2028 Presidential Frontrunner: 4 Soldiers Died And Their Names Were Erased | Pete Buttigieg

I'm really worried about where we're I'm really worried about where we're headed as a country. Right now headed as a country. Right now headed as a country. Right now >> American system is so out of whack that >> American system is so out of whack that >> American system is so out of whack that if you are a multi-billionaire, you if you are a multi-billionaire, you if you are a multi-billionaire, you probably pay a lower percentage in taxes probably pay a lower percentage in taxes probably pay a lower percentage in taxes than if you're a school teacher or a than if you're a school teacher or a than if you're a school teacher or a firefighter. firefighter. firefighter. >> You have levels of inequality that we've >> You have levels of inequality that we've >> You have levels of inequality that we've almost never seen. There's a rise in almost never seen. There's a rise in almost never seen. There's a rise in political violence, the collapse in political violence, the collapse in political violence, the collapse in trust, and the biggest thing of all that trust, and the biggest thing of all that trust, and the biggest thing of all that we're facing right now is this massive we're facing right now is this massive we're facing right now is this massive debt. But it's now escalated to a level debt. But it's now escalated to a level debt. But it's now escalated to a level that no one can ignore. that no one can ignore. that no one can ignore. >> How How do you think this plays out? >> How How do you think this plays out? >> How How do you think this plays out? >> I mean, you know, we're on the brink of >> I mean, you know, we're on the brink of >> I mean, you know, we're on the brink of losing our democracy and we're running losing our democracy and we're running losing our democracy and we're running out of time to do something about it. out of time to do something about it. out of time to do something about it. >> Secretary Pete Buttigieg, Trump made a >> Secretary Pete Buttigieg, Trump made a >> Secretary Pete Buttigieg, Trump made a lot of promises when he came into power. lot of promises when he came into power. lot of promises when he came into power. Keen to get your perspective on the Iran Keen to get your perspective on the Iran Keen to get your perspective on the Iran war. war. war. >> So the president can't explain why we're >> So the president can't explain why we're >> So the president can't explain why we're there. There's a lot of reasons to there. There's a lot of reasons to there. There's a lot of reasons to suspect that we're just at war cuz he suspect that we're just at war cuz he suspect that we're just at war cuz he wanted us to. And now he can't figure wanted us to. And now he can't figure wanted us to. And now he can't figure out how to get us out of it. Troops have out how to get us out of it. Troops have out how to get us out of it. Troops have lost their lives. [music] Prices are lost their lives. [music] Prices are lost their lives. [music] Prices are higher. You're paying more for gas and higher. You're paying more for gas and higher. You're paying more for gas and for food, for for mortgages because of for food, for for mortgages because of for food, for for mortgages because of this war. And so the the next president this war. And so the the next president this war. And so the the next president will be doing this at a big disadvantage will be doing this at a big disadvantage will be doing this at a big disadvantage because so many relationships with our because so many relationships with our because so many relationships with our allies have been burned. allies have been burned. allies have been burned. >> So I'm keen to get your perspective on >> So I'm keen to get your perspective on >> So I'm keen to get your perspective on the AI, good, bad? Should we implement a the AI, good, bad? Should we implement a the AI, good, bad? Should we implement a wealth tax? Is there anything you wealth tax? Is there anything you wealth tax? Is there anything you respect about Trump? But also greater respect about Trump? But also greater respect about Trump? But also greater Israel, for example. What does Netanyahu Israel, for example. What does Netanyahu Israel, for example. What does Netanyahu want in the region? And then be the want in the region? And then be the want in the region? And then be the first person in a presidential candidate first person in a presidential candidate first person in a presidential candidate to be openly gay?

to be openly gay? to be openly gay? >> Uh definitely the first person who's >> Uh definitely the first person who's >> Uh definitely the first person who's considered to have a shot. And when I considered to have a shot. And when I considered to have a shot. And when I finally made peace with this [music] finally made peace with this [music] finally made peace with this [music] reality reality reality that I was gay, I was well into my 20s that I was gay, I was well into my 20s that I was gay, I was well into my 20s cuz I wanted so bad for it not to be cuz I wanted so bad for it not to be cuz I wanted so bad for it not to be true. And I'd like to believe we'll get to a And I'd like to believe we'll get to a day when it's just day when it's just day when it's just not a thing. not a thing. not a thing. No one cares. No one cares. No one cares. >> Secretary Pete Buttigieg, are you going >> Secretary Pete Buttigieg, are you going >> Secretary Pete Buttigieg, are you going to run to be president in 2028? to run to be president in 2028? to run to be president in 2028? >> Um >> This is super interesting to me. My team >> This is super interesting to me. My team gave me this report to show me how many gave me this report to show me how many gave me this report to show me how many of you that watch this show subscribe, of you that watch this show subscribe, of you that watch this show subscribe, and some of you have told us, according and some of you have told us, according and some of you have told us, according to this, that you are unsubscribed from to this, that you are unsubscribed from to this, that you are unsubscribed from the channel randomly. So favor to ask the channel randomly. So favor to ask the channel randomly. So favor to ask all of you, please could you check right all of you, please could you check right all of you, please could you check right now if you've hit the subscribe button. now if you've hit the subscribe button. now if you've hit the subscribe button. If you are a regular viewer of the show If you are a regular viewer of the show If you are a regular viewer of the show and you like what we do here. We're and you like what we do here. We're and you like what we do here. We're approaching quite a significant landmark approaching quite a significant landmark approaching quite a significant landmark on this show in terms of a subscriber on this show in terms of a subscriber on this show in terms of a subscriber number. So, if there was one simple, number. So, if there was one simple, number. So, if there was one simple, free thing that you could do to help us, free thing that you could do to help us, free thing that you could do to help us, my team, everyone here to keep this show my team, everyone here to keep this show my team, everyone here to keep this show free, to keep it improving year over free, to keep it improving year over free, to keep it improving year over year and week over week, it is just to year and week over week, it is just to year and week over week, it is just to hit that subscribe button and to hit that subscribe button and to hit that subscribe button and to double-check if you've hit it. Only double-check if you've hit it. Only double-check if you've hit it. Only thing I'll ever ask of you.

thing I'll ever ask of you. thing I'll ever ask of you. Do we have a deal? Do we have a deal? Do we have a deal? If you do it, I'll tell you what I'll If you do it, I'll tell you what I'll If you do it, I'll tell you what I'll do. I'll make sure every single week, do. I'll make sure every single week, do. I'll make sure every single week, every single month, we fight harder and every single month, we fight harder and every single month, we fight harder and harder and harder and harder to bring harder and harder and harder to bring harder and harder and harder to bring you the guests, some conversations that you the guests, some conversations that you the guests, some conversations that you want to hear. I've stayed true to you want to hear. I've stayed true to you want to hear. I've stayed true to that promise since the very beginning of that promise since the very beginning of that promise since the very beginning of the Diary of a CEO, and I will not let the Diary of a CEO, and I will not let the Diary of a CEO, and I will not let you down. Please help us. Really you down. Please help us. Really you down. Please help us. Really appreciate it. Let's get on with the appreciate it. Let's get on with the appreciate it. Let's get on with the show. >> [singing] >> [singing] >> Secretary Pete Buttigieg, how are you >> Secretary Pete Buttigieg, how are you >> Secretary Pete Buttigieg, how are you feeling about the nature of feeling about the nature of feeling about the nature of politics at the moment? But I should politics at the moment? But I should politics at the moment? But I should probably say the nature of American life probably say the nature of American life probably say the nature of American life at the moment. at the moment. at the moment. >> I'm really worried about where we're >> I'm really worried about where we're >> I'm really worried about where we're headed as a country. I think many ways headed as a country. I think many ways headed as a country. I think many ways our our entire existence has been about our our entire existence has been about our our entire existence has been about creating a different kind of political creating a different kind of political creating a different kind of political system and introducing it to the world. system and introducing it to the world. system and introducing it to the world. That's what we're about. And now that That's what we're about. And now that That's what we're about. And now that whole project is in question. That whole whole project is in question. That whole whole project is in question. That whole project is In my view, it's on the project is In my view, it's on the project is In my view, it's on the brink. brink. brink. >> On the brink? >> On the brink? >> On the brink? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> What do you What do you mean by that? >> What do you What do you mean by that? >> What do you What do you mean by that? >> I mean, we're on the brink of losing our >> I mean, we're on the brink of losing our >> I mean, we're on the brink of losing our democracy. The whole idea of this democracy. The whole idea of this democracy. The whole idea of this country, the whole idea of overthrowing country, the whole idea of overthrowing country, the whole idea of overthrowing a king a king a king was that everyday life would get better was that everyday life would get better was that everyday life would get better if we set up a country where the people if we set up a country where the people if we set up a country where the people are in charge of the government instead are in charge of the government instead are in charge of the government instead of the other way around.

of the other way around. of the other way around. And now we're in this moment where after And now we're in this moment where after And now we're in this moment where after all of the things we've gone through for all of the things we've gone through for all of the things we've gone through for decades, for 250 years, decades, for 250 years, decades, for 250 years, it's not clear if that's going to work it's not clear if that's going to work it's not clear if that's going to work out. out. out. I think it will. I believe it will if we I think it will. I believe it will if we I think it will. I believe it will if we do what we have to do. do what we have to do. do what we have to do. But that means reforming, tuning up, But that means reforming, tuning up, But that means reforming, tuning up, changing that political system changing that political system changing that political system because the the problems in that because the the problems in that because the the problems in that political system help to explain political system help to explain political system help to explain all of the economic problems all of the economic problems all of the economic problems that I think so many Americans are that I think so many Americans are that I think so many Americans are living with, where you've had enormous living with, where you've had enormous living with, where you've had enormous economic growth and shockingly little of economic growth and shockingly little of economic growth and shockingly little of it making it into people's pockets. it making it into people's pockets. it making it into people's pockets. Where you have Where you have Where you have levels of inequality that we've almost levels of inequality that we've almost levels of inequality that we've almost never seen never seen never seen in this country. And then the other in this country. And then the other in this country. And then the other thing is thing is thing is there's there's the American promise in there's there's the American promise in there's there's the American promise in terms of the system, the politics, the terms of the system, the politics, the terms of the system, the politics, the government, democracy, the America's government, democracy, the America's government, democracy, the America's gift to the world. Creating democracy. gift to the world. Creating democracy. gift to the world. Creating democracy. But there's the economic version of But there's the economic version of But there's the economic version of that, which is the American dream. that, which is the American dream. that, which is the American dream. Like the idea that no matter how you Like the idea that no matter how you Like the idea that no matter how you start, start, start, no matter who you are, no matter who you are, no matter who you are, you can come out ahead of where you you can come out ahead of where you you can come out ahead of where you started economically. That used to started economically. That used to started economically. That used to happen for nine out of 10 Americans.

happen for nine out of 10 Americans. happen for nine out of 10 Americans. Statistically, Statistically, Statistically, the place where you're most likely to the place where you're most likely to the place where you're most likely to live out the American dream right now is live out the American dream right now is live out the American dream right now is Denmark. Denmark. Denmark. And I want that to be America. And I want that to be America. And I want that to be America. >> And systemically, if we just think from >> And systemically, if we just think from >> And systemically, if we just think from a high level, what is the what is the a high level, what is the what is the a high level, what is the what is the essence of of why Denmark is a better essence of of why Denmark is a better essence of of why Denmark is a better place for the American dream? What are place for the American dream? What are place for the American dream? What are the systemic problems? Is it with the the systemic problems? Is it with the the systemic problems? Is it with the current administration? Is it with the current administration? Is it with the current administration? Is it with the perspective on what a good life looks perspective on what a good life looks perspective on what a good life looks like in America? Or is it greed? Or is like in America? Or is it greed? Or is like in America? Or is it greed? Or is it something else? it something else? it something else? >> Well, I wouldn't say it's just the >> Well, I wouldn't say it's just the >> Well, I wouldn't say it's just the current administration. I mean, I think current administration. I mean, I think current administration. I mean, I think I think the current administration isn't I think the current administration isn't I think the current administration isn't helping, but I I think the problem is helping, but I I think the problem is helping, but I I think the problem is much deeper than that. Uh a lot of it is much deeper than that. Uh a lot of it is much deeper than that. Uh a lot of it is the last 30 or 40 years, we've had the last 30 or 40 years, we've had the last 30 or 40 years, we've had policies in this country policies in this country policies in this country that make it harder to get ahead if that make it harder to get ahead if that make it harder to get ahead if you're not already starting out well you're not already starting out well you're not already starting out well off. Even just the way our taxes work, off. Even just the way our taxes work, off. Even just the way our taxes work, they they they tax work they they they tax work they they they tax work more than they tax wealth. That's really more than they tax wealth. That's really more than they tax wealth. That's really catching up to us. I mean, it has catching up to us. I mean, it has catching up to us. I mean, it has created problems. I believe it's created created problems. I believe it's created created problems. I believe it's created problems for decades, but you feel it in problems for decades, but you feel it in problems for decades, but you feel it in a different way now. a different way now. a different way now. And when inequality reaches a certain And when inequality reaches a certain And when inequality reaches a certain level, level, level, and when the inequality of power follows and when the inequality of power follows and when the inequality of power follows the economic inequality to a certain the economic inequality to a certain the economic inequality to a certain level, that's when I think you start to level, that's when I think you start to level, that's when I think you start to have earthquakes in in the society and have earthquakes in in the society and have earthquakes in in the society and what it feels like to live in this what it feels like to live in this what it feels like to live in this country. And I think we're going through country. And I think we're going through country. And I think we're going through those earthquakes. Uh not just Trump and those earthquakes. Uh not just Trump and those earthquakes. Uh not just Trump and everything he represents, but the rise everything he represents, but the rise everything he represents, but the rise in political violence, in political violence, in political violence, the collapse in trust in our society.

the collapse in trust in our society. the collapse in trust in our society. All of these things I think are related All of these things I think are related All of these things I think are related to that. to that. to that. And we're running out time to do And we're running out time to do And we're running out time to do something about it. something about it. something about it. >> Trump made a lot of promises when he >> Trump made a lot of promises when he >> Trump made a lot of promises when he came into power. came into power. came into power. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> He won in a bigger than expected >> He won in a bigger than expected >> He won in a bigger than expected victory, I would say. Why does he victory, I would say. Why does he victory, I would say. Why does he resonate? resonate? resonate? >> Well, first of all, >> Well, first of all, >> Well, first of all, I think he speaks to a lot of people who I think he speaks to a lot of people who I think he speaks to a lot of people who know that the system has let them down. know that the system has let them down. know that the system has let them down. And even though I think he's somebody And even though I think he's somebody And even though I think he's somebody who really benefits from the system who really benefits from the system who really benefits from the system as it is, it's made him rich and kept as it is, it's made him rich and kept as it is, it's made him rich and kept him rich. You know, his message was, him rich. You know, his message was, him rich. You know, his message was, "I'm going to blow it all up." "I'm going to blow it all up." "I'm going to blow it all up." And I think he's blowing up all the And I think he's blowing up all the And I think he's blowing up all the wrong things. But look, if if the wrong things. But look, if if the wrong things. But look, if if the system's let you down, you know, you're system's let you down, you know, you're system's let you down, you know, you're only going to vote so many times within only going to vote so many times within only going to vote so many times within that system before somebody comes along that system before somebody comes along that system before somebody comes along says, "I'm going to blow it all up." And says, "I'm going to blow it all up." And says, "I'm going to blow it all up." And you say, "Well, you say, "Well, you say, "Well, I I might not even like the guy, but uh I I might not even like the guy, but uh I I might not even like the guy, but uh I'll give him a shot to see if that I'll give him a shot to see if that I'll give him a shot to see if that makes me better off." Now, I also think makes me better off." Now, I also think makes me better off." Now, I also think he lied to a lot of people. Um he lied to a lot of people. Um he lied to a lot of people. Um you know, some people voted for him you know, some people voted for him you know, some people voted for him because they believed him when he said because they believed him when he said because they believed him when he said he's not going to start a new war. he's not going to start a new war. he's not going to start a new war. Many people voted for him because they Many people voted for him because they Many people voted for him because they believed him when he said, "On day one, believed him when he said, "On day one, believed him when he said, "On day one, he was going to start lowering costs."

he was going to start lowering costs." he was going to start lowering costs." And right now, inflation's higher than And right now, inflation's higher than And right now, inflation's higher than it was the day he took over. it was the day he took over. it was the day he took over. So, these promises weren't true, So, these promises weren't true, So, these promises weren't true, but they spoke to something that I think but they spoke to something that I think but they spoke to something that I think a lot of people had on their mind that a lot of people had on their mind that a lot of people had on their mind that that made a lot of people willing to that made a lot of people willing to that made a lot of people willing to burn things down. burn things down. burn things down. And there's a lesson for my party in And there's a lesson for my party in And there's a lesson for my party in that. I'm obviously passionately against that. I'm obviously passionately against that. I'm obviously passionately against many destructive things that he's doing. many destructive things that he's doing. many destructive things that he's doing. That doesn't mean the answer is to That doesn't mean the answer is to That doesn't mean the answer is to quote-unquote reverse the damage, put quote-unquote reverse the damage, put quote-unquote reverse the damage, put everything back the way it was. everything back the way it was. everything back the way it was. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. Because I you're right that that the Because I you're right that that the Because I you're right that that the Democrats have a lot of responsibility Democrats have a lot of responsibility Democrats have a lot of responsibility here. here. here. Um for a lot of reasons. I think the Um for a lot of reasons. I think the Um for a lot of reasons. I think the very fact that Trump was voted into very fact that Trump was voted into very fact that Trump was voted into power says something about how people power says something about how people power says something about how people felt with the previous administration, felt with the previous administration, felt with the previous administration, which was a Democratic administration. which was a Democratic administration. which was a Democratic administration. What responsibility does the Democratic What responsibility does the Democratic What responsibility does the Democratic Party have for getting the country to a Party have for getting the country to a Party have for getting the country to a place where they thought Democrats place where they thought Democrats place where they thought Democrats weren't the solution? weren't the solution? weren't the solution? Because that's kind of I think a lot of Because that's kind of I think a lot of Because that's kind of I think a lot of people thought that's just like more of people thought that's just like more of people thought that's just like more of the same. Yeah. the same. Yeah. the same. Yeah. Maybe Maybe Maybe people are getting increasingly I think people are getting increasingly I think people are getting increasingly I think across the Western world by the looks of across the Western world by the looks of across the Western world by the looks of it increasingly tired with like it increasingly tired with like it increasingly tired with like politicians politicians politicians saying these like cute words and like saying these like cute words and like saying these like cute words and like we're going to help the working people we're going to help the working people we're going to help the working people and blah blah blah blah and being very and blah blah blah blah and being very and blah blah blah blah and being very polished and then you see this these polished and then you see this these polished and then you see this these other figures that have come in and said other figures that have come in and said other figures that have come in and said I'm not a politician. Yeah. And as you I'm not a politician. Yeah. And as you I'm not a politician. Yeah. And as you say, I'm going to burn it down. And for say, I'm going to burn it down. And for say, I'm going to burn it down. And for some reason people are choosing that.

some reason people are choosing that. some reason people are choosing that. >> Yeah. Even though when they do usually >> Yeah. Even though when they do usually >> Yeah. Even though when they do usually that person makes it worse and so that's that person makes it worse and so that's that person makes it worse and so that's why the president's unpopular. But the why the president's unpopular. But the why the president's unpopular. But the president is unpopular. To your point, president is unpopular. To your point, president is unpopular. To your point, that doesn't mean people are that doesn't mean people are that doesn't mean people are automatically going to trust Democrats. automatically going to trust Democrats. automatically going to trust Democrats. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Right? Uh so I mean the answer to your >> Right? Uh so I mean the answer to your >> Right? Uh so I mean the answer to your question is yes, Democrats have a question is yes, Democrats have a question is yes, Democrats have a responsibility responsibility responsibility to present something that is better not to present something that is better not to present something that is better not just better than now, but it's got to be just better than now, but it's got to be just better than now, but it's got to be better than before. The fact remains a better than before. The fact remains a better than before. The fact remains a lot of these results have unfolded on lot of these results have unfolded on lot of these results have unfolded on you know, kind of regardless of who's in you know, kind of regardless of who's in you know, kind of regardless of who's in power. power. power. >> Are you going to run to be president in >> Are you going to run to be president in >> Are you going to run to be president in 2028? 2028? 2028? >> I don't know. Um >> I don't know. Um >> I don't know. Um I would have to believe and this is how I would have to believe and this is how I would have to believe and this is how I've approached every every time I've I've approached every every time I've I've approached every every time I've decided to run for office. decided to run for office. decided to run for office. It's It's It's looking at everything that the office looking at everything that the office looking at everything that the office seems like it needs seems like it needs seems like it needs not just generally but in that moment. not just generally but in that moment. not just generally but in that moment. And then looking at what I bring to the And then looking at what I bring to the And then looking at what I bring to the table and asking myself, okay, am I table and asking myself, okay, am I table and asking myself, okay, am I bringing something that's different bringing something that's different bringing something that's different enough from what others are bringing enough from what others are bringing enough from what others are bringing and that fits like that moment. Like and that fits like that moment. Like and that fits like that moment. Like that's what led me to run for mayor that's what led me to run for mayor that's what led me to run for mayor which is a pretty unlikely move in in which is a pretty unlikely move in in which is a pretty unlikely move in in South Bend, Indiana when I was in my South Bend, Indiana when I was in my South Bend, Indiana when I was in my 20s.

20s. 20s. It's what led me to run for president It's what led me to run for president It's what led me to run for president when I did almost eight years ago now. when I did almost eight years ago now. when I did almost eight years ago now. >> Oh, you're in what's here? Secretary. Um >> Oh, you're in what's here? Secretary. Um >> Oh, you're in what's here? Secretary. Um you said politics often favors someone you said politics often favors someone you said politics often favors someone who is completely different to the who is completely different to the who is completely different to the current leader. current leader. current leader. And that you could not be more different And that you could not be more different And that you could not be more different from Trump. from Trump. from Trump. I quote, an intellectual young I quote, an intellectual young I quote, an intellectual young gay mayor from the Midwest. gay mayor from the Midwest. gay mayor from the Midwest. You know, Amazon have this really You know, Amazon have this really You know, Amazon have this really interesting thing when they hire people interesting thing when they hire people interesting thing when they hire people um which we've copied. They every time um which we've copied. They every time um which we've copied. They every time you meet someone you have to vote one of you meet someone you have to vote one of you meet someone you have to vote one of four things. You either vote strongly four things. You either vote strongly four things. You either vote strongly not inclined, not inclined, not inclined, not inclined, not inclined, not inclined, inclined, inclined, inclined, and strongly inclined. So, you've got and strongly inclined. So, you've got and strongly inclined. So, you've got four options when you interview someone. four options when you interview someone. four options when you interview someone. We do the same in our company now. We We do the same in our company now. We We do the same in our company now. We took it from them. And the whole idea took it from them. And the whole idea took it from them. And the whole idea here is to prevent people from sitting here is to prevent people from sitting here is to prevent people from sitting on the fence, which is like what is your on the fence, which is like what is your on the fence, which is like what is your inclination? inclination? inclination? So, if I presented you with those four So, if I presented you with those four So, if I presented you with those four options as it relates to you running for options as it relates to you running for options as it relates to you running for president in 2020 as things stand, and president in 2020 as things stand, and president in 2020 as things stand, and this is just a balance of probability, this is just a balance of probability, this is just a balance of probability, are you inclined, are you inclined, are you inclined, not inclined, strongly not inclined, not inclined, strongly not inclined, not inclined, strongly not inclined, strongly inclined? strongly inclined? strongly inclined? >> Um >> Um >> Um >> On these podcasts, nobody ever tells the >> On these podcasts, nobody ever tells the >> On these podcasts, nobody ever tells the bloody truth. This is why it's difficult bloody truth. This is why it's difficult bloody truth. This is why it's difficult sometimes to interview politicians, cuz sometimes to interview politicians, cuz sometimes to interview politicians, cuz we all have an inclination, right?

we all have an inclination, right? we all have an inclination, right? >> Yeah, I mean, one of the reasons why I >> Yeah, I mean, one of the reasons why I >> Yeah, I mean, one of the reasons why I hesitate to to talk in those terms is hesitate to to talk in those terms is hesitate to to talk in those terms is because you know that like people are because you know that like people are because you know that like people are going to run with it and it'll be this going to run with it and it'll be this going to run with it and it'll be this like news of the day thing and it'll, like news of the day thing and it'll, like news of the day thing and it'll, you know, it'll kind of dominate the you know, it'll kind of dominate the you know, it'll kind of dominate the next couple of days when you're trying next couple of days when you're trying next couple of days when you're trying to talk about something else. But to talk about something else. But to talk about something else. But >> Does the truth just not matter more >> Does the truth just not matter more >> Does the truth just not matter more though than the consequence of the truth though than the consequence of the truth though than the consequence of the truth in this regard? in this regard? in this regard? >> Yeah, but the truth about like what you >> Yeah, but the truth about like what you >> Yeah, but the truth about like what you know, what I'm maybe going to do like know, what I'm maybe going to do like know, what I'm maybe going to do like there's a there's a level of like not there's a there's a level of like not there's a there's a level of like not even being certain even being certain even being certain some of the things I'll have to weigh. some of the things I'll have to weigh. some of the things I'll have to weigh. Like before having made a decision like Like before having made a decision like Like before having made a decision like this before, this before, this before, I can tell you that there's I can tell you that there's I can tell you that there's the read the read the read >> I need to the inclination. >> I need to the inclination. >> I need to the inclination. >> Like I'm I'm obviously not to one end or >> Like I'm I'm obviously not to one end or >> Like I'm I'm obviously not to one end or the other. the other. the other. >> Yeah, okay. So, you're not those two. >> Yeah, okay. So, you're not those two. >> Yeah, okay. So, you're not those two. >> I think I'm >> I think I'm >> I think I'm like more inclined than not. like more inclined than not. like more inclined than not. >> Okay. Then >> Okay. Then >> Okay. Then I appreciate I appreciate I appreciate >> Um >> Um >> Um But there's so much we don't know. But there's so much we don't know. But there's so much we don't know. There's so much I don't even know about There's so much I don't even know about There's so much I don't even know about what's going to happen this year, let what's going to happen this year, let what's going to happen this year, let alone you know, what we need to know alone you know, what we need to know alone you know, what we need to know later. later. later. Um Um Um And this is not And this is not And this is not you know, the weight of a decision like you know, the weight of a decision like you know, the weight of a decision like that. And I don't just mean like the that. And I don't just mean like the that. And I don't just mean like the national political weight, but just like national political weight, but just like national political weight, but just like the weight of a decision to run for the weight of a decision to run for the weight of a decision to run for office for you and your family, office for you and your family, office for you and your family, which frankly I did not fully understand which frankly I did not fully understand which frankly I did not fully understand but until I had kids. Uh that's changed but until I had kids. Uh that's changed but until I had kids. Uh that's changed all of my equations.

all of my equations. all of my equations. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> Um it it's just something that you >> Um it it's just something that you >> Um it it's just something that you really sit with and take seriously. At really sit with and take seriously. At really sit with and take seriously. At least you you should. least you you should. least you you should. >> One of the big things that people are >> One of the big things that people are >> One of the big things that people are talking about at this moment in time is talking about at this moment in time is talking about at this moment in time is the Iran war. Yeah. And this feeds into the Iran war. Yeah. And this feeds into the Iran war. Yeah. And this feeds into some of the points we were touching on some of the points we were touching on some of the points we were touching on around promises kept and not kept. around promises kept and not kept. around promises kept and not kept. What is going on What is going on What is going on in plain terms? Cuz Americans are in plain terms? Cuz Americans are in plain terms? Cuz Americans are getting lots of messages. We've getting lots of messages. We've getting lots of messages. We've destroyed everything in Iran, the destroyed everything in Iran, the destroyed everything in Iran, the military bases are all gone, and then military bases are all gone, and then military bases are all gone, and then we're back at war and American lives we're back at war and American lives we're back at war and American lives have have been taken. have have been taken. have have been taken. >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> Can you help us see through all of this? >> Can you help us see through all of this? >> Can you help us see through all of this? >> I think what's going on is the president >> I think what's going on is the president >> I think what's going on is the president has painted himself and the country into has painted himself and the country into has painted himself and the country into a corner. a corner. a corner. There was a a moment where it seemed to There was a a moment where it seemed to There was a a moment where it seemed to him that he was better off politically him that he was better off politically him that he was better off politically if we were at war. if we were at war. if we were at war. Even though he promised that we wouldn't Even though he promised that we wouldn't Even though he promised that we wouldn't be, even though a lot of his supporters be, even though a lot of his supporters be, even though a lot of his supporters didn't want the war, and certainly the didn't want the war, and certainly the didn't want the war, and certainly the the American people as a whole don't the American people as a whole don't the American people as a whole don't want it. But, he was under a lot of heat want it. But, he was under a lot of heat want it. But, he was under a lot of heat over cost of living, over cost of living, over cost of living, over the Epstein files, which was over the Epstein files, which was over the Epstein files, which was dominating the conversation every day, dominating the conversation every day, dominating the conversation every day, being proven to be as connected to an being proven to be as connected to an being proven to be as connected to an infamous pedophile infamous pedophile infamous pedophile as Jeffrey Epstein, and then doing as Jeffrey Epstein, and then doing as Jeffrey Epstein, and then doing everything he could to cover up everything he could to cover up everything he could to cover up disclosures about it, right? This is disclosures about it, right? This is disclosures about it, right? This is something that obviously was something something that obviously was something something that obviously was something that was creating a ton of heat on the that was creating a ton of heat on the that was creating a ton of heat on the president. Meanwhile, there's a lot of president. Meanwhile, there's a lot of president. Meanwhile, there's a lot of people in his ear every day, people in his ear every day, people in his ear every day, and some of them, from American and some of them, from American and some of them, from American politicians to people around the world, politicians to people around the world, politicians to people around the world, would really like to see him go to war.

would really like to see him go to war. would really like to see him go to war. >> Why? >> Well, it's kind of the tradition of the >> Well, it's kind of the tradition of the Republican Party is to generally be more Republican Party is to generally be more Republican Party is to generally be more pro-war, right? That's I mean, that you pro-war, right? That's I mean, that you pro-war, right? That's I mean, that you know, my coming of age was at the time know, my coming of age was at the time know, my coming of age was at the time of the Iraq war. of the Iraq war. of the Iraq war. In fact, a big part of what kind of In fact, a big part of what kind of In fact, a big part of what kind of pulled me fully into politics was being pulled me fully into politics was being pulled me fully into politics was being opposed to the Iraq war. opposed to the Iraq war. opposed to the Iraq war. >> One of the things that a lot of people >> One of the things that a lot of people >> One of the things that a lot of people won't know about you is that you did won't know about you is that you did won't know about you is that you did actually go and serve actually go and serve actually go and serve your country. I got some photos of you your country. I got some photos of you your country. I got some photos of you here serving. And I think got your here serving. And I think got your here serving. And I think got your parents I think post Afghanistan as parents I think post Afghanistan as parents I think post Afghanistan as well. well. well. >> Yeah, so the day I got back. >> Yeah, so the day I got back. >> Yeah, so the day I got back. >> I just think it's important for people >> I just think it's important for people >> I just think it's important for people to know that you can speak to this quite to know that you can speak to this quite to know that you can speak to this quite accurately having served your country. accurately having served your country. accurately having served your country. >> Yeah, man. I know what it feels like to >> Yeah, man. I know what it feels like to >> Yeah, man. I know what it feels like to get on a get on a get on a gray tail airplane that's taking you gray tail airplane that's taking you gray tail airplane that's taking you into a war zone and and wondering what's into a war zone and and wondering what's into a war zone and and wondering what's waiting for you there. Where we are now waiting for you there. Where we are now waiting for you there. Where we are now is a lot of troops are in that is a lot of troops are in that is a lot of troops are in that situation. They're in harm's way. situation. They're in harm's way. situation. They're in harm's way. And And And the president doesn't seem to have a the president doesn't seem to have a the president doesn't seem to have a plan. He can't explain why we're there. plan. He can't explain why we're there. plan. He can't explain why we're there. He's said it's for regime change. He's He's said it's for regime change. He's He's said it's for regime change. He's said it's for unconditional surrender. said it's for unconditional surrender. said it's for unconditional surrender. He's said that it's to get deal with He's said that it's to get deal with He's said that it's to get deal with their nuclear program, but last year he their nuclear program, but last year he their nuclear program, but last year he said they obliterated the nuclear said they obliterated the nuclear said they obliterated the nuclear program.

program. program. And so it And so it And so it does a lot of reasons to suspect that does a lot of reasons to suspect that does a lot of reasons to suspect that we're just at war cuz he wanted us to we're just at war cuz he wanted us to we're just at war cuz he wanted us to be. be. be. And now he can't figure out how to get And now he can't figure out how to get And now he can't figure out how to get us out of it. us out of it. us out of it. And it appears that any way forward And it appears that any way forward And it appears that any way forward leaves us worse off leaves us worse off leaves us worse off than we were before the war. than we were before the war. than we were before the war. Prices are higher. Prices are higher. Prices are higher. Troops have lost their lives. Troops have lost their lives. Troops have lost their lives. And it seems like the least bad options And it seems like the least bad options And it seems like the least bad options still involve Iran having more control still involve Iran having more control still involve Iran having more control over the Strait of Hormuz than they were over the Strait of Hormuz than they were over the Strait of Hormuz than they were asserting. But here we go. Most asserting. But here we go. Most asserting. But here we go. Most Americans shouldn't have to be worrying Americans shouldn't have to be worrying Americans shouldn't have to be worrying about the Strait of Hormuz. They got about the Strait of Hormuz. They got about the Strait of Hormuz. They got enough to worry about. enough to worry about. enough to worry about. And a year ago we weren't. That was not And a year ago we weren't. That was not And a year ago we weren't. That was not a problem. Whatever was going on in the a problem. Whatever was going on in the a problem. Whatever was going on in the Strait of Hormuz did not feel like it Strait of Hormuz did not feel like it Strait of Hormuz did not feel like it was a problem. was a problem. was a problem. You know, where I live in Michigan. And You know, where I live in Michigan. And You know, where I live in Michigan. And now it is. now it is. now it is. >> Why though? What What was the like >> Why though? What What was the like >> Why though? What What was the like domino effect that caused him to go, domino effect that caused him to go, domino effect that caused him to go, "You know what? "You know what? "You know what? I think we can just go in there, I think we can just go in there, I think we can just go in there, decapitate the leader decapitate the leader decapitate the leader >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> and and that's victory." >> and and that's victory." >> and and that's victory." >> Obviously this is a question for the >> Obviously this is a question for the >> Obviously this is a question for the president, but honestly president, but honestly president, but honestly I don't fully understand why they would I don't fully understand why they would I don't fully understand why they would do something like this, especially do something like this, especially do something like this, especially because we know because we know because we know like you didn't have to be like an like you didn't have to be like an like you didn't have to be like an expert in international affairs and expert in international affairs and expert in international affairs and security studies to know security studies to know security studies to know if we actually attacked Iran if we actually attacked Iran if we actually attacked Iran they were going to shut down the Strait they were going to shut down the Strait they were going to shut down the Strait and try to the world economy.

and try to the world economy. and try to the world economy. The It was literally the most obvious The It was literally the most obvious The It was literally the most obvious next thing that could happen. next thing that could happen. next thing that could happen. And yet it seems like And yet it seems like And yet it seems like he either didn't understand or didn't he either didn't understand or didn't he either didn't understand or didn't believe. Surely he was told this. We believe. Surely he was told this. We believe. Surely he was told this. We know in fact it's been reported that he know in fact it's been reported that he know in fact it's been reported that he was told this. was told this. was told this. And he did it anyway. And he did it anyway. And he did it anyway. So, how does that happen? I mean, I have So, how does that happen? I mean, I have So, how does that happen? I mean, I have long given up trying to see into the long given up trying to see into the long given up trying to see into the mind of this president. mind of this president. mind of this president. >> Dare I say, if you are president in >> Dare I say, if you are president in >> Dare I say, if you are president in 2028, this could be your responsibility 2028, this could be your responsibility 2028, this could be your responsibility to resolve. to resolve. to resolve. >> I mean, >> I mean, >> I mean, I really hope that the next president I really hope that the next president I really hope that the next president isn't facing this war dragging on into isn't facing this war dragging on into isn't facing this war dragging on into 2029, but I mean, yeah, one thing we 2029, but I mean, yeah, one thing we 2029, but I mean, yeah, one thing we have learned is that it is harder to have learned is that it is harder to have learned is that it is harder to stop a war than it is to start one, stop a war than it is to start one, stop a war than it is to start one, which is why if you have any other which is why if you have any other which is why if you have any other reasonable choice, you don't start one. reasonable choice, you don't start one. reasonable choice, you don't start one. >> So, what are you going to do if you are >> So, what are you going to do if you are >> So, what are you going to do if you are president? president? president? >> Look, the next president will face a >> Look, the next president will face a >> Look, the next president will face a complicated, violent, complicated, violent, complicated, violent, and challenging Middle East and world and challenging Middle East and world and challenging Middle East and world map, no matter what. map, no matter what. map, no matter what. And the next president's going to have And the next president's going to have And the next president's going to have to deal with that to deal with that to deal with that while dealing with a more assertive while dealing with a more assertive while dealing with a more assertive China, China, China, and a and a and a dramatically, swiftly evolving security dramatically, swiftly evolving security dramatically, swiftly evolving security landscape, partly because of things like landscape, partly because of things like landscape, partly because of things like AI.

AI. AI. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> But just as you and I are sitting here >> But just as you and I are sitting here >> But just as you and I are sitting here now, there's a lot of headlines about a now, there's a lot of headlines about a now, there's a lot of headlines about a big safety issue created by an AI model big safety issue created by an AI model big safety issue created by an AI model that was supposed to not even be able to that was supposed to not even be able to that was supposed to not even be able to access the internet, managing to get access the internet, managing to get access the internet, managing to get itself on the internet and hack into itself on the internet and hack into itself on the internet and hack into another company to get the answers to a another company to get the answers to a another company to get the answers to a test that it was told to solve, right? test that it was told to solve, right? test that it was told to solve, right? And that's as of today And that's as of today And that's as of today in 2026. The things that could be going in 2026. The things that could be going in 2026. The things that could be going on by 2029 on by 2029 on by 2029 are surely going to change are surely going to change are surely going to change both what we're up against and what's both what we're up against and what's both what we're up against and what's possible. possible. possible. Look, in the same way that there was a Look, in the same way that there was a Look, in the same way that there was a nuclear hotline between Washington and nuclear hotline between Washington and nuclear hotline between Washington and Moscow, Moscow, Moscow, because it turns out because it turns out because it turns out even while at each other's throats in a even while at each other's throats in a even while at each other's throats in a lot of ways, one thing that lot of ways, one thing that lot of ways, one thing that Americans and Soviets didn't want was to Americans and Soviets didn't want was to Americans and Soviets didn't want was to incinerate the planet. incinerate the planet. incinerate the planet. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> There's going to have to be some way for >> There's going to have to be some way for >> There's going to have to be some way for countries that do not trust each other countries that do not trust each other countries that do not trust each other on things like making sure AI doesn't on things like making sure AI doesn't on things like making sure AI doesn't lead to bio weapons being made by rogue lead to bio weapons being made by rogue lead to bio weapons being made by rogue actors or even individual actors. actors or even individual actors. actors or even individual actors. Making sure that it doesn't lead to Making sure that it doesn't lead to Making sure that it doesn't lead to nuclear proliferation or any number of nuclear proliferation or any number of nuclear proliferation or any number of other problems, right? That could other problems, right? That could other problems, right? That could happen. So, the security picture I think happen. So, the security picture I think happen. So, the security picture I think will be more challenging for the next will be more challenging for the next will be more challenging for the next president than it's been for president than it's been for president than it's been for any president since the Cold War.

any president since the Cold War. any president since the Cold War. >> So, what kind of president in terms of >> So, what kind of president in terms of >> So, what kind of president in terms of mentality or character experience do you mentality or character experience do you mentality or character experience do you think can meet those challenges? think can meet those challenges? think can meet those challenges? >> Well, you need somebody who's deliberate >> Well, you need somebody who's deliberate >> Well, you need somebody who's deliberate and decisive. and decisive. and decisive. Uh those two things sometimes are in Uh those two things sometimes are in Uh those two things sometimes are in tension because deliberation means you tension because deliberation means you tension because deliberation means you slow down, you look at what's going on, slow down, you look at what's going on, slow down, you look at what's going on, and you think about it. and you think about it. and you think about it. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> But, decisive doesn't mean that you >> But, decisive doesn't mean that you >> But, decisive doesn't mean that you immediately make a call every time a immediately make a call every time a immediately make a call every time a question is put to you. It does mean question is put to you. It does mean question is put to you. It does mean that you once you feel like you've got that you once you feel like you've got that you once you feel like you've got enough information, enough information, enough information, you make a decision, you own the you make a decision, you own the you make a decision, you own the consequences of that decision, you move consequences of that decision, you move consequences of that decision, you move on to the next decision. on to the next decision. on to the next decision. And I think in terms of kind of And I think in terms of kind of And I think in terms of kind of character and style, we're going to need character and style, we're going to need character and style, we're going to need both of those things. We're going to both of those things. We're going to both of those things. We're going to need wisdom, we're going to need need wisdom, we're going to need need wisdom, we're going to need judgment. judgment. judgment. And we're going to need judgment that is And we're going to need judgment that is And we're going to need judgment that is not twisted or changed or colored or um not twisted or changed or colored or um not twisted or changed or colored or um biased biased biased based on based on based on corrupt reasons. And the reason I corrupt reasons. And the reason I corrupt reasons. And the reason I mention that is because right now mention that is because right now mention that is because right now we've got for the first time ever out of we've got for the first time ever out of we've got for the first time ever out of all of our presidents all of our presidents all of our presidents uh uh uh a president whose family is making a president whose family is making a president whose family is making billions of dollars billions of dollars billions of dollars from things that are sometimes directly from things that are sometimes directly from things that are sometimes directly connected to the decision connected to the decision connected to the decision of a foreign government. Right? Uh there of a foreign government. Right? Uh there of a foreign government. Right? Uh there was one government in the Middle East was one government in the Middle East was one government in the Middle East that put hundreds of millions of dollars that put hundreds of millions of dollars that put hundreds of millions of dollars into the family crypto fund of this into the family crypto fund of this into the family crypto fund of this president.

president. president. You got Saudi Arabia investing in the You got Saudi Arabia investing in the You got Saudi Arabia investing in the first family's business interests to the first family's business interests to the first family's business interests to the tune of I believe a couple of billion tune of I believe a couple of billion tune of I believe a couple of billion dollars for the president's son-in-law, dollars for the president's son-in-law, dollars for the president's son-in-law, right? right? right? And we just can't afford with everything And we just can't afford with everything And we just can't afford with everything that's on the line right now that's on the line right now that's on the line right now to have the next president be to have the next president be to have the next president be someone who could remotely be influenced someone who could remotely be influenced someone who could remotely be influenced by those kinds of considerations given by those kinds of considerations given by those kinds of considerations given everything that's on the line for the everything that's on the line for the everything that's on the line for the American people and for American American people and for American American people and for American security. security. security. >> When you look at that the picture um in >> When you look at that the picture um in >> When you look at that the picture um in Iran, it's all well and good saying we Iran, it's all well and good saying we Iran, it's all well and good saying we have to uh we have to get out of there, have to uh we have to get out of there, have to uh we have to get out of there, but how? but how? but how? >> No, the only good way to do it is to not >> No, the only good way to do it is to not >> No, the only good way to do it is to not be there in the first place. Yes, it's be there in the first place. Yes, it's be there in the first place. Yes, it's too late for that. And so, as is often too late for that. And so, as is often too late for that. And so, as is often the case in difficult decisions that the case in difficult decisions that the case in difficult decisions that executives face, it will be finding the executives face, it will be finding the executives face, it will be finding the least bad combination of options, which least bad combination of options, which least bad combination of options, which probably means engaging a lot of other probably means engaging a lot of other probably means engaging a lot of other countries, a lot of regional partners, countries, a lot of regional partners, countries, a lot of regional partners, uh a lot of allies. Now again, the next uh a lot of allies. Now again, the next uh a lot of allies. Now again, the next president will be doing this at a big president will be doing this at a big president will be doing this at a big disadvantage disadvantage disadvantage because because because so many relationships with our allies so many relationships with our allies so many relationships with our allies have been burned.

have been burned. have been burned. It turns out you you build relationships It turns out you you build relationships It turns out you you build relationships with allies not just out of friendliness with allies not just out of friendliness with allies not just out of friendliness or cuz it's neat. or cuz it's neat. or cuz it's neat. You do it cuz you're going to need each You do it cuz you're going to need each You do it cuz you're going to need each other someday. And the worse something other someday. And the worse something other someday. And the worse something is, the more difficult a problem. It's is, the more difficult a problem. It's is, the more difficult a problem. It's just like life. just like life. just like life. You know, the times I'm quickest to call You know, the times I'm quickest to call You know, the times I'm quickest to call a friend are the times when I'm hurting a friend are the times when I'm hurting a friend are the times when I'm hurting the most or feel like I I I need help the most or feel like I I I need help the most or feel like I I I need help the most. Same is true for countries. the most. Same is true for countries. the most. Same is true for countries. The tougher your situation, the more you The tougher your situation, the more you The tougher your situation, the more you got to have friends you can count on. We got to have friends you can count on. We got to have friends you can count on. We are in a very tough situation in Iran. are in a very tough situation in Iran. are in a very tough situation in Iran. We will be for a long time. We need our We will be for a long time. We need our We will be for a long time. We need our friends. friends. friends. >> Cuz you know, you're dealing with a lot >> Cuz you know, you're dealing with a lot >> Cuz you know, you're dealing with a lot of um dare I say very large ego leaders of um dare I say very large ego leaders of um dare I say very large ego leaders around the world. around the world. around the world. You got your Putins. I don't even know You got your Putins. I don't even know You got your Putins. I don't even know who's running around at the moment. Then who's running around at the moment. Then who's running around at the moment. Then you've got China. you've got China. you've got China. Um Um Um does it need a leader with a ego of the does it need a leader with a ego of the does it need a leader with a ego of the same size? same size? same size? You cuz I sometimes I think like I I I You cuz I sometimes I think like I I I You cuz I sometimes I think like I I I think crazy people kind of respect crazy think crazy people kind of respect crazy think crazy people kind of respect crazy people. people. people. You know, in which way? You know, in which way? You know, in which way? >> I think a lot of different ways to deal >> I think a lot of different ways to deal >> I think a lot of different ways to deal with people like that. with people like that. with people like that. But I think the the most useful is to But I think the the most useful is to But I think the the most useful is to earn a level of credibility.

earn a level of credibility. earn a level of credibility. And when we're talking with allies, a And when we're talking with allies, a And when we're talking with allies, a level of trust. level of trust. level of trust. When you're talking with adversaries, When you're talking with adversaries, When you're talking with adversaries, it's maybe not the same thing as trust, it's maybe not the same thing as trust, it's maybe not the same thing as trust, but it is credibility. That when you say but it is credibility. That when you say but it is credibility. That when you say you're going to do something or you seem you're going to do something or you seem you're going to do something or you seem like you're going to do something, like you're going to do something, like you're going to do something, you're going to do it. you're going to do it. you're going to do it. It means less energy gets wasted on It means less energy gets wasted on It means less energy gets wasted on guesswork. guesswork. guesswork. And it means you have just a little more And it means you have just a little more And it means you have just a little more stability. I think something all of us stability. I think something all of us stability. I think something all of us are looking for in the world right now are looking for in the world right now are looking for in the world right now is for it to just be a little more is for it to just be a little more is for it to just be a little more stable. stable. stable. And And And by the way, the way to do that is not to by the way, the way to do that is not to by the way, the way to do that is not to like rewind and imagine that we can make like rewind and imagine that we can make like rewind and imagine that we can make the world look the way it looked in the world look the way it looked in the world look the way it looked in the '90s or the '50s. It's not like the '90s or the '50s. It's not like the '90s or the '50s. It's not like that. We're going to have to find new that. We're going to have to find new that. We're going to have to find new ways to create a stable future. ways to create a stable future. ways to create a stable future. But But But look, there there are as many different look, there there are as many different look, there there are as many different kinds of personalities in world leaders kinds of personalities in world leaders kinds of personalities in world leaders and presidents as there are, you know, and presidents as there are, you know, and presidents as there are, you know, in humanity in general. But it'll need in humanity in general. But it'll need in humanity in general. But it'll need to be somebody who, like I said, is to be somebody who, like I said, is to be somebody who, like I said, is deliberate and decisive, tough and fair, deliberate and decisive, tough and fair, deliberate and decisive, tough and fair, and credible. and credible. and credible. >> Yeah, the the the Iran situation is >> Yeah, the the the Iran situation is >> Yeah, the the the Iran situation is particularly particularly particularly particularly uncertain for many reasons.

particularly uncertain for many reasons. particularly uncertain for many reasons. In part because I don't know who the In part because I don't know who the In part because I don't know who the leadership there is anymore. In part leadership there is anymore. In part leadership there is anymore. In part because they it seems like they will now because they it seems like they will now because they it seems like they will now control the Strait of Hormuz, or at control the Strait of Hormuz, or at control the Strait of Hormuz, or at least use it as leverage, really least use it as leverage, really least use it as leverage, really respective of what outcome takes place. respective of what outcome takes place. respective of what outcome takes place. And in part because you still have this And in part because you still have this And in part because you still have this nuclear threat. nuclear threat. nuclear threat. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um but they are probably now more >> Um but they are probably now more >> Um but they are probably now more motivated to develop nuclear weapons motivated to develop nuclear weapons motivated to develop nuclear weapons than they probably were under Obama when than they probably were under Obama when than they probably were under Obama when he signed that he signed that he signed that that agreement with them. that agreement with them. that agreement with them. >> Yes, they may have less capacity, but >> Yes, they may have less capacity, but >> Yes, they may have less capacity, but they certainly have more motivation at they certainly have more motivation at they certainly have more motivation at this point. this point. this point. >> Would you let them develop nuclear >> Would you let them develop nuclear >> Would you let them develop nuclear weapons if you were president? weapons if you were president? weapons if you were president? >> No. They should not be allowed to have >> No. They should not be allowed to have >> No. They should not be allowed to have nuclear weapons. Uh a nuclear-armed nuclear weapons. Uh a nuclear-armed nuclear weapons. Uh a nuclear-armed Iran, I mean, look at the malevolent Iran, I mean, look at the malevolent Iran, I mean, look at the malevolent activities that they already have activities that they already have activities that they already have pursued with conventional means, pursued with conventional means, pursued with conventional means, terrorist groups around the region, terrorist groups around the region, terrorist groups around the region, around the world. Like this is not a around the world. Like this is not a around the world. Like this is not a regime, regime, regime, certainly not in its current form or certainly not in its current form or certainly not in its current form or anything resembling its current form, anything resembling its current form, anything resembling its current form, that could ever be trusted with nuclear that could ever be trusted with nuclear that could ever be trusted with nuclear weapons. No. weapons. No. weapons. No. Different presidents, each of the last Different presidents, each of the last Different presidents, each of the last few presidents, had a way of making sure few presidents, had a way of making sure few presidents, had a way of making sure that that never happened. that that never happened. that that never happened. The best way to do that was through The best way to do that was through The best way to do that was through diplomacy. That was the whole point of diplomacy. That was the whole point of diplomacy. That was the whole point of the Obama deal.

the Obama deal. the Obama deal. The first Trump administration tore up The first Trump administration tore up The first Trump administration tore up the Obama deal, the Obama deal, the Obama deal, but couldn't get a better deal. And but couldn't get a better deal. And but couldn't get a better deal. And then, when the Biden administration was then, when the Biden administration was then, when the Biden administration was trying to get a better deal. trying to get a better deal. trying to get a better deal. It was very hard to work across the It was very hard to work across the It was very hard to work across the table to get the Iranians to negotiate table to get the Iranians to negotiate table to get the Iranians to negotiate because they remembered that it was because they remembered that it was because they remembered that it was Trump who tore up the Obama deal, right? Trump who tore up the Obama deal, right? Trump who tore up the Obama deal, right? It's part of what I mean when I talk It's part of what I mean when I talk It's part of what I mean when I talk about credibility. It doesn't mean that about credibility. It doesn't mean that about credibility. It doesn't mean that people across the table have to like people across the table have to like people across the table have to like you. you. you. It means they have to have some sense It means they have to have some sense It means they have to have some sense that it's at least worth dealing with that it's at least worth dealing with that it's at least worth dealing with you, right? you, right? you, right? And there's not a lot of that given that And there's not a lot of that given that And there's not a lot of that given that kind of instability, that pattern that kind of instability, that pattern that kind of instability, that pattern that we face. You know, I followed American we face. You know, I followed American we face. You know, I followed American politics I think since I was about 10. politics I think since I was about 10. politics I think since I was about 10. One of the things I've never heard One of the things I've never heard One of the things I've never heard mentioned so much in politics is mentioned so much in politics is mentioned so much in politics is Israel. Mhm. It appears to me as a Israel. Mhm. It appears to me as a Israel. Mhm. It appears to me as a objective observer that the subject of objective observer that the subject of objective observer that the subject of Israel is now so central to politics. Israel is now so central to politics. Israel is now so central to politics. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Why? >> Why? >> Why? What's going on with the the US's What's going on with the the US's What's going on with the the US's relationship with Israel and the public relationship with Israel and the public relationship with Israel and the public sentiment towards Israel? sentiment towards Israel? sentiment towards Israel? >> Well, it's getting a lot of attention >> Well, it's getting a lot of attention >> Well, it's getting a lot of attention because many very important things are because many very important things are because many very important things are at stake and they've been put into at stake and they've been put into at stake and they've been put into conflict with each other. conflict with each other. conflict with each other. Right.

Right. Right. And each of those things is a valid And each of those things is a valid And each of those things is a valid thing, at least in my opinion. And then thing, at least in my opinion. And then thing, at least in my opinion. And then I'll name three. One, which has become I'll name three. One, which has become I'll name three. One, which has become very challenging for many Jewish very challenging for many Jewish very challenging for many Jewish Americans, is the safety of Jews around Americans, is the safety of Jews around Americans, is the safety of Jews around the world and in America. the world and in America. the world and in America. Theoretically, that could be separated Theoretically, that could be separated Theoretically, that could be separated from what's happening in Israel and from what's happening in Israel and from what's happening in Israel and Palestine. But in the real world, Palestine. But in the real world, Palestine. But in the real world, there's been a relationship there's been a relationship there's been a relationship between between what's going on there between between what's going on there between between what's going on there and an explosion in anti-Semitism that and an explosion in anti-Semitism that and an explosion in anti-Semitism that has many American Jewish families afraid has many American Jewish families afraid has many American Jewish families afraid for their safety. Another thing for their safety. Another thing for their safety. Another thing is the is the is the safety and dignity of Palestinian people safety and dignity of Palestinian people safety and dignity of Palestinian people who in Gaza, but not only in Gaza, who in Gaza, but not only in Gaza, who in Gaza, but not only in Gaza, have been subjected to horrific violence have been subjected to horrific violence have been subjected to horrific violence and in my opinion, war crimes. and in my opinion, war crimes. and in my opinion, war crimes. And alongside that, And alongside that, And alongside that, there is the safety and dignity of there is the safety and dignity of there is the safety and dignity of people in Israel people in Israel people in Israel who we have a security relationship with who we have a security relationship with who we have a security relationship with as a country and have since the since as a country and have since the since as a country and have since the since the Jewish state of Israel was founded.

the Jewish state of Israel was founded. the Jewish state of Israel was founded. The future and survival of Israel as a The future and survival of Israel as a The future and survival of Israel as a Jewish state. Jewish state. Jewish state. And And And a country that is still responding to a country that is still responding to a country that is still responding to the worst day of the most violence the worst day of the most violence the worst day of the most violence against Jews since the Holocaust. against Jews since the Holocaust. against Jews since the Holocaust. Those three things, I believe in Those three things, I believe in Those three things, I believe in principle principle principle can be honored at the same time. In can be honored at the same time. In can be honored at the same time. In fact, I believe in principle they have fact, I believe in principle they have fact, I believe in principle they have to be honored at the same time. to be honored at the same time. to be honored at the same time. >> Is that what Netanyahu wants? >> Is that what Netanyahu wants? >> Is that what Netanyahu wants? >> No. I don't think he is remotely >> No. I don't think he is remotely >> No. I don't think he is remotely interested in interested in interested in the safety and dignity and security of the safety and dignity and security of the safety and dignity and security of Palestinian people. I think he believes Palestinian people. I think he believes Palestinian people. I think he believes that uh he would be better off if they that uh he would be better off if they that uh he would be better off if they didn't exist. didn't exist. didn't exist. Or at the very least, he doesn't want Or at the very least, he doesn't want Or at the very least, he doesn't want them around, right? And so we see a them around, right? And so we see a them around, right? And so we see a policy which policy which policy which obviously has led to what it did in obviously has led to what it did in obviously has led to what it did in Gaza, but also in the West Bank Gaza, but also in the West Bank Gaza, but also in the West Bank which gets less attention, maybe because which gets less attention, maybe because which gets less attention, maybe because there's been there's been there's been fewer deaths there, but uh fewer deaths there, but uh fewer deaths there, but uh pretty horrific behavior and conduct and pretty horrific behavior and conduct and pretty horrific behavior and conduct and violence violence violence from settlers from settlers from settlers that is part of a project of making it that is part of a project of making it that is part of a project of making it impossible for there to be a impossible for there to be a impossible for there to be a secure, viable Palestinian state.

secure, viable Palestinian state. secure, viable Palestinian state. >> So what does Netanyahu want in the >> So what does Netanyahu want in the >> So what does Netanyahu want in the region? region? region? >> Well, I don't know that I'm much more >> Well, I don't know that I'm much more >> Well, I don't know that I'm much more capable of seeing into the mind of capable of seeing into the mind of capable of seeing into the mind of Netanyahu than I am seeing into the mind Netanyahu than I am seeing into the mind Netanyahu than I am seeing into the mind of Trump, but looking at his choices, of Trump, but looking at his choices, of Trump, but looking at his choices, it seems that he wants to be able to it seems that he wants to be able to it seems that he wants to be able to assert assert assert domination of domination of domination of uh any other regional player. uh any other regional player. uh any other regional player. And something that is beyond just And something that is beyond just And something that is beyond just security and safety for the people of security and safety for the people of security and safety for the people of Israel, which is something that I Israel, which is something that I Israel, which is something that I believe in and something I think is hard believe in and something I think is hard believe in and something I think is hard to argue with, to argue with, to argue with, but something else, which is a but something else, which is a but something else, which is a project of project of project of taking over what is called Greater taking over what is called Greater taking over what is called Greater Israel uh in his ideology, in his Israel uh in his ideology, in his Israel uh in his ideology, in his worldview. worldview. worldview. >> Greater Israel, yeah, Eretz Israel. >> Greater Israel, yeah, Eretz Israel. >> Greater Israel, yeah, Eretz Israel. >> Which is a vision that does not have a >> Which is a vision that does not have a >> Which is a vision that does not have a lot of room for Palestinians lot of room for Palestinians lot of room for Palestinians anywhere between the river and the sea. anywhere between the river and the sea. anywhere between the river and the sea. He won't say it in those terms, He won't say it in those terms, He won't say it in those terms, but but but if you look at his actions, if you look at his actions, if you look at his actions, it is hard to believe that he is it is hard to believe that he is it is hard to believe that he is comfortable with anything less. comfortable with anything less. comfortable with anything less. >> What's your take on how Trump has >> What's your take on how Trump has >> What's your take on how Trump has treated Netanyahu in that relationship?

treated Netanyahu in that relationship? treated Netanyahu in that relationship? Is that the relationship you would have Is that the relationship you would have Is that the relationship you would have had? had? had? >> It's not the relationship I would have. >> It's not the relationship I would have. >> It's not the relationship I would have. Um I think like all things with Trump, Um I think like all things with Trump, Um I think like all things with Trump, it's pretty transactional. It's it's pretty transactional. It's it's pretty transactional. It's instrumental. It's what's in it for me. instrumental. It's what's in it for me. instrumental. It's what's in it for me. And I think part of how that has And I think part of how that has And I think part of how that has developed into a frenemy relationship developed into a frenemy relationship developed into a frenemy relationship now is that now is that now is that you know, the relationship that maybe you know, the relationship that maybe you know, the relationship that maybe served him well politically is not so served him well politically is not so served him well politically is not so good for him now because among other good for him now because among other good for him now because among other things, Netanyahu has an interest in a things, Netanyahu has an interest in a things, Netanyahu has an interest in a continued US presence in an Iran war continued US presence in an Iran war continued US presence in an Iran war that has gone from being something Trump that has gone from being something Trump that has gone from being something Trump would thought would be politically would thought would be politically would thought would be politically useful for Trump to something that is useful for Trump to something that is useful for Trump to something that is politically dangerous for Trump. politically dangerous for Trump. politically dangerous for Trump. >> How How do you think this plays out, >> How How do you think this plays out, >> How How do you think this plays out, Secretary Secretary Secretary What what do you think happens? You What what do you think happens? You What what do you think happens? You know, I said there I sort of know, I said there I sort of know, I said there I sort of hypothesized that by 2028 this will hypothesized that by 2028 this will hypothesized that by 2028 this will still be dragging on because from my still be dragging on because from my still be dragging on because from my perspective, you're either going to kind perspective, you're either going to kind perspective, you're either going to kind of lie to the American public and say of lie to the American public and say of lie to the American public and say that and declare some kind of victory, that and declare some kind of victory, that and declare some kind of victory, >> Hm. >> Hm. >> Hm. >> or you're going to stay in there. There >> or you're going to stay in there. There >> or you're going to stay in there. There I can't actually see a third option I can't actually see a third option I can't actually see a third option personally. So, how how do you imagine personally. So, how how do you imagine personally. So, how how do you imagine this playing out?

this playing out? this playing out? >> It's going to be hard to get out of >> It's going to be hard to get out of >> It's going to be hard to get out of Iran. Like we just cannot Iran. Like we just cannot Iran. Like we just cannot First of all, the president has already First of all, the president has already First of all, the president has already backpedaled a lot, even though he would backpedaled a lot, even though he would backpedaled a lot, even though he would never admit it, never admit it, never admit it, on what we're there to do. Cuz he said on what we're there to do. Cuz he said on what we're there to do. Cuz he said unconditional surrender, that's not unconditional surrender, that's not unconditional surrender, that's not happening. He said regime change, regime happening. He said regime change, regime happening. He said regime change, regime hasn't changed. We went from Ayatollah hasn't changed. We went from Ayatollah hasn't changed. We went from Ayatollah Khamenei to Ayatollah Khamenei Jr. At Khamenei to Ayatollah Khamenei Jr. At Khamenei to Ayatollah Khamenei Jr. At least on paper. Who knows if the guy's least on paper. Who knows if the guy's least on paper. Who knows if the guy's alive, but the regime is alive. But the alive, but the regime is alive. But the alive, but the regime is alive. But the regime's entire ideology is based on regime's entire ideology is based on regime's entire ideology is based on hating the United States, right? And now hating the United States, right? And now hating the United States, right? And now that the United States has done this, that the United States has done this, that the United States has done this, hard to believe that's going to change. hard to believe that's going to change. hard to believe that's going to change. There will have to be an exit that is There will have to be an exit that is There will have to be an exit that is very unlikely to be the unconditional very unlikely to be the unconditional very unlikely to be the unconditional surrender that Trump promised. surrender that Trump promised. surrender that Trump promised. But it has to be something that is But it has to be something that is But it has to be something that is tolerable to this country, to our tolerable to this country, to our tolerable to this country, to our country, to Americans, which includes country, to Americans, which includes country, to Americans, which includes passage through the Straits of Hormuz. passage through the Straits of Hormuz. passage through the Straits of Hormuz. And the only way to do that, I think, And the only way to do that, I think, And the only way to do that, I think, is with a lot of international partners is with a lot of international partners is with a lot of international partners who want the same thing to happen. who want the same thing to happen. who want the same thing to happen. Remember, anyone who is to Iran is Remember, anyone who is to Iran is Remember, anyone who is to Iran is feeling more economic pain even than we feeling more economic pain even than we feeling more economic pain even than we are from what's happening in the are from what's happening in the are from what's happening in the Straits. Straits. Straits. >> China and >> China and >> China and >> Yes, because East Asia relies on oil and >> Yes, because East Asia relies on oil and >> Yes, because East Asia relies on oil and and goods that go through there more.

and goods that go through there more. and goods that go through there more. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> So, I think what you're going to have to >> So, I think what you're going to have to >> So, I think what you're going to have to have is a regional and international have is a regional and international have is a regional and international partnership partnership partnership that that that ensures something at least resembling ensures something at least resembling ensures something at least resembling free passage of goods and security free passage of goods and security free passage of goods and security without the US sending troops in there without the US sending troops in there without the US sending troops in there or continuing to be a war. It's it's or continuing to be a war. It's it's or continuing to be a war. It's it's it's seems like the only way, but it's it's seems like the only way, but it's it's seems like the only way, but it's unquestionably worse than where we were unquestionably worse than where we were unquestionably worse than where we were a year ago before the war started. a year ago before the war started. a year ago before the war started. >> Did you hear recently that Trump >> Did you hear recently that Trump >> Did you hear recently that Trump mentioned, I think it was at the G7 mentioned, I think it was at the G7 mentioned, I think it was at the G7 summit, we run out of reserves about 4 summit, we run out of reserves about 4 summit, we run out of reserves about 4 weeks. You know, there are reserves all weeks. You know, there are reserves all weeks. You know, there are reserves all over the world and we would really run over the world and we would really run over the world and we would really run out and there'll be time when we out and there'll be time when we out and there'll be time when we wouldn't be able to get it. It would be wouldn't be able to get it. It would be wouldn't be able to get it. It would be bedlam. And he made these comments last bedlam. And he made these comments last bedlam. And he made these comments last month, 2026 at the G7 summit, in regards month, 2026 at the G7 summit, in regards month, 2026 at the G7 summit, in regards to the amount of oil the United States to the amount of oil the United States to the amount of oil the United States have left in the reserves. He was I have left in the reserves. He was I have left in the reserves. He was I think he was framing it around why he think he was framing it around why he think he was framing it around why he signed this memorandum of understanding, signed this memorandum of understanding, signed this memorandum of understanding, this agreement with them. But, you know, this agreement with them. But, you know, this agreement with them. But, you know, in the last week we've gone back to war in the last week we've gone back to war in the last week we've gone back to war in the Strait of Hormuz appears to be in the Strait of Hormuz appears to be in the Strait of Hormuz appears to be closed again. closed again. closed again. >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> So, when we think about oil reserves and >> So, when we think about oil reserves and >> So, when we think about oil reserves and how that impacts ordinary Americans and how that impacts ordinary Americans and how that impacts ordinary Americans and what might be around the corner. Like, what might be around the corner. Like, what might be around the corner. Like, there's a real pressure here there's a real pressure here there's a real pressure here to find a solution and to find a quick to find a solution and to find a quick to find a solution and to find a quick >> Yes, I mean, look, this is why he signed >> Yes, I mean, look, this is why he signed >> Yes, I mean, look, this is why he signed an MOU an MOU an MOU that was frankly more on Iranian terms that was frankly more on Iranian terms that was frankly more on Iranian terms than American terms. I mean, the than American terms. I mean, the than American terms. I mean, the ceasefire, so-called ceasefire, ceasefire, so-called ceasefire, ceasefire, so-called ceasefire, emerged from a deal that was really us emerged from a deal that was really us emerged from a deal that was really us responding to what Iran came up with, responding to what Iran came up with, responding to what Iran came up with, not vice versa. Again, he said he was not vice versa. Again, he said he was not vice versa. Again, he said he was out for regime change and unconditional out for regime change and unconditional out for regime change and unconditional surrender. We're not even talking about surrender. We're not even talking about surrender. We're not even talking about that anymore. We're nowhere near that.

that anymore. We're nowhere near that. that anymore. We're nowhere near that. And now we have is a set of conditions And now we have is a set of conditions And now we have is a set of conditions it's us redlining their texts, not the it's us redlining their texts, not the it's us redlining their texts, not the other way around, right? And then he's other way around, right? And then he's other way around, right? And then he's trying to figure out how do I go out and trying to figure out how do I go out and trying to figure out how do I go out and sell that? And so he points out sell that? And so he points out sell that? And so he points out something that is true. Sometimes he something that is true. Sometimes he something that is true. Sometimes he tells the truth when it serves him. And tells the truth when it serves him. And tells the truth when it serves him. And when he was trying to explain why he when he was trying to explain why he when he was trying to explain why he backpedaled on his war goals, backpedaled on his war goals, backpedaled on his war goals, the way he explained it was by admitting the way he explained it was by admitting the way he explained it was by admitting that there was a level of economic that there was a level of economic that there was a level of economic vulnerability vulnerability vulnerability that was unleashed by closing the that was unleashed by closing the that was unleashed by closing the strait, which is what Iran did to strait, which is what Iran did to strait, which is what Iran did to respond to the US attacks, right? respond to the US attacks, right? respond to the US attacks, right? But the problem is that ceasefire is not But the problem is that ceasefire is not But the problem is that ceasefire is not happening, at least not as you and I are happening, at least not as you and I are happening, at least not as you and I are sitting here right now. sitting here right now. sitting here right now. Still a hard thing for them to admit. Still a hard thing for them to admit. Still a hard thing for them to admit. You know, in the same way that You know, in the same way that You know, in the same way that he took out a Sharpie to modify a he took out a Sharpie to modify a he took out a Sharpie to modify a hurricane map rather than acknowledge hurricane map rather than acknowledge hurricane map rather than acknowledge that he was mistaken about some detail that he was mistaken about some detail that he was mistaken about some detail uh during a national disaster once. uh during a national disaster once. uh during a national disaster once. His administration deleted four names His administration deleted four names His administration deleted four names from the ranks of those killed in action from the ranks of those killed in action from the ranks of those killed in action in this conflict in this conflict in this conflict because they were afraid that listing because they were afraid that listing because they were afraid that listing their names their names their names would contradict him saying that we had would contradict him saying that we had would contradict him saying that we had a ceasefire.

a ceasefire. a ceasefire. >> Really? >> Really? >> Really? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. At least that's the only explanation I At least that's the only explanation I At least that's the only explanation I can think of. can think of. can think of. The crazy thing is all of us know The crazy thing is all of us know The crazy thing is all of us know there's a war. We've even had moments, there's a war. We've even had moments, there's a war. We've even had moments, remember I think it was Secretary Rubio remember I think it was Secretary Rubio remember I think it was Secretary Rubio said in Congress said in Congress said in Congress where there's where there's where there's punishment for lying. You know, you're punishment for lying. You know, you're punishment for lying. You know, you're supposed to lie to Congress. supposed to lie to Congress. supposed to lie to Congress. He said the war's over. He said the war's over. He said the war's over. We all know the war's not over. We all know the war's not over. We all know the war's not over. >> Are they stuck? >> Are they stuck? >> Are they stuck? Cuz they seem a bit stuck to me. I was Cuz they seem a bit stuck to me. I was Cuz they seem a bit stuck to me. I was watching Hegseth in in front of I think watching Hegseth in in front of I think watching Hegseth in in front of I think it was Congress. Yeah, it was Congress it was Congress. Yeah, it was Congress it was Congress. Yeah, it was Congress the other day and they're just repeating the other day and they're just repeating the other day and they're just repeating his quotes back to him over and over and his quotes back to him over and over and his quotes back to him over and over and over and over again. over and over again. over and over again. >> Yeah, cuz how's he supposed to explain >> Yeah, cuz how's he supposed to explain >> Yeah, cuz how's he supposed to explain that we're in a war that supposedly we that we're in a war that supposedly we that we're in a war that supposedly we already won? already won? already won? That we're not getting any of the things That we're not getting any of the things That we're not getting any of the things that were supposedly worth going to war that were supposedly worth going to war that were supposedly worth going to war over. over. over. And that the bill for this keeps getting And that the bill for this keeps getting And that the bill for this keeps getting bigger in terms of tax dollars. I think bigger in terms of tax dollars. I think bigger in terms of tax dollars. I think his latest number was 37 and a half his latest number was 37 and a half his latest number was 37 and a half billion dollars. billion dollars. billion dollars. It's our money, all of us as American It's our money, all of us as American It's our money, all of us as American taxpayers. taxpayers. taxpayers. And of course the cost in lives. And of course the cost in lives. And of course the cost in lives. And the cost in terms of everything in And the cost in terms of everything in And the cost in terms of everything in America starting with gas being more America starting with gas being more America starting with gas being more expensive. They don't want to be expensive. They don't want to be expensive. They don't want to be explaining that, right?

explaining that, right? explaining that, right? But they don't have a great way out But they don't have a great way out But they don't have a great way out either. either. either. And And And they're not prepared to lead us to a they're not prepared to lead us to a they're not prepared to lead us to a better place cuz they don't even know better place cuz they don't even know better place cuz they don't even know what it looks like. what it looks like. what it looks like. >> Is there anything you respect about >> Is there anything you respect about >> Is there anything you respect about Trump? Trump? Trump? >> Sure. >> Sure. >> Sure. Um Um Um I think he has been able to I think he has been able to I think he has been able to create the impression create the impression create the impression of a bias for action. of a bias for action. of a bias for action. And I think he gets a lot of credit for And I think he gets a lot of credit for And I think he gets a lot of credit for that. I think in general and especially that. I think in general and especially that. I think in general and especially in government in government in government there's a lot of hand ringing. Like, oh, there's a lot of hand ringing. Like, oh, there's a lot of hand ringing. Like, oh, we got to have a 19-step process to get we got to have a 19-step process to get we got to have a 19-step process to get all these things exactly. I saw this all these things exactly. I saw this all these things exactly. I saw this during my four years trying to get stuff during my four years trying to get stuff during my four years trying to get stuff built in this country built in this country built in this country as Secretary of Transportation that as Secretary of Transportation that as Secretary of Transportation that there were so many hoops and so much red there were so many hoops and so much red there were so many hoops and so much red tape. tape. tape. And he comes in and he says like, don't And he comes in and he says like, don't And he comes in and he says like, don't not do that. We're just going to do not do that. We're just going to do not do that. We're just going to do this. Yeah. this. Yeah. this. Yeah. Often what he's doing turns out to be Often what he's doing turns out to be Often what he's doing turns out to be illegal and it gets reversed. And illegal and it gets reversed. And illegal and it gets reversed. And obviously I think most of his policies obviously I think most of his policies obviously I think most of his policies are probably destructive. But I I think are probably destructive. But I I think are probably destructive. But I I think you have to respect the effect that he you have to respect the effect that he you have to respect the effect that he has had has had has had with that kind of bias toward just doing with that kind of bias toward just doing with that kind of bias toward just doing something. And I think we could learn a something. And I think we could learn a something. And I think we could learn a bit from that.

bit from that. bit from that. >> Is that a case for less politicians in >> Is that a case for less politicians in >> Is that a case for less politicians in power and more entrepreneurs? power and more entrepreneurs? power and more entrepreneurs? >> Look, I I think he's a politician >> Look, I I think he's a politician >> Look, I I think he's a politician through and through. I think that on through and through. I think that on through and through. I think that on some level some level some level every CEO is a politician. every CEO is a politician. every CEO is a politician. Every general is a politician. Every Every general is a politician. Every Every general is a politician. Every bishop is a politician. You just reach a bishop is a politician. You just reach a bishop is a politician. You just reach a certain level certain level certain level where part of what you're doing, if where part of what you're doing, if where part of what you're doing, if you're being honest with yourself, is you're being honest with yourself, is you're being honest with yourself, is is what is considered politics. Which by is what is considered politics. Which by is what is considered politics. Which by the way, I don't mean it in a pejorative the way, I don't mean it in a pejorative the way, I don't mean it in a pejorative way. I mean it's way. I mean it's way. I mean it's organizing people's choices organizing people's choices organizing people's choices loyalties loyalties loyalties and organizing power in order to get and organizing power in order to get and organizing power in order to get things done. things done. things done. >> I think the difference I I I understand >> I think the difference I I I understand >> I think the difference I I I understand what you're saying. I think the what you're saying. I think the what you're saying. I think the difference especially with founders is difference especially with founders is difference especially with founders is um founders got from um founders got from um founders got from started at zero and got somewhere started at zero and got somewhere started at zero and got somewhere because because because they had to be like highly they had to be like highly they had to be like highly have a high bias to action. have a high bias to action. have a high bias to action. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Believe that walls were made of paper >> Believe that walls were made of paper >> Believe that walls were made of paper and be disruptive in some I mean that and be disruptive in some I mean that and be disruptive in some I mean that the reason they were successful is the reason they were successful is the reason they were successful is because of disruption. because of disruption. because of disruption. >> Yeah, the best thing about founders is >> Yeah, the best thing about founders is >> Yeah, the best thing about founders is they see something that could be they see something that could be they see something that could be >> Yeah.

>> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> and the way things are just doesn't even >> and the way things are just doesn't even >> and the way things are just doesn't even bother them. bother them. bother them. >> They just see that vision and they just >> They just see that vision and they just >> They just see that vision and they just go after it and they blow through every go after it and they blow through every go after it and they blow through every wall between them wall between them wall between them >> Yeah. and getting it done. >> Yeah. and getting it done. >> Yeah. and getting it done. >> That's the best thing about founders. >> That's the best thing about founders. >> That's the best thing about founders. The worst thing about founders if from a The worst thing about founders if from a The worst thing about founders if from a political perspective is that sometimes political perspective is that sometimes political perspective is that sometimes because they were so good at one thing, because they were so good at one thing, because they were so good at one thing, like uniquely sometimes world like uniquely sometimes world like uniquely sometimes world historically good at one thing, historically good at one thing, historically good at one thing, they imagine that they're good at they imagine that they're good at they imagine that they're good at everything. everything. everything. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Now, that's not just a problem with >> Now, that's not just a problem with >> Now, that's not just a problem with founders, that's probably lots of smart founders, that's probably lots of smart founders, that's probably lots of smart people. people. people. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> But politics requires you to be a little >> But politics requires you to be a little >> But politics requires you to be a little bit humble about how much you don't know bit humble about how much you don't know bit humble about how much you don't know and surround yourself by people who are and surround yourself by people who are and surround yourself by people who are smarter than you at whatever it is smarter than you at whatever it is smarter than you at whatever it is they're in charge of and not imagine they're in charge of and not imagine they're in charge of and not imagine that you've got all the answers. that you've got all the answers. that you've got all the answers. >> Founders hate bureaucracy. >> Founders hate bureaucracy. >> Founders hate bureaucracy. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> This is why they often >> This is why they often >> This is why they often >> I mean look, I'm pretty impatient with >> I mean look, I'm pretty impatient with >> I mean look, I'm pretty impatient with bureaucracy, too. Like I I believe in bureaucracy, too. Like I I believe in bureaucracy, too. Like I I believe in the idea of a policy entrepreneur who the idea of a policy entrepreneur who the idea of a policy entrepreneur who can recognize can recognize can recognize here's a problem, here's a whole bunch here's a problem, here's a whole bunch here's a problem, here's a whole bunch of solutions and here's a window of of solutions and here's a window of of solutions and here's a window of opportunity and let's just like line it opportunity and let's just like line it opportunity and let's just like line it all up and make it happen. all up and make it happen. all up and make it happen. >> Also, the laws exist in order to protect >> Also, the laws exist in order to protect >> Also, the laws exist in order to protect people. people. people. And when we're talking about And when we're talking about And when we're talking about bureaucracy, like we're really talking bureaucracy, like we're really talking bureaucracy, like we're really talking about laws. Now, sometimes those laws about laws. Now, sometimes those laws about laws. Now, sometimes those laws need to be changed, simplified, stripped need to be changed, simplified, stripped need to be changed, simplified, stripped down to the most important things. I down to the most important things. I down to the most important things. I learned this very early on in my time in learned this very early on in my time in learned this very early on in my time in office where sometimes I was trying to office where sometimes I was trying to office where sometimes I was trying to get something done as a policy get something done as a policy get something done as a policy entrepreneur and somebody tapped the entrepreneur and somebody tapped the entrepreneur and somebody tapped the brakes on me and used a bureaucracy to brakes on me and used a bureaucracy to brakes on me and used a bureaucracy to do it. You know, sometimes they were do it. You know, sometimes they were do it. You know, sometimes they were right. Sometimes right. Sometimes right. Sometimes they made me better, they made me they made me better, they made me they made me better, they made me sharpen what I was trying to do sharpen what I was trying to do sharpen what I was trying to do by fighting me.

by fighting me. by fighting me. >> The other issue you mentioned a second >> The other issue you mentioned a second >> The other issue you mentioned a second ago that I think is going to be really ago that I think is going to be really ago that I think is going to be really pertinent over the next 24 months that pertinent over the next 24 months that pertinent over the next 24 months that is increasing in interest amongst is increasing in interest amongst is increasing in interest amongst Americans. I'd say especially young Americans. I'd say especially young Americans. I'd say especially young Americans that are thinking about Americans that are thinking about Americans that are thinking about getting a job and going into the getting a job and going into the getting a job and going into the workforce is the subject of artificial workforce is the subject of artificial workforce is the subject of artificial intelligence. intelligence. intelligence. >> Uh-huh. >> Uh-huh. >> Uh-huh. >> Talked to a lot of AI experts on my show >> Talked to a lot of AI experts on my show >> Talked to a lot of AI experts on my show over the last couple of years and I've over the last couple of years and I've over the last couple of years and I've also reflected a lot on the different also reflected a lot on the different also reflected a lot on the different types of comments that the CEOs of the types of comments that the CEOs of the types of comments that the CEOs of the big AI companies have made through time big AI companies have made through time big AI companies have made through time and how those quotes have changed. and how those quotes have changed. and how those quotes have changed. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Um if you go back couple of years, it >> Um if you go back couple of years, it >> Um if you go back couple of years, it was doom and gloom. was doom and gloom. was doom and gloom. >> Uh-huh. >> Uh-huh. >> Uh-huh. >> Um but now that they are running >> Um but now that they are running >> Um but now that they are running trillion-dollar companies, the quotes trillion-dollar companies, the quotes trillion-dollar companies, the quotes seem to be a bit more optimistic all of seem to be a bit more optimistic all of seem to be a bit more optimistic all of a sudden. a sudden. a sudden. >> Huh. >> Huh. >> Huh. >> One thing that I that I think they do >> One thing that I that I think they do >> One thing that I that I think they do agree on is that there's going to be agree on is that there's going to be agree on is that there's going to be significant job disruption, especially significant job disruption, especially significant job disruption, especially if you look at some of Anthropic's if you look at some of Anthropic's if you look at some of Anthropic's reports, reports, reports, >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> which are the maker of Claude. They >> which are the maker of Claude. They >> which are the maker of Claude. They already show that entry-level positions already show that entry-level positions already show that entry-level positions are at risk first, especially are at risk first, especially are at risk first, especially entry-level knowledge jobs. entry-level knowledge jobs. entry-level knowledge jobs. >> Huh. >> Huh. >> Huh. >> And people are scared. First time I I >> And people are scared. First time I I >> And people are scared. First time I I saw that um Eric Schmidt's speech where saw that um Eric Schmidt's speech where saw that um Eric Schmidt's speech where the the crowd the college the the crowd the college the the crowd the college audience are booing every time he says audience are booing every time he says audience are booing every time he says the word AI.

the word AI. the word AI. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> This is presumably going to accelerate >> This is presumably going to accelerate >> This is presumably going to accelerate this sentiment towards AI. this sentiment towards AI. this sentiment towards AI. And in part because people are going to And in part because people are going to And in part because people are going to find it harder to get jobs and find it harder to get jobs and find it harder to get jobs and they're going to experience more they're going to experience more they're going to experience more more of AI sort of permeating through more of AI sort of permeating through more of AI sort of permeating through their life. their life. their life. >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> How do you feel about all of this? What >> How do you feel about all of this? What >> How do you feel about all of this? What is the What is the balance of of AI, is the What is the balance of of AI, is the What is the balance of of AI, good, bad, ugly, risks? good, bad, ugly, risks? good, bad, ugly, risks? >> I think it can be all of those things >> I think it can be all of those things >> I think it can be all of those things and we've got some decisions to make and we've got some decisions to make and we've got some decisions to make about where AI goes. about where AI goes. about where AI goes. And the simplest way I put it is this. And the simplest way I put it is this. And the simplest way I put it is this. Either we're looking at a future where Either we're looking at a future where Either we're looking at a future where because of AI we have because of AI we have because of AI we have a shorter work week a shorter work week a shorter work week and more money in our pocket. and more money in our pocket. and more money in our pocket. Or we're looking at a future where there Or we're looking at a future where there Or we're looking at a future where there is even more extreme concentration of is even more extreme concentration of is even more extreme concentration of wealth and power in this country than wealth and power in this country than wealth and power in this country than we've already got. we've already got. we've already got. And which way it goes, which of those And which way it goes, which of those And which way it goes, which of those things happen, it's actually not things happen, it's actually not things happen, it's actually not something that's in the technology. It's something that's in the technology. It's something that's in the technology. It's not a tech question. not a tech question. not a tech question. It's a policy choice. It's a policy choice. It's a policy choice. It's about whether we make sure these It's about whether we make sure these It's about whether we make sure these technologies technologies technologies unfold unfold unfold in a way that is empowering for families in a way that is empowering for families in a way that is empowering for families and workers and college graduates and and workers and college graduates and and workers and college graduates and manage all of the harms that could come manage all of the harms that could come manage all of the harms that could come from it.

from it. from it. Every technology brings good and bad Every technology brings good and bad Every technology brings good and bad things. And we've certainly seen that things. And we've certainly seen that things. And we've certainly seen that with digital technology. We've seen it with digital technology. We've seen it with digital technology. We've seen it with social media. We've seen it with with social media. We've seen it with with social media. We've seen it with the internet itself. Good and bad things the internet itself. Good and bad things the internet itself. Good and bad things always. always. always. AI has incredible capabilities. AI has incredible capabilities. AI has incredible capabilities. I think a lot about uh something that's I think a lot about uh something that's I think a lot about uh something that's not usually in the top 10 thing people not usually in the top 10 thing people not usually in the top 10 thing people talk about, but it's self-driving talk about, but it's self-driving talk about, but it's self-driving vehicles. Easy to be freaked out by vehicles. Easy to be freaked out by vehicles. Easy to be freaked out by them. them. them. They actually have enormous potential to They actually have enormous potential to They actually have enormous potential to save lives. That's just one example of save lives. That's just one example of save lives. That's just one example of how we could be better off if we how we could be better off if we how we could be better off if we responsibly develop these technologies. responsibly develop these technologies. responsibly develop these technologies. But if we don't, But if we don't, But if we don't, I'll tell you what I think could happen. I'll tell you what I think could happen. I'll tell you what I think could happen. And I come at this based on where I grew And I come at this based on where I grew And I come at this based on where I grew up, right? I'm from the industrial up, right? I'm from the industrial up, right? I'm from the industrial Midwest, northern Indiana, a place Midwest, northern Indiana, a place Midwest, northern Indiana, a place dominated by the auto industry. dominated by the auto industry. dominated by the auto industry. And starting in the '60s, but definitely And starting in the '60s, but definitely And starting in the '60s, but definitely in the '90s when I was growing up in the in the '90s when I was growing up in the in the '90s when I was growing up in the early 2000s, there was a huge amount of early 2000s, there was a huge amount of early 2000s, there was a huge amount of job loss because the economy was job loss because the economy was job loss because the economy was changing. changing. changing. What happened was there were a whole lot What happened was there were a whole lot What happened was there were a whole lot of people who of people who of people who didn't just lose their jobs. Often they didn't just lose their jobs. Often they didn't just lose their jobs. Often they would lose their jobs, maybe find would lose their jobs, maybe find would lose their jobs, maybe find another job, maybe be trained to find a another job, maybe be trained to find a another job, maybe be trained to find a new career even, new career even, new career even, but never recovered their sense of but never recovered their sense of but never recovered their sense of identity.

identity. identity. You're an auto worker, you're in a tool You're an auto worker, you're in a tool You're an auto worker, you're in a tool and die shop, and it's your your whole and die shop, and it's your your whole and die shop, and it's your your whole sense of belonging revolves around your sense of belonging revolves around your sense of belonging revolves around your job. job. job. Not just your paycheck. It's Not just your paycheck. It's Not just your paycheck. It's how your spouses know each other from how your spouses know each other from how your spouses know each other from the union picnic. It's it's it's how the union picnic. It's it's it's how the union picnic. It's it's it's how you're sponsoring Little League. It's you're sponsoring Little League. It's you're sponsoring Little League. It's what you explain, you know, at least in what you explain, you know, at least in what you explain, you know, at least in the US. the US. the US. We don't even say like what's your job. We don't even say like what's your job. We don't even say like what's your job. We say what do you do, right? What we We say what do you do, right? What we We say what do you do, right? What we mean is what do you do professionally, mean is what do you do professionally, mean is what do you do professionally, but we say what do you do basically as a but we say what do you do basically as a but we say what do you do basically as a way of saying who are you. way of saying who are you. way of saying who are you. And that's true for blue-collar workers. And that's true for blue-collar workers. And that's true for blue-collar workers. That's even more true That's even more true That's even more true for white-collar workers. for white-collar workers. for white-collar workers. And so I think that there is a And so I think that there is a And so I think that there is a generation of workers who are about to generation of workers who are about to generation of workers who are about to have have have their their their identity, not just their job, their identity, not just their job, their identity, not just their job, their identity, identity, identity, disrupted. Whether we can come up with disrupted. Whether we can come up with disrupted. Whether we can come up with new sources or better sources of new sources or better sources of new sources or better sources of belonging belonging belonging than what your job is than what your job is than what your job is could decide everything about what it could decide everything about what it could decide everything about what it feels like and is like to live in this feels like and is like to live in this feels like and is like to live in this country within the next few years. country within the next few years. country within the next few years. >> And I just think about what you said >> And I just think about what you said >> And I just think about what you said there about growing up in the Midwest. there about growing up in the Midwest. there about growing up in the Midwest. Um Um Um people working in the auto industry people working in the auto industry people working in the auto industry making cars. And you also used the making cars. And you also used the making cars. And you also used the example of full self-driving vehicles example of full self-driving vehicles example of full self-driving vehicles being a net positive. But when I put being a net positive. But when I put being a net positive. But when I put those two things together, I thought, those two things together, I thought, those two things together, I thought, "Okay, so the people in the factories "Okay, so the people in the factories "Okay, so the people in the factories are at risk of being replaced by are at risk of being replaced by are at risk of being replaced by robotics now." Huge acceleration in robotics now." Huge acceleration in robotics now." Huge acceleration in robotics, both humanoid but just robotics, both humanoid but just robotics, both humanoid but just generally intelligent machines, which is generally intelligent machines, which is generally intelligent machines, which is right here. It's not theoretical. It's right here. It's not theoretical. It's right here. It's not theoretical. It's not sci-fi anymore. They're building not sci-fi anymore. They're building not sci-fi anymore. They're building them right now. And Sam Altman said, "On them right now. And Sam Altman said, "On them right now. And Sam Altman said, "On the current trajectory, we believe we the current trajectory, we believe we the current trajectory, we believe we may only be a couple of years away from may only be a couple of years away from may only be a couple of years away from early versions of true early versions of true early versions of true superintelligence. If we are right, by superintelligence. If we are right, by superintelligence. If we are right, by the end of 2028 more of the world's

the end of 2028 more of the world's the end of 2028 more of the world's intellectual capacity could reside in intellectual capacity could reside in intellectual capacity could reside in inside of a data center than outside of inside of a data center than outside of inside of a data center than outside of them." Dario, who's also the founder of them." Dario, who's also the founder of them." Dario, who's also the founder of Anthropic, said, Anthropic, said, Anthropic, said, "If the exponential continues, then it "If the exponential continues, then it "If the exponential continues, then it cannot possibly be more than a few years cannot possibly be more than a few years cannot possibly be more than a few years before AI is better than humans at before AI is better than humans at before AI is better than humans at essentially everything." And the quotes essentially everything." And the quotes essentially everything." And the quotes go on and on and on. Dennis from Google go on and on and on. Dennis from Google go on and on and on. Dennis from Google said, "We're only a few years, maybe said, "We're only a few years, maybe said, "We're only a few years, maybe within a decade, away from systems that within a decade, away from systems that within a decade, away from systems that have general human-level intelligence have general human-level intelligence have general human-level intelligence across the board." And Elon Musk in an across the board." And Elon Musk in an across the board." And Elon Musk in an interview this week talked about how interview this week talked about how interview this week talked about how with robots being physical and with robots being physical and with robots being physical and disruption and AI being intellectual disruption and AI being intellectual disruption and AI being intellectual disruption, you now have the perfect disruption, you now have the perfect disruption, you now have the perfect combination where work will become a combination where work will become a combination where work will become a choice. What does that mean for those choice. What does that mean for those choice. What does that mean for those people in the Midwest? Because Dara, the people in the Midwest? Because Dara, the people in the Midwest? Because Dara, the CEO of Uber, sat there in front of me CEO of Uber, sat there in front of me CEO of Uber, sat there in front of me and said the 9 million drivers he had and said the 9 million drivers he had and said the 9 million drivers he had would be replaced. would be replaced. would be replaced. And but also now you if I think about And but also now you if I think about And but also now you if I think about the production line, the people making the production line, the people making the production line, the people making the cars as well, theoretically could be the cars as well, theoretically could be the cars as well, theoretically could be at risk. There's always going to be at risk. There's always going to be at risk. There's always going to be something something something worth doing with our time. worth doing with our time. worth doing with our time. We need to arrange an economy that We need to arrange an economy that We need to arrange an economy that rewards things that are worth doing with rewards things that are worth doing with rewards things that are worth doing with our time, especially things that only our time, especially things that only our time, especially things that only people can do.

people can do. people can do. Some of that is creative work. Some of that is creative work. Some of that is creative work. Some of that is very human work like Some of that is very human work like Some of that is very human work like caregiving. I'm thinking about this more caregiving. I'm thinking about this more caregiving. I'm thinking about this more and more because I belong to this and more because I belong to this and more because I belong to this sandwich generation that's taking care sandwich generation that's taking care sandwich generation that's taking care of kids and aging parents at the same of kids and aging parents at the same of kids and aging parents at the same time. time. time. But whether those kinds of things are But whether those kinds of things are But whether those kinds of things are rewarded or not is what I worry about. I rewarded or not is what I worry about. I rewarded or not is what I worry about. I mean, imagine a a world where mean, imagine a a world where mean, imagine a a world where just for the sake of imagination just for the sake of imagination just for the sake of imagination you've got a machine that can make more you've got a machine that can make more you've got a machine that can make more and more things. It's like the and more things. It's like the and more things. It's like the replicator from Star Trek. You know, I replicator from Star Trek. You know, I replicator from Star Trek. You know, I love Star Trek as a kid. Captain Picard love Star Trek as a kid. Captain Picard love Star Trek as a kid. Captain Picard goes up to it and he just says like, goes up to it and he just says like, goes up to it and he just says like, "Give me a cup of tea, Earl Grey, hot." "Give me a cup of tea, Earl Grey, hot." "Give me a cup of tea, Earl Grey, hot." And like, And like, And like, it happens. Right? Imagine a it happens. Right? Imagine a it happens. Right? Imagine a some combination of artificial some combination of artificial some combination of artificial intelligence and robotics intelligence and robotics intelligence and robotics that that that leads to factories where you can kind of leads to factories where you can kind of leads to factories where you can kind of do that. do that. do that. Over time you need fewer and fewer Over time you need fewer and fewer Over time you need fewer and fewer people in them. people in them. people in them. And that means that And that means that And that means that less and less in the economy depends on less and less in the economy depends on less and less in the economy depends on the wages that those workers can command the wages that those workers can command the wages that those workers can command because you need fewer of them. because you need fewer of them. because you need fewer of them. That means more and more is going to That means more and more is going to That means more and more is going to depend on well, who actually owns depend on well, who actually owns depend on well, who actually owns the machine.

the machine. the machine. By which I mean both the intellectual By which I mean both the intellectual By which I mean both the intellectual property, the AI property, the AI property, the AI and the the physical plant, right? and the the physical plant, right? and the the physical plant, right? And that's where we've got to make sure And that's where we've got to make sure And that's where we've got to make sure that the American people own enough of that the American people own enough of that the American people own enough of this or at least to own enough of the this or at least to own enough of the this or at least to own enough of the value that's being created value that's being created value that's being created that people's needs can be met. that people's needs can be met. that people's needs can be met. >> How? >> How? >> How? >> Well, there's a lot of ways you can do >> Well, there's a lot of ways you can do >> Well, there's a lot of ways you can do it. Uh I think some version of a it. Uh I think some version of a it. Uh I think some version of a dividend makes sense. What I mean by dividend makes sense. What I mean by dividend makes sense. What I mean by that is there's some public share. that is there's some public share. that is there's some public share. We can argue about whether it should We can argue about whether it should We can argue about whether it should come with like a vote like being on a come with like a vote like being on a come with like a vote like being on a board or whether it's kind of closer to board or whether it's kind of closer to board or whether it's kind of closer to a tax. By the way, I think this is also a tax. By the way, I think this is also a tax. By the way, I think this is also fair game. I mean, these things trained fair game. I mean, these things trained fair game. I mean, these things trained on data that all of us put in the world on data that all of us put in the world on data that all of us put in the world for free. for free. for free. These things are based on the internet, These things are based on the internet, These things are based on the internet, which was created by the American which was created by the American which was created by the American taxpayer basically free of charge in the taxpayer basically free of charge in the taxpayer basically free of charge in the 1960s when DARPA uh the Defense Advanced 1960s when DARPA uh the Defense Advanced 1960s when DARPA uh the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency created what Research Projects Agency created what Research Projects Agency created what became the internet. became the internet. became the internet. And and now it's time to return more of And and now it's time to return more of And and now it's time to return more of that to the American people. If you do that to the American people. If you do that to the American people. If you do that, we really could have a shorter that, we really could have a shorter that, we really could have a shorter work week and more money in our pocket. work week and more money in our pocket. work week and more money in our pocket. But there's a big butt here, which is But there's a big butt here, which is But there's a big butt here, which is it hasn't always worked out that way it hasn't always worked out that way it hasn't always worked out that way with labor-saving technology. 100 years with labor-saving technology. 100 years with labor-saving technology. 100 years ago, the economist John Maynard Keynes ago, the economist John Maynard Keynes ago, the economist John Maynard Keynes wrote wrote wrote an essay called Economic Possibilities an essay called Economic Possibilities an essay called Economic Possibilities for Our Grandchildren. He wrote this in for Our Grandchildren. He wrote this in for Our Grandchildren. He wrote this in 1930, and it was all about what the 1930, and it was all about what the 1930, and it was all about what the world would be like 100 years from then, world would be like 100 years from then, world would be like 100 years from then, so 2030.

so 2030. so 2030. And he predicts that the productivity of And he predicts that the productivity of And he predicts that the productivity of our economy our economy our economy because of automation, technology, all because of automation, technology, all because of automation, technology, all these things these things these things will go up something like five to will go up something like five to will go up something like five to eightfold. eightfold. eightfold. And because of that And because of that And because of that really, we're not going to have to work really, we're not going to have to work really, we're not going to have to work more than 10 or 15 hours a week. more than 10 or 15 hours a week. more than 10 or 15 hours a week. And so far, we are on track to almost And so far, we are on track to almost And so far, we are on track to almost perfectly match his prediction about perfectly match his prediction about perfectly match his prediction about productivity. productivity. productivity. But we're nowhere close to that. If But we're nowhere close to that. If But we're nowhere close to that. If anything, we're working more anything, we're working more anything, we're working more right now. So, how does that happen? right now. So, how does that happen? right now. So, how does that happen? Well, it turns out that it has to do Well, it turns out that it has to do Well, it turns out that it has to do with policy choices about what is or with policy choices about what is or with policy choices about what is or isn't a good use of time. isn't a good use of time. isn't a good use of time. And it has to do with social choices, And it has to do with social choices, And it has to do with social choices, too. Right? I mean, one question I think too. Right? I mean, one question I think too. Right? I mean, one question I think about a lot is about a lot is about a lot is if we go into the best possible if we go into the best possible if we go into the best possible scenario, we get the policy choices scenario, we get the policy choices scenario, we get the policy choices right, we make sure the companies act right, we make sure the companies act right, we make sure the companies act right. This is saying a lot, but imagine right. This is saying a lot, but imagine right. This is saying a lot, but imagine that we do. that we do. that we do. And we do in fact have, you know, most And we do in fact have, you know, most And we do in fact have, you know, most of us have a shorter workweek of us have a shorter workweek of us have a shorter workweek and more money in our pocket. How do we know we're going to use our How do we know we're going to use our time well? time well? time well? Because in many ways, I think many of us Because in many ways, I think many of us Because in many ways, I think many of us are aching to have more time to use are aching to have more time to use are aching to have more time to use well. I know, just doing my thing, I well. I know, just doing my thing, I well. I know, just doing my thing, I wish I had more time with my kids. This wish I had more time with my kids. This wish I had more time with my kids. This is always the lament of a politician, is always the lament of a politician, is always the lament of a politician, but like anybody in an intense job but like anybody in an intense job but like anybody in an intense job wishes they had more time with people wishes they had more time with people wishes they had more time with people they love.

they love. they love. Well, you know, also a lot of our time Well, you know, also a lot of our time Well, you know, also a lot of our time right now is being absorbed by right now is being absorbed by right now is being absorbed by right? Scrolling. right? Scrolling. right? Scrolling. Things where you spend an hour doing it, Things where you spend an hour doing it, Things where you spend an hour doing it, and an hour later and an hour later and an hour later nothing sticks. It's exactly as if you nothing sticks. It's exactly as if you nothing sticks. It's exactly as if you hadn't. You regret Put your hour Yeah, hadn't. You regret Put your hour Yeah, hadn't. You regret Put your hour Yeah, or you feel worse, but the hour is gone. or you feel worse, but the hour is gone. or you feel worse, but the hour is gone. So, we need to figure out how to also be So, we need to figure out how to also be So, we need to figure out how to also be be stewards of our own time. These, by be stewards of our own time. These, by be stewards of our own time. These, by the way, are not the way, are not the way, are not just not This This sounds like a very just not This This sounds like a very just not This This sounds like a very 21st century problem, and in one way it 21st century problem, and in one way it 21st century problem, and in one way it is. But, you know, the Stoic philosopher is. But, you know, the Stoic philosopher is. But, you know, the Stoic philosopher Seneca, the Roman philosophers, writing Seneca, the Roman philosophers, writing Seneca, the Roman philosophers, writing about this kind of stuff more than 2,000 about this kind of stuff more than 2,000 about this kind of stuff more than 2,000 years ago, talking about how we are so years ago, talking about how we are so years ago, talking about how we are so careful about who can get our money. careful about who can get our money. careful about who can get our money. And and and are very up in arms if And and and are very up in arms if And and and are very up in arms if anybody looks like they're cheating us anybody looks like they're cheating us anybody looks like they're cheating us or taking our money. or taking our money. or taking our money. But, then our time, which is the one But, then our time, which is the one But, then our time, which is the one thing where we have every reason to be thing where we have every reason to be thing where we have every reason to be uh even more stingy about it than money, uh even more stingy about it than money, uh even more stingy about it than money, cuz you can get more money, but you cuz you can get more money, but you cuz you can get more money, but you can't get more time in your life, can't get more time in your life, can't get more time in your life, we let it get wasted in all kinds of we let it get wasted in all kinds of we let it get wasted in all kinds of ways. ways. ways. >> Bernie has this proposal where he >> Bernie has this proposal where he >> Bernie has this proposal where he believes we should terminate I was believes we should terminate I was believes we should terminate I was reading about, you know, you discovering reading about, you know, you discovering reading about, you know, you discovering Bernie I believe in college, right?

Bernie I believe in college, right? Bernie I believe in college, right? Wasn't it you Wasn't it you Wasn't it you >> High school, actually. >> High school, actually. >> High school, actually. >> In high school. He has a proposal where >> In high school. He has a proposal where >> In high school. He has a proposal where we should take 50% of the stock of these we should take 50% of the stock of these we should take 50% of the stock of these AI companies, gives the general public AI companies, gives the general public AI companies, gives the general public 50% ownership and board voting seats to 50% ownership and board voting seats to 50% ownership and board voting seats to block job-killing decisions, and block job-killing decisions, and block job-killing decisions, and redistribute AI profits directly to redistribute AI profits directly to redistribute AI profits directly to citizens for health care, education, and citizens for health care, education, and citizens for health care, education, and housing. housing. housing. Viable proposal? Viable proposal? Viable proposal? >> Part of that overlaps with what I'm >> Part of that overlaps with what I'm >> Part of that overlaps with what I'm talking about. I do think a public share talking about. I do think a public share talking about. I do think a public share of the profits, which could mean a of the profits, which could mean a of the profits, which could mean a public share of the ownership, can make public share of the ownership, can make public share of the ownership, can make sense. And again, for reasons that I sense. And again, for reasons that I sense. And again, for reasons that I shared earlier, I I think that would be shared earlier, I I think that would be shared earlier, I I think that would be fair. I do think we need to weigh fair. I do think we need to weigh fair. I do think we need to weigh whether the right way to make sure the whether the right way to make sure the whether the right way to make sure the public has a say in how these companies public has a say in how these companies public has a say in how these companies behave is to be on the board behave is to be on the board behave is to be on the board >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> versus >> versus >> versus just have some rules to make sure that just have some rules to make sure that just have some rules to make sure that the rules are such that the companies the rules are such that the companies the rules are such that the companies can do what they do best, create value, can do what they do best, create value, can do what they do best, create value, innovate, innovate, innovate, but they can't do it in a way that hurts but they can't do it in a way that hurts but they can't do it in a way that hurts people, which is generally how people, which is generally how people, which is generally how regulation's supposed to work. I mean, I regulation's supposed to work. I mean, I regulation's supposed to work. I mean, I say this having been in the cabinet of say this having been in the cabinet of say this having been in the cabinet of the Department of Transportation, where the Department of Transportation, where the Department of Transportation, where our job was to our job was to our job was to regulate companies. So, what that meant regulate companies. So, what that meant regulate companies. So, what that meant was we have something like the FAA, was we have something like the FAA, was we have something like the FAA, right? The Federal Aviation right? The Federal Aviation right? The Federal Aviation Administration. Administration. Administration. You know, it doesn't create aircraft, it You know, it doesn't create aircraft, it You know, it doesn't create aircraft, it doesn't invent doesn't invent doesn't invent uh aviation technology. Uh what it does uh aviation technology. Uh what it does uh aviation technology. Uh what it does is it sets a very elaborate set of rules is it sets a very elaborate set of rules is it sets a very elaborate set of rules to make sure that aviation is safe.

to make sure that aviation is safe. to make sure that aviation is safe. And the consequence of that is actually And the consequence of that is actually And the consequence of that is actually an incredible unsung civilizational an incredible unsung civilizational an incredible unsung civilizational achievement. And just in the time I was achievement. And just in the time I was achievement. And just in the time I was Secretary of Transportation, we had 4 Secretary of Transportation, we had 4 Secretary of Transportation, we had 4 billion people get on an airplane. 4 billion people get on an airplane. 4 billion people get on an airplane. 4 billion passenger airplane minutes on billion passenger airplane minutes on billion passenger airplane minutes on commercial airplanes. The number of commercial airplanes. The number of commercial airplanes. The number of fatalities was zero. fatalities was zero. fatalities was zero. Zero out of 4 billion. Zero out of 4 billion. Zero out of 4 billion. >> Crazy. >> Crazy. >> Crazy. >> There are very few things you can do in >> There are very few things you can do in >> There are very few things you can do in life. I mean, all the way down to like life. I mean, all the way down to like life. I mean, all the way down to like crossing the street or eating a crossing the street or eating a crossing the street or eating a cheeseburger. cheeseburger. cheeseburger. >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> They would have a zero to 4 billion >> They would have a zero to 4 billion >> They would have a zero to 4 billion fatality rate. So, that's an amazing fatality rate. So, that's an amazing fatality rate. So, that's an amazing achievement that happened because achievement that happened because achievement that happened because there was is the right framework with there was is the right framework with there was is the right framework with technology and rules. Where you have a technology and rules. Where you have a technology and rules. Where you have a lot of innovation. I mean, the aviation lot of innovation. I mean, the aviation lot of innovation. I mean, the aviation aerospace sector is known to be very aerospace sector is known to be very aerospace sector is known to be very innovative. But, also you make sure it's innovative. But, also you make sure it's innovative. But, also you make sure it's safe. safe. safe. And it's worth considering that when And it's worth considering that when And it's worth considering that when we're saying, "Okay, how do we make sure we're saying, "Okay, how do we make sure we're saying, "Okay, how do we make sure that these AI technologies develop so that these AI technologies develop so that these AI technologies develop so that we can have safer vehicles or you that we can have safer vehicles or you that we can have safer vehicles or you can get a better can get a better can get a better uh uh screening of a uh uh screening of a uh uh screening of a uh of a radiology scan for for cancer or uh of a radiology scan for for cancer or uh of a radiology scan for for cancer or all any of these other things all the all any of these other things all the all any of these other things all the way down to like, you know, these way down to like, you know, these way down to like, you know, these amazing ideas about curing cancer, amazing ideas about curing cancer, amazing ideas about curing cancer, figuring out nuclear fusion.

figuring out nuclear fusion. figuring out nuclear fusion. Which are urgently important things to Which are urgently important things to Which are urgently important things to do. do. do. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Without having the kind of AI equivalent >> Without having the kind of AI equivalent >> Without having the kind of AI equivalent of a plane crash. of a plane crash. of a plane crash. >> I've got 60 seconds and I'm going to >> I've got 60 seconds and I'm going to >> I've got 60 seconds and I'm going to show you how much I can get done because show you how much I can get done because show you how much I can get done because of our sponsor called Whisper Flow. And of our sponsor called Whisper Flow. And of our sponsor called Whisper Flow. And for those of you that don't know what it for those of you that don't know what it for those of you that don't know what it is, it's a business I invested in that is, it's a business I invested in that is, it's a business I invested in that turns your speech into text in any app turns your speech into text in any app turns your speech into text in any app or device. I'm going to post into our or device. I'm going to post into our or device. I'm going to post into our Slack channel which rewards whichever Slack channel which rewards whichever Slack channel which rewards whichever team member conducted the most team member conducted the most team member conducted the most experiments this week. Hi everyone. Here experiments this week. Hi everyone. Here experiments this week. Hi everyone. Here is this week's experiment of the week. is this week's experiment of the week. is this week's experiment of the week. Congratulations to the Diary of a CEO Congratulations to the Diary of a CEO Congratulations to the Diary of a CEO trailer team, which is Ant, Liv, Dom, trailer team, which is Ant, Liv, Dom, trailer team, which is Ant, Liv, Dom, and Cam. You guys [clears throat] have and Cam. You guys [clears throat] have and Cam. You guys [clears throat] have won. won. won. Okay, now I'm going to open Gmail. So, Okay, now I'm going to open Gmail. So, Okay, now I'm going to open Gmail. So, here is one of our founders on an email here is one of our founders on an email here is one of our founders on an email chain that I want to connect my team chain that I want to connect my team chain that I want to connect my team with. All I have to say is, "Add my with. All I have to say is, "Add my with. All I have to say is, "Add my team's emails." And Whisper will do team's emails." And Whisper will do team's emails." And Whisper will do exactly that. Now, a quick message to exactly that. Now, a quick message to exactly that. Now, a quick message to Juan who does my schedule every single Juan who does my schedule every single Juan who does my schedule every single week. "Hey Juan, can I record on week. "Hey Juan, can I record on week. "Hey Juan, can I record on Wednesday at 2:00 p.m. Actually, no. Do Wednesday at 2:00 p.m. Actually, no. Do Wednesday at 2:00 p.m. Actually, no. Do you know what? Let's record it 3:00 p.m. you know what? Let's record it 3:00 p.m. you know what? Let's record it 3:00 p.m. on Wednesday. on Wednesday. on Wednesday. WhisperFlow is four times faster than WhisperFlow is four times faster than WhisperFlow is four times faster than typing, and it is incredibly easy to typing, and it is incredibly easy to typing, and it is incredibly easy to use. So, if you want to give it a go, use. So, if you want to give it a go, use. So, if you want to give it a go, all you have to do is head to all you have to do is head to all you have to do is head to whisperflow.ai/steven whisperflow.ai/steven whisperflow.ai/steven to download it today.

to download it today. to download it today. I want to speak to the business owners I want to speak to the business owners I want to speak to the business owners listening and watching right now. I know listening and watching right now. I know listening and watching right now. I know what it's like to be personally what it's like to be personally what it's like to be personally responsible for every decision. I responsible for every decision. I responsible for every decision. I founded my first company at 21 years founded my first company at 21 years founded my first company at 21 years old, and honestly, the pressure can be old, and honestly, the pressure can be old, and honestly, the pressure can be immense. It's the kind of mental load immense. It's the kind of mental load immense. It's the kind of mental load that takes its toll below the surface. I that takes its toll below the surface. I that takes its toll below the surface. I recently did some tests through our recently did some tests through our recently did some tests through our sponsor, Function, which got me thinking sponsor, Function, which got me thinking sponsor, Function, which got me thinking about that invisible impact. I found about that invisible impact. I found about that invisible impact. I found that I had low levels of omega-3s. I had that I had low levels of omega-3s. I had that I had low levels of omega-3s. I had deficient levels of vitamin D, probably deficient levels of vitamin D, probably deficient levels of vitamin D, probably because I sit inside this dark room all because I sit inside this dark room all because I sit inside this dark room all day, and that has totally changed how I day, and that has totally changed how I day, and that has totally changed how I construct my day going forward. I would construct my day going forward. I would construct my day going forward. I would get up in the morning, and the first get up in the morning, and the first get up in the morning, and the first thing I now do is I go for a walk thing I now do is I go for a walk thing I now do is I go for a walk outside in the sunshine, in part to help outside in the sunshine, in part to help outside in the sunshine, in part to help my vitamin D levels increase, but also my vitamin D levels increase, but also my vitamin D levels increase, but also because it helps to reset my circadian because it helps to reset my circadian because it helps to reset my circadian rhythm. With Function, you can check rhythm. With Function, you can check rhythm. With Function, you can check your brain health, your aging, your your brain health, your aging, your your brain health, your aging, your stress, and so much more. They provide stress, and so much more. They provide stress, and so much more. They provide over 160 lab tests for what is equal to over 160 lab tests for what is equal to over 160 lab tests for what is equal to a dollar a day, and member pricing on a dollar a day, and member pricing on a dollar a day, and member pricing on advanced imaging. Head to advanced imaging. Head to advanced imaging. Head to functionhealth.com/doac to join, and use code doac25 to join, and use code doac25 for a $25 credit.

for a $25 credit. for a $25 credit. There's There's also just a broader There's There's also just a broader There's There's also just a broader debate, which I guess in some ways debate, which I guess in some ways debate, which I guess in some ways connected to this at the moment in connected to this at the moment in connected to this at the moment in America, but actually also across the America, but actually also across the America, but actually also across the Western world. It's happening in the UK Western world. It's happening in the UK Western world. It's happening in the UK as well. as well. as well. Around capitalism, socialism, Around capitalism, socialism, Around capitalism, socialism, and um I think a lot of it's driven by and um I think a lot of it's driven by and um I think a lot of it's driven by the inequality Yeah. that people are the inequality Yeah. that people are the inequality Yeah. that people are experiencing. And if my if my memory is experiencing. And if my if my memory is experiencing. And if my if my memory is true, true, true, the US has more extreme inequality. It the US has more extreme inequality. It the US has more extreme inequality. It has more growth GDP growth, but it has has more growth GDP growth, but it has has more growth GDP growth, but it has more extreme inequality than a country more extreme inequality than a country more extreme inequality than a country like the United Kingdom. like the United Kingdom. like the United Kingdom. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um so, socialism is often considered to >> Um so, socialism is often considered to >> Um so, socialism is often considered to be the solution to this inequality. be the solution to this inequality. be the solution to this inequality. Mamdani's now the mayor of um New York, Mamdani's now the mayor of um New York, Mamdani's now the mayor of um New York, and we're seeing, you know, in the UK, and we're seeing, you know, in the UK, and we're seeing, you know, in the UK, socialist parties are are becoming more socialist parties are are becoming more socialist parties are are becoming more and more popular. The idea of taxing the and more popular. The idea of taxing the and more popular. The idea of taxing the rich is becoming very popular. Big rich is becoming very popular. Big rich is becoming very popular. Big debate that actually this week in the UK debate that actually this week in the UK debate that actually this week in the UK is, is, is, should we implement a wealth tax on should we implement a wealth tax on should we implement a wealth tax on people who have wealth above 10 million? people who have wealth above 10 million? people who have wealth above 10 million? >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Keen to get your perspective on this. >> Keen to get your perspective on this. >> Keen to get your perspective on this. Yeah. Is socialism, is wealth tax is the Yeah. Is socialism, is wealth tax is the Yeah. Is socialism, is wealth tax is the right solution to some of these right solution to some of these right solution to some of these problems, some of the inequality?

problems, some of the inequality? problems, some of the inequality? >> Look, I find socialism is a word that >> Look, I find socialism is a word that >> Look, I find socialism is a word that means less and less the more people use means less and less the more people use means less and less the more people use it. It gets thrown around as a label and it. It gets thrown around as a label and it. It gets thrown around as a label and it means different things to different it means different things to different it means different things to different people. And and I'll I'll I'll take your people. And and I'll I'll I'll take your people. And and I'll I'll I'll take your example example example uh, to illustrate this. uh, to illustrate this. uh, to illustrate this. You know, higher taxes for very wealthy You know, higher taxes for very wealthy You know, higher taxes for very wealthy people is an idea that people is an idea that people is an idea that is broadly popular. is broadly popular. is broadly popular. I think it's the right thing to do. I think it's the right thing to do. I think it's the right thing to do. And importantly, And importantly, And importantly, we have a tradition of doing that we have a tradition of doing that we have a tradition of doing that already in the United States. already in the United States. already in the United States. Some of the highest tax There was a Some of the highest tax There was a Some of the highest tax There was a point where the income tax point where the income tax point where the income tax for the wealthiest tax bracket in the for the wealthiest tax bracket in the for the wealthiest tax bracket in the country country country was around 90% in the United States. I'm was around 90% in the United States. I'm was around 90% in the United States. I'm not saying we need to go back to that. not saying we need to go back to that. not saying we need to go back to that. I'm just saying I'm just saying I'm just saying then that was happening in the '40s and then that was happening in the '40s and then that was happening in the '40s and '50s and '60s '50s and '60s '50s and '60s when the Cold War was going on and the when the Cold War was going on and the when the Cold War was going on and the US represented capitalism against US represented capitalism against US represented capitalism against communism or some would put socialism communism or some would put socialism communism or some would put socialism would lump it in with that, right? So, would lump it in with that, right? So, would lump it in with that, right? So, there is a tradition of the US being a there is a tradition of the US being a there is a tradition of the US being a fully capitalist country fully capitalist country fully capitalist country and also doing a better job of heading and also doing a better job of heading and also doing a better job of heading off this inequality. And the point of off this inequality. And the point of off this inequality. And the point of dealing with the inequality wasn't to dealing with the inequality wasn't to dealing with the inequality wasn't to punish the wealthy, it was to make sure punish the wealthy, it was to make sure punish the wealthy, it was to make sure that that level of wealth didn't go off that that level of wealth didn't go off that that level of wealth didn't go off the rails and that it didn't turn into a the rails and that it didn't turn into a the rails and that it didn't turn into a level of political power level of political power level of political power that could bring down the whole system.

that could bring down the whole system. that could bring down the whole system. Which, by the way, is the problem I Which, by the way, is the problem I Which, by the way, is the problem I think we're facing now. First of all, think we're facing now. First of all, think we're facing now. First of all, our tax system our tax system our tax system taxes wealth less than it taxes work. taxes wealth less than it taxes work. taxes wealth less than it taxes work. That's a problem. That's an even bigger That's a problem. That's an even bigger That's a problem. That's an even bigger problem now that AI is coming for jobs problem now that AI is coming for jobs problem now that AI is coming for jobs because there's basically a thumb on the because there's basically a thumb on the because there's basically a thumb on the scale, a subsidy in effect, from the US scale, a subsidy in effect, from the US scale, a subsidy in effect, from the US government saying government saying government saying giving you a little more reason to giving you a little more reason to giving you a little more reason to automate a job than you otherwise would automate a job than you otherwise would automate a job than you otherwise would because things like capital gains taxes because things like capital gains taxes because things like capital gains taxes are coming in lower than things like are coming in lower than things like are coming in lower than things like income taxes. Now, wealth tax, which is income taxes. Now, wealth tax, which is income taxes. Now, wealth tax, which is a property tax by another name, a property tax by another name, a property tax by another name, can be part of the menu of taxes you can be part of the menu of taxes you can be part of the menu of taxes you have to get enough revenue have to get enough revenue have to get enough revenue and to make sure that outcomes are fair. and to make sure that outcomes are fair. and to make sure that outcomes are fair. You can argue about where to draw the You can argue about where to draw the You can argue about where to draw the line. I think some people have proposals line. I think some people have proposals line. I think some people have proposals that set it too high. You can also argue that set it too high. You can also argue that set it too high. You can also argue about whether you have to have a wealth about whether you have to have a wealth about whether you have to have a wealth tax or whether you can get the job done tax or whether you can get the job done tax or whether you can get the job done with capital gains and income and other with capital gains and income and other with capital gains and income and other taxes. taxes. taxes. >> But what we know right now >> But what we know right now >> But what we know right now is that our system is so out of whack is that our system is so out of whack is that our system is so out of whack that if you are a multi-billionaire that if you are a multi-billionaire that if you are a multi-billionaire you probably pay a lower percentage of you probably pay a lower percentage of you probably pay a lower percentage of what you make what you make what you make in taxes than if you're a school teacher in taxes than if you're a school teacher in taxes than if you're a school teacher or a firefighter. We even in percentage or a firefighter. We even in percentage or a firefighter. We even in percentage terms, generally tax billionaires less terms, generally tax billionaires less terms, generally tax billionaires less than we tax millionaires than we tax millionaires than we tax millionaires because again of this system that kind because again of this system that kind because again of this system that kind of favors wealth. So, the more you have of favors wealth. So, the more you have of favors wealth. So, the more you have uh the more you make and the less it's uh the more you make and the less it's uh the more you make and the less it's taxed.

taxed. taxed. Surely we can do better than that. Surely we can do better than that. Surely we can do better than that. >> So, you supportive of wealth taxes? And >> So, you supportive of wealth taxes? And >> So, you supportive of wealth taxes? And I'm defining that as I'm defining that as I'm defining that as um not taxing income, but looking at the um not taxing income, but looking at the um not taxing income, but looking at the net worth of somebody and taking a net worth of somebody and taking a net worth of somebody and taking a percentage of their net worth. percentage of their net worth. percentage of their net worth. >> Yeah, again, to me that's just a >> Yeah, again, to me that's just a >> Yeah, again, to me that's just a variation on the idea of a property tax. variation on the idea of a property tax. variation on the idea of a property tax. I think it's legitimate. There are some I think it's legitimate. There are some I think it's legitimate. There are some problems with doing it uh problems with doing it uh problems with doing it uh in in practical terms. in in practical terms. in in practical terms. >> Yeah, this is why it's hard, right? Like >> Yeah, this is why it's hard, right? Like >> Yeah, this is why it's hard, right? Like how do you how do you how do you >> tax like somebody's art collection? Are >> tax like somebody's art collection? Are >> tax like somebody's art collection? Are there things that can make it tricky? there things that can make it tricky? there things that can make it tricky? >> One of the things that I learned when um >> One of the things that I learned when um >> One of the things that I learned when um I I I I had this company it was a public I had this company it was a public I had this company it was a public company, so I had public stock. And company, so I had public stock. And company, so I had public stock. And someone came along and said, "Steven, someone came along and said, "Steven, someone came along and said, "Steven, you know with your your public stock you know with your your public stock you know with your your public stock that you have?" So, started this company that you have?" So, started this company that you have?" So, started this company when I was 21, does well, by 27 the when I was 21, does well, by 27 the when I was 21, does well, by 27 the stock that I have is public stock, which stock that I have is public stock, which stock that I have is public stock, which means it's on a stock market. Someone means it's on a stock market. Someone means it's on a stock market. Someone came to me and at 27 and said, "Steven, came to me and at 27 and said, "Steven, came to me and at 27 and said, "Steven, do you know you can just take a loan do you know you can just take a loan do you know you can just take a loan against your public stock?" And I went, against your public stock?" And I went, against your public stock?" And I went, "What?" They went, "You can just get a "What?" They went, "You can just get a "What?" They went, "You can just get a tax-free loan. So, if your stock is tax-free loan. So, if your stock is tax-free loan. So, if your stock is worth $50 million right now, worth $50 million right now, worth $50 million right now, they will give you a 50% loan without they will give you a 50% loan without they will give you a 50% loan without paying tax on that on that stock. So, paying tax on that on that stock. So, paying tax on that on that stock. So, they will crazy low interest rate.

they will crazy low interest rate. they will crazy low interest rate. Like not almost nothing. They will just Like not almost nothing. They will just Like not almost nothing. They will just transfer you today 25 million dollars in transfer you today 25 million dollars in transfer you today 25 million dollars in cash and you will have to pay no tax. cash and you will have to pay no tax. cash and you will have to pay no tax. And guess what? If the stock comes down, And guess what? If the stock comes down, And guess what? If the stock comes down, they'll just sell it. So, you'll never they'll just sell it. So, you'll never they'll just sell it. So, you'll never really have like a a real sort of tax really have like a a real sort of tax really have like a a real sort of tax liability there. liability there. liability there. I couldn't believe this was possible. I I couldn't believe this was possible. I I couldn't believe this was possible. I was like, is this what all the rich was like, is this what all the rich was like, is this what all the rich people do? And they told me, yes, this people do? And they told me, yes, this people do? And they told me, yes, this is what how it works. This is what is what how it works. This is what is what how it works. This is what Elon's doing. Elon is taking a tax-free Elon's doing. Elon is taking a tax-free Elon's doing. Elon is taking a tax-free pretty much tax-free loan against his pretty much tax-free loan against his pretty much tax-free loan against his Tesla stock and they're transferring him Tesla stock and they're transferring him Tesla stock and they're transferring him a billion dollars in cash. And he can a billion dollars in cash. And he can a billion dollars in cash. And he can live off that, start new companies with live off that, start new companies with live off that, start new companies with that, and never have to have a tax that, and never have to have a tax that, and never have to have a tax transaction. So, I thought, why don't transaction. So, I thought, why don't transaction. So, I thought, why don't politicians tax that? politicians tax that? politicians tax that? >> There's always going to be a cat and >> There's always going to be a cat and >> There's always going to be a cat and mouse, right? Whenever we figure out a mouse, right? Whenever we figure out a mouse, right? Whenever we figure out a way to make sure you can't hide all of way to make sure you can't hide all of way to make sure you can't hide all of your wealth from or all of your income your wealth from or all of your income your wealth from or all of your income from being fairly taxed, very wealthy from being fairly taxed, very wealthy from being fairly taxed, very wealthy people will figure out some other place people will figure out some other place people will figure out some other place to hide it. to hide it. to hide it. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And then we'll have to develop a new >> And then we'll have to develop a new >> And then we'll have to develop a new policy to deal with that. Well, I guess policy to deal with that. Well, I guess policy to deal with that. Well, I guess my point is that's okay. Too often we my point is that's okay. Too often we my point is that's okay. Too often we have just have just have just to do anything because it might be hard to do anything because it might be hard to do anything because it might be hard or because it might not last. or because it might not last. or because it might not last. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> But if if the idea that somebody will >> But if if the idea that somebody will >> But if if the idea that somebody will figure out a way around this law meant figure out a way around this law meant figure out a way around this law meant that you shouldn't have the law, that that you shouldn't have the law, that that you shouldn't have the law, that would be an argument against having any would be an argument against having any would be an argument against having any law.

law. law. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> So, it's messy. It's hard. But I am sure >> So, it's messy. It's hard. But I am sure >> So, it's messy. It's hard. But I am sure that if we had a more reasonable that if we had a more reasonable that if we had a more reasonable rate of taxation on capital gains rate of taxation on capital gains rate of taxation on capital gains and on corporate income, and if we made and on corporate income, and if we made and on corporate income, and if we made it harder to pass along wealth without it harder to pass along wealth without it harder to pass along wealth without especially inherited wealth without especially inherited wealth without especially inherited wealth without paying any taxes on it, or some of these paying any taxes on it, or some of these paying any taxes on it, or some of these other maneuvers like this borrowing other maneuvers like this borrowing other maneuvers like this borrowing thing you're talking about, thing you're talking about, thing you're talking about, >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> we would have a fairer country because >> we would have a fairer country because >> we would have a fairer country because we'd still have capitalism. There'd we'd still have capitalism. There'd we'd still have capitalism. There'd still be lots of motivation and lots of still be lots of motivation and lots of still be lots of motivation and lots of reason to innovate and build a business reason to innovate and build a business reason to innovate and build a business and create jobs and do all the things and create jobs and do all the things and create jobs and do all the things that very wealthy people that very wealthy people that very wealthy people have done. have done. have done. And also, we would be out of this doom And also, we would be out of this doom And also, we would be out of this doom loop we're in where they're saying, loop we're in where they're saying, loop we're in where they're saying, well, we can't possibly have as good well, we can't possibly have as good well, we can't possibly have as good health care as other countries. We health care as other countries. We health care as other countries. We couldn't possibly do something like, I couldn't possibly do something like, I couldn't possibly do something like, I don't know, fast trains here in the don't know, fast trains here in the don't know, fast trains here in the United States. We couldn't possibly have United States. We couldn't possibly have United States. We couldn't possibly have rural hospitals be properly funded or uh rural hospitals be properly funded or uh rural hospitals be properly funded or uh public education. Of course we can. public education. Of course we can. public education. Of course we can. We're the wealthiest economy in the We're the wealthiest economy in the We're the wealthiest economy in the world. It just doesn't add up world. It just doesn't add up world. It just doesn't add up that we can't have nice things. that we can't have nice things. that we can't have nice things. But, But, But, if we aren't if we aren't if we aren't collecting a fair level of taxes, then collecting a fair level of taxes, then collecting a fair level of taxes, then then of course we're going to come up then of course we're going to come up then of course we're going to come up short when we're trying to fund those short when we're trying to fund those short when we're trying to fund those things. And the biggest thing long things. And the biggest thing long things. And the biggest thing long uh that numerically that we're facing uh that numerically that we're facing uh that numerically that we're facing right now is this massive debt.

right now is this massive debt. right now is this massive debt. Now, it's not fashionable on the left to Now, it's not fashionable on the left to Now, it's not fashionable on the left to talk about deficits and the debt. Partly talk about deficits and the debt. Partly talk about deficits and the debt. Partly because you know, I think Democrats are because you know, I think Democrats are because you know, I think Democrats are pretty sick of that being invoked as a pretty sick of that being invoked as a pretty sick of that being invoked as a reason not to do things like roads and reason not to do things like roads and reason not to do things like roads and bridges and schools and hospitals that bridges and schools and hospitals that bridges and schools and hospitals that we believe in. we believe in. we believe in. But, it's now escalated to a level that But, it's now escalated to a level that But, it's now escalated to a level that no one can ignore. no one can ignore. no one can ignore. It turns out, you know, if some analysis It turns out, you know, if some analysis It turns out, you know, if some analysis has suggested or shown that if has suggested or shown that if has suggested or shown that if you start the clock at the beginning of you start the clock at the beginning of you start the clock at the beginning of this century with the big Bush tax cuts this century with the big Bush tax cuts this century with the big Bush tax cuts in I think 2001, in I think 2001, in I think 2001, and then you go through the Trump tax and then you go through the Trump tax and then you go through the Trump tax cuts for the wealthiest, you add all cuts for the wealthiest, you add all cuts for the wealthiest, you add all that up, if it weren't for all those tax that up, if it weren't for all those tax that up, if it weren't for all those tax cuts, cuts, cuts, the debt would actually be going down the debt would actually be going down the debt would actually be going down right now. right now. right now. So, they can fully account So, they can fully account So, they can fully account for what's happened to the increase in for what's happened to the increase in for what's happened to the increase in the debt. the debt. the debt. And it we just don't have don't have to And it we just don't have don't have to And it we just don't have don't have to accept that. accept that. accept that. >> Got this >> Got this >> Got this graph here of US national debt growth graph here of US national debt growth graph here of US national debt growth over that one on the screen between 1970 over that one on the screen between 1970 over that one on the screen between 1970 and 2026. and 2026. and 2026. It looks like a rocket is taking off. It looks like a rocket is taking off. It looks like a rocket is taking off. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> And I sat here with Ray Dalio just a >> And I sat here with Ray Dalio just a >> And I sat here with Ray Dalio just a couple of days ago. He talks about the couple of days ago. He talks about the couple of days ago. He talks about the sort of big economic boom and bust sort of big economic boom and bust sort of big economic boom and bust cycles. He talks about how every 80 cycles. He talks about how every 80 cycles. He talks about how every 80 years years years >> or so you you kind of see a great power >> or so you you kind of see a great power >> or so you you kind of see a great power >> falter and struggle. And we are 80 years >> falter and struggle. And we are 80 years >> falter and struggle. And we are 80 years into the American power. And he says into the American power. And he says into the American power. And he says that the writing is on the wall as it that the writing is on the wall as it that the writing is on the wall as it relates to what happens next when you relates to what happens next when you relates to what happens next when you let that go like this and you start let that go like this and you start let that go like this and you start getting sort of internal conflict and getting sort of internal conflict and getting sort of internal conflict and you start trying to please the world and you start trying to please the world and you start trying to please the world and >> Yeah. And what's going on with the debt >> Yeah. And what's going on with the debt >> Yeah. And what's going on with the debt is both evidence of it and part of the is both evidence of it and part of the is both evidence of it and part of the problem. I think it's a symptom, but in problem. I think it's a symptom, but in problem. I think it's a symptom, but in some ways it's a cause. It could be a some ways it's a cause. It could be a some ways it's a cause. It could be a cause of a currency crisis or force us cause of a currency crisis or force us cause of a currency crisis or force us to to to redo our whole tax code within the next

redo our whole tax code within the next redo our whole tax code within the next few years. One thing I learned about few years. One thing I learned about few years. One thing I learned about recently recently recently uh uh uh is a principle called Stein's law. It's is a principle called Stein's law. It's is a principle called Stein's law. It's named after uh Reagan era economist, named after uh Reagan era economist, named after uh Reagan era economist, actually the father of Ben Stein from if actually the father of Ben Stein from if actually the father of Ben Stein from if you remember Ferris Bueller. The you remember Ferris Bueller. The you remember Ferris Bueller. The principle is very simple. principle is very simple. principle is very simple. If something cannot go on forever, If something cannot go on forever, If something cannot go on forever, it will stop. it will stop. it will stop. It's one of these blindingly obvious It's one of these blindingly obvious It's one of these blindingly obvious things things things that we don't think about enough in a that we don't think about enough in a that we don't think about enough in a moment like this where everybody agrees moment like this where everybody agrees moment like this where everybody agrees the debt can't keep going up like this. the debt can't keep going up like this. the debt can't keep going up like this. This is almost definitely definitionally This is almost definitely definitionally This is almost definitely definitionally impossible. impossible. impossible. Pretty much everyone agrees our politics Pretty much everyone agrees our politics Pretty much everyone agrees our politics can't go on like this. can't go on like this. can't go on like this. And And And if something if something if something can't go on forever, it won't. can't go on forever, it won't. can't go on forever, it won't. So then the question is, okay, then So then the question is, okay, then So then the question is, okay, then what's going to happen? I believe one of what's going to happen? I believe one of what's going to happen? I believe one of two things can happen. two things can happen. two things can happen. Reform Reform Reform or catastrophe. or catastrophe. or catastrophe. And the whole reason I'm involved in And the whole reason I'm involved in And the whole reason I'm involved in public life is to try to make for make public life is to try to make for make public life is to try to make for make sure that it's reform sure that it's reform sure that it's reform and not catastrophe. Can I and not catastrophe. Can I and not catastrophe. Can I >> ask a question on this? So, on this >> ask a question on this? So, on this >> ask a question on this? So, on this Stein's law thing, and and why, Stein's law thing, and and why, Stein's law thing, and and why, irrespective of what you've just said, irrespective of what you've just said, irrespective of what you've just said, which makes perfect sense to me, this which makes perfect sense to me, this which makes perfect sense to me, this line keeps going up of national debt? Is line keeps going up of national debt? Is line keeps going up of national debt? Is it in part kind of like musical chairs it in part kind of like musical chairs it in part kind of like musical chairs with politicians where you come in for 4 with politicians where you come in for 4 with politicians where you come in for 4 years years years and the music is playing, and you're and the music is playing, and you're and the music is playing, and you're kind of hoping that the music doesn't kind of hoping that the music doesn't kind of hoping that the music doesn't stop during your term because you want stop during your term because you want stop during your term because you want to spend money because that's to spend money because that's to spend money because that's politically politically politically positive. If you're helping people's positive. If you're helping people's positive. If you're helping people's health care, if you're building health care, if you're building health care, if you're building infrastructure, positive. People are infrastructure, positive. People are infrastructure, positive. People are going to like you more, they're going to going to like you more, they're going to going to like you more, they're going to vote you in.

vote you in. vote you in. But But But the nature of politics means that you the nature of politics means that you the nature of politics means that you really do play for 4 years. And then really do play for 4 years. And then really do play for 4 years. And then maybe you play for 8. maybe you play for 8. maybe you play for 8. >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> But this might be a 2-decade >> But this might be a 2-decade >> But this might be a 2-decade catastrophe. The music might stop in 2 catastrophe. The music might stop in 2 catastrophe. The music might stop in 2 decades. So, actually, when you think decades. So, actually, when you think decades. So, actually, when you think about people's incentive structures, about people's incentive structures, about people's incentive structures, you're incentivized to actually not you're incentivized to actually not you're incentivized to actually not think about the future. You're think about the future. You're think about the future. You're incentivized to like be remembered and incentivized to like be remembered and incentivized to like be remembered and pass the baton to the next Democrat in 4 pass the baton to the next Democrat in 4 pass the baton to the next Democrat in 4 years' time in a way that's positive. years' time in a way that's positive. years' time in a way that's positive. So, that's why we're seeing this cuz So, that's why we're seeing this cuz So, that's why we're seeing this cuz clearly if someone was in power for 100 clearly if someone was in power for 100 clearly if someone was in power for 100 years, or maybe if the time horizon was years, or maybe if the time horizon was years, or maybe if the time horizon was even longer, even longer, even longer, maybe they would have thought about this maybe they would have thought about this maybe they would have thought about this debt rapidly increasing. debt rapidly increasing. debt rapidly increasing. >> Yeah, but I think it also comes down to >> Yeah, but I think it also comes down to >> Yeah, but I think it also comes down to why why do you think you're here if why why do you think you're here if why why do you think you're here if you're in office? Like are you in office you're in office? Like are you in office you're in office? Like are you in office just in order to hold it? just in order to hold it? just in order to hold it? >> It seems like that sometimes. >> It seems like that sometimes. >> It seems like that sometimes. >> It's not worth it. Being in a position >> It's not worth it. Being in a position >> It's not worth it. Being in a position to make a difference and hold public to make a difference and hold public to make a difference and hold public office like it it's an exciting thing. office like it it's an exciting thing. office like it it's an exciting thing. It's a compelling thing. It's a It's a compelling thing. It's a It's a compelling thing. It's a meaningful thing. And it comes with with meaningful thing. And it comes with with meaningful thing. And it comes with with a lot of things that are, you know, good a lot of things that are, you know, good a lot of things that are, you know, good for your ego. I get all of that. But for your ego. I get all of that. But for your ego. I get all of that. But also, also, also, it's just not worth it unless you it's just not worth it unless you it's just not worth it unless you understand that you hold an office understand that you hold an office understand that you hold an office in order to in order to in order to do things with policy and power to make do things with policy and power to make do things with policy and power to make people better off, not the other way people better off, not the other way people better off, not the other way around.

around. around. >> I guess the American people and >> I guess the American people and >> I guess the American people and everybody listening now will be everybody listening now will be everybody listening now will be thinking, "Fool me once." thinking, "Fool me once." thinking, "Fool me once." Secretary Pete Buttigieg because I've Secretary Pete Buttigieg because I've Secretary Pete Buttigieg because I've sat there and I've watched the elections sat there and I've watched the elections sat there and I've watched the elections and I all of them talk about bringing and I all of them talk about bringing and I all of them talk about bringing down the public debt and and then you I down the public debt and and then you I down the public debt and and then you I look at this graph and I go, "Oh, it look at this graph and I go, "Oh, it look at this graph and I go, "Oh, it goes up again." And Trump says the same goes up again." And Trump says the same goes up again." And Trump says the same about spending and nope, it's gone up about spending and nope, it's gone up about spending and nope, it's gone up again. again. again. It almost feels like in a way that I feel like you're trying to be nice. I feel like you're trying to be nice. No, no, no. I just I don't know. I can No, no, no. I just I don't know. I can No, no, no. I just I don't know. I can understand where people are sort of understand where people are sort of understand where people are sort of disenfranchised with politics. disenfranchised with politics. disenfranchised with politics. >> Yeah, me too. >> Yeah, me too. >> Yeah, me too. >> And I wonder if this is why they're >> And I wonder if this is why they're >> And I wonder if this is why they're picking a radical, you know, this is why picking a radical, you know, this is why picking a radical, you know, this is why and so and so and so >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> this is why Oh god. >> this is why Oh god. >> this is why Oh god. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Because this is disruption. This is kind >> Because this is disruption. This is kind >> Because this is disruption. This is kind of burn it down to some degree and of burn it down to some degree and of burn it down to some degree and >> Right. So, this is why everywhere I go >> Right. So, this is why everywhere I go >> Right. So, this is why everywhere I go I'm trying to talk to my own party I'm trying to talk to my own party I'm trying to talk to my own party about making sure that we understand about making sure that we understand about making sure that we understand that that that dealing with this dealing with this dealing with this is not is not is not the be-all and end-all. That our mission the be-all and end-all. That our mission the be-all and end-all. That our mission can't be to just take power and then go can't be to just take power and then go can't be to just take power and then go back to what we had before. back to what we had before. back to what we had before. That what we had before is actually what That what we had before is actually what That what we had before is actually what led to this. led to this. led to this. In other words, guys like Trump don't In other words, guys like Trump don't In other words, guys like Trump don't get very far unless you're already in an get very far unless you're already in an get very far unless you're already in an environment where the political and environment where the political and environment where the political and social and economic systems are letting social and economic systems are letting social and economic systems are letting people down.

people down. people down. Which is I think how we wound up here. Which is I think how we wound up here. Which is I think how we wound up here. And I worry there's a big temptation, And I worry there's a big temptation, And I worry there's a big temptation, there will be a big temptation in my there will be a big temptation in my there will be a big temptation in my party party party to say, "Okay, our job is to take power, to say, "Okay, our job is to take power, to say, "Okay, our job is to take power, turn back the clock, reverse the damage, turn back the clock, reverse the damage, turn back the clock, reverse the damage, fix what was broken, and get us back to fix what was broken, and get us back to fix what was broken, and get us back to where we were, get us back on track. I where we were, get us back on track. I where we were, get us back on track. I hear the word back a lot. I hear the hear the word back a lot. I hear the hear the word back a lot. I hear the prefix re a lot. Reverse, rebuild. And prefix re a lot. Reverse, rebuild. And prefix re a lot. Reverse, rebuild. And I'm very worried about that distracting I'm very worried about that distracting I'm very worried about that distracting from what our actual mission has to be. from what our actual mission has to be. from what our actual mission has to be. Which is to change and fix things so Which is to change and fix things so Which is to change and fix things so that we'll be set up well for the next that we'll be set up well for the next that we'll be set up well for the next 80 years. 80 years. 80 years. So that that's a harder project, for So that that's a harder project, for So that that's a harder project, for sure. But also sometimes sure. But also sometimes sure. But also sometimes the incentives change because the public the incentives change because the public the incentives change because the public is ready for something different. is ready for something different. is ready for something different. And I think the public tried one flavor And I think the public tried one flavor And I think the public tried one flavor of something different with Trumpism and of something different with Trumpism and of something different with Trumpism and is ready to spit it out. is ready to spit it out. is ready to spit it out. And so the question then is, okay, what And so the question then is, okay, what And so the question then is, okay, what are we offering in its place? And to me, are we offering in its place? And to me, are we offering in its place? And to me, that's where some very day-to-day things that's where some very day-to-day things that's where some very day-to-day things like like like setting up a better health care system setting up a better health care system setting up a better health care system >> Mhm.

>> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> or >> or >> or or reducing what we're paying in tariffs or reducing what we're paying in tariffs or reducing what we're paying in tariffs or better infrastructure or any any of or better infrastructure or any any of or better infrastructure or any any of the other policy, you know, paid family the other policy, you know, paid family the other policy, you know, paid family leave, all these policy things that I'd leave, all these policy things that I'd leave, all these policy things that I'd like to see happen. like to see happen. like to see happen. Really depend on Really depend on Really depend on fixing a political system that's just fixing a political system that's just fixing a political system that's just not as sexy. not as sexy. not as sexy. But But But it can be it can be it can be powerfully motivating because our powerfully motivating because our powerfully motivating because our country was started by people country was started by people country was started by people who fought a revolution who fought a revolution who fought a revolution to change the political system. I just to change the political system. I just to change the political system. I just can't imagine that it was just like can't imagine that it was just like can't imagine that it was just like Jefferson and Hamilton and these guys Jefferson and Hamilton and these guys Jefferson and Hamilton and these guys sitting in their studies sitting in their studies sitting in their studies reading, you know, John Locke and reading, you know, John Locke and reading, you know, John Locke and Rousseau and thinking, oh, it would be Rousseau and thinking, oh, it would be Rousseau and thinking, oh, it would be neat to try that somewhere. I I I think neat to try that somewhere. I I I think neat to try that somewhere. I I I think that they believed that like their lives that they believed that like their lives that they believed that like their lives and everybody's lives would be better, and everybody's lives would be better, and everybody's lives would be better, different if we actually had a different different if we actually had a different different if we actually had a different system. And then they risked violent system. And then they risked violent system. And then they risked violent death death death in order to challenge the existing in order to challenge the existing in order to challenge the existing political system that was the monarchy political system that was the monarchy political system that was the monarchy and replace it with the republic, the and replace it with the republic, the and replace it with the republic, the democratic country that they set up that democratic country that they set up that democratic country that they set up that is the United States of America, right?

is the United States of America, right? is the United States of America, right? So it's not like this can't stir So it's not like this can't stir So it's not like this can't stir passion. Should we not be a country passion. Should we not be a country passion. Should we not be a country where everybody's vote counts the same? where everybody's vote counts the same? where everybody's vote counts the same? That would mean a popular vote for the That would mean a popular vote for the That would mean a popular vote for the presidents. We ought to do that. I just presidents. We ought to do that. I just presidents. We ought to do that. I just think everybody's vote ought to count think everybody's vote ought to count think everybody's vote ought to count the same. the same. the same. And the person who gets the most votes And the person who gets the most votes And the person who gets the most votes ought to win. ought to win. ought to win. This is a hard thing for us to buy into This is a hard thing for us to buy into This is a hard thing for us to buy into in literally any other election we run in literally any other election we run in literally any other election we run in our political system. in our political system. in our political system. We need to do things like make it just We need to do things like make it just We need to do things like make it just ban gerrymandering where districts are ban gerrymandering where districts are ban gerrymandering where districts are being drawn. being drawn. being drawn. So consider this. We have 435 seats in So consider this. We have 435 seats in So consider this. We have 435 seats in the house. the house. the house. Nine out of 10 Nine out of 10 Nine out of 10 are so red or so blue are so red or so blue are so red or so blue that you basically know who's going to that you basically know who's going to that you basically know who's going to win win win before the first vote is cast. Nine out before the first vote is cast. Nine out before the first vote is cast. Nine out of 10. of 10. of 10. In a 50/50 country. In a 50/50 country. In a 50/50 country. That makes no sense. And of course what That makes no sense. And of course what That makes no sense. And of course what it leads to is the people in those seats it leads to is the people in those seats it leads to is the people in those seats are either are either are either very comfortable and not really worried very comfortable and not really worried very comfortable and not really worried about being responsive to the people. Or about being responsive to the people. Or about being responsive to the people. Or if they are in danger, if they are in danger, if they are in danger, they're in danger from their own side. they're in danger from their own side. they're in danger from their own side. What's amazing to me when I look at how What's amazing to me when I look at how What's amazing to me when I look at how Americans feel about certain big issues, Americans feel about certain big issues, Americans feel about certain big issues, like making sure there's health care for like making sure there's health care for like making sure there's health care for everybody, or raising the minimum wage, everybody, or raising the minimum wage, everybody, or raising the minimum wage, or having higher rates of taxes on the or having higher rates of taxes on the or having higher rates of taxes on the wealthy and on corporations, or wealthy and on corporations, or wealthy and on corporations, or background checks on guns, background checks on guns, background checks on guns, or marriage equality for same-sex or marriage equality for same-sex or marriage equality for same-sex couples, all kinds of things. There's couples, all kinds of things. There's couples, all kinds of things. There's like 60 or 70% agreement like 60 or 70% agreement like 60 or 70% agreement on most of the issues that most people on most of the issues that most people on most of the issues that most people tell pollsters they care about the most.

tell pollsters they care about the most. tell pollsters they care about the most. So how can we be a country that's got 60 So how can we be a country that's got 60 So how can we be a country that's got 60 or 70% agreement on issue after issue or 70% agreement on issue after issue or 70% agreement on issue after issue after issue? after issue? after issue? And we failed to get those policies done And we failed to get those policies done And we failed to get those policies done and we keep proceeding like it's normal and we keep proceeding like it's normal and we keep proceeding like it's normal to be a 50/50 country where everybody's to be a 50/50 country where everybody's to be a 50/50 country where everybody's at each other's throats. That to me is at each other's throats. That to me is at each other's throats. That to me is evidence of a broken evidence of a broken evidence of a broken system. If we don't fix the system, I system. If we don't fix the system, I system. If we don't fix the system, I don't think we're going to get going to don't think we're going to get going to don't think we're going to get going to get very far. get very far. get very far. >> It's interesting cuz when I think about >> It's interesting cuz when I think about >> It's interesting cuz when I think about the last sort of 20 years of politics we the last sort of 20 years of politics we the last sort of 20 years of politics we had, you know, the the Bush era, then we had, you know, the the Bush era, then we had, you know, the the Bush era, then we had had had Democrats and and so on that were very Democrats and and so on that were very Democrats and and so on that were very polished. Bush was kind of very polished polished. Bush was kind of very polished polished. Bush was kind of very polished as well. Then we had Biden who was um as well. Then we had Biden who was um as well. Then we had Biden who was um very polished, kind of like career very polished, kind of like career very polished, kind of like career politician, says the right things, reads politician, says the right things, reads politician, says the right things, reads off the teleprompter. And then it seems off the teleprompter. And then it seems off the teleprompter. And then it seems globally like people wanted some globally like people wanted some globally like people wanted some We had Brexit going on over there. We've We had Brexit going on over there. We've We had Brexit going on over there. We've got Nigel Farage increasing in got Nigel Farage increasing in got Nigel Farage increasing in popularity over the last 10 years or so popularity over the last 10 years or so popularity over the last 10 years or so as it relates to his political as it relates to his political as it relates to his political probabilities. And then over in the probabilities. And then over in the probabilities. And then over in the United States, we have Trump arrive. United States, we have Trump arrive. United States, we have Trump arrive. Again, not a career politician, not Again, not a career politician, not Again, not a career politician, not clean, not teleprompter kind of guy. If clean, not teleprompter kind of guy. If clean, not teleprompter kind of guy. If Democrats are to win, as you say, it's Democrats are to win, as you say, it's Democrats are to win, as you say, it's certainly not going to go back to the certainly not going to go back to the certainly not going to go back to the polished Joe Biden teleprompter. polished Joe Biden teleprompter. polished Joe Biden teleprompter. I almost think that there's going to I almost think that there's going to I almost think that there's going to need to be some disruptive character on need to be some disruptive character on need to be some disruptive character on the left side of politics to get to win the left side of politics to get to win the left side of politics to get to win over those independents some of those over those independents some of those over those independents some of those Republicans.

Republicans. Republicans. Is that Do you agree with that broadly? Is that Do you agree with that broadly? Is that Do you agree with that broadly? >> I think that's right. I mean, I think it >> I think that's right. I mean, I think it >> I think that's right. I mean, I think it depends what we mean by polished, right? depends what we mean by polished, right? depends what we mean by polished, right? That can mean a lot of different things, That can mean a lot of different things, That can mean a lot of different things, I think. I think. I think. Uh but I think you're talking about a Uh but I think you're talking about a Uh but I think you're talking about a sort of authenticity that people expect. sort of authenticity that people expect. sort of authenticity that people expect. And the paradox of Trump is he's And the paradox of Trump is he's And the paradox of Trump is he's authentic even when he's lying. Cuz he authentic even when he's lying. Cuz he authentic even when he's lying. Cuz he he it just seems like he's, you know, he it just seems like he's, you know, he it just seems like he's, you know, whatever he is, he's not reading talking whatever he is, he's not reading talking whatever he is, he's not reading talking points. At least, that's how it seems. I points. At least, that's how it seems. I points. At least, that's how it seems. I think also part of this is just the it's think also part of this is just the it's think also part of this is just the it's actually technology thing. So, the actually technology thing. So, the actually technology thing. So, the technology that dominated politics for technology that dominated politics for technology that dominated politics for as long as I've been alive was as long as I've been alive was as long as I've been alive was television. television. television. And And And I think it produced a generation of I think it produced a generation of I think it produced a generation of people. You know, George W. Bush, Bill people. You know, George W. Bush, Bill people. You know, George W. Bush, Bill Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, and Donald Trump were all born within a and Donald Trump were all born within a and Donald Trump were all born within a few weeks of each other. few weeks of each other. few weeks of each other. >> Really? >> Really? >> Really? >> Yeah, they were they were all products >> Yeah, they were they were all products >> Yeah, they were they were all products of the summer of I think it's 1946. of the summer of I think it's 1946. of the summer of I think it's 1946. Coming out of that generation, Joe Biden Coming out of that generation, Joe Biden Coming out of that generation, Joe Biden near to them in age, right? near to them in age, right? near to them in age, right? Into whatever is next, I think you're Into whatever is next, I think you're Into whatever is next, I think you're going to have leaders. I have this can going to have leaders. I have this can going to have leaders. I have this can be be be potentially a very good thing.

potentially a very good thing. potentially a very good thing. Who are just a little bit Who are just a little bit Who are just a little bit better able to just kind of show their better able to just kind of show their better able to just kind of show their humanity. Being a long podcast like this humanity. Being a long podcast like this humanity. Being a long podcast like this one, right? Like I remember when long one, right? Like I remember when long one, right? Like I remember when long form meant like maybe a 30-minute NPR form meant like maybe a 30-minute NPR form meant like maybe a 30-minute NPR interview. Now, you're sitting for interview. Now, you're sitting for interview. Now, you're sitting for sometimes two or three hours. I don't sometimes two or three hours. I don't sometimes two or three hours. I don't think it's possible as a matter of think it's possible as a matter of think it's possible as a matter of physical stamina to stay on talking physical stamina to stay on talking physical stamina to stay on talking points for two two or three hours even points for two two or three hours even points for two two or three hours even if you wanted to. Like it just you know, if you wanted to. Like it just you know, if you wanted to. Like it just you know, And so, you know, somebody once said And so, you know, somebody once said And so, you know, somebody once said that the running for office is like an that the running for office is like an that the running for office is like an MRI of the soul. Anyway. MRI of the soul. Anyway. MRI of the soul. Anyway. But that's even more true now than it But that's even more true now than it But that's even more true now than it used to be because you just used to be because you just used to be because you just there's so many different kind of ways there's so many different kind of ways there's so many different kind of ways of having to kind of show who you are. of having to kind of show who you are. of having to kind of show who you are. We used to imagine that the people in We used to imagine that the people in We used to imagine that the people in charge are just like next level charge are just like next level charge are just like next level like on a different plane of existence. like on a different plane of existence. like on a different plane of existence. And I think it's become harder and And I think it's become harder and And I think it's become harder and harder to believe that because it just harder to believe that because it just harder to believe that because it just we know too much, right? we know too much, right? we know too much, right? And so I think we're trading that for And so I think we're trading that for And so I think we're trading that for just wanting people that we just wanting people that we just wanting people that we have a reason to trust. have a reason to trust. have a reason to trust. >> We see the same across >> We see the same across >> We see the same across across business. We talked talked a lot across business. We talked talked a lot across business. We talked talked a lot about it over the last 10 years how about it over the last 10 years how about it over the last 10 years how we've shifted from this black box world we've shifted from this black box world we've shifted from this black box world where the PR department would pay would where the PR department would pay would where the PR department would pay would paint the image of the company on the paint the image of the company on the paint the image of the company on the outside of this black box. And then we outside of this black box. And then we outside of this black box. And then we moved because of phones and everyone has moved because of phones and everyone has moved because of phones and everyone has a mobile phone now and a camera in their a mobile phone now and a camera in their a mobile phone now and a camera in their pocket and social media platforms so pocket and social media platforms so pocket and social media platforms so they can give their own opinion. This they can give their own opinion. This they can give their own opinion. This glass box world where actually the job glass box world where actually the job glass box world where actually the job is to let everybody see inside.

is to let everybody see inside. is to let everybody see inside. Because if you don't, someone else will Because if you don't, someone else will Because if you don't, someone else will paint the black the box for you. So paint the black the box for you. So paint the black the box for you. So actually being defense became the big actually being defense became the big actually being defense became the big CEOs in the world now coming on podcast CEOs in the world now coming on podcast CEOs in the world now coming on podcast and having a personal brand and having a and having a personal brand and having a and having a personal brand and having a social media account. I would say I social media account. I would say I social media account. I would say I think the same to politicians that think the same to politicians that think the same to politicians that actually the winning strategy now is actually the winning strategy now is actually the winning strategy now is being a glass box which is yeah being a glass box which is yeah being a glass box which is yeah build your own reference points through build your own reference points through build your own reference points through transparency. transparency. transparency. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Which is why the podcast like this are I >> Which is why the podcast like this are I >> Which is why the podcast like this are I think probably going to dominate the think probably going to dominate the think probably going to dominate the next election cycle to some degree. next election cycle to some degree. next election cycle to some degree. >> Yeah, I think it's true not just for >> Yeah, I think it's true not just for >> Yeah, I think it's true not just for politics for even running and being a politics for even running and being a politics for even running and being a candidate. I think it's increasingly candidate. I think it's increasingly candidate. I think it's increasingly true for government, too. I mean I I true for government, too. I mean I I true for government, too. I mean I I started to feel this at the Department started to feel this at the Department started to feel this at the Department of Transportation. You're running this of Transportation. You're running this of Transportation. You're running this huge enterprise, 55,000 people, 145 huge enterprise, 55,000 people, 145 huge enterprise, 55,000 people, 145 billion dollars. It's bigger than most billion dollars. It's bigger than most billion dollars. It's bigger than most GDPs of most countries. GDPs of most countries. GDPs of most countries. And And And what I found was that there were so many what I found was that there were so many what I found was that there were so many situations where people situations where people situations where people who just are generally mistrustful of who just are generally mistrustful of who just are generally mistrustful of government or media would assume the government or media would assume the government or media would assume the worst. worst. worst. And the only antidote to that was to be And the only antidote to that was to be And the only antidote to that was to be way more transparent than a federal way more transparent than a federal way more transparent than a federal agency or department was used to being. agency or department was used to being. agency or department was used to being. But what I found was kind of the But what I found was kind of the But what I found was kind of the machinery of the department was not set machinery of the department was not set machinery of the department was not set up for that. up for that. up for that. It was designed to be It was designed to be It was designed to be you know, accountable but accountable in you know, accountable but accountable in you know, accountable but accountable in the sense that if there's something the sense that if there's something the sense that if there's something going on and a member of Congress is going on and a member of Congress is going on and a member of Congress is worried about it, they can write a worried about it, they can write a worried about it, they can write a letter and 6 months later they'll get a letter and 6 months later they'll get a letter and 6 months later they'll get a record. And I'm trying to figure out how record. And I'm trying to figure out how record. And I'm trying to figure out how do I cuz you know, I carry a phone in my do I cuz you know, I carry a phone in my do I cuz you know, I carry a phone in my pocket, too. Like how do I take it out pocket, too. Like how do I take it out pocket, too. Like how do I take it out sometimes and like shoot a video and sometimes and like shoot a video and sometimes and like shoot a video and like tell people what's going on?

like tell people what's going on? like tell people what's going on? Sometimes they're going to think that Sometimes they're going to think that Sometimes they're going to think that we're that we don't care about them, we're that we don't care about them, we're that we don't care about them, that we're putting a highway through that we're putting a highway through that we're putting a highway through their neighborhood and we don't care how their neighborhood and we don't care how their neighborhood and we don't care how it's going to hurt them or that we're it's going to hurt them or that we're it's going to hurt them or that we're not responding to a disaster in a not responding to a disaster in a not responding to a disaster in a Republican area because it's a Republican area because it's a Republican area because it's a Republican area or any other number of Republican area or any other number of Republican area or any other number of things with people things with people things with people might believe if we don't show them what might believe if we don't show them what might believe if we don't show them what we're actually doing and why. we're actually doing and why. we're actually doing and why. >> Go to Cap here. >> Go to Cap here. >> Go to Cap here. >> Okay. Pete Buttigieg 2020A. >> Okay. Pete Buttigieg 2020A. >> Okay. Pete Buttigieg 2020A. When you when you think about running When you when you think about running When you when you think about running for president or being president of the for president or being president of the for president or being president of the United States, the most powerful nation United States, the most powerful nation United States, the most powerful nation on Earth, on Earth, on Earth, do you not have imposter syndrome? And do you not have imposter syndrome? And do you not have imposter syndrome? And what is it about the job that you think what is it about the job that you think what is it about the job that you think cuz you know, it's pretty crazy for anyone to think it's pretty crazy for anyone to think they could run the most powerful nation they could run the most powerful nation they could run the most powerful nation on Earth and not think, "God, there's a on Earth and not think, "God, there's a on Earth and not think, "God, there's a couple of things that I'm not going to couple of things that I'm not going to couple of things that I'm not going to be great at." be great at." be great at." >> Yeah, I mean, the whole idea of the >> Yeah, I mean, the whole idea of the >> Yeah, I mean, the whole idea of the system was that system was that system was that no one person should have too much no one person should have too much no one person should have too much power, right? That's why we got rid of power, right? That's why we got rid of power, right? That's why we got rid of monarchy. monarchy. monarchy. But we've wound up with this presidency But we've wound up with this presidency But we've wound up with this presidency that uniquely in our country, not just that uniquely in our country, not just that uniquely in our country, not just the country, the world, right? Has this the country, the world, right? Has this the country, the world, right? Has this incredible amount of power that the incredible amount of power that the incredible amount of power that the lives of billions of people go lives of billions of people go lives of billions of people go differently and could be much better or differently and could be much better or differently and could be much better or could be much worse could be much worse could be much worse based on decisions that get made in that based on decisions that get made in that based on decisions that get made in that office. And the idea that we would have office. And the idea that we would have office. And the idea that we would have just one human being doing that just one human being doing that just one human being doing that is on some level terrifying. But, you is on some level terrifying. But, you is on some level terrifying. But, you know, part of what we did as a country know, part of what we did as a country know, part of what we did as a country is we set up a whole bunch of things is we set up a whole bunch of things is we set up a whole bunch of things around that human being.

around that human being. around that human being. And And And that's everything from like advisors to that's everything from like advisors to that's everything from like advisors to laws to Congress, you know, and the laws to Congress, you know, and the laws to Congress, you know, and the courts like to make sure that there's courts like to make sure that there's courts like to make sure that there's some balance to try to make sure that some balance to try to make sure that some balance to try to make sure that that whoever's in that seat that whoever's in that seat that whoever's in that seat can make the best decisions they can make the best decisions they can make the best decisions they possibly could possibly could possibly could and and has to act within certain and and has to act within certain and and has to act within certain boundaries. But yeah, I mean, look all boundaries. But yeah, I mean, look all boundaries. But yeah, I mean, look all the way down to when I was elected mayor the way down to when I was elected mayor the way down to when I was elected mayor and I was in my 20s. Like obviously I and I was in my 20s. Like obviously I and I was in my 20s. Like obviously I believed I could do the job or I believed I could do the job or I believed I could do the job or I wouldn't have run for it. But you know, wouldn't have run for it. But you know, wouldn't have run for it. But you know, even just walking into the office of the even just walking into the office of the even just walking into the office of the mayor of the fourth largest city in mayor of the fourth largest city in mayor of the fourth largest city in Indiana on the 14th floor of the county Indiana on the 14th floor of the county Indiana on the 14th floor of the county city building, and the snow's coming city building, and the snow's coming city building, and the snow's coming down the first day I It was New Year's down the first day I It was New Year's down the first day I It was New Year's Day, first day I was officially in Day, first day I was officially in Day, first day I was officially in office, and I'm thinking office, and I'm thinking office, and I'm thinking I'm now responsible for making sure the I'm now responsible for making sure the I'm now responsible for making sure the snow gets plowed. And And And if we snow gets plowed. And And And if we snow gets plowed. And And And if we don't do it right, not only will I get don't do it right, not only will I get don't do it right, not only will I get in trouble politically, but somebody in trouble politically, but somebody in trouble politically, but somebody could be harmed, right? But I think any could be harmed, right? But I think any could be harmed, right? But I think any office, any job like you have to office, any job like you have to office, any job like you have to let that weight let that weight let that weight sit on your shoulders and then have it sit on your shoulders and then have it sit on your shoulders and then have it push you to be better at the job. push you to be better at the job. push you to be better at the job. >> That's the >> That's the >> That's the >> Oh, there we go. >> Oh, there we go. >> Oh, there we go. >> There we go. >> There we go. >> There we go. >> Yeah. Yeah, that was election day.

>> Yeah. Yeah, that was election day. >> Yeah. Yeah, that was election day. That was a great feeling. But I I That was a great feeling. But I I That was a great feeling. But I I remember also immediately feeling this remember also immediately feeling this remember also immediately feeling this thrill of of of having won. And if thrill of of of having won. And if thrill of of of having won. And if you're a competitive person, it's also you're a competitive person, it's also you're a competitive person, it's also the excitement of having the excitement of having the excitement of having beaten your competitors, but having to beaten your competitors, but having to beaten your competitors, but having to balance that with, "Okay, I said balance that with, "Okay, I said balance that with, "Okay, I said that if you elected me, I'd be able to that if you elected me, I'd be able to that if you elected me, I'd be able to get these things done, and now get these things done, and now get these things done, and now I actually got to produce." I actually got to produce." I actually got to produce." >> Are you scared of the consequences of >> Are you scared of the consequences of >> Are you scared of the consequences of being president one day? being president one day? being president one day? >> Any president should be. Anybody who's >> Any president should be. Anybody who's >> Any president should be. Anybody who's even being seriously talked about or even being seriously talked about or even being seriously talked about or considered for it should be. It puts you considered for it should be. It puts you considered for it should be. It puts you in a position where you have a in a position where you have a in a position where you have a responsibility to say things that make responsibility to say things that make responsibility to say things that make sense, and think about what you have to sense, and think about what you have to sense, and think about what you have to say, and know that your words, even if say, and know that your words, even if say, and know that your words, even if you have no official power, but that you have no official power, but that you have no official power, but that still things that you do or say could still things that you do or say could still things that you do or say could help or hurt people. Just by Just by help or hurt people. Just by Just by help or hurt people. Just by Just by talking. Just by going on a podcast that talking. Just by going on a podcast that talking. Just by going on a podcast that millions of people listen to. millions of people listen to. millions of people listen to. >> And there's really four front-runners um >> And there's really four front-runners um >> And there's really four front-runners um according to the data that I saw, which according to the data that I saw, which according to the data that I saw, which is yourself, is yourself, is yourself, Gavin Newsom, Gavin Newsom, Gavin Newsom, AOC, AOC, AOC, and Kamala Harris. and Kamala Harris. and Kamala Harris. I've now interviewed three of them. I've now interviewed three of them. I've now interviewed three of them. Which one haven't I got to yet? Which one haven't I got to yet? Which one haven't I got to yet? AOC. I think this thing is in the works. AOC. I think this thing is in the works. AOC. I think this thing is in the works. Very different Very different Very different candidates, I'd say.

candidates, I'd say. candidates, I'd say. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> As individuals. >> As individuals. >> As individuals. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> If not you, then which one of them >> If not you, then which one of them >> If not you, then which one of them >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> is just a better idea to answer that >> is just a better idea to answer that >> is just a better idea to answer that question. question. question. >> I'm sorry. Like I want to be >> I'm sorry. Like I want to be >> I'm sorry. Like I want to be transparent, but like transparent, but like transparent, but like >> You must have an answer, though. >> You must have an answer, though. >> You must have an answer, though. >> I don't know. >> I don't know. >> I don't know. >> Let the truth set you free, secretary. >> Let the truth set you free, secretary. >> Let the truth set you free, secretary. Kamala, I I met her, she was lovely. Kamala, I I met her, she was lovely. Kamala, I I met her, she was lovely. Kevin's nice. Kevin's nice. Kevin's nice. >> Which one are you closest friends with? >> Which one are you closest friends with? >> Which one are you closest friends with? >> I mean the one I've spent most time with >> I mean the one I've spent most time with >> I mean the one I've spent most time with is is is is her because, you know, she was vice is her because, you know, she was vice is her because, you know, she was vice president and I was working president and I was working president and I was working transportation and there were times we transportation and there were times we transportation and there were times we traveled together. She was very involved traveled together. She was very involved traveled together. She was very involved in trying to get the infrastructure bill in trying to get the infrastructure bill in trying to get the infrastructure bill done, which was kind of the biggest done, which was kind of the biggest done, which was kind of the biggest thing that I worked on, the the thing that I worked on, the the thing that I worked on, the the legislation did to get roads and bridges legislation did to get roads and bridges legislation did to get roads and bridges and airports. and airports. and airports. >> Is she misunderstood? >> Is she misunderstood? >> Is she misunderstood? >> I think anybody in at that level is >> I think anybody in at that level is >> I think anybody in at that level is misunderstood. There's just uh misunderstood. There's just uh misunderstood. There's just uh I don't know that I can I don't know that I can I don't know that I can I don't know if I'm qualified to I don't know if I'm qualified to I don't know if I'm qualified to evaluate kind of more than more or less evaluate kind of more than more or less evaluate kind of more than more or less than than than other people in that job. I think other people in that job. I think other people in that job. I think anybody the vice presidency or any job anybody the vice presidency or any job anybody the vice presidency or any job with that visibility with that visibility with that visibility puts you in a position where it's hard for people to see your it's hard for people to see your humanity humanity humanity when you're when you're when you're bearing the responsibility that you bearing the responsibility that you bearing the responsibility that you have.

have. have. And even at other levels of government, And even at other levels of government, And even at other levels of government, I think this is this is true. I think this is this is true. I think this is this is true. I think high office does that, but I I think high office does that, but I I think high office does that, but I think office that high, especially, does think office that high, especially, does think office that high, especially, does it. it. it. >> Do you think she could be a good >> Do you think she could be a good >> Do you think she could be a good president? president? president? >> Sure. I mean I campaigned for her >> Sure. I mean I campaigned for her >> Sure. I mean I campaigned for her very energetically when she was running very energetically when she was running very energetically when she was running for president. I went all over the for president. I went all over the for president. I went all over the country uh trying to convince America to country uh trying to convince America to country uh trying to convince America to elect her. And um I did that because I elect her. And um I did that because I elect her. And um I did that because I thought she'd be a very good president. thought she'd be a very good president. thought she'd be a very good president. >> What about Gavin Newsom? >> What about Gavin Newsom? >> What about Gavin Newsom? >> Yeah, he's he's been uh he's not someone >> Yeah, he's he's been uh he's not someone >> Yeah, he's he's been uh he's not someone I know as well as as her, but he's I know as well as as her, but he's I know as well as as her, but he's somebody I've worked with a lot. somebody I've worked with a lot. somebody I've worked with a lot. Obviously, California was the place we Obviously, California was the place we Obviously, California was the place we were doing a lot of our best were doing a lot of our best were doing a lot of our best infrastructure work and he's somebody infrastructure work and he's somebody infrastructure work and he's somebody who who who I think he understands how to break I think he understands how to break I think he understands how to break through in this kind of attention world through in this kind of attention world through in this kind of attention world that we're in that we're in that we're in um um um where where where you know, the old formats and the old you know, the old formats and the old you know, the old formats and the old norms norms norms um just don't cut it anymore in terms of um just don't cut it anymore in terms of um just don't cut it anymore in terms of getting your message across. getting your message across. getting your message across. >> And AOC? >> And AOC? >> And AOC? >> I think she has spoken to >> I think she has spoken to >> I think she has spoken to so many people who understand that the so many people who understand that the so many people who understand that the system is letting them down. I might not system is letting them down. I might not system is letting them down. I might not agree with her on every policy. For agree with her on every policy. For agree with her on every policy. For example, on the infrastructure law that example, on the infrastructure law that example, on the infrastructure law that I worked with the Vice President on and I worked with the Vice President on and I worked with the Vice President on and worked with with Gavin on, worked with with Gavin on, worked with with Gavin on, she didn't see that the way we did. You she didn't see that the way we did. You she didn't see that the way we did. You know, I respect that she has activated a know, I respect that she has activated a know, I respect that she has activated a lot of young people, not just young lot of young people, not just young lot of young people, not just young people. She's activated a lot of people people. She's activated a lot of people people. She's activated a lot of people who were looking around saying, "The way who were looking around saying, "The way who were looking around saying, "The way things work things work things work doesn't serve me." And there's the doesn't serve me." And there's the doesn't serve me." And there's the generational thing. And when I ran for generational thing. And when I ran for generational thing. And when I ran for president, I was running on president, I was running on president, I was running on largely on a message of generational largely on a message of generational largely on a message of generational change.

change. change. I didn't win, I didn't win, I didn't win, obviously. obviously. obviously. >> Joe Biden won, you got behind him. Mhm. >> Joe Biden won, you got behind him. Mhm. >> Joe Biden won, you got behind him. Mhm. Near the end of his uh his time as Near the end of his uh his time as Near the end of his uh his time as president, he I mean, we all saw it. We president, he I mean, we all saw it. We president, he I mean, we all saw it. We saw him go out and do those debates saw him go out and do those debates saw him go out and do those debates against Trump. against Trump. against Trump. And I think it was obvious to anyone And I think it was obvious to anyone And I think it was obvious to anyone who's being intellectually honest with who's being intellectually honest with who's being intellectually honest with themselves and objective that Joe Biden themselves and objective that Joe Biden themselves and objective that Joe Biden wasn't the same Joe Biden that we've wasn't the same Joe Biden that we've wasn't the same Joe Biden that we've seen over the last 20, 30 years. And seen over the last 20, 30 years. And seen over the last 20, 30 years. And that something had changed quite that something had changed quite that something had changed quite considerably with his cognitive considerably with his cognitive considerably with his cognitive performance. performance. performance. Um Um Um Did you Were you aware of that? Cuz you Did you Were you aware of that? Cuz you Did you Were you aware of that? Cuz you were in his you were part of his team at were in his you were part of his team at were in his you were part of his team at that time. Were you aware that something that time. Were you aware that something that time. Were you aware that something was different? I saw the same thing that was different? I saw the same thing that was different? I saw the same thing that America saw, right? Um it's not like I America saw, right? Um it's not like I America saw, right? Um it's not like I was in a room with him every day, but was in a room with him every day, but was in a room with him every day, but you know, whether it was in front of you know, whether it was in front of you know, whether it was in front of cameras or whether it was I was invited cameras or whether it was I was invited cameras or whether it was I was invited to be in a meeting at the White House. to be in a meeting at the White House. to be in a meeting at the White House. Uh I saw what America saw, which is that Uh I saw what America saw, which is that Uh I saw what America saw, which is that he was getting older. he was getting older. he was getting older. >> I mean, cognitive performance is pretty >> I mean, cognitive performance is pretty >> I mean, cognitive performance is pretty important for the important for the important for the the most powerful job on earth, yeah? the most powerful job on earth, yeah? the most powerful job on earth, yeah? Were you concerned? Were you concerned? Were you concerned? >> I was definitely concerned when I saw >> I was definitely concerned when I saw >> I was definitely concerned when I saw the debate. the debate. the debate. I mean, I mean, I mean, >> You weren't concerned at any point >> You weren't concerned at any point >> You weren't concerned at any point before the debate? before the debate? before the debate? >> Up until that moment, I I saw that he >> Up until that moment, I I saw that he >> Up until that moment, I I saw that he was visibly growing older, but there's was visibly growing older, but there's was visibly growing older, but there's never some moment where I saw him like never some moment where I saw him like never some moment where I saw him like make a different decision or at least in make a different decision or at least in make a different decision or at least in terms of anything that I was involved terms of anything that I was involved terms of anything that I was involved with in transportation that I thought it with in transportation that I thought it with in transportation that I thought it was going different or worse or I was going different or worse or I was going different or worse or I couldn't get what I needed from him or couldn't get what I needed from him or couldn't get what I needed from him or from the White House because of his age.

from the White House because of his age. from the White House because of his age. But, of course, the job is not just But, of course, the job is not just But, of course, the job is not just policy guidance. But, the job is also to policy guidance. But, the job is also to policy guidance. But, the job is also to convey and communicate to the American convey and communicate to the American convey and communicate to the American people like what your administration is people like what your administration is people like what your administration is doing and why. That's the job of a doing and why. That's the job of a doing and why. That's the job of a president. It's in in some ways 100% the president. It's in in some ways 100% the president. It's in in some ways 100% the job of a candidate. job of a candidate. job of a candidate. And there was no watching the debate and And there was no watching the debate and And there was no watching the debate and not realizing how much of a burden that not realizing how much of a burden that not realizing how much of a burden that was. was. was. >> You just said then that um you were even >> You just said then that um you were even >> You just said then that um you were even conscious of like even in this medium conscious of like even in this medium conscious of like even in this medium every sentence counts. every sentence counts. every sentence counts. >> Mhm. Yeah. >> Mhm. Yeah. >> Mhm. Yeah. >> You say one sentence, that's the wrong >> You say one sentence, that's the wrong >> You say one sentence, that's the wrong sentence. Theoretically, it could have sentence. Theoretically, it could have sentence. Theoretically, it could have consequences. And that and you just said consequences. And that and you just said consequences. And that and you just said it, this is a someone that doesn't it, this is a someone that doesn't it, this is a someone that doesn't currently have a job. But President of currently have a job. But President of currently have a job. But President of the United States, Joe Biden, muddling the United States, Joe Biden, muddling the United States, Joe Biden, muddling up his sentences in front of the nation up his sentences in front of the nation up his sentences in front of the nation like he did in that debate like he did in that debate like he did in that debate >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> is um >> is um >> is um it's probably not good enough it's probably not good enough it's probably not good enough >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> to be in that in that position. >> to be in that in that position. >> to be in that in that position. >> Yeah. And that was the beginning, of >> Yeah. And that was the beginning, of >> Yeah. And that was the beginning, of course, of the process that led him to course, of the process that led him to course, of the process that led him to reach the same conclusion. reach the same conclusion. reach the same conclusion. >> Did you have a private conversation with >> Did you have a private conversation with >> Did you have a private conversation with him? him? him? >> No, I wasn't I was in the cabinet, but >> No, I wasn't I was in the cabinet, but >> No, I wasn't I was in the cabinet, but that doesn't mean I was invited to rooms that doesn't mean I was invited to rooms that doesn't mean I was invited to rooms when they were talking about things like when they were talking about things like when they were talking about things like whether he's going to run for president whether he's going to run for president whether he's going to run for president again.

again. again. >> Did the Democrats make the right >> Did the Democrats make the right >> Did the Democrats make the right decision there, 100 100 days until the decision there, 100 100 days until the decision there, 100 100 days until the election to election to election to swap in Kamala Harris at that point? swap in Kamala Harris at that point? swap in Kamala Harris at that point? Look, in hindsight, if you were honest Look, in hindsight, if you were honest Look, in hindsight, if you were honest with yourself. with yourself. with yourself. >> Yeah. I I I thought about that a lot, >> Yeah. I I I thought about that a lot, >> Yeah. I I I thought about that a lot, because I think in the moment it felt because I think in the moment it felt because I think in the moment it felt like, oh, we have very little time. like, oh, we have very little time. like, oh, we have very little time. We've all got to pull together. We've We've all got to pull together. We've We've all got to pull together. We've got to put ego aside. got to put ego aside. got to put ego aside. We've got to put uh kind of internal We've got to put uh kind of internal We've got to put uh kind of internal politics aside, and we got to quickly politics aside, and we got to quickly politics aside, and we got to quickly speak with one voice. Partly because speak with one voice. Partly because speak with one voice. Partly because I knew uh I knew uh I knew uh and we all knew and we all knew and we all knew what could happen to this country if what could happen to this country if what could happen to this country if Donald Trump was elected again. And I Donald Trump was elected again. And I Donald Trump was elected again. And I believe all of those harms, and then believe all of those harms, and then believe all of those harms, and then some, have come to pass. some, have come to pass. some, have come to pass. But the other side of the coin is, if But the other side of the coin is, if But the other side of the coin is, if there had been some way to have a there had been some way to have a there had been some way to have a competition competition competition even with that very short timeline I even with that very short timeline I even with that very short timeline I think that think that think that even if the candidate had still been even if the candidate had still been even if the candidate had still been Kamala Harris, I think she likely would Kamala Harris, I think she likely would Kamala Harris, I think she likely would have been a better candidate. I think in have been a better candidate. I think in have been a better candidate. I think in 2020, Joe Biden was a better candidate 2020, Joe Biden was a better candidate 2020, Joe Biden was a better candidate because he had to compete with Kamala because he had to compete with Kamala because he had to compete with Kamala Harris and me and like 18 other Harris and me and like 18 other Harris and me and like 18 other Democrats before winning Democrats before winning Democrats before winning that process. And that process. And that process. And I think that I think that I think that in general, we know the competition in general, we know the competition in general, we know the competition sharpens you. We know the competition sharpens you. We know the competition sharpens you. We know the competition gets more information out.

gets more information out. gets more information out. Um and I'm not saying I have it all Um and I'm not saying I have it all Um and I'm not saying I have it all solved in my head how that could have solved in my head how that could have solved in my head how that could have been done on the timeline that we faced. been done on the timeline that we faced. been done on the timeline that we faced. Or what it would have been like. Or what it would have been like. Or what it would have been like. But I think with the hindsight that we But I think with the hindsight that we But I think with the hindsight that we have now, I think it's pretty clear that have now, I think it's pretty clear that have now, I think it's pretty clear that we would have been better off if we had we would have been better off if we had we would have been better off if we had that. that. that. >> You know, we talked about that maybe >> You know, we talked about that maybe >> You know, we talked about that maybe people are looking for something a people are looking for something a people are looking for something a little bit more radical this time little bit more radical this time little bit more radical this time around. around. around. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> What are your most radical ideas as it >> What are your most radical ideas as it >> What are your most radical ideas as it relates to policies you would relates to policies you would relates to policies you would be in favor of? I know you would um be in favor of? I know you would um be in favor of? I know you would um you're keen to remove the Electoral you're keen to remove the Electoral you're keen to remove the Electoral College. College. College. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And do it based on numbers, that the >> And do it based on numbers, that the >> And do it based on numbers, that the quantity of votes for either quantity of votes for either quantity of votes for either presidential candidate. presidential candidate. presidential candidate. >> And I still can't believe that anybody >> And I still can't believe that anybody >> And I still can't believe that anybody considers this radical. Like to me it's considers this radical. Like to me it's considers this radical. Like to me it's there's nothing radical about thinking there's nothing radical about thinking there's nothing radical about thinking the person who gets the most votes ought the person who gets the most votes ought the person who gets the most votes ought to be the winner. to be the winner. to be the winner. But I think people haven't thought But I think people haven't thought But I think people haven't thought through through through how much benefit would come from that. how much benefit would come from that. how much benefit would come from that. If we did that, If we did that, If we did that, there are so many votes in red and blue there are so many votes in red and blue there are so many votes in red and blue states that you couldn't ignore anymore. states that you couldn't ignore anymore. states that you couldn't ignore anymore. Like if you were running for president Like if you were running for president Like if you were running for president as a Democrat, you'd have to go to as a Democrat, you'd have to go to as a Democrat, you'd have to go to Texas. Texas. Texas. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And even if >> And even if >> And even if Texas is still going to vote mostly for Texas is still going to vote mostly for Texas is still going to vote mostly for Republicans, you'd have to turn out Republicans, you'd have to turn out Republicans, you'd have to turn out every Democratic vote you could in every Democratic vote you could in every Democratic vote you could in Texas.

Texas. Texas. And I just think we'd be so much better And I just think we'd be so much better And I just think we'd be so much better off if a Republican and Democratic off if a Republican and Democratic off if a Republican and Democratic candidate were competing over Texas. And candidate were competing over Texas. And candidate were competing over Texas. And by the way, New York, even if New York by the way, New York, even if New York by the way, New York, even if New York is definitely going to vote more for is definitely going to vote more for is definitely going to vote more for Democrats, a Republican candidate would Democrats, a Republican candidate would Democrats, a Republican candidate would have to come to New York. have to come to New York. have to come to New York. And states from Alaska to Rhode Island, And states from Alaska to Rhode Island, And states from Alaska to Rhode Island, so it's small states, too, that get so it's small states, too, that get so it's small states, too, that get ignored now, ignored now, ignored now, would finally be part of this would finally be part of this would finally be part of this competition. So yeah, Electoral College competition. So yeah, Electoral College competition. So yeah, Electoral College for sure. for sure. for sure. Supreme Court needs to change. Supreme Court needs to change. Supreme Court needs to change. >> Court? What would you do to the Supreme >> Court? What would you do to the Supreme >> Court? What would you do to the Supreme Court? Court? Court? >> I would have term limits, more justices, >> I would have term limits, more justices, >> I would have term limits, more justices, and and and some process that makes it less partisan some process that makes it less partisan some process that makes it less partisan who the justices are. Some different who the justices are. Some different who the justices are. Some different ways to do that. The one I think is most ways to do that. The one I think is most ways to do that. The one I think is most interesting is called the balanced bench interesting is called the balanced bench interesting is called the balanced bench proposal. You have a mix. But anyway, proposal. You have a mix. But anyway, proposal. You have a mix. But anyway, the point is that it needs to change. the point is that it needs to change. the point is that it needs to change. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Uh House of Representatives Uh House of Representatives Uh House of Representatives like I said earlier should be like I said earlier should be like I said earlier should be proportional. proportional. proportional. >> What does that mean? >> What does that mean? >> What does that mean? >> It means that I was saying earlier how >> It means that I was saying earlier how >> It means that I was saying earlier how it worked for like it worked for like it worked for like school board or city council where school board or city council where school board or city council where sometimes you get more than one vote and sometimes you get more than one vote and sometimes you get more than one vote and more than one person wins. We could do more than one person wins. We could do more than one person wins. We could do that for Congress. The people get the that for Congress. The people get the that for Congress. The people get the top three votes, not just one. Get to go top three votes, not just one. Get to go top three votes, not just one. Get to go to Congress. So you'd have bigger to Congress. So you'd have bigger to Congress. So you'd have bigger districts, fewer districts, harder to districts, fewer districts, harder to districts, fewer districts, harder to gerrymander.

gerrymander. gerrymander. By the way, an easier change that I By the way, an easier change that I By the way, an easier change that I think we should do right away is ban think we should do right away is ban think we should do right away is ban gerrymandering. gerrymandering. gerrymandering. >> That's a good four things there. >> That's a good four things there. >> That's a good four things there. >> Uh let me give you one more. >> Uh let me give you one more. >> Uh let me give you one more. Constitutional Amendment to deal with Constitutional Amendment to deal with Constitutional Amendment to deal with money in politics. money in politics. money in politics. If the Supreme Court said in the If the Supreme Court said in the If the Supreme Court said in the Citizens United decision that a Citizens United decision that a Citizens United decision that a corporation is the same thing as a corporation is the same thing as a corporation is the same thing as a person for these purposes and that person for these purposes and that person for these purposes and that spending money to manipulate an election spending money to manipulate an election spending money to manipulate an election is the same constitutionally protected is the same constitutionally protected is the same constitutionally protected behavior as writing an op-ed or carrying behavior as writing an op-ed or carrying behavior as writing an op-ed or carrying a sign at a protest, we need to clarify a sign at a protest, we need to clarify a sign at a protest, we need to clarify that corporate spending is not speech that corporate spending is not speech that corporate spending is not speech and corporations are not citizens, and corporations are not citizens, and corporations are not citizens, people in the same way that that a human people in the same way that that a human people in the same way that that a human being is. And we can do that with a being is. And we can do that with a being is. And we can do that with a constitutional amendment. constitutional amendment. constitutional amendment. >> And so what would that mean? It would >> And so what would that mean? It would >> And so what would that mean? It would mean that you couldn't just if a company mean that you couldn't just if a company mean that you couldn't just if a company couldn't just pump money into a couldn't just pump money into a couldn't just pump money into a political campaign. political campaign. political campaign. >> Right. Congress could have Then you >> Right. Congress could have Then you >> Right. Congress could have Then you could actually have laws, which we used could actually have laws, which we used could actually have laws, which we used to have, like the McCain-Feingold law, to have, like the McCain-Feingold law, to have, like the McCain-Feingold law, which was struck down in Citizens which was struck down in Citizens which was struck down in Citizens United, but we could get to where United, but we could get to where United, but we could get to where Congress can once more have laws saying Congress can once more have laws saying Congress can once more have laws saying that you can't put unlimited that you can't put unlimited that you can't put unlimited unaccountable corporate dark money into unaccountable corporate dark money into unaccountable corporate dark money into a super PAC to manipulate how an a super PAC to manipulate how an a super PAC to manipulate how an election's going to go. And it's one election's going to go. And it's one election's going to go. And it's one more of these things that like more of these things that like more of these things that like two-thirds of the people think we ought two-thirds of the people think we ought two-thirds of the people think we ought to do.

to do. to do. >> Why doesn't it happen then? >> Why doesn't it happen then? >> Why doesn't it happen then? >> Because so many people who are already >> Because so many people who are already >> Because so many people who are already in office like the system just the way in office like the system just the way in office like the system just the way it is. And because of the Supreme Court. it is. And because of the Supreme Court. it is. And because of the Supreme Court. I actually think you could get it I actually think you could get it I actually think you could get it through Congress, but the Supreme Court through Congress, but the Supreme Court through Congress, but the Supreme Court won't let you because their won't let you because their won't let you because their interpretation of the Constitution is interpretation of the Constitution is interpretation of the Constitution is that you can't have these kinds of that you can't have these kinds of that you can't have these kinds of rules. So what do you do? If necessary, rules. So what do you do? If necessary, rules. So what do you do? If necessary, amend the Constitution. People forget amend the Constitution. People forget amend the Constitution. People forget that the best thing about the that the best thing about the that the best thing about the Constitution Constitution Constitution is its capability to be amended. When we is its capability to be amended. When we is its capability to be amended. When we talk about the most cherished part of talk about the most cherished part of talk about the most cherished part of the Constitution, the Constitution, the Constitution, many people will say the First many people will say the First many people will say the First Amendment, right? That's the one that Amendment, right? That's the one that Amendment, right? That's the one that gives us free speech. And we miss that gives us free speech. And we miss that gives us free speech. And we miss that the word amendment being in there the word amendment being in there the word amendment being in there signals to us signals to us signals to us that it wasn't part of the original text that it wasn't part of the original text that it wasn't part of the original text of the Constitution. It's an amendment. of the Constitution. It's an amendment. of the Constitution. It's an amendment. It's something they had to add on after. It's something they had to add on after. It's something they had to add on after. So is the Second Amendment. I mean, all So is the Second Amendment. I mean, all So is the Second Amendment. I mean, all of them, by definition, right? of them, by definition, right? of them, by definition, right? So we shouldn't be afraid of that kind So we shouldn't be afraid of that kind So we shouldn't be afraid of that kind of thing. It's only by an amendment that of thing. It's only by an amendment that of thing. It's only by an amendment that we get to pick who our senators are. we get to pick who our senators are. we get to pick who our senators are. Before that, it was the legislature. Before that, it was the legislature. Before that, it was the legislature. Same thing for making sure that black Same thing for making sure that black Same thing for making sure that black voters and and and the women could be voters and and and the women could be voters and and and the women could be voters. We shouldn't be afraid voters. We shouldn't be afraid voters. We shouldn't be afraid to use maybe the most elegant feature of to use maybe the most elegant feature of to use maybe the most elegant feature of the entire Constitution, the entire Constitution, the entire Constitution, which is that it has a process which is that it has a process which is that it has a process to change it.

to change it. to change it. We should use it. All of the things you We should use it. All of the things you We should use it. All of the things you I've mentioned are these kind of system I've mentioned are these kind of system I've mentioned are these kind of system reforms. They're about the engine. So reforms. They're about the engine. So reforms. They're about the engine. So then the policies, what comes out of the then the policies, what comes out of the then the policies, what comes out of the engine, like do we get paid family leave engine, like do we get paid family leave engine, like do we get paid family leave in this country? Do have fair taxes? Is in this country? Do have fair taxes? Is in this country? Do have fair taxes? Is there a health care system that gives there a health care system that gives there a health care system that gives everybody health care? All that stuff is everybody health care? All that stuff is everybody health care? All that stuff is decided by a government that works decided by a government that works decided by a government that works better. better. better. >> Much of the reason most people haven't >> Much of the reason most people haven't >> Much of the reason most people haven't posted content or built their personal posted content or built their personal posted content or built their personal brand is because it's hard and it's time brand is because it's hard and it's time brand is because it's hard and it's time consuming and we're all very very busy. consuming and we're all very very busy. consuming and we're all very very busy. And if you've never posted something And if you've never posted something And if you've never posted something before, before, before, there's so many factors in your there's so many factors in your there's so many factors in your psychology that stop you wanting to psychology that stop you wanting to psychology that stop you wanting to post. What people will think of you. Am post. What people will think of you. Am post. What people will think of you. Am I doing this right? Is the thing I'm I doing this right? Is the thing I'm I doing this right? Is the thing I'm saying absolutely stupid? All of these saying absolutely stupid? All of these saying absolutely stupid? All of these result in paralysis, which means you result in paralysis, which means you result in paralysis, which means you don't post and your feed goes better. don't post and your feed goes better. don't post and your feed goes better. I'm an investor in a company called I'm an investor in a company called I'm an investor in a company called Stand Store, which you've probably heard Stand Store, which you've probably heard Stand Store, which you've probably heard me talk about. And what they've been me talk about. And what they've been me talk about. And what they've been building is this new tool called Stanley building is this new tool called Stanley building is this new tool called Stanley that uses AI, looks at your feed, looks that uses AI, looks at your feed, looks that uses AI, looks at your feed, looks at your tone of voice, looks at your at your tone of voice, looks at your at your tone of voice, looks at your history, looks at your best performing history, looks at your best performing history, looks at your best performing posts and tells you what you should posts and tells you what you should posts and tells you what you should post, makes those posts for you. You can post, makes those posts for you. You can post, makes those posts for you. You can also just use it for inspiration. And also just use it for inspiration. And also just use it for inspiration. And sometimes what we need when we're sometimes what we need when we're sometimes what we need when we're thinking about doing a post for our thinking about doing a post for our thinking about doing a post for our social media channels is inspiration.

social media channels is inspiration. social media channels is inspiration. Building an audience has fundamentally Building an audience has fundamentally Building an audience has fundamentally changed my life, and I think it could changed my life, and I think it could changed my life, and I think it could change yours, too. So, I'm inviting you change yours, too. So, I'm inviting you change yours, too. So, I'm inviting you to give this new tool a shot and let me to give this new tool a shot and let me to give this new tool a shot and let me know what you think. All you have to do know what you think. All you have to do know what you think. All you have to do is search coach.stephan.store is search coach.stephan.store is search coach.stephan.store now to get started. now to get started. now to get started. There should be a button just down below There should be a button just down below There should be a button just down below here. And if it says subscribe, you're here. And if it says subscribe, you're here. And if it says subscribe, you're already subscribed. If it says subscribe already subscribed. If it says subscribe already subscribed. If it says subscribe bar, that means you're not yet. And if bar, that means you're not yet. And if bar, that means you're not yet. And if you're not subscribed, please could you you're not subscribed, please could you you're not subscribed, please could you do us a favor and hit that button. It do us a favor and hit that button. It do us a favor and hit that button. It helps the show more than you know. And helps the show more than you know. And helps the show more than you know. And according to the algorithm, you're according to the algorithm, you're according to the algorithm, you're someone that watches our show, but you someone that watches our show, but you someone that watches our show, but you haven't hit that hit that button. Thank haven't hit that hit that button. Thank haven't hit that hit that button. Thank you so much. you so much. you so much. >> What do you think of Elon Musk? >> What do you think of Elon Musk? >> What do you think of Elon Musk? >> The richest man on Earth, the arguably >> The richest man on Earth, the arguably >> The richest man on Earth, the arguably most famous entrepreneur on planet most famous entrepreneur on planet most famous entrepreneur on planet Earth, Earth, Earth, building companies here in America. building companies here in America. building companies here in America. >> Very intelligent. >> Very intelligent. >> Very intelligent. Has had an extremely important impact on Has had an extremely important impact on Has had an extremely important impact on a whole bunch of things. a whole bunch of things. a whole bunch of things. Um is right about Um is right about Um is right about a lot of things and is very wrong about a lot of things and is very wrong about a lot of things and is very wrong about a lot of things. And lacked the humility a lot of things. And lacked the humility a lot of things. And lacked the humility to understand to understand to understand some things that would have saved him some things that would have saved him some things that would have saved him from doing a lot of damage based on how from doing a lot of damage based on how from doing a lot of damage based on how long he was. So, you look, for example, long he was. So, you look, for example, long he was. So, you look, for example, at the tragedy of the failure of Dodge.

at the tragedy of the failure of Dodge. at the tragedy of the failure of Dodge. And the thing that most upsets me about And the thing that most upsets me about And the thing that most upsets me about the failure of Dodge the failure of Dodge the failure of Dodge is that we actually needed is that we actually needed is that we actually needed an effort around government efficiency. an effort around government efficiency. an effort around government efficiency. But what we got But what we got But what we got was unbelievably sloppy, making math was unbelievably sloppy, making math was unbelievably sloppy, making math errors. And the one thing they're errors. And the one thing they're errors. And the one thing they're supposed to be really good at ought to supposed to be really good at ought to supposed to be really good at ought to be math. be math. be math. Maybe I don't mean like little rounding Maybe I don't mean like little rounding Maybe I don't mean like little rounding errors, like saying billion when they errors, like saying billion when they errors, like saying billion when they meant million. meant million. meant million. On the {quote} "wall of receipts", the On the {quote} "wall of receipts", the On the {quote} "wall of receipts", the whole purpose of which was to show that whole purpose of which was to show that whole purpose of which was to show that they knew what they were doing, and they they knew what they were doing, and they they knew what they were doing, and they were transparently documenting their were transparently documenting their were transparently documenting their choices. Firing people they didn't know what they Firing people they didn't know what they did, and then having to scramble and did, and then having to scramble and did, and then having to scramble and hire them back on things like nuclear hire them back on things like nuclear hire them back on things like nuclear weapon safety, weapon safety, weapon safety, or managing biohazards and communicable or managing biohazards and communicable or managing biohazards and communicable diseases, diseases, diseases, and leaving a federal government that and leaving a federal government that and leaving a federal government that actually spent more actually spent more actually spent more after Dodge than before. Elon used to be after Dodge than before. Elon used to be after Dodge than before. Elon used to be a Democrat. a Democrat. a Democrat. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> He would then have had him say this that >> He would then have had him say this that >> He would then have had him say this that the Biden administration basically the Biden administration basically the Biden administration basically snubbed him. They were sort of snubbed him. They were sort of snubbed him. They were sort of adversarial towards him. There's always adversarial towards him. There's always adversarial towards him. There's always the the story people talk about about the the story people talk about about the the story people talk about about the electric vehicle summit in 2021 the electric vehicle summit in 2021 the electric vehicle summit in 2021 where everybody was invited, GM, Ford, where everybody was invited, GM, Ford, where everybody was invited, GM, Ford, Chrysler, but Elon wasn't invited and Chrysler, but Elon wasn't invited and Chrysler, but Elon wasn't invited and that was a mistake.

that was a mistake. that was a mistake. >> I was there for that. I can tell you how >> I was there for that. I can tell you how >> I was there for that. I can tell you how the mistake happened. There was a the mistake happened. There was a the mistake happened. There was a difficult and complex set of difficult and complex set of difficult and complex set of negotiations happening between the big negotiations happening between the big negotiations happening between the big three automakers to try to get to a new three automakers to try to get to a new three automakers to try to get to a new framework moving forward on tailpipe framework moving forward on tailpipe framework moving forward on tailpipe standards. This event was built to kind standards. This event was built to kind standards. This event was built to kind of celebrate the agreement that had been of celebrate the agreement that had been of celebrate the agreement that had been reached reached reached around tailpipe standards. around tailpipe standards. around tailpipe standards. Um and Tesla, because all they make are Um and Tesla, because all they make are Um and Tesla, because all they make are EVs, doesn't even have tailpipes. And so EVs, doesn't even have tailpipes. And so EVs, doesn't even have tailpipes. And so people weren't really thinking about people weren't really thinking about people weren't really thinking about inviting Tesla, but what Elon saw was inviting Tesla, but what Elon saw was inviting Tesla, but what Elon saw was there's an event at the White House there's an event at the White House there's an event at the White House about EVs. about EVs. about EVs. He is He is He is if not single-handedly responsible, if not single-handedly responsible, if not single-handedly responsible, certainly is the person most responsible certainly is the person most responsible certainly is the person most responsible for EV excellence on American soil. for EV excellence on American soil. for EV excellence on American soil. And he's saying, "What the fuck?" And I And he's saying, "What the fuck?" And I And he's saying, "What the fuck?" And I I don't blame him for that. I don't blame him for that. I don't blame him for that. >> And he publicly broke ranks with the >> And he publicly broke ranks with the >> And he publicly broke ranks with the Democrat party. He bought Twitter Democrat party. He bought Twitter Democrat party. He bought Twitter and ultimately became Donald Trump's and ultimately became Donald Trump's and ultimately became Donald Trump's largest donor and key surrogate. It's largest donor and key surrogate. It's largest donor and key surrogate. It's It's interesting I think I asked this It's interesting I think I asked this It's interesting I think I asked this question because I think uh the any question because I think uh the any question because I think uh the any president is going to need to contend president is going to need to contend president is going to need to contend with both solving the probably a problem with both solving the probably a problem with both solving the probably a problem in of inequality, this national debt, in of inequality, this national debt, in of inequality, this national debt, while also keeping entrepreneurs happy while also keeping entrepreneurs happy while also keeping entrepreneurs happy and highly productive at the same time.

and highly productive at the same time. and highly productive at the same time. And the the And the the And the the of the two parties, Republican and of the two parties, Republican and of the two parties, Republican and Democrat, the party that is typically, Democrat, the party that is typically, Democrat, the party that is typically, according to the data, more associated according to the data, more associated according to the data, more associated with being entrepreneur-friendly is the with being entrepreneur-friendly is the with being entrepreneur-friendly is the Republican party. Republican party. Republican party. It's not often you hear billionaires are It's not often you hear billionaires are It's not often you hear billionaires are evil coming from the Republican side evil coming from the Republican side evil coming from the Republican side from the Republican side. But that from the Republican side. But that from the Republican side. But that that's a prevailing narrative on the that's a prevailing narrative on the that's a prevailing narrative on the Democratic side is that billionaires are Democratic side is that billionaires are Democratic side is that billionaires are evil. evil. evil. >> I don't know if that's the prevailing >> I don't know if that's the prevailing >> I don't know if that's the prevailing narrative, but I get what you mean. narrative, but I get what you mean. narrative, but I get what you mean. >> It's It's more dominant on the left than >> It's It's more dominant on the left than >> It's It's more dominant on the left than it is on the right. it is on the right. it is on the right. >> Yeah. I think that's fair. >> Yeah. I think that's fair. >> Yeah. I think that's fair. >> Yeah. But, look. I mean, you have to >> Yeah. But, look. I mean, you have to >> Yeah. But, look. I mean, you have to engage engage engage everybody if you want to be in a high everybody if you want to be in a high everybody if you want to be in a high position of leadership. Like, the last position of leadership. Like, the last position of leadership. Like, the last time I had a specific problem with Elon time I had a specific problem with Elon time I had a specific problem with Elon when I was Department of Transportation, when I was Department of Transportation, when I was Department of Transportation, uh I called him. We talked it out, and uh I called him. We talked it out, and uh I called him. We talked it out, and we figured it out. And we actually we figured it out. And we actually we figured it out. And we actually solved the problem together. It is solved the problem together. It is solved the problem together. It is amazing in my experience how many amazing in my experience how many amazing in my experience how many problems can be, if not solved, at least problems can be, if not solved, at least problems can be, if not solved, at least better faced if you just pick up the better faced if you just pick up the better faced if you just pick up the phone. phone. phone. And well, we have this style of politics And well, we have this style of politics And well, we have this style of politics now where everything's combat. You're now where everything's combat. You're now where everything's combat. You're not just disagreeing with somebody, you not just disagreeing with somebody, you not just disagreeing with somebody, you got to destroy them, right? got to destroy them, right? got to destroy them, right? And that's really bad for America.

And that's really bad for America. And that's really bad for America. It does not lead to good political It does not lead to good political It does not lead to good political outcomes. outcomes. outcomes. And so, especially when I disagree with And so, especially when I disagree with And so, especially when I disagree with somebody or I have a problem with what somebody or I have a problem with what somebody or I have a problem with what they're doing, we should be talking. they're doing, we should be talking. they're doing, we should be talking. >> On the left, you've got AOC saying, "You >> On the left, you've got AOC saying, "You >> On the left, you've got AOC saying, "You can't make a billion dollars, you take a can't make a billion dollars, you take a can't make a billion dollars, you take a billion dollars." billion dollars." billion dollars." Is that true in your view? Is that true in your view? Is that true in your view? >> I don't know. That doesn't make a ton of >> I don't know. That doesn't make a ton of >> I don't know. That doesn't make a ton of sense to me. I I will say there's a lot sense to me. I I will say there's a lot sense to me. I I will say there's a lot of different ways you can get a billion of different ways you can get a billion of different ways you can get a billion dollars. And right now, the easiest way dollars. And right now, the easiest way dollars. And right now, the easiest way to get a billion dollars is to have 10 to get a billion dollars is to have 10 to get a billion dollars is to have 10 billion dollars and do nothing. billion dollars and do nothing. billion dollars and do nothing. You know, the thing we most admire about You know, the thing we most admire about You know, the thing we most admire about the entrepreneur is that they work hard, the entrepreneur is that they work hard, the entrepreneur is that they work hard, and they do things, and they make and they do things, and they make and they do things, and they make things, right? And they generate value. things, right? And they generate value. things, right? And they generate value. And And I think most Americans don't And And I think most Americans don't And And I think most Americans don't spite you the value that you get from spite you the value that you get from spite you the value that you get from having created even more value. having created even more value. having created even more value. I think at the same time, we see a lot I think at the same time, we see a lot I think at the same time, we see a lot of outcomes in the market that seem to of outcomes in the market that seem to of outcomes in the market that seem to be about just like money just sort of be about just like money just sort of be about just like money just sort of happening to whoever already has money. happening to whoever already has money. happening to whoever already has money. Many of them have seen their wealth go Many of them have seen their wealth go Many of them have seen their wealth go up like tenfold in the last few years. up like tenfold in the last few years. up like tenfold in the last few years. Way more than how much their wealth went Way more than how much their wealth went Way more than how much their wealth went up in the few years before that. So, I up in the few years before that. So, I up in the few years before that. So, I guess like guess like guess like the thing you did between zero and a the thing you did between zero and a the thing you did between zero and a billion, billion, billion, in my experience, is usually much more in my experience, is usually much more in my experience, is usually much more impressive than whatever you did between impressive than whatever you did between impressive than whatever you did between 1 billion and 10 or 10 and 100 or 100 1 billion and 10 or 10 and 100 or 100 1 billion and 10 or 10 and 100 or 100 and 500.

and 500. and 500. And I think we are in a political system And I think we are in a political system And I think we are in a political system where it would just be so naive to think where it would just be so naive to think where it would just be so naive to think that the amount that the market gives that the amount that the market gives that the amount that the market gives you is just purely equal to the amount you is just purely equal to the amount you is just purely equal to the amount of benefit that you create or the amount of benefit that you create or the amount of benefit that you create or the amount of hard work that you put in. of hard work that you put in. of hard work that you put in. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Some people work hard and they earn a >> Some people work hard and they earn a >> Some people work hard and they earn a lot. And some people don't do and lot. And some people don't do and lot. And some people don't do and they wind up with a lot. And some people they wind up with a lot. And some people they wind up with a lot. And some people are a mix of those two things. are a mix of those two things. are a mix of those two things. >> It's definitely not correlated to hard >> It's definitely not correlated to hard >> It's definitely not correlated to hard work, that is for sure. I've never met work, that is for sure. I've never met work, that is for sure. I've never met anyone that worked harder than my mom anyone that worked harder than my mom anyone that worked harder than my mom and working in you know coming from and working in you know coming from and working in you know coming from Nigeria, can't read or write, comes to Nigeria, can't read or write, comes to Nigeria, can't read or write, comes to the UK, the UK, the UK, uh works every waking hour that she can, uh works every waking hour that she can, uh works every waking hour that she can, never complains, and still financially never complains, and still financially never complains, and still financially struggling as a result of that all the struggling as a result of that all the struggling as a result of that all the time growing up. time growing up. time growing up. So I you know I know that very So I you know I know that very So I you know I know that very intimately that hard work doesn't equal intimately that hard work doesn't equal intimately that hard work doesn't equal wealth at all. wealth at all. wealth at all. >> And I don't think people would be as >> And I don't think people would be as >> And I don't think people would be as angry about billionaires as they are angry about billionaires as they are angry about billionaires as they are if there weren't millions of people if there weren't millions of people if there weren't millions of people whose story is closer to that of your whose story is closer to that of your whose story is closer to that of your mom. mom. mom. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> And it brings me back to this idea of >> And it brings me back to this idea of >> And it brings me back to this idea of the American dream where the American dream where the American dream where you know it's supposed to be the case you know it's supposed to be the case you know it's supposed to be the case that generally that generally that generally you come out ahead if you as the saying you come out ahead if you as the saying you come out ahead if you as the saying goes you work hard and you play by the goes you work hard and you play by the goes you work hard and you play by the rules. And that definitely happens rules. And that definitely happens rules. And that definitely happens sometimes.

sometimes. sometimes. But it doesn't happen enough now. And But it doesn't happen enough now. And But it doesn't happen enough now. And most importantly it happens less in most importantly it happens less in most importantly it happens less in America than in certain other countries. America than in certain other countries. America than in certain other countries. And it happens less in America than it And it happens less in America than it And it happens less in America than it used to in America. And those two things used to in America. And those two things used to in America. And those two things are the big blinking alarm lights to me. are the big blinking alarm lights to me. are the big blinking alarm lights to me. >> AOC also said a system that allows >> AOC also said a system that allows >> AOC also said a system that allows billionaires to exist is immoral. billionaires to exist is immoral. billionaires to exist is immoral. >> Yeah, I don't think I agree with that. >> Yeah, I don't think I agree with that. >> Yeah, I don't think I agree with that. It's not whether they exist, it's It's not whether they exist, it's It's not whether they exist, it's having too much power. having too much power. having too much power. It's it's being able to turn economic It's it's being able to turn economic It's it's being able to turn economic power into political power. power into political power. power into political power. And then using that power to get even And then using that power to get even And then using that power to get even more wealth. more wealth. more wealth. That's why people are so furious because That's why people are so furious because That's why people are so furious because they see that happening and are not they see that happening and are not they see that happening and are not wrong. And the role of money in our wrong. And the role of money in our wrong. And the role of money in our politics is just one example, probably politics is just one example, probably politics is just one example, probably the biggest example the biggest example the biggest example of how that can happen. I think of how that can happen. I think of how that can happen. I think Americans wouldn't mind people being as Americans wouldn't mind people being as Americans wouldn't mind people being as wealthy as they are nearly as much if we wealthy as they are nearly as much if we wealthy as they are nearly as much if we didn't have the inequality that we have. didn't have the inequality that we have. didn't have the inequality that we have. And if we didn't have some of those And if we didn't have some of those And if we didn't have some of those people using their wealth to assert people using their wealth to assert people using their wealth to assert political power in a country whose whole political power in a country whose whole political power in a country whose whole founding principle is that the founding principle is that the founding principle is that the millionaire or I guess billionaire millionaire or I guess billionaire millionaire or I guess billionaire stands in line next to the dishwasher stands in line next to the dishwasher stands in line next to the dishwasher and the taxi driver in the voting booth and the taxi driver in the voting booth and the taxi driver in the voting booth and they all have the same political and they all have the same political and they all have the same political power.

power. power. >> Yeah, I can It's It's interesting cuz I >> Yeah, I can It's It's interesting cuz I >> Yeah, I can It's It's interesting cuz I can weirdly relate to both sides of the can weirdly relate to both sides of the can weirdly relate to both sides of the spectrum. If you go back, I don't know, spectrum. If you go back, I don't know, spectrum. If you go back, I don't know, 13 years, I am broke, family not 13 years, I am broke, family not 13 years, I am broke, family not speaking to me um cuz I've decided to speaking to me um cuz I've decided to speaking to me um cuz I've decided to drop out university, and I am I can't drop out university, and I am I can't drop out university, and I am I can't feed myself feed myself feed myself to put it in a nice way for a long to put it in a nice way for a long to put it in a nice way for a long period of time living many hundreds of period of time living many hundreds of period of time living many hundreds of miles away from home in terms of a round miles away from home in terms of a round miles away from home in terms of a round trip. And then you jump 13 years forward trip. And then you jump 13 years forward trip. And then you jump 13 years forward and I'm running these businesses and the and I'm running these businesses and the and I'm running these businesses and the businesses are going well. So I I kind businesses are going well. So I I kind businesses are going well. So I I kind of It's weird. I oscillate between these of It's weird. I oscillate between these of It's weird. I oscillate between these two worlds of two worlds of two worlds of entrepreneurship and being very pro entrepreneurship and being very pro entrepreneurship and being very pro entrepreneurship entrepreneurship, but entrepreneurship entrepreneurship, but entrepreneurship entrepreneurship, but then falling back into that 18 19 then falling back into that 18 19 then falling back into that 18 19 20-year-old me who really needed society 20-year-old me who really needed society 20-year-old me who really needed society to catch up to be quite honest. to catch up to be quite honest. to catch up to be quite honest. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Um thankfully I lived in the United >> Um thankfully I lived in the United >> Um thankfully I lived in the United Kingdom where we have health care. Kingdom where we have health care. Kingdom where we have health care. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> But when I moved here >> But when I moved here >> But when I moved here >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> at 25 years old to launch the business >> at 25 years old to launch the business >> at 25 years old to launch the business here in New York City and run the office here in New York City and run the office here in New York City and run the office here, I discovered that you guys don't here, I discovered that you guys don't here, I discovered that you guys don't offer like health and that I had to ask offer like health and that I had to ask offer like health and that I had to ask the employer the employer the employer >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> pay for all of my team members' health >> pay for all of my team members' health >> pay for all of my team members' health care. I was just really What the hell care. I was just really What the hell care. I was just really What the hell What the hell What the hell is going on? What the hell What the hell is going on? What the hell What the hell is going on? I thought this was the land of the free I thought this was the land of the free I thought this was the land of the free and the and the and the all those kinds of things.

all those kinds of things. all those kinds of things. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So I kind of I kind of understand both >> So I kind of I kind of understand both >> So I kind of I kind of understand both ends of the spectrum and I it makes me ends of the spectrum and I it makes me ends of the spectrum and I it makes me realize that actually it's the realize that actually it's the realize that actually it's the inequality. It's the people at the the inequality. It's the people at the the inequality. It's the people at the the sort of bottom of the ladder, per se, sort of bottom of the ladder, per se, sort of bottom of the ladder, per se, being so far from the top of the ladder being so far from the top of the ladder being so far from the top of the ladder that is the central issue. So what is that is the central issue. So what is that is the central issue. So what is the radical idea that you bring forward the radical idea that you bring forward the radical idea that you bring forward to end inequality? Is it I mean to end inequality? Is it I mean to end inequality? Is it I mean presumably it's not just tax wealth. presumably it's not just tax wealth. presumably it's not just tax wealth. >> Well, here Yeah, here's the thing. >> Well, here Yeah, here's the thing. >> Well, here Yeah, here's the thing. >> you lift people up? >> you lift people up? >> you lift people up? >> I actually think the ideas for fixing >> I actually think the ideas for fixing >> I actually think the ideas for fixing those economic problems aren't that those economic problems aren't that those economic problems aren't that radical. radical. radical. The weird thing is in order to get what The weird thing is in order to get what The weird thing is in order to get what I think of as very reasonable economic I think of as very reasonable economic I think of as very reasonable economic ideas through, you have to have radical ideas through, you have to have radical ideas through, you have to have radical change on the political side. change on the political side. change on the political side. Economically, Economically, Economically, we can do this mostly with tools that we can do this mostly with tools that we can do this mostly with tools that are very familiar to us. Make sure that are very familiar to us. Make sure that are very familiar to us. Make sure that there are higher tax rates, not to there are higher tax rates, not to there are higher tax rates, not to punish the wealthy, but to get enough punish the wealthy, but to get enough punish the wealthy, but to get enough revenue to do so government can do its revenue to do so government can do its revenue to do so government can do its job. Make sure there are higher tax job. Make sure there are higher tax job. Make sure there are higher tax rates on the uh not on all Americans rates on the uh not on all Americans rates on the uh not on all Americans compared to today, but on the corporate compared to today, but on the corporate compared to today, but on the corporate profits and on the the wealthiest profits and on the the wealthiest profits and on the the wealthiest individuals.

individuals. individuals. Make sure that it is harder to hide and Make sure that it is harder to hide and Make sure that it is harder to hide and move around money so that you never have move around money so that you never have move around money so that you never have to pay taxes on it at all. And then what to pay taxes on it at all. And then what to pay taxes on it at all. And then what do you do with that money? You make sure do you do with that money? You make sure do you do with that money? You make sure there's a healthcare system where, for there's a healthcare system where, for there's a healthcare system where, for example, somebody in the situation you example, somebody in the situation you example, somebody in the situation you were in were in were in still gets to be an entrepreneur cuz still gets to be an entrepreneur cuz still gets to be an entrepreneur cuz they don't actually have to worry that they don't actually have to worry that they don't actually have to worry that they won't have healthcare if they don't they won't have healthcare if they don't they won't have healthcare if they don't just take the next low-wage job just take the next low-wage job just take the next low-wage job available to them. available to them. available to them. Invest in education enough that we are Invest in education enough that we are Invest in education enough that we are preparing for people who know not just preparing for people who know not just preparing for people who know not just how to work, but how to think so that how to work, but how to think so that how to work, but how to think so that when work changes, they're ready. when work changes, they're ready. when work changes, they're ready. Make sure that we make it easier to have Make sure that we make it easier to have Make sure that we make it easier to have a family. a family. a family. Things like paid family leave Things like paid family leave Things like paid family leave and and and using tax credits to compensate people using tax credits to compensate people using tax credits to compensate people who who who give care to their parents and or give care to their parents and or give care to their parents and or children. children. children. It can have a huge freeing effect on It can have a huge freeing effect on It can have a huge freeing effect on people and I think it's the right thing people and I think it's the right thing people and I think it's the right thing to do. And it's a way to respect that to do. And it's a way to respect that to do. And it's a way to respect that that's work, too. Yeah, I I've had roles that's work, too. Yeah, I I've had roles that's work, too. Yeah, I I've had roles and jobs where and jobs where and jobs where I have worked very, very hard, but the I have worked very, very hard, but the I have worked very, very hard, but the hardest I've ever worked in my life hardest I've ever worked in my life hardest I've ever worked in my life was when I was on parental leave when was when I was on parental leave when was when I was on parental leave when we adopted our newborn son and daughter, we adopted our newborn son and daughter, we adopted our newborn son and daughter, our twins.

our twins. our twins. That was the only time that they are. That was the only time that they are. That was the only time that they are. Yeah, I mean, that was the only time Yeah, I mean, that was the only time Yeah, I mean, that was the only time that that that I was routinely getting up at 3:00 in I was routinely getting up at 3:00 in I was routinely getting up at 3:00 in the morning. If I was lucky, I could get the morning. If I was lucky, I could get the morning. If I was lucky, I could get a nap at 5:30 in the morning. a nap at 5:30 in the morning. a nap at 5:30 in the morning. Uh and was just working until I Uh and was just working until I Uh and was just working until I physically couldn't work anymore and physically couldn't work anymore and physically couldn't work anymore and then then then tapping out and then Justin trying to my tapping out and then Justin trying to my tapping out and then Justin trying to my husband trying to, you know, we'd husband trying to, you know, we'd husband trying to, you know, we'd alternate and and and help each other. alternate and and and help each other. alternate and and and help each other. And that work was a beautiful work, very And that work was a beautiful work, very And that work was a beautiful work, very hard work. hard work. hard work. Is work. I think we also need to Is work. I think we also need to Is work. I think we also need to invest in things like national service invest in things like national service invest in things like national service so everybody has an experience Military so everybody has an experience Military so everybody has an experience Military is not for everybody, but everybody is not for everybody, but everybody is not for everybody, but everybody should know what it's like to be should know what it's like to be should know what it's like to be part of something bigger than yourself part of something bigger than yourself part of something bigger than yourself and to work on something that is hard and to work on something that is hard and to work on something that is hard with people you don't already know. I with people you don't already know. I with people you don't already know. I think if we have that, we'll have more think if we have that, we'll have more think if we have that, we'll have more trust. trust. trust. Where did you find this one? Where did you find this one? Where did you find this one? >> So, this These are some uh >> So, this These are some uh >> So, this These are some uh some photos some photos some photos >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> of a much younger Pete. I'm really >> of a much younger Pete. I'm really >> of a much younger Pete. I'm really curious that you know, I saw the Kamala curious that you know, I saw the Kamala curious that you know, I saw the Kamala I learned a lot lot lot lot about her by I learned a lot lot lot lot about her by I learned a lot lot lot lot about her by just understanding where she'd come just understanding where she'd come just understanding where she'd come from. from. from. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And her parents and her early contacts. >> And her parents and her early contacts. >> And her parents and her early contacts. What is it about your early context that What is it about your early context that What is it about your early context that shapes your world view as shapes your world view as shapes your world view as Mayor Pete, but also Secretary Pete, and Mayor Pete, but also Secretary Pete, and Mayor Pete, but also Secretary Pete, and potentially someday potentially someday potentially someday President Pete.

President Pete. President Pete. >> Huh. Well, >> Huh. Well, >> Huh. Well, my dad came to this country because he my dad came to this country because he my dad came to this country because he thought he could have a better life thought he could have a better life thought he could have a better life here. here. here. Um Um Um not exactly in a rags-to-riches sense. not exactly in a rags-to-riches sense. not exactly in a rags-to-riches sense. He came from a middle-class family He came from a middle-class family He came from a middle-class family uh in the tiny country of Malta. uh in the tiny country of Malta. uh in the tiny country of Malta. And the way he tells the story is that And the way he tells the story is that And the way he tells the story is that he he he he knew that he wanted to come he he he he knew that he wanted to come he he he he knew that he wanted to come to the US and go to grad school to the US and go to grad school to the US and go to grad school and he had a mentor who said, "Look, if and he had a mentor who said, "Look, if and he had a mentor who said, "Look, if you stay here, you stay here, you stay here, I can promise you that you will be a big I can promise you that you will be a big I can promise you that you will be a big fish in a small pond." fish in a small pond." fish in a small pond." And he said, And he said, And he said, "I'd rather be a medium-sized fish in a "I'd rather be a medium-sized fish in a "I'd rather be a medium-sized fish in a very big pond." very big pond." very big pond." Which is a great way to think about Which is a great way to think about Which is a great way to think about coming to America. And that's exactly coming to America. And that's exactly coming to America. And that's exactly what he did. Um he came he went to grad what he did. Um he came he went to grad what he did. Um he came he went to grad school school school in Binghamton, New York. in Binghamton, New York. in Binghamton, New York. And then he got a job in New Mexico, Las And then he got a job in New Mexico, Las And then he got a job in New Mexico, Las Cruces, New Mexico. He met my mother who Cruces, New Mexico. He met my mother who Cruces, New Mexico. He met my mother who was teaching there, too. She was a young was teaching there, too. She was a young was teaching there, too. She was a young uh linguist. uh linguist. uh linguist. They got married and then the first good They got married and then the first good They got married and then the first good job he got was at University of Notre job he got was at University of Notre job he got was at University of Notre Dame uh in South Bend, Indiana. They Dame uh in South Bend, Indiana. They Dame uh in South Bend, Indiana. They moved there and pretty soon after that I moved there and pretty soon after that I moved there and pretty soon after that I was born.

was born. was born. And so, I grew up with parents who you And so, I grew up with parents who you And so, I grew up with parents who you know, cared a lot about literature and know, cared a lot about literature and know, cared a lot about literature and learning and they cared a lot about learning and they cared a lot about learning and they cared a lot about politics. We weren't like politically politics. We weren't like politically politics. We weren't like politically connected. I don't think I ever met an connected. I don't think I ever met an connected. I don't think I ever met an elected official while I was a child, elected official while I was a child, elected official while I was a child, but I grew up with this sense that it but I grew up with this sense that it but I grew up with this sense that it was very important to know what was was very important to know what was was very important to know what was happening in the world. My dad was happening in the world. My dad was happening in the world. My dad was always reading the newspaper, the TV was always reading the newspaper, the TV was always reading the newspaper, the TV was always tuned to the news. It was just a always tuned to the news. It was just a always tuned to the news. It was just a sense like that's the most important sense like that's the most important sense like that's the most important thing. Whatever's happening in the world thing. Whatever's happening in the world thing. Whatever's happening in the world is the most important thing that you is the most important thing that you is the most important thing that you ought to be paying attention to out ought to be paying attention to out ought to be paying attention to out there. I don't know, it was a great there. I don't know, it was a great there. I don't know, it was a great upbringing. It was great parents and um upbringing. It was great parents and um upbringing. It was great parents and um a good neighborhood and good friends. a good neighborhood and good friends. a good neighborhood and good friends. You know, I felt in both a sense of You know, I felt in both a sense of You know, I felt in both a sense of belonging and a sense of being an belonging and a sense of being an belonging and a sense of being an outsider kind of at the same time. And I outsider kind of at the same time. And I outsider kind of at the same time. And I had this name that nobody could had this name that nobody could had this name that nobody could pronounce and we were in this great pronounce and we were in this great pronounce and we were in this great neighborhood. People did all kinds of neighborhood. People did all kinds of neighborhood. People did all kinds of different things. Our neighbor to one different things. Our neighbor to one different things. Our neighbor to one side laid carpet. Uh family across from side laid carpet. Uh family across from side laid carpet. Uh family across from us were retired public school teachers. us were retired public school teachers. us were retired public school teachers. Waiting on the corner was a nurse and Waiting on the corner was a nurse and Waiting on the corner was a nurse and I'd see her walk down to the night shift I'd see her walk down to the night shift I'd see her walk down to the night shift at the hospital a couple blocks away at the hospital a couple blocks away at the hospital a couple blocks away every day. every day. every day. And And And I felt like the texture of that I felt like the texture of that I felt like the texture of that neighborhood like really belonged to me. neighborhood like really belonged to me. neighborhood like really belonged to me. But at the same time like I also felt But at the same time like I also felt But at the same time like I also felt and knew that I was like I was and knew that I was like I was and knew that I was like I was different. Like this is before it was different. Like this is before it was different. Like this is before it was like trendy to drink espresso for like trendy to drink espresso for like trendy to drink espresso for example. That's like a weird immigrant example. That's like a weird immigrant example. That's like a weird immigrant thing that my dad did. You know, like he thing that my dad did. You know, like he thing that my dad did. You know, like he had this little thing you'd put on the had this little thing you'd put on the had this little thing you'd put on the stove and make espresso. Um and I stove and make espresso. Um and I stove and make espresso. Um and I remember them being kind of bewildered remember them being kind of bewildered remember them being kind of bewildered when like Starbucks became a thing, you when like Starbucks became a thing, you when like Starbucks became a thing, you know.

know. know. And then the the surroundings of it all, And then the the surroundings of it all, And then the the surroundings of it all, the city of South Bend, which people the city of South Bend, which people the city of South Bend, which people know that you know, the University of know that you know, the University of know that you know, the University of Notre Dame is there. But the other thing Notre Dame is there. But the other thing Notre Dame is there. But the other thing that was there was Studebaker. This was that was there was Studebaker. This was that was there was Studebaker. This was as big a car company as like GM or Ford as big a car company as like GM or Ford as big a car company as like GM or Ford in its day. But it stopped making cars in its day. But it stopped making cars in its day. But it stopped making cars in 1963. They just couldn't quite in 1963. They just couldn't quite in 1963. They just couldn't quite innovate and keep up and the company innovate and keep up and the company innovate and keep up and the company collapsed. That was a catastrophic thing collapsed. That was a catastrophic thing collapsed. That was a catastrophic thing for the city. The city lost a big chunk for the city. The city lost a big chunk for the city. The city lost a big chunk of its population and never really of its population and never really of its population and never really recovered it. recovered it. recovered it. And when I was a kid, I didn't really And when I was a kid, I didn't really And when I was a kid, I didn't really know any different. I didn't realize it know any different. I didn't realize it know any different. I didn't realize it was unusual that factories was unusual that factories was unusual that factories that hadn't been operating for decades that hadn't been operating for decades that hadn't been operating for decades in some cases that that looked like in some cases that that looked like in some cases that that looked like they'd been hit in a war. Just like they'd been hit in a war. Just like they'd been hit in a war. Just like collapsing big giant structures falling collapsing big giant structures falling collapsing big giant structures falling apart all over the city. apart all over the city. apart all over the city. I'd see them, you know, out the window I'd see them, you know, out the window I'd see them, you know, out the window of my dad's Chevy on the when he was of my dad's Chevy on the when he was of my dad's Chevy on the when he was driving me to school. driving me to school. driving me to school. And gradually as I grew up, I kind of And gradually as I grew up, I kind of And gradually as I grew up, I kind of put the pieces together of what it meant put the pieces together of what it meant put the pieces together of what it meant to live in a place whose to live in a place whose to live in a place whose best economic days had been behind it. best economic days had been behind it. best economic days had been behind it. And and the message that I got, the kind And and the message that I got, the kind And and the message that I got, the kind of lesson that I was given was I don't of lesson that I was given was I don't of lesson that I was given was I don't know if anybody said this to me in a know if anybody said this to me in a know if anybody said this to me in a sentence, but but the world kind of said sentence, but but the world kind of said sentence, but but the world kind of said to me was if you want to be something, to me was if you want to be something, to me was if you want to be something, go and be someone, you have to get out.

go and be someone, you have to get out. go and be someone, you have to get out. You have to move out. You have to move out. You have to move out. >> Did your dad say that? >> Did your dad say that? >> Did your dad say that? >> Not that I remember. I mean, he That's >> Not that I remember. I mean, he That's >> Not that I remember. I mean, he That's the irony, you know, he's this worldly the irony, you know, he's this worldly the irony, you know, he's this worldly very worldly man, you know, been all very worldly man, you know, been all very worldly man, you know, been all over the world, but he chose to live in over the world, but he chose to live in over the world, but he chose to live in South Bend. He died in South Bend, South Bend. He died in South Bend, South Bend. He died in South Bend, Indiana. That was where he lived his Indiana. That was where he lived his Indiana. That was where he lived his life. life. life. But I I don't know. You do You just get But I I don't know. You do You just get But I I don't know. You do You just get this this this sense that that was what you were sense that that was what you were sense that that was what you were supposed to do. And then I did. supposed to do. And then I did. supposed to do. And then I did. I got into Harvard, I got into Harvard, I got into Harvard, got to the East Coast to go to college, got to the East Coast to go to college, got to the East Coast to go to college, and then immediately began to understand and then immediately began to understand and then immediately began to understand that I was I was a from somewhere in a that I was I was a from somewhere in a that I was I was a from somewhere in a way that I didn't understand when I was way that I didn't understand when I was way that I didn't understand when I was growing up and started to feel this kind growing up and started to feel this kind growing up and started to feel this kind of of of loyalty, loyalty, loyalty, this kind of like almost militant this kind of like almost militant this kind of like almost militant attachment, partly cuz I heard the way attachment, partly cuz I heard the way attachment, partly cuz I heard the way these people talked about where I was these people talked about where I was these people talked about where I was from. from. from. >> He passed away while you were running >> He passed away while you were running >> He passed away while you were running for president? for president? for president? >> Yeah, it was just right about the moment >> Yeah, it was just right about the moment >> Yeah, it was just right about the moment that I was announcing the the beginning that I was announcing the the beginning that I was announcing the the beginning of the campaign. Yeah, like literally of the campaign. Yeah, like literally of the campaign. Yeah, like literally the same week. the same week. the same week. >> Unexpectedly? >> Unexpectedly? >> Unexpectedly? >> He had been diagnosed with cancer >> He had been diagnosed with cancer >> He had been diagnosed with cancer in September, in September, in September, and we knew that it it was pretty rough, and we knew that it it was pretty rough, and we knew that it it was pretty rough, and he passed away in January. So, yeah, and he passed away in January. So, yeah, and he passed away in January. So, yeah, I mean, there was I mean, there was I mean, there was you know, not overnight, but three or you know, not overnight, but three or you know, not overnight, but three or four months.

four months. four months. >> Destabilizing in the lead-up to the most >> Destabilizing in the lead-up to the most >> Destabilizing in the lead-up to the most consequential decision and period of consequential decision and period of consequential decision and period of your life? your life? your life? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. I mean, Yeah. I mean, Yeah. I mean, you know, this really big important part you know, this really big important part you know, this really big important part of your world. of your world. of your world. And we were close. I, you know, I moved And we were close. I, you know, I moved And we were close. I, you know, I moved into into into a house that was on the same block as a house that was on the same block as a house that was on the same block as where my parents lived in South Bend. where my parents lived in South Bend. where my parents lived in South Bend. Home for dinner every Sunday night. I Home for dinner every Sunday night. I Home for dinner every Sunday night. I mean, to have him become ill mean, to have him become ill mean, to have him become ill and then to have him and then to have him and then to have him pass away pass away pass away just at the moment that we were starting just at the moment that we were starting just at the moment that we were starting to launch. to launch. to launch. Sometimes I look back on it. and Sometimes I look back on it. and Sometimes I look back on it. and actually don't know how it worked. I was actually don't know how it worked. I was actually don't know how it worked. I was trying to remember something and I trying to remember something and I trying to remember something and I looked back at my like emails and I saw looked back at my like emails and I saw looked back at my like emails and I saw some some some email I sent at like 3:30 in the morning email I sent at like 3:30 in the morning email I sent at like 3:30 in the morning to my someone on my staff like it was to my someone on my staff like it was to my someone on my staff like it was normal. normal. normal. I think on the city staff cuz the other I think on the city staff cuz the other I think on the city staff cuz the other thing is I was still mayor, right? So I thing is I was still mayor, right? So I thing is I was still mayor, right? So I was running the city. was running the city. was running the city. facing my father's death facing my father's death facing my father's death During that period my mother had a During that period my mother had a During that period my mother had a heart attack and heart surgery. heart attack and heart surgery. heart attack and heart surgery. And then launching this campaign like And then launching this campaign like And then launching this campaign like all within a few within a few weeks with all within a few within a few weeks with all within a few within a few weeks with each other.

It's a lot. It's a lot at once. It's a lot. It's a lot at once. >> It's a lot for one person to take. How >> It's a lot for one person to take. How >> It's a lot for one person to take. How how do you deal with all of that? The how do you deal with all of that? The how do you deal with all of that? The noise, the the family stuff at home, the noise, the the family stuff at home, the noise, the the family stuff at home, the loss of your father all at once. What's loss of your father all at once. What's loss of your father all at once. What's the strategy for the strategy for the strategy for >> How do I strategize a word? Um >> How do I strategize a word? Um >> How do I strategize a word? Um but my way of dealing with it. First of but my way of dealing with it. First of but my way of dealing with it. First of all, I had a lot to do with Chasten, so all, I had a lot to do with Chasten, so all, I had a lot to do with Chasten, so Uh all this happened Yeah, we got Uh all this happened Yeah, we got Uh all this happened Yeah, we got married in married in married in 2018. 2018. 2018. And all of this happened toward the end And all of this happened toward the end And all of this happened toward the end of 2019. of 2019. of 2019. So we hadn't been So we hadn't been So we hadn't been married for long. married for long. married for long. I never I never I never guessed when guessed when guessed when Neither one of us guessed on our first Neither one of us guessed on our first Neither one of us guessed on our first date date date or even when we got married that that or even when we got married that that or even when we got married that that this was happening. this was happening. this was happening. >> What is the you know, I've got lots of >> What is the you know, I've got lots of >> What is the you know, I've got lots of friends who have been on the journey of friends who have been on the journey of friends who have been on the journey of um um um sort of sort of sort of discovering their sexual orientation at discovering their sexual orientation at discovering their sexual orientation at a young age and then a young age and then a young age and then going through the process of being going through the process of being going through the process of being comfortable enough in that kind of comfortable enough in that kind of comfortable enough in that kind of environment to environment to environment to announce it to the world. announce it to the world. announce it to the world. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> How does that What's the sort of the >> How does that What's the sort of the >> How does that What's the sort of the journey of of you knowing who you are journey of of you knowing who you are journey of of you knowing who you are and then feeling comfortable enough to and then feeling comfortable enough to and then feeling comfortable enough to announce it? And what was the How do I announce it? And what was the How do I announce it? And what was the How do I put together the picture of like how put together the picture of like how put together the picture of like how your parents understood that, how the your parents understood that, how the your parents understood that, how the world understood that, how you world understood that, how you world understood that, how you understood that?

understood that? understood that? And also I guess the other question that And also I guess the other question that And also I guess the other question that I have is like I have is like I have is like American politics American politics American politics >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> How does that understand it? You know, >> How does that understand it? You know, >> How does that understand it? You know, you've got the right, the left. How do you've got the right, the left. How do you've got the right, the left. How do you think about all of that at the you think about all of that at the you think about all of that at the moment? moment? moment? >> Yeah, I mean I'd like to believe we'll >> Yeah, I mean I'd like to believe we'll >> Yeah, I mean I'd like to believe we'll get to a day when it's just get to a day when it's just get to a day when it's just not a thing. not a thing. not a thing. No one cares. No one cares. No one cares. And it doesn't affect your career. It And it doesn't affect your career. It And it doesn't affect your career. It doesn't affect your opportunities in doesn't affect your opportunities in doesn't affect your opportunities in life. It just is what it is. That's how I feel it should be. But, you That's how I feel it should be. But, you know, that's not know, that's not know, that's not how it was or how it is. I mean, when I how it was or how it is. I mean, when I how it was or how it is. I mean, when I was commissioned into the Navy Reserve, was commissioned into the Navy Reserve, was commissioned into the Navy Reserve, it was still the law of the land that if it was still the law of the land that if it was still the law of the land that if I was known to be gay, I'd be fired, I was known to be gay, I'd be fired, I was known to be gay, I'd be fired, right? right? right? In fact, when I In fact, when I In fact, when I when I finally made peace with this when I finally made peace with this when I finally made peace with this reality reality reality that I was gay, that I was gay, that I was gay, >> What age? >> What age? >> What age? >> I was well into my 20s cuz I wanted so >> I was well into my 20s cuz I wanted so >> I was well into my 20s cuz I wanted so bad for it not to be true bad for it not to be true bad for it not to be true that even though that even though that even though obviously I was the whole time, obviously I was the whole time, obviously I was the whole time, I just needed it not to be true.

I just needed it not to be true. I just needed it not to be true. And working through that took most of my And working through that took most of my And working through that took most of my 20s. 20s. 20s. And then when I finally kind of came to And then when I finally kind of came to And then when I finally kind of came to terms with it, terms with it, terms with it, it was also around the time that I was it was also around the time that I was it was also around the time that I was I was running for mayor. I was running for mayor. I was running for mayor. And maybe because And maybe because And maybe because not being able to come to terms with it not being able to come to terms with it not being able to come to terms with it meant that I didn't have really a dating meant that I didn't have really a dating meant that I didn't have really a dating life, life, life, maybe in some ways that helped maybe in some ways that helped maybe in some ways that helped professionally cuz I I had nothing else professionally cuz I I had nothing else professionally cuz I I had nothing else to do with my energy, you know? to do with my energy, you know? to do with my energy, you know? Um Um Um but I remember but I remember but I remember when I realized I was going to win, I I realized it was important that I I I realized it was important that I kind of finished the process of coming kind of finished the process of coming kind of finished the process of coming out to myself, out to myself, out to myself, which meant which meant which meant I had to come out to somebody else. I had to come out to somebody else. I had to come out to somebody else. That was what kind of marked it, you That was what kind of marked it, you That was what kind of marked it, you know? And so know? And so know? And so I had a conversation with a close and I had a conversation with a close and I had a conversation with a close and trusted friend. trusted friend. trusted friend. And I remember And I remember And I remember part of his reaction was to part of his reaction was to part of his reaction was to say, you know, say, you know, say, you know, to joke that like to joke that like to joke that like you didn't exactly make it easy on you didn't exactly make it easy on you didn't exactly make it easy on yourself because well, you know, my yourself because well, you know, my yourself because well, you know, my whole career professional life had two whole career professional life had two whole career professional life had two parts.

parts. parts. One was being One was being One was being a Navy officer when that could be a Navy officer when that could be a Navy officer when that could be career-ending. career-ending. career-ending. And the other was being an elected And the other was being an elected And the other was being an elected official in Indiana, which had official in Indiana, which had official in Indiana, which had was well on its way to getting a was well on its way to getting a was well on its way to getting a reputation as reputation as reputation as maybe the most anti-gay state in the maybe the most anti-gay state in the maybe the most anti-gay state in the country. Mike Pence hadn't yet become country. Mike Pence hadn't yet become country. Mike Pence hadn't yet become governor, but he soon would. governor, but he soon would. governor, but he soon would. On one level I was at peace with this On one level I was at peace with this On one level I was at peace with this fact. fact. fact. But I also knew it could be a But I also knew it could be a But I also knew it could be a career-limiting fact. So I kept it to myself So I kept it to myself for for for a long time. a long time. a long time. And then I just hit a point where I And then I just hit a point where I And then I just hit a point where I couldn't do that anymore. couldn't do that anymore. couldn't do that anymore. And then it was time to come out because And then it was time to come out because And then it was time to come out because well, the thing that really put me over well, the thing that really put me over well, the thing that really put me over the edge was when I was getting ready to the edge was when I was getting ready to the edge was when I was getting ready to deploy to Afghanistan. I was already in deploy to Afghanistan. I was already in deploy to Afghanistan. I was already in there, but like a lot of people in the there, but like a lot of people in the there, but like a lot of people in the reserve, you leave your day job to go reserve, you leave your day job to go reserve, you leave your day job to go when you get called up. So when you get called up. So when you get called up. So when you deploy in a war zone, they tell when you deploy in a war zone, they tell when you deploy in a war zone, they tell you to write a letter just in case you don't come back. just in case you don't come back. Which I did.

Which I did. Which I did. And And And in that I in that I in that I in that process, you're kind of taking in that process, you're kind of taking in that process, you're kind of taking stock of your life. You're thinking stock of your life. You're thinking stock of your life. You're thinking about what you want to say about what you want to say about what you want to say to the people you love most if you don't to the people you love most if you don't to the people you love most if you don't come back. come back. come back. And that was kind of the the moment that And that was kind of the the moment that And that was kind of the the moment that really is the final moment where I just really is the final moment where I just really is the final moment where I just thought if I Here I am, I'm taking stock thought if I Here I am, I'm taking stock thought if I Here I am, I'm taking stock of my life. I have a great life. of my life. I have a great life. of my life. I have a great life. But I'm a grown man in a position of But I'm a grown man in a position of But I'm a grown man in a position of responsibility. I'm a homeowner. I'm responsibility. I'm a homeowner. I'm responsibility. I'm a homeowner. I'm going to be a veteran. going to be a veteran. going to be a veteran. I don't know what it's like to be in I don't know what it's like to be in I don't know what it's like to be in love. love. love. And I just thought that's not that's And I just thought that's not that's And I just thought that's not that's untenable. And so I promised myself that untenable. And so I promised myself that untenable. And so I promised myself that if I came home if I came home if I came home safe, safe, safe, I would deal with this. I would deal with this. I would deal with this. And I came home physically safe. And I came home physically safe. And I came home physically safe. And And And the problem was there was a re-election the problem was there was a re-election the problem was there was a re-election coming up, coming up, coming up, but I didn't want to have to wait until but I didn't want to have to wait until but I didn't want to have to wait until I'd been reelected. I'd been reelected. I'd been reelected. Um so I figured out a way to come out. Um so I figured out a way to come out. Um so I figured out a way to come out. And I I was kind of resentful of the And I I was kind of resentful of the And I I was kind of resentful of the idea that I even had to, like straight idea that I even had to, like straight idea that I even had to, like straight people don't have to come out. people don't have to come out. people don't have to come out. But I knew that if I just But I knew that if I just But I knew that if I just tried to just like show up at some tried to just like show up at some tried to just like show up at some Chamber of Commerce dinner and my date Chamber of Commerce dinner and my date Chamber of Commerce dinner and my date was a dude that night, like that was was a dude that night, like that was was a dude that night, like that was just not I couldn't do it that way.

just not I couldn't do it that way. just not I couldn't do it that way. Um Um Um and I didn't want to be like quote and I didn't want to be like quote and I didn't want to be like quote unquote found out. Like I definitely unquote found out. Like I definitely unquote found out. Like I definitely didn't want to be hiding it. But I wanted to start dating. What about But I wanted to start dating. What about you? you? you? >> Your parents? >> Your parents? >> Your parents? >> I remember >> I remember >> I remember it was weird cuz again I I knew that it was weird cuz again I I knew that it was weird cuz again I I knew that they were forward-thinking. I knew they they were forward-thinking. I knew they they were forward-thinking. I knew they were accepting. I knew how much they were accepting. I knew how much they were accepting. I knew how much they loved me. loved me. loved me. Uh Uh Uh but I had a it took me a while to be but I had a it took me a while to be but I had a it took me a while to be ready to come out to them. ready to come out to them. ready to come out to them. And I do, you know, like I said, I used And I do, you know, like I said, I used And I do, you know, like I said, I used to go home for Sunday dinner every to go home for Sunday dinner every to go home for Sunday dinner every night. night. night. And uh and so I was home for Sunday And uh and so I was home for Sunday And uh and so I was home for Sunday dinner one night and dinner one night and dinner one night and kind of kind of kind of pushing my ice cream around with a spoon pushing my ice cream around with a spoon pushing my ice cream around with a spoon in the bowl and just thinking about and in the bowl and just thinking about and in the bowl and just thinking about and then I just took a deep breath and it's then I just took a deep breath and it's then I just took a deep breath and it's just like I got to tell you something. just like I got to tell you something. just like I got to tell you something. And um And um And um yeah, as I expected, like they, you yeah, as I expected, like they, you yeah, as I expected, like they, you know, responded with love and acceptance know, responded with love and acceptance know, responded with love and acceptance and I know not everybody gets to expect and I know not everybody gets to expect and I know not everybody gets to expect that, so I'm I'm thankful for that. that, so I'm I'm thankful for that. that, so I'm I'm thankful for that. My dad was immediately worried about My dad was immediately worried about My dad was immediately worried about what it might mean for my future. Not in what it might mean for my future. Not in what it might mean for my future. Not in a way that he was trying to like talk me a way that he was trying to like talk me a way that he was trying to like talk me out of anything, he just out of anything, he just out of anything, he just thought about that and talked about it.

thought about that and talked about it. thought about that and talked about it. My mom wanted to know if I was dating My mom wanted to know if I was dating My mom wanted to know if I was dating somebody. I think she had had her eyes somebody. I think she had had her eyes somebody. I think she had had her eyes on, you know, maybe becoming your on, you know, maybe becoming your on, you know, maybe becoming your grandma for a long time. grandma for a long time. grandma for a long time. Um I wasn't dating anybody, but you Um I wasn't dating anybody, but you Um I wasn't dating anybody, but you know, know, know, I don't know, it was probably within a I don't know, it was probably within a I don't know, it was probably within a year of that that I brought Chasten home year of that that I brought Chasten home year of that that I brought Chasten home for Sunday dinner for the first time and for Sunday dinner for the first time and for Sunday dinner for the first time and watched him hit it off with my parents, watched him hit it off with my parents, watched him hit it off with my parents, which is just like everything about that which is just like everything about that which is just like everything about that everything about that scene at dinner everything about that scene at dinner everything about that scene at dinner was just not a thing that I was just not a thing that I was just not a thing that I could have thought would have been could have thought would have been could have thought would have been possible possible possible just just a few years before it was just just a few years before it was just just a few years before it was happening. happening. happening. >> By the way, I just to say that's really >> By the way, I just to say that's really >> By the way, I just to say that's really beautiful. And I it's I think you beautiful. And I it's I think you beautiful. And I it's I think you probably don't realize the um probably don't realize the um probably don't realize the um the net impact that decision had on the net impact that decision had on the net impact that decision had on many, many people who are contending many, many people who are contending many, many people who are contending with their own sexuality um by being with their own sexuality um by being with their own sexuality um by being both a politician. I think you were the both a politician. I think you were the both a politician. I think you were the you were also the um you were also the um you were also the um Were you the first person in a Were you the first person in a Were you the first person in a presidential candidate to be openly gay presidential candidate to be openly gay presidential candidate to be openly gay as well? as well? as well? >> Uh definitely the first person who was >> Uh definitely the first person who was >> Uh definitely the first person who was considered to have a shot. Yeah. I mean, considered to have a shot. Yeah. I mean, considered to have a shot. Yeah. I mean, not that I was considered to have a shot not that I was considered to have a shot not that I was considered to have a shot when I started. when I started. when I started. >> Yeah. But I think in the same way that >> Yeah. But I think in the same way that >> Yeah. But I think in the same way that Obama paved the way for lots of other Obama paved the way for lots of other Obama paved the way for lots of other people to expand their minds as to what people to expand their minds as to what people to expand their minds as to what was possible for them because of their was possible for them because of their was possible for them because of their identity, I think you've certainly done identity, I think you've certainly done identity, I think you've certainly done that.

that. that. And I think it's um And I think it's um And I think it's um it's a weird word word to say courageous it's a weird word word to say courageous it's a weird word word to say courageous or brave or brave or brave um as it relates to just being yourself. um as it relates to just being yourself. um as it relates to just being yourself. >> Yeah, I mean, it was a personal >> Yeah, I mean, it was a personal >> Yeah, I mean, it was a personal decision, but decision, but decision, but >> But I think that when there's >> But I think that when there's >> But I think that when there's consequence and there's obvious consequence and there's obvious consequence and there's obvious consequence and you do something consequence and you do something consequence and you do something irrespective of that, I do consider it irrespective of that, I do consider it irrespective of that, I do consider it to be very admirable in that regard. We to be very admirable in that regard. We to be very admirable in that regard. We have a closing tradition where the last have a closing tradition where the last have a closing tradition where the last guest leaves a question for the next not guest leaves a question for the next not guest leaves a question for the next not knowing who they're leaving it for. knowing who they're leaving it for. knowing who they're leaving it for. The question left for you The question left for you The question left for you is what is the thing is what is the thing is what is the thing that the world needs to hear right now that the world needs to hear right now that the world needs to hear right now that it maybe doesn't want to hear that it maybe doesn't want to hear that it maybe doesn't want to hear that is uncomfortable but necessary. I think it's I think it's that it doesn't have to be the way it is it doesn't have to be the way it is but but but we have to do the hard things we have to do the hard things we have to do the hard things to change it. Like to change it. Like to change it. Like people can feel that things can't go on people can feel that things can't go on people can feel that things can't go on like this. like this. like this. And I go around all around the country And I go around all around the country And I go around all around the country reminding people that it doesn't have to reminding people that it doesn't have to reminding people that it doesn't have to be like this.

be like this. be like this. But it's not going to change on its own. But it's not going to change on its own. But it's not going to change on its own. Like you can't just sit back and let Like you can't just sit back and let Like you can't just sit back and let some pattern some pattern some pattern or some or some or some wave of history wave of history wave of history or some technology just like come save or some technology just like come save or some technology just like come save the day. It doesn't work that way. the day. It doesn't work that way. the day. It doesn't work that way. Everybody's got to be part of it. Everybody's got to be part of it. Everybody's got to be part of it. Everybody's going to have to give a Everybody's going to have to give a Everybody's going to have to give a little something up. little something up. little something up. And And And if we do it, it'll be great. if we do it, it'll be great. if we do it, it'll be great. But hard things are hard. But hard things are hard. But hard things are hard. >> One of the things that's quite different >> One of the things that's quite different >> One of the things that's quite different between you and other politicians as between you and other politicians as between you and other politicians as well as I think you are most willing to well as I think you are most willing to well as I think you are most willing to go and talk to the other side. go and talk to the other side. go and talk to the other side. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> But just before you arrived here, you >> But just before you arrived here, you >> But just before you arrived here, you were actually over at Fox News. were actually over at Fox News. were actually over at Fox News. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And I think that's also something that >> And I think that's also something that >> And I think that's also something that gosh, both political sides haven't gosh, both political sides haven't gosh, both political sides haven't always wanted to do. If we're talking always wanted to do. If we're talking always wanted to do. If we're talking about the things that are not nice to about the things that are not nice to about the things that are not nice to hear is you actually have to go talk to hear is you actually have to go talk to hear is you actually have to go talk to your quote and quote enemies or your quote and quote enemies or your quote and quote enemies or adversaries or those that are totally adversaries or those that are totally adversaries or those that are totally against you. And I applaud you for against you. And I applaud you for against you. And I applaud you for really leading the way there and you do really leading the way there and you do really leading the way there and you do a remarkable job of it cuz you're so a remarkable job of it cuz you're so a remarkable job of it cuz you're so bloody articulate and smart. bloody articulate and smart. bloody articulate and smart. Um Um Um but I think there's a that's that's but I think there's a that's that's but I think there's a that's that's something important as well in this something important as well in this something important as well in this moment in time. moment in time. moment in time. >> I think it's >> I think it's >> I think it's like politics good politics is about like politics good politics is about like politics good politics is about encounter.

encounter. encounter. Like it's about encountering people. Like it's about encountering people. Like it's about encountering people. What's the point of doing this if you're What's the point of doing this if you're What's the point of doing this if you're only only only truly talking to people who already truly talking to people who already truly talking to people who already agree with you. agree with you. agree with you. So yeah, to me it's it's it's a very So yeah, to me it's it's it's a very So yeah, to me it's it's it's a very natural part of the job. I get why it's natural part of the job. I get why it's natural part of the job. I get why it's hard. I get why not everybody does it. hard. I get why not everybody does it. hard. I get why not everybody does it. Um but to me it's one of the most Um but to me it's one of the most Um but to me it's one of the most important ways to earn my my keep. important ways to earn my my keep. important ways to earn my my keep. >> Thank you for doing that. Because it's >> Thank you for doing that. Because it's >> Thank you for doing that. Because it's so wonderful to see the so wonderful to see the so wonderful to see the I'd say conflict of ideas in in in I'd say conflict of ideas in in in I'd say conflict of ideas in in in public. public. public. Well, it's wonderful to see you going to Well, it's wonderful to see you going to Well, it's wonderful to see you going to the other side and I know you've been on the other side and I know you've been on the other side and I know you've been on a bit of a tour of red states recently a bit of a tour of red states recently a bit of a tour of red states recently doing exactly that. I I wish more doing exactly that. I I wish more doing exactly that. I I wish more politicians would do that because as we politicians would do that because as we politicians would do that because as we get to see those ideas that often exist get to see those ideas that often exist get to see those ideas that often exist on extreme poles um collide and we get on extreme poles um collide and we get on extreme poles um collide and we get to make our own mind up and please keep to make our own mind up and please keep to make our own mind up and please keep doing what you're doing. Thank you. I doing what you're doing. Thank you. I doing what you're doing. Thank you. I think it's really really remarkable and think it's really really remarkable and think it's really really remarkable and the values that you have I also respect the values that you have I also respect the values that you have I also respect a huge amount. So thank you for being a huge amount. So thank you for being a huge amount. So thank you for being here and I appreciate your generosity. here and I appreciate your generosity. here and I appreciate your generosity. >> Thank you for coming. Thanks for having >> Thank you for coming. Thanks for having >> Thank you for coming. Thanks for having me. me. me. >> YouTube [snorts] have this new crazy >> YouTube [snorts] have this new crazy >> YouTube [snorts] have this new crazy algorithm where they know exactly what algorithm where they know exactly what algorithm where they know exactly what video you would like to watch next based video you would like to watch next based video you would like to watch next based on AI and all of your viewing behavior on AI and all of your viewing behavior on AI and all of your viewing behavior and the algorithm says that this video and the algorithm says that this video and the algorithm says that this video is the perfect video for you. It's is the perfect video for you. It's is the perfect video for you. It's different for everybody looking right different for everybody looking right different for everybody looking right now. Check this video out. I bet you you now. Check this video out. I bet you you now. Check this video out. I bet you you might love it.