He killed his girlfriend with cocaine to stop her pregnancy; Mother slain in daylight attack

Hello and welcome to the sidebar Hello and welcome to the sidebar presented by True Crime News taking you presented by True Crime News taking you presented by True Crime News taking you inside the courtrooms of high-profile inside the courtrooms of high-profile inside the courtrooms of high-profile and notorious cases from across the and notorious cases from across the and notorious cases from across the country. I'm your host Joshua Ritter. country. I'm your host Joshua Ritter. country. I'm your host Joshua Ritter. I'm a criminal defense lawyer based in I'm a criminal defense lawyer based in I'm a criminal defense lawyer based in Los Angeles and previously an LA County Los Angeles and previously an LA County Los Angeles and previously an LA County prosecutor for over a decade. We are prosecutor for over a decade. We are prosecutor for over a decade. We are recording this on Wednesday, July 1st, recording this on Wednesday, July 1st, recording this on Wednesday, July 1st, 2026. In this week's episode, a new 2026. In this week's episode, a new 2026. In this week's episode, a new trial date for Alec Murdoch as the trial date for Alec Murdoch as the trial date for Alec Murdoch as the disgraced attorney again faces charges disgraced attorney again faces charges disgraced attorney again faces charges for the murder of his wife and son. for the murder of his wife and son. for the murder of his wife and son. Plus, a mother's terrifying last moments Plus, a mother's terrifying last moments Plus, a mother's terrifying last moments after she was brazenly ambushed and after she was brazenly ambushed and after she was brazenly ambushed and stabbed to death. But first, a Tennessee stabbed to death. But first, a Tennessee stabbed to death. But first, a Tennessee jury has reached a verdict for the man jury has reached a verdict for the man jury has reached a verdict for the man accused of fatally poisoning his accused of fatally poisoning his accused of fatally poisoning his pregnant girlfriend with cocaine. I'm pregnant girlfriend with cocaine. I'm pregnant girlfriend with cocaine. I'm flying solo today, so let's go ahead and flying solo today, so let's go ahead and flying solo today, so let's go ahead and jump right in. First, out of Nashville, jump right in. First, out of Nashville, jump right in. First, out of Nashville, Tennessee, a former pro football Tennessee, a former pro football Tennessee, a former pro football standout is looking at life behind bars standout is looking at life behind bars standout is looking at life behind bars after he poisoned his pregnant after he poisoned his pregnant after he poisoned his pregnant girlfriend with a lethal dose of girlfriend with a lethal dose of girlfriend with a lethal dose of cocaine. Blaze Taylor was convicted on cocaine. Blaze Taylor was convicted on cocaine. Blaze Taylor was convicted on all counts for the death of Jade Benning all counts for the death of Jade Benning all counts for the death of Jade Benning and her unborn child. At the time of the and her unborn child. At the time of the and her unborn child. At the time of the incident, Benning was 5 months pregnant incident, Benning was 5 months pregnant incident, Benning was 5 months pregnant and by all accounts excited about the and by all accounts excited about the and by all accounts excited about the pregnancy. A coworker even testified pregnancy. A coworker even testified pregnancy. A coworker even testified that Benning gave up alcohol and that Benning gave up alcohol and that Benning gave up alcohol and marijuana in her preparations to become marijuana in her preparations to become marijuana in her preparations to become a mother. Tragically, she would never a mother. Tragically, she would never a mother. Tragically, she would never realize those aspirations after a realize those aspirations after a realize those aspirations after a medical event left her in a critical medical event left her in a critical medical event left her in a critical condition, eventually claiming the life condition, eventually claiming the life condition, eventually claiming the life of both Benning and the baby. While a of both Benning and the baby. While a of both Benning and the baby. While a toxicology report found Benning died toxicology report found Benning died toxicology report found Benning died with the highest concentration of with the highest concentration of with the highest concentration of cocaine, the medical examiner's office cocaine, the medical examiner's office cocaine, the medical examiner's office had ever seen, the doctor could not

had ever seen, the doctor could not had ever seen, the doctor could not ultimately deem the death a homicide, ultimately deem the death a homicide, ultimately deem the death a homicide, ruling the means of death undetermined. ruling the means of death undetermined. ruling the means of death undetermined. However, before she became unresponsive, However, before she became unresponsive, However, before she became unresponsive, the dying woman made a declaration while the dying woman made a declaration while the dying woman made a declaration while on the phone with a friend accusing on the phone with a friend accusing on the phone with a friend accusing Taylor of tampering with her drink Taylor of tampering with her drink Taylor of tampering with her drink because he didn't want the baby. Taylor because he didn't want the baby. Taylor because he didn't want the baby. Taylor opted not to testify in the trial and opted not to testify in the trial and opted not to testify in the trial and jurors ultimately sided with the jurors ultimately sided with the jurors ultimately sided with the prosecution's theory. They are now prosecution's theory. They are now prosecution's theory. They are now deliberating his sentence. deliberating his sentence. deliberating his sentence. This case is um This case is um This case is um a wild one and bizarre. We see cases a wild one and bizarre. We see cases a wild one and bizarre. We see cases like this every so often where people like this every so often where people like this every so often where people just are not happy with the way that just are not happy with the way that just are not happy with the way that their life is headed and they decided their life is headed and they decided their life is headed and they decided that that the only way out of that is to that that the only way out of that is to that that the only way out of that is to kill someone. And we've even seen it kill someone. And we've even seen it kill someone. And we've even seen it tragically before too where that has to tragically before too where that has to tragically before too where that has to do with a pregnancy, an unwanted do with a pregnancy, an unwanted do with a pregnancy, an unwanted pregnancy by by the uh the father in the pregnancy by by the uh the father in the pregnancy by by the uh the father in the relationship who decides that the only relationship who decides that the only relationship who decides that the only way option that he has out of it is to way option that he has out of it is to way option that he has out of it is to take the life of the mother and the take the life of the mother and the take the life of the mother and the child. But I don't know if that was what child. But I don't know if that was what child. But I don't know if that was what was exactly that was happening here and was exactly that was happening here and was exactly that was happening here and I think jurors saw it with a little bit I think jurors saw it with a little bit I think jurors saw it with a little bit more of nuances well because they more of nuances well because they more of nuances well because they convicted him convicted him convicted him of second-degree murder for the mother of second-degree murder for the mother of second-degree murder for the mother but first-degree murder for the unborn but first-degree murder for the unborn but first-degree murder for the unborn baby. Let's think about that and what baby. Let's think about that and what baby. Let's think about that and what that means for a second. It sounds like that means for a second. It sounds like that means for a second. It sounds like the theory that the jurors clung to and the theory that the jurors clung to and the theory that the jurors clung to and that really the prosecution went with in that really the prosecution went with in that really the prosecution went with in this case had to do with the pregnancy this case had to do with the pregnancy this case had to do with the pregnancy itself and not maybe not so much that he itself and not maybe not so much that he itself and not maybe not so much that he wanted to to kill both of them but he wanted to to kill both of them but he wanted to to kill both of them but he certainly wanted to end the pregnancy certainly wanted to end the pregnancy certainly wanted to end the pregnancy which would be the murder of the unborn

which would be the murder of the unborn which would be the murder of the unborn child. And that the murder of the child. And that the murder of the child. And that the murder of the uh mother uh mother uh mother was was was I I mean I'm I'm struggling to find a I I mean I'm I'm struggling to find a I I mean I'm I'm struggling to find a better way of putting this but almost a better way of putting this but almost a better way of putting this but almost a collateral consequence of that that he collateral consequence of that that he collateral consequence of that that he didn't really intend her death but put didn't really intend her death but put didn't really intend her death but put her in such a her in such a her in such a dangerous position that they're going to dangerous position that they're going to dangerous position that they're going to substitute that substitute that substitute that reckless disregard for her life and reckless disregard for her life and reckless disregard for her life and safety as enough intent to find him safety as enough intent to find him safety as enough intent to find him guilty of second-degree murder. It's guilty of second-degree murder. It's guilty of second-degree murder. It's [snorts] a really really sad case. The [snorts] a really really sad case. The [snorts] a really really sad case. The other part about it that makes it other part about it that makes it other part about it that makes it interesting is the the choice of interesting is the the choice of interesting is the the choice of weapon as it were in this case. It's not weapon as it were in this case. It's not weapon as it were in this case. It's not rat poison, it's not fentanyl, it's not rat poison, it's not fentanyl, it's not rat poison, it's not fentanyl, it's not something obviously that somebody would something obviously that somebody would something obviously that somebody would use to cause another person harm. It's use to cause another person harm. It's use to cause another person harm. It's cocaine, a very frequently used and cocaine, a very frequently used and cocaine, a very frequently used and widely available widely available widely available uh recreational drug that um I think uh recreational drug that um I think uh recreational drug that um I think there was evidence that even she herself there was evidence that even she herself there was evidence that even she herself may have taken in a prior may have taken in a prior may have taken in a prior time in her life. Now, I think the time in her life. Now, I think the time in her life. Now, I think the prosecution did a very excellent job of prosecution did a very excellent job of prosecution did a very excellent job of showing how she had really changed her showing how she had really changed her showing how she had really changed her life. And I'm not trying at all to say life. And I'm not trying at all to say life. And I'm not trying at all to say that she was living a high-risk that she was living a high-risk that she was living a high-risk lifestyle, but she certainly gave up lifestyle, but she certainly gave up lifestyle, but she certainly gave up drinking and any kind of other casual drinking and any kind of other casual drinking and any kind of other casual drug use, marijuana use, at least drug use, marijuana use, at least drug use, marijuana use, at least according to the testimony when she had according to the testimony when she had according to the testimony when she had this uh when she found out she was this uh when she found out she was this uh when she found out she was pregnant. And she was very excited like pregnant. And she was very excited like pregnant. And she was very excited like many many mothers are. And so you many many mothers are. And so you many many mothers are. And so you imagine she was living a lifestyle to do imagine she was living a lifestyle to do imagine she was living a lifestyle to do anything she could to protect that

anything she could to protect that anything she could to protect that precious baby inside of her. And that precious baby inside of her. And that precious baby inside of her. And that was important because when you're was important because when you're was important because when you're dealing with something like cocaine, a dealing with something like cocaine, a dealing with something like cocaine, a widely available recreational drug, widely available recreational drug, widely available recreational drug, there's always the built-in argument for there's always the built-in argument for there's always the built-in argument for the defense that it could have been the defense that it could have been the defense that it could have been something that she did to herself, something that she did to herself, something that she did to herself, tragically overdosed herself on cocaine. tragically overdosed herself on cocaine. tragically overdosed herself on cocaine. I think the other thing that obviously I think the other thing that obviously I think the other thing that obviously argued against that was the amount argued against that was the amount argued against that was the amount the medical examiner saying that it was the medical examiner saying that it was the medical examiner saying that it was such a the the largest amount of cocaine such a the the largest amount of cocaine such a the the largest amount of cocaine in a a person in a a person in a a person uh in a toxicology report that they had uh in a toxicology report that they had uh in a toxicology report that they had ever seen. That's incredibly powerful ever seen. That's incredibly powerful ever seen. That's incredibly powerful evidence. That is not something that evidence. That is not something that evidence. That is not something that somebody would accidentally take. You somebody would accidentally take. You somebody would accidentally take. You couple that with the phone call that she couple that with the phone call that she couple that with the phone call that she makes while she is literally makes while she is literally makes while she is literally breathing some of her last breaths, by breathing some of her last breaths, by breathing some of her last breaths, by the way. Think about the drama of that. the way. Think about the drama of that. the way. Think about the drama of that. Here's a person who may not even realize Here's a person who may not even realize Here's a person who may not even realize it yet, but she's it yet, but she's it yet, but she's essentially already dying and calls a essentially already dying and calls a essentially already dying and calls a friend to say that she feels that he put friend to say that she feels that he put friend to say that she feels that he put something in her drink. Uh pretty something in her drink. Uh pretty something in her drink. Uh pretty powerful stuff. powerful stuff. powerful stuff. One other thing I think worth mentioning One other thing I think worth mentioning One other thing I think worth mentioning is that at one point prosecutors is that at one point prosecutors is that at one point prosecutors presented testimony from a former presented testimony from a former presented testimony from a former girlfriend of Taylor's who claimed that girlfriend of Taylor's who claimed that girlfriend of Taylor's who claimed that he asked her in 2017 he asked her in 2017 he asked her in 2017 to obtain abortion pills so he could to obtain abortion pills so he could to obtain abortion pills so he could place them in the drink of another woman place them in the drink of another woman place them in the drink of another woman that he got pregnant. Obviously, this is that he got pregnant. Obviously, this is that he got pregnant. Obviously, this is the type of character evidence and it's the type of character evidence and it's the type of character evidence and it's not really character evidence, it's not really character evidence, it's not really character evidence, it's prior bad acts evidence, but it gives us prior bad acts evidence, but it gives us prior bad acts evidence, but it gives us an insight into his an insight into his an insight into his common plans, his

common plans, his common plans, his MO, the way that he operates. And that's MO, the way that he operates. And that's MO, the way that he operates. And that's when this type of evidence can be used when this type of evidence can be used when this type of evidence can be used in two very great and powerful effect. in two very great and powerful effect. in two very great and powerful effect. So, what they're saying here, that this So, what they're saying here, that this So, what they're saying here, that this is something important for us to all is something important for us to all is something important for us to all understand and it is a little bit understand and it is a little bit understand and it is a little bit in the weeds legally, but in the weeds legally, but in the weeds legally, but you cannot present evidence of a person you cannot present evidence of a person you cannot present evidence of a person being a bad person and say, "Listen, being a bad person and say, "Listen, being a bad person and say, "Listen, this guy's bad because he had asked for this guy's bad because he had asked for this guy's bad because he had asked for abortion pills allegedly to abortion pills allegedly to abortion pills allegedly to surreptitiously drug a prior girlfriend surreptitiously drug a prior girlfriend surreptitiously drug a prior girlfriend who had gotten pregnant. Therefore, he's who had gotten pregnant. Therefore, he's who had gotten pregnant. Therefore, he's a bad guy and bad guys do bad things." a bad guy and bad guys do bad things." a bad guy and bad guys do bad things." That would be character evidence. But That would be character evidence. But That would be character evidence. But you can use it to say, "Listen, this guy you can use it to say, "Listen, this guy you can use it to say, "Listen, this guy operates in an incredibly operates in an incredibly operates in an incredibly um predictable way um predictable way um predictable way that when he's in a situation where he that when he's in a situation where he that when he's in a situation where he finds that a life finds that a life finds that a life choice choice choice uh is being foisted upon him. uh is being foisted upon him. uh is being foisted upon him. When he finds out that he had that he I When he finds out that he had that he I When he finds out that he had that he I mean, you can get as detailed as saying mean, you can get as detailed as saying mean, you can get as detailed as saying when he finds out that he got someone when he finds out that he got someone when he finds out that he got someone pregnant in an unplanned way, his way of pregnant in an unplanned way, his way of pregnant in an unplanned way, his way of handling that is to surreptitiously drug handling that is to surreptitiously drug handling that is to surreptitiously drug that person with something that will that person with something that will that person with something that will stop that pregnancy, that will terminate stop that pregnancy, that will terminate stop that pregnancy, that will terminate that pregnancy. And that you can say that pregnancy. And that you can say that pregnancy. And that you can say that in a very similar pattern as to that in a very similar pattern as to that in a very similar pattern as to what he did before, if you believe that what he did before, if you believe that what he did before, if you believe that to be true, then you can believe it to to be true, then you can believe it to to be true, then you can believe it to be also true in this case. That is not be also true in this case. That is not be also true in this case. That is not character evidence. That is prior bad

character evidence. That is prior bad character evidence. That is prior bad acts evidence, and that is the type of acts evidence, and that is the type of acts evidence, and that is the type of evidence that we do allow. And again, I evidence that we do allow. And again, I evidence that we do allow. And again, I think it must have been incredibly think it must have been incredibly think it must have been incredibly convincing to the jurors. It was to me. convincing to the jurors. It was to me. convincing to the jurors. It was to me. When you look at this prior testimony of When you look at this prior testimony of When you look at this prior testimony of that bad acts, when you look at the that bad acts, when you look at the that bad acts, when you look at the phone call, you look at the amount of phone call, you look at the amount of phone call, you look at the amount of cocaine used, it all is starting to cocaine used, it all is starting to cocaine used, it all is starting to point away from any other explanation point away from any other explanation point away from any other explanation for this. What were they left with? They for this. What were they left with? They for this. What were they left with? They were left with the idea were left with the idea were left with the idea it's essentially binary, right? Either it's essentially binary, right? Either it's essentially binary, right? Either he did it or someone else did it. And he did it or someone else did it. And he did it or someone else did it. And there's never been any other evidence there's never been any other evidence there's never been any other evidence that anybody else was involved, that that anybody else was involved, that that anybody else was involved, that anybody else was in that room, that anybody else was in that room, that anybody else was in that room, that anybody else was around. He's the one anybody else was around. He's the one anybody else was around. He's the one that called 911. that called 911. that called 911. So, he himself is placing that choice in So, he himself is placing that choice in So, he himself is placing that choice in front of jurors. It's either me or her front of jurors. It's either me or her front of jurors. It's either me or her that did it. And when you take out the that did it. And when you take out the that did it. And when you take out the possibility that it could have been her, possibility that it could have been her, possibility that it could have been her, and you add to that the idea that he is and you add to that the idea that he is and you add to that the idea that he is the type of person who's at least tried the type of person who's at least tried the type of person who's at least tried to do this in the past, to do this in the past, to do this in the past, from her own conversation with a friend, from her own conversation with a friend, from her own conversation with a friend, it sounds like she was aware of how he it sounds like she was aware of how he it sounds like she was aware of how he didn't want this pregnancy. She provides didn't want this pregnancy. She provides didn't want this pregnancy. She provides the motive to the jurors, literally a the motive to the jurors, literally a the motive to the jurors, literally a voice from the grave providing the voice from the grave providing the voice from the grave providing the motive for the jurors. That is very, motive for the jurors. That is very, motive for the jurors. That is very, very convincing evidence. So, I do think very convincing evidence. So, I do think very convincing evidence. So, I do think that the jurors got this one right. I do that the jurors got this one right. I do that the jurors got this one right. I do think this is an incredible tragedy, but think this is an incredible tragedy, but think this is an incredible tragedy, but I think the jurors were balanced enough I think the jurors were balanced enough I think the jurors were balanced enough and perceptive enough to realize that and perceptive enough to realize that and perceptive enough to realize that probably what he wanted to do was to probably what he wanted to do was to probably what he wanted to do was to terminate that pregnancy and the life of

terminate that pregnancy and the life of terminate that pregnancy and the life of that beautiful baby, and not really end that beautiful baby, and not really end that beautiful baby, and not really end her life. her life. her life. But because he did, they're finding him But because he did, they're finding him But because he did, they're finding him guilty for second degree of the mother guilty for second degree of the mother guilty for second degree of the mother and first degree of the unborn child. and first degree of the unborn child. and first degree of the unborn child. Really sad case. Really sad case. Really sad case. Um Um Um again, he's being sentenced right now. I again, he's being sentenced right now. I again, he's being sentenced right now. I imagine he's going to be sentenced to imagine he's going to be sentenced to imagine he's going to be sentenced to life because he was convicted of life because he was convicted of life because he was convicted of first-degree murder for the unborn baby, first-degree murder for the unborn baby, first-degree murder for the unborn baby, the life of Jade Benning and her unborn the life of Jade Benning and her unborn the life of Jade Benning and her unborn child. So, we will put this one child. So, we will put this one child. So, we will put this one behind us and update you if we have any behind us and update you if we have any behind us and update you if we have any further updates if about that sentencing further updates if about that sentencing further updates if about that sentencing if anything turns out differently, but if anything turns out differently, but if anything turns out differently, but by the time you're hearing this by the time you're hearing this by the time you're hearing this recording, it will probably already have recording, it will probably already have recording, it will probably already have been determined. Let's turn her into our been determined. Let's turn her into our been determined. Let's turn her into our next case though out of Del Rio, Texas next case though out of Del Rio, Texas next case though out of Del Rio, Texas where a mother of five was tragically where a mother of five was tragically where a mother of five was tragically stabbed to death in broad daylight after stabbed to death in broad daylight after stabbed to death in broad daylight after an altercation with three women turned an altercation with three women turned an altercation with three women turned deadly. Caroline Pena, aged 32, suffered deadly. Caroline Pena, aged 32, suffered deadly. Caroline Pena, aged 32, suffered two stab wounds to the back and one to two stab wounds to the back and one to two stab wounds to the back and one to the side of her body which ended up the side of her body which ended up the side of her body which ended up fatally puncturing her lung. After fatally puncturing her lung. After fatally puncturing her lung. After police viewed surveillance footage and police viewed surveillance footage and police viewed surveillance footage and conducted witness interviews, they conducted witness interviews, they conducted witness interviews, they arrested sisters Amaya Cookie Diaz, aged arrested sisters Amaya Cookie Diaz, aged arrested sisters Amaya Cookie Diaz, aged 19, and Kitty Mia Diaz, aged 21, along 19, and Kitty Mia Diaz, aged 21, along 19, and Kitty Mia Diaz, aged 21, along with Keandra Renee Foz, also aged 21.

with Keandra Renee Foz, also aged 21. with Keandra Renee Foz, also aged 21. While a motive in the callous slaying While a motive in the callous slaying While a motive in the callous slaying isn't known, police indicated they that isn't known, police indicated they that isn't known, police indicated they that all three suspects knew the victim and all three suspects knew the victim and all three suspects knew the victim and speculated that Pena willingly went to speculated that Pena willingly went to speculated that Pena willingly went to one of the suspects' homes where she was one of the suspects' homes where she was one of the suspects' homes where she was brutally ambushed. In the wake of the brutally ambushed. In the wake of the brutally ambushed. In the wake of the senseless tragedy, the Diaz sisters and senseless tragedy, the Diaz sisters and senseless tragedy, the Diaz sisters and Foz have been charged with murder and Foz have been charged with murder and Foz have been charged with murder and are each being held on $5 million bond. are each being held on $5 million bond. are each being held on $5 million bond. This one really is disturbing. First of This one really is disturbing. First of This one really is disturbing. First of all, all, all, let's talk about what you have here. let's talk about what you have here. let's talk about what you have here. You'd have a lying in wait murder. You'd have a lying in wait murder. You'd have a lying in wait murder. Essentially, from the facts that we have Essentially, from the facts that we have Essentially, from the facts that we have right now, you have the lying in wait right now, you have the lying in wait right now, you have the lying in wait murder of a mother of five in the state murder of a mother of five in the state murder of a mother of five in the state of Texas. of Texas. of Texas. This very well could turn into a capital This very well could turn into a capital This very well could turn into a capital murder case. murder case. murder case. The state of Texas The state of Texas The state of Texas doesn't play around, folks. doesn't play around, folks. doesn't play around, folks. Not with stuff like this. You lure Not with stuff like this. You lure Not with stuff like this. You lure someone to a location, you ambush them, someone to a location, you ambush them, someone to a location, you ambush them, you stab them to death. The person's you stab them to death. The person's you stab them to death. The person's incredibly incredibly incredibly vulnerable. This isn't some vulnerable. This isn't some vulnerable. This isn't some you know, gang case, things went wrong.

you know, gang case, things went wrong. you know, gang case, things went wrong. Do not be surprised if they pursue the Do not be surprised if they pursue the Do not be surprised if they pursue the death penalty in this case. Now, death penalty in this case. Now, death penalty in this case. Now, why does that why does that why does that present some unique issues here? present some unique issues here? present some unique issues here? Well, because of the age Well, because of the age Well, because of the age of the of the of the girls involved. One, them being female, girls involved. One, them being female, girls involved. One, them being female, I don't think that's something that you I don't think that's something that you I don't think that's something that you can ignore. That is something that can ignore. That is something that can ignore. That is something that prosecutors are certainly going to have prosecutors are certainly going to have prosecutors are certainly going to have to think about when they're presenting to think about when they're presenting to think about when they're presenting this to a jury and asking them to put this to a jury and asking them to put this to a jury and asking them to put them to death. It's certainly something them to death. It's certainly something them to death. It's certainly something they're going to have to consider. But they're going to have to consider. But they're going to have to consider. But two, you've got one of them 19 and the two, you've got one of them 19 and the two, you've got one of them 19 and the other two 21. Those are still children other two 21. Those are still children other two 21. Those are still children in many people's eyes. Those are still in many people's eyes. Those are still in many people's eyes. Those are still children. Now, they'll be charged as children. Now, they'll be charged as children. Now, they'll be charged as adults, but they will have to think adults, but they will have to think adults, but they will have to think about that prosecutors moving forward. about that prosecutors moving forward. about that prosecutors moving forward. One other thing I'll add to this, this One other thing I'll add to this, this One other thing I'll add to this, this case case case is horrific and it made the news because is horrific and it made the news because is horrific and it made the news because it's horrific. it's horrific. it's horrific. But one of the things that really put But one of the things that really put But one of the things that really put this on the radar of a lot of outlets this on the radar of a lot of outlets this on the radar of a lot of outlets was the idea that the sisters were was the idea that the sisters were was the idea that the sisters were apparently smiling when they were apparently smiling when they were apparently smiling when they were arrested and again, when their mug shot arrested and again, when their mug shot arrested and again, when their mug shot mug shots were taken.

mug shots were taken. mug shots were taken. Now, is that evidence of a crime? Not Now, is that evidence of a crime? Not Now, is that evidence of a crime? Not necessarily. How will prosecutors use that? How will prosecutors use that? Um if I'm the prosecutor, I want that Um if I'm the prosecutor, I want that Um if I'm the prosecutor, I want that mug shot in for sure. That's evidence. You're allowed to show That's evidence. You're allowed to show a mug shot. a mug shot. a mug shot. If you're the defense, you want that If you're the defense, you want that If you're the defense, you want that kept out. Absolutely. You're going to kept out. Absolutely. You're going to kept out. Absolutely. You're going to say, "What relevance does this have to say, "What relevance does this have to say, "What relevance does this have to the case?" If you're the defense, you the case?" If you're the defense, you the case?" If you're the defense, you want the arresting video kept out. want the arresting video kept out. want the arresting video kept out. The prosecutor, you're trying to think The prosecutor, you're trying to think The prosecutor, you're trying to think creatively as to how that is relevant in creatively as to how that is relevant in creatively as to how that is relevant in this whole thing. this whole thing. this whole thing. But it really is, I think, But it really is, I think, But it really is, I think, you know, putting aside any kind of you know, putting aside any kind of you know, putting aside any kind of legal legal legal argument issue on all of this, just a disturbing sign of the times that just a disturbing sign of the times that we live in. we live in. we live in. Getting back to how are prosecutors Getting back to how are prosecutors Getting back to how are prosecutors going to have to um going to have to um going to have to um prove this prove this prove this uh you know uh you know uh you know I think one thing I wouldn't be I think one thing I wouldn't be I think one thing I wouldn't be surprised about given three surprised about given three surprised about given three people involved, three girls involved, people involved, three girls involved, people involved, three girls involved, one of them is going to be the one of them is going to be the one of them is going to be the ringleader.

ringleader. ringleader. And if you are the attorney representing And if you are the attorney representing And if you are the attorney representing either of the other two either of the other two either of the other two it's a foot race to the prosecutor's it's a foot race to the prosecutor's it's a foot race to the prosecutor's office to try to figure out who's going office to try to figure out who's going office to try to figure out who's going to flip first. to flip first. to flip first. Who who wants to be that person that is Who who wants to be that person that is Who who wants to be that person that is the star witness for the prosecution in the star witness for the prosecution in the star witness for the prosecution in this case and willing to tell everything this case and willing to tell everything this case and willing to tell everything that happened on the other two and that happened on the other two and that happened on the other two and hopefully get them hopefully get them hopefully get them themselves some sort of a deal themselves some sort of a deal themselves some sort of a deal that puts a light at the end of a very that puts a light at the end of a very that puts a light at the end of a very long tunnel of the amount of prison time long tunnel of the amount of prison time long tunnel of the amount of prison time that they're going to that they're going to that they're going to spend. spend. spend. Because otherwise, in my view, it's a Because otherwise, in my view, it's a Because otherwise, in my view, it's a capital case. And whether or not they capital case. And whether or not they capital case. And whether or not they pursue the death penalty, they're all pursue the death penalty, they're all pursue the death penalty, they're all probably looking about life behind bars. probably looking about life behind bars. probably looking about life behind bars. Just really, really sad stuff. We'll Just really, really sad stuff. We'll Just really, really sad stuff. We'll continue to keep an eye on that one. continue to keep an eye on that one. continue to keep an eye on that one. It's very, very early on in the case. It's very, very early on in the case. It's very, very early on in the case. Our final case though is out of Our final case though is out of Our final case though is out of Lexington County, South Carolina. A case Lexington County, South Carolina. A case Lexington County, South Carolina. A case that we're very familiar with. In a new that we're very familiar with. In a new that we're very familiar with. In a new chapter of the ongoing Alec Murdaugh chapter of the ongoing Alec Murdaugh chapter of the ongoing Alec Murdaugh saga, the disgraced former lawyer has saga, the disgraced former lawyer has saga, the disgraced former lawyer has been given a new trial date as he again been given a new trial date as he again been given a new trial date as he again faces charges for the deaths of his wife faces charges for the deaths of his wife faces charges for the deaths of his wife Maggie and Paul Murdaugh were gunned Maggie and Paul Murdaugh were gunned Maggie and Paul Murdaugh were gunned down near dog kennels located on the down near dog kennels located on the down near dog kennels located on the family's sprawling low country hunting family's sprawling low country hunting family's sprawling low country hunting property. Prosecutors claimed that property. Prosecutors claimed that property. Prosecutors claimed that Murdaugh perpetrated the slaying to gain Murdaugh perpetrated the slaying to gain Murdaugh perpetrated the slaying to gain sympathy and to create a distraction sympathy and to create a distraction sympathy and to create a distraction from his numerous financial crimes for from his numerous financial crimes for from his numerous financial crimes for which he had been convicted. However, which he had been convicted. However, which he had been convicted. However, South Carolina Supreme Court overturned South Carolina Supreme Court overturned South Carolina Supreme Court overturned Murdaugh's 2023 murder convictions.

Murdaugh's 2023 murder convictions. Murdaugh's 2023 murder convictions. After case, Murdaugh's pre-trial hearing After case, Murdaugh's pre-trial hearing After case, Murdaugh's pre-trial hearing drew a crowd with reporters, media drew a crowd with reporters, media drew a crowd with reporters, media outlets, and true crime podcasters outlets, and true crime podcasters outlets, and true crime podcasters filling the small courthouse. filling the small courthouse. filling the small courthouse. While listeners and true crime fans are While listeners and true crime fans are While listeners and true crime fans are very familiar with the case, presiding very familiar with the case, presiding very familiar with the case, presiding judge Deborah McCaslin judge Deborah McCaslin judge Deborah McCaslin was absent from the previous trial and was absent from the previous trial and was absent from the previous trial and will be coming into the case with fresh will be coming into the case with fresh will be coming into the case with fresh eyes. The prosecutor's case will likely eyes. The prosecutor's case will likely eyes. The prosecutor's case will likely remain similar to the first trial with remain similar to the first trial with remain similar to the first trial with Creighton Waters at the helm. On the Creighton Waters at the helm. On the Creighton Waters at the helm. On the other hand, Murdoch's defense team is other hand, Murdoch's defense team is other hand, Murdoch's defense team is seeking new DNA testing taken from seeking new DNA testing taken from seeking new DNA testing taken from Maggie's fingernails at the crime scene. Maggie's fingernails at the crime scene. Maggie's fingernails at the crime scene. Additionally, the defense is also Additionally, the defense is also Additionally, the defense is also seeking to move the proceedings outside seeking to move the proceedings outside seeking to move the proceedings outside of Colleton County where the killings of Colleton County where the killings of Colleton County where the killings and the first trial occurred. While it and the first trial occurred. While it and the first trial occurred. While it will be a long road before Murdoch again will be a long road before Murdoch again will be a long road before Murdoch again faces a jury, the judge laid out a faces a jury, the judge laid out a faces a jury, the judge laid out a timeline for upcoming hearings and set a timeline for upcoming hearings and set a timeline for upcoming hearings and set a start date for the retrial on April 5th start date for the retrial on April 5th start date for the retrial on April 5th of next year. of next year. of next year. Um some interesting stuff to talk about some interesting stuff to talk about here. First of all, let's talk about here. First of all, let's talk about here. First of all, let's talk about where where the prosecution is going to where where the prosecution is going to where where the prosecution is going to have to pivot in this case.

have to pivot in this case. have to pivot in this case. I I I pre um retrials usually favor the pre um retrials usually favor the pre um retrials usually favor the prosecution. prosecution. prosecution. And it's funny to me, every once in a And it's funny to me, every once in a And it's funny to me, every once in a while you hear while you hear while you hear uh pundits online say differently. And I uh pundits online say differently. And I uh pundits online say differently. And I don't I don't I don't understand that. The defense has very little advantages. The defense has very little advantages. One of those is the clock. They can they One of those is the clock. They can they One of those is the clock. They can they can control how quickly or how slowly, can control how quickly or how slowly, can control how quickly or how slowly, for the most part, something goes to for the most part, something goes to for the most part, something goes to trial. trial. trial. But the other advantage that they have But the other advantage that they have But the other advantage that they have is they're not under the same strict is they're not under the same strict is they're not under the same strict discovery rules as the prosecution. discovery rules as the prosecution. discovery rules as the prosecution. The prosecution has to turn over The prosecution has to turn over The prosecution has to turn over everything. Now, some jurisdictions everything. Now, some jurisdictions everything. Now, some jurisdictions require uh the same level of reciprocal require uh the same level of reciprocal require uh the same level of reciprocal discovery, as we call it, to the discovery, as we call it, to the discovery, as we call it, to the defense. In California, where I defense. In California, where I defense. In California, where I practice, it there is on the books the practice, it there is on the books the practice, it there is on the books the idea of reciprocal discovery. idea of reciprocal discovery. idea of reciprocal discovery. But But But there's a little bit of there's a little bit of there's a little bit of wiggle room there for the defense in wiggle room there for the defense in wiggle room there for the defense in that they don't have to turn over stuff that they don't have to turn over stuff that they don't have to turn over stuff that they don't plan on using.

that they don't plan on using. that they don't plan on using. So in other words, maybe they've So in other words, maybe they've So in other words, maybe they've consulted with an expert and it hasn't consulted with an expert and it hasn't consulted with an expert and it hasn't turned out all that favorable to them. turned out all that favorable to them. turned out all that favorable to them. Don't necessarily need to turn that Don't necessarily need to turn that Don't necessarily need to turn that over. over. over. They do need to turn it over, however, They do need to turn it over, however, They do need to turn it over, however, if it becomes important in trial and if it becomes important in trial and if it becomes important in trial and they realize that hey they realize that hey they realize that hey something happened in this trial, we're something happened in this trial, we're something happened in this trial, we're going to have to pivot and we're going going to have to pivot and we're going going to have to pivot and we're going to have to turn over this information. to have to turn over this information. to have to turn over this information. And so to some extent there's a little And so to some extent there's a little And so to some extent there's a little bit of gamesmanship, sandbagging, bit of gamesmanship, sandbagging, bit of gamesmanship, sandbagging, catching people off guard that can take catching people off guard that can take catching people off guard that can take place with the defense towards the place with the defense towards the place with the defense towards the prosecution. Not much, but some. prosecution. Not much, but some. prosecution. Not much, but some. The defense also has the opportunity to The defense also has the opportunity to The defense also has the opportunity to catch witnesses in cross-examination. But they lose all of those advantages in But they lose all of those advantages in a retrial. a retrial. a retrial. The prosecution's case doesn't really The prosecution's case doesn't really The prosecution's case doesn't really pivot all that much. They have their pivot all that much. They have their pivot all that much. They have their evidence, they present their case. The evidence, they present their case. The evidence, they present their case. The retrial comes up and they're going to do retrial comes up and they're going to do retrial comes up and they're going to do about the same thing. But now they know about the same thing. But now they know about the same thing. But now they know where their weaknesses are. They know where their weaknesses are. They know where their weaknesses are. They know what the defense has attacked, that they what the defense has attacked, that they what the defense has attacked, that they know the defense theories, they know the know the defense theories, they know the know the defense theories, they know the way the defense is going to way the defense is going to way the defense is going to cross-examine witnesses, and they may cross-examine witnesses, and they may cross-examine witnesses, and they may have heard some of these, you know, have heard some of these, you know, have heard some of these, you know, surprise surprise surprise uh uh uh issues from the defense the first time issues from the defense the first time issues from the defense the first time around.

around. around. It usually favors the prosecution the It usually favors the prosecution the It usually favors the prosecution the second time around. second time around. second time around. Also, the prosecution has an opportunity Also, the prosecution has an opportunity Also, the prosecution has an opportunity to streamline their case and realize to streamline their case and realize to streamline their case and realize what worked, what didn't. Here things what worked, what didn't. Here things what worked, what didn't. Here things are a little bit different in a couple are a little bit different in a couple are a little bit different in a couple of senses. One of senses. One of senses. One the Supreme Court in South Carolina not the Supreme Court in South Carolina not the Supreme Court in South Carolina not only overturned this case because of the only overturned this case because of the only overturned this case because of the misdeeds of misdeeds of misdeeds of the the the clerk, Becky Hill. clerk, Becky Hill. clerk, Becky Hill. But almost as an aside, the Supreme But almost as an aside, the Supreme But almost as an aside, the Supreme Court in South Carolina said, "While Court in South Carolina said, "While Court in South Carolina said, "While we're at it, though we're not we're at it, though we're not we're at it, though we're not ruling to overrule ruling to overrule ruling to overrule overturn this verdict based upon this overturn this verdict based upon this overturn this verdict based upon this reason, we're going to take this reason, we're going to take this reason, we're going to take this opportunity to tell you something. You opportunity to tell you something. You opportunity to tell you something. You leaned too heavily on the financial leaned too heavily on the financial leaned too heavily on the financial crimes." crimes." crimes." It was a fairly strong rebuke from this It was a fairly strong rebuke from this It was a fairly strong rebuke from this Supreme Court. They said, "You made too Supreme Court. They said, "You made too Supreme Court. They said, "You made too much of an issue of it." much of an issue of it." much of an issue of it." And that fairly strongly signaled to the And that fairly strongly signaled to the And that fairly strongly signaled to the prosecution that if this comes back on a prosecution that if this comes back on a prosecution that if this comes back on a retrial, which it is, tread lightly when retrial, which it is, tread lightly when retrial, which it is, tread lightly when it comes to the financial crimes.

it comes to the financial crimes. it comes to the financial crimes. The prosecution spent, I think, an The prosecution spent, I think, an The prosecution spent, I think, an inordinate and unnecessary amount of inordinate and unnecessary amount of inordinate and unnecessary amount of time on Alec Murdaugh's time on Alec Murdaugh's time on Alec Murdaugh's financial crimes in the first trial. And financial crimes in the first trial. And financial crimes in the first trial. And the judge allowed that because they were the judge allowed that because they were the judge allowed that because they were trying to lay the basis for motive. Why trying to lay the basis for motive. Why trying to lay the basis for motive. Why would this man do this? It's a very good would this man do this? It's a very good would this man do this? It's a very good question. question. question. Why would a man who had never Why would a man who had never Why would a man who had never really been accused of committing any really been accused of committing any really been accused of committing any kind of crime of violence in the past kind of crime of violence in the past kind of crime of violence in the past murder murder murder in cold blood his wife and son? in cold blood his wife and son? in cold blood his wife and son? You're going to have to come up with a You're going to have to come up with a You're going to have to come up with a really good reason for jurors for that. really good reason for jurors for that. really good reason for jurors for that. Well, the prosecution felt that had to Well, the prosecution felt that had to Well, the prosecution felt that had to do with his financial troubles. Because do with his financial troubles. Because do with his financial troubles. Because he committed all these financial crimes, he committed all these financial crimes, he committed all these financial crimes, the walls were closing in, and he felt the walls were closing in, and he felt the walls were closing in, and he felt that he had no choice but to create some that he had no choice but to create some that he had no choice but to create some sort of distraction, relief from all of sort of distraction, relief from all of sort of distraction, relief from all of this stress, and then they kind of this stress, and then they kind of this stress, and then they kind of coupled that with his coupled that with his coupled that with his ongoing ongoing ongoing substance abuse issues.

If If they they're going to have to be careful they they're going to have to be careful they they're going to have to be careful how they do this the second time around, how they do this the second time around, how they do this the second time around, though. I think the judge the second though. I think the judge the second though. I think the judge the second time around will allow them for the same time around will allow them for the same time around will allow them for the same reasons to present reasons to present reasons to present the idea that he was in financial the idea that he was in financial the idea that he was in financial trouble, but the amount of witnesses trouble, but the amount of witnesses trouble, but the amount of witnesses that they called really turned this into that they called really turned this into that they called really turned this into a financial case. And the defense a financial case. And the defense a financial case. And the defense complained about that quite a bit. So, complained about that quite a bit. So, complained about that quite a bit. So, if you think this is going to be a if you think this is going to be a if you think this is going to be a complete redo from the first trial, have complete redo from the first trial, have complete redo from the first trial, have another think. I think this is going to another think. I think this is going to another think. I think this is going to be a be a be a different trial from the prosecution different trial from the prosecution different trial from the prosecution perspective and maybe a more focused perspective and maybe a more focused perspective and maybe a more focused and streamlined trial. And I'm actually and streamlined trial. And I'm actually and streamlined trial. And I'm actually thinking that will probably be thinking that will probably be thinking that will probably be beneficial to the beneficial to the beneficial to the prosecution. The other interesting thing prosecution. The other interesting thing prosecution. The other interesting thing is this DNA. This DNA is really kind of is this DNA. This DNA is really kind of is this DNA. This DNA is really kind of a win-win for the defense. a win-win for the defense. a win-win for the defense. In the first trial, we knew about this. In the first trial, we knew about this. In the first trial, we knew about this. We knew that there was unknown male DNA We knew that there was unknown male DNA We knew that there was unknown male DNA found under Maggie Murdaugh's found under Maggie Murdaugh's found under Maggie Murdaugh's fingernails.

fingernails. fingernails. Not matching, in other words, to either Not matching, in other words, to either Not matching, in other words, to either Paul or to Paul or to Paul or to Alec. Alec. Alec. So, already So, already So, already the defense is happy with this. Already, the defense is happy with this. Already, the defense is happy with this. Already, you have a situation where there is you have a situation where there is you have a situation where there is {quote} evidence of somebody else. Now, {quote} evidence of somebody else. Now, {quote} evidence of somebody else. Now, we all know how DNA works. Just because we all know how DNA works. Just because we all know how DNA works. Just because there's DNA under her fingernails there's DNA under her fingernails there's DNA under her fingernails doesn't mean that has anything to do doesn't mean that has anything to do doesn't mean that has anything to do with anything about the murders. But, with anything about the murders. But, with anything about the murders. But, it's evidence. And it wasn't tested. And it's evidence. And it wasn't tested. And it's evidence. And it wasn't tested. And now they're asking the judge to test it. now they're asking the judge to test it. now they're asking the judge to test it. And the prosecution's argument is that, And the prosecution's argument is that, And the prosecution's argument is that, "Your Honor, there's no evidence that "Your Honor, there's no evidence that "Your Honor, there's no evidence that she was involved in any sort of a she was involved in any sort of a she was involved in any sort of a struggle." struggle." struggle." And the defense's response to that, And the defense's response to that, And the defense's response to that, "Well, there's no evidence "Well, there's no evidence "Well, there's no evidence on our client because our client didn't on our client because our client didn't on our client because our client didn't do it. You don't see the scratch marks do it. You don't see the scratch marks do it. You don't see the scratch marks on Alec Murdaugh that night because Alec on Alec Murdaugh that night because Alec on Alec Murdaugh that night because Alec Murdaugh wasn't scratched by her. The Murdaugh wasn't scratched by her. The Murdaugh wasn't scratched by her. The real assailant was, Your Honor." I think real assailant was, Your Honor." I think real assailant was, Your Honor." I think the judge is probably going to give this the judge is probably going to give this the judge is probably going to give this one to them and allow them to test this. one to them and allow them to test this. one to them and allow them to test this. It just seems to me like a um It just seems to me like a um It just seems to me like a um a real problematic thing to say I'm not a real problematic thing to say I'm not a real problematic thing to say I'm not going to allow you to pursue evidence going to allow you to pursue evidence going to allow you to pursue evidence that exists in the collection of the that exists in the collection of the that exists in the collection of the evidence in this case.

evidence in this case. evidence in this case. And really, the only way that this comes And really, the only way that this comes And really, the only way that this comes back as not being beneficial to the back as not being beneficial to the back as not being beneficial to the defense is if it comes back to a person defense is if it comes back to a person defense is if it comes back to a person who has a rock-solid alibi. who has a rock-solid alibi. who has a rock-solid alibi. If it comes back to some person If it comes back to some person If it comes back to some person that was a thousand miles away at the that was a thousand miles away at the that was a thousand miles away at the time of the murders, that's not helpful time of the murders, that's not helpful time of the murders, that's not helpful to the defense. But if it comes back to to the defense. But if it comes back to to the defense. But if it comes back to anybody else, anybody else, anybody else, now you're starting to see the makings now you're starting to see the makings now you're starting to see the makings of maybe some sort of third-party of maybe some sort of third-party of maybe some sort of third-party culpability issue, or at least the culpability issue, or at least the culpability issue, or at least the argument could be made that the the argument could be made that the the argument could be made that the the prosecution didn't do this testing, and prosecution didn't do this testing, and prosecution didn't do this testing, and the prosecution has been very myopic and the prosecution has been very myopic and the prosecution has been very myopic and singularly focused on Alec Murdoch from singularly focused on Alec Murdoch from singularly focused on Alec Murdoch from the very beginning. the very beginning. the very beginning. Last thing Last thing Last thing is the change of venue. is the change of venue. is the change of venue. I think again, they will probably I think again, they will probably I think again, they will probably prevail on this issue, and I'll be prevail on this issue, and I'll be prevail on this issue, and I'll be honest with you, I think the prosecution honest with you, I think the prosecution honest with you, I think the prosecution should join them in this request. should join them in this request. should join them in this request. This county, this small Colleton County, This county, this small Colleton County, This county, this small Colleton County, is is is from everyone I've ever spoken to, from everyone I've ever spoken to, from everyone I've ever spoken to, consumed by this case. They were living consumed by this case. They were living consumed by this case. They were living under the shadow of the Murdoch family under the shadow of the Murdoch family under the shadow of the Murdoch family before all of this.

before all of this. before all of this. And then And then And then from this trial and the tremendous crush from this trial and the tremendous crush from this trial and the tremendous crush of media attention, it's as if this town of media attention, it's as if this town of media attention, it's as if this town has a new identity. This community has a has a new identity. This community has a has a new identity. This community has a new identity. How you can try to put new identity. How you can try to put new identity. How you can try to put this man on trial again in that same this man on trial again in that same this man on trial again in that same county and not feel that every single county and not feel that every single county and not feel that every single juror you bring in is going to have been juror you bring in is going to have been juror you bring in is going to have been affected by this in some way is beyond affected by this in some way is beyond affected by this in some way is beyond me. me. me. In the first trial, In the first trial, In the first trial, remember, the Murdochs have been the remember, the Murdochs have been the remember, the Murdochs have been the county prosecutor county prosecutor county prosecutor in that county in that county in that county for generations. They literally had to for generations. They literally had to for generations. They literally had to remove the portrait of Alec Murdoch's remove the portrait of Alec Murdoch's remove the portrait of Alec Murdoch's grandfather from inside of the courtroom grandfather from inside of the courtroom grandfather from inside of the courtroom before they could start this trial. That before they could start this trial. That before they could start this trial. That alone probably should have had them move alone probably should have had them move alone probably should have had them move it out of that county to begin with. it out of that county to begin with. it out of that county to begin with. I think it's the right decision. I think I think it's the right decision. I think I think it's the right decision. I think it's going to avoid any other kind of it's going to avoid any other kind of it's going to avoid any other kind of issue in this case and I think they issue in this case and I think they issue in this case and I think they should do it and I wouldn't be surprised should do it and I wouldn't be surprised should do it and I wouldn't be surprised if they did. We will continue to watch if they did. We will continue to watch if they did. We will continue to watch this one cuz I know you're all this one cuz I know you're all this one cuz I know you're all fascinated with it as am I and we'll fascinated with it as am I and we'll fascinated with it as am I and we'll keep a watchful eye on it. But that is keep a watchful eye on it. But that is keep a watchful eye on it. But that is our show for this week. We'd like to our show for this week. We'd like to our show for this week. We'd like to give a very special thanks to all our give a very special thanks to all our give a very special thanks to all our listeners and viewers for turning it for listeners and viewers for turning it for listeners and viewers for turning it for tuning in. I'm your host Josh Ritter.

tuning in. I'm your host Josh Ritter. tuning in. I'm your host Josh Ritter. You can find me on Instagram and Twitter You can find me on Instagram and Twitter You can find me on Instagram and Twitter at Joshua Ritter Esq. at Joshua Ritter Esq. at Joshua Ritter Esq. And if you're curious to hear my And if you're curious to hear my And if you're curious to hear my thoughts and coverage on even more true thoughts and coverage on even more true thoughts and coverage on even more true crime cases, you can also check out my crime cases, you can also check out my crime cases, you can also check out my new YouTube channel Courtroom new YouTube channel Courtroom new YouTube channel Courtroom Confidential. And you can of course find Confidential. And you can of course find Confidential. And you can of course find all of our sidebar episodes wherever you all of our sidebar episodes wherever you all of our sidebar episodes wherever you get your podcast. We would love to hear get your podcast. We would love to hear get your podcast. We would love to hear from you. If you've got questions or from you. If you've got questions or from you. If you've got questions or comments you'd like us to address, comments you'd like us to address, comments you'd like us to address, please tweet [music] us your questions please tweet [music] us your questions please tweet [music] us your questions with the hashtag TCNsidebar. And thank with the hashtag TCNsidebar. And thank with the hashtag TCNsidebar. And thank you for joining us at the True Crime you for joining us at the True Crime you for joining us at the True Crime News sidebar.