How to Speak Jesus to Your Friends [TGC Podcast Ep. 397]

So, just a few words of So, just a few words of introduction. My name is Sam. Samch introduction. My name is Sam. Samch introduction. My name is Sam. Samch Chan. Yes, I'm Asian. Yes, I'm Chan. Yes, I'm Asian. Yes, I'm Chan. Yes, I'm Asian. Yes, I'm Australian. And yes, I'm short. That's Australian. And yes, I'm short. That's Australian. And yes, I'm short. That's why I'm standing on this. They built why I'm standing on this. They built why I'm standing on this. They built this just in time for me to be here. And this just in time for me to be here. And this just in time for me to be here. And I'm married to my wife Steph. We got I'm married to my wife Steph. We got I'm married to my wife Steph. We got into I don't know, USA, day before. into I don't know, USA, day before. into I don't know, USA, day before. Stephanie's trying to hide. She hates Stephanie's trying to hide. She hates Stephanie's trying to hide. She hates being seen, but she's sitting right in being seen, but she's sitting right in being seen, but she's sitting right in the middle next to the camera there. the middle next to the camera there. the middle next to the camera there. Also, we have three boys. So, I've told Also, we have three boys. So, I've told Also, we have three boys. So, I've told him, "Boys, when you grow up, chances him, "Boys, when you grow up, chances him, "Boys, when you grow up, chances are you'd be just like me. Not very are you'd be just like me. Not very are you'd be just like me. Not very good-looking. Very, very short. So, no good-looking. Very, very short. So, no good-looking. Very, very short. So, no girl is ever going to like you. Your girl is ever going to like you. Your girl is ever going to like you. Your only chance in life is to study hard and only chance in life is to study hard and only chance in life is to study hard and make a lot of make a lot of make a lot of money." Now, of course, I'm joking. I'm money." Now, of course, I'm joking. I'm money." Now, of course, I'm joking. I'm not say I never have said that. But not say I never have said that. But not say I never have said that. But every Asian in the room is thinking, every Asian in the room is thinking, every Asian in the room is thinking, "Hang on, I've said that or my dad has "Hang on, I've said that or my dad has "Hang on, I've said that or my dad has said that to me." No, I have never said said that to me." No, I have never said said that to me." No, I have never said that to my boys. But anyway, it's so that to my boys. But anyway, it's so that to my boys. But anyway, it's so good to be here. Uh just a few other good to be here. Uh just a few other good to be here. Uh just a few other words of words of words of introduction. Uh what can I say? So introduction. Uh what can I say? So introduction. Uh what can I say? So shout out to my publisher Zonovan. So I shout out to my publisher Zonovan. So I shout out to my publisher Zonovan. So I was an unknown Aussie and a few years was an unknown Aussie and a few years was an unknown Aussie and a few years ago they took a chance on me and we put ago they took a chance on me and we put ago they took a chance on me and we put out Evangelism in a skeptical world and out Evangelism in a skeptical world and out Evangelism in a skeptical world and it did way better than we thought it it did way better than we thought it it did way better than we thought it would do. It won book of the year by would do. It won book of the year by would do. It won book of the year by Christianity Today I think. But its only Christianity Today I think. But its only Christianity Today I think. But its only problem is it's a big book. It's over problem is it's a big book. It's over problem is it's a big book. It's over 200 pages long. So then we thought we'll 200 pages long. So then we thought we'll 200 pages long. So then we thought we'll put out a much easier easier version put out a much easier easier version put out a much easier easier version only a few much only a few pages how to only a few much only a few pages how to only a few much only a few pages how to talk about Jesus without being that guy

talk about Jesus without being that guy talk about Jesus without being that guy and we presented some of the points here and we presented some of the points here and we presented some of the points here at TGC in at TGC in at TGC in 2019 and so we'll present some more 2019 and so we'll present some more 2019 and so we'll present some more content from this book but much more content from this book but much more content from this book but much more content also there's a lot of stuff from content also there's a lot of stuff from content also there's a lot of stuff from me on YouTube so chances are you may me on YouTube so chances are you may me on YouTube so chances are you may have heard some of this stuff before have heard some of this stuff before have heard some of this stuff before don't worry there'll be other stuff you don't worry there'll be other stuff you don't worry there'll be other stuff you haven't heard but also if there's stuff haven't heard but also if there's stuff haven't heard but also if there's stuff you've heard heard before. Just laugh as you've heard heard before. Just laugh as you've heard heard before. Just laugh as if it's your very first time hearing if it's your very first time hearing if it's your very first time hearing that joke for the benefit of the others that joke for the benefit of the others that joke for the benefit of the others who have not heard who have not heard who have not heard yet. So, we're talking about shifts in yet. So, we're talking about shifts in yet. So, we're talking about shifts in talking about talking about talking about Jesus. Hands up here. Who hands up here? Jesus. Hands up here. Who hands up here? Jesus. Hands up here. Who hands up here? Who has heard of the rock band You Who has heard of the rock band You Who has heard of the rock band You Two? Wow. Okay. Hands down. Majority, Two? Wow. Okay. Hands down. Majority, Two? Wow. Okay. Hands down. Majority, right? So, a few years ago, you two came right? So, a few years ago, you two came right? So, a few years ago, you two came to Australia, came to Sydney. I went to to Australia, came to Sydney. I went to to Australia, came to Sydney. I went to the concert. It felt good. I thought, the concert. It felt good. I thought, the concert. It felt good. I thought, "Hey, look at me. Young, still rocking "Hey, look at me. Young, still rocking "Hey, look at me. Young, still rocking it at a big open air rock concert." Then it at a big open air rock concert." Then it at a big open air rock concert." Then I looked around and I realized everyone I looked around and I realized everyone I looked around and I realized everyone is really is really is really old. Everyone here is really old. I old. Everyone here is really old. I old. Everyone here is really old. I don't see any young people here. And I don't see any young people here. And I don't see any young people here. And I suddenly realized, "Wow, young people suddenly realized, "Wow, young people suddenly realized, "Wow, young people don't listen to you, too. They've never don't listen to you, too. They've never don't listen to you, too. They've never heard of you two. Our world has heard of you two. Our world has heard of you two. Our world has changed." I also worked part-time as a changed." I also worked part-time as a changed." I also worked part-time as a medical doctor. I was working with a medical doctor. I was working with a medical doctor. I was working with a young surgeon. Surgeon says to me, "Oh, young surgeon. Surgeon says to me, "Oh, young surgeon. Surgeon says to me, "Oh, Sam, do you like listening to Billy Sam, do you like listening to Billy Sam, do you like listening to Billy Idol?" I said, "Yes, I love Billy Idol."

Idol?" I said, "Yes, I love Billy Idol." Idol?" I said, "Yes, I love Billy Idol." He looks at me, "Who's Billy Idol?" I He looks at me, "Who's Billy Idol?" I He looks at me, "Who's Billy Idol?" I said, "Billy Isish?" And I said, "Who's said, "Billy Isish?" And I said, "Who's said, "Billy Isish?" And I said, "Who's Billy Isish?" And suddenly writes, "The Billy Isish?" And suddenly writes, "The Billy Isish?" And suddenly writes, "The world has changed. They're not listening world has changed. They're not listening world has changed. They're not listening to the music we grew up with." And to the music we grew up with." And to the music we grew up with." And chances are the ways we've been talking chances are the ways we've been talking chances are the ways we've been talking about Jesus, let's say 20 years ago, are about Jesus, let's say 20 years ago, are about Jesus, let's say 20 years ago, are are not the ways people talk about Jesus are not the ways people talk about Jesus are not the ways people talk about Jesus now. We're not just post-Christian. Now now. We're not just post-Christian. Now now. We're not just post-Christian. Now they're saying we're they're saying we're they're saying we're postChristian. So what are some things postChristian. So what are some things postChristian. So what are some things we can do to shift in the way we talk we can do to shift in the way we talk we can do to shift in the way we talk about Jesus to our friends and family? about Jesus to our friends and family? about Jesus to our friends and family? Now, if I'm talking really fast, it's Now, if I'm talking really fast, it's Now, if I'm talking really fast, it's because I'm talking really fast cuz I'm because I'm talking really fast cuz I'm because I'm talking really fast cuz I'm hoping to leave some time for question hoping to leave some time for question hoping to leave some time for question and answer time afterwards. So, as I'm and answer time afterwards. So, as I'm and answer time afterwards. So, as I'm talking, think of whatever questions you talking, think of whatever questions you talking, think of whatever questions you might want to ask. I'll do my best to might want to ask. I'll do my best to might want to ask. I'll do my best to try to answer those questions. All try to answer those questions. All try to answer those questions. All right. What are some random tips on how right. What are some random tips on how right. What are some random tips on how we can talk about Jesus to our friends we can talk about Jesus to our friends we can talk about Jesus to our friends and family? The first tip you may have and family? The first tip you may have and family? The first tip you may have heard before, and I call it the shift heard before, and I call it the shift heard before, and I call it the shift from well, rather than something we do from well, rather than something we do from well, rather than something we do as a once off, evangelism now has to be as a once off, evangelism now has to be as a once off, evangelism now has to be a lifestyle. It's actually a lifyle a lifestyle. It's actually a lifyle a lifestyle. It's actually a lifyle change. to be evangelistic. We It's a change. to be evangelistic. We It's a change. to be evangelistic. We It's a lifestyle change. And I'm sure you've lifestyle change. And I'm sure you've lifestyle change. And I'm sure you've probably heard this story before, but if probably heard this story before, but if probably heard this story before, but if I said to you, you won't believe what happened.

you, you won't believe what happened. Just last week, my wife and I were Just last week, my wife and I were Just last week, my wife and I were watching TV, and a UFO landed in our watching TV, and a UFO landed in our watching TV, and a UFO landed in our backyard, and a little alien got out, backyard, and a little alien got out, backyard, and a little alien got out, invited us into the UFO. So, my wife and invited us into the UFO. So, my wife and invited us into the UFO. So, my wife and I jumped in, and he took us to his home I jumped in, and he took us to his home I jumped in, and he took us to his home planet Jupiter. We got out. He showed us planet Jupiter. We got out. He showed us planet Jupiter. We got out. He showed us around. We had a meal with him. We around. We had a meal with him. We around. We had a meal with him. We jumped back into the UFO and because of jumped back into the UFO and because of jumped back into the UFO and because of the time portal space-time continuum the time portal space-time continuum the time portal space-time continuum thing, we arrived back in Earth and only thing, we arrived back in Earth and only thing, we arrived back in Earth and only 1 second of Earth time had gone by. 1 second of Earth time had gone by. 1 second of Earth time had gone by. Hands up here. Who believes Hands up here. Who believes Hands up here. Who believes me? Okay, one or two. It's a minority me? Okay, one or two. It's a minority me? Okay, one or two. It's a minority belief. Let me tell you another story. belief. Let me tell you another story. belief. Let me tell you another story. 2,000 years ago, God sent us his son, 2,000 years ago, God sent us his son, 2,000 years ago, God sent us his son, Jesus, born of a virgin, 100% God, 100% Jesus, born of a virgin, 100% God, 100% Jesus, born of a virgin, 100% God, 100% human. At the same time, dies on a human. At the same time, dies on a human. At the same time, dies on a cross. If you believe this, God washes cross. If you believe this, God washes cross. If you believe this, God washes away all your sin, guilt, and shame. away all your sin, guilt, and shame. away all your sin, guilt, and shame. More than this, 3 days later, he rose More than this, 3 days later, he rose More than this, 3 days later, he rose from the grave. And now he's in heaven. from the grave. And now he's in heaven. from the grave. And now he's in heaven. And one day, depending on which And one day, depending on which And one day, depending on which denomination you belong to, he will come denomination you belong to, he will come denomination you belong to, he will come back and he'll set up a physical kingdom back and he'll set up a physical kingdom back and he'll set up a physical kingdom here on earth. Hands up here. Who here on earth. Hands up here. Who here on earth. Hands up here. Who believes me? Whoa. Okay. Hands down.

believes me? Whoa. Okay. Hands down. believes me? Whoa. Okay. Hands down. Majority belief. Now, you got to think, Majority belief. Now, you got to think, Majority belief. Now, you got to think, why am I happy to believe the Jesus why am I happy to believe the Jesus why am I happy to believe the Jesus story but not the Jupiter story? Cuz story but not the Jupiter story? Cuz story but not the Jupiter story? Cuz let's face it, they both sound pretty let's face it, they both sound pretty let's face it, they both sound pretty unbelievable. And if we're honest, the unbelievable. And if we're honest, the unbelievable. And if we're honest, the Jesus story is more unbelievable than Jesus story is more unbelievable than Jesus story is more unbelievable than the Jupiter story. Why do we believe the Jupiter story. Why do we believe the Jupiter story. Why do we believe Jesus and not the Judas story? Because Jesus and not the Judas story? Because Jesus and not the Judas story? Because as I'm talking to listening, you have what philosophers, listening, you have what philosophers, sociologists call plausibility sociologists call plausibility sociologists call plausibility structures. And plausibility structures structures. And plausibility structures structures. And plausibility structures are are are pre-programmed, pre-programmed, pre-programmed, predetermined structures that we have predetermined structures that we have predetermined structures that we have that prejudge a story as bling, that prejudge a story as bling, that prejudge a story as bling, believable or unbelievable. So as I'm believable or unbelievable. So as I'm believable or unbelievable. So as I'm telling you the Jupiter story, I say, telling you the Jupiter story, I say, telling you the Jupiter story, I say, "Hey, a UFO Jupiter time portal. Your "Hey, a UFO Jupiter time portal. Your "Hey, a UFO Jupiter time portal. Your pre-programmed predetermined pre-programmed predetermined pre-programmed predetermined plausibility structures are prejudging plausibility structures are prejudging plausibility structures are prejudging the stories. Unbelievable." But I tell the stories. Unbelievable." But I tell the stories. Unbelievable." But I tell you the Jesus story. Jesus born of a you the Jesus story. Jesus born of a you the Jesus story. Jesus born of a virgin dies on a cross rises from the virgin dies on a cross rises from the virgin dies on a cross rises from the dead and one day you too will rise from dead and one day you too will rise from dead and one day you too will rise from the dead. You're thinking bling bling the dead. You're thinking bling bling the dead. You're thinking bling bling bling believable believable believable.

bling believable believable believable. bling believable believable believable. Why? Where do we get these plausibility Why? Where do we get these plausibility Why? Where do we get these plausibility structures from? Well, they come from structures from? Well, they come from structures from? Well, they come from three main sources. Our three main sources. Our three main sources. Our community, people that we know, love and community, people that we know, love and community, people that we know, love and trust. They come from our trust. They come from our trust. They come from our experiences and they come from facts, experiences and they come from facts, experiences and they come from facts, evidence and evidence and evidence and data. So as I tell you the Jupiter data. So as I tell you the Jupiter data. So as I tell you the Jupiter story, none of us live in a community of story, none of us live in a community of story, none of us live in a community of people who believe in UFOs. None of us people who believe in UFOs. None of us people who believe in UFOs. None of us have had a personal experience of UFOs have had a personal experience of UFOs have had a personal experience of UFOs and none of us believe there are any and none of us believe there are any and none of us believe there are any facts, evidence or data to support my facts, evidence or data to support my facts, evidence or data to support my UFO story. But as I tell you about UFO story. But as I tell you about UFO story. But as I tell you about Jesus, most of us live in a community of Jesus, most of us live in a community of Jesus, most of us live in a community of friends and family that also believe in friends and family that also believe in friends and family that also believe in Jesus. We've had a personal experience Jesus. We've had a personal experience Jesus. We've had a personal experience of Jesus and we believe there are enough of Jesus and we believe there are enough of Jesus and we believe there are enough facts, evidence, and data to support the facts, evidence, and data to support the facts, evidence, and data to support the Jesus story. Now, out of these three, Jesus story. Now, out of these three, Jesus story. Now, out of these three, which one is the most powerful for which one is the most powerful for which one is the most powerful for determining belief? Now, me, we may determining belief? Now, me, we may determining belief? Now, me, we may think it's facts, evidence, and data. We think it's facts, evidence, and data. We think it's facts, evidence, and data. We may want it to be facts, evidence, and may want it to be facts, evidence, and may want it to be facts, evidence, and data, but it's not. It's the least data, but it's not. It's the least data, but it's not. It's the least powerful one in determining belief. So, powerful one in determining belief. So, powerful one in determining belief. So, let's see how facts, evidence, and data let's see how facts, evidence, and data let's see how facts, evidence, and data works. If I said to you, the UFO, facts, works. If I said to you, the UFO, facts, works. If I said to you, the UFO, facts, evidence, and data, it's in my backyard evidence, and data, it's in my backyard evidence, and data, it's in my backyard still right now. Who here in this room still right now. Who here in this room still right now. Who here in this room of 700 people could be bothered flying of 700 people could be bothered flying of 700 people could be bothered flying to Australia to check out the to Australia to check out the to Australia to check out the UFO? No one. So, you could not be UFO? No one. So, you could not be UFO? No one. So, you could not be bothered to check it out. And even if bothered to check it out. And even if bothered to check it out. And even if you did come, you'd be thinking, "Aha, you did come, you'd be thinking, "Aha, you did come, you'd be thinking, "Aha, now there's another explanation." You

now there's another explanation." You now there's another explanation." You explain away the facts, evidence and explain away the facts, evidence and explain away the facts, evidence and data. So the most powerful one for data. So the most powerful one for data. So the most powerful one for determining belief is community. Friends determining belief is community. Friends determining belief is community. Friends and family that we know, love, and and family that we know, love, and and family that we know, love, and trust. So as I tell you the Jupiter trust. So as I tell you the Jupiter trust. So as I tell you the Jupiter story, I'm unbelievable. I'm the only story, I'm unbelievable. I'm the only story, I'm unbelievable. I'm the only bozo in this room that believes in the bozo in this room that believes in the bozo in this room that believes in the Jupiter story. But as I'm telling the Jupiter story. But as I'm telling the Jupiter story. But as I'm telling the Jupiter story, imagine if this half the Jupiter story, imagine if this half the Jupiter story, imagine if this half the room went, "Me, too. Last week, I also room went, "Me, too. Last week, I also room went, "Me, too. Last week, I also went in a UFO to Jupiter. I thought that went in a UFO to Jupiter. I thought that went in a UFO to Jupiter. I thought that was you I saw, but I just didn't want to was you I saw, but I just didn't want to was you I saw, but I just didn't want to raise my hand. Now, this half the room, raise my hand. Now, this half the room, raise my hand. Now, this half the room, you're thinking, "This is more you're thinking, "This is more you're thinking, "This is more believable." And imagine if the whole believable." And imagine if the whole believable." And imagine if the whole room said, "Me, too." And you're the one room said, "Me, too." And you're the one room said, "Me, too." And you're the one bozo who doesn't believe it. This is way bozo who doesn't believe it. This is way bozo who doesn't believe it. This is way more believable. That's why Paul says, more believable. That's why Paul says, more believable. That's why Paul says, "Hey, I saw Jesus risen from the dead." "Hey, I saw Jesus risen from the dead." "Hey, I saw Jesus risen from the dead." Oh, wait. Not just me, by 500 people Oh, wait. Not just me, by 500 people Oh, wait. Not just me, by 500 people that you know, love, and trust. They that you know, love, and trust. They that you know, love, and trust. They also saw Jesus risen from the dead. Now, also saw Jesus risen from the dead. Now, also saw Jesus risen from the dead. Now, it's believable. It's true whether you it's believable. It's true whether you it's believable. It's true whether you like it or not. It's true whether 500 like it or not. It's true whether 500 like it or not. It's true whether 500 people saw Jesus or not, but it's more people saw Jesus or not, but it's more people saw Jesus or not, but it's more believable because 500 other people saw believable because 500 other people saw believable because 500 other people saw Jesus risen from the dead. So, why am I Jesus risen from the dead. So, why am I Jesus risen from the dead. So, why am I saying this? Because usually when we saying this? Because usually when we saying this? Because usually when we think about telling our friends and think about telling our friends and think about telling our friends and family about family about family about Jesus, we go solo. We think, "Oh, okay.

Jesus, we go solo. We think, "Oh, okay. Jesus, we go solo. We think, "Oh, okay. I'm going to be bold and I'm going to I'm going to be bold and I'm going to I'm going to be bold and I'm going to sign up for a flag football team, a book sign up for a flag football team, a book sign up for a flag football team, a book club, and I'm going to tell everyone club, and I'm going to tell everyone club, and I'm going to tell everyone there about Jesus." Which is good. It's there about Jesus." Which is good. It's there about Jesus." Which is good. It's noble. It's bold, but we're going to be noble. It's bold, but we're going to be noble. It's bold, but we're going to be unbelievable because we're the one bozo unbelievable because we're the one bozo unbelievable because we're the one bozo in the room that believes the story. in the room that believes the story. in the room that believes the story. It's true, but it's unbelievable. So, It's true, but it's unbelievable. So, It's true, but it's unbelievable. So, what we need to do is merge our what we need to do is merge our what we need to do is merge our universes of friends. universes of friends. universes of friends. So, we have to merge our universes So, we have to merge our universes So, we have to merge our universes because typically as Christians, we have because typically as Christians, we have because typically as Christians, we have a universe of Christian friends and a a universe of Christian friends and a a universe of Christian friends and a universe of non-Christian friends. And universe of non-Christian friends. And universe of non-Christian friends. And so, when our Christian friends have a so, when our Christian friends have a so, when our Christian friends have a barbecue, we go with them. When our barbecue, we go with them. When our barbecue, we go with them. When our non-Christian friends go to the movies, non-Christian friends go to the movies, non-Christian friends go to the movies, we go with them. But we keep the we go with them. But we keep the we go with them. But we keep the universes separate. But what we need to universes separate. But what we need to universes separate. But what we need to do is merge our universes. So, when our do is merge our universes. So, when our do is merge our universes. So, when our Christian friends have a Christian friends have a Christian friends have a barbecue, invite our non-Christian barbecue, invite our non-Christian barbecue, invite our non-Christian friends along. when our non-Christian friends along. when our non-Christian friends along. when our non-Christian friends go to the movies, invite our friends go to the movies, invite our friends go to the movies, invite our Christian friends along. So, bit by bit, Christian friends along. So, bit by bit, Christian friends along. So, bit by bit, we won't be the one bozo who believes in we won't be the one bozo who believes in we won't be the one bozo who believes in the Jesus story, but they'll be the Jesus story, but they'll be the Jesus story, but they'll be thinking, hang on, a lot more people who thinking, hang on, a lot more people who thinking, hang on, a lot more people who I know, love, and trust also believe in I know, love, and trust also believe in I know, love, and trust also believe in the Jesus story. So, it becomes more the Jesus story. So, it becomes more the Jesus story. So, it becomes more believable. So, what this means is it's believable. So, what this means is it's believable. So, what this means is it's a lifestyle change because it takes a lifestyle change because it takes a lifestyle change because it takes years to build up a new network of years to build up a new network of years to build up a new network of friends. One or two years, it's a friends. One or two years, it's a friends. One or two years, it's a lifestyle change. It's like getting fit.

lifestyle change. It's like getting fit. lifestyle change. It's like getting fit. Every year for New Year's, we always Every year for New Year's, we always Every year for New Year's, we always think, "Ah, this year, this year, this think, "Ah, this year, this year, this think, "Ah, this year, this year, this this year for sure, I'm going to get this year for sure, I'm going to get this year for sure, I'm going to get fit. I'll eat less, drink less, exercise fit. I'll eat less, drink less, exercise fit. I'll eat less, drink less, exercise more, and it lasts about a week." And we more, and it lasts about a week." And we more, and it lasts about a week." And we get up at 5 in the morning, we go to go get up at 5 in the morning, we go to go get up at 5 in the morning, we go to go for a run, go to the gym last week for a run, go to the gym last week for a run, go to the gym last week because it's unsustainable because it because it's unsustainable because it because it's unsustainable because it was one extra event that we shoehorn was one extra event that we shoehorn was one extra event that we shoehorn into our busy calendar. When we shoe into our busy calendar. When we shoe into our busy calendar. When we shoe when when fitness should be a lifestyle when when fitness should be a lifestyle when when fitness should be a lifestyle change, we become fit. Evangelism is the change, we become fit. Evangelism is the change, we become fit. Evangelism is the same. It's not one extra thing we try to same. It's not one extra thing we try to same. It's not one extra thing we try to do in our calendar. No, we become do in our calendar. No, we become do in our calendar. No, we become evangelistic by deliberately merging our evangelistic by deliberately merging our evangelistic by deliberately merging our universes of friends. And that means we universes of friends. And that means we universes of friends. And that means we can matchmake our friends. See, this can matchmake our friends. See, this can matchmake our friends. See, this used to happen to me all the time when I used to happen to me all the time when I used to happen to me all the time when I was single. My friends will invite me to was single. My friends will invite me to was single. My friends will invite me to a dinner party. I'll turn up and think, a dinner party. I'll turn up and think, a dinner party. I'll turn up and think, "Ah, it's happened again. They're trying "Ah, it's happened again. They're trying "Ah, it's happened again. They're trying to match me up. Married couple, married to match me up. Married couple, married to match me up. Married couple, married couple, a girl all by herself. I see couple, a girl all by herself. I see couple, a girl all by herself. I see what's happening." But so my wife and I, what's happening." But so my wife and I, what's happening." But so my wife and I, we try to match make our non-Christian we try to match make our non-Christian we try to match make our non-Christian friends with our Christian friends. Not friends with our Christian friends. Not friends with our Christian friends. Not romantically, but socially. So if we romantically, but socially. So if we romantically, but socially. So if we have a barbecue, we think, hang on, this have a barbecue, we think, hang on, this have a barbecue, we think, hang on, this set of friends will get on really well set of friends will get on really well set of friends will get on really well with this set of friends. Let's with this set of friends. Let's with this set of friends. Let's introduce them to each other. It's introduce them to each other. It's introduce them to each other. It's called getting our friends to become called getting our friends to become called getting our friends to become friends with their friends. So now in friends with their friends. So now in friends with their friends. So now in Australia, a lot of churches now have Australia, a lot of churches now have Australia, a lot of churches now have merge days in their church calendar.

merge days in their church calendar. merge days in their church calendar. This is a deliberate day where we merge This is a deliberate day where we merge This is a deliberate day where we merge our universes of friends. When I was a our universes of friends. When I was a our universes of friends. When I was a junior doctor, I lived in hospital junior doctor, I lived in hospital junior doctor, I lived in hospital accommodation with three other accommodation with three other accommodation with three other non-Christian doctors. But that meant non-Christian doctors. But that meant non-Christian doctors. But that meant whenever my Christian friends came and whenever my Christian friends came and whenever my Christian friends came and we went out, we would invite them along. we went out, we would invite them along. we went out, we would invite them along. And whenever they went somewhere to do And whenever they went somewhere to do And whenever they went somewhere to do something, I'd invite my church friends something, I'd invite my church friends something, I'd invite my church friends along. And bit by bit, we merged our along. And bit by bit, we merged our along. And bit by bit, we merged our universes of friends. And bit by bit, universes of friends. And bit by bit, universes of friends. And bit by bit, after 2 years, they also came to know, after 2 years, they also came to know, after 2 years, they also came to know, love, and worship Jesus. But it takes love, and worship Jesus. But it takes love, and worship Jesus. But it takes about one or two years. It's a lifestyle about one or two years. It's a lifestyle about one or two years. It's a lifestyle change. That's one shift in how we talk change. That's one shift in how we talk change. That's one shift in how we talk about Jesus. So that's shift number one. about Jesus. So that's shift number one. about Jesus. So that's shift number one. It's a lifestyle change. Let's merge our It's a lifestyle change. Let's merge our It's a lifestyle change. Let's merge our universes. Shift number two is we pivot. universes. Shift number two is we pivot. universes. Shift number two is we pivot. We shift from what's called eventbased We shift from what's called eventbased We shift from what's called eventbased evangelism to what they call evangelism to what they call evangelism to what they call disciple making evangelism. So disciple making evangelism. So disciple making evangelism. So event-based evangelism is where our event-based evangelism is where our event-based evangelism is where our church invites a very gifted speaker to church invites a very gifted speaker to church invites a very gifted speaker to come to give a talk and our come to give a talk and our come to give a talk and our non-Christian friends come and they hear non-Christian friends come and they hear non-Christian friends come and they hear and they and they and they believe. Disciplem evangelism is where believe. Disciplem evangelism is where believe. Disciplem evangelism is where we train just the normal ordinary we train just the normal ordinary we train just the normal ordinary Christian to tell their friends about Christian to tell their friends about Christian to tell their friends about Jesus. Now once upon a time this was the Jesus. Now once upon a time this was the Jesus. Now once upon a time this was the main way of doing evangelism. Billy main way of doing evangelism. Billy main way of doing evangelism. Billy Graeme for example. And long may this Graeme for example. And long may this Graeme for example. And long may this continue. I'm employed by City Bible continue. I'm employed by City Bible continue. I'm employed by City Bible Forum in Australia to be that guy who Forum in Australia to be that guy who Forum in Australia to be that guy who gives a talk at the event. So long may

gives a talk at the event. So long may gives a talk at the event. So long may this continue. It pays the bills for me. this continue. It pays the bills for me. this continue. It pays the bills for me. But the shift is this. This is only But the shift is this. This is only But the shift is this. This is only going to be 1% of how evangelism works. going to be 1% of how evangelism works. going to be 1% of how evangelism works. 99% is going to happen through just 99% is going to happen through just 99% is going to happen through just normal non-trained people who have not normal non-trained people who have not normal non-trained people who have not been to seminary Christians telling been to seminary Christians telling been to seminary Christians telling their friends and family about Jesus. their friends and family about Jesus. their friends and family about Jesus. See, this is the pointy end of the See, this is the pointy end of the See, this is the pointy end of the funnel. But all the action is going to funnel. But all the action is going to funnel. But all the action is going to happen over here. By the time someone happen over here. By the time someone happen over here. By the time someone turns up to hear me speak, oh, this has turns up to hear me speak, oh, this has turns up to hear me speak, oh, this has had to happen over on this side. And had to happen over on this side. And had to happen over on this side. And this is good news. This is an this is good news. This is an this is good news. This is an opportunity. It's not a threat. So, opportunity. It's not a threat. So, opportunity. It's not a threat. So, Barner.com in the USA, they have worked Barner.com in the USA, they have worked Barner.com in the USA, they have worked out, they've surveyed non-believers and out, they've surveyed non-believers and out, they've surveyed non-believers and they said, "If I was to hear about they said, "If I was to hear about they said, "If I was to hear about Jesus, I'd want to hear it from a Jesus, I'd want to hear it from a Jesus, I'd want to hear it from a Christian friend." And they've also Christian friend." And they've also Christian friend." And they've also surveyed non-believers and they found surveyed non-believers and they found surveyed non-believers and they found that the average non-believer, yes, that the average non-believer, yes, that the average non-believer, yes, they've got a problem with the idea of they've got a problem with the idea of they've got a problem with the idea of Christianity, but they don't have a Christianity, but they don't have a Christianity, but they don't have a problem with the Christian friend that problem with the Christian friend that problem with the Christian friend that they know. Survey in the UK found they know. Survey in the UK found they know. Survey in the UK found exactly the same thing. Non-believers exactly the same thing. Non-believers exactly the same thing. Non-believers are favorably disposed to the Christian are favorably disposed to the Christian are favorably disposed to the Christian friend they have in their life. They friend they have in their life. They friend they have in their life. They have a high view of the Christian friend have a high view of the Christian friend have a high view of the Christian friend in their life. An easy way then of doing in their life. An easy way then of doing in their life. An easy way then of doing this is just show people and I'm I don't this is just show people and I'm I don't this is just show people and I'm I don't work for Alpha, but for example, they work for Alpha, but for example, they work for Alpha, but for example, they have online stuff. Glenn Scrivener has

have online stuff. Glenn Scrivener has have online stuff. Glenn Scrivener has something called 321. You can send them something called 321. You can send them something called 321. You can send them there online. Hey, check out this link. there online. Hey, check out this link. there online. Hey, check out this link. Uh and you know we always think I I Uh and you know we always think I I Uh and you know we always think I I reckon so this is a quick reckon so this is a quick reckon so this is a quick aside people discover Jesus I find in aside people discover Jesus I find in aside people discover Jesus I find in three ways and you sort of need all three ways and you sort of need all three ways and you sort of need all three to operate. One way is they meet a three to operate. One way is they meet a three to operate. One way is they meet a Christian friend. Second way and all Christian friend. Second way and all Christian friend. Second way and all three happen concurrently like you need three happen concurrently like you need three happen concurrently like you need all three it seems. Second thing is they all three it seems. Second thing is they all three it seems. Second thing is they get invited to go to church and they get invited to go to church and they get invited to go to church and they experience church. Third thing is they experience church. Third thing is they experience church. Third thing is they Google Jesus. They're discovering Jesus Google Jesus. They're discovering Jesus Google Jesus. They're discovering Jesus online. People want to check out Jesus online. People want to check out Jesus online. People want to check out Jesus in the privacy of their own home. It's in the privacy of their own home. It's in the privacy of their own home. It's like when you try to book accommodation like when you try to book accommodation like when you try to book accommodation in a hotel or you try to book a plane in a hotel or you try to book a plane in a hotel or you try to book a plane ticket and suddenly a pop-up window ticket and suddenly a pop-up window ticket and suddenly a pop-up window says, "Do you need help?" And you go, says, "Do you need help?" And you go, says, "Do you need help?" And you go, "No, no, no, no, no, no, no." Cuz you "No, no, no, no, no, no, no." Cuz you "No, no, no, no, no, no, no." Cuz you just want to do it yourself. And people just want to do it yourself. And people just want to do it yourself. And people are doing the same thing. They're are doing the same thing. They're are doing the same thing. They're googling Jesus. They want to find out googling Jesus. They want to find out googling Jesus. They want to find out about Jesus. So we can send them to good about Jesus. So we can send them to good about Jesus. So we can send them to good links rather than unhelpful links. That links rather than unhelpful links. That links rather than unhelpful links. That would be very good. Also Mark Green UK. He did some There's no E there. I UK. He did some There's no E there. I know they're UK, but they misspell know they're UK, but they misspell know they're UK, but they misspell everything in the UK, don't they? All everything in the UK, don't they? All everything in the UK, don't they? All right. Mark Green. He looked at when right. Mark Green. He looked at when right. Mark Green. He looked at when people went to hear Billy Graeme speak people went to hear Billy Graeme speak people went to hear Billy Graeme speak in the London Crusade. By the time they in the London Crusade. By the time they in the London Crusade. By the time they heard Billy Graeme speak and they prayed

heard Billy Graeme speak and they prayed heard Billy Graeme speak and they prayed the prayer, they ticked the box, they the prayer, they ticked the box, they the prayer, they ticked the box, they walked down the front, they gave their walked down the front, they gave their walked down the front, they gave their lives to Jesus, for that to happen, that lives to Jesus, for that to happen, that lives to Jesus, for that to happen, that person had 32 prior gospel encounters person had 32 prior gospel encounters person had 32 prior gospel encounters for that to happen. So, it's always been for that to happen. So, it's always been for that to happen. So, it's always been the pointy end of the funnel. We just the pointy end of the funnel. We just the pointy end of the funnel. We just weren't seeing it. So what all what weren't seeing it. So what all what weren't seeing it. So what all what we're trying to do is just trying to be we're trying to do is just trying to be we're trying to do is just trying to be one of those 32 prior gospel encounters. one of those 32 prior gospel encounters. one of those 32 prior gospel encounters. So don't be discouraged when they don't So don't be discouraged when they don't So don't be discouraged when they don't believe. No, it takes time. It's a believe. No, it takes time. It's a believe. No, it takes time. It's a lifestyle change. So that's a second lifestyle change. So that's a second lifestyle change. So that's a second pivot. pivot. pivot. The third shift, the third pivot in The third shift, the third pivot in The third shift, the third pivot in talking about 10, 20 years ago, if you went to 10, 20 years ago, if you went to seminary, if you took the class on seminary, if you took the class on seminary, if you took the class on evangelism, chances are you were trained evangelism, chances are you were trained evangelism, chances are you were trained in evangelism by a preacher because in evangelism by a preacher because in evangelism by a preacher because that's what evangelism was. It was a that's what evangelism was. It was a that's what evangelism was. It was a non-stop monologue where you control the non-stop monologue where you control the non-stop monologue where you control the conversation or and long may continue.

conversation or and long may continue. conversation or and long may continue. You got to walk up to a stranger, maybe You got to walk up to a stranger, maybe You got to walk up to a stranger, maybe read from a track, four points, six read from a track, four points, six read from a track, four points, six points, and again, it's a monologue. points, and again, it's a monologue. points, and again, it's a monologue. You're controlling the conversation. But You're controlling the conversation. But You're controlling the conversation. But with friends and family, it's going to with friends and family, it's going to with friends and family, it's going to be a be a be a conversation. So we need to pivot from conversation. So we need to pivot from conversation. So we need to pivot from thinking of evangelism from evangelizing thinking of evangelism from evangelizing thinking of evangelism from evangelizing like a preacher to evangelizing like a like a preacher to evangelizing like a like a preacher to evangelizing like a counselor. And how do counselors counsel counselor. And how do counselors counsel counselor. And how do counselors counsel you? If you've ever seen a counselor, you? If you've ever seen a counselor, you? If you've ever seen a counselor, what do counselors do? They ask what do counselors do? They ask what do counselors do? They ask questions. They don't monologue. They questions. They don't monologue. They questions. They don't monologue. They let you do all the talking. They ask let you do all the talking. They ask let you do all the talking. They ask questions. And I remember when I was questions. And I remember when I was questions. And I remember when I was going through a crossroads moment in my going through a crossroads moment in my going through a crossroads moment in my life many years ago where I had to life many years ago where I had to life many years ago where I had to decide, am I going to stay in full-time decide, am I going to stay in full-time decide, am I going to stay in full-time medicine or am I going to full-time medicine or am I going to full-time medicine or am I going to full-time Christian ministry? And I lined up eight Christian ministry? And I lined up eight Christian ministry? And I lined up eight wise, mature Christians for advice. And wise, mature Christians for advice. And wise, mature Christians for advice. And they monologued at me for half an hour they monologued at me for half an hour they monologued at me for half an hour to an hour. And I walked away from each to an hour. And I walked away from each to an hour. And I walked away from each session, huh? Underwhelmed, session, huh? Underwhelmed, session, huh? Underwhelmed, disappointed, and I couldn't work out disappointed, and I couldn't work out disappointed, and I couldn't work out why. Because I had asked for advice.

why. Because I had asked for advice. why. Because I had asked for advice. They gave me advice, but I was unhappy. They gave me advice, but I was unhappy. They gave me advice, but I was unhappy. But then I met a friend who was a But then I met a friend who was a But then I met a friend who was a trained counselor. And I said to him, trained counselor. And I said to him, trained counselor. And I said to him, "Hey, I could stay in full-time "Hey, I could stay in full-time "Hey, I could stay in full-time Christian and I could stay in full-time Christian and I could stay in full-time Christian and I could stay in full-time medicine." He just said, "You could, medicine." He just said, "You could, medicine." He just said, "You could, couldn't you?" couldn't you?" couldn't you?" And he unlocked me with one question. And he unlocked me with one question. And he unlocked me with one question. Because what questions do is they dis Because what questions do is they dis Because what questions do is they dis you are you now find your own pain point you are you now find your own pain point you are you now find your own pain point and you discover the answer for and you discover the answer for and you discover the answer for yourself. They're now showing in yourself. They're now showing in yourself. They're now showing in evangelism studies that Jesus in the New evangelism studies that Jesus in the New evangelism studies that Jesus in the New Testament asked about 300 questions. Testament asked about 300 questions. Testament asked about 300 questions. Jesus himself was asked 200 questions, Jesus himself was asked 200 questions, Jesus himself was asked 200 questions, but he only directly answered that but he only directly answered that but he only directly answered that question eight times. The rest of the question eight times. The rest of the question eight times. The rest of the time, he responded with a time, he responded with a time, he responded with a question. And so what we can do is learn question. And so what we can do is learn question. And so what we can do is learn the power of what are called nudge the power of what are called nudge the power of what are called nudge questions. nudge questions. So, just questions. nudge questions. So, just questions. nudge questions. So, just nudge the conversation from interest, nudge the conversation from interest, nudge the conversation from interest, what did you do in the what did you do in the what did you do in the weekend to values, oh, what do you like weekend to values, oh, what do you like weekend to values, oh, what do you like about that? To world views, nudge about that? To world views, nudge about that? To world views, nudge questions that nudge the the questions that nudge the the questions that nudge the the conversation along. And eventually, we conversation along. And eventually, we conversation along. And eventually, we can get to questions can get to questions can get to questions like, "What religion did your parents like, "What religion did your parents like, "What religion did your parents have?" Because that's still descriptive.

have?" Because that's still descriptive. have?" Because that's still descriptive. But now we've nudged the question into But now we've nudged the question into But now we've nudged the question into the world views layer because remember the world views layer because remember the world views layer because remember there are three layers to a there are three layers to a there are three layers to a conversation. Interests, what did you do conversation. Interests, what did you do conversation. Interests, what did you do on the weekend? What books are you on the weekend? What books are you on the weekend? What books are you reading? Middle layer values. What's reading? Middle layer values. What's reading? Middle layer values. What's good about that? To central layer world good about that? To central layer world good about that? To central layer world views. We can also ask views. We can also ask views. We can also ask them what was church like for you them what was church like for you them what was church like for you growing growing growing up. And again, that's descriptive, but up. And again, that's descriptive, but up. And again, that's descriptive, but that's going to say a lot about where that's going to say a lot about where that's going to say a lot about where they are in their faith. And it gives they are in their faith. And it gives they are in their faith. And it gives them permission now to talk faith them permission now to talk faith them permission now to talk faith conversations. Or even more directly, we conversations. Or even more directly, we conversations. Or even more directly, we can say, "Do you have a faith? Tell me can say, "Do you have a faith? Tell me can say, "Do you have a faith? Tell me about your faith journey." And if they about your faith journey." And if they about your faith journey." And if they say, "I have no faith or I have a faith say, "I have no faith or I have a faith say, "I have no faith or I have a faith or I'm a Buddhist or I'm a Muslim." What or I'm a Buddhist or I'm a Muslim." What or I'm a Buddhist or I'm a Muslim." What we do is then ask the we do is then ask the we do is then ask the power power power of the second of the second of the second question. As doctors, we make fun of our question. As doctors, we make fun of our question. As doctors, we make fun of our psychiatry colleagues and our counselor psychiatry colleagues and our counselor psychiatry colleagues and our counselor colleagues by colleagues by colleagues by saying it doesn't take much to be a saying it doesn't take much to be a saying it doesn't take much to be a psychiatrist. You only have to ask two psychiatrist. You only have to ask two psychiatrist. You only have to ask two questions. How are you doing? How are questions. How are you doing? How are questions. How are you doing? How are you really doing?

And it's that power the second question And it's that power the second question now we ask them how are you doing? How now we ask them how are you doing? How now we ask them how are you doing? How are you really doing? And it gives them are you really doing? And it gives them are you really doing? And it gives them permission to open up and be vulnerable. permission to open up and be vulnerable. permission to open up and be vulnerable. We and then all we do is keep asking We and then all we do is keep asking We and then all we do is keep asking questions. Tell me more. Why is that questions. Tell me more. Why is that questions. Tell me more. Why is that important? Tell me more. How do you feel important? Tell me more. How do you feel important? Tell me more. How do you feel about it? Tell me more. Why is that about it? Tell me more. Why is that about it? Tell me more. Why is that important? Tell me more. How do you feel important? Tell me more. How do you feel important? Tell me more. How do you feel about it? If you do that, you can listen about it? If you do that, you can listen about it? If you do that, you can listen for the next one hour. I for the next one hour. I for the next one hour. I remember I I was working as a doctor. remember I I was working as a doctor. remember I I was working as a doctor. This young nurse came to me and she This young nurse came to me and she This young nurse came to me and she said, "What books should I said, "What books should I said, "What books should I read?" And she was young. She was from read?" And she was young. She was from read?" And she was young. She was from China. So that was my chance now to be China. So that was my chance now to be China. So that was my chance now to be the doctor, play the power game, man. the doctor, play the power game, man. the doctor, play the power game, man. Explain to her. Okay, let me tell you Explain to her. Okay, let me tell you Explain to her. Okay, let me tell you about the cannon of western literature. about the cannon of western literature. about the cannon of western literature. Instead, I said, "Huh, why do you Instead, I said, "Huh, why do you Instead, I said, "Huh, why do you ask?" And she said, "Because I feel so ask?" And she said, "Because I feel so ask?" And she said, "Because I feel so naive and young. I want wisdom." And I naive and young. I want wisdom." And I naive and young. I want wisdom." And I said, "Well, I work for City Bible Forum said, "Well, I work for City Bible Forum said, "Well, I work for City Bible Forum and I we have a female chaplain who was and I we have a female chaplain who was and I we have a female chaplain who was trained as a lawyer and she's very wise trained as a lawyer and she's very wise trained as a lawyer and she's very wise and she speaks Chinese. would you like and she speaks Chinese. would you like and she speaks Chinese. would you like to talk to her? And she said yes. And so to talk to her? And she said yes. And so to talk to her? And she said yes. And so often people sound like they're looking often people sound like they're looking often people sound like they're looking for advice when really they're wanting for advice when really they're wanting for advice when really they're wanting permission to talk and open up. So

permission to talk and open up. So permission to talk and open up. So that's another shift. Now learning the that's another shift. Now learning the that's another shift. Now learning the art of conversation, evangelizing not so art of conversation, evangelizing not so art of conversation, evangelizing not so much like preachers, but like much like preachers, but like much like preachers, but like counselors. four, what we're trying to do now is four, what we're trying to do now is position ourselves in our friends life, position ourselves in our friends life, position ourselves in our friends life, in our family's life as I have a friend called Craig. He was a I have a friend called Craig. He was a military chaplain. Saw a few tours in military chaplain. Saw a few tours in military chaplain. Saw a few tours in the Middle East. A lot of tragic stuff the Middle East. A lot of tragic stuff the Middle East. A lot of tragic stuff would happen. So the military would come would happen. So the military would come would happen. So the military would come to him for prayer, for counseling, for to him for prayer, for counseling, for to him for prayer, for counseling, for advice. But the commanding officer, he advice. But the commanding officer, he advice. But the commanding officer, he was he was a strict atheist. He didn't was he was a strict atheist. He didn't was he was a strict atheist. He didn't have any time for this religious mumbo have any time for this religious mumbo have any time for this religious mumbo jumbo. But after a while, enough tragic jumbo. But after a while, enough tragic jumbo. But after a while, enough tragic stuff happened that the commanding stuff happened that the commanding stuff happened that the commanding officer one day said to Craig, "Hey, officer one day said to Craig, "Hey, officer one day said to Craig, "Hey, please come into my office. Close the please come into my office. Close the please come into my office. Close the door behind you. Can you pray for me?"

door behind you. Can you pray for me?" door behind you. Can you pray for me?" And my chaplain friends say, "This is And my chaplain friends say, "This is And my chaplain friends say, "This is how it works." As a chaplain, people how it works." As a chaplain, people how it works." As a chaplain, people have the doors closed, doors closed, but have the doors closed, doors closed, but have the doors closed, doors closed, but in a time of crisis, they come to you, in a time of crisis, they come to you, in a time of crisis, they come to you, they open up, they want you to speak on they open up, they want you to speak on they open up, they want you to speak on behalf of God. They want you to connect behalf of God. They want you to connect behalf of God. They want you to connect them with a sacred. They want you to them with a sacred. They want you to them with a sacred. They want you to bring meaning into a tragic situation. I bring meaning into a tragic situation. I bring meaning into a tragic situation. I remember once on our street, tragedy remember once on our street, tragedy remember once on our street, tragedy happened. Gorgeous young boy died happened. Gorgeous young boy died happened. Gorgeous young boy died suddenly, unexpectedly. The whole street suddenly, unexpectedly. The whole street suddenly, unexpectedly. The whole street loved him. The whole street grieved. But loved him. The whole street grieved. But loved him. The whole street grieved. But there was a wise Christian man on our there was a wise Christian man on our there was a wise Christian man on our street. So they got him to run the street. So they got him to run the street. So they got him to run the funeral. They got him to do the prayers. funeral. They got him to do the prayers. funeral. They got him to do the prayers. Also, people knew that my wife and I Also, people knew that my wife and I Also, people knew that my wife and I were Christians. They came to into our were Christians. They came to into our were Christians. They came to into our house to speak meaning into this house to speak meaning into this house to speak meaning into this tragedy. I know of a friend called tragedy. I know of a friend called tragedy. I know of a friend called Pierre. One time he and his wife have Pierre. One time he and his wife have Pierre. One time he and his wife have been investing, blessing, loving been investing, blessing, loving been investing, blessing, loving non-believers in their workplace. And non-believers in their workplace. And non-believers in their workplace. And they've done everything that you know they've done everything that you know they've done everything that you know we've been saying in in the in in in we've been saying in in the in in in we've been saying in in the in in in other evangelism courses in that book, other evangelism courses in that book, other evangelism courses in that book, How to Talk About Jesus without being How to Talk About Jesus without being How to Talk About Jesus without being that guy. merge your universes, go to that guy. merge your universes, go to that guy. merge your universes, go to their their their things, listen. And then one things, listen. And then one things, listen. And then one day a grand um the day a grand um the day a grand um the workers mother grandmother died and then workers mother grandmother died and then workers mother grandmother died and then they get a phone call out of the blue they get a phone call out of the blue they get a phone call out of the blue saying, "Hey, the little grandson wants saying, "Hey, the little grandson wants saying, "Hey, the little grandson wants to know where his grandmother is right

to know where his grandmother is right to know where his grandmother is right now. Can you talk to him?" And then Pier now. Can you talk to him?" And then Pier now. Can you talk to him?" And then Pier and his wife then had an open tele and his wife then had an open tele and his wife then had an open tele telephone call to like 20 relatives in telephone call to like 20 relatives in telephone call to like 20 relatives in one go. See at that moment they had one go. See at that moment they had one go. See at that moment they had earned the right to be the unofficial de earned the right to be the unofficial de earned the right to be the unofficial de facto chaplain in that family's life. So facto chaplain in that family's life. So facto chaplain in that family's life. So how can we become the unofficial deacto how can we become the unofficial deacto how can we become the unofficial deacto chaplain? Well my chaplain friends say chaplain? Well my chaplain friends say chaplain? Well my chaplain friends say it begins with genuine curiosity. So yes, we ask them what they did on the So yes, we ask them what they did on the weekend, but we're genuinely curious weekend, but we're genuinely curious weekend, but we're genuinely curious about what they did on the weekend. We about what they did on the weekend. We about what they did on the weekend. We do want to know. We ask that second do want to know. We ask that second do want to know. We ask that second question. How did that go? Tell me more. question. How did that go? Tell me more. question. How did that go? Tell me more. I love to ask people like at work so I love to ask people like at work so I love to ask people like at work so many of the nurses have tattoos. So I many of the nurses have tattoos. So I many of the nurses have tattoos. So I ask them to tell me about their tattoos. ask them to tell me about their tattoos. ask them to tell me about their tattoos. They must have a meaning. Which was They must have a meaning. Which was They must have a meaning. Which was their first tattoo? What's the next their first tattoo? What's the next their first tattoo? What's the next tattoo they have planned? If they have tattoo they have planned? If they have tattoo they have planned? If they have children, I ask them for the names of children, I ask them for the names of children, I ask them for the names of their children. What's the meaning their children. What's the meaning their children. What's the meaning behind their names? I show genuine behind their names? I show genuine behind their names? I show genuine curiosity. Wow. Tell me curiosity. Wow. Tell me curiosity. Wow. Tell me more. Chaplain also understand. I've heard the saying, it's understand. I've heard the saying, it's not original to me. Home is where you're not original to me. Home is where you're not original to me. Home is where you're unerstood.

unerstood. unerstood. So if we can be that second home away So if we can be that second home away So if we can be that second home away from home where they're from home where they're from home where they're undertood and we know how when we listen undertood and we know how when we listen undertood and we know how when we listen to counselors, if we've ever been to a to counselors, if we've ever been to a to counselors, if we've ever been to a counselor, there's that moment where we counselor, there's that moment where we counselor, there's that moment where we feel like you understand. And that's feel like you understand. And that's feel like you understand. And that's usually when we break down and cry. It's usually when we break down and cry. It's usually when we break down and cry. It's so good to finally find a home where so good to finally find a home where so good to finally find a home where someone understands you. And this means someone understands you. And this means someone understands you. And this means we listen to understand. And so there we listen to understand. And so there we listen to understand. And so there are three sorts of are three sorts of are three sorts of listening where we hear, where we listening where we hear, where we listening where we hear, where we understand, and we understand, and we understand, and we feel. So guys, it's everything you were feel. So guys, it's everything you were feel. So guys, it's everything you were taught in your pre-marriage counseling. taught in your pre-marriage counseling. taught in your pre-marriage counseling. Remember, do you remember conflict Remember, do you remember conflict Remember, do you remember conflict resolution 101? Your wife says to you, resolution 101? Your wife says to you, resolution 101? Your wife says to you, "You're not doing your share of the "You're not doing your share of the "You're not doing your share of the housework." Easy. All you have to do is housework." Easy. All you have to do is housework." Easy. All you have to do is repeat her words back at her. Oh, from repeat her words back at her. Oh, from repeat her words back at her. Oh, from what I hear, I'm not doing my share of what I hear, I'm not doing my share of what I hear, I'm not doing my share of the the the housework. Winner. And then you housework. Winner. And then you housework. Winner. And then you summarize and identify the issue behind summarize and identify the issue behind summarize and identify the issue behind the issue. So, do you show you're not the issue. So, do you show you're not the issue. So, do you show you're not just paring her words back at her? So, just paring her words back at her? So, just paring her words back at her? So, you say, "Oh, I understand I'm not doing you say, "Oh, I understand I'm not doing you say, "Oh, I understand I'm not doing my share of the housework." Oh, really my share of the housework." Oh, really my share of the housework." Oh, really good. And she'll say, "Yes." Now you good. And she'll say, "Yes." Now you good. And she'll say, "Yes." Now you have to say that must make you feel have to say that must make you feel have to say that must make you feel blank and you have to guess the

emotion. But it's always going to be emotion. But it's always going to be anger, right? anger, right? anger, right? So that must make you feel so angry and So that must make you feel so angry and So that must make you feel so angry and tick just like that. Conflict resolved. tick just like that. Conflict resolved. tick just like that. Conflict resolved. So, so my wife heard me give this advice So, so my wife heard me give this advice So, so my wife heard me give this advice to my guy friendss and she said, "Oh, if to my guy friendss and she said, "Oh, if to my guy friendss and she said, "Oh, if I ever catch you doing that to me." And I ever catch you doing that to me." And I ever catch you doing that to me." And I said, "Oh, from what I hear you saying." So, without friends and family, saying." So, without friends and family, listen to listen to listen to understand. So, I remember one time understand. So, I remember one time understand. So, I remember one time asking a nurse at work, "How are your asking a nurse at work, "How are your asking a nurse at work, "How are your children doing at school?" And you know, children doing at school?" And you know, children doing at school?" And you know, the answer's always good, good, good, the answer's always good, good, good, the answer's always good, good, good, good, good, good. But after a while, if good, good, good. But after a while, if good, good, good. But after a while, if you show you're genuinely curious, she you show you're genuinely curious, she you show you're genuinely curious, she finally opened up and said, "Ah, they're finally opened up and said, "Ah, they're finally opened up and said, "Ah, they're not doing well. They're getting bullied. not doing well. They're getting bullied. not doing well. They're getting bullied. They've got learning difficulties." And They've got learning difficulties." And They've got learning difficulties." And I said, I said, I said, "Ah, you're worried they're going to "Ah, you're worried they're going to "Ah, you're worried they're going to fall fall fall behind." And she said, "Yes, you've behind." And she said, "Yes, you've behind." And she said, "Yes, you've identified the issue and the emotion."

identified the issue and the emotion." identified the issue and the emotion." She feels understood at that moment. She feels understood at that moment. She feels understood at that moment. Also, we don't know it, but we actually Also, we don't know it, but we actually Also, we don't know it, but we actually have wisdom because we're filled with have wisdom because we're filled with have wisdom because we're filled with the spirit of God. You know, there's a the spirit of God. You know, there's a the spirit of God. You know, there's a general wisdom that we all get to enjoy, general wisdom that we all get to enjoy, general wisdom that we all get to enjoy, but somehow the fear of the Lord is the but somehow the fear of the Lord is the but somehow the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. So, we can't, you beginning of wisdom. So, we can't, you beginning of wisdom. So, we can't, you know, like dog owners can't smell the know, like dog owners can't smell the know, like dog owners can't smell the smell of dog in their house. They're so smell of dog in their house. They're so smell of dog in their house. They're so used to it. We actually can't smell the used to it. We actually can't smell the used to it. We actually can't smell the wisdom we enjoy by knowing Jesus. We wisdom we enjoy by knowing Jesus. We wisdom we enjoy by knowing Jesus. We have a wisdom that radiates and sooner have a wisdom that radiates and sooner have a wisdom that radiates and sooner or later people will come to us for or later people will come to us for or later people will come to us for advice. Also, chaplain have this advice. Also, chaplain have this advice. Also, chaplain have this calm, non- presence. And I've obviously I'm I'm not presence. And I've obviously I'm I'm not talking about medical anxiety. talking about medical anxiety. talking about medical anxiety. Christians can go through anxiety as Christians can go through anxiety as Christians can go through anxiety as well. But that's his non anxious well. But that's his non anxious well. But that's his non anxious presence we enjoy by knowing that presence we enjoy by knowing that presence we enjoy by knowing that there's a God of the universe who has there's a God of the universe who has there's a God of the universe who has everything in control. So I don't have everything in control. So I don't have everything in control. So I don't have to be in control of everything. So we to be in control of everything. So we to be in control of everything. So we have this calm non- anxious presence.

have this calm non- anxious presence. have this calm non- anxious presence. And I know I I was at work once and I And I know I I was at work once and I And I know I I was at work once and I said to a nurse, I said, "Hey, in this said to a nurse, I said, "Hey, in this said to a nurse, I said, "Hey, in this operating room with a surgeon, the operating room with a surgeon, the operating room with a surgeon, the anesiologist, the the scrub nurse, the anesiologist, the the scrub nurse, the anesiologist, the the scrub nurse, the scout nurse, the anesthesiology nurse, scout nurse, the anesthesiology nurse, scout nurse, the anesthesiology nurse, I'm the least important person in this I'm the least important person in this I'm the least important person in this room. If anyone else did not turn up, we room. If anyone else did not turn up, we room. If anyone else did not turn up, we would have to cancel the operation. If I would have to cancel the operation. If I would have to cancel the operation. If I didn't turn up, you could still do the didn't turn up, you could still do the didn't turn up, you could still do the operation. It would go even better operation. It would go even better operation. It would go even better without me turning up. So that's why I without me turning up. So that's why I without me turning up. So that's why I turn up so you don't find out how better turn up so you don't find out how better turn up so you don't find out how better it goes without me. And she said, "No, it goes without me. And she said, "No, it goes without me. And she said, "No, you're the one who brings peace." And I you're the one who brings peace." And I you're the one who brings peace." And I did not know that. She said, "You're the did not know that. She said, "You're the did not know that. She said, "You're the peacemaker in the room." So once we show peacemaker in the room." So once we show peacemaker in the room." So once we show genuine curiosity, we listen to genuine curiosity, we listen to genuine curiosity, we listen to understand and feel the emotion. We have understand and feel the emotion. We have understand and feel the emotion. We have wisdom which we can't smell but others wisdom which we can't smell but others wisdom which we can't smell but others can. where the calm non- anxious can. where the calm non- anxious can. where the calm non- anxious presence we can now offer to presence we can now offer to presence we can now offer to pray. So when my work colleague says, pray. So when my work colleague says, pray. So when my work colleague says, "Oh, my children are falling behind." I "Oh, my children are falling behind." I "Oh, my children are falling behind." I can say, "Hey, my wife, my kids, we pray can say, "Hey, my wife, my kids, we pray can say, "Hey, my wife, my kids, we pray every night for our friends. Can we pray every night for our friends. Can we pray every night for our friends. Can we pray for you tonight?" And if you've earned for you tonight?" And if you've earned for you tonight?" And if you've earned the capital, 100% of the time, the the capital, 100% of the time, the the capital, 100% of the time, the answer is yes. And I like to text our answer is yes. And I like to text our answer is yes. And I like to text our prayer that night. Say, "Hey, just prayer that night. Say, "Hey, just prayer that night. Say, "Hey, just prayed for you." Or record it on your prayed for you." Or record it on your prayed for you." Or record it on your phone and then send it to them. And then phone and then send it to them. And then phone and then send it to them. And then I check in a week or two later. I say I check in a week or two later. I say I check in a week or two later. I say how are things going? Whatever we pray how are things going? Whatever we pray how are things going? Whatever we pray for and then they will say yeah, you

for and then they will say yeah, you for and then they will say yeah, you know what? I think things are better and know what? I think things are better and know what? I think things are better and that's when I say it's a that's when I say it's a that's when I say it's a miracle. And now I've introduced a miracle. And now I've introduced a miracle. And now I've introduced a language of providence and supernatural. language of providence and supernatural. language of providence and supernatural. So we're gradually blurring the lines So we're gradually blurring the lines So we're gradually blurring the lines between the secular and the sacred. And between the secular and the sacred. And between the secular and the sacred. And now we're given permission to talk about now we're given permission to talk about now we're given permission to talk about our world view. So I've got so many more things I view. So I've got so many more things I I want to talk about, but I'm out of I want to talk about, but I'm out of I want to talk about, but I'm out of time. So what I'll do is I'll trust time. So what I'll do is I'll trust time. So what I'll do is I'll trust question and answer time to bring those question and answer time to bring those question and answer time to bring those things out. But there are three things things out. But there are three things things out. But there are three things we can do. Uh but before we go to we can do. Uh but before we go to we can do. Uh but before we go to question answer time, number one is I question answer time, number one is I question answer time, number one is I work for City Bible Forum and we have work for City Bible Forum and we have work for City Bible Forum and we have this thing called EVQ School of this thing called EVQ School of this thing called EVQ School of Evangelism. So the website is there and Evangelism. So the website is there and Evangelism. So the website is there and at the top of the website you can click at the top of the website you can click at the top of the website you can click on a link that measures your EVQ because on a link that measures your EVQ because on a link that measures your EVQ because we've heard of IQ EQ but EVQ and it we've heard of IQ EQ but EVQ and it we've heard of IQ EQ but EVQ and it would identify I think there are five or would identify I think there are five or would identify I think there are five or six dimensions that we will be strong at six dimensions that we will be strong at six dimensions that we will be strong at in in in evangelism and then somewhere we're not evangelism and then somewhere we're not evangelism and then somewhere we're not so strong. So what are the roadblocks?

so strong. So what are the roadblocks? so strong. So what are the roadblocks? We look at community like how many We look at community like how many We look at community like how many non-Christian friends do we have? We non-Christian friends do we have? We non-Christian friends do we have? We look at character like who are we like look at character like who are we like look at character like who are we like inside? What's my walk with Jesus like inside? What's my walk with Jesus like inside? What's my walk with Jesus like before we look at things like skills, before we look at things like skills, before we look at things like skills, experience, confidence, competence, experience, confidence, competence, experience, confidence, competence, stuff like that. But go to that. You stuff like that. But go to that. You stuff like that. But go to that. You will it will help unlock your evangelism. Number evangelism. Number two, those books I talked about, how to two, those books I talked about, how to two, those books I talked about, how to talk about Jesus without being that guy. talk about Jesus without being that guy. talk about Jesus without being that guy. Today I only had chance to share a Today I only had chance to share a Today I only had chance to share a handful of tips from there. There like handful of tips from there. There like handful of tips from there. There like nine tips in that yellow book. how to nine tips in that yellow book. how to nine tips in that yellow book. how to talk about Jesus without being that guy. talk about Jesus without being that guy. talk about Jesus without being that guy. But number But number But number three, I've got a Christmas book coming three, I've got a Christmas book coming three, I've got a Christmas book coming out with the Good Book Company and it's out with the Good Book Company and it's out with the Good Book Company and it's designed to give to non-believers at designed to give to non-believers at designed to give to non-believers at Christmas time. And it's going to be Christmas time. And it's going to be Christmas time. And it's going to be called The Missing Peace. How Christmas called The Missing Peace. How Christmas called The Missing Peace. How Christmas Brings the Calm We Crave. The Missing Brings the Calm We Crave. The Missing Brings the Calm We Crave. The Missing Peace. How Christmas Peace. How Christmas Peace. How Christmas brings the calm we crave. Cuz Christmas brings the calm we crave. Cuz Christmas brings the calm we crave. Cuz Christmas is chaos. Let's face it. So, we want is chaos. Let's face it. So, we want is chaos. Let's face it. So, we want calm. So, this is and Good Book Company calm. So, this is and Good Book Company calm. So, this is and Good Book Company has deliberately made it super cheap.

has deliberately made it super cheap. has deliberately made it super cheap. So, we can give it out as tracks and we So, we can give it out as tracks and we So, we can give it out as tracks and we can give it as Christmas presents to can give it as Christmas presents to can give it as Christmas presents to friends and family, but also we're friends and family, but also we're friends and family, but also we're pastors. This is what we have at the pastors. This is what we have at the pastors. This is what we have at the back of the church to hand out to all back of the church to hand out to all back of the church to hand out to all the newcomers who just came for the newcomers who just came for the newcomers who just came for Christmas Day. Anyway, I have a Christmas Day. Anyway, I have a Christmas Day. Anyway, I have a Christmas book coming out uh coming out Christmas book coming out uh coming out Christmas book coming out uh coming out in September, but you can pre-order it in September, but you can pre-order it in September, but you can pre-order it as well. All right, we have I think 10 as well. All right, we have I think 10 as well. All right, we have I think 10 minutes for question time. 10 minutes. minutes for question time. 10 minutes. minutes for question time. 10 minutes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's no microphone, so I don't know There's no microphone, so I don't know There's no microphone, so I don't know how this is going to work. Just wave, how this is going to work. Just wave, how this is going to work. Just wave, put a hand up, yell the question out. put a hand up, yell the question out. put a hand up, yell the question out. Okay, I have a question. You mentioned Okay, I have a question. You mentioned Okay, I have a question. You mentioned having an event day at church. I'm having an event day at church. I'm having an event day at church. I'm assuming that means people bring friends assuming that means people bring friends assuming that means people bring friends and you all do something together. My and you all do something together. My and you all do something together. My question is, how do you get your church question is, how do you get your church question is, how do you get your church to follow this to begin with to get them to follow this to begin with to get them to follow this to begin with to get them to bring their friends to the event? to bring their friends to the event? to bring their friends to the event? Yeah. Oh, wow. So how did yeah it's Yeah. Oh, wow. So how did yeah it's Yeah. Oh, wow. So how did yeah it's suddenly you realize it's it's a suddenly you realize it's it's a suddenly you realize it's it's a lifestyle change and the church itself lifestyle change and the church itself lifestyle change and the church itself has to think in terms of a lifestyle has to think in terms of a lifestyle has to think in terms of a lifestyle change. So what we usually do in August change. So what we usually do in August change. So what we usually do in August we run we run we run seminars on evangelism just like one seminars on evangelism just like one seminars on evangelism just like one here. So imagine this was a seminar that here. So imagine this was a seminar that here. So imagine this was a seminar that we ran at church in August and we're we ran at church in August and we're we ran at church in August and we're telling everyone there to do everything telling everyone there to do everything telling everyone there to do everything that my yellow book says. Start merging that my yellow book says. Start merging that my yellow book says. Start merging your universes. Go to their things so your universes. Go to their things so your universes. Go to their things so they will come to your things. Do they will come to your things. Do they will come to your things. Do hospitality. So hospitality. So hospitality. So coffee, dinner, gospel. Listen to

coffee, dinner, gospel. Listen to coffee, dinner, gospel. Listen to understand. And now and and be the un understand. And now and and be the un understand. And now and and be the un unofficial def facto unofficial def facto unofficial def facto chaplain. And now in chaplain. And now in chaplain. And now in October, if they're families, we run a October, if they're families, we run a October, if they're families, we run a family service designed where kids can family service designed where kids can family service designed where kids can sit in the service for the whole time. sit in the service for the whole time. sit in the service for the whole time. And then we say, "Hey, if you like that, And then we say, "Hey, if you like that, And then we say, "Hey, if you like that, around December, we're going to have a around December, we're going to have a around December, we're going to have a big open air carols event." And hey, if big open air carols event." And hey, if big open air carols event." And hey, if you like that, come come for Christmas you like that, come come for Christmas you like that, come come for Christmas Day. And then everyone goes away for Day. And then everyone goes away for Day. And then everyone goes away for Christmas holidays in Australia. But we Christmas holidays in Australia. But we Christmas holidays in Australia. But we say, "Hey, if you're like that in speaker, we're going to do a thing we speaker, we're going to do a thing we call Feb talks." Just like you have TED call Feb talks." Just like you have TED call Feb talks." Just like you have TED talks, we have Feb talks now, one on talks, we have Feb talks now, one on talks, we have Feb talks now, one on each Sunday. Hey, if you like that, uh each Sunday. Hey, if you like that, uh each Sunday. Hey, if you like that, uh there are three avenues there. You can there are three avenues there. You can there are three avenues there. You can join a life course and that's the join a life course and that's the join a life course and that's the baptism course. But then now your baptism course. But then now your baptism course. But then now your non-believers are mixing with believers non-believers are mixing with believers non-believers are mixing with believers who want to get baptized who want to get baptized who want to get baptized or or or there's in Australia there's an olive there's in Australia there's an olive there's in Australia there's an olive tree media that has something called the tree media that has something called the tree media that has something called the encounters series.

encounters series. encounters series. So come come watch the videos called So come come watch the videos called So come come watch the videos called encounters encounters encounters or we run a a group for newish if you're or we run a a group for newish if you're or we run a a group for newish if you're newish to church or Christianity we have newish to church or Christianity we have newish to church or Christianity we have a newish group and then from there we a newish group and then from there we a newish group and then from there we say hey come to Easter so we have this say hey come to Easter so we have this say hey come to Easter so we have this cycle just knowing people don't cycle just knowing people don't cycle just knowing people don't magically turn up in event so for this magically turn up in event so for this magically turn up in event so for this to to to happen this has to happen and then I happen this has to happen and then I happen this has to happen and then I work for city Bible forum where I work for city Bible forum where I work for city Bible forum where I actually speak in secular spaces to actually speak in secular spaces to actually speak in secular spaces to secular people are in the workplace. I secular people are in the workplace. I secular people are in the workplace. I come in under the DEI umbrella as a come in under the DEI umbrella as a come in under the DEI umbrella as a person of faith speaking about what it's person of faith speaking about what it's person of faith speaking about what it's like to be a person of faith. I I we like to be a person of faith. I I we like to be a person of faith. I I we speak in things like this for Easter speak in things like this for Easter speak in things like this for Easter Christmas in workplaces. for that to Christmas in workplaces. for that to Christmas in workplaces. for that to happen. Like if I turn up in a happen. Like if I turn up in a happen. Like if I turn up in a workplace, I'm not going to get anyone workplace, I'm not going to get anyone workplace, I'm not going to get anyone turn up unless there's been a lot of turn up unless there's been a lot of turn up unless there's been a lot of bottomup work happening with City Bible bottomup work happening with City Bible bottomup work happening with City Bible Forum where we network Christian workers Forum where we network Christian workers Forum where we network Christian workers with each other to pray for their with each other to pray for their with each other to pray for their non-Christian friends and then to do all non-Christian friends and then to do all non-Christian friends and then to do all this with their non-Christian friends so this with their non-Christian friends so this with their non-Christian friends so that when the event happens, I would that when the event happens, I would that when the event happens, I would turn up and this is what I see uh in in turn up and this is what I see uh in in turn up and this is what I see uh in in the workplace. So that's my specialy the workplace. So that's my specialy the workplace. So that's my specialy speaking secular spaces to secular speaking secular spaces to secular speaking secular spaces to secular people. Thanks.

people. Thanks. people. Thanks. Yeah. Question. What was the website Yeah. Question. What was the website Yeah. Question. What was the website that you had up earlier? Ba something. that you had up earlier? Ba something. that you had up earlier? Ba something. It was either Barner.com, It was either Barner.com, It was either Barner.com, the the the USA stat thing, and the my one was evq.org.au and and click on that link at evq.org.au and and click on that link at the top of the page. Take the barometer the top of the page. Take the barometer the top of the page. Take the barometer test. All right. Any other questions? test. All right. Any other questions? test. All right. Any other questions? Yes. You know, you talked about like the Yes. You know, you talked about like the Yes. You know, you talked about like the importance of learning to be a good importance of learning to be a good importance of learning to be a good question asker and listener. you feel question asker and listener. you feel question asker and listener. you feel like like what are the yeah like what like like what are the yeah like what like like what are the yeah like what are the best resources to help people to are the best resources to help people to are the best resources to help people to grow in learning how to be a good grow in learning how to be a good grow in learning how to be a good listener and question yeah the question listener and question yeah the question listener and question yeah the question is I said talked a lot about questions is I said talked a lot about questions is I said talked a lot about questions and listening what are great resources I and listening what are great resources I and listening what are great resources I think those counseling books that they think those counseling books that they think those counseling books that they so when whenever people training in so when whenever people training in so when whenever people training in counseling in Bible colleges or counseling in Bible colleges or counseling in Bible colleges or seminaries find those counseling books seminaries find those counseling books seminaries find those counseling books and they actually have categories of and they actually have categories of and they actually have categories of questions so what I've just done today questions so what I've just done today questions so what I've just done today is give or you know like in medicine, we is give or you know like in medicine, we is give or you know like in medicine, we we do CPR and it's actually very we do CPR and it's actually very we do CPR and it's actually very complicated, but we teach everyone this complicated, but we teach everyone this complicated, but we teach everyone this very easy version of CPR and and I think very easy version of CPR and and I think very easy version of CPR and and I think there's a very easy version of asking there's a very easy version of asking there's a very easy version of asking questions that doesn't necessarily be as questions that doesn't necessarily be as questions that doesn't necessarily be as complicated as what the counselors have, complicated as what the counselors have, complicated as what the counselors have, but I think the counselors know how to but I think the counselors know how to but I think the counselors know how to ask really good questions and they have ask really good questions and they have ask really good questions and they have categories for them as well. Yes.

categories for them as well. Yes. categories for them as well. Yes. Question. May I piggy back on that? Yes. Question. May I piggy back on that? Yes. Question. May I piggy back on that? Yes. Sometimes as Christians, we know we have Sometimes as Christians, we know we have Sometimes as Christians, we know we have the answers and we just want to dump it the answers and we just want to dump it the answers and we just want to dump it on them so fast and it takes extra time on them so fast and it takes extra time on them so fast and it takes extra time to to just hold our tongues and actually to to just hold our tongues and actually to to just hold our tongues and actually hear from them because they don't want hear from them because they don't want hear from them because they don't want to be dumped on necessarily and uh it's to be dumped on necessarily and uh it's to be dumped on necessarily and uh it's just hard to refrain. We just need to be just hard to refrain. We just need to be just hard to refrain. We just need to be quick to listen. Correct. So the the quick to listen. Correct. So the the quick to listen. Correct. So the the question comment is we need to be quick question comment is we need to be quick question comment is we need to be quick to listen. We know we should ask to listen. We know we should ask to listen. We know we should ask questions and listen but we don't questions and listen but we don't questions and listen but we don't because we just so much in a rush to because we just so much in a rush to because we just so much in a rush to want to dump information. And I'll give want to dump information. And I'll give want to dump information. And I'll give you an example. In an operation, surgeon you an example. In an operation, surgeon you an example. In an operation, surgeon asked me uh what my view is on same-sex asked me uh what my view is on same-sex asked me uh what my view is on same-sex marriage cuz it was March. We're going marriage cuz it was March. We're going marriage cuz it was March. We're going to have the Pride Gay March going to have the Pride Gay March going to have the Pride Gay March going through Sydney. And I used to teach in a through Sydney. And I used to teach in a through Sydney. And I used to teach in a seminary. So I gave him like the 20inut seminary. So I gave him like the 20inut seminary. So I gave him like the 20inut answer on nuanced, answer on nuanced, answer on nuanced, informed, sensitive. And I only found informed, sensitive. And I only found informed, sensitive. And I only found out later that this surgeon's I think um out later that this surgeon's I think um out later that this surgeon's I think um wife's brother is gay. And so all I had wife's brother is gay. And so all I had wife's brother is gay. And so all I had to do is why do you ask the question?

to do is why do you ask the question? to do is why do you ask the question? That's what I should have said and it That's what I should have said and it That's what I should have said and it would have been a very different would have been a very different would have been a very different conversation. Yes. How do you approach those who say Yes. How do you approach those who say they're confirmed atheists? they're confirmed atheists? they're confirmed atheists? How do you approach those who say How do you approach those who say How do you approach those who say they're confirmed atheists? I think they're confirmed atheists? I think they're confirmed atheists? I think treat it as a worldview and just say, treat it as a worldview and just say, treat it as a worldview and just say, "Wow, tell me more. What's what's the "Wow, tell me more. What's what's the "Wow, tell me more. What's what's the best thing about being an atheist? best thing about being an atheist? best thing about being an atheist? um how how how did you become an um how how how did you become an um how how how did you become an atheist? And I think just re and then atheist? And I think just re and then atheist? And I think just re and then look for the because in God's common look for the because in God's common look for the because in God's common grace there's always be something true, grace there's always be something true, grace there's always be something true, good and beautiful in every worldview. good and beautiful in every worldview. good and beautiful in every worldview. So genuine curiosity where we aim to So genuine curiosity where we aim to So genuine curiosity where we aim to discover what is true, what is good, discover what is true, what is good, discover what is true, what is good, what is beautiful in that person's what is beautiful in that person's what is beautiful in that person's position. position. position. Yes. Um if you had a non-Christian Yes. Um if you had a non-Christian Yes. Um if you had a non-Christian friend ask you why do you believe in friend ask you why do you believe in friend ask you why do you believe in Jesus? What would be like your short Jesus? What would be like your short Jesus? What would be like your short answer? Yeah. say if a non-Christian answer? Yeah. say if a non-Christian answer? Yeah. say if a non-Christian said why do you believe in Jesus what said why do you believe in Jesus what said why do you believe in Jesus what would be your your short answer I think would be your your short answer I think would be your your short answer I think we could say I could tell you about the we could say I could tell you about the we could say I could tell you about the facts evidence and data I could send you facts evidence and data I could send you facts evidence and data I could send you to the Bible I can send you all these to the Bible I can send you all these to the Bible I can send you all these websites so I get that all out the way websites so I get that all out the way websites so I get that all out the way but I think for me I but I think for me I but I think for me I say something came from say something came from say something came from nothing like something came from nothing nothing like something came from nothing nothing like something came from nothing life came from life came from life came from non-life and we believe in love We non-life and we believe in love We non-life and we believe in love We believe in believe in believe in forgiveness. In other words, we live as forgiveness. In other words, we live as forgiveness. In other words, we live as if Jesus is true. Everything that we if Jesus is true. Everything that we if Jesus is true. Everything that we hold to be true, good, and beautiful can

hold to be true, good, and beautiful can hold to be true, good, and beautiful can only be true, good, and beautiful only be true, good, and beautiful only be true, good, and beautiful because Jesus is true. We live as if because Jesus is true. We live as if because Jesus is true. We live as if he's true. I think that's how I'd go. go. Yes. Yeah. We got time. So, last Yes. Yeah. We got time. So, last Yes. Yeah. We got time. So, last question. So, how do you share the question. So, how do you share the question. So, how do you share the gospel with people who have been heard gospel with people who have been heard gospel with people who have been heard by the church? Yeah. How do we share the by the church? Yeah. How do we share the by the church? Yeah. How do we share the gospel with people who have been hurt by gospel with people who have been hurt by gospel with people who have been hurt by the church before? So, we know there's the church before? So, we know there's the church before? So, we know there's that great book called The Great that great book called The Great that great book called The Great Durching by Michael Graham and Ryan Durching by Michael Graham and Ryan Durching by Michael Graham and Ryan Burge, I want to say. So, we talked Burge, I want to say. So, we talked Burge, I want to say. So, we talked about the casually dechurched. They about the casually dechurched. They about the casually dechurched. They stopped going to church cuz just life stopped going to church cuz just life stopped going to church cuz just life got busy, but there's a durch got busy, but there's a durch got busy, but there's a durch casualty and I think they can only be casualty and I think they can only be casualty and I think they can only be loved back into the church and people loved back into the church and people loved back into the church and people have to be willing to say sorry for what have to be willing to say sorry for what have to be willing to say sorry for what happened. Like a wrong is a wrong. We happened. Like a wrong is a wrong. We happened. Like a wrong is a wrong. We have to call wrongs have to call wrongs have to call wrongs wrong. All right, give yourselves a wrong. All right, give yourselves a wrong. All right, give yourselves a hand. You guys did really well to get hand. You guys did really well to get hand. You guys did really well to get through that. Thank you for coming. through that. Thank you for coming. through that. Thank you for coming. Thanks so much. Thank you.