Actor EXPOSES the LIE of Hookup Culture on ‘Call Her Daddy Podcast’ (Penn Badgley)

You've probably heard of the Netflix You've probably heard of the Netflix show called you on Netflix. And in this show called you on Netflix. And in this show called you on Netflix. And in this episode, the celebrity of that show went episode, the celebrity of that show went episode, the celebrity of that show went on a podcast called Call Her Daddy on a podcast called Call Her Daddy on a podcast called Call Her Daddy podcast, which I'd say is probably one podcast, which I'd say is probably one podcast, which I'd say is probably one of the worst podcast in 2026. of the worst podcast in 2026. of the worst podcast in 2026. And he basically calls out the nonsense And he basically calls out the nonsense And he basically calls out the nonsense that has been peddled online, especially that has been peddled online, especially that has been peddled online, especially from this podcast. I hope you can enjoy. from this podcast. I hope you can enjoy. from this podcast. I hope you can enjoy. >> Casual dating. >> Casual dating. >> Casual dating. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> What do you feel about that? For people. >> What do you feel about that? For people. >> What do you feel about that? For people. >> Here's a platform upon which to skewer >> Here's a platform upon which to skewer >> Here's a platform upon which to skewer yourself. yourself. yourself. >> No, just go. >> No, just go. >> No, just go. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I love that mockery, though. >> I love that mockery, though. >> I love that mockery, though. I don't want to come across as prudish I don't want to come across as prudish I don't want to come across as prudish or like stuff like that, but it I love I or like stuff like that, but it I love I or like stuff like that, but it I love I love just breaking the glass of like love just breaking the glass of like love just breaking the glass of like he's on a podcast show and he's acting he's on a podcast show and he's acting he's on a podcast show and he's acting like he's kind of mocking the fact that like he's kind of mocking the fact that like he's kind of mocking the fact that people should even listen to him in the people should even listen to him in the people should even listen to him in the first place, which I I think does does first place, which I I think does does first place, which I I think does does show good humility right with me off. show good humility right with me off. show good humility right with me off. But anyway, we'll see what he says. But anyway, we'll see what he says. But anyway, we'll see what he says. >> Is it ever casual? Show me somebody Show me somebody who really who really who really really, truly really, truly really, truly is casual about it.

I'm I'll wait. I'm I'll wait. I'll wait. I'll wait. I'll wait. Not that they act casual about it. Not that they act casual about it. Not that they act casual about it. That they feel casual about it. That they feel casual about it. That they feel casual about it. I'll wait. I'll wait. I'll wait. Please, I would like to see it in the Please, I would like to see it in the Please, I would like to see it in the comments. comments. comments. >> I think that some women would ask back >> I think that some women would ask back >> I think that some women would ask back to you, Penn. to you, Penn. to you, Penn. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> I wish he didn't feel like it was >> I wish he didn't feel like it was >> I wish he didn't feel like it was casual. casual. casual. >> I'm telling you that he doesn't >> I'm telling you that he doesn't >> I'm telling you that he doesn't understand the ways in which understand the ways in which understand the ways in which it is not casual for him, either. it is not casual for him, either. it is not casual for him, either. >> Cuz he may just actually be like, "Oh, I >> Cuz he may just actually be like, "Oh, I >> Cuz he may just actually be like, "Oh, I don't like you." don't like you." don't like you." What about that? What about that? What about that? >> That whole thing, yeah, that's sorry. >> That whole thing, yeah, that's sorry. >> That whole thing, yeah, that's sorry. So, I you know, So, I you know, So, I you know, I am sorry to women I am sorry to women I am sorry to women on that one. on that one. on that one. >> Okay, so how do you feel about casual >> Okay, so how do you feel about casual >> Okay, so how do you feel about casual sex? Not now, obviously. I know sex? Not now, obviously. I know sex? Not now, obviously. I know >> Again, again, show me anyone who's able >> Again, again, show me anyone who's able >> Again, again, show me anyone who's able to have it. Truly. to have it. Truly. to have it. Truly. >> Oh my goodness, what what an incredible >> Oh my goodness, what what an incredible >> Oh my goodness, what what an incredible thing. So, he's on a podcast called Call thing. So, he's on a podcast called Call thing. So, he's on a podcast called Call Her Daddy, and this to say this podcast Her Daddy, and this to say this podcast Her Daddy, and this to say this podcast gives bad advice, I think is an gives bad advice, I think is an gives bad advice, I think is an understatement. But here he is basically understatement. But here he is basically understatement. But here he is basically saying saying saying you know, show me somebody who actually you know, show me somebody who actually you know, show me somebody who actually is experienced dating who's exact is experienced dating who's exact is experienced dating who's exact actually experiencing the most intimate actually experiencing the most intimate actually experiencing the most intimate thing possible and say it's casual. And thing possible and say it's casual. And thing possible and say it's casual. And the point he's making there is to the point he's making there is to the point he's making there is to experience love, to experience actually experience love, to experience actually experience love, to experience actually giving yourself to someone is giving yourself to someone is giving yourself to someone is vulnerability. So if that's casual, it's vulnerability. So if that's casual, it's vulnerability. So if that's casual, it's a paradox within itself. And this goes a paradox within itself. And this goes a paradox within itself. And this goes right to the heart of the pernicious right to the heart of the pernicious right to the heart of the pernicious lies that society tells us about maybe lies that society tells us about maybe lies that society tells us about maybe that be just guarding yourself, not that be just guarding yourself, not that be just guarding yourself, not letting go. Maybe, you know, you always letting go. Maybe, you know, you always letting go. Maybe, you know, you always have to have a backup. May that be you have to have a backup. May that be you have to have a backup. May that be you get married, you need a pre-nup if um get married, you need a pre-nup if um get married, you need a pre-nup if um you know, like protect yourself. Don't you know, like protect yourself. Don't you know, like protect yourself. Don't don't be dependent on them, you know,

don't be dependent on them, you know, don't be dependent on them, you know, this this corrosive this this corrosive this this corrosive pernicious lie that society screams at pernicious lie that society screams at pernicious lie that society screams at us that the ideal and archetype of a us that the ideal and archetype of a us that the ideal and archetype of a person is to be completely independent person is to be completely independent person is to be completely independent and doesn't need anyone. You know, which and doesn't need anyone. You know, which and doesn't need anyone. You know, which this podcast embodies. It's called this podcast embodies. It's called this podcast embodies. It's called literally Call Her Daddy podcast. literally Call Her Daddy podcast. literally Call Her Daddy podcast. What a beautiful legend for saying What a beautiful legend for saying What a beautiful legend for saying something like this. And this has come something like this. And this has come something like this. And this has come from someone who's obviously I'm sure from someone who's obviously I'm sure from someone who's obviously I'm sure there's loads of women that completely there's loads of women that completely there's loads of women that completely infatuated with him. He's an attractive infatuated with him. He's an attractive infatuated with him. He's an attractive bloke. And also, you know, he's a bloke. And also, you know, he's a bloke. And also, you know, he's a massive movie star. Like I'm sure massive movie star. Like I'm sure massive movie star. Like I'm sure there's there's there's like millions of women that love this like millions of women that love this like millions of women that love this bloke. And here he is being just a bloke. And here he is being just a bloke. And here he is being just a hammering ball to the the modern culture hammering ball to the the modern culture hammering ball to the the modern culture and the modern nonsense around intimacy, and the modern nonsense around intimacy, and the modern nonsense around intimacy, relationships. relationships. relationships. And I just absolutely love it because And I just absolutely love it because And I just absolutely love it because when he says casual, you you also got to when he says casual, you you also got to when he says casual, you you also got to look at the point as people speak about look at the point as people speak about look at the point as people speak about casual sex. Oh yeah, casual sex. casual sex. Oh yeah, casual sex. casual sex. Oh yeah, casual sex. If it is casual sex, it must be dreadful If it is casual sex, it must be dreadful If it is casual sex, it must be dreadful sex. Like the notion that basically sex. Like the notion that basically sex. Like the notion that basically somebody having like uh you know, a somebody having like uh you know, a somebody having like uh you know, a 10-minute or 1-hour bit of intimacy 10-minute or 1-hour bit of intimacy 10-minute or 1-hour bit of intimacy being actually incredible and then that being actually incredible and then that being actually incredible and then that being it or whatever and then maybe being it or whatever and then maybe being it or whatever and then maybe meeting in a few weeks with no strings meeting in a few weeks with no strings meeting in a few weeks with no strings attached. The notion that that attached. The notion that that attached. The notion that that could be could be could be like amazing and better than some like amazing and better than some like amazing and better than some you know, animalistic love where you you know, animalistic love where you you know, animalistic love where you know that you're never going to leave know that you're never going to leave know that you're never going to leave the person you're hugging for hours the person you're hugging for hours the person you're hugging for hours after naked, you know, the notion that after naked, you know, the notion that after naked, you know, the notion that like that one hour or something is is is like that one hour or something is is is like that one hour or something is is is more fulfilling and is somehow better is more fulfilling and is somehow better is more fulfilling and is somehow better is is bonkers. And also, if that is casual,

is bonkers. And also, if that is casual, is bonkers. And also, if that is casual, then by nature it's not better, is it? then by nature it's not better, is it? then by nature it's not better, is it? Because people say casual sex or stuff Because people say casual sex or stuff Because people say casual sex or stuff like that, but then by nature, if it's like that, but then by nature, if it's like that, but then by nature, if it's casual, then it it shouldn't be casual casual, then it it shouldn't be casual casual, then it it shouldn't be casual because it must have been dreadful then. because it must have been dreadful then. because it must have been dreadful then. Not dreadful cuz it could have been Not dreadful cuz it could have been Not dreadful cuz it could have been enjoyable in the moment, but if it was enjoyable in the moment, but if it was enjoyable in the moment, but if it was casual sex, then surely it contradicts casual sex, then surely it contradicts casual sex, then surely it contradicts the amazingness of it. Because if it was the amazingness of it. Because if it was the amazingness of it. Because if it was so amazing, it would pierce your heart so amazing, it would pierce your heart so amazing, it would pierce your heart to the point where you you feel attached to the point where you you feel attached to the point where you you feel attached to the person or you feel like you know, to the person or you feel like you know, to the person or you feel like you know, you never want to be separated, you you never want to be separated, you you never want to be separated, you know. The notion that like that's the know. The notion that like that's the know. The notion that like that's the archetype, you know, just go out, you archetype, you know, just go out, you archetype, you know, just go out, you know, smash and dash, happy days, mate, know, smash and dash, happy days, mate, know, smash and dash, happy days, mate, and like yeah, you'll be fulfilled and like yeah, you'll be fulfilled and like yeah, you'll be fulfilled there. Well, I'll tell you something, there. Well, I'll tell you something, there. Well, I'll tell you something, ladies and gentlemen, the amount of ladies and gentlemen, the amount of ladies and gentlemen, the amount of people like I don't know how many people people like I don't know how many people people like I don't know how many people who and I don't want to come across as who and I don't want to come across as who and I don't want to come across as prudish cuz I have done things I regret prudish cuz I have done things I regret prudish cuz I have done things I regret massively and I'm not saying that I am massively and I'm not saying that I am massively and I'm not saying that I am holier than thou remotely because I am a holier than thou remotely because I am a holier than thou remotely because I am a sinner like everyone and there's loads sinner like everyone and there's loads sinner like everyone and there's loads of things that if if you watching this of things that if if you watching this of things that if if you watching this video show me do, I'm sure you'd be video show me do, I'm sure you'd be video show me do, I'm sure you'd be like, mate, you are a hypocrite, you are like, mate, you are a hypocrite, you are like, mate, you are a hypocrite, you are this. So, I'm not I'm not for one second this. So, I'm not I'm not for one second this. So, I'm not I'm not for one second saying that I'm better than her in this saying that I'm better than her in this saying that I'm better than her in this podcast or anything like that, right?

podcast or anything like that, right? podcast or anything like that, right? But I'll tell you something, I know But I'll tell you something, I know But I'll tell you something, I know loads of men, I know loads of men who loads of men, I know loads of men who loads of men, I know loads of men who who who have been around the block, you who who have been around the block, you who who have been around the block, you know, who have slept with loads of know, who have slept with loads of know, who have slept with loads of people and all this people and all this people and all this and people feel and people feel and people feel you know, numb inside, you know, I've you know, numb inside, you know, I've you know, numb inside, you know, I've spoke to men who say stuff like yeah, if spoke to men who say stuff like yeah, if spoke to men who say stuff like yeah, if they speak to a woman, they they just they speak to a woman, they they just they speak to a woman, they they just feel nothing. They they don't know how feel nothing. They they don't know how feel nothing. They they don't know how to like almost to like almost to like almost like they just find them annoying and like they just find them annoying and like they just find them annoying and then they'll just, you know, discard then they'll just, you know, discard then they'll just, you know, discard them for someone else and have sex them for someone else and have sex them for someone else and have sex forever. forever. forever. And it does not because if if the it's And it does not because if if the it's And it does not because if if the it's like a flower, there's something like a flower, there's something like a flower, there's something beautiful, there's something absolutely beautiful, there's something absolutely beautiful, there's something absolutely incredible. And if you just incredible. And if you just incredible. And if you just sh- you know, drown it, you're not going sh- you know, drown it, you're not going sh- you know, drown it, you're not going to feel the incredibleness anymore. to feel the incredibleness anymore. to feel the incredibleness anymore. You're not. And I think he has What he's You're not. And I think he has What he's You're not. And I think he has What he's saying here, I just love cuz there's so saying here, I just love cuz there's so saying here, I just love cuz there's so much truth in it. much truth in it. much truth in it. >> And I'm saying I'm not just saying who >> And I'm saying I'm not just saying who >> And I'm saying I'm not just saying who does it. does it. does it. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Plenty of people do it. >> Plenty of people do it. >> Plenty of people do it. Show me someone who's actually What Show me someone who's actually What Show me someone who's actually What about is casual? about is casual? about is casual? What about is casual? What about is casual? What about is casual? >> I love that. What about is casual? This >> I love that. What about is casual? This >> I love that. What about is casual? This is Bearing in mind, right? I I've got to is Bearing in mind, right? I I've got to is Bearing in mind, right? I I've got to show this clip. So, this is from her, show this clip. So, this is from her, show this clip. So, this is from her, the the co-host of it or the host, the the co-host of it or the host, the the co-host of it or the host, whatever. Um so, so give this a watch, whatever. Um so, so give this a watch, whatever. Um so, so give this a watch, right?

right? right? >> Sleep with them the first night? Like, >> Sleep with them the first night? Like, >> Sleep with them the first night? Like, you have to go based on what feels good you have to go based on what feels good you have to go based on what feels good to your body. If you have some to your body. If you have some to your body. If you have some friends that are prudes that are like, friends that are prudes that are like, friends that are prudes that are like, "You should never kiss on the first "You should never kiss on the first "You should never kiss on the first date." Maybe for you, Cassandra, but I'm date." Maybe for you, Cassandra, but I'm date." Maybe for you, Cassandra, but I'm about to let them in my back door. about to let them in my back door. about to let them in my back door. >> So, bearing in mind, that is from >> So, bearing in mind, that is from >> So, bearing in mind, that is from somebody who is giving dating advice. somebody who is giving dating advice. somebody who is giving dating advice. This is the number one podcast for This is the number one podcast for This is the number one podcast for females. females. females. And that That's the advice. Dating And that That's the advice. Dating And that That's the advice. Dating advice. advice. advice. I I don't want to seem prudish, right? I I don't want to seem prudish, right? I I don't want to seem prudish, right? But that is not a um But that is not a um But that is not a um it's not wholesome message. That's not it's not wholesome message. That's not it's not wholesome message. That's not something you want your daughter to to something you want your daughter to to something you want your daughter to to grow up listening to. And don't get me grow up listening to. And don't get me grow up listening to. And don't get me wrong, there is so much nonsense advice wrong, there is so much nonsense advice wrong, there is so much nonsense advice for men as well. Look at Andrew Tate. for men as well. Look at Andrew Tate. for men as well. Look at Andrew Tate. Look at, you know, the whole red pi- red Look at, you know, the whole red pi- red Look at, you know, the whole red pi- red pill nonsense sphere. pill nonsense sphere. pill nonsense sphere. But, you know, that that's the dating But, you know, that that's the dating But, you know, that that's the dating advice. advice. advice. Like, it's prudish to want to reserve Like, it's prudish to want to reserve Like, it's prudish to want to reserve yourself for a stranger. yourself for a stranger. yourself for a stranger. That's That's prudish. That's That's prudish. That's That's prudish. Blimey. I mean, just imagine like our Blimey. I mean, just imagine like our Blimey. I mean, just imagine like our grandparents grandparents grandparents watching that clip.

watching that clip. watching that clip. They would be like, "What has happened? They would be like, "What has happened? They would be like, "What has happened? What is going on? What is going on?" What is going on? What is going on?" What is going on? What is going on?" Again, I'll wait. Again, I'll wait. Again, I'll wait. >> I think it's a great question to pose to >> I think it's a great question to pose to >> I think it's a great question to pose to the girls listening. the girls listening. the girls listening. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> People obviously like always say >> People obviously like always say >> People obviously like always say relationships are hard. They're hard relationships are hard. They're hard relationships are hard. They're hard work. They're a lot of work. work. They're a lot of work. work. They're a lot of work. But what does that tangibly look like to But what does that tangibly look like to But what does that tangibly look like to you? you? you? To work on a relationship. To work on a relationship. To work on a relationship. >> I feel like you have to always be >> I feel like you have to always be >> I feel like you have to always be learning new learning new learning new levels of levels of levels of listening. listening. listening. Because Because Because when you get past the you know, it's when you get past the you know, it's when you get past the you know, it's anywhere from the 6-month to 2-year mark anywhere from the 6-month to 2-year mark anywhere from the 6-month to 2-year mark when the the juices so to speak the when the the juices so to speak the when the the juices so to speak the chemicals have like sort of run their chemicals have like sort of run their chemicals have like sort of run their course. course. course. You may have had something that could be You may have had something that could be You may have had something that could be like wildly intoxicating. In some cases like wildly intoxicating. In some cases like wildly intoxicating. In some cases that's true. In some cases it may be that's true. In some cases it may be that's true. In some cases it may be less or somewhere in between, but less or somewhere in between, but less or somewhere in between, but you know, studies show you know, studies show you know, studies show about 6 to 6 to 24 months that runs its about 6 to 6 to 24 months that runs its about 6 to 6 to 24 months that runs its course. Then you have to course. Then you have to course. Then you have to enter into a different kind of enter into a different kind of enter into a different kind of relationship. One that we don't see a relationship. One that we don't see a relationship. One that we don't see a lot. You know, we don't see it modeled a lot. You know, we don't see it modeled a lot. You know, we don't see it modeled a lot. Hardly ever.

lot. Hardly ever. lot. Hardly ever. Um you know, for reasons that have to do Um you know, for reasons that have to do Um you know, for reasons that have to do more with like what it takes to tell a more with like what it takes to tell a more with like what it takes to tell a good story than than reality, you know, good story than than reality, you know, good story than than reality, you know, in movies and TV and books and stuff. in movies and TV and books and stuff. in movies and TV and books and stuff. So then you have to think of to yourself So then you have to think of to yourself So then you have to think of to yourself like well, what what is a relationship like well, what what is a relationship like well, what what is a relationship for? Not just like what am I in this for? Not just like what am I in this for? Not just like what am I in this for? What is a relationship for? for? What is a relationship for? for? What is a relationship for? Um Um Um that's also a question I pose. that's also a question I pose. that's also a question I pose. What is a relationship for? What is a relationship for? What is a relationship for? Not just what is it doing for you? What Not just what is it doing for you? What Not just what is it doing for you? What is it What is What are relationships is it What is What are relationships is it What is What are relationships for, you know? for, you know? for, you know? >> What a What an amazing bit of advice >> What a What an amazing bit of advice >> What a What an amazing bit of advice there. Just I mean, it's nothing too there. Just I mean, it's nothing too there. Just I mean, it's nothing too profound, but the reason it's profound profound, but the reason it's profound profound, but the reason it's profound is because the podcast he's on. He's on is because the podcast he's on. He's on is because the podcast he's on. He's on a podcast that bangs on about it's what a podcast that bangs on about it's what a podcast that bangs on about it's what I want. It's me. It's me. It's me. I want. It's me. It's me. It's me. I want. It's me. It's me. It's me. Independent is literally called Call Her Independent is literally called Call Her Independent is literally called Call Her Daddy podcast. And here he is saying Daddy podcast. And here he is saying Daddy podcast. And here he is saying it's not about me. it's not about me. it's not about me. What is the point of a relationship? Ask What is the point of a relationship? Ask What is the point of a relationship? Ask Ask him the big questions. And I I'm Ask him the big questions. And I I'm Ask him the big questions. And I I'm sure this penetrate a lot of people sure this penetrate a lot of people sure this penetrate a lot of people watching it. Um watching it. Um watching it. Um I wrote ironic with penis, but like, you I wrote ironic with penis, but like, you I wrote ironic with penis, but like, you know, I'm I'm sure that did spark a bit know, I'm I'm sure that did spark a bit know, I'm I'm sure that did spark a bit of like, of like, of like, "All right. That's That's a good point."

"All right. That's That's a good point." "All right. That's That's a good point." So, massive respect to this boy. So, massive respect to this boy. So, massive respect to this boy. >> Um >> Um >> Um and at some point I think you just have and at some point I think you just have and at some point I think you just have to realize that like you you're to realize that like you you're to realize that like you you're developing your own narratives and developing your own narratives and developing your own narratives and biases that have to be kind of biases that have to be kind of biases that have to be kind of constantly re- constantly re- constantly re- shaped. Reach You know, you have to shaped. Reach You know, you have to shaped. Reach You know, you have to check in with them. check in with them. check in with them. And so, just means it's just another And so, just means it's just another And so, just means it's just another level of listening. You You know, you level of listening. You You know, you level of listening. You You know, you And then once you get into parenting, And then once you get into parenting, And then once you get into parenting, it's it's it's it's it's it's it just adds like a level of complexity it just adds like a level of complexity it just adds like a level of complexity that's that's really beautiful and and that's that's really beautiful and and that's that's really beautiful and and rewarding. rewarding. rewarding. So, So, So, you know, when you're when you're you know, when you're when you're you know, when you're when you're parenting actually, sometimes it can be parenting actually, sometimes it can be parenting actually, sometimes it can be really practical stuff. Like we have to really practical stuff. Like we have to really practical stuff. Like we have to schedule time for schedule time for schedule time for any kind of intimacy we want to have. any kind of intimacy we want to have. any kind of intimacy we want to have. Like if we want to go out, that needs to Like if we want to go out, that needs to Like if we want to go out, that needs to be in that calendar. And you have to be in that calendar. And you have to be in that calendar. And you have to find child care. You have to It's all find child care. You have to It's all find child care. You have to It's all this stuff. It's like it's It's very this stuff. It's like it's It's very this stuff. It's like it's It's very real. Um and that can actually be a real. Um and that can actually be a real. Um and that can actually be a surprising amount of work. surprising amount of work. surprising amount of work. >> Like cuz I was going to ask, I know >> Like cuz I was going to ask, I know >> Like cuz I was going to ask, I know obviously your wife has a child from a obviously your wife has a child from a obviously your wife has a child from a previous relationship. And when you previous relationship. And when you previous relationship. And when you were starting to date, that takes were starting to date, that takes were starting to date, that takes another level of commitment and another level of commitment and another level of commitment and stability. And like, how did you know stability. And like, how did you know stability. And like, how did you know that was something that you were ready that was something that you were ready that was something that you were ready for?

for? for? >> Well, I didn't. And I mean, I think >> Well, I didn't. And I mean, I think >> Well, I didn't. And I mean, I think So, like the when we first met, it was So, like the when we first met, it was So, like the when we first met, it was kind of it was immediate. And before we had time to think, before we had time to think, I think we just we wanted to be together I think we just we wanted to be together I think we just we wanted to be together in in the deepest way. in in the deepest way. in in the deepest way. And I wanted to be there for her son. And I wanted to be there for her son. And I wanted to be there for her son. Um in whatever way was best. His father's in whatever way was best. His father's always been in his life. always been in his life. always been in his life. Um But then the cultural But then the cultural dating laws, which I never abided by, dating laws, which I never abided by, dating laws, which I never abided by, never understood, but you were never understood, but you were never understood, but you were pressuring me. I was like, "I need to pressuring me. I was like, "I need to pressuring me. I was like, "I need to sow my wild oats. What am I doing with sow my wild oats. What am I doing with sow my wild oats. What am I doing with this woman with a child? Um this woman with a child? Um this woman with a child? Um But, you know, I was 28, I think, maybe But, you know, I was 28, I think, maybe But, you know, I was 28, I think, maybe 27. And I really did think is it right for me, you know, to be to is it right for me, you know, to be to be getting into a relationship with a be getting into a relationship with a be getting into a relationship with a woman who has a child? Like that it all woman who has a child? Like that it all woman who has a child? Like that it all So, the stakes were always significant So, the stakes were always significant So, the stakes were always significant there. We both felt that. And so, we there. We both felt that. And so, we there. We both felt that. And so, we both actually after an immediate both actually after an immediate both actually after an immediate intense connection and like not thinking intense connection and like not thinking intense connection and like not thinking about it, we then sort of like you know, about it, we then sort of like you know, about it, we then sort of like you know, we need to think about this more.

we need to think about this more. we need to think about this more. And what And what And what I only felt that I was ready once I felt I only felt that I was ready once I felt I only felt that I was ready once I felt confident to like leave all that all confident to like leave all that all confident to like leave all that all these notions about what it is to be a these notions about what it is to be a these notions about what it is to be a man, what it is to date, what I needed man, what it is to date, what I needed man, what it is to date, what I needed to do, who I needed to be sexually. Once to do, who I needed to be sexually. Once to do, who I needed to be sexually. Once I was able to start really leaving that I was able to start really leaving that I was able to start really leaving that behind. behind. behind. >> That's beautiful. I also love like just >> That's beautiful. I also love like just >> That's beautiful. I also love like just like hearing the way that you talk about like hearing the way that you talk about like hearing the way that you talk about your relationship. your relationship. your relationship. It's so nice to hear It's so nice to hear It's so nice to hear again, almost back to the way that your again, almost back to the way that your again, almost back to the way that your parenting, about like listening and parenting, about like listening and parenting, about like listening and apologizing and doing things that are apologizing and doing things that are apologizing and doing things that are like not typically what you would think like not typically what you would think like not typically what you would think like a man is leading with. I think it's like a man is leading with. I think it's like a man is leading with. I think it's really refreshing to hear cuz I know really refreshing to hear cuz I know really refreshing to hear cuz I know even you've talked about with your wife even you've talked about with your wife even you've talked about with your wife that you guys like early on in your that you guys like early on in your that you guys like early on in your relationship took breaks. And I think relationship took breaks. And I think relationship took breaks. And I think like so much of what you've shared is like so much of what you've shared is like so much of what you've shared is quite helpful to people because I know quite helpful to people because I know quite helpful to people because I know there's people listening who are trying there's people listening who are trying there's people listening who are trying to figure it out. And I think people to figure it out. And I think people to figure it out. And I think people obviously look up to you. So, when obviously look up to you. So, when obviously look up to you. So, when you're more open obviously with what you're more open obviously with what you're more open obviously with what you're comfortable, I think it's nice to you're comfortable, I think it's nice to you're comfortable, I think it's nice to hear when you are like willing to share hear when you are like willing to share hear when you are like willing to share that kind of detail about your that kind of detail about your that kind of detail about your relationship. Cuz I know that there's relationship. Cuz I know that there's relationship. Cuz I know that there's people like, "Holy can I be a good people like, "Holy can I be a good people like, "Holy can I be a good mother father to another child?" You mother father to another child?" You mother father to another child?" You know what I mean?

know what I mean? know what I mean? >> Yeah, it's it's um >> Yeah, it's it's um >> Yeah, it's it's um There's a spiritual component to this, There's a spiritual component to this, There's a spiritual component to this, which is really the thing that is that allowed it really the thing that is that allowed it to happen. So, she and I, you know, we to happen. So, she and I, you know, we to happen. So, she and I, you know, we happened to sort of become sober around happened to sort of become sober around happened to sort of become sober around the same time. We the same time. We the same time. We were picking up meditation and and were picking up meditation and and were picking up meditation and and prayer and really trying to live prayer and really trying to live prayer and really trying to live with a different sort of framework, you with a different sort of framework, you with a different sort of framework, you know? know? know? Independent of one another, but this was Independent of one another, but this was Independent of one another, but this was happening kind of at the same time. And happening kind of at the same time. And happening kind of at the same time. And I think that was what even created like I think that was what even created like I think that was what even created like the opportunity or the the conditions the opportunity or the the conditions the opportunity or the the conditions for us to be like for us to be like for us to be like we're dealing with a lot of we're dealing with a lot of we're dealing with a lot of ways of thinking that are not our own. Some of those ways of thinking Some of those ways of thinking are putting a lot of pressure on us are putting a lot of pressure on us are putting a lot of pressure on us to conform in a way that to conform in a way that to conform in a way that we've seen before. we've seen before. we've seen before. To either be together in a way that To either be together in a way that To either be together in a way that we've seen or to not be together in a we've seen or to not be together in a we've seen or to not be together in a way that we've seen. And so and way that we've seen. And so and way that we've seen. And so and I think I think like maybe the world is I think I think like maybe the world is I think I think like maybe the world is ready for a lot of new relationships.

ready for a lot of new relationships. ready for a lot of new relationships. Like where people are discovering Like where people are discovering Like where people are discovering something. And I think in some way like something. And I think in some way like something. And I think in some way like we did we discovered something we did we discovered something we did we discovered something uh uh uh Like if I if I had advice for young Like if I if I had advice for young Like if I if I had advice for young people in people in people in it risks being simplistic. You could it risks being simplistic. You could it risks being simplistic. You could take it a lot of ways and I guess it take it a lot of ways and I guess it take it a lot of ways and I guess it could be misused, but like I think young could be misused, but like I think young could be misused, but like I think young people now we we we waste a lot of time people now we we we waste a lot of time people now we we we waste a lot of time worrying about relationships rather than worrying about relationships rather than worrying about relationships rather than like like like being in them and trying. We we waste a being in them and trying. We we waste a being in them and trying. We we waste a lot of time in fear and hesitation lot of time in fear and hesitation lot of time in fear and hesitation and trying to imagine what the other and trying to imagine what the other and trying to imagine what the other person's thinking. Like when is that person's thinking. Like when is that person's thinking. Like when is that ever going to happen? You don't know. ever going to happen? You don't know. ever going to happen? You don't know. You've never known. Stop trying to act You've never known. Stop trying to act You've never known. Stop trying to act like you've ever known. Never once have you read Never once have you read that person's mind. that person's mind. that person's mind. It's not a start now, you know? I mean It's not a start now, you know? I mean It's not a start now, you know? I mean like I don't know. Just Just the way like I don't know. Just Just the way like I don't know. Just Just the way that relationships function at least that relationships function at least that relationships function at least from a pop culture perspective, I think from a pop culture perspective, I think from a pop culture perspective, I think it's like so crazy dysfunctional. it's like so crazy dysfunctional. it's like so crazy dysfunctional. >> It's definitely become something that I >> It's definitely become something that I >> It's definitely become something that I think people almost like aren't even think people almost like aren't even think people almost like aren't even noticing. And it's like these games and noticing. And it's like these games and noticing. And it's like these games and it's like we we don't have to do any of it's like we we don't have to do any of it's like we we don't have to do any of that. And I definitely felt like I did that. And I definitely felt like I did that. And I definitely felt like I did it. I was a part of the cycle. I was it. I was a part of the cycle. I was it. I was a part of the cycle. I was like in it heavy. That's how I literally like in it heavy. That's how I literally like in it heavy. That's how I literally started this show. It's just like started this show. It's just like started this show. It's just like >> say.

>> say. >> say. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Well, the name. Yeah, I was like, oh, >> Well, the name. Yeah, I was like, oh, >> Well, the name. Yeah, I was like, oh, we're going to flip it on its head and we're going to flip it on its head and we're going to flip it on its head and we're going to like do what men do to we're going to like do what men do to we're going to like do what men do to us. And then eventually, when I met my us. And then eventually, when I met my us. And then eventually, when I met my >> make them happy either. >> make them happy either. >> make them happy either. >> Exactly. And then I literally met my >> Exactly. And then I literally met my >> Exactly. And then I literally met my husband and I was like, oh my god, I'm husband and I was like, oh my god, I'm husband and I was like, oh my god, I'm literally like literally like literally like >> daddy. >> daddy. >> daddy. >> Yeah. No. >> Yeah. No. >> Yeah. No. >> But not, sorry, not in that [laughter] >> But not, sorry, not in that [laughter] >> But not, sorry, not in that [laughter] not in that not in that not in that >> Never. I will always >> Never. I will always >> Never. I will always >> Scratch that from the records. Strike >> Scratch that from the records. Strike >> Scratch that from the records. Strike it. Strike it. it. Strike it. it. Strike it. >> Take it out. Um >> Take it out. Um >> Take it out. Um >> But I think that's a very interesting >> But I think that's a very interesting >> But I think that's a very interesting conversation and my hat's off to Penn conversation and my hat's off to Penn conversation and my hat's off to Penn Badgley because she asked some great Badgley because she asked some great Badgley because she asked some great questions there and I don't want to come questions there and I don't want to come questions there and I don't want to come across as prudish or anything like that. across as prudish or anything like that. across as prudish or anything like that. Um I'm sure she is a beautiful, lovely Um I'm sure she is a beautiful, lovely Um I'm sure she is a beautiful, lovely person. Um and she says she's married, person. Um and she says she's married, person. Um and she says she's married, so in many ways she's way more insight so in many ways she's way more insight so in many ways she's way more insight than I kind of, you know, a man on the than I kind of, you know, a man on the than I kind of, you know, a man on the internet who's single speaking about internet who's single speaking about internet who's single speaking about relationship. It's not exactly relationship. It's not exactly relationship. It's not exactly the best marriage advice in history. the best marriage advice in history. the best marriage advice in history. Um but I think he gives a lot of wisdom Um but I think he gives a lot of wisdom Um but I think he gives a lot of wisdom there and I I do want while I think like there and I I do want while I think like there and I I do want while I think like a lot of the stuff I see coming out of a lot of the stuff I see coming out of a lot of the stuff I see coming out of this podcast is absolute dribble. I'll I this podcast is absolute dribble. I'll I this podcast is absolute dribble. I'll I know that is a bit judgmental, bit know that is a bit judgmental, bit know that is a bit judgmental, bit condescending. condescending. condescending. But I would say it is a lot of it is But I would say it is a lot of it is But I would say it is a lot of it is complete dribble. Um I will just say complete dribble. Um I will just say complete dribble. Um I will just say that I think her heart's clearly in the that I think her heart's clearly in the that I think her heart's clearly in the right place. I think in many ways she's, right place. I think in many ways she's, right place. I think in many ways she's, you know, she's trying to you know, she's trying to you know, she's trying to help young women in this mad world help young women in this mad world help young women in this mad world trying to find some order, trying to trying to find some order, trying to trying to find some order, trying to find some things and and the humility to find some things and and the humility to find some things and and the humility to say kind of, you know, that she had a say kind of, you know, that she had a say kind of, you know, that she had a view of like women kind of acting like view of like women kind of acting like view of like women kind of acting like men to kind of battle the whole men to kind of battle the whole men to kind of battle the whole patriarchy view kind of thing and then patriarchy view kind of thing and then patriarchy view kind of thing and then how I realized, oh wait, no, that how I realized, oh wait, no, that how I realized, oh wait, no, that doesn't make even the people happy.

doesn't make even the people happy. doesn't make even the people happy. Massive humility for saying that. And Massive humility for saying that. And Massive humility for saying that. And I'm, you know, I've I've probably I'm, you know, I've I've probably I'm, you know, I've I've probably watched a few episodes of this podcast. watched a few episodes of this podcast. watched a few episodes of this podcast. I'm no expert. I don't watch it all the I'm no expert. I don't watch it all the I'm no expert. I don't watch it all the time, so I'm sure there's loads of time, so I'm sure there's loads of time, so I'm sure there's loads of insights that I'm not seeing here and insights that I'm not seeing here and insights that I'm not seeing here and I'm just taking a little snippet from I'm just taking a little snippet from I'm just taking a little snippet from it. So my apologies if I have come it. So my apologies if I have come it. So my apologies if I have come across as prudish or anything like that. across as prudish or anything like that. across as prudish or anything like that. And but I massive respect to this And but I massive respect to this And but I massive respect to this amazing guy, Joe Goldberg, but his amazing guy, Joe Goldberg, but his amazing guy, Joe Goldberg, but his actual name is Penn Badgley, for saying actual name is Penn Badgley, for saying actual name is Penn Badgley, for saying this really, cuz I think there's a lot this really, cuz I think there's a lot this really, cuz I think there's a lot of wisdom in what he's saying there. And of wisdom in what he's saying there. And of wisdom in what he's saying there. And I just think it's great when people I just think it's great when people I just think it's great when people actually go to places where, you know, actually go to places where, you know, actually go to places where, you know, you could say are spiritually a bit you could say are spiritually a bit you could say are spiritually a bit dark. And what they speak about, what dark. And what they speak about, what dark. And what they speak about, what they say, like there's nothing casual they say, like there's nothing casual they say, like there's nothing casual about it. It's it's a big deal to be about it. It's it's a big deal to be about it. It's it's a big deal to be vulnerable. It's to love, you know. It vulnerable. It's to love, you know. It vulnerable. It's to love, you know. It is a big deal. And this is a bloke who is a big deal. And this is a bloke who is a big deal. And this is a bloke who is a really great man from the sounds of is a really great man from the sounds of is a really great man from the sounds of it. Really secure man who is kind of it. Really secure man who is kind of it. Really secure man who is kind of preaching a really great moral code. And preaching a really great moral code. And preaching a really great moral code. And also just uh also just uh also just uh a real moral strength, you know, a real moral strength, you know, a real moral strength, you know, overcoming a lot of stereotypes that overcoming a lot of stereotypes that overcoming a lot of stereotypes that people have, you know. Like if you do people have, you know. Like if you do people have, you know. Like if you do love someone, someone has a kid, you love someone, someone has a kid, you love someone, someone has a kid, you know, as difficult as it is, the fact know, as difficult as it is, the fact know, as difficult as it is, the fact that he's managed to come over that is that he's managed to come over that is that he's managed to come over that is my hat's off to him. That takes real my hat's off to him. That takes real my hat's off to him. That takes real courage, bravery, and just love. Like courage, bravery, and just love. Like courage, bravery, and just love. Like actual love, you know. So much like actual love, you know. So much like actual love, you know. So much like respect to him. But yeah, I love you respect to him. But yeah, I love you respect to him. But yeah, I love you all. I hope you did take a little bit of all. I hope you did take a little bit of all. I hope you did take a little bit of insight from this. I I thought this is insight from this. I I thought this is insight from this. I I thought this is very insightful kind of seeing a bloke very insightful kind of seeing a bloke very insightful kind of seeing a bloke on a podcast like this actually saying on a podcast like this actually saying on a podcast like this actually saying kind of being a bit of a battering ram kind of being a bit of a battering ram kind of being a bit of a battering ram to all the nonsense.

to all the nonsense. to all the nonsense. But yeah, again, love you all. You might But yeah, again, love you all. You might But yeah, again, love you all. You might enjoy these two videos here. But yeah, I enjoy these two videos here. But yeah, I enjoy these two videos here. But yeah, I love you all and I'll see you all in the love you all and I'll see you all in the love you all and I'll see you all in the next one very soon. Peace.