"C.S. Lewis Was WRONG" Historian Bart Ehrman Drops Bombshell

I would say Jesus expanded I would say Jesus expanded the moral conscience of the West. the moral conscience of the West. the moral conscience of the West. So, there still was, and this is Lewis's So, there still was, and this is Lewis's So, there still was, and this is Lewis's argument, that I think you agree with, argument, that I think you agree with, argument, that I think you agree with, some basic moral principles some basic moral principles some basic moral principles that people have across cultures. that people have across cultures. that people have across cultures. There's a sense that right and wrong There's a sense that right and wrong There's a sense that right and wrong exist. exist. exist. And I ought to be a good person, even And I ought to be a good person, even And I ought to be a good person, even though maybe culturally it's defined though maybe culturally it's defined though maybe culturally it's defined differently in culture A versus culture differently in culture A versus culture differently in culture A versus culture B. I ought to love people, even though B. I ought to love people, even though B. I ought to love people, even though love looks differently in culture A love looks differently in culture A love looks differently in culture A versus culture B. I ought to care for my versus culture B. I ought to care for my versus culture B. I ought to care for my children and posterity, although that children and posterity, although that children and posterity, although that looks differently. So, the point is not looks differently. So, the point is not looks differently. So, the point is not the practice, but there are moral the practice, but there are moral the practice, but there are moral principles that we find, this is Lewis's principles that we find, this is Lewis's principles that we find, this is Lewis's argument in The Abolition of Man, that argument in The Abolition of Man, that argument in The Abolition of Man, that are across cultures, these common basic are across cultures, these common basic are across cultures, these common basic moral principle commitments. And so, I'm moral principle commitments. And so, I'm moral principle commitments. And so, I'm not saying Jesus introduced this idea of not saying Jesus introduced this idea of not saying Jesus introduced this idea of moral teaching, and it didn't exist moral teaching, and it didn't exist moral teaching, and it didn't exist before. before. before. I'm saying he expanded a certain moral I'm saying he expanded a certain moral I'm saying he expanded a certain moral belief that existed before then, in belief that existed before then, in belief that existed before then, in terms of globally he expanded it, but he terms of globally he expanded it, but he terms of globally he expanded it, but he also expanded it to include the also expanded it to include the also expanded it to include the disenfranchised, include the poor, those disenfranchised, include the poor, those disenfranchised, include the poor, those in the out group. So, I don't think in the out group. So, I don't think in the out group. So, I don't think there's any inconsistency in saying there's any inconsistency in saying there's any inconsistency in saying Jesus expanded our moral teachings, Jesus expanded our moral teachings, Jesus expanded our moral teachings, because we do see common moral teachings because we do see common moral teachings because we do see common moral teachings before the time of Jesus.

before the time of Jesus. before the time of Jesus. So, there's no inconsistency in the So, there's no inconsistency in the So, there's no inconsistency in the argument that I'm making, which is why argument that I'm making, which is why argument that I'm making, which is why Christians applaud things like books by Christians applaud things like books by Christians applaud things like books by Tom Holland, and I thought your book was Tom Holland, and I thought your book was Tom Holland, and I thought your book was so great. I was like, yeah, hospitals, so great. I was like, yeah, hospitals, so great. I was like, yeah, hospitals, orphanages, this is the teachings of orphanages, this is the teachings of orphanages, this is the teachings of Jesus, because he expanded Jesus, because he expanded Jesus, because he expanded these truths that we have these truths that we have these truths that we have to those who couldn't experience it in to those who couldn't experience it in to those who couldn't experience it in the past. So, the past. So, the past. So, does that make sense, or should we keep does that make sense, or should we keep does that make sense, or should we keep going? going? going? >> thesis >> thesis >> thesis No, that's the thesis of my book. No, that's the thesis of my book. No, that's the thesis of my book. But I mean, that's the thesis of my But I mean, that's the thesis of my But I mean, that's the thesis of my book, that Jesus transforms something book, that Jesus transforms something book, that Jesus transforms something that was already there. People have a that was already there. People have a that was already there. People have a moral conscience. I mean, I I talk about moral conscience. I mean, I I talk about moral conscience. I mean, I I talk about moral moral discussions that go back as moral moral discussions that go back as moral moral discussions that go back as far as we have literature and trace them far as we have literature and trace them far as we have literature and trace them up to Jesus' day and up to today. So, up to Jesus' day and up to today. So, up to Jesus' day and up to today. So, there are transformations. there are transformations. there are transformations. I think the point is that you see kind I think the point is that you see kind I think the point is that you see kind of common moral values across cultures. of common moral values across cultures. of common moral values across cultures. For example, parents love their children For example, parents love their children For example, parents love their children and take care of them across cultures. and take care of them across cultures. and take care of them across cultures. Virtually every culture thinks that in Virtually every culture thinks that in Virtually every culture thinks that in some instances it's wrong to murder you some instances it's wrong to murder you some instances it's wrong to murder you can go down a list of things that are can go down a list of things that are can go down a list of things that are broadly shared. Even though, as you broadly shared. Even though, as you broadly shared. Even though, as you agree, the practices are quite agree, the practices are quite agree, the practices are quite different. So, that we think that child different. So, that we think that child different. So, that we think that child sacrifice is a heinous idea and other sacrifice is a heinous idea and other sacrifice is a heinous idea and other people thought this was a really good people thought this was a really good people thought this was a really good idea. Okay, so there are differences and idea. Okay, so there are differences and idea. Okay, so there are differences and similarities. You're You're saying that similarities. You're You're saying that similarities. You're You're saying that the similarities across cultures the similarities across cultures the similarities across cultures demonstrate a as C.S. Lewis argued that demonstrate a as C.S. Lewis argued that demonstrate a as C.S. Lewis argued that that there must be some it must have that there must be some it must have that there must be some it must have been given to us by some superior being been given to us by some superior being been given to us by some superior being and that there's some kind of objective and that there's some kind of objective and that there's some kind of objective morality. I'm disagreeing with that.

morality. I'm disagreeing with that. morality. I'm disagreeing with that. I'm not This is not a big point for me I'm not This is not a big point for me I'm not This is not a big point for me in the book. And so, I just want people in the book. And so, I just want people in the book. And so, I just want people to know that, you know, I do think that to know that, you know, I do think that to know that, you know, I do think that Christians will will appreciate many Christians will will appreciate many Christians will will appreciate many parts of this book. They'll like you, parts of this book. They'll like you, parts of this book. They'll like you, they'll disagree with other parts. I they'll disagree with other parts. I they'll disagree with other parts. I think I think many Christians will think I think many Christians will think I think many Christians will disagree with disagree with disagree with the most Christians I know would the most Christians I know would the most Christians I know would disagree with parts other than the ones disagree with parts other than the ones disagree with parts other than the ones you're you're trying to focus on in you're you're trying to focus on in you're you're trying to focus on in terms of objectivity. terms of objectivity. terms of objectivity. But, there are other explanations for But, there are other explanations for But, there are other explanations for what Lewis identifies in several of his what Lewis identifies in several of his what Lewis identifies in several of his writings about writings about writings about about people having a shared moral about people having a shared moral about people having a shared moral sense. There are other ways to explain sense. There are other ways to explain sense. There are other ways to explain it that, in my opinion, they don't it that, in my opinion, they don't it that, in my opinion, they don't affect my thesis, but in my opinion, are affect my thesis, but in my opinion, are affect my thesis, but in my opinion, are superior to his view. superior to his view. superior to his view. >> I'm not actually making the argument >> I'm not actually making the argument >> I'm not actually making the argument that there's commonality across culture that there's commonality across culture that there's commonality across culture and that proves that it comes from God. and that proves that it comes from God. and that proves that it comes from God. That's not my point. I was simply That's not my point. I was simply That's not my point. I was simply pushing back and saying responding to pushing back and saying responding to pushing back and saying responding to the what you said was an apparent the what you said was an apparent the what you said was an apparent contradiction in my belief that Jesus is contradiction in my belief that Jesus is contradiction in my belief that Jesus is the one who brought this moral teaching the one who brought this moral teaching the one who brought this moral teaching to the world. And I'm saying there's to the world. And I'm saying there's to the world. And I'm saying there's actually commonality before this time actually commonality before this time actually commonality before this time that exists across culture. C.S. Lewis that exists across culture. C.S. Lewis that exists across culture. C.S. Lewis pointed that out.

pointed that out. pointed that out. The follow-up question The follow-up question The follow-up question Okay. Okay. Okay. >> with that. >> with that. >> with that. >> Right. And the follow-up question is I >> Right. And the follow-up question is I >> Right. And the follow-up question is I think where we differ in the sense of think where we differ in the sense of think where we differ in the sense of what best explains what best explains what best explains those common beliefs across culture. those common beliefs across culture. those common beliefs across culture. That's where I think we differ. And to That's where I think we differ. And to That's where I think we differ. And to me, that's what's most interesting about me, that's what's most interesting about me, that's what's most interesting about the book, even though there's plenty of the book, even though there's plenty of the book, even though there's plenty of other interesting stuff and we are other interesting stuff and we are other interesting stuff and we are disagreeing on certain issues. You're disagreeing on certain issues. You're disagreeing on certain issues. You're right, there's plenty of other stuff right, there's plenty of other stuff right, there's plenty of other stuff here. That's why I said I find your book here. That's why I said I find your book here. That's why I said I find your book fascinating. I was intrigued by it. fascinating. I was intrigued by it. fascinating. I was intrigued by it. There's plenty of other stuff. We have There's plenty of other stuff. We have There's plenty of other stuff. We have more common ground in this book than we more common ground in this book than we more common ground in this book than we do difference. do difference. do difference. >> Absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> To me, when I read a book like this, I'm >> To me, when I read a book like this, I'm >> To me, when I read a book like this, I'm trying to find what is the best trying to find what is the best trying to find what is the best explanation. explanation. explanation. Because if if evolution as you laid out Because if if evolution as you laid out Because if if evolution as you laid out can sufficiently account for can sufficiently account for can sufficiently account for our belief in morality then that doesn't our belief in morality then that doesn't our belief in morality then that doesn't mean there's no God. That just means mean there's no God. That just means mean there's no God. That just means that this argument doesn't point towards that this argument doesn't point towards that this argument doesn't point towards God. God. God. >> That's right. So, I think it's >> That's right. So, I think it's >> That's right. So, I think it's fascinating here cuz you have obviously fascinating here cuz you have obviously fascinating here cuz you have obviously Shawn McDowell who's a Christian. And Shawn McDowell who's a Christian. And Shawn McDowell who's a Christian. And can I just have my absolute hats off to can I just have my absolute hats off to can I just have my absolute hats off to Shawn cuz I think he did an absolutely Shawn cuz I think he did an absolutely Shawn cuz I think he did an absolutely phenomenal job in this interview. And phenomenal job in this interview. And phenomenal job in this interview. And the way he carried himself, the way he the way he carried himself, the way he the way he carried himself, the way he engaged with uh he was so respectful.

engaged with uh he was so respectful. engaged with uh he was so respectful. And I think I I haven't seen many And I think I I haven't seen many And I think I I haven't seen many interviews as good as this with Bart and interviews as good as this with Bart and interviews as good as this with Bart and and the point I think is that there's a and the point I think is that there's a and the point I think is that there's a commonality of what humans do. May that commonality of what humans do. May that commonality of what humans do. May that be helping the needy, may that be be helping the needy, may that be be helping the needy, may that be believing in helping those that are more believing in helping those that are more believing in helping those that are more vulnerable, or even guilt that they vulnerable, or even guilt that they vulnerable, or even guilt that they speak about guilt in this episode about speak about guilt in this episode about speak about guilt in this episode about how that like Shawn's point is guilt, how that like Shawn's point is guilt, how that like Shawn's point is guilt, you know, what biological purpose does you know, what biological purpose does you know, what biological purpose does that have? And you know, Bart makes the that have? And you know, Bart makes the that have? And you know, Bart makes the point well, those that feel guilt having point well, those that feel guilt having point well, those that feel guilt having more kind of a tuned view to that more kind of a tuned view to that more kind of a tuned view to that community and others. And those people community and others. And those people community and others. And those people have done better biologically. And he have done better biologically. And he have done better biologically. And he speaks about the queen bee and how I speaks about the queen bee and how I speaks about the queen bee and how I think he says the queen bee and how, you think he says the queen bee and how, you think he says the queen bee and how, you know, in the animal kingdom there are know, in the animal kingdom there are know, in the animal kingdom there are animals that will give up their lives to animals that will give up their lives to animals that will give up their lives to save others. And you could say that, you save others. And you could say that, you save others. And you could say that, you know, they're taking on an emotional know, they're taking on an emotional know, they're taking on an emotional trait. It doesn't mean that there's a a trait. It doesn't mean that there's a a trait. It doesn't mean that there's a a god behind that. I mean, I guess you god behind that. I mean, I guess you god behind that. I mean, I guess you could say how, you know, how sentient a could say how, you know, how sentient a could say how, you know, how sentient a certain animals are. And all sentient, I certain animals are. And all sentient, I certain animals are. And all sentient, I know Lewis has spoken about that. But know Lewis has spoken about that. But know Lewis has spoken about that. But it's a really interesting critique from it's a really interesting critique from it's a really interesting critique from Bart here because it kind of strips it Bart here because it kind of strips it Bart here because it kind of strips it back where Shawn is like, you know, back where Shawn is like, you know, back where Shawn is like, you know, there is this universal there is this universal there is this universal view of morality in some sense. While it view of morality in some sense. While it view of morality in some sense. While it may differ from culture to culture. And may differ from culture to culture. And may differ from culture to culture. And Jesus came and kind of transformed that Jesus came and kind of transformed that Jesus came and kind of transformed that and brought it to the world. And Shawn and brought it to the world. And Shawn and brought it to the world. And Shawn looks at that and he says that's looks at that and he says that's looks at that and he says that's pointing towards a god as Lewis speaks pointing towards a god as Lewis speaks pointing towards a god as Lewis speaks about in the abolition of man. But Bart about in the abolition of man. But Bart about in the abolition of man. But Bart is saying basically doesn't point to a is saying basically doesn't point to a is saying basically doesn't point to a god remotely.

god remotely. god remotely. Um, and it's it's a really lovely Um, and it's it's a really lovely Um, and it's it's a really lovely clarification, I think, on both sides clarification, I think, on both sides clarification, I think, on both sides here cuz it it separates very well what here cuz it it separates very well what here cuz it it separates very well what people actually think. Um, and the the people actually think. Um, and the the people actually think. Um, and the the issue of, you know, objective and issue of, you know, objective and issue of, you know, objective and subjective morality is is something that subjective morality is is something that subjective morality is is something that the new atheist movement, I I would the new atheist movement, I I would the new atheist movement, I I would argue, and I am biased cuz I'm a argue, and I am biased cuz I'm a argue, and I am biased cuz I'm a Christian, hasn't come Christian, hasn't come Christian, hasn't come and sufficiently clenched that and sufficiently clenched that and sufficiently clenched that intellectual difficulty. Now, you could intellectual difficulty. Now, you could intellectual difficulty. Now, you could similarly say, if you're an atheist, you similarly say, if you're an atheist, you similarly say, if you're an atheist, you could say, well, the issue of suffering, could say, well, the issue of suffering, could say, well, the issue of suffering, Christians haven't really dealt with Christians haven't really dealt with Christians haven't really dealt with that very well, have they? Like, they that very well, have they? Like, they that very well, have they? Like, they haven't addressed the issue that, you haven't addressed the issue that, you haven't addressed the issue that, you know, if there's like epicureanism, like know, if there's like epicureanism, like know, if there's like epicureanism, like if there's a god and, you know, is he if there's a god and, you know, is he if there's a god and, you know, is he all powerful? If he sees all this all powerful? If he sees all this all powerful? If he sees all this suffering happen? Or does he not help suffering happen? Or does he not help suffering happen? Or does he not help people? And then it's like, well, is the people? And then it's like, well, is the people? And then it's like, well, is the god even good, you know? There's a lot god even good, you know? There's a lot god even good, you know? There's a lot of of of interesting points there. And I'm, you interesting points there. And I'm, you interesting points there. And I'm, you know, I'm no academic. But we'll we'll know, I'm no academic. But we'll we'll know, I'm no academic. But we'll we'll see more of this conversation cuz I see more of this conversation cuz I see more of this conversation cuz I think it's an amazing exchange of two think it's an amazing exchange of two think it's an amazing exchange of two extremely smart people. So, we'll see extremely smart people. So, we'll see extremely smart people. So, we'll see what else is said here. what else is said here. what else is said here. >> Could you tell us what exactly do you >> Could you tell us what exactly do you >> Could you tell us what exactly do you think is unique about the teachings that think is unique about the teachings that think is unique about the teachings that Jesus gave?

Jesus gave? Jesus gave? >> Um, I think there are a couple things. >> Um, I think there are a couple things. >> Um, I think there are a couple things. Um, and you you you mentioned them. You Um, and you you you mentioned them. You Um, and you you you mentioned them. You mentioned them but well, you mentioned mentioned them but well, you mentioned mentioned them but well, you mentioned one of them anyway. The it was it's it's one of them anyway. The it was it's it's one of them anyway. The it was it's it's been throughout the human race. Ever been throughout the human race. Ever been throughout the human race. Ever since there's been a species that humans since there's been a species that humans since there's been a species that humans take care of others within who are take care of others within who are take care of others within who are genetically and socially related to genetically and socially related to genetically and socially related to them. them. them. Um, that's always been the case. It's Um, that's always been the case. It's Um, that's always been the case. It's true of every species. It's true of true of every species. It's true of true of every species. It's true of honeybees. It is true of chimpanzees. honeybees. It is true of chimpanzees. honeybees. It is true of chimpanzees. It's true of snakes. If you any species It's true of snakes. If you any species It's true of snakes. If you any species that um, that does not have some sense that um, that does not have some sense that um, that does not have some sense of altruism would not survive as a of altruism would not survive as a of altruism would not survive as a species. species. species. >> This is kind of the Darwinian, not >> This is kind of the Darwinian, not >> This is kind of the Darwinian, not Darwinian, sorry, the Richard Dawkins Darwinian, sorry, the Richard Dawkins Darwinian, sorry, the Richard Dawkins point of view. The we have biological point of view. The we have biological point of view. The we have biological impulse to go into these impulse to go into these impulse to go into these type of type of type of views. Now, the Christian could say it views. Now, the Christian could say it views. Now, the Christian could say it that doesn't You could say, "Well, why that doesn't You could say, "Well, why that doesn't You could say, "Well, why do I mean, you could throw it back even do I mean, you could throw it back even do I mean, you could throw it back even more and say, "Well, why do people more and say, "Well, why do people more and say, "Well, why do people and animals survive based on that view?" and animals survive based on that view?" and animals survive based on that view?" Well, the natural order points to a God Well, the natural order points to a God Well, the natural order points to a God because why why are these things because why why are these things because why why are these things beneficial?

beneficial? beneficial? Um, Um, Um, you I mean, you could say it's chance. you I mean, you could say it's chance. you I mean, you could say it's chance. It's just the way it is from a kind of It's just the way it is from a kind of It's just the way it is from a kind of atheist point of view or you could say atheist point of view or you could say atheist point of view or you could say God made it like that for a reason. But God made it like that for a reason. But God made it like that for a reason. But then I guess there's so many instances then I guess there's so many instances then I guess there's so many instances of horrific animal atrocities and of horrific animal atrocities and of horrific animal atrocities and cruelty where you look at it and you're cruelty where you look at it and you're cruelty where you look at it and you're like, "Well, how could a God be there like, "Well, how could a God be there like, "Well, how could a God be there within all that?" And if if you're going within all that?" And if if you're going within all that?" And if if you're going to point gods towards to point gods towards to point gods towards the natural order of things, then how do the natural order of things, then how do the natural order of things, then how do you explain you explain you explain you know, I think um, it was Darwin who you know, I think um, it was Darwin who you know, I think um, it was Darwin who there was a famous animal the way he there was a famous animal the way he there was a famous animal the way he killed its prey and when he saw that, he killed its prey and when he saw that, he killed its prey and when he saw that, he he was like, "How can there be a God if he was like, "How can there be a God if he was like, "How can there be a God if that is possible?" How can the natural that is possible?" How can the natural that is possible?" How can the natural order let such cruelty happen in the order let such cruelty happen in the order let such cruelty happen in the animal kingdom? You know, you look at animal kingdom? You know, you look at animal kingdom? You know, you look at the way some snakes kill. Yeah, you look the way some snakes kill. Yeah, you look the way some snakes kill. Yeah, you look at the way some snakes kill animals and at the way some snakes kill animals and at the way some snakes kill animals and it is horrific. And you look at that and it is horrific. And you look at that and it is horrific. And you look at that and you're like, how could God allow that? you're like, how could God allow that? you're like, how could God allow that? But then you you I mean, you could say, But then you you I mean, you could say, But then you you I mean, you could say, well, that's us looking from our view to well, that's us looking from our view to well, that's us looking from our view to them. them. them. And how much pain is actually going on And how much pain is actually going on And how much pain is actually going on there? Are we just kind of projecting there? Are we just kind of projecting there? Are we just kind of projecting our own pain and our own emotion and our our own pain and our own emotion and our our own pain and our own emotion and our own virtue towards that? Um and I'm not own virtue towards that? Um and I'm not own virtue towards that? Um and I'm not a biologist. I've I don't even a biologist. I've I don't even a biologist. I've I don't even have Do I I do have a science GCSE, but have Do I I do have a science GCSE, but have Do I I do have a science GCSE, but I didn't even pass science, you know I didn't even pass science, you know I didn't even pass science, you know what I mean? Like like um you know, I what I mean? Like like um you know, I what I mean? Like like um you know, I failed. Um so I'm I'm not one to be I'm failed. Um so I'm I'm not one to be I'm failed. Um so I'm I'm not one to be I'm just kind of riffing from what I know just kind of riffing from what I know just kind of riffing from what I know here, which isn't much, but I hope here, which isn't much, but I hope here, which isn't much, but I hope somebody can take something from it.

somebody can take something from it. somebody can take something from it. We'll hear more of it. We'll hear more of it. We'll hear more of it. >> Because if it's every individual for >> Because if it's every individual for >> Because if it's every individual for themselves, they're too easily picked themselves, they're too easily picked themselves, they're too easily picked off by by off by by off by by by their enemies. by their enemies. by their enemies. Uh and so every species has that. Darwin Uh and so every species has that. Darwin Uh and so every species has that. Darwin recognized that. Even Darwin didn't know recognized that. Even Darwin didn't know recognized that. Even Darwin didn't know about genes yet, but before they knew about genes yet, but before they knew about genes yet, but before they knew that there genetic explanations for that there genetic explanations for that there genetic explanations for this, Darwin recognized that survival of this, Darwin recognized that survival of this, Darwin recognized that survival of the fittest does not mean every the fittest does not mean every the fittest does not mean every individual for himself. It means that individual for himself. It means that individual for himself. It means that the the group has to be has to have the the group has to be has to have the the group has to be has to have coherence. That requires cooperation coherence. That requires cooperation coherence. That requires cooperation and on some level, then that that and on some level, then that that and on some level, then that that requires altruism. So that was there. requires altruism. So that was there. requires altruism. So that was there. And in Greek and Roman moral philosophy, And in Greek and Roman moral philosophy, And in Greek and Roman moral philosophy, within the Roman Jesus is born in the within the Roman Jesus is born in the within the Roman Jesus is born in the Roman world, within Greek philosophical Roman world, within Greek philosophical Roman world, within Greek philosophical traditions that Romans inherited, they traditions that Romans inherited, they traditions that Romans inherited, they go back um we can trace them definitely go back um we can trace them definitely go back um we can trace them definitely back through Aristotle to Plato to back through Aristotle to Plato to back through Aristotle to Plato to Socrates and there certainly were Socrates and there certainly were Socrates and there certainly were pre-Socratic philosophers who held these pre-Socratic philosophers who held these pre-Socratic philosophers who held these views. In the views that are advanced views. In the views that are advanced views. In the views that are advanced there, the idea is that you absolutely there, the idea is that you absolutely there, the idea is that you absolutely have to be loving towards other people have to be loving towards other people have to be loving towards other people and caring for other people and helping and caring for other people and helping and caring for other people and helping other people, but it was always within other people, but it was always within other people, but it was always within the group that is socially and the group that is socially and the group that is socially and biologically related to you in some way biologically related to you in some way biologically related to you in some way or another.

or another. or another. Uh not the outsider. My argument in the Uh not the outsider. My argument in the Uh not the outsider. My argument in the book is that Jesus universalized this so book is that Jesus universalized this so book is that Jesus universalized this so that uh it would be applied to anybody that uh it would be applied to anybody that uh it would be applied to anybody in need, whether they were in your in need, whether they were in your in need, whether they were in your social group or not, whether they part social group or not, whether they part social group or not, whether they part of your family or friends, whether they of your family or friends, whether they of your family or friends, whether they shared your nationality, your ethnicity, shared your nationality, your ethnicity, shared your nationality, your ethnicity, your race, anything else it matter. If your race, anything else it matter. If your race, anything else it matter. If they were in need, those are the people they were in need, those are the people they were in need, those are the people you're supposed to help. you're supposed to help. you're supposed to help. >> Somebody's in point and that's from >> Somebody's in point and that's from >> Somebody's in point and that's from somebody who's not Christians and he's somebody who's not Christians and he's somebody who's not Christians and he's speaking about how, speaking about how, speaking about how, you know, in Greek philosophy, there you know, in Greek philosophy, there you know, in Greek philosophy, there were people who believed in helping were people who believed in helping were people who believed in helping people and obviously had different types people and obviously had different types people and obviously had different types of philosophy and ways of living, you of philosophy and ways of living, you of philosophy and ways of living, you know, the Stoics and etc. But what Bart know, the Stoics and etc. But what Bart know, the Stoics and etc. But what Bart is saying here he's saying the is saying here he's saying the is saying here he's saying the uniqueness of Christianity is the notion uniqueness of Christianity is the notion uniqueness of Christianity is the notion that anybody in need, not people who that anybody in need, not people who that anybody in need, not people who are, are, are, you know, your own preference, your own you know, your own preference, your own you know, your own preference, your own race, your own place in the world. And I race, your own place in the world. And I race, your own place in the world. And I think this is something to hold onto so think this is something to hold onto so think this is something to hold onto so much, especially in this world of hate much, especially in this world of hate much, especially in this world of hate towards other people from a different towards other people from a different towards other people from a different place, from a different skin color. place, from a different skin color. place, from a different skin color. We're seeing the rise of that in the UK We're seeing the rise of that in the UK We're seeing the rise of that in the UK and America. Now, I'm not speaking from and America. Now, I'm not speaking from and America. Now, I'm not speaking from a woke place, you know, an identity a woke place, you know, an identity a woke place, you know, an identity place, but I'm saying, you know, viewing place, but I'm saying, you know, viewing place, but I'm saying, you know, viewing everyone made in the image of God and everyone made in the image of God and everyone made in the image of God and that anyone in need is your brother and that anyone in need is your brother and that anyone in need is your brother and sister is so central to Christianity and sister is so central to Christianity and sister is so central to Christianity and we must never ever forget that. But I we must never ever forget that. But I we must never ever forget that. But I thought this is an interesting clip, an thought this is an interesting clip, an thought this is an interesting clip, an interesting back and forth. Now, a lot interesting back and forth. Now, a lot interesting back and forth. Now, a lot of this stuff I'm speaking about here, of this stuff I'm speaking about here, of this stuff I'm speaking about here, I'm not well educated on. I'm really I'm I'm not well educated on. I'm really I'm I'm not well educated on. I'm really I'm speaking from stuff I don't know very speaking from stuff I don't know very speaking from stuff I don't know very much about. So, do take it with a pinch much about. So, do take it with a pinch much about. So, do take it with a pinch of salt, but you can learn from Bart of salt, but you can learn from Bart of salt, but you can learn from Bart Ehrman and Sand who are far, far Ehrman and Sand who are far, far Ehrman and Sand who are far, far smarter in every single respect than me.

smarter in every single respect than me. smarter in every single respect than me. Um and I thought it was an interesting Um and I thought it was an interesting Um and I thought it was an interesting exchange. And also Bart going into Lewis exchange. And also Bart going into Lewis exchange. And also Bart going into Lewis a bit and saying, you know, he was a bit and saying, you know, he was a bit and saying, you know, he was wrong, I'm right. So, I hope you did wrong, I'm right. So, I hope you did wrong, I'm right. So, I hope you did enjoy. Um love you all and I I think you enjoy. Um love you all and I I think you enjoy. Um love you all and I I think you enjoyed these two videos here. But yeah, enjoyed these two videos here. But yeah, enjoyed these two videos here. But yeah, love you all and I'll see you on the love you all and I'll see you on the love you all and I'll see you on the next one later. Peace.