles away and I else kind of just fiddles away and I else kind of just fiddles away and I just but it's funny that that the just but it's funny that that the just but it's funny that that the comfort you find there's a dra of comfort you find there's a dra of comfort you find there's a dra of comfort mhm but once you get to the comfort mhm but once you get to the comfort mhm but once you get to the Comfort once you find the Comfort within Comfort once you find the Comfort within Comfort once you find the Comfort within that comfort you become the Lesser that comfort you become the Lesser that comfort you become the Lesser version of yourself mhm yeah for sure version of yourself mhm yeah for sure version of yourself mhm yeah for sure it's weird what a lesson for us like we it's weird what a lesson for us like we it's weird what a lesson for us like we we need to keep struggling yeah a lot of we need to keep struggling yeah a lot of we need to keep struggling yeah a lot of times you have to force yourself in that times you have to force yourself in that times you have to force yourself in that so like if we took them as an example I so like if we took them as an example I so like if we took them as an example I mean a lot of times you drag this drunk mean a lot of times you drag this drunk mean a lot of times you drag this drunk guy into the woods literally just drag guy into the woods literally just drag guy into the woods literally just drag him into the woods and then he'd sober him into the woods and then he'd sober him into the woods and then he'd sober up and then he was like a month black up and then he was like a month black up and then he was like a month black out drunk and now he's sobered up and out drunk and now he's sobered up and out drunk and now he's sobered up and now boom back into life back into being now boom back into life back into being now boom back into life back into being a knowledgeable um capable person and a knowledgeable um capable person and a knowledgeable um capable person and because comfort so available to us all because comfort so available to us all because comfort so available to us all you almost have to force yourself into you almost have to force yourself into you almost have to force yourself into that situation plan it out okay I'm that situation plan it out okay I'm that situation plan it out okay I'm gonna go I'm gonna go do that thing and gonna go I'm gonna go do that thing and gonna go I'm gonna go do that thing and do that hard thing and then deal with do that hard thing and then deal with do that hard thing and then deal with the consequences when I'm there what do the consequences when I'm there what do the consequences when I'm there what do you learn from that on the nature of you learn from that on the nature of you learn from that on the nature of Happiness what does it take to be happy Happiness what does it take to be happy Happiness what does it take to be happy happiness is interesting because it's happiness is interesting because it's happiness is interesting because it's like it's complex and multi faceted it

like it's complex and multi faceted it like it's complex and multi faceted it includes a lot of things that are out of includes a lot of things that are out of includes a lot of things that are out of your control and a lot of things that your control and a lot of things that your control and a lot of things that are in your control and um and it makes are in your control and um and it makes are in your control and um and it makes it's quite the moving Target in life you it's quite the moving Target in life you it's quite the moving Target in life you know what I mean so yeah uh I one of the know what I mean so yeah uh I one of the know what I mean so yeah uh I one of the things that really impacted me when I things that really impacted me when I things that really impacted me when I was a young man and I read the gulag was a young man and I read the gulag was a young man and I read the gulag archipelago was don't pursue happiness archipelago was don't pursue happiness archipelago was don't pursue happiness because the the ingredients to happiness because the the ingredients to happiness because the the ingredients to happiness can be taken from you outside of your can be taken from you outside of your can be taken from you outside of your control your health your but pursue like control your health your but pursue like control your health your but pursue like a spiritual fullness pursue a spiritual fullness pursue a spiritual fullness pursue um pursue I think he words it Duty and um pursue I think he words it Duty and um pursue I think he words it Duty and then happiness may come alongside or it then happiness may come alongside or it then happiness may come alongside or it may not but so he gave the example that may not but so he gave the example that may not but so he gave the example that I thought was really interesting of in I thought was really interesting of in I thought was really interesting of in the prison camps everybody's trying to the prison camps everybody's trying to the prison camps everybody's trying to survive and they've made that their survive and they've made that their survive and they've made that their ultimate goal I will get through this ultimate goal I will get through this ultimate goal I will get through this and then and they've all basically and then and they've all basically and then and they've all basically turned into animals in pursuit of that turned into animals in pursuit of that turned into animals in pursuit of that goal and like lying and cheating and goal and like lying and cheating and goal and like lying and cheating and stealing and then he was like somehow stealing and then he was like somehow stealing and then he was like somehow the corrupt Orthodox Church produced the corrupt Orthodox Church produced the corrupt Orthodox Church produced these little babushkas who were like these little babushkas who were like these little babushkas who were like candles in the middle of all this candles in the middle of all this candles in the middle of all this Darkness because they did not allow Darkness because they did not allow Darkness because they did not allow their soul to get corrupted and he's their soul to get corrupted and he's their soul to get corrupted and he's like what they did do is they died they like what they did do is they died they like what they did do is they died they all died but they were lights while they all died but they were lights while they all died but they were lights while they were alive and lost their lives but they were alive and lost their lives but they were alive and lost their lives but they didn't lose their souls so for myself didn't lose their souls so for myself didn't lose their souls so for myself that was really powerful to read and that was really powerful to read and that was really powerful to read and realize that the pursuit of happiness realize that the pursuit of happiness realize that the pursuit of happiness wasn't exactly what I wanted to aim at I wasn't exactly what I wanted to aim at I wasn't exactly what I wanted to aim at I wanted to aim at living out my life wanted to aim at living out my life wanted to aim at living out my life according to love like we talked about according to love like we talked about according to love like we talked about earlier trying to be that candle trying earlier trying to be that candle trying earlier trying to be that candle trying to be that candle yeah make that your to be that candle yeah make that your to be that candle yeah make that your ideal and then in doing so is

ideal and then in doing so is ideal and then in doing so is interesting so when I for me personally interesting so when I for me personally interesting so when I for me personally my personal experience of that is I my personal experience of that is I my personal experience of that is I thought when I went to Russia that I thought when I went to Russia that I thought when I went to Russia that I kind of gave up I was like in my 20s I kind of gave up I was like in my 20s I kind of gave up I was like in my 20s I spent my whole 20s living in teps and spent my whole 20s living in teps and spent my whole 20s living in teps and doing all this stuff that I thought I doing all this stuff that I thought I doing all this stuff that I thought I should be getting a job I should be should be getting a job I should be should be getting a job I should be pursuing a career I should get an pursuing a career I should get an pursuing a career I should get an education of some sort like what am I education of some sort like what am I education of some sort like what am I doing for my future but I felt I knew doing for my future but I felt I knew doing for my future but I felt I knew where my purpose was I knew where my where my purpose was I knew where my where my purpose was I knew where my calling was I'm just going to do it and calling was I'm just going to do it and calling was I'm just going to do it and it it sounds glamorous now when I talk it it sounds glamorous now when I talk it it sounds glamorous now when I talk about it but it sucked a lot of the about it but it sucked a lot of the about it but it sucked a lot of the times and there was a lot of times and there was a lot of times and there was a lot of a lot of loneliness a lot of like giving a lot of loneliness a lot of like giving a lot of loneliness a lot of like giving up what I wanted a lot of watching up what I wanted a lot of watching up what I wanted a lot of watching people I cared about you know you put people I cared about you know you put people I cared about you know you put all this effort in and you just see the all this effort in and you just see the all this effort in and you just see the people that you get put all this over people that you get put all this over people that you get put all this over and just die and this and that and then and just die and this and that and then and just die and this and that and then commit it was that happened all the time commit it was that happened all the time commit it was that happened all the time and then the other thing I thought I and then the other thing I thought I and then the other thing I thought I gave up was like a relationship because gave up was like a relationship because gave up was like a relationship because you couldn't uh you know I wasn't going you couldn't uh you know I wasn't going you couldn't uh you know I wasn't going to find a a partner over there and so to find a a partner over there and so to find a a partner over there and so interestingly enough now in life I can interestingly enough now in life I can interestingly enough now in life I can look back and be like who weird those look back and be like who weird those look back and be like who weird those two things I thought I gave up is where two things I thought I gave up is where two things I thought I gave up is where I've been like almost provided for the I've been like almost provided for the I've been like almost provided for the most in life now I have this this career most in life now I have this this career most in life now I have this this career guiding people in the wilderness that I guiding people in the wilderness that I guiding people in the wilderness that I love like I genuinely love it I find love like I genuinely love it I find love like I genuinely love it I find purpose in it I know it's healthy and purpose in it I know it's healthy and purpose in it I know it's healthy and good for people and then I have an good for people and then I have an good for people and then I have an amazing wife and an amazing family like amazing wife and an amazing family like amazing wife and an amazing family like how did that happen but I didn't exactly how did that happen but I didn't exactly how did that happen but I didn't exactly aim at it I like I I consciously in a aim at it I like I I consciously in a aim at it I like I I consciously in a way I mean I hoped it was tangential but way I mean I hoped it was tangential but way I mean I hoped it was tangential but I aimed at something else which was I aimed at something else which was I aimed at something else which was those lessons I kind of got from the those lessons I kind of got from the those lessons I kind of got from the gulag archipelago so you you have uh gulag archipelago so you you have uh gulag archipelago so you you have uh just cuz you if you mentioned Gul

just cuz you if you mentioned Gul just cuz you if you mentioned Gul Capello I got to go there um you have Capello I got to go there um you have Capello I got to go there um you have some suffering in your family some suffering in your family some suffering in your family history uh whether it's the Armenian history uh whether it's the Armenian history uh whether it's the Armenian Assyrian genocide or the Nazi occupation Assyrian genocide or the Nazi occupation Assyrian genocide or the Nazi occupation of of of France uh maybe you could tell the story France uh maybe you could tell the story France uh maybe you could tell the story of that what of that what of that what um this this survival thing it runs in um this this survival thing it runs in um this this survival thing it runs in your blood it seems I love history like your blood it seems I love history like your blood it seems I love history like I find so much richness and knowing what I find so much richness and knowing what I find so much richness and knowing what other people went through and find so other people went through and find so other people went through and find so much perspective in my own place in the much perspective in my own place in the much perspective in my own place in the world um I have the advantage of in my world um I have the advantage of in my world um I have the advantage of in my direct family my grandparents yeah they direct family my grandparents yeah they direct family my grandparents yeah they went through the Armenian Genocide they went through the Armenian Genocide they went through the Armenian Genocide they were Assyrians which was a you know like were Assyrians which was a you know like were Assyrians which was a you know like a Christian minority indigenous people a Christian minority indigenous people a Christian minority indigenous people in the Middle East they lived in in the Middle East they lived in in the Middle East they lived in Northwestern Iran and uh during the Northwestern Iran and uh during the Northwestern Iran and uh during the chaos of World War I you know chaos of World War I you know chaos of World War I you know and the Ottoman Empire was collapsing and the Ottoman Empire was collapsing and the Ottoman Empire was collapsing and had all kinds of issues and it and had all kinds of issues and it and had all kinds of issues and it one of its issues was it had a big one of its issues was it had a big one of its issues was it had a big minority group and it thought it would minority group and it thought it would minority group and it thought it would be a good time to get rid of it and be a good time to get rid of it and be a good time to get rid of it and uh and you know they can justify it in uh and you know they can justify it in uh and you know they can justify it in all the ways you can like there were all the ways you can like there were all the ways you can like there were some people that were rebelling or this some people that were rebelling or this some people that were rebelling or this or that but ultimately it was just a big or that but ultimately it was just a big or that but ultimately it was just a big Collective Collective Collective guilt and extermination policy against guilt and extermination policy against guilt and extermination policy against the Armenians and the Assyrians and the the Armenians and the Assyrians and the the Armenians and the Assyrians and the uh my uh my uh my grandparents my grandma was 13 at the grandparents my grandma was 13 at the grandparents my grandma was 13 at the time and my grandpa was 17 which is time and my grandpa was 17 which is time and my grandpa was 17 which is interesting because that happened almost interesting because that happened almost interesting because that happened almost 100 years ago but our gen just my dad

100 years ago but our gen just my dad 100 years ago but our gen just my dad was born when my mom was my grandma was was born when my mom was my grandma was was born when my mom was my grandma was pretty old so um pretty old so um pretty old so um but my grandmother her dad was taken out but my grandmother her dad was taken out but my grandmother her dad was taken out to be shot you know the Turks were to be shot you know the Turks were to be shot you know the Turks were coming in and rounding up all the men coming in and rounding up all the men coming in and rounding up all the men and they took them out to be shot and and they took them out to be shot and and they took them out to be shot and then they took my grandma and her she then they took my grandma and her she then they took my grandma and her she had seven brothers and sisters and her had seven brothers and sisters and her had seven brothers and sisters and her mom and they like drove her out into the mom and they like drove her out into the mom and they like drove her out into the desert uh basically she her dad got desert uh basically she her dad got desert uh basically she her dad got taken out to be shot so his name was taken out to be shot so his name was taken out to be shot so his name was shaan Yar or whatever took him out they shaan Yar or whatever took him out they shaan Yar or whatever took him out they were all tied up all shot he said a were all tied up all shot he said a were all tied up all shot he said a quick prayer before they shot him but he quick prayer before they shot him but he quick prayer before they shot him but he fell down and he uh found he wasn't hit fell down and he uh found he wasn't hit fell down and he uh found he wasn't hit and usually of course they'd come up and and usually of course they'd come up and and usually of course they'd come up and stab everybody or finish him off but stab everybody or finish him off but stab everybody or finish him off but there was some kind of an alarm and all there was some kind of an alarm and all there was some kind of an alarm and all the soldiers rushed off and he found the soldiers rushed off and he found the soldiers rushed off and he found himself in the bodies and was able to himself in the bodies and was able to himself in the bodies and was able to untie himself they were naked and you untie himself they were naked and you untie himself they were naked and you know hungry and all that and he ran out know hungry and all that and he ran out know hungry and all that and he ran out of there escaped went into a building of there escaped went into a building of there escaped went into a building and found the loaf of bread wrapped in a and found the loaf of bread wrapped in a and found the loaf of bread wrapped in a shirt and was able to escape it fled he shirt and was able to escape it fled he shirt and was able to escape it fled he never saw his family for so to continue never saw his family for so to continue never saw his family for so to continue the story my grandma got the story my grandma got the story my grandma got taken with her with her mother and taken with her with her mother and taken with her with her mother and brothers and sisters and all just they brothers and sisters and all just they brothers and sisters and all just they just drove them into the desert until just drove them into the desert until just drove them into the desert until they died basically and run them around they died basically and run them around they died basically and run them around in circles and this and that and then in circles and this and that and then in circles and this and that and then all the raping and pillaging that all the raping and pillaging that all the raping and pillaging that accompanies it and accompanies it and accompanies it and um uh at one point her mom had the baby um uh at one point her mom had the baby um uh at one point her mom had the baby and the baby died and her mom just and the baby died and her mom just and the baby died and her mom just collapsed and said I just can't go any

collapsed and said I just can't go any collapsed and said I just can't go any further and and my grandma and her further and and my grandma and her further and and my grandma and her sister like picked her up to to we got sister like picked her up to to we got sister like picked her up to to we got to keep going and like picked her up to keep going and like picked her up to keep going and like picked her up they left the baby along with the other they left the baby along with the other they left the baby along with the other everybody else had died it was just the everybody else had died it was just the everybody else had died it was just the three of them left and somehow they three of them left and somehow they three of them left and somehow they bumbled across this British military bumbled across this British military bumbled across this British military camp and were rescued uh the my neither camp and were rescued uh the my neither camp and were rescued uh the my neither of the sister nor my great-grandmother of the sister nor my great-grandmother of the sister nor my great-grandmother ever really covered as far you know ever really covered as far you know ever really covered as far you know recovered from what I understand but my recovered from what I understand but my recovered from what I understand but my Grandma did um at the at the same time Grandma did um at the at the same time Grandma did um at the at the same time in another Village in north in Iran in another Village in north in Iran in another Village in north in Iran there the Turks came in and were burning there the Turks came in and were burning there the Turks came in and were burning down my grandpa's village and they down my grandpa's village and they down my grandpa's village and they caught and my grandpa's dad was in a caught and my grandpa's dad was in a caught and my grandpa's dad was in a wheelchair and he had like some money wheelchair and he had like some money wheelchair and he had like some money belt and he stuffed all his money in it belt and he stuffed all his money in it belt and he stuffed all his money in it and told it gave it to Grandpa and just and told it gave it to Grandpa and just and told it gave it to Grandpa and just told him to run and don't turn back and told him to run and don't turn back and told him to run and don't turn back and they came in the front door as he was they came in the front door as he was they came in the front door as he was running out the back and they uh he running out the back and they uh he running out the back and they uh he never saw his dad again but he said he never saw his dad again but he said he never saw his dad again but he said he turned around and saw the build you know turned around and saw the build you know turned around and saw the build you know the house on fire never knew what the house on fire never knew what the house on fire never knew what happened to his sister she then so he happened to his sister she then so he happened to his sister she then so he was just alone he ran at some point he was just alone he ran at some point he was just alone he ran at some point he uh I can't remember he like lost his uh I can't remember he like lost his uh I can't remember he like lost his money belt like he took his jacket off money belt like he took his jacket off money belt like he took his jacket off forgot it was in something happened um forgot it was in something happened um forgot it was in something happened um anyway so he got he was in a refugee anyway so he got he was in a refugee anyway so he got he was in a refugee camp he ended up getting taken in by camp he ended up getting taken in by camp he ended up getting taken in by some Jesuit missionar so anyway both of some Jesuit missionar so anyway both of some Jesuit missionar so anyway both of them had lost basically everything and them had lost basically everything and them had lost basically everything and then at some point they met in then at some point they met in then at some point they met in Baghdad started a family immigrated to Baghdad started a family immigrated to Baghdad started a family immigrated to France and then it just so happened to France and then it just so happened to France and then it just so happened to be right before World War II and so then be right before World War II and so then be right before World War II and so then the Nazis invaded my aunt she's still

the Nazis invaded my aunt she's still the Nazis invaded my aunt she's still alive but she uh she actually met a alive but she uh she actually met a alive but she uh she actually met a resistance fighter you know for the resistance fighter you know for the resistance fighter you know for the French and under a bridge somewhere and French and under a bridge somewhere and French and under a bridge somewhere and they and they fell in love and she got they and they fell in love and she got they and they fell in love and she got married so she had kind of an inn on the married so she had kind of an inn on the married so she had kind of an inn on the on the French Resistance at one point on the French Resistance at one point on the French Resistance at one point and of course they were all hungry they' and of course they were all hungry they' and of course they were all hungry they' recently immigrated but also had this recently immigrated but also had this recently immigrated but also had this Nazi occupation and all that and so the Nazi occupation and all that and so the Nazi occupation and all that and so the Uncle Joe the resistance fighter guy Uncle Joe the resistance fighter guy Uncle Joe the resistance fighter guy told him like Hey we're gonna storm this told him like Hey we're gonna storm this told him like Hey we're gonna storm this Noodle Factory like come and so they Noodle Factory like come and so they Noodle Factory like come and so they stormed the Noodle Factory and all my stormed the Noodle Factory and all my stormed the Noodle Factory and all my aunts around in there and were like aunts around in there and were like aunts around in there and were like throwing out noodles into wheelbarrows throwing out noodles into wheelbarrows throwing out noodles into wheelbarrows and everybody was running uh then the and everybody was running uh then the and everybody was running uh then the Nazis came back and took it back over Nazis came back and took it back over Nazis came back and took it back over and like shot a bunch of people and and like shot a bunch of people and and like shot a bunch of people and everything and and uh Grandpa because he everything and and uh Grandpa because he everything and and uh Grandpa because he had already come from where he came from had already come from where he came from had already come from where he came from was paranoid so he buried all the was paranoid so he buried all the was paranoid so he buried all the noodles out in the garden and then my noodles out in the garden and then my noodles out in the garden and then my two aunts got stuck in that factory two aunts got stuck in that factory two aunts got stuck in that factory overnight with all the nuts guards or overnight with all the nuts guards or overnight with all the nuts guards or whatever and then the the Nazi guards whatever and then the the Nazi guards whatever and then the the Nazi guards went all from house to house to find went all from house to house to find went all from house to house to find everybody that had had noodles and you everybody that had had noodles and you everybody that had had noodles and you know punish them but they didn't find my know punish them but they didn't find my know punish them but they didn't find my grandpa's fortunately they searched his grandpa's fortunately they searched his grandpa's fortunately they searched his house but not the garden and then uh so house but not the garden and then uh so house but not the garden and then uh so they had noodles and somehow must have they had noodles and somehow must have they had noodles and somehow must have been in the same Factory or something been in the same Factory or something been in the same Factory or something but a olive oil and they just lived off but a olive oil and they just lived off but a olive oil and they just lived off of that for the all the whole War years of that for the all the whole War years of that for the all the whole War years my aunts ended up getting out of the my aunts ended up getting out of the my aunts ended up getting out of the they hid behind boxes and crates they hid behind boxes and crates they hid behind boxes and crates overnight and stuff and the resistance overnight and stuff and the resistance overnight and stuff and the resistance stormed again in the morning and this stormed again in the morning and this stormed again in the morning and this they got away and stuff but anyway chaos they got away and stuff but anyway chaos they got away and stuff but anyway chaos so when they moved to America I will say so when they moved to America I will say so when they moved to America I will say the most patriotic family everywhere the most patriotic family everywhere the most patriotic family everywhere ever they loved it like paradise here I

ever they loved it like paradise here I ever they loved it like paradise here I mean that's a that's a lot to go through mean that's a that's a lot to go through mean that's a that's a lot to go through um what lessons do you do you draw from um what lessons do you do you draw from um what lessons do you do you draw from that on perseverance look I'm one just that on perseverance look I'm one just that on perseverance look I'm one just one generation away from all that one generation away from all that one generation away from all that suffering like my aunts and uncles and suffering like my aunts and uncles and suffering like my aunts and uncles and Dad and stuff were the kids of these Dad and stuff were the kids of these Dad and stuff were the kids of these people and somehow I don't have that people and somehow I don't have that people and somehow I don't have that like what what happened to that trauma like what what happened to that trauma like what what happened to that trauma like I it's like somehow my grandparents like I it's like somehow my grandparents like I it's like somehow my grandparents bore it and then they were able to build bore it and then they were able to build bore it and then they were able to build a family but not just a family that but a family but not just a family that but a family but not just a family that but a happy family like I knew all my aunts a happy family like I knew all my aunts a happy family like I knew all my aunts and uncles and I didn't know them they and uncles and I didn't know them they and uncles and I didn't know them they died before me but um they were it was died before me but um they were it was died before me but um they were it was so much joy the family reunions were the so much joy the family reunions were the so much joy the family reunions were the best thing ever at the Jonas's and they best thing ever at the Jonas's and they best thing ever at the Jonas's and they uh um and it's just like how in one uh um and it's just like how in one uh um and it's just like how in one generation did you go from that to that generation did you go from that to that generation did you go from that to that and and it must have been a great and and it must have been a great and and it must have been a great sacrifice of some sort to not not pass sacrifice of some sort to not not pass sacrifice of some sort to not not pass that much like resentment or like what that much like resentment or like what that much like resentment or like what did they do to to break that chain in did they do to to break that chain in did they do to to break that chain in one generation do you think it works the one generation do you think it works the one generation do you think it works the other way like where their ability to other way like where their ability to other way like where their ability to escape genocide to escape genocide to escape genocide to escape uh Nazi escape uh Nazi escape uh Nazi occupation gave them a gratitude for occupation gave them a gratitude for occupation gave them a gratitude for life it's not a trauma in the sense like life it's not a trauma in the sense like life it's not a trauma in the sense like you're forever bearing it it it the flip you're forever bearing it it it the flip you're forever bearing it it it the flip side of that is just gratitude to be side of that is just gratitude to be side of that is just gratitude to be alive when you know so many people did alive when you know so many people did alive when you know so many people did not survive yeah it must be because the not survive yeah it must be because the not survive yeah it must be because the only footage I saw of my grandma was only footage I saw of my grandma was only footage I saw of my grandma was like they were all the kids and stuff like they were all the kids and stuff like they were all the kids and stuff and they were cooking up a rabbit that and they were cooking up a rabbit that and they were cooking up a rabbit that they were raising or whatever and they they were raising or whatever and they they were raising or whatever and they uh uh but a joyful woman you could see

uh uh but a joyful woman you could see uh uh but a joyful woman you could see it in her and she must have been so she it in her and she must have been so she it in her and she must have been so she must have understood how fortunate she must have understood how fortunate she must have understood how fortunate she was and been so grateful for it and so was and been so grateful for it and so was and been so grateful for it and so thankful for every one of those 11 kids thankful for every one of those 11 kids thankful for every one of those 11 kids she had so I recognized it again in my she had so I recognized it again in my she had so I recognized it again in my in my dad cuz my dad went through a in my dad cuz my dad went through a in my dad cuz my dad went through a really slow kind of painful decline in really slow kind of painful decline in really slow kind of painful decline in his health and he had diabetes ended up his health and he had diabetes ended up his health and he had diabetes ended up losing one leg and so he lost his job he losing one leg and so he lost his job he losing one leg and so he lost his job he had to watch his mom or my mom go to had to watch his mom or my mom go to had to watch his mom or my mom go to school he long all he wanted to do was school he long all he wanted to do was school he long all he wanted to do was be a provider and be like a family man I be a provider and be like a family man I be a provider and be like a family man I bet the best time in his life was when bet the best time in his life was when bet the best time in his life was when his kids ran to him gave him a hug but his kids ran to him gave him a hug but his kids ran to him gave him a hug but then all of a sudden he found himself in then all of a sudden he found himself in then all of a sudden he found himself in a position where he couldn't work and he a position where he couldn't work and he a position where he couldn't work and he had to watch his wife go to school which had to watch his wife go to school which had to watch his wife go to school which is really hard for her and and become is really hard for her and and become is really hard for her and and become the bread winner for the family and he the bread winner for the family and he the bread winner for the family and he just felt like a failure and I watched just felt like a failure and I watched just felt like a failure and I watched him go through that after all these him go through that after all these him go through that after all these years of letting that foot heal we went years of letting that foot heal we went years of letting that foot heal we went out first day and we were splitting out first day and we were splitting out first day and we were splitting firewood with the splitter and he was firewood with the splitter and he was firewood with the splitter and he was just so good to be back out Jordan is so just so good to be back out Jordan is so just so good to be back out Jordan is so nice and he crushed his foot in the log nice and he crushed his foot in the log nice and he crushed his foot in the log splitter and you're like No And so then splitter and you're like No And so then splitter and you're like No And so then they just amputated it we got both legs they just amputated it we got both legs they just amputated it we got both legs amputated and then his health continued amputated and then his health continued amputated and then his health continued to decline he lost his movement in his to decline he lost his movement in his to decline he lost his movement in his hands so he was like incapacitated to a hands so he was like incapacitated to a hands so he was like incapacitated to a degree and in a lot of pain I would hear degree and in a lot of pain I would hear degree and in a lot of pain I would hear him at night in pain all the time and uh him at night in pain all the time and uh him at night in pain all the time and uh I delayed a trip back to R Russia and I delayed a trip back to R Russia and I delayed a trip back to R Russia and just stayed with my dad for those last 6 just stayed with my dad for those last 6 just stayed with my dad for those last 6 months and it was so interesting having months and it was so interesting having months and it was so interesting having had lost everything I've watched him had lost everything I've watched him had lost everything I've watched him wrestle with it through the years but wrestle with it through the years but wrestle with it through the years but then he found his joy and his then he found his joy and his then he found his joy and his purpose just in being almost I mean a

purpose just in being almost I mean a purpose just in being almost I mean a vegetable I'd have to help him pee I'll vegetable I'd have to help him pee I'll vegetable I'd have to help him pee I'll roll him onto the cot take him to roll him onto the cot take him to roll him onto the cot take him to dialysis and and but we would laugh he dialysis and and but we would laugh he dialysis and and but we would laugh he would like I'd hear him at night crying would like I'd hear him at night crying would like I'd hear him at night crying or like in pain like ah and then in the or like in pain like ah and then in the or like in pain like ah and then in the morning he'd have like encouraging words morning he'd have like encouraging words morning he'd have like encouraging words to say and and yes at and I was like wow to say and and yes at and I was like wow to say and and yes at and I was like wow that's how you face loss and suffering that's how you face loss and suffering that's how you face loss and suffering and and he must have gotten that from and and he must have gotten that from and and he must have gotten that from his somehow from his parents and then his somehow from his parents and then his somehow from his parents and then you know I find myself on this show and you know I find myself on this show and you know I find myself on this show and I had a thought like why is this easy to I had a thought like why is this easy to I had a thought like why is this easy to me in a way like you know why is this me in a way like you know why is this me in a way like you know why is this thing that's so and I was like and it thing that's so and I was like and it thing that's so and I was like and it just felt like this gift that had kind just felt like this gift that had kind just felt like this gift that had kind of handed down and now would be my duty of handed down and now would be my duty of handed down and now would be my duty to hand down you know like it's but it's to hand down you know like it's but it's to hand down you know like it's but it's kind of an interesting and be the beacon kind of an interesting and be the beacon kind of an interesting and be the beacon of that represent that kind of of that represent that kind of of that represent that kind of perseverance in perseverance in perseverance in the in the simp way that something like the in the simp way that something like the in the simp way that something like survival in the wilderness shows it's survival in the wilderness shows it's survival in the wilderness shows it's the it's it it it Rhymes it Rhymes and the it's it it it Rhymes it Rhymes and the it's it it it Rhymes it Rhymes and it's so simple like the lessons are it's so simple like the lessons are it's so simple like the lessons are simple and so we can take them and apply simple and so we can take them and apply simple and so we can take them and apply them so that's on the Survivor side what them so that's on the Survivor side what them so that's on the Survivor side what about on the people committing the about on the people committing the about on the people committing the atrocities what do you make of the atrocities what do you make of the atrocities what do you make of the Ottomans what they did to Armenians or Ottomans what they did to Armenians or Ottomans what they did to Armenians or the Nazis what they did to the Jews the the Nazis what they did to the Jews the the Nazis what they did to the Jews the Slavs and basically everyone what what Slavs and basically everyone what what Slavs and basically everyone what what do you uh why do you think people do do you uh why do you think people do do you uh why do you think people do evil in this world evil in this world evil in this world World World World um it's interesting that it's really um it's interesting that it's really um it's interesting that it's really easy right it's really easy you can easy right it's really easy you can easy right it's really easy you can almost see it sense it in yourself to almost see it sense it in yourself to almost see it sense it in yourself to justify justify justify um to justify a little bit of evil or

um to justify a little bit of evil or um to justify a little bit of evil or you see yourself cheer a little bit when you see yourself cheer a little bit when you see yourself cheer a little bit when the enemy gets knocked back in some way the enemy gets knocked back in some way the enemy gets knocked back in some way um it's really in the way it's just um it's really in the way it's just um it's really in the way it's just Perfectly Natural for us to feed that Perfectly Natural for us to feed that Perfectly Natural for us to feed that hate and feed that tribalism in group hate and feed that tribalism in group hate and feed that tribalism in group about group we're on this team um and I about group we're on this team um and I about group we're on this team um and I think that can happen I think it just happens slowly happen I think it just happens slowly like one justification at a time one like one justification at a time one like one justification at a time one step at a time you step at a time you step at a time you uh you hear something and it makes it uh you hear something and it makes it uh you hear something and it makes it makes you think then that you are in the makes you think then that you are in the makes you think then that you are in the right to perform some kind right to perform some kind right to perform some kind of you know you're Justified and create of you know you're Justified and create of you know you're Justified and create you know break a couple eggs to make an you know break a couple eggs to make an you know break a couple eggs to make an omelet type thing and then but all of a omelet type thing and then but all of a omelet type thing and then but all of a sudden that takes you down this whole sudden that takes you down this whole sudden that takes you down this whole train to where pretty soon you're train to where pretty soon you're train to where pretty soon you're justifying what's justifying what's justifying what's completely uh unjustifiable say gradual completely uh unjustifiable say gradual completely uh unjustifiable say gradual yeah it's a gradual process of a little yeah it's a gradual process of a little yeah it's a gradual process of a little bit at a time I think that's why like bit at a time I think that's why like bit at a time I think that's why like for me like having a a path of faith is for me like having a a path of faith is for me like having a a path of faith is like works as like a mooring because it like works as like a mooring because it like works as like a mooring because it can help me shine that light on myself can help me shine that light on myself can help me shine that light on myself you know it's like something out because you know it's like something out because you know it's like something out because if you're just looking at yourself and if you're just looking at yourself and if you're just looking at yourself and looking within yourself for for your looking within yourself for for your looking within yourself for for your compass in life it's really easy to get compass in life it's really easy to get compass in life it's really easy to get that thing out of whack but you kind of that thing out of whack but you kind of that thing out of whack but you kind of need a perspective from which you can need a perspective from which you can need a perspective from which you can step out of yourself and look into step out of yourself and look into step out of yourself and look into yourself and judge yourself accordingly yourself and judge yourself accordingly yourself and judge yourself accordingly and am I walking in line with that ideal and am I walking in line with that ideal and am I walking in line with that ideal you know and then and I think without you know and then and I think without you know and then and I think without that check you're you're subject you that check you're you're subject you that check you're you're subject you know it's easy to ignore the fact that

know it's easy to ignore the fact that know it's easy to ignore the fact that you might be able to commit those things you might be able to commit those things you might be able to commit those things but we live in a pretty easy comfortable but we live in a pretty easy comfortable but we live in a pretty easy comfortable Society like what if you know what if we Society like what if you know what if we Society like what if you know what if we pictured yourself in in the position of pictured yourself in in the position of pictured yourself in in the position of my grandparents and then all of a sudden my grandparents and then all of a sudden my grandparents and then all of a sudden you got the upper hand in some kind of a you got the upper hand in some kind of a you got the upper hand in some kind of a fight what are you going to do you know fight what are you going to do you know fight what are you going to do you know you could you definitely you could you definitely you could you definitely picture picture picture becoming um evil in that situation I becoming um evil in that situation I becoming um evil in that situation I think one think one think one thing faith in God can thing faith in God can thing faith in God can do is humble you before these kinds of do is humble you before these kinds of do is humble you before these kinds of complexities of the world and humility complexities of the world and humility complexities of the world and humility is a way to avoid the slippery slope is a way to avoid the slippery slope is a way to avoid the slippery slope towards evil I think humility that you towards evil I think humility that you towards evil I think humility that you don't know who the good guys and the bad don't know who the good guys and the bad don't know who the good guys and the bad guys are mhm and you defer that to sort guys are mhm and you defer that to sort guys are mhm and you defer that to sort of uh bigger powers to try to understand of uh bigger powers to try to understand of uh bigger powers to try to understand that yeah I I think there's a kind of I that yeah I I think there's a kind of I that yeah I I think there's a kind of I mean a lot of the atrocities were mean a lot of the atrocities were mean a lot of the atrocities were committed by people who are very sure of committed by people who are very sure of committed by people who are very sure of uh themselves being good yeah that's so uh themselves being good yeah that's so uh themselves being good yeah that's so true it is sad that Rel religion is at true it is sad that Rel religion is at true it is sad that Rel religion is at times used mhm as a way to kind of just times used mhm as a way to kind of just times used mhm as a way to kind of just as is yet another tool for justification as is yet another tool for justification as is yet another tool for justification exactly yeah which which is a sad exactly yeah which which is a sad exactly yeah which which is a sad application of uh of religion really is application of uh of religion really is application of uh of religion really is it's so inherent and so natural in us it's so inherent and so natural in us it's so inherent and so natural in us to justify ourselves it's really it's to justify ourselves it's really it's to justify ourselves it's really it's really I mean I think it's almost really I mean I think it's almost really I mean I think it's almost almost uh I mean just understanding

almost uh I mean just understanding almost uh I mean just understanding history you read history it it blows my history you read history it it blows my history you read history it it blows my mind that and I'm super thankful that mind that and I'm super thankful that mind that and I'm super thankful that somehow and this has been miss you so somehow and this has been miss you so somehow and this has been miss you so much but somehow this idea ology arose much but somehow this idea ology arose much but somehow this idea ology arose that love your enemies forgive forgive that love your enemies forgive forgive that love your enemies forgive forgive um those that persecute you uh and just um those that persecute you uh and just um those that persecute you uh and just on down the line that something like on down the line that something like on down the line that something like that Rose in the world into a position that Rose in the world into a position that Rose in the world into a position where we all kind of accept those ideals where we all kind of accept those ideals where we all kind of accept those ideals I think is really remarkable and worth I think is really remarkable and worth I think is really remarkable and worth appreciating that said a lot of that appreciating that said a lot of that appreciating that said a lot of that gets wrapped up in what you're talk you gets wrapped up in what you're talk you gets wrapped up in what you're talk you know what is so natural just becomes know what is so natural just becomes know what is so natural just becomes another instrument for another instrument for another instrument for tribalism or another justification for tribalism or another justification for tribalism or another justification for wrong and so I even myself am wrong and so I even myself am wrong and so I even myself am self-conscious sometimes talking about self-conscious sometimes talking about self-conscious sometimes talking about matters of Faith because I know when I'm matters of Faith because I know when I'm matters of Faith because I know when I'm talking about I'm talking about talking about I'm talking about talking about I'm talking about something else other than you know there something else other than you know there something else other than you know there everybody than what someone else might everybody than what someone else might everybody than what someone else might think of when they hear me talking about think of when they hear me talking about think of when they hear me talking about it so it's interesting yeah I've been it so it's interesting yeah I've been it so it's interesting yeah I've been listening to uh Jordan pet Peterson talk listening to uh Jordan pet Peterson talk listening to uh Jordan pet Peterson talk about this he has a way of articulating about this he has a way of articulating about this he has a way of articulating things which is sometimes hard to things which is sometimes hard to things which is sometimes hard to understand in the moment but when I like understand in the moment but when I like understand in the moment but when I like read it carefully afterwards it starts read it carefully afterwards it starts read it carefully afterwards it starts to make more sense I've heard him talk to make more sense I've heard him talk to make more sense I've heard him talk about religion and God as a a kind of about religion and God as a a kind of about religion and God as a a kind of base layer like a metaphorical substrate base layer like a metaphorical substrate base layer like a metaphorical substrate from which morality of our sense of what from which morality of our sense of what from which morality of our sense of what is right and wrong comes from and just is right and wrong comes from and just is right and wrong comes from and just our conceptions of what is beautiful in our conceptions of what is beautiful in our conceptions of what is beautiful in life all these kinds of higher things life all these kinds of higher things life all these kinds of higher things that are like

that are like that are like fuzzy understand that their religion fuzzy understand that their religion fuzzy understand that their religion helps create the substrate from which we helps create the substrate from which we helps create the substrate from which we as a species like as a civilization can as a species like as a civilization can as a species like as a civilization can come up with these Notions and without come up with these Notions and without come up with these Notions and without it you are lost at sea I guess for him it you are lost at sea I guess for him it you are lost at sea I guess for him morality requires that substrate like morality requires that substrate like morality requires that substrate like you said it's kind of fuzzy so I I've you said it's kind of fuzzy so I I've you said it's kind of fuzzy so I I've only been able to get Clear Vision of it only been able to get Clear Vision of it only been able to get Clear Vision of it when I live it it's not something you when I live it it's not something you when I live it it's not something you profess or anything like that just it's profess or anything like that just it's profess or anything like that just it's something that you take seriously and something that you take seriously and something that you take seriously and apply in your life and when you live it apply in your life and when you live it apply in your life and when you live it then there's some clarity there but that then there's some clarity there but that then there's some clarity there but that it has to be kind of defined like it it has to be kind of defined like it it has to be kind of defined like it it's like it's and that's where you come it's like it's and that's where you come it's like it's and that's where you come in with the religion and the stories in with the religion and the stories in with the religion and the stories because if you leave it completely because if you leave it completely because if you leave it completely undefined I don't know really know where undefined I don't know really know where undefined I don't know really know where you go from there I actually the funny you go from there I actually the funny you go from there I actually the funny to speak to that I did mushroom have you to speak to that I did mushroom have you to speak to that I did mushroom have you ever done those before mushrooms yeah uh ever done those before mushrooms yeah uh ever done those before mushrooms yeah uh I've done them a couple times but one I've done them a couple times but one I've done them a couple times but one time was didn't do that many the other time was didn't do that many the other time was didn't do that many the other time more and I had a I had a really time more and I had a I had a really time more and I had a I had a really profound experience in helping profound experience in helping profound experience in helping couch all this in in a proper context couch all this in in a proper context couch all this in in a proper context for myself so I could I when I did it I for myself so I could I when I did it I for myself so I could I when I did it I remember I was sitting on a swing and I remember I was sitting on a swing and I remember I was sitting on a swing and I could see my everything was so Blissful could see my everything was so Blissful could see my everything was so Blissful except I could see my black hands like except I could see my black hands like except I could see my black hands like on these chains like on the swing but on these chains like on the swing but on these chains like on the swing but everything else was Blissful and kind of everything else was Blissful and kind of everything else was Blissful and kind of amorphous and I could see the outline of amorphous and I could see the outline of amorphous and I could see the outline of my kids and I could just feel the love my kids and I could just feel the love my kids and I could just feel the love for them and I was just like man I just for them and I was just like man I just for them and I was just like man I just feel the love it's so wonderful why you

feel the love it's so wonderful why you feel the love it's so wonderful why you know but then I would you know at times know but then I would you know at times know but then I would you know at times I would try to picture them and I I would try to picture them and I I would try to picture them and I couldn't quite picture the kids but I couldn't quite picture the kids but I couldn't quite picture the kids but I could feel the love and then um and then could feel the love and then um and then could feel the love and then um and then I started asking all the deepest in I started asking all the deepest in I started asking all the deepest in existential questions I could you know existential questions I could you know existential questions I could you know and it felt like I was just one answer and it felt like I was just one answer and it felt like I was just one answer another answer another answer everything another answer another answer everything another answer another answer everything was being answered and I felt like I was was being answered and I felt like I was was being answered and I felt like I was communing with God whatever you want to communing with God whatever you want to communing with God whatever you want to say and but I was very aware of the fact say and but I was very aware of the fact say and but I was very aware of the fact that that communing was just peeling that that communing was just peeling that that communing was just peeling back the tiniest corner of the infinite back the tiniest corner of the infinite back the tiniest corner of the infinite and it just dumped me with every answer and it just dumped me with every answer and it just dumped me with every answer I felt like I could have and it kind of I felt like I could have and it kind of I felt like I could have and it kind of blew me away so then I asked it well if blew me away so then I asked it well if blew me away so then I asked it well if you're the infinite like why did you you're the infinite like why did you you're the infinite like why did you reveal to me yourself why did use like reveal to me yourself why did use like reveal to me yourself why did use like the story of Jesus to Reve reveal the story of Jesus to Reve reveal the story of Jesus to Reve reveal yourself and and yourself and and yourself and and then that then that then that infinite um Amorphis thing had to infinite um Amorphis thing had to infinite um Amorphis thing had to somehow take form for us to like for us somehow take form for us to like for us somehow take form for us to like for us to be able to relate to it it had to to be able to relate to it it had to to be able to relate to it it had to have some kind of a form and but have some kind of a form and but have some kind of a form and but whenever you create a form out of whenever you create a form out of whenever you create a form out of something you're like boxing it in and something you're like boxing it in and something you're like boxing it in and subjugating it to boundaries and stuff subjugating it to boundaries and stuff subjugating it to boundaries and stuff like that and then that subject to pain like that and then that subject to pain like that and then that subject to pain and subject to the Brokenness and all and subject to the Brokenness and all and subject to the Brokenness and all that and I was like oh wow and then but that and I was like oh wow and then but that and I was like oh wow and then but when I that thought then all of a sudden when I that thought then all of a sudden when I that thought then all of a sudden I I could relate my like dark hands on I I could relate my like dark hands on I I could relate my like dark hands on the chains to the rest of the experience the chains to the rest of the experience the chains to the rest of the experience and then all of a sudden I could picture and then all of a sudden I could picture and then all of a sudden I could picture my children as the children rather than my children as the children rather than my children as the children rather than this amorphous feeling of love it was this amorphous feeling of love it was this amorphous feeling of love it was like oh there's aana Al and and but but like oh there's aana Al and and but but like oh there's aana Al and and but but then they were bounded and then once then they were bounded and then once then they were bounded and then once they're bounded you're subject to the they're bounded you're subject to the they're bounded you're subject to the death and to the misunderstanding and to

death and to the misunderstanding and to death and to the misunderstanding and to the all that and like you know I picture the all that and like you know I picture the all that and like you know I picture the amoeba that or the cell and then the amoeba that or the cell and then the amoeba that or the cell and then when it dies it it turns into a when it dies it it turns into a when it dies it it turns into a unformed thing and uh so we need some unformed thing and uh so we need some unformed thing and uh so we need some kind of form to relate to so instead of kind of form to relate to so instead of kind of form to relate to so instead of always just talking about God completely always just talking about God completely always just talking about God completely intangibly it kind of gave me a way to intangibly it kind of gave me a way to intangibly it kind of gave me a way to relate to it and I was like oh wow relate to it and I was like oh wow relate to it and I was like oh wow that's that was really powerful to me in that's that was really powerful to me in that's that was really powerful to me in in putting it in a context that in putting it in a context that in putting it in a context that was was was applicable But applicable But applicable But ultimately God is sort of the thing ultimately God is sort of the thing ultimately God is sort of the thing that's formless that is unbounded right that's formless that is unbounded right that's formless that is unbounded right we humans we humans we humans need I mean that's the the the purpose need I mean that's the the the purpose need I mean that's the the the purpose of stories they resonate with something of stories they resonate with something of stories they resonate with something in us but when you need the sort of the in us but when you need the sort of the in us but when you need the sort of the bounded nature the constraints of those bounded nature the constraints of those bounded nature the constraints of those stories mhm otherwise we wouldn't be stories mhm otherwise we wouldn't be stories mhm otherwise we wouldn't be able to like can't relate to it can't able to like can't relate to it can't able to like can't relate to it can't relate to it yeah yeah and and then when relate to it yeah yeah and and then when relate to it yeah yeah and and then when you look at the stories literally or you you look at the stories literally or you you look at the stories literally or you just look at them just as they are it just look at them just as they are it just look at them just as they are it seems um silly mhm just too simplistic seems um silly mhm just too simplistic seems um silly mhm just too simplistic right right and then that was always you right right and then that was always you right right and then that was always you know all my a lot of my family and loved know all my a lot of my family and loved know all my a lot of my family and loved ones and friends have completely left ones and friends have completely left ones and friends have completely left the faith but and I totally in the way I the faith but and I totally in the way I the faith but and I totally in the way I get it like I understand but I also get it like I understand but I also get it like I understand but I also really see the baby that's being thrown really see the baby that's being thrown really see the baby that's being thrown out with the bath water and I want to out with the bath water and I want to out with the bath water and I want to cherish that in a way I guess and it's cherish that in a way I guess and it's cherish that in a way I guess and it's interesting that you say that the way to interesting that you say that the way to interesting that you say that the way to know what's right and wrong is uh you know what's right and wrong is uh you know what's right and wrong is uh you have to live it sometimes it's it's

have to live it sometimes it's it's have to live it sometimes it's it's probably very difficult to articulate probably very difficult to articulate probably very difficult to articulate but mhm in in the living of it do you but mhm in in the living of it do you but mhm in in the living of it do you realize it yeah and that I'm glad you realize it yeah and that I'm glad you realize it yeah and that I'm glad you say that because that's I found a lot of say that because that's I found a lot of say that because that's I found a lot of comfort in that because I feel somewhat comfort in that because I feel somewhat comfort in that because I feel somewhat inarticulate a lot of the times and inarticulate a lot of the times and inarticulate a lot of the times and unable to articulate my thoughts unable to articulate my thoughts unable to articulate my thoughts especially on these matters and then you especially on these matters and then you especially on these matters and then you just think it's I just have to but I do just think it's I just have to but I do just think it's I just have to but I do have to I can live it I can try to live have to I can live it I can try to live have to I can live it I can try to live it you know and then what I also am it you know and then what I also am it you know and then what I also am struck with right away is I can't struck with right away is I can't struck with right away is I can't because you can't love everybody you because you can't love everybody you because you can't love everybody you can't love your enemies and you can't um can't love your enemies and you can't um can't love your enemies and you can't um but as placing that in front of you as but as placing that in front of you as but as placing that in front of you as the ideal is so important to put like a the ideal is so important to put like a the ideal is so important to put like a a check on your human instincts on your a check on your human instincts on your a check on your human instincts on your tribalism on your uh I mean you can very tribalism on your uh I mean you can very tribalism on your uh I mean you can very quickly like we talking about with evil quickly like we talking about with evil quickly like we talking about with evil you know it can really quickly take its you know it can really quickly take its you know it can really quickly take its place in your life almost you almost place in your life almost you almost place in your life almost you almost won't observe it happening you know but won't observe it happening you know but won't observe it happening you know but uh and so I so much appreciate all the uh and so I so much appreciate all the uh and so I so much appreciate all the the me striving and that's where you the me striving and that's where you the me striving and that's where you know I grew up in a Christian family so know I grew up in a Christian family so know I grew up in a Christian family so I had these like cliches that I didn't I had these like cliches that I didn't I had these like cliches that I didn't really understand like a relationship really understand like a relationship really understand like a relationship with God like what does that mean but with God like what does that mean but with God like what does that mean but then I realized when I struggled with then I realized when I struggled with then I realized when I struggled with trying with taking I actually did try to trying with taking I actually did try to trying with taking I actually did try to take it seriously and struggle with what take it seriously and struggle with what take it seriously and struggle with what does it mean to live out a life of love does it mean to live out a life of love does it mean to live out a life of love in the world but that's like a wrestling in the world but that's like a wrestling in the world but that's like a wrestling match because it's not that simple it match because it's not that simple it match because it's not that simple it doesn't sound it sounds good but it's doesn't sound it sounds good but it's doesn't sound it sounds good but it's really hard to do and then you realize really hard to do and then you realize really hard to do and then you realize you can't do it perfectly but but in you can't do it perfectly but but in you can't do it perfectly but but in that struggle in that wrestling match is

that struggle in that wrestling match is that struggle in that wrestling match is where I actually sense that relationship where I actually sense that relationship where I actually sense that relationship and then it's and that's where it kind and then it's and that's where it kind and then it's and that's where it kind of gains life and how that really and of gains life and how that really and of gains life and how that really and that I'm sure that relates to what that I'm sure that relates to what that I'm sure that relates to what Jordan Peterson is you know getting at Jordan Peterson is you know getting at Jordan Peterson is you know getting at in his in his metaphor um yeah in this in his in his metaphor um yeah in this in his in his metaphor um yeah in this in the striving right of the in the striving right of the in the striving right of the ideal uh in the striving towards the ideal uh in the striving towards the ideal uh in the striving towards the ideal you ideal you ideal you discover the how to be a better person discover the how to be a better person discover the how to be a better person one thing I noticed really tangibly on one thing I noticed really tangibly on one thing I noticed really tangibly on alone was that because I had have so alone was that because I had have so alone was that because I had have so many people that were close to me kind many people that were close to me kind many people that were close to me kind of just leave it all together I was I of just leave it all together I was I of just leave it all together I was I could do that like I actually understand could do that like I actually understand could do that like I actually understand why they do or I could not you know I do why they do or I could not you know I do why they do or I could not you know I do have a choice and so I had to choose at have a choice and so I had to choose at have a choice and so I had to choose at that point that point that point to to maintain that ideal and because I to to maintain that ideal and because I to to maintain that ideal and because I could add enough time on aone one nice could add enough time on aone one nice could add enough time on aone one nice thing is you don't have any distractions thing is you don't have any distractions thing is you don't have any distractions you have all the time in the world to go you have all the time in the world to go you have all the time in the world to go into your head and uh I could play those into your head and uh I could play those into your head and uh I could play those paths out in my life and not only in my paths out in my life and not only in my paths out in my life and not only in my life but I feel like societally and for life but I feel like societally and for life but I feel like societally and for and generationally like he throw it all and generationally like he throw it all and generationally like he throw it all away and everybody's start from square away and everybody's start from square away and everybody's start from square one or we can try to you know redeem one or we can try to you know redeem one or we can try to you know redeem what's valuable in this and wrestle with what's valuable in this and wrestle with what's valuable in this and wrestle with it and strug and so I I just I chose it and strug and so I I just I chose it and strug and so I I just I chose that path well I do think it's a it's a that path well I do think it's a it's a that path well I do think it's a it's a kind of wrestling match because I'm I'm kind of wrestling match because I'm I'm kind of wrestling match because I'm I'm you mentioned Gulag archipelago I'm very you mentioned Gulag archipelago I'm very you mentioned Gulag archipelago I'm very much a believer that we all have the much a believer that we all have the much a believer that we all have the capacity for good and evil MH and capacity for good and evil MH and capacity for good and evil MH and striving for the ideal to be a good striving for the ideal to be a good striving for the ideal to be a good human being is not a trivial one you

human being is not a trivial one you human being is not a trivial one you have to find the right tools for have to find the right tools for have to find the right tools for yourself to be able to be the candle as yourself to be able to be the candle as yourself to be able to be the candle as you mentioned before I like that and you mentioned before I like that and you mentioned before I like that and then for that uh religion and faith can then for that uh religion and faith can then for that uh religion and faith can help I'm sure there's other ways but I help I'm sure there's other ways but I help I'm sure there's other ways but I think it's grounded in understanding think it's grounded in understanding think it's grounded in understanding that each human is able to be a really that each human is able to be a really that each human is able to be a really bad person and a really good person and bad person and a really good person and bad person and a really good person and that's like a choice it's a deliberate that's like a choice it's a deliberate that's like a choice it's a deliberate choice and it's a choice that's taken choice and it's a choice that's taken choice and it's a choice that's taken every moment and builds up over time every moment and builds up over time every moment and builds up over time and and and the hard part about it is and and and the hard part about it is and and and the hard part about it is you don't know you don't always have the you don't know you don't always have the you don't know you don't always have the clarity using reason to understand what clarity using reason to understand what clarity using reason to understand what is good and what is right and what is is good and what is right and what is is good and what is right and what is wrong you have to kind of live it uh wrong you have to kind of live it uh wrong you have to kind of live it uh with humility and constantly struggle with humility and constantly struggle with humility and constantly struggle cuz then yeah you have to you have you cuz then yeah you have to you have you cuz then yeah you have to you have you might wake up in a society where um might wake up in a society where um might wake up in a society where um you're committing genocides mhm and you you're committing genocides mhm and you you're committing genocides mhm and you think you're the good guys and I think think you're the good guys and I think think you're the good guys and I think you have to have the the courage to to you have to have the the courage to to you have to have the the courage to to realize you're not it's not always realize you're not it's not always realize you're not it's not always obvious it isn't man and history has the obvious it isn't man and history has the obvious it isn't man and history has the clarity to show who are the good guys clarity to show who are the good guys clarity to show who are the good guys and who are the bad guys right you and who are the bad guys right you and who are the bad guys right you wrestle with it it's like that quote you wrestle with it it's like that quote you wrestle with it it's like that quote you know the line between good and evil goes know the line between good and evil goes know the line between good and evil goes through the heart of every man and we through the heart of every man and we through the heart of every man and we push it this way and that and our job is push it this way and that and our job is push it this way and that and our job is to work on that within to work on that within to work on that within ourselves yeah that's the part it's uh

ourselves yeah that's the part it's uh ourselves yeah that's the part it's uh what I like sort of the full quote talks what I like sort of the full quote talks what I like sort of the full quote talks about the the fact that it moves it about the the fact that it moves it about the the fact that it moves it moves from the line moves Moment by moves from the line moves Moment by moves from the line moves Moment by moment day by day we have the uh the moment day by day we have the uh the moment day by day we have the uh the freedom to uh move that line so it's freedom to uh move that line so it's freedom to uh move that line so it's like a it's very deliberate thing it's like a it's very deliberate thing it's like a it's very deliberate thing it's not like you're born this way and it's not like you're born this way and it's not like you're born this way and it's it's it yeah I I agree and and it's it yeah I I agree and and it's it yeah I I agree and and especially you know in conditions that especially you know in conditions that especially you know in conditions that are like War and Peace are like War and Peace are like War and Peace uh in the case of the camps you know uh in the case of the camps you know uh in the case of the camps you know absurd levels of absurd levels of absurd levels of Injustice in the face of all that when Injustice in the face of all that when Injustice in the face of all that when everything is taken away from you you everything is taken away from you you everything is taken away from you you still have the choice to to be to be the still have the choice to to be to be the still have the choice to to be to be the candle like the grandmas by the way the candle like the grandmas by the way the candle like the grandmas by the way the grandmas in like all parts of the world grandmas in like all parts of the world grandmas in like all parts of the world are like the strongest shout out to are like the strongest shout out to are like the strongest shout out to Grandma Grandma Grandma seriously like I don't know what it is I seriously like I don't know what it is I seriously like I don't know what it is I don't know they have this like wisdom don't know they have this like wisdom don't know they have this like wisdom uh that comes from patience and have uh that comes from patience and have uh that comes from patience and have seen it all have seen all the bullshit seen it all have seen all the bullshit seen it all have seen all the bullshit of the people that come and gone all the of the people that come and gone all the of the people that come and gone all the abuses of power all this I don't know abuses of power all this I don't know abuses of power all this I don't know what it is and they just keep going what it is and they just keep going what it is and they just keep going right right right right yeah it's so true what do you right yeah it's so true what do you right yeah it's so true what do you think of think of think of uh as we've gotten a bit philosophical uh as we've gotten a bit philosophical uh as we've gotten a bit philosophical what do you think of uh Warner Herzog what do you think of uh Warner Herzog what do you think of uh Warner Herzog style of narration I kind of wish he style of narration I kind of wish he style of narration I kind of wish he narrated my narrated my narrated my life yeah it's a amazing to listen to

life yeah it's a amazing to listen to life yeah it's a amazing to listen to cuz that documentary is actually in cuz that documentary is actually in cuz that documentary is actually in Russian I think he took a longer Series Russian I think he took a longer Series Russian I think he took a longer Series yeah and then put narration over it MH yeah and then put narration over it MH yeah and then put narration over it MH and that narration can and that narration can and that narration can transform like story yeah he does an transform like story yeah he does an transform like story yeah he does an incredible job with it I I will say I incredible job with it I I will say I incredible job with it I I will say I have you seen the full version have you have you seen the full version have you have you seen the full version have you watched the four-part full version you watched the four-part full version you watched the four-part full version you should you like it it's in Russian and should you like it it's in Russian and should you like it it's in Russian and so you'll get the fullness of that and so you'll get the fullness of that and so you'll get the fullness of that and it's uh he had to fit it into a two-hour it's uh he had to fit it into a two-hour it's uh he had to fit it into a two-hour format and so I think what you lose in format and so I think what you lose in format and so I think what you lose in those extra couple hours is worth those extra couple hours is worth those extra couple hours is worth watching I think you'll like it so yeah watching I think you'll like it so yeah watching I think you'll like it so yeah they always go they always go pretty they always go they always go pretty they always go they always go pretty dark do they he has a very dark uh sense dark do they he has a very dark uh sense dark do they he has a very dark uh sense about nature that is violence and it's about nature that is violence and it's about nature that is violence and it's murder I think that's important to murder I think that's important to murder I think that's important to recognize because it's really easy I recognize because it's really easy I recognize because it's really easy I mean especially with what I do and what mean especially with what I do and what mean especially with what I do and what I talk about and and I see so much of I talk about and and I see so much of I talk about and and I see so much of the value in the value in the value in nature gosh you know I also see like a nature gosh you know I also see like a nature gosh you know I also see like a beautiful moose and a calf running beautiful moose and a calf running beautiful moose and a calf running around and then next week I see the calf around and then next week I see the calf around and then next week I see the calf ripped the shreds by wolves and you're ripped the shreds by wolves and you're ripped the shreds by wolves and you're just like oh just like oh just like oh and it's uh it's not as it's it's not as and it's uh it's not as it's it's not as and it's uh it's not as it's it's not as rouso and as we'd like to think you know rouso and as we'd like to think you know rouso and as we'd like to think you know it it it is it you know things must die for is it you know things must die for is it you know things must die for things to live like you said and and things to live like you said and and things to live like you said and and that's just played out all the time and that's just played out all the time and that's just played out all the time and it's indifferent to you doesn't doesn't it's indifferent to you doesn't doesn't it's indifferent to you doesn't doesn't care if you live or die it and doesn't care if you live or die it and doesn't care if you live or die it and doesn't care how you die or how much pain you go

care how you die or how much pain you go care how you die or how much pain you go through while you you know it's like through while you you know it's like through while you you know it's like it's pretty brutal so that it's it's pretty brutal so that it's it's pretty brutal so that it's interesting that he Taps into that and I interesting that he Taps into that and I interesting that he Taps into that and I think I think it's valuable because it's think I think it's valuable because it's think I think it's valuable because it's easy to idealize in a way but yeah the easy to idealize in a way but yeah the easy to idealize in a way but yeah the indifference indifference indifference is I don't know what to make of it there is I don't know what to make of it there is I don't know what to make of it there is an indifference it's a bit scary it's is an indifference it's a bit scary it's is an indifference it's a bit scary it's a bit lonely mhm you're just a cog in a bit lonely mhm you're just a cog in a bit lonely mhm you're just a cog in the in the machine of the in the machine of the in the machine of nature that doesn't really care about nature that doesn't really care about nature that doesn't really care about you totally I think that's something i' you totally I think that's something i' you totally I think that's something i' sat with a lot on on that show is sat with a lot on on that show is sat with a lot on on that show is another part of the depths of your another part of the depths of your another part of the depths of your psychology delve into but it and that's psychology delve into but it and that's psychology delve into but it and that's when I thought like I could I could I when I thought like I could I could I when I thought like I could I could I understand that deeply but I could also understand that deeply but I could also understand that deeply but I could also choose to believe yeah that for some choose to believe yeah that for some choose to believe yeah that for some reason it matters and then I could live reason it matters and then I could live reason it matters and then I could live like it matters and then I could see the like it matters and then I could see the like it matters and then I could see the trajectories and then kind of that was trajectories and then kind of that was trajectories and then kind of that was another fork in the road of my path I another fork in the road of my path I another fork in the road of my path I guess what do you think about the guess what do you think about the guess what do you think about the connection to the animals so in that in connection to the animals so in that in connection to the animals so in that in that movie it's with the dogs mhm and uh that movie it's with the dogs mhm and uh that movie it's with the dogs mhm and uh with you it's the other domesticated the with you it's the other domesticated the with you it's the other domesticated the the the the reindeer um what do you think about that reindeer um what do you think about that reindeer um what do you think about that human animal Connection in the context human animal Connection in the context human animal Connection in the context of that indifference isn't it of that indifference isn't it of that indifference isn't it interesting that we assigned so much interesting that we assigned so much interesting that we assigned so much value and love and appreciation for value and love and appreciation for value and love and appreciation for these animals and in some degree we get these animals and in some degree we get these animals and in some degree we get that back you know reciproc I think that back you know reciproc I think that back you know reciproc I think right now you just said the reindeer I right now you just said the reindeer I right now you just said the reindeer I think of uh the one they gave me because think of uh the one they gave me because think of uh the one they gave me because he was long and Tall so they named him he was long and Tall so they named him he was long and Tall so they named him delen and and I just remember delen and delen and and I just remember delen and delen and and I just remember delen and just watching him eat the leaves go with just watching him eat the leaves go with just watching him eat the leaves go with me through the woods and trust him to me through the woods and trust him to me through the woods and trust him to take me through rivers and stuff and uh

take me through rivers and stuff and uh take me through rivers and stuff and uh and it really is special it's really and it really is special it's really and it really is special it's really enriching you know uh to have that enriching you know uh to have that enriching you know uh to have that relationship with an animal and I think relationship with an animal and I think relationship with an animal and I think it also puts you in a proper context one it also puts you in a proper context one it also puts you in a proper context one thing I noticed about the natives who thing I noticed about the natives who thing I noticed about the natives who live with those animals all the time is live with those animals all the time is live with those animals all the time is they relate to life and death a little they relate to life and death a little they relate to life and death a little more naturally it feels you know we feel more naturally it feels you know we feel more naturally it feels you know we feel really removed from it it's particularly really removed from it it's particularly really removed from it it's particularly in urban settings and I think I think in urban settings and I think I think in urban settings and I think I think when you interact with animals and you when you interact with animals and you when you interact with animals and you have to confront the life and the death have to confront the life and the death have to confront the life and the death of them and the responsibility of a of them and the responsibility of a of them and the responsibility of a symbiotic relationship you have um I symbiotic relationship you have um I symbiotic relationship you have um I think it opens a little bit awareness to think it opens a little bit awareness to think it opens a little bit awareness to your place in the in the puzzle your place in the in the puzzle your place in the in the puzzle and puts you in it rather than above it and puts you in it rather than above it and puts you in it rather than above it have you been able to accept your own have you been able to accept your own have you been able to accept your own death I wonder you know you wonder when death I wonder you know you wonder when death I wonder you know you wonder when when it actually comes what you're going when it actually comes what you're going when it actually comes what you're going to think but I I did have you know I did to think but I I did have you know I did to think but I I did have you know I did did have my dad to did have my dad to did have my dad to watch confronted in as positive a manner watch confronted in as positive a manner watch confronted in as positive a manner as you could and I and that's a big as you could and I and that's a big as you could and I and that's a big advantage and so advantage and so advantage and so I I I think when the time comes that I I I I think when the time comes that I I I I think when the time comes that I will be ready but I think it but I think will be ready but I think it but I think will be ready but I think it but I think that's easy to say when the time feels that's easy to say when the time feels that's easy to say when the time feels far off you know it'll be interesting if far off you know it'll be interesting if far off you know it'll be interesting if you got a cancer diagnosis tomorrow and you got a cancer diagnosis tomorrow and you got a cancer diagnosis tomorrow and stage four it's stage four it's stage four it's like be heavy did you ever confront like be heavy did you ever confront like be heavy did you ever confront death while in survival situations I death while in survival situations I death while in survival situations I mean when you're I mean you're in did I mean when you're I mean you're in did I mean when you're I mean you're in did I did have a time I had a time where I did have a time I had a time where I did have a time I had a time where I thought I might I was going to die I had thought I might I was going to die I had thought I might I was going to die I had a lot of situations that could have gone

a lot of situations that could have gone a lot of situations that could have gone either way and a lot of injuries broken either way and a lot of injuries broken either way and a lot of injuries broken ribs and this and that but the one that ribs and this and that but the one that ribs and this and that but the one that that I was able to be conscious through that I was able to be conscious through that I was able to be conscious through a slowly evolving experience that I a slowly evolving experience that I a slowly evolving experience that I thought I might die in was at one point thought I might die in was at one point thought I might die in was at one point we were siphoning gas out of a a barrel we were siphoning gas out of a a barrel we were siphoning gas out of a a barrel and it was almost to the bottom and I and it was almost to the bottom and I and it was almost to the bottom and I was like start sucking really hard to was like start sucking really hard to was like start sucking really hard to get the gas out and then I didn't I get the gas out and then I didn't I get the gas out and then I didn't I didn't get the siphon gun so I like didn't get the siphon gun so I like didn't get the siphon gun so I like waited and then while I was sitting waited and then while I was sitting waited and then while I was sitting there Ura put the a new canister on top there Ura put the a new canister on top there Ura put the a new canister on top and put the hose in and I didn't see and and put the hose in and I didn't see and and put the hose in and I didn't see and so then I went to get another you know so then I went to get another you know so then I went to get another you know siphon and I went like sucked as hard as siphon and I went like sucked as hard as siphon and I went like sucked as hard as I could and it just instantly like a I could and it just instantly like a I could and it just instantly like a bunch of gas filled my mouth and I bunch of gas filled my mouth and I bunch of gas filled my mouth and I couldn't like spit it out I had to go couldn't like spit it out I had to go couldn't like spit it out I had to go like that and I just full mouthful of like that and I just full mouthful of like that and I just full mouthful of gas that I just drank and I was just gas that I just drank and I was just gas that I just drank and I was just like oh like what is that going to do like oh like what is that going to do like oh like what is that going to do and um wow and he and my friend were and um wow and he and my friend were and um wow and he and my friend were going to go on This fishing trip and so going to go on This fishing trip and so going to go on This fishing trip and so was I and I was just like oh I might was I and I was just like oh I might was I and I was just like oh I might just day and I was in this little just day and I was in this little just day and I was in this little Russian village and uh and they're like Russian village and uh and they're like Russian village and uh and they're like all right well Euro was like man I had a all right well Euro was like man I had a all right well Euro was like man I had a buddy that died doing that with diesel a buddy that died doing that with diesel a buddy that died doing that with diesel a couple years ago you know and I was oh couple years ago you know and I was oh couple years ago you know and I was oh man and so anyway I made my way to the man and so anyway I made my way to the man and so anyway I made my way to the hospital and by then you know you're hospital and by then you know you're hospital and by then you know you're really out of it cuz and then uh and it really out of it cuz and then uh and it really out of it cuz and then uh and it was they put me in this little dark room was they put me in this little dark room was they put me in this little dark room it almost sounds like unrealistic but it almost sounds like unrealistic but it almost sounds like unrealistic but it's actually how it happened they put it's actually how it happened they put it's actually how it happened they put me in a little a little to room with a me in a little a little to room with a me in a little a little to room with a toilet and they gave me cold you know toilet and they gave me cold you know toilet and they gave me cold you know galvanized bucket and then like they had galvanized bucket and then like they had galvanized bucket and then like they had a cold water faucet and they're just a cold water faucet and they're just a cold water faucet and they're just like just chug water and puke into the

like just chug water and puke into the like just chug water and puke into the toilet and just flush your system as toilet and just flush your system as toilet and just flush your system as much as you can but they only had a cold much as you can but they only had a cold much as you can but they only had a cold water faucet so I was just sitting there water faucet so I was just sitting there water faucet so I was just sitting there like chug chug chug chug until like you like chug chug chug chug until like you like chug chug chug chug until like you puke and chug until you puke and I'm in puke and chug until you puke and I'm in puke and chug until you puke and I'm in the dark and I and I was like started to the dark and I and I was like started to the dark and I and I was like started to shiver because I was so cold but I just shiver because I was so cold but I just shiver because I was so cold but I just had to like still like get this thing up had to like still like get this thing up had to like still like get this thing up to me and chug until I PUK I was to me and chug until I PUK I was to me and chug until I PUK I was picturing I remember reading you know picturing I remember reading you know picturing I remember reading you know about the Japanese torture where they about the Japanese torture where they about the Japanese torture where they would put a hose in somebody and then would put a hose in somebody and then would put a hose in somebody and then make them drink water till they puked make them drink water till they puked make them drink water till they puked anyway the uh and I and I just felt so anyway the uh and I and I just felt so anyway the uh and I and I just felt so the only way I can express it I felt so the only way I can express it I felt so the only way I can express it I felt so possessed like demon possessed like I possessed like demon possessed like I possessed like demon possessed like I was just permeated with gas I could feel was just permeated with gas I could feel was just permeated with gas I could feel it was coming out of my pores and I like it was coming out of my pores and I like it was coming out of my pores and I like wanted to like rip it out of me and I wanted to like rip it out of me and I wanted to like rip it out of me and I couldn't I'd like puke into the toilet couldn't I'd like puke into the toilet couldn't I'd like puke into the toilet and then couldn't see but I was and then couldn't see but I was and then couldn't see but I was wondering if it was like rainbow and wondering if it was like rainbow and wondering if it was like rainbow and then and then I just remember like I then and then I just remember like I then and then I just remember like I could tell I was going out pretty soon could tell I was going out pretty soon could tell I was going out pretty soon and and and um and I remember looking at my hands up um and I remember looking at my hands up um and I remember looking at my hands up close you'd see him a little bit and I I close you'd see him a little bit and I I close you'd see him a little bit and I I was like oh that's how dad's hands was like oh that's how dad's hands was like oh that's how dad's hands looked you know they were alive alive looked you know they were alive alive looked you know they were alive alive and then and I was like and then and I was like and then and I was like interesting is it are my hands going to interesting is it are my hands going to interesting is it are my hands going to look like that in a few minutes or look like that in a few minutes or look like that in a few minutes or whatever so then I wrote down like to my whatever so then I wrote down like to my whatever so then I wrote down like to my family what I thought you know like I family what I thought you know like I family what I thought you know like I love you all like feel at peace blah love you all like feel at peace blah love you all like feel at peace blah blah BL blah and then I've passed out blah BL blah and then I've passed out blah BL blah and then I've passed out and I woke up but I didn't think I and I woke up but I didn't think I and I woke up but I didn't think I actually thought I when I went to pass actually thought I when I went to pass actually thought I when I went to pass out I thought it was there was a coin out I thought it was there was a coin out I thought it was there was a coin toss for me so I really felt like I was toss for me so I really felt like I was toss for me so I really felt like I was fronting the uh end fronting the uh end fronting the uh end there what are the harshest conditions there what are the harshest conditions there what are the harshest conditions to surviving on Earth well there are to surviving on Earth well there are to surviving on Earth well there are places that are just purely

places that are just purely places that are just purely uninhabitable but I think as far as uninhabitable but I think as far as uninhabitable but I think as far as places that you have a chance you have a places that you have a chance you have a places that you have a chance you have a chance that's a good way to put it what chance that's a good way to put it what chance that's a good way to put it what with maybe Greenland I think of with maybe Greenland I think of with maybe Greenland I think of Greenland because I think of you know Greenland because I think of you know Greenland because I think of you know those Vikings that settled there were those Vikings that settled there were those Vikings that settled there were rugged capable dudes and they didn't rugged capable dudes and they didn't rugged capable dudes and they didn't make it but there are Inuit that that make it but there are Inuit that that make it but there are Inuit that that you know natives that live up there but you know natives that live up there but you know natives that live up there but it's a hard life you know and the it's a hard life you know and the it's a hard life you know and the population's never grown very big population's never grown very big population's never grown very big because they're you're scraping by up because they're you're scraping by up because they're you're scraping by up there and you picture and the and the there and you picture and the and the there and you picture and the and the Vikings that did land there you know Vikings that did land there you know Vikings that did land there you know they just weren't able to quite adapt they just weren't able to quite adapt they just weren't able to quite adapt and the fact that they all died out is and the fact that they all died out is and the fact that they all died out is just a symbol to that must be a pretty just a symbol to that must be a pretty just a symbol to that must be a pretty difficult place to live what would you difficult place to live what would you difficult place to live what would you say that's that's primarily because just say that's that's primarily because just say that's that's primarily because just the food sources are limited the food the food sources are limited the food the food sources are limited the food sources are limited but the fact that sources are limited but the fact that sources are limited but the fact that some people can live there means it is some people can live there means it is some people can live there means it is possible you know they they've figured possible you know they they've figured possible you know they they've figured out ways to to catch seals and do things out ways to to catch seals and do things out ways to to catch seals and do things to survive but it's by no means easier to survive but it's by no means easier to survive but it's by no means easier to be taken for granted or obvious I to be taken for granted or obvious I to be taken for granted or obvious I think it's a harsh probably a harsh think it's a harsh probably a harsh think it's a harsh probably a harsh place to try to live yeah it's it's place to try to live yeah it's it's place to try to live yeah it's it's fascinating not just humans but to to fascinating not just humans but to to fascinating not just humans but to to watch how animals have figured out how watch how animals have figured out how watch how animals have figured out how to survive of watching like a to survive of watching like a to survive of watching like a documentary on polar bears like they documentary on polar bears like they documentary on polar bears like they just figure out a way and they get then just figure out a way and they get then just figure out a way and they get then and they've been doing it for and they've been doing it for and they've been doing it for generations and they they figure out a generations and they they figure out a generations and they they figure out a way they travel like hundreds of miles way they travel like hundreds of miles way they travel like hundreds of miles to like to like to like to to the to the water to get fat and to to the to the water to get fat and to to the to the water to get fat and then they travel 100 miles like for then they travel 100 miles like for then they travel 100 miles like for whatever other purpose because it

whatever other purpose because it whatever other purpose because it because they want to stay on the ice I because they want to stay on the ice I because they want to stay on the ice I don't know but it's like there's there's don't know but it's like there's there's don't know but it's like there's there's a process and they figure it out against a process and they figure it out against a process and they figure it out against the long odds and some of them don't the long odds and some of them don't the long odds and some of them don't make it it's incredible it's a what a make it it's incredible it's a what a make it it's incredible it's a what a what tough things man you just think what tough things man you just think what tough things man you just think every little every animal you see up in every little every animal you see up in every little every animal you see up in the mountains when I'm up in the woods the mountains when I'm up in the woods the mountains when I'm up in the woods is that thing just surviving through the is that thing just surviving through the is that thing just surviving through the wi winter scraping wi winter scraping wi winter scraping it's tough tough existence what do you it's tough tough existence what do you it's tough tough existence what do you think it would take to break think it would take to break think it would take to break you say you say you say mentally um like if you're in a survival mentally um like if you're in a survival mentally um like if you're in a survival [Music] [Music] [Music] situation I mean I think it would H situation I mean I think it would H situation I mean I think it would H mentally it would have to be uh well we thought we talked about be uh well we thought we talked about that earlier I guess the thing that I've that earlier I guess the thing that I've that earlier I guess the thing that I've confronted that that I thought I knew confronted that that I thought I knew confronted that that I thought I knew was that if I knew I was the last person was that if I knew I was the last person was that if I knew I was the last person on Earth I wouldn't do it like I thought on Earth I wouldn't do it like I thought on Earth I wouldn't do it like I thought but maybe you're right maybe I would but maybe you're right maybe I would but maybe you're right maybe I would think I wasn't but I think you know I think I wasn't but I think you know I think I wasn't but I think you know I can't imagine I can't can't imagine I can't can't imagine I can't imagine we're we're so blessed in the imagine we're we're so blessed in the imagine we're we're so blessed in the time we live like but I can't imagine time we live like but I can't imagine time we live like but I can't imagine what it's like to lose your kids what it's like to lose your kids what it's like to lose your kids something like that it was an experience something like that it was an experience something like that it was an experience that was so common for Humanity for so that was so common for Humanity for so that was so common for Humanity for so much of History much of History much of History um would I be able to endure that I um would I be able to endure that I um would I be able to endure that I would have at least a legacy to look would have at least a legacy to look would have at least a legacy to look back on of people who did but back on of people who did but back on of people who did but God forbid I ever have to delve that God forbid I ever have to delve that God forbid I ever have to delve that deep you know what I mean that that I deep you know what I mean that that I deep you know what I mean that that I could see that breaking somebody and I could see that breaking somebody and I could see that breaking somebody and I mean in your F in your own family mean in your F in your own family mean in your F in your own family history there's there's people who have

history there's there's people who have history there's there's people who have survived that maybe that would give you survived that maybe that would give you survived that maybe that would give you hope I I mean I think that's what I hope I I mean I think that's what I hope I I mean I think that's what I would have to somehow hold on to but in would have to somehow hold on to but in would have to somehow hold on to but in a survival situation you're there's very a survival situation you're there's very a survival situation you're there's very few things that I don't know what it few things that I don't know what it few things that I don't know what it would be like so on alone like on alone would be like so on alone like on alone would be like so on alone like on alone I I knew if I wasn't gonna and I I knew if I wasn't gonna and I I knew if I wasn't gonna and ultimately it is a game show so it's ultimately it is a game show so it's ultimately it is a game show so it's like ultimately I was GNA kill myself like ultimately I was GNA kill myself like ultimately I was GNA kill myself out there it's like out there it's like out there it's like but so if I hadn't been able to procure but so if I hadn't been able to procure but so if I hadn't been able to procure food and I was starving to death it's food and I was starving to death it's food and I was starving to death it's like okay I'm not I'm gonna go home you like okay I'm not I'm gonna go home you like okay I'm not I'm gonna go home you know but like if you put yourself in in know but like if you put yourself in in know but like if you put yourself in in that situation but it's not a game that situation but it's not a game that situation but it's not a game show and having been there to some show and having been there to some show and having been there to some degree like I will say I wasn't even degree like I will say I wasn't even degree like I will say I wasn't even close like I don't even know yeah yeah I close like I don't even know yeah yeah I close like I don't even know yeah yeah I hadn't got it hadn't pushed my mental hadn't got it hadn't pushed my mental hadn't got it hadn't pushed my mental limit at all yet I would say on the limit at all yet I would say on the limit at all yet I would say on the scale but that's not to say there isn't scale but that's not to say there isn't scale but that's not to say there isn't one I know there is one and but I have a one I know there is one and but I have a one I know there is one and but I have a hard hard hard time I know I've dealt you I've dealt time I know I've dealt you I've dealt time I know I've dealt you I've dealt with enough pain and with enough pain and with enough pain and enough discomfort in life that I know I enough discomfort in life that I know I enough discomfort in life that I know I can deal with that I think I think it can deal with that I think I think it can deal with that I think I think it gets difficult when you start to when gets difficult when you start to when gets difficult when you start to when there's a way out and you start to there's a way out and you start to there's a way out and you start to wonder if you shouldn't take the way out wonder if you shouldn't take the way out wonder if you shouldn't take the way out as far as as far as as far as like uh if there's no way like uh if there's no way like uh if there's no way out I don't know what oh it's out I don't know what oh it's out I don't know what oh it's interesting I mean that is that is a interesting I mean that is that is a interesting I mean that is that is a real difficult battle when there's an real difficult battle when there's an real difficult battle when there's an exit when it's easy to quit right why am exit when it's easy to quit right why am exit when it's easy to quit right why am I doing this yeah that's I that's the

I doing this yeah that's I that's the I doing this yeah that's I that's the thing that like gets louder and louder thing that like gets louder and louder thing that like gets louder and louder the harder things get toally it's not the harder things get toally it's not the harder things get toally it's not insignificant like if you think you're insignificant like if you think you're insignificant like if you think you're doing like you know if you think you're doing like you know if you think you're doing like you know if you think you're doing permanent damage to your body you doing permanent damage to your body you doing permanent damage to your body you would be smart to quit you should just would be smart to quit you should just would be smart to quit you should just not do that on a when it's not necessary not do that on a when it's not necessary not do that on a when it's not necessary um because health is kind of all you um because health is kind of all you um because health is kind of all you have in some regards have in some regards have in some regards so do I don't blame anyone then they so do I don't blame anyone then they so do I don't blame anyone then they quit because of that reason it's like quit because of that reason it's like quit because of that reason it's like good but good but good but uh but if you're in a situation and it uh but if you're in a situation and it uh but if you're in a situation and it you don't have the option to quit is you don't have the option to quit is you don't have the option to quit is knowing that you're doing permanent knowing that you're doing permanent knowing that you're doing permanent that's not going to break that won't that's not going to break that won't that's not going to break that won't break me you know it just you just have break me you know it just you just have break me you know it just you just have to get through it I'm not sure what my to get through it I'm not sure what my to get through it I'm not sure what my mental limit would be outside of mental limit would be outside of mental limit would be outside of like the family suffering in the way like the family suffering in the way like the family suffering in the way that I described earlier one is just that I described earlier one is just that I described earlier one is just it's you it's you alone there's the it's you it's you alone there's the it's you it's you alone there's the limit uh you don't know what the limit limit uh you don't know what the limit limit uh you don't know what the limit is I don't injuries injuries like is I don't injuries injuries like is I don't injuries injuries like physical stuff is annoying physical stuff is annoying physical stuff is annoying though that could be isn't it weird how though that could be isn't it weird how though that could be isn't it weird how like I mean I can be have a good life like I mean I can be have a good life like I mean I can be have a good life happy life and then you have a bad back happy life and then you have a bad back happy life and then you have a bad back or you have a headache yeah and it's or you have a headache yeah and it's or you have a headache yeah and it's amazing how much that can overwhelm your amazing how much that can overwhelm your amazing how much that can overwhelm your experience um then again experience um then again experience um then again that that was something I saw in dad that that was something I saw in dad that that was something I saw in dad that was like interesting how can you that was like interesting how can you that was like interesting how can you find joy find joy find joy in that when you're just steeped in that in that when you're just steeped in that in that when you're just steeped in that all the time and people I'm sure all the time and people I'm sure all the time and people I'm sure listening there's a lot of people that listening there's a lot of people that listening there's a lot of people that do and it's do and it's do and it's so like and and talk about the cross to so like and and talk about the cross to so like and and talk about the cross to bear and the like Hero Journey to be

bear and the like Hero Journey to be bear and the like Hero Journey to be like good for you for trying to like good for you for trying to like good for you for trying to find what you can what your way through find what you can what your way through find what you can what your way through that there was a lady in Russia uh Tanya that there was a lady in Russia uh Tanya that there was a lady in Russia uh Tanya and she had had cancer and recovered but and she had had cancer and recovered but and she had had cancer and recovered but always had a pounding headache and she always had a pounding headache and she always had a pounding headache and she was really joyful and really fun to be was really joyful and really fun to be was really joyful and really fun to be around and I just like around and I just like around and I just like man I mean you just have to have a man I mean you just have to have a man I mean you just have to have a really bad headache for today know how really bad headache for today know how really bad headache for today know how much that throws a wrench in your much that throws a wrench in your much that throws a wrench in your existence so so all that to say if existence so so all that to say if existence so so all that to say if you're not right now suffering with you're not right now suffering with you're not right now suffering with blindness or a bad back or it's like blindness or a bad back or it's like blindness or a bad back or it's like just count your blessings because it is just count your blessings because it is just count your blessings because it is all it's so easy to have it's it's all it's so easy to have it's it's all it's so easy to have it's it's amazing how complex we are how well our amazing how complex we are how well our amazing how complex we are how well our bodies work and when they go out of bodies work and when they go out of bodies work and when they go out of whack it can be very overwhelming and whack it can be very overwhelming and whack it can be very overwhelming and they all will at some point and so they all will at some point and so they all will at some point and so that's an inter interesting thing to that's an inter interesting thing to that's an inter interesting thing to think ahead on how you're going to think ahead on how you're going to think ahead on how you're going to confront it when it does keeps you confront it when it does keeps you confront it when it does keeps you humble like you said it's inspiring that humble like you said it's inspiring that humble like you said it's inspiring that people figure out a way with migraines people figure out a way with migraines people figure out a way with migraines that's a hard one though if you have that's a hard one though if you have that's a hard one though if you have headaches so hard oh man cuz those can headaches so hard oh man cuz those can headaches so hard oh man cuz those can be really painful and it's like and be really painful and it's like and be really painful and it's like and dizzying and all dizzying and all dizzying and all this yeah that's inspiring that's this yeah that's inspiring that's this yeah that's inspiring that's inspiring that you found there's not inspiring that you found there's not inspiring that you found there's not nothing in that you know I mean there nothing in that you know I mean there nothing in that you know I mean there you can find somehow you can tap into you can find somehow you can tap into you can find somehow you can tap into purpose even in that pain I guess I purpose even in that pain I guess I purpose even in that pain I guess I would just speak from like right my would just speak from like right my would just speak from like right my dad's experience I saw somebody do it dad's experience I saw somebody do it dad's experience I saw somebody do it and I benefited from it and I benefited from it and I benefited from it so thanks to him for seeing the higher

so thanks to him for seeing the higher so thanks to him for seeing the higher calling there you uh you are a note on calling there you uh you are a note on calling there you uh you are a note on your blog in 2012 you spent 5 weeks is your blog in 2012 you spent 5 weeks is your blog in 2012 you spent 5 weeks is in the forest alone I just thought it in the forest alone I just thought it in the forest alone I just thought it was interesting cuz this is in contrast was interesting cuz this is in contrast was interesting cuz this is in contrast to on the show alone mhm you really to on the show alone mhm you really to on the show alone mhm you really alone where like you're not talking to alone where like you're not talking to alone where like you're not talking to anybody and you realize that uh I you're anybody and you realize that uh I you're anybody and you realize that uh I you're right I remember at one point after right I remember at one point after right I remember at one point after several weeks had passed I wondered into several weeks had passed I wondered into several weeks had passed I wondered into a particularly beautiful part of the a particularly beautiful part of the a particularly beautiful part of the woods and exclaimed out loud wow it woods and exclaimed out loud wow it woods and exclaimed out loud wow it struck me that it was the first time I struck me that it was the first time I struck me that it was the first time I had heard my own voice in several weeks had heard my own voice in several weeks had heard my own voice in several weeks with no one to talk to what with no one to talk to what with no one to talk to what um where what did your thoughts go into um where what did your thoughts go into um where what did your thoughts go into some like deep Place yeah I'd say my some like deep Place yeah I'd say my some like deep Place yeah I'd say my mental life was really active you know mental life was really active you know mental life was really active you know what you what you end up when you're what you what you end up when you're what you what you end up when you're that long alone I tell you what you that long alone I tell you what you that long alone I tell you what you won't have is any like skeletons in your won't have is any like skeletons in your won't have is any like skeletons in your closet that are still in your closet closet that are still in your closet closet that are still in your closet like you will be forced to confront like you will be forced to confront like you will be forced to confront every every person even the one not it I every every person even the one not it I every every person even the one not it I mean it's one thing if you've cheated on mean it's one thing if you've cheated on mean it's one thing if you've cheated on your W wife or something but you'll be your W wife or something but you'll be your W wife or something but you'll be confronted with the random dude you confronted with the random dude you confronted with the random dude you didn't say thank you to and like and the didn't say thank you to and like and the didn't say thank you to and like and the issue that you didn't resolve you know issue that you didn't resolve you know issue that you didn't resolve you know all this stuff that was long gone will all this stuff that was long gone will all this stuff that was long gone will come up and then you'll work through it come up and then you'll work through it come up and then you'll work through it and you'll think how you should make it and you'll think how you should make it and you'll think how you should make it right and uh I had a lot of those right and uh I had a lot of those right and uh I had a lot of those thoughts in while I was out there and it thoughts in while I was out there and it thoughts in while I was out there and it was it was so interesting to see what was it was so interesting to see what was it was so interesting to see what you would just brush over and

you would just brush over and you would just brush over and then uh and confront it because in our then uh and confront it because in our then uh and confront it because in our modern world when you're always modern world when you're always modern world when you're always distracted you just never ever going to distracted you just never ever going to distracted you just never ever going to know until you take the time to be alone know until you take the time to be alone know until you take the time to be alone for a considerable amount of time spend for a considerable amount of time spend for a considerable amount of time spend time hanging out with the skeletons yeah time hanging out with the skeletons yeah time hanging out with the skeletons yeah exactly exactly exactly I recommend it so you said you guide I recommend it so you said you guide I recommend it so you said you guide people what what are your favorite people what what are your favorite people what what are your favorite places to go places to go places to go to well if I tell them then is everybody to well if I tell them then is everybody to well if I tell them then is everybody G to go there I like how you actually G to go there I like how you actually G to go there I like how you actually have a it might be a YouTube video or have a it might be a YouTube video or have a it might be a YouTube video or your Instagram post where you give them your Instagram post where you give them your Instagram post where you give them a recommendation of like the best a recommendation of like the best a recommendation of like the best fishing pole in the world and like you fishing pole in the world and like you fishing pole in the world and like you give detailed instructions how to get give detailed instructions how to get give detailed instructions how to get there but it's like a journey of life there but it's like a journey of life there but it's like a journey of life it's like a Lord of the Rings type of it's like a Lord of the Rings type of it's like a Lord of the Rings type of Journey right right no I I love the I Journey right right no I I love the I Journey right right no I I love the I love love the like in love love the like in love love the like in the you know there's a region that I the you know there's a region that I the you know there's a region that I definitely love in the states it's definitely love in the states it's definitely love in the states it's special to me I grew up there stuff like special to me I grew up there stuff like special to me I grew up there stuff like that Idaho Wyoming Montana those are that Idaho Wyoming Montana those are that Idaho Wyoming Montana those are really cool places to me I like the really cool places to me I like the really cool places to me I like the small town Vibes they're still small town Vibes they're still small town Vibes they're still maintaining and stuff there just a mix maintaining and stuff there just a mix maintaining and stuff there just a mix of like mountains and of like mountains and of like mountains and forests but you know another really forests but you know another really forests but you know another really awesome place that blew my mind was uh awesome place that blew my mind was uh awesome place that blew my mind was uh New Zealand that South Island of New New Zealand that South Island of New New Zealand that South Island of New Zealand was pretty incredible as far is Zealand was pretty incredible as far is Zealand was pretty incredible as far is just stunning stuff to see I was pretty just stunning stuff to see I was pretty just stunning stuff to see I was pretty high up there on the list but there's high up there on the list but there's high up there on the list but there's all these places have such kind of all these places have such kind of all these places have such kind of unique unique things about Canada became unique unique things about Canada became unique unique things about Canada became like where they did alone it's not like where they did alone it's not like where they did alone it's not typically what you'd say because it's

typically what you'd say because it's typically what you'd say because it's fairly flat and Cliffy and stuff but it fairly flat and Cliffy and stuff but it fairly flat and Cliffy and stuff but it really became beautiful to me because I really became beautiful to me because I really became beautiful to me because I could tapped into the richness of the could tapped into the richness of the could tapped into the richness of the land you know or or you know the fishing land you know or or you know the fishing land you know or or you know the fishing hole thing it's like that's a special hole thing it's like that's a special hole thing it's like that's a special little spot you know something like that little spot you know something like that little spot you know something like that and and you see the beauty and then you and and you see the beauty and then you and and you see the beauty and then you start to see the beauty on the in the start to see the beauty on the in the start to see the beauty on the in the smaller scale like oh look at that smaller scale like oh look at that smaller scale like oh look at that little Meadow with that it's got an little Meadow with that it's got an little Meadow with that it's got an orange and a pink and a blue flower orange and a pink and a blue flower orange and a pink and a blue flower right next to each other that's super right next to each other that's super right next to each other that's super cool you know and there's a million cool you know and there's a million cool you know and there's a million things like that have you been back things like that have you been back things like that have you been back there yet uh back to where the alone there yet uh back to where the alone there yet uh back to where the alone show was no we're going back this uh show was no we're going back this uh show was no we're going back this uh summer I'm going to take guide a trip up summer I'm going to take guide a trip up summer I'm going to take guide a trip up there take a bunch of people I'm really there take a bunch of people I'm really there take a bunch of people I'm really looking forward to being able to enjoy looking forward to being able to enjoy looking forward to being able to enjoy it without the pressure it without the pressure it without the pressure of it's be fun what what advice would of it's be fun what what advice would of it's be fun what what advice would you give to people in terms of you give to people in terms of you give to people in terms of how how how to be in nature so like a Hikes to take to be in nature so like a Hikes to take to be in nature so like a Hikes to take or Journeys to take out of nature where or Journeys to take out of nature where or Journeys to take out of nature where it could it could take you to that place it could it could take you to that place it could it could take you to that place where the busyness and The Madness of where the busyness and The Madness of where the busyness and The Madness of the world the world the world can dissipate and you can be with it can dissipate and you can be with it can dissipate and you can be with it like how long does it take for you for like how long does it take for you for like how long does it take for you for people usually to just like yeah I think people usually to just like yeah I think people usually to just like yeah I think you need a few days probably to really you need a few days probably to really you need a few days probably to really tap into it but you know maybe you need tap into it but you know maybe you need tap into it but you know maybe you need to work your way there like it it's to work your way there like it it's to work your way there like it it's awesome to go out on a hike go see some awesome to go out on a hike go see some awesome to go out on a hike go see some beautiful little waterfall or go see beautiful little waterfall or go see beautiful little waterfall or go see some old tree or whatever it is you know some old tree or whatever it is you know some old tree or whatever it is you know like like like um but I think just doing is it that you um but I think just doing is it that you um but I think just doing is it that you know everybody thinks about doing it know everybody thinks about doing it know everybody thinks about doing it really you just really do do it like go really you just really do do it like go really you just really do do it like go out and then plan to go overnight don't

out and then plan to go overnight don't out and then plan to go overnight don't be so afraid of all the potentialities be so afraid of all the potentialities be so afraid of all the potentialities that you delay it inevitably you know that you delay it inevitably you know that you delay it inevitably you know it's actually one of the things that it's actually one of the things that it's actually one of the things that I've enjoyed the most about guiding I've enjoyed the most about guiding I've enjoyed the most about guiding people is is giving them the tools so people is is giving them the tools so people is is giving them the tools so that now they have this ability into the that now they have this ability into the that now they have this ability into the future you can go out and feel like I'm future you can go out and feel like I'm future you can go out and feel like I'm going to pick this spot on the map and going to pick this spot on the map and going to pick this spot on the map and go there and that's a tool in your go there and that's a tool in your go there and that's a tool in your toolkit of life that is I think really toolkit of life that is I think really toolkit of life that is I think really valuable because I think everybody valuable because I think everybody valuable because I think everybody should spend some time in nature I mean should spend some time in nature I mean should spend some time in nature I mean I think it's been pretty proven healthy I think it's been pretty proven healthy I think it's been pretty proven healthy yeah I mean camping camping is great and yeah I mean camping camping is great and yeah I mean camping camping is great and solo I got a chance to do it solo is solo I got a chance to do it solo is solo I got a chance to do it solo is pretty cool yeah that's cool you did pretty cool yeah that's cool you did pretty cool yeah that's cool you did yeah it's cool and I I recorded stuff so yeah it's cool and I I recorded stuff so yeah it's cool and I I recorded stuff so that that that helped oh good yeah till that that that helped oh good yeah till that that that helped oh good yeah till you sit there and you record the you sit there and you record the you sit there and you record the thoughts actually for having to record thoughts actually for having to record thoughts actually for having to record the thoughts I had to like it forced me the thoughts I had to like it forced me the thoughts I had to like it forced me to really think through what I was to really think through what I was to really think through what I was feeling to convert the feelings into feeling to convert the feelings into feeling to convert the feelings into words which is uh not a trivial thing words which is uh not a trivial thing words which is uh not a trivial thing because it's mostly just feeling MH yeah because it's mostly just feeling MH yeah because it's mostly just feeling MH yeah you feel a certain kind of you feel a certain kind of you feel a certain kind of way that's interesting you know I felt way that's interesting you know I felt way that's interesting you know I felt like the way of the way I met my wife like the way of the way I met my wife like the way of the way I met my wife was like you know we met at this wedding was like you know we met at this wedding was like you know we met at this wedding and then I went to Russia basically and and then I went to Russia basically and and then I went to Russia basically and we kept in touch via email for you know we kept in touch via email for you know we kept in touch via email for you know that year and and a similar thing it was that year and and a similar thing it was that year and and a similar thing it was really interesting to be have to be so really interesting to be have to be so really interesting to be have to be so thoughtful and purposeful about what thoughtful and purposeful about what thoughtful and purposeful about what you're saying and thing like I think you're saying and thing like I think you're saying and thing like I think it's probably healthy good thing to do

it's probably healthy good thing to do it's probably healthy good thing to do what gives you hope about this whole what gives you hope about this whole what gives you hope about this whole thing we have going thing we have going thing we have going on the uh the future of human on the uh the future of human on the uh the future of human civilization if we talk you know we civilization if we talk you know we civilization if we talk you know we talked about gratitude earlier like look talked about gratitude earlier like look talked about gratitude earlier like look look at what we have now that could give look at what we have now that could give look at what we have now that could give you hope like look at what we've the you hope like look at what we've the you hope like look at what we've the world we're in we live in such an world we're in we live in such an world we're in we live in such an amazing time with you know buildings and amazing time with you know buildings and amazing time with you know buildings and Roads buildings and Roads food security Roads buildings and Roads food security Roads buildings and Roads food security and and you know I lived with the and and you know I lived with the and and you know I lived with the natives and I thought to myself a lot natives and I thought to myself a lot natives and I thought to myself a lot like I wonder if not everybody would like I wonder if not everybody would like I wonder if not everybody would choose this way of life because it is choose this way of life because it is choose this way of life because it is there's something really rich about just there's something really rich about just there's something really rich about just that small group your direct that small group your direct that small group your direct relationship to your needs all that but relationship to your needs all that but relationship to your needs all that but with the food security and the with the food security and the with the food security and the he you know modern medicine things that he you know modern medicine things that he you know modern medicine things that we now have that we take for granted but we now have that we take for granted but we now have that we take for granted but that I wouldn't choose that life if we that I wouldn't choose that life if we that I wouldn't choose that life if we didn't have those things otherwise didn't have those things otherwise didn't have those things otherwise you're going to watch your family starve you're going to watch your family starve you're going to watch your family starve to death or things like that we uh so we to death or things like that we uh so we to death or things like that we uh so we have so much now which should lead us to have so much now which should lead us to have so much now which should lead us to be hopeful um while we try to improve be hopeful um while we try to improve be hopeful um while we try to improve because there's definitely a lot of because there's definitely a lot of because there's definitely a lot of things wrong you know but but I guess things wrong you know but but I guess things wrong you know but but I guess it's there's a lot of room for it's there's a lot of room for it's there's a lot of room for improvement and I do feel like we're improvement and I do feel like we're improvement and I do feel like we're sort of watching walking on The knife's sort of watching walking on The knife's sort of watching walking on The knife's Edge you know but I guess Edge you know but I guess Edge you know but I guess that's the way it is um as the as the that's the way it is um as the as the that's the way it is um as the as the tools we build become more powerful yeah tools we build become more powerful yeah tools we build become more powerful yeah exactly KN Edge is getting sharper and exactly KN Edge is getting sharper and exactly KN Edge is getting sharper and sharper I I talk yeah I like argue with sharper I I talk yeah I like argue with sharper I I talk yeah I like argue with with my brother about that sometimes he with my brother about that sometimes he with my brother about that sometimes he takes the more positive View and I'm takes the more positive View and I'm takes the more positive View and I'm like I mean it's great we've done great

like I mean it's great we've done great like I mean it's great we've done great but man more and more people with but man more and more people with but man more and more people with nuclear weapons and more it's just going nuclear weapons and more it's just going nuclear weapons and more it's just going to take one mistake with the more power to take one mistake with the more power to take one mistake with the more power I think there's something about the I think there's something about the I think there's something about the sharpness of the knife's edge mhm that sharpness of the knife's edge mhm that sharpness of the knife's edge mhm that gets Humanity to really like focus and gets Humanity to really like focus and gets Humanity to really like focus and like step up and not not screw it up like step up and not not screw it up like step up and not not screw it up there is just like you said with the there is just like you said with the there is just like you said with the cold going out into the extreme cold it cold going out into the extreme cold it cold going out into the extreme cold it like wakes you up and I think the same like wakes you up and I think the same like wakes you up and I think the same thing with nuclear weapons it just like thing with nuclear weapons it just like thing with nuclear weapons it just like wakes up Humanity like was half wakes up Humanity like was half wakes up Humanity like was half asleep and then we keep building more asleep and then we keep building more asleep and then we keep building more and more powerful things to make sure and more powerful things to make sure and more powerful things to make sure stay awake yeah exactly stay awake see stay awake yeah exactly stay awake see stay awake yeah exactly stay awake see what we've done be thankful for it but what we've done be thankful for it but what we've done be thankful for it but then improve it and then you know of then improve it and then you know of then improve it and then you know of course uh I appreciated your little post course uh I appreciated your little post course uh I appreciated your little post the other week where you said you wanted the other week where you said you wanted the other week where you said you wanted some kids you know that's a that's a some kids you know that's a that's a some kids you know that's a that's a very direct way to relate to the Future very direct way to relate to the Future very direct way to relate to the Future and to have hope for the future I can't and to have hope for the future I can't and to have hope for the future I can't wait and uh hopefully I also get a wait and uh hopefully I also get a wait and uh hopefully I also get a chance to go out in the wilderness with chance to go out in the wilderness with chance to go out in the wilderness with you at some point I would love it open you at some point I would love it open you at some point I would love it open invite let's make it happen I got some invite let's make it happen I got some invite let's make it happen I got some really cool spots of it have in mind to really cool spots of it have in mind to really cool spots of it have in mind to take you awesome let's go thank you for take you awesome let's go thank you for take you awesome let's go thank you for talking today brother thank you for talking today brother thank you for talking today brother thank you for everything you stand for thanks everything you stand for thanks everything you stand for thanks man thanks for listening to this man thanks for listening to this man thanks for listening to this conversation with Jordan and Jonas to conversation with Jordan and Jonas to conversation with Jordan and Jonas to support this podcast please check out support this podcast please check out support this podcast please check out our sponsors in the our sponsors in the our sponsors in the description and now let me try a new description and now let me try a new description and now let me try a new thing where I try to articulate some thing where I try to articulate some thing where I try to articulate some things I've been thinking about whether things I've been thinking about whether things I've been thinking about whether prompted by one of your questions or prompted by one of your questions or prompted by one of your questions or just in general if you would like to

just in general if you would like to just in general if you would like to submit a question including an audio and submit a question including an audio and submit a question including an audio and video form go to Lex freeman.com AMA now allow me to comment on the AMA now allow me to comment on the attempted assassination of Donald Trump attempted assassination of Donald Trump attempted assassination of Donald Trump on July on July on July 13th first as I've posted online wishing 13th first as I've posted online wishing 13th first as I've posted online wishing Donald Trump good health after an Donald Trump good health after an Donald Trump good health after an assassination attempt is not a partisan assassination attempt is not a partisan assassination attempt is not a partisan statement it's a human statement it's a human statement it's a human statement and I'm sorry if some of you statement and I'm sorry if some of you statement and I'm sorry if some of you want to categorize me and other people want to categorize me and other people want to categorize me and other people into blue and red into blue and red into blue and red bins perhaps you do it because it's easy bins perhaps you do it because it's easy bins perhaps you do it because it's easy easier to hate than to understand in easier to hate than to understand in easier to hate than to understand in this case it shouldn't matter but let me this case it shouldn't matter but let me this case it shouldn't matter but let me say once again that I am not right-wing say once again that I am not right-wing say once again that I am not right-wing nor leftwing I'm not partisan I make up nor leftwing I'm not partisan I make up nor leftwing I'm not partisan I make up my mind one issue at a time and I try to my mind one issue at a time and I try to my mind one issue at a time and I try to approach everyone and every idea with approach everyone and every idea with approach everyone and every idea with empathy and with an open mind I have and empathy and with an open mind I have and empathy and with an open mind I have and will continue to have many long form will continue to have many long form will continue to have many long form conversations with people both on the conversations with people both on the conversations with people both on the left and the left and the left and the right now onto the much more important right now onto the much more important right now onto the much more important point the attempted assassination of point the attempted assassination of point the attempted assassination of Donald Trump should serve as a reminder Donald Trump should serve as a reminder Donald Trump should serve as a reminder that history can turn on a single moment that history can turn on a single moment that history can turn on a single moment World War I started with the World War I started with the World War I started with the assassination of arch Duke France assassination of arch Duke France assassination of arch Duke France Ferdinand and just like that one moment Ferdinand and just like that one moment Ferdinand and just like that one moment in history on June 18th in history on June 18th in history on June 18th 1914 led to the death of 20 million 1914 led to the death of 20 million 1914 led to the death of 20 million people half of whom were

people half of whom were people half of whom were civilians if one of the bullets on July civilians if one of the bullets on July civilians if one of the bullets on July 13th had a slightly different trajectory 13th had a slightly different trajectory 13th had a slightly different trajectory where Donald Trump would end up dying in where Donald Trump would end up dying in where Donald Trump would end up dying in that small town in that small town in that small town in Pennsylvania history would write a new Pennsylvania history would write a new Pennsylvania history would write a new dramatic chapter the contents of which dramatic chapter the contents of which dramatic chapter the contents of which all the so-called experts and pundits all the so-called experts and pundits all the so-called experts and pundits would not be able to predict it very would not be able to predict it very would not be able to predict it very well could have led to a civil war well could have led to a civil war well could have led to a civil war because the true depth of the division because the true depth of the division because the true depth of the division in the country is unknown we only see in the country is unknown we only see in the country is unknown we only see the surface turmoil on social media and the surface turmoil on social media and the surface turmoil on social media and so on and in his events like the so on and in his events like the so on and in his events like the assassination of arch Duke France assassination of arch Duke France assassination of arch Duke France Ferdinand where we we as a human species Ferdinand where we we as a human species Ferdinand where we we as a human species get to find out what the truth is of get to find out what the truth is of get to find out what the truth is of where people really where people really where people really stand the task then is to try and make stand the task then is to try and make stand the task then is to try and make our society maximally resilient and our society maximally resilient and our society maximally resilient and robust as such destabilizing events the robust as such destabilizing events the robust as such destabilizing events the way to do that I think is to properly way to do that I think is to properly way to do that I think is to properly identify the threat the enemy it's not identify the threat the enemy it's not identify the threat the enemy it's not the left or the right that are the quote the left or the right that are the quote the left or the right that are the quote enemy extreme division itself is the enemy extreme division itself is the enemy extreme division itself is the enemy some division is productive it's enemy some division is productive it's enemy some division is productive it's how we develop good ideas and policies how we develop good ideas and policies how we develop good ideas and policies but too much leads to the spread of but too much leads to the spread of but too much leads to the spread of resentment and hate that can boil over resentment and hate that can boil over resentment and hate that can boil over into destruction on a global scale so we into destruction on a global scale so we into destruction on a global scale so we must absolutely avoid the slide into must absolutely avoid the slide into must absolutely avoid the slide into extreme division there are many ways to extreme division there are many ways to extreme division there are many ways to do this and perhaps it's a discussion do this and perhaps it's a discussion do this and perhaps it's a discussion for another time but at the very basic for another time but at the very basic for another time but at the very basic level let's continuously try to turn level let's continuously try to turn level let's continuously try to turn down the temperature of the partisan

down the temperature of the partisan down the temperature of the partisan bickering and more often celebrate our bickering and more often celebrate our bickering and more often celebrate our obvious common Humanity now let me also obvious common Humanity now let me also obvious common Humanity now let me also comment on conspiracy theories I've been comment on conspiracy theories I've been comment on conspiracy theories I've been hearing a lot of those hearing a lot of those hearing a lot of those recently I think they play an important recently I think they play an important recently I think they play an important role in society they ask questions that role in society they ask questions that role in society they ask questions that serve as a check on Power and Corruption serve as a check on Power and Corruption serve as a check on Power and Corruption of centralized of centralized of centralized institutions the way to answer the institutions the way to answer the institutions the way to answer the questions raised by conspiracy theories questions raised by conspiracy theories questions raised by conspiracy theories is not by dismissing them with arrogance is not by dismissing them with arrogance is not by dismissing them with arrogance and feigned ignorance but with and feigned ignorance but with and feigned ignorance but with transparency and transparency and transparency and accountability in this particular case accountability in this particular case accountability in this particular case the obvious question that needs an the obvious question that needs an the obvious question that needs an honest answer is why did the Secret honest answer is why did the Secret honest answer is why did the Secret Service fail so terribly in protecting Service fail so terribly in protecting Service fail so terribly in protecting the former the former the former president the story we're supposed to president the story we're supposed to president the story we're supposed to believe is that a 20-year-old untrained believe is that a 20-year-old untrained believe is that a 20-year-old untrained loner was able to outsmart the Secret loner was able to outsmart the Secret loner was able to outsmart the Secret Service by finding the optimal location Service by finding the optimal location Service by finding the optimal location on a roof for a shot on Trump from 130 on a roof for a shot on Trump from 130 on a roof for a shot on Trump from 130 yards away even though the Secret yards away even though the Secret yards away even though the Secret Service sniper spotted him on the roof Service sniper spotted him on the roof Service sniper spotted him on the roof 20 minutes before the shooting and did 20 minutes before the shooting and did 20 minutes before the shooting and did nothing about it nothing about it nothing about it this looks really shady to this looks really shady to this looks really shady to everyone why does it take so long to get everyone why does it take so long to get everyone why does it take so long to get to a full accounting of the truth of to a full accounting of the truth of to a full accounting of the truth of what happened and why is the reporting what happened and why is the reporting what happened and why is the reporting of the truth concealed by corporate of the truth concealed by corporate of the truth concealed by corporate governments speak cut the bullshit what governments speak cut the bullshit what governments speak cut the bullshit what happened who fucked up and why that's happened who fucked up and why that's happened who fucked up and why that's what we need to know that's the what we need to know that's the what we need to know that's the beginning of transparency and yes the beginning of transparency and yes the beginning of transparency and yes the director of the US Secret Service should director of the US Secret Service should director of the US Secret Service should probably step down or be fired by the

probably step down or be fired by the probably step down or be fired by the president and not as part of some president and not as part of some president and not as part of some political circus that I'm sure is coming political circus that I'm sure is coming political circus that I'm sure is coming but as a step towards uniting an but as a step towards uniting an but as a step towards uniting an increasingly divided and cynical increasingly divided and cynical increasingly divided and cynical Nation conspiracy theories are not noise Nation conspiracy theories are not noise Nation conspiracy theories are not noise even when they're false they are a even when they're false they are a even when they're false they are a signal that some shady corrupt secret signal that some shady corrupt secret signal that some shady corrupt secret bullshit is being done by those trying bullshit is being done by those trying bullshit is being done by those trying to hold on to power not always but often to hold on to power not always but often to hold on to power not always but often transparency is the answer here not transparency is the answer here not transparency is the answer here not secrecy if we don't do these things we secrecy if we don't do these things we secrecy if we don't do these things we leave ourselves vulnerable the singular leave ourselves vulnerable the singular leave ourselves vulnerable the singular moments that turn the tides of History moments that turn the tides of History moments that turn the tides of History Empires do fall Civil Wars do break out Empires do fall Civil Wars do break out Empires do fall Civil Wars do break out and tear apart the fabric of and tear apart the fabric of and tear apart the fabric of societies this is a great nation the societies this is a great nation the societies this is a great nation the most successful Collective human most successful Collective human most successful Collective human experiment in the history of Earth and experiment in the history of Earth and experiment in the history of Earth and letting ourselves become extremely letting ourselves become extremely letting ourselves become extremely divided risks destroying all of that so divided risks destroying all of that so divided risks destroying all of that so please ignore the political pundits the please ignore the political pundits the please ignore the political pundits the political grifters clickbait media political grifters clickbait media political grifters clickbait media outrage fueling politicians on the right outrage fueling politicians on the right outrage fueling politicians on the right and the left who try to divide us we're and the left who try to divide us we're and the left who try to divide us we're not so divided we're in this not so divided we're in this not so divided we're in this together as I've said many times before together as I've said many times before together as I've said many times before I love you I love you I love you all this is a long comment I'm hoping all this is a long comment I'm hoping all this is a long comment I'm hoping not to do comments this long in the not to do comments this long in the not to do comments this long in the future and hoping to do many more so future and hoping to do many more so future and hoping to do many more so I'll I'll leave it here for today but I'll I'll leave it here for today but I'll I'll leave it here for today but I'll try to answer questions and make I'll try to answer questions and make I'll try to answer questions and make comments on every episode if you would

comments on every episode if you would comments on every episode if you would like to submit questions like I met like to submit questions like I met like to submit questions like I met mentioned including audio and video form mentioned including audio and video form mentioned including audio and video form go Lex freeman.com go Lex freeman.com go Lex freeman.com and now let me leave you with some words and now let me leave you with some words and now let me leave you with some words from Ralph Waldo from Ralph Waldo from Ralph Waldo Emerson adopt the pace of nature her Emerson adopt the pace of nature her Emerson adopt the pace of nature her secret is secret is secret is patience thank you for listening and patience thank you for listening and patience thank you for listening and hope to see you next time