Conversational Bridges to Evangelism [The Deep Dish - Ep. 24]

And they asked all the churches and the And they asked all the churches and the pastor, "Where are you weakest?" And pastor, "Where are you weakest?" And pastor, "Where are you weakest?" And they gave them, "Where do you most need they gave them, "Where do you most need they gave them, "Where do you most need help?" Every single church, top of the help?" Every single church, top of the help?" Every single church, top of the list, was evangelism. Number one, we list, was evangelism. Number one, we list, was evangelism. Number one, we don't know how. So, we need this is we don't know how. So, we need this is we don't know how. So, we need this is we need to start helping the church and need to start helping the church and need to start helping the church and helping believers. Now, it's it's easier helping believers. Now, it's it's easier helping believers. Now, it's it's easier than they think. [Music] [Music] Welcome to the Deep Dish, a podcast from Welcome to the Deep Dish, a podcast from Welcome to the Deep Dish, a podcast from the Gospel Coalition where we love the Gospel Coalition where we love the Gospel Coalition where we love having deep conversations about deep having deep conversations about deep having deep conversations about deep truths. I'm Melissa Krueger. I'm here truths. I'm Melissa Krueger. I'm here truths. I'm Melissa Krueger. I'm here with my friend and co-host Courtney with my friend and co-host Courtney with my friend and co-host Courtney Doctor. And today I'm so excited to be Doctor. And today I'm so excited to be Doctor. And today I'm so excited to be joined by our guest Becky Pippert. Um, I joined by our guest Becky Pippert. Um, I joined by our guest Becky Pippert. Um, I have to say I read your book Out of the have to say I read your book Out of the have to say I read your book Out of the Salt Shaker for the first time in Salt Shaker for the first time in Salt Shaker for the first time in college. So, that was in the '9s. And I college. So, that was in the '9s. And I college. So, that was in the '9s. And I went to my shelf this morning to see if went to my shelf this morning to see if went to my shelf this morning to see if I could find it. And Becky, I just want I could find it. And Becky, I just want I could find it. And Becky, I just want to hold this up. Can you see this copy?

to hold this up. Can you see this copy? to hold this up. Can you see this copy? Oh, wow. A long time ago. Oh, wow. A long time ago. Oh, wow. A long time ago. Oh, that's so cute. Oh, that's so cute. Oh, that's so cute. >> I can remember the things I learned in >> I can remember the things I learned in >> I can remember the things I learned in that book. So, it is just a joy to be that book. So, it is just a joy to be that book. So, it is just a joy to be here with you today. Oh, it is. We're so here with you today. Oh, it is. We're so here with you today. Oh, it is. We're so excited for this conversation. And out excited for this conversation. And out excited for this conversation. And out of the salt shaker and into the world of the salt shaker and into the world of the salt shaker and into the world was published in 1979. Did you say was published in 1979. Did you say was published in 1979. Did you say that's when you were in college, that's when you were in college, that's when you were in college, Melissa? Melissa? Melissa? >> I clearly was barely born in 1979, >> I clearly was barely born in 1979, >> I clearly was barely born in 1979, but Becky has been writing and teaching but Becky has been writing and teaching but Becky has been writing and teaching about evangelism um not only for many about evangelism um not only for many about evangelism um not only for many years, but also all over the world. We years, but also all over the world. We years, but also all over the world. We were even having a conversation before were even having a conversation before were even having a conversation before we hit record that she's headed to Spain we hit record that she's headed to Spain we hit record that she's headed to Spain um to continue to teach and equip and um to continue to teach and equip and um to continue to teach and equip and strengthen the church. And so, Becky, strengthen the church. And so, Becky, strengthen the church. And so, Becky, thank you for just joining us uh in this thank you for just joining us uh in this thank you for just joining us uh in this way, even in the midst of a move and a way, even in the midst of a move and a way, even in the midst of a move and a storm and everything else uh you have storm and everything else uh you have storm and everything else uh you have going on right now. Um could you start going on right now. Um could you start going on right now. Um could you start off by just telling us about the first off by just telling us about the first off by just telling us about the first time you remember sharing the gospel and time you remember sharing the gospel and time you remember sharing the gospel and what that did for you?

what that did for you? what that did for you? >> Oh, I remember it vividly. Um the first >> Oh, I remember it vividly. Um the first >> Oh, I remember it vividly. Um the first time I ever shared the gospel was with time I ever shared the gospel was with time I ever shared the gospel was with my parents and I had just come to the my parents and I had just come to the my parents and I had just come to the Lord. I was the first person in my Lord. I was the first person in my Lord. I was the first person in my family to come to Christ and it sent family to come to Christ and it sent family to come to Christ and it sent shock waves like I can't tell you. They shock waves like I can't tell you. They shock waves like I can't tell you. They just weren't quite sure what to do with just weren't quite sure what to do with just weren't quite sure what to do with me. and and my father was not a believer me. and and my father was not a believer me. and and my father was not a believer at all. My mother felt there was at all. My mother felt there was at all. My mother felt there was something up there somewhere. They something up there somewhere. They something up there somewhere. They weren't hostile. It just hadn't been a weren't hostile. It just hadn't been a weren't hostile. It just hadn't been a part of their upbringing. My part of their upbringing. My part of their upbringing. My grandparents hadn't gone to church. Uh grandparents hadn't gone to church. Uh grandparents hadn't gone to church. Uh my my first cousins, my aunts and my my first cousins, my aunts and my my first cousins, my aunts and uncles, I mean, there wasn't anybody. I uncles, I mean, there wasn't anybody. I uncles, I mean, there wasn't anybody. I was the first. So, I called my dad and was the first. So, I called my dad and was the first. So, I called my dad and said, he was at the office and I said, said, he was at the office and I said, said, he was at the office and I said, "Daddy, when you have a chance, there's "Daddy, when you have a chance, there's "Daddy, when you have a chance, there's something I really want to talk to you something I really want to talk to you something I really want to talk to you about." He came home immediately. I about." He came home immediately. I about." He came home immediately. I think he thought something bad and he think he thought something bad and he think he thought something bad and he came home and I went and the Lord had came home and I went and the Lord had came home and I went and the Lord had nudged me to do it. I did not want to do nudged me to do it. I did not want to do nudged me to do it. I did not want to do it. I was scared to death and I loved it. I was scared to death and I loved it. I was scared to death and I loved him. The motive in sharing my faith was him. The motive in sharing my faith was him. The motive in sharing my faith was love as it should always be no matter love as it should always be no matter love as it should always be no matter who you're talking to. But I just I was who you're talking to. But I just I was who you're talking to. But I just I was really nervous. But anyway, I just, you really nervous. But anyway, I just, you really nervous. But anyway, I just, you know, shared and said the most wonderful know, shared and said the most wonderful know, shared and said the most wonderful thing has happened and you're one of the thing has happened and you're one of the thing has happened and you're one of the most important people in my life and I most important people in my life and I most important people in my life and I wanted you to be the first to know.

wanted you to be the first to know. wanted you to be the first to know. which was a bit of a wasn't exactly which was a bit of a wasn't exactly which was a bit of a wasn't exactly true. I was scared to death to tell him. true. I was scared to death to tell him. true. I was scared to death to tell him. Anyway, he he was wonderful and said, Anyway, he he was wonderful and said, Anyway, he he was wonderful and said, >> "Yeah, I you know that that you know >> "Yeah, I you know that that you know >> "Yeah, I you know that that you know faith isn't a part of my life." What I faith isn't a part of my life." What I faith isn't a part of my life." What I didn't know, but he said, "Becky, I am didn't know, but he said, "Becky, I am didn't know, but he said, "Becky, I am honored you tell me. Told my mom to honored you tell me. Told my mom to honored you tell me. Told my mom to >> um what I didn't know is he was really >> um what I didn't know is he was really >> um what I didn't know is he was really worried and thought, "Oh, has she joined worried and thought, "Oh, has she joined worried and thought, "Oh, has she joined a cult? What is going on?" And I found a cult? What is going on?" And I found a cult? What is going on?" And I found this out a little bit later. They also this out a little bit later. They also this out a little bit later. They also watch me very very carefully because uh watch me very very carefully because uh watch me very very carefully because uh and it what is really funny is that he and it what is really funny is that he and it what is really funny is that he said um I really think you should tell said um I really think you should tell said um I really think you should tell your grandmother his mother who is a bit your grandmother his mother who is a bit your grandmother his mother who is a bit of a character. She and I'm from of a character. She and I'm from of a character. She and I'm from Champagne, Illinois, and she is that's Champagne, Illinois, and she is that's Champagne, Illinois, and she is that's where she was. And so I went to her and where she was. And so I went to her and where she was. And so I went to her and she before I could even tell her, she she before I could even tell her, she she before I could even tell her, she goes, "I understand you've got religion, goes, "I understand you've got religion, goes, "I understand you've got religion, you know." Wow. Oh my gosh. you know, you know." Wow. Oh my gosh. you know, you know." Wow. Oh my gosh. you know, and she goes, "Oh, honey, I just don't and she goes, "Oh, honey, I just don't and she goes, "Oh, honey, I just don't understand it. You're so bright.

understand it. You're so bright. understand it. You're so bright. You're such a good student." I go, You're such a good student." I go, You're such a good student." I go, "Grandmother, I didn't hang up my "Grandmother, I didn't hang up my "Grandmother, I didn't hang up my brains." And she goes, "Oh, honey, I brains." And she goes, "Oh, honey, I brains." And she goes, "Oh, honey, I know, but you were a cheerleader." know, but you were a cheerleader." know, but you were a cheerleader." >> Oh, that's amazing. >> Oh, that's amazing. >> Oh, that's amazing. >> I said, "Yeah, listen, Grandma, I >> I said, "Yeah, listen, Grandma, I >> I said, "Yeah, listen, Grandma, I didn't." I said, "I I you I haven't, didn't." I said, "I I you I haven't, didn't." I said, "I I you I haven't, you know, I don't hang up my brains. I you know, I don't hang up my brains. I you know, I don't hang up my brains. I haven't uh it's still me." And she goes, haven't uh it's still me." And she goes, haven't uh it's still me." And she goes, "Well, all I can say is too bad you "Well, all I can say is too bad you "Well, all I can say is too bad you didn't know your great didn't know your great didn't know your great greatgrandfather." And I now nobody in greatgrandfather." And I now nobody in greatgrandfather." And I now nobody in my family were believers. And I said, my family were believers. And I said, my family were believers. And I said, "Oh my goodness, was my great "Oh my goodness, was my great "Oh my goodness, was my great greatgrandfather a Christian?" She said, greatgrandfather a Christian?" She said, greatgrandfather a Christian?" She said, "Well, for heaven's sakes, Becky, he was "Well, for heaven's sakes, Becky, he was "Well, for heaven's sakes, Becky, he was a Boy Scout." a Boy Scout." a Boy Scout." >> Oh, that's amazing. >> Oh, that's amazing. >> Oh, that's amazing. >> Yeah. I was thinking maybe a slightly >> Yeah. I was thinking maybe a slightly >> Yeah. I was thinking maybe a slightly narrower definition than Boy Scouts of narrower definition than Boy Scouts of narrower definition than Boy Scouts of America. And I thought, "How do I America. And I thought, "How do I America. And I thought, "How do I explain this?" I said, "Well, like did explain this?" I said, "Well, like did explain this?" I said, "Well, like did he read the Bible and pray?" She goes, he read the Bible and pray?" She goes, he read the Bible and pray?" She goes, "Oh, I didn't say he was a fanatic." "Oh, I didn't say he was a fanatic." "Oh, I didn't say he was a fanatic." Now, that was my religious heritage. It Now, that was my religious heritage. It Now, that was my religious heritage. It wasn't that they were hostile, wasn't that they were hostile, wasn't that they were hostile, >> but didn't have a clue. And my dad was >> but didn't have a clue. And my dad was >> but didn't have a clue. And my dad was he was worried and um looked at me much he was worried and um looked at me much he was worried and um looked at me much more carefully than I realized. The more carefully than I realized. The more carefully than I realized. The amazing thing a couple of years later is amazing thing a couple of years later is amazing thing a couple of years later is he said, "Becky, I've watched you so he said, "Becky, I've watched you so he said, "Becky, I've watched you so carefully and I was afraid that oh kind carefully and I was afraid that oh kind carefully and I was afraid that oh kind of your natural exuberance and you were of your natural exuberance and you were of your natural exuberance and you were going to become weird and I thought going to become weird and I thought going to become weird and I thought you'd given up your brains, you know, you'd given up your brains, you know, you'd given up your brains, you know, and all that." And he says, "I have to and all that." And he says, "I have to and all that." And he says, "I have to tell you," and Lewis says something very

tell you," and Lewis says something very tell you," and Lewis says something very similar to this. He said, "The more I've similar to this. He said, "The more I've similar to this. He said, "The more I've watched you, the more I've realized watched you, the more I've realized watched you, the more I've realized you're more Becky than I could have ever you're more Becky than I could have ever you're more Becky than I could have ever imagined." imagined." imagined." >> Exactly. >> Exactly. >> Exactly. >> I think it's the best thing that ever >> I think it's the best thing that ever >> I think it's the best thing that ever happened to you. happened to you. happened to you. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> My dad heard me speak. My mom and my dad >> My dad heard me speak. My mom and my dad >> My dad heard me speak. My mom and my dad Well, my mom heard me speak many times, Well, my mom heard me speak many times, Well, my mom heard me speak many times, but my dad heard me speak one time and I but my dad heard me speak one time and I but my dad heard me speak one time and I was now, was now, was now, you know, I was doing Yeah. I was you know, I was doing Yeah. I was you know, I was doing Yeah. I was working with inner varity and and um as working with inner varity and and um as working with inner varity and and um as an evangelist and training uh people an evangelist and training uh people an evangelist and training uh people around the country and I was invited to around the country and I was invited to around the country and I was invited to speak to her bana a missionary speak to her bana a missionary speak to her bana a missionary convention. This is a huge thing for convention. This is a huge thing for convention. This is a huge thing for students. Now my mom and dad of course students. Now my mom and dad of course students. Now my mom and dad of course live in Champagne so I flew in to speak. live in Champagne so I flew in to speak. live in Champagne so I flew in to speak. Mom and dad were there and one of the Mom and dad were there and one of the Mom and dad were there and one of the things I learned and I would say this to things I learned and I would say this to things I learned and I would say this to those of you whose parents aren't those of you whose parents aren't those of you whose parents aren't believers yet. Be patient. Don't don't believers yet. Be patient. Don't don't believers yet. Be patient. Don't don't >> um don't push it down their throats. And >> um don't push it down their throats. And >> um don't push it down their throats. And above all, let them know how much how above all, let them know how much how above all, let them know how much how grateful you are that they were your grateful you are that they were your grateful you are that they were your parents, that you believe God chose them parents, that you believe God chose them parents, that you believe God chose them to be your parents. Because so often to be your parents. Because so often to be your parents. Because so often what they think is uh and and my mom and what they think is uh and and my mom and what they think is uh and and my mom and dad felt this way. Oh, I bet she's dad felt this way. Oh, I bet she's dad felt this way. Oh, I bet she's critical of me because I didn't raise critical of me because I didn't raise critical of me because I didn't raise her in faith. You you can't raise you her in faith. You you can't raise you her in faith. You you can't raise you can't give what you don't have, can't give what you don't have, can't give what you don't have, >> right?

>> right? >> right? >> But I began to realize I really needed >> But I began to realize I really needed >> But I began to realize I really needed to affirm them. Anyway, I'm speaking at to affirm them. Anyway, I'm speaking at to affirm them. Anyway, I'm speaking at Urbana Urbana Urbana and I come up now. It's 20,000 people. and I come up now. It's 20,000 people. and I come up now. It's 20,000 people. These are all students. And I said, These are all students. And I said, These are all students. And I said, there's something I want to say. First there's something I want to say. First there's something I want to say. First of all, I'm the only speaker at the of all, I'm the only speaker at the of all, I'm the only speaker at the Urbana Missionary Convention who um I Urbana Missionary Convention who um I Urbana Missionary Convention who um I can say welcome to my hometown. I can can say welcome to my hometown. I can can say welcome to my hometown. I can also say welcome to my alma mater. I did also say welcome to my alma mater. I did also say welcome to my alma mater. I did graduate work at the University of graduate work at the University of graduate work at the University of Illinois in English lit. But I'm also Illinois in English lit. But I'm also Illinois in English lit. But I'm also the only speaker whose parents are the only speaker whose parents are the only speaker whose parents are sitting in the auditorium right now. And sitting in the auditorium right now. And sitting in the auditorium right now. And I didn't know that they flashed a light I didn't know that they flashed a light I didn't know that they flashed a light on mom and dad and they were sitting in on mom and dad and they were sitting in on mom and dad and they were sitting in a special section for uh you know people a special section for uh you know people a special section for uh you know people that knew the speaker and there is a that knew the speaker and there is a that knew the speaker and there is a picture of dad looking at me and my picture of dad looking at me and my picture of dad looking at me and my looking at my dad looking at my dad looking at my dad >> that is just oh my gosh I cry every time >> that is just oh my gosh I cry every time >> that is just oh my gosh I cry every time I see the picture but I said I it's not I see the picture but I said I it's not I see the picture but I said I it's not probably the only time in my life I'm probably the only time in my life I'm probably the only time in my life I'm going to be able to say before you going to be able to say before you going to be able to say before you before 20,000 people and the Lord I am before 20,000 people and the Lord I am before 20,000 people and the Lord I am so grateful that I have my mom and dad so grateful that I have my mom and dad so grateful that I have my mom and dad as my parents. God chose them. I as my parents. God chose them. I as my parents. God chose them. I couldn't be more grateful. I love them couldn't be more grateful. I love them couldn't be more grateful. I love them so much.

so much. so much. And the entire 20,000 students rose to And the entire 20,000 students rose to And the entire 20,000 students rose to their feet and applauded my parents. It their feet and applauded my parents. It their feet and applauded my parents. It took a long time. Every one of them came took a long time. Every one of them came took a long time. Every one of them came to the Lord. It took 30 years for my to the Lord. It took 30 years for my to the Lord. It took 30 years for my dad. dad. dad. >> 30 years later, I led my dad to the >> 30 years later, I led my dad to the >> 30 years later, I led my dad to the Lord. Even my grandparents came to the Lord. Even my grandparents came to the Lord. Even my grandparents came to the Lord. But it takes time. Lord. But it takes time. Lord. But it takes time. >> That's amazing. >> That's amazing. >> That's amazing. >> Anyway, that was my first. >> Anyway, that was my first. >> Anyway, that was my first. >> I love that. I remember being in >> I love that. I remember being in >> I love that. I remember being in seminary. We had to do a thing called seminary. We had to do a thing called seminary. We had to do a thing called the Gen Genog or Geneogram where you the Gen Genog or Geneogram where you the Gen Genog or Geneogram where you kind of trace through the generations kind of trace through the generations kind of trace through the generations different things that might cause different things that might cause different things that might cause brokenness. So maybe trace divorce brokenness. So maybe trace divorce brokenness. So maybe trace divorce through the generations, trace addiction through the generations, trace addiction through the generations, trace addiction through the generations, trace, you through the generations, trace, you through the generations, trace, you know, um arangements through like all know, um arangements through like all know, um arangements through like all these different things. these different things. these different things. >> And as you you see how the sins of the >> And as you you see how the sins of the >> And as you you see how the sins of the fathers can be passed down, right? fathers can be passed down, right? fathers can be passed down, right? things like brokenness can be get things like brokenness can be get things like brokenness can be get brokenness and but what I realized as I brokenness and but what I realized as I brokenness and but what I realized as I did this is the only thing that goes did this is the only thing that goes did this is the only thing that goes backwards through the generations is the backwards through the generations is the backwards through the generations is the gospel and it brings healing and it's gospel and it brings healing and it's gospel and it brings healing and it's incredible and so for anybody listening incredible and so for anybody listening incredible and so for anybody listening who's saying you know I I am not just who's saying you know I I am not just who's saying you know I I am not just trying to pass my faith on I'm trying to trying to pass my faith on I'm trying to trying to pass my faith on I'm trying to pass my faith back um Becky your pass my faith back um Becky your pass my faith back um Becky your testimony is encouraging in that I saw testimony is encouraging in that I saw testimony is encouraging in that I saw it uh as my classmates and I did these it uh as my classmates and I did these it uh as my classmates and I did these geneograms and it's just it's the power geneograms and it's just it's the power geneograms and it's just it's the power of the gospel it can of the gospel it can of the gospel it can and it brings healing. If sin comes and it brings healing. If sin comes and it brings healing. If sin comes down, you know, healing and and the down, you know, healing and and the down, you know, healing and and the gospel goes um back. But um I want to gospel goes um back. But um I want to gospel goes um back. But um I want to start Okay. And and Melissa, I want to start Okay. And and Melissa, I want to start Okay. And and Melissa, I want to get your thoughts on this, too. We're get your thoughts on this, too. We're get your thoughts on this, too. We're talking about having these. So, like talking about having these. So, like talking about having these. So, like what you had with your dad, that was the

what you had with your dad, that was the what you had with your dad, that was the first time you had what we would now say first time you had what we would now say first time you had what we would now say is an evangelistic conversation, which is an evangelistic conversation, which is an evangelistic conversation, which is kind of a fancy way of saying we're is kind of a fancy way of saying we're is kind of a fancy way of saying we're just talking to somebody about our faith just talking to somebody about our faith just talking to somebody about our faith and about who Christ is to us and what and about who Christ is to us and what and about who Christ is to us and what he's done. Um, but those conversations he's done. Um, but those conversations he's done. Um, but those conversations can be um can be misunderstood and we're can be um can be misunderstood and we're can be um can be misunderstood and we're going to talk about how to even start going to talk about how to even start going to talk about how to even start them and how to be comfortable with them and how to be comfortable with them and how to be comfortable with them. But what how would you even just them. But what how would you even just them. But what how would you even just define that both of you? Uh, Melissa, define that both of you? Uh, Melissa, define that both of you? Uh, Melissa, I'll start with you. Just this I'll start with you. Just this I'll start with you. Just this evangelistic conversation. evangelistic conversation. evangelistic conversation. >> Well, I define it a little differently >> Well, I define it a little differently >> Well, I define it a little differently now because of you, Courtney. So, I now because of you, Courtney. So, I now because of you, Courtney. So, I mean, I'm gonna I'm gonna probably push mean, I'm gonna I'm gonna probably push mean, I'm gonna I'm gonna probably push it push it back on on you, but um it push it back on on you, but um it push it back on on you, but um because I I found Courtney and I Becky because I I found Courtney and I Becky because I I found Courtney and I Becky were one time on a panel and she had were one time on a panel and she had were one time on a panel and she had this um three ways of thinking about um this um three ways of thinking about um this um three ways of thinking about um different parts of not even sharing our different parts of not even sharing our different parts of not even sharing our faith. I don't tell you say it, faith. I don't tell you say it, faith. I don't tell you say it, Courtney, because you're going to say it Courtney, because you're going to say it Courtney, because you're going to say it better. better. better. >> Okay. Well then, okay. So, I'm a little >> Okay. Well then, okay. So, I'm a little >> Okay. Well then, okay. So, I'm a little intimidated too in front of Becky, but intimidated too in front of Becky, but intimidated too in front of Becky, but Becky, you can push back and tell me Becky, you can push back and tell me Becky, you can push back and tell me what you think. So, I was um really what you think. So, I was um really what you think. So, I was um really pulling apart this idea of and it came pulling apart this idea of and it came pulling apart this idea of and it came out of a Sunday school class I was out of a Sunday school class I was out of a Sunday school class I was teaching. I said, "Who's who has shared teaching. I said, "Who's who has shared teaching. I said, "Who's who has shared their faith this week?" And almost their faith this week?" And almost their faith this week?" And almost everybody's hand went up and I was like, everybody's hand went up and I was like, everybody's hand went up and I was like, "What?" You know, and then I started "What?" You know, and then I started "What?" You know, and then I started getting examples of it and it was like, getting examples of it and it was like, getting examples of it and it was like, "I smiled at the grocery store checkout "I smiled at the grocery store checkout "I smiled at the grocery store checkout clerk or I did this good." And I was clerk or I did this good." And I was clerk or I did this good." And I was like, "Well, I don't think that's like, "Well, I don't think that's like, "Well, I don't think that's exactly what I'm talking about." And so, exactly what I'm talking about." And so, exactly what I'm talking about." And so, um, so I started thinking about the um, so I started thinking about the um, so I started thinking about the Abrahamic blessing and that he was Abrahamic blessing and that he was Abrahamic blessing and that he was blessed to be a blessing. Now, we know blessed to be a blessing. Now, we know blessed to be a blessing. Now, we know that that ultimate blessing is Christ that that ultimate blessing is Christ that that ultimate blessing is Christ himself, but but we are still called to himself, but but we are still called to himself, but but we are still called to just be a blessing. Um, and and thinking

just be a blessing. Um, and and thinking just be a blessing. Um, and and thinking about that in terms of, you know, I can about that in terms of, you know, I can about that in terms of, you know, I can pick up trash on the side of the road. pick up trash on the side of the road. pick up trash on the side of the road. That's a blessing. That's that's That's a blessing. That's that's That's a blessing. That's that's creation care. I can take a meal to a creation care. I can take a meal to a creation care. I can take a meal to a homeless shelter. That is that is caring homeless shelter. That is that is caring homeless shelter. That is that is caring for the least of these. Like, there are for the least of these. Like, there are for the least of these. Like, there are places that I can just simply be a places that I can just simply be a places that I can just simply be a blessing. But then I started thinking blessing. But then I started thinking blessing. But then I started thinking more about outreach as sustainable more about outreach as sustainable more about outreach as sustainable relationships. So if I take a meal to a relationships. So if I take a meal to a relationships. So if I take a meal to a homeless shelter once, that's a homeless shelter once, that's a homeless shelter once, that's a blessing. If I go every week for 3 years blessing. If I go every week for 3 years blessing. If I go every week for 3 years and I start having conversations with and I start having conversations with and I start having conversations with people, that's outreach. I'm actually people, that's outreach. I'm actually people, that's outreach. I'm actually building real relationships with people. building real relationships with people. building real relationships with people. And then it's those relationships that And then it's those relationships that And then it's those relationships that are usually the places that we can walk are usually the places that we can walk are usually the places that we can walk across the bridge from this real life across the bridge from this real life across the bridge from this real life relationship and actually do what I relationship and actually do what I relationship and actually do what I would call evangelism because evangelism would call evangelism because evangelism would call evangelism because evangelism has content. we have to you if we're not has content. we have to you if we're not has content. we have to you if we're not using words, right? If we're not talking using words, right? If we're not talking using words, right? If we're not talking about sin and salvation and Jesus and about sin and salvation and Jesus and about sin and salvation and Jesus and and the father sending the son for our and the father sending the son for our and the father sending the son for our sake, then I don't think we've actually sake, then I don't think we've actually sake, then I don't think we've actually done evangelism. Um, and so parsing done evangelism. Um, and so parsing done evangelism. Um, and so parsing those things out for me made me more those things out for me made me more those things out for me made me more intentional about the things I was intentional about the things I was intentional about the things I was doing. They're all needed. They're all doing. They're all needed. They're all doing. They're all needed. They're all necessary. They're all beautiful, but it necessary. They're all beautiful, but it necessary. They're all beautiful, but it was really helpful. So, how would you was really helpful. So, how would you was really helpful. So, how would you how would you push back or redefine how would you push back or redefine how would you push back or redefine that?

that? that? >> Yeah. No, I think that um there's three >> Yeah. No, I think that um there's three >> Yeah. No, I think that um there's three aspects as I see it to biblical aspects as I see it to biblical aspects as I see it to biblical evangelism. And the first is exactly evangelism. And the first is exactly evangelism. And the first is exactly what you're talking about. what you're talking about. what you're talking about. And that is when you look at Jesus, when And that is when you look at Jesus, when And that is when you look at Jesus, when you look at the early church, um uh it you look at the early church, um uh it you look at the early church, um uh it is the the way in is love. The way in is is the the way in is love. The way in is is the the way in is love. The way in is is wanting to really get to know this is wanting to really get to know this is wanting to really get to know this person. Now, I'm talking about personal person. Now, I'm talking about personal person. Now, I'm talking about personal evangelism. one to one personal evangelism. one to one personal evangelism. one to one personal evangelism. There's other forms of evangelism. There's other forms of evangelism. There's other forms of evangelism, but I'm talking about evangelism, but I'm talking about evangelism, but I'm talking about personal. It is just so critical that we personal. It is just so critical that we personal. It is just so critical that we when you watch Jesus, he's he's asking when you watch Jesus, he's he's asking when you watch Jesus, he's he's asking questions. He's all he asks questions. questions. He's all he asks questions. questions. He's all he asks questions. He listens. He shows respect. He listens. He shows respect. He listens. He shows respect. And what I find so um I I was asked on And what I find so um I I was asked on And what I find so um I I was asked on recently on a uh national radio show and recently on a uh national radio show and recently on a uh national radio show and they said, "Becky, the thing that we're they said, "Becky, the thing that we're they said, "Becky, the thing that we're asked all the time is how do we get the asked all the time is how do we get the asked all the time is how do we get the conversation more quickly onto the conversation more quickly onto the conversation more quickly onto the gospel? How how can we bring them onto gospel? How how can we bring them onto gospel? How how can we bring them onto our our way of thinking? What can we our our way of thinking? What can we our our way of thinking? What can we do?" And I said, and the answer is the do?" And I said, and the answer is the do?" And I said, and the answer is the way to get, if you want to get people way to get, if you want to get people way to get, if you want to get people interested in faith, to get them interested in faith, to get them interested in faith, to get them interested in what you're thinking, interested in what you're thinking, interested in what you're thinking, >> the way to do it is get on their turf >> the way to do it is get on their turf >> the way to do it is get on their turf first. That's a big mistake we make in first. That's a big mistake we make in first. That's a big mistake we make in evangelism. We want to get them over on evangelism. We want to get them over on evangelism. We want to get them over on our side. And we don't know them.

our side. And we don't know them. our side. And we don't know them. >> We don't know what they're looking for. >> We don't know what they're looking for. >> We don't know what they're looking for. We don't know what their interests are. We don't know what their interests are. We don't know what their interests are. We don't know where their losses are. We We don't know where their losses are. We We don't know where their losses are. We don't know what are the treasures of don't know what are the treasures of don't know what are the treasures of their heart. their heart. their heart. um we have to demonstrate a genuine um we have to demonstrate a genuine um we have to demonstrate a genuine interest. And so one of the ways that interest. And so one of the ways that interest. And so one of the ways that starts is find a common ground. What do starts is find a common ground. What do starts is find a common ground. What do you have in common just as human beings? you have in common just as human beings? you have in common just as human beings? What do you have in common? And what What do you have in common? And what What do you have in common? And what usually happens as as as trust is usually happens as as as trust is usually happens as as as trust is established and and you've found ways established and and you've found ways established and and you've found ways you genuinely connect, they're usually you genuinely connect, they're usually you genuinely connect, they're usually much more open to talking about their much more open to talking about their much more open to talking about their beliefs, their views. And then that can beliefs, their views. And then that can beliefs, their views. And then that can move that moves into what I think is the move that moves into what I think is the move that moves into what I think is the second aspect of evangelism. First, it's second aspect of evangelism. First, it's second aspect of evangelism. First, it's the model of love, of compassion, of the model of love, of compassion, of the model of love, of compassion, of listening, listening, listening, >> of showing respect, genuinely wanting to >> of showing respect, genuinely wanting to >> of showing respect, genuinely wanting to get to know that person and liking them. get to know that person and liking them. get to know that person and liking them. >> Second thing though, because if they >> Second thing though, because if they >> Second thing though, because if they sense they're just an evangelistic sense they're just an evangelistic sense they're just an evangelistic project, it it'll never work. Yeah. project, it it'll never work. Yeah. project, it it'll never work. Yeah. Okay. The second thing though is is love Okay. The second thing though is is love Okay. The second thing though is is love isn't enough. As important as love is, isn't enough. As important as love is, isn't enough. As important as love is, we are called to uh declare the truth.

we are called to uh declare the truth. we are called to uh declare the truth. We are called to communicate the truth. We are called to communicate the truth. We are called to communicate the truth. And that's where we're so weak. We don't And that's where we're so weak. We don't And that's where we're so weak. We don't know. Um we're we're I think we're know. Um we're we're I think we're know. Um we're we're I think we're pretty good at knowing how to pretty good at knowing how to pretty good at knowing how to demonstrate love. Uh I think we're demonstrate love. Uh I think we're demonstrate love. Uh I think we're really weak on knowing. But how do you really weak on knowing. But how do you really weak on knowing. But how do you communicate the truth? And how do you do communicate the truth? And how do you do communicate the truth? And how do you do it in a way that is natural that doesn't it in a way that is natural that doesn't it in a way that is natural that doesn't seem like you're um you know dropping an seem like you're um you know dropping an seem like you're um you know dropping an abomb into the conversation? Oh, you abomb into the conversation? Oh, you abomb into the conversation? Oh, you like uh so you're interested in you know like uh so you're interested in you know like uh so you're interested in you know whatever. What do you think Jesus thinks whatever. What do you think Jesus thinks whatever. What do you think Jesus thinks about that? about that? about that? >> It's like this bait and switch. >> It's like this bait and switch. >> It's like this bait and switch. >> We need to learn. And that's why I think >> We need to learn. And that's why I think >> We need to learn. And that's why I think training is so important in equipping. training is so important in equipping. training is so important in equipping. How do we do that naturally? How can we How do we do that naturally? How can we How do we do that naturally? How can we without being manipulative really have without being manipulative really have without being manipulative really have an understanding of what this person is an understanding of what this person is an understanding of what this person is interested in? What are their questions interested in? What are their questions interested in? What are their questions and then being able to raise questions and then being able to raise questions and then being able to raise questions ourself? Raising questions is absolutely ourself? Raising questions is absolutely ourself? Raising questions is absolutely critical. So it is the model of love. It critical. So it is the model of love. It critical. So it is the model of love. It is the message. How do we communicate it is the message. How do we communicate it is the message. How do we communicate it well and communicate in a way in well and communicate in a way in well and communicate in a way in language they can understand? And then language they can understand? And then language they can understand? And then thirdly it's invitational. And again, I thirdly it's invitational. And again, I thirdly it's invitational. And again, I think we're fairly weak on that spot, think we're fairly weak on that spot, think we're fairly weak on that spot, too. When at the right time, in the too. When at the right time, in the too. When at the right time, in the right place, we can say, is there any right place, we can say, is there any right place, we can say, is there any reason why you couldn't invite Jesus reason why you couldn't invite Jesus reason why you couldn't invite Jesus into your life? But that that's going to into your life? But that that's going to into your life? But that that's going to take time. That usually it can happen in take time. That usually it can happen in take time. That usually it can happen in a single conversation, but it doesn't a single conversation, but it doesn't a single conversation, but it doesn't usually. So, I think those are love, usually. So, I think those are love, usually. So, I think those are love, truth, uh, and and the invitation, truth, uh, and and the invitation, truth, uh, and and the invitation, >> which is the power of the Holy Spirit.

>> which is the power of the Holy Spirit. >> which is the power of the Holy Spirit. So, it's the power of God's love, the So, it's the power of God's love, the So, it's the power of God's love, the power of God's truth, the power of the power of God's truth, the power of the power of God's truth, the power of the Holy Spirit that helps us bring a person Holy Spirit that helps us bring a person Holy Spirit that helps us bring a person to be able to ask, would they be to be able to ask, would they be to be able to ask, would they be interested in coming to Christ? Becky, interested in coming to Christ? Becky, interested in coming to Christ? Becky, one thing I love that you were one thing I love that you were one thing I love that you were mentioning is that evangelism is mentioning is that evangelism is mentioning is that evangelism is something we actually grow in and we get something we actually grow in and we get something we actually grow in and we get better at and we learn because I think better at and we learn because I think better at and we learn because I think sometimes we can view it as this sometimes we can view it as this sometimes we can view it as this category for professionals, you know, category for professionals, you know, category for professionals, you know, like, oh, those people who are like, oh, those people who are like, oh, those people who are evangelists. And I always love the evangelists. And I always love the evangelists. And I always love the examples of sewing seeds and fishing in examples of sewing seeds and fishing in examples of sewing seeds and fishing in scripture because these are these two scripture because these are these two scripture because these are these two themes that come up when we talk about themes that come up when we talk about themes that come up when we talk about sharing our faith. And my husband loves sharing our faith. And my husband loves sharing our faith. And my husband loves to fish and I love to garden. Um, and to fish and I love to garden. Um, and to fish and I love to garden. Um, and here's the thing. I I think it is really here's the thing. I I think it is really here's the thing. I I think it is really interesting because these are both interesting because these are both interesting because these are both things we enjoy doing and they're things we enjoy doing and they're things we enjoy doing and they're hopeful things. So, we don't go into hopeful things. So, we don't go into hopeful things. So, we don't go into them miserable. We go into them them miserable. We go into them them miserable. We go into them expectant. And my husband can fish all expectant. And my husband can fish all expectant. And my husband can fish all day and catch literally nothing. And day and catch literally nothing. And day and catch literally nothing. And he's like, "I had a great day." you he's like, "I had a great day." you he's like, "I had a great day." you know, it was so fun getting to do this. know, it was so fun getting to do this. know, it was so fun getting to do this. And I think sometimes we view evangelism And I think sometimes we view evangelism And I think sometimes we view evangelism with this huge weight of like I've got with this huge weight of like I've got with this huge weight of like I've got to do this thing. Um a and so I want to to do this thing. Um a and so I want to to do this thing. Um a and so I want to talk about that a little bit, but I also talk about that a little bit, but I also talk about that a little bit, but I also want to talk about how we learn to get want to talk about how we learn to get want to talk about how we learn to get better at it because the reality is better at it because the reality is better at it because the reality is every year I garden I get a little every year I garden I get a little every year I garden I get a little better. I But first I got to sew the better. I But first I got to sew the better. I But first I got to sew the seeds and then I learn stuff. Every year seeds and then I learn stuff. Every year seeds and then I learn stuff. Every year I learn a little bit new stuff.

I learn a little bit new stuff. I learn a little bit new stuff. >> He has gotten to be a better fisherman >> He has gotten to be a better fisherman >> He has gotten to be a better fisherman because he learns stuff. He's like, "Oh, because he learns stuff. He's like, "Oh, because he learns stuff. He's like, "Oh, you know what? I'm going to catch a lot you know what? I'm going to catch a lot you know what? I'm going to catch a lot more in the fall than I am in the summer more in the fall than I am in the summer more in the fall than I am in the summer because it's just too hot." How have as because it's just too hot." How have as because it's just too hot." How have as you have walked this pathway of you have walked this pathway of you have walked this pathway of evangelism, as you have shared your evangelism, as you have shared your evangelism, as you have shared your faith over and over and over, what are a faith over and over and over, what are a faith over and over and over, what are a few things we can learn from your few things we can learn from your few things we can learn from your experience? What would you pass on to us experience? What would you pass on to us experience? What would you pass on to us and say, "Hey, this is the most hopeful and say, "Hey, this is the most hopeful and say, "Hey, this is the most hopeful way you can live. Go forward. This is a way you can live. Go forward. This is a way you can live. Go forward. This is a great skill to learn. Don't be great skill to learn. Don't be great skill to learn. Don't be intimidated by it, but here are some intimidated by it, but here are some intimidated by it, but here are some things that might help you as you're things that might help you as you're things that might help you as you're sewing seeds and going fishing. sewing seeds and going fishing. sewing seeds and going fishing. >> Right. Wonderful question. You know, my >> Right. Wonderful question. You know, my >> Right. Wonderful question. You know, my husband and I do evangelism training husband and I do evangelism training husband and I do evangelism training conferences all over the world. We have conferences all over the world. We have conferences all over the world. We have and we've lived in different places. We and we've lived in different places. We and we've lived in different places. We were in the UK and Europe for seven were in the UK and Europe for seven were in the UK and Europe for seven years right before CO. So, got a real years right before CO. So, got a real years right before CO. So, got a real good understanding of that neck of the good understanding of that neck of the good understanding of that neck of the woods. But we've been everywhere. Here's woods. But we've been everywhere. Here's woods. But we've been everywhere. Here's the amazing thing. when you ask about the amazing thing. when you ask about the amazing thing. when you ask about all right what is it that makes all right what is it that makes all right what is it that makes evangelism so difficult it's not that evangelism so difficult it's not that evangelism so difficult it's not that you know it really isn't as hard as you know it really isn't as hard as you know it really isn't as hard as you're making it they all say the same you're making it they all say the same you're making it they all say the same thing you would think with all these thing you would think with all these thing you would think with all these different cultures what do we hear all different cultures what do we hear all different cultures what do we hear all the time and this is some of the things the time and this is some of the things the time and this is some of the things we address in exactly your question how we address in exactly your question how we address in exactly your question how do we help uh believers to become more do we help uh believers to become more do we help uh believers to become more comfortable because I think it is really comfortable because I think it is really comfortable because I think it is really important to get equipping it helps us important to get equipping it helps us important to get equipping it helps us so much all right here's one what are so much all right here's one what are so much all right here's one what are some of the fears that they some of the fears that they some of the fears that they I always get this. What if they ask me a I always get this. What if they ask me a I always get this. What if they ask me a question I can't answer? Like that's

question I can't answer? Like that's question I can't answer? Like that's just, oh my gosh, what do we do? And I just, oh my gosh, what do we do? And I just, oh my gosh, what do we do? And I say, well, what did Jesus do when he was say, well, what did Jesus do when he was say, well, what did Jesus do when he was asked a question he couldn't answer? asked a question he couldn't answer? asked a question he couldn't answer? They looked kind of like shocked. And I They looked kind of like shocked. And I They looked kind of like shocked. And I say, Jesus was asked, um, when are you say, Jesus was asked, um, when are you say, Jesus was asked, um, when are you going to return? And he said, I don't going to return? And he said, I don't going to return? And he said, I don't know. Only the father knows that. I know. Only the father knows that. I know. Only the father knows that. I don't know. But if Jesus if we were if don't know. But if Jesus if we were if don't know. But if Jesus if we were if Jesus were going to speak the way we do, Jesus were going to speak the way we do, Jesus were going to speak the way we do, he would have said, "Oh, I don't know. he would have said, "Oh, I don't know. he would have said, "Oh, I don't know. Please don't tell anybody. I didn't Please don't tell anybody. I didn't Please don't tell anybody. I didn't know. Oh, this is so embarrassing. I know. Oh, this is so embarrassing. I know. Oh, this is so embarrassing. I didn't know." Jesus is such a model for didn't know." Jesus is such a model for didn't know." Jesus is such a model for how we go, how we do it. And if we don't how we go, how we do it. And if we don't how we go, how we do it. And if we don't know the answer to the question, what do know the answer to the question, what do know the answer to the question, what do we say? That's a fantastic question. I we say? That's a fantastic question. I we say? That's a fantastic question. I haven't a clue what the answer is. I am haven't a clue what the answer is. I am haven't a clue what the answer is. I am so glad God brought you into my life to so glad God brought you into my life to so glad God brought you into my life to sharpen me. I want to find out. You sharpen me. I want to find out. You sharpen me. I want to find out. You know, so often we think that unbelievers know, so often we think that unbelievers know, so often we think that unbelievers just want to, you know, devour us, just want to, you know, devour us, just want to, you know, devour us, gobble us up, and and in fact, I think gobble us up, and and in fact, I think gobble us up, and and in fact, I think they're looking for authenticity.

they're looking for authenticity. they're looking for authenticity. And for people that are real and say, And for people that are real and say, And for people that are real and say, "Wow, that that's a great question. I "Wow, that that's a great question. I "Wow, that that's a great question. I don't know." Another thing I always hear don't know." Another thing I always hear don't know." Another thing I always hear is, "It's not my gift. I can't do it. I is, "It's not my gift. I can't do it. I is, "It's not my gift. I can't do it. I do not have the gift of the evangelist." do not have the gift of the evangelist." do not have the gift of the evangelist." And I'm sure they're right. They could And I'm sure they're right. They could And I'm sure they're right. They could very well be right. But is that the very well be right. But is that the very well be right. But is that the point that we have to have the gift of point that we have to have the gift of point that we have to have the gift of the evangelist or I'll hear I'm the evangelist or I'll hear I'm the evangelist or I'll hear I'm introverted. I'm not extroverted like introverted. I'm not extroverted like introverted. I'm not extroverted like you. Uh and I don't have the gift and I you. Uh and I don't have the gift and I you. Uh and I don't have the gift and I couldn't possibly do it. What did Jesus couldn't possibly do it. What did Jesus couldn't possibly do it. What did Jesus say when he gave the great commission? say when he gave the great commission? say when he gave the great commission? Did he say go ye therefore all you Did he say go ye therefore all you Did he say go ye therefore all you extroverts, extroverts, extroverts, all you scripture memory buffs, all of all you scripture memory buffs, all of all you scripture memory buffs, all of you with great communication skills and you with great communication skills and you with great communication skills and knowledgeable in apologetics? Um, and knowledgeable in apologetics? Um, and knowledgeable in apologetics? Um, and all you clergy, okay? And all you all you clergy, okay? And all you all you clergy, okay? And all you Baptists, go and make disciples. Baptists, go and make disciples. Baptists, go and make disciples. >> All you smart former cheerleaders. Yeah. >> All you smart former cheerleaders. Yeah. >> All you smart former cheerleaders. Yeah. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. But the rest of you, listen, just >> Yeah. But the rest of you, listen, just >> Yeah. But the rest of you, listen, just hang out. Sing some hymns. I'll be back. hang out. Sing some hymns. I'll be back. hang out. Sing some hymns. I'll be back. Jesus says it has nothing to do with Jesus says it has nothing to do with Jesus says it has nothing to do with gifts, gifts, gifts, with personality, temperaments, but he with personality, temperaments, but he with personality, temperaments, but he says, "I'm with you. You abide me. I'm says, "I'm with you. You abide me. I'm says, "I'm with you. You abide me. I'm the greatest evangelist. I am the great the greatest evangelist. I am the great the greatest evangelist. I am the great evangel and I abide with you. I'll use evangel and I abide with you. I'll use evangel and I abide with you. I'll use you just as you are.

you just as you are. you just as you are. We can do a sigh of relief because it We can do a sigh of relief because it We can do a sigh of relief because it isn't a magic formula. It isn't a a isn't a magic formula. It isn't a a isn't a magic formula. It isn't a a combination of of the right gift and the combination of of the right gift and the combination of of the right gift and the right temperament. Closely related to right temperament. Closely related to right temperament. Closely related to this, I think is and I hear this more this, I think is and I hear this more this, I think is and I hear this more than anything else in any part of the than anything else in any part of the than anything else in any part of the world. Becky, I really and I believe world. Becky, I really and I believe world. Becky, I really and I believe them. I really do want to share my them. I really do want to share my them. I really do want to share my faith. I do. There's so many people I faith. I do. There's so many people I faith. I do. There's so many people I want to come know the Lord, but I can't. want to come know the Lord, but I can't. want to come know the Lord, but I can't. I hear this all the time when I'm I'm I hear this all the time when I'm I'm I hear this all the time when I'm I'm giving talks in our uh conferences. Why giving talks in our uh conferences. Why giving talks in our uh conferences. Why can't you I can't. And I go be and they can't you I can't. And I go be and they can't you I can't. And I go be and they always say because I'm inadequate. And I always say because I'm inadequate. And I always say because I'm inadequate. And I go, go, go, >> well, of course you're inadequate. >> well, of course you're inadequate. >> well, of course you're inadequate. You're in the I'm inadequate. Everybody You're in the I'm inadequate. Everybody You're in the I'm inadequate. Everybody is inadequate. What does the Bible keep is inadequate. What does the Bible keep is inadequate. What does the Bible keep saying over and over again? There's a saying over and over again? There's a saying over and over again? There's a very famous journalist who recently came very famous journalist who recently came very famous journalist who recently came to Christ and he said when he was to Christ and he said when he was to Christ and he said when he was reading the Bible he read it twice reading the Bible he read it twice reading the Bible he read it twice straight through and he said two things straight through and he said two things straight through and he said two things really struck me that God over and over really struck me that God over and over really struck me that God over and over again what we learn is I'm God and again what we learn is I'm God and again what we learn is I'm God and you're not and if you can get that you're not and if you can get that you're not and if you can get that straight you know if you can realize straight you know if you can realize straight you know if you can realize you're not God but you lean on God you you're not God but you lean on God you you're not God but you lean on God you depend on God depend on God depend on God >> uh and you need to move and depend on >> uh and you need to move and depend on >> uh and you need to move and depend on the power of the Holy Spirit where do we the power of the Holy Spirit where do we the power of the Holy Spirit where do we see this so clearly Paul and Paul, see this so clearly Paul and Paul, see this so clearly Paul and Paul, God is glorified in our weakness. And God is glorified in our weakness. And God is glorified in our weakness. And when Paul went and now Jesus is in when Paul went and now Jesus is in when Paul went and now Jesus is in heaven and Paul went, "Take away my heaven and Paul went, "Take away my heaven and Paul went, "Take away my throne in the flesh. I can't stand it. I

throne in the flesh. I can't stand it. I throne in the flesh. I can't stand it. I don't like being weak. I I please take don't like being weak. I I please take don't like being weak. I I please take it away." And Jesus says, "No, I'm not it away." And Jesus says, "No, I'm not it away." And Jesus says, "No, I'm not going to take it away going to take it away going to take it away >> because my my grace is manifested in >> because my my grace is manifested in >> because my my grace is manifested in your weakness. I I can take your your weakness. I I can take your your weakness. I I can take your weakness and take your inadequacy weakness and take your inadequacy weakness and take your inadequacy and I can move in you in ways you can't and I can move in you in ways you can't and I can move in you in ways you can't even imagine. Paul goes, "Well, all even imagine. Paul goes, "Well, all even imagine. Paul goes, "Well, all right then. I'm not going to be ashamed right then. I'm not going to be ashamed right then. I'm not going to be ashamed of my weakness. I I'm going to celebrate of my weakness. I I'm going to celebrate of my weakness. I I'm going to celebrate it." That's Do you know the first it." That's Do you know the first it." That's Do you know the first qualification for being used by God? We qualification for being used by God? We qualification for being used by God? We need to celebrate our inadequacy, not be need to celebrate our inadequacy, not be need to celebrate our inadequacy, not be ashamed of it. ashamed of it. ashamed of it. >> Celebrate. God wants to use us as we are >> Celebrate. God wants to use us as we are >> Celebrate. God wants to use us as we are with questions we can't answer with with with questions we can't answer with with with questions we can't answer with with uh not um being insecure or afraid or uh not um being insecure or afraid or uh not um being insecure or afraid or God will use us as we are and that is God will use us as we are and that is God will use us as we are and that is the way now there are skills we can the way now there are skills we can the way now there are skills we can learn and we can keep getting better we learn and we can keep getting better we learn and we can keep getting better we can get better listeners that's in the can get better listeners that's in the can get better listeners that's in the first what's the first part we need to first what's the first part we need to first what's the first part we need to demonstrate love respect be better demonstrate love respect be better demonstrate love respect be better listeners ask good questions etc and listeners ask good questions etc and listeners ask good questions etc and that's one part part of evangelism that's one part part of evangelism that's one part part of evangelism training. But there's a second part. How training. But there's a second part. How training. But there's a second part. How what is the gospel and how can we what is the gospel and how can we what is the gospel and how can we understand it and then connect it, understand it and then connect it, understand it and then connect it, communicate it in language they will communicate it in language they will communicate it in language they will understand? How do you talk about sin understand? How do you talk about sin understand? How do you talk about sin for instance in a culture that doesn't for instance in a culture that doesn't for instance in a culture that doesn't believe in sin? We can talk about that

believe in sin? We can talk about that believe in sin? We can talk about that in a minute. But how do we communicate in a minute. But how do we communicate in a minute. But how do we communicate the gospel? But also, how do we take the gospel? But also, how do we take the gospel? But also, how do we take what the gospel offers and tie it to the what the gospel offers and tie it to the what the gospel offers and tie it to the person's need? Look at John John 4, the person's need? Look at John John 4, the person's need? Look at John John 4, the woman at the well. woman at the well. woman at the well. >> I mean, this is a woman. It's absolutely >> I mean, this is a woman. It's absolutely >> I mean, this is a woman. It's absolutely extraordinary. She had had five extraordinary. She had had five extraordinary. She had had five husbands, divorced five times, we husbands, divorced five times, we husbands, divorced five times, we assume, and the man she was living with assume, and the man she was living with assume, and the man she was living with was not her husband. This was in first was not her husband. This was in first was not her husband. This was in first century. She's a Samaritan. She is a in century. She's a Samaritan. She is a in century. She's a Samaritan. She is a in a really moral traditional shamebased a really moral traditional shamebased a really moral traditional shamebased culture. Have you either of you culture. Have you either of you culture. Have you either of you personally known anybody who's been personally known anybody who's been personally known anybody who's been divorced five times? I'm just curious. divorced five times? I'm just curious. divorced five times? I'm just curious. My great aunt was married seven times. You know what? You know what? >> Wow. So, there we go. There we go. Yes. >> Wow. So, there we go. There we go. Yes. >> Wow. So, there we go. There we go. Yes. Exactly. Unusual. Exactly. Unusual. Exactly. Unusual. >> It is unusual. It is unusual. >> It is unusual. It is unusual. >> It is unusual. It is unusual. >> It's unusual. And now she's with the >> It's unusual. And now she's with the >> It's unusual. And now she's with the six. And what does Jesus do? six. And what does Jesus do? six. And what does Jesus do? when he's talking with her, you know, when he's talking with her, you know, when he's talking with her, you know, one one of the or particularly how did one one of the or particularly how did one one of the or particularly how did he communicate the gospel? He didn't he communicate the gospel? He didn't he communicate the gospel? He didn't sidestep her problem when he says, but sidestep her problem when he says, but sidestep her problem when he says, but how did he first communicate the gospel?

how did he first communicate the gospel? how did he first communicate the gospel? It's living water. It's living water. It's living water. >> I give a water and that is just >> I give a water and that is just >> I give a water and that is just resonates with Jews that were reading resonates with Jews that were reading resonates with Jews that were reading this. Um because it the Bible is full of this. Um because it the Bible is full of this. Um because it the Bible is full of how it's vital. God gives us life. The how it's vital. God gives us life. The how it's vital. God gives us life. The solution is so wonderful. We've got to solution is so wonderful. We've got to solution is so wonderful. We've got to be more positive about the solution. be more positive about the solution. be more positive about the solution. It's but what God gives us is alive and It's but what God gives us is alive and It's but what God gives us is alive and it's living water and it comes in us. Um it's living water and it comes in us. Um it's living water and it comes in us. Um and she goes, "Okay, then give it to and she goes, "Okay, then give it to and she goes, "Okay, then give it to her. I won't have to come here and draw her. I won't have to come here and draw her. I won't have to come here and draw water alone because she is so isolated." water alone because she is so isolated." water alone because she is so isolated." And that's when Jesus says, "Why don't And that's when Jesus says, "Why don't And that's when Jesus says, "Why don't you go call your husband?" Well, I don't you go call your husband?" Well, I don't you go call your husband?" Well, I don't have one. You know that's true. You've have one. You know that's true. You've have one. You know that's true. You've been married five times and the man been married five times and the man been married five times and the man you're living with now is not your you're living with now is not your you're living with now is not your husband, but thank you for telling me husband, but thank you for telling me husband, but thank you for telling me the truth. He he deals with the problem, the truth. He he deals with the problem, the truth. He he deals with the problem, but he commends her. He goes out of his but he commends her. He goes out of his but he commends her. He goes out of his way to to respect her, to lift her up, way to to respect her, to lift her up, way to to respect her, to lift her up, to treat her as a woman created in the to treat her as a woman created in the to treat her as a woman created in the image of God with a problem. Um, but image of God with a problem. Um, but image of God with a problem. Um, but what does he tie the gospel to? You need what does he tie the gospel to? You need what does he tie the gospel to? You need living water. living water. living water. >> One of the things that I love to do is >> One of the things that I love to do is >> One of the things that I love to do is look at all the different metaphors look at all the different metaphors look at all the different metaphors Jesus uses in talking about the gospel.

Jesus uses in talking about the gospel. Jesus uses in talking about the gospel. He ties it to the person's need. You're He ties it to the person's need. You're He ties it to the person's need. You're not going to know their need or what not going to know their need or what not going to know their need or what they're looking for if you don't take they're looking for if you don't take they're looking for if you don't take time to understand them. But then we've time to understand them. But then we've time to understand them. But then we've got to be able to understand the gospel got to be able to understand the gospel got to be able to understand the gospel and find ways to communicate it in and find ways to communicate it in and find ways to communicate it in English and to tie it to where they're English and to tie it to where they're English and to tie it to where they're struggling, what what they need. So struggling, what what they need. So struggling, what what they need. So those would be uh starters, I would say, those would be uh starters, I would say, those would be uh starters, I would say, of things that we can improve on and of things that we can improve on and of things that we can improve on and learn. learn. learn. >> I love that because you're reminding us >> I love that because you're reminding us >> I love that because you're reminding us nobody's a project. It's all done in the nobody's a project. It's all done in the nobody's a project. It's all done in the context of relationship from the motive context of relationship from the motive context of relationship from the motive of love. There are some very tangible of love. There are some very tangible of love. There are some very tangible things that we can do to learn and grow. things that we can do to learn and grow. things that we can do to learn and grow. I like especially just going through the I like especially just going through the I like especially just going through the Bible and looking at the different Bible and looking at the different Bible and looking at the different analogies that the scripture uses to um analogies that the scripture uses to um analogies that the scripture uses to um to to speak of the gospel or to speak of to to speak of the gospel or to speak of to to speak of the gospel or to speak of the hope that we have in Christ. You the hope that we have in Christ. You the hope that we have in Christ. You know, I think so often that when we're know, I think so often that when we're know, I think so often that when we're thinking about evangelism, we tend to thinking about evangelism, we tend to thinking about evangelism, we tend to think the one-off conversation that we think the one-off conversation that we think the one-off conversation that we have in a c, you know, in an Uber ride have in a c, you know, in an Uber ride have in a c, you know, in an Uber ride or on an airplane, you know, the back of or on an airplane, you know, the back of or on an airplane, you know, the back of the napkin, the person that we just drop the napkin, the person that we just drop the napkin, the person that we just drop the gospel in their lap and then we the gospel in their lap and then we the gospel in their lap and then we never see them again. And honestly, never see them again. And honestly, never see them again. And honestly, those are just a lot easier to have those are just a lot easier to have those are just a lot easier to have because there is nothing at risk. There because there is nothing at risk. There because there is nothing at risk. There are no stakes in the game for us are no stakes in the game for us are no stakes in the game for us relationally. I'm not risking relationally. I'm not risking relationally. I'm not risking relationship with the person that I'm relationship with the person that I'm relationship with the person that I'm going to sit next to for 2 hours. But I going to sit next to for 2 hours. But I going to sit next to for 2 hours. But I think this idea I want to talk about how think this idea I want to talk about how think this idea I want to talk about how we actually move these conversations we actually move these conversations we actually move these conversations into the relationships that we already into the relationships that we already into the relationships that we already have. You know, we don't stand on a have. You know, we don't stand on a have. You know, we don't stand on a street corner because then we're not street corner because then we're not street corner because then we're not doing it in the context of relationship.

doing it in the context of relationship. doing it in the context of relationship. Then we can't apply the gospel like you Then we can't apply the gospel like you Then we can't apply the gospel like you were just saying Jesus did for the woman were just saying Jesus did for the woman were just saying Jesus did for the woman at the well. But what about the the at the well. But what about the the at the well. But what about the the women that you sit in carpool line with women that you sit in carpool line with women that you sit in carpool line with or the women that are in your book club or the women that are in your book club or the women that are in your book club or the women that you walk with or you or the women that you walk with or you or the women that you walk with or you go to the gym with? I mean, these are go to the gym with? I mean, these are go to the gym with? I mean, these are these are the people that are in our these are the people that are in our these are the people that are in our real lives that we actually have real lives that we actually have real lives that we actually have contact with and relationship with where contact with and relationship with where contact with and relationship with where over time we get to actually know what over time we get to actually know what over time we get to actually know what people's real needs are. And so, how can people's real needs are. And so, how can people's real needs are. And so, how can we shift our thinking to think of all of we shift our thinking to think of all of we shift our thinking to think of all of the relationships we have in light of the relationships we have in light of the relationships we have in light of sharing the gospel? sharing the gospel? sharing the gospel? >> That is a profound question and I I want >> That is a profound question and I I want >> That is a profound question and I I want to answer it in two different ways or in to answer it in two different ways or in to answer it in two different ways or in two different examples if I could. I two different examples if I could. I two different examples if I could. I want to take an example of okay because want to take an example of okay because want to take an example of okay because I don't think the way we do it is really I don't think the way we do it is really I don't think the way we do it is really very different from the person we don't very different from the person we don't very different from the person we don't know and the person we do know. I think know and the person we do know. I think know and the person we do know. I think the principles are similar. Let me give the principles are similar. Let me give the principles are similar. Let me give you an example. you an example. you an example. I was flying uh in I was just back I I was flying uh in I was just back I I was flying uh in I was just back I think from uh where we'd been in Europe think from uh where we'd been in Europe think from uh where we'd been in Europe for seven years for seven years for seven years and I was flying it was a long flight in and I was flying it was a long flight in and I was flying it was a long flight in the states and I sat down next to a the states and I sat down next to a the states and I sat down next to a woman named Sue and I was preparing it woman named Sue and I was preparing it woman named Sue and I was preparing it was a very big conference and I was was a very big conference and I was was a very big conference and I was preparing uh to um my lectures and preparing uh to um my lectures and preparing uh to um my lectures and reading and writing and all that. Sue reading and writing and all that. Sue reading and writing and all that. Sue was very chatty and she kept talking and was very chatty and she kept talking and was very chatty and she kept talking and I was going and I was sort of thinking I was going and I was sort of thinking I was going and I was sort of thinking oh would you please stop talking so I oh would you please stop talking so I oh would you please stop talking so I can write my talk on how to talk to can write my talk on how to talk to can write my talk on how to talk to non-Christians.

non-Christians. non-Christians. >> Yeah. Yeah. Okay. And then she goes and >> Yeah. Yeah. Okay. And then she goes and >> Yeah. Yeah. Okay. And then she goes and then I went, "Wait a minute." And I said then I went, "Wait a minute." And I said then I went, "Wait a minute." And I said to myself, "Lord, and this you always to myself, "Lord, and this you always to myself, "Lord, and this you always start here, whether it's somebody you start here, whether it's somebody you start here, whether it's somebody you know or you don't know. Lord, right now know or you don't know. Lord, right now know or you don't know. Lord, right now I'm asking you in the name of Jesus, I'm asking you in the name of Jesus, I'm asking you in the name of Jesus, would you open up an opportunity here? would you open up an opportunity here? would you open up an opportunity here? Uh would you would with this woman, Uh would you would with this woman, Uh would you would with this woman, would you help me understand who she is? would you help me understand who she is? would you help me understand who she is? Help me to understand whether it's a Help me to understand whether it's a Help me to understand whether it's a somebody you've just met or somebody you somebody you've just met or somebody you somebody you've just met or somebody you know. Let us go deeper. Let me see more know. Let us go deeper. Let me see more know. Let us go deeper. Let me see more deeply. Let me see them as you see them. deeply. Let me see them as you see them. deeply. Let me see them as you see them. And but it's it's it's a fast prayer, And but it's it's it's a fast prayer, And but it's it's it's a fast prayer, but it's saying, "Holy Spirit, come. Let but it's saying, "Holy Spirit, come. Let but it's saying, "Holy Spirit, come. Let your love flow through me. And help me your love flow through me. And help me your love flow through me. And help me what to say, what to ask, how to listen. what to say, what to ask, how to listen. what to say, what to ask, how to listen. Help me." But you always invite the Holy Help me." But you always invite the Holy Help me." But you always invite the Holy Spirit every time. I never have a Spirit every time. I never have a Spirit every time. I never have a conversation with an unbeliever where conversation with an unbeliever where conversation with an unbeliever where I'm not first praying. Okay? I pray. I I'm not first praying. Okay? I pray. I I'm not first praying. Okay? I pray. I put away my my book and my notes. And um put away my my book and my notes. And um put away my my book and my notes. And um so what are we supposed to do? What do so what are we supposed to do? What do so what are we supposed to do? What do we learn from Jesus? One of the things we learn from Jesus? One of the things we learn from Jesus? One of the things we learn is find common ground. And how we learn is find common ground. And how we learn is find common ground. And how do you do that? You ask questions. So I do you do that? You ask questions. So I do you do that? You ask questions. So I began asking her questions and uh and began asking her questions and uh and began asking her questions and uh and then she um uh one trying to find out then she um uh one trying to find out then she um uh one trying to find out where we really connected as human where we really connected as human where we really connected as human beings. Well, it didn't take long and I beings. Well, it didn't take long and I beings. Well, it didn't take long and I found out we both were world travelers.

found out we both were world travelers. found out we both were world travelers. We love languages. We love to learn. And We love languages. We love to learn. And We love languages. We love to learn. And we had a long conversation about as we had a long conversation about as we had a long conversation about as Americans our experience in many places Americans our experience in many places Americans our experience in many places in the world. Okay. And it was a in the world. Okay. And it was a in the world. Okay. And it was a wonderful conversation wonderful conversation wonderful conversation that freed her once we had that that freed her once we had that that freed her once we had that commonality. commonality. commonality. We found a connection as human beings. We found a connection as human beings. We found a connection as human beings. She started talking about some of her She started talking about some of her She started talking about some of her beliefs. And so she started saying beliefs. And so she started saying beliefs. And so she started saying things like, "You know, Becky, I tell things like, "You know, Becky, I tell things like, "You know, Becky, I tell you, uh, if if you want to be a man on you, uh, if if you want to be a man on you, uh, if if you want to be a man on Monday and a woman on Friday, for Monday and a woman on Friday, for Monday and a woman on Friday, for heaven's sakes, go ahead. That's your heaven's sakes, go ahead. That's your heaven's sakes, go ahead. That's your business. That's not mine. And you know, business. That's not mine. And you know, business. That's not mine. And you know, she's a little bit like, I really she's a little bit like, I really she's a little bit like, I really believe in karma. I really believe in believe in karma. I really believe in believe in karma. I really believe in the law of karma. And so I'm listening the law of karma. And so I'm listening the law of karma. And so I'm listening to her, you know, talking about these to her, you know, talking about these to her, you know, talking about these various beliefs. And then she goes, and various beliefs. And then she goes, and various beliefs. And then she goes, and I really believe human beings that that I really believe human beings that that I really believe human beings that that our planet is filled with people who are our planet is filled with people who are our planet is filled with people who are good. Now, now even a close friend, good. Now, now even a close friend, good. Now, now even a close friend, somebody you know, carpal, could say the somebody you know, carpal, could say the somebody you know, carpal, could say the exact same thing. Uh-huh. exact same thing. Uh-huh. exact same thing. Uh-huh. >> I really believe that that uh this this >> I really believe that that uh this this >> I really believe that that uh this this world is good and it's full of goodness.

world is good and it's full of goodness. world is good and it's full of goodness. And I said, "Now, what don't you say at And I said, "Now, what don't you say at And I said, "Now, what don't you say at that moment? You don't say, "Are you that moment? You don't say, "Are you that moment? You don't say, "Are you kidding me? kidding me? kidding me? >> Do you want to look around and see the >> Do you want to look around and see the >> Do you want to look around and see the mess?" And that's one of the gifts of mess?" And that's one of the gifts of mess?" And that's one of the gifts of being alive in this time is every things being alive in this time is every things being alive in this time is every things are so difficult that people are are so difficult that people are are so difficult that people are realizing it and saying, "What's going realizing it and saying, "What's going realizing it and saying, "What's going on?" But that's not what I said. Um I on?" But that's not what I said. Um I on?" But that's not what I said. Um I said, "Let me ask you something." I said, "Let me ask you something." I said, "Let me ask you something." I said, um, that the world is full of said, um, that the world is full of said, um, that the world is full of goodness, people are are entirely good. goodness, people are are entirely good. goodness, people are are entirely good. What do you think about the state of the What do you think about the state of the What do you think about the state of the world? I'm just curious, how would you world? I'm just curious, how would you world? I'm just curious, how would you analyze it? She goes, and this is 10 analyze it? She goes, and this is 10 analyze it? She goes, and this is 10 years ago. Imagine what she'd say today. years ago. Imagine what she'd say today. years ago. Imagine what she'd say today. She goes, it's a mess. The world is an She goes, it's a mess. The world is an She goes, it's a mess. The world is an absolute mess. It's falling apart. I go, absolute mess. It's falling apart. I go, absolute mess. It's falling apart. I go, "Okay, so help me out here. How can the "Okay, so help me out here. How can the "Okay, so help me out here. How can the world be full of only good people and world be full of only good people and world be full of only good people and the world be a mess? I mean, h I don't the world be a mess? I mean, h I don't the world be a mess? I mean, h I don't see how that works." And she goes, "That see how that works." And she goes, "That see how that works." And she goes, "That is a very good question." She goes, is a very good question." She goes, is a very good question." She goes, "Actually, I think there are two "Actually, I think there are two "Actually, I think there are two problems. I think we most of us are problems. I think we most of us are problems. I think we most of us are psychologically wounded and we need psychologically wounded and we need psychologically wounded and we need therapy or a lot of us are addicts and therapy or a lot of us are addicts and therapy or a lot of us are addicts and we need recovery."

we need recovery." we need recovery." >> And don't you agree? I said, I agree. >> And don't you agree? I said, I agree. >> And don't you agree? I said, I agree. Those are two huge problems and I agree Those are two huge problems and I agree Those are two huge problems and I agree that those solutions have helped people. that those solutions have helped people. that those solutions have helped people. But I've got a question for you. All But I've got a question for you. All But I've got a question for you. All right. So you you're you're in recovery right. So you you're you're in recovery right. So you you're you're in recovery and and and and you realize you have to and and and and you realize you have to and and and and you realize you have to get over to an addiction to alcohol sick get over to an addiction to alcohol sick get over to an addiction to alcohol sick and with that help you are able to and with that help you are able to and with that help you are able to actually overcome your addiction to that actually overcome your addiction to that actually overcome your addiction to that specific thing. But the longer you're in specific thing. But the longer you're in specific thing. But the longer you're in recovery and looking really looking at recovery and looking really looking at recovery and looking really looking at yourself, you realize that you're yourself, you realize that you're yourself, you realize that you're actually addicted to more than just actually addicted to more than just actually addicted to more than just booze. booze. booze. you're you're also addicted to yourself. you're you're also addicted to yourself. you're you're also addicted to yourself. There's nobody we care more about, think There's nobody we care more about, think There's nobody we care more about, think more about, you know, but we're addicted more about, you know, but we're addicted more about, you know, but we're addicted to ourselves. She went, "That is so to ourselves. She went, "That is so to ourselves. She went, "That is so true. That is so true. But where in the true. That is so true. But where in the true. That is so true. But where in the world do we go for real?" Oh. Oh. Oh, world do we go for real?" Oh. Oh. Oh, world do we go for real?" Oh. Oh. Oh, yeah. That is so true. We're addicted to yeah. That is so true. We're addicted to yeah. That is so true. We're addicted to ourselves. I said, "What if the problem ourselves. I said, "What if the problem ourselves. I said, "What if the problem isn't just substances or psychological isn't just substances or psychological isn't just substances or psychological wounding, of which both are real, but wounding, of which both are real, but wounding, of which both are real, but what if our problem is a problem of the what if our problem is a problem of the what if our problem is a problem of the heart?" She goes, "I agree, but where do heart?" She goes, "I agree, but where do heart?" She goes, "I agree, but where do we go for rehab of the heart?"

we go for rehab of the heart?" we go for rehab of the heart?" And for the first time, and we've been And for the first time, and we've been And for the first time, and we've been talking an hour and a half, for the talking an hour and a half, for the talking an hour and a half, for the first time, I mentioned God. first time, I mentioned God. first time, I mentioned God. And I said, you know, uh, where do we go And I said, you know, uh, where do we go And I said, you know, uh, where do we go for rehab of the heart? I could only for rehab of the heart? I could only for rehab of the heart? I could only think of one thing, and that's God. And think of one thing, and that's God. And think of one thing, and that's God. And I have to tell you something. I went I have to tell you something. I went I have to tell you something. I went from an agnostic from an agnostic from an agnostic to actually eventually becoming a to actually eventually becoming a to actually eventually becoming a Christian for exactly that reason Christian for exactly that reason Christian for exactly that reason >> that it was the only answer I could >> that it was the only answer I could >> that it was the only answer I could think of to truly transform us from think of to truly transform us from think of to truly transform us from addicted to ourselves to actually addicted to ourselves to actually addicted to ourselves to actually becoming free. But I said, you know, am becoming free. But I said, you know, am becoming free. But I said, you know, am I coming becoming a Christian? It was a I coming becoming a Christian? It was a I coming becoming a Christian? It was a long story, you know, so we won't go long story, you know, so we won't go long story, you know, so we won't go there. And I only said that because I there. And I only said that because I there. And I only said that because I wanted to know if she was really wanted to know if she was really wanted to know if she was really interested. And she goes, yes, I want interested. And she goes, yes, I want interested. And she goes, yes, I want you to go there. I want to know how did you to go there. I want to know how did you to go there. I want to know how did that happen. We spent the rest of the that happen. We spent the rest of the that happen. We spent the rest of the flight talking about faith. Now, what's flight talking about faith. Now, what's flight talking about faith. Now, what's so critical about this example? so critical about this example? so critical about this example? >> The critical thing is that the it was an >> The critical thing is that the it was an >> The critical thing is that the it was an or my bringing up God was organic or my bringing up God was organic or my bringing up God was organic conversation.

conversation. conversation. >> It wasn't one of these bait and switch. >> It wasn't one of these bait and switch. >> It wasn't one of these bait and switch. >> It was absolutely organic. It wasn't >> It was absolutely organic. It wasn't >> It was absolutely organic. It wasn't manipulative. manipulative. manipulative. >> And when I said, "Well, you know, uh you >> And when I said, "Well, you know, uh you >> And when I said, "Well, you know, uh you know, I don't have we don't have to talk know, I don't have we don't have to talk know, I don't have we don't have to talk about that." No, no, no, no. I want to about that." No, no, no, no. I want to about that." No, no, no, no. I want to talk about it. and we did. One of the talk about it. and we did. One of the talk about it. and we did. One of the things that was really interesting is things that was really interesting is things that was really interesting is that she said um uh that she said um uh that she said um uh I I just I feel that um oh oh we we're I I just I feel that um oh oh we we're I I just I feel that um oh oh we we're talking about faith. We're talking and talking about faith. We're talking and talking about faith. We're talking and that and in that context she was really that and in that context she was really that and in that context she was really asking me in essence what's the message asking me in essence what's the message asking me in essence what's the message what's the essence of this Christian what's the essence of this Christian what's the essence of this Christian thing and I was talking to and she said thing and I was talking to and she said thing and I was talking to and she said Becky does the Bible tell us why we're Becky does the Bible tell us why we're Becky does the Bible tell us why we're so self-addicted so self-addicted so self-addicted that that we are addicted to ourselves that that we are addicted to ourselves that that we are addicted to ourselves and we are locked in and we are we're and we are locked in and we are we're and we are locked in and we are we're not free and we are all there's an not free and we are all there's an not free and we are all there's an emptiness there. I said yeah it does. emptiness there. I said yeah it does. emptiness there. I said yeah it does. Well, what do they say is the problem? Well, what do they say is the problem? Well, what do they say is the problem? I said well I'm going to use my language I said well I'm going to use my language I said well I'm going to use my language first. Uh, but the Bible is saying this. first. Uh, but the Bible is saying this. first. Uh, but the Bible is saying this. Um, we've got a God complex. We keep Um, we've got a God complex. We keep Um, we've got a God complex. We keep getting ourselves and God mixed up. Why getting ourselves and God mixed up. Why getting ourselves and God mixed up. Why didn't I first say it's sin? Because she didn't I first say it's sin? Because she didn't I first say it's sin? Because she wouldn't understand it, wouldn't understand it, wouldn't understand it, >> right?

>> right? >> right? >> And in fact, I said, "We've got a God >> And in fact, I said, "We've got a God >> And in fact, I said, "We've got a God complex. We get ourselves and God mixed complex. We get ourselves and God mixed complex. We get ourselves and God mixed up. God is God. We are not." And she up. God is God. We are not." And she up. God is God. We are not." And she goes, "Oh, I have a God complex. I mean, goes, "Oh, I have a God complex. I mean, goes, "Oh, I have a God complex. I mean, I am in charge. And I am in charge I am in charge. And I am in charge I am in charge. And I am in charge because I believe I'm the master of my because I believe I'm the master of my because I believe I'm the master of my own universe. own universe. own universe. Wow. Wow. Wow. >> And she said, "I've got a God complex." >> And she said, "I've got a God complex." >> And she said, "I've got a God complex." And she goes, "Is you said that's And she goes, "Is you said that's And she goes, "Is you said that's biblical language. What is the what does biblical language. What is the what does biblical language. What is the what does the Bible call it?" I said, "Sin." She the Bible call it?" I said, "Sin." She the Bible call it?" I said, "Sin." She goes, "Sin? I thought sin was like goes, "Sin? I thought sin was like goes, "Sin? I thought sin was like drugs, sex, and rock and roll." I said, drugs, sex, and rock and roll." I said, drugs, sex, and rock and roll." I said, "That's behavior." "That's behavior." "That's behavior." >> I said, "That might result in behavior, >> I said, "That might result in behavior, >> I said, "That might result in behavior, >> but the core of it, I said, there's >> but the core of it, I said, there's >> but the core of it, I said, there's really two corks, but I said two really two corks, but I said two really two corks, but I said two aspects, I think, to what sin is?" But I aspects, I think, to what sin is?" But I aspects, I think, to what sin is?" But I said, "One is this addiction to said, "One is this addiction to said, "One is this addiction to ourselves?" ourselves?" ourselves?" And um it is. And she goes, "Well," she And um it is. And she goes, "Well," she And um it is. And she goes, "Well," she goes, "I I tell you what, um" she said, goes, "I I tell you what, um" she said, goes, "I I tell you what, um" she said, "I I I "I I I "I I I know I've got a God complex, but I to know I've got a God complex, but I to know I've got a God complex, but I to tell you the truth, and I know I'm I'm tell you the truth, and I know I'm I'm tell you the truth, and I know I'm I'm I'm God of my universe of of my I'm God of my universe of of my I'm God of my universe of of my universe, but boy," I said, "How's it universe, but boy," I said, "How's it universe, but boy," I said, "How's it working out for you?"

working out for you?" working out for you?" And she goes, "How's it working out? I And she goes, "How's it working out? I And she goes, "How's it working out? I find it exhausting." Yep. find it exhausting." Yep. find it exhausting." Yep. >> I said, "Now, that's very interesting. >> I said, "Now, that's very interesting. >> I said, "Now, that's very interesting. Why would you find it exhausting? Why would you find it exhausting? Why would you find it exhausting? Because if that's who you truly are, Because if that's who you truly are, Because if that's who you truly are, it's liberating. it's liberating. it's liberating. >> It should vitalize you, revitalize you. >> It should vitalize you, revitalize you. >> It should vitalize you, revitalize you. Why would you find it exhausting?" She Why would you find it exhausting?" She Why would you find it exhausting?" She goes, "I don't know, but I have a goes, "I don't know, but I have a goes, "I don't know, but I have a feeling you do." feeling you do." feeling you do." And I said, "Yeah, you know why you find And I said, "Yeah, you know why you find And I said, "Yeah, you know why you find it exhausting to be God? Because it's it exhausting to be God? Because it's it exhausting to be God? Because it's way above our pay grade. I tried to be way above our pay grade. I tried to be way above our pay grade. I tried to be God. It's exhausting." God. It's exhausting." God. It's exhausting." We land, we get there, and she said, We land, we get there, and she said, We land, we get there, and she said, "Becky, um, if I wrote you, could we "Becky, um, if I wrote you, could we "Becky, um, if I wrote you, could we have a discussion about faith? Could we have a discussion about faith? Could we have a discussion about faith? Could we keep this up?" And we did for a long keep this up?" And we did for a long keep this up?" And we did for a long time, center books, etc. But let me just time, center books, etc. But let me just time, center books, etc. But let me just say a couple of things here. say a couple of things here. say a couple of things here. What are tips for how do we raise the What are tips for how do we raise the What are tips for how do we raise the topic of faith? And the first thing is topic of faith? And the first thing is topic of faith? And the first thing is you pray. You pray and ask God every you pray. You pray and ask God every you pray. You pray and ask God every day, guide me to people you're seeking. day, guide me to people you're seeking. day, guide me to people you're seeking. Even some may be open, some may be real Even some may be open, some may be real Even some may be open, some may be real secret, but guide me. Then before you secret, but guide me. Then before you secret, but guide me. Then before you have the conversation, pray a silent have the conversation, pray a silent have the conversation, pray a silent prayer. That's number one. Number two, prayer. That's number one. Number two, prayer. That's number one. Number two, find common ground. Once we really find common ground. Once we really find common ground. Once we really discovered that we were we loved um discovered that we were we loved um discovered that we were we loved um traveling around the world and all that, traveling around the world and all that, traveling around the world and all that, we connected as human beings. So that we connected as human beings. So that we connected as human beings. So that when it came up that I was a Christian, when it came up that I was a Christian, when it came up that I was a Christian, she couldn't put me in this little box she couldn't put me in this little box she couldn't put me in this little box >> because we'd already connected >> because we'd already connected >> because we'd already connected authentically. So you pray, you find authentically. So you pray, you find authentically. So you pray, you find common ground, ask good questions.

common ground, ask good questions. common ground, ask good questions. questions are so powerful because they questions are so powerful because they questions are so powerful because they aren't preachy. They reveal that we've aren't preachy. They reveal that we've aren't preachy. They reveal that we've really been listening to them that that really been listening to them that that really been listening to them that that that uh uh we and funny thing about that uh uh we and funny thing about that uh uh we and funny thing about questions it actually causes people to questions it actually causes people to questions it actually causes people to reconsider their views without being reconsider their views without being reconsider their views without being judgmental because when I said okay so judgmental because when I said okay so judgmental because when I said okay so how is it then um that when when you say how is it then um that when when you say how is it then um that when when you say um that people are good how do you work um that people are good how do you work um that people are good how do you work that out if you say the world's a mess that out if you say the world's a mess that out if you say the world's a mess right I'm asking her to rethink her right I'm asking her to rethink her right I'm asking her to rethink her worldview Mhm. worldview Mhm. worldview Mhm. >> Uh but she it wasn't judgmental. Agree >> Uh but she it wasn't judgmental. Agree >> Uh but she it wasn't judgmental. Agree where you can. Keep asking good where you can. Keep asking good where you can. Keep asking good questions, but agree where you can. I questions, but agree where you can. I questions, but agree where you can. I agreed with her about her analysis of agreed with her about her analysis of agreed with her about her analysis of the problems that I said, I think it the problems that I said, I think it the problems that I said, I think it might be deeper. Here's where I think it might be deeper. Here's where I think it might be deeper. Here's where I think it could be. Another really important could be. Another really important could be. Another really important point, ask questions, but use their point, ask questions, but use their point, ask questions, but use their terminology. terminology. terminology. We some we make the mistakes of wanting We some we make the mistakes of wanting We some we make the mistakes of wanting them to come on our turf and to them to come on our turf and to them to come on our turf and to understand our language. The first thing understand our language. The first thing understand our language. The first thing I did is I said, "What if it's an I did is I said, "What if it's an I did is I said, "What if it's an addiction to ourselves?" I didn't say addiction to ourselves?" I didn't say addiction to ourselves?" I didn't say sin yet, but I used her language.

sin yet, but I used her language. sin yet, but I used her language. And then she goes, "Well, um, yeah, but And then she goes, "Well, um, yeah, but And then she goes, "Well, um, yeah, but you know what exactly does that mean?" you know what exactly does that mean?" you know what exactly does that mean?" And I said, "Well, the Bible says it's a And I said, "Well, the Bible says it's a And I said, "Well, the Bible says it's a God complex." Well, I've got a God God complex." Well, I've got a God God complex." Well, I've got a God complex. You know, it's still not using complex. You know, it's still not using complex. You know, it's still not using biblical language. Then I went to sin. biblical language. Then I went to sin. biblical language. Then I went to sin. You can use biblical language. It's You can use biblical language. It's You can use biblical language. It's important to but you need to explain important to but you need to explain important to but you need to explain what it means. Um what it means. Um what it means. Um it is uh I I it is so exciting to be a it is uh I I it is so exciting to be a it is uh I I it is so exciting to be a Christian and to keep understanding Christian and to keep understanding Christian and to keep understanding better and better who God is, what he better and better who God is, what he better and better who God is, what he has done for us, but learn how to say it has done for us, but learn how to say it has done for us, but learn how to say it in English. That's one of the things we in English. That's one of the things we in English. That's one of the things we do in conferences. But the wonderful do in conferences. But the wonderful do in conferences. But the wonderful thing is I was able to bring up the thing is I was able to bring up the thing is I was able to bring up the topic of God topic of God topic of God >> and it was natural to the conversation. >> and it was natural to the conversation. >> and it was natural to the conversation. Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, >> I didn't learn that automatically. It >> I didn't learn that automatically. It >> I didn't learn that automatically. It took me time and years to listen to took me time and years to listen to took me time and years to listen to people, but then to be able to bring up people, but then to be able to bring up people, but then to be able to bring up the subject um in a natural way without the subject um in a natural way without the subject um in a natural way without being manipulative. I love um the the being manipulative. I love um the the being manipulative. I love um the the way you just walked us through that way you just walked us through that way you just walked us through that whole story because it's really so whole story because it's really so whole story because it's really so informative and I just realized the informative and I just realized the informative and I just realized the moment where I would have gotten the moment where I would have gotten the moment where I would have gotten the most caught up is when she started most caught up is when she started most caught up is when she started giving her diagnosis because I would giving her diagnosis because I would giving her diagnosis because I would have been like, "Yeah, that's wrong."

have been like, "Yeah, that's wrong." have been like, "Yeah, that's wrong." But I would have thought, "Okay, in this But I would have thought, "Okay, in this But I would have thought, "Okay, in this moment, how do I speak the truth in moment, how do I speak the truth in moment, how do I speak the truth in love?" you know, I I would have felt love?" you know, I I would have felt love?" you know, I I would have felt like it's, you know, and what I love like it's, you know, and what I love like it's, you know, and what I love that you did is you got her to the truth that you did is you got her to the truth that you did is you got her to the truth in love, but it wasn't through in love, but it wasn't through in love, but it wasn't through confrontation. It was through like confrontation. It was through like confrontation. It was through like revelation. You kind of exposed it, you revelation. You kind of exposed it, you revelation. You kind of exposed it, you know, by asking her really good know, by asking her really good know, by asking her really good questions. And I that is such a place I questions. And I that is such a place I questions. And I that is such a place I want to grow. I mean, because I can ask want to grow. I mean, because I can ask want to grow. I mean, because I can ask good questions about tell me about your good questions about tell me about your good questions about tell me about your life, tell me what you do, but it it's life, tell me what you do, but it it's life, tell me what you do, but it it's when we get to um tell me what you think when we get to um tell me what you think when we get to um tell me what you think and then trying, you know, I just I I and then trying, you know, I just I I and then trying, you know, I just I I think what you did there was just really think what you did there was just really think what you did there was just really really wise. And I think it's not our really wise. And I think it's not our really wise. And I think it's not our natural instinct. We think we're natural instinct. We think we're natural instinct. We think we're supposed to that's what you confront. supposed to that's what you confront. supposed to that's what you confront. No, you're wrong and let me tell you why No, you're wrong and let me tell you why No, you're wrong and let me tell you why you're wrong. And you're wrong. And you're wrong. And >> um and that's when it goes south and I >> um and that's when it goes south and I >> um and that's when it goes south and I think that's when we feel the discomfort think that's when we feel the discomfort think that's when we feel the discomfort rather than rather than rather than >> okay well tell me how you how you've >> okay well tell me how you how you've >> okay well tell me how you how you've would you know like even just being would you know like even just being would you know like even just being being inquisitive about what do you being inquisitive about what do you being inquisitive about what do you think the biggest problem is then how think the biggest problem is then how think the biggest problem is then how how do you think we should solve it as a how do you think we should solve it as a how do you think we should solve it as a society like asking society like asking society like asking >> exactly >> exactly >> exactly >> and that's that's this being curious of >> and that's that's this being curious of >> and that's that's this being curious of other people because I think when we ask other people because I think when we ask other people because I think when we ask their thought, they often then ask our their thought, they often then ask our their thought, they often then ask our thought.

thought. thought. >> Exactly. That's exactly right. You know, >> Exactly. That's exactly right. You know, >> Exactly. That's exactly right. You know, one of the things we do one of the things we do one of the things we do >> in training conferences is I say, "Okay, >> in training conferences is I say, "Okay, >> in training conferences is I say, "Okay, I want you to write down the name of I want you to write down the name of I want you to write down the name of somebody you really know well." Now, we somebody you really know well." Now, we somebody you really know well." Now, we haven't gotten to that yet about the haven't gotten to that yet about the haven't gotten to that yet about the person that we really know well and what person that we really know well and what person that we really know well and what are some of the differences. There's not are some of the differences. There's not are some of the differences. There's not a lot of differences, but there are a lot of differences, but there are a lot of differences, but there are some, but but what what is this person? some, but but what what is this person? some, but but what what is this person? What's their passion? What's their What's their passion? What's their What's their passion? What's their interest? Then I want you to write and I interest? Then I want you to write and I interest? Then I want you to write and I do this exercise where we're looking at do this exercise where we're looking at do this exercise where we're looking at how do you go from a natural how do you go from a natural how do you go from a natural conversation to a spiritual one and I conversation to a spiritual one and I conversation to a spiritual one and I give them sort of principles. I said give them sort of principles. I said give them sort of principles. I said using these principles I want you to ask using these principles I want you to ask using these principles I want you to ask four questions that go from a natural four questions that go from a natural four questions that go from a natural conversation to a spiritual conversation to a spiritual conversation to a spiritual conversation. It is amazing when you're conversation. It is amazing when you're conversation. It is amazing when you're breaking it down. You really can learn. breaking it down. You really can learn. breaking it down. You really can learn. It's a different way of thinking in a It's a different way of thinking in a It's a different way of thinking in a way but it is it is learnable. it is way but it is it is learnable. it is way but it is it is learnable. it is doable and and doable and and doable and and people feel heard. people feel heard. people feel heard. >> So, so let me ask you this question. >> So, so let me ask you this question. >> So, so let me ask you this question. Most of us are going through our days Most of us are going through our days Most of us are going through our days and we are simply distracted by the fact and we are simply distracted by the fact and we are simply distracted by the fact that we forgot to order the dog food and that we forgot to order the dog food and that we forgot to order the dog food and now we're roaming to the store and you now we're roaming to the store and you now we're roaming to the store and you know we're just disheveled ourselves.

know we're just disheveled ourselves. know we're just disheveled ourselves. And we can make evangelism something. And we can make evangelism something. And we can make evangelism something. Oh, we're going to do that when there's Oh, we're going to do that when there's Oh, we're going to do that when there's a space for it. And the other thing you a space for it. And the other thing you a space for it. And the other thing you did here is you noticed a person. You did here is you noticed a person. You did here is you noticed a person. You put away your notes. And you had the put away your notes. And you had the put away your notes. And you had the conversation. Um, you know, we all live conversation. Um, you know, we all live conversation. Um, you know, we all live lives with our phones. They're so lives with our phones. They're so lives with our phones. They're so distracting. Our lives are distracting. distracting. Our lives are distracting. distracting. Our lives are distracting. How do we do this? How would you How do we do this? How would you How do we do this? How would you encourage a woman who's listening, who's encourage a woman who's listening, who's encourage a woman who's listening, who's just living her life, and she's like, I just living her life, and she's like, I just living her life, and she's like, I never even have evangelistic never even have evangelistic never even have evangelistic opportunities. opportunities. opportunities. I I think they're there. we maybe I I think they're there. we maybe I I think they're there. we maybe struggle to see them. So, how can we struggle to see them. So, how can we struggle to see them. So, how can we train our eyes to see the fields before train our eyes to see the fields before train our eyes to see the fields before us? It says the fields are white for us? It says the fields are white for us? It says the fields are white for harvest. How can we get a bigger vision harvest. How can we get a bigger vision harvest. How can we get a bigger vision for our mundane lives? One is prayer and for our mundane lives? One is prayer and for our mundane lives? One is prayer and saying Lord, you know, when he he saying Lord, you know, when he he saying Lord, you know, when he he commands us um but but uh he commands us commands us um but but uh he commands us commands us um but but uh he commands us in love uh and and the scriptures say in love uh and and the scriptures say in love uh and and the scriptures say take advantage of every opportunity take advantage of every opportunity take advantage of every opportunity to share the hope that is within you.

to share the hope that is within you. to share the hope that is within you. Where we get confused is we think that Where we get confused is we think that Where we get confused is we think that the verse goes uh take advantage of the verse goes uh take advantage of the verse goes uh take advantage of every situation and share the hope with every situation and share the hope with every situation and share the hope with the gospel. That's not what it says. the gospel. That's not what it says. the gospel. That's not what it says. take advantage of every opportunity. So take advantage of every opportunity. So take advantage of every opportunity. So we go, Lord, you've called me to share we go, Lord, you've called me to share we go, Lord, you've called me to share my faith for love. You know that that my faith for love. You know that that my faith for love. You know that that that what glorifies you is people being that what glorifies you is people being that what glorifies you is people being able to come home to find their true able to come home to find their true able to come home to find their true home. home. home. >> But I I help me. All right. So you pray. >> But I I help me. All right. So you pray. >> But I I help me. All right. So you pray. Secondly, you look at Jesus. You look at Secondly, you look at Jesus. You look at Secondly, you look at Jesus. You look at the the the then you really you could the the the then you really you could the the the then you really you could look the whole of the Bible, but boy, look the whole of the Bible, but boy, look the whole of the Bible, but boy, it's so moving to look at Jesus and to it's so moving to look at Jesus and to it's so moving to look at Jesus and to see the way he kept dealing with people see the way he kept dealing with people see the way he kept dealing with people so different than he was. and and the so different than he was. and and the so different than he was. and and the way he talked to unbelievers was just uh way he talked to unbelievers was just uh way he talked to unbelievers was just uh so moving. And then write down, all so moving. And then write down, all so moving. And then write down, all right, what am I going to do? What how right, what am I going to do? What how right, what am I going to do? What how what do I learn here? How am I going to what do I learn here? How am I going to what do I learn here? How am I going to do that? And then look at how do I spend do that? And then look at how do I spend do that? And then look at how do I spend my day? Well, I like to walk and I go my day? Well, I like to walk and I go my day? Well, I like to walk and I go with my neighbors walking. And that with my neighbors walking. And that with my neighbors walking. And that could be an opportunity just to raise could be an opportunity just to raise could be an opportunity just to raise some questions. It's easier if it's some questions. It's easier if it's some questions. It's easier if it's one-on-one, but if it's in a group, you one-on-one, but if it's in a group, you one-on-one, but if it's in a group, you um but or you like art and you're taking um but or you like art and you're taking um but or you like art and you're taking an art class. what what you're standing an art class. what what you're standing an art class. what what you're standing I don't know how many times I'd be at I don't know how many times I'd be at I don't know how many times I'd be at soccer games for my kids or what soccer games for my kids or what soccer games for my kids or what performances they were doing whatever performances they were doing whatever performances they were doing whatever and we'd be you know the moms waiting and we'd be you know the moms waiting and we'd be you know the moms waiting for the kids and and beginning to for the kids and and beginning to for the kids and and beginning to develop conversations and you don't develop conversations and you don't develop conversations and you don't start I mean again this is people you start I mean again this is people you start I mean again this is people you know ask them for a cup of coffee get know ask them for a cup of coffee get know ask them for a cup of coffee get together have them over for meals we've together have them over for meals we've together have them over for meals we've got to get to know people

got to get to know people got to get to know people >> right >> right >> right >> and so be the home where you're bringing >> and so be the home where you're bringing >> and so be the home where you're bringing uh the the the parents of the kids that uh the the the parents of the kids that uh the the the parents of the kids that your kids go to school with. But you do your kids go to school with. But you do your kids go to school with. But you do have to be intentional. It it it it is have to be intentional. It it it it is have to be intentional. It it it it is you're exactly right. We're busy. We're you're exactly right. We're busy. We're you're exactly right. We're busy. We're distracted. But just say, "Lord, give me distracted. But just say, "Lord, give me distracted. But just say, "Lord, give me one person, just one person I can reach one person, just one person I can reach one person, just one person I can reach out to." And then begin that social uh out to." And then begin that social uh out to." And then begin that social uh relationship. Um telling them when they relationship. Um telling them when they relationship. Um telling them when they do share something, oh, I I I I really do share something, oh, I I I I really do share something, oh, I I I I really will pray. In fact, I will depends on will pray. In fact, I will depends on will pray. In fact, I will depends on how well I know him. I go, "Can I just how well I know him. I go, "Can I just how well I know him. I go, "Can I just pray just now pray just now pray just now >> and I know you're not sure where God is >> and I know you're not sure where God is >> and I know you're not sure where God is and all that, but would you mind if I and all that, but would you mind if I and all that, but would you mind if I did? I'm just so grieved about what did? I'm just so grieved about what did? I'm just so grieved about what you're going through." So, don't even you're going through." So, don't even you're going through." So, don't even There's opportunities and prayer can be There's opportunities and prayer can be There's opportunities and prayer can be another opportunity, but we need um another opportunity, but we need um another opportunity, but we need um yeah, we need to be intentional and we yeah, we need to be intentional and we yeah, we need to be intentional and we need to follow the way of Jesus. You need to follow the way of Jesus. You need to follow the way of Jesus. You know, so much research now is telling us know, so much research now is telling us know, so much research now is telling us that there is a real an openness to that there is a real an openness to that there is a real an openness to talking about spiritual things in light talking about spiritual things in light talking about spiritual things in light of all these problems.

of all these problems. of all these problems. >> And I was just this spring I was invited >> And I was just this spring I was invited >> And I was just this spring I was invited to uh San Francisco and Oakland. Those to uh San Francisco and Oakland. Those to uh San Francisco and Oakland. Those are two of the most gospel resistant are two of the most gospel resistant are two of the most gospel resistant regions. Um and and it when I I in San regions. Um and and it when I I in San regions. Um and and it when I I in San Francisco I gave a conference just for Francisco I gave a conference just for Francisco I gave a conference just for pastors and it was pastors all up and pastors and it was pastors all up and pastors and it was pastors all up and down California saying we're trying to down California saying we're trying to down California saying we're trying to figure out how do you build an figure out how do you build an figure out how do you build an evangelistic culture in our church evangelistic culture in our church evangelistic culture in our church >> and so we spent the day trying to help >> and so we spent the day trying to help >> and so we spent the day trying to help them and equip them. But you know what them and equip them. But you know what them and equip them. But you know what they said they said and then the next they said they said and then the next they said they said and then the next day I gave a conference to all their day I gave a conference to all their day I gave a conference to all their churches. Their churches all came churches. Their churches all came churches. Their churches all came together and so we were doing evangelism together and so we were doing evangelism together and so we were doing evangelism training. But what the pastor said was training. But what the pastor said was training. But what the pastor said was for the first time and I cannot tell you for the first time and I cannot tell you for the first time and I cannot tell you how long in San Francisco Oakland how long in San Francisco Oakland how long in San Francisco Oakland Christians are our parishioners our our Christians are our parishioners our our Christians are our parishioners our our congregation are coming up to us and congregation are coming up to us and congregation are coming up to us and saying you know this has been a place saying you know this has been a place saying you know this has been a place that's so hostile to faith so hostile to that's so hostile to faith so hostile to that's so hostile to faith so hostile to Christianity that that we um we we love Christianity that that we um we we love Christianity that that we um we we love them we uh certainly our our churches them we uh certainly our our churches them we uh certainly our our churches are doing justice you know reaching out are doing justice you know reaching out are doing justice you know reaching out to the poor or I'm trying to do you know to the poor or I'm trying to do you know to the poor or I'm trying to do you know something to make them interested but I something to make them interested but I something to make them interested but I never talk about my faith. There is no never talk about my faith. There is no never talk about my faith. There is no verbal explanation is too hostile. And verbal explanation is too hostile. And verbal explanation is too hostile. And the pastors were saying to me the pastors were saying to me the pastors were saying to me we have so many people in our church we have so many people in our church we have so many people in our church saying that that their non-Christian saying that that their non-Christian saying that that their non-Christian friends are saying we were told that if friends are saying we were told that if friends are saying we were told that if we did these social policies the world

we did these social policies the world we did these social policies the world would be great and the world is a mess. would be great and the world is a mess. would be great and the world is a mess. Where do you have hope? Well Christians Where do you have hope? Well Christians Where do you have hope? Well Christians have been quiet for so long. Yeah, have been quiet for so long. Yeah, have been quiet for so long. Yeah, >> they weren't sure how quite how to do >> they weren't sure how quite how to do >> they weren't sure how quite how to do it. And that's why they asked us to it. And that's why they asked us to it. And that's why they asked us to come, my husband and me. They said, "How come, my husband and me. They said, "How come, my husband and me. They said, "How can we equip the church to do this?" Uh, can we equip the church to do this?" Uh, can we equip the church to do this?" Uh, it was interesting. Now, that's where it was interesting. Now, that's where it was interesting. Now, that's where they were in Portland. They they asked they were in Portland. They they asked they were in Portland. They they asked us to come and this is in the spring was us to come and this is in the spring was us to come and this is in the spring was they said they said they said uh in um they did this is a big ministry uh in um they did this is a big ministry uh in um they did this is a big ministry that ministers to churches throughout that ministers to churches throughout that ministers to churches throughout the Northwest. And they asked all the the Northwest. And they asked all the the Northwest. And they asked all the churches and the pastors u where are you churches and the pastors u where are you churches and the pastors u where are you weakest? and they gave them where do you weakest? and they gave them where do you weakest? and they gave them where do you most need help? Every single church top most need help? Every single church top most need help? Every single church top of the list was evangelism number one. of the list was evangelism number one. of the list was evangelism number one. We don't know. We don't know. We don't know. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So, we need this is we need to start >> So, we need this is we need to start >> So, we need this is we need to start helping the church and helping helping the church and helping helping the church and helping believers. Now, it's it's easier than believers. Now, it's it's easier than believers. Now, it's it's easier than they think. they think. they think. >> I love what you're saying about even the >> I love what you're saying about even the >> I love what you're saying about even the life of the church because I think for life of the church because I think for life of the church because I think for someone who's listening who who maybe someone who's listening who who maybe someone who's listening who who maybe does feel just so intimidated how you does feel just so intimidated how you does feel just so intimidated how you know I hear Becky do it and I'm like, know I hear Becky do it and I'm like, know I hear Becky do it and I'm like, "Oh, "Oh, "Oh, >> that's exactly right." And I have no >> that's exactly right." And I have no >> that's exactly right." And I have no idea. I I would just encourage you. Um I idea. I I would just encourage you. Um I idea. I I would just encourage you. Um I have found it it's surprising the have found it it's surprising the have found it it's surprising the response when I just say, "Hey, would response when I just say, "Hey, would response when I just say, "Hey, would you like to come to Bible study with me you like to come to Bible study with me you like to come to Bible study with me or would you like to come to church with or would you like to come to church with or would you like to come to church with me?" Bible study is sometimes a little me?" Bible study is sometimes a little me?" Bible study is sometimes a little bit of an easier ask actually, bit of an easier ask actually, bit of an easier ask actually, especially if it's in the neighborhood especially if it's in the neighborhood especially if it's in the neighborhood or something. But just being or something. But just being or something. But just being invitational in our everyday lives and invitational in our everyday lives and invitational in our everyday lives and not separating those things and just not separating those things and just not separating those things and just even even I think the first hint when

even even I think the first hint when even even I think the first hint when you know you're talking to your neighbor you know you're talking to your neighbor you know you're talking to your neighbor and you're like, "Oh yeah, I'm heading and you're like, "Oh yeah, I'm heading and you're like, "Oh yeah, I'm heading to Bible study." Just being honest about to Bible study." Just being honest about to Bible study." Just being honest about who we are and what our lives are. who we are and what our lives are. who we are and what our lives are. Sometimes that makes you the person you Sometimes that makes you the person you Sometimes that makes you the person you just like your dad said to bring it back just like your dad said to bring it back just like your dad said to bring it back at the beginning or your or your at the beginning or your or your at the beginning or your or your grandmother, you got religion. They know grandmother, you got religion. They know grandmother, you got religion. They know yes, she's religious. But when they yes, she's religious. But when they yes, she's religious. But when they finally maybe have that moment that finally maybe have that moment that finally maybe have that moment that their life starts to fall apart, um, you their life starts to fall apart, um, you their life starts to fall apart, um, you might be the very one they turn to just might be the very one they turn to just might be the very one they turn to just because they think, "Wow, she's always because they think, "Wow, she's always because they think, "Wow, she's always been so friendly. Um, you know, she's been so friendly. Um, you know, she's been so friendly. Um, you know, she's always open to a conversation. Maybe I always open to a conversation. Maybe I always open to a conversation. Maybe I could ask her." Um, and so I just don't could ask her." Um, and so I just don't could ask her." Um, and so I just don't want us to even discount the power of want us to even discount the power of want us to even discount the power of our local churches and to say, "Yeah, our local churches and to say, "Yeah, our local churches and to say, "Yeah, maybe you don't know how to proclaim it, maybe you don't know how to proclaim it, maybe you don't know how to proclaim it, but but Lord willing, it's proclaimed but but Lord willing, it's proclaimed but but Lord willing, it's proclaimed every Sunday at at our churches." And so every Sunday at at our churches." And so every Sunday at at our churches." And so maybe you bring them with you and you maybe you bring them with you and you maybe you bring them with you and you say, "Sit with me on this pew." And I say, "Sit with me on this pew." And I say, "Sit with me on this pew." And I think there are a lot of people just think there are a lot of people just think there are a lot of people just like you said more open than ever to like you said more open than ever to like you said more open than ever to being invited um to something like being invited um to something like being invited um to something like church which you know maybe used to be church which you know maybe used to be church which you know maybe used to be intimidating but they've realized um the intimidating but they've realized um the intimidating but they've realized um the secular society that we've tried to secular society that we've tried to secular society that we've tried to create doesn't work. It's been a create doesn't work. It's been a create doesn't work. It's been a complete failure in a lot of ways.

complete failure in a lot of ways. complete failure in a lot of ways. People are just just as unhappy as they People are just just as unhappy as they People are just just as unhappy as they were before, even more so. And so we were before, even more so. And so we were before, even more so. And so we actually have something hopeful to give actually have something hopeful to give actually have something hopeful to give people. So this this conversation's been people. So this this conversation's been people. So this this conversation's been so helpful. so helpful. so helpful. >> My my last book was called Stay Salt. >> My my last book was called Stay Salt. >> My my last book was called Stay Salt. The world has changed. Our message must The world has changed. Our message must The world has changed. Our message must not. And the very last chapter is all not. And the very last chapter is all not. And the very last chapter is all about how can we build an evangelistic about how can we build an evangelistic about how can we build an evangelistic culture in our church. How can we be a culture in our church. How can we be a culture in our church. How can we be a church and this is so important church and this is so important church and this is so important that knows how to welcome the stranger that knows how to welcome the stranger that knows how to welcome the stranger in our midst. in our midst. in our midst. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> That knows how to reach out. It knows >> That knows how to reach out. It knows >> That knows how to reach out. It knows how to love. And how can we be a church how to love. And how can we be a church how to love. And how can we be a church that can help our our parishioners know that can help our our parishioners know that can help our our parishioners know that that evangelism is easier than they that that evangelism is easier than they that that evangelism is easier than they think, but we need but I want to add think, but we need but I want to add think, but we need but I want to add just one amendment to that and that is just one amendment to that and that is just one amendment to that and that is to immediately ask somebody to come to to immediately ask somebody to come to to immediately ask somebody to come to church or immediately ask and you church or immediately ask and you church or immediately ask and you weren't saying this but immediately ask weren't saying this but immediately ask weren't saying this but immediately ask them to go to a Bible study was is them to go to a Bible study was is them to go to a Bible study was is probably premature. We need to talk. We probably premature. We need to talk. We probably premature. We need to talk. We need to have fun. We need to have them need to have fun. We need to have them need to have fun. We need to have them in our home. and um and and and then in in our home. and um and and and then in in our home. and um and and and then in the context of that natural relationship the context of that natural relationship the context of that natural relationship and say, "Oh, you know what? Our pastor and say, "Oh, you know what? Our pastor and say, "Oh, you know what? Our pastor was just doing a sermon on this very was just doing a sermon on this very was just doing a sermon on this very thing we're talking about." But where do thing we're talking about." But where do thing we're talking about." But where do you find love? How do you how do you do you find love? How do you how do you do you find love? How do you how do you do it without um anyway, whichever way you it without um anyway, whichever way you it without um anyway, whichever way you want to see it, if you ever want to want to see it, if you ever want to want to see it, if you ever want to come, I'd love to bring you Let me just come, I'd love to bring you Let me just come, I'd love to bring you Let me just say one other thing about Bible study.

say one other thing about Bible study. say one other thing about Bible study. This is another thing I have in Stay This is another thing I have in Stay This is another thing I have in Stay Soul. I think one of the most effective Soul. I think one of the most effective Soul. I think one of the most effective tools I have seen in evangelism besides tools I have seen in evangelism besides tools I have seen in evangelism besides the whole relational part, the personal the whole relational part, the personal the whole relational part, the personal evangelism and all that as you get to evangelism and all that as you get to evangelism and all that as you get to know each other and um as trust know each other and um as trust know each other and um as trust develops, have what I call a seeker develops, have what I call a seeker develops, have what I call a seeker Bible study. I write a lot about this. Bible study. I write a lot about this. Bible study. I write a lot about this. I've written many seeker Bible studies. I've written many seeker Bible studies. I've written many seeker Bible studies. In other words, say, "Your questions are In other words, say, "Your questions are In other words, say, "Your questions are so good. Uh, have you ever actually read so good. Uh, have you ever actually read so good. Uh, have you ever actually read the New Testament or have you read any the New Testament or have you read any the New Testament or have you read any portion of of the Bible? What did you portion of of the Bible? What did you portion of of the Bible? What did you think? Well, usually say, "Well, you think? Well, usually say, "Well, you think? Well, usually say, "Well, you know, I remember maybe when I was a know, I remember maybe when I was a know, I remember maybe when I was a child or no, I haven't. I really child or no, I haven't. I really child or no, I haven't. I really haven't." Say, "Oh, listen. Listen. What haven't." Say, "Oh, listen. Listen. What haven't." Say, "Oh, listen. Listen. What would you think about just getting would you think about just getting would you think about just getting together and then get together with a together and then get together with a together and then get together with a couple of other friends where they couple of other friends where they couple of other friends where they haven't figured it out? They don't know. haven't figured it out? They don't know. haven't figured it out? They don't know. They're not sure what they think." But They're not sure what they think." But They're not sure what they think." But we're trying to just try and find out we're trying to just try and find out we're trying to just try and find out who is Jesus. What was he like? And you who is Jesus. What was he like? And you who is Jesus. What was he like? And you I think you're going to be really I think you're going to be really I think you're going to be really surprised. He's very different than what surprised. He's very different than what surprised. He's very different than what you think. And so it's a perfect you think. And so it's a perfect you think. And so it's a perfect followup to missions to evangelistic followup to missions to evangelistic followup to missions to evangelistic mission, but it's always a wonderful mission, but it's always a wonderful mission, but it's always a wonderful place to go as the relationship place to go as the relationship place to go as the relationship develops. Do a seeker Bible study. I've develops. Do a seeker Bible study. I've develops. Do a seeker Bible study. I've got one in John. I've got one in Luke.

got one in John. I've got one in Luke. got one in John. I've got one in Luke. And I've done this all over the world. I And I've done this all over the world. I And I've done this all over the world. I cannot tell you the number of people I cannot tell you the number of people I cannot tell you the number of people I have seen come to Christ because they have seen come to Christ because they have seen come to Christ because they were in a group with like-minded people were in a group with like-minded people were in a group with like-minded people but with two maybe Christians leading it but with two maybe Christians leading it but with two maybe Christians leading it but they were loving they introduced but they were loving they introduced but they were loving they introduced them to Jesus. The power of the word of them to Jesus. The power of the word of them to Jesus. The power of the word of God is so immense and Jesus just yeah he God is so immense and Jesus just yeah he God is so immense and Jesus just yeah he just comes alive. just comes alive. just comes alive. >> Becky I just love that. I think we have >> Becky I just love that. I think we have >> Becky I just love that. I think we have such a we um sometimes we put little such a we um sometimes we put little such a we um sometimes we put little Easter eggs in the you know little Easter eggs in the you know little Easter eggs in the you know little little treasures in the in the little treasures in the in the little treasures in the in the background and I had actually put this background and I had actually put this background and I had actually put this one which is we wrote this as as a one which is we wrote this as as a one which is we wrote this as as a study. It's on the I am statements study. It's on the I am statements study. It's on the I am statements behold and believe and so we're going to behold and believe and so we're going to behold and believe and so we're going to drop your studies in the show notes. drop your studies in the show notes. drop your studies in the show notes. We're going to drop this one in the show We're going to drop this one in the show We're going to drop this one in the show notes. We're going to drop your latest notes. We're going to drop your latest notes. We're going to drop your latest book Stay Salt. I love that title. Uh, I book Stay Salt. I love that title. Uh, I book Stay Salt. I love that title. Uh, I feel like this conversation could go on feel like this conversation could go on feel like this conversation could go on all day and I am so grateful because all day and I am so grateful because all day and I am so grateful because you're not just an example of this. You you're not just an example of this. You you're not just an example of this. You are equipping the church for this and are equipping the church for this and are equipping the church for this and this is our greatest joy. This is this this is our greatest joy. This is this this is our greatest joy. This is this is why we're here. We have we want I is why we're here. We have we want I is why we're here. We have we want I mean our prayer our hope is that uh mean our prayer our hope is that uh mean our prayer our hope is that uh everybody listening and that you know everybody listening and that you know everybody listening and that you know Melissa and I as we're having this Melissa and I as we're having this Melissa and I as we're having this conversation with you that we will be conversation with you that we will be conversation with you that we will be more compelled that we will have more more compelled that we will have more more compelled that we will have more joy more desire to continue to have joy more desire to continue to have joy more desire to continue to have these conversations in all spheres of these conversations in all spheres of these conversations in all spheres of our life. And so so we're praying that our life. And so so we're praying that our life. And so so we're praying that for everybody listening. We're praying for everybody listening. We're praying for everybody listening. We're praying that for ourselves. And we hope that you that for ourselves. And we hope that you that for ourselves. And we hope that you have enjoyed this episode of the deep have enjoyed this episode of the deep have enjoyed this episode of the deep dish from the gospel coalition. If you dish from the gospel coalition. If you dish from the gospel coalition. If you have found this conversation helpful, have found this conversation helpful, have found this conversation helpful, which I don't know how you couldn't have

which I don't know how you couldn't have which I don't know how you couldn't have because Becky, that was just incredibly because Becky, that was just incredibly because Becky, that was just incredibly helpful. It was practical and it was helpful. It was practical and it was helpful. It was practical and it was also um compelling. But if you have also um compelling. But if you have also um compelling. But if you have found this helpful, then please like and found this helpful, then please like and found this helpful, then please like and subscribe. And really what we need right subscribe. And really what we need right subscribe. And really what we need right now, Melissa and I have been sort of now, Melissa and I have been sort of now, Melissa and I have been sort of putting this out there at the end of putting this out there at the end of putting this out there at the end of every episode. We would love your review every episode. We would love your review every episode. We would love your review on Apple Podcast. It just helps us get on Apple Podcast. It just helps us get on Apple Podcast. It just helps us get these conversations into more people's these conversations into more people's these conversations into more people's hands. So please consider sharing it hands. So please consider sharing it hands. So please consider sharing it with a friend. We'd love your review on with a friend. We'd love your review on with a friend. We'd love your review on Apple podcast and we will see you next Apple podcast and we will see you next Apple podcast and we will see you next time on the deep dish.