How to Know You're Ready to Plant a Church

I would be hesitant to make any strict I would be hesitant to make any strict rules. rules. rules. Um one thought is that Um one thought is that Um one thought is that I think you're ready to plant a church I think you're ready to plant a church I think you're ready to plant a church when you can be confident that the when you can be confident that the when you can be confident that the people who would be going out have been people who would be going out have been people who would be going out have been with you long enough with you long enough with you long enough to have absorbed the DNA. to have absorbed the DNA. to have absorbed the DNA. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Uh and and the the theological >> Uh and and the the theological >> Uh and and the the theological convictions and instincts of your convictions and instincts of your convictions and instincts of your church. So that you can have confidence church. So that you can have confidence church. So that you can have confidence that you know what's actually going to that you know what's actually going to that you know what's actually going to be reproduced. I think there is a danger be reproduced. I think there is a danger be reproduced. I think there is a danger of reproducing, planting prematurely, of reproducing, planting prematurely, of reproducing, planting prematurely, and therefore not knowing frankly what and therefore not knowing frankly what and therefore not knowing frankly what kind of church is going to get planted. kind of church is going to get planted. kind of church is going to get planted. >> I'm I'm I'm assuming this not only >> I'm I'm I'm assuming this not only >> I'm I'm I'm assuming this not only becomes a becomes a becomes a a burden, a desire on your heart to a burden, a desire on your heart to a burden, a desire on your heart to serve in this way, but some other people serve in this way, but some other people serve in this way, but some other people confirm that hey, this is a good idea confirm that hey, this is a good idea confirm that hey, this is a good idea for you to think about. Walk us through for you to think about. Walk us through for you to think about. Walk us through from there to you getting to Richmond to from there to you getting to Richmond to from there to you getting to Richmond to where you are. Just give us a timeline where you are. Just give us a timeline where you are. Just give us a timeline of that whole process. of that whole process. of that whole process. >> Yeah, the quick flyover would be that >> Yeah, the quick flyover would be that >> Yeah, the quick flyover would be that in the fall of 2020, when my wife and I in the fall of 2020, when my wife and I in the fall of 2020, when my wife and I had had prayerfully come to the had had prayerfully come to the had had prayerfully come to the realization that that we we think we realization that that we we think we realization that that we we think we want to be in Richmond, we took a little want to be in Richmond, we took a little want to be in Richmond, we took a little vision trip, just the two of us, vision trip, just the two of us, vision trip, just the two of us, to Richmond and met with some local to Richmond and met with some local to Richmond and met with some local pastors in the area, some friends that pastors in the area, some friends that pastors in the area, some friends that we knew in Richmond who were interested we knew in Richmond who were interested we knew in Richmond who were interested in being a part of a of a new in being a part of a of a new in being a part of a of a new gospel outpost.

gospel outpost. gospel outpost. And after that trip, we went back to my And after that trip, we went back to my And after that trip, we went back to my elders in to our elders in Louisville elders in to our elders in Louisville elders in to our elders in Louisville and and said we'd like to do this, and and and said we'd like to do this, and and and said we'd like to do this, and they said great. they said great. they said great. >> Were you on staff at Third Avenue at the >> Were you on staff at Third Avenue at the >> Were you on staff at Third Avenue at the time? time? time? >> I was a lay elder. >> I was a lay elder. >> I was a lay elder. >> Lay elder? >> Lay elder? >> Lay elder? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> And >> And >> And then in January of 2021, we announced then in January of 2021, we announced then in January of 2021, we announced this to the church. We had an this to the church. We had an this to the church. We had an informational presentation for about 45 informational presentation for about 45 informational presentation for about 45 minutes, which we recorded and had as an minutes, which we recorded and had as an minutes, which we recorded and had as an unlisted YouTube link, and that became unlisted YouTube link, and that became unlisted YouTube link, and that became really useful because as people in really useful because as people in really useful because as people in Richmond started to hear about this Richmond started to hear about this Richmond started to hear about this church plant and would and would inquire church plant and would and would inquire church plant and would and would inquire about it and say, "Can we do a Zoom about it and say, "Can we do a Zoom about it and say, "Can we do a Zoom call?" Rather than saying, "Sure, when call?" Rather than saying, "Sure, when call?" Rather than saying, "Sure, when are you available?" I would say, are you available?" I would say, are you available?" I would say, "Here's a link, watch this informational "Here's a link, watch this informational "Here's a link, watch this informational presentation, and if you're still presentation, and if you're still presentation, and if you're still interested in talking, I'd be happy to." interested in talking, I'd be happy to." interested in talking, I'd be happy to." Uh so, it was just a a a frankly Uh so, it was just a a a frankly Uh so, it was just a a a frankly efficient way efficient way efficient way uh to help just orient people to what uh to help just orient people to what uh to help just orient people to what our church was going to be about. our church was going to be about. our church was going to be about. We had a period of about 6 months there We had a period of about 6 months there We had a period of about 6 months there in Louisville where we were praying, in Louisville where we were praying, in Louisville where we were praying, planning, recruiting, um having those planning, recruiting, um having those planning, recruiting, um having those prayer and pizza gatherings, and then prayer and pizza gatherings, and then prayer and pizza gatherings, and then the summer of 2021, we and those 11 the summer of 2021, we and those 11 the summer of 2021, we and those 11 other adults and their kids moved to other adults and their kids moved to other adults and their kids moved to Richmond with a view to planting River Richmond with a view to planting River Richmond with a view to planting River City Baptist.

City Baptist. City Baptist. >> Now, when did you know that they were >> Now, when did you know that they were >> Now, when did you know that they were going to come? I mean, what what where going to come? I mean, what what where going to come? I mean, what what where where were they were identified in the where were they were identified in the where were they were identified in the early part of that year? Is it early part of that year? Is it early part of that year? Is it >> Some some as early as January, others >> Some some as early as January, others >> Some some as early as January, others were were, you know, last of all, were were, you know, last of all, were were, you know, last of all, uh you know, as untimely born. They they uh you know, as untimely born. They they uh you know, as untimely born. They they they kind of were buzzer-beater they kind of were buzzer-beater they kind of were buzzer-beater situations. Um situations. Um situations. Um but we we all kind of came here summer but we we all kind of came here summer but we we all kind of came here summer of 2021, and then in the fall and winter of 2021, and then in the fall and winter of 2021, and then in the fall and winter we had 10 core team meetings. And these we had 10 core team meetings. And these we had 10 core team meetings. And these were on were on were on every other Sunday evening, so we didn't every other Sunday evening, so we didn't every other Sunday evening, so we didn't want to impinge on people's commitment want to impinge on people's commitment want to impinge on people's commitment to their churches in Richmond. Um to their churches in Richmond. Um to their churches in Richmond. Um and we and we and we I didn't want to also start with our I didn't want to also start with our I didn't want to also start with our ecclesiological distinctives. I wanted ecclesiological distinctives. I wanted ecclesiological distinctives. I wanted to start with the glory of God. So, what to start with the glory of God. So, what to start with the glory of God. So, what I taught on week one was the glory of I taught on week one was the glory of I taught on week one was the glory of God. God. God. >> a service in the home? How did you do >> a service in the home? How did you do >> a service in the home? How did you do that? that? that? >> Think a church service meets a Young >> Think a church service meets a Young >> Think a church service meets a Young Life meeting. So, I I I didn't want to Life meeting. So, I I I didn't want to Life meeting. So, I I I didn't want to make it the kind of thing where people make it the kind of thing where people make it the kind of thing where people um um um I didn't want to so simulate a church I didn't want to so simulate a church I didn't want to so simulate a church service that people thought that's what service that people thought that's what service that people thought that's what was happening. Uh as if that checks the was happening. Uh as if that checks the was happening. Uh as if that checks the box. We're not a church yet. But I also box. We're not a church yet. But I also box. We're not a church yet. But I also for like for example, I thought about for like for example, I thought about for like for example, I thought about not doing any musical worship not doing any musical worship not doing any musical worship um so that we wouldn't lead people to um so that we wouldn't lead people to um so that we wouldn't lead people to think, "Hey, you've already you've think, "Hey, you've already you've think, "Hey, you've already you've experienced church." But we ended up experienced church." But we ended up experienced church." But we ended up singing a few songs each time because I singing a few songs each time because I singing a few songs each time because I realized actually one of the main things realized actually one of the main things realized actually one of the main things that I'm wanting to promote is that I'm wanting to promote is that I'm wanting to promote is congregational singing. And so I want to congregational singing. And so I want to congregational singing. And so I want to give folks a taste of of what that's

give folks a taste of of what that's give folks a taste of of what that's going to be like. Um but yeah, I I going to be like. Um but yeah, I I going to be like. Um but yeah, I I started week one teaching on the glory started week one teaching on the glory started week one teaching on the glory of God. Week two of God. Week two of God. Week two >> evening that you do that? Okay. >> evening that you do that? Okay. >> evening that you do that? Okay. >> evening. Week two was the gospel of God. >> evening. Week two was the gospel of God. >> evening. Week two was the gospel of God. Week three was the people of God, which Week three was the people of God, which Week three was the people of God, which was a biblical theology survey of of was a biblical theology survey of of was a biblical theology survey of of God's people. And then starting week God's people. And then starting week God's people. And then starting week four we drilled down on distinctives um four we drilled down on distinctives um four we drilled down on distinctives um in in terms of in in terms of in in terms of expositional preaching, congregational expositional preaching, congregational expositional preaching, congregational singing, regulative principle, singing, regulative principle, singing, regulative principle, uh polity, elders, deacons, et cetera. uh polity, elders, deacons, et cetera. uh polity, elders, deacons, et cetera. And it kind of became our membership And it kind of became our membership And it kind of became our membership class for the that original core group. class for the that original core group. class for the that original core group. >> All all four of those things became the >> All all four of those things became the >> All all four of those things became the membership class or the the fourth week? membership class or the the fourth week? membership class or the the fourth week? >> section. Final section. Statement of >> section. Final section. Statement of >> section. Final section. Statement of faith, church covenant, priorities. And faith, church covenant, priorities. And faith, church covenant, priorities. And then I I did membership interviews of then I I did membership interviews of then I I did membership interviews of everyone. And then in February of 2022 >> with you? >> with you? >> Yeah, so we we we we covenanted together >> Yeah, so we we we we covenanted together >> Yeah, so we we we we covenanted together as a church in February with with 69 as a church in February with with 69 as a church in February with with 69 um members. And um I had two other um members. And um I had two other um members. And um I had two other founding elders. And we voted on members founding elders. And we voted on members founding elders. And we voted on members before elders because you can have a before elders because you can have a before elders because you can have a church without elders, but can't have a church without elders, but can't have a church without elders, but can't have a church without members. And um church without members. And um church without members. And um and and so what the the first action of and and so what the the first action of and and so what the the first action of the church um was taking the Lord's the church um was taking the Lord's the church um was taking the Lord's Supper and affirming our first slate of Supper and affirming our first slate of Supper and affirming our first slate of elders.

elders. elders. >> And did you visit around some of the >> And did you visit around some of the >> And did you visit around some of the other churches in the area during that other churches in the area during that other churches in the area during that period of time? period of time? period of time? >> Absolutely. And I encouraged the others >> Absolutely. And I encouraged the others >> Absolutely. And I encouraged the others who had come from Louisville to do that who had come from Louisville to do that who had come from Louisville to do that and for us not all to go to the same and for us not all to go to the same and for us not all to go to the same church. church. church. >> What'd you learn? >> What'd you learn? >> What'd you learn? >> I learned that there's a lot of >> I learned that there's a lot of >> I learned that there's a lot of wonderful gospel ministry going on in wonderful gospel ministry going on in wonderful gospel ministry going on in the city. And that and that we are not the city. And that and that we are not the city. And that and that we are not saviors swooping into Richmond. saviors swooping into Richmond. saviors swooping into Richmond. Um we're just we're just reinforcements Um we're just we're just reinforcements Um we're just we're just reinforcements coming in and wanting to um coming in and wanting to um coming in and wanting to um just just take just just take just just take a few more yards on on the beach as it a few more yards on on the beach as it a few more yards on on the beach as it were. Um were. Um were. Um as as we advance against the powers of as as we advance against the powers of as as we advance against the powers of hell in the city. hell in the city. hell in the city. >> Um >> Um >> Um How how did you approach funding? I How how did you approach funding? I How how did you approach funding? I mean, did you were you supported fully mean, did you were you supported fully mean, did you were you supported fully out of 3rd Avenue? Tell us a little bit out of 3rd Avenue? Tell us a little bit out of 3rd Avenue? Tell us a little bit about the funding side of things. about the funding side of things. about the funding side of things. >> Have you ever heard of laying out a >> Have you ever heard of laying out a >> Have you ever heard of laying out a fleece? fleece? fleece? >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Uh >> Uh >> Uh funding is is [snorts] yeah, it's just funding is is [snorts] yeah, it's just funding is is [snorts] yeah, it's just it's an occupational hazard. Uh it's it's an occupational hazard. Uh it's it's an occupational hazard. Uh it's just some it's the it's it literally is just some it's the it's it literally is just some it's the it's it literally is the kind of the cost of doing business.

the kind of the cost of doing business. the kind of the cost of doing business. And so, And so, And so, um it's it's not fun, but it's um it's it's not fun, but it's um it's it's not fun, but it's necessary. And so, I just I just got necessary. And so, I just I just got necessary. And so, I just I just got after it. I I basically reached out to after it. I I basically reached out to after it. I I basically reached out to every pastor friend in the United States every pastor friend in the United States every pastor friend in the United States of America of America of America and sent our prospectus and vision and sent our prospectus and vision and sent our prospectus and vision uh for reaching Richmond for Christ. And uh for reaching Richmond for Christ. And uh for reaching Richmond for Christ. And by God's grace, a lot of churches were by God's grace, a lot of churches were by God's grace, a lot of churches were very generous with us. very generous with us. very generous with us. Um and we also saw a pretty quick growth Um and we also saw a pretty quick growth Um and we also saw a pretty quick growth as a church. Um as a church. Um as a church. Um so that so that so that for example, our sending church in for example, our sending church in for example, our sending church in Louisville had agreed to support us for Louisville had agreed to support us for Louisville had agreed to support us for 3 years, but after year two, we were 3 years, but after year two, we were 3 years, but after year two, we were able to say, "Wow, you can put that able to say, "Wow, you can put that able to say, "Wow, you can put that money elsewhere." And I realize that's money elsewhere." And I realize that's money elsewhere." And I realize that's not the reality for most church not the reality for most church not the reality for most church planters. planters. planters. Um Um Um and in in that sense, yeah, I'm just so and in in that sense, yeah, I'm just so and in in that sense, yeah, I'm just so so grateful to the Lord, but so grateful to the Lord, but so grateful to the Lord, but yeah, I I would encourage guys not to be yeah, I I would encourage guys not to be yeah, I I would encourage guys not to be bashful about asking for money. bashful about asking for money. bashful about asking for money. Um I actually think support raising Um I actually think support raising Um I actually think support raising builds builds builds muscles of faith, which are really good muscles of faith, which are really good muscles of faith, which are really good for growth as a Christian. In fact, the for growth as a Christian. In fact, the for growth as a Christian. In fact, the same muscles that are required for same muscles that are required for same muscles that are required for raising money are the same muscles for raising money are the same muscles for raising money are the same muscles for sharing the gospel. You're going up to sharing the gospel. You're going up to sharing the gospel. You're going up to someone someone someone and you're presenting something and and you're presenting something and and you're presenting something and there's the risk of rejection. There's there's the risk of rejection. There's there's the risk of rejection. There's the risk of being told absolutely not, the risk of being told absolutely not, the risk of being told absolutely not, please get out of here.

please get out of here. please get out of here. And so I think it's it's a good thing And so I think it's it's a good thing And so I think it's it's a good thing and it's a humbling thing and it's a humbling thing and it's a humbling thing to to ask people to consider in faith to to ask people to consider in faith to to ask people to consider in faith giving to the work of your ministry. giving to the work of your ministry. giving to the work of your ministry. >> What do you wish that you had understood >> What do you wish that you had understood >> What do you wish that you had understood earlier earlier earlier about the importance of clear pathways about the importance of clear pathways about the importance of clear pathways for newcomers to belong and to serve and for newcomers to belong and to serve and for newcomers to belong and to serve and be discipled in the church? be discipled in the church? be discipled in the church? >> Yeah, two two levels to this. So So one >> Yeah, two two levels to this. So So one >> Yeah, two two levels to this. So So one for me, for me, for me, I think I think I think I looking back wish that I hadn't I looking back wish that I hadn't I looking back wish that I hadn't assumed that we had to be hitting on all assumed that we had to be hitting on all assumed that we had to be hitting on all cylinders on day one. So I wanted I cylinders on day one. So I wanted I cylinders on day one. So I wanted I wanted to kind of have all the wanted to kind of have all the wanted to kind of have all the offerings, offerings, offerings, all the programs, all the things all the programs, all the things all the programs, all the things day one, whereas I had a an elder day one, whereas I had a an elder day one, whereas I had a an elder challenge me and say, "Hey, challenge me and say, "Hey, challenge me and say, "Hey, let's just get Sunday mornings right." let's just get Sunday mornings right." let's just get Sunday mornings right." That that was very liberating and it was That that was very liberating and it was That that was very liberating and it was very wise and I needed to hear that. And very wise and I needed to hear that. And very wise and I needed to hear that. And and we can add other stuff and we can add other stuff and we can add other stuff as we're able, home groups, Sunday as we're able, home groups, Sunday as we're able, home groups, Sunday school, etc., but we started just with school, etc., but we started just with school, etc., but we started just with Sunday morning and a Sunday evening Sunday morning and a Sunday evening Sunday morning and a Sunday evening prayer service every other week and we prayer service every other week and we prayer service every other week and we went from there and I think that's okay.

went from there and I think that's okay. went from there and I think that's okay. Um in terms of the kind of pathways to Um in terms of the kind of pathways to Um in terms of the kind of pathways to membership, membership, membership, I I just kind of resolved at the I I just kind of resolved at the I I just kind of resolved at the beginning that that we were going to beginning that that we were going to beginning that that we were going to engage in truth and advertising. engage in truth and advertising. engage in truth and advertising. >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> So that's actually one of the reasons I >> So that's actually one of the reasons I >> So that's actually one of the reasons I put Baptist in the church name. Uh put Baptist in the church name. Uh put Baptist in the church name. Uh that's very rare to do. In fact, my that's very rare to do. In fact, my that's very rare to do. In fact, my church planning assessors and coaches church planning assessors and coaches church planning assessors and coaches with the with the with the state convention state convention state convention were basically like, "Are you sure you were basically like, "Are you sure you were basically like, "Are you sure you want to do that?" Just because no one want to do that?" Just because no one want to do that?" Just because no one does that these days. does that these days. does that these days. But, counterintuitively, Lig, I've found But, counterintuitively, Lig, I've found But, counterintuitively, Lig, I've found that that that that has actually served and promoted that has actually served and promoted that has actually served and promoted gospel catholicity. And here's why. gospel catholicity. And here's why. gospel catholicity. And here's why. We're being upfront about who we are We're being upfront about who we are We're being upfront about who we are and who we're not. and who we're not. and who we're not. And it's a way of saying, And it's a way of saying, And it's a way of saying, "We're not trying to be the right church "We're not trying to be the right church "We're not trying to be the right church for everyone." I planted at the age of for everyone." I planted at the age of for everyone." I planted at the age of 39, which is which is old for a church 39, which is which is old for a church 39, which is which is old for a church planter. planter. planter. I think if I had planted at 29, there's I think if I had planted at 29, there's I think if I had planted at 29, there's no way I would have had Baptist in the no way I would have had Baptist in the no way I would have had Baptist in the church name.

church name. church name. Because I think and there there are Because I think and there there are Because I think and there there are 29-year-olds out there who are a lot 29-year-olds out there who are a lot 29-year-olds out there who are a lot more mature than I was. So, I'm just more mature than I was. So, I'm just more mature than I was. So, I'm just telling on myself. telling on myself. telling on myself. But, I think that I would have tried to But, I think that I would have tried to But, I think that I would have tried to be all things to all people be all things to all people be all things to all people in a way that 10 years later, I didn't in a way that 10 years later, I didn't in a way that 10 years later, I didn't feel the need to be. Um and so, at our feel the need to be. Um and so, at our feel the need to be. Um and so, at our membership class, membership class, membership class, I have a a list of things that I always I have a a list of things that I always I have a a list of things that I always tick off that uh tick off that uh tick off that uh might tick people off. Uh but basically, might tick people off. Uh but basically, might tick people off. Uh but basically, here, I don't want to waste your time. I here, I don't want to waste your time. I here, I don't want to waste your time. I don't want to waste my time. So, here don't want to waste my time. So, here don't want to waste my time. So, here are a few distinctives about our church are a few distinctives about our church are a few distinctives about our church that might surprise you, that that um that might surprise you, that that um that might surprise you, that that um that you may need to think more about or that you may need to think more about or that you may need to think more about or might just be off-putting to you. And might just be off-putting to you. And might just be off-putting to you. And I'm just I we just try to be upfront I'm just I we just try to be upfront I'm just I we just try to be upfront about that that that kind of stuff. And about that that that kind of stuff. And about that that that kind of stuff. And I found that has borne so much fruit I found that has borne so much fruit I found that has borne so much fruit >> you for that, and let me gently commend >> you for that, and let me gently commend >> you for that, and let me gently commend that to my Presbyterian brethren. You that to my Presbyterian brethren. You that to my Presbyterian brethren. You know, don't try and hide that you're a know, don't try and hide that you're a know, don't try and hide that you're a Presbyterian and bring in the Presbyterian and bring in the Presbyterian and bring in the unsuspecting multitudes and then sneak unsuspecting multitudes and then sneak unsuspecting multitudes and then sneak your Calvinism out of your back pocket. your Calvinism out of your back pocket. your Calvinism out of your back pocket. Just put it on the table upfront and let Just put it on the table upfront and let Just put it on the table upfront and let them know what you are. I I think that's them know what you are. I I think that's them know what you are. I I think that's much healthier much healthier much healthier uh way of I actually think that helps uh way of I actually think that helps uh way of I actually think that helps you in theological identity, and it you in theological identity, and it you in theological identity, and it keeps you from having to overcorrect keeps you from having to overcorrect keeps you from having to overcorrect so that you don't have a proper so that you don't have a proper so that you don't have a proper catholicity, right? If you if you catholicity, right? If you if you catholicity, right? If you if you haven't put your cards on the table haven't put your cards on the table haven't put your cards on the table where you are theologically, you end up where you are theologically, you end up where you are theologically, you end up having to compensate for that at certain having to compensate for that at certain having to compensate for that at certain points down the line. Whereas if you points down the line. Whereas if you points down the line. Whereas if you just hey, here's where we are and by the just hey, here's where we are and by the just hey, here's where we are and by the way, we're very thankful for all the

way, we're very thankful for all the way, we're very thankful for all the other evangelical churches in this area. other evangelical churches in this area. other evangelical churches in this area. We're going to pray for them, pray that We're going to pray for them, pray that We're going to pray for them, pray that the Lord prospers their ministry. We're the Lord prospers their ministry. We're the Lord prospers their ministry. We're not them, they're not us, we're not them, they're not us, we're not them, they're not us, we're different, we've got these convictions, different, we've got these convictions, different, we've got these convictions, but we really appreciate the fact that but we really appreciate the fact that but we really appreciate the fact that the gospel is going out there. It's I the gospel is going out there. It's I the gospel is going out there. It's I think it's just a much healthier way of think it's just a much healthier way of think it's just a much healthier way of starting out and the way of continuing starting out and the way of continuing starting out and the way of continuing in ministry. in ministry. in ministry. >> Yeah, as it's been said, have clear >> Yeah, as it's been said, have clear >> Yeah, as it's been said, have clear fences and shake hands over them often.