The Power of the Pulpit (with H. B. Charles) [The Everyday Pastor - Ep. 52]

If you're ready to go deeper in If you're ready to go deeper in theology, Southern Seminary's PhD theology, Southern Seminary's PhD theology, Southern Seminary's PhD programs were built for you with programs were built for you with programs were built for you with flexible formats from fully online to flexible formats from fully online to flexible formats from fully online to modular to in-person. Southern makes modular to in-person. Southern makes modular to in-person. Southern makes serious doctoral-level theological serious doctoral-level theological serious doctoral-level theological training accessible to the pastor called training accessible to the pastor called training accessible to the pastor called to bring the depth of God's word to to bring the depth of God's word to to bring the depth of God's word to God's people. Study with faculty God's people. Study with faculty God's people. Study with faculty committed to strengthening the church committed to strengthening the church committed to strengthening the church and bring that depth back to the people and bring that depth back to the people and bring that depth back to the people you lead. Visit sbts.edu/phd There are those who There are those who >> [music] >> [music] >> [music] >> think that expository preaching >> think that expository preaching >> think that expository preaching is just um heavy in interpretation and is just um heavy in interpretation and is just um heavy in interpretation and devoid of real-life application. devoid of real-life application. devoid of real-life application. >> [music] >> [music] >> [music] >> I think that is a caricature of >> I think that is a caricature of >> I think that is a caricature of expository preaching and it is a mark of expository preaching and it is a mark of expository preaching and it is a mark of expository preaching done wrong. [music] expository preaching done wrong. [music] expository preaching done wrong. [music] In its essence, expository preaching is In its essence, expository preaching is In its essence, expository preaching is both explanation and exhortation. both explanation and exhortation. both explanation and exhortation. >> [music] >> Welcome, friends, to another episode of >> Welcome, friends, to another episode of The Everyday Pastor, a podcast from The The Everyday Pastor, a podcast from The The Everyday Pastor, a podcast from The Gospel Coalition on the nuts and bolts Gospel Coalition on the nuts and bolts Gospel Coalition on the nuts and bolts of ministry. My name is Matt Smethurst.

of ministry. My name is Matt Smethurst. of ministry. My name is Matt Smethurst. And I'm Ligon Duncan. And we're joined And I'm Ligon Duncan. And we're joined And I'm Ligon Duncan. And we're joined today by our good friend H.B. Charles. today by our good friend H.B. Charles. today by our good friend H.B. Charles. H.B. is the pastor of Shiloh Church in H.B. is the pastor of Shiloh Church in H.B. is the pastor of Shiloh Church in Jacksonville, Florida. He's a council Jacksonville, Florida. He's a council Jacksonville, Florida. He's a council member with The Gospel Coalition. He's member with The Gospel Coalition. He's member with The Gospel Coalition. He's the author of several helpful books the author of several helpful books the author of several helpful books including on preaching, on pastoring, including on preaching, on pastoring, including on preaching, on pastoring, and on worship. And today we wanted to and on worship. And today we wanted to and on worship. And today we wanted to talk with H.B. in particular about that talk with H.B. in particular about that talk with H.B. in particular about that first topic, on preaching. Uh some of first topic, on preaching. Uh some of first topic, on preaching. Uh some of you listeners may be aware of his you listeners may be aware of his you listeners may be aware of his preaching ministry. Maybe you've heard preaching ministry. Maybe you've heard preaching ministry. Maybe you've heard him preach in person. It's a real treat him preach in person. It's a real treat him preach in person. It's a real treat for those of us who have. Uh he preached for those of us who have. Uh he preached for those of us who have. Uh he preached at our church at River City Baptist here at our church at River City Baptist here at our church at River City Baptist here in Richmond in Richmond in Richmond uh not too long ago and our congregation uh not too long ago and our congregation uh not too long ago and our congregation was deeply blessed. HB, thanks for was deeply blessed. HB, thanks for was deeply blessed. HB, thanks for joining us for this conversation. Hey joining us for this conversation. Hey joining us for this conversation. Hey Matt. Hey Lee. It's a joy to be with you Matt. Hey Lee. It's a joy to be with you Matt. Hey Lee. It's a joy to be with you both. Thanks for having me. Now HB, both. Thanks for having me. Now HB, both. Thanks for having me. Now HB, you've been doing this preaching thing you've been doing this preaching thing you've been doing this preaching thing for a long time. for a long time. for a long time. Um you became a a pastor at 17. Is that Um you became a a pastor at 17. Is that Um you became a a pastor at 17. Is that right? Yeah, I trusted Christ as a boy right? Yeah, I trusted Christ as a boy right? Yeah, I trusted Christ as a boy and started preaching as a boy and started preaching as a boy and started preaching as a boy and was preaching pretty regularly by my and was preaching pretty regularly by my and was preaching pretty regularly by my early teens early teens early teens and and and succeeded my father who passed away in succeeded my father who passed away in succeeded my father who passed away in 1989 and the next year in 1990, I was 1989 and the next year in 1990, I was 1989 and the next year in 1990, I was called to serve the church while still a called to serve the church while still a called to serve the church while still a teenager, still a teenager, still a teenager, still a senior at Los Angeles High School. HB, senior at Los Angeles High School. HB, senior at Los Angeles High School. HB, what did that season what did that season what did that season as a as a young preacher do to you as a as a young preacher do to you as a as a young preacher do to you spiritually and emotionally that people spiritually and emotionally that people spiritually and emotionally that people still may not fully understand? How did

still may not fully understand? How did still may not fully understand? How did that form the the man you are today? that form the the man you are today? that form the the man you are today? Well, Well, Well, you ask how you know, I'm often asked, you ask how you know, I'm often asked, you ask how you know, I'm often asked, how does a 17-year-old pastor a church? how does a 17-year-old pastor a church? how does a 17-year-old pastor a church? And there are a lot of answers to that And there are a lot of answers to that And there are a lot of answers to that question, but maybe the most blunt question, but maybe the most blunt question, but maybe the most blunt answer is he does it. answer is he does it. answer is he does it. Um Um Um the the the men were determined to lead the church men were determined to lead the church men were determined to lead the church and just let me preach. and just let me preach. and just let me preach. So, that was my So, that was my So, that was my singular responsibility. singular responsibility. singular responsibility. I led the I led the I led the pulpit ministry and I led the prayer pulpit ministry and I led the prayer pulpit ministry and I led the prayer meetings and really those early meetings and really those early meetings and really those early formative years were teaching me formative years were teaching me formative years were teaching me Acts 6:4 Acts 6:4 Acts 6:4 that that that the pastoral ministry the pastoral ministry the pastoral ministry is to devote itself to prayer and the is to devote itself to prayer and the is to devote itself to prayer and the ministry of the word. That was critical ministry of the word. That was critical ministry of the word. That was critical to my spiritual formation and the to my spiritual formation and the to my spiritual formation and the development of my philosophy of development of my philosophy of development of my philosophy of ministry. HB, you grew up under your ministry. HB, you grew up under your ministry. HB, you grew up under your father's preaching and he was a faithful father's preaching and he was a faithful father's preaching and he was a faithful man but not an expository preacher in man but not an expository preacher in man but not an expository preacher in the way that you are. So, talk talk to the way that you are. So, talk talk to the way that you are. So, talk talk to me how you know, how how did you form me how you know, how how did you form me how you know, how how did you form your convictions your convictions your convictions about the way you ought to preach while about the way you ought to preach while about the way you ought to preach while admiring your father whom you loved?

admiring your father whom you loved? admiring your father whom you loved? Yeah, my dad is my first and foremost Yeah, my dad is my first and foremost Yeah, my dad is my first and foremost preaching hero. preaching hero. preaching hero. He was a textual preacher. So, from week He was a textual preacher. So, from week He was a textual preacher. So, from week to week to week to week he preached he preached he preached typically one verse. typically one verse. typically one verse. Every week that verse had nothing to do Every week that verse had nothing to do Every week that verse had nothing to do with last week's verse. with last week's verse. with last week's verse. Um Um Um and kind of his homiletical hero and kind of his homiletical hero and kind of his homiletical hero uh historical hero is mine uh Charles uh historical hero is mine uh Charles uh historical hero is mine uh Charles Spurgeon. Spurgeon. Spurgeon. And he is he was an evangelist at heart. And he is he was an evangelist at heart. And he is he was an evangelist at heart. He looked for the gospel implications of He looked for the gospel implications of He looked for the gospel implications of the text. He was also the text. He was also the text. He was also pretty eloquent in the pulpit. Uh he was pretty eloquent in the pulpit. Uh he was pretty eloquent in the pulpit. Uh he was an orator is the word I would use to an orator is the word I would use to an orator is the word I would use to describe him. And I just immediately describe him. And I just immediately describe him. And I just immediately felt like as a boy I would not be able felt like as a boy I would not be able felt like as a boy I would not be able to to to I wouldn't be able to do that. I wouldn't be able to do that. I wouldn't be able to do that. So, very early on in my ministry in my So, very early on in my ministry in my So, very early on in my ministry in my teens I'm reading books on preaching. teens I'm reading books on preaching. teens I'm reading books on preaching. I'm reading Al Fasol stuff who who was a I'm reading Al Fasol stuff who who was a I'm reading Al Fasol stuff who who was a prophet of Southwestern. I'm reading prophet of Southwestern. I'm reading prophet of Southwestern. I'm reading Jerry Vines' works on preaching. I'm Jerry Vines' works on preaching. I'm Jerry Vines' works on preaching. I'm reading even reading even reading even uh Walter Kaiser's toward an exegetical uh Walter Kaiser's toward an exegetical uh Walter Kaiser's toward an exegetical theology.

theology. theology. So, So, So, um um um I'm slowly I'm slowly I'm slowly being convinced of expositional being convinced of expositional being convinced of expositional preaching. And then I heard it done by preaching. And then I heard it done by preaching. And then I heard it done by the late Dr. E.K. Bailey the late Dr. E.K. Bailey the late Dr. E.K. Bailey uh uh uh who is the founding pastor of Concord who is the founding pastor of Concord who is the founding pastor of Concord Church and that sealed the deal for me Church and that sealed the deal for me Church and that sealed the deal for me that expository preaching was the right that expository preaching was the right that expository preaching was the right way to most faithful way to handle way to most faithful way to handle way to most faithful way to handle scripture and preaching. scripture and preaching. scripture and preaching. How did you equip yourself for that? How did you equip yourself for that? How did you equip yourself for that? H.B. You obviously good preaching is H.B. You obviously good preaching is H.B. You obviously good preaching is caught and I'm I'm all about that. I had caught and I'm I'm all about that. I had caught and I'm I'm all about that. I had the same privilege as you to sit under the same privilege as you to sit under the same privilege as you to sit under great preaching and to listen to great great preaching and to listen to great great preaching and to listen to great preaching. But there's certain things preaching. But there's certain things preaching. But there's certain things that a person has to do for himself as that a person has to do for himself as that a person has to do for himself as well. So, what are the things that you well. So, what are the things that you well. So, what are the things that you did for yourself in order to exercise an did for yourself in order to exercise an did for yourself in order to exercise an expository ministry. expository ministry. expository ministry. So, um my dad would always say So, um my dad would always say So, um my dad would always say that he didn't want me to be a that he didn't want me to be a that he didn't want me to be a uh uh uh jackleg preacher. jackleg preacher. jackleg preacher. I had no idea what that meant. I just I had no idea what that meant. I just I had no idea what that meant. I just knew it wasn't a good thing.

knew it wasn't a good thing. knew it wasn't a good thing. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> And to be honest with you, this year >> And to be honest with you, this year >> And to be honest with you, this year this year is like the first time I ever this year is like the first time I ever this year is like the first time I ever looked up that word, jackleg, and it's looked up that word, jackleg, and it's looked up that word, jackleg, and it's like a amateur or phony. like a amateur or phony. like a amateur or phony. >> [laughter] >> Um >> Um so I I wanted I did not want to be that. so I I wanted I did not want to be that. so I I wanted I did not want to be that. And I knew as a And I knew as a And I knew as a as a young guy, people would not I as a young guy, people would not I as a young guy, people would not I didn't I wouldn't have credibility. I didn't I wouldn't have credibility. I didn't I wouldn't have credibility. I would have to be taken seriously. would have to be taken seriously. would have to be taken seriously. And I I know that I didn't have age or And I I know that I didn't have age or And I I know that I didn't have age or experience, so that had to be a result experience, so that had to be a result experience, so that had to be a result of my work. of my work. of my work. So, I I I worked hard. So, I I I worked hard. So, I I I worked hard. Um I read. Um I read. Um I read. I read everything I could get my hands I read everything I could get my hands I read everything I could get my hands on. I was listening to on. I was listening to on. I was listening to um um um as much preaching as I could. as much preaching as I could. as much preaching as I could. Just uh we had a weekly newspaper Just uh we had a weekly newspaper Just uh we had a weekly newspaper that uh would have church events in Los that uh would have church events in Los that uh would have church events in Los Angeles, and I'm Angeles, and I'm Angeles, and I'm Sunday marking what events, who's coming Sunday marking what events, who's coming Sunday marking what events, who's coming to town for me to hear. I still have to town for me to hear. I still have to town for me to hear. I still have um in one of my rooms um in one of my rooms um in one of my rooms uh uh uh shelves of tapes from those early years shelves of tapes from those early years shelves of tapes from those early years where I'm buying as many tapes, and I'm where I'm buying as many tapes, and I'm where I'm buying as many tapes, and I'm just listening to preaching.

just listening to preaching. just listening to preaching. And um And um And um I didn't have much of a social life. You I didn't have much of a social life. You I didn't have much of a social life. You know, um know, um know, um there there's old story about the there there's old story about the there there's old story about the the um pianist that's playing the the um pianist that's playing the the um pianist that's playing the concert, and he walks off stage, and a concert, and he walks off stage, and a concert, and he walks off stage, and a young protege says young protege says young protege says um to him, "I'd give my life to be able um to him, "I'd give my life to be able um to him, "I'd give my life to be able to play like that." And the maestro to play like that." And the maestro to play like that." And the maestro says, "Young man, I did, you know." says, "Young man, I did, you know." says, "Young man, I did, you know." Um I did not have a plan B. I gave my Um I did not have a plan B. I gave my Um I did not have a plan B. I gave my life life life to to to preaching. Um and I got as many reps as preaching. Um and I got as many reps as preaching. Um and I got as many reps as I could. The other thing I'll mention I could. The other thing I'll mention I could. The other thing I'll mention finally that related to that is finally that related to that is finally that related to that is I started pastoring at 17. I started pastoring at 17. I started pastoring at 17. So that the church kind of I was thrown So that the church kind of I was thrown So that the church kind of I was thrown in and did not have time to go to in and did not have time to go to in and did not have time to go to seminary. seminary. seminary. I was pastoring a pretty I was pastoring a pretty I was pastoring a pretty well-established church that was pulling well-established church that was pulling well-established church that was pulling me in a lot of different directions, me in a lot of different directions, me in a lot of different directions, but that church gave me an unlimited but that church gave me an unlimited but that church gave me an unlimited book allowance. book allowance. book allowance. And just one they gave me a And just one they gave me a And just one they gave me a generous book allowance. They did not generous book allowance. They did not generous book allowance. They did not they they did they did whatever they they they did they did whatever they they they did they did whatever they could to help me to have time to pray, could to help me to have time to pray, could to help me to have time to pray, read, and think.

read, and think. read, and think. And they expected me to come to the And they expected me to come to the And they expected me to come to the pulpit prepared. There's a lot of things pulpit prepared. There's a lot of things pulpit prepared. There's a lot of things they made excuses, he's a young man, he they made excuses, he's a young man, he they made excuses, he's a young man, he won't be able to do A, B, and C. There won't be able to do A, B, and C. There won't be able to do A, B, and C. There was there there was no excuse for me was there there was no excuse for me was there there was no excuse for me coming to the pulpit unprepared. And the coming to the pulpit unprepared. And the coming to the pulpit unprepared. And the fact that I had that honor and fact that I had that honor and fact that I had that honor and privilege, I took that very very privilege, I took that very very privilege, I took that very very seriously. seriously. seriously. >> Mhm. That's glorious. Let's talk about >> Mhm. That's glorious. Let's talk about >> Mhm. That's glorious. Let's talk about that process of preparation, H.B. Um that process of preparation, H.B. Um that process of preparation, H.B. Um I love how you you've said before, a I love how you you've said before, a I love how you you've said before, a passion to preach without a burden to passion to preach without a burden to passion to preach without a burden to study is a desire to perform. study is a desire to perform. study is a desire to perform. Yep. Yep. Yep. >> So so talk about that burden to study. >> So so talk about that burden to study. >> So so talk about that burden to study. Uh maybe before you talk about studying Uh maybe before you talk about studying Uh maybe before you talk about studying the text, how do you prepare yourself? the text, how do you prepare yourself? the text, how do you prepare yourself? Uh what what's the role of prayer and Uh what what's the role of prayer and Uh what what's the role of prayer and and uh your own intimacy with Christ as and uh your own intimacy with Christ as and uh your own intimacy with Christ as it relates to sermon prep? it relates to sermon prep? it relates to sermon prep? Sure. So Sure. So Sure. So how does a 17-year-old pastor a church? how does a 17-year-old pastor a church? how does a 17-year-old pastor a church? Another answer to that question is I was Another answer to that question is I was Another answer to that question is I was blessed to pastor a church that was blessed to pastor a church that was blessed to pastor a church that was committed to believing prayer.

committed to believing prayer. committed to believing prayer. Um Um Um during my pastorate, there met a during my pastorate, there met a during my pastorate, there met a 6:00 a.m. prayer meeting every morning 6:00 a.m. prayer meeting every morning 6:00 a.m. prayer meeting every morning at that church at that church at that church where members gathered in person to pray where members gathered in person to pray where members gathered in person to pray for me. for me. for me. That prayer meeting continued after I That prayer meeting continued after I That prayer meeting continued after I was gone. and they were still was gone. and they were still was gone. and they were still remembering me every day in prayer. That remembering me every day in prayer. That remembering me every day in prayer. That That didn't end until COVID forced them That didn't end until COVID forced them That didn't end until COVID forced them in Los Angeles to stop that prayer in Los Angeles to stop that prayer in Los Angeles to stop that prayer meeting. So, meeting. So, meeting. So, I I was in a atmosphere that prioritized I I was in a atmosphere that prioritized I I was in a atmosphere that prioritized prayer and that was critical to my prayer and that was critical to my prayer and that was critical to my spiritual formation, but but also very spiritual formation, but but also very spiritual formation, but but also very critical to my development as a as a critical to my development as a as a critical to my development as a as a preacher. preacher. preacher. Um the way I say it I I published a book Um the way I say it I I published a book Um the way I say it I I published a book under this title, It happens after under this title, It happens after under this title, It happens after prayer. prayer. prayer. Mhm. And um there's a lot of things we Mhm. And um there's a lot of things we Mhm. And um there's a lot of things we could do to help the situation after we could do to help the situation after we could do to help the situation after we pray, but there's nothing we could do to pray, but there's nothing we could do to pray, but there's nothing we could do to help the situation until we pray. When help the situation until we pray. When help the situation until we pray. When we work, we work. When we pray, God we work, we work. When we pray, God we work, we work. When we pray, God works and I think that applies to works and I think that applies to works and I think that applies to private study and public ministry in private study and public ministry in private study and public ministry in every sphere of both of those realities.

every sphere of both of those realities. every sphere of both of those realities. So, I do have So, I do have So, I do have a um a um a um process of personal devotion that process of personal devotion that process of personal devotion that includes Bible intake and prayer and includes Bible intake and prayer and includes Bible intake and prayer and scripture memorization that is scripture memorization that is scripture memorization that is divorced from my sermon preparation. divorced from my sermon preparation. divorced from my sermon preparation. And I I want a firewall there so that my And I I want a firewall there so that my And I I want a firewall there so that my time with God is non-utilitarian. time with God is non-utilitarian. time with God is non-utilitarian. Um Um Um but primarily, I am but primarily, I am but primarily, I am I'm I'm starting my day with that time I'm I'm starting my day with that time I'm I'm starting my day with that time of personal devotion with the Lord. In of personal devotion with the Lord. In of personal devotion with the Lord. In terms of the more general study for terms of the more general study for terms of the more general study for preaching, preaching, preaching, when I was young, the advice I kept when I was young, the advice I kept when I was young, the advice I kept getting was that you should spend your getting was that you should spend your getting was that you should spend your mornings mornings mornings with God, your afternoons with your with God, your afternoons with your with God, your afternoons with your people, and your evenings with your people, and your evenings with your people, and your evenings with your family. family. family. So, So, So, that has been the general pattern of my that has been the general pattern of my that has been the general pattern of my schedule as best as I could guard that. schedule as best as I could guard that. schedule as best as I could guard that. So, I have been So, I have been So, I have been blessed in two churches I've pastored blessed in two churches I've pastored blessed in two churches I've pastored who who who they're going to pull at me. This The they're going to pull at me. This The they're going to pull at me. This The church I serve is going to pull at me in church I serve is going to pull at me in church I serve is going to pull at me in a lot of different directions, but they a lot of different directions, but they a lot of different directions, but they don't bother me in the morning.

don't bother me in the morning. don't bother me in the morning. They are going to let me spend those They are going to let me spend those They are going to let me spend those mornings mornings mornings in prayer and preparation. Then it in prayer and preparation. Then it in prayer and preparation. Then it becomes a, you know, my responsibility becomes a, you know, my responsibility becomes a, you know, my responsibility to make sure I am using that time wisely to make sure I am using that time wisely to make sure I am using that time wisely and strategically. Um but most mornings and strategically. Um but most mornings and strategically. Um but most mornings I am in sermon preparation and then I am in sermon preparation and then I am in sermon preparation and then stealing whatever time I can in the stealing whatever time I can in the stealing whatever time I can in the afternoon and uh evenings. afternoon and uh evenings. afternoon and uh evenings. We're recording this in the morning, We're recording this in the morning, We're recording this in the morning, listeners should know, which means that listeners should know, which means that listeners should know, which means that [laughter] HB [laughter] HB [laughter] HB and and hanging out with the leg, he's and and hanging out with the leg, he's and and hanging out with the leg, he's hanging [laughter] he's spending time hanging [laughter] he's spending time hanging [laughter] he's spending time with the voice of God. Yeah. with the voice of God. Yeah. with the voice of God. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. HB, you've been involved in promoting HB, you've been involved in promoting HB, you've been involved in promoting expository preaching for a long time and expository preaching for a long time and expository preaching for a long time and you you you preach at expositional you you you preach at expositional you you you preach at expositional preaching conferences. You have your own preaching conferences. You have your own preaching conferences. You have your own conference, Cutting It Straight, where conference, Cutting It Straight, where conference, Cutting It Straight, where you have promoted this. Undoubtedly, you have promoted this. Undoubtedly, you have promoted this. Undoubtedly, you have heard misconceptions about you have heard misconceptions about you have heard misconceptions about expositional preaching. Mhm. And you've expositional preaching. Mhm. And you've expositional preaching. Mhm. And you've heard objections to expositional heard objections to expositional heard objections to expositional preaching. Can you talk about some of preaching. Can you talk about some of preaching. Can you talk about some of the misconceptions that you run into out the misconceptions that you run into out the misconceptions that you run into out there because I I I do as well there because I I I do as well there because I I I do as well and some of the objections that you run and some of the objections that you run and some of the objections that you run into and how you might answer those into and how you might answer those into and how you might answer those things. Sure. So um one of the things that I hear often is one of the things that I hear often is that expositional preaching is not how that expositional preaching is not how that expositional preaching is not how Jesus preached, it's not how Paul Jesus preached, it's not how Paul Jesus preached, it's not how Paul preached, it's not how Peter preached.

preached, it's not how Peter preached. preached, it's not how Peter preached. Just read their sermons and their Just read their sermons and their Just read their sermons and their writings in the New Testament, it's not writings in the New Testament, it's not writings in the New Testament, it's not how they preached. To which I just how they preached. To which I just how they preached. To which I just respond, they were inspired and we are respond, they were inspired and we are respond, they were inspired and we are not. not. not. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> But >> But >> But um I think there are those who um I think there are those who um I think there are those who think that expository preaching think that expository preaching think that expository preaching is just um heavy in interpretation and is just um heavy in interpretation and is just um heavy in interpretation and devoid of real-life application. I think devoid of real-life application. I think devoid of real-life application. I think that is a caricature of expository that is a caricature of expository that is a caricature of expository preaching and it is a mark of expository preaching and it is a mark of expository preaching and it is a mark of expository preaching done wrong. In its essence, preaching done wrong. In its essence, preaching done wrong. In its essence, expository preaching is both explanation expository preaching is both explanation expository preaching is both explanation and exhortation. and exhortation. and exhortation. There are some that think it's just a There are some that think it's just a There are some that think it's just a running commentary running commentary running commentary of the text that you read you an of the text that you read you an of the text that you read you an extended passage and things that jump extended passage and things that jump extended passage and things that jump out at you along the way that you think out at you along the way that you think out at you along the way that you think it might be significant to note without it might be significant to note without it might be significant to note without that sermon being bound together with a that sermon being bound together with a that sermon being bound together with a main idea, a point. I think there are main idea, a point. I think there are main idea, a point. I think there are those who think that expository those who think that expository those who think that expository preaching is preaching is preaching is pulpit exegesis.

pulpit exegesis. pulpit exegesis. Where I call it, you know, when I use Where I call it, you know, when I use Where I call it, you know, when I use the pulpit as a cooking show the pulpit as a cooking show the pulpit as a cooking show and bring languages and all of this and bring languages and all of this and bring languages and all of this exegetical detail and are are showing exegetical detail and are are showing exegetical detail and are are showing people in the pulpit how to make a people in the pulpit how to make a people in the pulpit how to make a sermon when they should be serving fresh sermon when they should be serving fresh sermon when they should be serving fresh bread on Sunday morning. bread on Sunday morning. bread on Sunday morning. And then I think the other thing is that And then I think the other thing is that And then I think the other thing is that I think in our circles you can also you can also treat expository preaching as if it's a treat expository preaching as if it's a treat expository preaching as if it's a theological lecture. theological lecture. theological lecture. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. Um Um Um where where where it is something more appropriate for a it is something more appropriate for a it is something more appropriate for a classroom. Probably your professor would classroom. Probably your professor would classroom. Probably your professor would give you an A on it but it doesn't, you give you an A on it but it doesn't, you give you an A on it but it doesn't, you know, know, know, feed the elderly saint sitting in the feed the elderly saint sitting in the feed the elderly saint sitting in the front or the young person sitting in the front or the young person sitting in the front or the young person sitting in the back. It is not true for life, if I may back. It is not true for life, if I may back. It is not true for life, if I may say it that way say it that way say it that way and just letting the text speak for and just letting the text speak for and just letting the text speak for itself. Yeah, so along those lines, HB itself. Yeah, so along those lines, HB itself. Yeah, so along those lines, HB what are some of the common So those are what are some of the common So those are what are some of the common So those are those are misconceptions. What are some those are misconceptions. What are some those are misconceptions. What are some of the common mistakes you see of the common mistakes you see of the common mistakes you see among young preachers who maybe have a among young preachers who maybe have a among young preachers who maybe have a right understanding of what expository right understanding of what expository right understanding of what expository preaching is preaching is preaching is but in the pulpit they're but in the pulpit they're but in the pulpit they're doing something else. Sure.

doing something else. Sure. doing something else. Sure. Yep. I I think uh one of the mistakes is Yep. I I think uh one of the mistakes is Yep. I I think uh one of the mistakes is and I I struggle with this. and I I struggle with this. and I I struggle with this. I mean, I just think it's the challenge I mean, I just think it's the challenge I mean, I just think it's the challenge of application. of application. of application. Um Um Um Uh we are we are to be doers of the word Uh we are we are to be doers of the word Uh we are we are to be doers of the word and not hearers only. and not hearers only. and not hearers only. And I think um it is incumbent upon And I think um it is incumbent upon And I think um it is incumbent upon faithful preaching to exhort the hearer faithful preaching to exhort the hearer faithful preaching to exhort the hearer to live out the life of the teachings of to live out the life of the teachings of to live out the life of the teachings of our faith. I could tell you when I our faith. I could tell you when I our faith. I could tell you when I started learning expository preaching, I started learning expository preaching, I started learning expository preaching, I also think that also think that also think that I was very serious about it. I was very serious about it. I was very serious about it. But I think I viewed the role of the But I think I viewed the role of the But I think I viewed the role of the sermon is to just get out as much as I sermon is to just get out as much as I sermon is to just get out as much as I can about what I've learned about the can about what I've learned about the can about what I've learned about the text that week. So, my sermons were just text that week. So, my sermons were just text that week. So, my sermons were just data dumps. You know, I data dumps. You know, I data dumps. You know, I my my my I had I had I had >> all the pots and pans to the dinner >> all the pots and pans to the dinner >> all the pots and pans to the dinner table. Yes. [laughter] And I'm telling table. Yes. [laughter] And I'm telling table. Yes. [laughter] And I'm telling you, I mean, I had a I had a preaching you, I mean, I had a I had a preaching you, I mean, I had a I had a preaching mentor, Maurice Watson, who was like HB, mentor, Maurice Watson, who was like HB, mentor, Maurice Watson, who was like HB, I appreciate what you are striving to I appreciate what you are striving to I appreciate what you are striving to do. But if you're going to deal with the do. But if you're going to deal with the do. But if you're going to deal with the text in a serious way you're trying, you text in a serious way you're trying, you text in a serious way you're trying, you can't do that and have a 40-minute can't do that and have a 40-minute can't do that and have a 40-minute introduction, you know.

introduction, you know. introduction, you know. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Where everything that I couldn't find a >> Where everything that I couldn't find a >> Where everything that I couldn't find a place for in the outline, you know, I I place for in the outline, you know, I I place for in the outline, you know, I I just stuck it in to the just stuck it in to the just stuck it in to the >> becomes so big you're out of breath by >> becomes so big you're out of breath by >> becomes so big you're out of breath by the time you get to the the house. the time you get to the the house. the time you get to the the house. Absolutely. I mean, I was putting the Absolutely. I mean, I was putting the Absolutely. I mean, I was putting the big screen and the couch and the dinner big screen and the couch and the dinner big screen and the couch and the dinner table all on the front porch. table all on the front porch. table all on the front porch. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> And then wondering why nobody wanted to >> And then wondering why nobody wanted to >> And then wondering why nobody wanted to come in the house with me. It was good. come in the house with me. It was good. come in the house with me. It was good. Hey, it was a good intro. Let's be Hey, it was a good intro. Let's be Hey, it was a good intro. Let's be honest. honest. honest. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Yes, yes, yes. And so as you're training >> Yes, yes, yes. And so as you're training >> Yes, yes, yes. And so as you're training up uh up uh up uh young preachers to grow, for example, in young preachers to grow, for example, in young preachers to grow, for example, in application, application, application, what are some specific concrete tips you what are some specific concrete tips you what are some specific concrete tips you give for how a preacher can grow in give for how a preacher can grow in give for how a preacher can grow in application? application? application? I um I um I um I recommend I recommend I recommend um um um people make use of the application grid people make use of the application grid people make use of the application grid that, um, our friend Mark Dever uses. that, um, our friend Mark Dever uses. that, um, our friend Mark Dever uses. Um, there is a section Um, there is a section Um, there is a section >> be found online. Which can be found >> be found online. Which can be found >> be found online. Which can be found online. There is a section on in the online. There is a section on in the online. There is a section on in the book Come and See book Come and See book Come and See that is by Jonathan Pennington that is that is by Jonathan Pennington that is that is by Jonathan Pennington that is a, um, a, um, a, um, popularly written work on Bible popularly written work on Bible popularly written work on Bible interpretation.

interpretation. interpretation. But he has a little section on, um, But he has a little section on, um, But he has a little section on, um, application, duties, character, application, duties, character, application, duties, character, uh, goals, and perspective. uh, goals, and perspective. uh, goals, and perspective. Um, I just think those are good four Um, I just think those are good four Um, I just think those are good four good principles to be thinking through. good principles to be thinking through. good principles to be thinking through. What does it What is the duty here? What does it What is the duty here? What does it What is the duty here? How does this develop my character? How How does this develop my character? How How does this develop my character? How does it shape my perspective how I does it shape my perspective how I does it shape my perspective how I should see the world around me? should see the world around me? should see the world around me? And or and goals, what should I be And or and goals, what should I be And or and goals, what should I be striving for? striving for? striving for? I could keep going on and on, but one of I could keep going on and on, but one of I could keep going on and on, but one of the things I think matters the things I think matters the things I think matters [clears throat] [clears throat] [clears throat] is is is you just got to have a pastor's heart. you just got to have a pastor's heart. you just got to have a pastor's heart. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. And you got to you got to love the And you got to you got to love the And you got to you got to love the people to whom, you know, D. Martin people to whom, you know, D. Martin people to whom, you know, D. Martin Lloyd Jones is right. It is one thing to Lloyd Jones is right. It is one thing to Lloyd Jones is right. It is one thing to love to preach. It is quite another love to preach. It is quite another love to preach. It is quite another thing to love those to whom you preach. thing to love those to whom you preach. thing to love those to whom you preach. And I think if you have a shepherd's And I think if you have a shepherd's And I think if you have a shepherd's heart and you love those to whom you heart and you love those to whom you heart and you love those to whom you preach, preach, preach, um, my congregation is not with me in my um, my congregation is not with me in my um, my congregation is not with me in my study, but they are with me in my study. study, but they are with me in my study. study, but they are with me in my study. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. And I know the questions that they ask And I know the questions that they ask And I know the questions that they ask me. me. me. Um, I know, um, some who are godly Um, I know, um, some who are godly Um, I know, um, some who are godly people that are going through sickness, people that are going through sickness, people that are going through sickness, um, their children have gone astray, um, their children have gone astray, um, their children have gone astray, they are in a season of grief, they are they are in a season of grief, they are they are in a season of grief, they are unemployed or underemployed.

unemployed or underemployed. unemployed or underemployed. And I I those burdens that my members And I I those burdens that my members And I I those burdens that my members have, I I feel the weight of them as I have, I I feel the weight of them as I have, I I feel the weight of them as I am preparing. And I want to I want to am preparing. And I want to I want to am preparing. And I want to I want to point them to Christ point them to Christ point them to Christ and his total sufficiency for every and his total sufficiency for every and his total sufficiency for every need, including the deep needs of the need, including the deep needs of the need, including the deep needs of the soul. So, I it may not be, you know, all soul. So, I it may not be, you know, all soul. So, I it may not be, you know, all of the technical tips about application, of the technical tips about application, of the technical tips about application, but I think but I think but I think it's it's it's I get the job done with of course with I get the job done with of course with I get the job done with of course with the help of the Holy Spirit the help of the Holy Spirit the help of the Holy Spirit by just carrying a burden of spiritual by just carrying a burden of spiritual by just carrying a burden of spiritual concern for those to whom I preach to concern for those to whom I preach to concern for those to whom I preach to week in and week out. The pastor who goes deeper in theology The pastor who goes deeper in theology doesn't just become a better thinker. He doesn't just become a better thinker. He doesn't just become a better thinker. He becomes a better shepherd. becomes a better shepherd. becomes a better shepherd. >> [music] >> [music] >> [music] >> Southern Seminary's PhD programs are >> Southern Seminary's PhD programs are >> Southern Seminary's PhD programs are forming pastor theologians. Men who have forming pastor theologians. Men who have forming pastor theologians. Men who have wrestled seriously with the great wrestled seriously with the great wrestled seriously with the great tradition of Christian thought and who tradition of Christian thought and who tradition of Christian thought and who bring that depth back to the people they bring that depth back to the people they bring that depth back to the people they love and lead. What you gain in your love and lead. What you gain in your love and lead. What you gain in your study, your congregation receives.

study, your congregation receives. study, your congregation receives. >> [music] >> [music] >> [music] >> And Southern Seminary's faculty are here >> And Southern Seminary's faculty are here >> And Southern Seminary's faculty are here to support you in your work to to support you in your work to to support you in your work to strengthen the church. strengthen the church. strengthen the church. Southern's PhD program is built to fit Southern's PhD program is built to fit Southern's PhD program is built to fit alongside your ministry offering alongside your ministry offering alongside your ministry offering flexible formats from fully online to flexible formats from fully online to flexible formats from fully online to modular to in-person so you can pursue modular to in-person so you can pursue modular to in-person so you can pursue the kind of rigorous theological the kind of rigorous theological the kind of rigorous theological training that will change how you pastor training that will change how you pastor training that will change how you pastor without stepping away from your church. without stepping away from your church. without stepping away from your church. If you're ready to go deeper, Southern If you're ready to go deeper, Southern If you're ready to go deeper, Southern Seminary's PhD program is where that Seminary's PhD program is where that Seminary's PhD program is where that begins. Visit sbts.edu/phd Yeah, so good. You know, I might I might Yeah, so good. You know, I might I might throw in throw in throw in and and by the way, fellow preachers, and and by the way, fellow preachers, and and by the way, fellow preachers, I've not done this myself. So, I'm I'm I've not done this myself. So, I'm I'm I've not done this myself. So, I'm I'm about to give you some advice that I've about to give you some advice that I've about to give you some advice that I've not done yet myself, but I I've I've not done yet myself, but I I've I've not done yet myself, but I I've I've done it done it done it I've done it at least in my head and I've done it at least in my head and I've done it at least in my head and that is that is that is I love that application grid by the way I love that application grid by the way I love that application grid by the way HP that you just recommended. And I love HP that you just recommended. And I love HP that you just recommended. And I love other tools like you just mentioned the other tools like you just mentioned the other tools like you just mentioned the Pennington tool. There are other tools Pennington tool. There are other tools Pennington tool. There are other tools we could mention as well that make you we could mention as well that make you we could mention as well that make you think about different ways that you can think about different ways that you can think about different ways that you can bring the text to bear on people's bring the text to bear on people's bring the text to bear on people's hearts. But it's also good in light of hearts. But it's also good in light of hearts. But it's also good in light of what you just said to to have sort of an what you just said to to have sort of an what you just said to to have sort of an application grid of your congregation application grid of your congregation application grid of your congregation because not all the people sitting under because not all the people sitting under because not all the people sitting under you are the same and they're not all you are the same and they're not all you are the same and they're not all struggling with the same thing. Some struggling with the same thing. Some struggling with the same thing. Some sometimes we preach as if everybody in sometimes we preach as if everybody in sometimes we preach as if everybody in the congregation is in the same place the congregation is in the same place the congregation is in the same place and they're not. Yeah. And the the

and they're not. Yeah. And the the and they're not. Yeah. And the the Puritans were so aware that the people Puritans were so aware that the people Puritans were so aware that the people sitting under their noses were not all sitting under their noses were not all sitting under their noses were not all facing the same thing in the same way. facing the same thing in the same way. facing the same thing in the same way. And so and and hence Puritan application And so and and hence Puritan application And so and and hence Puritan application often went on and on because they were often went on and on because they were often went on and on because they were trying to apply the text to 23 different trying to apply the text to 23 different trying to apply the text to 23 different things and you have to watch out for things and you have to watch out for things and you have to watch out for that as well. That can be a a problem that as well. That can be a a problem that as well. That can be a a problem too, but too, but too, but works like Thomas Brooks' Precious works like Thomas Brooks' Precious works like Thomas Brooks' Precious Remedies Against Satan's Devices Remedies Against Satan's Devices Remedies Against Satan's Devices reminded me reminded me reminded me >> Mhm. wow, there are actually a lot of >> Mhm. wow, there are actually a lot of >> Mhm. wow, there are actually a lot of different things that my people are different things that my people are different things that my people are struggling with. And so I think it's struggling with. And so I think it's struggling with. And so I think it's it's probably good early in your it's probably good early in your it's probably good early in your ministry to go to a resource like that ministry to go to a resource like that ministry to go to a resource like that and build a little application grid in and build a little application grid in and build a little application grid in the sense of what are my people dealing the sense of what are my people dealing the sense of what are my people dealing with and then to build that for your own with and then to build that for your own with and then to build that for your own congregation. You know, what are the congregation. You know, what are the congregation. You know, what are the unique temptations of my people? What unique temptations of my people? What unique temptations of my people? What are they particularly struggling with in are they particularly struggling with in are they particularly struggling with in this particular geographical location, this particular geographical location, this particular geographical location, demographical location, social location?

demographical location, social location? demographical location, social location? What are the What are the unique things What are the What are the unique things What are the What are the unique things that I need to help them in? That's one that I need to help them in? That's one that I need to help them in? That's one way that we can love our people well and way that we can love our people well and way that we can love our people well and preach to our people well and and not preach to our people well and and not preach to our people well and and not have them walking away saying, "Well, have them walking away saying, "Well, have them walking away saying, "Well, that didn't have anything to do with my that didn't have anything to do with my that didn't have anything to do with my life." We we would rather say, "How did life." We we would rather say, "How did life." We we would rather say, "How did the pastor know that I was struggling the pastor know that I was struggling the pastor know that I was struggling with that?" How did How did How did he with that?" How did How did How did he with that?" How did How did How did he know that that was exactly what I needed know that that was exactly what I needed know that that was exactly what I needed to hear today? Well, because the to hear today? Well, because the to hear today? Well, because the pastor's been praying over you. You were pastor's been praying over you. You were pastor's been praying over you. You were in his study this week even though you in his study this week even though you in his study this week even though you were in his study this week. That's were in his study this week. That's were in his study this week. That's right. You were in his heart, in his right. You were in his heart, in his right. You were in his heart, in his mind. He's trying to think about how to mind. He's trying to think about how to mind. He's trying to think about how to bring to bear the word of God on your bring to bear the word of God on your bring to bear the word of God on your heart. So I wish I'd done more of that heart. So I wish I'd done more of that heart. So I wish I'd done more of that earlier on. I think my application earlier on. I think my application earlier on. I think my application probably more came out of how God was probably more came out of how God was probably more came out of how God was you know, addressing my own soul as I you know, addressing my own soul as I you know, addressing my own soul as I studied the passage and thinking, "Okay, studied the passage and thinking, "Okay, studied the passage and thinking, "Okay, well, if God's helping my soul in this well, if God's helping my soul in this well, if God's helping my soul in this way, maybe he'll help the people of way, maybe he'll help the people of way, maybe he'll help the people of God." And that that's important, but I I God." And that that's important, but I I God." And that that's important, but I I do think your point about loving your do think your point about loving your do think your point about loving your people enough to know them is that that people enough to know them is that that people enough to know them is that that is a that's an application unlocker for is a that's an application unlocker for is a that's an application unlocker for pastors. If I can add a couple of things pastors. If I can add a couple of things pastors. If I can add a couple of things quickly, I would also say quickly, I would also say quickly, I would also say um um um I read, one of the reasons I read I read, one of the reasons I read I read, one of the reasons I read Spurgeon Spurgeon Spurgeon is because I do think he is a model of is because I do think he is a model of is because I do think he is a model of very clean preaching, clear preaching very clean preaching, clear preaching very clean preaching, clear preaching that did it well. You just, you know, that did it well. You just, you know, that did it well. You just, you know, "Oh, there it for that mother who care, "Oh, there it for that mother who care, "Oh, there it for that mother who care, you know."

you know." you know." >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> He's preaching to thousands and his mind >> He's preaching to thousands and his mind >> He's preaching to thousands and his mind is on the mother, you know, making is on the mother, you know, making is on the mother, you know, making dinner. Um dinner. Um dinner. Um I also listened to over the years I also listened to over the years I also listened to over the years John Piper John Piper John Piper and Ralph Douglas West um and Ralph Douglas West um and Ralph Douglas West um a white pastor and a black pastor who I a white pastor and a black pastor who I a white pastor and a black pastor who I thought in their preaching does thought in their preaching does thought in their preaching does corporate application from a pastoral corporate application from a pastoral corporate application from a pastoral perspective. perspective. perspective. Um it excellently well. I think that is Um it excellently well. I think that is Um it excellently well. I think that is helpful and I do think that it's helpful and I do think that it's helpful and I do think that it's important for you to as a pastor important for you to as a pastor important for you to as a pastor to be knowing your church's own to be knowing your church's own to be knowing your church's own idolatries. So idolatries. So idolatries. So it's not my job. I'm not the, you know, it's not my job. I'm not the, you know, it's not my job. I'm not the, you know, bishop of America. It's not my job to bishop of America. It's not my job to bishop of America. It's not my job to address everything that's going on address everything that's going on address everything that's going on in the larger church world and in the in the larger church world and in the in the larger church world and in the culture around us. There are specific culture around us. There are specific culture around us. There are specific high places in my own congregation that high places in my own congregation that high places in my own congregation that I need to be pulling down. Um ways my I need to be pulling down. Um ways my I need to be pulling down. Um ways my congregation thinks about things and congregation thinks about things and congregation thinks about things and responds to things that I need to be responds to things that I need to be responds to things that I need to be aware of and and pushing them in those aware of and and pushing them in those aware of and and pushing them in those areas to greater faithfulness to Christ.

areas to greater faithfulness to Christ. areas to greater faithfulness to Christ. That's really good. Matt, you've talked That's really good. Matt, you've talked That's really good. Matt, you've talked before about not trying to pastor before about not trying to pastor before about not trying to pastor Twitter, but pastor your own Twitter, but pastor your own Twitter, but pastor your own congregation. And that's a that's a good congregation. And that's a that's a good congregation. And that's a that's a good word, HB. We We all need to inhabit the word, HB. We We all need to inhabit the word, HB. We We all need to inhabit the world of the people that the Lord has world of the people that the Lord has world of the people that the Lord has granted us the responsibility of being granted us the responsibility of being granted us the responsibility of being the undershepherds to their souls, and the undershepherds to their souls, and the undershepherds to their souls, and and not focus on some sort of generic and not focus on some sort of generic and not focus on some sort of generic out there place. out there place. out there place. Uh we'll serve them better if we're Uh we'll serve them better if we're Uh we'll serve them better if we're thinking about them. Indeed. Well, I thinking about them. Indeed. Well, I thinking about them. Indeed. Well, I love what you're saying, HB, because love what you're saying, HB, because love what you're saying, HB, because for someone who preaches at conferences for someone who preaches at conferences for someone who preaches at conferences as much as you do, as much as you do, as much as you do, part of what you're saying is that the part of what you're saying is that the part of what you're saying is that the the bread and butter of your preaching the bread and butter of your preaching the bread and butter of your preaching ministry ministry ministry are not conference messages. You're not are not conference messages. You're not are not conference messages. You're not preaching generic application at Shiloh preaching generic application at Shiloh preaching generic application at Shiloh Church. You're preaching to a particular Church. You're preaching to a particular Church. You're preaching to a particular flock in a particular sheep pen for whom flock in a particular sheep pen for whom flock in a particular sheep pen for whom you will give account to God. you will give account to God. you will give account to God. Um your first Father's Day after your Um your first Father's Day after your Um your first Father's Day after your dad died, you preached a sermon titled dad died, you preached a sermon titled dad died, you preached a sermon titled The Lord Knows What He Is Doing.

The Lord Knows What He Is Doing. The Lord Knows What He Is Doing. How did grief, both then and since, how How did grief, both then and since, how How did grief, both then and since, how did how has grief shaped the way you did how has grief shaped the way you did how has grief shaped the way you preach to suffering people? Yeah, so preach to suffering people? Yeah, so preach to suffering people? Yeah, so the um week my father passed away, I was the um week my father passed away, I was the um week my father passed away, I was preaching a youth meeting at the Chapel preaching a youth meeting at the Chapel preaching a youth meeting at the Chapel Hill Baptist Church in Detroit, Hill Baptist Church in Detroit, Hill Baptist Church in Detroit, Michigan. So, as I'm flying from Detroit Michigan. So, as I'm flying from Detroit Michigan. So, as I'm flying from Detroit um to Los Angeles, the Lord calls my um to Los Angeles, the Lord calls my um to Los Angeles, the Lord calls my father from labor to reward. And I come father from labor to reward. And I come father from labor to reward. And I come home to the news that my my dad had home to the news that my my dad had home to the news that my my dad had passed away. I'm sitting in the backseat passed away. I'm sitting in the backseat passed away. I'm sitting in the backseat with my suitcase. with my suitcase. with my suitcase. And And And the men of the church are there waiting the men of the church are there waiting the men of the church are there waiting for me. I'm 16 years old. It is the day for me. I'm 16 years old. It is the day for me. I'm 16 years old. It is the day before Father's Day. before Father's Day. before Father's Day. They have come out They have come out They have come out to to the car to tell me my dad passed, to to the car to tell me my dad passed, to to the car to tell me my dad passed, and and and I will tell you something about the man. When When I got in the house, my family I got in the house, my family I got in the house, my family told me I needed to come in because the told me I needed to come in because the told me I needed to come in because the men wanted me to preach the next day.

men wanted me to preach the next day. men wanted me to preach the next day. And my family, we needed to call a And my family, we needed to call a And my family, we needed to call a locksmith locksmith locksmith because people were going in my daddy's because people were going in my daddy's because people were going in my daddy's members were showing up members were showing up members were showing up going in my dad's studies to take a going in my dad's studies to take a going in my dad's studies to take a book. They just wanted something that book. They just wanted something that book. They just wanted something that belonged to him. They just loved the belonged to him. They just loved the belonged to him. They just loved the man. Um man. Um man. Um but but but um um um I I I I I I think I was more shocked I I I I I I think I was more shocked I I I I I I think I was more shocked than stunned. than stunned. than stunned. Uh so much not to say no to the telling Uh so much not to say no to the telling Uh so much not to say no to the telling me to preach the next day. me to preach the next day. me to preach the next day. And I had just preached that youth And I had just preached that youth And I had just preached that youth message on the lads lunch in John message on the lads lunch in John message on the lads lunch in John chapter 6 chapter 6 chapter 6 and looked at uh that text again and saw and looked at uh that text again and saw and looked at uh that text again and saw that line that line that line that he asked these things to test that he asked these things to test that he asked these things to test Philip because he knew what he would do. Philip because he knew what he would do. Philip because he knew what he would do. And I restructured that to lean into And I restructured that to lean into And I restructured that to lean into that that the Lord knew what he was that that the Lord knew what he was that that the Lord knew what he was doing. doing. doing. I will tell you though, the week of my I will tell you though, the week of my I will tell you though, the week of my dad's funeral, my pastor's my dad's dad's funeral, my pastor's my dad's dad's funeral, my pastor's my dad's pastor friends told me pastor friends told me pastor friends told me as I wept at his funeral, "Don't cry. Your dad would not be proud to see you Your dad would not be proud to see you sitting here crying. You know where your sitting here crying. You know where your sitting here crying. You know where your daddy is. There is nothing for you to daddy is. There is nothing for you to daddy is. There is nothing for you to cry about.

cry about. cry about. Uh stop stop that crying. And Uh stop stop that crying. And Uh stop stop that crying. And I so appreciated their care and concern I so appreciated their care and concern I so appreciated their care and concern and they were absolutely wrong. and they were absolutely wrong. and they were absolutely wrong. >> [laughter] >> They were just absolutely wrong. Um >> They were just absolutely wrong. Um and it took me some time to and it took me some time to and it took me some time to come to grips with that. come to grips with that. come to grips with that. That being saved doesn't mean you are That being saved doesn't mean you are That being saved doesn't mean you are bionic. bionic. bionic. And you are Yes, the Bible And you are Yes, the Bible And you are Yes, the Bible says that we should not sorrow as those says that we should not sorrow as those says that we should not sorrow as those who have no hope, but it doesn't mean we who have no hope, but it doesn't mean we who have no hope, but it doesn't mean we should not sorrow. should not sorrow. should not sorrow. Um so it took me a while to go through Um so it took me a while to go through Um so it took me a while to go through the grief process. the grief process. the grief process. And I feel like And I feel like And I feel like not only the the loss of a loved one at not only the the loss of a loved one at not only the the loss of a loved one at an early age, and then me really having an early age, and then me really having an early age, and then me really having the grief process delayed makes me the grief process delayed makes me the grief process delayed makes me really, really sensitive. As I am really, really sensitive. As I am really, really sensitive. As I am ministering to suffering people here at ministering to suffering people here at ministering to suffering people here at Shiloh Church when I preach a funeral Shiloh Church when I preach a funeral Shiloh Church when I preach a funeral sermon, sermon, sermon, >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> um and there are families and guests >> um and there are families and guests >> um and there are families and guests there that don't don't there that don't don't there that don't don't don't know who I am, who has shown up don't know who I am, who has shown up don't know who I am, who has shown up for a funeral.

for a funeral. for a funeral. One of the things I say to introduce One of the things I say to introduce One of the things I say to introduce myself is not my title, they are my a myself is not my title, they are my a myself is not my title, they are my a tenure at the church, but that I've sat tenure at the church, but that I've sat tenure at the church, but that I've sat where you sit. where you sit. where you sit. And I know what it is for a death to And I know what it is for a death to And I know what it is for a death to snatch away a loved one. snatch away a loved one. snatch away a loved one. Um so I do Um so I do Um so I do and after all these decades, I still I and after all these decades, I still I and after all these decades, I still I still still still miss my dad and grieve my miss my dad and grieve my miss my dad and grieve my uh my dad's passing and carry on the uh my dad's passing and carry on the uh my dad's passing and carry on the hope of heaven hope of heaven hope of heaven uh in my heart for comfort, but um I do uh in my heart for comfort, but um I do uh in my heart for comfort, but um I do feel like it has shaped me to be feel like it has shaped me to be feel like it has shaped me to be sensitive sensitive sensitive to those in our congregation who are to those in our congregation who are to those in our congregation who are going through various sorrows and griefs going through various sorrows and griefs going through various sorrows and griefs and afflictions. and afflictions. and afflictions. Uh I don't remember who said it, but Uh I don't remember who said it, but Uh I don't remember who said it, but they've said it was well said they've said it was well said they've said it was well said that you should preach to broken hearts that you should preach to broken hearts that you should preach to broken hearts and you'll never lack for a congregation and you'll never lack for a congregation and you'll never lack for a congregation because there's one in every pew. because there's one in every pew. because there's one in every pew. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. That's right. Yeah, HB, I lost my dad at 32, and I Yeah, HB, I lost my dad at 32, and I Yeah, HB, I lost my dad at 32, and I can't imagine what it would have been can't imagine what it would have been can't imagine what it would have been like to lose my dad at 16 or 17 years like to lose my dad at 16 or 17 years like to lose my dad at 16 or 17 years old. I just I I can't even imagine that.

old. I just I I can't even imagine that. old. I just I I can't even imagine that. And I probably miss him more now than I And I probably miss him more now than I And I probably miss him more now than I missed him at 32. So I I resonate with missed him at 32. So I I resonate with missed him at 32. So I I resonate with that. And I do think that's the Lord the that. And I do think that's the Lord the that. And I do think that's the Lord the Lord prepared your heart, the heart of a Lord prepared your heart, the heart of a Lord prepared your heart, the heart of a shepherd to love people that are shepherd to love people that are shepherd to love people that are broken-hearted that way. And uh and what broken-hearted that way. And uh and what broken-hearted that way. And uh and what a what a wonderful testimony you do you a what a wonderful testimony you do you a what a wonderful testimony you do you know people love you, but they can still know people love you, but they can still know people love you, but they can still sometimes give you bad advice. That's sometimes give you bad advice. That's sometimes give you bad advice. That's really important for for pastors to really important for for pastors to really important for for pastors to hear. People that love you can give you hear. People that love you can give you hear. People that love you can give you really bad advice. Um HB, I know that really bad advice. Um HB, I know that really bad advice. Um HB, I know that that leaving Los Angeles to go to Shiloh that leaving Los Angeles to go to Shiloh that leaving Los Angeles to go to Shiloh in Jacksonville, you you've you've in Jacksonville, you you've you've in Jacksonville, you you've you've talked about the Lord dragging you there talked about the Lord dragging you there talked about the Lord dragging you there kicking and screaming. Mhm. Um and and kicking and screaming. Mhm. Um and and kicking and screaming. Mhm. Um and and and like like any church, you've had and like like any church, you've had and like like any church, you've had challenges that you've had to face. How challenges that you've had to face. How challenges that you've had to face. How how has how has how has your preaching your preaching your preaching uh helped you lead that congregation and uh helped you lead that congregation and uh helped you lead that congregation and and see that congregation grow in their and see that congregation grow in their and see that congregation grow in their knowledge of the Lord, their love for knowledge of the Lord, their love for knowledge of the Lord, their love for the Lord Jesus Christ. Tell us a little the Lord Jesus Christ. Tell us a little the Lord Jesus Christ. Tell us a little bit about your preaching at Shiloh these bit about your preaching at Shiloh these bit about your preaching at Shiloh these last seven what seven how many years last seven what seven how many years last seven what seven how many years now? Is it I am in my 18th year now, 20.

now? Is it I am in my 18th year now, 20. now? Is it I am in my 18th year now, 20. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. I'm in my 18th year and this has >> Yeah. I'm in my 18th year and this has >> Yeah. I'm in my 18th year and this has been a great joy to pastor this church. been a great joy to pastor this church. been a great joy to pastor this church. But But But um I'm I I know what John Newton meant. um I'm I I know what John Newton meant. um I'm I I know what John Newton meant. Through many dangers, trials and snares Through many dangers, trials and snares Through many dangers, trials and snares I have already come. So, I have had some I have already come. So, I have had some I have already come. So, I have had some very difficult seasons very difficult seasons very difficult seasons um over these 18 years pastoring this um over these 18 years pastoring this um over these 18 years pastoring this church. Um church. Um church. Um I have been I have been I have been aided aided aided by my study of God's word by my study of God's word by my study of God's word and preaching from the overflow. Um God and preaching from the overflow. Um God and preaching from the overflow. Um God has used that in times of um division, has used that in times of um division, has used that in times of um division, sometimes of betrayal, sometimes of just sometimes of betrayal, sometimes of just sometimes of betrayal, sometimes of just difficult transition here. Um my own difficult transition here. Um my own difficult transition here. Um my own time in the I still time in the I still time in the I still I'm still shocked I'm still shocked I'm still shocked that I get paid to study the Bible. that I get paid to study the Bible. that I get paid to study the Bible. Yeah. Um I just I just I can't believe Yeah. Um I just I just I can't believe Yeah. Um I just I just I can't believe that. And my study of God's word that. And my study of God's word that. And my study of God's word to fill up my heart and then get to the to fill up my heart and then get to the to fill up my heart and then get to the pulpit to preach from the overflow of pulpit to preach from the overflow of pulpit to preach from the overflow of that that that um has um has um has been a great blessing. Secondly, I do been a great blessing. Secondly, I do been a great blessing. Secondly, I do believe in the power of the pulpit.

believe in the power of the pulpit. believe in the power of the pulpit. And I just believe there is nothing that And I just believe there is nothing that And I just believe there is nothing that the word of God cannot fix. the word of God cannot fix. the word of God cannot fix. So, I do not think the solutions to the So, I do not think the solutions to the So, I do not think the solutions to the challenges I've had in my I've never challenges I've had in my I've never challenges I've had in my I've never thought that the solutions are in the thought that the solutions are in the thought that the solutions are in the boardroom. boardroom. boardroom. I think I the solutions are in the power I think I the solutions are in the power I think I the solutions are in the power of God's word. of God's word. of God's word. And I am his spokesman here, and I want And I am his spokesman here, and I want And I am his spokesman here, and I want to make sure that I rightly divide the to make sure that I rightly divide the to make sure that I rightly divide the word of truth. word of truth. word of truth. I I also think um I I also think um I I also think um one of the great compliments I've one of the great compliments I've one of the great compliments I've received on the other side of some received on the other side of some received on the other side of some difficult periods difficult periods difficult periods is that is that is that I would have never known you were going I would have never known you were going I would have never known you were going through that through that through that behind the scenes from the way you went behind the scenes from the way you went behind the scenes from the way you went to the pulpit on Sundays. to the pulpit on Sundays. to the pulpit on Sundays. >> Yeah. Um >> Yeah. Um >> Yeah. Um God's God's grace is sufficient for us God's God's grace is sufficient for us God's God's grace is sufficient for us and his strength is perfected in our and his strength is perfected in our and his strength is perfected in our weakness, and I don't think that the weakness, and I don't think that the weakness, and I don't think that the pulpit is a place to vent. pulpit is a place to vent. pulpit is a place to vent. >> [gasps] >> [gasps] >> [gasps] >> Um and I think that has made me I know >> Um and I think that has made me I know >> Um and I think that has made me I know that I have been the times burdened and that I have been the times burdened and that I have been the times burdened and hurt and troubled, and it has made me be hurt and troubled, and it has made me be hurt and troubled, and it has made me be more intentional more intentional more intentional in the crafting of my sermon, not just in the crafting of my sermon, not just in the crafting of my sermon, not just the study of the text, but the crafting the study of the text, but the crafting the study of the text, but the crafting of my sermon. There was a period where I of my sermon. There was a period where I of my sermon. There was a period where I just went just went just went to the pulpit with the full I'm I'm not to the pulpit with the full I'm I'm not to the pulpit with the full I'm I'm not a manuscript preacher. I write it but a manuscript preacher. I write it but a manuscript preacher. I write it but didn't take it to the pulpit, but I I didn't take it to the pulpit, but I I didn't take it to the pulpit, but I I went through a stretch where I took it went through a stretch where I took it went through a stretch where I took it to the pulpit every week.

to the pulpit every week. to the pulpit every week. And I did not want us to come to the And I did not want us to come to the And I did not want us to come to the temptation to say something off the cuff temptation to say something off the cuff temptation to say something off the cuff that might be a reaction that might be a reaction that might be a reaction to a last deacon meeting rather than the to a last deacon meeting rather than the to a last deacon meeting rather than the leadership of the Holy Spirit. leadership of the Holy Spirit. leadership of the Holy Spirit. So, if push come to shove, I just want So, if push come to shove, I just want So, if push come to shove, I just want to read what I what I have prayerfully to read what I what I have prayerfully to read what I what I have prayerfully thought of here. So, I I have tried thought of here. So, I I have tried thought of here. So, I I have tried to be very precise and careful to be very precise and careful to be very precise and careful um um um in the pulpit, and in the pulpit, and in the pulpit, and I am blessed. Not everyone can say this. I am blessed. Not everyone can say this. I am blessed. Not everyone can say this. With all of the challenges, I am blessed With all of the challenges, I am blessed With all of the challenges, I am blessed to serve a church where preaching is in to serve a church where preaching is in to serve a church where preaching is in season. season. season. And And And the people the people the people Last week I got a chance to preach at a Last week I got a chance to preach at a Last week I got a chance to preach at a great conference, great conference, great conference, national conference. I came here Sunday. national conference. I came here Sunday. national conference. I came here Sunday. I got came home Sunday. They didn't know I got came home Sunday. They didn't know I got came home Sunday. They didn't know or care that I was at that conference. or care that I was at that conference. or care that I was at that conference. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> They just wanted to know if there a word >> They just wanted to know if there a word >> They just wanted to know if there a word from the Lord. And that is a inspiring from the Lord. And that is a inspiring from the Lord. And that is a inspiring reality that spurs me on to keep reality that spurs me on to keep reality that spurs me on to keep preaching.

preaching. preaching. HB, you mentioned that the power is in HB, you mentioned that the power is in HB, you mentioned that the power is in the pulpit, specifically in the word of the pulpit, specifically in the word of the pulpit, specifically in the word of God. And so many of the pastors God. And so many of the pastors God. And so many of the pastors listening to this podcast believe that listening to this podcast believe that listening to this podcast believe that in their heads. in their heads. in their heads. But the week in, week out grind of But the week in, week out grind of But the week in, week out grind of ministry with satanic distraction and ministry with satanic distraction and ministry with satanic distraction and and discouragement, as well as just our and discouragement, as well as just our and discouragement, as well as just our own struggles as weak, fallen creatures, own struggles as weak, fallen creatures, own struggles as weak, fallen creatures, it can it can lead us to lose sight of it can it can lead us to lose sight of it can it can lead us to lose sight of those theological truths we affirm, to those theological truths we affirm, to those theological truths we affirm, to not not feel them. So what would what not not feel them. So what would what not not feel them. So what would what would you say to the pastor would you say to the pastor would you say to the pastor who is struggling to believe that the who is struggling to believe that the who is struggling to believe that the word works? I mean, after all, his word works? I mean, after all, his word works? I mean, after all, his people show up every Sunday looking people show up every Sunday looking people show up every Sunday looking pretty much the same they did the Sunday pretty much the same they did the Sunday pretty much the same they did the Sunday before. before. before. Same same struggles, same questions. So Same same struggles, same questions. So Same same struggles, same questions. So how do you fight to really believe that how do you fight to really believe that how do you fight to really believe that God's word will not return void? What God's word will not return void? What God's word will not return void? What would you encourage would you encourage would you encourage What word would you have for a What word would you have for a What word would you have for a discouraged pastor in that regard?

discouraged pastor in that regard? discouraged pastor in that regard? Sure. So Sure. So Sure. So the entirety of my ministry, I have been the entirety of my ministry, I have been the entirety of my ministry, I have been consumed with the opening of a series of consumed with the opening of a series of consumed with the opening of a series of commands in 2 Timothy chapter 4, verse commands in 2 Timothy chapter 4, verse commands in 2 Timothy chapter 4, verse 2. 2. 2. Preach the word. Preach the word. Preach the word. Now, at this season of my life, I I Now, at this season of my life, I I Now, at this season of my life, I I consumed with the last of that series consumed with the last of that series consumed with the last of that series commands of commands in verse five. commands of commands in verse five. commands of commands in verse five. Fulfill your ministry. Fulfill your ministry. Fulfill your ministry. And we don't get any credit And we don't get any credit And we don't get any credit for how well we start. for how well we start. for how well we start. Anyone can Anyone can Anyone can start fast. The question is, can you start fast. The question is, can you start fast. The question is, can you finish strong? finish strong? finish strong? And And And the word works, the word works, the word works, but but but it it doesn't work according to our it it doesn't work according to our it it doesn't work according to our timetable and schedule. timetable and schedule. timetable and schedule. Um you can't preach and expect God to Um you can't preach and expect God to Um you can't preach and expect God to uh you know, he is the fool who who uh you know, he is the fool who who uh you know, he is the fool who who expects to sow and reap on the same day.

expects to sow and reap on the same day. expects to sow and reap on the same day. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Yeah. Um and you have to have a great >> Yeah. Um and you have to have a great >> Yeah. Um and you have to have a great confidence in God. There are there are confidence in God. There are there are confidence in God. There are there are weeks where weeks where weeks where I do feel I do feel I do feel that I have poured out everything I've that I have poured out everything I've that I have poured out everything I've gotten and I don't see a difference. gotten and I don't see a difference. gotten and I don't see a difference. But I'm grateful that But I'm grateful that But I'm grateful that whether or not I can thank God for whether or not I can thank God for whether or not I can thank God for things I can see growing over things I can see growing over things I can see growing over uh above the soil, God is always at work uh above the soil, God is always at work uh above the soil, God is always at work underneath the soil in ways that we underneath the soil in ways that we underneath the soil in ways that we cannot see and we do not know. cannot see and we do not know. cannot see and we do not know. And our confidence must be in him, And our confidence must be in him, And our confidence must be in him, in the lordship of Christ and in the in the lordship of Christ and in the in the lordship of Christ and in the power of his word and in the ministry of power of his word and in the ministry of power of his word and in the ministry of the Holy Spirit to get the job done in the Holy Spirit to get the job done in the Holy Spirit to get the job done in the life of his people. Um the life of his people. Um the life of his people. Um I pray a prayer of illumination I pray a prayer of illumination I pray a prayer of illumination every Sunday before I start the sermon. every Sunday before I start the sermon. every Sunday before I start the sermon. And I typically end that prayer by And I typically end that prayer by And I typically end that prayer by saying saying saying that as we plant as the seed of your that as we plant as the seed of your that as we plant as the seed of your word is planted and watered, Lord, we word is planted and watered, Lord, we word is planted and watered, Lord, we know that only you can make it grow.

know that only you can make it grow. know that only you can make it grow. So we reserve for you as always the So we reserve for you as always the So we reserve for you as always the highest praise and full credit for the highest praise and full credit for the highest praise and full credit for the fruit that shall come from this time. fruit that shall come from this time. fruit that shall come from this time. It's our job to just plant and water. We It's our job to just plant and water. We It's our job to just plant and water. We have trust God to give the increase. have trust God to give the increase. have trust God to give the increase. Hang in there. Hang in there. Hang in there. Amen. Amen. Amen. I I've forgotten 99% of the meals I've I I've forgotten 99% of the meals I've I I've forgotten 99% of the meals I've eaten in my life, but you know what? eaten in my life, but you know what? eaten in my life, but you know what? They've kept me alive. Amen. God God They've kept me alive. Amen. God God They've kept me alive. Amen. God God uses faithful, forgettable sermons to uses faithful, forgettable sermons to uses faithful, forgettable sermons to beautify his bride. Amen. Praise God. beautify his bride. Amen. Praise God. beautify his bride. Amen. Praise God. And and it's just think how often the And and it's just think how often the And and it's just think how often the Bible tells us to wait. Mhm. To wait on Bible tells us to wait. Mhm. To wait on Bible tells us to wait. Mhm. To wait on the Lord. And you know, the the prophets the Lord. And you know, the the prophets the Lord. And you know, the the prophets had to set the people of God up for a had to set the people of God up for a had to set the people of God up for a 600-year wait between the exile and the 600-year wait between the exile and the 600-year wait between the exile and the coming of Christ. And you know, it I'm coming of Christ. And you know, it I'm coming of Christ. And you know, it I'm sure that there are could have been a sure that there are could have been a sure that there are could have been a lot of people who said within that time, lot of people who said within that time, lot of people who said within that time, um oh, well, the God's word hasn't come um oh, well, the God's word hasn't come um oh, well, the God's word hasn't come to pass. But they had to wait. They just to pass. But they had to wait. They just to pass. But they had to wait. They just had to wait. So, um had to wait. So, um had to wait. So, um that that that's important for that that that's important for that that that's important for preachers, too, to remember. The The preachers, too, to remember. The The preachers, too, to remember. The The Lord God does not work on our time Lord God does not work on our time Lord God does not work on our time schedule. Uh his his his ways are not schedule. Uh his his his ways are not schedule. Uh his his his ways are not our ways, and our faithfulness is is not our ways, and our faithfulness is is not our ways, and our faithfulness is is not measured in speed. Um the you know, the measured in speed. Um the you know, the measured in speed. Um the you know, the speed of the the immediate results. I I speed of the the immediate results. I I speed of the the immediate results. I I you know, even you know, even you know, even at a smaller level, very often a pastor

at a smaller level, very often a pastor at a smaller level, very often a pastor won't see the effect of his ministry won't see the effect of his ministry won't see the effect of his ministry until the ministry of the next man in until the ministry of the next man in until the ministry of the next man in his congregation. Mhm. And his congregation. Mhm. And his congregation. Mhm. And you know, now you'll you'll see some you know, now you'll you'll see some you know, now you'll you'll see some results, but all of us we're always results, but all of us we're always results, but all of us we're always trying to measure in this area, but a trying to measure in this area, but a trying to measure in this area, but a lot of times you won't see the effect lot of times you won't see the effect lot of times you won't see the effect until the next ministry. And so, pastors until the next ministry. And so, pastors until the next ministry. And so, pastors have to live realizing we won't get our have to live realizing we won't get our have to live realizing we won't get our final report card until glory. And uh final report card until glory. And uh final report card until glory. And uh and if the report card is well done, and if the report card is well done, and if the report card is well done, good and faithful servant, everything's good and faithful servant, everything's good and faithful servant, everything's going to be all right. Amen. HB, would going to be all right. Amen. HB, would going to be all right. Amen. HB, would you have uh, a final word for preachers you have uh, a final word for preachers you have uh, a final word for preachers who are listening. Yes, I am glad you who are listening. Yes, I am glad you who are listening. Yes, I am glad you gave me that opportunity because as Lig gave me that opportunity because as Lig gave me that opportunity because as Lig was talking, it was on my heart to was talking, it was on my heart to was talking, it was on my heart to simply quote 1 Corinthians 15 simply quote 1 Corinthians 15 simply quote 1 Corinthians 15 verse 58. Therefore, my beloved verse 58. Therefore, my beloved verse 58. Therefore, my beloved brothers, brothers, brothers, be steadfast, be steadfast, be steadfast, immovable, immovable, immovable, always abounding in the work of the always abounding in the work of the always abounding in the work of the Lord, Lord, Lord, knowing that in the Lord your labor is knowing that in the Lord your labor is knowing that in the Lord your labor is not in vain. H.B., would you pray uh, not in vain. H.B., would you pray uh, not in vain. H.B., would you pray uh, for pastors listening? It'll be a for pastors listening? It'll be a for pastors listening? It'll be a pleasure.

pleasure. pleasure. Gracious and heavenly Father, we do give Gracious and heavenly Father, we do give Gracious and heavenly Father, we do give you praise for the privilege of prayer you praise for the privilege of prayer you praise for the privilege of prayer that is ours in Christ, our great high that is ours in Christ, our great high that is ours in Christ, our great high priest, priest, priest, whose blood and righteousness opens a whose blood and righteousness opens a whose blood and righteousness opens a way, a new and living way for us to draw way, a new and living way for us to draw way, a new and living way for us to draw near to the throne of grace. near to the throne of grace. near to the throne of grace. Thank you that we need not be anxious Thank you that we need not be anxious Thank you that we need not be anxious about anything, about anything, about anything, that we can bring all of our cares that we can bring all of our cares that we can bring all of our cares and cast them upon you because you care and cast them upon you because you care and cast them upon you because you care for us. for us. for us. I pray for the pastors listening and I pray for the pastors listening and I pray for the pastors listening and watching watching watching that you would, Lord, that you would, Lord, that you would, Lord, prove in their experience that your prove in their experience that your prove in their experience that your grace is sufficient and that your grace is sufficient and that your grace is sufficient and that your strength is perfected in our weakness. strength is perfected in our weakness. strength is perfected in our weakness. Fulfill every holy desire they have and Fulfill every holy desire they have and Fulfill every holy desire they have and bring to pass the deeds prompted by bring to pass the deeds prompted by bring to pass the deeds prompted by their faith. May every sphere of our their faith. May every sphere of our their faith. May every sphere of our lives be brought under the authority of lives be brought under the authority of lives be brought under the authority of the lordship of Christ and may we not be the lordship of Christ and may we not be the lordship of Christ and may we not be weary in well doing knowing that in due weary in well doing knowing that in due weary in well doing knowing that in due season we will reap the harvest if we do season we will reap the harvest if we do season we will reap the harvest if we do not give up. We pray these things in not give up. We pray these things in not give up. We pray these things in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. Amen. Amen. Amen. Thank you for listening to this episode Thank you for listening to this episode Thank you for listening to this episode of the everyday pastor. We hope it has of the everyday pastor. We hope it has of the everyday pastor. We hope it has put some fresh wind in your sails. We'd put some fresh wind in your sails. We'd put some fresh wind in your sails. We'd encourage you to share it with another encourage you to share it with another encourage you to share it with another friend in ministry so that we can friend in ministry so that we can friend in ministry so that we can continue helping pastors find fresh joy continue helping pastors find fresh joy continue helping pastors find fresh joy >> [music] >> [music] >> [music] >> in the work of ministry. H.B., thanks >> in the work of ministry. H.B., thanks >> in the work of ministry. H.B., thanks for being with us. Thank you, brothers.

for being with us. Thank you, brothers. for being with us. Thank you, brothers. It was a joy to be with you. Thanks, It was a joy to be with you. Thanks, It was a joy to be with you. Thanks, H.B. Thanks, Matt.