How Ina Garten Learned to Trust Herself | The Interview

I remember thinking how crazy it was to I remember thinking how crazy it was to disagree with the top cookbook editor in disagree with the top cookbook editor in disagree with the top cookbook editor in the country. And I remember saying to the country. And I remember saying to the country. And I remember saying to myself, well, either I'm wrong and he'll myself, well, either I'm wrong and he'll myself, well, either I'm wrong and he'll never have to see me again or I'm right never have to see me again or I'm right never have to see me again or I'm right and he'll think I'm a genius. I'm Lulu Garcia Navaro and today I'm I'm Lulu Garcia Navaro and today I'm interviewing a garden. Garden's best interviewing a garden. Garden's best interviewing a garden. Garden's best known for her cookbooks and her show known for her cookbooks and her show known for her cookbooks and her show Barefoot Contessa, which premiered on the Food Network which premiered on the Food Network almost 24 years ago. I'm always looking almost 24 years ago. I'm always looking almost 24 years ago. I'm always looking for new ways to cook chicken, but for new ways to cook chicken, but for new ways to cook chicken, but nothing says summer more than cooking nothing says summer more than cooking nothing says summer more than cooking chicken on a grill. That show taught chicken on a grill. That show taught chicken on a grill. That show taught people how to cook. 1/4 cup of olive people how to cook. 1/4 cup of olive people how to cook. 1/4 cup of olive oil, [music] a cup of onion, how to oil, [music] a cup of onion, how to oil, [music] a cup of onion, how to entertain. So, I'm going to have entertain. So, I'm going to have entertain. So, I'm going to have cocktails and ordurves on the porch. cocktails and ordurves on the porch. cocktails and ordurves on the porch. [music] I'm going to have dinner on the [music] I'm going to have dinner on the [music] I'm going to have dinner on the dining room table. It's going to be dining room table. It's going to be dining room table. It's going to be casual. And how to be unfussy about it. casual. And how to be unfussy about it. casual. And how to be unfussy about it. You can use ingredients from the store You can use ingredients from the store You can use ingredients from the store like a pound cake or vanilla ice cream like a pound cake or vanilla ice cream like a pound cake or vanilla ice cream that are just as good as homemade. that are just as good as homemade. that are just as good as homemade. >> Gart's laid-back style and pluckucky >> Gart's laid-back style and pluckucky >> Gart's laid-back style and pluckucky personality made her both a household personality made her both a household personality made her both a household name and a cult figure.

name and a cult figure. name and a cult figure. Delicious. [laughter] Delicious. [laughter] Delicious. [laughter] >> Lovingly parodyied and meme'd on social >> Lovingly parodyied and meme'd on social >> Lovingly parodyied and meme'd on social [music] media. [music] media. [music] media. >> Tonight, I'm making a wonderful dinner >> Tonight, I'm making a wonderful dinner >> Tonight, I'm making a wonderful dinner and it starts with brownie pudding. And and it starts with brownie pudding. And and it starts with brownie pudding. And now at 78, she's doing something new, now at 78, she's doing something new, now at 78, she's doing something new, launching a video podcast called Happy launching a video podcast called Happy launching a video podcast called Happy Hour with AA and her 14th cookbook, Hour with AA and her 14th cookbook, Hour with AA and her 14th cookbook, Simply Aa, is coming out this fall. Simply Aa, is coming out this fall. Simply Aa, is coming out this fall. Here's my conversation with a garden. Here's my conversation with a garden. Here's my conversation with a garden. [music] I am thrilled to have you here. I have I am thrilled to have you here. I have watched you for such a long time. Um, I watched you for such a long time. Um, I watched you for such a long time. Um, I have cooked your recipes and so it is a have cooked your recipes and so it is a have cooked your recipes and so it is a great pleasure to welcome you to the great pleasure to welcome you to the great pleasure to welcome you to the interview. interview. interview. >> Thank you, Lulu. I've I love what you >> Thank you, Lulu. I've I love what you >> Thank you, Lulu. I've I love what you do, too. So, it's I'm so thrilled to be do, too. So, it's I'm so thrilled to be do, too. So, it's I'm so thrilled to be here. Really honored. here. Really honored. here. Really honored. >> Okay. So, I've been doing the math on >> Okay. So, I've been doing the math on >> Okay. So, I've been doing the math on your life. Um [laughter] your life. Um [laughter] your life. Um [laughter] >> um you're now 78 years old. >> um you're now 78 years old. >> um you're now 78 years old. >> Um and you are just about to start this >> Um and you are just about to start this >> Um and you are just about to start this whole new chapter. Uh you are launching whole new chapter. Uh you are launching whole new chapter. Uh you are launching a podcast. a podcast. a podcast. >> I am. >> I am. >> I am. >> Um and you started your Celebrated Food >> Um and you started your Celebrated Food >> Um and you started your Celebrated Food Network uh TV show when you were in your Network uh TV show when you were in your Network uh TV show when you were in your mid-50s and you wrote your first mid-50s and you wrote your first mid-50s and you wrote your first cookbook when you were in your early cookbook when you were in your early cookbook when you were in your early 50s. And I find this very inspirational 50s. And I find this very inspirational 50s. And I find this very inspirational as a woman also in my 50s. What have you as a woman also in my 50s. What have you as a woman also in my 50s. What have you learned about taking on challenges in learned about taking on challenges in learned about taking on challenges in later life? I think that um when I look later life? I think that um when I look later life? I think that um when I look back and I think about the things that back and I think about the things that back and I think about the things that I've done like writing cookbooks and I I I've done like writing cookbooks and I I I've done like writing cookbooks and I I love working scared love working scared love working scared >> um because it keeps me up at night. So I >> um because it keeps me up at night. So I >> um because it keeps me up at night. So I love, you know, I love this expression

love, you know, I love this expression love, you know, I love this expression getting out over your skis. Well, you getting out over your skis. Well, you getting out over your skis. Well, you have no choice. You've invested your have no choice. You've invested your have no choice. You've invested your money. you've um you know sort of made a money. you've um you know sort of made a money. you've um you know sort of made a stake in what you've decided to do stake in what you've decided to do stake in what you've decided to do whether it's books or TV. Um and very whether it's books or TV. Um and very whether it's books or TV. Um and very often I've said no to things for years often I've said no to things for years often I've said no to things for years until I figured out how can I do this until I figured out how can I do this until I figured out how can I do this differently? Like I don't I don't like differently? Like I don't I don't like differently? Like I don't I don't like doing it the way everybody else does it. doing it the way everybody else does it. doing it the way everybody else does it. I like doing taking something like books I like doing taking something like books I like doing taking something like books and saying most cookbooks are in when I and saying most cookbooks are in when I and saying most cookbooks are in when I started in 1999 most cookbooks had like started in 1999 most cookbooks had like started in 1999 most cookbooks had like 250 recipes. I mean who needs 250 250 recipes. I mean who needs 250 250 recipes. I mean who needs 250 recipes? I need 75 really good recipes recipes? I need 75 really good recipes recipes? I need 75 really good recipes that I can make over and over again. Um, that I can make over and over again. Um, that I can make over and over again. Um, and so when I decided to write and so when I decided to write and so when I decided to write cookbooks, I thought, okay, I'm going to cookbooks, I thought, okay, I'm going to cookbooks, I thought, okay, I'm going to write this book. And I'm not even sure write this book. And I'm not even sure write this book. And I'm not even sure my publisher was convinced that it was my publisher was convinced that it was my publisher was convinced that it was going to work, but it worked out okay. going to work, but it worked out okay. going to work, but it worked out okay. [laughter] [laughter] [laughter] >> Yeah. I think one of the things though >> Yeah. I think one of the things though >> Yeah. I think one of the things though that happens when people get older in that happens when people get older in that happens when people get older in particular, um, is that you get more particular, um, is that you get more particular, um, is that you get more afraid. Um, you know, afraid. Um, you know, afraid. Um, you know, >> get more afraid. Oh, that's interesting. >> get more afraid. Oh, that's interesting. >> get more afraid. Oh, that's interesting. I thought you were going to say get more I thought you were going to say get more I thought you were going to say get more confident. confident. confident. >> No, I don't. I think I I actually don't >> No, I don't. I think I I actually don't >> No, I don't. I think I I actually don't think people have more to lose.

think people have more to lose. think people have more to lose. >> Well, you have more to lose. You get >> Well, you have more to lose. You get >> Well, you have more to lose. You get more set in your ways. You know, just more set in your ways. You know, just more set in your ways. You know, just the opposite actually. the opposite actually. the opposite actually. >> I know. That's what I'm and I think >> I know. That's what I'm and I think >> I know. That's what I'm and I think that's such a great um that's such a great um that's such a great um lesson, but I think it's it's unusual. lesson, but I think it's it's unusual. lesson, but I think it's it's unusual. >> I think I have a very low threshold of >> I think I have a very low threshold of >> I think I have a very low threshold of boredom. boredom. boredom. >> If I know how to do something, I don't >> If I know how to do something, I don't >> If I know how to do something, I don't want to do it again. want to do it again. want to do it again. >> I I I love um using what I've learned >> I I I love um using what I've learned >> I I I love um using what I've learned and and figuring out the next step. and and figuring out the next step. and and figuring out the next step. >> It's really clear for me. it. I ask >> It's really clear for me. it. I ask >> It's really clear for me. it. I ask myself one question. Is it going to be myself one question. Is it going to be myself one question. Is it going to be fun? fun? fun? >> And if it's fun, then I I really want to >> And if it's fun, then I I really want to >> And if it's fun, then I I really want to do it. I just have to figure out how to do it. I just have to figure out how to do it. I just have to figure out how to make sure it's fun. I mean, it's working make sure it's fun. I mean, it's working make sure it's fun. I mean, it's working with people that I love working with. with people that I love working with. with people that I love working with. Um, it's working with creative people. I Um, it's working with creative people. I Um, it's working with creative people. I mean, in the cookbook, I have food mean, in the cookbook, I have food mean, in the cookbook, I have food stylists doing the photographs and stylists doing the photographs and stylists doing the photographs and photographer. Um, I there are people I photographer. Um, I there are people I photographer. Um, I there are people I look forward to working where we create look forward to working where we create look forward to working where we create something that's better than any one of something that's better than any one of something that's better than any one of us alone. And I'm responsible for the us alone. And I'm responsible for the us alone. And I'm responsible for the team. I love that feeling. It's kind of team. I love that feeling. It's kind of team. I love that feeling. It's kind of like a great ballet where everybody's like a great ballet where everybody's like a great ballet where everybody's working together. So, I like that working together. So, I like that working together. So, I like that feeling of building something with feeling of building something with feeling of building something with people. Well, let's talk about the two people. Well, let's talk about the two people. Well, let's talk about the two new projects that you have coming out.

new projects that you have coming out. new projects that you have coming out. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Um a podcast um and a new cookbook. >> Um a podcast um and a new cookbook. >> Um a podcast um and a new cookbook. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um let's start with the cookbook. It's >> Um let's start with the cookbook. It's >> Um let's start with the cookbook. It's the first one in four years. the first one in four years. the first one in four years. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Uh it's called Simply AA. The recipes >> Uh it's called Simply AA. The recipes >> Uh it's called Simply AA. The recipes all look easy and delicious, which are all look easy and delicious, which are all look easy and delicious, which are your signature. your signature. your signature. >> Um have you ever been tempted to make >> Um have you ever been tempted to make >> Um have you ever been tempted to make something off-brand? complicated. Aina, something off-brand? complicated. Aina, something off-brand? complicated. Aina, fussy aa, you know, pretentious. Um, fussy aa, you know, pretentious. Um, fussy aa, you know, pretentious. Um, let's make cassulet, right? let's make cassulet, right? let's make cassulet, right? >> Yeah. Let's [laughter] make casslet. >> Yeah. Let's [laughter] make casslet. >> Yeah. Let's [laughter] make casslet. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. >> Um, no, >> Um, no, >> Um, no, I I actually am not that good a cook. I I I actually am not that good a cook. I I I actually am not that good a cook. I think of myself more as a taster. I know think of myself more as a taster. I know think of myself more as a taster. I know what I'm looking for in flavor and what I'm looking for in flavor and what I'm looking for in flavor and texture, but um I don't like spending texture, but um I don't like spending texture, but um I don't like spending hours in the kitchen cooking. I really hours in the kitchen cooking. I really hours in the kitchen cooking. I really don't. When I wrote my first book, which don't. When I wrote my first book, which don't. When I wrote my first book, which was the bear for contestant cookbook, I was the bear for contestant cookbook, I was the bear for contestant cookbook, I I decided I wanted to have several I decided I wanted to have several I decided I wanted to have several things. I wanted it to have um gorgeous things. I wanted it to have um gorgeous things. I wanted it to have um gorgeous photographs so that when you looked at photographs so that when you looked at photographs so that when you looked at it, you thought, "Oh, that looks it, you thought, "Oh, that looks it, you thought, "Oh, that looks delicious." And then you looked at the delicious." And then you looked at the delicious." And then you looked at the recipe and you thought, "I could recipe and you thought, "I could recipe and you thought, "I could actually make that recipe." And then you actually make that recipe." And then you actually make that recipe." And then you looked at the ingredients and thought, looked at the ingredients and thought, looked at the ingredients and thought, "Oh, I can get all those ingredients in "Oh, I can get all those ingredients in "Oh, I can get all those ingredients in my local grocery store." That was a my local grocery store." That was a my local grocery store." That was a guiding principle of the first book and guiding principle of the first book and guiding principle of the first book and it's still the guiding principle it's still the guiding principle it's still the guiding principle principle. There may be a few things principle. There may be a few things principle. There may be a few things like truffle butter that you, you know, like truffle butter that you, you know, like truffle butter that you, you know, can order online and keep in the can order online and keep in the can order online and keep in the freezer, but very, very few things like freezer, but very, very few things like freezer, but very, very few things like that. Most things you can buy locally.

that. Most things you can buy locally. that. Most things you can buy locally. And because this is about keeping things And because this is about keeping things And because this is about keeping things simple, it's even the the recipes are simple, it's even the the recipes are simple, it's even the the recipes are even easier. even easier. even easier. >> Do you like eating complicated food? >> Do you like eating complicated food? >> Do you like eating complicated food? Like do when you go to a restaurant, do Like do when you go to a restaurant, do Like do when you go to a restaurant, do you order complicated food? you order complicated food? you order complicated food? >> I hate it. [laughter] >> I hate it. [laughter] >> I hate it. [laughter] >> Really? >> Really? >> Really? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I'm the first one who's going to order a >> I'm the first one who's going to order a >> I'm the first one who's going to order a roast chicken in a restaurant. roast chicken in a restaurant. roast chicken in a restaurant. [laughter] [laughter] [laughter] Um, no. I really don't like complicated Um, no. I really don't like complicated Um, no. I really don't like complicated food and I don't like tasty menus. They food and I don't like tasty menus. They food and I don't like tasty menus. They give me a headache. Neither do give me a headache. Neither do give me a headache. Neither do >> all those flavors just are like, oh my >> all those flavors just are like, oh my >> all those flavors just are like, oh my god. And I don't like when somebody puts god. And I don't like when somebody puts god. And I don't like when somebody puts something down on on, you know, in front something down on on, you know, in front something down on on, you know, in front of me that I have no idea what it is. of me that I have no idea what it is. of me that I have no idea what it is. >> I just I'm not a an adventurous eater at >> I just I'm not a an adventurous eater at >> I just I'm not a an adventurous eater at all. And I think my recipes reflect all. And I think my recipes reflect all. And I think my recipes reflect that. I like, you know, raspberry that. I like, you know, raspberry that. I like, you know, raspberry cheesecake. You know, like you know cheesecake. You know, like you know cheesecake. You know, like you know exactly what what it's going to taste exactly what what it's going to taste exactly what what it's going to taste like. like. like. >> Let's talk about your podcast. >> Let's talk about your podcast. >> Let's talk about your podcast. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> You'll be making cocktails and mocktails >> You'll be making cocktails and mocktails >> You'll be making cocktails and mocktails with a guest. Is that right? with a guest. Is that right? with a guest. Is that right? >> Well, I mean, I'm going to serve a >> Well, I mean, I'm going to serve a >> Well, I mean, I'm going to serve a cocktail and mocktail to each person. cocktail and mocktail to each person. cocktail and mocktail to each person. >> Oh, you're you're not going to make it >> Oh, you're you're not going to make it >> Oh, you're you're not going to make it with me. with me. with me. >> You're not going to make it. Yeah. >> You're not going to make it. Yeah. >> You're not going to make it. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. >> All right. So day drinking with aa. >> All right. So day drinking with aa. >> All right. So day drinking with aa. [laughter] [laughter] [laughter] >> No, it's not. It's not day drinking with >> No, it's not. It's not day drinking with >> No, it's not. It's not day drinking with aa. aa. aa. >> A that sounds great.

>> A that sounds great. >> A that sounds great. >> People are invited at 5:00. Okay. >> People are invited at 5:00. Okay. >> People are invited at 5:00. Okay. >> So it's cocktail hour. >> So it's cocktail hour. >> So it's cocktail hour. >> It's cocktail hour. [laughter] Okay. >> It's cocktail hour. [laughter] Okay. >> It's cocktail hour. [laughter] Okay. >> But it's really about the conversation. >> But it's really about the conversation. >> But it's really about the conversation. >> What makes a good conversation for you? >> What makes a good conversation for you? >> What makes a good conversation for you? >> Um I think what I'm always looking for >> Um I think what I'm always looking for >> Um I think what I'm always looking for is where I connect with the guest. Um so is where I connect with the guest. Um so is where I connect with the guest. Um so for example with Allison Roman, she for example with Allison Roman, she for example with Allison Roman, she writes cookbooks. She has a specialy writes cookbooks. She has a specialy writes cookbooks. She has a specialy food store um in upstate New York. we food store um in upstate New York. we food store um in upstate New York. we have a lot of common experiences and so have a lot of common experiences and so have a lot of common experiences and so it's really fun to talk about how she it's really fun to talk about how she it's really fun to talk about how she sees building a business, how she sees sees building a business, how she sees sees building a business, how she sees writing recipes. Um, I think that's writing recipes. Um, I think that's writing recipes. Um, I think that's that's what I'm always looking for. And that's what I'm always looking for. And that's what I'm always looking for. And it's it's interesting no matter what the it's it's interesting no matter what the it's it's interesting no matter what the the guest does, whether it's a movie the guest does, whether it's a movie the guest does, whether it's a movie director or a a writer like Aunt director or a a writer like Aunt director or a a writer like Aunt Patchet, um, we always can find a common Patchet, um, we always can find a common Patchet, um, we always can find a common thread. You know, I think having a good thread. You know, I think having a good thread. You know, I think having a good conversation conversation conversation also means having a little bit of also means having a little bit of also means having a little bit of tension at some point. Um, but I think tension at some point. Um, but I think tension at some point. Um, but I think that's probably not your philosophy. Am that's probably not your philosophy. Am that's probably not your philosophy. Am I right? I right? I right? >> Hadn't thought about it, but now I'm >> Hadn't thought about it, but now I'm >> Hadn't thought about it, but now I'm going to Yeah. Like what's what's going to Yeah. Like what's what's going to Yeah. Like what's what's tension in a conversation where you tension in a conversation where you tension in a conversation where you disagree about something? You know, disagree about something? You know, disagree about something? You know, there are a lot of celebrity podcasts there are a lot of celebrity podcasts there are a lot of celebrity podcasts now, um, where famous people interview now, um, where famous people interview now, um, where famous people interview other famous people and they're very other famous people and they're very other famous people and they're very friendly and they're very fun, but I friendly and they're very fun, but I friendly and they're very fun, but I think they often steer clear of think they often steer clear of think they often steer clear of difficult questions or touchy questions difficult questions or touchy questions difficult questions or touchy questions in part because the interviewer and the in part because the interviewer and the in part because the interviewer and the interviewe are either friends or they're interviewe are either friends or they're interviewe are either friends or they're in the same social circles or you're in the same social circles or you're in the same social circles or you're going to see them again at some point.

going to see them again at some point. going to see them again at some point. >> And sometimes the conversations don't go >> And sometimes the conversations don't go >> And sometimes the conversations don't go very deep. they kind of um skirt the very deep. they kind of um skirt the very deep. they kind of um skirt the surface and I was just wondering have surface and I was just wondering have surface and I was just wondering have you thought about na how you navigate you thought about na how you navigate you thought about na how you navigate that? I actually think it should be fun. that? I actually think it should be fun. that? I actually think it should be fun. >> I think it should the person should have >> I think it should the person should have >> I think it should the person should have an interesting point of view but I'm an interesting point of view but I'm an interesting point of view but I'm really conscious that I want every really conscious that I want every really conscious that I want every conversation to have things that the the conversation to have things that the the conversation to have things that the the listener can take away. listener can take away. listener can take away. >> So it's not just you and I are talking, >> So it's not just you and I are talking, >> So it's not just you and I are talking, it's that we're sharing our experience it's that we're sharing our experience it's that we're sharing our experience about how we do something. Um what's about how we do something. Um what's about how we do something. Um what's interest Allison and I talked about um a interest Allison and I talked about um a interest Allison and I talked about um a book that I had read called Why We Buy, book that I had read called Why We Buy, book that I had read called Why We Buy, like how um people shop like how um people shop like how um people shop >> and I I'm sure somebody listening is >> and I I'm sure somebody listening is >> and I I'm sure somebody listening is going to go out and buy that book and going to go out and buy that book and going to go out and buy that book and it's going to change change how they it's going to change change how they it's going to change change how they retail retail retail >> whatever it is they're selling. So my my >> whatever it is they're selling. So my my >> whatever it is they're selling. So my my goal is not just to have a really goal is not just to have a really goal is not just to have a really interesting conversation, but to connect interesting conversation, but to connect interesting conversation, but to connect with the audience with the audience with the audience >> and and that's like the way I write >> and and that's like the way I write >> and and that's like the way I write cookbooks and it's the way I um do the cookbooks and it's the way I um do the cookbooks and it's the way I um do the TV show. It's what's the user TV show. It's what's the user TV show. It's what's the user experience?

experience? experience? >> Is it is it enjoyable to listen to and >> Is it is it enjoyable to listen to and >> Is it is it enjoyable to listen to and do you learn something from it? And the do you learn something from it? And the do you learn something from it? And the other thing is I think it's really other thing is I think it's really other thing is I think it's really important to ask questions you don't important to ask questions you don't important to ask questions you don't know the answer to know the answer to know the answer to >> and and and let go of control of the >> and and and let go of control of the >> and and and let go of control of the conversation. conversation. conversation. >> Why did you want to do this? Why did you >> Why did you want to do this? Why did you >> Why did you want to do this? Why did you want to have a a a podcast um which is want to have a a a podcast um which is want to have a a a podcast um which is nowadays a TV show? Because it's going nowadays a TV show? Because it's going nowadays a TV show? Because it's going to be filmed obviously. Um I because it to be filmed obviously. Um I because it to be filmed obviously. Um I because it re I think it really goes back to my re I think it really goes back to my re I think it really goes back to my childhood where I couldn't connect with childhood where I couldn't connect with childhood where I couldn't connect with my parents and I I I crave that my parents and I I I crave that my parents and I I I crave that connection with people and that's why my connection with people and that's why my connection with people and that's why my friends are very important and I just I friends are very important and I just I friends are very important and I just I find this so interesting the stories find this so interesting the stories find this so interesting the stories that people have told me on be my guest that people have told me on be my guest that people have told me on be my guest >> like Emily Blunt talking about having a >> like Emily Blunt talking about having a >> like Emily Blunt talking about having a a a stutter a a stutter a a stutter >> which was debilitating when she was a >> which was debilitating when she was a >> which was debilitating when she was a child and so I just I find people's child and so I just I find people's child and so I just I find people's stories really inspiring and it's the stories really inspiring and it's the stories really inspiring and it's the difficult things in their lives that difficult things in their lives that difficult things in their lives that have led to the things that have have have led to the things that have have have led to the things that have have changed. Like Marcus Samuelson, do you changed. Like Marcus Samuelson, do you changed. Like Marcus Samuelson, do you know the story of Marcus Samuelson? Um know the story of Marcus Samuelson? Um know the story of Marcus Samuelson? Um when he was 3 years old, he his mother when he was 3 years old, he his mother when he was 3 years old, he his mother and his 5-year-old sister got and his 5-year-old sister got and his 5-year-old sister got tuberculosis and their their mother tuberculosis and their their mother tuberculosis and their their mother walked them from the village in Ethiopia walked them from the village in Ethiopia walked them from the village in Ethiopia where they lived to a hospital to get where they lived to a hospital to get where they lived to a hospital to get treatment and I don't know how long it treatment and I don't know how long it treatment and I don't know how long it was like 20 miles without shoes. walked was like 20 miles without shoes. walked was like 20 miles without shoes. walked to this treatment center and the and the to this treatment center and the and the to this treatment center and the and the mother died mother died mother died >> and left two children and a nurse knew >> and left two children and a nurse knew >> and left two children and a nurse knew that there was somebody in Sweden that that there was somebody in Sweden that that there was somebody in Sweden that was interested in adopting a young boy was interested in adopting a young boy was interested in adopting a young boy and she called and said I have a young

and she called and said I have a young and she called and said I have a young boy but he has a sister and I won't boy but he has a sister and I won't boy but he has a sister and I won't break them up and the Swedish family break them up and the Swedish family break them up and the Swedish family said them both said them both said them both >> so Marcus Samuelson ended up from the >> so Marcus Samuelson ended up from the >> so Marcus Samuelson ended up from the worst thing that could possibly happen worst thing that could possibly happen worst thing that could possibly happen to you he lost his mother when he was to you he lost his mother when he was to you he lost his mother when he was three with a Swedish family and the three with a Swedish family and the three with a Swedish family and the grandmother said, "Come, come cook with grandmother said, "Come, come cook with grandmother said, "Come, come cook with me." me." me." How did this happen? He's a brilliant How did this happen? He's a brilliant How did this happen? He's a brilliant cook and he's got fabulous restaurants. cook and he's got fabulous restaurants. cook and he's got fabulous restaurants. Never would have happened if the worst Never would have happened if the worst Never would have happened if the worst thing in his life hadn't happened at thing in his life hadn't happened at thing in his life hadn't happened at that moment. that moment. that moment. >> What is that for you? What is that >> What is that for you? What is that >> What is that for you? What is that origin story for you? origin story for you? origin story for you? >> Well, I think that I I had a very tough >> Well, I think that I I had a very tough >> Well, I think that I I had a very tough childhood and it was lonely and it was childhood and it was lonely and it was childhood and it was lonely and it was um um um >> You had a mother who was very um >> You had a mother who was very um >> You had a mother who was very um >> disconnected. >> disconnected. >> disconnected. >> Disconnected >> Disconnected >> Disconnected >> and my father was always mad at me. >> and my father was always mad at me. >> and my father was always mad at me. >> Yeah. [laughter] I don't know why, but >> Yeah. [laughter] I don't know why, but >> Yeah. [laughter] I don't know why, but um uh cuz you tried to control me. So, I um uh cuz you tried to control me. So, I um uh cuz you tried to control me. So, I mean, what goes in early goes in deep. mean, what goes in early goes in deep. mean, what goes in early goes in deep. And I'm always trying to recreate what I And I'm always trying to recreate what I And I'm always trying to recreate what I what I craved when I was a kid. what I craved when I was a kid. what I craved when I was a kid. >> Yeah. I think either people repeat their >> Yeah. I think either people repeat their >> Yeah. I think either people repeat their parents' mistakes. parents' mistakes. parents' mistakes. >> Well, that's that's intentionality. >> Well, that's that's intentionality. >> Well, that's that's intentionality. >> Yeah. Or they or they really try to move >> Yeah. Or they or they really try to move >> Yeah. Or they or they really try to move away from it.

away from it. away from it. >> I had a lot of help figuring out what >> I had a lot of help figuring out what >> I had a lot of help figuring out what happened cuz I don't think I I happened cuz I don't think I I happened cuz I don't think I I understood it until I was probably 40. M understood it until I was probably 40. M understood it until I was probably 40. M >> and and then once you understand it and >> and and then once you understand it and >> and and then once you understand it and you say, "Oh, it was that wasn't you say, "Oh, it was that wasn't you say, "Oh, it was that wasn't everybody's childhood." everybody's childhood." everybody's childhood." >> When you're a kid, you think everybody >> When you're a kid, you think everybody >> When you're a kid, you think everybody lives like that. And then you realize, lives like that. And then you realize, lives like that. And then you realize, "No, it doesn't." And you make a "No, it doesn't." And you make a "No, it doesn't." And you make a decision to do it differently. decision to do it differently. decision to do it differently. >> Your your your history isn't necessarily >> Your your your history isn't necessarily >> Your your your history isn't necessarily your life. your life. your life. >> You have to break free of it at some >> You have to break free of it at some >> You have to break free of it at some point. point. point. >> You have to be think figure it out and >> You have to be think figure it out and >> You have to be think figure it out and then decide how you want to live. then decide how you want to live. then decide how you want to live. >> Yeah. Um, your story can be seen as a >> Yeah. Um, your story can be seen as a >> Yeah. Um, your story can be seen as a series of beginnings or actually a series of beginnings or actually a series of beginnings or actually a series of endings. Um, as I was sort of series of endings. Um, as I was sort of series of endings. Um, as I was sort of looking at things, you stopped catering looking at things, you stopped catering looking at things, you stopped catering at a certain point. Um, and catering had at a certain point. Um, and catering had at a certain point. Um, and catering had helped sort of propel you into the food helped sort of propel you into the food helped sort of propel you into the food world when you had your specialty store. world when you had your specialty store. world when you had your specialty store. or was allowing you to be in people's or was allowing you to be in people's or was allowing you to be in people's houses and you know it was a lot of your houses and you know it was a lot of your houses and you know it was a lot of your business initially and you just decided business initially and you just decided business initially and you just decided it wasn't working out because because I it wasn't working out because because I it wasn't working out because because I would run barefoot contestant during the would run barefoot contestant during the would run barefoot contestant during the day and then at 4 or 5:00 I would go to day and then at 4 or 5:00 I would go to day and then at 4 or 5:00 I would go to we would do like 10 parties at night and we would do like 10 parties at night and we would do like 10 parties at night and I'd get home at 1:00 in the morning I'd get home at 1:00 in the morning I'd get home at 1:00 in the morning exhausted and on Sunday my only day off exhausted and on Sunday my only day off exhausted and on Sunday my only day off was you know it's basically the was you know it's basically the was you know it's basically the afternoon I had off I couldn't even talk afternoon I had off I couldn't even talk afternoon I had off I couldn't even talk I was so exhausted I thought okay this I was so exhausted I thought okay this I was so exhausted I thought okay this is not working right because it really I is not working right because it really I is not working right because it really I I couldn't work and have a personal life I couldn't work and have a personal life I couldn't work and have a personal life at the same time.

at the same time. at the same time. >> And then you sold your iconic store um >> And then you sold your iconic store um >> And then you sold your iconic store um for similar reasons. for similar reasons. for similar reasons. >> I I think I sold the store because I >> I I think I sold the store because I >> I I think I sold the store because I knew how to do it. knew how to do it. knew how to do it. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And it was no longer a challenge. And I >> And it was no longer a challenge. And I >> And it was no longer a challenge. And I think if you're not bringing new energy think if you're not bringing new energy think if you're not bringing new energy and new ideas to a business, um it's and new ideas to a business, um it's and new ideas to a business, um it's time to pass it off to somebody else who time to pass it off to somebody else who time to pass it off to somebody else who who will. who will. who will. >> And then you stop selling prepared foods >> And then you stop selling prepared foods >> And then you stop selling prepared foods at a certain point. Um you know, some at a certain point. Um you know, some at a certain point. Um you know, some people expand their business. say, you people expand their business. say, you people expand their business. say, you know, they just keep adding and you seem know, they just keep adding and you seem know, they just keep adding and you seem to replace and I thought that that was to replace and I thought that that was to replace and I thought that that was very interesting. very interesting. very interesting. >> It is interesting. I don't expand it. I >> It is interesting. I don't expand it. I >> It is interesting. I don't expand it. I do it sequentially. You're absolutely do it sequentially. You're absolutely do it sequentially. You're absolutely right. Hadn't thought about it that way. right. Hadn't thought about it that way. right. Hadn't thought about it that way. Um I think that when I know how to do Um I think that when I know how to do Um I think that when I know how to do something, I don't want to do it something, I don't want to do it something, I don't want to do it anymore. [laughter] anymore. [laughter] anymore. [laughter] It's really that simple. And um I mean It's really that simple. And um I mean It's really that simple. And um I mean sometimes I've taken, you know, one time sometimes I've taken, you know, one time sometimes I've taken, you know, one time I took a year off to try and figure out I took a year off to try and figure out I took a year off to try and figure out what to do next. And at I remember in what to do next. And at I remember in what to do next. And at I remember in the middle of that thinking this is the the middle of that thinking this is the the middle of that thinking this is the worst year I've ever had cuz I have worst year I've ever had cuz I have worst year I've ever had cuz I have nothing to do which is not my favorite nothing to do which is not my favorite nothing to do which is not my favorite thing. Um but I never would have started thing. Um but I never would have started thing. Um but I never would have started writing cookbooks if I hadn't done it. I writing cookbooks if I hadn't done it. I writing cookbooks if I hadn't done it. I did it just to have something to do and did it just to have something to do and did it just to have something to do and it turned out to be so much more it turned out to be so much more it turned out to be so much more interesting than I expected.

interesting than I expected. interesting than I expected. >> So I I think I kind of like the the >> So I I think I kind of like the the >> So I I think I kind of like the the journey, you know, like just finding out journey, you know, like just finding out journey, you know, like just finding out where my place is and what what works. where my place is and what what works. where my place is and what what works. And it's I I always see it as like And it's I I always see it as like And it's I I always see it as like tapping on a wall and I'm just tap tap tapping on a wall and I'm just tap tap tapping on a wall and I'm just tap tap tap until I hear like a hollow sound and tap until I hear like a hollow sound and tap until I hear like a hollow sound and I'm like, "Okay, that's where I'm going I'm like, "Okay, that's where I'm going I'm like, "Okay, that's where I'm going to go." to go." to go." >> And it's not what I'm going to finish >> And it's not what I'm going to finish >> And it's not what I'm going to finish with. It's what I'm going to start and with. It's what I'm going to start and with. It's what I'm going to start and I'm going to see where this leads. I'm going to see where this leads. I'm going to see where this leads. >> Um, and maybe because maybe because I >> Um, and maybe because maybe because I >> Um, and maybe because maybe because I like to have control over what I'm like to have control over what I'm like to have control over what I'm doing. Um, I don't like expanding it doing. Um, I don't like expanding it doing. Um, I don't like expanding it with more and more people and bigger. I with more and more people and bigger. I with more and more people and bigger. I like I like doing things sequentially. I like I like doing things sequentially. I like I like doing things sequentially. I hadn't thought about it that way, but hadn't thought about it that way, but hadn't thought about it that way, but you're absolutely right. you're absolutely right. you're absolutely right. You've always spoken about learning to You've always spoken about learning to You've always spoken about learning to trust your instincts and I think that's trust your instincts and I think that's trust your instincts and I think that's one of the hardest things for women in one of the hardest things for women in one of the hardest things for women in particular um especially to do. Our particular um especially to do. Our particular um especially to do. Our inner voice is sometimes our harshest inner voice is sometimes our harshest inner voice is sometimes our harshest critic. How did you learn to trust critic. How did you learn to trust critic. How did you learn to trust yourself? I think my husband taught me yourself? I think my husband taught me yourself? I think my husband taught me because I think as a child I was always because I think as a child I was always because I think as a child I was always taught that whatever I wanted to do was taught that whatever I wanted to do was taught that whatever I wanted to do was a bad idea. And when I married Jeffrey, a bad idea. And when I married Jeffrey, a bad idea. And when I married Jeffrey, I think he always said I think he always said I think he always said he always supported whatever I wanted to he always supported whatever I wanted to he always supported whatever I wanted to do and encouraged it and didn't question do and encouraged it and didn't question do and encouraged it and didn't question it. And I think I really learned how to it. And I think I really learned how to it. And I think I really learned how to be in the world that way.

be in the world that way. be in the world that way. >> Cuz you met him when you were 16. >> Cuz you met him when you were 16. >> Cuz you met him when you were 16. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Very, very young. Um he saw you >> Yeah. Very, very young. Um he saw you >> Yeah. Very, very young. Um he saw you when you went to go visit your brother. when you went to go visit your brother. when you went to go visit your brother. >> Brother in Dartmouth. Yeah. >> Brother in Dartmouth. Yeah. >> Brother in Dartmouth. Yeah. >> Just the luckiest thing that could ever >> Just the luckiest thing that could ever >> Just the luckiest thing that could ever happen to anybody. I had gone from such happen to anybody. I had gone from such happen to anybody. I had gone from such a negative childhood to such a positive a negative childhood to such a positive a negative childhood to such a positive um um um life. I mean where everything I do he life. I mean where everything I do he life. I mean where everything I do he thinks is brilliant [laughter] and um thinks is brilliant [laughter] and um thinks is brilliant [laughter] and um and encourages me to do more of it. and encourages me to do more of it. and encourages me to do more of it. >> When did you realize that perhaps that >> When did you realize that perhaps that >> When did you realize that perhaps that inner voice wasn't um inner voice wasn't um inner voice wasn't um was not there anymore? The harsh critic was not there anymore? The harsh critic was not there anymore? The harsh critic because I think we do because I think we do because I think we do >> Oh, it is. It is. >> Oh, it is. It is. >> Oh, it is. It is. >> Oh, it absolutely is. But I think um >> Oh, it absolutely is. But I think um >> Oh, it absolutely is. But I think um maybe when I was around 40, I I started maybe when I was around 40, I I started maybe when I was around 40, I I started seeing a therapist. And what I learned seeing a therapist. And what I learned seeing a therapist. And what I learned from that is that when I hear that from that is that when I hear that from that is that when I hear that voice, I say, "Oh, that's my mother's voice, I say, "Oh, that's my mother's voice, I say, "Oh, that's my mother's voice. That's not my voice." voice. That's not my voice." voice. That's not my voice." >> Cuz my mother always thought everything >> Cuz my mother always thought everything >> Cuz my mother always thought everything I would do would be a failure. I would do would be a failure. I would do would be a failure. >> So, you know, her first reaction is, >> So, you know, her first reaction is, >> So, you know, her first reaction is, "What makes you think that you can do "What makes you think that you can do "What makes you think that you can do that?" that?" that?" >> And I just go, "Okay, that's my mother's >> And I just go, "Okay, that's my mother's >> And I just go, "Okay, that's my mother's voice. That's not my voice." And I just voice. That's not my voice." And I just voice. That's not my voice." And I just reinforce, reinforce, reinforce, >> okay, I'm going to try this. I don't >> okay, I'm going to try this. I don't >> okay, I'm going to try this. I don't know if I can do it, but I'm going to know if I can do it, but I'm going to know if I can do it, but I'm going to learn a lot from it. And um and I'm learn a lot from it. And um and I'm learn a lot from it. And um and I'm always surprised how well it turns out.

always surprised how well it turns out. always surprised how well it turns out. >> And how do you deal with external um >> And how do you deal with external um >> And how do you deal with external um pressure um when people aren't don't pressure um when people aren't don't pressure um when people aren't don't believe in you believe in you believe in you >> um >> um >> um >> because there's the internal voice and >> because there's the internal voice and >> because there's the internal voice and then there's like people in life who then there's like people in life who then there's like people in life who underestimate you. underestimate you. underestimate you. >> Oh yeah, there are a lot of them. >> Oh yeah, there are a lot of them. >> Oh yeah, there are a lot of them. [laughter] [laughter] [laughter] >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> And I just have this philosophy, you're >> And I just have this philosophy, you're >> And I just have this philosophy, you're either on my train or just get off, get either on my train or just get off, get either on my train or just get off, get out of my way. I think because I had out of my way. I think because I had out of my way. I think because I had such a difficult time as a child, I such a difficult time as a child, I such a difficult time as a child, I don't like negative people around me. don't like negative people around me. don't like negative people around me. >> I just don't like to be with them. So, >> I just don't like to be with them. So, >> I just don't like to be with them. So, if you're going to be positive and if you're going to be positive and if you're going to be positive and you're going to bring things to the you're going to bring things to the you're going to bring things to the party, party, party, >> come along for the ride. >> come along for the ride. >> come along for the ride. >> But if you're going to be negative and >> But if you're going to be negative and >> But if you're going to be negative and question what I'm doing or not listen to question what I'm doing or not listen to question what I'm doing or not listen to what I want, um, just get out of my way. what I want, um, just get out of my way. what I want, um, just get out of my way. >> Um, >> Um, >> Um, >> is that tough? [laughter] >> is that tough? [laughter] >> is that tough? [laughter] >> No, I you know what? I don't think it's >> No, I you know what? I don't think it's >> No, I you know what? I don't think it's tough. I think it's clear. tough. I think it's clear. tough. I think it's clear. >> How then do you take feedback? >> How then do you take feedback? >> How then do you take feedback? >> Oh, I ask for feedback all the time, >> Oh, I ask for feedback all the time, >> Oh, I ask for feedback all the time, right? I mean, every morning I meet my right? I mean, every morning I meet my right? I mean, every morning I meet my team and we talk about what we're doing team and we talk about what we're doing team and we talk about what we're doing and I want to know what they think about and I want to know what they think about and I want to know what they think about it, but at the end of the day, it's my it, but at the end of the day, it's my it, but at the end of the day, it's my decision decision decision >> and once I've made a decision, I don't >> and once I've made a decision, I don't >> and once I've made a decision, I don't want to discuss it. want to discuss it. want to discuss it. >> I mean, now at this stage in your >> I mean, now at this stage in your >> I mean, now at this stage in your career, obviously people are going to be career, obviously people are going to be career, obviously people are going to be on the ina train.

on the ina train. on the ina train. >> Yes and no. Yes and no. But I [laughter] >> Yes and no. Yes and no. But I [laughter] >> Yes and no. Yes and no. But I [laughter] mean, you know, you are a person who has mean, you know, you are a person who has mean, you know, you are a person who has a proven track record, but when you were a proven track record, but when you were a proven track record, but when you were first trying to move into things. Um, first trying to move into things. Um, first trying to move into things. Um, well, I do remember my first book and my well, I do remember my first book and my well, I do remember my first book and my editor was the the top cookbook editor editor was the the top cookbook editor editor was the the top cookbook editor in the country. I mean, he was in the country. I mean, he was in the country. I mean, he was extraordinary, really knowledgeable. I extraordinary, really knowledgeable. I extraordinary, really knowledgeable. I had some of the great Martha Stewart, had some of the great Martha Stewart, had some of the great Martha Stewart, Lee Bailey had really great authors. And Lee Bailey had really great authors. And Lee Bailey had really great authors. And I have no idea why, but I would say to I have no idea why, but I would say to I have no idea why, but I would say to him, "That's not the way I want to do him, "That's not the way I want to do him, "That's not the way I want to do it. I want to do it this way." And he it. I want to do it this way." And he it. I want to do it this way." And he would disagree with me. He said, "That's would disagree with me. He said, "That's would disagree with me. He said, "That's not the way it's done." [clears throat] not the way it's done." [clears throat] not the way it's done." [clears throat] >> And and I remember thinking, "Okay, >> And and I remember thinking, "Okay, >> And and I remember thinking, "Okay, well, well, well, I'm I'm not going to be happy unless I'm I'm not going to be happy unless I'm I'm not going to be happy unless it's the way I want it done." Um, and I it's the way I want it done." Um, and I it's the way I want it done." Um, and I don't know why I I remember thinking how don't know why I I remember thinking how don't know why I I remember thinking how crazy it was to disagree with the top crazy it was to disagree with the top crazy it was to disagree with the top cookbook editor in the country, but I cookbook editor in the country, but I cookbook editor in the country, but I just needed to have my vision in that just needed to have my vision in that just needed to have my vision in that book. And and I remember saying to book. And and I remember saying to book. And and I remember saying to myself, well, either I'm wrong and he'll myself, well, either I'm wrong and he'll myself, well, either I'm wrong and he'll never have to see me again or I'm right never have to see me again or I'm right never have to see me again or I'm right and he'll think I'm a genius. [laughter] and he'll think I'm a genius. [laughter] and he'll think I'm a genius. [laughter] So, I was just determined to make sure So, I was just determined to make sure So, I was just determined to make sure it was the way I wanted it to be.

it was the way I wanted it to be. it was the way I wanted it to be. >> And that determination comes from the >> And that determination comes from the >> And that determination comes from the feeling that if you can't execute your feeling that if you can't execute your feeling that if you can't execute your vision, then it's not going to be vision, then it's not going to be vision, then it's not going to be satisfying. satisfying. satisfying. >> And why bother doing it if you're just >> And why bother doing it if you're just >> And why bother doing it if you're just going to do what everybody else is going to do what everybody else is going to do what everybody else is doing? doing? doing? >> So, but you have to have an idea. You >> So, but you have to have an idea. You >> So, but you have to have an idea. You have to show up 100%. and um and come have to show up 100%. and um and come have to show up 100%. and um and come with an idea. with an idea. with an idea. >> Martha Stewart um helped launch you um >> Martha Stewart um helped launch you um >> Martha Stewart um helped launch you um >> and >> and >> and in that early stage of your career there in that early stage of your career there in that early stage of your career there was a lot of pressure to be a mini was a lot of pressure to be a mini was a lot of pressure to be a mini Martha like Martha like Martha like >> she had >> she had >> she had >> sort of created the mold and they wanted >> sort of created the mold and they wanted >> sort of created the mold and they wanted to have more to have more to have more >> that was one of the models that was >> that was one of the models that was >> that was one of the models that was brilliant and she changed how how it brilliant and she changed how how it brilliant and she changed how how it happened. I mean she did it brilliantly happened. I mean she did it brilliantly happened. I mean she did it brilliantly in her vision. I mean, you walked away in her vision. I mean, you walked away in her vision. I mean, you walked away from your first foray into television from your first foray into television from your first foray into television because they wanted you to be a mini because they wanted you to be a mini because they wanted you to be a mini Martha. Um, Martha. Um, Martha. Um, >> h how did you just have a sense that it >> h how did you just have a sense that it >> h how did you just have a sense that it wasn't the right fit? wasn't the right fit? wasn't the right fit? >> I just don't know. >> I just don't know. >> I just don't know. >> You're stubborn. >> You're stubborn. >> You're stubborn. >> Clearly, [laughter] >> Clearly, [laughter] >> Clearly, [laughter] >> I'm clear. >> I'm clear. >> I'm clear. >> I don't think stubborn is a bad word, by >> I don't think stubborn is a bad word, by >> I don't think stubborn is a bad word, by the way. [laughter] the way. [laughter] the way. [laughter] >> I'm determined. Um I I think well, it >> I'm determined. Um I I think well, it >> I'm determined. Um I I think well, it was her film crew that was filming a was her film crew that was filming a was her film crew that was filming a show for me, and they kept saying to me, show for me, and they kept saying to me, show for me, and they kept saying to me, "No, no, no, you can't do it that way."

"No, no, no, you can't do it that way." "No, no, no, you can't do it that way." And I was like I kept saying to them, And I was like I kept saying to them, And I was like I kept saying to them, "You have Martha. you don't need me to "You have Martha. you don't need me to "You have Martha. you don't need me to be Martha, you need me to be me. And I be Martha, you need me to be me. And I be Martha, you need me to be me. And I don't know why I knew that, but I I just don't know why I knew that, but I I just don't know why I knew that, but I I just was very clear that, you know, Martha was very clear that, you know, Martha was very clear that, you know, Martha does a certain does things a certain way does a certain does things a certain way does a certain does things a certain way and I do them differently. And unless and I do them differently. And unless and I do them differently. And unless that film reflected who I was, that film reflected who I was, that film reflected who I was, >> it was going to look like I was trying >> it was going to look like I was trying >> it was going to look like I was trying to be Martha and that's not who I am. to be Martha and that's not who I am. to be Martha and that's not who I am. >> According to a New Yorker profile of you >> According to a New Yorker profile of you >> According to a New Yorker profile of you from a few years ago, um you and Martha from a few years ago, um you and Martha from a few years ago, um you and Martha grew apart. Can I just say I admire her grew apart. Can I just say I admire her grew apart. Can I just say I admire her enormously. I think what she created is enormously. I think what she created is enormously. I think what she created is stunning and she did it with vision. Um stunning and she did it with vision. Um stunning and she did it with vision. Um I mean we're you know we're friendly. I mean we're you know we're friendly. I mean we're you know we're friendly. We're not there's no antipathy. Um she We're not there's no antipathy. Um she We're not there's no antipathy. Um she moved to moved to moved to >> Bedford and she used to live in >> Bedford and she used to live in >> Bedford and she used to live in Eastampton so we saw each other then. Eastampton so we saw each other then. Eastampton so we saw each other then. >> I mean I know you get asked about Martha >> I mean I know you get asked about Martha >> I mean I know you get asked about Martha a lot. Um and in many ways you became a lot. Um and in many ways you became a lot. Um and in many ways you became your own thing. The anti- Martha in some your own thing. The anti- Martha in some your own thing. The anti- Martha in some ways you know a different style of ways you know a different style of ways you know a different style of cooking. Is that in itself frustrating cooking. Is that in itself frustrating cooking. Is that in itself frustrating that you always get kind of put in that you always get kind of put in that you always get kind of put in some kind of juxtaposition of her?

some kind of juxtaposition of her? some kind of juxtaposition of her? >> I had an interesting conversation with >> I had an interesting conversation with >> I had an interesting conversation with Allison Roman recently actually. Um I Allison Roman recently actually. Um I Allison Roman recently actually. Um I said to her, you know, she and I are said to her, you know, she and I are said to her, you know, she and I are kind of in a continuum that started with kind of in a continuum that started with kind of in a continuum that started with Julia Child who wanted to teach people Julia Child who wanted to teach people Julia Child who wanted to teach people how to cook with real food. You know, how to cook with real food. You know, how to cook with real food. You know, when when everybody was making like box when when everybody was making like box when when everybody was making like box macaroni and cheese, she wanted you to macaroni and cheese, she wanted you to macaroni and cheese, she wanted you to appreciate a really good beef organo. appreciate a really good beef organo. appreciate a really good beef organo. And then Martha came along and elevated And then Martha came along and elevated And then Martha came along and elevated home arts to something really worth home arts to something really worth home arts to something really worth doing. Well, set a beautiful table. Make doing. Well, set a beautiful table. Make doing. Well, set a beautiful table. Make it wonderful dinner. Carve out a pumpkin it wonderful dinner. Carve out a pumpkin it wonderful dinner. Carve out a pumpkin and for the pumpkin soup. It's just and for the pumpkin soup. It's just and for the pumpkin soup. It's just fabulous. I came along and said, "Okay, fabulous. I came along and said, "Okay, fabulous. I came along and said, "Okay, don't maybe not carve out the pumpkin. don't maybe not carve out the pumpkin. don't maybe not carve out the pumpkin. Set a nice table. It doesn't have to be Set a nice table. It doesn't have to be Set a nice table. It doesn't have to be over the top. And make a lovely dinner over the top. And make a lovely dinner over the top. And make a lovely dinner and serve it." And then Allison Roman and serve it." And then Allison Roman and serve it." And then Allison Roman came along and said, "Forget setting the came along and said, "Forget setting the came along and said, "Forget setting the table. Just put the pot of soup on the table. Just put the pot of soup on the table. Just put the pot of soup on the on the table and and have a good time." on the table and and have a good time." on the table and and have a good time." And so I think everybody's getting a And so I think everybody's getting a And so I think everybody's getting a little simpler and simpler, but at the little simpler and simpler, but at the little simpler and simpler, but at the end of the day, we all like the same end of the day, we all like the same end of the day, we all like the same thing, which is gathering people around thing, which is gathering people around thing, which is gathering people around a table. a table. a table. >> You know, Allison Roman also said in >> You know, Allison Roman also said in >> You know, Allison Roman also said in that New Yorker profile that people were that New Yorker profile that people were that New Yorker profile that people were always asking her if she's a Martha or always asking her if she's a Martha or always asking her if she's a Martha or an aa.

an aa. an aa. >> Oh, really? Oh, I don't remember that. >> Oh, really? Oh, I don't remember that. >> Oh, really? Oh, I don't remember that. [laughter] [laughter] [laughter] >> So, there is like a sense of of a >> So, there is like a sense of of a >> So, there is like a sense of of a continuum, but also a sort of dichotomy, continuum, but also a sort of dichotomy, continuum, but also a sort of dichotomy, if you will. if you will. if you will. >> Yeah. I think we've each taken um what >> Yeah. I think we've each taken um what >> Yeah. I think we've each taken um what what's in the world and made it our own. what's in the world and made it our own. what's in the world and made it our own. The reason I ask also is because in that The reason I ask also is because in that The reason I ask also is because in that New Yorker profile, Martha said she had New Yorker profile, Martha said she had New Yorker profile, Martha said she had never made one of your recipes, which I never made one of your recipes, which I never made one of your recipes, which I felt was kind of pointed felt was kind of pointed felt was kind of pointed and I wondered if it bothered you. and I wondered if it bothered you. and I wondered if it bothered you. >> No, it's certainly her hers to decide. >> No, it's certainly her hers to decide. >> No, it's certainly her hers to decide. It's I I didn't know what to make of It's I I didn't know what to make of It's I I didn't know what to make of that. that. that. [snorts] [snorts] [snorts] >> I've certainly made lots of hers. >> I've certainly made lots of hers. >> I've certainly made lots of hers. Um, we've talked about how you've sort Um, we've talked about how you've sort Um, we've talked about how you've sort of evolved over time and I do want to of evolved over time and I do want to of evolved over time and I do want to touch on a period of your life that I touch on a period of your life that I touch on a period of your life that I find fascinating, which is your period find fascinating, which is your period find fascinating, which is your period at the Food Network. Um, because at the Food Network. Um, because at the Food Network. Um, because >> it's really changed since you started >> it's really changed since you started >> it's really changed since you started there 20 years ago. Uh, you know, you there 20 years ago. Uh, you know, you there 20 years ago. Uh, you know, you came up with Rachel Ray, you came up came up with Rachel Ray, you came up came up with Rachel Ray, you came up with Paulyine, with Paulyine, with Paulyine, >> and you women were really a big deal at >> and you women were really a big deal at >> and you women were really a big deal at that certain period of time.

that certain period of time. that certain period of time. >> There's a lot of competition shows now, >> There's a lot of competition shows now, >> There's a lot of competition shows now, though. though. though. >> Yeah. Um, doesn't interest me. >> Yeah. Um, doesn't interest me. >> Yeah. Um, doesn't interest me. >> Yeah. Um, a lot of sort of male energy. >> Yeah. Um, a lot of sort of male energy. >> Yeah. Um, a lot of sort of male energy. Guy Fiery, Pit Masters, Bobby Fle. I Guy Fiery, Pit Masters, Bobby Fle. I Guy Fiery, Pit Masters, Bobby Fle. I watch a lot of Bobby Fle. watch a lot of Bobby Fle. watch a lot of Bobby Fle. >> Um, >> Um, >> Um, >> can I just say how much I adore Bobby >> can I just say how much I adore Bobby >> can I just say how much I adore Bobby Fle? Fle? Fle? >> You can say he's just he's just >> You can say he's just he's just >> You can say he's just he's just extraordinary. extraordinary. extraordinary. >> Would you ever compete with Bobby Fle? >> Would you ever compete with Bobby Fle? >> Would you ever compete with Bobby Fle? >> No. [laughter] >> No. [laughter] >> No. [laughter] See, I, you know, I'm not I'm not a See, I, you know, I'm not I'm not a See, I, you know, I'm not I'm not a chef. I'm a home home cook, right? chef. I'm a home home cook, right? chef. I'm a home home cook, right? >> And I mean, to to go to Bobby's house >> And I mean, to to go to Bobby's house >> And I mean, to to go to Bobby's house and watch him just make lunch with not a and watch him just make lunch with not a and watch him just make lunch with not a recipe anywhere. I mean, he's, you know, recipe anywhere. I mean, he's, you know, recipe anywhere. I mean, he's, you know, he's run restaurants. It's in his DNA. he's run restaurants. It's in his DNA. he's run restaurants. It's in his DNA. He's such an extraordinary cook and he's He's such an extraordinary cook and he's He's such an extraordinary cook and he's so joyful in the kitchen. It's just so joyful in the kitchen. It's just so joyful in the kitchen. It's just wonderful to watch. And, you know, he wonderful to watch. And, you know, he wonderful to watch. And, you know, he doesn't when he's competing with doesn't when he's competing with doesn't when he's competing with somebody, this is their identifying recipe. This is the their identifying recipe. This is the their their favorite recipe. And Bobb's never their favorite recipe. And Bobb's never their favorite recipe. And Bobb's never seen it before, seen it before, seen it before, >> and he usually beats them. Why have you >> and he usually beats them. Why have you >> and he usually beats them. Why have you never wanted to be part of a competition never wanted to be part of a competition never wanted to be part of a competition show? That's just not who I am. And you show? That's just not who I am. And you show? That's just not who I am. And you know what? That's what other people do.

know what? That's what other people do. know what? That's what other people do. I just like to do something different. I just like to do something different. I just like to do something different. >> I think part of food food network's DNA >> I think part of food food network's DNA >> I think part of food food network's DNA is showing people how to cook. And is showing people how to cook. And is showing people how to cook. And fortunately that they still support my fortunately that they still support my fortunately that they still support my doing it. [laughter] doing it. [laughter] doing it. [laughter] >> Warner Brothers, which runs the Food >> Warner Brothers, which runs the Food >> Warner Brothers, which runs the Food Network, is in the midst of possibly Network, is in the midst of possibly Network, is in the midst of possibly being sold to Paramount. being sold to Paramount. being sold to Paramount. >> Not yet. Not so fast. >> Not yet. Not so fast. >> Not yet. Not so fast. >> Not so fast. I mean, do you have an >> Not so fast. I mean, do you have an >> Not so fast. I mean, do you have an opinion about that merger? Will you stay opinion about that merger? Will you stay opinion about that merger? Will you stay with the Food Network if it gets sold? with the Food Network if it gets sold? with the Food Network if it gets sold? I think I'm going to stay away from that I think I'm going to stay away from that I think I'm going to stay away from that one. one. one. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. Is that all right? >> Okay. Is that all right? >> Okay. Is that all right? >> Yeah, I understand. It's complicated. >> Yeah, I understand. It's complicated. >> Yeah, I understand. It's complicated. >> It's complicated. >> It's complicated. >> It's complicated. >> Yeah. All right. Who would you say your >> Yeah. All right. Who would you say your >> Yeah. All right. Who would you say your audience is today? Um I'm sure you've audience is today? Um I'm sure you've audience is today? Um I'm sure you've thought about this as you're launching thought about this as you're launching thought about this as you're launching your new podcast. I mean, who do you your new podcast. I mean, who do you your new podcast. I mean, who do you think of as people who watch Garden? think of as people who watch Garden? think of as people who watch Garden? >> You know, it's astonishing to me how >> You know, it's astonishing to me how >> You know, it's astonishing to me how varied it is. I just I mean I always varied it is. I just I mean I always varied it is. I just I mean I always I've said this before that I loved I've said this before that I loved I've said this before that I loved walking up Madison Avenue one day and a walking up Madison Avenue one day and a walking up Madison Avenue one day and a woman in big fur coat was like, "Oh, woman in big fur coat was like, "Oh, woman in big fur coat was like, "Oh, darling, love your cookbooks." darling, love your cookbooks." darling, love your cookbooks." [laughter] And and a block later a truck [laughter] And and a block later a truck [laughter] And and a block later a truck driver pulled over and said, "Hey babe, driver pulled over and said, "Hey babe, driver pulled over and said, "Hey babe, love your show." [laughter] love your show." [laughter] love your show." [laughter] And I thought, "This is what food is."

And I thought, "This is what food is." And I thought, "This is what food is." And um I mean I would think that my And um I mean I would think that my And um I mean I would think that my audience would be older because cuz I am audience would be older because cuz I am audience would be older because cuz I am but I mean Jenzers are just desperate to but I mean Jenzers are just desperate to but I mean Jenzers are just desperate to um to cook and entertain now and and be um to cook and entertain now and and be um to cook and entertain now and and be together with their friends. Have you together with their friends. Have you together with their friends. Have you seen the many social media accounts seen the many social media accounts seen the many social media accounts paring you with love? Um paring you with love? Um paring you with love? Um >> no. >> no. >> no. >> Oh really? No. I would love to show like >> Oh really? No. I would love to show like >> Oh really? No. I would love to show like in particular you heard of a comedian in particular you heard of a comedian in particular you heard of a comedian called Tom Hearn? called Tom Hearn? called Tom Hearn? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> He does the shirt the giant margarita >> He does the shirt the giant margarita >> He does the shirt the giant margarita glass but there's also just many many glass but there's also just many many glass but there's also just many many others you know. Um, others you know. Um, others you know. Um, >> somebody came to Jeffrey and said that >> somebody came to Jeffrey and said that >> somebody came to Jeffrey and said that they were having a wedding at Anaganset, they were having a wedding at Anaganset, they were having a wedding at Anaganset, which is the next town over from East which is the next town over from East which is the next town over from East Hampton, and that all the bridesmaids Hampton, and that all the bridesmaids Hampton, and that all the bridesmaids were dressed like me, [laughter] were dressed like me, [laughter] were dressed like me, [laughter] and could I stop by? And I was like, are and could I stop by? And I was like, are and could I stop by? And I was like, are you kidding? I mean, [laughter] you kidding? I mean, [laughter] you kidding? I mean, [laughter] what were they going to explain to their what were they going to explain to their what were they going to explain to their kids in 10 years [clears throat] why kids in 10 years [clears throat] why kids in 10 years [clears throat] why everybody was dressed in a denim shirt? everybody was dressed in a denim shirt? everybody was dressed in a denim shirt? [laughter] [laughter] [laughter] I mean, it was incredibly flattering, I mean, it was incredibly flattering, I mean, it was incredibly flattering, but a little crazy. [laughter] but a little crazy. [laughter] but a little crazy. [laughter] I [clears throat] mean, speaking of I [clears throat] mean, speaking of I [clears throat] mean, speaking of social media, what do you make of the social media, what do you make of the social media, what do you make of the influencers influencers influencers sort of online making um sort of sort of online making um sort of sort of online making um sort of elevating the old-fashioned idea of elevating the old-fashioned idea of elevating the old-fashioned idea of homemaking, you know, the tradife trend, homemaking, you know, the tradife trend, homemaking, you know, the tradife trend, wives who are farming their own food, wives who are farming their own food, wives who are farming their own food, making everything from scratch. It seems making everything from scratch. It seems making everything from scratch. It seems very different than what you've been very different than what you've been very different than what you've been advocating your whole career. The only advocating your whole career. The only advocating your whole career. The only thing I advocate is do exactly what thing I advocate is do exactly what thing I advocate is do exactly what feels right to you.

feels right to you. feels right to you. >> Period. >> Period. >> Period. Just don't don't become Just don't don't become Just don't don't become somebody else because you think it'll somebody else because you think it'll somebody else because you think it'll allow you to fit in. Figure out who you allow you to fit in. Figure out who you allow you to fit in. Figure out who you are and do what you want to do. If you are and do what you want to do. If you are and do what you want to do. If you want to stay home and cook and take care want to stay home and cook and take care want to stay home and cook and take care of the family, I think it's wonderful. of the family, I think it's wonderful. of the family, I think it's wonderful. If you want to work, I think it's great. If you want to work, I think it's great. If you want to work, I think it's great. We're so busy judging everybody and it's We're so busy judging everybody and it's We're so busy judging everybody and it's it's free. You just from the sidelines, it's free. You just from the sidelines, it's free. You just from the sidelines, you can take pot shots at anybody. And you can take pot shots at anybody. And you can take pot shots at anybody. And what's the point? Does it make you feel what's the point? Does it make you feel what's the point? Does it make you feel better? No. The reason I asked about better? No. The reason I asked about better? No. The reason I asked about sort of the trend of sort of the trend of sort of the trend of elevating the home arts and cooking your elevating the home arts and cooking your elevating the home arts and cooking your own food and all of that own food and all of that own food and all of that >> is because it did make me wonder if you >> is because it did make me wonder if you >> is because it did make me wonder if you ever had internal battles over your ever had internal battles over your ever had internal battles over your career with traditionally women coded career with traditionally women coded career with traditionally women coded things because I see you as clearly a things because I see you as clearly a things because I see you as clearly a feminist. Uh I is that how you would feminist. Uh I is that how you would feminist. Uh I is that how you would describe yourself first of all? describe yourself first of all? describe yourself first of all? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And how did you think about how you were >> And how did you think about how you were >> And how did you think about how you were sort of showing up with what you were sort of showing up with what you were sort of showing up with what you were doing? Well, I'll tell you a story I've doing? Well, I'll tell you a story I've doing? Well, I'll tell you a story I've actually never told is when I was in actually never told is when I was in actually never told is when I was in high school, the girls took home and the high school, the girls took home and the high school, the girls took home and the boys took um boys took um boys took um uh shop.

uh shop. uh shop. >> Yeah. And I I don't think anybody had >> Yeah. And I I don't think anybody had >> Yeah. And I I don't think anybody had ever questioned that. And I just refused ever questioned that. And I just refused ever questioned that. And I just refused to take homec to take homec to take homec >> and I took shop and what I learned is >> and I took shop and what I learned is >> and I took shop and what I learned is drafting. drafting. drafting. >> And I at some point I was thinking maybe >> And I at some point I was thinking maybe >> And I at some point I was thinking maybe I'd be an architect. Um but I use those I'd be an architect. Um but I use those I'd be an architect. Um but I use those drafting skills all the time. M drafting skills all the time. M drafting skills all the time. M >> so I I now when I think back how ironic >> so I I now when I think back how ironic >> so I I now when I think back how ironic it is that I refused to do cooking and it is that I refused to do cooking and it is that I refused to do cooking and you know whatever whatever home was at you know whatever whatever home was at you know whatever whatever home was at the time um I I love what I do and and I the time um I I love what I do and and I the time um I I love what I do and and I could actually make a case that I really could actually make a case that I really could actually make a case that I really lucky that I'm um interested in a field lucky that I'm um interested in a field lucky that I'm um interested in a field where women excel so that the only where women excel so that the only where women excel so that the only limitation on my success was my own limitation on my success was my own limitation on my success was my own imagination and I think women in imagination and I think women in imagination and I think women in cookbooks and women in TV I mean it's cookbooks and women in TV I mean it's cookbooks and women in TV I mean it's it's easier so it was just a happy it's easier so it was just a happy it's easier so it was just a happy confluence. I didn't choose it because confluence. I didn't choose it because confluence. I didn't choose it because it was a female um talent. I just choose it was a female um talent. I just choose it was a female um talent. I just choose it because I love doing it. it because I love doing it. it because I love doing it. >> Thank you so much. We are going to speak >> Thank you so much. We are going to speak >> Thank you so much. We are going to speak again, but this has been utterly again, but this has been utterly again, but this has been utterly delightful. I delightful. I delightful. I >> appreciated your time.

>> appreciated your time. >> appreciated your time. >> Thank you. It was so much fun to be here >> Thank you. It was so much fun to be here >> Thank you. It was so much fun to be here with you. [laughter] with you. [laughter] with you. [laughter] [music] [music] [music] >> On the interview, we talked to our guest >> On the interview, we talked to our guest >> On the interview, we talked to our guest twice. So later, I followed up with twice. So later, I followed up with twice. So later, I followed up with Garton who was at her home in East Garton who was at her home in East Garton who was at her home in East Hampton. We got into her favorite Hampton. We got into her favorite Hampton. We got into her favorite ingredients and whether she's ever ingredients and whether she's ever ingredients and whether she's ever considered retiring. >> All right, AA, thank you so much for >> All right, AA, thank you so much for joining me again. It's nice to see you. joining me again. It's nice to see you. joining me again. It's nice to see you. >> Nice to see you again, too. We had such >> Nice to see you again, too. We had such >> Nice to see you again, too. We had such a good time last time. a good time last time. a good time last time. >> You know, I was thinking we had spoken >> You know, I was thinking we had spoken >> You know, I was thinking we had spoken um earlier about how you ask yourself um earlier about how you ask yourself um earlier about how you ask yourself one question when deciding whether or one question when deciding whether or one question when deciding whether or not to do something, right? And you not to do something, right? And you not to do something, right? And you said, "Is it going to be fun?" But I was said, "Is it going to be fun?" But I was said, "Is it going to be fun?" But I was wondering about something for you that wondering about something for you that wondering about something for you that might have been really really hard but might have been really really hard but might have been really really hard but not fun that you're glad that you did in not fun that you're glad that you did in not fun that you're glad that you did in the end. Do you have a story about that? the end. Do you have a story about that? the end. Do you have a story about that? >> Something that was hard but not fun. I >> Something that was hard but not fun. I >> Something that was hard but not fun. I mean the thing about hard is I like mean the thing about hard is I like mean the thing about hard is I like having problems to solve. having problems to solve. having problems to solve. >> So if I [clears throat] have something >> So if I [clears throat] have something >> So if I [clears throat] have something that's difficult and I have to work it that's difficult and I have to work it that's difficult and I have to work it out, I find myself totally engaged in it out, I find myself totally engaged in it out, I find myself totally engaged in it and I enjoy that process. So I think and I enjoy that process. So I think and I enjoy that process. So I think that's fun figuring it out like starting that's fun figuring it out like starting that's fun figuring it out like starting out going how is this ever going to out going how is this ever going to out going how is this ever going to happen and then you go well if I start happen and then you go well if I start happen and then you go well if I start it this way and I go there and then I it this way and I go there and then I it this way and I go there and then I try that let me see where I am when I try that let me see where I am when I try that let me see where I am when I get there. So I like that. I find that get there. So I like that. I find that get there. So I like that. I find that process fun. I mean fun isn't always process fun. I mean fun isn't always process fun. I mean fun isn't always haha fun.

haha fun. haha fun. >> Fun is just something that really um >> Fun is just something that really um >> Fun is just something that really um feels good. feels good. feels good. >> Are you perfectionist? >> Are you perfectionist? >> Are you perfectionist? >> I mean you >> I mean you >> I mean you >> I think the people around me might say I >> I think the people around me might say I >> I think the people around me might say I am. [laughter] am. [laughter] am. [laughter] >> I am in some ways. Yeah I am. I like >> I am in some ways. Yeah I am. I like >> I am in some ways. Yeah I am. I like things done the way I want them done. things done the way I want them done. things done the way I want them done. >> And do you think that's part of your >> And do you think that's part of your >> And do you think that's part of your success? That idea of it has to be on success? That idea of it has to be on success? That idea of it has to be on the ina train or not on the ina train. the ina train or not on the ina train. the ina train or not on the ina train. [laughter] [laughter] [laughter] >> Um I think that clarity is part of >> Um I think that clarity is part of >> Um I think that clarity is part of anybody's success and I think I'm really anybody's success and I think I'm really anybody's success and I think I'm really clear about what is my brand and what I clear about what is my brand and what I clear about what is my brand and what I want to do to further that rather than want to do to further that rather than want to do to further that rather than you know people having lots of ideas and you know people having lots of ideas and you know people having lots of ideas and going well let's try this and let's try going well let's try this and let's try going well let's try this and let's try that. I I don't you know I've I've been that. I I don't you know I've I've been that. I I don't you know I've I've been doing this for 50 years and I know what doing this for 50 years and I know what doing this for 50 years and I know what I like and I think that's why people I like and I think that's why people I like and I think that's why people understand what I'm doing because it's understand what I'm doing because it's understand what I'm doing because it's consistent. consistent. consistent. >> I was thinking also about your origin >> I was thinking also about your origin >> I was thinking also about your origin story because as we mentioned in our story because as we mentioned in our story because as we mentioned in our first conversation, you had a lot of first conversation, you had a lot of first conversation, you had a lot of trauma with your parents who didn't trauma with your parents who didn't trauma with your parents who didn't support you. They didn't believe in you.

support you. They didn't believe in you. support you. They didn't believe in you. What are some of those memories for you What are some of those memories for you What are some of those memories for you um growing up in your house that that um growing up in your house that that um growing up in your house that that sort of made you have this reaction of sort of made you have this reaction of sort of made you have this reaction of wanting to do something completely wanting to do something completely wanting to do something completely different? Um I think I never had any different? Um I think I never had any different? Um I think I never had any agency whatsoever. Nobody ever asked agency whatsoever. Nobody ever asked agency whatsoever. Nobody ever asked what would you like to do today or um or what would you like to do today or um or what would you like to do today or um or if I decided to do something that was if I decided to do something that was if I decided to do something that was well done. So I've taught myself how to well done. So I've taught myself how to well done. So I've taught myself how to do it myself. I'm thinking of your do it myself. I'm thinking of your do it myself. I'm thinking of your mother's relationship to food. She was a mother's relationship to food. She was a mother's relationship to food. She was a nutritionist, right? who saw food as nutritionist, right? who saw food as nutritionist, right? who saw food as sort of a method of control and not of sort of a method of control and not of sort of a method of control and not of joy. There was no joy in it. I I don't joy. There was no joy in it. I I don't joy. There was no joy in it. I I don't think she really understood joy. Um think she really understood joy. Um think she really understood joy. Um [clears throat] I think if you go [clears throat] I think if you go [clears throat] I think if you go through a difficult time, you either through a difficult time, you either through a difficult time, you either allow it to affect you or you decide allow it to affect you or you decide allow it to affect you or you decide you're going to do it differently and I you're going to do it differently and I you're going to do it differently and I absolutely deliberately decided to do it absolutely deliberately decided to do it absolutely deliberately decided to do it differently. And I just love having a differently. And I just love having a differently. And I just love having a good time and I don't don't see any good time and I don't don't see any good time and I don't don't see any reason why I shouldn't. So I I I always reason why I shouldn't. So I I I always reason why I shouldn't. So I I I always go towards that. go towards that. go towards that. >> I I go towards people that are happy. I >> I I go towards people that are happy. I >> I I go towards people that are happy. I go towards people I um projects that go towards people I um projects that go towards people I um projects that will be fun to do or or be satisfying.

will be fun to do or or be satisfying. will be fun to do or or be satisfying. As you say, fun isn't always like, you As you say, fun isn't always like, you As you say, fun isn't always like, you know, going down a water slide. Fun is know, going down a water slide. Fun is know, going down a water slide. Fun is is um building something with people is um building something with people is um building something with people that you care about. You and Jeffrey that you care about. You and Jeffrey that you care about. You and Jeffrey decided pretty early on not to have decided pretty early on not to have decided pretty early on not to have kids, and you've talked about that. When kids, and you've talked about that. When kids, and you've talked about that. When you look at your peers who've raised you look at your peers who've raised you look at your peers who've raised kids, do you think you could have had kids, do you think you could have had kids, do you think you could have had the career that you've had if you had the career that you've had if you had the career that you've had if you had been a mom? been a mom? been a mom? I think it would have been difficult. I think it would have been difficult. I think it would have been difficult. And I think Jeffrey and I would have had And I think Jeffrey and I would have had And I think Jeffrey and I would have had a different life together and we would a different life together and we would a different life together and we would have had a good life. It doesn't I'm not have had a good life. It doesn't I'm not have had a good life. It doesn't I'm not saying it's a better life or a worse saying it's a better life or a worse saying it's a better life or a worse life, but there [clears throat] were life, but there [clears throat] were life, but there [clears throat] were times when Jeffrey was decided that he times when Jeffrey was decided that he times when Jeffrey was decided that he wanted to start a business in Japan. And wanted to start a business in Japan. And wanted to start a business in Japan. And so he moved to Japan. I was in East so he moved to Japan. I was in East so he moved to Japan. I was in East Hampton. we went back and forth and we Hampton. we went back and forth and we Hampton. we went back and forth and we figured it out. Um, so I think that that figured it out. Um, so I think that that figured it out. Um, so I think that that probably couldn't have happened. Um, and probably couldn't have happened. Um, and probably couldn't have happened. Um, and I couldn't have stayed long hours at the I couldn't have stayed long hours at the I couldn't have stayed long hours at the store um, doing catering and running the store um, doing catering and running the store um, doing catering and running the specialy food store. I think it would specialy food store. I think it would specialy food store. I think it would have been much harder. And I I've never have been much harder. And I I've never have been much harder. And I I've never looked back on the decision and thought looked back on the decision and thought looked back on the decision and thought I should have done it differently. I I should have done it differently. I I should have done it differently. I mean, I understand how my friends have mean, I understand how my friends have mean, I understand how my friends have wonderful families and they really enjoy wonderful families and they really enjoy wonderful families and they really enjoy um being parents, but I it's just not um being parents, but I it's just not um being parents, but I it's just not not something I ever um not something I ever um not something I ever um [clears throat and snorts] wanted to do, [clears throat and snorts] wanted to do, [clears throat and snorts] wanted to do, and I'm really happy that I didn't.

and I'm really happy that I didn't. and I'm really happy that I didn't. >> All right. Um I'm going to do a final >> All right. Um I'm going to do a final >> All right. Um I'm going to do a final lightning round if that's okay. lightning round if that's okay. lightning round if that's okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Favorite person you've ever cooked for? >> Favorite person you've ever cooked for? >> Favorite person you've ever cooked for? >> Cooked for? Well, I actually had um Eric Repair come Well, I actually had um Eric Repair come for lunch recently, and I love to cook for lunch recently, and I love to cook for lunch recently, and I love to cook for him because he's not only an for him because he's not only an for him because he's not only an incredible chef, but he's also an incredible chef, but he's also an incredible chef, but he's also an appreciative guest. appreciative guest. appreciative guest. >> And when someone like that comes, are >> And when someone like that comes, are >> And when someone like that comes, are you trying to up your game? Do you ask you trying to up your game? Do you ask you trying to up your game? Do you ask them what they'd like or are you How are them what they'd like or are you How are them what they'd like or are you How are you preparing? you preparing? you preparing? >> I know what he likes and I love to >> I know what he likes and I love to >> I know what he likes and I love to prepare it. So, it's um it's just really prepare it. So, it's um it's just really prepare it. So, it's um it's just really fun. fun. fun. >> What did you make? Um I I made a um >> What did you make? Um I I made a um >> What did you make? Um I I made a um fillet of beef with um basil parmesan fillet of beef with um basil parmesan fillet of beef with um basil parmesan mayonnaise and um a Charlie bird salad mayonnaise and um a Charlie bird salad mayonnaise and um a Charlie bird salad and I served a um a red saucere which and I served a um a red saucere which and I served a um a red saucere which was slightly chilled and was just was slightly chilled and was just was slightly chilled and was just delicious. delicious. delicious. >> Sounds wonderful making me [laughter] >> Sounds wonderful making me [laughter] >> Sounds wonderful making me [laughter] hungry. Um best advice you've ever hungry. Um best advice you've ever hungry. Um best advice you've ever gotten for how to live a good life.

gotten for how to live a good life. gotten for how to live a good life. >> Do what you love. If you love it, you'll >> Do what you love. If you love it, you'll >> Do what you love. If you love it, you'll be really good at it. be really good at it. be really good at it. >> And that was I think Jeffrey who told >> And that was I think Jeffrey who told >> And that was I think Jeffrey who told you that. was indeed Jeffrey. That was you that. was indeed Jeffrey. That was you that. was indeed Jeffrey. That was the beginning of my life. the beginning of my life. the beginning of my life. >> Um, customer pet peeve. Help me not be a >> Um, customer pet peeve. Help me not be a >> Um, customer pet peeve. Help me not be a bad customer. bad customer. bad customer. >> I think I I I actually said this. I >> I think I I I actually said this. I >> I think I I I actually said this. I think that everybody should work in think that everybody should work in think that everybody should work in retail like military service so they retail like military service so they retail like military service so they understand how difficult it is and I understand how difficult it is and I understand how difficult it is and I think they'll have more respect for think they'll have more respect for think they'll have more respect for waiters and for ser you know for people waiters and for ser you know for people waiters and for ser you know for people who work in restaurants and retail who work in restaurants and retail who work in restaurants and retail stores. stores. stores. >> What do you want people to learn? >> What do you want people to learn? >> What do you want people to learn? >> A little job. A little kindness. Yeah. >> A little job. A little kindness. Yeah. >> A little job. A little kindness. Yeah. that that that the people working there that that that the people working there that that that the people working there aren't just functionaries, they're aren't just functionaries, they're aren't just functionaries, they're actually people. actually people. actually people. >> And a little kindness goes a long way. >> And a little kindness goes a long way. >> And a little kindness goes a long way. >> Uh three most important ingredients to >> Uh three most important ingredients to >> Uh three most important ingredients to always have at hand. And what is the always have at hand. And what is the always have at hand. And what is the most overrated ingredient? most overrated ingredient? most overrated ingredient? [snorts] [snorts] [snorts] >> Um three most important ingredients I >> Um three most important ingredients I >> Um three most important ingredients I would say good olive oil, um French would say good olive oil, um French would say good olive oil, um French butter with flaked sea salt, and butter with flaked sea salt, and butter with flaked sea salt, and I think lemons. I love lemon on on lots I think lemons. I love lemon on on lots I think lemons. I love lemon on on lots of things because you can use the the of things because you can use the the of things because you can use the the grated zest, you can use the juice, and grated zest, you can use the juice, and grated zest, you can use the juice, and it kind of brings out the flavors of a it kind of brings out the flavors of a it kind of brings out the flavors of a lot of things.

lot of things. lot of things. >> And what's the most overrated? >> And what's the most overrated? >> And what's the most overrated? I might say like granulated garlic in a I might say like granulated garlic in a I might say like granulated garlic in a in a in a spice jar. Why not just use in a in a spice jar. Why not just use in a in a spice jar. Why not just use regular garlic? regular garlic? regular garlic? >> I'm glad you didn't say salt, but salt >> I'm glad you didn't say salt, but salt >> I'm glad you didn't say salt, but salt is indeed the most important ingredient. is indeed the most important ingredient. is indeed the most important ingredient. >> Yeah. Um, finally, because at this >> Yeah. Um, finally, because at this >> Yeah. Um, finally, because at this stage, you don't need to achieve stage, you don't need to achieve stage, you don't need to achieve anything more. You're beloved, you're anything more. You're beloved, you're anything more. You're beloved, you're famous, you're successful. Thank you. famous, you're successful. Thank you. famous, you're successful. Thank you. >> Have you flirted with the idea of >> Have you flirted with the idea of >> Have you flirted with the idea of calling it quits? calling it quits? calling it quits? >> Never, never, never. I can't even >> Never, never, never. I can't even >> Never, never, never. I can't even imagine doing that. People ask my imagine doing that. People ask my imagine doing that. People ask my wonderful agent, Esther Newberg, if wonderful agent, Esther Newberg, if wonderful agent, Esther Newberg, if she's ever going to retire, and she she's ever going to retire, and she she's ever going to retire, and she says, "Now, they pay me to read books. says, "Now, they pay me to read books. says, "Now, they pay me to read books. Why would I retire?" [laughter] Why would I retire?" [laughter] Why would I retire?" [laughter] And I kind of feel the same way. And I kind of feel the same way. And I kind of feel the same way. Um, I love what I do. I love getting up Um, I love what I do. I love getting up Um, I love what I do. I love getting up in the morning and having a challenge in the morning and having a challenge in the morning and having a challenge for the day. Um, I I just I have I I for the day. Um, I I just I have I I for the day. Um, I I just I have I I have the life I've always wanted. have the life I've always wanted. have the life I've always wanted. >> So, why stop? >> So, why stop? >> So, why stop? >> Why stop? >> Why stop? >> Why stop? >> Ina Garden. It's been an absolute >> Ina Garden. It's been an absolute >> Ina Garden. It's been an absolute pleasure. Thank you so much for talking.

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