Reptiles | 60 Minutes Full Episodes

Australia's infamous for the variety of Australia's infamous for the variety of ways its wildlife can kill you. Deadly ways its wildlife can kill you. Deadly ways its wildlife can kill you. Deadly snakes, spiders, and jellyfish. But when snakes, spiders, and jellyfish. But when snakes, spiders, and jellyfish. But when it comes to inspiring fear, Australia's it comes to inspiring fear, Australia's it comes to inspiring fear, Australia's saltwater crocodiles are in a category saltwater crocodiles are in a category saltwater crocodiles are in a category of their own. of their own. of their own. They can grow to more than 20 ft, weigh They can grow to more than 20 ft, weigh They can grow to more than 20 ft, weigh over a ton, and have a bite force strong over a ton, and have a bite force strong over a ton, and have a bite force strong enough to crush a human skull. enough to crush a human skull. enough to crush a human skull. Salties, as Australians call the apex Salties, as Australians call the apex Salties, as Australians call the apex predators, live across swaths of the predators, live across swaths of the predators, live across swaths of the country's north. country's north. country's north. They're protected by law, and because of They're protected by law, and because of They're protected by law, and because of that, their numbers have surged in that, their numbers have surged in that, their numbers have surged in recent years, creating friction with recent years, creating friction with recent years, creating friction with another species, another species, another species, humans. >> In the tropical city of Darwin, the >> In the tropical city of Darwin, the sunsets on the beach are spectacular. sunsets on the beach are spectacular. sunsets on the beach are spectacular. Though most people stay well away from Though most people stay well away from Though most people stay well away from the water. the water. the water. Darwin's surrounded by crocodile Darwin's surrounded by crocodile Darwin's surrounded by crocodile habitat, and salties are known for being habitat, and salties are known for being habitat, and salties are known for being territorial. territorial. territorial. A quick dip in the sea would be over in A quick dip in the sea would be over in A quick dip in the sea would be over in a flash if you ran into this creature.

a flash if you ran into this creature. a flash if you ran into this creature. >> So it's just luck. >> So it's just luck. >> So it's just luck. >> Yeah, luck. >> Yeah, luck. >> Yeah, luck. >> You could go for a swim here >> You could go for a swim here >> You could go for a swim here >> I wouldn't I wouldn't go for a swim, no. >> I wouldn't I wouldn't go for a swim, no. >> I wouldn't I wouldn't go for a swim, no. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. On the shores of Darwin's idyllic On the shores of Darwin's idyllic On the shores of Darwin's idyllic harbor, crocodiles sometimes show up in harbor, crocodiles sometimes show up in harbor, crocodiles sometimes show up in backyards. backyards. backyards. Anywhere they get too close to humans, Anywhere they get too close to humans, Anywhere they get too close to humans, Tom Nichols and his team of government Tom Nichols and his team of government Tom Nichols and his team of government rangers have the job of removing them. >> One of those crocs that doesn't want to >> One of those crocs that doesn't want to open his mouth. open his mouth. open his mouth. >> They're known as problem crocodiles. >> They're known as problem crocodiles. >> They're known as problem crocodiles. But catching them is fairly easy in But catching them is fairly easy in But catching them is fairly easy in cages baited with wild boar meat. It's getting an angry salty out of a It's getting an angry salty out of a floating trap with a rope and a zip tie. floating trap with a rope and a zip tie. floating trap with a rope and a zip tie. That's an art form. Nickels told us this six-footer wasn't Nickels told us this six-footer wasn't fully grown yet, fully grown yet, fully grown yet, but could easily kill a human. but could easily kill a human. but could easily kill a human. >> Now, this size crocodile, >> Now, this size crocodile, >> Now, this size crocodile, he wouldn't kill you by biting unless he he wouldn't kill you by biting unless he he wouldn't kill you by biting unless he bit you in a certain place, but he would bit you in a certain place, but he would bit you in a certain place, but he would drown you quite easily. He'd take you drown you quite easily. He'd take you drown you quite easily. He'd take you down and down and down and under under water and then he then he'll under under water and then he then he'll under under water and then he then he'll come back up and then he'll start come back up and then he'll start come back up and then he'll start spinning around.

spinning around. spinning around. >> And that's what what they call the death >> And that's what what they call the death >> And that's what what they call the death roll. roll. roll. >> The death roll, that's correct. >> The death roll, that's correct. >> The death roll, that's correct. >> That's how a crocodile took off half of >> That's how a crocodile took off half of >> That's how a crocodile took off half of Nickels' left hand just over 20 years Nickels' left hand just over 20 years Nickels' left hand just over 20 years ago in this exact spot. ago in this exact spot. ago in this exact spot. >> With the crocodile, if he didn't spin, I >> With the crocodile, if he didn't spin, I >> With the crocodile, if he didn't spin, I would have been all right, but trouble would have been all right, but trouble would have been all right, but trouble is he spinning he spun all my hand is he spinning he spun all my hand is he spinning he spun all my hand around. around. around. >> You operate just fine with three fingers >> You operate just fine with three fingers >> You operate just fine with three fingers on your left hand. Is there anything you on your left hand. Is there anything you on your left hand. Is there anything you can't do? can't do? can't do? >> Yeah, pick my nose with my left. >> All joking aside, salties are the >> All joking aside, salties are the largest reptiles on the planet. largest reptiles on the planet. largest reptiles on the planet. Much bigger than alligators and Much bigger than alligators and Much bigger than alligators and according to some scientists, the according to some scientists, the according to some scientists, the Australian crocs are the world's most Australian crocs are the world's most Australian crocs are the world's most aggressive. But that didn't protect them from But that didn't protect them from hunters. hunters. hunters. >> The huge reptile is mastered, one of 33 >> The huge reptile is mastered, one of 33 >> The huge reptile is mastered, one of 33 captured on this exciting trip. >> By the 1970s, they were so close to >> By the 1970s, they were so close to extinction with just a few thousand left extinction with just a few thousand left extinction with just a few thousand left that Australian officials banned nearly that Australian officials banned nearly that Australian officials banned nearly all crocodile hunting.

all crocodile hunting. all crocodile hunting. Since then, the population's bounced Since then, the population's bounced Since then, the population's bounced back to over 150,000 back to over 150,000 back to over 150,000 and counting. and counting. and counting. That's a conservation success story to That's a conservation success story to That's a conservation success story to some, some, some, a menace to others. >> Crocodiles are way misunderstood. >> Crocodiles are way misunderstood. They've survived the times of the They've survived the times of the They've survived the times of the dinosaurs and that is a question of dinosaurs and that is a question of dinosaurs and that is a question of respect. respect. respect. >> They're also pretty scary. >> They're also pretty scary. >> They're also pretty scary. >> Not really. Humans are far more scary. >> Not really. Humans are far more scary. >> Not really. Humans are far more scary. Um we kill each other for a lot less, Um we kill each other for a lot less, Um we kill each other for a lot less, for money. for money. for money. And crocodiles only kill for food. >> Trevor Sullivan keeps 10 saltwater >> Trevor Sullivan keeps 10 saltwater crocodiles in his backyard crocodiles in his backyard crocodiles in his backyard behind patched-up chain-link fencing. Can I stand up in the back here? Can I stand up in the back here? Oh my god. >> Chuck. >> Chuck. Chuck. Chuck. Chuck. >> He feeds them whole chickens by hand. He >> He feeds them whole chickens by hand. He >> He feeds them whole chickens by hand. He rescued most of them from crocodile rescued most of them from crocodile rescued most of them from crocodile farms and research facilities, including farms and research facilities, including farms and research facilities, including the biggest one, Chuck, who's over 120 the biggest one, Chuck, who's over 120 the biggest one, Chuck, who's over 120 years old and missing part of his jaw.

years old and missing part of his jaw. years old and missing part of his jaw. Trevor. Trevor. Trevor. What would happen if this fence wasn't What would happen if this fence wasn't What would happen if this fence wasn't here? here? here? >> Nothing. >> Nothing. >> Nothing. >> What do you mean nothing? >> What do you mean nothing? >> What do you mean nothing? >> I I >> I I >> I I I I fed him in there. I've gone in and I I fed him in there. I've gone in and I I fed him in there. I've gone in and fed him. fed him. fed him. >> You go over the fence? >> You go over the fence? >> You go over the fence? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> With a 16-ft crocodile? >> With a 16-ft crocodile? >> With a 16-ft crocodile? >> a problem. That one is. It's all right, yeah. It's all right, yeah. It's all right, Chuck. It's all right, Chuck. It's all right, Chuck. >> Sullivan's a self-described >> Sullivan's a self-described >> Sullivan's a self-described conservationist and told us he keeps conservationist and told us he keeps conservationist and told us he keeps crocodiles to prove they can coexist crocodiles to prove they can coexist crocodiles to prove they can coexist safely with humans. safely with humans. safely with humans. >> They answer to their name. They come >> They answer to their name. They come >> They answer to their name. They come when you teach them. You can train them. when you teach them. You can train them. when you teach them. You can train them. Get them into a routine. Get them into a routine. Get them into a routine. They're not just pets, they're family. They're not just pets, they're family. They're not just pets, they're family. >> I'm sorry, they're family? >> I'm sorry, they're family? >> I'm sorry, they're family? >> They're family. >> They're family. >> They're family. >> Okay, so >> Okay, so >> Okay, so just for the sake of clarity, they don't just for the sake of clarity, they don't just for the sake of clarity, they don't see you as food? see you as food? see you as food? >> No. >> No. >> No. I bring food. I bring food. I bring food. >> You're also a big chunk of protein. >> You're also a big chunk of protein. >> You're also a big chunk of protein. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. Um Um Um dogs eat meat. They don't generally see dogs eat meat. They don't generally see dogs eat meat. They don't generally see you as food. you as food. you as food. >> Rangers are searching for a killer >> Rangers are searching for a killer >> Rangers are searching for a killer crocodile which hunted down crocodile which hunted down crocodile which hunted down >> The truth is that crocodiles do kill >> The truth is that crocodiles do kill >> The truth is that crocodiles do kill people, though we were surprised to people, though we were surprised to people, though we were surprised to learn that only around 50 deaths have learn that only around 50 deaths have learn that only around 50 deaths have been reported in Australia since hunting been reported in Australia since hunting been reported in Australia since hunting was banned half a century ago.

was banned half a century ago. was banned half a century ago. That might be because of public That might be because of public That might be because of public education campaigns warning people to education campaigns warning people to education campaigns warning people to keep a distance. keep a distance. keep a distance. Many of those who've been killed by Many of those who've been killed by Many of those who've been killed by salties misjudged where it was safe to salties misjudged where it was safe to salties misjudged where it was safe to swim or go fishing. swim or go fishing. swim or go fishing. But there's also anger in Australia that But there's also anger in Australia that But there's also anger in Australia that the law protects crocodiles instead of the law protects crocodiles instead of the law protects crocodiles instead of people. people. people. >> They die? Yeah, well, so do we at the >> They die? Yeah, well, so do we at the >> They die? Yeah, well, so do we at the end of the day. end of the day. end of the day. >> Bob Katter is a member of Australia's >> Bob Katter is a member of Australia's >> Bob Katter is a member of Australia's Parliament with a reputation as a Parliament with a reputation as a Parliament with a reputation as a combative lawmaker. combative lawmaker. combative lawmaker. >> You're going to GET A BIG BAR. You're >> You're going to GET A BIG BAR. You're >> You're going to GET A BIG BAR. You're going to get A BIG BAR. >> YOU'RE A VERY popular man in these >> YOU'RE A VERY popular man in these parts. parts. parts. >> One of Katter's most controversial >> One of Katter's most controversial >> One of Katter's most controversial positions is that he wants the crocodile positions is that he wants the crocodile positions is that he wants the crocodile hunting ban repealed. hunting ban repealed. hunting ban repealed. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. >> His electorate is about a thousand miles >> His electorate is about a thousand miles >> His electorate is about a thousand miles southeast of Darwin, much of it's southeast of Darwin, much of it's southeast of Darwin, much of it's farmland where cattle are sometimes farmland where cattle are sometimes farmland where cattle are sometimes eaten by saltie's. eaten by saltie's. eaten by saltie's. >> When you were growing up in northern >> When you were growing up in northern >> When you were growing up in northern Australia, did you used to go swimming Australia, did you used to go swimming Australia, did you used to go swimming in in the rivers here? in in the rivers here? in in the rivers here? >> Oh, absolutely. You know, >> Oh, absolutely. You know, >> Oh, absolutely. You know, every Saturday, Sunday, you'd be in the every Saturday, Sunday, you'd be in the every Saturday, Sunday, you'd be in the river.

river. river. >> Can the children do that now? Can they >> Can the children do that now? Can they >> Can the children do that now? Can they go swimming in the river? go swimming in the river? go swimming in the river? >> No way. No way you would risk your life >> No way. No way you would risk your life >> No way. No way you would risk your life if you went near any of these waterways. if you went near any of these waterways. if you went near any of these waterways. >> He told us he's tempted to risk arrest >> He told us he's tempted to risk arrest >> He told us he's tempted to risk arrest by shooting a crocodile himself. by shooting a crocodile himself. by shooting a crocodile himself. >> You think the law is evil? >> You think the law is evil? >> You think the law is evil? >> Oh, yes, absolutely. A law that puts the >> Oh, yes, absolutely. A law that puts the >> Oh, yes, absolutely. A law that puts the value of crocodile over a human being, value of crocodile over a human being, value of crocodile over a human being, that is a definition of evil. that is a definition of evil. that is a definition of evil. >> Bob Katter believes that legalizing >> Bob Katter believes that legalizing >> Bob Katter believes that legalizing crocodile hunting would make waterways crocodile hunting would make waterways crocodile hunting would make waterways safe again and turn a profit by safe again and turn a profit by safe again and turn a profit by attracting big game hunters. attracting big game hunters. attracting big game hunters. Other Australians disagree with his Other Australians disagree with his Other Australians disagree with his science and his economics. science and his economics. science and his economics. They say saltie's are worth more alive They say saltie's are worth more alive They say saltie's are worth more alive than dead. than dead. than dead. Darwin's roaring tourism trade relies in Darwin's roaring tourism trade relies in Darwin's roaring tourism trade relies in large part on crocodiles. large part on crocodiles. large part on crocodiles. >> Wow, look at that, guys. >> Wow, look at that, guys. >> Wow, look at that, guys. Great time to see crocodiles now. Great time to see crocodiles now. Great time to see crocodiles now. Beautiful. Oh, yeah. Beautiful. Oh, yeah. Beautiful. Oh, yeah. >> Just outside the city, >> Just outside the city, >> Just outside the city, you can pay for a close encounter with you can pay for a close encounter with you can pay for a close encounter with some cold-blooded killers.

>> And he'll be waiting for you to look >> And he'll be waiting for you to look away. He'll move real quick. away. He'll move real quick. away. He'll move real quick. >> Oh my god. >> Believe me, if he grabs hold of you, >> Believe me, if he grabs hold of you, that's it. You're gone. >> Humans and crocodiles have shared this >> Humans and crocodiles have shared this land for around 50,000 years. land for around 50,000 years. land for around 50,000 years. We drove to Kakadu National Park to meet We drove to Kakadu National Park to meet We drove to Kakadu National Park to meet some of Australia's indigenous people. some of Australia's indigenous people. some of Australia's indigenous people. Kakadu is bigger than Connecticut, home Kakadu is bigger than Connecticut, home Kakadu is bigger than Connecticut, home to a few hundred people and around to a few hundred people and around to a few hundred people and around 10,000 crocodiles. 10,000 crocodiles. 10,000 crocodiles. >> Yeah. Well, thank you. >> Yeah. Well, thank you. >> Yeah. Well, thank you. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Gleeson Namabulwa is an indigenous >> Gleeson Namabulwa is an indigenous >> Gleeson Namabulwa is an indigenous Australian who works as a river guide. Australian who works as a river guide. Australian who works as a river guide. >> Good place for hunting in there. >> Good place for hunting in there. >> Good place for hunting in there. >> Like other traditional owners, he's >> Like other traditional owners, he's >> Like other traditional owners, he's permitted by law to hunt crocodiles for permitted by law to hunt crocodiles for permitted by law to hunt crocodiles for food. food. food. How do you hunt it? How do you hunt it? How do you hunt it? >> Um spear. >> Um spear. >> Um spear. >> With a spear. Is it good eating? >> With a spear. Is it good eating? >> With a spear. Is it good eating? >> Yeah, that that that tastes like fish. >> Yeah, that that that tastes like fish. >> Yeah, that that that tastes like fish. >> Like fish. >> Like fish. >> Like fish. Namabulwa and his friend, Robert Namabulwa and his friend, Robert Namabulwa and his friend, Robert Namanyulk, told us indigenous Namanyulk, told us indigenous Namanyulk, told us indigenous Australians disagree about salties, just Australians disagree about salties, just Australians disagree about salties, just like other Australians.

like other Australians. like other Australians. Some favor commercial hunting. Others Some favor commercial hunting. Others Some favor commercial hunting. Others prize them as a totem or spiritual prize them as a totem or spiritual prize them as a totem or spiritual emblem that should be left alone. emblem that should be left alone. emblem that should be left alone. >> It's like a >> It's like a >> It's like a crocodile and us, we've been together crocodile and us, we've been together crocodile and us, we've been together for a very long time. for a very long time. for a very long time. >> You have a special connection. >> You have a special connection. >> You have a special connection. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Trevor Sullivan is also of indigenous >> Trevor Sullivan is also of indigenous >> Trevor Sullivan is also of indigenous ancestry. He believes living with ancestry. He believes living with ancestry. He believes living with saltwater crocodiles is not just saltwater crocodiles is not just saltwater crocodiles is not just possible, but a privilege. possible, but a privilege. possible, but a privilege. >> It's the best fun. Being able to coexist >> It's the best fun. Being able to coexist >> It's the best fun. Being able to coexist with saltwater crocodiles, the most with saltwater crocodiles, the most with saltwater crocodiles, the most dangerous predator on Earth, dangerous predator on Earth, dangerous predator on Earth, and we your crocodile attacks are almost and we your crocodile attacks are almost and we your crocodile attacks are almost non-existent. non-existent. non-existent. >> But isn't one fatal attack of a human >> But isn't one fatal attack of a human >> But isn't one fatal attack of a human being too many attacks? being too many attacks? being too many attacks? >> It will Well, what are we supposed to >> It will Well, what are we supposed to >> It will Well, what are we supposed to die from? >> Millions of years before people ever set >> Millions of years before people ever set foot on this wild land, Australia was foot on this wild land, Australia was foot on this wild land, Australia was croc country. croc country. croc country. As humans debate their future, the As humans debate their future, the As humans debate their future, the crocodiles are a lesson crocodiles are a lesson crocodiles are a lesson in survival.

>> Of all the different species of >> Of all the different species of crocodiles in the world, Africa's Nile crocodiles in the world, Africa's Nile crocodiles in the world, Africa's Nile crocodile is the most dangerous and crocodile is the most dangerous and crocodile is the most dangerous and deadly. They can grow up to 20 ft long, deadly. They can grow up to 20 ft long, deadly. They can grow up to 20 ft long, weigh as much as a car, and bite as hard weigh as much as a car, and bite as hard weigh as much as a car, and bite as hard as a Tyrannosaurus Rex. as a Tyrannosaurus Rex. as a Tyrannosaurus Rex. Crocodiles are prehistoric creatures Crocodiles are prehistoric creatures Crocodiles are prehistoric creatures that have been around since the time of that have been around since the time of that have been around since the time of the dinosaurs, but we still don't know a the dinosaurs, but we still don't know a the dinosaurs, but we still don't know a lot about them because studying them up lot about them because studying them up lot about them because studying them up close on land is treacherous and close on land is treacherous and close on land is treacherous and underwater was always thought to be underwater was always thought to be underwater was always thought to be impossible. As we reported last year, impossible. As we reported last year, impossible. As we reported last year, two wildlife filmmakers in Botswana in two wildlife filmmakers in Botswana in two wildlife filmmakers in Botswana in Southern Africa have found a way to get Southern Africa have found a way to get Southern Africa have found a way to get up close to crocs in the murky waters of up close to crocs in the murky waters of up close to crocs in the murky waters of the Okavango Delta. The images they've the Okavango Delta. The images they've the Okavango Delta. The images they've captured are some of the most remarkable captured are some of the most remarkable captured are some of the most remarkable wildlife scenes we've ever seen. The Okavango Delta has been called one The Okavango Delta has been called one of the last Edens on Earth. Hundreds of of the last Edens on Earth. Hundreds of of the last Edens on Earth. Hundreds of miles of winding waterways and untouched miles of winding waterways and untouched miles of winding waterways and untouched islands are home to some of Africa's islands are home to some of Africa's islands are home to some of Africa's most exotic and enchanting wildlife. most exotic and enchanting wildlife. most exotic and enchanting wildlife. It's also home to thousands of Nile It's also home to thousands of Nile It's also home to thousands of Nile crocodiles.

crocodiles. crocodiles. For the last 6 years, Brad Bestelink and For the last 6 years, Brad Bestelink and For the last 6 years, Brad Bestelink and his wife Andy Crawford have been risking his wife Andy Crawford have been risking his wife Andy Crawford have been risking their lives filming these man-eaters in their lives filming these man-eaters in their lives filming these man-eaters in the most daring way imaginable. the most daring way imaginable. the most daring way imaginable. Following the crocodiles into their Following the crocodiles into their Following the crocodiles into their underwater lairs. It is a dark and foreboding world down It is a dark and foreboding world down there. Visibility is sometimes only a there. Visibility is sometimes only a there. Visibility is sometimes only a few feet, and you can't even see the few feet, and you can't even see the few feet, and you can't even see the crocodiles crocodiles crocodiles until you catch a glimpse of their long until you catch a glimpse of their long until you catch a glimpse of their long rows of razor-sharp white teeth. rows of razor-sharp white teeth. rows of razor-sharp white teeth. >> How did you know you could do this? >> How did you know you could do this? >> How did you know you could do this? >> We were next to a ledge and this >> We were next to a ledge and this >> We were next to a ledge and this crocodile swam out and actually swam crocodile swam out and actually swam crocodile swam out and actually swam between us. between us. between us. And then settled on the ground next to And then settled on the ground next to And then settled on the ground next to us. us. us. >> What first went through your mind? >> What first went through your mind? >> What first went through your mind? >> Well, just lots of bubbles and just >> Well, just lots of bubbles and just >> Well, just lots of bubbles and just panic. panic. panic. >> The panic was understandable. Nile >> The panic was understandable. Nile >> The panic was understandable. Nile crocodiles are Africa's largest and most crocodiles are Africa's largest and most crocodiles are Africa's largest and most feared predator, but surprisingly this feared predator, but surprisingly this feared predator, but surprisingly this one didn't attack. Brad and Andy have one didn't attack. Brad and Andy have one didn't attack. Brad and Andy have been getting closer and closer to these been getting closer and closer to these been getting closer and closer to these creatures ever since.

creatures ever since. creatures ever since. >> You do get a different sense of them. >> You do get a different sense of them. >> You do get a different sense of them. They look very beautiful underwater. They look very beautiful underwater. They look very beautiful underwater. They're dappled and gold and black. They're dappled and gold and black. They're dappled and gold and black. And you see them as more timid, I think. And you see them as more timid, I think. And you see them as more timid, I think. Beyond the teeth and the terror, there's Beyond the teeth and the terror, there's Beyond the teeth and the terror, there's this incredible creature that is this incredible creature that is this incredible creature that is actually an amazing animal in its own actually an amazing animal in its own actually an amazing animal in its own right. right. right. >> You actually think they're beautiful? >> You actually think they're beautiful? >> You actually think they're beautiful? >> I do think they're beautiful. I never >> I do think they're beautiful. I never >> I do think they're beautiful. I never used to think they were beautiful, but used to think they were beautiful, but used to think they were beautiful, but this is a whole different view of them. this is a whole different view of them. this is a whole different view of them. >> This is the view most people have of >> This is the view most people have of >> This is the view most people have of Nile crocodiles. Patient and stealthy Nile crocodiles. Patient and stealthy Nile crocodiles. Patient and stealthy killers, they grab their prey, drag them killers, they grab their prey, drag them killers, they grab their prey, drag them into the water, then drown and dismember into the water, then drown and dismember into the water, then drown and dismember them. them. them. And it's not just animals they eat. And it's not just animals they eat. And it's not just animals they eat. Hundreds of people in Africa are killed Hundreds of people in Africa are killed Hundreds of people in Africa are killed each year while bathing, laundering each year while bathing, laundering each year while bathing, laundering clothes, or fishing along the water's clothes, or fishing along the water's clothes, or fishing along the water's edge. edge. edge. Nile crocodiles are now protected in Nile crocodiles are now protected in Nile crocodiles are now protected in Botswana, but Brad and Andy believe more Botswana, but Brad and Andy believe more Botswana, but Brad and Andy believe more needs to be known about their behavior needs to be known about their behavior needs to be known about their behavior so that humans can better avoid them. so that humans can better avoid them. so that humans can better avoid them. They've invited Dr. Adam Britton, an They've invited Dr. Adam Britton, an They've invited Dr. Adam Britton, an Australian zoologist, to dive with them. Australian zoologist, to dive with them. Australian zoologist, to dive with them. >> When you first heard about what they >> When you first heard about what they >> When you first heard about what they were doing here, what did you think?

were doing here, what did you think? were doing here, what did you think? >> Look, I'll be honest. When I when I >> Look, I'll be honest. When I when I >> Look, I'll be honest. When I when I first heard about this, my instant first heard about this, my instant first heard about this, my instant immediate reaction was that sounds immediate reaction was that sounds immediate reaction was that sounds crazy. crazy. crazy. >> Dr. Britton has been studying crocodiles >> Dr. Britton has been studying crocodiles >> Dr. Britton has been studying crocodiles for almost 20 years. for almost 20 years. for almost 20 years. >> I describe crocodiles like Ferraris. >> I describe crocodiles like Ferraris. >> I describe crocodiles like Ferraris. They're they're just extremely finely They're they're just extremely finely They're they're just extremely finely honed creatures. honed creatures. honed creatures. They are They are They're just perfectly They are They are They're just perfectly They are They are They're just perfectly adapted to do what they do. They They've adapted to do what they do. They They've adapted to do what they do. They They've They've, you know, the smartest of of of They've, you know, the smartest of of of They've, you know, the smartest of of of all the reptiles. all the reptiles. all the reptiles. >> Britain is building a genetic database >> Britain is building a genetic database >> Britain is building a genetic database on Nile crocodiles in the delta to on Nile crocodiles in the delta to on Nile crocodiles in the delta to better understand how to protect them. better understand how to protect them. better understand how to protect them. For years, the only way to study them up For years, the only way to study them up For years, the only way to study them up close was to capture them. close was to capture them. close was to capture them. >> There, croc on. >> There, croc on. >> There, croc on. So, once I've got him by the mouth, I'll So, once I've got him by the mouth, I'll So, once I've got him by the mouth, I'll grab him up here. grab him up here. grab him up here. >> It is difficult, dangerous work. IT'S ON HIM. GET HIM ON THE LEFT. PIN IT'S ON HIM. GET HIM ON THE LEFT. PIN HIS LEGS. Between his knees, as well. HIS LEGS. Between his knees, as well. HIS LEGS. Between his knees, as well. He's got no leverage. He's got no leverage. He's got no leverage. >> So, what are you doing now? >> So, what are you doing now? >> So, what are you doing now? >> I'm just going to cover his eyes >> I'm just going to cover his eyes >> I'm just going to cover his eyes so that he's so that he's so that he's can't see what we're doing.

can't see what we're doing. can't see what we're doing. >> So, he's not injured at all? >> So, he's not injured at all? >> So, he's not injured at all? >> No, no, he's not injured apart from his >> No, no, he's not injured apart from his >> No, no, he's not injured apart from his pride, perhaps. pride, perhaps. pride, perhaps. >> This crocodile is not sedated. It's >> This crocodile is not sedated. It's >> This crocodile is not sedated. It's simply trying to conserve its energy. simply trying to conserve its energy. simply trying to conserve its energy. >> Why are you doing this? >> Why are you doing this? >> Why are you doing this? >> If we can get a sample of all the DNA >> If we can get a sample of all the DNA >> If we can get a sample of all the DNA from every single crocodile across the from every single crocodile across the from every single crocodile across the delta, then we can start to build up a delta, then we can start to build up a delta, then we can start to build up a picture then of exactly, not only where picture then of exactly, not only where picture then of exactly, not only where these crocodiles came from, but how these crocodiles came from, but how these crocodiles came from, but how they're moving within the delta. they're moving within the delta. they're moving within the delta. >> Cuz right now you don't really know >> Cuz right now you don't really know >> Cuz right now you don't really know that. that. that. >> No one really knows anything about that >> No one really knows anything about that >> No one really knows anything about that at all. at all. at all. >> When you actually see the crocodiles up >> When you actually see the crocodiles up >> When you actually see the crocodiles up close, there is a a beauty to them. close, there is a a beauty to them. close, there is a a beauty to them. Often in pictures, they're covered in Often in pictures, they're covered in Often in pictures, they're covered in mud. They look very drab, but up close, mud. They look very drab, but up close, mud. They look very drab, but up close, you see the variety of color, and not you see the variety of color, and not you see the variety of color, and not just on the top, but also on the bottom. just on the top, but also on the bottom. just on the top, but also on the bottom. And the touch to the touch, it's really And the touch to the touch, it's really And the touch to the touch, it's really There's a softness to them, particularly There's a softness to them, particularly There's a softness to them, particularly on the on the on the uh the feet like this. The claws are uh the feet like this. The claws are uh the feet like this. The claws are about an inch, an inch and a half, uh about an inch, an inch and a half, uh about an inch, an inch and a half, uh but the the pads of the feet are but the the pads of the feet are but the the pads of the feet are actually incredibly soft. actually incredibly soft. actually incredibly soft. >> Capturing crocodiles is stressful for >> Capturing crocodiles is stressful for >> Capturing crocodiles is stressful for the animal and for us. Putting them back the animal and for us. Putting them back the animal and for us. Putting them back in the water is just as hard. in the water is just as hard. in the water is just as hard. >> keep pressing down on the center on the >> keep pressing down on the center on the >> keep pressing down on the center on the top of the skull. It's good.

top of the skull. It's good. top of the skull. It's good. Okay, now he's ready to go. Okay, now he's ready to go. Okay, now he's ready to go. >> So, you pretty to go? Okay, 3 2 1 go. >> Diving with Brad and Andy has given Dr. >> Diving with Brad and Andy has given Dr. Adam Britton a whole new understanding Adam Britton a whole new understanding Adam Britton a whole new understanding of crocodiles and their underwater of crocodiles and their underwater of crocodiles and their underwater world. world. world. >> You're in the water. You've got the >> You're in the water. You've got the >> You're in the water. You've got the current washing over you. You can feel current washing over you. You can feel current washing over you. You can feel the changes in temperature. You suddenly the changes in temperature. You suddenly the changes in temperature. You suddenly think this is what it's like to be a think this is what it's like to be a think this is what it's like to be a crocodile. This crocodile is is crocodile. This crocodile is is crocodile. This crocodile is is experiencing these same things. experiencing these same things. experiencing these same things. >> Britton has actually begun to take DNA >> Britton has actually begun to take DNA >> Britton has actually begun to take DNA samples from crocodiles underwater, samples from crocodiles underwater, samples from crocodiles underwater, cutting off pieces of their tails. And cutting off pieces of their tails. And cutting off pieces of their tails. And incredibly, they don't seem to mind. Diving with Nile crocodiles is only Diving with Nile crocodiles is only possible in the winter months when the possible in the winter months when the possible in the winter months when the water is chilly and the animals are water is chilly and the animals are water is chilly and the animals are sluggish. These cold-blooded reptiles sluggish. These cold-blooded reptiles sluggish. These cold-blooded reptiles are far too dangerous to dive with in are far too dangerous to dive with in are far too dangerous to dive with in the summer. the summer. the summer. >> The crocs are much more active. They're >> The crocs are much more active. They're >> The crocs are much more active. They're much more um inclined to want to much more um inclined to want to much more um inclined to want to predate. predate. predate. >> Predate, attack. >> Predate, attack. >> Predate, attack. >> Attack. Yeah, they they want to go and >> Attack. Yeah, they they want to go and >> Attack. Yeah, they they want to go and eat something. eat something. eat something. >> So, 2 months from now, 3 months from >> So, 2 months from now, 3 months from >> So, 2 months from now, 3 months from now, you would not dive in these waters.

now, you would not dive in these waters. now, you would not dive in these waters. >> No. >> No. >> No. No. No. No. No, no, I don't. I want I don't want to No, no, I don't. I want I don't want to No, no, I don't. I want I don't want to die. Make no mistake, I do this because die. Make no mistake, I do this because die. Make no mistake, I do this because I get an understanding of what the how I get an understanding of what the how I get an understanding of what the how these predators work. >> Brad and Andy offered to take me diving >> Brad and Andy offered to take me diving with them, explaining it's crucial to with them, explaining it's crucial to with them, explaining it's crucial to get off the surface of the water as get off the surface of the water as get off the surface of the water as quickly as possible because that's where quickly as possible because that's where quickly as possible because that's where the crocs attack. the crocs attack. the crocs attack. >> That's the most important thing because >> That's the most important thing because >> That's the most important thing because as soon as you're underwater, we believe as soon as you're underwater, we believe as soon as you're underwater, we believe the crocodiles don't know what we are. the crocodiles don't know what we are. the crocodiles don't know what we are. They don't recognize us as prey. They don't recognize us as prey. They don't recognize us as prey. >> You say we believe. Do Do you know? >> You say we believe. Do Do you know? >> You say we believe. Do Do you know? >> We don't We don't know for sure. We can >> We don't We don't know for sure. We can >> We don't We don't know for sure. We can never know how they're perceiving us. never know how they're perceiving us. never know how they're perceiving us. We're trying to establish how they We're trying to establish how they We're trying to establish how they perceive us. perceive us. perceive us. >> Again, you're not really building my >> Again, you're not really building my >> Again, you're not really building my confidence here by saying you're not confidence here by saying you're not confidence here by saying you're not sure. sure. sure. Um what what do I need to know before Um what what do I need to know before Um what what do I need to know before before going in? before going in? before going in? >> Well, we believe you're safe. >> Well, we believe you're safe. >> Well, we believe you're safe. With all that uncertainty, we believe With all that uncertainty, we believe With all that uncertainty, we believe you're safe. you're safe. you're safe. >> Safe? Take a look at a recent encounter >> Safe? Take a look at a recent encounter >> Safe? Take a look at a recent encounter they had with a crocodile. they had with a crocodile. they had with a crocodile. >> You see how close he comes to me. >> You see how close he comes to me. >> You see how close he comes to me. >> And look at the eye. >> And look at the eye. >> And look at the eye. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And look at those teeth. Those are huge. >> And look at those teeth. Those are huge. >> And look at those teeth. Those are huge. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> This croc was 12 ft long and weighed >> This croc was 12 ft long and weighed >> This croc was 12 ft long and weighed about 1,400 lb.

about 1,400 lb. about 1,400 lb. >> And there's a diver. >> And there's a diver. >> And there's a diver. I want to film him. I want to film him. I want to film him. >> Oh my gosh. >> Oh my gosh. >> Oh my gosh. But because the croc's moving, it But because the croc's moving, it But because the croc's moving, it doesn't even really sense that diver doesn't even really sense that diver doesn't even really sense that diver there. there. there. >> It didn't even know that he was there. >> It didn't even know that he was there. >> It didn't even know that he was there. And you'll you'll see how it just goes. And you'll you'll see how it just goes. And you'll you'll see how it just goes. It hits his light. It squashes his It hits his light. It squashes his It hits his light. It squashes his light. light. light. >> So, it just thinks that's some debris or >> So, it just thinks that's some debris or >> So, it just thinks that's some debris or tree or something. tree or something. tree or something. That's amazing. That's amazing. That's amazing. >> We set off early the next day. It's an >> We set off early the next day. It's an >> We set off early the next day. It's an hour upriver to a spot that has a lot of hour upriver to a spot that has a lot of hour upriver to a spot that has a lot of underwater caves. underwater caves. underwater caves. Three divers will go in with me. Brad, Three divers will go in with me. Brad, Three divers will go in with me. Brad, cameraman Richard Yawn, and Andy. She'll cameraman Richard Yawn, and Andy. She'll cameraman Richard Yawn, and Andy. She'll be the safety diver watching our backs. >> I'll let you know if there's a croc if I >> I'll let you know if there's a croc if I see it first. see it first. see it first. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Basically, it's about >> Basically, it's about >> Basically, it's about >> crocodile is that? >> crocodile is that? >> crocodile is that? >> It's a >> It's a >> It's a >> That's the international sign for >> That's the international sign for >> That's the international sign for crocodile? crocodile? crocodile? >> It's a sign for crocodile. Well, it's >> It's a sign for crocodile. Well, it's >> It's a sign for crocodile. Well, it's our sign for crocodile. Brad does this. our sign for crocodile. Brad does this. our sign for crocodile. Brad does this. >> I didn't learn that in scuba school. I >> I didn't learn that in scuba school. I >> I didn't learn that in scuba school. I didn't make that. didn't make that. didn't make that. >> Cuz we're going to give you one of these >> Cuz we're going to give you one of these >> Cuz we're going to give you one of these to dive with. Makes you feel better. It to dive with. Makes you feel better. It to dive with. Makes you feel better. It also gives you some barrier in place. also gives you some barrier in place. also gives you some barrier in place. >> That's what they're all for is to make >> That's what they're all for is to make >> That's what they're all for is to make you feel better. you feel better. you feel better. >> Mainly that and actually to actually >> Mainly that and actually to actually >> Mainly that and actually to actually anchor yourself in the current. anchor yourself in the current. anchor yourself in the current. >> Okay. Cuz no matter what, you do not >> Okay. Cuz no matter what, you do not >> Okay. Cuz no matter what, you do not want to drift onto the want to drift onto the want to drift onto the >> drift onto the crocodile.

>> drift onto the crocodile. >> drift onto the crocodile. >> As soon as the crocs see our boat, they >> As soon as the crocs see our boat, they >> As soon as the crocs see our boat, they disappear. We hope they've gone to the disappear. We hope they've gone to the disappear. We hope they've gone to the bottom to hide in their underwater bottom to hide in their underwater bottom to hide in their underwater caves, but they might still be floating caves, but they might still be floating caves, but they might still be floating near the surface waiting to attack. near the surface waiting to attack. near the surface waiting to attack. It's a very strange feeling before you It's a very strange feeling before you It's a very strange feeling before you go diving because you know there are go diving because you know there are go diving because you know there are crocodiles in this area, but you you crocodiles in this area, but you you crocodiles in this area, but you you don't see any on the surface. don't see any on the surface. don't see any on the surface. And the problem is as the boat comes in, And the problem is as the boat comes in, And the problem is as the boat comes in, any motion on the surface does tend to any motion on the surface does tend to any motion on the surface does tend to attract crocodiles. So, you want to try attract crocodiles. So, you want to try attract crocodiles. So, you want to try to get here and in the water and to the to get here and in the water and to the to get here and in the water and to the bottom as quickly as possible. bottom as quickly as possible. bottom as quickly as possible. We suit up, do our final checks, and We suit up, do our final checks, and We suit up, do our final checks, and then take the plunge. then take the plunge. then take the plunge. >> Anderson, Richard? >> Anderson, Richard? >> Anderson, Richard? >> Yep. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> We'll go with Anderson. >> We'll go with Anderson. >> We'll go with Anderson. >> Yeah, okay. >> Yeah, okay. >> Yeah, okay. >> Anderson, good. >> Anderson, good. >> Anderson, good. Go. Go. Go. >> Okay. >> We get to the river bottom as quickly as >> We get to the river bottom as quickly as we can. we can. we can. It's only about 15 ft deep. It's only about 15 ft deep. It's only about 15 ft deep. Thankfully, the visibility is good and Thankfully, the visibility is good and Thankfully, the visibility is good and we find ourselves in a stunning we find ourselves in a stunning we find ourselves in a stunning underwater garden underwater garden underwater garden with overhanging ledges, with overhanging ledges, with overhanging ledges, walls of papyrus, walls of papyrus, walls of papyrus, submerged trees, and lilies.

>> We know there's at least one crocodile >> We know there's at least one crocodile in this area because we saw the ripples in this area because we saw the ripples in this area because we saw the ripples on the water. on the water. on the water. We believe it's gone into a nearby cave We believe it's gone into a nearby cave We believe it's gone into a nearby cave system. system. system. So, we're going to go into the caves So, we're going to go into the caves So, we're going to go into the caves right now to try to right now to try to right now to try to see if we can find it. >> It's eerie and intimidating down here. >> It's eerie and intimidating down here. The only light comes from our cameras The only light comes from our cameras The only light comes from our cameras and it's easy to lose your way. and it's easy to lose your way. and it's easy to lose your way. Brad signals that he sees a crocodile. Brad signals that he sees a crocodile. Brad signals that he sees a crocodile. At first, I can't see anything. But At first, I can't see anything. But At first, I can't see anything. But then, out of the darkness, on the floor then, out of the darkness, on the floor then, out of the darkness, on the floor of the cave, just as Brad warned, I see of the cave, just as Brad warned, I see of the cave, just as Brad warned, I see that gleaming row of white teeth. that gleaming row of white teeth. that gleaming row of white teeth. >> To finally see one >> To finally see one >> To finally see one it's amazing. it's amazing. it's amazing. There's a beauty to it, There's a beauty to it, There's a beauty to it, but it's also incredibly intimidating. but it's also incredibly intimidating. but it's also incredibly intimidating. You really have the sense You really have the sense You really have the sense when you're so close to it of just how when you're so close to it of just how when you're so close to it of just how strong it is. strong it is. strong it is. And it looks right at you. And it looks right at you. And it looks right at you. And you know and it knows And you know and it knows And you know and it knows that it could attack you at any moment that it could attack you at any moment that it could attack you at any moment and there's nothing you can do about it. and there's nothing you can do about it. and there's nothing you can do about it. >> The crocodile disappears into the >> The crocodile disappears into the >> The crocodile disappears into the darkness. We push further into the cave.

darkness. We push further into the cave. darkness. We push further into the cave. It gets narrower and more claustrophobic It gets narrower and more claustrophobic It gets narrower and more claustrophobic as we move deeper into the gloom. as we move deeper into the gloom. as we move deeper into the gloom. Then, lurking on a nearby ledge, there's Then, lurking on a nearby ledge, there's Then, lurking on a nearby ledge, there's another crocodile. another crocodile. another crocodile. >> This crocodile is about 9 ft >> This crocodile is about 9 ft >> This crocodile is about 9 ft long. long. long. Its tail, though, makes up about half Its tail, though, makes up about half Its tail, though, makes up about half its length. its length. its length. Crocs have the amazing ability to Crocs have the amazing ability to Crocs have the amazing ability to actually slow their heart rate down. actually slow their heart rate down. actually slow their heart rate down. They can They can They can close off one of the valves in their close off one of the valves in their close off one of the valves in their hearts, which stops the flow of blood hearts, which stops the flow of blood hearts, which stops the flow of blood to some of its organs. to some of its organs. to some of its organs. It it them to stay underwater for hours It it them to stay underwater for hours It it them to stay underwater for hours at a time. It's amazing how close the crocodile is. It's amazing how close the crocodile is. You can't tell if it's watching you or You can't tell if it's watching you or You can't tell if it's watching you or not. not. not. >> Suddenly, the crocodile backs away. It's >> Suddenly, the crocodile backs away. It's >> Suddenly, the crocodile backs away. It's not taking its eyes off me. My heart is pounding. Neither of us My heart is pounding. Neither of us moves.

Then, with a flick of his tail, he's Then, with a flick of his tail, he's off. We move further through the undergrowth We move further through the undergrowth and find yet another crocodile. This time, it's facing me head-on. This time, it's facing me head-on. On the stick I'm holding, I have a small On the stick I'm holding, I have a small On the stick I'm holding, I have a small camera, and I move it closer to try and camera, and I move it closer to try and camera, and I move it closer to try and get a better shot. I know I should be terrified, but the I know I should be terrified, but the truth is, it's actually thrilling. truth is, it's actually thrilling. truth is, it's actually thrilling. >> It's extraordinary to be able to get so >> It's extraordinary to be able to get so >> It's extraordinary to be able to get so close. Literally looking at it right in the Literally looking at it right in the face, staring at it face-to-face. face, staring at it face-to-face. face, staring at it face-to-face. A crocodile's front vision is not very A crocodile's front vision is not very A crocodile's front vision is not very good. good. good. So, this is actually a relatively safe So, this is actually a relatively safe So, this is actually a relatively safe place to be. place to be. place to be. The crocodile is also laying low, The crocodile is also laying low, The crocodile is also laying low, which is a good sign. which is a good sign. which is a good sign. If it felt threatened, it would rise up If it felt threatened, it would rise up If it felt threatened, it would rise up on its feet. on its feet. on its feet. That would be an indication it might be That would be an indication it might be That would be an indication it might be ready to strike.

>> When it finally takes off, we start >> When it finally takes off, we start following it. The crocodile is kicking following it. The crocodile is kicking following it. The crocodile is kicking up so much sand and sediment, we can't up so much sand and sediment, we can't up so much sand and sediment, we can't see where we're going. >> We're trying to pursue the crocodile >> We're trying to pursue the crocodile right now. It's right now. It's right now. It's I can't tell how large it is. It's tail I can't tell how large it is. It's tail I can't tell how large it is. It's tail is so powerful. I'm almost right on top is so powerful. I'm almost right on top is so powerful. I'm almost right on top of it. of it. of it. I could reach out right now and just I could reach out right now and just I could reach out right now and just touch the tail. touch the tail. touch the tail. But I'm worried if I do that it'll But I'm worried if I do that it'll But I'm worried if I do that it'll somehow somehow somehow turn around. It just doesn't seem like a turn around. It just doesn't seem like a turn around. It just doesn't seem like a good idea. good idea. good idea. But I got to say it's so tempting. But I got to say it's so tempting. But I got to say it's so tempting. >> The croc is moving so fast we can't keep >> The croc is moving so fast we can't keep >> The croc is moving so fast we can't keep up for long. up for long. up for long. It's time to surface and find the boat. It's time to surface and find the boat. It's time to surface and find the boat. >> That was amazing. >> That was amazing. >> That was amazing. Look at right. Look at right. Look at right. Right. Right. Right. I was right on top of it. I was right on I was right on top of it. I was right on I was right on top of it. I was right on its tail. I mean I could have touched its tail. I mean I could have touched its tail. I mean I could have touched it. it. it. >> And then he turns around. >> And then he turns around. >> And then he turns around. >> turns around. >> turns around. >> turns around. I swear there was a moment where I I swear there was a moment where I I swear there was a moment where I thought thought thought Jesus, he could just attack. And there's Jesus, he could just attack. And there's Jesus, he could just attack. And there's nothing I could do about it. nothing I could do about it. nothing I could do about it. >> Absolutely. But did you ever feel like >> Absolutely. But did you ever feel like >> Absolutely. But did you ever feel like he was going to attack? he was going to attack? he was going to attack? >> No. >> No. >> No. Well, may- maybe a little bit actually.

Well, may- maybe a little bit actually. Well, may- maybe a little bit actually. I've dived with great white sharks I've dived with great white sharks I've dived with great white sharks before, but in terms of numbers of before, but in terms of numbers of before, but in terms of numbers of people killed each year, Nile crocodiles people killed each year, Nile crocodiles people killed each year, Nile crocodiles are far more deadly. Once ruthlessly are far more deadly. Once ruthlessly are far more deadly. Once ruthlessly hunted, still vilified as mindless hunted, still vilified as mindless hunted, still vilified as mindless killing machines, we can finally observe killing machines, we can finally observe killing machines, we can finally observe them as they really are. Perfectly them as they really are. Perfectly them as they really are. Perfectly evolved denizens of the dark. Ancient evolved denizens of the dark. Ancient evolved denizens of the dark. Ancient creatures, now for the first time, fully creatures, now for the first time, fully creatures, now for the first time, fully visible in the light. >> Not since the dinosaurs disappeared have >> Not since the dinosaurs disappeared have animals been going extinct as fast as animals been going extinct as fast as animals been going extinct as fast as they are now. Entire species vanish they are now. Entire species vanish they are now. Entire species vanish every year. And while our hearts are every year. And while our hearts are every year. And while our hearts are moved by the plight of the biggest, moved by the plight of the biggest, moved by the plight of the biggest, whales or elephants, the fiercest, whales or elephants, the fiercest, whales or elephants, the fiercest, tigers, even sharks, and certainly the tigers, even sharks, and certainly the tigers, even sharks, and certainly the cutest, like pandas, what about the cutest, like pandas, what about the cutest, like pandas, what about the slowest? The turtle and its land-loving slowest? The turtle and its land-loving slowest? The turtle and its land-loving cousin the tortoise have been plotting cousin the tortoise have been plotting cousin the tortoise have been plotting along slow and steady for more than 200 along slow and steady for more than 200 along slow and steady for more than 200 million years. But their hard shells are million years. But their hard shells are million years. But their hard shells are little protection from human predators little protection from human predators little protection from human predators and a booming illegal animal trade.

and a booming illegal animal trade. and a booming illegal animal trade. It may be too late to save many of them, It may be too late to save many of them, It may be too late to save many of them, but they have found an unlikely but they have found an unlikely but they have found an unlikely protector in a man named Eric Goode. protector in a man named Eric Goode. protector in a man named Eric Goode. Some of New York City's hottest hotels, Some of New York City's hottest hotels, Some of New York City's hottest hotels, restaurants, and bars are owned by Eric restaurants, and bars are owned by Eric restaurants, and bars are owned by Eric Goode. Goode. Goode. >> Hello. I need to say hello to people >> Hello. I need to say hello to people >> Hello. I need to say hello to people that I haven't said hello to. Hi. that I haven't said hello to. Hi. that I haven't said hello to. Hi. >> That's made him rich >> That's made him rich >> That's made him rich and comfortable with the glitterati and and comfortable with the glitterati and and comfortable with the glitterati and fashionistas. fashionistas. fashionistas. But behind the scenes, he caters to a But behind the scenes, he caters to a But behind the scenes, he caters to a far less glamorous clientele. far less glamorous clientele. far less glamorous clientele. Endangered turtles and tortoises. Endangered turtles and tortoises. Endangered turtles and tortoises. >> How did the whole interest, if not >> How did the whole interest, if not >> How did the whole interest, if not obsession, with turtles and tortoises obsession, with turtles and tortoises obsession, with turtles and tortoises begin? begin? begin? >> As a child at six, I >> As a child at six, I >> As a child at six, I >> At six? >> At six? >> At six? >> a small Hermann's tortoise. And that >> a small Hermann's tortoise. And that >> a small Hermann's tortoise. And that created a budding interest in the created a budding interest in the created a budding interest in the natural world and in reptiles and snakes natural world and in reptiles and snakes natural world and in reptiles and snakes and lizards and in my hard-shelled and lizards and in my hard-shelled and lizards and in my hard-shelled friends that I just fell in love with. friends that I just fell in love with. friends that I just fell in love with. And so, it was a progression. And so, it was a progression. And so, it was a progression. >> It's an obsession that takes him as far >> It's an obsession that takes him as far >> It's an obsession that takes him as far from the glitz of the New York scene as from the glitz of the New York scene as from the glitz of the New York scene as imaginable.

imaginable. imaginable. He wades through swamps, He wades through swamps, He wades through swamps, turns over rocks, turns over rocks, turns over rocks, wrangles exotic snakes and other wrangles exotic snakes and other wrangles exotic snakes and other reptiles reptiles reptiles as he searches for his first love. as he searches for his first love. as he searches for his first love. >> What a beautiful tortoise. >> What a beautiful tortoise. >> What a beautiful tortoise. This is our first This is our first This is our first Psammobates tentorius trimeni. Psammobates tentorius trimeni. Psammobates tentorius trimeni. >> Turtles and tortoises trace back before >> Turtles and tortoises trace back before >> Turtles and tortoises trace back before the dinosaurs, but now today about half the dinosaurs, but now today about half the dinosaurs, but now today about half of the over 300 species are headed of the over 300 species are headed of the over 300 species are headed toward extinction, largely because of toward extinction, largely because of toward extinction, largely because of habitat loss and an insatiable market habitat loss and an insatiable market habitat loss and an insatiable market for them, particularly in Asia, as food, for them, particularly in Asia, as food, for them, particularly in Asia, as food, medicine, rare collector's items, and medicine, rare collector's items, and medicine, rare collector's items, and pets. pets. pets. >> How big a business is the turtle >> How big a business is the turtle >> How big a business is the turtle tortoise trade? tortoise trade? tortoise trade? >> China alone is probably in the hundreds >> China alone is probably in the hundreds >> China alone is probably in the hundreds of millions of dollars. This trade of millions of dollars. This trade of millions of dollars. This trade flourishes because the payoff is huge flourishes because the payoff is huge flourishes because the payoff is huge and the chance of getting prosecuted and and the chance of getting prosecuted and and the chance of getting prosecuted and and incarcerated are very low. and incarcerated are very low. and incarcerated are very low. >> If you're going to be in something >> If you're going to be in something >> If you're going to be in something illicit, this is the safest or one of illicit, this is the safest or one of illicit, this is the safest or one of the safest.

the safest. the safest. >> And that's a tragedy. >> And that's a tragedy. >> And that's a tragedy. >> Eric Goode is spending a million dollars >> Eric Goode is spending a million dollars >> Eric Goode is spending a million dollars a year of his own money to fight the a year of his own money to fight the a year of his own money to fight the trade in places like Madagascar, an trade in places like Madagascar, an trade in places like Madagascar, an island off the coast of Africa that's island off the coast of Africa that's island off the coast of Africa that's vastly undeveloped. vastly undeveloped. vastly undeveloped. >> People are so poor and so many of these >> People are so poor and so many of these >> People are so poor and so many of these villages make less than a dollar a day villages make less than a dollar a day villages make less than a dollar a day or it's basically subsistence living and or it's basically subsistence living and or it's basically subsistence living and there just simply isn't the political there just simply isn't the political there just simply isn't the political will of the country to really enforce will of the country to really enforce will of the country to really enforce you know, what's going on with their you know, what's going on with their you know, what's going on with their natural heritage, whether it's tortoises natural heritage, whether it's tortoises natural heritage, whether it's tortoises or other wildlife. or other wildlife. or other wildlife. >> Fly over Madagascar and you can see why >> Fly over Madagascar and you can see why >> Fly over Madagascar and you can see why conservationists say it's bleeding to conservationists say it's bleeding to conservationists say it's bleeding to death. Rivers run red with soil erosion death. Rivers run red with soil erosion death. Rivers run red with soil erosion from logging and slash and burn from logging and slash and burn from logging and slash and burn agriculture that have wiped out animal agriculture that have wiped out animal agriculture that have wiped out animal habitats and 90% of the country's habitats and 90% of the country's habitats and 90% of the country's forests. forests. forests. And yet, because of its isolation, And yet, because of its isolation, And yet, because of its isolation, Madagascar is a paradise of plants and Madagascar is a paradise of plants and Madagascar is a paradise of plants and animals found nowhere else, like the animals found nowhere else, like the animals found nowhere else, like the wide-eyed lemurs, wide-eyed lemurs, wide-eyed lemurs, chameleons that sparkle with color, chameleons that sparkle with color, chameleons that sparkle with color, geckos that hide in plain sight, geckos that hide in plain sight, geckos that hide in plain sight, more than 200 kinds of frogs and five more than 200 kinds of frogs and five more than 200 kinds of frogs and five species of rare turtles and tortoises.

species of rare turtles and tortoises. species of rare turtles and tortoises. Eric was taking us on a trek to find the Eric was taking us on a trek to find the Eric was taking us on a trek to find the fastest disappearing animal in fastest disappearing animal in fastest disappearing animal in Madagascar, the ploughshare tortoise, Madagascar, the ploughshare tortoise, Madagascar, the ploughshare tortoise, whose shrinking habitat is so deep in whose shrinking habitat is so deep in whose shrinking habitat is so deep in the wilderness it's only accessible by the wilderness it's only accessible by the wilderness it's only accessible by boat. boat. boat. >> This tortoise is one of the world's most >> This tortoise is one of the world's most >> This tortoise is one of the world's most endangered animals. It is the world's endangered animals. It is the world's endangered animals. It is the world's most endangered tortoise and it has an most endangered tortoise and it has an most endangered tortoise and it has an incredibly high price on its head. Asian incredibly high price on its head. Asian incredibly high price on its head. Asian countries love gold and this is a gold countries love gold and this is a gold countries love gold and this is a gold tortoise. tortoise. tortoise. And so literally, these are like gold And so literally, these are like gold And so literally, these are like gold bricks that one can pick up and sell. bricks that one can pick up and sell. bricks that one can pick up and sell. >> We were following the path the poachers >> We were following the path the poachers >> We were following the path the poachers take, landing on a deserted beach, and take, landing on a deserted beach, and take, landing on a deserted beach, and off we went on a long hike. We walked off we went on a long hike. We walked off we went on a long hike. We walked through scrub brush in blazing heat for through scrub brush in blazing heat for through scrub brush in blazing heat for almost an hour. almost an hour. almost an hour. >> The sun starts to go up too high, they >> The sun starts to go up too high, they >> The sun starts to go up too high, they just disappear. just disappear. just disappear. >> The once plentiful ploughshare >> The once plentiful ploughshare >> The once plentiful ploughshare population here, he says, could be down population here, he says, could be down population here, he says, could be down to as few as 300 adults. to as few as 300 adults. to as few as 300 adults. >> And this is where the guards are based. >> And this is where the guards are based. >> And this is where the guards are based. >> Good has helped hire around 40 locals to >> Good has helped hire around 40 locals to >> Good has helped hire around 40 locals to go out and find the tortoises before the go out and find the tortoises before the go out and find the tortoises before the poachers do.

poachers do. poachers do. >> We have to be on a team of uh many >> We have to be on a team of uh many >> We have to be on a team of uh many people. people. people. >> Different lines, 30 ft apart, yeah. >> Different lines, 30 ft apart, yeah. >> Different lines, 30 ft apart, yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> All right, let's go. >> All right, let's go. >> All right, let's go. >> Go on it. >> Go on it. >> Go on it. >> We lined up the way police do when they >> We lined up the way police do when they >> We lined up the way police do when they search for a missing person, and by search for a missing person, and by search for a missing person, and by midday, with a lot of help, we got midday, with a lot of help, we got midday, with a lot of help, we got lucky. lucky. lucky. >> I found one. >> Look at that. >> Look at that. How did you ever find it? How did you ever find it? How did you ever find it? >> Wow. Oh, it's a beauti- beautiful >> Wow. Oh, it's a beauti- beautiful >> Wow. Oh, it's a beauti- beautiful female. So, this is a just female. So, this is a just female. So, this is a just a perfect perfect female. a perfect perfect female. a perfect perfect female. Now, this tortoise is a crown jewel. Now, this tortoise is a crown jewel. Now, this tortoise is a crown jewel. This is a beautiful animal. This is a beautiful animal. This is a beautiful animal. >> Look at her. >> Look at her. >> Look at her. >> And and you see this is this incredible >> And and you see this is this incredible >> And and you see this is this incredible dome shell that's unique with this dome shell that's unique with this dome shell that's unique with this tortoise. Nothing has No turtle has this tortoise. Nothing has No turtle has this tortoise. Nothing has No turtle has this shell, like an army helmet. This is a shell, like an army helmet. This is a shell, like an army helmet. This is a very very valuable tortoise. very very valuable tortoise. very very valuable tortoise. >> Based on his own research, Good says a >> Based on his own research, Good says a >> Based on his own research, Good says a tortoise like this could sell for tortoise like this could sell for tortoise like this could sell for $60,000 in Asia. $60,000 in Asia. $60,000 in Asia. To try and stop the trafficking, he and To try and stop the trafficking, he and To try and stop the trafficking, he and his colleagues have begun doing the his colleagues have begun doing the his colleagues have begun doing the unthinkable.

It's a drill. Oh my god. It's a drill. Oh my god. >> Yeah. He has to be very careful not to hit the He has to be very careful not to hit the bone, cuz then we'll draw blood. So, bone, cuz then we'll draw blood. So, bone, cuz then we'll draw blood. So, he's going just that very carefully 1/16 he's going just that very carefully 1/16 he's going just that very carefully 1/16 of an inch into the shell. of an inch into the shell. of an inch into the shell. >> They want to leave an indelible gash, a >> They want to leave an indelible gash, a >> They want to leave an indelible gash, a scar, that makes the tortoises scar, that makes the tortoises scar, that makes the tortoises undesirable to collectors. I have to undesirable to collectors. I have to undesirable to collectors. I have to tell you, watching Angelo do this, it tell you, watching Angelo do this, it tell you, watching Angelo do this, it it's painful. it's painful. it's painful. It is painful to watch. It is painful to watch. It is painful to watch. >> Yeah, now it's it's very hard, but I >> Yeah, now it's it's very hard, but I >> Yeah, now it's it's very hard, but I think we're at a point where we're down think we're at a point where we're down think we're at a point where we're down to so few animals. There's so few of to so few animals. There's so few of to so few animals. There's so few of these tortoises left that we these tortoises left that we these tortoises left that we have to really take extreme measures. have to really take extreme measures. have to really take extreme measures. >> Scarring the shells of these animals, >> Scarring the shells of these animals, >> Scarring the shells of these animals, defacing them, etching. Is that working? defacing them, etching. Is that working? defacing them, etching. Is that working? Can you tell yet? Can you tell yet? Can you tell yet? >> It's too soon to know if that's working. >> It's too soon to know if that's working. >> It's too soon to know if that's working. It breaks your heart to have to do that It breaks your heart to have to do that It breaks your heart to have to do that to this beautiful, beautiful shell. I to this beautiful, beautiful shell. I to this beautiful, beautiful shell. I mean, we you can compare it maybe to mean, we you can compare it maybe to mean, we you can compare it maybe to chainsawing off a rhinoceros's horn to chainsawing off a rhinoceros's horn to chainsawing off a rhinoceros's horn to save a rhino. I mean, how horrible is save a rhino. I mean, how horrible is save a rhino. I mean, how horrible is that? that? that? >> To show us what he's up against, Eric >> To show us what he's up against, Eric >> To show us what he's up against, Eric took us to a market in a small city took us to a market in a small city took us to a market in a small city called Mahajanga, where we saw, with our called Mahajanga, where we saw, with our called Mahajanga, where we saw, with our hidden camera, shells of endangered hidden camera, shells of endangered hidden camera, shells of endangered tortoises out in the open, on display tortoises out in the open, on display tortoises out in the open, on display for sale. And soon, we were being for sale. And soon, we were being for sale. And soon, we were being offered live tortoises.

offered live tortoises. offered live tortoises. >> What is this? >> What is this? >> What is this? >> This is a >> This is a >> This is a >> This is a spider tortoise from southern >> This is a spider tortoise from southern >> This is a spider tortoise from southern Madagascar. This is critically Madagascar. This is critically Madagascar. This is critically endangered. endangered. endangered. And the Chinese sometimes just puncture And the Chinese sometimes just puncture And the Chinese sometimes just puncture the shell just to eat the liver out of the shell just to eat the liver out of the shell just to eat the liver out of this tortoise. this tortoise. this tortoise. >> One of the vendors showed up with >> One of the vendors showed up with >> One of the vendors showed up with something in a plastic bag. something in a plastic bag. something in a plastic bag. >> What is it? >> It was a radiated tortoise on the >> It was a radiated tortoise on the endangered species list. Asking price, endangered species list. Asking price, endangered species list. Asking price, just $400. just $400. just $400. We were even offered a ploughshare We were even offered a ploughshare We were even offered a ploughshare tortoise if we paid up front and waited tortoise if we paid up front and waited tortoise if we paid up front and waited several days. several days. several days. But that would have meant breaking But that would have meant breaking But that would have meant breaking Madagascar and international laws Madagascar and international laws Madagascar and international laws against smuggling an endangered animal. against smuggling an endangered animal. against smuggling an endangered animal. >> How hard was it for you to not take that >> How hard was it for you to not take that >> How hard was it for you to not take that tortoise and save its life? tortoise and save its life? tortoise and save its life? If you leave it behind, who knows where If you leave it behind, who knows where If you leave it behind, who knows where it's going to end up. it's going to end up. it's going to end up. >> It's incredibly frustrating. This animal >> It's incredibly frustrating. This animal >> It's incredibly frustrating. This animal is from such a tiny geography. You think is from such a tiny geography. You think is from such a tiny geography. You think you could wall it in and protect it. you could wall it in and protect it. you could wall it in and protect it. >> There is one place in Madagascar that is >> There is one place in Madagascar that is >> There is one place in Madagascar that is trying to wall them in and protect them trying to wall them in and protect them trying to wall them in and protect them behind locks and razor wire. This behind locks and razor wire. This behind locks and razor wire. This national park, deep in a forest.

national park, deep in a forest. national park, deep in a forest. >> Are these automatic rifles? >> Are these automatic rifles? >> Are these automatic rifles? >> They certainly are, yeah. >> They certainly are, yeah. >> They certainly are, yeah. >> Richard Lewis is with the British >> Richard Lewis is with the British >> Richard Lewis is with the British conservation group Durrell, which runs conservation group Durrell, which runs conservation group Durrell, which runs this refuge and breeding center. this refuge and breeding center. this refuge and breeding center. >> Be careful of the youngsters here. >> Be careful of the youngsters here. >> Be careful of the youngsters here. >> They're all over the place. >> They're all over the place. >> They're all over the place. >> Yeah, just be careful. >> Yeah, just be careful. >> Yeah, just be careful. >> some. >> some. >> some. >> Watch where you step and then come on >> Watch where you step and then come on >> Watch where you step and then come on over. These are all adult males. over. These are all adult males. over. These are all adult males. >> Look at them. Do you know how old they >> Look at them. Do you know how old they >> Look at them. Do you know how old they are? are? are? >> This could be 50 years old, 100 years >> This could be 50 years old, 100 years >> This could be 50 years old, 100 years old, 150, 200 years old. old, 150, 200 years old. old, 150, 200 years old. >> I mean, this is the longest-lived animal >> I mean, this is the longest-lived animal >> I mean, this is the longest-lived animal on the planet. on the planet. on the planet. >> Their longevity is one of the reasons >> Their longevity is one of the reasons >> Their longevity is one of the reasons they're so valuable. Asian collectors they're so valuable. Asian collectors they're so valuable. Asian collectors believe owning one confers long life on believe owning one confers long life on believe owning one confers long life on them. them. them. The black market trade is now so The black market trade is now so The black market trade is now so lucrative that crime syndicates are lucrative that crime syndicates are lucrative that crime syndicates are involved. The center was robbed in the involved. The center was robbed in the involved. The center was robbed in the late 1990s in what was called one of the late 1990s in what was called one of the late 1990s in what was called one of the heists of the century. heists of the century. heists of the century. >> So, people actually broke into this >> So, people actually broke into this >> So, people actually broke into this compound, the breeding center, with all compound, the breeding center, with all compound, the breeding center, with all the security and stole the security and stole the security and stole >> 75 youngsters and two adults. They stole >> 75 youngsters and two adults. They stole >> 75 youngsters and two adults. They stole At that moment in time, it was half of At that moment in time, it was half of At that moment in time, it was half of our half of the youngsters we've had our half of the youngsters we've had our half of the youngsters we've had we'd ever bred.

we'd ever bred. we'd ever bred. >> Since then, with the help of Arak good, >> Since then, with the help of Arak good, >> Since then, with the help of Arak good, the population of ploughshares here has the population of ploughshares here has the population of ploughshares here has rebounded. rebounded. rebounded. >> This is the female enclosure. >> This is the female enclosure. >> This is the female enclosure. >> These girls are responsible for >> These girls are responsible for >> These girls are responsible for producing 300 offspring, 300 animals producing 300 offspring, 300 animals producing 300 offspring, 300 animals that you're looking at in this entire that you're looking at in this entire that you're looking at in this entire enclosure. enclosure. enclosure. >> Very few people have ever seen them >> Very few people have ever seen them >> Very few people have ever seen them actually produce offspring even here. actually produce offspring even here. actually produce offspring even here. But as we were just about to leave, one But as we were just about to leave, one But as we were just about to leave, one of the females wandered off and to of the females wandered off and to of the females wandered off and to everyone's surprise, began to dig a nest everyone's surprise, began to dig a nest everyone's surprise, began to dig a nest for laying eggs. Richard, for laying eggs. Richard, for laying eggs. Richard, >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> have you ever seen this before? >> have you ever seen this before? >> have you ever seen this before? >> No. >> No. >> No. >> You have never seen >> You have never seen >> You have never seen >> me personally, no. It's the luck of the >> me personally, no. It's the luck of the >> me personally, no. It's the luck of the draw, as it were. draw, as it were. draw, as it were. >> Being a tortoise, the work was very slow >> Being a tortoise, the work was very slow >> Being a tortoise, the work was very slow and very plodding. and very plodding. and very plodding. >> Yeah, it's remarkable. You think those >> Yeah, it's remarkable. You think those >> Yeah, it's remarkable. You think those legs are just these stubby elephantine legs are just these stubby elephantine legs are just these stubby elephantine feet, but they're very good at cupping feet, but they're very good at cupping feet, but they're very good at cupping the soil, the soil, the soil, digging this incredible little hole. digging this incredible little hole. digging this incredible little hole. >> Yeah, she could be what? 60, 70 years >> Yeah, she could be what? 60, 70 years >> Yeah, she could be what? 60, 70 years old? old? old? >> Yeah, 100 years old. >> Yeah, 100 years old. >> Yeah, 100 years old. >> It took her almost an hour, and then >> It took her almost an hour, and then >> It took her almost an hour, and then >> Oh, there's the egg.

>> Oh, there's the egg. >> Oh, there's the egg. >> Oh my god. >> Oh my god. >> Oh my god. Oh my god. Is she going to do another Oh my god. Is she going to do another Oh my god. Is she going to do another one? one? one? >> Yep, yep. Oh, there it goes. >> Yep, yep. Oh, there it goes. >> Yep, yep. Oh, there it goes. There it goes. There it goes. There it goes. Ooh, number two. Ooh, number two. Ooh, number two. This is what you work for. And even more This is what you work for. And even more This is what you work for. And even more so when the little tortoise, when the so when the little tortoise, when the so when the little tortoise, when the hatchling comes out it is you feel like hatchling comes out it is you feel like hatchling comes out it is you feel like you've broken a secret code. you've broken a secret code. you've broken a secret code. >> Good wants to emulate this kind of >> Good wants to emulate this kind of >> Good wants to emulate this kind of success back in the United States with success back in the United States with success back in the United States with not just plowshares, but dozens of other not just plowshares, but dozens of other not just plowshares, but dozens of other species. He has his own breeding center species. He has his own breeding center species. He has his own breeding center in the mountains outside of Los Angeles in the mountains outside of Los Angeles in the mountains outside of Los Angeles that he began with 150 turtles and that he began with 150 turtles and that he began with 150 turtles and tortoises given to him for safekeeping tortoises given to him for safekeeping tortoises given to him for safekeeping by the Bronx Zoo. by the Bronx Zoo. by the Bronx Zoo. >> They were trucked across the United >> They were trucked across the United >> They were trucked across the United States and they were the first guests in States and they were the first guests in States and they were the first guests in my tortoise hotel. my tortoise hotel. my tortoise hotel. >> Each species is pampered like a guest at >> Each species is pampered like a guest at >> Each species is pampered like a guest at one of Good's hotels with fresh-cut one of Good's hotels with fresh-cut one of Good's hotels with fresh-cut flowers, salad greens, and a tortoise flowers, salad greens, and a tortoise flowers, salad greens, and a tortoise smoothie blended with organic milk. smoothie blended with organic milk. smoothie blended with organic milk. >> Each species needs a different >> Each species needs a different >> Each species needs a different ecosystem. Like this tortoise for ecosystem. Like this tortoise for ecosystem. Like this tortoise for example is from Burma and this is example is from Burma and this is example is from Burma and this is biologically extinct in the wild. And biologically extinct in the wild. And biologically extinct in the wild. And these guys need to be kept warm and uh these guys need to be kept warm and uh these guys need to be kept warm and uh very high humidity.

very high humidity. very high humidity. >> He now has 680 animals from 30 >> He now has 680 animals from 30 >> He now has 680 animals from 30 endangered species. endangered species. endangered species. >> This is a turtle from India and >> This is a turtle from India and >> This is a turtle from India and Bangladesh maybe a little bit into Bangladesh maybe a little bit into Bangladesh maybe a little bit into Pakistan. Pakistan. Pakistan. >> And these turtles that elsewhere would >> And these turtles that elsewhere would >> And these turtles that elsewhere would be on the menu. be on the menu. be on the menu. >> It's called the golden coin turtle. >> It's called the golden coin turtle. >> It's called the golden coin turtle. Probably one of the top 25 most Probably one of the top 25 most Probably one of the top 25 most endangered turtles in the world. endangered turtles in the world. endangered turtles in the world. >> And young Galapagos tortoises that'll >> And young Galapagos tortoises that'll >> And young Galapagos tortoises that'll grow to 400 lb. grow to 400 lb. grow to 400 lb. >> These were bred in Texas at a zoo and >> These were bred in Texas at a zoo and >> These were bred in Texas at a zoo and they've been raised here. they've been raised here. they've been raised here. >> Don't come for my toes, but Eric Goode >> Don't come for my toes, but Eric Goode >> Don't come for my toes, but Eric Goode says he doesn't want any of his guests says he doesn't want any of his guests says he doesn't want any of his guests to stay too long. to stay too long. to stay too long. >> Ideally, we'd like to send these animals >> Ideally, we'd like to send these animals >> Ideally, we'd like to send these animals back to the to the wild. back to the to the wild. back to the to the wild. >> Why would you send them back? There >> Why would you send them back? There >> Why would you send them back? There there's no protection for them there's no protection for them there's no protection for them back in the wild. back in the wild. back in the wild. >> It may be too soon to send a lot of them >> It may be too soon to send a lot of them >> It may be too soon to send a lot of them back. back. back. >> And can you? >> And can you? >> And can you? I mean, let's be realistic. I mean, let's be realistic. I mean, let's be realistic. >> I don't know yet, but I think it's >> I don't know yet, but I think it's >> I don't know yet, but I think it's important to show that we're not just important to show that we're not just important to show that we're not just bringing animals into captivity and bringing animals into captivity and bringing animals into captivity and keeping them there forever. keeping them there forever. keeping them there forever. >> For now, he's fulfilling his dream by >> For now, he's fulfilling his dream by >> For now, he's fulfilling his dream by protecting 11 plowshares and trying to protecting 11 plowshares and trying to protecting 11 plowshares and trying to breed more.

breed more. breed more. Last year, he hatched 250 other Last year, he hatched 250 other Last year, he hatched 250 other tortoises and turtles. tortoises and turtles. tortoises and turtles. Eric Goode is like Noah, building a safe Eric Goode is like Noah, building a safe Eric Goode is like Noah, building a safe haven for in some cases the last of haven for in some cases the last of haven for in some cases the last of these animals on Earth. There's something about dinosaurs that There's something about dinosaurs that captures the imagination. Giant, captures the imagination. Giant, captures the imagination. Giant, mysterious animals that roam the earth mysterious animals that roam the earth mysterious animals that roam the earth for millions of years, now gone forever. for millions of years, now gone forever. for millions of years, now gone forever. All they've left us are their fossils, All they've left us are their fossils, All they've left us are their fossils, the dried-out mineral remnants of the the dried-out mineral remnants of the the dried-out mineral remnants of the creatures they once were with the creatures they once were with the creatures they once were with the organic material that gave them life organic material that gave them life organic material that gave them life long gone. long gone. long gone. Or so everyone always thought, until Or so everyone always thought, until Or so everyone always thought, until B-Rex, a 68-million-year-old B-Rex, a 68-million-year-old B-Rex, a 68-million-year-old Tyrannosaurus Rex who was dug up and Tyrannosaurus Rex who was dug up and Tyrannosaurus Rex who was dug up and named by a paleontologist from Montana named by a paleontologist from Montana named by a paleontologist from Montana State University, whose unorthodox State University, whose unorthodox State University, whose unorthodox approach to dinosaurs may be changing approach to dinosaurs may be changing approach to dinosaurs may be changing the whole dino ball game.

Think dinosaur and most of us think Think dinosaur and most of us think this. this. this. The 1993 classic film Jurassic Park with The 1993 classic film Jurassic Park with The 1993 classic film Jurassic Park with its dinosaur resurrection experiment its dinosaur resurrection experiment its dinosaur resurrection experiment gone wrong and its embattled hero, famed gone wrong and its embattled hero, famed gone wrong and its embattled hero, famed paleontologist Alan Grant. paleontologist Alan Grant. paleontologist Alan Grant. >> You consulted on that movie. >> You consulted on that movie. >> You consulted on that movie. >> consult on the all those movies. >> consult on the all those movies. >> consult on the all those movies. >> that the guy Alan Grant was you. >> that the guy Alan Grant was you. >> that the guy Alan Grant was you. >> Yes. Yeah, well, fortunately I didn't >> Yes. Yeah, well, fortunately I didn't >> Yes. Yeah, well, fortunately I didn't get eaten. get eaten. get eaten. >> Meet Jack Horner, the real-life Alan >> Meet Jack Horner, the real-life Alan >> Meet Jack Horner, the real-life Alan Grant. He's one of the most prominent Grant. He's one of the most prominent Grant. He's one of the most prominent and controversial paleontologist in the and controversial paleontologist in the and controversial paleontologist in the country. A dyslexic MacArthur Foundation country. A dyslexic MacArthur Foundation country. A dyslexic MacArthur Foundation genius who never finished college and genius who never finished college and genius who never finished college and who says he doesn't care why dinosaurs who says he doesn't care why dinosaurs who says he doesn't care why dinosaurs went extinct. To him, the important part went extinct. To him, the important part went extinct. To him, the important part is how they lived. is how they lived. is how they lived. >> I'm trying to figure out the biology of >> I'm trying to figure out the biology of >> I'm trying to figure out the biology of of dinosaurs and what they were like as of dinosaurs and what they were like as of dinosaurs and what they were like as living creatures. living creatures. living creatures. >> You want to know what their behavior >> You want to know what their behavior >> You want to know what their behavior was, how they treated their young. was, how they treated their young. was, how they treated their young. >> I want to know everything we can know >> I want to know everything we can know >> I want to know everything we can know about them and about them and about them and make one if we can. make one if we can. make one if we can. >> Make a dinosaur? The things Jack Horner >> Make a dinosaur? The things Jack Horner >> Make a dinosaur? The things Jack Horner says make him a maverick, but the finds says make him a maverick, but the finds says make him a maverick, but the finds he's made, including more T-Rexes than he's made, including more T-Rexes than he's made, including more T-Rexes than anyone else in the world, make him a anyone else in the world, make him a anyone else in the world, make him a legend.

legend. legend. >> can tell me what these are. >> Oh my gosh. Are these teeth? >> Oh my gosh. Are these teeth? >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Look at that. And not just any teeth, >> Look at that. And not just any teeth, >> Look at that. And not just any teeth, the teeth of the oldest T-Rex ever the teeth of the oldest T-Rex ever the teeth of the oldest T-Rex ever found. found. found. >> This little pocket right here in the >> This little pocket right here in the >> This little pocket right here in the teeth is where the next tooth sits. teeth is where the next tooth sits. teeth is where the next tooth sits. Dinosaurs replace their teeth throughout Dinosaurs replace their teeth throughout Dinosaurs replace their teeth throughout their life and T-Rex replace it all of their life and T-Rex replace it all of their life and T-Rex replace it all of their teeth every year. their teeth every year. their teeth every year. Here you can see that the jaw. Here you can see that the jaw. Here you can see that the jaw. >> But Horner is most famous for >> But Horner is most famous for >> But Horner is most famous for discovering a kinder, gentler side of discovering a kinder, gentler side of discovering a kinder, gentler side of dinosaurs. dinosaurs. dinosaurs. >> that. >> that. >> that. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Here in the badlands of Montana, he and >> Here in the badlands of Montana, he and >> Here in the badlands of Montana, he and his team uncovered the first dinosaur his team uncovered the first dinosaur his team uncovered the first dinosaur nesting ground in the world. A vast nesting ground in the world. A vast nesting ground in the world. A vast landscape of eggs, nests, and babies landscape of eggs, nests, and babies landscape of eggs, nests, and babies that helped change our image of that helped change our image of that helped change our image of dinosaurs. dinosaurs. dinosaurs. Thanks to Horner's influence, Jurassic Thanks to Horner's influence, Jurassic Thanks to Horner's influence, Jurassic Park showed that most dinosaurs were Park showed that most dinosaurs were Park showed that most dinosaurs were social animals who lived in colonies and social animals who lived in colonies and social animals who lived in colonies and he's found evidence they actually cared he's found evidence they actually cared he's found evidence they actually cared for their young. for their young. for their young. >> This is the tibia, the shin bone. >> This is the tibia, the shin bone. >> This is the tibia, the shin bone. >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> And this is a little less than a month >> And this is a little less than a month >> And this is a little less than a month old.

old. old. But in here But in here But in here here is the same bone here is the same bone here is the same bone >> of an adult? >> of an adult? >> of an adult? >> of a 1-year-old. >> of a 1-year-old. >> of a 1-year-old. >> A 1-year-old? >> A 1-year-old? >> A 1-year-old? Horner figured out that such rapidly Horner figured out that such rapidly Horner figured out that such rapidly growing baby dinosaurs couldn't walk at growing baby dinosaurs couldn't walk at growing baby dinosaurs couldn't walk at first, meaning that their parents were first, meaning that their parents were first, meaning that their parents were bringing food back to them in the nest bringing food back to them in the nest bringing food back to them in the nest like birds. His discoveries lend support like birds. His discoveries lend support like birds. His discoveries lend support to a then controversial but now widely to a then controversial but now widely to a then controversial but now widely accepted theory that dinosaurs actually accepted theory that dinosaurs actually accepted theory that dinosaurs actually gave rise gave rise gave rise to modern birds. to modern birds. to modern birds. If a little kid today studies all this If a little kid today studies all this If a little kid today studies all this in school and they look up in the sky in school and they look up in the sky in school and they look up in the sky and see a bird and turn to mom and say, and see a bird and turn to mom and say, and see a bird and turn to mom and say, "You know, that's a dinosaur." "You know, that's a dinosaur." "You know, that's a dinosaur." >> They're right. >> They're right. >> They're right. >> They're right? >> They're right? >> They're right? >> They're right. >> They're right. >> They're right. >> Jack Horner told us that birds are >> Jack Horner told us that birds are >> Jack Horner told us that birds are dinosaurs. Do you agree with that? dinosaurs. Do you agree with that? dinosaurs. Do you agree with that? >> Absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> Sean Carroll is a professor of molecular >> Sean Carroll is a professor of molecular >> Sean Carroll is a professor of molecular biology and genetics at the University biology and genetics at the University biology and genetics at the University of Wisconsin. of Wisconsin. of Wisconsin. >> So, really dinosaurs never went extinct. >> So, really dinosaurs never went extinct. >> So, really dinosaurs never went extinct. >> Dinosaurs never went extinct, but we all >> Dinosaurs never went extinct, but we all >> Dinosaurs never went extinct, but we all think they did.

think they did. think they did. >> There was an asteroid event that took >> There was an asteroid event that took >> There was an asteroid event that took out a lot of life on Earth including out a lot of life on Earth including out a lot of life on Earth including T-Rex and all the most famous dinosaurs, T-Rex and all the most famous dinosaurs, T-Rex and all the most famous dinosaurs, but this other group, what we call but this other group, what we call but this other group, what we call birds, made it through and as course birds, made it through and as course birds, made it through and as course there's thousands of species of birds there's thousands of species of birds there's thousands of species of birds still around today. still around today. still around today. >> The dinosaur-bird connection is largely >> The dinosaur-bird connection is largely >> The dinosaur-bird connection is largely settled now, but that hasn't stopped settled now, but that hasn't stopped settled now, but that hasn't stopped Horner from using unusual means to make Horner from using unusual means to make Horner from using unusual means to make unusual discoveries. And he's found the unusual discoveries. And he's found the unusual discoveries. And he's found the perfect partner in his protégé Mary perfect partner in his protégé Mary perfect partner in his protégé Mary Schweitzer, a professor at North Schweitzer, a professor at North Schweitzer, a professor at North Carolina State University who studies Carolina State University who studies Carolina State University who studies the internal makeup of ancient bone. She the internal makeup of ancient bone. She the internal makeup of ancient bone. She let us in on the paleontologist trick let us in on the paleontologist trick let us in on the paleontologist trick for telling dinosaur bone from rock. You for telling dinosaur bone from rock. You for telling dinosaur bone from rock. You don't just look at it. don't just look at it. don't just look at it. >> Touch your tongue to that. >> Touch your tongue to that. >> Touch your tongue to that. >> She actually wanted me to lick it. >> She actually wanted me to lick it. >> She actually wanted me to lick it. >> It's supposed to stick like Velcro. >> It's supposed to stick like Velcro. >> It's supposed to stick like Velcro. >> Uh. >> Uh. >> Uh. It did. It did. It did. >> That's bone. That's how you can tell. >> That's bone. That's how you can tell. >> That's bone. That's how you can tell. >> Yeah. Because the bone is filled with >> Yeah. Because the bone is filled with >> Yeah. Because the bone is filled with with little capillaries. And when you with little capillaries. And when you with little capillaries. And when you put your tongue on it, the moisture from put your tongue on it, the moisture from put your tongue on it, the moisture from your tongue sucks up the capillaries.

your tongue sucks up the capillaries. your tongue sucks up the capillaries. >> This is 80 million years old and it can >> This is 80 million years old and it can >> This is 80 million years old and it can do that? do that? do that? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Oh my god. >> Oh my god. >> Oh my god. >> Rocks don't do that. >> Rocks don't do that. >> Rocks don't do that. >> The tricky thing about Schweitzer's work >> The tricky thing about Schweitzer's work >> The tricky thing about Schweitzer's work is that she needs to get her hands on is that she needs to get her hands on is that she needs to get her hands on the insides of dinosaur bones, which the insides of dinosaur bones, which the insides of dinosaur bones, which means literally breaking the bones apart means literally breaking the bones apart means literally breaking the bones apart and sometimes dissolving pieces of them and sometimes dissolving pieces of them and sometimes dissolving pieces of them in acid. Most paleontologists won't let in acid. Most paleontologists won't let in acid. Most paleontologists won't let her near their precious finds. her near their precious finds. her near their precious finds. >> Jack is the only paleontologist out >> Jack is the only paleontologist out >> Jack is the only paleontologist out there who lets me dissolve his there who lets me dissolve his there who lets me dissolve his dinosaurs. dinosaurs. dinosaurs. >> Dissolve his dinosaurs? You mean ruin >> Dissolve his dinosaurs? You mean ruin >> Dissolve his dinosaurs? You mean ruin them? them? them? >> Well, isn't that considered a little >> Well, isn't that considered a little >> Well, isn't that considered a little sacrilegious to take one of these sacrilegious to take one of these sacrilegious to take one of these precious artifacts, fossils that have precious artifacts, fossils that have precious artifacts, fossils that have been in the ground for 68 million years been in the ground for 68 million years been in the ground for 68 million years and and and crack it in half? crack it in half? crack it in half? >> We found the first dinosaur embryos. >> We found the first dinosaur embryos. >> We found the first dinosaur embryos. The first babies inside of eggs. And The first babies inside of eggs. And The first babies inside of eggs. And that was just from breaking eggs open that was just from breaking eggs open that was just from breaking eggs open and looking inside. I mean, people had and looking inside. I mean, people had and looking inside. I mean, people had always thought that eggs were so always thought that eggs were so always thought that eggs were so precious, they didn't want to break them precious, they didn't want to break them precious, they didn't want to break them and look inside. And yet, they're like and look inside. And yet, they're like and look inside. And yet, they're like presents. presents. presents. You know, I mean, it's like having a You know, I mean, it's like having a You know, I mean, it's like having a Christmas present and never unwrapping Christmas present and never unwrapping Christmas present and never unwrapping it. it. it. >> Did you ever though have a moment where >> Did you ever though have a moment where >> Did you ever though have a moment where it was kind of heartbreaking? I'm it was kind of heartbreaking? I'm it was kind of heartbreaking? I'm destroying Never.

destroying Never. destroying Never. >> No, glue is cheap. >> No, glue is cheap. >> No, glue is cheap. >> Horner's practice of breaking dinosaur >> Horner's practice of breaking dinosaur >> Horner's practice of breaking dinosaur bones apart and sending the insides to bones apart and sending the insides to bones apart and sending the insides to Mary Schweitzer has landed the two of Mary Schweitzer has landed the two of Mary Schweitzer has landed the two of them at the center of one of the biggest them at the center of one of the biggest them at the center of one of the biggest controversies paleontology has seen in controversies paleontology has seen in controversies paleontology has seen in years. years. years. It started back in 2000 with a series of It started back in 2000 with a series of It started back in 2000 with a series of coincidences. coincidences. coincidences. A member of Jack's team, Bob Harmon, A member of Jack's team, Bob Harmon, A member of Jack's team, Bob Harmon, wandered away from a dig site one day to wandered away from a dig site one day to wandered away from a dig site one day to eat lunch and noticed a small piece of eat lunch and noticed a small piece of eat lunch and noticed a small piece of bone sticking out of the side of a 50-ft bone sticking out of the side of a 50-ft bone sticking out of the side of a 50-ft cliff. cliff. cliff. >> I could tell pretty much what it was >> I could tell pretty much what it was >> I could tell pretty much what it was from where I was sitting that from where I was sitting that from where I was sitting that it was a T-Rex metatarsal. it was a T-Rex metatarsal. it was a T-Rex metatarsal. >> How was it sticking out? You mean it was >> How was it sticking out? You mean it was >> How was it sticking out? You mean it was a side Here's a cliff. It was like a a side Here's a cliff. It was like a a side Here's a cliff. It was like a little jutting out? little jutting out? little jutting out? >> Yep, exactly. >> Yep, exactly. >> Yep, exactly. >> He got a folding chair and he stacked it >> He got a folding chair and he stacked it >> He got a folding chair and he stacked it on these rocks right there. And you can on these rocks right there. And you can on these rocks right there. And you can see that this is on the sheer side hill see that this is on the sheer side hill see that this is on the sheer side hill of a cliff. of a cliff. of a cliff. >> This is not possible. Is he attached to >> This is not possible. Is he attached to >> This is not possible. Is he attached to anything? anything? anything? >> No, he's not. That's Bob. >> No, he's not. That's Bob. >> No, he's not. That's Bob. >> Jack named the T-Rex B-Rex in Bob's >> Jack named the T-Rex B-Rex in Bob's >> Jack named the T-Rex B-Rex in Bob's honor and made the decision to dig it honor and made the decision to dig it honor and made the decision to dig it out.

out. out. >> But this was under 50 ft of rock. I >> But this was under 50 ft of rock. I >> But this was under 50 ft of rock. I mean, this was in a terrible place. mean, this was in a terrible place. mean, this was in a terrible place. There was no road to it. There was no There was no road to it. There was no There was no road to it. There was no access to it. And so for the next three access to it. And so for the next three access to it. And so for the next three summers, we sent out climbing crews, summers, we sent out climbing crews, summers, we sent out climbing crews, people that could rappel down cliffs people that could rappel down cliffs people that could rappel down cliffs with jackhammers. I mean, it was a with jackhammers. I mean, it was a with jackhammers. I mean, it was a horrendous undertaking. horrendous undertaking. horrendous undertaking. >> The site was so remote that bones had to >> The site was so remote that bones had to >> The site was so remote that bones had to be lifted out by helicopter. But the be lifted out by helicopter. But the be lifted out by helicopter. But the giant cast containing B-Rex's thigh giant cast containing B-Rex's thigh giant cast containing B-Rex's thigh bones was too heavy. The chopper bones was too heavy. The chopper bones was too heavy. The chopper couldn't get it off the ground. So after couldn't get it off the ground. So after couldn't get it off the ground. So after all that excavating, Jack gave the order all that excavating, Jack gave the order all that excavating, Jack gave the order to cut one of B-Rex's femurs in two. to cut one of B-Rex's femurs in two. to cut one of B-Rex's femurs in two. >> Now that was heartbreaking. >> Now that was heartbreaking. >> Now that was heartbreaking. >> No, well, not really. I mean, >> No, well, not really. I mean, >> No, well, not really. I mean, get a chance to see inside. get a chance to see inside. get a chance to see inside. >> He shipped the bone fragments that fell >> He shipped the bone fragments that fell >> He shipped the bone fragments that fell out to Mary Schweitzer. out to Mary Schweitzer. out to Mary Schweitzer. >> So the first piece I pulled out, I >> So the first piece I pulled out, I >> So the first piece I pulled out, I picked it up and I looked at it and I picked it up and I looked at it and I picked it up and I looked at it and I said, said, said, "It's a girl and it's pregnant." "It's a girl and it's pregnant." "It's a girl and it's pregnant." >> That's the first time as I understand it >> That's the first time as I understand it >> That's the first time as I understand it that anyone had ever been able to that anyone had ever been able to that anyone had ever been able to identify gender in any dinosaur.

identify gender in any dinosaur. identify gender in any dinosaur. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Mary recognized a specific type of bone >> Mary recognized a specific type of bone >> Mary recognized a specific type of bone called medullary bone, which female called medullary bone, which female called medullary bone, which female birds produce when they're about to lay birds produce when they're about to lay birds produce when they're about to lay eggs. No one had ever found it before in eggs. No one had ever found it before in eggs. No one had ever found it before in a dinosaur. It was yet another link to a dinosaur. It was yet another link to a dinosaur. It was yet another link to birds and it meant that B-Rex was birds and it meant that B-Rex was birds and it meant that B-Rex was definitely no Bob. definitely no Bob. definitely no Bob. >> So she calls you up and she says >> So she calls you up and she says >> So she calls you up and she says >> Calls up and says, "We have medullary >> Calls up and says, "We have medullary >> Calls up and says, "We have medullary bone." bone." bone." >> Oh. Now this had to be thrilling. >> Oh. Now this had to be thrilling. >> Oh. Now this had to be thrilling. >> Yes, very exciting. >> Yes, very exciting. >> Yes, very exciting. And that wasn't all. And that wasn't all. And that wasn't all. >> What happened next happened by mistake. >> What happened next happened by mistake. >> What happened next happened by mistake. Mary put some fragments of the bone in Mary put some fragments of the bone in Mary put some fragments of the bone in acid to dissolve away the outermost acid to dissolve away the outermost acid to dissolve away the outermost layer of mineral, but the acid worked layer of mineral, but the acid worked layer of mineral, but the acid worked too fast and all the mineral dissolved too fast and all the mineral dissolved too fast and all the mineral dissolved away. Being a fossil, there should have away. Being a fossil, there should have away. Being a fossil, there should have been nothing left, but there was and it been nothing left, but there was and it been nothing left, but there was and it was elastic like living tissue. was elastic like living tissue. was elastic like living tissue. >> This is the piece. >> This is the piece. >> This is the piece. >> No. >> No. >> No. >> She showed us video she took under the >> She showed us video she took under the >> She showed us video she took under the microscope. microscope. microscope. >> That's really what happened? >> That's really what happened? >> That's really what happened? >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> That's the dinosaur bone?

>> That's the dinosaur bone? >> That's the dinosaur bone? >> mineral now. That's what was left. >> mineral now. That's what was left. >> mineral now. That's what was left. >> It looked like the soft tissue she would >> It looked like the soft tissue she would >> It looked like the soft tissue she would have expected to find if it had been have expected to find if it had been have expected to find if it had been modern bone. This was impossible. This modern bone. This was impossible. This modern bone. This was impossible. This bone was 68 million years old. bone was 68 million years old. bone was 68 million years old. >> So you see this >> So you see this >> So you see this and you think what? and you think what? and you think what? >> I didn't want to tell anybody. >> I didn't want to tell anybody. >> I didn't want to tell anybody. >> You'd be ridiculed, right? >> You'd be ridiculed, right? >> You'd be ridiculed, right? >> And so I I said to my technician, okay, >> And so I I said to my technician, okay, >> And so I I said to my technician, okay, do it again. I don't believe it. do it again. I don't believe it. do it again. I don't believe it. >> And yet in sample after sample, they >> And yet in sample after sample, they >> And yet in sample after sample, they were there. Things that look were there. Things that look were there. Things that look suspiciously like flexible, transparent suspiciously like flexible, transparent suspiciously like flexible, transparent blood vessels. She finally mustered the blood vessels. She finally mustered the blood vessels. She finally mustered the courage to tell Jack. courage to tell Jack. courage to tell Jack. >> She said she dissolved the bone away and >> She said she dissolved the bone away and >> She said she dissolved the bone away and there were blood vessels and, you know, there were blood vessels and, you know, there were blood vessels and, you know, I was like shocked. I was like shocked. I was like shocked. >> How could that be? >> How could that be? >> How could that be? >> How could that be? That's right. >> How could that be? That's right. >> How could that be? That's right. >> The things Mary was finding inside >> The things Mary was finding inside >> The things Mary was finding inside dinosaur bones, dinosaur bones, dinosaur bones, >> Look at that. >> Look at that. >> Look at that. >> blood vessels and even what seemed to be >> blood vessels and even what seemed to be >> blood vessels and even what seemed to be intact cells, pose a radical challenge intact cells, pose a radical challenge intact cells, pose a radical challenge to the existing rules of science that to the existing rules of science that to the existing rules of science that organic material can't possibly survive organic material can't possibly survive organic material can't possibly survive even a million years, let alone 68 even a million years, let alone 68 even a million years, let alone 68 million. Mary, Jack, and their team million. Mary, Jack, and their team million. Mary, Jack, and their team published their B-Rex findings in a published their B-Rex findings in a published their B-Rex findings in a series of papers in the journal Science series of papers in the journal Science series of papers in the journal Science and were promptly attacked. Critics said and were promptly attacked. Critics said and were promptly attacked. Critics said their samples might have been their samples might have been their samples might have been contaminated or that the supposed blood contaminated or that the supposed blood contaminated or that the supposed blood vessels were actually something called vessels were actually something called vessels were actually something called biofilm, a type of slime.

biofilm, a type of slime. biofilm, a type of slime. But as Mary showed us, she's been able But as Mary showed us, she's been able But as Mary showed us, she's been able to replicate her findings. These are to replicate her findings. These are to replicate her findings. These are pieces of an even older dinosaur, a pieces of an even older dinosaur, a pieces of an even older dinosaur, a well-preserved 80-million-year-old well-preserved 80-million-year-old well-preserved 80-million-year-old duckbill. When she dissolved it away in duckbill. When she dissolved it away in duckbill. When she dissolved it away in acid, acid, acid, >> Let's put this under the scope here. >> Let's put this under the scope here. >> Let's put this under the scope here. >> Well, look. Is that a blood vessel? >> Well, look. Is that a blood vessel? >> Well, look. Is that a blood vessel? >> blood vessel. You see the branches right >> blood vessel. You see the branches right >> blood vessel. You see the branches right there? And look at all of them. And it's there? And look at all of them. And it's there? And look at all of them. And it's so consistent. Over and over and over so consistent. Over and over and over so consistent. Over and over and over again, we do this bone and it comes out again, we do this bone and it comes out again, we do this bone and it comes out and I get excited every time. I can't and I get excited every time. I can't and I get excited every time. I can't help it. I mean, 80 million years old. help it. I mean, 80 million years old. help it. I mean, 80 million years old. >> Mary published her new results last >> Mary published her new results last >> Mary published her new results last spring. And while some of her critics spring. And while some of her critics spring. And while some of her critics have been swayed, the controversy still have been swayed, the controversy still have been swayed, the controversy still rages. And the stakes are high. If blood rages. And the stakes are high. If blood rages. And the stakes are high. If blood vessels can survive 80 million years, vessels can survive 80 million years, vessels can survive 80 million years, what about DNA? what about DNA? what about DNA? Jack Horner is looking. Jack Horner is looking. Jack Horner is looking. His crews are now wearing surgical His crews are now wearing surgical His crews are now wearing surgical gloves, unheard of in the world of gloves, unheard of in the world of gloves, unheard of in the world of paleontology, where no one used to worry paleontology, where no one used to worry paleontology, where no one used to worry about getting skin cells, sweat, even an about getting skin cells, sweat, even an about getting skin cells, sweat, even an occasional spilled beer on fossils. Jack occasional spilled beer on fossils. Jack occasional spilled beer on fossils. Jack is skeptical that the full dinosaur DNA is skeptical that the full dinosaur DNA is skeptical that the full dinosaur DNA sequence will ever be found. But, that sequence will ever be found. But, that sequence will ever be found. But, that hasn't stopped him. He's come up with a hasn't stopped him. He's come up with a hasn't stopped him. He's come up with a whole new idea for his dream of making a whole new idea for his dream of making a whole new idea for his dream of making a dinosaur.

dinosaur. dinosaur. >> The best way is just to use a modern >> The best way is just to use a modern >> The best way is just to use a modern dinosaur. dinosaur. dinosaur. The chicken. The chicken. The chicken. Because evolution works. Birds are Because evolution works. Birds are Because evolution works. Birds are actually carrying ancestral DNA. actually carrying ancestral DNA. actually carrying ancestral DNA. >> Horner has written a new book proposing >> Horner has written a new book proposing >> Horner has written a new book proposing a plan to mine that ancestral DNA as a a plan to mine that ancestral DNA as a a plan to mine that ancestral DNA as a way to reverse engineer a chicken into way to reverse engineer a chicken into way to reverse engineer a chicken into what he calls a dino chicken. It may what he calls a dino chicken. It may what he calls a dino chicken. It may seem improbable that this is carrying seem improbable that this is carrying seem improbable that this is carrying DNA from something like this. But, when DNA from something like this. But, when DNA from something like this. But, when you think about it, birds, like the you think about it, birds, like the you think about it, birds, like the dinosaurs they evolve from, still walk dinosaurs they evolve from, still walk dinosaurs they evolve from, still walk on hind legs. Most have three toes on hind legs. Most have three toes on hind legs. Most have three toes pointing forward with one in the back. pointing forward with one in the back. pointing forward with one in the back. And they even all have wishbones. As for And they even all have wishbones. As for And they even all have wishbones. As for dinosaur features you don't see in dinosaur features you don't see in dinosaur features you don't see in modern chickens like long tails, modern chickens like long tails, modern chickens like long tails, Horner's contention is they can be Horner's contention is they can be Horner's contention is they can be brought back since you can still see brought back since you can still see brought back since you can still see them in embryos as little chicks grow. them in embryos as little chicks grow. them in embryos as little chicks grow. >> As the chicken embryo develops it does >> As the chicken embryo develops it does >> As the chicken embryo develops it does develop a fairly long tail before a gene develop a fairly long tail before a gene develop a fairly long tail before a gene kicks on and destroys it. So if we can kicks on and destroys it. So if we can kicks on and destroys it. So if we can stop that gene we theoretically can get stop that gene we theoretically can get stop that gene we theoretically can get a chicken to hatch out with a relatively a chicken to hatch out with a relatively a chicken to hatch out with a relatively long tail.

long tail. long tail. >> So you're not saying actually change the >> So you're not saying actually change the >> So you're not saying actually change the gene. gene. gene. >> It's switching a gene on or switching a >> It's switching a gene on or switching a >> It's switching a gene on or switching a gene off. gene off. gene off. >> He says picture a chicken with a long >> He says picture a chicken with a long >> He says picture a chicken with a long tail, teeth, and little claw-like hands tail, teeth, and little claw-like hands tail, teeth, and little claw-like hands instead of wings. So maybe there will be instead of wings. So maybe there will be instead of wings. So maybe there will be a dino chicken. a dino chicken. a dino chicken. >> I'm sure there'll be a dino chicken. >> I'm sure there'll be a dino chicken. >> I'm sure there'll be a dino chicken. >> You're sure there'll be a dino chicken. >> You're sure there'll be a dino chicken. >> You're sure there'll be a dino chicken. >> I think we'll be able to make a dino >> I think we'll be able to make a dino >> I think we'll be able to make a dino chicken chicken chicken within the next 5 years. within the next 5 years. within the next 5 years. >> Boy, I see a new movie coming out of >> Boy, I see a new movie coming out of >> Boy, I see a new movie coming out of this. this. this. >> This time I could get eaten.