Are UFOs Actually Demonic? Hugh Ross on UAPs, Aliens & the Spiritual Realm

When you go to the crash site, you'll When you go to the crash site, you'll see a shallow depression. You'll see a see a shallow depression. You'll see a see a shallow depression. You'll see a [music] crater. The vegetation will be [music] crater. The vegetation will be [music] crater. The vegetation will be damaged. If there's snow, the snow will damaged. If there's snow, the snow will damaged. If there's snow, the snow will be melted. Yet, when you examine the be melted. Yet, when you examine the be melted. Yet, when you examine the crater site, there's no debris, there's crater site, there's no debris, there's crater site, there's no debris, there's no artifacts. [music] And in a famous no artifacts. [music] And in a famous no artifacts. [music] And in a famous case that happened in Russia, the UAP case that happened in Russia, the UAP case that happened in Russia, the UAP was coming in at a low angle through the was coming in at a low angle through the was coming in at a low angle through the atmosphere, and as it went to the crash atmosphere, and as it went to the crash atmosphere, and as it went to the crash site, it melted all the ashalt and a site, it melted all the ashalt and a site, it melted all the ashalt and a road towards that crash site. And in road towards that crash site. And in road towards that crash site. And in that same town in Russia, in a course of that same town in Russia, in a course of that same town in Russia, in a course of two years, they had 30 landings. And in two years, they had 30 landings. And in two years, they had 30 landings. And in each case, no debris, no [music] each case, no debris, no [music] each case, no debris, no [music] artifacts. Which is why the physicists artifacts. Which is why the physicists artifacts. Which is why the physicists who given the most study say that we're who given the most study say that we're who given the most study say that we're dealing with something interdimensional. dealing with something interdimensional. dealing with something interdimensional. We're dealing with something that's We're dealing with something that's We're dealing with something that's coming from another dimension. coming from another dimension. coming from another dimension. [music] Well, I'm here today with my friend Hugh Well, I'm here today with my friend Hugh Ross. Let me just give a brief Ross. Let me just give a brief Ross. Let me just give a brief background on him, but uh many of you background on him, but uh many of you background on him, but uh many of you will be familiar with you. Uh he's an will be familiar with you. Uh he's an will be familiar with you. Uh he's an astrophysicist and author and he's the astrophysicist and author and he's the astrophysicist and author and he's the founder and senior scholar at Reasons to founder and senior scholar at Reasons to founder and senior scholar at Reasons to Believe, an organization that exists to Believe, an organization that exists to Believe, an organization that exists to open people to the gospel by revealing open people to the gospel by revealing open people to the gospel by revealing God in science. His books include Noah's God in science. His books include Noah's God in science. His books include Noah's Flood Revisited, Flood Revisited, Flood Revisited, Rescuing Inherency, and the Creator and Rescuing Inherency, and the Creator and Rescuing Inherency, and the Creator and the Cosmos. He's also written a book the Cosmos. He's also written a book the Cosmos. He's also written a book called uh uh who was Adam that really called uh uh who was Adam that really called uh uh who was Adam that really impacted me and a good colleague of mine impacted me and a good colleague of mine impacted me and a good colleague of mine who is Rick Smallley. And then we're who is Rick Smallley. And then we're who is Rick Smallley. And then we're going to be discussing today uh he has a

going to be discussing today uh he has a going to be discussing today uh he has a book called Lights in the Sky and Little book called Lights in the Sky and Little book called Lights in the Sky and Little Green Men that deal with the issues that Green Men that deal with the issues that Green Men that deal with the issues that we've been talking about. But he's we've been talking about. But he's we've been talking about. But he's writing another book about that topic writing another book about that topic writing another book about that topic because uh uh that that book is is the because uh uh that that book is is the because uh uh that that book is is the one that I just mentioned, Lights in the one that I just mentioned, Lights in the one that I just mentioned, Lights in the Sky and Little Green Men, is is more Sky and Little Green Men, is is more Sky and Little Green Men, is is more than 20 years old. But there's nothing than 20 years old. But there's nothing than 20 years old. But there's nothing in that book that he he would change. in that book that he he would change. in that book that he he would change. But he's going to update it and But he's going to update it and But he's going to update it and hopefully that will be out uh in in 10 hopefully that will be out uh in in 10 hopefully that will be out uh in in 10 in about 10 months, something like that in about 10 months, something like that in about 10 months, something like that uh the summer of 2027. But we're going uh the summer of 2027. But we're going uh the summer of 2027. But we're going to talk a little bit about this today. to talk a little bit about this today. to talk a little bit about this today. So, first of all, Hugh, welcome. So, first of all, Hugh, welcome. So, first of all, Hugh, welcome. >> Well, thank you for inviting me. >> Well, thank you for inviting me. >> Well, thank you for inviting me. >> Well, I I want to talk about this topic. >> Well, I I want to talk about this topic. >> Well, I I want to talk about this topic. Uh we used to call it UFOs, unidentified Uh we used to call it UFOs, unidentified Uh we used to call it UFOs, unidentified flying objects, and now the the the flying objects, and now the the the flying objects, and now the the the wording has has expanded a little bit. wording has has expanded a little bit. wording has has expanded a little bit. It's called UAPs, unidentified anomalous It's called UAPs, unidentified anomalous It's called UAPs, unidentified anomalous phenomena. We're going to be talking phenomena. We're going to be talking phenomena. We're going to be talking also about something called SETI, which also about something called SETI, which also about something called SETI, which is the search for extraterrestrial is the search for extraterrestrial is the search for extraterrestrial intelligence. And then there's something intelligence. And then there's something intelligence. And then there's something called ETI, which is extraterrestrial called ETI, which is extraterrestrial called ETI, which is extraterrestrial intelligence, and ETH, which is intelligence, and ETH, which is intelligence, and ETH, which is extraterrestrial hypothesis. I want to extraterrestrial hypothesis. I want to extraterrestrial hypothesis. I want to first start out, you know, I I read a a first start out, you know, I I read a a first start out, you know, I I read a a manuscript which was a a draft of of the manuscript which was a a draft of of the manuscript which was a a draft of of the book that you are now writing and it it book that you are now writing and it it book that you are now writing and it it just it it just uh uh really I was just it it just uh uh really I was just it it just uh uh really I was locked into it. I I read the entire locked into it. I I read the entire locked into it. I I read the entire thing in two days and then to prepare thing in two days and then to prepare thing in two days and then to prepare for this interview uh I read the whole for this interview uh I read the whole for this interview uh I read the whole thing again last night. Uh it is just a thing again last night. Uh it is just a thing again last night. Uh it is just a phenomenal book. Uh maybe maybe you can phenomenal book. Uh maybe maybe you can phenomenal book. Uh maybe maybe you can start by first of all telling us uh

start by first of all telling us uh start by first of all telling us uh without going into huge amount of without going into huge amount of without going into huge amount of details uh what is it what is it about details uh what is it what is it about details uh what is it what is it about life that that makes it really hard to life that that makes it really hard to life that that makes it really hard to to to think about life starting all over to to think about life starting all over to to think about life starting all over all over the universe. Uh and in that all over the universe. Uh and in that all over the universe. Uh and in that you can you can bring in also what's you can you can bring in also what's you can you can bring in also what's special about the earth and the moon and special about the earth and the moon and special about the earth and the moon and our sun and the galaxy and and uh things our sun and the galaxy and and uh things our sun and the galaxy and and uh things like that. So let me have you start with like that. So let me have you start with like that. So let me have you start with that. that. that. >> Yes, Jim. Well, you're a chemist and the >> Yes, Jim. Well, you're a chemist and the >> Yes, Jim. Well, you're a chemist and the thing about life is uh well, if you look thing about life is uh well, if you look thing about life is uh well, if you look at abiotic chemistry, it has to obey at abiotic chemistry, it has to obey at abiotic chemistry, it has to obey thermodynamics and kinetics. But we see thermodynamics and kinetics. But we see thermodynamics and kinetics. But we see in life systems, it doesn't obey either. in life systems, it doesn't obey either. in life systems, it doesn't obey either. Uh it basically looks it's governed by Uh it basically looks it's governed by Uh it basically looks it's governed by purpose. The chemistry is governed by purpose. The chemistry is governed by purpose. The chemistry is governed by purpose. That's a signature of life. In purpose. That's a signature of life. In purpose. That's a signature of life. In fact, I'm wondering that's a better fact, I'm wondering that's a better fact, I'm wondering that's a better definition of life than what scientists definition of life than what scientists definition of life than what scientists have been struggling with over the past have been struggling with over the past have been struggling with over the past 100 years. It's the chemistry that's 100 years. It's the chemistry that's 100 years. It's the chemistry that's really different. And because of how really different. And because of how really different. And because of how different the chemistry is, it's different the chemistry is, it's different the chemistry is, it's extremely challenging to look at physics extremely challenging to look at physics extremely challenging to look at physics and chemistry and having it come and chemistry and having it come and chemistry and having it come together naturalistically to produce together naturalistically to produce together naturalistically to produce life. I mean, I've been attending origin life. I mean, I've been attending origin life. I mean, I've been attending origin of life research conferences. Every of life research conferences. Every of life research conferences. Every conference I attend, the mood is more conference I attend, the mood is more conference I attend, the mood is more depressing because the harder they try depressing because the harder they try depressing because the harder they try to explain origin of life from a to explain origin of life from a to explain origin of life from a naturalistic perspective, more naturalistic perspective, more naturalistic perspective, more impossible it seems to be. Uh you know, impossible it seems to be. Uh you know, impossible it seems to be. Uh you know, even the simple chemistry that they're even the simple chemistry that they're even the simple chemistry that they're not able to make make happen within the not able to make make happen within the not able to make make happen within the lab. And when they're doing it in the lab. And when they're doing it in the lab. And when they're doing it in the lab, there's always human interference.

lab, there's always human interference. lab, there's always human interference. So you got what's called the hand of God So you got what's called the hand of God So you got what's called the hand of God dilemma. uh basically the biochemist is dilemma. uh basically the biochemist is dilemma. uh basically the biochemist is taking the place of God and putting taking the place of God and putting taking the place of God and putting these molecules together but even then these molecules together but even then these molecules together but even then all they can achieve are the most all they can achieve are the most all they can achieve are the most elementary steps. elementary steps. elementary steps. >> So life is really hard. That's where >> So life is really hard. That's where >> So life is really hard. That's where that's where you start out in your that's where you start out in your that's where you start out in your manuscript that you sent me. And and uh manuscript that you sent me. And and uh manuscript that you sent me. And and uh yeah, this is this is the thing that yeah, this is this is the thing that yeah, this is this is the thing that that that I study and try to critique. that that I study and try to critique. that that I study and try to critique. And it's interesting, I'll tell you, And it's interesting, I'll tell you, And it's interesting, I'll tell you, Hugh, that that origin of life chemists Hugh, that that origin of life chemists Hugh, that that origin of life chemists refuse to come on my YouTube uh program refuse to come on my YouTube uh program refuse to come on my YouTube uh program and talk with me about it. Uh I've even and talk with me about it. Uh I've even and talk with me about it. Uh I've even offered to go on their program or on a offered to go on their program or on a offered to go on their program or on a neutral channel and they just keep neutral channel and they just keep neutral channel and they just keep refusing. And I even say, "How about we refusing. And I even say, "How about we refusing. And I even say, "How about we just discuss your latest paper? We just just discuss your latest paper? We just just discuss your latest paper? We just discuss you just discuss your latest discuss you just discuss your latest discuss you just discuss your latest paper." They refuse to talk about it paper." They refuse to talk about it paper." They refuse to talk about it with me. So, I think that that's kind of with me. So, I think that that's kind of with me. So, I think that that's kind of telling that they themselves are are telling that they themselves are are telling that they themselves are are having real trouble pulling this thing having real trouble pulling this thing having real trouble pulling this thing together. together. together. >> They are and they're they're actually >> They are and they're they're actually >> They are and they're they're actually admitting it in their research papers admitting it in their research papers admitting it in their research papers now just how challenging this is. And I now just how challenging this is. And I now just how challenging this is. And I remember the last Origin of Life remember the last Origin of Life remember the last Origin of Life research conference that my colleague research conference that my colleague research conference that my colleague Fuzz Ron and I attended all the Fuzz Ron and I attended all the Fuzz Ron and I attended all the opportunities we had over meal times in opportunities we had over meal times in opportunities we had over meal times in the elevator walking back and forth uh the elevator walking back and forth uh the elevator walking back and forth uh to talk about well hey if it can happen to talk about well hey if it can happen to talk about well hey if it can happen naturalistically naturalistically naturalistically maybe God's making this all happen and maybe God's making this all happen and maybe God's making this all happen and we found that they'd be quite open to we found that they'd be quite open to we found that they'd be quite open to that perspective. It's like, hey, yeah, that perspective. It's like, hey, yeah, that perspective. It's like, hey, yeah, the chemistry is not working from a the chemistry is not working from a the chemistry is not working from a naturalistic perspective. And uh I naturalistic perspective. And uh I naturalistic perspective. And uh I remember there's one famous uh scientist

remember there's one famous uh scientist remember there's one famous uh scientist at MIT, she actually held the elevator at MIT, she actually held the elevator at MIT, she actually held the elevator door open to continue the conversation door open to continue the conversation door open to continue the conversation for another 15 minutes. And when a lot for another 15 minutes. And when a lot for another 15 minutes. And when a lot of them admitted, you know, we call of them admitted, you know, we call of them admitted, you know, we call ourselves atheists, but really we're ourselves atheists, but really we're ourselves atheists, but really we're default atheists. We haven't really default atheists. We haven't really default atheists. We haven't really thought through the issue of death or thought through the issue of death or thought through the issue of death or what there is beyond this uh universe or what there is beyond this uh universe or what there is beyond this uh universe or beyond this life we have. here here on beyond this life we have. here here on beyond this life we have. here here on Earth. And what I recognized was they're Earth. And what I recognized was they're Earth. And what I recognized was they're so uh committed to their scientific so uh committed to their scientific so uh committed to their scientific research. It's almost like an addiction. research. It's almost like an addiction. research. It's almost like an addiction. All they think about is their science, All they think about is their science, All they think about is their science, they never take time off, the Sabbath, they never take time off, the Sabbath, they never take time off, the Sabbath, to focus on the most important issues of to focus on the most important issues of to focus on the most important issues of life. And so, it was interesting to see. life. And so, it was interesting to see. life. And so, it was interesting to see. Yeah, you're right. I'm a default Yeah, you're right. I'm a default Yeah, you're right. I'm a default atheist. I've never really thought about atheist. I've never really thought about atheist. I've never really thought about the issues and how eager they are to the issues and how eager they are to the issues and how eager they are to actually stop and think about them. actually stop and think about them. actually stop and think about them. >> That's right. And and uh and and I think >> That's right. And and uh and and I think >> That's right. And and uh and and I think that that's certainly true. I I don't that that's certainly true. I I don't that that's certainly true. I I don't think they wake up in the morning saying think they wake up in the morning saying think they wake up in the morning saying I want I want to uh uh be an atheist I want I want to uh uh be an atheist I want I want to uh uh be an atheist today. They just have never thought today. They just have never thought today. They just have never thought about it. about it. about it. >> Right? >> Right? >> Right? >> So let me let me move into what is so >> So let me let me move into what is so >> So let me let me move into what is so special about our earth. You know, we've special about our earth. You know, we've special about our earth. You know, we've heard about uh I mean may some some heard about uh I mean may some some heard about uh I mean may some some people may have heard special things people may have heard special things people may have heard special things about the Earth, but you can elaborate about the Earth, but you can elaborate about the Earth, but you can elaborate on that. But you bring into this on that. But you bring into this on that. But you bring into this something that's very special about our something that's very special about our something that's very special about our moon, our sun, and our galaxy.

moon, our sun, and our galaxy. moon, our sun, and our galaxy. And then why the universe has to be so And then why the universe has to be so And then why the universe has to be so large because there's this suggestion by large because there's this suggestion by large because there's this suggestion by some that if there is a God, he's wasted some that if there is a God, he's wasted some that if there is a God, he's wasted a whole lot of space because he's made a whole lot of space because he's made a whole lot of space because he's made the universe really quite large. So the universe really quite large. So the universe really quite large. So touch touch on each of these things if touch touch on each of these things if touch touch on each of these things if you could. you could. you could. >> Yeah, that's what most of the new book >> Yeah, that's what most of the new book >> Yeah, that's what most of the new book is devoted to cuz when we came out with is devoted to cuz when we came out with is devoted to cuz when we came out with lights in the sky and little green men, lights in the sky and little green men, lights in the sky and little green men, I was thinking, well, for sure belief I was thinking, well, for sure belief I was thinking, well, for sure belief that we're being visited by aliens on that we're being visited by aliens on that we're being visited by aliens on spaceships, that belief is going to spaceships, that belief is going to spaceships, that belief is going to plummet. It's going to go down to zero. plummet. It's going to go down to zero. plummet. It's going to go down to zero. Instead, it's gone the other way around. Instead, it's gone the other way around. Instead, it's gone the other way around. So what we're doing in this new book is So what we're doing in this new book is So what we're doing in this new book is basically demonstrating hey uh the basically demonstrating hey uh the basically demonstrating hey uh the possibility of interstellar space travel possibility of interstellar space travel possibility of interstellar space travel uh that can't happen. We well it can is uh that can't happen. We well it can is uh that can't happen. We well it can is your spaceships are tiny enough but they your spaceships are tiny enough but they your spaceships are tiny enough but they have to be really tiny. The tiny you have to be really tiny. The tiny you have to be really tiny. The tiny you know like the size of a toothpick and so know like the size of a toothpick and so know like the size of a toothpick and so and then when you look at the and then when you look at the and then when you look at the characteristics you need for life it's characteristics you need for life it's characteristics you need for life it's not just a liquid water habitable zone. not just a liquid water habitable zone. not just a liquid water habitable zone. I think that's the myth that the public I think that's the myth that the public I think that's the myth that the public has heard and it's being promoted by has heard and it's being promoted by has heard and it's being promoted by institutions like NASA. If you got institutions like NASA. If you got institutions like NASA. If you got liquid water, you're going to have life.

liquid water, you're going to have life. liquid water, you're going to have life. Well, the truth is liquid water is only Well, the truth is liquid water is only Well, the truth is liquid water is only one of many, many uh characteristics one of many, many uh characteristics one of many, many uh characteristics that must be fine-tuned for life to that must be fine-tuned for life to that must be fine-tuned for life to exist. So, most of this new book is exist. So, most of this new book is exist. So, most of this new book is devoted to looking at all the different devoted to looking at all the different devoted to looking at all the different habitable zones. And the liquid water habitable zones. And the liquid water habitable zones. And the liquid water habitable zone is the most generous of habitable zone is the most generous of habitable zone is the most generous of all the no inhabitable zones. And I all the no inhabitable zones. And I all the no inhabitable zones. And I think the book has 23 distinct habitable think the book has 23 distinct habitable think the book has 23 distinct habitable zones. Uh we have, you know, 14 for the zones. Uh we have, you know, 14 for the zones. Uh we have, you know, 14 for the earth, uh five for the moon, we got the earth, uh five for the moon, we got the earth, uh five for the moon, we got the sun, we got our galaxy. It all adds up sun, we got our galaxy. It all adds up sun, we got our galaxy. It all adds up to 23 known habitable zones. And for a to 23 known habitable zones. And for a to 23 known habitable zones. And for a planet to be truly habitable, it must planet to be truly habitable, it must planet to be truly habitable, it must simultaneously reside in all 23 known simultaneously reside in all 23 known simultaneously reside in all 23 known habitable zones. and a gym about uh you habitable zones. and a gym about uh you habitable zones. and a gym about uh you know every three months we find a new know every three months we find a new know every three months we find a new one. So the list keeps getting bigger one. So the list keeps getting bigger one. So the list keeps getting bigger and bigger. So I would predict that hey and bigger. So I would predict that hey and bigger. So I would predict that hey if we were to have this interview a year if we were to have this interview a year if we were to have this interview a year from now we're going to be looking at 26 from now we're going to be looking at 26 from now we're going to be looking at 26 habitable zones because we keep habitable zones because we keep habitable zones because we keep discovering new ones. U so for example discovering new ones. U so for example discovering new ones. U so for example for life to be possible in the planet it for life to be possible in the planet it for life to be possible in the planet it has to have liquid water that's there in has to have liquid water that's there in has to have liquid water that's there in a stable form not just there a stable form not just there a stable form not just there ephemerally. It's got to be there for a ephemerally. It's got to be there for a ephemerally. It's got to be there for a while and it has to cover a significant while and it has to cover a significant while and it has to cover a significant portion of the planet for light to be portion of the planet for light to be portion of the planet for light to be possible. But also that planet has to be possible. But also that planet has to be possible. But also that planet has to be the ultraviolet habitable zone. I mean the ultraviolet habitable zone. I mean the ultraviolet habitable zone. I mean as a chemist you know that you need as a chemist you know that you need as a chemist you know that you need ultraviolet radiation to produce some ultraviolet radiation to produce some ultraviolet radiation to produce some crucial proteins that life needs. So if

crucial proteins that life needs. So if crucial proteins that life needs. So if you don't have a little bit of you don't have a little bit of you don't have a little bit of ultraviolet radiation uh you're not ultraviolet radiation uh you're not ultraviolet radiation uh you're not going to get life. Uh but if you got too going to get life. Uh but if you got too going to get life. Uh but if you got too much especially short ultraviolet much especially short ultraviolet much especially short ultraviolet radiation you're not going to have life radiation you're not going to have life radiation you're not going to have life at all. And that uh ultraviolet at all. And that uh ultraviolet at all. And that uh ultraviolet habitable zone is far narrower than the habitable zone is far narrower than the habitable zone is far narrower than the liquid water habitable zone. And only a liquid water habitable zone. And only a liquid water habitable zone. And only a few% of stars simultaneously are capable few% of stars simultaneously are capable few% of stars simultaneously are capable of having a planet that's in both zones. of having a planet that's in both zones. of having a planet that's in both zones. And if you look at all 23 habitable And if you look at all 23 habitable And if you look at all 23 habitable zones, there's only one planet we know zones, there's only one planet we know zones, there's only one planet we know of that exists in more than three of of that exists in more than three of of that exists in more than three of those habitable zones. And your those habitable zones. And your those habitable zones. And your listeners and viewers can guess which listeners and viewers can guess which listeners and viewers can guess which planet that is. planet that is. planet that is. >> Let me just help them. That's planet >> Let me just help them. That's planet >> Let me just help them. That's planet Earth. Earth. Earth. >> Yes. Yeah. I mean, just the fact that >> Yes. Yeah. I mean, just the fact that >> Yes. Yeah. I mean, just the fact that the moon has to be exactly the way it the moon has to be exactly the way it the moon has to be exactly the way it is. And you know, and I I tell my is. And you know, and I I tell my is. And you know, and I I tell my friends, I have a lot of friends that friends, I have a lot of friends that friends, I have a lot of friends that are doing search for extraterrestrial are doing search for extraterrestrial are doing search for extraterrestrial intelligent life. And it's like, well, intelligent life. And it's like, well, intelligent life. And it's like, well, if the planet's not orbiting a special if the planet's not orbiting a special if the planet's not orbiting a special kind of star, there's no way you can kind of star, there's no way you can kind of star, there's no way you can have advanced life on any conceivable have advanced life on any conceivable have advanced life on any conceivable planet orbiting that star. And the planet orbiting that star. And the planet orbiting that star. And the advantage is stars are much easier to advantage is stars are much easier to advantage is stars are much easier to measure than planets. And all the measure than planets. And all the measure than planets. And all the research effort seems to be focused on research effort seems to be focused on research effort seems to be focused on trying to find a habitable planet. It's trying to find a habitable planet. It's trying to find a habitable planet. It's way easier. Let's just see if we can way easier. Let's just see if we can way easier. Let's just see if we can find a star that's sufficiently like the find a star that's sufficiently like the find a star that's sufficiently like the sun that it could be a candidate to have sun that it could be a candidate to have sun that it could be a candidate to have a planet going around it that could a planet going around it that could a planet going around it that could conceivably have advanced life on it.

conceivably have advanced life on it. conceivably have advanced life on it. Well, for 70 years, astronomers have Well, for 70 years, astronomers have Well, for 70 years, astronomers have been scouring our galaxy trying to find been scouring our galaxy trying to find been scouring our galaxy trying to find a star sufficiently like the sun that it a star sufficiently like the sun that it a star sufficiently like the sun that it could be a candidate to have a planet could be a candidate to have a planet could be a candidate to have a planet orbiting it in which advanced life is orbiting it in which advanced life is orbiting it in which advanced life is possible. what they discovered in those possible. what they discovered in those possible. what they discovered in those 70 years. A lot of stars are twins of 70 years. A lot of stars are twins of 70 years. A lot of stars are twins of one another, but our sun has no twin. one another, but our sun has no twin. one another, but our sun has no twin. So, it's like we're wasting our time and So, it's like we're wasting our time and So, it's like we're wasting our time and money searching for extraterrestrial money searching for extraterrestrial money searching for extraterrestrial life on these planets when we already life on these planets when we already life on these planets when we already know that the star rules out advanced know that the star rules out advanced know that the star rules out advanced life on those planets. Why does a twin life on those planets. Why does a twin life on those planets. Why does a twin rule it out? Explain that to us. If you rule it out? Explain that to us. If you rule it out? Explain that to us. If you do not believe in the physical do not believe in the physical do not believe in the physical resurrection of Jesus Christ, [music] resurrection of Jesus Christ, [music] resurrection of Jesus Christ, [music] send me an email tour.org and we will get together and I will and we will get together and I will share with you about why I embrace the share with you about why I embrace the share with you about why I embrace the resurrection of Jesus. Well, for resurrection of Jesus. Well, for resurrection of Jesus. Well, for example, uh if the flaring activity of example, uh if the flaring activity of example, uh if the flaring activity of the star is too intense, that's going to the star is too intense, that's going to the star is too intense, that's going to rule out advanced life on a planet, any rule out advanced life on a planet, any rule out advanced life on a planet, any planet orbiting it. or if the star has planet orbiting it. or if the star has planet orbiting it. or if the star has luminosity instability that's too great, luminosity instability that's too great, luminosity instability that's too great, the climate's going to be changing too the climate's going to be changing too the climate's going to be changing too rapidly for advanced life. And the more rapidly for advanced life. And the more rapidly for advanced life. And the more advanced the life form is, the more advanced the life form is, the more advanced the life form is, the more sensitive it is to the radiation coming sensitive it is to the radiation coming sensitive it is to the radiation coming out of that star. And for example, you out of that star. And for example, you out of that star. And for example, you need the star to have a stellar wind need the star to have a stellar wind need the star to have a stellar wind strong enough to prevent deadly cosmic strong enough to prevent deadly cosmic strong enough to prevent deadly cosmic radiation coming into the planet radiation coming into the planet radiation coming into the planet surface. But you don't want the solar

surface. But you don't want the solar surface. But you don't want the solar radiation to be so intense that it radiation to be so intense that it radiation to be so intense that it causes a problem. And so our star that causes a problem. And so our star that causes a problem. And so our star that our sun is fine-tuned in multiple ways our sun is fine-tuned in multiple ways our sun is fine-tuned in multiple ways to make advanced life possible. And you to make advanced life possible. And you to make advanced life possible. And you know, if you're talking about just know, if you're talking about just know, if you're talking about just bacteria, then you got a more generous bacteria, then you got a more generous bacteria, then you got a more generous possibility for those bacteria to exist, possibility for those bacteria to exist, possibility for those bacteria to exist, especially if you're only looking for especially if you're only looking for especially if you're only looking for bacteria to be able to survive for 3 bacteria to be able to survive for 3 bacteria to be able to survive for 3 months or less. But if you want months or less. But if you want months or less. But if you want creatures like us, the finetuning is creatures like us, the finetuning is creatures like us, the finetuning is orders and orders of magnitude more orders and orders of magnitude more orders and orders of magnitude more constraining than is the case for constraining than is the case for constraining than is the case for bacteria. But even in the case of bacteria. But even in the case of bacteria. But even in the case of bacteria, the discipline of astrobiology bacteria, the discipline of astrobiology bacteria, the discipline of astrobiology has a distinction of being the only has a distinction of being the only has a distinction of being the only datafree science. They've been searching datafree science. They've been searching datafree science. They've been searching for decades for the remnants of life for decades for the remnants of life for decades for the remnants of life elsewhere uh beyond Earth. Uh they elsewhere uh beyond Earth. Uh they elsewhere uh beyond Earth. Uh they haven't found any yet. So it's a haven't found any yet. So it's a haven't found any yet. So it's a datafree discipline. Uh but Jim, I've datafree discipline. Uh but Jim, I've datafree discipline. Uh but Jim, I've been on record since the 1980s. We will been on record since the 1980s. We will been on record since the 1980s. We will find the remains of life on every solar find the remains of life on every solar find the remains of life on every solar system body except for the sun, of system body except for the sun, of system body except for the sun, of course. And that's just because Earth course. And that's just because Earth course. And that's just because Earth has had so much life on it for so long has had so much life on it for so long has had so much life on it for so long that when meteors strike our planet, it that when meteors strike our planet, it that when meteors strike our planet, it causes Earth's soil to be exported causes Earth's soil to be exported causes Earth's soil to be exported throughout interplanetary space. And I throughout interplanetary space. And I throughout interplanetary space. And I have colleagues uh who have calculated have colleagues uh who have calculated have colleagues uh who have calculated how much Earth material is on the how much Earth material is on the how much Earth material is on the surface of the moon. It adds up to surface of the moon. It adds up to surface of the moon. It adds up to 20,000 kilograms for every 100 square 20,000 kilograms for every 100 square 20,000 kilograms for every 100 square kilometers. So, I'm hoping with all this kilometers. So, I'm hoping with all this kilometers. So, I'm hoping with all this effort to return to the moon, uh, that

effort to return to the moon, uh, that effort to return to the moon, uh, that they'll be, fact, I got to speak at NASA they'll be, fact, I got to speak at NASA they'll be, fact, I got to speak at NASA Houston many years ago and told them we Houston many years ago and told them we Houston many years ago and told them we need to go back to the moon and find the need to go back to the moon and find the need to go back to the moon and find the fossils of Earth's first life because fossils of Earth's first life because fossils of Earth's first life because they don't exist on planet Earth. Our they don't exist on planet Earth. Our they don't exist on planet Earth. Our geology destroyed those fossils, but geology destroyed those fossils, but geology destroyed those fossils, but they're there on the moon. And we can they're there on the moon. And we can they're there on the moon. And we can find out who got it right. Was Earth's find out who got it right. Was Earth's find out who got it right. Was Earth's first life like the theists believe it first life like the theists believe it first life like the theists believe it is or is it like the atheists believe it is or is it like the atheists believe it is or is it like the atheists believe it is? And I remember lecturing to the NASA is? And I remember lecturing to the NASA is? And I remember lecturing to the NASA scientists there saying, "Last time I scientists there saying, "Last time I scientists there saying, "Last time I checked, the US taxpayer base was 100% checked, the US taxpayer base was 100% checked, the US taxpayer base was 100% comprised of theists and atheists." So comprised of theists and atheists." So comprised of theists and atheists." So you can go to the moon and determine who you can go to the moon and determine who you can go to the moon and determine who got it right, the atheists or the got it right, the atheists or the got it right, the atheists or the theists. When you say who got it right, theists. When you say who got it right, theists. When you say who got it right, you're saying that that that the that you're saying that that that the that you're saying that that that the that the earliest forms of life that we would the earliest forms of life that we would the earliest forms of life that we would find residually from the earth that is find residually from the earth that is find residually from the earth that is now on the moon would be very similar in now on the moon would be very similar in now on the moon would be very similar in structure to the simplest life we have structure to the simplest life we have structure to the simplest life we have today. today. today. >> Well, uh the atheist model is basically >> Well, uh the atheist model is basically >> Well, uh the atheist model is basically saying yes there will be bacteria that saying yes there will be bacteria that saying yes there will be bacteria that arises from naturalistically arises from naturalistically arises from naturalistically uh but it's going to be smaller than a uh but it's going to be smaller than a uh but it's going to be smaller than a tenth of a micron across. is going to tenth of a micron across. is going to tenth of a micron across. is going to have very few gene elements in it. Uh have very few gene elements in it. Uh have very few gene elements in it. Uh whereas theists make the prediction, whereas theists make the prediction, whereas theists make the prediction, hey, God's involved. He creates an hey, God's involved. He creates an hey, God's involved. He creates an ecology of bacteria. They're going to be ecology of bacteria. They're going to be ecology of bacteria. They're going to be tiny ones. There's going to be big ones.

tiny ones. There's going to be big ones. tiny ones. There's going to be big ones. There's going to be a diversity of There's going to be a diversity of There's going to be a diversity of bacteria. Well, we can go to the moon bacteria. Well, we can go to the moon bacteria. Well, we can go to the moon and see who got it right. Are the and see who got it right. Are the and see who got it right. Are the fossils that we see on the moon averse fossils that we see on the moon averse fossils that we see on the moon averse first life show a an ecological first life show a an ecological first life show a an ecological diversity? Are we seeing bacteria micron diversity? Are we seeing bacteria micron diversity? Are we seeing bacteria micron in size and bigger or all are we finding in size and bigger or all are we finding in size and bigger or all are we finding are things that are tinier than a tenth are things that are tinier than a tenth are things that are tinier than a tenth of a micron and only one species? of a micron and only one species? of a micron and only one species? >> So around our earth we have to have some >> So around our earth we have to have some >> So around our earth we have to have some some sort of belt around our earth that some sort of belt around our earth that some sort of belt around our earth that that protects us from from really that protects us from from really that protects us from from really degrading uh uh radiation that could degrading uh uh radiation that could degrading uh uh radiation that could come in but it can't block us from other come in but it can't block us from other come in but it can't block us from other radiation that needs to come in. So that radiation that needs to come in. So that radiation that needs to come in. So that has to have it its perfect thing. You has to have it its perfect thing. You has to have it its perfect thing. You have to have this stability in our sun have to have this stability in our sun have to have this stability in our sun which the sun didn't always have. Uh but which the sun didn't always have. Uh but which the sun didn't always have. Uh but it's we're we're in a window where where it's we're we're in a window where where it's we're we're in a window where where there is this this stability. Then we there is this this stability. Then we there is this this stability. Then we have to be in a galaxy that that in a have to be in a galaxy that that in a have to be in a galaxy that that in a just right place in a galaxy and then just right place in a galaxy and then just right place in a galaxy and then and then the vastness of the universe and then the vastness of the universe and then the vastness of the universe has to be there as well. So tell me a has to be there as well. So tell me a has to be there as well. So tell me a little bit now about the galaxy little bit now about the galaxy little bit now about the galaxy challenge and the the bigness of the challenge and the the bigness of the challenge and the the bigness of the universe. Well, there are a number of universe. Well, there are a number of universe. Well, there are a number of non-theistic scientists who said, "Hey, non-theistic scientists who said, "Hey, non-theistic scientists who said, "Hey, if we're the only life form in the if we're the only life form in the if we're the only life form in the universe, the universe is a huge waste universe, the universe is a huge waste universe, the universe is a huge waste of space and time." Well, actually, of space and time." Well, actually, of space and time." Well, actually, that's not correct. Uh if you want the that's not correct. Uh if you want the that's not correct. Uh if you want the periodic table, the universe has to be a periodic table, the universe has to be a periodic table, the universe has to be a very uh fine-tuned mass. If you make the

very uh fine-tuned mass. If you make the very uh fine-tuned mass. If you make the universe the tiniest bit less massive, universe the tiniest bit less massive, universe the tiniest bit less massive, uh then in the big bang creation event, uh then in the big bang creation event, uh then in the big bang creation event, all you're going to get is hydrogen and all you're going to get is hydrogen and all you're going to get is hydrogen and a little bit of helium. And if you only a little bit of helium. And if you only a little bit of helium. And if you only have a little bit of helium, when stars have a little bit of helium, when stars have a little bit of helium, when stars form, the nuclear furnaces of those form, the nuclear furnaces of those form, the nuclear furnaces of those stars will be unable to make any stars will be unable to make any stars will be unable to make any elements heavier than helium, which elements heavier than helium, which elements heavier than helium, which would sure make passing a chemistry would sure make passing a chemistry would sure make passing a chemistry class easy. All you got is hydrogen and class easy. All you got is hydrogen and class easy. All you got is hydrogen and helium, and only three molecules are helium, and only three molecules are helium, and only three molecules are possible. So, uh, that would make your possible. So, uh, that would make your possible. So, uh, that would make your job a lot easier, Jim, but you wouldn't job a lot easier, Jim, but you wouldn't job a lot easier, Jim, but you wouldn't be here. On the other hand, make the be here. On the other hand, make the be here. On the other hand, make the universe a tiny bit more massive. Then, universe a tiny bit more massive. Then, universe a tiny bit more massive. Then, so much helium is produced in the first so much helium is produced in the first so much helium is produced in the first few minutes after the cosmic creation few minutes after the cosmic creation few minutes after the cosmic creation event that when stars form with that event that when stars form with that event that when stars form with that rich mixture of helium, they quickly rich mixture of helium, they quickly rich mixture of helium, they quickly convert all the elements in the universe convert all the elements in the universe convert all the elements in the universe into elements that are iron or heavier into elements that are iron or heavier into elements that are iron or heavier than iron. Notice in both cases you get than iron. Notice in both cases you get than iron. Notice in both cases you get a universe with no carbon, no oxygen, no a universe with no carbon, no oxygen, no a universe with no carbon, no oxygen, no nitrogen and no possibility for life.

nitrogen and no possibility for life. nitrogen and no possibility for life. Change the mass of the universe by as Change the mass of the universe by as Change the mass of the universe by as little as one part and 10 the 60th as little as one part and 10 the 60th as little as one part and 10 the 60th as little as one part and a quadrillion little as one part and a quadrillion little as one part and a quadrillion quadrillion quadrillion quadrillion quadrillion quadrillion quadrillion quadrillion quadrillion quadrillion there'd be no possibility for life in there'd be no possibility for life in there'd be no possibility for life in the universe. Now the mass has to be the universe. Now the mass has to be the universe. Now the mass has to be very fine-tuned. So does the size. You very fine-tuned. So does the size. You very fine-tuned. So does the size. You need the universe expanding at the just need the universe expanding at the just need the universe expanding at the just right rate for a just right time so that right rate for a just right time so that right rate for a just right time so that the galaxies are the right distance the galaxies are the right distance the galaxies are the right distance apart from one another and the stars are apart from one another and the stars are apart from one another and the stars are the right distance apart one another. If the right distance apart one another. If the right distance apart one another. If they're too far apart uh too quickly, they're too far apart uh too quickly, they're too far apart uh too quickly, you're not going to get the heavy you're not going to get the heavy you're not going to get the heavy elements you need for life to exist. Uh elements you need for life to exist. Uh elements you need for life to exist. Uh but if they expand too slowly and the but if they expand too slowly and the but if they expand too slowly and the stars are too close together, then you stars are too close together, then you stars are too close together, then you got deadly radiation problems. So the got deadly radiation problems. So the got deadly radiation problems. So the universe is a precisely fine-tuned size universe is a precisely fine-tuned size universe is a precisely fine-tuned size and a fine-tuned mass. And you know you and a fine-tuned mass. And you know you and a fine-tuned mass. And you know you made the point we have to be at a made the point we have to be at a made the point we have to be at a certain position or galaxy what's called certain position or galaxy what's called certain position or galaxy what's called the co- rotation distance uh where our the co- rotation distance uh where our the co- rotation distance uh where our solar system would be crossing spiral solar system would be crossing spiral solar system would be crossing spiral arms only about once every a half arms only about once every a half arms only about once every a half billion years. And uh there's only one billion years. And uh there's only one billion years. And uh there's only one distance from the center of the galaxy distance from the center of the galaxy distance from the center of the galaxy where that happens where you don't run where that happens where you don't run where that happens where you don't run into problems of crossing spiral arms into problems of crossing spiral arms into problems of crossing spiral arms too quickly. Uh but our galaxy also has too quickly. Uh but our galaxy also has too quickly. Uh but our galaxy also has to be in a fine-tuned position. Our to be in a fine-tuned position. Our to be in a fine-tuned position. Our galaxy has to exist in a place in the galaxy has to exist in a place in the galaxy has to exist in a place in the universe that's under dense with universe that's under dense with universe that's under dense with galaxies and where we're nowhere near galaxies and where we're nowhere near galaxies and where we're nowhere near any dangerous super massive black holes.

any dangerous super massive black holes. any dangerous super massive black holes. I mean, all galaxies have these black I mean, all galaxies have these black I mean, all galaxies have these black holes that are a million times more holes that are a million times more holes that are a million times more massive than our star of the sun. The massive than our star of the sun. The massive than our star of the sun. The interesting thing is the black hole in interesting thing is the black hole in interesting thing is the black hole in the center of our galaxy is about 40 the center of our galaxy is about 40 the center of our galaxy is about 40 times too small for the size of the times too small for the size of the times too small for the size of the galaxy. It's the only spiral galaxy we galaxy. It's the only spiral galaxy we galaxy. It's the only spiral galaxy we know of that's like that. And right now, know of that's like that. And right now, know of that's like that. And right now, uh, it's in an extremely quiet phase. uh, it's in an extremely quiet phase. uh, it's in an extremely quiet phase. So, there's no deadly radiation coming So, there's no deadly radiation coming So, there's no deadly radiation coming out of the black hole. Now the Andromeda out of the black hole. Now the Andromeda out of the black hole. Now the Andromeda galaxy is 2 and a half million years galaxy is 2 and a half million years galaxy is 2 and a half million years away. Its black hole is 40 times bigger away. Its black hole is 40 times bigger away. Its black hole is 40 times bigger than the one in our galaxy. Uh but it than the one in our galaxy. Uh but it than the one in our galaxy. Uh but it also currently is in a very quiet phase. also currently is in a very quiet phase. also currently is in a very quiet phase. And the amazing thing is all the nearby And the amazing thing is all the nearby And the amazing thing is all the nearby galaxies their super massive black holes galaxies their super massive black holes galaxies their super massive black holes are simultaneously in the quietest are simultaneously in the quietest are simultaneously in the quietest possible phase they could be. And I possible phase they could be. And I possible phase they could be. And I would argue that's no coincidence. maybe would argue that's no coincidence. maybe would argue that's no coincidence. maybe one or two, but when all of them are in one or two, but when all of them are in one or two, but when all of them are in extremely quiet phase, then the really extremely quiet phase, then the really extremely quiet phase, then the really deadly one that's at the center of the deadly one that's at the center of the deadly one that's at the center of the Virgo cluster, uh it's deadly radiation Virgo cluster, uh it's deadly radiation Virgo cluster, uh it's deadly radiation jets are pointed away from us at this jets are pointed away from us at this jets are pointed away from us at this time. So on multiple size scales, we can time. So on multiple size scales, we can time. So on multiple size scales, we can see that we're in a just right position.

see that we're in a just right position. see that we're in a just right position. In fact, even our galaxy cluster is in In fact, even our galaxy cluster is in In fact, even our galaxy cluster is in the just right position in the universe. the just right position in the universe. the just right position in the universe. I describe all this in a book called I describe all this in a book called I describe all this in a book called Design to the Core. how no matter what Design to the Core. how no matter what Design to the Core. how no matter what size scale you look at in terms of the size scale you look at in terms of the size scale you look at in terms of the universe, each size scale is incredibly universe, each size scale is incredibly universe, each size scale is incredibly fine-tuned to make advanced life fine-tuned to make advanced life fine-tuned to make advanced life possible here on Earth. The whole possible here on Earth. The whole possible here on Earth. The whole universe has to be fine-tuned for us to universe has to be fine-tuned for us to universe has to be fine-tuned for us to exist here. exist here. exist here. >> Okay. So, Hugh, this this this is this >> Okay. So, Hugh, this this this is this >> Okay. So, Hugh, this this this is this is great because what you'd have done is is great because what you'd have done is is great because what you'd have done is you've showed how difficult it would be you've showed how difficult it would be you've showed how difficult it would be to have life in another place. how to have life in another place. how to have life in another place. how difficult it would be because when when difficult it would be because when when difficult it would be because when when you consider our our our earth, when you you consider our our our earth, when you you consider our our our earth, when you consider our moon, you consider our sun, consider our moon, you consider our sun, consider our moon, you consider our sun, our galaxy, and our our place in that our galaxy, and our our place in that our galaxy, and our our place in that galaxy in the universe, all of this had galaxy in the universe, all of this had galaxy in the universe, all of this had to be fine-tuned. So, if you're going to to be fine-tuned. So, if you're going to to be fine-tuned. So, if you're going to say life happens all over, uh there's say life happens all over, uh there's say life happens all over, uh there's just not this fine-tuning. So, you've just not this fine-tuning. So, you've just not this fine-tuning. So, you've established that. Now, I want to shift established that. Now, I want to shift established that. Now, I want to shift this conversation this conversation this conversation to UAPs, the these uh uh unidentified to UAPs, the these uh uh unidentified to UAPs, the these uh uh unidentified anomalous phenomena.

anomalous phenomena. anomalous phenomena. >> Sure. There are UAPs and then there are >> Sure. There are UAPs and then there are >> Sure. There are UAPs and then there are UAPs. UAPs are unidentified anomalous UAPs. UAPs are unidentified anomalous UAPs. UAPs are unidentified anomalous phenomena. The RUAPS are the residual phenomena. The RUAPS are the residual phenomena. The RUAPS are the residual unidentified anomalous phenomena that unidentified anomalous phenomena that unidentified anomalous phenomena that proved to be real but not physical. proved to be real but not physical. proved to be real but not physical. >> What I find fascinating is that >> What I find fascinating is that >> What I find fascinating is that scientists will beat their chest and scientists will beat their chest and scientists will beat their chest and proclaim that they are materialists. It proclaim that they are materialists. It proclaim that they are materialists. It has to be a material. But yet they'll has to be a material. But yet they'll has to be a material. But yet they'll embrace these these uh um these ideas embrace these these uh um these ideas embrace these these uh um these ideas that that uh uh extraterrestrial beings that that uh uh extraterrestrial beings that that uh uh extraterrestrial beings are coming and doing all these magical are coming and doing all these magical are coming and doing all these magical things that that uh so they're real but things that that uh so they're real but things that that uh so they're real but uh uh and they will accept this but uh uh uh and they will accept this but uh uh uh and they will accept this but uh we are seeing phenomena that are real we are seeing phenomena that are real we are seeing phenomena that are real but Hugh are they material? Could these but Hugh are they material? Could these but Hugh are they material? Could these could these uh UAP uh uh be a material could these uh UAP uh uh be a material could these uh UAP uh uh be a material phenomena? Well, Jim, I'm a reluctant phenomena? Well, Jim, I'm a reluctant phenomena? Well, Jim, I'm a reluctant UAP expert. I had no intention of UAP expert. I had no intention of UAP expert. I had no intention of becoming an expert, but as a child, I be becoming an expert, but as a child, I be becoming an expert, but as a child, I be quickly became an amateur astronomer. I quickly became an amateur astronomer. I quickly became an amateur astronomer. I knew the night sky really well. So, knew the night sky really well. So, knew the night sky really well. So, every university where I served, they every university where I served, they every university where I served, they made me the one who had to handle all made me the one who had to handle all made me the one who had to handle all the UFO reports. In my experience, I the UFO reports. In my experience, I the UFO reports. In my experience, I could explain about 98 to 99% of what could explain about 98 to 99% of what could explain about 98 to 99% of what people reported to me as natural people reported to me as natural people reported to me as natural phenomena, secret military activity, or phenomena, secret military activity, or phenomena, secret military activity, or some kind of hoax. But there was this some kind of hoax. But there was this some kind of hoax. But there was this disturbing 1 to 2% residual. And for disturbing 1 to 2% residual. And for disturbing 1 to 2% residual. And for other researchers, the residual can be

other researchers, the residual can be other researchers, the residual can be as high as 10%. as high as 10%. as high as 10%. And we notice in these residual UAPs, And we notice in these residual UAPs, And we notice in these residual UAPs, and this is what's really coming out and this is what's really coming out and this is what's really coming out from the latest releases from our from the latest releases from our from the latest releases from our government and other governments, is government and other governments, is government and other governments, is they're releasing a lot of data that they're releasing a lot of data that they're releasing a lot of data that supports what what we what was revealed supports what what we what was revealed supports what what we what was revealed before. Namely, that there is a small before. Namely, that there is a small before. Namely, that there is a small fraction of UFO reports, UAP reports fraction of UFO reports, UAP reports fraction of UFO reports, UAP reports that proves to be real but not physical. that proves to be real but not physical. that proves to be real but not physical. And of course that challenges an And of course that challenges an And of course that challenges an atheistic worldview where they say that atheistic worldview where they say that atheistic worldview where they say that everything is natural and materialistic. everything is natural and materialistic. everything is natural and materialistic. Uh these UAPs, the residual UAPs Uh these UAPs, the residual UAPs Uh these UAPs, the residual UAPs basically are proving that that basically are proving that that basically are proving that that worldview is incorrect. And for example, worldview is incorrect. And for example, worldview is incorrect. And for example, there are several thousand documented there are several thousand documented there are several thousand documented cases where the UFO goes through the cases where the UFO goes through the cases where the UFO goes through the atmosphere where observers can actually atmosphere where observers can actually atmosphere where observers can actually track it going through the atmosphere track it going through the atmosphere track it going through the atmosphere and recognize that it's traveling at 5 and recognize that it's traveling at 5 and recognize that it's traveling at 5 to 10,000 mph. to 10,000 mph. to 10,000 mph. And yet the observers never hear a sonic And yet the observers never hear a sonic And yet the observers never hear a sonic boom and they don't see any heat boom and they don't see any heat boom and they don't see any heat friction behind the UAP. I mean, I've friction behind the UAP. I mean, I've friction behind the UAP. I mean, I've watched the space shuttle go through the watched the space shuttle go through the watched the space shuttle go through the atmosphere a couple of times. You see atmosphere a couple of times. You see atmosphere a couple of times. You see this big heat uh thing going behind it this big heat uh thing going behind it this big heat uh thing going behind it and you hear two loud sonic booms. In and you hear two loud sonic booms. In and you hear two loud sonic booms. In these cases, nothing like that happens.

these cases, nothing like that happens. these cases, nothing like that happens. Then it crashes into the earth and you Then it crashes into the earth and you Then it crashes into the earth and you go to the crash site, you'll see a go to the crash site, you'll see a go to the crash site, you'll see a shallow depression. You'll see a crater shallow depression. You'll see a crater shallow depression. You'll see a crater caused by the crash. Uh the vegetation caused by the crash. Uh the vegetation caused by the crash. Uh the vegetation will be damaged. If there's snow, the will be damaged. If there's snow, the will be damaged. If there's snow, the snow will be melted. Yet, when you snow will be melted. Yet, when you snow will be melted. Yet, when you examine the crater site, there's no examine the crater site, there's no examine the crater site, there's no debris. There's no artifacts. And we all debris. There's no artifacts. And we all debris. There's no artifacts. And we all know what happens when an aircraft know what happens when an aircraft know what happens when an aircraft crashes into the Earth. There's all crashes into the Earth. There's all crashes into the Earth. There's all kinds of debris that can be recovered. kinds of debris that can be recovered. kinds of debris that can be recovered. In the case of these UAPs, there's In the case of these UAPs, there's In the case of these UAPs, there's nothing. But there's a crater there. nothing. But there's a crater there. nothing. But there's a crater there. Something caused that crater. Uh Something caused that crater. Uh Something caused that crater. Uh something damaged the vegetation. And in something damaged the vegetation. And in something damaged the vegetation. And in a famous uh case that happened in a famous uh case that happened in a famous uh case that happened in Russia, uh the UAP was coming in at a Russia, uh the UAP was coming in at a Russia, uh the UAP was coming in at a low angle through the atmosphere and as low angle through the atmosphere and as low angle through the atmosphere and as it went to the crash site, it melted all it went to the crash site, it melted all it went to the crash site, it melted all the ashalt in a road towards that crash the ashalt in a road towards that crash the ashalt in a road towards that crash site. Something had to melt that site. Something had to melt that site. Something had to melt that ashvault. And in that same town in ashvault. And in that same town in ashvault. And in that same town in Russia, in the course of two years, they Russia, in the course of two years, they Russia, in the course of two years, they had 30 landings.

had 30 landings. had 30 landings. And in each case, no debris, no And in each case, no debris, no And in each case, no debris, no artifacts. artifacts. artifacts. Which is why the physicists who given Which is why the physicists who given Which is why the physicists who given the most study to this UAP phenomena, the most study to this UAP phenomena, the most study to this UAP phenomena, the residual UAP phenomena say this 1 to the residual UAP phenomena say this 1 to the residual UAP phenomena say this 1 to 2 to 10% residual. We're dealing with 2 to 10% residual. We're dealing with 2 to 10% residual. We're dealing with something interdimensional. It's called something interdimensional. It's called something interdimensional. It's called the interdimensional hypothesis. Uh the interdimensional hypothesis. Uh the interdimensional hypothesis. Uh coined after the French astrophysicist coined after the French astrophysicist coined after the French astrophysicist Jacques Vleet. uh in fact uh he just Jacques Vleet. uh in fact uh he just Jacques Vleet. uh in fact uh he just donated a million documents I think to donated a million documents I think to donated a million documents I think to your university Rice University and so your university Rice University and so your university Rice University and so uh he's collected the the largest uh he's collected the the largest uh he's collected the the largest documents on this UAP phenomena documents on this UAP phenomena documents on this UAP phenomena basically proving beyond a shadow of basically proving beyond a shadow of basically proving beyond a shadow of doubt with the residuals we're dealing doubt with the residuals we're dealing doubt with the residuals we're dealing with something that's coming from with something that's coming from with something that's coming from another dimension. another dimension. another dimension. >> Help us out a little bit here. you know >> Help us out a little bit here. you know >> Help us out a little bit here. you know uh um you are a physicist and at some uh um you are a physicist and at some uh um you are a physicist and at some point you went from seeing that within point you went from seeing that within point you went from seeing that within the field of physics itself the field of physics itself the field of physics itself there are things that are not always there are things that are not always there are things that are not always material material material uh uh and and can you can you point to uh uh and and can you can you point to uh uh and and can you can you point to something that is not material even something that is not material even something that is not material even within the discipline of physics or within the discipline of physics or within the discipline of physics or astronomy? Well, when I was first uh astronomy? Well, when I was first uh astronomy? Well, when I was first uh checking out Christianity during my late checking out Christianity during my late checking out Christianity during my late teenage years, the thing that struck me teenage years, the thing that struck me teenage years, the thing that struck me were these space-time theorems, were these space-time theorems, were these space-time theorems, basically establishing that the universe basically establishing that the universe basically establishing that the universe has a beginning, but that the beginning

has a beginning, but that the beginning has a beginning, but that the beginning includes the beginning of space and time includes the beginning of space and time includes the beginning of space and time itself, which means that the cause of itself, which means that the cause of itself, which means that the cause of the universe must be some entity that's the universe must be some entity that's the universe must be some entity that's operating beyond space, time, matter, operating beyond space, time, matter, operating beyond space, time, matter, and energy. To me, that's the clearest and energy. To me, that's the clearest and energy. To me, that's the clearest piece of evidence that there is piece of evidence that there is piece of evidence that there is something beyond this material universe. something beyond this material universe. something beyond this material universe. Naturalism can't be the whole story Naturalism can't be the whole story Naturalism can't be the whole story because we have these powerful because we have these powerful because we have these powerful space-time theorems that prove the cause space-time theorems that prove the cause space-time theorems that prove the cause of the universe is an entity beyond of the universe is an entity beyond of the universe is an entity beyond space, time, matter, and energy as we space, time, matter, and energy as we space, time, matter, and energy as we can observe it. Now, I've run into can observe it. Now, I've run into can observe it. Now, I've run into colleagues that say, "Well, we can find colleagues that say, "Well, we can find colleagues that say, "Well, we can find some way to explain the universe, but some way to explain the universe, but some way to explain the universe, but they're inventing other dimensions of they're inventing other dimensions of they're inventing other dimensions of space and time." So, the space-time space and time." So, the space-time space and time." So, the space-time dimensions we observe, they definitely dimensions we observe, they definitely dimensions we observe, they definitely have a beginning. They had to be created have a beginning. They had to be created have a beginning. They had to be created by something beyond space and time. And by something beyond space and time. And by something beyond space and time. And that's just the beginning. I mean, we that's just the beginning. I mean, we that's just the beginning. I mean, we were talking about the origin of life. were talking about the origin of life. were talking about the origin of life. The fact that we can't explain the The fact that we can't explain the The fact that we can't explain the origin of life from a materialistic origin of life from a materialistic origin of life from a materialistic perspective. We can't explain the Avalon perspective. We can't explain the Avalon perspective. We can't explain the Avalon explosion of the first large animals explosion of the first large animals explosion of the first large animals that appeared or the Cameron explosion.

that appeared or the Cameron explosion. that appeared or the Cameron explosion. I mean, the list goes on and on and on I mean, the list goes on and on and on I mean, the list goes on and on and on of things that can't be explained from a of things that can't be explained from a of things that can't be explained from a naturalistic perspective. And just two naturalistic perspective. And just two naturalistic perspective. And just two weeks ago, we held a workshop at Reasons weeks ago, we held a workshop at Reasons weeks ago, we held a workshop at Reasons to Believe on what's happening in to Believe on what's happening in to Believe on what's happening in evolutionary biology where they're now evolutionary biology where they're now evolutionary biology where they're now saying there's something teological saying there's something teological saying there's something teological about the history of life on planet about the history of life on planet about the history of life on planet Earth. Interestingly, they bypass the Earth. Interestingly, they bypass the Earth. Interestingly, they bypass the origin of life and say, "Let's just look origin of life and say, "Let's just look origin of life and say, "Let's just look at the history of life." But they say, at the history of life." But they say, at the history of life." But they say, "The latest discoveries in paleontology "The latest discoveries in paleontology "The latest discoveries in paleontology and genetics are telling us that there's and genetics are telling us that there's and genetics are telling us that there's something teological, which is another something teological, which is another something teological, which is another word, God somehow is involved in the word, God somehow is involved in the word, God somehow is involved in the process." Uh, what we're seeing is these process." Uh, what we're seeing is these process." Uh, what we're seeing is these evolutionary biologists, they're quickly evolutionary biologists, they're quickly evolutionary biologists, they're quickly becoming deas. I mean, there's really a becoming deas. I mean, there's really a becoming deas. I mean, there's really a revolution going on in evolutionary revolution going on in evolutionary revolution going on in evolutionary biology. So, so let let's let's take biology. So, so let let's let's take biology. So, so let let's let's take take this now a step further. Uh if take this now a step further. Uh if take this now a step further. Uh if these are not if these phenomena these these are not if these phenomena these these are not if these phenomena these repeatable phenomena where where you repeatable phenomena where where you repeatable phenomena where where you actually see evidence of you know you actually see evidence of you know you actually see evidence of you know you you talked about asphalt uh uh melting I you talked about asphalt uh uh melting I you talked about asphalt uh uh melting I think in in your manuscript that you you think in in your manuscript that you you think in in your manuscript that you you gave me the these examples of just the gave me the these examples of just the gave me the these examples of just the rocks being scorched. If these are not rocks being scorched. If these are not rocks being scorched. If these are not extraterrestrial life, then what are extraterrestrial life, then what are extraterrestrial life, then what are they?

they? they? >> Well, as Jacqu Valle points out, we're >> Well, as Jacqu Valle points out, we're >> Well, as Jacqu Valle points out, we're dealing with interdimensional entities. dealing with interdimensional entities. dealing with interdimensional entities. And in some of his writings, he actually And in some of his writings, he actually And in some of his writings, he actually uses the word beings because they seem uses the word beings because they seem uses the word beings because they seem to be able to communicate with human to be able to communicate with human to be able to communicate with human contactes. contactes. contactes. Well, from a biblical perspective, we Well, from a biblical perspective, we Well, from a biblical perspective, we got God creating two distinct species of got God creating two distinct species of got God creating two distinct species of intelligent life. We human beings that intelligent life. We human beings that intelligent life. We human beings that are constrained by the physics and the are constrained by the physics and the are constrained by the physics and the dimensions of the universe and angels dimensions of the universe and angels dimensions of the universe and angels who are not constrained and God has who are not constrained and God has who are not constrained and God has granted these angelic beings that exist granted these angelic beings that exist granted these angelic beings that exist in another dimension to be able to come in another dimension to be able to come in another dimension to be able to come into our realm and leave. And what's into our realm and leave. And what's into our realm and leave. And what's interesting is that we have two interesting is that we have two interesting is that we have two categories. the righteous angels uh that categories. the righteous angels uh that categories. the righteous angels uh that are perfectly virtuous and then the ones are perfectly virtuous and then the ones are perfectly virtuous and then the ones that are in rebellion against God, the that are in rebellion against God, the that are in rebellion against God, the unrighteous angels, what many people unrighteous angels, what many people unrighteous angels, what many people call demons. And the Bible tells us in call demons. And the Bible tells us in call demons. And the Bible tells us in Hebrews 13, uh that the righteous angels Hebrews 13, uh that the righteous angels Hebrews 13, uh that the righteous angels will frequently assist we Christians in will frequently assist we Christians in will frequently assist we Christians in our ministries, but they typically come our ministries, but they typically come our ministries, but they typically come and assist for just a few seconds and and assist for just a few seconds and and assist for just a few seconds and they're gone. Whereas the evil angels they're gone. Whereas the evil angels they're gone. Whereas the evil angels tend to hang around. And the thing that tend to hang around. And the thing that tend to hang around. And the thing that I noticed about this UAP phenomena, I noticed about this UAP phenomena, I noticed about this UAP phenomena, uh, the UAP sightings are most frequent uh, the UAP sightings are most frequent uh, the UAP sightings are most frequent at 3:00 a.m. in the morning at the end at 3:00 a.m. in the morning at the end at 3:00 a.m. in the morning at the end of lonely country roads. And immediately of lonely country roads. And immediately of lonely country roads. And immediately that caught my attention because who that caught my attention because who that caught my attention because who who's living at the end of country roads who's living at the end of country roads who's living at the end of country roads at 3:00 a.m. in the morning? Well, at 3:00 a.m. in the morning? Well, at 3:00 a.m. in the morning? Well, that's where we astronomers put our

that's where we astronomers put our that's where we astronomers put our telescopes. You know, we'll construct a telescopes. You know, we'll construct a telescopes. You know, we'll construct a road away from civilization, put a road away from civilization, put a road away from civilization, put a telescope there. So, you'd anticipate telescope there. So, you'd anticipate telescope there. So, you'd anticipate that astronomers would be at the top of that astronomers would be at the top of that astronomers would be at the top of the list of citing these UAPs, but the the list of citing these UAPs, but the the list of citing these UAPs, but the truth is they're close to the bottom of truth is they're close to the bottom of truth is they're close to the bottom of the list. So, hey, they're out at 3:00 the list. So, hey, they're out at 3:00 the list. So, hey, they're out at 3:00 a.m. in the morning at the end of only a.m. in the morning at the end of only a.m. in the morning at the end of only country roads. They don't see anything. country roads. They don't see anything. country roads. They don't see anything. Uh but when I was doing my uh graduate Uh but when I was doing my uh graduate Uh but when I was doing my uh graduate research on quazars and galaxies, I research on quazars and galaxies, I research on quazars and galaxies, I noted that there were two astronomers noted that there were two astronomers noted that there were two astronomers that were seeing UAP phenomena every that were seeing UAP phenomena every that were seeing UAP phenomena every time they went on the telescope, but time they went on the telescope, but time they went on the telescope, but they're only logging three or four hours they're only logging three or four hours they're only logging three or four hours of observing time a year. I was logging of observing time a year. I was logging of observing time a year. I was logging 1500 hours. And I had friends who were 1500 hours. And I had friends who were 1500 hours. And I had friends who were logging almost as much time on the logging almost as much time on the logging almost as much time on the telescopes. We never saw anything. But telescopes. We never saw anything. But telescopes. We never saw anything. But one thing I knew about those two one thing I knew about those two one thing I knew about those two astronomers, both of them were deep into astronomers, both of them were deep into astronomers, both of them were deep into practicing the occult. So that was the practicing the occult. So that was the practicing the occult. So that was the first time I said, "Well, maybe the first time I said, "Well, maybe the first time I said, "Well, maybe the connection is the occult." The people connection is the occult." The people connection is the occult." The people who practice the occult are the ones who practice the occult are the ones who practice the occult are the ones that are going to have these close that are going to have these close that are going to have these close encounters with UAPs. And over the last encounters with UAPs. And over the last encounters with UAPs. And over the last 40 years, that has proven to be true. I 40 years, that has proven to be true. I 40 years, that has proven to be true. I especially saw that when I went to the especially saw that when I went to the especially saw that when I went to the Soviet Union when the communists were Soviet Union when the communists were Soviet Union when the communists were still running the show and they had me still running the show and they had me still running the show and they had me speak to their scientists. What I speak to their scientists. What I speak to their scientists. What I realized is how many of them uh had realized is how many of them uh had realized is how many of them uh had these close encounters with UFOs, these close encounters with UFOs, these close encounters with UFOs, even had communication experiences with

even had communication experiences with even had communication experiences with the entities that were part of this UAP the entities that were part of this UAP the entities that were part of this UAP phenomena. But that was an era when the phenomena. But that was an era when the phenomena. But that was an era when the Soviet Union was sponsoring research in Soviet Union was sponsoring research in Soviet Union was sponsoring research in occult physics. And what I noticed is occult physics. And what I noticed is occult physics. And what I noticed is the physicists involved in occult the physicists involved in occult the physicists involved in occult physics, they were the ones having these physics, they were the ones having these physics, they were the ones having these experiences. experiences. experiences. When I back went back to Russia in 1994 When I back went back to Russia in 1994 When I back went back to Russia in 1994 when the communists were no longer when the communists were no longer when the communists were no longer running the show and there was no longer running the show and there was no longer running the show and there was no longer any uh you know sponsorship of all any uh you know sponsorship of all any uh you know sponsorship of all physics, the number of scientists having physics, the number of scientists having physics, the number of scientists having these encounters, it plummeted. It these encounters, it plummeted. It these encounters, it plummeted. It dropped by more than a factor of 20 dropped by more than a factor of 20 dropped by more than a factor of 20 times. And I see that over even here in times. And I see that over even here in times. And I see that over even here in the United States is that when I go to the United States is that when I go to the United States is that when I go to speak say in Alaska and Hawaii, I run speak say in Alaska and Hawaii, I run speak say in Alaska and Hawaii, I run into a lot of people who've had into a lot of people who've had into a lot of people who've had encounters with UFOs. But those are the encounters with UFOs. But those are the encounters with UFOs. But those are the two states where you got the highest two states where you got the highest two states where you got the highest percentage of the population involved in percentage of the population involved in percentage of the population involved in the occult. When I speak in Nebraska or the occult. When I speak in Nebraska or the occult. When I speak in Nebraska or Iowa, the percentage is much much lower Iowa, the percentage is much much lower Iowa, the percentage is much much lower because a much smaller percentage of the because a much smaller percentage of the because a much smaller percentage of the population is involved in the occult.

population is involved in the occult. population is involved in the occult. So, and the Bible tells us the occult is So, and the Bible tells us the occult is So, and the Bible tells us the occult is a way that you can be contacted by these a way that you can be contacted by these a way that you can be contacted by these evil angelic beings. And so what I tell evil angelic beings. And so what I tell evil angelic beings. And so what I tell people in Lights and Sky, Little Green people in Lights and Sky, Little Green people in Lights and Sky, Little Green Men, and even more emphatically and Men, and even more emphatically and Men, and even more emphatically and specifically in this new book we're specifically in this new book we're specifically in this new book we're bringing out, the UFO problem is that if bringing out, the UFO problem is that if bringing out, the UFO problem is that if you get the occult out of your life, you get the occult out of your life, you get the occult out of your life, that'll be the end of your encounters uh that'll be the end of your encounters uh that'll be the end of your encounters uh with these close, you know, close with these close, you know, close with these close, you know, close encounters with these UAPs. But if you encounters with these UAPs. But if you encounters with these UAPs. But if you practice the occult, good chance it's practice the occult, good chance it's practice the occult, good chance it's going to happen to you. And if you're going to happen to you. And if you're going to happen to you. And if you're deep into the occult, it'll happen deep into the occult, it'll happen deep into the occult, it'll happen repeatedly. repeatedly. repeatedly. >> Yes. And this is what you know I >> Yes. And this is what you know I >> Yes. And this is what you know I remember you were sitting in my office. remember you were sitting in my office. remember you were sitting in my office. It was in about 2003 or 2004 and the It was in about 2003 or 2004 and the It was in about 2003 or 2004 and the Nobel Prize winner Rick Smallley was Nobel Prize winner Rick Smallley was Nobel Prize winner Rick Smallley was there and his wife Debbie and uh you there and his wife Debbie and uh you there and his wife Debbie and uh you started taking Rick through this and started taking Rick through this and started taking Rick through this and this is where I first learned that this is where I first learned that this is where I first learned that indeed uh um it's through the practice indeed uh um it's through the practice indeed uh um it's through the practice of the occult and you know even even as of the occult and you know even even as of the occult and you know even even as simple as Ouija boards and tarot cards simple as Ouija boards and tarot cards simple as Ouija boards and tarot cards can begin to open people up to demonic can begin to open people up to demonic can begin to open people up to demonic activity. And it is then that they begin activity. And it is then that they begin activity. And it is then that they begin seeing the these UAPs and and the the seeing the these UAPs and and the the seeing the these UAPs and and the the the times when there's interaction when the times when there's interaction when the times when there's interaction when there's interaction between these there's interaction between these there's interaction between these phenomena and and the individual, it is phenomena and and the individual, it is phenomena and and the individual, it is almost always a a just a terrifying almost always a a just a terrifying almost always a a just a terrifying thing, which is exactly what demons do.

thing, which is exactly what demons do. thing, which is exactly what demons do. It's a terrifying thing. When there's an It's a terrifying thing. When there's an It's a terrifying thing. When there's an angelic presence in the Bible, it's angelic presence in the Bible, it's angelic presence in the Bible, it's always peaceful. It's kind. It's always peaceful. It's kind. It's always peaceful. It's kind. It's gracious. And most of the time they're gracious. And most of the time they're gracious. And most of the time they're appearing in some other form. But when appearing in some other form. But when appearing in some other form. But when they, you know, they'll appear as a as a they, you know, they'll appear as a as a they, you know, they'll appear as a as a young man, uh, and they'll say, "Well, young man, uh, and they'll say, "Well, young man, uh, and they'll say, "Well, the body of Jesus is not here. He's he's the body of Jesus is not here. He's he's the body of Jesus is not here. He's he's he's he's risen." You know, they he's he's risen." You know, they he's he's risen." You know, they they'll, it comforting thing. And and so they'll, it comforting thing. And and so they'll, it comforting thing. And and so even though just the presence, so if you even though just the presence, so if you even though just the presence, so if you think of Zechariah, I mean, he was think of Zechariah, I mean, he was think of Zechariah, I mean, he was terrified to see the angel sitting on terrified to see the angel sitting on terrified to see the angel sitting on the on the on the end there because the the on the on the end there because the the on the on the end there because the the the Israelites knew that that uh the the Israelites knew that that uh the the Israelites knew that that uh this is the phenomena that could happen this is the phenomena that could happen this is the phenomena that could happen if if you're going to be killed. But it if if you're going to be killed. But it if if you're going to be killed. But it turned out to be a very peaceful thing. turned out to be a very peaceful thing. turned out to be a very peaceful thing. And so so uh uh but all of these And so so uh uh but all of these And so so uh uh but all of these sightings I mean the the animals in the sightings I mean the the animals in the sightings I mean the the animals in the in in around will detect these much more in in around will detect these much more in in around will detect these much more quickly and the individual ends up quickly and the individual ends up quickly and the individual ends up terrified sometimes to the point of of terrified sometimes to the point of of terrified sometimes to the point of of being highly sick afterwards and being highly sick afterwards and being highly sick afterwards and psychologically damaged afterward which psychologically damaged afterward which psychologically damaged afterward which is consistent with this being a de is consistent with this being a de is consistent with this being a de demonic entity. And I like what you said demonic entity. And I like what you said demonic entity. And I like what you said that when you start dealing with the that when you start dealing with the that when you start dealing with the occult, when you get people praying and occult, when you get people praying and occult, when you get people praying and you get get them uh uh claiming the you get get them uh uh claiming the you get get them uh uh claiming the blood of Christ and and and praying and blood of Christ and and and praying and blood of Christ and and and praying and getting free of this and repenting of getting free of this and repenting of getting free of this and repenting of this, these sightings go away. And I this, these sightings go away. And I this, these sightings go away. And I remember you said something in my office remember you said something in my office remember you said something in my office uh uh more than 20 years ago, you said, uh uh more than 20 years ago, you said, uh uh more than 20 years ago, you said, you know, if you if you take a place you know, if you if you take a place you know, if you if you take a place where people are having a lot of these where people are having a lot of these where people are having a lot of these sightings, you see that there are occult

sightings, you see that there are occult sightings, you see that there are occult practices. But if you bring a prayer practices. But if you bring a prayer practices. But if you bring a prayer group in and they start praying and they group in and they start praying and they group in and they start praying and they start start uh uh uh uh bringing people start start uh uh uh uh bringing people start start uh uh uh uh bringing people into a a time of repentance the the the into a a time of repentance the the the into a a time of repentance the the the sightings go away. So again there is sightings go away. So again there is sightings go away. So again there is this correlation. Expand on this for us. this correlation. Expand on this for us. this correlation. Expand on this for us. >> Yeah very much so. I mean in terms of >> Yeah very much so. I mean in terms of >> Yeah very much so. I mean in terms of the close encounters the close encounters the close encounters Alan Heinik the astrophysicist basically Alan Heinik the astrophysicist basically Alan Heinik the astrophysicist basically said uh the things we have to worry said uh the things we have to worry said uh the things we have to worry about is where the human contact is less about is where the human contact is less about is where the human contact is less than 500 ft away from the UFO phenomena than 500 ft away from the UFO phenomena than 500 ft away from the UFO phenomena and uh and in some cases you actually and uh and in some cases you actually and uh and in some cases you actually have communication. I mean the most have communication. I mean the most have communication. I mean the most dramatic case is where the human dramatic case is where the human dramatic case is where the human contactee goes into a trance and while contactee goes into a trance and while contactee goes into a trance and while they're in a trance uh this angelic they're in a trance uh this angelic they're in a trance uh this angelic being will have them right and so being will have them right and so being will have them right and so there's actually four UFO religions that there's actually four UFO religions that there's actually four UFO religions that are quite prominent here in the United are quite prominent here in the United are quite prominent here in the United States many more overseas. Uh but kind States many more overseas. Uh but kind States many more overseas. Uh but kind of their holy book is the Arantia book of their holy book is the Arantia book of their holy book is the Arantia book which was communicated from one of these which was communicated from one of these which was communicated from one of these UAP entities to a human contactee.

UAP entities to a human contactee. UAP entities to a human contactee. It's actually bigger than the Bible but It's actually bigger than the Bible but It's actually bigger than the Bible but a third of its content is denying the a third of its content is denying the a third of its content is denying the deity of Jesus Christ. So that kind of deity of Jesus Christ. So that kind of deity of Jesus Christ. So that kind of gives you an idea where it's coming gives you an idea where it's coming gives you an idea where it's coming from. Uh but Jacqu Valet and Alan Heinik from. Uh but Jacqu Valet and Alan Heinik from. Uh but Jacqu Valet and Alan Heinik also documented that when people have also documented that when people have also documented that when people have these close encounters with these UAPs, these close encounters with these UAPs, these close encounters with these UAPs, it's always harmful. The best you're it's always harmful. The best you're it's always harmful. The best you're going to come away with is recurring going to come away with is recurring going to come away with is recurring terrifying nightmares. Say what's the terrifying nightmares. Say what's the terrifying nightmares. Say what's the worst case scenario? There's many worst case scenario? There's many worst case scenario? There's many documented cases where the human contact documented cases where the human contact documented cases where the human contact has been killed uh by the encounter or has been killed uh by the encounter or has been killed uh by the encounter or their animals have been killed. As you their animals have been killed. As you their animals have been killed. As you mentioned, sometimes it's the pets that mentioned, sometimes it's the pets that mentioned, sometimes it's the pets that are associated with the human that react are associated with the human that react are associated with the human that react first to the UAP phenomena and sometimes first to the UAP phenomena and sometimes first to the UAP phenomena and sometimes they're killed by the phenomena. So, they're killed by the phenomena. So, they're killed by the phenomena. So, this is quite a harmful thing and uh you this is quite a harmful thing and uh you this is quite a harmful thing and uh you know and very deceptive. I mean, that's know and very deceptive. I mean, that's know and very deceptive. I mean, that's the thing that caught my attention even the thing that caught my attention even the thing that caught my attention even my teenage years. People who claimed to my teenage years. People who claimed to my teenage years. People who claimed to have gotten these messages from the have gotten these messages from the have gotten these messages from the UAPs, I knew right away that the UAPs, I knew right away that the UAPs, I knew right away that the astronomy they were communicating was astronomy they were communicating was astronomy they were communicating was incorrect. But it's like they seem to be incorrect. But it's like they seem to be incorrect. But it's like they seem to be keeping pace with their education level keeping pace with their education level keeping pace with their education level and our technology because you know 100 and our technology because you know 100 and our technology because you know 100 years ago they appearing as slowm moving years ago they appearing as slowm moving years ago they appearing as slowm moving derigibles in the atmosphere. World War derigibles in the atmosphere. World War derigibles in the atmosphere. World War II they were the foo fighters moving at II they were the foo fighters moving at II they were the foo fighters moving at the speed of sound. Now they're moving the speed of sound. Now they're moving the speed of sound. Now they're moving as fast as our fastest spaceships. And as fast as our fastest spaceships. And as fast as our fastest spaceships. And the stories they tell people change. A the stories they tell people change. A the stories they tell people change. A 100 years ago they said they were from 100 years ago they said they were from 100 years ago they said they were from the back side of the moon. When people

the back side of the moon. When people the back side of the moon. When people realize, well, that's not credible, they realize, well, that's not credible, they realize, well, that's not credible, they said, well, we're from Venus. When said, well, we're from Venus. When said, well, we're from Venus. When people figured how hot it is on Venus, people figured how hot it is on Venus, people figured how hot it is on Venus, they said, we're from Mars. Now, they're they said, we're from Mars. Now, they're they said, we're from Mars. Now, they're saying that they're from another saying that they're from another saying that they're from another planetary system. So, the fact that they planetary system. So, the fact that they planetary system. So, the fact that they keep changing their story. And as Jacqu keep changing their story. And as Jacqu keep changing their story. And as Jacqu Valet has documented, this phenomena has Valet has documented, this phenomena has Valet has documented, this phenomena has always been with us. So, some of the always been with us. So, some of the always been with us. So, some of the documented cases go back more than 3,000 documented cases go back more than 3,000 documented cases go back more than 3,000 years. But there they were appearing as years. But there they were appearing as years. But there they were appearing as fairies and as leprechauns. Now they're fairies and as leprechauns. Now they're fairies and as leprechauns. Now they're appearing as flying saucers and appearing as flying saucers and appearing as flying saucers and spaceships. And angelic beings have that spaceships. And angelic beings have that spaceships. And angelic beings have that power uh for a brief period of time. power uh for a brief period of time. power uh for a brief period of time. They can transform themselves into a They can transform themselves into a They can transform themselves into a your grandfather, a human being, an your grandfather, a human being, an your grandfather, a human being, an animal or a spaceship. They can do that. animal or a spaceship. They can do that. animal or a spaceship. They can do that. Uh but when they do those kinds of Uh but when they do those kinds of Uh but when they do those kinds of things, they're violating the laws of things, they're violating the laws of things, they're violating the laws of physics. That's what our government is physics. That's what our government is physics. That's what our government is releasing. uh these reports that are releasing. uh these reports that are releasing. uh these reports that are coming out where pilots see uh these coming out where pilots see uh these coming out where pilots see uh these supposed craft making sharp right angle supposed craft making sharp right angle supposed craft making sharp right angle turns at 15,000 mph. Well, no physical turns at 15,000 mph. Well, no physical turns at 15,000 mph. Well, no physical object can withstand those kinds of G object can withstand those kinds of G object can withstand those kinds of G forces. So, we are already dealing with forces. So, we are already dealing with forces. So, we are already dealing with something that's real but not physical.

something that's real but not physical. something that's real but not physical. It's spiritual. There really is a It's spiritual. There really is a It's spiritual. There really is a spiritual realm. I think that's what's spiritual realm. I think that's what's spiritual realm. I think that's what's going to be exciting about these going to be exciting about these going to be exciting about these releases from France and Britain and releases from France and Britain and releases from France and Britain and Russia, Brazil and the United States. Russia, Brazil and the United States. Russia, Brazil and the United States. It's going to persuade people there It's going to persuade people there It's going to persuade people there really is a spiritual dimension out really is a spiritual dimension out really is a spiritual dimension out there. My concern as a Christian, there. My concern as a Christian, there. My concern as a Christian, they're going to go into uh spiritualism they're going to go into uh spiritualism they're going to go into uh spiritualism rather than Christianity. Uh you know, rather than Christianity. Uh you know, rather than Christianity. Uh you know, we're fundamentally spiritual. All of us we're fundamentally spiritual. All of us we're fundamentally spiritual. All of us want to worship something. Uh my worry want to worship something. Uh my worry want to worship something. Uh my worry is when they say, "Oh, materialism isn't is when they say, "Oh, materialism isn't is when they say, "Oh, materialism isn't the answer." instead of following Jesus the answer." instead of following Jesus the answer." instead of following Jesus Christ, uh they're going to follow a Christ, uh they're going to follow a Christ, uh they're going to follow a false spiritual religion. false spiritual religion. false spiritual religion. >> Yes. And and we know that there's going >> Yes. And and we know that there's going >> Yes. And and we know that there's going to be no peace in that. And as you say, to be no peace in that. And as you say, to be no peace in that. And as you say, their own book talks spends so much time their own book talks spends so much time their own book talks spends so much time denying the deity of Jesus and attacking denying the deity of Jesus and attacking denying the deity of Jesus and attacking the things of Jesus. So that's telling the things of Jesus. So that's telling the things of Jesus. So that's telling in itself of of what what they fear. in itself of of what what they fear. in itself of of what what they fear. >> And uh um and and so the Bible talks >> And uh um and and so the Bible talks >> And uh um and and so the Bible talks about this sort of thing. And scientists about this sort of thing. And scientists about this sort of thing. And scientists say, "Well, I'm I'm just a hard say, "Well, I'm I'm just a hard say, "Well, I'm I'm just a hard materialist." And I'll say, well, you materialist." And I'll say, well, you materialist." And I'll say, well, you know, tell me about some of these know, tell me about some of these know, tell me about some of these phenomena in the universe. Tell me about phenomena in the universe. Tell me about phenomena in the universe. Tell me about dark matter. Tell me about dark energy.

dark matter. Tell me about dark energy. dark matter. Tell me about dark energy. I mean, these are things that you can't I mean, these are things that you can't I mean, these are things that you can't measure with any tools. Uh, but but we measure with any tools. Uh, but but we measure with any tools. Uh, but but we have evidence for them being there by by have evidence for them being there by by have evidence for them being there by by other methods uh uh from from from some other methods uh uh from from from some other methods uh uh from from from some sort of difference. You could even sort of difference. You could even sort of difference. You could even expand on that if you like, but it's expand on that if you like, but it's expand on that if you like, but it's it's hard for us to to to say that it's hard for us to to to say that it's hard for us to to to say that there's just this materialistic world. there's just this materialistic world. there's just this materialistic world. And I'm finding that these people who And I'm finding that these people who And I'm finding that these people who pound their fist on the table that pound their fist on the table that pound their fist on the table that materialism is all there is. And then materialism is all there is. And then materialism is all there is. And then they'll readily embrace these things the they'll readily embrace these things the they'll readily embrace these things the from from other planetary systems which from from other planetary systems which from from other planetary systems which as we know as you say when they do these as we know as you say when they do these as we know as you say when they do these sharp turns there's no biological entity sharp turns there's no biological entity sharp turns there's no biological entity that we know of no life entity no that we know of no life entity no that we know of no life entity no materials no materials that could stand materials no materials that could stand materials no materials that could stand the G forces that these things are the G forces that these things are the G forces that these things are doing. So they are they are they're doing. So they are they are they're doing. So they are they are they're saying they're not material. they're not saying they're not material. they're not saying they're not material. they're not material when they're doing these sort material when they're doing these sort material when they're doing these sort of things. And it's interesting how of things. And it's interesting how of things. And it's interesting how these keep trying to keep pace with a these keep trying to keep pace with a these keep trying to keep pace with a dimension that's going to keep people dimension that's going to keep people dimension that's going to keep people impressed. If they just came as little impressed. If they just came as little impressed. If they just came as little fairies, we wouldn't be impressed fairies, we wouldn't be impressed fairies, we wouldn't be impressed anymore. I mean, with AI, we we can do anymore. I mean, with AI, we we can do anymore. I mean, with AI, we we can do these sort of things. So, they keep these sort of things. So, they keep these sort of things. So, they keep trying to come with something that's trying to come with something that's trying to come with something that's going to tantalize people to show that going to tantalize people to show that going to tantalize people to show that that they're they're interested in this.

that they're they're interested in this. that they're they're interested in this. Expand on these things for me. Expand on these things for me. Expand on these things for me. >> Yeah. Their basic motivation is to >> Yeah. Their basic motivation is to >> Yeah. Their basic motivation is to deceive us. I mean, we have the evidence deceive us. I mean, we have the evidence deceive us. I mean, we have the evidence that they're not material but real. But that they're not material but real. But that they're not material but real. But I think the deception that we see, I I think the deception that we see, I I think the deception that we see, I mean, that's what pervades all the mean, that's what pervades all the mean, that's what pervades all the millions of sightings is that you can millions of sightings is that you can millions of sightings is that you can see this one common denominator. They're see this one common denominator. They're see this one common denominator. They're out to deceive us about the out to deceive us about the out to deceive us about the characteristics of the universe and uh characteristics of the universe and uh characteristics of the universe and uh they're out to deceive us about our they're out to deceive us about our they're out to deceive us about our purpose and our destiny. So, that should purpose and our destiny. So, that should purpose and our destiny. So, that should be a good clue what's going on. And uh be a good clue what's going on. And uh be a good clue what's going on. And uh again, I'm concerned that uh this is again, I'm concerned that uh this is again, I'm concerned that uh this is finally going to persuade people finally going to persuade people finally going to persuade people materialism doesn't work. Uh but instead materialism doesn't work. Uh but instead materialism doesn't work. Uh but instead of submitting their life to Jesus of submitting their life to Jesus of submitting their life to Jesus Christ, they're going to basically Christ, they're going to basically Christ, they're going to basically submit their life to some other entity. submit their life to some other entity. submit their life to some other entity. That's always been a concern, which is That's always been a concern, which is That's always been a concern, which is why the Bible so much emphasizes seek why the Bible so much emphasizes seek why the Bible so much emphasizes seek truth. What I find interesting too from truth. What I find interesting too from truth. What I find interesting too from a biblical perspective, Christian a biblical perspective, Christian a biblical perspective, Christian scholars have debated for 2,000 years, scholars have debated for 2,000 years, scholars have debated for 2,000 years, did God create life elsewhere in the did God create life elsewhere in the did God create life elsewhere in the universe or we alone in the universe?

universe or we alone in the universe? universe or we alone in the universe? And there's good theological arguments And there's good theological arguments And there's good theological arguments for both perspectives. for both perspectives. for both perspectives. But if you're an atheist, if you're a But if you're an atheist, if you're a But if you're an atheist, if you're a materialist, you have to believe that materialist, you have to believe that materialist, you have to believe that there's life everywhere in the universe. there's life everywhere in the universe. there's life everywhere in the universe. And yet all of our astronomical And yet all of our astronomical And yet all of our astronomical measurements are countering that. You measurements are countering that. You measurements are countering that. You know, as we kind of look at other know, as we kind of look at other know, as we kind of look at other planets, other stars, other galaxies, planets, other stars, other galaxies, planets, other stars, other galaxies, it's basically telling us the universe it's basically telling us the universe it's basically telling us the universe is out to kill us. I'm quoting Neil is out to kill us. I'm quoting Neil is out to kill us. I'm quoting Neil deGrasse Tyson there. He says once you deGrasse Tyson there. He says once you deGrasse Tyson there. He says once you get past planet Earth, the universe is a get past planet Earth, the universe is a get past planet Earth, the universe is a very deadly place. And the more we very deadly place. And the more we very deadly place. And the more we observe the universe, the more that that observe the universe, the more that that observe the universe, the more that that is confirmed. So the our astrophysical is confirmed. So the our astrophysical is confirmed. So the our astrophysical data is telling us it strongly looks data is telling us it strongly looks data is telling us it strongly looks like we are alone in the universe as the like we are alone in the universe as the like we are alone in the universe as the only physical uh life forms that are only physical uh life forms that are only physical uh life forms that are constrained by the laws of physics and constrained by the laws of physics and constrained by the laws of physics and yet we have these entities that violate yet we have these entities that violate yet we have these entities that violate the laws of physics. So and if we're the laws of physics. So and if we're the laws of physics. So and if we're alone in the universe that basically alone in the universe that basically alone in the universe that basically tells us again materialism can't be the tells us again materialism can't be the tells us again materialism can't be the answer. And let let me let me just answer. And let let me let me just answer. And let let me let me just reassure folks that in Jesus Christ reassure folks that in Jesus Christ reassure folks that in Jesus Christ there is protection and and uh uh even there is protection and and uh uh even there is protection and and uh uh even among believers we have to be careful. I among believers we have to be careful. I among believers we have to be careful. I I remember there was one one man that I remember there was one one man that I remember there was one one man that you cited in your book that uh um came you cited in your book that uh um came you cited in your book that uh um came to you and talked about that he was to you and talked about that he was to you and talked about that he was having these sort of of of uh sightings having these sort of of of uh sightings having these sort of of of uh sightings and and uh you said well have you been and and uh you said well have you been and and uh you said well have you been involved in the occult occult practices?

involved in the occult occult practices? involved in the occult occult practices? He said no. and and you you pushed it He said no. and and you you pushed it He said no. and and you you pushed it further and it turns out well his further and it turns out well his further and it turns out well his girlfriend was was very involved in girlfriend was was very involved in girlfriend was was very involved in these sort of things and he was having a these sort of things and he was having a these sort of things and he was having a sexual relationship with his girlfriend sexual relationship with his girlfriend sexual relationship with his girlfriend and and so this was brought into it as and and so this was brought into it as and and so this was brought into it as the Bible talks about sexual union the Bible talks about sexual union the Bible talks about sexual union brings a oneness between the the two brings a oneness between the the two brings a oneness between the the two parties and uh and so he was parties and uh and so he was parties and uh and so he was experiencing this and then you brought experiencing this and then you brought experiencing this and then you brought him through a repentance and he broke him through a repentance and he broke him through a repentance and he broke off that relationship and the sightings off that relationship and the sightings off that relationship and the sightings went away. Have I got this right? went away. Have I got this right? went away. Have I got this right? >> Yeah, you've got that right. And yeah, >> Yeah, you've got that right. And yeah, >> Yeah, you've got that right. And yeah, this is what makes this such a subtle uh this is what makes this such a subtle uh this is what makes this such a subtle uh phenomena is that sometimes these fallen phenomena is that sometimes these fallen phenomena is that sometimes these fallen angels will work through your angels will work through your angels will work through your grandfather uh to get to you. And so you grandfather uh to get to you. And so you grandfather uh to get to you. And so you also have to say, okay, I might be free also have to say, okay, I might be free also have to say, okay, I might be free of the occult, but is anyone in my of the occult, but is anyone in my of the occult, but is anyone in my immediate family that's involved in the immediate family that's involved in the immediate family that's involved in the occult? Because sometimes the demons occult? Because sometimes the demons occult? Because sometimes the demons will work through a family line. Which will work through a family line. Which will work through a family line. Which is why it's important when you come to is why it's important when you come to is why it's important when you come to faith in Jesus Christ to repent of your faith in Jesus Christ to repent of your faith in Jesus Christ to repent of your sins of rebellion against God, but also sins of rebellion against God, but also sins of rebellion against God, but also to agree with God in prayer that what to agree with God in prayer that what to agree with God in prayer that what your parents were doing or your aunt and your parents were doing or your aunt and your parents were doing or your aunt and uncle was doing or your grandparents uncle was doing or your grandparents uncle was doing or your grandparents were doing doesn't please God. And when were doing doesn't please God. And when were doing doesn't please God. And when you do that, that cuts the link. The you do that, that cuts the link. The you do that, that cuts the link. The demon can no longer work through that demon can no longer work through that demon can no longer work through that close relative to get to you. And I've close relative to get to you. And I've close relative to get to you. And I've been sharing with parents, if you have a been sharing with parents, if you have a been sharing with parents, if you have a young child that's afraid to go to sleep young child that's afraid to go to sleep young child that's afraid to go to sleep at night, wants the light on all night, at night, wants the light on all night, at night, wants the light on all night, can't be alone, uh is terrified about

can't be alone, uh is terrified about can't be alone, uh is terrified about going to sleep, and this [clears throat] going to sleep, and this [clears throat] going to sleep, and this [clears throat] happens repeatedly, happens repeatedly, happens repeatedly, take it seriously. It could be that take it seriously. It could be that take it seriously. It could be that there's a demon that's trying to attack there's a demon that's trying to attack there's a demon that's trying to attack that child and basically go through your that child and basically go through your that child and basically go through your house, go through your life, your family house, go through your life, your family house, go through your life, your family history, and close all the doors of the history, and close all the doors of the history, and close all the doors of the occult. And what I've seen consistently occult. And what I've seen consistently occult. And what I've seen consistently as a pastor when that is done, no longer as a pastor when that is done, no longer as a pastor when that is done, no longer is a child afraid to go to sleep at is a child afraid to go to sleep at is a child afraid to go to sleep at night. He's afraid or she is afraid night. He's afraid or she is afraid night. He's afraid or she is afraid because these entities are trying to because these entities are trying to because these entities are trying to come into the bedroom and invade their come into the bedroom and invade their come into the bedroom and invade their life. It's a very terrifying experience. life. It's a very terrifying experience. life. It's a very terrifying experience. And unfortunately that happens quite And unfortunately that happens quite And unfortunately that happens quite frequently even amongst Christian frequently even amongst Christian frequently even amongst Christian communities. And so yes, the Bible warns communities. And so yes, the Bible warns communities. And so yes, the Bible warns us we always must be on our guard us we always must be on our guard us we always must be on our guard against these demonic attacks. against these demonic attacks. against these demonic attacks. But there's always help through Jesus But there's always help through Jesus But there's always help through Jesus Christ. Christ. Christ. >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> Mention the name of Jesus, they flee. >> Mention the name of Jesus, they flee. >> Mention the name of Jesus, they flee. >> That's exactly it. That's what I was >> That's exactly it. That's what I was >> That's exactly it. That's what I was going to say. The practical outworking going to say. The practical outworking going to say. The practical outworking of this that I have seen uh working with of this that I have seen uh working with of this that I have seen uh working with with people for for many years. I've with people for for many years. I've with people for for many years. I've been a believer uh um for for almost 50 been a believer uh um for for almost 50 been a believer uh um for for almost 50 years. is that you you bring people into years. is that you you bring people into years. is that you you bring people into a place of repentance and just just say a place of repentance and just just say a place of repentance and just just say you know what what has been dealt with you know what what has been dealt with you know what what has been dealt with and you deal with this in in repentance and you deal with this in in repentance and you deal with this in in repentance and then also you you uh you take the and then also you you uh you take the and then also you you uh you take the next step of say of calling down the next step of say of calling down the next step of say of calling down the blood of Jesus over this home over this blood of Jesus over this home over this blood of Jesus over this home over this life over this family and submitting to life over this family and submitting to life over this family and submitting to the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and

the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and these things start to break they really these things start to break they really these things start to break they really break so this is the practical break so this is the practical break so this is the practical outworking Lord outworking Lord outworking Lord the blood of Jesus over this home. the blood of Jesus over this home. the blood of Jesus over this home. Cleanse this home and protect us, crying Cleanse this home and protect us, crying Cleanse this home and protect us, crying out to the Lord like that. And this this out to the Lord like that. And this this out to the Lord like that. And this this sort of thing really brings protection sort of thing really brings protection sort of thing really brings protection into the home. into the home. into the home. >> It definitely does. >> It definitely does. >> It definitely does. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> And often when people buy a home, they >> And often when people buy a home, they >> And often when people buy a home, they discover an article is left behind by a discover an article is left behind by a discover an article is left behind by a previous owner. previous owner. previous owner. >> You need to get that article out. So I >> You need to get that article out. So I >> You need to get that article out. So I mean there's strange things going on. mean there's strange things going on. mean there's strange things going on. When when when you say an article, you When when when you say an article, you When when when you say an article, you mean you mean say like a pentagram, mean you mean say like a pentagram, mean you mean say like a pentagram, things that that that occult practices things that that that occult practices things that that that occult practices might use? might use? might use? >> Yes. I mean, I remember visiting a >> Yes. I mean, I remember visiting a >> Yes. I mean, I remember visiting a couple, they just purchased a home and couple, they just purchased a home and couple, they just purchased a home and there was one room in the home where there was one room in the home where there was one room in the home where articles were floating in midair and it articles were floating in midair and it articles were floating in midair and it was 10° colder and, you know, they was 10° colder and, you know, they was 10° colder and, you know, they shivered when they went into the room. shivered when they went into the room. shivered when they went into the room. They knew that there was some alcohol They knew that there was some alcohol They knew that there was some alcohol article left behind by the previous article left behind by the previous article left behind by the previous owner, but they couldn't find it. But owner, but they couldn't find it. But owner, but they couldn't find it. But eventually we found an astrological eventually we found an astrological eventually we found an astrological forecaster in a pile of junk lumber in forecaster in a pile of junk lumber in forecaster in a pile of junk lumber in the garage. When we destroyed that item, the garage. When we destroyed that item, the garage. When we destroyed that item, everything went back to normal.

everything went back to normal. everything went back to normal. >> And and I I want to as we wrap this >> And and I I want to as we wrap this >> And and I I want to as we wrap this thing up, I want to to ask a couple of thing up, I want to to ask a couple of thing up, I want to to ask a couple of questions that I'm just deeply questions that I'm just deeply questions that I'm just deeply interested in. One of them is what do interested in. One of them is what do interested in. One of them is what do you think about this idea that Elon Musk you think about this idea that Elon Musk you think about this idea that Elon Musk is talking about of us inhabiting Mars? Because of you, millions of people have Because of you, millions of people have heard the gospel. If you confess [music] heard the gospel. If you confess [music] heard the gospel. If you confess [music] with your mouth, Jesus is Lord and with your mouth, Jesus is Lord and with your mouth, Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that he's risen believe in your heart that he's risen believe in your heart that he's risen from the dead and you will [music] be from the dead and you will [music] be from the dead and you will [music] be saved. That's the requirement. We talk saved. That's the requirement. We talk saved. That's the requirement. We talk about science concepts which [music] about science concepts which [music] about science concepts which [music] draw people in. take these nanom draw people in. take these nanom draw people in. take these nanom machines and have them drill into cells. machines and have them drill into cells. machines and have them drill into cells. It would be a great way to kill cancer, It would be a great way to kill cancer, It would be a great way to kill cancer, right? We also talk about Jesus Christ right? We also talk about Jesus Christ right? We also talk about Jesus Christ who's [music] the best in everything. My who's [music] the best in everything. My who's [music] the best in everything. My faith in Jesus Christ means more to me faith in Jesus Christ means more to me faith in Jesus Christ means more to me than anything. If you could continue to than anything. If you could continue to than anything. If you could continue to give or give for the first time, we give or give for the first time, we give or give for the first time, we would certainly appreciate it. You can would certainly appreciate it. You can would certainly appreciate it. You can go to jesusandcience.org/donate. [music] go to jesusandcience.org/donate. [music] go to jesusandcience.org/donate. [music] All US donations are taxdeductible. All US donations are taxdeductible. All US donations are taxdeductible. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. >> I'm all for sending spacecraft to Mars.

>> I'm all for sending spacecraft to Mars. >> I'm all for sending spacecraft to Mars. Uh, and we're not in the 1970s anymore Uh, and we're not in the 1970s anymore Uh, and we're not in the 1970s anymore with the Apollo program. Our technology with the Apollo program. Our technology with the Apollo program. Our technology is such that the machines can do the job is such that the machines can do the job is such that the machines can do the job much faster, give us more data for a much faster, give us more data for a much faster, give us more data for a whole lot less money than sending whole lot less money than sending whole lot less money than sending people. So, I see no reason to send people. So, I see no reason to send people. So, I see no reason to send people to the moon or send people to people to the moon or send people to people to the moon or send people to Mars or any solar system body because we Mars or any solar system body because we Mars or any solar system body because we can send a machine that'll get us way can send a machine that'll get us way can send a machine that'll get us way more science uh for a lot less money and more science uh for a lot less money and more science uh for a lot less money and a lot less time than if we tried to do a lot less time than if we tried to do a lot less time than if we tried to do with humans. But of course, within us with humans. But of course, within us with humans. But of course, within us human beings, we always have this desire human beings, we always have this desire human beings, we always have this desire to personally explore. So, I understand to personally explore. So, I understand to personally explore. So, I understand why. Hey, uh, if I'm a billionaire, put why. Hey, uh, if I'm a billionaire, put why. Hey, uh, if I'm a billionaire, put me in a spaceship and let me go orbit me in a spaceship and let me go orbit me in a spaceship and let me go orbit about the moon. Uh, because we kind of about the moon. Uh, because we kind of about the moon. Uh, because we kind of love that kind of exploration. love that kind of exploration. love that kind of exploration. And we can send people to the moon. We And we can send people to the moon. We And we can send people to the moon. We proved that with the Apollo program. proved that with the Apollo program. proved that with the Apollo program. It's because we had people there for It's because we had people there for It's because we had people there for only a few days maximum. And for halfway only a few days maximum. And for halfway only a few days maximum. And for halfway there, they were protected by the Van there, they were protected by the Van there, they were protected by the Van Allen belt that surrounds our Earth. So, Allen belt that surrounds our Earth. So, Allen belt that surrounds our Earth. So, they didn't get exposed to a lot of they didn't get exposed to a lot of they didn't get exposed to a lot of radiation. But if you're going to Mars, radiation. But if you're going to Mars, radiation. But if you're going to Mars, you're very quickly outside the Van you're very quickly outside the Van you're very quickly outside the Van Allen belt that surrounds the Earth. You Allen belt that surrounds the Earth. You Allen belt that surrounds the Earth. You get exposed to deadly solar radiation get exposed to deadly solar radiation get exposed to deadly solar radiation and deadly cosmic radiation. And also, and deadly cosmic radiation. And also, and deadly cosmic radiation. And also, you're in zero gravity. Well, Elon Musk you're in zero gravity. Well, Elon Musk you're in zero gravity. Well, Elon Musk has figured that out that hey, we're has figured that out that hey, we're has figured that out that hey, we're going to have to have artificial going to have to have artificial going to have to have artificial gravity. Uh, but the problem is if gravity. Uh, but the problem is if gravity. Uh, but the problem is if you're in a small spacecraft with a long you're in a small spacecraft with a long you're in a small spacecraft with a long rod and a counterwe and you're rotating

rod and a counterwe and you're rotating rod and a counterwe and you're rotating it to produce artificial gravity is that it to produce artificial gravity is that it to produce artificial gravity is that you're going to have a stronger you're going to have a stronger you're going to have a stronger gravitational pull on your feet than on gravitational pull on your feet than on gravitational pull on your feet than on your head. And the human body is not your head. And the human body is not your head. And the human body is not designed for that. We have to experience designed for that. We have to experience designed for that. We have to experience roughly the same gravity at our head as roughly the same gravity at our head as roughly the same gravity at our head as we do our feet. Well, to make that we do our feet. Well, to make that we do our feet. Well, to make that happen, you got to make the spaceship oh happen, you got to make the spaceship oh happen, you got to make the spaceship oh about 10 miles. Like making it a large about 10 miles. Like making it a large about 10 miles. Like making it a large Coke can where the Coke can is 10 miles Coke can where the Coke can is 10 miles Coke can where the Coke can is 10 miles in diameter. Now you can have roughly in diameter. Now you can have roughly in diameter. Now you can have roughly the same gravity at your head as your the same gravity at your head as your the same gravity at your head as your feet. But now we're looking at a really, feet. But now we're looking at a really, feet. But now we're looking at a really, really big spaceship. And even Elon Mutz really big spaceship. And even Elon Mutz really big spaceship. And even Elon Mutz with all of his money isn't going to be with all of his money isn't going to be with all of his money isn't going to be able to build that kind of a spacecraft. able to build that kind of a spacecraft. able to build that kind of a spacecraft. Moreover, once you get into Moreover, once you get into Moreover, once you get into interplanetary space, the chance you interplanetary space, the chance you interplanetary space, the chance you being hit by some kind of tiny pebble or being hit by some kind of tiny pebble or being hit by some kind of tiny pebble or a piece of dust that punctures your a piece of dust that punctures your a piece of dust that punctures your spaceship, once that happens, everybody spaceship, once that happens, everybody spaceship, once that happens, everybody inside dies. And hey, to protect from inside dies. And hey, to protect from inside dies. And hey, to protect from the radiation, you're going to need the radiation, you're going to need the radiation, you're going to need about 15 ft of water or a foot of lead about 15 ft of water or a foot of lead about 15 ft of water or a foot of lead to protect you from that. Now, again, to protect you from that. Now, again, to protect you from that. Now, again, you're looking at a really heavy you're looking at a really heavy you're looking at a really heavy spaceship. And hey, if the armor that spaceship. And hey, if the armor that spaceship. And hey, if the armor that protects that water or that lead uh gets protects that water or that lead uh gets protects that water or that lead uh gets punctured, all your water escapes and punctured, all your water escapes and punctured, all your water escapes and everybody on board dies. So, it's like everybody on board dies. So, it's like everybody on board dies. So, it's like we're not sending people to Mars. And we're not sending people to Mars. And we're not sending people to Mars. And even we get to Mars, they can't live on even we get to Mars, they can't live on even we get to Mars, they can't live on the surface. They're going to have to the surface. They're going to have to the surface. They're going to have to live underground. And we already done live underground. And we already done live underground. And we already done experiments. Humans don't do too well experiments. Humans don't do too well experiments. Humans don't do too well spending all the life underground. And spending all the life underground. And spending all the life underground. And uh and incidentally, the environment of

uh and incidentally, the environment of uh and incidentally, the environment of Mars is deadly for life. So yes, I would Mars is deadly for life. So yes, I would Mars is deadly for life. So yes, I would say that's not going to happen. Although say that's not going to happen. Although say that's not going to happen. Although what I find interesting, and this really what I find interesting, and this really what I find interesting, and this really applies to the UAP phenomena, is we applies to the UAP phenomena, is we applies to the UAP phenomena, is we astronomers are seriously wanting to astronomers are seriously wanting to astronomers are seriously wanting to send spaceships to the nearest planet send spaceships to the nearest planet send spaceships to the nearest planet outside of our solar system. But we're outside of our solar system. But we're outside of our solar system. But we're aware we're going to have to go at least aware we're going to have to go at least aware we're going to have to go at least onetenth the velocity of light. And onetenth the velocity of light. And onetenth the velocity of light. And you're going that fast, you get hit by you're going that fast, you get hit by you're going that fast, you get hit by dust particles that can do a lot of dust particles that can do a lot of dust particles that can do a lot of damage. So, for example, even as slow as damage. So, for example, even as slow as damage. So, for example, even as slow as 1/10enth the velocity of light, which 1/10enth the velocity of light, which 1/10enth the velocity of light, which means you're looking at 43 years to get means you're looking at 43 years to get means you're looking at 43 years to get to the nearest planet outside of our to the nearest planet outside of our to the nearest planet outside of our solar system. If you run into a dust solar system. If you run into a dust solar system. If you run into a dust particle that's 10 times smaller than particle that's 10 times smaller than particle that's 10 times smaller than the period at the end of a sentence in the period at the end of a sentence in the period at the end of a sentence in 10point type, basically a dust particle 10point type, basically a dust particle 10point type, basically a dust particle you can't even see. It's going to slam you can't even see. It's going to slam you can't even see. It's going to slam into your spaceship with a force of a into your spaceship with a force of a into your spaceship with a force of a baseball throwing at a 100 milesPH baseball throwing at a 100 milesPH baseball throwing at a 100 milesPH multiplied by 19,000 times. Bottom line, multiplied by 19,000 times. Bottom line, multiplied by 19,000 times. Bottom line, you're not going anywhere unless you can you're not going anywhere unless you can you're not going anywhere unless you can avoid hitting even any the tiniest of avoid hitting even any the tiniest of avoid hitting even any the tiniest of dust particles. Interstellar space is dust particles. Interstellar space is dust particles. Interstellar space is filled with dust particles. And so we filled with dust particles. And so we filled with dust particles. And so we astronomers have figured out the only astronomers have figured out the only astronomers have figured out the only way we're going to be able to get a way we're going to be able to get a way we're going to be able to get a spaceship to the nearest planet outside spaceship to the nearest planet outside spaceship to the nearest planet outside of our solar system is to make the of our solar system is to make the of our solar system is to make the spaceships extremely small and spaceships extremely small and spaceships extremely small and needle-shaped so they have a chance of needle-shaped so they have a chance of needle-shaped so they have a chance of getting there without hitting a dust getting there without hitting a dust getting there without hitting a dust particle. How small? Well, the biggest particle. How small? Well, the biggest particle. How small? Well, the biggest one we could send is about the size of a

one we could send is about the size of a one we could send is about the size of a matchick. Better yet, make them the size matchick. Better yet, make them the size matchick. Better yet, make them the size of a toothpick and send 5,000 of them of a toothpick and send 5,000 of them of a toothpick and send 5,000 of them because almost all of them are going to because almost all of them are going to because almost all of them are going to get destroyed by running into dust. But get destroyed by running into dust. But get destroyed by running into dust. But the odds are maybe we get two out of the odds are maybe we get two out of the odds are maybe we get two out of three out of those 5,000 tiny spaceships three out of those 5,000 tiny spaceships three out of those 5,000 tiny spaceships that'll be able to send us back some that'll be able to send us back some that'll be able to send us back some information. And of course, it's going information. And of course, it's going information. And of course, it's going to be just a flyby. Uh with a spaceship to be just a flyby. Uh with a spaceship to be just a flyby. Uh with a spaceship that tiny, you can't slow it down. Uh that tiny, you can't slow it down. Uh that tiny, you can't slow it down. Uh you can't land. You can't make an orbit you can't land. You can't make an orbit you can't land. You can't make an orbit around the planet. It's simply going to around the planet. It's simply going to around the planet. It's simply going to be a flyby at onetenth the velocity of be a flyby at onetenth the velocity of be a flyby at onetenth the velocity of light. And so for a few seconds, we light. And so for a few seconds, we light. And so for a few seconds, we might be able to get some useful might be able to get some useful might be able to get some useful information we can send back to Earth. information we can send back to Earth. information we can send back to Earth. But that tells us the idea that beings But that tells us the idea that beings But that tells us the idea that beings are traveling to us from another are traveling to us from another are traveling to us from another planetary system. There's no way a planetary system. There's no way a planetary system. There's no way a spaceship bigger than the size of a spaceship bigger than the size of a spaceship bigger than the size of a toothpick is going to be able to toothpick is going to be able to toothpick is going to be able to traverse interstellar space. And even a traverse interstellar space. And even a traverse interstellar space. And even a bacterium is not going to survive in a bacterium is not going to survive in a bacterium is not going to survive in a spaceship that tiny going across spaceship that tiny going across spaceship that tiny going across interstellar space. The radiation in interstellar space. The radiation in interstellar space. The radiation in interstellar space will kill even the interstellar space will kill even the interstellar space will kill even the tiniest bacterium. So no biological tiniest bacterium. So no biological tiniest bacterium. So no biological entity can possibly engage in entity can possibly engage in entity can possibly engage in interstellar travel. That's really the interstellar travel. That's really the interstellar travel. That's really the theme of the new book we're bringing theme of the new book we're bringing theme of the new book we're bringing bringing out is that this ETH hypothesis bringing out is that this ETH hypothesis bringing out is that this ETH hypothesis were being visited by beings on were being visited by beings on were being visited by beings on spaceships. It's simply impossible based spaceships. It's simply impossible based spaceships. It's simply impossible based on the laws of physics. The only way it on the laws of physics. The only way it on the laws of physics. The only way it can be done is by entities that are not can be done is by entities that are not can be done is by entities that are not subject to the laws of physics like we subject to the laws of physics like we subject to the laws of physics like we are.

are. are. >> Okay, Hugh, tell me about dark matter. >> Okay, Hugh, tell me about dark matter. >> Okay, Hugh, tell me about dark matter. Is this something that we can point out Is this something that we can point out Is this something that we can point out to materialists that there there are to materialists that there there are to materialists that there there are things that we can't measure things that things that we can't measure things that things that we can't measure things that that uh uh seem to us uh immaterial or that uh uh seem to us uh immaterial or that uh uh seem to us uh immaterial or is is is that is that not the way to is is is that is that not the way to is is is that is that not the way to approach this in a discussion say with approach this in a discussion say with approach this in a discussion say with scientists? scientists? scientists? >> Yeah, dark matter is material. I mean uh >> Yeah, dark matter is material. I mean uh >> Yeah, dark matter is material. I mean uh we can detect it from its gravitational we can detect it from its gravitational we can detect it from its gravitational influence on galaxies and galaxy influence on galaxies and galaxy influence on galaxies and galaxy clusters. Our own galaxy is 90% composed clusters. Our own galaxy is 90% composed clusters. Our own galaxy is 90% composed of dark matter. So uh the thing is we of dark matter. So uh the thing is we of dark matter. So uh the thing is we have yet to detect the predominant dark have yet to detect the predominant dark have yet to detect the predominant dark matter particles. So we know dark matter matter particles. So we know dark matter matter particles. So we know dark matter is real. We know it's physical. Uh we is real. We know it's physical. Uh we is real. We know it's physical. Uh we know there's more than five times as know there's more than five times as know there's more than five times as much dark matter as there is ordinary much dark matter as there is ordinary much dark matter as there is ordinary matter. But we've not yet found the matter. But we've not yet found the matter. But we've not yet found the particles. And for good reason. Uh, dark particles. And for good reason. Uh, dark particles. And for good reason. Uh, dark matter is composed of particles that matter is composed of particles that matter is composed of particles that very very weakly interacts with photons.

very very weakly interacts with photons. very very weakly interacts with photons. So, of course, it's going to be So, of course, it's going to be So, of course, it's going to be extremely challenging to detect these extremely challenging to detect these extremely challenging to detect these particles. particles. particles. >> Yeah, we we have a whole area called >> Yeah, we we have a whole area called >> Yeah, we we have a whole area called spectroscopy. spectroscopy. spectroscopy. Well, we have some hints that these Well, we have some hints that these Well, we have some hints that these particles are there. Uh because we particles are there. Uh because we particles are there. Uh because we notice that uh stars that are orbiting notice that uh stars that are orbiting notice that uh stars that are orbiting our super massive black hole, they seem our super massive black hole, they seem our super massive black hole, they seem to have too much energy if all their to have too much energy if all their to have too much energy if all their energy is coming from, you know, energy is coming from, you know, energy is coming from, you know, ordinary matter, protons, neutrons, and ordinary matter, protons, neutrons, and ordinary matter, protons, neutrons, and electrons. And we're also seeing white electrons. And we're also seeing white electrons. And we're also seeing white dwarf binary stars uh that seem to be dwarf binary stars uh that seem to be dwarf binary stars uh that seem to be cooling too rapidly. So these are the cooling too rapidly. So these are the cooling too rapidly. So these are the best hints we have of the existence of best hints we have of the existence of best hints we have of the existence of these particles, but we've yet to detect these particles, but we've yet to detect these particles, but we've yet to detect the particle itself. And I think it's the particle itself. And I think it's the particle itself. And I think it's going to be another 5 or 10 years before going to be another 5 or 10 years before going to be another 5 or 10 years before we do. But there's no doubt that dark we do. But there's no doubt that dark we do. But there's no doubt that dark matter is real because we can see its matter is real because we can see its matter is real because we can see its gravitational influence. In fact, all gravitational influence. In fact, all gravitational influence. In fact, all the way back in 1930, uh the physicist the way back in 1930, uh the physicist the way back in 1930, uh the physicist Fritz Wiki said, "There's got to be this Fritz Wiki said, "There's got to be this Fritz Wiki said, "There's got to be this dark matter cuz the only way we can dark matter cuz the only way we can dark matter cuz the only way we can explain the dynamics of the galaxies we explain the dynamics of the galaxies we explain the dynamics of the galaxies we see in the universe see in the universe see in the universe >> and that dark matter is the source of >> and that dark matter is the source of >> and that dark matter is the source of the dark energy."

the dark energy." the dark energy." >> No, dark energy is distinct from dark >> No, dark energy is distinct from dark >> No, dark energy is distinct from dark matter. Dark energy is the energy that's matter. Dark energy is the energy that's matter. Dark energy is the energy that's embedded in the space surface of the embedded in the space surface of the embedded in the space surface of the universe. It's got nothing to do with universe. It's got nothing to do with universe. It's got nothing to do with electromagnetism. That's why they call electromagnetism. That's why they call electromagnetism. That's why they call it dark. It's the energy that causes the it dark. It's the energy that causes the it dark. It's the energy that causes the space surface of the universe to expand space surface of the universe to expand space surface of the universe to expand more rapidly as the universe expands. more rapidly as the universe expands. more rapidly as the universe expands. So, uh it accelerates the expansion of So, uh it accelerates the expansion of So, uh it accelerates the expansion of the universe and is everywhere embedded the universe and is everywhere embedded the universe and is everywhere embedded in the surface of the universe. And what in the surface of the universe. And what in the surface of the universe. And what causes lay people to be a bit confused causes lay people to be a bit confused causes lay people to be a bit confused is an analogy I think that helps. Our is an analogy I think that helps. Our is an analogy I think that helps. Our planet Earth is a three-dimensional body planet Earth is a three-dimensional body planet Earth is a three-dimensional body and we humans live on the and we humans live on the and we humans live on the two-dimensional surface of the two-dimensional surface of the two-dimensional surface of the three-dimensional Earth. For the three-dimensional Earth. For the three-dimensional Earth. For the universe, the stars and galaxies and universe, the stars and galaxies and universe, the stars and galaxies and even the space-time fabric is even the space-time fabric is even the space-time fabric is constrained to the three-dimensional constrained to the three-dimensional constrained to the three-dimensional surface of the four-dimensional surface of the four-dimensional surface of the four-dimensional universe. And so, as the universe universe. And so, as the universe universe. And so, as the universe expands, dark energy becomes expands, dark energy becomes expands, dark energy becomes progressively more powerful to progressively more powerful to progressively more powerful to accelerate the expansion of the accelerate the expansion of the accelerate the expansion of the universe. So, I tell people next year universe. So, I tell people next year universe. So, I tell people next year the universe is going to expand faster the universe is going to expand faster the universe is going to expand faster than it's expanding right now. And it'll than it's expanding right now. And it'll than it's expanding right now. And it'll even cause your waistline to expand a even cause your waistline to expand a even cause your waistline to expand a little more rapidly, but not by much.

little more rapidly, but not by much. little more rapidly, but not by much. It's much less than a quadrillionth of a It's much less than a quadrillionth of a It's much less than a quadrillionth of a centimeter. centimeter. centimeter. >> Okay. What is it that I could speak with >> Okay. What is it that I could speak with >> Okay. What is it that I could speak with a physicist with a colleague to point a physicist with a colleague to point a physicist with a colleague to point out something that is immaterial but is out something that is immaterial but is out something that is immaterial but is is uh but they would accept in physics? is uh but they would accept in physics? is uh but they would accept in physics? >> Well, I'll tell you what happened. a >> Well, I'll tell you what happened. a >> Well, I'll tell you what happened. a couple of weeks ago at a workshop is couple of weeks ago at a workshop is couple of weeks ago at a workshop is that we were citing all these papers that we were citing all these papers that we were citing all these papers written by non-Christian evolutionary written by non-Christian evolutionary written by non-Christian evolutionary biologists and they said you know even biologists and they said you know even biologists and they said you know even at the bacterial level there seems to be at the bacterial level there seems to be at the bacterial level there seems to be some element of awareness and some element of awareness and some element of awareness and consciousness because the bacterium consciousness because the bacterium consciousness because the bacterium seems to react to its environment in the seems to react to its environment in the seems to react to its environment in the way that shows uh some uh you know way that shows uh some uh you know way that shows uh some uh you know element of consciousness. Now, this is element of consciousness. Now, this is element of consciousness. Now, this is evident in all life. And they said evident in all life. And they said evident in all life. And they said there's no materialistic explanation for there's no materialistic explanation for there's no materialistic explanation for how the bacterium responds that way to how the bacterium responds that way to how the bacterium responds that way to its environment. And for example, how its environment. And for example, how its environment. And for example, how bacteria when they're threatened by the bacteria when they're threatened by the bacteria when they're threatened by the environment. What they'll do is they'll environment. What they'll do is they'll environment. What they'll do is they'll congregate. Thousands or millions of congregate. Thousands or millions of congregate. Thousands or millions of these microbes will come together these microbes will come together these microbes will come together because they come together uh they can because they come together uh they can because they come together uh they can use their combined uh you know use their combined uh you know use their combined uh you know biochemistry to thwart off the threat.

biochemistry to thwart off the threat. biochemistry to thwart off the threat. And it's like this seems to be some And it's like this seems to be some And it's like this seems to be some awareness of the environment. How do we awareness of the environment. How do we awareness of the environment. How do we explain this? And this is something we explain this? And this is something we explain this? And this is something we only see in living systems. We don't see only see in living systems. We don't see only see in living systems. We don't see it in a dead bacterium. So it's kind of it in a dead bacterium. So it's kind of it in a dead bacterium. So it's kind of a new paradigm shift that's happening in a new paradigm shift that's happening in a new paradigm shift that's happening in the community of evolutionary biologists the community of evolutionary biologists the community of evolutionary biologists is that even at the bacterial level, is that even at the bacterial level, is that even at the bacterial level, there seems to be this awareness and there seems to be this awareness and there seems to be this awareness and capacity to response to benefits and capacity to response to benefits and capacity to response to benefits and threats in the immediate environment. threats in the immediate environment. threats in the immediate environment. And you know there's no way we can And you know there's no way we can And you know there's no way we can explain this from a materialistic explain this from a materialistic explain this from a materialistic perspective which is why we're now perspective which is why we're now perspective which is why we're now claiming there's a teological revolution claiming there's a teological revolution claiming there's a teological revolution going on in biology where they're going on in biology where they're going on in biology where they're admitting somewhere somehow there's a admitting somewhere somehow there's a admitting somewhere somehow there's a mind involved in all this and there mind involved in all this and there mind involved in all this and there there's some unique property that life there's some unique property that life there's some unique property that life has here. So the fact that we're seeing has here. So the fact that we're seeing has here. So the fact that we're seeing evolutionary biologist going from evolutionary biologist going from evolutionary biologist going from atheism to deism. I wish they would go atheism to deism. I wish they would go atheism to deism. I wish they would go to theism, but at least they're getting to theism, but at least they're getting to theism, but at least they're getting to dism there has to be some mind to dism there has to be some mind to dism there has to be some mind outside the universe that explains why outside the universe that explains why outside the universe that explains why all life forms have this property. Or to all life forms have this property. Or to all life forms have this property. Or to put it another way, again, I think you'd put it another way, again, I think you'd put it another way, again, I think you'd appreciate this as a chemist. You can appreciate this as a chemist. You can appreciate this as a chemist. You can take a bacterium and remove some life take a bacterium and remove some life take a bacterium and remove some life critical proteins so that the creature critical proteins so that the creature critical proteins so that the creature dies. Then you put the proteins back in, dies. Then you put the proteins back in, dies. Then you put the proteins back in, it doesn't do anything.

it doesn't do anything. it doesn't do anything. It's like, okay, you can damage this It's like, okay, you can damage this It's like, okay, you can damage this simple life form by removing some simple life form by removing some simple life form by removing some critical elements, it would die. You put critical elements, it would die. You put critical elements, it would die. You put them back in, they're still dead. So, them back in, they're still dead. So, them back in, they're still dead. So, it's like, what's going on here? it's like, what's going on here? it's like, what's going on here? >> Yeah, life is mysterious. And I've heard >> Yeah, life is mysterious. And I've heard >> Yeah, life is mysterious. And I've heard of the cellular consciousness, this of the cellular consciousness, this of the cellular consciousness, this >> responding to the environment, but but >> responding to the environment, but but >> responding to the environment, but but that's what you would say would be the that's what you would say would be the that's what you would say would be the best argument. Well, I always argue the best argument. Well, I always argue the best argument. Well, I always argue the space-time theorems are the real cru space-time theorems are the real cru space-time theorems are the real cru because that basically shows you this is because that basically shows you this is because that basically shows you this is true even on the scale of the entire true even on the scale of the entire true even on the scale of the entire universe. There is something beyond the universe. There is something beyond the universe. There is something beyond the universe that we can detect. And uh you universe that we can detect. And uh you universe that we can detect. And uh you know I've been debating cosmologists who know I've been debating cosmologists who know I've been debating cosmologists who say hey there's no beginning to the say hey there's no beginning to the say hey there's no beginning to the universe. But what they're doing is universe. But what they're doing is universe. But what they're doing is they're invoking extra dimensions of they're invoking extra dimensions of they're invoking extra dimensions of space and time. They're invoking extra space and time. They're invoking extra space and time. They're invoking extra laws of physics. I say well wait a laws of physics. I say well wait a laws of physics. I say well wait a minute. What I want to defend is what minute. What I want to defend is what minute. What I want to defend is what the Bible declares about the beginning the Bible declares about the beginning the Bible declares about the beginning of the universe. Hebrews 11:3, the of the universe. Hebrews 11:3, the of the universe. Hebrews 11:3, the universe that we can detect did not come universe that we can detect did not come universe that we can detect did not come from that which we can detect. And from that which we can detect. And from that which we can detect. And here's the irony. I had a debate with here's the irony. I had a debate with here's the irony. I had a debate with two atheist cosmologists. I said, 'All two atheist cosmologists. I said, 'All two atheist cosmologists. I said, 'All the models of the universe that you're the models of the universe that you're the models of the universe that you're bringing up to explain away the bringing up to explain away the bringing up to explain away the beginning are exactly the same models we beginning are exactly the same models we beginning are exactly the same models we came up with in 2005 at Cambridge came up with in 2005 at Cambridge came up with in 2005 at Cambridge University where we gathered together University where we gathered together University where we gathered together Christian physicists and astronomers and Christian physicists and astronomers and Christian physicists and astronomers and saying, "Well, saying, "Well, saying, "Well, what can we speculate beyond what we can what can we speculate beyond what we can what can we speculate beyond what we can detect as a way that God could bring the detect as a way that God could bring the detect as a way that God could bring the universe into existence?" The irony is universe into existence?" The irony is universe into existence?" The irony is the atheists are coming up with the

the atheists are coming up with the the atheists are coming up with the identical speculations. So I said, identical speculations. So I said, identical speculations. So I said, 'Guys, welcome. You're part of the 'Guys, welcome. You're part of the 'Guys, welcome. You're part of the Christian community of theologians Christian community of theologians Christian community of theologians that's debating what's going on about that's debating what's going on about that's debating what's going on about the universe. And really what's the universe. And really what's the universe. And really what's happening is the atheists and trying to happening is the atheists and trying to happening is the atheists and trying to get around these space-time theorems get around these space-time theorems get around these space-time theorems have to redefine the universe and they have to redefine the universe and they have to redefine the universe and they redefine the beginning. So when I do redefine the beginning. So when I do redefine the beginning. So when I do these debates, I say, "Well, wait a these debates, I say, "Well, wait a these debates, I say, "Well, wait a minute. Let's just stop the beginning of minute. Let's just stop the beginning of minute. Let's just stop the beginning of what?" And hey, how do you define the what?" And hey, how do you define the what?" And hey, how do you define the universe? and get them back into a universe? and get them back into a universe? and get them back into a biblical perspective where they're biblical perspective where they're biblical perspective where they're forced to admit, yes, it really does forced to admit, yes, it really does forced to admit, yes, it really does have a beginning. There really is have a beginning. There really is have a beginning. There really is something outside that created it. something outside that created it. something outside that created it. >> So, go back to the space-time theorems. >> So, go back to the space-time theorems. >> So, go back to the space-time theorems. >> Uh, I remember one atheist physicist I >> Uh, I remember one atheist physicist I >> Uh, I remember one atheist physicist I debated and he says, "Look, I won't debated and he says, "Look, I won't debated and he says, "Look, I won't become a believer until all the possible become a believer until all the possible become a believer until all the possible speculations for there not being a speculations for there not being a speculations for there not being a beginning of the universe are removed." beginning of the universe are removed." beginning of the universe are removed." And I said, "Well, wait a minute. that And I said, "Well, wait a minute. that And I said, "Well, wait a minute. that would require that we know everything would require that we know everything would require that we know everything about the universe. We'll never know about the universe. We'll never know about the universe. We'll never know everything about the universe. Uh Kurt everything about the universe. Uh Kurt everything about the universe. Uh Kurt Girdle in 1930, the philosopher proved Girdle in 1930, the philosopher proved Girdle in 1930, the philosopher proved that with his incompleteness theorem is that with his incompleteness theorem is that with his incompleteness theorem is that we'll always be ignorant about at that we'll always be ignorant about at that we'll always be ignorant about at least something about the universe. So least something about the universe. So least something about the universe. So if what you're demanding is absolute if what you're demanding is absolute if what you're demanding is absolute proof, how about if you respond to proof, how about if you respond to proof, how about if you respond to practical proof? We're learning more and practical proof? We're learning more and practical proof? We're learning more and more about the universe with every month more about the universe with every month more about the universe with every month that goes by. What does it do with your that goes by. What does it do with your that goes by. What does it do with your atheistic speculations? Well, I've atheistic speculations? Well, I've atheistic speculations? Well, I've documented in my books and papers that documented in my books and papers that documented in my books and papers that I've written that they've been I've written that they've been I've written that they've been consistently on the retreat. So, for

consistently on the retreat. So, for consistently on the retreat. So, for example, they said, well, something example, they said, well, something example, they said, well, something strange could be going on in the quantum strange could be going on in the quantum strange could be going on in the quantum gravity era and they were confident that gravity era and they were confident that gravity era and they were confident that we would never be able to come up with we would never be able to come up with we would never be able to come up with experiments or observations that would experiments or observations that would experiments or observations that would penetrate what was going on in the penetrate what was going on in the penetrate what was going on in the universe before it was 10 theus 43 universe before it was 10 theus 43 universe before it was 10 theus 43 seconds old. Well, a couple of years seconds old. Well, a couple of years seconds old. Well, a couple of years ago, astronomers were looking at ago, astronomers were looking at ago, astronomers were looking at gammaray sources where they said the gammaray sources where they said the gammaray sources where they said the energy we're observing is eight times energy we're observing is eight times energy we're observing is eight times greater than the plank energy, which greater than the plank energy, which greater than the plank energy, which means we've penetrated the quantum means we've penetrated the quantum means we've penetrated the quantum gravity era by a factor of eight times. gravity era by a factor of eight times. gravity era by a factor of eight times. And we do that, it's catastrophic for And we do that, it's catastrophic for And we do that, it's catastrophic for the atheistic speculations. So, what did the atheistic speculations. So, what did the atheistic speculations. So, what did the atheists do? They retreated a factor the atheists do? They retreated a factor the atheists do? They retreated a factor of eight. But the point is, they've of eight. But the point is, they've of eight. But the point is, they've always been on the retreat. And that always been on the retreat. And that always been on the retreat. And that should tell you, you got the wrong should tell you, you got the wrong should tell you, you got the wrong model. That's a principle in science. If model. That's a principle in science. If model. That's a principle in science. If all your research tells you that your all your research tells you that your all your research tells you that your model is wrong, the more you learn about model is wrong, the more you learn about model is wrong, the more you learn about it, you need to come up with a different it, you need to come up with a different it, you need to come up with a different model. And the only model is viable is a model. And the only model is viable is a model. And the only model is viable is a theistic model. theistic model. theistic model. >> And often I use the analogy, well, uh, I >> And often I use the analogy, well, uh, I >> And often I use the analogy, well, uh, I married my wife without absolute proof married my wife without absolute proof married my wife without absolute proof that she exists. But every year I've that she exists. But every year I've that she exists. But every year I've been married, the probability she been married, the probability she been married, the probability she exists, it really is a human being gets exists, it really is a human being gets exists, it really is a human being gets greater and greater. But even today, greater and greater. But even today, greater and greater. But even today, after 48 years of marriage, I still after 48 years of marriage, I still after 48 years of marriage, I still don't have absolute proof that she don't have absolute proof that she don't have absolute proof that she already exists. It's conceivable I've already exists. It's conceivable I've already exists. It's conceivable I've been fooled all these years by a been fooled all these years by a been fooled all these years by a three-dimensional hologram, but the three-dimensional hologram, but the three-dimensional hologram, but the probability of that being the case is probability of that being the case is probability of that being the case is extremely remote. So, and I personally

extremely remote. So, and I personally extremely remote. So, and I personally am able to testify. I got more evidence am able to testify. I got more evidence am able to testify. I got more evidence that God exists than I have that my wife that God exists than I have that my wife that God exists than I have that my wife exists. I'm convinced my wife exists. exists. I'm convinced my wife exists. exists. I'm convinced my wife exists. I'm even more convinced that God exists. I'm even more convinced that God exists. I'm even more convinced that God exists. Well, thank you, Hugh. Yeah, I remember Well, thank you, Hugh. Yeah, I remember Well, thank you, Hugh. Yeah, I remember 25 years ago reading your books and 25 years ago reading your books and 25 years ago reading your books and seeing these tables of your predictions seeing these tables of your predictions seeing these tables of your predictions that this is what we should find. This that this is what we should find. This that this is what we should find. This is what I mean, you you just always put is what I mean, you you just always put is what I mean, you you just always put it out there and and then over time it out there and and then over time it out there and and then over time these things are these things are seen. these things are these things are seen. these things are these things are seen. >> Yeah. The Bible has a predictable uh >> Yeah. The Bible has a predictable uh >> Yeah. The Bible has a predictable uh creation model and we're living at a creation model and we're living at a creation model and we're living at a time where science advancing so fast. We time where science advancing so fast. We time where science advancing so fast. We can see these predictions being can see these predictions being can see these predictions being fulfilled week by week, month by month. fulfilled week by week, month by month. fulfilled week by week, month by month. And I like to put those out in front of And I like to put those out in front of And I like to put those out in front of unbelievers saying, "Okay, what are your unbelievers saying, "Okay, what are your unbelievers saying, "Okay, what are your predictions? How well are they doing? predictions? How well are they doing? predictions? How well are they doing? Let's compare our predictions and see Let's compare our predictions and see Let's compare our predictions and see what happens." what happens." what happens." >> Well, thank you for answering my my >> Well, thank you for answering my my >> Well, thank you for answering my my questions particularly on this. I want questions particularly on this. I want questions particularly on this. I want to thank you for for bringing this to to thank you for for bringing this to to thank you for for bringing this to the four and as Christians how we how we the four and as Christians how we how we the four and as Christians how we how we think about this, how we deal with it. think about this, how we deal with it. think about this, how we deal with it. Thank you for for just always being a Thank you for for just always being a Thank you for for just always being a voice that we can go back to and the the voice that we can go back to and the the voice that we can go back to and the the you know I I hate to promote your book you know I I hate to promote your book you know I I hate to promote your book too much cuz it's it's going to be a too much cuz it's it's going to be a too much cuz it's it's going to be a year before it comes out or 10 months year before it comes out or 10 months year before it comes out or 10 months before it comes out. uh uh the the before it comes out. uh uh the the before it comes out. uh uh the the updated version, but but what's in the updated version, but but what's in the updated version, but but what's in the 2002 book uh Lights in the Sky and 2002 book uh Lights in the Sky and 2002 book uh Lights in the Sky and Little Green Men uh that that is still Little Green Men uh that that is still Little Green Men uh that that is still available and everything in there is you available and everything in there is you available and everything in there is you you wouldn't change a thing in it. But you wouldn't change a thing in it. But you wouldn't change a thing in it. But now this new book is going to expand it now this new book is going to expand it now this new book is going to expand it a lot and uh first talk about how

a lot and uh first talk about how a lot and uh first talk about how amazing life is, how hard it is to think amazing life is, how hard it is to think amazing life is, how hard it is to think of life being in some other place of life being in some other place of life being in some other place because of the finetuning that would be because of the finetuning that would be because of the finetuning that would be needed. There is one item uh it's in a needed. There is one item uh it's in a needed. There is one item uh it's in a peer-reviewed uh journal and the article peer-reviewed uh journal and the article peer-reviewed uh journal and the article is called are we humans alone in the is called are we humans alone in the is called are we humans alone in the cosmos and that's where I talk about the cosmos and that's where I talk about the cosmos and that's where I talk about the 23 habitable zones that we must be in 23 habitable zones that we must be in 23 habitable zones that we must be in and why from an astronomical perspective and why from an astronomical perspective and why from an astronomical perspective we're really alone. So and that's an we're really alone. So and that's an we're really alone. So and that's an open access journal article. If you put open access journal article. If you put open access journal article. If you put in are we humans alone in the cosmos, in are we humans alone in the cosmos, in are we humans alone in the cosmos, it'll pop right up and that'll give you it'll pop right up and that'll give you it'll pop right up and that'll give you the very latest science on the subject the very latest science on the subject the very latest science on the subject that we've been talking about. I'll also that we've been talking about. I'll also that we've been talking about. I'll also include a discussion in there on UAPs. include a discussion in there on UAPs. include a discussion in there on UAPs. So that's that's publicly available So that's that's publicly available So that's that's publicly available right now. right now. right now. >> We've got that. So we're going to put a >> We've got that. So we're going to put a >> We've got that. So we're going to put a link in the description box for this. If link in the description box for this. If link in the description box for this. If if we can't find it, we'll get with your if we can't find it, we'll get with your if we can't find it, we'll get with your staff and we'll get that link and we'll staff and we'll get that link and we'll staff and we'll get that link and we'll put it in the description box below. Uh put it in the description box below. Uh put it in the description box below. Uh uh because that that'd be great. PE uh because that that'd be great. PE uh because that that'd be great. PE people would probably want to read more people would probably want to read more people would probably want to read more about this. Hugh, you have been just for about this. Hugh, you have been just for about this. Hugh, you have been just for for decades and decades, you you've been for decades and decades, you you've been for decades and decades, you you've been a voice of of uh of reason and and uh a voice of of uh of reason and and uh a voice of of uh of reason and and uh bringing clarity to things. So, I deeply bringing clarity to things. So, I deeply bringing clarity to things. So, I deeply appreciate it. God bless you, my friend, appreciate it. God bless you, my friend, appreciate it. God bless you, my friend, and blessings to your family.

and blessings to your family. and blessings to your family. >> Thank you very much. It's always been a >> Thank you very much. It's always been a >> Thank you very much. It's always been a pleasure to partner with you. pleasure to partner with you. pleasure to partner with you. >> Thank you for joining me today. If you >> Thank you for joining me today. If you >> Thank you for joining me today. If you could give us a like, share, or podcast could give us a like, share, or podcast could give us a like, share, or podcast review, we would [music] appreciate it. review, we would [music] appreciate it. review, we would [music] appreciate it. If you have any questions, you could If you have any questions, you could If you have any questions, you could send them to [email protected] send them to [email protected] send them to [email protected] [music] [music] [music] and we'll try to answer some of those and we'll try to answer some of those and we'll try to answer some of those questions in an upcoming video. And if questions in an upcoming video. And if questions in an upcoming video. And if you do not believe in the physical you do not believe in the physical you do not believe in the physical resurrection of Jesus [music] Christ and resurrection of Jesus [music] Christ and resurrection of Jesus [music] Christ and you want to hear about why I believe, you want to hear about why I believe, you want to hear about why I believe, send me an email to tour drsour.org send me an email to tour drsour.org send me an email to tour drsour.org [music] [music] [music] or and we'll get together by Zoom and or and we'll get together by Zoom and or and we'll get together by Zoom and I'll share with you why I embrace I'll share with you why I embrace I'll share with you why I embrace [music] [music] [music] the resurrection of Jesus