Funded Founder Fridays: E7 Customer Driven Leadership

[snorts] [snorts] and welcome back to Funded Founder and welcome back to Funded Founder and welcome back to Funded Founder Fridays. [clears throat] This is episode Fridays. [clears throat] This is episode Fridays. [clears throat] This is episode seven uh where we'll be talking about seven uh where we'll be talking about seven uh where we'll be talking about customerdriven leadership and how that customerdriven leadership and how that customerdriven leadership and how that relates to investment and general relates to investment and general relates to investment and general narrative of uh a startup. Um, welcome narrative of uh a startup. Um, welcome narrative of uh a startup. Um, welcome again to Funded Founder Fridays, where again to Funded Founder Fridays, where again to Funded Founder Fridays, where every Friday we create space for every Friday we create space for every Friday we create space for founders to ask the oddest questions founders to ask the oddest questions founders to ask the oddest questions about building companies, raising about building companies, raising about building companies, raising capital, leading teams, and navigating capital, leading teams, and navigating capital, leading teams, and navigating the startup journey. I am Roselos, uh, the startup journey. I am Roselos, uh, the startup journey. I am Roselos, uh, CEO and co-founder of Creattopia, Inc., CEO and co-founder of Creattopia, Inc., CEO and co-founder of Creattopia, Inc., where we're centered on exploring the where we're centered on exploring the where we're centered on exploring the relationship between safety and relationship between safety and relationship between safety and creativity. creativity. creativity. >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> We know that without safety, our brain >> We know that without safety, our brain >> We know that without safety, our brain is not capable of creating original is not capable of creating original is not capable of creating original creative thoughts. And we are all about creative thoughts. And we are all about creative thoughts. And we are all about co-creation and what happens when we're co-creation and what happens when we're co-creation and what happens when we're in person co-creating. And my co-host is in person co-creating. And my co-host is in person co-creating. And my co-host is >> my name is Ben Keabati. >> my name is Ben Keabati. >> my name is Ben Keabati. I am the CEO and co-founder of Red Ruby I am the CEO and co-founder of Red Ruby I am the CEO and co-founder of Red Ruby Capital um and Noble Innovative uh Capital um and Noble Innovative uh Capital um and Noble Innovative uh solutions and noble founder and I'm a solutions and noble founder and I'm a solutions and noble founder and I'm a part of something global. Um, and part of something global. Um, and part of something global. Um, and [snorts] today uh we have my uh good [snorts] today uh we have my uh good [snorts] today uh we have my uh good friend Daniel with us. [snorts] friend Daniel with us. [snorts] friend Daniel with us. [snorts] >> Hey man. Hey. Great to great to be here >> Hey man. Hey. Great to great to be here >> Hey man. Hey. Great to great to be here with you guys.

with you guys. with you guys. >> Thanks for being here. Um, so just a >> Thanks for being here. Um, so just a >> Thanks for being here. Um, so just a little bit about Daniel. He helps people little bit about Daniel. He helps people little bit about Daniel. He helps people solve complexity quickly. He focuses and solve complexity quickly. He focuses and solve complexity quickly. He focuses and multiplies the vision of others, helping multiplies the vision of others, helping multiplies the vision of others, helping them to do more more easily for the good them to do more more easily for the good them to do more more easily for the good of the world. His company is called of the world. His company is called of the world. His company is called Business Interrogation and he's open to Business Interrogation and he's open to Business Interrogation and he's open to being asked questions about that um being asked questions about that um being asked questions about that um after during the Q&A or after in the after during the Q&A or after in the after during the Q&A or after in the hangout. Um and he has a book that we'll hangout. Um and he has a book that we'll hangout. Um and he has a book that we'll be talking about later. But welcome. be talking about later. But welcome. be talking about later. But welcome. >> Thank you so much. I'm excited to be >> Thank you so much. I'm excited to be >> Thank you so much. I'm excited to be here. here. here. >> Absolutely. So Daniel and I got >> Absolutely. So Daniel and I got >> Absolutely. So Daniel and I got connected uh with our good friend Scott. connected uh with our good friend Scott. connected uh with our good friend Scott. Scott is a a amazing human being. He's Scott is a a amazing human being. He's Scott is a a amazing human being. He's one of the early uh internet founders one of the early uh internet founders one of the early uh internet founders and he has a really good grasp on and he has a really good grasp on and he has a really good grasp on internet and a startup and and more internet and a startup and and more internet and a startup and and more importantly he cares about humanity and importantly he cares about humanity and importantly he cares about humanity and you know serving others. So Denny and I you know serving others. So Denny and I you know serving others. So Denny and I got connected uh with him and and then got connected uh with him and and then got connected uh with him and and then uh now Daniel is my good friend uh for uh now Daniel is my good friend uh for uh now Daniel is my good friend uh for for for a while uh I think it's almost for for a while uh I think it's almost for for a while uh I think it's almost almost a year right.

almost a year right. almost a year right. >> Yeah. So Daniel, tell us more about, you >> Yeah. So Daniel, tell us more about, you >> Yeah. So Daniel, tell us more about, you know, how we got connected, you know, know, how we got connected, you know, know, how we got connected, you know, how uh how things going on uh with you. how uh how things going on uh with you. how uh how things going on uh with you. >> Yeah, fantastic. So our mutual friend >> Yeah, fantastic. So our mutual friend >> Yeah, fantastic. So our mutual friend Scott is uh one of those visionary Scott is uh one of those visionary Scott is uh one of those visionary uh founders that just has a huge um uh founders that just has a huge um uh founders that just has a huge um vision, built a company that solved a vision, built a company that solved a vision, built a company that solved a unique problem. Uh I won't tell uh unique problem. Uh I won't tell uh unique problem. Uh I won't tell uh Scott's story, but uh let's say Scott's story, but uh let's say Scott's story, but uh let's say everybody who meets Scott's blown away everybody who meets Scott's blown away everybody who meets Scott's blown away by his background. And uh what was very by his background. And uh what was very by his background. And uh what was very interesting about my first conversation interesting about my first conversation interesting about my first conversation with Scott was uh he labeled what I do with Scott was uh he labeled what I do with Scott was uh he labeled what I do for companies. uh as I started to talk for companies. uh as I started to talk for companies. uh as I started to talk to Scott um and you know we connected to Scott um and you know we connected to Scott um and you know we connected originally on kind of a a faith a shared originally on kind of a a faith a shared originally on kind of a a faith a shared faith background and then um he as we faith background and then um he as we faith background and then um he as we started to talk about the things that started to talk about the things that started to talk about the things that we've done one of the things that Scott we've done one of the things that Scott we've done one of the things that Scott mentioned was uh he as I started to mentioned was uh he as I started to mentioned was uh he as I started to describe it he goes oh you're a bounce describe it he goes oh you're a bounce describe it he goes oh you're a bounce head and just just dropped that label on head and just just dropped that label on head and just just dropped that label on me and I'm like I don't know what a me and I'm like I don't know what a me and I'm like I don't know what a bounce head is [laughter] bounce head is [laughter] bounce head is [laughter] uh but I just uh but I just uh but I just >> of a bobblehead >> of a bobblehead >> of a bobblehead >> yeah so one of the things that I do is I >> yeah so one of the things that I do is I >> yeah so one of the things that I do is I sort sort sort uh put together from context uh what uh put together from context uh what uh put together from context uh what happens in complexity. So I basically happens in complexity. So I basically happens in complexity. So I basically reverse engineered and wrote a uh well reverse engineered and wrote a uh well reverse engineered and wrote a uh well first I went to LinkedIn and I I asked first I went to LinkedIn and I I asked first I went to LinkedIn and I I asked LinkedIn uh if they knew what a bounce LinkedIn uh if they knew what a bounce LinkedIn uh if they knew what a bounce head was and 41 people answered no and head was and 41 people answered no and head was and 41 people answered no and none answered yes. So uh you don't get none answered yes. So uh you don't get none answered yes. So uh you don't get pulls like that every day. Uh so I

pulls like that every day. Uh so I pulls like that every day. Uh so I reverse engineered my own definition. reverse engineered my own definition. reverse engineered my own definition. And I gave it to Scott and he said, "Uh, And I gave it to Scott and he said, "Uh, And I gave it to Scott and he said, "Uh, yeah, it's pretty much the best yeah, it's pretty much the best yeah, it's pretty much the best description that I've heard." And and in description that I've heard." And and in description that I've heard." And and in a world where a lot of visionaries, they a world where a lot of visionaries, they a world where a lot of visionaries, they see further than other people can keep see further than other people can keep see further than other people can keep up. and I have the ability to not only up. and I have the ability to not only up. and I have the ability to not only reach the point of their vision, but reach the point of their vision, but reach the point of their vision, but again as as you guys mentioned, focus again as as you guys mentioned, focus again as as you guys mentioned, focus and multiplying that vision um and and multiplying that vision um and and multiplying that vision um and seeing what's really important, where seeing what's really important, where seeing what's really important, where are the key touch points that are are the key touch points that are are the key touch points that are critical and then I can also look critical and then I can also look critical and then I can also look backward to go, okay, there's some backward to go, okay, there's some backward to go, okay, there's some things that aren't connected. uh this things that aren't connected. uh this things that aren't connected. uh this you don't have the foundational you don't have the foundational you don't have the foundational solutions to reach that vision yet but solutions to reach that vision yet but solutions to reach that vision yet but here's some steps that you would have to here's some steps that you would have to here's some steps that you would have to go through to reverse engineer your go through to reverse engineer your go through to reverse engineer your success. success. success. >> So I can see kind of to have capability >> So I can see kind of to have capability >> So I can see kind of to have capability D you need you know capability C and to D you need you know capability C and to D you need you know capability C and to have that you need B and then A and and have that you need B and then A and and have that you need B and then A and and so I I'm able to kind of pull together so I I'm able to kind of pull together so I I'm able to kind of pull together uh loose threads from people who are uh loose threads from people who are uh loose threads from people who are seeing further than other people and seeing further than other people and seeing further than other people and across multiple domains as well. I've across multiple domains as well. I've across multiple domains as well. I've I've worked I've worked I've worked sure you're welcome to interrogate me sure you're welcome to interrogate me sure you're welcome to interrogate me about my background, but I wasn't about my background, but I wasn't about my background, but I wasn't interrogated.

interrogated. interrogated. >> Yeah. Share share as much as you as >> Yeah. Share share as much as you as >> Yeah. Share share as much as you as you'd like uh with just the different you'd like uh with just the different you'd like uh with just the different types of companies and projects or types of companies and projects or types of companies and projects or whatever ideas that you've worked with. whatever ideas that you've worked with. whatever ideas that you've worked with. >> Yeah. Uh so >> Yeah. Uh so >> Yeah. Uh so >> what that looks like. >> what that looks like. >> what that looks like. >> Yeah, [laughter] I'll be respectful of >> Yeah, [laughter] I'll be respectful of >> Yeah, [laughter] I'll be respectful of your time. Uh but uh some of the things your time. Uh but uh some of the things your time. Uh but uh some of the things that uh I've done so uh I got bored in that uh I've done so uh I got bored in that uh I've done so uh I got bored in school uh was going to University of school uh was going to University of school uh was going to University of Houston here in Houston and I just got Houston here in Houston and I just got Houston here in Houston and I just got bored and I enjoyed working more and so bored and I enjoyed working more and so bored and I enjoyed working more and so I started running a Little Caesar's I started running a Little Caesar's I started running a Little Caesar's Pizza and um at at some point I realized Pizza and um at at some point I realized Pizza and um at at some point I realized uh I'm working so many hours and I like uh I'm working so many hours and I like uh I'm working so many hours and I like within 10 months I'd been certified as a within 10 months I'd been certified as a within 10 months I'd been certified as a training manager at like age 21 I think training manager at like age 21 I think training manager at like age 21 I think I was at that time I was at that time I was at that time >> and and then the next step up was >> and and then the next step up was >> and and then the next step up was district manager and I saw the path district manager and I saw the path district manager and I saw the path there was long and at 60 hour plus weeks there was long and at 60 hour plus weeks there was long and at 60 hour plus weeks uh not going to be very fun. So I joined uh not going to be very fun. So I joined uh not going to be very fun. So I joined the military to have more time off uh the military to have more time off uh the military to have more time off uh and [laughter] uh that's not how most and [laughter] uh that's not how most and [laughter] uh that's not how most people join the military but it worked people join the military but it worked people join the military but it worked out. Uh I asked what's the hardest thing out. Uh I asked what's the hardest thing out. Uh I asked what's the hardest thing to qualify for? They said signals to qualify for? They said signals to qualify for? They said signals intelligence uh collector. So I said intelligence uh collector. So I said intelligence uh collector. So I said I'll do that. I had the scores to to do I'll do that. I had the scores to to do I'll do that. I had the scores to to do it. And uh I ended up in the 82nd it. And uh I ended up in the 82nd it. And uh I ended up in the 82nd Airborne Division jumping out of Airborne Division jumping out of Airborne Division jumping out of airplanes and doing some interesting airplanes and doing some interesting airplanes and doing some interesting things for the military. Uh I had a kid things for the military. Uh I had a kid things for the military. Uh I had a kid and got divorced and I wasn't getting to and got divorced and I wasn't getting to and got divorced and I wasn't getting to see my kid very much. So I wanted to see my kid very much. So I wanted to see my kid very much. So I wanted to come back to Texas and um the Army said come back to Texas and um the Army said come back to Texas and um the Army said no. And I said, "Well, my term is up."

no. And I said, "Well, my term is up." no. And I said, "Well, my term is up." So I got out. I went into the Army So I got out. I went into the Army So I got out. I went into the Army Reserves. Uh the day I joined my new Reserves. Uh the day I joined my new Reserves. Uh the day I joined my new unit, my signals intelligence position unit, my signals intelligence position unit, my signals intelligence position went away. And so they said, "Do you went away. And so they said, "Do you went away. And so they said, "Do you want to become an interrogator?" I said, want to become an interrogator?" I said, want to become an interrogator?" I said, "Yes." I went to interrogation school. "Yes." I went to interrogation school. "Yes." I went to interrogation school. They handed me my diploma and said, They handed me my diploma and said, They handed me my diploma and said, "You're really good at this. You should "You're really good at this. You should "You're really good at this. You should be teaching it." So I became an be teaching it." So I became an be teaching it." So I became an instructor. [snorts] instructor. [snorts] instructor. [snorts] Oh, Oh, Oh, >> nice. >> nice. >> nice. >> Um and then I ended up uh in Iraq for uh >> Um and then I ended up uh in Iraq for uh >> Um and then I ended up uh in Iraq for uh the early parts of uh the 2003 invasion. the early parts of uh the 2003 invasion. the early parts of uh the 2003 invasion. Uh, and I eventually got to interrogate Uh, and I eventually got to interrogate Uh, and I eventually got to interrogate kind of the high-value detainees, the kind of the high-value detainees, the kind of the high-value detainees, the people featured on playing cards into people featured on playing cards into people featured on playing cards into including two top 10 detainees, a pair including two top 10 detainees, a pair including two top 10 detainees, a pair of kings if you're if you're playing of kings if you're if you're playing of kings if you're if you're playing card games. uh including uh Saddam card games. uh including uh Saddam card games. uh including uh Saddam Hussein's cousin, Chemical Ali. And uh I Hussein's cousin, Chemical Ali. And uh I Hussein's cousin, Chemical Ali. And uh I uh successfully interrogated him for 6 uh successfully interrogated him for 6 uh successfully interrogated him for 6 months and got some cool stories out of months and got some cool stories out of months and got some cool stories out of it and maybe a letter of recommendation it and maybe a letter of recommendation it and maybe a letter of recommendation that sits on my back wall, which is that sits on my back wall, which is that sits on my back wall, which is unusual for interrogators. I did unusual for interrogators. I did unusual for interrogators. I did everything Geneva compliant. Um you everything Geneva compliant. Um you everything Geneva compliant. Um you know, building relationships with know, building relationships with know, building relationships with difficult people is I guess one of my difficult people is I guess one of my difficult people is I guess one of my skill sets. Um, it's funny when people skill sets. Um, it's funny when people skill sets. Um, it's funny when people say, "Oh, I got this guy so difficult to say, "Oh, I got this guy so difficult to say, "Oh, I got this guy so difficult to work with." I'm like, "How many hundreds work with." I'm like, "How many hundreds work with." I'm like, "How many hundreds of thousands of people is he killed?"

of thousands of people is he killed?" of thousands of people is he killed?" And, uh, [laughter] the answer is never And, uh, [laughter] the answer is never And, uh, [laughter] the answer is never one or more. Uh, so it's it's kind of a one or more. Uh, so it's it's kind of a one or more. Uh, so it's it's kind of a unique thing. I got to interrogate on unique thing. I got to interrogate on unique thing. I got to interrogate on weapons of mass destruction as well, weapons of mass destruction as well, weapons of mass destruction as well, which are incredibly complicated, but a which are incredibly complicated, but a which are incredibly complicated, but a lot of banking stuff. And then, um, went lot of banking stuff. And then, um, went lot of banking stuff. And then, um, went on to become a contract interrogation on to become a contract interrogation on to become a contract interrogation instructor. I quit that job to move to instructor. I quit that job to move to instructor. I quit that job to move to Honduras. Um I built built programs for Honduras. Um I built built programs for Honduras. Um I built built programs for the military uh inter advanced the military uh inter advanced the military uh inter advanced interrogation and analysis course and interrogation and analysis course and interrogation and analysis course and then uh helped my wife in textile then uh helped my wife in textile then uh helped my wife in textile exports run her business and uh we got exports run her business and uh we got exports run her business and uh we got home invaded guns at our kids' heads. home invaded guns at our kids' heads. home invaded guns at our kids' heads. Give us all your stuff. Give us all your stuff. Give us all your stuff. >> Um I sort of facilitated the robbing of >> Um I sort of facilitated the robbing of >> Um I sort of facilitated the robbing of my family like here let me help you guys my family like here let me help you guys my family like here let me help you guys do this without hurting my family and uh do this without hurting my family and uh do this without hurting my family and uh let me show you where all the valuables let me show you where all the valuables let me show you where all the valuables are. And um that led to me meeting uh a are. And um that led to me meeting uh a are. And um that led to me meeting uh a owner of a a physical security company owner of a a physical security company owner of a a physical security company in Honduras. And we became friends and in Honduras. And we became friends and in Honduras. And we became friends and six months later he said, "My company's six months later he said, "My company's six months later he said, "My company's bleeding money. Do you think you can bleeding money. Do you think you can bleeding money. Do you think you can figure out what's going on?" And I said, figure out what's going on?" And I said, figure out what's going on?" And I said, "I don't know. Uh I I'll take a look." I "I don't know. Uh I I'll take a look." I "I don't know. Uh I I'll take a look." I went over and saw his company. I was went over and saw his company. I was went over and saw his company. I was like, "You got 435 employees. I think to like, "You got 435 employees. I think to like, "You got 435 employees. I think to solve the problem, you'd have to put me solve the problem, you'd have to put me solve the problem, you'd have to put me in charge." And he's like, "You're in in charge." And he's like, "You're in in charge." And he's like, "You're in charge." And [laughter] so, uh within charge." And [laughter] so, uh within charge." And [laughter] so, uh within three months, I'd found a million three months, I'd found a million three months, I'd found a million dollars of hidden debt. uh made new dollars of hidden debt. uh made new dollars of hidden debt. uh made new revenue streams that got us cash revenue streams that got us cash revenue streams that got us cash positive, at least paying our bills, positive, at least paying our bills, positive, at least paying our bills, paid off all the personal debt that the paid off all the personal debt that the paid off all the personal debt that the owner had taken on to help the company.

owner had taken on to help the company. owner had taken on to help the company. And um and uh so that was kind of a And um and uh so that was kind of a And um and uh so that was kind of a 90day turnaround of a failing company 90day turnaround of a failing company 90day turnaround of a failing company that I didn't really know that much that I didn't really know that much that I didn't really know that much about, but it was just kind of fun to about, but it was just kind of fun to about, but it was just kind of fun to puzzle it out. And I've also gone on to puzzle it out. And I've also gone on to puzzle it out. And I've also gone on to do cyber security with uh some major do cyber security with uh some major do cyber security with uh some major banks and I break things and make them banks and I break things and make them banks and I break things and make them better. That's sort of the sort of the better. That's sort of the sort of the better. That's sort of the sort of the long and short and scuba instructing to long and short and scuba instructing to long and short and scuba instructing to my friend [laughter] out there I've my friend [laughter] out there I've my friend [laughter] out there I've done. There's plenty I've left out, but done. There's plenty I've left out, but done. There's plenty I've left out, but I think uh happy to answer more if you I think uh happy to answer more if you I think uh happy to answer more if you have more questions. have more questions. have more questions. >> Talk about a transferable skill. >> Talk about a transferable skill. >> Talk about a transferable skill. [laughter] [laughter] [laughter] >> Yeah, breaking things for good is one of >> Yeah, breaking things for good is one of >> Yeah, breaking things for good is one of the things that I I call it. the things that I I call it. the things that I I call it. >> Yeah. You know, I think uh one of the >> Yeah. You know, I think uh one of the >> Yeah. You know, I think uh one of the things that I noticed is things that I noticed is things that I noticed is um when you look at the the startups, um when you look at the the startups, um when you look at the the startups, every startup founder is visionary, every startup founder is visionary, every startup founder is visionary, right? And you know, like when you say, right? And you know, like when you say, right? And you know, like when you say, you know, I am like, you know, bounce, you know, I am like, you know, bounce, you know, I am like, you know, bounce, right? You know, so we're just like, right? You know, so we're just like, right? You know, so we're just like, yeah, we're going to make it, you know, yeah, we're going to make it, you know, yeah, we're going to make it, you know, it's going to be the greatest and it's going to be the greatest and it's going to be the greatest and biggest company. And I think that's uh biggest company. And I think that's uh biggest company. And I think that's uh that's that's more important to that's that's more important to that's that's more important to understand like what happens after that understand like what happens after that understand like what happens after that big vision right how you put it together big vision right how you put it together big vision right how you put it together and how you look at it from a lens of and how you look at it from a lens of and how you look at it from a lens of like what's going to go wrong what's like what's going to go wrong what's like what's going to go wrong what's going to fail I think what this is what going to fail I think what this is what going to fail I think what this is what you have done for for a long time you you have done for for a long time you you have done for for a long time you know the the story of you know Honduras know the the story of you know Honduras know the the story of you know Honduras company I think it's just just an company I think it's just just an company I think it's just just an example of it so how do you help a example of it so how do you help a example of it so how do you help a startups like if somebody is starting a

startups like if somebody is starting a startups like if somebody is starting a startup up and they have like this big startup up and they have like this big startup up and they have like this big vision. What are the first question you vision. What are the first question you vision. What are the first question you ask them? What they need to ask ask them? What they need to ask ask them? What they need to ask themselves? themselves? themselves? >> Yeah, thanks man. That's a great >> Yeah, thanks man. That's a great >> Yeah, thanks man. That's a great question. Um, yeah, so I I'd say the question. Um, yeah, so I I'd say the question. Um, yeah, so I I'd say the first time I did this was sort of first time I did this was sort of first time I did this was sort of accidental as part of a a coaching accidental as part of a a coaching accidental as part of a a coaching program for entrepreneurs called program for entrepreneurs called program for entrepreneurs called Strategic Coach run by Dan Sullivan. And Strategic Coach run by Dan Sullivan. And Strategic Coach run by Dan Sullivan. And um, there was a guy there that he was a um, there was a guy there that he was a um, there was a guy there that he was a fintech guy. He'd already had two fintech guy. He'd already had two fintech guy. He'd already had two successful exits. He was in his 30s, successful exits. He was in his 30s, successful exits. He was in his 30s, clearly knew what he was doing. Um, and clearly knew what he was doing. Um, and clearly knew what he was doing. Um, and you know, coming out of banking, I knew you know, coming out of banking, I knew you know, coming out of banking, I knew about half of what his company model about half of what his company model about half of what his company model was, but there were some pieces I was was, but there were some pieces I was was, but there were some pieces I was interested in. So, one of the things I interested in. So, one of the things I interested in. So, one of the things I did was I asked, you know, can I can I did was I asked, you know, can I can I did was I asked, you know, can I can I ask you some questions? Uh, can you can ask you some questions? Uh, can you can ask you some questions? Uh, can you can you pitch me your your new startup? you pitch me your your new startup? you pitch me your your new startup? >> And so, he did and I asked five >> And so, he did and I asked five >> And so, he did and I asked five questions and my fifth question broke questions and my fifth question broke questions and my fifth question broke his business model. Like, I said, "Well, his business model. Like, I said, "Well, his business model. Like, I said, "Well, what if your customers do this instead what if your customers do this instead what if your customers do this instead of this?" And I just saw the pieces fall of this?" And I just saw the pieces fall of this?" And I just saw the pieces fall into place in his head and he was like, into place in his head and he was like, into place in his head and he was like, "Oh, that would be bad. That would be "Oh, that would be bad. That would be "Oh, that would be bad. That would be really bad." And so he said, "I'm gonna really bad." And so he said, "I'm gonna really bad." And so he said, "I'm gonna fix that and I want to talk to you fix that and I want to talk to you fix that and I want to talk to you again." And so um we we he reached out a again." And so um we we he reached out a again." And so um we we he reached out a month later and he had designed end to month later and he had designed end to month later and he had designed end to end his entire process. And uh end his entire process. And uh end his entire process. And uh >> and and I just asked him, "Well, what if >> and and I just asked him, "Well, what if >> and and I just asked him, "Well, what if this happens and how would you handle a this happens and how would you handle a this happens and how would you handle a customer doing this?" And and just in customer doing this?" And and just in customer doing this?" And and just in two hours went through his entire two hours went through his entire two hours went through his entire process. um and he got, you know, process. um and he got, you know, process. um and he got, you know, probably 10 good aha moments out of it probably 10 good aha moments out of it probably 10 good aha moments out of it where like I hadn't thought of that, you where like I hadn't thought of that, you where like I hadn't thought of that, you know, and and so sort of helping him know, and and so sort of helping him know, and and so sort of helping him pre-think some of the challenges he

pre-think some of the challenges he pre-think some of the challenges he might have uh in the way that he'd built might have uh in the way that he'd built might have uh in the way that he'd built his processes and stuff. So uh to back his processes and stuff. So uh to back his processes and stuff. So uh to back to your question uh if if I'm doing kind to your question uh if if I'm doing kind to your question uh if if I'm doing kind of a what I call a value flow of a what I call a value flow of a what I call a value flow optimization 20 call which is uh 20 optimization 20 call which is uh 20 optimization 20 call which is uh 20 minutes on what is your biggest business minutes on what is your biggest business minutes on what is your biggest business challenge I start with uh what is your challenge I start with uh what is your challenge I start with uh what is your biggest business challenge and then the biggest business challenge and then the biggest business challenge and then the second question I ask is what is it second question I ask is what is it second question I ask is what is it preventing you from doing because a lot preventing you from doing because a lot preventing you from doing because a lot of times uh the problem is actually a of times uh the problem is actually a of times uh the problem is actually a symptom of the problem and so you know symptom of the problem and so you know symptom of the problem and so you know putting a band-aid on a gushing wound putting a band-aid on a gushing wound putting a band-aid on a gushing wound doesn't really solve anything you you doesn't really solve anything you you doesn't really solve anything you you got to get to the root of what what's got to get to the root of what what's got to get to the root of what what's really happening here, really happening here, really happening here, >> right? >> right? >> right? >> Um and then the third question I ask is >> Um and then the third question I ask is >> Um and then the third question I ask is what is it costing you to not solve it? what is it costing you to not solve it? what is it costing you to not solve it? Uh because that helps cement in, oh Uh because that helps cement in, oh Uh because that helps cement in, oh yeah, this is really costing me and I yeah, this is really costing me and I yeah, this is really costing me and I need to fix it. Um and then I just drill need to fix it. Um and then I just drill need to fix it. Um and then I just drill into kind of what's what's the ecosystem into kind of what's what's the ecosystem into kind of what's what's the ecosystem in which this is happening? Sort of a in which this is happening? Sort of a in which this is happening? Sort of a root cause analysis using basic root cause analysis using basic root cause analysis using basic interrogation techniques that I learned interrogation techniques that I learned interrogation techniques that I learned from the military. That's great.

from the military. That's great. from the military. That's great. >> So that's why you call it like business >> So that's why you call it like business >> So that's why you call it like business interrogations, right? So you're just interrogations, right? So you're just interrogations, right? So you're just looking at like interrogating the looking at like interrogating the looking at like interrogating the business, right? business, right? business, right? >> To find like where is is going to fail. >> To find like where is is going to fail. >> To find like where is is going to fail. >> So about how many companies have you >> So about how many companies have you >> So about how many companies have you worked with and how did how has your worked with and how did how has your worked with and how did how has your journey led to writing the books that journey led to writing the books that journey led to writing the books that you have written? you have written? you have written? >> Sure. Uh fantastic question as well. Uh >> Sure. Uh fantastic question as well. Uh >> Sure. Uh fantastic question as well. Uh I I have over 40 companies that I've I I have over 40 companies that I've I I have over 40 companies that I've helped with various business helped with various business helped with various business interrogation services including Fortune interrogation services including Fortune interrogation services including Fortune 500 companies. um probably the biggest 500 companies. um probably the biggest 500 companies. um probably the biggest like startup type company was 10 10 like startup type company was 10 10 like startup type company was 10 10 million revenue and then um under million revenue and then um under million revenue and then um under business interrogation I also do some business interrogation I also do some business interrogation I also do some cyber security work which is how I get cyber security work which is how I get cyber security work which is how I get the fortune 500 kind of box checked I've the fortune 500 kind of box checked I've the fortune 500 kind of box checked I've I've actually worked with the seauite of I've actually worked with the seauite of I've actually worked with the seauite of the fortune 500 company and had the the fortune 500 company and had the the fortune 500 company and had the board of directors kind of observing board of directors kind of observing board of directors kind of observing that I do cyber exercises so I design that I do cyber exercises so I design that I do cyber exercises so I design cyber disasters and help leadership cyber disasters and help leadership cyber disasters and help leadership teams think through what would we do if teams think through what would we do if teams think through what would we do if we were ransomware or or other other we were ransomware or or other other we were ransomware or or other other issues around like that. issues around like that. issues around like that. >> Um, most people don't think to think >> Um, most people don't think to think >> Um, most people don't think to think about those things.

about those things. about those things. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> They're always going to happen to >> They're always going to happen to >> They're always going to happen to somebody else until they don't. somebody else until they don't. somebody else until they don't. >> Especially if you're in a physical >> Especially if you're in a physical >> Especially if you're in a physical space, that definitely changes things space, that definitely changes things space, that definitely changes things too. too. too. >> For sure. >> For sure. >> For sure. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> For sure. So, um, the that the answer is >> For sure. So, um, the that the answer is >> For sure. So, um, the that the answer is 40ish um with various services. 40ish um with various services. 40ish um with various services. >> Nice. >> Nice. >> Nice. >> So, in the book um is customer uh >> So, in the book um is customer uh >> So, in the book um is customer uh leadership, right? customerdriven leadership, right? customerdriven leadership, right? customerdriven leadership and we had like a lot of leadership and we had like a lot of leadership and we had like a lot of conversation about that. conversation about that. conversation about that. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um >> Um >> Um >> we got the same. >> we got the same. >> we got the same. >> Yeah. Yeah. And you know like I think >> Yeah. Yeah. And you know like I think >> Yeah. Yeah. And you know like I think the biggest challenge for many startups the biggest challenge for many startups the biggest challenge for many startups even a lot of people even like we have even a lot of people even like we have even a lot of people even like we have people in the room how to find customers people in the room how to find customers people in the room how to find customers and how to you know uh uh drive value and how to you know uh uh drive value and how to you know uh uh drive value and capture value. So, how do you how do and capture value. So, how do you how do and capture value. So, how do you how do you solve the customer uh problem in you solve the customer uh problem in you solve the customer uh problem in this book? this book? this book? >> Yeah. So, um well, let me tell you what >> Yeah. So, um well, let me tell you what >> Yeah. So, um well, let me tell you what customer-driven leadership is first. So, customer-driven leadership is first. So, customer-driven leadership is first. So, uh my wife and I uh helped build a uh my wife and I uh helped build a uh my wife and I uh helped build a nursing school in central Honduras. Uh nursing school in central Honduras. Uh nursing school in central Honduras. Uh and part of the leadership team included and part of the leadership team included and part of the leadership team included uh Dr. Ted Anders who helped build u the uh Dr. Ted Anders who helped build u the uh Dr. Ted Anders who helped build u the training program for NASA shuttle teams training program for NASA shuttle teams training program for NASA shuttle teams here in Houston. um he has no longer here in Houston. um he has no longer here in Houston. um he has no longer lived in Texas, but he lives in my lived in Texas, but he lives in my lived in Texas, but he lives in my second favorite state, Florida. So, uh second favorite state, Florida. So, uh second favorite state, Florida. So, uh uh and he's an organizational uh and he's an organizational uh and he's an organizational psychologist. And after we finished this psychologist. And after we finished this psychologist. And after we finished this five-year long nursing school project, five-year long nursing school project, five-year long nursing school project, uh building this modern nursing school uh building this modern nursing school uh building this modern nursing school in in central Honduras, um we were in in central Honduras, um we were in in central Honduras, um we were looking at what else can we do to help

looking at what else can we do to help looking at what else can we do to help the the local uh we were working with the the local uh we were working with the the local uh we were working with the Episcopal bishops of Honduras, El the Episcopal bishops of Honduras, El the Episcopal bishops of Honduras, El Salvador, and Guatemala. And we said, Salvador, and Guatemala. And we said, Salvador, and Guatemala. And we said, what can we do? And uh Ted showed me what can we do? And uh Ted showed me what can we do? And uh Ted showed me customer-driven leadership. And as I customer-driven leadership. And as I customer-driven leadership. And as I mentioned, I I put pieces together very mentioned, I I put pieces together very mentioned, I I put pieces together very quickly. As he started to explain it, quickly. As he started to explain it, quickly. As he started to explain it, within five minutes, I was like, "Wow, within five minutes, I was like, "Wow, within five minutes, I was like, "Wow, this is genius. The world needs this, this is genius. The world needs this, this is genius. The world needs this, Ted. Let's let's let's do this." And he Ted. Let's let's let's do this." And he Ted. Let's let's let's do this." And he goes, "Coauthor the second edition of my goes, "Coauthor the second edition of my goes, "Coauthor the second edition of my book." And I said, "Uh, okay." Okay. So, book." And I said, "Uh, okay." Okay. So, book." And I said, "Uh, okay." Okay. So, I did my due diligence and I did my due diligence and I did my due diligence and >> uh I I was the kind of lead author for >> uh I I was the kind of lead author for >> uh I I was the kind of lead author for this um basic using a lot of Ted's this um basic using a lot of Ted's this um basic using a lot of Ted's material and of course he was always in material and of course he was always in material and of course he was always in the uh in the conversation. We we do uh the uh in the conversation. We we do uh the uh in the conversation. We we do uh interviews at the end of each chapter interviews at the end of each chapter interviews at the end of each chapter where I talk about the key concepts of where I talk about the key concepts of where I talk about the key concepts of customer-driven leadership, but it's customer-driven leadership, but it's customer-driven leadership, but it's effectively empower your people with the effectively empower your people with the effectively empower your people with the vision and values of your organization vision and values of your organization vision and values of your organization and uh let them be partners in the and uh let them be partners in the and uh let them be partners in the success of the organization. So uh and success of the organization. So uh and success of the organization. So uh and reward them when they successfully do reward them when they successfully do reward them when they successfully do that. So it's uh incentive based um as that. So it's uh incentive based um as that. So it's uh incentive based um as they help you grow your business they help you grow your business they help you grow your business according to your vision um they get according to your vision um they get according to your vision um they get rewarded for that and why wouldn't you rewarded for that and why wouldn't you rewarded for that and why wouldn't you do that? Right. So um do that? Right. So um do that? Right. So um >> I've yet to start reading it but it's >> I've yet to start reading it but it's >> I've yet to start reading it but it's but it's but it's but it's >> yeah it's it's very interesting. It's >> yeah it's it's very interesting. It's >> yeah it's it's very interesting. It's got sort of inverts the hierarchy of the got sort of inverts the hierarchy of the got sort of inverts the hierarchy of the organization. So everybody is evaluated organization. So everybody is evaluated organization. So everybody is evaluated by the people they serve within the by the people they serve within the by the people they serve within the organization. So the CEO gets evaluated organization. So the CEO gets evaluated organization. So the CEO gets evaluated by everybody and uh teams evaluate their by everybody and uh teams evaluate their by everybody and uh teams evaluate their leaders and how well they're being leaders and how well they're being leaders and how well they're being supported to be successful.

supported to be successful. supported to be successful. >> Each team understands kind of we call >> Each team understands kind of we call >> Each team understands kind of we call them careabouts uh what what the the them careabouts uh what what the the them careabouts uh what what the the people further down the value chain. Um people further down the value chain. Um people further down the value chain. Um so you know if you've got the R&D branch so you know if you've got the R&D branch so you know if you've got the R&D branch goes into production uh what what does goes into production uh what what does goes into production uh what what does the R&D what does the production team the R&D what does the production team the R&D what does the production team need from R&D to be successful? Those need from R&D to be successful? Those need from R&D to be successful? Those are the careabouts that are connected are the careabouts that are connected are the careabouts that are connected and we measure them. They're all hard and we measure them. They're all hard and we measure them. They're all hard metrics. Um it's not the easiest system metrics. Um it's not the easiest system metrics. Um it's not the easiest system to set up, but if you get it up and to set up, but if you get it up and to set up, but if you get it up and running, um it it uh has definitely in running, um it it uh has definitely in running, um it it uh has definitely in Ted's background, this is before I Ted's background, this is before I Ted's background, this is before I joined, has created billion-dollar joined, has created billion-dollar joined, has created billion-dollar companies. It has um normally I would companies. It has um normally I would companies. It has um normally I would say it 10xes a company in three to five say it 10xes a company in three to five say it 10xes a company in three to five years. years. years. >> Oh, okay. It's never it's never failed >> Oh, okay. It's never it's never failed >> Oh, okay. It's never it's never failed to return ROI of the initial investment to return ROI of the initial investment to return ROI of the initial investment in less than two. in less than two. in less than two. >> Um, and it's not the most inexpensive of >> Um, and it's not the most inexpensive of >> Um, and it's not the most inexpensive of programs. So, yeah, it's it's uh it's programs. So, yeah, it's it's uh it's programs. So, yeah, it's it's uh it's really good and it'll change your really good and it'll change your really good and it'll change your culture as well. Everybody feels culture as well. Everybody feels culture as well. Everybody feels empowered to to help, right? And and empowered to to help, right? And and empowered to to help, right? And and this really came out of Ted's uh you this really came out of Ted's uh you this really came out of Ted's uh you know when he trained the shuttle teams know when he trained the shuttle teams know when he trained the shuttle teams when Challenger exploded those were his when Challenger exploded those were his when Challenger exploded those were his friends and the people at the bottom friends and the people at the bottom friends and the people at the bottom knew they shouldn't have launched knew they shouldn't have launched knew they shouldn't have launched because the O-rings were out of because the O-rings were out of because the O-rings were out of specifications but they got overridden specifications but they got overridden specifications but they got overridden by people at the top who knew less.

by people at the top who knew less. by people at the top who knew less. >> Dang. >> Dang. >> Dang. We should definitely have We should definitely have We should definitely have >> anybody in a customer-driven leadership >> anybody in a customer-driven leadership >> anybody in a customer-driven leadership uh organization is empowered to put up uh organization is empowered to put up uh organization is empowered to put up their hand, pull the emergency stop, and their hand, pull the emergency stop, and their hand, pull the emergency stop, and say, "Hey, this isn't who we are. This say, "Hey, this isn't who we are. This say, "Hey, this isn't who we are. This isn't where we said we're going. Um, isn't where we said we're going. Um, isn't where we said we're going. Um, this isn't a policy that uh that honors this isn't a policy that uh that honors this isn't a policy that uh that honors our promises to our customers." our promises to our customers." our promises to our customers." So I think it what it does is really uh So I think it what it does is really uh So I think it what it does is really uh helps you one of the the last step of helps you one of the the last step of helps you one of the the last step of customer-driven leadership is going to customer-driven leadership is going to customer-driven leadership is going to your customers and asking what's the one your customers and asking what's the one your customers and asking what's the one thing that I can do where if I deliver thing that I can do where if I deliver thing that I can do where if I deliver that for you you'll never look at that for you you'll never look at that for you you'll never look at another person another person another person >> to do what I do for you know >> to do what I do for you know >> to do what I do for you know >> that's very interesting >> that's very interesting >> that's very interesting >> and the answer's different for different >> and the answer's different for different >> and the answer's different for different yeah for different customers the answer yeah for different customers the answer yeah for different customers the answer will be different so you need to assess will be different so you need to assess will be different so you need to assess what what does each customer really care what what does each customer really care what what does each customer really care about and then make sure you're about and then make sure you're about and then make sure you're delivering on those things. delivering on those things. delivering on those things. >> Yeah. Yeah. And that's really just your >> Yeah. Yeah. And that's really just your >> Yeah. Yeah. And that's really just your ongoing market research, right? Like ongoing market research, right? Like ongoing market research, right? Like you're just you're just always in in you're just you're just always in in you're just you're just always in in your market researching it while you're your market researching it while you're your market researching it while you're exploring it at the same time and exploring it at the same time and exploring it at the same time and discovering it.

discovering it. discovering it. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. the concept of the care about like you the concept of the care about like you the concept of the care about like you know in the storytelling if you ask you know in the storytelling if you ask you know in the storytelling if you ask you know um our good friend Kendrick you know um our good friend Kendrick you know um our good friend Kendrick you know in the storytelling and in know in the storytelling and in know in the storytelling and in storytelling like Donna Miller's a storytelling like Donna Miller's a storytelling like Donna Miller's a storytelling framework is exactly we are storytelling framework is exactly we are storytelling framework is exactly we are the guide and the customer is the hero the guide and the customer is the hero the guide and the customer is the hero >> so now the customer-driven is leadership >> so now the customer-driven is leadership >> so now the customer-driven is leadership at the layer of what the hero cares at the layer of what the hero cares at the layer of what the hero cares about about about >> right >> right >> right >> right so if if I'm a guide and the >> right so if if I'm a guide and the >> right so if if I'm a guide and the customer is the hero customer is the hero customer is the hero >> I like that yeah >> I like that yeah >> I like that yeah >> so like what they really care about and >> so like what they really care about and >> so like what they really care about and that's a really interesting concept. that's a really interesting concept. that's a really interesting concept. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So if if I'm like a startup founder, >> So if if I'm like a startup founder, >> So if if I'm like a startup founder, right? You know, right? You know, right? You know, >> um how do I apply this to my startup to >> um how do I apply this to my startup to >> um how do I apply this to my startup to understand the better understand my understand the better understand my understand the better understand my customers and to develop like my goto customers and to develop like my goto customers and to develop like my goto market strategy, my uh c like my my market strategy, my uh c like my my market strategy, my uh c like my my beach head strategy, my customer beach head strategy, my customer beach head strategy, my customer acquisition strategy. How do how do I acquisition strategy. How do how do I acquisition strategy. How do how do I apply it? apply it? apply it? >> Yeah, I would say you start off with the >> Yeah, I would say you start off with the >> Yeah, I would say you start off with the kind of the principles of kind of the principles of kind of the principles of customer-driven leadership. Um, you customer-driven leadership. Um, you customer-driven leadership. Um, you know, I had I had a soloreneur ask me know, I had I had a soloreneur ask me know, I had I had a soloreneur ask me once, you know, well, I'm a soloreneur.

once, you know, well, I'm a soloreneur. once, you know, well, I'm a soloreneur. How can I do customer-driven leadership? How can I do customer-driven leadership? How can I do customer-driven leadership? And I was like, well, let's say there's And I was like, well, let's say there's And I was like, well, let's say there's 10 things you need to do within your 10 things you need to do within your 10 things you need to do within your company that drive its success. At the company that drive its success. At the company that drive its success. At the beginning, guess what? You wear all 10 beginning, guess what? You wear all 10 beginning, guess what? You wear all 10 hats. I mean, that's just how it is, hats. I mean, that's just how it is, hats. I mean, that's just how it is, right? right? right? >> Um, but you're going to find, hey, these >> Um, but you're going to find, hey, these >> Um, but you're going to find, hey, these five I'm really good at, and these five, five I'm really good at, and these five, five I'm really good at, and these five, you know, maybe I'm average, maybe I'm you know, maybe I'm average, maybe I'm you know, maybe I'm average, maybe I'm worse than average, right, at these worse than average, right, at these worse than average, right, at these five. So those should be the positions five. So those should be the positions five. So those should be the positions that you hire for first, right? And so that you hire for first, right? And so that you hire for first, right? And so you're bringing on the people that keep you're bringing on the people that keep you're bringing on the people that keep you more in the stuff that you're really you more in the stuff that you're really you more in the stuff that you're really good at and less in the stuff that good at and less in the stuff that good at and less in the stuff that you're not so good at. And you literally you're not so good at. And you literally you're not so good at. And you literally just hand off those responsibilities, just hand off those responsibilities, just hand off those responsibilities, care about care about. And you know, care about care about. And you know, care about care about. And you know, maybe you find a co-founder that can maybe you find a co-founder that can maybe you find a co-founder that can tackle the other five for you. tackle the other five for you. tackle the other five for you. >> Um or maybe you have to hire five other >> Um or maybe you have to hire five other >> Um or maybe you have to hire five other people each to handle one of those for people each to handle one of those for people each to handle one of those for you. you. you. >> Very interesting. what >> Very interesting. what >> Very interesting. what >> keeps the main thing the main thing um >> keeps the main thing the main thing um >> keeps the main thing the main thing um you know again um once it really unlocks you know again um once it really unlocks you know again um once it really unlocks um asking your team how could we do um asking your team how could we do um asking your team how could we do better how can we improve in the things better how can we improve in the things better how can we improve in the things that matter um again it's all hard that matter um again it's all hard that matter um again it's all hard metrics uh I interviewed a CEO that was metrics uh I interviewed a CEO that was metrics uh I interviewed a CEO that was Ted's first customer he's been running Ted's first customer he's been running Ted's first customer he's been running customer-driven leadership for 30 years customer-driven leadership for 30 years customer-driven leadership for 30 years uh he makes more than a million dollars uh he makes more than a million dollars uh he makes more than a million dollars of revenue venue per employee regardless of revenue venue per employee regardless of revenue venue per employee regardless of role.

of role. of role. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> So, wow. >> So, wow. >> So, wow. >> Janitor, that's great. Receptionist, >> Janitor, that's great. Receptionist, >> Janitor, that's great. Receptionist, engineer, doesn't matter. engineer, doesn't matter. engineer, doesn't matter. >> Um, he's got over 300 employees. They've >> Um, he's got over 300 employees. They've >> Um, he's got over 300 employees. They've never never never >> $200 million. >> $200 million. >> $200 million. >> Yeah. They've never failed to pay >> Yeah. They've never failed to pay >> Yeah. They've never failed to pay >> a uh an incentive check. >> a uh an incentive check. >> a uh an incentive check. And the the teams, they're super And the the teams, they're super And the the teams, they're super innovative. They do things that no other innovative. They do things that no other innovative. They do things that no other company would consider doing, like company would consider doing, like company would consider doing, like >> we have to renegotiate >> we have to renegotiate >> we have to renegotiate uh you know, the janitorial service. uh you know, the janitorial service. uh you know, the janitorial service. Well, what if we all just cleaned up Well, what if we all just cleaned up Well, what if we all just cleaned up this place ourselves? You know, what if this place ourselves? You know, what if this place ourselves? You know, what if I split half of that money with I split half of that money with I split half of that money with everybody here and I'll I'll clean everybody here and I'll I'll clean everybody here and I'll I'll clean toilets as a CEO, you know? toilets as a CEO, you know? toilets as a CEO, you know? >> Um, you know, you can get really >> Um, you know, you can get really >> Um, you know, you can get really creative in what's possible. creative in what's possible. creative in what's possible. >> So, you know, let me ask you another >> So, you know, let me ask you another >> So, you know, let me ask you another question. question. question. >> Uh, just tying this to communicating >> Uh, just tying this to communicating >> Uh, just tying this to communicating that complex vision, right? Because one that complex vision, right? Because one that complex vision, right? Because one of the things you do really well, you of the things you do really well, you of the things you do really well, you know, you just figure out what is my, know, you just figure out what is my, know, you just figure out what is my, you know, complex vision and you can you know, complex vision and you can you know, complex vision and you can just, you know, uh, simple it down and just, you know, uh, simple it down and just, you know, uh, simple it down and communicate that if I'm a tech founder, communicate that if I'm a tech founder, communicate that if I'm a tech founder, uh, specifically, right?

uh, specifically, right? uh, specifically, right? >> And I have this great idea, but I can't >> And I have this great idea, but I can't >> And I have this great idea, but I can't really communicate that. It's just really communicate that. It's just really communicate that. It's just really always hard. Uh so what do you really always hard. Uh so what do you really always hard. Uh so what do you depend you know I'm just building this depend you know I'm just building this depend you know I'm just building this platform that has you know AI agents platform that has you know AI agents platform that has you know AI agents uh that AI agents go and do like the uh that AI agents go and do like the uh that AI agents go and do like the investment for like then I go into like investment for like then I go into like investment for like then I go into like a lot of technical things right a lot of technical things right a lot of technical things right >> so how do you use this framework and how >> so how do you use this framework and how >> so how do you use this framework and how do you communicate like what is your uh do you communicate like what is your uh do you communicate like what is your uh what is your advice for tech founders what is your advice for tech founders what is your advice for tech founders especially to communicate really complex especially to communicate really complex especially to communicate really complex ideas? Yeah. So, interrogation basics, ideas? Yeah. So, interrogation basics, ideas? Yeah. So, interrogation basics, who, what, where, when, why, how. Uh, who, what, where, when, why, how. Uh, who, what, where, when, why, how. Uh, that's where what I' I'd start with, that's where what I' I'd start with, that's where what I' I'd start with, right? Who who are first of all, what do right? Who who are first of all, what do right? Who who are first of all, what do you do, right? What what's the solution you do, right? What what's the solution you do, right? What what's the solution that's the most unique that that it has that's the most unique that that it has that's the most unique that that it has there? There there's a problem and your there? There there's a problem and your there? There there's a problem and your solution solves that problem. solution solves that problem. solution solves that problem. >> If if [clears throat] you're building >> If if [clears throat] you're building >> If if [clears throat] you're building something and you haven't identified something and you haven't identified something and you haven't identified what problem it solves, uh, you've got a what problem it solves, uh, you've got a what problem it solves, uh, you've got a big problem. [snorts] Yeah. big problem. [snorts] Yeah. big problem. [snorts] Yeah. >> Um, but then you ask, well, who has that >> Um, but then you ask, well, who has that >> Um, but then you ask, well, who has that problem? And so then you find out what problem? And so then you find out what problem? And so then you find out what what that ideal client looks like. Um what that ideal client looks like. Um what that ideal client looks like. Um and then you just sort of you know uh and then you just sort of you know uh and then you just sort of you know uh staying focused one of the one of the staying focused one of the one of the staying focused one of the one of the other things that you know in in that other things that you know in in that other things that you know in in that digesting complexity uh you know there's digesting complexity uh you know there's digesting complexity uh you know there's visionaries and there's kind of the visionaries and there's kind of the visionaries and there's kind of the integrator role the COO role and I'm I integrator role the COO role and I'm I integrator role the COO role and I'm I score high on both of those things. So, score high on both of those things. So, score high on both of those things. So, one of the things that I can do is I can one of the things that I can do is I can one of the things that I can do is I can help communicate. If I come into a help communicate. If I come into a help communicate. If I come into a company where there's some a disconnect company where there's some a disconnect company where there's some a disconnect between the this is my vision and this

between the this is my vision and this between the this is my vision and this is not what's getting done is I I by is not what's getting done is I I by is not what's getting done is I I by stepping in all of a sudden you've got stepping in all of a sudden you've got stepping in all of a sudden you've got two visionaries and two integrators and two visionaries and two integrators and two visionaries and two integrators and somebody that can translate between the somebody that can translate between the somebody that can translate between the two. two. two. >> Um when your visionary says this, >> Um when your visionary says this, >> Um when your visionary says this, >> this is what he wants you to do. This is >> this is what he wants you to do. This is >> this is what he wants you to do. This is what she she's looking for. Right. And what she she's looking for. Right. And what she she's looking for. Right. And um that um that um that >> Yeah. and and then and then when when >> Yeah. and and then and then when when >> Yeah. and and then and then when when you tell your your visionary it can't be you tell your your visionary it can't be you tell your your visionary it can't be done what he's saying is done what he's saying is done what he's saying is >> I don't have the resources to solve that >> I don't have the resources to solve that >> I don't have the resources to solve that problem right [laughter] problem right [laughter] problem right [laughter] and so those are the types of things and so those are the types of things and so those are the types of things that uh so marriage counselor for CEOs that uh so marriage counselor for CEOs that uh so marriage counselor for CEOs and COOS as well a little bit [snorts] and COOS as well a little bit [snorts] and COOS as well a little bit [snorts] >> tell us a little bit more about so this >> tell us a little bit more about so this >> tell us a little bit more about so this book we're book we're book we're >> Yeah it's a collaboration >> Yeah it's a collaboration >> Yeah it's a collaboration >> we're giving it away >> we're giving it away >> we're giving it away >> yeah we can give this book away uh it's >> yeah we can give this book away uh it's >> yeah we can give this book away uh it's a the second book that I wrote. Uh I'm a a the second book that I wrote. Uh I'm a a the second book that I wrote. Uh I'm a colle I have um seven book colle I have um seven book colle I have um seven book collaborations not including collaborations not including collaborations not including customdriven leadership. Um success customdriven leadership. Um success customdriven leadership. Um success secrets of disruptors was out of a secrets of disruptors was out of a secrets of disruptors was out of a community out of the [snorts] UK. Um community out of the [snorts] UK. Um community out of the [snorts] UK. Um they were looking to build a community.

they were looking to build a community. they were looking to build a community. I'm super community focused. I love uh I'm super community focused. I love uh I'm super community focused. I love uh building rich communities. That's one of building rich communities. That's one of building rich communities. That's one of the things that really appealed uh to me the things that really appealed uh to me the things that really appealed uh to me about uh Ben's vision is the community about uh Ben's vision is the community about uh Ben's vision is the community that he wanted to build. Um, and so this that he wanted to build. Um, and so this that he wanted to build. Um, and so this community uh was limited to a hundred community uh was limited to a hundred community uh was limited to a hundred people. Um, the founder interviewed over people. Um, the founder interviewed over people. Um, the founder interviewed over 5,000 to find the hundred that he wanted 5,000 to find the hundred that he wanted 5,000 to find the hundred that he wanted and he was not, you know, talking to and he was not, you know, talking to and he was not, you know, talking to people on the streets. Um, that was a people on the streets. Um, that was a people on the streets. Um, that was a really hard filtration system. It was a really hard filtration system. It was a really hard filtration system. It was a great community to be part of. I stayed great community to be part of. I stayed great community to be part of. I stayed for two years and I talked to over 130 for two years and I talked to over 130 for two years and I talked to over 130 entrepreneurs globally and and uh they entrepreneurs globally and and uh they entrepreneurs globally and and uh they had a couple of books already and they had a couple of books already and they had a couple of books already and they were looking for their third. Uh I'll were looking for their third. Uh I'll were looking for their third. Uh I'll take credit for the title of the third take credit for the title of the third take credit for the title of the third book. They were like it's a s series is book. They were like it's a s series is book. They were like it's a s series is called success secrets of or for and I called success secrets of or for and I called success secrets of or for and I said how about success secrets of said how about success secrets of said how about success secrets of disruptors because I'm a disruptor and disruptors because I'm a disruptor and disruptors because I'm a disruptor and uh uh uh >> I like to uh so my chapter in the book >> I like to uh so my chapter in the book >> I like to uh so my chapter in the book is called let's get uncomfortable is called let's get uncomfortable is called let's get uncomfortable >> and it's all about um you know where are >> and it's all about um you know where are >> and it's all about um you know where are the areas that you're [snorts] ignoring the areas that you're [snorts] ignoring the areas that you're [snorts] ignoring that you need to focus some growth on.

that you need to focus some growth on. that you need to focus some growth on. So So So >> I think again disruptions >> I think again disruptions >> I think again disruptions uh and startups and community, right? uh and startups and community, right? uh and startups and community, right? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Things that are uh core to any >> Things that are uh core to any >> Things that are uh core to any ecosystem. ecosystem. ecosystem. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Right. So how do you feel about >> Right. So how do you feel about >> Right. So how do you feel about disruption itself? Right. So getting disruption itself? Right. So getting disruption itself? Right. So getting uncomfortable. uncomfortable. uncomfortable. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> What does that mean? >> What does that mean? >> What does that mean? >> Yeah. So I think one of the things is if >> Yeah. So I think one of the things is if >> Yeah. So I think one of the things is if you're not looking for what can disrupt you're not looking for what can disrupt you're not looking for what can disrupt your business u and I I would be your business u and I I would be your business u and I I would be tracking those things once once you tracking those things once once you tracking those things once once you identify them identify them identify them >> um then all that means is you're going >> um then all that means is you're going >> um then all that means is you're going to be blindsided by the thing that to be blindsided by the thing that to be blindsided by the thing that disrupts you right disrupts you right disrupts you right >> y >> y >> y >> it's better to be thinking at you know >> it's better to be thinking at you know >> it's better to be thinking at you know um what technology could be created that um what technology could be created that um what technology could be created that would make my technology obsolete would make my technology obsolete would make my technology obsolete >> uh keep an eye on that space right maybe >> uh keep an eye on that space right maybe >> uh keep an eye on that space right maybe invest in that space yourself so that invest in that space yourself so that invest in that space yourself so that you've already gotten to a place where you've already gotten to a place where you've already gotten to a place where if if if >> you know, >> you know, >> you know, >> yeah, >> yeah, >> yeah, >> whatever whatever [snorts] the next >> whatever whatever [snorts] the next >> whatever whatever [snorts] the next level of AI is, solve some of the pieces level of AI is, solve some of the pieces level of AI is, solve some of the pieces of your puzzle, you already have ways to of your puzzle, you already have ways to of your puzzle, you already have ways to integrate with that AI to improve the integrate with that AI to improve the integrate with that AI to improve the thing that you're already doing, right?

thing that you're already doing, right? thing that you're already doing, right? >> It's a great idea. >> It's a great idea. >> It's a great idea. >> Oh, yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> Yeah. um [snorts] you know who who who's >> Yeah. um [snorts] you know who who who's >> Yeah. um [snorts] you know who who who's out there that that's in that same out there that that's in that same out there that that's in that same vertical as you um that are doing things vertical as you um that are doing things vertical as you um that are doing things uh in different ways than you are and uh in different ways than you are and uh in different ways than you are and what can you learn from those? Right. M what can you learn from those? Right. M what can you learn from those? Right. M >> one of the interesting things about the >> one of the interesting things about the >> one of the interesting things about the the CDL uh initial founder um was all of the CDL uh initial founder um was all of the CDL uh initial founder um was all of the companies that he competes against the companies that he competes against the companies that he competes against are publicly traded and he he keeps an are publicly traded and he he keeps an are publicly traded and he he keeps an eye on exactly what their numbers are eye on exactly what their numbers are eye on exactly what their numbers are and he goes I know we're four times and he goes I know we're four times and he goes I know we're four times better than they are and my numbers better than they are and my numbers better than they are and my numbers aren't public but you know it's like aren't public but you know it's like aren't public but you know it's like you're able to keep track of you know you're able to keep track of you know you're able to keep track of you know what are the things that can come in um what are the things that can come in um what are the things that can come in um pandemics uh I was working for a major pandemics uh I was working for a major pandemics uh I was working for a major bank bank bank >> who literally made >> who literally made >> who literally made >> told me I needed to move to another city >> told me I needed to move to another city >> told me I needed to move to another city to be at a core location uh 6 months to be at a core location uh 6 months to be at a core location uh 6 months well four months five months before the well four months five months before the well four months five months before the pandemic hit and then everybody was pandemic hit and then everybody was pandemic hit and then everybody was working from home and that was a problem working from home and that was a problem working from home and that was a problem was I was working from home was I was working from home was I was working from home >> you know >> you know >> you know >> and you know again what I was >> and you know again what I was >> and you know again what I was contributing uh was a high value to the contributing uh was a high value to the contributing uh was a high value to the organization. I'll just say that. So uh organization. I'll just say that. So uh organization. I'll just say that. So uh they basically said well you're not they basically said well you're not they basically said well you're not going to follow our policy so we're going to follow our policy so we're going to follow our policy so we're willing to lose top talent. So willing to lose top talent. So willing to lose top talent. So >> that's interesting. It's not a good idea >> that's interesting. It's not a good idea >> that's interesting. It's not a good idea >> you know like because community >> you know like because community >> you know like because community everything that we uh believe in noble everything that we uh believe in noble everything that we uh believe in noble founders founders founders uh community and ecosystem uh community and ecosystem uh community and ecosystem uh when we started this you know uh when uh when we started this you know uh when uh when we started this you know uh when I had initial you know conversations I had initial you know conversations I had initial you know conversations with Roselia and a lot of people and with Roselia and a lot of people and with Roselia and a lot of people and Roselia is leading the the Houston

Roselia is leading the the Houston Roselia is leading the the Houston chapter chapter chapter >> and her vision is on cocreation creating >> and her vision is on cocreation creating >> and her vision is on cocreation creating this you know safe environment this you know safe environment this you know safe environment >> uh solving local problems problems >> uh solving local problems problems >> uh solving local problems problems solving real problems, right? And I solving real problems, right? And I solving real problems, right? And I think like with you and I and even with think like with you and I and even with think like with you and I and even with Scott and the something global and Scott and the something global and Scott and the something global and something greater community, that's the something greater community, that's the something greater community, that's the same theme, you know, serving uh people same theme, you know, serving uh people same theme, you know, serving uh people and solving bigger problem. And I know and solving bigger problem. And I know and solving bigger problem. And I know like when the first time I talked you like when the first time I talked you like when the first time I talked you know uh [snorts] to Roselia I was like know uh [snorts] to Roselia I was like know uh [snorts] to Roselia I was like uh what problems can we solve and one uh what problems can we solve and one uh what problems can we solve and one thing just we had uh the conversation is thing just we had uh the conversation is thing just we had uh the conversation is well like human trafficking solving the well like human trafficking solving the well like human trafficking solving the housing problem and I know you are housing problem and I know you are housing problem and I know you are really you have a really uh you you're really you have a really uh you you're really you have a really uh you you're really big on those uh initiatives as really big on those uh initiatives as really big on those uh initiatives as well. So, how do you see a community well. So, how do you see a community well. So, how do you see a community coming together can really tackle these coming together can really tackle these coming together can really tackle these big problems? And I think Roselia can big problems? And I think Roselia can big problems? And I think Roselia can elaborate more on how Houston is a hub elaborate more on how Houston is a hub elaborate more on how Houston is a hub for for many of those things. for for many of those things. for for many of those things. >> Yeah, I'm I'm sure you know as >> Yeah, I'm I'm sure you know as >> Yeah, I'm I'm sure you know as [clears throat] well. Um I mean yeah I [clears throat] well. Um I mean yeah I [clears throat] well. Um I mean yeah I when I got my masters in social work I when I got my masters in social work I when I got my masters in social work I went down a rabbit hole of human went down a rabbit hole of human went down a rabbit hole of human trafficking and saw some UN reports that trafficking and saw some UN reports that trafficking and saw some UN reports that just not everybody has to read just not everybody has to read just not everybody has to read everything but if you are curious um I'm everything but if you are curious um I'm everything but if you are curious um I'm a mother uh so as a mama bear I had to a mother uh so as a mama bear I had to a mother uh so as a mama bear I had to learn everything about it um and how learn everything about it um and how learn everything about it um and how complex it is right and essentially complex it is right and essentially complex it is right and essentially Creattopia started because because of Creattopia started because because of Creattopia started because because of that rabbit hole that I went down um

that rabbit hole that I went down um that rabbit hole that I went down um because I saw how technology um is not because I saw how technology um is not because I saw how technology um is not necessarily necessarily necessarily improving our brain development and how improving our brain development and how improving our brain development and how that is that is that is >> making teens more susceptible to things >> making teens more susceptible to things >> making teens more susceptible to things like human trafficking. like human trafficking. like human trafficking. >> Uh yeah, I completely agree. I think uh >> Uh yeah, I completely agree. I think uh >> Uh yeah, I completely agree. I think uh uh one of the things that I say to that uh one of the things that I say to that uh one of the things that I say to that really uh disrupts people's thinking is really uh disrupts people's thinking is really uh disrupts people's thinking is I think it's safer safer to have your I think it's safer safer to have your I think it's safer safer to have your kids sleeping with a loaded gun in their kids sleeping with a loaded gun in their kids sleeping with a loaded gun in their room than a cell phone or a laptop. room than a cell phone or a laptop. room than a cell phone or a laptop. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Or a tablet or anything anything like >> Or a tablet or anything anything like >> Or a tablet or anything anything like that because uh the predators are out that because uh the predators are out that because uh the predators are out there. Um one of one of my abilities is there. Um one of one of my abilities is there. Um one of one of my abilities is to be able to think like a bad guy. Uh to be able to think like a bad guy. Uh to be able to think like a bad guy. Uh so I know how people are targeted. Um, so I know how people are targeted. Um, so I know how people are targeted. Um, you know, you you you know, you you you know, you you it happens so much. Um, and until it it happens so much. Um, and until it it happens so much. Um, and until it touches you personally, you know, in the touches you personally, you know, in the touches you personally, you know, in the home invasion, these guys were home invasion, these guys were home invasion, these guys were threatening to take my daughter. And, threatening to take my daughter. And, threatening to take my daughter. And, you know, my wife was the superhero you know, my wife was the superhero you know, my wife was the superhero because I was at that point already tied because I was at that point already tied because I was at that point already tied up. Um, but, you know, she wrapped up. Um, but, you know, she wrapped up. Um, but, you know, she wrapped herself around our daughter and said herself around our daughter and said herself around our daughter and said over my dead body, which is over my dead body, which is over my dead body, which is >> an offer they could have taken her up >> an offer they could have taken her up >> an offer they could have taken her up on. Um, on. Um, on. Um, >> so you you never know. um living in a >> so you you never know. um living in a >> so you you never know. um living in a place like Honduras, one of the most place like Honduras, one of the most place like Honduras, one of the most violent cities in the world, San Pedro violent cities in the world, San Pedro violent cities in the world, San Pedro Sula, um you you got to hear stories Sula, um you you got to hear stories Sula, um you you got to hear stories firsthand of of trafficking. Um you firsthand of of trafficking. Um you firsthand of of trafficking. Um you know, even before working with the know, even before working with the know, even before working with the physical security company, there's just physical security company, there's just physical security company, there's just nightmare scenarios and you you never uh nightmare scenarios and you you never uh nightmare scenarios and you you never uh it's like being hacked. You don't think it's like being hacked. You don't think it's like being hacked. You don't think it's going to happen to you. Um, and

it's going to happen to you. Um, and it's going to happen to you. Um, and then all of a sudden, you know, the then all of a sudden, you know, the then all of a sudden, you know, the unthinkable happens and that's unthinkable happens and that's unthinkable happens and that's too late to help prepare your kids from too late to help prepare your kids from too late to help prepare your kids from the dangers, right? You got to got to the dangers, right? You got to got to the dangers, right? You got to got to educate them educate them educate them >> and that like think like knowing things >> and that like think like knowing things >> and that like think like knowing things like that, like at least for me, right? like that, like at least for me, right? like that, like at least for me, right? Like once I know something, it's very Like once I know something, it's very Like once I know something, it's very hard for me to not do anything about it hard for me to not do anything about it hard for me to not do anything about it and to just be like that's just and to just be like that's just and to just be like that's just happening, you know? Um, like that's happening, you know? Um, like that's happening, you know? Um, like that's definitely something that wakes me up. definitely something that wakes me up. definitely something that wakes me up. like something that on the hard days like something that on the hard days like something that on the hard days that um right on the hard days that I'm that um right on the hard days that I'm that um right on the hard days that I'm like should I just give up? Is anything like should I just give up? Is anything like should I just give up? Is anything even worth it? Um it's the thing that's even worth it? Um it's the thing that's even worth it? Um it's the thing that's like yes. That's that's a lot of our why like yes. That's that's a lot of our why like yes. That's that's a lot of our why and a lot of um why we want to make and a lot of um why we want to make and a lot of um why we want to make these spaces and why we want to create these spaces and why we want to create these spaces and why we want to create the technology to be able to see what the technology to be able to see what the technology to be able to see what happens when we come together and happens when we come together and happens when we come together and co-create. Um because I do think that co-create. Um because I do think that co-create. Um because I do think that can heal our brains. I think that can be can heal our brains. I think that can be can heal our brains. I think that can be very helpful for a lot of different very helpful for a lot of different very helpful for a lot of different things that we're seeing with things that we're seeing with things that we're seeing with technology. Um [snorts] technology. Um [snorts] technology. Um [snorts] and and yeah, our youth matter and our and and yeah, our youth matter and our and and yeah, our youth matter and our future matters and our water matters, future matters and our water matters, future matters and our water matters, right?

right? right? >> I completely agree and I love that. >> I completely agree and I love that. >> I completely agree and I love that. [clears throat] Um, you know, we kind I [clears throat] Um, you know, we kind I [clears throat] Um, you know, we kind I went down the human trafficking side uh went down the human trafficking side uh went down the human trafficking side uh but really collaboration is what I think but really collaboration is what I think but really collaboration is what I think is uh the thing that solves so many of is uh the thing that solves so many of is uh the thing that solves so many of these problems and um you know Ben from these problems and um you know Ben from these problems and um you know Ben from even our earliest conversations I was even our earliest conversations I was even our earliest conversations I was like if you're going to build this like if you're going to build this like if you're going to build this community you know build it so that it's community you know build it so that it's community you know build it so that it's easy to work with people um where we can easy to work with people um where we can easy to work with people um where we can come in and help each other in that come in and help each other in that come in and help each other in that season where it makes sense and you know season where it makes sense and you know season where it makes sense and you know not sign all these agreements that lock not sign all these agreements that lock not sign all these agreements that lock you in legal chains. with each other. you in legal chains. with each other. you in legal chains. with each other. Um, just look like, hey, Um, just look like, hey, Um, just look like, hey, >> you have a a capability I'm interested >> you have a a capability I'm interested >> you have a a capability I'm interested in. Maybe it's even, you know, sort of in. Maybe it's even, you know, sort of in. Maybe it's even, you know, sort of going back to bartering system, right? I going back to bartering system, right? I going back to bartering system, right? I I have a technology solution that I I have a technology solution that I I have a technology solution that I think could really help you. If you help think could really help you. If you help think could really help you. If you help me, I help you and we both win together. me, I help you and we both win together. me, I help you and we both win together. I mean those are those are the types of I mean those are those are the types of I mean those are those are the types of things I want always to be uh in things I want always to be uh in things I want always to be uh in collabor collaborations with people not collabor collaborations with people not collabor collaborations with people not not partnerships not stuff because again not partnerships not stuff because again not partnerships not stuff because again um you know they could take a turn and um you know they could take a turn and um you know they could take a turn and then I don't want to detangle myself then I don't want to detangle myself then I don't want to detangle myself it's like a divorce right if you if you it's like a divorce right if you if you it's like a divorce right if you if you have a partnership it's you know to have a partnership it's you know to have a partnership it's you know to break that off break that off break that off >> can take lawyers and lawsuits and stuff >> can take lawyers and lawsuits and stuff >> can take lawyers and lawsuits and stuff like that just work with each other like that just work with each other like that just work with each other while it makes sense while it makes sense while it makes sense >> no collaborate >> no collaborate >> no collaborate >> collaborate I think that's that's that's >> collaborate I think that's that's that's >> collaborate I think that's that's that's I think that's that's the key word.

I think that's that's the key word. I think that's that's the key word. >> Yeah. and and you know contribute like >> Yeah. and and you know contribute like >> Yeah. and and you know contribute like you know I think there like a lot of you know I think there like a lot of you know I think there like a lot of people they just uh question you know people they just uh question you know people they just uh question you know why you guys are doing it like you know why you guys are doing it like you know why you guys are doing it like you know what is behind it what is what is in it what is behind it what is what is in it what is behind it what is what is in it for you right for you right for you right >> that's right >> that's right >> that's right >> um to me innovation comes from creation >> um to me innovation comes from creation >> um to me innovation comes from creation creation comes from collaboration creation comes from collaboration creation comes from collaboration >> right >> right >> right >> so when we work together I have this >> so when we work together I have this >> so when we work together I have this flywheel you know [laughter] flywheel you know [laughter] flywheel you know [laughter] so when We as a community come together, so when We as a community come together, so when We as a community come together, we help each other, we contribute. we help each other, we contribute. we help each other, we contribute. People with money, they contri People with money, they contri People with money, they contri contribute financially, people with uh contribute financially, people with uh contribute financially, people with uh intellect, they contribute with, you intellect, they contribute with, you intellect, they contribute with, you know, IP and intellectual property. know, IP and intellectual property. know, IP and intellectual property. >> Uh people with resources, people with >> Uh people with resources, people with >> Uh people with resources, people with talent, we all contribute talent, we all contribute talent, we all contribute >> and we all rise together, right? >> and we all rise together, right? >> and we all rise together, right? Everything will uh elevate. We we lift Everything will uh elevate. We we lift Everything will uh elevate. We we lift the economy, we lift the community and the economy, we lift the community and the economy, we lift the community and and then the same communities invest in and then the same communities invest in and then the same communities invest in this uh in in in new ideas, new this uh in in in new ideas, new this uh in in in new ideas, new businesses and we all become successful businesses and we all become successful businesses and we all become successful and and that's how you build new stuff, and and that's how you build new stuff, and and that's how you build new stuff, right? When we are building this right? When we are building this right? When we are building this community, when we are building this community, when we are building this community, when we are building this ecosystem, the goal is come together, ecosystem, the goal is come together, ecosystem, the goal is come together, collaborate and that's how it becomes collaborate and that's how it becomes collaborate and that's how it becomes really attractive to investors, really attractive to investors, really attractive to investors, attractive to uh people with money and attractive to uh people with money and attractive to uh people with money and resources and they come and support it.

resources and they come and support it. resources and they come and support it. >> And it's all Houston centered >> And it's all Houston centered >> And it's all Houston centered >> and all Houston centered right >> and all Houston centered right >> and all Houston centered right >> by Houston for Houston. >> by Houston for Houston. >> by Houston for Houston. >> So let me tell you a story like there's >> So let me tell you a story like there's >> So let me tell you a story like there's a company um he's building an operating a company um he's building an operating a company um he's building an operating system for cars an entrepreneur. He was system for cars an entrepreneur. He was system for cars an entrepreneur. He was in Houston was working on his idea. He in Houston was working on his idea. He in Houston was working on his idea. He didn't get the support in Houston. He didn't get the support in Houston. He didn't get the support in Houston. He went to Austin. He didn't get support in went to Austin. He didn't get support in went to Austin. He didn't get support in Austin. Now he's in San Francisco. Austin. Now he's in San Francisco. Austin. Now he's in San Francisco. >> Oh wow. >> Oh wow. >> Oh wow. >> And this is a real story. This is a true >> And this is a real story. This is a true >> And this is a real story. This is a true story. Yeah. story. Yeah. story. Yeah. >> And a lot of people when I they ask like >> And a lot of people when I they ask like >> And a lot of people when I they ask like what is in there for you what is in there for you what is in there for you collaboration creating greater you know collaboration creating greater you know collaboration creating greater you know uh innovative ideas and also if you're uh innovative ideas and also if you're uh innovative ideas and also if you're building a fund if you're building um building a fund if you're building um building a fund if you're building um financial support financial support financial support we need to build a very strong ecosystem we need to build a very strong ecosystem we need to build a very strong ecosystem that supports that supports that supports >> that financial uh decisions like >> that financial uh decisions like >> that financial uh decisions like investors who invest in funds. They investors who invest in funds. They investors who invest in funds. They wanted to see uh you have really great wanted to see uh you have really great wanted to see uh you have really great uh companies and you have great uh uh companies and you have great uh uh companies and you have great uh people that they are worth investing people that they are worth investing people that they are worth investing >> and you know so now talking about >> and you know so now talking about >> and you know so now talking about investors how do you feel about customer investors how do you feel about customer investors how do you feel about customer leadership and disruption from an leadership and disruption from an leadership and disruption from an investor like let's just turn the you investor like let's just turn the you investor like let's just turn the you know [laughter] know [laughter] know [laughter] >> so first of all I love the whole the >> so first of all I love the whole the >> so first of all I love the whole the whole theory behind the ecosystem whole theory behind the ecosystem whole theory behind the ecosystem because again you're building a because again you're building a because again you're building a community right and it's communities of community right and it's communities of community right and it's communities of trust break down barriers and make trust break down barriers and make trust break down barriers and make things possible that aren't possible things possible that aren't possible things possible that aren't possible without it. Um, one of, in fact, my

without it. Um, one of, in fact, my without it. Um, one of, in fact, my fourth, the fourth collaboration book fourth, the fourth collaboration book fourth, the fourth collaboration book collaboration I had was called, uh, my collaboration I had was called, uh, my collaboration I had was called, uh, my chapter in Voices for Leadership Volume chapter in Voices for Leadership Volume chapter in Voices for Leadership Volume Two is called uh, community leadership Two is called uh, community leadership Two is called uh, community leadership for the good of the world. And it's it's for the good of the world. And it's it's for the good of the world. And it's it's really about where do you see there really about where do you see there really about where do you see there being a need within your community being a need within your community being a need within your community [snorts] [snorts] [snorts] and then step up, fill that fill that and then step up, fill that fill that and then step up, fill that fill that need. I think that that summarizes what need. I think that that summarizes what need. I think that that summarizes what you guys are building here extremely you guys are building here extremely you guys are building here extremely well. well. well. um a uh you know not every startup is um a uh you know not every startup is um a uh you know not every startup is going to have the capital to move going to have the capital to move going to have the capital to move multiple times and keep their dream multiple times and keep their dream multiple times and keep their dream alive uh before they find somebody who alive uh before they find somebody who alive uh before they find somebody who will get them funding. The other thing I will get them funding. The other thing I will get them funding. The other thing I think is think is think is >> um there's a lot of [clears throat] >> um there's a lot of [clears throat] >> um there's a lot of [clears throat] let's say predatory investors out there let's say predatory investors out there let's say predatory investors out there um that will try to steal their dream um that will try to steal their dream um that will try to steal their dream >> um and you got to keep the sharks out of >> um and you got to keep the sharks out of >> um and you got to keep the sharks out of your waters, right? and and uh so I your waters, right? and and uh so I your waters, right? and and uh so I really love how that all comes together really love how that all comes together really love how that all comes together in a strong uh psychologically safe uh in a strong uh psychologically safe uh in a strong uh psychologically safe uh community. You look out for each other, community. You look out for each other, community. You look out for each other, right? You can say, "Hey, uh I tried to right? You can say, "Hey, uh I tried to right? You can say, "Hey, uh I tried to do business with this guy. He took my do business with this guy. He took my do business with this guy. He took my money and took three times as long to money and took three times as long to money and took three times as long to deliver." Um you know that kind of deliver." Um you know that kind of deliver." Um you know that kind of >> Yeah. Right. that you create that >> Yeah. Right. that you create that >> Yeah. Right. that you create that safety, right? You create the safety for safety, right? You create the safety for safety, right? You create the safety for people to be able to be vulnerable. And people to be able to be vulnerable. And people to be able to be vulnerable. And that's I mean that's that's the that's I mean that's that's the that's I mean that's that's the importance of space, the importance of importance of space, the importance of importance of space, the importance of really building the community and the really building the community and the really building the community and the trust so that people can say the things trust so that people can say the things trust so that people can say the things that are happening cuz I feel like that are happening cuz I feel like that are happening cuz I feel like there's a lot of shame in admitting there's a lot of shame in admitting there's a lot of shame in admitting things like that happen.

things like that happen. things like that happen. >> Um and from just like a psychological >> Um and from just like a psychological >> Um and from just like a psychological and like social psychological and like social psychological and like social psychological perspective um it's interesting to perspective um it's interesting to perspective um it's interesting to witness what happens when a lot of witness what happens when a lot of witness what happens when a lot of people come together and just the things people come together and just the things people come together and just the things that naturally arise. Um so yeah that naturally arise. Um so yeah that naturally arise. Um so yeah definitely something to think about. definitely something to think about. definitely something to think about. Yeah, it's hard. Um there, you know, Yeah, it's hard. Um there, you know, Yeah, it's hard. Um there, you know, within a community once, um there was a within a community once, um there was a within a community once, um there was a question asked, "How many of you have question asked, "How many of you have question asked, "How many of you have filed for bank, you know, have gone gone filed for bank, you know, have gone gone filed for bank, you know, have gone gone bankrupt?" And I was like one of the two bankrupt?" And I was like one of the two bankrupt?" And I was like one of the two hands in a room of, you know, half more hands in a room of, you know, half more hands in a room of, you know, half more than a dozen people that didn't have than a dozen people that didn't have than a dozen people that didn't have their hand up. Um, you know, not that I their hand up. Um, you know, not that I their hand up. Um, you know, not that I couldn't have, maybe a couple of times, couldn't have, maybe a couple of times, couldn't have, maybe a couple of times, but you know, uh, it's it's tough and but you know, uh, it's it's tough and but you know, uh, it's it's tough and and you know, as you're building stuff, and you know, as you're building stuff, and you know, as you're building stuff, when the cash flow stops, it it gets uh when the cash flow stops, it it gets uh when the cash flow stops, it it gets uh you need someplace to go uh to talk to. you need someplace to go uh to talk to. you need someplace to go uh to talk to. And guess what? If the if the money And guess what? If the if the money And guess what? If the if the money relationships aren't already developed, relationships aren't already developed, relationships aren't already developed, you're not going to find that money in you're not going to find that money in you're not going to find that money in time. So, that's another reason why um time. So, that's another reason why um time. So, that's another reason why um building this u is is super helpful building this u is is super helpful building this u is is super helpful because you'll be able to help the because you'll be able to help the because you'll be able to help the people in people in people in >> in the time of need. You'll already have >> in the time of need. You'll already have >> in the time of need. You'll already have the trust in what they're building and the trust in what they're building and the trust in what they're building and be able to find the the right path uh to be able to find the the right path uh to be able to find the the right path uh to to help them and uh to to grow and to help them and uh to to grow and to help them and uh to to grow and succeed together. Um, one of the things succeed together. Um, one of the things succeed together. Um, one of the things about business interrogation that I about business interrogation that I about business interrogation that I probably have never said publicly is, probably have never said publicly is, probably have never said publicly is, um, I charge for the value of the um, I charge for the value of the um, I charge for the value of the service that I provide to the person and service that I provide to the person and service that I provide to the person and they decide how big a check to write.

they decide how big a check to write. they decide how big a check to write. So, if I if they if you end up talking So, if I if they if you end up talking So, if I if they if you end up talking to me and no value is gained, I don't to me and no value is gained, I don't to me and no value is gained, I don't expect to get paid. So, I only want to expect to get paid. So, I only want to expect to get paid. So, I only want to get paid when I help you solve a get paid when I help you solve a get paid when I help you solve a problem. problem. problem. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Interesting. >> Interesting. >> Interesting. >> I just have one more question before we >> I just have one more question before we >> I just have one more question before we go to our studio audience. Um so get go to our studio audience. Um so get go to our studio audience. Um so get ready studio audience. ready studio audience. ready studio audience. >> Um but what kind of patterns have you >> Um but what kind of patterns have you >> Um but what kind of patterns have you seen after working with all these seen after working with all these seen after working with all these companies? What are like the biggest um companies? What are like the biggest um companies? What are like the biggest um challenges I guess that they go through challenges I guess that they go through challenges I guess that they go through or things that you're like constantly or things that you're like constantly or things that you're like constantly being like you need to fix this? being like you need to fix this? being like you need to fix this? >> Yeah. Well, and again, um, not to, you >> Yeah. Well, and again, um, not to, you >> Yeah. Well, and again, um, not to, you know, overly promote Ben, uh, but, uh, know, overly promote Ben, uh, but, uh, know, overly promote Ben, uh, but, uh, one of the things that I love about Ben one of the things that I love about Ben one of the things that I love about Ben is he's thinking about, um, you know, is he's thinking about, um, you know, is he's thinking about, um, you know, what what part [snorts] of your what what what part [snorts] of your what what what part [snorts] of your what chapter of your journey are you on and chapter of your journey are you on and chapter of your journey are you on and kind of being able to snapshot that so kind of being able to snapshot that so kind of being able to snapshot that so that you're not getting the wrong amount that you're not getting the wrong amount that you're not getting the wrong amount of funding at the wrong time. because of funding at the wrong time. because of funding at the wrong time. because obviously if your company's not worth obviously if your company's not worth obviously if your company's not worth much and you get take a bunch of money, much and you get take a bunch of money, much and you get take a bunch of money, you're going to lose a ton of value.

you're going to lose a ton of value. you're going to lose a ton of value. >> And so, um, knowing where you are and >> And so, um, knowing where you are and >> And so, um, knowing where you are and and having that ecosystem structured, I and having that ecosystem structured, I and having that ecosystem structured, I think, uh, the people who aren't in think, uh, the people who aren't in think, uh, the people who aren't in communities, they they don't have that, communities, they they don't have that, communities, they they don't have that, uh, that awareness. So, um, I' I've uh, that awareness. So, um, I' I've uh, that awareness. So, um, I' I've talked to founders that say, you know, talked to founders that say, you know, talked to founders that say, you know, I'm ready to 10x my company, and then I'm ready to 10x my company, and then I'm ready to 10x my company, and then you go in and they don't have any you go in and they don't have any you go in and they don't have any systems in place. Um, and I'm like, you systems in place. Um, and I'm like, you systems in place. Um, and I'm like, you know, if you 2x your company, you're out know, if you 2x your company, you're out know, if you 2x your company, you're out of business because you can't you won't of business because you can't you won't of business because you can't you won't be able to handle be able to handle be able to handle >> the things there. There's ceilings of >> the things there. There's ceilings of >> the things there. There's ceilings of complexity is what Dan Dan Sullivan complexity is what Dan Dan Sullivan complexity is what Dan Dan Sullivan would call it. But, you know, the thing would call it. But, you know, the thing would call it. But, you know, the thing that got you here won't get you any that got you here won't get you any that got you here won't get you any further. And you need to see, you know, further. And you need to see, you know, further. And you need to see, you know, do I need to hire a sales team now? Do I do I need to hire a sales team now? Do I do I need to hire a sales team now? Do I need to start thinking about marketing? need to start thinking about marketing? need to start thinking about marketing? Do I do I have my message right? because Do I do I have my message right? because Do I do I have my message right? because once you once you turn on the sales at a once you once you turn on the sales at a once you once you turn on the sales at a level that you're not ready to go into, level that you're not ready to go into, level that you're not ready to go into, um you you could then start jeopardizing um you you could then start jeopardizing um you you could then start jeopardizing your relationships with the long-term your relationships with the long-term your relationships with the long-term clients that you rely on to keep your clients that you rely on to keep your clients that you rely on to keep your bills paid. So, you really need to do bills paid. So, you really need to do bills paid. So, you really need to do the pre-work. Um everybody's trying to the pre-work. Um everybody's trying to the pre-work. Um everybody's trying to sell you what they sell you. Um but sell you what they sell you. Um but sell you what they sell you. Um but you're not ready for everything at all you're not ready for everything at all you're not ready for everything at all time at all the time. And if you if you time at all the time. And if you if you time at all the time. And if you if you buy a solution that unclogs one pipe buy a solution that unclogs one pipe buy a solution that unclogs one pipe without looking at the whole system end without looking at the whole system end without looking at the whole system end to end, you're likely to trip over to end, you're likely to trip over to end, you're likely to trip over something pretty important. So something pretty important. So something pretty important. So >> stay high level.

>> stay high level. >> stay high level. >> Yeah. And and you know build with >> Yeah. And and you know build with >> Yeah. And and you know build with intention, right? If you're ready to go intention, right? If you're ready to go intention, right? If you're ready to go from this level to this level, talk to from this level to this level, talk to from this level to this level, talk to somebody who's already made that somebody who's already made that somebody who's already made that journey. Again, have the ecosystem where journey. Again, have the ecosystem where journey. Again, have the ecosystem where you can say, [clears throat] you can say, [clears throat] you can say, [clears throat] >> "How did you solve for, you know, not >> "How did you solve for, you know, not >> "How did you solve for, you know, not having a sales team?" And then, you having a sales team?" And then, you having a sales team?" And then, you know, um I'm not a fan of pay me 10 know, um I'm not a fan of pay me 10 know, um I'm not a fan of pay me 10 $10,000 a month and I'll put some ads $10,000 a month and I'll put some ads $10,000 a month and I'll put some ads on, you know, some websites. Well, on, you know, some websites. Well, on, you know, some websites. Well, >> you have no investment in my success. >> you have no investment in my success. >> you have no investment in my success. >> You know, why don't you do what you do >> You know, why don't you do what you do >> You know, why don't you do what you do and I'll pay you for every customer you and I'll pay you for every customer you and I'll pay you for every customer you bring me. Right? I mean, that's where bring me. Right? I mean, that's where bring me. Right? I mean, that's where we're now collaborating. We're winning we're now collaborating. We're winning we're now collaborating. We're winning together. If you're as good as you say together. If you're as good as you say together. If you're as good as you say you are, bring me some customers, right? you are, bring me some customers, right? you are, bring me some customers, right? [laughter] and we'll we'll drive the [laughter] and we'll we'll drive the [laughter] and we'll we'll drive the other together, you know. So, other together, you know. So, other together, you know. So, >> and you know, in the ecosystem model, >> and you know, in the ecosystem model, >> and you know, in the ecosystem model, it's kind of like a value exchange, it's kind of like a value exchange, it's kind of like a value exchange, right? right? right? >> You exchange value and you uh >> You exchange value and you uh >> You exchange value and you uh collaborate with others. Yeah. Yeah.

collaborate with others. Yeah. Yeah. collaborate with others. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. >> Yeah. And and know at what point to to >> Yeah. And and know at what point to to >> Yeah. And and know at what point to to reward the people who are, you know, at reward the people who are, you know, at reward the people who are, you know, at some point you you can't pay and maybe some point you you can't pay and maybe some point you you can't pay and maybe the community is helping you, but the community is helping you, but the community is helping you, but eventually when you solve your cash flow eventually when you solve your cash flow eventually when you solve your cash flow issue, um start paying them for issue, um start paying them for issue, um start paying them for Absolutely. And why not to pay people in Absolutely. And why not to pay people in Absolutely. And why not to pay people in the community? Like a lot of people are the community? Like a lot of people are the community? Like a lot of people are saying, what is the value of saying, what is the value of saying, what is the value of >> uh the ecosystem? To me, we're just >> uh the ecosystem? To me, we're just >> uh the ecosystem? To me, we're just like, look, um let's say somebody is in like, look, um let's say somebody is in like, look, um let's say somebody is in series A, somebody just raised money. series A, somebody just raised money. series A, somebody just raised money. What we're asking is, can you hire the What we're asking is, can you hire the What we're asking is, can you hire the startups in our ecosystem first startups in our ecosystem first startups in our ecosystem first >> so they get some value? Can you work >> so they get some value? Can you work >> so they get some value? Can you work with our partners that they really work with our partners that they really work with our partners that they really work really hard to get us here? So the money really hard to get us here? So the money really hard to get us here? So the money stays in the community and it helps stays in the community and it helps stays in the community and it helps everybody. It just everybody. It just everybody. It just >> basically do you want to be part of our >> basically do you want to be part of our >> basically do you want to be part of our flywheel? flywheel? flywheel? >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> Well, and and again, what's great about >> Well, and and again, what's great about >> Well, and and again, what's great about that is if I work with somebody in the that is if I work with somebody in the that is if I work with somebody in the community and let's say I get 20% less community and let's say I get 20% less community and let's say I get 20% less value than I would have if I had worked value than I would have if I had worked value than I would have if I had worked with somebody that I know has already with somebody that I know has already with somebody that I know has already got that solved, well, I can go to them got that solved, well, I can go to them got that solved, well, I can go to them and say, "Hey, this is where it didn't and say, "Hey, this is where it didn't and say, "Hey, this is where it didn't work for me. Can you help improve that?"

work for me. Can you help improve that?" work for me. Can you help improve that?" That's really that customer-driven That's really that customer-driven That's really that customer-driven leadership part where you can leadership part where you can leadership part where you can proactively say, "Hey, I really wished proactively say, "Hey, I really wished proactively say, "Hey, I really wished your service had done this instead of your service had done this instead of your service had done this instead of this." Um, and so you're helping them this." Um, and so you're helping them this." Um, and so you're helping them fix their flywheel as well as um, you fix their flywheel as well as um, you fix their flywheel as well as um, you know, keeping it in the community. know, keeping it in the community. know, keeping it in the community. >> All good things. >> All good things. >> All good things. >> This is so exciting. Thank you for being >> This is so exciting. Thank you for being >> This is so exciting. Thank you for being here with us. here with us. here with us. >> Yeah, thanks. >> Yeah, thanks. >> Yeah, thanks. >> Do we have uh questions from Wait, how >> Do we have uh questions from Wait, how >> Do we have uh questions from Wait, how are we going to give this away? I was are we going to give this away? I was are we going to give this away? I was thinking of like just thinking of like just thinking of like just >> the best question. I'm an interrogator. >> the best question. I'm an interrogator. >> the best question. I'm an interrogator. I I taught interrogation. [laughter] I I taught interrogation. [laughter] I I taught interrogation. [laughter] >> No pressure. >> No pressure. >> No pressure. >> No pressure. Who's going to ask me the >> No pressure. Who's going to ask me the >> No pressure. Who's going to ask me the best question? best question? best question? >> Somebody Roland. Well, you got to come >> Somebody Roland. Well, you got to come >> Somebody Roland. Well, you got to come up to the purple circle and then grab up to the purple circle and then grab up to the purple circle and then grab the mic. the mic. the mic. >> We should shine a bright light in his >> We should shine a bright light in his >> We should shine a bright light in his eye, too. I just [laughter] eye, too. I just [laughter] eye, too. I just [laughter] be fair. I mean, we've got be fair. I mean, we've got be fair. I mean, we've got >> Okay, you get you get to >> Okay, you get you get to >> Okay, you get you get to >> give it. >> give it. >> give it. >> Great talk. >> Great talk. >> Great talk. My question is, My question is, My question is, >> wait, tell us who you are and how you >> wait, tell us who you are and how you >> wait, tell us who you are and how you found found found >> Thank you.

>> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. My question [snorts] to you is >> Yeah. My question [snorts] to you is >> Yeah. My question [snorts] to you is what are your top three incentive check what are your top three incentive check what are your top three incentive check uh for a customer uh for a customer uh for a customer driven leadership company? driven leadership company? driven leadership company? >> Yeah. Yeah. No, that's a fantastic >> Yeah. Yeah. No, that's a fantastic >> Yeah. Yeah. No, that's a fantastic question. So um as we go in I'd say the question. So um as we go in I'd say the question. So um as we go in I'd say the first step is sort of to understand first step is sort of to understand first step is sort of to understand um you know there there are uh it's a um you know there there are uh it's a um you know there there are uh it's a business operating system an business operating system an business operating system an organizational operating system and organizational operating system and organizational operating system and there are organizational operating there are organizational operating there are organizational operating systems out there that are very good but systems out there that are very good but systems out there that are very good but it's very much this is the framework it's very much this is the framework it's very much this is the framework squeeze your company into our framework squeeze your company into our framework squeeze your company into our framework and our operating system will run your and our operating system will run your and our operating system will run your company. Uh CDL customer-driven company. Uh CDL customer-driven company. Uh CDL customer-driven leadership works the opposite. uh we go leadership works the opposite. uh we go leadership works the opposite. uh we go in there and see how do all of the in there and see how do all of the in there and see how do all of the departments within your organization departments within your organization departments within your organization interconnect with each other and then um interconnect with each other and then um interconnect with each other and then um like if I let's say my team serves uh uh like if I let's say my team serves uh uh like if I let's say my team serves uh uh Ben's team I'll go to Ben and go what's Ben's team I'll go to Ben and go what's Ben's team I'll go to Ben and go what's the one thing that we can do to help you the one thing that we can do to help you the one thing that we can do to help you deliver to the customer better right deliver to the customer better right deliver to the customer better right maybe I'm production and maybe there's a maybe I'm production and maybe there's a maybe I'm production and maybe there's a lot of customer complaints on technology lot of customer complaints on technology lot of customer complaints on technology not working so maybe it's I need to QC not working so maybe it's I need to QC not working so maybe it's I need to QC my my products better. I need to test my my products better. I need to test my my products better. I need to test them and make sure that they're actually them and make sure that they're actually them and make sure that they're actually working before I hand them off to working before I hand them off to working before I hand them off to shipping, right? Uh so um and then like shipping, right? Uh so um and then like shipping, right? Uh so um and then like how [snorts] do you determine how much how [snorts] do you determine how much how [snorts] do you determine how much is really also super entrepreneurial. Um is really also super entrepreneurial. Um is really also super entrepreneurial. Um I had a company once that one of the

I had a company once that one of the I had a company once that one of the things that they had a challenge that things that they had a challenge that things that they had a challenge that they had in um in in COVID was they had they had in um in in COVID was they had they had in um in in COVID was they had racked up a couple of hundred,000 in racked up a couple of hundred,000 in racked up a couple of hundred,000 in debt. So what we did is we when we debt. So what we did is we when we debt. So what we did is we when we designed the incentive program, we said, designed the incentive program, we said, designed the incentive program, we said, "Hey, look, this is how it's going to "Hey, look, this is how it's going to "Hey, look, this is how it's going to work, but for the health of the company, work, but for the health of the company, work, but for the health of the company, we need to pay down this debt that we we need to pay down this debt that we we need to pay down this debt that we have. Um, it doesn't need to maybe be have. Um, it doesn't need to maybe be have. Um, it doesn't need to maybe be zero, but it needs to be way less than zero, but it needs to be way less than zero, but it needs to be way less than the, you know, couple hundred,000 it is the, you know, couple hundred,000 it is the, you know, couple hundred,000 it is now. So what we're going to do is half now. So what we're going to do is half now. So what we're going to do is half of the incentive money is going to the of the incentive money is going to the of the incentive money is going to the debt and then the other half will go to debt and then the other half will go to debt and then the other half will go to the employees. And then once the debt the employees. And then once the debt the employees. And then once the debt gets down to this level we all agree on gets down to this level we all agree on gets down to this level we all agree on ahead of time now you get twice as much ahead of time now you get twice as much ahead of time now you get twice as much in in incentive checks. in in incentive checks. in in incentive checks. >> Follow up. How do you my what I was >> Follow up. How do you my what I was >> Follow up. How do you my what I was trying to really get at is how does that trying to really get at is how does that trying to really get at is how does that trickle down to whole good people in trickle down to whole good people in trickle down to whole good people in your company that incentive check with your company that incentive check with your company that incentive check with Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. So um again I I'll go back to that >> Yeah. So um again I I'll go back to that >> Yeah. So um again I I'll go back to that conversation. I I interviewed this CEO conversation. I I interviewed this CEO conversation. I I interviewed this CEO who works 16 hours a day, uh, you know, who works 16 hours a day, uh, you know, who works 16 hours a day, uh, you know, at least six days a week. Um, and he at least six days a week. Um, and he at least six days a week. Um, and he works that way because he wants to work works that way because he wants to work works that way because he wants to work that way. He's like a mad scientist in that way. He's like a mad scientist in that way. He's like a mad scientist in the lab of his [snorts] dreams. uh and the lab of his [snorts] dreams. uh and the lab of his [snorts] dreams. uh and you know when he said at one point that you know when he said at one point that you know when he said at one point that he had a 20-year period where he you he had a 20-year period where he you he had a 20-year period where he you know with 300 employees uh at least at know with 300 employees uh at least at know with 300 employees uh at least at the end of that 20 years where he only the end of that 20 years where he only the end of that 20 years where he only had five people quit to go work had five people quit to go work had five people quit to go work someplace else. someplace else. someplace else. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> So you tell tell me anybody else that's >> So you tell tell me anybody else that's >> So you tell tell me anybody else that's doing better than that how I would doing better than that how I would doing better than that how I would absolutely be interrogating the heck out absolutely be interrogating the heck out absolutely be interrogating the heck out of their processes but just he said of their processes but just he said of their processes but just he said people will die here they will retire people will die here they will retire people will die here they will retire from here but nobody wants to work from here but nobody wants to work from here but nobody wants to work anywhere else. So it just it it rewards anywhere else. So it just it it rewards anywhere else. So it just it it rewards them. [clears throat] Uh when they have them. [clears throat] Uh when they have them. [clears throat] Uh when they have a great idea that helps make the company a great idea that helps make the company a great idea that helps make the company improve, that's an additional incentive improve, that's an additional incentive improve, that's an additional incentive check. So you're really getting you're check. So you're really getting you're check. So you're really getting you're unlocking all the creative genius of unlocking all the creative genius of unlocking all the creative genius of your entire company to help you build a your entire company to help you build a your entire company to help you build a better company. And you know, in better company. And you know, in better company. And you know, in corporations, if you have a great idea, corporations, if you have a great idea, corporations, if you have a great idea, they're just going to patent it and keep they're just going to patent it and keep they're just going to patent it and keep it. They're not going to, you know, it. They're not going to, you know, it. They're not going to, you know, they'll give you a $100 thank you. Uh they'll give you a $100 thank you. Uh they'll give you a $100 thank you. Uh way to go, you're amazing. Um, and your way to go, you're amazing. Um, and your way to go, you're amazing. Um, and your name gets to be on the patent, but name gets to be on the patent, but name gets to be on the patent, but that's it, right?

that's it, right? that's it, right? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Oh, thank you. >> Oh, thank you. >> Oh, thank you. >> Yeah, >> Yeah, >> Yeah, >> thank you. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> Do you have another question? >> Do you have another question? >> Do you have another question? >> What what you just said seems like >> What what you just said seems like >> What what you just said seems like radical employee ownership, right? So radical employee ownership, right? So radical employee ownership, right? So well how do you how do you balance that well how do you how do you balance that well how do you how do you balance that in a world when you're going after in a world when you're going after in a world when you're going after venture capital and um your investors venture capital and um your investors venture capital and um your investors want you know to hold on to more value want you know to hold on to more value want you know to hold on to more value and you're trying to build a company and you're trying to build a company and you're trying to build a company where the ownership is shared more where the ownership is shared more where the ownership is shared more broadly uh with the employees from an broadly uh with the employees from an broadly uh with the employees from an incentive standpoint. How do you balance incentive standpoint. How do you balance incentive standpoint. How do you balance that? that? that? >> Yeah. Uh good question. uh definitely >> Yeah. Uh good question. uh definitely >> Yeah. Uh good question. uh definitely had some conversations with some had some conversations with some had some conversations with some employeeowned [snorts] uh uh companies employeeowned [snorts] uh uh companies employeeowned [snorts] uh uh companies uh mostly in the UK. Uh but one of the uh mostly in the UK. Uh but one of the uh mostly in the UK. Uh but one of the challenges is like okay you know how do challenges is like okay you know how do challenges is like okay you know how do we share the wealth of it and and I we share the wealth of it and and I we share the wealth of it and and I think the the CDL formula is a good way think the the CDL formula is a good way think the the CDL formula is a good way to give back to the employees for the to give back to the employees for the to give back to the employees for the work that they do. Um it's certainly, work that they do. Um it's certainly, work that they do. Um it's certainly, you know, if you're kind of somebody who you know, if you're kind of somebody who you know, if you're kind of somebody who wants to build their company up and then wants to build their company up and then wants to build their company up and then sell it, uh the odds that the next sell it, uh the odds that the next sell it, uh the odds that the next company is going to keep CDL in place, company is going to keep CDL in place, company is going to keep CDL in place, >> you know, it's possible. I would >> you know, it's possible. I would >> you know, it's possible. I would definitely negotiate for that. Uh definitely negotiate for that. Uh definitely negotiate for that. Uh because that's what got them noticed in because that's what got them noticed in because that's what got them noticed in the first place. Uh the numbers that CDL the first place. Uh the numbers that CDL the first place. Uh the numbers that CDL is going to generate. Uh so do what you is going to generate. Uh so do what you is going to generate. Uh so do what you can to keep the ecosystem. I'd say be can to keep the ecosystem. I'd say be can to keep the ecosystem. I'd say be honest with the people. I'd say if your honest with the people. I'd say if your honest with the people. I'd say if your goal in in a CDL driven company is to

goal in in a CDL driven company is to goal in in a CDL driven company is to sell it, I would definitely find a way sell it, I would definitely find a way sell it, I would definitely find a way to share equity uh with with the to share equity uh with with the to share equity uh with with the employees uh so that when it's sold they employees uh so that when it's sold they employees uh so that when it's sold they also win right also win right also win right >> and you know like adoption pools and uh >> and you know like adoption pools and uh >> and you know like adoption pools and uh a lot of different things and a lot of a lot of different things and a lot of a lot of different things and a lot of time you are the successful company and time you are the successful company and time you are the successful company and you are you know VCs are noticing you you are you know VCs are noticing you you are you know VCs are noticing you because of your employees and all the because of your employees and all the because of your employees and all the programs that you have. So if you just programs that you have. So if you just programs that you have. So if you just if you're just giving them up to get a if you're just giving them up to get a if you're just giving them up to get a VC, that VC is not the right partner for VC, that VC is not the right partner for VC, that VC is not the right partner for you. you. you. >> Correct. You know. >> Correct. You know. >> Correct. You know. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And and Yeah. And the same thing with >> And and Yeah. And the same thing with >> And and Yeah. And the same thing with getting acquired, right? When you when getting acquired, right? When you when getting acquired, right? When you when you get bought out, um if you're if you you get bought out, um if you're if you you get bought out, um if you're if you know, if you're selling it to like a know, if you're selling it to like a know, if you're selling it to like a multinational corporation, what are they multinational corporation, what are they multinational corporation, what are they going to do? They're just going to steal going to do? They're just going to steal going to do? They're just going to steal your customers and and your uh IP and your customers and and your uh IP and your customers and and your uh IP and liquidate your work workforce, right? liquidate your work workforce, right? liquidate your work workforce, right? That's uh so you got I mean you know be That's uh so you got I mean you know be That's uh so you got I mean you know be intentional, be honest about you know intentional, be honest about you know intentional, be honest about you know that mission. If the if part of the that mission. If the if part of the that mission. If the if part of the mission is eventually to exit, you know mission is eventually to exit, you know mission is eventually to exit, you know I I'd be honest with your employees. Uh I I'd be honest with your employees. Uh I I'd be honest with your employees. Uh and again include that and again uh and again include that and again uh and again include that and again uh incentives can be a lot of different incentives can be a lot of different incentives can be a lot of different things uh at a lot of different let's things uh at a lot of different let's things uh at a lot of different let's say you're a nonprofit and you're say you're a nonprofit and you're say you're a nonprofit and you're running customer-driven leadership.

running customer-driven leadership. running customer-driven leadership. Maybe it's maybe it's uh coaching and Maybe it's maybe it's uh coaching and Maybe it's maybe it's uh coaching and mentoring with the senior leadership mentoring with the senior leadership mentoring with the senior leadership opportunities, right? where where a c opportunities, right? where where a c opportunities, right? where where a c maybe a cash check for doing their their maybe a cash check for doing their their maybe a cash check for doing their their service isn't isn't an appropriate or service isn't isn't an appropriate or service isn't isn't an appropriate or unappreciated, you've got to give them unappreciated, you've got to give them unappreciated, you've got to give them something that's meaningful to them. something that's meaningful to them. something that's meaningful to them. Right? If I'm if I'm in a if I'm in a Right? If I'm if I'm in a if I'm in a Right? If I'm if I'm in a if I'm in a company or a nonprofit and my goal is to company or a nonprofit and my goal is to company or a nonprofit and my goal is to help stop human trafficking, the odds help stop human trafficking, the odds help stop human trafficking, the odds that a a check an extra check are going that a a check an extra check are going that a a check an extra check are going to make me excited about working for you to make me excited about working for you to make me excited about working for you is pretty slim probably, you know? So, is pretty slim probably, you know? So, is pretty slim probably, you know? So, give them something that they care give them something that they care give them something that they care about, about, about, >> right? >> right? >> right? >> Ironically, >> Ironically, >> Ironically, >> that's great. >> that's great. >> that's great. >> Always comes back to care about. >> Always comes back to care about. >> Always comes back to care about. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> That's great. We're gonna need a a book >> That's great. We're gonna need a a book >> That's great. We're gonna need a a book club to read this club to read this club to read this >> customerdriven leadership book. So, if >> customerdriven leadership book. So, if >> customerdriven leadership book. So, if anybody wants to join me for a book anybody wants to join me for a book anybody wants to join me for a book club, let me know. club, let me know. club, let me know. >> Hey, and uh happy to lead a mastermind >> Hey, and uh happy to lead a mastermind >> Hey, and uh happy to lead a mastermind around that. If if uh the community around that. If if uh the community around that. If if uh the community wants uh I can I can get you some books wants uh I can I can get you some books wants uh I can I can get you some books at cost. Um, if people want to get in, at cost. Um, if people want to get in, at cost. Um, if people want to get in, uh, just build it and I will I will uh, just build it and I will I will uh, just build it and I will I will come.

come. come. >> Yeah, this is exactly where we're where >> Yeah, this is exactly where we're where >> Yeah, this is exactly where we're where we're at. Just thinking in terms of we're at. Just thinking in terms of we're at. Just thinking in terms of growth and how we bring on people, growth and how we bring on people, growth and how we bring on people, right? And and how you really I mean, right? And and how you really I mean, right? And and how you really I mean, it's all about your culture and how it's all about your culture and how it's all about your culture and how you're keeping people around and and you're keeping people around and and you're keeping people around and and growing. I mean, if people aren't growing. I mean, if people aren't growing. I mean, if people aren't invested, then then you're not going to invested, then then you're not going to invested, then then you're not going to grow. If you don't have people's grow. If you don't have people's grow. If you don't have people's attention, attention, attention, >> it doesn't matter what you're doing. >> it doesn't matter what you're doing. >> it doesn't matter what you're doing. You're not going to [laughter] You're not going to [laughter] You're not going to [laughter] >> Well, I I can tell you another good >> Well, I I can tell you another good >> Well, I I can tell you another good question to ask uh when I'm when I'm question to ask uh when I'm when I'm question to ask uh when I'm when I'm evaluating a C uh you know a company is evaluating a C uh you know a company is evaluating a C uh you know a company is who who is irreplaceable >> who who when they leave kills your >> who who when they leave kills your entire company. entire company. entire company. >> A lot of times it's the tech people who >> A lot of times it's the tech people who >> A lot of times it's the tech people who who are are building the technology. Um who are are building the technology. Um who are are building the technology. Um you know make sure you increase the you know make sure you increase the you know make sure you increase the stickiness with those relationships. stickiness with those relationships. stickiness with those relationships. treat those people well and make them, treat those people well and make them, treat those people well and make them, you know, create a lot of things, uh, you know, create a lot of things, uh, you know, create a lot of things, uh, mistakes. I think people give equity too mistakes. I think people give equity too mistakes. I think people give equity too fast. Uh, they should have equity that fast. Uh, they should have equity that fast. Uh, they should have equity that builds, uh, over time and builds, uh, over time and builds, uh, over time and accomplishments, milestones.

accomplishments, milestones. accomplishments, milestones. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. So, the book goes to >> Yeah. So, the book goes to >> Yeah. So, the book goes to >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Wait, do we have time for one more >> Wait, do we have time for one more >> Wait, do we have time for one more question? We have time for one more question? We have time for one more question? We have time for one more question. question. question. >> Was there one more question out there? >> Was there one more question out there? >> Was there one more question out there? Secret uh success secrets of disruptors Secret uh success secrets of disruptors Secret uh success secrets of disruptors is what we're asking questions for. is what we're asking questions for. is what we're asking questions for. >> Hey every sorry to interrupt you. >> Hey every sorry to interrupt you. >> Hey every sorry to interrupt you. [laughter] [laughter] [laughter] >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Who are you? >> Who are you? >> Who are you? >> Hey everyone, I'm Shaka. Um this goes >> Hey everyone, I'm Shaka. Um this goes >> Hey everyone, I'm Shaka. Um this goes into You don't have to adjust the camera into You don't have to adjust the camera into You don't have to adjust the camera height because of me. [laughter] height because of me. [laughter] height because of me. [laughter] >> No. Yeah, we do. Cuz [clears throat] >> No. Yeah, we do. Cuz [clears throat] >> No. Yeah, we do. Cuz [clears throat] chops off of your head. chops off of your head. chops off of your head. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> That's literally his job. >> That's literally his job. >> That's literally his job. >> This goes to the question of like >> This goes to the question of like >> This goes to the question of like community incentives and building, community incentives and building, community incentives and building, right? So, uh, within, right? So, uh, within, right? So, uh, within, uh, Houston, right? We're going to just uh, Houston, right? We're going to just uh, Houston, right? We're going to just go ahead and center this in Houston go ahead and center this in Houston go ahead and center this in Houston because we're in Houston. Um, how do you because we're in Houston. Um, how do you because we're in Houston. Um, how do you get past, uh, kind of like the I would get past, uh, kind of like the I would get past, uh, kind of like the I would phrase it as like the big fish fallacy phrase it as like the big fish fallacy phrase it as like the big fish fallacy where, um, you you probably already kind where, um, you you probably already kind where, um, you you probably already kind of get where I'm going with it. of get where I'm going with it. of get where I'm going with it. >> Yeah. Yeah. But finish your question.

>> Yeah. Yeah. But finish your question. >> Yeah. Yeah. But finish your question. >> Okay. um where >> Okay. um where >> Okay. um where where you're more inclined to uh work where you're more inclined to uh work where you're more inclined to uh work with uh the another individual because with uh the another individual because with uh the another individual because they are the biggest, hottest, brightest they are the biggest, hottest, brightest they are the biggest, hottest, brightest um star in the in the area. um star in the in the area. um star in the in the area. >> Yeah. Yeah. Uh good friend of mine uh is >> Yeah. Yeah. Uh good friend of mine uh is >> Yeah. Yeah. Uh good friend of mine uh is Dr. Dr. Don Barton has a book uh that Dr. Dr. Don Barton has a book uh that Dr. Dr. Don Barton has a book uh that really talks about um the levels of of really talks about um the levels of of really talks about um the levels of of uh sales, right? So there there's three uh sales, right? So there there's three uh sales, right? So there there's three there's three kind of a pyramid of buy there's three kind of a pyramid of buy there's three kind of a pyramid of buy what people are interested in when what people are interested in when what people are interested in when they're buying. Uh the bottom level, they're buying. Uh the bottom level, they're buying. Uh the bottom level, let's call them Walmart shoppers. They let's call them Walmart shoppers. They let's call them Walmart shoppers. They only care about the price. They want to only care about the price. They want to only care about the price. They want to buy the cheapest thing possible. Uh buy the cheapest thing possible. Uh buy the cheapest thing possible. Uh that's what they're going to that's what that's what they're going to that's what that's what they're going to that's what they're going to invest in. Um you can they're going to invest in. Um you can they're going to invest in. Um you can undercut the big the big names by undercut the big the big names by undercut the big the big names by charging less. So that is an option. The charging less. So that is an option. The charging less. So that is an option. The middle brand, uh the people who let's middle brand, uh the people who let's middle brand, uh the people who let's say go to Target and maybe buy name say go to Target and maybe buy name say go to Target and maybe buy name brand clothing, polos and things like brand clothing, polos and things like brand clothing, polos and things like that. Um they care about uh safety and u that. Um they care about uh safety and u that. Um they care about uh safety and u being in, right? They're they're going being in, right? They're they're going being in, right? They're they're going to go with the brand because again, to go with the brand because again, to go with the brand because again, what's the what's the phrase? Nobody what's the what's the phrase? Nobody what's the what's the phrase? Nobody gets fired for hiring IBM, right?

gets fired for hiring IBM, right? gets fired for hiring IBM, right? >> Uh it's it's job security. So those are >> Uh it's it's job security. So those are >> Uh it's it's job security. So those are the people uh they're never going to the people uh they're never going to the people uh they're never going to hire you in in that case. Um they're hire you in in that case. Um they're hire you in in that case. Um they're going to they're going to be too risk going to they're going to be too risk going to they're going to be too risk adverse to take a chance on you. But the adverse to take a chance on you. But the adverse to take a chance on you. But the third level is the ROI people. And if third level is the ROI people. And if third level is the ROI people. And if you can show that you will give them a you can show that you will give them a you can show that you will give them a better return on their investment and better return on their investment and better return on their investment and you can get to them, right? That's how you can get to them, right? That's how you can get to them, right? That's how being part of a community that can open being part of a community that can open being part of a community that can open some doors for you and can get you at some doors for you and can get you at some doors for you and can get you at those ROI people. They're the people those ROI people. They're the people those ROI people. They're the people that their their time is worth so much that their their time is worth so much that their their time is worth so much money, they're going to have the tailor money, they're going to have the tailor money, they're going to have the tailor come to them to take their measurements come to them to take their measurements come to them to take their measurements and get the suit delivered wherever it and get the suit delivered wherever it and get the suit delivered wherever it needs to be rather than because it just needs to be rather than because it just needs to be rather than because it just they don't have time to mess around and they don't have time to mess around and they don't have time to mess around and and so you got to be really crisp in and so you got to be really crisp in and so you got to be really crisp in your message and your value proposition your message and your value proposition your message and your value proposition has to be crystal clear. So, one of the has to be crystal clear. So, one of the has to be crystal clear. So, one of the one of the jobs that I do is cyber one of the jobs that I do is cyber one of the jobs that I do is cyber exercises and I have seen what all of exercises and I have seen what all of exercises and I have seen what all of the big companies do and uh I know that the big companies do and uh I know that the big companies do and uh I know that I am better than anybody that they have.

I am better than anybody that they have. I am better than anybody that they have. Um, and you know, they'll get charged Um, and you know, they'll get charged Um, and you know, they'll get charged they they can charge $100,000 they they can charge $100,000 they they can charge $100,000 uh to to deliver a cookie cutter uh to to deliver a cookie cutter uh to to deliver a cookie cutter solution that um you know, they're going solution that um you know, they're going solution that um you know, they're going to do as little work as possible to to do as little work as possible to to do as little work as possible to customize it for the customer, but customize it for the customer, but customize it for the customer, but they're still going to get most of the they're still going to get most of the they're still going to get most of the corporate work because uh people aren't corporate work because uh people aren't corporate work because uh people aren't going to take a chance unless again they going to take a chance unless again they going to take a chance unless again they know me and and then they they've seen know me and and then they they've seen know me and and then they they've seen the exercises that I do. uh then they the exercises that I do. uh then they the exercises that I do. uh then they they would never go with those they would never go with those they would never go with those >> people >> people >> people again unless unless they were going to again unless unless they were going to again unless unless they were going to get fired if it went badly and they get fired if it went badly and they get fired if it went badly and they didn't have that total faith in my didn't have that total faith in my didn't have that total faith in my ability to deliver what their ability to deliver what their ability to deliver what their stakeholders want. stakeholders want. stakeholders want. >> So >> So >> So >> hopefully that was helpful. [laughter] >> hopefully that was helpful. [laughter] >> hopefully that was helpful. [laughter] >> I think so. >> I think so. >> I think so. >> Thank you, Shaka. >> Thank you, Shaka. >> Thank you, Shaka. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. Um well, I think we're right at >> Yeah. Um well, I think we're right at >> Yeah. Um well, I think we're right at one. Um, and we do want to hang out with one. Um, and we do want to hang out with one. Um, and we do want to hang out with our studio audience after. So, thank you our studio audience after. So, thank you our studio audience after. So, thank you everybody that's here in person. everybody that's here in person. everybody that's here in person. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> Uh, we'll be here a little bit after, >> Uh, we'll be here a little bit after, >> Uh, we'll be here a little bit after, uh, hanging out with Daniel and asking uh, hanging out with Daniel and asking uh, hanging out with Daniel and asking him more questions and interrogating the him more questions and interrogating the him more questions and interrogating the interrogator.

interrogator. interrogator. >> Ever since [laughter] I stopped being an >> Ever since [laughter] I stopped being an >> Ever since [laughter] I stopped being an interrogation instructor, people don't interrogation instructor, people don't interrogation instructor, people don't ask me enough questions, ask me enough questions, ask me enough questions, >> you know. >> you know. >> you know. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So, yeah, thank you so much for being >> So, yeah, thank you so much for being >> So, yeah, thank you so much for being here. here. here. >> A pleasure. This is great. Thank you. >> A pleasure. This is great. Thank you. >> A pleasure. This is great. Thank you. Learned a lot. Learned a lot. Learned a lot. >> Thank you. Yeah. Appreciate it. Thank >> Thank you. Yeah. Appreciate it. Thank >> Thank you. Yeah. Appreciate it. Thank you so much. you so much. you so much. >> Yeah. And thank you to 801 Travis and >> Yeah. And thank you to 801 Travis and >> Yeah. And thank you to 801 Travis and the Innovation Hub and Iron Grove. Um, the Innovation Hub and Iron Grove. Um, the Innovation Hub and Iron Grove. Um, and yeah, and anybody that tuned in and yeah, and anybody that tuned in and yeah, and anybody that tuned in online. Um, and anybody that's here in online. Um, and anybody that's here in online. Um, and anybody that's here in person, come back next Friday as person, come back next Friday as person, come back next Friday as [snorts] we continue building our [snorts] we continue building our [snorts] we continue building our ecosystem together, one conversation at ecosystem together, one conversation at ecosystem together, one conversation at a time. a time. a time. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you.