Saving lives with light with Dr. Mary Lou Jepsen - ACM ByteCast

you know I love my terminal I have you know I love my terminal I have completely customized my terminal with completely customized my terminal with completely customized my terminal with open source tools like oh my Posh I love open source tools like oh my Posh I love open source tools like oh my Posh I love the windows terminal I've been talking the windows terminal I've been talking the windows terminal I've been talking about it for a long time but recently about it for a long time but recently about it for a long time but recently warp has launched on Windows this is a warp has launched on Windows this is a warp has launched on Windows this is a new way of thinking about the terminal new way of thinking about the terminal new way of thinking about the terminal and I'm excited to see this newcomer and I'm excited to see this newcomer and I'm excited to see this newcomer into the windows developer ecosystem I into the windows developer ecosystem I into the windows developer ecosystem I think you should check it out I think you should check it out I think you should check it out I definitely push back on a lot of uh definitely push back on a lot of uh definitely push back on a lot of uh sprinkling AI onto an application but sprinkling AI onto an application but sprinkling AI onto an application but warp is really recreating the command warp is really recreating the command warp is really recreating the command line it's bringing Ai and collaboration line it's bringing Ai and collaboration line it's bringing Ai and collaboration and a modern user interface to an and a modern user interface to an and a modern user interface to an essential tool historically it's only essential tool historically it's only essential tool historically it's only been on Mac but now warp is bringing been on Mac but now warp is bringing been on Mac but now warp is bringing itself to Windows as a native itself to Windows as a native itself to Windows as a native application it's a really really application it's a really really application it's a really really interesting really interesting product I interesting really interesting product I interesting really interesting product I spent a lot of time with the team uh spent a lot of time with the team uh spent a lot of time with the team uh personally spending literally hours with personally spending literally hours with personally spending literally hours with them to help them improve their them to help them improve their them to help them improve their experience they're really passionate experience they're really passionate experience they're really passionate about delivering a great product I think about delivering a great product I think about delivering a great product I think the experience is really good and it's the experience is really good and it's the experience is really good and it's it's a new take on the terminal I think it's a new take on the terminal I think it's a new take on the terminal I think it adds a lot to the windows developer it adds a lot to the windows developer it adds a lot to the windows developer experience and if you maybe haven't been experience and if you maybe haven't been experience and if you maybe haven't been driving stick shift as much as I have driving stick shift as much as I have driving stick shift as much as I have you haven't spent a lot of time at the you haven't spent a lot of time at the you haven't spent a lot of time at the terminal and you want a terminal with a terminal and you want a terminal with a terminal and you want a terminal with a modern user interface that lets you talk modern user interface that lets you talk modern user interface that lets you talk to it in plain language you should check to it in plain language you should check to it in plain language you should check out workp it's really really interesting out workp it's really really interesting out workp it's really really interesting and I've had a lot of fun running it on and I've had a lot of fun running it on and I've had a lot of fun running it on Windows it's out now on Windows you can Windows it's out now on Windows you can Windows it's out now on Windows you can get started for free at war. deev Hansel get started for free at war. deev Hansel get started for free at war. deev Hansel minutes and as a listener you get 50% minutes and as a listener you get 50% minutes and as a listener you get 50% off your first two months of warp Pro off your first two months of warp Pro off your first two months of warp Pro with the code Handel minutes just all with the code Handel minutes just all with the code Handel minutes just all caps Handel minutes and pro gives you caps Handel minutes and pro gives you caps Handel minutes and pro gives you over th000 AI requests a month which is over th000 AI requests a month which is over th000 AI requests a month which is certainly more than enough to uh to do certainly more than enough to uh to do certainly more than enough to uh to do some damage very very cool product I

some damage very very cool product I some damage very very cool product I encourage you to check out warp the encourage you to check out warp the encourage you to check out warp the intelligent terminal with AI and I want intelligent terminal with AI and I want intelligent terminal with AI and I want to thank them for sponsoring Hansel to thank them for sponsoring Hansel to thank them for sponsoring Hansel minutes you know I don't bring a ton of minutes you know I don't bring a ton of minutes you know I don't bring a ton of sponsors on and I certainly don't bring sponsors on and I certainly don't bring sponsors on and I certainly don't bring them on as guest but I thought that this them on as guest but I thought that this them on as guest but I thought that this was a cool tool that you all should was a cool tool that you all should was a cool tool that you all should check out that's check out that's check out that's warp.and minutes hi I'm Scott Hanselman and this is hi I'm Scott Hanselman and this is another episode of Hanselman it's in another episode of Hanselman it's in another episode of Hanselman it's in association with the ACM bite cast today association with the ACM bite cast today association with the ACM bite cast today I have the distinct pleasure of chatting I have the distinct pleasure of chatting I have the distinct pleasure of chatting with Dr Mary L jebson CEO and founder of with Dr Mary L jebson CEO and founder of with Dr Mary L jebson CEO and founder of Open Water how are you I'm great how are Open Water how are you I'm great how are Open Water how are you I'm great how are you thanks for having me today fantastic you thanks for having me today fantastic you thanks for having me today fantastic I just love talking to cool people that I just love talking to cool people that I just love talking to cool people that are doing cool stuff and um I I tell you are doing cool stuff and um I I tell you are doing cool stuff and um I I tell you though I get a little intimidated though I get a little intimidated though I get a little intimidated because when I I I read you read up you because when I I I read you read up you because when I I I read you read up you do all your research you 250 patents and do all your research you 250 patents and do all your research you 250 patents and 50 plus products and it's like do you 50 plus products and it's like do you 50 plus products and it's like do you have more hours than we do or are you have more hours than we do or are you have more hours than we do or are you how you know how many year you are you how you know how many year you are you how you know how many year you are you 300 years old how are you getting all 300 years old how are you getting all 300 years old how are you getting all this fun work this fun work this fun work done uh you know we all work I'm I've done uh you know we all work I'm I've done uh you know we all work I'm I've looked at your resume too it's pretty looked at your resume too it's pretty looked at your resume too it's pretty astonishing all the work that you've astonishing all the work that you've astonishing all the work that you've done so uh it's just what I work in is a done so uh it's just what I work in is a done so uh it's just what I work in is a little bit different the patents are little bit different the patents are little bit different the patents are really useful when you're designing um really useful when you're designing um really useful when you're designing um mixed signal and analog things because mixed signal and analog things because mixed signal and analog things because you use contract you use contract you use contract manufacturing and it's sort of a fig manufacturing and it's sort of a fig manufacturing and it's sort of a fig leaf that helps you indemnify the leaf that helps you indemnify the leaf that helps you indemnify the contract manufacturer so you can ship

contract manufacturer so you can ship contract manufacturer so you can ship and it's just very helpful to have a lot and it's just very helpful to have a lot and it's just very helpful to have a lot of patents and when you use contract of patents and when you use contract of patents and when you use contract manufacturing and not build your own manufacturing and not build your own manufacturing and not build your own Factory you can ship a lot more product Factory you can ship a lot more product Factory you can ship a lot more product more quickly so that's it's that's the more quickly so that's it's that's the more quickly so that's it's that's the secret oh interesting because I think secret oh interesting because I think secret oh interesting because I think that the lay person who may only have that the lay person who may only have that the lay person who may only have one or two patents I've got a patent on one or two patents I've got a patent on one or two patents I've got a patent on the uh actually I have a didn't even the uh actually I have a didn't even the uh actually I have a didn't even think about this until we started think about this until we started think about this until we started talking I have a patent on the Microsoft talking I have a patent on the Microsoft talking I have a patent on the Microsoft band if you remember that little device band if you remember that little device band if you remember that little device that would be on the you know failed that would be on the you know failed that would be on the you know failed failed the failed Microsoft Apple watch failed the failed Microsoft Apple watch failed the failed Microsoft Apple watch which had sensors and such that were which had sensors and such that were which had sensors and such that were trying to give us information about how trying to give us information about how trying to give us information about how we moved but that that patent just kind we moved but that that patent just kind we moved but that that patent just kind of just happened it was one of those of just happened it was one of those of just happened it was one of those things and we always think as a lay things and we always think as a lay things and we always think as a lay person about how why do people make person about how why do people make person about how why do people make patents and you're right in the in the patents and you're right in the in the patents and you're right in the in the course of your daily life it would be course of your daily life it would be course of your daily life it would be important for you to get patents in important for you to get patents in important for you to get patents in order to indemnify the manufacturers and order to indemnify the manufacturers and order to indemnify the manufacturers and things like that it it helps us get things like that it it helps us get things like that it it helps us get indemnification because we can show it's indemnification because we can show it's indemnification because we can show it's Unique cuz the claims are like you just Unique cuz the claims are like you just Unique cuz the claims are like you just you add the claims are the things that you add the claims are the things that you add the claims are the things that make the valuable that you can write make the valuable that you can write make the valuable that you can write like how it works and then you write like how it works and then you write like how it works and then you write these claims and combining this with these claims and combining this with these claims and combining this with this in this circumstance for this this in this circumstance for this this in this circumstance for this purpose you own so that's very helpful purpose you own so that's very helpful purpose you own so that's very helpful um in being able to ship stuff using um in being able to ship stuff using um in being able to ship stuff using contract manufacturing yeah so um in the contract manufacturing yeah so um in the contract manufacturing yeah so um in the healthc care space I am uh not a person healthc care space I am uh not a person healthc care space I am uh not a person that works in the space but I'm a fan that works in the space but I'm a fan that works in the space but I'm a fan and I'm a fan because I've been diabetic and I'm a fan because I've been diabetic and I'm a fan because I've been diabetic for over 32 years and I use an open- for over 32 years and I use an open- for over 32 years and I use an open- Source artificial pancreas so I've been Source artificial pancreas so I've been Source artificial pancreas so I've been attached to an open APS now for almost attached to an open APS now for almost attached to an open APS now for almost 10 years so this is off label not FDA

10 years so this is off label not FDA 10 years so this is off label not FDA approved very kind of suspicious type approved very kind of suspicious type approved very kind of suspicious type stuff and we're always promised stuff and we're always promised stuff and we're always promised non-invasive diabetics for the 30 years non-invasive diabetics for the 30 years non-invasive diabetics for the 30 years I've been diabetics have been promised I've been diabetics have been promised I've been diabetics have been promised non-invasive Solutions and I when I give non-invasive Solutions and I when I give non-invasive Solutions and I when I give my talks on it always say you have to my talks on it always say you have to my talks on it always say you have to poke the meat bag if you want to know poke the meat bag if you want to know poke the meat bag if you want to know what's going on inside the meat bag what's going on inside the meat bag what's going on inside the meat bag but it seems to me like Open Water but it seems to me like Open Water but it seems to me like Open Water Medical Technology does not believe that Medical Technology does not believe that Medical Technology does not believe that you think we don't have to necessarily you think we don't have to necessarily you think we don't have to necessarily poke this giant meatbag that we are to poke this giant meatbag that we are to poke this giant meatbag that we are to get good data out of this get good data out of this get good data out of this body by poking the me do you mean cut or body by poking the me do you mean cut or body by poking the me do you mean cut or inject poke uh push in non you know like inject poke uh push in non you know like inject poke uh push in non you know like I have multiple holes in me every day in I have multiple holes in me every day in I have multiple holes in me every day in order to get to the interstitial fluid order to get to the interstitial fluid order to get to the interstitial fluid underneath the the the skin or push in underneath the the the skin or push in underneath the the the skin or push in insulin like but Apple has been insulin like but Apple has been insulin like but Apple has been promising me you know with with light promising me you know with with light promising me you know with with light they'll tell my blood sugar or with they'll tell my blood sugar or with they'll tell my blood sugar or with light they can tell my my my puls Soxs light they can tell my my my puls Soxs light they can tell my my my puls Soxs and with light they can do this and and and with light they can do this and and and with light they can do this and and I don't think that we understand do we I don't think that we understand do we I don't think that we understand do we or do we not have to poke the thing in or do we not have to poke the thing in or do we not have to poke the thing in order to get good data I think we're order to get good data I think we're order to get good data I think we're missing a lot um certainly people have missing a lot um certainly people have missing a lot um certainly people have been working on on blood sugar been working on on blood sugar been working on on blood sugar measurements and blood pressure measurements and blood pressure measurements and blood pressure measurements and there there is measurements and there there is measurements and there there is progress the issue I come to is $658 progress the issue I come to is $658 progress the issue I come to is $658 million 13 years that is the average million 13 years that is the average million 13 years that is the average amount of time and capitalized cost it amount of time and capitalized cost it amount of time and capitalized cost it takes to get a regulatory approval to takes to get a regulatory approval to takes to get a regulatory approval to say this really works for something say this really works for something say this really works for something that's novel and

that's novel and that's novel and therapeutic as averaged in a therapeutic as averaged in a therapeutic as averaged in a comprehensive paper which I can share a comprehensive paper which I can share a comprehensive paper which I can share a link for you for but that's the problem link for you for but that's the problem link for you for but that's the problem and what that also means is you're and what that also means is you're and what that also means is you're building 10 units a year you don't get building 10 units a year you don't get building 10 units a year you don't get to use Moors law you don't get to use to use Moors law you don't get to use to use Moors law you don't get to use contract Manufacturing they're not contract Manufacturing they're not contract Manufacturing they're not interested in building 10 units a year interested in building 10 units a year interested in building 10 units a year they make the Consumer Electronics in they make the Consumer Electronics in they make the Consumer Electronics in the world of the world and so yeah you the world of the world and so yeah you the world of the world and so yeah you can use AI you can use supercomputers can use AI you can use supercomputers can use AI you can use supercomputers but if you actually want to get the data but if you actually want to get the data but if you actually want to get the data in different ways you've got to get in different ways you've got to get in different ways you've got to get through those proofs and so I love the through those proofs and so I love the through those proofs and so I love the open pancreas project because it is open open pancreas project because it is open open pancreas project because it is open source so that mean but but it's sort of source so that mean but but it's sort of source so that mean but but it's sort of limited on a certain organ I wish they'd limited on a certain organ I wish they'd limited on a certain organ I wish they'd sort of expand to more organs because sort of expand to more organs because sort of expand to more organs because then you get to make custom chips that then you get to make custom chips that then you get to make custom chips that can send light and ultrasound and can send light and ultrasound and can send light and ultrasound and electromagnetics into your body and then electromagnetics into your body and then electromagnetics into your body and then read it coming out and we get to use the read it coming out and we get to use the read it coming out and we get to use the ever shrinking transistor size to get ever shrinking transistor size to get ever shrinking transistor size to get ever shrinking um ever shrinking um ever shrinking um resolution of rather than just measuring resolution of rather than just measuring resolution of rather than just measuring the intensity of light or sound or the intensity of light or sound or the intensity of light or sound or electromagnetics we can modulate the electromagnetics we can modulate the electromagnetics we can modulate the phase and the interaction of these light phase and the interaction of these light phase and the interaction of these light and sounds in different ways and so and sounds in different ways and so and sounds in different ways and so that's why I left my cushy position that's why I left my cushy position that's why I left my cushy position was then called Facebook uh running a was then called Facebook uh running a was then called Facebook uh running a large aspect of advanced virtual reality large aspect of advanced virtual reality large aspect of advanced virtual reality and augmented reality and seeing what and augmented reality and seeing what and augmented reality and seeing what our checkbook could our checkbook could our checkbook could Fund in collaboration with the work of

Fund in collaboration with the work of Fund in collaboration with the work of the mighty Microsoft and my former the mighty Microsoft and my former the mighty Microsoft and my former employer Google and certainly what Apple employer Google and certainly what Apple employer Google and certainly what Apple was doing and Samsung I could see this was doing and Samsung I could see this was doing and Samsung I could see this stuff was coming down the pike and no stuff was coming down the pike and no stuff was coming down the pike and no one wanted to touch the fact that maybe one wanted to touch the fact that maybe one wanted to touch the fact that maybe we could Leap Frog we could Leap Frog we could Leap Frog drugs and be able to to not just even drugs and be able to to not just even drugs and be able to to not just even diagnose but also diagnose but also diagnose but also treat hundreds of diseases that kill us treat hundreds of diseases that kill us treat hundreds of diseases that kill us like not just we've got great results on like not just we've got great results on like not just we've got great results on glioblastoma but the implications of the glioblastoma but the implications of the glioblastoma but the implications of the results are for all cancers we're moving results are for all cancers we're moving results are for all cancers we're moving mice into remission of gly blastoma it's mice into remission of gly blastoma it's mice into remission of gly blastoma it's a big deal it's 100% dead deadly form of a big deal it's 100% dead deadly form of a big deal it's 100% dead deadly form of human brain cancer the implications for human brain cancer the implications for human brain cancer the implications for all cancers are pretty profound we've all cancers are pretty profound we've all cancers are pretty profound we've got great results on mental disease uh got great results on mental disease uh got great results on mental disease uh severe depression in humans we're now severe depression in humans we're now severe depression in humans we're now doing work with ameloid microclots which doing work with ameloid microclots which doing work with ameloid microclots which are the Hallmark of acute covid and type are the Hallmark of acute covid and type are the Hallmark of acute covid and type 2 diabetes and neurodegenerative disease 2 diabetes and neurodegenerative disease 2 diabetes and neurodegenerative disease and aging itself so the implications and aging itself so the implications and aging itself so the implications for using light infrared light that for using light infrared light that for using light infrared light that penetrates our body ultrasound that penetrates our body ultrasound that penetrates our body ultrasound that penetrates our body and electromagnetics penetrates our body and electromagnetics penetrates our body and electromagnetics at diagnostic levels to sort of Leap at diagnostic levels to sort of Leap at diagnostic levels to sort of Leap Frog to make general purpose machines Frog to make general purpose machines Frog to make general purpose machines that can be configured at the software that can be configured at the software that can be configured at the software layer so we're trying to just kind of layer so we're trying to just kind of layer so we're trying to just kind of make like Android where the apps are make like Android where the apps are make like Android where the apps are regular ulatory approvals that our regular ulatory approvals that our regular ulatory approvals that our customers get and with that we can make customers get and with that we can make customers get and with that we can make scale so we are making custom custom scale so we are making custom custom scale so we are making custom custom lasers custom ultrasound transducers lasers custom ultrasound transducers lasers custom ultrasound transducers custom chips um um all in a a custom you custom chips um um all in a a custom you custom chips um um all in a a custom you know Hardware uh We've started by doing

know Hardware uh We've started by doing know Hardware uh We've started by doing this it started the company nine years this it started the company nine years this it started the company nine years ago next month by building out rooms ago next month by building out rooms ago next month by building out rooms with lots of equipment to see you know with lots of equipment to see you know with lots of equipment to see you know what what worked using Phantom tissue what what worked using Phantom tissue what what worked using Phantom tissue you know going to buy kidneys at the you know going to buy kidneys at the you know going to buy kidneys at the Chinese over near Chinatown in San Chinese over near Chinatown in San Chinese over near Chinatown in San Francisco so we get a lot of range of of Francisco so we get a lot of range of of Francisco so we get a lot of range of of of dead meat to try this on and then of dead meat to try this on and then of dead meat to try this on and then moving into carts and got into hospitals moving into carts and got into hospitals moving into carts and got into hospitals for about four years starting at the for about four years starting at the for about four years starting at the beginning of pandemic and now we've beginning of pandemic and now we've beginning of pandemic and now we've shrunk it down again to make a system shrunk it down again to make a system shrunk it down again to make a system that we can ship right now for $10,000 a that we can ship right now for $10,000 a that we can ship right now for $10,000 a piece but the the cost of it at volume piece but the the cost of it at volume piece but the the cost of it at volume can be the cost of a smartphone it's can be the cost of a smartphone it's can be the cost of a smartphone it's fully open source like real open source fully open source like real open source fully open source like real open source not not whatever it's agpl creative not not whatever it's agpl creative not not whatever it's agpl creative comms 4.0 Sher aike it's all of that so comms 4.0 Sher aike it's all of that so comms 4.0 Sher aike it's all of that so people can try it open source is a people can try it open source is a people can try it open source is a distribution model it's a trust model distribution model it's a trust model distribution model it's a trust model and it's an innovation model and the and it's an innovation model and the and it's an innovation model and the health care industry doesn't mean to be health care industry doesn't mean to be health care industry doesn't mean to be but the healthcare industry is anti- but the healthcare industry is anti- but the healthcare industry is anti- innovation when it takes 30 to 40 years innovation when it takes 30 to 40 years innovation when it takes 30 to 40 years to ship a new to ship a new to ship a new product just got to call us SP to Spade product just got to call us SP to Spade product just got to call us SP to Spade it's it's a lot of well- meeting people it's it's a lot of well- meeting people it's it's a lot of well- meeting people no I well I that very much resonates no I well I that very much resonates no I well I that very much resonates with me because again I've been to with me because again I've been to with me because again I've been to diabetes for 30 years when I was diabetes for 30 years when I was diabetes for 30 years when I was diagnosed 32 years ago they said I think diagnosed 32 years ago they said I think diagnosed 32 years ago they said I think we'll get this thing kicked in 5 years we'll get this thing kicked in 5 years we'll get this thing kicked in 5 years and that's the joke is that every five and that's the joke is that every five and that's the joke is that every five you know every every year they tell you you know every every year they tell you you know every every year they tell you five more years and then you start after five more years and then you start after five more years and then you start after 30 years you start getting a tinf foil 30 years you start getting a tinf foil 30 years you start getting a tinf foil hat you say well it's cheaper to keep me hat you say well it's cheaper to keep me hat you say well it's cheaper to keep me diabetic than it is to fix this thing

diabetic than it is to fix this thing diabetic than it is to fix this thing well right there's a lot of stories well right there's a lot of stories well right there's a lot of stories about that particularly with the um oh about that particularly with the um oh about that particularly with the um oh the kidney uh the transfusion stuff and the kidney uh the transfusion stuff and the kidney uh the transfusion stuff and there's a great book written about it there's a great book written about it there's a great book written about it recently about the bracket recently about the bracket recently about the bracket of I want to remember the two names of I want to remember the two names of I want to remember the two names Freez and Freez and Freez and Dita where they do apparently do that Dita where they do apparently do that Dita where they do apparently do that according to a lot of the according to a lot of the according to a lot of the lawsuits uh yeah it it is it's yeah Cash lawsuits uh yeah it it is it's yeah Cash lawsuits uh yeah it it is it's yeah Cash Cow you're a Cash Cow of the industry I Cow you're a Cash Cow of the industry I Cow you're a Cash Cow of the industry I am too I had brain surgery in 1995 am too I had brain surgery in 1995 am too I had brain surgery in 1995 hardest thing I've ever done it took 17 hardest thing I've ever done it took 17 hardest thing I've ever done it took 17 years to diagnose it I've taken a dozen years to diagnose it I've taken a dozen years to diagnose it I've taken a dozen medications every day but last 29 years medications every day but last 29 years medications every day but last 29 years to stay alive wow so you can really to stay alive wow so you can really to stay alive wow so you can really relate and you're thinking yourself relate and you're thinking yourself relate and you're thinking yourself become a neuroendocrinology expert maybe become a neuroendocrinology expert maybe become a neuroendocrinology expert maybe this work can help for that but you know this work can help for that but you know this work can help for that but you know actually maybe having treatments for all actually maybe having treatments for all actually maybe having treatments for all Cancers and all mental diseases and Cancers and all mental diseases and Cancers and all mental diseases and addictions is faster and easier so you addictions is faster and easier so you addictions is faster and easier so you got to sort of say wow let's let's got to sort of say wow let's let's got to sort of say wow let's let's pursue that and so that's really what um pursue that and so that's really what um pursue that and so that's really what um we decided to pursue oh and by the way we decided to pursue oh and by the way we decided to pursue oh and by the way uh the number two killer in the world uh the number two killer in the world uh the number two killer in the world stroke we have blood flow level stroke we have blood flow level stroke we have blood flow level detection that's about 30 times better detection that's about 30 times better detection that's about 30 times better 20 times better excuse me than 20 times better excuse me than 20 times better excuse me than multi-million Mr dollar MRI and that multi-million Mr dollar MRI and that multi-million Mr dollar MRI and that really matters for diseases of blood really matters for diseases of blood really matters for diseases of blood flow and the number two killer in the flow and the number two killer in the flow and the number two killer in the world is stroke that's a blood flow world is stroke that's a blood flow world is stroke that's a blood flow issue it either stops or it explodes and issue it either stops or it explodes and issue it either stops or it explodes and when you can see blood flow actually

when you can see blood flow actually when you can see blood flow actually blood flow precisely that's a big deal blood flow precisely that's a big deal blood flow precisely that's a big deal so we've been in hospitals for three so we've been in hospitals for three so we've been in hospitals for three years studying stroke patients of the years studying stroke patients of the years studying stroke patients of the most severe type of stroke called large most severe type of stroke called large most severe type of stroke called large vessel occlusion stroke vessel occlusion stroke vessel occlusion stroke when the large vessel is uded it blocks when the large vessel is uded it blocks when the large vessel is uded it blocks everything Downstream so you know if you everything Downstream so you know if you everything Downstream so you know if you don't get the right procedure within 2 don't get the right procedure within 2 don't get the right procedure within 2 hours right if you live you probably hours right if you live you probably hours right if you live you probably won't either walk or talk again you won't either walk or talk again you won't either walk or talk again you certainly won't have a job again you certainly won't have a job again you certainly won't have a job again you probably won't go home again my my dad probably won't go home again my my dad probably won't go home again my my dad had two tias last had two tias last had two tias last week and and they're ocular tias and week and and they're ocular tias and week and and they're ocular tias and we're trying to figure out is that the we're trying to figure out is that the we're trying to figure out is that the harbinger of the big one and 30% of the harbinger of the big one and 30% of the harbinger of the big one and 30% of the time it is yeah the repeat strokes and time it is yeah the repeat strokes and time it is yeah the repeat strokes and so if you had a way to know if you were so if you had a way to know if you were so if you had a way to know if you were having an lvo stroke you could go to the having an lvo stroke you could go to the having an lvo stroke you could go to the only 5% of the hospitals this is the only 5% of the hospitals this is the only 5% of the hospitals this is the worst one the the big killer it kills worst one the the big killer it kills worst one the the big killer it kills 6.5 million people a year globally 6.5 million people a year globally 6.5 million people a year globally number two cause of death globally um 5% number two cause of death globally um 5% number two cause of death globally um 5% of the hospitals can do the treatment so of the hospitals can do the treatment so of the hospitals can do the treatment so by chance you have 5% chance of getting by chance you have 5% chance of getting by chance you have 5% chance of getting there because it's not apparent what you there because it's not apparent what you there because it's not apparent what you have The Gunshot victims we know what have The Gunshot victims we know what have The Gunshot victims we know what they have they get to go to the right they have they get to go to the right they have they get to go to the right treatment even heart attacks because treatment even heart attacks because treatment even heart attacks because there's an ECG you can put on your chest there's an ECG you can put on your chest there's an ECG you can put on your chest and find out if you've got a heart and find out if you've got a heart and find out if you've got a heart attack or not so we've basically made a attack or not so we've basically made a attack or not so we've basically made a version of an ECG for your forehead that version of an ECG for your forehead that version of an ECG for your forehead that tells you if you're having an lvo stroke tells you if you're having an lvo stroke tells you if you're having an lvo stroke that could be used in a portable in an that could be used in a portable in an that could be used in a portable in an ambulance to direct the ambulance to the ambulance to direct the ambulance to the ambulance to direct the ambulance to the right hospital and notify the hospital right hospital and notify the hospital right hospital and notify the hospital so in parallel they're preparing they so in parallel they're preparing they so in parallel they're preparing they call it the cath lab the solution is to call it the cath lab the solution is to call it the cath lab the solution is to string a catheter up your corate Ary and

string a catheter up your corate Ary and string a catheter up your corate Ary and pull the clot out because it's a pull the clot out because it's a pull the clot out because it's a plumbing problem it is if you can get plumbing problem it is if you can get plumbing problem it is if you can get that done within two hours of stroke that done within two hours of stroke that done within two hours of stroke onset there's a 90% chance of no neural onset there's a 90% chance of no neural onset there's a 90% chance of no neural deficit at all time is brain cells but deficit at all time is brain cells but deficit at all time is brain cells but this is also useful potentially for tias this is also useful potentially for tias this is also useful potentially for tias those are transient ice chemic attacks those are transient ice chemic attacks those are transient ice chemic attacks what we're seeing in amalo microclots is what we're seeing in amalo microclots is what we're seeing in amalo microclots is um there's a theory it's clogging the um there's a theory it's clogging the um there's a theory it's clogging the capillaries which are the smallest you capillaries which are the smallest you capillaries which are the smallest you know diameter vessel in your know diameter vessel in your know diameter vessel in your body this is happening in acute covid um body this is happening in acute covid um body this is happening in acute covid um and long CO as well as diabetes and and long CO as well as diabetes and and long CO as well as diabetes and neurodegenerative disease and aging and neurodegenerative disease and aging and neurodegenerative disease and aging and what we shown is um using ultrasound as what we shown is um using ultrasound as what we shown is um using ultrasound as well and I can tell you the frequencies well and I can tell you the frequencies well and I can tell you the frequencies we're we're open source we're using 150 we're we're open source we're using 150 we're we're open source we're using 150 khz 10% duty cycle and we're breaking khz 10% duty cycle and we're breaking khz 10% duty cycle and we're breaking apart those microclots so they're sub apart those microclots so they're sub apart those microclots so they're sub five microns in size which means the five microns in size which means the five microns in size which means the capill are as th its width is 5 to 10 capill are as th its width is 5 to 10 capill are as th its width is 5 to 10 microns so the theas they should be able microns so the theas they should be able microns so the theas they should be able to get through we're in preclinical with to get through we're in preclinical with to get through we're in preclinical with it but we're sharing that we're just it but we're sharing that we're just it but we're sharing that we're just writing up our first results right now writing up our first results right now writing up our first results right now we also think we should be able to see we also think we should be able to see we also think we should be able to see those micr clots which which may give those micr clots which which may give those micr clots which which may give rise to tias it's un it's not fully rise to tias it's un it's not fully rise to tias it's un it's not fully under understood tias but we can make under understood tias but we can make under understood tias but we can make these better non-invasive tools that these better non-invasive tools that these better non-invasive tools that help us have better understanding of it help us have better understanding of it help us have better understanding of it and so forth you had how do you you had and so forth you had how do you you had and so forth you had how do you you had a round last uh last year of $100 a round last uh last year of $100 a round last uh last year of $100 million how do you raise money and also million how do you raise money and also million how do you raise money and also give away things as open source how do

give away things as open source how do give away things as open source how do you like I have found that that is not you like I have found that that is not you like I have found that that is not necessarily compatible I made the case necessarily compatible I made the case necessarily compatible I made the case to be fair $54 million last year $100 to be fair $54 million last year $100 to be fair $54 million last year $100 million over the life of the company in million over the life of the company in million over the life of the company in total funding yeah in total funding uh total funding yeah in total funding uh total funding yeah in total funding uh that it's a better business model than that it's a better business model than that it's a better business model than $658 million in 13 years for a single $658 million in 13 years for a single $658 million in 13 years for a single rare disease that if you get it to work rare disease that if you get it to work rare disease that if you get it to work then you still have to get through then you still have to get through then you still have to get through standard of care approval and standard of care approval and standard of care approval and reimbursement minimum a billion dollars reimbursement minimum a billion dollars reimbursement minimum a billion dollars okay it's single rare disease let's take okay it's single rare disease let's take okay it's single rare disease let's take gasta I happen to know about 5,000 gasta I happen to know about 5,000 gasta I happen to know about 5,000 people in the US have glioblastoma right people in the US have glioblastoma right people in the US have glioblastoma right now a new 5,000 people will have it next now a new 5,000 people will have it next now a new 5,000 people will have it next year because these ones will be dead year because these ones will be dead year because these ones will be dead 5,000 people how many have health 5,000 people how many have health 5,000 people how many have health insurance half maybe maybe so can and insurance half maybe maybe so can and insurance half maybe maybe so can and how many will not get will get denied how many will not get will get denied how many will not get will get denied let's say you get let's call it a th let's say you get let's call it a th let's say you get let's call it a th 2,000 there's 2,000 you've spent a 2,000 there's 2,000 you've spent a 2,000 there's 2,000 you've spent a billion dollars to get there what do you billion dollars to get there what do you billion dollars to get there what do you charge well most people charges close to charge well most people charges close to charge well most people charges close to a million dollars there's new treatments a million dollars there's new treatments a million dollars there's new treatments right now that are at $3 million some of right now that are at $3 million some of right now that are at $3 million some of the new crisper treatment the new crisper treatment the new crisper treatment so it shouldn't take me to say it's an so it shouldn't take me to say it's an so it shouldn't take me to say it's an understatement to say that a million-- understatement to say that a million-- understatement to say that a million-- dollar treatment is not affordable to dollar treatment is not affordable to dollar treatment is not affordable to the vast vast majority of humanity nor the vast vast majority of humanity nor the vast vast majority of humanity nor Americans so why are we funding R&D that Americans so why are we funding R&D that Americans so why are we funding R&D that if it works or companies that if it if it works or companies that if it if it works or companies that if it works it's going to be a million-- works it's going to be a million-- works it's going to be a million-- dollar treatment what have we why yeah

dollar treatment what have we why yeah dollar treatment what have we why yeah so the argument of a this general so the argument of a this general so the argument of a this general purpose device and it's not we on the purpose device and it's not we on the purpose device and it's not we on the shoulders of giants we've done some shoulders of giants we've done some shoulders of giants we've done some really Innovative things the hardware really Innovative things the hardware really Innovative things the hardware design is really amazing we're lowering design is really amazing we're lowering design is really amazing we're lowering the cost of the system we've load the cost of the system we've load the cost of the system we've load lowered it from a million dollars to lowered it from a million dollars to lowered it from a million dollars to $10,000 it'll go down to another $1 $10,000 it'll go down to another $1 $10,000 it'll go down to another $1 thousand but there's been a million thousand but there's been a million thousand but there's been a million papers published in the last 20 years papers published in the last 20 years papers published in the last 20 years alone about using infrared light or alone about using infrared light or alone about using infrared light or ultrasound or electromagnetics or in ultrasound or electromagnetics or in ultrasound or electromagnetics or in combination to treat thousands of combination to treat thousands of combination to treat thousands of diseases people get their phds people diseases people get their phds people diseases people get their phds people get tenure maybe they get into the get tenure maybe they get into the get tenure maybe they get into the national maybe come an I sorry ACM national maybe come an I sorry ACM national maybe come an I sorry ACM fellow whatever fellow whatever fellow whatever um but it's a rounding error to say zero um but it's a rounding error to say zero um but it's a rounding error to say zero of it gets into the Health Care system of it gets into the Health Care system of it gets into the Health Care system because no one can afford the $658 because no one can afford the $658 because no one can afford the $658 million and you don't get to shrink the million and you don't get to shrink the million and you don't get to shrink the cost of the device cost of the device cost of the device first because the FDA considers a first because the FDA considers a first because the FDA considers a quality Bild 10 quality Bild 10 quality Bild 10 units I was a CTO of group CTO at Intel units I was a CTO of group CTO at Intel units I was a CTO of group CTO at Intel in 20 21 years ago in 20 21 years ago in 20 21 years ago a sample size was 10,000 units for us a a sample size was 10,000 units for us a a sample size was 10,000 units for us a sample size there's not nothing quality sample size there's not nothing quality sample size there's not nothing quality build about 10 units and so you build build about 10 units and so you build build about 10 units and so you build these big carts for a million dollars these big carts for a million dollars these big carts for a million dollars and you get a regulatory approval you and you get a regulatory approval you and you get a regulatory approval you get reimbursement and you get to build get reimbursement and you get to build get reimbursement and you get to build 12 carts then and have them in 12 12 carts then and have them in 12 12 carts then and have them in 12 Hospital like it's just until you can Hospital like it's just until you can Hospital like it's just until you can spend another $658 million shrink it and spend another $658 million shrink it and spend another $658 million shrink it and and get it to production so why not just

and get it to production so why not just and get it to production so why not just say look we have enough data say look we have enough data say look we have enough data to demonstrate that this is viable to demonstrate that this is viable to demonstrate that this is viable because if you look at it if you make because if you look at it if you make because if you look at it if you make more of something it's cheaper it's a more of something it's cheaper it's a more of something it's cheaper it's a slight exaggeration to say if you make slight exaggeration to say if you make slight exaggeration to say if you make 10x more of something it's 10x cheaper 10x more of something it's 10x cheaper 10x more of something it's 10x cheaper but it's only slight but it's only slight but it's only slight exaggeration so you make a lot more you exaggeration so you make a lot more you exaggeration so you make a lot more you collect a lot of data we're making collect a lot of data we're making collect a lot of data we're making everybody that buys our devices and you everybody that buys our devices and you everybody that buys our devices and you can make your own if you want to good can make your own if you want to good can make your own if you want to good luck with a laser it's really hard so luck with a laser it's really hard so luck with a laser it's really hard so the ultrasound it's really hard to do the ultrasound it's really hard to do the ultrasound it's really hard to do this mixed signal sort of stuff so but this mixed signal sort of stuff so but this mixed signal sort of stuff so but the plans are there you can do it or can the plans are there you can do it or can the plans are there you can do it or can buy this and if and it keeps us honest buy this and if and it keeps us honest buy this and if and it keeps us honest if if you get if if you get if if you get approval we're ISO approval we're ISO approval we're ISO 1345 approved you can just we're IRB 1345 approved you can just we're IRB 1345 approved you can just we're IRB ready FDA ready all that stuff for for ready FDA ready all that stuff for for ready FDA ready all that stuff for for doing clinical trials but you can also doing clinical trials but you can also doing clinical trials but you can also just take the design and have it built just take the design and have it built just take the design and have it built wherever you want wherever you want wherever you want to so why is that a good business model to so why is that a good business model to so why is that a good business model because we still ship a lot more of them because we still ship a lot more of them because we still ship a lot more of them we're a lot more profitable we'll ship a we're a lot more profitable we'll ship a we're a lot more profitable we'll ship a few thousand units this year we go few thousand units this year we go few thousand units this year we go profitable profitable profitable like it's it's like just even getting it like it's it's like just even getting it like it's it's like just even getting it into the R&D Community a fully into the R&D Community a fully into the R&D Community a fully reconfigurable low intensity focused reconfigurable low intensity focused reconfigurable low intensity focused ultrasound system that's wearable and ultrasound system that's wearable and ultrasound system that's wearable and small as well as this blood flow small as well as this blood flow small as well as this blood flow detection unit that's also useful for detection unit that's also useful for detection unit that's also useful for any movement we're seeing um seizures any movement we're seeing um seizures any movement we're seeing um seizures and we think kidney flow and lymph flow and we think kidney flow and lymph flow and we think kidney flow and lymph flow and anything you want you can change the and anything you want you can change the and anything you want you can change the pulst duration of the laser we make pulst duration of the laser we make pulst duration of the laser we make basically a hologram on camera shs

basically a hologram on camera shs basically a hologram on camera shs shipping in every smartphone in the shipping in every smartphone in the shipping in every smartphone in the world okay so I want to understand you world okay so I want to understand you world okay so I want to understand you you you've said shrink it down a couple you you've said shrink it down a couple you you've said shrink it down a couple of times MRIs CTS big giant Donuts that of times MRIs CTS big giant Donuts that of times MRIs CTS big giant Donuts that spin these are giant million-dollar spin these are giant million-dollar spin these are giant million-dollar machines that are scary and then we have machines that are scary and then we have machines that are scary and then we have these pocket supercomputers help me these pocket supercomputers help me these pocket supercomputers help me understand why medical devices need to understand why medical devices need to understand why medical devices need to be so big and why you're deciding that be so big and why you're deciding that be so big and why you're deciding that no they really don't need to be so big no they really don't need to be so big no they really don't need to be so big well you need a big magnet to see the I well you need a big magnet to see the I well you need a big magnet to see the I mean this one of the most complicated mean this one of the most complicated mean this one of the most complicated products I know ever shipped it saved my products I know ever shipped it saved my products I know ever shipped it saved my life life life size and cost hasn't changed in the 29 size and cost hasn't changed in the 29 size and cost hasn't changed in the 29 years since um I wasn't scared of it years since um I wasn't scared of it years since um I wasn't scared of it people are um but yeah you have to lie people are um but yeah you have to lie people are um but yeah you have to lie inside of the magnet and the magnet is a inside of the magnet and the magnet is a inside of the magnet and the magnet is a very specific thing it's actually a we very specific thing it's actually a we very specific thing it's actually a we can get into the physics of it but yes can get into the physics of it but yes can get into the physics of it but yes it hasn't changed this is my frustration it hasn't changed this is my frustration it hasn't changed this is my frustration as well and yet look at what we can make as well and yet look at what we can make as well and yet look at what we can make in the Silicon Fabs and the in the Silicon Fabs and the in the Silicon Fabs and the semiconductor Fabs within a variety of semiconductor Fabs within a variety of semiconductor Fabs within a variety of Mater materials I started life as um as Mater materials I started life as um as Mater materials I started life as um as a teenager falling in love with making a teenager falling in love with making a teenager falling in love with making Holograms you can now make holograms on Holograms you can now make holograms on Holograms you can now make holograms on these camera chips that are shipping in these camera chips that are shipping in these camera chips that are shipping in smartphones that have high Quantum smartphones that have high Quantum smartphones that have high Quantum efficiency in the near infrared the near efficiency in the near infrared the near efficiency in the near infrared the near infrared that's the thing that goes infrared that's the thing that goes infrared that's the thing that goes through your body like the invention of through your body like the invention of through your body like the invention of the fire was really important to the fire was really important to the fire was really important to humanity you see the light but you feel humanity you see the light but you feel humanity you see the light but you feel the heat that's the infrared light the heat that's the infrared light the heat that's the infrared light warming your belly like it goes warming your belly like it goes warming your belly like it goes through but scatters through but scatters through but scatters everywhere you can un scatter it if you

everywhere you can un scatter it if you everywhere you can un scatter it if you can record the phase of the light and can record the phase of the light and can record the phase of the light and the camera the two 5 megapixel camera the camera the two 5 megapixel camera the camera the two 5 megapixel camera pixels shipping in most all smartphones pixels shipping in most all smartphones pixels shipping in most all smartphones have pixel sizes of a micron that's the have pixel sizes of a micron that's the have pixel sizes of a micron that's the wavelength of light you can then wavelength of light you can then wavelength of light you can then interfere if you can make a highly interfere if you can make a highly interfere if you can make a highly coherent laser that allows you to get coherent laser that allows you to get coherent laser that allows you to get that information out because the phase that information out because the phase that information out because the phase of light with the intensity of light is of light with the intensity of light is of light with the intensity of light is fundamentally a lot more fundamentally a lot more fundamentally a lot more information and what we do is we pulse information and what we do is we pulse information and what we do is we pulse this laser that we made and when you this laser that we made and when you this laser that we made and when you pulse it pulse it pulse it for anybody in the audience that ever's for anybody in the audience that ever's for anybody in the audience that ever's made made a hologram you know if made made a hologram you know if made made a hologram you know if anything moves when you're doing your anything moves when you're doing your anything moves when you're doing your exposure you get a bad hologram it's exposure you get a bad hologram it's exposure you get a bad hologram it's either a dim one or nothing comes out so either a dim one or nothing comes out so either a dim one or nothing comes out so if we pulse the laser and something's if we pulse the laser and something's if we pulse the laser and something's moving we get a dim moving we get a dim moving we get a dim hologram and if nothing's moving we get hologram and if nothing's moving we get hologram and if nothing's moving we get a really bright hologram and the a really bright hologram and the a really bright hologram and the gradations that we can see give us blood gradations that we can see give us blood gradations that we can see give us blood flow in Phantom tissue to 0.1% accuracy flow in Phantom tissue to 0.1% accuracy flow in Phantom tissue to 0.1% accuracy which is 20 times better than anything which is 20 times better than anything which is 20 times better than anything else we can find recorded including CT else we can find recorded including CT else we can find recorded including CT MRI Doppler ultrasound and so forth MRI Doppler ultrasound and so forth MRI Doppler ultrasound and so forth using literally a $1 camera chip in your using literally a $1 camera chip in your using literally a $1 camera chip in your smartphones and a laser that was a smartphones and a laser that was a smartphones and a laser that was a million dollars in the size of this room million dollars in the size of this room million dollars in the size of this room five years ago but we've reduced it down five years ago but we've reduced it down five years ago but we've reduced it down to something the size of of the first to something the size of of the first to something the size of of the first digit of my finger in a butterfly digit of my finger in a butterfly digit of my finger in a butterfly package and so that it's a mopa laser we package and so that it's a mopa laser we package and so that it's a mopa laser we use a highly coherency laser and amplify use a highly coherency laser and amplify use a highly coherency laser and amplify it with a a tapered amplifier it's a it with a a tapered amplifier it's a it with a a tapered amplifier it's a little bit more tricky than that because

little bit more tricky than that because little bit more tricky than that because the pulsing when you pulse something you the pulsing when you pulse something you the pulsing when you pulse something you change its heat and it's current and change its heat and it's current and change its heat and it's current and that can change its wavelength and so that can change its wavelength and so that can change its wavelength and so it's really tricky on how you build that it's really tricky on how you build that it's really tricky on how you build that out but we've we now have it and it's out but we've we now have it and it's out but we've we now have it and it's starting production next quarter that's starting production next quarter that's starting production next quarter that's amazing so using lay persons analogies amazing so using lay persons analogies amazing so using lay persons analogies here uh for the for the audience is here uh for the for the audience is here uh for the for the audience is you're using light you're using broads you're using light you're using broads you're using light you're using broads frequencies for both read and write you frequencies for both read and write you frequencies for both read and write you are detecting things and then changing are detecting things and then changing are detecting things and then changing it you are reaching into the body and it you are reaching into the body and it you are reaching into the body and changing it like just like gamma knife changing it like just like gamma knife changing it like just like gamma knife radio surgery you're doing pinpoint radio surgery you're doing pinpoint radio surgery you're doing pinpoint accuracy targeting things in the body accuracy targeting things in the body accuracy targeting things in the body from the outside without having to cut from the outside without having to cut from the outside without having to cut but with no ionizing radiation so we're but with no ionizing radiation so we're but with no ionizing radiation so we're using ultrasound to selectively kill using ultrasound to selectively kill using ultrasound to selectively kill cancer cancer cancer cells at diagnostic doses shown safe on cells at diagnostic doses shown safe on cells at diagnostic doses shown safe on pregnant women and their fetuses in rich pregnant women and their fetuses in rich pregnant women and their fetuses in rich countries for the last 50 years and T of countries for the last 50 years and T of countries for the last 50 years and T of billions of people for the last hundred billions of people for the last hundred billions of people for the last hundred years this is not like a new drug that's years this is not like a new drug that's years this is not like a new drug that's never existed before and has being never existed before and has being never existed before and has being injected into a body a bunch of bodies injected into a body a bunch of bodies injected into a body a bunch of bodies nonetheless so what the way we do it is nonetheless so what the way we do it is nonetheless so what the way we do it is we find the resonant frequency of the we find the resonant frequency of the we find the resonant frequency of the cancer cells so for example with gasta cancer cells so for example with gasta cancer cells so for example with gasta we got 16 different lines of gly we got 16 different lines of gly we got 16 different lines of gly blastoma built up these little organoids blastoma built up these little organoids blastoma built up these little organoids little tiny brains half a millimeter in little tiny brains half a millimeter in little tiny brains half a millimeter in size and ran through frequency sweeps size and ran through frequency sweeps size and ran through frequency sweeps and Rhythm sweeps to find the ones that and Rhythm sweeps to find the ones that and Rhythm sweeps to find the ones that would kill the cancer Shake apart the would kill the cancer Shake apart the would kill the cancer Shake apart the cancer but not harm the healthy cells cancer but not harm the healthy cells cancer but not harm the healthy cells and when it shakes apart the cancer it and when it shakes apart the cancer it and when it shakes apart the cancer it releases protein releases protein releases protein that vaccinate the body from the very

that vaccinate the body from the very that vaccinate the body from the very cancer it has whether you're an antiva cancer it has whether you're an antiva cancer it has whether you're an antiva or not you're going to be for this it's or not you're going to be for this it's or not you're going to be for this it's your own protein letting your immune your own protein letting your immune your own protein letting your immune system see it so we ran through that we system see it so we ran through that we system see it so we ran through that we we in our studies we did better than any we in our studies we did better than any we in our studies we did better than any of the chemo drugs in the autopsies we of the chemo drugs in the autopsies we of the chemo drugs in the autopsies we then replicated that in mice and moved then replicated that in mice and moved then replicated that in mice and moved 30 mice into remission of Leo blastoma 30 mice into remission of Leo blastoma 30 mice into remission of Leo blastoma the ones that we didn't give the the ones that we didn't give the the ones that we didn't give the treatment we had to sacrifice we sent treatment we had to sacrifice we sent treatment we had to sacrifice we sent them to them to them to autopsy child rer found no damaged autopsy child rer found no damaged autopsy child rer found no damaged healthy healthy healthy cells in the autopsy there's no cancer cells in the autopsy there's no cancer cells in the autopsy there's no cancer treatment that doesn't harm healthy treatment that doesn't harm healthy treatment that doesn't harm healthy cells even surgery you cut through but cells even surgery you cut through but cells even surgery you cut through but chemotherapy radiation therapy also chemotherapy radiation therapy also chemotherapy radiation therapy also harms the healthy cells so it's huge harms the healthy cells so it's huge harms the healthy cells so it's huge just find the resonant just find the resonant just find the resonant frequency of the cancer get a biopsy we frequency of the cancer get a biopsy we frequency of the cancer get a biopsy we think it's probably going to end we're think it's probably going to end we're think it's probably going to end we're not sure where it's going to end up but not sure where it's going to end up but not sure where it's going to end up but people are want to to biopsy we're people are want to to biopsy we're people are want to to biopsy we're probably going to start a thing with an probably going to start a thing with an probably going to start a thing with an organoid cell so you can send your organoid cell so you can send your organoid cell so you can send your biopsy we can find your frequency and biopsy we can find your frequency and biopsy we can find your frequency and you know you can try in a trial we don't you know you can try in a trial we don't you know you can try in a trial we don't we are not FDA approved yet so of course we are not FDA approved yet so of course we are not FDA approved yet so of course of course so pushing gently on that if of course so pushing gently on that if of course so pushing gently on that if you're if this was a Hollywood movie and you're if this was a Hollywood movie and you're if this was a Hollywood movie and I was the scientist and I had least I I was the scientist and I had least I I was the scientist and I had least I would jump into the into the box and I would jump into the into the box and I would jump into the into the box and I would shoot it shoot myself with the would shoot it shoot myself with the would shoot it shoot myself with the thing how far away is this because there thing how far away is this because there thing how far away is this because there my neighbor my neighbor has literally my neighbor my neighbor has literally my neighbor my neighbor has literally quarter and I have uh uh someone in quarter and I have uh uh someone in quarter and I have uh uh someone in London waiting for the treatment where

London waiting for the treatment where London waiting for the treatment where um so that that's at 150 khz so what um so that that's at 150 khz so what um so that that's at 150 khz so what we're trying to do is span a whole bunch we're trying to do is span a whole bunch we're trying to do is span a whole bunch of ranges um we're turning on and off of ranges um we're turning on and off of ranges um we're turning on and off neurons non-invasively without the neurons non-invasively without the neurons non-invasively without the one-inch hole in your head I had the one-inch hole in your head I had the one-inch hole in your head I had the onein hole in my head no it was death or onein hole in my head no it was death or onein hole in my head no it was death or that of course I went for it but I don't that of course I went for it but I don't that of course I went for it but I don't see the vast swath of humanity actually see the vast swath of humanity actually see the vast swath of humanity actually signing up for it indeed they don't for signing up for it indeed they don't for signing up for it indeed they don't for deep brain stimulation where you could deep brain stimulation where you could deep brain stimulation where you could get two to do it but non-invasively we get two to do it but non-invasively we get two to do it but non-invasively we can reach anywhere in the brain and in can reach anywhere in the brain and in can reach anywhere in the brain and in our first study of severe depression our first study of severe depression our first study of severe depression almost half of the patients went into almost half of the patients went into almost half of the patients went into remission with just 10 minute a day remission with just 10 minute a day remission with just 10 minute a day doses for uh three weeks five days the doses for uh three weeks five days the doses for uh three weeks five days the first week three days the second week first week three days the second week first week three days the second week three days the third week and they've three days the third week and they've three days the third week and they've stayed there so this could be an at home stayed there so this could be an at home stayed there so this could be an at home system that you put on your head and and system that you put on your head and and system that you put on your head and and you know honestly we even found a way to you know honestly we even found a way to you know honestly we even found a way to register we can register precisely to register we can register precisely to register we can register precisely to where your thing is by by not using a where your thing is by by not using a where your thing is by by not using a $1,000 system in the hospital but an $1,000 system in the hospital but an $1,000 system in the hospital but an Android smartphone where we take Android smartphone where we take Android smartphone where we take pictures of your head make a mesh a 3D pictures of your head make a mesh a 3D pictures of your head make a mesh a 3D mesh register it on your scans match mesh register it on your scans match mesh register it on your scans match your bone your bone your bone structure when we take those pictures structure when we take those pictures structure when we take those pictures you're wearing the headset we know you're wearing the headset we know you're wearing the headset we know exactly where those transducers are and exactly where those transducers are and exactly where those transducers are and with the transducers we um delay the with the transducers we um delay the with the transducers we um delay the phase from trans we we are we have these phase from trans we we are we have these phase from trans we we are we have these 8 by eight arrays you delay the phase 8 by eight arrays you delay the phase 8 by eight arrays you delay the phase from one emitter to the next emitter so from one emitter to the next emitter so from one emitter to the next emitter so you can steer that sound to precise you can steer that sound to precise you can steer that sound to precise Focus near far up down right left

Focus near far up down right left Focus near far up down right left anywhere in the body we wish to go so anywhere in the body we wish to go so anywhere in the body we wish to go so it's a very versatile system we're it's a very versatile system we're it's a very versatile system we're making it in a tiled manner you can buy making it in a tiled manner you can buy making it in a tiled manner you can buy on Z or two Z or six pack for your abs on Z or two Z or six pack for your abs on Z or two Z or six pack for your abs and you know 3D print your own shape so and you know 3D print your own shape so and you know 3D print your own shape so that you can experiment with whatever that you can experiment with whatever that you can experiment with whatever the ailment is because the the ailment is because the the ailment is because the implications of focus ultrasound are so implications of focus ultrasound are so implications of focus ultrasound are so profound we've seen uh really great profound we've seen uh really great profound we've seen uh really great results in high-intensity focused results in high-intensity focused results in high-intensity focused ultrasound but that like Gite well in ultrasound but that like Gite well in ultrasound but that like Gite well in the case of H like it ablates tissue by the case of H like it ablates tissue by the case of H like it ablates tissue by heating or even vaporizing it in this heating or even vaporizing it in this heating or even vaporizing it in this case we're just looking for the the the case we're just looking for the the the case we're just looking for the the the resonant frequencies and with the resonant frequencies and with the resonant frequencies and with the diagnostic level affecting selectively diagnostic level affecting selectively diagnostic level affecting selectively the at a cellular the at a cellular the at a cellular level do you think in some some years level do you think in some some years level do you think in some some years this will be the kind of thing that this will be the kind of thing that this will be the kind of thing that someone could bu build in there I mean I someone could bu build in there I mean I someone could bu build in there I mean I could certainly get my get a could certainly get my get a could certainly get my get a prescription for this and take it home prescription for this and take it home prescription for this and take it home but could I build this myself isn't but could I build this myself isn't but could I build this myself isn't there risk in high-intensity Focus there risk in high-intensity Focus there risk in high-intensity Focus ultrasound creating heat well we're not ultrasound creating heat well we're not ultrasound creating heat well we're not we're doing low intensity diagnostic we're doing low intensity diagnostic we're doing low intensity diagnostic level achieving the therapeutic result level achieving the therapeutic result level achieving the therapeutic result therapeutic results on low we can ship therapeutic results on low we can ship therapeutic results on low we can ship it we when Once the first volumes hit it we when Once the first volumes hit it we when Once the first volumes hit for about a C thousand dolls a piece for about a C thousand dolls a piece for about a C thousand dolls a piece about the cost of a smartphone and about the cost of a smartphone and about the cost of a smartphone and treatment would be like the cost of a treatment would be like the cost of a treatment would be like the cost of a phone phone phone call so that really changes things you call so that really changes things you call so that really changes things you think of the shortages of drugs and and think of the shortages of drugs and and think of the shortages of drugs and and using drugs they just affect here not using drugs they just affect here not using drugs they just affect here not your whole body it doesn't flow through

your whole body it doesn't flow through your whole body it doesn't flow through your whole body there could be doesn't your whole body there could be doesn't your whole body there could be doesn't this do you ever feel like you're really this do you ever feel like you're really this do you ever feel like you're really close to a tricorder you know what I close to a tricorder you know what I close to a tricorder you know what I mean this is that Star Trek level of mean this is that Star Trek level of mean this is that Star Trek level of non-invasive diagnosis and Curative non-invasive diagnosis and Curative non-invasive diagnosis and Curative that's the goal we're starting with two that's the goal we're starting with two that's the goal we're starting with two modules of that but but really when you modules of that but but really when you modules of that but but really when you look at the million papers that have look at the million papers that have look at the million papers that have been published there's a lot of talent been published there's a lot of talent been published there's a lot of talent out there so we hope to bring them along out there so we hope to bring them along out there so we hope to bring them along um and get more modules in this unit or um and get more modules in this unit or um and get more modules in this unit or compete to save the world whatever but compete to save the world whatever but compete to save the world whatever but sure we think open source is the right sure we think open source is the right sure we think open source is the right approach because it gets the cost approach because it gets the cost approach because it gets the cost structure right like literally the Wall structure right like literally the Wall structure right like literally the Wall Street Journal in December had a Street Journal in December had a Street Journal in December had a headline are we justified in murdering headline are we justified in murdering headline are we justified in murdering healthc care CEOs oh my goodness we all healthc care CEOs oh my goodness we all healthc care CEOs oh my goodness we all remember Guido there who shot the United remember Guido there who shot the United remember Guido there who shot the United Healthcare CEO dead on the streets of Healthcare CEO dead on the streets of Healthcare CEO dead on the streets of Manhattan of course not but people are Manhattan of course not but people are Manhattan of course not but people are frustrated there really are death panels frustrated there really are death panels frustrated there really are death panels you know it's called standard of care you know it's called standard of care you know it's called standard of care can we move it forward fast enough I why can we move it forward fast enough I why can we move it forward fast enough I why do so many people have to die there are do so many people have to die there are do so many people have to die there are 55 million people dying every year 55 million people dying every year 55 million people dying every year globally and those bodies are stacking globally and those bodies are stacking globally and those bodies are stacking up and we all know those people let's up and we all know those people let's up and we all know those people let's get going so open source does that and get going so open source does that and get going so open source does that and the ACM is perfect because like writing the ACM is perfect because like writing the ACM is perfect because like writing software testing this like getting it software testing this like getting it software testing this like getting it out it's the right way right it's r it's out it's the right way right it's r it's out it's the right way right it's r it's otherwise it's just this you know what otherwise it's just this you know what otherwise it's just this you know what we're literally making new therapies for we're literally making new therapies for we're literally making new therapies for the fraction of the top 1% that can

the fraction of the top 1% that can the fraction of the top 1% that can afford a million dollar therapy afford a million dollar therapy afford a million dollar therapy it's well I mentioned my dad and his TI it's well I mentioned my dad and his TI it's well I mentioned my dad and his TI we're literally waiting we either pay we're literally waiting we either pay we're literally waiting we either pay $1,799 $1,800 a month for the drug that $1,799 $1,800 a month for the drug that $1,799 $1,800 a month for the drug that he needs or we fight with Medicare and he needs or we fight with Medicare and he needs or we fight with Medicare and go back and forth and right now we're in go back and forth and right now we're in go back and forth and right now we're in the middle of going back and forth and the middle of going back and forth and the middle of going back and forth and every day is another day that we're every day is another day that we're every day is another day that we're wasting time wasting time wasting time or we move yeah exactly we move or we move yeah exactly we move or we move yeah exactly we move somewhere where we could just get somewhere where we could just get somewhere where we could just get another healthc care plan or another another healthc care plan or another another healthc care plan or another country with another healthare plan country with another healthare plan country with another healthare plan that's what I've done just to stay that's what I've done just to stay that's what I've done just to stay alive I have healthc care in other alive I have healthc care in other alive I have healthc care in other countries it's funny that you mentioned countries it's funny that you mentioned countries it's funny that you mentioned that a lot of i' I've worked at that a lot of i' I've worked at that a lot of i' I've worked at Microsoft now for 17 years I came here Microsoft now for 17 years I came here Microsoft now for 17 years I came here to do open source that's the narrative to do open source that's the narrative to do open source that's the narrative and that's what people say they know and that's what people say they know and that's what people say they know that I came to Microsoft 17 years ago to that I came to Microsoft 17 years ago to that I came to Microsoft 17 years ago to do open source but the part that I don't do open source but the part that I don't do open source but the part that I don't usually talk publicly about is I also usually talk publicly about is I also usually talk publicly about is I also came because we have really good came because we have really good came because we have really good Healthcare right and Microsoft was the Healthcare right and Microsoft was the Healthcare right and Microsoft was the cheapest place for me to get the insulin cheapest place for me to get the insulin cheapest place for me to get the insulin I need the the insulin pumps and the I need the the insulin pumps and the I need the the insulin pumps and the medication that I need it had a at the medication that I need it had a at the medication that I need it had a at the time it had a Cadillac level healthc time it had a Cadillac level healthc time it had a Cadillac level healthc care plan and that tying Health Care to care plan and that tying Health Care to care plan and that tying Health Care to employment is employment is employment is insanity right I wasn't after my brain insanity right I wasn't after my brain insanity right I wasn't after my brain tumor I wasn't going to found my first tumor I wasn't going to found my first tumor I wasn't going to found my first startup I had dropped out of my PhD in startup I had dropped out of my PhD in startup I had dropped out of my PhD in physics I was living in a wheelchair physics I was living in a wheelchair physics I was living in a wheelchair sleeping 20 hours a day super sick um I sleeping 20 hours a day super sick um I sleeping 20 hours a day super sick um I got the surgery finished my PhD was got the surgery finished my PhD was got the surgery finished my PhD was going to DARPA gave us $4 million I said going to DARPA gave us $4 million I said going to DARPA gave us $4 million I said I can't do it I need really good health I can't do it I need really good health I can't do it I need really good health insurance and you know what my insurance and you know what my insurance and you know what my co-founder said you seem to know a lot co-founder said you seem to know a lot co-founder said you seem to know a lot about health insurance why don't you about health insurance why don't you about health insurance why don't you figure that one out then I'm like oh

figure that one out then I'm like oh figure that one out then I'm like oh yeah I can do a startup it doesn't have yeah I can do a startup it doesn't have yeah I can do a startup it doesn't have to be risky so everybody in all of my to be risky so everybody in all of my to be risky so everybody in all of my startups and their families get really startups and their families get really startups and their families get really good health care because they're taking good health care because they're taking good health care because they're taking a risk being with a startup but yeah a risk being with a startup but yeah a risk being with a startup but yeah American system has this and other American system has this and other American system has this and other systems have you know drugs I take in systems have you know drugs I take in systems have you know drugs I take in other countries I literally have to get other countries I literally have to get other countries I literally have to get a script from the US and go with a bag a script from the US and go with a bag a script from the US and go with a bag of money to where it's made and um get of money to where it's made and um get of money to where it's made and um get the drug that way because it's illegal the drug that way because it's illegal the drug that way because it's illegal for adults fine for children something for adults fine for children something for adults fine for children something like like human growth hormone for like like human growth hormone for like like human growth hormone for example I love that open source is at example I love that open source is at example I love that open source is at the heart of this though that it's about the heart of this though that it's about the heart of this though that it's about availability be yeah so yeah it it seems availability be yeah so yeah it it seems availability be yeah so yeah it it seems like it has to be because it's a scale like it has to be because it's a scale like it has to be because it's a scale thing because if we get the as we get thing because if we get the as we get thing because if we get the as we get the the the approvals we want the costs to be approvals we want the costs to be approvals we want the costs to be affordable to change the outcomes like affordable to change the outcomes like affordable to change the outcomes like why is it novel for a health care why is it novel for a health care why is it novel for a health care company its success to be attached company its success to be attached company its success to be attached to helping um people with dis more to helping um people with dis more to helping um people with dis more people with diseases rather than less people with diseases rather than less people with diseases rather than less like the billionaires that funded me a like the billionaires that funded me a like the billionaires that funded me a lot of them would say go for the single lot of them would say go for the single lot of them would say go for the single rare disease first and that gets you and rare disease first and that gets you and rare disease first and that gets you and maybe it's not a million dollars but maybe it's not a million dollars but maybe it's not a million dollars but it's more than $100,000 for the it's more than $100,000 for the it's more than $100,000 for the treatment then treatment then treatment then and it's um you know the and it's um you know the and it's um you know the bankruptcies from healthc care are bankruptcies from healthc care are bankruptcies from healthc care are staggering um across the country it's staggering um across the country it's staggering um across the country it's not just not paying their credit card not just not paying their credit card not just not paying their credit card loans or having OB aado toast it like loans or having OB aado toast it like loans or having OB aado toast it like literally is the bankruptcies are cost literally is the bankruptcies are cost literally is the bankruptcies are cost yeah it's so staggering that when I talk yeah it's so staggering that when I talk yeah it's so staggering that when I talk to people in other countries they don't to people in other countries they don't to people in other countries they don't believe it like you know that bank the believe it like you know that bank the believe it like you know that bank the number one source of bankruptcy in the

number one source of bankruptcy in the number one source of bankruptcy in the united states is medical bills and united states is medical bills and united states is medical bills and they're like no surely like no no fully they're like no surely like no no fully they're like no surely like no no fully organized you know first first world organized you know first first world organized you know first first world country would ever allow their people to country would ever allow their people to country would ever allow their people to die out of medical debt I mean and go die out of medical debt I mean and go die out of medical debt I mean and go bankrupt lose their homes is insane yeah bankrupt lose their homes is insane yeah bankrupt lose their homes is insane yeah and it's the reality and so with open and it's the reality and so with open and it's the reality and so with open source we can get more data so we're source we can get more data so we're source we can get more data so we're asking everybody to share the safety asking everybody to share the safety asking everybody to share the safety data because don't we want it to be safe data because don't we want it to be safe data because don't we want it to be safe shouldn't that be open if somebody dies shouldn't that be open if somebody dies shouldn't that be open if somebody dies from a Tylenol every day we don't hear from a Tylenol every day we don't hear from a Tylenol every day we don't hear about it because Tylenol is not 100% about it because Tylenol is not 100% about it because Tylenol is not 100% safe so share that so that a regulator safe so share that so that a regulator safe so share that so that a regulator has that information all the safety has that information all the safety has that information all the safety stuff but also a doctor and patient have stuff but also a doctor and patient have stuff but also a doctor and patient have the details of it and the advocacy da the details of it and the advocacy da the details of it and the advocacy da data gets shared there is like we data gets shared there is like we data gets shared there is like we there'll be a group that just shares all there'll be a group that just shares all there'll be a group that just shares all their advocacy data because we have this their advocacy data because we have this their advocacy data because we have this other Major Tool over time is really other Major Tool over time is really other Major Tool over time is really hard to miss AI could it do more with hard to miss AI could it do more with hard to miss AI could it do more with more data data understand more about more data data understand more about more data data understand more about disease States treatments Etc sure um if disease States treatments Etc sure um if disease States treatments Etc sure um if we um create that structure there's a we um create that structure there's a we um create that structure there's a there's a beneficial structure for there's a beneficial structure for there's a beneficial structure for everybody in this I'm just surprised I everybody in this I'm just surprised I everybody in this I'm just surprised I can't I can't understand why people are can't I can't understand why people are can't I can't understand why people are getting stuck we've come upon this getting stuck we've come upon this getting stuck we've come upon this general purpose thing and we stand on general purpose thing and we stand on general purpose thing and we stand on the shoulder of these these millions the shoulder of these these millions the shoulder of these these millions papers again we've pushed it forward papers again we've pushed it forward papers again we've pushed it forward with this harmonic stuff and blood flow with this harmonic stuff and blood flow with this harmonic stuff and blood flow we've got really great technology we've got really great technology we've got really great technology um that we've opened to everybody but a um that we've opened to everybody but a um that we've opened to everybody but a lot of people have really great lot of people have really great lot of people have really great technology in healthcare and it just technology in healthcare and it just technology in healthcare and it just doesn't get I mean the stuff I've seen doesn't get I mean the stuff I've seen doesn't get I mean the stuff I've seen in in measuring glucose is ex there's a

in in measuring glucose is ex there's a in in measuring glucose is ex there's a bunch of different approaches it's very bunch of different approaches it's very bunch of different approaches it's very I'm I'm very excited about some of the I'm I'm very excited about some of the I'm I'm very excited about some of the polarization approaches because with polarization approaches because with polarization approaches because with sugar the light rotates you know you can sugar the light rotates you know you can sugar the light rotates you know you can the I think it's funny I think of uh the the I think it's funny I think of uh the the I think it's funny I think of uh the polarization rotation around glucose and polarization rotation around glucose and polarization rotation around glucose and light the same way I think about e in light the same way I think about e in light the same way I think about e in displays and how e in displays rotate displays and how e in displays rotate displays and how e in displays rotate the ink to turn black or to the ink to turn black or to the ink to turn black or to sure I remember there so many different sure I remember there so many different sure I remember there so many different approaches and I think people run out of approaches and I think people run out of approaches and I think people run out of gas they can get funded for their PHD or gas they can get funded for their PHD or gas they can get funded for their PHD or early research but then they it's the early research but then they it's the early research but then they it's the companies that that need to do those so companies that that need to do those so companies that that need to do those so we can take on part of that um others we can take on part of that um others we can take on part of that um others can take on part of that we're we're you can take on part of that we're we're you can take on part of that we're we're you know the Partnerships seem to be know the Partnerships seem to be know the Partnerships seem to be evolving I was talking to the NIH they evolving I was talking to the NIH they evolving I was talking to the NIH they went a little blank BL you know the US went a little blank BL you know the US went a little blank BL you know the US government is government is government is um what did you say before for yeah um um what did you say before for yeah um um what did you say before for yeah um it's in some um major transition for it's in some um major transition for it's in some um major transition for sure that's nicest way I can put it um sure that's nicest way I can put it um sure that's nicest way I can put it um and and and so but people are still dying and um so but people are still dying and um so but people are still dying and um what can we do to save them and how do what can we do to save them and how do what can we do to save them and how do we better engage with the open source we better engage with the open source we better engage with the open source Community I think we need the hardware Community I think we need the hardware Community I think we need the hardware out for them so that's coming out next out for them so that's coming out next out for them so that's coming out next quarter but um and we need to seed some quarter but um and we need to seed some quarter but um and we need to seed some hacker spaces or some labs and so forth hacker spaces or some labs and so forth hacker spaces or some labs and so forth to make sure people have access to to do to make sure people have access to to do to make sure people have access to to do things oh yeah I would love to help with things oh yeah I would love to help with things oh yeah I would love to help with that if I can work with you and get that if I can work with you and get that if I can work with you and get Microsoft to give you office space or we Microsoft to give you office space or we Microsoft to give you office space or we have these things called reactors that have these things called reactors that have these things called reactors that you can have in different cities where you can have in different cities where you can have in different cities where you can get people together and and hack you can get people together and and hack you can get people together and and hack as a as a collective that would be super

as a as a collective that would be super as a as a collective that would be super fun that would be great there that' be fun that would be great there that' be fun that would be great there that' be fantastic there is this issue um it's fantastic there is this issue um it's fantastic there is this issue um it's it's um all it's um all it's um all ultrasound after 1995 is considered ultrasound after 1995 is considered ultrasound after 1995 is considered Class 2 after the toothbrushes we all Class 2 after the toothbrushes we all Class 2 after the toothbrushes we all use were approved and the beauty use were approved and the beauty use were approved and the beauty treatments for getting rid of wring hles treatments for getting rid of wring hles treatments for getting rid of wring hles so so so as a result to use it on people there's as a result to use it on people there's as a result to use it on people there's some some some rules We Like rules it's okay but they rules We Like rules it's okay but they rules We Like rules it's okay but they have to be followed you biohacking is have to be followed you biohacking is have to be followed you biohacking is legal you just have to follow the local legal you just have to follow the local legal you just have to follow the local local local rules on it but but if if local local rules on it but but if if local local rules on it but but if if there's the with that construct um even there's the with that construct um even there's the with that construct um even doing it on on anything with a backbone doing it on on anything with a backbone doing it on on anything with a backbone is illegal that's why you'll find in is illegal that's why you'll find in is illegal that's why you'll find in labs in Boston they often use lobsters labs in Boston they often use lobsters labs in Boston they often use lobsters because they don't have a backbone no because they don't have a backbone no because they don't have a backbone no offense we've got crabs on the west offense we've got crabs on the west offense we've got crabs on the west Coast so there's Coast so there's Coast so there's things I wish I but no there's fast ways things I wish I but no there's fast ways things I wish I but no there's fast ways to do it and and there's irbs like to do it and and there's irbs like to do it and and there's irbs like there's um irbs are they're called there's um irbs are they're called there's um irbs are they're called they're the ethics review panel to make they're the ethics review panel to make they're the ethics review panel to make sure anything you're doing with this is sure anything you're doing with this is sure anything you're doing with this is checked out it's going to be safe share checked out it's going to be safe share checked out it's going to be safe share the results it's all very reasonable and the results it's all very reasonable and the results it's all very reasonable and you know even to putting together what you know even to putting together what you know even to putting together what we're starting to do there's different we're starting to do there's different we're starting to do there's different Pockets where you can find irbs but to Pockets where you can find irbs but to Pockets where you can find irbs but to help people create their own irbs is a help people create their own irbs is a help people create their own irbs is a whole thing as well like because we want whole thing as well like because we want whole thing as well like because we want it to be safe we want the data to be it to be safe we want the data to be it to be safe we want the data to be shared but there's there's a huge so we shared but there's there's a huge so we shared but there's there's a huge so we we really now that these are coming out we really now that these are coming out we really now that these are coming out now have to start to engage better with now have to start to engage better with now have to start to engage better with the open source community so we would the open source community so we would the open source community so we would love to try the reactors or anything

love to try the reactors or anything love to try the reactors or anything else you might suggest else you might suggest else you might suggest as yeah absolutely my team runs the open as yeah absolutely my team runs the open as yeah absolutely my team runs the open source programs office at Microsoft and source programs office at Microsoft and source programs office at Microsoft and I'd love to chat with you and of course I'd love to chat with you and of course I'd love to chat with you and of course you probably know people at MSR and I'm you probably know people at MSR and I'm you probably know people at MSR and I'm gonna have Peter Lee the head of gonna have Peter Lee the head of gonna have Peter Lee the head of Microsoft research on soon so you know Microsoft research on soon so you know Microsoft research on soon so you know Peter right lovely guy he I got to end Peter right lovely guy he I got to end Peter right lovely guy he I got to end up talking about this stuff at neker up talking about this stuff at neker up talking about this stuff at neker island and he was there too and spent it island and he was there too and spent it island and he was there too and spent it that's cool yeah it was um the speakers that's cool yeah it was um the speakers that's cool yeah it was um the speakers were on um it's called mosquito Island were on um it's called mosquito Island were on um it's called mosquito Island but the mosquitoes were gone but yes so but the mosquitoes were gone but yes so but the mosquitoes were gone but yes so I got to get to know him and his wife I got to get to know him and his wife I got to get to know him and his wife very well for absolutely so in in very well for absolutely so in in very well for absolutely so in in conclusion if we can go to open waterer conclusion if we can go to open waterer conclusion if we can go to open waterer health and we can learn about this you health and we can learn about this you health and we can learn about this you can click on open source business you can click on open source business you can click on open source business you can learn about your patent pledge you can learn about your patent pledge you can learn about your patent pledge you can learn about how you use the agpl and can learn about how you use the agpl and can learn about how you use the agpl and Creative Commons uh what is another Creative Commons uh what is another Creative Commons uh what is another recommendation and how either a hacker recommendation and how either a hacker recommendation and how either a hacker or a lay person can get involved and or a lay person can get involved and or a lay person can get involved and support the work that you're doing at support the work that you're doing at support the work that you're doing at Open Water if you want a device um reach Open Water if you want a device um reach Open Water if you want a device um reach out to us and and you don't can't afford out to us and and you don't can't afford out to us and and you don't can't afford the 10K we might be able to pull it and the 10K we might be able to pull it and the 10K we might be able to pull it and get it into a local space a reactor like get it into a local space a reactor like get it into a local space a reactor like you suggest or the whatever the hacker you suggest or the whatever the hacker you suggest or the whatever the hacker otherwise spaces so that maybe more otherwise spaces so that maybe more otherwise spaces so that maybe more people can have access to it uh there's people can have access to it uh there's people can have access to it uh there's certain like universities but then the certain like universities but then the certain like universities but then the universities sort of are already covered universities sort of are already covered universities sort of are already covered for people outside of that yeah I can for people outside of that yeah I can for people outside of that yeah I can see up on github.com openwater health see up on github.com openwater health see up on github.com openwater health you've got the neuromodulation hardware you've got the neuromodulation hardware you've got the neuromodulation hardware the focused ultrasound toolbox and

the focused ultrasound toolbox and the focused ultrasound toolbox and python the blood flow gen2 stuff like python the blood flow gen2 stuff like python the blood flow gen2 stuff like you're you're continuing to release you're you're continuing to release you're you're continuing to release everything firmware software and everything firmware software and everything firmware software and Hardware up on GitHub and we will Hardware up on GitHub and we will Hardware up on GitHub and we will forever we changed our corporate rules forever we changed our corporate rules forever we changed our corporate rules to do that Forever by the way um the to do that Forever by the way um the to do that Forever by the way um the alic buan the founder of ethereum MH alic buan the founder of ethereum MH alic buan the founder of ethereum MH wrote a $50 million non-dilutive wrote a $50 million non-dilutive wrote a $50 million non-dilutive check and and and we changed the check and and and we changed the check and and and we changed the structure to be open source forever he structure to be open source forever he structure to be open source forever he has veto Authority if we ever change has veto Authority if we ever change has veto Authority if we ever change that um he yeah it's we had lawyers I that um he yeah it's we had lawyers I that um he yeah it's we had lawyers I mean lawyering this up like how has mean lawyering this up like how has mean lawyering this up like how has everybody else gotten out of Open Source everybody else gotten out of Open Source everybody else gotten out of Open Source open AI was getting out of it at the open AI was getting out of it at the open AI was getting out of it at the time and and and so we made the best um time and and and so we made the best um time and and and so we made the best um the best Minds in the legal field put the best Minds in the legal field put the best Minds in the legal field put together the best construct they could together the best construct they could together the best construct they could for no way for us to get out of this for no way for us to get out of this for no way for us to get out of this ever to prevent you from ever unop ever to prevent you from ever unop ever to prevent you from ever unop sourcing or Clos sourcing anything sourcing or Clos sourcing anything sourcing or Clos sourcing anything that's excellent right fantastic well that's excellent right fantastic well that's excellent right fantastic well what a joy to chat with you and to learn what a joy to chat with you and to learn what a joy to chat with you and to learn about the great work that you're doing about the great work that you're doing about the great work that you're doing over there at Open Water uh thank you so over there at Open Water uh thank you so over there at Open Water uh thank you so much for spending time with us today much for spending time with us today much for spending time with us today thank you too I hope to work with you thank you too I hope to work with you thank you too I hope to work with you with the reactors and the open source in with the reactors and the open source in with the reactors and the open source in the Microsoft Community it'll be great I the Microsoft Community it'll be great I the Microsoft Community it'll be great I hope so we have been chatting with Dr hope so we have been chatting with Dr hope so we have been chatting with Dr Mary L jebson CEO and founder of Open Mary L jebson CEO and founder of Open Mary L jebson CEO and founder of Open Water this has been another episode of Water this has been another episode of Water this has been another episode of Hansel minutes in association with the Hansel minutes in association with the Hansel minutes in association with the ACM bite cast and we will see you again ACM bite cast and we will see you again ACM bite cast and we will see you again next week