The Xbox Adaptive Joystick with Kaitlyn Jones

hey friends you know here at Hansel hey friends you know here at Hansel minutes we like to appreciate our minutes we like to appreciate our minutes we like to appreciate our sponsors so I'm talking directly to JD sponsors so I'm talking directly to JD sponsors so I'm talking directly to JD from Ray gun.com JD everyone sprinkling from Ray gun.com JD everyone sprinkling from Ray gun.com JD everyone sprinkling AI on stuff I feel like error resolution AI on stuff I feel like error resolution AI on stuff I feel like error resolution needs AI can you help oh I absolutely needs AI can you help oh I absolutely needs AI can you help oh I absolutely can help you with that yeah ray gun now can help you with that yeah ray gun now can help you with that yeah ray gun now includes AI error resolution which includes AI error resolution which includes AI error resolution which allows a developer to get a better allows a developer to get a better allows a developer to get a better understanding of what may be causing a understanding of what may be causing a understanding of what may be causing a fault and I got to be honest quite often fault and I got to be honest quite often fault and I got to be honest quite often I read those responses and you know the I read those responses and you know the I read those responses and you know the reason for the fault is actually reason for the fault is actually reason for the fault is actually something quite basic and I've just something quite basic and I've just something quite basic and I've just forgotten about it so having those forgotten about it so having those forgotten about it so having those little bit of prompts really saves me a little bit of prompts really saves me a little bit of prompts really saves me a lot of time it's kind of like having the lot of time it's kind of like having the lot of time it's kind of like having the rubber duck debugging built right into rubber duck debugging built right into rubber duck debugging built right into the product I love it auto prompt with the product I love it auto prompt with the product I love it auto prompt with your chosen large language model you get your chosen large language model you get your chosen large language model you get all that error context from your stack all that error context from your stack all that error context from your stack Trace from your environment and your Trace from your environment and your Trace from your environment and your affected code you can take a look at affected code you can take a look at affected code you can take a look at run.com for a 14-day free trial and use run.com for a 14-day free trial and use run.com for a 14-day free trial and use the code Hanselman for half price the code Hanselman for half price the code Hanselman for half price monitoring for your first month monitoring for your first month monitoring for your first month [Music] hi I'm Scott hansome and this is another hi I'm Scott hansome and this is another episode of hansome minutes today I'm episode of hansome minutes today I'm episode of hansome minutes today I'm chatting with senior product manager chatting with senior product manager chatting with senior product manager Caitlyn Jones who works on Xbox Caitlyn Jones who works on Xbox Caitlyn Jones who works on Xbox accessibilities and the new Xbox accessibilities and the new Xbox accessibilities and the new Xbox adaptive joystick how's it going pretty adaptive joystick how's it going pretty adaptive joystick how's it going pretty good how are you Scott I am very well good how are you Scott I am very well good how are you Scott I am very well you know I uh am a big fan of the Xbox you know I uh am a big fan of the Xbox you know I uh am a big fan of the Xbox adaptive controller this is the kind of adaptive controller this is the kind of adaptive controller this is the kind of white uh slate it's like like a tablet white uh slate it's like like a tablet white uh slate it's like like a tablet and it's got two giant black buttons on

and it's got two giant black buttons on and it's got two giant black buttons on them and when I had my shoulder surgery them and when I had my shoulder surgery them and when I had my shoulder surgery and I couldn't play Xbox for a while I and I couldn't play Xbox for a while I and I couldn't play Xbox for a while I used that controller and I've actually used that controller and I've actually used that controller and I've actually set that controller up for multiple set that controller up for multiple set that controller up for multiple people where I've actually gone to their people where I've actually gone to their people where I've actually gone to their house brought them the controller set it house brought them the controller set it house brought them the controller set it up some people had you know wheelchairs up some people had you know wheelchairs up some people had you know wheelchairs some people had maybe cuple paly some people had maybe cuple paly some people had maybe cuple paly everyone's different so you set it up in everyone's different so you set it up in everyone's different so you set it up in different ways and uh it's been a killer different ways and uh it's been a killer different ways and uh it's been a killer product I mean people love the Adaptive product I mean people love the Adaptive product I mean people love the Adaptive controller don't they they do and I controller don't they they do and I controller don't they they do and I think what you just said really think what you just said really think what you just said really showcases the beauty of it that you know showcases the beauty of it that you know showcases the beauty of it that you know someone with a more I guess extreme someone with a more I guess extreme someone with a more I guess extreme limited Mobility can use it but also limited Mobility can use it but also limited Mobility can use it but also just following a shoulder surgery and just following a shoulder surgery and just following a shoulder surgery and you're trying to protect that that you're trying to protect that that you're trying to protect that that movement it's it's great for that too movement it's it's great for that too movement it's it's great for that too yeah I have video of me on um on YouTube yeah I have video of me on um on YouTube yeah I have video of me on um on YouTube like using my right foot my left foot to like using my right foot my left foot to like using my right foot my left foot to like shoot because the AR my right arm like shoot because the AR my right arm like shoot because the AR my right arm was just you the whole thing was was just you the whole thing was was just you the whole thing was paralyzed for for a while so I just paralyzed for for a while so I just paralyzed for for a while so I just plugged it in and I got to use it and it plugged it in and I got to use it and it plugged it in and I got to use it and it was like unlimited remapping and if was like unlimited remapping and if was like unlimited remapping and if people haven't seen this they really got people haven't seen this they really got people haven't seen this they really got to go check out Xbox adaptive controller to go check out Xbox adaptive controller to go check out Xbox adaptive controller because it's not a controller this is because it's not a controller this is because it's not a controller this is the part that I think is so funny I'm the part that I think is so funny I'm the part that I think is so funny I'm you call it the Xbox adapter controller you call it the Xbox adapter controller you call it the Xbox adapter controller it's a controller construction kit and I it's a controller construction kit and I it's a controller construction kit and I think when I started thinking about it think when I started thinking about it think when I started thinking about it like that for me that clicked more than like that for me that clicked more than like that for me that clicked more than like what are these two giant black like what are these two giant black like what are these two giant black buttons for like how is this buttons for like how is this buttons for like how is this adaptive yeah totally I do love that we adaptive yeah totally I do love that we adaptive yeah totally I do love that we call it a controller so people know call it a controller so people know call it a controller so people know it'll work wherever and Xbox controller it'll work wherever and Xbox controller it'll work wherever and Xbox controller works it's seen as a controller by games works it's seen as a controller by games works it's seen as a controller by games but I similarly I think of it kind of

but I similarly I think of it kind of but I similarly I think of it kind of like a hub like it's a hub you can plug like a hub like it's a hub you can plug like a hub like it's a hub you can plug in what you need and it it sends those in what you need and it it sends those in what you need and it it sends those inputs back to your your console or your inputs back to your your console or your inputs back to your your console or your PC so when you plug it in it shows up as PC so when you plug it in it shows up as PC so when you plug it in it shows up as a a hid right a hardware input device a a hid right a hardware input device a a hid right a hardware input device you don't have to there's no drivers for you don't have to there's no drivers for you don't have to there's no drivers for the thing you just plug it in and your the thing you just plug it in and your the thing you just plug it in and your machine goes oh Xbox controller but machine goes oh Xbox controller but machine goes oh Xbox controller but there's a whole Xbox accessories app on there's a whole Xbox accessories app on there's a whole Xbox accessories app on Xbox so the Xbox knows that it's special Xbox so the Xbox knows that it's special Xbox so the Xbox knows that it's special and the Xbox then allows you to do and the Xbox then allows you to do and the Xbox then allows you to do unlimited uh customization right yeah unlimited uh customization right yeah unlimited uh customization right yeah and it'll it'll work on the PC version and it'll it'll work on the PC version and it'll it'll work on the PC version of the accessories app too and one of my of the accessories app too and one of my of the accessories app too and one of my favorite things is that the Adaptive favorite things is that the Adaptive favorite things is that the Adaptive controller will actually store your controller will actually store your controller will actually store your remap profiles on the device itself you remap profiles on the device itself you remap profiles on the device itself you can store up to three and save them can store up to three and save them can store up to three and save them right onto the physical Hardware so you right onto the physical Hardware so you right onto the physical Hardware so you can then bring that to another console can then bring that to another console can then bring that to another console or your friend's house and your your or your friend's house and your your or your friend's house and your your remappings are already saved onto the remappings are already saved onto the remappings are already saved onto the device oh that's cool see that's a small device oh that's cool see that's a small device oh that's cool see that's a small thing but a huge thing right like you thing but a huge thing right like you thing but a huge thing right like you could have you all the program managers could have you all the program managers could have you all the program managers have stored that in the cloud somewhere have stored that in the cloud somewhere have stored that in the cloud somewhere but by storing it in firmware on the but by storing it in firmware on the but by storing it in firmware on the device itself means that it really is device itself means that it really is device itself means that it really is yours and you carry it to your friend's yours and you carry it to your friend's yours and you carry it to your friend's house and you plug it in and you just house and you plug it in and you just house and you plug it in and you just keep doing your thing exactly see this keep doing your thing exactly see this keep doing your thing exactly see this is the thing that I appreciate and I is the thing that I appreciate and I is the thing that I appreciate and I really like you know I I wish Microsoft really like you know I I wish Microsoft really like you know I I wish Microsoft hardware and by that I mean like all up hardware and by that I mean like all up hardware and by that I mean like all up mice keyboard any you know webcams was mice keyboard any you know webcams was mice keyboard any you know webcams was was still really a thing because I think was still really a thing because I think was still really a thing because I think Microsoft does a really good job at this Microsoft does a really good job at this Microsoft does a really good job at this and the the little joyful notes of like

and the the little joyful notes of like and the the little joyful notes of like the Adaptive controller and the work the Adaptive controller and the work the Adaptive controller and the work that happens in the Xbox controller team that happens in the Xbox controller team that happens in the Xbox controller team is so clever like for example let me is so clever like for example let me is so clever like for example let me talk about the top row talk tell me talk about the top row talk tell me talk about the top row talk tell me about the the Adaptive controllers top about the the Adaptive controllers top about the the Adaptive controllers top row because it looks like a bunch of row because it looks like a bunch of row because it looks like a bunch of headphone Jacks yeah that is pretty much headphone Jacks yeah that is pretty much headphone Jacks yeah that is pretty much what they are um but they're there's 19 what they are um but they're there's 19 what they are um but they're there's 19 3.5 mm ports and they have labels across 3.5 mm ports and they have labels across 3.5 mm ports and they have labels across all of them so every button that you'd all of them so every button that you'd all of them so every button that you'd find on a standard controller abxy find on a standard controller abxy find on a standard controller abxy triggers bumpers um they are all triggers bumpers um they are all triggers bumpers um they are all externalized to these ports so you can externalized to these ports so you can externalized to these ports so you can just take whatever switch button you just take whatever switch button you just take whatever switch button you want plug it into any of them and by want plug it into any of them and by want plug it into any of them and by default it'll be mapped to what's default it'll be mapped to what's default it'll be mapped to what's labeled on it but then you can also labeled on it but then you can also labeled on it but then you can also change it um my favorite thing is that change it um my favorite thing is that change it um my favorite thing is that there's actually two ports that are kind there's actually two ports that are kind there's actually two ports that are kind of wild card ports we call them uh and of wild card ports we call them uh and of wild card ports we call them uh and they're not mapped to anything they're they're not mapped to anything they're they're not mapped to anything they're just called X1 and X2 and um this way just called X1 and X2 and um this way just called X1 and X2 and um this way you know you're not taking away another you know you're not taking away another you know you're not taking away another button if you remap one that's already button if you remap one that's already button if you remap one that's already in place on a default assignment you can in place on a default assignment you can in place on a default assignment you can remap them to whatever you want and uh remap them to whatever you want and uh remap them to whatever you want and uh they're more than just digital and they're more than just digital and they're more than just digital and analog you can actually connect like a analog you can actually connect like a analog you can actually connect like a 10K potentiometer joystick into those X1 10K potentiometer joystick into those X1 10K potentiometer joystick into those X1 and X2 ports and uh use them for for and X2 ports and uh use them for for and X2 ports and uh use them for for joystick movement too so the head the joystick movement too so the head the joystick movement too so the head the thing about headphone Jacks these 3.5mm thing about headphone Jacks these 3.5mm thing about headphone Jacks these 3.5mm headphone Jacks is that they are really headphone Jacks is that they are really headphone Jacks is that they are really just two wires disguised as a headphone just two wires disguised as a headphone just two wires disguised as a headphone right so if you're a mechanical engineer right so if you're a mechanical engineer right so if you're a mechanical engineer type person you can go and buy the this type person you can go and buy the this type person you can go and buy the this is this is a little Advanced but you is this is a little Advanced but you is this is a little Advanced but you could go and buy a headphone jack and an could go and buy a headphone jack and an could go and buy a headphone jack and an Arduino or a widget or what whatever Arduino or a widget or what whatever Arduino or a widget or what whatever button or thing you can imagine 3D print button or thing you can imagine 3D print button or thing you can imagine 3D print and wire up to as long as your two wires

and wire up to as long as your two wires and wire up to as long as your two wires terminate in this end you could make terminate in this end you could make terminate in this end you could make your own button you could make your own your own button you could make your own your own button you could make your own anything as long as it can effectively anything as long as it can effectively anything as long as it can effectively turn two wires into a headphone jack and turn two wires into a headphone jack and turn two wires into a headphone jack and tell the adapter controller to do a tell the adapter controller to do a tell the adapter controller to do a thing is that correct yeah exactly and thing is that correct yeah exactly and thing is that correct yeah exactly and we've seen people make really cool we've seen people make really cool we've seen people make really cool buttons too like we have folks who work buttons too like we have folks who work buttons too like we have folks who work with kids with autism um who might have with kids with autism um who might have with kids with autism um who might have sensory processing disorder and the sensory processing disorder and the sensory processing disorder and the clickiness or sound of buttons is just clickiness or sound of buttons is just clickiness or sound of buttons is just um not something that they enjoy so um not something that they enjoy so um not something that they enjoy so they've made pillow buttons where you they've made pillow buttons where you they've made pillow buttons where you just squeeze the pillow and that's what just squeeze the pillow and that's what just squeeze the pillow and that's what connects the two wires and sends it as a connects the two wires and sends it as a connects the two wires and sends it as a button press and just all different button press and just all different button press and just all different textures and and stuff like that it's textures and and stuff like that it's textures and and stuff like that it's been really cool to see that is so cool been really cool to see that is so cool been really cool to see that is so cool um okay so then fast forward a couple of um okay so then fast forward a couple of um okay so then fast forward a couple of years everyone loves the Xbox adaptive years everyone loves the Xbox adaptive years everyone loves the Xbox adaptive controller uh it exists you can buy it controller uh it exists you can buy it controller uh it exists you can buy it is really very well priced it's not a is really very well priced it's not a is really very well priced it's not a expensive I think it's actually cheaper expensive I think it's actually cheaper expensive I think it's actually cheaper than a regular controller um and you can than a regular controller um and you can than a regular controller um and you can go and do whatever you want to with it go and do whatever you want to with it go and do whatever you want to with it and now the Xbox adaptive joystick is and now the Xbox adaptive joystick is and now the Xbox adaptive joystick is coming early next year and this is a coming early next year and this is a coming early next year and this is a this is a another kind of Xbox adaptive this is a another kind of Xbox adaptive this is a another kind of Xbox adaptive controller or it's a companion to the controller or it's a companion to the controller or it's a companion to the existing adaptive uh Hub it is more of a existing adaptive uh Hub it is more of a existing adaptive uh Hub it is more of a companion to the existing adaptive Hub companion to the existing adaptive Hub companion to the existing adaptive Hub it's got a thumb stick and six buttons it's got a thumb stick and six buttons it's got a thumb stick and six buttons on it so using just that joystick Alone on it so using just that joystick Alone on it so using just that joystick Alone um you know you might need a few more um you know you might need a few more um you know you might need a few more buttons If you're playing a more intense buttons If you're playing a more intense buttons If you're playing a more intense game that has more inputs than six game that has more inputs than six game that has more inputs than six buttons but I think the beauty of it too buttons but I think the beauty of it too buttons but I think the beauty of it too is that it'll work with the Adaptive is that it'll work with the Adaptive is that it'll work with the Adaptive controller it's a fantastic companion

controller it's a fantastic companion controller it's a fantastic companion for it but if you don't have an Adaptive for it but if you don't have an Adaptive for it but if you don't have an Adaptive controller or don't need one you will be controller or don't need one you will be controller or don't need one you will be able to connect the Adaptive joystick able to connect the Adaptive joystick able to connect the Adaptive joystick directly to your PC or console and and directly to your PC or console and and directly to your PC or console and and use that alone or use it with Xbox use that alone or use it with Xbox use that alone or use it with Xbox controller assist which is forly our controller assist which is forly our controller assist which is forly our Xbox co-pilot feature um and use it with Xbox co-pilot feature um and use it with Xbox co-pilot feature um and use it with another standard controller kind of another standard controller kind of another standard controller kind of combinations of different controllers combinations of different controllers combinations of different controllers too yeah that co-pilot assist thing uh too yeah that co-pilot assist thing uh too yeah that co-pilot assist thing uh that was a word before co-pilot got that was a word before co-pilot got that was a word before co-pilot got taken over by the AI people was this taken over by the AI people was this taken over by the AI people was this idea that uh you can virtually split a idea that uh you can virtually split a idea that uh you can virtually split a controller in half and I'll do the head controller in half and I'll do the head controller in half and I'll do the head and you do the body at least that's what and you do the body at least that's what and you do the body at least that's what I did when my kids and I were playing I did when my kids and I were playing I did when my kids and I were playing Halo and they couldn't get the left Halo and they couldn't get the left Halo and they couldn't get the left thumb and the right thumb to work thumb and the right thumb to work thumb and the right thumb to work together okay you run around and shoot together okay you run around and shoot together okay you run around and shoot and I'll move the head so you can and I'll move the head so you can and I'll move the head so you can virtually split stuff up this is a virtually split stuff up this is a virtually split stuff up this is a single thumb stick right so it's one of single thumb stick right so it's one of single thumb stick right so it's one of the two thumb sticks and you could the two thumb sticks and you could the two thumb sticks and you could potentially buy two I suppose right yep potentially buy two I suppose right yep potentially buy two I suppose right yep and use them in left hand and right hand and use them in left hand and right hand and use them in left hand and right hand kind of like a meta Quest yeah exactly kind of like a meta Quest yeah exactly kind of like a meta Quest yeah exactly if you wanted to and are they if you wanted to and are they if you wanted to and are they left-handed and right-handed or is it left-handed and right-handed or is it left-handed and right-handed or is it it's just universally handed they are it's just universally handed they are it's just universally handed they are ambidextrous and that was actually ambidextrous and that was actually ambidextrous and that was actually something that was really important to something that was really important to something that was really important to us when we were um kind of deciding on us when we were um kind of deciding on us when we were um kind of deciding on the form factor and the the design of it the form factor and the the design of it the form factor and the the design of it was making sure that um it wasn't was making sure that um it wasn't was making sure that um it wasn't specific to one hand or the other and specific to one hand or the other and specific to one hand or the other and and cater to more broader needs MH I'm and cater to more broader needs MH I'm and cater to more broader needs MH I'm looking at the website and I'll put a looking at the website and I'll put a looking at the website and I'll put a link to this in the show notes and I link to this in the show notes and I link to this in the show notes and I really think it's important that people really think it's important that people really think it's important that people look at this um right at the top you see look at this um right at the top you see look at this um right at the top you see the joystick and it's got you know a the joystick and it's got you know a the joystick and it's got you know a pretty typical looking Xbox thumb stick

pretty typical looking Xbox thumb stick pretty typical looking Xbox thumb stick and it's got not buttons marked uh ab and it's got not buttons marked uh ab and it's got not buttons marked uh ab and X and Y but it's rather it says one and X and Y but it's rather it says one and X and Y but it's rather it says one two 3 and uh and four with an X in front two 3 and uh and four with an X in front two 3 and uh and four with an X in front of it I want to talk about that in a of it I want to talk about that in a of it I want to talk about that in a second but there's a young lady who is second but there's a young lady who is second but there's a young lady who is got some limb differences and she's got got some limb differences and she's got got some limb differences and she's got the controller kind of pushed up against the controller kind of pushed up against the controller kind of pushed up against her her chin and I'm looking at this her her chin and I'm looking at this her her chin and I'm looking at this ball that she's pushing which is ball that she's pushing which is ball that she's pushing which is basically an extension on top of the uh basically an extension on top of the uh basically an extension on top of the uh the thumbstick and it it looks very the thumbstick and it it looks very the thumbstick and it it looks very familiar and I realize it's because I'm familiar and I realize it's because I'm familiar and I realize it's because I'm a 3D printing person it has texture on a 3D printing person it has texture on a 3D printing person it has texture on it that is not something that comes with it that is not something that comes with it that is not something that comes with a joystick have they 3D printed an a joystick have they 3D printed an a joystick have they 3D printed an extension joystick there yes it's extension joystick there yes it's extension joystick there yes it's actually another new program that we actually another new program that we actually another new program that we announced when we announced the the announced when we announced the the announced when we announced the the joystick in August of this year um it's joystick in August of this year um it's joystick in August of this year um it's the Adaptive Toppers with Xbox Design the Adaptive Toppers with Xbox Design the Adaptive Toppers with Xbox Design Lab where you can actually go the same Lab where you can actually go the same Lab where you can actually go the same place that you would design customize place that you would design customize place that you would design customize controller colors and that sort of thing controller colors and that sort of thing controller colors and that sort of thing in in Design Lab uh we now have a in in Design Lab uh we now have a in in Design Lab uh we now have a separate section that is adaptive separate section that is adaptive separate section that is adaptive Toppers so you can choose between the Toppers so you can choose between the Toppers so you can choose between the Adaptive joystick the elite controller Adaptive joystick the elite controller Adaptive joystick the elite controller or uh just a standard series XS or uh just a standard series XS or uh just a standard series XS controller and uh choose from I think controller and uh choose from I think controller and uh choose from I think six different topper shapes adjust the six different topper shapes adjust the six different topper shapes adjust the height and the width of those Toppers height and the width of those Toppers height and the width of those Toppers and it'll give you a a free 3D printable and it'll give you a a free 3D printable and it'll give you a a free 3D printable STL file that you can then take to a STL file that you can then take to a STL file that you can then take to a printer or send to a printing service if printer or send to a printing service if printer or send to a printing service if you don't have access to one um and and you don't have access to one um and and you don't have access to one um and and really customize the how you grip the really customize the how you grip the really customize the how you grip the thumb sticks on our controllers even thumb sticks on our controllers even thumb sticks on our controllers even more I thought this was really amazing

more I thought this was really amazing more I thought this was really amazing uh and I'll put a link to this as well uh and I'll put a link to this as well uh and I'll put a link to this as well this is Xbox designlab this is Xbox designlab this is Xbox designlab xbox.com these STL files you can just xbox.com these STL files you can just xbox.com these STL files you can just bring them in and print them out it bring them in and print them out it bring them in and print them out it takes literally 15 minutes to print takes literally 15 minutes to print takes literally 15 minutes to print these out how are they clicking in these out how are they clicking in these out how are they clicking in though because I noticed that it's not though because I noticed that it's not though because I noticed that it's not just adaptive toppers for the Adaptive just adaptive toppers for the Adaptive just adaptive toppers for the Adaptive controller in the picture here I see an controller in the picture here I see an controller in the picture here I see an Elite controller that has an Adaptive Elite controller that has an Adaptive Elite controller that has an Adaptive knob attached as well is that a magnet knob attached as well is that a magnet knob attached as well is that a magnet is this a screw how does that thing is this a screw how does that thing is this a screw how does that thing attach yeah it it differs so for the the attach yeah it it differs so for the the attach yeah it it differs so for the the standard it's more of a claw that standard it's more of a claw that standard it's more of a claw that attaches to it but for the elite um and attaches to it but for the elite um and attaches to it but for the elite um and the same way that you can remove the the same way that you can remove the the same way that you can remove the entire thumbstick metal cap uh you just entire thumbstick metal cap uh you just entire thumbstick metal cap uh you just take the full thumb stick off and then take the full thumb stick off and then take the full thumb stick off and then this has that same attachment this has that same attachment this has that same attachment circumference and you just pop that one circumference and you just pop that one circumference and you just pop that one on where your Elite stick would have sat on where your Elite stick would have sat on where your Elite stick would have sat otherwise that's so cool I wonder did otherwise that's so cool I wonder did otherwise that's so cool I wonder did they think about that or did like what they think about that or did like what they think about that or did like what came first the Adaptive idea or just you came first the Adaptive idea or just you came first the Adaptive idea or just you know like how did y all think oh you know like how did y all think oh you know like how did y all think oh you know we could also adapt the elite know we could also adapt the elite know we could also adapt the elite controllers too um I think it just came controllers too um I think it just came controllers too um I think it just came naturally like we wanted to make sure naturally like we wanted to make sure naturally like we wanted to make sure that we if we were offering this sort of that we if we were offering this sort of that we if we were offering this sort of customization for One Suite of customization for One Suite of customization for One Suite of controllers that anyone uh who had a controllers that anyone uh who had a controllers that anyone uh who had a different controller like the elite different controller like the elite different controller like the elite could do it too but we also know that could do it too but we also know that could do it too but we also know that the elite controller is really important the elite controller is really important the elite controller is really important for a lot of our players with for a lot of our players with for a lot of our players with disabilities uh the paddles on the back disabilities uh the paddles on the back disabilities uh the paddles on the back are great the customization is great so are great the customization is great so are great the customization is great so um if anything making sure it was uh um if anything making sure it was uh um if anything making sure it was uh available for the elite controller was available for the elite controller was available for the elite controller was even more important because we know how even more important because we know how even more important because we know how many players with disabilities use it many players with disabilities use it many players with disabilities use it yeah now people might be listening and yeah now people might be listening and yeah now people might be listening and say well that's great for the people who say well that's great for the people who say well that's great for the people who know how to design things and have know how to design things and have know how to design things and have industrial engineering degrees and have

industrial engineering degrees and have industrial engineering degrees and have a 3D printer but let me tell you the a 3D printer but let me tell you the a 3D printer but let me tell you the tool that you're designing it in is tool that you're designing it in is tool that you're designing it in is actually interactive and you can see it actually interactive and you can see it actually interactive and you can see it visually you don't have to go into like visually you don't have to go into like visually you don't have to go into like Fusion 360 with a with a calipers and it Fusion 360 with a with a calipers and it Fusion 360 with a with a calipers and it takes care of it for you so you can pick takes care of it for you so you can pick takes care of it for you so you can pick the topper change the width change the the topper change the width change the the topper change the width change the height and if you don't have a 3D height and if you don't have a 3D height and if you don't have a 3D printer you can just go to the library printer you can just go to the library printer you can just go to the library and your local library can print one of and your local library can print one of and your local library can print one of these out and it's not hours it's it's these out and it's not hours it's it's these out and it's not hours it's it's minutes to print these out and test them minutes to print these out and test them minutes to print these out and test them and try again it's super and try again it's super and try again it's super cool hey friends for the next couple of cool hey friends for the next couple of cool hey friends for the next couple of episodes as I learn more about AI I'm episodes as I learn more about AI I'm episodes as I learn more about AI I'm going to take a moment in the middle of going to take a moment in the middle of going to take a moment in the middle of the show and chat with ler van dor from the show and chat with ler van dor from the show and chat with ler van dor from Qualcomm I thought that Qualcomm was Qualcomm I thought that Qualcomm was Qualcomm I thought that Qualcomm was putting special herbs and spices and putting special herbs and spices and putting special herbs and spices and making things in the Silicon that are making things in the Silicon that are making things in the Silicon that are secret but all the great work that secret but all the great work that secret but all the great work that you're doing is in open source software you're doing is in open source software you're doing is in open source software how do you balance being an IP company how do you balance being an IP company how do you balance being an IP company and doing so much open source oh that's and doing so much open source oh that's and doing so much open source oh that's a great question uh open source is a a great question uh open source is a a great question uh open source is a necessity nowadays right if you look at necessity nowadays right if you look at necessity nowadays right if you look at all these new businesses that were going all these new businesses that were going all these new businesses that were going in XR PC Auto uh iot right open source in XR PC Auto uh iot right open source in XR PC Auto uh iot right open source is the name of the game there and so we is the name of the game there and so we is the name of the game there and so we have to participate that doesn't mean have to participate that doesn't mean have to participate that doesn't mean that we're giving up all our secrets that we're giving up all our secrets that we're giving up all our secrets right there is still a lot of secret right there is still a lot of secret right there is still a lot of secret saws and how we Implement things but how saws and how we Implement things but how saws and how we Implement things but how you use it right how developers can use you use it right how developers can use you use it right how developers can use it that b needs to be open because again it that b needs to be open because again it that b needs to be open because again developers are the ones that make our

developers are the ones that make our developers are the ones that make our platform valuable so we want to have platform valuable so we want to have platform valuable so we want to have them we want to give them every them we want to give them every them we want to give them every opportunity to use our platform and to opportunity to use our platform and to opportunity to use our platform and to enable for our platform yeah and Y all enable for our platform yeah and Y all enable for our platform yeah and Y all at qualcom are starting to show up in at qualcom are starting to show up in at qualcom are starting to show up in all of the spaces that developers are I all of the spaces that developers are I all of the spaces that developers are I see you in GitHub issues I see you in see you in GitHub issues I see you in see you in GitHub issues I see you in the discords they're out there the the discords they're out there the the discords they're out there the engineers from Qualcomm helping uh engineers from Qualcomm helping uh engineers from Qualcomm helping uh enable these new tools uh on your s enable these new tools uh on your s enable these new tools uh on your s soc's it's so amazing exactly soc's it's so amazing exactly soc's it's so amazing exactly participation is so important you can participation is so important you can participation is so important you can learn more about all the great stuff learn more about all the great stuff learn more about all the great stuff that's happening at Qualcomm at that's happening at Qualcomm at that's happening at Qualcomm at qualcomm.com qualcomm.com qualcomm.com developers the uh the Xbox adaptive developers the uh the Xbox adaptive developers the uh the Xbox adaptive joystick looks like a uh like I joystick looks like a uh like I joystick looks like a uh like I mentioned the W uh it looks like a Wii mentioned the W uh it looks like a Wii mentioned the W uh it looks like a Wii nunchuk um you know there's there's nunchuk um you know there's there's nunchuk um you know there's there's there's been things like this before how there's been things like this before how there's been things like this before how is it more than that how is it you know is it more than that how is it you know is it more than that how is it you know what is it what features does it have what is it what features does it have what is it what features does it have that make it Beyond just a handheld that make it Beyond just a handheld that make it Beyond just a handheld thumbstick yeah I think as compared to thumbstick yeah I think as compared to thumbstick yeah I think as compared to the Wii nunchuk it's got more buttons on the Wii nunchuk it's got more buttons on the Wii nunchuk it's got more buttons on it it has those four face buttons on the it it has those four face buttons on the it it has those four face buttons on the front of it um I think the biggest front of it um I think the biggest front of it um I think the biggest difference which is also one of my difference which is also one of my difference which is also one of my favorite aspects of the device is it's favorite aspects of the device is it's favorite aspects of the device is it's got on the bottom of it a quarter 20 got on the bottom of it a quarter 20 got on the bottom of it a quarter 20 threaded insert so you can take any kind threaded insert so you can take any kind threaded insert so you can take any kind of like standard tripod mount for of like standard tripod mount for of like standard tripod mount for cameras things like that and just twist cameras things like that and just twist cameras things like that and just twist it into the bottom and it will hold up it into the bottom and it will hold up it into the bottom and it will hold up the entire device for you so that's when the entire device for you so that's when the entire device for you so that's when you could start doing things like the you could start doing things like the you could start doing things like the image you mentioned um using it with image you mentioned um using it with image you mentioned um using it with your chin because it's mounted up by your chin because it's mounted up by your chin because it's mounted up by your face using it with your foot um so

your face using it with your foot um so your face using it with your foot um so like first and foremost it's it's a like first and foremost it's it's a like first and foremost it's it's a handheld device it's a one-handed handheld device it's a one-handed handheld device it's a one-handed joystick sort of thing but we wanted to joystick sort of thing but we wanted to joystick sort of thing but we wanted to make sure that we weren't limited to make sure that we weren't limited to make sure that we weren't limited to just hands so through that mounting just hands so through that mounting just hands so through that mounting support uh hoping to give folks more support uh hoping to give folks more support uh hoping to give folks more flexibility in how they're actually flexibility in how they're actually flexibility in how they're actually using this yeah that term quarter 20 one using this yeah that term quarter 20 one using this yeah that term quarter 20 one qu inch 20 describes the width and then qu inch 20 describes the width and then qu inch 20 describes the width and then the threading of that and that standard the threading of that and that standard the threading of that and that standard is a standard for putting cameras on is a standard for putting cameras on is a standard for putting cameras on tripods yeah but that's so cool that tripods yeah but that's so cool that tripods yeah but that's so cool that you're not creating a new standard you're not creating a new standard you're not creating a new standard you're accepting that there's already a you're accepting that there's already a you're accepting that there's already a way to do this so let's just let's just way to do this so let's just let's just way to do this so let's just let's just use that yeah and that was the idea too use that yeah and that was the idea too use that yeah and that was the idea too with the the headphone jacks on the with the the headphone jacks on the with the the headphone jacks on the Adaptive controller it's like well we Adaptive controller it's like well we Adaptive controller it's like well we already know people are using us uh already know people are using us uh already know people are using us uh adaptive buttons that have this adaptive buttons that have this adaptive buttons that have this connection type let's not make a new connection type let's not make a new connection type let's not make a new connection type let's use what people connection type let's use what people connection type let's use what people already have so you mention that you can already have so you mention that you can already have so you mention that you can plug the Adaptive joystick directly into plug the Adaptive joystick directly into plug the Adaptive joystick directly into your PC or your console but you can also your PC or your console but you can also your PC or your console but you can also plug it into the Xbox adaptive plug it into the Xbox adaptive plug it into the Xbox adaptive controller so I want to this is an audio controller so I want to this is an audio controller so I want to this is an audio show but we're juxtaposing the Adaptive show but we're juxtaposing the Adaptive show but we're juxtaposing the Adaptive joystick with the Adaptive controller so joystick with the Adaptive controller so joystick with the Adaptive controller so if I wanted I'm imagining I could have if I wanted I'm imagining I could have if I wanted I'm imagining I could have two of these one in each hand and then I two of these one in each hand and then I two of these one in each hand and then I could put the Adaptive controller on the could put the Adaptive controller on the could put the Adaptive controller on the ground and I could use my feet like you ground and I could use my feet like you ground and I could use my feet like you have effectively unlimited have effectively unlimited have effectively unlimited flexibility yeah flexibility yeah flexibility yeah exactly the uh the Adaptive controller exactly the uh the Adaptive controller exactly the uh the Adaptive controller that's the flat one with the two big that's the flat one with the two big that's the flat one with the two big black buttons doesn't have thumb sticks black buttons doesn't have thumb sticks black buttons doesn't have thumb sticks it doesn't have access control does it it doesn't have access control does it it doesn't have access control does it always expect that you're going to do always expect that you're going to do always expect that you're going to do your your your left and right uh thumb your your your left and right uh thumb your your your left and right uh thumb stick with some stick with some stick with some add-on I think that's the more common

add-on I think that's the more common add-on I think that's the more common use scenario is that you'll have some use scenario is that you'll have some use scenario is that you'll have some sort of thumb stick if that attaches to sort of thumb stick if that attaches to sort of thumb stick if that attaches to it but uh the remapping is so robust on it but uh the remapping is so robust on it but uh the remapping is so robust on it you can actually take four buttons it you can actually take four buttons it you can actually take four buttons and map them to left or right stick and map them to left or right stick and map them to left or right stick cardinal directions and basically use cardinal directions and basically use cardinal directions and basically use like do thumb stick movement through like do thumb stick movement through like do thumb stick movement through four buttons that are up down left right four buttons that are up down left right four buttons that are up down left right so that's an option too oh wow okay so so that's an option too oh wow okay so so that's an option too oh wow okay so you could you don't like you can remap you could you don't like you can remap you could you don't like you can remap digital things to analog things they digital things to analog things they digital things to analog things they don't necessarily have to be a thumb don't necessarily have to be a thumb don't necessarily have to be a thumb stick or like you could just say up on stick or like you could just say up on stick or like you could just say up on this button or this button like you this button or this button like you this button or this button like you could move your head to the left and could move your head to the left and could move your head to the left and that could be a button and that would that could be a button and that would that could be a button and that would move the joystick left yeah very cool so move the joystick left yeah very cool so move the joystick left yeah very cool so I want to back up a little bit because I I want to back up a little bit because I I want to back up a little bit because I want to understand how you get a job want to understand how you get a job want to understand how you get a job like this because you weren't always a like this because you weren't always a like this because you weren't always a product manager at at Microsoft but you product manager at at Microsoft but you product manager at at Microsoft but you you had an interesting job that is kind you had an interesting job that is kind you had an interesting job that is kind of in the same vein of helping people be of in the same vein of helping people be of in the same vein of helping people be successful as they move through life successful as they move through life successful as they move through life yeah I was uh an occupational therapist yeah I was uh an occupational therapist yeah I was uh an occupational therapist before coming over to Microsoft about before coming over to Microsoft about before coming over to Microsoft about six years ago um so I was very often six years ago um so I was very often six years ago um so I was very often working with with my patients and my working with with my patients and my working with with my patients and my clients and was trying to bring bring clients and was trying to bring bring clients and was trying to bring bring adaptive gaming into their treatment adaptive gaming into their treatment adaptive gaming into their treatment sessions I realized really early on that sessions I realized really early on that sessions I realized really early on that um you know playing a video game where um you know playing a video game where um you know playing a video game where I'm challenging them to do the same I'm challenging them to do the same I'm challenging them to do the same exercises and and range of motion exercises and and range of motion exercises and and range of motion movements was much more engaging and movements was much more engaging and movements was much more engaging and fruitful for them than you know asking fruitful for them than you know asking fruitful for them than you know asking them to do a puzzle or an arm bike or them to do a puzzle or an arm bike or them to do a puzzle or an arm bike or something like that so uh I saw the something like that so uh I saw the something like that so uh I saw the power of healing for gaming and then I power of healing for gaming and then I power of healing for gaming and then I guess along with that um I was working

guess along with that um I was working guess along with that um I was working with my dad who had a nonprofit where he with my dad who had a nonprofit where he with my dad who had a nonprofit where he was adapting video game controllers way was adapting video game controllers way was adapting video game controllers way before the Adaptive controller came out before the Adaptive controller came out before the Adaptive controller came out for veterans with limb loss spinal cord for veterans with limb loss spinal cord for veterans with limb loss spinal cord injuries things like that um he was injuries things like that um he was injuries things like that um he was pretty much cracking open Xbox pretty much cracking open Xbox pretty much cracking open Xbox controllers and soldering out um big controllers and soldering out um big controllers and soldering out um big buttons and joysticks and mouth buttons and joysticks and mouth buttons and joysticks and mouth controllers and things like that he's controllers and things like that he's controllers and things like that he's made devices for quadruple amputees with made devices for quadruple amputees with made devices for quadruple amputees with uh no limbs and now they're playing uh no limbs and now they're playing uh no limbs and now they're playing first-person shooters competitively so I first-person shooters competitively so I first-person shooters competitively so I I very much grew up with that in that I very much grew up with that in that I very much grew up with that in that space and then going into the healthc space and then going into the healthc space and then going into the healthc care space and um yeah it just kind of care space and um yeah it just kind of care space and um yeah it just kind of all came together the the weird all came together the the weird all came together the the weird backstory of how I actually got backstory of how I actually got backstory of how I actually got connected to Microsoft specifically is connected to Microsoft specifically is connected to Microsoft specifically is uh an engineer from Microsoft saw our uh an engineer from Microsoft saw our uh an engineer from Microsoft saw our nonprofits Twitter page and they saw nonprofits Twitter page and they saw nonprofits Twitter page and they saw that we were cracking open all of the that we were cracking open all of the that we were cracking open all of the Xbox controllers and wanted to know how Xbox controllers and wanted to know how Xbox controllers and wanted to know how they can help us do that work to scale they can help us do that work to scale they can help us do that work to scale because obviously there's a lot more because obviously there's a lot more because obviously there's a lot more players with disabilities uh than what players with disabilities uh than what players with disabilities uh than what these small nonprofits who were hacking these small nonprofits who were hacking these small nonprofits who were hacking could support in the world so they could support in the world so they could support in the world so they brought us out for some hackathons and brought us out for some hackathons and brought us out for some hackathons and through that partnership and us and a through that partnership and us and a through that partnership and us and a few other organizations talking about few other organizations talking about few other organizations talking about our needs and how they could help scale our needs and how they could help scale our needs and how they could help scale this work work um that is what this work work um that is what this work work um that is what eventually became the Xbox adaptive eventually became the Xbox adaptive eventually became the Xbox adaptive controller a few years later through controller a few years later through controller a few years later through lots of awesome talented groups and and lots of awesome talented groups and and lots of awesome talented groups and and people internally at Microsoft pushing people internally at Microsoft pushing people internally at Microsoft pushing to get it out there um but just through to get it out there um but just through to get it out there um but just through those connections being on campus those connections being on campus those connections being on campus talking about how as an OT I often have talking about how as an OT I often have talking about how as an OT I often have to hack and modify Products off the to hack and modify Products off the to hack and modify Products off the shelf to make them work for my clients shelf to make them work for my clients shelf to make them work for my clients it'd be really cool if you brought it'd be really cool if you brought it'd be really cool if you brought somebody with that hacking knowledge of

somebody with that hacking knowledge of somebody with that hacking knowledge of what needs to be done into the what needs to be done into the what needs to be done into the development process so we can kind of development process so we can kind of development process so we can kind of embed those thoughts and how to make embed those thoughts and how to make embed those thoughts and how to make products more inclusive during products more inclusive during products more inclusive during development so they're already development so they're already development so they're already accessible off the shelf and my OT accessible off the shelf and my OT accessible off the shelf and my OT friends and and parents and caregivers friends and and parents and caregivers friends and and parents and caregivers at home aren't hot gluing and velcroing at home aren't hot gluing and velcroing at home aren't hot gluing and velcroing and soldering um to to make the products and soldering um to to make the products and soldering um to to make the products more accessible once they're out your OT more accessible once they're out your OT more accessible once they're out your OT friends your occupational therapy friends your occupational therapy friends your occupational therapy friends yes sorry occupational therapy friends yes sorry occupational therapy friends yes sorry occupational therapy friends so let me ask you this what is friends so let me ask you this what is friends so let me ask you this what is your dad doing now is he like is he is your dad doing now is he like is he is your dad doing now is he like is he is he you know changed his nonprofit and he you know changed his nonprofit and he you know changed his nonprofit and now it is based on the Adaptive now it is based on the Adaptive now it is based on the Adaptive controller platform yeah pretty much um controller platform yeah pretty much um controller platform yeah pretty much um he does a lot of um just creating he does a lot of um just creating he does a lot of um just creating joysticks with different grasps and joysticks with different grasps and joysticks with different grasps and handles and form factors that are handles and form factors that are handles and form factors that are compatible with the Xbox adaptive compatible with the Xbox adaptive compatible with the Xbox adaptive joystick to try to fill some of those joystick to try to fill some of those joystick to try to fill some of those gaps um now that the the actual adaptive gaps um now that the the actual adaptive gaps um now that the the actual adaptive joystick is out um I'm hoping that joystick is out um I'm hoping that joystick is out um I'm hoping that alleviates some of that need cuz you alleviates some of that need cuz you alleviates some of that need cuz you know he's basically 3D printing in like know he's basically 3D printing in like know he's basically 3D printing in like my childhood bedroom that he turned into my childhood bedroom that he turned into my childhood bedroom that he turned into his office um and it's it's a small his office um and it's it's a small his office um and it's it's a small operation so um but yeah he's he's still operation so um but yeah he's he's still operation so um but yeah he's he's still at it he's still supporting the at it he's still supporting the at it he's still supporting the community and he has a a small little community and he has a a small little community and he has a a small little shop page and our our business model is shop page and our our business model is shop page and our our business model is kind of you know the very very tiny kind of you know the very very tiny kind of you know the very very tiny profit margin from civilians purchasing profit margin from civilians purchasing profit margin from civilians purchasing these peripherals for the Adaptive these peripherals for the Adaptive these peripherals for the Adaptive controller goes towards funding the the controller goes towards funding the the controller goes towards funding the the free hardware for any veteran who comes free hardware for any veteran who comes free hardware for any veteran who comes to us looking for this kind of stuff to us looking for this kind of stuff to us looking for this kind of stuff what is the domain or the name so we can what is the domain or the name so we can what is the domain or the name so we can add that to the show notes yeah it is add that to the show notes yeah it is add that to the show notes yeah it is Warfighter engaged.

Warfighter engaged. Warfighter engaged. org Warfighter engaged a org Warfighter engaged a org Warfighter engaged a 501c3 all volunteer veteran support 501c3 all volunteer veteran support 501c3 all volunteer veteran support organization that folks can check out at organization that folks can check out at organization that folks can check out at Warfighter engaged. org that is Warfighter engaged. org that is Warfighter engaged. org that is fantastic so um he says though that uh fantastic so um he says though that uh fantastic so um he says though that uh at the end of the year he's not going to at the end of the year he's not going to at the end of the year he's not going to be designing and doing the custom be designing and doing the custom be designing and doing the custom buttons why is that yeah I think um you buttons why is that yeah I think um you buttons why is that yeah I think um you know it's it's been a long great run know it's it's been a long great run know it's it's been a long great run over the last five six years that the over the last five six years that the over the last five six years that the Adaptive controllers has been out but um Adaptive controllers has been out but um Adaptive controllers has been out but um again like I mentioned earlier he's just again like I mentioned earlier he's just again like I mentioned earlier he's just he's very exhausting with all of the he's very exhausting with all of the he's very exhausting with all of the fabrication and trying to community yeah fabrication and trying to community yeah fabrication and trying to community yeah and he does he he has a day job so he and he does he he has a day job so he and he does he he has a day job so he works all day comes home and uh you know works all day comes home and uh you know works all day comes home and uh you know 3D prints and solders and does 3D prints and solders and does 3D prints and solders and does electronic stuff all night so um I think electronic stuff all night so um I think electronic stuff all night so um I think he's he's looking to take a break from he's he's looking to take a break from he's he's looking to take a break from the space for a little bit and uh hoping the space for a little bit and uh hoping the space for a little bit and uh hoping that some of the the more commercialized that some of the the more commercialized that some of the the more commercialized products like the adoptive joystick are products like the adoptive joystick are products like the adoptive joystick are going to fill a little bit more of that going to fill a little bit more of that going to fill a little bit more of that Niche yeah well folks can check out Warf Niche yeah well folks can check out Warf Niche yeah well folks can check out Warf fighter engaged though until the end of fighter engaged though until the end of fighter engaged though until the end of the year because there's still stuff uh the year because there's still stuff uh the year because there's still stuff uh on the store that plugs in so you could on the store that plugs in so you could on the store that plugs in so you could buy the the final last stock he's buy the the final last stock he's buy the the final last stock he's created uh FPS joysticks snap sticks created uh FPS joysticks snap sticks created uh FPS joysticks snap sticks Palm sticks Palm sticks Palm sticks d-pads uh different large large and d-pads uh different large large and d-pads uh different large large and small button pads it's really very small button pads it's really very small button pads it's really very diverse this is all just imagined by by diverse this is all just imagined by by diverse this is all just imagined by by he and you these different adapters yeah he and you these different adapters yeah he and you these different adapters yeah mostly him I I won't take credit for for mostly him I I won't take credit for for mostly him I I won't take credit for for his designs um but just again through his designs um but just again through his designs um but just again through working with uh folks with various

working with uh folks with various working with uh folks with various disabilities over the past I don't know disabilities over the past I don't know disabilities over the past I don't know since 2012 so I guess 12 years now um since 2012 so I guess 12 years now um since 2012 so I guess 12 years now um realizing what folks need what works realizing what folks need what works realizing what folks need what works what doesn't work and putting all that what doesn't work and putting all that what doesn't work and putting all that into um specific form factors yeah some into um specific form factors yeah some into um specific form factors yeah some of these are really really interesting of these are really really interesting of these are really really interesting uh some of them are sold out of course uh some of them are sold out of course uh some of them are sold out of course but like there's some really interesting but like there's some really interesting but like there's some really interesting uh analog joysticks that look like uh analog joysticks that look like uh analog joysticks that look like flight sticks and I can imagine how like flight sticks and I can imagine how like flight sticks and I can imagine how like he designed it 3D printed it and then he designed it 3D printed it and then he designed it 3D printed it and then now it can plug into a uh an Xbox now it can plug into a uh an Xbox now it can plug into a uh an Xbox adaptive controller and it's very adaptive controller and it's very adaptive controller and it's very comfortable to grip if you're if your comfortable to grip if you're if your comfortable to grip if you're if your grip is uh is different than than uh grip is uh is different than than uh grip is uh is different than than uh typical grip some of the some of these typical grip some of the some of these typical grip some of the some of these look like they mount two wheelchairs as look like they mount two wheelchairs as look like they mount two wheelchairs as well yeah they do they a lot of them well yeah they do they a lot of them well yeah they do they a lot of them have the same one4 20 size threaded uh have the same one4 20 size threaded uh have the same one4 20 size threaded uh insert on them for that insert on them for that insert on them for that purpose where do you see the future of purpose where do you see the future of purpose where do you see the future of this stuff going like is there an end this stuff going like is there an end this stuff going like is there an end game where it's done and we've you've game where it's done and we've you've game where it's done and we've you've made the Adaptive joystick you made the made the Adaptive joystick you made the made the Adaptive joystick you made the Adaptive controller and the team is like Adaptive controller and the team is like Adaptive controller and the team is like okay I think that's it we're okay I think that's it we're okay I think that's it we're finished I don't think we'll ever be finished I don't think we'll ever be finished I don't think we'll ever be done I think we're we're always learning done I think we're we're always learning done I think we're we're always learning um and especially just how much the like um and especially just how much the like um and especially just how much the like the overall premise of game the overall premise of game the overall premise of game accessibility has been growing really accessibility has been growing really accessibility has been growing really rapidly over the past like five six rapidly over the past like five six rapidly over the past like five six seven years um I think the more people seven years um I think the more people seven years um I think the more people whose hands we get these devices in the whose hands we get these devices in the whose hands we get these devices in the more discoverability that there are more discoverability that there are more discoverability that there are these tools out there the more we learn these tools out there the more we learn these tools out there the more we learn where maybe we fell short or could where maybe we fell short or could where maybe we fell short or could improve next time so I I would hope that improve next time so I I would hope that improve next time so I I would hope that at some point we we've created at some point we we've created at some point we we've created everything that everyone needs but I

everything that everyone needs but I everything that everyone needs but I don't know when that'll happen or if it don't know when that'll happen or if it don't know when that'll happen or if it will so um no end Insight right now but will so um no end Insight right now but will so um no end Insight right now but that's I think a positive thing where do that's I think a positive thing where do that's I think a positive thing where do you personally see uh the hardware you personally see uh the hardware you personally see uh the hardware software combining like there's tools software combining like there's tools software combining like there's tools like seph that used to be called enabled like seph that used to be called enabled like seph that used to be called enabled play which are letting you do like um play which are letting you do like um play which are letting you do like um like gaze like gaze like gaze control um there's also you know puffer control um there's also you know puffer control um there's also you know puffer tools mouth based tools but being able tools mouth based tools but being able tools mouth based tools but being able to just make accessibility personal with to just make accessibility personal with to just make accessibility personal with just you know like your face where would just you know like your face where would just you know like your face where would you see something like that fitting in you see something like that fitting in you see something like that fitting in into the Xbox into the Xbox into the Xbox ecosystem um I I mean I think it it fits ecosystem um I I mean I think it it fits ecosystem um I I mean I think it it fits in perfectly to the or it would to the in perfectly to the or it would to the in perfectly to the or it would to the Xbox ecosystem right now um I think it's Xbox ecosystem right now um I think it's Xbox ecosystem right now um I think it's just a matter of how we try to get some just a matter of how we try to get some just a matter of how we try to get some of those um softwares and supports more of those um softwares and supports more of those um softwares and supports more integrated directly into our platform um integrated directly into our platform um integrated directly into our platform um but like my hope is that any player who but like my hope is that any player who but like my hope is that any player who wants to use especially a combination of wants to use especially a combination of wants to use especially a combination of something like seph where I could use something like seph where I could use something like seph where I could use head head tracking and movement voice head head tracking and movement voice head head tracking and movement voice input and maybe the Adaptive controller input and maybe the Adaptive controller input and maybe the Adaptive controller for one or two buttons can seamlessly do for one or two buttons can seamlessly do for one or two buttons can seamlessly do that so I I would love to see it brought that so I I would love to see it brought that so I I would love to see it brought in for sure yeah I really like the idea in for sure yeah I really like the idea in for sure yeah I really like the idea that it's like almost like Lego pieces that it's like almost like Lego pieces that it's like almost like Lego pieces and this is again I mentioned at the and this is again I mentioned at the and this is again I mentioned at the very beginning how how it I thought when very beginning how how it I thought when very beginning how how it I thought when I had my mobility issue that I would I had my mobility issue that I would I had my mobility issue that I would just buy the controller and I would be just buy the controller and I would be just buy the controller and I would be done but then I realized oh it's a kit done but then I realized oh it's a kit done but then I realized oh it's a kit and I can I I would build it and it's and I can I I would build it and it's and I can I I would build it and it's adaptive literally I have to imagine

adaptive literally I have to imagine adaptive literally I have to imagine what my idealized scenario what my idealized scenario what my idealized scenario would be so maybe for you the listener would be so maybe for you the listener would be so maybe for you the listener It's a combination of like okay I'm It's a combination of like okay I'm It's a combination of like okay I'm going to I'm going to jump the character going to I'm going to jump the character going to I'm going to jump the character by using my eyebrows and I'm going to by using my eyebrows and I'm going to by using my eyebrows and I'm going to use my voice to reload and I'm going to use my voice to reload and I'm going to use my voice to reload and I'm going to use my foot to do this it's completely use my foot to do this it's completely use my foot to do this it's completely almost overwhelmingly almost overwhelmingly almost overwhelmingly customizable yeah yeah the uh and then customizable yeah yeah the uh and then customizable yeah yeah the uh and then of course with the seable example uh of course with the seable example uh of course with the seable example uh just for for folks that may not be just for for folks that may not be just for for folks that may not be familiar it's c p h a b l e it shows up familiar it's c p h a b l e it shows up familiar it's c p h a b l e it shows up as a hid device as well it's just a an as a hid device as well it's just a an as a hid device as well it's just a an input device so you can plug it in and input device so you can plug it in and input device so you can plug it in and it'll work on an Xbox or on a uh on a PC it'll work on an Xbox or on a uh on a PC it'll work on an Xbox or on a uh on a PC it used to run on a Raspberry Pi and now it used to run on a Raspberry Pi and now it used to run on a Raspberry Pi and now it's a little bit more um uh a little it's a little bit more um uh a little it's a little bit more um uh a little more fancy it's worth checking out and more fancy it's worth checking out and more fancy it's worth checking out and just for just for just for um uh for ethical reasons just note that um uh for ethical reasons just note that um uh for ethical reasons just note that I'm an investor in in seable and I'm a I'm an investor in in seable and I'm a I'm an investor in in seable and I'm a big fan of Alex dun and the folks that big fan of Alex dun and the folks that big fan of Alex dun and the folks that work with that it is free for individual work with that it is free for individual work with that it is free for individual use so folks can can check that out as use so folks can can check that out as use so folks can can check that out as well I think it's going to be a really well I think it's going to be a really well I think it's going to be a really nice um uh nice um uh nice um uh companion to the the Adaptive joystick companion to the the Adaptive joystick companion to the the Adaptive joystick do you know how much the Adaptive do you know how much the Adaptive do you know how much the Adaptive joystick is gonna going to cost ballpark joystick is gonna going to cost ballpark joystick is gonna going to cost ballpark yeah it's going to be $29.99 US yeah it's going to be $29.99 US yeah it's going to be $29.99 US dollar like my face like that seems very dollar like my face like that seems very dollar like my face like that seems very reasonable like hang on a second it's reasonable like hang on a second it's reasonable like hang on a second it's not a 100 bucks that's cool was that a not a 100 bucks that's cool was that a not a 100 bucks that's cool was that a goal as well to make it fit into price goal as well to make it fit into price goal as well to make it fit into price points yes that was probably one of the points yes that was probably one of the points yes that was probably one of the most important goals is the price point most important goals is the price point most important goals is the price point and knowing that um some folks in this

and knowing that um some folks in this and knowing that um some folks in this community don't always have uh the same community don't always have uh the same community don't always have uh the same level of disposable income to um you level of disposable income to um you level of disposable income to um you know purchase these sort of devices and know purchase these sort of devices and know purchase these sort of devices and they're already spending a lot of money they're already spending a lot of money they're already spending a lot of money on other medical and assistive devices on other medical and assistive devices on other medical and assistive devices we didn't want to introduce that as a we didn't want to introduce that as a we didn't want to introduce that as a barrier for this device barrier for this device barrier for this device too that is super cool and the uh the too that is super cool and the uh the too that is super cool and the uh the Xbox adaptive controller the The Hub is Xbox adaptive controller the The Hub is Xbox adaptive controller the The Hub is 99 bucks 100 bucks still less than an 99 bucks 100 bucks still less than an 99 bucks 100 bucks still less than an elite uh if you get the big fancy Elite elite uh if you get the big fancy Elite elite uh if you get the big fancy Elite uh so then you know for for not too much uh so then you know for for not too much uh so then you know for for not too much you can you can assemble your own your you can you can assemble your own your you can you can assemble your own your own thing own thing own thing has have you seen a community build up has have you seen a community build up has have you seen a community build up around this like you know that your dad around this like you know that your dad around this like you know that your dad is making these things but is there like is making these things but is there like is making these things but is there like a Reddit Community or where would I go a Reddit Community or where would I go a Reddit Community or where would I go to learn more about some of the cool to learn more about some of the cool to learn more about some of the cool controls add-ons and 3D printed pieces controls add-ons and 3D printed pieces controls add-ons and 3D printed pieces that people are making yeah there that people are making yeah there that people are making yeah there there's a lot of um I would say kind of there's a lot of um I would say kind of there's a lot of um I would say kind of fragmented communities of just different fragmented communities of just different fragmented communities of just different groups of folks that are kind of groups of folks that are kind of groups of folks that are kind of Grassroots creating these resources and Grassroots creating these resources and Grassroots creating these resources and websites um there is a Reddit Community websites um there is a Reddit Community websites um there is a Reddit Community I think it's like R disabled Gamers r I think it's like R disabled Gamers r I think it's like R disabled Gamers r adaptive gaming sort of those those adaptive gaming sort of those those adaptive gaming sort of those those keywords where folks are posting keywords where folks are posting keywords where folks are posting different ideas and setups that they've different ideas and setups that they've different ideas and setups that they've created um we do have some Xbox forums created um we do have some Xbox forums created um we do have some Xbox forums on the subject as well as uh an Xbox on the subject as well as uh an Xbox on the subject as well as uh an Xbox adaptive controller user guide on our adaptive controller user guide on our adaptive controller user guide on our Xbox support Pages uh where we have a Xbox support Pages uh where we have a Xbox support Pages uh where we have a lot of information but we also have some lot of information but we also have some lot of information but we also have some player Spotlight videos where players player Spotlight videos where players player Spotlight videos where players just talk through um these are the just talk through um these are the just talk through um these are the buttons I use this is where I place them buttons I use this is where I place them buttons I use this is where I place them and uh this is how I use it for this and uh this is how I use it for this and uh this is how I use it for this game just to help other folks generate

game just to help other folks generate game just to help other folks generate ideas uh for how they might set up their ideas uh for how they might set up their ideas uh for how they might set up their own setup because as you mentioned own setup because as you mentioned own setup because as you mentioned before it can be really overwhelming um before it can be really overwhelming um before it can be really overwhelming um but there's also a lot of other maker but there's also a lot of other maker but there's also a lot of other maker groups too uh so there's makers making groups too uh so there's makers making groups too uh so there's makers making change they're based in Canada but they change they're based in Canada but they change they're based in Canada but they had this really really robust open had this really really robust open had this really really robust open source um kind of platform where they source um kind of platform where they source um kind of platform where they have tons of joysticks and buttons that have tons of joysticks and buttons that have tons of joysticks and buttons that you can literally print yourself all the you can literally print yourself all the you can literally print yourself all the instructions are right there um they instructions are right there um they instructions are right there um they tell you which a lot like inner tell you which a lot like inner tell you which a lot like inner Electronics to buy so there's there's Electronics to buy so there's there's Electronics to buy so there's there's certainly a lot of options out there certainly a lot of options out there certainly a lot of options out there yeah you know one of the ones I think is yeah you know one of the ones I think is yeah you know one of the ones I think is really cool that that you all worked really cool that that you all worked really cool that that you all worked with Logitech on it's a it's a separate with Logitech on it's a it's a separate with Logitech on it's a it's a separate thing that's sold by Logitech it's an thing that's sold by Logitech it's an thing that's sold by Logitech it's an Adaptive gaming kit and one of the Adaptive gaming kit and one of the Adaptive gaming kit and one of the things that I was surprised about is it things that I was surprised about is it things that I was surprised about is it it's not just a bunch of buttons in a it's not just a bunch of buttons in a it's not just a bunch of buttons in a box it actually has a board that's box it actually has a board that's box it actually has a board that's effectively velcro like it's the the effectively velcro like it's the the effectively velcro like it's the the soft side of velcro which means you can soft side of velcro which means you can soft side of velcro which means you can lay these things out however you want so lay these things out however you want so lay these things out however you want so you don't necessarily have to have a you don't necessarily have to have a you don't necessarily have to have a construction you know like the ability construction you know like the ability construction you know like the ability to go and build boards and stuff with to go and build boards and stuff with to go and build boards and stuff with wood you can get this kit adjust the wood you can get this kit adjust the wood you can get this kit adjust the Angles and the the way that these things Angles and the the way that these things Angles and the the way that these things plug in just with velcro which is super plug in just with velcro which is super plug in just with velcro which is super cool yeah we're we're super um grateful cool yeah we're we're super um grateful cool yeah we're we're super um grateful that they have made that kit and that they have made that kit and that they have made that kit and continue to make it like for context um continue to make it like for context um continue to make it like for context um before that kit a lot of the assisted before that kit a lot of the assisted before that kit a lot of the assisted Tech buttons were like $60 for a single Tech buttons were like $60 for a single Tech buttons were like $60 for a single button and and with theirs you get 12 button and and with theirs you get 12 button and and with theirs you get 12 and the boards for a 100 bucks it's and the boards for a 100 bucks it's and the boards for a 100 bucks it's amazing yeah you get buttons you get uh amazing yeah you get buttons you get uh amazing yeah you get buttons you get uh foot pedals you get uh you get like what foot pedals you get uh you get like what foot pedals you get uh you get like what three three small buttons three large three three small buttons three large three three small buttons three large buttons varable triggers and then four

buttons varable triggers and then four buttons varable triggers and then four what are called light touch buttons what are called light touch buttons what are called light touch buttons which I didn't even realize uh mattered which I didn't even realize uh mattered which I didn't even realize uh mattered like to your point about people wanting like to your point about people wanting like to your point about people wanting to have uh you know like a pillow that to have uh you know like a pillow that to have uh you know like a pillow that they could squeeze but also you don't they could squeeze but also you don't they could squeeze but also you don't want every button to click and slap it want every button to click and slap it want every button to click and slap it could just be a very very tiny light could just be a very very tiny light could just be a very very tiny light touch which is super helpful yeah touch which is super helpful yeah touch which is super helpful yeah exactly so what are you what are you exactly so what are you what are you exactly so what are you what are you hoping to do in the next couple of years hoping to do in the next couple of years hoping to do in the next couple of years yourself like where do you see your yourself like where do you see your yourself like where do you see your adaptive Journey going because if I adaptive Journey going because if I adaptive Journey going because if I understand correctly you don't have any understand correctly you don't have any understand correctly you don't have any Mobility challenges your dad doesn't Mobility challenges your dad doesn't Mobility challenges your dad doesn't have any Mobility challeng this has just have any Mobility challeng this has just have any Mobility challeng this has just been a passion for your whole family been a passion for your whole family been a passion for your whole family yeah as long as you can yeah as long as you can yeah as long as you can remember yeah um I mean I I love my role remember yeah um I mean I I love my role remember yeah um I mean I I love my role here at Microsoft uh I definitely feel here at Microsoft uh I definitely feel here at Microsoft uh I definitely feel like the the impact that you can have on like the the impact that you can have on like the the impact that you can have on on product that can you know be in the on product that can you know be in the on product that can you know be in the hands of thousands and thousands to hands of thousands and thousands to hands of thousands and thousands to millions of people is way larger than I millions of people is way larger than I millions of people is way larger than I think every individual patient I could think every individual patient I could think every individual patient I could have ever treated as an occupational have ever treated as an occupational have ever treated as an occupational therapist so I hope to stay here I keep therapist so I hope to stay here I keep therapist so I hope to stay here I keep working with the hardware teams here I I working with the hardware teams here I I working with the hardware teams here I I think what's been really great is how think what's been really great is how think what's been really great is how things like the Adaptive controller are things like the Adaptive controller are things like the Adaptive controller are also influencing our standard product also influencing our standard product also influencing our standard product lines so making sure that all of our our lines so making sure that all of our our lines so making sure that all of our our you know our next Generations of Xbox you know our next Generations of Xbox you know our next Generations of Xbox Hardware even if it's not a bespoke Hardware even if it's not a bespoke Hardware even if it's not a bespoke accessibility device just has inclusive accessibility device just has inclusive accessibility device just has inclusive design and accessible features built design and accessible features built design and accessible features built into it as well so I think those are into it as well so I think those are into it as well so I think those are some of the the big things that we're some of the the big things that we're some of the the big things that we're looking for is just across the board we looking for is just across the board we looking for is just across the board we are intentionally thinking about are intentionally thinking about are intentionally thinking about accessibility for all products yeah you accessibility for all products yeah you accessibility for all products yeah you know and it's also worth noting as I get know and it's also worth noting as I get know and it's also worth noting as I get older and as I have my own Mobility

older and as I have my own Mobility older and as I have my own Mobility challenges that it could be said all of challenges that it could be said all of challenges that it could be said all of us will be disabled at some point it us will be disabled at some point it us will be disabled at some point it just depends on how long it's going to just depends on how long it's going to just depends on how long it's going to take you know so like my dad has take you know so like my dad has take you know so like my dad has arthritis in his hands and I've been arthritis in his hands and I've been arthritis in his hands and I've been trying to get him to play games and he trying to get him to play games and he trying to get him to play games and he might play the controller for a few might play the controller for a few might play the controller for a few minutes and ah this is not for me and we minutes and ah this is not for me and we minutes and ah this is not for me and we want to avoid that we because we're all want to avoid that we because we're all want to avoid that we because we're all going to be in that situation at some going to be in that situation at some going to be in that situation at some point no one should be able to to should point no one should be able to to should point no one should be able to to should be excluded from from playing yeah be excluded from from playing yeah be excluded from from playing yeah exactly my my dad's the same way he he exactly my my dad's the same way he he exactly my my dad's the same way he he jokes he asks for what he calls gezer jokes he asks for what he calls gezer jokes he asks for what he calls gezer mode in games which is just as I'm mode in games which is just as I'm mode in games which is just as I'm getting older my reaction time isn't as getting older my reaction time isn't as getting older my reaction time isn't as quick and my eyesight isn't as good so quick and my eyesight isn't as good so quick and my eyesight isn't as good so like I might not need an Adaptive like I might not need an Adaptive like I might not need an Adaptive controller but just the game mechanics controller but just the game mechanics controller but just the game mechanics are a little bit too much for me right are a little bit too much for me right are a little bit too much for me right now but I still want to play all the now but I still want to play all the now but I still want to play all the games I I've been playing for years so games I I've been playing for years so games I I've been playing for years so you know that is so true like I don't you know that is so true like I don't you know that is so true like I don't like I don't know if I would call it like I don't know if I would call it like I don't know if I would call it gezer mode but I I'm playing um like gezer mode but I I'm playing um like gezer mode but I I'm playing um like Star Wars Outlaws right now and I'm Star Wars Outlaws right now and I'm Star Wars Outlaws right now and I'm playing on story mode you know what I playing on story mode you know what I playing on story mode you know what I mean I'm une easy I am not interested in mean I'm une easy I am not interested in mean I'm une easy I am not interested in being punished like I've already beaten being punished like I've already beaten being punished like I've already beaten Elden ring twice I get it there's no you Elden ring twice I get it there's no you Elden ring twice I get it there's no you know like get good is is is not I mean know like get good is is is not I mean know like get good is is is not I mean it's fine but it's like I just want to it's fine but it's like I just want to it's fine but it's like I just want to like Vibe and run around in my jet like Vibe and run around in my jet like Vibe and run around in my jet speeder whatever can I just not be speeder whatever can I just not be speeder whatever can I just not be punished by this game I don't have the punished by this game I don't have the punished by this game I don't have the time so yes I respect your dad's goal time so yes I respect your dad's goal time so yes I respect your dad's goal for gezer for gezer for gezer mode awesome well thank you so much mode awesome well thank you so much mode awesome well thank you so much Caitlyn Jones for chatting with us today Caitlyn Jones for chatting with us today Caitlyn Jones for chatting with us today yeah thank you this was awesome yeah thank you this was awesome yeah thank you this was awesome you can check out the Xbox adaptive you can check out the Xbox adaptive you can check out the Xbox adaptive joystick and Xbox adaptive controllers

joystick and Xbox adaptive controllers joystick and Xbox adaptive controllers at at at xbox.com and this has been another xbox.com and this has been another xbox.com and this has been another episode of handome minutes and we'll see episode of handome minutes and we'll see episode of handome minutes and we'll see you again next week you again next week you again next week [Music]