Is Vibe Coding Real? with James Montemagno

Maybe you've been involved in a Maybe you've been involved in a Microsoft 365 migration, optimizing your Microsoft 365 migration, optimizing your Microsoft 365 migration, optimizing your environment, maybe prepping for environment, maybe prepping for environment, maybe prepping for co-pilot, and then you've probably heard co-pilot, and then you've probably heard co-pilot, and then you've probably heard the name Sharegate. It rarely gets the the name Sharegate. It rarely gets the the name Sharegate. It rarely gets the spotlight, but everything runs on what spotlight, but everything runs on what spotlight, but everything runs on what they build. Mergers, restructures, they build. Mergers, restructures, they build. Mergers, restructures, tenant sprawl, it figures it out as they tenant sprawl, it figures it out as they tenant sprawl, it figures it out as they handle everything from migrating data handle everything from migrating data handle everything from migrating data from tenant to tenant to making sure from tenant to tenant to making sure from tenant to tenant to making sure that AI and co-pilot is ready to be that AI and co-pilot is ready to be that AI and co-pilot is ready to be rolled out securely and responsibly. rolled out securely and responsibly. rolled out securely and responsibly. They make chaos feel like business as They make chaos feel like business as They make chaos feel like business as usual. And Sharegate, it's the sidekick usual. And Sharegate, it's the sidekick usual. And Sharegate, it's the sidekick that helps them do it. Sharegate is an that helps them do it. Sharegate is an that helps them do it. Sharegate is an out-of-the-box tool that simplifies the out-of-the-box tool that simplifies the out-of-the-box tool that simplifies the chaos that it faces. Assess, migrate, chaos that it faces. Assess, migrate, chaos that it faces. Assess, migrate, optimize. It's that simple. Now, whether optimize. It's that simple. Now, whether optimize. It's that simple. Now, whether it's tenant to tenant, Microsoft it's tenant to tenant, Microsoft it's tenant to tenant, Microsoft Exchange, Google to M365, or getting Exchange, Google to M365, or getting Exchange, Google to M365, or getting visibility on your data hygiene in order visibility on your data hygiene in order visibility on your data hygiene in order to prep for co-pilot rollouts, ShareGate to prep for co-pilot rollouts, ShareGate to prep for co-pilot rollouts, ShareGate helps it migrate quickly, cleanly, and helps it migrate quickly, cleanly, and helps it migrate quickly, cleanly, and with minimal drama. Go to sharegate.com. with minimal drama. Go to sharegate.com. with minimal drama. Go to sharegate.com. It's one tool, fast migrations and It's one tool, fast migrations and It's one tool, fast migrations and co-pilot co-pilot co-pilot [Music] [Music] [Music] ready. Hey, I'm Scott Hansselman. This ready. Hey, I'm Scott Hansselman. This ready. Hey, I'm Scott Hansselman. This is another episode of Hansel Minutes.

is another episode of Hansel Minutes. is another episode of Hansel Minutes. Today I've got my good friend James Today I've got my good friend James Today I've got my good friend James Monttoagno, podcast professional. Also Monttoagno, podcast professional. Also Monttoagno, podcast professional. Also works with me. And uh you have like a works with me. And uh you have like a works with me. And uh you have like a couple podcasts, don't you? Did you couple podcasts, don't you? Did you couple podcasts, don't you? Did you still do the Nintendo one? No, we no still do the Nintendo one? No, we no still do the Nintendo one? No, we no longer do the Nintendo one. Merge longer do the Nintendo one. Merge longer do the Nintendo one. Merge conflicts going strong uh with Frank conflicts going strong uh with Frank conflicts going strong uh with Frank Krueger and we got work podcasts and a Krueger and we got work podcasts and a Krueger and we got work podcasts and a bunch of stuff. At one point I had like bunch of stuff. At one point I had like bunch of stuff. At one point I had like 28 podcasts and there's just too many 28 podcasts and there's just too many 28 podcasts and there's just too many podcasts. Frank, you know, someone's got podcasts. Frank, you know, someone's got podcasts. Frank, you know, someone's got to put a tariff on those because uh to put a tariff on those because uh to put a tariff on those because uh there's too many guys with podcasts. there's too many guys with podcasts. there's too many guys with podcasts. It's fact and I'm and I'm the worst of It's fact and I'm and I'm the worst of It's fact and I'm and I'm the worst of them to be sure. Um just I actually them to be sure. Um just I actually them to be sure. Um just I actually should probably pay up front. Um, in should probably pay up front. Um, in should probably pay up front. Um, in fact, uh, I've got a show I'm doing with fact, uh, I've got a show I'm doing with fact, uh, I've got a show I'm doing with Mark Rinovich, and, uh, we did a Mark Rinovich, and, uh, we did a Mark Rinovich, and, uh, we did a two-part series we didn't even mean to two-part series we didn't even mean to two-part series we didn't even mean to do on on vibe coding. And what was going do on on vibe coding. And what was going do on on vibe coding. And what was going on is I, you know, I was trying to on is I, you know, I was trying to on is I, you know, I was trying to explain to him what it was going on. And explain to him what it was going on. And explain to him what it was going on. And he's like, "Yeah, we could probably vibe he's like, "Yeah, we could probably vibe he's like, "Yeah, we could probably vibe that." We ended up vibe coding a that." We ended up vibe coding a that." We ended up vibe coding a HLSL shader in the shader language of, HLSL shader in the shader language of, HLSL shader in the shader language of, you know, of games and of of 3D you know, of games and of of 3D you know, of games and of of 3D rendering. and we rendered a shader for rendering. and we rendered a shader for rendering. and we rendered a shader for uh for Windows Terminal and it was uh for Windows Terminal and it was uh for Windows Terminal and it was pretty cool. It was impressive. I don't pretty cool. It was impressive. I don't pretty cool. It was impressive. I don't think we use the latest features and all think we use the latest features and all think we use the latest features and all the different things that are available the different things that are available the different things that are available to us, but you blew my mind a couple of to us, but you blew my mind a couple of to us, but you blew my mind a couple of weeks ago and that's why I wanted to weeks ago and that's why I wanted to weeks ago and that's why I wanted to have you on the show because I've always have you on the show because I've always have you on the show because I've always vibecoded prototypes and I've vibecoded vibecoded prototypes and I've vibecoded vibecoded prototypes and I've vibecoded toys and my my my opinion and I think toys and my my my opinion and I think toys and my my my opinion and I think it's strong opinions weakly held is that it's strong opinions weakly held is that it's strong opinions weakly held is that I would not want to vibe something into I would not want to vibe something into I would not want to vibe something into production, but you did and that production, but you did and that production, but you did and that concerns me. So, what did you make and concerns me. So, what did you make and concerns me. So, what did you make and are did you become a convert? I only

are did you become a convert? I only are did you become a convert? I only vive. Uh, funny story though is actually vive. Uh, funny story though is actually vive. Uh, funny story though is actually my very first job when I was in college. my very first job when I was in college. my very first job when I was in college. I was interning at a game studio and my I was interning at a game studio and my I was interning at a game studio and my first job was developing shaders uh for first job was developing shaders uh for first job was developing shaders uh for our game Nebula. I should have had you our game Nebula. I should have had you our game Nebula. I should have had you there and you would have fixed it. And there and you would have fixed it. And there and you would have fixed it. And for people that don't know about shader for people that don't know about shader for people that don't know about shader technology, it is uh not easy. It's very technology, it is uh not easy. It's very technology, it is uh not easy. It's very mathematical, very complex and uh very mathematical, very complex and uh very mathematical, very complex and uh very hard to debug and do stuff. So, it's hard to debug and do stuff. So, it's hard to debug and do stuff. So, it's very very awesome that you're able to very very awesome that you're able to very very awesome that you're able to kind of go through that that flow. That kind of go through that that flow. That kind of go through that that flow. That being said, shaders and and that type of being said, shaders and and that type of being said, shaders and and that type of technology has been around for a long technology has been around for a long technology has been around for a long time, which I assume probably the models time, which I assume probably the models time, which I assume probably the models did fairly good. And I think yeah, I I did fairly good. And I think yeah, I I did fairly good. And I think yeah, I I wish I had I wish I had the the agent wish I had I wish I had the the agent wish I had I wish I had the the agent modes and the things back then that I do modes and the things back then that I do modes and the things back then that I do now with my knowledge that I have, but I now with my knowledge that I have, but I now with my knowledge that I have, but I have built up and I've been developing have built up and I've been developing have built up and I've been developing professionally for I'm about to be 40, professionally for I'm about to be 40, professionally for I'm about to be 40, so I guess so I guess so I guess like 20 years or so, right? So 18 17 like 20 years or so, right? So 18 17 like 20 years or so, right? So 18 17 years or so doing mobile apps for a long years or so doing mobile apps for a long years or so doing mobile apps for a long long time but not nec necessarily like long time but not nec necessarily like long time but not nec necessarily like web development. So it's kind of like web development. So it's kind of like web development. So it's kind of like not my strong suit but I'm really good not my strong suit but I'm really good not my strong suit but I'm really good at like backend services and mobile at like backend services and mobile at like backend services and mobile applications and client applications but applications and client applications but applications and client applications but in the last and I I'll be honest I in the last and I I'll be honest I in the last and I I'll be honest I really want to say 4 months 3 months uh really want to say 4 months 3 months uh really want to say 4 months 3 months uh is when it's really transformed how I is when it's really transformed how I is when it's really transformed how I develop. So maybe what you are develop. So maybe what you are develop. So maybe what you are experiencing is a lot of the ghost text, experiencing is a lot of the ghost text, experiencing is a lot of the ghost text, the asking, the editing, sort of the asking, the editing, sort of the asking, the editing, sort of reviewing like hey I am asking a reviewing like hey I am asking a reviewing like hey I am asking a question, prompting questions, going question, prompting questions, going question, prompting questions, going back and forth and yeah the

back and forth and yeah the back and forth and yeah the AI say co-pilot uh GitHub copilot inside AI say co-pilot uh GitHub copilot inside AI say co-pilot uh GitHub copilot inside of VS Code or inside of Visual Studio is of VS Code or inside of Visual Studio is of VS Code or inside of Visual Studio is giving me recommendations and I'm giving me recommendations and I'm giving me recommendations and I'm applying what it's telling me. I'm doing applying what it's telling me. I'm doing applying what it's telling me. I'm doing a lot of chunking I would call it, a lot of chunking I would call it, a lot of chunking I would call it, right? like I need this function or take right? like I need this function or take right? like I need this function or take a look at that and make it more secure. a look at that and make it more secure. a look at that and make it more secure. There's a lot of conversations but but There's a lot of conversations but but There's a lot of conversations but but define vibe coding in your mind. Well, define vibe coding in your mind. Well, define vibe coding in your mind. Well, the thing that I wanted to build and the thing that I wanted to build and the thing that I wanted to build and this is where the vibes come in and I've this is where the vibes come in and I've this is where the vibes come in and I've always been a vibe person. Me and Pierce always been a vibe person. Me and Pierce always been a vibe person. Me and Pierce Boen uh worked at Zamron for a long time Boen uh worked at Zamron for a long time Boen uh worked at Zamron for a long time and our vibes the vibes go up and down. and our vibes the vibes go up and down. and our vibes the vibes go up and down. Vi and like when you think about vibes Vi and like when you think about vibes Vi and like when you think about vibes it's like a glucose curve. It goes up it's like a glucose curve. It goes up it's like a glucose curve. It goes up and down all the time. The vibes are and down all the time. The vibes are and down all the time. The vibes are high the vibes are low. Um, I feel like high the vibes are low. Um, I feel like high the vibes are low. Um, I feel like we need to define this for people who we need to define this for people who we need to define this for people who have English as a second language. Yeah. have English as a second language. Yeah. have English as a second language. Yeah. Right. Because like the vibes, if the Right. Because like the vibes, if the Right. Because like the vibes, if the vibes are good, then you're having a vibes are good, then you're having a vibes are good, then you're having a good day and things are cool. It's like good day and things are cool. It's like good day and things are cool. It's like it's your emotional state. It's the it's your emotional state. It's the it's your emotional state. It's the atmosphere. Like, hey, James gives off atmosphere. Like, hey, James gives off atmosphere. Like, hey, James gives off good vibes today. Or, wow, this good vibes today. Or, wow, this good vibes today. Or, wow, this restaurant has bad vibes. It's just kind restaurant has bad vibes. It's just kind restaurant has bad vibes. It's just kind of an ethereal thing. It's your feeling, of an ethereal thing. It's your feeling, of an ethereal thing. It's your feeling, right? And actually, funnily enough, right? And actually, funnily enough, right? And actually, funnily enough, like when you vibe code in quotes, like when you vibe code in quotes, like when you vibe code in quotes, right? Think of it as normal right? Think of it as normal right? Think of it as normal development. I was talking to someone development. I was talking to someone development. I was talking to someone about vibe coding like what's the about vibe coding like what's the about vibe coding like what's the difference? I'm like you know when difference? I'm like you know when difference? I'm like you know when you're developing software and you're you're developing software and you're you're developing software and you're debugging a problem or you're writing debugging a problem or you're writing debugging a problem or you're writing and scaffolding code or you're creating and scaffolding code or you're creating and scaffolding code or you're creating a new class you're implementing a a a new class you're implementing a a a new class you're implementing a a method sometimes you are in a flow you method sometimes you are in a flow you method sometimes you are in a flow you are in a vibe and sometimes that is are in a vibe and sometimes that is are in a vibe and sometimes that is going really good like you when you are going really good like you when you are going really good like you when you are on a on a spree like you are on a good on a on a spree like you are on a good on a on a spree like you are on a good flow and you're coding you're jamming to

flow and you're coding you're jamming to flow and you're coding you're jamming to some music like you're just you have the some music like you're just you have the some music like you're just you have the spec in front of you you're implementing spec in front of you you're implementing spec in front of you you're implementing you're implementing everything's going you're implementing everything's going you're implementing everything's going right intellisense's popping up you're right intellisense's popping up you're right intellisense's popping up you're like yes this is good this is good and like yes this is good this is good and like yes this is good this is good and and you're debugging your app and and you're debugging your app and and you're debugging your app and everything's working like that to me is everything's working like that to me is everything's working like that to me is vibing in a different way. That is me vibing in a different way. That is me vibing in a different way. That is me vibe coding. It is me in the flow. And vibe coding. It is me in the flow. And vibe coding. It is me in the flow. And sometimes if I'm debugging a problem or sometimes if I'm debugging a problem or sometimes if I'm debugging a problem or my code is not working correctly and I'm my code is not working correctly and I'm my code is not working correctly and I'm trying to tweak the CSS for the 8,000th trying to tweak the CSS for the 8,000th trying to tweak the CSS for the 8,000th time, the vibes are a little bit lower. time, the vibes are a little bit lower. time, the vibes are a little bit lower. I'm a little bit frustrated, right? I'm I'm a little bit frustrated, right? I'm I'm a little bit frustrated, right? I'm struggling through it. So what if you struggling through it. So what if you struggling through it. So what if you apply the same concept of how we've been apply the same concept of how we've been apply the same concept of how we've been developing software to working closely developing software to working closely developing software to working closely with our AI counterparts to help us get with our AI counterparts to help us get with our AI counterparts to help us get that code completed then to me that is that code completed then to me that is that code completed then to me that is the vibe. Now the traditional vibe the vibe. Now the traditional vibe the vibe. Now the traditional vibe coding definition is forget the code. coding definition is forget the code. coding definition is forget the code. The code doesn't exist. Be one with the The code doesn't exist. Be one with the The code doesn't exist. Be one with the AI. That's not my vibe, Scott. And I AI. That's not my vibe, Scott. And I AI. That's not my vibe, Scott. And I think everybody has their own think everybody has their own think everybody has their own interpretation of vibe coding. I was interpretation of vibe coding. I was interpretation of vibe coding. I was just talking with Ashley over at GitHub. just talking with Ashley over at GitHub. just talking with Ashley over at GitHub. She like what do you think about this? She like what do you think about this? She like what do you think about this? What do you think about this? I was What do you think about this? I was What do you think about this? I was like, listen, the definition of vibe like, listen, the definition of vibe like, listen, the definition of vibe coding and just coding in general is coding and just coding in general is coding and just coding in general is going to transform and continue to going to transform and continue to going to transform and continue to evolve as all of these tools in our evolve as all of these tools in our evolve as all of these tools in our toolbox. Like you remember the first toolbox. Like you remember the first toolbox. Like you remember the first time you were in Visual Studio or some time you were in Visual Studio or some time you were in Visual Studio or some other IDE or code editor and you got other IDE or code editor and you got other IDE or code editor and you got IntelliSense for the first time, you did IntelliSense for the first time, you did IntelliSense for the first time, you did like something dot and you're like, like something dot and you're like, like something dot and you're like, "Wow, oh my god, it's like amazing."

"Wow, oh my god, it's like amazing." "Wow, oh my god, it's like amazing." Like this thing worked. It's like exact Like this thing worked. It's like exact Like this thing worked. It's like exact like then you got Intellode and it's like then you got Intellode and it's like then you got Intellode and it's like oh it's like guessing what I'm like oh it's like guessing what I'm like oh it's like guessing what I'm doing. Yeah. But but that's spicy doing. Yeah. But but that's spicy doing. Yeah. But but that's spicy autocomplete. Ah, it is. So imagine that autocomplete. Ah, it is. So imagine that autocomplete. Ah, it is. So imagine that but plus++ right and this is where I am but plus++ right and this is where I am but plus++ right and this is where I am defining what I want to accomplish and defining what I want to accomplish and defining what I want to accomplish and it just does it. The difference is that it just does it. The difference is that it just does it. The difference is that I work with it. So when I think of it as I work with it. So when I think of it as I work with it. So when I think of it as a pair programmer, not a peer but a pair a pair programmer, not a peer but a pair a pair programmer, not a peer but a pair programmer, me and you sitting here programmer, me and you sitting here programmer, me and you sitting here instead of you sitting next to me, I instead of you sitting next to me, I instead of you sitting next to me, I have GitHub co-pilot and we are working have GitHub co-pilot and we are working have GitHub co-pilot and we are working through evolving an application or through evolving an application or through evolving an application or evolving something um adding a feature, evolving something um adding a feature, evolving something um adding a feature, evolving a new concept or like restyling evolving a new concept or like restyling evolving a new concept or like restyling an app or working through a mug for an app or working through a mug for an app or working through a mug for example. So that's kind of the example. So that's kind of the example. So that's kind of the difference. I want to challenge you difference. I want to challenge you difference. I want to challenge you though because I don't want this is not though because I don't want this is not though because I don't want this is not an ad for Copilot or for Cursor or any an ad for Copilot or for Cursor or any an ad for Copilot or for Cursor or any of these different tools out there. I of these different tools out there. I of these different tools out there. I want to I want to there's a lot of them want to I want to there's a lot of them want to I want to there's a lot of them and I want to kind of challenge my my and I want to kind of challenge my my and I want to kind of challenge my my assumptions and I want to challenge assumptions and I want to challenge assumptions and I want to challenge yours as well because you know you and I yours as well because you know you and I yours as well because you know you and I are both enthusiastic people like when are both enthusiastic people like when are both enthusiastic people like when we discover a thing we spread the word we discover a thing we spread the word we discover a thing we spread the word and we're oh this is so cool. Um there's and we're oh this is so cool. Um there's and we're oh this is so cool. Um there's you know the the the uh the computer you know the the the uh the computer you know the the the uh the computer scientist and a co-founder of open AI scientist and a co-founder of open AI scientist and a co-founder of open AI Andrege Karpathy uh is the one who is Andrege Karpathy uh is the one who is Andrege Karpathy uh is the one who is generally the one who is believed to be generally the one who is believed to be generally the one who is believed to be the the one who invented or coined the the the one who invented or coined the the the one who invented or coined the term rather vibe coding which is not not term rather vibe coding which is not not term rather vibe coding which is not not an old term. This has been going on for an old term. This has been going on for an old term. This has been going on for years. This is like 6 months old. He years. This is like 6 months old. He years. This is like 6 months old. He said that the you know New York's said that the you know New York's said that the you know New York's hottest new programming language is

hottest new programming language is hottest new programming language is English. He said this in 2023 saying English. He said this in 2023 saying English. He said this in 2023 saying that at some point LLMs would get to the that at some point LLMs would get to the that at some point LLMs would get to the point where humans would not have to point where humans would not have to point where humans would not have to learn specific programming languages. learn specific programming languages. learn specific programming languages. But I've always felt like programming But I've always felt like programming But I've always felt like programming languages strength is languages strength is languages strength is specificity. Right? If you can write specificity. Right? If you can write specificity. Right? If you can write English so well that English could English so well that English could English so well that English could compile, that would be a programming compile, that would be a programming compile, that would be a programming language. But with vibe coding, if I language. But with vibe coding, if I language. But with vibe coding, if I understand correctly, you're letting understand correctly, you're letting understand correctly, you're letting some of the specificity go away. And if some of the specificity go away. And if some of the specificity go away. And if you truly vibe code something, maybe you truly vibe code something, maybe you truly vibe code something, maybe this is a a worthwhile hair for us to this is a a worthwhile hair for us to this is a a worthwhile hair for us to split. If you don't understand it all, split. If you don't understand it all, split. If you don't understand it all, it was vibed. it was vibed. it was vibed. But Simon Willis, who is a very But Simon Willis, who is a very But Simon Willis, who is a very well-known AI researcher, says if an LLM well-known AI researcher, says if an LLM well-known AI researcher, says if an LLM wrote every line of code, but you wrote every line of code, but you wrote every line of code, but you reviewed it all and you tested it all reviewed it all and you tested it all reviewed it all and you tested it all and you understood it all, that's not and you understood it all, that's not and you understood it all, that's not vibe coding. That's just a typing vibe coding. That's just a typing vibe coding. That's just a typing assistant. So where do you stand? You assistant. So where do you stand? You assistant. So where do you stand? You see the difference? I do see the see the difference? I do see the see the difference? I do see the difference. Uh the difference difference. Uh the difference difference. Uh the difference is to me somewhere in between. I would is to me somewhere in between. I would is to me somewhere in between. I would say I believe that when I'm in a vibe say I believe that when I'm in a vibe say I believe that when I'm in a vibe with the AI that I'm working with uh it with the AI that I'm working with uh it with the AI that I'm working with uh it is happening at the same time. The AI I is happening at the same time. The AI I is happening at the same time. The AI I am prompting the AI. The AI is am prompting the AI. The AI is am prompting the AI. The AI is generating code. As it is generating generating code. As it is generating generating code. As it is generating code, I am actively reviewing it. I am code, I am actively reviewing it. I am code, I am actively reviewing it. I am actively seeing how it is responding and actively seeing how it is responding and actively seeing how it is responding and telling me what it's doing. And I am telling me what it's doing. And I am telling me what it's doing. And I am working with it in real time to make working with it in real time to make working with it in real time to make modifications and I can almost like if I modifications and I can almost like if I modifications and I can almost like if I was about to write some incorrect code was about to write some incorrect code was about to write some incorrect code or create some data structure in the in

or create some data structure in the in or create some data structure in the in the correct way, I can sense what it's the correct way, I can sense what it's the correct way, I can sense what it's about to do because it's going to tell about to do because it's going to tell about to do because it's going to tell me what it's going to do and I can stop me what it's going to do and I can stop me what it's going to do and I can stop it. I can pause it. I can correct it in it. I can pause it. I can correct it in it. I can pause it. I can correct it in real time and I am flowing with the AI. real time and I am flowing with the AI. real time and I am flowing with the AI. So maybe my vibes are more of a flow and So maybe my vibes are more of a flow and So maybe my vibes are more of a flow and a jam, but to me that's how I look at a jam, but to me that's how I look at a jam, but to me that's how I look at add vibes of it because but you can do add vibes of it because but you can do add vibes of it because but you can do both. So I'm working on um there's two both. So I'm working on um there's two both. So I'm working on um there's two things. One is I have a I have a things. One is I have a I have a things. One is I have a I have a production vibe coded. I wrote 20 lines production vibe coded. I wrote 20 lines production vibe coded. I wrote 20 lines of code. I actually wrote 20 lines of of code. I actually wrote 20 lines of of code. I actually wrote 20 lines of code. I had to correct some really hard code. I had to correct some really hard code. I had to correct some really hard JSON parsing from Reddit. How many how JSON parsing from Reddit. How many how JSON parsing from Reddit. How many how many lines of code total in the entire many lines of code total in the entire many lines of code total in the entire app that you made? Uh I added um app that you made? Uh I added um app that you made? Uh I added um according to the the the PR that I sent according to the the the PR that I sent according to the the the PR that I sent David Fowler, I think it was 17,000 David Fowler, I think it was 17,000 David Fowler, I think it was 17,000 lines of code. And you wrote 20 of it. I lines of code. And you wrote 20 of it. I lines of code. And you wrote 20 of it. I wrote 20 of it. That is correct. Meaning wrote 20 of it. That is correct. Meaning wrote 20 of it. That is correct. Meaning that you needed to stop and say, "No, that you needed to stop and say, "No, that you needed to stop and say, "No, no, I'm going to drive for a while." Y no, I'm going to drive for a while." Y no, I'm going to drive for a while." Y and you you wrote that yourself. Okay. and you you wrote that yourself. Okay. and you you wrote that yourself. Okay. Yeah. This and I was very proud of that Yeah. This and I was very proud of that Yeah. This and I was very proud of that very complex JSON parsing because it was very complex JSON parsing because it was very complex JSON parsing because it was a real problem that uh it could not a real problem that uh it could not a real problem that uh it could not figure out and could not solve. So, this figure out and could not solve. So, this figure out and could not solve. So, this was a this is a sentiment analysis tool.

was a this is a sentiment analysis tool. was a this is a sentiment analysis tool. I'm I'm really trying to still I'm I'm really trying to still I'm I'm really trying to still understand how do I do something with AI understand how do I do something with AI understand how do I do something with AI as far as like integrating AI into my as far as like integrating AI into my as far as like integrating AI into my applications that's meaningful. And applications that's meaningful. And applications that's meaningful. And something we do at work all the time is something we do at work all the time is something we do at work all the time is interact on Reddit and create YouTube interact on Reddit and create YouTube interact on Reddit and create YouTube videos and there's all these comments videos and there's all these comments videos and there's all these comments and I want to do sentiment analysis. and I want to do sentiment analysis. and I want to do sentiment analysis. David Fowler wanted this. And he David Fowler wanted this. And he David Fowler wanted this. And he actually had a bunch of command line actually had a bunch of command line actually had a bunch of command line applications that would go talk to these applications that would go talk to these applications that would go talk to these different services, grab their comments different services, grab their comments different services, grab their comments and then spit it out to a text file. And and then spit it out to a text file. And and then spit it out to a text file. And I said, well, that's garbage. I'm not a I said, well, that's garbage. I'm not a I said, well, that's garbage. I'm not a command line person. I don't know what command line person. I don't know what command line person. I don't know what to do with these files. I will create to do with these files. I will create to do with these files. I will create backend services. I will create a web backend services. I will create a web backend services. I will create a web front end with blazer and I will use you front end with blazer and I will use you front end with blazer and I will use you know uh Azure AI to do sentiment know uh Azure AI to do sentiment know uh Azure AI to do sentiment analysis and add on these different analysis and add on these different analysis and add on these different services. And I took his original services. And I took his original services. And I took his original library which was very small just a few library which was very small just a few library which was very small just a few files and I refactored all the code. So files and I refactored all the code. So files and I refactored all the code. So and by I I mean I told the co-pilot to and by I I mean I told the co-pilot to and by I I mean I told the co-pilot to go do it and I told it exactly what I go do it and I told it exactly what I go do it and I told it exactly what I wanted. I had it create new projects, wanted. I had it create new projects, wanted. I had it create new projects, had it do everything for me. Then I had it do everything for me. Then I had it do everything for me. Then I added Azure function backends. Then I added Azure function backends. Then I added Azure function backends. Then I added a blazer front end and then I added a blazer front end and then I added a blazer front end and then I started figuring out how to work best started figuring out how to work best started figuring out how to work best with it and I started to create prompts with it and I started to create prompts with it and I started to create prompts to basically add new features and to basically add new features and to basically add new features and functionality. I created a spec of how functionality. I created a spec of how functionality. I created a spec of how to create something right and I worked to create something right and I worked to create something right and I worked with it and in fact I didn't write the with it and in fact I didn't write the with it and in fact I didn't write the spec. What I did is I vibed a feature spec. What I did is I vibed a feature spec. What I did is I vibed a feature and then I said go create a spec of and then I said go create a spec of and then I said go create a spec of everything that you just did so I can everything that you just did so I can everything that you just did so I can implement a new feature. So I had it implement a new feature. So I had it implement a new feature. So I had it write the spec of what it did so that write the spec of what it did so that write the spec of what it did so that way it can follow itself. right as it's

way it can follow itself. right as it's way it can follow itself. right as it's going. So all of these things to me were going. So all of these things to me were going. So all of these things to me were in the flow and of the vibes of me in the flow and of the vibes of me in the flow and of the vibes of me coding this application. So now and when coding this application. So now and when coding this application. So now and when I say this when I'm implementing this by I say this when I'm implementing this by I say this when I'm implementing this by the way you and I are on about a the way you and I are on about a the way you and I are on about a thousand calls a day. I would send a thousand calls a day. I would send a thousand calls a day. I would send a prompt, it would go do stuff. How long prompt, it would go do stuff. How long prompt, it would go do stuff. How long does it take? Because most people are does it take? Because most people are does it take? Because most people are used to seeing that demo where they type used to seeing that demo where they type used to seeing that demo where they type something and the, you know, the AI something and the, you know, the AI something and the, you know, the AI agent or the co-pilot does some ghost agent or the co-pilot does some ghost agent or the co-pilot does some ghost text like they they start typing FOR and text like they they start typing FOR and text like they they start typing FOR and then a bunch of gray appears and they then a bunch of gray appears and they then a bunch of gray appears and they either like the gray or they don't. either like the gray or they don't. either like the gray or they don't. That's one perspective. Then there's a That's one perspective. Then there's a That's one perspective. Then there's a way I use it, which is a lot of way I use it, which is a lot of way I use it, which is a lot of chatting. Basically, I use it as a I get chatting. Basically, I use it as a I get chatting. Basically, I use it as a I get out of my writer's block by talking to out of my writer's block by talking to out of my writer's block by talking to the mirror. I rubber duck. So, I'm a the mirror. I rubber duck. So, I'm a the mirror. I rubber duck. So, I'm a rubber duck. Uh Steven Tob tends to do rubber duck. Uh Steven Tob tends to do rubber duck. Uh Steven Tob tends to do ghost text. Sounds like you and Fowler ghost text. Sounds like you and Fowler ghost text. Sounds like you and Fowler are more agentbased. are more agentbased. are more agentbased. I'm Yeah. So there's like ask, edit, and I'm Yeah. So there's like ask, edit, and I'm Yeah. So there's like ask, edit, and agent. And ask is exactly what you're agent. And ask is exactly what you're agent. And ask is exactly what you're saying, rubber deck. Edit's more like I saying, rubber deck. Edit's more like I saying, rubber deck. Edit's more like I It's not going to go outside the box. It's not going to go outside the box. It's not going to go outside the box. It's like somewhere between this safety It's like somewhere between this safety It's like somewhere between this safety box. And edit is like I want you to do box. And edit is like I want you to do box. And edit is like I want you to do something. It's going to give you something. It's going to give you something. It's going to give you recommendations for you to review and recommendations for you to review and recommendations for you to review and you apply them. Agent mode is I'm going you apply them. Agent mode is I'm going you apply them. Agent mode is I'm going to just do it. Like I'm going to go I'm to just do it. Like I'm going to go I'm to just do it. Like I'm going to go I'm going to call tools. I'm going to look going to call tools. I'm going to look going to call tools. I'm going to look at the error messages. I'm going to at the error messages. I'm going to at the error messages. I'm going to install Nougat packages, npm packages.

install Nougat packages, npm packages. install Nougat packages, npm packages. I'm going to create files. I'm going I'm going to create files. I'm going I'm going to create files. I'm going just go. And here's what's fascinating just go. And here's what's fascinating just go. And here's what's fascinating about this too. When you ask how does it about this too. When you ask how does it about this too. When you ask how does it do it, how long does it take? It depends do it, how long does it take? It depends do it, how long does it take? It depends on the model. Some models, they like to on the model. Some models, they like to on the model. Some models, they like to explore. They're exploratory. Claude, explore. They're exploratory. Claude, explore. They're exploratory. Claude, super exploratory saw it. It just likes super exploratory saw it. It just likes super exploratory saw it. It just likes to take a look around. Oo, I changed to take a look around. Oo, I changed to take a look around. Oo, I changed this thing. What else can I change? What this thing. What else can I change? What this thing. What else can I change? What else can I? And it'll just do it. And else can I? And it'll just do it. And else can I? And it'll just do it. And sometimes I want it to do that, but then sometimes I want it to do that, but then sometimes I want it to do that, but then sometimes I just want you to do the sometimes I just want you to do the sometimes I just want you to do the thing. That's when I slipped to to like thing. That's when I slipped to to like thing. That's when I slipped to to like GBT41, for example. I'm just do the GBT41, for example. I'm just do the GBT41, for example. I'm just do the thing, go. Using the self-driving car thing, go. Using the self-driving car thing, go. Using the self-driving car analogy, you're it feels like maybe it's analogy, you're it feels like maybe it's analogy, you're it feels like maybe it's generational, maybe it's stylistic, generational, maybe it's stylistic, generational, maybe it's stylistic, maybe it's just experience. You're maybe it's just experience. You're maybe it's just experience. You're trusting and letting go of the the trusting and letting go of the the trusting and letting go of the the steering wheel maybe more than I would steering wheel maybe more than I would steering wheel maybe more than I would let go of the steering wheel. Got to let go of the steering wheel. Got to let go of the steering wheel. Got to pick. You know what I mean? I'm a little pick. You know what I mean? I'm a little pick. You know what I mean? I'm a little Yeah. You have a finger. I have a You Yeah. You have a finger. I have a You Yeah. You have a finger. I have a You have a finger on the steering wheel. have a finger on the steering wheel. have a finger on the steering wheel. That way the sensor knows that it's That way the sensor knows that it's That way the sensor knows that it's there. Yeah. But you know what I mean? there. Yeah. But you know what I mean? there. Yeah. But you know what I mean? like there's there's still I think like there's there's still I think like there's there's still I think there's just still fear there that it'll there's just still fear there that it'll there's just still fear there that it'll swerve at some point on my part. So swerve at some point on my part. So swerve at some point on my part. So here's the difference with code is that here's the difference with code is that here's the difference with code is that we have this magical capability of git we have this magical capability of git we have this magical capability of git and um the cool part about this is it and um the cool part about this is it and um the cool part about this is it has transformed how I commit code and has transformed how I commit code and has transformed how I commit code and how I look at code. So you're committing how I look at code. So you're committing how I look at code. So you're committing more often than I am. I am committing more often than I am. I am committing more often than I am. I am committing all the time. In fact, PICE has it. So all the time. In fact, PICE has it. So all the time. In fact, PICE has it. So his custom instructions, the rules his custom instructions, the rules his custom instructions, the rules basically Pierce Boen who uh leads Boen.

basically Pierce Boen who uh leads Boen. basically Pierce Boen who uh leads Boen. Yeah. Pybogg as I like to call him. I Yeah. Pybogg as I like to call him. I Yeah. Pybogg as I like to call him. I worked for Pyog 13 years. Our coworker, worked for Pyog 13 years. Our coworker, worked for Pyog 13 years. Our coworker, our coworker, Pierce, very good at this our coworker, Pierce, very good at this our coworker, Pierce, very good at this drive coding, by the way. Very good. So, drive coding, by the way. Very good. So, drive coding, by the way. Very good. So, he has this custom instruction that when he has this custom instruction that when he has this custom instruction that when a prompt is complete, it commits and a prompt is complete, it commits and a prompt is complete, it commits and tells you exactly what it did. So, it's tells you exactly what it did. So, it's tells you exactly what it did. So, it's always he can do that. So, he can tell always he can do that. So, he can tell always he can do that. So, he can tell the agent to commit for him every single the agent to commit for him every single the agent to commit for him every single time. Yeah, he has it. So, it does a time. Yeah, he has it. So, it does a time. Yeah, he has it. So, it does a little ding when it's done and it little ding when it's done and it little ding when it's done and it commits the code or when it's done and commits the code or when it's done and commits the code or when it's done and you can tell it exactly what to you can tell it exactly what to you can tell it exactly what to summarize in these custom instructions. summarize in these custom instructions. summarize in these custom instructions. custom instructions.mmd is a thing that custom instructions.mmd is a thing that custom instructions.mmd is a thing that a lot of people don't know about. Yeah. a lot of people don't know about. Yeah. a lot of people don't know about. Yeah. And that's really the key. So, as I've And that's really the key. So, as I've And that's really the key. So, as I've been evolving, I've been vibing. As the been evolving, I've been vibing. As the been evolving, I've been vibing. As the AI does something that I like, I update AI does something that I like, I update AI does something that I like, I update my instructions to tell it go to go do my instructions to tell it go to go do my instructions to tell it go to go do that. For example, put all my CSS in that. For example, put all my CSS in that. For example, put all my CSS in Razer.css files. If it does something I Razer.css files. If it does something I Razer.css files. If it does something I don't like doing, I tell it don't to do don't like doing, I tell it don't to do don't like doing, I tell it don't to do that. Like write tests. I say, "Please that. Like write tests. I say, "Please that. Like write tests. I say, "Please never write a test unless I tell you to never write a test unless I tell you to never write a test unless I tell you to write a test." And if you think, I even write a test." And if you think, I even write a test." And if you think, I even say this in my c. I said if you think I say this in my c. I said if you think I say this in my c. I said if you think I should write a test ask me if you should should write a test ask me if you should should write a test ask me if you should write a test test I just that's my vibe write a test test I just that's my vibe write a test test I just that's my vibe there's there's no testing also we'll go there's there's no testing also we'll go there's there's no testing also we'll go and do it. So as I'm working with it I and do it. So as I'm working with it I and do it. So as I'm working with it I am for all intents and purposes crafting am for all intents and purposes crafting am for all intents and purposes crafting and making it better over time. So now and making it better over time. So now and making it better over time. So now I'm implementing features in you know I'm implementing features in you know I'm implementing features in you know not that much time at all like 10 not that much time at all like 10 not that much time at all like 10 minutes to add a new service 20 minutes minutes to add a new service 20 minutes minutes to add a new service 20 minutes add a new service. So what I've been add a new service. So what I've been add a new service. So what I've been doing is I'm in meetings is I'm giving doing is I'm in meetings is I'm giving doing is I'm in meetings is I'm giving it prompts I'm working on stuff I let it it prompts I'm working on stuff I let it it prompts I'm working on stuff I let it go. And to your original question is how go. And to your original question is how go. And to your original question is how long does it take? depends on the model.

long does it take? depends on the model. long does it take? depends on the model. It depends on the feature. Um, but it's It depends on the feature. Um, but it's It depends on the feature. Um, but it's doing all things live, right? So, doing all things live, right? So, doing all things live, right? So, sometimes it can be 30 seconds, 10 sometimes it can be 30 seconds, 10 sometimes it can be 30 seconds, 10 seconds, sometimes it's a minute or two. seconds, sometimes it's a minute or two. seconds, sometimes it's a minute or two. Uh, I recently had it restyle the entire Uh, I recently had it restyle the entire Uh, I recently had it restyle the entire application. Oh, I said, I want modern application. Oh, I said, I want modern application. Oh, I said, I want modern rounded corners. I want drop shadows. I rounded corners. I want drop shadows. I rounded corners. I want drop shadows. I want pastel colors. I was in a very want pastel colors. I was in a very want pastel colors. I was in a very pastel mood. And, you know, that took me pastel mood. And, you know, that took me pastel mood. And, you know, that took me like 30 minutes to do. And that was me like 30 minutes to do. And that was me like 30 minutes to do. And that was me back and forth, right? That was me back back and forth, right? That was me back back and forth, right? That was me back and forth maybe 15, 20 prompts as it was and forth maybe 15, 20 prompts as it was and forth maybe 15, 20 prompts as it was going. I was like, "That doesn't look going. I was like, "That doesn't look going. I was like, "That doesn't look right. that doesn't look right. I like I right. that doesn't look right. I like I right. that doesn't look right. I like I don't write any code. I'm not a CSS don't write any code. I'm not a CSS don't write any code. I'm not a CSS styler. I go that doesn't that doesn't styler. I go that doesn't that doesn't styler. I go that doesn't that doesn't look right. Go do this. Go do this. And look right. Go do this. Go do this. And look right. Go do this. Go do this. And it's the communication aspect of it that it's the communication aspect of it that it's the communication aspect of it that I uh have enjoyed doing. And the app is I uh have enjoyed doing. And the app is I uh have enjoyed doing. And the app is running. It's a real thing. It's a real running. It's a real thing. It's a real running. It's a real thing. It's a real thing that's in in Azure, right? It's on thing that's in in Azure, right? It's on thing that's in in Azure, right? It's on the interweb, which is scary, but it the interweb, which is scary, but it the interweb, which is scary, but it works. So, if we we have to respect and works. So, if we we have to respect and works. So, if we we have to respect and understand that a lot of people don't understand that a lot of people don't understand that a lot of people don't buy this. They don't think that this is buy this. They don't think that this is buy this. They don't think that this is a good idea. They think that they don't a good idea. They think that they don't a good idea. They think that they don't believe you. Like even our own believe you. Like even our own believe you. Like even our own co-workers co-workers co-workers uh would say it's go it's garbage. It's uh would say it's go it's garbage. It's uh would say it's go it's garbage. It's awful. You know, like we're I'm not awful. You know, like we're I'm not awful. You know, like we're I'm not trying to sell anyone anything because trying to sell anyone anything because trying to sell anyone anything because there's so many options. There's free there's so many options. There's free there's so many options. There's free options. There's $7 a month options.

options. There's $7 a month options. options. There's $7 a month options. There's chatbt itself. There's co-pilot. There's chatbt itself. There's co-pilot. There's chatbt itself. There's co-pilot. There's cursor. But I'm trying to There's cursor. But I'm trying to There's cursor. But I'm trying to understand how I should think about this understand how I should think about this understand how I should think about this and what it means for early in career and what it means for early in career and what it means for early in career developers because you may you know it's developers because you may you know it's developers because you may you know it's you know you you you know what you're you know you you you know what you're you know you you you know what you're good at. You said at the beginning good at. You said at the beginning good at. You said at the beginning you're a very good mobile developer. you're a very good mobile developer. you're a very good mobile developer. You've been doing mobile dev since You've been doing mobile dev since You've been doing mobile dev since phones. I remember when mobile was still phones. I remember when mobile was still phones. I remember when mobile was still getting started and you were on Windows getting started and you were on Windows getting started and you were on Windows phones, you were on iPhones before phones, you were on iPhones before phones, you were on iPhones before anybody. You know you worked with Miguel anybody. You know you worked with Miguel anybody. You know you worked with Miguel at Zamarind. So, you were ahead of the at Zamarind. So, you were ahead of the at Zamarind. So, you were ahead of the curve on mobile. And I acknowledge that curve on mobile. And I acknowledge that curve on mobile. And I acknowledge that I'm a web person from Jump. I've been on I'm a web person from Jump. I've been on I'm a web person from Jump. I've been on the web since the web was invented. So, the web since the web was invented. So, the web since the web was invented. So, I'm trying to put it in my head. I think I'm trying to put it in my head. I think I'm trying to put it in my head. I think I would be afraid. Maybe afraid isn't I would be afraid. Maybe afraid isn't I would be afraid. Maybe afraid isn't the right word. I would be conservative the right word. I would be conservative the right word. I would be conservative if I were to vibe code a mobile app. And if I were to vibe code a mobile app. And if I were to vibe code a mobile app. And I would probably pause and explore it. I would probably pause and explore it. I would probably pause and explore it. Are you pausing and exploring the CSS or Are you pausing and exploring the CSS or Are you pausing and exploring the CSS or are you just trusting I hit F5 and it are you just trusting I hit F5 and it are you just trusting I hit F5 and it looks good so it must be fine? looks good so it must be fine? looks good so it must be fine? Uh, yes. Uh, yes and no. Uh so so let's Uh, yes. Uh, yes and no. Uh so so let's Uh, yes. Uh, yes and no. Uh so so let's take the blazer example and the take the blazer example and the take the blazer example and the function. Blazer is the web framework function. Blazer is the web framework function. Blazer is the web framework you're using. That's the the the net the you're using. That's the the the net the you're using. That's the the the net the C# um front end that I'm using. So it's C# um front end that I'm using. So it's C# um front end that I'm using. So it's got you know HTML and C and things like got you know HTML and C and things like got you know HTML and C and things like that and HTML and CSS. It's very mixed.

that and HTML and CSS. It's very mixed. that and HTML and CSS. It's very mixed. There's CSS, there's HTML, there's There's CSS, there's HTML, there's There's CSS, there's HTML, there's JavaScript. There's a lot going on. All JavaScript. There's a lot going on. All JavaScript. There's a lot going on. All the stuff all sorts of things that are the stuff all sorts of things that are the stuff all sorts of things that are in there. And I'm not traditional web in there. And I'm not traditional web in there. And I'm not traditional web developer, but I'm a backend I can do developer, but I'm a backend I can do developer, but I'm a backend I can do backend development quite a bit um as backend development quite a bit um as backend development quite a bit um as well. So in this instance, I can I can well. So in this instance, I can I can well. So in this instance, I can I can here's what I'm good at. The HTML and here's what I'm good at. The HTML and here's what I'm good at. The HTML and the C# code. Good at it. Uh what I'm not the C# code. Good at it. Uh what I'm not the C# code. Good at it. Uh what I'm not good at Bootstrap, CSS, JavaScript. Not good at Bootstrap, CSS, JavaScript. Not good at Bootstrap, CSS, JavaScript. Not my centering a div. No. Uh no. And I my centering a div. No. Uh no. And I my centering a div. No. Uh no. And I will never have to center a div ever will never have to center a div ever will never have to center a div ever again. That is for sure. So the things again. That is for sure. So the things again. That is for sure. So the things that it is generating as far as the that it is generating as far as the that it is generating as far as the code, where it puts the code, if I want code, where it puts the code, if I want code, where it puts the code, if I want interfaces, if I want classes, if I want interfaces, if I want classes, if I want interfaces, if I want classes, if I want services, if I want dependency services, if I want dependency services, if I want dependency injection, I'm in control. I'm telling injection, I'm in control. I'm telling injection, I'm in control. I'm telling it what to do and I'm reviewing that it what to do and I'm reviewing that it what to do and I'm reviewing that code and I'm looking at it and I'm code and I'm looking at it and I'm code and I'm looking at it and I'm working to morph it into what I want. working to morph it into what I want. working to morph it into what I want. The CSS, the JavaScript stuff, hands The CSS, the JavaScript stuff, hands The CSS, the JavaScript stuff, hands off. I I I will I will work with it for off. I I I will I will work with it for off. I I I will I will work with it for an hour if I have to to make that CSS an hour if I have to to make that CSS an hour if I have to to make that CSS look absolutely amazing. I will not look absolutely amazing. I will not look absolutely amazing. I will not write any CSS cuz I'm just not I'm is it write any CSS cuz I'm just not I'm is it write any CSS cuz I'm just not I'm is it amazing CSS? I don't know. It's also not amazing CSS? I don't know. It's also not amazing CSS? I don't know. It's also not something you enjoy for you. It's toil.

something you enjoy for you. It's toil. something you enjoy for you. It's toil. It's inconvenience. It is toil compared It's inconvenience. It is toil compared It's inconvenience. It is toil compared to if I'm in mobile app dev. So imagine to if I'm in mobile app dev. So imagine to if I'm in mobile app dev. So imagine I go to mobile app. I'm doing ML which I go to mobile app. I'm doing ML which I go to mobile app. I'm doing ML which is our C you know front end or maybe I'm is our C you know front end or maybe I'm is our C you know front end or maybe I'm doing swift development or something doing swift development or something doing swift development or something like that. I'm very confident in all like that. I'm very confident in all like that. I'm very confident in all aspects of that right I'm very confident aspects of that right I'm very confident aspects of that right I'm very confident in all of it. So in that instance where in all of it. So in that instance where in all of it. So in that instance where it will do extremely well and I can do it will do extremely well and I can do it will do extremely well and I can do and apply the same approach is I will and apply the same approach is I will and apply the same approach is I will most likely be reviewing a lot of the UI most likely be reviewing a lot of the UI most likely be reviewing a lot of the UI work the thing that the the users are work the thing that the the users are work the thing that the the users are seeing but when it comes to classes and seeing but when it comes to classes and seeing but when it comes to classes and view models and the services I'm just view models and the services I'm just view models and the services I'm just going to let it do its thing. I'm going going to let it do its thing. I'm going going to let it do its thing. I'm going to let it go because that's a lot of to let it go because that's a lot of to let it go because that's a lot of boilerplate code that I need to review. boilerplate code that I need to review. boilerplate code that I need to review. And it remember is if you already have a And it remember is if you already have a And it remember is if you already have a project. So if I already have a project project. So if I already have a project project. So if I already have a project or I've been working in a project and or I've been working in a project and or I've been working in a project and vibing in a project and I've been vibing in a project and I've been vibing in a project and I've been working on these best practices, it's working on these best practices, it's working on these best practices, it's going to follow my best practices. So if going to follow my best practices. So if going to follow my best practices. So if it uses a style and I've told it about it uses a style and I've told it about it uses a style and I've told it about and it knows about it, it's going to and it knows about it, it's going to and it knows about it, it's going to generate code that is similar to my mind generate code that is similar to my mind generate code that is similar to my mind that I because I I've I've taught it in that I because I I've I've taught it in that I because I I've I've taught it in a way to go do that. It has the context.

a way to go do that. It has the context. a way to go do that. It has the context. Remember context context is what's Remember context context is what's Remember context context is what's really important. So feed it the really important. So feed it the really important. So feed it the context, right? Feed it the problems. context, right? Feed it the problems. context, right? Feed it the problems. Give it the text. If you load up your Give it the text. If you load up your Give it the text. If you load up your website and it gives you an error, copy website and it gives you an error, copy website and it gives you an error, copy that, shove it in it, it will fix it. that, shove it in it, it will fix it. that, shove it in it, it will fix it. Now, on the flip side, really quick, I'm Now, on the flip side, really quick, I'm Now, on the flip side, really quick, I'm working on a React app for for this working on a React app for for this working on a React app for for this build demo that I have. I don't know build demo that I have. I don't know build demo that I have. I don't know nothing about React. Never used React a nothing about React. Never used React a nothing about React. Never used React a day in my life. I went from a blank day in my life. I went from a blank day in my life. I went from a blank folder to a fully you saw the app. I folder to a fully you saw the app. I folder to a fully you saw the app. I showed you this app, this application. I showed you this app, this application. I showed you this app, this application. I wrote zero lines of code. Didn't review wrote zero lines of code. Didn't review wrote zero lines of code. Didn't review any of the code. And it's a full, you any of the code. And it's a full, you any of the code. And it's a full, you know, prototype. That's a prototype, but know, prototype. That's a prototype, but know, prototype. That's a prototype, but I haven't I would say that was a I haven't I would say that was a I haven't I would say that was a prototype because So that that was true prototype because So that that was true prototype because So that that was true vibes. That was a definition. vibes. That was a definition. vibes. That was a definition. Are you afra I keep coming back to Simon Are you afra I keep coming back to Simon Are you afra I keep coming back to Simon Willis because I really think very Willis because I really think very Willis because I really think very highly of him. Uh that like vibing your highly of him. Uh that like vibing your highly of him. Uh that like vibing your way into a production app is risky. What way into a production app is risky. What way into a production app is risky. What would you do? Is this is this would you do? Is this is this would you do? Is this is this specificationdriven development? cuz I specificationdriven development? cuz I specificationdriven development? cuz I know that your prompts are very very know that your prompts are very very know that your prompts are very very very verbose and I I advocate for like very verbose and I I advocate for like very verbose and I I advocate for like yapping at the AI cuz I very much yapping at the AI cuz I very much yapping at the AI cuz I very much believe like more context is better.

believe like more context is better. believe like more context is better. Like you don't say, "Hey app, make me a Like you don't say, "Hey app, make me a Like you don't say, "Hey app, make me a master detail uh you know app and master detail uh you know app and master detail uh you know app and bootstrap and like think that that's bootstrap and like think that that's bootstrap and like think that that's enough." Yeah. You're going to be typing enough." Yeah. You're going to be typing enough." Yeah. You're going to be typing a lot or talking a lot to the thing. I a lot or talking a lot to the thing. I a lot or talking a lot to the thing. I very much believe that we're talking to very much believe that we're talking to very much believe that we're talking to ourselves in the mirror. You know, it's ourselves in the mirror. You know, it's ourselves in the mirror. You know, it's you think that you're working with you think that you're working with you think that you're working with someone, but really you're working with someone, but really you're working with someone, but really you're working with yourself. And by talking out loud, yourself. And by talking out loud, yourself. And by talking out loud, you're understanding what you want and you're understanding what you want and you're understanding what you want and giving it as much context as possible. giving it as much context as possible. giving it as much context as possible. And I've seen your prompts. I think the And I've seen your prompts. I think the And I've seen your prompts. I think the difference is I'm hearing that you're difference is I'm hearing that you're difference is I'm hearing that you're taking a lot of that prompt and putting taking a lot of that prompt and putting taking a lot of that prompt and putting it into that custom instructions. It it into that custom instructions. It it into that custom instructions. It must be very large. So there's maybe must be very large. So there's maybe must be very large. So there's maybe people who are unhappy are not putting people who are unhappy are not putting people who are unhappy are not putting enough into their I think it's a mix. So enough into their I think it's a mix. So enough into their I think it's a mix. So these cool custom instructions get sent these cool custom instructions get sent these cool custom instructions get sent with every call. So you kind of want to with every call. So you kind of want to with every call. So you kind of want to keep them low. You know, they're with keep them low. You know, they're with keep them low. You know, they're with every call to to co-pilot in this every call to to co-pilot in this every call to to co-pilot in this instance. It's like an include file. instance. It's like an include file. instance. It's like an include file. It's like an include file. It gets every It's like an include file. It gets every It's like an include file. It gets every single time. So you want it to be long single time. So you want it to be long single time. So you want it to be long enough but not too long. So you kind of enough but not too long. So you kind of enough but not too long. So you kind of want to get those best practices. But want to get those best practices. But want to get those best practices. But there's another instance which is called there's another instance which is called there's another instance which is called a prompt. Then a prompt is for all a prompt. Then a prompt is for all a prompt. Then a prompt is for all intents and purposes instead of putting intents and purposes instead of putting intents and purposes instead of putting the reusable prompts basically. So the reusable prompts basically. So the reusable prompts basically. So imagine you had a I want to implement a imagine you had a I want to implement a imagine you had a I want to implement a new API. It's like you might have an API new API. It's like you might have an API new API. It's like you might have an API prompt. You might have where do you save prompt. You might have where do you save prompt. You might have where do you save those? So in inside so the custom those? So in inside so the custom those? So in inside so the custom instructions are inside the GitHub instructions are inside the GitHub instructions are inside the GitHub folder and then these are inside of a folder and then these are inside of a folder and then these are inside of a prompts folder inside that folder and prompts folder inside that folder and prompts folder inside that folder and then you can say run this prompt and then you can say run this prompt and then you can say run this prompt and then you can give it so imagine you had then you can give it so imagine you had then you can give it so imagine you had one is here's how you create an API. So one is here's how you create an API. So one is here's how you create an API. So you could define as the architect here you could define as the architect here you could define as the architect here in this instance the prompt file you say

in this instance the prompt file you say in this instance the prompt file you say here is how I implement this. Now of here is how I implement this. Now of here is how I implement this. Now of course you could also have copilot just course you could also have copilot just course you could also have copilot just generate a prompt for you and how you do generate a prompt for you and how you do generate a prompt for you and how you do it. It knows your code right don't waste it. It knows your code right don't waste it. It knows your code right don't waste your keystrokes. a wise man once told your keystrokes. a wise man once told your keystrokes. a wise man once told me, "You only have so many keystrokes. me, "You only have so many keystrokes. me, "You only have so many keystrokes. Don't waste them." So, uh, so you can Don't waste them." So, uh, so you can Don't waste them." So, uh, so you can have it create the prompt file for you. have it create the prompt file for you. have it create the prompt file for you. It knows how you create it. So, imagine It knows how you create it. So, imagine It knows how you create it. So, imagine for, uh, your your your podcast, you're for, uh, your your your podcast, you're for, uh, your your your podcast, you're like, "Here's how I create an API. like, "Here's how I create an API. like, "Here's how I create an API. Here's what it looks like, and here are Here's what it looks like, and here are Here's what it looks like, and here are the the different files that I need to the the different files that I need to the the different files that I need to do." And kind of give it best practices do." And kind of give it best practices do." And kind of give it best practices around the API or a front-end component around the API or a front-end component around the API or a front-end component or a login definition or some testing or a login definition or some testing or a login definition or some testing thing. So you instead of it just saying thing. So you instead of it just saying thing. So you instead of it just saying create the test say here's a prompt on create the test say here's a prompt on create the test say here's a prompt on how I want to create the test that gives how I want to create the test that gives how I want to create the test that gives it the best practices and it will go do it the best practices and it will go do it the best practices and it will go do it. So that's how I've been doing it. So it. So that's how I've been doing it. So it. So that's how I've been doing it. So I literally have a prompt and my prompt I literally have a prompt and my prompt I literally have a prompt and my prompt actually has a decision tree which is actually has a decision tree which is actually has a decision tree which is here's how I create a service. Now this here's how I create a service. Now this here's how I create a service. Now this service can be this type or this type. service can be this type or this type. service can be this type or this type. So based on what type it is some of it So based on what type it is some of it So based on what type it is some of it you know forks at some point. So ask me you know forks at some point. So ask me you know forks at some point. So ask me these questions and define with it. And these questions and define with it. And these questions and define with it. And this is really fascinating because this is really fascinating because this is really fascinating because there's also this sort of new specd there's also this sort of new specd there's also this sort of new specd driven approach not just to feature driven approach not just to feature driven approach not just to feature development but to app development. So development but to app development. So development but to app development. So the whole idea is creating a large spec the whole idea is creating a large spec the whole idea is creating a large spec just like your product manager would do.

just like your product manager would do. just like your product manager would do. And this becomes really important when And this becomes really important when And this becomes really important when you think of how you might add new you think of how you might add new you think of how you might add new features is okay I could just go start features is okay I could just go start features is okay I could just go start writing code but let me define actually writing code but let me define actually writing code but let me define actually what I want to do. And you might already what I want to do. And you might already what I want to do. And you might already have this in Jira or in GitHub or have this in Jira or in GitHub or have this in Jira or in GitHub or somewhere else or just in a in a a text somewhere else or just in a in a a text somewhere else or just in a in a a text file like a notepad. And you might say, file like a notepad. And you might say, file like a notepad. And you might say, "Okay, well here's what I want it to do "Okay, well here's what I want it to do "Okay, well here's what I want it to do and here's how I want it to look and and here's how I want it to look and and here's how I want it to look and here's all these things. Create a here's all these things. Create a here's all these things. Create a prompt. Shove it at the prompt and prompt. Shove it at the prompt and prompt. Shove it at the prompt and here's where you want to go." And the here's where you want to go." And the here's where you want to go." And the other thing that I do too is I don't other thing that I do too is I don't other thing that I do too is I don't type to it. I talk to it. So you so I type to it. I talk to it. So you so I type to it. I talk to it. So you so I don't want to I've worked for Scott for don't want to I've worked for Scott for don't want to I've worked for Scott for for many years but one thing that he for many years but one thing that he for many years but one thing that he does is he he uses uh and in Windows the does is he he uses uh and in Windows the does is he he uses uh and in Windows the the voice uh yeah Windows H Windows the voice uh yeah Windows H Windows the voice uh yeah Windows H Windows dictation I'm I'm always yapping I don't dictation I'm I'm always yapping I don't dictation I'm I'm always yapping I don't want cuz my hands are hurting after all want cuz my hands are hurting after all want cuz my hands are hurting after all these years it's easier to just to talk these years it's easier to just to talk these years it's easier to just to talk and you said something really important and you said something really important and you said something really important which was you have this idea in your which was you have this idea in your which was you have this idea in your brain and you want to get it out so what brain and you want to get it out so what brain and you want to get it out so what I do is in VS Code I have the there's an I do is in VS Code I have the there's an I do is in VS Code I have the there's an extension for speech that puts a little extension for speech that puts a little extension for speech that puts a little microphone button I tap on it and I microphone button I tap on it and I microphone button I tap on it and I speak out in my find everything that I speak out in my find everything that I speak out in my find everything that I want until I am I am happy with and I'm want until I am I am happy with and I'm want until I am I am happy with and I'm working through this flow and I give it working through this flow and I give it working through this flow and I give it give it this huge prompt and I'm okay give it this huge prompt and I'm okay give it this huge prompt and I'm okay with big prompts because big prompts for with big prompts because big prompts for with big prompts because big prompts for big features gives it more context. So big features gives it more context. So big features gives it more context. So the more context I can give and I'm the more context I can give and I'm the more context I can give and I'm referencing files and I'm doing things referencing files and I'm doing things referencing files and I'm doing things as well. You got to give it the context.

as well. You got to give it the context. as well. You got to give it the context. So to your point earlier is like if when So to your point earlier is like if when So to your point earlier is like if when you're in the vibe you're just letting you're in the vibe you're just letting you're in the vibe you're just letting it do its thing. Well I'm somewhere in it do its thing. Well I'm somewhere in it do its thing. Well I'm somewhere in between where I'm in the vibe but I between where I'm in the vibe but I between where I'm in the vibe but I understand the codebase. I know where understand the codebase. I know where understand the codebase. I know where files are. I know where services is. So files are. I know where services is. So files are. I know where services is. So go do this, do this. And the other part go do this, do this. And the other part go do this, do this. And the other part too is you can be pretty generic. So I'm too is you can be pretty generic. So I'm too is you can be pretty generic. So I'm really bad at typing. Um almost as bad really bad at typing. Um almost as bad really bad at typing. Um almost as bad as you with our grammar when we typos as you with our grammar when we typos as you with our grammar when we typos like really terrible. Maybe that's why like really terrible. Maybe that's why like really terrible. Maybe that's why we speak to our computers now. But but we speak to our computers now. But but we speak to our computers now. But but you can tell it, oh go put it in the you can tell it, oh go put it in the you can tell it, oh go put it in the services folder and it knows. You don't services folder and it knows. You don't services folder and it knows. You don't need to give it like a special thing. It need to give it like a special thing. It need to give it like a special thing. It it can parse text, right? So it knows it can parse text, right? So it knows it can parse text, right? So it knows how to do that. And to the point that how to do that. And to the point that how to do that. And to the point that like it is good. It I was here's the like it is good. It I was here's the like it is good. It I was here's the thing is like these things are really thing is like these things are really thing is like these things are really smart. They're really good. They they've smart. They're really good. They they've smart. They're really good. They they've done this for a long time. The thing is done this for a long time. The thing is done this for a long time. The thing is really getting it to that production really getting it to that production really getting it to that production level. I think what you're saying is how level. I think what you're saying is how level. I think what you're saying is how do you m massage the code? Like when do do you m massage the code? Like when do do you m massage the code? Like when do you stop vibing and start code reviewing you stop vibing and start code reviewing you stop vibing and start code reviewing effectively? Because vibe coding could effectively? Because vibe coding could effectively? Because vibe coding could also be thought of as like going on also be thought of as like going on also be thought of as like going on Fiverr and hiring uh a young person to Fiverr and hiring uh a young person to Fiverr and hiring uh a young person to go and do this work for you. Uh and I go and do this work for you. Uh and I go and do this work for you. Uh and I want to make sure that we call out these want to make sure that we call out these want to make sure that we call out these these prompts. This.github folder and these prompts. This.github folder and these prompts. This.github folder and underneath it a prompts folder and a underneath it a prompts folder and a underneath it a prompts folder and a workflows folder. This is a convention workflows folder. This is a convention workflows folder. This is a convention that is an emerging experimental that is an emerging experimental that is an emerging experimental convention in in VS Code that you can go convention in in VS Code that you can go convention in in VS Code that you can go and make and make and make whatever.prompt MD. So, you know what whatever.prompt MD. So, you know what whatever.prompt MD. So, you know what this reminds me of? I've got a a utils this reminds me of? I've got a a utils this reminds me of? I've got a a utils folder that people know about. For the folder that people know about. For the folder that people know about. For the last 20 years, I've been talking about last 20 years, I've been talking about last 20 years, I've been talking about my tools list. I would download an my tools list. I would download an my tools list. I would download an executable. Uh I just downloaded a new

executable. Uh I just downloaded a new executable. Uh I just downloaded a new one called YEdit from Malcolm Smith. I one called YEdit from Malcolm Smith. I one called YEdit from Malcolm Smith. I throw it in my utils folder. It's in my throw it in my utils folder. It's in my throw it in my utils folder. It's in my path. It's available everywhere. And I path. It's available everywhere. And I path. It's available everywhere. And I carry these around at the command line carry these around at the command line carry these around at the command line thinking they make me more useful. I'm thinking they make me more useful. I'm thinking they make me more useful. I'm realizing as you're talking to me that realizing as you're talking to me that realizing as you're talking to me that I'm going to start carrying around my I'm going to start carrying around my I'm going to start carrying around my prompts, my bone best practices. It's prompts, my bone best practices. It's prompts, my bone best practices. It's like my dot files. Yeah. Except for my like my dot files. Yeah. Except for my like my dot files. Yeah. Except for my AI agent and maybe I'll carry around MCP AI agent and maybe I'll carry around MCP AI agent and maybe I'll carry around MCP servers and MCP utilities and they'll be servers and MCP utilities and they'll be servers and MCP utilities and they'll be available as well. As I get to a new available as well. As I get to a new available as well. As I get to a new computer, just as I set up my prompt and computer, just as I set up my prompt and computer, just as I set up my prompt and I download my one drive or my Dropbox, I download my one drive or my Dropbox, I download my one drive or my Dropbox, I'm going to do the same thing with all I'm going to do the same thing with all I'm going to do the same thing with all of my prompts, my prompt snippets. of my prompts, my prompt snippets. of my prompts, my prompt snippets. That is you've get you got you're you're That is you've get you got you're you're That is you've get you got you're you're scratching the right part of my brain scratching the right part of my brain scratching the right part of my brain right now, James. And and that's where right now, James. And and that's where right now, James. And and that's where the vibe coding evolves, right? We we the vibe coding evolves, right? We we the vibe coding evolves, right? We we start to talk about best practices as a start to talk about best practices as a start to talk about best practices as a team. Maybe it's not just you working on team. Maybe it's not just you working on team. Maybe it's not just you working on the code. What are you developing as the code. What are you developing as the code. What are you developing as your team? Not just to scaffold new your team? Not just to scaffold new your team? Not just to scaffold new projects, but how to run the project, projects, but how to run the project, projects, but how to run the project, how to do these things. The cool part how to do these things. The cool part how to do these things. The cool part here is you can tell custom instructions here is you can tell custom instructions here is you can tell custom instructions and you can tell these run runners and and you can tell these run runners and and you can tell these run runners and you can give it context of how to run you can give it context of how to run you can give it context of how to run your app, what to run the app, do this your app, what to run the app, do this your app, what to run the app, do this stuff. It can run your app for you. It stuff. It can run your app for you. It stuff. It can run your app for you. It can put things inside of many browsers, can put things inside of many browsers, can put things inside of many browsers, inside of VS Code. It can it can you can inside of VS Code. It can it can you can inside of VS Code. It can it can you can just tell it what to do and it will do just tell it what to do and it will do just tell it what to do and it will do it right. You guide it. I think some of it right. You guide it. I think some of it right. You guide it. I think some of the the problems we talked back of like the the problems we talked back of like the the problems we talked back of like how people can go down the wrong path is how people can go down the wrong path is how people can go down the wrong path is like not giving it the context, not like not giving it the context, not like not giving it the context, not looking at the tools and the tools can looking at the tools and the tools can looking at the tools and the tools can do better. The tools can do better at do better. The tools can do better at do better. The tools can do better at making it better. You know what I mean?

making it better. You know what I mean? making it better. You know what I mean? Because if you start with a blank folder Because if you start with a blank folder Because if you start with a blank folder and and that's it, it has to do a lot and and that's it, it has to do a lot and and that's it, it has to do a lot more work and it may not give you more work and it may not give you more work and it may not give you exactly what you want compared to I exactly what you want compared to I exactly what you want compared to I carry around my custom instructions. I carry around my custom instructions. I carry around my custom instructions. I carry around my prompt files of how I carry around my prompt files of how I carry around my prompt files of how I start new projects and how I want my my start new projects and how I want my my start new projects and how I want my my files to be organized, you know, and files to be organized, you know, and files to be organized, you know, and what type of development I like. And what type of development I like. And what type of development I like. And that's that's a James thing. Um, so that's that's a James thing. Um, so that's that's a James thing. Um, so those are the things that you'll those are the things that you'll those are the things that you'll continue to evolve over time um when continue to evolve over time um when continue to evolve over time um when you're developing. And these these you're developing. And these these you're developing. And these these things will continue to get better. So things will continue to get better. So things will continue to get better. So they get better even without these they get better even without these they get better even without these things, but they get even better with things, but they get even better with things, but they get even better with it. And it's all about context. It's it. And it's all about context. It's it. And it's all about context. It's really what I've learned at the end of really what I've learned at the end of really what I've learned at the end of the day. Whether that's your prompt or the day. Whether that's your prompt or the day. Whether that's your prompt or whether you put these in these whether you put these in these whether you put these in these instructions that are reusable. And to instructions that are reusable. And to instructions that are reusable. And to me, I I start and I give it a lot of me, I I start and I give it a lot of me, I I start and I give it a lot of trust. I run the applica. I'm constantly trust. I run the applica. I'm constantly trust. I run the applica. I'm constantly checking the work that it's doing. I'm checking the work that it's doing. I'm checking the work that it's doing. I'm running the application. If it has build running the application. If it has build running the application. If it has build errors, I'm telling it about the build's errors, I'm telling it about the build's errors, I'm telling it about the build's error. I'm having it fix the build error. I'm having it fix the build error. I'm having it fix the build errors. I'm having it do these things. errors. I'm having it do these things. errors. I'm having it do these things. I'm checking the work. I'm committing I'm checking the work. I'm committing I'm checking the work. I'm committing when I'm happy. Doesn't mean the feature when I'm happy. Doesn't mean the feature when I'm happy. Doesn't mean the feature is done. When I see something, so I was is done. When I see something, so I was is done. When I see something, so I was implementing a history feature. So, I implementing a history feature. So, I implementing a history feature. So, I want to be able to save a sentiment want to be able to save a sentiment want to be able to save a sentiment analysis on my feedback application and analysis on my feedback application and analysis on my feedback application and I got a history screen. It wrote I got a history screen. It wrote I got a history screen. It wrote everything and it looked terrible. It everything and it looked terrible. It everything and it looked terrible. It was just like the worst basic HTML ever.

was just like the worst basic HTML ever. was just like the worst basic HTML ever. Didn't matter. Commit it cuz it works. Didn't matter. Commit it cuz it works. Didn't matter. Commit it cuz it works. Now, at this point, I'm ready to get Now, at this point, I'm ready to get Now, at this point, I'm ready to get back into the vibes and tell it exactly back into the vibes and tell it exactly back into the vibes and tell it exactly how I want it to look, how I want it to how I want it to look, how I want it to how I want it to look, how I want it to feel, how I want the drop downs to look, feel, how I want the drop downs to look, feel, how I want the drop downs to look, how I want the shadows to look, and the how I want the shadows to look, and the how I want the shadows to look, and the additional functionality. And I iterate additional functionality. And I iterate additional functionality. And I iterate through it. I think the other part through it. I think the other part through it. I think the other part is bigger prompts are really good for is bigger prompts are really good for is bigger prompts are really good for bigger features but I also like to bigger features but I also like to bigger features but I also like to narrow things down too. How would I narrow things down too. How would I narrow things down too. How would I chunk if you will like you were saying chunk if you will like you were saying chunk if you will like you were saying yeah pie is a functionality. So instead yeah pie is a functionality. So instead yeah pie is a functionality. So instead of giving it a prompt to do multiple of giving it a prompt to do multiple of giving it a prompt to do multiple things. So when I said history I scoped things. So when I said history I scoped things. So when I said history I scoped it down. I said I want you to save it in it down. I said I want you to save it in it down. I said I want you to save it in the browser. I want this information. I the browser. I want this information. I the browser. I want this information. I want that information. I want a button want that information. I want a button want that information. I want a button here. I could have said I also want you here. I could have said I also want you here. I could have said I also want you to implement this entire spec and all to implement this entire spec and all to implement this entire spec and all these other features and it would have these other features and it would have these other features and it would have done it. But how I vibe and how I read done it. But how I vibe and how I read done it. But how I vibe and how I read code is in real time. So I think this is code is in real time. So I think this is code is in real time. So I think this is a a big switch for me which was when I a a big switch for me which was when I a a big switch for me which was when I was asking it and in the edit mode I was asking it and in the edit mode I was asking it and in the edit mode I would stop. I would be more meticulous would stop. I would be more meticulous would stop. I would be more meticulous like actually looking at what I was like actually looking at what I was like actually looking at what I was writing. When I'm in the agent mode, writing. When I'm in the agent mode, writing. When I'm in the agent mode, yeah, you'd come up for error. It's it's yeah, you'd come up for error. It's it's yeah, you'd come up for error. It's it's streaming now. I'm just I am I am diving streaming now. I'm just I am I am diving streaming now. I'm just I am I am diving deep with it. Okay. I come up from air deep with it. Okay. I come up from air deep with it. Okay. I come up from air only when I want to. So how much faster only when I want to. So how much faster only when I want to. So how much faster is this making you? And I wanted I have is this making you? And I wanted I have is this making you? And I wanted I have two questions as we get towards the end two questions as we get towards the end two questions as we get towards the end here. First, on this app that you made here. First, on this app that you made here. First, on this app that you made and I and I can attest that I saw you and I and I can attest that I saw you and I and I can attest that I saw you vibe 90% of it and it's crazy. Did it vibe 90% of it and it's crazy. Did it vibe 90% of it and it's crazy. Did it say open? It's open source. Yeah, it's say open? It's open source. Yeah, it's say open? It's open source. Yeah, it's all open source. You can see this and all open source. You can see this and all open source. You can see this and I'm sure people will go and find things I'm sure people will go and find things I'm sure people will go and find things that they would do differently or that they would do differently or that they would do differently or whatever. But do you did it make you whatever. But do you did it make you whatever. But do you did it make you twice as fast? Did it did it just or did twice as fast? Did it did it just or did twice as fast? Did it did it just or did it really

it really it really just feel different? Because people I just feel different? Because people I just feel different? Because people I don't like this whole 10x developer don't like this whole 10x developer don't like this whole 10x developer nonsense. people saying 10x 10x but you nonsense. people saying 10x 10x but you nonsense. people saying 10x 10x but you know I just is it just different or is know I just is it just different or is know I just is it just different or is it faster? It's it's different it faster? It's it's different it faster? It's it's different faster different areas where you're faster different areas where you're faster different areas where you're going to be frustrated just because going to be frustrated just because going to be frustrated just because we're also developers are developing we're also developers are developing we're also developers are developing things like right we've all written code things like right we've all written code things like right we've all written code by hand manually where we've been by hand manually where we've been by hand manually where we've been frustrated by what we wrote and how it frustrated by what we wrote and how it frustrated by what we wrote and how it performs right and how it acts you're performs right and how it acts you're performs right and how it acts you're going to run into those things and then going to run into those things and then going to run into those things and then you're going to course correct over time you're going to course correct over time you're going to course correct over time um I would not one remember my day job um I would not one remember my day job um I would not one remember my day job is not writing code eight hours a day is not writing code eight hours a day is not writing code eight hours a day five hours a day right this application five hours a day right this application five hours a day right this application two things two things two things um would not be done. It would maybe um would not be done. It would maybe um would not be done. It would maybe have a 20th like a tenth of the have a 20th like a tenth of the have a 20th like a tenth of the functionality that it has today. Um functionality that it has today. Um functionality that it has today. Um because I have a life, you know, have a because I have a life, you know, have a because I have a life, you know, have a life outside of work too and and I was life outside of work too and and I was life outside of work too and and I was vibing. So for you it's about saving vibing. So for you it's about saving vibing. So for you it's about saving time like you don't want to toil. So time like you don't want to toil. So time like you don't want to toil. So you're trying to remove toil. I want to you're trying to remove toil. I want to you're trying to remove toil. I want to remove toil. To me, I don't have a remove toil. To me, I don't have a remove toil. To me, I don't have a percentage on it, but I don't know if percentage on it, but I don't know if percentage on it, but I don't know if this app would have gotten done uh in this app would have gotten done uh in this app would have gotten done uh in the last I went from zero to being the last I went from zero to being the last I went from zero to being deployed in 3 days.

deployed in 3 days. deployed in 3 days. Like, and that's me in my spare time and Like, and that's me in my spare time and Like, and that's me in my spare time and my amazing wife and partner that allowed my amazing wife and partner that allowed my amazing wife and partner that allowed me to vibe code until 2 in the morning me to vibe code until 2 in the morning me to vibe code until 2 in the morning cuz again, the different part here is cuz again, the different part here is cuz again, the different part here is like I was enjoying aspects of it and I like I was enjoying aspects of it and I like I was enjoying aspects of it and I was like, I got to I got to I got to was like, I got to I got to I got to was like, I got to I got to I got to know you were having fun. I could tell know you were having fun. I could tell know you were having fun. I could tell you were locked in. I was I was I was you were locked in. I was I was I was you were locked in. I was I was I was locked in. The vibes were I mean the locked in. The vibes were I mean the locked in. The vibes were I mean the vibes were up and down but there was vibes were up and down but there was vibes were up and down but there was high vibes and I was doing stuff and I high vibes and I was doing stuff and I high vibes and I was doing stuff and I was implementing it and once I got even was implementing it and once I got even was implementing it and once I got even streamlined they was there. So to me it streamlined they was there. So to me it streamlined they was there. So to me it was fun. I enjoyed it. I continue to was fun. I enjoyed it. I continue to was fun. I enjoyed it. I continue to enjoy it. I continue to add new features enjoy it. I continue to add new features enjoy it. I continue to add new features that I think of. So to me it saved me that I think of. So to me it saved me that I think of. So to me it saved me from where it's at today. Uh weeks weeks from where it's at today. Uh weeks weeks from where it's at today. Uh weeks weeks weeks of development 100%. Now that weeks of development 100%. Now that weeks of development 100%. Now that being said remember I'm not like an being said remember I'm not like an being said remember I'm not like an expert in Yeah. You're a dev though of expert in Yeah. You're a dev though of expert in Yeah. You're a dev though of 20 years. And that's my next question. 20 years. And that's my next question. 20 years. And that's my next question. Do the same thing except you're 22 and Do the same thing except you're 22 and Do the same thing except you're 22 and you don't know how to code. Well, then you don't know how to code. Well, then you don't know how to code. Well, then you would ask the AI to help you code. you would ask the AI to help you code. you would ask the AI to help you code. Put it into This is the difference. Uh Put it into This is the difference. Uh Put it into This is the difference. Uh you tell the AI how you want it to work.

you tell the AI how you want it to work. you tell the AI how you want it to work. You tell it how you want to review it or You tell it how you want to review it or You tell it how you want to review it or how you want to learn. Have it describe how you want to learn. Have it describe how you want to learn. Have it describe things. Something that's very things. Something that's very things. Something that's very fascinating that I learned about AI is fascinating that I learned about AI is fascinating that I learned about AI is um and especially with co-pilot is the um and especially with co-pilot is the um and especially with co-pilot is the context window. You can create new context window. You can create new context window. You can create new chats. chats. chats. So how copilot works or any of these AI So how copilot works or any of these AI So how copilot works or any of these AI works, it has the context of the chat works, it has the context of the chat works, it has the context of the chat and all the changes that it made. I'm and all the changes that it made. I'm and all the changes that it made. I'm constantly committing and I'm constantly constantly committing and I'm constantly constantly committing and I'm constantly creating new chats, right? Just like a creating new chats, right? Just like a creating new chats, right? Just like a new email, I'm ready to give it new new email, I'm ready to give it new new email, I'm ready to give it new work, not work off existing work. It's work, not work off existing work. It's work, not work off existing work. It's the history. So it has the history the history. So it has the history the history. So it has the history context so it could continue to build context so it could continue to build context so it could continue to build and if you start working on other and if you start working on other and if you start working on other features it will switch over right so I features it will switch over right so I features it will switch over right so I think in this instance when I am a new think in this instance when I am a new think in this instance when I am a new developer to a new codebase I'm going to developer to a new codebase I'm going to developer to a new codebase I'm going to use some of those early things which is use some of those early things which is use some of those early things which is asking and editing and then when I'm asking and editing and then when I'm asking and editing and then when I'm comfortable get into agent mode but I comfortable get into agent mode but I comfortable get into agent mode but I might put it in a different context in might put it in a different context in might put it in a different context in my co-pilot instruction say hey I really my co-pilot instruction say hey I really my co-pilot instruction say hey I really want you to describe what's going I want want you to describe what's going I want want you to describe what's going I want you to ask me questions I want to review you to ask me questions I want to review you to ask me questions I want to review I want you to highlight features and it I want you to highlight features and it I want you to highlight features and it will like link to code files it will will like link to code files it will will like link to code files it will link to things If you want to use it as link to things If you want to use it as link to things If you want to use it as a tool for learning, you can just tell a tool for learning, you can just tell a tool for learning, you can just tell it to because it is telling you. One it to because it is telling you. One it to because it is telling you. One thing that's really fascinating and how thing that's really fascinating and how thing that's really fascinating and how my how your my brain is like really my how your my brain is like really my how your my brain is like really transformed when the agent mode is going transformed when the agent mode is going transformed when the agent mode is going is I am dissecting the words and what is I am dissecting the words and what is I am dissecting the words and what it's building and what it's doing in it's building and what it's doing in it's building and what it's doing in real time. It's telling you everything real time. It's telling you everything real time. It's telling you everything it's doing. It's not just doing it. It it's doing. It's not just doing it. It it's doing. It's not just doing it. It is doing it and telling you exactly what is doing it and telling you exactly what is doing it and telling you exactly what it's doing. If you're in like verbose it's doing. If you're in like verbose it's doing. If you're in like verbose logs mode, you definitely like to know logs mode, you definitely like to know logs mode, you definitely like to know what's happening. And it will tell you, what's happening. And it will tell you, what's happening. And it will tell you, it will also tell you before you do it.

it will also tell you before you do it. it will also tell you before you do it. So the question to you is like that you So the question to you is like that you So the question to you is like that you had for me was like, well, if I'm a new had for me was like, well, if I'm a new had for me was like, well, if I'm a new developer, should I just be all coding developer, should I just be all coding developer, should I just be all coding all the time? Uh, I don't know. I don't all the time? Uh, I don't know. I don't all the time? Uh, I don't know. I don't that's not my vibe. I don't think I that's not my vibe. I don't think I that's not my vibe. I don't think I think that learning data structures, think that learning data structures, think that learning data structures, learning code, understanding things are learning code, understanding things are learning code, understanding things are really good. However, as developers, really good. However, as developers, really good. However, as developers, we're going to be jumping across we're going to be jumping across we're going to be jumping across JavaScript, TypeScript, C, Swift, JavaScript, TypeScript, C, Swift, JavaScript, TypeScript, C, Swift, Cotlin, whatever. And these tools can be Cotlin, whatever. And these tools can be Cotlin, whatever. And these tools can be very helpful. Like I I would feel really very helpful. Like I I would feel really very helpful. Like I I would feel really comfortable jumping and creating a new comfortable jumping and creating a new comfortable jumping and creating a new Swift iOS app with these tools today. Swift iOS app with these tools today. Swift iOS app with these tools today. I'd feel super. Yeah, it would be Xcode I'd feel super. Yeah, it would be Xcode I'd feel super. Yeah, it would be Xcode that'll slow you down. Yeah, there you that'll slow you down. Yeah, there you that'll slow you down. Yeah, there you go. Right. I'll do it in VS Code, right? go. Right. I'll do it in VS Code, right? go. Right. I'll do it in VS Code, right? You install an extended but and it would You install an extended but and it would You install an extended but and it would be that. So, I think that I would feel be that. So, I think that I would feel be that. So, I think that I would feel very very comfortable doing it. Now, the very very comfortable doing it. Now, the very very comfortable doing it. Now, the difference would be like long-term difference would be like long-term difference would be like long-term maintenance, right? You know, hey, we maintenance, right? You know, hey, we maintenance, right? You know, hey, we created something. I created this created something. I created this created something. I created this feedback flow. What about a year from feedback flow. What about a year from feedback flow. What about a year from now? What about two years from now? now? What about two years from now? now? What about two years from now? Like, is the code maintainable? Is it Like, is the code maintainable? Is it Like, is the code maintainable? Is it this or that? The difference is what I'm this or that? The difference is what I'm this or that? The difference is what I'm doing now is I've shifted my hat a doing now is I've shifted my hat a doing now is I've shifted my hat a little bit or I'm not like feature little bit or I'm not like feature little bit or I'm not like feature complete, but now I'm in refinement. So complete, but now I'm in refinement. So complete, but now I'm in refinement. So now I'm vibing making the code more now I'm vibing making the code more now I'm vibing making the code more reusable. And what I did is I used MCP reusable. And what I did is I used MCP reusable. And what I did is I used MCP servers or model context protocols.

servers or model context protocols. servers or model context protocols. Basically tools that the AI can call Basically tools that the AI can call Basically tools that the AI can call like GitHub or Perplexity or uh context like GitHub or Perplexity or uh context like GitHub or Perplexity or uh context 7. This is a really awesome MCP server. 7. This is a really awesome MCP server. 7. This is a really awesome MCP server. So if you have libraries you're using it So if you have libraries you're using it So if you have libraries you're using it can go fetch context about that specific can go fetch context about that specific can go fetch context about that specific library. It's called context 7. Um library. It's called context 7. Um library. It's called context 7. Um because again AI is only a point in because again AI is only a point in because again AI is only a point in time. You can feed it context. So a new time. You can feed it context. So a new time. You can feed it context. So a new hot JavaScript or C# library comes out, hot JavaScript or C# library comes out, hot JavaScript or C# library comes out, it'll grab it and feed it the context. it'll grab it and feed it the context. it'll grab it and feed it the context. Well, what I did, Scott, is I went in Well, what I did, Scott, is I went in Well, what I did, Scott, is I went in and two different things. One is I asked and two different things. One is I asked and two different things. One is I asked it to do a code review. I said, "Analyze it to do a code review. I said, "Analyze it to do a code review. I said, "Analyze the entire codebase." And here's what the entire codebase." And here's what the entire codebase." And here's what I'm looking for. I'm looking for code I'm looking for. I'm looking for code I'm looking for. I'm looking for code that um can be cleaned up and it can be that um can be cleaned up and it can be that um can be cleaned up and it can be reusable. It's like not in a good state. reusable. It's like not in a good state. reusable. It's like not in a good state. Stuff that isn't adhering to best Stuff that isn't adhering to best Stuff that isn't adhering to best security practices or coding standards, security practices or coding standards, security practices or coding standards, performance improvements. go analyze the performance improvements. go analyze the performance improvements. go analyze the code and then go create from what you've code and then go create from what you've code and then go create from what you've analyzed the 10 top things that I could analyzed the 10 top things that I could analyzed the 10 top things that I could do in my application and go create the do in my application and go create the do in my application and go create the GitHub issues for me really and yeah GitHub issues for me really and yeah GitHub issues for me really and yeah just just do it it's on the it's on the just just do it it's on the it's on the just just do it it's on the it's on the the GitHub right now you can look at the the GitHub right now you can look at the the GitHub right now you can look at the issues all of those issues were created issues all of those issues were created issues all of those issues were created it has the context of your entire app it has the context of your entire app it has the context of your entire app again I don't waste keystrokes I'm not again I don't waste keystrokes I'm not again I don't waste keystrokes I'm not going to go create a GitHub issue you going to go create a GitHub issue you going to go create a GitHub issue you know what's interesting about this is know what's interesting about this is know what's interesting about this is there's a consistently you're expecting there's a consistently you're expecting there's a consistently you're expecting far more than I am oh my expectations far more than I am oh my expectations far more than I am oh my expectations are super high. They're super high and are super high. They're super high and are super high. They're super high and every single time I am not let down every single time I am not let down every single time I am not let down surprisingly. I went through I said this surprisingly. I went through I said this surprisingly. I went through I said this I gave you this uh issue. It's the top I gave you this uh issue. It's the top I gave you this uh issue. It's the top issue on there is I want to add issue on there is I want to add issue on there is I want to add authentication. Not an authentication authentication. Not an authentication authentication. Not an authentication person that's for sure but I know that I person that's for sure but I know that I person that's for sure but I know that I either want to use Entra ID or MSL or either want to use Entra ID or MSL or either want to use Entra ID or MSL or some other service provider. I told it

some other service provider. I told it some other service provider. I told it go do the research. Go figure it out. I go do the research. Go figure it out. I go do the research. Go figure it out. I have perplexity. Go do the research. Go have perplexity. Go do the research. Go have perplexity. Go do the research. Go do the thing. Go do the web search with do the thing. Go do the web search with do the thing. Go do the web search with Bing and then go create a GitHub issue. Bing and then go create a GitHub issue. Bing and then go create a GitHub issue. That's the other thing that you're That's the other thing that you're That's the other thing that you're doing. I think it's worth noting for the doing. I think it's worth noting for the doing. I think it's worth noting for the folks that are listening and kind of folks that are listening and kind of folks that are listening and kind of like getting your kind of like like getting your kind of like like getting your kind of like enthusiasm is you're not just copilot, enthusiasm is you're not just copilot, enthusiasm is you're not just copilot, you're using perplexity or you'll get an you're using perplexity or you'll get an you're using perplexity or you'll get an open AI key. Like these are all servers, open AI key. Like these are all servers, open AI key. Like these are all servers, MCP servers, right? Model context MCP servers, right? Model context MCP servers, right? Model context protocol servers that you can use as protocol servers that you can use as protocol servers that you can use as well and you can tell well and you can tell well and you can tell uh you can tell Visual Studio Code to go uh you can tell Visual Studio Code to go uh you can tell Visual Studio Code to go and and do these things because you can and and do these things because you can and and do these things because you can actually set up this MCP.json JSON go in actually set up this MCP.json JSON go in actually set up this MCP.json JSON go in there and say, "Well, I'm going to use there and say, "Well, I'm going to use there and say, "Well, I'm going to use my GitHub token. That'll let me use the my GitHub token. That'll let me use the my GitHub token. That'll let me use the GitHub tools. I'm going to use GitHub tools. I'm going to use GitHub tools. I'm going to use Perplexity, which is, you know, Honda, Perplexity, which is, you know, Honda, Perplexity, which is, you know, Honda, Toyota, whatever." Pick the one that Toyota, whatever." Pick the one that Toyota, whatever." Pick the one that makes you happy. You put in your your makes you happy. You put in your your makes you happy. You put in your your personal access token for GitHub. You personal access token for GitHub. You personal access token for GitHub. You put in your Perplexity API key, and you put in your Perplexity API key, and you put in your Perplexity API key, and you start building this collection just like start building this collection just like start building this collection just like I have my path with my list of my I have my path with my list of my I have my path with my list of my command line tools. You're doing the command line tools. You're doing the command line tools. You're doing the same thing except in 2025 or 2050, same thing except in 2025 or 2050, same thing except in 2025 or 2050, whatever year you live in, right? where whatever year you live in, right? where whatever year you live in, right? where you're collecting your collection of MCP you're collecting your collection of MCP you're collecting your collection of MCP servers which are in your path where servers which are in your path where servers which are in your path where your path is now this MCP.json that your path is now this MCP.json that your path is now this MCP.json that lives in the VSS code folder and it lives in the VSS code folder and it lives in the VSS code folder and it becomes your toolkit. So it's not a it's becomes your toolkit. So it's not a it's becomes your toolkit. So it's not a it's not a homogeneous one-sizefits-all not a homogeneous one-sizefits-all not a homogeneous one-sizefits-all thing. You're building your team. Yeah.

thing. You're building your team. Yeah. thing. You're building your team. Yeah. And and and that team is going to be And and and that team is going to be And and and that team is going to be different for every app that you're different for every app that you're different for every app that you're building and every every stage of the building and every every stage of the building and every every stage of the app as well. And I'll say I'll say one app as well. And I'll say I'll say one app as well. And I'll say I'll say one more thing here about the earlier in more thing here about the earlier in more thing here about the earlier in career is like how I I've been using career is like how I I've been using career is like how I I've been using these tools for a while. So I'd have a these tools for a while. So I'd have a these tools for a while. So I'd have a very hard time to say I'm a brand new very hard time to say I'm a brand new very hard time to say I'm a brand new coder going into VS Code for the very coder going into VS Code for the very coder going into VS Code for the very first time. Go. Right. That's the part first time. Go. Right. That's the part first time. Go. Right. That's the part setup is non-trivial for this stuff to setup is non-trivial for this stuff to setup is non-trivial for this stuff to get it t dialed in the way you want. get it t dialed in the way you want. get it t dialed in the way you want. Correct. Now one thing that's very Correct. Now one thing that's very Correct. Now one thing that's very fascinating is I evolved through the fascinating is I evolved through the fascinating is I evolved through the stages as VS Code evolved. Right. And stages as VS Code evolved. Right. And stages as VS Code evolved. Right. And the agent mode stuff evolved. So I went the agent mode stuff evolved. So I went the agent mode stuff evolved. So I went from ghost text to the ask to the edit from ghost text to the ask to the edit from ghost text to the ask to the edit to the agent and I felt that I to the agent and I felt that I to the agent and I felt that I understood what it was doing and I got understood what it was doing and I got understood what it was doing and I got better at each step to go to that. So better at each step to go to that. So better at each step to go to that. So that's how I've been doing and you can that's how I've been doing and you can that's how I've been doing and you can tell my enthusiasm. I I obviously work tell my enthusiasm. I I obviously work tell my enthusiasm. I I obviously work for Microsoft right and I'm very close for Microsoft right and I'm very close for Microsoft right and I'm very close to the VS code team like no hidden to the VS code team like no hidden to the VS code team like no hidden things no there's obviously some bias things no there's obviously some bias things no there's obviously some bias there but I'm also a real developer. I there but I'm also a real developer. I there but I'm also a real developer. I built real software not only fully with built real software not only fully with built real software not only fully with agent mode but in the past as well and I agent mode but in the past as well and I agent mode but in the past as well and I am really loving the direction it's am really loving the direction it's am really loving the direction it's going to help me not only just save time going to help me not only just save time going to help me not only just save time write code that I don't want to write write code that I don't want to write write code that I don't want to write and then put myself back in the driver's and then put myself back in the driver's and then put myself back in the driver's seat to help it generate the code how I seat to help it generate the code how I seat to help it generate the code how I want it to generate the code as if I want it to generate the code as if I want it to generate the code as if I wrote it now I'm not wasting keystrokes wrote it now I'm not wasting keystrokes wrote it now I'm not wasting keystrokes then I will work on the real problems then I will work on the real problems then I will work on the real problems I'll work on the real things yeah you I'll work on the real things yeah you I'll work on the real things yeah you want to work on the hard stuff you want want to work on the hard stuff you want want to work on the hard stuff you want to work on those 20 lines of JSON that to work on those 20 lines of JSON that to work on those 20 lines of JSON that was an interesting problem that hadn't was an interesting problem that hadn't was an interesting problem that hadn't been solved before. But Bootstrap, been solved before. But Bootstrap, been solved before. But Bootstrap, that's trivial. You don't need to waste that's trivial. You don't need to waste that's trivial. You don't need to waste time on that. Yeah. The things that I time on that. Yeah. The things that I time on that. Yeah. The things that I want to work on give me a lot of

want to work on give me a lot of want to work on give me a lot of pleasure. When I saw that JSON bug, I pleasure. When I saw that JSON bug, I pleasure. When I saw that JSON bug, I was like, and I'm going on break. I was was like, and I'm going on break. I was was like, and I'm going on break. I was like so excited. I was like, this is I like so excited. I was like, this is I like so excited. I was like, this is I was I was over the moon because it was a was I was over the moon because it was a was I was over the moon because it was a really hard problem. Me centering a div. really hard problem. Me centering a div. really hard problem. Me centering a div. I'm not going to waste time on that. I'm not going to waste time on that. I'm not going to waste time on that. Yeah. Yeah. Well, folks can check this Yeah. Yeah. Well, folks can check this Yeah. Yeah. Well, folks can check this out at out at out at github.com/jamesmtomagno. It's in the github.com/jamesmtomagno. It's in the github.com/jamesmtomagno. It's in the feedback flow folder. Uh you've got a feedback flow folder. Uh you've got a feedback flow folder. Uh you've got a bunch of stuff. You're super public in bunch of stuff. You're super public in bunch of stuff. You're super public in the way that you're doing this. You've the way that you're doing this. You've the way that you're doing this. You've got this spec driven app template which got this spec driven app template which got this spec driven app template which is super interesting. All again totally is super interesting. All again totally is super interesting. All again totally public like you're very generous with public like you're very generous with public like you're very generous with the way that you share this stuff. I'm the way that you share this stuff. I'm the way that you share this stuff. I'm still kind of exploring in there and how still kind of exploring in there and how still kind of exploring in there and how you're doing this. I think people should you're doing this. I think people should you're doing this. I think people should make pay special attention at the GitHub make pay special attention at the GitHub make pay special attention at the GitHub and the VSS code folders because they and the VSS code folders because they and the VSS code folders because they show you how you've basically customized show you how you've basically customized show you how you've basically customized this. You're not doing anything by this. You're not doing anything by this. You're not doing anything by default. You know, just like our buddy default. You know, just like our buddy default. You know, just like our buddy Abel, RI IP said, don't accept the Abel, RI IP said, don't accept the Abel, RI IP said, don't accept the defaults. You're exploring the options. defaults. You're exploring the options. defaults. You're exploring the options. A lot of these are experimental, but A lot of these are experimental, but A lot of these are experimental, but they're super fun and they're super they're super fun and they're super they're super fun and they're super interesting and I'm learning a lot from interesting and I'm learning a lot from interesting and I'm learning a lot from watching you and and learning. And I got watching you and and learning. And I got watching you and and learning. And I got to get my head beyond AI as ghost text.

to get my head beyond AI as ghost text. to get my head beyond AI as ghost text. You know what I mean? It's not spicy You know what I mean? It's not spicy You know what I mean? It's not spicy autocomplete. It's more the agent stuff autocomplete. It's more the agent stuff autocomplete. It's more the agent stuff is interesting, but also human in the is interesting, but also human in the is interesting, but also human in the loop. I'm very big strong uh opinion of loop. I'm very big strong uh opinion of loop. I'm very big strong uh opinion of strong advocate for human in the loop. I strong advocate for human in the loop. I strong advocate for human in the loop. I am not I'm always going to have a finger am not I'm always going to have a finger am not I'm always going to have a finger on the on the steering wheel and I on the on the steering wheel and I on the on the steering wheel and I appreciate that you feel the same way. appreciate that you feel the same way. appreciate that you feel the same way. You decide how you want to vibe. It's You decide how you want to vibe. It's You decide how you want to vibe. It's your vibe. Don't anyone don't let anyone your vibe. Don't anyone don't let anyone your vibe. Don't anyone don't let anyone mess with your vibe or tell you how you mess with your vibe or tell you how you mess with your vibe or tell you how you vibe. Yeah. Don't let them dictate your vibe. Yeah. Don't let them dictate your vibe. Yeah. Don't let them dictate your vibe. I think you code and you vibe code vibe. I think you code and you vibe code vibe. I think you code and you vibe code and you flow code exactly how you want and you flow code exactly how you want and you flow code exactly how you want want to. And I think that's what's been want to. And I think that's what's been want to. And I think that's what's been helpful for me because I think if I was helpful for me because I think if I was helpful for me because I think if I was stuck in that box of oh, you got to stuck in that box of oh, you got to stuck in that box of oh, you got to ignore the code and do this stuff. Yeah, ignore the code and do this stuff. Yeah, ignore the code and do this stuff. Yeah, that's a vibe, but that's not my vibe. that's a vibe, but that's not my vibe. that's a vibe, but that's not my vibe. So, I am going to be productive how I So, I am going to be productive how I So, I am going to be productive how I want to be. And I think I encourage want to be. And I think I encourage want to be. And I think I encourage everyone to do explore, try stuff out. everyone to do explore, try stuff out. everyone to do explore, try stuff out. And if you try it today, it's my last And if you try it today, it's my last And if you try it today, it's my last point I'll make. And and something works point I'll make. And and something works point I'll make. And and something works how you like it, maybe it doesn't work how you like it, maybe it doesn't work how you like it, maybe it doesn't work how you like it, try again in next week. how you like it, try again in next week. how you like it, try again in next week. I'm on Insiders, which is like nightly I'm on Insiders, which is like nightly I'm on Insiders, which is like nightly builds of VS Code. Anyone can get it. builds of VS Code. Anyone can get it. builds of VS Code. Anyone can get it. I'm getting new bits every I'm getting I'm getting new bits every I'm getting I'm getting new bits every I'm getting bits throughout the day. It's going to bits throughout the day. It's going to bits throughout the day. It's going to be changing and evolving. So what we be changing and evolving. So what we be changing and evolving. So what we talked about now, have me back in 3 talked about now, have me back in 3 talked about now, have me back in 3 months. Going to be something different.

months. Going to be something different. months. Going to be something different. There's going to be some of the same, There's going to be some of the same, There's going to be some of the same, but some of the new and things that but some of the new and things that but some of the new and things that worked are going to continue to evolve. worked are going to continue to evolve. worked are going to continue to evolve. And that's how I found about this entire And that's how I found about this entire And that's how I found about this entire thing. And it's fun. It's new. It's like thing. And it's fun. It's new. It's like thing. And it's fun. It's new. It's like new buildings going up around you all new buildings going up around you all new buildings going up around you all the time. Oh, I want to go there. Oh, the time. Oh, I want to go there. Oh, the time. Oh, I want to go there. Oh, I'm going to go to that restaurant. I'm going to go to that restaurant. I'm going to go to that restaurant. We'll try that restaurant. Oh, they got We'll try that restaurant. Oh, they got We'll try that restaurant. Oh, they got a new menu item. Oh, what's the specials a new menu item. Oh, what's the specials a new menu item. Oh, what's the specials today? That's how I'm looking at it. So, today? That's how I'm looking at it. So, today? That's how I'm looking at it. So, that mind shift for me made it less that mind shift for me made it less that mind shift for me made it less scary and more like I want to go learn scary and more like I want to go learn scary and more like I want to go learn something new. Every time I open up, I'm something new. Every time I open up, I'm something new. Every time I open up, I'm learning something new and that's what I learning something new and that's what I learning something new and that's what I want to do. Yeah, I am cautiously want to do. Yeah, I am cautiously want to do. Yeah, I am cautiously optimistic. I'm not trying to be a optimistic. I'm not trying to be a optimistic. I'm not trying to be a hater, but I definitely like I wanted I hater, but I definitely like I wanted I hater, but I definitely like I wanted I wanted to work the way I want to work. wanted to work the way I want to work. wanted to work the way I want to work. You've explained the prompts, the You've explained the prompts, the You've explained the prompts, the workflows, the way they thought, you workflows, the way they thought, you workflows, the way they thought, you know, that I I can put myself back in know, that I I can put myself back in know, that I I can put myself back in charge. You know what I mean? always. charge. You know what I mean? always. charge. You know what I mean? always. And also, you know, when it comes to uh And also, you know, when it comes to uh And also, you know, when it comes to uh text suggestions and ghost text, as we text suggestions and ghost text, as we text suggestions and ghost text, as we call the gray text, like you can decide call the gray text, like you can decide call the gray text, like you can decide where that shows up and how it shows up. where that shows up and how it shows up. where that shows up and how it shows up. And some people turn that off. Maybe And some people turn that off. Maybe And some people turn that off. Maybe turn on just nextedit suggestions, which turn on just nextedit suggestions, which turn on just nextedit suggestions, which are like more like less ghost text and are like more like less ghost text and are like more like less ghost text and more like recommendations and things more like recommendations and things more like recommendations and things like that. So, you use it to how you like that. So, you use it to how you like that. So, you use it to how you would use anything, right? How do you would use anything, right? How do you would use anything, right? How do you customize your terminal? How you customize your terminal? How you customize your terminal? How you customize your email inbox? Do you use customize your email inbox? Do you use customize your email inbox? Do you use folders? Do you not use folders? You use folders? Do you not use folders? You use folders? Do you not use folders? You use groupings? Do you not use groupings?

groupings? Do you not use groupings? groupings? Do you not use groupings? Just like any developer tool, you're in Just like any developer tool, you're in Just like any developer tool, you're in control always and you decide how you control always and you decide how you control always and you decide how you want to use it. And I think that is how want to use it. And I think that is how want to use it. And I think that is how I've been really enjoying using the I've been really enjoying using the I've been really enjoying using the tools because again, you are in control. tools because again, you are in control. tools because again, you are in control. Even though it's doing a lot of work, Even though it's doing a lot of work, Even though it's doing a lot of work, you're always in control. There's always you're always in control. There's always you're always in control. There's always a big stop button, by the way. There's a a big stop button, by the way. There's a a big stop button, by the way. There's a pause button. Do whatever you want. pause button. Do whatever you want. pause button. Do whatever you want. Yeah, that is true. Very cool. Well, Yeah, that is true. Very cool. Well, Yeah, that is true. Very cool. Well, thanks so much, James, for getting me thanks so much, James, for getting me thanks so much, James, for getting me plugged in. I'm going to go and clone plugged in. I'm going to go and clone plugged in. I'm going to go and clone this, explore it, understand how you're this, explore it, understand how you're this, explore it, understand how you're doing this. I see both you and Dave doing this. I see both you and Dave doing this. I see both you and Dave Fowler playing with this stuff and I Fowler playing with this stuff and I Fowler playing with this stuff and I appreciate your open your open mind. appreciate your open your open mind. appreciate your open your open mind. Always anytime. Anytime, Scott. This has Always anytime. Anytime, Scott. This has Always anytime. Anytime, Scott. This has been another episode of Hansel Minutes. been another episode of Hansel Minutes. been another episode of Hansel Minutes. A bit of a long episode, but a good one. A bit of a long episode, but a good one. A bit of a long episode, but a good one. And we'll see you again next week. And we'll see you again next week. And we'll see you again next week. [Music]